# Chinese Missiles News & Discussions



## Lankan Ranger

*Chinese Missiles News & Discussions (Strictly) *

The Second Artillery Corps (SAC) is the strategic missile forces of the People's Republic of China. The SAC is the component of the People's Liberation Army that controls China's nuclear ballistic and conventional missiles. China's total nuclear arsenal size is estimated to be between 100 and 400 nuclear weapons in total with about 180 of them actively deployed. 

The SAC comprises approximately 90,000-120,000 personnel and six ballistic missile brigades. The six brigades are independently deployed in different military regions throughout the country.

The Second Artillery Corps was established on 1 July 1966 and made its first public appearance on 1 October 1984. The headquarters for operations is located at Qinghe. Second Artillery Corps is under the direct command of the Chinese Central Military Commission.

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## Lankan Ranger

*DongFeng 21 Medium-Range Ballistic Missile*







The DongFeng 21 is a two-stage, solid-propellant, single-warhead medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) system developed by China Changfeng Mechanics and Electronics Technology Academy (also known as 2nd Space Academy). Developed from the JuLang 1 (JL-1) submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM), the DF-21 was originally intended for strategic missions but its later variants were designed for both nuclear and conventional missions. 

The latest DF-21D was said to be the worlds first and only anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) system. The DF-21 has also been developed into space launcher and anti-satellite/anti-missile weapon carrier.

*DongFeng 21* 

The basic variant DongFeng 21 has a maximum range of 1,700km, and a payload of 600kg. The missile can carry a single 500kT nuclear warhead, with an estimated CEP of 300~400m. This version did not enter operational service.

*DongFeng 21A*

The DF-21A is the extended-range version developed in the 1990s. The PLA demanded a new land-based MRBM as a successor to its DongFeng 3A in 1985, and the contract with the CASIC to develop the DF-21A was signed in 1987. 

The development programme suffered from major setbacks in 1991, when two flight tests both failed. The PLA allocated additional funds to the programme in 1993 for an improved design. Four successful flight tests were carried out between 1995 and 1996 and the missile was operational by 1996.

The DF-21A has an increased range of 2,700km, and an estimated CEP of 100~300m. The missile is believed to be configured for strategic missions only. 

The missile is carried inside a canister mounted on a truck-towed trailer for road-mobile. It was estimated that so far around 60~80 DongFeng 21 missiles and 30~40 launcher systems may have been deployed by the PLA Second Artillery Corps in 7 missile brigades:

802 Brigade
807 Brigade
808 Brigade
809 Brigade
811 Brigade
822 Brigade
823 Brigade

These missiles are generally deployed in areas closer to Chinas borders to ensure adequate target overage of areas previously covered by the DF-3 IRBM, which has a longer range, but is less accurate compared to DongFeng 21. There have reports suggesting that some DongFeng 21 MRBMs have been re-fitted with conventional warheads.

*DongFeng 21C* 

First revealed in 2006, the DF-21C is a conventionally-armed MRBM system with upgraded mobile launcher and guidance system. The missile was said to have a payload of 2,000kg and a maximum range of 1,700km. Unlike the road-mobile DF-21A, the DF-21C is mounted on a 10X10 WS2500 TEL vehicle, which offers some limited off-road travelling ability. The new GPS-based guidance system has reduced the missiles CEP to 30~40m, enabling it for precision-strike missions.

*DongFeng 21D*

The U.S. Department of Defense has confirmed the existence of the DF-21D land-based ASBM system, which is the worlds first and only of its kind. By combining manoeuvrable re-entry vehicles (MaRVs) with a terminal guidance system, the DF-21C is capable of targeting a slow-moving aircraft carrier battle group from a land-based mobile launcher. The maximum range of the missile was said to be 3,000km, possibly achieved by carrying a smaller payload.

DongFeng 21 (CSS-5) Medium-Range Ballistic Missile - SinoDefence.com

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## mil-avia



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## MZUBAIR



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## applesauce

mil-avia said:


>



koreans imagining the pla fighting the usn?

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## mil-avia

Missile ranges :





Chinese anti-ship ballistic missile course :







Locations of SAM sites :







SRBM, MRBM and IRBM :





DF-31 ICBM :

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## @nline

China the superb country.


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## Indus Falcon

DF-21 Deployed:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/wmd-mi...inese-interceptor-missile-defense-2012-a.html

Post #34

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## mil-avia

Schematic Diagram of DF-21D ASBM Flight Trajectory with Midcourse and Terminal Guidance :

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## mil-avia

SRBM brigades of Second Artillery Corps :

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## mil-avia

Another map showing existing and possible Second Artillery units :


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## Indus Falcon

mil-avia said:


> Schematic Diagram of DF-21D ASBM Flight Trajectory with Midcourse and Terminal Guidance :




Just to add to your informative post, Terminal Guidance can be provided by either Land, sea, or air based radars, as well as satellites. It has redundancy built in, (in a heavy electronic warfare environment), should all external communication fail, it has the capability to figure out where it's target could have moved to, (i.e. distinguish, identify, evade countermeasures and lock on) since the missile was launched. After all ships, only move on a single axis! 

In reality this is a *completely new generation* of long range missile *designed to hit moving target*s. There is other exciting / interesting stuff about this particular missile but I can't reveal that on a public forum. In the coming years it will be quite a game changer!

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## mil-avia

Diagram of DF-21D warhead :

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## mil-avia

Second Artillery Corps missile bases in Chinese maps :


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## Clareurst

china is really a superb country because they believe in change time to time they thinks that the new should be much better than the first. and that's a nice Quality in china.


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## mil-avia

Comparison of six Dong Feng and JL-2 ballistic missiles :

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## mil-avia

Comparison of 7 Chinese and 2 Russian missiles : HQ-9 missile is 4th from right :











http://min.us/mveMmxP#1

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## ChineseTiger1986

JL-2/JL-2A and DF-41 were already deployed.

And JL-2 needs to constantly testify for the reliability just like the Trident II D5 missiles.

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## mil-avia

Chinese ASBM with satellite guidance diagram :







Detailed cutaway diagram of Type 052C missile destroyer (post # 16 in Chinese Navy thread) :

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## mil-avia

China Practices Intercepting U.S. Stealth Fighters with HQ-9 missile / Side view of HQ-9 :


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## mil-avia

Foreign media awaits Chinese National Day Parade
60 years of missiles

(Excerpts)

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2009-09-11
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Link

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## mil-avia

Comparison of HQ-2, HQ-9, SA-10B, SA-20 and HQ-12 missiles by Planeman :






http://www.cankaoa.com/Article/UploadFiles/201103/2011032311054946.jpg


JL-2 SLBM diagram (post # 29 in another diagram)


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## mil-avia

DF-21 missile launch vehicle :


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## khurasaan1

Excellent Pics and design...Mashallah ...Very Good China...keep it up for the evilz West hegemony.....


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## mil-avia

Missile base locations of China and Taiwan superimposed onto Google Maps :


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## mil-avia

Top : Timeline of anti-aircraft missiles, military aircrafts and engines deliveries from Russia to China - years 2000 to 2005 / Bottom : DF-3 and DF-21 ballistic missile ranges from north-eastern China :






DF-3 and DF-21 ranges :





Source


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## mil-avia

S-300PMU-2 missiles of Longtian base :


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## mil-avia

Second Artillery Corps insignia :






800 x 1067


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## TEXAS BATTLESTAR

Thanks for posting the pics and graphs Mil-Avia!

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## ChineseTiger1986

Good to see that DF-21D is already in the operational stage, just need to be constantly testified to make sure the accuracy and reliability.


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## ChineseTiger1986

mil-avia said:


> DF-21 missile launch vehicle :


 
That's the launch vehicle for DF-31.

And this is the launch vehicle for DF-21D.

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## mil-avia

mil-avia said:


> DF-21 missile launch vehicle :



That's the earlier model DF-21/21A towed TEL (transporter erector launcher) :

Link 

Link 

Link 

Some photos in the last link also show the earlier model TEL


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## mil-avia

FL-2000 missile photo and description :







Photo in another thread :


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## mil-avia

Same image posted again for it does not show up in previous post # 28 properly : Second Artillery Corps insignia :






800 x 1067


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## mil-avia

LY-60 missile and its launcher : land-based variant :


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## mil-avia

Map showing ranges of eight different types Dong Feng missiles : 950 x 601 :


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## mil-avia

DF-31 missile photo :


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## mil-avia

Anti-satellite missile program : 800 x 633 :


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## mil-avia

KT-2 ASAT/ surface-to-air missile :


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## mil-avia

Map showing missile bases with ranges and air force bases in north-eastern China :


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## Obambam

mil-avia said:


> DF-31 missile photo :


 
It would be great if we can miniaturise it like that and fire it out of a pistol

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## mil-avia

*America presses Turkey to renounce buying Chinese or Russian air and missile defense systems*


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## Obambam

A showcase of some of Chinese ground/vehicle launched missiles.

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## Broccoli

What missile in PLAAF inventory (something what J-10 can use) is closest to pakistani Ra'ad? Most similar missiles (sizewise) what PLAAF uses are anti-ship oriented and not really meant to attack land targets.


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## cloneman

Broccoli said:


> What missile in PLAAF inventory (something what J-10 can use) is closest to pakistani Ra'ad? Most similar missiles (sizewise) what PLAAF uses are anti-ship oriented and not really meant to attack land targets.


*KongDi-88 (C-802KD) Air-Launched Land-Attack Cruise Missile*

The KongDi-88 (KD-88) air-launched land-attack cruise missile (LACM) was developed from the YJ-83 (C-802) anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) first introduced in the late 1980s. The weapon was first unveiled during the 2006 Zhuhai Air Show under its export designation C-802KD. The deployment of the missile by the PLAAF has been confirmed by TV footages of Chinese state television in November 2006. The introduction of this the stand-off precision strike weapon provides the PLA with greater flexibility in targeting key command, communications, or political nodes during a conflict.

The KD-88 is similar in concept to the U.S. Stand-off Land Attack Missile (SLAM), which was originally developed as an anti-ship missile but later adopted for use on aircraft to attack high-value land targets. Powered by a small turbojet engine, the missile can deliver a 165kg conventional HE warhead at subsonic speed (Mach 0.9) over a distance of 180~200km. The missile may use an inertial navigation system (INS), with datalink command for mid-course correction and an active radar homing for terminal guidance. A targeting pod carried by the aircraft provides initial target information.

The missile is claimed to be capable of engaging ships in harbour or fixed land targets. Given that the missile is fitted with a radar seeker only, land targets would need to provide a high radar contrast. The missile can be launched from the JH-7A fighter-bomber and H-6 medium bomber. More capable guidance methods such as GPS and TV-homing may be adopted In the future to achieve higher accuracy. Other variants using the GPS or passive radar radiation guidance methods may have also been developed.

KongDi-88 (C-802KD) Air-Launched Land-Attack Cruise Missile - SinoDefence.com
PLA Cruise Missiles / PLA Air - Surface Missiles


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## Broccoli

But that is still based on older anti-ship missile instead of being actually new. I find it odd that Chinese aren't following this current trend, most missiles in list below are quite (some brand) new. 

PLAAF does not have modern air-launched cruise missile what could be dropped from J-10, I find this very strange indeed. 

Pakistan has Ra'ad. 
Ra'ad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In Europe there is Storm Shadow/SCALP and Taurus. 
Storm Shadow - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
KEPD 350 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Turkey has SOM
SOM (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## houshanghai

bcz J10 is only a air supremacy role in PLAAF
firing cruise missiles from long-range aircraft ex.JH7A H6K.

maybe new cruise missiles

CJ-10K
Chinese Military Aviation | China Air Force

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## cloneman

houshanghai said:


> bcz J10 is only a air supremacy role in PLAAF
> firing cruise missiles from long-range aircraft ex.JH7A H6K.
> 
> maybe new cruise missiles
> 
> CJ-10K
> Chinese Military Aviation | China Air Force


He's right.the PLAAF doesn't operate a Ra'ad like missile.Acturally there's a gap between the 1500km CJ-10 and 300km KD-88.I think the second artillery responces for the medium range firepower surpport with 600 km DF-15 and 300km DF-11.The PLAAF has many land attack ammino below 300km,guided or un-guided.I don't know if the PLAAF has a plan to develope a Ra'ad like missile or it thinks it's the second artillery or army's responce to cover this range.There's a rumour that in the future the PLA army will take the 600km DF-15 and 300 km DF-11.

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## Great China

Two unknown missiles. Never seen before. Their TEL are similar to df21c's, but there are some differences..

1st
http://img10.itiexue.net/1289/12892930.jpg
http://img9.itiexue.net/1289/12893133.jpg
http://img8.itiexue.net/1289/12893132.jpg


2nd
http://i0.sinaimg.cn/jc/p/2008-10-12/U1716P27T1D524997F3DT20081012101049.jpg


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## tomluter

*China Ground-Based midcourse missile Interception(GBI)* 


The U.S. Intelligence Community assesses that on 11 January 2010, China launched an SC-19 missile from the Korla Missile Test Complex and successfully intercepted a near-simultaneously launched CSS-X-11 medium-range ballistic missile launched from the Shuangchengzi Space and Missile Center. 

The CSS-X-11 was launched from Shuangchengzi at 1150:00Z; the SC-19 was launched from Korla at 1152:42Z. 

U.S. missile warning satellites detected each missile's powered flight as well as the intercept, which *occurred at 1157:31Z at an altitude of approximately 250 kilometers*. No debris from this test remains on-orbit. A Chinese news service published an article on 11 January 2010 stating, "On 11 January, China conducted a test on ground-based midcourse missile interception technology within its own territory. The test has achieved the expected objective.

We anticipate that the SC-19 will launch from the Korla Missile Test Complex (a new location for SC-19 activity) in western China. The CSS-X-11 will launch from Shuangchengzi Space and Missile Center, approximately *1,100 kilometers *east of Korla.

The test is defensive in nature and is not targeted at any country." An SC-19 was used previously as the payload booster for the January 11, 2007, direct-ascent anti-satellite (DA-ASAT) intercept of the Chinese FY-1C weather satellite. Previous SC-19 DA-ASAT flight-tests were conducted in 2005 and 2006. This test is assessed to have furthered both Chinese ASAT and ballistic missile defense (BMD) technologies. (S//NF) Due to the sensitivity of the intelligence that would have to be disclosed to substantiate the U.S. assessment, the U.S. Government in its demarche to the PRC Government will not associate the January 2010 SC-19 intercept flight-test with past SC-19 ASAT flight-tests. The United States will request assistance from our Asia-Pacific allies Australia, Japan, and the Republic of Korea in demarching China in a fashion similar to the U.S. approach.


DEMARCHE FOLLOWING CHINA'S JANUARY 2010 INTERCEPT FLIGHT-TEST - Telegraph

11/1/2007 anti-satelite.
11/1/2010 midcourse missile Interception.
11/1/2011 J-20 first flight.
What about next year(2012)?


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## sweetgrape

What kind of missile is it in the pic?


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## regular

looks like they are air to air missiles as seen from their structures....


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## Martian2

*China's DF-31As deter 144 cities*





China's DF-31A launch

Let's do the math to see if China's DF-31A mobile ICBM retaliatory force is sufficient to provide a nuclear deterrent.

"Britain`s International Institute of Strategic Studies notes" there are "24 DF-31A ICBMs, indicating a possible increase of one new brigade from 2008 to 2009." China is increasing her DF-31A ICBM force by approximately 12 missiles/one brigade a year.

We will add 12 more missiles from 2009 to 2010 and another dozen missiles from 2010 to 2011. A reasonable estimate of China's DF-31A force is 48 ICBMs (e.g. 24 at end of 2009; 36 at end of 2010; and 48 at end of 2011).

If Richard Fisher's information is correct and China's DF-31A is MIRVed with three warheads then that means the 48 DF-31As are armed with a total of 144 warheads (e.g. 48 DF-31As x 3 MIRVed warheads = 144 warheads).

We know China possesses the technology for a W-88 class warhead with a yield of 475 kilotons. The conclusion is that China's DF-31A nuclear force is capable of retaliating against 144 cities. That does seem to be a formidable second-strike capability.

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China and START. Missile buildup may surpass U.S., Russia as they denuclearize

"China and START
By Richard D. Fisher Jr.,
The Washington Times,
20 September 2010
...
In its latest report to the Congress on China`s military released on Aug. 16, the Pentagon says there are less than 10 DF-31 and "10-15" DF-31A ICBMs, up to five more than reported in the previous year`s report, covering 2008. However, in the 2010 issue of "Military Balance," *Britain`s International Institute of Strategic Studies notes there is one brigade of 12 DF-31s and two brigades or 24 DF-31A ICBMs, indicating a possible increase of one new brigade from 2008 to 2009.*
...
*This analyst has been told by Asian military sources that the DF-31A already carries three warheads* and that one deployed DF-5B carries five or six warheads."

----------

The most interesting and controversial debate regarding China's reverse-engineering was the development of China's W-88 class miniaturized thermonuclear warhead. The U.S. claims China appropriated the designs and reverse-engineered the W-88 warhead. China says that isn't true.

China says this is a case of convergent engineering. For example, an airplane must have two wings to provide lift and an engine to provide thrust in the rear. Another example of convergent engineering is all rockets are long and thin. In other words, form must follow function. There is only a very limited way to create a massive thermonuclear explosion using a compact warhead.

Here is the crux of the problem. "U.S. government realized that information derived from Chinese tests in 1992-1996 were similar to U.S. nuclear designs." The Chinese nuclear tests data are "similar," but *not identical* to U.S. nuclear tests on the W-88.





W88 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The *W88 is a United States thermonuclear warhead, with an estimated yield of 475 kiloton (kt), and is small enough to fit on MIRVed missiles.* The W88 was designed at the Los Alamos National Laboratory in the 1970s. In 1999 the director of Los Alamos who had presided over its design described it as "*The most advanced U.S. nuclear warhead.*"[1]

The *Trident II SLBM can be armed with up to 8 W88 (475 kt) warheads (Mark 5)* or 8 W76 (100 kt) warheads (Mark 4), but it is limited to 4 warheads under SORT."

NTI: Research Library: Country Profiles: China

"...According to the Cox Committee Report, suspicion of China's nuclear espionage started after the *U.S. government realized that information derived from Chinese tests in 1992-1996 were similar to U.S. nuclear designs.* This similarity, combined with other information derived from classified sources, led the Cox Committee to claim that China had stolen several bomb designs, including the U.S.' most advanced W-88 design and a design for an enhanced radiation weapon (neutron bomb). Yet, the *Cox Report has been severely criticized by both experts and officials in the United States as a political document that has several technical inaccuracies.*"


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## mil-avia

*34 missiles with submunition warhead could cover all parking ramps at Kadena :







Related image in post #227 of PLAAF thread. *

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## Great China

Great China said:


> Two unknown missiles. Never seen before. Their TEL are similar to df21c's, but there are some differences..
> 
> 1st
> http://img10.itiexue.net/1289/12892930.jpg
> http://img9.itiexue.net/1289/12893133.jpg
> http://img8.itiexue.net/1289/12893132.jpg
> 
> 
> 2nd
> http://i0.sinaimg.cn/jc/p/2008-10-12/U1716P27T1D524997F3DT20081012101049.jpg



I've found out these are not new TELs, but DF missile transporter-reloaders, maybe for DF-15


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## Great China

http://img8.itiexue.net/1468/14684360.jpg
http://img9.itiexue.net/1468/14684361.jpg
http://img10.itiexue.net/1468/14684362.jpg

DF-16 was seen in tv one year ago but only few details, no in its entire shape. Now these pics show the real shape of the SAC new big toy.

Seems the missile is covered by a big lid, that opens before the missile is erected. First of its kind, because DF-11 had no lid while DF-15 only partially covered.

Wonder what are these missiles doing in that place..it's not a base nor a training facility..


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## Great China

It's estimated that DF-16 range is between 1000 and 1500km, and its re-entry vehicle speed is faster than older SAC missiles, making interception almost impossible even for Patriot-3 system. 

They say DF-16 is deployed mainly against Taiwan, but considering its range, I think it's also another nightmare for India.

India, stop threatening China by developing other ugly agni missiles. Instead, look at the beauty of the chinese missiles.

Go China, Go!!!

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## mil-avia

*1970s anti-ship missile gyroscope detailed dismantling (press onto the 59 images) :


1120 × 707 pixels


Related link. *

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## Great China




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## Great China

Today North korean military parade has shown a new giant missile (maybe an icbm?) 

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59662000/jpg/_59662627_paradermissile2_afp.jpg
http://cencio4.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/missile-reuters.jpg

and what I noticed first is the TEL, which is very very similar to the chinese WS-2900 truck used for our new missile, especially the bumper and fuel tanks, they're identical!!
Maybe chinese WS company provides them these trucks...






China should leak more pics of its new monster to scare the indians!!!


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## pzkilo

Great China said:


> Today North korean military parade has shown a new giant missile (maybe an icbm?)
> 
> http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59662000/jpg/_59662627_paradermissile2_afp.jpg
> http://cencio4.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/missile-reuters.jpg
> 
> and what I noticed first is the TEL, which is very very similar to the chinese WS-2900 truck used for our new missile, especially the bumper and fuel tanks, they're identical!!
> Maybe chinese WS company provides them these trucks...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> China should leak more pics of its new monster to scare the indians!!!




Dude, it is not "maybe". It is ws51200.
========================================================================
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????????????????????

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&#26102;&#38388;&#65306;2011-05-26 &#25991;&#31456;&#26469;&#28304;&#65306;&#20013;&#22269;&#33322;&#22825;&#31185;&#24037;&#38598;&#22242;&#20844;&#21496;

&#12288;&#12288;&#26085;&#21069;&#65292;&#30001;&#20013;&#22269;&#33322;&#22825;&#31185;&#24037;&#38598;&#22242;&#20844;&#21496;&#20061;&#38498;&#29420;&#31435;&#33258;&#20027;&#30740;&#21046;&#30340;&#22269;&#20869;&#26368;&#38271;&#12289;&#35013;&#36733;&#36136;&#37327;&#26368;&#22823;&#30340;&#33258;&#34892;&#24335;&#36229;&#37325;&#22411;&#29305;&#31181;&#36234;&#37326;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#8212;&#8212;WS51200&#38750;&#20844;&#36335;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#25104;&#21151;&#20132;&#20184;&#20351;&#29992;&#65292;&#22635;&#34917;&#20102;&#22269;&#20869;&#31354;&#30333;&#12290;
&#12288;&#12288;&#35813;&#22411;&#38750;&#20844;&#36335;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#26159;&#20061;&#38498;&#19975;&#23665;&#20844;&#21496;&#26681;&#25454;&#29992;&#25143;&#38656;&#27714;&#65292;&#21033;&#29992;WS&#31995;&#21015;&#36229;&#37325;&#22411;&#24213;&#30424;&#25216;&#26415;&#24320;&#21457;&#30340;&#20840;&#26032;&#36229;&#37325;&#22411;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#65292;&#25972;&#36710;&#20840;&#38271;21&#31859;&#12289;&#26368;&#22823;&#24635;&#36136;&#37327;&#36798;122&#21544;&#65292;&#26159;WS&#31995;&#21015;&#36229;&#37325;&#22411;&#36710;&#36742;&#20013;&#22806;&#24418;&#23610;&#23544;&#21450;&#36733;&#37325;&#37327;&#26368;&#22823;&#30340;&#36234;&#37326;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#12290;&#20135;&#21697;&#30340;&#30740;&#21046;&#25104;&#21151;&#65292;&#23454;&#29616;&#20102;&#20061;&#38498;&#36229;&#37325;&#22411;&#36234;&#37326;&#36710;&#20135;&#21697;&#22411;&#35889;&#30340;&#23454;&#29289;&#21270;&#65292;&#26159;&#22269;&#20869;&#35013;&#36733;&#36136;&#37327;&#26368;&#22823;&#30340;&#33258;&#34892;&#24335;&#36234;&#37326;&#36816;&#36755;&#36710;&#12290;
&#12288;&#12288;&#35813;&#20135;&#21697;&#22312;&#20132;&#20184;&#29992;&#25143;&#36827;&#34892;&#30340;&#28436;&#31034;&#39564;&#25910;&#20013;&#34920;&#29616;&#33391;&#22909;&#65292;&#29992;&#20110;&#32473;&#20104;&#39640;&#24230;&#35780;&#20215;&#65292;&#24182;&#34920;&#31034;&#20102;&#36827;&#19968;&#27493;&#28145;&#20837;&#21512;&#20316;&#30340;&#24847;&#24895;&#12290;

???????????????????

?????????????????????????

&#20844;&#21496;&#39318;&#21488;WS51200&#24213;&#30424;&#39034;&#21033;&#19979;&#32447;

&#21457;&#34920;&#26085;&#26399;&#65306;2011-8-4
5&#26376;12&#26085;8&#65306;15&#26102;&#65292;&#21046;&#36896;&#37096;&#19968;&#21495;&#24635;&#35013;&#24037;&#20301;&#19978;&#65292;&#38543;&#30528;&#38453;&#38453;&#20302;&#27785;&#24378;&#21170;&#30340;&#38534;&#38534;&#30340;&#21457;&#21160;&#26426;&#36720;&#40483;&#22768;&#65292;&#20844;&#21496;&#39318;&#21488;WS51200&#24213;&#30424;&#39034;&#21033;&#39542;&#20986;&#24635;&#35013;&#32447;&#65292;&#32780;&#20026;&#20102;&#20170;&#26085;&#30340;&#26089;&#26089;&#19979;&#32447;&#65292;&#24037;&#20301;&#20154;&#21592;&#26152;&#26202;&#30340;&#31361;&#20987;&#21152;&#29677;&#19968;&#30452;&#22859;&#25112;&#21040;&#20170;&#26085;&#30340;&#20940;&#26216;2&#26102;&#12290;

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ä¸&#8240;æ±&#376;ç&#8220;¦å&#352;&#8250;ç&#8240;¹ç&#8240;¹ç§è½¦è¾&#8224;æ&#339;&#8240;é&#8482;å&#8230;¬å¸
http://www.zymp.com.cn/index.php ... ws&itemid=21788


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## mil-avia

*Linyi SSM Training Facility and DF-21C ballistic missiles :




785 × 1490 pixels 


Related image in post #237 of PLAAF thread.*

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## Broccoli

DF-21 launch.
DF-21.flv - YouTube

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## Beast

Broccoli said:


> But that is still based on older anti-ship missile instead of being actually new. I find it odd that Chinese aren't following this current trend, most missiles in list below are quite (some brand) new.
> 
> PLAAF does not have modern air-launched cruise missile what could be dropped from J-10, I find this very strange indeed.
> 
> Pakistan has Ra'ad.
> Ra'ad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> In Europe there is Storm Shadow/SCALP and Taurus.
> Storm Shadow - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> KEPD 350 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Turkey has SOM
> SOM (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



I believe china did have but since they are not oblige to reveal to the public. Think abt it, even Pakistan has the capabilities to develop it. You think China can't??? 

Another thing is china recently develop fire and forget anti - missile called HJT-11 but this missile is only reveal by insider rather than the military.



sweetgrape said:


> What kind of missile is it in the pic?



New fire and forget anti- tank missile. Something similar concept to Israel spike missile...

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## mil-avia

*Chinese ballistic missiles compared, from a report written in Czech language :




1758 × 2186 pixels 


Related link.*


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## Beast

mil-avia said:


> *Chinese ballistic missiles compared, from a report written in Czech language :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1758 × 2186 pixels
> 
> 
> Related link.*



Those are oldies BM.. The new one shall be the double digit series, like DF-15, DF-21 and DF-31....



mil-avia said:


> *Chinese ballistic missiles compared, from a report written in Czech language :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1758 × 2186 pixels
> 
> 
> Related link.*



Those are oldies BM.. The new one shall be the double digit series, like DF-15, DF-21 and DF-31....


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## Broccoli

Eurosatory 2012 has started and Chinese are there too. 


China's Blue Arrow 7


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## Martian2

*Multiple-warhead DF-21D ASBM*

An efficient method to attack an aircraft carrier or a destroyer is to use an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) with multiple MARV (maneuverable re-entry vehicle) warheads.

With multiple MARV warheads, a ballistic missile will have reduced range. This can be fixed by building a larger missile to accommodate the larger number of warheads.

My original proposal was to use a simultaneous attack on each capital ship with ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, torpedoes, stealth cruise missiles if available, and mix of subsonic (with supersonic terminal phase if available) and supersonic sea-skimming anti-ship missiles.

I want to elaborate on the anti-ship ballistic missile discussion. It is more efficient and effective to arm each ASBM with multiple MARVs. Let's say each DF-21D ASBM is armed with three MARVs. Firing 25 ASBMs at each destroyer within a five-minute window would total 75 MARV warheads or an incoming warhead every four seconds.

I had proposed launching 50 ASBMs at each aircraft carrier. That is a total of 150 MARV warheads within a five-minute window. This means an incoming warhead will attempt to strike the carrier every two seconds for five minutes non-stop.

We would have to run computer simulations, but another option is to time the arrival of all 50 ASBMs within a ten-second window by using computerized coordination. Basically, the sky will drop down on the carrier with 150 warheads in ten seconds.

With an intense ballistic missile bombardment coupled to an equally intense simultaneous cruise missile and torpedo attack, I don't think an aircraft carrier battle group will survive in Chinese waters.

Feel free to create your own attack plan, such as an initial EMP warhead to fry the carrier group's electronics and a follow-up of 150 MARV warheads in a short time-frame.





It is logical to equip Chinese DF-21D ASBMs with multiple MARV warheads by reducing the range or building a larger ballistic missile.





A MARV (maneuverable re-entry vehicle) is basically a warhead with thrusters.





Multiple warheads (MIRVs) can be placed on top of a ballistic missile. Similarly, multiple warheads with thrusters (e.g. MARVs) can be placed on top of a ballistic missile.

[Note: Thank you to Dr. Somnath999 for the composite images of China's ASBM.]

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## Banglar Lathial

Would love to see the DF-21D in action. Is there any video of DF-21D in action like the Iranian Khalij e Fars missile? It could be a timely acquisition for Pakistan or other friendly states to the Chinese, I reckon, if it is indeed available for export.


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## Martian2

*Is the Chinese HQ-9 capable of countering a stealth fighter like the F-22?*
(&#20013;&#22269;&#36896;&#26368;&#24378;&#38450;&#31354;&#23548;&#24377; &#21487;&#20987;&#33853;F-22)





Deployed HQ-9 battery. Above, self-propelled YLC-2V to the left with its three support vehicles, in the background a HT-233 battery engagement radar. All vehicles employ the &#8220;classic&#8221; rather than more recent &#8220;pixelated&#8221; camouflage patterns. (Source: Australia Air Power)


























[Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the post.]

----------

HQ-9 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"*Radars*

To reduce the cost, the HQ-9 is designed to be flexible enough to employ a wide range of radars, both the search/surveillance/acquisition radar and the tracking/engagement/fire control radar (FCR).

*Fire control radar*

Many FCRs of other Chinese SAM can be used for HQ-9, such as FCR used in KS-1 SAM, SJ-212, itself an enlarged and improved version of the SJ-202 fire control radar (FCR) used in HQ-2J.[5][8] H-200 & SJ-231 FCRs of latter models of KS-1 SAM are also compatible with HQ-9.

*HT-233 Radar*

To maximize the combat effectiveness of HQ-9, a dedicated FCR for HQ-9 was developed, and it is most commonly seen with HQ-9. Designated as HT-233, this radar is the most advanced FCRs HQ-9 could employ, and it has greater similarities to the MIM-104 Patriot's MPQ-53 than the S-300's 30N6 (Flap-Lid) series,[9] working in the NATO G-band (4&#8211;6 GHz) also as a search and targeting radar. This could be due to an alleged transfer of Patriot technology to China.[10] The radar can search a 120 degree arc in azimuth and 0-90 degrees in elevation out to 300 km, with a peak power output on 1MW (average 60 kW). The radar is credited as being able to track 100 targets and guides up to 6 missiles to 6 targets, or alternatively, to 3 targets with a pair of missiles for each target.

HT-233 is the FCR used by HQ-9 that is closest to AN/MPQ-53: In comparison to earlier H-200 radar used by early models of KS-1 SAM which uses a simple horn instead of lens arrangement, HT-233 radar adopts lens arrangement of AN/MPQ-53. In comparison to SJ-231 radar used by the latest model of KS-1, HT-233 has a thousand more phase shifter on its antenna array, totaling four thousand, as opposed to the three thousand of SJ-231. In contrast, both AN/MPQ-53 & 30N6E radars have ten thousand phase shifters on their antenna arrays respectively. HT-233 radar is mounted on Tai'an TAS5501 10 x 10 high mobility cross country truck, and operates in C-band at 300MHz. When deployed as a search radar TH-233 is fielded at brigade level, while FCR radars deployed would be SJ-212, H-200 or SJ-231. [3] HT-233 is credited with a detection range of 120 km,[11] scanning 360 degrees in azimuth and 0-65 degrees in elevation. It can track 100 targets and designate 50 for engagements.

*Search radars*

Several search radars are discovered to be associated with HQ-9, including anti-ballistic radars and *anti-stealth radars*.
*
Type 305B radar*

Type 305B (also known as LLQ-305B) radar is the standard search radar for HQ-9, and it is a development of YLC-2 Radar. This 3-D radar which has an antenna height of 3.5 meters, and employs sixty 350 mm waveguide feeds. It operates in the *S-band* at a wavelength of 11.67 cm.
*
Type 102 radar*

Type 120 (also known as LLQ-120) radar is the low altitude search radar, it is a telescoping radar with an antenna height of 2.3 metres folded, and 7 metres unfolded, using a feed network of sixteen 230mm wave guides. It rotates at a maximum of ten revolutions per minute, and operates in the *L-band* at a wavelength of 23.75 cm.

*Type 305A radar*

Type 305A (also known as LLQ-305A) radar is another search radar for HQ-9 system. This AESA radar is designed maximize the anti-ballistic capability of HQ-9, and it resembles Thales Ground Master 400 AESA radar. Very little info is released about this radar other than it can also act as FCR.
*
YLC-20 passive sensor*

*Although Type 305 radars are effective against stealthy targets such as F-22 or F-35, full stealth target such as B-2 is difficult to detect.* YLC-20 passive radar was conceptually based on KRTP-91 Tamara passive sensor, incorporating experience obtained from documentation acquired during the abortive attempt to procure six Czech VERA passive sensors. *YLC-20 passive radar was first revealed in 2006.*
*
DWL002 passive sensor*

*DWL002 passive radar is the development of earlier YLC-20, incorporating Kolchuga passive sensor, four of which were sold to China.[12] Like its predecessor YLC-20, DWL002 is also developed by China Electronics Technology Corp. (CETC).*"

----------

Since we're discussing anti-stealth radars, which include L-band radars, I might as well mention China's KJ-2000 L-band airborne radar.

PLA-AF Airborne Early Warning & Control Programs





_An early production KJ-2000 Airborne Early Warning and Control system on short finals. The dielectric panels on the dorsal radome indicate this is a three sided phased array, probably operating in the *L-band* and influenced by the design of the Israeli Elta Phalcon system (image © 2009, Zhenguan Studio)._

----------

Personally, I bet China can shoot down a stealth fighter. However, the U.S. will attack the radar sites in China's integrated radar defense network. But then, China would have used its ballistic and cruise missiles to preemptively destroy the American air bases.

If things get ugly, both sides go thermonuclear and we're in World War IV.

The history of military technology has shown that weapons are most effective if the other side is surprised by it. The F-22 is a decades-old technology. China had fifteen years to prepare for it. If you can't shoot down a fifteen-year-old plane then there's a serious problem in defense planning.

The attributes of the F-22 are well-known. You just need to attack one of the F-22's weak points (e.g. use non-X band radar, bi-static radar, multi-static radar, J-20 stealth fighter intercept, destroy F-22 airbase, etc.).

I will eventually get around to writing a post on using stealth drones as part of an active defense. In a prior post, I used a stealth drone as a passive receiver along the anticipated paths of an incoming F-22. However, a stealth drone (silently accompanied by J-20s) can intermittently broadcast radar and try to detect a F-22 along anticipated flight paths.

Furthermore, stealth drones can fly in the area behind the anticipated flight paths of incoming F-22s and look for the infrared signature of F-22 engines.

Another option is to set off a massive 25-megaton EMP in the airspace between China and Japan. Also, massive EMPs should be detonated over other major American airbases in Japan. That should fry the electronics in the F-22 and its missiles.

The point is there are many inherent weaknesses in using the F-22 fighter. You can either attack the fighter's weak points or its bases. In the worst case scenario, I would just drop a 3.3-megaton MARV on Kadena Air Force Base, Guam, and a few other major bases. My next move would be an all-out thermonuclear strike.

Militarily threatening China is a terrible idea. No matter what happens, the country threatening China will be completely fried and there will be no victory.

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## Martian2

*US Naval War College: China's DF-21D ASBM costs $5 to $10.5 million per missile*





A Chinese DF-21D ASBM costs only $5 to $10.5 million. China can afford to build hundreds of them.





Out of the 100 DF-21D ASBMs fired at a single aircraft carrier, China only needs one or two hits to achieve a "soft kill" (e.g. knocked out of combat). If there are more impacts, the carrier might sink.

I have suggested China may fire 100 DF-21D ASBMs to arrive near-simultaneously and attack an aircraft carrier. However, is this economically feasible? As shown in the citation below, each DF-21D ASBM costs between $5 to $10.5 million per missile.

We'll pick the upper range and say each DF-21D ASBM costs $10 million. A bombardment of 100 DF-21D ASBMs will cost a total of $1 billion. This is a cost-effective way to attack a $5 billion aircraft carrier.

Anyway, in a war, costs don't really matter. China will attempt to sink the aircraft carrier with sufficient numbers of DF-21D ASBMs regardless of cost.

----------

From the third page at the following link from the US Naval War College:

http://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/...9d27/The-Strategic-Implications-of-Obscurants

"While it is problematic to estimate accurately *the cost of the DF-21, sources place the unit price, in U.S. currency, between $5,000,000 and $10,500,000 per missile.[7] This seems a reasonable estimate in light of the cost of a similar weapon, the U.S. Pershing II, which adjusted for inflation would be roughly twelve million dollars per missile.* In comparison, the ballistic-missile-defense-capable SM-3 costs roughly ten million dollars per missile. At first blush, the nearly equal prices of interceptor (SM-3) and ASBM (DF-21) suggest near parity in cost ratio, but a &#8220;shoot two to kill one&#8221; doctrine means a differential of nearly ten million dollars per exchange. However, even this is misleading, as the launch platform&#8212;essentially a big truck&#8212;of the DF-21 is far less expensive than that of the SM-3, a warship. This estimate also ignores the operational and developmental challenges of intercepting an ASBM; nor does it fold in the things like purchasing power disparity, labor costs, and government controls, which all favor China. Nonetheless, this simple cost comparison is striking."

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## Martian2

*Aside from endless coal and minerals, Mongolia possesses strategic value*





Annexing Mongolia will allow China to station its camouflaged mobile-launched ICBMs a lot closer to the United States. This reduces fuel consumption and increases the warhead throw-weight.





In other words, China can place bigger megaton thermonuclear warheads or more MIRVs on each intercontinental ballistic missile.

Mongolia is a valuable strategic asset to China.

1. Mongolia is estimated to have 100 billion tonnes of coal. This is basically an endless supply of energy.

2. Mongolia has a large variety of valuable minerals, including iron ore.

3. Mongolia is half-the-size of India, a subcontinent. China can hide hundreds of camouflaged mobile ICBM launchers with MIRVed warheads in Mongolia and they're virtually impossible to find.

Now, we just need to sit back and wait for the neo-cons to attack ships carrying oil to China. Invoking the principle of self-defense/survival, China can roll into Mongolia the next day. If only the neo-cons will hurry up and cooperate.

War is a win-win for both sides. The neo-cons can claim they're tough on China. China will get Mongolia as compensation.

----------

Comparison of really large land masses.

India: 3,287,263 km2

Alaska: 1,717,854 km2

Mongolia: 1,564,115.75 km2 (Mongolia is 2.25 Texases or 3.7 Californias.)

Texas: 696,241 km2

California: 423,970 km2

-----

References:

India: India - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Alaska: Alaska - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Mongolia: Mongolia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Texas: Texas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

California: California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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## Broccoli

> Rare video from the '70s showing China's FanJi 1 ABM interceptor

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## Abdi-Karim Elmi

Martian2 said:


> *Aside from endless coal and minerals, Mongolia possesses strategic value*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Annexing Mongolia will allow China to station its camouflaged mobile-launched ICBMs a lot closer to the United States. This reduces fuel consumption and increases the warhead throw-weight.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other words, China can place bigger megaton thermonuclear warheads or more MIRVs on each intercontinental ballistic missile.
> 
> Mongolia is a valuable strategic asset to China.
> 
> 1. Mongolia is estimated to have 100 billion tonnes of coal. This is basically an endless supply of energy.
> 
> 2. Mongolia has a large variety of valuable minerals, including iron ore.
> 
> 3. Mongolia is half-the-size of India, a subcontinent. China can hide hundreds of camouflaged mobile ICBM launchers with MIRVed warheads in Mongolia and they're virtually impossible to find.
> 
> Now, we just need to sit back and wait for the neo-cons to attack ships carrying oil to China. Invoking the principle of self-defense/survival, China can roll into Mongolia the next day. If only the neo-cons will hurry up and cooperate.
> 
> War is a win-win for both sides. The neo-cons can claim they're tough on China. China will get Mongolia as compensation.
> 
> ----------
> 
> Comparison of really large land masses.
> 
> India: 3,287,263 km2
> 
> Alaska: 1,717,854 km2
> 
> Mongolia: 1,564,115.75 km2 (Mongolia is 2.25 Texases or 3.7 Californias.)
> 
> Texas: 696,241 km2
> 
> California: 423,970 km2
> 
> -----
> 
> References:
> 
> India: India - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Alaska: Alaska - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Mongolia: Mongolia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Texas: Texas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> California: California - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia





No way... Mongolia is protected by Russia and Turkey would not allow you..


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## oct605032048

Abdi-Karim Elmi said:


> No way... Mongolia is protected by Russia and Turkey would not allow you..



With all due respect but does Turkey possess any missile that could reach Mongolia?

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## pzkilo

Abdi-Karim Elmi said:


> No way... Mongolia is protected by Russia and Turkey would not allow you..


China needs ur protection, too. plz plz plz

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## Martian2

*Range of China's DF-21D Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile (ASBM)*







[Note: Thank you to EastWind for the picture.]

----------

*US Naval War College: China's DF-21D ASBM costs $5 to $10.5 million per missile*





A Chinese DF-21D ASBM costs only $5 to $10.5 million. China can afford to build hundreds of them.





Out of the 100 DF-21D ASBMs fired at a single aircraft carrier, China only needs one or two hits to achieve a "soft kill" (e.g. knocked out of combat). If there are more impacts, the carrier might sink.

I have suggested China may fire 100 DF-21D ASBMs to arrive near-simultaneously and attack an aircraft carrier. However, is this economically feasible? As shown in the citation below, each DF-21D ASBM costs between $5 to $10.5 million per missile.

We'll pick the upper range and say each DF-21D ASBM costs $10 million. A bombardment of 100 DF-21D ASBMs will cost a total of $1 billion. This is a cost-effective way to attack a $5 billion aircraft carrier.

Anyway, in a war, costs don't really matter. China will attempt to sink the aircraft carrier with sufficient numbers of DF-21D ASBMs regardless of cost.

----------

From the third page at the following link from the US Naval War College:

http://www.usnwc.edu/getattachment/...9d27/The-Strategic-Implications-of-Obscurants

"While it is problematic to estimate accurately *the cost of the DF-21, sources place the unit price, in U.S. currency, between $5,000,000 and $10,500,000 per missile.[7] This seems a reasonable estimate in light of the cost of a similar weapon, the U.S. Pershing II, which adjusted for inflation would be roughly twelve million dollars per missile.* In comparison, the ballistic-missile-defense-capable SM-3 costs roughly ten million dollars per missile. At first blush, the nearly equal prices of interceptor (SM-3) and ASBM (DF-21) suggest near parity in cost ratio, but a &#8220;shoot two to kill one&#8221; doctrine means a differential of nearly ten million dollars per exchange. However, even this is misleading, as the launch platform&#8212;essentially a big truck&#8212;of the DF-21 is far less expensive than that of the SM-3, a warship. This estimate also ignores the operational and developmental challenges of intercepting an ASBM; nor does it fold in the things like purchasing power disparity, labor costs, and government controls, which all favor China. Nonetheless, this simple cost comparison is striking."

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## j20blackdragon

Martian2 said:


> *Range of China's DF-21D Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile (ASBM)*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Note: Thank you to EastWind for the picture.]


 
Notice that the range of the DF-21D allows China to cover everything from the Arabian Sea to the Strait of Malacca. 

I'm sure India notices.

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## cirr

http://static.video.qq.com/TPout.swf?auto=1&vid=89SFWSJ52yi

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## XName

this post from the sinodefenceforum ,thanks for escobar

http://www.*********************/st...-ballistic-missiles-nuclear-arms-31-5881.html

Chinese DongFeng series of ballistic missile: DongFeng-1


Nothing to say, it's the first ballistic missile made by Chinese ppl, related sources from USSR P-2 missile. DongFeng-1 ballistic missile successfully launched at 1960.11.05.But DongFeng-1 didn't have the chance to serve in PLA, after related test DongFeng-1 walked into museum. DongFeng-1 is the beginner of Chinese domestic ballistic missile industry, China trained missile designers through building DongFeng-1 ballistic missile in 1960s. 

DongFeng-1 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 1 (DF-1)
Service status: test missile, no deployment
Configuration: Single-stage, liquid propellant
Deployment: on towed trailer
Length: 17.68m
Body diameter: 1.65m
Launch weight: 20,400kg
Range: 600km
Re-entry vehicle mass: 1,300kg
Accuracy: unknown
Launch preparation time: unknown












The DongFeng 2 (NATO code name: CSS-1) 

The DongFeng 2 (NATO code name: CSS-1) is a single-stage, liquid-propellant, road-mobile, medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) developed by the Ministry of Defence 5th Academy (now China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology, CALT). The DongFeng 2 is China&#8217;s first indigenously developed ballistic missile. The development of the DongFeng 2 began in the late 1950s. The DongFeng 2 development encountered some serious difficulties due to Soviet Union&#8217;s withdrawal of its technical assistance in 1960. The first test launch of the DongFeng 2 in March 1962 failed. The redesigned DongFeng 2A was successfully launched on 29 June 1964. On 27 December 1966, a DongFeng 2A missile carrying a 12kT atomic warhead was launched from Jiuquan and the missile hit the target in Lop Nor 800km away. The DongFeng 2A entered operational service with the PLA in the late 1960s, and was completely retired from active duty in the early 1980s. 

DongFeng-2 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 2 (DF-2)
NATO reporting name: CSS-1
Contractor: MND 5th Academy
Service status: Retired
Configuration: Single-stage, liquid propellant
Deployment: Road-mobile on towed trailer
Length: 20.61m
Body diameter: 1.65m
Wingspan: 2.13m
Launch weight: 31,900kg
Range: 1,250km
Re-entry vehicle mass: 1,500kg
Accuracy: CEP 4,000m
Launch preparation time: 120~180 min

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## XName

The DongFeng-3 (DF-3, NATO designation: CSS-2).
The DF-3 is China&#8217;s first operational intermediate-range ballistic missile. The missile is a single-stage, liquid-propellant design carrying a single nuclear warhead.The DongFeng-3 (DF-3, NATO designation: CSS-2) is a single-warhead, single-stage, liquid-propellant, intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM). Developed in the 1960, it is China's first independently developed ballistic missile. The DF-3A is the improved variant with extended range developed in the early 1980s. A total of 150~200 DF-3/3A missiles are believed to have been deployed, with 30~40 remaining in service today. 

DongFeng-3 specifications:

Configuration: Single stage liquid
Length: 21.2m
Diameter: 2.25m
Launch Weight: 64,000kg
Propellant: Liquid fuel (Unsymmetrical Dimethylhydrazine/Nitrogen Tetroxide mix [UDMH/N2H4])
Guidance: Inertial
Range: 2,500km (DF-3); 2,800km (DF-3A)
Deployment: Launch pad + road mobile
Re-entry Vehicle Mass: 2,150kg
Warhead: Single 1,000~3,000kT
CEP: 2,000~3,000m (DF-3); 1,000m (DF-3A)
Launch Preparation Time: 120~180 min

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## PäkPõwér

Dong Feng 3 is *BADASS*!!

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## XName

The DongFeng 4 (NATO reporting name: CSS-3)
The DongFeng 4 (NATO reporting name: CSS-3) liquid-propellant, two-stage intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) was developed by the China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT, also known as 1st Space Academy) in the 1960s. The missile entered operational service in the early 1980s, with approximately 20 missiles (2008 Pentagon report) currently deployed by the PLA Second Artillery Corps. The DongFeng 4 was also used to develop PRC&#8217;s first space launch vehicle Changzheng 1 (Long March 1), which sent the country&#8217;s first satellite into the orbit in 1970. 

DongFeng-4 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 4 (DF-4)
NATO reporting name: CSS-3
Contractor: China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology (CALT)
Service status: In service
Configuration: Two-stage, liquid propellant
Deployment: Silo and semi-mobile (towed trailer)
Propellant: Unsymmetrical Dimethylhydrazine/Nitrogen Tetroxide mix (UDMH/N2H4)
Length: 28m
Diameter: 2.25m
Launch weight: 82,000kg
Range: 4,750km
Re-entry vehicle mass: 2,200kg
Warhead: Single, 1,000~3,000kT yield thermalnuclear
Guidance: Inertial
Accuracy: CEP 1,500m
Launch preparation time: 3~5 hours (mobile), or 2~3 hours (silo)

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## Martian2

PäkPõwér;3292733 said:


> Dong Feng 3 is *BADASS*!!



It's 3.3 megatons of thermonuclear badass per DF-3A warhead.

----------

*Chinese DF-3A 3.3-megaton IRBM*

Contrary to the exultation in the Indian media, I believe the development of the Agni V increases the danger to all Indians. Basically, it makes all Indians less safe and more likely to become extinct. Here's why.




DF-3A/CSS-2 IRBM with 3.3 megaton warhead

Citation: Securing India's Future in the New Millennium - Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - Google Books

"Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - 1999 - History - 612 pages
*China's missile choices against India include the DF 3 and DF 3A, armed with a 3.3-megaton thermonuclear warhead* and capable of hitting targets up to 2800 ..."

China has a multitude of IRBMs with thermonuclear 3.3 megaton warheads that can easily obliterate an entire Indian city with a single blast.




A single 3.3 megaton DF-3A strike by China would instantly vaporize New Delhi.

In contrast, a 20 kiloton atomic warhead delivered by an Agni V (that survives China's missile defenses) causes relatively minor damage.




For comparison purposes, an Indian 20 kiloton blast on New Delhi is hardly noticeable.

The impudence of Indians to trumpet their "China killer" and if they are actually stupid enough to launch one at a major Chinese city will bring terrible retribution. China can legitimately claim India has used a Weapon of Mass Destruction (WMD) against Chinese civilians and choose to respond in kind.

Unfortunately for Indians, China will destroy every major and minor Indian city to drive home the message that the use of a WMD against a Chinese city means self-genocide for dumb Indians.

The bottom line is you do not threaten the world's third-largest thermonuclear power that possesses the most advanced W-88 warhead design and delivery vehicles. Crazy Indians with puny atomic weapons (which are roughly 1/100 as powerful as a similarly-sized hydrogen bomb) are asking for trouble and seeking their own self-extinction.

Yes, it is true you might successfully atomic nuke a few city blocks in a few Chinese cities. In response, we will thermonuke all of India and take your subcontinent as payment. The Indian capability to inflict limited damage upon Chinese cities will force China to fight India at full thermonuclear power. At last check, China had a minimum of 294 megatons and God knows how many more in 5,000km of underground tunnels.

Also, China can now legitimately claim that India poses a serious threat to its national security. China may choose to launch a preemptive strike (citing the Bush doctrine) against India at any time. In conclusion, I think the development of the Agni V is a detriment to Indian security and existence.

http://www.crf-usa.org/war-in-iraq/bush-doctrine.html

"The _Bush Doctrine_ The Iraq War [or China's War Against India] may only be the beginning of an ambitious American [Chinese] strategy to confront dangerous [Indian] regimes and expand democracy [Chinese national security] in the ..."


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## XName

The Dong Feng-5 (DF-5, NATO codename: CSS-4) is China&#8217;s first intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM). 
Developed by China Academy of Launch Vehicle (CALT, also known as 1st Aerospace Academy), it is a silo-based, two-stage, liquid propellant ballistic missile. The missile carries a single 3 megatons nuclear warhead and has an effective range of 12,000km. The DF-5A is the improved variant with an extended range. The PLA currently deploys approximately 24~36 of this missile deployed in central China. 

DongFeng-5 specifications:

Configuration: Two stage liquid
Length: 33m
Diameter: 3.4m
Launch Weight: 183,000kg
Propellant: Liquid fuel (Unsymmetrical Dimethylhydrazine/Nitrogen Tetroxide mix [UDMH/N2H4])
Guidance: Inertial with onboard computer
Range: 12,000km (DF-5); >13,000km (DF-5A)
Deployment: Silo and launch pad
Re-entry Vehicle Mass: ~3,000kg
Warhead: Single 3,000~5,000kT
CEP: ~1,000m
Launch Preparation Time: 120 min (mobile), or 45~60 min (in silo)

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## PäkPõwér

Martian2 said:


> It's 3.3 megatons of thermonuclear badass per DF-3A warhead.




and now we got DF-5 coming in!!!

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## XName

The DongFeng 11 (Export name: M-11; NATO codename: CSS-7)
The DongFeng 11 (Export name: M-11; NATO codename: CSS-7) is a road-mobile, single-stage, short-range ballistic missile (SRBM) system developed by CASIC Sanjiang Space Group (also known as Base 066) located in Hubei Province. The missile and its 8-wheeled transporter-erector-launcher (TEL) vehicle bear some resemblance to the Russian SS-1C Scud-B. The DongFeng 11 was developed in the 1980s intended for the export market. An improved variant DongFeng 11A with extended range and greater accuracy was fielded by the PLA ground forces in 1999. 

DongFeng-11 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 11 (DF-11)
Export name: M-11
NATO reporting name: CSS-7
Contractor: CASIC Sanjiang Space Group (Base 066)
Service status: In service
Configuration: Single-stage, solid propellant
Deployment: Road mobile, 6X6 tractor truck + six-wheel trailer; or silo
Length: 7.5m (DF-11); 8.5m (DF-11A)
Diameter: 0.8m
Launch weight: 4,200kg
Warhead: 500kg HE
Range: 280~350km (DF-11); >500km (DF-11A)
Accuracy: CEP 500~600m (DF-11); <200m (DF-11A)
Launch preparation time: 15~30 min

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## XName

The DongFeng 15 (Export name: M-9; NATO codename: CSS-6)
The DongFeng 15 (Export name: M-9; NATO codename: CSS-6) is a solid-fuel, short-range ballistic missile (SRBM) system developed by CASC China Academy of Rocket Motor Technology (ARMT, also known as 4th Space Academy). The missile became famous during the 1996 Taiwan Strait crisis when the PLA launched several missiles as a warning to Taiwan&#8217;s independent trend. It is the only non-nuclear missile in service with the PLA Second Artillery Corps (strategic missile force). The improved variants DongFeng 15B and DongFeng 15C were spotted in service with the PLA recently.

DongFeng-15 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 15 (DF-15)
Export name: M-9
NATO reporting name: CSS-6
Contractor: CASIC 4th Academy
Service status: In service
Configuration: Single-stage (DF-15) or two-stage (DF-15B, DF-15C), solid propellant
Deployment: Road mobile, 6X6 tractor truck + six-wheel trailer; or silo
Length: 9.1m (DF-15)
Diameter: 1.0m
Launch weight: 6,200kg
Warhead: 500kg HE
Range: 600km (DF-15)
Guidance: Inertial + GPS
Accuracy: CEP 150~500m; or 30~50m on the later variants
Launch preparation time: 15~30 min

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## cirr

I want to hear about the new members of the DF series&#65292;such as the DF-26 etc&#12290;&#12290;&#12290;&#12290;


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## PäkPõwér

Quite a collection.

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## cirr

what's the latest on DF-16&#12289;DF-25 and DF-27&#65311;


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## Anees

any video available ????


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## XName

The DongFeng 21 (NATO code name: CSS-5)
The DongFeng 21 (NATO code name: CSS-5) is a two-stage, solid-propellant, single-warhead medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) system developed by China Changfeng Mechanics and Electronics Technology Academy (also known as 2nd Space Academy). The missile design is based on the two-stage JuLang 1 submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM). The DongFeng 21 is capable of delivering a 500kT nuclear warhead over a distance of 1,800km. Some DongFeng 21 missiles are reportedly armed with a conventional warhead. The improved DongFeng 21A with extended range was reportedly introduced in 1996. China has also developed the Kaituozhe 1 (KT-1) space launch vehicle based on the DongFeng 21 design. 


DongFeng-21 specifications:

Official name: DongFeng 21 (DF-21)
NATO reporting name: CSS-5
Contractor: CASIC 2nd Academy
Service status: In service
Configuration: Two-stage, solid propellant
Deployment: Road mobile, 6X6 tractor truck + six-wheel trailer; or silo
Length: 10.7m
Diameter: 1.4m
Launch weight: 14,700kg
Range: 1,770km
Re-entry vehicle mass: 600kg
Warhead: One single 500kT yield, or conventional
Guidance: Inertial + terminal radar guidance
Accuracy: CEP 300~400m

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## XName

DongFeng 21C Medium-Range Ballistic Missile: 
DongFeng 21C Medium-Range Ballistic Missile: The PLA Second Artillery Corps fielded a new type conventionally-armed, solid-propellant, mobile-launch medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) in 2004~05. Carried and launched from a wheeled 10X10 transporter-erector-launcher (TEL) vehicle, the missile is believed to be capable of delivering a single and multiple conventional warheads weighing 2,000kg and have a maximum range of 1,700km.

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## XName

DongFeng 31 (CSS-9) Intercontinental Ballistic Missile: 
DongFeng 31 (CSS-9) Intercontinental Ballistic Missile: The most advanced Chinese ballistic missile currently in service, the DF-31 replaced the DF-4 originally introduced in the 1970s. The missile first debut in the 1999 National day military parade.The DongFeng-31 (DF-31, NATO codename: CSS-9) is an intercontinental-range, road-mobile, solid-propellant ballistic missile developed by Academy of Rocket Motor Technology (ARMT, also known as 4th Aerospace Academy). The missile was developed as a land-based version of the JL-2 submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM). The most advanced ballistic missile currently in service, the DF-31 features higher mobility and therefore better survivability compared to the last generation Chinese ICBM. 

DongFeng-31 specifications:

Configuration: Three stage
Length: 13m
Diameter: 2.25m
Launch Weight: 42,000kg
Propellant: Solid fuel
Guidance: Inertial + stellar update
Range: 8,000km (DF-31); 10,000km (DF-31A)
Deployment: Silo or road mobile
Re-entry Vehicle Mass: 1,050~1,750kg
Warhead: One single 1,000kT, or up to three 20~150kT multiple independently targeted re-entry vehicle (MIRV)
CEP: 100~300m
Launch Preparation Time: ~15 min

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## XName

sorry,never heard of that,all above posts come from sinodefenceforum,thanks to escobar


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## XName

[video]http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDIxNjk0NTcy.html[/video]
[video]http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzk4ODg3ODMy.html[/video]
[video]http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDMyMDQwMjg0.html[/video]

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## Martian2

You missed one. 

----------

*DF-41 ICBM: China's answer to American NMD*

Aside from building more road- and rail-mobile DF-31As, what's next for China's ICBM program? The obvious answer is the DF-41 with 10 MIRVs.

China's ICBM nuclear forces were quiescent for 20 years until "President George W. Bush formally announced December 13 [2001] that the United States will unilaterally withdraw from the Anti-Ballistic Missile (ABM) Treaty." (See Withdrawal from ABM treaty signals escalation of US militarism)

The formal withdrawal occurred six months after notification, when "the United States withdrew from the landmark 1972 Anti-Ballistic Missile (ABM) Treaty on June 13 [2002]." (See U.S. Withdraws From ABM Treaty; Global Response Muted | Arms Control Association)

The Chinese response was swift. China had possessed the basic technology for MIRVs in 1981, but only tested it after the United States withdrew from the ABM treaty in 2002. China's first known successful MIRV test occurred in December 2002, six months after the U.S. withdrawal from the ABM treaty.

To preserve China's security through mutually-assured-destruction, China must maintain a capability to inflict sufficient damage in a counter-strike. Towards that strategic objective, China is building the DF-41 with 10 MIRVs to overwhelm any American National Missile Defense (NMD) shield.

In a counter-strike, for every DF-41 with 10 warheads, the United States must build 10 interceptors. There is also the question of how many interceptors will succeed (e.g. the success rate). I am leaving aside the question of whether the NMD is viable at all. For example, if China attacked the sea-based X-band radar sites then the NMD will be significantly impaired.

Anyway, it will always be far cheaper for China to build DF-41 ICBMs and much more expensive to defend against them. Ten DF-41s with 10 MIRVs each will require 100 interceptors. 100 DF-41s with 10 MIRVs each will require 1,000 interceptors. It is pointless to build a NMD against a near-peer opponent. The other side can easily overwhelm a NMD system.

I will leave it to you to decide whether America was safer prior to President Bush's withdrawal from the ABM treaty. Prior to 2002, China only had 20 DF-5s capable of a counter-strike against the United States. Forced to counter President Bush's NMD initiative, China is on its way to becoming armed with an ever-increasing number of MIRVs.





According to Jane's Defense, China's DF-41 ICBM is capable of carrying 10 MIRVs. (See http://articles.janes.com/articles/Janes-S...-X10-China.html)





Closer look at DF-41





DF-41 seen on a public road. *Look carefully at the unique double-ring with multiple horizontal bars on the end of the DF-41 canister. It is the same design in both the top and bottom pictures.
*

----------

*Jane's June 21, 2011 article on DF-41 ICBM*

DF-41 (CSS-X-10) (China) - Jane's Strategic Weapon Systems

"*DF-41 (CSS-X-10) (China)...*

*Type*

Inter-continental range, road/rail mobile, solid propellant, single warhead or MIRV-capable ballistic missile.

*Development*

The Chinese are believed to have started the design and development of the Dong Feng-41 (DF-41) in 1986, with the operational requirement to have a solid-propellant, road mobile, ballistic missile with a *range of 12,000 km* to replace the CSS-4 (DF-5 and DF-5A) liquid-propellant missiles. The development for DF-41 is believed to be managed by the China Aerospace Sciences and Industry Corporation (CASIC), Beijing (it was the First Academy of the Ministry of Aerospace Industries). The flight test programme is managed by the 2nd Artillery Corps, based at the Wuzhai test centre in Shanxi province. There has been one reported ground test and a simulated cold launch in October 1999, but no test flights to date, although a test was reported to have been in preparation in September 2001. Original reports stated that DF-41 used the first two stages of the DF-31, with a lengthened third stage, but it is now believed that this description referred to the DF-31A, and that the DF-41 is a new design. It is believed that the NATO designator is CSS-X-10. Reports in 1996 suggested that DF-41 would have between two and nine Multiple Independently Targeted Re-entry Vehicle (MIRV) warheads, but it is possible that the initial build missiles will have provision for either a single warhead or *up to 10 MIRV*. In 2001 both rail-car and cross-country Transporter-Erector-Launcher (TEL) projects were noted for DF-31, and it is presumed that these might also be adapted later for DF-41. These launchers appeared to use a rail-car."

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## sweetgrape

XName said:


> ä¸*å&#8250;½æ´²é&#8482;&#8230;å¯¼å¼¹å&#8216;å±&#8226;å²â&#8364;&#8221;å&#339;¨çº¿æ&#8217;*æ&#8221;¾â&#8364;&#8221;ä¼&#732;é&#8230;·ç½&#8216;ï¼&#338;è§&#8224;é¢&#8216;é«&#732;æ¸&#8230;å&#339;¨çº¿è§&#8218;ç&#339;&#8249;
> Japan! To the Diaoyu Islands? Or to Life?


Very awesome Video!
China strategic missiles are not well unknown by the world, even Chinese don't know it well, only a few be leaked to the world, that's why chinese are proud of them!!
Let's thank the people who work hard for our missile project or even die for it, because of their hard work, let our country have comprehensive and powful missile and rocket industry, we don't need depend on other countries completely, although our Warplane and Warship have to seek for help from others, but China missile will let any rival think twice before attack china!!
Thank all the people who work for missile again. and I hope one day chinese scientist can build the best engine for plane, warship and any other vehicle!!!

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## trinity

Martian2 said:


> It's 3.3 megatons of thermonuclear badass per DF-3A warhead.
> 
> ----------
> 
> *Chinese DF-3A 3.3-megaton IRBM*
> 
> Contrary to the exultation in the Indian media, I believe the development of the Agni V increases the danger to all Indians. Basically, it makes all Indians less safe and more likely to become extinct. Here's why.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DF-3A/CSS-2 IRBM with 3.3 megaton warhead
> 
> Citation: Securing India's Future in the New Millennium - Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - Google Books
> 
> "Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - 1999 - History - 612 pages
> *China's missile choices against India include the DF 3 and DF 3A, armed with a 3.3-megaton thermonuclear warhead* and capable of hitting targets up to 2800 ..."
> 
> China has a multitude of IRBMs with thermonuclear 3.3 megaton warheads that can easily obliterate an entire Indian city with a single blast.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A single 3.3 megaton DF-3A strike by China would instantly vaporize New Delhi.
> 
> In contrast, a 20 kiloton atomic warhead delivered by an Agni V (that survives China's missile defenses) causes relatively minor damage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For comparison purposes, an Indian 20 kiloton blast on New Delhi is hardly noticeable.
> 
> The impudence of Indians to trumpet their "China killer" and if they are actually stupid enough to launch one at a major Chinese city will bring terrible retribution. China can legitimately claim India has used a Weapon of Mass Destruction (WMD) against Chinese civilians and choose to respond in kind.
> 
> Unfortunately for Indians, China will destroy every major and minor Indian city to drive home the message that the use of a WMD against a Chinese city means self-genocide for dumb Indians.
> 
> The bottom line is you do not threaten the world's third-largest thermonuclear power that possesses the most advanced W-88 warhead design and delivery vehicles. Crazy Indians with puny atomic weapons (which are roughly 1/100 as powerful as a similarly-sized hydrogen bomb) are asking for trouble and seeking their own self-extinction.
> 
> Yes, it is true you might successfully atomic nuke a few city blocks in a few Chinese cities. In response, we will thermonuke all of India and take your subcontinent as payment. The Indian capability to inflict limited damage upon Chinese cities will force China to fight India at full thermonuclear power. At last check, China had a minimum of 294 megatons and God knows how many more in 5,000km of underground tunnels.
> 
> Also, China can now legitimately claim that India poses a serious threat to its national security. China may choose to launch a preemptive strike (citing the Bush doctrine) against India at any time. In conclusion, I think the development of the Agni V is a detriment to Indian security and existence.
> 
> Bush Doctrine - Constitutional Rights Foundation
> 
> "The _Bush Doctrine_ The Iraq War [or China's War Against India] may only be the beginning of an ambitious American [Chinese] strategy to confront dangerous [Indian] regimes and expand democracy [Chinese national security] in the ..."





Yeah but India won;t attack China ever. India has stated its weapons are purely for defensive purposes. If and when China invades India, then these nukes can be used on it's forces who have trespassed into their country. Hitting your military within India is fair game and with proper evidence, the entire world will see China as the sole aggressor. Win - Win if you ask me.


More importantly, you put India in a corner and this is your weakness. By underestimating your enemy, you have given India an advantage. There is no way you can tell that such powerful nukes have not been prepared already. Though there is no testing, computer simulations have come a long, long way. I suspect India may be hiding and guarding whatever advantages it may have. Just call it a hunch.


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## sweetgrape

trinity said:


> Yeah but India won;t attack China ever. India has stated its weapons are purely for defensive purposes. If and when China invades India, then these nukes can be used on it's forces who have trespassed into their country. Hitting your military within India is fair game and with proper evidence, the entire world will see China as the sole aggressor. Win - Win if you ask me.
> 
> 
> More importantly, you put India in a corner and this is your weakness. By underestimating your enemy, you have given India an advantage. There is no way you can tell that such powerful nukes have not been prepared already. Though there is no testing, computer simulations have come a long, long way. I suspect India may be hiding and guarding whatever advantages it may have. Just call it a hunch.


Excuse me, Seems here, we didn't mention india, I don't know why should we invade you? What do you have can deserve our "invasion"? even there are war between china and india, that's because of the disputed area!
Please don't deviate this thread, this is about china strategic missile. we just want to some "self complacence", If you talk about china and india NUKE, open a new one, OK, thanks!

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## chauism

page issue


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## Kesang

sweetgrape said:


> *Excuse me, Seems here, we didn't mention india*, I don't know why should we invade you? What do you have can deserve our "invasion"? even there are war between china and india, that's because of the disputed area!
> Please don't deviate this thread, this is about china strategic missile. we just want to some "self complacence", If you talk about china and india NUKE, open a new one, OK, thanks!



are you blind? Just look at the post whom he replied.




Martian2 said:


> It's 3.3 megatons of thermonuclear badass per DF-3A warhead.
> 
> ----------
> 
> *Chinese DF-3A 3.3-megaton IRBM*
> 
> Contrary to the exultation in the Indian media, I believe the development of the Agni V increases the danger to all Indians. Basically, it makes all Indians less safe and more likely to become extinct. Here's why.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DF-3A/CSS-2 IRBM with 3.3 megaton warhead
> 
> Citation: Securing India's Future in the New Millennium - Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - Google Books
> 
> "Brahma Chellaney, Centre for Policy Research (New Delhi, India) - 1999 - History - 612 pages
> *China's missile choices against India include the DF 3 and DF 3A, armed with a 3.3-megaton thermonuclear warhead* and capable of hitting targets up to 2800 ..."
> 
> China has a multitude of IRBMs with thermonuclear 3.3 megaton warheads that can easily obliterate an entire Indian city with a single blast.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A single 3.3 megaton DF-3A strike by China would instantly vaporize New Delhi.
> 
> In contrast, a 20 kiloton atomic warhead delivered by an Agni V (that survives China's missile defenses) causes relatively minor damage.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For comparison purposes, an Indian 20 kiloton blast on New Delhi is hardly noticeable.
> 
> The impudence of Indians to trumpet their "China killer" and if they are actually stupid enough to launch one at a major Chinese city will bring terrible retribution. China can legitimately claim India has used a Weapon of Mass Destruction (WMD) against Chinese civilians and choose to respond in kind.
> 
> Unfortunately for Indians, China will destroy every major and minor Indian city to drive home the message that the use of a WMD against a Chinese city means self-genocide for dumb Indians.
> 
> The bottom line is you do not threaten the world's third-largest thermonuclear power that possesses the most advanced W-88 warhead design and delivery vehicles. Crazy Indians with puny atomic weapons (which are roughly 1/100 as powerful as a similarly-sized hydrogen bomb) are asking for trouble and seeking their own self-extinction.
> 
> Yes, it is true you might successfully atomic nuke a few city blocks in a few Chinese cities. In response, we will thermonuke all of India and take your subcontinent as payment. The Indian capability to inflict limited damage upon Chinese cities will force China to fight India at full thermonuclear power. At last check, China had a minimum of 294 megatons and God knows how many more in 5,000km of underground tunnels.
> 
> Also, China can now legitimately claim that India poses a serious threat to its national security. China may choose to launch a preemptive strike (citing the Bush doctrine) against India at any time. In conclusion, I think the development of the Agni V is a detriment to Indian security and existence.
> 
> Bush Doctrine - Constitutional Rights Foundation
> 
> "The _Bush Doctrine_ The Iraq War [or China's War Against India] may only be the beginning of an ambitious American [Chinese] strategy to confront dangerous [Indian] regimes and expand democracy [Chinese national security] in the ..."


 
^^ you can't see the name of India in this post?

Who dragged India here?

Who is talking about agni V and India in place of china's strategic missile?


----------



## sweetgrape

Kesang said:


> are you blind? Just look at the post whom he replied.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^^ you can't see the name of India in this post?
> 
> Who dragged India here?
> 
> Who is talking about agni V and India in place of china's strategic missile?


Sorry, My fault, I am short lighted, Didn't find "india"!!


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## Broccoli

Does anyone here know what model this truck is? Dimensions of it etc. Pzkilo suggested that it is "ws51200" but that truck is too large, and Google search gave me pictures of different trucks using that same name. 





This new TEL (seen few months ago) seems to be using that truck but with few modifications. 





Knowing that trucks dimensions would make it easier to estimate length of that missile canister.


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## grey boy 2

Broccoli said:


> Does anyone here know what model this truck is? Dimensions of it etc. Pzkilo suggested that it is "ws51200" but that truck is too large, and Google search gave me pictures of different trucks using that same name.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This new TEL (seen few months ago) seems to be using that truck but with few modifications.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Knowing that trucks dimensions would make it easier to estimate length of that missile canister.



Perhaps its this one?


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## Broccoli

Yeah, that looks more like it. DF-21's length is almost 11m and that missile canister what this new TEL is carrying should be at least 15m.


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## Martian2

Broccoli said:


> Does anyone here know what model this truck is? Dimensions of it etc. Pzkilo suggested that it is "ws51200" but that truck is too large, and Google search gave me pictures of different trucks using that same name.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This new TEL (seen few months ago) seems to be using that truck but with few modifications.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Knowing that trucks dimensions would make it easier to estimate length of that missile canister.



Bill Gertz claims the new thermonuclear-capable Chinese 4,000km IRBM (to potentially strike Guam) is "about 25 to 30 percent larger than the DF-21 missile."

Additional excerpt: "Chinese military bloggers said the new missile is different from the already deployed DF-31 intercontinental ballistic missile, and also *six feet longer than the DF-21 medium-range missile*."

Reference: China Unveils New Nuke Missile

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> I have suggested China may fire 100 DF-21D ASBMs to arrive near-simultaneously and attack an aircraft carrier. However, is this economically feasible? As shown in the citation below, each DF-21D ASBM costs between $5 to $10.5 million per missile.


 
How are these missiles guided? 

if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory. 

may i ask how they are guided?

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## Alpery

amalakas said:


> How are these missiles guided?
> 
> if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory.
> 
> may i ask how they are guided?



good question
how they are guided?
if its not deleted by her Hu Songshan

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## gambit

> amalakas said:
> 
> 
> 
> How are these missiles guided?
> 
> if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory.
> 
> may i ask how they are guided?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alpery said:
> 
> 
> 
> good question
> how they are guided?
> if its not deleted by her Hu Songshan
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

He will probably say something vague like 'terminal guidance', as if he understands the proper context of 'terminal' here.


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## amalakas

gambit said:


> He will probably say something vague like 'terminal guidance', as if he understands the proper context of 'terminal' here.



It will be interesting to see what the response will be. This is a genuine case where I am really curious to find out. 


let's see.


----------



## April.lyrics

amalakas said:


> How are these missiles guided?
> 
> if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory.
> 
> may i ask how they are guided?


 
er..only my personal opinion here:will it be similar as space shuffle or x-37?


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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> How are these missiles guided?
> 
> if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory.
> 
> may i ask how they are guided?



Take your pick.

1. GPS via Beidou satellites.

2. Active radar during terminal phase.

3. Infrared during terminal phase.

4. Optical (via TV) during terminal phase.

5. Laser guidance via targeting by (stealth) drone.

These are all standard and proven terminal guidance systems.

6. Theoretically, if a Chinese submarine or SOSUS has triangulated the acoustic location of the carriers then the data can be relayed to a missile and inertial guidance may be sufficient. After all, some of the 100 missiles should strike the carrier if the CEP is sufficiently reasonable or an "area effect" warhead like flechettes are used.

7. Theoretically, a warhead can act like an anti-radiation missile and home in on the carrier's electromagnetic radiation (e.g. emitted radar or radio communications).


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## SinoChallenger

Submarine, UAV and satellites transmit re-entry coordinates to the MaRV.

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## ice bomb

You can be sure that USN wont let any UAV or subs get anywhere near the carrier. And track a carrier group in the middle of an ocean with satellites? Please tell me it is a joke....


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## Martian2

ice bomb said:


> You can be sure that USN wont let any UAV or subs get anywhere near the carrier. And track a carrier group in the middle of an ocean with satellites? Please tell me it is a joke....



Why not? I don't remember the U.S. being immune to (stealth) UAVs and having a perfect record of detecting and shooting down UAVs.

Also, why doesn't the U.S. have to fight Chinese subs? China has 71 subs. U.S. only has 60. The Chinese know the waters off their coast very well. Their subs practice there all the time. As far as I know, the U.S. does not hold its submarine drills in Chinese waters. The advantage lies with the Chinese submarine force.

What's wrong with tracking carrier groups with satellites? Have you never heard of optical (during the day) or infrared (during the night) satellites? You think the search radars and radio communications from carrier groups cannot be detected by planes, UAVs, or satellites?

The joke is your stupidity.

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> Take your pick.



if i have to take my pick, does that mean that the actual info is not out there right ? 
Essentially an assumptions game. 
Now that we have established that, let go down the list. 

1. GPS via Beidou satellites. If I am not mistaken, these satellites are only providing position, they are not targeting satellites.Right?

2. Active radar during terminal phase. - A possibility, although the technical hurdles of such an approach have been exhaustively presented. Even with the more advance radar one can possibly imagine, the approach has many weaknesses.

3. Infrared during terminal phase. - A slightly more robust method. It a lower potential system to start with, but the more robust one

4. Optical (via TV) during terminal phase. -- laughable.

5. Laser guidance via targeting by (stealth) drone. A technological possibility, unlikely though. A simple LWR would make the Drone long before any missiles get there. 

These are all standard and proven terminal guidance systems. -- Yes, for once we agree. But not for such a weapon use as your favorite carrier killer missile. 

6. Theoretically, if a Chinese submarine or SOSUS has triangulated the acoustic location of the carriers then the data can be relayed to a missile and inertial guidance may be sufficient. After all, some of the 100 missiles should strike the carrier if the CEP is sufficiently reasonable or an "area effect" warhead like flechettes are used.

you are just forgetting that the carrier would have moved about 13Km in the meantime. That is a large distance.

7. Theoretically, a warhead can act like an anti-radiation missile and home in on the carrier's electromagnetic radiation (e.g. emitted radar or radio communications). 

perhaps, but that would mean it has a seeker far more advanced than anything currently out there. I am not saying it is not possible, but if such a seeker existed we would have seen smaller versions in advanced anti radiation missiles from china. Perhaps I have missed it, but I don't remember that.


----------



## Alpery

Martian2 said:


> Take your pick.
> 
> 1. GPS via Beidou satellites.
> 
> 2. Active radar during terminal phase.
> 
> 
> 3. Infrared during terminal phase.
> 
> 4. Optical (via TV) during terminal phase.
> 
> 5. Laser guidance via targeting by (stealth) drone.
> 
> These are all standard and proven terminal guidance systems.
> 
> 6. Theoretically, if a Chinese submarine or SOSUS has triangulated the acoustic location of the carriers then the data can be relayed to a missile and inertial guidance may be sufficient. After all, some of the 100 missiles should strike the carrier if the CEP is sufficiently reasonable or an "area effect" warhead like flechettes are used.
> 
> 7. Theoretically, a warhead can act like an anti-radiation missile and home in on the carrier's electromagnetic radiation (e.g. emitted radar or radio communications).



what's the speeds of MaRV during re-entry and impact/blast ?

