# Greece vs Turkiye Military Power : Tactical and Strategic Advantages



## MMM-E

Turkey’s unique regional assertiveness and engagement of its armed forces and deployment of its technological capabilities in several battlefields, every aspect of Greece’s military capabilities has been exposed


-- NAVAL POWER
-- AIR FORCE
-- ARMY



It's time to wake the Greeks from their dreams


*NAVAL POWER

Hellenic Navy ( 13 Warships )*
-- 4 MEKO-20HN class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 16x ESSM SAMs )
-- 9 ELLI class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 8x Sea Sparrow SAMs )


*Turkish Navy ( 20 Warships )*
--4 MEKO-200TN Track1 class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 16x Sea Sparrow SAMs )
--4 MEKO-200TN Track2 class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 32/64x ESSM SAMs )
--4 OHP class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 36x SM-1MR SAMs )
--4 GABYA class Frigates .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 36x SM-1MR - 32x ESSM SAMs )

-- 4 ADA class Corvettes .... ( 8x HARPOON anti-ship missiles and 21x RAM SAMs )


*Turkish Navy has more Warships with far superior fire power and technology*






















List of active Hellenic Navy ships - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org










List of active ships of the Turkish Naval Forces - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org






*to be continued*

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## Primus

Yaaaay MMME you're back! Missed you buddy

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## MMM-E

*ANTI-SHIP MISSILE POWER*


Greece is a Country without national defense Industry
on the other hand Turkiye has developed its own Missiles to hit Hellenic Navy Warships in the Aegean Sea and in the Eastern Mediterranean



*TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile*

-- Range : 70 km land launched and 150 km air launched
-- Warhead : 50 kg













*ATMACA land based anti-ship Missile*

Range : 250 km
Warhead : 250 km

















*CAKIR New generation anti-ship Missile*​it will use the most modern systems in the world
next-generation swarm technologies as well as artificial intelligence


For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the targets





*There is not yet such a detailed mini Cruise Missile in the world*




Range = 150 km
Diameter = 275 mm
Weight = 330 kg ( with booster )
Length = 4.1 m ( with booster )
Warhead = 70 kg
Speed = 0.75-0.85 Mach
Guidance = INS , IIR , RF , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink


--The earth reference navigation system will be loaded into its memory. In the absence of GNSS, it will continue by looking at the map in its memory

-- The passive hybrid ( RF+IIR) seeker
-- Network-centric warfare capability with Datalink
-- next-generation swarm technologies
-- artificial intelligence
-- Swarm concept that allows coordinated attack with a large number of ammunition.
-- Determining and changing the flight route
-- Ability to perform evasive maneuvers during the hit phase.
-- Ability to detect damage.
-- sea skimming and terrain hugging
-- Low radar visibility due to its small dimensions and unique body design with radar absorber
-- High durability in GNSS jamming and deception environments thanks to the Anti-Jamming GNSS system
-- Usability from all manned and unmanned air, land and sea vehicles ( including transport aircrafts )














*SOM air launched anti-ship Missile*

Range : 275 km
Warhead : 230 kg






even AKINCI UCAV to carry SOM Missile






Hellenic Navy is so easy target by Turkish Missiles


*to be continued*

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## Apollon

Doesnt it get boring to post all this bullshit and to know nothing will change anyways since Greece and Turkey are both in NATO and Greece is EU. 


It gets so incredible boring when you have high IQ.

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## MMM-E

Apollon said:


> Doesnt it get boring to post all this bullshit and to know nothing will change anyways since Greece and Turkey are both in NATO and Greece is EU.
> 
> 
> It gets so incredible boring when you have high IQ.




It's time to wake the Greeks from their dreams


Turkiye reminds Greece of ‘Casus Belli’​
in the event Greece extends its territorial waters in the Aegean it will be a cause for war,
The decision taken by the Turkish parliament in 1995

NATO or EU can not save Greece


France-İtaly-Greece and Greek Cypriots are playing with fire in the Eastern Mediterranean

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## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> It's time to wake the Greeks from their dreams
> 
> 
> Turkiye reminds Greece of ‘Casus Belli’​
> in the event Greece extends its territorial waters in the Aegean it will be a cause for war,
> The decision taken by the Turkish parliament in 1995
> 
> NATO or EU can not save Greece
> 
> 
> France-İtaly-Greece and Greek Cypriots are playing with fire in the Eastern Mediterranean



Yawn.

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## MMM-E

*SUBMARINE POWER*


Hellenic Navy
-- 6 Type-209 class Submarines
-- 4 Type-214 class Submarines


Turkish Navy
-- 12 Type-209 class Submarines
-- 6 Type-214 class Submarines to enter service between 2022 and 2027
-- *MILDEN class indigenous AIP Submarine *
-- *STM500 Mini attack Submarine*


Turkish Navy has the best Submarine fleet in the Eastern Mediterranean





First Type-214 class AIP Submarine enter service in 2022





*MILDEN class indigenous AIP Submarine construction will start in 2025*






*STM500 Mini attack Submarines will be game changer*

-- 42 m
-- 550 tons
-- speeds of around 18 knots
-- range 4.500 nm
-- accommodate 18 crew members
-- operate at depths of more than 250 meters for 30 days
-- with a 6-person Special Forces team
-- powered by two diesel generators and Lithium-Ion batteries.

STM-500 Submarine armed with 8 AKYA heavyweight Torpedos
( No platform in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean will be safe once the STM500s are in the inventory )










*Indigenous Weapons and Torpedo counter measure Systems*

ATMACA Anti ship Missile
GEZGIN Land attack Cruise Missile
AKYA heavyweight Torpedo
ZARGANA Soft-kill Torpedo counter measure System
TORK Hard-kill Torpedo Countermeasure System


















*to be continued*

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## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> *SUBMARINE POWER*
> 
> 
> Hellenic Navy
> -- 6 Type-209 class Submarines
> -- 4 Type-214 class Submarines
> 
> 
> Turkish Navy
> -- 12 Type-209 class Submarines
> -- 6 Type-214 class Submarines to enter service between 2022 and 2027
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish Navy has the best Submarine fleet in the Eastern Mediterranean
> View attachment 849593
> 
> 
> Type-214 class AIP Submarine enter sercine in 2022
> View attachment 849595
> 
> 
> *MILDEN class indigenous AIP Submarine construction will start in 2025*
> View attachment 849596
> 
> 
> 
> *STM500 Mini Submarines will be game changer*
> 
> -- 42 m
> -- 550 tons
> -- speeds of around 18 knots
> -- range 4.500 nm
> -- accommodate 18 crew members
> -- operate at depths of more than 250 meters for 30 days
> -- with a 6-person Special Forces team
> -- powered by two diesel generators and Lithium-Ion batteries.
> 
> STM-500 Submarine armed with 8 AKYA heavyweight Torpedos
> ( No platform in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean will be safe once the STM500s are in the inventory )
> View attachment 849609
> 
> View attachment 849607
> 
> 
> 
> *Indigenous Weapon Systems and Torpedo counter measure System*
> 
> ATMACA Anti ship Missile
> GEZGIN Land attack Cruise Missile
> AKYA heavyweight Torpedo
> ZARGANA Soft-kill Torpedo counter measure System
> TORK Hard-kill Torpedo Countermeasure System
> View attachment 849599
> 
> View attachment 849600
> 
> View attachment 849601
> 
> View attachment 849602



Wow. So cool. 


But i wonder, do they have a spa in there? How about tourism? If you put windows in it it might become popular for tourists to tour the sea.


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## MMM-E

*10 HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessels for the Turkish Navy*


The first Ship is scheduled to be launched in 2023

The primary missions of the OPVs to protect the sovereignty rights within the scope of national and international law in low-risk Exclusive Economic Zone and open sea areas
( intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance, search and rescue )


*Overall length:* 99,56 meters
*Maximum speed:* 24 knots
*Displacement:* 2300 tons
*Range :* 4500 nautical miles

CENK-S AESA Radar
-- 76 mm Gun
-- L-UMTAS Missiles
-- 8 x HISAR-O Air Defense Missiles
-- 8 x ATMACA Anti-Ship Missiles
-- 1 x GOKDENIZ CIWS ( 35 mm )










Hellenic Navy even can not enter Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean


*to be continued*


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## Primus

I have a question. Since both nations are in NATO, how would NATO article 4 (or 5, whichever it is, where they all go to war against a nation) apply if either nation goes to war with one another? Say if Turkey attacks Greece or Greece attacks Turkey, do they gang up on Turkey or Greece?


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## MMM-E

*NEW FRIGATES




Hellenic Navy buys 3+1 FDI Frigates from France between 2025 and 2027*

-- 76 mm Gun
-- 8x EXOCET anti-ship Missiles
-- 32x ASTER SAMs







*Turkih Navy 4 ISTIF class Frigates between 2023 and 2026*

-- 1 x 76 mm Gun
-- 16 x ATMACA Anti ship Missiles ( 250 km )
-- 64 x HISAR Air Defense Missiles











*to be continued*


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## retaxis

Apollon said:


> Doesnt it get boring to post all this bullshit and to know nothing will change anyways since Greece and Turkey are both in NATO and Greece is EU.
> 
> 
> It gets so incredible boring when you have high IQ.


but trolls like u have low IQ its proven

high IQ people never talk about their IQ which proves you have low IQ pretending to be high IQ

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## MMM-E

*Turkish Navy Barbaros Class Frigate Half-Life Modernization Project ( about €250 million )



4 Ships are planned to be delivered to the Turkish Navy until 2025*



-- Havelsan Network Enabled Data Integrated (GENESIS ADVENT) Combat Management System
-- Aselsan TAKS Fire Control System
-- Aselsan SMART-S MK-II 3D Radar
-- Aselsan MAR-D 3B AESA Radar
-- Aselsan AKR-D X and Ka-Band fire control Radars
-- Aselsan ARES-2N Electronic Warfare System
-- Aselsan PIRI Panoramic Infrared Imaging - KATS Infrared Search and Track system
-- Aselsan FERSAH Carina Mounted Sonar System
-- Aselsan HIZIR Torpedo counter measure System

-- 127 mm Gun
-- Aselsan STOP 25mm Remote Controlled Stabilized Cannon System
-- Aselsan GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
-- 64x ESSM/HISAR Air Defense Missiles
-- 16x ATMACA Anti ship Missiles
-- Lightweight Torpedoes







Hellenic Navy no match for the Turkish Navy


*to be continued*


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## Foinikas

retaxis said:


> but trolls like u have low IQ its proven
> 
> high IQ people never talk about their IQ which proves you have low IQ pretending to be high IQ


Forget about Apollon and focus on how ridiculous such a thread is. It's another flex thread. MMM-E wants an audience to pat him at the back and say "good job,Turkiye is superpower".



Huffal said:


> I have a question. Since both nations are in NATO, how would NATO article 4 (or 5, whichever it is, where they all go to war against a nation) apply if either nation goes to war with one another? Say if Turkey attacks Greece or Greece attacks Turkey, do they gang up on Turkey or Greece?


Official NATO statement is always "work out things on your own". So I guess it's probably according to each country's interests to support one or another. France,Hungary and Austria could help Greece. Britain and Germany could indirectly help Turkey. Who knows.

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## MMM-E

Erdogan says Mitsotakis no longer exist for me​

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## MMM-E

Huffal said:


> I have a question. Since both nations are in NATO, how would NATO article 4 (or 5, whichever it is, where they all go to war against a nation) apply if either nation goes to war with one another? Say if Turkey attacks Greece or Greece attacks Turkey, do they gang up on Turkey or Greece?




NATO Members USA and France used Greece , PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye from Syria to Karabakh and from Libya to Eastern Mediterranean

USA-France arming Greece
on the other hand USA-France use arms embargo on Turkiye

therefore Greeks have another big dreams as like 1919-1922

100 years ago UK-France backed Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming,


Turkish Armed Forces kicked PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia
and Greece is the next puppet to be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> NATO Members USA and France used Greece , PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye from Syria to Karabakh and from Libya to Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> USA-France arming Greece
> on the other hand USA-France use arms embargo on Turkiye
> 
> therefore Greeks have another big dreams as like 1919-1922
> 
> 100 years ago UK-France backed Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming,
> 
> 
> Turkish Armed Forces kicked PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia
> and Greece is the next puppet to be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces


The exact same sentences in a loop. Again and again and again. 

In every thread where you post. The exact same sentences,statements and comments. 

It's like an endless c/p madness.

@Huffal do you see the paranoia here?

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## Mahabahu kaunteya

Foinikas said:


> The exact same sentences in a loop. Again and again and again.
> 
> In every thread where you post. The exact same sentences,statements and comments.
> 
> It's like an endless c/p madness.
> 
> @Huffal do you see the paranoia here?


I see a little flexing here only

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> @Huffal do you see the paranoia here?



Its not paranoia , its reality

USA and France use Greece, PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye in Syria , Karabakh ,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean


Greece gets F-16V , Rafale even maybe F-35
but Your Micoteakis cried in Washington not to sell even F-16V to Turkiye
why ? because Greeks have dreams to fight unmarmed Turkiye as like 1919-1922

to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean

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## Primus

MMM-E said:


> NATO Members USA and France used Greece , PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye from Syria to Karabakh and from Libya to Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> USA-France arming Greece
> on the other hand USA-France use arms embargo on Turkiye
> 
> therefore Greeks have another big dreams as like 1919-1922
> 
> 100 years ago UK-France backed Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming,
> 
> 
> Turkish Armed Forces kicked PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia
> and Greece is the next puppet to be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces


That didnt answer my question 🤔🤨

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## jhungary

Huffal said:


> I have a question. Since both nations are in NATO, how would NATO article 4 (or 5, whichever it is, where they all go to war against a nation) apply if either nation goes to war with one another? Say if Turkey attacks Greece or Greece attacks Turkey, do they gang up on Turkey or Greece?


There are special clause with Article 5. I am not going to quote a bunch of text here. But think why NATO did not attack Argentina when Argentina attack the UK in Falkland back in 82'

If you know the reason why then, you will know what NATO will do.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Its not paranoia , its reality
> 
> USA and France use Greece, PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye in Syria , Karabakh ,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> Greece gets F-16V , Rafale even maybe F-35
> but Your Micoteakis cried in Washington not to sell even F-16V to Turkiye
> why ? because Greeks have dreams to fight unmarmed Turkiye as like 1919-1922
> 
> to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean


All I see is Erdogan crying in the video you posted.

"Mitsotakis does not exist for me" 😢 like a crying ex-gf.


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## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> Its not paranoia , its reality
> 
> USA and France use Greece, PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia as pawns against Turkiye in Syria , Karabakh ,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> Greece gets F-16V , Rafale even maybe F-35
> but Your Micoteakis cried in Washington not to sell even F-16V to Turkiye
> why ? because Greeks have dreams to fight unmarmed Turkiye as like 1919-1922
> 
> to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean



My only dream right now is Uganda travel next year with Gorilla trekking.


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean


Turks demand everything from Greece to Libya. You should stop your bullying and be real friends and neighbors. You're the thieves here.


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## MMM-E

Huffal said:


> That didnt answer my question 🤔🤨



All NATO allies are required to come to the aid of a member state that suffers aggression,
but the decades-old tensions between Greece and Turkiye are complicated by the fact that Turkiye is also a member of the NATO

NATO members USA-France use PKK/YPG Terror organization to destroy NATO member Turkiye's territorial integrity

Even in 2021 NATO Members France-Greece signed a new defence agreement against NATO member Turkiye


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## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> All NATO allies are required to come to the aid of a member state that suffers aggression,
> but the decades-old tensions between Greece and Turkiye are complicated by the fact that Turkiye is also a member of the NATO
> 
> USA-France use PKK/YPG Terror organization to destroy Turkiye's territorial integrity
> 
> Even in 2021 NATO Members France-Greece signed a new defence agreement against NATO member Turkiye



Why dont we sign deal too?


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Turks demand everything from Greece to Libya. You should stop your bullying and be real friends and neighbors. You're the thieves here.



The only thieves here are USA-France-Greece

-- USA-France used PKK/YPG Terror organization to take 30% of Syria
-- USA-France used HAFTAR to make military coup in Libya to steal oil reserves
-- USA-France use Greece to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean

by international law even Greece has no any right in the Eastern Mediterranean
and USA-France have no even borderline in the Eastern Mediterranean


Turkiye is not İraq or Syria or Libya or Mali
Nobody can steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean

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## Foinikas

As you can see,MMM-E has been spamming similar threads again and again. Just like his posts,the threads he starts are usually the same stuff again and again.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> All I see is Erdogan crying in the video you posted.
> 
> "Mitsotakis does not exist for me" 😢 like a crying ex-gf.



Mitsotakis = escort girl


Mitsotakis comes to Turkiye and says to work with Erdogan
then Mitsotakis comes to USA and says please help us against Erdogan even dont sell F-16V to Turkiye


no more tolerance to escort girl Mitsotakis and Greece
Turkish Armed Forces will show your place as always



Foinikas said:


> As you can see,MMM-E has been spamming similar threads again and again. Just like his posts,the threads he starts are usually the same stuff again and again.



not similar threads .. stop crying and lying


its about Greece and Turkiye
other threads have no any info about Greek military power


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> not similar threads .. stop crying and lying
> 
> 
> its about Greece and Turkiye
> other threads have no any info about Greek military power


Crying and lying? It's there. It's right there. Anyone can read the titles and check the threads. You post the same long lists of Turkish "superweapons" and projects. It's the same thing again and again.

What was the reason for this thread? You've made threads of Greece vs Turkey,Cyprus EEZ,East Mediterranean,Turkey vs France,Turkey vs Egypt,Turkey vs Syria. 

What's the reason? It's the same trash. You just want to showcase and brag about your products. 

Are you getting paid to do that?


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## MMM-E

*UCAV Fleet Greece vs Turkiye*



Greece has no any UCAV

even Turkish Armed Forces have more UCAVs than all Europe combined


TB-2
TB-3
ANKA-S
AKSUNGUR
AKINCI
and soon KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet



Greek Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates armed with only 17-20 km SEA SPARROW air defense Missiles

even 10 AKINCI and AKSUNGUR UCAVs can fire 60 MAM-T laser guided munitions on Greek Frigate from 30km away .... and game over !

weight of 94 kg











*upcoming Turkish fire power for UCAVs to hit enemy Warships*
-- 30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
-- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR anti-ship Missile with IIR+RF seeker
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ Missile with IIR seeker
-- 275 km SOM anti-ship Missile with IIR seeker


even only Turkish UCAVs will be enough to wipe out Hellenic Navy


*to be continued*


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## MMM-E

*MISSILE POWER Greece vs Turkiye*



Greece has no military capability to hit every military target in Turkiye

-- 100 ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missiles with range of 165 km
-- 90 SCALP Cruise Missiles
-- 50 HARM anti-radiation Missiles



on the other hand , All Greek Air Defense Systems , Air Bases , Jet Hangars , Navy-Naval Ports , Military and Strategic targets are in range of Turkish Missiles

-- 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided Missile
-- 120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
-- 150 km J600-T Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km KHAN Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km ATMACA Land based Cruise Missile
-- 280 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile




























also Turkish Army has 12 M-270 MLRS with 120 of ATACMS Tactical Balistic Missiles ( range of 165 km ) to hit Greek PATRIOT Air Defense Systems , Air Bases and Military targets in Greek Islands such as Skyros









also Turkish Air Force has 50 AGM-84 SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles ( 280km ) and 90+ POPEYE Cruise Missiles and 95 HARM anti-radiation Missiles










*to be continued*


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## MMM-E

*ATTACK HELICOPTER FLEET Greece vs Turkiye*




Greece has 27 AH-64 Apache Attack Helicopters ... ( 19 AH-64A and 8 AH-64D )

on the other hand Turkiye has 83 T-129 also 8 AH-1W Super Cobra Attack Helicopters


*Turkiye has the best Attack Helicopter fleet in NATO after USA*
















*Also Turkiye used Drones as primary element in air strikes to destroy* * Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Air Defense Systems*

Turkiye’s extensive deployment of Armed Drones in its fight against Syrian Regime Forces in Idlib province has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world














and soon KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet






*to be continued*


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## MMM-E

*Greece RAFALE vs Turkiye S400



GREECE*
85 modernized F-16V block72 until 2028

also Greece buys 24 Rafale Fighter Jets








*TURKIYE*
Turkiye bought S400 Air Defense Systems including 380 km 40N6E Missiles

-- 36 launchers
-- 144+48 Missiles

S400s can block Greek Rafales even over the Aegean












*also Turkiye wants to buy 40 new F-16V block70*

The Turkish Ministry of Defense sent a Letter of Request (LoR) to the American government for the acquisition of 40 new F-16C/D Block 70 Viper Fighter Jets as well as the modernization of a total of 80 existing Turkish F-16s to the Viper standard


-- 40 new F-16 block70
-- 80 F-16 modernization to the Viper standard






USA blocked sale of 100 F-35A to Turkiye





*to be continued*


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## _Nabil_

@MMM-E 

Why Turkey don't fix peacefully it's problems with Greece and focus on Israel, the real enemy???


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## MMM-E

_Nabil_ said:


> @MMM-E
> 
> Why Turkey don't fix peacefully it's problems with Greece and focus on Israel, the real enemy???



İsrael is not enemy now ...... ( no any big problem )
and Israel-Turkiye have decided to fix peacefully it's problems






Erdogan and Greek PM Mitsotakis agreed to not let third countries come between Greece and Turkiye . But despite this, just few weeks ago he went to the US and in the US Senate he said do whatever is needed against Turkiye

Greece is a puppet
USA-France says jump and Greece says how long Sir


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> İsrael is not enemy


@_Nabil_ There you go,sir. You got your answer.

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## Mahabahu kaunteya

Thats why Pakistanis call you munafiq and muslim in name.only 


MMM-E said:


> İsrael is not enemy now ...... ( no any big problem )
> and Israel-Turkiye have decided to fix peacefully it's problems
> View attachment 849762
> 
> 
> 
> Erdogan and Greek PM Mitsotakis agreed to not let third countries come between Greece and Turkiye . But despite this, just few weeks ago he went to the US and in the US Senate he said do whatever is needed against Turkiye
> 
> Greece is a puppet
> USA-France says jump and Greece says how long Sir

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## MMM-E

*ANTI SUBMARINE WARFARE AIRCRAFTS*



Greece
-- 6 P-3B Orion

Turkiye
-- 6 CN-235
-- 6 ATR-72


















also AKSUNGUR UCAV will change the game in the Eastern Mediterranean to carry SONOBOUY Pod capable to host 18 sonobuoys and to receive their signals providing the data to the AKSUNGUR to detect Submarines


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## Steppe Wolff

Blueindian said:


> Thats why Pakistanis call you munafiq and muslim in name.only


Get tf out of here Indian. Turkey is a brother country to Pakistan. Your filthy propaganda won’t work here.

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## MMM-E

Blueindian said:


> Thats why Pakistanis call you munafiq and muslim in name.only




are you a muslim from India ? or zionist lover hindu ?

Pakistanis ?
what did Pakistan do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING

what did S.Arabia , Egypt , Indonesia and The Uae do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING


We Turks are not stupid to fight Israel ( USA-Europe ) for traitor Palestinians
go and say even something to Israel-USA , then come to discuss

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## _Nabil_

MMM-E said:


> İsrael is not enemy now ...... ( no any big problem )
> and Israel-Turkiye have decided to fix peacefully it's problems
> View attachment 849762
> 
> 
> 
> Erdogan and Greek PM Mitsotakis agreed to not let third countries come between Greece and Turkiye . But despite this, just few weeks ago he went to the US and in the US Senate he said do whatever is needed against Turkiye
> 
> Greece is a puppet
> USA-France says jump and Greece says how long Sir


You are making Greece your enemy just because their PM mentioned you to force an arm deal. 🙄

Israel an apartheid, terrorist, racist state, daily killing Palestinians kids, isn't your enemy.🤮🤕

You can put all your mentioned missiles and rockets where I'm thinking .....


----------



## Steppe Wolff

MMM-E said:


> Pakistanis ?
> what did Pakistan do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> what did S.Arabia , Egypt , Indonesia and The Uae do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> 
> We Turks are not stupid to fight Israel ( USA-Europe ) for traitor Palestinians
> go and say even something to Israel-USA , then come discuss you useless muslims


Pakistani pilots fought in Arab Israel Wars and downed Israeli Jets without no losses, the achievement no other country can claim.

To this day, Pakistan hasn’t even recognized Israel as a state despite mounting International pressure.

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## MMM-E

_Nabil_ said:


> You are making Greece your enemy just because their PM mentioned you to force an arm deal. 🙄



if you are so ignorant , then dont jump to the issue


Greeks have only one eternal enemy and its Turkiye
even Greek national anthem has racist words towards the Turks

100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye
today same senario ... ( Greece has a dream to attack on Turkiye but they have no enough power )

if USA-France says lets attack together on Turkiye , then Greece will say okey lets attack on Turkiye


there are many problems between Turkiye and Greece in Cyprus , Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean

even Christian Greeks have dreams of capturing Anatolia and Istanbul from muslim Turks



_Nabil_ said:


> Israel an apartheid, terrorist, racist state, daily killing Palestinians kids, isn't your enemy.🤮🤕



go and say nuclear power Pakistan and rich Arabs S.Arabia,The Uae and
Egypt,Tunusia,Algeria,Morocco to do someting for Palestine against Israel

only is Turkiye muslim country in the world ?


----------



## MMM-E

Steppe Wolff said:


> To this day, Pakistan hasn’t even recognized Israel as a state despite mounting International pressure.



woowww what a support for Palestine

useless Pakistan , Indonesia , Maleysia , S.Arabia , The Uae , Egypt , etc


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greeks have only one eternal enemy and its Turkiye
> even Greek national anthem has racist words towards the Turks


You've said this bullshit before 2-3 times.Tell me where is the racism? First,you were saying it sings of genocide. When I told you that you're wrong,you quietly stopped talking about it. Now you say it has "racist words".



MMM-E said:


> 100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye
> today same senario ... ( Greece has a dream to attack on Turkiye but they have no enough power )


It must be like...the 100st time you've mentioned this. Apparently,even you can't believe that you beat the Hellenic Army.
What,you can? Well then move on and stop acting like you can't.



MMM-E said:


> even Christian Greeks have dreams of capturing Anatolia and Istanbul from muslim Turks


Just like Arabs dream of Al Quds.



MMM-E said:


> if USA-France says lets attack together on Turkiye , then Greece will say okey lets attack on Turkiye


Greece knows better than to attack on their promises. If they decide to attack,they have enough manpower and weapons to destroy the Turkish army. However,we will not attack first,unless attacked or provoked.




MMM-E said:


> go and say your nuclear power Pakistan and rich Arabs S.Arabia,The Uae to do someting for Palestine
> 
> also Egypt,Tunusia,Algeria,Morocco


I thought it was Erdogan who kept threatening Israel and kept reciting poems about Kudus and said he is brothers to the Palestinians?

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## Steppe Wolff

MMM-E said:


> woowww what a support for Palestine
> 
> useless Pakistan , Indonesia , Maleysia , S.Arabia , The Uae , Egypt , etc


What does Turkey has done for Palestine except for bending over backwards for the Jews?

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## _Nabil_

MMM-E said:


> if you are so ignorant , then dont jump to the issue
> 
> 
> Greeks have only one eternal enemy and its Turkiye
> even Greek national anthem has racist words towards the Turks
> 
> 100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye
> today same senario ... ( Greece has a dream to attack on Turkiye but they have no enough power )
> 
> if USA-France says lets attack together on Turkiye , then Greece will say okey lets attack on Turkiye
> 
> 
> there are many problems between Turkiye and Greeks in Cyprus , Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> even Christian Greeks have dreams of capturing Anatolia and Istanbul from muslim Turks
> 
> 
> 
> go and say your nuclear power Pakistan and rich Arabs S.Arabia,The Uae to do someting for Palestine
> 
> also Egypt,Tunusia,Algeria,Morocco


Greece Turkey animosity is well known, you are the one that gave me that silly excuse of Greek PM to say they are your enemy.

In the same time you are pointing at USA, UK, France as the countries that are the real threat to Turkey and supposing that Greece will back them if they attack you.

It will be wise and smart to fix your problems with Greece so the countries that are a really threat won't have foot on Greece to easily attack you.

Again you show your lack of Islam spirit and humanity, Palestine is a *Human* cause, not only Arab or Indonesian or Pakistani.....

For the Tunisian part, thanks to God, our regime is not a Cûck one like many Arab and Muslim ones ( Turkey included), we aren't bending over and licking balls of Zionists like your regime is doing .....


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You've said this bullshit before 2-3 times.Tell me where is the racism? First,you were saying it sings of genocide. When I told you that you're wrong,you quietly stopped talking about it. Now you say it has "racist words".



I showed you rasict words in Greek national anthem towards the Turks

but you cried to MODS and they deleted my post


----------



## Foinikas

P.S. @_Nabil_ just in case you don't know,when he keeps saying "100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye",what really happened was Turkey fought with the Greek Army,who reached the outskirts of Ankara,but with overstreched lines of supply,harassed by irregulars,fought against a few thousand Armenians who were given a massive amount of land and couldn't cover it all,Italy played no part,French fought a few small battles but retreated to Syria because they didn't care about keeping Cilicia and finally Britain did virtually nothing but a tiny skirmish.

So basically it was the Turks and Kurdish irregulars vs the Greek Army in the West and the few Armenians in the East.

But in MMM-E's mind,Turkey fought superpowers amidst a civil war and won. It's like fighting a garisson of Americans and saying you defeated USA. You get the idea.



MMM-E said:


> I showed you rasict words in Greek national anthem towards the Turks
> 
> but you cried to MODS and they deleted my post


Show me again,because I remember I corrected you. I think you posted a completely different text and not the national athem.

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## _Nabil_

Foinikas said:


> P.S. @_Nabil_ just in case you don't know,when he keeps saying "100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye",what really happened was Turkey fought with the Greek Army,who reached the outskirts of Ankara,but with overstreched lines of supply,harassed by irregulars,fought against a few thousand Armenians who were given a massive amount of land and couldn't cover it all,Italy played no part,French fought a few small battles but retreated to Syria because they didn't care about keeping Cilicia and finally Britain did virtually nothing but a tiny skirmish.
> 
> So basically it was the Turks and Kurdish irregulars vs the Greek Army in the West and the few Armenians in the East.
> 
> But in MMM-E's mind,Turkey fought superpowers amidst a civil war and won. It's like fighting a garisson of Americans and saying you defeated USA. You get the idea.
> 
> 
> Show me again,because I remember I corrected you. I think you posted a completely different text and not the national athem.


That's was ages ago, different times, it doesn't really matter who really won .

What is actually see, is Turkey giving huge amount of support to a terrorist state against Palestinians.

The Christian regime of Greece isn't supporting Israel as our so called Muslim regime in Turkey.....


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## MMM-E

Steppe Wolff said:


> What does Turkey has done for Palestine except for bending over backwards for the Jews?



Only Turkiye could say this to Israel .... other muslim countries are so useless

2009 DAVOS one minute .. watch





since 2013 , there was asymmetric - economic war between İsrael-USA-Europpean Union , PKK/YPG ,FETO and Turkiye

and Turkiye lost over $500 billion because of criticising Israel


We Turks dont care about traitor Palestine which supported USA-France-S.Arabia,The Uae,PKK/YPG against Turkiye in Syria and in the Eastern Mediterranean

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## Abid123

Greece and Turkey are never going to war ever.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Greece knows better than to attack on their promises. If they decide to attack,they have enough manpower and weapons to destroy the Turkish army. However,we will not attack first,unless attacked or provoked.



They are smart to use puppets like Greece,PKK/YPG,FETO,HAFTAR,Armenia against Turkiye


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## _Nabil_

MMM-E said:


> I showed you rasict words in Greek national anthem towards the Turks
> 
> but you cried to MODS and they deleted my post


Here is the English translation of Greek national anthem (only first 8 verses), there is nothing wrong even for the remaining verses ....

*I know you from the blade
Of the sword, the terrifying [blade],
I know you from the appearance,
Which, with force, measures the earth.

From the bones taken out,
the sacred (bones) of greeks
𝄆 And as first brave again,
Rejoice, oh rejoice, liberty! 𝄇*

There in you were living
bitter, ashamed,
And a mouth you were awaiting,
"Come again", should it tell you.

Late came that day,
And it was all silent,
𝄆 Because the bullying was overshadowing them
And the slavery was oppressing them. 𝄇

Unhappy one! Consolation
Alone was staying to tell you
Past greatnesses
And narrating them to mourn.

And it was awaiting, and it was awaiting
Freedom-loving speech.
𝄆 One hand strikes the other
Out of the hopelessness. 𝄇

And you were saying: when, oh when do I get
My head out of these lonely places?
And answering from above were
Cries, chains, voices.

Then you were raising your glance
Into the tears, blurry.
𝄆 And into the clothing of yours was dripping blood,
A lot of Greek blood. 𝄇









Hymn to Liberty - Wikipedia







en.m.wikipedia.org

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> So basically it was the Turks and Kurdish irregulars vs the Greek Army in the West and the few Armenians in the East.



nahhh

Ottoman Army was banned after ww1 in 1918

and in 1919 UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on unarmed Turkiye

Greek Army was so superior with most modern weapons
France sent over 50.000 troops to invade the part of Anatolia
Armenians attacked from the East
British and French invaded Istanbul

only İtaly withdrew its forces from Anatolia


ATATURK organized Turkish People for national war of independence
Turks bought weapons from the Russians and kicked all enemies in 1922


100 years ago , Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming


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## Foinikas

_Nabil_ said:


> That's was ages ago, different times, it doesn't really matter who really won .
> 
> What is actually see, is Turkey giving huge amount of support to a terrorist state against Palestinians.
> 
> The Christian regime of Greece isn't supporting Israel as our so called Muslim regime in Turkey.....


Today is the anniversay of the Gaza Flotilla by the way...which if you ask me was an attempt for publicity and provocation by Erdogan. But tell me something,do you find logical that Turkey claims an EEZ reaching to Libya? I won't be surprised if they claim and EEZ up to Tunis.

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## _Nabil_

Steppe Wolff said:


> What does Turkey has done for Palestine except for bending over backwards for the Jews?


He did a lot !!! condemning the stabbing of settlers in Israel 🤕


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greek Army was so superior with most modern weapons


Slightly bigger number of weapons and equipment.Nothing else. 



MMM-E said:


> Armenians attacked from the East
> British and French invaded Istanbul


Nobody invaded Istanbul...relax. You make it sound like the British took the City 🙄 



MMM-E said:


> France sent over 50.000 troops to invade the part of Anatolia


Do I have to quote Ataturk again just to show you? I'm tired of showing you the same stuff and you coming back with the same arguements.



MMM-E said:


> ATATURK organized Turkish People for national war of independence
> Turks bought weapons from the Russiand and kicked all enemies in 1922


Not Russia. The Soviet Union. The Bolsheviks. Lenin. 

And Erdogan is destroying Ataturk's legacy now. How do you like that?



MMM-E said:


> They are smart to use puppets like Greece,PKK/YPG,FETO,HAFTAR,Armenia against Turkiye


LOL everyone caring for their interests is a "puppet"? 

Greeks want to defend against Turkish aggression. The Kurds want their own State. Haftar wants a united Libya under the House of Representatives. Armenia simply wants to survive.

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## MMM-E

_Nabil_ said:


> Here is the English translation of Greek national anthem (only first 8 verses), there is nothing wrong even for the remaining verses ....



read the all 158 verses and you can see racism towards to Turks in Greek national anthem





__





National Anthems & Patriotic Songs - Greek & Cypriot National Anthem -


National Anthems & Patriotic Songs sanatçısının 'Greek & Cypriot




lyricstranslate.com


----------



## Mahabahu kaunteya

Steppe Wolff said:


> Get tf out of here Indian. Turkey is a brother country to Pakistan. Your filthy propaganda won’t work here.


Zyada gussa hone kii koi load na hai .
Isi forum pe keh rahe the kuch din Pehle tak baki apki dosti hai unse khud jaano


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> read all 158 verses and you can see racism towards to Turks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> National Anthems & Patriotic Songs - Greek & Cypriot National Anthem -
> 
> 
> National Anthems & Patriotic Songs sanatçısının 'Greek & Cypriot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lyricstranslate.com


Abu Khalifa,let me remind you that it was written during the War of Independence,that is the war against the Ottoman slavery.


----------



## Mahabahu kaunteya

MMM-E said:


> are you a muslim from India ? or zionist lover hindu ?
> 
> Pakistanis ?
> what did Pakistan do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> what did S.Arabia , Egypt , Indonesia and The Uae do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> 
> We Turks are not stupid to fight Israel ( USA-Europe ) for traitor Palestinians
> go and say even something to Israel-USA , then come to discuss


Iam a Hindu from India, but I don't love ziaonists
Some good men from America opened my eyes .
Jews will one slaughter us also, we too are goyim for them.

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## _Nabil_

MMM-E said:


> read all 158 verses and you can see racism towards to Turks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> National Anthems & Patriotic Songs - Greek & Cypriot National Anthem -
> 
> 
> National Anthems & Patriotic Songs sanatçısının 'Greek & Cypriot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lyricstranslate.com


Again the Greek national anthem is only 8 verses.

You can say that the Greek national anthem was taken from a text containing racism toward turcs (written in 1823)

Not the Greek national anthem contains racism toward turcs .



Blueindian said:


> Iam a Hindu from India, but I don't love ziaonists
> Some good men from America opened my eyes .
> Jews will one slaughter us also, we too are goyim for them.


Welcome to the club ✌️

Let me warn you that's its not an easy task to be anti Zionist even in a Pakistani "Muslim" majority forum.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> LOL everyone caring for their interests is a "puppet"?
> 
> Greeks want to defend against Turkish aggression. The Kurds want their own State. Haftar wants a united Libya under the House of Representatives. Armenia simply wants to survive.



Smart USA-France used daydreamer puppets against Turkiye


-- Greeks tried to steal oil-gas reserves from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean
-- PKK/YPG Terrorists tried to create communist State
-- Armenia tried to invade another area from Azerbaijan
-- Terrorist FETO tried to make military coup to destroy president ERDOGAN
-- Terrorist HAFTAR tried to make military coup to destroy UN recognized legal Libyan government

but the Turkish Armed Forces kicked all of them .....


----------



## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> if you are so ignorant , then dont jump to the issue
> 
> 
> Greeks have only one eternal enemy and its Turkiye
> even Greek national anthem has racist words towards the Turks
> 
> 100 years ago UK+France+Italy+Armenia+Greece all together attacked on Turkiye
> today same senario ... ( Greece has a dream to attack on Turkiye but they have no enough power )
> 
> if USA-France says lets attack together on Turkiye , then Greece will say okey lets attack on Turkiye
> 
> 
> there are many problems between Turkiye and Greece in Cyprus , Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> even Christian Greeks have dreams of capturing Anatolia and Istanbul from muslim Turks
> 
> 
> 
> go and say nuclear power Pakistan and rich Arabs S.Arabia,The Uae and
> Egypt,Tunusia,Algeria,Morocco to do someting for Palestine against Israel
> 
> only is Turkiye muslim country in the world ?



I have no such dreams and nobody i know has. Maybe its your psychosis?

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Smart USA-France used daydreamer puppets against Turkiye
> 
> 
> -- Greeks tried to steal oil-gas reserves from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean
> -- PKK/YPG Terrorists tried to create communist State
> -- Armenia tried to invade any area from Azerbaijan
> -- Terrorist FETO tried to make military coup to destroy president ERDOGAN
> -- Terrorist HAFTAR tried to make military coup to destroy UN recognized legal Libyan government
> 
> but the Turkish Armed Forces kicked all of them .....


 Everybody enemy of superpower Turkiye,but superpower Turkiye win everywhere 

We get it. Erdogan makes Turkish nation stronk.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Not Russia. The Soviet Union. The Bolsheviks. Lenin.
> 
> And Erdogan is destroying Ataturk's legacy now. How do you like that?



100 years ago Russians led by LENIN .... there were not race called the Bolsheviks

and now Russians led by PUTIN who sold the most modern AD System S400 to Turkiye

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## Apollon

Abid123 said:


> Greece and Turkey are never going to war ever.



Exactly. Its just barking from both sides


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> 100 years ago Russians led by LENIN .... there were not race called the Bolsheviks
> 
> and now Russians led by PUTIN who sold the most modern AD System S400 to Turkiye


Soviets,you historically ignorant troll. 

The Bolsheviks created the Soviet Union,a Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. 

Belarussians,Ukrainians,Lithuanians,Latvians,Estonians,Kazahks,Turkmens,Ubzeks,Tajiks,Georgians,Armenians,Azeris,Moldovans and dozens of other ethnicities.


----------



## Apollon

MMM-E said:


> 100 years ago Russians led by LENIN .... there were not race called the Bolsheviks
> 
> and now Russians led by PUTIN who sold the most modern AD System S400 to Turkiye



S400 doesnt work and turkey has never activated it. Its in storage. S400 could not even defend their own flagship.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> and now Russians led by PUTIN who sold the most modern AD System S400 to Turkiye


😂😂😂

Ok



Apollon said:


> S400 doesnt work and turkey has never activated it. Its in storage. S400 could not even defend their own flagship.


Moskva had S-300F actually.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Soviets,you historically ignorant troll.
> 
> The Bolsheviks created the Soviet Union,a Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
> 
> Belarussians,Ukrainians,Lithuanians,Latvians,Estonians,Kazahks,Turkmens,Ubzeks,Tajiks,Georgians,Armenians,Azeris,Moldovans and dozens of other ethnicities.



What an ignorant TROLL


That were Russians ( Russian Empire ) who helped the Turks in 1920-1921
even Russians opened the first amunition factory in Turkiye ( Ottoman Empire ) in 1921

before the Soviet Union
even Soviet Union = Russia and vassals of Russians




Apollon said:


> S400 doesnt work and turkey has never activated it. Its in storage. S400 could not even defend their own flagship.



even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria

dont worry in a war everybody will see S400s works or not
btw only 30 minutes are enough to activate the S400s

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> What an ignorant TROLL
> 
> 
> That were Russians ( Russian Empire ) who helped the Turks in 1920-1921
> 
> even Russians opened the first amunition factory in Turkiye ( Ottoman Empire ) in 1921
> 
> 
> before the Soviet Union
> even Soviet Union = Russia and vassals of Russians
> 
> 
> 
> even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria
> 
> dont worry in a war everybody will see S400s works or not
> btw only 30 minutes are enough to activate the S400s




The Russian Empire was gone already,the country was in civil war and the Bolsheviks were the ones who helped you.

It was the Soviet Union that helped Turkey,the communists. The Soviet Union was already officially founded in 1922. The October Revolutio had taken place in 1917. Even @jamahir can tell you about this in more detail.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> The Russian Empire was gone already,the country was in civil war and the Bolsheviks were the ones who helped you.
> 
> It was the Soviet Union that helped Turkey,the communists. The Soviet Union was already officially founded in 1922. The October Revolutio had taken place in 1917. Even @jamahir can tell you about this in more detail.




In the October Revolution, the Bolsheviks seized power, leading to the Russian Civil War.
The Bolsheviks executed the imperial family in 1918 and established the Soviet Union in 1922

Communist Russians led by LENIN helped the Turks during Turkish war of independence in 1920-1921


and today Russia led by PUTIN is ready to sell more S400 , SU-35 , SU-57 , Jet Engines and Submarines to Turkiye .. if ERDOGAN buy Russian weapons


----------



## MMM-E

*Airborne Early Warning and  Air refueling Aircrafts*




Greece : 4 Embraer R-99








Turkiye : 7 Boeing KC-135 ... 4 Boeing E-7T














*Hellenic Airforce has no capability to conduct large scale operations*

Turkiye has commenced Operation Olive Branch in 2018 and 72 Aircrafts destroyed PKK/YPG terror targets in a few hours in seven districts of Afrin, where 108 targets were hit of the 113 targets

Turkiye has been able to conduct large scale operations .. only Israeli and Turkish Airforces can do it in the region



Turkish Airforce has 7 KC-135 Air refueling Aircrafts can refuel to Boeing E-7T AEWC and 70 F-16 Fighter Jets armed with 140 SOM Cruise Missiles to operate entire Middle East 

F-16 Fighter Jet = 1370 km
SOM Cruise Missile = 250+ km
KC-135 Air refueling Aircraft = 10.000+ km


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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *Hellenic Airforce has no capability to conduct large scale operations*
> 
> Turkiye has commenced Operation Olive Branch in 2018 and 72 Aircrafts destroyed PKK/YPG terror targets in a few hours in seven districts of Afrin, where 108 targets were hit of the 113 targets
> 
> Turkiye has been able to conduct large scale operations .. only Israeli and Turkish Airforces can do it in the region


And who told you that Greece has plans for large-scale operations? 
And how do you say that Turkey conduct large scale operations when there aren't to face no enemy planes, rival air defenses, only armed guerrillas hidden in caves and trenches.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> And who told you that Greece has plans for large-scale operations?



in 1974 HAF could not help Greek Cypriots
still Greece has no large-scale operation capability




Akritas said:


> And how do you say that Turkey conduct large scale operations when there aren't to face no enemy planes, rival air defenses, only armed guerrillas hidden in caves and trenches.



I am not talking about history of air to air combat or Suppression and Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD/DEAD) missions

dont worry , Turkish Airforce has great capability and technology to do it



but I am talking about large-scale operation capability

-- Air refueling Aircrafts
-- AEWCs
-- Airborne stand off Jammer Aircraft
-- Fighter Jets equipped with night vision
-- Fighter Jets armed with Cruise Missiles
-- Network centric warfare


*what about the Hellenic Airforce ?*

-- NO Air refueling Aircraft
-- NO Airborne stand off Jammer Aircraft
-- 150+ Greek F-16s without Cruise Missiles
-- only around 40 Greek F-16s equipped with night vision


*what about the Turkish Air Force ?*

-- 7 Air refueling Aircrafts
-- 4 AEWCs
-- 4 Airborne stand off Jammer Aircrafts ( on the way )
-- 163 Turkish F-16s equipped with night vision
-- 230 Turkish F-16s armed with SOM and SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles
-- Network centric warfare


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> in 1974 HAF could not help Greek Cypriots
> still Greece has no large-scale operation capability
> 
> I am not talking about history of air to air combat or Suppression and Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD/DEAD) missions





MMM-E said:


> dont worry , Turkish Airforce has great capability and technology to do it
> 
> but I am talking about large-scale operation capability
> 
> -- Air refueling Aircrafts
> -- AEWCs
> -- Airborne stand off Jammer Aircraft
> -- Fighter Jets equipped with night vision
> -- Fighter Jets armed with Cruise Missiles
> -- Network centric warfare
> 
> 
> *what about the Hellenic Airforce ?*
> 
> -- NO Air refueling Aircraft
> -- NO Airborne stand off Jammer Aircraft
> -- 150+ Greek F-16s without Cruise Missiles
> -- only around 40 Greek F-16s equipped with night vision
> 
> 
> *what about the Turkish Air Force ?*
> 
> -- 7 Air refueling Aircrafts
> -- 4 AEWCs
> -- 4 Airborne stand off Jammer Aircrafts ( on the way )
> -- 163 Turkish F-16s equipped with night vision
> -- 230 Turkish F-16s armed with SOM and SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles
> -- Network centric warfare


Of course I'm talking about history, when you tell me that your country can do military large-scale operation, when he has not done it anywhere.
Turkish operations at Iraq and Syria are local and not large-scale.

*The Scale of military action are five* : tactical, operational-tactical, operational, operational-strategic, and strategic.
*The Scale of military operation are four*: local, regional, large-scale, strategic

As has been shown in practice, Turkey has been conducting *local operations* in recent years with *operational-tactical* and *operational-strategic actions*.

Large-scale operations, only USA, Russia and China have the capabilities.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Turkish operations at Iraq and Syria are local and not large-scale.



Turkish Airforce 150 F-16s , KC-135s , E7-Ts hit targets at the same time in one sortie = large-scale operation

and only İsraeli and Turkish Air Forces can do it in the region


Even for night operation , Hellenic Airforce 40 F-16s equipped with night vision , on the other hand Turkish Airforce 163+29 F-16s equipped with night vision

and 150+ Greek F-16s without Cruise Missiles ... what a pathetic Airforce


*in KOSOVO War 1999*
only American and Turkish Airforces could night strike in NATO
Turkiye had far before night strike capability than France,UK,Germany,İtaly,Greece

in 1994 , Turkish F-16s were the first F-16s outside the USAF to receive LANTIRN pods

and only USA-France and Turkiye have their own targeting pod in NATO


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## KendoKhan

This entire thread is an echo chamber designed to massage Turkish Ego's.

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## Primus

MMM-E said:


> are you a muslim from India ? or zionist lover hindu ?
> 
> Pakistanis ?
> what did Pakistan do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> what did S.Arabia , Egypt , Indonesia and The Uae do for Palestine and Al Aqsa mosque against Israel ? NOTHING
> 
> 
> We Turks are not stupid to fight Israel ( USA-Europe ) for traitor Palestinians
> go and say even something to Israel-USA , then come to discuss


What has Turkey done for Palestine or Kashmir? 

Pakistan is literally on the border with India protecting AJK from India. Pakistan sent pilots to arab nations to fight Israel. What have you done?


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Large-scale operations, only USA, Russia and China have the capabilities.



Turkish , İsraeli Airforces have Large-scale operation capability with superior technology

-- Air refueling Aircrafts
-- AEWCs
-- Airborne stand off Jammer Aircraft
-- Fighter Jets equipped with night vision
-- Fighter Jets armed with Cruise Missiles and long range guided Bombs
-- Network centric warfare
-- great experience for air to ground mission



so funny Russia and China



Huffal said:


> What has Turkey done for Palestine or Kashmir?



We dont care about useless Kashmir
Turkiye fought USA-France-Russia-İran and their proxies Greece ,PKK/YPG , FETO , ASSAD , IRGC , Hezbollah , HAFTAR , etc in İraq , Syria , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean since 2016


and Turkiye lost over $500 billion to support Palestine against Israel


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## KendoKhan

Turkey is underestimating Greece, this grandstanding is nothing more than boastful chest-thumping for domestic consumption. Sooner or later Turkey will realise that it is just another small cog in a much larger machine and then Tukey will sit down quietly like a meek little mouse.


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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> Turkey is underestimating Greece, this grandstanding is nothing more than boastful chest-thumping for domestic consumption. Sooner or later Turkey will realise that it is just another small cog in a much larger machine and then Tukey will sit down quietly like a meek little mouse.



As like 100 years ago how Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming


Turkish Armed Forces kicked USA-France-Russia-İran and their proxies Greece ,PKK/YPG , FETO , ASSAD , IRGC , Hezbollah , HAFTAR , etc in İraq , Syria , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean since 2016

even only Turkish Missiles and UCAVs are enough for little mouse Greece


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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> As like 100 years ago


We are not living in the time of cannons and swords and Mehmed the Conqueror.

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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> We are not living in the time of cannons and swords and Mehmed the Conqueror.



We are living in the time of Missiles and UCAVs

only 1.000 Turkish Missiles will be enough to destroy all Air Bases , Jet hangars , air defense systems , radars , military targets in Greece and Greek Islands in a few days

and only 200 Turkish UCAVs will be enough to destroy whole Hellenic Navy in a day


Thanks to great Turkish Defense Industry


----------



## MMM-E

*Even only Turkish land based Missiles will be enough to wipe out Hellenic Navy Warships in the Aegean*



-- 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR nex-gen anti ship Missile with IIR+RF seeker
-- 250 km ATMACA anti ship Missile with IIR seeker

Also RAMJET powered supersonic anti ship Missile on the way















also 1.000 HARPOON , SLAM-ER , SOM , HARM , and upcoming KUZGUN-TJ , KGK-LR , AKBABA to hit enemy Warships


even 10 AKINCI and AKSUNGUR UCAVs can fire 60 MAM-T laser guided munitions on Hellenic Navy ELLI class Frigate from 30 km away ..... and game over !


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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> We are living in the time of Missiles and UCAVs
> 
> only 1.000 Turkish Missiles will be enough to destroy all Air Bases , Jet hangars , air defense systems , radars , military targets in Greece


And you think the Greeks wont retaliate in kind? How very simple minded of you. You seem to be a little unhinged if you think that's how it works. The Greeks have MIM-104 batteries, they can make mincemeat of those missiles and UCAV's you are so boastful about in this ludicrous thread.


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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> And you think the Greeks wont retaliate in kind? How very simple minded of you. You seem to be a little unhinged if you think that's how it works. The Greeks have MIM-104 batteries, they can make mincemeat of those missiles and UCAV's you are so boastful about in this ludicrous thread.



so funny
Greece never can stop great Turkish Missile Fire power


*Turkish Army Tactical Ballistic Missiles ATACMS , J600T and KHAN can make mincemeat of those MIM-104 batteries in Skyros in a few minutes ... and game over*

even I am not talking about other missiles/long range guided glide bomb

-- 130 km JSOW glide Bomb
-- 140 km HARPOON block2 land attack Cruise Missile
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 150 km AKBABA anti-radiation Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
-- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
-- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
-- 275 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile
-- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile
-- 280 km KARA-ATMACA land based Cruise Missile
-- 500 km HARPY kamikaze Drone
-- 1.000 km KARGI anti-radiation Drone


other MIM-104 batteries in Athens and Thessaloniki can not engage on Turkish F-16s , UCAVs

Greece has only 6 MIM-104 batteries that to be destroyed by the Turkish Armed Forces in a day


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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> so funny
> Greece never can stop great Turkish Missile Fire power
> 
> 
> *Turkish Army Tactical Ballistic Missiles ATACMS , J600T and KHAN can make mincemeat of those MIM-104 batteries in Skyros in a few minutes ... and game over*
> 
> even I am not talking about other missiles/long range guided glide bomb
> 
> -- 130 km JSOW glide Bomb
> -- 140 km HARPOON block2 land attack Cruise Missile
> -- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
> -- 150 km AKBABA anti-radiation Missile
> -- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
> -- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
> -- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
> -- 275 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile
> -- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile
> -- 280 km KARA-ATMACA land based Cruise Missile
> -- 500 km HARPY kamikaze Drone
> -- 1.000 km KARGI anti-radiation Drone
> 
> 
> other MIM-104 batteries in Athens and Thessaloniki can not engage on Turkish F-16s , UCAVs
> 
> Greece has only 6 MIM-104


This is wishful thinking on your part, hmm I wonder what happened recently when another country overestimated its own potential? 🤔

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## Foinikas

KendoKhan said:


> This entire thread is an echo chamber designed to massage Turkish Ego's.


The only reason he posted this thread is to flex about Turkish "superiority" again and showcase Turkey's products. Which he has been doing for months and months,in an endless loop,posting threads with different titles,but always including the same statements and long lists of Turkish military projects.

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## KendoKhan

Foinikas said:


> The only reason he posted this thread is to flex about Turkish "superiority" again and showcase Turkey's products. Which he has been doing for months and months,in an endless loop,posting threads with different titles,but always including the same statements and long lists of Turkish military projects.


Oh dear, its rather sad. I am new to the forum so I don't know who's who but the moment I went through the first few posts and saw the lack of response or reasonable comparison with Greece, I knew it was an echo chamber. I don't know why Turks have their chip on their shoulder, they should really pack it in.

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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> This is wishful thinking on your part, hmm I wonder what happened recently when another country overestimated its own potential? 🤔




its reality and power of the Turkish Defense Industry


Ukraine lost Crimea , Don-Bas , soon even Odessa against Russia
and tiny Greece is dreaming about fighting against regional power Turkiye .. ( Greece will lose Islands )



KendoKhan said:


> Oh dear, its rather sad. I am new to the forum so I don't know who's who but the moment I went through the first few posts and saw the lack of response or reasonable comparison with Greece, I knew it was an echo chamber. I don't know why Turks have their chip on their shoulder, they should really pack it in.



keep talking with your another account ..... so funny


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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> its reality and power of the Turkish Defense Industry


So far based on this thread littered with glossy images, you have yet to convince me about all this machismo bragging. The Greeks are a formidable country in terms of combat experience, you would do well not to make light of that fact.

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## Foinikas

KendoKhan said:


> And you think the Greeks wont retaliate in kind? How very simple minded of you. You seem to be a little unhinged if you think that's how it works. The Greeks have MIM-104 batteries, they can make mincemeat of those missiles and UCAV's you are so boastful about in this ludicrous thread.


I see that you're new here so let me tell you a bit about MMM-E:

In his mind,Turkish weapons will always find target and the enemy has no countermeasures.

Turkish weapons are of best quality,while everything everyone else is using,is just trash.

The enemy never finds target and the Turkish Armed Forces apparently have hundreds of thousands of missiles to destroy every enemy.

Turkiye is a regional superpower only comparable to USA,Russia and China. Although,if you ask him,he will tell you that in a war,all these countries will be defeated by them if they try to invade.

He believes Turkey has the best Navy in the Mediterranean and can easily destroy the Greek,Egyptian and Israeli navies combined.

He will tell you that the economic crisis in Turkey is not Erdogan's fault,but that foreigners have been waging a war against Turkey.

He believes that every country is a puppet of the West against Turkey.

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## KendoKhan

Foinikas said:


> I see that you're new here so let me tell you a bit about MMM-E:
> 
> In his mind,Turkish weapons will always find target and the enemy has no countermeasures.
> 
> Turkish weapons are of best quality,while everything everyone else is using,is just trash.
> 
> The enemy never finds target and the Turkish Armed Forces apparently have hundreds of thousands of missiles to destroy every enemy.
> 
> Turkiye is a regional superpower only comparable to USA,Russia and China. Although,if you ask him,he will tell you that in a war,all these countries will be defeated by them if they try to invade.
> 
> He believes Turkey has the best Navy in the Mediterranean and can easily destroy the Greek,Egyptian and Israeli navies combined.
> 
> He will tell you that the economic crisis in Turkey is not Erdogan's fault,but that foreigners have been waging a war against Turkey.
> 
> He believes that every country is a puppet of the West against Turkey.


That makes sense, thank you for educating me. This is the reason I decided to make an account on this forum.


----------



## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> So far based on this thread littered with glossy images, you have yet to convince me about all this machismo bragging. The Greeks are a formidable country in terms of combat experience, you would do well not to make light of that fact.



so funny
after WW2 , Greeks are only training ... no any real conflict experience

on the other hand Turkish Armed Forces in active fight in Turkish soil,İraq,Syria,Libya and Eastern Mediterranean against big powers and their proxies


*in 1996 we have seen noob Greek Armed Forces*

12 Turkish special forces SAT Commandos captured the Island .and planted the Turkish Flag on the west Island and Americans said to Greeks that the TURKS captured Island 

and It wasn't until 4 hours later when the Greeks noticed this when a Greek helicopter took off at 5.30 am from the Greek Frigate for reconnaissance 

during the mission Turkish Navy shot down Greek Helicopter with Electronic Warfare attack over the Island and 3 Greek officers on the Helicopter died (Christodoulos Karathanasis, Panagiotis Vlahakos, and Ektoras Gialopsos). 
and Greek admiral Hristos Limberis resigned in 1996.....what a shame on Greeks


----------



## Foinikas

KendoKhan said:


> That makes sense, thank you for educating me. This is the reason I decided to make an account on this forum.


Oh I've got a lot of screenshots of posts of his. I've kept some hilarious screenshots from other posters years ago,before I joined the forum.Those specific ones were about Greece,Cyprus and some weird comments on history by various guys here. 

But MMM-E is just a spammer. He posts the exact same words,the exact same phrases and the exact same long lists of Turkish "superweapons" and future projects everytime he makes a thread or posts somewhere.

Here he was mocking the Royal Marines.

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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> so funny
> after WW2 , Greeks are only training ... no any real conflict experience


Their military was deployed in Afghanistan.



Foinikas said:


> Oh I've got a lot of screenshots of posts of his. I've kept some hilarious screenshots from other posters years ago,before I joined the forum.Those specific ones were about Greece,Cyprus and some weird comments on history by various guys here.
> 
> But MMM-E is just a spammer. He posts the exact same words,the exact same phrases and the exact same long lists of Turkish "superweapons" and future projects everytime he makes a thread or posts somewhere.
> 
> Here he was mocking the Royal Marines.
> 
> View attachment 850300


Oh dear what a sad deluded and twisted person. To actually mock the Royal Marines...


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> In his mind,Turkish weapons will always find target and the enemy has no countermeasures.



We have seen most modern Russian SAMs against Turkish TB-2 UCAVs in Syria,Karabakh,Libya and Ukraine


if Greece has 300 SAMs then Turkiye has thousands of missiles/long range guided Bombs
( Greece is buying missiles but Turkiye is producing missiles )

even Turkiye produce more 415 SOM Cruise Missiles .... 

our rivals are France,Russia , but not tiny Greece


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We have seen most modern Russian SAMs against Turkish TB-2 UCAVs in Syria,Karabakh,Libya and Ukraine


And yet you brag about S-400 😂 

@IblinI @jamahir @Huffal @retaxis @_Nabil_ See,he said it again 😂😂😂

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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> Their military was deployed in Afghanistan.



Yes total of 130 Greek soldiers deployed in Afghanistan for peacekeeping mission

on the other hand 658 Turkish soldiers controlled capital of Afganistan and Kabul Airport for many years


Turkish Armed Forces have great real conflict experience in İraq,Syria,Libya


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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> Yes total of 130 Greek soldiers deployed in Afghanistan for peacekeeping mission
> 
> on the other hand 658 Turkish soldiers controlled capital of Afganistan and Kabul Airport for many years
> 
> 
> Turkish Armed Forces have great real conflict experience in İraq,Syria,Libya


Earlier you said they had no operational experience, and now you are backtracking.


----------



## jamahir

Foinikas said:


> And yet you brag about S-400 😂
> 
> @IblinI @jamahir @Huffal @retaxis @_Nabil_ See,he said it again 😂😂😂



Contradiction or irony, I am unable to decide to pick. 

MMM-E, if you visit the Ukraine war thread you will see the greatest-of-greats Bayraktar TB2s brought down by the Russians. 



MMM-E said:


> Turkish Armed Forces have great real conflict experience in İraq,Syria,Libya



You are so shamelessly proud of assisting the Al Qaeda and "Muslim" Brotherhood criminals terrorizing and slaughtering Libyans and Syrians on behalf of their master, NATO.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> And yet you brag about S-400 😂
> 
> @IblinI @jamahir @Huffal @retaxis @_Nabil_ See,he said it again 😂😂😂



Greece and Europe have no Turkish TB-2 or similar technology capabilities to attack on Air Defense Systems

and PANTSIR or BUK is thing , S400 is another thing


S400s to turn Greek F-16V and Rafales into crap of metal
even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria



KendoKhan said:


> Earlier you said they had no operational experience, and now you are backtracking.



Yes Greek Armed Forces have no real conflict experience
only 130 soldiers in Afghanistan for peackeeper mission dont make Greek Armed Forces as experienced



jamahir said:


> MMM-E, if you visit the Ukraine war thread you will see the greatest-of-greats Bayraktar TB2s brought down by the Russians.



what a pathetic guy

even military super power Russia could not destroy all 24 TB-2s in Ukraine

Ukranian TB-2s still destroying Russian military hardware
even Ukraine has no Airforce to protect TB-2s


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## Akritas

KendoKhan said:


> Their military was deployed in Afghanistan.


Also in Somalia, Kosovo, Bosnia, etc.



MMM-E said:


> Yes Greek Armed Forces have no real conflict experience
> only 130 soldiers in Afghanistan for peackeeper mission dont make Greek Armed Forces as experienced


Why have you only thought about war?
Has it never crossed your mind that a country goes to war only when it needs to defend itself?
We are not *warlovers and troublemakers* as some others are.

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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> Their military was deployed in Afghanistan.
> 
> 
> Oh dear what a sad deluded and twisted person. To actually mock the Royal Marines...




deluded and twisted person KendoKhan and Foinikas
read but dont cry ok ? so funny

SAS and MI6 officers released by Libya's rebel commanders​Libya's rebel commanders have freed two MI6 officers and six SAS soldiers captured by farm guards 








SAS and MI6 officers released by Libya's rebel commanders


The group's capture is a major embarrassment to the British government and could potentially undermine the rebels' claims that the revolution has had solely domestic roots




www.theguardian.com


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> even military super power Russia could not destroy all 24 TB-2s in Ukraine


No,they destroyed them. You just kept sending more and more.

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## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> deluded and twisted person KendoKhan and Foinikas
> read but dont cry ok ? so funny
> 
> SAS and MI6 officers released by Libya's rebel commanders​Libya's rebel commanders have freed two MI6 officers and six SAS soldiers captured by farm guards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SAS and MI6 officers released by Libya's rebel commanders
> 
> 
> The group's capture is a major embarrassment to the British government and could potentially undermine the rebels' claims that the revolution has had solely domestic roots
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com


That incident was 11 years ago and the SAS didn't retaliate to preserve diplomatic ties, read what you share please.

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## Foinikas

KendoKhan said:


> Oh dear what a sad deluded and twisted person. To actually mock the Royal Marines...


He thought that 42 Royal Marines was actually 42 people and not a unit.

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## KendoKhan

Foinikas said:


> He thought that 42 Royal Marines was actually 42 people and not a unit.


Oh dear... Well what can I say. It makes me laugh when people can be so blinded by nationalistic fervour to the point of lunacy.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Also in Somalia, Kosovo, Bosnia, etc.



small number Greek forces for peacekeeper mission .... nothing else



on the other hand in 1995, the Turkish Air Force took part in NATO's Operation Deliberate Force.

Turkiye provided 18 F-16s for the NATO campaign against Serbia during Operation Allied Force in 1999

All F-16s were equipped with laser-guided bombs using the LANTIRN night vision system. 

Turkish jets had previously patrolled Balkan airspace, providing protection for attacking aircraft. During this allied air campaign, TAI-built F-16s set a world CAP record by patrolling for 9 hours and 22 minutes above the Balkan theatre. Normally, CAP missions last between 3 and 4 hours.


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> small number Greek forces for peacekeeper mission .... nothing else
> 
> 
> 
> on the other hand in 1995, the Turkish Air Force took part in NATO's Operation Deliberate Force.
> 
> Turkiye provided 18 F-16s for the NATO campaign against Serbia during Operation Allied Force in 1999
> 
> All F-16s were equipped with laser-guided bombs using the LANTIRN night vision system.
> 
> Turkish jets had previously patrolled Balkan airspace, providing protection for attacking aircraft. During this allied air campaign, TAI-built F-16s set a world CAP record by patrolling for 9 hours and 22 minutes above the Balkan theatre. Normally, CAP missions last between 3 and 4 hours.


Superpower Turkiye conquer world

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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> Oh dear... Well what can I say. It makes me laugh when people can be so blinded by nationalistic fervour to the point of lunacy.





Foinikas said:


> Superpower Turkiye conquer world




Keep dreaming with your weak and pathetic daydreamer Greece


We Turks have no dream or blinded by nationalistic fervour


Turkish Armed Forces now in TRNC , İraq , Syria , Azerbaijan , Somalia , Qatar , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean to kick bandit countries and their proxies/terrorists


----------



## KendoKhan

MMM-E said:


> We Turks have no dream or blinded by nationalistic fervour



Umm...



> Turkish Armed Forces now in TRNC , İraq , Syria , Azerbaijan , Somalia , Qatar , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean to kick bandit countries and their proxies/terrorists



Do you read what you post?


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## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> That incident was 11 years ago and the SAS didn't retaliate to preserve diplomatic ties, read what you share please.



so pathetic
2 MI6 and 6 SAS soldiers captured by even farm guards ....... 

British James Bond and American Rambo 
only movies and cheap propaganda



Foinikas said:


> No,they destroyed them. You just kept sending more and more.



nahhhh
maybe only in your lies

Turkiye sold / deployed 24 TB-2s in Ukraine 
and Russia could not destroy all 24 TB-2s

only a few confirmed loses of TB-2s
Ukraine needs only guided munitions for TB-2s


----------



## Foinikas

jamahir said:


> OKKKKK I see a part of India not coming under Sultan Erdogan's dominion. It is the Deccan where I am, maybe because it has the former Hyderabad Muslim nizam ruled state where now the Sultan will put in a governor, maybe @MMM-E Himself. I wouldn't mind staying there as long as this lady visits time to time, having chubbied up of course, and I get to invite her to long tea sessions :


Deccan Valley,where Sultan Alamghir spent years campaigning at?


----------



## MMM-E

*Greeks says we are buying 4 FDI Frigates to beat Turkish Navy*


lol daydreamer Greeks


on the other hand Turks produce 31 new Warships to modernize the Turkish Navy

-- 4 ISTIF class Frigates
-- 7 TF-2000 class Destroyers
-- 10 FACs
-- 10 OPVs


also Drone super power Turkiye has started producing unmanned Vessels armed with Missiles and Torpedos

Greek Frigates will face with swarm attack of 150 km CAKIR anti-ship missiles from Turkish unmanned Vessels ... and game over








*Turkish UCAV war concept has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Air Defense Systems*

soon Naval war concept version ........


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *Greeks says we are buying 4 FDI Frigates to beat Turkish Navy*
> 
> 
> lol daydreamer Greeks
> 
> 
> on the other hand Turks produce 31 new Warships to modernize the Turkish Navy
> 
> -- 4 ISTIF class Frigates
> -- 7 TF-2000 class Destroyers
> -- 10 FACs
> -- 10 OPVs
> 
> 
> also Drone super power Turkiye has started producing unmanned Vessels armed with Missiles and Torpedos
> 
> Greek Frigates will face with swarm attack of 150 km CAKIR anti-ship missiles from Turkish unmanned Vessels ... and game over
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Turkish UCAV war concept has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Air Defense Systems*
> 
> soon Naval war concept version ........



Ok tell me something,if you are so extremely superior,what's the point of this thread? If your armaments are "not for Greece" as you and your government claim,what's the point of this thread? 

You posted it to lick your balls and feel good?


----------



## jamahir

Foinikas said:


> Deccan Valley,where Sultan Alamghir spent years campaigning at?



Correct, but Deccan is also where Tipu Sultan, The Tiger of Mysore ( a place now in Karnataka state ) ruled from until 1799 when a combined military of British units, Hyderabad nizam's units, Maratha units, Nair units from Malabar ( now Kerala state ) and the Coorgis ( from now Karnataka state ) defeated him after entering his fort by treachery done by Tipu's deputy Mir Sadiq. Tipu was one of the great rulers of South Asia and he was an internationalist who was much inspired by the French Revolution, corresponded with Napoleon, had French troops training his and had an arrangement with Napoleon to bring in a big unit to India to assist him against the British and their indian allies. IIRC the French got stuck in Egypt. Tipu was the only recent-modern ruler who could have thrown the British out of South Asia gradually. He was a progressive ruler who if had lived by the middle century next century he would have been among the first Communists in India :


> Tipu Sultan: a secular internationalist, not a bigot​
> The recent offer made by a film producer to Tamil superstar Rajinikanth to act in a movie on the ‘ >Tiger of Mysore ’, Tipu Sultan, has yet again opened up a Pandora’s Box. The Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) and some Hindutva groups have demanded that Rajinikanth refuse the offer. This argument is made on the grounds that Tipu, the 18th century ruler of Mysore state, was a “tyrant” who killed thousands of Hindus as they refused to convert to Islam.
> 
> This is not the first time that Tipu’s name has been dragged into a controversy. It began some years back when Sanjay Khan made a tele-serial based on Bhagwan S. Gidwani’s book, The Sword of Tipu Sultan. His name was once again dragged into a controversy when the Congress government intended to celebrate his birth anniversary in 2014. There was opposition when a proposal was made to establish a university named after him.
> 
> Colonial historians have projected Tipu as a “religious bigot”, who was instrumental in killing and converting to Islam thousands of Nayars of Kerala, Catholics of Dakshina Kannada and Coorgis of Kodagu. Even Kannada chauvinists have projected him as anti-Kannadiga as he was instrumental in changing the local names of places and introducing Persian vocabulary into administration. Marxist historians, on the other hand, have viewed him as “one of the foremost commanders of independence struggle” and a “harbinger of new productive forces”.
> 
> >History is unkind to Tipu Sultan . The fact is that Tipu cannot be reduced to a singular narrative or tradition of intolerance or bigotry as he represented multiple traditions. He combined tolerant inter-religious traditions, liberal and secular traditions, anti-colonialism and internationalism. He could do this as he had strong roots in Sufism, which is not explored much by historians. He belonged to the Chisti/Bande Nawaz tradition of Sufism.
> 
> In fact, Tipu was radical in more than one sense. He was the first to ban consumption of alcohol in the entire State, not on religious grounds, but on moral and health grounds. He went to the extent of saying: “A total prohibition is very near to my heart.” He is credited with introducing missile or rocket technology in war. He was the first to introduce sericulture to the then Mysore state. He was the first to confiscate the property of upper castes, including Mutts, and distribute it among the Shudras. He is also credited with sowing the seeds of capitalist development at a time when the country was completely feudal. He thought about constructing a dam across the Cauvery in the present-day location of Krishnaraja Sagar. He completed the task of establishing a biodiversity garden named Lal Bagh.
> 
> His tolerance is reflected in his annual grants to no less than 156 temples, which included land deeds and jewellery. His army was largely composed of Shudras. When the famed Sringeri Mutt, established by Shankaracharya, was invaded by the Maratha army, he issued a firman to provide financial assistance for reinstallation of the holy idol and restoring the tradition of worship at the Mutt. His donation to the famous Srikanteshwara temple at Nanjangud; the donation of 10,000 gold coins to complete temple work at Kanchi; settling the disputes between two sects of priests at the Melkote temple; and gifts to Lakshmikanta temple at Kalale are all well-known. Interestingly, Srirangapatna, a temple town, remained his permanent capital till the end of his rule. He was also instrumental in constructing the first-ever church in Mysuru. Incidentally, well-known historian B.A. Saletore calls him “defender of Hindu Dharma”.
> 
> The allegation of forcible conversions has to be seen in the background of political exigencies — either they were with the colonialists such as in the case of Christians of Dakshina Kannada, or were waging a protracted guerrilla war as in the case of Coorg. Here, historians have distorted the facts by reducing political exigencies to the “communal ideology” of Tipu.
> 
> A ruler, who once identified himself with the American and French Revolution and Jacobinism, has remained an enigma to many. That a man who ruled for just 16 years continues to haunt Hindutva groups obviously means that Tipu continues to exist in the political discourses, political narratives as well as in the imagination of nation-building. This is where the irony of history lies — one cannot just bury Tipu in the annals of history.
> 
> _(The writer is chairman, department of political science at the University of Mysore. muzaffar.assadi@gmail.com.)_


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Ok tell me something,if you are so extremely superior,what's the point of this thread? If your armaments are "not for Greece" as you and your government claim,what's the point of this thread?
> 
> You posted it to lick your balls and feel good?




to wake Greeks from their dreams
Greece never can match with Turkiye ... not even close


USA-UK-France-Germany used Ukraine as a pawn against Russia
and USA-UK-France-Germany only watching on TV how Russia destroyed Ukranian cities and took Crimea , Don-Bas even maybe soon Odessa

Your daydreamer Politicians will face with same fate as like Ukraine

stop dreaming and stop being a puppet

PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Armenia , ASSAD Regime , IRGC , Hezbol
and now Greece


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> to wake Greeks from their dreams
> Greece never can match with Turkiye ... not even close
> 
> 
> USA-UK-France-Germany used Ukraine as a pawn against Russia
> and USA-UK-France-Germany only watching on TV how Russia destroyed Ukranian cities and took Crimea , Don-Bas even maybe soon Odessa
> 
> Your daydreamer Politicians will face with same fate as like Ukraine
> 
> stop dreaming and stop being a puppet


No,no you didn't do it "to wake Greeks from their dreams".

