# 13 BEST INFANTRY OF ALL TIME[NO ORDER]



## AUSTERLITZ

Now its the time of the infantry,the queen of the battlefield .Europe traditionally produced some of the most powerful infantry forces of all time and after the increase in gunpowder fielding mass cheap gunpwder infantry,superbly drilled was one of the causes of their military supremacy.

So here it is right from the spartan hoplite to the wehrmacht/waffen ss infantryman.[in no order]

1]Spartan hoplite
2]Macedonian phalanx
3]Roman legionary
4]Viking berserker
5]English longbow
6]Swiss pikemen
7]Ottoman jannissary
8]Spanish Tercio
9]Swedish Carolingean infantry
10]Japanese samurai
11]French imperial guard
12]British redcoat
13]Wehrmacht/waffen ss infantryman.


Honourable mention-Us marine corps,frederick the great's prussian infantry,han crossbowmen,gurkha,pashtun tribal,sikh,persian immortals,assyrian archer,vietnamese guerilla,french voltigeur,Red army guards,french foreign legion.

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## Water Car Engineer

Roman infantry crushed the Greek phalanx, hoplite, etc.

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## AUSTERLITZ

I know that,your point?The carolingian infantry also crushed the spanish tercio.Its called the evolution of militay tactics and arms.The new replace the old,doesn't mean the old were not kings in their day.So what's ur point?

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## KingMamba

AUSTERLITZ said:


> I know that,your point?The carolingian infantry also crushed the spanish tercio.Its called the evolution of militay tactics and arms.The new replace the old,doesn't mean the old were not kings in their day.So what's ur point?



Don't mind him, go for it. Looking forward to this discussion as well.

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## AUSTERLITZ

1.SPARTAN HOPLITE

Spartans have achieved a almost mythical status as warriors supreme,ad in their heyday the reputation was justified.Trained from birth in totally militarized society that existed solely for war and war alone,the spartan warrior was feared to the point where other greek armies simply refused to meet them in open battle,prefering to withstand siege warfare[weakness of the spartan army]All the greek states of classical greece and imperial persia were savaged by these born and bred for war red cloaked menaces.





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Spartan hoplites fought in a phalanx,with xyston spear,a hoplon/aspis round shield,a corinthian helmet and linothorax bronze cuirass.Close range weapon was the xiphos short sword, later replaced by the kopis.





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Spartans trained from birth for their whole life for only war,weak or physically deformed babies were discarded at birth.Death for sparta[the beautiful death] was considered the greatest objective of life.





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Equipment of a spartan hoplite.They were the best soldiers in the world and they knew it!





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A spartan shieldwall,impenetrable usually in a frontal battle.The spartans greatest hour was at thermopylae when 300 spartans stood their ground in a epic last stand against a invading huge persian army under xerxes,a feat that inspired the greeks.
Later the spartan hoplites would lead the greeks to victory in the battle of platea that destroyed the persian land invasion[the athenians led the greeks to victory at sea at salamis]





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The original close range weapon was the xyphos.Later the kopis was adopted.





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The later kopis.

How they fought-
Many here may have seen the movie 300,its fun popcorn movie,but also a major propaganda piece.The persians are depicted as wild half naked barbarians with piercings, lashing soldiers into battle,the immortals as goofy ninjas with scarred ghastly faces and fangs.They are also depicted using elephants and rhinos of all things.These are hilarious.But this battle scene despite the propaganda depicts accurately how the spartans fought in the shieldwall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdNn5TZu6R8
Its small video[5 mins].

Next:The macedonian Phalanx.

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## Water Car Engineer

AUSTERLITZ said:


> I know that,your point?The carolingian infantry also crushed the spanish tercio.Its called the evolution of militay tactics and arms.The new replace the old,doesn't mean the old were not kings in their day.So what's ur point?



Romans took a huge poop on them. The poop was all over their face. Drenched in it.


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## livingdead

Water Car Engineer said:


> Romans took a huge poop on them. The poop was all over their face. Drenched in it.


 He has already replied the reason why it was included in the list, if you have any other reason please post. There is no point saying same thing in different words. (like in next post romans nuked them or something like that)

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## Water Car Engineer

hinduguy said:


> He has already replied the reason why it was included in the list, if you have any other reason please post. There is no point saying same thing in different words. (like in next post romans nuked them or something like that)



The Romans nuked them also.

There were many infantry groups that were "king" of their times. And very much sophisticated, well equipped, and were much older than the Greeks. But they dont get the same hype.







Like the Sumerian phalanx.

What I notice about these lists it's always the same over hyped groups. Maybe the Chinese, Koreans, Mongols, Turkics etc were MUCH superior to the Japanese samurai. 

I bet the Song-Chinese infantry were superior to the Japanese samurai.

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## livingdead

Thanks for a positive contribution to the thread. I will be interested in knowing your list and the reason behind it, can you post it here? I am sure op wont mind.


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## Water Car Engineer

hinduguy said:


> Thanks for a positive contribution to the thread. I will be interested in knowing your list and the reason behind it, can you post it here? I am sure op wont mind.



I dont have a list honestly, because I don't know about all the infantry fielded by the many empires. Songs, Tangs, Manchus, and many others I'm sure fielded highly trained , well equipped, etc infantry but they don't get any hype from games, movies, books, etc.

But two infantry I'm a fan of are 


















*Assyrian infantry*










*Sumerian Phalanx *


These guys seem to be ahead of their times.

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## livingdead

Good find. 
BTW, dont take these list seriously, its just a way of saying these were quite good during their period. 
OP seems to have a good knowledge of military history which he is kindly sharing. My only knowledge of military history comes from Age of Empires.


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## Water Car Engineer

hinduguy said:


> Good find.
> BTW, dont take these list seriously, its just a way of saying these were quite good during their period. Its perfectly okey to have different view.
> OP seems to have a good knowledge of military history which he is kindly sharing. My only knowledge of military history comes from Age of Empires.



Lol, I didnt take it seriously. I'm just trolling.

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## Water Car Engineer

Various Assyrian soldiers. Assyria was a war machine.

In the last relief you can see a primitive siege weapon/ram. Amazing considering the time.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Thanks for ur useful contributions.I agree certain chinese dynasty troops can be said to be equally as good as the japanese samurai,though don't forget the samurai repulsed a amphibious invasion by the yuan dynasty of china.Also they didn't possess the fanaticism or warrior zeal of the samurai.
As for the assyrians the main killing wepaon was the archer ,not melee infantry.An assyrian army without its archers lost its offensive capability.As u see i have included assyrian archer and han crossbowmen in my honorable mentions list.Even gurkhas and french foreign legion are in that list.I can't include everybody .Feel free to add urs.
The main problem with sumerian phalanx is that there is no info at all except that one stele found.Thats why its impossible to include them.
Anyway here are some chinese infantry from the song dynasty and other periods.Quite good.




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But if i had to pick one chinese infantry it would be the chu ko nu crossbowman.




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Song dynasty imperial crossbowman.Devastating firepower.

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## Water Car Engineer

> Thanks for ur useful contributions.I agree certain chinese dynasty troops can be said to be equally as good as the japanese samurai,though don't forget the samurai repulsed a amphibious invasion by the yuan dynasty of china.Also they didn't possess the fanaticism or warrior zeal of the samurai.




Well, they kinda got lucky because of the kamikaze.

The Japanese also invaded Korea that ended in a complete failure.



> The main problem with sumerian phalanx is that there is no info at all except that one stele found



Not much info, but considering the time. The organization, equipment, training, etc seems way a head of its time. It's from 2600&#8211;2350 BC.






Stunning.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Water Car Engineer said:


> Well, they kinda got lucky because of the kamikaze.
> 
> The Japanese also invaded Korea that ended in a complete failure.
> 
> 
> 
> Not much info, but considering the time. The organization, equipment, training, etc seems way a head of its time. It's from all 2600&#8211;2350 BC.



Yes but the korean inavsion failed more due to logistics and naval weakness than the inferiority of japanese infantry.
Japanese invasions of Korea (1592
Read from 'military capabilities' section.


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## Water Car Engineer

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Yes but the korean inavsion failed more due to logistics and naval weakness than the inferiority of japanese infantry.
> Japanese invasions of Korea (1592
> Read from 'military capabilities' section.



What they were trying to do was impossible anyways, lol.

But in terms of infantry on infantry, I dont think there would be a huge difference honestly.


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## AUSTERLITZ

2.THE MACEDONIAN PHALANX.

One of the most celebrated and imitated military formations in history,the macedonian phalanx superseded the hoplite phalanx as the main instrument of hellenistic warfare.This unstoppable forest of 18 foot pikes were invulnerable from the front and as long as their flanks were secured could pin an enemy force in place pushing it constantly back.It was invented by philip of macedon ,father of alexander who intended to use it as a anvil to his heavy hetairoi cavalry's hammer.
He replaced the hoplite spear with a 18 ft sarissa and the shield with a smaller hand held shield.They were lighter,more mobile and among the first regularly drilled professional forces that allowed them to perform complex manuevres.Alexander cconquered his empire with these as the backbone of his army.





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They fought packed in a close rectangular formation, typically eight men deep, with a leader at the head of each column and a secondary leader in the middle, so that the back rows could move off to the sides if more frontage was needed.The basic unit of 256 men was called the syntagma.





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Difference with the hoplite phalanx.Before a battle the sarissa were carried in two pieces and then slid together when they were being used. At close range such large weapons were of little use, but an intact phalanx could easily keep its enemies at a distance; the weapons of the first five rows of men all projected beyond the front of the formation, so that there were more spearpoints than available targets at any given time.





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Syntagma ,side view.Faced with a forest of pikes.Enemies were usually helpless.The other held their spears upwrads to ward off arrows.





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The Macedonian phalanx was not very different from the Hoplite phalanx of other Greeks states, save it was better trained, armed with the sarissa enabling it to outreach its competitors and stave off enemy cavalry, and wore far lighter armor enabling longer endurance and long fast forced marches, including the ability to sprint to close and overwhelm opposing positions and archers. In essence, the range of their counter-weighted sarissa, allowed them superior mobility as well as superior defense and attack abilities despite the encumbrance disadvantages of the longer weapon once trained up to handling it in formation.




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Note the size of the man compared to the sarissa.





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Elite phalangites,were the argyraspides.Or silver shields.These were the veterans aged 45 and over who had fought under philip and alexander.In the successor wars,all suuccessor states fielded their own phalangites.The seleucids eventually developed their own argyraspid royal guard.Maintained at 10000.





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Macedonian battle formation.Note; hypaspists were elite hoplite style heavy infantry[not heavy cavalry as wrongly stated here]The elite heavy cavalry were the companions led by alexander in person.[first entry in best 12 cavalry thread]
Neither Philip nor Alexander actually used the phalanx as their arm of choice, but instead used it to hold the enemy in place while their heavy cavalry broke through their ranks. The Macedonian cavalry fought in wedge formation and was stationed on the far right; after these broke through the enemy lines they were followed by the hypaspists, elite infantrymen who served as the king's bodyguard, and then the phalanx proper. The left flank was generally covered by allied cavalry supplied by the Thessalians, which fought in rhomboid formation and served mainly in a defensive role.

Weaknesses:The armies of the early Hellenistic period were equipped and fought mainly in the same style as Alexander's. Towards the end, however, there was a general slide away from the combined arms approach back to using the phalanx itself as the arm of decision, having it charge into the enemy lines much like earlier hoplites had. This left the formation fairly vulnerable &#8212; though near invincible to forwards assault, phalanxes like other infantry formations were fairly prone to flanking, and worse still tending to break up when advancing quickly over rough ground. So long as everyone was using the same tactics these weaknesses were not immediately apparent, but with the advent of the Roman legion they proved fatal in every major engagement, the most famous being the Battle of Pydna, as the Romans were able to advance through gaps in the line and easily defeat the phalangites once in close on rough ground.
If used in a combined armed fashion led by competent generals such as pyrrhus of epirus,the phalangites proved they were still capable of defeating rome's armies albeit high cost.But the roman legion was the formation of the future.





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Next;Roman legion

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## AUSTERLITZ

3.THE ROMAN LEGION

The single most successful,long lasting and influential infantry formation in history the legions were rome's instrument of destruction,through which it conquered and ruled the ancient world for nearly 700 years!Even after the western roman empire fell,the eastern roman empire would last another 1000 yrs and their infantry too was based on the original roman model,though weapons and tactics had changed.Later european armies like the spanish tercio,again and again tried to capture the key principles of the roman success.





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This will be discussed in 3-4 parts because of the massive time frame,rome's legions constantly evolved and so did the tactics.Also because of the extensive information available on them.

Part 1;The republican legions


The legion['levy' in latin] began its career in a unspectacular manner .The first legions were essentially hoplites who fought in the greek manner with a round shield and spear and a straight sword in rigid formations.In the hilly terrain of italy they lost heavily to their more mobile samnite foes,and in 390 bc the gauls even sacked rome itself.This first incarnation of the legion was known as the servian legion.







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The Upper and lower tier of roman servian legionaries,equipment according to class divisions and wealth.Fought mostly as hoplites,with some skirmishers,archers and light cavalry in support.
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The romans learned,adapted and put forward a new system known as the manipular legion adopted from their enemies,the italian samnites but perfected by rome.
The new army was deployed in three liens known as maniples in a triplex aces.The first line were the 1200 hastati[young men of around 20.green with little combat experience].The second line were 1200 princeps [men at the prime of their life,combat experienced,usually former hastati] and third line of 600 triarii,older veterans.




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Hastati.They shed the spear.Adopted the new heavy throwing javelin the pilum and the stabbing short sword ,the greek hoplite shield was discarded in favour of the samnite oval scutum shield.The hastati would discharge their javelins before charging.





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2nd line princeps,similar equipment with heavier armour.





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The final line,they retained the hasta spear and fought as hoplites. 
These 3 were supported by a screen of skirmishers called velites.

The main genius of the formation was in its organization..Within this triplex acies system, contemporary Roman writers talk of the maniples adopting a checkered formation called quincunx when deployed for battle but not yet engaged. In the first line, the hastati left gaps equal in size to their cross-sectional area between each maniple. The second line consisting of principes followed in a similar manner, lining up behind the gaps left by the first line. This was also done by the third line, standing behind the gaps in the second line. The velites were deployed in front of this line in a continuous, loose-formation line.