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## chauism

Alpery said:


> what's the speeds of MaRV during re-entry and impact/blast ?



Impact speed for MIRV is at a speed of up to 4 km/s (for early ICBMs less than 1 km/s)


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## amalakas

Alpery said:


> what's the speeds of MaRV during re-entry and impact/blast ?



conservative estimations put a high limit of less than 22 seconds for the warhead to search track and lock on at terminal phase. 

Again conservative estimates place the target at any position within a 13-15 km radius from it's original position when the missile was launched.


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## SinoChallenger

amalakas said:


> conservative estimations put a high limit of less than 22 seconds for the warhead to search track and lock on at terminal phase.
> 
> *Again conservative estimates place the target at any position within a 13-15 km radius from it's original position when the missile was launched.*


 What a foolish and illogical reply! The guy has never heard of flight controls and he's posting endless garbage on Chinese threads to delude himself against fear of China.

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## gambit

Martian2 said:


> Why not? I don't remember the U.S. being immune to (stealth) UAVs and having a perfect record of detecting and shooting down UAVs.


Remember? What do you know in the first place in order to 'remember'? Considering we are the only country currently using more UAVs than the rest of the world *COMBINED* and that the USAF graduated more UAV controllers than aircraft pilots, what make you think we do not know how to counter UAVs? Because *YOU* do not 'remember'?  And do you really think the US military will reveal the know-how?



Martian2 said:


> Also, why doesn't the U.S. have to fight Chinese subs? China has 71 subs. U.S. only has 60.


Ridiculous argument. Despite what the movie 'Red October' may entertained, subs do not gang up on each other. The US have far more experience than China in submarine warfare and in any mano-a-mano engagement, go to Vegas if you want to bet on the Chinese sub.



Martian2 said:


> The Chinese know the waters off their coast very well. Their subs practice there all the time. As far as I know, the U.S. does not hold its submarine drills in Chinese waters. The advantage lies with the Chinese submarine force.


Bunk. The US know the Chinese coastal region quite well. We go there a lot during the Cold War.



Martian2 said:


> What's wrong with tracking carrier groups with satellites? Have you never heard of optical (during the day) or infrared (during the night) satellites?


Satellites move and eventually will lose its line-of-sight. Does China have enough satellites to track? Doubtful at this time.



Martian2 said:


> You think the search radars and radio communications from carrier groups cannot be detected by planes, UAVs, or satellites?


We have far more experience at EMCON than China does.

Enterprises EW Module Stays Below the Radar


> During EMCON Alpha, no emissions are permitted at all.


Back in Apr 1986, the USS Ranger left San Diego and entered EMCON Alpha and for two weeks she conducted 'air assaults' with no one able to find her.

Tell the PLAN to try harder. Much much harder.



SinusChallenged said:


> What a foolish and illogical reply. Such a desperate attempt at self-delusion.


You mean it went whoooosh over your head and that is all you can say to cover for your lack of understanding.


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## SinoChallenger

gambit said:


> You mean it went whoooosh over your head and that is all you can say to cover for your lack of understanding.


 Yeah so says some janitor pretending to be General MacArthur online.

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## j20blackdragon

The easiest way to counter the US Navy is to nuke Yokosuka, Sasebo, and Naval base Guam.

100 DF-41s can nuke 1,000 US cities.

Bring it on. 

http://freebeacon.com/manchu-missile-launch/

PLA test-fired multiple warhead ICBM in July: Jane's Defence Weekly

Pentagon plans new missile defences in Asia - Telegraph

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## j20blackdragon

Destroy these 3 bases and the US Navy is gone. I'll even post the links. You decide if you want to go nuclear or conventional. It doesn't really matter. 

Commander Fleet Activities Yokosuka

Commander Fleet Activities Sasebo

Naval Base Guam

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## Martian2

Alpery said:


> what's the speeds of MaRV during re-entry and impact/blast ?



During the terminal phase:

Chinese DF-15 SRBM has a terminal speed of Mach 6 (see citation below).

Chinese DF-21D IRBM has a terminal speed of Mach 10.

Chinese DF-5/DF-31/DF-31A ICBM has a terminal speed of Mach 23.

----------

*Indian missile defense won't work against hypersonic Chinese ballistic missiles*

Shooting down a Prithvi SRBM



> Gentlemen, your view on this .....
> 
> *The Hindu : News / National : Interceptor scores a direct hit on target missile*


It depends on whether the interceptor shot down a Prithvi I/II or a Prithvi III SRBM.

A Prithvi I SRBM has a range of 150km. A Prithvi II has a range of 250km.

For an interceptor to shoot down a Prithvi I, it's really not that hard. A Prithvi I is liquid fueled, which should have a lower energy density than a solid-fueled missile. Also, given the limited range of 150km, the incoming warhead will have a very slow speed.

Shooting down a Prithvi II is better performance. Given the greater 250-350km range of a Prithvi II, the incoming warhead should travel a little faster than a Prithvi I.

Since a Prithvi III is solid-fueled and has the greatest range at 350-600km range. Shooting down a Prithvi III warhead would be the best performance, because the warhead should be traveling faster than a Prithvi I or II.

However, in the end, the interceptor only shot down a SRBM.

I would have to research the answer, but a SRBM warhead moves pretty slowly. It's nice for India to develop a defense against a SRBM.

I know a Chinese DF-21D ASBM travels at Mach 10. As far as I know, the United States has no reliable defense against an incoming IRBM warhead.

An ICBM warhead travels at Mach 23. No known conventional technology can intercept an incoming ICBM MARV. You might get lucky with a Nike Hercules-type nuclear interceptor, but then you'll become blind to the follow-up nuclear strike.

In conclusion, an interceptor against a SRBM is a nice beginning. To become truly useful, the technology must be extended and shown to reliably intercept Mach 10 IRBMs and Mach 23 ICBMs.

References:

Prithvi (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

LGM-30 Minuteman III ICBM - United States Nuclear Forces

"Speed:	Approximately 15,000 mph (Mach 23 or 24,000 kph) at burnout"

----------

Indian AAD/Prithvi interceptor won't work against China's DF-15 SRBM with MARV warhead

The Indian Prithvi AAD works only against dumb warheads that travel in a predictable trajectory. Basically, a Prithvi interceptor was used to shoot down another Prithvi SRBM.

A Chinese DF-15 SRBM is a completely different story. A DF-15 has a maneuverable warhead (MARV or maneuverable reentry vehicle). I don't think the U.S. can shoot down an incoming Mach 6 MARV under real world conditions.

Technically speaking, it is impossible for a supersonic Prithvi to intercept a Mach 6 DF-15 MARV warhead. You need a steerable hypersonic interceptor kill vehicle that can travel at least Mach 6 to have a chance.






Chinese DF-15 SRBM (short-range ballistic missile) with 600km range has a terminal velocity of over Mach 6. China's hypersonic DF-15 SRBM cannot be intercepted by slow-moving supersonic Indian AAD interceptor missile.

----------

DF-15 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The DF-15 uses a solid fuel, single-stage rocket. It is vertically launched from an eight wheeled transporter erector launcher (TEL). The missile's trajectory is guided using small thrusters and an inertial guidance system on the warhead. The warhead is only a tenth of the size of the missile body. After the body and warhead separate, the body trails behind to camouflage the warhead. The terminal velocity of the missile is over Mach 6.[3]
...
*Warhead* One, with Maneuverable reentry vehicles [1]

*Blast yield* 350-500 kT"

----------

Too many intractable problems in defending against China

India has lots of problems.

1. Too many Chinese missiles. China has 1,800 SRBMs stationed near the Taiwan coast. It will bankrupt India to build that many interceptors.

2. Chinese DF-15 MARVs traveling at Mach 6 cannot be intercepted with current supersonic Indian AAD interceptor. The technology required is completely different.

3. China is working on stealth HN-2000 cruise missiles. India has a whole host of new problems in trying to protect its interceptor batteries.

4. In a few years, J-20 stealth fighters will be ready. India has to defend its military installations against J-20s as well.

5. India has to defend against WS-2C (350km range) and WS-2D (400km range) MLRS.

6. MIRV problem. The DF-31, DF-31A, and JL-2 all carry 3 MIRVs. It's more economical for China to build MIRVed missiles than it will ever be for India to build interceptors for each warhead. Also, the DF-41 with 10 MIRVs per missile is almost ready. It will never make sense to build 10 interceptors to defend against one DF-41.

I could extend the list, but you get the point. It's a bad position to be that far behind the technological curve.

It's a nightmare to try and build a defense system against a mature missile power like China. China will either destroy your missile defense system first (e.g. stealth strike or overwhelming missile strikes), evade it with MARVs, or overwhelm it with MIRVs.

----------

As far as I can tell, the U.S. seems to have lost enthusiasm for its ballistic missile defense (BMD) system. China can build triple-MIRVed DF-31A and 10-MIRVed DF-41 ICBMs a lot faster than the U.S. can build interceptors in Alaska.

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## j20blackdragon

If Japan is smart, they will stay neutral in any conflict between the US and China. They stand to lose *everything* if they get involved.

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## amalakas

SinoChallenger said:


> What a foolish and illogical reply! The guy has never heard of flight controls and he's posting endless garbage on Chinese threads to delude himself against fear of China.



my intellectually challenged friend, the missile will take some time to get to the carrier. At maximum range that is about 14-15 minutes of flight time. 

at 35 knots a carrier will cover 14-15 kilometres in that amount of time. Do you understand or do you want me to do the math for you ????

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## anarchy 99

gambit said:


> Remember? What do you know in the first place in order to 'remember'? Considering we are the only country currently using more UAVs than the rest of the world *COMBINED* and that the USAF graduated more UAV controllers than aircraft pilots, what make you think we do not know how to counter UAVs? Because *YOU* do not 'remember'?  And do you really think the US military will reveal the know-how?
> 
> 
> Ridiculous argument. Despite what the movie 'Red October' may entertained, subs do not gang up on each other. The US have far more experience than China in submarine warfare and in any mano-a-mano engagement, go to Vegas if you want to bet on the Chinese sub.
> 
> 
> Bunk. The US know the Chinese coastal region quite well. We go there a lot during the Cold War.
> 
> 
> Satellites move and eventually will lose its line-of-sight. Does China have enough satellites to track? Doubtful at this time.
> 
> 
> We have far more experience at EMCON than China does.
> 
> Enterprise&#8217;s EW Module Stays Below the Radar
> 
> Back in Apr 1986, the USS Ranger left San Diego and entered EMCON Alpha and for two weeks she conducted 'air assaults' with no one able to find her.
> 
> Tell the PLAN to try harder. Much much harder.
> 
> 
> You mean it went whoooosh over your head and that is all you can say to cover for your lack of understanding.



 The self proclaimed 'expert' in military affairs gambit at it again. 
You are delusional old man, your old age is frying your brain. Leave your house to get some fresh air, china's rise is making you frustrated and angry. 

Oh by the way, tell the shupa powah US military to try much much much harder if they want to beat the PLA. Last time the so called 'invinsible' US military messed with China in the Korean war, the yanks got a good ole spanking.
Wear that spanking with pride, keep it as a badge of honour.

Don't write checks your military can't cash son. Korean war should've taught you that.

Ta!

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## Alpery

is it possible to use infrared and radar dedector by mach10..I think heat will appear
also..maneuverability is a problem at that speed..if you reduce the speed CIWS can destroy all MaRVs


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## Martian2

Alpery said:


> is it possible to use infrared and radar dedector by mach10..I think heat will appear
> also..maneuverability is a problem at that speed..if you reduce the speed CIWS can destroy all MaRVs



*Heat caused by troposphere is irrelevant to DF-21D ASBM targeting*

You do realize the DF-21D travels at Mach 10, which is 3,314 meters per second.

The troposphere is the densest part of the atmosphere (which comprises 80% of the total atmosphere) and it is 10km thick.

Before entering the troposphere, the radar and infrared detectors on the DF-21D can identify the location of its target. The target will be struck in 3 seconds. How far do you think a ship can move in 3 seconds? Also, the DF-21D's detectors can probably track the moving ship and predict its exact location in the next three seconds.

The heat caused by entering the troposphere is irrelevant to a DF-21D warhead.

----------

I've already previously stated a CIWS can only destroy missiles on a horizontal trajectory, not a vertical trajectory like a MARV.


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## Alpery

is this ilustration of MaRV true..
heat does not appers only at troposphere..
you cant know the ship will turn rigth or left..a war ship can move at least 50 m within 3 second..
do you calculate inertia of MIRVs at Mach10?


why 88 degree of CIWS not enougth? (high:1000 meters)


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## Martian2

Alpery said:


> is this ilustration of MaRV true..
> heat does not appers only at troposphere..
> you cant know the ship will turn rigth or left..a war ship can move at least 50 m within 3 second..
> do you calculate inertia of MIRVs at Mach10?
> 
> 
> why 88 degree of CIWS not enougth? (high:1000 meters)



*Who cares if an aircraft carrier moved 50m linearly? Outcome doesn't change*

Use your common sense. The DF-21D warhead is 10km overhead. Do you think you can move a CIWS into exact alignment in 3 seconds to shoot down a Mach 10 missile in 3-D space.

Go ahead, show me a video of a CIWS vertical shootdown of a hypersonic warhead. Tell you what, I'll make it easy for you. Show me a CIWS vertical shootdown of a mere supersonic ballistic warhead and I will be willing to concede this discussion to you.

Both Admiral Willard and a Chinese official have both stated the DF-21D ASBM can hit a slow-moving ship. You are trying to raise potential technical issues. We have already moved beyond that. If I show you the quotes, will you stop raising spurious technical issues?

----------

By the way, you said a ship can move 50m in 3 seconds. I fail to see the relevance.

Do you know the length of an aircraft carrier or do you want me to give you a citation for it?

Let me ask you a simple question. Let's assume the DF-21D warhead CAN'T determine the linear velocity of an aircraft carrier and predict its future location in 3 seconds (which is obviously ridiculous), would the DF-21D ASBM warhead still hit an aircraft carrier if it moved 50m linearly?


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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> *Heat caused by troposphere is irrelevant to DF-21D ASBM targeting*
> 
> You do realize the DF-21D travels at Mach 10, which is 3,314 meters per second.
> 
> The troposphere is the densest part of the atmosphere (which comprises 80% of the total atmosphere) and it is 10km thick.
> 
> Before entering the troposphere, the radar and infrared detectors on the DF-21D can identify the location of its target. The target will be struck in 3 seconds. How far do you think a ship can move in 3 seconds? Also, the DF-21D's detectors can probably track the moving ship and predict its exact location in the next three seconds.
> 
> The heat caused by entering the troposphere is irrelevant to a DF-21D warhead.
> 
> ----------
> 
> I've already previously stated a CIWS can only destroy missiles on a horizontal trajectory, not a vertical trajectory like a MARV.



let's have a look at this:


Temp, 5.0 km/sec in inertial frame, 100 km starting altitude





It shows heating is *not* during the troposphere descent.
In actual fact it shows the opposite.


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## j20blackdragon

Who cares about the DF-21D?

China will completely destroy Yokosuka, Sasebo, and Naval Base Guam.

J-20 and J-15 will handle the remaining surface ships.

Y-8 ASW will handle the submarines.

Any questions?

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## Alpery

is this ilustration of MaRV true (post^# 108 l am still waiting)
what I said:
"..if you reduce the speed CIWS can destroy all MaRVs"
if not..you cant move MaRV 1cm left-right at Mach10 within 10km due to inertia laws
Frigates which next of AC will use CIWS ...88 degrees is enougth
you cant find any video because no one designed a crazy 90 degrees attacker anti-ship missilles except chineese

do you know how much wide a tipical AC of USNavy...has DF-21 "0"cm. CEP?


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## amalakas

Alpery said:


> is this ilustration of MaRV true (post^# 108 l am still waiting)
> what I said:
> "..if you reduce the speed CIWS can destroy all MaRVs"
> if not..you cant move MaRV 1cm left-right at Mach10 within 10km due to inertia laws
> Frigates which next of AC will use CIWS ...88 degrees is enougth
> you cant find any video because no one designed a crazy 90 degrees attacker anti-ship missilles except chineese
> 
> do you know how much wide a tipical AC of USNavy...has DF-21 "0"cm. CEP?



I don't know about the rest, but one cannot use CIWS to destroy a Mach 10 warhead. No time, no elevation no nothing.



j20blackdragon said:


> Who cares about the DF-21D?
> 
> China will completely destroy Yokosuka, Sasebo, and Naval Base Guam.
> 
> J-20 and J-15 will handle the remaining surface ships.
> 
> Y-8 ASW will handle the submarines.
> 
> *Any questions*?



Yes, one.. how old are you?


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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> let's have a look at this:
> 
> 
> Temp, 5.0 km/sec in inertial frame, 100 km starting altitude
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It shows heating is *not* during the troposphere descent.
> In actual fact it shows the opposite.



Your graph is irrelevant.

It does not show the temperature of a Mach 10 warhead at an altitude of 1 through 10km.

Your graph is only relevant for a supersonic warhead that transitions to a sub-sonic speed. It is useless in a discussion of a Mach 10 hypersonic warhead.

I'm talking about apples (hypersonic Mach 10 warhead in troposphere) and you put up a graph about oranges (supersonic warhead transitioning to subsonic speed in troposphere).

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## grey boy 2

Martian2 pal, check this out (his source:Reentry Heating) it will eventually unveil his trick.

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## amalakas

grey boy 2 said:


> Martian2 pal, check this out (his source:Reentry Heating) it will eventually unveil his trick.



errmmm which trick exactly are you referring at ?


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## j20blackdragon

amalakas said:


> Yes, one.. how old are you?



I'm old enough to realize the DF-41 can destroy 10 cities per missile.

If you must worry about a DF series missile, worry about the DF-41 instead.

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> Your graph is irrelevant.
> 
> It does not show the temperature of a Mach 10 warhead at an altitude of 1 through 10km.
> 
> Your graph is only relevant for a supersonic warhead that transitions to a sub-sonic speed. It is useless in a discussion of a Mach 10 hypersonic warhead.
> 
> I'm talking about apples (hypersonic Mach 10 warhead in troposphere) and you put up a graph about oranges (supersonic warhead transitioning to subsonic speed in troposphere).


 
No 5 km / sec is faster than your warhead, but yes, it slows down considerably after, so well fine if you want to look at it this way, it's ok, I'll accept that, it is not unreasonable to say so. 

so the warhead reaches the troposphere at Mach 10, I am game with that. So, it didn't heat up at all before like the example in the graph? You mean it had low temperatures before ? what was its velocity before the 10km zone?

Re heating commences at roughly 60 km and is about 2000 Celcius. That is not hot ?



j20blackdragon said:


> I'm old enough to realize the DF-41 can destroy 10 cities per missile.
> 
> If you must worry about a DF series missile, worry about the DF-41 instead.



I am worried about that missile. 

But I am worried about your fascination with missiles too. Maybe you should get that looked at by a professional.  


friendly advice.


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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> No 5 km / sec is faster than your warhead, but yes, it slows down considerably after, so well fine if you want to look at it this way, it's ok, I'll accept that, it is not unreasonable to say so.
> 
> so the warhead reaches the troposphere at Mach 10, I am game with that. So, it didn't heat up at all before like the example in the graph? You mean it had low temperatures before ? what was its velocity before the 10km zone?
> 
> Re heating commences at roughly 60 km and is about 2000 Celcius. That is not hot ?



*You are barking up the wrong tree*

You are barking up the wrong tree. The graph looks like the flight profile for the space shuttle. A Mach 10 hypersonic warhead does not share the same flight profile as a space shuttle.

A ballistic-shaped DF-21D ASBM warhead will lose very little speed as gravity keeps pulling on the warhead. It will never slow down to a subsonic speed as shown in your posted graph.

Quote from your source:



> "There is a certain amount of kinetic energy in your reentry vehicle that will be converted to heat as it comes through the atmosphere. *How much of the heat goes into the vehicle depends on the trajectory flown and the size and shape of the vehicle.* The choice of trajectory is limited by the realities of lift, drag, and mass of the vehicle."



[Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the article link, which Amalakas shamefully hid and for good reason. It is only applicable to a hypersonic vehicle transitioning to subsonic speeds.]

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> *You are barking up the wrong tree*
> 
> You are barking up the wrong tree. The graph looks like the flight profile for the space shuttle. A Mach 10 hypersonic warhead does not share the same flight profile as a space shuttle.
> 
> A ballistic-shaped DF-21D ASBM warhead will lose very little speed as gravity keeps pulling on the warhead. It will never slow down to a subsonic speed as shown in your posted graph.
> 
> Quote from your source:
> 
> 
> 
> [Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the article link, which Amalakas shamefully hid and for good reason. It is only applicable to a hypersonic vehicle transitioning to subsonic speeds.]



On the shameful bit, think what you like. 

On the other bit, I think you are not following what you are saying. The point was *heat*!

a few posts up, you responded to someone telling him that, and I quote you.. 



Martian2 said:


> Before entering the troposphere, the radar and infrared detectors on the DF-21D can identify the location of its target. The target will be struck in 3 seconds. How far do you think a ship can move in 3 seconds? Also, the DF-21D's detectors can probably track the moving ship and predict its exact location in the next three seconds.
> 
> The heat caused by entering the troposphere is irrelevant to a DF-21D warhead.



You hint that the heat from friction is only in Troposphere and there is insignificant heat before, I am asking you clearly, is that what you are saying ?


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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> You hint that the heat from friction is only in Troposphere and there is insignificant heat before, I am asking you clearly, is that what you are saying ?



Yes, for a ballistic-shaped re-entry vehicle. Not a planar space shuttle.

Want me to post a video of burning/glowing MIRVs in the troposphere for you?

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> Yes, for a ballistic-shaped re-entry vehicle. Not a planar space shuttle.
> 
> Want me to post a video of burning/glowing MIRVs in the troposphere for you?



So, for a ballistic missile shape vehicle, significant friction only happens in the troposphere. Fine , 

however this contradicts what you are saying. 


Re-enter The DF-21D ASBM | USNI Blog


> on the reentry vehicle correspondingly grow, but not at a 1:1 pace. For example, *at 200,000 ft (the point at which re-entry begins)* thermal loading on an ICBM-class RV will cause the tip to experience temperatures in *excess of 3,500 deg.F*



Note: 200K feet is 60Km and 3500 F is ~1930 Celcius. 

have a read.

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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> So, for a ballistic missile shape vehicle, significant friction only happens in the troposphere. Fine ,
> 
> however this contradicts what you are saying.
> 
> 
> Re-enter The DF-21D ASBM | USNI Blog
> 
> 
> Note: 200K feet is 60Km and 3500 F is ~1930 Celcius.
> 
> have a read.



Big deal. The ASBM enters the atmosphere at 63km. What's the temperature before impact? It's higher. You have proven nothing.

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> Big deal. The ASBM enters the atmosphere at 63km. What's the temperature before impact? It's higher. You have proven nothing.



Are we driving in circles or is it my impression. 

If I have proven nothing and the temperature is higher (and you don't care) why the hell did you even post what you posted to the other guy ? 

makes no sense.

also.. side note ..

if the temperature is higher throughout, then IR cannot be used. 

Also, if the temperature is higher, and especially as you said during the latter stages, then, the re-entry friction creates a plasma field around the warhead as indicated by your :



Martian2 said:


> Yes, for a ballistic-shaped re-entry vehicle. Not a planar space shuttle.
> 
> Want me to post a video of burning/glowing MIRVs in the troposphere for you?



We all know that stops EM radiation -shuttle like- .. so a radar guidance will be hampered..

so what gives ? 

unless you are not saying what you are saying ...


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## Martian2

amalakas said:


> Are we driving in circles or is it my impression.
> 
> If I have proven nothing and the temperature is higher (and you don't care) why the hell did you even post what you posted to the other guy ?
> 
> makes no sense.



1. My statement regarding physics is correct.

2. The high temperature at a high altitude excludes infrared detection by the warhead. We are still left with radar detection or relay of coordinates from an external sensor.

If we are still discussing point number one then your citation proves nothing.

If we are discussing point number two then infrared detection by the warhead has been ruled out.

----------

I will give you one out of three points.

a. Your first graph was irrelevant. (0 point)

b. Your argument about the majority of friction-induced heating was wrong. (0 point)

c. I didn't know the significant heating started at 63km, instead of 10km. (1 point)

Still don't like you.


----------



## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> 1. My statement regarding physics is correct.



which statement ? 



Martian2 said:


> 2. The high temperature at a high altitude excludes infrared detection by the warhead. We are still left with active radar or relay of coordinates from an external sensor.



errmmm forgive me , but NO, if your high temperature prevents IR, the same high temperature creates the re-entry plasma burn up field -which is the same that *blocks communication* and *radar track of the shuttle*- and hence the onboard RADAR cannot work...

so which is it? 



Martian2 said:


> If we are still discussing point number one then your citation proves nothing.
> 
> If we are discussing point number two then infrared detection by the warhead has been ruled out.
> 
> ----------
> 
> I will give you one out of three points.
> 
> a. Your first graph was irrelevant. (0 point)
> 
> b. Your argument about the majority of friction-induced heating was wrong. (0 point)
> 
> c. I didn't know the significant heating started at 63km, instead of 10km. (1 point)
> 
> *Still don't like you.*



it is irrelevant to the truth if you like me or not .


----------



## Martian2

amalakas said:


> which statement ?
> 
> errmmm forgive me , but NO, if your high temperature prevents IR, the same high temperature creates the re-entry plasma burn up field -which is the same that blocks communication and radar track of the shuttle- and hence the onboard RADAR cannot work...
> 
> so which is it?
> 
> it is irrelevant to the truth if you like me or not .



*Radar can penetrate plasma depending on wavelength*

The plasma field is chaotic only during the transition period. Also, the field should exist in a cone. Data should be relayable to the warhead through the rear section.

Plasma should not affect high frequency radar.

Plasma stealth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The central issue here is frequency of the incoming signal. A plasma will simply reflect radio waves below a certain frequency (which depends on the plasma properties). This aids long-range communications, because low-frequency radio signals bounce between the Earth and the ionosphere and may therefore travel long distances. Early-warning over-the-horizon radars utilize such low-frequency radio waves. *Most military airborne and air defense radars, however, operate in the microwave band, where many plasmas, including the ionosphere, absorb or transmit the radiation (the use of microwave communication between the ground and communication satellites demonstrates that at least some frequencies can penetrate the ionosphere).*"

----------

You are incorrect about plasma blocking ALL radar wavelengths. Your score has dropped to 1 point (correct) out of 4 (statements/claims).


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## j20blackdragon

amalakas said:


> errmmm forgive me , but NO, if your high temperature prevents IR, the same high temperature creates the re-entry plasma burn up field -which is the same that *blocks communication* and *radar track of the shuttle*- and hence the onboard RADAR cannot work...



Which is why the DF-21D will most likely use an *offboard* sensor like the J-20 or J-15 to provide targeting information.

This is so simple even a baby should be able to figure it out.

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## amalakas

Martian2 said:


> *Radar can penetrate plasma depending on wavelength*
> 
> The plasma field is chaotic only during the transition period. Also, the field should exist in a cone. Data should be relayable to the warhead through the rear section.
> 
> Plasma should not affect high frequency radar.
> 
> Plasma stealth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> "The central issue here is frequency of the incoming signal. A plasma will simply reflect radio waves below a certain frequency (which depends on the plasma properties). This aids long-range communications, because low-frequency radio signals bounce between the Earth and the ionosphere and may therefore travel long distances. Early-warning over-the-horizon radars utilize such low-frequency radio waves. *Most military airborne and air defense radars, however, operate in the microwave band, where many plasmas, including the ionosphere, absorb or transmit the radiation (the use of microwave communication between the ground and communication satellites demonstrates that at least some frequencies can penetrate the ionosphere).*"
> 
> ----------
> 
> You are incorrect about plasma blocking ALL radar wavelengths. Your score has dropped to 1 point (correct) out of 4 (statements/claims).



Score or not, you have resorted to using wikipedia. Moreover you are now speculating two things. 

1. That the re-entry plasma will not affect the vehicle's radar (without knowing what radar that is, or if such a radar could be on the cone)

2. That the rear section will be receiving targeting information .. From where? 


Also in that famous photo of the simulated carrier hit by the missile you showed us, 

two things there too.

1. I searched the coordinates on Google earth and found nothing. 

Now maybe I have done something wrong, I accept that, I would appreciate you going to these coordinates now and getting a new image if possible 

2. In that photo, the target was a flat piece of land. No structures of beacons of any kind. 
What targeting Radar found a flat piece of land so the missile could be evalu-tested ?


And just so you two are not wondering, I am trying to get you to see, that the more you think about this, the more complex this targeting infrastructure for this missile is getting.. 

more links in the chain, more things to affect its effectiveness... 




j20blackdragon said:


> Which is why the DF-21D will most likely use an *offboard* sensor like the J-20 or J-15 to provide targeting information.
> 
> This is so simple even a baby should be able to figure it out.



same goes for you my phallic symbol obsessed friend, your solution is more desperate than you think..


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## j20blackdragon

The DF-21D isn't really needed.

It should be easy enough for J-20s to destroy an enemy ship's radar with a barrage of anti-radiation missiles like in any other SEAD mission. After that, the ship is nothing more than a floating target for glide bombs or anti-ship cruise missiles. 

If the DF-21D works, you have one extra thing to worry about.

If it doesn't work, China has other options.

Also if you're absolutely certain that the DF-21D isn't capable of hitting a moving ship, the obvious solution is that it is nuclear. End of story.


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## amalakas

j20blackdragon said:


> The DF-21D isn't really needed.
> 
> It should be easy enough for J-20s to destroy an enemy ship's radar with a barrage of anti-radiation missiles like in any other SEAD mission. After that, the ship is nothing more than a floating target for glide bombs or anti-ship cruise missiles.
> 
> If the DF-21D works, you have one extra thing to worry about.
> 
> If it doesn't work, China has other options.
> 
> Also if you're absolutely certain that the DF-21D isn't capable of hitting a moving ship, the obvious solution is that it is nuclear. End of story.




That sounds more plausible, with the exception that it isn't easy for any plane to reach a carrier. Possible, yes, easy, no.

I have no argument with the nuclear. The Russians went that way too I believe.


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## j20blackdragon

And even if we assume that the DF-21D is incapable of hitting a moving target, there are still many applications for a highly accurate conventional ballistic missile. For example, a stationary ship in port is a very tempting target. Think Pearl Harbor.


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## hk299792458

A video from CCTV showing a combat simulation between Su-27SK and HQ-9A SAM system...

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## Obambam




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## Broccoli

DF-31 as seen in NAIC 1996 report.


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## Broccoli

There is some mistakes in this, for starters DF-31's NATO codename is actually CSS-10. 

DF-31: CSS-10 Mod 1 
DF-31A: CSS-10 Mod 2
http://www.fas.org/irp/threat/missile/naic/NASIC2009.pdf



XName said:


> DongFeng 31 (CSS-9) Intercontinental Ballistic Missile:
> DongFeng 31 (CSS-9) Intercontinental Ballistic Missile: The most advanced Chinese ballistic missile currently in service, the DF-31 replaced the DF-4 originally introduced in the 1970s. The missile first debut in the 1999 National day military parade.The DongFeng-31 (DF-31, NATO codename: CSS-9) is an intercontinental-range, road-mobile, solid-propellant ballistic missile developed by Academy of Rocket Motor Technology (ARMT, also known as 4th Aerospace Academy). The missile was developed as a land-based version of the JL-2 submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM). The most advanced ballistic missile currently in service, the DF-31 features higher mobility and therefore better survivability compared to the last generation Chinese ICBM.
> 
> DongFeng-31 specifications:
> 
> Configuration: Three stage
> Length: 13m 15,5m
> Diameter: 2.25m
> Launch Weight: 42,000kg
> Propellant: Solid fuel
> Guidance: Inertial + stellar update
> Range: 8,000km (DF-31); 10,000km (DF-31A) 7240km+ (DF-31); 11,200km+ (DF-31A)
> Deployment: Silo or road mobile
> Re-entry Vehicle Mass: 1,050~1,750kg 470kg
> Warhead: One single 1,000kT, or up to three 20~150kT multiple independently targeted re-entry vehicle (MIRV) One single 500-700kt, MIRV capabililty not known
> CEP: 100~300m
> Launch Preparation Time: ~15 min


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## cirr

DF-25&#65306;











Model shown during an *internal* exhibition held several years ago&#12290;


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## Lone

...Anybody knows the specifications of the missile that Saudi Arabia purchased from China? I heard it was css-7 (?) can anybody confirm? And the type of warhead too. Thanks in advance...


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## Broccoli

Lone said:


> ...Anybody knows the specifications of the missile that Saudi Arabia purchased from China? I heard it was css-7 (?) can anybody confirm? And the type of warhead too. Thanks in advance...



Saudi-Arabia purchased older liquid fueled DF-3A (CSS-2) missiles from China.
IMINT & Analysis: Saudi Arabia's Ballistic Missile Force


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## hk299792458

How many different kind of missiles could you identify in this video?


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## Broccoli

> &#8220;Assuming that a brigade counts up to 12 mobile launchers and 12 missiles, this may amount to 48 DF-31A missiles, or multiples of 48 if the [People&#8217;s Liberation Army] plans reloads for this ICBM,&#8221; Fisher said.
> 
> Fisher said the DF-31A appears to be a single-warhead missile, *but published photos of the warhead released in 2008 reveal that the warhead seems capable of rapid maneuvers and likely would use decoys to enhance its survivability from missile defenses.*


China conducts fourth flight test of mobile ICBM | Washington Free Beacon


Does anyone have those photos of DF-31 warhead? I haven't managed to find them.


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## The Deterrent

hk299792458 said:


> How many different kind of missiles could you identify in this video?



DF-15 A, B and C.


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## Great China

Why purchasing a good system when you can clone it?
I'm sure our version has some improvements over the original tor m1.


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## Great China

At first sight this could be a simple CJ-10 transporter, but IMO it could be a new version. Because it doesn't make sense using such advanced 8x8 vehicle just for transporting 3 missiles.
I'm sure the vehicle is identical to this one:


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## hk299792458

A new C4ISR platform is entered into service in Second Artillery...

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## mosu

China&#8217;s DF-31A MIRV ICBM Missile Is A Big Deal
During the nuclear honed days of the Cold War, the Soviet Union developed a nuclear missile able to strike anywhere in the U.S.

Loaded with multiple maneuverable warheads (MIRVs), while carrying decoys and chaff to keep from getting struck down, the missiles undermined the entire balance of power between the two superpowers and struck fear into hard hearts at the Kremlin and the Pentagon alike.

When China successfully tested its DF-31A missile several days ago, it confirmed another country now has proven nuclear ability reach any city in the U.S. with precisely the type of missiles that troubled the U.S. decades ago.

The DF-31A is believed to have three warheads per missile and a range of about 7,000 miles, which allows it to target anywhere in the U.S. While that ability isn&#8217;t new, China&#8217;s CSS-4 has that capability as well, that missile requires a stationary launch pad and contains but one nuclear warhead.

The DF-31A is portable and launches from the back of a tank, train, or truck. China also has more than 3,000 miles of underground tunnels and highly reinforced military bunkers where it can stash the highly mobile ordnance.

Notoriously cryptic about the extent of its nuclear arsenal, China announced the launch on a Chinese military news site.

Bill Gertz at The Washington Free Beacon confirms what the site claims, reporting that U.S. intelligence, airborne, and space sensors picked up the launch from China&#8217;s Wuzhai Space and Missile Test Center in western China when it happened.

From the Beacon:

It was the second DF-31A flight test since August and highlights China&#8217;s growing strategic nuclear buildup, a modernization program largely carried out in secret. The DF-31A test also took place on the last day of a rare U.S.-China military exercise in Chengdu that practiced joint disaster relief efforts.

China is known to use its missile tests to send political signals, as in 1996 when it bracketed Taiwan with missile flight tests that impacted north and south of the island prior to a presidential election. Analysts say the DF-31A test likely was intended to bolster the Chinese military&#8217;s hardline stance toward the United States and particularly the U.S. military, regarded by Beijing as its main adversary.

Richard Fisher, a China military affairs specialist, told the Beacon, the development &#8220;suggests that China may be building toward a &#8216;counterstrike&#8217; strategy that would require the secret buildup of many more missiles and warheads than suggested by public ICBM number estimates made available by the U.S. Intelligence Community.&#8221;

A viable counterstrike is one potential scenario China may be planning for, but what unsettled both the U.S. and the Soviets about the MIRVs when they came around the first time was the &#8220;enhancement of a first strike capability.&#8221;

Basically, having multiple warheads per missile vastly increases the chances of successfully striking the U.S. and at multiple sites. The belief was that this degree of confidence would do little to decrease the chances of nuclear war.

But with so much going on in the world today at a pace the warriors of the Cold War never imagined, it&#8217;s easy to overlook just one more missile test. Which is why it could be important to remember that it&#8217;s missiles like this that helped lift the arms race to the frenzied heights it achieved before the Iron Curtain fell in the early 1990s and defined a generation.

If China shares the MIRV technology with Iran, Pakistan, Syria, and North Korea like it has shared nuclear, missile materials, and technology in the past it could prompt an entirely new round of concerns.

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## XName

Broccoli said:


> There is some mistakes in this, for starters DF-31's NATO codename is actually CSS-10.
> 
> DF-31: CSS-10 Mod 1
> DF-31A: CSS-10 Mod 2
> http://www.fas.org/irp/threat/missile/naic/NASIC2009.pdf



I find some sources,using
DF-31:CSS-9
DF-41:CSS-X-10
Missiles of the World | Missile ThreatMissile Threat
Chinese BaiDu encyclopedia "ICBM"
http://baike.baidu.com/view/481437.htm
and some using DF31:CSS-10
DF-31 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
also your thread
http://www.defence.pk/forums/chinese-defence/134920-nato-reporting-name-df-31-missiles.html

and some specifications also different,like warhead,range


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## Broccoli

XName said:


> I find some sources,using
> DF-31:CSS-9
> DF-41:CSS-X-10
> Missiles of the World | Missile ThreatMissile Threat
> Chinese BaiDu encyclopedia "ICBM"
> ICBM_°Ù¶È°Ù¿Æ
> and some using DF31:CSS-10
> DF-31 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> also your thread
> http://www.defence.pk/forums/chinese-defence/134920-nato-reporting-name-df-31-missiles.html
> 
> and some specifications also different,like warhead,range



All Pentagon reports use "CSS-10"... I think it's the correct codename. Some older sources still use CSS-9, but it's clearly outdated because Pentagon does not use it. There is also wrong information about weight of the DF-31 RV, The National Air Intelligence Center (NAIC) reported back in 1996 that DF-31 RV weights 470kg, most non-governmental websites report RV's weight to be more than 1000kg.


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## Vitchilo

> If China shares the MIRV technology with Iran, Pakistan, Syria, and North Korea like it has shared nuclear, missile materials, and technology in the past it could prompt an entirely new round of concerns.



There's no way China would give this technology to Iran, Syria or North Korea. Pakistan might already have it... and if they don't it wouldn't be such a big deal.


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## Broccoli

Vitchilo said:


> There's no way China would give this technology to Iran, Syria or North Korea. Pakistan might already have it... and if they don't it wouldn't be such a big deal.



Most of those countries are potential enemies of China... it would be bad policy to give them such technology. MIRV and ICBM technologies are "crown jewels", and such things won't be usually shared with anyone... not even with friends.

Brits and US are probably only ones who have done such things, and when UK launches Tridents there is always US NAVY personnel in their submarine (not very independent).


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## hk299792458

MRO drill of 2nd artillery on *DF-15* and old *DF-3*...


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## hk299792458

Launch at the same time of at least 7 SRBM *DF-11A*...


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## mil-avia

*About DF-21D Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile 


 *


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## Broccoli

hk299792458 said:


> MRO drill of 2nd artillery on *DF-15* and old *DF-3*...



Shame that they didn't show more of that DF-31 TEL.


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## yusheng

DF21 warhead types: traditional warheads are MaRV MIRV EMP 






hit results, testing






The DF21 coverage range, red for estimates of DF-21C range of 1700 kilometers. Orange for claims a DF-21D 3000 km range.

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## qasimali

when will Pakistan gonna have these types of missiles.


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## cnleio

qasimali said:


> when will Pakistan gonna have these types of missiles.


The range of DF-21D over 150 km, UN forbidden to export long-range ballistic missile.

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## Chengduman

&#22269;&#20043;&#37325;&#22120;&#20063;&#65292;When will DF31 or DF41 have this warhead and system?


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## yusheng

qasimali said:


> when will Pakistan gonna have these types of missiles.




Pakistan will soon have it.

Since China is a ADHERENT STATE of MISSILE TECHONOLOGY CONTROL REGIME&#65292;MTCR, she cannot export it directly, however US usually accuesed China of translating ballistic missiles technology to anti-US countries, such as Iran, who has independently developed and deployed battle-condition anti ship ballistic missiles. 

Pakistan has long range ballistic missiles in hand and in order to make it able to attack a moving sea ship just to add some new guiding facilities and a small change of dynamic control and structure, which it is not a mission impossible for brilliant Pakistan scientists.


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## yusheng

Chengduman said:


> &#22269;&#20043;&#37325;&#22120;&#20063;&#65292;When will DF31 or DF41 have this warhead and system?



when our satellites surveyrance network finishs, then we can attack any ship on this plante from homeland, schu system is nuder construction; but it is not necessary using DF to fight a ship except the aircraft carrier formation.

Generally, DF31> is strategic weapon not for ships.


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## Hyperion

Well, it's not that complex of a task. Needs a maneuverable reentry vehicle (MaRV), either with an integrated seeker, or active terminal guidance. 

We already have all things in place. Including the infrastructure. It's a political decision as the most difficult part "delivery" vehicle already has been developed.



qasimali said:


> when will Pakistan gonna have these types of missiles.





cnleio said:


> The range of DF-21D over 150 km, UN forbidden to export long-range ballistic missile.



Only MaRV and seeker will be needed. None of which come under MTCR. They can easily be mated with our domestic delivery vehicles and tuned to our specifications.

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## Methu_Xie

Hyperion said:


> Well, it's not that complex of a task. Needs a maneuverable reentry vehicle (MaRV), either with an integrated seeker, or active terminal guidance.
> 
> We already have all things in place. Including the infrastructure. It's a political decision as the most difficult part "delivery" vehicle already has been developed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Only MaRV and seeker will be needed. None of which come under MTCR. They can easily be mated with our domestic delivery vehicles and tuned to our specifications.



Brother,don't be worried,Indian will not do anything when they are under boom by our missiles


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## cirr

Bring on the YJ-12&#12289;YJ-18 and YJ-22&#12290;


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## yusheng

" Sword " type -10 land-based cruise missile also known as the " East Sea" 10 land-based cruise missile is long range, superior performance missile, relying on advanced sensors to find, identify and locate the goal, through the communication system to the command transmitting location information, to strike the valuable ground target, " Effective in a range of 1500 to 2500 kilometres. The damage capacity is over the United States of America " Tomahawk " cruise missile, one hit can sink a ship of 7000 -- 10000 tons.

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## SHAMK9

qasimali said:


> when will Pakistan gonna have these types of missiles.


never, unless we make our own.


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## hk299792458

The one who had designed the national network-centric balistic missiles system is a woman.


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## hk299792458

Yesterday I posted a video on a woman scientific working on balistic missile technologies, today CCTV broadcasts an another video on her who has also developed an auto-diagnostic system for missile TELs...


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## sweetgrape

HQ-16A air defence system in Lanzhou Military region.


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## hk299792458

Second artillery's training with *DF-11A*...


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## Broccoli

*The Minimum Means of Reprisal: China's Search for Security in the Nuclear Age*
http://www.cissm.umd.edu/papers/files/the_minimum_means_of_reprisal.pdf


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## hk299792458

Can someone make a quick analysis and tell me if the 2 technologies described in this R&D document are for HQ-8 or for HQ-26, or both of them?

Thank you,
































Henri K.


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## Vitchilo

Hitting a non-moving target with no defenses is much, much easier than hitting the real thing...

China's 'Carrier Killer' Missile Test - Business Insider


> China Successfully Tests 'Carrier Killer' Missile In The Gobi Desert
> 
> China's PLA "sunk" a U.S. aircraft carrier during a war game in remote China using its DF-21D "Carrier Killer" missile, reports Taiwan paper Want China Times.
> 
> The China Times is a 63 year old Taiwanese paper slightly slanted toward unification, but with a solid reputation and accurate reporting.
> 
> The Times report originates with a Google Earth image published at SAORBOATS Argentinian internet forum.
> 
> The photo shows two big craters on a 600 foot platform deep in China's Gobi desert that Chinese military testers used to simulate the flight deck of an aircraft carrier.
> 
> "The thing to keep in mind is that, in order for China to successfully attack a U.S. navy ship with a ballistic missile," Cliff told The Diplomat, "it must first detect the ship, identify it as a U.S. warship of a type that it wishes to attack ... [then] over-the-horizon radars used to detect ships can be jammed, spoofed, or destroyed; smoke and other obscurants can be deployed ... and when the missile locks on to the target its seeker can be jammed or spoofed."



More Chinese ``look at how tough we are`` made up hype...


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## homing28




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## hk299792458

China carried out a "_Test of the Land-based Mid-course Phase Anti-ballistic Missile Interception Technology_" tonight, according to Xinhua agency.

Link to Xinhua website

The last time China had performed this kind of test was on January 11th 2010, where a KKV destroyed in exo-atmosphere a balistic missile, after which the Pentagon spokeswoman declared that : "_We detected two geographically separated missile launch events with an exo-atmospheric collision also being observed by space-based sensors_".

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## tomluter

according to the china-wikileaks about interception fire in 2010, occurred at an altitude of approximately 250 kilometers.


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## hk299792458

*China, U.S. conduct missile defense tests*

China, U.S. conduct missile defense tests | Washington Free Beacon



> BY: Bill Gertz
> January 27, 2013 5:02 pm
> 
> China on Sunday conducted the second test of a new anti-ballistic missile defense interceptor that United States officials say is directly linked to Beijing&#8217;s secret anti-satellite weapons program.
> 
> Meanwhile, the Pentagon on Sunday announced it conducted a successful test of a long-range anti-missile interceptor.
> 
> China&#8217;s Defense Ministry announced the test, according to the official state-run Xinhua news agency, which quoted an official saying &#8220;the test has reached the preset goal.&#8221;
> 
> &#8220;The test is defensive in nature and targets no other country,&#8221; the official was quoted as saying.
> 
> China in the past has opposed U.S. missile defenses, claiming the systems are designed to weaponize space. However, Beijing refused to discuss any details of its secret ASAT program. A 2007 ASAT missile destroyed a Chinese weather satellite, creating a debris field that threatens both manned and unmanned satellites.
> 
> It is the second time China announced such a missile test. A similar anti-missile interception test was successfully conducted on Jan. 11, 2010.
> 
> The test was not unexpected. U.S. officials said Chinese missile defense testing facilities were under close intelligence surveillance since early January amid signs a missile defense interceptor test was to be carried out.
> 
> The Washington Free Beacon reported in September that new intelligence had indicated the Chinese were planning to fire what they called a Dong Ning-2 anti-satellite missile that is part of Beijing&#8217;s program to target U.S. military communications, navigation, and targeting satellites in space.
> 
> Pentagon officials had no immediate comment on the Chinese test.
> 
> Maj. Catherine Wilkinson, a Pentagon spokeswoman, earlier this month declined to comment on Chinese plans for an ASAT test, citing a policy of not discussing intelligence matters.
> 
> &#8220;We carefully monitor China&#8217;s military developments and urge China to exhibit greater transparency regarding its capabilities and intention,&#8221; she said. &#8220;Military-to-military dialogues between the United States and China featuring open and substantive discussions between our armed forces will help us improve mutual understanding, build trust, and reduce the risk of misperception and miscalculations.&#8221;
> 
> A U.S. official said earlier this month there were signs in China that the missile defense test was being readied.
> 
> Regarding the 2010 test, a State Department cable, disclosed by Wikileaks, revealed that China had launched an SC-18 missile from the Korla Peninsula and intercepted a near-simultaneous launched CSS-X-11 medium-range target missile from the Shuangchengzi Space and Missile Center.
> 
> The cable noted the similarities between the missile defense interceptor and China&#8217;s ASAT missile. &#8220;An SC-19 was used previously as the payload booster for the Jan. 11, 2007, direct-ascent anti-satellite (DA-ASAT) intercept of the Chinese FY-1C weather satellite,&#8221; the cable said. &#8220;Previous SC-19 DA-ASAT flight-tests were conducted in 2005 and 2006. This test is assessed to have furthered both Chinese ASAT and ballistic missile defense technologies.&#8221;
> 
> Richard Fisher, a China military affairs specialist, said the latest test also was carried out over Korla, China&#8217;s traditional center for anti-missile research dating to the 1960s.
> 
> &#8220;So far the missile used for the Jan. 27 test has not been identified,&#8221; Fisher, with the International Assessment and Strategy Center, said. &#8220;It could be a second test of the SC-19 ASAT missile modified for warhead interception for the January 2010 test, or it could be a new missile.&#8221;
> 
> Fisher said China is known to be developing several anti-missile systems. &#8220;One system sometimes referred to as the HQ-26 appears to be intended to have a capability similar to the Raytheon-built SM-3 [interceptor], the main system used by the U.S. Navy for missile defense,&#8221; he said.
> 
> &#8220;China&#8217;s new missile is expected to arm a new large PLA Navy combat ship that has not yet been launched and is also expected to have a land-deployed version as well.&#8221;
> 
> According to reports from China, an engineer from the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC), the state-run company most likely behind development of a HQ-26-like missile, has received a national prize for the development of a dual-pulse rocket engine, a technology also used on the SM-3, Fisher said.
> 
> &#8220;China&#8217;s development of more capable theater missile defense systems addresses what for China is a practically non-existent threat,&#8221; Fisher said. &#8220;Other than North Korea and to a slight degree India, no country has the ability to target China with medium or intermediate range missiles.&#8221;
> 
> Fisher said unlike the Chinese, the United States has retired its subsonic nuclear cruise missiles and has no plans for medium-range ballistic missiles or longer-range non-strategic missiles.
> 
> &#8220;These Chinese missiles allow the PLA to target Asian-based land and naval aircraft at longer distances,&#8221; he said. &#8220;In all, it poses another major chop at the U.S. ability to &#8216;extend&#8217; deterrence to its Asian allies, adds another layer to China&#8217;s &#8216;anti-access&#8217; capabilities.&#8221;
> 
> The missile test comes as the Pentagon on Sunday announced the successful test of a Ground-Based Interceptor, the new limited anti-missile system currently deployed against North Korean ICBMs.
> 
> Missile Defense Agency spokesman Rick Lehner said in a statement that the GBI test was &#8220;successful&#8221; after launch on Saturday from Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif., one of two western U.S. missile defense bases.
> 
> &#8220;Data from this flight test will be used to evaluate the Exoatmospheric Kill Vehicle system performance in a flight environment,&#8221; Lehner said. &#8220;If a target missile were present, the Exoatmospheric Kill Vehicle would collide directly with the threat warhead to perform a hit-to-kill intercept. Engineering data from this test will be used to improve confidence for future intercept missions.
> 
> The test did not plan to use a target missile.
> 
> &#8220;After performing fly out maneuvers, the three-stage booster deployed the Exoatmospheric Kill Vehicle to a designated point in space,&#8221; Lehner said. &#8220;After separating from the booster, the Exoatmospheric Kill Vehicle executed a variety of pre-planned maneuvers to collect performance data in space.&#8221;
> 
> Preliminary results show all components performed as designed, he said.



Henri K.

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## hk299792458

From a local television...


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## shuttler

Vitchilo said:


> *Hitting a non-moving target with no defenses is much, much easier than hitting the r*eal thing...
> 
> China's 'Carrier Killer' Missile Test - Business Insider
> 
> 
> *More Chinese ``look at how tough we are`` made up hype...*



I am afraid only indian cheerleaders or kids are interpreting that way!

do you think we do not know how fast an aircraft carrier moves and the compositon of a fleet?


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## hk299792458

Henri K.


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## Fsjal

hk299792458 said:


> Henri K.



What's that place?


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## hk299792458

Training of 2nd Artillery...


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## hk299792458

Henri K.


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## ChineseTiger1986

The DF-25 ASBM, much more powerful than the DF-21D ASBM.


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## Broccoli

How you know that it is ASBM instead of conventional missile?


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## ChineseTiger1986

Broccoli said:


> How you know that it is ASBM instead of conventional missile?



Sorry, but you can't read Chinese.

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## gambit

Broccoli said:


> How you know that it is ASBM instead of conventional missile?


Visually speaking -- cannot.


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## Broccoli

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Sorry, but you can't read Chinese.



I guess you could translate it for us then.


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## ChineseTiger1986

Broccoli said:


> I guess you could translate it for us then.



I am pretty busy these days, maybe i'll do it later.


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## Broccoli

gambit said:


> Visually speaking -- cannot.



Yeah, that is the reason why I was asking about it. I would like to see some evidence for these claims people usually make here. Like that missile TEL what people claimed to be the long rumored DF-41 (probably DF-31A) even when they cannot see what is inside the missile canister.


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## gambit

Broccoli said:


> Yeah, that is the reason why I was asking about it. I would like to see some evidence for these claims people usually make here. Like that missile TEL what people claimed to be the long rumored DF-41 (probably DF-31A) even when they cannot see what is inside the missile canister.


I can point to a Minuteman and say it is an anti-ship ballistic missile, specifically, it targets only container cargo ships from China.

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## Fsjal

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> The DF-25 ASBM, much more powerful than the DF-21D ASBM.



Are you sure that is a DF-25 ASBM. Never heard of it.
BTW isn't the DF-25 and DF-21C the same?


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## ChineseTiger1986

Fsjal said:


> Are you sure that is a DF-25 ASBM. Never heard of it.
> BTW isn't the DF-25 and DF-21C the same?



DF-21C and DF-21D







DF-25

DF-25 | Missile ThreatMissile Threat


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## hk299792458

Second Artillery training...






Henri K.


----------



## fatman17

*China&#8217;s Eagle Strike-Eight Anti-Ship Cruise Missiles: Designation Confusion and the Family Members from YJ-8 to YJ-8A* 


Written by: Christopher P. Carlson on February 4, 2013



A People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) missile boat launches a YJ-8 anti-ship missile.

With the arguments over disputed islands and reefs in the South and East China Seas getting louder and louder, it is only natural there would be increased media coverage on the People&#8217;s Republic of China&#8217;s (PRC) military capabilities. Unfortunately, the confusing and often-inaccurate information on the technical aspects of China&#8217;s armed forces, and in this particular case the People&#8217;s Liberation Army Navy (PLAN), makes meaningful debate difficult. One especially troublesome example is the inadequate reporting on China&#8217;s anti-ship cruise missiles (ASCM), and more specifically the Ying Ji-8 (YJ-8) or Eagle Strike-8 family. The purpose of this article is to conduct a critical review of the available evidence to sort out the correct identity of the members of this missile family, as well as providing accurate characteristics and performance data.

Designation Confusion
One of the major causes of confusion surrounding the YJ-8 family is the myriad of designations for the various missiles and their relationship to each other. Unfortunately, many of the designations out in the mainstream press are incorrect, which makes it very difficult to link a PLAN designation with the appropriate export version. Table 1 presents a summarized list of the published designations, their relationships, and accuracy.

PLAN Designation...Export Designation...Accuracy
YJ-1........	C801......................x
YJ-12......	C801A....................x
YJ-2.......	C802......................x
YJ-21......	C802A.....................x
YJ-8........	C801.......................&#8730;
YJ-8A.......	C801A.....................x
YJ-81......	C801A.....................x
YJ-8K.......	C801K......................x
YJ-8Q......	C801Q.....................x
YJ-82......	C802.......................x
YJ-82K.....	C802K......................x
YJ-83......	C803........................x
YJ-83K.....	C803K.......................x

Table 1: PLAN and export designations for the Eagle Strike-8 family.

A single red entry in either designation column indicates an incorrect designation. If both entries are red, this indicates that either both designation entries are incorrect, as in the case of the YJ-12 and the C801A, or that an incorrect relationship or linkage has been made between correct designators (e.g. YJ-82 and C802). As it can be seen from the above table, only one designation pair is correctly identified and linked &#8211; no wonder there is so much confusion in current publications. Clearing up this designator confusion is essential to understanding a missile&#8217;s true identity, and for whom it was made, the PLAN or the export market. This is an important distinction, as the PLAN doesn&#8217;t use missiles with a C800 series designation; all the missiles on their warships, aircraft, and submarines use the YJ-8 series designation, as we will see shortly.

Recognition Features
Before we can begin to untangle this knot, there has to be a clear understanding as to what type of missile is being discussed. To accomplish this, some basic recognition features are provided to assist in missile identification. Figure 1 compares the physical characteristics of the C801 and C802 export missiles based on brochure data provided by the China National Precision Machinery Import & Export Corporation, or CPMIEC. All members of the YJ-8 family closely follow one, or the other, of these two missiles.

Figure 1: Physical comparison of C801 and C802 missiles. Graphic courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

There are three significant recognition features that need to be highlighted. First, the C802 has a longer fuselage section aft of the wings, a necessary modification to accommodate the TRI 60 series turbojet. A second related identifier is the pronounced inlet scoop on the C802 for said turbojet. An inlet scoop is unnecessary on the shorter C801 as it is fitted with a solid rocket motor for propulsion. And finally, there are two external cable runs on the C802, located on both sides of the missile, while the C801 has a single cable run on the missile&#8217;s underside. Of note, some photos of the air-launched version of the YJ-83 lack cable runs. These photos are of dummy training missiles that do not require an electrical connection between the missile&#8217;s flight control computer and rudders.

YJ-8
The YJ-8 was a radical departure from the Soviet P-15 (SS-N-2) Styx-based missiles that were the mainstay of the PLAN&#8217;s arsenal throughout the mid-1990s. Considerably smaller and lighter than the Styx, the YJ-8 had essentially the same range and speed, but with a much smaller warhead. The key technological leap forward was the transition from a liquid-fueled rocket engine to a solid rocket motor.

The approval to begin developing a small rocket-powered ASCM was granted by the Central Military Commission in September 1976. The decision to use a solid rocket motor was based on encouraging results from laboratory tests since 1973 and the preliminary work done on the SY-2 (Upstream-2) ASCM. According to a 1991 Aerospace China article, the development of the actual YJ-8 propulsion system began in 1978, with flight-testing completed by 1985. The YJ-8 reached initial operational capability (IOC) with the PLAN in 1987. Although first announced in 1984, the export version of the YJ-8, the C801, wasn&#8217;t formally introduced to the international arms market until three years later. This initial version had fixed wings and was stored in small externally ribbed box launchers on surface ships, or in external tubes on a single modified Type 033G Romeo class submarine. Figure 2 shows a YJ-8 missile being loaded into one of the tubes on the modified Romeo.

Figure 2: A YJ-8 missile being loaded on the Project 033G Modified Romeo class SSG. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

The origins of the YJ-8 are somewhat shrouded in mystery. Several defense analysts have suggested the YJ-8 is a reverse engineered copy of the French MM38 Exocet. The general appearance of the missile, and the externally ribbed launcher, was cited in support of this theory. Other analysts and commentators disagree and argue the Chinese missile was a logical result of the development of a weapon system with similar requirements. The analysts that hold this view point to the differences in the size of the two missiles, and the significant disparity in rocket motor designs. The MM38 uses a sustainer and booster that are housed within the missile&#8217;s body, while the YJ-8 uses an internal sustainer motor with a separate, jettisonable booster.

The independent development hypothesis is difficult to support today given our knowledge of the PRC&#8217;s weapon acquisition and development strategy. China has perfected the practice of acquiring weapon systems, openly or covertly, analyzing them, and then developing indigenous versions. This is a necessary evil when a country has to close a significant gap in military capabilities within a short amount of time, and with limited resources.

A better argument to support the theory that the YJ-8 design was at least heavily influenced by the MM38, if not a highly modified copy, is to look at the two missiles&#8217; operational characteristics; the YJ-8&#8217;s are almost identical to the MM38. Range, speed, and warhead size for both missiles are virtually the same, but the most significant aspect is the flight profile. The French MM38 was the first sea-skimming ASCM, with a highly advanced (for the day) radar altimeter and flight computer. For China&#8217;s immature industrial base to successfully replicate the Exocet&#8217;s revolutionary flight profile in less than ten years (1976-1985) strongly implies they had access to proven technology.

An article in the Shipborne Weapons journal (Volume 5, 2008) suggests this was the case, as the author states that the Chinese were quite interested in purchasing Exocet missiles from France. Unfortunately, the price the French wanted was too high and the deal was shelved, at least temporarily. The author doesn&#8217;t explicitly say whether or not a Chinese purchase of the MM38 eventually occurred. He does say that the flight control system gave Chinese experts &#8220;great inspiration.&#8221; Therefore, it is probable that the Chinese had either somehow acquired an Exocet missile, obtained individual flight control components, or at least had access to highly detailed production schematics early in the YJ-8&#8217;s development.

Beginning in the early 1990s, numerous publications referred to the YJ-8 as the YJ-1, claiming that this was related to the C801 export designation. This is an incorrect assertion, as photographic evidence shows the YJ-1 is the PLAN designation for the unsuccessful C101 supersonic ASCM.

YJ-8A
The YJ-8A appeared very quickly after the YJ-8 entered service, reaching IOC in 1992 or 1993. In fact, the YJ-8 was only deployed by the PLAN on the Jianghu III (Type 053HT) frigates Huangshi (Hull 535) and Wuhu (Hull 536), as well as the single Type 033G modified Romeo class submarine. The only known recipients of the export version of the fixed-wing C801, with the externally ribbed box launchers, were Thailand&#8217;s four Jianghu III frigates and Yemen&#8217;s three Hounan (Project 021) missile boats. 

The rationale for the limited fielding of this brand new weapon has not been made public, nor have there been any reports of technical problems or dissatisfaction with the YJ-8&#8217;s performance by the PLAN. Indeed, historical accounts of the YJ-8&#8217;s development published in the early to mid-1990s indicate the flight tests were quite successful.

Figure 3: A YJ-8 missile with folding wings. Insert shows the fold line and the two hinges. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

The only physical difference that is readily visible is that the YJ-8A had wings and booster fins that folded (see Figure 3), permitting the missile to be stored in an even smaller, non-ribbed launch container. Of note, both the C802 and YJ-83 would also use the same container, as it was specifically designed to hold folding wing missiles. The change in launch canisters went largely unnoticed by Western defense publications, and subsequently so too did the deployment of the YJ-8A. Some ten years later, articles started popping up on an extended range version of the C801 using the designations YJ-12, YJ-81, and C801A to describe this missile. Both the extended range assessment and the majority of the designations are inaccurate.

The YJ-12 designation basically means YJ-1 Mod 2 in Western nomenclature. As has already been discussed, the YJ-1 is a very different missile from the YJ-8 family, and the repeated references to the YJ-12 being supersonic harken back to its true origins. The YJ-81 designation, on the other hand, is a valid one. However, it is the designation for the rocket-propelled, air-launched member of the YJ-8 family, as we will see in the next section. The C801A designation has been used repeatedly to describe the export version of this new longer-range missile. This makes some degree of sense; if the YJ-8 is the C801, then the YJ-8A must be the C801A. The problem with this assumption is the C801A designation has never been seen at arms shows. CPMIEC mockup displays, placards, and brochures seen throughout the 1990s and into the early 2000s (the C801 disappeared from the major shows after 2003) never used this designation. In every circumstance, the designation displayed was C801. Figure 4 shows a mockup of a C801 missile on display at the CPMIEC booth during an arms show in 1998, the C801 designation is clearly visible.

Figure 4: A C801 display model. Note the hinges on the wings. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

The argument that the YJ-8A has a longer range is also not supported by CPMIEC placard and brochure data. In all characteristics and performance aspects, including maximum range, both the fixed wing and folding wing versions of the C801 (aka YJ-8 and YJ-8A) are identical. In addition, if the YJ-8A truly had a greater range, one has to ask the question why wasn&#8217;t the extended range capability also integrated into the YJ-81 and YJ-82 missiles? An extra 28 to 48 km of range would be tactically significant, particularly for an aircraft attempting to penetrate the outer air defenses of a ship or formation. 

Furthermore, an aircraft with even a moderately capable surface search radar could actually employ the weapon out to near its maximum range. Up until about 2002 or so, the PLAN did not have an indigenous shipboard sensor system that could support over the horizon targeting. Such a targeting system would be necessary for the YJ-8A to be employed against targets at a range of 50 km or more. Still, the vast majority of the standard references, articles, and blog postings consistently hold the C801A as having a maximum range of 70 to 90 km.

This claim appears to stem from an unspoken assumption in Western journals that since the C801 was considered a reverse engineered MM38 Exocet, then the C801A with folding wings was a copy of the MM40, which has a range of 70 km. The French, by the way, had to add 0.6 meters to the MM40&#8217;s length to accommodate the necessary additional fuel. Given the YJ-8 and YJ-8A have the exact same length, the proponents of this argument assert the Chinese came up with a new high-energy density solid rocket fuel. This assertion is weak from a both a technological and programmatic perspective.

The Chinese aerospace industrial base was still in its infancy in the late 1980s, and relied heavily on technological assistance from other nations. Propulsion systems in particular were a significant weakness, one that China has struggled with for decades. Research into solid rocket propellants had started in the mid-1960s, and by 1977 the Chinese had developed a fuel that worked reliably, but represented only the state-of-practice from a technology perspective. It would take another eight years to complete the design and testing of the original YJ-8 rocket motor. To suggest the Chinese had developed a new higher performance solid rocket fuel, tested and deployed it in a modified YJ-8 missile in less than seven years strains credibility to the breaking point. And while translated historical accounts of Chinese weapon systems developments are by no means complete, there is no mention of a new propellant for the YJ-8A in what is available.

Even if the technological leap wasn&#8217;t an issue, programmatically the Chinese had already decided on a non-rocket solution for extending their anti-ship cruise missile&#8217;s maximum range. By the time the YJ-8 had reached IOC in 1987, the Chinese were already committed toward developing an air-breathing engine for the follow-on missile design that would eventually become the C802 and YJ-83.

YJ-83
The YJ-83 showed up on the scene without any advance warning, but even during its so-called début at the National Day Military Parade in Beijing in October 1999, no actual missiles were shown. The trucks that rolled by only sported two of the launch containers on their flatbeds &#8211; containers that were also used by YJ-8A missiles. Almost immediately, wild claims as to the YJ-83&#8217;s performance began showing up on Internet blog sites. Published largely by enthusiastic Chinese nationals, the claims of supersonic speeds, GPS guidance, and a ship-to-missile data link were made repeatedly.

As photos of missiles with the YJ-83 designation stenciled on them started showing up on Internet sites, questions were raised about the performance claims. The visible configuration of the missile just didn&#8217;t support what was being said online. And yet, despite the lack of any solid evidence to support the speculative claims, many Western defense journalists accepted them as gospel, and articles proclaiming China&#8217;s unexpected rapid advancement became the norm. Even after some Chinese blog site moderators began raising flags that much of the hype concerning the YJ-83 was unfounded, the content of Western books and articles remained largely unchanged.

Figure 9: The PLAN&#8217;s YJ-83 is virtually identical in appearance to the export C802, but is an updated missile. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

The development of the YJ-83 is somewhat blurred as it is closely linked with the C802. A rough estimate is that the technical design was probably locked down as soon as the Chinese were confident the C802 would fly. This lone criterion suggests the design for the YJ-83 was frozen sometime between 1993 and 1994. Several Western sources reported that the new missile entered service in 1994, but hindsight now indicates that this was when the final design was likely approved.

The choice of the TRI 60-2 turbojet essentially defined the YJ-83&#8217;s size and aerodynamic form. Measurements of broad aspect photos of missiles with the YJ-83, C802A, and C802 designations all show them to be essentially the same. According to CPMIEC brochure data, the C802A is actually nine millimeters shorter than the original C802, a trivial difference. All other dimensions are the same. With the propulsion plant fixed, and the warhead design largely the same, only about 25% of the YJ-83 missile&#8217;s subcomponents were open for significant improvement. Fortunately, those subcomponents were predominantly electronic in nature.

The early YJ-8/8A missiles used hybrid computers for the navigation, autopilot, and radar seeker. A hybrid computer uses a mixture of digital and analog components &#8211; that is solid-state elements along with servos, relays, and vacuum tubes. It is interesting to note that only the radio altimeter was fully digital, comprised of solid-state components only, which reflects the likely direct influence from the revolutionary French MM38 Exocet missile.

The inertial reference unit used small mechanical gyros and accelerometers that feed their input to the autopilot computer. Servomechanisms transmitted the steering commands to the four independent rudders. While the Chinese were satisfied with the YJ-8/8A&#8217;s overall performance, the electronic and navigation components were very bulky and took up a considerable amount of space inside the missile&#8217;s fuselage. By transitioning to all digital, microprocessor based computers, and a more compact strap-down mechanical inertial reference unit; the YJ-83 had more internal volume available for fuel and a slightly larger semi-armor piercing warhead (190 kg vice 165 kg). These changes increased the maximum range of the YJ-83 and its export variant, the C802A, from 120 km to 180 km.

With a well-established airframe and mature propulsion plant already in place, the YJ-83 benefitted from an exceptionally short development timeline and began flight-testing in 1997. Apparently the missile passed through its trials quickly, as it was reported to have reached IOC in 1998. It was formally announced in October 1999 at the National Day Military Parade, and it has slowly worked up to become the dominant ASCM in the PLAN inventory (see Figure 9). The C802A export variant, shown in Figure 10, wasn&#8217;t displayed until the DSEi 2005 arms show in London, England. The seven-year delay was likely due to production limitations, and the more urgent need to replace YJ-8A missiles on the PLAN&#8217;s warships. The information presented by CPMIEC C802A brochures since 2005 go a long way toward defining the capabilities of the YJ-83 more accurately.

Figure 10: The C802A missile mock-up displayed at the Airshow China 2010 expo is the export variant of the YJ-83, not the the C803 as reported in numerous PLAN related books and journals. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

In regard to maximum speed, the YJ-83 is most definitely a subsonic missile. The TRI 60-2 turbojet is unaugmented, i.e. no afterburner, and is only capable of speeds up to Mach 0.9. In fact, in the 1990s there weren&#8217;t any small turbojets with the ability to support supersonic speeds. The first time an engine with this capability is mentioned is in a 2008 American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics conference paper, a historical overview of Mircoturbo SA&#8217;s engines, which stated the TRI 60-5+ turbojet first demonstrated supersonic flight capability in 2007.

From a drag perspective, the rounded blunt nose of the YJ-83 is highly inefficient for supersonic flight. Since the effects of the shock wave on the nose dominate supersonic drag, the missile&#8217;s overall drag coefficient is heavily influenced by the nose cap&#8217;s fineness ratio (length of the nose cap divided by its diameter). The YJ-83 nose has a rather low fineness ratio, thus its drag coefficient would be approximately twice that of a missile with a sharper, more pointed nose such as the one on the 3M-80 Moskit (SS-N-22) family at speeds between Mach 1.5 and 2.0. Higher drag requires more thrust to maintain speed and would dramatically increase fuel consumption, thereby greatly reducing the missile&#8217;s range.

Another related problem is the turbojet&#8217;s scoop inlet. It is a fixed geometry inlet that is by design optimized for a very narrow speed range. Operating away from that design point incurs a non-trivial loss in engine performance. Furthermore, the inlet face is completely flat, which would make it even less efficient at supersonic speeds as it lacks an upper diverter to isolate the inlet from shockwave interactions with the boundary layer near the missile&#8217;s body. Finally, the scoop inlet of the YJ-83/C802A is identical to that on the C802, and similar in design to the scoop inlet on the C602 and C705, all known to be subsonic missiles. All of these observable features strongly point to the inlet design being optimized for subsonic airflow.

Combining the technical limitations of the turbojet, nose cap, and scoop inlet makes it all but impossible for the YJ-83/C802A to be supersonic. And it should be no surprise at all that the CPMIEC brochure lists the C802A&#8217;s maximum speed as Mach 0.8 to 0.9 &#8211; identical to the earlier C802.

The YJ-83 has often been described as having the ability to use the Global Positioning System (GPS) with its inertial navigation system to improve its accuracy. This claim is also unsupportable.

The first GPS-directed ordnance was the U.S. Joint Direct Attack Munition, or JDAM, a free falling bomb with an integrated inertial navigation system (INS) and GPS receiver. JDAM began flight-testing in 1996 and reached IOC in 1998. A B-2A stealth bomber first used the JDAM operationally during Operation ALLIED FORCE in the spring of 1999. An in depth Chinese technical paper, published in 1995, stated that Chinese scientists and engineers were well aware of the benefits that GPS could provide to both manned aircraft, as well as weaponry. But there were technical limitations that had to be overcome before they could be implemented in Chinese systems.

By the time the JDAM reached IOC, the YJ-83 was at the end of its flight-testing phase and was about to enter IOC itself. To even consider replacing the mechanical strap-down INS with one using ring laser gyroscopes, an integrated GPS receiver, and a dedicated computer would have delayed the introduction of this missile for at least five years, as China was still in the research and development stage of an indigenous ring laser gyro and GPS receivers had to be obtained from outside the country. And of course, since the GPS was an American system, there would always be concerns about the accuracy of the satellites&#8217; signals. Programmatically, a decision during the 1994 &#8211; 97 timeframe to include a GPS feature in the YJ-83 would make little sense.

Indeed, senior Chinese military leaders seem to show more discipline then their Western counterparts in regard to requirements creep with defense acquisition programs, and in this case they would move any satellite navigation requirement on to the next missile in an earlier stage of development. This requirement would also be tied to the development of the indigenous Beidou system that first went operational, with a limited regional capability, in 2000. In looking at the CPMIEC brochures for the C802A, there is no reference to GPS as part of the navigation system. It is, however, explicitly stated as a feature in the C602 brochures (the PLAN version is the YJ-62) that reached IOC in 2005.

A similar argument can also be made against the data link claim. Prior to the late 1990s, only the very large Soviet ASCMs of the SS-N-3 and SS-N-12 families, and the Franco-Italian Otomat had a limited ship-to-missile data link capability. In 1997, both Israel and the U.S. were well along with their respective Harpoon improvement programs. The U.S. Harpoon II under went its first test flight in 2001, while the Israeli Harpoon Extended Performance (HAP) program was completed around the same time. Both missiles included a full two-way data link and an integrated INS/GPS to improve targeting in littoral environments cluttered with civilian shipping. Again, incorporating a command data link this late in the YJ-83&#8217;s development would have incurred significant delays. In addition, articles discussing such an advanced data link assume highly accurate navigation information; implicitly suggesting an integrated INS/GPS navigation capability is required.

The CPMIEC brochure on the C802A doesn&#8217;t mention a data link as one of the missile&#8217;s features. In fact, it is quite the opposite as the brochure explicitly states the C802A is a &#8220;fire and forget&#8221; weapon. There are three YJ-83K-based land attack missiles with a command data link, two versions of the KD-88 (one electro optic and the other probably IR-guided) and the electro optical homing CM802AKG. These missiles all showed up much later than the YJ-83. The first Internet photos of the electro optical version of the KD-88 were posted in 2006, while the CM802AKG made its initial appearance at the Zhuhai Airshow China 2010 exposition. For the earlier KD-88 missiles, the data link antennas are clearly visible on the missile&#8217;s wings. In the case of the CM802AKG, the display mock-up lacked the wing-mounted data link antennas, however, a Chinese news article covering the 2010 Zhuhai show contained a summarized interview with an unidentified CM802AKG designer who explicitly stated that a data link had to be added to the missile. When combined, all these points rule out the possibility of a data link in the YJ-83. But if this is true, how does one explain the reported attributes of adaptive mission planning and post-launch maneuvers? Again brochure data helps close this loop.

In the CPMIEC 2010 C802A brochure, route planning using waypoints is described for the first time. The missile system is capable of storing four different attacking paths with a maximum of three waypoints each. This enables a single ship to launch a multi-axis attack, a significant improvement over the limited range of launch bearings of the earlier YJ-8 and C802 missiles.

For years, the YJ-83 has been tied to the C803 designation. This linkage is based on a flawed assumption that the YJ-81 is the C801, the YJ-82 is the C802, and therefore, the YJ-83 must be the C803. As has been shown throughout this article, this naming convention is incorrect. The export version of the YJ-83 is the C802A, but there is so much reporting on the C803 that it must be dealt with separately. The air-launched version is the YJ-83K and, as one would expect, the export variant is the C802AK (see Figure 11). As for the submarine-launched version, a missile with the YJ-83Q designation hasn&#8217;t been seen; nor is it likely it ever will be.

Figure 11: The YJ-83K is the air launched version of the YJ-83, as denoted by the &#8220;K&#8221; at the end of the designator. The missile in the photo is a training version without the side cable runs. The export variant is the C802AK as shown next to a Pakistani JF-17 fighter-bomber at the Dubai Air Show in 2011.Chinese internet photos courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

Indigenously designed and built Chinese submarines have torpedo tubes that are about the same length as Western submarines. A review of Chinese torpedoes shows that they are less than seven meters in length, over a meter shorter than Russian weapons. This puts the torpedo tubes on the Song (Type 039), Yuan (Type 041), Shang (Type 093) and others at about 7.1 meters in length. This assumes an additional 0.25 meters clearance on top of the 6.8 meters of the Yu-4 torpedo with a wire dispenser. The Yu-6 looks to be a little shorter, about 6.5 meters long with the torpedo mount dispenser for the wire.

Going back to the earlier discussion, recall that the YJ-82 capsule is about 6.1 meters long, and this is for a YJ-8-size missile without the booster. If the booster were added, the capsule would be at a minimum 7.3 meters long, probably closer to 7.5 meters as the heavier missile would likely require some additional buoyancy to ensure it reached the surface. Both the C802 and YJ-83 start out at almost 6.4 meters in length, and both missiles must have the booster to operate properly &#8211; there is no option with this, as the turbojet can only start when the missile is under powered flight. Using simple ratios, this makes the capsule length of a C802 or YJ-83 missile on the order of eight meters, far too large for the probable torpedo tube length of approximately 7.1 meters. Rumors of a YJ-83 submarine-launched variant being developed are based on speculation that doesn&#8217;t take into account the limitations of the potential launching platforms.

In addition, the 2011 U.S. Department of Defense&#8217;s annual report to Congress on China&#8217;s military developments stated that a new long-range submarine-launched ASCM, with the NATO designation CH-SS-NX-13, was under development for the Song (Type 039), Yuan (Type 041), Shang (Type 093), and the future Type 095 SSN. If this ASCM were a variant of the YJ-83, it would not have an entirely new NATO designation. The YJ-83, being a variant of the C802, would share a similar NATO designation and nickname. Since the C802 is the CSS-N-8 Saccade, the CH-SS-NX-13 designation (note the change in designator format) explicitly shows the U.S. government believes it is a new weapon.