You did it because you want to brag,to flex. To show how strong your country is and to prove to Pakistanis,Chinese,Iranians and Arabs and Europeans and Americans here,that "Turkiye is a superpower". 

Maybe it's an inferiority complex. Maybe it's insecurity. 

As for the dreams,somebody else is the one with dreams and imperial aspirations. Somebody else and not the Greeks,are making maps and trying to re-write history. An islamic populist government is feeding its people with dreams of new conquests by reminding them of the old ones,constantly. 

Day-dreamer Turkiye which can be brought to its senses with an economic collapse or a kick out of NATO.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> No,no you didn't do it "to wake Greeks from their dreams".
> 
> You did it because you want to brag,to flex.



We dont need to brag and to flex

We want to warn Greece ..... because USA-France-Germany wants to use Greece as a pawn against Turkiye


since 2013 Turkiye fought USA-France and their proxies/terrorists FETO , PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , etc in İraq,Syria,Libya

now they're putting on a new puppet to fight against Turkiye
Greeks and Turks will fight each others , and USA-France-Germany will be happy and laugh on us




Foinikas said:


> To show how strong your country is and to prove to Pakistanis,Chinese,Iranians and Arabs and Europeans and Americans here,that "Turkiye is a superpower".



on internet ?

We show it on the battlefield



Foinikas said:


> As for the dreams,somebody else is the one with dreams and imperial aspirations. Somebody else and not the Greeks,are making maps and trying to re-write history.



what about trash Seville map ? 
even no any value by international law

daydreamer Greece wants to steal oil-gas reserves and 150.000 km of land from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean

100 years ago we gave you a lesson
you want a lesson again



Foinikas said:


> Day-dreamer Turkiye which can be brought to its senses with an economic collapse or a kick out of NATO.



keep dreaming dream is free


----------



## Taimur Khurram

Strange thread considering the fact that everyone knows Turkey is more militarily capable.

But it's not as if Greece wouldn't be able to put up a decent defence considering the equipment they possess, and I do hope Turkish people realise that if they push things too far NATO and the EU will side with Greece over them.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> what about trash Seville map ?
> even no any value by international law


For your information,yesterday,the EU,Germany and the U.S. said that Greece stands with international law,the islands are rightfully Greek and Turkey should stop provocations 

_A spokesperson for the German government told a regular news conference in Berlin on Wednesday that C*hancellor Olaf Scholz “is of the opinion that, given the current situation, it is necessary for all NATO allies to stand together and refrain from provocations between themselves.”*_


*“Invading Greek airspace and flying over Greek islands is not OK, it seems counterproductive and against the spirit of the alliance,” added the spokesperson, who stressed that Germany is committed to resolving the open questions between Greece and Turkey in private dialogue, and on the basis of international law.*_ However, he insisted that “*we cannot accept the questioning of the sovereignty of member-states of the European Union.”*_



MMM-E said:


> keep dreaming dream is free


You call me a dreamer?

Look at your government:







You must be crazy to call me a dreamer. Or a hypocrite. Look at the maps you're printing. You're dreaming of new conquests and expansion. You have an aggressive government ruling you.




MMM-E said:


> 100 years ago we gave you a lesson
> you want a lesson again


100 years ago,100 years ago...

When you're cornered you always say "100 years ago hur dur" 😂


----------



## MMM-E

Taimur Khurram said:


> Strange thread considering the fact that everyone knows Turkey is more militarily capable.
> 
> But it's not as if Greece wouldn't be able to put up a decent defence considering the equipment they possess, and I do hope Turkish people realise that if they push things too far NATO and the EU will side with Greece over them.



Turkiye will lose money
but Greece will lose Islands


Ukraine made a mistake to trust in treacherous USA and The EU
USA and The EU provoked Ukraine against Russia

RESULT = Ukraine lost Crimea , also Don-Bas , maybe also Odessa
and Ukranian cities were destroyed by the Russian Armed Forces

since 2014 pathetic USA-UK-France-Germany only watching on TV how Russia destroyed Ukranian cities and took Crimea , Don-Bas


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye will lose money
> but Greece will lose Islands


So you admit that you're an aggressive,expansionist,militarist,imperialist country.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> For your information,yesterday,the EU,Germany and the U.S. said that Greece stands with international law,the islands are rightfully Greek and Turkey should stop provocations



we dont care about Bandit countries who also used terrorist FETO,PKK/YPG,HAFTAR,etc to fight Turkiye

by international law you have zero right



Foinikas said:


> So you admit that you're an aggressive,expansionist,militarist,imperialist country.




no Greece is a puppet country which using by aggressive,expansionist,militarist,imperialist USA-France


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> we dont care about Bandit countries who also used terrorist FETO,PKK/YPG,HAFTAR,etc to fight Turkiye
> 
> by international law you have zero right


AHAHAHAHA! 

You are the ONLY country that says we have "zero rights" by international law! Everybody else says we are the ones who are right by international law. EVERYONE EXCEPT TURKEY! 

😂😂😂

Hadi cocuk,go play Tetris.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You call me a dreamer?
> 
> Look at your government:



by international law 
Turkiye has the longest coast-line in the Eastern Mediterranean

and Turkish mainland generate 200 nm of EZZ

on the other hand a tiny Greek Island which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ... 

so Greek EEZ should start from Greek Mainland ,, not from every tiny Greek Island


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> by international law
> Turkiye has the longest coast-line in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> and Turkish mainland generate 200 nm of EZZ
> 
> on the other hand a tiny Greek Island which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ...
> 
> so Greek EEZ should start from Greek Mainland ,, not from every tiny Greek Island


Since you're saying the same old bull again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again...

You're just repeating the same statements in an endless loop like a bot.

So here. Read and cry:


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> AHAHAHAHA!
> 
> You are the ONLY country that says we have "zero rights" by international law! Everybody else says we are the ones who are right by international law. EVERYONE EXCEPT TURKEY!
> 
> 😂😂😂
> 
> Hadi cocuk,go play Tetris.




COCUK keep dreaming with your bandit countries

Not countries but international law generate EEZ
therefore USA-France-Greece can do nothing except using military power and threatens to sanction

since 2013 We paid heavy price ( over $500 billion ) to fight against bandit USA-France and their terrorists FETO,PKK/YPG,HAFTAR,etc

no problem , Greece will be the next puppet to be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces



Foinikas said:


> Since you're saying the same old bull again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again...
> 
> You're just repeating the same statements in an endless loop like a bot.
> 
> So here. Read and cry:
> 
> View attachment 850365
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 850364



and you're saying the same old bull again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again

daydreamer Greeks will wake up from their dreams when Turkish missiles will explode on their head

here watch and cry


----------



## _Nabil_

Foinikas said:


> And yet you brag about S-400 😂
> 
> @IblinI @jamahir @Huffal @retaxis @_Nabil_ See,he said it again 😂😂😂


He's at least confused and delusional, his Israeli master's doing joint military drills with his enemy Cyprus 😂🤣😅.....

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> COCUK keep dreaming with your bandit countries
> 
> Not countries but international lwa says the truth ,
> therefore USA-France-Greece can do nothing except using military power and threatens to sanction
> 
> since 2013 We paid heavy price ( over $500 billion ) to fight against bandit USA-France and their terrorists FETO,PKK/YPG,HAFTAR,etc
> 
> no problem , Greece will be the next puppet to be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces
> 
> 
> 
> and you're saying the same old bull again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again
> 
> daydreamer Greeks will wake up from their dreams when Turkish missiles will explode on their head


Please stop crying.


----------



## MMM-E

_Nabil_ said:


> He's at least confused and delusional, his Israeli master's doing joint military drills with his enemy Cyprus.....



nice dream


but reality is different

Turkish navy orders Israeli ship out of Cyprus’s waters​








Turkish navy orders Israeli ship out of Cyprus’s waters


Israeli research vessel reportedly vacated the area after being approached and told to leave by the Turkish navy.




www.aljazeera.com





Turkish navy forces back Italian drillship: Cyprus​








Turkey navy forces back Italian drillship: Cyprus


Five Turkish warships threatened to engage an Italian drillship Friday and forced it to turn back after it tried to break a two-week blockade off Cyprus, Cypriot officials said.




www.thelocal.it






Turkiye has enough power to protect its rights



Foinikas said:


> Please stop crying.



Greece is crying everywhere in USA ,in France , in İsrael , in Germany

Nobody can steal even 1cm2 of area from MAVI VATAN and Turkiye
loser PKK could not do it since 1985
and Greece will face with same fath


----------



## _Nabil_

MMM-E said:


> nice dream
> 
> 
> but reality is different
> 
> Turkish navy orders Israeli ship out of Cyprus’s waters​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish navy orders Israeli ship out of Cyprus’s waters
> 
> 
> Israeli research vessel reportedly vacated the area after being approached and told to leave by the Turkish navy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.aljazeera.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish navy forces back Italian drillship: Cyprus​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkey navy forces back Italian drillship: Cyprus
> 
> 
> Five Turkish warships threatened to engage an Italian drillship Friday and forced it to turn back after it tried to break a two-week blockade off Cyprus, Cypriot officials said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.thelocal.it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye has enough power to protect its rights
> 
> 
> 
> Greece is crying everywhere in USA ,in France , in İsrael , in Germany
> 
> Nobody can steal even 1cm2 of area from MAVI VATAN and Turkiye
> loser PKK could not do it since 1985
> and Greece will face with same fath







__





Cyprus-Israel joint drill not directed against Lebanon: ambassador


Cyprus-Israel joint drill not directed against Lebanon: ambassador-



english.news.cn





"The aim of these exercises is to train the border guards to defend the island of Cyprus," Kyriacou said"

Israeli (your masters) helping Cypriots (your enemies) in naval drills.


Any comments?

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## Foinikas

@_Nabil_ watch it,because Erdogan will extend his EEZ to Sousse and Carthage 

I mean look at that...they bypassed everything and reached Libya


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> here watch and cry
> View attachment 850368


*Can you tell me, according the Mavi Vatan map*, why the centre and eastern Greek islands as well as the sea area of 6 miles, are under Turkish "domination" (blue color) ?
Turkish map does not separate small or large islands, it considers everything Turkish, including their territorial waters.

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## Taimur Khurram

MMM-E said:


> Ukraine made a mistake to trust in treacherous USA and The EU



So has your country, they kicked you out of the F-35 programme even though you're the 2nd largest NATO military.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## IblinI

Foinikas said:


> And yet you brag about S-400 😂
> 
> @IblinI @jamahir @Huffal @retaxis @_Nabil_ See,he said it again 😂😂😂


Isnt it normal when this guy just replied with certain format based on keywords.

Reactions: Haha Haha:
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## IblinI

Foinikas said:


> Please stop crying.





Steppe Wolff said:


> Turkey is a brother country to Pakistan.





MMM-E said:


> useless Pakistan


Lol, the guy supported him because he is from Turkey but it somehow triggered mmme's keywords..
Mmme will called his family members ignorant troll if they disagreed with his list.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## MMM-E

Taimur Khurram said:


> So has your country, they kicked you out of the F-35 programme even though you're the 2nd largest NATO military.




Thanks to Turkish defense Industry and Thanks to American arms embargo

USA blocked sale of UCAVs to Turkiye
and Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with its own UCAVs TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI .... ( USA , Turkiye , Israel , China )


Sooner or later Turkiye will also become Stealth Fighter Jet power in the world







Turkiye develops its own KIZILELMA and TFX projects

*KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet*
first flight : 2023
in service : 2025

Endurance : 5 Hours
Service ceiling : 40,000 ft
Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
Payload : 1.5 Tons

-- AESA radar and next-generation avionics, sensor fusion
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
-- Turbofan engine











*The KIZILELMA will be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets*

stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *Can you tell me, according the Mavi Vatan map*, why the centre and eastern Greek islands as well as the sea area of 6 miles, are under Turkish "domination" (blue color) ?
> Turkish map does not separate small or large islands, it considers everything Turkish, including their territorial waters.



*INTERNATIONAL LAW

1 --* That doesnt matter small or large Island ... Greece is not Archipelagic State as like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland

therefore Greek Islands can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ... only Territorial Water of 6nm

*2 -- *Greek EEZ-Continental Shelf should start from Greek mainland , not from every Greek Island

*3 --* Greek Islands can not block Turkish Mainland
especially a tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland can not generate EEZ of 200 nm


*So , Turkiye is 100% right by international law in the Eastern Mediterranean*


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> I mean look at that...they bypassed everything and reached Libya



bypassed what ?

by international law , Greek Islands can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ... only Territorial Water of 6 nm in the Eastern Mediterranean

therefore , its our EEZ and Libya-Turkiye signed a maritime agreement .....

*nothing against international law*

Nobody can steal oil-gas reserves and 150.000 km2 of area from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterranean
Turkish Military Power to protect MAVI VATAN ( Blue Homeland )​


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *INTERNATIONAL LAW
> 
> 1 --* That doesnt matter small or large Island ... Greece is not Archipelagic State as like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland
> 
> therefore Greek Islands can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ... only Territorial Water of 6nm
> 
> *2 -- *Greek EEZ-Continental Shelf should start from Greek mainland , not from every Greek Island
> 
> *3 --* Greek Islands can not block Turkish Mainland
> especially a tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland can not generate EEZ of 200 nm
> 
> 
> *So , Turkiye is 100% right by international law in the Eastern Mediterranean*



Obviously you do not read what the other person writes to you.



MMM-E said:


> by international law , Greek Islands can not generate EEZ of 200 nm ... only Territorial Water of 6 nm in the Eastern Mediterranean



Of course Greece can.....


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Of course Greece can.....





if Greece is an Archipelagic State as like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland
but Greece is not an Archipelagic State

so Greek Islands can not block Turkish Mainland
especially a tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland

Greek Island can not generate EEZ of 200 nm
and Greek EEZ-Continental Shelf should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


btw USA,İsrael,Turkiye and many more countries have never signed the UNCLOS 1982


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> btw USA,İsrael,Turkiye and many more countries have never signed the UNCLOS 1982


USA and Israel have ratified it, which means they recognize it as International Law. 
Turkey has not done that either.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> USA and Israel have ratified it, which means they recognize it as International Law.
> Turkey has not done that either.



even UNCLOS doesnt give a right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ against Turkish mainland in the Eastern Mediterranean


what a stupid claim by Greece

a tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland generate EEZ of 200 nm

no any other same example in the World
by international law , its not possible ....

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> a tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland generate EEZ of 200 nm
> 
> no any other same example in the World
> and by international law , its not possible ....


Yes, it can, plenty examples.....


*Saint-Pierre and Miquelon*









*Jan Mayen*.....







Colombia and Nicaragua......


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Yes, it can, plenty examples.....
> 
> 
> *Saint-Pierre and Miquelon*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Jan Mayen*.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Colombia and Nicaragua......



Its not same example ....

Jan Mayen doesnt block any mainland
Jan Mayen Island lies 600 km northeast of Iceland and 500 km east of central Greenland


but as of Greek claim
tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland






I am saying again , by international law Greek Islands can not block Turkish mainland to generate its own EEZ

Islands can not block mainland


----------



## Super Falcon

Typhoons are also coming



MMM-E said:


> *10 HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessels for the Turkish Navy*
> 
> 
> The first Ship is scheduled to be launched in 2023
> 
> The primary missions of the OPVs to protect the sovereignty rights within the scope of national and international law in low-risk Exclusive Economic Zone and open sea areas
> ( intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance, search and rescue )
> 
> 
> *Overall length:* 99,56 meters
> *Maximum speed:* 24 knots
> *Displacement:* 2300 tons
> *Range :* 4500 nautical miles
> 
> CENK-S AESA Radar
> -- 76 mm Gun
> -- L-UMTAS Missiles
> -- 8 x HISAR-O Air Defense Missiles
> -- 8 x ATMACA Anti-Ship Missiles
> -- 1 x GOKDENIZ CIWS ( 35 mm )
> View attachment 849614
> 
> View attachment 849615
> 
> 
> 
> Hellenic Navy even can not enter Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> *to be continued*


Less protection on these subs


----------



## Foinikas

IblinI said:


> Lol, the guy supported him because he is from Turkey but it somehow triggered mmme's keywords..
> Mmme will called his family members ignorant troll if they disagreed with his list.


Every Pakistani on the forum should see this. 



Akritas said:


> Obviously you do not read what the other person writes to you.


He doesn't. He will say his things no matter what you tell him. He is not here to listen to anyone or debate. He just wants people to tell him "well done,Turkey is the best country". 

And if people disagree with him,he keeps writing the same stuff.



MMM-E said:


> Its not same example ....
> 
> Jan Mayen doesnt block any mainland
> 
> but as of Greek claim
> tiny Greek Island ( Kastellorizo ) which is 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland
> View attachment 850544
> 
> 
> 
> I am saying again , by international law Greek Islands can not block Turkish mainland to generate its own EEZ
> 
> Islands can not block mainland


You know he can't debate anyone,when he repeats his famous phrase "I am saying again"

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> He doesn't. He will say his things no matter what you tell him. He is not here to listen to anyone or debate. He just wants people to tell him "well done,Turkey is the best country".
> 
> And if people disagree with him,he keeps writing the same stuff.



I dont care about lies of anti-Turkiye guys on PDF

You have no military knowledge to discuss with me
no military discuss but only deflect the facts and trying to discredit me


and I show you reality , not dreams

as like Greeks says we are buying 4 FDI Frigates , 24 Rafales .. end of Turkiye
Greek dreams are so funny


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> as like Greeks says we are buying 4 FDI Frigates , 24 Rafales .. end of Turkiye
> Greek dreams are so funny


Who says that? Only you. 

Besides,we're not buying just FDI and 24 Rafale. We're buying a lot more than that. Our goals are purely defensive. We don't want a war,but if you try to take our lands,our islands,our EEZ,we will defend our country.



MMM-E said:


> You have no real military knowledge to discuss with me
> no military discuss but only deflect the facts and trying to discredit me


You have discredited every serious person on the forum and called everyone "ignorant". You keep saying that you are the only one with real knowledge of history,geopolitics and military. And everyone in the forum is laughing.

Even your fellow Turks avoid you.


----------



## MMM-E

Super Falcon said:


> Less protection on these subs



Its Offshore Patrol Vessel based on ADA class Corvette platform

HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessel armed with
-- 76 mm Gun
-- 1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
-- 8 x HISAR SAMs
-- 8 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles

what a great fire power for Offshore Patrol Vessel

10 HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessels will protect Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean

Greece can not match with Turkish defense Industry

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## Foinikas

Super Falcon said:


> Typhoons are also coming


That's not sure yet. These are just speculations,bro.



Super Falcon said:


> Less protection on these subs


No matter what you tell him,he will tell you "We have this and it can destroy everything". It's useless trying to debate him. Even untested weapons are superior for him than everything the others have.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Besides,we're not buying just FDI and 24 Rafale. We're buying a lot more than that. Our goals are purely defensive. We don't want a war,but if you try to take our lands,our islands,our EEZ,we will defend our country.



You are buying a lot more than that ? so funny
Your military power can not stop even Turkish UCAVs and unmanned armed Vessels and land based Missiles


Your tiny Greece has big dreams
USA-France-Germany says jump and Greece says how long Sir


Greece is trying to steal our Islands and our EEZ

Turkiye was busy to fight USA-France and their terrorists FETO,PKK/YPG,HAFTAR also Russia-İran backed WAGNER , ASSAD,IRGC,Hezbol in İraq,Syria,Libya

16 Turkish Islands Have Been Occupied by Greece​




__





16 Turkish Islands Have Been Occupied by Greece


R. Major-General and Deputy Chairman of the Patriotic Party, Naci Beştepe, evaluated the occupation and annexation of 16 Turkish islands.




vatanpartisi.org.tr


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greece is trying to steal our Islands and our EEZ



Your islands?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You have discredited every serious person on the forum and called everyone "ignorant". You keep saying that you are the only one with real knowledge of history,geopolitics and military. And everyone in the forum is laughing.
> 
> Even your fellow Turks avoid you.



I dont care about ignorant and anti-Erdogan guys including Turkish users




Foinikas said:


> No matter what you tell him,he will tell you "We have this and it can destroy everything". It's useless trying to debate him. Even untested weapons are superior for him than everything the others have.



stop trolling , go and search about OPV

1x 76mm gun , 1x 35 mm CIWS , 8 SAMs and 8 anti-ship Missiles are great fire power for Offshore Patrol Vessel

even Egyptian FREMM Frigate armed with only 16x SAMs and 8x anti-ship Missiles
Hellenic Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates also armed with 16x SAMs and 8x anti-ship Missiles


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> I dont care about ignorant and anti-Erdogan guys including Turkish users


@dBSPL Are you that guy?

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Your islands?



Dont worry
when the true time comes , we will kick Greeks out of our Islands
as like we did it in 1996



Foinikas said:


> @dBSPL Are you that guy?



dont cry to everone and discuss with me one on one

You are already calling Chinese,İranian,İndian,etc users to attack me

This thread about Greece vs Turkiye
but your Chinese,İranian,İndian,etc friends are cring on my thread


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You are already calling Chinese,İranian,İndian,etc users to attack me


Because everyone is amused by the bullshit you post. Really.



MMM-E said:


> dont cry to everone and discuss with me one on one


What makes you think that people are crying and not laughing at your posts?

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## Super Falcon

Foinikas said:


> That's not sure yet. These are just speculations,bro.
> 
> 
> No matter what you tell him,he will tell you "We have this and it can destroy everything". It's useless trying to debate him. Even untested weapons are superior for him than everything the others have.


What a rubbish comment you passed on me when did I said it can destroy everything no weapon is superior to any one as far as typhoon it is not speculation turkey wants to counter Greek aggression build up of airforce F 35 not coming F 16 upgrade to viper is not getting finalized Russian jets turkey won't like to buy typhoons are at par with Rafales in terms of capabilities and UK always supported turkey over Greeks and Turkish govt already in talk s and deal along with TFX engines of rolce Royce will be also re negotiated with uk


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Because everyone is amused by the bullshit you post. Really.



reality hurts anti-Turkiye troll team
same users are crying on my threads

My post 100% true info

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## Foinikas

Super Falcon said:


> What a rubbish comment you passed on me when did I said it can destroy everything no weapon is superior to any one


Wait,wait,wait....you got it all wrong. First of all,that comment was not about you,but MMM-E. 
I was telling you,that no matter what you tell him,he will claim Turkish weapons are superior.



Super Falcon said:


> as far as typhoon it is not speculation turkey wants to counter Greek aggression build up of airforce


Bhai,what aggression? 



Super Falcon said:


> F 35 not coming F 16 upgrade to viper is not getting finalized Russian jets turkey won't like to buy typhoons are at par with Rafales in terms of capabilities and UK always supported turkey over Greeks and Turkish govt already in talk s and deal along with TFX engines of rolce Royce will be also re negotiated with uk


Yes,that's why I'm telling you it's just rumors. They haven't bought any Eurofighters yet,they don't have a deal. And I think the Germans need to approve a sale too,right? Along with the Italians and the Spaniards.


----------



## Super Falcon

Foinikas said:


> Wait,wait,wait....you got it all wrong. First of all,that comment was not about you,but MMM-E.
> I was telling you,that no matter what you tell him,he will claim Turkish weapons are superior.
> 
> 
> Bhai,what aggression?
> 
> 
> Yes,that's why I'm telling you it's just rumors. They haven't bought any Eurofighters yet,they don't have a deal. And I think the Germans need to approve a sale too,right? Along with the Italians and the Spaniards.


Bro sorry for miss understanding 

Italians will definately approve them and I think UK has a right to sell single handedly no need of any approval but turkey will get them for sure they are talking the proposal with uk to buy them



MMM-E said:


> Its Offshore Patrol Vessel based on ADA class Corvette platform
> 
> HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessel armed with
> -- 76 mm Gun
> -- 1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
> -- 8 x HISAR SAMs
> -- 8 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
> 
> what a great fire power for Offshore Patrol Vessel
> 
> 10 HISAR class Offshore Patrol Vessels will protect Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> Greece can not match with Turkish defense Industry


Still it needs atleast 24 anti air 4 CIWS 1 Main gun 3 torpedo tubes with 20 torpedos and 16 anti ship missile this is what call weapons packed least

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> I was telling you,that no matter what you tell him,he will claim Turkish weapons are superior.



You are still lying

I never said that all Turkish weapons are superior
I always said that Turkish military fire power is superior

-- Turkish Navy has more SAMs than even Hellenic+French Navies combined
-- Turkish UCAVs and unmanned armed Vessels will be enough to wipe out the Hellenic Navy
-- Greece can fire 100 missiles on the other hand Turkiye can fire 1.000 missiles


what about Greek military power ?
90 SCALP , 50 HARM , 39 air launched EXOCET and 100 ATACMS 

Turkiye has the best missile power in NATO after USA

-- 75-100 km POPEYE air launched Cruise Missile
-- 120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
-- 140 km HARPOON block2 land attack Cruise Missile
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
-- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
-- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
-- 150 km J600T Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
-- 275 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile
-- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile
-- 280 km KARA-ATMACA land based Cruise Missile
-- 280 km KHAN Tactical Ballistic Missile

Alsp soon 150 km AKBABA anti-radiation Missile , 1.000 km GEZGIN strategic Cruise Missile and RAMJET powered supersonic cruise Missile


----------



## Foinikas

Super Falcon said:


> Italians will definately approve them


Italians will probably approve them,they generally don't have a problem with Turks. The funny thing is with the Germans,because you know the Germans have always been pro-Turkish,but this new government now doesn't support them very much. They hate Erdogan. But then again,the British are a strong country and they will probably convince them.

Erdogan's government almost made the mistake to buy Su-35s from Russia.That would need new logistics,training of pilots and engineers in a completely different philosophy of jet fighter and integrating it to NATO systems etc.



MMM-E said:


> You are still lying
> 
> I never said that all Turkish weapons are superior
> I always said that Turkish military fire power is superior
> 
> -- Turkish Navy has more SAMs than even Hellenic+French Navies combined
> -- Turkish UCAVs and unmanned armed Vessels will be enough to wipe out the Hellenic Navy
> -- Greece can fire 100 missiles on the other hand Turkiye can fire 1.000 missiles
> 
> 
> what about Greek military power ?
> 90 SCALP , 50 HARM , 39 air launched EXOCET and 100 ATACMS
> 
> Turkiye has the best missile power in NATO after USA
> 
> -- 75-100 km POPEYE air launched Cruise Missile
> -- 120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
> -- 140 km HARPOON block2 land attack Cruise Missile
> -- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
> -- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
> -- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
> -- 150 km J600T Tactical Ballistic Missile
> -- 165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile
> -- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
> -- 275 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile
> -- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile
> -- 280 km KARA-ATMACA land based Cruise Missile
> -- 280 km KHAN Tactical Ballistic Missile
> 
> Alsp soon 150 km AKBABA anti-radiation Missile , 1.000 km GEZGIN strategic Cruise Missile and RAMJET powered supersonic cruise Missile


If I had 1 euro every time you posted that same list,I would have bought a new laptop by now.


----------



## Super Falcon

Foinikas said:


> Italians will probably approve them,they generally don't have a problem with Turks. The funny thing is with the Germans,because you know the Germans have always been pro-Turkish,but this new government now doesn't support them very much. They hate Erdogan. But then again,the British are a strong country and they will probably convince them.
> 
> Erdogan's government almost made the mistake to buy Su-35s from Russia.That would need new logistics,training of pilots and engineers in a completely different philosophy of jet fighter and integrating it to NATO systems etc.
> 
> 
> If I had 1 euro every time you posted that same list,I would have bought a new laptop by now.


They did not bought any Su 35 from Russia sir ji


----------



## MMM-E

Super Falcon said:


> Still it needs atleast 24 anti air 4 CIWS 1 Main gun 3 torpedo tubes with 20 torpedos and 16 anti ship missile this is what call weapons packed least



Bro
its just Offshore Patrol Vessel , but not Frigate
Turkish HISAR Offshore Patrol Vessel is one of the best armed Offshore Patrol Vessel in the world


Turkiye also produce 4 ISTIF class Frigates
( 76mm main gun , CIWS , 3 torpedo tubes with torpedos , 64 x SAMs and 16x anti-ship Missiles ) to match with upcoming Greek FDI Frigates


----------



## Super Falcon

MMM-E said:


> Bro
> its just Offshore Patrol Vessel , but not Frigate
> Turkish HISAR Offshore Patrol Vessel is one of the best armed Offshore Patrol Vessel in the world
> 
> 
> Turkiye also produce ISTIF class Frigates
> ( 76mm main gun , CIWS , 3 torpedo tubes with torpedos , 64 x SAMs and 16x anti-ship Missiles ) to match with upcoming Greek FDI Frigates
> View attachment 850584


I hope it stays that way sir


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> If I had 1 euro every time you posted that same list,I would have bought a new laptop by now.



as always another stupid post from you

no any knowledge for military discuss
only trolling and blah-blah


----------



## Foinikas

Super Falcon said:


> They did not bought any Su 35 from Russia sir ji


Yes. Erdogan was ready to go buy. He was asking Putin for Su-35s or Su-57s.

I don't know how much the Turkish pilots and officers and even Akar himself would have liked that.

But in the end,they didn't. And that's good for the Turkish Air Force.

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## Super Falcon

Foinikas said:


> Yes. Erdogan was ready to go buy. He was asking Putin for Su-35s or Su-57s.
> 
> I don't know how much the Turkish pilots and officers and even Akar himself would have liked that.
> 
> But in the end,they didn't. And that's good for the Turkish Air Force.


It was offered by Putin after S 400 sale but Turks denied them


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> as always another stupid post from you
> 
> no any knowledge for military discuss
> only trolling and blah-blah


Because I know that even if I reply seriously,like I've done many times in the past,you will keep making flaming comments,you will throw insults for against my country and me and in the end you will not admit anything. You don't want to debate,you just want to say something and have people tell you "Well done". 

Come on,man. You just made this thread to flex,not because you want a discussion. If you could,you would have had disabled comments. You just want an audience for your long-lists of Turkish projects.


----------



## Super Falcon

MMM-E said:


> reality hurts anti-Turkiye troll team
> same users are crying on my threads
> 
> My post 100% true info


Cool down friends I agree with both you


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Because I know that even if I reply seriously,like I've done many times in the past,you will keep making flaming comments,you will throw insults for against my country and me and in the end you will not admit anything. You don't want to debate,you just want to say something and have people tell you "Well done".



I dont need to hear "Well done"

I just show reality to wake Greeks from their big dreams


even Greek program producer Ioannis Theodoratos talks about the ATMACA, KARA ATMACA, GEZGİN, CAKIR, BORA, SOM , KUZGUN-TJ , TRLG-230 missiles which will be used for saturation attack that will pose a great danger to the Greek mainland, islands and navy

only watch your Greek program producer Ioannis Theodoratos





also there are around 1.000 HARPY , HARPOON , SLAM-ER , HARM , ATACMS , JSOW and POPEYE


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> only watch your Greek program producer Ioannis Theodoratos


Who is that guy? Nobody even knows him 😂

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> 64 x SAMs and 16x anti-ship Missiles ) to match with upcoming Greek FDI Frigates


Istif class has only 2 x 8=16 cells for 16 SAM (e.g. Hisar) and not......64


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Istif class has only 2 x 8=16 cells for 16 SAM (e.g. Hisar) and not......64



Turkiye doesnt use inferior French technology SYLVER VLS which is without quad pack capability for ASTER Missiles



Turkish OHP and MEKO-200 Frigates use American MK-41 VLS with quad pack capability
for example Turkish OHP Frigates equipped with 8 cells MK-41 VLS for 32 x ESSM air defense missiles

so Turkiye develops its own VLS System with quad pack capability
and ISTIF class Frigates will use indigenous VLS system .... ( 16 cells VLS for 64 x HISAR-O or HISAR-RF air defense missiles )

and HISAR Missiles are ready


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye doesnt use inferior French technology SYLVER VLS which is without quad pack capability for ASTER Missiles
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish OHP and MEKO-200 Frigates use American MK-41 VLS with quad pack capability
> for example Turkish OHP Frigates equipped with 8 cells MK-41 VLS armed with 32 x ESSM air defense missiles
> 
> so Turkiye develops its own VLS System with quad pack capability
> and ISTIF class Frigates will use indigenous VLS system .... ( 16 cells VLS for 64 x HISAR-O or HISAR-RF air defense missiles )


Turkish VLS is a copy paste of MK 41, that's mean has similar dimensions.
If you put Hisar, then you will have 32 missiles ..*..ESSM and not SAM*, and of course 64 is a non-existent number.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye doesnt use inferior French technology SYLVER VLS which is without quad pack capability for ASTER Missiles


Akrita,don't you know? Turkiye only use best weapons in the world 😂

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## Akritas

Foinikas said:


> Akrita,don't you know? Turkiye only use best weapons in the world 😂


I have understood it for a long time, they have surpassed in military technology countries such as the USA, France, China, Russia, N. Korea, etc.,


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Turkish VLS is a copy paste of MK 41, that's mean has similar dimensions.
> If you put Hisar, then you will have 32 missiles ..*..ESSM and not SAM*, and of course 64 is a non-existent number.




İf Turkish VLS is a copy paste of MK-41 then 64 x HISAR-O

American MK-41 VLS has quad pack capability ( 4 ESSM missiles in one canister )
16 cells = 64 HISAR-O Missiles


btw SAM means surface to air missile

ASTER-15 , ESSM , CAMM , HISAR all of them are surface to air missile


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> İf Turkish VLS is a copy paste of MK-41 then 64 x HISAR-O
> 
> American MK-41 VLS has quad pack capability ( 4 ESSM missiles in one canister )
> 16 cells = 64 HISAR-O Missiles
> 
> 
> btw SAM means surface to air missile
> 
> ASTER-15 , ESSM , CAMM , HISAR all of them are surface to air missile


Do you understand that Aster 30 will hit the Turkish ship, without you seeing it?
Hisar O with a range of 25 kilometers, even the Super Vita will not reach.

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## Foinikas

Akritas said:


> I have understood it for a long time, they have surpassed in military technology countries such as the USA, France, China, Russia, N. Korea, etc.,


You know,if you ask him,he will tell you that USA cannot defeat Turkey. I've asked him in the past,if the US Navy sends a full Aircraft carrier group and squadrons from the Middle-East,he kept insisting that nobody can defeat 88,000,000 Turks defending their country.

He also claims that the Turkish Navy can defeat the Greek,Egyptian and Israeli Navies combined.

I kept showing him flaws in Turkish ships and how some of the things he says are wrong,but he kept insisting.

He basically discredits everyone and keeps posting the same stuff like a spambot.
















Even Legend gave up

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Do you understand that Aster 30 will hit the Turkish ship, without you seeing it?
> Hisar O with a range of 25 kilometers, even the Super Vita will not reach.





ASTER-30 is not for anti-ship role ..... learn about military

ASTER-30 Missiles for air defense mission .... and 120 km ASTER-30 can not engage on Turkish UCAVs and F-16s armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , HARM , SOM and SLAM-ER Missiles

better you worry about inferior French technology SYLVER VLS
Greece buys FDI Frigate with 32 cells VLS for 32 ASTER air defense missiles

to fire 60 TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ missiles for swarm attack on FDI Frigate and game over


btw Turkish SIPER air defense missile will have range of 150 km



Foinikas said:


> You know,if you ask him,he will tell you that USA cannot defeat Turkey. I've asked him in the past,if the US Navy sends a full Aircraft carrier group and squadrons from the Middle-East,he kept insisting that nobody can defeat 88,000,000 Turks defending their country.



We have seen loser USA in Vietnam and Afghanistan
20 years and full of fiasco

War is not computer game


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> He also claims that the Turkish Navy can defeat the Greek,Egyptian and Israeli Navies combined.



I said even We dont need the Turkish Navy


to produce 1.000 SOM , ATMACA , KUZGUN-TJ , TRLG-230 , CAKIR Missiles
and game over

The Greek,Egyptian Frigates have no even 250 air defense missiles
Israel has tiny Navy with only 5 Corvettes

I said that Your Navies can not enter Turkish EEZ to fight Turkish Armed Forces


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We have seen loser USA in Vietnam and Afghanistan
> 20 years and full of fiasco
> 
> War is not computer game


How many wars have they fought since Vietnam? How many militaries did they smash? How many countries did they bomb? 

You live in your own world. Thinking that you're a superpower with inflation at 73,5% and internal problems.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> How many wars have they fought since Vietnam? How many militaries did they smash? How many countries did they bomb?



Only one reality .. full of fiasco

Vietnam , Afghanistan , İraq





Foinikas said:


> You live in your own world. Thinking that you're a superpower with inflation at 73,5% and internal problems.



We have enough power to kick enemies from İraq to Syria from Libya to Eastern Mediterranean

Turkish Armed Forces everywhere .... not dream or fantasy but reality


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Vietnam , Afghanistan , İraq


Vietnam: USA didn't lose the war,they left the country and stopped supporting the South Vietnam government. The South Vietnamese government lost the war,not USA. Up to the point they left,the U.S. forces had been hammering the NVA and VCs for years,causing them heavy casualties.

Afghanistan: Same thing as Vietnam. The U.S. forces destroyed the Taliban in the country and the Afghan government and ANA collapsed as soon as the Americans left. 

Iraq: Complete victory for the Americans in both wars.



MMM-E said:


> We have enough power to kick enemies from İraq to Syria from Libya to Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> Turkish Armed Forces everywhere .... not dream or fantasy but reality


It seems that you are dreaming of wars and conquests. That's not reality,that's dreaming.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Vietnam: USA didn't lose the war,they left the country and stopped supporting the South Vietnam government. The South Vietnamese government lost the war,not USA. Up to the point they left,the U.S. forces had been hammering the NVA and VCs for years,causing them heavy casualties.



USA lost in Vietnam
20 years and fiasco




Foinikas said:


> Afghanistan: Same thing as Vietnam. The U.S. forces destroyed the Taliban in the country and the Afghan government and ANA collapsed as soon as the Americans left.



USA lost in Afghanistan
20 years and Fiasco

28 countries including super power USA could not clean Afghanistan from Taliban
and in finally USA gave Afghanistan to Taliban and left




Foinikas said:


> Iraq: Complete victory for the Americans in both wars.



İran seized İraq and İraqi government
İraqi Kurdistan is working with Turkiye

What did USA win in İraq ?
USA spent trillions of dollars and lost thousands of soldiers and failed to create Kurdistan


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> It seems that you are dreaming of wars and conquests. That's not reality,that's dreaming.



We Turks are not dreaming about wars and conquests
even I am trying to wake Greeks from their dreams

Ukraine and Russia have fallen into a trap set by the US-Europe
and Russia took Crimea , Don-Bas and Ukranian cities were destroyed


Turkiye just protect itself against bandit countries and their terrorists FETO,PKK/YPG,etc

or Turkiye would be similar to İraq,Syria,Libya
USA-EU and their terrorists FETO,PKK/YPG,etc tried but failed


----------



## KendoKhan

@MMM-E you are in for a rude awakening. Such bluster often leads to embarrassment. But keep smoking the cheap stuff and believing in your delusion of "Turkey Superpower".


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Even Legend gave up




Full of wrong predictions by LEGEND in 2020


1 -- He said Hellenic Air Force F-16s will be upgraded until 2027
Turkish Airforce F-16s also will be upgraded to block72 standard
also Turkiye will buy 40 new F-16V from the US or Eurofighters from the UK

even 150+ Greek F-16s without Cruise Missiles .... so pathetic


2 -- He said Hellenic Air Force will be receiving Rafales from France
and Turkiye bought S400 Air Defense Systems to block Rafales

also He forget about tiny Greece
all Airbases , jet hangars , air defense systems in range of Turkish Ballistic and Cruise Missiles 

He is talking about Hellenic Air Force F-16 upgrade until 2027
but He is not talking about Turkish Ballistic ,Cruise and Air Defense Missiles 


3 -- He forget about the KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet ( first flight by 2023 , in service by 2025 )

4 -- He said that this is assuming that British will hep Turkiye in developing the TFX
in 2022 even British Rolls Royce decided to work with Turkiye to develop turbofan engine for the TFX

5 -- He said Turkiye has problems with Egypt , İsrael , UAE , Russia
as of 2022 , no any problem with Russia and Turkiye-İsrael-Uae hails new era in relations

Nobody will fight against Turkiye for Greece



full of ignorance about the Turkish defense Industry and lack of vision


He thinks 24 Rafales will give a victory to Greece against Turkiye
and He thinks French Navy can block Eastern Mediterranean to the Turkish Armed Forces

better worry about how to stop hundreds of Turkish missiles ( land-naval-air launched )
pathetic French Frigates armed with only 16-32 ASTER SAMs
Greek Frigates also so pathetic , armed with only 16 SAMs


----------



## MMM-E

KendoKhan said:


> @MMM-E you are in for a rude awakening. Such bluster often leads to embarrassment. But keep smoking the cheap stuff and believing in your delusion of "Turkey Superpower".



stop smoking and stop trolling

Nobody says Turkiye is a super power
even Russia is not a super power


only one reality
Turkiye has enough power to kick enemies in İraq,Syria,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean


----------



## MMM-E

*Greek Frigates armed with only 16 x SAMs*



how to stop swarm attack of Turkish Armed Forces Missile power

-- 140 km HARPOON anti-ship Missile
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
-- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
-- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
-- 250 km ATMACA anti-ship Missile
-- 275 km SOM air launched anti-ship Missile
-- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile


*Greek and French Navy can not survive against the Turkish Armed Forces Missile power from land-naval-air platforms*

so easy to produce more hundreds of 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missiles
even AKINCI UCAVs to carry 4 x TRLG-230 supersonic Missiles






*ATMACA land based anti-ship Missile*

Range : 250 km
Warhead : 250 km

















*and game changer KIZILELMA is coming*

For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the targets


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Full of wrong predictions by LEGEND in 2020
> 
> 
> 1 -- He said Hellenic Air Force F-16s will be upgraded until 2027
> Turkish Airforce F-16s also will be upgraded to block72 standard
> also Turkiye will buy 40 new F-16V from the US or Eurofighters from the UK
> 
> even 150+ Greek F-16s without Cruise Missiles .... so pathetic
> 
> 
> 2 -- He said Hellenic Air Force will be receiving Rafales from France
> and Turkiye bought S400 Air Defense Systems to block Rafales
> 
> also He forget about tiny Greece
> all Airbases , jet hangars , air defense systems in range of Turkish Ballistic and Cruise Missiles
> 
> He is talking about Hellenic Air Force F-16 upgrade until 2027
> but He is not talking about Turkish Ballistic ,Cruise and Air Defense Missiles
> 
> 
> 3 -- He forget about the KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet ( first flight by 2023 , in service by 2025 )
> 
> 4 -- He said that this is assuming that British will hep Turkiye in developing the TFX
> in 2022 even British Rolls Royce decided to work with Turkiye to develop turbofan engine for the TFX
> 
> 5 -- He said Turkiye has problems with Egypt , İsrael , UAE , Russia
> as of 2022 , no any problem with Russia and Turkiye-İsrael-Uae hails new era in relations
> 
> Nobody will fight against Turkiye for Greece
> 
> 
> 
> full of ignorance about the Turkish defense Industry and lack of vision
> 
> 
> He thinks 24 Rafales will give a victory to Greece against Turkiye
> and He thinks French Navy can block Eastern Mediterranean to the Turkish Armed Forces
> 
> better worry about how to stop hundreds of Turkish missiles ( land-naval-air launched )
> pathetic French Frigates armed with only 16-32 ASTER SAMs
> Greek Frigates also so pathetic , armed with only 16 SAMs
> 
> 
> View attachment 850677


Trust me,Legend was spot on in everything. To the tiniest word. He was spot on and talked like an educated person. Unlike someone else.



MMM-E said:


> USA lost in Vietnam
> 20 years and fiasco
> 
> 
> 
> 
> USA lost in Afghanistan
> 20 years and Fiasco
> 
> 28 countries including super power USA could not clean Afghanistan from Taliban
> and in finally USA gave Afghanistan to Taliban and left
> 
> 
> 
> 
> İran seized İraq and İraqi government
> İraqi Kurdistan is working with Turkiye
> 
> What did USA win in İraq ?
> USA spent trillions of dollars and lost thousands of soldiers and failed to create Kurdistan


Go learn history and stop watching Ertugrul 😂


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Trust me,Legend was spot on in everything. To the tiniest word. He was spot on and talked like an educated person. Unlike someone else.



Full of wrong predictions and lack of vision




Foinikas said:


> Go learn history and stop watching Ertugrul 😂



Go learn history and stop watching Rambo


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Go learn history and stop watching Rambo


What should I watch,Korkusuz? 😂


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> What should I watch,Korkusuz? 😂



You know Turkish movies better than me
watch Rambo 2 in Vietnam or Rambo 3 in Afghanistan


----------



## Wolfhunter

MMM-E said:


> You know Turkish movies better than me
> watch Rambo 2 in Vietnam or Rambo 3 in Afghanistan


Dumb cunt.

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> ASTER-30 is not for anti-ship role ..... learn about military
> 
> ASTER-30 Missiles for air defense mission .... and 120 km ASTER-30 can not engage on Turkish UCAVs and F-16s armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , HARM , SOM and SLAM-ER Missiles


I wanted to write Exocet MM40 Block 3C, that's why I mentioned Super Vita. So leave the ironies, because I can play this game too.
Now tell me how will you deal with a missile(air, land or sea), which can hit you from a range of 200 km, with another, with only 25 km?

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## Wolfhunter

Akritas said:


> I wanted to write Exocet MM40 Block 3C, that's why I mentioned Super Vita. So leave the ironies, because I can play this game too.
> Now tell me how will you deal with a missile(air, land or sea), which can hit you from a range of 200 km, with another, with only 25 km?


Super power turkey's economy is in the shitter:









Turkey experiencing ‘inflation-devaluation spiral’ as lira heads south | Ahval


Turkey is finding itself in a vicious circle of surging inflation and a depreciating currency, said a leading emerging markets strategist, as the lira extended losses this year against the dollar.




ahvalnews.com

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *Greek Frigates armed with only 16 x SAMs*
> 
> how to stop swarm attack of Turkish Armed Forces Missile power
> 
> -- 140 km HARPOON anti-ship Missile
> -- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
> -- 150 km CAKIR Cruise Missile
> -- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
> -- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missiles with IIR seeker
> -- 250 km ATMACA anti-ship Missile
> -- 275 km SOM air launched anti-ship Missile
> -- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile


Each FDI has :32 Aster 30, 21 RAM and Super Rapid
If the Turkish Navy has the naval power of a Arleigh Burke and the air superiority of a F-35, then you will defeat the Greek Navy, and one of the most powerful modern west anti-aircraft frigates.

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## Akritas

Wolfhunter said:


> Super power turkey's economy is in the shitter:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkey experiencing ‘inflation-devaluation spiral’ as lira heads south | Ahval
> 
> 
> Turkey is finding itself in a vicious circle of surging inflation and a depreciating currency, said a leading emerging markets strategist, as the lira extended losses this year against the dollar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ahvalnews.com


Known for this, you see it constantly from the people who are fighting for a free loaf of bread. But as you can see, the Erdogan regime, through the controlled media, is constantly bombarding them with pro-war shouts and news and how....super power are.
Turkey is a giant with glasses feet.

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## Abid123

Turkey ranking: 13
Greece ranking: 27






2023 Military Strength Ranking


Ranking the nations of the world based on current available firepower.



www.globalfirepower.com


----------



## Foinikas

@Akritas Check this out

These are the flaws of the Turkish Navy,that I had showed him a few months ago. 

6 out of 10 corvettes of the Turkish Navy have no AA systems and all 19 Fast Attack Craft lack an AA system.

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## Wolfhunter

Foinikas said:


> @Akritas Check this out
> 
> These are the flaws of the Turkish Navy,that I had showed him a few months ago.
> 
> 6 out of 10 corvettes of the Turkish Navy have no AA systems and all 19 Fast Attack Craft lack an AA system.
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 850823
> 
> 
> View attachment 850821


Floating coffins lol!

Turkish Supa POWER! lol


----------



## Foinikas

Wolfhunter said:


> Floating coffins lol!
> 
> Turkish Supa POWER! lol


See,currently,the Turkish Navy has 2 or 3 times the ships that we have,but as you can see,their Fast Attack Craft have to AA system,I think they only have some heavy machine guns or auto-cannons.

We also have 19 Fast Attack Craft,but 7 of them have RAM as CIWS. They are the Roussen class. 



Also,check this out:







So apparently not all 8 Gabya class ships have VLS systems installed yet.

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## Akritas

Foinikas said:


> @Akritas Check this out
> 
> These are the flaws of the Turkish Navy,that I had showed him a few months ago.
> 
> 6 out of 10 corvettes of the Turkish Navy have no AA systems and all 19 Fast Attack Craft lack an AA system.
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 850823
> 
> 
> View attachment 850821


Add also and this fact as regards the so called Ada Class Corvette: *the lack of any kind of anti-submarine suite!!!!*
Hellenic navy has set as a precondition the existence of two suites for its new corvettes: Kingklip Hull Mounted Sonar as well as the CAPTAS-2 Variable Depth Sonar.

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## Foinikas

Akritas said:


> Add also and this fact as regards the so called Ada Class Corvette: *the lack of any kind of anti-submarine suite!!!!*
> Hellenic navy has set as a precondition the existence of two suites for its new corvettes: Kingklip Hull Mounted Sonar as well as the CAPTAS-2 Variable Depth Sonar.



Bro,check my previous post too.

Another version of the Gowind HN.

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## Foinikas

Great news! Apparently,the Hellenic Army is interested in Spike SR/LR2! 









ΕΞΕΛΙΞΗ: Εξετάζονται οι αντιαρματικοί πύραυλοι SPIKE SR/LR2 από τον Ελληνικό Στρατό! - Πτήση & Διάστημα


Οι εξελίξεις στα θέματα των εξοπλισμών είναι μάλλον ταχύτερες από αυτές που μπορούμε να παρακολουθήσουμε. Πλήθος προγραμμάτων ωριμάζουν ταυτόχρονα, με τα στελέχη των Ενόπλων Δυνάμεων να ξενυχτούν προκειμένου να αντιμετωπίσουν τον έντονο φόρτο εργασίας. Ένα από τα πολλά προγράμματα που “τρέχουν”...




www.ptisidiastima.com





Now,I wish we buy drone dome to defend against the Turkish UAVs and UCAVs. And if not Iron Dome too,maybe a battery of Spyder or two.

@Adir-M @Beny Karachun 
​*The Lord is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge,
my shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.*
Psalms 18:2

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## Beny Karachun

Foinikas said:


> Great news! Apparently,the Hellenic Army is interested in Spike SR/LR2!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ΕΞΕΛΙΞΗ: Εξετάζονται οι αντιαρματικοί πύραυλοι SPIKE SR/LR2 από τον Ελληνικό Στρατό! - Πτήση & Διάστημα
> 
> 
> Οι εξελίξεις στα θέματα των εξοπλισμών είναι μάλλον ταχύτερες από αυτές που μπορούμε να παρακολουθήσουμε. Πλήθος προγραμμάτων ωριμάζουν ταυτόχρονα, με τα στελέχη των Ενόπλων Δυνάμεων να ξενυχτούν προκειμένου να αντιμετωπίσουν τον έντονο φόρτο εργασίας. Ένα από τα πολλά προγράμματα που “τρέχουν”...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ptisidiastima.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now,I wish we buy drone dome to defend against the Turkish UAVs and UCAVs. And if not Iron Dome too,maybe a battery of Spyder or two.
> 
> @Adir-M @Beny Karachun
> ​*The Lord is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
> my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge,
> my shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.*
> Psalms 18:2


Pretty much any military that respects itself bought the Spike missile in some form.

I doubt there would be a war between Greece and Turkey though

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## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> Pretty much any military that respects itself bought the Spike missile in some form.
> 
> I doubt there would be a war between Greece and Turkey though


Erdogan and his friends have been itching lately...they demand that we "demilitarize" the islands or they say "their sovereignty is up for discussion". It's the same trick,start trouble out of nowhere so that you might grab something out of negotiations and deals.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Each FDI has :32 Aster 30, 21 RAM and Super Rapid
> If the Turkish Navy has the naval power of a Arleigh Burke and the air superiority of a F-35, then you will defeat the Greek Navy, and one of the most powerful modern west anti-aircraft frigates.



Still day dreamer Greeks are sleeping
Even Ukraine used 2 NEPTUN land based anti-ship Missiles to sink Russian Navy MOSKVA Battle Cruiser

*32 ASTER and 21 RAM never can stop Turkish Missile Fire Power*


Turkiye has the best Missile Fire Power in Europe
even I am not talking about 600+ HARPOON , HARM and SLAM-ER Missiles


4 FDI Frigates will carry total of 212 SAMs
Turkiye has its own defense Industry to produce 500 anti-ship Missiles for swarm attack on all Greek Frigates ... and game over !

*Anti-ship Missiles ... from land-naval-air platforms*
-- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
-- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
-- 150 km CAKIR anti-ship Missile with IIR+RF seeker
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile with IIR seeker
-- 250 km ATMACA anti-ship Missile
-- 275 km SOM anti-ship Missile

so funny , F-35s can not do anything against land based anti-ship Missiles

only land based anti-ship Missiles will be enough to turn 4 FDI Frigates into crap of metal in a day


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> @Akritas Check this out
> 
> These are the flaws of the Turkish Navy,that I had showed him a few months ago.
> 
> 6 out of 10 corvettes of the Turkish Navy have no AA systems and all 19 Fast Attack Craft lack an AA system.



so funny , stop dreaming and wake up


We dont need to use 6 BURAK class Corvettes and 19 FACs ...

as of 2022 , Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates and 4 ADA class Corvettes armed with 756 air defense Missiles ... ( better fire power than Hellenic-French Navies combined )

on the other hand Hellenic Airforce has only 39 EXOCET anti-ship Missiles .... so pathetic


and Turkiye produce 20 new Warships to replace BURAK class Corvettes and old FACs

-- 10 new FACs ( 76mm gun , 21x RAM and 8x ATMACA anti-ship missiles )
-- 10 new OPVs ( 76mm gun , 8x HISAR SAMs and 8x ATMACA anti-ship missiles )


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Pretty much any military that respects itself bought the Spike missile in some form.




oil/gas reserves are not in the Aegean , but in the Eastern Mediterranean

and 40 km SPIKE Missile wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean .....so funny and so pathetic



French-İsraeli technologies are nothing to match with Turkish technology in the Eastern Mediterranean

*better worry about how to stop Turkish missiles from land-naval-air platforms*

also 250+ UCAVs and unmanned Vessels armed with superior missiles ( TRLG-230 , SOM , CAKIR and KUZGUN-TJ )


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Each FDI has :32 Aster 30, 21 RAM and Super Rapid
> If the Turkish Navy has the naval power of a Arleigh Burke and the air superiority of a F-35, then you will defeat the Greek Navy, and one of the most powerful modern west anti-aircraft frigates.



4 FDI Frigates ... 32 Aster 30, 21 RAM ... ( so funny )

4 FDI Frigates armed with total of 212 air defense missiles and 32 anti-ship missiles

on the other hand Turkish Navy 4 MEKO-200 Frigates , 4 ISTIF Frigates and 7 TF-2000 Destroyers armed with 1.632 air defense missiles and 240 anti-ship missiles



Ok lets go and lean about great fire power of upcoming Turkish Navy


*4 modernized MEKO-200 Frigates *
1 x 122 mm gun
64x ESSM air Defense Missiles
16x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
Torpedos






*4 ISTIF class Frigates*
1x 76mm gun
64x HISAR air Defense Missiles
16x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
Torpedos






*7 TF-2000 class Destroyers*
1 x 122mm gun
128x HISAR air Defense Missiles
32x SIPER air Defense Missiles
16x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS
Torpedos






*Also 4 ADA class Corvettes*
1x 76mm gun
21x RAM air Defense Missiles
8x HARPOON or ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
Torpedos






*10 HISAR class OPVs*
1 x 76mm gun
8x HISAR air Defense Missiles
8x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles
8x UMTAS Missiles
1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS






*10 new FACs*
1x 76mm gun
21x RAM air Defense Missiles
8x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles







also Drone super power Turkiye has started producing unmanned Vessels armed with Missiles and Torpedos

Greek Frigates will face with swarm attack of 150 km CAKIR anti-ship missiles from Turkish unmanned Vessels ... and game over






*Turkish UCAV war concept has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Air Defense Systems*

soon Naval war concept version ........


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We dont need to use 6 BURAK class Corvettes and 19 FACs ...


*Yes,but you use them! *








MMM-E said:


> as of 2022 , Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates and 4 ADA class Corvettes armed with 756 air defense Missiles ... ( better fire power than Hellenic-French Navies combined )


Now that's a fantasy! Check out the previous posts that prove this isn't the deal.



MMM-E said:


> on the other hand Hellenic Airforce has only 39 EXOCET anti-ship Missiles .... so pathetic



*I've got news for you! *

_The second contract will supply weaponry for six additional Rafale combat aircraft. This follows on from the contract signed in January 2021 for the weaponry for 18 Rafale aircraft. The additional six aircraft will be equipped with the same weapons package: the *Meteor *beyond visual range air-to-air missile, the *SCALP *cruise missile, the *MICA *multi-mission air-to-air missile, and the *AM39 Exocet *anti-ship missile._









MBDA signs two contracts with Greece for naval and air weaponry - Naval News


MBDA strengthens its close relationship with Greece’s armed forces with two contracts for armaments for the Hellenic Navy and Air Force.




www.navalnews.com







MMM-E said:


> and Turkiye produce 20 new Warships to replace BURAK class Corvettes and old FACs
> 
> -- 10 new FACs ( 76mm gun , 21x RAM and 8x ATMACA anti-ship missiles )
> -- 10 new OPVs ( 76mm gun , 8x HISAR SAMs and 8x ATMACA anti-ship missiles )



Future. Not present. 



MMM-E said:


> Still day dreamer Greeks are sleeping
> Even Ukraine used 2 NEPTUN land based anti-ship Missiles to sink Russian Navy MOSKVA Battle Cruiser


*Day-dreamer Turk* thinks Western technology is the same with Soviet/Russian technology.



MMM-E said:


> 4 FDI Frigates will carry total of 212 SAMs
> Turkiye has its own defense Industry to produce 500 anti-ship Missiles for swarm attack on all Greek Frigates ... and game over !


The "can" from "will" has a long distance between. 



MMM-E said:


> *Anti-ship Missiles ... from land-naval-air platforms*
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 supersonic Missile
> -- 150 km KGK-LR glide Bomb with IIR seeker
> -- 150 km CAKIR anti-ship Missile with IIR+RF seeker
> -- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile with IIR seeker
> -- 250 km ATMACA anti-ship Missile
> -- 275 km SOM anti-ship Missile










MMM-E said:


> so funny , F-35s can not do anything against land based anti-ship Missiles


It can bomb the launchers? 



MMM-E said:


> and 40 km SPIKE Missile wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean .....so funny and so pathetic



How many islands does Greece have? How many of them can be used as platforms to launch Spike missiles against the Turkish Navy? How many of them can be used as hideouts for Greek gunboats to attack the Turkish Navy? 



MMM-E said:


> French-İsraeli technologies are nothing to match with Turkish technology in the Eastern Mediterranean


Oh yes,I remember that one








MMM-E said:


> also 250+ UCAVs and unmanned Vessels armed with superior missiles ( TRLG-230 , SOM , CAKIR and KUZGUN-TJ )



Superior why? Who says they are superior?

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> So apparently not all 8 Gabya class ships have VLS systems installed yet.



You Greeks are so pathetic

what about Hellenic Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates ? only 16x Sea Sparrow SAMs

Turkish Navy 4 GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 x SM-1MR SAMs
and other 4 modernized Frigates armed with 36 x SM-1MR and 32x ESSM SAMs

Turkish Navy has more SAMs than Hellenic+French Navies combined .... lol





Akritas said:


> Add also and this fact as regards the so called Ada Class Corvette: *the lack of any kind of anti-submarine suite!!!!*



stop lying

4 Turkish ADA class Corvettes equipped with TBT-01 Sonar and 6 x MK-46 Torpedos

The ADA class is a class of anti-submarine Corvettes








Ada-class corvette - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Now that's a fantasy! Check out the previous posts that prove this isn't the deal.



Not fantasy but reality ..* stop lying day dreamer Greeks*


Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs

4 GABYA = 36x 4 = 144 SM-1MR
4 modernized GABYA = 36x 4 = 144 SM-1MR and 32x4 = 128 ESSM
2 MEKO-200 = 32x2 = 64 ESSM
2 MEKO-200 = 64x2 = 128 ESSM
4 MEKO 200 = 16x4 = 64 Sea Sparrow

also 4 ADA class Corvettes armed with total of 84 RAM air defense missiles


*what about pathetic Hellenic Navy ? so funny*

9 ELLI class Frigates = 16x9 = 144 Sea Sparrow
4 HYDRA Frigates = 16x4 = 64 ESSM


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> 4 FDI Frigates ... 32 Aster 30, 21 RAM ... ( so funny )
> 
> 4 FDI Frigates armed with total of 212 air defense missiles and 32 anti-ship missiles
> 
> on the other hand Turkish Navy 4 MEKO-200 Frigates , 4 ISTIF Frigates and 7 TF-2000 Destroyers armed with 1.632 air defense missiles and 240 anti-ship missiles


That entire post is useless,because

1.We still haven't decided if we'll be getting 4 FDI HN. So far we have signed for 3 with an option for 1 more.
2. The Hellenic Navy will not just be getting 3 FDI HN frigates,but also 4-5 corvettes or light frigates,depending on the deal that will be chosen.
3.Apart from the corvettes,there will be 2 or 4 of the MEKO 200 HN frigates to be modernized.
4. The vast majority of your comparison is about *future ships and not the current fleet. You don't even have the first Istanbul class frigate in active service yet,let alone the other three of them and TF-2000 is just a fantasy for now. *




MMM-E said:


> what about Hellenic Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates ? only 16x Sea Sparrow SAMs


2 of the Elli class Kortaener frigates,the Elli and Limnos,are armed with not just 16 Sea Sparrows,but also 2 Phalanx CIWS.
The rest have one Phalanx.



MMM-E said:


> and other 4 modernized Frigates armed with 36 x SM-1MR and 32x ESSM SAMs



The big question is: Do you have all these missiles to fill every ship? That's the question. Because if you have the capability,but not the missiles,then there's no point bragging about these ships. Also,are they certified? Because last time you fired one against a drone in Libya,it ended up on the Libyan shore.



MMM-E said:


> Turkish Navy has more SAMs than Hellenic+French Navies combined .... lol


Again,this is just theory. And you seem to be only taking theory into account. If you don't have enough missiles to use them,the right experience and ability to use a ship correctly,then you can have an Air Defence frigate and still get sunk.



MMM-E said:


> stop lying
> 
> 4 Turkish ADA class Corvettes equipped with TBT-01 Sonar and 6 x MK-46 Torpedos
> 
> The ADA class is a class of anti-submarine Corvettes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ada-class corvette - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org


He's not lying. You have 1 old Turkish sonar there and you're happy. ADA class are your newest ships in active service and yet still inferior in certain aspects.



MMM-E said:


> Not fantasy but reality .. stop lying
> 
> 
> Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs
> 
> 4 GABYA = 36x 4 = 144 SM-1MR
> 4 modernized GABYA = 36x 4 = 144 SM-1MR and 32x4 = 128 ESSM
> 2 MEKO-200 = 32x2 = 64 ESSM
> 2 MEKO-200 = 64x2 = 128 ESSM
> 4 MEKO 200 = 16x4 = 64 Sea Sparrow
> 
> also 4 ADA class Corvettes armed with total of 84 RAM air defense missiles
> 
> 
> *what about pathetic Hellenic Navy ? so funny*
> 
> 9 ELLI class Frigates = 16x9 = 144 Sea Sparrow
> 4 HYDRA Frigates = 16x4 = 64 ESSM


If honestly you think that SAMs are everything in naval warfare,then I suggest you just retire without saying a word and get back to posting Turkish products on Telemarketing.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> *Day-dreamer Turk* thinks Western technology is the same with Soviet/Russian technology.



Day dreamer Greek thinks old Greek Frigates is the same with Russian MOSKVA Battle Cruiser

even American PATRIOT System could not stop İran made Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in Saudi Arabia




Foinikas said:


> It can bomb the launchers?



only in your dreams .... it's impossible to find and to bomb dozens of mobile launchers 

btw even Greece has no F-35 
but Turkish KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet will make the first flight in 2023



Foinikas said:


> 1.We still haven't decided if we'll be getting 4 FDI HN. So far we have signed for 3 with an option for 1 more.
> 2. The Hellenic Navy will not just be getting 3 FDI HN frigates,but also 4-5 corvettes or light frigates,depending on the deal that will be chosen.
> 3.Apart from the corvettes,there will be 2 or 4 of the MEKO 200 HN frigates to be modernized.
> 4. The vast majority of your comparison is about *future ships and not the current fleet. You don't even have the first Istanbul class frigate in active service yet,let alone the other three of them and TF-2000 is just a fantasy for now.*



you Greeks are so pathetic

as of 2022 , Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates and 4 ADA class Corvettes far superior technology and fire power than pathetic Hellenic Navy


your future fantasy Hellenic Navy can not match with even current Turkish Navy

btw ISTANBUL Frigate will be in service by 2023
also Turkiye has started producing HISAR class OPVs and unmanned armed Vessels


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Superior why? Who says they are superior?



You are silly boy and dont change my words
no military knowledge .. only trolling and stupid posts from you







I said that Egypt bought FREMM Frigate from France armed with only 16x ASTER-15 SAMs

Greek Frigates also armed with only 16x SAMs

and 9 AKINCI UCAVs can fire 36x TRLG-230 supersonic missiles on Egyptian Navy FREEM Frigate or Greek Frigate for swarn attack and game over !


TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic missile


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Day dreamer Greek thinks old Greek Frigates is the same with Russian MOSKVA Battle Cruiser
> 
> even American PATRIOT System could not stop İran made Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in Saudi Arabia


In many cases they stopped them. Besides,you wanted Patriot too. Now that you have the S-400,you mock the Patriot and praise the Russian systems. 

It's the same thing that you did with the F-35s. When you were going to get F-35s,you used to praise them and make fun of Greece about it. After you got kicked out of the program,you started mocking it and saying that the F-35 is not a good aircraft and it's better that you're not getting it.



MMM-E said:


> btw even Greece has no F-35
> but Turkish KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet will make the first flight in 2023


*And Turkey doesn't have in active service or hasn't even produced yet more than half of what you've been posting about again and again! *




MMM-E said:


> your future fantasy Hellenic Navy can not match with even current Turkish Navy


You're throwing the word "future fantasy" a lot for a guy who keeps talking about future Turkish projects that are only theoretically superior.



MMM-E said:


> You are silly boy and dont change my words


Oh no,I'm not changing your words. You have used that same quote numerous times. That's why it's a meme.



MMM-E said:


> said that Egypt bought FREMM Frigate from France armed with only 16x ASTER-15 SAMs
> 
> Greek Frigates also armed with only 16x SAMs
> 
> and 9 AKINCI UCAVs can fire 36x TRLG-230 supersonic missiles on Egyptian Navy FREEM Frigate or Greek Frigate for swarn attack and game over !
> 
> 
> TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic missile


You must be complete naive,ignorant or just deluded to think that the Egyptian Air Force can't destroy your so-called "TRLG-230" launcher platforms,whether they are on the ground or on UCAVs. 

You know,Turkey is not the only one with an Air Force.

Egypt has an even bigger Air Force than you. Their dozens of Rafale,F-16s,Mirage 2000s,Mig-29s and Su-35s can protect the Egyptian Navy.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> 2 of the Elli class Kortaener frigates,the Elli and Limnos,are armed with not just 16 Sea Sparrows,but also 2 Phalanx CIWS.
> The rest have one Phalanx.



Ahahahaha

all Turkish Frigates armed with also CIWS

You tried to make fun of Turkish Navy GABYA class Frigates

better go and worry about pathetic Hellenic Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates only 16x Sea Sparrow

Turkish Navy
4 GABYA Frigates armed with 36x SM-1MR
4 modernized GABYA Frigates armed with 36x SM-1MR and 32x ESSM


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> It's the same thing that you did with the F-35s. When you were going to get F-35s,you used to praise them and make fun of Greece about it. After you got kicked out of the program,you started mocking it and saying that the F-35 is not a good aircraft and it's better that you're not getting it.



You always lying ... stop lying and be real man


I said that F-35s is not good for the Turkish Air Force

because F-35 is a flying computer and there are many problems between USA and Turkiye

in a war , Turkish F-35s even can not take off without American permission


read my thread about Turkish F-35 vs İsraeli F-35








Turkish F-35 vs Israeli F-35


Israel has a unique position in the project because it is the only country that is allowed to equip the F-35 with its avionics and software on the other hand Turkish Airforce F-35s always will be dependent on the US the F-35 like as a flying computer The internal programming of the F-35...



defence.pk


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You know,Turkey is not the only one with an Air Force.
> 
> Egypt has an even bigger Air Force than you. Their dozens of Rafale,F-16s,Mirage 2000s,Mig-29s and Su-35s can protect the Egyptian Navy




Turkish UCAVs will not attack on Egypt


I am talking about if Egypt send Navy to help Greece against Turkiye

the war will be near of Turkish EEZ , that means its our play zone

and Turkish 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs , 12 Submarines , land based anti-ship Missiles , S400 air defense systems and Turkish Airforce will block Turkish EZZ to enemy Forces

Turkiye created great A2/AD capability to protect Turkish EEZ

btw how to stop 250+ Turkish UCAVs ?

-- Egyptian Airforce has no large scale operation capability
-- Egyptian F-16s are so pathetic without BVR missile
-- Egyptian Rafales are also armed with only 60km MICA air to air missiles

Turkiye maybe can lose a few dozens of UCAVs ... but Egypt can lose all Fighter Jets which will be send to fight against Turkiye


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Ahahahaha
> 
> all Turkish Frigates armed with also CIWS
> 
> You tried to make fun of Turkish Navy GABYA class Frigates
> 
> better go and worry about pathetic Hellenic Navy 9 ELLI class Frigates only 16x Sea Sparrow
> 
> Turkish Navy
> 4 GABYA Frigates armed with 36x SM-1MR
> 4 modernized GABYA Frigates armed with 36x SM-1MR and 32x ESSM


So you can't debate my arguements and *what you do is turn back to the good old spamming of the same things.*


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> So you can't debate my arguements and *what you do is turn back to the good old spamming of the same things.*
> 
> View attachment 851039




again stupid post from you

you have no military knowledge to discuss with me

Reactions: Haha Haha:
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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You're throwing the word "future fantasy" a lot for a guy who keeps talking about future Turkish projects that are only theoretically superior.



not future , stop lying


current Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates and 4 ADA class Corvettes armed with 672+84 SAMs

on the other hand Hellenic Navy 13 Frigates armed with only 208 SAMs ... so pathetic


Hellenic Navy 208 SAMs never can stop Turkish Armed Forces missile power 1.000+ HARPOON , SOM , ATMACA , TRLG-230 , SLAM-ER , HARM


wake up day dreamer Greeks , its not 1996 , its 2022
Turkiye has developed its own defense industry to produce more hundreds of missiles


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> How many islands does Greece have? How many of them can be used as platforms to launch Spike missiles against the Turkish Navy? How many of them can be used as hideouts for Greek gunboats to attack the Turkish Navy?



Oil/gas reserves are in the Eastern Mediterranean 

and there are no Greek Islands in the Eastern Mediterranean 
that means 40 km SPIKE Missiles wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean

also Greece has no capability to use PATRIOT Air Defense Systems and Fighter Jets in the Eastern Mediterranean 

Eastern Mediterranean = Turkiye's play zone



btw even Turkiye doesnt need to use Warships in the Aegean to hunt Greek Warships
its not 1996 , its 2022

Turkiye will use far soficticated weapons to hunt Greek Warships in the Aegean

-- 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missiles ( land based version )
-- 150 km CAKIR and 250 km ATMACA land based anti-ship Missiles
-- Turkish UCAVs armed with 30 km MAM-T , 150 km CAKIR , 150 km TRLG-230 , 275 km SOM
-- and unmanned armed Vessels

also Turkiye produce STM-500 mini attack Submarines armed with AKYA heavy weight torpedos to change the game in the Aegean


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> - 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missiles ( land based version )
> -- 150 km CAKIR and 250 km ATMACA land based anti-ship Missiles
> -- Turkish UCAVs armed with 30 km MAM-T , 150 km CAKIR , 150 km TRLG-230 , 275 km SOM
> -- and unmanned armed Vessels


Here we go again...the record is spinning, the same song playing in a loop.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> He's not lying. You have 1 old Turkish sonar there and you're happy. ADA class are your newest ships in active service and yet still inferior in certain aspects.



You are still lying


Turkiye has developed 3 newest technology SONARs

ADA class Corvettes use YAKAMOS Sonar
ISTIF class Frigates use FERSAH Sonar


4 ADA Corvettes use state of the art Meteksan YAKAMOS Sonar


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You are still lying
> 
> 
> Turkiye has developed 3 newest technology SONARs
> 
> ADA class Corvettes use YAKAMOS Sonar
> ISTIF class Frigates use FERSAH Sonar
> 
> 
> 4 ADA Corvettes use state of the art Meteksan YAKAMOS Sonar
> View attachment 851048
> 
> View attachment 851047
> 
> View attachment 851045
> 
> View attachment 851046


Pathetic


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Here we go again...the record is spinning, the same song playing in a loop.



Daydreamer Greeks says we buys 40 km SPIKE Missile from Israel which wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean ..... so funny


on the other hand Turkish Missiles 

-- 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile ( land based version )
-- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile (air launched version )
-- 150 km CAKIR land-naval-air launched anti-ship Missile
-- 250 km ATMACA land-naval based anti-ship Missile
-- 275 km SOM air launched anti-ship Missile


70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missiles to hunt Greek Warships in the Aegean







Foinikas said:


> Pathetic



yes you and Hellenic Navy so pathetic


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> on the other hand Turkish Missiles
> 
> -- 70 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile ( land based version )
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile (air launched version )
> -- 150 km CAKIR land-naval-air launched anti-ship Missile
> -- 250 km ATMACA land-naval based anti-ship Missile
> -- 275 km SOM air launched anti-ship Missile


LOL it's like talking to a bot.