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As the army approached its enemy, the velites in front would throw their javelins at the enemy and then retreat through the gaps in the lines. This was an important innovation since in other armies of the period skirmishers would have to either retreat through their own armies ranks, causing confusion, or else flee around either flank of their own army. After the velites had retreated through the hastati, the 'posterior' century would march to the left and then forward so that they presented a solid line, creating a solid line of soldiers. The same procedure would be employed as they passed through the second and third ranks or turned to the side to channel down the gap between the first and second rows on route to help guard the legion's flanks





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At this point, the legion then presented a solid line to the enemy and the legion was in the correct formation for engagement. When the enemy closed, the hastati would charge. If they were losing the fight, the 'posterior' century returned to its position creating gaps again. Then the maniples would fall back through the gaps in the principes, who followed the same procedure to form a battle line and charge. If the principes could not break the enemy, they would retreat behind the triarii and the whole army would leave the battlefield in good order. According to some writers, the triarii formed a continuous line when they deployed, and their forward movement allowed scattered or discomfited units to rest and reform, to later rejoin the struggle.

The manipular system allowed engaging every kind of enemy even in rough terrain, because the legion had both flexibility and toughness according to the deployment of its lines. Lack of a strong cavalry corps however, was a major flaw of the Roman forces.

Still don't get it?Go see the flash animation on this link.
A Warhammer Ancient Battles Site

The checkerboard formation in action,.When engaged they would present a solid line.[can't post more than 8 images per post,so will make a isolated post to display the checkerboard formation within each maniple after this post].
Another unique feature of the Roman infantry was the depth of its spacing. Most ancient armies deployed in shallower formations, particularly phalanx-type forces. Phalanxes might deepen their ranks heavily to add both stamina and shock power, but their general approach still favored one massive line, as opposed to the deep three-layer Roman arrangement. The advantage of the Roman system is that it allowed the continual funneling or metering of combat power forward over a longer period&#8212;massive, steadily renewed pressure to the front&#8212;until the enemy broke.If both the hastati and princeps failed they could either retreat behind the triarii to reform while they presented a barrier of pikes and retire in good order or attack again with the triarii acting as the final reserve.

This was primarily the army that conquered greece,carthage and the seleucids and won rome the dominance of the mediteranean.


PART 2;Marian legions.Caesar.

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## AUSTERLITZ

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Notice in the first picture the maniples of the first line deployed in checkerboard formation.In the distance u can see the 2nd and third line maniples too.
In the 2nd pic.The red indicates hastati,blue principes.


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## Koovie

the outcome of a legion vs phalanx fight is indeed a difficult question. I would say the type of commander would have made the difference between victory and defeat. But I also think that the highly mobile and flexible Romans had a slight advantage with their legions. Especially the late republican ones/imperial ones.

OT: Anyone else waiting for this game?

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## Kambojaric

Rome Total War was a classic game especially with mods like EB. On topic as I stated in the previous banned thread, IMO the Roman Legions take the title of best infantry in history at any time of the day. Fierce, skilled and organized with good armour. What more can a general ask for.

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## AUSTERLITZ

ROMAN LEGION -PART 2

The Marian Legion

Though the manipular legion was a great improvement,hannibal's combined arms tactics in the punic wars demonstrated its weaknesses.The reforms were unofficially begun under scipio africanus and finally completed under gaius marius to counter the germanic threat.The legion which was previously a conscript force was now slowly becoming a professional army.Marius removed all class requirements.





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The maniples were done away with,replaced by the cohort.
The distinction between the heavy infantry types of hastati, principes and triarii had began to blur, perhaps because the state was now assuming the responsibility of providing standard-issue equipment to all but the first class of troops, who alone were able to afford their own equipment and under marius were officially removed.The cohort was 480 men each,composed of 8 centuries of 80 men each.At the right of the legion the best cohort was stationed ,composed of 800 men.They were the most experienced soldiers and fought at the right flank because thats where their right flanks would be uncovered ,unlike in the centre where the next roman shield would cover the exposed right flank of a legionary.
The young men were still placed in front and the senior veterans in the back of a cohort according to manipular legion principles.
A legion consisted of ten cohorts.9 normal and one first cohort.





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This is what caesar's men would have looked like.Hamata chainmail armour.Note the romans adopted the gallic helmet from the gauls and the stabbing short sword gladius hispanseis from the iberians who they faced under carthage.This roman trait from learning from their enemies was a great asset.They copied the samnite pilum[made their own ingenious addition],scutum shield[modified it themselves],greek siege ballistas[created their own similar scorpions],the gallic helmet from the gauls and the short sword from spanish.They also began to use field artillery like ballistas.





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The roman republican eagle.Marius gave the legions their silver/golden eagles.To lose its eagle was the ultimate disgrace for a legion.Napoleon copied this and gave eagles to his regiments.




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The pilum heavy javelin.Each legionary carried 2.These were designed to bend on impact meaning a thrown pilum couldn't be thrown back by the enemy.It was a lethal armour piercing weapon and was designed so that even if the enemy didn't die from the pilum by taking the blow on his shield,it would get stuck in his shield making it unusable.This meant the enemy now had to face the roman legionary without his shield.Bad idea against roman infantry.




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The melee weapon was the short stabbing sword,the gladius .And a small dagger too.The legionary would throw his pilum ,either killing or removing his opponent's shield.Now in close combat he would thrust him back with his big shield and pin him down/obstruct his view and from behind the protection of the shield bring his short sword into the enemy's gut and intestines.It was a brutally effective method.





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The dreaded pila storm.Any army approaching roman infantry would face a storm of thousands of these javelins.Just play rome total war,u'll know how brutal pila are.

THE IMPERIAL LEGIONS-PART 3.

After the roman civil wars,rome became a empire.The legions were reorganized by emperor augustus as fully professional voluntary standing army soldiers paid and equipped by the state.Each legionary served for upto 25 yrs.Imperial rome usally fielded a force of 30 legions each with around 5000 men.And an equal number of auxillary allied legions for a standing army of around 350000.Usually most of these were involved in guarding the frontiers,so for new camapigns only 5 -10 max were available.Coupled with similar number auxillaries.This would still be a large force.[50000-100000 men]
Roman discipline became legendary,it was said that 'their battles were bloody drills,and drills bloodless battles'.





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The imperial legions.The new rectangular shield and segmented armour.

How they fought.First they would throw pilum,then.....this video explains the dreaded roman wedge formation and system of rotating troops.Excellent video.Its about boudicca's revolt against the romans and the battle where it ended with 9000 romans slaughtering 80000 britons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHl9jYue_g

Next:The imperial legions continued.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Part 3:The imperial legions.[continued]





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Roman legionaries.100AD during dacian wars of trajan.Note the deadly dacian romphoria sickle like weapon.This weapon had such slashing power it could slice through the edges of the shield and strike hand of the legionary holding it.To counter it the romans adopted the hand guard and added iron edges to the shields.




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Legionaries with hand guards at the peak of the empire.





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The equipment of imperial roman legionaries.Note the superb lightweight segmented armour the lorica segmenta and the gallic helmet,plus pilum and gladius.





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The famed roman testudo or tortoise formation.This was a defensive formation that provided excellent protection against missile troops and was also used for sieges.Against eastern cavalry and horse archers,this formation along with field artillery like archers and ballistas,combined with light cavalry and new slingers with deadly lead bullets were used.





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One of the roman formations used for recieving heavy cavalry,units like this would form hollow squares with slingers and missile troops in the centre.Directly charging roman legionnaries was usually suicidal unless u could break up their formation.Even for cataphracts.





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Each imperial roman legion had a artillery corps of 130 ballistas and scorpions.these provided direct fire support and from field fortifications were devastating as the gauls found out at alesia.





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A roman legionary with equipment.The digging equipment was carried.Romans were masters at building roads,and till the 16th century and whole of the middle ages,roman roads were the main infrastructure of europe and north africa.Hence the saying-'all roads lead to rome'.
They were also masters of field fortifications,good cavalry based armies against which romans were sometimes at a disadvantage usually couldn't exploit any battlefield success much as they were helpless vs roman fortifications protected by artillery and legionaries.Alaric the goth,sacked rome in 410 AD during the fall of the western roman empire.Was very wary of roman fortifications and famously said-'I have made peace with walls' after suffering devastating losses in an attempt.





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A roman mobile fort.The Roman Legions used to carry EVERYTHING they needed to form their own stockade, an armed camp to include the wood for fencing! No matter where they were, deserts, woods, swamps they could stop and set up a protective camp. In fact, you can still see the traces of their encampments today in archaeological ruins. The Roman Camp was a vital technique used in the military. One might ask themselves, technique? Yes, technique. The Roman Camp was actually a detailed strategy used to prevent surprise attack. The Roman Legions would easily control their surroundings by taking a portable city wherever they went. The Army would march all day, and when they found a spot to settle, the entire army could build a camp that ran as efficiently as a well-planned city. The only difference between the Roman Camp and the Roman City was that the camp would be in a different location the next day.

The Roman Camp was easily built in about six hours. The first step in building the city is constructing the walls. The camp would be surrounded in fossa (ditch) and an agger (wall). This ditch and wall system made it difficult to attack, and often would slow down the enemy.
The Roman Camp was shaped like a square, with entrances at the midpoint of each of its sides. The entire camp perimeter was made of a strong wall, built up by a vallum. This vallum had walkways that were constantly guarded by centurions, and each portae is guarded by an additional watchtower. The guarded gates in the vallum were called portae. The camp was connected by roads which were built as straight as possible. The way the road system worked was that the Via Principia connected the eastern and western portae, and the Via Praetoria connected the north and south portae.
All the Soldiers were quartered inside cantebernium, which were tents that could hold eight men at a time. The general's tent, called the Praetorium, was located in the center of the camp, where the main roads intersected. Outside the general's tent was a flagpole. When certain flags were raised, battle could be signaled.

Next;Late roman legion.Decline of the heavy legions.


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## AUSTERLITZ

PART 4:The Late Roman legion.





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From around 250 AD a slow decline began in the quality of the roman infantry.From the 4rth century a.d the great tribal migrtions of the germanic tribes began.Revolts and succession struggles,plus the persistent threat of the new sassanids in the east.Combined to overwhelm the empire's forces.To combat the more frequent raids and advances of their hostile neighbors the legions were changed from slow and heavy to much lighter troops, and cavalry was introduced as a serious concept.Now ther was one cavalryman to 3 infantry to the earlier 1 to 40.The legion was trimmed down to meager 1000-1500 men units.
This meant that the new subdivided infantry lost the awesome power that the earlier legions had, meaning that whilst they were more likely to see a battle they were less likely to win it. That legion size was at an all time low was also a factor.Roman horsemen, while fast and more numerous,were actually much too weak to cope with the very cavalry based invasions of the Huns, Goths, Vandals and Sassanids.





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Another primary reason was the 'barbarisation of the infantry'. Essentially it is argued that the increasing barbarization of the heavy legions weakened weaponry, training, morale and military effectiveness in the long run.The italians no longer had citizenship privilage and legions recruited from all over the empire.Most barbarians fought under their own leaders in their own style and since were not italains generally didn't have the same morale of earlier legions.Such practices as permitting the settlement of massive, armed barbarian populations on Roman territory, the watering down of the privilege of citizenship, increasing use of alien contingents, and relaxation or removal of traditionally thorough and severe Roman discipline, organization and control, contributed to the decline of the heavy infantry.





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The late roman legion used round shields because the Roman state didn't have the money to train the soldiers to work as an organized fighting machine like the early legion was. Instead the late legion was a militia and hence had to use round shields because round shields are better in individual combat.
The excellent but expensive lorica segmenta armour was also abandoned.The spear became prevelant.The romans were now armed and armoured mostly like their barbarian enemies.Later roman authors lamented this decline and praised their old legionaries.





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These comitatenses were the mobile heavy infantry of the late legions.





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Evolution of the legionary.





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Evolution of the legions through the ages.





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Note the praetorian legion on the extreme right.These were the roman imperial guard.They were initially superb troops but like the ottoman jannisaries later became corrupt and took part in palace coups and intrigues.

Next:English Longbow.

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## KingMamba

AUSTERLITZ said:


> 2.THE MACEDONIAN PHALANX.
> 
> One of the most celebrated and imitated military formations in history,the macedonian phalanx superseded the hoplite phalanx as the main instrument of hellenistic warfare.This unstoppable forest of 18 foot pikes were invulnerable from the front and as long as their flanks were secured could pin an enemy force in place pushing it constantly back.It was invented by philip of macedon ,father of alexander who intended to use it as a anvil to his heavy hetairoi cavalry's hammer.
> He replaced the hoplite spear with a 18 ft sarissa and the shield with a smaller hand held shield.They were lighter,more mobile and among the first regularly drilled professional forces that allowed them to perform complex manuevres.Alexander cconquered his empire with these as the backbone of his army.
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> They fought packed in a close rectangular formation, typically eight men deep, with a leader at the head of each column and a secondary leader in the middle, so that the back rows could move off to the sides if more frontage was needed.The basic unit of 256 men was called the syntagma.
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> Difference with the hoplite phalanx.Before a battle the sarissa were carried in two pieces and then slid together when they were being used. At close range such large weapons were of little use, but an intact phalanx could easily keep its enemies at a distance; the weapons of the first five rows of men all projected beyond the front of the formation, so that there were more spearpoints than available targets at any given time.
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> Syntagma ,side view.Faced with a forest of pikes.Enemies were usually helpless.The other held their spears upwrads to ward off arrows.
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> The Macedonian phalanx was not very different from the Hoplite phalanx of other Greeks states, save it was better trained, armed with the sarissa enabling it to outreach its competitors and stave off enemy cavalry, and wore far lighter armor enabling longer endurance and long fast forced marches, including the ability to sprint to close and overwhelm opposing positions and archers. In essence, the range of their counter-weighted sarissa, allowed them superior mobility as well as superior defense and attack abilities despite the encumbrance disadvantages of the longer weapon once trained up to handling it in formation.
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> Note the size of the man compared to the sarissa.
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> Elite phalangites,were the argyraspides.Or silver shields.These were the veterans aged 45 and over who had fought under philip and alexander.In the successor wars,all suuccessor states fielded their own phalangites.The seleucids eventually developed their own argyraspid royal guard.Maintained at 10000.
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> Macedonian battle formation.Note; hypaspists were elite hoplite style heavy infantry[not heavy cavalry as wrongly stated here]The elite heavy cavalry were the companions led by alexander in person.[first entry in best 12 cavalry thread]
> Neither Philip nor Alexander actually used the phalanx as their arm of choice, but instead used it to hold the enemy in place while their heavy cavalry broke through their ranks. The Macedonian cavalry fought in wedge formation and was stationed on the far right; after these broke through the enemy lines they were followed by the hypaspists, elite infantrymen who served as the king's bodyguard, and then the phalanx proper. The left flank was generally covered by allied cavalry supplied by the Thessalians, which fought in rhomboid formation and served mainly in a defensive role.
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> Weaknesses:The armies of the early Hellenistic period were equipped and fought mainly in the same style as Alexander's. Towards the end, however, there was a general slide away from the combined arms approach back to using the phalanx itself as the arm of decision, having it charge into the enemy lines much like earlier hoplites had. This left the formation fairly vulnerable &#8212; though near invincible to forwards assault, phalanxes like other infantry formations were fairly prone to flanking, and worse still tending to break up when advancing quickly over rough ground. So long as everyone was using the same tactics these weaknesses were not immediately apparent, but with the advent of the Roman legion they proved fatal in every major engagement, the most famous being the Battle of Pydna, as the Romans were able to advance through gaps in the line and easily defeat the phalangites once in close on rough ground.
> If used in a combined armed fashion led by competent generals such as pyrrhus of epirus,the phalangites proved they were still capable of defeating rome's armies albeit high cost.But the roman legion was the formation of the future.
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> Next;Roman legion



Macedonia Battle of Gaugamela 331 BC - YouTube


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## AUSTERLITZ

Bamxa said:


> Rome Total War was a classic game especially with mods like EB. On topic as I stated in the previous banned thread, IMO the Roman Legions take the title of best infantry in history at any time of the day. Fierce, skilled and organized with good armour. What more can a general ask for.



