UAE Mirage to PAF and SH to IAF Extract

[Kinshuk]

Sir, Had I been a Pakistani I would have said.

Mature our J-17 and stop singing for what it will be? Some people say it will carry AMRAAM but what about big apple's obligation? Will he allow that? AESA RADAR? J 17 will have one in the future, but when? Avionics? Chinese avionics must be good but are they of any match with US, Israel? May be I don't know. JF 17 is an addition that Pakistan should and is inducting in its fleet, But I would suggest to have at least a type of world class fighter that can challenge the enemy in the ring. PAF is a professional force but don't you think it should be more practical toward what it has what it will have? We will have JF 17, we will have J 10B. But when is the dead line and when these fighters are going to get matured, plus training of the fighter pilot. Here I again admit PAF pilots must be superior to IAF, I don't know for sure but still I have read that all the time in the forum and Indian guys also accepting it. But you also need machine to give a tough fight. We talk about JF 17 quite often and I personally feel it is better than LCA but did you ever try to accept the fact it is successfully going through trials, and just its Engine is not as per IAFs requirement, so they have two suppliers desperate to sell the engine. I think J 17 also having the same problem of underpowered engine. Well I am not here to praise India, God forbid if someone feels that way, but as I said had I been a Pakistani, instead of realising and accepting my failure on one side and instead of closing my eyes and stop believing in the reality on the other side, I would have worked toward reducing the power gap between me and my enemy.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Pakistani fan boys are forgetting that in 65 and 71 paf had superior aircraft and superior missiles than iaf---maybe lesser in numbers but quality has its own strength.

In 65 war PAF had only 12 F-104 and hardly 20-24 F-86 which were equipped with 1st generation heat seekers which were good as longbows. on the other hand IAF had superior Hunters (RAF replaced Sabers with Hunters) Gnats, and not to forget a squadron of mig-21 which were equipped with heat seekers but they never saw any action. overall PAF were only equipped with 120 combat planes while IAF had over 800 on their side. even 120 F-4 would be a hard match!
71 both sides had equally as good technology but the numbers were in IAF favor.

 

[Super Falcon]

growler thanx for info but kindly come on topic of UAE mirage to PAF not the war of 1965

 

[pak-yes]

Luftwaffe,

Thanks for your post---an excellent post. It is amazing that our pak colleagues would talk about the ROSE upgrade like it is a gift from heaven on an obsolete mirage 3 / 5 and when it comes to the most recent strike / interceptor---the pride of the french the m2k9---these same people are at aloss for words.

Pakistani fan boys are forgetting that in 65 and 71 paf had superior aircraft and superior missiles than iaf---maybe lesser in numbers but quality has its own strength.

Why can't they understand they neither have superior aircraft, nor do they superior a to a missiles as compared to the enemy---have they been so much brainwashed by the air force that they have lost the common sense of straight thinking---isn't it amazing that these young students of colleges and universities have no intellect at all to realize, recognize and assess the threat level---how the defencive and offencive strike weapons are procured---and most important of all---the importance of time factor in all this unsettling conditions.

My young men are thinking like every thing is hunky dory---there are no problems at all from anywhere---there is no hurry and no rush from any place---there are no enemies poised to destroy us---pakistan has no wars going on around it---pakistan's neighbours love pakistan---pakistan love sits neighbour---we are all in a lovey dovey and huggy relationship with our esteemed neighbour----pakistani 30 miles missile will kill the indian plane and indian 60 miles missile will not kill the pakistani plane. Indian SU 30's are a pos---indian mig21 bis are a pos---mirage m2k5 is same---so is mig 29----. PAF's F 16 A/B are the greatest--F 7 pg will take out everything---mirage 3/ 5 rose will slaughter all the indian planes---jf 17 zindabad---fc 20 paindabad---jeeway jeeway pakistan. Can somebody mail me that peyote---pease.

What a fools paradise---

The Best Post.

Instead of posting this bull sh** like a fanboy, why dont you go over the specs that JF17 lacks that M2K-9 has. PAF is run by professionals who have done their homework, before a platform is purchased dozens of technical and feasability studies are done. If PAF is going for JF17 over the M2K's, there is a good reason for that.

You still have not proved how is JF17 a sitting duck infront of the M2K-9, maybe you are forgetting that our JF17's will be backed by force multipliers which will neutralize many advantages that M2K-9 has. Even besides that the JF17 is a very agile and manuverable plane with excellent avionics, radar and EW capabilities. The only weakness that JF17 has is its engine, but PAF is working to solve this issue.

Gone are those days when aircrafts used to engage each other one on one, your forgetting that Electronic Warfare is the name of the game today. The argument your putting forward is the same Indian fanboys put forward; that MKI has Western avionics, Israeli radar blah blah blah blah that is why its undefeatable.

Sir don't get angry it's you who are the fan boy of PAF i am the one which just telling their short comings.
And By the way you really mean that JF-17 is equal to or better than m2k9.If that's true then Sir the french and dozens of AF's around the world are a bunch of fools.They should scrap their Mirages and instead get Jf-17.Seriously Sir if you don't even know the difference between the two then i can not ever convince you.
And half of this forum is teaming with JF-17 facts so its useless to post them again.Some facts of Mirage are given on first pages and if you want more just google it.