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> oil/gas reserves are not in the Aegean , but in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> and 40 km SPIKE Missile wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean .....so funny and so pathetic
> 
> 
> 
> French-İsraeli technologies are nothing to match with Turkish technology in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> *better worry about how to stop Turkish missiles from land-naval-air platforms*
> 
> also 250+ UCAVs and unmanned Vessels armed with superior missiles ( TRLG-230 , SOM , CAKIR and KUZGUN-TJ )


Spike is anti tank, it's not meant to stop ships larger than patrol boats.

French and Israeli technology are superior to Turkish


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> LOL it's like talking to a bot.



Ukraine used NEPTUN anti-ship Missile with warhead of 150kg to sink Russian Battle Cruiser MOSKVA

another Turkish anti-ship Missile 250km ATMACA with warhead of 250kg to turn Hellenic Navy into crap of metal


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Ukraine used NEPTUN anti-ship Missile with warhead of 150kg to sink Russian Battle Cruiser MOSKVA
> 
> another Turkish anti-ship Missile 250km ATMACA with warhead of 250kg to turn Hellenic Navy into crap of metal


You mentioned that in a previous post,I replied to you and you are posting the same example again.

You compare Soviet technology with Western modern technology? Russian CIWS had problems with bad radars and the Moskva carried the ship version of the OSA as medium-range AA system. They had the S-300F as a long-range AA system,but I don't know if it was used.

The question is what makes you think Turkish ships won't be destroyed in the same way by Exocet,Harpoon or Spike?


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Spike is anti tank, it's not meant to stop ships larger than patrol boats.
> 
> French and Israeli technology are superior to Turkish



LOL

Israel has no enough technology to match with Turkish Defense Industry
know your place tiny İsrael

Yes pathetic French technology SYLVER VLS without quad pack capability
Egypt bought French FREMM Frigate armed with only 16x SAMs .... so pathetic



Turkish Anti-Tank Missile OMTAS is extremely sophisticated​

From a NATO perspective the OMTAS remains a formidable weapon system; only France , USA and Turkiye have top attack ATGMs with similar characteristics.
The OMTAS is clearly superior to the FGM-148 Javelin in every aspect














Turkish Anti-Tank Missiles Are Extremely Sophisticated


The OMTAS is an ATGM with alternating guidance options. Via Roketsan. With the exception of the United States no other NATO ally is advancing its military-industrial sector as fast as Turkey. At th…




21stcenturyasianarmsrace.com


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> LOL
> 
> Israel has no enough technology to match with Turkish Defense Industry
> know your place tiny İsrael
> 
> Yes pathetic French technology SYLVER VLS without quad pack capability
> Egypt bought French FREMM Frigate armed with only 16x SAMs .... so pathetic
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish Anti-Tank Missile OMTAS is extremely sophisticated​
> 
> From a NATO perspective the OMTAS remains a formidable weapon system; only France , USA and Turkiye have top attack ATGMs with similar characteristics.
> The OMTAS is clearly superior to the FGM-148 Javelin in every aspect
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish Anti-Tank Missiles Are Extremely Sophisticated
> 
> 
> The OMTAS is an ATGM with alternating guidance options. Via Roketsan. With the exception of the United States no other NATO ally is advancing its military-industrial sector as fast as Turkey. At th…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 21stcenturyasianarmsrace.com


Israel's defense industry is bigger than the Turkish one with way more customers


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You compare Soviet technology with Western modern technology? Russian CIWS had problems with bad radars and the Moskva carried the ship version of the OSA as medium-range AA system. They had the S-300F as a long-range AA system,but I don't know if it was used.



what about western technology ?

as like pathetic PATRIOT Air Defense System which could not stop İranian made Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in Saudi Arabia





Foinikas said:


> The question is what makes you think Turkish ships won't be destroyed in the same way by Exocet,Harpoon or Spike?




Problem = Hellenic Navy 13 Frigates armed with 104 anti-ship Missiles to match with Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs

Problem = Hellenic Navy 13 Frigates armed with only 212 SAMs to match with the Turkish Armed Forces 1.000+ HARPOON , SLAM-ER , HARM , TRLG-230 , SOM and ATMACA

even I am not talking about upcoming Turkish missiles KUZGUN-TJ , CAKIR , KGK-LR , AKBABA and RAMJET powered supersonic anti-ship missile



*EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN*

-- Spike can not destroy Frigate and 40km SPIKE wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean
-- Greece can not use land based anti-ship Missile in the Eastern Mediterranean
-- Hellenic Airforce can not operate in the Eastern Mediterranean ,
if Turkiye use 144+48 S400 Air Defense Missiles and Turkish Airforce Fighter Jets and Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs


----------



## Michel Niesten

Yes yes Turkey Superpower. Turkey Strong. Turkey 70% Inflation.

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Israel's defense industry is bigger than the Turkish one with way more customers



Turkish Defense Industry far bigger than Israel's defense industry with way more products

Turkish Defense Industry has everything ..... but Israel's defense industry has NO everything


-- Israel has no industry to produce Corvette , Frigate , Destroyer , FAC , OPV , LHD , LST , Super Tanker , Submarines

-- Israel has no industry to produce Attack Helicopter , Utility Helicopter , Trainer and Fighter Jets

-- Israel has no industry to produce turbodiesel , turbojet , turboshaft and turbofan Engines

and many more


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> as like pathetic PATRIOT Air Defense System which could not stop İranian made Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in Saudi Arabia


We're just going in circles,it's ridiculous...

You mentioned this earlier as well. And I told you,some were shot down,some hit the targets. The Patriot system shot down a lot of missiles and drones. 

Besides,Greece doesn't only have Patriot systems. 

We also have I-HAWK PIP III,Tor-M1,Crotale NG,Skyguard VELOS,ASRAD HELLAS and the S-300PMU1.



MMM-E said:


> Problem = Hellenic Navy 13 Frigates armed with 104 anti-ship Missiles to match with Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs
> 
> Problem = Hellenic Navy 13 Frigates armed with only 212 SAMs to match with the Turkish Armed Forces 1.000+ HARPOON , SLAM-ER , HARM , TRLG-230 , SOM and ATMACA


Again,the same arguements and dumb mindset.

1.You think that naval warfare is about who's got more AA missiles
2.You talk as if Turkey will fire thousands of missiles at the same time,at the same place.



MMM-E said:


> -- Spike can not destroy Frigate and 40km SPIKE wont work in the Eastern Mediterranean
> -- Greece has no capability to use land based Cruise Missile in the Eastern Mediterranean
> -- Hellenic Airforce can not operate in the Eastern Mediterranean ,


Spike NLOS can be used from gunboats,missile launchers on vehicles or even some UAV 
Can you imagine some Spike NLOS at Kastellorizo or Cyprus?

We don't have to use a cruise missile in the East Mediterranean.

Hellenic Air Force can operate in the Eastern Mediterranean from Crete,Rhodes and even Cyprus.



MMM-E said:


> if Turkiye use 144+48 S400 Air Defense Missiles and Turkish Airforce Fighter Jets and Turkish Navy 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs


And if you had wheels on your legs,you'd be a skateboard 🙄


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You mentioned this earlier as well. And I told you,some were shot down,some hit the targets. The Patriot system shot down a lot of missiles and drones.



so what ?

Russian PANTSIR , BUK , S200 , S300 , S400 also shot down a lot of missiles and drones and Fighter Jet

even S-125 shot down American stealth F-117 in Serbia

stop underestimate Russian Air Defense capabilities


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Turkish Defense Industry far bigger than Israel's defense industry with way more products
> 
> Turkish Defense Industry has everything ..... but Israel's defense industry has NO everything
> 
> 
> -- Israel has no industry to produce Corvette , Frigate , Destroyer , FAC , OPV , LHD , LST , Super Tanker , Submarines
> 
> -- Israel has no industry to produce Attack Helicopter , Utility Helicopter , Trainer and Fighter Jets
> 
> -- Israel has no industry to produce turbodiesel , turbojet , turboshaft and turbofan Engines
> 
> and many more











Israel ranked as world's 10th biggest arms exporter







en.globes.co.il





I don't see Turkey on that list


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> so what ?
> 
> Russian PANTSIR , BUK , S200 , S300 , S400 also shot down a lot of missiles and drones and Fighter Jet
> 
> even S-125 shot down American stealth F-117 in Serbia
> 
> stop underestimate Russian Air Defense capabilities


You're the one who has been underestimating them ever since the TB2 😂 lol

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## KediKesenFare3

Stop opening threads like this one, you moronic troll.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> We also have I-HAWK PIP III,Tor-M1,Crotale NG,Skyguard VELOS,ASRAD HELLAS and the S-300PMU1.



They wont work to protect Hellenic Navy in the Eastern Mediterranean





Foinikas said:


> Again,the same arguements and dumb mindset.
> 
> 1.You think that naval warfare is about who's got more AA missiles
> 2.You talk as if Turkey will fire thousands of missiles at the same time,at the same place.



yes Again,the same arguements and dumb mindset from you

*1. .*You think that naval warfare is about Warships to Warships
Turkiye has land based anti-ship Missiles to turn Hellenic Navy into crap of metal in the Eastern Mediterranean ......... but Greece can not do it against the Turkish Navy

also Hellenic Airforce has only 39 EXOCET air launched anti-ship missiles
even 20 Turkish AKINCI and AKSUNGUR UCAVs to carry 80 TRLG-230 missiles

also hundreds of SOM and SLAM-ER air launched anti-ship missiles to be used by F-16s


*2.. * No need to fire 1.000 missiles at the same time

13 Greek Frigates armed with only 16x SAMs
to fire 30 missiles on each Frigate ........ and game over



Foinikas said:


> You're the one who has been underestimating them ever since the TB2 😂 lol



I never underestimate Russian Air Defense Systems
and I always said Turkish TB-2s destroyed most modern Russian SAMs

even outdated S-125 kicked American stealth F-117 in Serbia
even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria
most modern S400 easly can turn Greek F-16V and Rafales into crap of metal



KediKesenFare said:


> Stop opening threads like this one, you moronic troll.



stfu you fcking bastard
siktir git kodugumun uyuz iti
İsraile Yunana laf gelince nasılda damlıyor kodugumun capulcuları

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> They wont work to protect Hellenic Navy in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yes Again,the same arguements and dumb mindset from you
> 
> *1. .*You think that naval warfare is about Warships to Warships
> Turkiye has land based anti-ship Missiles to turn Hellenic Navy into crap of metal in the Eastern Mediterranean ......... but Greece can not do it against the Turkish Navy
> 
> also Hellenic Airforce has only 39 EXOCET air launched anti-ship missiles
> even 20 Turkish AKINCI and AKSUNGUR UCAVs to carry 80 TRLG-230 missiles
> 
> also hundreds of SOM and SLAM-ER air launched anti-ship missiles to be used by F-16s
> 
> 
> *2.. * No need to fire 1.000 missiles at the same time
> 
> 13 Greek Frigates armed with only 16x SAMs
> to fire 30 missiles on each Frigate ........ and game over



Ok,Turkey has ships,Air Force,AA systems,missiles. Nobody else has any of that. 

The rest of the world only has peasants armed with spears and swords.

Well done Turkey,you are superpower! Best country in the world.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Israel ranked as world's 10th biggest arms exporter
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.globes.co.il
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't see Turkey on that list



and I dont see İsraeli Corvette , Frigate , Destroyer , FAC , OPV , LHD , LST , Super Tanker , Submarines , Attack Helicopter , Utility Helicopter , Trainer and Fighter Jets , turbodiesel , turbojet , turboshaft and turbofan Engines and many more



Foinikas said:


> Ok,Turkey has ships,Air Force,AA systems,missiles. Nobody else has any of that.
> 
> The rest of the world only has peasants armed with spears and swords.
> 
> Well done Turkey,you are superpower! Best country in the world.
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 851079




another stupid post from you

Reactions: Haha Haha:
1


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> and I dont see İsraeli Corvette , Frigate , Destroyer , FAC , OPV , LHD , LST , Super Tanker , Submarines , Attack Helicopter , Utility Helicopter , Trainer and Fighter Jets , turbodiesel , turbojet , turboshaft and turbofan Engines and many more


You build stuff no one buys, we build stuff we can sell and profit, and buy what we need, fit to our purpose.

We don't need to build frigates and destroyers, those are big, bulky and have no advantage over Israeli Saar 6 and Saar 5 corvettes in naval combat, even the huge 11,000 tons Moskva missile cruiser, protected by S-300F and OSA missiles was easily sunk by two anti ship missiles. In the end what's important is :

electronic warfare (Which even the British, renowned for their navy, are using: https://elbitsystems.com/pr-new/elb...ronic-warfare-capabilities-to-the-royal-navy/)

Radar (MF-STAR)

missile interceptors (Barak 8 which shot down 2 Iskander missiles in Azerbaijan and Iron Dome with the most interceptions and highest interception rate ever) 

And anti ship missiles (Gabriel V, Blue Spear, used by Israel, Singapore, Finland, Estonia with 400+ km range) all of which Israel is superior at. 

We can build Corvettes, Saar 72 and Saar 62 for example. But they're only for export. But we can buy German corvettes and submarines in a massive discount, making it not worth for us to build them for IDF use. 

About engines, we design them and sell the licenses for them, this is usually the business model of many Israeli companies (selling software, designs, patents or the company itself, as we call it an "exit", as opposed to manufacturing) as Israel is already small with very low unemployment rate.
Here is one example: 








A little startup that could: Aquarius builds an engine others only dreamed of


***




www.haaretz.com












Aquarius Engines says it developed new Hydrogen engine model


The company's findings were confirmed in third-party tests conducted by Austrian engineering firm AVL-Schrick, the company added.




www.jpost.com






You can build a turbojet engine but we have F-35s (Which we build the wings and advanced helmet for) and you don't, so who won?

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## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> You build stuff no one buys, we build stuff we can sell and profit, and buy what we need, fit to our purpose.
> 
> We don't need to build frigates and destroyers, those are big, bulky and have no advantage over Israeli Saar 6 and Saar 5 corvettes in naval combat, even the huge 11,000 tons Moskva missile cruiser, protected by S-300F and OSA missiles was easily sunk by two anti ship missiles. In the end what's important is :
> 
> electronic warfare (Which even the British, renowned for their navy, are using: https://elbitsystems.com/pr-new/elb...ronic-warfare-capabilities-to-the-royal-navy/)
> 
> Radar (MF-STAR)
> 
> missile interceptors (Barak 8 which shot down 2 Iskander missiles in Azerbaijan and Iron Dome with the most interceptions and highest interception rate ever)
> 
> And anti ship missiles (Gabriel V, Blue Spear, used by Israel, Singapore, Finland, Estonia with 400+ km range) all of which Israel is superior at.
> 
> We can build Corvettes, Saar 72 and Saar 62 for example. But they're only for export. But we can buy German corvettes and submarines in a massive discount, making it not worth for us to build them for IDF use.
> 
> About engines, we design them and sell the licenses for them, this is usually the business model of many Israeli companies (selling software, designs, patents or the company itself, as we call it an "exit", as opposed to manufacturing) as Israel is already small with very low unemployment rate.
> Here is one example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A little startup that could: Aquarius builds an engine others only dreamed of
> 
> 
> ***
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.haaretz.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aquarius Engines says it developed new Hydrogen engine model
> 
> 
> The company's findings were confirmed in third-party tests conducted by Austrian engineering firm AVL-Schrick, the company added.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.jpost.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can build a turbojet engine but we have F-35s (Which we build the wings and advanced helmet for) and you don't, so who won?


Remind him that it was Israeli UAVs that inspired Turkey to start making UAVs and UCAVs. 

He also doesn't know that Israel has little need for a navy because of the relatively small area the Israeli State has to cover at sea and no islands. Besides,anyone trying to invade Israel from the sea,will be met with dozens of anti-ship missiles and the Israeli Air Force.

If Turkey has developed Turbofan engines,why haven't they built the TFX and Mius yet? 

Currently,Iron Dome,Spyder,David's Sling along with...what else do you guys have? Patriot? All that are technologically superior to Turkish Air Defence systems and battle tested. 

Ze ze yom hadin
tzahal shuv makeh bachem

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> You build stuff no one buys, we build stuff we can sell and profit, and buy what we need, fit to our purpose.



Turkiye sells UCAVs like hot cake

Nobody wants İsraeli trash HERON
but many Countries including NATO Members buys Turkish UCAVs to hunt Russian military hardware

Turkiye sold AFVs , light Tank , MLRS , Missiles , Targeting Pods , Radars , EW Systems , Attack Helicopters , Corvettes , Warships , Tankers , Naval Platforms and many more

Turkish Defense Industry exported 228 products to 170 Countries​








Turkish Defense Industry exported 228 products to 170 Countries


The Turkish defense industry has exported 228 products to 170 countries in several geographies within the past ten years, Presidency of Defense Industries (SSB) Chairperson Ismail Demir said on Saturday While only 62 defense projects were carried out nearly 20 years ago, today this number has...



defence.pk







Beny Karachun said:


> We don't need to build frigates and destroyers, those are big, bulky and have no advantage over Israeli Saar 6 and Saar 5 corvettes in naval combat, even the huge 11,000 tons Moskva missile cruiser, protected by S-300F and OSA missiles was easily sunk by two anti ship missiles. In the end what's important is :



so pathetic excuse

full of American,French,German technologies from JERICO Ballistic Missiles to nuclear , from Air Defense Systems to Corvettes


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Remind him that it was Israeli UAVs that inspired Turkey to start making UAVs and UCAVs.



Turkish UCAV technology is nothing to do with trash Israeli Heron

but Israeli Air Defense Systems have been developed by American helping
Boeing , Raytheon


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye sells UCAVs like hot cake
> 
> Nobody wants İsraeli trash HERON
> but many Countries including NATO Members buys Turkish UCAVs to hunt Russian military hardware
> 
> Turkiye sold AFVs , light Tank , MLRS , Missiles , Targeting Pods , Radars , EW Systems , Attack Helicopters , Corvettes , Warships , Tankers , Naval Platforms and many more
> 
> Turkish Defense Industry exported 228 products to 170 Countries​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish Defense Industry exported 228 products to 170 Countries
> 
> 
> The Turkish defense industry has exported 228 products to 170 countries in several geographies within the past ten years, Presidency of Defense Industries (SSB) Chairperson Ismail Demir said on Saturday While only 62 defense projects were carried out nearly 20 years ago, today this number has...
> 
> 
> 
> defence.pk


Hermes 900:





Hermes 450:





Harop:





Skylark:





Uvision suicide drones users: Israel and US, and soon many IFVs will use them








US Marine Corps to buy UVision Hero-120 loitering munition


The US Marine Corps plans to acquire an undisclosed number of UVision Hero-120 loitering munitions to be mounted and launched from two types of armoured ground vehicles and an autonomous boat.




www.flightglobal.com





Heron:





Eitan drone:


----------



## Attila the Hun

MMM-E said:


> Turkish UCAV technology is nothing to do with trash Israeli Heron
> 
> but Israeli Air Defense Systems have been developed by American helping
> Boeing , Raytheon


Stop these pointless troll threads. and if you're going to troll do it right.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Hermes 900:
> View attachment 851159
> 
> Hermes 450:
> View attachment 851160
> 
> 
> Harop:
> View attachment 851162
> 
> 
> Skylark:
> View attachment 851164
> 
> 
> Uvision suicide drones users: Israel and US, and soon many IFVs will use them
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> US Marine Corps to buy UVision Hero-120 loitering munition
> 
> 
> The US Marine Corps plans to acquire an undisclosed number of UVision Hero-120 loitering munitions to be mounted and launched from two types of armoured ground vehicles and an autonomous boat.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.flightglobal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Heron:
> View attachment 851166
> 
> 
> Eitan drone:
> 
> View attachment 851167




Not İsraeli HERON , HERMES-900/450 , but Turkish TB-2 UCAVs hunted Russian military hardware in Syria,Azerbaijan,Libya and Ukraine

Turkiye sells TB-2 UCAVs like hot cake
Nobody wants İsraeli UCAVs .... your time is over


not Israel , but Turkiye has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,AFVs,MLRS,Air Defense Systems by UCAVs



Attila the Hun said:


> Stop these pointless troll threads. and if you're going to troll do it right.



another jewish cock sucker


----------



## Attila the Hun

MMM-E said:


> Not trash İsraeli HERON , HERMES-900/450 , but Turkish TB-2 UCAVs hunted Russian military hardware in Syria,Azerbaijan,Libya and Ukraine
> 
> Turkiye sells TB-2 UCAVs like hot cake
> Nobody wants İsraeli UCAVs .... your time is over
> 
> 
> not Israel , but Turkiye has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,AFVs,MLRS,Air Defense Systems by UCAVs
> 
> 
> 
> another jewish cock sucker


I am Turkish. You are the Jew here. lmao

Stop all this Jewish troll threads, you friggin kikes


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> You can build a turbojet engine but we have F-35s (Which we build the wings and advanced helmet for) and you don't, so who won?



HELMET ? so funny

Turkiye has TAI to produce most critical part of F-35 ( fuselage )

Turkiye has KALE-AERO to produce most critical parts of F-35's engine

Turkiye has ASELSAN for everything from HELMET to AESA Radar , from EW suite to E/O Systems and targeting pod for the TFX project

and Turkiye will win in near future with over 750 military projects



USA blocked sale of UCAVs to Turkiye
and Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with its own UCAVs TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI

Sooner or later Turkiye will also become Stealth Fighter Jet power in the world





Turkiye develops its own KIZILELMA and TFX projects

*KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet*
first flight : 2023
in service : 2025

Endurance : 5 Hours
Service ceiling : 40,000 ft
Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
Payload : 1.5 Tons

-- AESA radar and next-generation avionics, sensor fusion
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
-- Turbofan engine









*The KIZILELMA will be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets*

stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Not trash İsraeli HERON , HERMES-450 , but Turkish TB-2 UCAVs hunted Russian military hardware in Syria,Azerbaijan,Libya and Ukraine
> 
> Turkiye sells TB-2 UCAVs like hot cake
> Nobody wants İsraeli UCAVs .... your time is over


Lol, Harop drones hunted Russian military hardware as well, S-300 and TOR-M2 were engaged only with HAROP

Ukraine doesn't operate Israeli drones because of Israel's geopolitical issues with Russia.

TB-2 has no advantage over other drones, in fact it's worse in every aspect, countries only buy it as a cheap alternative to better drones. You'll never see a first rate country buy Turkish weapons/drones, only 3rd world countries. 


MMM-E said:


> HELMET ? so funny
> 
> Turkiye has TAI to produce most critical part of F-35 ( fuselage )
> 
> Turkiye has KALE-AERO to produce most critical parts of F-35's engine
> 
> Turkiye has ASELSAN for everything from HELMET to AESA Radar , from EW suite to E/O Systems and targeting pod for the TFX project
> 
> and Turkiye will win in near future with over 750 military projects
> 
> 
> 
> USA blocked sale of UCAVs to Turkiye
> and Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with its own UCAVs TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI
> 
> Sooner or later Turkiye will also become Stealth Fighter Jet power in the world
> View attachment 851173
> 
> 
> Turkiye develops its own KIZILELMA and TFX projects
> 
> *KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet*
> first flight : 2023
> in service : 2025
> 
> Endurance : 5 Hours
> Service ceiling : 40,000 ft
> Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
> Payload : 1.5 Tons
> 
> -- AESA radar and next-generation avionics, sensor fusion
> -- Internal weapon stations
> -- Stealth flight capability
> -- The ability to hide from Radars
> -- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
> -- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
> -- Turbofan engine
> View attachment 851174
> 
> View attachment 851175
> 
> 
> *The KIZILELMA will be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets*
> 
> stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat


The Helmet is arguably the most complicated piece of technology to make, it has to be integrated with every part of the jet.







As for the rest of your post, don't count your chickens before they hatch out of their egg, I remember you saying "Turkey will have 100 F-35s, Israel will have 50 F-35s"


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> so pathetic excuse
> 
> full of American,French,German technologies from JERICO Ballistic Missiles to nuclear , from Air Defense Systems to Corvettes


Lol, face it, only 3rd world countries buy Turkish complete weapon systems. Israeli weapons are better, more advanced, and that's why everyone works with us to develop weapons and that's why everyone wants our weapons.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Lol, Harop drones hunted Russian military hardware as well, S-300 and TOR-M2 were engaged only with HAROP
> 
> Ukraine doesn't operate Israeli drones because of Israel's geopolitical issues with Russia.



HAROP is a Kamikaze Drone , not UCAV

Turkish TB-2 UCAVs also destroyed Russian AD Systems PANTSIR , TOR , BUK , OSA


and Israeli UCAVs HERON , HERMES wont work ... no any success to destroy Air Defense Systems

but Azerbaijan used Turkish and İsraeli technologies to destroy Armenian military targets


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> TB-2 has no advantage over other drones, in fact it's worse in every aspect, countries only buy it as a cheap alternative to better drones. You'll never see a first rate country buy Turkish weapons/drones, only 3rd world countries.



You are so pathetic ..

trash İsraeli UCAVs have no any success to destroy Air Defense Systems,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS


We have seen trash İsraeli technology on HERONs 
and Turkiye replaced İsraeli E/O System with Turkish Aselsan E/O System
trash İsraeli HERON sucks in bad weather


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish UCAV technology is nothing to do with trash Israeli Heron
> 
> but Israeli Air Defense Systems have been developed by American helping
> Boeing , Raytheon


Trash Heron? Harop? Harpy? 

Lol you're ignorant.Go back to telemarketing.



MMM-E said:


> trash İsraeli UCAVs have no any success to destroy Air Defense Systems,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS


NKR war. Azerbaijan had Israeli UCAVs. Learn history. Pathetic pathetic.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Lol, face it, only 3rd world countries buy Turkish complete weapon systems. Israeli weapons are better, more advanced, and that's why everyone works with us to develop weapons and that's why everyone wants our weapons.



LOL you compare tiny Israel with Turkiye ... know your place

Everyone USA,France,Germany helped Israel to develop many things from JERICO Ballistic Missiles to Nuclear , from Air Defense Systems to Corvettes

İsrael is only ahead Turkiye in AD Systems ... thanks to American Boeing and Raytheon



OMTAS Missile is superior to American JAVELIN and ISRAELI SPIKE
SOM air launched Cruise Missile is superior to Israeli POPEYE and DELILAH

Israel has no its own Attack Helicopter protect
Israel has no its own Utility project
Israel has no its own Trainer and light attack Jet project
Israel has no its own unmanned stealth Fighter Jet project
Israel has no its own stealth Fighter Jet project
Israel has no its own Corvette project
Israel has no its own Frigate project
Israel has no its own Destroyer project
Israel has no its own Submarine project
Israel has no its own LST , LHD , Aircraft Carrier project
Israel has no its own turbojet , turbofan , turboshaft engine technologies
and many more



Pakistan , Indonesia , Malesia , Poland , The UAE , Qatar , S.Arabia , Algeria , Ukraine have strong militaries and bought Turkish weapons

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> You are so pathetic ..
> 
> trash İsraeli UCAVs have no any success to destroy Air Defense Systems,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS
> 
> 
> We have seen trash İsraeli technology on HERONs
> and Turkiye replaced İsraeli E/O System with Turkish Aselsan E/O System
> trash İsraeli HERON sucks in bad weather
> View attachment 851200


Your Heron is from 1994 and haven't been upgraded since, how can you compare between the two?

Israeli drones destroyed many air defense systems but Israel doesn't allow to publish footage because it violates the MTCR









Israeli Industry Pushing Jerusalem To Drop MTCR Drone Export Restrictions - Breaking Defense


"We cannot play according to these rules anymore, when everybody else just goes wild," an Israeli industry source said.




breakingdefense-com.cdn.ampproject.org


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> stop lying
> 
> 4 Turkish ADA class Corvettes equipped with TBT-01 Sonar and 6 x MK-46 Torpedos
> 
> The ADA class is a class of anti-submarine Corvettes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ada-class corvette - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org


You know a lot of ASW ships with the lack of VDS sonar such as the turkish ship?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Trash Heron? Harop? Harpy?
> 
> Lol you're ignorant.Go back to telemarketing.



HAROP and HARPY are not UCAV .... but Kamikaze Drone

Yes trash HERON and HERMES

You are real ignorant here

not Israel , but Turkiye has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,AFVs,MLRS,Air Defense Systems by UCAVs




and its real war machine

*Baykar AKINCI UCAV*

Turkish AKINCI UCAVs to wipe out enemy Navy , Air Defense Systems , Attack Helicopters , Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS etc

thanks to Turkish Defense Industry to arm AKINCI UCAVs with

-- 280 km SOM-C anti ship missile to hit even moving Warships
-- 280 km SOM-B Cruise Missiles to hit Air Defense Systems like PATRIOT , S300 , etc
-- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ missile with IIR seeker to hit Air Defense Systems like PATRIOT , S300 , PANTSIR,TOR-M2 and BUK
-- 150+ km CAKIR Cruise Missile with IIR+RF seeker to hit even moving targets
-- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic missile to hit even moving targets
-- 65 km GOKDOGAN and 25 km BOZDOGAN air to air missiles to hit Attack Helicopters or UCAVs
-- 12 km UMTAS anti Tank Missile with top attack capability to destroy Tanks

Length : 12,3 m
Height : 4,1 m
Wingspan : 20 m
MTOW : 5.500 kg
Max speed : 360 km/h
Combat range : 2.000+ km
Payload : 1350 kg
Endurance : 24 hours
Service ceiling : 40.000 feet

-- AESA Radar
-- SATCOM
-- Electronic Data Gathering ( ELINT / COMINT )
-- 6 multi-core Artificial Intelligence Computers

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> HAROP and HARPY are not UCAV .... but Kamikaze Drone
> 
> Yes trash HERON and HERMES
> 
> You are real ignorant here
> 
> not Israel , but Turkiye has put forward a "new military doctrine" in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,AFVs,MLRS,Air Defense Systems by UCAVs


Yes they are Loiter Munitions and yes you can call them UCAVs too. And they are pretty darn good.

Turkey didn't put forward a new military doctrine,it had existed for more than a decade. It just hadn't been used in such a wide scale earlier against such armies. It was mainly used against small insurgent groups in Iraq,Afghanistan,Gaza and elsewhere.

Pathetic MMM-E with his ignorant information. Patetic Patetic.



MMM-E said:


> thanks to Turkish Defense Industry to arm AKINCI UCAVs with
> 
> -- 280 km SOM-C anti ship missile to hit even moving Warships
> -- 280 km SOM-B Cruise Missiles to hit Air Defense Systems like PATRIOT , S300 , etc
> -- 250 km KUZGUN-TJ missile with IIR seeker to hit Air Defense Systems like PATRIOT , S300 , PANTSIR,TOR-M2 and BUK
> -- 150+ km CAKIR Cruise Missile with IIR+RF seeker to hit even moving targets
> -- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic missile to hit even moving targets
> -- 65 km GOKDOGAN and 25 km BOZDOGAN air to air missiles to hit Attack Helicopters or UCAVs
> -- 12 km UMTAS anti Tank Missile with top attack capability to destroy Tanks








MMM-E psychological warfare: Post the same bull 100,000 times and see everybody agree with you because they're tired of arguing with a dumbass.


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> You know a lot of ASW ships with the lack of VDS sonar such as the turkish ship?




another ignorant user .... if you know nothing about Turkish defense industry then educate yourself


4 Turkish ADA class Corvettes use state of the art Meteksan YAKAMOS Sonar

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Turkey didn't put forward a new military doctrine,it had existed for more than a decade. It just hadn't been used in such a wide scale earlier against such armies. It was mainly used against small insurgent groups in Iraq,Afghanistan,Gaza and elsewhere.



so funny

you are talking about small terrorist groups without AD System
and USA used UCAVs not to destroy AD Systems,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,etc

I am talking about real Armies which used most modern Russian AD Systems in Syria , Libya ,Azerbaijan and Ukraine


so Turkeiye has put forward a new military doctrine to use UCAVs for destroying enemy AD Systems,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,etc

Bayraktar TB-2 and ANKA-S UCAVs are intended to be used as close air support

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> As for the rest of your post, don't count your chickens before they hatch out of their egg, I remember you saying "Turkey will have 100 F-35s, Israel will have 50 F-35s"



and I remember you in 2013 on youtube with same username

You said that Turkiye can not develop UCAVs

RESULT = Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with its own UCAVs TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI


and *KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet *is coming to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets

stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> and I remember you in 2013 on youtube with same username
> 
> You said that Turkiye can not develop UCAVs
> 
> RESULT = Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with its own UCAVs TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI
> 
> 
> and *KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet *is coming to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets
> 
> stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat
> View attachment 851239


I said Israeli drones are better, I remember comparing stats with you. So long ago lol.

You're that DenPro guy, no?

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> The Helmet is arguably the most complicated piece of technology to make, it has to be integrated with every part of the jet.



still dreaming with HELMET .. lol

Turkiye develops the TFX Fighter Jet with turbofan Engine
and Aselsan also develops next gen HELMET to use by Turkish Fighter Jet Pilots

also Its Turkish Aselsan advanced HELMET for Attack Helicopters











Beny Karachun said:


> I said Israeli drones are better, I remember comparing stats with you. So long ago lol.
> 
> You're that DenPro guy, no?



yeah denpro

in 2013 you said Turkiye can not develop UCAVs and you called me daydreamer

also in 2016 you said Israeli UCAVs are better than Turkish ANKA


and now 2022 ,
Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world
Turkish AKINCI UCAV become better than all Israeli UCAVs and American MQ-9

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> another ignorant user .... if you know nothing about Turkish defense industry then educate yourself
> 
> 4 Turkish ADA class Corvettes use state of the art Meteksan YAKAMOS Sonar


The question was not answered!!
I repeat it : *You know a lot of ASW ships with the lack of VDS sonar such as the turkish ship?*

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## Dalit

MMM-E said:


> still dreaming with HELMET .. lol
> 
> Turkiye develops the TFX Fighter Jet with turbofan Engine
> and Aselsan also develops next gen HELMET to use by Turkish Fighter Jet Pilots
> 
> also Its Turkish Aselsan advanced HELMET for Attack Helicopters
> View attachment 851241
> 
> View attachment 851245
> 
> 
> 
> 
> yeah denpro
> 
> in 2013 you said Turkiye can not develop UCAVs and you called me daydreamer
> 
> also in 2016 you said Israeli UCAVs are better than Turkish ANKA
> 
> 
> and now 2022 ,
> Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world
> Turkish AKINCI UCAV become better than all Israeli UCAVs and American MQ-9



Turkish defence industry today rivals Western counterparts. Needless to go through each and every achievement. I am in no doubt that the Turks will field a homegrown 5th gen fighter. Turkiye is on path of self-sufficiency in many areas and that is excellent news for their armed forces. The fact that Turkiye also exports many weaponry to other nations is enough indication where Turkiye stands today.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> The question was not answered!!
> I repeat it : *You know a lot of ASW ships with the lack of VDS sonar such as the turkish ship?*



Turkish ADA class Corvettes use YAKAMOS hull mounted Sonar for anti-submarine warfare, submarine warfare, mine warfare and torpedo defence


also Turkish Aselsan HIZIR LFAS towed Sonar for Turkish Warships

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet


So first you started developing TFX,then MIUS,now Karsilama...all the while you have 73,5% inflation. 

What's wrong with MIUS that you have to develop Karsilama? 😂



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye develops the TFX Fighter Jet with turbofan Engine
> and Aselsan also develops next gen HELMET to use by Turkish Fighter Jet Pilots


Is that why you desperately try to get the British to help you develop the engine? 

You couldn't make a tank engine for Altay,now you're telling me you're making turbofan?



MMM-E said:


> stealth KIZILELMA can detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 ,F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and game over in BVR combat


With what?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> So first you started developing TFX,then MIUS,now Karsilama...all the while you have 73,5% inflation.
> 
> What's wrong with MIUS that you have to develop Karsilama? 😂



MIUS = KIZILELMA

same project





Foinikas said:


> Is that why you desperately try to get the British to help you develop the engine?
> 
> You couldn't make a tank engine for Altay,now you're telling me you're making turbofan?



Tank Engine is different technology ... and who told you Turkiye can not make Tank engine ?

Turkiye has started developing Tank Engine ... but needs more time to finish development








Turkiye has developed TS-1400 gas turbine turboshaft Engine for Helicopters ... ( only a few countries in the world )






and if RR helps Turkiye , then turbofan engine will be developed in short time instead of 12 years

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> With what?



with Aselsan AESA Radar by 2023

also with data link for cooperative engagement capability to use 600 km EIRS early warning AESA Radar and 450 km CAFRAD naval AESA Radar also 600km E-7T AEWC to detect F-16V ,Rafale or F-15 , SU-35 and to guide Turkish air to air missiles on enemy Fighter Jets in BVR combat



With Turkish air to air missiles GOKDOGAN and BOZDOGAN
















also in 2022 we will see the first prototype of Turkish RAMJET for GOKHAN long range air to air missile which will have superior range to compare with METEOR Missile

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> with Aselsan AESA Radar by 2023
> 
> also with data link for cooperative engagement capability to use 600 km EIRS early warning AESA Radar and 450 km CAFRAD naval AESA Radar also 600km E-7T AEWC to detect F-16V ,Rafale or F-15 , SU-35 and to guide Turkish air to air missiles on enemy Fighter Jets in BVR combat
> 
> 
> 
> With Turkish air to air missiles GOKDOGAN and BOZDOGAN
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 851261
> 
> 
> 
> also in 2022 we will see the first prototype of Turkish RAMJET for GOKHAN long range air to air missile which will have superior range to compare with METEOR Missile


How much is Aselsan paying you?



MMM-E said:


> Tank Engine is different technology ... and who told you Turkiye can not make Tank engine ?


Well the fact that you kept asking the Germans to make the engine,then the South Koreans. It took more than a decade to decide.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> How much is Aselsan paying you?



PDF is military forum for discuss

discuss like a real man or stop trolling


you said with what and I said with Aselsan

my posts hurts anti-Turkiye guys

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> PDF is military forum for discuss
> 
> discuss like a real man or stop trolling
> 
> 
> you said with what and I said with Aselsan
> 
> my posts hurts anti-Turkiye guys


Come on,seriously,how much? I'm curious.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Well the fact that you kept asking the Germans to make the engine,then the South Koreans. It took more than a decade to decide.



Germany and Austria cancelled to work with Turkiye to develop Tank Engine

Turkiye will use S.Korean Engine to produce ALTAY Tanks
( since 2018 ALTAY Tank is ready for mass production )

and BMC Power has started developing indigenous Tank Engine ...

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Germany and Austria cancelled to work with Turkiye to develop Tank Engine
> 
> Turkiye will use S.Korean Engine to produce ALTAY Tanks
> ( since 2018 ALTAY Tank is ready for mass production )
> 
> and BMC Power has started developing indigenous Tank Engine ...


Do you have specifications for the armor?


----------



## retaxis

Can't make a tank engine but talking about making indigenous 6th gen fighters? Sounds like lunacy.

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## MMM-E

all Greek Air bases , Jet hangars , Air Defense Systems will be destroyed by the Turkish Armed Forces ( 1.000+ ATACMS , J600T , BORA , POPEYE , SLAM-ER , SOM , HARM , KARA-ATMACA , HARPOON blockII Missiles )



*Turkish BORA Tactical Balistic Missile hit target located 280 km away with point precision ( below 1m )*

Warhead = 470 kg
Speed : mach 3+

*















Greece has PATRIOT Air Defense Systems ( 36 launchers / 325 missiles )*

Turkiye produce more 415 SOM air launched Cruise Missiles

Warhead : 230 kg
Speed : mach 0,95
Range : 280 km












*
İn 1996 , there was no any Turkish Missile , now 325 PATRIOT Missiles can not stop Turkish Armed Forces missile power*

--

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## MMM-E

*Europe's first surface to surface Cruise Missile *



KARA-ATMACA is a jamming-resistant Cruise Missile system launched on tactical wheeled vehicles and used against strategical land targets by the Turkish Army

Weight : 890 kg
Range :280 km
Warhead : 250 kg
Guidance : INS + GPS + Barometric Altimeter + Radar Altimeter + TRN
Seeker : IIR
Datalink
















*To hit PATRIOT Air Defense Systems installed near Athens, Thessaloniki and on the island of Skyros*

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *To hit PATRIOT Air Defense Systems installed near Athens, Thessaloniki and on the island of Skyros*


See @retaxis this is Turkish aggression.

Always dreaming about wars and expansion. So sad. AKP and Bahceli want to establish a "Greater Turkey". 

Like you said,can't make a tank,want to make a 6th generation fighter and have 73,5% inflation.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> See @retaxis this is Turkish aggression.
> 
> Always dreaming about wars and expansion. So sad. AKP and Bahceli want to establish a "Greater Turkey".




Erdogan and Bahceli are kicking bandit countries USA,France and their puppets/terrorists FETO , PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , Armenia , Greece in İraq,Syria,Libya and in the Eastern mediterranean to protect Turkish People and Turkish national interests

They are trying to destroy Turkiye's territorial integrity and to steal oil/gas reserves , 150.000 km2 of area from the Turks in the Eastern mediterranean

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Like you said,can't make a tank,want to make a 6th generation fighter and have 73,5% inflation.




and only ignorant Trolls can say Turkiye can not make Tank Engine


BMC Tank Engine is rising











ALTAY T1 Tank version mass production starts with S.Korean Engine , ALTAY T2 version will use indigenous Engine

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> and only ignorant Trolls can say Turkiye can not make Tank Engine
> 
> 
> BMC Tank Engine is rising
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 851562
> 
> 
> 
> ALTAY T1 Tank version mass production starts with S.Korean Engine , ALTAY T2 version will use indigenous Engine
> View attachment 851561


Pathetic Turkish Altay vs Leopard 2A7 with APS system

Vay vay vay!


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Pathetic Turkish Altay vs Leopard 2A7 with APS system
> 
> Vay vay vay!




Or AKINCI UCAV vs pathetic Leopard2A7
We perefer 250 Turkish UCAVs instead of 2.500 pathetic Leopard2A7




btw most modern ALTAY Tank has everything including APS System

*also Turkish Army modernized Leopard2 with APS*
New Fire control System
New desing turret
Electric Gun-Turret Power System
Laser Warning System
Remote Command Weapon System
Telescopic Periscope System
Position and Orientation Detection System
Close Distance Surveillance System
Tank Driver Vision System
Air Conditioning System
Auxiliary Current System
Smoke Grenade Launchers
AKKOR Active Protection System







*even Turkish modernized M60TM Tanks more advanced than Greek Leopard26HEL*

-- 1.000 hp MTU diesel Engine
-- MG253 120mm Gun
-- RENK 304S Transmission
-- Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
-- Knight fire control system from Elbit Systems
-- The hybrid electric and hydraulic system
-- Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV)
-- The RWR/IR warning system, and tracks from the Merkava IV
-- Close Range Surveillance System (YAMGÖZ)
-- Telescopic Periscope System (TEPES)
-- Tank Laser Warning System (TLUS)
-- Tank Driver Vision System (TDVS)
-- Fire Suppression System
-- Smoke Grenade Launchers
-- Air Conditioning System
-- Auxiliary Power Unit and Audible Warning System
-- 12,7mm SARP Stabilized Advanced Remote Weapon Platform
-- Interior Primer Protection (SPALL LINER)

*-- PULAT Active Protection System*



















*Turkish Army M-60TM Tank in combat area - October 2019 / Syria






superior Turkish Army easly can crush any European Army like insect*

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> superior Turkish Army easly can crush any European Army like insect


@BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman 

There you have it,gentlemen.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> @BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman
> 
> There you have it,gentlemen.



So funny
Still dreaming about European Armies .... what about tiny weak European Armies ?

NO Ucavs
NO Tactical Ballistic Missiles
NO long range guided MLRS
NO laser guided supersonic Missile
NO land based Cruise Missile
NO mobile Radar Electronic Warfare System
NO real conflict experienced Army

Turkish Army has everything ... superior technology ..quality and quantity

-- Turkish Army has more UCAVs then all Europe combined
-- Turkish Army has more Howitzers than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
-- Turkish Army has more MLRS than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
-- Turkish Army has the best anti-Tank missile power in Europe
-- Turkish Army has the best Ballistic missile power in Europe
-- Turkish Army has the best Attack Hellicopter fleet in Europe


*Turkish Army is 2nd strongest Army in NATO after the US Army*

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## A.P. Richelieu

Foinikas said:


> @BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman
> 
> There you have it,gentlemen.


Sorry, but @MMM-E is on ignore for years.

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## reflecthofgeismar

A country which can't even develop a own tank engine, should be quiet.
When Turks wouldn't be able to shop in NATO countries, they would use Nintendo 64.


Foinikas said:


> @BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman
> 
> There you have it,gentlemen.



It's so funny.
They are bragging about "superior", when Europeans had the will and the lust of the Turks and would wanna think about conquering countries/parts of countries, they would be 3 decades ahead of Turkey and force them to use lesser stuff than cheap copied Ukrainian APS, rocket engines etc.
Turks can "produce" when having all the components and only need to stick them together. LEGO builders.
Pathetic. Can't really produce much from 0-100, like high tier nations can. (US, Israel, GB, France, Germany, Japan, SK, Sweden, Finnland, China etc.)
I mean he is often talking much BS, I remember one time when he said that ONE barrel of MKE KDC-02/GDF-003B had 1100 rpm rate of fire. 
No, they have only 550 PER barrel, together they have 1100.
Rheinmetall made 35x228mm revolver gun has 1100, with ONE barrel.
He (and many others) doesn't understand that Europeans aren't unleashed in their will to completely dominate 100% of the time.
They are slow but steady with progress and not rushed.
Should sanction Turkey like Russia and build a wall around it.
See what happens. 
Maybe they can go closer to China, Uyghurs don't matter, aren't important, will be saved later by mighty Turkey.

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## Primus

Foinikas said:


> @BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman
> 
> There you have it,gentlemen.


I mean hes not wrong... But hes not right either


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## reflecthofgeismar

MMM-E said:


> So funny
> Still dreaming about European Armies .... what about tiny weak European Armies ?
> 
> NO Ucavs
> NO Tactical Ballistic Missiles
> NO long range guided MLRS
> NO laser guided supersonic Missile
> NO land based Cruise Missile
> NO mobile Radar Electronic Warfare System
> NO real conflict experienced Army
> 
> Turkish Army has everything ... superior technology ..quality and quantity
> 
> -- Turkish Army has more UCAVs then all Europe combined
> -- Turkish Army has more Howitzers than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
> -- Turkish Army has more MLRS than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
> -- Turkish Army has the best anti-Tank missile power in Europe
> -- Turkish Army has the best Ballistic missile power in Europe
> -- Turkish Army has the best Attack Hellicopter fleet in Europe
> 
> 
> *Turkish Army is 2nd strongest Army in NATO after the US Army*



Quality we saw when cheap head choppers couldn't secure flanks of old (1st "Baulos") Leopard 2A4 (even with 1st gen armor, not the 3rd package which was built around 1988) and how pathetic turkish tankist were vs a bunch of drug abusing yellers. 
Pathetic.
I know, I know, great operation in Cyprus 1974 
vs WHAT?!
A bunch of undergunned Cypriots?! 32 T-34/85 vs 180 M47 and M48 with aerial supremacy. 
That's like "giant" Azerbaijan with turkish support vs tiny, corrupt and not helped Armenia.
"Great" victory.

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## Apollon

Foinikas said:


> @BON PLAN @Raffie @Reichsmarschall @A.P. Richelieu @Vergennes @SalarHaqq @Huffal @Apollon @Meengla @reflecthofgeismar @ZeGerman
> 
> There you have it,gentlemen.



At least he is funny


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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Quality we saw when cheap head choppers couldn't secure flanks of old (1st "Baulos") Leopard 2A4 (even with 1st gen armor, not the 3rd package which was built around 1988) and how pathetic turkish tankist were vs a bunch of drug abusing yellers.



are you blind or what ? full of ignarant users dreaming about tiny weak outdated German , French Armies


*Turkish Leopard2A4 modernization to 2A7 standard*

The hybrid reactive ERA armor system is a new generation armor system developed by ROKETSAN

New Fire control System
New desing turret
Electric Gun-Turret Power System
Laser Warning System
Remote Command Weapon System
Telescopic Periscope System
Position and Orientation Detection System
Close Distance Surveillance System
Tank Driver Vision System
Air Conditioning System
Auxiliary Current System
Smoke Grenade Launchers
AKKOR Active Protection System









Roketsan - BALLISTIC PROTECTION SYSTEMS







www.roketsan.com.tr

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> They are bragging about "superior", when Europeans had the will and the lust of the Turks and would wanna think about conquering countries/parts of countries, they would be 3 decades ahead of Turkey and force them to use lesser stuff than cheap copied Ukrainian APS, rocket engines etc.
> Turks can "produce" when having all the components and only need to stick them together. LEGO builders.



Yes its so funny
You pathetic guys still dreaming about outdated Tank concept from ww2 .... lol

pathetic Europe without UCAVs


*Turkiye has superior technologies to turn tiny weak outdated German , French Armies into crap of metal*

We perefer 250 Turkish UCAVs instead of 2.500 pathetic Tanks

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Turks can "produce" when having all the components and only need to stick them together. LEGO builders.



Your lies wont change reality
Pathetic German Army use outdated MILAN Anti Tank Missile



Turkish Anti-Tank Missile OMTAS is extremely sophisticated​From a NATO perspective the OMTAS remains a formidable weapon system; only France , USA and Turkiye have top attack ATGMs with similar characteristics.
The OMTAS is clearly superior to the FGM-148 Javelin in every aspect

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> A country which can't even develop a own tank engine, should be quiet.
> When Turks wouldn't be able to shop in NATO countries, they would use Nintendo 64.




after USA and NATO arms embargo on Turkiye in 1975
Turks opened defense companies TAI , TEI , ASELSAN , ROKETSAN , HAVELSAN , METEKSAN , STM also TUBITAK to develop national defense Industry


Turkish BMC 1500 hp Tank Engine is coming











Turkiye has developed TS-1400 gas turbine turboshaft Engine for Helicopters ... ( only a few countries in the world )







Turkish KALE KTJ3200 Turbojet Engine for SOM and ATMACA Cruise Missiles

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> That's like "giant" Azerbaijan with turkish support vs tiny, corrupt and not helped Armenia.
> "Great" victory.



Your cowardly Germany,France and all Europe can not do anything against Russia to help Ukraine

on the other hand brave Turkiye helped Azerbaijan against Russia-İran backed Armenia
Russia-İran could not fight against Turkiye for Armenia


and not European but Turkish TB-2 UCAVs and American JAVELIN , STINGER Missiles are hunting Russian hardware in Ukraine


o*utdated German weapons wont work in modern warfare*

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Turks can "produce" when having all the components and only need to stick them together. LEGO builders.



*Turkiye has superior technologies to turn tiny weak outdated German , French Armies into crap of metal*


Pathetic European Armies have no UCAV and high precision strike capability with supersonic Missiles

Turkish Roketsan TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missiles easly can destroy tiny weak outdated German French Armies ( Tanks,Howitzers,IFVs,MLRS ) from 70-150 km away


and pathetic European Armies have no those superior technologies

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## Akritas

What is most striking is not that Turkey remains a revisionist power, which it considers to be more relevant to it than international law recognizes *but that this revisionism is escalating over time*.
Today's Turkey is now a* hotbed of problems, the troublemaker* of the Eastern Mediterranean. Its political system is kept alive by the reproduction of tensions, claims and discoveries of enemies. There is no Turkish politician who is moderate.

*The opposition directly supports Erdogan's revensionists policies,* such as invasions of neighboring countries, military operations, hybrid wars, national purges, kidnappings and mass imprisonment.

*Unfortunately, this revisionism exists everywhere in Turkish society,* which as a recipient is bombarded for how superpower Turkey is, the defense industry makes what others do not make, they make enemies, they falsify historical facts, they produce revisionist nationalism.

Closing with this: Now, more and more, Turkey is using a rhetoric that refers to the "hot conflict" as the creation of those committed to challenge Greek sovereignty, that is, to a conflict that does not aim at external intervention of third parties, *but claims to form a correlation on the ground*. After all, the fact that Turkey is making long-term annexation moves (eg the use of Turkish currency) in the "security zone" it has occupied in northern Syria says a lot.


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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> That's like "giant" Azerbaijan with turkish support vs tiny, corrupt and not helped Armenia.
> "Great" victory.



Hezbollah kicked most modern Israeli Army in 2006

on the other hand Turkish Army kicked Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah in Idlib/Syria 


watch superior Turkish technology and new war doctrine in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems

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## reflecthofgeismar

@Foinikas eh, why did you link me, now I have this spoiled, turkish big mouth brat on ma a*s.
Will he ever stop to post his nonsense?
I mean, it's like a disease, isn't there any cure?
Or you need to gave them a Vienna 3.0?
Little 3rd worlders want always chew more than they can get.
Turkish invasion of Vienna, colorized.




Funny thing, best troops were not x-legged, 1.60m original Turks but islamized people of European stock.
It's like Easterlings all over again (best troops Mordor had).
Trolls = European interventions in "turkish" hands.
Faggot Denethor II the classical European politican atm, let them have a Theoden and Aragorn and 3rd world countries couldn't "win" like in Afghanistan, you know why?
Because nobody would be left. ^^
In the end, there shouldn't be useless, dumb conflicts in other culture spaces, as long as they don't annoy in such a scale that u can't look away (disturb economic grow etc.).
Thanks for Turkey, a minority is thinking like MMM-E because otherwise all of the people would be targets. ^^
Most Turks who are Turks living in Turkey I met in my life were VERY nice persons.
Good at making a party and drinking...

*PS:*
The moment the Europeans or as a whole - the Whites stop to be being the hippity hoppity "Liberals" it's the day big mouth 3rd worlders couldn't take it anymore.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *Turkiye has superior technologies to turn tiny weak outdated German , French , British Armies into crap of metal*


You're really on another level.



MMM-E said:


> Hezbollah kicked most modern Israeli Army in 2006


How did they kick them? Lebanon was left in ruins and nobody won clearly. Hizbollah suffered heavy casualties,but won the propaganda war and Israel lost some men and equipment,but caused heavy damages on Lebanon's infastracture and made a point.



reflecthofgeismar said:


> Or you need to gave them a Vienna 3.0?


He thinks Erdogan will march to Vienna again. Didn't you hear? "Tiny weak European armies". 

Erdogan wants to start a new operation in Syria,at the same time he has been raising tensions in the Aegean again. 

Angers the Americans,Sweden,Finland and France,sells weapons to Ukraine and angers the Russians,but keeps diplomatic ties with the Russians and angers the Ukrainians.


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We perefer 250 Turkish UCAVs instead of 2.500 pathetic Tanks


AMAP-ADS or Trophy will protect our tanks,while the Air Force is taking care of your UCAVs. 

God willing.


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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Most Turks who are Turks living in Turkey I met in my life were VERY nice persons.
> Good at making a party and drinking...


Exactly. But of course there are the ones who believe everything Yeni Safak and their State Department says. 

Erdogan fills them with neo-Ottoman and Pan-islamic dreams (with Turkey always at the head),Bahceli fills them with the old extreme nationalist dreams and Pan-Turkic visions. Kilicdaroglu and Aksener,as opposition,criticize them for not being more provocative and daring.

Meanwhile,inflation has reached 73,5% and they keep trying to make TFX,MIUS,TF-2000,aircraft carriers and submarines.

That's why Erdogan was running behind Israel,Saudi Arabia and UAE.


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## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> AMAP-ADS or Trophy will protect our tanks,while the Air Force is taking care of your UCAVs.
> 
> God willing.



AMAP-ADS AND Trophy APS should work in conjunction.
Or German radar based Trophy like APS (Diehl AVePS (in the past „AWiSS“)).
But there is some serious problem about top down attacks.
Not one atm fielded APS is working against TD-attacks.

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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> AMAP-ADS AND Trophy APS should work in conjunction.
> Or German radar based Trophy like APS (Diehl AVePS (in the past „AWiSS“)).
> But there is some serious problem about top down attacks.
> Not one atm fielded APS is working against TD-attacks.


Last night,I checked out the AMAP-ADS because I remembered what you told me about it. And I was amazed. 

It really is absolutely amazing. I downloaded the video,we're talking about probably the best system to defend tanks. Theoretically,it could protect our Leopard tanks from Turkish UCAVs too. It could frustrate the Turks. 

If we bought Drone Dome from Israel and AMAP-ADS and Trophy,we could finally have a solution to the Turkish UCAV problem. Drone Dome might not be enough,but if we also get Iron Dome or other anti-drone systems,we could have a good defence against them.

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## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> Last night,I checked out the AMAP-ADS because I remembered what you told me about it. And I was amazed.
> 
> It really is absolutely amazing. I downloaded the video,we're talking about probably the best system to defend tanks. Theoretically,it could protect our Leopard tanks from Turkish UCAVs too. It could frustrate the Turks.
> 
> If we bought Drone Dome from Israel and AMAP-ADS and Trophy,we could finally have a solution to the Turkish UCAV problem. Drone Dome might not be enough,but if we also get Iron Dome or other anti-drone systems,we could have a good defence against them.




Iron Dome isn't magic or something like this.
You could go the "french way", especially when you go with VBCI 2 and take the 40mm gun for it.
Mistral 3 (imo the best manpad, short range AA rocket atm...)
Crotale NG/Mk.3, Aster-15 and Aster-30 ...
MMP = excellent ATGM, very good, higher range than "superior" OMTAS ... lul.
And for a dedicated tank hunter, based on 4x4, 6x6, 8x8, tracked go for Spike NLOS Mk 5 (or higher if available then).
IMO - as a German - the best way would to get mostly french stuff, you could give us back the Leopards  because pathetic politics don't wanna have a real army, only mouth propaganda...
French will reopen facility line (they only need to reopen it) and produce 500 - with German upgrades if you want - Leclerc "Charlemagne the Great" - Variant.
For tracked IFV/other variants, you have old M113 which could be perfectly upgraded by FFG and hopefully you will produce KF41 Lynx IN Greece! For sure, then with you wheeled IFV weapons (40x255mm, MMP etc.) so logistics are easier.
Germany should pay for upgrading all your Apaches to E/Guardian variant and give money for two full AHB with 80 (with 16 in reserves)...
Greece IS OSGILIATH!
As a whole it would be so much better to strengthen Greece to the core than to spend money to feed people who don't like "the West"...


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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Iron Dome isn't magic or something like this.
> You could go the "french way", especially when you go with VBCI 2 and take the 40mm gun for it.
> Mistral 3 (imo the best manpad, short range AA rocket atm...)
> Crotale NG/Mk.3, Aster-15 and Aster-30 ...
> MMP = excellent ATGM, very good, higher range than "superior" OMTAS ... lul.
> And for a dedicated tank hunter, based on 4x4, 6x6, 8x8, tracked go for Spike NLOS Mk 5 (or higher if available then).
> IMO - as a German - the best way would to get mostly french stuff, you could give us back the Leopards  because pathetic politics don't wanna have a real army, only mouth propaganda...
> French will reopen facility line (they only need to reopen it) and produce 500 - with German upgrades if you want - Leclerc "Charlemagne the Great" - Variant.
> For tracked IFV/other variants, you have old M113 which could be perfectly upgraded by FFG and hopefully you will produce KF41 Lynx IN Greece! For sure, then with you wheeled IFV weapons (40x255mm, MMP etc.) so logistics are easier.
> Germany should pay for upgrading all your Apaches to E/Guardian variant and give money for two full AHB with 80 (with 16 in reserves)...
> Greece IS OSGILIATH!
> As a whole it would be so much better to strengthen Greece to the core than to spend money to feed people who don't like "the West"...


I know,but I wouldn't mind a couple of Iron Dome batteries  

Drone Dome is the one we need. 

The French had proposed a version of the VBCI for us,they called it Philoctetes:






We already have Crotale NG,but I would like some SAMP-T if we can afford them.

Tell me about the Charlemagne Leclerc  

I loved the EMBT that has the Leopard 2 chassis and Leclerc turret. 

Personally,I like the Puma more than the Lynx. But everybody says the Lynx is the best. I understand it's more modern,yes. But it's soooo ugly! Lol. 

Still,imagine Marder 1A3/A5 and Lynx and M1117 Guardian and Leopard 2A6 HEL,Leopard 2A7...and if we also get Spike SR/LR2...that will give us a good chance against the Turks.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> AMAP-ADS or Trophy will protect our tanks,while the Air Force is taking care of your UCAVs.
> 
> God willing.



AMAP-ADS or Trophy can not protect your Tanks from UCAVs .... not even close

and Turkish UCAVs will be under protection of the Turkish Air Force

-- S400 Air Defense System
-- SIPER Air Defense System
-- F-16 Fighter Jets
-- upcoming KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet

good like you will need it

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> AMAP-ADS or Trophy can not protect your Tanks from UCAVs .... not even close
> 
> and Turkish UCAVs will be under protection of the Turkish Air Force
> 
> -- S400 Air Defense System
> -- SIPER Air Defense System
> -- F-16 Fighter Jets
> -- upcoming KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
> 
> good like you will need it


Trophy can take care of everything


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Meanwhile,inflation has reached 73,5% and they keep trying to make TFX,MIUS,TF-2000,aircraft carriers and submarines.
> 
> That's why Erdogan was running behind Israel,Saudi Arabia and UAE.



Dont worry
Turkiye has enough money to develop the TFX,MIUS,TF-2000,Aircraft Carriers, Submarines and many more

better worry about your bankrupt Greece which can not pay its debt until 2060


btw first The Uae and İsrael came to Turkiye to meet president ERDOGAN for peace

on the other hand Mitsotakis was running behind USA,İsrael,France,Germany for crying about Turkiye



Beny Karachun said:


> Trophy can take care of everything



only in your dreams

death comes from above .... lol

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> btw first The Uae and İsrael came to Turkiye to meet president ERDOGAN for peace


It's not true, Erdogan was the one inviting them lol.
Erdogan just a year ago was calling us murderers and terrorists and is now shaking hand with the so called murderers and terrorists.

I guess the inflation in Turkey shook him up lol


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Still,imagine Marder 1A3/A5 and Lynx and M1117 Guardian and Leopard 2A6 HEL,Leopard 2A7...and if we also get Spike SR/LR2...that will give us a good chance against the Turks.



so funny still dreaming about pathetic European technologies


superior Turkish Army easly can turn Marder 1A3/A5 and Lynx and M1117 Guardian and Leopard 2A6 HEL,Leopard 2A7 into crap of metal

thanks to great Turkish Defense Industry

2 km KARAOK shoulder launched anti-Tank Missile ... ( similar to JAVELIN )
4 km OMTAS nex gen anti-Tank Missile
12 km UMTAS anti-Tank Missile
15 km MAM-L laser guided munition
30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
40 km KUZGUN-KY Missile
50 km SDB guided Bomb with IIR seeker
70-150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile

also Turkish Army has 20.000+ TOW , MILAN , ERYX , KONKURS and KORNET anti-Tank Missiles
and Turkish F-16s armed with 880 MAVERIC Missiles to hunt enemy Tanks


*We Turks prefer 250 UCAVs instead of 2.500 Tanks*

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> It's not true, Erdogan was the one inviting them lol.
> Erdogan just a year ago was calling us murderers and terrorists and is now shaking hand with the so called murderers and terrorists.
> 
> I guess the inflation in Turkey shook him up lol



İsrael and The UAE wanted to meet president ERDOGAN and They came to Turkiye

Erdogan called Netanyahu as murderer ..... Netanyahu lost the elections
and Herzog-Erdogan opened new era in relations ......Israel so happy


btw the inflation doesnt change anything ......... Turkish military projects enter service year by year

only a few examples

-- other Countries pays billions of Dollars to buy trash LCS from USA
but Turkiye produce superior ISTIF Frigate for less than $500 million

--- other Countries pays $1,2 million to buy HARPOON anti-ship Missile
but Turkiye produce superior ATMACA anti-ship Missile for less than $500.000


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## MMM-E

*Tiny and weak German - French Armies *


TANKS
Germany : 266
France : 222

HOWITZERS
Germany : 121
France : 120

MLRS
Germany : 38
France : 13

ATTACK HELICOPTERS
Germany : 51
France : 68

NO Ucavs
NO Tactical Ballistic Missiles
NO long range guided MLRS
NO laser guided supersonic Missile
NO land based Cruise Missile
NO mobile Radar Electronic Warfare System
NO real conflict experienced Army


Turkish Army has everything ... superior technology ..quality and quantity

-- Turkish Army has more UCAVs then all Europe combined
-- Turkish Army has more Howitzers than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
-- Turkish Army has more MLRS than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
-- Turkish Army has Europe's only high presicion strike capability with laser guided supersonic missiles
-- Turkish Army has the best anti-Tank missile power in Europe
-- Turkish Army has the best Ballistic missile power in Europe
-- Turkish Army has the best Attack Hellicopter fleet in Europe


*Turkish Army is 2nd strongest Army in NATO after the US Army*


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *We Turks prefer 250 UCAVs instead of 2.500 Tanks*


And yet you have more than 3,000 tanks


----------



## MMM-E

*1.000 km Turkish KARGI Kamikaze Drone is coming similar to Israeli HAROP*



The KARGI Drone to be designed to minimize its radar signature through stealth
This anti-radiation drone to target enemy air defense systems in a first line of attack from 1.000+ km away


KARGI will replace 100+ of Israeli HARPY in the Turkish Armed Forces













TEI has developed PG-50 Engine for the KARGI anti radiotion Drone


----------



## MMM-E

*200 km SIMSEK Kamikaze Drone to attack on Air Defense Systems*



speed of mach 0,7
range of 200 km

















*Greeks will use high price Air Defense Missiles to intercept very low price SIMSEK Kamikaze Drones*

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *1.000 km Turkish KARGI Kamikaze Drone is coming similar to Israeli HAROP*
> 
> 
> 
> The KARGI Drone to be designed to minimize its radar signature through stealth
> This anti-radiation drone to target enemy air defense systems in a first line of attack from 1.000+ km away
> 
> 
> KARGI will replace 100+ of Israeli HARPY in the Turkish Armed Forces
> View attachment 851794
> 
> 
> 
> Atmaca Flir
> View attachment 851793
> 
> 
> TEI has developed PG-50 Engine for the KARGI anti radiotion Drone
> View attachment 851803


It's funny,most of the stuff you brag about are titled "to produce" or "is coming".


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> İsrael and The UAE wanted to meet president ERDOGAN and They came to Turkiye
> 
> Erdogan called Netanyahu as murderer ..... Netanyahu lost the elections
> and Herzog-Erdogan opened new era in relations ......Israel so happy
> 
> 
> btw the inflation doesnt change anything ......... Turkish military projects enter service year by year
> 
> only a few examples
> 
> -- other Countries pays billions of Dollars to buy trash LCS from USA
> but Turkiye produce superior ISTIF Frigate for less than $500 million
> 
> --- other Countries pays $1,2 million to buy HARPOON anti-ship Missile
> but Turkiye produce superior ATMACA anti-ship Missile for less than $500.000


Lmfao, Erdogan called Netanyahu murderer? Erdogan called ISRAEL murderers, Israel hasn't stopped killing Palestinians or occupying the Palestinians as you claim we do, cope harder.

Inflation changes everything, your economy is officially trash tier because of this


----------



## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> Lmfao, Erdogan called Netanyahu murderer? Netanyahu called ISRAEL murderers, Israel hasn't stopped killing Palestinians or occupying the Palestinians as you claim we do, cope harder.
> 
> Inflation changes everything, your economy is officially trash tier because of this


He said Israel is very happy now that relations with Turkey are restored 😂😂😂


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> It's funny,most of the stuff you brag about are titled "to produce" or "is coming".



as like your coming FDI Frigate , GOWIND Corvette , F35 , Leopard2A7 and many more .... lol


Most of weapons I show in service or under production

only KARGI antiradiation Drone and KUZGUN joint strike missile family is coming ( by 2023 )


----------



## Akritas

*How many hours does the Turkish Aegean Army need to organize an attack on the Greek islands?*

Greek diplomacy presents to all its interlocutors the revisionism of Turkey. T*urkey's insistence on the demilitarization of the Greek islands of the Eastern Aegean* has recently reached the extreme and absurd argument of "violation" - by Greece - of international treaties and, in the logic of Ankara, of questioning the Greek sovereignty of our islands. 

According Estia newspaper, the Greek Ministry of Foreign Affairs, with an unqualified document *dated 10 May 2022, *informs the Greek ambassadors around the world of all the legal arguments against Ankara's objections, *while accompanying them with a map, which contains detailed information on the time required in Turkish forces of the 3rd Aegean Army located in Asia Minor, in order to gather, attack and invade Rhodes, Kos, Chios, Samos, Ikaria and other islands!* 

In this way, Greek diplomacy presents to all its interlocutors, in the most vivid way, *the revisionism of Turkey in practice.*

The map, according to the report, contains the number of 22.000 special forces troops , reaction time to an invasion order, helicopter bases and the deployment of Turkish forces, naval foces and others in Asia Minor. The image with the bows painted on the map by the Foreign Ministry officials "speaks" for itself: 

12 hours to gather the forces that will attack Lesvos. 
12 hours to mobilize the forces that will attack Chios. 
12 to mobilize the forces that will attack Rhodes.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Lmfao, Erdogan called Netanyahu murderer? Netanyahu called ISRAEL murderers, Israel hasn't stopped killing Palestinians or occupying the Palestinians as you claim we do, cope harder.



reality is HERZOG and MBZ came to Turkiye to meet ERDOGAN for peace
so ERDOGAN-HERZOG-MBZ opened new era in relations .. and İsrael needs Turkiye against Iran




Beny Karachun said:


> Inflation changes everything, your economy is officially trash tier because of this




Inflation changes nothing for Turkish military projects
and Turkish economy is the 2nd fastest growing economy in OECD

Turkiye produce everything to export for over $250 billion 
even Greece has no $250 billion of GDP ...lol


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> as like your coming FDI Frigate , GOWIND Corvette , F35 , Leopard2A7 and many more .... lol
> 
> 
> Most of weapons I show in service or under production
> 
> only KARGI antiradiation Drone and KUZGUN joint strike missile family is coming ( by 2023 )


I mentioned many current weapons and systems,but you have a habit in all your posts and threads,to talk about future projects and things you might not even produce or buy.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> I mentioned many current weapons and systems,but you have a habit in all your posts and threads,to talk about future projects and things you might not even produce or buy.




I mentioned only current weapons and systems 

only a few weapons for 2023
KIZIELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet ( under production )
ISTIF class Frigate
KARGI anti radiation Drone
KUZGUN joint strike missile family


on the other hand you have a habit in all your posts and threads,to talk about future projects and things you might not even produce or buy

85 F-16V until 2028
4 FDI Frigate after 2025
even no any deal for F35 , Leopard2A7 , GOWIND Corvette


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> How many hours does the Turkish Aegean Army need to organize an attack on the Greek islands?



Greece violates int'l agreements by arming 16 islands​
Stationing troops and weapons on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris



Turkiye filed a complaint about Greece’s actions that violate the demilitarized status of the eastern Aegean islands through a July 2021 letter to the UN chief.


sooner of later a conflict will start between Turkiye and Greece
its seems , tiny Greece will be the next American-French puppet which will be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greece violates int'l agreements by arming 16 islands​
> Stationing troops and weapons on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye filed a complaint about Greece’s actions that violate the demilitarized status of the eastern Aegean islands through a July 2021 letter to the UN chief.
> 
> 
> sooner of later a conflict will start between Turkiye and Greece
> its seems , tiny Greece will be the next American-French puppet which will be kicked by the Turkish Armed Forces



Greece is fine by international law:


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Beny Karachun said:


> Trophy can take care of everything



It - just every other APS which is available atm- CAN't defend against top down attacks...

Trophy is relative slow, especially compared to Rheinmetall ADS/StrikeShield (built in with AMAP modules).
And radar based, so very high signature.
Is Trophy effective against APFSDS?
ADS is.
It's nice that it qualified against APFSDS-rounds in the 2000s.
I mean still better than crappy "turkish" (ukrainian copied) APS. 
Trophy is the "test" for the Germans in the mean time - because of our extremely sharp rules, Germans wanna have later "infantry-safe" APS or at least most possible safe for operating near by infantry, so Rheinmetall needs to refine their ADS and until then we will test-use the (NOT infantry-friendly) Trophy for a company or 2 companies of Leo2 ... 
Was the same story with ERA in german service. Took only 40 yrs, LOL.
Don't forget it was Manfred Held who patented ERA and worked with Israelis together but it took so long to make it EFFICIENT and more safer for Infantry. Diehl is producing this infantry-"friendly" ERA for German Puma as example.
Sometimes I wish Germans would rush their products like the Turks.
Then we would already have the 130mm.


https://www.ads-protection.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/RPS-folder-030719.pdf

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## Foinikas

@mike2000 is back I kept trying to remember your nickname to add you in the post the other day,along with the rest of the Europeans. It turns out according to MMM-E here,that the Turkish Army is "superior" to "weak,pathetic British,French,German European armies". 

I think you should be afraid,because Erdogan will reach London and turn it into a vilayet,after he conquers Vienna of course.



reflecthofgeismar said:


> It - just every other APS which is available atm- CAN't defend against top down attacks...
> 
> Trophy is relative slow, especially compared to Rheinmetall ADS/StrikeShield (built in with AMAP modules).
> And radar based, so very high signature.
> Is Trophy effective against APFSDS?
> ADS is.
> It's nice that it qualified against APFSDS-rounds in the 2000s.
> I mean still better than crappy "turkish" (ukrainian copied) APS.
> Trophy is the "test" for the Germans in the mean time - because of our extremely sharp rules, Germans wanna have later "infantry-safe" APS or at least most possible safe for operating near by infantry, so Rheinmetall needs to refine their ADS and until then we will test-use the (NOT infantry-friendly) Trophy for a company or 2 companies of Leo2 ...
> Was the same story with ERA in german service. Took only 40 yrs, LOL.
> Don't forget it was Manfred Held who patented ERA and worked with Israelis together but it took so long to make it EFFICIENT and more safer for Infantry. Diehl is producing this infantry-"friendly" ERA for German Puma as example.
> Sometimes I wish Germans would rush their products a like the Turks.
> Then we would already have the 130mm.
> 
> 
> https://www.ads-protection.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/RPS-folder-030719.pdf


Personally,I would love to have AMAP-ADS and if not,then Trophy. But I thought Trophy also protects from top-down attacks.
Still,these two are the top APS in the world right now!