C803
Since about 2002, the &#8220;C803&#8221; designation has worked its way into just about every Western naval systems book and article. And yet, in over ten years of reporting there has been no formal evidence to support its existence. If one examines the brochures, placards, and mockup displays that CPMIEC has put up at the various arm shows throughout the years, nowhere will the designation &#8220;C803&#8221; be found. Never. For example, Figure 12 shows a flat screen display at the CPMIEC booth at the Airshow China 2010 expo. The display lists, by range, all the ASCMs that China had on the market &#8211; the C701, C704, C802, C705, C802A, and the C602. Furthermore, there was a full mockup display of each of the above missiles on the exhibition hall floor, as well as a smaller scale model. A missile with the &#8220;C803&#8221; designation was conspicuous by its absence. The recent Zhuhai Airshow China 2012 also lacked any mention of the C803, even though numerous new missile variants were presented to the public for the first time. That is because the &#8220;C803,&#8221; if it exists at all, is likely still in the developmental stage, probably in early flight testing, and isn&#8217;t ready to be marketed.

Figure 12: CPMIEC display at Airshow China 2010. The C803 is not even mentioned on the screen with other Chinese anti-ship missiles offered for sale. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson

If the high performance attributes that have long been ascribed to the YJ-83 are actually for an entirely new advanced missile, a program start date can be roughly estimated by looking at when Western and Chinese-based media sources first started reporting on these capabilities. A quick review of the primary Western references indicates these attributes were first described around 2001-2002. Chinese blog sites, as well as the Kanwa Defense Review, started to mention these capabilities in late 1999. If this new missile began development between 1999 and 2002, then the integrated INS and satellite navigation system (GPS and Beidou) and the command data link would now be within China&#8217;s technical capabilities. However, a small supersonic capable propulsion system would undoubtedly still be the most challenging aspect.

Early on, the &#8220;C803&#8221; was initially described as a supersonic missile throughout its entire flight. The problem with this is that the new missile couldn&#8217;t possibly go 200+ km at supersonic speeds and still fit in a torpedo tube; all existing missiles with these speed and range characteristics are much larger than any torpedo tube ever built. The &#8220;smallest&#8221; missile is the Russian 3M-55 (SS-N-26) Onyx/Yakhont at 0.67 meters in diameter and 8.9 meters long, not including the launch canister. Given that the U.S. Department of Defense&#8217;s report explicitly stated the CH-SS-NX-13 is to go on all classes of modern Chinese attack submarines, it is either a torpedo tube-launched weapon, or every PLAN submarine in the Song, Yuan, Shang, and Type 095 classes would have to be fitted with external launch tubes &#8211; a significant modification for the vast majority of these submarines.

This would be tremendously expensive, not to mention occupying most of the available submarine construction way space for years. In short, fitting existing submarines with external tubes for a large supersonic missile seems totally unreasonable from a programmatic perspective. It also completely skips the PLAN&#8217;s proven acquisition concept of buy some, study thoroughly, then build our own, and is fraught with technological risk. With the recent memory of the unsuccessful YJ-1/C101 and HY-3/C301 large supersonic ASCM programs still fresh in the PLAN leaderships minds&#8217;, neither missile was formally accepted into service, it is highly unlikely they would try to go down this path again.

By the mid-2000s, there was a noticeable change in regard to the &#8220;C803&#8217;s&#8221; speed. Chinese blog sites, and some Western sources started questioning the all-supersonic flight profile, and shifted to a subsonic cruise mode followed by a supersonic terminal attack. This change eliminates the problem of requiring a large missile to meet the 250 km range figure that most of the blog sites coalesced about. If one accepts the premise that the missile had a subsonic cruise mode, with a supersonic terminal attack, then this narrows down the possible propulsion system options considerably, as there is only one ASCM in the world that can do this &#8211; Russia&#8217;s 3M54 Novator Alpha (SS-N-27).

Recall that Mircoturbo only demonstrated a supersonic flight capable small-scale turbojet in 2007; this would be rather late in the design stage for this missile and there is no reason to believe China could count on such a development six or so years earlier. However, China had signed a contract with Russia for eight Project 636M Kilo class submarines with the ability to fire the export Novator Alpha (3M54E/SS-N-27B) in May 2002, with the first submarines and SS-N-27B missiles being delivered in 2005.

It is likely Chinese engineer&#8217;s had access to detailed design documentation for both the submarine and the missile after signing the contract, and this timing corresponds roughly with the first rumors of China developing a new advanced ASCM &#8211; one that the U.S. Department of Defense&#8217;s 2010 and 2011 annual reports stated was in &#8220;development and testing.&#8221; While admittedly speculative, and based largely on coincidental inference, there is at least some basis to suggest that the new CH-SS-NX-13 ASCM may be a modified Chinese copy of the Russian Novator Alpha, a very different missile from the YJ-83.

Eagle Strike-8 Family Tree
It&#8217;s been a long haul, but with all the data and discussion completed, Table 1 can now be rebuilt and the confusion eliminated. Table 2 lists all the missiles in the YJ-8 family with their correct PLAN and export designations properly linked, along with their performance characteristics. Those entries with an &#8220;est,&#8221; indicate that the number is the author&#8217;s estimate and not information found in official brochure data or published articles. With regard to the YJ-82, the maximum range has been reduced to reflect the fact that the sustainer rocket motor has to do the booster&#8217;s job as well.

PLAN Desig...Export Desig...IOC...Launch Plat...Lgth(m)...Wt(kg)...Max.Range(km)...Speed(Mach)...Cruise Alt(m)Terminal Alt.(m)
YJ-8...........C801..............1987..Surf/Coast...	5.814.....	815........42...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
YJ-8A.........C801..............92-93.Surf/Coast...	5.814.....	815........42...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
YJ-81.........C801K............1989...Air..............	4.65.......610........50...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
YJ-82........C801Q.............2003...Sub............	4.57.......610 est...30-34 est.........0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
................C802...............94-95..Surf/Coast..	6.392......715........120.................0.80-0.90........20 or 30.......5 or 7
................C802K.............1997 est.Air...........5.15.......515 est...150-160 est.......0.80-0.90.......20 or 30.......5 or 7
YJ-83........C802A.............1998...Surf/Coast...	6.383.....	800........180...................0.80-0.90.......20...............5 or 7.
YJ-83K......C802AK............2002..Air...............5.14.......600........230 &#8211; 250..........0.80-0.90.......20................5 or 7.

Table 2: Eagle Strike-8 missile family designation and characteristics data.

Conclusion
There has been much confusion in published works and on blog sites regarding Chinese ASCMs in general, and the YJ-8 family in particular. It is also fairly safe to say that the confusion is probably not the result of a dedicated deception program; rather it is due to an overload of information, courtesy of the Internet, coupled with a lack of basic engineering expertise by many of the participants. China has had a flurry of activity in their ASCM programs over the last 15 years, and the sheer amount of information that has been made available is unprecedented. Unfortunately, often times the presenters and/or receivers of this information don&#8217;t have a technical background, and this resulted in designations and performance specifications being misunderstood, cross-decked between different missiles, or sometimes, just plain made up to fill in the gaps. Without realizing it, the majority of reporters and bloggers &#8220;spammed&#8221; the world with a multitude of inaccurate and confusing books, articles, and chat room entries.

This article has attempted to sort the wheat from the chaff by looking at the available information through an engineering lens. A lot of the capabilities credited to the YJ-83 were just not technically feasible at the time of the missile&#8217;s development; it is an evolutionary weapon, not a quantum leap. A good analogy would be if the YJ-8 is China&#8217;s MM38 Exocet, then the YJ-83 is China&#8217;s Harpoon Block 1C. This conclusion isn&#8217;t meant to be disparaging to China or Chinese engineers. On the contrary, they have made huge strides in a relatively short period of time. Granted, they&#8217;ve had a lot of help in the process, but the bottom line is that the PLAN has fielded a very capable missile, as well as a functional targeting system, that supports accurate over the horizon missile strikes against a potential adversary&#8217;s surface ships. Not many nations can say they have this capability.

Part 1: Designation Confusion and the Family Members from YJ-8 to YJ-8A
Part 2: YJ-81, YJ-82, and C802

Christopher P. Carlson is a co-designer of the Harpoon tactical naval wargame and a bestselling author.

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## Great China

This time no censorship! The canister is visible, and it is actually DF-41!!
Long live to the Second Artillery Corps!

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## Great China

CJ-10, Second Artillery's Long Sword.

Range: 2,000-2,500 km
Max speed: Mach 2.5 
CEP: <10 m
Warhead: conventional or nuclear

It can easily decapitate whoever dares to threat China!

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## hk299792458

China planned to deploy THAAD-like system facing Indian missile treat. It is composed of 3 radars bases and the intercepteur should be *HQ-19*...











Henri K.

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## hk299792458

A brigade of 2nd artillery is currently in a survival exercise in an underground launch base. More than 2000 soldiers will be isolated during 2 months.






Henri K.


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## Akasa

hk299792458 said:


> China planned to deploy THAAD-like system facing Indian missile treat. It is composed of 3 radars bases and the intercepteur should be *HQ-19*...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Henri K.



Try and publish some papers related to the testing of it. As far as rumors are concerned, the HQ-26 and HQ-8 are tested. They will serve aboard the Type 055.

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## hk299792458

SinoSoldier said:


> Try and publish some papers related to the testing of it. As far as rumors are concerned, the HQ-26 and HQ-8 are tested. They will serve aboard the Type 055.



HQ-19, HQ-29 and HQ-8 were tested, it seems that this is not the case of HQ-26.

Henri K.


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## Akasa

hk299792458 said:


> HQ-19, HQ-29 and HQ-8 were tested, it seems that this is not the case of HQ-26.
> 
> Henri K.



That doesn't make much sense. Papers regarding the HQ-8 and HQ-26 were both published. They were in fact first published in 2003, and rumors are in consensus as well. However nothing has been published regarding HQ-19 or HQ-29.


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## hk299792458

SinoSoldier said:


> That doesn't make much sense. Papers regarding the HQ-8 and HQ-26 were both published. They were in fact first published in 2003, and rumors are in consensus as well. However nothing has been published regarding HQ-19 or HQ-29.



HQ-29 - A quick search of "&#26446;&#33464;&#65306;&#20013;&#22269;&#33322;&#22825;&#31185;&#24037;&#38598;&#22242;&#20844;&#21496;&#20108;&#38498;&#20108;&#37096;&#26576;&#22411;&#21495;&#24635;&#35774;&#35745;&#24072;" on Google will give you some informations, this should be the PAC3-like

HQ-19 - The name is revealed in a R&D paper "&#25112;&#26415;&#23548;&#24377;&#21160;&#21147;&#35013;&#32622;&#38656;&#27714;&#20998;&#26512;&#19982;&#22266;&#20307;&#28779;&#31661;&#21457;&#21160;&#26426;&#21457;&#23637;&#26041;&#21521;", so as HQ-26. This is a THAAD-like system.

Don't forget that HQ-26 is under development in SAST (belongining to CASC), which has also developped HQ-61 and HQ-16 with a lot of delays.

Henri K.


----------



## hk299792458

An official footage showing that the DF-31A ICBM has at least two types of decoy, one to encounter ground based radar for GBI-like system, an another to encounter SM-3/THAAD-like anti-ballistic system.






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

Use of simulators in Second artillery's training. We can see in the footage some ballistic missiles like *DF-21C*, *DF-15B*, *DF-15* and *DF-11A*...






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

Training of a sergent from 2nd artillery and his *DF-3A*...






Henri K.

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## Great China

7 MIRV missile test?


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## hk299792458

Fire simulation of old *DF-3A*...






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

The Second Artillery : *DF-21A* night emergency transmitter walkthrough under the biological and chemical attacks 






Henri K.

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## xuxu1457

PLA deploy DF-21C in Northwest part of China

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery : A variety of new communication equipments in training field






Henri K.

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## Great China

hk299792458 said:


> China's Second Artillery : A variety of new communication equipments in training field
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Henri K.



Hi, first of all my compliments for your videos. They're all very interesting, especially those on SA Corps. 

can you tell me the titles of the music of these two video, please?

ä¸*å½äºç® - ç¬¬äºç®åµæ¼ç»æ°ææ³ - YouTube
ä¸*å½äºç® - ä¸*å½æç¥æ*¸æ*¦å¨åå±å¹´é´ - YouTube

because they're very cool.

Thanks

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## hk299792458

Great China said:


> Hi, first of all my compliments for your videos. They're all very interesting, especially those on SA Corps.
> 
> can you tell me the titles of the music of these two video, please?
> 
> ä¸*å½äºç® - ç¬¬äºç®åµæ¼ç»æ°ææ³ - YouTube
> ä¸*å½äºç® - ä¸*å½æç¥æ*¸æ*¦å¨åå±å¹´é´ - YouTube
> 
> because they're very cool.
> 
> Thanks



I think it's in the album Invincible of Two steps fromm hell.

Henri K.

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery - New biochemical rescue equipment unveiled






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery Corps - Lean command platform for efficient multi-wave assault






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery Engineering University






Henri K.


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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery - New logistics support forces to ensure accurate missile launch






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery - Use technology and innovation to enhance *DF-31A* operability






China's Second Artillery - *DF4* firing drill under confined survival conditions






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

China's Second Artillery - History of a DF15B grassroots commander Yue Yan Hui






Henri K.

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## shuttler

Rocket artillery of the Multiple-Launch Rocket System.

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## Fsjal

shuttler said:


> Rocket artillery of the Multiple-Launch Rocket System.



Do you know the name and range of rockets?


----------



## shuttler

Fsjal said:


> Do you know the name and range of rockets?



A-100 30mm MLRS with a range of 650 km

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## mil-avia

shuttler said:


> A-100 30mm MLRS with a range of 650 km


 *A-100 / PHL-96 rocket has 300mm caliber.*

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## mil-avia

*New long-range rocket artillery's drill : video.*


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## Broccoli

> The NASIC report states that the Chinese ballistic missile force is expanding both in size and types of missiles.
> 
> Deployment of the DF-31A (CSS-10 Mod 2) ICBM continues at a slow pace with &#8220;more than 15&#8221; launchers deployed six years after the system was first introduced.
> 
> Despite many rumors about a new DF-41 ICBM, the NASIC report does not mention this system at all.
> 
> Deployment of the shorter-range DF-31 (CSS-10 Mod 1) ICBM, on the contrary, appears to have stalled or paused, with only 5-10 launchers deployed seven years after it was initially introduced (see my recent analysis of this trend here). Moreover, the range of the DF-31 is lowered a bit, from 7,200+ km in the 2009 report to 7,000+ in the new version.
> 
> Medium-range nuclear missiles include the DF-21 (CSS-5) (in two versions: Mod 1 and Mod 2, but with identical range etc.) and the old DF-3A (CSS-2), which is still listed as deployed. Only 5-10 launchers are left, probably in a single brigade that will probably convert to DF-21 in the near future.
> 
> An important new development concerns conventional missiles, where the NASIC report states that several new systems have been introduced or are in development. This includes a &#8220;number of new mobile, conventionally armed MRBMs,&#8221; apparently in addition to the DF-21C and DF-21D already known. As for the DF-21D anti-ship missile, report states that &#8220;China has likely started to deploy&#8221; the missile but that it is &#8220;unknown&#8221; how many are deployed.
> 
> More dramatic is the development on five new short-range ballistic missiles, including the CSS-9, CSS-11, CSS-14, CSS-X-15, and CSS-X-16. The CSS-9 and CSS-14 come in different versions with different ranges. The CSS-11 Mod 1 is a modification of the existing DF-11, but with a range of over 800 kilometers (500 miles). None of these systems are listed as nuclear-capable.
> 
> Concerning sea-based nuclear forces, the NASIC report echoes the DOD report by saying that the JL-2 SLBM for the new Jin-class SSBN is not yet operational. The JL-2 is designated as CSS-NX-14, which I thought it was a typo in the 2009 report, as opposed to the CSS-NX-3 for the JL-1 (which is also not operational).
> 
> NASIC concludes that JL-2 &#8220;will, for the first time, allow Chinese SSBNs to target portions of the United States from operating areas located near the Chinese coast.&#8221; That is true for Guam and Alaska, but not for Hawaii and the continental United States. Moreover, like the DF-31, the JL-2 range estimate is lowered from 7,200+ km in the 2009 report to 7,000+ km in the new version. Earlier intelligence estimates had the range as high as 8,000+ km.
> 
> One of the surprises (perhaps) in the new report is that it does not list the CJ-20 air-launched cruise missile, which was listed in the U.S. Air Force Global Strike Command briefing as a nuclear cruise missile that had been &#8220;fielded&#8221; within the past five years.
> 
> Concerning the overall size of the Chinese nuclear arsenal, there have been many rumors that it includes hundreds or even thousands of additional warheads more than the 250 we estimate. STRATCOM commander has also rejected these rumors. To that end, the NASIC report lists all Chinese nuclear missiles with one warhead each, despite widespread rumors in the news media and among some analysts that multiple warheads are deployed on some missiles.
> 
> Yet the report does echo a projection made by the annual DOD report, that &#8220;China may also be developing a new road-mobile ICBM capable of carrying a MIRV payload.&#8221; But NASIC does not confirm widespread news media rumors that this system is the DF-41 &#8211; in fact, the report doesn&#8217;t even mention the DF-41 as in development.
> 
> As for the future, the NASIC report repeats the often-heard prediction that &#8220;the number of warheads on Chinese ICBMs capable of threatening the United States is expected to grow to well over 100 in the next 15 years.&#8221; This projection has continued to slip and NASIC slips it a bit further into the future to 2028.


Air Force Intelligence Report Provides Snapshot of Nuclear Missiles - FAS Strategic Security Blog


----------



## Psyops

Not a credible website.


----------



## xuxu1457



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## mil-avia

*Dongfeng-2 / DF-2 ballistic missile photo :




800 × 532 pixels


Related link 1 and link 2. *

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## hk299792458

Chinese Second Artillery Corps - Launching exercise under chemical and biological attacks






Henri K.

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## mil-avia

*The Second Artillery Corps has a series of 'Dong Feng' ballistic missiles and 'Chang Jian' cruise missiles, both long, medium and short range.*

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## BRASSNAUTILUS

Fsjal said:


> Do you know the name and range of rockets?



30cm version has 85km range. 12.2cm version 40km.


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## mil-avia

*DF-2 medium-range ballistic missile :





799 × 407 pixels





Related link(s). *


----------



## mil-avia

*Video about Donfeng-31A / DF-31A (and other) ballistic missiles :

[youku]XNTk2OTc2MzE2[/youku]


Related link(s).*


----------



## xunzi

I have some information from a friend of mine who work with China missile program. All he disclosed was China is currently working on a "secret" missile that will be a game changer.

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## Fsjal

xunzi said:


> I have some information from a friend of mine who work with China missile program. All he disclosed was China is currently working on a "secret" missile that will be a game changer.


Possibly a missile with a huge range or something...


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## East Asia United

xunzi said:


> I have some information from a friend of mine who work with China missile program. All he disclosed was China is currently working on a "secret" missile that will be a game changer.



Come one!! Get some more please!!

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## mil-avia

*Indonesia, China discuss C-705 missile technology transfer*

August 20, 2013

Beijing (ANTARA News) - Indonesia and China are in talks about the technology transfer mechanism for C-705 missiles that will be used by the Indonesian navy.

Director General of Security Potentials at the Indonesian Ministry of Defense Pos Hutabarat told ANTARA News here on Tuesday that both countries need to have their individual legal requirements on technology transfer fulfilled.

Speaking after attending the second meeting on Indonesia-China defense industry cooperation, he stated that Indonesia`s Law Number 16/2012 on defense industry covers technology transfer, trading, and purchase of license for medium- and high-technology weapons.

"However, China`s regulations on technology transfer are based on intellectual property rights, which require us to pay a special fee for transferring technology from that country. The two countries have yet to reach an agreement in this area," Hutabarat noted.

Defense ties between the two countries have strengthened since the signing of the memorandum of understanding between the Indonesian Ministry of Defense and the State Administration of Science, Technology, and Industry for National Defense of the People`s Republic of China (SASTIND) on March 22, 2011, in Jakarta.

Besides, a meeting on defense industry cooperation (DICM) was held in Jakarta on July 24-25, 2012, which was followed by a meeting in Beijing on August 19-20 this year.

These meetings have paved the way for increased defense cooperation between Indonesia and China, including the signing of the Letter of Intent for the joint manufacturing of C-705 anti-ship missiles between the Indonesian Ministry of Defense and SASTIND.

The manufacturing process for C-705 missiles will involve four stages.

"We have yet to agree on the stage at which the transfer of technology will be done. However, the two sides have agreed that a technology transfer process must be put in place immediately," Pos said.


*Related link(s).*


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## cirr

Our Indian friends should be concerned&#65306;






Key words&#65306;Space launch technology institue&#12289;AT&#12289;45-ton&#12289;super heavy-duty chassis&#12289;5000m above sea level&#65292;Tanggula Range&#12290;

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## Johnlaw

Aegis 's SM2 defense missile has sensitive thermal imaging camera that can chase maveurable warhead ballistic missiles. I wonder if it can really defeat the DF.


----------



## Zarvan

cirr said:


> Our Indian friends should be concerned&#65306;
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Key words&#65306;Space launch technology institue&#12289;AT&#12289;45-ton&#12289;super heavy-duty chassis&#12289;5000m above sea level&#65292;Tanggula Range&#12290;


at
What is the range of Anti Carrier Ballistic Missile of China


----------



## Fsjal

Johnlaw said:


> Aegis 's SM2 defense missile has sensitive thermal imaging camera that can chase maveurable warhead ballistic missiles. I wonder if it can really defeat the DF.



Depends on which DF missile you're referring to. If it was the DF-21/31/41/11/15, then you're wrong. If you're referring to DF-3/4/5, then you're right.


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## HumanRights

Fsjal said:


> Depends on which DF missile you're referring to. If it was the DF-21/31/41/11/15, then you're wrong. If you're referring to DF-3/4/5, then you're right.



Indians guys r dreaming. lol


----------



## mil-avia

*DF-2 ballistic missile vintage photo:




822 × 1103 pixels








Related link(s).*


----------



## nomi007




----------



## hk299792458

nomi007 said:


>



Why an A320 from Tianjin is posted in a thread of missile?

Henri K.


----------



## Fsjal

hk299792458 said:


> Why an A320 from Tianjin is posted in a thread of missile?
> 
> Henri K.



Maybe he didn't see the cockpit windows, therefore, he mistaken it for a missiles.


----------



## mil-avia

*HQ 9 air defense missile vertical launching :





866 × 1495 pixels


Related link(s). *

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## mil-avia

*HHQ-9 Fired From PLAN Type 052C Lanzhou Class Destroyer :




1380 × 1971 pixels


Related link(s). *

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## cirr

HQ-9B is onboard Type 052D DDGs&#12290;

But when will we get glimpses of the new members of the HQ family&#65292;such as HQ-19 and HQ-26&#65311;

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## Beast

cirr said:


> HQ-9B is onboard Type 052D DDGs&#12290;
> 
> But when will we get glimpses of the new members of the HQ family&#65292;such as HQ-19 and HQ-26&#65311;



After Type052D is commissioned.


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## mil-avia

*FD-2000 SAM (export version of HQ-9) images in Zhuhai Airshow 2012.*


----------



## Broccoli

DF-15C

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## hk299792458

DF-15A, DF-15B, DF-21A and CJ-10











Henri K.

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## cirr



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## cirr



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## cirr

New high-precision optic seeker with CEP of less than a metre for ballistic missile，including a new generation of the so-called DF-21D ASBMs：

http://www.chinanews.com/mil/2013/10-25/5426190.shtml

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## cirr

Great，simply great！！

http://www.guancha.cn/military-affairs/2013_10_27_181320.shtml

Now ballistic missiles can be as accurate as cruise missiles，and with the use of advanced data link system to realize man-in-the-loop guidance，operators thousands of kilometres away can even guide the missiles to hit the target（possibly moving target）at the terminal stage。

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## Nishan_101

Pakistan KRL, NESCOM and SUPARCO should work on small, medium and large size rocket systems, missiles and other related equipment to fulfill Pakistan's needs.

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## cirr

YJ-100：


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## Fsjal

mil-avia said:


> *HQ 9 air defense missile vertical launching :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 866 × 1495 pixels
> 
> Related link(s). *


That's an S-300 missile. Just look at the TEL and the missile.


----------



## mil-avia

Fsjal said:


> That's an S-300 missile. Just look at the TEL and the missile.


U r not correct bro. I found the image in a webpage written in Chinese language, the missile is an HQ-9 according to the image caption and story title in that webpage.

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## Fsjal

S


mil-avia said:


> U r not correct bro. I found the image in a webpage written in Chinese language, the missile is an HQ-9 according to the image caption and story title in that webpage.


sometimes, captions can be misleading, but S-300 and HQ-9 are similar in appearance, so... yeah.


----------



## cirr

China test-fires new members of the JL and CJ families today and tomorrow。

If all goes according to plan，both missiles will be used on the SSBN and SSN in-one White Tiger。


----------



## mil-avia

*HQ-9 missile thrust vectoring nozzle :





*
*1024×768 pixels*


Related link(s).

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## mil-avia

*Chinese publication cover showing HQ-9 missiles :*







*Related link(s).*


----------



## shuttler

An illustration of 霹雳10 PL-10 now circulating on military forums
Credit: tieba.baidu.com

It will be the most advanced infrared homing ASRAAM to be deployed on the likes of J-20 and J-16 two years earlier than planned!

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## cirr

DF-21D






firing at a slow-moving target

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## Beidou2020

cirr said:


> DF-21D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> firing at a slow-moving target



American military just shat itself.


----------



## Fsjal

cirr said:


> DF-21D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> firing at a slow-moving target


Why the long nose?


----------



## Akasa

China Tests High-Speed Missile Designed to Evade US Defenses


----------



## cirr

YJ-100 anti-ship cruise missile：






Effective range：650km

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## shuttler

shuttler said:


> Credit: qianzhan.com
> 
> An illustration of 霹雳10 PL-10 now circulating on military forums
> 
> It will be the most advanced infrared homing ASRAAM to be deployed on the likes of J-20 and J-16 two years earlier than planned!



More pix and PL:-10 seen carried by J20 and other fighter jets













Credit: Huanqiu



Fsjal said:


> Why the long nose?



Image-seeker, micro vidcam, infrared imaging sensors, Beidou guidance, positioning and controlling devices etc.

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## Broccoli

DF-21 launch.

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## xhw1986

DF-31 launch, 23/01/14

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## cirr

HQ-19，China's THAAD-ER，a mighty success！！！

*PRC's “Evolved THAAD Interceptor (ETI)” *

PS。Thick 1st stage，cone-shaped 2nd stage，shorter than HQ-9.

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## cirr

36X3 DF-15Bs making up a brigade of the 2nd artillery Corps：

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## ChineseTiger1986

cirr said:


> HQ-19，China's THAAD-ER，a mighty success！！！
> 
> *PRC's “Evolved THAAD Interceptor (ETI)” *
> 
> PS。Thick 1st stage，cone-shaped 2nd stage，shorter than HQ-9.



I think soon HQ-19 will become HQ-26 and being equipped by both Type 052D and Type 055.


----------



## 592257001

mil-avia said:


> U r not correct bro. I found the image in a webpage written in Chinese language, the missile is an HQ-9 according to the image caption and story title in that webpage.


seriously though, it is a S-300. Doesn't matter what the caption says. Plz go look up some comparative picture of HQ-9 and S-300, it's pretty easy to tell.


----------



## Martian2

*Best photographs of China's JL-2 8-MIRVed SLBM and DF-41 10-MIRVed ICBM*






"Submarine launch of JL-2 SLBM"

Source: SLBM | Errymath's

Original Chinese source: 中国十天内进行两种新型洲际核导弹发射试验_军事_环球网

----------





"The PLA Second Artillery Corps, China’s strategic missile force, conducted a second test flight of its DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile on Dec. 13, according to the US website Washington Free Beacon."

Source: PLA Conducts 2nd Test Flight of DF-41 ICBM - Threat Journal by AlertsUSA

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## ChineseTiger1986

Martian2 said:


> *Best photographs of China's JL-2 8-MIRVed SLBM and DF-41 10-MIRVed ICBM*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Submarine launch of JL-2 SLBM"
> 
> Source: SLBM | Errymath's
> 
> Original Chinese source: 中国十天内进行两种新型洲际核导弹发射试验_军事_环球网
> 
> ----------
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "The PLA Second Artillery Corps, China’s strategic missile force, conducted a second test flight of its DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile on Dec. 13, according to the US website Washington Free Beacon."
> 
> Source: PLA Conducts 2nd Test Flight of DF-41 ICBM - Threat Journal by AlertsUSA



According to the Chines source, China also did test JL-2A few days after testing DF-41.

And JL-2A has a range of 11000km.

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## Martian2

*Chinese J-10A armed with PL-12 missile is far superior to French Rafale armed with MICA missile*





_PL-12 / SD-10A on display at Datangshan in 2010 (Zhenguan Studio, © 2010, Air Power Australia)._





A MICA EM missile (top) and MICA IR (bottom), displayed at Farnborough in 1998 (Duncan Lennox)

1. The Chinese PL-12 air-to-air missile has *higher potential energy in combat*. The Chinese J-10A has a service ceiling of 18,000m. The French Rafale has a lower service ceiling of 16,800m. For combat, the same missile launched at a higher altitude (such as 18,000m) will fly further.

2. The Chinese PL-12 missile has *higher kinetic energy in combat*. A missile fired from a Mach 2.2 J-10A will fly much further than a missile fired from a much slower Mach 1.8 Rafale. The J-10A has a faster "maximum speed of Mach 2.2 at altitude" than the significantly slower "Mach 1.8+" for the French Rafale.

3. *The Chinese PL-12 missile is significantly larger in size and can carry more rocket propellant.* More rocket fuel means greater range.

Chinese PL-12 missile has a volume of 3.7m x pi x (0.1m^2) = 0.116 cubic meters

French MICA missile has a volume of 3.1m x pi x (0.08m^2) = 0.062 cubic meters

In conclusion, the Chinese PL-12 has almost twice the volume of the much smaller French Rafale missile.
_________________________________________________________________________________

PL-12 | GlobalSecurity

"The missile is thought to correspond to the PL-12 designation, which is also associated with the SD-10 designation, possibly for export purposes. Like the basic R-77, Project 129 appears to have a body diameter of 200 mm., with a length of around 3.7 meters (12.1 ft.)."
-----

Mica RF - Deagel

"Mica RF
IOC: 1996
Also Known As: Mica EM
Origin: France
Contractor/s: MBDA

Dimensions

Diameter: 160 millimeter
Length: 3.10 meter"
----------

*China's J-10A Vigorous Dragon is superior to French Rafale*





China's J-10A flies higher, faster, and carry longer-range PL-12 AAM (air-to-air missile) than French Rafale.





The J-10A carries four PL-12 missiles with 70+ km range that can easily shoot down a French Rafale carrying shorter 50km range MICA missiles.

The J-10A has a service ceiling of 18,000m. The French Rafale has a lower service ceiling of 16,800m. For combat, the same missile launched at a higher altitude (such as 18,000m) will fly further.

For within-visual-range (WVR) combat, a J-10A can circle above and swoop down with guns blazing on a helpless French Rafale. On the other hand, a French Rafale cannot engage a high-flying J-10A at 18,000m (which is 1,200m beyond the French Rafale's service ceiling).

The J-10A can carry four PL-12 beyond-visual-range (BVR) missiles with 70+ km range. However, the MICA missile carried by the French Rafale has a much shorter 50km range (according to GlobalSecurity).

There is an alternative citation for a higher 100km range for the PL-12 (see International Assessment and Strategy Center > Research > The Air Balance on the Taiwan Strait).

The J-10A has a faster "maximum speed of Mach 2.2 at altitude" than the significantly slower "Mach 1.8+" for the French Rafale. This means the J-10A can fire its four PL-12 missiles at a French Rafale at 60km and fly home safely. The French Rafale's slower speed means it cannot chase down a J-10A.

The final point is the deadliness of China's PL-12 missiles.

Advanced but Unproved Chinese BVR Medium Range Missile SD-10

"Its seven recent test firings all hit the targets.
...
Experts believe that domestic SD-10's performance has surpassed the U.S. AIM-120A/B, Russian R-77 and the French MICA (Missile d'Interception et de Combat Aerien), etc., and close to the AIM-120C."

[Note: PL-12/SD-10 refers to the same missile.]

----------

References (for Wikipedia articles, see primary source footnotes):

Chengdu J-10 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Dassault Rafale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Mica | GlobalSecurity

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## cirr

Successful firing test of new *dual pulse solid rocket motor*：

我国双脉冲固体发动机研制 - 就爱飞行!

Hello HQ-26 and other missiles。

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## hk299792458

Women in 2nd artillery corps






Henri K.

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## hk299792458

Multi-items control in a salvo mode SRBMs firing






Henri K.

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## cirr

All-electric servos successfully tested during a recent missile flight demo：

中国首次实现伺服系统全电化 在某型号上试验成功_陕西频道_凤凰网

Electro-Mechanical Actuation（EMA）was first used on the M51 SLBM。

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## shuttler

cirr said:


> All-electric servos successfully tested during a recent missile flight demo：
> 
> 中国首次实现伺服系统全电化 在某型号上试验成功_陕西频道_凤凰网
> 
> Electro-Mechanical Actuation（EMA）was first used on the M51 SLBM。






cirr said:


> Successful firing test of new *dual pulse solid rocket motor*：
> 
> 我国双脉冲固体发动机研制 - 就爱飞行!
> 
> Hello HQ-26 and other missiles。

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## hk299792458

Training of 2nd artillery corps






Henri K.


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## cirr



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## hk299792458

DF-26 Boost-Glide MRBM...

Henri K.


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## hk299792458

Training of 2nd artillery corp






Henri K.


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## cirr

YJ-12

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## hk299792458

Training of 2nd artillery corps






Henri K.

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## cirr

PLAAF Missile Troops

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## hk299792458

DF-11 and CJ-10






Henri K.

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## cabatli_53

cirr said:


> HQ-9B is onboard Type 052D DDGs&#12290;
> 
> But when will we get glimpses of the new members of the HQ family&#65292;such as HQ-19 and HQ-26&#65311;




Do you have any info about HQ-9C to share? 
According to some reports, Turkish and Chinese officials are negotiating over HQ-9C missiles for Turkey altitude missile program.


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## hk299792458

*CJ-10*








cabatli_53 said:


> Do you have any info about HQ-9C to share?
> According to some reports, Turkish and Chinese officials are negotiating over HQ-9C missiles for Turkey altitude missile program.



Never heard about HQ-9C

Henri K.

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## cirr

KF-3，Chinese ”PAC3“

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## Beast

cirr said:


> KF-3，Chinese ”PAC3“



What's that? Another variant of HQ-9 series?

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## hk299792458

cirr said:


> KF-3，Chinese ”PAC3“



Chinese PAC-3-like is HQ-29 from 2nd academy of CASIC

FK-3 is from 061 base of CASIC.

2 products, 2 different clients...

Henri K.

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## cirr

CJ-10s in storage

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## Luftwaffe

SOM, Joint Strike Missile...Turkey, Norway and US are developing Advanced Cruise Missiles to be integrated with F-35, Is there any known advanced stealth cruise missile program by China for its J-20.



@hk299792458 @cirr


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## cirr

Wii our friends at the Pentagon have a few words on this？

不明飞行物—在线播放—优酷网，视频高清在线观看

Recorded last night

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## Indus Falcon

cirr said:


> Wii our friends at the Pentagon have a few words on this？
> 
> 不明飞行物—在线播放—优酷网，视频高清在线观看
> 
> Recorded last night


Can you please explain / details please? I can hardly see it.


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## 55100864

cirr said:


> Wii our friends at the Pentagon have a few words on this？
> 
> 不明飞行物—在线播放—优酷网，视频高清在线观看
> 
> Recorded last night


Looks like WU-14 HGV?

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## cirr

Abu Nasar said:


> Can you please explain / details please? I can hardly see it.













Spotted in the sky over Shandong、Hebei、Inner Mongolian etc。

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## xhw1986

*Chinese agency also revealed existence of DF-26, HQ-19, HQ-26*

The Shaanxi Province Environmental Monitoring Center was found to have revealed the existence of the DF-26 MRBM in a progress report in March this year.






In the same report, there was a mention of two missile systems which could be the HQ-19 and HQ-26 air defense missiles.

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## Zarvan

xhw1986 said:


> *Chinese agency also revealed existence of DF-26, HQ-19, HQ-26*
> 
> The Shaanxi Province Environmental Monitoring Center was found to have revealed the existence of the DF-26 MRBM in a progress report in March this year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In the same report, there was a mention of two missile systems which could be the HQ-19 and HQ-26 air defense missiles.


According to reports China has produced and developed new Anti Tank Missile and launcher if true share the details


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## Beast

Zarvan said:


> According to reports China has produced and developed new Anti Tank Missile and launcher if true share the details


HJ-19, fire and forgot. Same as US Javelin and Israel spike.

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## cirr

DF-16（in Tibet）

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## Saifullah Sani

After China's CX-1 supersonic cruise missile, displayed at the recent Zhuhai Airshow, was noted to resemble India's BrahMos missile, the Beijing-based Sina Military Network undertook a comparison between the Chinese and Indian missiles on Nov. 18.

The Chaoxun-1 missile designed by China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation has earned the nickname Cahoxi 1 ("Copy 1" in English) because of its uncanny similarity to the BrahMos missile jointly developed by Russia and India. However, Wang Hongpo, the chief designer of the missile, said the CX-1 is a completely new design. Wang said it has different wings, aerodynamic guidance and jet vane.

Under the restrictions of the Missile Technology Control Regime, the attacking range of cruise missiles like the CX-1 and BrahMos can not exceed 300 kilometers. Wang said this is the main reason the CX-1 shares many similar characteristics with the BrahMos. Sina Military Network noted that the CX-1 flies faster than the Indian missile. It is capable of reaching a speed of Mach 3 at 17,000 meters, whereas the BrahMos can only reach Mach 2.6 at an altitude of 14,000 meters.

Launched against targets in low altitude, the speed of the CX-1 is Mach 2.3., while the Russian-built P-800 Oniks on which the BrahMos is designed can only reach Mach 2. Sina Military Network said the CX-1's ramjet engine may be better than the solid rocket motor of the P-800. However, it pointed out that the attack range of CX-1 can be reduced to 40 kilometers at low trajectories while the Russian missile can travel 120 kilometers.

Since the BrahMos is designed to conduct attacks below an altitude of 500 meters, the Sina Military Network said the Indian missile is unsuitable for actual combat situations. Though India plans to produce 2,000 BrahMos, only 200 of them have been produced, the report said, adding that the proof of the CX-1's superiority will rest in how many nations wish to purchase it.

CX-1 cruise missile better than BrahMos, not a copy: report｜Politics｜News｜WantChinaTimes.com

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## ali_raza

i hope pakistan takes a few

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## truthseeker2010

lets wait for indian's reply......


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## Mitro

Cx-1 Made by a country who makes lots of different missile system like Air to Air [BVR][WVR],SEAD,Cruise missile,Ballistic missile,Ground to Air missile and working on hypersonic cruise missile .
They are independent in every thing except aircraft engine other then 100% indigenous 
So what makes a person to think that its very difficult to make CX-1 or impossible for china .
When china show some thing in the weapon exhibition it means its all ready tested and marketed and there are some country already talk to buy it.
Cx-1 is no doubt more formidable then Brahmos because russian tech base on soviet union glory is old with no new research .

Why China always Troll India with something new in every airshow
Last time was Cm400AKG and this year HJ-12 [Spike] and CX-1 [Brahmos]

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## rockstar08

ali_raza said:


> i hope pakistan takes a few



Pakistan already has babur and Ra'ad .. we dont need another ... but need to focus on range and accuracy of our existing CM's


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## Zarvan

So Brahmos is also copy of P-800


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## GR!FF!N

Since the BrahMos is designed to conduct attacks below an altitude of 500 meters, the Sina Military Network said the Indian missile is unsuitable for actual combat situations. Though India plans to produce 2,000 BrahMos, only 200 of them have been produced, the report said, adding that the proof of the CX-1's superiority will rest in how many nations wish to purchase it.

Source: CX-1 cruise missile better than BrahMos



Brahmos Block III has an advanced guidance and upgraded software, incorporating high manoeuvres at multiple points and steep dive from high altitude. The steep dive capability of the Block III enables it to hit targets hidden behind a mountain range. It will be deployed in Arunachal Pradesh. It can engage ground targets from an altitude as low as 10 meters for surgical strikes with out any collateral damage. It is capable of being launched from multiple platforms like submarines, ships, aircraft and land based Mobile Autonomous Launchers (MAL).

Defence News - All you need to know about BRAHMOS Block III Missile

as per Sina Military Network,the mountain ranges of Arunachal Pradesh is below 500m MSL. 

fact....*Tawang:* It is located at a height of 12, 000 feet above sea level.

and Speed of Brahmos is Mach 3.Sina Military Network and their noob report.. 

I say,let them make the missile first.its just a mock up and so many cheerleaders are dancing with pom pom.

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## AUz

Great!

As China matures up, and advances in weapon's technology---Pakistan's defense industry and military capability will increase proportionally as well, due to very good ties of Pakistan and China.

We already have super-sonic missiles in our arsenal...

Now, we should look into China's fire-and-forget HJ-12 anti-tank missile system.

More Muslim countries should do joint-ventures and cooperation with China and develop their own defense industries.

Turkey, Pakistan, Iran, and now increasingly GCC are developing their own weapon-systems and increasing their defense sector.

Malaysia and Indonesia are also going towards this path.

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## feilong

@Gr!ffin 
I don't know what the heck this guy trying to said, first he said Bra Mole is superior to women undies. Then he compare India as paradise of horse. Last he compare Indian is invincible and masturbating themselves. I dunno what the heck he yapping about.


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## GR!FF!N

feilong said:


> @Gr!ffin
> I don't know what the heck this guy trying to said, first he said Bra Mole is superior to women undies. Then he compare India as paradise of horse. Last he compare Indian is invincible and masturbating themselves. I dunno what the heck he yapping about.



at first,you've to learn spelling to tag me..

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## root

Good China is advancing in defence technology very quickly.


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## Beidou2020

Who actually believes the specs on the brahmos.

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## cnleio

No matter what it is ... only cheaper & effective for foreign customers, CX-1 is a successful export weapon for China.

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## SrNair

Zarvan said:


> So Brahmos is also copy of P-800



Where are you coming from?
There is a hell lot of thread in this PDF where Brahmos was a JV based on Oniks.

On topic :They already gave them a name copy 

Wait for 2 years you will get Mach 5+ Brahmos 2


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## cirr

Brahmos is a piece of crap。CX-1 is a better piece of crap。


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## SrNair

root said:


> Good China is advancing in defence technology very quickly.



And also copying.


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## cirr

A new generation of tank gun launched missile fielded：

我军新一代炮射导弹将列装部队- 军报记者网

*DF-16*

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## Martian2

This is a great video on Chinese anti-ship missiles. You can see the evolution from crude designs to modern sleek missiles.

"*Published on Oct 21, 2014*
China has unveiled its latest surface-to-air missile system for the first time coinciding with President Xi Jinping's four-nation tour, including India. The HongQi-10 missile system, which can mitigate the threat from low-altitude anti-ship missiles, was unveiled during a China Central Television (CCTV) report."

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## davidwang

amalakas said:


> How are these missiles guided?
> 
> if the US have two carriers in the region that is 200 missiles according to your theory.
> 
> may i ask how they are guided?


guided by satellites, or submarines who pick up the sound footprint of aircraft carrier fleet, which is pretty noisy and obvious.

Once the initial position of the fleet is located, the fleet will be continually tracked while the missiles are launched.

it will take the missile less than 10 minutes to travel 2,500 km, and the warhead can use SAR to locate the exact location of the fleet before it re-entered the atmosphere, there will be a short period when the radar is jammed because of the high speed.

the terminal guidance is reactivated once the jamming period concludes and the radar will search the previously market area, then it will hit the aircraft carrier at speed up to Mach 5



ice bomb said:


> You can be sure that USN wont let any UAV or subs get anywhere near the carrier. And track a carrier group in the middle of an ocean with satellites? Please tell me it is a joke....


The fleet travels at the speed of 18-20 knots, the submarine doesn't need to be close to know where the fleet is

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## davidwang

Abdi-Karim Elmi said:


> No way... Mongolia is protected by Russia and Turkey would not allow you..


ICBM from Mongolia does not have to fly over Turkey

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## cirr

DF-41？

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## Martian2

cirr said:


> DF-41？
> 
> View attachment 197055



I don't think so. The DF-41 is very long and usually extends beyond the truck cabin.

The tire pattern resembles the DF-41 TEL, but the missile canister looks too short.

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## terranMarine

Martian2 said:


> I don't think so. The DF-41 is very long and usually extends beyond the truck cabin.
> 
> The tire pattern resembles the DF-41 TEL, but the missile itself looks too short.



any idea what missile it could be?

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## cirr

Martian2 said:


> I don't think so. The DF-41 is very long and usually extends beyond the truck cabin.
> 
> The tire pattern resembles the DF-41 TEL, but the missile itself looks too short.



Sorry，I was meant to post the following：

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## Martian2

terranMarine said:


> any idea what missile it could be?


I'll guess a more rugged (for mountain or jungle operation) or compact DF-31A TEL.

Also, the new DF-31A TEL could be the same TEL for the DF-41. Why produce two different TELs? Standardize on the same TEL and merely carry the shorter DF-31A on it.



cirr said:


> Sorry，I was meant to post the following：
> 
> View attachment 197056


Okay. That looks like a DF-41 ICBM.

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## Martian2

Fighting for Customers | The New York Times





----------

An HQ-9 costs $750,000 per missile. With a speed of Mach 4.2 and a range of 200km, the Chinese HQ-9 provides capable and affordable air-defense.[1] It is impossible for an F-22, F-35, or B-2 to outrun the HQ-9.

Thus, the focus of the discussion shifts over to the anti-stealth radars. As long as accurate targeting information is provided to the HQ-9, it will do its job of protecting the airspace.

Citation.

1. HQ-9 - Technical Characteristics | GlobalSecurity




































[Note: Thank you to Greyboy2 for the pictures.]

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## Sulman Badshah

fatman17 said:


> *China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s Eagle Strike-Eight Anti-Ship Cruise Missiles: Designation Confusion and the Family Members from YJ-8 to YJ-8A*
> 
> 
> Written by: Christopher P. Carlson on February 4, 2013
> 
> 
> 
> A People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) missile boat launches a YJ-8 anti-ship missile.
> 
> With the arguments over disputed islands and reefs in the South and East China Seas getting louder and louder, it is only natural there would be increased media coverage on the People&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s Republic of China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s (PRC) military capabilities. Unfortunately, the confusing and often-inaccurate information on the technical aspects of China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s armed forces, and in this particular case the People&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s Liberation Army Navy (PLAN), makes meaningful debate difficult. One especially troublesome example is the inadequate reporting on China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s anti-ship cruise missiles (ASCM), and more specifically the Ying Ji-8 (YJ-8) or Eagle Strike-8 family. The purpose of this article is to conduct a critical review of the available evidence to sort out the correct identity of the members of this missile family, as well as providing accurate characteristics and performance data.
> 
> Designation Confusion
> One of the major causes of confusion surrounding the YJ-8 family is the myriad of designations for the various missiles and their relationship to each other. Unfortunately, many of the designations out in the mainstream press are incorrect, which makes it very difficult to link a PLAN designation with the appropriate export version. Table 1 presents a summarized list of the published designations, their relationships, and accuracy.
> 
> PLAN Designation...Export Designation...Accuracy
> YJ-1........ C801......................x
> YJ-12...... C801A....................x
> YJ-2....... C802......................x
> YJ-21...... C802A.....................x
> YJ-8........ C801.......................&[HASHTAG]#8730[/HASHTAG];
> YJ-8A....... C801A.....................x
> YJ-81...... C801A.....................x
> YJ-8K....... C801K......................x
> YJ-8Q...... C801Q.....................x
> YJ-82...... C802.......................x
> YJ-82K..... C802K......................x
> YJ-83...... C803........................x
> YJ-83K..... C803K.......................x
> 
> Table 1: PLAN and export designations for the Eagle Strike-8 family.
> 
> A single red entry in either designation column indicates an incorrect designation. If both entries are red, this indicates that either both designation entries are incorrect, as in the case of the YJ-12 and the C801A, or that an incorrect relationship or linkage has been made between correct designators (e.g. YJ-82 and C802). As it can be seen from the above table, only one designation pair is correctly identified and linked &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; no wonder there is so much confusion in current publications. Clearing up this designator confusion is essential to understanding a missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s true identity, and for whom it was made, the PLAN or the export market. This is an important distinction, as the PLAN doesn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t use missiles with a C800 series designation; all the missiles on their warships, aircraft, and submarines use the YJ-8 series designation, as we will see shortly.
> 
> Recognition Features
> Before we can begin to untangle this knot, there has to be a clear understanding as to what type of missile is being discussed. To accomplish this, some basic recognition features are provided to assist in missile identification. Figure 1 compares the physical characteristics of the C801 and C802 export missiles based on brochure data provided by the China National Precision Machinery Import & Export Corporation, or CPMIEC. All members of the YJ-8 family closely follow one, or the other, of these two missiles.
> 
> Figure 1: Physical comparison of C801 and C802 missiles. Graphic courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> There are three significant recognition features that need to be highlighted. First, the C802 has a longer fuselage section aft of the wings, a necessary modification to accommodate the TRI 60 series turbojet. A second related identifier is the pronounced inlet scoop on the C802 for said turbojet. An inlet scoop is unnecessary on the shorter C801 as it is fitted with a solid rocket motor for propulsion. And finally, there are two external cable runs on the C802, located on both sides of the missile, while the C801 has a single cable run on the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s underside. Of note, some photos of the air-launched version of the YJ-83 lack cable runs. These photos are of dummy training missiles that do not require an electrical connection between the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s flight control computer and rudders.
> 
> YJ-8
> The YJ-8 was a radical departure from the Soviet P-15 (SS-N-2) Styx-based missiles that were the mainstay of the PLAN&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s arsenal throughout the mid-1990s. Considerably smaller and lighter than the Styx, the YJ-8 had essentially the same range and speed, but with a much smaller warhead. The key technological leap forward was the transition from a liquid-fueled rocket engine to a solid rocket motor.
> 
> The approval to begin developing a small rocket-powered ASCM was granted by the Central Military Commission in September 1976. The decision to use a solid rocket motor was based on encouraging results from laboratory tests since 1973 and the preliminary work done on the SY-2 (Upstream-2) ASCM. According to a 1991 Aerospace China article, the development of the actual YJ-8 propulsion system began in 1978, with flight-testing completed by 1985. The YJ-8 reached initial operational capability (IOC) with the PLAN in 1987. Although first announced in 1984, the export version of the YJ-8, the C801, wasn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t formally introduced to the international arms market until three years later. This initial version had fixed wings and was stored in small externally ribbed box launchers on surface ships, or in external tubes on a single modified Type 033G Romeo class submarine. Figure 2 shows a YJ-8 missile being loaded into one of the tubes on the modified Romeo.
> 
> Figure 2: A YJ-8 missile being loaded on the Project 033G Modified Romeo class SSG. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> The origins of the YJ-8 are somewhat shrouded in mystery. Several defense analysts have suggested the YJ-8 is a reverse engineered copy of the French MM38 Exocet. The general appearance of the missile, and the externally ribbed launcher, was cited in support of this theory. Other analysts and commentators disagree and argue the Chinese missile was a logical result of the development of a weapon system with similar requirements. The analysts that hold this view point to the differences in the size of the two missiles, and the significant disparity in rocket motor designs. The MM38 uses a sustainer and booster that are housed within the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s body, while the YJ-8 uses an internal sustainer motor with a separate, jettisonable booster.
> 
> The independent development hypothesis is difficult to support today given our knowledge of the PRC&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s weapon acquisition and development strategy. China has perfected the practice of acquiring weapon systems, openly or covertly, analyzing them, and then developing indigenous versions. This is a necessary evil when a country has to close a significant gap in military capabilities within a short amount of time, and with limited resources.
> 
> A better argument to support the theory that the YJ-8 design was at least heavily influenced by the MM38, if not a highly modified copy, is to look at the two missiles&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG]; operational characteristics; the YJ-8&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s are almost identical to the MM38. Range, speed, and warhead size for both missiles are virtually the same, but the most significant aspect is the flight profile. The French MM38 was the first sea-skimming ASCM, with a highly advanced (for the day) radar altimeter and flight computer. For China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s immature industrial base to successfully replicate the Exocet&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s revolutionary flight profile in less than ten years (1976-1985) strongly implies they had access to proven technology.
> 
> An article in the Shipborne Weapons journal (Volume 5, 2008) suggests this was the case, as the author states that the Chinese were quite interested in purchasing Exocet missiles from France. Unfortunately, the price the French wanted was too high and the deal was shelved, at least temporarily. The author doesn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t explicitly say whether or not a Chinese purchase of the MM38 eventually occurred. He does say that the flight control system gave Chinese experts &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];great inspiration.&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; Therefore, it is probable that the Chinese had either somehow acquired an Exocet missile, obtained individual flight control components, or at least had access to highly detailed production schematics early in the YJ-8&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s development.
> 
> Beginning in the early 1990s, numerous publications referred to the YJ-8 as the YJ-1, claiming that this was related to the C801 export designation. This is an incorrect assertion, as photographic evidence shows the YJ-1 is the PLAN designation for the unsuccessful C101 supersonic ASCM.
> 
> YJ-8A
> The YJ-8A appeared very quickly after the YJ-8 entered service, reaching IOC in 1992 or 1993. In fact, the YJ-8 was only deployed by the PLAN on the Jianghu III (Type 053HT) frigates Huangshi (Hull 535) and Wuhu (Hull 536), as well as the single Type 033G modified Romeo class submarine. The only known recipients of the export version of the fixed-wing C801, with the externally ribbed box launchers, were Thailand&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s four Jianghu III frigates and Yemen&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s three Hounan (Project 021) missile boats.
> 
> The rationale for the limited fielding of this brand new weapon has not been made public, nor have there been any reports of technical problems or dissatisfaction with the YJ-8&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s performance by the PLAN. Indeed, historical accounts of the YJ-8&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s development published in the early to mid-1990s indicate the flight tests were quite successful.
> 
> Figure 3: A YJ-8 missile with folding wings. Insert shows the fold line and the two hinges. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> The only physical difference that is readily visible is that the YJ-8A had wings and booster fins that folded (see Figure 3), permitting the missile to be stored in an even smaller, non-ribbed launch container. Of note, both the C802 and YJ-83 would also use the same container, as it was specifically designed to hold folding wing missiles. The change in launch canisters went largely unnoticed by Western defense publications, and subsequently so too did the deployment of the YJ-8A. Some ten years later, articles started popping up on an extended range version of the C801 using the designations YJ-12, YJ-81, and C801A to describe this missile. Both the extended range assessment and the majority of the designations are inaccurate.
> 
> The YJ-12 designation basically means YJ-1 Mod 2 in Western nomenclature. As has already been discussed, the YJ-1 is a very different missile from the YJ-8 family, and the repeated references to the YJ-12 being supersonic harken back to its true origins. The YJ-81 designation, on the other hand, is a valid one. However, it is the designation for the rocket-propelled, air-launched member of the YJ-8 family, as we will see in the next section. The C801A designation has been used repeatedly to describe the export version of this new longer-range missile. This makes some degree of sense; if the YJ-8 is the C801, then the YJ-8A must be the C801A. The problem with this assumption is the C801A designation has never been seen at arms shows. CPMIEC mockup displays, placards, and brochures seen throughout the 1990s and into the early 2000s (the C801 disappeared from the major shows after 2003) never used this designation. In every circumstance, the designation displayed was C801. Figure 4 shows a mockup of a C801 missile on display at the CPMIEC booth during an arms show in 1998, the C801 designation is clearly visible.
> 
> Figure 4: A C801 display model. Note the hinges on the wings. Chinese internet courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> The argument that the YJ-8A has a longer range is also not supported by CPMIEC placard and brochure data. In all characteristics and performance aspects, including maximum range, both the fixed wing and folding wing versions of the C801 (aka YJ-8 and YJ-8A) are identical. In addition, if the YJ-8A truly had a greater range, one has to ask the question why wasn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t the extended range capability also integrated into the YJ-81 and YJ-82 missiles? An extra 28 to 48 km of range would be tactically significant, particularly for an aircraft attempting to penetrate the outer air defenses of a ship or formation.
> 
> Furthermore, an aircraft with even a moderately capable surface search radar could actually employ the weapon out to near its maximum range. Up until about 2002 or so, the PLAN did not have an indigenous shipboard sensor system that could support over the horizon targeting. Such a targeting system would be necessary for the YJ-8A to be employed against targets at a range of 50 km or more. Still, the vast majority of the standard references, articles, and blog postings consistently hold the C801A as having a maximum range of 70 to 90 km.
> 
> This claim appears to stem from an unspoken assumption in Western journals that since the C801 was considered a reverse engineered MM38 Exocet, then the C801A with folding wings was a copy of the MM40, which has a range of 70 km. The French, by the way, had to add 0.6 meters to the MM40&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s length to accommodate the necessary additional fuel. Given the YJ-8 and YJ-8A have the exact same length, the proponents of this argument assert the Chinese came up with a new high-energy density solid rocket fuel. This assertion is weak from a both a technological and programmatic perspective.
> 
> The Chinese aerospace industrial base was still in its infancy in the late 1980s, and relied heavily on technological assistance from other nations. Propulsion systems in particular were a significant weakness, one that China has struggled with for decades. Research into solid rocket propellants had started in the mid-1960s, and by 1977 the Chinese had developed a fuel that worked reliably, but represented only the state-of-practice from a technology perspective. It would take another eight years to complete the design and testing of the original YJ-8 rocket motor. To suggest the Chinese had developed a new higher performance solid rocket fuel, tested and deployed it in a modified YJ-8 missile in less than seven years strains credibility to the breaking point. And while translated historical accounts of Chinese weapon systems developments are by no means complete, there is no mention of a new propellant for the YJ-8A in what is available.
> 
> Even if the technological leap wasn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t an issue, programmatically the Chinese had already decided on a non-rocket solution for extending their anti-ship cruise missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s maximum range. By the time the YJ-8 had reached IOC in 1987, the Chinese were already committed toward developing an air-breathing engine for the follow-on missile design that would eventually become the C802 and YJ-83.
> 
> YJ-83
> The YJ-83 showed up on the scene without any advance warning, but even during its so-called début at the National Day Military Parade in Beijing in October 1999, no actual missiles were shown. The trucks that rolled by only sported two of the launch containers on their flatbeds &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; containers that were also used by YJ-8A missiles. Almost immediately, wild claims as to the YJ-83&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s performance began showing up on Internet blog sites. Published largely by enthusiastic Chinese nationals, the claims of supersonic speeds, GPS guidance, and a ship-to-missile data link were made repeatedly.
> 
> As photos of missiles with the YJ-83 designation stenciled on them started showing up on Internet sites, questions were raised about the performance claims. The visible configuration of the missile just didn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t support what was being said online. And yet, despite the lack of any solid evidence to support the speculative claims, many Western defense journalists accepted them as gospel, and articles proclaiming China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s unexpected rapid advancement became the norm. Even after some Chinese blog site moderators began raising flags that much of the hype concerning the YJ-83 was unfounded, the content of Western books and articles remained largely unchanged.
> 
> Figure 9: The PLAN&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s YJ-83 is virtually identical in appearance to the export C802, but is an updated missile. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> The development of the YJ-83 is somewhat blurred as it is closely linked with the C802. A rough estimate is that the technical design was probably locked down as soon as the Chinese were confident the C802 would fly. This lone criterion suggests the design for the YJ-83 was frozen sometime between 1993 and 1994. Several Western sources reported that the new missile entered service in 1994, but hindsight now indicates that this was when the final design was likely approved.
> 
> The choice of the TRI 60-2 turbojet essentially defined the YJ-83&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s size and aerodynamic form. Measurements of broad aspect photos of missiles with the YJ-83, C802A, and C802 designations all show them to be essentially the same. According to CPMIEC brochure data, the C802A is actually nine millimeters shorter than the original C802, a trivial difference. All other dimensions are the same. With the propulsion plant fixed, and the warhead design largely the same, only about 25% of the YJ-83 missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s subcomponents were open for significant improvement. Fortunately, those subcomponents were predominantly electronic in nature.
> 
> The early YJ-8/8A missiles used hybrid computers for the navigation, autopilot, and radar seeker. A hybrid computer uses a mixture of digital and analog components &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; that is solid-state elements along with servos, relays, and vacuum tubes. It is interesting to note that only the radio altimeter was fully digital, comprised of solid-state components only, which reflects the likely direct influence from the revolutionary French MM38 Exocet missile.
> 
> The inertial reference unit used small mechanical gyros and accelerometers that feed their input to the autopilot computer. Servomechanisms transmitted the steering commands to the four independent rudders. While the Chinese were satisfied with the YJ-8/8A&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s overall performance, the electronic and navigation components were very bulky and took up a considerable amount of space inside the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s fuselage. By transitioning to all digital, microprocessor based computers, and a more compact strap-down mechanical inertial reference unit; the YJ-83 had more internal volume available for fuel and a slightly larger semi-armor piercing warhead (190 kg vice 165 kg). These changes increased the maximum range of the YJ-83 and its export variant, the C802A, from 120 km to 180 km.
> 
> With a well-established airframe and mature propulsion plant already in place, the YJ-83 benefitted from an exceptionally short development timeline and began flight-testing in 1997. Apparently the missile passed through its trials quickly, as it was reported to have reached IOC in 1998. It was formally announced in October 1999 at the National Day Military Parade, and it has slowly worked up to become the dominant ASCM in the PLAN inventory (see Figure 9). The C802A export variant, shown in Figure 10, wasn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t displayed until the DSEi 2005 arms show in London, England. The seven-year delay was likely due to production limitations, and the more urgent need to replace YJ-8A missiles on the PLAN&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s warships. The information presented by CPMIEC C802A brochures since 2005 go a long way toward defining the capabilities of the YJ-83 more accurately.
> 
> Figure 10: The C802A missile mock-up displayed at the Airshow China 2010 expo is the export variant of the YJ-83, not the the C803 as reported in numerous PLAN related books and journals. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> In regard to maximum speed, the YJ-83 is most definitely a subsonic missile. The TRI 60-2 turbojet is unaugmented, i.e. no afterburner, and is only capable of speeds up to Mach 0.9. In fact, in the 1990s there weren&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t any small turbojets with the ability to support supersonic speeds. The first time an engine with this capability is mentioned is in a 2008 American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics conference paper, a historical overview of Mircoturbo SA&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s engines, which stated the TRI 60-5+ turbojet first demonstrated supersonic flight capability in 2007.
> 
> From a drag perspective, the rounded blunt nose of the YJ-83 is highly inefficient for supersonic flight. Since the effects of the shock wave on the nose dominate supersonic drag, the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s overall drag coefficient is heavily influenced by the nose cap&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s fineness ratio (length of the nose cap divided by its diameter). The YJ-83 nose has a rather low fineness ratio, thus its drag coefficient would be approximately twice that of a missile with a sharper, more pointed nose such as the one on the 3M-80 Moskit (SS-N-22) family at speeds between Mach 1.5 and 2.0. Higher drag requires more thrust to maintain speed and would dramatically increase fuel consumption, thereby greatly reducing the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s range.
> 
> Another related problem is the turbojet&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s scoop inlet. It is a fixed geometry inlet that is by design optimized for a very narrow speed range. Operating away from that design point incurs a non-trivial loss in engine performance. Furthermore, the inlet face is completely flat, which would make it even less efficient at supersonic speeds as it lacks an upper diverter to isolate the inlet from shockwave interactions with the boundary layer near the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s body. Finally, the scoop inlet of the YJ-83/C802A is identical to that on the C802, and similar in design to the scoop inlet on the C602 and C705, all known to be subsonic missiles. All of these observable features strongly point to the inlet design being optimized for subsonic airflow.
> 
> Combining the technical limitations of the turbojet, nose cap, and scoop inlet makes it all but impossible for the YJ-83/C802A to be supersonic. And it should be no surprise at all that the CPMIEC brochure lists the C802A&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s maximum speed as Mach 0.8 to 0.9 &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; identical to the earlier C802.
> 
> The YJ-83 has often been described as having the ability to use the Global Positioning System (GPS) with its inertial navigation system to improve its accuracy. This claim is also unsupportable.
> 
> The first GPS-directed ordnance was the U.S. Joint Direct Attack Munition, or JDAM, a free falling bomb with an integrated inertial navigation system (INS) and GPS receiver. JDAM began flight-testing in 1996 and reached IOC in 1998. A B-2A stealth bomber first used the JDAM operationally during Operation ALLIED FORCE in the spring of 1999. An in depth Chinese technical paper, published in 1995, stated that Chinese scientists and engineers were well aware of the benefits that GPS could provide to both manned aircraft, as well as weaponry. But there were technical limitations that had to be overcome before they could be implemented in Chinese systems.
> 
> By the time the JDAM reached IOC, the YJ-83 was at the end of its flight-testing phase and was about to enter IOC itself. To even consider replacing the mechanical strap-down INS with one using ring laser gyroscopes, an integrated GPS receiver, and a dedicated computer would have delayed the introduction of this missile for at least five years, as China was still in the research and development stage of an indigenous ring laser gyro and GPS receivers had to be obtained from outside the country. And of course, since the GPS was an American system, there would always be concerns about the accuracy of the satellites&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG]; signals. Programmatically, a decision during the 1994 &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; 97 timeframe to include a GPS feature in the YJ-83 would make little sense.
> 
> Indeed, senior Chinese military leaders seem to show more discipline then their Western counterparts in regard to requirements creep with defense acquisition programs, and in this case they would move any satellite navigation requirement on to the next missile in an earlier stage of development. This requirement would also be tied to the development of the indigenous Beidou system that first went operational, with a limited regional capability, in 2000. In looking at the CPMIEC brochures for the C802A, there is no reference to GPS as part of the navigation system. It is, however, explicitly stated as a feature in the C602 brochures (the PLAN version is the YJ-62) that reached IOC in 2005.
> 
> A similar argument can also be made against the data link claim. Prior to the late 1990s, only the very large Soviet ASCMs of the SS-N-3 and SS-N-12 families, and the Franco-Italian Otomat had a limited ship-to-missile data link capability. In 1997, both Israel and the U.S. were well along with their respective Harpoon improvement programs. The U.S. Harpoon II under went its first test flight in 2001, while the Israeli Harpoon Extended Performance (HAP) program was completed around the same time. Both missiles included a full two-way data link and an integrated INS/GPS to improve targeting in littoral environments cluttered with civilian shipping. Again, incorporating a command data link this late in the YJ-83&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s development would have incurred significant delays. In addition, articles discussing such an advanced data link assume highly accurate navigation information; implicitly suggesting an integrated INS/GPS navigation capability is required.
> 
> The CPMIEC brochure on the C802A doesn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t mention a data link as one of the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s features. In fact, it is quite the opposite as the brochure explicitly states the C802A is a &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];fire and forget&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; weapon. There are three YJ-83K-based land attack missiles with a command data link, two versions of the KD-88 (one electro optic and the other probably IR-guided) and the electro optical homing CM802AKG. These missiles all showed up much later than the YJ-83. The first Internet photos of the electro optical version of the KD-88 were posted in 2006, while the CM802AKG made its initial appearance at the Zhuhai Airshow China 2010 exposition. For the earlier KD-88 missiles, the data link antennas are clearly visible on the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s wings. In the case of the CM802AKG, the display mock-up lacked the wing-mounted data link antennas, however, a Chinese news article covering the 2010 Zhuhai show contained a summarized interview with an unidentified CM802AKG designer who explicitly stated that a data link had to be added to the missile. When combined, all these points rule out the possibility of a data link in the YJ-83. But if this is true, how does one explain the reported attributes of adaptive mission planning and post-launch maneuvers? Again brochure data helps close this loop.
> 
> In the CPMIEC 2010 C802A brochure, route planning using waypoints is described for the first time. The missile system is capable of storing four different attacking paths with a maximum of three waypoints each. This enables a single ship to launch a multi-axis attack, a significant improvement over the limited range of launch bearings of the earlier YJ-8 and C802 missiles.
> 
> For years, the YJ-83 has been tied to the C803 designation. This linkage is based on a flawed assumption that the YJ-81 is the C801, the YJ-82 is the C802, and therefore, the YJ-83 must be the C803. As has been shown throughout this article, this naming convention is incorrect. The export version of the YJ-83 is the C802A, but there is so much reporting on the C803 that it must be dealt with separately. The air-launched version is the YJ-83K and, as one would expect, the export variant is the C802AK (see Figure 11). As for the submarine-launched version, a missile with the YJ-83Q designation hasn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t been seen; nor is it likely it ever will be.
> 
> Figure 11: The YJ-83K is the air launched version of the YJ-83, as denoted by the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];K&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; at the end of the designator. The missile in the photo is a training version without the side cable runs. The export variant is the C802AK as shown next to a Pakistani JF-17 fighter-bomber at the Dubai Air Show in 2011.Chinese internet photos courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> Indigenously designed and built Chinese submarines have torpedo tubes that are about the same length as Western submarines. A review of Chinese torpedoes shows that they are less than seven meters in length, over a meter shorter than Russian weapons. This puts the torpedo tubes on the Song (Type 039), Yuan (Type 041), Shang (Type 093) and others at about 7.1 meters in length. This assumes an additional 0.25 meters clearance on top of the 6.8 meters of the Yu-4 torpedo with a wire dispenser. The Yu-6 looks to be a little shorter, about 6.5 meters long with the torpedo mount dispenser for the wire.
> 
> Going back to the earlier discussion, recall that the YJ-82 capsule is about 6.1 meters long, and this is for a YJ-8-size missile without the booster. If the booster were added, the capsule would be at a minimum 7.3 meters long, probably closer to 7.5 meters as the heavier missile would likely require some additional buoyancy to ensure it reached the surface. Both the C802 and YJ-83 start out at almost 6.4 meters in length, and both missiles must have the booster to operate properly &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; there is no option with this, as the turbojet can only start when the missile is under powered flight. Using simple ratios, this makes the capsule length of a C802 or YJ-83 missile on the order of eight meters, far too large for the probable torpedo tube length of approximately 7.1 meters. Rumors of a YJ-83 submarine-launched variant being developed are based on speculation that doesn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t take into account the limitations of the potential launching platforms.
> 
> In addition, the 2011 U.S. Department of Defense&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s annual report to Congress on China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s military developments stated that a new long-range submarine-launched ASCM, with the NATO designation CH-SS-NX-13, was under development for the Song (Type 039), Yuan (Type 041), Shang (Type 093), and the future Type 095 SSN. If this ASCM were a variant of the YJ-83, it would not have an entirely new NATO designation. The YJ-83, being a variant of the C802, would share a similar NATO designation and nickname. Since the C802 is the CSS-N-8 Saccade, the CH-SS-NX-13 designation (note the change in designator format) explicitly shows the U.S. government believes it is a new weapon.
> 
> C803
> Since about 2002, the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; designation has worked its way into just about every Western naval systems book and article. And yet, in over ten years of reporting there has been no formal evidence to support its existence. If one examines the brochures, placards, and mockup displays that CPMIEC has put up at the various arm shows throughout the years, nowhere will the designation &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; be found. Never. For example, Figure 12 shows a flat screen display at the CPMIEC booth at the Airshow China 2010 expo. The display lists, by range, all the ASCMs that China had on the market &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; the C701, C704, C802, C705, C802A, and the C602. Furthermore, there was a full mockup display of each of the above missiles on the exhibition hall floor, as well as a smaller scale model. A missile with the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; designation was conspicuous by its absence. The recent Zhuhai Airshow China 2012 also lacked any mention of the C803, even though numerous new missile variants were presented to the public for the first time. That is because the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803,&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; if it exists at all, is likely still in the developmental stage, probably in early flight testing, and isn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t ready to be marketed.
> 
> Figure 12: CPMIEC display at Airshow China 2010. The C803 is not even mentioned on the screen with other Chinese anti-ship missiles offered for sale. Chinese internet photo courtesy of Christopher P. Carlson
> 
> If the high performance attributes that have long been ascribed to the YJ-83 are actually for an entirely new advanced missile, a program start date can be roughly estimated by looking at when Western and Chinese-based media sources first started reporting on these capabilities. A quick review of the primary Western references indicates these attributes were first described around 2001-2002. Chinese blog sites, as well as the Kanwa Defense Review, started to mention these capabilities in late 1999. If this new missile began development between 1999 and 2002, then the integrated INS and satellite navigation system (GPS and Beidou) and the command data link would now be within China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s technical capabilities. However, a small supersonic capable propulsion system would undoubtedly still be the most challenging aspect.
> 
> Early on, the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; was initially described as a supersonic missile throughout its entire flight. The problem with this is that the new missile couldn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t possibly go 200+ km at supersonic speeds and still fit in a torpedo tube; all existing missiles with these speed and range characteristics are much larger than any torpedo tube ever built. The &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];smallest&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; missile is the Russian 3M-55 (SS-N-26) Onyx/Yakhont at 0.67 meters in diameter and 8.9 meters long, not including the launch canister. Given that the U.S. Department of Defense&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s report explicitly stated the CH-SS-NX-13 is to go on all classes of modern Chinese attack submarines, it is either a torpedo tube-launched weapon, or every PLAN submarine in the Song, Yuan, Shang, and Type 095 classes would have to be fitted with external launch tubes &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; a significant modification for the vast majority of these submarines.
> 
> This would be tremendously expensive, not to mention occupying most of the available submarine construction way space for years. In short, fitting existing submarines with external tubes for a large supersonic missile seems totally unreasonable from a programmatic perspective. It also completely skips the PLAN&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s proven acquisition concept of buy some, study thoroughly, then build our own, and is fraught with technological risk. With the recent memory of the unsuccessful YJ-1/C101 and HY-3/C301 large supersonic ASCM programs still fresh in the PLAN leaderships minds&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];, neither missile was formally accepted into service, it is highly unlikely they would try to go down this path again.
> 
> By the mid-2000s, there was a noticeable change in regard to the &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];C803&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; speed. Chinese blog sites, and some Western sources started questioning the all-supersonic flight profile, and shifted to a subsonic cruise mode followed by a supersonic terminal attack. This change eliminates the problem of requiring a large missile to meet the 250 km range figure that most of the blog sites coalesced about. If one accepts the premise that the missile had a subsonic cruise mode, with a supersonic terminal attack, then this narrows down the possible propulsion system options considerably, as there is only one ASCM in the world that can do this &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; Russia&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s 3M54 Novator Alpha (SS-N-27).
> 
> Recall that Mircoturbo only demonstrated a supersonic flight capable small-scale turbojet in 2007; this would be rather late in the design stage for this missile and there is no reason to believe China could count on such a development six or so years earlier. However, China had signed a contract with Russia for eight Project 636M Kilo class submarines with the ability to fire the export Novator Alpha (3M54E/SS-N-27B) in May 2002, with the first submarines and SS-N-27B missiles being delivered in 2005.
> 
> It is likely Chinese engineer&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s had access to detailed design documentation for both the submarine and the missile after signing the contract, and this timing corresponds roughly with the first rumors of China developing a new advanced ASCM &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; one that the U.S. Department of Defense&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s 2010 and 2011 annual reports stated was in &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];development and testing.&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; While admittedly speculative, and based largely on coincidental inference, there is at least some basis to suggest that the new CH-SS-NX-13 ASCM may be a modified Chinese copy of the Russian Novator Alpha, a very different missile from the YJ-83.
> 
> Eagle Strike-8 Family Tree
> It&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s been a long haul, but with all the data and discussion completed, Table 1 can now be rebuilt and the confusion eliminated. Table 2 lists all the missiles in the YJ-8 family with their correct PLAN and export designations properly linked, along with their performance characteristics. Those entries with an &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];est,&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; indicate that the number is the author&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s estimate and not information found in official brochure data or published articles. With regard to the YJ-82, the maximum range has been reduced to reflect the fact that the sustainer rocket motor has to do the booster&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s job as well.
> 
> PLAN Desig...Export Desig...IOC...Launch Plat...Lgth(m)...Wt(kg)...Max.Range(km)...Speed(Mach)...Cruise Alt(m)Terminal Alt.(m)
> YJ-8...........C801..............1987..Surf/Coast... 5.814..... 815........42...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
> YJ-8A.........C801..............92-93.Surf/Coast... 5.814..... 815........42...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
> YJ-81.........C801K............1989...Air.............. 4.65.......610........50...................0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
> YJ-82........C801Q.............2003...Sub............ 4.57.......610 est...30-34 est.........0.90...............20...............5 or 7.
> ................C802...............94-95..Surf/Coast.. 6.392......715........120.................0.80-0.90........20 or 30.......5 or 7
> ................C802K.............1997 est.Air...........5.15.......515 est...150-160 est.......0.80-0.90.......20 or 30.......5 or 7
> YJ-83........C802A.............1998...Surf/Coast... 6.383..... 800........180...................0.80-0.90.......20...............5 or 7.
> YJ-83K......C802AK............2002..Air...............5.14.......600........230 &[HASHTAG]#8211[/HASHTAG]; 250..........0.80-0.90.......20................5 or 7.
> 
> Table 2: Eagle Strike-8 missile family designation and characteristics data.
> 
> Conclusion
> There has been much confusion in published works and on blog sites regarding Chinese ASCMs in general, and the YJ-8 family in particular. It is also fairly safe to say that the confusion is probably not the result of a dedicated deception program; rather it is due to an overload of information, courtesy of the Internet, coupled with a lack of basic engineering expertise by many of the participants. China has had a flurry of activity in their ASCM programs over the last 15 years, and the sheer amount of information that has been made available is unprecedented. Unfortunately, often times the presenters and/or receivers of this information don&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t have a technical background, and this resulted in designations and performance specifications being misunderstood, cross-decked between different missiles, or sometimes, just plain made up to fill in the gaps. Without realizing it, the majority of reporters and bloggers &[HASHTAG]#8220[/HASHTAG];spammed&[HASHTAG]#8221[/HASHTAG]; the world with a multitude of inaccurate and confusing books, articles, and chat room entries.
> 
> This article has attempted to sort the wheat from the chaff by looking at the available information through an engineering lens. A lot of the capabilities credited to the YJ-83 were just not technically feasible at the time of the missile&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s development; it is an evolutionary weapon, not a quantum leap. A good analogy would be if the YJ-8 is China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s MM38 Exocet, then the YJ-83 is China&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s Harpoon Block 1C. This conclusion isn&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];t meant to be disparaging to China or Chinese engineers. On the contrary, they have made huge strides in a relatively short period of time. Granted, they&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];ve had a lot of help in the process, but the bottom line is that the PLAN has fielded a very capable missile, as well as a functional targeting system, that supports accurate over the horizon missile strikes against a potential adversary&[HASHTAG]#8217[/HASHTAG];s surface ships. Not many nations can say they have this capability.
> 
> Part 1: Designation Confusion and the Family Members from YJ-8 to YJ-8A
> Part 2: YJ-81, YJ-82, and C802
> 
> Christopher P. Carlson is a co-designer of the Harpoon tactical naval wargame and a bestselling author.


I couldn't found C803 pics ... do you have any ???


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## cirr

8X8，missile canister X 3

















 12X12，missile canister X 2

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## cirr

YJ-12 fired from a 。。。

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## cnleio

cirr said:


> YJ-12 fired from a 。。。
> 
> View attachment 243127


From H-6 bomber ...

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## Martian2

*For the price of one $1.7 billion Arleigh Burke, China can fire 340 DF-21D "carrier killer" ASBMs (which cost $5 million each).*

Source: DDG 51 AEGIS Destroyer | Info, ACS, AN/SPY-1D(V), Budget/Costs, Specs
"In FY 2014, the unit cost of a DDG 51 Destroyer is $1.73 billion (end cost)."