Try roma surrectum 2 mod 1 turn campaigns.Just epic.The romans were disciplined,educated,patient,flexible,persistent and ruthless.Diffcult combo to overcome.


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## KingMamba

Koovie said:


> the outcome of a legion vs phalanx fight is indeed a difficult question. I would say the type of commander would have made the difference between victory and defeat. But I also think that the highly mobile and flexible Romans had a slight advantage with their legions. Especially the late republican ones/imperial ones.
> 
> OT: Anyone else waiting for this game?



I am waiting for that, the last time I played total war was couple of years ago. Total war Empires.

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## AUSTERLITZ

KingMamba93 said:


> Macedonia Battle of Gaugamela 331 BC - YouTube



One of the worst movies i have ever seen.The persians are constantly depicted as orgy enjoying,womanizing,slave masters.While the fact is that the macedonians themselves were masters of orgies,homosexuality and such.Alexander himself was bisexual.And the 'civilized' macedonians under alexander often butchered entire cities including their own greeks like thebes.So they were certainly not paragons of virtue and civilization fighting the barbarians,though they certainly were the better military machine.
Also all modern accounts agree darius's force was not 250000 as it was not logistically feasible but around 200000.This would be the total force when including the huge persian baggage train along with the non combatants.Of these around 120,000 were actual combatants that faced the macedonians.
The film is full of historical inaccuracies such as alexander's wife roxanne being shown as a african,while actually she was central asian.The indians of porus from the punjab area are made to look like polynesians and alexander does a hilarious faceoff against a elephant with his horse lol.In reality horses would run from the smell of elephants and he charges into this elephant.

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## KingMamba

AUSTERLITZ said:


> One of the worst movies i have ever seen.The persians are constantly depicted as orgy enjoying,womanizing,slave masters.While the fact is that the macedonians themselves were masters of orgies,homosexuality and such.Alexander himself was bisexual.And the 'civilized' macedonians under alexander often butchered entire cities including their own greeks like thebes.So they were certainly not paragons of virtue and civilization fighting the barbarians,though they certainly were the better military machine.
> Also all modern accounts agree darius's force was not 250000 as it was not logistically feasible but around 200000.This would be the total force when including the huge persian baggage train along with the non combatants.Of these around 120,000 were actual combatants that faced the macedonians.
> The film is full of historical inaccuracies such as alexander's wife roxanne being shown as a african,while actually she was central asian.The indians of porus from the punjab area are made to look like polynesians and alexander does a hilarious faceoff against a elephant with his horse lol.In reality horses would run from the smell of elephants and he charges into this elephant.



Yes, some of the battles were far fetched but I posted it because of the maneuver Alexander did. This is pretty much how he got the army to rout in that particular battle, they did show the Greeks as womanizers and such. They also blatantly made it clear that Alexander was bisexual. Yes, the elephant scene was hilarious but most accounts say he did go head to head with Porus and was knocked out, after which his lieutenants captured Porus (which is a fishy).


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## TheRafael00000

AUSTERLITZ said:


> One of the worst movies i have ever seen.The persians are constantly depicted as orgy enjoying,womanizing,slave masters.While the fact is that the macedonians themselves were masters of orgies,homosexuality and such.Alexander himself was bisexual.And the 'civilized' macedonians under alexander often butchered entire cities including their own greeks like thebes.So they were certainly not paragons of virtue and civilization fighting the barbarians,though they certainly were the better military machine.
> Also all modern accounts agree darius's force was not 250000 as it was not logistically feasible but around 200000.This would be the total force when including the huge persian baggage train along with the non combatants.Of these around 120,000 were actual combatants that faced the macedonians.
> The film is full of historical inaccuracies such as alexander's wife roxanne being shown as a african,while actually she was central asian.The indians of porus from the punjab area are made to look like polynesians and alexander does a hilarious faceoff against a elephant with his horse lol.In reality horses would run from the smell of elephants and he charges into this elephant.



*It's a Hollywood brainwash among our society. We eat what they feed us. They teach us Civilization was built by Greeks. They teach us Greeks are great warriors, skilled in Engineering and many more. But the real truth is Greeks were a low caste among Roman tribes. But Greeks merged and others somehow failed to do so. West always favored Greeks. So keep on eating what they teach you! *


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## KingMamba

TheRafael00000 said:


> *It's a Hollywood brainwash among our society. We eat what they feed us. They teach us Civilization was built by Greeks. They teach us Greeks are great warriors, skilled in Engineering and many more. But the real truth is Greeks were a low caste among Roman tribes. But Greeks merged and others somehow failed to do so. West always favored Greeks. So keep on eating what they teach you! *



What the hell you ranting on about, we know they exaggerate we aren't children.

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## carplii

junk, not worth anything


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## AUSTERLITZ

carplii said:


> junk, not worth anything



The movie or the thread?


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## AUSTERLITZ

4.THE ENGLISH LONGBOWMAN

The longbow was the machine gun of the Middle Ages[1200 A.D to 1500 A.D]: accurate, deadly, possessed of a long range and rapid rate of fire, the flight of its missiles was likened to a storm.The dreaded english longbowman was responsible for victories against enormous odds especially during the anglo-french hundred years war.Time and again the brutal firepower provided by hail of longbows arrows mowed down the french knights and crossbowmen in thousands.





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On the battlefield English archers stored their arrows stabbed upright into the ground at their feet, reducing the time it took to notch, draw and loose, as drawing from a quiver or arrow bag is slower. An unintended effect of this practice was that an arrowhead that had been stuck into the dirty ground would be more likely to cause infection.





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Archery is not very accurate at extreme distances, so generals massed longbowmen in order to create a 'cloud of arrows.' A skilful general would alternate flights of arrows with cavalry charges and sometimes flank attacks to demoralise the enemy. The arrows were used in volleys and not aimed at specific targets until the enemy was quite close. Although bowmen were still deadly at close range, they were light troops unsuited to prolonged hand-to-hand combat and were vulnerable to a committed attack by cavalry. Consequently they were often deployed behind physical barricades, such as stakes and poles driven into the ground and had armoured dismounted knights or men at arms for close range protection.





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The weapon.The welsh longbow could fire at a range of 250 m.A seasoned longbowman with high draw strength could fire upto 400 metres.Rate of fire was around 6 shots per minute.





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A longbowman's equipment.The legend of robinhood is intimately associated with the longbowman.
Penetration was lethal.A british noble writes-'' the war against the Welsh, one of the men of arms was struck by an arrow shot at him by a Welshman. It went right through his thigh, high up, where it was protected inside and outside the leg by his iron cuirasses, and then through the skirt of his leather tunic; next it penetrated that part of the saddle which is called the alva or seat; and finally it lodged in his horse, driving so deep that it killed the animal''.





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The typical missile troop of the middle ages was the crossbowman,even the famed genoese crossbowmen in french service were totally outclassed in both range and firing rate by the longbow which mowed them down before they even got close enough.





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Longbows were very difficult to master because the force required to deliver an arrow through the improving armour of medieval Europe was very high by modern standards. Along with the greater ability of gunfire to penetrate plate armour, it was the long training needed by longbowmen which eventually led to their being replaced by musketmen though the lonbow still had a superior firing rate than muskets.

Next:Viking berserker

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## AUSTERLITZ

5.VIKING BERSERKER

From the 8th century A.D to the 11th century A.D nothing was more terrifying to europe's dark ages than the viking raider.The coasts of europe from russia to britain to spain were set ablaze by these massive axe wielding monstrosities and their amphibious asaults from bases in scandinavia and iceland.The chosen among the norse warriors were the terrifying berserker who went into battle semi naked in fit of drugged mindless rage wearing bearskin or wolfskins and horned helmets ready to join thor and odin in their feast at valhalla[the viking concept of paradise,where fallen warriors would join odin in a grand feast drinking in cups made out of the skulls of their enemies]




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The name berserker arose from their reputed habit of wearing a kind of shirt or coat (Old Norse: serkr) made from the pelt of a bear (Old Norse: ber-) during battle.




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They fought in a nearly uncontrollable, trance-like fury, a characteristic which later gave rise to the English word berserk.This believed to be done from consumed drugged foods.The actual fit of madness the berserker experienced was referred to as berserkergang ("going berserk"). This condition has been described as follows:

This fury, which was called berserkergang, occurred not only in the heat of battle, but also during laborious work. Men who were thus seized performed things which otherwise seemed impossible for human power. This condition is said to have begun with shivering, chattering of the teeth, and chill in the body, and then the face swelled and changed its colour. With this was connected a great hot-headedness, which at last gave over into a great rage, under which they howled as wild animals, bit the edge of their shields, and cut down everything they met without discriminating between friend or foe. When this condition ceased, a great dulling of the mind and feebleness followed, which could last for one or several days.





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Vikings coming ashore on a raid.Rurik the viking established the tsardom of russia with the origin of the romanov dynasty at novgorod.





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A chosen norse berserker.The longaxe was the weapon of choice and for those strong enough to wield it,provided massive blunt force and shock as well as penetration that would penetrate even medieval armour.





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Viking weapons.The longsword was another weapon commonly used by vikings,but berserkers prefered the brutal battle axe.The barbarian character of diablo 2/3 is based on the berserker.





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Viking helmets,on the right u can also see the arab and samurai helmets.





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Last Stand of the viking berserker:25 September 1066. The Saxons really had the Vikings by the balls now. The saxon army had caught the vikings unprepared and dispersed,With all of the Viking warriors on the West bank either slaughtered or running for their lives, the Saxon forces prepared to charge over the river, jam their spears into the eyes of anyone wearing animal fur and complete the destruction of these Norse invaders once and for all. However, even with the Northman Army reeling and in complete disarray, victory would not come so easily for the Saxon Army. 
Standing astride the bridge was one man. A giant Norse berserker silently surveyed the Saxon army, firmly clutching a massive double-bladed Greataxe in his weathered, calloused hands. A lone Viking hero granted permission by his King to die honorably in combat, tasked with defending the narrow bridge and buying time for his brethren to reorganize. His face was concealed by an imposing horned helm - metal plates reinforcing a mask constructed from the bleached bone remains of a fearsome animal skull, his wild eyes peering through the darkness like searing orbs of white-hot flame. A living demon, sent forth from the darkest recesses of Hell itself to exact brutal vengeance on any mortal brave or foolish enough to cross him, defying anyone with more balls than sense to test his wrath.
The full might of the Anglo-Saxon army charged the bridge, determined to extricate this colossal beast from his post through the sheer weight of their numbers, but the narrow walkway above the raging waters of the River Derwent was only wide enough for four men to stand abreast, and its guardian was unwavering in his resolve. The first rank of fighting men crashed full-speed into the Norseman like a school bus full of insolent teenagers being hurled face-first into a wall of unflinching spikes. For almost an hour this resolute 20th Level Fighter single-handedly tore through the English like a chainsaw-wielding space marine with the God Mode cheat activated, shaking off even the most horrific wounds as if they were gunshot wounds from a laser tag weapon and slaughtering more soldiers than a bad Sci-Fi Channel Original movie. After watching this man unleash mayhem so brutal that it would make even the most hardcore MMA enthusiasts nauseous, one clever Saxon warrior wised up and decided not to try and test this barbarian's might. He floated a barrel in the river, hopped in, drifted underneath the bridge, and jammed his spear up through the planks, striking the Viking in his only weak point - the ball sack. 
Achilles had his infamous heel,and finally the berserker went down after another strike.
The legend would live on as the lone viking of stamford bridge.
Note[excerpts of the story taken from badass of the week site,i don't take credit so don't flame me]





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The vikings eventually settled down , but many made their way to the byzantine empire where they formed the elite imperial guard known as the varangian guard.This was one of the best medieval infantry forces and usually fought to the death around their emperor.

Next:Swiss Pikeman.

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## AUSTERLITZ

TheRafael00000 said:


> *It's a Hollywood brainwash among our society. We eat what they feed us. They teach us Civilization was built by Greeks. They teach us Greeks are great warriors, skilled in Engineering and many more. But the real truth is Greeks were a low caste among Roman tribes. But Greeks merged and others somehow failed to do so. West always favored Greeks. So keep on eating what they teach you! *



A loud unnecessary rant,the greeks WERE great warriors,and skilled in engeneering.Athens did produce a great civilization of artists,philosophers like plato,socrates,aristotle,sophocles etc.They were also the first major democratic power.But this doesn't mean that others were barbarians,the persians too had a advanced and great civilization.Don't belittle anyone.
By the roman times greeks had declined,taken over by macedonia.But they revived under the byzantines which was essentially a greek empire built on roman ideals.The film is bad because its one sided,historically inaccurate and partial.But this doesn't mean greeks were 'low caste' useless as u say.


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## AUSTERLITZ

6.SWISS PIKEMEN

Today switzerland might have the reputation of peaceful country of banks,chocolates and swiss cheese but from around 1300 AD to 1500 A.D the swiss pikeman was the most fearsome heavy infantry of the european battlefield.Among the most sought after mercenaries in europe they fought for the highest bidders when not fighting for switzerland's principlalities.The scourge of medieval knights, these steel clad forest of pikes were a main reason for the decline of the european knight.