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Greece is fine by international law:



Greece is a bandit country violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


According to Article 13 of the Treaty of Lausanne, signed in 1923
“With a view to ensuring the maintenance of peace, the Greek Government undertakes to observe the following restrictions in the islands of Mytilene, Chios, Samos and Nikaria: 
No naval base and no fortification will be established in the said islands

The Dodecanese islands were handed over to Italy with the Treaty of Ouchy signed after the 1912 Turco-Italian War and remained under Italian sovereignty until the 1947 Treaty of Paris.

With Italy taking the side of the defeated countries in World War II, the Treaty of Paris was signed with the Allied countries on Feb. 10, 1947, and these islands were ceded to Greece.

Under the treaty, it was decided that the Dodecanese islands and the small nearby islets would not be militarized.

“These islands shall be and shall remain demilitarised


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

@Foinikas Rheinmetall will show the Lynx 120 (which is good for small countries like Slovakia etc.)
BUT I smell a better Leopard 2 with Rh 130mmL/51





Rheinmetall at Eurosatory


Rheinmetall, exhibition, fair, Eurosatory 2022, Eurosatory2022




www.rheinmetall-defence.com






https://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/media/editor_media/rm_defence/publicrelations/messen_symposien/eurosatory_bilder/2022/eurosatory_2022_halbe_buehne~1_keyvisual.png










New Rheinmetall Fighting Vehicle At Eurosatory | Joint Forces News


The world premiere of a new large-calibre Rheinmetall fighting vehicle is sure to be a major highlight of this year's Eurosatory expo in Paris




www.joint-forces.com


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greece is a bandit country violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris
> 
> 
> According to Article 13 of the Treaty of Lausanne, signed in 1923
> “With a view to ensuring the maintenance of peace, the Greek Government undertakes to observe the following restrictions in the islands of Mytilene, Chios, Samos and Nikaria:
> No naval base and no fortification will be established in the said islands
> 
> The Dodecanese islands were handed over to Italy with the Treaty of Ouchy signed after the 1912 Turco-Italian War and remained under Italian sovereignty until the 1947 Treaty of Paris.
> 
> With Italy taking the side of the defeated countries in World War II, the Treaty of Paris was signed with the Allied countries on Feb. 10, 1947, and these islands were ceded to Greece.
> 
> Under the treaty, it was decided that the Dodecanese islands and the small nearby islets would not be militarized.
> 
> “These islands shall be and shall remain demilitarised


Didn't you read my post? If you didn't,go back and read it.

If you read it and keep saying your trash,then talk to the hand.

Turkey's foreign policy is schizophrenic and bipolar.

First you guys say that Turkey is out of our league,that Greece cannot be compared to Turkey,that no matter how much we arm,we don't have a chance against you.

THEN,you say that the tiny garissons on the islands,which have a purely defensive role...are actually a threat to big Turkey.

All the while,you have entire armies and bases on the other side.


The bandit,lying and scheming country is Turkey,not Greece. You are the ones who want no peace,no friendship and no good neigborhood,by wanting everything and by bullying everyone.

Oh,you just care for your interests? Well then **** off,our interests too.



MMM-E said:


> Under the treaty, it was decided that the Dodecanese islands and the small nearby islets would not be militarized.


The Treaty was between Greece and Italy,not Greece and Turkey. Italy has no problem with it.

Go read my post and stop talking shit.


----------



## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Trophy is relative slow, especially compared to Rheinmetall ADS/StrikeShield (built in with AMAP modules).
> And radar based, so very high signature.
> Is Trophy effective against APFSDS?
> ADS is.
> It's nice that it qualified against APFSDS-rounds in the 2000s.
> I mean still better than crappy "turkish" (ukrainian copied) APS.



Crappy German or İsraeli APS can not stop Turkish UCAVs .... not even close

death comes from above ...lol


btw PULAT Active Protection System for M60TM Tanks
and Aselsan AKKOR Active Protection System for ALTAY Tank





reflecthofgeismar said:


> Sometimes I wish Germans would rush their products like the Turks.
> Then we would already have the 130mm.



still dreaming about outdated war concept from ww2 .. pathetic Germans


superior Turkish Army can destroy German Leopard2 Tanks from 70-150 km away with TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missiles 

warhead of 50 kg .... only Turkish Army has this technology in Europe


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Didn't you read my post? If you didn't,go back and read it.



1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris says everything

no need to read tales from daydreamer Greeks





Foinikas said:


> Turkey's foreign policy is schizophrenic and bipolar.



Greece is a puppet which use by USA,France against Turkiye
as like PKK/YPG Terrorists





Foinikas said:


> THEN,you say that the tiny garissons on the islands,which have a purely defensive role...are actually a threat to big Turkey.
> 
> All the while,you have entire armies and bases on the other side.



Turkiye doesnt violates international agreements
Turkiye doesnt attack on Greece or Greek Islands

but daydreamer Greece violates int'l agreements by arming 16 islands
daydreamer Greece has big dreams and occuiped our Islands
daydreamer Greece has big dreams to increase territorial waters to 12nm

puppet Greece , PKK/YPG are waiting for green light from USA-France against Turkiye

as like 100 years ago Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris says everything
> 
> no need to read tales from daydreamer Greeks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greece is a puppet which use by USA,France against Turkiye
> as like PKK/YPG Terrorists
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye doesnt violates international agreements
> Turkiye doesnt attack on Greece or Greek Islands
> 
> but daydreamer Greece violates int'l agreements by arming 16 islands
> daydreamer Greece has big dreams and occuiped our Islands
> daydreamer Greece has big dreams to increase territorial waters to 12nm
> 
> puppet Greece , PKK/YPG are waiting for green light from USA-France against Turkiye
> 
> as like 100 years ago Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming


Why am I arguing with a crazy,deluded person who refuses to debate when he's shown evidence and goes back to saying the same things again and again,in an endless loop???


----------



## Attila the Hun

Foinikas said:


> Why am I arguing with a crazy,deluded person who refuses to debate when he's shown evidence and goes back to saying the same things again and again,in an endless loop???
> 
> View attachment 851864


You argue with him every single day ... is this your life? lol

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Why am I arguing with a crazy,deluded person who refuses to debate when he's shown evidence and goes back to saying the same things again and again,in an endless loop???
> 
> View attachment 851864



1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris says everything , you daydreamer deluded Greeks

ERDOGAN , AKAR , CAVUSOGLU always warned daydreamer MICO , DENDIAS , but small nations like Greeks prefer being a puppet

USA-EU provoked Ukraine against Russia
and Ukraine lost Crimea , Don-Bas and Ukranian cities were destroyed

puppet liar Greeks , hidding behind USA-EU and barking
dont worry we will kick your tranny butt again just like 1922,1974,1996


----------



## Foinikas

Attila the Hun said:


> You argue with him every single day ... is this your life? lol


Well,I was bored. Everyone's out of town


----------



## Germanpeter

MMM-E said:


> So funny
> Still dreaming about European Armies .... what about tiny weak European Armies ?
> 
> NO Ucavs
> NO Tactical Ballistic Missiles
> NO long range guided MLRS
> NO laser guided supersonic Missile
> NO land based Cruise Missile
> NO mobile Radar Electronic Warfare System
> NO real conflict experienced Army
> 
> Turkish Army has everything ... superior technology ..quality and quantity
> 
> -- Turkish Army has more UCAVs then all Europe combined
> -- Turkish Army has more Howitzers than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
> -- Turkish Army has more MLRS than German+French+British+İtalian Armies combined
> -- Turkish Army has the best anti-Tank missile power in Europe
> -- Turkish Army has the best Ballistic missile power in Europe
> -- Turkish Army has the best Attack Hellicopter fleet in Europe
> 
> 
> *Turkish Army is 2nd strongest Army in NATO after the US Army*


You speak honestly like a toddler whose pacifier has been taken away. Any medium-sized country willing to invest some resources can develop its own drone industry like Turkiye. For no other country are drones geographically and geopolitically better suited than Turkiye. So this has something to do with necessity.

I don't see any tactics or a discussion here, just the cheapest trolls and the kindergarten. Only that much.


Greece has absolutely nothing that would even remotely matter in a real conflict, sad as that may sound. A quick look at the map is enough. The conflict would be centered on the island just off the Turkish border and would not last many hours. It's absolutely impossible to defend this whole island. I even bet that Greece will go into shock and not react at all and frankly can't and actually insist on the empty promises of the US. Unfortunately, Greece does not have good politicians.

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## Foinikas

Germanpeter said:


> I even bet that Greece will go into shock and not react at all and frankly can't and actually insist on the empty promises of the US. Unfortunately, Greece does not have good politicians.


The islands that actually have military presence,only have small garissons,mostly by Homeguard. The ones that have Air Defence,as is known,only have old OSA AKMs,some Skyguard VELOS and Stinger manpads.

When it comes to armor,the most they have is some M48A5 MOLF tanks,BMP-1s with ZSU-23-2 on them and M113s. 

And that's for the biggest islands in the Eastern Aegean. 

Yet,Turkey considers that as a threat. The truth is that realistically,these islands can't be defended against a Turkish invasion. They can at best hold some of the Turkish forces off and cause casualties,until the Navy arrives and the rest of the army is mobilized.

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## MMM-E

Germanpeter said:


> Any medium-sized country willing to invest some resources can develop its own drone industry like Turkiye.



another little boy who knows nothing about worldwide military

-- big country India failed to develop RUSTAM UCAV and buying UAV-UCAV from Israel
-- Germany-France still dreaming about EUROMALE UAV for 2028
-- Italy is till dreaming about SELEX UCAV
-- big Russia has no its own high capacity UCAV

only USA-İsrael-Turkiye-China in the world


Pathetic boys stop dreaming and wake up
Turkiye is not developing only UCAV , but also 750+ military projects


----------



## retaxis

With Turkey economy in free fall it is very likely Turkey will end up in Civil war that last a decade. Greece will take this opportunity to take back Constantinople and Western Anatolia.


----------



## MMM-E

Germanpeter said:


> Greece has absolutely nothing that would even remotely matter in a real conflict, sad as that may sound. A quick look at the map is enough. The conflict would be centered on the island just off the Turkish border and would not last many hours. It's absolutely impossible to defend this whole island. I even bet that Greece will go into shock and not react at all and frankly can't and actually insist on the empty promises of the US. Unfortunately, Greece does not have good politicians.




USA-France-Germany use Greece as a pawn against Turkiye , because of daydreamer Greek politicians

Greek politicians thinks USA-EU will fight Turkiye for Greece .. but Nobody will fight for Greece



*İn a war Greece will lose Islands .... Greece never can defend Islands


1... * All Air bases , jet hangars , air defense systems , military targets are in range of Turkish Armed Forces missile fire power ( TRG-122 , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , ATACMS , J600T , BORA , HARM , POPEYE , SLAM-ER , JSOW , KGK , CAKIR , SOM , ATMACA , HARPOON block2 ) in Greece and Greek Islands

*2 ..* Turkiye has its own 250+ UCAV fleet to destroy all military targets in Islands
even military super power Russia lost big loses against 24 UCAVs in Ukraine

*3 ..* Islands are more closer to Turkiye than Greece
PATRIOT Air Defense Systems in Athens and Thessaloniki can not create no fly zone over Islands

but Turkiye can create no fly zone over Islands
thanks to S400 and SIPER high altitude Air Defense Systems , Fighter Jets , Boeing E-7T AEWCs , KC-135 Tankers , KORAL and REDET Radar Electronic Warfare Systems

*4 ..* Greece is a small country , therefore all military targets in range of the Turkish Armed Forces

on the other hand , Turkiye is much bigger country with over width size of 1.500 km
Greek Armed Forces can not hit all military targets in Turkiye

*5..* Greece has 10 million population , while Turkiye has 85 million population
Turkiye can organize 10 million soldiers if needed ,,, bigger than population of Greece

6 .. Turkish Army has great real conflict experience for 4th generation hybrid war , urban farfare and guerilla tactics


*Turkiye's advantages*
-- Geopolitics , bigger population , superior technology and superior fire power , larger weapon inventory , national defense industry and more experienced armed forces


----------



## retaxis

MMM-E said:


> *5..* Greece has 10 million population , while Turkiye has 85 million population
> Turkiye can organize 10 million soldiers if needed ,,, bigger than population of Greece


Greece vs Turkey is like Israel vs Arabs. Greece will always win even outnumbered


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *1... * All Air bases , jet hangars , air defense systems , military targets are in range of Turkish Armed Forces missile fire power ( TRG-122 , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , ATACMS , J600T , BORA , HARM , POPEYE , SLAM-ER , JSOW , KGK , CAKIR , SOM , ATMACA , HARPOON block2 ) in Greece and Greek Islands
> 
> *2 ..* Turkiye has its own 250+ UCAV fleet to destroy all military targets in Islands
> even military super power Russia lost big loses against 24 UCAVs in Ukraine


Repeat mode on again

An endless loop.


----------



## Akritas

Turkey persistently demanding de-militarization of Greece islands. 
Turkey should follow its own words a*nd de-militarize its Aegean coast.* 
It should withdraw its 4th army and the Army Aviation Regiments from Izmir. 
It should also resign from Montreux convention & de-militarize the Dardanelles Straits.
It should close its naval bases in Phocea and Aksaz . 
Withdraw their invasion army from Cyprus .

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## MMM-E

retaxis said:


> Greece vs Turkey is like Israel vs Arabs. Greece will always win even outnumbered



*Greece is our ex-vassal which ruled by the Turks for over 450 years*

Yes in the last war we have seen loser Greece in 1922
Turks kicked outnumbered and outgunned Greeks+French+Armenians in 1922

Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming


Our rivals are France , Germany-Austria , UK in Europe since Crusades 1096 , but not tiny Greece or tiny Israel


btw Turkiye - Israel have their own defense industry
Greece - Arab countries can not develop even cruise missile


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Turkey persistently demanding de-militarization of Greece islands.
> Turkey should follow its own words a*nd de-militarize its Aegean coast.*
> It should withdraw its 4th army and the Army Aviation Regiments from Izmir.
> It should also resign from Montreux convention & de-militarize the Dardanelles Straits.
> It should close its naval bases in Phocea and Aksaz .
> Withdraw their invasion army from Cyprus .



stop smoking and wake up

Nobody gave Anatolia to the Turks .. We Turks won wars to be Anatolia
and Nobody can order us what to do in our soil ... no any agreement


on the other hand our Islands were given to Greece by Italy, if Greece de-militarize the Islands 
and stationing troops and weapons on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Our rivals are France , Germany-Austria , UK in Europe since Crusades 1096 , but not tiny Greece or tiny Israel


Tiny Israel can nuke you to Stone Age.



MMM-E said:


> Nobody gave Anatolia to the Turks .. We Turks won wars to be Anatolia
> and Nobody can order us what to do in our soil ... no any agreement


Yes,you invaded and killed and stole our homes and lands. Is that what you're trying to prove? That this has been your civilisation? A civilisation of expansionism and war? No philosophy,no culture,no trade? Just an aggressive,militarist, thieving nation? 

Thank you for proving it.

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## MMM-E

Akritas  Foinikas​

*Turkish KARGI anti-radiation Drone *


Critical subsystems such as navigation and automatic flight control system , software , RF Seeker, Engine, Booster, Link System, Propeller and Fuel Tank were developed completely by Turkiye

6+ hours of operation capability
home-of-jam capability
SATCOM communication 
*SEAD* (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses)
*DEAD* (Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses)


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Akritas  Foinikas​
> 
> *Turkish KARGI anti-radiation Drone *
> 
> 
> Critical subsystems such as navigation and automatic flight control system , software , RF Seeker, Engine, Booster, Link System, Propeller and Fuel Tank were developed completely by Turkiye
> 
> 6+ hours of operation capability
> home-of-jam capability
> *SEAD* (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses)
> *DEAD* (Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 851901
> 
> View attachment 851902


Oh yeah,like Iranian models,yes.


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Oh yeah,like Iranian models,yes.



Iranian models hit ARAMCO Facilities in S.Arabia and PATRIOT AD Systems could not do anything

when Turkish KARGI anti-radiation Drones hit Greek military targets , then daydreamer Greeks will wake up from their dreams



Foinikas said:


> Tiny Israel can nuke you to Stone Age.



keep dreaming dream is free


----------



## MMM-E

*Turkiye’s Growing Military Expeditionary Posture*


A glance at the Turkish Armed Forces’ recent combat record demonstrates that Turkiye’s defense policy now extends well beyond its borders


-- Turkish Drones loitering in the Syrian Airspace
-- Mountain Commando units operating in Northern Iraq
-- Turkish Navy Frigates along the Libyan coast
Turkish military advisors in Tripoli alongside Government of National Accord (GNA) formations
-- High-ranking Turkish officers in Qatar and Somalia are all pretty common to see now
-- Turkish Navy blocking bandits in the Eastern Mediterranean

Overall, the Turkish military is fast becoming an expeditionary actor in league with Ankara’s geopolitical worldview



*Turkiye's ambitious strategic posture is centered on three pivots*

1-- The naval transformation toward a blue-water force
2-- The army’s expeditionary warfare concepts married to a growing tendency of resorting to proxy war agents in various battlegrounds from North Africa to the Levant
3-- Expanding forward military bases in different parts of the Turkish zone d’influence


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> when Turkish KARGI anti-radiation Drones hit Greek military targets , then daydreamer Greeks will wake up from their dreams


And when Turkish economy goes to pieces,Turks will wake up and wonder what they needed all these weapons.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> And when Turkish economy goes to pieces,Turks will wake up and wonder what they needed all these weapons.



since 2013 , you are dreaming to see it but never will happen

Turkish Economy is 2nd fastest growing economy in OECD
and Turkiye easly pays its debt ... no any problem

Economic powerhouse Turkiye produce everything to export for $250 billion ... ( Greece has no even $250 billion of GDP )


----------



## Foinikas

You know what is hilarious? 

You say Turkiye has superior technology from Britain,France and Germany.

Yet,you ask the British to sell you Eurofighters and help you with the TFX engine.

Yet,you want to buy SAMP-T from France.

Yet,you have been buying German submarines and asked them to sell you an engine for the Altay.

Yet,you asked the Americans to let you back in the F-35 program.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Yes,you invaded and killed and stole our homes and lands. Is that what you're trying to prove? That this has been your civilisation? A civilisation of expansionism and war? No philosophy,no culture,no trade? Just an aggressive,militarist, thieving nation?
> 
> Thank you for proving it.



Then British,French,Dutch,Spaniards,Portuguese,etc invaded and killed and stole homes and lands in America , Africa , Australia

btw Greeks came to Anatolia and Greece from Africa ... Greeks are not European


Turks have great culture since 3.300 BC ( KURGAN - ANDRONOVO - AFANASIEVO )

Greeks : gay philosophers
Turks : great warriors


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You say Turkiye has superior technology from Britain,France and Germany.



I said superior technology for Army
do you know what about Army ?




Foinikas said:


> Yet,you want to buy SAMP-T from France.



NO
İts not 2015 , its 2022 and Turkiye has developed its own SIPER high altitude Air Defense System to be in service in 2023

3 years ago there was not any Turkish Air Defense System , but now 4 Turkish Air Defense Systems in service

-- KORKUT 35mm SPAAG
-- SUNGUR MANPADS
-- HISAR-A low altitude Air Defense System
-- HISAR-O medium altitude Air Defense System

and by 2023 SIPER high altitude Air Defense System





Foinikas said:


> Yet,you have been buying German submarines and asked them to sell you an engine for the Altay.



and Turkiye start to produce its own AIP Submarine MILDEN in 2025
even TYPE-214TN ( REIS ) class Submarine = 80% Turkish Systems

and in 2015 Turkiye asked German Engine for ALTAY Tank
as of 2022 Turkish BMC 1500 hp Tank Engine is rising




Foinikas said:


> Yet,you asked the Americans to let you back in the F-35 program.



NO
Turkiye doesnt cancel the S400 deal
Turkiye focused on developing KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet and TFX Fighter Jet

Turkiye has started developing big military projects after 2014
and took come a long way in a short time
Turkiye needs more 5 - 10 years to finish all military projects


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> I said superior technology for Army
> do you know what about Army ?


HAHAHAHAHAHA! Now you're changing your words! 

You kept talking about all these systems,Turkey has superior tanks and UAVs and UCAVs and anti-ship missiles and air defence and has TFX and MIUS and TF-2000 etc etc.

And now... "I said for Army".

What is that,lollipops? Hadi bre,hadi git. Hadi go play some Call of Duty.

Turkiye is on the road to economic collapse because of your foreign and financial policy. Keep building aircraft carriers.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> HAHAHAHAHAHA! Now you're changing your words!
> 
> You kept talking about all these systems,Turkey has superior tanks and UAVs and UCAVs and anti-ship missiles and air defence and has TFX and MIUS and TF-2000 etc etc.



You are a liar as always

I just talked about Army ( superior OMTAS , TRLG-230 , Ballistic and Cruise Missiles , EW Systems and UCAVs ) to compare with tiny and weak German-French Armies


MIUS,TFX,TF2000 for Navy and Airforce .......




Foinikas said:


> And now... "I said for Army".
> 
> What is that,lollipops? Hadi bre,hadi git. Hadi go play some Call of Duty.



you go and play Call of Duty.





Foinikas said:


> Turkiye is on the road to economic collapse because of your foreign and financial policy. Keep building aircraft carriers.



keep dreaming dream is free

even Turkiye spent over $100 billion for humanitarian aid to other countries in the last 12 years


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## Abid123

Foinikas is obsessed with Turkey.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You are a liar as always
> 
> I just talked about Army ( OMTAS , TRLG-230 , Ballistic and Cruise Missiles and UCAVs ) to compare with tiny and weak German-French Armies


You're a hypocrite then,because you keep talking about Army in the sense of Armed Forces,not Land Forces specifically and you constantly brag about Turkish superiority in everything. 

Accept the fact that you're acting like a dick. Everyone told you. And all you do is call everyone "another boy who knows nothing about history and military". Well,hello? That's actually you. And everyone in here has been telling you,that you're the ignorant one. Get over it and go back to Telemarketing in Germany.



Abid123 said:


> Foinikas is obsessed with Turkey.


Educated post by Abid,the part-time trollmann fran Norge. As much as you are obsessed with India probably.


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You're a hypocrite then,because you keep talking about Army in the sense of Armed Forces,not Land Forces specifically and you constantly brag about Turkish superiority in everything.



You are a liar

My posts are here
then show me and prove it

I just compare Armies





Foinikas said:


> Accept the fact that you're acting like a dick. Everyone told you. And all you do is call everyone "another boy who knows nothing about history and military". Well,hello? That's actually you. And everyone in here has been telling you,that you're the ignorant one. Get over it and go back to Telemarketing in Germany.



You are acting like pussy
dreaming about weak and tiny European Armies ....

when I prove that Turkish Army is superior , then You jumped TFX-MIUS-TF-2000 projects

yes these Turkish projects also will be superior to compare with trash FREMM,Rafale,etc

but I just talked about Army

pathetic French technology SYLVER VLS without quad pack capability

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## dani92

MMM-E said:


> Yes its so funny
> You pathetic guys still dreaming about outdated Tank concept from ww2 .... lol
> 
> pathetic Europe without UCAVs
> 
> 
> *Turkiye has superior technologies to turn tiny weak outdated German , French Armies into crap of metal*
> 
> We perefer 250 Turkish UCAVs instead of 2.500 pathetic Tanks
> View attachment 851629
> 
> View attachment 851632
> 
> View attachment 851631
> 
> View attachment 851628


All of these junk drones can’t fly without the European technology which you call outdated🤣

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## MMM-E

Abid123 said:


> Foinikas is obsessed with Turkey.




not only Foinikas but also Greek PM Mitsotakis , Greek FM Dendias are crying everywhere like little girls about Turkiye



dani92 said:


> All of these junk drones can’t fly without the European technology which you call outdated🤣



another stupid Troll

Turkish UCAVs have no European technology ..you stupid fuckwit

even Europeans have no their own UCAV ....lol


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> not only Foinikas but also Greek PM Mitsotakis , Greek FM Dendias are crying everywhere like little girls about Turkiye


For you everyone is crying,except Erdoğan and yourself. Even the Russians,even the Americans. And yet,you're the ones running behind the ones you used to mock and you're the ones who haven't stopped talking about Mitsotaki's visit to Washington. It's been weeks. Get over it.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> For you everyone is crying,except Erdoğan and yourself. Even the Russians,even the Americans. And yet,you're the ones running behind the ones you used to mock and you're the ones who haven't stopped talking about Mitsotaki's visit to Washington. It's been weeks. Get over it.



We Turks fought USA-France-Russia and their proxies PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , WAGNER , SAA , IRGC , etc in İraq,Syria,Libya

You Greeks keep crying everywhere like little girls to stop Turkiye

Your Greek PM Mitsotakis cried in Washington not to sell F-16V to Turkiye

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## dani92

Foinikas said:


> You know what is hilarious?
> 
> You say Turkiye has superior technology from Britain,France and Germany.
> 
> Yet,you ask the British to sell you Eurofighters and help you with the TFX engine.
> 
> Yet,you want to buy SAMP-T from France.
> 
> Yet,you have been buying German submarines and asked them to sell you an engine for the Altay.
> 
> Yet,you asked the Americans to let you back in the F-35 program.


They have technology even aliens, predators, and terminators don’t have they have technology superior G.I. Joe.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We Turks fought USA-France-Russia and their proxies PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , WAGNER , SAA , IRGC , etc in İraq,Syria,Libya
> 
> You Greeks keep crying everywhere like little girls to stop Turkiye
> 
> Your Mitsotakis cried in Washington not to sell F-16V to Turkiye


You say it so many times,it seems that you don't believe it yourself 😂😂😂 

And if Mitsotakis asked them to block the sale,why are you crying for two weeks? You can't believe it,can you? It bothers you,because he got invited and your Sultan doesn't get to talk in the Congress or even get invited at all.



dani92 said:


> They have technology even aliens, predators, and terminators don’t have they have technology superior to that of gundam franchise.


Predator visited Ottoman Turkey and found the secrets to war technology

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## dani92

Foinikas said:


> You say it so many times,it seems that you don't believe it yourself 😂😂😂
> 
> And if Mitsotakis asked them to block the sale,why are you crying for two weeks? You can't believe it,can you? It bothers you,because he got invited and your Sultan doesn't get to talk in the Congress or even get invited at all.
> 
> 
> Predator visited Ottoman Turkey and found the secrets to war technology


and even the Cephs from crysis game were surprised by the ottoman technology so did metal gear solid.

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Your Greek PM Mitsotakis cried in Washington not to sell F-16V to Turkiye


Bring me a statement by Mitsotakis when he was in the US (Biden and Congress), which says the name of Turkey? 
Only one....


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You say it so many times,it seems that you don't believe it yourself 😂😂😂
> 
> And if Mitsotakis asked them to block the sale,why are you crying for two weeks? You can't believe it,can you? It bothers you,because he got invited and your Sultan doesn't get to talk in the Congress or even get invited at all.
> 
> 
> Predator visited Ottoman Turkey and found the secrets to war technology



Only puppet and loser Greeks, FETO,PKK,,Armenians to talk in the Congress

keep crying losers


smart USA-France-İsrael uses Greeks, FETO,PKK,,Armenians as pawns against Turkiye


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Only puppet and loser Greeks, FETO,PKK,,Armenians to talk in the Congress
> 
> keep crying losers


So everybody is a puppet,except Turkey. Turkey is the only sovereign country in the world. Right,ok. Thank you.

So,why did it hurt you so much that Mitsotakis went to Washington and was given such a reception?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Predator visited Ottoman Turkey and found the secrets to war technology



PREDATOR is not European .... but American technology

only Turkiye and USA have UCAV technologies in NATO

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> PREDATOR is not European .... but American technology
> 
> only Turkiye and USA have UCAV technologies in NATO


BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! 

@dani92 @Akritas AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh Kotol u so stewpid!

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> So,why did it hurt you so much that Mitsotakis went to Washington and was given such a reception?



We have no hurt
We have to see real face of liar Greeks

Mitsotakis visited Turkiye to meet Erdogan and both leaders agreed not interfering 3rd countries between Greece and Turkiye

and Mitsotakis cried in Washington please stop Turkiye , please not to sell F-16V to Turkiye

act like real enemy ..... or stop being liar and hypocrite



Foinikas said:


> BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
> 
> @dani92 @Akritas AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
> 
> Oh Kotol u so stewpid!



another stupid post from you


----------



## dani92

MMM-E said:


> PREDATOR is not European .... but American technology
> 
> only Turkiye and USA have UCAV technologies in NATO


We are mocking you we are talking about the predator alien movie franchise and terminator movie franchise which we say turkey have superior technology to them.

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## Attila the Hun

Turkish weapons better than Greece's . But not better than France's. But better than USA. But not so good as Cyprus, but better than Russia. 

Am I getting it right??


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We have no hurt
> We have to see real face of liar Greeks


If you have no hurt,why has Erdogan,Cavusoglu and the Turkish media been talking about it for 2 weeks straight?

And in the forum,you're the only person constantly talking about it. Really,you're the only one mentioning it again and again.
Can't you see that *you're* the one who's been crying?



MMM-E said:


> Mitsotakis visited Turkiye to meet Erdogan and both leaders agreed not interfering 3rd countries between Greece and Turkiye
> 
> and just a few weeks after Mitsotakis cried in Washington please stop Turkiye , please not to sell F-16V to Turkiye


Because Erdogan started sending F-16s and UAVs over our FIR again. Nobody can trust Erdogan. Everybody knows that now. Both Russians and Americans and even the Ukrainians.



MMM-E said:


> another stupid post from you


It's not my fault if you don't get what we're talking about 😂 😂😂🤷‍♂️



Attila the Hun said:


> Turkish weapons better than Greece's . But not better than France's. But better than USA. But not so good as Cyprus, but better than Russia.
> 
> Am I getting it right??


The guy said in previous posts,that Turkish army is superior to "weak,pathetic,outdated European armies".

He probably thinks AKP's Turkey can fight USA,Russia and all of Western Europe at the same time and then march to China.

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## MMM-E

dani92 said:


> We are mocking you we are talking about the predator alien movie franchise and terminator movie franchise which we say turkey have superior technology to them.



stupid Trolls from backward countries can not develop even Cruise Missile
go and mock your backward countries


----------



## dani92

Foinikas said:


> If you have no hurt,why has Erdogan,Cavusoglu and the Turkish media been talking about it for 2 weeks straight?
> 
> And in the forum,you're the only person constantly talking about it. Really,you're the only one mentioning it again and again.
> Can't you see that *you're* the one who's been crying?
> 
> 
> Because the Erdogan started sending F-16s and UAVs over our FIR again. Nobody can trust Erdogan. Everybody knows that now. Both Russians and Americans and even the Ukrainians.
> 
> 
> It's not my fault if you don't get what we're talking about 😂 😂😂🤷‍♂️


It’s funny they say they are sovereign nation yet they keep kiss the west Asss also they said they fought he crusaders and western imperialism yet they are members of nato and keep begging to get in the EU😂🤣



Attila the Hun said:


> Turkish weapons better than Greece's . But not better than France's. But better than USA. But not so good as Cyprus, but better than Russia.
> 
> Am I getting it right??


According to him turkey have superior technology to that of alien and predators franchise and terminator franchise abd engender superior to that of crysis, call of duty, mass effect, metal gear solid, gi joe titanfall and halo.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> If you have no hurt,why has Erdogan,Cavusoglu and the Turkish media been talking about it for 2 weeks straight?



They show real face of liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis




Foinikas said:


> Because the Erdogan started sending F-16s and UAVs over our FIR again. Nobody can trust Erdogan. Everybody knows that now. Both Russians and Americans and even the Ukrainians.



lol
then send your trash Rafales against Turkish instead of crying in washington


only losers crying about ERDOGAN


----------



## Foinikas

dani92 said:


> It’s funny they say they are sovereign nation yet they keep kiss the west Asss also they said they fought he crusaders and western imperialism yet they are members of nato and keep begging to get in the EU😂🤣


Bro,I remember Erdogan a few ago saying:

-Germans are Nazis
-Mocked Macron of having mental problems
-Accused Israel of genocide against the Palestinians
-Accused the Americans of genocide against the natives and called them a bunch of things.
-Called the Saudis and the Emiratis terrorists and evil this and evil that.

Then he went to Saudi Arabia,UAE and invited the Israelis in Turkey.

He asked to see Biden,he was rejected,he went to see Putin,he came back disappointed,he asked for F-16Vs. 

He shook hands with Macron in the conference about Ukraine.

We're talking about a big "sovereign" nation. As soon as the lira falls,all evil terrorists become good investors again.

He says Palestinians are brothers,he rekindles relations with Israel.

Says interest is haram and meanwhile this isn't haram?

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## MMM-E

dani92 said:


> According to him turkey have superior technology to that of alien and predators franchise and terminator franchise abd engender superior to that of crysis, call of duty, mass effect, metal gear solid, gi joe titanfall and halo.



What a stupid Troll


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> They show real face of liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis


Did you understand what I wrote? Do you have the mental capacity to understand that it was Erdogan who broke the deal and trust first?


MMM-E said:


> lol
> then send your trash Rafales against Turkish instead of crying in washington
> 
> 
> only losers crying about ERDOGAN


Habibi,you're the only one crying about it on the forum,you're the one who keeps talking about it. That shows it hurts you a lot.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Bro,I remember Erdogan a few ago saying:
> 
> -Germans are Nazis
> -Mocked Macron of having mental problems
> -Accused Israel of genocide against the Palestinians
> -Accused the Americans of genocide against the natives and called them a bunch of things.
> -Called the Saudis and the Emiratis terrorists and evil this and evil that.
> 
> Then he went to Saudi Arabia,UAE and invited the Israelis in Turkey.
> 
> He asked to see Biden,he was rejected,he went to see Putin,he came back disappointed,he asked for F-16Vs.
> 
> He shook hands with Macron in the conference about Ukraine.
> 
> We're talking about a big "sovereign" nation. As soon as the lira falls,all evil terrorists become good investors again.
> 
> He says Palestinians are brothers,he rekindles relations with Israel.
> 
> Says interest is haram and meanwhile this isn't haram?
> 
> View attachment 851939



The UAE,İsrael came to Turkiye for peace
S.Arabia invited Erdogan for praying in holy Mecca

Greece left alone like naked loser , and Mitsotakis went to USA,Germany for crying .....lol



Foinikas said:


> Did you understand what I wrote? Do you have the mental capacity to understand that it was Erdogan who broke the deal and trust first?



we dont care about liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis anymore

we will show your place as like 1922,1974,1996
dont worry


----------



## dani92

MMM-E said:


> What a stupid Troll


Everyone on this forum mock your unreal stupidity who lives in on other world lol.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> The UAE,İsrael came to Turkiye for peace
> S.Arabia invited Erdogan for praying in holy Mecca


Please tell us how filthy rich countries asked for peace with inflation diplomatically isolated Turkey 😂



MMM-E said:


> we will show your place as like 1922,1974,1996
> dont worry


You forget 1912 and WWI when we sank your fleet and you didn't dare leave the Dardanelles for 20 years.



MMM-E said:


> we dont care about liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis anymore


How retarded are you? Erdogan broke the deal and the talks and you still say "liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis". You don't have the mental capacity to discuss with other people.

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## Beny Karachun

reflecthofgeismar said:


> It - just every other APS which is available atm- CAN't defend against top down attacks...
> 
> Trophy is relative slow, especially compared to Rheinmetall ADS/StrikeShield (built in with AMAP modules).
> And radar based, so very high signature.
> Is Trophy effective against APFSDS?
> ADS is.
> It's nice that it qualified against APFSDS-rounds in the 2000s.
> I mean still better than crappy "turkish" (ukrainian copied) APS.
> Trophy is the "test" for the Germans in the mean time - because of our extremely sharp rules, Germans wanna have later "infantry-safe" APS or at least most possible safe for operating near by infantry, so Rheinmetall needs to refine their ADS and until then we will test-use the (NOT infantry-friendly) Trophy for a company or 2 companies of Leo2 ...
> Was the same story with ERA in german service. Took only 40 yrs, LOL.
> Don't forget it was Manfred Held who patented ERA and worked with Israelis together but it took so long to make it EFFICIENT and more safer for Infantry. Diehl is producing this infantry-"friendly" ERA for German Puma as example.
> Sometimes I wish Germans would rush their products like the Turks.
> Then we would already have the 130mm.
> 
> 
> https://www.ads-protection.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/RPS-folder-030719.pdf


Trophy is designed for top down attacks, at a limited angle. It won't work for 90 degrees, but it will work against Javelins. 
There's a reason why it's pointed up.







Trophy isn't slow at all lol, what do you mean? Have you seen how fast it aims?

Trophy isn't against APFSDS because it's designed for Israel's needs and Israel isn't threatened by APFSDS. ADS won't work against APFSDS. If you want something to counter APFSDS you could buy the Iron Fist, like the UK.





I doubt ADS will stop an APFSDS shell completely, anything less than a tank/IFV would still be penetrated by what's left of the APFSDS shell, unless the shell is completely vaporized. 


ADS is nothing more than fancy ERA, has tons of disadvantages including weight.
Its *BIGGEST *disadvantage is it can't protect the front of any sloped tank, there's no 360 degree protection and that's why no one will ever buy it.



Notice how it only protects the flat angled sides of the tanks. 



What would happen if an RPG would hit this MRAP at the most likely place, the engine bay/window from the front? They'd all be dead.

Here's the best example:




Engine bay is not protected.

This system is completely inferior to Trophy/Iron Fist.


Do you know the advantages of the Trophy? The Trophy isn't designed just to protect the tank, it's also designed to kill the threat.

Since 2014 the Trophy has been upgraded, once it detects a missile has been launched, the system notifies the crew on the whereabouts of the enemy and in a push of a button it automatically rotates the turret to the location the missile was fired from. 

So from the view of the ATGM operator, almost as soon as he fires it, he sees the tank aiming and shooting at him, even if the shell misses (Most likely it won't), the threat will run away.



reflecthofgeismar said:


> Then we would already have the 130mm.
> https://www.ads-protection.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/RPS-folder-030719.pdf


130mm might be a good addition though.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Please tell us how filthy rich countries asked for peace with inflation diplomatically isolated Turkey 😂



without American protection S.Arabia and The Uae are nothing
They have money but no military power .... İran easly can invade both S.Arabia and The Uae

OBAMA and BIDEN dont care about Gulf States 
even in 2021 , USA has removed its most advanced missile defense system and PATRIOT batteries from Saudi Arabia

also S.Arabia is so happy because Turkiye transferred of journalist Jamal Khashoggi trial to S.Arabia


so Turkiye and Saudi Arabia agreed to increase all kinds of political, military and economic relations to start a new era



Foinikas said:


> How retarded are you? Erdogan broke the deal and the talks and you still say "liar and hypocrite Mitsotakis". You don't have the mental capacity to discuss with other people.



Your Troll team have no any military-politic knowledge to discuss with me

your liar , hypocrite , puppet Mitsotakis broke deal and cried like little girls in Washington 
( please stop Turkiye , please not to sell F-16V to Turkiye ) pathetic puppet


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Trophy is designed for top down attacks, at a limited angle. It won't work for 90 degrees, but it will work against Javelins.



Turkish UCAVs use smart munitions and TROPHY can not stop Turkish UCAVs

death comes from above


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Turkish UCAVs use smart munitions and TROPHY can not stop Turkish UCAVs
> 
> death comes from above


Trophy can unless the ATGM comes at an 80-90 degree angle.

Anyways, your UCAVs only faced trash tier Russian air defenses, against a trained force with good, automated air defenses, your 200kmph drones are easy prey.

You could try and fly low but then you can't fire ATGMs

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## MMM-E

*GOKSUNGUR JEMSAH supersonic fake decoy Drone*



Weight of less than 100 kg
Range of 300 km

it will be used to deceive and confuse the opponent's defense systems during the battle, and to consume their missiles by waking them early and causing them to fire incorrectly

GOKSUNGUR decoy Drone can be programmed in advance and is launched to enemy air defense positions before an air attack, deceiving the enemy air defense systems, reducing the casualties of friendly aircraft and allowing them to operate in survivability

low-cost decoy Drone for Suppression of Enemy Air Defense (SEAD) missions






American MALD
İsraeli TALD-ITALD
Turkish GOKSUNGUR

*Good luck to Enemy Air Defense Systems , They will need it*


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Trophy can unless the ATGM comes at an 80-90 degree angle.
> 
> Anyways, your UCAVs only faced trash tier Russian air defenses, against a trained force with good, automated air defenses, your 200kmph drones are easy prey.
> 
> You could try and fly low but then you can't fire ATGMs



You called trash tier Russian air defenses .... so funny
even outdated S125 kicked American stealth F-117 in Serbia
even outdated S200 kicked Israeli F-16 in Syria

Radars can not detect and trace TB-2 UCAVs because of tiny platform with very low flight speed


btw Your 70-150 km IRON-DOME , SPYDER , BARAK-8 , DAVID SLING Air Defense Systems can not engage on Turkish AKSUNGUR , AKINCI and upcoming KIZILELMA UCAVs armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ and SOM Missiles

American UCAVs armed with only 8-22 km Missiles-Guided Bombs
but hunter killer Turkish UCAVs armed with 12-30-40-150-250 km Missiles-Guided Munitions


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> You called trash tier Russian air defenses .... so funny
> even outdated S125 kicked American stealth F-117 in Serbia
> even outdated S200 kicked Israeli F-16 in Syria
> 
> Radars can not detect and trace TB-2 UCAVs because of tiny platform with very low flight speed
> 
> 
> btw Your 70-150 km IRON-DOME , SPYDER , BARAK-8 , DAVID SLING Air Defense Systems can not engage on Turkish AKSUNGUR , AKINCI and upcoming KIZILELMA UCAVs armed with 150-250 km TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ and SOM Missiles
> 
> American UCAVs armed with only 8-22 km Missiles-Guided Bombs
> but hunter killer Turkish UCAVs armed with 12-30-40-150-250 km Missiles-Guided Munitions


All flukes, hundreds of F-117 and thousands of F-16 sorties in which thousands of Russian SAMs were fired and yet only 1 F-16 and only 1 F-117 were shot down.

F-117 had its weapons bay open in a known bombing run and the F-16 had 20 S-200 missiles fired at it, last one hit him.

Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense

Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)

For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.

Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.


----------



## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> All flukes, hundreds of F-117 and thousands of F-16 sorties in which thousands of Russian SAMs were fired and yet only 1 F-16 and only 1 F-117 were shot down.
> 
> F-117 had its weapons bay open in a known bombing run and the F-16 had 20 S-200 missiles fired at it, last one hit him.
> 
> Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense
> 
> Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)
> 
> For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.
> 
> Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.


Even if a pentagon military advisor comes and explains things to him,he will still say "so funny,pathetic American technology can't compare to superior Turkish army"

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Radars can trace TB-2, it's not a stealthy drone, don't say nonsense




Bayraktar TB-2 UCAV has been designed to emit a low-radar signature
it's slow speed and size, which give it a low radar cross section making it very likely that it fell below the detection threshold of many Radars


Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone

Greeks learned about this from flightradar24.com







Pantsir-S1 (EHF/UHF)
10 km RCS 0,1 m2
7 km RCS 0,03 m2


The TB-2 UCAV speed is at a very low level of 130 km/h. Since radars are usually programmed to jets and rockets, TB2s can bypass the radar barrier

for example The air defense systems can detect aircrafts below 360 km/h at a distance of 6.4 km and at an altitude of 5 km.

TB-2 can fly slower than 130 km/h. It can fire ammunition from altitudes above 5.5 km.

even S-300s perceive flights at speeds below 180 km/h as an internal malfunction and cannot follow it..... therefore Syrian S200 S300 could not anything against Turkish TB-2 UCAVs

so hard to detect and track TB-2 UCAVs
needs to use Fighter Jet radars to intercept TB-2s


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone


So you admit that Turkey violates our air space.


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone
> 
> Greeks learned about this from flightradar24.com


Do you understand what you are writing?

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Davids Sling is 300 kilometers range, also, each one of those air defenses can intercept any missile your drones could fire (Could even intercept mortars)



300 km against UCAVs ? no

maybe against AEWCs or Bombers (depending on the engagement dynamics)



and Tel Aviv , Haifa , etc have altitude of 5 m ( see level )

Turkish SOM Cruise Missile is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m
and attack senario will be from Sea to land over the Eastern Mediterranean

Israeli Air Defense Systems maybe good for İranian Ballistic Missiles
how to stop Turkish SOM Cruise Missile which flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m ?


also Russian S400 is located at sea level in Latakia region of Syria

so difficult to intercept state of the art stealth SOM Cruise Missile


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> For 150-250 kilometer range you need visual contact, you won't have any, and our air defenses outrange that.
> 
> Also those are not TV guided missiles, they're laser guided rockets. Need constant lasing.



*150 km CAKIR New generation Cruise Missile with jamming capability*​
Guidance = INS , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink , artificial intelligence


For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles

The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the targets










*Turkiye rules technologies*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> 300 km against UCAVs ? no


Israeli's have Patriot,Iron Dome,David's Sling. 

They probably have Spyder and Drone Dome too deployed. If you've got balls,try to send a couple of UCAVs that way and see what happens.


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Beny Karachun said:


> Trophy is designed for top down attacks, at a limited angle. It won't work for 90 degrees, but it will work against Javelins.
> There's a reason why it's pointed up.
> View attachment 851948
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trophy isn't slow at all lol, what do you mean? Have you seen how fast it aims?
> 
> Trophy isn't against APFSDS because it's designed for Israel's needs and Israel isn't threatened by APFSDS. ADS won't work against APFSDS. If you want something to counter APFSDS you could buy the Iron Fist, like the UK.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I doubt ADS will stop an APFSDS shell completely, anything less than a tank/IFV would still be penetrated by what's left of the APFSDS shell, unless the shell is completely vaporized.
> 
> 
> ADS is nothing more than fancy ERA, has tons of disadvantages including weight.
> Its *BIGGEST *disadvantage is it can't protect the front of any sloped tank, there's no 360 degree protection and that's why no one will ever buy it.
> View attachment 851950
> Notice how it only protects the flat angled sides of the tanks.
> View attachment 851952
> What would happen if an RPG would hit this MRAP at the most likely place, the engine bay/window from the front? They'd all be dead.
> 
> Here's the best example:
> View attachment 851953
> 
> Engine bay is not protected.
> 
> This system is completely inferior to Trophy/Iron Fist.
> 
> 
> Do you know the advantages of the Trophy? The Trophy isn't designed just to protect the tank, it's also designed to kill the threat.
> 
> Since 2014 the Trophy has been upgraded, once it detects a missile has been launched, the system notifies the crew on the whereabouts of the enemy and in a push of a button it automatically rotates the turret to the location the missile was fired from.
> 
> So from the view of the ATGM operator, almost as soon as he fires it, he sees the tank aiming and shooting at him, even if the shell misses (Most likely it won't), the threat will run away.
> 
> 
> 130mm might be a good addition though.




Greetings!
Good writing but not completely true.








Rheinmetall tests new Active Defense System under live fire


Defense supplier Rheinmetall AG's newly developed Active Defense System (AMAP-ADS) is designed to provide an unmatched level of protection to land vehicles through the use of sophisticated threat detection, identification and nullification technology that takes just milliseconds to react. The…




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Rheinmetall ADS The Active Defence System â€“ Test scenarios


The Rheinmetall Active Defence System (ADS) for light to heavy vehicles combines performance and innovation. ADS is able to counteract ...




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__





AMAP-ADS - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org




US testings​A Textron ASV vehicle has been modified and equipped with the AMAP-ADS hardkill-system. Then it was tested 6 weeks extensively at Redstone Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama. These tests were overseen by the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Different types of RPGs and ATGMs were launched at various spots like the sides or the roof from close range (15 metres (49 ft), including multi-hit attacks, in which multiple threats were used in a short period of time. AMAP-ADS met or even exceeded all US requirements during the tests. The operationability in hot climates was also proven.

Rheinmtall ADS/StrikeShield is working as the fastest.
Can work vs top down - like Trophy only to a certain angle.
You have AMAP passive armor WITH the ADS so you could place it in front of the engine.
Diehl AVePS is like Iron Fist, launcher based, 360° 4x+ launch tubes.
Both of them were tested in the 2000s against (then) current APFSDS and weakened them so much that a stronger vehicle woulnd't take substantial damage.
The older variants were not heavy, 140kg for lighter vehicles and 500kg for heavier vehicles and since it has become StrikeShield it's built in AMAP armor modules.
100% 500-560 microseconds is faster than Trophy.
Problem with Trophy is against Peer enemies, they will detect the radar signature very early.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Israeli's have Patriot,Iron Dome,David's Sling.
> 
> They probably have Spyder and Drone Dome too deployed. If you've got balls,try to send a couple of UCAVs that way and see what happens.



dont worry , if needed
Turkiye has many sophisticated weapons to hit AD Systems
from Balistic Missiles to Cruise Missiles and Anti-radiation Drones


Israeli AD Systems are located at sea level in Tel Aviv can not detect and trace SOM Cruise Missile which is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m


Tel Aviv and Lakatia ( Syria ) are located at sea level .... so bad situation for defense


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> dont worry , if needed
> Turkiye has many sophisticated weapons to hit AD Systems
> from Balistic Missiles to Cruise Missiles and Anti-radiation Drones
> 
> 
> Israeli AD Systems are located at sea level in Tel Aviv can not detect and trace SOM Cruise Missile which is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m
> 
> 
> Tel Aviv and Lakatia ( Syria ) are located at sea level .... so bad for defense


Yes the super-amazing SOM cruise missile that you've been blabbering about for months on. EVerything is easy for you. Turkey launches a few Anti-radiation and ballistic missiles and Israel is gone. So easy in your mind.

Meanwhile,I was just watching on TV,a discussion at a Turkish channel,where a military analyst said Greece tends to get superiority in the Aegean with the Rafale,F-35,Belharra and 214 submarines. 

And makes me wonder,what kind of a world you live in. Because everyone on Turkish TV,from former military officers to military analysts,defence experts and current officers,talk about Greek improvement in arms and even superiority in some aspects like the jet fighters....and yet* only you *present some parallel universe version of a Turkey so strong and advanced,nobody in the world has a chance to fight against it.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Yes the super-amazing SOM cruise missile that you've been blabbering about for months on. EVerything is easy for you. Turkey launches a few Anti-radiation and ballistic missiles and Israel is gone. So easy in your mind.




Go and learn about military then come to discuss

We have seen Russian MOSKVA Cruiser against Ukranian NEPTUN Missile
We have seen American PATRIOT against Iranian Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones in S.Arabia









Turkiye is not buying but producing missiles,kamikaze Drones

to produce 3.000 Missiles,kamikaze Drones so enough to hit all military targets


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Go and learn about military then come to discuss


Yes,I know military history. What are YOU doing here? Telemarketing? Order 5 SOM missiles and get a TB2 for free? 




MMM-E said:


> to produce 3.000 Missiles,kamikaze Drones so enough to hit all military targets


What the f does "to produce" mean,you pathetic Gestarbeiter? 

That you _*have*_ produced or that you* will *produce or that you _*could*_ produce?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Meanwhile,I was just watching on TV,a discussion at a Turkish channel,where a military analyst said Greece tends to get superiority in the Aegean with the Rafale,F-35,Belharra and 214 submarines.



from crypto FETO Members or anti-Erdogan CHP capulcu ? so funny

I also watching on TV
on Turkish TV,from former military officers to military analysts,defence experts everybody says Greece is an American puppet and Greece will lose Islands in a war 


stop dreaming and wake up ... Greece has no F35 and Belharra

if you are talking about future weapons for Greece in 2028-2030s then talk about also future weapons for Turkiye .... Turks are not sleeping


*1-- * if Greece buys 24 Rafales 
then Turkiye bought 144+48 S400 Air Defense Missiles to block Rafales over the Aegean

also 150 km SIPER Air Defense System is coming


*2--* if Greece has 4 Type-214 Submarines , 
then Turkiye 6 Type-214TN Submarines between 2022 and 2027

also STM-500 mini attack Submarines

*3-- *İf Greece buys 4 BELHARRA Frigates between 2025-2028
then 4 ISTIF Frigates with superior fire power between 2023 and 2027

also first TF-2000 Destroyer enter service in 2027

even land based ATMACA , CAKIR , TRLG-230 , KUZGUN-TJ Missiles can turn BELHARRA Frigates into crap of metal in the Aegean


*4 --* if Greece buys F35 after 2027
then Turkish KIZILELMA unmanned Fighter Jet by 2025
and Turkish TFX air superiority Fighter Jet by 2029


And makes me wonder,what kind of a world you live in 
and yet* only you *present some parallel universe version of a Greece so strong and advanced

keep dreaming dream is free


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> from crypto FETO Members or anti-Erdogan CHP capulcu ? so funny
> 
> I also watching on TV
> on Turkish TV,from former military officers to military analysts,defence experts everybody says Greece is an American puppet and Greece will lose Islands in a war
> 
> 
> stop dreaming and wake up ... Greece has no F35 and Belharra
> 
> if you are talking about future weapons for Greece in 2028-2030s then talk about also future weapons for Turkiye .... Turks are not sleeping
> 
> 
> *1-- * if Greece buys 24 Rafales
> then Turkiye bought 144+48 S400 Air Defense Missiles to block Rafales over the Aegean
> 
> also 150 km SIPER Air Defense System is coming
> 
> 
> *2--* if Greece has 4 Type-214 Submarines ,
> then Turkiye 6 Type-214TN Submarines between 2022 and 2027
> 
> also STM-500 mini attack Submarines
> 
> *3-- *İf Greece buys 4 BELHARRA Frigates between 2025-2028
> then 4 ISTIF Frigates with superior fire power between 2023 and 2027
> 
> also first TF-2000 Destroyer enter service in 2027
> 
> even land based ATMACA , CAKIR , TRLG-230 , KUZGUN-TJ Missiles can turn BELHARRA Frigates into crap of metal in the Aegean
> 
> 
> *4 --* if Greece buys F35 after 2027
> then Turkish KIZILELMA unmanned Fighter Jet by 2025
> and Turkish TFX air superiority Fighter Jet by 2029
> 
> 
> And makes me wonder,what kind of a world you live in
> and yet* only you *present some parallel universe version of a Greece so strong and advanced
> 
> keep dreaming dream is free


Do you have something new to say? If not,don't post the same bull that you've posted 3,000 times before. Nobody's going to read it.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Yes,I know military history. What are YOU doing here? Telemarketing? Order 5 SOM missiles and get a TB2 for free?



I talked to İsraeli guy ... and you jumped like a puppet
and you started telemarketing İsraeli AD Systems ... lol

we have seen loser İsraeli Army against Hezbollah in 2006

on the other hand Turkish Army easly kicked Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah in Idlib Syria within 4 days

Thanks to game changer TB-2 UCAVs
watch superior Turkish technology and new war doctrine in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems







Foinikas said:


> Do you have something new to say? If not,don't post the same bull that you've posted 3,000 times before. Nobody's going to read it.



truth and my posts hurts you


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> we have seen loser İsraeli Army against Hezbollah in 2006


How exactly did Israel lose in 2006? Hmm? I thought you said you "knew" military history.
Wasn't Beirut and South Lebanon bombed to pieces and Hizbollah suffered hundreds and hundreds of casualties? 

But skip 2006. Let's see the whole picture










Yup,indeed we've seen Israeli performance.



MMM-E said:


> truth and my posts hurts you


Lol...you've been told off by virtually every nationality on this forum and on this thread. Germans,Greeks,Chinese,British,Israelis,Arabs,Persians,French and even Americans. 

But in your mind,allllll these people are wrong,lying and pathetic and you are the only one here who knows better and speaks the truth. We're talking about some mental problems here...



MMM-E said:


> on the other hand Turkish Army easly kicked Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah in Idlib Syria within 4 days


You easily kicked Russia in Syria? Is that why you lost more than a hundred men in bombings? 



MMM-E said:


> Thanks to game changer TB-2 UCAVs
> watch superior Turkish technology and new war doctrine in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems


Superior Turkish technology? Let's see you fight Israel and compare technology and experience. Maybe your big mouth will finally stop talking nonsense then.

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## dani191

Foinikas said:


> How exactly did Israel lose in 2006? Hmm? I thought you said you "knew" military history.
> Wasn't Beirut and South Lebanon bombed to pieces and Hizbollah suffered hundreds and hundreds of casualties?
> 
> But skip 2006. Let's see the whole picture
> 
> View attachment 852147
> View attachment 852146
> 
> 
> Yup,indeed we've seen Israeli performance.
> 
> 
> Lol...you've been told off by virtually every nationality on this forum and on this thread. Germans,Greeks,Chinese,British,Israelis,Arabs,Persians,French and even Americans.
> 
> But in your mind,allllll these people are wrong,lying and pathetic and you are the only one here who knows better and speaks the truth. We're talking about some mental problems here...
> 
> 
> You easily kicked Russia in Syria? Is that why you lost more than a hundred men in bombings?
> 
> 
> Superior Turkish technology? Let's see you fight Israel and compare technology and experience. Maybe your big mouth will finally stop talking nonsense then.


we develop 300-500 kilowhat laser to deal with that

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Superior Turkish technology? Let's see you fight Israel and compare technology and experience. Maybe your big mouth will finally stop talking nonsense then.



first go beat Hezbolah then come and dream about fighting against regional power Turkiye





Foinikas said:


> You easily kicked Russia in Syria? Is that why you lost more than a hundred men in bombings?



on the other hand
Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah lost 6 generals , 4.000+ troops-militia , 2 Fighter Jets , 8 Helicopters , 8 AD Systems and hundreds of Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,etc in 4 days

even Turkish Armed Forces used oniy 1% of its power

Russian army fled in panic after Turkish attack on Idlib​








Foinikas said:


> Lol...you've been told off by virtually every nationality on this forum and on this thread. Germans,Greeks,Chinese,British,Israelis,Arabs,Persians,French and even Americans.
> 
> But in your mind,allllll these people are wrong,lying and pathetic and you are the only one here who knows better and speaks the truth. We're talking about some mental problems here..



They are all ignorant Trolls who has problem with Turkiye and Erdogan


----------



## MMM-E

dani191 said:


> we develop 300-500 kilowhat laser to deal with that



IRON BEAM is 100 kilowatt, then dream about 500 kilowatt

Israel has no even single mode LASER Weapon technology
only USA and Turkiye in the World .... ( China also working on single mode LASER )


*multi-mode LASER Weapon technology has high energy buy low beam quality*


----------



## Akritas

Foinikas said:


> Yes the super-amazing SOM cruise missile that you've been blabbering about for months on. EVerything is easy for you. Turkey launches a few Anti-radiation and ballistic missiles and Israel is gone. So easy in your mind.
> 
> Meanwhile,I was just watching on TV,a discussion at a Turkish channel,where a military analyst said Greece tends to get superiority in the Aegean with the Rafale,F-35,Belharra and 214 submarines.
> 
> And makes me wonder,what kind of a world you live in. Because everyone on Turkish TV,from former military officers to military analysts,defence experts and current officers,talk about Greek improvement in arms and even superiority in some aspects like the jet fighters....and yet* only you *present some parallel universe version of a Turkey so strong and advanced,nobody in the world has a chance to fight against it.


*The argument of MMM-E reminds me of the argument of Turkey in the UN*, where the Greek delegation , convey the Greek arguments, one by one, article by article, fact by fact, counter-argument to argument, and Turkey repeats the same.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> first go beat Hezbolah then come and dream about fighting against regional power Turkiye
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> on the other hand
> Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah lost 6 generals , 4.000+ troops-militia , 2 Fighter Jets , 8 Helicopters , 8 AD Systems and hundreds of Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,etc in 4 days
> 
> even Turkish Armed Forces used oniy 1% of its power
> 
> Russian army fled in panic after Turkish attack on Idlib​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are all ignorant Trolls who has problem with Turkiye and Erdogan


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *The argument of MMM-E reminds me of the argument of Turkey in the UN*, where the Greek delegation , convey the Greek arguments, one by one, article by article, fact by fact, counter-argument to argument, and Turkey repeats the same.



try to enter MAVI VATAN , if Greece is right by international law
but bandit Greece-France can not enter Turkish EEZ

by international law Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean

as like we kicked criminal savage Greeks in 1974 .... no more tolerance to puppet Greeks 


little puppet Greece hidding behind USA-The EU and barking


*1964-1974 Greeks* : hey Turks if you are brave come and take

*1974 Turks *: We are brave , we came and took , where are you Greeks ?


----------



## Foinikas

Serious military analysis by professor MMM-E.

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## dani191

MMM-E said:


> IRON BEAM is 100 kilowatt, then dream about 500 kilowatt
> 
> Israel has no even single mode LASER Weapon technology
> only USA and Turkiye in the World .... ( China also working on single mode LASER )
> 
> 
> *multi-mode LASER Weapon technology has high energy buy low beam quality*


yes im sure turkey have that best tech lol

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## Foinikas

dani191 said:


> yes im sure turkey have that best tech lol


Don't you know? Only Turkiye in the world! 😂

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## Akritas

Foinikas said:


> Serious military analysis by professor MMM-E.


And yet what he is doing, that is, the style of his answers, *is what Cavousoglou has been doing lately*.
E.g. a week ago he came out and said that Greece has not responded to Turkish letters to the UN. Greece, meanwhile, has responded to both. 
Today, he repeats the same thing. 
Who is he trying to convince?
Obviously the followers of his AKP party, but is also a .... political strategy, w*hich, however, leads to misinformation*.

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## Foinikas

Akritas said:


> And yet what he is doing, that is, the style of his answers, *is what Cavousoglou has been doing lately*.
> E.g. a week ago he came out and said that Greece has not responded to Turkish letters to the UN. Greece, meanwhile, has responded to both.
> Today, he repeats the same thing.
> Who is he trying to convince?
> Obviously the followers of his AKP party, but is also a .... political strategy, w*hich, however, leads to misinformation*.


Man,he talks as if he is the official AKP mouthpiece! Everything Erdogan and Cavusoglu say,he just repeats it here! 
He's been constantly repeating the exact same phrases and long lists of Turkish weapons for months and months. 
No matter what you say,you cannot find logic. When he is cornered about a lost battle or war,he just goes back to repeating his same phrases. 

At first,I tried to talk to him in a logical manner. I tried to debate with him and see if he can have a sense of humor or respect, but there's just absolutely no reasoning with him. It's pointless.

No wonder you'll rarely see other Turks posting on his threads  

Meanwhile,we know where the hypocrisy is...

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> 300 km against UCAVs ? no
> 
> maybe against AEWCs or Bombers (depending on the engagement dynamics)
> 
> 
> 
> and Tel Aviv , Haifa , etc have altitude of 5 m ( see level )
> 
> Turkish SOM Cruise Missile is capable of flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m
> and attack senario will be from Sea to land over the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> Israeli Air Defense Systems maybe good for İranian Ballistic Missiles
> how to stop Turkish SOM Cruise Missile which flying under the radar level at 2.5-3.5 m ?
> 
> 
> also Russian S400 is located at sea level in Latakia region of Syria
> 
> so difficult to intercept state of the art stealth SOM Cruise Missile
> View attachment 852128





MMM-E said:


> Bayraktar TB-2 UCAV has been designed to emit a low-radar signature
> it's slow speed and size, which give it a low radar cross section making it very likely that it fell below the detection threshold of many Radars
> 
> 
> Turkish Bayraktar TB-2 entered Greek airspace for 16km .. and TB-2 Drone was near of American military base in Greece .. and Radars could not detect/trace TB-2 Drone
> 
> Greeks learned about this from flightradar24.com
> 
> 
> View attachment 852119
> 
> 
> Pantsir-S1 (EHF/UHF)
> 10 km RCS 0,1 m2
> 7 km RCS 0,03 m2
> 
> 
> The TB-2 UCAV speed is at a very low level of 130 km/h. Since radars are usually programmed to jets and rockets, TB2s can bypass the radar barrier
> 
> for example The air defense systems can detect aircrafts below 360 km/h at a distance of 6.4 km and at an altitude of 5 km.
> 
> TB-2 can fly slower than 130 km/h. It can fire ammunition from altitudes above 5.5 km.
> 
> even S-300s perceive flights at speeds below 180 km/h as an internal malfunction and cannot follow it..... therefore Syrian S200 S300 could not anything against Turkish TB-2 UCAVs
> 
> so hard to detect and track TB-2 UCAVs
> needs to use Fighter Jet radars to intercept TB-2s


Flying low won't save you, Israel is preparing for anything Iran has, Iran has pretty much anything Turkey has in terms of cruise missiles, ballistic missiles and drones. Israel has blimps with radars for OTH radars, as well has radars on the Golan Heights.





__





Giant missile-detecting balloon begins operational use over northern Israel | The Times of Israel







www-timesofisrael-com.cdn.ampproject.org





Maybe Russian radars don't detect such drones, Israel is not Russia, Iran sends small drones into Israel from Lebanon many times, they fly below the tree lines sometimes, we always detect them. They're smaller than what Turkey has.


You act like no TB 2 drones have been shot down. Ukraine's TB2 drones were depleted. And that's against shit tier Russian air defenses.

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## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> Flying low won't save you, Israel is preparing for anything Iran has, Iran has pretty much anything Turkey has in terms of cruise missiles, ballistic missiles and drones. Israel has blimps with radars for OTH radars, as well has radars on the Golan Heights.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Giant missile-detecting balloon begins operational use over northern Israel | The Times of Israel
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> www-timesofisrael-com.cdn.ampproject.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe Russian radars don't detect such drones, Israel is not Russia, Iran sends small drones into Israel from Lebanon many times, they fly below the tree lines sometimes, we always detect them. They're smaller than what Turkey has.
> 
> 
> You act like no TB 2 drones have been shot down. Ukraine's TB2 drones were depleted. And that's against shit tier Russian air defenses.


Now he's going to mock Iran and tell you that Iran is pathetic compared to Turkey.

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> IRON BEAM is 100 kilowatt, then dream about 500 kilowatt
> 
> Israel has no even single mode LASER Weapon technology
> only USA and Turkiye in the World .... ( China also working on single mode LASER )
> 
> 
> *multi-mode LASER Weapon technology has high energy buy low beam quality*


There's no information on whether Iron Beam is single mode beam or multi mode beam.

There's practically no information about it at all. All there is to know is it could intercept drones, rockets, mortars and ATGMs and anything else that could fly from 10+ kilometers away. This falls into the 100KW range.






Israel literally mounted on a Cesna sized airplane what the US needed a destroyer for. 

You said "Then dream about 500kilowatt" it's ironic when it comes from you, the majority of the weapon systems you boast about are in fact dreams, not reality. It's going to happen eventually.

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## Beny Karachun

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Greetings!
> Good writing but not completely true.
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
> 
> 
> Rheinmetall tests new Active Defense System under live fire
> 
> 
> Defense supplier Rheinmetall AG's newly developed Active Defense System (AMAP-ADS) is designed to provide an unmatched level of protection to land vehicles through the use of sophisticated threat detection, identification and nullification technology that takes just milliseconds to react. The…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> newatlas.com
> 
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> Rheinmetall ADS The Active Defence System â€“ Test scenarios
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> The Rheinmetall Active Defence System (ADS) for light to heavy vehicles combines performance and innovation. ADS is able to counteract ...
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> militaryleak.com
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> AMAP-ADS - Wikipedia
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> en.wikipedia.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> US testings​A Textron ASV vehicle has been modified and equipped with the AMAP-ADS hardkill-system. Then it was tested 6 weeks extensively at Redstone Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama. These tests were overseen by the Office of the Secretary of Defense. Different types of RPGs and ATGMs were launched at various spots like the sides or the roof from close range (15 metres (49 ft), including multi-hit attacks, in which multiple threats were used in a short period of time. AMAP-ADS met or even exceeded all US requirements during the tests. The operationability in hot climates was also proven.
> 
> Rheinmtall ADS/StrikeShield is working as the fastest.
> Can work vs top down - like Trophy only to a certain angle.
> You have AMAP passive armor WITH the ADS so you could place it in front of the engine.
> Diehl AVePS is like Iron Fist, launcher based, 360° 4x+ launch tubes.
> Both of them were tested in the 2000s against (then) current APFSDS and weakened them so much that a stronger vehicle woulnd't take substantial damage.
> The older variants were not heavy, 140kg for lighter vehicles and 500kg for heavier vehicles and since it has become StrikeShield it's built in AMAP armor modules.
> 100% 500-560 microseconds is faster than Trophy.
> Problem with Trophy is against Peer enemies, they will detect the radar signature very early.


Well, as I said, I don't understand the functional difference between AMAP-ADS and modern ERA. 


Having faster reaction time than the Trophy is not disputed, as it's essentially an ERA. Single use "plate". Saying the Trophy is slow is wrong. 
One could argue that the Trophy/Iron Fist are faster because they blows up the threat from 10 meters. 

Merkava uses AESA radars. They're inherently much harder to detect, because they have a much bigger range of frequencies than other radars. That's the reason F-35s and F22s use AESA and remain stealthy. A

There's next generation Trophy APS prototypes already, a mix of Iron Fist and Trophy from what I understood.

As of now the only combat proven, most effective APS is the Trophy, and that's why 700+ units were exported.


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Israel literally mounted on a Cesna sized airplane what the US needed a destroyer for.
> 
> You said "Then dream about 500kilowatt" it's ironic when it comes from you, the majority of the weapon systems you boast about are in fact dreams, not reality. It's going to happen eventually.



so funny

even Turkish 20kw single mode LASER Weapon has much better beam quality than Israeli 100 kw multi mode LASER

Your multi-mode LASER has high energy but beam quality is poor
















Turkish Weapons are combat proven from UCAVs to Radar EW Systems , from Missiles to LASER Weapons against Russian , Chinese and Western weapons in Syria,Libya and Ukraine

Turkiye is the first Country in the World that used LASER Weapon in real conflict zone

*in 2020 , Turkish LASER Weapon turned Chinese made WING LOONG-II UCAV into burned bird in Libya*


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Flying low won't save you, Israel is preparing for anything Iran has, Iran has pretty much anything Turkey has in terms of cruise missiles, ballistic missiles and drones.



only in your dreams


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> so funny
> 
> even Turkish 20kw single mode LASER Weapon has much better beam quality than Israeli 100 kw multi mode LASER
> 
> Your multi-mode LASER has high energy but beam quality is poor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 852325
> 
> View attachment 852326
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish Weapons are combat proven from UCAVs to Radar EW Systems , from Missiles to LASER Weapons against Russian , Chinese and Western weapons in Syria,Libya and Ukraine
> 
> Turkiye is the first Country in the World that used LASER Weapon in real conflict zone
> 
> *in 2020 , Turkish LASER Weapon turned Chinese made WING LOONG-II UCAV into burned bird in Libya*
> View attachment 852332
> 
> View attachment 852331


How do you know if Israeli laser is multi mode or single mode lol?

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Maybe Russian radars don't detect such drones, Israel is not Russia, Iran sends small drones into Israel from Lebanon many times, they fly below the tree lines sometimes, we always detect them. They're smaller than what Turkey has.



not Radars but E/O Systems detect small UAVs




Beny Karachun said:


> You act like no TB 2 drones have been shot down. Ukraine's TB2 drones were depleted. And that's against shit tier Russian air defenses.



Nahh
not TB-2s but Ukraine's MAM-L laser guided munitions were depleted
even Russia used Fighter Jets against TB-2 UCAVs

and TB-2s destroyed over 1.000 of AFVs,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems in Syria,Libya,Karabakh and Ukraine

on the other hand , only a few dozens of TB-2 loses in Syria,Libya,Karabakh and Ukraine



and Israeli technology is a toy to compare with Russian Missile technology

Israel can fight against only home-made Rockets from Palestine ... nothing else






Beny Karachun said:


> How do you know if Israeli laser is multi mode or single mode lol?



We know only USA and Turkiye have developed single mode LASER ( China also working on single mode )

Israel,India,Germany,etc develops multi-mode LASER


We have see İsraeli LASER against plastic UAV ...lol
high energy but poor beam quality

Turkish 20 kw single mode LASER against 22mm steel for Warships

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> not Radars but E/O Systems detect small UAVs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nahh
> not TB-2s but Ukraine's MAM-L laser guided munitions were depleted
> even Russia used Fighter Jets against TB-2 UCAVs
> 
> and TB-2s destroyed over 1.000 of AFVs,Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems in Syria,Libya,Karabakh and Ukraine
> 
> on the other hand , only a few dozens of TB-2 loses in Syria,Libya,Karabakh and Ukraine
> 
> 
> 
> and Israeli technology is a toy to compare with Russian Missile technology
> 
> Israel can fight against only home-made Rockets from Palestine ... nothing else
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We know only USA and Turkiye have developed single mode LASER ( China also working on single mode )
> 
> Israel,India,Germany,etc develops multi-mode LASER
> 
> 
> We have see İsraeli LASER against plastic UAV ...lol
> high energy but poor beam quality
> but still tiny Israel is better than all Islamic countries combined , except Turkiye
> 
> Turkish 20 kw single mode LASER against 22mm steel for Warships
> View attachment 852334


Another stupid post by you.

Day-dreamer Turkey is day-dreaming. Remember we kicked your navy 110 years ago. Even tiny Greece kicked bandit country Turkiye from EEZ. 

Nobody can mess with tiny Greece.

Stop crying now,little baby.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Another stupid post by you.
> 
> Day-dreamer Turkey is day-dreaming. Remember we kicked your navy 110 years ago. Even tiny Greece kicked bandit country Turkiye from EEZ.
> 
> Nobody can mess with tiny Greece.
> 
> Stop crying now,little baby.



another stupid post from you

keep dreaming dream is free
and keep crying everywhere like little girls to stop Turkiye



even Greece+France could not match with Turkiye in the Eastern Mediterranean
only Turkish UCAVs and missile power are enough your pathetic Navies ....lol


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> keep dreaming dream is free


Welcome to the dreamers club. How big do you want your imaginary Turkey?


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Welcome to the dreamers club. How big do you want your imaginary Turkey?




crying little girls

Turkish Frigates carried out radar targeting three times, suggesting a missile strike was imminent,
This is an extremely aggressive act that is unacceptable by an ally against a NATO ship French defence ministry


Pathetic French cried like little girls in NATO
and NATO said stop crying ..lol









France blasts ‘extremely aggressive’ Turkish intervention against NATO mission targeting Libyan arms


France's defence ministry on Wednesday denounced an "extremely aggressive" intervention by Turkish frigates against a French navy vessel participating in a NATO mission in the Mediterranean. Turkey,…




www.france24.com






wth is tiny-weak Greece ?
even your MASTERs can not save you as like 1922,1974,1996


regional super power Turkiye is not Greece or Iraq or Syria or Libya or Mali

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye is the first Country in the World that used LASER Weapon in real conflict zone
> 
> *in 2020 , Turkish LASER Weapon turned Chinese made WING LOONG-II UCAV into burned bird in Libya*


The AN/SEQ-3 Laser Weapon System used by the US Navy,it needs a 50 KW generator and has a range of 1,6 km to fry sensors, burn out motors, and detonate explosive materials.
So the Turks built a laser, that works with the battery of the simple vehicle.......