Source: Navy looks to advancements in 'fog of war' for missile defense - News - Stripes
"Meanwhile, a single Chinese DF-21D missile costs $5 million or more, Culora noted."





Chinese DF-21D ASBMs (anti-ship ballistic missiles).

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## cirr

Design has been finalized and approved of a turbo-based combined cycle（TBCC）engine pertaining to a hypersonic vehicle under development：

中国多型航空发动机设计通过评审 新型号无先例-中新网

The official article above also contains information regarding the progresses being made of two other engines。

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## j20blackdragon

YJ-12

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## j20blackdragon

YJ-83





YJ-12





KD-20

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## j20blackdragon

DF-21D ASBM unveiled...









MIRVed DF-5B unveiled...

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## j20blackdragon

DF-10A





DF-21D





DF-26





DF-5B

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## yuondog

Martian2 said:


> Chinese DF-21D ASBMs (anti-ship ballistic missiles).



What a beautiful sight.

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## hk299792458

It's also confirmed that the MRBM *DF-26* can attack ships, as the ASBM *DF-21D*.






There will have no more completely secured place for aircraft carriers navigating between the 1st and the 2nd island chains in Western Pacifics, and also near the East coast of India.

My very first estimation :






Henri K.

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## Beast

hk299792458 said:


> It's also confirmed that the MRBM *DF-26* can attack ships, as the ASBM *DF-21D*.
> 
> There will have no more completely secured place for aircraft carriers navigating between the 1st and the 2nd island chains in Western Pacifics, and also near the East coast of India.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Henri K.


If the system fitted onto DF-31 missile. USN warship might sunk right at pearl harbour.

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## hk299792458

Beast said:


> If the system fitted onto DF-31 missile. USN warship might sunk right at pearl harbour.



Fitting such a system in an ICBM might provok misunderstanding. How can you distinguish in this case that the head is not a nuclear one ?

It is already quit "limit" with DF-26.

Henri K.


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## Beast

hk299792458 said:


> Fitting such a system in an ICBM might provok misunderstanding. How can you distinguish in this case that the head is not a nuclear one ?
> 
> It is already quit "limit" with DF-26.
> 
> Henri K.


That is why China deploy the no nuclear first use policy. It is not for peaceful or non aggression policy but to faciliate ASBM. By declaring no first use. China is telling everybody that all China ballistic missile launch is non nuclear warhead. Unless being strike with nuclear weapon. Whether you want to believe or not or escalate into Armageddon is your choice. China already declare her intention and are free to launch any ballistic missile for any concentional strike. I believe nobody wants to escalate to end of the world scenario, right?

Losing a few carrier is better than losing the whole earth where no one can survive. I believe for a big and rich country like China do have enough nuclear stockpile to wipe out the whole earth.

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## hk299792458

Imagine that India says the same thing (I don't know if they have already said that or not, sorry for ignorance), and China detects a MRBM launched. (ICBM is not necessary from India to China main cities)

Will your governers take the risk to admit that it is not nuclear ? Allow me to have a doubt on it.

But I would prefer stop the discussion here because we will make round and round without conclusion. 

Henri K.


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## j20blackdragon

Showtime: China Reveals Two 'Carrier-Killer' Missiles

Andrew S. Erickson

September 3, 2015

Yesterday’s Beijing V-Day parade addressed multiple audiences. Among them, clearly—the U.S. Navy, the U.S. military writ large and their regional allied and partner counterparts. After years of foreign speculation and surprising skepticism about an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM), China has for the first time officially revealed two variants: the DF-21D and DF-26.

There were other hardware firsts, with DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) and YJ-12 anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) also revealed for the first time (the latter an air-launched missile on a display truck for parading purposes). The DF-5B ICBM officially confirmed as a “MIRV-ed nuclear missile” (分导核导弹), with multiple independently targetable reentry vehicles that can greatly complicate its intercept by ballistic missile defenses. What makes these displays particularly significant: all the missiles on parade are currently in PLA service. That explains why China’s DF-41 ICBM and YJ-18 ASCM were nowhere to be found—they are not yet deployed. Otherwise, by raising concerns without demonstrating credible capabilities, China would risk reaping “the onus without the bonus.” A tremendous non-hardware-related announcement provided greater context: Xi Jinping’s statement in his speech at the parade, “I announce that China will reduce military personnel numbers by 300,000.” But what is arguably most significant in hardware terms is that Beijing used this high-profile occasion to reveal not one but two different ASBMs—both already deployed by China’s Second Artillery Force (SAF).

There was nothing subtle about the parade or its showcasing of Chinese military hardware. First, precise details of the weapons showcased and their formations were available on the Internet several days before the big event. Second, all major missiles had large English-language designators stenciled in bright white—even the most ophthalmologically challenged foreign observes could not possibly miss the deterrent message.

The parade, together with official commentary, remains available on YouTube, and from behind China’s Great Firewall for those who can’t access such foreign social media. As official Chinese-language commentary streamed on the state television channel CCTV-1, and sixteen DF-21D MRBMs rolled by in precise formation on their transporter-erector-launchers (TELs), the missile was described as an “assassin’s mace weapon” (杀手锏武器) with the ability to strike “targets on water” (水面目标). The set of sixteen DF-21Ds was further described as the “Conventional Missile Second Formation. DF-21D, road mobile anti ship ballistic missile, the assassin’s mace for maritime asymmetric warfare” (常规导弹第二方队, DF21丁是打击舰船目标的路基弹道导弹, 是我军海上非对称作战的杀手锏武器). The DF-21Ds appeared to have a longer, pointier nose cap than the DF-21C variants displayed in the previous parade.

Official commentary states that the longer-range DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) is “capable of nuclear and conventional strike” (核常兼备). This dual-payload term is particularly interesting, and the Janus-faced concept has clearly been contemplated by Chinese strategists and technicians alike for some time. In September 2006, in Xiamen, China, at the “10th Program for Science and National Security Studies Beijing Seminar on International Security” conference, I remember an unattributed paper on “核常兼备” appearing mysteriously on the publications table. That conference was co-sponsored by the Institute of Applied Physics and Computational Mathematics (IAPCM), a reclusive organization closely affiliated with China’s nuclear-weapons industry.

Official commentary elaborated that the DF-26 is “capable of targeting large- and medium-sized targets on water” (打击大中型水面目标). This “Guam Killer” missile is credited with 3,000-4,000-km (1,800-2,500 mile) range, sufficient to strike U.S. bases on Guam. The set of sixteen DF-26 missiles was further described as the “Conventional-/Nuclear-capable formation. The DF-26 can perform medium-to-long-range precision attack on both land and large-to-medium-sized maritime targets. A new weapon for strategic deterrence” (核常兼备导弹方队, 东26能对陆上重要目标和海上大中型舰船实施中远程精确打击, 是我军战略威慑力量体系中的新型武器).

Showtime: China Reveals Two 'Carrier-Killer' Missiles | The National Interest

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## Beidou2020

j20blackdragon said:


> Showtime: China Reveals Two 'Carrier-Killer' Missiles
> 
> Andrew S. Erickson
> 
> September 3, 2015
> 
> Yesterday’s Beijing V-Day parade addressed multiple audiences. Among them, clearly—the U.S. Navy, the U.S. military writ large and their regional allied and partner counterparts. After years of foreign speculation and surprising skepticism about an anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM), China has for the first time officially revealed two variants: the DF-21D and DF-26.
> 
> There were other hardware firsts, with DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) and YJ-12 anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) also revealed for the first time (the latter an air-launched missile on a display truck for parading purposes). The DF-5B ICBM officially confirmed as a “MIRV-ed nuclear missile” (分导核导弹), with multiple independently targetable reentry vehicles that can greatly complicate its intercept by ballistic missile defenses. What makes these displays particularly significant: all the missiles on parade are currently in PLA service. That explains why China’s DF-41 ICBM and YJ-18 ASCM were nowhere to be found—they are not yet deployed. Otherwise, by raising concerns without demonstrating credible capabilities, China would risk reaping “the onus without the bonus.” A tremendous non-hardware-related announcement provided greater context: Xi Jinping’s statement in his speech at the parade, “I announce that China will reduce military personnel numbers by 300,000.” But what is arguably most significant in hardware terms is that Beijing used this high-profile occasion to reveal not one but two different ASBMs—both already deployed by China’s Second Artillery Force (SAF).
> 
> There was nothing subtle about the parade or its showcasing of Chinese military hardware. First, precise details of the weapons showcased and their formations were available on the Internet several days before the big event. Second, all major missiles had large English-language designators stenciled in bright white—even the most ophthalmologically challenged foreign observes could not possibly miss the deterrent message.
> 
> The parade, together with official commentary, remains available on YouTube, and from behind China’s Great Firewall for those who can’t access such foreign social media. As official Chinese-language commentary streamed on the state television channel CCTV-1, and sixteen DF-21D MRBMs rolled by in precise formation on their transporter-erector-launchers (TELs), the missile was described as an “assassin’s mace weapon” (杀手锏武器) with the ability to strike “targets on water” (水面目标). The set of sixteen DF-21Ds was further described as the “Conventional Missile Second Formation. DF-21D, road mobile anti ship ballistic missile, the assassin’s mace for maritime asymmetric warfare” (常规导弹第二方队, DF21丁是打击舰船目标的路基弹道导弹, 是我军海上非对称作战的杀手锏武器). The DF-21Ds appeared to have a longer, pointier nose cap than the DF-21C variants displayed in the previous parade.
> 
> Official commentary states that the longer-range DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) is “capable of nuclear and conventional strike” (核常兼备). This dual-payload term is particularly interesting, and the Janus-faced concept has clearly been contemplated by Chinese strategists and technicians alike for some time. In September 2006, in Xiamen, China, at the “10th Program for Science and National Security Studies Beijing Seminar on International Security” conference, I remember an unattributed paper on “核常兼备” appearing mysteriously on the publications table. That conference was co-sponsored by the Institute of Applied Physics and Computational Mathematics (IAPCM), a reclusive organization closely affiliated with China’s nuclear-weapons industry.
> 
> Official commentary elaborated that the DF-26 is “capable of targeting large- and medium-sized targets on water” (打击大中型水面目标). This “Guam Killer” missile is credited with 3,000-4,000-km (1,800-2,500 mile) range, sufficient to strike U.S. bases on Guam. The set of sixteen DF-26 missiles was further described as the “Conventional-/Nuclear-capable formation. The DF-26 can perform medium-to-long-range precision attack on both land and large-to-medium-sized maritime targets. A new weapon for strategic deterrence” (核常兼备导弹方队, 东26能对陆上重要目标和海上大中型舰船实施中远程精确打击, 是我军战略威慑力量体系中的新型武器).
> 
> Showtime: China Reveals Two 'Carrier-Killer' Missiles | The National Interest



LOL this guy thinks the DF-41 is not deployed. 
What a noob.

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## hk299792458

Beidou2020 said:


> LOL this guy thinks the DF-41 is not deployed.
> What a noob.



Nothing proof that it is deployed. DF-41 just carried out it's 4th test flight, it's still too early for a opertaional deployment.

Let's see if it will be there in 2019's parade.

Henri K.

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## Beidou2020

hk299792458 said:


> Nothing proof that it is deployed. DF-41 just carried out it's 4th test flight, it's still too early for a opertaional deployment.
> 
> Let's see if it will be there in 2019's parade.
> 
> Henri K.



Just because it's not in a parade doesn't mean it's not deployed. That's the thinking of a noob.

That article was from Andrew Erickson. PDF members know more about military than that guy. He was the guy that said China will have to wait for a long time before WS-10 are equipped in Chinese fighter jets. Within 1 year, J-11B, J-11D, J-16 are equipped with the WS-10 

WantChinaTimes and StrategyPage have more credibility than Andrew Erickson. 

He is one of those people that think saying a few fancy military jargons makes you a know-it-all 'expert'. It's like when you speak a few good English words you are considered 'smart'.

He doesn't know anything more than what many members on this forum knows. He just happens to be allowed to give his opinion on mainstream media and people believe it as the 'truth'.

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## hk299792458

For sure, not in the parade doesn't mean it is not deployed, i.e. YJ-18.

However, I maintained my position saying that DF-41 is not deployed yet. Put into service an ICBM only after 4 flight tests, to reuse a word I see frequently now in chinese internet : 这不科学。



Henri K.


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## j20blackdragon

I think one of the biggest surprises of the parade is actually the DF-5B.

Earlier this year, some people noticed that the Pentagon report on China mentioned a MIRVed version of the DF-5.

Most 'experts' in the US arms control community dismissed the development. Many thought China simply put the smaller DF-31 warhead on the vintage DF-5, resulting in maybe 3 to 4 warheads.

Now it is obviously clear the DF-5B is something new.



















The shroud is completely different.

The post boost vehicle is wider in diameter.

It wouldn't surprise me if some of the rocket stages and other components have changed.

The DF-5B is now one of the largest silo-based MIRVed ICBMs in the world today. A very interesting development.

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## hk299792458

Finally not a surprise, as *DF-5B* is unveiled long time ago but people didn't believe on that because they remain on their mindset 15 years backward thinking that China doesn't master MiRVs technologies.

Personnaly I knew it's existence since 2009






And fully confirmed till 2012, as more and more R&D documents mentionned it, for example this one :






The big surprise for me is *DF-26*, especially fir it's anti-ship capability.

Henri K.

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## j20blackdragon

Nightmare for the US Navy.

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## hk299792458

Several HD videos


























Henri K.

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## Keel

hk299792458 said:


> Imagine that India says the same thing (I don't know if they have already said that or not, sorry for ignorance), and China detects a MRBM launched. (ICBM is not necessary from India to China main cities)
> 
> Will your governers take the risk to admit that it is not nuclear ? Allow me to have a doubt on it.
> 
> But I would prefer stop the discussion here because we will make round and round without conclusion.
> 
> Henri K.



@Beast ( post # 358 ) has made a valid point on China's "no-first-use" nuclear policy which has pointed squarely on the error of your logic

I presume India may have the same thing but if we really have to go to war with India, I think the engagement will very much be conventional warfares

You dont need to reply if you accept my comment

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## Beast

hk299792458 said:


> Imagine that India says the same thing (I don't know if they have already said that or not, sorry for ignorance), and China detects a MRBM launched. (ICBM is not necessary from India to China main cities)
> 
> Will your governers take the risk to admit that it is not nuclear ? Allow me to have a doubt on it.
> 
> But I would prefer stop the discussion here because we will make round and round without conclusion.
> 
> Henri K.


Yes, China will believe that and China has the abilities to strike right back at India if hit by nuclear attack. Far more importantly, India is nuclear inferior and missile inferior to China. India is not stupid to attempt that. A nuclear all out by India with MRBM is unlikely unless India risk being totally annihilated by China nuclear weapon. The advantage is on Chinese side. China possess the most advance conventional strike ballistic missile in the world and you can see large number of conventional ballistic missile deploy. If will be silly to think after China spend so much money on these system just to only pause and think of possible escalation to end of world scenario. Of Cos fitting ASBM system on DF-31 is a bit exaggerate on my part but is possible and not done so due to restriction. But will not rule out if some nasty war shook China.

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## terranMarine

Beast said:


> Yes, China will believe that and China has the abilities to strike right back at India if hit by nuclear attack. Far more importantly, India is nuclear inferior and missile inferior to China. India is not stupid to attempt that. A nuclear all out by India with MRBM is unlikely unless India risk being totally annihilated by China nuclear weapon. The advantage is on Chinese side. China possess the most advance conventional strike ballistic missile in the world and you can see large number of conventional ballistic missile deploy. If will be silly to think after China spend so much money on these system just to only pause and think of possible escalation to end of world scenario. Of Cos fitting ASBM system on DF-31 is a bit exaggerate on my part but is possible and not done so due to restriction. But will not rule out if some nasty war shook China.



You should check this out Understanding Western Media's Take on China's Victory Parade | Page 3

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## Beast

terranMarine said:


> You should check this out Understanding Western Media's Take on China's Victory Parade | Page 3


Their countrymen are dumb but I do not expect Indians leader to be equally dumb.

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## Indus Falcon

Beast said:


> Their countrymen are dumb but I do not expect Indians leader to be equally dumb.


Well you can't always be right!

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## Beidou2020

Beast said:


> Their countrymen are dumb but I do not expect Indians leader to be equally dumb.



Their leader Kalam said they will be superpower by 2012. Indian leaders are not as smart as you think.

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## Beast

Beidou2020 said:


> Their leader Kalam said they will be superpower by 2012. Indian leaders are not as smart as you think.


But when comes to life and death. They will think twice becos they will chicken out.

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## Beidou2020

Beast said:


> But when comes to life and death. They will think twice becos they will chicken out.



You would think reality will hit them before they commit national suicide but they are so delusional that I fear for them.

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## j20blackdragon

The LGM-118A Peacekeeper has a diameter of *2.3 meters*.

http://fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/icbm/lgm-118.htm

The DF-5 has a diameter of *3.35 meters*.

http://fas.org/nuke/guide/china/icbm/df-5.htm

If the Peacekeeper has the ability to carry 10 W87 warheads, so can the DF-5B.















In the original DF-5, the missile narrows as it approaches the post boost vehicle, providing less room for the warheads.






In the DF-5B, the missile remains 'fat' all the way through. There is no narrowing. That means we have the full 3.35 meter diameter space for warheads, which is more than the Peacekeeper.






10+ warheads for the DF-5B is possible. This is one of the most powerful ICBMs in the world today.

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## ChineseTiger1986

j20blackdragon said:


> The LGM-118A Peacekeeper has a diameter of *2.3 meters*.
> 
> http://fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/icbm/lgm-118.htm
> 
> The DF-5 has a diameter of *3.35 meters*.
> 
> http://fas.org/nuke/guide/china/icbm/df-5.htm
> 
> If the Peacekeeper has the ability to carry 10 W87 warheads, so can the DF-5B.
> 
> View attachment 254322
> 
> View attachment 254323
> 
> View attachment 254324
> 
> 
> In the original DF-5, the missile narrows as it approaches the post boost vehicle, providing less room for the warheads.
> 
> View attachment 254325
> 
> 
> In the DF-5B, the missile remains 'fat' all the way through. There is no narrowing. That means we have the full 3.35 meter diameter space for warheads, which is more than the Peacekeeper.
> 
> View attachment 254326
> 
> 
> 10+ warheads for the DF-5B is possible. This is one of the most powerful ICBMs in the world today.



The DF-41 has a diameter of 2.5 meters, so it can exceed the Peacekeeper in term of range and payload.

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## j20blackdragon

The DF-5B is basically a militarized version of the later variants of the CZ-2C.

The DF-5 would be the original CZ-2.






That means the technology is proven.

And the production line is already in place to mass produce the ICBM if needed.

This is a Chinese modern-day SS-18 in terms of size.

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## j20blackdragon

The DF-5B is a much *longer* ICBM than the original DF-5.

Compare the length of the shroud + 2nd stage to the length of the 1st stage on the DF-5B.










Now do the same for the DF-5.










Notice how much shorter the shroud + 2nd stage is on the original.

This is one of the reasons why I believe this ICBM is based on the later variants of the CZ-2C.

Starting with the CZ-2C/SD, a stretched 2nd stage was developed and the overall length of the rocket was increased to 40 meters. The DF-5B appear to have the same changes.

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## j20blackdragon

The DF-5B shroud is shorter than the CZ-2C/SD payload fairing.

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## j20blackdragon

Disregard what I originally said about the length of the DF-5B.

I now believe the DF-5B is about the same length as the original DF-5.

Hopefully these pictures are taken from an angle that won't misrepresent the size of the objects.










The DF-5B is a unique design.

It's not a simple modification of the original DF-5 because the shroud and 2nd stage have changed significantly.

It's also not a copy of the CZ-2C/SD because it is much shorter.

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## j20blackdragon

Report: Stolen data gives China advanced nuclear know-how

'It's not good news'

May 24, *1999*
Web posted at: 10:42 p.m. EDT (0242 GMT)

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- China could begin production of advanced thermonuclear weapons based on stolen U.S. design information during the next decade, according to a congressional report on Chinese nuclear espionage that will be released officially Tuesday.

Those weapons "may be tested in 1999 and could be deployed as soon as 2002," the report states.

According to the Cox report, *China penetrated U.S. nuclear labs, stealing secrets about the U.S. neutron bomb and every warhead in the U.S. nuclear arsenal -- including those for the MX Peacekeeper and Minuteman III missiles. 

Also among the purloined blueprints for weapons of mass destruction: the W-88 warhead, described as "the most sophisticated nuclear weapon the United States has ever built."*

CNN - Report: Stolen data gives China advanced nuclear know-how - May 24, 1999

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## Martian2

*New PL-10 AAM has thrust vectoring, high off-boresight attacks, and super maneuverability | Jane's*

Chief designer reveals data on China's new Luoyang PL-10 AAM - IHS Jane's 360





----------

The new generation of Chinese missiles appears to include thrust vectoring across the board. Here's the larger LY-80 and it has thrust vectoring too.

*China's HQ-16 (export name LY-80) Surface-to-Air Missile has thrust vectoring*

Thrust-vectoring on the HQ-16 increases maneuverability. This means the HQ-16 SAM is ultra-lethal. You wouldn't want four HQ-16 SAMs simultaneously chasing your fighter jet.

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## Jlaw

Martian2 said:


> *New PL-10 AAM has thrust vectoring, high off-boresight attacks, and super maneuverability | Jane's*
> 
> Chief designer reveals data on China's new Luoyang PL-10 AAM - IHS Jane's 360


It is quite strange as why the missile data is made public?

Any reason for that?

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## Martian2

Jlaw said:


> It is quite strange as why the missile data is made public?
> 
> Any reason for that?


I think it's confidence.

China's missile technology compares favorably to Western missiles.

The United States has no problem in providing basic statistics to tout the awesomeness of its weaponry.
China is doing the same thing.

China is announcing: thrust vectoring, high off-boresight attacks, and super maneuverability (as evidenced by the numerous control surfaces on the new PL-10 missile).

To sell missiles in the export market, China has to tout their high-tech features.



> *The report also noted that the PL-10 has "world class" capabilities that include a "multi-element imaging infrared seeker with anti-jamming capabilities" and indicated that it is capable of high off-boresight attacks and has super manoeuvrability.*

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## 55100864

Martian2 said:


> I think it's confidence.
> 
> China's missile technology compares favorably to Western missiles.
> 
> The United States has no problem in providing basic statistics to tout the awesomeness of its weaponry.
> China is doing the same thing.
> 
> China is announcing: thrust vectoring, high off-boresight attacks, and super maneuverability (as evidenced by the numerous control surfaces on the new PL-10 missile).
> 
> To sell missiles in the export market, China has to tout their high-tech features.


don't forget the PL-15,
USAF seeks ‘interim’ CHAMP, longer-range air-to-air missiles
*USAF seeks ‘interim’ CHAMP, longer-range air-to-air missiles*

The US Air Force plans to introduce Boeing and Raytheon’s “CHAMP” high-power-microwave emitting cruise missile into the combat force on board the 1990s conventional air-launched cruise missile as an “interim capability” while the technology transitions to Lockheed Martin’s JASSM-ER.

Air Combat Command chief Gen Hawk Carlisle says the computer-killing capability, which knocks out electronic equipment with bursts of high-frequency electromagnetic energy, is a “great capability” that will be fielded in small numbers initially with US Global Strike Command – the air force’s nuclear combat force.

“We’ve talked about the transition of that capability for Global Strike Command, but that will probably be small numbers because what we really want to do is get CHAMP into next-generation missiles, so JASSM-ER,” Carlisle said at an Air Force Association event in Washington.

“[Global Strike commander Gen Robin Rand] and I are talking about how to transition some number, an interim capability that’s on the current [CALCM] system and then how do we move to even an improved capability into the next generation air-to-surface cruise missiles we’re producing today.”

The weapon has been in development with the Air Force Research Laboratory since 2009 and was successfully demonstrated at a test range in Utah in 2012. The technology has been deemed ready for development and fielding, and is already being improved and adapted to new platforms such as the JASSM-ER and possibly even reusable unmanned aircraft.

AFRL has been pursuing the Counter-electronics High Power Microwave Advanced Missile Project (CHAMP) as a niche capability that is difficult and expensive to harden against.

In terms of air superiority weapons, Carlisle says the development of next-generation air-to-air missiles is also “an exceptionally high priority”.

Raytheon’s AMRAAM is the current go-to Western weapon for beyond-visual-range air combat, but new long-range missiles being fielded by Russia and China are a significant concern to the Pentagon.

Carlisle says outmatching the Chinese PL-15 air-to-air missile in particular is an “exceedingly high priority”.

“The PL-15 and the range of that missile, we’ve got to be able to out-stick that missile,” he says.

The air force is currently exploring a range of next-generation weapon concepts as it also pursues a sixth-generation fighter aircraft.

*


*

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## cirr

Martian2 said:


> *New PL-10 AAM has thrust vectoring, high off-boresight attacks, and super maneuverability | Jane's*
> 
> Chief designer reveals data on China's new Luoyang PL-10 AAM - IHS Jane's 360
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----------
> 
> The new generation of Chinese missiles appears to include thrust vectoring across the board. Here's the larger LY-80 and it has thrust vectoring too.
> 
> *China's HQ-16 (export name LY-80) Surface-to-Air Missile has thrust vectoring*
> 
> Thrust-vectoring on the HQ-16 increases maneuverability. This means the HQ-16 SAM is ultra-lethal. You wouldn't want four HQ-16 SAMs simultaneously chasing your fighter jet.



I might add that the development of the LRAAM PL-15 has been more or less complete，with live firings from J-16 and J-20 hitting far-away targets。

Further，the development of the PL-21 is also said to be proceeding smoothly。

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## Jlaw

55100864 said:


> don't forget the PL-15,
> USAF seeks ‘interim’ CHAMP, longer-range air-to-air missiles
> *USAF seeks ‘interim’ CHAMP, longer-range air-to-air missiles*
> 
> The US Air Force plans to introduce Boeing and Raytheon’s “CHAMP” high-power-microwave emitting cruise missile into the combat force on board the 1990s conventional air-launched cruise missile as an “interim capability” while the technology transitions to Lockheed Martin’s JASSM-ER.
> 
> Air Combat Command chief Gen Hawk Carlisle says the computer-killing capability, which knocks out electronic equipment with bursts of high-frequency electromagnetic energy, is a “great capability” that will be fielded in small numbers initially with US Global Strike Command – the air force’s nuclear combat force.
> 
> “We’ve talked about the transition of that capability for Global Strike Command, but that will probably be small numbers because what we really want to do is get CHAMP into next-generation missiles, so JASSM-ER,” Carlisle said at an Air Force Association event in Washington.
> 
> “[Global Strike commander Gen Robin Rand] and I are talking about how to transition some number, an interim capability that’s on the current [CALCM] system and then how do we move to even an improved capability into the next generation air-to-surface cruise missiles we’re producing today.”
> 
> The weapon has been in development with the Air Force Research Laboratory since 2009 and was successfully demonstrated at a test range in Utah in 2012. The technology has been deemed ready for development and fielding, and is already being improved and adapted to new platforms such as the JASSM-ER and possibly even reusable unmanned aircraft.
> 
> AFRL has been pursuing the Counter-electronics High Power Microwave Advanced Missile Project (CHAMP) as a niche capability that is difficult and expensive to harden against.
> 
> In terms of air superiority weapons, Carlisle says the development of next-generation air-to-air missiles is also “an exceptionally high priority”.
> 
> Raytheon’s AMRAAM is the current go-to Western weapon for beyond-visual-range air combat, but new long-range missiles being fielded by Russia and China are a significant concern to the Pentagon.
> 
> Carlisle says outmatching the Chinese PL-15 air-to-air missile in particular is an “exceedingly high priority”.
> 
> “The PL-15 and the range of that missile, we’ve got to be able to out-stick that missile,” he says.
> 
> The air force is currently exploring a range of next-generation weapon concepts as it also pursues a sixth-generation fighter aircraft.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> *


Giving out specs is not a good idea in some cases like missiles.

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## aliaselin

Martian2 said:


> To sell missiles in the export market, China has to tout their high-tech features.


I don't think PL-10 and PL-15 will be certified for export in near future

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## 55100864

Jlaw said:


> Giving out specs is not a good idea in some cases like missiles.


how do u know we gave the correct specs? 
take china's moon landing program for example, we launched the Chang'e-2 lunar probe on 1 October 2010, and claim it has only 6 month life span, turn out it is still alive and transmitting data as we speak. we also claimed it's only for "moon study", but after completing its claimed objective, took the highest-resolution picture of the entire Moon yet recorded, the mission extended and the probe left lunar orbit for the Earth–Sun L2 on 25 August 2011, the Chang'e-2 even visited the asteroid Toutatis.







And the more mysterious Chang'e-3 Yutu rover, which was landed NOT on the "previously planned and widely publicized" lunar landing site, in "Sinus Iridum" on the moon , but on "19.5 W, 44 N" of the moon, hundreds miles east of the presumed location, an incredibly significant "tetrahedral" lunar coordinates.













LOL.....

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## cirr

震撼曝光：中国巡航导弹精确打击敌机场雷达和指挥大楼惊耸画面—在线播放—优酷网，视频高清在线观看

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## Beast

The commander of DF-5B claimed it is a total transformation compare to old 80s DF-5.It has MIRV, strong ECM, decoy capable and strong penetration capabilities. The best ICBM China ever has.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Beast said:


> The commander of DF-5B claimed it is a total transformation compare to old 80s DF-5.It has MIRV, strong ECM, decoy capable and strong penetration capabilities. The best ICBM China ever has.



I say one of the best, since the DF-41 and JL-2 are also ranked as the elites of China's nuclear deterrence.

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## Beast

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> I say one of the best, since the DF-41 and JL-2 are also ranked as the elites of China's nuclear deterrence.


I think DF-41 has not enter service but soon. DF-31A lack the payload of DF-5B. Same as JL-2.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Beast said:


> I think DF-41 has not enter service but soon. DF-31A lack the payload of DF-5B. Same as JL-2.



The DF-41 has already entered into the service, and sometimes the US media doesn't necessarily tell you the truth.

The JL-2 is the first intercontinental SLBM for China, and if you wanna see a SLBM with the payload comparable to the DF-5B and DF-41, then you have to wait for the JL-3.

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## cirr



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## Akasa

cirr said:


>



What is it?


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## cirr

SinoSoldier said:


> What is it?



TEL for a certain type of missile。

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> TEL for a certain type of missile。



Well, what missile?


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## Beast

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> The DF-41 has already entered into the service, and sometimes the US media doesn't necessarily tell you the truth.
> 
> The JL-2 is the first intercontinental SLBM for China, and if you wanna see a SLBM with the payload comparable to the DF-5B and DF-41, then you have to wait for the JL-3.



DF-5B has no pre launch liquid fueling process, making it can launch anytime in silo. Plus using liquid fuel propulsion meaning it can control its ignition to make unpredictable path which is difficult to counter compare to solid fuel DF-41 which ignition cannot be control.

I think that is a major reason why the DF-5B commander claimed DF-5B is the best nuclear strategic missile in China nuclear arsenal.

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## ChineseTiger1986

SinoSoldier said:


> Well, what missile?



The DF-31B most likely.

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## bobsm

Appears to be another test on 4th of Dec. 


*A3553/15* - A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED BY: N404100E1015512-N401152E1045504-N394016E1044540-N395330E1031232-N40 2046E1001301-N405240E1002036 BACK TO START. VERTICAL LIMITS:GND-UNL. GND - UNL, 04 DEC 03:22 2015 UNTIL 04 DEC 04:13 2015. CREATED: 03 DEC 07:17 2015

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## hk299792458

IRBM / ASBM *DF-26*...

*Access vs. anti-access: China, US posture in anti-ship missile face off*



> BY BILL GERTZ on DECEMBER 14, 2015 in CHINA
> 
> The People’s Liberation Army last month disclosed new details about its new intermediate-range anti-ship ballistic missile known as the DF-26.
> 
> The missile can be armed with nuclear or conventional warheads and supplements the shorter range DF-21D anti-ship ballistic missile that along with the DF-26 are elements of a military strategy of building arms designed to force the US military to operate further away from Chinese shores.
> 
> First displayed in September during the high-profile military parade in Beijing, the DF-26 is known by the Chinese as the “Guam killer” because it gives PLA war planners the new capability of targeting the major US military hub in the south Pacific island – out of range for most of the short- and medium-range missiles.
> 
> Two military analysts from the China Academy of Military Sciences revealed new details about the missile they described in a news article as a two-for-one weapon.
> 
> “The DF-26’s distinct characteristic of being nuclear and conventional all in one; that is, one missile body can carry a nuclear warhead for a nuclear strike against the enemy, or it can carry a conventional warhead for conventional firepower attack against the enemy,” Wang Changqin and Fang Guangming stated in the Nov. 30 issue of China Youth Daily.
> 
> “That ‘change the warhead, not the missile’ feature provides a rapid switch between nuclear and conventional.”
> 
> The conventional DF-26 system extends the striking range from the 620-mile DF-21D anti-ship missile to 2,485 miles.
> 
> The missile system also is based on a road-mobile launcher, making it difficult for U.S. intelligence assets to find and track – and counter with US sea-based Aegis missile defenses or, as on Guam, with long-range THAAD anti-missile interceptors.
> 
> “Thus it further upgrades joint land, sea, and air firepower attack capability,” the analysts said. “In particular, it can, along with forward deployed surface and underwater attack forces and ship borne, shore-based, and air war forces, execute long, medium, and short-range integrated attacks against large vessels at sea, and integrated, land, sea, and air attacks.”
> 
> The authors describe the key feature of the solid-fueled DF-26 as being fast – with the rapid switch from conventional to nuclear warheads; quick launch preparation time; and fast road withdrawal after firing.
> 
> Its modular features allow for the use of several types of warheads, including two types of nuclear re-entry vehicles, and several conventional warheads each with differing destructive capabilities, such as area attacks for use against airfields and ports, ground penetrators for buried targets, and fuel-air explosives for use against electronic targets.
> 
> The authors regard the DF-26 as a state-of-the-art missile and China’s prize possession to support what they said is the military concept of “use offense to assist defense.”
> 
> “Against time-sensitive targets such as surface ships in particular, [the DF-26] can attack at the last minute as soon as information on a ship’s movement is acquired, meaning the ship cannot get away,” Wang and Fang state.
> 
> The weapon is clearly directed at the United States, a country the authors say is taking steps to build up forces in Asia and “hype” the threat from China.
> 
> They accuse the United States of using the renamed Air Sea Battle Concept called Joint Concept for Access and Maneuver in the Global Commons to split the region and disrupt stability.
> 
> America “has stepped up relevant preparations” for military action in the region, they say.
> 
> For these reasons, the authors argue, the DF-26 is one of the PLA’s most important weapons, despite the complexity of the its use that will require networked “combat chain” of data from numerous sensors and other systems used for targeting and attack.
> 
> China’s new weapons like the DF-26 have ended a decades-long period when the US military projected power will little or no risk. “That era is gone,” Thomas Mahnken, a US Naval War College expert on the Chinese military, said last week during a conference hosted by the Heritage Foundation.
> 
> Today, the US military is developing asymmetric responses to Chinese weapons like the DF-26 that the Pentagon calls “anti-access, area denial” arms, and that China calls “counter-intervention” weapons.
> 
> “China really has been at the forefront of pursuing some of these counter-intervention capabilities that pose a significant challenge,” Mahnken said.
> 
> “China is deploying capabilities to deter the United States and its allies from taking action close to China,” he added. “Those deployments are imposing considerable costs to us collectively and they have given Beijing momentum.”
> 
> The Pentagon’s response to these new Chinese weapons has been modest, in part due to defense budget shortfalls and demands for military support in the Middle East against Islamic State terrorism.
> 
> The US buildup in Asia so far has included the deployment of several thousand troops to Australia, the deployment of Littoral Combat Ships to Singapore, and an additional attack submarine and regular rotations of B-52 and B-2 bombers to Guam.
> 
> Plans call for deploying a second aircraft carrier strike group to the region in the future.
> 
> A Pentagon policymaker outlined some steps the US military is taking to assure its forces and allies can gain access to the sea lanes and ports of the Asia Pacific in the face of the Chinese missile buildup and assertiveness.
> 
> Abraham M. Denmark, deputy assistant defense secretary for East Asia, bluntly stated last week that US forces will not be forced to retreat in the face of China’s new arms.
> 
> “I want to reiterate the US commitment to the Asia Pacific region should not be underestimated,” Denmark said. “There should be no question that the United States retains a decisive military edge today, and we are taking action to preserve and enhance our conventional deterrence for the long term.”
> 
> The immediate shift to Asia includes the best and newest weapons, he said, along with bolstering allies by providing arms and intelligence support.
> 
> Denmark did not provide details of the new capabilities planned for Asia. But he asserted that US military forces are being increased both qualitatively and quantitatively.
> 
> The plans call for trumping China’s high-technology weapons with new arms and military capabilities that will nullify the growing advantages.
> 
> For the DF-26, the Pentagon plans to disrupt the missile’s complex system for long-range strike capability through such things as cyber attacks on weapons and sensor systems. The electronic and other non-kinetic attacks will be aimed at disrupting this so-called “kill chain,” — the difficult task of finding, tracking, targeting and guiding missiles – before they can strike ships and other targets.
> 
> “We’re making heavy investments in forces for military operations in the Asia Pacific, including subsurface warfare, electronic warfare, space, cyber, missile defense, and more,” he said.
> 
> How much new military power will be added to Asia will depend on China’s behavior, Denmark said.
> 
> “How China rises and relates to the principled order that has undergirded regional peace, stability and security since the end of World War II will be a defining variable of the future security architecture of the Asia Pacific,” he said.
> 
> The recent disclosures about the DF-26 and Pentagon’s planned report shows that US-China big power rivalry is showing signs of increasing, despite the close economic and trade relations between the two states.
> 
> Bill Gertz is a journalist and author who has spent decades covering defense and national security affairs. He is the author of six national security books. Contact him on Twitter at @BillGertz
> 
> (Copyright 2015 Asia Times Holdings Limited, a duly registered Hong Kong company. All rights reserved. Please contact us about sales, syndication and republishing.)













Range of DF-26 launched from North East of China






Henri K.

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## JSCh

*Stealth tech on view in Beijing parade*
By Zhao Lei (China Daily) Updated: 2015-12-21 08:17







DF-26 missiles appear in the Sept 3 parade in Beijing.[Photo/China Daily]​
Stealth technology was applied to the wheels of missile transporters used in the Sept 3 parade in Beijing marking the 70th anniversary of the end of World War II.

This was disclosed by the nation's largest missile manufacturer, China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, in an article published this month on WeChat, the smartphone-based social media app.

The company did not go into details about the technologies used, saying only that the move was requested by the People's Liberation Army. A picture published with the article shows some people wearing respirators working on shells that were later installed as a shield on the vehicles' wheels.

The article said 30 engineers and workers from the Wuhan Magnetism-Electron Co Ltd in Hubei province, including four doctoral and 11 master's degree holders, took part in developing the unidentified equipment. Work started in March.

Gao Zhuo, a military observer in Shanghai, said missile specialists would be able to calculate the weight of a missile and its warhead if they could examine the transporter vehicles' wheels.

"This information is highly sensitive because you can use it to judge a missile's power and capacity," he said. "I think the specially designed shells can reduce radar and thermal detection, enabling the missile to remain a secret from those in the crowd using mini-detection devices, or from spy satellites."

In addition to the wheels, the PLA must have used stealth technologies on the missiles and the transporter vehicles to reduce the number of identifiable features on the weapons, he added.

A total of 112 missiles paraded by the PLA Second Artillery Corps, the country's de facto strategic missile force, appeared in the parade in Tian'anmen Square. The seven types shown at the event were all "backbones" of the missile force, according to the Corps.

The public debuts at the parade of the DF-21D and DF-26, both capable of sinking aircraft carriers, have become a hot topic among foreign military websites and publications, as it was the first confirmation that they had been developed.

Two weapons experts from the PLA Academy of Military Science, Wang Changqin and Fang Guangming, wrote in China Youth Daily last month that the DF-26 can carry nuclear and conventional warheads.

It can be launched in a way that requires hardly any prelaunch preparations. As a result, the missile is very hard to detect and track.

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## hk299792458

One day after the 5th flight test of MiRV-capable and mobile *DF-41*, China could have carried out an another test around the same ICBM.

*China Tests New ICBM from Railroad Car*



> Rail-mobile launcher used in DF-41 ejection test
> 
> BY: Bill Gertz
> December 21, 2015 5:00 am
> 
> U.S. intelligence agencies recently monitored a Chinese test of a new rail car-based long-range missile capable of hitting targets throughout the United States.
> 
> The canister ejection test of a DF-41 missile from a rail-mobile launcher was detected on Dec. 5 in western China, said defense officials familiar with reports of the test.
> 
> Few details were available on the DF-41 launcher ejection test.
> 
> However, Chinese rail-based missile development has been carried out in the past at the Wuzhai missile test center, also known as the Taiyuan satellite launch center since 1982, according to declassified CIA documents. The launch site is located in China’s central Shanxi Province.
> 
> The test this month marks a significant milestone for Chinese strategic weapons developers and demonstrates that Beijing is moving ahead with building and deploying the DF-41 on difficult-to-locate rail cars, in addition to previously-known road-mobile launchers, the officials said.
> 
> Pentagon spokesman Cmdr. Bill Urban declined to comment. “We do not comment on PRC weapons tests, but we do monitor Chinese military modernization carefully,” he said.
> 
> Previous disclosures from China on the DF-41, including Internet photographs, all showed the heavy missile deployed on a wheeled transporter erector launcher that is moved on roads.
> 
> The DF-41, with a range of more than 7,500 miles, is China’s most potent ICBM and was flight tested a day before the rail car ejection test with two multiple-independently targetable reentry vehicles (MIRVs), officials said.
> 
> Military analysts say the mobile basing of missiles is designed to complicate preemptive attacks on nuclear forces, such as those envisioned under the Pentagon’s Prompt Global Strike program, which will use precision-guided conventional weapons capable of striking targets at any location on earth within minutes of their discovery.
> 
> U.S. intelligence agencies estimate the DF-41 when deployed will carry up to 10 MIRVs—vastly increasing Beijing’s current warhead stockpile, which is based on single-warhead missiles, and currently estimated to include around 300 warheads.
> 
> Details of the Chinese rail-based missile system were first reported by the Washington Free Beacon in 2013.
> 
> China is believed to have obtained rail-mobile missile technology from Ukraine, which during the Soviet period built the SS-24 rail-based ICBM, according to a report by Georgetown University’s Asian Arms Control Project.
> 
> China state television in 2006 released the first details of the train basing for missiles in video footage showing missile launch cars, command cars, and other missile system railcars—all disguised as passenger train cars.
> 
> The Georgetown report said the Chinese rail-mobile ICBM system is modeled on the Ukrainian-designed SS-24, and is known as a “land nuclear submarine”—an indication the rail launcher uses an ejection tube to boost the missile from the train car shortly before ignition of its engine.
> 
> China also is developing an extensive rail and tunnel system devoted to the missile train in central China, according to the report.
> 
> Phillip A. Karber, a defense expert who heads the Potomac Foundation, said his organization recently identified a DF-41 at a special launch site at Taiyuan. The missile was revealed in commercial satellite photos.
> 
> “If that missile train hosts the DF-41 ICBM it means it will also have a MIRV potential,” Karber said. “The combination of high-speed mobility, launch cars disguised as civilian passenger trains, tunnel protection and secure reloading of missiles, coupled with multiple warheads, makes the system extremely hard to regulate or verify the number of systems.”
> 
> Karber, who also is affiliated with the Georgetown arms control project, said the project first identified the rail-based ICBM system four years ago. However, the arms control community dismissed reports about the basing mode, he said.
> 
> “Since then there have been reports that China’s 2nd Artillery Corps, the force that operates the missiles, had built 2,000 kilometers [1,243 miles] of heavy gauge rail for this system,” Karber said.
> 
> The dedicated missile rail and tunnel system will significantly expand China’s ability to target ICBMs in the United States by avoiding missile overflight of Alaska, where U.S. anti-missile interceptors are based.
> 
> “We have also seen imagery of huge tunnel complexes capable of hosting three missile trains side by side,” Karber said.
> 
> China’s first public disclosure of the DF-41 occurred in August 2014 when details about the missile program were published on a regional Chinese government web site.
> 
> After the disclosure, Chinese military spokesman Geng Yansheng told state media that “research and development [of missiles] is normal for the military without any specific enemy in mind.”
> 
> “Because of the missile’s mobility, it is extremely difficult to be tracked by satellite,” Geng said.
> 
> China’s military doctrine in a 2013 study stated that U.S. prompt global strike weapons posed a threat to China’s nuclear forces.
> 
> A congressional China commission stated in its annual report published earlier this year that China is deploying multiple-warhead missiles to increase China’s “ability to penetrate adversary missile defenses and enhancing the credibility of its nuclear forces as a deterrent.”
> 
> The Pentagon is also studying a road- and rail-mobile ICBM system for future nuclear forces, according to Air Force contracting documents.
> 
> Rick Fisher, an expert on Chinese military programs, said China has been interested in rail basing for missiles for some time.
> 
> “The Soviet SS-24 used a rail car launcher, could carry up to 10 warheads and had a range of 10,000 kilometers,” Fisher said. “This is close to the capabilities of the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation DF-41 ICBM.”
> 
> China also has decades of experience in perfecting rail cars for transport of easily damaged large missiles and payloads.
> 
> “Like the versions developed for the Soviets, the Chinese system likely uses a cold-launch tube fitted to a covered rail car,” Fisher said.
> 
> The recent rail ejection test likely is for “verifying the ability of the tube to eject the heavy DF-41 ICBM,” he added.
> 
> After ejection from the tube, the DF-41 engine ignites microseconds after the missile clears the end of the canister.
> 
> Cold launch tubes are preferred for missile systems because the materials cost less and require less strength than missiles launched “hot” from within a tube.
> 
> “This vastly increases the challenge of tracking China’s ICBM force, as China today has 74,565 miles of rail lines, including 9,942 miles of high speed rail,” Fisher said, adding that by 2050 China could have up to 170,000 miles of rail lines.
> 
> High-speed rail lines would allow the DF-41 to reach deployment location rapidly and would complicate efforts to monitor, track, and counter the missiles.
> 
> Road-mobile and rail-mobile DF-41s will double China’s warheads in China’s arsenal and give China the capability of targeting the United States with nuclear strikes from most locations in China, Fisher said.
> 
> The Chinese nuclear buildup should prompt the United States to re-evaluate its arms control constraints on its nuclear forces, Fisher said.
> 
> “Given the growing degree of military technical cooperation and military-political coordination between Beijing and Moscow, we have to consider that eventually Russia and China could combine their nuclear weapons in a ‘tilt’ to coerce the United States, lets say in a military crisis over the future of democratic Taiwan,” he said.
> 
> Meanwhile, Russia also disclosed recently that it is developing a new rail basing system for ICBMs.
> 
> Col. Gen. Sergei Karakayev, commander of the Strategic Rocket Forces, Russian’s nuclear missile and bomber forces, said a report on the rail basing would be presented to the Kremlin in 2017.
> 
> “Now the initial design is ready and we are preparing working design documentation for aggregates and systems within the weapon,” Karakayev said, according to state-run Interfax on Dec. 17.
> 
> The new system will be based on the SS-24 that was dismantled after the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991.
> 
> Russia is seeking rail basing for missiles in response to the U.S. Prompt Global Strike system, according to Russian press reports.



Henri K.

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## cirr



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## hk299792458

New balistic test planned on December 27th at 02h15 UTC from TSLC.



> A3734/15 NOTAMN
> 
> Q) ZXXX/QRTCA/IV/BO/W/000/999/4026N09357E033
> A) ZLHW ZWUQ B) 1512270215 C) 1512270255
> E) A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED
> BY:N401715E0935522-N401715E0943746-N403934E0943746-N403934E0935522-
> N403516E0931655-N402429E0931641 BACK TO START.
> VERTICAL LIMITS:GND-UNL.
> F) GND G) UNL








This is nearly the same NOTAM zone as the one of October 15th, that we still ignore what's that.

Henri K.

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## cirr

*China says carrying out tests of new long-range missile*

Posted 31 Dec 2015 18:40

BEIJING: China's Defence Ministry said on Thursday that it was carrying out routine tests of a new long-rang missile, after a U.S.-based website said China had tested it from a railroad car, which would be difficult to locate in a conflict.

The Washington Free Beacon said last week U.S. intelligence agencies had recently monitored a test of the DF-41 on the train, a missile that could hit U.S. targets.

The report said the test was a "significant milestone", and would add to an existing capability to move the missile on road-mobile launchers.

Chinese Defence Ministry spokesman Yang Yujun, asked about the report, would not comment on the specifics.

"The scientific research tests carried out domestically are done in accordance with plans," he told a monthly news briefing, without elaborating.

Chinese President Xi Jinping is overseeing an ambitious military modernisation programme, including developing stealth fighters and building its own aircraft carriers.

That has rattled Beijing's neighbours, several of whom are engaged in territorial disputes with China, as well as Washington.

China says it has no hostile intent and that it needs a modern military to protect its legitimate security needs as the world's second-largest economy.

(Reporting by Ben Blanchard; Editing by Nick Macfie)

- Reuters

China says carrying out tests of new long-range missile - Channel NewsAsia

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## cirr



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## cirr

DF-26 able to penetrate enemies‘ defences at speed of *Mach 18* according to official media（article based on National Award for Science and Technology Progress）：

官媒曝东风26可18倍音速突防 美航母难有活路-20160204军迷前线-凤凰视频-最具媒体品质的综合视频门户-凤凰网

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## cirr

DF-16B











Good old DF-16

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## JSCh

* March of Rocket Force *
The song of People's Liberation Army Rocket Force.

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## cirr

DF-16B，the airport annihilator，in action

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## Akasa

More photos of the DF-16B test:

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## Beast

Imagine the last photo of the explosion ,stuck a carrier or nearby. It will be goner.

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## 55100864

Official report of DF5A silo.

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## Akasa

55100864 said:


> Official report of DF5A silo.
> View attachment 294238
> View attachment 294240
> View attachment 294239
> View attachment 294241
> View attachment 294243
> View attachment 294242



I've a hunch that the pictures are CGIs.


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## 55100864

SinoSoldier said:


> I've a hunch that the pictures are CGIs.


It's appeared in The Song Of People's Liberation Army Rocket Force.

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## Akasa

55100864 said:


> It's appeared in The Song Of Chinese Liberation Army Rocket Force.



Doesn't preclude the silo images from being CGI. Now, on a second look, they definitely are CGIs.


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## Tiqiu

DF21D

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## hk299792458

CGIs are quite representative comparing to the real pictures





















Henri K.

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## cirr

DF-26 are go

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## JSCh



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## cirr

A unit of CASIC is simultaneously working on 60 plus missile programmes。

Poor guys at A Academy. Working flatout.

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## cirr

CCTV 7 reports on PLA Rocket Force

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## cirr

DF-21D，target CV 1500km away eastward, ready，fire！

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## cirr

ASAT test this afternoon in Korla?






Time for the "Beacon of the Free World" to get busy.

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## grey boy 2

中国高超声速武器真身曝光 (Hypersonic weapon)? source: CCTV

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## 星海军事

grey boy 2 said:


> 中国高超声速武器真身曝光 (Hypersonic weapon)? source: CCTV



My image was clipped again...

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## hk299792458

星海军事 said:


> My image was clipped again...



I won't say that's your image. 

The original image comes from the collection of documents of academician Liu Xingzhou, it is a model he presented in 2007 during the national meeting of aerospace propulsion.






Henri K.

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## 星海军事

hk299792458 said:


> I won't say that's your image.
> 
> The original image comes from the collection of documents of academician Liu Xingzhou, it is a model he presented in 2007 during the national meeting of aerospace propulsion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Henri K.


I meant the image I made -- it is the upper part and the lower part that formed a chain of evidence and connected the previous design of Liu Xingzhou and the article about Lu hong together

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## j20blackdragon

ASBM target practice.

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## hk299792458

j20blackdragon said:


> ASBM target practice.
> View attachment 320593
> View attachment 320594
> View attachment 320595



This seems to be classic bombing...

Henri K.


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## Han Patriot

cirr said:


> DF-26 are go


If you look at the radar image in the pic, it is clearly for Spratly's. Who do you use it on? Aircraft carriers?

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## jkroo

Han Patriot said:


> If you look at the radar image in the pic, it is clearly for Spratly's. Who do you use it on? Aircraft carriers?



Are you kidding? Try to speak correct Chinese.

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## cirr

DF-16B

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## grey boy 2

DF-16B 中国火箭军最新东风16B导弹发射照片

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## grey boy 2



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## grey boy 2

First live firing images of HQ-16 from CCTV 
日前，央视曝光了解放军红旗16地空导弹发射瞬间近距离多角度实拍画面，十分震撼

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## grey boy 2



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## Zarvan

Chinese HongQi 12 (KaiShan 1) medium range, high altitude surface-to-air missile (SAM) system

The Chinese PLA Air Force is now strengthened with third generation surface to air missiles that are capable of hitting U-2 ultra high altitude reconnaissance aircraft.

The PLA Air Force's "Hero Battalion", assigned to a missile division with the air force of the Central Theater Command has formed combat capability after employing this 3rd-generation surface-to-air missiles independently, China Military online reported Monday.

The PLA Air Force's ground-to-air defense troops have established a combat system covering long, medium and short ranges and high, medium and low altitudes, Senior Colonel Shen Jinke, spokesperson for the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force said Sunday.

The PLA Air Force has built a sky shield ensuring China's air and space security with the air defense and anti-missile capability comprehensively upgraded in IT-based conditions.

Air defense and anti-missile capability is an important part of the Air Force's strategic capabilities, Shen added.

The PLA Air Force, following the strategic requirement of building air-space capabilities and conducting both offensive and defensive operations, will try hard to shift its focus from territorial air defense to both defense and offense, and build an air-space defense force structure that can meet the requirements of informationized operations.

The PLA Air Force will boost its capabilities for strategic early warning, air strike, air and missile defense, information countermeasures, airborne operations, strategic projection and comprehensive support.

The HQ-9 surface-to-air missile displayed in the military parade for V-Day celebration is a high-altitude and medium and long-range air defense equipment focused on hitting various aircraft.


The HQ-12 surface-to-air missile is a new type of medium and high-altitude air defense weapon independently designed by China and the HQ-6 air defense missile system is a new-generation terminal defense weapon equipment that realizes terminal air defense interception with its high missile precision and high firing rate of the anti-aircraft gun.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/16...Altitude_Reconnaissance_Aircraft#.V8QudCNRXqA

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## Beast

Able to hit U-2 is not sometime new. Demonstrated in the 60s already with HQ-2 missile. I dont know what is the fuss that this news agency need to mention it.


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## Rukarl

"ultra high altitude"  What's next? mega super ultra high altitude?

As for the news, what nonsense is it? They had such capabilities years ago, who even writes these news?


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## Bussard Ramjet

Beast said:


> Able to hit U-2 is not sometime new. Demonstrated in the 60s already with HQ-2 missile. I dont know what is the fuss that this news agency need to mention it.



Taking down one U2 in thousands of sorties is not a reliable capability.


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## lcloo

Bussard Ramjet said:


> Taking down one U2 in thousands of sorties is not a reliable capability.


Pls check the fact right before you comment. One U2 shot down in thousands of sorties?

U2 wreckage on displayed in war museum in China. U2 flew 110 sorties over Mainland China, 5 were shot down by SA-2.

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## Hamartia Antidote

lcloo said:


> Pls check the fact right before you comment. One U2 shot down in thousands of sorties?
> 
> U2 wreckage on displayed in war museum in China. U2 flew 110 sorties over Mainland China, 5 were shot down by SA-2.
> 
> View attachment 329994



Probably Taiwanese:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Cat_Squadron


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## lcloo

Flew by ROC pilots from Black Cat squadron under CIA. U2 belonged to US, but painted with ROC colors.

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## Bussard Ramjet

lcloo said:


> Pls check the fact right before you comment. One U2 shot down in thousands of sorties?
> 
> U2 wreckage on displayed in war museum in China. U2 flew 110 sorties over Mainland China, 5 were shot down by SA-2.
> 
> View attachment 329994



Even by those stats, it is a kill efficiency of less than 5%.


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## MilSpec

Beast said:


> Able to hit U-2 is not sometime new. Demonstrated in the 60s already with HQ-2 missile. I dont know what is the fuss that this news agency need to mention it.


HQ-2 is a re-badged S75 (SA-2)... This might be your own development this time around.

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## lcloo

Bussard Ramjet said:


> Even by those stats, it is a kill efficiency of less than 5%.


Wrong again. Trying to play number games? Not all flights were in areas covered by SA-2 or HQ-2. In 1960s China only had so many SA-2 battalion deployed, and most of them were around Beijing. 

There was no way China could deployed SA-2 to covered every militarily/ strategic base/ ports/cities 50 years ago. U2 could only be shot down by SA-2 during that time, other missiles and jet fighters protecting these areas could not fly as high as U2.

The results of downing 5 U2 were fruits of good intellgent work of finding the flight path and flight time of U2 as well as their intended target area.

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## sheik

Bussard Ramjet said:


> Even by those stats, it is a kill efficiency of less than 5%.



Definitely not as efficient as IAF that's used to crash own airplanes more efficiently even without a SAM

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## j20blackdragon

KD-20 ALCM

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## Brainsucker

KD-20 ALCM is a cruise missile?


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## Beast

Brainsucker said:


> KD-20 ALCM is a cruise missile?


Yes, land version call CJ-10. You look at the shape you will know. Cruise missile is usually big , slender and long.

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## cirr

At least one DF-16 brigade and one DF-26 brigade formed in the last few months.

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## nadeemkhan110

The air defense system HQ-64
The air defense system HQ-64 ( export name LY-60) is a direct clone of the Italian Selenia (Alenia) Aspide Mk.1, itself derived from the RIM-7E Sea Sparrow.

This missile is frequently cited as the direct replacement for the conceptually similar but much bulkier HQ-61. Recent literature shows a four round LY-60 TEL which is based on the naval box launcher mount, similar to the US Sea Sparrow and original Aspide designs.

Like the Aspide / Sparrow, the LY-60 appears in naval and mobile point defence SAM configurations, and as an AAM for fighter aircraft, designated as the FD-60 or PL-10.

Source: http://defence-blog.com/missiles/new-chinese-air-defense-system-hq-64-export-name-ly-60.html

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## Brainsucker

A question to anyone who know it.
Is this HQ-6-4 or HQ 64? It is an upgrade for old HQ-6 or is this a brand new AAM HQ-64? Which is newer? This system or the HQ-9?
Thanks


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## 艹艹艹

*China's development of quantum radar made a breakthrough，
Stealth aircraft can be easily detected
http://mil.news.sina.com.cn/jssd/2016-08-31/doc-ifxvixeq0797932.shtml





Picture has nothing to do with content

*

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## Pepsi Cola

wait.. how?


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## cirr

HQ-16B





HQ-16A

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## grey boy 2

DF-21D world's first anti-ship ballistic _missile_ (_ASBM_)

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## cirr

Anyone knows anything about the new CM-302 supersonic anti-ship missle?

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## Dungeness

cirr said:


> Anyone knows anything about the new CM-302 supersonic anti-ship missle?




Could it be the export version of YJ-12?


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## 星海军事

Dungeness said:


> Could it be the export version of YJ-12?

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## cirr

Dungeness said:


> Could it be the export version of YJ-12?



Mach 3 or 4? 290km？

Anyway, we should know in less than 2 months.

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## Dungeness

cirr said:


> Mach 3 or 4? 290km？
> 
> Anyway, we should know *in less than 2 months.*




Any new development?


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## cirr

Dungeness said:


> Any new development?



A fuzzy photo from CASIC, the maker of the missile

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## Ultima Thule

cirr said:


> A fuzzy photo from CASIC, the maker of the missile
> 
> View attachment 332153


i think it is based on YJ-12 visually sir


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## cirr

pakistanipower said:


> i think it is based on YJ-12 visually sir



Most likely it is. 

Now we can look forward to the release of specs in the next month or two.

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## grey boy 2

HQ16B

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## Zarvan

The China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC) has developed a new variant of its HQ-16 (Red Flag-16) self-propelled medium-range surface-to-air missile (SAM), according to imagery released by Chinese state television in early September.





New imagery reveals that China has developed a new variant of its HQ-16 self-propelled surface-to-air missile. (CCTV)

The new variant (referred to by some as the HQ-16B) appears to have an improved rocket motor and revised wings, which sources say increase the missile's range to 70 km, up from the 40 km credited to the HQ-16, in service with the air defence units of the People's Liberation Army Ground Force (PLAGF).

In late September/early October 2011 official Chinese media reported that co-development between Russia and China of the HQ-16 had been completed and that the missile had reached operational capability within the Chinese army. It is understood that development within China commenced as early as 2005.

The HQ-16 SAM is similar to the 9M38E series of export missiles that form part of the Russian Almaz-Antey Shtil systems China purchased for use on its Sovremenny-class (Project 956E/956EM) and Type 052B destroyers.

But the HQ-16 would also seem to have some aspects of the vertically launched 9M317M, never supplied to China as far as can be ascertained. In its naval guise, the HQ-16 is known as the HHQ-16 (Red Sea-16). The HQ-16 is also referred to as the HQ-16A.

Almaz-Antey reportedly provided missile technology to aid China's development of the HQ-16, as it did with the HQ-9 SAM system, which is analogous to Almaz-Antey's S-300 SAM.

The HQ-16 has reportedly been delivered to the Shenyang Military Region.

*Want to read more? For analysis on this article and access to all our insight content, please enquire about our subscription options　**ihs.com/contact*




To read the full article, Client Login
(275 of 408 words)

http://www.janes.com/article/63500/china-develops-longer-range-hq-16-sam-variant

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## 艹艹艹



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## aliaselin

Don't know how could the journalist fabricate so many junk words

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## cirr

aliaselin said:


> Don't know how could the journalist fabricate so many junk words



What do you expect from these guys?

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## grey boy 2

*疑中国机动式快舟运载火箭真身：可反制敌卫星*

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## Akasa

grey boy 2 said:


> *疑中国机动式快舟运载火箭真身：可反制敌卫星*



Translation? Is the second-last photo of the first Kuaizhou test?


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## grey boy 2

SinoSoldier said:


> Translation? Is the second-last photo of the first Kuaizhou test?


Mobil version, dont know about the 2nd last photo


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## hk299792458

Very old pictures indeed.

The first one is the TEL of Kuaizhou. A mobile military space launcher, very similar to American OBS program.

Henri K.


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## cirr

DF-21D in action












Four tests were carried out between Nov. 2014 and July 2015 at this base.

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> DF-21D in action
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Four tests were carried out between Nov. 2014 and July 2015 at this base.



I suppose the missile in these photos is DF-21C.


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## grey boy 2

DF-10A










DF-26

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## grey boy 2

DF-31A 














DF-5B

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## Dungeness



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## Tiqiu

After the first appearance at Airshow China 2014, Chinese WS-43 Miniature Attack Cruise Missile System (Loitering Attack Munition) was being displayed in Russia recently.

WS-43 can carry warhead of 20 kg to a distance of 60km and stay over the battlefield for up to 30 minutes. It is designed to find, track and engage moving as well as hard to hit reverse slope targets. 

The US(Lockheed Martin) terminated its XM501 loitering rocket development program after its poor performance test and high cost in 2011.

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## Beast

Tiqiu said:


> After the first appearance at Airshow China 2014, Chinese WS-43 Miniature Attack Cruise Missile System (Loitering Attack Munition) was being displayed in Russia recently.
> 
> WS-43 can carry warhead of 20 kg to a distance of 60km and stay over the battlefield for up to 30 minutes. It is designed to find, track and engage moving as well as hard to hit reverse slope targets.
> 
> The US(Lockheed Martin) terminated its XM501 loitering rocket development program after its poor performance test and high cost in 2011.


Its like a swarm of bees and work as a team will be devastating.

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## wiseone2

Israel has loitering munitions


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## Skull and Bones

So it's basically a low cost short range cruise missile launching out of a MBRL, pretty sleek.


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## Oldman1

Skull and Bones said:


> So it's basically a low cost short range cruise missile launching out of a MBRL, pretty sleek.



Reminds me of this.





http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2015/04/navy-preparing-launch-swarm-bots-out-cannons/110167/

The military’s swarm robots move from sea to air with a new program to shoot drones.

The U.S. Navy will launch up to 30 synchronized drones within one minute, possibly from a single cannon-like device, in what marks a significant advance in robot autonomy. The drones, when airborne, will then unfold their wings and conduct a series of maneuvers and simulated missions with very little human guidance over the course of 90 minutes.

Navy officials announced on Tuesday that they intend to stage a key demonstration of the swarm bots from what the Navy is calling a “tube-based launcher,” essentially, a big cannon, next year.

The program, which the Navy is called Low-Cost UAV Swarming Technology, or LOCUST, marks a significant advance in applications for robotic swarming software. In August, the Office of Naval Research, or ONR, which is behind the program, demonstrated a swarming configuration of 13 robotic boats on Virginia’s James River. The boats were able to perform a variety of tasks to protect a high-value ship from incoming craft.

Getting flying robots to coordinate maneuvers isn’t new. In *this 2012 demo*, University of Pennsylvania researchers show how they were able to turn a set of small quad-helicopter drones into autonomous musicians.

But preprograming a musical flight path for consumer quadbots is different from getting fast-moving military drones, possibly armed, to spontaneously and autonomously collaborate and perform missions in the air. In conversation with _Defense One _at Navy League’s Sea Air Space conference outside of Washington, D.C., Lee Mastroianni, director for the LOCUST program, discussed some of the complex differences between swarm boats and flying swarm bots. The Navy needs robots that can join together, break apart and conduct missions individually, collaboratively, and spontaneously.

“In 3-D space you’re doing maneuvers, so that’s very complex. The other part of it is the ability to disaggregate and re-aggregate components,” he said. That means telling the drones “I need three of you to break off and go kill something or do some [intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance, or ISR,] come back and reform,” said Mastroianni. “It’s very, very dynamic.”

The challenge also represents an ambitious goal for shrinking onboard processing capabilities. “I can’t put a mainframe computer on there. It’s a case of needing very efficient processing,” he said.

The Navy’s swarm boats were guided by lasers and radar, but run primarily by a Rubik’s Cube-sized processing unit called the Control Architecture for Robotic Agent Command and Sensing, or CARACaS. The LOCUST project will borrow from the pervious effort but the ultimate solution will be very different.

For the LOCUST project, the Navy is relying on Coyote drones manufactured by Sensintel, an Arizona-based company recently acquired by Raytheon. Coyotes have proven especially useful to the special operations community as well as in various types of scientific research. Last September, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, or NOAA, dropped a Coyote drone from a canister into Hurricane Eduard to study the storm.

Future flying swarms wouldn’t be limited to Coyotes. But the smaller the drone, the easer the wings can be folded into a capsule that can shot out of the cannon, er, “tube-based launcher.”

“How do you get a lot of birds up in the air quickly? That drives you to a canister launch configuration,” said Mastroianni. “I’m platform-agnostic. If you’re looking at a swarm of 20 or 30, there’s no reason why you couldn’t swarm Predators,” he said. “But when you get into something like the Predator, they want them back. They’re not going to be one-way missions.”

Some national security thinkers, most notably Paul Scharre at the Center for New American Security, or CNAS, argue that cheap swarm robots with increasing autonomy are key to maintaining air dominance in the new century.

“Individually, robotic systems can provide warfighters significant advantages in a range of missions,” he writes in his report _Robotics On the Battlefield Part II, the Coming Swarm_, published last year. “Collectively, swarms of robotic systems have the potential for even more dramatic, disruptive change to military operations. Swarms of robotic systems can bring greater mass, coordination, intelligence and speed to the battlefield, enhancing the ability of warfighters to gain a decisive advantage over their adversaries.”

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## cirr

Hit your enemy from above











Attack your enemy from afar






DF-21X, the AWACS killer






China is putting a lot of efforts and resources into the development and deployment of integrated air and space defence/attack systems that are made of @Bussard Ramjet 

a variety of long-range(300km-2000km), highspeed(hypersonic, reentry deceleration, Mach 5 terminal) and precision missiles that are capable of downing high value air targets such as stealth fighter jets, AWACS and strategic bombers.

Being able to destroy a slow-moving target like CV 2000km(or 4000km or 6000km or...) away is definitely not the end of the story.

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## cirr

dddddhm -> dddddfj -> ddddddddd???


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## Bussard Ramjet

cirr said:


> dddddhm -> dddddfj -> ddddddddd???



What does this mean?

Also your tags aren't appearing in my notifications. 

Finally post something more related to China science.


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## cirr

Bussard Ramjet said:


> What does this mean?
> 
> Also your tags aren't appearing in my notifications.
> 
> Finally post something more related to China science.



Nuclear fusion 

http://www.cas.cn/syky/201609/t20160913_4574537.shtml

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> dddddhm -> dddddfj -> ddddddddd???


Some anti-ballistic missiles themselves actually ARE ballistic missiles in some ways

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## cirr

星海军事 said:


> Some anti-ballistic missiles themselves actually ARE ballistic missiles in some ways



Is it true that DF-16D is the 3rd version of anti-ship ballistic missiles？

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## Talha Baloch

impressive missile system for ground troops (y)

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Game changer system no doubt , tremendously difficult for enemy to stop these weapons

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## cirr

Ready to say hello to Chinese "PAC3"?

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> Ready to say hello to Chinese "PAC3"?



First flight in 2011 and another test flight in 2013. The designation is rumored to be the "HQ-29".

What's the news regarding it this time? A milestone, perhaps?


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## cirr

Bussard Ramjet said:


> What does this mean?
> 
> Also your tags aren't appearing in my notifications.
> 
> Finally post something more related to China science.



http://news.sciencenet.cn/htmlnews/2016/9/356534.shtm

and

http://news.sciencenet.cn/htmlnews/2016/9/356487.shtm

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## grey boy 2

FM-3000 short Medium range air defense system 国产FM-3000中近程防空导弹武器系统

With all direction, detection and interception capability, FM-3000 missile can effective intercept various aircrafts and precision-guided munitions. According to Chinese Internet sources, the FM-3000 is also able to detect and destroy stealth aircraft. It has the capability to track eight targets at the same time.

The FM-3000 air defense missile system uses a TEL (Transporter Erector Launcher) based on a 6x6 heavy truck chassis. The FM-3000 TEL carries a total of 8 missile container-launcher tubes. The missile containers arrangement is two separate banks of four missiles. These tubes are raised to the vertical at the rear of the truck chassis for missile launch and are carried horizontally for travel. In firing position two hydraulic jacks are lowered on the ground each side of the vehicle to stabilize the truck during firing operations.

The FM-3000 missile has a maximum engagement range of 30 km for aerial targets, but this range is reduced to 20 km when it is used to intercept tactical missiles. It only takes four seconds to launch the missile when the enemy target is detected in airspace.

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## Economic superpower

SinoSoldier said:


> First flight in 2011 and another test flight in 2013. The designation is rumored to be the "HQ-29".
> 
> What's the news regarding it this time? A milestone, perhaps?



Yes a milestone indeed.

CIA didn't give you the briefing?


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## Muhammad Omar

Cool


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## jha

System is indeed impressive.
Doesnt Israel already use such munitions for some years now ?

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## hk299792458

New ABM (??) test could have been carried out this morning.

http://www.eastpendulum.com/nouvel-abm-20-septembre






Henri K.

P.S. - Regristration for new membership is free.

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## Brainsucker

Economic superpower said:


> Yes a milestone indeed.
> 
> CIA didn't give you the briefing?



Oh my, you are CIA, Economic Superpower? I'm surprise  But well, I don't care if you're CIA, or other spy. let just enjoy the forum together


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## cirr



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## hk299792458

cirr said:


> View attachment 336088



It is not a missile, it is the responsive luancher CZ-11 from CASC. You should put it in space thread.

Henri K.


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## 星海军事

hk299792458 said:


> New ABM (??) test could have been carried out this morning.
> 
> http://www.eastpendulum.com/nouvel-abm-20-septembre
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Henri K.
> 
> P.S. - Regristration for new membership is free.


How did you find these NOTAMs?


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## hk299792458

星海军事 said:


> How did you find these NOTAMs?



You can find all NOTAM either with FAA or EASA.

I'm not sure because I never tried but I think CAAC should have same kind of service.

Henri K.


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## 星海军事

hk299792458 said:


> You can find all NOTAM either with FAA or EASA.
> 
> I'm not sure because I never tried but I think CAAC should have same kind of service.
> 
> Henri K.



I searched on https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/ for NOTAM in key FIRs in China, but found nothing related


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## hk299792458

星海军事 said:


> I searched on https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/ for NOTAM in key FIRs in China, but found nothing related



Because they only keep upcoming NOTAM, not those which past already.

Henri K.


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## ahojunk

*Is China Really Building Missiles With Artificial Intelligence?*
There are real limits on the amount of AI acceptable to navy commanders.

By Abhijit Singh, The Diplomat
September 21, 2016

With rising security challenges in the global commons, there is growing interest in the subject of “intelligent” weapons systems. This is especially so in the maritime realm, where recent studies have shown that precision-guided weaponry and networked systems are likely to play an increasingly important role. Even while accepting autonomous systems as the future of maritime warfare, however, many find the subject of “intelligent weapon systems” to be deeply contentious.

A good point of departure for the discussion on autonomous combat systems is a recent report in the Chinese media about the development of a family of cruise missiles with artificial intelligence (AI) capabilities. In August this year, a Chinese daily reported that China’s aerospace industry was developing tactical missiles with inbuilt intelligence that would help seek out targets in combat. The “plug and play” approach, a Chinese aerospace executive pointed out, could potentially enable China’s military commanders to launch missiles tailor made for specific combat conditions.

Oddly enough, no clarifications were offered for what “tailor made cruise missiles with high levels of artificial intelligence and automation” really meant. Apart from reiterating China’s global leadership status in the field of artificial intelligence, the Chinese source did not provide any insight into the specific nature of autonomous capability being developed.

The issue for many naval commanders is the dichotomy between the theoretical definition of Artificial Intelligence and its popular interpretation. Technically, AI is any onboard intelligence that allows machines in combat to execute regular tasks, allowing humans more time to focus on demanding and complex missions. Modern-day combat requires war-fighters to operate with the active assistance from sensors and systems. In theory, AI provides the technology to augment human analysis and decision-making by capturing knowledge that can be re-applied in critical situations. It purports to change the human role from “in-the-loop” controller to “on-the-loop” thinker who can focus on a more reflective assessment of problems and strategies, guiding rather than being buried in execution detail.

In practice, however, Artificial Intelligence is a term used for a combat system that has the ability to take targeting decisions. This is more in the nature of “who to target,” as opposed to “how to target,” which is anyway a task that guided missiles have been performing with some precision. It’s worth emphasizing that maritime forces remain skeptical of autonomous weapon systems with independent targeting capability. In the nautical realm, the launch of a missile on an enemy platform is an act of war. The decision to execute a missile launch is the exclusive preserve of the command team (led by the ship’s captain), which must independently assess the threat and act in pursuit of war objectives.

Despite several advancements allowing for a more precise targeting of platforms, the logic of maritime operations hasn’t fundamentally changed. As a result, naval missiles haven’t been invested with any serious intelligence to make command decisions to target enemy units. While their ability to strike targets has been radically enhanced — through the use of superior onboard gyros, computing systems, and track radars — the basic mode of operation of cruise missiles remains the same.

To be sure, Artificial Intelligence is considered indispensable in the development of new-age naval weapons, in particular hypersonic missiles. After China’s recent high-speed (over Mach 10), “extreme maneuvers” hypersonic tests, it is amply clear that future combat missions will require a human-machine interface on an unprecedented scale; which is why four other Asian states — Japan, India, South Korea, and Taiwan — have been developing supersonic and hypersonic systems. Each one of them has expressed an aspiration for a sophisticated maritime force, with long range sensors, armor protection, precision weapons, and networking technologies. Yet none has been developing naval missile systems with artificial intelligence.

A useful illustration of the predicament that AI poses for the naval community is the U.S. Navy’s Long Range Anti-Ship Missile (LRASM). Often portrayed by senior officers as a single-shot remedy for America’s surface-combat deficit at sea, the LRASM is a replacement for the Harpoon missile (albeit a more powerful version) and a supposedly “intelligent” missile system. Guided first by ship-borne equipment and then by satellite, the projectile is jam-resistant and capable of operations without the Global Positioning System. Flying through a series of way-points, evading static threats, land features, and commercial shipping, the LRASM has the capability to detect threats independently, and navigate around them.

The nature of the LRASM’s “intelligence,” however, tells a story. The missile is smart enough to avoid the engagement zone of an enemy ship that is not on the target list. To bypass enemy warships that aren’t on the target list, it skips way-points that lie within their weapons-engagement range. With an inbuilt capability to dive to sea-skimming altitude in its approach to the target vessel, the missile can strike at an independently calculated “mean point of impact.”

Notwithstanding its considerable computing and processing capabilities, however, the LRASM does not select its target in flight. Human operators feed that information into the missile, providing it with a continuous stream of data. In crime-investigation lingo, the missile is not the mastermind of the encounter; only the assassin. This also demonstrates of the limits of artificial intelligence, where the missile makes its own decisions only after it receives critical targeting information from the command team. Despite its coordinated attack capabilities, the LRASM cannot be termed as a fully autonomous weapon.

Understandably, the debate surrounding artificial intelligence and autonomous naval platforms is a contentious one. AI might have the potential to radicalize naval operations at sea, but many maritime practitioners are uncomfortable with its use in combat – particularly the development of lethal autonomous weapons systems (LAWS). The ethical dilemma arises from the LAWS’ ability to kill people, and policymakers’ reservations about inanimate systems that can take decisions to terminate lives.

It is instructive that while the U.S. Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) has, in recent years, developed programs that envisages the use of LAWS, these apply only to Collaborative Operations in Denied Environment (CODE) — where autonomous aerial vehicles must only target enemy platforms in situations where signal-jamming makes communication between human commanders impossible.

Here too, there is a debate about its humanitarian implications, because international humanitarian law — which governs attacks on humans in times of war — has no specific provisions for such autonomy. The 1949 Geneva Convention on humane conduct in war requires any attack to satisfy three criteria: military necessity; discrimination between combatants and non-combatants; and proportionality between the value of the military objective and the potential for collateral damage. Evidently, these are subjective judgments no current AI system seems able to fully to satisfy.

In the absence of consensus around “artificially intelligent” weapons, autonomous naval combat systems are yet to find ready acceptance in the military. Navy officials aren’t against the use of AI technologies to hasten command and control processes and human decision-making on naval platforms, but it is unlikely they will easily acquiesce to weapon systems taking independent targeting decisions.

_Abhijit Singh is a Senior Fellow at the Observer Research Foundation at New Delhi. His recent report on Unmanned and Autonomous Vehicles and Future Maritime Operations in Littoral Asia elaborates on issues covered in this piece._

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## hk299792458

Another test flight

http://www.eastpendulum.com/tir-essai-balistique-22-septembre

Henri K.


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## hk299792458

An another double flight test

http://www.eastpendulum.com/nouveau-double-tir-essai-23-septembre

Henri K.


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## cirr

Lots of activities(weapons tests) in the gobi desert.

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## hk299792458

cirr said:


> Lots of activities(weapons tests) in the gobi desert.



Not Gobi.

Henri K.