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The swiss pikemen usually formed the hollow pike square and were disciplined drilled troops.





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How about a heavy cavalry charge?No thanks.




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The Swiss, with their head-down attack in huge columns with the long pike, refusal to take prisoners, and consistent record of victory, were greatly feared and admired&#8212;for instance, Machiavelli addresses their system of combat at length in The Prince. The Valois Kings of France, in fact, considered it a virtual impossibility to take the field of battle without Swiss pikemen as the infantry core of their armies. 




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The swiss fought in pike squares,these were similar but much more flexible tan the ancient macedonian phalanx and could easily take attacks on flanks by redirecting troops from the centre of the square,another reason was that the swiss pikeman was actually armed with a combination of pikes and the shorter halberd,which was much more easily used by one man.





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Swiss halberd,a pike square had a combination of pikes and halberds as well as a crossbowman screen.





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The only remaining swiss pikemen active.The vatican swiss guard,charged with protecting the pope.The bourbon kings of france also had a swiss guard.





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Pikemen usually had a sword as secondary weapon.As time went by they shed their earlier full plate mail armour for lighter armour.





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The increasing use of handguns and artillery led to the first problems,and german mercenries known as landschnedts also began to copy swiss tactics.The final blow came when the spanish who had faced the swiss in french service and suffered,developed their own all arms pike squares with a combination of musketeers,armoured swordsmen and pikemen which came to be known as the tercio.This would be the infantry formation of the future.

Next:The ottoman jannisssary.

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## Tridibans

Very good thread Austerlitz.... very informative for the history buffs especially the Vikings and The English Longbowman. Time to play Civilisation on my PC.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Tridibans said:


> Very good thread Austerlitz.... very informative for the history buffs especially the Vikings and The English Longbowman. Time to play Civilisation on my PC.



Thanks mate for the encouragement.Not to brag but this does take up a lot of time.


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## Tridibans

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Thanks mate for the encouragement.Not to brag but this does take up a lot of time.



Eagerly waiting for the Samurais (Bushido traditions has been one of the most interestimng topics for me in Japan's history ) and the Wehrmacht (as they were the closest to our generation who terrified half the world with their awsome military tactics but an insane madman at the helm).  Cheers to your thread again.

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## meghdut

Wow after a very very long time something worth reading and bookmarking. Thank you sir, loads of hard work there I see.

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## AUSTERLITZ

7.THE OTTOMAN JANISSARY

The elite fighting force of the ottoman empire,the janissaries were the a model of efficiency and the dread of christian european forces for much of their existence.At the vanguard of a turkish assault these disciplined,utterly fearless ,religiously indoctrined imperial guards of the turkish sultans were a fearsome sight to behold usually charging into battle with the cries of 'allah!allah!.





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Janissaries were originally recruited from among the christian subjects of the empire especially fromthe balkans.Every five years the Turkish administrators would scour their regions for the strongest sons of the sultan's Christian subjects. These boys, usually between the ages of 10 and 12, were then taken from their parents and given to the Turkish families in the provinces to learn Turkish language and customs, and the rules of Islam; these boys were then enrolled in Janissary training. The recruit was immediately indoctrinated into the religion of Islam. He was supervised 24 hours a day and subjected to severe discipline: he was prohibited from growing a beard, taking up a skill other than war, or marrying.In this spartan lifestyle they resembled many of the christian knight organizations like the templars or knights of malta.The Janissaries were extremely well disciplined (a rarity in the Middle Ages).Eventually as the janissaries grew in power and became a prestigious organization that rivalled the power of the turkish aristocracy,turkish parents would voluntarily allow their children to serve in the janissary corps.





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The original janissaries were founded by sultan murad in the 1380s.They were famed for their skills in archery and at nicopolis 1396 bayezid's janissary archers caused heavy losses among the crusader knights.Later from 1500 onwards they switched to matchlock muskets and gained proficiency in this too.





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Janissary assault.Janissaries had a reputation for fearlessness and excellent marksmanship.Janissary sappers and miners were also very capable siege warfare specialists.The janissary corps became the ottoman standing army.





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Jannisaries were the only regular infantry division in the turkish army,the rest being levies and served in the european campaigns as well as wars against safavid persia and the mamelukes of egypt.Thye were usually kept at a strength of 10000-15000 men until 1600 A.D.From 1600 until their demise in 1826 by order of the sultan ,the janissaries increased massively to around 50000.Around this time they began to become a state within a state,organizing palace coups and taking part in palace intrigues while their military effectiveness declined due to less discipline and reluctance to adopt new technologies such as flintlocks and lighter artillery.In this they were similar to the earlier roman praetorian guards.





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The Janissary corps was distinctive in a number of ways: they were the first regular army to wear unique uniforms.They were also paid regular salaries for their service[not prevelant in middle ages]; marched to music, the mehter; lived in barracks; and used mainly firearms.





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Janissary muskets.





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For close combat,the janissaries used the kilij sabre and the yataghan swords.





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Another was a unique ottoman smallbore anti infantry light artillery gun mounted on a tripod callled the abus gun.

Next:Japanese samurai.

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## AUSTERLITZ

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The janissary lives on in popular media.DC comics recently unvieled its new superheroine named the janissary.





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Kemal ataturk in traditional janissary dress during his soldiering days 1913.

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## indushek

Congratulations on this great effort by you, please keep posting. Very informative.

Offtopic u seem to be very knowledge'd on the war topics right from earliest known periods and forces till date. Can u suggest some site for reading on this subject i mean things like tactics how they evolved and armies etc etc.

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## AUSTERLITZ

@indushek
Napoleon, His Army and Enemies : Napoleonic Battles : Uniforms : Maps : Tactics

Earlier link for info on the napoleonic age.

iacta alea est &#8211; The Realm of Chance
Lots of important battles in epic detail.

The Art of Battle: Animated Battle Maps
Superb site for battle animations.Needs powerpoint viewer[free download] .View as slideshow.

Apart from these recommend 2 great military history forums.
Historum - History Forums
Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History

Another forum for extensive info on ww2 german military.
Axis History Forum &bull; Index page

This site is my primary source of learning.
Osprey Publishing - Military History Books - Campaign
The campaign series is epic,truly in every sense of the word along with the command and elite serieses[elite series deals with indivual soldier types].See the catalogue ,pick which one u want to know about.If u are confused about one do a google wiki search on it.Wikipedia is a much maligned but very easily obtainable source of info as it gives u a background info on the whole thing pretty quickly.

Anyway now that u have seen the catalogues but can't read the books.Check ur message box for how to download and read as i don't want to violate forum rules.

http://napoleonistyka.atspace.com/

Earlier link for info on the napoleonic age.

http://iactaaleaest.wordpress.com/
Lots of important battles in epic detail.

http://www.theartofbattle.com/
Superb site for battle animations.Needs powerpoint viewer[free download] .View as slideshow.

Apart from these recommend 2 great military history forums.
http://www.historum.com/
www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/

Another forum for extensive info on ww2 german military.
http://forum.axishistory.com/

This site is my primary source of learning.
http://www.ospreypublishing.com/campaign/
The campaign series is epic,truly in every sense of the word along with the command and elite serieses[elite series deals with indivual soldier types].See the catalogue ,pick which one u want to know about.If u are confused about one do a google wiki search on it.Wikipedia is a much maligned but very easily obtainable source of info as it gives u a background info on the whole thing pretty quickly.

Anyway now that u have seen the catalogues but can't read the books.Check ur message box for how to download and read as i don't want to violate forum rules.
Wait i can't seem to send PMs ,requires 10000 posts wtf.Ok sent a friend request ,accept and then i can post in profile i think.
All i can say is when reading military history keep an open mind and read about all great militaries,though everyone has favourites.Usually the trend is to learn only about the military of his own country/religion and since they usually know in depth only about them insult the rest all too quickly.Its better to study both western and eastern armies than engage in futile glorification based on nationalism or religion.Because in the end,whatever they were is gone and won't matter today.So popcorn,coke,chill.

Also another great source of interest in military history comes from playing video games.
For lots of time over the week grand strategy games with lot of brainwork play europa universalis 3,deals with age of discovery of america from late medieval to modern era and industrial revolution.
Another superb grand strategy game is hearts of iron 3,deals with ww2.

Other great games are age of empires 3,especially the expansion pack asian dynasties deals with asian factions india,china and japan so might be of interest to u.Note this is a fast ususally 30 mins to1 hr Real time strategy game.

One of the best RTS games is Company of heroes .Set in ww2.I play this even now online one game per night.

Another turn based grand strategy game is civilization .Try civ 4 and civ 5.

A classic is rome total war,dealing with the ancient age and medieval total war.
New additions are empire total war and napoleon total war.
The new shogun total war deals with samurai japan.

U can download ******** of all these from u know which site.
Regards.

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## indushek

AUSTERLITZ said:


> @indushek
> Napoleon, His Army and Enemies : Napoleonic Battles : Uniforms : Maps : Tactics
> 
> Earlier link for info on the napoleonic age.
> 
> iacta alea est  The Realm of Chance
> Lots of important battles in epic detail.
> 
> The Art of Battle: Animated Battle Maps
> Superb site for battle animations.Needs powerpoint viewer[free download] .View as slideshow.
> 
> Apart from these recommend 2 great military history forums.
> Historum - History Forums
> Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History
> 
> Another forum for extensive info on ww2 german military.
> Axis History Forum  Index page
> 
> This site is my primary source of learning.
> Osprey Publishing - Military History Books - Campaign
> The campaign series is epic,truly in every sense of the word along with the command and elite serieses[elite series deals with indivual soldier types].See the catalogue ,pick which one u want to know about.If u are confused about one do a google wiki search on it.Wikipedia is a much maligned but very easily obtainable source of info as it gives u a background info on the whole thing pretty quickly.
> 
> Anyway now that u have seen the catalogues but can't read the books.Check ur message box for how to download and read as i don't want to violate forum rules.
> 
> Napoleon, His Army and Enemies : Napoleonic Battles : Uniforms : Maps : Tactics
> 
> Earlier link for info on the napoleonic age.
> 
> iacta alea est  The Realm of Chance
> Lots of important battles in epic detail.
> 
> The Art of Battle: Animated Battle Maps
> Superb site for battle animations.Needs powerpoint viewer[free download] .View as slideshow.
> 
> Apart from these recommend 2 great military history forums.
> Historum - History Forums
> Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History
> 
> Another forum for extensive info on ww2 german military.
> Axis History Forum &bull; Index page
> 
> This site is my primary source of learning.
> Osprey Publishing - Military History Books - Campaign
> The campaign series is epic,truly in every sense of the word along with the command and elite serieses[elite series deals with indivual soldier types].See the catalogue ,pick which one u want to know about.If u are confused about one do a google wiki search on it.Wikipedia is a much maligned but very easily obtainable source of info as it gives u a background info on the whole thing pretty quickly.
> 
> Anyway now that u have seen the catalogues but can't read the books.Check ur message box for how to download and read as i don't want to violate forum rules.
> Wait i can't seem to send PMs ,requires 10000 posts wtf.Ok sent a friend request ,accept and then i can post in profile i think.
> All i can say is when reading military history keep an open mind and read about all great militaries,though everyone has favourites.Usually the trend is to learn only about the military of his own country/religion and since they usually know in depth only about them insult the rest all too quickly.Its better to study both western and eastern armies than engage in futile glorification based on nationalism or religion.Because in the end,whatever they were is gone and won't matter today.So popcorn,coke,chill.
> 
> Also another great source of interest in military history comes from playing video games.
> For lots of time over the week grand strategy games with lot of brainwork play europa universalis 3,deals with age of discovery of america from late medieval to modern era and industrial revolution.
> Another superb grand strategy game is hearts of iron 3,deals with ww2.
> 
> Other great games are age of empires 3,especially the expansion pack asian dynasties deals with asian factions india,china and japan so might be of interest to u.Note this is a fast ususally 30 mins to1 hr Real time strategy game.
> 
> One of the best RTS games is Company of heroes .Set in ww2.I play this even now online one game per night.
> 
> Another turn based grand strategy game is civilization .Try civ 4 and civ 5.
> 
> A classic is rome total war,dealing with the ancient age and medieval total war.
> New additions are empire total war and napoleon total war.
> The new shogun total war deals with samurai japan.
> 
> U can download ******** of all these from u know which site.
> Regards.



Can't thank u more than once, have copied the post and links in notepad. I assume to even get an idea properly will take some months for sure.

I have accepted the request sent buddy.

Also is it better to start with basics like terms etc etc or go straight into the soup?? My knowledge is all over here and there and zero on tactics and the kind of forces involved etc etc. I am in no hurry and want to be thorough.


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## AUSTERLITZ

Usually follow a chronological order and try to get a sense of geography.Meaning u know where the stuff is hapening.Best way is to start from the ancient age,usually graeco persian wars,cyrus the great etc.Documented history in detail starts from here.
And maintain an idea of what is happening in a timeframe in both east and west to gain a better understanding .for example while alexander's succesors are fighting for his empire[egypt,persia,greece,asia minor],the mauryans are the masters of india.While most of europe are semi naked tribal barbarians.Rome a city state slowly unifying italy under it,but still weak.
Carthage is the mistress of the western mediterranean and the premiun maritime power.

Thus if u get an overall basic idea of the political situation and geography of a certain time period and then follow events chronologically,u'll be very well delve into military tactics.

What the hell,still can't mesage u.
Fine,here's the link anyway.Search for the ebooks u need from here.
http://************.com/index.php?q=osprey+ebooks+napoleon
That link is given on a napoleon search,just delete and type whatever u need to search from catalogue.

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## AUSTERLITZ

8.The JAPANESE SAMURAI.

Samurai,the word has become legend.Synonymous with fanaticism and loyalty and a unique warrior code.A 'death over dishonour' style slashing machine armed with the most badass sword ever forged and fanatically loyal to their lord and emperor to the death .




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Samurai are regarded among the most skilled swordsmen in history,the katana was a part of their very existence.Dueling was common,and master swordsmen came to be known as kensei[sword saints].There were very few sword saints in one generation.Probably 3 to 4 in the whole country.The title was not given lightly.





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Samurai were the nobility of pre industrial japan,each feudal warlord or daimyo[the guy sitting] would have a band of loyal samurai.The samurai code stressed the importance of loyalty unto death for his master.It was considered an honour to die for one's master.




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It is a common misconception that samurai only fought with swords.In battle they carried two other excellent weapons.First was the lance.Richer samurai fought on horseback,but these were not used as heavy charge cavalry until later.