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> crying little girls
> 
> Turkish Frigates carried out radar targeting three times, suggesting a missile strike was imminent,
> This is an extremely aggressive act that is unacceptable by an ally against a NATO ship French defence ministry
> 
> 
> Pathetic French cried like little girls in NATO
> and NATO said stop crying ..lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> France blasts ‘extremely aggressive’ Turkish intervention against NATO mission targeting Libyan arms
> 
> 
> France's defence ministry on Wednesday denounced an "extremely aggressive" intervention by Turkish frigates against a French navy vessel participating in a NATO mission in the Mediterranean. Turkey,…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.france24.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wth is tiny-weak Greece ?
> even your MASTERs can not save you as like 1922,1974,1996
> 
> 
> regional super power Turkiye is not Greece or Iraq or Syria or Libya or Mali


Can you tell @Beny Karachun and @Akritas about how much money Erdogan gave to muslim countries for charity? You forgot to mention that in this thread.

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## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> Can you tell @Beny Karachun and @Akritas about how much money Erdogan gave to muslim countries for charity? You forgot to mention that in this thread.



100 billion in 10 yrs or so was it?
That's nothing for a so called pöwer cöuntry, that is what Germany spend on 50% of the non-working Turks, Arabs, Africans and fresh 2015 "refugees" in 2 yrs for social welfare. 
Would be better to built a few factories of German companies in Greece (and took them out from Turkey) and give them military aid like the US does with Israel.
5 billion a year military aid but 3/4 is to spend on German military products.

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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> 100 billion in 10 yrs or so was it?
> That's nothing for a so called pöwer cöuntry, that is what Germany spend on 50% of the non-working Turks, Arabs, Africans and fresh 2015 "refugees" in 2 yrs for social welfare.
> Would be better to built a few factories of German companies in Greece (and took them out from Turkey) and give them military aid like the US does with Israel.
> 5 billion a year military aid but 3/4 is to spend on German military products.


Yes! 100 billion dollars in 10 years! Meanwhile,Germany just decided to have a 300 billion euros budget for the Armed Forces,in one year. But hey,weak Germany cannot be compared to superpower Turkiye,right?


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## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> Yes! 100 billion dollars in 10 years! Meanwhile,Germany just decided to have a 300 billion euros budget for the Armed Forces,in one year. But hey,weak Germany cannot be compared to superpower Turkiye,right?



100 billion but this was nessecary after 30 years of "wE dOn'T wAnT wEaPoNs" or anything military related ...
IMO much too small.
% of GDP should be 2.5% + 150 billion instead of 100 billion.
No useless politic/lobby intervention, only military competent people should decide. Politicans need only to say yes - for the money.
Best would be conscription again, but quality conscription (not every donkey to the army).


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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Best would be conscription again, but quality conscription (not every donkey to the army).


That would boost the numbers tremendously. Of course keeping the professional army as well. Nothing like a professional,experienced core of hardened veterans leading a bigger number of conscripts. Just like in the mid to late WWII days,where the Wehrmacht was building units around a core of veterans.


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## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> That would boost the numbers tremendously. Of course keeping the professional army as well. Nothing like a professional,experienced core of hardened veterans leading a bigger number of conscripts. Just like in the mid to late WWII days,where the Wehrmacht was building units around a core of veterans.



According to the CFE Treaty Adaptation Agreement, Germany "may" have (in active units):
3444 battle tanks (weight >= 16.5 t, cannon >=75mm)
3201 infantry fighting vehicle (personnel transport and cannon >=20mm)
80 combat vehicles with heavy armament (weight >= 6.0t, cannon >=75mm)
2255 artillery systems (guns, mortars and rocket launchers >=100mm)
765 fighter planes
280 Attack Helicopters (anything wired for guided missiles)

There are no restrictions for transport tanks or other armored vehicles without the above armament. According to the last report to UNROCA, the "holdings" in the sense of the total stock available in the country (not in active units as required above, but everything lying around somewhere in the depot or in the industry) are: 
26% for main battle tanks 
34% for infantry fighting vehicles 
14% for artillery systems 
31% for fighter planes 
40% for attack helicopters 

For ships there is no restriction according to KSE. The German Navy was limited in terms of numbers and equipment by an agreement of the WEU with regard to "larger" combat units, hence the focus at the time on smaller combat ships that did not fall under them (and parallel constant adjustment of the agreement, especially in terms of technology...)

370,000 personnel, no more than 345,000 of whom were to be in the Army and the Air Force.

*Personal wish:*
150.000-200.000 Army (75.000-100.000 professionals)
75.000 Air Force (50.000 professionals)
25.000 Navy (15.000 professionals)
Because of conscription you can choose the "from the beginning" higher quality candidates.
*Not* included is the SKB (Streitkräftebasis) where you have support elements and military police.

*More wishes:*
Territorial/Home Guard
In every "Bundesland" you have a Brigade with several btl. or reg. with light UNIFORMED infantry who know partisan warfare.
And militarized police forces. 
Not that some MMM-E is building a predator-tech-laser in his basement and threatening the state...


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## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> According to the CFE Treaty Adaptation Agreement, Germany "may" have (in active units):
> 3444 battle tanks (weight >= 16.5 t, cannon >=75mm)
> 3201 infantry fighting vehicle (personnel transport and cannon >=20mm)
> 80 combat vehicles with heavy armament (weight >= 6.0t, cannon >=75mm)
> 2255 artillery systems (guns, mortars and rocket launchers >=100mm)
> 765 fighter planes
> 280 Attack Helicopters (anything wired for guided missiles)
> 
> There are no restrictions for transport tanks or other armored vehicles without the above armament. According to the last report to UNROCA, the "holdings" in the sense of the total stock available in the country (not in active units as required above, but everything lying around somewhere in the depot or in the industry) are:
> 26% for main battle tanks
> 34% for infantry fighting vehicles
> 14% for artillery systems
> 31% for fighter planes
> 40% for attack helicopters
> 
> For ships there is no restriction according to KSE. The German Navy was limited in terms of numbers and equipment by an agreement of the WEU with regard to "larger" combat units, hence the focus at the time on smaller combat ships that did not fall under them (and parallel constant adjustment of the agreement, especially in terms of technology...)
> 
> 370,000 personnel, no more than 345,000 of whom were to be in the Army and the Air Force.
> 
> *Personal wish:*
> 150.000-200.000 Army (75.000-100.000 professionals)
> 75.000 Air Force (50.000 professionals)
> 25.000 Navy (15.000 professionals)
> Because of conscription you can choose the "from the beginning" higher quality candidates.
> *Not* included is the SKB (Streitkräftebasis) where you have support elements and military police.
> 
> *More wishes:*
> Territorial/Home Guard
> In every "Bundesland" you have a Brigade with several btl. or reg. with light UNIFORMED infantry who know partisan warfare.
> And militarized police forces.
> Not that some MMM-E is building a predator-tech-laser in his basement and threatening the state...


I imagine the reply:

"Keep dreaming,dreams are for free. Only Turkiye has this kind of army after USA in NATO. And pathetic USA has old UCAV."


But seriously,I like the idea of a Home Guard. It could work like Yugoslavia's TO in a way. I have a love for such units

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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> 100 billion in 10 yrs or so was it?
> That's nothing for a so called pöwer cöuntry, that is what Germany spend on 50% of the non-working Turks, Arabs, Africans and fresh 2015 "refugees" in 2 yrs for social welfare.



Turkiye would buy Greek+İsraeli+Egyptian militaries combined for $100 billion instead of humanitarian aid to other countries

still tiny Greece is barking to fight against regional super power Turkiye

even I am not talking about Turkiye lost $1 trillion , because of to fight USA-Europe backed PKK/YPG Terrorism since 1985


and pathetic slave Germany ... first save your Germany from USA invasion

also full of old buildings , old airports , etc in Germany

thanks to president ERDOGAN to spent $1 trillion for public projects since 2003 to modernize Turkiye


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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Would be better to built a few factories of German companies in Greece (and took them out from Turkey) and give them military aid like the US does with Israel.
> 5 billion a year military aid but 3/4 is to spend on German military products.



Turkiye doesnt need military aid from other countries
We Turks have our own Defense Industry to develop 750+ military projects to kick all enemies

also Turkiye has great Industry to produce 1.200 products to reduce imports by $120 billion
annually

in 10 years = $1,2 trillion USD


we dont care about tiny Greece and slave Germany


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye would buy Greek+İsraeli+Egyptian militaries combined for $100 billion instead of humanitarian aid to other countries
> 
> still tiny Greece is barking to fight against regional super power Turkiye
> 
> even I am not talking about Turkiye lost $1 trillion , because of to fight USA-Europe backed PKK/YPG Terrorism since 1985
> also over $1 trillion
> 
> 
> and pathetic slave Germany ... first save your Germany from USA invasion
> 
> also full of old buildings , old airports , etc in Germany
> 
> thanks to president ERDOGAN to spent $1 trillion for public projects since 2003 to modernize Turkiye
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and weak outdated German Armed Forces
> 
> Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects
> 
> keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol



There's a nice album from Blind Guardian,it would fit your mental state:









MMM-E said:


> still tiny Greece is barking to fight against regional super power Turkiye


Regional superpower Turkiye says garissons on the islands are a threat. Is regional superpower Turkiye afraid of tiny Greek garissons on the islands?


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Regional superpower Turkiye says garissons on the islands are a threat. Is regional superpower Turkiye afraid of tiny Greek garissons on the islands?



in Turkish Sinek küçük fakat mide bulandırır ( The fly is small but nauseous )

and Greece violates international agreements ...


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> in Turkish Sinek küçük fakat mide bulandırır ( The fly is small but nauseous )


Just admit that your government is following a two-faced,aggressive foreign policy. 

Be a man and admit it. Are you wearing trousers? Be a man and admit that you're government wants to grab our islands and is itching for a war. 

If Greece is not threat to you,then why do you make such a fuss about it? If Greece is nothing compared to Turkey,then why are you so annoyed by us buying Rafale and FDI HN? Why are you annoyed by our PMs visit in Washington and why are you acting like we are threatening your existence,by having small garissons on our islands? 

Stop bragging about your government's double-standards and hypocritical foreign policy. Admit that AKP has been making a lot of mistakes and has been provoking for an armed conflict.


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## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Not that some MMM-E is building a predator-tech-laser in his basement and threatening the state...



and weak outdated German Armed Forces

Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects

even French-Germaan FCAS Fighter Jets Program will be delayed for at least 10 more years for 2050 . lol so funny

keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Just admit that your government is following a two-faced,aggressive foreign policy.



its Greek government is two-faced and liar


-- to allow USA to open military bases in Greece and USA deployed 1.000 Tanks,AFVs , 150+ Apache,Chinook,Blackhawk Helicopters and dozens of F-15 , F35 Fighter Jets in Greece against Turkiye

-- Greece signed military pact with France against Turkiye

-- Greece vioolates international agreements and arming Islands

-- Greece is crything everywhere not to sell weapons to Turkiye

-- by international law , Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
still Greece is trying to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 area from the Turks


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> and weak outdated German Armed Forces
> 
> Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects
> 
> even French-Germaan FCAS Fighter Jets Program will be delayed for at least 10 more years for 2050 . lol so funny
> 
> keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol


Yes "weak and outdated"...

How will you deal with 141 Eurofighters? 

And the German Navy? 






What will you do for the tanks and IFVs with APS on them? 

What will you do for the 121 PzH 2000? 

And more specifically,what will you do if Germany,France and various other EU countries gang up on you?



MMM-E said:


> -- to allow USA to open military bases in Greece and USA deployed 1.000 Tanks,AFVs , 150+ Apache,Chinook,Blackhawk Helicopters and dozens of F-15 , F35 Fighter Jets in Greece against Turkiye


You're in NATO,we're in NATO. Do you have a problem with your ally,USA? 
Like you say "Our armament is not for Greece" well then so we can say "The American bases are not for Turkey".



MMM-E said:


> -- Greece signed military pact with France against Turkiye


The defensive agreement does not specify Turkey. It says against any enemy that might threaten us.



MMM-E said:


> -- Greece is crything everywhere not to sell weapons to Turkiye


Turkey is crying everywhere about Greek diplomatic successes. YOU have been crying about it here day and night.



MMM-E said:


> -- by international law , Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
> still Greece is trying to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000 km2 area from the Turks


By international law,Turkey should sign UNCLOS if it wants to have a say on this. If not,then you played your cards wrong in the Black Sea and can't ask for that now. So you have to understand how wrong you are,even if you repeat 1000000 times the same crap.


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## reflecthofgeismar

MMM-E said:


> and weak outdated German Armed Forces
> 
> Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects
> 
> even French-Germaan FCAS Fighter Jets Program will be delayed for at least 10 more years for 2050 . lol so funny
> 
> keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol



Listen boy, listen very well.
IF Germans want - respective have the same aggressive politics in military sense as Turkey, it would be under top 5 in the world, even without pampering the military as a whole too much.
Just some better things here & there, less hippity hoppity influence and clear structures.
Even planes and helicopters and especially cheap (but effective) drones like TB2 would be NO big problem.
Turks needed them, so they developed them, for sure in the beginning with mostly non-turkish components and still often with foreign-dual use components or unlicensed components.
If Turkey get sanctioned like Russia, they will fight on donkeys.

Some things are "better" if you buy them (circumstances), most things are better when you develop them by your own and others are - if politically correctly supported - multinational.
The thing is, mighty Turkey can't even produce a tank engine by it's own ... no wonder.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/average-iq-by-country (Yeah I know, many syrian FSA-like brothers are the problem. )
And yes, in the past average IQ of German population was even higher, too many non-Europeans here and even own Europeans are becoming more stupid bc of "Liberalism".


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> If Greece is not threat to you,then why do you make such a fuss about it? If Greece is nothing compared to Turkey,then why are you so annoyed by us buying Rafale and FDI HN? Why are you annoyed by our PMs visit in Washington and why are you acting like we are threatening your existence,by having small garissons on our islands?



Read carefully

USA-France-Germany use puppet Greece, FETO , PKK/YPG as proxies to fight against Turkiye


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Read carefully
> 
> USA-France-Germany use puppet Greece, FETO , PKK/YPG as proxies to fight against Turkiye


DOES USA HAVE FUCKING BASES IN EASTERN AEGEAN ISLANDS? No! Then what the **** are you afraid of? Homeguard and a few soldiers operating OSA-AKM and Stinger manpads? That's what scares you?

Again,you're avoiding to admit how wrong your government is in its foreign policy. You're not a man to admit it. You're just going around,avoiding it and coming up with such utter nonsense as "hur dur they are using you as puppet".


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> How will you deal with 141 Eurofighters?



so funny 


Germany's Military is a total Mess

most of German Eurofighters are not ready for combat
128 German Eurofighter Typhoons are _not_ flightworthy.

also most of Helicopters,Submarines,etc



Foinikas said:


> DOES USA HAVE FUCKING BASES IN EASTERN AEGEAN ISLANDS? No! Then what the **** are you afraid of? Homeguard and a few soldiers operating OSA-AKM and Stinger manpads? That's what scares you?



wtf weapons on Islands ?
if This is forbidden by international agreements ?

USA-France arming Greece to fight against Turkiye
PKK/YPG Terrorists are another bastards to fight against Turkiye


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> so funny
> 
> 
> Germany's Military Is a Total Mess
> 
> most of German Eurofighters are not ready for combat
> 128 German Eurofighter Typhoons are _not_ flightworthy.
> 
> also most of Helicopters,Submarines,etc


But all of the Turkish F-16s post-2016 are combat worthy? You're a joke. 

Your Sultan purged the Air Force of pilots and officers and although you replaced some of them,you're still not 100% combat ready,not on the levels you used to be before the coup.

The Germans can have their airplanes and helicopters ready in a few hours if they want. We're talking about Germany here,the master-engineer country. Don't fool yourself with fairy-tales and made-up stories from AKP newspapers.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You're in NATO,we're in NATO. Do you have a problem with your ally,USA?



Turkiye lost over $1 trillion and tens of thousands of citizens

because our NATO allies USA-France,Germany-etc gives weapons-weapons and political support to PKK/YPG Terrorists to fight against Turkiye since 1985

now another puppet Greece which uses by USA-France,Germany to fight against Turkiye





Foinikas said:


> But all of the Turkish F-16s post-2016 are combat worthy? You're a joke.




You are real joke

All Turkish F-16s are combat ready ........... Turkiye has many enemies from all sides



Foinikas said:


> Your Sultan purged the Air Force of pilots and officers and although you replaced some of them,you're still not 100% combat ready,not on the levels you used to be before the coup.




nahhhh

as of 2022 all Turkish Airforce is combat ready
experienced Turkish pilots returned to the Turkish Airforce from Turkish Airlines and other private air lines


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> But all of the Turkish F-16s post-2016 are combat worthy? You're a joke.
> 
> Your Sultan purged the Air Force of pilots and officers and although you replaced some of them,you're still not 100% combat ready,not on the levels you used to be before the coup.
> 
> The Germans can have their airplanes and helicopters ready in a few hours if they want. We're talking about Germany here,the master-engineer country. Don't fool yourself with fairy-tales and made-up stories from AKP newspapers.



He is right in the case of the mess - to a certain point.
Imo many things need to be upgraded by NOW available stuff and best german made products, there is so much potential.
Otherwise, even a scratch on a vehicle = non operable after German standards.
Same with tolerances in military equipment which is multinational or foreign, German standards are sometimes a bit 110%.
Good thing, otherwise we would already use 130mm in MBTs.
TRL* is a good thing, something MMM-E doesn't know and always bragging about "what could be ... in 10, 20, 30 yrs".
Yeah, in 10 years Germany could be a right wing dictatorship. And what do you think who are the people who would get kicked out (minimum) in the first few years?  And THEN which country couldn't do anything to help his "surpressed" people? 

*The Technology Readiness Level (TRL) or technology maturity is a scale for evaluating the development status and was introduced by NASA in 1988 and is now considered the standard in the development of future technologies. 
TRL 1: Observation and description of the functional principle (8-15 years) 
TRL 2: Description of the application of a technology 
TRL 3: Proof of the functionality of a technology (5-13 years) 
TRL 4: Experimental setup in the laboratory 
TRL 5: Test setup in operational environment 
TRL 6: Prototype in operational environment 
TRL 7: Prototype in action (1-5 years) 
TRL 8: Qualified system with proof of functionality in the area of application 
TRL 9: Qualified system with proof of successful use


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> The Germans can have their airplanes and helicopters ready in a few hours if they want. We're talking about Germany here,the master-engineer country. Don't fool yourself with fairy-tales and made-up stories from AKP newspapers.



You know nothing about military and dont fool yourself with pathetic-outdated useless German military power

even German pilots dont know how to fight ...... after ww2 no any real conflict experience


Turkish pilots kicking Greek F-16s in dogfights
Turkish pilots has great air to ground presicion strike experience from İraq to Syria

Germany is not military power .. even Greece has far better organized and combat ready Armed Forces than Germany


-- German air force pilots don’t have enough flight time to meet NATO training requirements.
-- The Luftwaffe doesn’t have enough flyable planes for its pilots to fly.
-- only 39 of the Luftwaffe’s 128 Eurofighters were rated fit to fly because of spare parts shortages



Bad News: German Pilots Don't Have Enough Warplanes to Fly​








Bad News: German Pilots Don't Have Enough Warplanes to Fly


The Luftwaffe remains far from combat-ready.




nationalinterest.org


----------



## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> TRL* is a good thing, something MMM-E doesn't know and always bragging about "what could be ... in 10, 20, 30 yrs".



I am saying again

Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects

even French-Germaan FCAS Fighter Jets Program will be delayed for at least 10 more years for 2050 . lol so funny

keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Turkey is crying everywhere about Greek diplomatic successes. YOU have been crying about it here day and night.



Diplomatic what ? lol daydreamer Greeks


-- Turkiye blocked Greek dreams with maritime agreement between Libya and Turkiye
-- also Turkiye-Egypt-Libya to work together for energy sector
-- USA witdrew its support from EASTMED project
-- İsrael and Turkiye opened new era to work for enegy sector in the Eastern Mediterranean

and nobody enter Turkish EZZ ( MAVI VATAN )


keep crying everywhere day and night



Foinikas said:


> By international law,Turkey should sign UNCLOS if it wants to have a say on this. If not,then you played your cards wrong in the Black Sea and can't ask for that now. So you have to understand how wrong you are,even if you repeat 1000000 times the same crap.



we dont care about bandit countries with their absurd claims

even UNCLOS doesnt give Greek Island Kastellarizo which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland to generate EEZ of 200 nm


Greece is not archipelagic state 
so Greek EEZ should start from Greek Mainland ,, not from every tiny Greek Island


----------



## MMM-E

*New air-to-air missiles for Akıncı UCAV*

to hunt other UCAVs even Greek AH-64 Apache Attack Helicopters

to stay in the air 7/24 for air defense role














Turkish defense industry eyes new air-to-air missiles for Akıncı UCAV


The Defense Industries Research and Development Institute (SAGE) of the Scientific and Technological Research Council of Turkey (TÜBITAK) is working with...




www.dailysabah.com


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish pilots kicking Greek F-16s in dogfights
> Turkish pilots has great air to ground presicion strike experience from İraq to Syria


Masturbation has clouded your mind so much,you believe Erdogan's government.



MMM-E said:


> we dont care about bandit countries with their absurd claims


Sure,sure,everyone is a bandit country when it suits you.



MMM-E said:


> Greece is not archipelagic state
> so Greek EEZ should start from Greek Mainland ,, not from every tiny Greek Island




Not according to UNCLOS.

Stop repeating the same bull. Nobody believes you anymore. You have discredited yourself on this forum and everybody thinks you're a joke.



MMM-E said:


> *New air-to-air missiles for Akıncı UCAV*
> 
> to hunt other UCAVs even Greek AH-64 Apache Attack Helicopters
> 
> to stay in the air 7/24 for air defense role
> View attachment 852394
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Turkish defense industry eyes new air-to-air missiles for Akıncı UCAV
> 
> 
> The Defense Industries Research and Development Institute (SAGE) of the Scientific and Technological Research Council of Turkey (TÜBITAK) is working with...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.dailysabah.com


Oh so easy! Oh my! Turkish Army has solutions to everything! No country can fight against superpower Turkiye! 

Well,then I wonder why you're not in Vienna yet.



MMM-E said:


> keep crying everywhere day and night


Umm...you're the one talking about it every single day and night on the forum.

You. Have you noticed it? You're the one crying like a baby day and night,needing attention for food. Every day and night you mumble about superpower Turkiye and Mitsotakis' visit to Washington.



MMM-E said:


> You are real joke
> 
> All Turkish F-16s are combat ready ........... Turkiye has many enemies from all sides


Yeah Turkish veteran pilots just appeared. Hundreds of pilots,officers and technicians sacked,but "Turkiye Air Force combat ready as of 2022". How many squadrons have problems? How many detachments lack manpower and spare parts?


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

MMM-E said:


> I am saying again
> 
> Germany has no any modern game changer weapon or weapon projects
> 
> even French-Germaan FCAS Fighter Jets Program will be delayed for at least 10 more years for 2050 . lol so funny
> 
> keep dreaming with 130mm gun ... outdated war concept from ww2 ... lol



Go ahead and modernize your FNSS ACV-15, which is all license built 
Even the new modernized variant is still using foreign cannon and stuff.
Still producing the shitty GPV Colonel based Pars?
4x4 variant is to a certain point based on old Fennek 4x4.
Still using Caterpillar & Deutz engines from bandit countries.
Did you swap for licensed built Firtina (K9 Thunder) the engine?
Isn't it MTU?
BANDIT countries!
Great Turkey!
For most "turkish" equipment I can find the real original, mostly developed/produced by bandit countries!
No matter face-lifted HK417 based MPT-76 (58 mülütary "tests") or technology in "turkish" bombs.




__





TDW - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org




(Now, biased but real)








German missile technology used in the Turkish aggression on Zap


German technology plays a strategic role in Turkey's large-scale attack on the PKK-held Medya Defense Zones in southern Kurdistan (northern Iraq). Videos from the Turkish Ministry of Defense show t...




anfenglish.com












German and British Complicity in Turkey's Drone Warfare -


With military operations being waged by Turkey in dozens of countries, drone warfare has become a key part of the regime’s arsenal. Azerbaijan, Southern Kurdistan, Northern Syria, Northern Kurdistan, Yemen and Libya are just some of the areas where Turkish drones have played an active role...




boycott-turkey.net




Without bandit countries turkish military can fight with bow again.


Foinikas said:


> Masturbation has clouded your mind so much,you believe Erdogan's government.
> 
> 
> Sure,sure,everyone is a bandit country when it suits you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not according to UNCLOS.
> 
> Stop repeating the same bull. Nobody believes you anymore. You have discredited yourself on this forum and everybody thinks you're a joke.
> 
> 
> Oh so easy! Oh my! Turkish Army has solutions to everything! No country can fight against superpower Turkiye!
> 
> Well,then I wonder why you're not in Vienna yet.
> 
> 
> Umm...you're the one talking about it every single day and night on the forum.
> 
> You. Have you noticed it? You're the one crying like a baby day and night,needing attention for food. Every day and night you mumble about superpower Turkiye and Mitsotakis' visit to Washington.
> 
> 
> Yeah Turkish veteran pilots just appeared. Hundreds of pilots,officers and technicians sacked,but "Turkiye Air Force combat ready as of 2022". How many squadrons have problems? How many detachments lack manpower and spare parts?



Be careful!
Mehmetcik Mülütary Master - Erdogan knows best!
Israeli murderers! 
Israeli friends! 

U dont have any military (Mehmetcik Mülütary Master - Erdogan (MMM-E)) knowledge to discuss with me and now go back to your cave with your gay-lover! (psht, never forget, without BANDIT-countries Germany, France, GB, Turks couldn't conquer the world bc they can't really produce anything on THEIR own )
Unmanned combat aerial vehicles (UCAVs) maufactured by the Turkish regime, its supporters and President Recep Tayyip Erdogan’s family companies are responsible for killing Kurdish civilians in the northern, southern and western parts of Kurdistan.


Western countries remain silent about these massacres and many are making deals with Turkey for the production of UCAVs.


_ANF_ journalists in South Kurdistan recently saw parts of missiles fired from Turkish UCAVs. Experts examined photos of these laser-guided MAM-C and MAM-L missiles and provided information about the manufacturers.


German Prime Minister Angela Merkel’s government has approved 33 units of military hardware for export to Turkey for use in the construction of military unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) in the past 10 years.


Following _ANF's_ research into the production of missiles fired from Turkish UCAVs, five western companies stood out. They are based in Germany, England and North America.

Wescam​The camera is undoubtedly the most important technology in both armed and unarmed drones.

The Bayraktar and TAI companies, which produce drones/UAVs for the Erdogan regime, use Canadian company Wescam’s electro-optical and infrared cameras.

In October last year, when the Turkish state launched its invasion of Rojava, Canada decided to embargo the sale of arms to Ankara. However, as a result of negotiations with the Canadian administration in May and June, the embargo was lifted and Wescam began to sell its cabin and optical instruments to the Turkish state again.

Wescam took its cooperation with the Erdogan regime even further and granted Turkish UAV manufacturer Baykar the right to license its technical facilities to perform maintenance and software updates of its technical equipment in Turkey.

TDW​TDW is a subsidiary of MBDA in Germany, a European-based missile system developer with French and Italian partners.

It designs the OMTAS missiles fired from UCAVs. Developed as an anti-tank missile, OMTAS have been made suitable for use by the Turkish army in armaments with the "tandem warhead" system produced by TDW.

The 35 kilogram, medium-range missiles are equipped with a feature that makes it possible for a missile to change its target point, even after firing.

TDW is targeted by international anti-war organisations, because it helps many repressive regimes to produce weapons. TDW, headquartered in Schrobenhausen, Bavaria, easily grants the licensing rights for its missile heads to foreign companies.

Turkey ranks first in the list of license rights granted by TDW. Cooperation between the Turkish state and TDW started in 2010.

Thanks to a question by the left party Die Linke in the German parliament last year, it emerged that the Merkel government approved two arms deals with the Turkish state in 2018, with a total value of €290,000.

UTAS​UTC Aerospace Systems (UTAS), a subsidiary of the US aviation company Collins Aerospace, was founded in 2012. It has many investments in Turkey, including in Turkish Airlines. It provides Turkey with Inertial Navigation System technology. This technology, which determines the absolute position of a moving vehicle by using an accelerometer and protractor sensors, is also an indispensable feature of UAVs.

According to ANF's research, UTAS, operating in England under the name Atlantic Inertial Systems, produces the laser technology for the MAM-L and MAM-C missiles fired from Turkish UCAVs.

The MAM-C missiles, called Javelins by the Turkish state, weigh 6.5kg and have a diameter of 70mm. MAM-L missiles weigh 22kg. The main feature of both missiles is that they are non-motorised and guided by laser.

The GPS and Inertial Navigation System supplied by UTAS play a critical role in the MAM-L and MAM-C missiles, which are used against civilians, especially in Rojava and South Kurdistan.

Continental Motors​German-based Thielert Aircraft Engines GmbH and Continental Aerospace Technologies GmbH merged in 2013 to establish a company called Continental Motors.

The company produces engines for small-sized aircraft and aerial vehicles. Continental Motors produces diesel engines named Continental CD 155 for Bayraktar TB2 vehicles and PD155 engines for Anka-S unarmed aerial vehicles.

Continental Motors has been collaborating with Turkey since 2010, according to data from the German government. However, in response to a question from Die Linke, it was confirmed in the German parliament that the company had deals with Turkey in 2010, 2011, 2012, 2015 and 2016. The contents of the agreements were not disclosed and are labelled state secrets.

Numerics Software GmbH​Numerics Software GmbH has headquarters in the town of Petershausen near Munich, and has helped Turkey with software for missiles launched from UCAVs.

According to data from the German Ministry of Economy and Energy, Numerics Software GmbH approved two deals with the Turkish state in 2008, one in 2011 and two in 2013.

Reactions: Love Love:
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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Masturbation has clouded your mind so much,you believe Erdogan's government.



Turkish F-16s intercept 6 Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean







Foinikas said:


> Not according to UNCLOS.
> 
> Stop repeating the same bull. Nobody believes you anymore. You have discredited yourself on this forum and everybody thinks you're a joke.



keep crying stupid TROLL Team


----------



## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Go ahead and modernize your FNSS ACV-15, which is all license built



so funny .... go and dream with your tiny German Army



150 modernized ACV-15





650 modernizee ACV-30







*Also Turkiye has its own most modern war machines *


----------



## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Wescam​The camera is undoubtedly the most important technology in both armed and unarmed drones.
> 
> The Bayraktar and TAI companies, which produce drones/UAVs for the Erdogan regime, use Canadian company Wescam’s electro-optical and infrared cameras.
> 
> In October last year, when the Turkish state launched its invasion of Rojava, Canada decided to embargo the sale of arms to Ankara. However, as a result of negotiations with the Canadian administration in May and June, the embargo was lifted and Wescam began to sell its cabin and optical instruments to the Turkish state again.
> 
> Wescam took its cooperation with the Erdogan regime even further and granted Turkish UAV manufacturer Baykar the right to license its technical facilities to perform maintenance and software updates of its technical equipment in Turkey.




You are another TROLL , nothing else

Canadian company which produce Wescam was bankrupt in 2022 .. lol


Turkish UCAVs has started using indigenous Aselsan CATS E/O System
( Canadian Wescam has laser range of 20km ... Turkish CATS has laser range of 30km )

40 of them have been delivered so far







reflecthofgeismar said:


> It designs the OMTAS missiles fired from UCAVs. Developed as an anti-tank missile, OMTAS have been made suitable for use by the Turkish army in armaments with the "tandem warhead" system produced by TDW.



Source : Your asss .. lol


----------



## MMM-E

reflecthofgeismar said:


> Continental Motors​German-based Thielert Aircraft Engines GmbH and Continental Aerospace Technologies GmbH merged in 2013 to establish a company called Continental Motors.
> 
> The company produces engines for small-sized aircraft and aerial vehicles. Continental Motors produces diesel engines named Continental CD 155 for Bayraktar TB2 vehicles and PD155 engines for Anka-S unarmed aerial vehicles.



Another lie from TROLL Team
wake up this is not 2016 ... this is 2022


ANKA-S and AKSUNGUR UCAVs use indigenous TEI PD-170 Engine


----------



## MMM-E

*Bad news for daydreamer Greeks*



Rafale jets and Qatari pilots stationed at TAF Konya Air Base will continue until 2027​




With the agreement signed in 2021, 36 aircrafts and 250 Qatari air force personnel were assigned to Konya airbase.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish F-16s intercept 6 Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> keep crying stupid TROLL Team


The same old video you've posted a gazillion times on the forum,as "proof". Lol!


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> The same old video you've posted a gazillion times on the forum,as "proof". Lol!


That was the last dogfight between Turkish F-16s and Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean when HAF and Hellenic Navy tried to harash Turkish research Ship ORUCREIS

Turkish F-16s kicked Greek F-16s .... and French Frigate ran away . lol


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> That was the last dogfight between Turkish F-16s and Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean when HAF and Hellenic Navy tried to harash Turkish research Ship ORUCREIS
> 
> Turkish F-16s kicked Greek F-16s .... and French Frigate ran away . lol


Fantasies? Hellenic Navy tried to harass? That's what the Turkish Navy and Coast Guard do. They harass and bully other ships,trying to cause a collision. And then have the guts to accuse Greece of "provocations". Shame. Shame on Turkey.

The videos are here for people to watch and judge for themselves.


----------



## Foinikas

@reflecthofgeismar @Beny Karachun 

As for what's been going on in the Aegean,the video posted by MMM-E was probably the one where HAF F-16s had landed in Cyprus undetected,later left and were only detected on the trip back home,surprising the Turks who sent their own F-16s to intercept them 😂 

Here are some classic videos from the dofights in the Aegean:

Reactions: Like Like:
2 | Haha Haha:
1


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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> The videos are here for people to watch and judge for themselves.



Because bandit Greece always attack Turkish Fishermen
Greek territorial water 6nm , not 12 .... ( even according to Treaty of Lausanne 3nm )

and always Turkish Coast guard kicked tiny Greek Coast guard ... lol


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> @reflecthofgeismar @Beny Karachun
> 
> As for what's been going on in the Aegean,the video posted by MMM-E was probably the one where HAF F-16s had landed in Cyprus undetected,later left and were only detected on the trip back home,surprising the Turks who sent their own F-16s to intercept them 😂
> 
> Here are some classic videos from the dofights in the Aegean:



(M)ehmetcik (M)ülütary (M)aster - (E)rdogan will explain to us all that you are a greek LIAR, you'll see you uneducated TROLL.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Because bandit Greece always attack Turkish Fishermen


Funny,that's exactly what you do to our fishermen. And you twist it and blame us about it.
The evidence of your provocations is there,all those videos.

You can't deny it. Our Navy and Coast Guard have been responding with restraint and not replying to your provocative and dangerous behavior. That's why you think you "kicked" our tiny Coast Guard.



reflecthofgeismar said:


> (M)ehmetcik (M)ülütary (M)aster - (E)rdogan will explain to us all that you are a greek LIAR, you'll see you uneducated TROLL.


I remember that every time I showed him these videos,he simply went back to saying his stuff "oooh 100 years ago..." etc. 😂


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Here are some classic videos from the dofights in the Aegean:



Turkish F-16s kicked 6 Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean in the last dog fight


if we show dogfight over the Aegean
then watch , Turkish pilot easly would kill Greek Pilot , if he wanted







reflecthofgeismar said:


> (M)ehmetcik (M)ülütary (M)aster - (E)rdogan will explain to us all that you are a greek LIAR, you'll see you uneducated TROLL.



All of you losers have mental problem ...

You can not send post without Erdogan .... why ? 
because Erdogan kicked all of you FETO , PKK/YPG , Greece , Armenia , Germany , France,etc

keep crying


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkish F-16s kicked 6 Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean in the la


Lol it's on repeat...that's all he talks about,the last dogfight 2-3 years ago 

Here boy,have some facts:











@reflecthofgeismar @Akritas @Beny Karachun What do you guys think of this?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Funny,that's exactly what you do to our fishermen. And you twist it and blame us about it.
> The evidence of your provocations is there,all those videos.
> 
> You can't deny it. Our Navy and Coast Guard have been responding with restraint and not replying to your provocative and dangerous behavior. That's why you think you "kicked" our tiny Coast Guard.



Greece hidding behind USA-The EU and barking like lapdog


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Greece hidding behind USA-The EU and barking like lapdog


See? No balls to admit you're the aggressor and provocator here.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Lol it's on repeat...that's all he talks about,the last dogfight 2-3 years ago



28 .08. 2020

the last dog fight between Turkish F-16s and Greek F-16s over the Eastern Mediterranean when HAF and Hellenic Navy tried to harash Turkish research Ship ORUCREIS

Turkish F-16s kicked Greek F-16s .... and French Frigate ran away . lol

tiny Greece and pussy France



Foinikas said:


> See? No balls to admit you're the aggressor and provocator here.



your troll team is crying my thread as always

no military discuss ..only trolling , lies and personal attack on president Erdogan

yes No balls to admit Greece hidding behind USA-The EU and barking like lapdog


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> your troll team is crying my thread as always


1.Not my team
2.Nobody,but you is crying
3.You started this trash thread,you wanted to prove superiority,now everybody is telling you off.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> 10 years bandit criminal Greeks attacked Turkish Cypriots
> 
> Greeks were hidding behind USA-The EU and provoked Turkiye between 1964 and 1974
> in finally we Turks kicked daydreamer Greeks in 1974 , still Greeks are crying since 1974
> 
> 
> today same senario
> Greece hidding behind USA-The EU and provoke Turkiye , stop provoke Turkiye or Greeks will cry another 50 years for Islands this time
> 
> 
> 
> *1964-1974 Greeks* : hey Turks if you are brave come and take
> 
> *1974 Turks *: We are brave , we came and took , where are you Greeks ?
> View attachment 852459



Same posts again and again. You're boring.


----------



## MMM-E

*The First batch of KTJ-3200 to be delivered this month*


Indigenous KTJ-2000 turbojet Engine has been developed by KALE ARGE for SOM and ATMACA Cruise Missiles










__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1534513913194237953

Turkiye produce more 415 SOM air launched Cruise Missile





ATMACA land and naval based Cruise Missile


----------



## Beny Karachun

Foinikas said:


> Lol it's on repeat...that's all he talks about,the last dogfight 2-3 years ago
> 
> Here boy,have some facts:
> 
> View attachment 852454
> 
> 
> View attachment 852453
> 
> 
> @reflecthofgeismar @Akritas @Beny Karachun What do you guys think of this?


Seems like Turkey isn't so much of a superpower like MMM-E claims.

I find it odd you guys were literally launching missiles at each other though lol

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Foinikas

Beny Karachun said:


> Seems like Turkey isn't so much of a superpower like MMM-E claims.
> 
> I find it odd you guys were literally launching missiles at each other though lol


Cypriots were shooting down TuAF jets with Bofors. HAF pilots have been getting awards in NATO exercises repeatedly.
Then you have this clown,posting trash he gets from the official MoD of theirs,as evidence of superiority. 

And when you corner him,he goes back to posting the same posts and random Turkish projects.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Seems like Turkey isn't so much of a superpower like MMM-E claims.
> 
> I find it odd you guys were literally launching missiles at each other though lol




since 2013
Turkiye kicked USA-İsrael-France and their puppets/terrorists FETO , PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , Armenia , Greece , etc and Russia-İran backed SAA,IRGC,Hezbolah in İraq,Syria,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean

even S.Arabia,The UAE,Egypt were in the side of USA-İsrael-France

What a great power Turkiye vs all of you


btw we have seen pathetic İsrael against Hezbollah in 2006





Foinikas said:


> Cypriots were shooting down TuAF jets with Bofors. HAF pilots have been getting awards in NATO exercises repeatedly.
> Then you have this clown,posting trash he gets from the official MoD of theirs,as evidence of superiority.
> 
> And when you corner him,he goes back to posting the same posts and random Turkish projects.



Greeks are real clown who hidding behind USA-The EU and barking like lapdog


only 3 days were enough for the Turkish Armed Forces in the 2nd operation in 1974
and pussy Greek Armed Forces only watched on TV

pussy Greeks could do nothing without USA and The EU as always

only 72 hours will be enough to kick Greece one on one
Turkish Armed Forces to plant Turkish flag on Islands


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> since 2013
> Turkiye kicked USA-İsrael-France and their puppets/terrorists FETO , PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , Armenia , Greece , etc and Russia-İran backed SAA,IRGC,Hezbolah in İraq,Syria,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> even S.Arabia,The UAE,Egypt were in the side of USA-İsrael-France
> 
> What a great power Turkiye vs all of you
> 
> 
> btw we have seen pathetic İsrael against Hezbollah in 2006
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greeks are real clown who hidding behind USA-The EU and barking like lapdog
> 
> 
> only 3 days were enough for the Turkish Armed Forces in the 2nd operation in 1974
> and pussy Greek Armed Forces only watched on TV
> 
> pussy Greeks could do nothing without USA and The EU as always
> 
> only 72 hours will be enough to kick Greece one on one
> Turkish Armed Forces to plant Turkish flag on Islands


Do you have something new and constructive to say?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Do you have something new and constructive to say?



wth is tiny Greece ? 


since 2013
Turkiye kicked USA-İsrael-France and their puppets/terrorists FETO , PKK/YPG , HAFTAR , Armenia , Greece , etc and Russia-İran backed SAA,IRGC,Hezbolah in İraq,Syria,Libya and in the Eastern Mediterranean

even S.Arabia,The UAE,Egypt were in the side of USA-İsrael-France

What a great power Turkiye vs all of you

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## reflecthofgeismar

Do you have something new and constructive to say?
MMM-E Mehmetcik Mülütary Master - Erdogan

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> btw we have seen pathetic İsrael against Hezbollah in 2006







You have 3 times more casualties than Israel when you entered Syria
At least 8 Turkish Leopard 2s were destroyed and a bunch of M-60s as well.

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> You have 3 times more casualties than Israel when you entered Syria
> At least 8 Turkish Leopard 2s were destroyed and a bunch of M-60s as well.



so funny
*Israel fought against 1.000 trash Hezbol militia which has no even air force and Israel had heavy losses in 34 days*


on the other hand Turkiye fought Russia,İran,SAA,Hezbol also USA-France backed PKK/YPG Terrorists and also ISIS Terrorists ... ( 4 military operations between 2016 and 2020 )

and Turkiye lost most of soldiers from air strikes by Russia,İran,SAA

Turkish Army killed over 3.000 ISIS terrorists
Turkish Army killed over 3.000 PKK/YPG Terrorists in Afrin , Telabyad and Rasulayn
Turkish Army killed 3.322 Assad Regime militia including 6 generals and Iran backed IRGC , HEZBOL terrorists

also Turkish Armed Forces destroyed
3 UAVs
2 SU-24 Fighter Jets
1 L-39 Aircraft
8 Helicopters
8 Air Defense Systems
155 Tanks
51 Howitzers
52 MLRS
29 AFVs
68 Military Vehicles
15 Anti Tank Weapons
36 Pick-up mounted anti aircraft guns
49 Ammunition Trucks
10 Ammunition Storage
2 Missile Systems


Noob Israeli Army sucked in guerrilla warfare against Hezbolah

Great Turkish Army kicked PKK/YPG , ISIS , IRGC , Hezbolah and SAA

*even Turkish Armed Forces used only less than 5% of its own Power*


----------



## Akritas

Beny Karachun said:


> You have 3 times more casualties than Israel when you entered Syria
> At least 8 Turkish Leopard 2s were destroyed and a bunch of M-60s as well.


The losses of the Leopards are much greater because the replacements left Western Thrace to the Eastern Turkey. In my view, the losses were at least 25, and have to do with the wrong coverage tactics.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> The losses of the Leopards are much greater because the replacements left Western Thrace to the Eastern Turkey. In my view, the losses were at least 25, and have to do with the wrong coverage tactics.



Turkiye had 339 Leopard2A4 Tanks 

and BMC modernize 81+250 Leopard2A4 Tanks ( 331 Tanks )







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1483174640839278592


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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> In my view, the losses were at least 25, and have to do with the wrong coverage tactics.



not 25 , but only 8 .... and in 2016 Turkish Leopar2A4 Tanks were without APS


*Turkish Army has the best experience in the World to fight against 4th generation hybrid warfare , urban warfare and guerilla tactics*

ISIS built a very serious fortification in Al Bab

-- There was a very serious network of tunnels
-- The tunnels helped ISIS terrorists to shift a very serious force without being seen. and They fired anti-tank missiles from the streets
-- There were also Bombs
-- also ISIS used bombed vehicles and suicide bomb attacks
-- ISIS also had heavy weapons - ATGMs
-- ISIS had UAVs for reconnaissance and surveillance

and Turkiye did not use Airforce and UCAVs against ISIS in Al Bab in 2016
on the other hand Turkish soldiers faced with unknown air strikes ( Assad Regime-İran )


Every time our Soldiers made a forward move, they faced a counter move.
and in Finally Turkish Army killed over 3.000 ISIS Terrorists and took Al Bab , Jarablus , Dabiq , Rai , Azez


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *Turkish Army has the best experience in the World to fight against 4th generation hybrid warfare ,*


*Fourth-generation warfare* (*4GW*) is conflict characterized by a blurring of the lines between war and politics, combatants and civilians.
*Example is what Turkey did in 2020* on the border with Greece, following the killing of 34 Turkish soldiers during the Spring Shield military operation in Idlib on 27 February 2020, *when it instrumentalized foreign citizens and with the help of Turkish armed force*s, tried to break through the Greek border.
Of course, it was defeated by the Greek Forces.










Reference : https://verfassungsblog.de/what-happened-at-the-greece-turkey-border-in-early-2020/

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## Brainsucker

Akritas said:


> *Fourth-generation warfare* (*4GW*) is conflict characterized by a blurring of the lines between war and politics, combatants and civilians.
> *Example is what Turkey did in 2020* on the border with Greece, following the killing of 34 Turkish soldiers during the Spring Shield military operation in Idlib on 27 February 2020, *when it instrumentalized foreign citizens and with the help of Turkish armed force*s, tried to break through the Greek border.
> Of course, it was defeated by the Greek Forces.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reference : https://verfassungsblog.de/what-happened-at-the-greece-turkey-border-in-early-2020/


I don't understand about the so called 4th generation warfare. Because from the day of forgotten era, all war are always about war and politic, combatants and civilian.


----------



## Akritas

Brainsucker said:


> I don't understand about the so called 4th generation warfare. Because from the day of forgotten era, all war are always about war and politic, combatants and civilian.


What distinguishes 4GW from earlier generations is that typically at least one side is something other than a military force organized and operating under the control of a national government, and one that often transcends national boundaries.

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## MMM-E

*Turkiye has the best Attack Helicopter Fleet to compare with France , Germany , İsrael and Greece*



Turkiye : 83 T-129 and 10 AH-1W Super Cobra
France : 68 TIGER
Germany : 51 TIGRE
İsrael : 47 AH-64 Apache 
Greece : 29 AH-64 Apache

Turkiye : 93
Greece : 29

Turkish Army T-129 Attack Helicopters


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> *Israel fought against 1.000 trash Hezbol militia which has no even air force and Israel had heavy losses in 34 days*


So suddenly,YPG/PKK are super-soldiers and not bands of Kurdish terrorists? 

You bragged about fighting ISIS in Al Bab. But you didn't mention that SDF and SAA were also fighting against them at the same time. 

For a super-power Turkiye,it took you more than 3 months to conquer a town like Al Bab.



MMM-E said:


> Turkish Army has the best experience in the World to fight against 4th generation hybrid warfare , urban warfare and guerilla tactics


Oh because NATO armies and Pakistan haven't been fighting against guerillas and hybrid warfare for 20 years,huh?



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye : 83 T-129 and 10 AH-1W Super Cobra


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> For a super-power Turkiye,it took you more than 3 months to conquer a town like Al Bab.




and For a super-power USA+France+150.000 İraqi Army + Kurdish Pesmerge it took them more than 18 months to take Mosul


Outsiders with no ethics can't understand Turkish sensivity towards civilian life 
We will never leave thousands of innocent deads behind us just like Assad, Russia or Usa


-- Turkish Army used only around 6.000 soldiers in Idlib
USA-France used 150.000 İraqi Army + Kurdish Pesmerge in Mosul

-- Turkiye did not use Fighter Jets and UCAVs in Idlib
American and French Fighter Jets bombed Mosul day and night

-- No civilian loses in Al Bab
10.000+ civilian loses in Mosul


even Turkiye has started military operation against ISIS after 30 days USA backed military coup attempt 

*only Turkish Army can do it in the world , because great real conflict experience since 1990 *

in 2006 Israeli Army sucked against 1.000 Hezbolah militia ....


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> and For a super-power USA+France+150.000 İraqi Army + Kurdish Pesmerge it took them more than 18 months to take Mosul


You must be of truly limited mental capacity. 

You have said this exact same phrase like 2-3 times before and I told you back then: You compare Al Bab with Mosul? That's like comparing Izmir with a village in southeast Turkey.



MMM-E said:


> -- No civilian loses in Al Bab
> 10.000+ civilian loses in Mosul


Yeah,because they all fled as soon as they heard the Turks were coming.



MMM-E said:


> -- Turkish Army used only around 6.000 soldiers in Idlib
> USA-France used 150.000 İraqi Army + Kurdish Pesmerge in Mosul


No they didn't.






And these were total forces around the city,in the province,not all of them fighting inside the city.

And we're talking about Mosul,not a town like Al Bab. 



MMM-E said:


> Outsiders with no ethics can't understand Turkish sensivity towards civilian life
> We will never leave thousands of innocent deads behind us just like Assad, Russia or Usa


Just lol. Seriously....lol.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You bragged about fighting ISIS in Al Bab. But you didn't mention that SDF and SAA were also fighting against them at the same time.



in Al Bab , only Turkish Army fought against ISIS in Al Bab

Turkish Army always tried not to kill civilians in Operation ES in Al Bab. 
still Turkish Army killed over 3000 ISIS terrorists and Turkish Army lost only 72 soldiers

even Turkish Army lost only 5 soldiers with gunshot .. 
Turkish Army lost 67 soldiers with ISIS suicide bomb attacks and unknow Air strikes and Artillery attacks by Iran and Syrian Regime


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> in Al Bab , only Turkish Army fought against ISIS in Al Bab















MMM-E said:


> Turkish Army always tried not to kill civilians in Operation ES in Al Bab.





https://www.syriahr.com/en/61502/



_
SOHR reported that 72 civilians were killed in Turkish airstrikes during the day, with another 23 killed on the next day.[112]__[113]_


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You must be of truly limited mental capacity.
> 
> You have said this exact same phrase like 2-3 times before and I told you back then: You compare Al Bab with Mosul? That's like comparing Izmir with a village in southeast Turkey.



You have no brain to understand my posts and military knowledge

I am saying again ignorant Foinikas

-- Turkish Army used only around 6.000 soldiers in Idlib
while USA-France used 150.000 İraqi Army + Kurdish Pesmerge in Mosul

--Turkiye did not use Fighter Jets and UCAVs in Idlib
American and French Fighter Jets bombed Mosul day and night

-- No civilian loses in Al Bab
10.000+ civilian loses in Mosul





Foinikas said:


> Yeah,because they all fled as soon as they heard the Turks were coming.



what a stupid post from you as almays


ISIS never let civilians to leave Al Bab
ISIS used civilians as barricade against Turkish Army



Foinikas said:


> https://www.syriahr.com/en/61502/
> 
> _SOHR reported that 72 civilians were killed in Turkish airstrikes during the day, with another 23 killed on the next day.[112]__[113]_



We dont care about lies from antTurkiye loser clowns and media

Turkiye did not use air strikes .... stop lying


and you stupid clown
SAA and İran backed Terrorists did not fight ISIS in Al Bab, they tried to take Al Bab when Turkish Army killed over 3.000 ISIS Terrorists

even Turkish Army lost soldiers from air strikes and artillery attacks by SAA and İran backed Terrorists

fck off now ignorant sht


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> what a stupid post from you as almays
> 
> 
> ISIS never let civilians to leave Al Bab
> ISIS used civilians as barricade against Turkish Army


_On 3 February, UN Secretary-General Stephane Dujjaric *estimated that around 30,000 civilians had fled al-Bab,* and that 10,000 still remained inside of the city._



MMM-E said:


> We dont care about lies from antTurkiye loser clowns and media
> 
> Turkiye did not use air strikes .......... stop lying


You are in denial.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> On 3 February, UN Secretary-General Stephane Dujjaric *estimated that around 30,000 civilians had fled al-Bab,* and that 10,000 still remained inside of the city.



You are so pathetic and ignorant

when Turkish Army killed thousands of ISIS Terrorists , then civilians have started leaving Al Bab

6 November 2016 - 23 February 2017
and , UN Secretary-General Stephane Dujjaric talked about the last 20 days of conflict ( On 3 February, )



Foinikas said:


> You are in denial.



We dont care about liar losers



Foinikas said:


> Just lol. Seriously....lol.



typical christian and zionist media with full of lies against muslim Turks

losers keep crying

Barbarian savage Greeks tried to kill all Turks to take whole Island between 1964 and 1974

in finally Turkish Army kicked dirty Greek asss in 1974


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> _On 3 February, UN Secretary-General Stephane Dujjaric *estimated that around 30,000 civilians had fled al-Bab,* and that 10,000 still remained inside of the city._
> 
> 
> You are in denial.



SOHR 1 man based in GB who is anti-Assad... 
If FSA & consorts didn't evacuate and led NEUTRAL (especially pro-Assad) not out of cities = mimimi bad Assad. 
We saw useless TFSA militias who couldn't even support, wrong used old Leo2A4 which were not even with 2nd (1985/86) or 3rd gen (1988/89) basic armor built.
The loses were - even the old Leo2A4 aren't good - bc of pathetic turkish "tactics".
I could bet Turks would do the same mistakes but only saved by ukrainian copied APS.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You are so pathetic and ignorant


I showed you the facts and all you can say is "you are pathetic and ignorant".

A thousand people will tell you something,you will still call them "pathetic" and "ignorant". 

Sir,you have problems. Please,please try to seek help from an expert. Seriously.


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> I showed you the facts and all you can say is "you are pathetic and ignorant".
> 
> A thousand people will tell you something,you will still call them "pathetic" and "ignorant".
> 
> Sir,you have problems. Please,please try to seek help from an expert. Seriously.



Mental Mehmetic Mülütary - Experiments.


----------



## Foinikas

reflecthofgeismar said:


> SOHR 1 man based in GB who is anti-Assad...
> If FSA & consorts didn't evacuate and led NEUTRAL (especially pro-Assad) not out of cities = mimimi bad Assad.
> We saw useless TFSA militias who couldn't even support, wrong used old Leo2A4 which were not even with 2nd (1985/86) or 3rd gen (1988/89) basic armor built.
> The loses were - even the old Leo2A4 aren't good - bc of pathetic turkish "tactics".
> I could bet Turks would do the same mistakes but only saved by ukrainian copied APS.


I usually don't quote SOHR,but when you have guys saying Leopard 2A4 losses were just a few and denying there were any civilians dead,well then you have to show him something,even from SOHR. Because these weirdos might be Anti-Assad,but they didn't lie about this. Of course,in MMM-E's mind,it was a great operation,no casualties,all rainbows and fun.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> I showed you the facts and all you can say is "you are pathetic and ignorant".



you cried as always .. nothing else


only Turkish Army without airforce can do it without civilian loses .... 

Cowardly USA-France Airforces bombed Mosul day in night 18 months and killed over 10.000+ civilians


----------



## reflecthofgeismar

Foinikas said:


> I usually don't quote SOHR,but when you have guys saying Leopard 2A4 losses were just a few and denying there were any civilians dead,well then you have to show him something,even from SOHR. Because these weirdos might be Anti-Assad,but they didn't lie about this. Of course,in MMM-E's mind,it was a great operation,no casualties,all rainbows and fun.



Yeah BECAUSE they are anti-Assad they only have reason to put the amount of civs killed by Turks lower. That was why I wrote it. 
After the motto, "MMM-E, Foinikas IS using a more or less PRO turkish source and still there they are admitting dead civilians..." 
And Leopard losses were "low", 8-10 or so?
There was a very interesting analysis about that, from a neutral source I read back then.
Conclusion.
Pathetic FSA support and turkish "tactics".

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> A thousand people will tell you something,you will still call them "pathetic" and "ignorant".



only your ignorant and liar Troll team who has mental problems against Turkiye and Erdogan


keep crying loser Greece,FETO,PKK-YPG,HAFTAR,Armenia,SAA,IRGC,Hezbolah

10% of Turkish Armed Forces power kicked all of you in İraq,Syria,Libya,Eastern Mediterranean


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> you cried as always .. nothing else


Excuse me,are you retarded? Where exactly did I cry? 

I posted you facts,information and you simply discarded it,mumbling your usual insults and nonsense. 

Don't you realize that you're the one coming out as the loser here?



MMM-E said:


> only your ignorant and liar Troll team who has mental problems against Turkiye and Erdogan
> 
> 
> keep crying loser Greece,FETO,PKK-YPG,HAFTAR,Armenia,SAA,IRGC,Hezbolah
> 
> 10% of Turkish Armed Forces power kicked all of you in İraq,Syria,Libya,Eastern Mediterranean


There you go again. No evidence,when you get cornered all you do is return to the exact same phrases,like a child that has nothing else to say.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Excuse me,are you retarded? Where exactly did I cry?
> 
> I posted you facts,information and you simply discarded it,mumbling your usual insults and nonsense.



You always cried here with lies and stupid posts


You compare 6.000 Turkish soldiers without airforce for 3 months with 150.000+ soldiers and American+French Airforces for 18 months and 10.000+ civilian loses

except Turkish Army , no any Army can do it in the world

Super upper Israeli Army sucked against 1.000 HEZBOL militia in guerrilla warfare by 2006
only Israeli Airforce bombed Lebanon ... nothing else

you are so ignorant and pathetic with inferiority complex
keep crying losers




Foinikas said:


> There you go again. No evidence,when you get cornered all you do is return to the exact same phrases,like a child that has nothing else to say.



keep crying like a child

reality is even 10% of Turkish Armed Forces power kicked all of you Greece,FETO,PKK-YPG,ISIS,HAFTAR,IRGC,SAA,HEZBOL in İraq,Syria,Libya,Eastern Mediterranean


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You compare 6.000 Turkish soldiers without airforce for 3 months with 150.000+ soldiers and American+French Airforces for 18 months and 10.000+ civilian loses


And you compare a town the size of Al Bab to the second biggest city in Iraq.



MMM-E said:


> you are so ignorant and pathetic with inferiority complex
> keep crying losers


Oh I believe we all know who has the inferiority complex here...


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Just lol. Seriously....lol.



Liar and Criminal savage Greeks

The British newspaper deciphered the black propaganda of the Greeks: The woman in the photograph is a Turkish woman whose husband was murdered by the Greeks.












Foinikas said:


> And you compare a town the size of Al Bab to the second biggest city in Iraq.



if we use 150.000 soldiers and airforce instead of 6.000 soldiers without airforce

and if 18 months instead of 3 months

you brainless pathetic guy


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Liar and Criminal savage Greeks
> 
> The British newspaper deciphered the black propaganda of the Greeks: The woman in the photograph is a Turkish woman whose husband was murdered by the Greeks.
> 
> View attachment 852696
> 
> View attachment 852695
> 
> 
> 
> 
> if we use 150.000 soldiers and airforce instead of 6.000 soldiers without airforce
> 
> and if 18 months instead of 3 months
> 
> you brainless pathetic guy


When it comes to military matters,you know as much as a monkey knows about nuclear science.



MMM-E said:


> Liar and Criminal savage Greeks


Everybody is a liar except great Turkish nation,huh? Especially for you. Chinese, Pakistanis,Persians,Arabs,Europeans, Israelis,Americans,Armenians,Kurds...
Everybody...


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> When it comes to military matters,you know as much as a monkey knows about nuclear science.



its you , not me
You have no any worldwide military knowledge 





Foinikas said:


> Everybody is a liar except great Turkish nation,huh?



read again about liar Greeks

The British newspaper deciphered the black propaganda of the Greeks: The woman in the photograph is a Turkish woman whose husband was murdered by the Greeks.


----------



## MMM-E

*Turkiye has bigger Attack Helicopter fleet than Greece+İsrael combined*


Turkiye : 93
Greece : 29 + Israel : 47 = 76







*also 250+ UCAVs to hunt enemy Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Defense Systems*










40 km KUZGUN-KY Missile to hit even moving targets






*The best fire power in Europe

even only 350 Attack Helicopters - UCAVs are enough to destroy all Greek Military targets in Greek Islands*


----------



## Foinikas

Mental capacity of a teenager...you should have been banned from the forum a long time ago. But they probably find you amusing.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Mental capacity of a teenager...you should have been banned from the forum a long time ago. But they probably find you amusing.



as always trash post from you
You have no any worldwide military knowledge to be on PDF

stop trolling and discuss like a real man

tiny-weak Greece with 29 Attack Helicopters dreaming about fighting against regional power Turkiye* 350 Attack Helicopters - UCAVs*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> stop trolling and discuss like a real man


*You want to discuss like a real man? Do you even know what that's like? *
Get out of here and go back to telemarketing in Germany. Pathetic spambot.


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> My posts hurts liar and pathetic daydreamers like you
> 
> read again about liar Greeks
> 
> The British newspaper deciphered the black propaganda of the Greeks: The woman in the photograph is a Turkish woman whose husband was murdered by the Greeks.
> View attachment 852898



The fact that you posted this 3 times already,shows your inability to properly debate and your insecurities. 

I refrained from posting photo replies to it,because we'll turn this thread into chaos. But if you insist,I assure you,you will be cornered and you will run back to your long lists of Turkish superweapons,because there's way more newspaper articles and evidence of Turkish crimes. So either delete your provocative posts and get back on topic or you'll end up crying again.


----------



## MMM-E

*Turkish TEI TF-6000 Turbofan Engine at the prototype stage after 2 years of design work*


( 6.000 lbs ~10.000 lbs ) Turbofan Engine to use by supersonic UCAVs





__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1535162459971010560


----------



## retaxis

There are only 2 regional superpowers in the world and that is China and US who dominates their region. How can Turkey even be a regional power when Israel, Egypt and Iran is more powerful and Greece/Saudi equal? Its like calling Cambodia and Botswana regional superpowers. Sound delusional at best and retarded most likely

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## MMM-E

*Greece never can defend its Islands which 2-30 km away from Turkiye*


American-French weapons can not save Greece from the Turkish Armed Forces fire power


*All military targets will be destroyed by the Turkish Armed Forces in Greek Islands*

-- 250+ UCAVs armed with 15km MAM-L , 30 km MAM-T laser guided munition
-- 93 Attack Helicopters

-- 40 km T-155 Howitzer
-- 40 km TRG-122 guided MLRS
-- 70 km TRLG-230 guided MLRS
-- 120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
-- 150 km J600T Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 165 ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km BORA Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km KARA-ATMACA ground launched Cruise Missile
-- 200 km SIMSEK kamikaze Drone
-- 500 km HARPY kamikaze Drone
-- 1.000 km KARGI anti-radiation Drone

-- 70 km POPEYE air launched Cruise Missile
-- 110 km KGK guided Bomb
-- 110 km SDB guided Bomb
-- 130 km JSOW glide Bomb
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 280 km SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missile
-- 280 km SOM air launched Cruise Missile


----------



## Foinikas

@waz @LeGenD This has moved to pure spam. He has posted these lists in the same thread,literally more than a dozen times. It's just spam after a certain point. It's a never ending loop. He keeps posting the exact same stuff like c/p.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> @waz @LeGenD This has moved to pure spam. He has posted these lists in the same thread,literally more than a dozen times. It's just spam after a certain point. It's a never ending loop. He keeps posting the exact same stuff like c/p.



reality hurts you

and its my thread which is not violate Forum rules .. stop crying
PDF is not forum for you to cry

I show Tactical and Strategic Advantages
and shut up or say some thing about how to defend Islands ? how ?


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> reality hurts you
> 
> and its my thread which is not violate Forum rules .. stop crying
> PDF is not forum for you to cry
> 
> I show Tactical and Strategic Advantages
> and shut up or say some thing about how to defend Islands ? how


All you do is constantly repeat the exact same lists and insult and mock every time somebody mentions a different weapons system.

That's not a discussion,that's not a debate. You're not here to talk. You're here to showcase your lists,brag about "Turkish superiority" and expect others to say "well done". That's all you're here for,you're not here to discuss.

One can only go through the thread's posts and see how many times you've spammed the same things. Every time you were cornered,you either went back to mentioning alleged Turkish "victories" or repeat the same weapons lists. That's all you do.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> That's not a discussion,that's not a debate. You're not here to talk. You're here to showcase your lists,brag about "Turkish superiority" and expect others to say "well done". That's all you're here for,you're not here to discuss.



its your lie

I dont need to brag about Turkish superiority and expect others to say "well done"
everybody knows about Turkish superiority against Greece

I just showing reality to wake Greeks from their dreams


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> its your lie
> 
> I dont need to brag about Turkish superiority and expect others to say "well done"
> everybody knows about it
> 
> I just showing reality to wake Greeks from their dreams


Here we go again...


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Here we go again...
> 
> View attachment 853361



no military knowledge to discuss ... but only trolling as always


stop dreaming and look at the map

tiny Greece never can defend its Islands which 2-30 km away from Turkiye


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> no military knowledge to discuss ... but only trolling as always


Everybody on this forum have given up trying to discuss seriously with you. Not because they don't have knowledge,but because it always ends up with you acting like a 10 year-old,insisting and refusing to listen to anyone. It's useless.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Everybody on this forum have given up trying to discuss seriously with you. Not because they don't have knowledge,but because it always ends up with you acting like a 10 year-old,insisting and refusing to listen to anyone. It's useless.



its your method as always ... trolling , blah blah and trying to discredit me

my posts hurts all daydreamers and they have no military knowledge to discuss and they acting like a 10 year-old boy


my question .. how to defend Islands ? how ?


USA-UK-France-Germany provoked Ukraine against Russia
RESULT : Ukraine lost Crimea and Don-Bas ... also Ukranian cities were destroyed


now USA-France-Germany provoke tiny Greece against Turkiye
Do you want to lose Islands ?


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> my question .. how to defend Islands ? how ?


I've answered before,the islands in the Eastern Aegean that do have a military presence,only have small garissons and only basic Air Defence like OSA-AKM,Skyguard Velos(I think)and Stinger manpads. The biggest of those that have some armor presence have M48A5 MOLF tanks and BMP-1 converted to ZSU-23-2 carriers. 

Therefore they can only fight a delaying role or try to bleed the invader as much as they can. 

That also proves that they are no threat to Turkey,discrediting the Turkish claims that this tiny presence on the islands is a "threat".



MMM-E said:


> now USA-France-Germany provoke tiny Greece against Turkiye
> Do you want to lose Islands ?


How exactly does USA-France-Germany provoke Greece against Turkey concerning the islands? 

Turkey is the one that started threatening of taking them in the first place.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Therefore they can only fight a delaying role or try to bleed the invader as much as they can.



Do you Greeks think Turkiye will invade Athens or something Greek mainland ?

or you have big dreams to increase territorial waters to 12 nm ?





Foinikas said:


> That also proves that they are no threat to Turkey,discrediting the Turkish claims that this tiny presence on the islands is a "threat".



threat or not

Greece continues to militarize eastern Aegean islands in violation of international agreements
Stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris​




Foinikas said:


> How exactly does USA-France-Germany provoke Greece against Turkey concerning the islands?
> 
> Turkey is the one that started threatening of taking them in the first place.



USA-France-Germany used Ukraine as a pawn against Russia
and now USA-France-Germany use Greece as a pawn against Turkiye

Turkiye has decided to make a new military operation against USA-France-Germany backed PKK/YPG Terrorists in Syria 

and USA-France-Germany wants to use Greece to fight Turkiye


Greece has no rights to arm Islands
and in 1980s Greece is the one that started threatening of increase territorial water to 12 nm

stop illegally arming Islands and stop threatening of increase territorial water to 12 nm

then no any problem ....just stick to the agreements you signed


----------



## Akritas

Foinikas said:


> @waz @LeGenD This has moved to pure spam. He has posted these lists in the same thread,literally more than a dozen times. It's just spam after a certain point. It's a never ending loop. He keeps posting the exact same stuff like c/p.


Ignorant spammers are worse than trolls. So ignored him, after all he never answers the arguments of others, just makes advertisements of supposed Turkish super weapons.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Do you Greeks think Turkiye will invade Athens or something Greek mainland ?


Do YOU think Greece will invade Turkey? 



MMM-E said:


> Greece continues to militarize eastern Aegean islands in violation of international agreements
> Stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris​



I showed you and the other Turks here,how Greece violates absolutely no Treaty and is 100% with International Law.

If you had read what I showed you a few days ago,instead of mumbling "lies...lies...Greek lies",you would have seen that everything we do is according to International Law.

And even if we wanted to demilitarize the islands on our own,your government only makes us suspicious,by insisting so much on them having absolutely no military presence.



MMM-E said:


> Greece has no rights to arm Islands
> and in 1980s Greece is the one that started threatening of increase territorial water to 12 nm


It shows how ignorant you are. Turkey is the one that started expansionist claims:


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Ignorant spammers are worse than trolls. So ignored him, after all he never answers the arguments of others, just makes advertisements of supposed Turkish super weapons.



You ignorant Trolls never answers the our arguments

again just trolling , blah blah ..nothing else


1 -- Greece continues to militarize eastern Aegean islands in violation of international agreements
and stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


2 -- by international law Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc

therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


----------



## Samar111

Turkey would crush Greece like a little bug... Bankrupt Greece should focus on its citizens not buying expensive military equipment.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Do YOU think Greece will invade Turkey?



Greece and PKK/YPG Terrorists will be used as pawns by USA-France to fight Turkiye





Foinikas said:


> I showed you and the other Turks here,how Greece violates absolutely no Treaty and is 100% with International Law.



Stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris





Foinikas said:


> It shows how ignorant you are. Turkey is the one that started expansionist claims:



*expansionist Greece has grown its territory 3 times in the last 200 years*

even Greeks tried to take whole Cyprus between 1964 and 1974
but Turkish Armed Forces kicked expansionist Greeks in 1974


expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne and in 1936 Greece increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm

and since 1990s expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm


only stupid and expansionist Greece can claim this

a tiny Greek Island which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland to generate EEZ of 200 nm ....

*what a stupid dream by expansionist Greece*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


Understand two things,because even if I show you the text again,you will ignore it:

1.The Turkish government refrained from any demilitarisation of the islands
2. The Treaty of Paris was between Greece and Italy. Turkey had absolutely no part in it and therefore no say. 

Now,if you want to read the sources and see how all that is legal,I can show you again. 

If you are willing to read it of course.



MMM-E said:


> expansionist Greece has grown its territory 3 times in the last 200 years


Are you retarded? It was a war of liberation. Do you realize that Ottomans conquered all of our lands in Asia Minor,mainland Greece and the Balkans? Your people expanded first and took over our lands,we just liberated them in subsequent wars.



MMM-E said:


> and expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm
> 
> 
> only stupid and expansionist Greece can claim this
> 
> a tiny Greek Island which is just 10 km2 and 580 km away from Greek Mainland and just 2 km away from Turkish Mainland to generate EEZ of 200 nm ....
> 
> *what a stupid dream by expansionist Greece*


What happened? Are you out of arguements again? You're back nagging about Kastellorizo,when I show you that Turkey is the one that started the expansionist claims after 50 years of not complaining?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Understand two things,because even if I show you the text again,you will ignore it:
> 
> 1.The Turkish government refrained from any demilitarisation of the islands
> 2. The Treaty of Paris was between Greece and Italy. Turkey had absolutely no part in it and therefore no say.




Turkiye always warned Greece not to militarize Islands
and stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


nahhhhhh

Violation by Greece of the rules on the disarmament of the eastern Aegean islands may give Turkiye the right to terminate the articles of the Lausanne Peace Treaty 1923 regulating sovereignty over the islands.

even Paragraph 1 of Article 14 of the Treaty of Paris 1947, under the title of "Twelve Islands", counts 14 islands, including Kastellerizo Island which were transferred from Italy to Greece, will be demilitarized and will remain so

*now Turkiye has right to take Islands

even Italy had no right transfer our 12 Islands to Greece without Turkish permission*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye always warned Greece not to militarize Islands
> and stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris
> 
> 
> nahhhhhh
> 
> Violation by Greece of the rules on the disarmament of the eastern Aegean islands may give Turkiye the right to terminate the articles of the Lausanne Peace Treaty 1923 regulating sovereignty over the islands.
> 
> even Paragraph 1 of Article 14 of the Treaty of Paris 1947, under the title of "Twelve Islands", counts 14 islands, including Meis Island which were transferred from Italy to Greece, will be demilitarized and will remain so
> 
> *now Turkiye has right to take Islands*


Ok,the question is this:

Do you want to read how that is annuled or not? Do you want to learn something or do you want to just say your things? 

Answer seriously.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Ok,the question is this:
> 
> Do you want to read how that is annuled or not? Do you want to learn something or do you want to just say your things?
> 
> Answer seriously.




*expansionist Greece violates international agreements *

expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne 
and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm

and since 1990s expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm

also Greece hiding behind USA-The EU and dreaming about Seville map which is not valid


Do you want a war ?

Answer seriously.

because Turks have no JOKE as like 1974


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> What happened? Are you out of arguements again? You're back nagging about Kastellorizo,when I show you that Turkey is the one that started the expansionist claims after 50 years of not complaining?



its your fake propaganda and your stupid map


in 1972 there was not EEZ 

An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982 which a sovereign state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources, including energy production from water and wind


----------



## MMM-E

*Greece buys 24 RAFALE Fighter Jets 




War in the Neighbor's Sky*

In this scenario, Rafale with Meteor air-to-air missiles (150-200 km)
and the S-400 - 40N6E Missiles (250-380 km)






*Turkiye bought 36 S400 Air Defense Systems with 144+48 Missiles*





*NO Fly zone over the Aegean*


----------



## dani191

need laser weapon every thing else very expensive


----------



## MMM-E

dani191 said:


> need laser weapon every thing else very expensive



Rafale Fighter Jet also very expensive to lose ( $100 million )


----------



## dani191

MMM-E said:


> Rafale Fighter Jet also very expensive to lose ( $100 million )


yes


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> its your fake propaganda and your stupid map
> 
> 
> in 1972 there was not EEZ
> 
> An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982 which a sovereign state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources, including energy production from water and wind


Eh,you don't want to talk,you don't want to understand. 