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## Economic superpower

hk299792458 said:


> Another test flight
> 
> http://www.eastpendulum.com/tir-essai-balistique-22-septembre
> 
> Henri K.





hk299792458 said:


> An another double flight test
> 
> http://www.eastpendulum.com/nouveau-double-tir-essai-23-septembre
> 
> Henri K.



Your blog is in French. 

English?


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## hk299792458

Economic superpower said:


> Your blog is in French.
> 
> English?



Still working on it.

Henri K.


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## hk299792458

Fourth ballistic test in three days time

http://www.eastpendulum.com/essai-balistique-24-septembre

Henri K.

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## cirr

hk299792458 said:


> Not Gobi.
> 
> Henri K.



Listen dude, the whole Northwest China outside the Jiayuguan Pass is generally known as the Gobi desert.


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## hk299792458

cirr said:


> Listen dude, the whole Northwest China outside the Jiayuguan Pass is generally known as the Gobi desert.



The recent tests are both in the area of Taklamakan desert, not in Gobi, even in a "general" way of speaking.

Henri K.


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## cirr

hk299792458 said:


> The recent tests are both in the area of Taklamakan desert, not in Gobi, even in a "general" way of speaking.
> 
> Henri K.



The Taklamakan desert is part of what is generally known and termed as "gebidamo-戈壁大漠“ in Chinese and Gobi desert in English.

Let me repeat: the whole of northwest China west of the Jiayuguan Pass is popularly known by the name of "Gobi desert".

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## Beast

cirr said:


> The Taklamakan desert is part of what is generally known and termed as "gebidamo-戈壁大漠“ in Chinese and Gobi desert in English.
> 
> Let me repeat: the whole of northwest China west of the Jiayuguan Pass is popularly known by the name of "Gobi desert".


I would trust a Chinese than a whiteman on Chinese matter.

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## hk299792458

cirr said:


> The Taklamakan desert is part of what is generally known and termed as "gebidamo-戈壁大漠“ in Chinese and Gobi desert in English.
> 
> Let me repeat: the whole of northwest China west of the Jiayuguan Pass is popularly known by the name of "Gobi desert".



Even a whiteman knows this, but the strict fact is, the recent tests occured in Taklamakan, not in Gobi, from a pure geographical point of view.

You want to be "general" and to use the larger terme Gobi, I don't really care, but this doesn't change the fact that those tests were carried out in Taklamakan, from a pure geographical point of view.

I love things to be precise, but I can tolerate approximation. We can argue for months, but this won't change anything in my mind, even if I understand what you mean.



Beast said:


> I would trust a Chinese than a whiteman on Chinese matter.



From time to time, you might have surprise. 

Henri K.

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## cirr



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## grey boy 2

HQ-16 on actions

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## grey boy 2

DF-21 C

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## 艹艹艹



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## 艹艹艹



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## grey boy 2

HQ-16 being mass deployed 陆军已大量装备红旗16防空导弹

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## grey boy 2

HQ-16 being mass deployed 陆军已大量装备红旗16防空导弹

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## Zarvan

China has successfully completed a live-firing demonstration of its new HQ-17 medium-range anti-air missile system. The HQ-17 missile system of 38th Mechanized Group Army has successfully conducted live-fire exercises.

The new HQ-17 medium-range anti-air missile system bears strong resemblance to the Russian Tor-M1 missile system. The only difference is that the new Chinese missile system has identification, friend or foe (IFF) array on top of an electronically scanned radar.

The HQ-17 may have a short range, but manufacturer claims for its Tor-M1 relative claim that it has a 90% probably of destroying cruise missiles. That was reported bywww.popsci.com.

The HQ-17 is rugged enough to keep up with frontline units like tank battalions, as seen here with the 41st Group Army in Guangzhou Province, and protect them from helicopter and drone attacks. At the same time, its vertically launched missiles allows the Tor M1/HQ-17 to engage multiple cruise missiles like the American Tomahawk or Taiwanese HF-IIE aimed at Chinese command and control infrastructure.










HQ-17 medium-range anti-air missile system



HQ-17 medium-range anti-air missile system



HQ-17 medium-range anti-air missile system




http://defence-blog.com/news/china-...opy-of-the-russian-tor-m1-missile-system.html

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## tarrar

Excellent & congrats to China on successful test of their new air defence system. 

This is what Pakistan needs & I am pretty sure Pakistan is going to acquire them in the future. Russians have already offered Pakistan Tor M1, but now HQ17 is a strong contender & surely Pakistan is going to acquire them. Not only Pakistan will be able to target enemy aircraft but also their Cruise missiles.

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## princefaisal

TOR M2 is much better and need to be considered for Pakistan Army.

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## illusion8

tarrar said:


> Excellent & congrats to China on successful test of their new air defence system.
> 
> This is what Pakistan needs & I am pretty sure Pakistan is going to acquire them in the future. Russians have already offered Pakistan Tor M1, but now HQ17 is a strong contender & surely Pakistan is going to acquire them. Not only Pakistan will be able to target enemy aircraft but also their Cruise missiles.



One is a copy and the other is the original, I am sure PA would prefer the original, the Russians would prefer hard cash.


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## Bravo Lion

MASHALLAH Congratulation’s to our Chinese brothers.

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## Beast

princefaisal said:


> TOR M2 is much better and need to be considered for Pakistan Army.


On what basics?

http://www.popsci.com/blog-network/eastern-arsenal/hq-17-classic-russian-missile-new-chinese-twist



illusion8 said:


> One is a copy and the other is the original, I am sure PA would prefer the original, the Russians would prefer hard cash.


J-15 a copy of Su-33 has much higher thrust engine, using 3D printing and composite to produce lighter and stronger airframe than old Su-33. The avionics has a massive upgrade of using AESA radar compare to doppler pulse Su-33.

So your point?

https://defence.pk/threads/hq-17-joint-pla-army-new-field-sam-system.351551/

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## Akasa

illusion8 said:


> One is a copy and the other is the original, I am sure PA would prefer the original, the Russians would prefer hard cash.



The HQ-17 is not an exact copy; it features key improvements, such as a phased-array radar, IFF antenna, and differing datalinks.

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## Deino

Beast said:


> ...
> 
> J-15 a copy of Su-33 has much higher thrust engine, using 3D printing and composite to produce lighter and stronger airframe than old Su-33. The avionics has a massive upgrade of using AESA radar compare to doppler pulse Su-33.
> 
> .../




Again NO, it uses exactly the same engines, is probably a bit lighter but avionics-wise uses the same radar like the J-11B ... only the J-15A or T if You like maybe.


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## WaLeEdK2

As long as it gets the job done; no one care if it is a copy it or not.

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## cirr

This is nothing new. HQ-17 has been in service with the PLA for years. Test firing of the missiles is routine in this kind of drills.

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## 艹艹艹

*DF-21C on the plateau*

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## princefaisal

Beast said:


> On what basics?


Sorry, I mean to say *Buk M3* as its *target-destruction probability has reached 0.9999 and its maximum destruction range now stands at 70 kilometers. *A battery of Buk-M3 missiles can track and engage up to 36 targets simultaneously, while its advanced 9R31M missile is capable of knocking down all existing flying objects, including highly maneuverable ones, even during active electronic jamming.


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## Beast

princefaisal said:


> Sorry, I mean to say *Buk M3* as its *target-destruction probability has reached 0.9999 and its maximum destruction range now stands at 70 kilometers. *A battery of Buk-M3 missiles can track and engage up to 36 targets simultaneously, while its advanced 9R31M missile is capable of knocking down all existing flying objects, including highly maneuverable ones, even during active electronic jamming.


Buk M3 is different beast compare to Tor M. You are comparing and Apple to orange. Saying Russian Tor M is better than HQ-17 is actually without basics and no backing.

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## princefaisal

Beast said:


> Buk M3 is different beast compare to Tor M. You are comparing and Apple to orange. Saying Russian Tor M is better than HQ-17 is actually without basics and no backing.


For short range, FM-90 is enough for Pakistan.


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## grey boy 2

Judgement Day Express (DF-41 ICBM rail version) 中国版末日列车:东风41导弹铁路运输车疑曝光

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## 艹艹艹

grey boy 2 said:


> Judgement Day Express (DF-41 ICBM rail version) 中国版末日列车:东风41导弹铁路运输车疑曝光


*Missile train*

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## cirr



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## 艹艹艹

cirr said:


> View attachment 342028
> 
> 
> View attachment 342029
> 
> 
> View attachment 342030
> 
> 
> View attachment 342031
> 
> 
> View attachment 342032
> 
> 
> View attachment 342033
> 
> 
> View attachment 342034
> 
> 
> View attachment 342035


*Missile train*

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## monitor



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## monitor

* Chinese Brahmos like Supersonic Cruise missle CX 1 *

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## monitor



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## Beast

monitor said:


>



Last Zhuhai airshow is mock up. This time they show real business... I am sure they are already ready buyer.


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## ChineseLuver

Beast said:


> Last Zhuhai airshow is mock up. This time they show real business... I am sure they are already ready buyer.


The aesthetic itself is already a winner with that launch vehicle compared to the mother of all missile of a certain race that keeps mentioning it


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## Malik Alashter

Beast said:


> Zhuhai airshow


when is
coming


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## nomi007

any video available of ws-43 demonstration

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## cirr

CCTV Documentary aired on 23.10.2016: Internet makes missile factory highly automated

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## Hindustani78

Is China's New Short-Range Missile System Designed to Compete With Iskander?
https://sputniknews.com/military/201610261046764752-donfeng12-vs-iskander-analysis/






19:04 26.10.2016
Next week, China is expected to formally reveal an export version of its *Dongfeng 12 mobile short range missile system at China Airshow-2016.* Commenting on the new weapon, which bears a superficial resemblance to Russia's Iskander, Russian observers suggest it is an indication of the rapid progress made by China's defense complex in recent years. On Friday, independent military news website Defense Blog published photos of a *dual-launch platform carrying the Dongfeng 12 (DF-12) short range ballistic missile, expected to be officially unveiled at Airshow China-2016, taking place in Zhuhai, Guangdong province next week. *

The website pointed out that the new tactical missile system seems to have similar characteristics, and is even superficially similar in appearance, to Russia's 9K720 Iskander missile system. The Chinese system is said to have an official range between 100 and 280 km, with an actual possible range of as much as 400 km. Unlike the Iskander, the system's inertial and satellite guidance-equipped missiles are configured in dual launch configuration aboard an 8x8 truck chassis. 

The system's precise technical characteristics are being kept a secret, but could be officially revealed at Zhuhai next week. Asked to comment on the system, and whether it will pose any threat to the export-potential of Russia's Iskander, military analysts told the independent online newspaper Svobodnaya Pressa that this depends on a combination of factors. 

Commenting on the rumored superficial similarity between the two systems, Col. Gen. Viktor Esin, former chief of staff of Russia's Strategic Missile Forces, told the online resource that it is no secret that China has made extensive use of technologies borrowed from abroad to develop its weapons in the past. Countries in the former USSR and the Soviet bloc, particularly Ukraine, have assisted them in doing so, he added.






The officer noted that "as far as the M20 [another name for the Dongfeng 12] is concerned, little is known about it, but I would not speak about it being a direct derivation." In fact, "in its technical characteristics, the Chinese system appears more like an improved version of the Tochka-U tactical missile complex than a rough analogue to the Iskander."


"The range of the export version of the Chinese system, in accordance with the Missile Technology Control Regime [an international agreement aimed at preventing the proliferation of missile technology] is 280 km. According to my sources, the system's CEP (circular error probable) is less than 30 meters. In other words, we are talking about a highly accurate missile which by all accounts was put into service in 2013 under the name DF-12. To achieve an accuracy of less than 30 meters, it's necessary to be able to control the rocket in flight, and we know that the Chinese have an analogue to the GPS – the BeiDou navigation satellite system."






Esin pointed out that even without the new system, China's arsenal of missile systems is already very large. *"This includes the DF-11 (whose range is 300-800 km), and the DF-15 (up to 1,000 km) of various modifications, as well as the new DF-16. Very large variations exist in data regarding the number of such weapons.* According to my information, *the Chinese have at least 300 DF-11 systems, not less than 500 DF-15s*, and between* 30-50 D-16s*, which have just now started to come online. All of them have *two variants in terms of armament – conventional and nuclear.* According to available information, about *10-15% of DF-11s, and 20-25% of DF-15s, are equipped with nuclear warheads." 
*

Most of these systems are deployed against India and Taiwan, with those deployed in Taiwan's direction not nuclear-armed, the officer added. 

For his part, military analyst Alexander Khramchihin explained that the overall strategy of China's military industrial complex has been the development of large numbers of missile systems. "Their tactical missiles may not be perfect, but they are banking on numbers –even if enemy air and missile defenses take some of them down, some will still make it through to their targets." The analyst suggested that the numbers of DF-11s and DF-15s China has deployed could actually range in the thousands.

Asked about the role borrowed technology has played in building up China's tactical missile potential, Khramchihin noted that basically,* "the basis of all Chinese equipment is Soviet technology, with Western tech comprising only a small segment – mostly in helicopter and torpedo designs. *China is similar in this regard to the Soviet Union: it copies technologies, and then 'Sinifies' them – that is, gradually develops them to make them their own."

"This takes place in all areas, including tactical missiles," the analyst stressed. "Chinese tactical missiles have good demand in the global weapons market, first and foremost in the Middle East. The export version of the M20 may well find its niche." 

Andrei Frolov, editor-in-chief of 'Arms Export' magazine, explained that unlike Russia, which has been reticent to export its missile technology (the only other country operating Iskander is Armenia), China has actively pursued potential foreign markets. 

"In other words, in this segment there are the Americans with their MGM-140 Army Tactical Missile System (ATACMS), and the Chinese. China is not competing with us in this area, for the simple reason that we have basically withdrawn, and did not export SRBM systems to Syria, or elsewhere. Incidentally, Ukraine may prove to be a conditional competitor for us with their Grom SRBM, whose development is being financed by Saudi Arabia. Here it would be more correct to talk about the sale of technology, rather than a finished system."






At the same time, Frolov pointed out that multiple rocket launcher systems (MRL/MRLS) "are now actively replacing tactical missile systems on the market, because they have almost the same range. For example, *the Belarusian MLRS Polonaise*, created with China's help, is comparable in its characteristics to the export version of the Iskander SRBM. Meanwhile, Russia has actively marketed the Smerch MLRS, selling it, for example, to Azerbaijan and Algeria." 

Finally, China expert Vassily Kashin told the online paper that all discussion regarding the Dongfeng 12's characteristics remains little more than speculation. Moreover, the analyst noted, the system may actually turn out to be a platform for launching a variety of weapons, from SRBMs to supersonic cruise missiles and heavy MLRS. 






ashin stressed that "China's missile industry is factually the most dynamic branch of their military industrial complex. In this area the Chinese stopped copying foreign models fairly early on. They generally regard ballistic missiles as a priority, since their development allows them to compensate for the relative weakness of its aircraft in relation to the US. Their export potential is fairly large too."

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## aliaselin

HQ-26？

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## Akasa

aliaselin said:


> HQ-26？
> View attachment 347560



Could you provide a bit more context?

EDIT:
Some more information about the test:
- 3 missiles were tested
- They could only fit inside the Type 055's 9m CCL vertical launch system cells (the booster itself takes up over 4 meters of the missile) -- they were cold-launched
- Diameter of the missile is estimated at 850 mm.


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## aliaselin

SinoSoldier said:


> Could you provide a bit more context?
> 
> EDIT:
> Some more information about the test:
> - 3 missiles were tested
> - They could only fit inside the Type 055's 9m CCL vertical launch system cells (the booster itself takes up over 4 meters of the missile) -- they were cold-launched
> - Diameter of the missile is estimated at 850 mm.


How did you get so much information from the picture


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## yusheng

M20 
Without the traditional instrument module, the front end of the cable duct is directly connected with the big warhead, and the head body is not separated. There are four covers, respectively corresponding aiming system / guidance system and warhead control system. All moving tail rudder + composite attitude control，the missile all-range high-speed maneuvering flight,。

M20 surface to surface missile with a range of 280 kilometers, the circular error probability is less than 30 meters.. the maximum Maher number is 6, the maximum flight height of not more than 50 kilometers, high maneuverabe to implement vertical attack on the target at the end of the flight.

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## Akasa

aliaselin said:


> How did you get so much information from the picture



These statements are from rumors and/or subsequent analyses, not the pictures themselves.


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## cirr

aliaselin said:


> HQ-26？
> View attachment 347560




More likely the shipborne version of HQ-19

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> More likely the shipborne version of HQ-19



In other words, the HQ-26?


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## cirr

SinoSoldier said:


> In other words, the HQ-26?



HQ-19 is more like SM3, THAAD-ER, GBI etc rolled into one.

HQ-26 ？？

HQ-29 is PACIII

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> HQ-19 is more like SM3, THAAD-ER, GBI etc rolled into one.
> 
> HQ-26 ？？
> 
> HQ-29 is PACIII



Isn't the HQ-26 the SM-3-type missile? My post generally agrees with yours, that the missile in the photo is an SM-3 equivalent.


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## aliaselin

SinoSoldier said:


> These statements are from rumors and/or subsequent analyses, not the pictures themselves.


850mm is the diameter of the launcher


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## Deino

Was this already posted ??? IMO (at least as far as I remember) the first image of a YJ-12 during launch ....

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## hk299792458

New test flight on November 1st

http://www.eastpendulum.com/essai-balistique-lancement-1er-novembre

Henri K.


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## ahojunk

*World's best' anti-ship missile a showstopper*
2016-11-07 09:49 | China Daily | _Editor: Xu Shanshan_

China's largest missile-maker is promoting what it calls "the world's best anti-ship missile" for sales in the international market.

China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, one of the main defense equipment suppliers in the nation, is marketing its CM-302 supersonic anti-ship cruise missile to nations hoping to improve their naval capabilities.

*CM-302 is the best anti-ship missile available on the world's arms market and "it's not an exaggeration"*, said Lyu Xiaoge, spokesman for the State-owned defense technology giant, who spoke to China Daily on the sidelines of the 2016 Zhuhai Airshow.

The justification for the statement is that the missile can fly at supersonic speeds during its entire 290-kilometer trajectory, and it can be mounted on ships, aircraft or ground vehicles. It can be used to knock out land targets as well, Lyu said.

Offerings from competitors do not have such advantages, Lyu said. "They can be supersonic only during one certain part of the flight and can't be mounted on multiple platforms."

Only two other supersonic anti-ship missiles are available in the market: Russia's P-800 Oniks, also known as the SS-N-26 Strobile, and BrahMos, a joint development by Russia and India.

The most widely sold anti-ship missiles are the United States' Harpoon series, which have a maximum range of 280 km, the first of which entered into service in the 1970s, according to Cao Weidong, a researcher with the People's Liberation Army Naval Military Studies Research Institute.

Lyu said market research shows that "many nations" need potent weapons like the CM-302 to beef up their maritime defenses.

The missile, designed for export, resembles the YJ-12 heavy-duty, supersonic anti-ship cruise missile that made its debut at the V-Day military parade in Beijing in September of last year.

Aside from speed and flexibility, the CM-302 also has a greater ability to penetrate defenses and greater destructive power than others in the market, Lyu said.

He said only one CM-302 is capable of disabling a 5,000-metric-ton guided missile destroyer.

"I believe our clients will be highly interested," he said, noting that the CM-302 was one of the Chinese products that had attracted the most inquiries during the six-day Zhuhai Airshow, which ended on Sunday.

"They know we'll satisfy their maritime defense strategy on only a limited budget," Lyu said, although he declined to quote the missile's price.

Brochures from CM-302's developer, CASIC Third Academy, call the missile an effective weapon for use against large warships, including aircraft carriers and destroyers. CM-302 is characterized by its small size, light weight, strong power, modular design and high accuracy, the academy said.

With a 250-kilogram warhead, CM-302 is capable of approaching the target in a sea-skimming mode and maneuvering before striking, which makes it hard to intercept, said Yin Lixin, a senior researcher with the CASIC Third Academy.

It boasts a high accuracy rate of about 90 percent, designers said.

Military observers said China's best anti-ship missile for its own use is the YJ-18, also developed by the CASIC Third Academy. Some observers report that the YJ-18 has an even longer range of 540 km, and a cruise speed of 966 kilometers per hour. When approaching a target, its warhead can accelerate to three times the speed of sound.

The biennial Zhuhai Airshow, officially known as China International Aviation and Aerospace Exhibition, claims to be the largest arms exhibition in Asia. It is held in Zhuhai, Guangdong province.

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## cirr

ahojunk said:


> *World's best' anti-ship missile a showstopper*
> 2016-11-07 09:49 | China Daily | _Editor: Xu Shanshan_
> 
> China's largest missile-maker is promoting what it calls "the world's best anti-ship missile" for sales in the international market.
> 
> China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, one of the main defense equipment suppliers in the nation, is marketing its CM-302 supersonic anti-ship cruise missile to nations hoping to improve their naval capabilities.
> 
> *CM-302 is the best anti-ship missile available on the world's arms market and "it's not an exaggeration"*, said Lyu Xiaoge, spokesman for the State-owned defense technology giant, who spoke to China Daily on the sidelines of the 2016 Zhuhai Airshow.
> 
> The justification for the statement is that the missile can fly at supersonic speeds during its entire 290-kilometer trajectory, and it can be mounted on ships, aircraft or ground vehicles. It can be used to knock out land targets as well, Lyu said.
> 
> Offerings from competitors do not have such advantages, Lyu said. "They can be supersonic only during one certain part of the flight and can't be mounted on multiple platforms."
> 
> Only two other supersonic anti-ship missiles are available in the market: Russia's P-800 Oniks, also known as the SS-N-26 Strobile, and BrahMos, a joint development by Russia and India.
> 
> The most widely sold anti-ship missiles are the United States' Harpoon series, which have a maximum range of 280 km, the first of which entered into service in the 1970s, according to Cao Weidong, a researcher with the People's Liberation Army Naval Military Studies Research Institute.
> 
> Lyu said market research shows that "many nations" need potent weapons like the CM-302 to beef up their maritime defenses.
> 
> The missile, designed for export, resembles the YJ-12 heavy-duty, supersonic anti-ship cruise missile that made its debut at the V-Day military parade in Beijing in September of last year.
> 
> Aside from speed and flexibility, the CM-302 also has a greater ability to penetrate defenses and greater destructive power than others in the market, Lyu said.
> 
> He said only one CM-302 is capable of disabling a 5,000-metric-ton guided missile destroyer.
> 
> "I believe our clients will be highly interested," he said, noting that the CM-302 was one of the Chinese products that had attracted the most inquiries during the six-day Zhuhai Airshow, which ended on Sunday.
> 
> "They know we'll satisfy their maritime defense strategy on only a limited budget," Lyu said, although he declined to quote the missile's price.
> 
> Brochures from CM-302's developer, CASIC Third Academy, call the missile an effective weapon for use against large warships, including aircraft carriers and destroyers. CM-302 is characterized by its small size, light weight, strong power, modular design and high accuracy, the academy said.
> 
> With a 250-kilogram warhead, CM-302 is capable of approaching the target in a sea-skimming mode and maneuvering before striking, which makes it hard to intercept, said Yin Lixin, a senior researcher with the CASIC Third Academy.
> 
> It boasts a high accuracy rate of about 90 percent, designers said.
> 
> Military observers said China's best anti-ship missile for its own use is the YJ-18, also developed by the CASIC Third Academy. Some observers report that the YJ-18 has an even longer range of 540 km, and a cruise speed of 966 kilometers per hour. When approaching a target, its warhead can accelerate to three times the speed of sound.
> 
> The biennial Zhuhai Airshow, officially known as China International Aviation and Aerospace Exhibition, claims to be the largest arms exhibition in Asia. It is held in Zhuhai, Guangdong province.



YJ-12 is better than CM-302, pitty though the former is NOT on the world's arms market.

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## Deino

cirr said:


> YJ-12 is better than CM-302, pitty though the former is NOT on the world's arms market.




But isn't the CM-302 simply the export version for the YJ-12?


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## ashok321

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/17...s_Best__Anti_ship_Cruise_Missile#.WCDUO_k2vIV









*China unveiled its CM-302 supersonic missile for international export and says it is the ‘best anti-ship cruise missile’ in the world.

Lyu Xiaoge, spokesman for China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp touted CM-30 as better than the available supersonic anti-ship missile of the likes of the Indo-Russian BrahMos missile, and Russian SSN-26 Strobile.*

CM-302 is the best anti-ship missile available on the world's arms market and "it's not an exaggeration", Lyu was quoted as saying by China Daily on the sidelines of the 2016 Zhuhai Airshow Monday.

*The justification for the statement is that the missile can fly at supersonic speeds during its entire 290-kilometer trajectory, and it can be mounted on ships, aircraft or ground vehicles. It can be used to knock out land targets as well, Lyu said.*

*Offerings from competitors do not have such advantages, Lyu said. "They can be supersonic only during one certain part of the flight and can't be mounted on multiple platforms."*

BrahMos, like CM-302 is a supersonic cruise missile. It is the world’s fastest missile in operation till date with speeds of Mach 2.8 to 3.0. CM-302 is speculated to have 2.5 times the speed of sound. BrahMos has both land and ship launched versions which are already in service and the air and submarine-launched versions are currently in the testing phase. *BrahMos-II presently under development is aiming at speed of Mach 7 to 8 to boost aerial fast strike capability. It is expected to be ready for testing by 2017.*

CASIC claims CM-302 can fly at supersonic speeds during its entire 290-km (range) trajectory.

CM-302 missile using compact solid fuel ramjet engine in high trajectory mode, the maximum range can reach up to 290 km, if the use of sea-skimming low-altitude trajectory, "range will be reduced to some extent." It can be mounted on ships, aircraft or ground vehicles. BrahMos also flies at a range of 290 km trajectory.

The ship-launched and the land based BrahMos can carry a 200kg warhead whereas the CM-302 can carry up to 250 kg warhead. The air-launched version's will be test-fired from Su-30MKI by the end of this year. A decommissioned Indian Navy warship is expected to the target for the super-sonic cruise missile traveling at almost three times the speed of sound targeting a range between 300 and 600 km following India’s entry into the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR).

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/17...s_Best__Anti_ship_Cruise_Missile#.WCDUO_k2vIV

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## Akasa

ashok321 said:


> It is the world’s fastest missile in operation till date with speeds of Mach 2.8 to 3.0. CM-302 is speculated to have 2.5 times the speed of sound.



Not necessarily true nowadays. The YJ-12 is believed to be able to achieve up to Mach 4 in terminal speed. The CX-1 missile can achieve Mach 2.8-3.0 while the YJ-18 is has a top speed of 2.5-3.0.

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## Zarvan

The CM-302 missile exhibited at Airshow China 2016 is being marketed for export as the world's best anti-ship missile, according to Chinese news media. Source: Via sina.com.cn
The CM-302 missile exhibited at Airshow China 2016 is being marketed for export as "the world's best anti-ship missile", according to Chinese news media.

The missile's manufacturer, state-owned China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC), reportedly justifies the claim on the grounds that the missile is supersonic throughout its flight, can be launched from air, land, and naval platforms, and used in a land attack role.

A report published by the _China Daily_ newspaper also confirmed that the CM-302, which was allegedly one of the exhibits to have attracted the most enquiries at this year's air show in Zhuhai, is closely related to the YJ-12 supersonic anti-ship missile (ASM), which is in service with China's armed forces.

The report states that the CM-302 has a range of 280 km, a warhead of 250 kg, and a 90% probability of hitting its target. CASIC claims that the missile is effective against large warships, such as aircraft carriers and destroyers, with a single missile having the capacity to disable a 5,000-tonne warship.

While the news report provides few details about the CM-302's propulsion and flight profile, it said that the missile sea-skims for most of the flight and manoeuvres during the terminal phase to defeat the defensive weapons of ships.

Previously published reports about the YJ-12 indicate that the ramjet-powered missile achieves a mid-course speed of Mach 1.5-2, accelerating to Mach 3 or higher during the terminal phase of the flight.

The missile is guided by satellite navigation - specifically by China's BeiDou Navigation Satellite System - to a target location, which can be updated by data link. Terminal homing is driven by an active radar seeker.

Assuming the missile's physical characteristics are similar to those of the YJ-12, the CM-302 is likely to be a large missile of around 7 m in length, 0.6 m diameter, and with an estimated weight of around 2,000-2,500 kg.

*Want to read more? For analysis on this article and access to all our insight content, please enquire about our subscription options　**ihs.com/contact*




To read the full article, Client Login
(337 of 917 words)

http://www.janes.com/article/65364/china-offers-export-version-of-yj-12-supersonic-anti-ship-missile

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## Zarvan

*





The Chinese military company has unveiled new multi-purpose anti-tank guided missile system. The new multi-purpose missile system consists of a cross-country YJ2080 (4×4) chassis with a fully protected cab with automatic launcher for Siber-ER missiles.*

Is designed to engage existing and future combat tanks protected by explosive reactive armor, light armored vehicles, fortifications, surface low-speed air targets (helicopters, UAVs, assault aircrafts) by day and at night in adverse weather conditions as well as in optical and radio jamming environment.

The chassis is designated as YJ2080 Sentinel in Chinese service. BYMC has fully localized the manufacturing process of the MUV. Its armoured hull is identical to the original Russian Tigr vehicle. The Chinese variant of the Tigr MUV has been unveiled at the China Military and Civilian Integration Expo 2016 (July 4 – July 6, 2016) in Beijing.

The new Chinese multi-purpose anti-tank guided missile system closely resembles the Russian Kornet-EM multi-purpose long-range antitank guided missile system.











http://defence-blog.com/news/china-...-that-looks-similar-to-russian-kornet-em.html

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## Akasa

A more accurate comparator to the Kornet-EM would be the HJ-8; the Saber-ER missile likely uses infrared-homing like the HJ-12 or TS-01. The Kornet-EM, on the other hand, uses SACLOS.

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## Zarvan

SinoSoldier said:


> A more accurate comparator to the Kornet-EM would be the HJ-8; the Saber-ER missile likely uses infrared-homing like the HJ-12 or TS-01. The Kornet-EM, on the other hand, uses SACLOS.
> 
> View attachment 350728
> 
> View attachment 350729


Chinese forums are suggesting that Pakistan is buying 170 units of these. Is it right ?


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## Akasa

Zarvan said:


> Chinese forums are suggesting that Pakistan is buying 170 units of these. Is it right ?



Not sure. So far these are only PDF rumors.


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## Zaslon

I wonder if China will actually use some of these for their own armed forces or just planning to export them, either way keep it up China

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## IblinI

Zaslon said:


> I wonder if China will actually use some of these for their own armed forces or just planning to export them, either way keep it up China


The Police force has already purchased them in counter terrorism.

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## TaimiKhan

SinoSoldier said:


> Not sure. So far these are only PDF rumors.



But i believe the rumor was posted by a chinese friend and not Pakistanis. It was posted in the Zhuhai airshow thread.

If true, we are ourselves shocked as never heard of any such system being bought.

https://defence.pk/threads/zhuhai-airshow-china-2016.456208/page-53#post-8883130

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## zestokryl

Who is the developer of the Sabre missile series ?

There was HJ 12 by NORINCO, Poly s group fire and forget missile system and now Sabre ?

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## GS Zhou

zestokryl said:


> Who is the developer of the Sabre missile series ?


the system is developed by a company called Aerospace Jiacheng, a private company based in Beijing

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## zestokryl

GS Zhou said:


> the system is developed by a company called Aerospace Jiacheng, a private company based in Beijing



Tnx, thats wonderful. Since even, private companies in China can build fire and forget and NLOS missile systems, and Russia, Iran and India can only dream about having indigenous designs

There should be much more advertising of those. Is the Sabre, finally tested and ready for sales ? Slide from previous page claims two modifications are ready, can you add some detail from chines internet ? Tnx in advance

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## GS Zhou

zestokryl said:


> Tnx, thats wonderful. Since even, private companies in China can build fire and forget and NLOS missile systems, and Russia, Iran and India can only dream about having indigenous designs
> 
> There should be much more advertising of those. Is the Sabre, finally tested and ready for sales ? Slide from previous page claims two modifications are ready, can you add some detail from chines internet ? Tnx in advance



The system has been tested and ready for export. Here are some pictures found from Chinese internet.

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## zestokryl

Awesome. Wonder if this kind of hi tech private companies have an acces to the goverment fudings. Anyhow, there should be some resource in english about them. There are no related results after googling with : Sabre ER chinese missile and Jiancheng Aerospace

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## GS Zhou

zestokryl said:


> Awesome. Wonder if this kind of hi tech private companies have an acces to the goverment fudings. Anyhow, there should be some resource in english about them. There are no related results after googling with : Sabre ER chinese missile and Jiancheng Aerospace


Its name is even new to most Chinese military fans 

We now do see the emerge of some private start-ups in the Chinese defense sector. And government is encouraging them to play a bigger role. But right now, securing a large order from PLA is still a mission impossible for the private ones, at least that's the observation from my end.

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## 52051

In latest issue of "World Miltary", Chief designer of PL-10E, Liang Xiaogeng, told the news reporter this short range AA missile is the world best:

(1) Unlike 3rd generation AA missiles where the missile can only lock targets within a very narrow *<=30 degree angle* region, PL-10E can lock on enemy targets *within 180 degree angle*, and the missiles can do 60g+ maneuverability.

(2) PL-10E using an advanced infra-image shape-recongization method to lock on, due to the advanced locking algorthim, the missile is almost immune to infra countermeasures.

(3) Future development chould be extending PL-10E's range to middle range with dual-mode gudiance.

The chief designer believe PL-10E offer significant advantage over 3rd generation AA missiles,
fighters equiped with it will enjoy significant advantage in air combat.

This missile can not only equip J-20, but also equip J-10B/C, and he believe, when J-10B/C equpip this advanced AA missiles, it will give them the ability to fight and win air combat against low-end 4th generation fighters like F-35.






Full article can be found here: http://military.china.com/important/11132797/20161116/30040986.html

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## Beast

52051 said:


> In latest issue of "World Miltary", Chief designer of PL-10E, Liang Xiaogeng, told the news reporter this short range AA missile is the world best:
> 
> (1) Unlike 3rd generation AA missiles where the missile can only lock targets within a very narrow *<=30 degree angle* region, PL-10E can lock on enemy targets *within 180 degree angle*, and the missiles can do 60g+ maneuverability.
> 
> (2) PL-10E using an advanced infra-image shape-recongization method to lock on, due to the advanced locking algorthim, the missile is almost immune to infra countermeasures.
> 
> (3) Future development chould be extending PL-10E's range to middle range with dual-mode gudiance.
> 
> The chief designer believe PL-10E offer significant advantage over 3rd generation AA missiles,
> fighters equiped with it will enjoy significant advantage in air combat.
> 
> This missile can not only equip J-20, but also equip J-10B/C, and he believe, when J-10B/C equpip this advanced AA missiles, it will give them the ability to fight and win air combat against low-end 4th generation fighters like F-35.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Full article can be found here: http://military.china.com/important/11132797/20161116/30040986.html


Direct from the horse mouth of chief designer. I know Jane will claim skepticak and bull aside his facts... 

Regarding the foreign designer benchmark. I suspect is South Africa D-Darter.

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## cirr

Test firing of a new type long-range missile that is specifically conceived for the downing of AWACS, was successfully carried out a couple of days back in the western Inner Mogolian region of China.

The missile system is believed to have an operational range of over 800km.

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> Test firing of a new type long-range missile that is specifically conceived for the downing of AWACS, was successfully carried out a couple of days back in the western Inner Mogolian region of China.
> 
> The missile system is believed to have an operational range of over 800km.


Is this your interpretation of the poem It seems to me that the poem is not implying anything.


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## Zhu Rong Zheng Yang

52051 said:


> In latest issue of "World Miltary", Chief designer of PL-10E, Liang Xiaogeng, told the news reporter this short range AA missile is the world best:
> 
> (1) Unlike 3rd generation AA missiles where the missile can only lock targets within a very narrow *<=30 degree angle* region, PL-10E can lock on enemy targets *within 180 degree angle*, and the missiles can do 60g+ maneuverability.
> 
> (2) PL-10E using an advanced infra-image shape-recongization method to lock on, due to the advanced locking algorthim, the missile is almost immune to infra countermeasures.
> 
> (3) Future development chould be extending PL-10E's range to middle range with dual-mode gudiance.
> 
> This missile can not only equip J-20, but also equip J-10B/C, and he believe, when J-10B/C equpip this advanced AA missiles, it will give them the ability to fight and win air combat against low-end 4th generation fighters like F-35.



 

PL-10E Supersonic missile with their
*180 degree Coverage and 60g Turning Performance* ... ...
and with the
*Infra--Image Shape--Recognition algorithm Locking--On* ... ...



PLA shall present and lend 12 J-10Bs to *IRANIAN Air Force*, and equip them with PL-10E
to test the enemy pilots Flying skills that will soon be equipped with the famous Flying Coffins F-35s.

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## Ultima Thule

cirr said:


> Test firing of a new type long-range missile that is specifically conceived for the downing of AWACS, was successfully carried out a couple of days back in the western Inner Mogolian region of China.
> 
> The missile system is believed to have an operational range of over 800km.


Is it SAMS or AAMS sir?


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## Beast

pakistanipower said:


> Is it SAMS or AAMS sir?


I think it's SAM. The missile will be too big too be carry by ordinary bomber unless 战神.


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## Deino

PLANAF Z-9D helicopter spotted for the first time operationally with a YJ-9 AShM.

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## cirr

pakistanipower said:


> Is it SAMS or AAMS sir?



SAM

New anti-submarine missile test fired from an integrated weapons test site

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## Deino

Deino said:


> PLANAF Z-9D helicopter spotted for the first time operationally with a YJ-9 AShM.
> 
> View attachment 353616




And here as a gif showing a test firing at PLAN test range.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/800189125437505537


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## Zarvan

Red Sword exercise: LGBs hit targets.

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## hk299792458

Deino said:


> And here as a gif showing a test firing at PLAN test range.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/800189125437505537



According to the original footage, it is a test firing range of PLAGF, not from PLAN.

Henri K.

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## Deino

Thanks for that info and correction.


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## Beast

Zarvan said:


> Red Sword exercise: LGBs hit targets.

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## Zarvan

Beast said:


>



Can you tell the name of MRL shown at 5th minute of this video ? Also if you can give details about that


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## Beast

Zarvan said:


> Can you tell the name of MRL shown at 5th minute of this video ? Also if you can give details about that


http://chinesemilitaryreview.blogspot.sg/2013/09/chinese-sr5-truckmounted-universal.html

There is no fixed calibre. It can be 370mm to 122mm.

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## Zarvan

Beast said:


> http://chinesemilitaryreview.blogspot.sg/2013/09/chinese-sr5-truckmounted-universal.html
> 
> There is no fixed calibre. It can be 370mm to 122mm.


This is nice. I hope Pakistan inducts few more MRLS from China and also this system






SY 400 this beast and can be of great use against moving Indian Armor.



cirr said:


> SAM
> 
> New anti-submarine missile test fired from an integrated weapons test site
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 353784



This is not a torpedo so How on earth it can destroy a Submarine ?

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## cirr

Zarvan said:


> This is nice. I hope Pakistan inducts few more MRLS from China and also this system
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SY 400 this beast and can be of great use against moving Indian Armor.
> 
> 
> 
> This is not a torpedo so How on earth it can destroy a Submarine ?



Look it this way

It is a winged rocket assisted/turbofan powered missile while flying midair and becomes a torpedo when hitting water near where the submarine is.

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## Beast

cirr said:


> Look it this way
> 
> It is a winged rocket assisted/turbofan powered missile while flying midair and becomes a torpedo when hitting water near where the submarine is.


Precisely, just like a reverse process of Torpedo to Missile of YJ-18 







Beast said:


> Precisely, just like a reverse process of Torpedo to Missile of YJ-18



Normal anti sub torpedo is limited in range and speed against Submarine. With Rocket assisted or missile torpedo, you have fast reaction and far longer range against lurking submarine.






Look at this missile launch. It is flat head against tradition sharp point SAM launch from warship.. It is a ASROC fired from PLAN Type054A frigate

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## Zarvan

cirr said:


> Look it this way
> 
> It is a winged rocket assisted/turbofan powered missile while flying midair and becomes a torpedo when hitting water near where the submarine is.


By the way the VLS system used in Type 054 !!! Can they only fire Air Defence Missiles but can also fire long range cruise missiles ?

@Beast @cirr @Deino

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## Beast

Zarvan said:


> By the way the VLS system used in Type 054 !!! Can they only fire Air Defence Missiles but can also fire long range cruise missiles ?
> 
> @Beast @cirr @Deino



So far , only ASROC and SAM. The canister is smaller consider than on Type052D. I dont think its possible to fire cruise missile but the SY-400 is a possible candidate with a modify slim version but that will also mean shorter range than 400km.

http://www.popsci.com/blog-network/eastern-arsenal/sy-400-guided-rocket-makes-tv-debut

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## qwerrty



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## Deino

Beast said:


> Precisely, just like a reverse process of Torpedo to Missile of YJ-18
> ....




YJ-18 formerly a torpedo ??? care to explain ???


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## Beast

Deino said:


> YJ-18 formerly a torpedo ??? care to explain ???


Wrong typo , it is YJ-81 and you don't rot. I am talking about missile fitted into torpedo canister to be underwater fire anti-ship missile. Even zarvan understands that.


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## Akasa

Beast said:


> Wrong typo , it is YJ-81 and you don't rot. I am talking about missile fitted into torpedo canister to be underwater fire anti-ship missile. Even zarvan understands that.



The YJ-81 is not and was never designed as an anti-submarine rocket, which new mystery CY-XX is. The two are unrelated.

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## Deino

Beast said:


> Wrong typo , it is YJ-81 and you don't rot. I am talking about missile fitted into torpedo canister to be underwater fire anti-ship missile. Even zarvan understands that.




A simple: Oh thanks; sorry ... I meant the YJ-81 and YJ-18 was a typo would be fine, but as typical You blame me that I ask again only to be sure when you make a type (not a problem at all!) and even more don't know that the YJ-81 was never a torpedo ! Indeed, well done again.

Deino


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## cirr

Beast said:


> Precisely, just like a reverse process of Torpedo to Missile of YJ-18
> View attachment 353924
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Normal anti sub torpedo is limited in range and speed against Submarine. With Rocket assisted or missile torpedo, you have fast reaction and far longer range against lurking submarine.
> 
> View attachment 353925
> 
> 
> Look at this missile launch. It is flat head against tradition sharp point SAM launch from warship.. It is a ASROC fired from PLAN Type054A frigate



It is worth bearing in mind that what we see now might had been filmed more than 3 years ago.

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## Shotgunner51

*China is testing a new long-range, air-to-air missile that could thwart U.S. plans for air warfare*
The hypersonic missile reaches can take down aircraft from 200 miles.
By Jeffrey Lin and P.W. Singer Yesterday at 5:45am






PL-XX 
The J-16 carries two VLRAAM for a test firing.​
In November 2016, a Chinese J-16 strike fighter test-fired a gigantic hypersonic missile, successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range.

Looking at takeoff photos, we estimate the missile is about 28 percent of the length of the J-16, which measures 22 meters (about 72 feet). The puts the missile at about 19 feet, and roughly 13 inches in diameter. The missile appears to have four tailfins. Reports are that the size would put into the category of a very long range air to air missile (VLRAAM) with ranges exceeding 300 km (roughly 186 miles), likely max out between 250 and 310 miles. (As a point of comparison, the smaller 13.8-foot, 15-inch-diameter Russian R-37 missile has a 249-mile range).

This is a big deal: this missile would easily outrange any American (or other NATO) air-to-air missile. Additionally, the VLRAAM's powerful rocket engine will push it to Mach 6 speeds, which will increase the no escape zone (NEZ), that is the area where a target cannot outrun the missile, against even supersonic targets like stealth fighters.





VLRAAM 
The VLRAAM is one of the world's largest air to air missiles.
Its other advanced features include an AESA radar, a infrared/electro-optical seeker (under the yellow-orange cover on the forward section above the nosecone), and satellite navigation midcourse correction.​
The new, larger missile's added value is not just in range. Another key feature: its large active electronically scanned (AESA) radar, which is used in the terminal phase of flight to lock onto the target. The AESA radar's large size—about 300-400% larger than that of most long range air-to-air missiles—and digital adaptability makes it highly effective against distant and stealthy targets, and resilient against electronic countermeasures like jamming and spoofing.

The VLRAAM's backup sensor is a infrared/electro-optical seeker that can identify and hone in on high-value targets like aerial tankers and airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) radar aircraft. The VLRAAM also uses lateral thrusters built into the rear for improving its terminal phase maneuverability when engaging agile targets like fighters.





Glide 
This 2015 study in a Chinese scientific journal discusses the flight path and performance of a VLRAAM, which flies 15 km upward of its launching fighter to a 30 km altitude, and is guided by a combination of long range radars (like Chinese AEWC planes) and satellite navigation, before divebombing at hypersonic speeds onto enemy aircraft, including stealth fighters, stealth bombers and AEWC aircraft.​
Interestingly, the ability to glide may be a key feature as well. A 2016 research paper by Zhang Hongyuan, Zheng Yuejing, and Shi Xiaorong of Beijing Institute of Control and Electronics Technology linked to the VLRAAM development suggests that the midcourse portion of the VLRAAM's flight will occur at altitudes above 30 km (about 18.6 miles). Flying at such low pressure, low drag high altitudes would allow the VLRAAM to extend its range (similar to hypersonic gliders). The high altitude also makes it difficult for enemy aircraft and air defenses to shoot it down midflight. Finally, high altitude flight means that the VLRAAM would have a high angle of attack against lower flying targets, which reduces the response time for enemy evasive action.





Divine Eagle at War 
The Divine Eagle is shown here in both offensive operations (providing targeting for smart bombs to strike enemy SAM, communications, bunkers and ballistic ICBMs) as well as defensive operations (detecting American stealth aircraft before they enter China airspace).
This HALE drone, with radars optimized to detect stealth aircraft, would be part of a wider Chinese air defense network that would guide VLRAAMs against enemy stealth aircraft.​
Another researched VLRAAM function is datalinking; the papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks. It is envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple Chinese systems. For example, a J-20 stealth fighter wouldn't mount the missile (the VLRAAM is too large to fit in the J-20's weapons bay), but could use its low observable features to fly relatively close in order to detect enemy assets like AEW&C aircraft (which are vital to gather battlespace data for manned and unmanned assets, but subsonic in speed and less able to evade missiles). Then before breaking off contact, the J-20 would signal a J-16 400 km (249 miles) away (outside the range of most air to air missiles) providing it the data needed to launch the VLRAAM at the target. This would offer China a longer range version of present U.S. tactics that involve using the fifth generation F-22 as a sensor for 4th generation fighters as the "shooters."





The Future is Here
In operation, the VLRAAM will provide J-20 stealth fighters with long range "aerial artillery" to even the odds against numerically superior air forces, while giving new life to J-11 and J-16 fighters. It can also give J-15 carrier fighters a long range interception capability to defend Chinese naval forces.​
The gains in range and speed of the VLRAAM pose another significant risk to the concepts of the U.S. military's "Third Offset." U.S. operations are highly dependent on assets like aerial tankers, dedicated electronic warfare aircraft, and AEW&C. For example, without aerial tankers, the relatively short range of the F-35s would become even more of a liability in long range operations in the South China Seas and Taiwan Straits. Similarly, without AEW&C aircraft, F-22s would have to use onboard radars more, raising their risk of detection. Even for stealthy tanker platforms like the planned MQ-25 Stingray drone and proposed KC-Z tanker will be vulnerable to VLRAAMs if detected by emerging dedicated anti-stealth systems such as the Divine Eagle drone and Yuanmeng airship.

By pushing the Chinese air defense threat bubble hundreds of miles out further, they also offer to turn the long range tables on the putative U.S. "Arsenal" Plane concept, a Pentagon plan to launch missiles from non-stealthy planes from afar. In sum, VLRAAM is not just a big missile, but a potential big deal for the future of air warfare.

http://www.popsci.com/china-new-long-range-air-to-air-missile

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## Kompromat

Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Horus said:


> Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.



Maybe J-20B for Pakistan.

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## Kompromat

That is a very optimistic assumption and very generous too. First, i doubt that China will export the J-20s, even to Pakistan. Secondly, even if it does, we won't be able to acquire them in strong numbers which would be needed to make the difference vis-a-vis India.



ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Maybe J-20B for Pakistan.

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## New World

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Maybe J-20B for Pakistan.


J-20B?


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## Shotgunner51

Horus said:


> Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.




These VLRAAM are too large for weapons bay of stealth jets, even that of J20. The papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks, envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple systems. In PAF scenario, Thunders with improved penetration capabilities may act as "sensors", while other heavier platforms act as the "shooters".

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## Blue Marlin

Shotgunner51 said:


> *China is testing a new long-range, air-to-air missile that could thwart U.S. plans for air warfare*
> The hypersonic missile reaches can take down aircraft from 200 miles.
> By Jeffrey Lin and P.W. Singer Yesterday at 5:45am
> 
> View attachment 354924
> 
> PL-XX
> The J-16 carries two VLRAAM for a test firing.​
> In November 2016, a Chinese J-16 strike fighter test-fired a gigantic hypersonic missile, successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range.
> 
> Looking at takeoff photos, we estimate the missile is about 28 percent of the length of the J-16, which measures 22 meters (about 72 feet). The puts the missile at about 19 feet, and roughly 13 inches in diameter. The missile appears to have four tailfins. Reports are that the size would put into the category of a very long range air to air missile (VLRAAM) with ranges exceeding 300 km (roughly 186 miles), likely max out between 250 and 310 miles. (As a point of comparison, the smaller 13.8-foot, 15-inch-diameter Russian R-37 missile has a 249-mile range).
> 
> This is a big deal: this missile would easily outrange any American (or other NATO) air-to-air missile. Additionally, the VLRAAM's powerful rocket engine will push it to Mach 6 speeds, which will increase the no escape zone (NEZ), that is the area where a target cannot outrun the missile, against even supersonic targets like stealth fighters.
> 
> View attachment 354925
> 
> VLRAAM
> The VLRAAM is one of the world's largest air to air missiles.
> Its other advanced features include an AESA radar, a infrared/electro-optical seeker (under the yellow-orange cover on the forward section above the nosecone), and satellite navigation midcourse correction.​
> The new, larger missile's added value is not just in range. Another key feature: its large active electronically scanned (AESA) radar, which is used in the terminal phase of flight to lock onto the target. The AESA radar's large size—about 300-400% larger than that of most long range air-to-air missiles—and digital adaptability makes it highly effective against distant and stealthy targets, and resilient against electronic countermeasures like jamming and spoofing.
> 
> The VLRAAM's backup sensor is a infrared/electro-optical seeker that can identify and hone in on high-value targets like aerial tankers and airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) radar aircraft. The VLRAAM also uses lateral thrusters built into the rear for improving its terminal phase maneuverability when engaging agile targets like fighters.
> 
> View attachment 354926
> 
> Glide
> This 2015 study in a Chinese scientific journal discusses the flight path and performance of a VLRAAM, which flies 15 km upward of its launching fighter to a 30 km altitude, and is guided by a combination of long range radars (like Chinese AEWC planes) and satellite navigation, before divebombing at hypersonic speeds onto enemy aircraft, including stealth fighters, stealth bombers and AEWC aircraft.​
> Interestingly, the ability to glide may be a key feature as well. A 2016 research paper by Zhang Hongyuan, Zheng Yuejing, and Shi Xiaorong of Beijing Institute of Control and Electronics Technology linked to the VLRAAM development suggests that the midcourse portion of the VLRAAM's flight will occur at altitudes above 30 km (about 18.6 miles). Flying at such low pressure, low drag high altitudes would allow the VLRAAM to extend its range (similar to hypersonic gliders). The high altitude also makes it difficult for enemy aircraft and air defenses to shoot it down midflight. Finally, high altitude flight means that the VLRAAM would have a high angle of attack against lower flying targets, which reduces the response time for enemy evasive action.
> 
> View attachment 354927
> 
> Divine Eagle at War
> The Divine Eagle is shown here in both offensive operations (providing targeting for smart bombs to strike enemy SAM, communications, bunkers and ballistic ICBMs) as well as defensive operations (detecting American stealth aircraft before they enter China airspace).
> This HALE drone, with radars optimized to detect stealth aircraft, would be part of a wider Chinese air defense network that would guide VLRAAMs against enemy stealth aircraft.​
> Another researched VLRAAM function is datalinking; the papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks. It is envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple Chinese systems. For example, a J-20 stealth fighter wouldn't mount the missile (the VLRAAM is too large to fit in the J-20's weapons bay), but could use its low observable features to fly relatively close in order to detect enemy assets like AEW&C aircraft (which are vital to gather battlespace data for manned and unmanned assets, but subsonic in speed and less able to evade missiles). Then before breaking off contact, the J-20 would signal a J-16 400 km (249 miles) away (outside the range of most air to air missiles) providing it the data needed to launch the VLRAAM at the target. This would offer China a longer range version of present U.S. tactics that involve using the fifth generation F-22 as a sensor for 4th generation fighters as the "shooters."
> 
> View attachment 354928
> 
> The Future is Here
> In operation, the VLRAAM will provide J-20 stealth fighters with long range "aerial artillery" to even the odds against numerically superior air forces, while giving new life to J-11 and J-16 fighters. It can also give J-15 carrier fighters a long range interception capability to defend Chinese naval forces.​
> The gains in range and speed of the VLRAAM pose another significant risk to the concepts of the U.S. military's "Third Offset." U.S. operations are highly dependent on assets like aerial tankers, dedicated electronic warfare aircraft, and AEW&C. For example, without aerial tankers, the relatively short range of the F-35s would become even more of a liability in long range operations in the South China Seas and Taiwan Straits. Similarly, without AEW&C aircraft, F-22s would have to use onboard radars more, raising their risk of detection. Even for stealthy tanker platforms like the planned MQ-25 Stingray drone and proposed KC-Z tanker will be vulnerable to VLRAAMs if detected by emerging dedicated anti-stealth systems such as the Divine Eagle drone and Yuanmeng airship.
> 
> By pushing the Chinese air defense threat bubble hundreds of miles out further, they also offer to turn the long range tables on the putative U.S. "Arsenal" Plane concept, a Pentagon plan to launch missiles from non-stealthy planes from afar. In sum, VLRAAM is not just a big missile, but a potential big deal for the future of air warfare.
> 
> http://www.popsci.com/china-new-long-range-air-to-air-missile


lol, a load of crap coupled with images from pdf that surfaced about few days ago. and yes someone can count pixels too


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## Ultima Thule

Shotgunner51 said:


> These VLRAAM are too large for weapons bay of stealth jets, even that of J20. The papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks, envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple systems. In PAF scenario, Thunders may act as "sensors", while other heavier platforms act as the "shooters".


What other *havier plate-form sir? kindy explain*


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## Shotgunner51

pakistanipower said:


> What other *havier plate-form sir? kindy explain*



There isn't a suitable one in PAF at the moment, need to procure. In PLAAF's scenario, it's J-16 series.

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## Akasa

Horus said:


> Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.



The missile is 5-6 meters long, which could fit on the centerline hardpoint of the JF-17. However, to use this weapon effectively, Pakistan would need a platform that can provide midcourse guidance and be able to go near enemy air assets with little detection.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Horus said:


> That is a very optimistic assumption and very generous too. First, i doubt that China will export the J-20s, even to Pakistan. Secondly, even if it does, we won't be able to acquire them in strong numbers which would be needed to make the difference vis-a-vis India.



China is now developing the 6th generation aircraft fighter, so there is no need to follow like the US to restrict the 5th generation aircraft fighter technology.



New World said:


> J-20B?



The finalized version of the J-20.

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## Akasa

Shotgunner51 said:


> There isn't a suitable one in PAF at the moment, need to procure. In PLAAF's scenario, it's J-16 series.



The J-16 is a strike fighter, so it's unlikely the intended platform for the PL-XX. The J-11D, J-11B, J-15, and J-10B/C are likely carriers.

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## Ultima Thule

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> China is now developing the 6th generation aircraft fighter, so there is no need to follow like the US to restrict the 5th generation aircraft fighter technology.


so does Russia and US not only china sir


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## ChineseTiger1986

pakistanipower said:


> so does Russia and US not only china sir



The 6th generation aircraft should be the end of the turbofan jet era, since the turbofan engine will reach its theoretical limit. The 7th generation aircraft will likely use the scramjet engine which is strongly favored China.

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## Beast

Horus said:


> Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.


https://sputniknews.com/military/201611231047746741-su35-china-delivery/

Not to worry too much

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## Deino

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Maybe J-20B for Pakistan.





Beast said:


> https://sputniknews.com/military/201611231047746741-su35-china-delivery/
> 
> Not to worry too much




Oh no, not these wet-dreams again.  PAFK will get these Su-35, Pakistan will use this PL-XX from the JF-17, PAF will get €F, additional F-16s, the FC-31 and will participate on the TF-X ... and most of all will get the J-20B ! 

Really not sure, why this obsession ???


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## Kompromat

Deino said:


> Oh no, not these wet-dreams again.  PAFK will get these Su-35, Pakistan



Negotiations for Su-35s are on. Russians will sell them if we can pay for them.



> use this PL-XX from the JF-17



Not possible, the missile is too big.



> PAF will get €F



Who said that?



> additional F-16s



Used ones, yes. Like the ADF F-16s
New ones. No



> FC-31 and will participate on the TF-X



Pakistan will have to choose between the two for replacing the F-7PG and F-16s eventually. 


> and most of all will get the J-20B ! Really not sure, why this obsession ???



J-20B or any variant won't see service in Pakistan. Beijing won't export them to anyone, even us.

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## Deino

Horus said:


> Negotiations for Su-35s are on. Russians will sell them if we can pay for them.
> ... maybe but not the ones to be delivered to China as Beast always claims.
> 
> Not possible, the missile is too big.
> YES, but some still don't think so ...
> 
> Who said that?
> ... just look at the PAF-section.
> 
> Used ones, yes. Like the ADF F-16s
> New ones. No
> ... agreed.
> 
> Pakistan will have to choose between the two for replacing the F-7PG and F-16s eventually.
> ... most likely, but IMO the TFX will be cancelled given the current political changes and if Pakistan cannot found the FC-31 also and it fails too, what's then ???
> 
> J-20B or any variant won't see service in Pakistan. Beijing won't export them to anyone, even us.
> YES, but some certain fan-boys still think the PAF will get them.




Don't get me wrong or probably You got me wrong, but You only need to go over to the PAF-section and take a look what some fan-boys claim: this is exactly ranging from "we get these PLAAF Su-35, China will pay for us" over "€F or Rafale and new F-16 are a must have" (all for free) and most of all "Pakstan will surely get J-20" (also for free) ... simply laughable.

As such I completely agree with You.

Deino

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## Kompromat

Above all, this forum is for better informing young people. 



Deino said:


> Don't get me wrong or probably You got me wrong, but You only need to go over to the PAF-section and take a look what some fan-boys claim: this is exactly ranging from "we get these PLAAF Su-35, China will pay for us" over "€F or Rafale and new F-16 are a must have" (all for free) and most of all "Pakstan will surely get J-20" (also for free) ... simply laughable.
> 
> As such I completely agree with You.
> 
> Deino

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## Deino

Horus said:


> Above all, this forum is for better informing young people.




Exactly this is the reason for my constant insisting in certain issues or - after a certain post contains only pure BS - sometimes harsh replies ... maybe too much of a teacher.

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## hk299792458

My very first analysis on the missile found on the J-16

http://www.eastpendulum.com/la-chine-developpe-un-missile-air-air-tres-longue-portee

Henri K.

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## onebyone

In November 2016, a Chinese J-16 strike fighter test-fired a larger and longer range hypersonic missile and successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range.

The missile is about 28 percent of the length of the J-16, which measures 22 meters (about 72 feet). The puts the missile at about 19 feet, and roughly 13 inches in diameter. The missile appears to have four tailfins. Reports are that the size would put into the category of a very long range air to air missile (VLRAAM) with ranges exceeding 300 km (roughly 186 miles), likely max out between 250 and 310 miles. (As a point of comparison, the smaller 13.8-foot, 15-inch-diameter Russian R-37 missile has a 249-mile range).


This missile would easily outrange any American (or other NATO) air-to-air missile.

The VLRAAM's powerful rocket engine will push it to Mach 6 speeds, which will increase the no escape zone (NEZ), that is the area where a target cannot outrun the missile, against even supersonic targets like stealth fighters.








_The VLRAAM is one of the world's largest air to air missiles. Its other advanced features include an AESA radar, a infrared/electro-optical seeker (under the yellow-orange cover on the forward section above the nosecone), and satellite navigation midcourse correction._

*Large radar able to detect stealth targets*

The new, larger missile's added value is not just in range. It has a large active electronically scanned (AESA) radar, which is used in the terminal phase of flight to lock onto the target. The AESA radar's large size—about 300-400% larger than that of most long range air-to-air missiles—and digital adaptability makes it highly effective against distant and stealthy targets, and resilient against electronic countermeasures like jamming and spoofing.

Another researched VLRAAM function is datalinking; the papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks. It is envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple Chinese systems. For example, a J-20 stealth fighter wouldn't mount the missile (the VLRAAM is too large to fit in the J-20's weapons bay), but could use its low observable features to fly relatively close in order to detect enemy assets like AEW and C aircraft (which are vital to gather battlespace data for manned and unmanned assets, but subsonic in speed and less able to evade missiles). Then before breaking off contact, the J-20 would signal a J-16 400 km (249 miles) away (outside the range of most air to air missiles) providing it the data needed to launch the VLRAAM at the target. This would offer China a longer range version of present U.S. tactics that involve using the fifth generation F-22 as a sensor for 4th generation fighters as the "shooters."

*Putting US refueling and electronic warfare planes at risks messes with all US Air operation strategies*

The gains in range and speed of the VLRAAM pose another significant risk to the concepts of the U.S. military's "Third Offset." U.S. operations are highly dependent on assets like aerial tankers, dedicated electronic warfare aircraft, and AEW&C. For example, without aerial tankers, the relatively short range of the F-35s would become even more of a liability in long range operations in the South China Seas and Taiwan Straits. Similarly, without AEW&C aircraft, F-22s would have to use onboard radars more, raising their risk of detection. Even for stealthy tanker platforms like the planned MQ-25 Stingray drone and proposed KC-Z tanker will be vulnerable to VLRAAMs if detected by emerging dedicated anti-stealth systems such as the Divine Eagle drone and Yuanmeng airship

SOURCE- Popular Science, wikipedia

http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/china-successfully-fires-radical-300.html

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## masud

IT,S RELLY A HUGE AAM...............

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## Beast

How heavy is this missile? 400-600kg?

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## Deino

onebyone said:


> In November 2016, a Chinese J-16 strike fighter test-fired a larger and longer range hypersonic missile and successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range.
> 
> The missile is about 28 percent of the length of the J-16, which measures 22 meters (about 72 feet). The puts the missile at about 19 feet, and roughly 13 inches in diameter. The missile appears to have four tailfins. Reports are that the size would put into the category of a very long range air to air missile (VLRAAM) with ranges exceeding 300 km (roughly 186 miles), likely max out between 250 and 310 miles. (As a point of comparison, the smaller 13.8-foot, 15-inch-diameter Russian R-37 missile has a 249-mile range).
> 
> 
> This missile would easily outrange any American (or other NATO) air-to-air missile.
> 
> The VLRAAM's powerful rocket engine will push it to Mach 6 speeds, which will increase the no escape zone (NEZ), that is the area where a target cannot outrun the missile, against even supersonic targets like stealth fighters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _The VLRAAM is one of the world's largest air to air missiles. Its other advanced features include an AESA radar, a infrared/electro-optical seeker (under the yellow-orange cover on the forward section above the nosecone), and satellite navigation midcourse correction._
> 
> *Large radar able to detect stealth targets*
> 
> The new, larger missile's added value is not just in range. It has a large active electronically scanned (AESA) radar, which is used in the terminal phase of flight to lock onto the target. The AESA radar's large size—about 300-400% larger than that of most long range air-to-air missiles—and digital adaptability makes it highly effective against distant and stealthy targets, and resilient against electronic countermeasures like jamming and spoofing.
> 
> Another researched VLRAAM function is datalinking; the papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks. It is envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple Chinese systems. For example, a J-20 stealth fighter wouldn't mount the missile (the VLRAAM is too large to fit in the J-20's weapons bay), but could use its low observable features to fly relatively close in order to detect enemy assets like AEW and C aircraft (which are vital to gather battlespace data for manned and unmanned assets, but subsonic in speed and less able to evade missiles). Then before breaking off contact, the J-20 would signal a J-16 400 km (249 miles) away (outside the range of most air to air missiles) providing it the data needed to launch the VLRAAM at the target. This would offer China a longer range version of present U.S. tactics that involve using the fifth generation F-22 as a sensor for 4th generation fighters as the "shooters."
> 
> *Putting US refueling and electronic warfare planes at risks messes with all US Air operation strategies*
> 
> The gains in range and speed of the VLRAAM pose another significant risk to the concepts of the U.S. military's "Third Offset." U.S. operations are highly dependent on assets like aerial tankers, dedicated electronic warfare aircraft, and AEW&C. For example, without aerial tankers, the relatively short range of the F-35s would become even more of a liability in long range operations in the South China Seas and Taiwan Straits. Similarly, without AEW&C aircraft, F-22s would have to use onboard radars more, raising their risk of detection. Even for stealthy tanker platforms like the planned MQ-25 Stingray drone and proposed KC-Z tanker will be vulnerable to VLRAAMs if detected by emerging dedicated anti-stealth systems such as the Divine Eagle drone and Yuanmeng airship
> 
> SOURCE- Popular Science, wikipedia
> 
> http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/china-successfully-fires-radical-300.html



Was this missile really test-fired? As far as I know we have only seen these 3 images, IMO ss a captive test, but there was no actual launch.


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## The Eagle

onebyone said:


> In November 2016, a Chinese J-16 strike fighter test-fired a larger and longer range hypersonic missile and successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range.
> 
> The missile is about 28 percent of the length of the J-16, which measures 22 meters (about 72 feet). The puts the missile at about 19 feet, and roughly 13 inches in diameter. The missile appears to have four tailfins. Reports are that the size would put into the category of a very long range air to air missile (VLRAAM) with ranges exceeding 300 km (roughly 186 miles), likely max out between 250 and 310 miles. (As a point of comparison, the smaller 13.8-foot, 15-inch-diameter Russian R-37 missile has a 249-mile range).
> 
> 
> This missile would easily outrange any American (or other NATO) air-to-air missile.
> 
> The VLRAAM's powerful rocket engine will push it to Mach 6 speeds, which will increase the no escape zone (NEZ), that is the area where a target cannot outrun the missile, against even supersonic targets like stealth fighters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _The VLRAAM is one of the world's largest air to air missiles. Its other advanced features include an AESA radar, a infrared/electro-optical seeker (under the yellow-orange cover on the forward section above the nosecone), and satellite navigation midcourse correction._
> 
> *Large radar able to detect stealth targets*
> 
> The new, larger missile's added value is not just in range. It has a large active electronically scanned (AESA) radar, which is used in the terminal phase of flight to lock onto the target. The AESA radar's large size—about 300-400% larger than that of most long range air-to-air missiles—and digital adaptability makes it highly effective against distant and stealthy targets, and resilient against electronic countermeasures like jamming and spoofing.
> 
> Another researched VLRAAM function is datalinking; the papers called for the VLRAAM to be embedded within a highly integrated combat networks. It is envisioned as just part of a larger wave of networked solutions aggregated through multiple Chinese systems. For example, a J-20 stealth fighter wouldn't mount the missile (the VLRAAM is too large to fit in the J-20's weapons bay), but could use its low observable features to fly relatively close in order to detect enemy assets like AEW and C aircraft (which are vital to gather battlespace data for manned and unmanned assets, but subsonic in speed and less able to evade missiles). Then before breaking off contact, the J-20 would signal a J-16 400 km (249 miles) away (outside the range of most air to air missiles) providing it the data needed to launch the VLRAAM at the target. This would offer China a longer range version of present U.S. tactics that involve using the fifth generation F-22 as a sensor for 4th generation fighters as the "shooters."
> 
> *Putting US refueling and electronic warfare planes at risks messes with all US Air operation strategies*
> 
> The gains in range and speed of the VLRAAM pose another significant risk to the concepts of the U.S. military's "Third Offset." U.S. operations are highly dependent on assets like aerial tankers, dedicated electronic warfare aircraft, and AEW&C. For example, without aerial tankers, the relatively short range of the F-35s would become even more of a liability in long range operations in the South China Seas and Taiwan Straits. Similarly, without AEW&C aircraft, F-22s would have to use onboard radars more, raising their risk of detection. Even for stealthy tanker platforms like the planned MQ-25 Stingray drone and proposed KC-Z tanker will be vulnerable to VLRAAMs if detected by emerging dedicated anti-stealth systems such as the Divine Eagle drone and Yuanmeng airship
> 
> SOURCE- Popular Science, wikipedia
> 
> http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/china-successfully-fires-radical-300.html



What a beast and if become reality, I wish we may have a platform for full utilization of such kind of weapons.

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## Zhu Rong Zheng Yang

By writing comment such as the above ( post #632 ) , ... ...
I hope ... ...
your intention is to get someone from PLAAF to post the unknown VLRAAM firing hitting a Targetting drone pictures.
If this is your intention, then I salute your effort.

===

Maybe that is not your intention.
If that is not your intention, then your comment makes you look ridiculously stupid.
Why would PLAAF show a picture of J-16 carrying this unknown VLRAAM -- just to parade it around ??
without even testing and firing this missile into a Targetting drone ??

*No war-mongering & bashing of other countries !*

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## Beast

Zhu Rong Zheng Yang said:


> By writing comment such as the above ( post #632 ) , ... ...
> I hope ... ...
> your intention is to get someone from PLAAF to post the unknown VLRAAM firing hitting a Targetting drone pictures.
> If this is your intention, then I salute your effort.
> 
> ===
> 
> Maybe that is not your intention.
> If that is not your intention, then your comment makes you look ridiculously stupid.
> Why would PLAAF show a picture of J-16 carrying this unknown VLRAAM -- just to parade it around ??
> without even testing and firing this missile into a Targetting drone ??
> 
> Do you think PLAAF can scare those Dumb Dumb in Pentagon to change their minds by seeing this parading VLRAAM picture alone ?
> 
> 
> 
> In fact, this J-16 VLRAAM picture *will motivate and embolden those Dumb Dumb in Pentagon* to enhance their strategy of *Blackmailing and Nuking PRC back into the stone age*.
> 
> Because, there is no way usa can win a conventional warfare with PRC.
> Because, usaf and usn can NOT protect usaf AWACS and Tankers aircrafts and Burky DDG and usn carriers from becoming the Soft hundreds billion dollar targets within the reach of PLAAF firing power in SCS and ECS.
> 
> Without AWACS and Tankers, then those F-22s and F-35s will be even more naked and vulnerable.
> These VLRAAM will send all those F-22s and F-35s to the Slippery edge of Gate to Hell.
> 
> *F-35s * 400 Billion USD * Flying Coffins made by
> the most patriotic americese Lockheed Martin*
> 
> View attachment 355773


Fully agree with your post. From Chinese forum source, a target drone was successfully down by this missile during the test run and yet someone can ignore that call? This news was picked up by many western news and very likely the US has observed the test launch from their spy satellite and too confirm the launch.

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## Tempest II

Horus said:


> Unfortunately, we might not be able to use them on Thunders. We'd have to acquire a larger jet coupled with these Missiles to 'take care' of the Phalcons.


This missile is about as long as the C-802 and is smaller in diameter. From a physical size, the JF-17 should be able to manage.

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## Deino

pakistanipower said:


> Chinese military than inform you that they are conducting specific missile test, its a top-secret test your *German ego *in delusional mode and how do know you such test was not occurred?, just in your wet dreams and wishful thinking



Why again ranting, telling me stupid and more? I am fully aware of that said test as mentioned in that poem, but I am questioning if THIS particular missile was launced? For this we have no hint and even more all who are familiar with such tests know, that You barely carry two missiles at once. Usually for such tests the aircraft and missile carries special calibration markings.

As such to question if this missile was actially launched from this aircraft shown in that Image is IMO not that off and even more has nothing to do with my Background. But if You prefer again to be in ranting Modus again, who's The stupid one again.


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## j20blackdragon



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## Deino

... but isn't this an old image ???


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## onebyone

A Chinese J-16 strike fighter recently test-fired a mach 6 hypersonic missiles to successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range. The hypersonic missile has a range of between 200-310 miles.

The U.S. military’s own longest-range air-to-air missile, the AIM-120 Advanced Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile. The AMRAAM is just 12 feet long and seven inches in diameter. The latest version of the American missile, the AIM-120D, reportedly boasts a maximum range in excess of 90 miles.


Launched by a fighter flying as high as 50,000 feet, the Chinese missile could climb to an altitude of around 100,000 feet and glide in the thin air for more than a hundred miles before descending to strike its target 

Beijing’s VLRAAM reportedly features an active electronically-scanned array seeker with optical back-up and mid-course satellite guidance — truly state of the art for an air-to-air missile. The AIM-120D makes do with an older-style, and less effective, mechanically-steered radar.




_VLRAAM missile on J-16_

The Chinese military is apparently working on a solution to the identification problem, and has proposed building a targeting network around the high-flying Divine Eagle sensor drone. A Divine Eagle could pass targeting data to a VLRAAM-armed fighter — and potentially even to the missile itself, provided any operational version of the munition incorporates a datalink.




_Divine eagle drones_

The Divine Eagle is a low observable, high altitude UAV meant detect stealth aircraft at long ranges, using special purpose radars.

China's giant UAV has been getting a lots of international attention. With its giant, double bodied design, carrying high performance anti-stealth radars, the drones are a potential key part of China's offensive and defensive military strategy in the coming years. Formations of Divine Eagle UAVs are expected to provide an early warning line to detect threats to China's airspace, like cruise missiles and stealth bombers, as well as be able to take on such missions as hunting for aircraft carriers in the open waters of the Pacific.






By using the single deck bus in the background (probably 3.2 meters tall, like most buses of its type) as a very crude visual yardstick, a very rough comparison suggests that the Divine Eagle is about 6 meters tall, and 15 meters long (since most high altitude large UAVs have a wingspan to body length ratio of 2.5:1 to 3:1, the wingspan of the Divine Eagle is likely its be 35 to 45 meters across). With a maximum take off weight of at least 15 tons, the Divine Eagle is the world's largest UAV, edging out the RQ-4 Global Hawk.
http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/chinas-new-mach-6-hypersonic-missile.html

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## Akasa

Can't we stop re-posting news articles and, more frustratingly, creating a new thread for it every time? There's no need to replicate a Chinese propaganda sales pitch in this forum.

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## nang2

Beidou2020 said:


> We don't need the permission of some anti-China buffon like you to post articles regarding China in the Chinese section.


he is not anti-China. he is anti-nagging.

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## Ultima Thule

onebyone said:


> A Chinese J-16 strike fighter recently test-fired a mach 6 hypersonic missiles to successfully destroying the target drone at a very long range. The hypersonic missile has a range of between 200-310 miles.
> 
> The U.S. military’s own longest-range air-to-air missile, the AIM-120 Advanced Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile. The AMRAAM is just 12 feet long and seven inches in diameter. The latest version of the American missile, the AIM-120D, reportedly boasts a maximum range in excess of 90 miles.
> 
> 
> Launched by a fighter flying as high as 50,000 feet, the Chinese missile could climb to an altitude of around 100,000 feet and glide in the thin air for more than a hundred miles before descending to strike its target
> 
> Beijing’s VLRAAM reportedly features an active electronically-scanned array seeker with optical back-up and mid-course satellite guidance — truly state of the art for an air-to-air missile. The AIM-120D makes do with an older-style, and less effective, mechanically-steered radar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _VLRAAM missile on J-16_
> 
> The Chinese military is apparently working on a solution to the identification problem, and has proposed building a targeting network around the high-flying Divine Eagle sensor drone. A Divine Eagle could pass targeting data to a VLRAAM-armed fighter — and potentially even to the missile itself, provided any operational version of the munition incorporates a datalink.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _Divine eagle drones_
> 
> The Divine Eagle is a low observable, high altitude UAV meant detect stealth aircraft at long ranges, using special purpose radars.
> 
> China's giant UAV has been getting a lots of international attention. With its giant, double bodied design, carrying high performance anti-stealth radars, the drones are a potential key part of China's offensive and defensive military strategy in the coming years. Formations of Divine Eagle UAVs are expected to provide an early warning line to detect threats to China's airspace, like cruise missiles and stealth bombers, as well as be able to take on such missions as hunting for aircraft carriers in the open waters of the Pacific.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By using the single deck bus in the background (probably 3.2 meters tall, like most buses of its type) as a very crude visual yardstick, a very rough comparison suggests that the Divine Eagle is about 6 meters tall, and 15 meters long (since most high altitude large UAVs have a wingspan to body length ratio of 2.5:1 to 3:1, the wingspan of the Divine Eagle is likely its be 35 to 45 meters across). With a maximum take off weight of at least 15 tons, the Divine Eagle is the world's largest UAV, edging out the RQ-4 Global Hawk.
> http://www.nextbigfuture.com/2016/11/chinas-new-mach-6-hypersonic-missile.html


Already posted @Deino please merge this to Chinese missiles and discussing thread, Thank you


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## khanasifm

HOME DEFENCE WEAPONS AIR-LAUNCHED WEAPONS ARTICLE
CONTENT PREVIEW To read the full article, Client Login
Air-Launched Weapons
*Images show PLAAF testing possible new air-to-air missile*

http://www.janes.com/article/65922/images-show-plaaf-testing-possible-new-air-to-air-missile


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## yusheng



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## quanghnn

China is very strong


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## cirr

Official: new strategic missile in operational use by the PLA






Is it DF-41, DF-31B or DF-27?

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## cirr

Raigun: simulations and experiments











So this is the third team in China working on railguns.


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## Pepsi Cola

am i the only one or the images not showing

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## cirr

Electro thermal chemical(ETC) gun


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## grey boy 2

Okarus said:


> am i the only one or the images not showing


Me too

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## cirr

Future developments of ETC, railgun and CIWS(High Firing Rate)











Future is now!


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## Makarena

none of cirr pics show up


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## Hindustani78

“Quantity should be reduced, quality improved to build a capable and efficient modernized standing army,” he said, adding that China must develop a joint operation force system with the elite force at its core.

The Chinese armed forces have also demonstrated their military muscle following Mr. Trump’s nomination of retired Marine Corps General, James Mattis as his Defence Secretary. In tune with the nomination, China’s military has carried out flight tests of 10 DF-21 intermediate-range ballistic missiles. These missiles “can destroy U.S. Asia-Pacific bases at any time,” the Xinhua reported.

According to Xinhua, the DF-21 can be compared with the U.S. Pershing II intermediate-range missile.

The core design of the DF-21 has spawned a family of missiles, including the naval “carrier killer” “DF-21D, which has been built specially to neutralise the U.S. dominance of aircraft carriers in the Asia-Pacific region. Another variant of this missile is apparently a part of China’s anti-satellite arsenal.


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## Dungeness

*China Flight-Tests 10 DF-21 Missiles*
*Show of force comes amid transition to Trump*





DF-21 salvo launch


BY: Bill Gertz 
December 2, 2016 5:00 pm

China’s military conducted a salvo of 10 missile flight tests late last month in a show of force during the transition to the Donald Trump administration.

Chinese state media reported Thursday that the simultaneous flight tests of 10 DF-21 intermediate-range ballistic missiles were carried out in China.