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The second was the yumi longbow.This was a very powerful weapon at the time.Had great range though less than the english longbow,penetration was good but again less than the english longbow.But one huge advantage was that it was designed to be used from horseback,unlike the english longbow which could only be fired from a standing position.Samurai were proficient in archery.





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Early samurai exchanges included arrow fire,followed by melee combat with spears,and close combat with swords.





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Arsenal of the samurai.





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The famed daimyo takeda shingen introduced the massed cavalry charge and takeda cavalry were feared throughout japan.However they met their end at the battle of nagashino by oda nobunaga's rotating volley fire arquebusiers deployd behind stakes after shingen's death.Nobunaga,the first super daimyo would be the first unifier of japan.





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The introduction of gunpowder revolutionized samurai warfare.New formations and tactics evolved to make use of these gunpwder armed samurai arquebusiers .These guns were traded from chrsitian jesuit missionaries and portugese and dutch traders.

Part 2:Samurai tactics.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Part 2:Samurai tactics.




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With the advent of gunpowder infantry tactics matured greatly.Especially in the sengoku age under the two famous daimyos takeda shingen'the tiger of kai' and his legendary arch rival uesugi kenshin 'the dragon of echigo'.Their rivalry was legendary,they fought 5 battles over 20 yrs on the same plains of kawankajima.Shingen won 1,kenshin 1 and other 3 draws.None of the victories were decisive.At one battle kenshin charged out of the protection of his army straight into shingen and these 2 badasses went head to head in mano a mano combat before their bodyguards intervened.
They also respected each other,once when shingen's province was short of rice and another daimyo wouldn't sell him ,kenshin sent him rice with a letter saying battles were fought with swords and honour not with rice.
7 traditional formations evolved.




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The half moon formation.Used as a desperate defense when an army had its backs to the wall with no chance to retreat.The army was not surrounded, but because of heavy losses, had no opportunity to respond in case of an attempted encirclement. The wounded are collected on the rear lines and formed the vanguard with a half moon that could be adapted according to the evolution of the situation. The musketeers[arquebusiers] were deployed in depth with a long line of spearmen and archers behind a line.





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"Birds in Flight": It is a relatively flexible disposition of troops who could at any time easily change configuration. It was made &#8203;&#8203;of solid lines of arquebusiers who protected the front and rear of the troops. But there was enough on the sides to go around, in case the enemy positions change. General is located at the back, but near the center, so that his orders are respected.





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The fish scales.An attack formation.It was adopted if ur army was larger than ur enemies.It is essentially a blunt wedge/arrowhead formation,designed not to gamble everything on one blow but rather keep sustained pressure on an area slowly attriting down the numerically inferior enemy.





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Arrowhead Formation.A all out assault breakthrough formation very similar to the roman wedge.
Formations of arquebuses is placed in the first line, which create gaps in opposing defenses , which will be exploited by the cahrge of the samurai advance guard. As it is a very mobile form, drums, banners and other means of transmission of orders are covered by the bodyguard of the Lord. The "arrowhead" was designed for rapid penetration, so that the sides were slightly protected by archers and spearmen.





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"The crane wing". The best formation to encircle the enemy. Again, arquebusiers and archers thinned enemy lines, followed by samurai advance guard who engaged in melee combat, while the second company took the opportunity to encircle them. Note how the convex shape of the formation of the second company, does not suggest to the enemy, an immediate threat of being surrounded. Indeed, from the front of the "arrowhead" such movement was not expected, it was exactly what the general wanted his enemy to believe.




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"The yoke". This form is similar to yoke oxen. It was a elastic defense, against an ideal "crane wing", but equally effective against an "arrowhead". The enemy advance guard was separately absorbed by a frontal attack long enough to reveal the intentions of the enemy. The second and third companies could then react accordingly, either by adopting the 7th form "keyhole" against a "arrowhead" or spread out to avoid encirclement against a crane form.





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"The keyhole." A heavily defensive formation.This formation was considered the best defense against the "arrowhead". Six lines of musketeers, supported by two rows of archers, forming a V to receive the attack "arrowhead" and take it in a crossfire. The samurai are formed up in a keyhole to take the shock of the attack.

Next-Part 3- Fall of the samurai.

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## AUSTERLITZ

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While kenshin and shingen were duking it out with each other,a new player oda nobunaga had risen and defeated daimyo after d aimyo and become a super daimyo,but these 2, the only ones capable of stopping his rise were busy bruising each other.Another powerful daimyo tokugawa leyasu allied himself with oda nobunaga.When shingen was free from kenshin's attention,he dealt a heavy defeat to leyasu.These 2 daimyos were the ones in nobunagas path to total domination,shingen died of natural causes and his son was crushingly defeated by nobunaga at nagashino as stated earlier.With the takeda clan out of the picture,he turned his attention to uesugi but uesugi kenshin gave nobunaga his only large defeat.Before he could follow it up though he would die of natural causes.On hearing of his death,nobunaga reportedly said"Now the empire is mine".
Nobunaga unified all japan under him,but was betrayed and forced to commit suicide by one of his subordinates.
Toyotomi hideyoshi avenged his master and took his place,consolidating the unity.At his death tokugawa leyasurevolted and ignoring hideyoshi's infant son assumed supreme power.He had played his cards right,always remaining on the winning side and waited for the oppurtune moment,he had outlived all the other great men of his age and founded the tokugawa shogunate which would rule japan till the industrial reformations of the late 19th century.
Thus the japanese saying-
"Nobunaga made the rice cake,hideyoshi shaped it and leyasu ate it''





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Samurai fought to the death.Disgrace by defeat in battle or imminent capture would lead them to commit ritual suicide or sepukku/harakiri.They shoved their katanas into their stomach and disembowelled themselves,as epic balls out a way to take the exit as any.





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Samurai matchlock muskets.





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Samurai melee weapons.The katana is usually considered the most balanced,deadly and beautiful sword design of all time.The japanese construction method was unique.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMPLmG2fvPc
The last stand of the samurai.The tokugawa shogunate fell when american ironclads entered japanese waters and used their cannons to bully the japanese into a unfair trade treaty.In the clamour for reforms,the samurai were increasingly rendered obsolete.Most accepted this change.But a few last samurai held onto their traditions prefering to go out in one last stand against impossible odds.Death over abandoning their way of life.The video above depicts the last stand of the samurai at satsuma.

Though samurai themselves died out,the samurai spirit didn't.In ww2 japanese soldiers often fought to the death,when out of ammunition fixing bayonets charging all out to the cries of 'tennoho kou banzai'[ten thousand years to the emperor] choosing death over the shame of surrender.

The samurai has become legendary in popular media,and several excellent animes are available.Recommend this one.My favourite.Rorouni kenshin english dubbed.The whole series is available on youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be7Y0SFUIBM.
The anime is around 60 episodes.for the great first season.





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Next: Spanish Tercio


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## AUSTERLITZ

9.THE SPANISH TERCIO

A moving battle fortress bristling with pikes and covered from all angles by musketeers these all arms juggernauts with a fearsome reputation and nicknamed the 'invincibles' fought in Spain itself, Oran and Tripoli, Italy, Ireland, France, South and Central America, holland and belgium always eager to give a bloody lesson in pain the spanish style to all those who incurred the displeasure of 'his most catholic majesty' be they protestants,turks,french or inca and aztecs.





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For over 150 years[1500-1650] the tercio was the dominant military force on the european battlefield.SPAIN WAS VERY definitely the dominant military power of 16th Century Europe, primarily because her troops were the only real 'Regulars' west of the Ottoman Empire .They were permanently employed, since Spain was permanently at war; Spanish forces alone provided anything like a career-structure for officers also, and partly for this reason enjoyed the best generalship of the period. Spanish armies were far the most efficient, and acted as model and training-school for many others.





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It was designed to defeat the swiss pike squares which had been the dominant force in the european battlefield for 2 centuries.
Gonzalo cordoba,the great spanish general invented the tercio during the italian wars around 1500 to defeat the swiss pikes[mercenaries in french service] and french heavy cavalry combo.
He took the basic of the pike square,a big square block of pikes,and added a sleeve or musketeers all around the pike square and a block of arquebusiers at each corner.Within the block of pikemen 5-10% would be sword and shield swordsmen.The musketeers would skirmish and soften up an opposing force,being especially effective against densely packed swiss pike squares.While their very slow rate of fire meant they needed protection from cavalry,which the pikes provided.A disrupted enemy would be charged in the style of a more flexible macedonian phalanx by the pikes.While engaged with opposing infantry,the musketeers would keep giving fire support and the mobile legionary like swordsmen would find gaps in the opposing pike squares and sneak in to close combat in which opposing pikemen were very vulnerable.It was like a hellish nightmare combo of the phalanx,legionary and musketeer for their enemies.
The above pic depicts the 3 troop types,the pikeman,the rodelero swordsman and the arquebusier/musketeer.





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The original tercio formation.Pikemen in centre with musketeers front and arquebusiers on each corner plus a sleeve of them on thesides[called garrison],provided perfect balance of the firepower from guns and shock from pikes.With time the rodeleros slowly began to disappear.
The arquebusiers on each corner were mobile fire groups called manga.While the garrison arquebusiers would stay with the main square,the mangas fought generally in vanguard or on the flanks like the light infantry of the XVIII - XIX century. They would fight skirmish to disorganise enemy formations. A lot of battles (like the battle of Jemmingen) were won by these detachments of gunmen fighting in front of the main squadrons of pikemen.
When skirmishing,To protect the arquebusiers from cavalry, some halberdiers/pikes would go with the mangas. If the enemy cavalry decided to charge the mangas, the halberdiers would form a hollow square where the arquebusiers could be safe.





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Firing Tactic: If needed, a mangas of arquebusiers would be sent in vanguard. From this formation, Officers would select a section of a minimum of 15 men deployed in 5 files of 3 gunmen. The section would advance towards the enemy. When the section was at point blank range (30 m), the first row would fire quietly and then go to the rear to reload. The second and third row would do the same. Almost a continuous fire, the important was the precision of the shot. When each arquebusier had fired 4 bullets, the section would go back to the mangas.[remember reloading took huge amount of time with early firearms] Officers could detach several sections like that to harass and disorganise the enemy.Pikemen detachments would come along to provide cover from cavalry.

Want to know in depth about firing systems of the mangs?Go to this link,click on the different types and watch the animations.
Battle of Breitenfeld - Alternative to Tercio





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Late tercios were much smaller in size,around 1500 men to refelct declining manpower and clumsiness of the older formations.This is a reformed tercio.In late tercios number of pikes began to decrease heavily while gunmen increased.

Anyone who can't understand the difference between musketeer and arquebusier?
At the beginning of the 16th century, the arquebus was considered a general-purpose firearm. It generally weighed ten pounds or less--no heavier than a modern assault rifle--and fired a fairly light lead ball to an effective range of 150 meters or more, although its accurate range was only about 50-80 meters, depending on the arquebusier's skill and environmental conditions. As a matter of fact, it was light enough to be fired comfortably without a rest (but the arquebusier often used one anyway, since a rest does help with accuracy--note how modern snipers prefer to use bipods or tripods rather than supporting their rifles entirely with their hands). On the other hand, the musket was a much heavier weapon devised by Spanish gunsmiths to achieve greater penetration against both steel armor and the wooden planks of naval vessels. It weighed at least eighteen pounds and had a much larger bore that could consequently take a much heavier projectile and a greater gunpowder charge. Both the weight of the musket and its prodigious recoil made it difficult (if not outright impossible) to use without some sort of rest or mounting hook. Perhaps it would not be inaccurate to say that the early musket resembled a portable artillery piece more than a personal firearm.
With those considerations in mind, it is not surprising that arquebusiers always outnumbered musketeers by a large margin in 16th-century armies. Where the arquebusier was a general-purpose soldier, the musketeers were regarded more as specialists due to the greater strength and skill needed to handle their weapons. In a typical army there would usually be three arquebusiers or more for every musketeer in the field. 
But with improvement in gun technology and with soldiers no longer using heavy armour,the musket design evolved.Like the assault rifle became a middle evolution of the bolt action rifles with range,accuracy and penetration and the sub machine gun's rate of fire,the new muskets would eventually replace both these earlier types becoming a general purpose firearm.





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What u see above is a quincunx,the same formation the roman legions used.Tercios in a battlefield of 1500/3000 men would be deployed in a quincunx.Just replace each tree in the pic with a tercio box and u get the picture.Each supported by another in checkerboard formation.If a enemy force got into the gap between the tercios they would be caught in the crossfire of 3 tercio squares.





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The tercios were the enforcers of spanish power for over half a century,exemplified by emperor charles v's boast of the'empire on which the sun never set' composed of south and central america,parts of north america,plus spain,holland,belgium,italy and the holy roman empire[parts of germany].Serving as the muscle of the spanish empire while incan and aztec gold provided the sinew.
The problems began with the dutch reforms of maurice of nassau,whose formations stressed greater firepower and massed musketeers in a liner formation.They would be perfected under the swedish king gustavas adolphus,the father of the european military revolution who used his new style carolingian swedish infantry to devastate the imperial tercios.The end came with 
Adoption of the socket bayonet,as pikes became obsolete for each infantryman had now his own protection against cavalry.

Next: The swedish carolingian infantry.

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## AUSTERLITZ

People still reading this?Or are the formations and tactics too complex and i should stick to just pics?

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## meghdut

AUSTERLITZ said:


> People still reading this?Or are the formations and tactics too complex and i should stick to just pics?



Please continue sir, its the only interesting stuff going admist all the usual stuff here.

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## AUSTERLITZ

10.SWEDISH CAROLIAN INFANTRY

1630.Religious war is raging in germany and holland,the spanish holy roman empire led catholic league seeks to permanently destroy the protestants of europe.The catholics under tilly and his invincible imperial tercios have defeated the protestants in every battle and look poised to take all their last bases.At this juncture the protestant king of sweden,gustavas adolphus lands in germany with a new reformed army .This army will go on to inflict devastating defeats on the hitherto invincible tercios and in the process start a military revolution that would usher in european military dominance.




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For 2 centuries tercios had dominated the european battlefield.But the way forward began with the dutch reforms that emphasized massive increase in musketeers and far less pikes.The swedes under gustavas adolphus would lead this to its perfect form.