First you complain about me trolling you. I talk to you in a serious manner,because you pretend you want to dicuss seriously and with arguements. I try to explain to you the arguements,you change the subject. 

Like I've said,you don't want to discuss anything here. All you want is to say your thing,present Turkey as a superpower and then leave. 

And when people question the validity of your statements,you just insult them and talk like a 10 year-old brat.



MMM-E said:


> In this scenario, Rafale with Meteor air-to-air missiles (150-200 km)
> and the S-400 - 40N6E Missiles (250-380 km)


And if you're S-400 don't work against the Rafale or you're not allowed to activate them,you'll get a nice slap in the face.



MMM-E said:


> expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne
> and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm


Do you want an answer or not? 

You want to prove that you're a serious person,here's your chance. Do you want or not? Or will you cry like a baby and continue being the joke of the forum?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Eh,you don't want to talk,you don't want to understand.
> 
> First you complain about me trolling you. I talk to you in a serious manner,because you pretend you want to dicuss seriously and with arguements. I try to explain to you the arguements,you change the subject.
> 
> Like I've said,you don't want to discuss anything here. All you want is to say your thing,present Turkey as a superpower and then leave.
> 
> And when people question the validity of your statements,you just insult them and talk like a 10 year-old brat.



no discuss , but just trolling and crying as always


I am saying again
in 1972 there was not EEZ

An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982 which a sovereign state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources, including energy production from water and wind

so Greece's cheap propaganda wont work




Foinikas said:


> Do you want an answer or not?
> 
> You want to prove that you're a serious person,here's your chance. Do you want or not? Or will you cry like a baby and continue being the joke of the forum?



as always you have started crying like little girls

Greeks can not give answer to questions


*expansionist Greece violates international agreements*

expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne
and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm

and since 1990s expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm

also Greece hiding behind USA-The EU and dreaming about Seville map which is not valid


Do you want a war ?

Answer seriously.

because Turks have no JOKE as like 1974


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> And if you're S-400 don't work against the Rafale or you're not allowed to activate them,you'll get a nice slap in the face.



if what , if so

-- S400 to work against Fighter Jets including old technology Rafale
-- S400s are belong to Turkiye and only 30 minutes to activate

in 2020 Turkiye activated and tested S400s in Sinop



even 120-150 km Turkish SIPER Air Defense System to work against Fighter Jets ...( you'll get a nice slap in the face )

600 km AESA Radar for SIPER Air Defense System


















*also HISAR-RF Air Defense System to intercept Cruise Missiles - Fighter Jets*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> no discuss , but just trolling and crying as always
> 
> 
> I am saying again
> in 1972 there was not EEZ
> 
> An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982 which a sovereign state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources, including energy production from water and wind
> 
> so Greece's cheap propaganda wont work
> 
> 
> 
> 
> as always you have started crying like little girls
> 
> Greeks can not give answer to questions
> 
> 
> *expansionist Greece violates international agreements*
> 
> expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne
> and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm
> 
> and since 1990s expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm
> 
> also Greece hiding behind USA-The EU and dreaming about Seville map which is not valid
> 
> 
> Do you want a war ?
> 
> Answer seriously.
> 
> because Turks have no JOKE as like 1974


@WebMaster @LeGenD @waz @RescueRanger @Deino @Irfan Baloch @Jango @Kambojaric @Foxtrot Alpha 

I'm right about to tear this joke of a member,a new one. He's been constantly spamming,then pretends he wants to discuss,I'm trying to discuss and he goes back to mocking and retarded comments without even wanting to actually discuss anything.

He's been pissing everyone off the last week with his endless spam of the same things. I'm right about to go ballistic on this buffoon,he's only here to say his things,spam the same long lists of Turkish weapons in an endless loop and insult our intelligence and patience.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> keep crying pathetic loser


You're the biggest flamer on the forum. A 15 year-old kid with no knowledge,spamming bullshit all the time and when you get cornered,you go back to insults.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> You're the biggest flamer on the forum. A 15 year-old kid with no knowledge,spamming bullshit all the time and when you get cornered,you go back to insults.
> 
> View attachment 853459



keep crying ....... my posts hurts losers including you

PDF is not USA or The EU for Greeks to cry


My thread is not violate forum rules

you can not answer my questions .... because you have no any military and political knowledge to discuss


----------



## dani191

what about s 500 ?


----------



## MMM-E

dani191 said:


> what about s 500 ?



in 2019 Erdogan said S-400 deal done, S-500 on agenda
maybe 2nd batch of S400s will be purchased from Russia

because USA doesnt sell even F-16V to Turkiye
on the other hand USA-France arming Greece ( F-16V - Rafale )


----------



## dani191

MMM-E said:


> in 2019 Erdogan said S-400 deal done, S-500 on agenda
> but not S500 ..... maybe 2nd batch of S400s will be purchased from Russia
> 
> because USA doesnt sell even F-16V to Turkiye


you dont need you will have your fighter


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Yes? Is that why you have -32 Reaction score and you got banned like 10 times already?



because you and your troll team provoked me in 2021
and I took -32 reaction score within 4 months .... including Chinese MOD from Germany DEINO

so I dont care about you anymore ... you and your troll team can not provoke me





Foinikas said:


> Yes? Is that why you have -32 Reaction score and you got banned like 10 times already?
> 
> 
> Hey dumbfuck YOU'RE the one who's not answering my questions.
> 
> I ASKED YOU AGAIN AND AGAIN IF YOU WANT TO DISCUSS SERIOUSLY! And all you did was refuse to read what I showed you and hastily rejected it to post trash Turkish technology from the garbadge can.



you can not provoke me

I answered your question .... but you have started crying as always


I am saying again

in 1972 there was not EEZ

An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982 which a sovereign state has special rights regarding the exploration and use of marine resources, including energy production from water and wind


now you answer my question

*expansionist Greece violates international agreements*

expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne
and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm

and since 1990s expansionist Greece is trying to increase territorial water to 12nm from 6 nm

also Greece hiding behind USA-The EU and dreaming about Seville map which is not valid


Do you want a war ?

because Turks have no JOKE as like 1974


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> I answered your question .... but you have started crying as always


First you asked about the islands,when I replied about the islands,you went to the EEZ. You're avoiding the subject when you can't handle it and then you repeat the same stuff again and again.

You want to talk about the demilitirasation or not?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> First you asked about the islands,when I replied about the islands,you went to the EEZ.



because your map shows Turkish EEZ
and in 1972 there was not any EZZ , An exclusive economic zone (EEZ), as prescribed in 1982
and Turkish MAVI VATAN doctrine from 2006

You have no any knodledge to discuss


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> expansionist Greece violated 1923 Treaty of Lausanne
> and in 1936 Greece illegally increased territorial water to 6nm from 3 nm


Cry baby,cry:

_*Greece’s right to militarise Limnos and Samothrace was recognized by Turkey, in accordance with the letter sent to the Greek Prime Minister on 6 May 1936 by the Turkish Ambassador in Athens at the time, Roussen Esref, upon instructions from his Government.* The Turkish government reiterated this position when the then Turkish Minister for Foreign Affairs, Rustu Aras, in his address to the Turkish National Assembly on the occasion of the ratification of the Montreux Treaty, unreservedly recognized Greece’s legal right to deploy troops on Limnos and Samothrace, with the following statement : “The provisions pertaining to the islands of Limnos and Samothrace, which belong to our neighbor and friendly country Greece and were demilitarized in application of the 1923 Lausanne Treaty, were also abolished by the new Montreux Treaty, which gives us great pleasure” (Gazette of the Minutes of the *Turkish National Assembly*, volume 12, July 31/1936, page 309). During the same period, Turkey gave similar assurances on this subject to the governments of interested third countries._


*The status of Mytilene, Chios, Samos and Ikaria*


The Lausanne Treaty* makes no mention *of these islands having been granted demilitarized status.


The Greek government simply commits to not establishing naval bases or fortifications there in accordance with Article 13 of the Treaty. More specifically, this article specifies that :


“With a view to ensuring the maintenance of peace, the Greek Government undertakes to observe the following restrictions in the islands of Mytilene, Chios, Samos and Nikaria:


• No naval base and no fortification will be established in the said islands.


• Greek military aircraft will be forbidden to fly over the territory of the Anatolian coast. Reciprocally, the Turkish Government will forbid their military aircraft to fly over the said islands.


• The Greek military forces in the said islands will be limited to the normal contingent called up for military service, which can be trained on the spot, as well as to a force of gendarmerie and police in proportion to the force of gendarmerie and police existing in the whole of the Greek territory”.

*The Status of the Islands of the South-Eastern Aegean (the Dodecanese) *

The Dodecanese islands were ceded to Greece in full sovereignty by the Paris Peace Treaty between Italy and the Allies in April 1947. The provisions of this Treaty provided for the demilitarization of these islands: “The above islands shall be demilitarized and shall remain so”. There is a National Guard presence on the Dodecanese islands, which has been declared in accordance with CFE provisions.

With regard to Turkish claims on the demilitarization of the Dodecanese islands, it should be noted that:

• *Turkey is not a signatory state to this Treaty*, which therefore constitutes a "res inter alios acta" for Turkey; i.e., an issue pertaining to others. According to Article 34 of the Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties, a treaty does not create obligations or rights for third countries.

• The demilitarized status of the Dodecanese islands was imposed after the decisive intervention of the Soviet Union and echoes Moscow’s political intentions at that point in time. It should, however, be noted that demilitarized status lost its raison d’être with the creation of NATO and the Warsaw Pact, as incompatible with countries’ participation in military alliances. Against this backdrop, demilitarized status ceased to apply to the Italian islands of Pantelaria, Lampedusa, Lampione and Linosa, as well as to West Germany on the one hand and Bulgaria, Romania, East Germany, Hungary and Finland on the other.

It should be stressed that Greece, just like any other country in the world, has never ceded its natural right of defense in the event of a threat to its islands or any other part of its territory, especially since there has been sufficient proof over the past decades that Turkey is acting in an inconsistent manner and in violation of the United Nations Charter.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Cry baby,cry:



Violation by Greece of the rules on the disarmament of the eastern Aegean islands may give Turkiye the right to terminate the articles of the Lausanne Peace Treaty 1923 regulating sovereignty over the islands.

also Paragraph 1 of Article 14 of the Treaty of Paris 1947, under the title of "Twelve Islands", counts 14 islands, including Kastellerizo Island which were transferred from Italy to Greece, will be demilitarized and will remain so

stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris

now Turkiye has right to take Islands

*dont worry we Turks again will kick bandit Greeks as like in 1974

and loser Greeks are crying since 1974*


----------



## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Violation by Greece of the rules on the disarmament of the eastern Aegean islands may give Turkiye the right to terminate the articles of the Lausanne Peace Treaty 1923 regulating sovereignty over the islands.
> 
> also Paragraph 1 of Article 14 of the Treaty of Paris 1947, under the title of "Twelve Islands", counts 14 islands, including Kastellerizo Island which were transferred from Italy to Greece, will be demilitarized and will remain so
> 
> stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris
> 
> now Turkiye has right to take Islands
> 
> *dont worry we Turks again will kick bandit Greeks as like in 1974
> 
> and loser Greeks are crying since 1974*


Did you read anything from what I posted? 🤦‍♂️


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Did you read anything from what I posted? 🤦‍♂️



We read only international agreements 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris

We dont care about Greek crying


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> 1 -- Greece continues to militarize eastern Aegean islands in violation of international agreements
> and stationing troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


I have already answered, but as usual you did not read it, so I repeat:
as long as there is the Turkish Aegean Army, a big landing fleet, the two Turkish naval bases and two helicopter brigades in the wider region of Asia Minor, there is no case to demilitarize a Greek island, instead the equipment with new modern weapons systems will continue.

With "_Mavi Vatan-type dogmas_" and "_Mîsâk-ı Millî_ _national borders_", as are constantly repeated by Turkish politicians, there is no case for normalization, let alone demilitarization of Greek territories that threatened by the Turkish armed forces.

The Turkish military threat is real, *what is threatened is not demilitarized*.



MMM-E said:


> 2 -- by international law Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
> Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc
> 
> therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


First of all, when you talk about "international law" be clear. Of course you have never been, like the politicians of your country.
Greece has rights as they derive from UNCLOS.
The following diagram explains them in detail, which I doubt you will ever read.








Therefore every island (with economic life), according to UNCLOS has an Exclusive Economic Zone.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> We read only international agreements 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris
> 
> We dont care about Greek crying


Ah I understand. You read it and you didn't like what it says and you pretend you don't care. 

I see now. You just pretend you didn't read it.


----------



## MMM-E

*Greece has SCALP Cruise Missiles*



Turkiye has developed HISAR-A and HISAR-O Air Defense Systems which are already in service to intercept Cruise Missiles

*HISAR-A*





*HISAR-O*


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> I have already answered, but as usual you did not read it, so I repeat:
> as long as there is the Turkish Aegean Army, a big landing fleet, the two Turkish naval bases and two helicopter brigades in the wider region of Asia Minor, there is no case to demilitarize a Greek island, instead the equipment with new modern weapons systems will continue.



Turkiye doesnt violate international agreements
but Greek continues to militarize islands in the eastern Aegean, in violation of both the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne and the Paris Treaty of 1947

even American military bases in Greece can not save you

*sooner or later bandit Greeks will get a new lesson as like in 1974*





Akritas said:


> Greece has rights as they derive from UNCLOS.



even UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ


1-- Greek Islands which only 2-30 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland

2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc

therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Ah I understand. You read it and you didn't like what it says and you pretend you don't care.
> 
> I see now. You just pretend you didn't read it.



Your talk has no any value by international agreements

therefore we dont care about Greek crying


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye doesnt violate international agreements


*Turkey always violates international treaties*, with the typical example of the* national cleansing of the Greek minority* in Constantinople and in the islands of Imbros and Tenedos(Treaty of Lausanne and Articles 37 to 45).

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *Turkey always violates international treaties*, with the typical example of the* national cleansing of the Greek minority* in Constantinople and in the islands of Imbros and Tenedos(Treaty of Lausanne and Articles 37 to 45).




not Constantinople , but Istanbul


and what about the* national cleansing ?*

Greece violates the Lausanne Treaty by not recognizing the Muftis selected by the Turkish minority in Western Trace

about 150,000 ethnic Turkish people reside in Western Thrace with their status set by the Lausanne Peace Treaty of 1923 and their rights guaranteed by agreements.


----------



## musti

Greece do not let to open single mosque in Athen which had 150 mosques Ottoman reign


Muslims of Athen have no religon freedom for their temples. 

Athen has serious a Pakistani population.


----------



## Foinikas

@MMM-E You want to talk about something,but you don't read what we tell you. We explain to you why you and your government are wrong,but all you do is say "liar greek Lausanne 1923". 

Are you psychotic or something?



MMM-E said:


> even UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ
> 
> 
> 1-- Greek Islands which only 2-30 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland
> 
> 2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc
> 
> therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


You lost the game when you used a different way to declare your EEZ in the Black Sea.


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> @MMM-E You want to talk about something,but you don't read what we tell you. We explain to you why you and your government are wrong,but all you do is say "liar greek Lausanne 1923".
> 
> Are you psychotic or something?
> 
> 
> You lost the game when you used a different way to declare your EEZ in the Black Sea.
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 853521



still dreaming about UNCLOS
Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean

even UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ


1-- Greek Islands which only 2-30 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland

2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc

therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> still dreaming about UNCLOS
> Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> even UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ
> 
> 
> 1-- Greek Islands which only 2-30 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland
> 
> 2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc
> 
> therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


Are you suffering from some mental disorder? You just posted this part in a previous post.

Are you ok?

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Are you suffering from some mental disorder? You just posted this part in a previous post.
> 
> Are you ok?



You Greeks have mental disorder ..... stupid Greeks read again

UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ


1-- Greek Island which only 2 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland

2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc

therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> You Greeks have mental disorder ..... stupid Greeks read again
> 
> UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ
> 
> 
> 1-- Greek Island which only 2 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland
> 
> 2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc
> 
> therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island
> 
> 
> *so Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean*


Third time? Are you ok?


----------



## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Third time? Are you ok?



its UNCLOS to remind day dreamer Greeks

read again and stop dreaming

UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ


1-- Greek Island which only 2 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland

2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc

therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island


*so Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean
*
Greeks wants to use USA-The EU to force Turkiye to give up from its right

-- to use military power
-- sanctions
-- political support


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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> not Constantinople , but Istanbul
> 
> 
> and what about the* national cleansing ?*


*Yes, national cleasing...*..













The Turkish Kristallnacht


Sixty years after its pogroms against ethnic Greeks, Turkey grapples with its ugly history.




www.politico.eu





*Under the terms of the Treaty of Lausanne (1923)*, the islands of Imvros and Tenedos were ceded to Turkey, which, *pursuant to Article 14, undertook to provide guarantees for non-Muslim residents regarding the protection of persons and propert*y. However, in the 1960s, Greek property was confiscated, Greek language teaching was abolished and all Greek teachers dismissed. The Turkish Government approved the settlement of ethnic Turks from mainland Turkey on the island of Imvros and the construction of an open prison, whose inmates were then allowed to roam freely. 
In 1974, the islands fell victim to Turkish acts of rape and desecration. As a result, according to 2014 statistics, *only 550 of the 8644 inhabitants of Imvros are Greek, while there are no more than a few dozen elderly Greeks left on Tenedos*. 
This compares to a Greek population of 9207 on the island of Imvros when the Treaty of Lausanne was signed.



The dwindling of the Greek population of Imbros and Tenedos within the framework of the Turkish foreign policy

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> its UNCLOS to remind day dreamer Greeks
> 
> read again and stop dreaming
> 
> UNCLOS doesnt give right to Greek Islands to generate its own EEZ
> 
> 
> 1-- Greek Island which only 2 km away from Turkiye can not block Turkish mainland
> 
> 2 - Greece is not archipelagic State like Indonesia , Philippines , New Zelland ,etc
> 
> therefore Greek EEZ should start from Greek mainland , not from every tiny Greek Island
> 
> 
> *so Greece has zero right in the Eastern Mediterranean*
> 
> Greeks wants to use USA-The EU to force Turkiye to give up from its right
> 
> -- to use military power
> -- sanctions
> -- political support


Can you say it again? Because I didn't understand it.


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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *only 550 of the 8644 inhabitants of Imvros are Greek, while there are no more than a few dozen elderly Greeks left on Tenedos*.
> This compares to a Greek population of 9207 on the island of Imvros when the Treaty of Lausanne was signed.



Population exchange between Greece and Turkiye in 1923

around 1.1 million Greeks arrived in Greece ......



Foinikas said:


> Can you say it again? Because I didn't understand it.



bandit Greeks dont understand international law and agreements

therefore We Turks kicked bandit Greeks in 1974


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Population exchange between Greece and Turkiye in 1923
> 
> around 1.1 million Greeks arrived in Greece ......


Learn to read what the other person tells you, I am not talking about 1923, but about the period 1955-1965, where you did a national cleansing of the last 100 thousand Greeks in Constantinople, Imbros and Tenedos, in violation of the Treaty of Lausanne.

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> bandit Greeks dont understand international law and agreements
> 
> therefore We Turks kicked bandit Greeks in 1974


Can you repeat it again?



Akritas said:


> Learn to read what the other person tells you, I am not talking about 1923, but about the period 1955-1965, where you did a national cleansing of the last 100 thousand Greeks in Constantinople, Imbros and Tenedos, in violation of the Treaty of Lausanne.


He doesn't read. He doesn't want to have a discussion. He is not here to debate. He is just here to talk loud and advertise Turkish defence projects in a way that will make other forum members think that Turkey is a superpower.

It works on most of the Pakistanis,who are already pro-Turkish and long to see an islamic Turkey become the leader of the Muslim world.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Learn to read what the other person tells you, I am not talking about 1923, but about the period 1955-1965, where you did a national cleansing of the last 100 thousand Greeks in Constantinople, Imbros and Tenedos, in violation of the Treaty of Lausanne.



Greeks are so liar .... full of brainwashed people living in big dreams

Nobody attacked Greeks in Turkiye ... never
The number of Greeks of Turkiye origin living abroad is about 60.000

but bandit Greeks attacked Turks to make national cleansing of the Turks in Cyprus between 1964 and 1974

many Turks have been killed by Greeks and over 30.000 Turks were refugees



Akritas said:


> Learn to read what the other person tells you, I am not talking about 1923, but about the period 1955-1965, where you did a national cleansing of the last 100 thousand Greeks in Constantinople, Imbros and Tenedos, in violation of the Treaty of Lausanne.




not Turkiye
but Greece violates the Lausanne Treaty by not recognizing the Muftis selected by the Turkish minority in Western Trace

about 150,000 ethnic Turkish people reside in Western Thrace with their status set by the Lausanne Peace Treaty of 1923 and their rights guaranteed by agreements.


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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Greeks are so liar .... full of brainwashed people living in big dreams
> 
> Nobody attacked Greeks in Turkiye ... never


Who is liar?

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## Foinikas

MMM-E said:


> Nobody attacked Greeks in Turkiye ... never


Buddy,wake up and read history. 

My own grandfather barely escaped the massacre of the entire village. The people were literally butchered,like cattle. Inside and outside the church.

And apart from that,there were the Istanbul pogroms during the 50's and 60's.

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## MMM-E

Foinikas said:


> Buddy,wake up and read history.
> 
> My own grandfather barely escaped the massacre of the entire village. The people were literally butchered,like cattle. Inside and outside the church.
> 
> And apart from that,there were the Istanbul pogroms during the 50's and 60's.



You wake up and ready history


Gladio ( CIA and MI6 ) organized 6–7 September 1955 events
Istanbul events were triggered by a fake news story which stated that the day before, Greeks had bombed the Turkish consulate in Thessaloniki and the house where ATATURK was born

also Greek EOKA Terror organization has started attacking on the Turkish Cypriots on march 29 1955


Greek EOKA Terror organization killed many Turks in Cyprus
and had the ultimate goal of achieving the ENOSIS (union) of Cyprus with Greece

The armed struggle started on the night of March 29 1955. A total of 18 bomb attacks occurred in various locations across Cyprus




Foinikas said:


> And apart from that,there were the Istanbul pogroms* during the 50's and 60's.*



and only 2 days ... stop lying

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## MMM-E

*KARDAK ISLETS crisis between Turkiye and Greece in 1996*



12 Turkish special forces SAT Commandos captured the Island .... and planted the Turkish Flag on the west Island 

Americans said to Greeks that the TURKS captured Island 
and It wasn't until 4 hours later when the Greeks noticed this when a Greek Helicopter took off 5:30 am from the Greek Frigate for reconnaissance 

during the mission, Turkiye used Electronic Warfare attack on Greek Helicopter over the Island and 3 Greek officers on the Helicopter died (Christodoulos Karathanasis, Panagiotis Vlahakos and Ektoras Gialopsos )

and Greek admiral Hristos Limberis resigned in 1996 ... so pathetic


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## Akritas

It is always interesting to learn the Turkish views of the events that took place in the past. 
*The only victim from the Turkish view is the truth, even the subjective one.*

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## MMM-E

*AKINCI UCAV gets air-to-air Missiles to counter air targets*



Turkiye become the first country in the world to turn its UCAV into active weapons against air targets


To stay in the air 7/24 for air defeense mission to intercept even Cruise Missiles
and to hit Greek Army Helicopters including AH-64 Apache

to carry 6 GOKDOGAN - BOZDOGAN air to air missiles

















Turkish defense industry eyes new air-to-air missiles for Akıncı UCAV


The Defense Industries Research and Development Institute (SAGE) of the Scientific and Technological Research Council of Turkey (TÜBITAK) is working with...




www.dailysabah.com


----------



## Akritas

The time has come for a stable and reliable Euro-Atlantic Greece* to sharpen the climate.*
It is a matter of *substance* and *communication*.

*In essence*, the government must seriously and in-depth discuss possible scenarios with the leadership of the parliamentary parties.
*In terms of communication*, the sending of the message is urgent: we systematically note the Turkish graphic events and statements, but from now on we will react dynamically to acts of insult to Greek sovereignty such as overflights.

Greece must act in preparation, something which, to some extent, fortunately, it has begun to do , and convincing* that if necessary it will clash*.

The overthrow of a Turkish UAV flying over a Greek island, even a small one, *must be the first strategic message*.
*The second strategic message *is the capture of Turkish fishing boats, which are in Greek territorial waters.

*The lies are over for the Greek political staff*. Opposite is a Turkish political staff that dreaming "lost lands" and "neo-Ottoman ideals".

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *The lies are over for the Greek political staff*. Opposite is a Turkish political staff that dreaming "lost lands" and "neo-Ottoman ideals".



or Greeks dreaming about "lost lands" including Istanbul and Cyprus and dreaming about Megalo Idea

Turkiye always will block bandit Greece to enter MAVI VATAN and Nobody can change this reality


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *superior Turkish Army easly can crush any European Army like insect*



Wet dreams my dear.

To have weapon is one thing. To use it properly another.

We have seen how the Turkish Leo2 were used againt ISIS....



MMM-E said:


> *Turkish Army is 2nd strongest Army in NATO after the US Army*



As Irak was the 4th army of the world in 1991 ?

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> To have weapon is one thing. To use it properly another.
> 
> We have seen how the Turkish Leo2 were used againt ISIS....



losing 8 Tanks against 10.000+ ISIS terrorists in urban warfare within 3 months

-- that was urban warfare
-- ISIS used anti-Tank Missiles and suicide bomb attacks
-- Leo2 Tanks were without active protection system
-- ISIS used UAVs for reconnaissance and surveillance
-- and Turkiye did not use UCAVs and Fighter Jets against ISIS

*that was great success by the Turkish Army against ISIS after failed coup attempt*


French Army has no any success .. not even one

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> As Irak was the 4th army of the world in 1991 ?



Stop same bs by Europeans

-- Iraqi Army was not the 4th strongest Army of the world in 1991
-- Arabs dont know how to fight
-- Kurds and Shiite İraqis did not fight against USA
-- there was no İraqi defense industry to produce modern weapons
-- American Army is not a tiny-weak European Army
-- USA used traitor KESNIZANI Organization to destroy İraqi Army from inside

similar to traitor FETO Organization which seized the Turkish Armed Forces

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## MMM-E

*T-155 Howitzer ammunition range will increase from 40 to 56 km this year, then 72 km*


to hit Greek military targets in Islands
















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1539620303059443712

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## Akritas

We start again the advertising campaign of the turkish military material, which is nothing but a *reverse engineering *and assembly of componets that depends from foreign parts.

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> French Army has no any success .. not even one


We, all alone, break the *** of all the muslims terrorist in Sahara region.



MMM-E said:


> *T-155 Howitzer ammunition range will increase from 40 to 56 km this year, then 72 km*
> 
> 
> to hit Greek military targets in Islands
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 855882
> 
> View attachment 855883
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1539620303059443712


I hope a better success than the 1500HP engine of your tank...

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> We start again the advertising campaign of the turkish military material, which is nothing but a *reverse engineering *and assembly of componets that depends from foreign parts.




Another jealousy from Greeks 

Go develop even a Cruise Missile then come and say someting about great Turkish Defense Industry with over 750 military projects


*ROKETSAN - TUBITAK-SAGE ( Cruise missile , Anti-ship missile , Air Defense missile , Air to Air missile , Anti-Tank missile , and many more )*

Full of Turkish Engineering and technology
no any dependence from foreign parts for Missiles

-- Design and development
-- IIR and RF seeker
-- Turbojet Engine
-- JP-10 type missile fuel
-- KEMENT national data link
-- Inertial Measurement Unit

only a few Countries in the world .....


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> We, all alone, break the *** of all the muslims terrorist in Sahara region.



not even close to compare with Turkish Army against USA-France backed PKK/YPG in İraq-Syria , against ISIS in Syria , against Russia-İran backed SAA+IRGC+Hezbolah in Syria and against HAFTAR+WAGNER+The Uae in Libya




BON PLAN said:


> I hope a better success than the 1500HP engine of your tank...



Turkish Army has enough Tank power ... no problem
We can wait for 3 years indigenous BMC POWER 1500 hp Engine for ALTAY Tank

Our 250+ UCAVs are enough to destroy enemy Tanks


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> increase from 40 to 56 km this year, then 72 km


To take with a pinch of salt....

Or it needs to remove the barrel every 10 fires...


----------



## Akritas

Turkey promotes geopolitical competition with the spearhead of the falsification of history. But for the Hellenic Republic there can be no future without knowledge of the past. The example of Ukraine has shown that Europe is already paying a heavy price for what it wrongly devalues. Europe and NATO should not make the same mistake with Turkey, and especially let Greece not. Turkish allegations must be crushed by Greece in all international steps as was recently done at the UN. T*he full utilization of the historical and legal toolbox is the Greek dominant weapon.*

Greek politicians need to understand that. But it is even more necessary *to formulate a common national strategy, based on this knowledg*e. A country cannot peacefully defend its national rights when its politicians do not bother to agree on exactly what those rights are. Any delay in such an agreement undermines our national interest.

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## MMM-E

*in 2000s Greeks : *We have superior weapons Leopard2-HEL , AH-64 Apache , Type-214 , AEWC , Mirage-2000 , F-16 block52+ , PATRIOT , S300 , SCALP , EXOCET



*in 2020s Turks : *Ok Yorgi , We have also superior weapons TB-2 , AKINCI , BORA , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , SOM , ATMACA , T-129 , Boeing E-7T AEWC , ADA class stealth Corvette , GABYA Frigate, KORAL , HISAR-A/O , S400 , etc

also in 2022-2023

-- Type-214TN class AIP Submarine
-- TCG ANADOLU Amphibious Assault Ship
-- ISTIF class stealth Frigate
-- HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircraft
-- KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
-- KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile
-- CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
-- KARA-ATMACA ground launched Cruise Missile
-- ATMACA Coastal Defense Missile System


geographic superiority
strategic superiority
quantity superiority
range and platform superiority
etc
etc


----------



## MMM-E

*2 Game changer Weapons to block Hellenic Navy and Helenic Air Force in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean*




ATMACA and S-400 will act as Turkiye’s defense umbrella and the main constituent of TAF’s defense grid, giving it all-round protection against adversary threats including RAFALE Fighter Jets and BELHARRA Frigates


*1-- ) The S-400’s kill reportedly set a world record for the longest range ever for a Fighter Jet shootdown*

The S-400 shoot down Ukrainian SU-27 from 150+ km ranges


*2--) IIR guided ATMACA Missile increasing its performance in the Aegean Sea*

The land-based version of the ATMACA anti-ship Missile is outfitted with an Imaging Infrared seeker (IIR) and an image processing function that allows the missile to take out targets positioned near islands

The RF guided, sea-based version lacks this capability




*ATMACA Coastal Defense Missile System*
Warhead : 250 kg
Range : 250 km
Seeker : IIR
Speed : high subsonic

-- super sea skimming ( below 3 m )
-- zigzag maneuver that makes it difficult for anti missile batteries












*S400 Air Defense System*
Radar range : 600 km
Firing range : 400 km (40N6E missile)
Altitude : 30 km
Speed : Mach 3.5

The S-400 is able to destroy any incoming hostile Fighter Jets , AEWCs within a range of up to 400 km


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *in 2000s Greeks : *We have superior weapons Leopard2-HEL , AH-64 Apache , Type-214 , AEWC , Mirage-2000 , F-16 block52+ , PATRIOT , S300 , SCALP , EXOCET
> 
> 
> 
> *in 2020s Turks : *Ok Yorgi , We have also superior weapons TB-2 , AKINCI , BORA , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , SOM , ATMACA , T-129 , Boeing E-7T AEWC , ADA class stealth Corvette , GABYA Frigate, KORAL , HISAR-A/O , S400 , etc
> 
> also in 2022-2023
> 
> -- Type-214TN class AIP Submarine
> -- TCG ANADOLU Amphibious Assault Ship
> -- ISTIF class stealth Frigate
> -- HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircraft
> -- KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
> -- KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile
> -- CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
> -- KARA-ATMACA ground launched Cruise Missile
> -- ATMACA Coastal Defense Missile System
> 
> 
> geographic superiority
> strategic superiority
> quantity superiority
> range and platform superiority
> etc
> etc


Probably, but NATO is now on the greek side and beware of Turkey.
You are no more seen as a loyal partner. You remain in the NATO org just to avoid to go in the russian camp.



MMM-E said:


> *in 2000s Greeks : *We have superior weapons Leopard2-HEL , AH-64 Apache , Type-214 , AEWC , Mirage-2000 , F-16 block52+ , PATRIOT , S300 , SCALP , EXOCET
> 
> 
> 
> *in 2020s Turks : *Ok Yorgi , We have also superior weapons TB-2 , AKINCI , BORA , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , SOM , ATMACA , T-129 , Boeing E-7T AEWC , ADA class stealth Corvette , GABYA Frigate, KORAL , HISAR-A/O , S400 , etc
> 
> also in 2022-2023
> 
> -- Type-214TN class AIP Submarine
> -- TCG ANADOLU Amphibious Assault Ship
> -- ISTIF class stealth Frigate
> -- HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircraft
> -- KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
> -- KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile
> -- CAKIR next gen Cruise Missile
> -- KARA-ATMACA ground launched Cruise Missile
> -- ATMACA Coastal Defense Missile System
> 
> 
> geographic superiority
> strategic superiority
> quantity superiority
> range and platform superiority
> etc
> etc


2022 + : Turkey without a up to date air force (no F35, even the F16 V LMU is not so evident as uncle Sam knows you will purchase more S400...)

2022 + : you forget new FDI frigates on the Greek side, as Rafale and probably F35.



MMM-E said:


> The S-400 shoot down Ukrainian SU-27 from 150+ km ranges


Between 150° km and the 400km in the marketing brochure there is a big difference.

And as seen in Ukraine : the russian products are not so effective. To destroy a SU27 is something, to do the same on a modern west fighter another.


----------



## Akritas

At the moment, the Russian S400s are in Ankara, to provide anti-aircraft protection to Sultan Erdogan, in case he is attacked by a Turkish FETO F16, as was done in 2016 during the coup.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> 2022 + : Turkey without a up to date air force (no F35, even the F16 V LMU is not so evident as uncle Sam knows you will purchase more S400...)
> 
> 2022 + : you forget new FDI frigates on the Greek side, as Rafale and probably F35.




İf You are talking about 2028-2030 ( 4 FDI , 85 F-16V and probably F35 )


*then Turkiye is not sleeping *

KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
TFX air superiority Fighter Jet
F-16 modernization by indigenous AESA Radar and Systems with Ramjet powered GOKHAN long range air to air Missile

S400 Air Defense System
SIPER Air Defense System
TF-2000 class AW Destroyer
4 ISTIF class stealth Frigates
4 modernized MEKO-200 Frigates ( more stealth design )


Good luck ....


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Between 150° km and the 400km in the marketing brochure there is a big difference.
> 
> And as seen in Ukraine : the russian products are not so effective. To destroy a SU27 is something, to do the same on a modern west fighter another.



Even outdated S-125 turned American F-117 stealth Attack Aircraft into crap of metal in Serbia

Even outdated S-200 turned İsraeli F-16 into crap of metal in Syria


so S400 easly can turn F-16V and RAFALE into crap of metal 


*btw not marketing brochure but firing tests with 40N6E missile ( range of 400 km )*


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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Even outdated S-200 turned İsraeli F-16 into crap of metal in Syria


Now imagine what a outdated S300 or a modernized Patriot or a Meteor, can do to a present Turkish outdated F16.....into.......

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> 2022 + : you forget new FDI frigates on the Greek side, as Rafale and probably F35.



better you worry about Greece how to match with the Turkish Armed Forces



*4 FDI Frigates never can match with the Turkish Armed Forces*

4 ISTIF class stealth Frigates
4 modernized MEKO-200 Frigates ( more stealth design )
250 km ATMACA Coastal Defense Missile
150 km CAKIR Coastal Defense Missile

and F-16 , HURJET , AKINCI armed with SOM , CAKIR , TRLG-230 , KUZGUN-TJ , HARM , AKBABA Missiles



*85 F-16V and 24 RAFALE never can match with the Turkish Armed Forces*

36 S400 Air Defense Systems with 192 Missiles ( 144 missiles are ready to fire ) 1st batch
36 S400 Air Defense Systems with 192 Missiles ( 144 missiles are ready to fire ) 2nd batch
120 km SIPER Air Defense System

35+79 AESA Radar modernized F-16s by Turkiye ( 114 F-16V standard )
maybe also 40 new F-16V

KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet by 2025 to carry 100-200 km GOKDOGAN-GOKHAN air to air Missiles

TF-2000 Air Warfare Destroyers armed with 120 km SIPER air defense Missiles


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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Now imagine what a outdated S300 or a modernized Patriot or a Meteor, can do to a present Turkish outdated F16.....into.......




*So funny 
S300 and PATRIOT have no enough range to hit Turkish F-16s armed with 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles



1 -- )* S300s in Crete will be destroyed by BORA , SOM , KARA ATMACA , KARGI , SLAM-ER

*2 -- )* PATRIOTs in Skyros will be destroyed by BORA ,TRG-300 , SOM , KARA ATMACA , HARM , KARGI

*3 -- ) in the Agean Sea ,* Turkish F-16s will be under S400 protection which can turn Greek Rafales into crap of metal



Better worry about how to stop 1.000 + BORA , ATACMS , SOM , SLAM-ER , HARM , KARGI , POPEYE , KGK-LR , SDM-IIR , TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , HARPOON Block-II , KARA ATMACA

Also 150 km CAKIR and 250 km KUZGUN-TJ Missiles on the way


*Turkiye has the 2nd strongest missile fire power in NATO after USA*


----------



## MMM-E

*Greek PATRIOT Air Defense Systems are not threat to Turkish F-16s anymore*




Greek Island Skyros hosts PATRIOT Air Defense Systems






PATRIOTs in Skyros are not safe now .
because BORA , TRG-300 , SOM , KARA ATMACA, KARGI have been developed by Turkiye in the last 7 years

120-280-1.000 km























Also 150 km CAKIR and 250 km KUZGUN-TJ Missiles with IIR seeker ( on the way ) to be launched from land-naval-air platforms to hit PATRIOTs in Skyros


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## musti

Hang rings over there . It seems missile will be launched from aircraft.

TuRAF has SOM systems. l coludnt get why this missile will be builded.


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## musti

BON PLAN said:


> Probably, but NATO is now on the greek side and beware of Turkey.
> You are no more seen as a loyal partner. You remain in the NATO org just to avoid to go in the russian camp.



Turkıye one of the oldest members of NATO since 1952 and never left the pact like France in the past , never closed airspace for NATO operations like France, never closed NATO bases like France.

Turkiye has never sold weapons enemy of NATO and NATO members. 

Currently France has no NATO base and port while Turkiye has many ones. Turkiye joined all joint ops. of NATO.

Briefly France can not judge NATO membership of Turkiye.

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## MMM-E

musti said:


> Hang rings over there . It seems missile will be launched from aircraft.
> 
> TuRAF has SOM systems. l coludnt get why this missile will be builded.



SOM is air launched Cruise Missile


CAKIR is a new generation Cruise Missile to be launched from land platforms , Helicopters , unmanned Vessels and Submarines , AKINCI , KIZILELMA and many more

CAKIR Missiles uses next-generation swarm technologies as well as artificial intelligence with electronic jamming capability and passive hybrid ( RF+IIR) seeker , network-centric warfare capability with Datalink

and Turkiye can produce 3 CAKIR Missiles in price of 1 SOM Missile


*There is not yet such a detailed mini Cruise Missile in the world*


1-- Turkiye to produce unmanned Vessels armed with 4-8 x CAKIR anti-ship Missiles
2-- AKINCI UCAV to carry 4 x CAKIR Missiles for land attack / anti-ship role
3 - Sikorsky SEAHAWK Helicopters to carry 2 x CAKIR anti-ship Missiles
4 - CAKIR will be launched from land platform for coastal defense role
5 - Unmanned Submarines will be armed with CAKIR anti-ship Missiles
6 - KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to carry 4 x CAKIR Missiles for land attack / anti-ship role




















For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the targets







*Turkiye can send 10 unmanned Vessels armed with total of 80 CAKIR Missiles to destroy Greek S300s in Crete or PATRIOTs in Skyros *

250 km KUZGUN-TJ Missile with IIR seeker also will be launched from land-naval-air platforms 


Or *Turkiye can send 10 unmanned Vessels armed with total of 80 CAKIR Missiles to destroy Greece's future FDI Frigate which costs $1 billion*


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> İf You are talking about 2028-2030 ( 4 FDI , 85 F-16V and probably F35 )
> 
> 
> *then Turkiye is not sleeping *
> 
> KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
> TFX air superiority Fighter Jet
> F-16 modernization by indigenous AESA Radar and Systems with Ramjet powered GOKHAN long range air to air Missile
> 
> S400 Air Defense System
> SIPER Air Defense System
> TF-2000 class AW Destroyer
> 4 ISTIF class stealth Frigates
> 4 modernized MEKO-200 Frigates ( more stealth design )
> 
> 
> Good luck ....
> 
> View attachment 872554
> 
> View attachment 872555
> 
> View attachment 872557
> 
> View attachment 872553
> 
> View attachment 872559
> 
> View attachment 872560
> 
> View attachment 872556
> 
> View attachment 872558


TFX is far from being a reality.
You need an engine. And you need to struggle against 60% inflation and a people that will probably kick off Erdogan soon.



MMM-E said:


> btw not marketing brochure but firing tests with 40N6E missile ( range of 400 km )


400km for S400 is like the 100+ km figure of AMRAAM or 70+ km of MICA : a max range against a non moving target. 

S300 faided against israeli F16, and not a single attempt !

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## BON PLAN

musti said:


> never closed airspace for NATO operations like France


FALSE !
After the 1st Gulf war, the north of Irak was protected by the allies against irakis. It was the Northern Watch operation.
Each allies country (or group of countries) has a day in the week to air patrol.
When it was the day of Turkish "peacefull" missions, no awacs fly or other ally fly was allowed from turkish top brass (possible because main of the allies fighters and awacs were host on the Ircirlik air base). 
The Belgium pilots and French pilots flew the day before and the day after the turkish... And they exchange pictures of some groud target before and after the turkish patrols : you used these so peacefull missions to destroy kurds targets, in total violation with your mandat, and to do so by *restraining your airspace*.

My source? A Jaguar french pilot, husband of a friend of my wife. He showed me pictures....

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> TFX is far from being a reality.
> You need an engine. And you need to struggle against 60% inflation and a people that will probably kick off Erdogan soon.



in 2023 everybody will see roll out and in 2025 first flight


Everybody will see Turkish TEI TS-1400 turboshaft engine on T-625 Helicopter in 2023
TAI-TEI says indigenous turbofan Engine by 2030
also TEI develops TF-6000 turbofan Engine for unmanned Fighter Jets


There is an alternative engine option in addition to the F110 engine to be supplied from the USA

President of defense industry ISMAIL DEMİR said, We also had the possibility of working with Rolls-Royce for the national engine for the TFX

We had some concerns here, and we resolved these concerns as a result of the meetings we held. The work has begun


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> After the 1st Gulf war, the north of Irak was protected by the allies against irakis. It was the Northern Watch operation.





BON PLAN said:


> And they exchange pictures of some groud target before and after the turkish patrols : you used these so peacefull missions to destroy kurds targets, in total violation with your mandat, and to do so by *restraining your airspace*.



Not Kurds but PKK Terrorists

after the 1st Gulf war , PKK terror organization established many terror camps in the northen of Iraq to attack Turkiye 
and PKK terrorists used no fly zone in the northen of Iraq as a protection against the Turkish Armed Force

Turkiye lost over $1 trillion and tens of thousands of citizens to fight USA-France-Germany-Europe backed PKK terrorism since 1990


*btw Turkiye saved over 1 million Iraqi Kurds from SADDAM*
as like Turkiye saved over 3,5 million Syrians ( over 500.000 Kurds ) from ASSAD , ISIS , PKK/YPG Terrorists

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> 400km for S400 is like the 100+ km figure of AMRAAM or 70+ km of MICA : a max range against a non moving target.
> 
> S300 faided against israeli F16, and not a single attempt !




*S400 40N6E Missile has max firing range of 380 km even can hit Hellenic Air Force AEWCs over Athens*

PATRIOT PAC2 has maximum firing range of 150-160 km which can not hit Turkish F-16s armed with 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles

Even 250 km range can block all Aegean against Hellenic Air Force


btw even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria

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## MMM-E

*Turkiye S400 vs Greece PATRIOT PAC-II



S400 ( 40N6E Missile )*

Weight : 1.893 kg
Diameter : 515 mm
Range : 380 km
Altitude : 30 km
Speed : mach 3,5


*PATRIOT PAC-II*

Weight : 914 kg
Diameter : 410 mm
Range : 160 km
Altitude : 24 km
Speed : mach 4


RESULT : S400 is far superior to PATRIOT PAC-II


Turkiye received 51P6E and 5P85TE2/3 TELs as part of its S-400 regiment.
and only the 51P6E is reportedly capable of carrying the 380 km 40N6E missile

S400 ( 40N6E Missile ) .... No fly zone over the Aegean

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## MMM-E

*Incapable Hellenic Navy




Hellenic Navy has 13 Frigates armed with only 208 SAMs*

9 ELLI class Frigates armed with only 16 x RIM-7 SAMs
4 HYDRA class Frigates armed with only 16 x ESSM SAMs

what a inferior fire power and poor self defence capability



*Turkish Navy has 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs*

4 GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR SAMs
4 GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR and 32 ESSM SAMs
4 MEKO-200 Track-IIA Frigates armed with 16 x RIM-7 SAMs
2 MEKO 200 Track-IIB Frigates armed with 32 x ESSM SAMs
2 MEKO 200 Track-IIB Frigates armed with 64 x ESSM - RIM-7 SAMs


Turkish Navy has more SAMs than Hellenic+French Navies combined



*4 modernized GABYA class Frigates armed with 36 SM-1MR and 32 ESSM SAMs *
*( total of 272 SAMs which are more than 13 Greek Frigates combined )*


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## MMM-E

*GREEK MEDIA*

The first Greek drone that the Turks are trembling over is almost ready!​







*TURKISH MEDIA*

AKINCI UCAV to carry total of 1.230 kg weapons in 9 hardpoints

2 x MAM-C
2 x MAM-L
1 x MAM-T
3 x TEBER-82
1 x HGK-82


That means , soon AKINCI UCAV will be able to carry 9 x KUZGUN-TJ Missiles with range of 250 km to hit Warships , Air Defense Systems , Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS














*40 km KUZGUN-KY ( rocket motor )*
*250 km KUZGUN-TJ ( turbojet engine )*


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## beijingwalker

If a war really broke out, Greece stands no chance at all, Turkey should put their aim higher.

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## Akritas

beijingwalker said:


> If a war really broke out, Greece stands no chance at all, Turkey should put their aim higher.


This is exactly what we want the Turks to believe.
As Sun Tzu said "_Pretend to be inferior and encourage the arrogance of the enemy_"

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## MMM-E

As Sun Tzu said
"" If you know yourself as well as you know the enemy, there is no doubt about victory ""

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## MMM-E

beijingwalker said:


> If a war really broke out, Greece stands no chance at all, Turkey should put their aim higher.



Greece is not even a regional power

Turkiye put aim to become global power again when all Turkish military projects finish in 2030s


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *Turkiye S400 vs Greece PATRIOT PAC-II
> 
> 
> 
> S400 ( 40N6E Missile )*
> 
> Weight : 1.893 kg
> Diameter : 515 mm
> Range : 380 km
> Altitude : 30 km
> Speed : mach 3,5
> 
> 
> *PATRIOT PAC-II*
> 
> Weight : 914 kg
> Diameter : 410 mm
> Range : 160 km
> Altitude : 24 km
> Speed : mach 4
> 
> 
> RESULT : S400 is far superior to PATRIOT PAC-II
> 
> 
> Turkiye received 51P6E and 5P85TE2/3 TELs as part of its S-400 regiment.
> and only the 51P6E is reportedly capable of carrying the 380 km 40N6E missile
> 
> S400 ( 40N6E Missile ) .... No fly zone over the Aegean
> View attachment 872807


The range of S400 is so empressive that it destroyed all the Turkish F35 !!!



beijingwalker said:


> If a war really broke out, Greece stands no chance at all, Turkey should put their aim higher.


All NATO is behind Greece.
Turkey is now, during the Erdogan area, seen as the key of Bosphore, nothing more. It is a dubious ally.



MMM-E said:


> Turkish Navy has more SAMs than Hellenic+French Navies combined


You really can't compare ESSM and SM1 with ASTER 15/30.



MMM-E said:


> in 2023 everybody will see roll out and in 2025 first flight
> 
> 
> Everybody will see Turkish TEI TS-1400 turboshaft engine on T-625 Helicopter in 2023
> TAI-TEI says indigenous turbofan Engine by 2030
> also TEI develops TF-6000 turbofan Engine for unmanned Fighter Jets
> 
> 
> There is an alternative engine option in addition to the F110 engine to be supplied from the USA
> 
> President of defense industry ISMAIL DEMİR said, We also had the possibility of working with Rolls-Royce for the national engine for the TFX
> 
> We had some concerns here, and we resolved these concerns as a result of the meetings we held. The work has begun


You struggle to developp a 1500HP engine for your MBT. A fighter engine is another beast, really.
Betwwen the plan and the real result there may be a deep gap. Ask China why they used so many time and money just to have a fade copy of russian engine.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> You struggle to developp a 1500HP engine for your MBT. A fighter engine is another beast, really.
> Betwwen the plan and the real result there may be a deep gap. Ask China why they used so many time and money just to have a fade copy of russian engine.




China used so many time and money to develop western type turbofan Engine with single crystal blade technology

Russian AL-31 turbofan engine use different technology ( conventionally cast blades ) , instead of single crystal blade technology


*Turkiye is one of 6 Countries in the World that has single crystal blade and bliks-spool manufacturing technologies for aviation engines



WELL DONE great Turkish Defense Industry*


Turkiye has started developing 1500 hp BMC BATU diesel Engine in 2018
and was successfully fired for the first time in 2021

According to President of Defence Industry Agency ALTAY Tank will be powered by 1500 hp indigenous Engine in 2024

*2018-2024 ( 6 years for developing a 1500 hp diesel Engine )*









*TS-1400 Turboshaft Engine*
Turkiye has started developing TS-1400 turboshaft Engine in 2017

According to President of Defence Industry Agency T-625 Helicopter will be powered by TS-1400 turboshaft Engine in 2023






*TEI-TF6000 Turbofan Engine*

TEI-TF6000, with 6000 lbf dry thrust. The engine, designed to support the TEI-TF10000-A/B configuration as the afterburner version, will provide 10000 lbf thrust together with the afterburner and will be able to reach the forces needed for supersonic flights to power unmanned stealth Fighter Jet









TEI and TR-MOTOR have already started developing indigenous turbofan Engine for the TFX Fighter Jet

President of defense industry ISMAIL DEMİR said, We also had the possibility of working with Rolls-Royce for the national engine for the TFX


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> You really can't compare ESSM and SM1 with ASTER 15/30.



Hellenic Navy doesnt have any ASTER-15/30 , maybe in future

as of 2022 , Turkish Navy has 672 SAMs , while Hellenic Navy has only 208 SAMs


Turkish HISAR-RF and SIPER air defense Missiles for the upcoming ISTIF class Frigate and TF-2000 class Destroyer

*50 km HISAR-RF





70 km SIPER block-0 and 120-150 km SIPER block-1






Hellenic Navy never can match with the Turkish Navy which is the strongest Navy in the region


Hellenic Navy 3 FDI Frigates in 2025-2026 *

32 x ASTER SAMs
21 x RAM
8 x EXOCET anti-ship Missiles


*Turkish Navy 4 ISTIF and 4 MEKO-200TM Frigates in 2025-2026*

-- 64 x ESSM SAMs ..... ( 8 x SIPER + 32 x HISAR-RF SAMs )
-- KORKUT 35mm CIWS .... ( PHALANX 20 mm CIWS + KORKUT 35mm CIWS )
-- 16 x ATMACA anti-ship Missiles


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## musti

BON PLAN said:


> FALSE !
> After the 1st Gulf war, the north of Irak was protected by the allies against irakis. It was the Northern Watch operation.
> Each allies country (or group of countries) has a day in the week to air patrol.
> When it was the day of Turkish "peacefull" missions, no awacs fly or other ally fly was allowed from turkish top brass (possible because main of the allies fighters and awacs were host on the Ircirlik air base).
> The Belgium pilots and French pilots flew the day before and the day after the turkish... And they exchange pictures of some groud target before and after the turkish patrols : you used these so peacefull missions to destroy kurds targets, in total violation with your mandat, and to do so by *restraining your airspace*.
> 
> My source? A Jaguar french pilot, husband of a friend of my wife. He showed me pictures....



Iraq ops. both in 1991 and 2003 were not NATO operations.

Again Turkiye has never closed airspace to NATO operations unlike France did many times.


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> All NATO is behind Greece.



Only in your dreams .... Nobody will fight Turkiye for Greece


Turkish F-16s and KC-135 with American B-52 Bomber performed a flight mission in the Eastern Mediterranean as part of the NATO "Presence Operations". 23.08.2022










Turkish Frigate TCG KEMALREIS, assigned to NATO Standing Naval Task Group-2 which conducted trainings with American USS FORREST SHERMAN, Spanish JUAN DE BORBON and German FGS BONN in the Aegean .. 21.08.2022






*at the end of the day , Turkiye is more important NATO member than useless Greece*

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Hellenic Navy doesnt have any ASTER-15/30 , maybe in future


I was answering to your comparison between turkish and french navy. About Greece, the FDI frigates will have ASTER 30.



MMM-E said:


> China used so many time and money to develop western type turbofan Engine with single crystal blade technology
> 
> Russian AL-31 turbofan engine use different technology ( conventionally cast blades ) , instead of single crystal blade technology
> 
> 
> *Turkiye is one of 6 Countries in the World that has single crystal blade and bliks-spool manufacturing technologies for aviation engines
> 
> 
> 
> WELL DONE great Turkish Defense Industry*
> 
> 
> Turkiye has started developing 1500 hp BMC BATU diesel Engine in 2018
> and was successfully fired for the first time in 2021
> 
> According to President of Defence Industry Agency ALTAY Tank will be powered by 1500 hp indigenous Engine in 2024
> 
> *2018-2024 ( 6 years for developing a 1500 hp diesel Engine )*
> 
> View attachment 873078
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *TS-1400 Turboshaft Engine*
> Turkiye has started developing TS-1400 turboshaft Engine in 2017
> 
> According to President of Defence Industry Agency T-625 Helicopter will be powered by TS-1400 turboshaft Engine in 2023
> View attachment 873079
> 
> 
> 
> *TEI-TF6000 Turbofan Engine*
> 
> TEI-TF6000, with 6000 lbf dry thrust. The engine, designed to support the TEI-TF10000-A/B configuration as the afterburner version, will provide 10000 lbf thrust together with the afterburner and will be able to reach the forces needed for supersonic flights to power unmanned stealth Fighter Jet
> 
> View attachment 873080
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TEI and TR-MOTOR have already started developing indigenous turbofan Engine for the TFX Fighter Jet
> 
> President of defense industry ISMAIL DEMİR said, We also had the possibility of working with Rolls-Royce for the national engine for the TFX


We will see if the announced delays will be respected.



MMM-E said:


> China used so many time and money to develop western type turbofan Engine with single crystal blade technology


As far as I know, WS10 is just a copy of russian engine, with less life.
Chinese engine life << Russian engine life << West engine life.



musti said:


> Iraq ops. both in 1991 and 2003 were not NATO operations.


it was UN operations. Far damaging !

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Nobody will fight Turkiye for Greece


You are wrong.
The Erdogan's turkey is more and more seen as a foe.
To be clear, we all hope that Erdogan be fired. With 60% inflation, it is on the right track.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> You are wrong.
> The Erdogan's turkey is more and more seen as a foe.
> To be clear, we all hope that Erdogan be fired. With 60% inflation, it is on the right track.



ATATURK also kicked same enemies France,Greece 100 years ago


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> ATATURK also kicked same enemies France,Greece 100 years ago


what you're being blamed for : you consider your alliance allies (at least supposed to do) as enemies, so don't be surprised we are doing the same.

It's not a greece ship that seach oil & gas in total contradiction in oriental med. It's not a french frigate that open its fire radar more than one time against another frigate needed to control a commercial ship that, it's now cristal clear, violate the UN embargo. => This is the Erdogan's Turkey.



MMM-E said:


> at the end of the day , Turkiye is more important NATO member than useless Greece


You just are the usefull idiot of uncle Sam.
Once he will not have the need of, you will be scrap.

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *S400 40N6E Missile has max firing range of 380 km even can hit Hellenic Air Force AEWCs over Athens*
> 
> PATRIOT PAC2 has maximum firing range of 150-160 km which can not hit Turkish F-16s armed with 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER Cruise Missiles
> 
> Even 250 km range can block all Aegean against Hellenic Air Force
> 
> 
> btw even outdated S200 kicked İsraeli F-16 in Syria











Russia’s S-400 is a disgrace in Syria, says Brigadier General Abdolrahim Mousavi


Tensions are escalating between Iran and Israel. Israel has said it had destroyed nearly all of Iran's military capabilities in Syria. It was reportedly retaliation for an Iranian missile attack on the Golan Heights. Israeli Prime Minister Naftali Bennett's meeting with President Joe Biden comes...




www.globaldefensecorp.com

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> what you're being blamed for : you consider your alliance allies (at least supposed to do) as enemies, so don't be surprised we are doing the same.



And Turks will give another lesson to you




BON PLAN said:


> It's not a greece ship that seach oil & gas in total contradiction in oriental med. It's not a french frigate that open its fire radar more than one time against another frigate needed to control a commercial ship that, it's now cristal clear, violate the UN embargo. => This is the Erdogan's Turkey.



YES , it's now cristal clear, violate the UN embargo.

France , Russia , The UAE deployed tons of weapons in Libya to help HAFTAR to attack on the UN recognized legal Libyan government in Tripoli

but Erdogan's Turkiye entered Libya and kicked all invaders/terrorists



BON PLAN said:


> You just are the usefull idiot of uncle Sam.
> Once he will not have the need of, you will be scrap.



You are talking about Greece


Turkiye kicked uncle Sam in Syria
Turkiye kicked uncle Sam's PKK/YPG and FETO Terrorists
Turkiye bought S400

uncle Sam can not use Erdogan's Turkiye

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Russia’s S-400 is a disgrace in Syria, says Brigadier General Abdolrahim Mousavi
> 
> 
> Tensions are escalating between Iran and Israel. Israel has said it had destroyed nearly all of Iran's military capabilities in Syria. It was reportedly retaliation for an Iranian missile attack on the Golan Heights. Israeli Prime Minister Naftali Bennett's meeting with President Joe Biden comes...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.globaldefensecorp.com



Iranian general is crying about S400

but Israel attack on İranian and Syrian targets in Syria
and Russia doesnt use S400s against Israel for İran

attack on Russian air base in Syria , and see what will happen

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> And Turks will give another lesson to you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> YES , it's now cristal clear, violate the UN embargo.
> 
> France , Russia , The UAE deployed tons of weapons in Libya to help HAFTAR to attack on the UN recognized legal Libyan government in Tripoli
> 
> but Erdogan's Turkiye entered Libya and kicked all invaders/terrorists
> 
> 
> 
> You are talking about Greece
> 
> 
> Turkiye kicked uncle Sam in Syria
> Turkiye kicked uncle Sam's PKK/YPG and FETO Terrorists
> Turkiye bought S400
> 
> uncle Sam can not use Erdogan's Turkiye


PITYFULL.


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## MMM-E

*SİPER Air Defense System hit the target from 90+ km*

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *SİPER Air Defense System hit the target from 90+ km*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 873930
> 
> View attachment 874089


Possible to have pics of the missile itself?


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Possible to have pics of the missile itself?



SIPER Block-0 missile with range of almost 100 km










HISAR-RF , SIPER , HISAR-O








in 2018 , Turkiye signed an agreement with EUROSAM to develop Air Defense System but MACRON blocked agreement in 2020

MACRON thought that Turkiye could not develop Air Defense missiles


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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> in 2018 , Turkiye signed an agreement with EUROSAM to develop Air Defense System but MACRON blocked agreement in 2020
> 
> MACRON thought that Turkiye could not develop Air Defense missiles
> 
> The French side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts well and sit on it.


*And why is Turkey looking for ways to buy French ASTER 30 missiles by buying SAMP/T air defense system?*
Because quite simply, the Italo-French system, with the French missiles, is superior and better than yours.
Obviously, the turkish copy paste method, is not enough to develop modern defense technology.






Turkiye willing to cooperate with Italy and France on air defense project with Aster 30 SAMP/T | Defense News July 2022 Global Security army industry | Defense Security global news industry army year 2022 | Archive News year


Turkiye willing to cooperate with Italy and France on air defense project with Aster 30 SAMP/T




www.armyrecognition.com

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *And why is Turkey looking for ways to buy French ASTER 30 missiles by buying SAMP/T air defense system?*
> Because quite simply, the Italo-French system, with the French missiles, is superior and better than yours.
> Obviously, the turkish copy paste method, is not enough to develop modern defense technology.



Who says ? Greeks who can not develop even a MANPADS


*Typical Greek jealousy and deflect the facts*


1-- Turkiye never wanted to buy SAMP-T alone
in 2018 , Turkiye signed an agreement with EUROSAM to develop new Air Defense System with Ballistic Missile interception capability ... ASTER-30 has no Ballistic Missile intercept capability against BMs up to 3.000 km

but MACRON blocked agreement in 2020

and Turkiye has developed its own most modern SIPER high altitude Defense System as of 2022


2 -- copy paste method ? Turkiye has no SAMP-T to copy it .. you are a liar
go and copy PATRIOT , if so easy

3 -- SIPER is most modern Air Defense System with unique RF seeker design , dual pulse rocket motor, two way data link , modern digital control unite , long range IFF , hit to kill technology and GaN based AESA Radar


even only 7 Countries have their own long range IFF System and Turkiye is one of them
even only a few Countries have their own GaN based AESA Radar and Turkiye is one of them

even Russian S400 has no hit to kill technology


*SIPER to turn Greek F-16V and RAFALE into crap of metal*



















*The French side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts well and sit on it.*



Well Done ASELSAN and ROKETSAN
*what a great work in 5 years*

SUNGUR MANPADS ( in service )
KORKUT 35mm SPAAG ( in service )
HISAR-A+ low altitude Air Defense System ( in service )
HISAR-O+ medium altitude Air Defense System ( in service )
SIPER high altitude Air Defense System ( SIPER block-0 will enter service in 2022 )


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Iranian general is crying about S400
> 
> but Israel attack on İranian and Syrian targets in Syria
> and Russia doesnt use S400s against Israel for İran
> 
> attack on Russian air base in Syria , and see what will happen


Russian air defenses are garbage, Israel shown it, Ukraine shown it. S-400 isn't activated because the moment it will it's going to be destroyed. Israel already attacked targets less than 10 kilometers from S-400 batteries. 

20 S-200 missiles were fired on that single Israeli F-16, last one wasn't expected by the pilot because he was already over Israel's airspace. Thousands of sorties, only one F-16 shot down, and then Israel knocked out half of Syria's air defense systems as a result.

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> Russian air defenses are garbage, Israel shown it, Ukraine shown it. S-400 isn't activated because the moment it will it's going to be destroyed. Israel already attacked targets less than 10 kilometers from S-400 batteries.



Russia doesnt use S400s against İsrael .. Russia allow İsrael to attack İranian targets in Syria

go and attack on Russian Air Base in Syria and see what will happen



*The S-400’s kill reportedly set a world record for the longest range ever for a Fighter Jet shootdown*

The S-400 shoot down Ukrainian SU-27 from 150+ km away from Belarus
The S-400 is able to destroy any incoming hostile Fighter Jets , Bombers , AEWCs within a range of up to 400 km

120 km SAMP-T ( France/İtaly )
160 km PAC-II ( Usa )
250-300 km DAVID'S SLING ( Usa/İsrael )

The US , Europe ,İsrael do not have a true competitor to the S-400
even I am not talking about S500


*Russia's S-400 Is Way More Dangerous Than You Think*








Russia's S-400 Is Way More Dangerous Than You Think


What you need to know.




nationalinterest.org

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## MMM-E

*Not Turkiye , but Greece used a Russian Weapon 
( S300 ) against a NATO Member Turkiye*



Greek S300 Air Defense System radar locks Turkish F-16 Jets in international airspace

Hypocrite USA continue to criticize Türkiye for buying Russian-made S-400 but say nothing about S300 in Greece


Greece lost in the Eastern Mediterranean and repeated useless provocative actions in the last week


*what about ? if Turkiye deploy S400s in İzmir to block all Aegean against Hellenic Airforce



*

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## MMM-E

*What about Turkish Military Power to hit Greek S300s in Crete ?*



-- 1.000 km KARGI anti-radiation Drone
-- 360 km BORA Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km SOM and SLAM-ER air launched Cruise Missiles
-- 280 km KARA-ATMACA land based Cruise Missile
-- 200 km SIMSEK Kamikaze Drone
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 140 km HARPOON Block-II Submarine and Warship launched Cruise Missile


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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Russia doesnt use S400s against İsrael .. Russia allow İsrael to attack İranian targets in Syria
> 
> go and attack on Russian Air Base in Syria and see what will happen
> 
> 
> 
> *The S-400’s kill reportedly set a world record for the longest range ever for a Fighter Jet shootdown*
> 
> The S-400 shoot down Ukrainian SU-27 from 150+ km away from Belarus
> The S-400 is able to destroy any incoming hostile Fighter Jets , Bombers , AEWCs within a range of up to 400 km
> 
> 120 km SAMP-T ( France/İtaly )
> 160 km PAC-II ( Usa )
> 250 km DAVID'S SLING ( Usa/İsrael )
> 
> The US , Europe ,İsrael do not have a true competitor to the S-400
> even I am not talking about S500
> 
> 
> *Russia's S-400 Is Way More Dangerous Than You Think*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Russia's S-400 Is Way More Dangerous Than You Think
> 
> 
> What you need to know.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nationalinterest.org


David's Sling is 300km range







S-400 is garbage, in order to reach 400km it launches a variant that is a whole ballistic missile, it will never be able to target a fighter jet from anywhere near that range, that missile variant isn't maneuverable. Even if it did shoot down a single Su-27 it's still garbage, easy to shoot down garbage 1980s aircraft with no EW.

To this day Ukraine still flies jets, Ukrainian HIMARS pound Antonovsky bridge,

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> S-400 is garbage, in order to reach 400km it launches a variant that is a whole ballistic missile, it will never be able to target a fighter jet from anywhere near that range, that missile variant isn't maneuverable. Even if it did shoot down a single Su-27 it's still garbage, easy to shoot down garbage 1980s aircraft with no EW



Turkiye bought 250 km 48N6E3 Missile with speed of mach 5.9

Turkiye also bought 40N6E Missile to hit AEWCs , EW Aircrafts from 380 km away and far better than 120 km SAMPT and 160 km PAC-II

and S400's BIG BIRD Radar to detect F-15 , F-16 , Mirage2000 , Rafale Jets from 400-450 km away

380 Km 40N6E Missile can block all Aegean and Eastern Mediterranean against enemy Airforces for great A2/AD capability

36 fire units and 192 missiles were delivered to Turkiye
2nd batch ( 36 fire units and 192 missiles ) on agenda

and Turkish S400s use Turkish IIF and Radar software to be effective against even Egyptian MIG-29M2 and SU-35


btw even S-125 turned American F-117 stealth Bomber into crap of metal in Serbia

on the other hand , Israeli AD Systems dont have even a single Fighter Jet shootdown
we dont know what about capability of Israeli AD Systems .... maybe your AD System is garbage

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye bought 250 km 48N6E3 Missile with speed of mach 5.9


David's Sling are Mach 8, 300km range.



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye also bought 40N6E Missile to hit AEWCs , EW Aircrafts from 380 km away and far better than 120 km SAMPT and 160 km PAC-II


Those missiles are huge, they maybe can hit an AWACS plane from that range, they can't hit fighter aircraft, they're too big and clumsy.
EW aircraft will jam the **** out of those S-400 missiles, especially from 380km, they can easily overwhelm the S-400 radar from that range.



MMM-E said:


> and S400's BIG BIRD Radar to detect F-15 , F-16 , Mirage2000 , Rafale Jets from 400-450 km away


EL/M-2090U ULTRA, EL/M-2090S SPECTRA AESA radars (S band and UHF radars working together) and EL/M-2080 Block C Green Pine have ranges of over 900 kilometers









Sky Dew - Vikipedi







tr.wikipedia.org





SkyDew has classified technology that allows tracking of low flying cruise missiles, drones and jet fighters from far away, S-400 as well as any air defense system are easily avoidable by flying low. 



MMM-E said:


> btw even S-125 turned American F-117 stealth Bomber into crap of metal in Serbia


F-117 was in a predictable bombing run with its weapons bay open and no radar warning receivers, F-117 is stealth, only when weapons bay is closed.



MMM-E said:


> on the other hand , Israeli AD Systems dont have even a single Fighter Jet shootdown
> we dont know what about capability of Israeli AD Systems .... maybe your AD System is garbage


Our air defenses are the best, there is no system parallel to the Iron Dome, Israeli air defenses are bought by the richest and most successful armies. Tested against thousands of rockets, as well as drones and cruise missiles. 

David's Sling intends on replacing the Patriot system, as the PAAC-4. The reason it didn't shoot down a single fighter jet yet is because no one dares to threaten us.


​


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> David's Sling are Mach 8, 300km range.



250 km range and speed of mach 5.9 . also 380 km range and speed of mach 3,5 enough to turn all enemy AEWCs , EW Aircrafts , Fighter Jets into crap of metal in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean




Beny Karachun said:


> Those missiles are huge, they maybe can hit an AWACS plane from that range, they can't hit fighter aircraft, they're too big and clumsy.
> 
> EW aircraft will jam the **** out of those S-400 missiles, especially from 380km, they can easily overwhelm the S-400 radar from that range.



to hit AEWCs and almost game over !

EW aircraft can not do anything against the S400 Radar from 380 km away


if your senario , then Turkish HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircraft also can easily overwhelm the DAVID SLING's radar from 400 km away

KORAL and REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare Systems to jam the **** out of those RF guided missiles


Turkiye is one of top 5 countries in EW technologies ( USA ,Russia , İsrael , Turkiye , The UK )

on the other hand Greece has nothing ...


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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> EL/M-2090U ULTRA, EL/M-2090S SPECTRA AESA radars (S band and UHF radars working together) and EL/M-2080 Block C Green Pine have ranges of over 900 kilometers



600 or 900 km , that doesnt matter

S-400's BIG BIRD Radar has range of 600 km as like Turkish EIRS early warning AESA Radar to detect all AEWCs , Fighter Jets over Greece or over İsrael

also Turkish Airforce has 4 Boeing E-7T AEWC with 600 km PESA Radar

Nothing can fly unaware of Turkiye in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean





Beny Karachun said:


> Our air defenses are the best, there is no system parallel to the Iron Dome, Israeli air defenses are bought by the richest and most successful armies. Tested against thousands of rockets, as well as drones and cruise missiles.
> 
> David's Sling intends on replacing the Patriot system, as the PAAC-4. The reason it didn't shoot down a single fighter jet yet is because no one dares to threaten us.



Yes against only primitive HAMAS

what about HAMAS?

No modern Cruise Missile , No modern Tactical Ballistic Missile , No supersonic-hypersonic Missiles , No Fighter Jets , No modern UCAVs , No unmanned stealth Fighter Jet , No fake decoy Drone with supersonic speed , No Cruise Missile with radar jamming capability

No anti-radiation Drone , No Electronic Warfare Systems , No stand off jammer Aircraft

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> 250 km range and speed of mach 5.9 or 380 km range and speed of mach 3,5 enough to turn all enemy AEWCs , EW Aircrafts , Fighter Jets into crap of metal in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to hit AEWCs and almost game over !
> 
> EW aircraft can not do anything against the S400 Radar from 380 km away
> 
> 
> if your senario , then Turkish HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircraft also can easily overwhelm the DAVID SLIING's radar from 400 km away
> 
> KORAL and REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare Systems to jam the **** out of those RF guided missiles
> 
> 
> Turkiye is one of top 5 countries in EW technologies ( USA ,Russia , İsrael , Turkiye , The UK )
> 
> on the other hand Greece has nothing ...


S-400 can do nothing against F-35. Israeli F-35 fly above Lebanon and Syria without even being detected. Some reports they even fly above Iran but I don't know if they're credible.
F-35 is designed to defeat the S-400.

The further the radar is, the easier it is to deceive. 






Greece bought Israeli EW and F-35



MMM-E said:


> 600 or 900 km , that doesnt matter
> 
> S-400's BIG BIRD Radar has range of 600 km as like Turkish EIRS early warning AESA Radar to detect all AEWCs , Fighter Jets over Greece or over İsrael
> 
> also Turkish Airforce has 4 Boeing E-7T AEWC with 600 km PESA Radar
> 
> Nothing can fly unaware of Turkiye in the Aegean and in the Eastern Mediterranean


What are you talking about lol, F-35s would easily evade it all.



MMM-E said:


> Yes against only primitive HAMAS
> 
> what about HAMAS?
> 
> No modern Cruise Missile , No modern Tactical Ballistic Missile , No supersonic-hypersonic Missiles , No Fighter Jets , No modern UCAVs , No unmanned stealth Fighter Jet , No fake decoy Drone with supersonic speed
> 
> No anti-radiation Drone , No Electronic Warfare Systems , No stand off jammer Aircraft


Intercepting hundreds of rockets from short range is a more difficult task than intercepting jets, UAVs or cruise missiles. Even 1960s technology can do it, but no 1960 technology could intercept a 200 rocket barrage. No other system has 95% interception rate. 

Iron Dome was tested against everything, cruise missiles, UAVs, mortars, and artillery shells. 

If it can destroy those, it can destroy anything. There is no harder target than artillery shells and mortars.

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## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> KORAL











Turkish Forces Lick Wounds After Airstrikes Hit Their Base In Libya • The Syrian Observatory For Human Rights


After a short break, the military confrontation between the Libyan National Army mainly backed up by Egypt and the UAE and the Turkish-backed Government of National Accord has once again entered an open phase. On July 5, aircraft of the Libyan National Army conducted nine pinpoint airstrikes on...




www.syriahr.com





KORAL could not stop a missile attack on the GNA, in fact, KORAL was destroyed.