*The missiles “can destroy U.S. Asia-Pacific bases at any time,” the dispatch from the official Xinhua news agency reported.*

The flight tests were disclosed by China Central Television on Nov. 28 and coincide with President-elect Donald Trump’s high-profile announcements of new senior government officials.

Disclosure of the missile salvo launch comes as Trump announced on Thursday that he will nominate retired Marine Corps. Gen. James Mattis as his defense secretary. Mattis is one of the Corps’ most celebrated warfighting generals.


Xinhua reported that the DF-21 is comparable to the U.S. Pershing II intermediate-range missile that used a two-stage rocket and aerodynamic reentry vehicle. The Pershing II was dismantled under the U.S.-Russian INF treaty.

Rick Fisher, a China military expert, confirmed the missile tests involved the DF-21C variant of the missile.

Fisher, a senior fellow with the International Assessment and Strategy Center, also noted that the missile test came as China is conducting large-scale naval exercises.

“The PLA is banging some drums to provide background for military psychological warfare,” Fisher said.

The DF-21 is the basis for several types of missiles, including the anti-ship variant known as the DF-21D. Another version is believed to be part of China’s anti-satellite arsenal.

The DF-21C is a land-attack maneuvering missile with a range of about 1,000 miles.

It is also capable of firing a maneuvering warhead.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-flight-tests-10-df-21-missiles/

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## Dungeness



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## Beast

DF-21D , the ASBM version will be better than Pershing II as it can hit moving targets

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## cirr

Need ten thousands of these and ten thousands of land attack cruise missiles for saturated attacks on ALL military targets and other assets of strategic importance along the so-called first island chain. 

Sorry, I forgot the DF-15s and the DF-16s. They should do the job just fine.

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## royalharris

especially should increase the amout of nuclear war heads, keep the same level with USA

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## EpiiC

royalharris said:


> especially should increase the amout of nuclear war heads, keep the same level with USA


Thats true.... USA has 450 Minuteman III missiles and 336 Trident d5 missiles.... China has maybe 200 Nuclear Missiles..... China Must increase Nuclear Missiles stock pile.


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## samsara

Hindustani78 said:


> “Quantity should be reduced, quality improved to build a capable and efficient modernized standing army,” he said, adding that China must develop a joint operation force system with the elite force at its core.
> 
> The Chinese armed forces have also demonstrated their military muscle following Mr. Trump’s nomination of retired Marine Corps General, James Mattis as his Defence Secretary. In tune with the nomination, China’s military has carried out flight tests of 10 DF-21 intermediate-range ballistic missiles. These missiles “can destroy U.S. Asia-Pacific bases at any time,” the Xinhua reported.
> 
> According to Xinhua, the DF-21 can be compared with the U.S. Pershing II intermediate-range missile.
> 
> The core design of the DF-21 has spawned a family of missiles, including the naval “carrier killer” “DF-21D, which has been built specially to neutralise the U.S. dominance of aircraft carriers in the Asia-Pacific region. Another variant of this missile is apparently a part of China’s anti-satellite arsenal.



*After Trump’s Taiwan talk, Xi calls for combat readiness - INTERNATIONAL - The Hindu (2016-12-05)*
The Indian major publication, The Hindu, carries the news on this matter.

For an impressive brief 71-sec video clip at Youtube, watch this one "美媒：中国同时发射10枚东风 21 向特朗普示威", published on 2016-12-04.

Just noticed that user *xinfengcao* at Twitter uploaded a much better clip of this DF-21C flight test aired by CCTV 7 on 03 Dec.

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## 21stCentury

Can anyone find this video? Firing 10 df-21 missiles at once is pretty insane


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## Dungeness

21stCentury said:


> Can anyone find this video? Firing 10 df-21 missiles at once is pretty insane

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## 星海军事

Dungeness said:


>


Those are actually DF-11s

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## hk299792458

星海军事 said:


> Those are actually DF-11s



Exactly, and the video also comes from an old drill end of 2014 (or 2015) in Tibet, if I'm not wrong.

Henri K.

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## Dungeness

星海军事 said:


> Those are actually DF-11s



Free Beacon is not as informed as it seems.


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## cirr

Possible missile interception test

*2016.12.06 NOTAM *

*A3096/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD: 1.W187: SADAN-OBDEG. 2.W112: NOLEP-ADMUX. 3.Y1: SADAN-MAGOD. FL000 - FL999, 06 DEC 03:55 2016 UNTIL 06 DEC 05:05 2016. CREATED: 05 DEC 14:43 2016 
*
A3098/16* - THE FLW ATS RTE CLSD: 1. Y2:MEPEP-LUVAR. 2. L888:MUMAN-LUVAR. 06 DEC 04:05 2016 UNTIL 06 DEC 05:15 2016. CREATED: 05 DEC 15:18 2016
*
A3100/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD: 1.Y1: MAGOD-DUMIN. 2.W112: TUSLI-ADMUX. 3.W192: TUSLI-DUMIN. 4.W187: OBDEG- TUSLI. 06 DEC 03:55 2016 UNTIL 06 DEC 04:55 2016. CREATED: 05 DEC 15:27 2016

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## Pepsi Cola

Dungeness said:


> Free Beacon is not as informed as it seems.


dont get me started on free beacon lmao


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## cirr

*2016.12.07 NOTAM *

*A3099/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD 1.B215: NUKTI-JIAYUGUAN VOR 'CHW'. 2.G470: BIKNO-DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'. 3.W187: DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'- NUKTI. 4.W191: DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'-MOVBI. 06 DEC 07:10 2016 UNTIL 06 DEC 08:10 2016. CREATED: 05 DEC 15:20 2016

*A3118/16 *- THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD 1.B215: NUKTI-JIAYUGUAN VOR 'CHW'. 2.G470: BIKNO-DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'. 3.W187: DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'- NUKTI. 4.W191: DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH'-MOVBI. 07 DEC 05:00 2016 UNTIL 07 DEC 06:00 2016. CREATED: 06 DEC 13:10 2016 

*A3121/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD : 1.G470: IPMUN-BIKNO. 2.W191: ESDEX-MOVBI 3.W192: ESDEX-RUSDI. 07 DEC 04:50 2016 UNTIL 07 DEC 06:00 2016. CREATED: 06 DEC 16:47 2016

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## cirr

Significant breakthroughs achieved in key technologies of next generation solid propulsion, studies on next next generation propulsion technologies launched

Entering no man's land 

China's missiles are set to fly higher，faster and farther.

*中国突破下一代固体火箭推进剂 预研更新一代*

2016年12月08日 10:54

来源：新华网

原标题：*“燃烧”激情，托举起大国长剑——记中国航天科技集团四院42所科研团队*

这是一个研究“燃烧”的机构——

所有科研工作都围绕最危险的燃烧展开：研究各种易燃材料，发掘燃烧的力量，使之变成可利用可驾驭的动力，是这个研究所的使命。

这是一个激情“燃烧”的群体——

从一无所有起步，半个多世纪中，一代代科研人员与高毒、高爆危险品为伴，燃烧青春，甚至生命，成功研制出一系列固体推进剂，使我国成为世界上第二个掌握高能固体推进技术的国家。

这里锻造出一个个“燃烧”的奇迹——

我国大多数固体推进的火箭和导弹，都使用这家研究所研制的固体燃料推进剂。正是他们研制的新型固体燃料，有力推动着我国航天和导弹事业进步。

履行“燃烧”的使命，砥砺燃烧的激情。在地处鄂西北的中国航天科技集团公司四院42所，几代研究人员默默坚守，艰难攻关，以一次次壮丽的燃烧，书写出爱国奉献的传奇。






11月18日，科研人员在试验室进行研究工作。新华社记者程敏摄

*追赶超越，为火箭腾飞提供更大能量*

2016年11月10日，我国长征系列运载火箭中唯一全固体运载火箭长征十一号火箭第二次发射，成功完成“一箭五星”飞行试验任务。

这种有着“太空出租车”之称的快速机动火箭，所用的推进剂就由42所研制。研究所党委书记柴玉萍说，由于采用固体推进，长征十一号首次实现了我国运载火箭“全箭整体储存、星箭快速对接、高效快速发射”等技术突破，这在应对自然灾害、突发事件等应急发射需求方面有重要意义。

“早期火箭和导弹都使用液体推进剂为动力。但由于液体推进剂储存、运输十分不便，因此美苏先后研制成功固体燃料推进剂。”研究所所长张小平说，固体燃料推进剂储存和运输方便，可靠性高，适用性广，在航天和国防领域都有着重要用途。

固体推进剂技术一出现，就成为大国十分重视和严密保护的尖端科技。

专门研究固体发动机燃料的42所科研人员，是许多壮丽发射的幕后英雄。他们的名字，他们的事业都罕为人知。然而，正是他们在固体推进剂研制上的一次次突破，推动了我国火箭和导弹事业一个个举世瞩目的跨越：从最早托举东方红一号飞天的火箭第三级发动机，到如今固体推进导弹越打越远……在他们的不息努力下，我国固体推进剂技术已经达到世界前沿水平。






11月18日，科研人员吴倩在进行分析测试研究。

“推进剂是决定火箭和导弹飞行能力的基础。”张小平说，目前，我国航天用固体运载火箭，以及火箭军和陆、海、空军部队所使用的国产固体推进导弹，多数复合固体推进剂技术都出自四院42所科研人员之手。

从上世纪50年代国防部五院成立固体推进剂研究小组，到60年代组建42所，几代科研人员献身科研、献身国防，在极端困难的条件下，突破了一代代固体推进剂技术，形成了系列推进剂配方和相关配套技术，不仅为国防安全提供了源源不绝的动力，还为我国航天事业发展提供了独特助力。

神舟飞船逃逸塔所用燃料，飞船、天宫和“飞天”舱外航天服上的各种密封件，都由该研究所研制。研究所系统产品开发中心主任邓康清说，长征五号发射前会排放低温氢气，如不能及时排除则可能影响发射安全。正是他们研制出的消氢发动机，解决了这一难题，安全护航火箭成功发射。






11月18日，科研人员在进行电镜扫描实验。

*自主创新，从星星之火到壮丽腾飞*

这是从一无所知开始的艰难攻关。

固体推进剂，被称为“改变游戏规则”的技术。在42所科研人员眼中，只有在这一领域跟上对手，祖国的和平与安全才有强大力量保证。

“当时只知道世界上有一种固体推进剂，其他什么都不知道。”回望半个多世纪前的那次攻关，81岁的韦启嵩至今难忘：“研究人员听说有一种材料是液态橡胶，就到专业的化学研究单位去请教，结果对方说这完全是‘奇谈’！”

“什么资料都找不到，没有哪个国家愿意在固体推进技术上为我们提供帮助。”76岁的徐桂林仍记得聂荣臻元帅那句感叹：“谁也不可能把最先进的东西交给别人。”






11月18日，科研人员何铁山在进行推进剂性能研究。

现实中的重重困难，挡不住科研人员为国铸造和平砥柱的雄心。

千百次摸索和试验，千百次跨越难以想象的困难……1958年7月，一根铅笔香烟大小的固体药条在国防部五院的一次大会上被点燃。就是那一簇小小的火苗，照亮了中国固体推进剂的突破之路。

这一点星星之火，经过研究人员10余年艰苦培育，最终在1970年变成了推动民族腾飞的熊熊火炬。东方红一号卫星上天时，火箭第三级首次使用了我国第一种固体推进剂，成功将卫星送到了太空。中国从此迈入世界上少数掌握固体推进剂技术的国家之列。

靠着这种不畏艰险、奋勇赶超的雄心，他们连续实现多次技术突破，推动了我国固体燃料推进技术的发展。






11月18日，科研人员在实验室进行助剂合成实验。

前进的道路从来都是不平坦的，追赶的进程也会经历曲折。

上世纪60年代，发达国家开始高能固体推进剂研究，我国也于1970年启动了一场“高能大会战”。然而，汇聚了包括四院42所在内的全国许多相关单位集体攻关，受当时科研条件所限，历时9年最终没能成功。

上世纪80年代中期，新一代高能固体推进剂面世。

“这是事关我国守卫和平能力的关键技术。”张小平说，虽然难度和风险空前，“但我们认为，宁可承担风险，也决不能在先进技术上输了国家安全的未来。”

这一次，他们要再次冲击世界固体推进技术的最前沿。

一种主要成分爆炸力极强且极不稳定，要不要使用？如何使用？新型粘合剂的合成方式千变万化，根本不可能一一试验。好不容易摸索出的“可能”路径，又被新的“不可能”挡住去路。

困难之后还是困难，失败后面连着失败。

“一年做了五六百次试验”，副所长庞爱民回忆说，几度绝望又几度绝处逢生。最终，课题组的研究人员们凭着一股九折不回的自主创新韧劲，成功取得突破——始于上世纪70年代的高能探索，两代人30年攻关，最终换来中国在这一技术领域站到世界前沿的格局。






11月19日，科研人员郭翔在思考推进剂发展发向。

*“迈入固体推进技术前沿的‘无人区’，接下来的突破会变得更难。”张小平说，着眼未来，四院42所下一代固体推进的关键技术已经取得重大突破，更新一代推进技术的预研也已展开。*

*牺牲奉献，用青春和生命点燃壮丽的燃烧*

8：34：53。

扭曲的表盘上，三根清晰的指针印，永远凝固下那个壮烈的时刻。

1979年7月11日，一声剧烈的爆炸声响彻鄂西北的郭峪山沟，正在厂房进行混合的高能药剂突然发生爆炸。两位女研究人员戴学华、杜品芳当场牺牲。

“在爆炸的废墟里，我们找到了烈士的遗物，一个‘上海牌’手表的表盘。”79岁的张金华回忆。强大的爆炸冲击波，竟然把三根指针嵌入了表盘。

在此前6年的一场爆炸中，两名研究人员受伤致残。

“固体推进剂研究的对象，几乎全部是敏感高爆和剧毒化学品，非常容易燃烧爆炸。”已退休的老所长侯林法说，“但这是国家安全需要，再危险我们也要干。”






11月19日，已经退休的老一代科研人员侯林法（中）、王北海（右）、陶自成（左）在火箭模型前留影。

上世纪80年代末，42所启动高能推进剂项目。面对极为敏感易爆，且爆炸力极强的新型材料，时任副所长的侯林法带头成立“敢死队”，投入这一高风险的研究。

“拿个装材料瓶子，要有一个人在前面专门开路。”52岁的特级技师张玉亭说，“只要有一点滴到地上，就会引起强烈爆炸。”

没有人比这些科研人员更了解其中的风险。侯林法回忆，在混合这种危险材料时，研究员祝一辰把同事们都赶走，自己却留下来近距离观察搅拌状态。

“那时，每次试验前我们都会互相开玩笑，问‘细粮吃了没有？’”80岁的陈荣定回忆。上世纪60年代初，生活条件艰苦，科研人员多数时候还在吃粗粮。“大家会开这样的玩笑，意思是每次试验前都要把细粮吃掉，‘死也要做个饱死鬼’。”

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## cirr

Continued

听到“敢死队”的称谓，听到老科研人员讲起这样的“传统”，怎能不让人动容？怎能不让人肃然起敬？面对国家安全需要，42所一代代科研人员选择了面对危险和困难，义无反顾。






11月18日，科研人员聂海英在进行材料分析测试。

“为了需要一个干燥的研究环境，我们研究所曾一声令下，一周内全所从四川搬到内蒙古。”徐桂林回忆。没有房子，就住窝棚或借住老乡家里；没有食堂，饭吃着吃着就冻住了；最难的是没有工具和仪器设备，“大家要冒着随时会燃烧、爆炸的危险，在农民加工粮食的石碾盘上碾化学材料。”

“固化好的药不合规格，我们就用刀切，再用木工刨仔细刨平。”张金华回忆，在那种一粒火星，一丝静电，甚至过重的摩擦都可能引起爆炸的条件下，他们硬是靠手工和非常原始的工具，研制成功我国第一种固体推进剂。

1970年，研究所又从内蒙古搬到鄂西北的深山中。“上山砍柴，下山挑水，遇上洪水还会断炊绝粮。”侯林法说，深山工作18年间，科研人员以忘我的精神，一边克服生活上的困难，一边接连取得技术突破。

今天，再次搬迁到湖北襄阳市的四院42所，已经建立起配套先进的实验和安全设施，老人们谈到的生活困难也已经成为过往的“谈资”。

然而，当我们翘首仰望一枚枚直刺云天的大国利剑，我们同样应该记住，这些以燃烧的激情托举起它们的无数默默无闻的科研人员；应该记住，42所这个鲜为人知的名字和被尘封的故事。

延伸阅读

为实现中国梦加注强劲能量

当火箭和导弹一次次拔地而起直刺长空，有谁会想到，那壮丽的燃烧是谁人点燃？

这是一个罕为人知的事业。

航天科技集团四院42研究所，是我国专门从事固体推进剂技术的核心研究机构。目前，我国的固体运载火箭和导弹，多数复合固体推进剂技术都出自该所科研人员之手。

这是一个关于燃烧的传奇。

42所研究的固体推进剂技术，是大国都十分重视的国防尖端技术之一。一代代科研人员殚精竭虑，以连续的创新突破，推动我国火箭和导弹的一次次壮丽起飞，创造了科研攻关的奇迹。

他们的成就举世瞩目，他们的名字却罕为人知。

从北京到四川，从内蒙古草原到鄂西北山区，为了祖国的安全，一代代科研人员南迁北徙；从不知道“液体橡胶”为何物到掌握固体推进技术，从用石碾处理易爆化学品直至追到世界固体推进技术前沿，一代代科研人员前仆后继……科研奇迹的背后，是一代代42所人为国拼搏献身科研的感人故事。






11月18日，科研人员朱朝阳在进行功能剂合成研究。新华社记者程敏摄

是一种什么样的精神，支撑他们默默坚守在危险的工作岗位？

是一种什么样的力量，推动他们不计代价攻关克难创新突破？

“艰苦创业、无私奉献、团结协作、敢于探索”，写在研究所陈列馆上这个看起来并不出奇的“郭峪精神”，却因为一代代科研人员忘我攻关，因为那些壮烈牺牲，因为那些数不清的奋斗攻关故事，而被赋予了震撼人心的力量。只有决心为祖国奉献青春和生命的人，才能忍受一无所有中起步的艰辛，忍受跨越每一代技术难关的艰难，忍受与剧毒易爆危险品为伴的风险，以及，隐姓埋名默默奉献的寂寞与清苦。对他们来说，生命的全部壮丽，都凝固和燃烧在了固体燃料那澎湃的能量之中。

郭峪，一个42所曾驻留攻关18年的无人山谷。在这里，科研人员们一边过着“下山挑水，上山砍柴”的艰苦生活，一边创造了举世瞩目的成就。这是走向伟大复兴征程上中国奋斗者的典型形象。他们身上所闪耀的，正是我们这个时代的伟大精神，从火箭腾飞到国家经济、文化的全面腾飞，千千万万像他们这样的奋斗者，创造了“中国速度”的奇迹。

历史性的成就令人鼓舞，新的历史使命催人奋进。今天，与42所一样，我们国家在诸多领域，都接近或抵达了世界前沿，面临步入“无人区”后新的更大挑战。前沿的竞争将更为激烈，更需要各行各业的奋斗者们像42所、四院乃至整个中国航天的科研人员一样，共同发扬以爱国主义为核心的伟大民族精神，为实现“两个一百年”奋斗目标、实现中华民族伟大复兴中国梦注入新的强大能量。

记者：徐壮志、熊金超、袁志国

摄影：程敏

新媒体编辑：郑晓奕、王晓梅、唐荣桂



http://news.ifeng.com/a/20161208/50383660_0.shtml

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## samsara

*"China Should Build More Nuclear Arms, ICBMs" (2016-12-08)*

_"China won't pay into Trump's protection racket. It should use the money to build more strategic nuclear arms and accelerate the deployment of the DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile. China's military spending in 2017 should be augmented significantly. China needs to always prepare for the worst and stay open to the good."_ - Global Times

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1022482.shtml

Even China Daily ran a related article in its printed edition (2016-12-08)
http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/epaper/2016-12/08/content_27612091.htm

I always wonder, never grasp it why China has only 300 strategic nuke heads by the official figures, the smallest arsenal among the P5 nations. This matter always put China in belittled situation and encourage others to think its nuke deterrence is insignificant, ignorable, in particular with those First Nuclear Strike; Prompt Global Strike military doctrines adopted by some, plus the many ABM/BDM installations encircling China, purportedly to neutralize China's second (retaliatory) nuclear strikes. That's a dangerous perception that may cause some serious miscalculation and unwanted dire consequences. Time for China to rectify such mistakes asap, imo.

Because of its deterrent nature, "a respectable or an effective deterrence" is a mandatory quality to preserve from time to time!

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## cirr

Need at least 500 of this - nuclear tipped

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> Need at least 500 of this - nuclear tipped
> 
> View attachment 360417



Note the geometry of the payload fairing. This missile definitely has MIRVs, if it is indeed a ballistic missile.


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## Beast

samsara said:


> *"China Should Build More Nuclear Arms, ICBMs" (2016-12-08)*
> 
> _"China won't pay into Trump's protection racket. It should use the money to build more strategic nuclear arms and accelerate the deployment of the DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile. China's military spending in 2017 should be augmented significantly. China needs to always prepare for the worst and stay open to the good."_ - Global Times
> 
> http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1022482.shtml
> 
> Even China Daily ran a related article in its printed edition (2016-12-08)
> http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/epaper/2016-12/08/content_27612091.htm
> 
> I always wonder, never grasp it why China has only 300 strategic nuke heads by the official figures, the smallest arsenal among the P5 nations. This matter always put China in belittled situation and encourage others to think its nuke deterrence is insignificant, ignorable, in particular with those First Nuclear Strike; Prompt Global Strike military doctrines adopted by some, plus the many ABM/BDM installations encircling China, purportedly to neutralize China's second (retaliatory) nuclear strikes. That's a dangerous perception that may cause some serious miscalculation and unwanted dire consequences. Time for China to rectify such mistakes asap, imo.
> 
> Because of its deterrent nature, "a respectable or an effective deterrence" is a mandatory quality to preserve from time to time!


No first used policy shall continue. This will legalized our ABSM. But nuclear stockpile actual amount shall declared. I doubt 300 nuclear is the true figure.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Beast said:


> No first used policy shall continue. This will legalized our ABSM. But nuclear stockpile actual amount shall declared. I doubt 300 nuclear is the true figure.



China's nuclear warheads being stored in the 5000 KM underground tunnel.

CPC is deliberately leaking this pic, and the western media can keep believing that China only got 300 nukes stored in that underground tunnel.

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## Beast

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> China's nuclear warheads being stored in the 5000 KM underground tunnel.
> 
> CPC is deliberately leaking this pic, and the western media can keep believing that China only got 300 nukes stored in that underground tunnel.
> 
> View attachment 360434


Trump will make China reveal its true amount of nuclear arsenal and true face of Chinese MIRV.

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## cirr

The 1st DF-41 brigade formed this year(see People's Daily article).

There will be one new DF-41 brigade created each year for the next N years, N>10.

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## samsara

Beast said:


> *No first used policy shall continue.* This will legalized our ABSM. But nuclear stockpile actual amount shall declared. I doubt 300 nuclear is the true figure.


Beast, I don't get your short sentence! Not sure what did you mean!

However, seeing today's aggressive FIRST STRIKE (FIRST USE) nuclear doctrine of major powers, I think it's *obsolete* for China to stick to its "No First Strike" nuclear doctrine, instead just changes it the same as other major powers and *declares it accordingly*, as well as increasing the numbers of strategic nuke arsenal and *declare the new quantity accordingly too*! It's long overdue for China to update its strategic nuke stocks same as its update of the official (physical) gold reserves  
*for a much understated strength may inadvertently cause some dangerous overly miscalculations!*

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## cirr



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## samsara

samsara said:


> Beast, I don't get your short sentence! Not sure what did you mean!
> 
> However, seeing today's aggressive FIRST STRIKE (FIRST USE) nuclear doctrine of major powers, I think it's *obsolete* for China to stick to its "No First Strike" nuclear doctrine, instead just changes it the same as other major powers and *declares it accordingly*, as well as increasing the numbers of strategic nuke arsenal and *declare the new quantity accordingly too*! It's long overdue for China to update its strategic nuke stocks same as its update of the official (physical) gold reserves
> *for a much understated strength may inadvertently cause some dangerous overly miscalculations!*


I just finished watching the movie *"The Coming War on China", an excellent movie by JOHN PILGER, an independent film maker from Australia, a must-watch, an eye-opening movie* for every sane mind! It explains a lot what's happening in the Asia-Pacific (covering the Marshall Island, Bikini Island, Japan, Korea, China, Australia, and so on) in the past, at present, and possibly in future!

I STRONGLY SUGGEST every one here to watch this movie! It's quite worth the viewing time and it flows quickly covering the so-called “First-Island-Chain” and so on.

If a picture is worth of thousands of words then a good movie is worth of thousands of pictures...

(A higher resolution avails at torrent)





*@Beast *

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## slng

I did open up a thread about the movie but was closed down for unknown reason.
This is a recent movie developed as documentary and understanding of historic for "man-kind".

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## Beast

slng said:


> I did open up a thread about the movie but was closed down for unknown reason.
> This is a recent movie developed as documentary and understanding of historic for "man-kind".


They are many western boot licker here still serving their white master. They closed down your thread to prevent the truth from spreading.



samsara said:


> I just finished watching the movie *"The Coming War on China", an excellent movie by JOHN PILGER, an independent film maker from Australia, a must-watch, an eye-opening movie* for every sane mind! It explains a lot what's happening in the Asia-Pacific (covering the Marshall Island, Bikini Island, Japan, Korea, China, Australia, and so on) in the past, at present, and possibly in future!
> 
> I STRONGLY SUGGEST every one here to watch this movie! It's quite worth the viewing time and it flows quickly covering the so-called “First-Island-Chain” and so on.
> 
> If a picture is worth of thousands of words then a good movie is worth of thousands of pictures...
> 
> (A higher resolution avails at torrent)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *@Beast *


Not to afraid pal. China is fully prepare for nuclear war with US. Unless US is willing to kamikaze with China. There is no way US can destroy China and survive.

China demonstrated hydrogen bomb using much smaller size and yet could yield 300tines the explosion in Hiroshima. And that is 1967. You can imagine in 2016 , with aid of world fastest supercomputer. China could design a far smaller and yet deadly hydrogen miniature warhead that could yield 500-700times of Hiroshima hydrogen bomb that just one alone can wipe out 2-3 states of US.

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## atan651

US will only respect nuclear weapons and nothing else.

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## cirr

The initial flight test of a new missile declared a complete success:

http://124.205.131.137/article.acti...4483&products=11000112-1&rightList=1126706016

CASIC are go! 

Report dated 15.12.2016.

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## cirr

16.12.2016

Maiden flight of a certain type of "product" of extreme pioneering significance successfully concluded:

http://124.205.131.137/article.acti...4494&products=11000112-1&rightList=1126706016

CAST are go!

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## GS Zhou

cirr said:


> Maiden flight of a certain type of "product" of extreme pioneering significance successfully concluded:


the article said "稳得住，不解体，分得开，点得着，打得准，测得到". Sounds like some extremely high speed stuff launched from the space??

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## slng

Probably the 'arguable' new thrust which is against newton law.


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## Shotgunner51

slng said:


> I did open up a thread about the movie but was closed down for unknown reason.
> This is a recent movie developed as documentary and understanding of historic for "man-kind".


Closed down? Let me check , I have found these:
https://defence.pk/threads/the-coming-war-on-china-documentary.466175/
https://defence.pk/threads/the-coming-war-on-china’-john-pilger-new-film-trailer.466382/
If you any link, date or section just let me know, let me try to search again, will re-open (will be merged with similar topic) if I can.

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## cirr

GS Zhou said:


> the article said "稳得住，不解体，分得开，点得着，打得准，测得到". Sounds like some extremely high speed stuff launched from the space??



I wish I knew exactly.

When read in conjunction with an earlier article published in Nov. 2015(see below), one might infer that

(1) the "product" in question is a spacecraft
(2) it is ground-launched, and
(3) it is a weapon

铸剑团队：在磨砺中走向成熟
刘淮宇
日期 : 20151113
期号 : 3004
版号 : 2
版名 : 综合新闻
栏目 : 走进型号试验队
作者 : 刘淮宇
标题 : 铸剑团队：在磨砺中走向成熟
副题 : ——记中国航天科技集团公司一院某型号研制团队

2013年深秋一天的傍晚，是中国航天科技集团公司一院某型号产品进行“首秀”的时刻。

然而，试验失利了。

消失的轨迹

事情过去两年了，型号副总设计师迪总仍对当时的情景记忆犹新。*型号点火升空后*，在夜空划出一道漂亮的弧线，它的实际飞行轨迹与设计的飞行轨迹在电脑屏幕上一同延伸……一切都是那么完美。

可就在大家准备松口气的时候，实际飞行轨迹从屏幕上消失了，指挥大厅里的空气骤然凝固。

是不是遥测设备出了问题？测控人员立即调动其他观测手段，试图寻找型号产品的蛛丝马迹，但没有踪影。经验丰富的专家们判断，可能遭遇失利了。

但现场并没有出现慌乱的情况，前来指导试验的院领导和型号“两总”紧急商议，确定四条思路对试验全过程进行条分缕析，力求尽快将问题定位。

那一夜，无人入眠，队员们分头核查自己负责的分系统可能出现的问题。与之同时，四辆越野车轰鸣启动，向产品残骸可能的落点进发……

两个月后，问题定位，并通过试验得到了复现。



两年过去了，团队中的每一个人现在仍能脱口说出失利那天的准确日期。

首飞的产品从提出设计概念到一院自筹立项，再从确定方案到飞行试验用了多年时间，出现这种结果，是“谁也不愿意看到的”。但科研试验本身就存在着高风险性，成与败往往只在一线间。这次失利给团队中每个人都上了宝贵的一课。

型号副总设计师迪总介绍说，这支队伍有个特点，就是悲喜不形于色，失利之时，没有人歇斯底里，而是按照布置各自排查自己那摊子事；而之后飞行试验取得圆满成功时，也没人表现出异常的兴奋。

这个团队的总设计师是位“巾帼英雄”，长年躬耕于型号领域。团队文化的那种内敛和沉稳，也许与这位女总师的影响有关。

在指导队员们分析问题时，这位女总师与往常研制时一样，这种强大的内心令同事们十分钦佩。队员们私下会议论，其实总师在面对失利时、排查问题时，心里何尝不是压力巨大呢，她只是从来不表现出来罢了。

型号副总设计师来总说，一个型号队伍没有失利的经历，就无法真正地成熟和强大起来。

去年夏天，方案进行全新改进后，型号产品再次实施飞行试验，一举成功。此刻，经历了失利挫败的那些人心里有着别样的滋味。

2011年入职、一直从事这个型号研制的小王说：“失利教会了我什么叫细节决定成败，也真正体会到*航天型号产品*研制的艰辛和不易。”



第二次飞行试验打得非常漂亮。掌声面前，这支团队依旧保持着淡定。

今年上半年，该型号产品正式批准立项，但设计的技术指标被大范围调整，改进之多、难度之大不亚于研制一个全新型号。按照装备采购的要求，多家研制单位还要从方案到单机进行残酷PK，只有胜出者才能在下一步的研制生产中掌握主动权。

令人欣慰的是，该型号产品研制团队在与对手的竞争中表现得非常出色。那些平日里不爱张扬的小伙子和姑娘们，在证明自己方案的优越性时变得能说善道，而且能以理服人。

“吃透设计机理，才能达到这种境界。”结构副主任设计师小策认为，这是多年参与型号研制磨砺出来的。

主任设计师大平记得，该型号产品开始进行研制时，核心设计人员的平均年龄才30岁。而如今，这些年轻人已经能够在专业上独当一面。小锋博士就是一个典型的例子，由于在专业上小有建树，其他团队要做复核复算时往往都要请小锋出马。

看着队员们特别是年轻队员伴随着型号逐渐成长起来，让女总师觉得这是比“型号成功”更大的收获。

这位总设计师说，航天人不仅要踏踏实实一步步做好已有型号的研制改进，更要站在国家战略安全需求的高度，主动探索型号产品未来发展规律，提早谋划研制管用、好用的型号装备，尽到航天人的使命和责任。

（中国航天报）

and

但这并不是终点。陈总清晰地看到从这次试验成功到*型号正式装备*的道路还有多远。他说：“不管多难，只要目标清晰，步伐坚定，即使面对难以逾越的困难，也总能在黎明前的黑暗中看到希望的光芒。”

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## cirr

*2016.12.21 NOTAM *

2016-12-21 11:39:15

分类： 武器试验

*A3221/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD: 1.W66: NUKTI- EJINAQI VOR 'JNQ'. 2.B215: NUKTI- JIAYUGUAN VOR 'CHW'. 3.W187: DUNHUANG VOR 'DNH' - NUKTI. 21 DEC 02:45 2016 UNTIL 21 DEC 03:40 2016. CREATED: 20 DEC 12:59 2016 

*A3225/16* - THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD: 1.W192: IPMUN-RUSDI. 2.W191: ESDEX-MOVBI. 3.G470: IPMUN-BIKNO. 21 DEC 02:45 2016 UNTIL 21 DEC 03:40 2016. CREATED: 20 DEC 16:41 2016

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## grey boy 2

Cold launch

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## Hindustani78

Chinese military vehicles carrying DF-21D antiship ballistic missiles, potentially capable of sinking a US Nimitz-class aircraft carrier in a single strike, travel past Tiananmen Gate during a military parade to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the end of World War II in Beijing, September 3, 2015. Andy Wong/Reuters 





China has also emerged as an influential arms supplier since the 1980s, when Beijing proved willing to provide weaponry to Iran and Iraq during their brutal war that lasted most of that decade.

From 2012 to 2015, China's arms-transfer agreements to developing countries averaged more than $4 billion annually, with 2015 as the highest year, when the country made $6 billion in deals. Those sales can be attributed to an ongoing relationship with Pakistan


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## samsara

Hindustani78 said:


> Chinese military vehicles carrying DF-21D antiship ballistic missiles, potentially capable of sinking a US Nimitz-class aircraft carrier in a single strike, travel past Tiananmen Gate during a military parade to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the end of World War II in Beijing, September 3, 2015. Andy Wong/*Reuters*
> ...
> *China has also emerged as an influential arms supplier since the 1980s, when Beijing proved willing to provide weaponry to Iran and Iraq during their brutal war that lasted most of that decade.*
> ...


WHAT A CUNNING TWISTING LINE by the Rothschild-controlled REUTERS, as if the NATO Clan played as saints not supplying the devastating weapons to Saddam Hussein regime incl. the prohibited CHEMICAL WEAPONS used by Saddam Hussein's forces against the Iranians!! In fact they were the major arm suppliers and did reap the lion share of this arm sale bonanza.

This almost decade-long war of attrition between Iraq vs Iran happened because the NATO Clan supported Iraq under Saddam Hussein to attack Iran to weaken the "renegade" nation under the Grand Ayatollah Khomeini, as well as for other geopolitical reasons (the sectarian rivalry between Saudi vs Iran as well as Israel wanted no strong nation in that region) and created somewhat oil scarcity that propped up the oil price then (Petro-windfall for the rest oil exporters and Western oil giants), while this war also gave very good arm sale bonanza for the NATO Clan to sell weapons to Iraq. Both nations of Iran and Iraq underwent nearly decade-long (1980 ~ 1988), quite huge losses and setbacks caused by one of the longest grinding wars post the Vietnam War, a carefully plotted war whereas neither side would win yet the war would be protracted to suck off the resources of the two major regional powers in the Middle East!! Both nations were the pathetic victims, mainly because the megalomaniac Saddam Hussein was the dumb willing pawn, fell into the diabolic plots by the Axis of Empire!

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## grey boy 2

1 YJ-63 fired from H-6K destroyed one whole building 
一发毁一栋楼！空军轰6K发射改进型鹰击63导弹

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## ChineseTiger1986

DF-41

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## Ultima Thule

BoQ77 said:


> Russian tech


yes, it is based on Russian tech, and you have too


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## ChineseTiger1986

pakistanipower said:


> yes, it is based on Russian tech, and you have too



The Trident II D5 missile also got the cold launch, but it is not based on the Russian tech.

That Viet is an infamous anti-China troll, just ignore him.

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## cirr

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> DF-41
> 
> View attachment 364622
> 
> 
> View attachment 364623
> 
> 
> View attachment 364624
> 
> 
> View attachment 364625



Happy New Year!

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## Cybernetics

grey boy 2 said:


> 1 YJ-63 fired from H-6K destroyed one whole building
> 一发毁一栋楼！空军轰6K发射改进型鹰击63导弹


"bombs away!"
This gif never fails to put a smile on my face. Just look at that power! 
If that 4 story building is to scale: 
assuming 3 meters height per floor
height = 12m
The fireball radius was about 3 times higher/wider than the building height, about 35m fireball radius or 70m wide(using rounded numbers for simplicity), and that's only the fireball, then factor in the blast radius. That's INSANE! If it can be guided through a window or penetrate steel reinforced concrete then this can vaporize the insides of an office building sized compound. Imagine what it can do to a small island fortification.

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## The SC



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## Akasa

Those are DF-11s.


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## Azeri440

SinoSoldier said:


> Those are DF-11s.



actually its both DF-11 and DF-21, you can see DF-21 launching at 0:37


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## somebozo

What were the targets and purpose of this exercise?


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## The SC

somebozo said:


> What were the targets and purpose of this exercise?


A salvo targeting a big wide target.. you can see then converge after launch..


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## ChineseTiger1986

The TEL used by the DF-41.

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## BoQ77

SinoSoldier said:


> Those are DF-11s.



You're right.
Salvo is by DF-11


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## beijingwalker

*New Chinese ''USA Killer'' Mobile Missile System Spotted during Road Testing.*
*



*
The new-generation mobile missile system has been spotted testing in China. The video shows new long-range ballistic missile mounted on a heavy truck.
American experts report that this DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) and estimate the DF-41 to be an 80-ton, three-stage solid-fuel missile capable of carrying between six and 10 nuclear warheads.
The DF-41 can carry from one to 10 nuclear warheads with yields ranging from 250 kilotons to one megaton. This missile is being called the “USA Killer” because it places all the U.S. at China’s mercy.
The first information about the new generation Chinese ballistic missile – which according to the Washington Free Beacon is capable of reaching any location within the US – emerged in the American media in July 2014.
According to the Washington Free Beacon, the Chinese military staged its previous DF-41 ballistic missile test launch on December 5, 2015, when a missile was launched from a container mounted on a special railroad car.
China is estimated to have 260 nuclear warheads, with an unknown number of them active and ready to deploy. U.S. intelligence in 2013 estimated the Chinese active ICBM arsenal to range between 50 and 75 land- and sea-based missiles


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## beijingwalker

China's DF 41 ICBM Longest range nuclear missile


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## yolo2016

"*Places USA at China's mercy."*

ROFL. I guess no objections to our missile shield around you anymore?


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## Deino

*What a plain-stupid and warmongering thread-title !!! *

*Topic name changed and even more ... we already have and had this post several times.*


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## onebyone

Is China's 'Carrier-Killer' Really A Threat To The U.S. Navy?

Good Job


Hand of God






Ten DF21 Missiles Launch.






China lunch world most dangerous anti gunships missile.






Should America Fear China s Carrier Killer Missile DF 21D anti ship ballistic missile

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## cirr

PLAAF Central Theater's new HQ-9B unit

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> PLAAF Central Theater's new HQ-9B unit



Any more details on HQ-9B vs HQ-9?


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## cirr

Hypersonic cruise/glide missile with terminal course correction....declared a complete success

Tiankong-1(Sky-1). Yes

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## Dungeness

Going home for Chinese New Year?

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## cirr

41

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## 星海军事

High power microwave weapon is rewarded with the first prize of National Award for Science and Technology Progress 2016.

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## cirr

星海军事 said:


> High power microwave weapon is rewarded with the first prize of National Award for Science and Technology Progress 2016.



News came out of nowhere.

Best thing since sliced bread judging by the way this pioneering technology has been described.

Over 6 years passed since initial success, enough time to have weaponized the technology or even begun operational deployment?

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## ChineseTiger1986

@Martian2 

China was testing the DF-41 with MIRVed HGV warheads on January 15th 2017, the number of the MIRV warheads during the test could be up to ten.

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## JSCh

*Dongfeng-41 will bring China more respect: Global Times*
(People's Daily Online) 04:08, January 25, 2017

Beijing has deployed advanced Dongfeng-41 ICBMs in northernmost China’s Heilongjiang Province, which borders Russia, according to reports based on images.

Some Hong Kong and Taiwan media reported that pictures of China's Dongfeng-41 ballistic missile were exposed on Chinese mainland websites. It was revealed that the pictures were taken in Heilongjiang Province. Military analysts believe that this is perhaps the second Dongfeng-41 strategic missile brigade and it should be deployed in northeastern China.

According to reports, the Dongfeng-41 is a nuclear solid-fuel road-mobile intercontinental ballistic missile. With a range of 14,000km and a payload of 10-12 nuclear warheads, it can target anywhere in the world and is widely considered one of the most advanced intercontinental ballistic missiles.

There has been constant speculation about the Dongfeng-41. Its deployment is classified at the highest military levels. But most military experts believe that China has finished the research and production of the Dongfeng-41 and the conditions for deployment are optimal. But there has been no authoritative information on whether China has a Dongfeng-41 strategic missile brigade, how many such brigades it has and where they are deployed.

Some media claimed that the Chinese military intentionally revealed the Dongfeng-41 and connected it with the inauguration of US President Donald Trump. They think this is Beijing's response to Trump's provocative remarks on China.

According to RIA Novosti, the alleged deployment of the DF-41 near Russia’s border should not be read as a threat to Russia, confirmed by military analyst Konstantin Sivkov.

“DF-41 missiles placed near Russia’s border are a smaller threat than if they were placed deeper in the Chinese territory. Such missiles usually have a very large ‘dead zone’ [area within minimal range that cannot be attacked by a weapon],” he said, adding that the ICBMs would not be able to target Russia’s Far East and most of Eastern Siberia from the Heilongjiang Province.

“Certainly, the actions of the Chinese military, if the reports prove correct, the military build-up in China is not perceived as a threat to our country,” said Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov. The Kremlin agreed with the assessment, saying that China is Russia’s “strategic partner in political and economic senses.”

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## grey boy 2

Night missiles

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## haidian

*China may be developing new long-range air-to-air missile*
Thu Jan 26, 2017 | 12:32am EST

China may be testing a new, long-range air-to-air missile that could take out early warning aircraft and aerial refueling aircraft, a state-run newspaper said on Thursday, after pictures of the new missile surfaced online.

President Xi Jinping is overseeing an ambitious military modernization program that includes stealth jets and aircraft carriers. The country has also tested anti-satellite missiles.

The official China Daily said the People's Liberation Army had recently posted pictures online of a J-11B fighter carrying a large, unidentified missile during drills last year.

Air force researcher Fu Qianshao told the newspaper he believed the missile was designed to hit distant high-value targets, such as early warning aircraft, normally outside actual combat zones.

That represents an improved capability over existing Chinese missiles, which have ranges of less than 100 km (62 miles).

"The best solution to this problem I can figure out is to send a super-manoeuvrable fighter jet with very long-range missiles to destroy those high-value targets, which are the 'eyes' of enemy jets," Fu said.

"So the successful development of this potential new missile would be a major breakthrough."

The missile may even have an actual range of 400 km (249 miles), exceeding those used by Western air forces, and dive down on targets from the stratosphere, he added.

The air force has yet to formally comment on the new missile.

Chinese state media periodically report on new weapons before there is official confirmation of their existence.

The military modernization comes as China has rattled nerves around the region with increasingly assertive moves to bolster its sovereignty claims in the South China Sea and over Taiwan, which it regards as a breakaway province.

China's first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, recently sailed around the self-ruled island in what China called a routine drill, but which prompted Taiwan to scramble fighter jets and navy ships.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-defence-idUSKBN15A0HI

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## samsara

*How "made in China" missiles perform in military combat*

_Display of various missiles_

New China TV, Nov 2016
*



*

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## Devil Soul

*China may be developing new long-range air-to-air missile*
REUTERS — PUBLISHED less than a minute ago
WHATSAPP
 0 COMMENTS
 PRINT
China may be testing a new, long-range air-to-air missile that could take out early warning aircraft and aerial refuelling aircraft, a state-run newspaper said on Thursday, after pictures of the new missile surfaced online.

President Xi Jinping is overseeing an ambitious military modernisation program that includes stealth jets and aircraft carriers. The country has also tested anti-satellite missiles.

The official China Daily said the People's Liberation Army had recently posted pictures online of a J-11B fighter carrying a large, unidentified missile during drills last year.

Air force researcher Fu Qianshao told the newspaper he believed the missile was designed to hit distant high-value targets, such as early warning aircraft, normally outside actual combat zones.

ADVERTISEMENT
That represents an improved capability over existing Chinese missiles, which have ranges of less than 100 km (62 miles).

"The best solution to this problem I can figure out is to send a super-manoeuvrable fighter jet with very long-range missiles to destroy those high-value targets, which are the 'eyes' of enemy jets," Fu said.

"So the successful development of this potential new missile would be a major breakthrough."

The missile may even have an actual range of 400 km, exceeding those used by Western air forces, and dive down on targets from the stratosphere, he added.

The air force has yet to formally comment on the new missile.

Chinese state media periodically report on new weapons before there is official confirmation of their existence.

The military modernisation comes as China has rattled nerves around the region with increasingly assertive moves to bolster its sovereignty claims in the South China Sea and over Taiwan, which it regards as a breakaway province.

China's first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, recently sailed around the self-ruled island in what China called a routine drill, but which prompted Taiwan to scramble fighter jets and navy ships.

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## Kurlang

*China may be developing new long-range air-to-air missile*

China may be testing a new, long-range air-to-air missile that could take out early warning aircraft and aerial refuelling aircraft, a state-run newspaper said on Thursday, after pictures of the new missile surfaced online.

President Xi Jinping is overseeing an ambitious military modernisation program that includes stealth jets and aircraft carriers. The country has also tested anti-satellite missiles.

The official China Daily said the People's Liberation Army had recently posted pictures online of a J-11B fighter carrying a large, unidentified missile during drills last year.

Air force researcher Fu Qianshao told the newspaper he believed the missile was designed to hit distant high-value targets, such as early warning aircraft, normally outside actual combat zones.

That represents an improved capability over existing Chinese missiles, which have ranges of less than 100 km (62 miles).

"The best solution to this problem I can figure out is to send a super-manoeuvrable fighter jet with very long-range missiles to destroy those high-value targets, which are the 'eyes' of enemy jets," Fu said.

"So the successful development of this potential new missile would be a major breakthrough."

The missile may even have an actual range of 400 km, exceeding those used by Western air forces, and dive down on targets from the stratosphere, he added.

The air force has yet to formally comment on the new missile.

Chinese state media periodically report on new weapons before there is official confirmation of their existence.

The military modernisation comes as China has rattled nerves around the region with increasingly assertive moves to bolster its sovereignty claims in the South China Sea and over Taiwan, which it regards as a breakaway province.

China's first aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, recently sailed around the self-ruled island in what China called a routine drill, but which prompted Taiwan to scramble fighter jets and navy ships.

http://www.dawn.com/news/1310850/china-may-be-developing-new-long-range-air-to-air-missile


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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> SD-10A SAM/天龙-50



Interesting to see that the Sky-Dragon SAM has the same front section as the PL-12 ... would be interesting if an AAM-version with a wider diameter would not also be an option or if this was a competitor to the new PL-XX?


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## samsara

*US Think Tank CSIS: China has the most active ballistic missile development program in the world (2017-01-27)*

_China features its missiles most prominently in its developing anti-access/area denial (A2/AD) doctrines, which use a combination of ballistic and cruise missiles launched from air, land and sea to target opposing military assets in the Asia-Pacific theater. China is also developing a number of advanced capabilities such as maneuverable anti-ship ballistic missiles, MIRVs, and hypersonic glide vehicles. The combination of these trends degrade the survivability of foundational elements of the US power projection like the aircraft carrier and forward air bases. China also has a relatively small but developing contingent of nuclear intercontinental ballistic missiles capable of striking the Continental US (CONUS), as well as a growing fleet of nuclear ballistic missile submarines._






MISSILE TYPES






_Source: US Think Tank - Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS)_

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## grey boy 2

*Royal Saudi Navy Frigate Badly Damaged in Houthi Attack; Iran Claims Chinese-made C-802 Missile Hit Warship*
*By* Arthur Dominic Villasanta | Jan 30, 2017 07:34 PM EST

If true, this will be the second successful missile attack on a ship belonging to the Saudi-coalition. On Oct. 2, 2016, a C-802 Chinese-made AShM supplied by Iran heavily damaged the United Arab Emirates vessel, HSV Swift, as the ship was transiting the Bab al-Mandeb Strait off Yemen.

The C-802 is the export version of China's YJ-8 AShM and carries a 190 kg warhead to a distance of 120 km. The YJ-8 arms China's Xian H-6 strategic heavy bombers.




http://www.chinatopix.com/articles/...e-badly-damaged-houthi-attack-iran-claims.htm

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## beijingwalker

*US Wary as China Tests Missile With 10 Warheads*
Wednesday February 01, 2017
In what defense officials say represents a dramatic shift in Beijing's nuclear strategy at a time of growing tensions with the United States, China tested a new version of a long-range missile with 10 warheads, *The Washington Free Beacon reported on Tuesday.*

The test of the DF-5C missile is significant, because it demonstrates that China is boosting the number of warheads in its arsenal and could alter the strategic balance, especially as it strives for a second-strike capability.

Two officials familiar with reports of the missile test said it was carried out last month and was monitored closely by U.S. intelligence agencies.

The test comes as China is stepping up preparedness for a possible military conflict with the U.S., the*South China Morning Post reported.*

After President Donald Trump's inauguration, the Chinese army said that the chances of war have become "more real" amid an increasingly complex security situation in Asia Pacific.

International Assessment and Strategy Center analyst Rick Fisher told the Free Beacon that the missile test appears to be sending a signal to the new Trump administration due to his vocal opposition to their military buildup on disputed South China Sea islands and on American policy toward Taiwan, which Beijing regards as a renegade province and not an independent country.

Fisher added that this test is only the latest in attempts by China to demonstrate strength toward the U.S., as previous signs "have included the public revelation in late December via Chinese websites of the new DF-41 ICBM in Heilongjiang province, plus articles in China's state-controlled media touting the need for China to increase its nuclear forces to intimidate Washington."

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/China-Tests-Missile/2017/01/31/id/771269/

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## cirr

DF-5C？Gertz is a bad lad. 

*China Tests Missile With 10 Warheads*

*Multi-warhead weapon tested amid growing tensions with the United States*





BY: Bill Gertz Follow @BillGertz 

January 31, 2017 5:00 am

*China flight tested a new variant of a long-range missile with 10 warheads in what defense officials say represents a dramatic shift in Beijing's strategic nuclear posture.*

The flight test of the *DF-5C* missile was carried out earlier this month using 10 multiple independently targetable reentry vehicles, or MIRVs. The test of the inert warheads was monitored closely by U.S. intelligence agencies, said two officials familiar with reports of the missile test.

The missile was fired from the Taiyuan Space Launch Center in central China and flew to an impact range in the western Chinese desert.

No other details about the test could be learned. Pentagon spokesman Cmdr. Gary Ross suggested in a statement the test was monitored.

"The [Defense Department] routinely monitors Chinese military developments and accounts for PLA capabilities in our defense plans," Ross told the _Washington Free Beacon_.





DF-5 launch

The test of a missile with 10 warheads is significant because it indicates the secretive Chinese military is increasing the number of warheads in its arsenal.

Estimates of China's nuclear arsenal for decades put the number of strategic warheads at the relatively low level of around 250 warheads.

U.S. intelligence agencies in February reportedthat China had begun adding warheads to older DF-5 missiles, in a move that has raised concerns for strategic war planners.

Uploading Chinese missiles from single or triple warhead configurations to up to 10 warheads means the number of warheads stockpiled is orders of magnitude larger than the 250 estimate.

Currently, U.S. nuclear forces—land-based and sea-based nuclear missiles and bombers—have been configured to deter Russia's growing nuclear forces and the smaller Chinese nuclear force.

Under the 2010 U.S.-Russian arms treaty, the United States is slated to reduce its nuclear arsenal to 1,550 deployed warheads.

A boost in the Chinese nuclear arsenal to 800 or 1,000 warheads likely would prompt the Pentagon to increase the U.S. nuclear warhead arsenal by taking weapons out of storage.

The new commander of the U.S. Strategic Command, Air Force Gen. John Hyten, stated during a Senate confirmation hearing in September that he is concerned about China's growing nuclear arsenal.

"I am fully aware that China continues to modernize its nuclear missile force and is striving for a secure second-strike capability," Hyten told the Senate Armed Services Committee.

"Although it continues to profess a ‘no first use' doctrine, China is re-engineering its long-range ballistic missiles to carry multiple nuclear warheads and continues to develop and test hyper-glide vehicle technologies," Hyten added.

"These developments—coupled with a lack of transparency on nuclear issues such as force disposition and size—may impact regional and strategic stability and are cause for continued vigilance and concern."

The 10-warhead missile test comes amid heightened tensions with China. State-run media in recent weeks has carried reports calling for China to expand its nuclear forces. A broadcast report showed that new long-range mobile missiles could strike the entire United States.

The Chinese state television channel CCTV-4 last week broadcast nuclear threats, including graphics showing new DF-41 missiles deployed in northern China and graphics showing the missiles' strike path into the United States. The Jan. 25 broadcast included a graphic of a 10-warhead MIRV bus for the DF-41.






The Chinese Communist Party propaganda newspaper(so Gertz, known for its anti-China stance, is not writing propaganda bullshit?) _Global Times_, known for its anti-U.S. stance, issued stark calls for China to build up its nuclear arsenal for use against the United States. On Jan. 24, the newspaper said China's strategic forces "must be so strong that no country would dare launch a military showdown."

"China must procure a level of strategic military strength that will force the U.S. to respect it," the newspaper said.

The same state-run organ criticized President Donald Trump in an article on Dec. 8 and said China should use its wealth "to build more strategic nuclear arms and accelerate the deployment of the DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile."

"We need to get better prepared militarily regarding the Taiwan question to ensure that those who advocate Taiwan's independence will be punished, and take precautions in case of U.S. provocations in the South China Sea," the newspaper said.

China conducted a flight test of the DF-41 in April.

Trump in December called for boosting America's aging nuclear arsenal.

"The United States must greatly strengthen and expand its nuclear capability until such time as the world comes to its senses regarding nukes," he stated in a tweet.

Military analysts said the large number of warheads is unusual for the Chinese nuclear program.

Rick Fisher, an analyst with the International Assessment and Strategy Center, said the multi-warhead missile test appears to be aimed at sending a signal to the new Trump administration.

Trump has tangled with China in opposing its military buildup on disputed South China Sea islands and on U.S. policy toward Taiwan, which Beijing regards as a renegade province and not an independent country.

White House spokesman Sean Spicer said the United States is prepared to block China's access to reclaimed islands he said are located in international waters and not China's sovereign maritime domain.

"This test of the 10-warhead DF-5C is China's latest nuclear intimidation exercise aimed at the new Trump administration," Fisher said.

"China's nuclear intimidation signals have included the public revelation in late December via Chinese websites of the new DF-41 ICBM in Heilongjiang province, plus articles in China's state-controlled media touting the need for China to increase its nuclear forces to intimidate Washington," Fisher added.

China's known force of around 20 D-5 missiles were deployed with large single warheads in the past, while some were upgraded with three-warhead top stages.

In September 2015 China revealed for the first time during a military parade that it had deployed a new DF-5B multi-warhead missile. Unofficial published reports suggested the DF-5B carries between six and eight warheads.

"The revelation that China has tested a new version of the DF-5 carrying ten warheads constitutes a very strong indication that China has produced a smaller warhead to equip its MIRV-capable ICBMs," Fisher said.

Some analysts speculate that the recent test of the DF-5C used the older missile as a test platform for a new warhead delivery bus that will be used on the new DF-41.

French China watcher Henri Kenhmann reported on his website East Pendulum that a Chinese missile test was to be carried out Jan. 15, based on air closure notices issued by the Chinese government for areas around Taiyuan and a missile impact range in western Xinjiang Province.

Analysis of the impact range suggests the test would include multiple test warheads.

"The point of impact is located south of the Taklamakan desert, in the former ballistic range of Minfeng," Kenhmann said, noting the Chinese had imposed an unusually large air exclusion zone of 125 miles around the impact zone.

"It should be noted that this zone of ballistic impact is abnormally large," he stated, a sign the large area would be used for multiple dummy warheads.

‘The size of this impact zone could indicate testing several MIRVs," he said.

A similar Chinese test of the DF-41 in April involved two MIRVs that were fired to a much smaller impact area of 60 miles by 37 miles.

The Pentagon's latest annual report on the Chinese military said Beijing continues to upgrade its nuclear forces by enhancing silo-based missiles and adding new road-mobile missiles.

"China’s ICBM arsenal to date consists of approximately 75 to 100 ICBMs, including the silo-based CSS-4 Mod 2 (DF-5) and multiple independently-targetable reentry vehicle (MIRV)-equipped Mod 3 (DF-5B); the solid-fueled, road-mobile CSS-10 Mod 1 and 2 (DF-31 and DF-31A); and the shorter range CSS-3 (DF-4)," the report said.

The DF-5 is a two-stage, liquid-fueled missile with a range of around 8,000 miles.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-tests-missile-10-warheads/#

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## Beast

Those liquid fuel DF-5C once fuel. Can be position ready to launch in standby mode for quite sometimes.

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## onebyone

*Big Banking Scam Exposed*
Home | Newsfront
Tags: China | Tests | Missile

*US Wary as China Tests Missile With 10 Warheads*




A Chinese-made CH-5 (Caihong-5 or Rainbow 5) reconnaissance and combat drone and its compatible missiles are on display during the 11th China International Aviation and Aerospace Exhibition, also known as Airshow China 2016, in Zhuhai city, south China's Guangdong province, Nov. 2, 2016.(Imaginechina via AP Images)


In what defense officials say represents a dramatic shift in Beijing's nuclear strategy at a time of growing tensions with the United States, China tested a new version of a long-range missile with 10 warheads, *The Washington Free Beacon reported on Tuesday.*

The test of the DF-5C missile is significant, because it demonstrates that China is boosting the number of warheads in its arsenal and could alter the strategic balance, especially as it strives for a second-strike capability.

Two officials familiar with reports of the missile test said it was carried out last month and was monitored closely by U.S. intelligence agencies.

The test comes as China is stepping up preparedness for a possible military conflict with the U.S., the *South China Morning Post reported.*

After President Donald Trump's inauguration, the Chinese army said that the chances of war have become "more real" amid an increasingly complex security situation in Asia Pacific.

ALERT: These 2 'Triggers' Cause Your Memory Loss


Learn More
International Assessment and Strategy Center analyst Rick Fisher told the Free Beacon that the missile test appears to be sending a signal to the new Trump administration due to his vocal opposition to their military buildup on disputed South China Sea islands and on American policy toward Taiwan, which Beijing regards as a renegade province and not an independent country.

Fisher added that this test is only the latest in attempts by China to demonstrate strength toward the U.S., as previous signs "have included the public revelation in late December via Chinese websites of the new DF-41 ICBM in Heilongjiang province, plus articles in China's state-controlled media touting the need for China to increase its nuclear forces to intimidate Washington."

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/China-Tests-Missile/2017/01/31/id/771269/

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## 帅的一匹

DF5 has 15000KM range.

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## samsara

*Say Hello to China's ICBMs*

*Pepe Escobar, Sputnik International, 2017-01-27*






*China's alleged deployment of a DF-41 strategic ballistic missile brigade to Heilongjiang province, bordering Russia, triggered a fascinating spectacle; how to spin – or not to spin - what necessarily represents a milestone in Russia-China's strategic partnership.*

The Global Times stressed Hong Kong and Taiwan media interpreted pictures of the DF-41 were taken in Heilongjiang, admitting there was no official confirmation from Beijing while hoping the "strategic edge" would soon be confirmed.

Russian media was way more explicit, with military analyst Konstantin Sivkov stressing that the DF-41, as positioned, would not be able to target Russia's Far East and most of Eastern Siberia; and Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov noting that "if the reports prove correct, the military build-up in China is not perceived as a threat to our country."





China's Reported Missile Deployment Near Russian Borders No Threat to Moscow - Kremlin

Of course not. The Russia-China strategic partnership, which, as I argued, needs to be broken according to Trump's shadow foreign policy adviser Henry Kissinger's strategy, is a very serious business. If there were indeed a deployment, Russian intelligence would have been fully aware. Peskov's response also pre-empted the notion this might represent a Chinese response to potential US-Russia negotiations over nuclear disarmament.

Still, all of the above did not prevent the Chinese Foreign Ministry to issue an attempt at a non-denial denial, describing the alleged deployment as "speculation and crude guesses".

*Go West, young missile*

The timing of the alleged deployment, with Team Trump doubling down on anti-Chinese rhetoric on their war of positioning geared to extract further trade concessions, may indeed betray a very graphic Beijing message.





Why Developing Nuclear Potential is an 'Absolute Necessity' for China

The DF-41, a three-stage solid-propellant missile, with a range of up to 15,000 km and capable of delivering up to 10 MIRVed nuclear warheads, is one of the most sophisticated – and secret — ICBMS on earth. Virtually everything about it is classified. Positioning in Heilongjiang, near the city of Daqing, close to the Russian border, implies a huge "dead zone" around it. So call it a mix of nuclear deterrence and a "message" to the ultimate target — the West Coast of the United States.

This propels the matter to an even more serious sphere than a possible upcoming crisis in the South China Sea, where the Pentagon, under the pretext of "freedom of navigation", is obsessed in maintaining "access", Trump or no Trump.

If there ever were an attempted American blockade in the South China Sea, it would be easy to take out the Chinese-developed islands/islets/rocks/shoals. But far from easy to grapple with the Chinese response; submarines with "carrier killer" missiles able to take out anything the US Navy may come up with.

Islands/islets/rocks/shoals in the South China Sea have no inherent strategic significance for the US. What their upgrading – the Beltway would say "militarization" — does represent is China's progressive attempt to eventually deny access to the US Navy.





Chinese Editorial Speculates About 'Real War' With US After Trump Inauguration

Enter the "messenger" DF-41. The technical reasons why Russia does not see the DF-41 as a threat are simple – and may unveil the rationale behind the alleged deployment.

Beijing has been able to deploy its predecessor, the DF-31 – which is able to target Russia — for more than a decade now. And a simple analysis of distance and trajectory reveals that Heilongjiang province is the optimum location for the DF-41 to target the whole of the continental US.

It's virtually guaranteed that an official Chinese confirmation of the DF-41 deployment will accelerate a nuclear arms race, involving all players from Russia, China and the US to India and Pakistan and even North Korea.





This is China's 'Riskiest and Most Complex' Active Defense Program

But more than this, it will be yet another lethal blow to the Beltway's master strategy – first deployed by Dr. Zbig "Grand Chessboard" Brzezinski – of trying to prevent the emergence of any peer competitor, or worse, an alliance of peer competitors such as Russia-China.

Just at the start of the Trump era, the new reality could not be more striking. Not long ago, it was "say hello to Russia-China". Now it's "say hello to China's ICBMs."

_The views expressed in this article are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official position of Sputnik._

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## grey boy 2



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## ahojunk

PLA drill features advanced missile
(China Daily) 08:14, February 06, 2017

The People's Liberation Army has released a video of a recent exercise employing the advanced DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile, a weapon seen as filling a gap in the nation's arsenal.

Several launch vehicles carrying the ballistic missiles were seen in the footage that the PLA published on its video website, released to show the training of Rocket Force missile brigade soldiers around the Spring Festival holiday.

The participating units handled a number of scenarios, including chemical/biological contamination, countering satellite reconnaissance and electronic jamming. The crews practiced multiple maneuvers, such as rapid loading, redeployment and launch sequence, though the video showed no missile actually being launched.

Two types of DF-16 that appeared in the exercise are the bullet-shaped missile that is considered the original DF-16 and a new variant that features a maneuverable warhead and several extra fins.

The video represents the third time the DF-16 has been shown to the public. The missile made its debut at a military parade in Beijing in September 2015. In July, a television news program showed General Fan Changlong, a vice-chairman of the Central Military Commission, inspecting a DF-16 unit of the Southern Theater Command.

Though the PLA has never disclosed its ballistic missiles' specifications, experts said the DF-16 poses a challenge to foreign military installations along the first island chain, which is what the Chinese military calls the series of islands that stretch from Japan in the north to China's Taiwan and the Philippines to the south.

Xu Guangyu, a retired major general and now a strategy researcher, said that DF-16 has a strike range of more than 1,000 kilometers, filling the gap that previously existed with the absence of a medium-range ballistic missile in the PLA's arsenal. He said the missile also is able to reach Okinawa, a Japanese island about 400 km from China's Diaoyu Islands.

Shi Hong, executive editor of Shipborne Weapons, said the DF-16 was developed by China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp based on the DF-11 short-range ballistic missile and can carry a warhead of at least 500 kg. The missile has a strike accuracy as good as that of a cruise missile, Shi said. It is also able to maneuver in its final stage to penetrate enemy defensive firepower, he said.

Other PLA Rocket Force brigades also mobilized their DF-11, DF-15 and DF-21C ballistic missiles during training around Spring Festival, according to PLA media outlets.

In another development, Washington Free Beacon, a news website in the United States that specializes in military affairs, reported on Jan 31 that China conducted the first flight of the DF-5C intercontinental ballistic missile in January. The missile carries 10 multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicles. The DF-5C is the latest variant of the three-decade-old DF-5 family, the report said.

An unidentified officer from the Defense Ministry's Information Bureau reached by Shenzhen TV on Saturday would neither confirm nor deny the DF-5C test, but said such tests are not aimed at any foreign nation or specific target.

.

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## Suff Shikan

*Chinese troops conduct drills with Advanced Ballistic Missile that can target India, Japan and the US*
Monday, February 06, 2017
By: TNN




Highlights

People's Liberation Army has released a video of recent exercise.
The exercise was conducted by China's newly-formed Rocket Force.
The exercise included advanced DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile.
Two types of DF-16 appeared in the exercise.
China's newly-formed Rocket Force has held an exercise with advanced DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile with a range of over 1,000km that could threaten a number countries+ , including India, Japan and the US.

Significantly the People's Liberation Army (PLA), which is secretive about its weapons systems, has released a video of the recent exercise of its troops employing the advanced DF-16 medium-range ballistic missile.

China's Rocket Force is a special contingent to handle range of missiles in its military's arsenal.

Several launch vehicles carrying the ballistic missiles were seen in the footage released to show the training of Rocket Force missile brigade soldiers around the Spring Festival holiday.

The participating units handled a number of scenarios, including chemical/biological contamination, countering satellite reconnaissance and electronic jamming, state-run China Daily reported on Monday.

The crews practiced in multiple manoeuvres, such as rapid loading, redeployment and launch sequence, though the video showed no missile actually being launched.

Two types of DF-16 appeared in the exercise. The video represents the third time the DF-16 has been shown to the public.

The missile made its debut at a military parade in Beijing in September 2015.

In July, a television news programme showed General Fan Changlong, a vice-chairman of the Central Military Commission, inspecting a DF-16 unit of the Southern Theatre Command.

Though the PLA has never disclosed its ballistic missiles' specifications, experts said the DF-16 poses a challenge to foreign military installations along the first island chain, which is what the Chinese military calls the series of islands that stretch from Japan in the north to Taiwan and the Philippines to the south, the Daily report said.

Since the election of Donald Trump as US President+ , China has been striking aggressive postures against Taiwan after he spoke to Taiwanese President Tsai-Ing-wen.

While criticising his moves, China has sent its first aircraft carrier to Taiwan straits+ , as well as the first island chain in the Pacific and stepped up naval drills in the disputed South China Sea.

Washington Free Beacon, a news website in the United States that specialises in military affairs, reported on January 31 that China conducted the first flight of the DF-5C intercontinental ballistic missile in January.

China has also deployed its long range missile close to the Russian border which the Russian media said is aimed at US.

Reports in the official media said China is stepping up preparedness for a possible military conflict with the US+ as Trump signalled to follow more hardline policy to counter China's claims on the disputed South China Sea, official media reports here said.

A commentary in the official website of People's Liberation Army's (PLA) said on January 20 the day Trump assumed presidency that the chances of war have become "more real" amid a more complex security situation in Asia Pacific.

Xu Guangyu, a retired major general and now a strategy researcher, said that DF-16 has a strike range of more than 1,000 kms, filling the gap that previously existed with the absence of a medium-range ballistic missile in the PLA's arsenal.

He said the missile also is able to reach Okinawa, a Japanese island about 400km from China's Diaoyu Islands.

Shi Hong, executive editor of Shipborne Weapons, said the DF-16 has a strike accuracy as good as that of a cruise missile, Shi said.

It is also able to manoeuvre in its final stage to penetrate enemy defensive firepower, he said.

Other PLA Rocket Force brigades also mobilised their DF-11, DF-15 and DF-21C ballistic missiles during training around Spring Festival, according to PLA media outlets.

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## cirr

Cutting edge, world beating......technology 

http://news.china.com/domestic/945/20170207/30237105_all.html

*中国研发新型弹片材料 二次爆炸威力惊人*

【观察者网综合】科学网2月7日报道，北京理工大学教授王海福，二十年痴心不改强军梦。在2016年度国家科学技术奖励大会上，有66项成果获得了国家技术发明奖项目，其中有一项名为“活性毁伤元技术”的项目获得了二等奖。文中提到，“活性毁伤元技术”是一种新型的战斗部材料技术。

观察者网军事评论员表示，从国外一些类似设想来看，这应该是一种大幅提升导弹武器战斗部的毁伤能力的新技术，理论上可让导弹毁伤飞机的半径增加一倍。不过目前世界上其他国家，包括最初提出类似构想的美国，都尚未取得实际研制成果。






美国海军曾在2002年提出过类似爆炸毁伤元的想法，号称能100%提高导弹毁伤半径，然而这个项目似乎没有了下文，似乎又是一个美国负责“想”，中国负责“干”的例证. 

@Bussard Ramjet

但大幅度提高武器的威力是世界公认的重大瓶颈性难题。王海福主持的项目正是针对该技术难题。

“*我们发明的新型爆炸材料毁伤元，既具有类似金属的力学强度，又含有与高能炸药相当的化学能，还具有与惰性材料类似的安全性，可以直接机械加工，只有高速命中目标后才会发生爆炸*。”王海福说，*以前的惰性金属毁伤元只能通过纯动能毁伤目标，而这种新型材料毁伤元具备动能穿孔和爆炸作用的双重毁伤能力，威力会成倍性提升*。

而对于该研究成果的技术水平和地位，王海福坦言：“*近二十年来，如果把我国武装装备研制和发展看作是一个从全面跟踪追赶，到部分并跑甚至有限领跑的过程，那么本项技术发明成果无疑属于并跑或引领。*”

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## cirr

Super staring infrared imaging system for high-speed high-acceleration surface-2-air missile interceptor and new generation long-range A2A missile(not the one you have seen)

本项目针对影响大气层内高速导弹光学成像探测精度的气动光学效应这一“瓶颈”问题，成功建立了结合流场仿真数据和风洞测试试验图像进行气动光学效应退化机理分析和气动光学效应图像校正方法研究的技术理论；并研制了“气动光学效应图像校正仿真平台”。

本项目得到了武器装备预研基金和国防基础科研项目的支持。研究工作在以下方面取得了突破性进展： 提出了基于流场数值计算的光线追迹模型,给出了光线在高速流场中的理论传输特性，提高了气动光学效应图像仿真的真实度。 提出了“误差-参数分析”的气动光学效应降晰函数辨识方法，并通过对风洞测试试验图像的处理，验证了气动光学效应图像退化模型辨识方法的有效性。 在复原过程中引入气动光学效应退化模型和成像物理模型约束，提出了总变分极小化的图像复原新方法，实现了对恢复图像边缘的有效保持以及对振铃效应和噪声的有效抑制，较好地解决了盲目图像恢复算法的病态性问题,提高了校正效果。

研制的“气动光学效应图像校正仿真系统”，其软件子系统模块化程度高,稳定性好，可扩展性和可移植性强;其硬件子系统具有快速实现气动光学效应校正的功能。目前已应用于国家重大背景型号项目研究，使我国的高速导弹成像探测气动光学效应校正技术取得重大进展，具有重要军事价值。相关的研究成果可用于以下技术领域：

1)为了实现在大气层内直接碰撞、动能杀伤机动目标，我国重点发展的“杀手锏”武器——高速高加速飞行的“地对空反导武器系统”和重大背景型号新一代远程空空导弹，将采用凝视红外成像系统作为关键部件，其中的气动光学效应问题非常突出，是影响其作战效能的瓶颈之一，需要对其进行校正。

2)我国现有的战术地地导弹大多采用单一的惯性制导方式，在不能提供高精度陀螺惯导平台的情况下，制导精度在百米量级，无法实现远程精确摧毁敌方地面硬目标和海上活动目标的要求。采用光学/惯性复合制导技术可以大大提高其制导精度，但在导弹高速重返大气层时，也存在着严重的气动光学效应问题。

3)为了提高飞航导弹的生存能力，发展高马赫数的飞航导弹是一个研究方向，其中光学成像系统的气动光学效应问题也需要解决。

4)在大气层内或水下进行光学观测，也存在着模糊、抖动和偏移等图像退化问题，要实现精确观测，也需要解决退化图像的校正问题。

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## The Eagle

cirr said:


> Cutting edge, world beating......technology
> 
> http://news.china.com/domestic/945/20170207/30237105_all.html
> 
> *中国研发新型弹片材料 二次爆炸威力惊人*
> 
> 【观察者网综合】科学网2月7日报道，北京理工大学教授王海福，二十年痴心不改强军梦。在2016年度国家科学技术奖励大会上，有66项成果获得了国家技术发明奖项目，其中有一项名为“活性毁伤元技术”的项目获得了二等奖。文中提到，“活性毁伤元技术”是一种新型的战斗部材料技术。
> 
> 观察者网军事评论员表示，从国外一些类似设想来看，这应该是一种大幅提升导弹武器战斗部的毁伤能力的新技术，理论上可让导弹毁伤飞机的半径增加一倍。不过目前世界上其他国家，包括最初提出类似构想的美国，都尚未取得实际研制成果。
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 美国海军曾在2002年提出过类似爆炸毁伤元的想法，号称能100%提高导弹毁伤半径，然而这个项目似乎没有了下文，似乎又是一个美国负责“想”，中国负责“干”的例证.
> 
> @Bussard Ramjet
> 
> 但大幅度提高武器的威力是世界公认的重大瓶颈性难题。王海福主持的项目正是针对该技术难题。
> 
> “*我们发明的新型爆炸材料毁伤元，既具有类似金属的力学强度，又含有与高能炸药相当的化学能，还具有与惰性材料类似的安全性，可以直接机械加工，只有高速命中目标后才会发生爆炸*。”王海福说，*以前的惰性金属毁伤元只能通过纯动能毁伤目标，而这种新型材料毁伤元具备动能穿孔和爆炸作用的双重毁伤能力，威力会成倍性提升*。
> 
> 而对于该研究成果的技术水平和地位，王海福坦言：“*近二十年来，如果把我国武装装备研制和发展看作是一个从全面跟踪追赶，到部分并跑甚至有限领跑的过程，那么本项技术发明成果无疑属于并跑或引领。*”





cirr said:


> Super staring infrared imaging system for high-speed high-acceleration surface-2-air missile interceptor and new generation long-range A2A missile(not the one you have seen)
> 
> 本项目针对影响大气层内高速导弹光学成像探测精度的气动光学效应这一“瓶颈”问题，成功建立了结合流场仿真数据和风洞测试试验图像进行气动光学效应退化机理分析和气动光学效应图像校正方法研究的技术理论；并研制了“气动光学效应图像校正仿真平台”。
> 
> 本项目得到了武器装备预研基金和国防基础科研项目的支持。研究工作在以下方面取得了突破性进展： 提出了基于流场数值计算的光线追迹模型,给出了光线在高速流场中的理论传输特性，提高了气动光学效应图像仿真的真实度。 提出了“误差-参数分析”的气动光学效应降晰函数辨识方法，并通过对风洞测试试验图像的处理，验证了气动光学效应图像退化模型辨识方法的有效性。 在复原过程中引入气动光学效应退化模型和成像物理模型约束，提出了总变分极小化的图像复原新方法，实现了对恢复图像边缘的有效保持以及对振铃效应和噪声的有效抑制，较好地解决了盲目图像恢复算法的病态性问题,提高了校正效果。
> 
> 研制的“气动光学效应图像校正仿真系统”，其软件子系统模块化程度高,稳定性好，可扩展性和可移植性强;其硬件子系统具有快速实现气动光学效应校正的功能。目前已应用于国家重大背景型号项目研究，使我国的高速导弹成像探测气动光学效应校正技术取得重大进展，具有重要军事价值。相关的研究成果可用于以下技术领域：
> 
> 1)为了实现在大气层内直接碰撞、动能杀伤机动目标，我国重点发展的“杀手锏”武器——高速高加速飞行的“地对空反导武器系统”和重大背景型号新一代远程空空导弹，将采用凝视红外成像系统作为关键部件，其中的气动光学效应问题非常突出，是影响其作战效能的瓶颈之一，需要对其进行校正。
> 
> 2)我国现有的战术地地导弹大多采用单一的惯性制导方式，在不能提供高精度陀螺惯导平台的情况下，制导精度在百米量级，无法实现远程精确摧毁敌方地面硬目标和海上活动目标的要求。采用光学/惯性复合制导技术可以大大提高其制导精度，但在导弹高速重返大气层时，也存在着严重的气动光学效应问题。
> 
> 3)为了提高飞航导弹的生存能力，发展高马赫数的飞航导弹是一个研究方向，其中光学成像系统的气动光学效应问题也需要解决。
> 
> 4)在大气层内或水下进行光学观测，也存在着模糊、抖动和偏移等图像退化问题，要实现精确观测，也需要解决退化图像的校正问题。



It would be really helpful by posting a bit of over-view and possible translated script for the ease of readers to understand otherwise, IMO, none other than Chinese would be able to read it or find it helpful at all. Hope you understand..

Regards,

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## Pangu

The Eagle said:


> It would be really helpful by posting a bit of over-view and possible translated script for the ease of readers to understand otherwise, IMO, none other than Chinese would be able to read it or find it helpful at all. Hope you understand..
> 
> Regards,



No translation from the reporting media, unfortunately. Google Translate is the best alternative for non-Chinese readers. That's what I do regularly with foreign language articles.


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## The Eagle

gambit said:


> The Chinese is an exception the rules. You did not know that ?



Oh.. Come on Sir ----I was serious.... but now am  ... However, by such remarks, the thread will be going off-road soon and there is no exception. 



Pangu said:


> No translation from the reporting media, unfortunately. Google Translate is the best alternative for non-Chinese readers. That's what I do regularly with foreign language articles.



Well IMO, Google translator can skip or wrongly translate the contexts hence, A Chinese Friend familiar with English can at-least share key points, conclusion by translating an overview so would be more beneficial.

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## The Eagle

gambit said:


> So was I.