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Gustavas introduced the brigade[a designation most armies use today]as a alternative tactical formation of the tercio.Each brigade consisted of 2 regiments.1st picture is brigade second regiment.Note the T formation of the regiment for massive increase in firepower.The reserve lines could move up deliver fire as well.
Gustavas's another great innovation was the regimental artillery guns.12 light field guns per brigade added to the firepower and devastation.These guns were usually deployed in front of the front row pikes.[see pic 1,the guns would be deployed ahead of the pike blocks]





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The standard firing formation of the day.Each man fired and went to the back to reload and next man took his step.While this provided almost continous fire,only the front rows could bring their muskets to bear and also to keep the fire continous a lot of musketeers had to be kept in line.Also each man fired individually and went back individually.So density of fire was low.





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The swedes for normal firing used the new dutch model,where all front rank muskets fired simlutaneously then went back.This had greater density of fire.




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Gustavas's real great firing innovation.The Triple Rank Volley Fire: was achieved by advancing the rear ranks upon the front ranks, while echeloning to the right. Triple rank volley fire was performed with the first rank kneeling, second rank stooping, and third rank standing.For a company of 60 musketeers. In 50 -60 seconds 2 volleys of 30 bullets could be fired. When the last three ranks were deployed on the right a massive volley of 60 bullets could be fired.
By using this tactic three ranks fired simultaneously from point blank range adding to the fire of the regimental guns,then rear 3 ranks fired their own salvo.Result was a devastating hail of shot.The swedish tactic would require these salvos at point blank range followed by a limited charge of the pikemen to finish off remnants that survived the enfilade.While the 6 ranks reloaded.The swedes would often use both firing systems together providing continous fire and concentrated salvo fire.






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The swedish brigades were much more mobile than the cumbersome tercios,had less pikemen.Gustavas adolphus had ascended the throne at 17 with a financially poor sweden at war with denmark,russia and poland and its armies disorganized.He did away with mercenaries who were a financial burden,enacted conscription.Drilling and discipline were superb in this new largely national swedish army. A sign of what the catholic imperials would taste came in the war against poland where the hitherto invincible polish winged hussars often refused to charge into the hail of storm and shot from the swedish infantry.
Gustav's another great innovation was to place bodies of musketeers on the wings intermixed with his cavalry when defending and also giving them light guns.When the opposing cavalry charged they would be met by salvoes of the infantry to break up the momentum of the charge,then the swedish cavalry would charge the disorganized foe.This combined arms approach in all parts of the army would make sweden a nation with small population and economy a great power for the next few decades.For protecting their religious freedom the germans named him 'the lion of the north'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0u0HwgnTeO0
Gustavas adolphus tribute video with epic song from swedish band sabaton.

Adolphus was also personally brave charging into battle with his signature war cry 'gott mitt uns'(god with us).Having been injured 13 times leading cavalry charges in his short career his luck ran out and He was killed in the fighting at lutzen,but his new army won the day.The swedish tactics were copied all over europe with national armies,drilled and emphasizing firepower the road to the future.Thus he is called the father of modern warfare.

Next: British Redcoat.

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## Koovie

BTW: @AUSTERLITZ Do you play Total War games???


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## AUSTERLITZ

Avid fan of rome total war.Especially with europa barbarorum,roma surrectum 2 and rome total realism mods.
waiting for rtw2.

Haven't played medieval total war or barbarian invasion much.
Haven't played shogun total war 2 or empire total war much.

Massive fan of napoleon total war.Especially with darthmod napoleon or napoleon total war all in one mods.

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## AUSTERLITZ

11.BRITISH REDCOAT

While britannia ruled the waves,the largest empire on earth was sustained for over 2 hundred years by the dependable,indomitable and immovable british redcoat,it fought from america,to africa,mainland europe,india,middle east just about anywhere the royal navy would carry the union jack.Any enemy facing the redcoats knew they were in for a fight,they symbolized british imperial arrogance,defiance,immovability and a 'stand and take it' attitude that screamed to their enemies 'we shall not be moved'.
'British infantry is the best in the world,good thing there aren't too many of them'.-a french general.




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Take that!Redcoats using the triple rank salvo fire invented by gustavas adolphus.With the advent of the bayonet the pike became obsolete.The favourite redcoat formation was the double line,providing 2 lines of usketeers dealing devastating firepower.However it was very vulnerable to cavalry.British infantry were the best shooters of their day ,mainly because it was best drilled and had most live firing practice.This was because unlike the huge continental armies,britain's army was small protected as it was from invasion by the all powerful royal navy.At the same time britain was also the richest country in the world,and thus the small army recieved superb training and equipment,no expenses spared.

"Well posted, as Wellington knows how to post it, and attacked from the front,
I consider the English infantry to be impregnable ..." - General Reille

Wellington's favourite tactic was to post his infantry behind reverse slopes,invulnerable to flat projectiles of most artillery save howitzers.The advancing enemy infantry when they appeared on the slope would surprised by volley after volley as the british suddenly revealed themselves.





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For protection against cavalry charges.The infantry of the age used the hollow square.99 out of 100 times cavalry charges would fail to break a square.Any cavalry that got into the middle of the squares would be caught in the crossfire of 2-3 squares.





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How the square worked.The first rank would dig their muskets into the ground,bayonets pointing out like a hedgehog of pointed steel,while other 2 ranks standing would fire and reload alternatively.No horse would charge into this wall of steel,even if some got inside they would be bayoneted.The infantry squares were largely responsible for the defeat of eastern cavalry based armies,and the artillery ofcourse.





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Redcoats hold their ground at waterloo against massed french cuirassier charges despite tremendous pressure.They provided time for their prussian allies to arrive and defeat the french once and for all in the napoleonic wars.





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"Come on ya rascals,ya fighting villains.God save the king"-leading the charge
The other tactic was the bayonet charge,after shattering the enemy with volleys they would lower bayonets and charge.Only disciplined troops could stand and recieve the bayonet charge,most panicked.The redcoats of marlborough saved europe from french domination at blenheim 1704.In the seven years war they were again triumphant in the colonial battles.In the american war of independence they were trumped by irregular american warfare and their disiplined french allies.Their greatest moment came at waterloo under wellington in the napoleonic wars.They fought in the crimean wars and all colonial wars in africa,india,middle east and america.





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Russian cavalry tasting lead at balaclava,crimean war 1856.Badass scottish highlanders in their kilt skirts and bagpipers.





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The brown bess musket,the most accurate and durable musket of the napoleonic age though it had lesser range than the french charleville.Bayonet attatched.





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The redcoat was replaced by the khaki,but is still used in ceremonial parades.These coldstream guards are a direct descendant of those that fought in the napoleonic wars.

Next;French Napoleonic infantry/the imperial guard.

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## Koovie

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Avid fan of rome total war.Especially with europa barbarorum,roma surrectum 2 and rome total realism mods.
> waiting for rtw2.
> 
> Haven't played medieval total war or barbarian invasion much.
> Haven't played shogun total war 2 or empire total war much.
> 
> Massive fan of napoleon total war.Especially with darthmod napoleon or napoleon total war all in one mods.




We should fight out a MP match  My MP rank was 5 stars as far as I remember


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## AUSTERLITZ

Mostly a campaign player but why not?
play coh online every night though.


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## KingMamba

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Uploaded with ImageShack.us
> While kenshin and shingen were duking it out with each other,a new player oda nobunaga had risen and defeated daimyo after d aimyo and become a super daimyo,but these 2, the only ones capable of stopping his rise were busy bruising each other.Another powerful daimyo tokugawa leyasu allied himself with oda nobunaga.When shingen was free from kenshin's attention,he dealt a heavy defeat to leyasu.These 2 daimyos were the ones in nobunagas path to total domination,shingen died of natural causes and his son was crushingly defeated by nobunaga at nagashino as stated earlier.With the takeda clan out of the picture,he turned his attention to uesugi but uesugi kenshin gave nobunaga his only large defeat.Before he could follow it up though he would die of natural causes.On hearing of his death,nobunaga reportedly said"Now the empire is mine".
> Nobunaga unified all japan under him,but was betrayed and forced to commit suicide by one of his subordinates.
> Toyotomi hideyoshi avenged his master and took his place,consolidating the unity.At his death tokugawa leyasurevolted and ignoring hideyoshi's infant son assumed supreme power.He had played his cards right,always remaining on the winning side and waited for the oppurtune moment,he had outlived all the other great men of his age and founded the tokugawa shogunate which would rule japan till the industrial reformations of the late 19th century.
> Thus the japanese saying-
> "Nobunaga made the rice cake,hideyoshi shaped it and leyasu ate it''
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> Samurai fought to the death.Disgrace by defeat in battle or imminent capture would lead them to commit ritual suicide or sepukku/harakiri.They shoved their katanas into their stomach and disembowelled themselves,as epic balls out a way to take the exit as any.
> 
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> Samurai matchlock muskets.
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> Samurai melee weapons.The katana is usually considered the most balanced,deadly and beautiful sword design of all time.The japanese construction method was unique.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMPLmG2fvPc
> The last stand of the samurai.The tokugawa shogunate fell when american ironclads entered japanese waters and used their cannons to bully the japanese into a unfair trade treaty.In the clamour for reforms,the samurai were increasingly rendered obsolete.Most accepted this change.But a few last samurai held onto their traditions prefering to go out in one last stand against impossible odds.Death over abandoning their way of life.The video above depicts the last stand of the samurai at satsuma.
> 
> Though samurai themselves died out,the samurai spirit didn't.In ww2 japanese soldiers often fought to the death,when out of ammunition fixing bayonets charging all out to the cries of 'tennoho kou banzai'[ten thousand years to the emperor] choosing death over the shame of surrender.
> 
> The samurai has become legendary in popular media,and several excellent animes are available.Recommend this one.My favourite.Rorouni kenshin english dubbed.The whole series is available on youtube.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be7Y0SFUIBM.
> The anime is around 60 episodes.for the great first season.
> 
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> 
> Next: Spanish Tercio



I actually have the 153 GL in my house as a collection piece.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Sry for the delay,in between exams so diificult to find time to finish the imperial guard and waffen ss.Will finish as soon as possible.


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## Kambojaric

Focus on your exams Austerlitz, PDF will still be here when your exams have finished


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## Koovie

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Mostly a campaign player but why not?
> play coh online every night though.



kk PM me if you got time for a NTW battle. I havent played CoH, couldnt find it in Kochi. But I am waiting for CoH2


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## AUSTERLITZ

Hmm NTW,runs slow on my computer a little.I'll have to reinstall it[its 12 GB],but i have rome total war.Anyway after exams are over i'll make time.

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## AUSTERLITZ

12.NAPOLEON'S FRENCH INFANTRY

In 1789 the french revolution shattered europe,when in 1792 the french executed the royal family and declared itself a republic all the monarchies,austrian empire,prussia,britain,russia,swden,naples declared war.France stood alone against all europe,desperate they unleashed total war.Mass conscription was implemented and france the most populous nation in europe churned out troops like a boiler,any dissent at home was taken care of by the guillotine and the reign of terror.Almost all the officers of the old army had fled as they were from the nobility,a new breed of officers from the common soldiers ranks rose.One among these was napoleon bonaparte,by his astonishing military victories he captured the imagination of the french.From a first lieutenant from corsica,to general,first consul and soon to be emperor.For the next 20 years the revolutionary wars evolved into the napoleonic wars as french armies poured accross europe storming all before them.It would take 7 coalitions among all the other superpowers of the world,the royal navy,napoleon's own ego,the guerillas of spain,20 years and the russian winter to finally bring napoleon and france down.The forefront of napoleon's army where the infantry and from 1796-1809 they were undoubtedly the most feared and respected in the world.The pinnacle of the french infantry being the celebrated imperial guard.





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French voltigeurs skirmishing.Voltigeurs were elite light infantry who usually fought in loose formation,unlike the line infantry like chasseurs and grenadiers who fought in ranks.When most of the royalist officercorps of nobles fled,france was attacked from all sides.The new people's militia had little discipline and there was no time to drill them.Hence they fought as a dense mass of skirmishers or as a huge charging mass of bayonets.The new french fighting style was very discomforting fro traditional armies.These would be perfected under napoleon.At jena 1806 french voltigeurs behind walls devastated prussian line infantry in a firefight who were standing in formation in the open.Light infantry could make excellent use of terrain,but were very vulnerable to cavalry.





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Line infantry were the standard infantry and fought in formations.The french usually prefered to move and attack in coloumns after the light infantry and artillery had softened up the enemy.This practice would get them into trouble vs british redcoats,though by that time due to increasing no. of conscripts quality had declined.The other formations used were double line for firefights,bayonet charges,infantry square vs cavalry[shown in british redcoat what square and double line are]





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Out of misty legend to the terrifying rumble of the Grande Armée's drums come vague and dusty images of the generals who led it. Old before their time, they damned and led the eager volunteers of 1792, the sullen conscripts of 1800, the determined veterans of 1805, the ragfed, frozen scarecrows their Emperor called his 'men of bronze' through snow, ice, and masses of revenge-minded russians in 1812, and the scared, much too young conscripts and the older National Guard 'fathers of families' through the heartbreak, bitterness, mud, and despair of 1813-1814, finally to the last desperate days of 1815. Professionals because they learned their trade if they survived, these sometimes half-educated, iron-hard men led one of the greatest armies in history the length and breadth of Europe and finally to the Valhalla of enduring legend to stand beside the great conquerors of the past and their immortal legions.

The french under napoleon swept all before them.From the olive trees of italy,to the austrian alps,the banks of the danube and rhine,the desert sands and the shadows of the pyramids in egypt,the plains of germany,the snow and mud of poland,the frosty barren wastes of russia and the hills of spain and portugal the french fought everywhere.They remain the only army in history to have entered every major continental european capital from madrid to moscow.





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French imperial eagle.Napoleon gave his regiments eagle's in imitation of the roman legions.
'They drove fear into the heart of europe's kings,a terrible reality and an enduring legend'-john elting.
Each line infantry regiment had a company of elite greandiers,they were big men specializing in bayonet fighting.





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'There is no temple without a god,and no throne without a guard.But there are guards and there are Guards'-historian
The most feared infantry formation was the old guard of the imperial guard.Known as the immortals or sans piere[without equal]Veterans of many campaigns,they had followed their grim faced emperor on his grey horse from the early days of italy 1796 to the bitter end at waterloo in 1815 .However by 1815 few of the original veterans were left.The quality of french infantry declined after 1809 due mass influx of untrained conscripts.





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Bayonet charge of the imperial guard.In their black bearskin caps they were a fearsome sight.
"More dreadful-looking fellows I had never seen. They had
the look of thoroughbread, veteran, disciplined banditti."
- Mr Hayden ,a british visitor on the old guard.