MMM-E said:


> Yes against only primitive HAMAS
> 
> what about HAMAS?
> 
> No modern Cruise Missile , No modern Tactical Ballistic Missile , No supersonic-hypersonic Missiles , No Fighter Jets , No modern UCAVs , No unmanned stealth Fighter Jet , No fake decoy Drone with supersonic speed , No Cruise Missile with radar jamming capability
> 
> No anti-radiation Drone , No Electronic Warfare Systems , No stand off jammer Aircraft


Barak 8 missile destroyed hypersonic Iskander missile in Azerbaijan.

Iron Dome is deployed in Guam, a US military base threatened by munitions way more advanced than rockets. Israeli technology is more than capable of destroying advanced threats.


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> MACRON thought that Turkiye could not develop Air Defense missiles


No. He though that it was not convenient to help a friend becoming an ennemy.


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> S-400 can do nothing against F-35. Israeli F-35 fly above Lebanon and Syria without even being detected.



Lebanon and Syria dont have S400
and Russia saying nothing about S400 - F35

S400 Radars work by operating in multiple frequency bands including both VHF and L bands that can see stealth Fighters

Also new Turkish EIRS AESA Radar to detect stealth Fighters





Beny Karachun said:


> Greece bought Israeli EW and F-35



Greece bought nothing yet


but Turkiye has its own Ballistic and Cruise Missile technology up to 1.000 km to destroy all Jet Hangars with Fighter Jets , also AD Systems in Greece in a day

Turkiye has its own KORAL , REDET-II , HAVASOJ

and Turkiye has its own KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35


*TO DOMINATE THE SKIES*
what a hell of war machine , combination with RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in BVR combat

and to open new horizons in dog fight through its advantages of unmanned combat

how could a human win when an AI can withstand G forces that no human could survive ?

AI would win non stop eventually


You keep sleeping , 
Turkish TB-2 UCAVs has put forward a new military doctrine in the world to destroy enemy Tanks,Howitzers,MLRS,Air Deffense Systems

KIZILELMA to open new horizons in air combat through its advantages of unmanned combat


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## BON PLAN

Beny Karachun said:


> S-400 can do nothing against F-35. Israeli F-35 fly above Lebanon and Syria without even being detected. Some reports they even fly above Iran but I don't know if they're credible.
> F-35 is designed to defeat the S-400.


It's not so clear.
F35 was initially built as an answer to the 3 european eurocanards. And it is a success in this area ! 
It was not studied as a SAM killer, but as a F16 and A10 replacement.

Are the S400 battery full in Syria? Not sure. (specially about the low band radar)
Are the F35 not seen? Absolutely not sure. If I was russian, in such a "low intensity" battlefiled in Syria, I will do all my possible not to show I can detect this weapon system, so as to create a big surprise the day I have to fight USA or a close ally in a high intensity war.



MMM-E said:


> Lebanon and Syria dont have S400
> and Russia saying nothing about S400 - F35
> 
> S400 Radars work by operating in multiple frequency bands including both VHF and L bands that can see stealth Fighters
> 
> Also new Turkish EIRS AESA Radar to detect stealth Fighters
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Greece bought nothing yet
> 
> 
> but Turkiye has its own Ballistic and Cruise Missile technology up to 1.000 km to destroy all Jet Hangars with Fighter Jets , also AD Systems in Greece in a day
> 
> Turkiye has its own KORAL , REDET-II , HAVASOJ
> 
> and Turkiye has its own KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35
> 
> 
> *TO DOMINATE THE SKIES*
> what a hell of war machine , combination with RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in BVR combat
> 
> and to open new horizons in dog fight through its advantages of unmanned combat
> 
> how could a human win when an AI can withstand G forces that no human could survive ?
> 
> AI would win non stop eventually
> View attachment 874904
> 
> View attachment 874905


A dronized J-20 ?



MMM-E said:


> The French side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts well and sit on it.


LOL.
Mach 2,5, low fligh profile, RAM coated missile, 500+ km range. Good luck with your SAM 2 shaped missile.



MMM-E said:


> *what a great work in 5 years*


Indeed : 60% annual inflation rate ! GOOD JOB.

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## Beny Karachun

BON PLAN said:


> It's not so clear.
> F35 was initially built as an answer to the 3 european eurocanards. And it is a success in this area !
> It was not studied as a SAM killer, but as a F16 and A10 replacement.
> 
> Are the S400 battery full in Syria? Not sure. (specially about the low band radar)
> Are the F35 not seen? Absolutely not sure. If I was russian, in such a "low intensity" battlefiled in Syria, I will do all my possible not to show I can detect this weapon system, so as to create a big surprise the day I have to fight USA or a close ally in a high intensity war.


F-35 was definitely built to defeat SAMs, F-35 was never supposed to be an answer to the European 4th generation jets, as American F-16 and F-15 advanced variants can hold their own against them. F-35 is a different league. F-35 is stealthy, has powerful integrated EW system and antiradiation capabilities.






Russians are openly saying their radars can see stealthy jets but that's just Russian scarecrow tactics.


----------



## BON PLAN

Beny Karachun said:


> F-35 was definitely built to defeat SAMs, F-35 was never supposed to be an answer to the European 4th generation jets, as American F-16 and F-15 advanced variants can hold their own against them. F-35 is a different league. F-35 is stealthy, has powerful integrated EW system and antiradiation capabilities.
> View attachment 874907
> 
> 
> Russians are openly saying their radars can see stealthy jets but that's just Russian scarecrow tactics.


No fighter size plane can be stealth to low band radar. It's a physical effect, and even the americans can't avoid physics laws.

F35 was built in a hurry because there was no modern fighter in the USA arsenal for export. As a result it is always in developpment phase, more than 15 years after first pre serial flight. Even the engine, quite brand new, is under scrutinity.
The real next US fighter is to come : NGAD. F35 is only a stop gap, and thanks to the USA diplomatic strenght, a commercial success. Mark my words : all the country purchasing F35 will have deep sorrows in +/- 10 years because costs++, availibility -- , breakthroughs in counter stealth.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Mach 2,5, low fligh profile, RAM coated missile, 500+ km range. Good luck with your SAM 2 shaped missile.



not mach 2,5 , but mach 3,5 and its only SIPER Block-0 variant

Turkish GaN based AESA Radar to detect even stealth Fighters





hit to kill technology






also Turkiye to produce Air Defense System based on GOKDOGAN air to air Missile ( range of 100+ km and speed of mach 4 )








BON PLAN said:


> No. He though that it was not convenient to help a friend becoming an ennemy.



What did ERDOGAN do to France ? nothing

Turkiye kicked USA-France backed PKK/YPG Terrorists who want to destroy Turkiye's territorial integrity


We dont need any help
The French side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts well and sit on it.

*SIPER and GOKDOGAN easly can turn RAFALE Fighter Jet into crap of metal*


----------



## Beny Karachun

BON PLAN said:


> No fighter size plane can be stealth to low band radar. It's a physical effect, and even the americans can't avoid physics laws.
> 
> F35 was built in a hurry because there was no modern fighter in the USA arsenal for export. As a result it is always in developpment phase, more than 15 years after first pre serial flight. Even the engine, quite brand new, is under scrutinity.
> The real next US fighter is to come : NGAD. F35 is only a stop gap, and thanks to the USA diplomatic strenght, a commercial success. Mark my words : all the country purchasing F35 will have deep sorrows in +/- 10 years because costs++, availibility -- , breakthroughs in counter stealth.


They can't provide guidance for missiles. They are inaccurate due to the wide wavelength, only providing estimated location. 

Also, they could be easily jammed, F-35 can send fake radio waves to make it appear as if hundreds of F-35s are flying. Much more fake radio signals can be transmitted in between low band radar waves than could be for example in between UHF radar waves.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> A dronized J-20 ?



Good luck to old technology F-15 , F-16V , RAFALE


KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35

combination with RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in BVR combat


Lenght : 14.7 m
Wingspan : 10 m
Height : 3.3 m

Endurance : 5 Hours
Combat radius : 500 nm
Service ceiling : 35,000 - 45.000 ft
Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
Payload : 1.5 Tons

-- AESA Radar , EOTS , sensor fusion
-- Stealth design
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> Good luck to old technology F-15 , F-16V , RAFALE
> 
> 
> KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35
> 
> combination with RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in BVR combat
> 
> Endurance : 5 Hours
> Combat radius : 500 nm
> Service ceiling : 35,000 ft
> Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
> Payload : 1.5 Tons
> 
> -- AESA Radar , EOTS , sensor fusion
> -- Stealth design
> -- Internal weapon stations
> -- Stealth flight capability
> -- The ability to hide from Radars
> -- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
> -- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
> 
> View attachment 874911
> 
> View attachment 874910


You said its cruise speed was Mach 0.6, maximum speed is 0.9.

This doesn't exist yet. F-15EX can fly twice as high as this drone at 65k ft. More than twice the combat radius at 1200nmi. Mach 2.5. Way more payload, American missiles, EW, radars are all better than Turkish comparable systems. American manufacturing capability is way more than Turkey could ever hope to achieve. 

American Australian MQ-28 Loyal Wingman project already exists:





Western technology is years ahead of you, and will always remain that way


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> You said its cruise speed was Mach 0.6, maximum speed is 0.9.



There will be Block-0 variant with speed of mach 0,6-0,9
and Block-1 variant with supersonic speed mach 1,4 as like F-35




Beny Karachun said:


> This doesn't exist yet. F-15EX can fly twice as high as this drone at 65k ft. More than twice the combat radius at 1200nmi. Mach 2.5. Way more payload, American missiles, EW, radars are all better than Turkish comparable systems. American manufacturing capability is way more than Turkey could ever hope to achieve.
> 
> American Australian MQ-28 Loyal Wingman project already exists:



F15EX is a manned Fighter Jet , Turkiye develops the TFX air superiority Fighter Jet

and Turkiye produced even 2nd prototype of KIZILELMA to make maiden flight in 2023





so nice to compare Turkiye with hyper power USA

but We dont care about USA and MQ-28
USA is a hyper power and Turkiye has developed technologies which were developed by only a few Countries in the world



Beny Karachun said:


> Western technology is years ahead of you, and will always remain that way



Turkiye is also in western - NATO technology club

and USA , The UK , France , Turkiye , Germany in top 5

even now Turkiye has far more military projects than Germany


----------



## Beny Karachun

MMM-E said:


> There will be Block-0 variant with speed of mach 0,6-0,9
> and Block-1 variant with supersonic speed mach 1,4 as like F-35
> 
> 
> 
> 
> F15EX is a manned Fighter Jet , Turkiye develops the TFX air superiority Fighter Jet
> 
> and Turkiye produced even 2nd prototype of KIZILELMA to make maiden flight in 2023
> View attachment 874914
> 
> 
> so nice to compare Turkiye with hyper power USA
> 
> but We dont care about USA and MQ-28
> USA is a hyper power and Turkiye has developed technologies which were developed by only a few Countries in the world
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye is also in western - NATO technology club
> 
> and USA , The UK , France , Turkiye , Germany in top 5
> 
> even now Turkiye has far more military projects than Germany


When will they be produced? Production is important, and the hardest. Anyone can make prototypes, we even made a whole fighter jet years ago. Even if you make that drone fly it doesn't mean anything about its capabilities. F-35 has an unbeatable IRST/optical sensor suite. It's insane.

We don't know how refined it will be, how well is the stealth compared to US stealth aircraft, etc.

You are saying your drone can compete with F-15, F-16 and Rafale but it can't. The subsonic version will get destroyed. 

You are not diving deep enough in your comparison. Which aircraft will detect the other first, F-35 or your drone? Which EW system is better? Those are all answers you can't answer. 

By the way, Greece has Patriot PAC-3 that will defend the Greek territory.

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## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> When will they be produced? Production is important, and the hardest. Anyone can make prototypes, we even made a whole fighter jet years ago.



KIZILELMA will be in service in 2025

HURJET and KIZILELMA








Beny Karachun said:


> Even if you make that drone fly it doesn't mean anything about its capabilities. F-35 has an unbeatable IRST/optical sensor suite. It's insane.



What a great technology is coming ... ( all together )

*1-- *KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet : AESA Radar + EOTS sensor fusion
to carry RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in the Internal weapon station for stealth flight capability

*2--* Boeing E-7T AEWCs with 600 km PESA Radar will help KIZILELMA to detect enemy Fighter Jets and to guide GOKHAN long range air to air missiles on enemy Fighter Jets via data link for network centric warfare and cooperative engagement capability

*3-- *HAVASOJ stand off jammer Aircrafts to jam enemy communications and radars from 400 km away to protect the Turkish Air Force Fighter Jets

*4-- *380 km S400s to create Air Defense umbrella over the Eastern Mediterranean to protect the Turkish Air Force Fighter Jets


*good luck to enemies .. they will need it*


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> You are saying your drone can compete with F-15, F-16 and Rafale but it can't. The subsonic version will get destroyed



What about BVR combat ?

KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to carry RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in the Internal weapon station for stealth flight capability

100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile is ready
200+ km RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air under development


stealth KIZILELMA with much lower RCS vs 4th gen F-15 , F-16V , Rafale with much bigger RCS

so stealth KIZILELMA to detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 , F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and then press the kill button and game over in BVR combat

Egypt and Greece in the region



*KIZILELMA Block-II variant will have supersonic speed of mach 1,4 for dog fight*

and KIZILELMA to open new horizons in dog fight through its advantages of unmanned combat and aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers

how could a human win when an AI can withstand G forces that no human could survive ?

AI would win non stop eventually


and F-35 sucks in dog fight


----------



## MMM-E

Beny Karachun said:


> By the way, Greece has Patriot PAC-3 that will defend the Greek territory.



*We have seen PATRIOT PAC-III how defend S.Arabia ... so pathetic*

btw Greece has only 325 PAC-II and PAC-III Missiles ... on the other hand , Turkiye produce more 415 SOM Cruise Missiles

even I am not talking about 2.000+ of TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , J600T , BORA , ATACMS , JSOW , KGK-LR , HARPY , POPEYE , SLAM-ER , HARM , HARPOON Block-II to hit all Jet Hangars with Fighter Jets and AD Systems in Greece , Greek Islands

also 1.000+ KARA-ATMACA , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , SDB-IIR , AKBABA and KARGI in the next 3-5 years

And 200+ TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI UCAVs are in service


You are still living in 2000s when Turkiye had only POPEYE , SLAM-ER , JSOW , HARM , ATACMS with limited numbers


*now tiny Greece never can match with great Turkish missile fire power which is the 2nd strongest in NATO after USA*

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## Michel Niesten

MMM-E said:


> not mach 2,5 , but mach 3,5 and its only SIPER Block-0 variant
> 
> Turkish GaN based AESA Radar to detect even stealth Fighters
> View attachment 874909
> 
> 
> hit to kill technology
> View attachment 874913
> 
> 
> 
> also Turkiye to produce Air Defense System based on GOKDOGAN air to air Missile ( range of 100+ km and speed of mach 4 )
> View attachment 874908
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What did ERDOGAN do to France ? nothing
> 
> Turkiye kicked USA-France backed PKK/YPG Terrorists who want to destroy Turkiye's territorial integrity
> 
> 
> We dont need any help
> The French side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts well and sit on it.
> 
> *SIPER and GOKDOGAN easly can turn RAFALE Fighter Jet into crap of metal*


You kick the PKK for 40 years, and still not defeated them…

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## Sapei

Michel Niesten said:


> You kick the PKK for 40 years, and still not defeated them…



PKK is only remaining outside Turkey's borders.


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## MMM-E

Michel Niesten said:


> You kick the PKK for 40 years, and still not defeated them…



Loser PKK could not take even 1cm2 of land from Turkiye in 40 years

Turkish Army kicked all PKK terrorists out of Turkish soil and since 1990 PKK terror camps are in İraq
over 15.000 Turkish soldiers are in İraq now to block Northen of İraq

also Turkish military operations took AFRIN , RASULAYN , TELABYAD from loser PKK/YPG Terrorists and destroyed ROJAVA dream ....

and another Turkish military operation is loading in Syria ...

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## Michel Niesten

MMM-E said:


> Loser PKK could not take even 1cm2 of land from Turkiye in 40 years
> 
> Turkish Army kicked all PKK terrorists out of Turkish soil and since 1990 PKK terror camps are in İraq
> over 15.000 Turkish soldiers are in İraq now to block Northen of İraq
> 
> also Turkish military operations took AFRIN , RASULAYN , TELABYAD from loser PKK/YPG Terrorists
> 
> and another Turkish military operation is loading in Syria ...


You should be a comedian

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## MMM-E

*100 years ago 30.08.1922 Turkih victory over Greece-France*



it is the centenary of the resounding defeat of the UK+France backed occupying Greek army at the hands of Turks in the Battle of Dumlupınar in 1922

ATATURK kicked enemies 100 years ago
ERDOGAN is ready to kick enemies again


* Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming*

and on 28 November 1922, six people, including General Yeoryos Hacıanestis, Prime Minister Dimitrios Gunaris, Georgios Baltatzis, Nikolaos Stratos, Nikolaos Theotokis, Prime Minister Petros Protopadakis *were sentenced to death* because of the defeats in Anatolia against the Turks

*MICOTAKIS wants the same destiny*







Erdoğan wrote in the memorial book of Anıtkabir:

"Beloved Atatürk, we remember you, your fellow soldiers, respectable members of the Turkish Grand National Assembly and our beloved martyrs in the centenary of the great victory, which is one of the most important turning points of our glorious history. Inspired by our heroic martyrs, we are continuing to empower the Republic of Türkiye, taking it to the goals you set out, to empower it in every field, economy, defense and diplomacy in particular. Our country, which overcame the fallout of the global pandemic crisis, is successfully managing the conflicts in its region and is engaged in diplomatic steps hailed by the whole world for the reestablishment of peace and stability."

Building a Türkiye which is growing, strengthened and serving as a hope for the oppressed will not be prevented by the plots of invaders or the attacks of terrorist groups with bloody hands."










Türkiye marks Victory Day, a month of past glories


Joy was in the air across Türkiye as the country on Tuesday marked Victory Day, the centenary of a legendary battle against invading Greeks and an...




www.dailysabah.com


----------



## MMM-E

*President ERDOGAN ... 30.08.2022*



Greece is not our equal and interlocutor, neither politically, economically, nor militarily.


We don't care about F-35 and embargoes. We are a country that has the determination to produce every product that is denied us sooner or later

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> not mach 2,5


I was speaking of ASMP-A ....



Beny Karachun said:


> They can't provide guidance for missiles. They are inaccurate due to the wide wavelength, only providing estimated location.


Indeed, not accurate enough if they are used alone. But they are never used alone, as seen by the F117 destruction in Serbia.
Instead of using their inboard X radar to search in a 180° a target, a fighter with a low bad radar detection has now to search in a narrow angle... It changes everything.



MMM-E said:


> *We have seen PATRIOT PAC-III how defend S.Arabia ... so pathetic*
> 
> btw Greece has only 325 PAC-II and PAC-III Missiles ... on the other hand , Turkiye produce more 415 SOM Cruise Missiles
> 
> even I am not talking about 2.000+ of TRLG-230 , TRG-300 , J600T , BORA , ATACMS , JSOW , KGK-LR , HARPY , POPEYE , SLAM-ER , HARM , HARPOON Block-II to hit all Jet Hangars with Fighter Jets and AD Systems in Greece , Greek Islands
> 
> also 1.000+ KARA-ATMACA , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , SDB-IIR , AKBABA and KARGI in the next 3-5 years
> 
> And 200+ TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI UCAVs are in service
> 
> 
> You are still living in 2000s when Turkiye had only POPEYE , SLAM-ER , JSOW , HARM , ATACMS with limited numbers
> 
> 
> *now tiny Greece never can match with great Turkish missile fire power which is the 2nd strongest in NATO after USA*


The problem of all these weapons is that they are used by poor trained and poor brained people....



MMM-E said:


> Good luck to old technology F-15 , F-16V , RAFALE
> 
> 
> KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35
> 
> combination with RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in BVR combat
> 
> 
> Lenght : 14.7 m
> Wingspan : 10 m
> Height : 3.3 m
> 
> Endurance : 5 Hours
> Combat radius : 500 nm
> Service ceiling : 35,000 - 45.000 ft
> Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
> Payload : 1.5 Tons
> 
> -- AESA Radar , EOTS , sensor fusion
> -- Stealth design
> -- Internal weapon stations
> -- Stealth flight capability
> -- The ability to hide from Radars
> -- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
> -- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
> 
> View attachment 874911
> 
> View attachment 874910


nice wooden mock up.

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Greek S300 Air Defense System radar locks Turkish F-16 Jets in international airspace


*Turkish fake news........*
This is the range of the S300 at the Heraklion.....
Turkish F-16 acording the turkish fake new were south east of the Rodos island, and the Greek S300 at the Heraklion.
*It's obviously out of range.*

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *what about ? if Turkiye deploy S400s in İzmir to block all Aegean against Hellenic Airforce*


The dream of the Greek Air Force is the S400 in Smyrna..... 
The reason are these.....
The actual l range of the S400






Scalp EG

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> I was speaking of ASMP-A ....




Turkiye will use SIPER against Fighter Jets

HISAR-A and HISAR-0 are in service to intercept even supersonic cruise Missiles










Also there will be land based AD System which based on GOKDOGAN - BOZDOGAN air to air missiles ( speed of mach 4 ) .... similar to French MICA-VL



*Now Turkiye has the best Air Defense capability in EUROPE*


-- STINGER and SUNGUR MANPADS
-- KORKUT 35mm SPAAG
-- SAHIN 40 mm Anti-Drone System
-- NAZAR LASER EW System
-- HISAR-A low altitude Air Defense System
-- HISAR-O medium altitude Air Defense System
-- SIPER high altitude Air Defense System
-- S400 long range Air Defense System

-- KORAL and REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare Systems

-- 600 km BIG BIRD Radar of S400
-- 600 km EIRS Early Warning AESA Radar
-- 600 km PESA Radar of Boeing E-7T AEWCs

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> nice wooden mock up.



You are liars ... nothing else
Primitive countries dreaming to match with Turkiye


Its not mock up 
Its real 2nd prototype of KIZILELMA which make first flight in the first quarter of 2023


Lenght : 14.7 m
Wingspan : 10 m
Height : 3.3 m

Endurance : 5 Hours
Combat radius : 500 nm
Service ceiling : 35,000 - 45.000 ft
Cruise speed : Block-1 mach 0,6 - 0,9 .... Block-2 mach 1,4
MTOW: 6000 kg
Payload : 1.500 kg

-- AESA Radar , EOTS , sensor fusion
-- Stealth design
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence

-- SATCOM + 3 redundant LOS
-- Independent navigation
-- Operational capability from TCG ANADOLU light Aircraft Carrier







Good luck to old RAFALE

KIZILELMA Block-II with 2 x turbofan engines for supersonic speed of mach 1.4-1.6 and expanded fusulage for more internal weapon station volume and fuel capacity to a larger combat radius

and with aggressive maneuverability with delta canard 

AESA Radar , EOTS , Datalink , sensor fusion

also its advantages of unmanned combat with AI which can withstand G forces that no human could survive in manned Fighter Jets

and to carry RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in the Internal weapon station for stealth flight capability in BVR combat


that means , KIZILELMA Block-II to be able to fight against the highest capacity Fighter Jets including F-35


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> The problem of all these weapons is that they are used by poor trained and poor brained people....



Or pathetic PATRIOT System with launcher at a 70-degree angle

also Vehicles that can fly closer to the ground such as cruise missiles and Kamikaze Drones can’t be detected from long distance by the PATRIOT's one-way Radar

İran used 18 Kamikaze Drones and 7 Cruise Missiles to hit ARAMCO oil facilities and Saudi PATRIOT AD Systems failed



Swarm attacks by low-flying Kamikaze Drones and Cruise Missiles are exactly the types of systems The US is having trouble defending against after years of focusing on longer range threats


*So easy to turn Greek PATRIOT Air Defense Systems into crap of metal *

1-- Kamikaze Drones and Cruise Missiles easy to maneuver, allowing them to hit the coverage gaps between Radars and Patriot batteries

2--Kamikaze Drones and Cruise Missiles are far cheaper than a $2 million Patriot missile, meaning the supply of Patriots can be depleted much faster than the bevy of Drones launching attacks

3-- Turkiye is producing with huge numbers but Greece is buying with limited numbers
Turkiye's missile power is the best in NATO after USA


*Europe's first anti-radiation Drone .. Turkish KARGI*

6+ hours of operation capability ( 1.000 km )
RF seeker
home-of-jam capability
SATCOM communication
Datalink
*SEAD* (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses)
*DEAD* (Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses)












*200 km SIMSEK Kamikaze Drone to carry by Turkish UCAVs *










*GOKSUNGUR JEMSAH supersonic fake decoy Drone*

Range : 300 km

GOKSUNGUR decoy Drone can be programmed in advance and is launched to enemy air defense positions before an air attack, deceiving the enemy air defense systems, reducing the casualties of friendly aircraft and allowing them to operate in survivability

low-cost decoy Drone for Suppression of Enemy Air Defense (SEAD) missions






American MALD
Turkish GOKSUNGUR

*Good luck to Enemy Air Defense Systems , They will need it*


----------



## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> *Turkish fake news........*
> This is the range of the S300 at the Heraklion.....
> Turkish F-16 acording the turkish fake new were south east of the Rodos island, and the Greek S300 at the Heraklion.
> *It's obviously out of range.*



Dont show an useless map

Turkiye has evidance ( radar information ) and sent to NATO
Bandit Greece used a Russian weapon ( S300 ) Air Defense System radar locks Turkish F-16 Jets in international airspace

weak-tiny Greece is hidding behind USA-France and barking

Greece is a puppet as like loser PKK/YPG , FETO
Smart USA use brainless puppets for American-İsraeli interests

100 years ago smart British used Greeks as puppet
*Greeks came with dreams of capturing Anatolia from the Turks but ended up going back to Athens swimming*




Akritas said:


> Scalp EG



Daydreamer Greeks are still living in 2000s
stop dreaming and wake up

Turkiye has developed its own Air Defense Systems to intercept subsonic SCALP-EG

HISAR-A , HISAR-0 and KORKUT
Even KORKUT 35 mm SPAAG with airbust ammo can intercept low speed SCALP-EG

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## MMM-E

*12 AKINCI UCAVs are in service*



even France have only 12 MQ-9 Reaper

Turkiye has over 200 TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI UCAVs which are more than all Europe combined


By the end of this year, the 20th AKINCI UCAV will be produced

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> 12 AKINCI UCAVs are in service





MMM-E said:


> even France have only 12 MQ-9 Reaper


Since you keep comparing the two UAVs, can you finally tell us what their radar range is? 
A question you avoid answering.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Since you keep comparing the two UAVs, can you finally tell us what their radar range is?
> A question you avoid answering.



Radar range ? for what ?

MQ-9 doesnt carry long range missiles and guided Bombs 
( only 12-25 km HELLFIRE missile and GBU-12 Paveway II laser guided Bomb ) ... so pathetic fire power


French Air Force MQ-9 Reaper has AN/APY-8 Lynx II Radar






superior Aselsan GaN based AESA Radar will be fitted to AKINCI in 2022






Also MQ-9 UCAV armed with only 12-25 km Missile and laser guided Bomb ..so pathetic
-- HELLFIRE
-- GBU-12 Paveway II

on the other hand superior AKINCI armed with 12-15-30-50-150-280 km Missile and laser guided Bombs , including SOM Cruise Missile

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## MMM-E

*30.08.1922 Turkih victory over Greece-France


and NATO congratulated the Turks .... 



*


----------



## BON PLAN

Akritas said:


> *Turkish fake news........*
> This is the range of the S300 at the Heraklion.....
> Turkish F-16 acording the turkish fake new were south east of the Rodos island, and the Greek S300 at the Heraklion.
> *It's obviously out of range.*
> 
> View attachment 875093


You may be out of the missile range but inside the radar range....



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye will use SIPER against Fighter Jets
> 
> HISAR-A and HISAR-0 are in service to intercept even supersonic cruise Missiles
> 
> View attachment 875102
> 
> View attachment 875103
> 
> 
> Also there will be land based AD System which based on GOKDOGAN - BOZDOGAN air to air missiles ( speed of mach 4 ) .... similar to French MICA-VL
> 
> 
> 
> *Now Turkiye has the best Air Defense capability in EUROPE*
> 
> 
> -- STINGER and SUNGUR MANPADS
> -- KORKUT 35mm SPAAG
> -- SAHIN 40 mm Anti-Drone System
> -- NAZAR LASER EW System
> -- HISAR-A low altitude Air Defense System
> -- HISAR-O medium altitude Air Defense System
> -- SIPER high altitude Air Defense System
> -- S400 long range Air Defense System
> 
> -- KORAL and REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare Systems
> 
> -- 600 km BIG BIRD Radar of S400
> -- 600 km EIRS Early Warning AESA Radar
> -- 600 km PESA Radar of Boeing E-7T AEWCs


So it's strange you purchased S400 and ask for an ASTER purchase with such nice goodies.
Maybe these goodies are not so efficient. Or just made for the show.



MMM-E said:


> Primitive countries dreaming to match with Turkiye


LOL. It's clear that all want to compete with your 70% inflation rate.

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Europe's first anti-radiation Drone .. Turkish KARGI


only a copy and paste of IAI Harpy drone. Shame on you ! naughty copier....



MMM-E said:


> Even KORKUT 35 mm SPAAG with airbust ammo can intercept low speed SCALP-EG


can intercept only if this missile is detected. And SCALP is a very low flying stealth missile. No way you can detect it.



MMM-E said:


> Radar range ? for what ?
> 
> MQ-9 doesnt carry long range missiles and guided Bombs
> ( only 12-25 km HELLFIRE missile and GBU-12 Paveway II laser guided Bomb ) ... so pathetic fire power
> 
> 
> French Air Force MQ-9 Reaper has AN/APY-8 Lynx II Radar
> View attachment 875221
> 
> 
> 
> superior Aselsan GaN based AESA Radar will be fitted to AKINCI in 2022
> View attachment 875222
> 
> 
> 
> Also MQ-9 UCAV armed with only 12-25 km Missile and laser guided Bomb ..so pathetic
> -- HELLFIRE
> -- GBU-12 Paveway II
> 
> on the other hand superior AKINCI armed with 12-15-30-50-150-280 km Missile and laser guided Bombs , including SOM Cruise Missile
> View attachment 875232


Turkish drone is a real commercial success. Congrats !

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> So it's strange you purchased S400 and ask for an ASTER purchase with such nice goodies.
> Maybe these goodies are not so efficient. Or just made for the show.




380 km S400 is a strategic weapon and far better than 120 km SAMP-T and 160 km PAC-II

and Turkiye doesnt want to buy ASTER
in 2018 , Turkiye signed an agreement with EUROSAM to develop new AD System with ballistic missile interception capability


-- 380 km S400 to use against enemy AEWC , EW Aircrafts , Fighter Jets
-- 100 km SIPER block-0 to use against enemy Fighter Jets
( 150 km SIPER block-1 in 2024-2025 ) and SIPER block-2 with ballistic missile interception capability in 2027

-- HISAR-A and HISAR-O will protect S400 and SIPER from Cruise Missiles and anti-radiation Drones


Turkiye will have full of air defense umbrella with indigenous HISAR-A , HISAR-O and SIPER to protect all Turkish territory from Fighter Jets , Ballistic Missiles , Cruise Missiles and anti-radiation Drones

*only 2 countries in EUROPE*

Turkiye : HISAR-A , HISAR-O and SIPER
France : CROTALE-NG , MICA-VL and SAMP-T

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> only a copy and paste of IAI Harpy drone. Shame on you ! naughty copier....



Not copy but developing with full of indigenous subsystems such as navigation and automatic flight control system , software , warhead , RF Seeker, Engine, Booster, Link System, Propeller , Fuel Tank , etc


now Turkiye has better UCAV technologies than Israel
( TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI , KIZILELMA , KARGI , SIMSEK , GOKSUNGUR , ALPAGU , KARGU and many more )


and HARPY is so inferior to compare with KARGI

*HARPY*
Range : 200 km
NO datalink
NO SATCOM communication

*KARGI*
Range : 1.000 km
Datalink
SATCOM communication
home-of-jam capability


*And Turkish GOKSUNGUR JEMSAH supersonic fake decoy Drone*

Weight of less than 100 kg
Range of 300 km

GOKSUNGUR decoy Drone can be programmed in advance and is launched to enemy air defense positions before an air attack, deceiving the enemy air defense systems, reducing the casualties of friendly aircraft and allowing them to operate in survivability

low-cost decoy Drone for Suppression of Enemy Air Defense (SEAD) missions







Turkiye has its own KARGI , SIMSEK and GOKSUNGUR kamikaze Drones
*SEAD* (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses)
*DEAD* (Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses)

*Good luck to Enemy Air Defense Systems , They will need it*


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> can intercept only if this missile is detected. And SCALP is a very low flying stealth missile. No way you can detect it.



SCALP Missile doesnt have terrain hugging capability
Flight altitude : 30-40 m

SOM Missile has terrain hugging capability
Flight altitude : less than 5 m



*INTEGRETED RADAR SYSTEMS*
Boeing E-7T AEWCs with 600 km PESA Radar 7/24 in the air to control all Aegean and Eastern Mediterranean

Early warning Radars to stay at 2.000-2.500 m in the mountains to detect all Cruise Missiles
also S400s 600 km BIG BIRD Radar will not stay at sea level

and KORKUT has 70 km Radar to detect cruise missiles


also We will protect S400s from the air in a possible conflict
AKINCI UCAV ( AESA Radar + 6 air to air missiles ) to stay in the air 7/24


----------



## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Radar range ? for what ?
> 
> French Air Force MQ-9 Reaper has AN/APY-8 Lynx II Radar
> View attachment 875221


As usual you didn't answer......
And you don't answer, because you know that the range of the MQ-9 is superior from the AKinci.
MQ-9 has two types, the MQ-9A Reader and the MQ-9B Sea/Sky Guard.
As regards the radar, the new MQ-9 will have the new radar Leonardo Seaspray 7500E V2(range 320 N.M.) that replacing the AN/APY-8 Lynx II.
The range of the new radar of the MQ-9 will be.....350 N.M.
The range of Acinci radar is.....unknown......









General Atomics Integrates Sea Spray 7500E V2 radar onto MQ-9 - Naval News


GA-ASI has integrated the Leonardo Seaspray 7500E V2 multi-mode radar onto an MQ-9A Block 5 and performed its first test flight on Apr. 14.




www.navalnews.com

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> MQ-9 has two types, the MQ-9A Reader and the MQ-9B Sea/Sky Guard.
> As regards the radar, the new MQ-9 will have the new radar Leonardo Seaspray 7500E V2(range 320 N.M.) that replacing the AN/APY-8 Lynx II.




I am talking about UCAV
France has MQ-9 Reaper with the AN/APY-8 Lynx II radar 
and MQ-9 Reaper ( only 12-25 km missiles/laser guided Bombs ) ..... so pathetic

and the most important thing missile fire power , not radar range

AKINCI UCAV to carry long range cruise missiles to hit Warships , AD Systems
IIR and laser guided long range Bombs to hit Warships , AD Systems
100+ km air to air missiles to hit UAVs , Helicopters , Aircrafts

for example Greece buys MQ-9B Sea Guardian
on the other hand Turkiye has AKINCI ( in 2023 GaN based AESA Radar with 6 x GOKDOGAN air to air missiles ) to turn Greek MQ-9B Sea Guardian into crap of metal from 100 km away in a conflict

Eastern Mediterranean Turkiye's play zone to protect Turkish EEZ

AKINCI UCAV , AESA Radar , GOKDOGAN air to air missile

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> LOL. It's clear that all want to compete with your 70% inflation rate.



still dreaming about 70% inflation rate

*in reality , Turkiye has enough money for all Turkish military projects ... no problem*

Dozens of New UCAVs entered service in 2022
More T-625 and T-129 Helicopters in production line
New T-70 Blackhawk Helicopters enter service in 2022
T-929 ATAK-II heavy Attack Helicopter under production
HURJET and TFX Fighter Jets under production
2 KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jets were produced in 2022
HISAR-A and HISAR-O AD Systems entered service in 2022
SIPER high altitude AD Systems with 600 km EIRS Early Warning AESA Radar in 2022
New Type-214 class AIP Submarine enter service in 2022
TCG ANADOLU light Aircraft Carrier enter service in 2022
ISTANBUL class Frigate works continues
4 BARBAROS class Frigates and 4 PREVEZE class Submarines under modernization
TCG DERYA Marine Supply Combat Support Ship
KTJ-3200 turbojet engine mass production in 2022 for SOM and ATMACA Cruise Missiles
Land based new version of ATMACA Anti-Ship Missile in 2022
BOZDOGAN and GOKDOGAN air to air Missiles enter service
in 2022 , Turkiye announced 40 new F-16V and 79 kits for VIPER modernization $6 billion
2nd batch of S400 on agenda ... ( $2,5 billion )

and many more ...



a few months ago FOINIKAS said that Turkiye doesnt have 10 AKINCI UCAV , but only 3

now 12 AKINCI UCAVs are in service and 20th AKINCI UCAV will be produced by the end of this year ..... even France has only 12 MQ-9 ... nothing else

as of 2022 , Turkiye has 200+ TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI UCAVs ( 4 x more than all Europe combined )


*TB-2 UCAVs kill list ... 
still tiny Greece dreaming to fight Turkiye*

2 x Ilyushin IL-76
1 x Antonov AN-32
2x S-300
12 x Pantsir S1
2 x Kamov KA-52
3 x Sukhoi SU-22
2 x Mi-8
120+ Tanks
421+ Vehicles
18+ Aircrafts
8+ Radars
7+ Naval Ships
2+ Trains
60+ Air-Defence Systems ( BUK , TOR , OSA , etc )
280+ Missile Systems

Total: 857






__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1565491818699030529

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## FuturePAF

MMM-E said:


> What about BVR combat ?
> 
> KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to carry RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air missiles in the Internal weapon station for stealth flight capability
> 
> 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missile is ready
> 200+ km RAMJET powered GOKHAN long range air to air under development
> 
> 
> stealth KIZILELMA with much lower RCS vs 4th gen F-15 , F-16V , Rafale with much bigger RCS
> 
> so stealth KIZILELMA to detect Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15 , F-16V before they detect KIZILELMA and then press the kill button and game over in BVR combat
> 
> Egypt and Greece in the region
> 
> 
> 
> *KIZILELMA Block-II variant will have supersonic speed of mach 1,4 for dog fight*
> 
> and KIZILELMA to open new horizons in dog fight through its advantages of unmanned combat and aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
> 
> how could a human win when an AI can withstand G forces that no human could survive ?
> 
> AI would win non stop eventually
> 
> 
> and F-35 sucks in dog fight


What is the state of Turkish Datalinks. Reports are that Greek EW was able to break the line with a Turkish Drone over or near the Aegean, and had the drone circling eventually forcing it to return to base.

Either way, I’m sure Turkish firms will deal with the challenge.

I hope the Block 2 Model is acquired by the PAF to support the PN. It would be a potent fighter to use alongside the J-10 under a manned-unmanned teaming strategy, allowing the use of direct like of sight control. Kizilelma could not only form the advanced stealthy wave of fighter escorts with the best Turkish BVR missiles, but other planes could be equipped with the best Turkish anti ship missiles to take out a potential Indian naval blockade.

It would probably be the best way to replace the naval mirages qualitatively while also maintain the quantitative numbers of fighter/bombers in the PAF, even if some of them are unmanned.

Any idea what the projected unit price of the Block 1 and Block 2 variant are expected to be?

Considering the PAF will be facing the Rafale and possibly the F-18 Hornet and eventually the F-35 it would be another theater the Turks could test the plane against real world challenges, and refine it better for their own use.


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## MMM-E

FuturePAF said:


> What is the state of Turkish Datalinks. Reports are that Greek EW was able to break the line with a Turkish Drone over or near the Aegean, and had the drone circling eventually forcing it to return to base.



Greek wet dream




FuturePAF said:


> I hope the Block 2 Model is acquired by the PAF to support the PN. It would be a potent fighter to use alongside the J-10 under a manned-unmanned teaming strategy, allowing the use of direct like of sight control. Kizilelma could not only form the advanced stealthy wave of fighter escorts with the best Turkish BVR missiles, but other planes could be equipped with the best Turkish anti ship missiles to take out a potential Indian naval blockade.



*CAKIR New generation Cruise Missile*​
it will use the most modern systems in the world
next-generation swarm technologies as well as artificial intelligence


For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the Warship









*There is not yet such a detailed mini Cruise Missile in the world*

Range = 150 km
Diameter = 275 mm
Weight = 330 kg ( with booster )
Length = 4.1 m ( with booster )
Warhead = 70 kg
Speed = 0.75-0.85 Mach
Guidance = INS , IIR , RF , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink

-- Network-centric warfare capability with Datalink
-- Sea skimming and terrain hugging
-- Next-generation swarm technologies
-- Artificial intelligence

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## FuturePAF

MMM-E said:


> Greek wet dream
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *CAKIR New generation Cruise Missile*​
> it will use the most modern systems in the world
> next-generation swarm technologies as well as artificial intelligence
> 
> 
> For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
> The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the Warship
> View attachment 875920
> 
> View attachment 875921
> 
> 
> *There is not yet such a detailed mini Cruise Missile in the world*
> 
> Range = 150 km
> Diameter = 275 mm
> Weight = 330 kg ( with booster )
> Length = 4.1 m ( with booster )
> Warhead = 70 kg
> Speed = 0.75-0.85 Mach
> Guidance = INS , IIR , RF , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink
> 
> -- Network-centric warfare capability with Datalink
> -- Sea skimming and terrain hugging
> -- Next-generation swarm technologies
> -- Artificial intelligence


Any plans for it to fit the longer range SOM missile, (for taking on Indian carrier battle groups)? The mini cruise missile looks promising when taking on smaller escorts.

Would also love to see the Kizilelma integrate a lift fan so that it can operate from the future Turkish LHD as well as austere bases.


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## MMM-E

FuturePAF said:


> Any idea what the projected unit price of the Block 1 and Block 2 variant are expected to be?
> 
> Considering the PAF will be facing the Rafale and possibly the F-18 Hornet and eventually the F-35 it would be another theater the Turks could test the plane against real world challenges, and refine it better for their own use.



Turkiye can produce 3 or 4 KIZILELMA in price of 1 RAFALE




FuturePAF said:


> Any plans for it to fit the longer range SOM missile?



KIZILELMA to carry 275 km SOM Cruise Missile ( anti-ship / land attack ) with warhead of 230 kg

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## FuturePAF

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye can produce 3 or 4 KIZILELMA in price of 1 RAFALE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> KIZILELMA to carry 275 km SOM Cruise Missile ( anti-ship / land attack ) with warhead of 230 kg


So what would you say is the price, roughly? Approx. $30 million each?


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## MMM-E

FuturePAF said:


> So what would you say is the price, roughly? Approx. $30 million each?



Price is not clear yet

but production cost is a thing , selling price is another thing

for example, USA selling MQ-9 Sea Guardian UAV for $100 millon per unite ( more than F35 price )

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## MMM-E

*Barbaros Class Frigate Half-Life Modernization Project
( about €250 million )



4 Ships are planned to be delivered to the Turkish Navy until 2025 to match with 3 BELHARRA Frigates for the Hellenic Navy*


The first modernization of BARBAROS class Frigate to be completed in May 2023

-- Havelsan ADVENT Network Enabled Data Integrated Combat Management System
-- Aselsan TAKS Fire Control System
-- Aselsan SMART-S MK-II 3D Radar
-- Aselsan MAR-D 3B AESA Radar
-- Aselsan AKR-D X and Ka-Band fire control Radars
-- Aselsan ARES-2N Electronic Warfare System
-- Aselsan PIRI Panoramic Infrared Imaging
-- Aselsan KATS Infrared Search and Track system
-- Aselsan FERSAH Carina Mounted Sonar System
-- Aselsan HIZIR Torpedo counter measure System

-- 1 x 127 mm Gun
-- 2 x Aselsan STOP 25mm RCW
-- 1 x Aselsan GOKDENIZ 35 mm CIWS
-- 1 x PHALANX 20 mm CIWS
-- 32/64 x ESSM/HISAR Air Defense Missiles
-- 16 x ATMACA Anti ship Missiles
-- 6 x Lightweight Torpedoes

*Most modern Systems , weapons and more stealth capabilities*

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## Hakikat ve Hikmet

FuturePAF said:


> So what would you say is the price, roughly? Approx. $30 million each?


According to Selchuk Bayraktar, KIZILELMA is planned to be a low cost solution to have a mass production. TEI has come up with a turbofan engine prototype to cater for both single and dual engine variants.....

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> SCALP Missile doesnt have terrain hugging capability
> Flight altitude : 30-40 m
> 
> SOM Missile has terrain hugging capability
> Flight altitude : less than 5 m
> 
> 
> 
> *INTEGRETED RADAR SYSTEMS*
> Boeing E-7T AEWCs with 600 km PESA Radar 7/24 in the air to control all Aegean and Eastern Mediterranean
> 
> Early warning Radars to stay at 2.000-2.500 m in the mountains to detect all Cruise Missiles
> also S400s 600 km BIG BIRD Radar will not stay at sea level
> 
> and KORKUT has 70 km Radar to detect cruise missiles
> 
> 
> also We will protect S400s from the air in a possible conflict
> AKINCI UCAV ( AESA Radar + 6 air to air missiles ) to stay in the air 7/24


Every modern weapons use terrain following passive system, as SCALP.
Only older one useactive terrain following system. It's probably the case of your SOM.

70km for a terrain radar to detect cruise miisile? Just impossible because of clutter, because the modern cruise miisile are stealth and just because the earth is round.


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Every modern weapons use terrain following passive system, as SCALP.
> Only older one useactive terrain following system. It's probably the case of your SOM.



Old technology SCALP nothing to compare with the latest technology SOM


*SCALP Cruise Missile

Guidance : *INS , GPS and TERPROM with DSMAC
*Seeker : *NO
*Flight altitude :* 30-40 m
*Anti-ship capability :* NO


*superior SOM Cruise Missile

Guidance :* INS , GPS , Terrain Referenced Navigation , Image Based Navigation , Automatic Target Recognition
*Seeker :* IIR
*Flight altitude : *less than 5 m ( Terrain hugging and sea skimming )
*Anti-ship capability :* YES


Also Turkish ATMACA anti-ship Missile is superior to French EXOCET and American HARPOON



*Europe's first Anti-radiation Drone ... Turkish KARGI*

to hit enemy Air Defense Systems-Radars from 1.000 km away

6+ hours of operation capability ( 1.000 km )
RF seeker
home-of-jam capability
SATCOM communication
Datalink
SEAD (Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses)
DEAD (Destruction of Enemy Air Defenses)







*KARGI anti-radiation Drone with EO/IR System



*

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> 70km for a terrain radar to detect cruise miisile? Just impossible because of clutter, because the modern cruise miisile are stealth and just because the earth is round.



Yes can detect and intercept

even there are naval version of KORKUT to intercept sea skimming anti-ship missiles


GOKDENIZ 35 mm CIWS

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Also Turkish ATMACA anti-ship Missile is superior to French EXOCET and American HARPOON


Yes, sure. Post after post your are explaining us that turkish weapons are the best of the world. 
Fortunately for Greece it's not the case. Remember the 3rd army of the world in 1991 : Irak... Turkey is in the same position : a fool leader and a big but unorganised army.

I add that with a US made fighter fleet, the moment you decide to act against Greece or another NATO nation, the support will cease immediatly. Good luck without an air force.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Fortunately for Greece it's not the case. Remember the 3rd army of the world in 1991 : Irak... Turkey is in the same position : a fool leader and a big but unorganised army.



İraq was so weak without defense industry ...and Arabs dont know how to fight

On the other hand
-- Great leader ERDOGAN
-- Turkiye which has great defense industry
-- Turkiye which has great military , warrior nation and traditation since 209 BC
-- Turks have the best military history with 16 Empires who ruled India , İran , Anatolia , Caucasia , All Middle East , Egypt , North Africa , Greece and all Balkans for centuries

*even super power Ottoman Empire protected weak France against Germans for over 200 years in the 16th and 17th centuries*

Turkish Army has the best experince of real conflicts since 1990s and now in İraq , Syria , Libya , Azerbaijan , TRNC , Somalia and Qatar


even 100 years ago , Turks kicked Greeks+French when the Turks were the weakest period

today Turkiye has everything to kick tiny Greece and trash France .

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> I add that with a US made fighter fleet, the moment you decide to act against Greece or another NATO nation, the support will cease immediatly. Good luck without an air force.



Keep dreaming dream is free
Nobody will fight Turkiye for useless Greece as like 1922 , 1974 , 1996
smart USA-France use brainless PKK-YPG , FETO , Greece as puppets .. nothing else


USA-France : Turkiye can not enter Syria , we will fight Turkiye , we have airforces

*RESULT : *USA-France only watched on TV , when the Turkish Armed Forces kicked PKK/YPG and your dreams in Syria


and we dont need USA-France
if needed We can buy superior weapons like S400 from Russia , instead of American PATRIOT and French SAMP-T

Even now Turkiye has its own 100 km SIPER air Defense System

*The French and American side can now lubricate the tip of the SAMP-Ts and PATRIOTs well and sit on it.*




BON PLAN said:


> Yes, sure. Post after post your are explaining us that turkish weapons are the best of the world.



I am saying again , Turkish ATMACA anti-ship Missile is superior to French EXOCET and American HARPOON

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## Akritas

in meantime, Greek Rafale against Turkish F-16 in the Aegean....

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> in meantime, Greek Rafale against Turkish F-16 in the Aegean....



Daydreamer Greeks will wake up when Turkish missiles explodes on their heads in a conflict



RAFALE deal signed in January of 2021 

Greek propaganda map September 7 2020 .... as always fake


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## [TR]AHMET

BON PLAN said:


> a fool leader and a big but unorganised army.


I laughed out loud


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## MMM-E

*One more surprize for our Greek friends, the 16-Cell MIDLAS on I Class Frigates will also feature SIPER Naval Missile in Quadpack configuration*



100 km SIPER Blok-1 will be in active service in 2023.

150 km SIPER Block-2 is on the way



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1567794255648759808

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1567543531073306625


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## MMM-E

*New anti-ship ammunition is coming*



Hellenic Navy Frigates armed with only 17-50 km RIM-7 and ESSM SAMs

Turkiye to produce hundreds of KGK-SIHA 82 anti-ship ammunition to carry by F-16 , HURJET and AKINCI for swarm attack on enemy Warships


Active RF seeker , Wing Guidance Kit for UCAVs

Weight : 336 kg
Warhead : 90 kg
Range : 65 -110 km
Seeker : RF

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## qwerrty

MMM-E said:


> *There is not yet such a detailed mini Cruise Missile in the world*
> 
> Range = 150 km
> Diameter = 275 mm
> Weight = 330 kg ( with booster )
> Length = 4.1 m ( with booster )
> Warhead = 70 kg
> Speed = 0.75-0.85 Mach
> Guidance = INS , IIR , RF , Hybrid (IIR+RF) Seeker , Radar Altimeter , Barometric Altimeter , Datalink



I'm pretty sure the C-705KD can do all those and has more powerful warhead lol


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## MMM-E

qwerrty said:


> I'm pretty sure the C-705KD can do all those and has more powerful warhead lol



Keep dreaming with old technology C-705KD ,,

-- NO Sea skimming and terrain hugging capability
-- NO Next-generation swarm technologies
-- NO Artificial intelligence
-- NO electronic warfare jamming capability



CAKIR is new generation mini cruise missile and unique to use the most modern systems in the world

-- Sea skimming and terrain hugging
-- Next-generation swarm technologies
-- Artificial intelligence
-- Electronic warfare jamming capability


For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the Warship


*Good luck to enemis , they will need it*


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## qwerrty

MMM-E said:


> Keep dreaming with old technology C-705KD ,,
> 
> -- NO Sea skimming and terrain hugging capability
> -- NO Next-generation swarm technologies
> -- NO Artificial intelligence
> -- NO electronic warfare jamming capability
> 
> full of old technology ......
> 
> 
> 
> CAKIR is new generation mini cruise missile and unique to use the most modern systems in the world
> 
> -- Sea skimming and terrain hugging
> -- Next-generation swarm technologies
> -- Artificial intelligence
> -- Electronic warfare jamming capability
> 
> 
> For example, KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to fire 4 CAKIR cruise missiles
> The first one, with electronic jamming capability will go ahead, and the other 3 will follow behind it. The first one will confuse the air defense systems, and the 3 following will hit the Warship
> 
> 
> *Good luck to enemis , they will need it*
> View attachment 877361
> 
> View attachment 877363



c705 maybe old, but the KD version has got some new tricks. the modular design makes it flexible to adapt to whatever mission. it can be a swarm type, jammer or... and it's real not in fantasy world

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## MMM-E

qwerrty said:


> lol



still showing old technology


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Great leader ERDOGAN


He only has 3 hairs on the *ss and think he is a bear.



[TR]AHMET said:


> I laughed out loud


We all have seen how the turkish tank crews managed their Leo 2 against ISIS....


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> We all have seen how the turkish tank crews managed their Leo 2 against ISIS....



*Turkish Army has great success ... *
We lost only 72 soldiers ,.... ISIS lost 3.000+ terrorists
even 67 of 72 were from unknown artillery attacks and airstrikes from Syrian Regime/İran

and losing only a few Tanks against 10.000+ ISIS terrorists armed with anti-Tank Misiles


Leo2 Tanks without active protection system
NO Turkish Airforce
NO Turkish UCAVs
only a few thousands of Turkish Soldiers
urban warfare
10.000+ ISIS terrorists
ISIS used UAVs for reconnaissance and surveillance
ISIS used anti-Tank Misiles
ISIS used suicide bomb attack tactics



go and send noob French or Greek Army and see what will happen



BON PLAN said:


> He only has 3 hairs on the *ss and think he is a bear.



ERDOGAN kicked France,USA,Greece,Armenia,FETO,PKK/YPG,ISIS,SSA,Hezbol,HAFTAR,etc in Karabakh , Syria , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean

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## MMM-E

*Network centric warfare capability since 2015



Turkiye spent $5,4 billion for network centric warfare capability*

-- CCIP Modernization for 163 F-16C/D block52 standard ( $3,9 billion ) since 2015
-- 4 Boeing E-7T AEWCs ( $1,5 billion ) since 2015


CCIP modernization made Turkish F-16s more lethal, survivable and network-centric weapon system


*BVR COMBAT*

-- 163 CCIP modernized F-16s with link-16 datalink
-- 4 Boeing E-7T AEWCs 600 km MESA Radar
-- 120 km AIM-120C7 networked air to air Missile





*Link-16 Tactical Data Link






to use network centric Warfare with Boeing E-7T AEWC to detect F-16V from 350-400 km away*

Turkish F-16s can use Boeing E-7T AEWC Radar to detect F-16V from 350-400 km away and to guide 120 km AIM--120C7 air to air missile on F-16V in BVR combat










*Let's imagine a scenario where we go to war with Greece

BVR COMBAT*

Let's assume that the war will start with the encounter of the Fighter Jets. In this case,

Our Boeing E7-T AEWCs can detect Greek Fighter Jets from long distances thanks to their 600 km long-range MESA Radar, can direct Turkish F-16s accordingly, and most importantly, they can put radar locks on Greek Fighter Jets and transfer this to the screens of Turkish F-16s via link16 data link

In this way, Turkish F-16s can be ready to fire directly without the need for their radar to scan for enemy Fighter Jets

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> *Network centric warfare capability since 2015
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye spent $5,4 billion for network centric warfare capability*
> 
> -- CCIP Modernization for 163 F-16C/D block52 standard ( $3,9 billion ) since 2015
> -- 4 Boeing E-7T AEWCs ( $1,5 billion ) since 2015
> 
> 
> CCIP modernization made Turkish F-16s more lethal, survivable and network-centric weapon system
> 
> 
> *BVR COMBAT*
> 
> -- 163 CCIP modernized F-16s with link-16 datalink
> -- 4 Boeing E-7T AEWCs 600 km MESA Radar
> -- 120 km AIM-120C7 networked air to air Missile
> 
> View attachment 878381
> 
> *Link-16 Tactical Data Link
> View attachment 878382
> 
> 
> 
> to use network centric Warfare with Boeing E-7T AEWC to detect F-16V from 350-400 km away*
> 
> Turkish F-16s can use Boeing E-7T AEWC Radar to detect F-16V from 350-400 km away and to guide 120 km AIM--120C7 air to air missile on F-16V in BVR combat
> View attachment 878383
> 
> View attachment 878384
> 
> 
> 
> *Let's imagine a scenario where we go to war with Greece
> 
> BVR COMBAT*
> 
> Let's assume that the war will start with the encounter of the Fighter Jets. In this case,
> 
> Our Boeing E7-T AEWCs can detect Greek Fighter Jets from long distances thanks to their 600 km long-range MESA Radar, can direct Turkish F-16s accordingly, and most importantly, they can put radar locks on Greek Fighter Jets and transfer this to the screens of Turkish F-16s via link16 data link
> 
> In this way, Turkish F-16s can be ready to fire directly without the need for their radar to scan for enemy Fighter Jets


The Turkish air force can shoot down up to F35, with your crazy reasoning.
How could USA, France, and Israel not have thought of that and are investing in very expensive aircraft. 
But the Turkish Air Force didn't think of it, and is begging the Americans to buy....F-16V.

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## Hold the door

Akritas said:


> The Turkish air force can shoot down up to F35, with your crazy reasoning.
> How could USA, France, and Israel not have thought of that and are investing in very expensive aircraft.
> But the Turkish Air Force didn't think of it, and is begging the Americans to buy....F-16V.


Turkey's electronic warfare capability is the second in the world after the USA. Most of Greece's planes will go blind and won't even be able to fly.

Those who ask for land from the Turks lose their own land. We make the islands and western Thrace our county.

Neither the USA nor France can save you.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> The Turkish air force can shoot down up to F35, with your crazy reasoning.



Dont jump to F-35 .... Greece has no any F-35


I am talking about current situation
Greek F-16V *vs* Turkish CCIP modernized F-16 + Boeing E7-T AEWC

and Turkish F-16s can be ready to fire directly without the need for their radar to scan for Greek F-16V Fighter Jets

Thanks to Boeing E7-T AEWC 600 km long-range MESA Radar can put radar locks on Greek F-16V Fighter Jets and transfer this to the screens of Turkish F-16s via link16 data link

*Greek F-16V to use 370 km SABR Radar
Turkish F-16 to use 600 km MESA Radar


Now only 2 Greek F-16V 
but 163 CCIP modernized Turkish F-16s have network centric warfare capability to use Boeing E7-T AEWC 600 km long-range MESA Radar *


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> ERDOGAN kicked France,USA,Greece,Armenia,FETO,PKK/YPG,ISIS,SSA,Hezbol,HAFTAR,etc in Karabakh , Syria , Libya and Eastern Mediterranean


He will be forced to leave government next election because its politic is desastrous. officially 70% inflation and some say 150%....



MMM-E said:


> Turkish F-16 to use 600 km MESA Radar


Why not 6000 km ? You are pityfull.



Hold the door said:


> Turkey's electronic warfare capability is the second in the world after the USA.


No, thank to Erdogan magic, the first of the world.

Next time you will explain us that the turkish F16 reach the light speed....

You may be proud of your country, but except for carpets you are the 2nd of the world in any scientific field. It's just the truth.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> He will be forced to leave government next election because its politic is desastrous. officially 70% inflation and some say 150%....



keep dreaming dream is free




BON PLAN said:


> Why not 6000 km ? You are pityfull.



Another ignorant daydramer who knows nothing about network centric warfare




BON PLAN said:


> You may be proud of your country, but except for carpets you are the 2nd of the world in any scientific field. It's just the truth.



*Turkish UCAV technology is the 2nd of the world after USA*

-- TB-2 to destroy enemy Tanks, Howitzers , IFVs , MLRS , short-medium range AD Systems
-- ANKA UCAV to carry 200 km SIMSEK kamikaze Drones
-- AKSUNGUR UCAV to carry SONOBOUYS and Torpedos to hunt enemy Submarines
-- AKINCI UCAV to destroy enemy Tanks, Howitzers , IFVs , MLRS , AD Systems .... Also enemy UCAVs , Attack Helicopters , Warships

Also KARGI anti-radiation Drone to destroy enemy AD Systems , Radars

and KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet is coming to destroy old technology 4th gen Fighters like F-16V , RAFALE





*Primitive countries are dreaming about fighting Turkiye .....*

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## Akritas

Hold the door said:


> Turkey's electronic warfare capability is the second in the world after the USA. Most of Greece's planes will go blind and won't even be able to fly.


Since you have such a great capability, why didn't the 8 Turkish F16s avoid being locked up, either by the Greek S300s, or by the Greek Rafales?
Besides, you're still looking for what kind of system locked up your planes.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> Since you have such a great capability, why didn't the 8 Turkish F16s avoid being locked up, either by the Greek S300s, or by the Greek Rafales?
> Besides, you're still looking for what kind of system locked up your planes.



in a conflict you will see what will happen

S300 Radar lock on Turkish F-16s were during peace time when we did NATO duty
We did not use any Electronic Warfare System ......

btw Turkish Armed Forces have tons of weapons to destroy S300s in Crete in a hour

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## MMM-E

*ADVANCED ELECTRONIC WARFARE SYSTEMS



Turkiye is one of top 5 Countries in the World in EW technology*
( USA , Turkiye , Russia , Israel and The UK )


*Aselsan KORAL Radar Electronic Warfare System to jam and deceive hostile radars *










*REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare System to jam and deceive hostile radars *






*Aselsan MUKAS Communication Jamming System*

Effective Electronic Attack in HF and V/UHF frequency bands
High sensitive and accurate Electronic Support in HF and V/UHF frequency bands
Remote controlled , unattended V/UHF jammers on the field






*Aselsan MİLKAR-3A3 Electronic Attack System*

MILKAR-3A3 Mobile V/UHF Elektronic Attack System is developed to provide electronic attack against target V/UHF communication systems on various platforms
With this system, target communication systems are blocked or deceived, providing advantage to allied forces on the tactical field







*VURAL Radar Electronic Warfare System consists of Electronic Support and Electronic Attack subsystems*






*EHPOD/EDPOD Electronic Warfare and Electronic Support Pod *

its DRFM technology is optimized as the self-protection pod of the F-16s
The EHPOD System is able to provide users with “considerably more” effective radiated power than the AN/ALQ-211(V)9 Pod in the inventory of Turkish Air Force

EHPOD will enable F-16 to protect itself against air defense elements during joint operations










*60 CCIP modernized F-16C equipped with Aselsan SPEWS-II Self protection Electronic Warfare Suite*

With its radar warning receiver, the SPEWS-II system can detect radar signals coming from homing missiles and warn the jet's pilot. The system's electronic countermeasure capabilities allow it to confuse the signals that enable missiles to find planes and to deceive the missiles by sending signals showing the aircraft in different locations.

The protection against radar-guided missile threats will be especially useful in Turkiye's cross-border operations






*also HAVASOJ stand off Jammer is coming*

The HAVA SOJ system which has superior technological features than the KORAL Land Based Remote Electronic Support/Electronic Attack (KARA SOJ) system will combine many electronic warfare capabilities on an aircraft. There is no other system with this quality known in the world

The HAVA SOJ will be able to detect, identify , deceive and blind enemy communication systems and radars (air defense, early warning, etc ) from 400 km away










*Primitive countries are dreaming about fighting Turkiye .....*

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## dani191

MMM-E said:


> in a conflict you will see what will happen
> 
> S300 Radar lock on Turkish F-16s were during peace time when we did NATO duty
> We did not use any Electronic Warfare System ......
> 
> btw Turkish Armed Forces have tons of weapons to destroy S300s in Crete in a hour


what about s 500 like or arrow 3 like missile that intercept in the space?


----------



## MMM-E

dani191 said:


> what about s 500 like or arrow 3 like missile that intercept in the space?



According to *President of Defence Industry Agency İsmail Demir *
Turkish Ballistic Missile Defense System by 2027


*Turkish Space and Ballistic Missile Defense System Project will leverage Turkiye's breakthroughs in launch, rocket, and control technologies in Space*


Turkiye to kickstart 1st space trials of liquid-propellant rocket engine technology
130km Altitude Test











*Turkiye speeds up works on anti-ballistic missiles*








Turkey speeds up works on critical systems like anti-ballistic missiles


Turkey has stepped up efforts to develop anti-ballistic missile systems, a critical technology owned by few countries.For instance, a leading local...




www.dailysabah.com






Turkey has stepped up efforts to develop anti-ballistic missile systems, a critical technology owned by few countries

In addition to our Hisar and Siper air defense systems will speed up our design and technology development studies for the development of missile defense systems that will eliminate ballistic missiles by engaging in the upper layer

*TUBITAK develops DACS for Ballistic Missile Defense System






So , TURKIYE create its own Air Defense Capability to intercept Fighter Jets , AWACSs , Bombers , Helicopters , UCAVs , Cruise Missiles , Ballistic Missiles*

-- SUNGUR MANPADS in service
-- KORKUT 35mm SPAAG in service
-- HISAR-A low altitude Air Defense System in service
-- HISAR-O medium altitude Air Defense System in service
-- SIPER high altitude Air Defense System enter service
-- GUMS Ballistic Missile Defense System *under development*

-- BOZDOGAN WVR air to air Missile enter service
-- GOKDOGAN BVR air to air Missile enter service
-- GOKHAN RamJet powered long range air to air Missile *under development*

also navalized variants of HISAR and SIPER Missiles will be used on ISTIF class Frigate and TF-2000 class Destroyer

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> S300 Radar lock on Turkish F-16s were during peace time when we did NATO duty


We are still waiting for the....evidence that you will send to NATO.
We always talk about the lock up of 8 Turkish F-16s at the same time and in the FIR Athens.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> We are still waiting for the....evidence that you will send to NATO.
> We always talk about the lock up of 8 Turkish F-16s at the same time and in the FIR Athens.



FIR against only civil aviation and FIR Athens is not Greek Airspace

Turkish F-16s are military Aircrafts and dont give a shit to FIR Athens for civil aviation
and Turkish F-16s were in NATO mission to escort American B-52s in international airspace

The Ministry of Defense send to NATO *the radar traces and images of the Greek harassment of the Turkish jets by the S-300 air defense systems* and according to sources to all 30 allied countries


Defense Minister AKAR accuses Greece of hypocrisy, hostile acts​
*HULUSI AKAR*
Two Greek coast guard boats harassed a civil ro-ro ship (cargo vessel) in international waters, Akar said: “Immediately after the incident, Greek politicians accused Türkiye of aggression. If that is not hypocrisy, then what is it?”












Defense Minister Akar accuses Greece of hypocrisy, hostile acts


Despite Türkiye's efforts to ease tension in the region, Greece continues with its 'provocative actions,' Defense Minister Hulusi Akar said, calling...




www.dailysabah.com






*USA-France use puppet Greece to stop Turkish military operation against PKK/YPG Terrorists in Syria*

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *ADVANCED ELECTRONIC WARFARE SYSTEMS
> 
> 
> 
> Turkiye is one of top 5 Countries in the World in EW technology*
> ( USA , Turkiye , Russia , Israel and The UK )
> 
> 
> *Aselsan KORAL Radar Electronic Warfare System to jam and deceive hostile radars *
> View attachment 878654
> 
> View attachment 878655
> 
> 
> 
> *REDET-II Radar Electronic Warfare System to jam and deceive hostile radars *
> View attachment 878656
> 
> 
> 
> *Aselsan MUKAS Communication Jamming System*
> 
> Effective Electronic Attack in HF and V/UHF frequency bands
> High sensitive and accurate Electronic Support in HF and V/UHF frequency bands
> Remote controlled , unattended V/UHF jammers on the field
> View attachment 878657
> 
> 
> 
> *Aselsan MİLKAR-3A3 Electronic Attack System*
> 
> MILKAR-3A3 Mobile V/UHF Elektronic Attack System is developed to provide electronic attack against target V/UHF communication systems on various platforms
> With this system, target communication systems are blocked or deceived, providing advantage to allied forces on the tactical field
> View attachment 878658
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *VURAL Radar Electronic Warfare System consists of Electronic Support and Electronic Attack subsystems*
> View attachment 878659
> 
> 
> 
> *EHPOD/EDPOD Electronic Warfare and Electronic Support Pod *
> 
> its DRFM technology is optimized as the self-protection pod of the F-16s
> The EHPOD System is able to provide users with “considerably more” effective radiated power than the AN/ALQ-211(V)9 Pod in the inventory of Turkish Air Force
> 
> EHPOD will enable F-16 to protect itself against air defense elements during joint operations
> View attachment 878650
> 
> View attachment 878651
> 
> 
> 
> *60 CCIP modernized F-16C equipped with Aselsan SPEWS-II Self protection Electronic Warfare Suite*
> 
> With its radar warning receiver, the SPEWS-II system can detect radar signals coming from homing missiles and warn the jet's pilot. The system's electronic countermeasure capabilities allow it to confuse the signals that enable missiles to find planes and to deceive the missiles by sending signals showing the aircraft in different locations.
> 
> The protection against radar-guided missile threats will be especially useful in Turkiye's cross-border operations
> View attachment 878652
> 
> 
> 
> *also HAVASOJ stand off Jammer is coming*
> 
> The HAVA SOJ system which has superior technological features than the KORAL Land Based Remote Electronic Support/Electronic Attack (KARA SOJ) system will combine many electronic warfare capabilities on an aircraft. There is no other system with this quality known in the world
> 
> The HAVA SOJ will be able to detect, identify , deceive and blind enemy communication systems and radars (air defense, early warning, etc ) from 400 km away
> View attachment 878661
> 
> View attachment 878660
> 
> 
> 
> *Primitive countries are dreaming about fighting Turkiye .....*


We have seen in Ukraine how efficient was the russian weapons....

Instead of spending nearly 3% of theTurkish GDP for useless weapons, better act to reduce the awfull inflation and give bread to your people.



MMM-E said:


> The Ministry of Defense send to NATO *the radar traces and images of the Greek harassment of the Turkish jets by the S-300 air defense systems* and according to sources to all 30 allied countries


The french Min Def sent to NATO the radar trace of the turkish frigates trying to frighten the french one when it wanted to control a cargo sending banned weapons in Lybia.

The turkish representents got yelled at but USA top brass. Erdogan was quiet for a while.



MMM-E said:


> Defense Minister AKAR accuses Greece of hypocrisy, hostile acts


LOL. 
Only internal Psy Ops to distract the turkish people about meal risen costs. Erdogan economic failure is complete. Last try to hide the chaos....

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> The Ministry of Defense send to NATO *the radar traces and images of the Greek harassment of the Turkish jets by the S-300 air defense systems* and according to sources to all 30 allied countries


Is there an announcement by NATO that it received them, let alone investigate them?

E.g. when the two Turkish frigates (protecting a Turkish smuggling ship) locked the French in Libya, there was a related announcement by NATO that it received the relevant complaint, as well as the proofs.

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> E.g. when the two Turkish frigates (protecting a Turkish smuggling ship) locked the French in Libya, there was a related announcement by NATO that it received the relevant complaint, as well as the proofs.



Greece used Russian weapon S300 against NATO Member Turkiye during NATO mission

now USA has no any right to say anything about S400s in Turkiye ...

thanks to stupid move by Greece

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Greece used Russian weapon S300 against NATO Member Turkiye during NATO mission
> 
> now USA has no any right to say anything about S400s in Turkiye ...
> 
> thanks to stupid move by Greece


 
You didn't answer in that...



Akritas said:


> Is there an announcement by NATO that it received them, let alone investigate them?


----------



## MMM-E

*Turkish Missiles to destroy Air Bases , Jet hangars with Fighter Jets , Air Defense Systems in Greece and Greek Islands*



Turkish missile fire power is the strongest fire power in NATO after USA

-- TRLG-230
-- TRG-300
-- J600T
-- BORA
-- SOM
-- ATMACA
-- KARGI
-- SIMSEK
-- KGK ( 110 km )
-- SDB-IIR ( 110 km )

















































Also hundreds of

-- ATACMS
-- POPEYE
-- SLAM-ER
-- HARM
-- JSOW
-- HARPOON Block-II


----------



## MMM-E

*Anti-Ship Missiles/Bombs to sink Hellenic Navy in a day*


-- 110 km SDB with IIR seeker
-- 110 km HGK-82 with RF seeker
-- 140 km HARPOON Block-II
-- 150 km TRLG-230 laser guided supersonic Missile
-- 150 km HARM anti-radiation Missile
-- 250 km ATMACA - ATMACA-K with IIR and RF seeker
-- 280 km SLAM-ER
-- 280 km SOM with IIR seeker


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Turkish weapons kicked all of you in Syria , Libya and Karabakh ... losers
> 
> Turks have enough money to spend even $100 billion for humanitarian aid including over 3,5 million Syrian refugees in Turkiye
> 
> loser France keep crying
> 
> 
> 
> Bandit France has no any right to stop and control Turkish Ship without Turkiye's permission
> 
> learn about international law
> 
> 
> and France-Russia-The Uae deployed banned weapons in Lybia
> hypocrite French
> 
> 
> 
> ERDOGAN kicked all of you
> therefore you are barking day and night


France will not allow "any disorder to settle" in the eastern Mediterranean









M. Macron : La France ne laissera "s'installer aucun désordre" en Méditerranée orientale - Zone Militaire


Remise en cause de la souveraineté d'Athènes sur certaines îles de la mer Égée, rupture du dialogue avec le gouvernement grec, des forces grecques




www.opex360.com





We are not afraid.



MMM-E said:


> Bandit France has no any right to stop and control Turkish Ship without Turkiye's permission


It was a UN mission. The right was us. Say what you want, as your leader, the UN mission was to control EVERY ships. Including the marvellous turkish delight ones.

***

"We expect Turkey to refrain from verbal escalation and to commit to promoting good neighborly relations," said Peter Stano, spokesman for the EU's foreign policy chief. , Josep Borrell, September 5th.

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> now USA has no any right to say anything about S400s in Turkiye ...


indeed. It costs you the F35 deal. And an upgrade of your now old F16 is blocked by the US Senat.
The turkish air force will loose its fire power with time. A tiger without tooth... 

Congrats Erdogan ! well played !

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> France will not allow "any disorder to settle" in the eastern Mediterranean



Who cares about France ? Nobody
Nobody can enter Turkish EEZ for drilling

and France lost in Libya , Syria , Karabakh and in the Eastern Mediterranean



BON PLAN said:


> We are not afraid.



We are also not afraid




BON PLAN said:


> It was a UN mission. The right was us. Say what you want, as your leader, the UN mission was to control EVERY ships. Including the marvellous turkish delight ones.



Stop lying
There was no any UN mission ... French Frigate was under the NATO's operation Sea Guardian providing support to maritime situational awareness and to maritime counter-terrorism .....