Got you 




gambit said:


> Do you know why the *WORKING* language of aviation is English ? It was because a common language has to be used and since English was already the dominant language in aviation, English became the official unofficial language of aviation. Likewise, on an anonymous Internet forum that intends to have as wide an audience as possible, a common language must be used, so English was used for PDF.



Agreed that English is most spoken and common among the nations hence, used commonly so that everyone can understand the contexts and the same would be helpful to read and educate one self. Yes, these are the reasons as the same is used for PDF. 




gambit said:


> The reason why the Chinese members of this forum often posts in Chinese is because they believe they can get away with it, and why/where that belief came from is because they were *ALLOWED* to do so. The allowance may not be official but inferred from lack of enforcement of the rules. Essentially, if you do something contrary to norms and consistently got away with it, pretty much you are the exception to the rules.



I beg to differ here and I don't think so as the same would be the reason however, would like to say that few times gone unnoticed and leaving the same to get away can actually affect interest of the readers. I am not hiding such posts/reporting the same for moderation because an info may loss hence, have been asking for translations to the respective members with most conclusion or an overview. @Deino @ahojunk @Shotgunner51 can we try to enforce the rule as mush as possible for the quality and information so that more readers can take part into discussions.


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## The Eagle

gambit said:


> If you cannot understand, then it is the same as lost.
> 
> The point of having a common language is because of that fear of information that is lost on the general readership, lost as in gone over one's head -- whooosh.
> 
> The point of having a common language is to disseminate whatever information to as wide a range of readership as possible. What the Chinese members are doing is trying to turn this subforum into their own by way of discouragement.
> 
> This is grossly disrespectful to both the creators of this forum and to the readership that the creators wanted to reach.
> 
> But do the Chinese care that they are being disrespectful to everyone ? No.




Chief, let's play it low (at-least from my end for the sake of thread and topic). 

I fully agree with you w.r.t. not understanding a post means, already a lost cause and the point w.r.t. choosing English for the forum is clear as well. 

I am sure, Chinese members have no intention as such to turn this forum into abc but I myself, have found many of our friends stating as clearly that as English is not common spoken for them hence, sometimes avoid it and also, there are few words/contexts in Chinese that actually cannot be translated at all though I do agree that, a minimum overview with general description and translation would be helpful yet I am sure too that it is not a deliberate thing that even PDF Admin is aware fully. There is no disrespect in it at all. I know that due to conflict in arguments between you and Chinese, things sometimes went wrong that I have been reading most of the posts with interest but it doesn't mean that someone is favoured over other and difference in opinion is actually beneficial for all. Personal attacks or offensive posting should not be tolerated at all, without any difference.

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## The Eagle

Pangu said:


> Get away with what? A crime? Many threads in this forum has often interjected in their respective national language, so what? No one is forcing YOU to read. The problem is YOU who make it a problem in your persistent, rabid, anti-Chinese fervor.





cirr said:


> Viets would do well making the mastery of Chinese as the most important event in their life.



Guys, don't escalate things that have no purpose but derailing and going off-topic. I mean, there is no need to do as such. There is a key called "agree to disagree and move on" to work with anything when someone dislike a content on personal ground or in-case of an offense, use the report button and leave it to the respective team. Also, we need to make sure that at-least a post consist of Chinese Language, be translated with an overview/conclusion statement for the interest non-Chinese readers and quality discussion.

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## samsara

*US-Japanese Missile Test Could Prompt China to Upgrade its Nuclear Arsenal*

Sputnik, 2017-02-09

*Last week, the United States and Japan successfully tested the Standard Missile-3 (SM-3) Block IIA missile defense system. An interceptor was launched from the USS John Paul Jones missile destroyer and took out a medium-range target ballistic missile. The test took place off the Hawaiian island of Kauai.*

The test came as a new reminder for Russia and China that they should not stop modernizing their strategic arsenals, taking into account the advanced capabilities of the US missile defense shield, Russian military expert Vasily Kashin said.

According to information from the US military, unlike the previous versions of the SM-3 missile, the SM-3 Block IIA is capable of intercepting not only middle-range missiles but also intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBM).





Admiral: US Navy Top Priority to Deploy Next Generation Strategic Missile Subs

Russia began developing anti-missile defense measures in advance. Russia’s main advantages are a rich and advanced arsenal of nuclear weapons delivery, an immense territory and geographical proximity to the US. Due to these factors, missile defenses of the US and its Asian allies cannot intercept Russian missiles at launch. As for the European missile shield, it covers only a small part of the Russian strategic arsenal.

In turn, China is in a more complicated situation, taking into account the capacity of its nuclear arsenal. The majority of China’s missiles are middle-range and vulnerable to missile defenses.

In the light of the ongoing expansion of the US’ missile defense, China’s intercontinental ballistic missile arsenal may be insufficient to guarantee a retaliatory strike.

Russia to Boost Far East Missile Defense Amid China's ICBM Deployment - MP

"Beijing should also take into account the upcoming deployment of US THAAD missile systems to South Korea and Japan," Kashin commented to Sputnik Chinese.

The expert also noted that taking into the account the scope of US and Japanese missile defense efforts, it is "ridiculous" to justify the initiative with possible threats from North Korea or Iran.

_*"Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons and is unlikely to develop an ICBM in the foreseeable future. As for North Korea, due to the lack of resources and technologies, it has a small arsenal of faulty ballistic missiles," Kashin pointed out.*_​
The main goal of the US’ missile defense deployment plan is to gain an advantage over Russia and, what is more important, to gain the upper hand over China’s nuclear arsenal.

_*"Washington believes that this would force Beijing abandon its hardline foreign policy strategy aimed at protecting national interests. However, such an assumption is based on underestimating China’s capabilities to expand its nuclear arsenal," the expert pointed out.*_​
Meanwhile, in recent years, China has put much effort to increasing capacities of its missile-manufacturing industry. Reserves of the space industry could now also be recruited to boost production of strategic missiles. It is also noteworthy that during the final stage of the Cold War China conducted certain research and development works in the field but then abandoned them due to political reasons.





Russia-US Cooperation on Missile Defense 'Lies Far Beyond the Horizon'

_*"Deployment of DF-41 missiles and tests of the DF-5C carrying 10 warheads prove that China is capable of rapidly modernizing its offensive potential. Possibly, its will expand even faster than US missile defense aimed at deterring China. In this case, none of the sides will get the upper hand, but global security will be damaged," Kashin concluded.
*_​_*
=====================================*_

READ ALSO:

*New US Missile Hits Target in Space*





Sputnik, 2017-02-07

*The US Department of Defense Missile Defense Agency and Raytheon have successfully tested a missile that intercepts enemy missiles in space.*

The SM-3 IIA missile can sense ballistic missile attacks from space and neutralize the threats. The SM-3 made its debut by eliminating a ballistic missile fired from the Navy’s USS John Paul Jones destroyer.

The idea for the mission was conceived and motivated, in part, by Star Wars, according to Scout Warrior’s Kris Osborn. “Now that technology is getting better,” he said, “exoatmospheric” missiles can intercept short- and medium-range ballistic missiles descending from outer space. *The anti-missile technology would come in handy if the medium-range DF-16 missile tested by the Chinese People’s Liberation Army gets deployed.*

The next-generation missile is being developed by both Washington and Tokyo, Scout reported. Further, the US plans to deploy the missile in Poland by 2018. The successful launch took place in the Pacific Ocean off the coast of Hawaii.
[...]
https://sputniknews.com/military/201702071050411099-new-missile-hits-space-target/
​


----------



## 52051

cirr said:


> Cutting edge, world beating......technology
> 
> http://news.china.com/domestic/945/20170207/30237105_all.html
> 
> *中国研发新型弹片材料 二次爆炸威力惊人*
> 
> 【观察者网综合】科学网2月7日报道，北京理工大学教授王海福，二十年痴心不改强军梦。在2016年度国家科学技术奖励大会上，有66项成果获得了国家技术发明奖项目，其中有一项名为“活性毁伤元技术”的项目获得了二等奖。文中提到，“活性毁伤元技术”是一种新型的战斗部材料技术。
> 
> 观察者网军事评论员表示，从国外一些类似设想来看，这应该是一种大幅提升导弹武器战斗部的毁伤能力的新技术，理论上可让导弹毁伤飞机的半径增加一倍。不过目前世界上其他国家，包括最初提出类似构想的美国，都尚未取得实际研制成果。
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 美国海军曾在2002年提出过类似爆炸毁伤元的想法，号称能100%提高导弹毁伤半径，然而这个项目似乎没有了下文，似乎又是一个美国负责“想”，中国负责“干”的例证.
> 
> @Bussard Ramjet
> 
> 但大幅度提高武器的威力是世界公认的重大瓶颈性难题。王海福主持的项目正是针对该技术难题。
> 
> “*我们发明的新型爆炸材料毁伤元，既具有类似金属的力学强度，又含有与高能炸药相当的化学能，还具有与惰性材料类似的安全性，可以直接机械加工，只有高速命中目标后才会发生爆炸*。”王海福说，*以前的惰性金属毁伤元只能通过纯动能毁伤目标，而这种新型材料毁伤元具备动能穿孔和爆炸作用的双重毁伤能力，威力会成倍性提升*。
> 
> 而对于该研究成果的技术水平和地位，王海福坦言：“*近二十年来，如果把我国武装装备研制和发展看作是一个从全面跟踪追赶，到
> 部分并跑甚至有限领跑的过程，那么本项技术发明成果无疑属于并跑或引领。*”



For non-Chinese readers:

The article basically says that a professor from Beijing Institute of Technology recieved state prize for science and tech advancement, second class, for he has developed a new material called damaging element or whatever tech term.

The material has several ways to enhance its damaging radius, it offer both superior explosive and impact damaging characters, and it is actually very stable, comparable to inert material.

The material is mean to be used to build warhead of missiles, it can enhance the missiles's kill radius by 100% with the same payload.

In the end of the article, the author mentioned that the Americans try to do similar things since 1990s, but they fail to develop a working one up to now.

And the authors mock that this is the usual pattern that the Americans are representable for dreaming and the Chinese are representable for making things happen.

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## Brainsucker

52051 said:


> For non-Chinese readers:
> 
> The article basically says that a professor from Beijing Institute of Technology recieved state prize for science and tech advancement, second class, for he has developed a new material called damaging element or whatever tech term.
> 
> The material has several ways to enhance its damaging radius, it offer both superior explosive and impact damaging characters, and it is actually very stable, comparable to inert material.
> 
> The material is mean to be used to build warhead of missiles, it can enhance the missiles's kill radius by 100% with the same payload.
> 
> In the end of the article, the author mentioned that the Americans try to do similar things since 1990s, but they fail to develop a working one up to now.
> 
> And the authors mock that this is the usual pattern that the Americans are representable for dreaming and the Chinese are representable for making things happen.



Thank you for the explanation


----------



## Hindustani78

https://sputniknews.com/military/201702091050498845-us-missile-defense-china/

*Last week, the United States and Japan successfully tested the Standard Missile-3 (SM-3) Block IIA missile defense system. An interceptor was launched from the USS John Paul Jones missile destroyer and took out a medium-range target ballistic missile. The test took place off the Hawaiian island of Kauai.*

The test came as a new reminder for Russia and China that they should not stop modernizing their strategic arsenals, taking into account the advanced capabilities of the US missile defense shield, Russian military expert Vasily Kashin said.

According to information from the US military, unlike the previous versions of the SM-3 missile, the SM-3 Block IIA is capable of intercepting not only middle-range missiles but also intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBM).

Russia began developing anti-missile defense measures in advance. Russia’s main advantages are a rich and advanced arsenal of nuclear weapons delivery, an immense territory and geographical proximity to the US. Due to these factors, missile defenses of the US and its Asian allies cannot intercept Russian missiles at launch. As for the European missile shield, it covers only a small part of the Russian strategic arsenal.

In turn, China is in a more complicated situation, taking into account the capacity of its nuclear arsenal. The majority of China’s missiles are middle-range and vulnerable to missile defenses.

In the light of the ongoing expansion of the US’ missile defense, China’s intercontinental ballistic missile arsenal may be insufficient to guarantee a retaliatory strike.

"Beijing should also take into account the upcoming deployment of US THAAD missile systems to South Korea and Japan," Kashin commented to Sputnik Chinese.

The expert also noted that taking into the account the scope of US and Japanese missile defense efforts, it is "ridiculous" to justify the initiative with possible threats from South Korea or Iran.

"Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons and is unlikely to develop an ICBM in the foreseeable future. As for North Korea, due to the lack of resources and technologies, it has a small arsenal of faulty ballistic missiles," Kashin pointed out.

The main goal of the US’ missile defense deployment plan is to gain an advantage over Russia and, what is more important, to gain the upper hand over China’s nuclear arsenal.

"Washington believes that this would force Beijing abandon its hardline foreign policy strategy aimed at protecting national interests. However, such an assumption is based on underestimating China’s capabilities to expand its nuclear arsenal," the expert pointed out.

Meanwhile, in recent years, China has put much effort to increasing capacities of its missile-manufacturing industry. Reserves of the space industry could now also be recruited to boost production of strategic missiles. It is also noteworthy that during the final stage of the Cold War China conducted certain research and development works in the field but then abandoned them due to political reasons.

"Deployment of DF-41 missiles and tests of the DF-5C carrying 10 warheads prove that China is capable of rapidly modernizing its offensive potential. Possibly, its will expand even faster than US missile defense aimed at deterring China. In this case, none of the sides will get the upper hand, but global security will be damaged," Kashin concluded.


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## cirr

CASIC's kinetic energy terminal missile interceptor system(Project 8102)






won 2013 National Science & Technology Progress Award 2nd Class.

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## samsara

cirr said:


> CASIC's kinetic energy terminal missile interceptor system(Project 8102)
> 
> View attachment 375867
> 
> 
> won 2013 National Science & Technology Progress Award 2nd Class.


It's *awarded* around three years ago  so quite possibly the invention had been turned into operational products nowadays.

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## cirr

samsara said:


> It's *awarded* around three years ago  so quite possibly the invention had been turned into operational products nowadays.



动能末端低层反导拦截系统，射高相当于美军爱国者3改进型反导导弹，2011年5月15日第一次试验成功，2013年12月25日获国家科技进步二等奖。

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## samsara

cirr said:


> 动能末端低层反导拦截系统，射高相当于美军爱国者3改进型反导导弹，2011年5月15日第一次试验成功，2013年12月25日获国家科技进步二等奖。


from cirr's post above - thanks fyi 

_"Kinetic energy at the end of the lower missile interception system, much equivalent to the American Patriot 3 modified anti-missile missiles, *on May 15, 2011 for the first time the trial was successful*; on December 25, 2013 it won the national scientific and technological progress second prize." _

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> 动能末端低层反导拦截系统，射高相当于美军爱国者3改进型反导导弹，2011年5月15日第一次试验成功，2013年12月25日获国家科技进步二等奖。



Is this in service?


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## onebyone

*China Confirms Testing Multi-Warhead Missile*





(AP)

By Sandy Fitzgerald | Saturday, 11 Feb 2017 10:24 AM
China's Defense Ministry has confirmed the test of a missile containing 10 warheads, but called it a "scientific" test that was not directed toward any other nations.

The ministry, responding to reports last month in* The Washington 
Free Beacon *about the test of a Chinese DF-5C missile, said the flight test included 10 MIRVs, or multiple independently targetable reentry vehicles, *The Free Beacon reported on Saturday. *

The officials made the confirmation through China's state-run Shenzhen television on Feb. 6, in a written statement repeated in several other news sources and the official Communist newspaper, *The People's Daily.*
The newspaper reported that the American media has been "hyping up" the Chinese "normal scientific tests," but that China employs a defensive, "no-first use" strategy on nuclear weapons.

While the United States "believes China's possession of DF-5C missiles poses some threat to its dominance," the Communist publication reported, Li Wei, a professor at the People's Liberation Army's National Defence University told Shenzhen TV the U.S. will likely stay as the dominant power, including with nuclear weapons.

However, reports The Free Beacon, China's ability to add up to 10 warheads to a missile is being seen as a major change to the country's nuclear arsenal by U.S. military officials, and comes as tensions mount between the two countries as President Donald Trump and his administration questions the nation's ties.

Trump and Chinese leader Xi Jinping spoke by telephone Thursday night, with the president saying the United States plans to continue its longstanding "one China policy," despite Trump in December accepting a phone call from Taiwan's president Tsai Ing-wen.

Tensions are also rising between Japan and China, but Trump said Friday, during a press conference with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe that his phone call with Xi went well and he believes all will work out "very well for everybody."

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/China-Missile-warhead-missile/2017/02/11/id/773119/

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## yusheng



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## Deino

samsara said:


> So I guess that I can safely assume that the missile in your attached picture is one of the operational products from the awarded CASIC's kinetic energy research.




Not sure where a standard YJ-91 ARM has a connection or relation to "the awarded CASIC's kinetic energy research" ??


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## samsara

Deino said:


> Not sure where a standard YJ-91 ARM has a connection or relation to "the awarded CASIC's kinetic energy research" ??


Ha ha ha, so it's an unsafe guess (and be retracted)  I just wildly guessed it, really have no idea about the many kinds of airborne missiles  better let the experts do it


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## cirr

52051 said:


> For non-Chinese readers:
> 
> The article basically says that a professor from Beijing Institute of Technology recieved state prize for science and tech advancement, second class, for he has developed a new material called damaging element or whatever tech term.
> 
> The material has several ways to enhance its damaging radius, it offer both superior explosive and impact damaging characters, and it is actually very stable, comparable to inert material.
> 
> The material is mean to be used to build warhead of missiles, it can enhance the missiles's kill radius by 100% with the same payload.
> 
> In the end of the article, the author mentioned that the Americans try to do similar things since 1990s, but they fail to develop a working one up to now.
> 
> And the authors mock that this is the usual pattern that the Americans are representable for dreaming and the Chinese are representable for making things happen.



Can't believe you omitted to translate the most eye-catching paragraph

“*我们发明的新型爆炸材料毁伤元，既具有类似金属的力学强度，又含有与高能炸药相当的化学能，还具有与惰性材料类似的安全性，可以直接机械加工，只有高速命中目标后才会发生爆炸*。”王海福说，*以前的惰性金属毁伤元只能通过纯动能毁伤目标，而这种新型材料毁伤元具备动能穿孔和爆炸作用的双重毁伤能力，威力会成倍性提升*。

PS Active Damage Element(or whatever the actual tech term maybe) is no longer a laboratory product. It has found wide applications in many weapon platforms after key technology breakthroughs were made with weaponization in 201X(X<5).

PSS The new type of explosive material should be ideal for making railgun projectiles.

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## Gryphon

Aerospace Long-March International Trade Co., Ltd (ALIT) is now offering 70 km range version of LY-80 MR-SAM to export customers, according to new information available on its website. The website also states that the "LY-80 SAM has been employed in PLA and many friendly countries in very large quantities as the primary medium range air defense weapon system."

Another addition to ALIT product list is the LY-80N Ship-borne Air Defense Missile Weapon System which has Interception Range of 40 km.

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## truthseeker2010

LY-80N for follow on F-22s? who knows


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## YeBeWarned

@TheOccupiedKashmir any news on LY-80N been Inducted in PN ??


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## monitor

TheOccupiedKashmir said:


> Aerospace Long-March International Trade Co., Ltd (ALIT) is now marketing 70 km range version of LY-80 MR-SAM to export customers, according to new information available on its website. The website also states that the "LY-80 SAM has been employed in PLA and many friendly countries in very large quantities as the primary medium range air defense weapon system."
> 
> LY-80N Ship-borne Air Defense Missile Weapon System (range 40 km) is also offered by the company for export in its new product list.



Now it's confirm what Pakistan army just inducted have 70 KM range. No more confusion regarding it's capabilities.


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## samsara

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/840877188131909632

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## samsara

@OedoSoldier Mar 14, 2017

HQ-16A Surface-to-Air Missile

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## samsara

*@OedoSoldier* Mar 16, 2017

*HQ-17 Surface-to-Air Missile*

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## cirr

1st HQ-19（THAAD-ER）battalion reportedly combat ready. 

*新组建的某导弹营官兵来自空军26个团以上单位，构成复杂、思想多元，营连领导普遍谈心，全面了解个人诉求和困难，有的放矢抓好教育管理，圆满完成各项战备值班任务。*

http://www.81.cn//kj/2017-03/20/content_7531571_2.htm

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## HannibalBarca

cirr said:


> 1st HQ-19（THAAD-ER）battalion reportedly combat ready.
> 
> *新组建的某导弹营官兵来自空军26个团以上单位，构成复杂、思想多元，营连领导普遍谈心，全面了解个人诉求和困难，有的放矢抓好教育管理，圆满完成各项战备值班任务。*
> 
> http://www.81.cn//kj/2017-03/20/content_7531571_2.htm



yep..but no actual footage of the beast no proof...


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## Akasa

HannibalBarca said:


> yep..but no actual footage of the beast no proof...



No footage, but some photos have popped up. The first one is from its maiden flight in 2003.

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## samsara

The HQ-19 is closer to the THAAD-ER than THAAD in the two-stage

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/843718052503932933

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## zestokryl



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## IblinI

HannibalBarca said:


> yep..but no actual footage of the beast no proof...


The members of the new battalion were coming from 26 different air force regiment, so it must be something really important.

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## samsara

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/844048466615525376Comparison of HQ-19 and THAAD & THAAD Extended Range (ER)

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## Gryphon

monitor said:


> Now it's confirm what Pakistan army just inducted have 70 KM range. No more confusion regarding it's capabilities.



40 km version. First system was ordered in 2013-14.

70 km version (HQ-16B) was cleared for export this year.

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## cirr

Anyone who knows the designation for the NEW medium range SAM?

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## zestokryl



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## samsara

zestokryl said:


>


"China's Strategic Missile Troop Emerges" - CCTV 7 (2016)

Coverage about the PLA Rocket Force

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## zestokryl

Tnx, samsara ...

I love the moment at 1:23, cluster bombs bursts. Liquid engine missile are still in chinese arsenal, according to the video. I though they are phased out in favor of solid fuel ones

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## monitor

Seat of DF-26 ballistic missile

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## samsara

DF-26 MRBM TEL cab









*@xinfengcao* 2017.04.09

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## cirr

PLA Daily report on 18.04.2017: a new missile brigade with a new member of the DF missile family being formed.

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## samsara

China's YJ-62 ASM

Eagle Strike-62 (YJ-62 鹰击-62; yingji-62) heavy coastal defense subsonic anti-ship cruise missile.

The missile has an inertial guidance system using GPS and BeiDou data, and an active terminal sensor. YJ-62A is credited with an operational range of up to 400 km.

The missile is deployed aboard Type 052C DDG, and by coastal defense units using three-round transporter erector launchers (TEL).




















Via Xutianran 2017.04.25

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## grey boy 2

A pretty clear picture of "submarine launch YJ-18 anti-ship missile with a range of 500KM" that also can be launch by a 533 torpedo tube *is in service already*
(Chinese naval analysts, who have labeled the YJ-18 in an early 2015 analysis “最完美的反舰导弹” [the most perfect ASCM] would not agree with that rendering. A Chinese analysis of the YJ-18 appearing in the naval magazine 舰船知识 [Naval & Merchant Ships] published by the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC) in February 2015 is the main basis of this _Dragon Eye_ discussion.
跟俱乐部像，但不是。可以采用标准533鱼雷发射管发射。)
http://nationalinterest.org/feature/chinas-yj-18-supersonic-anti-ship-cruise-missile-americas-13010
基础型号的鹰击18潜舰导弹射程500公里，超过鹰击12的400公里射程。引进的俱乐部导弹最大射程220公里。

飞行速度和弹道方面更趋近俱乐部，末端速度超过M2，但巡航段高度比俱乐部导弹更低。但巡航速度及末端最大速度等均比比鹰击12的全程低空M2.X~2.X，高空M2.7~X.X要低。

更重要的是，该弹应该已经服役

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## samsara

grey boy 2 said:


> A pretty clear picture of "submarine launch YJ-18 anti-ship missile with a range of 500KM" that also can be launch by a 533 torpedo tube *is in service already*
> (Chinese naval analysts, who have labeled the YJ-18 in an early 2015 analysis “最完美的反舰导弹” [the most perfect ASCM] would not agree with that rendering. A Chinese analysis of the YJ-18 appearing in the naval magazine 舰船知识 [Naval & Merchant Ships] published by the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC) in February 2015 is the main basis of this _Dragon Eye_ discussion.
> 跟俱乐部像，但不是。可以采用标准533鱼雷发射管发射。)
> http://nationalinterest.org/feature/chinas-yj-18-supersonic-anti-ship-cruise-missile-americas-13010
> 基础型号的鹰击18潜舰导弹射程500公里，超过鹰击12的400公里射程。引进的俱乐部导弹最大射程220公里。
> 
> 飞行速度和弹道方面更趋近俱乐部，末端速度超过M2，但巡航段高度比俱乐部导弹更低。但巡航速度及末端最大速度等均比比鹰击12的全程低空M2.X~2.X，高空M2.7~X.X要低。
> 
> 更重要的是，该弹应该已经服役


A good read to learn some info about China's ASCM arsenals from the American source. But the article, written by *Lyle J. Goldstein*, an Associate Professor in the China Maritime Studies Institute (CMSI) at the U.S. Naval War College in Newport, RI, is rather aging, dated nearly 2-year-old to be reposted here 

Anyhow it's still a good read and more importantly the publication at least *has the resources to employ the Chinese language experts* to access, track and learn the open military publications and military blogs of China, just to say. Though the author still lamented about the transparency level of the Chinese military. A see-through capability is sought after  somehow they're seeking for an "all seeing eye", the kind of Eye of Sauron 
​
An excerpt from that article: "*China's YJ-18 Supersonic Anti-Ship Cruise Missile: America's Nightmare? | The National Interest*" 2015-06-01 --> a good ref on YJ-18
http://nationalinterest.org/feature...-ship-cruise-missile-americas-13010?page=show

For Washington, some additional attention seems warranted in future intelligence community studies with respect to Chinese ASCM development. The 2015 ONI study gave some attention to YJ-18, but omitted discussion of the supersonic YJ-12, the long-range subsonic YJ-100 or the CX-1 supersonic ASCM that are apparently now in development, according to Chinese sources. Renewed attention will help muster the necessary focus for the U.S. going forward to prepare its forces adequately. For all the ink spilled and Washington seminars convened to discuss China’s expanding coast guard fleet, it is obviously the ever-growing sophistication of the Chinese ASCM arsenal that poses the “clear and present danger” to American sailors.
​*MORE interesting read at The National Interest by the author: *http://nationalinterest.org/profile/lyle-j-goldstein

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## yusheng



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## Akasa

grey boy 2 said:


> A pretty clear picture of "submarine launch YJ-18 anti-ship missile with a range of 500KM" that also can be launch by a 533 torpedo tube *is in service already*
> (Chinese naval analysts, who have labeled the YJ-18 in an early 2015 analysis “最完美的反舰导弹” [the most perfect ASCM] would not agree with that rendering. A Chinese analysis of the YJ-18 appearing in the naval magazine 舰船知识 [Naval & Merchant Ships] published by the China State Shipbuilding Corporation (CSSC) in February 2015 is the main basis of this _Dragon Eye_ discussion.
> 跟俱乐部像，但不是。可以采用标准533鱼雷发射管发射。)
> http://nationalinterest.org/feature/chinas-yj-18-supersonic-anti-ship-cruise-missile-americas-13010
> 基础型号的鹰击18潜舰导弹射程500公里，超过鹰击12的400公里射程。引进的俱乐部导弹最大射程220公里。
> 
> 飞行速度和弹道方面更趋近俱乐部，末端速度超过M2，但巡航段高度比俱乐部导弹更低。但巡航速度及末端最大速度等均比比鹰击12的全程低空M2.X~2.X，高空M2.7~X.X要低。
> 
> 更重要的是，该弹应该已经服役



Is there any information on the land-attack variant, which supposedly has a range of 1400-1500 km?


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## samsara

SinoSoldier said:


> Is there any information on the land-attack variant, which *supposedly has a range of 1400-1500 km*?


Where did you get such info?

More likely it's a groundless rumor


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## Akasa

samsara said:


> Where did you get such info?
> 
> More likely it's a groundless rumor



Seems like groundless rumors as well. It was an estimate taken from an article.


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## cirr

HQ-XX EMSM 









Time: last night
Location: Xinjiang

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## samsara

cirr said:


> HQ-XX EMSM
> 
> View attachment 395155
> View attachment 395156
> 
> 
> Time: last night
> Location: Xinjiang


Good teaser  knowing some really wanna have a transparent look into...

EMSM = Energy-Management Steering Maneuver - have an old glimpse here:

*What Made These Weird Spirals Over China on Halloween Night?*

By Popular Mechanics, Nov 2015






"A series of photographs taken October 31st in China's western Xinjiang province appear to depict a new high altitude air defense missile being developed by the Chinese military. The photos, posted that evening to the Chinese Internet, depict unusual corkscrewing contrails, suggesting a high speed missile intentionally being made to slow itself down.

The photos were taken from the town of Korla, near the Chinese government's Korla Missile Test Complex. China has conducted three tests of what outside observers call the SC-19 or "Hit To Kill Interceptor" at Korla. The SC-19 is alleged to be capable of intercepting enemy missile warheads (and possibly satellites) at altitudes of over 100 kilometers.

The spiraling contrail is an important clue about the nature of the missile that left it. Instead of going straight up—the shortest way from Point A to Point B—the missile traveled in a corkscrew pattern. Such a pattern is evidence of a Energy-Management Steering Maneuver (EMSM).

This spiral is comparable to the American THAAD missile (Theater High Altitude Area Defense), which flies extremely fast—its speeds exceed Mach 8—in order to meet enemy warheads descending on their targets from space. This high speed works against THAAD if called upon to intercept a lower altitude threat.

In order to compensate and still achieve an intercept, the THAAD missile is programmed to fly an EMSM to slow itself down. This means flying in an energy-dissipating spiral pattern. We knew previously that China was working on an THAAD-like interceptor, the SC-19."
...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a18033/china-tests-new-mystery-missile/

*hard to locate any newer article

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## samsara

_It seems that *DF-26B* came out_





Via *@OedoSoldier* *@xinfengcao* 2017-05-07

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> HQ-XX EMSM
> 
> View attachment 395155
> View attachment 395156
> 
> 
> Time: last night
> Location: Xinjiang


These are old photos taken in 2015.


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## Deino

samsara said:


> _It seems that *DF-26B* came out_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Via *@OedoSoldier* *@xinfengcao* 2017-05-07




How does it differ to the A-model ?


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## samsara

Deino said:


> How does it differ to the A-model ?


No idea! 

Even the _powerful front-end tool Wikipedia_ has no mentioning at the slightest about the B-model   and it just keeps a meager entry of it... last update on April 08, 2017!






Interestingly, one of its sources as quoted (I highlighted in yellow shade):

_Military and Security Developments Involving the People's Republic of China (PDF). Office of the Secretary of Defense (Report). U.S. Department of Defense. 2013. Retrieved 3 May 2014. *The DF-21D has a range exceeding 1,500 km and is armed with a maneuverable warhead.*_​

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## 星海军事

26B began its tests at least a year ago.

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## samsara

Ballistic missiles: 4 tests within 4 days

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/858542450499084289
* * * * *

Video on the landing site of the new variant, DF-26B

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861188530080370688

DF-26B: a new variant of the Chinese long-range ASBM

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861517758785355776


samsara said:


> _It seems that *DF-26B* came out_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Via *@OedoSoldier* *@xinfengcao* 2017-05-07

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## JSCh

*China's PLA Rocket Force conducts missile test, defense ministry confirms*
By Wang Xuejing
2017-05-09 21:12 GMT+8




China recently conducted a missile test in the Bohai Sea, according to a statement on Tuesday posted by the Ministry of National Defense on its official website.

The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force carried out a mission in the Bohai Sea to test its new missile based on annual training program, read the statement. It also said the test had "achieved an expected result."

The ministry has not released any further information about the missile. The Bohai Sea is a body of water off the coasts of Tianjin municipality, Shandong, Hebei and Liaoning provinces.

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## samsara

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861975352457003008
To improve military mission performance and ability to effectively deal with national security threats, according to the Ministry of National Defense release, the PLA Rocket Force recently conducted a new missile combat trial in the Bohai Sea, and the outcome achieved its desired effects.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861916009526996992

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861906176421711872

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/861904669492133888
In full (Eng): http://english.chinamil.com.cn/view/2017-05/09/content_7594377.htm

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## Hindustani78

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/610673/china-tests-guided-missile-bohai.html
China today said it has successfully tested a new guided missile in the Bohai Sea near the tense Korean peninsula to raise the operational capability of its armed forces and "effectively respond to threats" to national security.

The People's Liberation Army Rocket (Missile) Force tested the new missile in the Bohai based on annual training programme, the defence ministry said in a brief statement.

The missile was designed to "raise operational capability" of the armed forces to "effectively respond to threats" to national security, it said, adding that the test had "achieved an expected result." However, the statement did not specify when the missile was tested. It just said the test was carried out recently.

The ministry has not released any further information about the missile, state-run CGTN reported today.

The Bohai Sea is a body of water off the coasts of Tianjin municipality, Shandong, Hebei and Liaoning provinces. The test was carried amid China's vociferous protests over US deployment of THAAD interceptor missiles in South Korea, whose powerful radars could see through most part of China including its missile development programme.

THAAD's deployment in South Korea has infuriated China, which fears it will weaken its own ballistic missile capabilities and says it upsets the regional security balance. The THAAD system is designed to intercept and destroy short and medium-range ballistic missiles during their final phase of flight.

The US said the THAAD deployment was aimed at countering any missile attack by North Korea against South Korea, Japan and US itself. China has vowed appropriate response for THAAD missile batteries.

China also said its troops carried out exercises close the North Korean border as US President Donald Trump stepped up pressure on the North Korean leader Kim-Jong-un to scale back the nuclear and missile programme.

China, an acknowledged missile power, has several short, medium and long range missiles. Its Dong Feng 31 (DF-31) is the longest with a range of 11,700 kms.

In 2015, China for the first time demonstrated a whole range of long, medium and short range missiles during a military parade. It included Dongfeng-21D missile, the anti-ship ballistic missile described as the "carrier killer".

It had caused concern among US defence officials as it reportedly has the ability to blow up aircraft carriers from a distance of about 1,500 km to 1,700 kms.

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## BHarwana

*China on Tuesday said it has successfully tested a new guided missile in the Bohai Sea* near the tense Korean peninsula to raise the operational capability of its armed forces and "effectively respond to threats" to national security.

The People's Liberation Army Rocket (Missile) Force tested the new missile in the Bohai based on annual training programme, the defence ministry said in a brief statement.

The missile was designed to "raise operational capability" of the armed forces to "effectively respond to threats" to national security, it said, adding that the test had "achieved an expected result."

However, the statement did not specify when the missile was tested. It just said the test was carried out recently.

The ministry has not released any further information about the missile, state-run CGTN reported.

The Bohai Sea is a body of water off the coasts of Tianjin municipality, Shandong, Hebei and Liaoning provinces. The test was carried amid China's vociferous protests over US deployment of THAAD interceptor missiles in South Korea, whose powerful radars could see through most part of China including its missile development programme.

THAAD's deployment in South Korea has infuriated China, which fears it will weaken its own ballistic missile capabilities and says it upsets the regional security balance. The THAAD system is designed to intercept and destroy short and medium-range ballistic missiles during their final phase of flight. The US said the THAAD deployment was aimed at countering any missile attack by North Korea against South Korea, Japan and US itself.

China has vowed appropriate response for THAAD missile batteries.

China also said its troops carried out exercises close the North Korean border as US President Donald Trump stepped up pressure on the North Korean leader Kim-Jong-un to scale back the nuclear and missile programme.

China, an acknowledged missile power, has several short, medium and long range missiles. *Its Dong Feng 31 (DF-31) is the longest with a range of 11,700 kms.*

In 2015, China for the first time demonstrated a whole range of long, medium and short range missiles during a military parade. *It included Dongfeng-21D missile, the anti-ship ballistic missile described as the "carrier killer"*.

It had caused concern among US defence officials as it reportedly has the ability to *blow up aircraft carriers from a distance of about 1,500 km to 1,700 kms*.

_Representative image_



http://www.rediff.com/news/report/china-tests-new-guided-missile-near-korean-peninsula/20170509.htm

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## samsara

*US Concern Mounts About Chinese Military Modernization, Navy Size, Hypersonic Weapons*






_China experts told Congress about growing concerns regarding Chinese military modernization such as nuclear weapons, Navy fleet growth, hypersonic weapons and submarines._

*By Daniel L. Kuester, U.S. Naval War College Public Affairs - Feb. 27, 2017*

NEWPORT, R.I. – An expert on the faculty of U.S. Naval War College (NWC) in Newport, Rhode Island updated Congress on China’s current military capabilities, possible intentions, and what he sees as the future options in the region at a governmental committee meeting.

*Andrew S. Erickson*, *professor of strategy at NWC* in the *China Maritime Studies Institute* *testified before the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission (USCC)* in the Dirksen Senate Office Building in Washington.

“_My key points are, *with its ambitious ASBM* (anti-ship ballistic missile) development, *China is challenging U.S. Asia-Pacific interests and military influence in new ways*,” said Erickson. “This is part of *a much larger Chinese counter-intervention effort* that is advancing significantly regardless of precise ASBM capabilities or limitations. While China’s missiles pose potential challenges to U.S. forces, ensuring that they can be targeted effectively is expensive and creates growing space-based electromagnetic spectrum vulnerabilities that can be exploited._”

The hearing was co-chaired by Carolyn Bartholomew and Sen. James Talent of Missouri.






Erickson went on to say that select regions are particularly active for the Chinese military right now.

“_In what it (China) considers the near seas (the Yellow Sea, East China Sea, and the South China Sea), Beijing enjoys powerful synergies and advantages vis-à-vis the disputed sovereignty claims it pursues there,” Erickson testified, “increasingly in defiance of regional stability and international laws and norms, and supported by precision-targeted systems designed to challenge American sea control and make American intervention risky._”

*The panel was titled* “_*China’s Hypersonic and Maneuverable Re-Entry Vehicle Programs*_” and also included *James Acton*, co-director of Nuclear Policy Program and senior fellow, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace; and *Mark Stokes*, executive director, Project 2049 Institute.

In closing, Erickson gave USCC some direction on where U.S. policy might go next.

“_U.S. policymakers should enhance efforts at developing tailored countermeasures, particularly concerning electronic warfare,” Erickson said. “(U.S. should also) attempt to ensure that China doesn’t develop Scarborough Shoal into a key targeting node in the South China Sea, and increase U.S. Navy ship numbers to avoid presenting China with an over-concentrated target set._”

The USCC was created by the United States Congress in *October 2000* with the legislative mandate to monitor, investigate, and submit to Congress an annual report on the national security implications of the bilateral trade and economic relationship between the United States and the People’s Republic of China, and to provide recommendations, where appropriate, to Congress for legislative and administrative action.


*READ ALSO:*
My Testimony before the U.S.-China Commission—“Chinese Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile Development and Counter-intervention Efforts”—Hearing on China’s Advanced Weapons | Andrew S. Erickson *2017-02-23*

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## samsara

*DF-26 brigade trains with quick shots*

By Henri Kenhmann - East Pendulum- 31 March 2017






A brigade of Chinese rocket forces recently conducted a nocturnal exercise during which DF-26 long range ballistic missile simulations were conducted, based on a new TV report from the national channel CCTV-7.





Although the military journalists of the Chinese army did not reveal any information about the missile unit, location or even the missile model, it was still possible to identify the missile with a few images identified in the video .

Indeed, the TEL (transporter erector launcher) vehicles that can be seen at the beginning of the report have six axles, two in the front and four in the rear. This configuration is typical of the TEL 12 × 12 of DF-26, model *HTF-5680* designed by the Taian subsidiary of the Chinese group CASC.

One can also notice the conical "hollow", of particular shape which distinguishes it from that of the TELs of DF-21C and DF-21D, which can be seen in the middle of the driver's cabin in a passage of the video.





The cabin of DF-26 TEL, look at the conical shape in the middle





The HTF-5680 model TELs developed for the IRBM DF-26 ballistic missile

During this exercise, the battalions of this DF-26 brigade were ordered to disperse to five shooting sites. Operators have been trained in camouflage against the passage of reconnaissance satellites, countermeasures against communication interference, as well as resistance to precision and biochemical strikes.

According to Colonel Lu Kangwen (吕康文), commander of the brigade in maneuver, this night exercise aims to check the ability of its troops to carry out the burst fire, the rapid launch and also the redeployment on several different sites.

Due to a suspensive base placed at the bottom of the missile tube, like the *RSD-10 *_Pioneer_ missile system (NATO Code SS-20), *the launch of DF-26 no longer requires well-prepared firing sites and fixed coordinates. It can, in principle, be launched without restrictive condition of the ground, thus improving the mobility and survival of the TEL, and the speed of launch.*

It should be noted that Col. Lu had been responsible for the equipment service of another *DF-21D* anti*-*ship ballistic missile brigade based in Qingyuan, southern China. This promotion to the command of a DF-26 brigade therefore remains consistent because this IRBM, with a range of 4,000 to 5,000 km, also has the function of striking large naval targets such as aircraft carriers.

This element also suggests that the DF-26 brigade in question is also based in southern China, probably in the mountainous province of Yunnan. It could therefore be a new unit equipped with this intermediate-range ballistic missile.





The (estimated) range of the DF-26 missile from Kunming, southern China

A final point of interest - at the end of the CCTV-7 report, TELs of DF-21D can be spotted too. Although the idea is tempting to say that the PLA Rocket Forces are maneuvering together two types of anti-ship ballistic missiles, but in reality these sequences most likely have nothing to do with the rapid firing of DF-26 right here.

Henri K.

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## samsara

*DF-26B: A new variant of the Chinese long-range ASBM*

By Henri Kenhmann - East Pendulum - 08 May 2017






Chinese Rocket Forces - the country's strategic deterrent - may have completed a new operational test for the *DF-26B* ballistic missile, a variant of the DF-26 IRBM / long range ASBM, within April if an amateur video taken in Inner Mongolia could be relied upon.

Visibly recorded using a mobile phone, it can be seen that the person who recorded it revolved around a cylindrical object about 5 meter long and 1.5 meters in diameter, on which there is a clear inscription of "E/ADF-26B".

The letter E here means Er (二 in Chinese) which stands for 二炮 (Second Artillery Corps), the former name of the PLA Rocket Forces. And the letter A is the acronym of "Missile" according to the Chinese nomination standard.

Therefore if our first evaluation is accurate, it is a ballistic missile of model DF-26B of the PLA Rocket Forces.






This hull, which is likely to be part of the first or second stage of the missile, plus another wreck smaller in size and embedded in the ground on the side, were found by the local inhabitants of the Siziwang Banner 四子王旗, an administrative region of the Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region, according to the video provider. The faces of the people filmed seem to confirm this very valuable information.

Indeed, the Siziwang Banner is not on the usual route of Chinese ballistic test fire, which is expected to be much further west, over a large area between Ningxia and Xinjiang provinces.

This implies that the DF-26B was launched from northeast China, over the Korean Peninsula, and across the country to the west.

Consider now all the bases of the PLA Rocket Forces, the only possible missile starting points, which correspond to these hypotheses, are located in Jingyu or Tonghua of base No. 51 in Jilin Province near the border of North Korea.





The location of the Siziwang Banner 四子王旗, which is a banner (county equivalent) in the Ulanqab region of 
Inner Mongolia, China. It is located about 80 km north to Hohhot, the capital city of that province.





The possible trajectory of the DF-26B launch

Assuming that the DF-26B missile had actually left Tonghua for example, it would be noticed that the straight line across Tonghua and the Siziwang Banner joins Minfeng, a Chinese ballistic test impact site south to the Taklamakan Desert.

And, the distance between Tonghua and Minfeng is just over 3,700 km, equivalent to the estimated range of DF-26.





From Tonghua to Minfeng, passing by the Siziwang Banner

All of these elements therefore suggest that a combat unit of the PLA Rocket Forces carried out this operational shooting in "Full Range" mode.

Knowing that the DF-26 is officially presented as an intermediate-range ballistic missile capable of carrying nuclear or conventional warhead, in order to strike fixed ground targets or "large ships" in motion, several possibilities are available for us to learn what variant of DF-26B this is:

A variant of Ground-Ground nuclear
A variant of Ground-Ground conventional
A variant of Ground-Sea conventional
A variant of extended range
But considering the scope of the firing, the location of its launch and the geopolitical context around that time, we are focusing more on the third possibility, namely a *long-range anti-ship variant*. This remains to be confirmed, of course.

Finally, when was this DF-26B shot?

The amateur video was posted for the first time on Sunday, April 23rd, 2017. However, there had been no officially published notification, such as NOTAMs, to indicate the firing. And we are not sure whether the date on which the video was published corresponds to the launch date.

By looking in our tracking database on Chinese ballistic missiles that took place before April 23, some could match the trajectory sought. One can quote for example the shot of 13 April, or the double shot of 15 April.





In yellow lines, the aerial segments closed during the ballistic tests on April 13 and 15.

It should be noted that this may not be the first operational shot of DF-26B. Indeed, if we compare the photos of the wreck of another DF-26 shot that took place in August 2016, there are indeed similarities. For those who are interested, you can check our article "DF-26: the 1st operational fire after the entry into service" and have your own ideas.

To be continued.

Henri K.

----------------

The untouched question now is what difference between the A and B models? More range? Higher accuracy? Better penetration (hardened head)?

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## Zarvan

Stills from a video published in April showing what appears to be a jettisoned motor section from a multi-stage ballistic missile in the Chinese autonomous region of Inner Mongolia. Source: Tencent video

China's People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force has successfully test-fired a new missile in the Bohai Sea amid tensions with Seoul and Washington over the deployment of the US Army's Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) system to South Korea.

In reply to a media enquiry about a recent missile test, the Information Bureau of China's Ministry of National Defense (MND) said in a 9 May statement that the Rocket Force had "conducted an operational test for its new-type missile weapons in waters of the Bohai Sea and achieved its expected results".

It implied the test was a routine, saying it was carried out "in accordance to the annual training plan to enhance the combat skills of the force and its ability to handle threats to national security".

The statement did not identify the missiles or say when the test took place, but it came about two weeks after video footage emerged on Chinese online forums showing what appeared to be a motor section from a multi-stage ballistic missile that was jettisoned, reportedly over the Siziwang area in China's autonomous region of Inner Mongolia, as part of a missile test launch.

The markings E/ADF-26B could be seen on the object, suggesting it was a stage from a variant of the two-stage DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile.

Released around 23 April, the footage shows the motor case in relatively good condition, given the impact of it falling back to the ground. At the rear of the motor case a single nozzle aperture is present, with the nozzle assembly and most of the supporting structures broken off and missing.

It appears the front of the motor case struck the ground, leaving a large crater and damaging and scattering parts of what seem to be inter-stage components. From image scaling, the motor case appears to be approximately 6 m long with a diameter of around 1.4 m.

*Want to read more? For analysis on this article and access to all our insight content, please enquire about our subscription options:　**ihs.com/contact*




To read the full article, Client Login
(336 of 1042 words)

http://www.janes.com/article/70251/china-tests-new-missile-in-bohai-sea

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## samsara

PLAAF S300 SAM troops

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/862662412104744960

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## samsara

The Dongfeng 21 东风 (DF-21)










Via @xinfengcao 2017.05.15


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## grey boy 2

samsara said:


> The Dongfeng 21 东风 (DF-21)
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
> 
> Via @xinfengcao 2017.05.15

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## samsara

*China’s latest missile test shows country can respond to aircraft carriers, THAAD*

By Deng Xiaoci | Global Times Published: 2017-05-10





_China's DF-26 in picture. The new variant tested is DF-26B._​
China's successful test of a *new type of guided missile* in the Bohai Sea killed two birds with one stone, experts told the Global Times, as the launch shows China _can attack both aircraft carriers_ and _the US Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) missile defense system deployed in South Korea_. 

"_To judge from the missile remains disclosed by media, it was a *DF-26* that was tested recently, also known as the '*aircraft carrier killer*' missile,_" Song Zhongping, a military expert who used to serve in the PLA Rocket Force, told the Global Times

"_Considering the type of missile and the test location it is evident that we conducted a firing experiment *targeting aircraft carriers*, and the warhead possibly featured an *electromagnetic pulse* that could destroy a carrier's command system, as well as the *THAAD system*,_" Song noted.

When asked if the test's location in the Bohai Sea, close to the Korean Peninsula, could show that the test was specifically aimed at Seoul's THAAD deployment, Song said that this is unlikely as Bohai is China's usual weapons testing ground, unlike the South and East China Seas where experiments could be difficult as the waters contain various nations' Exclusive Economic Zones and international waters.

*A statement from the Information Bureau of China's Ministry of National Defense on Tuesday confirmed that Chinese rocket forces tested a new type of missile in the Bohai Sea.*

The statement said the test was conducted in accordance with the annual training plan to "_raise the operational capability of the armed forces and effectively respond to threats to national security,_" the statement said.

"_The test achieved the expected result,_" said the statement, without disclosing its exact date.

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## grey boy 2



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## samsara

*China’s missile tests in Bohai ‘aimed at THAAD’*

Analysts say ‘rare high-profile announcement of test’ was a response to last month’s deployment of US-built anti-missile system in South Korea

By Minnie Chan - SCMP
PUBLISHED : Wednesday, 10 May, 2017, 11:16am
UPDATED : Wednesday, 10 May, 2017, 11:27pm






Chinese rocket forces tested a _new type of missile_ aimed at the country’s waters west of the Korean peninsula, the defence ministry announced in a rare public statement.

The statement did not say what missile was tested or when the launch took place but the announcement was likely aimed at South Korea and the United States, observers said.

South Korea’s President Moon would visit North under ‘right circumstances’, will talk THAAD with US and China

“_The People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force conducted a test of a new type of missile somewhere in Bohai [Sea] in recent days, and achieved desired results,_” the ministry said in a statement on Tuesday.

It said the test was designed to boost the military’s capacity to fight threats to national security.

Military analysts said the “_rare *high-profile* announcement of the missile test_” was a response to the deployment of the US-built Terminal High Altitude Area Defence (THAAD) anti-missile system in South Korea. The announcement comes after defence ministry spokesman Yang Yujun said last month that China would conduct live-fire drills and test new weapons to safeguard its security in response to the THAAD roll-out.

The US military began installing the system’s first components in South Korea late last month after nuclear-armed North Korea launched four missiles which it said was part of training for a strike on US bases in Japan.






Hong Kong-based military analyst Liang Guoliang said the Chinese missile might have been launched from the mainland’s northwest, probably in Xinjiang or Gansu provinces, *with the warhead landing in the Bohai Sea*.

“_The missile might be launched from the northwest to the east by the Rocket Force, with a range of 2,000km or above. It was likely the advanced intermediate-range *DF-26B*, a modified version of the DF-26,_” Liang said.

Holiday hush as Chinese tourists shun South Korean resort island amid THAAD missile shield row

“_Given the landing area, the test is obviously aimed at THAAD in South Korea._”

The *DF-26B* is the _new generation_ of Dongfeng series missiles.

Zhou Chenming, from the Knowfar Institute for Strategic and Defence Studies, a Chinese think tank, said: “_The test might involve variants of *new missile types*, including the DF-21, DF-26 and other types of Dongfeng series missiles._”

Zhou said the Bohai Sea had been the landing site for all sea target missile tests for several years, but this time “_was quite high profile_” as the defence ministry announced it. “_Missile tests near the East Sea could cause deterrence to some countries,_” Zhou said.

China reaches out to new South Korean leader amid tensions with North Korea and the US

Macau-based military observer Antony Wong Dong said the test might also be aimed at Washington, which has sent two aircraft carrier strike groups to waters off the Korean Peninsula.

“_The test missile might be a new modified DF-26A anti-ship missile launched from a marine weapons testing ground in southern Liaoning,_” Wong said.

The US the USS Carl Vinson carrier strike group to the Korean peninsula to conduct naval drills with the South Korean navy and Japanese Maritime Self-Defence Force last month. Another carrier, the Ronald Reagan, would join the carrier group late this month, according to a report from the _Nikkei Asian Review_.


_*This article appeared in the South China Morning Post print edition as:*
CHINA missile test ‘aimed at thaad’_

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## JSCh

From Weibo, said to be the first ever showing of DF-5B ICBM launch on Chinese media.




​Link to the CCTV-7 program - 《军事报道》, on 17 May.
http://tv.cctv.com/2017/05/17/VIDExh0O5squTe5AY9RAOFU1170517.shtml​

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## cirr



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## Han Patriot

cirr said:


> View attachment 397827


Do they really need to show it off? Please maintain our old tradition of humility and secrecy. Please dun be a 'quantum mouth' like our fellow indy forumers.

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## yusheng



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## samsara

*The 8th Boost-Glide test, an ICBM with MiRV, or...?*

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/865938896172965888

*The 8th Boost-Glide test, an ICBM with MiRV, or...?*

By Henri Kenhmann - East Pendulum - 19 May 2017





Chinese Hypersonic Gliding Vehicle (HGV) - artist rendition​
On May 18, 1980, *37 years ago*, China carried out its first and only intercontinental full-scope ballistic test with what they called the "transport rocket", actually the DF-5 ballistic missile, which hit an area of 70 nautical miles in the southern Pacific Ocean.

And thirty seven years later, and as if to commemorate this important date, Chinese Rocket Forces seem to have conducted a large-scale trial in the western part of China this day.

In addition to 9 aerial segments closed to aircraft over a wide area measuring 1,270 km in length and 330 km in width, a large 422,308 km² fallout area in Xinjiang Province was also notified and access was prohibited.

This figure of 422,308 km² seems little, but it is as if 77% of the surface of metropolitan France is totally closed in an armament test and transformed into fallout zone. *No Chinese test in recent years has reserved such a wide security zone, if our tracking is correct.*

By way of comparison, the final fallout zone of the new DF-5C test with MiRV this year in January measured only 125,336 km², just less than one third of this test. France's last test run of the M51 missile in Operation Bellérophon which took place on July 1, 2015, had only a final fallout zone within a 92 nautical mile radius, or 90,938 km².

According to the four Notices to Airmen (NOTAMs) concerned, this test would had taken place between 01:20 and 02:30 UTC, that was from 07:20 to 08:30 BJT. The shape and orientation of the prohibited areas seem to suggest that the launch of any gear originated in eastern China, probably from the Taiyuan Space Launch Center (TSLC), used frequently in Chinese ballistic tests.

*A1119 / 17*
Q) ZLHW / QARLC / IV / NBO / E / 000/999 /
A) ZLHW B) 1705180110 C) 1705180230
E) THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD:
1.W188: LIKMI - GOVSA.
2.W66: NUKTI - EJINAQI VOR 'JNQ'-GOBIN.
3.B215: JIAYUGUAN VOR 'CHW' - NUKTI.
4. W187: TUSLI- DUNHUANG VOR'DNH '- NUKTI.
5.G470: BIKNO- DUNHUANG VOR'DNH'- AKTOB.
6.W191: DUNHUANG VOR'DNH'-MOVBI.
7.W192: TUSLI-RUSDI.

*A1118 / 17*
Q) ZLHW / QARLC / IV / NBO / E / 000/999 /
A) ZLHW B) 1705180110 C) 1705180330
E) THE FLW SEGMENTS OF ATS RTE CLSD:
1. B330: YABRAI VOR 'YBL'-MORIT.
2. W66: DENGKOU VOR 'DKO'-GOBIN.

*A1125 / 17*
Q) ZWUQ / QRTCA / IV / BO / W / 000/999 /
A) ZWUQ B) 1705180120 C) 1705180230
E) A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED BY:
N420010E0953153-N423458E0851212-N420109E0845143-N393631E0780251-N375138E0802409-N381132E0825744-N395343E0921913 BACK TO START.
VERTICAL LIMITS: GND-UNL.
F) GND G) UNL





In yellow, the area & aerial segments prohibited from overflying. In orange, closed areas partially under 6,000 m (Image: East Pendulum)​So what type of weapon requires such a large fallout zone?

We can start from the first assumption that the riskier the subject of the test, the more precautionary measures people must prepare, the greater the safety zone must be reserved to avoid collateral damage.

The next question we can ask is, what risks can we have to justify the establishment of a security zone three times greater than that for a MiRV test, with a priori knowledge that a ballistic weapon must cover about 1,500 to 2,000 km before arriving at this one?

Our first thought goes for a highly maneuverable machine, whose longitudinal and lateral maneuverability exceeds a few tens to see a hundred kilometers of MiRV heads.

Ramjet / Scramjet type hypersonic missiles may already be discarded due to the very long (> 2,000 km) test distance.

The upper Supersonic / Hypersonic Drone that we have already spoken several times here on East Pendulum could match but the duration of the flight, 80 minutes at the most, is much less than previous flights.

So what left is a *hypersonic vector* that the Chinese have already tested 7 times, a priori all successful, during the last 3 years - the gear *Boost-Glide* (*Hypersonic Glider*).

This type of craft is *precisely characterized by its very great lateral maneuverability in terminal approach phase.* The United States HTV-2 had 16,677 km of rectilinear distance and 5,560 km of lateral deviation, which corresponds to 1/3 of the flight distance.

And if we look again at the areas of this Chinese test, we could distinguish two flight directions - one (in white) that goes from the TSLC center to the Korla site, and the other (red) Taklamakan desert.

The distance of the deviation is also approximately 1/3 of the total range.






The two flight directions in the test of May 18, 2017 (Image: East Pendulum)​
To make sure that the firing direction of this Chinese test remains consistent with the last Boost-Glide tests, we chose to overlap the no-fly zones of the 5th Chinese Boost-Glide test, which took place on 20 August 2015, with those of yesterday.

The 5th test was chosen because, according to Pentagon sources, the Chinese machine, known as the DF-ZF (formerly known as the Wu-14 as referred by the Americans), carried out "evasive maneuvers" (evasive actions).

The light colored areas in the diagram at the bottom shows the trajectory of this 5th DF-ZF and the last drop zone near Korla illustrates the lateral maneuvers of the craft.

And the result of this superposition shows that the flights of 20 August 2015 and 18 May 2017 could be of the same nature. It can therefore be assumed that the test of May 18, 2017 would correspond to a Boost-Glide machine, also capable of performing lateral deviation but much more importantly.








The no-fly zones of the 5th Boost-Glide test (blue) and those of 18 May 2017 (Images: East Pendulum)​Of course, other hypotheses are possible and the Boost-Glide machine is only one possibility, perhaps more credible, among many others.

In any case, it is particularly noteworthy that the institutional media of the Chinese Army, such as the "PLA Daily" newspaper, for example, published many articles on rocket forces on 18 May. Knowing the communication habits of the Chinese army, if the test has indeed taken place, it can only be a success.

Note that some of these articles published yesterday even revealed interesting information, such as on the "new" MRBM DF-16 and DF-16A for example, but we will have the opportunity to come back in the near future.

Henri K.

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## samsara

*Ballistic missile with submunition warhead hits target*






















*Ballistic missile with penetrating warhead hits concrete hangar*






















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/866268531926507520

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## grey boy 2

samsara said:


> *Ballistic missile with submunition warhead hits target*
> 
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> *Ballistic missile with penetrating warhead hits concrete hangar*
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> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/866268531926507520



Wow, "Powerful" DF-16?

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## grey boy 2

PLA Rocket Force

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## cirr

Develoment of new generation aerospace defence missile completed:

http://www.fyjs.casic.cn/n355677/n661085/c3515797/content.html

HQ-26???

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> Develoment of new generation aerospace defence missile completed:
> 
> http://www.fyjs.casic.cn/n355677/n661085/c3515797/content.html
> 
> HQ-26???



Successor to HQ-9.

A missile possesses lateral jets and aerodynamic surfaces.

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## Han Patriot

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2017-05/27/content_29520150.htm

*Ultrafast missile interceptor developed*
By Zhao Lei | China Daily | Updated: 2017-05-27 05:24













China has developed a new type of ultrafast anti-missile interceptor capable of knocking down an incoming projectile that is flying 10 times faster than a bullet, according to the nation's largest missile maker.

China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, one of the major defense contractors for the People's Liberation Army, recently revealed that its Second Academy in Beijing has made a "new-generation aerospace defense missile" that incorporates top space technologies, and which it describes as one of the cornerstones of a world power's strategic prowess.

The weapon is so difficult to design that only a handful of nations in the world are able to develop it, the State-owned company said, adding that its product is capable of bringing down targets tens of kilometers above the ground that fly 10 times faster than a bullet.

The CASIC Second Academy is the country's major developer of air defense systems.

The information of such a missile defense system, a cutting-edge weapon that only the United States and Russia were previously reported to have, was disclosed in an article released by CASIC earlier this month.

The article was about the contribution by control system researchers from the Zhang Yiqun Studio, a group named after a prominent scientist, at the academy.

Although the introduction did not specify the anti-missile interceptor's capabilities, experts said the descriptions "tens of kilometers" and "10 times faster than a bullet" indicate its range should be from 10 km to 100 km and its minimum velocity around 12,000 km/h — a typical bullet used by a handgun, the slowest of all bullets, normally travels about 1,200 km/h.

The average age of the weapon's designers is 32, according to the article. They overcame numerous problems during research and development, including an explosion of one of the weapon's prototypes during a flight test, it said.

Lyu Xiaoge, spokesman for CASIC, declined to comment on the anti-missile interceptor on Friday, saying his company has developed many world-class missiles in recent years and will continue to contribute to the nation's missile arsenal.

Wang Ya'nan, editor-in-chief of Aerospace Knowledge, said an advanced anti-missile interceptor requires cutting-edge technologies, superb manufacturing techniques and top materials and will only be successful after a great number of tests.

China successfully completed three land-based, midcourse missile interception tests in 2010, 2013 and 2014, according to the Defense Ministry. Whether the weapon mentioned by the CASIC Second Academy was the same used in these tests was not clear.

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## zestokryl



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## Shotgunner51

zestokryl said:


>


Interesting video of Norinco SR-5, I heard English in the video background, who are testing this system? I know Bahrain and Venezuela have inducted this system.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/armor/detail.asp?armor_id=819
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/17...SR5_Multiple_Launch_Rocket_Systems_To_Bahrain

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## zestokryl

Maybe it was a presentation during some arms expo, for international auditorium. Wonder under what conditions its projectile can hit target with almost zero CEP

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## grey boy 2

DF-15C "Bunker Buster" 
"DF-15C ‘bunker buster’ — a hi-tech ballistic missile designed to obliterate enemy command centres."
A short-range missile, equipped with a powerful deep-penetration warhead, were published in _Ordnance Knowledge_, which is controlled by the People’s Liberation Army.

According Taiwan’s _ Want China Times_, citing a report in the China’s _Global Times_, the missile can be directed using a terminal radar guidance system or infra-red imaging guidance system. It has a range of 700 kilometres — covering any point between Kyushu in Japan and the Indian capital of New Delhi — and a circular error probability of between 15-20 metres.
http://www.news.com.au/technology/c...d/news-story/223019155935526b944d0b7b200a5452

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## grey boy 2

HQ-9凌晨发射高清大图 (credits to extentt)of cjdby

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## lcloo

Soldiers assigned to a surface-to-air missile brigade of the air force under the PLA Central Theater Command utilize a dedicated wire rope sling to hoist a HQ-2B long-range anti-aircraft missile system to the proper height during an actual combat tactical training exercise in northwest China's Gansu Province on June 1, 2017. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Wang Hongbin)

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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> Successor to HQ-9.
> 
> A missile possesses lateral jets and aerodynamic surfaces.



So, to be clear, is this the unknown mystery missile shown below, otherwise known as the ''*HQ-26*''? Is this missile a SAM-ABM hybrid?


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## Beast

lcloo said:


> Soldiers assigned to a surface-to-air missile brigade of the air force under the PLA Central Theater Command utilize a dedicated wire rope sling to hoist a HQ-2B long-range anti-aircraft missile system to the proper height during an actual combat tactical training exercise in northwest China's Gansu Province on June 1, 2017. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Wang Hongbin)
> 
> View attachment 400939
> 
> View attachment 400940
> 
> View attachment 400941
> 
> View attachment 400942


More of training for newbie. I doubt PLAAF actually put them into real combat duties now.

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## lcloo

Beast said:


> More of training for newbie. I doubt PLAAF actually put them into real combat duties now.


LOL, you are right, See the broken seal 封条 on the door of the truck? This truck must have been moth-balled and kept in reserve before they took it out for training. 

HQ-2B formed the main missile shields around cities like Beijing, before S-300 ad HQ-9 took over the job.

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## grey boy 2



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## grey boy 2



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## onebyone

China is improving on the firing range of its missiles with recent tests of a solid-fuel engine that operates most efficiently at supersonic speeds. File Photo by Stephen Shaver/UPI 
| License Photo

June 6 (UPI) -- China has completed a successful test of a solid-fuel engine that would improve the firing range of missiles, according to state media.

Beijing's state tabloid Global Times reported the military's solid-fuel variable flow ramjet engine underwent two tests.

The engine would improve the stealth-fighting capabilities of the J-20 fighter aircraft, according to China Aerospace Science and Technology Corp.

A ramjet is a jet engine that operates most efficiently at supersonic speeds. It operates by injecting fuel into compressed air during high-speed flight and is chiefly used in missile technology.

Chinese military expert Song Zhongping, formerly of the People's Liberation Army Rocket Force, said the new engine would increase the firing range of the J-20, and mobility for air-to-air and anti-ship missiles.

China has been working on a new missile engine with a special team since 2000, and has conducted eight tests with the No. 4 research institute.

Song said if the engine is miniaturized, China's air-to-air missiles could travel at a hypersonic speed of Mach 5, or five times the speed of sound, while capable of striking targets at distances of about 180 miles.

The new engine could be fitted on China's new missiles, including the PL-12, Song said.

The J-20 is capable of flying long distances while receiving air refueling, and can fire long-range cruise missiles.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-N...issile-engine-state-media-says/8151496755575/

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## cirr

It seems that the cost to PLA Rocket force of a DF-10 cruise missile（tipped with a cluster wrhead) is a mere 850,000 RMB, and that of a DF-16/DF-21 BM with cluster warhead is 3,500,000 RMB. 

Bloody cheap! 

Now let's have hundreds of thousands of these missiles just for fun.

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## GDP Adil Khan Niazi

China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation (CASC) announced that it successfully undertook two flight tests for its new solid-fuel variable flow ramjet engine.

According to CASC (via China’s state-owned Global Times), the engine will power hypersonic air-to-air missiles (AAM) as part of its next-generation air warfare arsenal to accompany China’s next-generation fighters, such as the Chengdu J-20.

Chinese analysts – such as Song Zhongping – believe China will be able to develop AAMs with ranges of up to 300 km and speeds exceeding Mach 5. This will be contingent on how well China fares in developing onboard electronics (for guidance and terminal engagement).

As per Global Times, CASC’s No. 4 Research Institute has been engaged in developing ramjet engines since 2000 – it had conducted eight tests in recent years.

*Notes & Comments:*

China’s near-term aspirations will center on building a counterpart to the MBDA Meteor, which is a mainstay ramjet-powered AAM with a long-range No Escape Zone (which MBDA claims is “several times” that of contemporary medium-range AAMs).

It does not seem that this solution would be ramjet-powered – the forthcoming PL-15 appears to be a development of the rocket-based PL-12. Another Chinese long-range AAM program, which surfaced thanks to photos from November of a new missile onboard the J-16, is also rocket-based, as opposed to ramjet-powered. That said, these are valuable programs, especially since they can be scaled towards the development of compact medium-to-long-range surface-to-air missiles (SAM).

China’s current portfolio of serviceable ramjet-powered missiles include anti-ship missiles, such as the CM-302, which can cruise at supersonic speed. China Aerospace Science & Industry Corporation (CASIC) marketed the CM-302 for export at Air Show China 2016, which took place in Zhuhai in November. CASC’s research will likely yield alternate solutions, but it will be worth observing if China’s pursuit for high-value exports drive CASC to create a ramjet-powered AAM in the short-to-medium term.


This is remarkable achievement for China.
It makes them 5th country after USA, Russia, France, Germany to test solid duct ramjet.

SFDR solid fuel ducted rocket as used in meteor have larger range, higher supersonic speed(early hypersonic)as compared to liquid ramjet used in brahmos.

Infact liquid ramjet is not feasible for AAM for which it's better to use dual pulse engine.

Indian version of desi meteor is work in progress . It's an AAM based on booster ramjet sustainable propulsion. Let's hope if DRDL can show their first test launch of controlled ramjet, air intakes, nozzle less booster with powerful boron based propellent before 2020

The recent test of qrsam 1st version based on Astra dual pulse engine with local seeker is first jump into sophisticated, precision SAM/AAM development.

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## Hallian_Khan

congratulations

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## Dungeness

*Jane's Defence: New ramjet engine to enhance range, speed of China's air-launched missiles*
*Gabriel Dominguez, London* - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
06 June 2017


China has successfully tested a solid-fuel, variable-flow ramjet engine designed to enhance the firing range and speed of air-launched missiles, the state-owned _Global Times_ newspaper reported on 5 June.

The paper quoted a report by the Science and Technology Daily of China's Ministry of Science and Technology as saying that a research team affiliated with the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation (CASC) recently conducted two successful flight tests with the new engine.

According to the report, the engine is "ready for further engineering application, paving the way for China's next generations of hypersonic missiles".

The new engine, which is still under development, is expected to increase the firing range and mobility of air-to-air missiles and anti-ship missiles fitted onto China's latest combat aircraft, including the Chengdu Aircraft Corporation (CAC) J-20 'fifth-generation' fighter, Song Zhongping, a military expert who used to serve in the PLA Rocket Force, told _Global Times_ .

http://www.janes.com/article/71183/...-range-speed-of-china-s-air-launched-missiles

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## grey boy 2

DF-21C (十枚东风21导弹齐亮相)

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## grey boy 2

CCTV: DF-21C launching mode on the highway 东风21C在公路上机动起竖夜间发射
据央视报道，中国火箭军某导弹部队近日在戈壁荒滩和山地丛林进行实弹演练，演习了多项新战法。画面中，疑似东风21C导弹在公路上机动、起竖，并在夜间进行了发射。

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## grey boy 2

DF-21C targeting at the "1st island chain" 解放军东风21C弹道导弹野外发射，大国利器强劲出击，可覆盖第一岛链内的所有目标，是解放军火箭军部队的中流砥柱。

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## grey boy 2

DF-21C

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## grey boy 2

DF-21

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## JSCh

* China's PLA Rocket Force releases new recruiting commercial *
 People's Daily, China
Published on Jun 13, 2017

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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> Successor to HQ-9.
> 
> A missile possesses lateral jets and aerodynamic surfaces.



Do we know if this new interceptor is related to (or the same as) the HQ-26? Is the HQ-26 the same as the missile in the following photo?


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## 星海军事

SinoSoldier said:


> Do we know if this new interceptor is related to (or the same as) the HQ-26? Is the HQ-26 the same as the missile in the following photo?



I don't think so


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## The SC

China's Poly Defense Company offered the GAM-10X series of rockets:

- The GAM-100 is capable of penetrating 800 mm with a range of 2500 meters
- GAM-101A / B for UAV with 1000 mm penetration capacity
- The GAM-102 is capable of penetrating 1000 mm with a range of 4000 meters

The missile can be guided by infrared so that it can hit the target either from the top or hit it directly.

GAM-101A/B





GAM-102










E / O radar

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## 52051

According to Xi Yazhou, a famous blogger on military news, the huge size long range anti-air missile you saw carried by possibly J-16, has a maximum range of 700 km instead of 400 km:
https://lt.cjdby.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2399781&extra=page=1

Dont know how creditable this is.

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## yusheng

range700km。。。。。。。。。。。。。

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## ChineseTiger1986

yusheng said:


> View attachment 412473
> 
> range700km。。。。。。。。。。。。。



Maybe the radar of the J-20 can do it.

@UKBengali something new for you.

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## 52051

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Maybe the radar of the J-20 can do it.
> 
> @UKBengali something new for you.



Impossible, considering the curve of earth.

The only way I can think about is to have UAV detecting network, communicating and and data-linking through satelliates to the platforms carrying such missiles.

Basically means it works like a inter-connected system.

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## ChineseTiger1986

52051 said:


> Impossible, considering the curve of earth.
> 
> The only way I can think about is to have UAV detecting network, communicating and and data-linking through satelliates to the platforms carrying such missiles.
> 
> Basically means it works like a inter-connected system.



At least I was hoping that the J-20 can do it alone without the help from the AEW&C aircraft.

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## Cybernetics

52051 said:


> Impossible, considering the curve of earth.
> 
> The only way I can think about is to have UAV detecting network, communicating and and data-linking through satelliates to the platforms carrying such missiles.
> 
> Basically means it works like a inter-connected system.



In addition the type 055, 052D and other ships with powerful enough radars and network warfare capability could be utilised to track and target planes and guide the missile. This will provide quite a strong synergy between naval and aerial platforms.






If such an missile is used in theoretical battle in North Eastern India 055 destroyer(s) can operate in the bay of Bengal tracking and targeting planes in the entire north east plus a few other surrounding states. The 700 km missile range is sufficient to cover the distance from Chinese-Indian border to bay of Bengal. J-16 can takeoff from bases in Tibet, Yunnan, Sichuan, and Qinghai reach attitude and speed then fire the missile when close to the border at a target hundreds of km away all under the cover of the Himalayas or peek over temporarily, not having to cross the Chinese-Indian border and return to base. This will give the non-stealthy J-16 effective stealth with the cover of the Himalayas or at least reduce radar exposure. J-16s patrolling in Tibetan plateau during high alert can provide continuous instant launch ability, without having to be scrambled when an enemy plane is spotted, giving them time to flee. This could be done in conjunction with UAV swarm operating from bases within China in the north and 055 in the south. Any planes taking off from the north east and a few surrounding states would be potential targets. It is a possible way of achieving air superiority without having to send fighters over Indian airspace at the start of operations. This is a viable strategy if there is a naval presence in the Bay of Bengal.

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## 52051

Cybernetics said:


> In addition the type 055, 052D and other ships with powerful enough radars and network warfare capability could be utilised to track and target planes and guide the missile. This will provide quite a strong synergy between naval and aerial platforms.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If such an missile is used in theoretical battle in North Eastern India 055 destroyer(s) can operate in the bay of Bengal tracking and targeting planes in the entire north east plus a few other surrounding states. The 700 km missile range is sufficient to cover the distance from Chinese-Indian border to bay of Bengal. J-16 can takeoff from bases in Tibet, Yunnan, Sichuan, and Qinghai reach attitude and speed then fire the missile when close to the border at a target hundreds of km away all under the cover of the Himalayas or peek over temporarily, not having to cross the Chinese-Indian border and return to base. This will give the non-stealthy J-16 effective stealth with the cover of the Himalayas or at least reduce radar exposure. J-16s patrolling in Tibetan plateau during high alert can provide continuous instant launch ability, without having to be scrambled when an enemy plane is spotted, giving them time to flee. This could be done in conjunction with UAV swarm operating from bases within China in the north and 055 in the south. Any planes taking off from the north east and a few surrounding states would be potential targets. It is a possible way of achieving air superiority without having to send fighters over Indian airspace at the start of operations. This is a viable strategy if there is a naval presence in the Bay of Bengal.



These missiles are still in expermential stage, so they are not useful in the coming war with india, but China has more than enough arsenal to overpower india anyway.

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## 帅的一匹

52051 said:


> These missiles are still in expermential stage, so they are not useful in the coming war with india, but China has more than enough arsenal to overpower india anyway.


PL15 with 180KM range can knock down any Barat fighter easily.

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## Han Patriot

wanglaokan said:


> PL15 with 180KM range can knock down any Barat fighter easily.


Nooooo....India will tell you they have BRAHMOSSSSSSSSSSS. BRAHMOSSSS can kill anything.

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## hassamun

PLAAF CAC J-10C combat aircraft armed with PL-10 short-range AAMs (outer underwing pylons) and what appear to be new BVRAAMs (mid-underwing pylons). Source: Via Chinese internet

Images have emerged on Chinese online military forums showing a People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) J-10C combat aircraft armed with what appears to be a new beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile (BVRAAM).

The fighter was photographed carrying two PL-10 short-range AAMs on its outer underwing pylons and two of the new missiles on its mid-underwing pylons.

Although nomenclature is uncertain as no official information is forthcoming, it is likely that the new missile is the one being referred to unofficially as the PL-15, with its appearance on the underwing pylons of a J-10C possibly reflecting that it is now in service.

The missile is estimated to be around 3.7 m long, with a diameter of 200 mm. It is fitted with low aspect ratio aerodynamic stabilising surfaces (trapezoidal wings) on its mid-section and at the moveable control surfaces (clipped delta fins) at its tail.

The respective surface spans approximately 390 mm and 515 mm. There is no visible evidence of a thrust vectoring control (TVC) system present at the rear of the new missile, as can clearly be seen on the PL-10, so control appears to be aerodynamic only. Additionally, there are no air intakes that would be necessary if propulsion was provided by a ramjet, so it can be assumed that a standard form rocket motor is being used.

Photographs of a similar missile carried by a Shenyang Aircraft Corporation J-16 emerged in 2012, which is thought to be undergoing development trials. Like the recent sighting, the missile’s aerodynamic surfaces are the same low aspect ratio planform, which facilitates loading in the internal weapons bay of the CAC J-20 'fifth-generation' fighter.

http://www.janes.com/article/72393/new-bvraam-may-have-entered-plaaf-service

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## 帅的一匹

PL15 uses dual pulse solid rocket engine same as AIM-120D, the ramjet design had been scrapped due to its natural born flaw.

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## JSCh

From weibo, said to be from museum in Beijing.
















​Military Museum of the Chinese People's Revolution - Wikipedia




start exhibition today with main theme to commemorate 90 anniversary of the PLA. 
​

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## cirr

JSCh said:


> From weibo, said to be from museum in Beijing.
> 
> View attachment 413193
> 
> View attachment 413195
> 
> View attachment 413196
> 
> View attachment 413199
> ​Military Museum of the Chinese People's Revolution - Wikipedia
> 
> View attachment 413241​
> start exhibition today with main theme to commemorate 90 anniversary of the PLA.
> ​



1st pic 2nd from left DF-31AG

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## grey boy 2

Does anyone has problem signing in into "Weibo" or its only me?

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## cirr

DF-41







New brigade, this time in Xinjiang.

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## FullColor15

who have new photos about DF-41 fanboys show me and post please

i have photos df-41


















i want to see the new photos about df-41 fanboys who have new photos post please

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## cirr

DF-31A and its younger stronger brother DF-31AG(model) on public display

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## ChineseTiger1986

cirr said:


> DF-31A and its younger stronger brother DF-31AG(model) on public display



With the HGV, the range of the DF-31AG can be increased up to 18000 km with a Mach 20 non-ballistic warhead.

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## Tiqiu

Maybe it is time for China to showcase this type of weapon on our bad neighbour. Or at least it should be handed over to our PK brother for free.

" 这款发射车有4小8大共12个发射筒，在一旁则配合展出了2款口径不同的巡飞弹。在珠海航展上展出的体型相仿的CH901巡飞弹，长1.2米，重9千克，最高速度150公里/小时，飞行控制半径15千米，留空时间120分钟，具有很强的实用价值"

"从图中看，这款巡飞弹自带红外搜索系统，可以很方便的实现“察打一体”；而且该系统可以很方便的整合到现役“装甲猛士”高机动车辆平台上，无疑能够大大提升我军基层分队的火力和精确度。未来，我们还能以广泛装备部队的40管122毫米火箭弹为平台，装备更大的旅级侦察、打击、评估等多功能巡飞弹。"
















What makes the Chinese CH-901 drone so dangerous to the US?
https://www.quora.com/What-makes-the-Chinese-CH-901-drone-so-dangerous-to-the-US

The CH-901 is a real game-changer, not because it's the first lethal, portable drone — the AeroVironment Switchblade takes that credit — but because it's being produced by China for the export market.