JF17 thunder cannot carry USA amraams. Thats FANBOYS stuff.

Secondly Pakistan is looking to obtain a better Radar and new BVR missles for Thunder. They have been evaluting the French RC400 & MICA BVR missle combo which is a lighter faster missle than SD10..

There is a Thread re this story started by a senior PDF poster already.

AND GUESS WAT radar MIRAGE2000-9 of UAE carries ?????????

Yes you guessed it RC400 & mica BVR MISSLE COMBO.

uae mirages are the most advanced mirage 2000S EVER BUILT and are superior to the IAF MIRAGE2000H

Pakistanis problem is not short sigtedness. They know the threat that is building up by INDIAN MILITARY PROCUREMENT

Pakistan cannot afford the luxury of a additional $1.5billion to buy these planes from UAE.

Thats the real issue

Sir problem is that some of our brothers just blindly follow JF-17.So they won't understand.

And as far as price is concerned it is not going to be as high as 1.5 billion dollars.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

Why not make a bank account for armed forces. People living abroad and in Pakistan can donate some money which will give a great boost to R&D and procuring new weapons. If authorities assure transparency many people will come out. Trust me!

When we went outside to ask money than why not make a bank account and ask our own people.
It can be done!

 

[SekrutYakhni]

To me making a bank account is a very good idea!

If anyone knows some top military commanders...he can give this idea...

I will love to send my "farz" (money) to Pakistan Army for R&D and weapons procurement...

Or we can open an account on PDF and the webbies can send them money..

but if PA opens a bank account..more people will donate

 

[Luftwaffe]

I swear if this happens I'll be the first to donate an initial $1000.00 first we need to close down benazir ka zakat funds account, bilawl ka plot funds, zardari ka fraud funds accounts.

 

[Kinshuk]

Why not make a bank account for armed forces. People living abroad and in Pakistan can donate some money which will give a great boost to R&D and procuring new weapons. If authorities assure transparency many people will come out. Trust me!

When we went outside to ask money than why not make a bank account and ask our own people.
It can be done!

This would really help, but if we look at the practical side don't you think it's quite erroneous to say that every or majority of people are going to contribute? Instead if Pakistan can have transperent system and govt fiscal policy is aggresive toward tax collection then it is an obligation to the people of the country and the funds can be raised in the large amount. Relying on donations can hurt the continuity inflow of money to the armed forces. But tax obligation will facilitate continous supply of captial.

Thanks.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

This would really help, but if we look at the practical side don't you think it's quite erroneous to say that every or majority of people are going to contribute? Instead if Pakistan can have transperent system and govt fiscal policy is aggresive toward tax collection then it is an obligation to the people of the country and the funds can be raised in the large amount. Relying on donations can hurt the continuity inflow of money to the armed forces. But tax obligation will facilitate continous supply of captial.

Thanks.

Your model is a nice one!
but it will take time and we need money right now

2) You mentioned "donation"..Refer to my post I said "farz"..personally if I send money to PA..I wont think that I gave donation instead it was my job to do..

3) I never said majority...I said many...but as you said majority will donate...

 

[SekrutYakhni]

I swear if this happens I'll be the first to donate an initial $1000.00 first we need to close down benazir ka zakat funds account, bilawl ka plot funds, zardari ka fraud funds accounts.

We will send money to PA's account not Zardari's account...

 

[Luftwaffe]

kinshuk you and i and most of u here knows most of Indians and Pakistanis don't pay taxes in their respective countries tax evasion is on the rise and govts have failed in this regards..Yes if Pakistani govt sets up an account obligatory to all citizens of Pakistan living abroad to pay even 5 dollars per head monthly or even yearly i think Pakistan Govt can collect enough after all something is better than nothing. I've no problem in paying it if i am given assurance that money would be spent in right way in right place for right purpose.

 

[Luftwaffe]

saad if we keep paying to PA account and there on the other hand other accounts the money is ripped off and send to Swiss accounts and la la accounts than it would be a total loss..

 

[SekrutYakhni]

kinshuk you and i and most of u here knows most of Indians and Pakistanis don't pay taxes in their respective countries tax evasion is on the rise and govts have failed in this regards..Yes if Pakistani govt sets up an account obligatory to all citizens of Pakistan living abroad to pay even 5 dollars per head monthly or even yearly i think Pakistan Govt can collect enough after all something is better than nothing. If no problem in paying it if i am given assurance that money would be spent in right way in right place for right purpose.

Yes!
I think $20 per month is fine. Someone should think about this idea!
I think this proposal should be taken seriously.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

saad if we keep paying to PA account and there on the other hand other accounts the money is ripped off and send to Swiss accounts and la la accounts than it would be a total loss..

No.
This account will state Pakistan' Army account.
It will not say Gen kiyani's account or Zardari's account.
Some kind of authority should be put in place..
Some people should look after the account..
It is possible if we want to do..

If this happens than there will be a massive boost to Pakistan Armed forces.
$200 per person a year and if 100,000 people give...$ 20 million..I am sure people living abroad can give more..
76,000 Pakistanis live in Toronto only...

There are many Pakistanis who can give more...

 

[MaXimMaRz]

If every one pay their Tax.
Never vote the wrong person ( We still looking for the right one though)
No one will have to pay extra dollars