Bandit France tried to stop and control Turkish Ship to support terrorist HAFTAR
France support terrorist HAFTAR to make military coup against UN recognized legal Libyan Government in Tripoli

and Turkish Frigates gave a lesson to bandit France


by international law , without flag Country's permission , Nobody can stop and control Ship




BON PLAN said:


> "We expect Turkey to refrain from verbal escalation and to commit to promoting good neighborly relations," said Peter Stano, spokesman for the EU's foreign policy chief. , Josep Borrell, September 5th.



go and restrain your puppet Greece who provoke Turkiye by illegal actions

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> indeed. It costs you the F35 deal. And an upgrade of your now old F16 is blocked by the US Senat.
> The turkish air force will loose its fire power with time. A tiger without tooth...
> 
> Congrats Erdogan ! well played !




We dont need American controlled flying computer F-35
even without American permission , Turkish F-35 can not take off during a conflict with Greece 


Turkish Air Force never will lose its fire power ... Turks are not sleeping

*Turkiye has its own defense industry *

-- 35 F-16 modernization block30 to block70 standard ( OZGUR project )
-- 163 CCIP modernized F-16s lacks only AESA Radar .... and Turkish AESA Radar is coming
even 163 CCIP modernized F-16s can use 600 km MESA Radar of E-7T AEWCs in BVR combat ( network centric warfare via link16 data link )

-- Turkiye will buy 40 new F-16 block70 or other options from Eurofighter or SU-35 / SU-57

-- HURJET next gen Fighter Jet for CAS mission
to carry anti-ship missiles to turn enemy navy into crap of metal in the Eastern Mediterranean

-- KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet ( first flight 2023 .. in service 2025 )

-- TFX air superiority Fighter Jet ( first flight 2025 .. in service 2029 )

-- also SIPER and S400 Air Defense Systems to turn enemy Fighter Jets into crap of metal

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> 35 F-16 modernization block30 to block70 standard


block 70 ? With what kind of radar my dear? big LOL

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> View attachment 879024
> 
> View attachment 879025
> 
> View attachment 879028


At least Turkey is the world wide champion of wooden scale fighter and ucav !

for potent fighter engine or AESA inboard radar, we have a lot of free time before seeing it.

It takes time to move from turkish delicatessen to AESA radar....

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *Turkiye ( ASELSAN ) has GaN based AESA Radar technology*
> 
> 
> Aselsan GAN based AESA Radar which will be also putted into AKINCI UCAV in 2022
> F-16s and KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet also to use indigenous AESA Radar
> View attachment 879068


lacks a lot of components.... just another good looking wooden scale product.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> lacks a lot of components.... just another good looking wooden scale product.



keep crying and trolling loser who say wooden scale product to ASELSAN which is the one of top defense companies in the world for GaN based AESA Radar , E/O and Electronic Warfare technologies



BON PLAN said:


> block 70 ? With what kind of radar my dear? big LOL




*Turkiye ( ASELSAN ) has GaN based AESA Radar technology*


Aselsan GAN based AESA Radar which will be also putted into AKINCI UCAV in 2022
F-16s and KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet also to use indigenous AESA Radar






Aselsan MURAD GaN based AESA Radar ( 1.000 modules )
Thales RBE2 GAaS based AESA Radar ( 838 modules ) .. Rafale Fighter Jet


Also 600 km Aselsan EIRS early warning AESA Radar for network centric warfare to use by Turkish F-16s

SIPER Air Defense System use Aselsan AESA Radar


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> keep crying and trolling loser who say wooden scale product to ASELSAN which is the one of top defense companies in the world for GaN based AESA Radar , E/O and Electronic Warfare technologies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Turkiye ( ASELSAN ) has GaN based AESA Radar technology*
> 
> 
> Aselsan GAN based AESA Radar which will be also putted into AKINCI UCAV in 2022
> F-16s and KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet also to use indigenous AESA Radar
> View attachment 879070
> 
> 
> 
> Aselsan MURAD GaN based AESA Radar ( 1.000 modules )
> Thales RBE2 GAaS based AESA Radar ( 838 modules ) .. Rafale Fighter Jet
> 
> 
> Also 600 km Aselsan EIRS early warning AESA Radar for network centric warfare to use by Turkish F-16s
> 
> SIPER Air Defense System use Aselsan AESA Radar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 879071


With T/R modules mades in USA... (or Europe... ?)
The rest is only some cooling system and some software.
Even India is able to make such products with T/R modules purchase on the market... It gives you your real level. (I've nothing against India)


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> With T/R modules mades in USA... (or Europe... ?)



*T/R modules also made in Turkiye*

both Gallium Arsenide (GaAs) and Gallium Nitride (GaN) technologies


ASELSAN designs and manufactures technologically critical microwave modules and components in dedicated special areas..... *only a few countries in the world*

-- high performance transmitter
-- transmitter/receiver T/R modules
-- front-end modules
-- filters
-- frequency converters
-- power amplifier modules
-- digital frequency discriminators (DFD)
-- logarithmic video amplifiers (DLVA)
-- monolithic microwave integrated circuits (MMIC)



https://www.aselsan.com.tr/en/capabilities/microwave-products




I am saying again
Turkish ASELSAN is one of top defense companies in the world for GaN based AESA Radar , E/O and Electronic Warfare technologies


*even ASELSAN provided T/R modules to France for Thales Radar in 2015*





__





Aselsan to provide transmitter/receiver modules for Thales radar


Thales has chosen to procure radar transmitter/receiver modules from Aselsan.



www.microwavejournal.com






*also Aselsan quantum well infrared Photodetectors .. *
( only USA,Israel,Turkiye and France in the world )

*-- HgCdTe
-- QWIP
-- InSb
-- InGaAs*







*Our rival is France , but not tiny-weak Greece which develop nothing*





BON PLAN said:


> Even India is able to make such products with T/R modules purchase on the market... It gives you your real level. (I've nothing against India)



Israel gave Radar technology to India

even Indian SWORDFISH AESA Radar is a derivative of the Israeli EL/M-2080 Green Pine long range radar

even India has no its own E/O Systems , using İsraeli and French E/O Systems


*Targeting Pods in the World*

WMD-7 .... China
SAPSAN ... Russia
DAMOCLES ... France
SNIPER ...... Usa
LITENING .... İsrael
ASELPOD ..... Turkiye

Turkish Aselsan ASELPOD Targeting Pod

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## MMM-E

*With the agreement signed in 2021, 36 Aircrafts and 250 Qatari air force personnel were assigned to Konya airbase in Turkiye*



Great response against 24 Greek Rafales

*Turkish F-16s - Qatari Rafales*









The arrangement between Turkiye and Qatar regarding the temporary deployment of Qatari air force personnel and aircrafts in Turkiye has been approved. The regulation of the decision was published in the Official Gazette


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1570494219319644161

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## Akritas

MMM-E said:


> Great response against 24 Greek Rafales


In other words, Qatarian Rafales will make jams, violations of the FIR Athens , dogfights with the Greek jets and overflights over Greek territory?
What dream are you in?

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## MMM-E

Akritas said:


> In other words, Qatarian Rafales will make jams, violations of the FIR Athens , dogfights with the Greek jets and overflights over Greek territory?
> What dream are you in?



Miilitary Aircrafts dont care about the FIR Athens for civil aviation
and FIR Athens is not Greek airspace

only to intercept daydreamer bandits who are trying to steal oil/gas reserves and 150.000+ km2 of area from the Turks in the Eastern Mediterraneaan


btw Qatar buys 36 Rafales , 36 F-15E and 24 Eurofighters ....... we have also allies and brothers

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> btw Qatar buys 36 Rafales , 36 F-15E and 24 Eurofighters ....... we have also *allies and brothers*


with how many Qatar pilots? nearly zero. All these birds are driven by west mercenaries. In case of a real conflict along Turkey they all will leave Qatar forces.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> with how many Qatar pilots? nearly zero. All these birds are driven by west mercenaries. In case of a real conflict along Turkey they all will leave Qatar forces.



No any western mercenaries but full of Qatari Pilots
and Turkish Air Force training Qatari Pilots with high level NATO standard at Konya Air Base


*only 3 Countries in the World ( USA ,Turkiye and Israel )

1 -- USA*
NELLIS Air Force Base is known by the USAF to focus for advanced combat and Electronic Warfare training

Red Flag exercise since 1975


*2 -- TURKIYE *
KONYA Air Force Base is known by the TURAF to focus for advanced combat and Electronic Warfare training

Anatolian Eagle exercise since 2001

The first exercise, Anatolian Eagle 01, was held by TURAF on 18–29 June 2001. As well as Turkiye, USA and Israel participated


*3-- ISRAEL *
OVDA Air Force Base is known by the IAF to focus for advanced combat and Electronic Warfare training

Blue Flag exercise since 2013


*KONYA-TURKIYE*
The Air Defense Electronic Warfare Test and Training Area has been developed for Turkish fighter pilots to receive "Air Defense Electronic Warfare" training as close to reality since 1999

EHTES Air Defense Electronic Warfare Test and Training Area has air defense systems, mostly of Russian origin, such as the following radars and their subsystems

HAWK
Skyguard Sparrow
S-300 PMU
9K330 Tor-M
9K37 Buk-M
9K22 Tunguska
9K33 Osa
2K12 Kub
S-125 Pachora
ZSU 23-4 Shilka










*only American , Turkish and İsraeli Air Forces have this capability in the world*

Greece allowed USA-İsraeli Fighter Jets to train with S300 Air Defense System which is located in Crete

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Qatari Pilots


A Qatari pilot only drive a Lamborghini, or a Testarossa. Not a fighter jet : too dangerous my friend.



MMM-E said:


> only American , Turkish and İsraeli Air Forces have this capability in the world


No. Europe also. MACE exercise.... 








Exercice Otan MACE - RAFALE : The omnirole fighter


L'exercice MACE XIX permet aux Etats membres de l’OTAN de renforcer leurs connaissances des menaces électromagnétiques. Des Rafale se rendent en Slovaquie.




omnirole-rafale.com

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> No. Europe also. MACE exercise....



Dont compare pathetic Europe with USA-Turkiye-İsrael

Europe has no Russian AD Systems for EW combat training


Turkiye has all Soviet-Russian AD Systems for EW combat training

S-300 PMU
9K330 Tor-M
9K37 Buk-M
9K22 Tunguska
9K33 Osa
2K12 Kub
S-125 Pachora
ZSU 23-4 Shilka


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## BON PLAN

Turkish skill :

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1571784156669005824


MMM-E said:


> Dont compare pathetic Europe with USA-Turkiye-İsrael
> 
> Europe has no Russian AD Systems for EW combat training
> 
> 
> Turkiye has all Soviet-Russian AD Systems for EW combat training
> 
> S-300 PMU
> 9K330 Tor-M
> 9K37 Buk-M
> 9K22 Tunguska
> 9K33 Osa
> 2K12 Kub
> S-125 Pachora
> ZSU 23-4 Shilka


Once again your are wrong : there is at least, at least, a S300 for MACE. 
At this occasion, in 2008 I think, a without option Rafale proved to be able to detect and virtually destroeyed a S300 when the dedicated F16 CJ can't. It was during MACE XIII.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Turkish skill :



French skill









BON PLAN said:


> Turkish skill :
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1571784156669005824
> 
> Once again your are wrong : there is at least, at least, a S300 for MACE.
> At this occasion, in 2008 I think, a without option Rafale proved to be able to detect and virtually destroeyed a S300 when the dedicated F16 CJ can't. It was during MACE XIII.



Once again nice story as always 

talking about untalented Belgium, Netherlands , Poland , Slovakia , France , etc


Turkish and İsraeli F-16s proved to be able to detect and destroeyed a S300 
even Turkish TB-2 UCAVs destroyed S300s in real conflict

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## BON PLAN

Seventh Rafale delivered.
It is officially declared operational.


----------



## MMM-E

40 new F-16 block70​79 F-16 modernization to the Viper standard​
The Turkish Ministry of Defense sent a Letter of Request (LoR) to the American government for the acquisition of 40 new F-16C/D Block 70 Viper Fighter Jets as well as the modernization of a total of 80 existing Turkish F-16s to the Viper standard


-- 40 new F-16 block70
-- 79 F-16 modernization to the Viper standard

*F-16 Block70*

-- APG-83 AESA Radar
-- New avionics architecture
-- New mission computer and electronic warfare suite
-- The new Center Pedestal Display (CPD)
-- Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (Auto GCAS)
-- The Night Vision Imaging System
-- The Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System II
-- SNIPER Advanced Targeting Pod
-- IRST (Infrared Search and Track)
-- Conformal fuel tanks
-- Extended structural service life of 12,000 hours
-- General Electric F110-GE-132 Engine rated at 32,500 lbf (144 kN) of afterburning thrust







*The Eurofighter Typhoon option was first time officially mentioned by Presidential Spokesperson İbrahim Kalın on Sep 23, 2022*

Turkiye has brought up the purchase of Eurofighter Typhoon jets, which will not draw any reaction from the NATO against the possibility of the USA's F-16 block70 sale not being realized.

İbrahim Kalın, Turkiye's presidential spokesperson, confirmed the previously reported plan, telling local NTV news channel on 23 September, “We have negotiations with Europe regarding Eurofighter . Turkiye will never be without alternatives.”


*Eurofighter Typhoon*

Captor-E AESA Radar
IRST
METEOR Air to Air Missile











Turkey touts Eurofighter plan, should F-16 talks stall


Turkey has, for the first time, officially pronounced a possible purchase of Eurofighter Typhoons in case if the United States fails to sell Lockheed Martin F-16...



www.janes.com


----------



## MMM-E

*Even Turkish Army modernized M-60TM Tanks are better than Greek Army Leopard-2HEL Tanks



170 Tanks were upgraded to M-60TM *

-- 1.000 hp MTU diesel Engine
-- MG253 120mm Gun
-- RENK 304S Transmission
-- Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
-- Knight fire control system from Elbit Systems
-- The hybrid electric and hydraulic system
-- Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV)
-- The RWR/IR warning system, and tracks from the Merkava IV

-- Close Range Surveillance System (YAMGÖZ)
M-60TM Tanks to have situational awareness in day and night conditions. System includes uncooled thermal camera and color TV camera, and provides a great advantage in threat and target detection and recognition in close/middle range to its user with its 360˚ horizontal field of view in various weather conditions

-- Telescopic Periscope System (TEPES)
It is possible to detect the enemy without being seen to the enemy elements while in the position behind the suture and to make safe surveillance and target detection. Laser distance measurement up to 20 kilometers, Thermal and TV image capture, automatic target tracking, wide surveillance, height can be raised to 2.5 meters with an upgradeable mast

-- Interior Primer Protection (SPALL LINER)
Spall Liner is a kind of FRC material used for lining the interior of vehicles to decrease the risk and the effect of spall generated by attacks on the exterior surface

-- Tank Laser Warning System (TLUS)
-- Tank Driver Vision System (TDVS)
-- Fire Suppression System
-- Smoke Grenade Launchers
-- Air Conditioning System
-- Auxiliary Power Unit and Audible Warning System
-- 12,7mm SARP Stabilized Advanced Remote Weapon Platform
-- PULAT hard kill Active Protection System

And* BITES Beyond Armor Vision System*

The beyond armor vision System can receive Command and Control System data and uses this data to enrich the camera images. While using the system, the personnel wearing augmented reality glasses can directly monitor the vehicle’s surroundings without seeing the armor in whichever direction they turn their head






















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1576886544459128832


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## MMM-E

*TCG Akhisar (P-1220) Offshore Patrol Vessel under construction*


The first Ship is scheduled to be launched in 2023


*Overall length:* 99,56 meters
*Maximum speed:* 24 knots
*Displacement:* 2300 tons
*Range :* 4500 nautical miles

CENK-S AESA Radar
-- 76 mm Gun
-- L-UMTAS Missiles
-- 8 x HISAR-O Air Defense Missiles
-- 8 x ATMACA Anti-Ship Missiles
-- 1 x GOKDENIZ 35mm CIWS


The primary missions of the OPVs to protect the sovereignty rights within the scope of national and international law in low-risk Exclusive Economic Zone and open sea areas

10 HISAR class OPVs will protect Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Even Turkish Army modernized M-60TM Tanks are better than Greek Army Leopard-2HEL Tanks


NO..... are you kidding us? really....




MMM-E said:


> 40 new F-16 block70​79 F-16 modernization to the Viper standard​
> The Turkish Ministry of Defense sent a Letter of Request (LoR) to the American government for the acquisition of 40 new F-16C/D Block 70 Viper Fighter Jets as well as the modernization of a total of 80 existing Turkish F-16s to the Viper standard


The old Joe (Biden) seems OK. But not the US senate..... They found the Erdogan's Turkey far too dangerous and unpredictable. They are right.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> NO..... are you kidding us? really....



I am saying again even Turkish Army modernized M-60TM Tanks are better than Greek Army Leopard-2HEL Tanks

send Greek Army pathetic Leopard-2HEL Tanks for urban warfare and see what will happen


what about Greek Army Leopard-2HEL Tanks ? so old technology

NO hard kill Active Protection System
NO Close Range Surveillance System
NO Telescopic Periscope System
NO Beyond Armor Vision System
NO Remote Weapon Platform


Turkish Army modernized M-60TM Tanks have superior technology

German MTU Engine and RENK 304S Transmission
İsraeli 120 mm Gun , RWR/IR warning systems from the Merkava IV Tank

-- Volkan-M new generation Fire Control System
-- Tank Command Control Combat Information System
-- New Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
-- The hybrid electric and hydraulic system
-- Tank Laser Warning System (TLUS)
-- Tank Driver Vision System (TDVS)
-- Fire Suppression System
-- Smoke Grenade Launchers
-- Air Conditioning System
-- Auxiliary Power Unit and Audible Warning System
-- 12,7mm SARP Stabilized Advanced Remote Weapon Platform
-- PULAT hard kill Active Protection System

Close Range Surveillance System (YAMGÖZ)
Telescopic Periscope System (TEPES)
Interior Primer Protection (SPALL LINER)
Beyond Armor Vision System ( BITES )

What a technology ...

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> The old Joe (Biden) seems OK. But not the US senate..... They found the Erdogan's Turkey far too dangerous and unpredictable. They are right.



Turkiye should say go to hell the US senate and to buy Eurofighter from The UK

and bravo ERDOGAN who protect Turkiye and Turkish People against bandit USA-France and their terrorists/puppets PKK/YPG , FETO , Greece


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Turkish Army modernized M-60TM Tanks have superior technology


We all know your patriotism.

But what about armor? M60 may be destroyed by so many weapons.....



MMM-E said:


> and bravo ERDOGAN who protect Turkiye and Turkish People against bandit USA-France and their terrorists/puppets PKK/YPG , FETO , Greece


The Turkey of Erdogan is not the real Turkey. Only another muslim state, so a foe for the rest of humanity.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> We all know your patriotism.
> 
> But what about armor? M60 may be destroyed by so many weapons.....



You ,Foinikas and Akritas have patriotism and anti-Turkiye feeling that prevents seeing the truth


Turkish Army modernized M-60TM is not basic M-60

New Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
PULAT hard kill Active Protection System








We prefer Turkish M60TM Tank instead of Greek Leopard2HEL Tank for urban warfare


----------



## BON PLAN

Dangerous Turkey....

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1579525879730176000


MMM-E said:


> You ,Foinikas and Akritas have patriotism and anti-Turkiye feeling that prevents seeing the truth
> 
> 
> Turkish Army modernized M-60TM is not basic M-60
> 
> New Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
> PULAT hard kill Active Protection System
> 
> View attachment 886189
> 
> 
> 
> We prefer Turkish M60TM Tank instead of Greek Leopard2HEL Tank for urban warfare


It remains a old gen MBT, not brillant at its time so no more potent now. It is more a rubbish solution to increase the number of MBT than an efficient solution.

France can do the same by adding ERA on AMX30 and saying it's better than a Leclerc.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> France can do the same by adding ERA on AMX30 and saying it's better than a Leclerc.



not only New Explosive Reactive Armor ERA

but also PULAT hard kill Active Protection System





-- German MTU Engine and RENK 304S Transmission
-- İsraeli 120 mm Gun , RWR/IR warning systems from the Merkava IV Tank

-- Volkan-M new generation Fire Control System
-- Tank Command Control Combat Information System
-- Tank Laser Warning System (TLUS)
-- Tank Driver Vision System (TDVS)
-- Fire Suppression System
-- Smoke Grenade Launchers
-- Air Conditioning System
-- Auxiliary Power Unit and Audible Warning System
-- 12,7mm SARP Stabilized Advanced Remote Weapon Platfor

Close Range Surveillance System (YAMGÖZ)
Telescopic Periscope System (TEPES)
Interior Primer Protection (SPALL LINER)
Beyond Armor Vision System ( BITES )


LECLERC is so old technology which has no capability for urban warfare


----------



## BON PLAN

*Έλληνας πιλότος για Rafale: ”Εχουμε πια στα χέρια μας ένα game changer που μπορεί να εξουδετερώσει οποιαδήποτε απειλή”*
*Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

Greek pilot on Rafale: "We now have in our hands a game changer that can neutralise any threat"*

Greece's Armed Forces are monitoring everything. That is why both ground and air assets are in a surveillance role and are expected to monitor every move of Turkish ships in the Aegean Sea. Of course, the new Rafale fighter jets have their own special role, which are expected to be the big nightmare of the Turkish air force! With each passing day the Greek fliers are learning more and more about the French super weapons and getting used to flying with them.

"Our goal is to take this tool and take it even further and once we get the orders to use it regularly we will do it 100%. With this supercarrier the Air Force has become even more powerful and can make a difference in the air compared to any other aircraft," an Air Force pilot tells Alpha who was at Squadron 332, code-named "Falcon", where every day they discover the Rafale's capabilities in the air.

"We now have in our hands a game changer that can neutralize any threat. What we call: game over threat! The Rafale pleasantly surprises us with its capabilities and on this French blast, the Greek Air Force is building the future of the next decade," says a gunner of 332 Squadron.

As for the Meteor missile carried by the Rafale, it is probably the best weapon system currently available: "The chances of an enemy fighter surviving within 60 km are zero. It is probably one of the best missiles and can make the difference compared to any other new generation weapon system. It has a different engine and a different operating philosophy than any other older missile, making it irresistible in a demanding battle."

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> LECLERC is so old technology which has no capability for urban warfare


LOOOOL.
Your futur Altay MBT is built on Korean K2 technology which is a copy of Leclerc MBT.



MMM-E said:


> not only New Explosive Reactive Armor ERA
> 
> but also PULAT hard kill Active Protection System


Those are so potent technology that russian MBT are suffering hundreds loss in Ukrainia.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> LOOOOL.
> Your futur Altay MBT is built on Korean K2 technology which is a copy of Leclerc MBT.



K2 and ALTAY use German 120mm gun technology and nothing to do with old LECLERC

Both K2 and ALTAY are superior to old LECLERC
even modernized M-60TM is superior to LECLERC in urban warfare


ALTAY Tank mass production start in 2023

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Greek pilot on Rafale: "We now have in our hands a game changer that can neutralise any threat"




*Game changer S400 Air Defense System*


Turkiye bought 192 Air Defense Missiles to turn 24 Greek Rafales into crap of metal

Greek Rafales can not flight even over the Aegean

*48N6E3 Missile *
speed : mach 5,9
range : 250 km

*40N6E Missile*
speed : mach 3,5
range : 380 km

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## serenity

how is K2 a copy of Leclerc. Idiot. Leclerc is good but K2 makes Leclerc look like a Lada compared to a Mercedes.

If Leclerc is stick figures, K2 is 3D animation. Just leagues beyond Leclerc.

The only similarity (which le french calls copy immediately) is that K2 also uses bustle autoloader. On engine, suspension, APS, armor, composites, and electronics, K2 is two generations ahead. In this similarity case then all airbus are copies of boeing and all dassault Mirage are copies of Convair F-106.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> The chances of an enemy fighter surviving within 60 km are zero. It is probably one of the best missiles and can make the difference compared to any other new generation weapon system. It has a different engine and a different operating philosophy than any other older missile, making it irresistible in a demanding battle."



100 km Turkish SIPER Block-1 air defense missile to block Greek Rafales
No fly zone over the Islands which are 2-10-30 km away from Turkiye
....... nowhere to hide and nowhere to run .......

GAME OVER for day dreamer Greeks-French

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> K2 and ALTAY use German 120mm gun technology and nothing to do with old LECLERC


Once again, you write without knowing.

What means "old" ?

The 120mm gun of Leclerc uses the same shells than the german Leo2, but has a slightly better speed impulse (> 1850m/s).

Just have a look to K2 : same number oh wheels, 6, when the standart is 7. Same number of pax, 3, when standart is 4. Same weight class, 55 to 56T, when the standart is more 60 to 62T, same overall look, same autolader (a full copy of the frenc one). 

You know absolutely nothing about the Leclerc armor. The UAE and SA fight in Yemen : a lot of Abrams lost. Just one driver killed in a Leclerc and the tank was not lost.



MMM-E said:


> Both K2 and ALTAY are superior to old LECLERC


full conjecture. About Altay it is a product non in production, so impossible to say it is a good or bad product.



MMM-E said:


> even modernized M-60TM is superior to LECLERC in urban warfare


Another conjecture.



MMM-E said:


> ALTAY Tank mass production start in 2023


Always "next year".... 

So next time write about it when the first full squad will be FOC. It will not be in 2023.



serenity said:


> how is K2 a copy of Leclerc. Idiot. Leclerc is good but K2 makes Leclerc look like a Lada compared to a Mercedes.
> 
> If Leclerc is stick figures, K2 is 3D animation. Just leagues beyond Leclerc.
> 
> The only similarity (which le french calls copy immediately) is that K2 also uses bustle autoloader. On engine, suspension, APS, armor, composites, and electronics, K2 is two generations ahead. In this similarity case then all airbus are copies of boeing and all dassault Mirage are copies of Convair F-106.


Leclerc is the first 3rd gen MBT.
the 4th gen is not born.
So stop your bull shit and read my previous post about how the K2 is a copy of the french MBT.


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> 100 km Turkish SIPER Block-1 air defense missile to block Greek Rafales
> No fly zone over the Islands which are 2-10-30 km away from Turkiye
> ....... nowhere to hide and nowhere to run .......
> 
> GAME OVER for day dreamer Greeks-French
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 886596
> 
> View attachment 886598
> 
> View attachment 886597
> 
> View attachment 886610


Why a SAM cover when all year long it is the Turkish fighters that want to enter the Greek airspace ?

Why such a SAM cover if your air force is so strong ? (your awacs are so useless? your pilots so unskilled? your F16 so old fashioned ?)

If the russian made SAM were so potent, why so many are destroyed in Ukraine?


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Another conjecture.



Old LECLERC is so trash in urban warfare ... 

3rd generation LECLERC is from 1990s
The next genetat,on K2 and ALTAY from 2010s

LECLER has no capability even to fire smart Top-Attack Munition which is a fire-and-forget, top-attack anti-tank munition with an effective operating range up to 8 km

K2 and ALTAY can destroy LECLERC from 8 km away
also both K2 and ALTAY have superior sensors ( millimeter band radar, infrared and radiometer )


*Old LECLERC Tank *

NO hard kill Active Protection System
NO Close Range Surveillance System
NO Telescopic Periscope System
NO Beyond Armor Vision System
NO Remote Weapon Platform
NO Camera
NO Sensor fusion


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Always "next year"....
> 
> So next time write about it when the first full squad will be FOC. It will not be in 2023.



It will be in 2023 with Korean Engine ( engine problem solved )










BON PLAN said:


> Why a SAM cover when all year long it is the Turkish fighters that want to enter the Greek airspace ?




Its international airspace ..
liar Greeks use 10nm airspace over Islands while 6nm territorial water and air space









BON PLAN said:


> Why such a SAM cover if your air force is so strong ? (your awacs are so useless? your pilots so unskilled? your F16 so old fashioned ?)
> 
> If the russian made SAM were so potent, why so many are destroyed in Ukraine?



No any S400 losing in Ukranian war ....
even S400 has the longest kill record in the wold .. ( Russian S400 in Belarus shot down Ukranian SU-27 over Kiev from 150+ km away


Why Greece bought Rafale ?
if Greek air force is so strong ? Greek pilots so unskilled? their F16 so old fashioned ?

because in 2020 , Turkish F-16 Pilots kicked Greek F-16 Pilots over the Eastern Mediterranean


----------



## MMM-E

*TAYFUN ( Typhoon ) Ballistic Missile test firing carried out this morning ( 561 km )*



TAYFUN ( Typhoon ) Ballistic Missile hit the target from 561 km away within 458 second


Turkish TAYFUN ( Typhoon ) Ballistic Missile can hit all Air Bases in Greece

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Greek pilots so unskilled? their F16 so old fashioned ?
> 
> because in 2020 , Turkish F-16 Pilots kicked Greek F-16 Pilots over the Eastern Mediterranean


The first F16 shooted down in dog fight in the world was a turkish one, piloted by a Lt colonel and a captain... in 1996.... and shooted by a greek M2000 piloted by a lieutenant.

Greek lieutenant skill >> Turkish Lt Colonel skill ..... (sorry)









Incident gréco-turc du 8 octobre 1996 — Wikipédia







fr.wikipedia.org

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## Sapei

BON PLAN said:


> The first F16 shooted down in dog fight in the world was a turkish one, piloted by a Lt colonel and a captain... in 1996.... and shooted by a greek M2000 piloted by a lieutenant.
> 
> Greek lieutenant skill >> Turkish Lt Colonel skill ..... (sorry)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Incident gréco-turc du 8 octobre 1996 — Wikipédia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> fr.wikipedia.org


you must be a moron to count an accident as a win. both sides engage regularly in mock dog fights. In this case greek pilots f***** up and by error launched a missile.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> The first F16 shooted down in dog fight in the world was a turkish one, piloted by a Lt colonel and a captain... in 1996.... and shooted by a greek M2000 piloted by a lieutenant.





Turkish F-16 was unarmed ... that's your cowardly mentality

You can attack on only unarmed Turks as like when the Ottoman Army was banned in 1918 and French+British+İtalians+Greeks+Armenians together attacked unarmed Turks in 1919

Turks bought weapons from Russians and kicked all of you in 1922

*İf Turkish pilot wanted , he would kill the Greek pilot*








*in 1992*
during a dogfight with the Turkish F-16 over the Aegean, the Mirage fighter jet crashed

and Greek pilot Nikolaos Sialmas died

*in 2006*
during the dogfight where the pilots were pushing their limits, 1 Turkish and 1 Greek F-16 trying to unlock missiles to gain an advantage over each other. as the plane crashed into the waters of the Aegean Sea

and Greek Pilot Kostas İliakis died

*in 2018*
The Greek Air Force's Mirage 2000 Fighter jet crashed during the interception role against the Turkish F-16 over the Aegean

and Greek Pilot Giorgos Baltadoros died



in 0:42 sec
Turkish F-16 pilot says damn ! Greek fighter jet fell into the sea during a doghfight





Turkish F-16 Pilot says I am saddened by the death of a colleague ( Greek pilot ) like this.

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## BON PLAN

Sapei said:


> you must be a moron to count an accident as a win. both sides engage regularly in mock dog fights. In this case greek pilots f***** up and by error launched a missile.


LOL. The accident thesis was said after the incident so as no one loose face. Reality is not politic.
Do you really understand that a pilot flying with war ready weapons align its wepon system on the foe by error, open by error the safety and press fire once again by error ? 
You must be a moron to understand this fake news.



MMM-E said:


> Turkish F-16 was unarmed ... that's your cowardly mentality


Of course, of course. And the turkish pilot drive its plane with one hand in the back and a headband on the eyes.....


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> that's your cowardly mentality


As your extermination of civilian armenians ?


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> As your extermination of civilian armenians ?



extermination of civilian armenians ? maybe in your lies
Millions of Ottoman Armenian population in USA,Canada,Argentina,France,Russia,Lebanon,Syria,İran,etc now

on the other hand when Turks fought against French,Russians,Italians,Greeks,Serbs,etc

France-Russia backed traitor Armenians killed over 500.000 Ottoman muslim population ( Turks,Kurds , etc ) between 1894 and 1915 

even around 200.000 Armenians joined Russian Army to fight against the Turks 

Turks only exterminated dream of Greater Armenia in Anatolia



BON PLAN said:


> Of course, of course. And the turkish pilot drive its plane with one hand in the back and a headband on the eyes.....



Yes of course
Turkish F-16 was unarmed .... if you know nothing about it ,,, shut up and go to play computer game

Turkiye lost only 1 pilot .. Greece lost 3 Fighter jet pilots and 3 Helicopter officers

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Turkish F-16 was unarmed ....


some evidence? 

Because in this case your are fools to test your prefered foe on the field. You play, you loose. A life lesson.

And it's also a proof that Magic 2 missile is potent, even against F16 flares.


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> some evidence?
> 
> Because in this case your are fools to test your prefered foe on the field. You play, you loose. A life lesson.
> 
> And it's also a proof that Magic 2 missile is potent, even against F16 flares.



Turkish F-16D was unarmed in training mission

Turkiye always send only F-16C for dogfight with the Hellenic Air Force Fighter Jets

Mirage2000 is shit in a conflict ..
Turkish F-16 easy can shot down it from long distance with AIM-120 BVR missile

but that was in peace time and during a training mission
Greeks are so cowards and only attacking unarmed F-16D

Turkish pilots many times locked Greek Fighter Jets but Turks never fired missiles on Greek jets in peace time


Turkiye lost 1 Pilot .. ( Nail Erdogan )
Greece lost 3 Pilots ( Nikolaos Sialmas , Kostas İliakis and Giorgos Baltadoros )

*and in 1996 Turkiye gave a lesson to Greece*
during the mission Turkiye used Electronic Warfare attack on Greek Helicopter over the Island and Greek Helicopter crashed
3 Greek officers on the Helicopter died
(Christodoulos Karathanasis, Panagiotis Vlahakos, and Ektoras Gialopsos).

and Greek admiral Hristos Limberis resigned in 1996


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Mirage2000 is shit in a conflict ..
> Turkish F-16 easy can shot down it from long distance with AIM-120 BVR missile


big LOL another time.
Fact is that no M2000 was ever destroyed by another bird in air to air combat, where the first F16 shooted was yours, by a M2000. Just fact Bro.



MMM-E said:


> Turkish pilots many times locked Greek Fighter Jets but Turks never fired missiles on Greek jets in peace time


Inded, your prefered use 2 F16 to shoot a unarmed russian Su24 in 2015....


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> big LOL another time.
> Fact is that no M2000 was ever destroyed by another bird in air to air combat, where the first F16 shooted was yours, by a M2000. Just fact Bro.



Yes unarmed F-16D in a traning mission




BON PLAN said:


> Inded, your prefered use 2 F16 to shoot a unarmed russian Su24 in 2015....



Russians used Syrian AD Systems to shoot a unarmed Turkish RF-4 in 2012


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Yes unarmed F-16D in a traning mission


A training mission in a disputed airspace ? Are you kidding us?
They tried, they failed. It's as simple as that my proud Turkish forumer.



MMM-E said:


> Russians used Syrian AD Systems to shoot a unarmed Turkish RF-4 in 2012


Poor turkish army.... Do you have some weapons to fit on your birds or are you so money short you only have mock up?

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> A training mission in a disputed airspace ? Are you kidding us?
> They tried, they failed. It's as simple as that my proud Turkish forumer.



that was in international airspace

Greek Islands have both 6nm for territorial water and air space
but Greece says Islands have 6nm territorial water and 10 nm air space

a nonsense claim that has no other precedent in the world




BON PLAN said:


> Poor turkish army.... Do you have some weapons to fit on your birds or are you so money short you only have mock up?



learn about military before talking

RF-4 is an unarmed photographic reconnaissance Aircraft ... so defenceless

Turkish F-16Cs equipped with most modern EW Suite , link16 , and HARM anti-radiation Missile ... also JHMCS Helmet Mounted Cueing System with AIM-9x and AIM-120C7 air to air missiles to kick enemy Fighter Jets and AD Systems

French RAFALE doesnt have this capability ( Helmet Mounted Cueing System )


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> French RAFALE doesnt have this capability ( Helmet Mounted Cueing System )


False. Qatar and India Rafale, at least, are fitted with.


----------



## Titanium100

I don't think this thread even does Turkey a favor..

I mean come on? Why would you compare Turkey with tiny Greece? Are you out of your mind and in which ways are they comparable?

I could understand if it was Germany, France, Egypt, UK, KSA, Iran, Pakistan, Japan, South Korea, Indonesia


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> False. Qatar and India Rafale, at least, are fitted with.



I am talking about French Rafales which are without Helmet Mounted Cueing System


----------



## White and Green with M/S

@waz @The Eagle @LeGenD please close this thread open by @MMM-E

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## MMM-E

White and Green with M/S said:


> @waz @The Eagle @LeGenD please close this thread open by @MMM-E



keep crying loser troll team
my thread doesnt violate any forum rule but kicking greek wet dreams


----------



## White and Green with M/S

MMM-E said:


> keep crying loser


YOUR HATE SPEECH DOESN'T BOTHER ME AND YOU'RE REPORTED FOR YOUR NONSENSE

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## MMM-E

White and Green with M/S said:


> YOUR HATE SPEECH DOESN'T BOTHER ME AND YOU'RE REPORTED FOR YOUR NONSENSE



even I did not say anything about you here , until you came and terrorized my thread with your hate speech

YOU'RE REPORTED FOR YOUR NONSENSE and terrorize thread


----------



## White and Green with M/S

MMM-E said:


> even I did not say anything about you here unti you came and terrorized my thread with your hate speech
> 
> YOU'RE REPORTED FOR YOUR NONSENSE


Dude you repeating same stuff again and again we already knows that what's is the purpose of this thread AGAIN PRAISING TURKISH MILITARY INDUSTRY 😆

WHAT LOW LIFE YOU HAVE



MMM-E said:


> even I did not say anything about you here unti you came and terrorized my thread with your hate speech
> 
> YOU'RE REPORTED FOR YOUR NONSENSE


Dude you repeating same stuff again and again we already knows that what's is the purpose of this thread AGAIN PRAISING TURKISH MILITARY INDUSTRY 😆

WHAT LOW LIFE YOU HAVE

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## MMM-E

White and Green with M/S said:


> Dude you repeating same stuff again and again we already knows that what's is the purpose of this thread AGAIN PRAISING TURKISH MILITARY INDUSTRY 😆
> 
> WHAT LOW LIFE YOU HAVE



You have low life to terrorize my threads 24/7 since 2021
same false flager troll team Foinikas , retaxis , Iblini , White and Green with M/S and others

if you dont like my threads then dont visit

PDF is military forum and my threads hurts all anti-Turkiye jealous troll team


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## White and Green with M/S

MMM-E said:


> You have low life to terrorize my threads 24/7 since 2021
> 
> PDF is military forum and my threads hurts all anti-Turkiye jealous troll team


LOL YOUR OWN COUNTRYMEN ARE TO IGNORE YOU IN VARIOUS TURKISH MILITARY THREAD STARTED BY YOU POSTING A PICS AND SPECIFICATIONS AGAIN ANDAGAIN DOESN'T BRING YOU SOBERTY/ SANE LEVEL LIKE OTHER TURKISH MEMBERS HERE

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## MMM-E

White and Green with M/S said:


> LOL YOUR OWN COUNTRYMEN ARE TO IGNORE YOU IN VARIOUS TURKISH MILITARY THREAD STARTED BY YOU POSTING A PICS AND SPECIFICATIONS AGAIN ANDAGAIN DOESN'T BRING YOU SOBERTY/ SANE LEVEL LIKE OTHER TURKISH MEMBERS HERE



false flager troll team

I dont care about anti-Erdogan loser team and I ignore all of them
I just sharing Turkish military projects ..

not me but your false flager troll team running to terrorize my threads 24/7 ....


----------



## White and Green with M/S

MMM-E said:


> false flager troll team
> 
> I dont care about anti-Erdogan loser team and I ignore all of them
> 
> not me but your false flager troll team running to terrorize my threads 24/7 ....


LOL ME OR ANYONE NOT AGAINST TURKEY AND ERDOGAN BUT WE ARE AGAINST YOUR STUPIDITY AND FALSEHOOD THINKING LOL

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## Akritas

Titanium100 said:


> I don't think this thread even does Turkey a favor..
> 
> I mean come on? Why would you compare Turkey with tiny Greece? Are you out of your mind and in which ways are they comparable?
> 
> I could understand if it was Germany, France, Egypt, UK, KSA, Iran, Pakistan, Japan, South Korea, Indonesia


You forget Russia, Italy, Spain, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Australia.

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## MMM-E

*ALTAY Tank will delivered to the Turkish Army in 2023*


BMC CEO Murat Yalçıntaş and BMC Defense General Manager Mehmet Karaaslan


It was decided to start mass production with the Power Group supplied from South Korea

New ALTAY is another Tank from 9 years ago design
This took us quite a while. It is ready now and we will deliver 2 of 100 ALTAY Tanks to the Turkish Armed Forces in 2023

Turkish Army will test 2 ALTAY Tanks . After approval
We will give the remaining 98 Tanks ( 8 per month ) within 12 months

The most modern Tank in the region














BMC Yetkilileri: "ALTAY Tankı 2023'te Teslim Edilecek"


BMC CEO'su Murat Yalçıntaş ve BMC Savunma Genel Müdürü Mehmet Karaaslan, ALTAY Tankı ile ilgili olarak Habertürk'ten Fatih Altaylı'nın sorularını yanıtladı.




www.savunmasanayist.com

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## MMM-E

Titanium100 said:


> I could understand if it was Germany, France, Egypt, UK, KSA, Iran, Pakistan, Japan, South Korea, Indonesia



Only Greece is dreaming about fighting against Turkiye
and we show what about daydreamer Greece




Titanium100 said:


> I mean come on? Why would you compare Turkey with tiny Greece? Are you out of your mind and in which ways are they comparable?




*Turkiye has better equipment quality and quantity ... Greece not even close*


Greece is so weak and tiny ..
so easy to destroy Greek Navy , Jet Hangars , AD Systems in 24 hours

Turkish Armed Forces is in top 4 in NATO
( great urban and 4th gen hybrid warfare experience , great technology , defense industry , great fire power , perfect special forces and high disciplined brave soldiers )


Greece has only 25 PHZ-2000 Howitzers
Turkiye has its own 350+154 T-155 Howitzers

Greece has only 40 km R-70 unguided MLRS
Turkiye has its own 40-70-120 km TRLG-122 , TRLG-230 and TRG-300 guided MLRS

Greece has only 165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile
Turkiye has its own 150-280-850 km YILDIRIM ,BORA and TUFAN Ballistic Missiles
Turkiye has also 165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile

Greece has no Land based Cruise Missile
Turkiye has its own 280 km KARA-ATMACA based Cruise Missile

Greece has no Land based anti-ship Missile
Turkiye has its own ATMACA-K land based anti-ship Missile

Greece has no Land based EW Systems
Turkiye has its own KORAL , REDET-II , VURAL , MILKAR-A3 , SANCAK Land based EW Systems

Greece has no 5th gen Anti-Tank Missile
Turkiye has its own OMTAS and KARAOK 5th gen Anti-Tank Missiles

Greece has no AESA Early Warning Radar
Turkiye has its own 600 km EIRS AESA Early Warning Radar

Greece has no UCAV fleet
Turkiye has its own 200+ TB-2 , ANKA-S , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI UCAVs

Greece has no Air refueling Tanker
Turkiye has 7 Boeing KC-135 Air refueling Tankers

Greece has no Kamikaze Drone
Turkiye has its own SIMSEK and KARGI anti-radiation - Kamikaze Drones

Greece has 4 R-99 AEWCS
Turkiye has superior 4 Boeing E-7T AEWC

Greece has only 5 Anti-Submarine Warfare Aircrafts
Turkiye has 12 Anti-Submarine Warfare Aircrafts

Greece has no strategic transport Aircraft
Turkiye has 10 Airbus A400M strategic transport Aircrafts

Greece has only 23 transport Aircrafts
Turkiye has 84 transport Aircrafts

Greece has 90 SCALP air launched Cruise Missile
Turkiye has 400 SOM , SLAM-ER and POPEYE Cruise Missile

Greece has PATRIOT , S300 , TOR AD Systems
Turkiye has superior S400 , HISAR-0 , SIPER AD Systems

Greece has only 28 AH-64 Attack Helicopters
Turkiye has 83 T-129 and 10 AH-1W Super Cobra Attack Helicopters

Greece has 45 NH-90 and CHINOOK Utility Helicopters
Turkiye has 250+ Sikorsky Black Hawk ,CHINOOK and AS-532 Utility Helicopters


Greece has no Light Aircraft Carrier
Turkiye has TCG ANADOLU Light Aircraft Carrier

Greece has no Corvette
Turkiye has 4 ADA class stealth Corvette

Greece has 13 Frigates armed with 208 SAMs
Turkiye has 16 Frigates armed with 672 SAMs

even Iam not talking about upcoming Turkish military projects within 3 years

*Greece buys 24 Rafales ... nothing else to threat against the Turkish Armed Forces

and 24 Rafales can not win a war ....*


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> *ALTAY Tank will delivered to the Turkish Army in 2023*
> 
> 
> BMC CEO Murat Yalçıntaş and BMC Defense General Manager Mehmet Karaaslan
> 
> 
> It was decided to start mass production with the Power Group supplied from South Korea
> 
> New ALTAY is another Tank from 9 years ago design
> This took us quite a while. It is ready now and we will deliver 2 of 100 ALTAY Tanks to the Turkish Armed Forces in 2023
> 
> Turkish Army will test 2 ALTAY Tanks . After approval
> We will give the remaining 98 Tanks ( 8 per month ) within 12 months
> 
> The most modern Tank in the region
> View attachment 888240
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BMC Yetkilileri: "ALTAY Tankı 2023'te Teslim Edilecek"
> 
> 
> BMC CEO'su Murat Yalçıntaş ve BMC Savunma Genel Müdürü Mehmet Karaaslan, ALTAY Tankı ile ilgili olarak Habertürk'ten Fatih Altaylı'nın sorularını yanıtladı.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.savunmasanayist.com


Nice looking beast.



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye has better equipment quality and quantity ... Greece not even close


Quantity, sure. Quality not really, in hard and in soldiers training.
Greece have unrivaled (so far) Rafale.
Greece secured F16V upgrade. It's all but not made for Turkey.
Greece will probably ordered some F35. Cold case for Turkey.



MMM-E said:


> Greece has only 165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile


Just a small call to Joe Biden and they will have the 300km model. Be sure.

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> and 24 Rafales can not win a war ....


They can prevent a Turkish air domination. And no modern war is won without air dominance.
These 24 are only the beginning. I see a final between 36 and 48 Rafale. Add 20 to 40 F35. F16V in the squad soon...
More than enough to halt your numerous but old fashioned air force. And specially in a defense posture, because the aggressiv side is not Greece.


----------



## sami_1

MMM-E said:


> *ALTAY Tank will delivered to the Turkish Army in 2023*
> 
> 
> BMC CEO Murat Yalçıntaş and BMC Defense General Manager Mehmet Karaaslan
> 
> 
> It was decided to start mass production with the Power Group supplied from South Korea
> 
> New ALTAY is another Tank from 9 years ago design
> This took us quite a while. It is ready now and we will deliver 2 of 100 ALTAY Tanks to the Turkish Armed Forces in 2023
> 
> Turkish Army will test 2 ALTAY Tanks . After approval
> We will give the remaining 98 Tanks ( 8 per month ) within 12 months
> 
> The most modern Tank in the region
> View attachment 888240
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BMC Yetkilileri: "ALTAY Tankı 2023'te Teslim Edilecek"
> 
> 
> BMC CEO'su Murat Yalçıntaş ve BMC Savunma Genel Müdürü Mehmet Karaaslan, ALTAY Tankı ile ilgili olarak Habertürk'ten Fatih Altaylı'nın sorularını yanıtladı.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.savunmasanayist.com









Ha-ha-ha-always dishonesty in translation or publishing incorrect news has a bad effect after distorting the inks.


The article talks about that it will be delivered at the end of 2023
The number of 2 forms for the examination to continue for two years
The start of production in 2025, and this is excellent for a simple reason. The idea of the project was in 2000, the first contract was signed in 2008, and production was supposed to take place after 54 months, meaning that production was supposed to take place in 2014, now production will start in 2025

This is part of the article in English

That is, the translation of the article, and therefore what a reminder, as usual, amplifying and promoting Turkish capabilities that do not exist

" Field Tests to be Performed While in TAF Inventory

Providing information from Altay, General Manager of BMC Defense Mehmet Karaaslan said, “We will deliver 2 prototypes to the Turkish Armed Forces in 2023. These will be tested in field conditions by the TAF.” is in the statement.

As it will be remembered, “ What will the process be when ALTAY is ready for mass production? In my article titled “, I emphasized that ALTAY should be tested for 1 to 2 years after it is ready for mass production, and I stated that the tank could enter the inventory in 2025 at best. However, taking the tank into inventory before field tests and performing these tests while in inventory naturally shortens this period.

On the other hand, field tests of the existing ALTAY prototypes were carried out jointly by Otokar and TAF personnel. Many shots were fired during the tests.
This is all in the field of optimism, the success of the merger, and the absence of problems in the Korean engine. There is simply no real confirmation. It is talk about the future. "


As for the Greek side







Speaking of facts, Greece is starting to get a 200 Marder A3/5

they claim to be a mix of block's, anyway the one's we get are totally overhauled and upgraded.
Example vehicles will carry next generation gunner thermal camera even more advanced compared with Leopard 2HEL who have installed OPHELIOS.

You will also develop them locally before 2025
The first stage of the actual production of 205 armored Lynx has also begun
The Greece will have completed the upgrade of existing LEO2A4 in the most modern versions of tanks.

By 2025 Greece will have completed the large-scale modernization of its tanks programs. It is about 190 Leopard type 1 tanks, and 183 Leopard type 2 tanks.

Greece is also negotiating more tanks, both new and used, from Germany and

Also, Germany, in need of rapid production of tanks and armored vehicles, will give Greece more work to produce Leopard tanks for the European market.
Unusual move: KMW explores Leopard tank production in Greece




This provides more exposure and funding
https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/...w-explores-leopard-tank-production-in-greece/








Unusual move: KMW explores Leopard tank production in Greece


German company Krauss-Maffei Wegmann [KMW] is exploring the Balkans as a destination for new production facilities for its Leopard tank. It is about Greece.




bulgarianmilitary.com





Greece wants more tanks, as it is negotiating with Norway and Spain over Leopard 2 A4 tanks to be upgraded locally

And with a new deal of Leopard 2 A7+ tanks
Thus, the years until 2025 are more than enough to develop the Greek tanks and armored vehicles to meet Turkish dreams

There is good news Pakistan wants to buy a second-hand Greek F-16, believed to be the F-16 Block 30
Greece will respond to Pakistan's request to provide financing for the first batch of F-35 purchases






The Ukrainian-Russian war brings economic and military benefits to Greece, as it gets rid of old armored vehicles with more efficient armored vehicles at no cost and provides business volume for the Greek industry in favor of production and export of German tanks.




With this, Greece will have 1,200 American armored vehicles
Its old armored vehicles of all models fly
It produces new armored vehicles and tanks to protect its islands and economic areas. Europe is bound by the blood of Greece in order to prevent the Turks from any Turkish hostile programs against Greece, its wealth and islands.







Some provide golden opportunities through colonial and hostile policies to develop the military capabilities of other countries and give justifications to impede their national defense projects
Cyprus is now developing its armaments
Greece is improving economically and reaping the benefits from the high cost of energy and providing financing for sufficient armament to defend its islands and lands. As for the delusional calculations of some and the illusory superiority, it will not benefit them because it gradually collapses.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> They can prevent a Turkish air domination. And no modern war is won without air dominance.



Do you think Turkiye has nothing ?

Turkiye has 236 F-16 Fighter Jets and 192 S400 Air Defense Missiles ...
also 100 km SIPER Air Defense Missile enter service as of december 2022

*so enough to block all Aegean ... *


and KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet make maiden flight in the first quarter of 2023

and Turkish Ballistic - Cruise Missiles can hit Rafales even in Jet Hangars


keep dreaming with Rafales ....

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## MMM-E

sami_1 said:


> Ha-ha-ha-always dishonesty in translation or publishing incorrect news has a bad effect after distorting the inks.



Daydreamer little boy again in action .. dreaming about weak and tiny Greece with his lies

go and learn about the Turkish Defense Industry then come and dream about weak and tiny Greece


200 Marder A3/5 ? so funny what an ignorant troll team

Turkiye even export 1.000 AFV , IFV , light Tank to dozens of Countries
Turkiye has its own defense Industry to produce everything for the Turkish Army

even 200+ TB-2 , ANKA-S , AKSUNGUR , AKINCI UCAVs easly can destroy 200 Marder A3/5 in a day ... 


Thanks to Great Turkish Industry

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## sami_1

The Greek Air Force is preparing an unhappy surprise for the Turkish Air Force, which is to pressure America, which is committed to Greece's security, to agree to integrate European METEOR missiles into the Greek F-16 block 72 aircraft, as well as IRIS-T missiles
The missile is already working on RAFALE and working on the F-35, which Greece will speed up its contract if Turkey succeeds in contracting 40 F-16 BLOCK 72
to maintain its air superiority


Greece is one of 10 countries
India Looks to Export BrahMos NG





Which will get the BrahMos NG missile to be integrated on the French Rafale fighters, and Greece changes the rules of the game not only with eager fighters, but with superior munitions

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## Sohail Qamar Photography

TAI Hürkuş


----------



## MMM-E

*Turkiye bought Game Changer S400 AD System with 192 Missiles to turn 24 Greek Rafales into crap of metal*


S400 has the longest range kill record ( 150+ km ) in the world

250-380 km S400 easly can block all Aegean or Turkish EEZ in the Eastern Mediterranean against the enemy Air Forces 

*48N6E3 Missile *
speed : mach 5,9
range : 250 km
altitude : 60 km

*40N6E Missile*
speed : mach 3,5
range : 380 km
altitude : 30 km

nowhere to hide , nowhere to run


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Just a small call to Joe Biden and they will have the 300km model. Be sure.



300 km can not hit even 1/3 of Turkiye
but all Greece is in range of Turkish Ballistic-Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones




BON PLAN said:


> Quantity, sure. Quality not really, in hard and in soldiers training.
> Greece have unrivaled (so far) Rafale.
> Greece secured F16V upgrade. It's all but not made for Turkey.
> Greece will probably ordered some F35. Cold case for Turkey.



Dream is thing and Reality is another thing
24 Rafales can not change anything in a large scale war


*About 24 Rafale*
SOM - ATMACA Cruise Missiles to hit Rafale in Jet Hangars at Tanagra Air Base
BORA Tactical Ballistic Missile to hit Rafale in Jet Hangars at Tanagra Air Base
TAYFUN hypersonic Ballistic Missile to hit Rafale in Jet Hangars at Tanagra Air Base
KARGI and SIMSEK kamikaze Drones with E/O Camera to hit Rafale at Tanagra Air Base
S400 air defense missile to turn Rafale into crap of metal
SIPER air defense missile to turn Rafale into crap of metal

*also Turkiye to buy 40 new F-16V or Eurofighter*

also KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet is coming to carry 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air missiles in the internal weapon bay for stealth flight capability to turn Rafale into crap of metal in BVR combat

BAYKAR has capability to produce 36 KIZILELMA annually







if Turkiye want , Greek Rafales can not flight safely over the Aegean



*About F-16V*
Turkish Air Force 192 F-16s have network centric warfare capability to use 600km MESA Radar of Boeing E7-T AEWC to detect Greek F-16V from 350-400 km away

Turkish Airforce has superior network centric warfare with 192 F-16s while Greece has only 30 F-16 block52+ and 2 F-16V with this capability now

also Turkiye to modernize 35+163 F-16s with indigenous MURAD AESA Radar
Turkiye has great defense industry to modernize F-16s to block70 standard ....


*About F-35*
Even no any deal yet ... Greece wants to buy 20 F-35s between 2028-2032

if you are talking about future 2028-2032

then I remind you Turkish projects
-- KIZILELMA ( first flight 2023 .. in service 2025 )
-- TFX ( first flight 2025 .. in service 2029 )

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## MMM-E

sami_1 said:


> Greece is one of 10 countries
> India Looks to Export BrahMos NG





sami_1 said:


> Greece changes the rules of the game not only with eager fighters, but with superior munitions



Keep dreaming dream is free


even I am not talking about Turkish RAMJET powered supersonic Cruise Missile project
or 150 km TRLG-230 air launched supersonic Missile which is already in service






Turkiye has already its own hypersonic Missile TAYFUN which hit the target from 561 km away in a few days ago

also Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile role .... on the way

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## BON PLAN

sami_1 said:


> Which will get the BrahMos NG missile to be integrated on the French Rafale fighters, and Greece changes the rules of the game not only with eager fighters, but with superior munitions


There are more and more rumors in India about the Rafale integration of Brahmos mini (not the heavy model !).

Same old rumors about Astra integration, now officially confirmed.
Next step is, indeed, Brahmos mini anti ship and anti bunker supersonic missile. A real game changer.



MMM-E said:


> *Turkiye bought Game Changer S400 AD System with 192 Missiles to turn 24 Greek Rafales into crap of metal*
> 
> 
> S400 has the longest range kill record ( 150+ km ) in the world


Yes, a longest kill record. One.
But why is there Ukrainian Mig and Su already in the sky after 9 month of war against the fierce russain SAM ? Because they are not so potent.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> There are more and more rumors in India about the Rafale integration of Brahmos mini (not the heavy model !).
> 
> Same old rumors about Astra integration, now officially confirmed.
> Next step is, indeed, Brahmos mini anti ship and anti bunker supersonic missile. A real game changer.
> 
> 
> Yes, a logest kill record. One.
> But why is there Ukrainian Mig and Su already in the sky after 9 month of war against the fierce russain SAM ? Because they are not so potent.



Ukranian Air Force almost totally was destroyed
No any air strike on Russian Forces
therefore Ukraine use land based HIMARS to attack Russian Forces

btw Ukraine's strategic dept 1.000+ km
on the other hand 250-380 km S400 can block all Aegean against the Hellenic Air Force

250 km range and speed of mach 5,9 ( 48N6E3 Missile )
nowhere to hide , nowhere to run


----------



## MMM-E

*METEOR Missile vs 48N6E3 Missile


Greeks : *We have RAFALE with 200 km METEOR Missile with speed of mach 4

*Turks :* We have S400 with 250 km 48N6E3 Missile with speed of mach 5,9


Turkish F-16s are under S400 protection over the Aegean


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> 250 km range and speed of mach 5,9 ( 48N6E3 Missile )
> nowhere to hide , nowhere to run


Your forget that the earth is round....



MMM-E said:


> Ukranian Air Force almost totally was destroyed
> No any air strike on Russian Forces


No. 
some Su25 made until these last weeks some CAS mission on russian ground troops.



MMM-E said:


> *METEOR Missile vs 48N6E3 Missile
> 
> 
> Greeks : *We have RAFALE with 200 km METEOR Missile with speed of mach 4
> 
> *Turks :* We have S400 with 250 km 48N6E3 Missile with speed of mach 5,9
> 
> 
> Turkish F-16s are under S400 protection over the Aegean
> View attachment 888921


Just us some less powerfull weapons, but fired from the Greek islands so near your country... and made the same circles


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Your forget that the earth is round....



Your forget that Turkish Air Force has 4 Boeing E-7T AEWC to detect Greek Fighter Jets from 350-400 km away

also AKINCI UCAV to carry GaN based AESA Radar to detect even low flying Fighter Jets from long distance

AKINCI UCAVs to stay in the air 24/7 for air based Radar and Air Defense mission




BON PLAN said:


> No.
> some Su25 made until these last weeks some CAS mission on russian ground troops.



and Russian S400s in Belarus
no any S400 in Ukranian soil




BON PLAN said:


> Just us some less powerfull weapons, but fired from the Greek islands so near your country... and made the same circles



Within 24 hours
All weapons will be destroyed in Islands which are 2-10-30 km from Turkish mainland


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Within 24 hours
> All weapons will be destroyed in Islands which are 2-10-30 km from Turkish mainland


It depends who open the fire first.....



MMM-E said:


> Your forget that Turkish Air Force has 4 Boeing E-7T AEWC to detect Greek Fighter Jets from 350-400 km away


Do something against Greece and the support of your Awacs will be cut immediatly by uncle Sam. That means that your bird will be out of order in weeks because no dedicated spare parts.
Even before if uncle Sam had installed a software on/off switch on its AWACS software (a kind of ALIS)


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> It depends who open the fire first.....



Greece has only 158 RM-70 unguided MLRS with range of 20-36 km and 36 M-270 with 152 ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missiles (165km) .... so weak

Greece doesnt have deep strike capability
only air launched SCALP Cruise Missiles ( 250km ) .... nothing else

on the other hand Greek Island which are 2-10-30 km from Turkish mainland in range of Turkish UCAVs , guided MLRS , Tactical Ballistic Missiles , Cruise Missiles , guided Bombs , Kamikaze Drones

Within 24 hours
*All weapons will be destroyed in Islands which are 2-10-30 km from Turkish mainland*

30-40 km TRLG-122 laser guided MLRS
70 km TRLG-230 laser guided MLRS
120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
150 km J600T Tactical Ballistic Missile
165 km ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missile

16 km MAM-L laser guided Bomb
20 km MAVERIC Missile
30 km MAM-T laser guided Bomb
50 km HGK-82 guided Bomb
75 km POPEYE air launched Cruise Missile
110 km KGK guided Bomb
110 km TOLUN IIR guided Bomb
130 km JSOW glide Bomb
150 km TRLG-230 laser guided air launched Missile

200 km SIMSEK Kamikaze Drone with E/O Camera
200 km KARGI Kamikaze Drone with E/O Camera

also ongoing projects = 40 km KUZGUN-KY , 110 km KUZGUN-SD , 180+ km KUZGUN-TJ , 150 km CAKIR Missiles with IIR guided to hit even moving targets

also SOM , SLAM-ER , ATMACA , BORA , TAYFUN Ballistic/Cruise Missiles for dept strike


*Turkiye has the biggest fire power in NATO after USA ....*

İn a war , Greece will lose Islands



BON PLAN said:


> Do something against Greece and the support of your Awacs will be cut immediatly by uncle Sam. That means that your bird will be out of order in weeks because no dedicated spare parts.
> Even before if uncle Sam had installed a software on/off switch on its AWACS software (a kind of ALIS)



*Nice dream but reality is different*


Boeing E-7T AEWC with Turkish HAVELSAN software

Uncle Sam can not do anything
even Uncle Sam do it in a war , then USA will lose its credibility and Nobody will buy weapons from USA anymore

also E-7T AEWC is based on civil plane Boeing-737
and Turkish Airlines and other Airlines have spare parts for Boeing-737

so stop dreaming


----------



## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Greece has only 158 RM-70 unguided MLRS with range of 20-36 km and 36 M-270 with 152 ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missiles (165km) .... so weak


Far than enough to destroy all the S400 in the region.



MMM-E said:


> Boeing E-7T AEWC with Turkish HAVELSAN software
> 
> Uncle Sam can not do anything
> even Uncle Sam do it in a war , then USA will lose its credibility and Nobody will buy weapons from USA anymore


A turkish software to drive the coffee machine inside?
USA and credibility ? Just remember the 100 F35 ordered and partially paid by.... Turkey !



MMM-E said:


> Within 24 hours
> *All weapons will be destroyed in Islands which are 2-10-30 km from Turkish mainland*


Sure, but after they have made all sorts of destructions among the S400 battery, the HQ, the fuel tanks, the radars, the airfields....


----------



## MMM-E

*Attack Helicopters


Greece :* 60 KIOWA
so funny even Turkish UCAVs have better fire power than pathetic KIOWA







*Turkiye : *40+ AH-1P and 10 AH-1W






*Modern Attack Helicopters*
Greece : 28 AH-64
Turkiye : 83 T-129

Turkiye has the best Attack Helicopter fleet in NATO , after USA


----------



## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Far than enough to destroy all the S400 in the region.



Only in your dreams

better worry about how to defend Islands
We will re-take our Islands in a war and nobody can stop us





BON PLAN said:


> A turkish software to drive the coffee machine inside?
> USA and credibility ? Just remember the 100 F35 ordered and partially paid by.... Turkey !



Well come to ignorant troll team

*HAVELSAN *
Mission System Software
Ground Support Center Software



https://www.havelsan.com.tr/sektorler/savunma-ve-guvenlik/hava/hava-gozetleme-sistemleri/baris-kartali-aew-c-projesi




don't compare apples and pears
USA blocked sale of F-35 to Turkiye
but you are talking about to use on/off switch ... İf Uncle Sam do it in a war , then USA will lose its credibility and Nobody will buy weapons from USA anymore

and USA will lose Turkiye to China-Russia block




BON PLAN said:


> Sure, but after they have made all sorts of destructions among the S400 battery, the HQ, the fuel tanks, the radars, the airfields....



And Greece will lose Islands and will cry for decades as like Cyprus 1974

never forget about it
Turkiye is watching Islands 24/7 ,, if Greece deploy ATACMS Tactical Ballistic Missiles in Islands then Turkish Armed Forces will hit ATACMS 

*Stationing weapons-troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris*

btw Turkiye has strategic dept ( 1.000+ km ) .. Greece can not attack all Turkish air bases , fuel Tanks , Radars , etc


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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> and nobody can stop us


as in 1664, or 1918.....



MMM-E said:


> İf Uncle Sam do it in a war , then USA will lose its credibility and Nobody will buy weapons from USA anymore


They did, as when they didn't agree UAE and Egypt to use their F16 in Syria in 2011. I haven't seen the world not purchasing US weapons since.



MMM-E said:


> Stationing weapons-troops on islands violates 1923 Treaty of Lausanne, 1947 Treaty of Paris


And Chyprus is not a turkish violation of international laws ?


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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> as in 1664, or 1918.....



as in 1922 , 1974 , 1996




BON PLAN said:


> They did, as when they didn't agree UAE and Egypt to use their F16 in Syria in 2011. I haven't seen the world not purchasing US weapons since.



still you compare apples with pears
using restriction is a thing and using on/off switch is another thing

btw The UAE said go to hell USA with your F-35 andThe UAE bought Rafale from France
also Egypt buys Rafale from France , MIG-29M2 and SU-35 from Russia

Turkiye said go to hell USA with your PATRIOT and Turkiye bought S400 from Russia

USA is losing its credibility
and if USA use on/off switch in an American weapon
then Nobody will buy weapons from USA anymore





BON PLAN said:


> And Chyprus is not a turkish violation of international laws ?



No

Turkiye is a guarantor country in Cyprus according to London Zurich Treaties of February 1959

Turkish military operation is 100% legal


*1964-1974*
USA-EU backed Greeks tried to take whole Cyprus between 1964 and 1974 ,
in finally Turkish military operation saved the Turkish Cypriots and their legal rights in Cyprus

1/3 of Cyprus belongs to the Turks , and Nobody can change this reality

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## BON PLAN

MMM-E said:


> Turkiye said go to hell USA with your PATRIOT and Turkiye bought S400 from Russia


Indeed. And Donald T said "Turkey can say good bye to F35".



MMM-E said:


> Turkiye is a guarantor country in Cyprus according to London Zurich Treaties of February 1959
> 
> Turkish military operation is 100% legal


LOL. You are not serious Bro.

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## MMM-E

BON PLAN said:


> Indeed. And Donald T said "Turkey can say good bye to F35".



Turkiye develops its own KIZILELMA and TFX Fighter Jets

USA also blocked sale of UCAV to Turkiye
and in 10 years , Turkiye was become Drone super power in the world with is own TB-2 , ANKA , AKSUNGUR and AKINCI UCAV


France-Germany still dreaming about EUROMALE UAV for 2028




BON PLAN said:


> LOL. You are not serious Bro.



İf you are so ignorant , its your problem

Turkiye,Greece and The UK are guarantor countries in Cyprus according to London Zurich Treaties of February 1959

Greek EOKA Terror organization attacked and killed Turkish Cypriots to take whole Cyprus between 1964 and 1974

in finally Turkiye as a guarantor country gave a lesson to savage Greeks in 1974
Turkish military operation is 100% legal

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## MMM-E

*ALPAGUT Loitering Munition*


It will be a game changer on the battlefield with its artificial intelligence algorithms and superior sensor technologies.


Lenght : 2.3 m
Weight : 45 kg
Warhead : 11 kg
Range : 60+ km
Guidance : TV , IIR , GPS , INS

Platforms :Land , Air , Naval


















to hit enemy Tanks , Howitzers , MLRS , Radars , medium range Air Defense Systems

*nowhere to hide , nowhere to run*


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## MMM-E

*BAYKAR and ROKETASAN signed a cooperation agreement for IIR Guided MAM-L, ÇAKIR and SUNGUR munitions


Head of Defense Industry Prof. Dr. İsmail Demir*
"I ask our friends to prepare for at least 200 ÇAKIR and 1000 SUNGUR Missiles "

*Roketsan General Manager Murat Ikinci*
" 8 km SUNGUR missile which will be used in air to air missions in Bayraktar TB2 and AKINCI, will have a game-changing effect."

SUNGUR Missile : to hit enemy UAV-UCAVs , Attack-Utility Helicopters
CAKIR Missile : to hit AD Systems , Warships from 150 km away















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1585280533084397569


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## MMM-E

*Answering the question about the sale of Eurofighter Fighter Jets to Turkiye*



British Defense Minister Ben Wallace participated in the "SAHA EXPO Defense, Aviation and Space Industry Fair" held in Istanbul .. 26.10.2022






Wallace said, "The best Fighter Jets in the world. There is a strong cooperation behind them. The nice thing is that you can add any feature of your own defense industry.
Eurofighter is not closed system, you use another country's systems by paying a lot of money. " said

Wallace stated that Turkish missiles can also be placed on Eurofighter Fighter Jets

but purchase depends on Turkiye's decision


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## MMM-E

*President Erdogan: 29.10.2022*
"When the TAYFUN missiles started to be fired, what did the Greeks start to do? 
It was immediately on the agenda on television broadcasts.

Just wait, {this just the beginning,} the others is yet to come."

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## Ali_Baba

MMM-E said:


> Wallace stated that Turkish missiles can also be placed on Eurofighter Fighter Jets



Very interesting carrot for sure!!! Part of building more connections between the UK and Turkey, on top of the BAe and TFX connection. The starting point for the Turkish Eurofighter offer - if they want to buy of course - will be version that was pitched for the Finland offer. UK is certainly making a sales pitch - but of course - Turkey could be just window shopping. It would represent a significant capapbility upgrade over the Rafale and highlight some of the newer information workflow concepts to Turkish officers. That diversity will aid the development of some of the concepts for TFX.






The Large Displayt Cockpit screen provides much better information density and the ability to visually correlate data and situation awareness for the pilot - which is why I was hoping that the JF17 Block III had adopted it (alongside a side controller with now the 4way quadraplex FBW..) - but by all indications, JF17 Block III has kept the 3 display layout of the block I/II series still as well as other cockpit layout items if commentary here and other chinese defence forums is believed.
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## Oublious

If they give us source code should not be a problem to put our own AESA radar and weapons, upgrading Tranche EF to EF TM could be possible. In the end our own upgrade program to the F16 is not cheap, or they upgrade it to T3 or T4 and give the source code to use our own weapons.

In this case money should not the problem..


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## MMM-E

Ali_Baba said:


> The Large Displayt Cockpit screen provides much better information density and the ability to visually correlate data and situation awareness for the pilot - which is why I was hoping that the JF17 Block III had adopted it (alongside a side controller with now the 4way quadraplex FBW..) - but by all indications,



Turkiye ( Aselsan ) can modernize Eurofighters

even TAI HURJET is eqiupped with the large display cockpit screen










Ali_Baba said:


> Very interesting carrot for sure!!!



American F-35 is a flying computer
without American permission Turkish F-35 can not even take off

while F-35 , Eurofighter is not closed system and The UK offers Turkiye to use its own missiles

100+ km *GOKDOGAN* air to air missile enter service in 2023
and Ramjet powered *GOKHAN *long range air to air missile will be superior to the *METEOR* in speed and in technological capability with the next generation seeker , two-way datalink , expanded no-escape envelope, improved high angle off-boresight capability , etc


*To match with RAFALE in BVR Combat*

1 ) to buy Eurofighter armed with *METEOR* air to air missiles

2 ) to buy F-16 Block 70 armed wiith *AIM-120D* air to air missiles

3 ) modernized F-16 with MURAD AESA Radar + Ramjet powered *GOKHAN *long range air to air missiles

4 ) KIZILELMA unmanned stealth Fighter Jet to carry GOKDOGAN air to air missiles in the internal weapon bay for stealth flight capability


First detect the enemy Fighter Jets then press the kill button and game over in BVR combat

Even 20 km is impressive when you realize the KIZILELMA has already killed the 4+ gen Fighters Rafale , SU-35 , F-16V , F-15 a couple times before you visually IDed him.

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## MMM-E

*KTJ-1750 , KTJ-3200 , KTJ-3700 Turbojet Engines*




KALE-AERO has developed Turbojet Engines to power SOM and ATMACA Cruise Missiles

Range of SOM aand ATMACA Cruise Missiles were limited 280 km because of using French TRI-40 Turbojet Engine

With indigenous Turbojet Engine Range of SOM aand ATMACA Cruise Missiles will increase up to 500 km







*KTJ-1750 and KTJ-3200 Turbojet Engines



*





*SOM air launched Cruise Missile











KARA-ATMACA ground launched Cruise Missile












*


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## MMM-E

*President Erdogan: 29.10.2022*
"When the TAYFUN missiles started to be fired, what did the Greeks start to do?
It was immediately on the agenda on television broadcasts.

Just wait, {this just the beginning,} the others is yet to come."



*After TAYFUN Missile , TUFAN Ballistic Missile is coming*

MaRV (Manevuerable Reentry Vehicle) and HGV (hypersonic gliding vehicle) that will be used with TUFAN MRBM.

And TUBITAK-SAGE develops the supersonic - hypersonic cruise missiles in parallel with its ramjet and scramjet engine development



*Tubitak-SAGE KUZGUN-TJ Missile*

Weight : 85 kg
Warhead : 10 kg
Guidance : GNS-INS + IIR seeker / Laser
Platform : UCAVs , Helicopters , Fighter Jets

AKINCI UCAV to fire KUZGUN-SS in 2022
AKINCI UCAV to fire KUZGUN-TJ in the 3rd quarter of 2023






*there will be RF seeker variant*





10 AKINCI UCAV to carry 80 KUZGUN-TJ Missiles for swarm attack on enemy Frigate
and GAME OVER !

*Greek Navy Frigates armed with only 16 x SAMs which can not intercept swarm attack of 80 KUZGUN-TJ Missiles*

80 KUZGUN-TJ Missiles = $8 million
1 Frigate : $500-750 million

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