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Square of the imperial guard.The guard emerged out of the consular guard of the republic which had famously stood its ground against overwhelming austrian atatcks buying time for the french reinforcements to arrive and win the battle at marengo.Napoleon dubbed them the 'granite wall' for this action.





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The french charleville 1777 musket.Usually considered the best musket of the napoleonic age.
French infantry were also renowned for extreme fast marching.The french saying was-'The emperor has found a new way of making war,he makes us use our legs instead of our bayonets'.Speed was the essence of napoleonic warfare.

NEXT: Wehrmacht infantry/The waffen ss.

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## AUSTERLITZ

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Romanlegionaries in the dacian wars under trajan.The romans modified their helmet and added handguards to deal with the dacian falx weapon.





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The falx was a deadly weapon capable of penetrating the edges of the roman shield at full swing.





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Turkish imperial guard.Janissaries around the sultan.





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Spanish tercio.Legions of christ,spain was the standard bearer of orthodox catholic christianity,and was a main combatant of many religious wars especially against protestants .





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Byzantine varangian guard.Succesor of the vikings.





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Swiss pikemen.Scourge of the european knight.

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## Koovie

Keep it coming!!! Very interesting


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## AUSTERLITZ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0JJlDlYGRM

For those interested in roman warfare.Watch this series.Part1 of episode 1.Check for episodes 2 and 3 too.
Name of the series is roman war machine.

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## T-Bortecine

Nice thread but big big mistakes in information. Janisarries was always but always Turks until there was a lack of troops which would require additional soldiers who then was some Christians. 

Also the Turks was one of the first empires starting from seljuks to use gunpowder widely, anyone who plays medieval total War or age of Empires can see this clearly, as they get the first gunpowder units in the game and the janissary rush in age of Empires is nearly un defeat able.


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## Koovie

AUSTERLITZ said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0JJlDlYGRM
> 
> For those interested in roman warfare.Watch this series.Part1 of episode 1.Check for episodes 2 and 3 too.
> Name of the series is roman war machine.




whooooo this makes me sooooo hot for this:


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## AUSTERLITZ

T-Bortecine said:


> Nice thread but big big mistakes in information. Janisarries was always but always Turks until there was a lack of troops which would require additional soldiers who then was some Christians.
> 
> Also the Turks was one of the first empires starting from seljuks to use gunpowder widely, anyone who plays medieval total War or age of Empires can see this clearly, as they get the first gunpowder units in the game and the janissary rush in age of Empires is nearly un defeat able.



Yes turks did use gunpowder on a large scale first.True.But where did i deny this?

Second ,no jannisaries were recruited at first exclusively from christian children.Check any sources.Its only later when jannisaries becaem a political force and prestigious and powerful organization that turkish families started giving their own children to the jannissary corps.Don't give in to blind patriotism.

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## T-Bortecine

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Yes turks did use gunpowder on a large scale first.True.But where did i deny this?
> 
> Second ,no jannisaries were recruited at first exclusively from christian children.Check any sources.Its only later when jannisaries becaem a political force and prestigious and powerful organization that turkish families started giving their own children to the jannissary corps.Don't give in to blind patriotism.



Mate i dont talk from patriotism nationalism or anything. One of the best turkish historians who know about ottoman history said this and all of them say it. The thing you seem to mistake is only janisarries were in balkans thats not true.

This is the guy . 
&#304;lber Ortayl&#305; (born 21 May 1947), is a leading Turkish historian, professor of history at the Galatasaray University in Istanbul and at Bilkent University in Ankara. Since 2005 he has been the head of the Topkap&#305; Museum in Istanbul.
&#304;lber Ortayl&#305; is widely known as a polyglot. Apart from Turkish, he also speaks German, Russian, English and French.
Ä°lber OrtaylÄ± - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## AUSTERLITZ

I am not saying they were recruited from balkans ONLY but PRIMARILY from the christians of the balkans during the early period.Later all over including turks.Its what i learn from sources when i read about jannisaries on the net and military books,i have no personal agenda as such.Regards.


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## T-Bortecine

AUSTERLITZ said:


> I am not saying they were recruited from balkans ONLY but PRIMARILY from the christians of the balkans during the early period.Later all over including turks.Its what i learn from sources when i read about jannisaries on the net and military books,i have no personal agenda as such.Regards.



nice thread just wanted to point out a few mistakes.


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## AUSTERLITZ

13.WEHRMACHT FRONTSOLDATEN

Part-1
Fanatical,ruthless,innovative,disciplined,efficient,tenacious and bearers of both a proud military tradition and a barbarous regime's ideaology..they were modern history's greatest army.The measuring stick for all modern armies....an army that fought for only 6 yrs compared to all the other great armies of legend but in that short time earned both eternal fame as warriors par excellence and infamy as murderers of the highest calibre.They are the dreaded german wehrmacht.
For all the media attention taken up by the panzers,it was the modest foot infantry toiling through blood,sweat and mud-the landser or frontsoldaten that was the backbone of the german war machine.





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German infantry consistently outperformed its opponents in both offense and defense.The key to this was superior doctrine,unit co operation,low level initiative,a superb NCO cadre and high espirit de corps from a highly militarized society.





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Hitler's legions assembled at a party rally.Many germans were fanatical ,ready to die for volk,aryan race,vaterland and fuhrer.
The coal scuttle shape german helmet became a infamous sight.The shape of this helmet was superior from british or french designs because it afforded greater protection against shrapnel.After the war americans would adopt the model in their new helmet.





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Magnificent german infantry of the glory days of 1939-1942.Germany with its new tactics rapidly overran poland[2 weeks],france[6 weeks],norway and denmark,holland and belgium and the balkans.In russia they made massive initial gains.But this is where it finally met its match.Like napoleon before them,the germans were to learn a bitter and fatal lesson in humility in the frozen wastes of russia against an enemy every bit as ruthless and fanatical as them.




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One of the great differences in german infantry doctrine was its emphasis on firepower over mass.The german infantry section of 9 men revolved around the LMG and HMG,the machine guns.The job of the riflemen were to support and advance the machine guns which would then unleash a deadly hail of lead.Unlike the allies who relied upon riflemen as the main advancing force with mgs only in a supporting role,In a german platoon the MG was the main weapon.The above two weapons the mg-34 and mg-42 were the first general purpose machine guns in the world.Enormously successful they influenced all later designs and are still in use[mg-42].





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The other infantry support weapon was the mortar,german mortars were superior to the allied ones in general.All german elite units had greater numbers of mortars and mgs per company.





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German section leaders with MP40 submachineguns at stalingrad.
One of the key factors of german success was superior low level leadership and initiative.The german army encouraged initiative.The core to this was the concept of 'aufragstaktik' or officer tactics.It essentially meant that officers were given an objective and higher level commanders didn't bother with micromanagement trusting their subordinates judgement and initiative to achieve that objective of their own initiative.The low level officers also had leverage to undertake actions that they deemed necessary without waiting for orders to meet a developing situation or crisis.This meant that german forces could react to situations in the chaos of war far faster than their centralized and rigid opponents.





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German army street fighting.
The other german advantage was the innovative use of 'battlegroups' or kampfgruppe.
The Kampfgruppe was an ad-hoc combined arms formation, usually employing combination of tanks, infantry, and artillery (including anti-tank) elements, generally organised for a particular task or operation. A Kampfgruppe could range in size from a corps to a company, but the most common was an Abteilung (battalion)-sized formation. Kampfgruppen were generally referred to by either their commanding officer's name or the parent division.This meant even when their parent divisions had sustained massive casualities and ceased to exist as seperate units,the germans could gather the survivors into temporary battlegroups and fight on or counterattack.This made them extremely tenacious and hard to defeat.





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German troops advance through a burning village amidst snow.The other great german advantage in organization was the tri linear model.Each german regiment had 3 battalions instead of british 4.This was proved to be superior and after the war most armies adopted this model.

next: Part 2- The weapons and equipment.

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## AUSTERLITZ

PART 2-WEAPONS AND EQUIPMENT.

Every great army needs excellent weapons,and the germans were pioneers of ahead of their time state of the art weaponry that was set the benchmark.




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German infantry's arsenal.Includes rifles,assault rifles,sub machine guns,heavy and medium machine guns,grenades,mines,anti tank rocket launchers and pistols.





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Mauser 98k bolt action rifle.Reliable,accurate,powerful.The most succesful bolt action rifle of all time used in both world wars by the german army with little change.





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MP40 submachinegun 'the schmeisser'.Usually carried by assault troops or squad leaders it was excellent for urban fighting or close quarter fights.Less range,accuracy and hitting power than the rifle but great rate of fire.





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The german infantry field support gun.These regimental guns provided direct fire support to advancing infantry.





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The MP44/Stg-44.The world's first assault rifle.the germans recognized that most infantry fights took place actually quite close and that the bolt action rifle's huge range was unnecessary,so they combined the range and power of the rifle with the firing rate of the sub machine gun and came up with the world's first assault rifle.Fortunately it came too late to change the outcome of the war.





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The dreaded mg-42.Considered the greatest machine gun of all time.It had a peerless rate of fire,was reliable and cheaply manufactured.The model for all modern machine guns.Still in use with the german army as the mg-3!Pakistan incidentally still uses it.'Hitler's buzzsaw' was a terrifying weapon feared by all allied soldiers.





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The single shot panzerfaust anti tank weapon was a simple ,cheap and deadly weapon to stop the tide of allied armour.





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The germans encountered the american bazooka in north africa.They were so impressed they made their own better version-the panzerschreck or tank terror.

Next: Part 3.


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## AUSTERLITZ

PART 3;





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The german 'bundle' grenade.Used as a emergency anti tank weapon by joining the explosive heads of the traditional german'stick' grenade or the potato masher.By joining the explosive heads a well aimed close shot at a tanks engine would immobilize the tank.





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Early german anti tank gun crew.Each german battalion had a heavy weapons company including several anti tank guns.These early pak-36 guns served well in poland and france,but were totally shocked by the russian t-34 in russia which were invulnerable to them.New larger calibre AT guns and the infamous 88 mm anti aircraft guns would be pressed into service.





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Early war german infantry.





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Late war german infantry.





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German paratroopers,the fallschirmjager.Germans pioneered the first large scale successful use of paratroopers,these were part of the luftwaffe.After germany lost air superiority thye fought as elite infantry.At normandy,italy and crete the german paratroopers consistently bested or held up allied troops several times their number.Note the different helmet.





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They also had their own weapon.The FG-42.

THE WAFFEN SS

"No better soldier ever fought for a worse cause"-saying on the waffen ss.





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The name is synonymous with terror.These were the armed vanguard of national socialism.Hitler's praetorian guards.Legions of fanatical,racially indoctrinated,ruthless soldiers who struck fear into the hearts of their enemies.Their ferocity only matched by their utter brutality and lack of morality.
The waffen ss training was infamous and brutal.1 in 3 were succesful.Espirit de corps was tremendous.Officers and men slept,ate ,lived and died together.There was no seperate rooms for them.The waffen ss training is the basis of most of today's special forces training regimen's like the us navy seals.





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'Evil looks better'-Waffen ss officers dressed to kill.The SS motto was 'loyalty is my honour'.They kept their vow, fighting on till the bitter end for their fuhrer.


Next- Part 4.


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## T-Bortecine

Nice thread , modern warfare seems to be forgotten usually in these kind of all time things.

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## AUSTERLITZ

PART 4 - TO THE BITTER END.

The german army fought nearly the whole world for around 5 yrs.Its tenacity legendary,it was acclaimed by its very enemies as the best soldiers in the world.It was the german infantryman that bore the brunt of the fighting.





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Soldier of rommel's famous afrikakorps,when most german forces were infamous for war crimes,the afrika korps conducted itself with honour.





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German machine gunner.Despite massive inferiority in heavy weapons ,the german platoons centred around their machine guns used their superior firepower of the mgs and their excellent skills at camoflage to even the playing field.





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German snipers were a constant hindrance to allied infantry.The superb camoflage skills of german marksmen made them second to none but the red army's snipers.





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Motorized german infantry/panzergrenadiers.Each german panzer division had its own infantry regiment in trucks or halftracks.The close co operation between armour and infantry was key to rapid german advances.





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Tortured and slaughtered russian children.These peerless soldiers were equally remembered for the barbaric acts they comitted with the support and leadership of a murderous regime,millions of civilians were systematically exterminated by the nazis.





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The end.Graves of german soldiers in russia.Russia would suck out the flower of germany's army.80% of her forces fought and died there.





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Hitler's fanatical teenage soldiers.The hitler youth.Soldier of the ss hitlerjugend in normandy 1944.





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The wehrmacht is usually considered among the greatest armies of all time,a reputation well earned as its enemies testify.Though they fought for a wrong cause their tenacity,valour and discipline made them the model for all armies to come.

That's it people.Thanks for reading.I might add periodic small updates on heterogenous troops from the list and those that just missed out.

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## shadow7

The Wehrmacht should go at the top of any list of great infantry or panzers.


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## shadow7

*I have been researching two historic directions for the past decade and I will soon produce a book on each topic. Those two directions are:
- How Highly Placed German Army Traitors caused Germany to lose WWII.
-US Grounds Forces are the Greatest Bluff since Maskirovka, and Why.
Do any of you share interest in these two topics? If I detail some of my findings, will it be allowed since both topics are controversial?*

*Have any of you heard of Soviet NKVD Sniperism? Sniperism refers to the NKVD's fraudulent repeated exaggeration, beyond human toleration, of Red Army sniper achievements. It was a propaganda campaign of the NKVD.*


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## AUSTERLITZ

Fire away,though i'm afraid ur gross understimating red army's tenacity by merely attributing it to propaganda and treason.


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## Juice

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Avid fan of rome total war.Especially with europa barbarorum,roma surrectum 2 and rome total realism mods.
> waiting for rtw2.
> 
> Haven't played medieval total war or barbarian invasion much.
> Haven't played shogun total war 2 or empire total war much.
> 
> Massive fan of napoleon total war.Especially with darthmod napoleon or napoleon total war all in one mods.


 Only have the Rome, total realism...will try the other Rome mods. Also have Midieval 2, Empire and Napolean...some add on content but no mods.


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## Koovie

Juice said:


> Only have the Rome, total realism...will try the others (also Em)pire and Napoleon



So many TW gamers here, should open a PDF clan

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## AUSTERLITZ

Juice said:


> Only have the Rome, total realism...will try the other Rome mods. Also have Midieval 2, Empire and Napolean...some add on content but no mods.



If u haven't played roma surrectum 2 ur rome total war experience isn't complete.
For a pro challenge try the roma surrcetum 2 submod five good emperors,extremely challenging and nail biting.
For napoleon try darthmod napoleon for better battles.
Medieval try stainless steel mod.

Also ther is shogun 2 total war-fall of the samurai.

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## AUSTERLITZ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybHl9jYue_g

Posting this video link again for those who missed it first time,how the legions crushed barbarian hordes.

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## jaibi

Very interesting read, very informative. It is easy to forget sitting in the 21st century what an awesome war machine Germany built against a colonial powers like Britain and France and the vast armies of the US, despite the atrocities of the Riech, it is indeed an accomplishment in military history. Great read.

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## Koovie

British red coats vs. American revolutionaries at the battle of camden.


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## Juice

An awesome thread and good read...keep'em coming.


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## notorious_eagle

@AUSTERLITZ

Double Cheers for a job very well done, keep it up friend. 



shadow7 said:


> *Have any of you heard of Soviet NKVD Sniperism? Sniperism refers to the NKVD's fraudulent repeated exaggeration, beyond human toleration, of Red Army sniper achievements. It was a propaganda campaign of the NKVD.*



There is no doubt that propaganda played a key role for Soviet War Machinery as propaganda was deeply imbedded with the Bolsheviks. But that being aside, if one goes through history books, one cannot help but admire the average Soviet soldier. Despite the enormous losses they suffered, they were able to regroup, halt German advances and finally push them back. The Soviet soldier won this war with their blood, they were fighting battles of annihilation and eventually consumed the entire Wehrmacht.

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## AUSTERLITZ

Thanks for all the appreciation guys.If anyone has any particular historical infantry he wants to know about let me know here.

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## AUSTERLITZ

The Roman Legion at War - YouTube

The mechanics of a marian legion

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## Koovie

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Thanks for all the appreciation guys.If anyone has any particular historical infantry he wants to know about let me know here.



WW 2 Royal Commandos and Chindits would be nice


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## AUSTERLITZ

Ok.soon.Need some time to gather the info and pics.

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## meghdut

@AUSTERLITZ long time no new updates. Keep the good work going.


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## AUSTERLITZ

Oh i had almost forgotten about the thread.I guess i'll start again soon.

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## flamer84

Excellent thread! I can't add anything since you've just summed it up superbly,congrats!
As a little joke to some of the posters here,the reason why most of the examples in this thread are european armies is because the continent of Europe is more suited for infantry as oppossed to Asia which favours open terrain and cavalry,not because of some racial superiority.Just thought in throwing this as a prevention,you'll never know when they'll come shouting "supremacists"


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## AUSTERLITZ

flamer84 said:


> Excellent thread! I can't add anything since you've just summed it up superbly,congrats!
> As a little joke to some of the posters here,the reason why most of the examples in this thread are european armies is because the continent of Europe is more suited for infantry as oppossed to Asia which favours open terrain and cavalry,not because of some racial superiority.Just thought in throwing this as a prevention,you'll never know when they'll come shouting "supremacists"



Yes ,what u say is absolutely true.Thats why my best cavalry thread has mostly asiatic entrys.http://www.defence.pk/forums/military-history-strategy/222689-top-12-cavalry-all-time-no-order.html
Thanks for liking the thread.

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## Ecka_the_viking

The carolean infantry, RAF


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## livingdead

@Dillinger .. you might like this thread


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## Audio

Eh, noone mentioned Gondor tower guards!


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## Shaped charge

Waffen SS, arguably one of the best infantry of all times wasted because of a mad man's super human ego... Allied air and Soviet artillery had a field day on them because of Hitler's no retreat order thus negating the German army's main strength = maneuver warfare. one of the greatest what-ifs, Hitler doesn't recall the Armee Gruppes from the Moscow front


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## AUSTERLITZ

Shaped charge said:


> Waffen SS, arguably one of the best infantry of all times wasted because of a mad man's super human ego... Allied air and Soviet artillery had a field day on them because of Hitler's no retreat order thus negating the German army's main strength = maneuver warfare. one of the greatest what-ifs, Hitler doesn't recall the Armee Gruppes from the Moscow front



A german general once said of the waffen ss -''no better soldier ever fought for a worse cause''.


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## Shaped charge

gurkhas also need a recognition as one of the best infantry, damn bugger put the D in discipline, one of my friend's family has been serving in the British Gurkhas for 4 generations, his grandpa served in the Malayan Campaign, the old man once told a story narrated to him by a senior who served in WWII, when told to bury dead Germans after a bitter fight, the gurkhas bewildered but obliged the CO's order n dug a pit. while dumping the bodies one German woke up and asked for mercy or something, since no one spoke German they decided they had to follow the orders to the letter, one of them jumps into the pit with a khukri and the order to bury the Germans is completed


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## AUSTERLITZ

Can anyone tell me how to create my own drawings or maps on my computer so i can do basic illustrations to describe battles of history.I want to create a thread to describe some great battles of history and need to make basic drawing illustrations to detail the progress of these battles.
Thanks.

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## RAMPAGE

AUSTERLITZ said:


> 3.THE ROMAN LEGION
> 
> The single most successful,long lasting and influential infantry formation in history the legions were rome's instrument of destruction,through which it conquered and ruled the ancient world for nearly 700 years!Even after the western roman empire fell,the eastern roman empire would last another 1000 yrs and their infantry too was based on the original roman model,though weapons and tactics had changed.Later european armies like the spanish tercio,again and again tried to capture the key principles of the roman success.
> 
> 
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> 
> This will be discussed in 3-4 parts because of the massive time frame,rome's legions constantly evolved and so did the tactics.Also because of the extensive information available on them.
> 
> Part 1;The republican legions
> 
> 
> The legion['levy' in latin] began its career in a unspectacular manner .The first legions were essentially hoplites who fought in the greek manner with a round shield and spear and a straight sword in rigid formations.In the hilly terrain of italy they lost heavily to their more mobile samnite foes,and in 390 bc the gauls even sacked rome itself.This first incarnation of the legion was known as the servian legion.
> 
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> The Upper and lower tier of roman servian legionaries,equipment according to class divisions and wealth.Fought mostly as hoplites,with some skirmishers,archers and light cavalry in support.
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> The romans learned,adapted and put forward a new system known as the manipular legion adopted from their enemies,the italian samnites but perfected by rome.
> The new army was deployed in three liens known as maniples in a triplex aces.The first line were the 1200 hastati[young men of around 20.green with little combat experience].The second line were 1200 princeps [men at the prime of their life,combat experienced,usually former hastati] and third line of 600 triarii,older veterans.
> 
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> Hastati.They shed the spear.Adopted the new heavy throwing javelin the pilum and the stabbing short sword ,the greek hoplite shield was discarded in favour of the samnite oval scutum shield.The hastati would discharge their javelins before charging.
> 
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> 2nd line princeps,similar equipment with heavier armour.
> 
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> The final line,they retained the hasta spear and fought as hoplites.
> These 3 were supported by a screen of skirmishers called velites.
> 
> The main genius of the formation was in its organization..Within this triplex acies system, contemporary Roman writers talk of the maniples adopting a checkered formation called quincunx when deployed for battle but not yet engaged. In the first line, the hastati left gaps equal in size to their cross-sectional area between each maniple. The second line consisting of principes followed in a similar manner, lining up behind the gaps left by the first line. This was also done by the third line, standing behind the gaps in the second line. The velites were deployed in front of this line in a continuous, loose-formation line.
> 
> 
> 
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> As the army approached its enemy, the velites in front would throw their javelins at the enemy and then retreat through the gaps in the lines. This was an important innovation since in other armies of the period skirmishers would have to either retreat through their own armies ranks, causing confusion, or else flee around either flank of their own army. After the velites had retreated through the hastati, the 'posterior' century would march to the left and then forward so that they presented a solid line, creating a solid line of soldiers. The same procedure would be employed as they passed through the second and third ranks or turned to the side to channel down the gap between the first and second rows on route to help guard the legion's flanks
> 
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> 
> At this point, the legion then presented a solid line to the enemy and the legion was in the correct formation for engagement. When the enemy closed, the hastati would charge. If they were losing the fight, the 'posterior' century returned to its position creating gaps again. Then the maniples would fall back through the gaps in the principes, who followed the same procedure to form a battle line and charge. If the principes could not break the enemy, they would retreat behind the triarii and the whole army would leave the battlefield in good order. According to some writers, the triarii formed a continuous line when they deployed, and their forward movement allowed scattered or discomfited units to rest and reform, to later rejoin the struggle.
> 
> The manipular system allowed engaging every kind of enemy even in rough terrain, because the legion had both flexibility and toughness according to the deployment of its lines. Lack of a strong cavalry corps however, was a major flaw of the Roman forces.
> 
> Still don't get it?Go see the flash animation on this link.
> A Warhammer Ancient Battles Site
> 
> The checkerboard formation in action,.When engaged they would present a solid line.[can't post more than 8 images per post,so will make a isolated post to display the checkerboard formation within each maniple after this post].
> Another unique feature of the Roman infantry was the depth of its spacing. Most ancient armies deployed in shallower formations, particularly phalanx-type forces. Phalanxes might deepen their ranks heavily to add both stamina and shock power, but their general approach still favored one massive line, as opposed to the deep three-layer Roman arrangement. The advantage of the Roman system is that it allowed the continual funneling or metering of combat power forward over a longer periodmassive, steadily renewed pressure to the frontuntil the enemy broke.If both the hastati and princeps failed they could either retreat behind the triarii to reform while they presented a barrier of pikes and retire in good order or attack again with the triarii acting as the final reserve.
> 
> This was primarily the army that conquered greece,carthage and the seleucids and won rome the dominance of the mediteranean.
> 
> 
> PART 2;Marian legions.Caesar.


No#1 infantry !!!!

Specially Mark Antony's Testudo formation.


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## AUSTERLITZ

RAMPAGE said:


> No#1 infantry !!!!
> 
> Specially Mark Antony's Testudo formation.



Its not marc antony's formation.Marc antony was a roman general thats all,and not even too successful at that.
Most successful roman generals were julius caesar,publius scipio,constantine,aurelian,trajan,sulla,gaius marius,germanicus,agrippa,publius ventidius and pompey.Others being lucullus,marc antony,avidius cassius,flavius aetius,stilicho etc.


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## RAMPAGE

AUSTERLITZ said:


> Its not marc antony's formation.Marc antony was a roman general thats all,and not even too successful at that.
> Most successful roman generals were julius caesar,publius scipio,constantine,aurelian,trajan,sulla,gaius marius,germanicus,agrippa,publius ventidius and pompey.Others being lucullus,marc antony,avidius cassius,flavius aetius,stilicho etc.


lolzzz Mark Antony was Caesar's best and most trusted general and also had the privilege of being his best friend, and the formation was most successfully used by him to defend his retreating army against the Parthians.

Here you go page #55 : http://books.google.com.pk/books?id=WadVUvp2qlAC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false


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## AUSTERLITZ

RAMPAGE said:


> lolzzz Mark Antony was Caesar's best and most trusted general and also had the privilege of being his best friend, and the formation was most successfully used by him to defend his retreating army against the Parthians.
> 
> Here you go page #55 : Roman Battle Tactics 109BC-AD313 - Ross Cowan - Google Books



Marc antony was caesar's freind and trusted aide,but not best general.That was labienus ,his second in command.
And his parthian campaign was a failure,though yes he used the testudo there.The testudo was used by alkl roman generals in parthian campaigns.Best roman general against the parthians is publius ventidius.


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## vostok

Great theme, very thoroughly and deployed.
I have only one question. I see here the soldiers of Sweden kings, soldiers of Napoleon and Hitler. But I do not see those, who defeat them in the heyday of their glory - Russian soldiers?

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## flamer84

vostok said:


> Great theme, very thoroughly and deployed.
> I have only one question. I see here the soldiers of Sweden kings, soldiers of Napoleon and Hitler. But I do not see those, who defeat them in the heyday of their glory - Russian soldiers?



Russian winter and human wave attacks don't fall into "great infantry" category.



AUSTERLITZ said:


> Can anyone tell me how to create my own drawings or maps on my computer so i can do basic illustrations to describe battles of history.I want to create a thread to describe some great battles of history and need to make basic drawing illustrations to detail the progress of these battles.
> Thanks.



Can't wait for that thread man ! Christmas is coming early this year ! Sry if i can't help you with the drawings as i'm no computer geek

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## AUSTERLITZ

vostok said:


> Great theme, very thoroughly and deployed.
> I have only one question. I see here the soldiers of Sweden kings, soldiers of Napoleon and Hitler. But I do not see those, who defeat them in the heyday of their glory - Russian soldiers?



Yes truly russia has produced some of the greatest soldiers,but i can't really pin down one particular period of the russian infantry where it all all conquering,thats all.Not that russian infantry is doubted.

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## AUSTERLITZ

A little help here from any computer wiz,i want to start a thread to analyze different battles.So i made drawings in microsoft word of the battle maps and manuevres,but i can't post them on the forum as pictures.Usually i just host using imageshack.But imageshack won't upload the word drawings in document form.How can i post the drawings in the forum?
Thanks in advance.


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## Alpha1

AUSTERLITZ said:


> A little help here from any computer wiz,i want to start a thread to analyze different battles.So i made drawings in microsoft word of the battle maps and manuevres,but i can't post them on the forum as pictures.Usually i just host using imageshack.But imageshack won't upload the word drawings in document form.How can i post the drawings in the forum?
> Thanks in advance.


Bro, one option is to take a screenshot of the drawings

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## AUSTERLITZ

Alpha1 said:


> Bro, one option is to take a screenshot of the drawings



How do i take a screenshot?And then what?Host the screenshot via imageshack?
Thanks.


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## Alpha1

AUSTERLITZ said:


> How do i take a screenshot?And then what?Host the screenshot via imageshack?
> Thanks.


use snipping tool or this method  Take a Screenshot in Microsoft Windows - wikiHow

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## p(-)0ENiX

Awesome thread, the Spartan Hoplites are one of my favorite infantry units as well. As for cavalry, the Companions & Parthian Cataphracts are among my favorites. 



AUSTERLITZ said:


> A little help here from any computer wiz,i want to start a thread to analyze different battles.So i made drawings in microsoft word of the battle maps and manuevres,but i can't post them on the forum as pictures.Usually i just host using imageshack.But imageshack won't upload the word drawings in document form.How can i post the drawings in the forum?
> Thanks in advance.



You could save the documents in PDF format & then convert them in to the PNG image format for uploading online.

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