This is a tactical weapon that can be carried by one soldier and launched from its tube from behind cover. The operator uses the video image beamed back by the drone to locate targets; it can cruise around for up to an hour at speeds of 40–80 mph at a few hundred feet. This long endurance, and the ability to find targets on its own, make it a loitering munition. Range is around nine miles.

Once a target is located, the CH-901 locks on and dives on it in a Kamikaze-style attack.

Two key things to note about the CH-901. Unlike the Switchblade, it carries a warhead powerful enough to destroy light armoured vehicles — anything short of an M1 Abrams in fact. At six pounds, it's a much bigger warhead than an RPG and will hit with much greater accuracy because it's a guided weapon. That means that Bradleys, Strykers, Hummers and everything else are vulnerable to a portable long-range anti-armor weapon which, unllike rockets and missiles, has no firing signature. You will not see this coming or know where it was fired from.

Of course, it can also target soldiers on foot. Lethal radius is several metres, and it has high precision. Every time one is used there are likely to be casualties.

Secondly, there are no existing countermeasures. It is hard to detect - no IR signature, minimal radar signature, and fly low and near-silently. It cannot be engaged by any existing anti-aircraft systems. Sure, you could try and shoot it down with a machine gun, but even if you know one is coming and where from, you have about three seconds to hit a tiny,fast-moving target.

Jamming is one possible solution, but only if you know exactly how it is controlled. And modern battlefield comms are extremely hard to jam, and getting harder. Optical comms or other counter-countermeasures would make it unjammable.

Being on the export market — and made by a company previously sanctioned for selling to enemies of the US — means that American troops are likely to run to the CH-901 sooner rather than later. And being made by the Chinese, it may be cheap enough to be sold in large numbers (unlike, say, guided missiles). Meeting a few of these would be bad news; a lot of them could be a disaster.



nomi007 said:


> any video available of ws-43 demonstration


No demo video yet, just this one

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## Godman

Is this a cruise missile ,drone or rocket?


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## Tiqiu

Godman said:


> Is this a cruise missile ,drone or rocket?


The Chinese words call it cruise missile. It also mentioned it can be used as the other two.

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## FullColor15

cirr said:


> View attachment 282299



This is DF 41 Missile ?????


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## cirr

*Chinese People's Liberation Army Rocket Force Staged a Massive Missile Drill Against a THAAD Mockup Target*

The exercise came one day before the People’s Liberation Army celebrated its 90th anniversary with a major parade.

By Ankit Panda

August 03, 2017

China’s People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) held a combined massive ballistic and cruise missile exercise over the weekend, one day before a major parade to celebrate the People’s Liberation Army’s 90th anniversary.

The drill, which took place in Inner Mongolia, near the PLA’s Zhurihe military base, involved at least three types of missile systems and the launch of at least 20 missiles.

According to U.S. government sources with knowledge of the exercise who spoke to The Diplomat, the PLARF employed four DF-26C intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBM), ten DF-16A medium-range ballistic missiles, and six CJ-10 land attack cruise missiles in the live fire portion of the exercise.

At least three surface-to-air missile systems were involved in the exercise as well, including the HQ-6, HQ-16, and HQ-22. The HQ-22 was seen publicly for the first time at the PLA’s 90th anniversary parade.

The ballistic and cruise missiles simulated a long-range strike on a mock up of a U.S. Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) site and also struck ground-based models of U.S. F-22 Raptor stealth fighters, one source added.

The exercise is one of the largest recent PLARF exercises of its kind and one of the first publicly reported uses of the DF-26C IRBM in an exercise. Little public information exists on the DF-26C, which is a secretive PLARF IRBM capable of precision strikes with both conventional and nuclear payloads and is thought to have been first deployed in 2014 or earlier.

The DF-16 MRBM is also a secretive program, with the missiles having first been displayed publicly at China’s September 2015 parade to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the end of the Second World War.

Earlier this year, new images of the DF-16, including never-before-seen configurations, appeared on several Chinese websites. The MRBM serves a conventional payload precision-strike role with a range in excess of 1,000 kilometers and at least three known variants exist.

The CJ-10, meanwhile, is a standoff cruise missile, capable of striking targets at a range in excess of 1,500 kilometers, according to U.S. Department of Defense’s 2017 report on China’s military capabilities.

Combined, the exercise likely tested the PLARF’s ability to stage a coordinated precision-strike salvo attack against defensive installations like a THAAD battery across multiple missile crews.

A single THAAD battery, while effective against short-, medium-, and intermediate-range incoming targets, can be easily overwhelmed by a saturation strike.

The PLARF’s combined exercise came one day after North Korea’s second-ever test of an intercontinental-range ballistic missile, the Hwasong-14. The PLARF’s choice of a simulated THAAD installation for the exercise was likely intended to convey a message to the United States.

Beijing has long opposed the deployment of a THAAD system in South Korea, where it will be deployed in the southern part of the country, in Gyeongsanbuk-do.

China fears that the system’s associated AN/TPY-2 X-band radar will be able to diminish the effectiveness of its strategic nuclear deterrent by improving the United States’ ability to discriminate real intercontinental-range ballistic missile warheads from decoys and other penetration aids.

http://thediplomat.com/2017/08/chin...-missile-drill-against-a-thaad-mockup-target/

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## Beast

cirr said:


> *Chinese People's Liberation Army Rocket Force Staged a Massive Missile Drill Against a THAAD Mockup Target*
> 
> The exercise came one day before the People’s Liberation Army celebrated its 90th anniversary with a major parade.
> 
> By Ankit Panda
> 
> August 03, 2017
> 
> China’s People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) held a combined massive ballistic and cruise missile exercise over the weekend, one day before a major parade to celebrate the People’s Liberation Army’s 90th anniversary.
> 
> The drill, which took place in Inner Mongolia, near the PLA’s Zhurihe military base, involved at least three types of missile systems and the launch of at least 20 missiles.
> 
> According to U.S. government sources with knowledge of the exercise who spoke to The Diplomat, the PLARF employed four DF-26C intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBM), ten DF-16A medium-range ballistic missiles, and six CJ-10 land attack cruise missiles in the live fire portion of the exercise.
> 
> At least three surface-to-air missile systems were involved in the exercise as well, including the HQ-6, HQ-16, and HQ-22. The HQ-22 was seen publicly for the first time at the PLA’s 90th anniversary parade.
> 
> The ballistic and cruise missiles simulated a long-range strike on a mock up of a U.S. Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD) site and also struck ground-based models of U.S. F-22 Raptor stealth fighters, one source added.
> 
> The exercise is one of the largest recent PLARF exercises of its kind and one of the first publicly reported uses of the DF-26C IRBM in an exercise. Little public information exists on the DF-26C, which is a secretive PLARF IRBM capable of precision strikes with both conventional and nuclear payloads and is thought to have been first deployed in 2014 or earlier.
> 
> The DF-16 MRBM is also a secretive program, with the missiles having first been displayed publicly at China’s September 2015 parade to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the end of the Second World War.
> 
> Earlier this year, new images of the DF-16, including never-before-seen configurations, appeared on several Chinese websites. The MRBM serves a conventional payload precision-strike role with a range in excess of 1,000 kilometers and at least three known variants exist.
> 
> The CJ-10, meanwhile, is a standoff cruise missile, capable of striking targets at a range in excess of 1,500 kilometers, according to U.S. Department of Defense’s 2017 report on China’s military capabilities.
> 
> Combined, the exercise likely tested the PLARF’s ability to stage a coordinated precision-strike salvo attack against defensive installations like a THAAD battery across multiple missile crews.
> 
> A single THAAD battery, while effective against short-, medium-, and intermediate-range incoming targets, can be easily overwhelmed by a saturation strike.
> 
> The PLARF’s combined exercise came one day after North Korea’s second-ever test of an intercontinental-range ballistic missile, the Hwasong-14. The PLARF’s choice of a simulated THAAD installation for the exercise was likely intended to convey a message to the United States.
> 
> Beijing has long opposed the deployment of a THAAD system in South Korea, where it will be deployed in the southern part of the country, in Gyeongsanbuk-do.
> 
> China fears that the system’s associated AN/TPY-2 X-band radar will be able to diminish the effectiveness of its strategic nuclear deterrent by improving the United States’ ability to discriminate real intercontinental-range ballistic missile warheads from decoys and other penetration aids.
> 
> http://thediplomat.com/2017/08/chin...-missile-drill-against-a-thaad-mockup-target/


China opposed THAAD not becos, it diminished China nuclear capability but becos this THAAD are basically ballistic missile that can configure with nuke and strike China in very short response time as they are position very near Beijing.

They are wolf in sheep clothes.

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## 8888888888888

Deploying Thaad in S Korea is for China only as it is not effective against North Korean missiles being so close.

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## JSCh

*New missile a more mobile deterrent*
By Zhao Lei | China Daily | Updated: 2017-08-05 05:59

The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force has improved its strategic deterrence capability, thanks to the service of a new missile.

The DF-31AG, an enhanced version of the DF-31A intercontinental ballistic missile, is a new type of solid-fuel, road-mobile missile that can be launched from an eight-axle vehicle that also transports the missiles, according to an article published on Thursday by an online outlet run by PLA Daily, the military's flagship newspaper.

Compared with its predecessors, the DF-31 and DF-31A, the new missile features better mobility and survivability, the article said, without giving further details.

Before the arrival of the DF-31AG, the DF-31A was the PLA's newest intercontinental ballistic missile known to the public.

The DF-31AG was first viewed by the public at a field parade on Sunday morning at the PLA's Zhurihe Training Base in the Inner Mongolia autonomous region.

The parade was held to mark the 90th anniversary of the founding of the PLA, which was on Tuesday. The PLA used the occasion to display many new weapons, such as the J-20 stealth fighter jet and HQ-22 air defense missile.

The military said the new ballistic missile and the older DF-31A, which also appeared in Sunday's parade, represent China's status as a world power and the country's defense prowess. It called them "trump cards" in strategic deterrence.

Footage of the DF-31AG in the parade shows it is carried by an integrated missile vehicle known as a transporter-erector-launcher, and the bottom of the launch tube has been equipped with a buffer device. By comparison, the DF-31A is still mounted on an older, two-part vehicle and has no buffer attached to its launch tube.

The upgrades indicate that the DF-31AG is capable of making off-road launch in most kinds of terrain, with a very short preparation time, said Yang Chengjun, a military observer close to China's missile programs.

Du Wenlong, a senior researcher at the PLA Academy of Military Science, said that judging by the DF-31AG's extrinsic features and earlier information about it, the new model is likely to have a longer range, stronger penetration capability and larger destructive capacity than the DF-31A.

"It is possible that the missile has a global coverage and is able to deliver multiple maneuverable re-entry vehicles," he said. "Its service will extensively strengthen the Rocket Force's strategic strike capability."

According to Western weapons analysts, research and development for the DF-31, the first in the series, began in the mid-1980s. In August 1999, the first launch of the missile was conducted, and two months later, it was displayed to the public at the National Day parade.

The PLA Rocket Force now operates at least three types of intercontinental ballistic missiles for its nuclear deterrence system — the DF-31A, DF-31AG and DF-5B. The DF-5B, which made its debut at a parade in September 2015, is a liquid-propelled model capable of carrying multiple nuclear warheads, according to information from the Chinese military.

In addition to the DF-31AG, another ground-to-ground missile that emerged for the first time was the DF-16G medium-range ballistic missile. Compared with the DF-16, the upgraded variant has higher accuracy and an improved maneuverable terminal stage that can better infiltrate missile defense systems, said the PLA Daily article.

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## cirr

KD-20A？

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## Deino

cirr said:


> KD-20A？
> 
> View attachment 416262




IMO a reasonable successor to the KD-63 !


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## Zarvan

While images first appeared on Chinese webpages in 2013, China identified its DF-31AG ICBM in late July and featured 16 in its 30 July military parade marking the 90th anniversary of the People's Liberation Army. Source: CCTV
*Key Points*

Chinese media have suggested that China's DF-31AG ICBM could be armed with MIRV warheads
The DF-31AG uses a 16-wheel road-capable TEL, widening its deployment options and thus increasing its survivability
While official Chinese sources have said almost nothing about the capabilities of the recently identified DF-31AG intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM), Chinese state media have in recent days offered indications that it might be armed with multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicle (MIRV) warheads.




An aft image of the DF-31AG ICBM shows the use of a prominent pad at the base of the cold-launch missile tube, also used by the new DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile. (Via Meyet.com)

Although images of this missile first appeared on Chinese webpages in mid-2013, it was not until its mid-July appearance in model form at a new exhibit at Beijing’s Military Museum of the Chinese People’s Revolution that a new variant of the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation (CASC) DF-31A was identified as the ‘DF-31AG’.

Then, on 30 July, 16 DF-31AGs appeared in a major military parade marking the 90th Anniversary of the People’s Liberation Army (PLA). Its appearance in such a parade would indicate that the DF-31AG has entered service with the PLA Rocket Forces.

Previously this ICBM was identified as the ‘DF-31B’ by US government sources in a 2 October 2015 article in the _Washington Free Beacon_ , which also reported that the DF-31B had been tested on 25 September 2015.

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http://www.janes.com/article/72971/...-multiple-warheads-claims-china-s-state-media

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## Zarvan

An image appearing on the PLAAF-affiliated 'Blue Sky' website showing a Xian H-6K bomber being loaded with two KD-20 LACMs with nose covers: an indication it uses an optical seeker. Source: Blue Sky web page

*Key Points*

China may have developed a new optically guided version of the KD-20 land attack cruise missile
Such a weapon would allow aircraft like the H-6K bomber to conduct attacks from greater stand-off ranges
An image appearing on a People's Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF)-linked webpage suggests that China has developed a new optical precision-guided version of the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC) CJ-10K/KD-20 land attack cruise missile (LACM).

In mid-July the 'Blue Sky' web page, sponsored by the Society of the People's Liberation Army Air Force, featured an image of a Xian Aircraft Corporation H-6K bomber being loaded with two KD-20 and two YJ-63/KD-63 LACMs in which the KD-20s appear to have a protective cover partially covering their nose. This feature is used on some missiles to protect their optical or infrared (IR) seeker windows while in storage or being loaded.

The PLAAF's possible use of a new terminally guided version of the KD-20, perhaps designated the KD-20A, was first suggested by PLAAF analyst Hui Tong in his English- and Chinese-language blogs. He has also noted that as early as 2013, the PLAAF had upgraded the original 180-200 km-range KD-63 TV-based terminal guidance system with a model based on an imaging IR (IIR) seeker.

For guidance, the KD-20 – which is estimated to have a range of 1,500 km – has previously been reported to use an inertial navigation system (INS) aided by a terrain-contour-mapping radar altimeter, and possibly a global navigation satellite system (GNSS). An IIR-seeker-equipped KD-20 could enable the H-6K to conduct strikes from beyond the range of most ground-based air defences.

*Want to read more? For analysis on this article and access to all our insight content, please enquire about our subscription options:　**ihs.com/contact*




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http://www.janes.com/article/73028/...recision-guided-version-of-china-s-kd-20-lacm

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## SingaporeGuy

Wow chinese tomahawk cruise missile and its 5 times the range of brahmos

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## Deino

SingaporeGuy said:


> Wow chinese tomahawk cruise missile and its 5 times the range of brahmos




No need to compare with brahmos, it's a very different weapon. You also would not compare it to an AAM.

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## yusheng

【无码东风十】这应该是史上最清晰的东风10巡航导弹发射照。科老师例行解毒：弹头下面的圆形口盖，是等高线地形匹配制导系统的雷达天线口，据悉东风10的巡航段采用采用等高线匹配进行超低空飞行，雷达每隔几十秒测得地形高度数据，与蛋载计算机存储的数字地图相匹配，调整导弹巡航姿态。
东风10的弹头为陶瓷雷达天线罩，采用雷达图像区域相关末制导。也可采用光学图像末制导。
蛋体中后部下方的开口，为埋入式进气道，这种进气道可以减少蛋体尺寸，有利于隐身，但进气效率较低。
东风10采用中置平直蛋翼，平时收入蛋体内，藏于邮箱中间，发射后弹出，锁定。这照片是导弹刚刚发射，蛋翼尚未弹出。
后部为助推器，用于将导弹射出包装筒，加速到涡扇发动机启动。东风10的助推器与鹰击62反舰导弹的极为相似，可能是通用设计。

这个照片是老式的东风10，已经装备十几年了。目前最新型号是东风10A，可能使用了北斗卫星导航，以及红外热成像末制导。

http://weibo.wbdacdn.com/user/1403915120/#utm_source=ifvisible

This should be the clearest of the df-10 cruise missiles in history.Teachers in detoxification routine: a circular warhead under the flap, is a terrain contour matching guidance system of the radar antenna, the dongfeng 10 cruise flight by using contour matching in a low-level, radar measured terrain height data every few seconds, and egg storage of digital map matching, cruising missile attitude adjustment.The warhead of dongfeng 10 is ceramic radar antenna cover, and the terminal guidance of radar image area is adopted.Optical image terminal guidance can also be used.The opening in the lower part of the egg body is an embedded intake channel, which can reduce the size of the egg body and facilitate stealth, but the intake efficiency is low.The east wind 10 adopts the straight egg wing, which is hidden in the middle of the mailbox and is locked in the middle of the mailbox.This picture is a missile just launched, and the egg wing has not yet popped up.The rear is a booster that can be used to fire the missile out of the packaging cylinder to the turbofan engine.The dongfeng 10 booster is very similar to the falcon 62 anti-ship missile, possibly universal design.The picture is of the old east wind 10, which has been equipped for more than ten years.The latest model is dongfeng 10A, which may use the beidou satellite navigation and infrared thermal imaging terminal guidance.

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## Suff Shikan

*Images indicate possible precision-guided version of China's KD-20 LACM*
*Neil Gibson and Richard D Fisher Jr* - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
10 August 2017




An image appearing on the PLAAF-affiliated 'Blue Sky' website showing a Xian H-6K bomber being loaded with two KD-20 LACMs with nose covers: an indication it uses an optical seeker. Source: Blue Sky web page
*Key Points*

China may have developed a new optically guided version of the KD-20 land attack cruise missile
Such a weapon would allow aircraft like the H-6K bomber to conduct attacks from greater stand-off ranges
An image appearing on a People's Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF)-linked webpage suggests that China has developed a new optical precision-guided version of the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC) CJ-10K/KD-20 land attack cruise missile (LACM).

In mid-July the 'Blue Sky' web page, sponsored by the Society of the People's Liberation Army Air Force, featured an image of a Xian Aircraft Corporation H-6K bomber being loaded with two KD-20 and two YJ-63/KD-63 LACMs in which the KD-20s appear to have a protective cover partially covering their nose. This feature is used on some missiles to protect their optical or infrared (IR) seeker windows while in storage or being loaded.

The PLAAF's possible use of a new terminally guided version of the KD-20, perhaps designated the KD-20A, was first suggested by PLAAF analyst Hui Tong in his English- and Chinese-language blogs. He has also noted that as early as 2013, the PLAAF had upgraded the original 180-200 km-range KD-63 TV-based terminal guidance system with a model based on an imaging IR (IIR) seeker.

For guidance, the KD-20 – which is estimated to have a range of 1,500 km – has previously been reported to use an inertial navigation system (INS) aided by a terrain-contour-mapping radar altimeter, and possibly a global navigation satellite system (GNSS). An IIR-seeker-equipped KD-20 could enable the H-6K to conduct strikes from beyond the range of most ground-based air defences.

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## zestokryl

Chinese HJ 11 laser guided ATGM :http://imp-navigator.livejournal.com/649944.html

Author claims there are no known system technical parameters published

@cirr is that true ?

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## Brainsucker

Deino said:


> No need to compare with brahmos, it's a very different weapon. You also would not compare it to an AAM.



Wait Deino, if brasmos is not an LACM too, why India place it to Sikkim? I know that it is a AShM, but seems also an LACM because of what India suggested in China - India current crisis. Unless that news about Brasmos in the border was a hoax news, or India doesn't understand that AShM is not an LACM.

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## ozranger

Brainsucker said:


> Wait Deino, if brasmos is not an LACM too, why India place it to Sikkim? I know that it is a AShM, but seems also an LACM because of what India suggested in China - India current crisis. Unless that news about Brasmos in the border was a hoax news, or India doesn't understand that AShM is not an LACM.



There seems to be no credible information on any technical support build-up for land attacking to Brasmos yet. Also, Brasmos is a supersonic missile, right? Do you think it can fly low with terrain following? If it can, how much distance you think it can fly with its current size and corresponding fuel capacity until hitting the target? If it can't, for a high flying, supersonic missile which is still well below the so called hypersonic regime, how hard would it be intercepted by SAMs such as S-300 or HQ-9 ?

So, unless the Brasmos is used on anti-ship mission, there is little tactical significance using it for land attacking.

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## Zarvan

Read news from Defence Blog at Flipboard.com | Subscribe to the newsletter from Defence Blog
By Dylan Malyasov -
Aug 20, 2017
268
Chinese state media has released video footage demonstrating the production line of the short-range surface-to-air missile system.

Released in August, the footage shows the first high-quality images of a new production facility for the manufacturing of the HQ-17 all-weather low to medium altitude, short-range surface-to-air missile system in the country’s northern region of Inner Mongolia.

The *HQ-17* is a Chinese development of the Russia-made Tor-M1 system with multiple improvements. Unlike the Tor system, the HQ-17 incorporates an IFF array on top of an electronically scanned array radar, modernized electronics, a new all-terrain launcher, and the ability to datalink with other Chinese systems.

The HQ-17 missile system is designed to protect frontline units like tank battalions against helicopters, cruise missiles, precision guided munitions, unmanned aerial vehicles.















http://defence-blog.com/news/china-releases-footage-of-hq-17s-production-line.html

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## 帅的一匹

HJ12-ER

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## yantong1980

Zarvan said:


> The HQ-17 missile system is designed to protect frontline units like tank battalions against helicopters, cruise missiles, precision guided munitions, unmanned aerial vehicles.



Sorry if I was wrong, IMO HQ-17 task was provide air-defence to fixed unit like air base not moving unit like tanks, for task like protect tank in battle against chopper or armed drones, better use SPAAG's that moving with battle tank group.


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## Hindustani78

https://sputniknews.com/military/201708191056602562-china-new-icbm-deterrence/





China is developing a new sea-based intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM), the Julang-3 (JL-3), according to local media.

The development of the JL-3 missile was initially reported on several years ago. It’s expected that the new missile will be part of the advanced nuclear-powered submarine project 096.

Earlier this month, Chinese websites published pictures showing the project 032 submarine, the world’s largest conventionally powered submarine, undergoing tests. The submarine underwent re-fitting work at a shipyard in Dalian. In Dalian, the submarine received new silos capable of housing a larger missile.

Currently, the Navy of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLA) has four 094/094G project nuclear-powered missile submarines. They carry the JL-2 missile. This is the first fully operational maritime component of the Chinese nuclear triad.

Vasily Kashin, a military expert and senior research fellow at the Institute for Far Eastern Studies of the Russian Academy of Sciences, spoke to Sputnik about the possible role of the JL-3 missile for China’s strategic interests.

Kashin underscored that the development of the new ICBM is dictated by the fact that current Chinese potential for nuclear deterrence is insufficient.

"Despite the fact that the JL-2 has a relatively decent operational range (7,400-8,000 km, according to different sources), its capability to deter the United States is limited. China’s nuclear submarines operate in the South China Sea. At the same time, they are likely to face problems while leaving China’s territorial waters due to the activities of the US and Japanese naval forces," Kashin told Sputnik China.

According to Kashin, the JL-2 missile would be unable to reach the continental US in the event of a military conflict.

"They could be used against US allies and American bases in Asia, but their role in deterrence is minor. In order to boost its sea-based strategic nuclear forces, China needs a missile with a range of 11,000-13,000 kilometers, preferably with a multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle," Kashin pointed out.

At the time, the JL-2 underwent a long and challenging series of tests, with a number of failures and delays. One of the failures nearly resulted in the destruction of the testing submarine. The problem was resolved only in 2012.

At the same time, Kashin suggested that the development of the JL-3 missile will be much less troubled.

"The difference between the JL-3 and JL-2 are not as major as that between the JL-2 and the JL-1, China’s first submarine-based ballistic missile. China will use its experience in missile development to avoid repeating its previous mistakes and speed up the creation of a new missile," Kashin concluded.

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## lcloo

yantong1980 said:


> Sorry if I was wrong, IMO HQ-17 task was provide air-defence to fixed unit like air base not moving unit like tanks, for task like protect tank in battle against chopper or armed drones, better use SPAAG's that moving with battle tank group.



A moving army needs as much multi-layers air defence as much as a fixed military facilities. SPAAGs provide short range air defence and is really useless against high speed targets like incoming missiles or high flying aircraft. 

HQ-17 is a 12KM range missile system mounted on track vehicles.


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## Jlaw

Beast said:


> China opposed THAAD not becos, it diminished China nuclear capability but becos this THAAD are basically ballistic missile that can configure with nuke and strike China in very short response time as they are position very near Beijing.
> 
> They are wolf in sheep clothes.


Best counter is remove nfu and let SK know 10 megaton of thermal nuclear warhead is aimed at Seol.
Better than the typical BS coming from liberal hanjian


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## Figaro

Jlaw said:


> Best counter is remove nfu and let SK know 10 megaton of thermal nuclear warhead is aimed at Seol.
> Better than the typical BS coming from liberal hanjian


No need. In an event of war, the PLA can easily jam THAAD radars and conduct surgical strikes. I can guarantee that the THAAD will not be a problem if China and South Korea come to blows. The only problem is in peacetime; the THAAD radar is invasive to Chinese national security.

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## hassamun

*China’s PLA readying missiles to counter Indian air power*

*As tensions mount between India and China in a border dispute, Beijing is strengthening its mobile missile defenses to counteract India’s perceived air supremacy.*

Every summer the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) conducts a major air defense exercise at its western theater command’s air force experimental training base. The anti-aircraft brigade of the 79th group army was the main participant in this year’s drill, on August 22.

The exercise evaluated the unit’s radar system, command and control network, intercept capabilities, electronic and cyber warfare abilities, mobility and logistics. The batteries engaged a variety of aircraft, including the J-10, J-11, Mil Mi-171, Harbin Z-9 and an assortment of UAVs (Unmanned Aerial Vehicles).

Reporting, Chinese state media gave particular attention to the Hongqi-16 (HQ-16), one of the PLA’s most prized surface-to-air missiles.

Earlier this month, video and photographic evidence surfaced online that shows China moving trainloads of HQ-16 and HQ-17 missiles to Tibet as the standoff with India at Doklam continues.

The HQ-16 is a third-generation medium-range air defense missile system. Inspired by the Russian Buk, the HQ-16 has a 40 km maximum range of fire. Cold-launched vertically, it takes 13 minutes for a moving HQ-16 to load and fire missiles armed with 70kg warheads.

The transporting of HQ missiles to Tibet shows the PLA is reinforcing its layered air defense arrangement in anticipation of Indian air power

The HQ-16 can lock-on eight targets and engage four simultaneously. Its missile has a claimed maximum flight speed of Mach 2.8, with a single-hit probability rate of between 70% and 98%. In 2016, an upgraded version known as the HQ-16B was unveiled with a greater range of fire at 70 km.

A battery of HQ-16 consists of four launch vehicles, a target searching radar vehicle, a tracking and guidance radar vehicle, a command and control vehicle, missile transport and reloading vehicles and power supply trucks. The HQ-16 is generally used to defend stationary assets.

The HQ-17, however, is highly mobile. Sitting on an all-terrain tracked chassis, the HQ-17 usually accompanies fast-moving armored units. An improved version of the Russian Tor-M1, the HQ-17 has a 12 km range of fire.

Like the HQ-16, the HQ-17 uses vertical cold launchers against enemy jets, helicopters, smart bombs, cruise missiles and UAVs. But unlike the former, one HQ-17 vehicle combines all functions of an HQ-16 battery, empowering it with greater mobility. It takes ten seconds for a moving HQ-17 to engage an enemy. Carrying eight 9M331 missiles with a maximum flight speed of Mach 2.3, an HQ-17 can engage two targets simultaneously.

The HQ-17’s claimed hit probability against cruise missiles is between 56% and 99%; against fighter jets it’s between 45% and 93%; and against helicopters 82% and 98%.

The transporting of HQ missiles to Tibet shows the PLA is reinforcing its layered air defense arrangement in anticipation of Indian air power. The systems’ suitability for operating on the high plateau was confirmed at an exercise, in May, in Tibet’s Tanggula Mountains.

When reflecting on the 1962 war with China, Indian generals often blame their country’s defeat on its misuse of air power. Many believe the war’s outcome would have been quite different had India’s air force participated in an offensive role.

A recent Vayu Aerospace study concluded that the PLA air force would be at a disadvantage in a future war due to Tibet’s extreme climate, which would will limit the payload and combat radius of Chinese aircraft.

Last year, India deployed supersonic BrahMos missiles to Arunachal Pradesh near Tibet. In June, the Indian army announced its plans to send a squadron of HAL Dhruv helicopters to the Chinese border. More recently, the Indian defense ministry approved a deal to purchase six US-made AH-64 Apache attack helicopters for the army aviation corps and announced that it is looking to procure 234 naval helicopters, at a cost of US$5 billion. On August 24, the Indian air force added six C-130J Super Hercules strategic aircraft to its Arjan Singh base in Panagarh, 470 km from Doklam.

The Chinese high command understands India’s assumption of achieving air supremacy in the next war. However the PLA is quietly putting together a neat little surprise for India’s flyboys.

*http://www.atimes.com/article/chinas-pla-readying-missiles-stun-indian-air-power/*

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## ozranger

lcloo said:


> View attachment 420357
> 
> 
> A moving army needs as much multi-layers air defence as much as a fixed military facilities. SPAAGs provide short range air defence and is really useless against high speed targets like incoming missiles or high flying aircraft.
> 
> HQ-17 is a 12KM range missile system mounted on track vehicles.



The one in the photo is a TOR-M1 imported from Russia. A HQ-17 has at least a different radar

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## juj06750

lol english guess is false again 

it is chinese HQ17

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## juj06750

as above, easily confirmed

HQ17 adopts flat panel radar, which is used on newly developed HQ7B, while TOR M1 still uses 1980s-developed passive antenna based radar . the chinese radar is much sensitive and better than the obsolete russian radar . and HQ17 has shorter reaction time than TOR M1 . china imported about 60 TOR M1s in 2010s but it was for comparative developemts (NOT for mass deployment) china has largely deployed only domestic arms in fields . china DON'T want any russian in chinese arms industry

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## zestokryl

Few russian TOR modification since the 90s, ensued

Russia now has TOR with better radar, enhanced missile range and much quicker time lapse, between target detection and engaging. Example : http://www.arms-expo.ru.images.1c-b...8bbb067a2a60112334c54afe2.jpg?140499275552508

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## grey boy 2

Newest version of DF-16 nuclear capable medium range missiles spotted 近日，有网友在金华某大学门口拍摄到了驻地火箭军装备的疑似最新式“东风-16”中短程弹道导弹，用于打击中近程范围的重要目标。外媒分析称，东风-16导弹的主要打击目标或是美军在亚太前沿军事基地，有精确打击能力，也具备核常兼备能力。正因此，东风-16在网上得到了一个绰号：“冲绳专递”。[污]

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## samsara

*Is This China's DF-21D Air Launched Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile Toting Bomber? - The Drive*

By Tyler Rogoway, August 15, 2017

Pictures have surfaced from China's internet supposedly showing a new derivative of the People's Liberation Air Force's Xian H-6 bomber. This incarnation of the H-6, dubbed the *H-6N*, is designed to carry one weapon in particular—*the DF-21D anti-ship ballistic missile*.

China has also adapted the H-6 for a huge variety of roles, including reconnaissance, electronic warfare, aerial refueling, and a wide array of testbed duties, in addition to its role as a bomber and cruise missile carrier. Now the H-6N, the latest variant of the most modern H-6 version, the H-6K bomber, will supposedly take on one of the most exotic roles of all—hauling anti-ship ballistic missiles to *launching points far from Chinese shores*.

China's New Bomber H-6k Represents Great Leap in Long Range Precision Strike





China's DF-21D remains a somewhat shadowy weapon when it comes to its true abilities. Nevertheless it is now widely regarded as a game-changing anti-access/area-denial weapon system. The DF-21D is a conventionally armed, ground-launched medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM), with a range thought to be around 800 to 900 miles (about 1,290 - 1,450 kilometers). How it differs from standard MRBMs is that it can maneuver dynamically during reentry and has the ability to target large vessels during the terminal phase of its flight. 

In essence, it is a carrier killer that engages at hypersonic speeds and steep angles of descent, making most traditional defensive weaponry useless against it. Even advanced anti-ballistic missile capabilities would be hard pressed to intercept a DF-21D depending on its stage of flight. 
(...)
http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...hed-anti-ship-ballistic-missile-toting-bomber

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## Martian2

*China's YJ-12 Mach 3 terminal-phase "cork-screw" anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM)*

China's YJ-12 anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) has two interesting features to attack a naval ship.

Firstly, the YJ-12 ASCM travels at Mach 3. Since there is a curvature to the Earth, Popular Science says "the target ship has less than 10 seconds to respond with last-ditch defenses like Gatling cannons."

This new ramjet engine could triple the range of Chinese missiles | Popular Science





Secondly, in addition to the supersonic speed, the YJ-12 engages in "cork-screw-like turns which allow it to evade final defenses."

As I understand it, China's YJ-12 has minor random variations programmed into its final approach of "cork-screw-like turns" to make its flight trajectory extremely unpredictable.

China's YJ-12 ASCM is superior to the US Harpoon anti-ship cruise missile (which is only subsonic and flies in a straight line). China's YJ-12 reduces the adversary's reaction time to "less than 10 seconds" and flies in "cork-screw-like turns" to create unpredictability in its location.

YJ-12 | Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance

*"Protection against the YJ-12 is even more difficult due to its cork-screw-like turns which allow it to evade final defenses."*

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## samsara

The coverages of DF-16 MRBM according to Henri K. - East Pendulum







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/904637485728325632

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## ozranger

Martian2 said:


> *China's YJ-12 Mach 3 terminal-phase "cork-screw" anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM)*
> 
> China's YJ-12 anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) has two interesting features to attack a naval ship.
> 
> Firstly, the YJ-12 ASCM travels at Mach 3. Since there is a curvature to the Earth, Popular Science says "the target ship has less than 10 seconds to respond with last-ditch defenses like Gatling cannons."
> 
> This new ramjet engine could triple the range of Chinese missiles | Popular Science
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Secondly, in addition to the supersonic speed, the YJ-12 engages in "cork-screw-like turns which allow it to evade final defenses."
> 
> As I understand it, China's YJ-12 has minor random variations programmed into its final approach of "cork-screw-like turns" to make its flight trajectory extremely unpredictable.
> 
> China's YJ-12 ASCM is superior to the US Harpoon anti-ship cruise missile (which is only subsonic and flies in a straight line). China's YJ-12 reduces the adversary's reaction time to "less than 10 seconds" and flies in "cork-screw-like turns" to create unpredictability in its location.
> 
> YJ-12 | Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance
> 
> *"Protection against the YJ-12 is even more difficult due to its cork-screw-like turns which allow it to evade final defenses."*



CM-400AKG is completely a different missile, isn't it?

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## Martian2

ozranger said:


> CM-400AKG is completely a different missile, isn't it?



CM-400AKG | Deagel

*"The CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11."*

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## Deino

Martian2 said:


> CM-400AKG | Deagel
> 
> *"The CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11."*




OHM ... first that J-25 or whatever fake at DEAGEL and now this.
They surely mixed this smaller and lighter version with the YJ-91, which in fact is based on the Russian Ch-31, a very different weapon.
The CM-400AKG is that weapon we saw under a FC-1/JF-17.

So much on DEAGEL's credibility. 

Deino

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## ozranger

Martian2 said:


> CM-400AKG | Deagel
> 
> *"The CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11."*



CM-400AKG is a ballistic missile which employs a rocket engine, while YJ-12 is a cruise missile which employs a Ramjet engine.

CM-400AKG (No intake as the engine is a rocket) 





YJ-12 (4 intakes of a ramjet engine)


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## Martian2

ozranger said:


> CM-400AKG is a ballistic missile which employs a rocket engine, while YJ-12 is a cruise missile which employs a Ramjet engine.
> 
> CM-400AKG (No intake as the engine is a rocket)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> YJ-12 (4 intakes of a ramjet engine)


That's the definition of a variant.

Variant means "not identical."

A family of missiles may share the same sensors or basic frame.

It does not mean they must have the exact same propulsion engine.
----------

Let me give you an example.

A Chinese J-11 is commonly referred to as a VARIANT of an Su-30. However, they only share the same basic airframe. The turbofan engines, WS-10A on the Chinese J-11 and AL-31 on the Russian Su-30, are completely different.

Similarly, there is no reason to expect the same engines on the YJ-12 and the CM-400AKG.
----------

The CM-302 closely resembled the YJ-12 in design. I think the CM-400AKG is the next-generation upgrade of the CM-302.

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## Deino

Martian2 said:


> That's the definition of a variant.
> 
> Variant means "not identical."
> 
> A family of missiles may share the same sensors or basic frame.
> 
> It does not mean they must have the exact same propulsion engine.
> ----------
> 
> Let me give you an example.
> 
> A Chinese J-11 is commonly referred to as a VARIANT of a Su-30. However, they only share the basic airframe. The turbofan engines, WS-10A on the Chinese J-11 and AL-31 on the Russian Su-30, are completely different.
> 
> Similarly, there is no reason to expect the same engines on the YJ-12 and the CM-400AKG.



Come on. The Yj-12 and CM are so much different thy dont share the airframe nor the engine. The first is a true monster only able to be carried by the H-6G whereas the CM is a much smaller one able to be carried by the JF-17.
They share nothing. Not the size, not the mission profile, not the weight nor the propulsion system. They onky have the same colour maybe.

To say both are a variant of each other is as telling the J-16 a version of the JF-17.

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## Martian2

Deino said:


> Come on. The Yj-12 and CM are so mich


That's your opinion.

There are reasons to think the CM-400AKG is the latest air-launched version of the YJ-12. The range, supersonic speed, and warhead specifications are all pretty close.

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## Deino

Nev


Martian2 said:


> That's your opinion.
> 
> There are reasons to think the CM-400AKG is the latest air-launched version of the YJ-12. The range, supersonic speed, and warhead specifications are all pretty close.




Never ever. Just look at their dimensions, their mission profile... 
Since when is speed an item to tell it a variant?? All airliners have similar speed. An A.320 is roughly the same to a B-737 and no-one would call them variants.
Like I said. Only the colour is the same.

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## ozranger

Martian2 said:


> That's your opinion.
> 
> There are reasons to think the CM-400AKG is the latest air-launched version of the YJ-12. The range, supersonic speed, and warhead specifications are both pretty close.



They are completely different in regards to engine, speed, flight altitude and path. Their developers are also different.

BTW logically both J-11 and Su-30 are Su-27 variants, but J-11 is not a Su-30 variant as J-11 is not rooted from Su-30 and the term variant implies a hierarchy.


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## Martian2

YJ-12
range: 250km
speed: Mach 3.5
warhead: 205kg

CM400-AKG
range: 240km
speed: Mach 4 (because it is launched at a higher altitude)
warhead: 200kg

The two missiles look very similar in performance to me. I think Deagel and Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance are right. YJ-12 and CM400-AKG belong to the same family of missiles. Their performance characteristics are nearly identical.
----------

The analogy for a Boeing and Airbus airliner does not apply here.

The YJ-12 and CM400-AKG are both built by the same Chinese government.

Boeing is built by Americans. Airbus is built by Europeans.

If Boeing and Airbus airliners were both built by the same people then yes, they would belong to the same family of aircraft.
----------

A Chinese J-11 has completely different radar, fire control, weapon systems, and engines than a Russian Su-30. However, their performance characteristics are similar. Thus, a Chinese J-11 is commonly referred to as a VARIANT of a Russian Su-30 and classified as a branch of the tree.

Similarly, the performance characteristics of the YJ-12 and CM400-AKG are very similar. Since the YJ-12 came first, the CM400-AKG is commonly referred to as a VARIANT of the YJ-12. China has very few Mach 4 anti-ship cruise missiles. It is illogical to believe that China funded two separate expensive programs. Most likely, the CM400-AKG is a derivative of the YJ-12 project.

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## 星海军事

Martian2 said:


> The two missiles look very similar in performance to me.



That doesn't change anything.



Martian2 said:


> YJ-12 and CM400-AKG belong to the same family of missiles.



They apparently belong to different families of missiles.



Martian2 said:


> Their performance characteristics are nearly identical.



These characteristics are unreliable.

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## Martian2

星海军事 said:


> That doesn't change anything.
> 
> 
> 
> They apparently belong to different families of missiles.
> 
> 
> 
> These characteristics are unreliable.


You can believe whatever you want.

Send a letter to both Deagel and Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance and argue with them.

I don't care. I've simply explained the reasons that many people believe the CM400-AKG is a derivative of the YJ-12.

If you want to believe the Chinese government funded two completely separate Mach 4 missiles to achieve the same performance, that is your choice. I don't think the Chinese government was that stupid.
----------

The CM-302 was the first attempt to convert the YJ-12 into an air-launched cruise missile.

The CM400-AKG is a modernized version of the CM-302 after new design changes.

It is perfectly logical to believe the CM400-AKG is the next evolutionary design-upgrade of the CM-302. This would mean the CM400-AKG is still a derivative of the YJ-12.

The CM400-AKG did not pop out of thin air. It was probably based on experience gained from the CM-302. China improved the CM-302 by making design changes and designated the new missile as the CM400-AKG.

Does the CM400-AKG look different from the CM-302? Of course it does. China made as many improvements as possible. The most logical chain of events is that the Chinese engineers looked at the CM-302 and thought about ways to improve it. Thus, we have the CM400-AKG.

The CM400-AKG looks different, but it adheres closely to the original performance specifications for the YJ-12.

The nearly-identical performance specifications of the YJ-12 and CM400-AKG are not a coincidence.

YJ-12
range: 250km
speed: Mach 3.5
warhead: 205kg

CM400-AKG
range: 240km
speed: Mach 4 (because it is launched at a higher altitude)
warhead: 200kg

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## Deino

Martian2 said:


> You can believe whatever you want.
> ...
> I don't care. I've simply explained the reasons that many people believe the CM400-AKG is a derivative of the YJ-12.




Sorry, but that's a lame argument.

So is the Chinese built A.320 and the COMAC built C919 then a variant ? Some stupid peoples would indeed think they are and some stupid peoples also think the J-10 is a Lavi-clone, the WS-10 is based on the AL-31 and so on.


Also I think Your data for the YJ-12 is wrong:

*YJ-12:
Weight* 2,500 kg (5,500 lb)
*Length* 6.3 m (21 ft)
*Diameter* 0.756 m (2.48 ft)
*Warhead* 205–500 kg (452–1,102 lb)
*Engine* integrated ramjet
*Range *250–400 km (depending on altitude)
*Speed* Mach 2-4 (depending on altitude)
*Guidance system *INS/Beidou + terminal guidance

So that in comparison to Your data .. 

*CM400-AKG
Range* 240km
*Speed* Mach 4 (because it is launched at a higher altitude)
*Warhead* 200kg

… both are no longer that similar. IMO it is more likely that DAEGEL is simply wrong in the same way Wiki post this BS. Nothing more.

Deino

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## Martian2

Deino said:


> Sorry, but that's a lame argument.
> 
> So is the Chinese built A.320 and the COMAC built C919 then a variant ? Some stupid peoples would indeed think they are and some stupid peoples also think the J-10 is a Lavi-clone, the WS-10 is based on the AL-31 and so on.
> 
> 
> Also I think Your data for the YJ-12 is wrong:
> 
> *YJ-12:
> Weight* 2,500 kg (5,500 lb)
> *Length* 6.3 m (21 ft)
> *Diameter* 0.756 m (2.48 ft)
> *Warhead* 205–500 kg (452–1,102 lb)
> *Engine* integrated ramjet
> *Range *250–400 km (depending on altitude)
> *Speed* Mach 2-4 (depending on altitude)
> *Guidance system *INS/Beidou + terminal guidance
> 
> So that in comparison to Your data ..
> 
> *CM400-AKG
> Range* 240km
> *Speed* Mach 4 (because it is launched at a higher altitude)
> *Warhead* 200kg
> 
> … both are no longer that similar. IMO it is more likely that DAEGEL is simply wrong in the same way Wiki post this BS. Nothing more.
> 
> Deino


Deino, you think the mainstream media is constantly wrong. You can believe whatever you want.

The mainstream media has experts with decades of experience. They are occasionally wrong about a minor detail, but they are mostly right.

You cannot just say: Oh look, the CM400-AKG doesn't look exactly like a YJ-12. Therefore the mainstream media is wrong.

The story is more complicated than that.

The CM400-AKG is most likely the successor to the CM-302. The timeline fits. Many years passed and the Chinese engineers upgraded the CM-302.

In any case, I grow tired of arguing with you guys. The mainstream media thinks the CM400-AKG is a derivative of the YJ-12. I think there are many reasons that the mainstream media is right, which I mentioned in my earlier posts. If you guys want to think the Chinese government is a complete idiot and wastes resources on duplicative efforts then that's your choice.

This matter is actually pretty easy to settle. Let's wait 5 to 10 years. Eventually, the designer(s) of the CM400-AKG will tell his story and we'll know for certain whether the CM400-AKG is a derivative of the YJ-12 or not.

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## Martian2

The issue was raised that the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor and the YJ-12 uses air-intakes. Thus, the claim was that the two missiles are completely related.

When you read the DEAGEL article, it specifically mentions the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor. DEAGEL has already accounted for the CM400-AKG's solid rocket motor.

The distinction is not news.
----------

CM-400AKG | Deagel

"The *CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile* intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11. The supersonic CM-400AKG missile weighs 400 kg and has a maximum range of up to 100/250 kilometers and can fly at a top speed of Mach 4 carrying a 150/200 kg warhead. The missile is fitted with either a blast fragmentation or a penetration warhead to engage surface ships or fixed-position ground targets respectively. The missile can be fitted with an active radar seeker or an imaging infrared (IIR) seeker. *The propulsion system uses a solid fuel rocket motor.* The CM-400AKG anti-ship missile has been ordered by the Air Forces of Pakistan and China."

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## Figaro

Martian2 said:


> The issue was raised that the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor and the YJ-12 uses air-intakes. Thus, the claim was that the two missiles are completely related.
> 
> When you read the DEAGEL article, it specifically mentions the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor. DEAGEL has already accounted for the CM400-AKG's solid rocket motor.
> 
> The distinction is not news.
> ----------
> 
> CM-400AKG |
> 
> "The *CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile* intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11. The supersonic CM-400AKG missile weighs 400 kg and has a maximum range of up to 100/250 kilometers and can fly at a top speed of Mach 4 carrying a 150/200 kg warhead. The missile is fitted with either a blast fragmentation or a penetration warhead to engage surface ships or fixed-position ground targets respectively. The missile can be fitted with an active radar seeker or an imaging infrared (IIR) seeker. *The propulsion system uses a solid fuel rocket motor.* The CM-400AKG anti-ship missile has been ordered by the Air Forces of Pakistan and China."


http://www.deagel.com/Combat-Aircraft/J-25_a002931001.aspx:rofl:


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## Ultima Thule

Martian2 said:


> The issue was raised that the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor and the YJ-12 uses air-intakes. Thus, the claim was that the two missiles are completely related.
> 
> When you read the DEAGEL article, it specifically mentions the CM400-AKG uses a solid rocket motor. DEAGEL has already accounted for the CM400-AKG's solid rocket motor.
> 
> The distinction is not news.
> ----------
> 
> CM-400AKG | Deagel
> 
> "The *CM-400AKG is a smaller and lighter version of the YJ-12 anti-ship missile* intended for use by tactical fighter aircraft such as the FC-1, J-10 and Su-30MKK/J-11. The supersonic CM-400AKG missile weighs 400 kg and has a maximum range of up to 100/250 kilometers and can fly at a top speed of Mach 4 carrying a 150/200 kg warhead. The missile is fitted with either a blast fragmentation or a penetration warhead to engage surface ships or fixed-position ground targets respectively. The missile can be fitted with an active radar seeker or an imaging infrared (IIR) seeker. *The propulsion system uses a solid fuel rocket motor.* The CM-400AKG anti-ship missile has been ordered by the Air Forces of Pakistan and China."


But engine is not ramjet, solid fuel rocket and its not low flying cruise missile but high flying missile its a development of SY-400 rocket look at yourself
*SY-400 / CM-400AKG*


The 7th China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition was held on November 4th to 9th, 2008 in Zhuhai Airshow Centre, South China's Guangdong province. A new set of Chinese missile equipment, including the SY 400 rocket-powered guided missile weapon system, made its debut [Shen Ying, meaning Divine Eagle]. China is calling it as a guided artillery rocket system, hence claiming the 400 km range missile it is not limited by the 300 km range MTCR export restrictions. Capable of carrying an HE, fragment, submunition and EMP payload, other sources give this solid fueled SRBM an estimated range of 200km, well below the MTCR-mandated 300km restriction.

SY-400 system from the outset was designed as a tactic to-surface missiles, with a wing mainly used to increase the missile body lift, increasing the missile's gliding distance and improve range. The wing also plays a role in strengthening the the longitudinal strength, in order to avoid intense elastic oscillation.

SY-400 is not purely ballistic missiles since the end of the active segment, there is a very long flight distance, in this period of time, the missile had burn engine, the rudder has no gas for gas deflection, how the error correction produced during this time, only a control surface by air. The vane is only supporting the vertical launch system, gas in the vertical direction after the launch target deflection direction. So after the operation, will be discarded, after which control relis on the air rudder.

The main mix is based on a range, SY-400 for 180 km within the tactical support, as more tactical targets, so the use of smaller missiles, can attack several targets. The BP-12A is generally used for fire support battle, a maximum range of 300 kilometers, this is mainly because of the Missile Technology Control Regime restricting the export of missiles with a range of 300 kilometers.



Versatility has always been to improve national weapons development. For example, with 10 launch vehicles, as close to full support, these could have 80 SY-400, used for a remote support, can have 20 BP-12A, if the 10 private launch vehicles, that is, 5 vehicles SY-400, 5 BP-12A is the largest number of 40 SY400, 10 BP-12A, the task fell a lot of flexibility. SY-400 and BP-12A are using GPS / INS guidance, CEP of 30 meters, if the military code GPS system, or the military code of the Compass 2 system, and that accuracy can be further improved.

The CM-400AKG supersonic standoff missile was first on display at the 2012 Zhuhai Airshow as part of FC-1/JF-17's "complete" weapon package. Unlike most modern ASMs flying at the low altitude, the missile flies a rare high ballistic trajectory, powered by a solid rocket motor. It appears that CM-400AKG may have evolved from the earlier SY-400 SRBM. Therefore the effectiveness of such attack profile is still unknown.

The missile has a weight of 900kg, maximum range of 240 km, max speed Mach 5.5 (at diving stage?). It has INS during the mid-course and utilizes active radar/passive radar/IIR seeker with target-recognition capabilities at the terminal stage, which may improve its accuracy. The missile is claimed to be capable of terminal maneuver in some degree to avoid interception by SAM. CM-400AKG is speculated to have been designed to attack fixed or "slow moving", high value ground targets. It has yet to be confirmed that CM-400AGK is in service with PAF's JF-17.


http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/sy-400.htm:p:


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## Martian2

*CASIC builds all three anti-ship cruise missiles: YJ-12, CM-302, and CM400-AKG*

China Aerospace Science & Industry Corporation (CASIC) is China's main missile designer and manufacturer.

Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC) is involved in building military aircraft for China.

CASIC built the YJ-12, CM-302, and CM400-AKG anti-ship cruise missiles.

As I understand it, AVIC is responsible for the overseas marketing of CASIC missiles.

China spent years investing in the team that designed and built the YJ-12 anti-ship cruise missile. The YJ-12 has a variant called the CM-302.

Now, the CM400-AKG is China's latest air-launched supersonic cruise missile. There are only two scenarios.

Scenario #1: CASIC used the experienced team that designed the YJ-12 and CM-302 cruise missiles to design the new and improved CM400-AKG. This means the CM400-AKG is a variant of the YJ-12, because the same experienced design team made the modifications.

Scenario #2: CASIC picked a new team of greenhorns and somehow the inexperienced team managed to produce a superior CM400-AKG within only a few years and met the PLA requirements.

Obviously, Scenario #2 is far-fetched and Scenario #1 is the most likely. By using our common sense, the conclusion is that Deagel is right and the CM400-AKG is a variant of the YJ-12.
----------

CM-400AKG Missile at Zhuhai Airshow 2012 | Defense Updates

"At Zhuhai Aishow 2012, the CM-400AKG was displayed for the first time. *The CM-400AKG is a high speed, Air-to-Surface Missile developed by the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC).*"

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## ozranger

pakistanipower said:


> But engine is not ramjet, solid fuel rocket and its not low flying cruise missile but high flying missile its a development of SY-400 rocket look at yourself
> *SY-400 / CM-400AKG*
> 
> 
> The 7th China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition was held on November 4th to 9th, 2008 in Zhuhai Airshow Centre, South China's Guangdong province. A new set of Chinese missile equipment, including the SY 400 rocket-powered guided missile weapon system, made its debut [Shen Ying, meaning Divine Eagle]. China is calling it as a guided artillery rocket system, hence claiming the 400 km range missile it is not limited by the 300 km range MTCR export restrictions. Capable of carrying an HE, fragment, submunition and EMP payload, other sources give this solid fueled SRBM an estimated range of 200km, well below the MTCR-mandated 300km restriction.
> 
> SY-400 system from the outset was designed as a tactic to-surface missiles, with a wing mainly used to increase the missile body lift, increasing the missile's gliding distance and improve range. The wing also plays a role in strengthening the the longitudinal strength, in order to avoid intense elastic oscillation.
> 
> SY-400 is not purely ballistic missiles since the end of the active segment, there is a very long flight distance, in this period of time, the missile had burn engine, the rudder has no gas for gas deflection, how the error correction produced during this time, only a control surface by air. The vane is only supporting the vertical launch system, gas in the vertical direction after the launch target deflection direction. So after the operation, will be discarded, after which control relis on the air rudder.
> 
> The main mix is based on a range, SY-400 for 180 km within the tactical support, as more tactical targets, so the use of smaller missiles, can attack several targets. The BP-12A is generally used for fire support battle, a maximum range of 300 kilometers, this is mainly because of the Missile Technology Control Regime restricting the export of missiles with a range of 300 kilometers.
> 
> 
> 
> Versatility has always been to improve national weapons development. For example, with 10 launch vehicles, as close to full support, these could have 80 SY-400, used for a remote support, can have 20 BP-12A, if the 10 private launch vehicles, that is, 5 vehicles SY-400, 5 BP-12A is the largest number of 40 SY400, 10 BP-12A, the task fell a lot of flexibility. SY-400 and BP-12A are using GPS / INS guidance, CEP of 30 meters, if the military code GPS system, or the military code of the Compass 2 system, and that accuracy can be further improved.
> 
> The CM-400AKG supersonic standoff missile was first on display at the 2012 Zhuhai Airshow as part of FC-1/JF-17's "complete" weapon package. Unlike most modern ASMs flying at the low altitude, the missile flies a rare high ballistic trajectory, powered by a solid rocket motor. It appears that CM-400AKG may have evolved from the earlier SY-400 SRBM. Therefore the effectiveness of such attack profile is still unknown.
> 
> The missile has a weight of 900kg, maximum range of 240 km, max speed Mach 5.5 (at diving stage?). It has INS during the mid-course and utilizes active radar/passive radar/IIR seeker with target-recognition capabilities at the terminal stage, which may improve its accuracy. The missile is claimed to be capable of terminal maneuver in some degree to avoid interception by SAM. CM-400AKG is speculated to have been designed to attack fixed or "slow moving", high value ground targets. It has yet to be confirmed that CM-400AGK is in service with PAF's JF-17.
> 
> 
> http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/sy-400.htm:p:



Civilian use of guided rocket SY-400 for typhoon research by penetrating a typhoon central and distributing drop sensors with satellite data link. Obviously with proper sensors/seekers and even data link it can hit any moving ship with a considerable size as every ship is slow moving target comparing to the rocket's speed.






http://share.iclient.ifeng.com/news/shareNews?aid=101835164&mid=&vt=5&srctag=cpz_sh_imtj_p

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## Ultima Thule

May be its guideness and navigation technology from YJ-12 but its a totally different missile from YJ-12, YJ-12 supersonic sea skimming anti ship missiles with a ramjet, whereas CM-400AKG has a high flying trajectory to achieve its maximum range and not to forget that it is developed from SY-400 which is MRLS rocket and has a solid fuel roket engine instead of ramjet and has a terminal velocity of Mach 5 +


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## Deino

Martian2 said:


> *CASIC builds all three anti-ship cruise missiles: YJ-12, CM-302, and CM400-AKG*




Thanks for Your explanations and even if I'm still not convinced I have the feeling we are now discussing more on semantics than on technical issues.

If indeed both are from the same design team and use certain same items but otherwise have a different propulsion, a different airframe and so on isn't this question more on what's the definition of variant??

If a J-10B uses the same IRST-device, the same HUD and other avionics as the J-11B no-one would call them a variant. Or if the FC-1 and J-10 from the same manufactor.

My point is to call something a variant, it has to share and feature certain physical details like structure and so on: the PL-8-family are variants of each other, the J-7-family or even the J-10 and so on. An A.320, A.319, A.321 for example but here I would call them at best a related development and not a version or variant.

Just my two cents.
Deino

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## grey boy 2

YJ-18 unveiled for the 1st time?

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> YJ-18 unveiled for the 1st time?



Indeed ... and also indeed a 3M-54E Klub (Kalibr) variant.

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## grey boy 2

HQ-9B

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## grey boy 2

HQ-16 in actions 红旗-16B破壳而出！_













_

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## leapx

grey boy 2 said:


> HQ-9B


How did you know It is 9B?


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## grey boy 2

CCTV: anti-sat 我国反卫星技术?

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## Akasa

grey boy 2 said:


> CCTV: anti-sat 我国反卫星技术?



Poorly-made CGI.


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## grey boy 2



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## Figaro

grey boy 2 said:


>


Are those HQ-9B's? Or standard HQ-9A's? I'm not able to tell the difference unfortunately.

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## grey boy 2

Figaro said:


> Are those HQ-9B's? Or standard HQ-9A's? I'm not able to tell the difference unfortunately.


Neither could i tell the difference thats why i didn't leave a title for it

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## Ultima Thule

grey boy 2 said:


> Neither could i tell the difference thats why i didn't leave a title for it


what is the difference between HQ-9A and HQ-9B


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## samsara

The *HQ-9* (*红旗*; pinyin: _hóng qí,_ "_red flag_" or "_red banner_") is China’s new generation *medium- to long-range, active radar homing surface-to-air missile*.

Similar to the Russian S-300 and American Patriot systems, the HQ-9 uses a HT-233 PESA radar system. The naval HQ-9 appears to be identical to the land-based variant.

*HQ-9A* — Upgraded version, first tested in 1999 and service entry in 2001. Chinese sources claim that the HQ-9 family of systems employ much newer computing technology than imported Russian S-300PMU/PMU1/PMU2 systems, because HQ-9 is developed more than a decade later, thus allowing it to incorporate advancement in microelectronics. Due to the superior computing capability for signal processing, data processing and guidance support, this missile can have an optional semi-active radar homing (SARH) mode, because more info can be processed on board the missile itself.
*HQ-9B* — reportedly tested in February 2006. According to Jane's Information Group, this missile has a dual seeker that incorporates both SARH & infrared homing mode.
*HQ-9C* - Currently under development, incorporating active radar homing mode.
From Wiki on HQ-9 Series.

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## ozranger

samsara said:


> The *HQ-9* (*红旗*; pinyin: _hóng qí,_ "_red flag_" or "_red banner_") is China’s new generation *medium- to long-range, active radar homing surface-to-air missile*.
> 
> Similar to the Russian S-300 and American Patriot systems, the HQ-9 uses a HT-233 PESA radar system. The naval HQ-9 appears to be identical to the land-based variant.
> 
> *HQ-9A* — Upgraded version, first tested in 1999 and service entry in 2001. Chinese sources claim that the HQ-9 family of systems employ much newer computing technology than imported Russian S-300PMU/PMU1/PMU2 systems, because HQ-9 is developed more than a decade later, thus allowing it to incorporate advancement in microelectronics. Due to the superior computing capability for signal processing, data processing and guidance support, this missile can have an optional semi-active radar homing (SARH) mode, because more info can be processed on board the missile itself.
> *HQ-9B* — reportedly tested in February 2006. According to Jane's Information Group, this missile has a dual seeker that incorporates both SARH & infrared homing mode.
> *HQ-9C* - Currently under development, incorporating active radar homing mode.
> From Wiki on HQ-9 Series.



The fundamental difference between HQ9 and S300 or Patriot is its active radar seeker.

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## JSCh

MLRS rockets firing simultaneously.

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## Figaro

JSCh said:


> MLRS rockets firing simultaneously.
> 
> View attachment 427651
> 
> View attachment 427652
> 
> View attachment 427653
> 
> View attachment 427654​


PHL-03

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## JSCh

MLRS in live-fire training in Firepower-2017 Qingtongxia exercise - China Military

【火力-2017 青铜峡】远程火箭炮多弹...-来自CCTV军事报道-微博视频

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> MLRS in live-fire training in Firepower-2017 Qingtongxia exercise - China Military
> 
> 【火力-2017 青铜峡】远程火箭炮多弹...-来自CCTV军事报道-微博视频


The related CCTV footage can be seen here:

*火力-2017·青铜峡远程火箭炮多弹种多方式昼夜打击*

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## samsara

*Shooting simulation of a MRBM DF-21C on a main road.*

*DF-21C* is a medium-range road-mobile ballistic missile (while DF-21D is an anti-ship ballistic missile).



> _Description_
> The *DF-21C* is a modernized version of the DF-21 family medium-range road mobile ballistic missile. The development of the DF-21C began in 1984, intended to offer the ability to carry a much larger warhead. The DF-21 and DF-21A were nuclear strike weapons; the DF-21C is employed as a conventional weapon system, employing terminal guidance for increased accuracy. The DF-21 was unveiled for the first time to the public during a military parade the October 1, 2009. The latest variant to enter service is the DF-21D, an ASBM (Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile) variant employing a terminally guided MaRV (Maneuvering Re-entry Vehicle).
> 
> _Variants:_
> - DF-21A: has improved accuracy with an estimated circular error probable (CEP) of 100~300m, with both GPS and a radar-based terminal guidance system in a redesigned nose. This version is reported to have a similar range of 1,770 km.
> - DF-21B: is estimated to be the same physical size and shape of the DF-21A, but it is equipment with an enhanced terminal guidance system. The accuracy is believed to be 10 m CEP.
> - *DF-21C*: Its maximum range is believed to be about 1,700 kilometers (1,100 mi). The new GPS-based guidance system has reduced the missile’s CEP to 30~40m, enabling it for precision-strike missions
> - DF-21D: is an ant-ship ballistic missile. U.S. reports suggest a range a 1,450 to 1,550 km, but Chinese reports indicate a range of 2,700 km. Similar to the DF-21B, the warhead is likely maneuverable and may have an accuracy of 20 m CEP
> 
> Source: Army Recognition











_East Pendulum @HenriKenhmann 2017-09-27_

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## samsara

_PLARF missiles launch compilation.
At 0:36, extremely rare to see the salvo launch of DF-10 LRCMs (long-range cruise missiles).


 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/913308326003277824_

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## samsara

Knowing that even Mianyang barely starts wind-tunnel testing of an HTV-2-like glider,
we're pretty sure that DF-ZF is of the form ≠.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/914132719121997825

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## 星海军事

samsara said:


> Knowing that even Mianyang barely starts wind-tunnel testing of an HTV-2-like glider,
> we're pretty sure that DF-ZF is of the form ≠.
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/914132719121997825


I doubt that.


----------



## beijingwalker

*China's DF-41 ICBM: The World’s Longest-range Nuclear Missile




*

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## samsara

beijingwalker said:


> *China's DF-41 ICBM: The World’s Longest-range Nuclear Missile
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


The maker of this video has made some good packaging... just like those Japanese cookies with elegant & beautiful packings yet casual taste (and sell at premium prices)  anyhow still has points for the laymen.

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## grey boy 2

"The oriental express" #东风快递使命必达# 强军路上【3】--大国王牌！（1）

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## grey boy 2

Any idea what this is about? it was uploaded to Weibo today

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## TaimiKhan

grey boy 2 said:


> Any idea what this is about? it was uploaded to Weibo today


A rocket launch. Most probably upper atmosphere entry.

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## Figaro

grey boy 2 said:


> Any idea what this is about? it was uploaded to Weibo today


New ASAT test? Similar to the July one?

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## ChineseTiger1986

grey boy 2 said:


> Any idea what this is about? it was uploaded to Weibo today



JL-3

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## 星海军事

grey boy 2 said:


> Any idea what this is about? it was uploaded to Weibo today



Test of Russian RS-12M with new warhead on September 26.

https://sputniknews.com/russia/201709261057721528-russia-icbm-topol-test/

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## cirr

KZ-11 TEL

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## grey boy 2

Oriental express #东风快递使命必达# 强军路上！【4】--战略铁拳！（2）

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## JSCh

CCTV show P-band phased array early warning radar. Said to be capable of anti-stealth and missile defence.

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## clarkgap

JSCh said:


> View attachment 430159​CCTV show P-band phased array early warning radar. Said to be capable of anti-stealth and missile defence.

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## samsara

samsara said:


> The related CCTV footage can be seen here:
> 
> *火力-2017·青铜峡远程火箭炮多弹种多方式昼夜打击*


The new footage link:

*Multiple Launch Rocket System (MLRS) in live-fire training in Firepower-2017 Qingtongxia exercise
火力-2017·青铜峡远程火箭炮多弹种多方式昼夜打击*

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## JSCh

* Combined corps in live-fire test *
Source: China Military Online Published: 2017/10/9 17:51:10





Type-81 122mm wheeled rocket launcher systems attached to a combined brigade under the PLA 77th Group Army deploy rockets from the 6X6 wheeled military rocket launching trucks during a live-fire test at an undisclosed plateau area on October 3, 2017. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Guo Peng)


Combined corps in live-fire test - Global Times

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## grey boy 2

Cool gif: 10 DF missiles firing at the same time 10枚东风导弹齐射！
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.

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## Figaro

grey boy 2 said:


> Cool gif: 10 DF missiles firing at the same time 10枚东风导弹齐射！
> Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.


Dude, no need to put disclaimer man ... no one gonna sue you or anything

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## Deino

Figaro said:


> Dude, no need to put disclaimer man ... no one gonna sue you or anything




No need to worry. That's just a sidekick against me and my complain he was posting a photoshopped image.


----------



## yusheng

The United States magazine “diplomat： published an article < August 3rd reported that in July 29th China large-scale anti missile exercises, close to Zhurihe exercise field in the Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region. During this exercise, the PLA army fired 4 DF-26C long-range ballistic missiles, 10 DF-16A type medium range ballistic missiles, 6 CJ-10 (DF-10) type land attack cruise missiles.

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## Beast

yusheng said:


> View attachment 430632
> View attachment 430633
> View attachment 430634
> View attachment 430635
> View attachment 430636
> View attachment 430637
> View attachment 430638
> View attachment 430639
> View attachment 430640
> View attachment 430641
> 
> 
> The United States magazine “diplomat： published an article < August 3rd reported that in July 29th China large-scale anti missile exercises, close to Zhurihe exercise field in the Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region. During this exercise, the PLA army fired 4 DF-26C long-range ballistic missiles, 10 DF-16A type medium range ballistic missiles, 6 CJ-10 (DF-10) type land attack cruise missiles.


The american only tested their missile interception against one or two missile only. Such massive attack will handicapped or overwhelm the American missile shield.

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## samsara

yusheng said:


> View attachment 430632
> View attachment 430633
> View attachment 430634
> View attachment 430635
> View attachment 430636
> View attachment 430637
> View attachment 430638
> View attachment 430639
> View attachment 430640
> View attachment 430641
> 
> 
> The United States magazine “diplomat： published an article < August 3rd reported that in July 29th China large-scale anti missile exercises, close to Zhurihe exercise field in the Inner Mongolia Autonomous Region. During this exercise, the PLA army fired 4 DF-26C long-range ballistic missiles, 10 DF-16A type medium range ballistic missiles, 6 CJ-10 (DF-10) type land attack cruise missiles.

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## cnleio

Deino said:


> No need to worry. That's just a sidekick against me and my complain he was posting a photoshopped image.


That's real my friend, 10x DF missiles launched together on CCTV-1 news, just i saw it.



clarkgap said:


>


Very good for China anti-missile system, P-band phased array early warning radar it's the key to detect enemy's ballistic missile flying outside the space into atmosphere, it can prove the capable of anti-stealth and missile defence.

A phased array early warning radar built in U.S Alaska






Another one built in China






U.S, Russia, China they built such stuffs only prepare for anti-ICBMs in next WWIII.

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## grey boy 2



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## samsara

cnleio said:


> ...
> Another one built in China
> View attachment 430723
> 
> 
> 
> U.S, Russia, China they built such stuffs only prepare for anti-ICBMs in next WWIII.


I guess this is the NEW ICBM early warning radar located in *Shandong or Liaoning province*, read previously the similar shape ICBM early warning radar and other types (over the horizon type; rotational type) were allegedly located in Heilongjiang, Fujian, Zhejiang, in southern region, in SW region, in some unspecified coastal location, so this one is just the _X-th installation _in China... it's said that China has the 2nd largest installation of the ICBM early warning system in the world after the USA (two- to three-year-old info)

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## grey boy 2

HQ-16 and HQ-7 air defense combo could completely covered the mid, low and ultra low air defense mission(红旗16与红旗7的搭配，能够完整地担负起中低空与超低空的防空任务)
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.

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## grey boy 2

Some nice pictures
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.

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## grey boy 2

DF-26 long range anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) in camera
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.

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## grey boy 2

HQ-9 air defense system live firing at the "2017S金盾牌" competition 
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.



CNR国防时空
Uploaded on 10-18 18:04
Via 专业版微博
【空军蓝盾-2017S金盾牌比武 大量红旗9开火动图曝光】来自东部、北部和中部战区空军的6支导弹部队近日采取铁路运输、摩托化机动等方式千里挺进甘肃塞北某地，参加空军“蓝盾-2017S”金盾牌比武。（凤凰网）

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## samsara

*Missile: the Chinese early warning radar is finally revealed*

*By Henri Kenhmann - East Pendulum - 09 October 2017*

China has revealed what looks like its new dedicated warning radar defence missile, installed at the mountain top in the Shandong province, in a public exhibition in Beijing.

This huge electronic scanning radar measuring 30 meters in diameter was inaugurated on September 27, 2016, without a drum or trumpet, but in the presence of several senior officials of the Chinese Air Force (PLAAF) as well as the representatives of the builder NRIET and an anti-missile early warning unit.

We had talked about this inauguration in the case of "Anti-missile: the first operational early warning radar" last year and gave some technical details of this early-warning radar in "OTH, GBR... These very long-range Chinese radar".





China's anti-missile warning radar is put on display in picture in an exhibition in Beijing






The inscription on the image indicates that this radar being operated by the PLAAF is in fact operating in the P-band, a frequency range (from 225 to 390 MHz) also used by the PAVE PAWS radar of the American Army.

The image also confirms that the surface of the radar is cut into many submatrices, as specified in the research papers by NRIET Institute.

The 10,000 Transmit/Receive (T/R) modules are installed on 60 submatrices of 2 meters × 7.5 meters and form a circle 30 meters in diameter. This reduces the difficulty of designing, manufacturing and above all installing the radar. The latter requires, for example, that the flatness of the sub-matrices is ≤ 3.8 mm, in accordance with the decimetric wavelength of the radar.

More than 1,000 power sources are necessary for proper functioning of the system. NRIET reports indicate that the heat density of each transistor reaches "several tens of W/cm²", which requires the implementation of a large liquid cooling network.

No data on the scope of the radar has been released while it can usually reach as far as 4,000 km, if not more, for this kind of device.

But in simulation studies published by the Academy of Air and Missile Defence, an institution that trains specialized officers of the Chinese Air Force, the most effective range is 2,000 km that most often stands for what they call the 'GBR-P' (Ground-Based Radar, P-band), coupled with 800 to 3,500 km of over-the-horizon radar (OTHR) and 1,000 km of X-band fire (GBR-X).

The aim of the set is to detect, track, identify and then provide targeted firing solutions (missile heads in general) of a RES of 0.2 m² from the Guam area in the Pacific Ocean.

Given that China already has an OTHR oriented towards this direction, and that the GBR-P is now in operation, it is believed that the construction of the Chinese last anti-missile link towards the Pacific, GBR-X missile system would already be underway.





The satellite image of the Chinese early warning radar in Shandong





Diagram extracted from other university document showing the operation of ABM radars





The supposed coverage of Chinese radar

It should be noted that the shape of the "modules" of this Chinese early warning radar seems to be very similar to that of the *JY-26*, a three-dimensional surveillance radar operating in P-band and designed by Institute No. 38 of the CETC group.

The JY-26 round "cover" is not a T/R module, but serves to protect the dipoles located below and also to facilitate air cooling.

These dipoles forming a cross are capable of emitting right-handed, left-handed or directional polarized waves, which improves the detection of targets with low observability, according to the manufacturer.





Control Panel description of the Chinese early warning radar (Image: CCTV-13)






The JY-26 surveillance radar, also operating in P-band (Photo: 机贩子)





A close-up on the antennas of JY-26 (Photo: 中华 - 暖风)

At the Zhuhai Air Show, technical experts from CETC, the parent company of NRIET, also indicated that the Chinese version of JY-26 deployed in Shandong, with double the modules and four times more power (> 100 kW) compared to the export version, _*has already followed the movement of the American *_*F-22*_* flying over the Korean Peninsula*_.

To be continued.

Henri K.

http://www.eastpendulum.com/antimissile-le-radar-dalerte-avancee-chinois-se-revele-enfin

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## samsara

*What is known about the naval missile YJ-18...*


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/921673624909746176

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## samsara

*On 16 October 1964, China exploded its first atomic bomb.*


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/919995750284529669
*For this achievement, among many other contributors, the name of the late famous Chinese scientist Qian Xuesen or Hsue-Shen Tsien (Chinese: 钱学森; 11 December 1911 – 31 October 2009) is forever and ever remembered!*
*。*

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## JSCh

Soldier of Rocket force watching 19th CPC.

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## yusheng



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## cnleio

yusheng said:


> View attachment 434072
> View attachment 434073
> View attachment 434074
> View attachment 434075
> View attachment 434076


DF-21 C or D

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## Figaro

cnleio said:


> DF-21 C or D


It appears to be a C

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## yusheng



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## samsara

samsara said:


> *Missile: the Chinese early warning radar is finally revealed*
> 
> *By Henri Kenhmann - East Pendulum - 09 October 2017*
> 
> China has revealed what looks like its new dedicated warning radar defence missile, installed at the mountain top in the Shandong province, in a public exhibition in Beijing.
> 
> This huge electronic scanning radar measuring 30 meters in diameter was inaugurated on September 27, 2016, without a drum or trumpet, but in the presence of several senior officials of the Chinese Air Force (PLAAF) as well as the representatives of the builder NRIET and an anti-missile early warning unit.
> 
> We had talked about this inauguration in the case of "Anti-missile: the first operational early warning radar" last year and gave some technical details of this early-warning radar in "OTH, GBR... These very long-range Chinese radar".
> 
> View attachment 432503
> 
> China's anti-missile warning radar is put on display in picture in an exhibition in Beijing
> 
> View attachment 432504
> 
> 
> The inscription on the image indicates that this radar being operated by the PLAAF is in fact operating in the P-band, a frequency range (from 225 to 390 MHz) also used by the PAVE PAWS radar of the American Army.
> 
> The image also confirms that the surface of the radar is cut into many submatrices, as specified in the research papers by NRIET Institute.
> 
> The 10,000 Transmit/Receive (T/R) modules are installed on 60 submatrices of 2 meters × 7.5 meters and form a circle 30 meters in diameter. This reduces the difficulty of designing, manufacturing and above all installing the radar. The latter requires, for example, that the flatness of the sub-matrices is ≤ 3.8 mm, in accordance with the decimetric wavelength of the radar.
> 
> More than 1,000 power sources are necessary for proper functioning of the system. NRIET reports indicate that the heat density of each transistor reaches "several tens of W/cm²", which requires the implementation of a large liquid cooling network.
> 
> No data on the scope of the radar has been released while it can usually reach as far as 4,000 km, if not more, for this kind of device.
> 
> But in simulation studies published by the Academy of Air and Missile Defence, an institution that trains specialized officers of the Chinese Air Force, the most effective range is 2,000 km that most often stands for what they call the 'GBR-P' (Ground-Based Radar, P-band), coupled with 800 to 3,500 km of over-the-horizon radar (OTHR) and 1,000 km of X-band fire (GBR-X).
> 
> The aim of the set is to detect, track, identify and then provide targeted firing solutions (missile heads in general) of a RES of 0.2 m² from the Guam area in the Pacific Ocean.
> 
> Given that China already has an OTHR oriented towards this direction, and that the GBR-P is now in operation, it is believed that the construction of the Chinese last anti-missile link towards the Pacific, GBR-X missile system would already be underway.
> 
> View attachment 432533
> 
> The satellite image of the Chinese early warning radar in Shandong
> 
> View attachment 432534
> 
> Diagram extracted from other university document showing the operation of ABM radars
> 
> View attachment 432535
> 
> The supposed coverage of Chinese radar
> 
> It should be noted that the shape of the "modules" of this Chinese early warning radar seems to be very similar to that of the *JY-26*, a three-dimensional surveillance radar operating in P-band and designed by Institute No. 38 of the CETC group.
> 
> The JY-26 round "cover" is not a T/R module, but serves to protect the dipoles located below and also to facilitate air cooling.
> 
> These dipoles forming a cross are capable of emitting right-handed, left-handed or directional polarized waves, which improves the detection of targets with low observability, according to the manufacturer.
> 
> View attachment 432540
> 
> Control Panel description of the Chinese early warning radar (Image: CCTV-13)
> 
> 
> View attachment 432541
> 
> The JY-26 surveillance radar, also operating in P-band (Photo: 机贩子)
> 
> View attachment 432542
> 
> A close-up on the antennas of JY-26 (Photo: 中华 - 暖风)
> 
> At the Zhuhai Air Show, technical experts from CETC, the parent company of NRIET, also indicated that the Chinese version of JY-26 deployed in Shandong, with double the modules and four times more power (> 100 kW) compared to the export version, _*has already followed the movement of the American *_*F-22*_* flying over the Korean Peninsula*_.
> 
> To be continued.
> 
> Henri K.
> 
> http://www.eastpendulum.com/antimissile-le-radar-dalerte-avancee-chinois-se-revele-enfin


_Interestingly, just read about @Martian2 post about the USA's gigantic PAVE PAWS radar installed in Taiwan:_



> An example of an obliging US client is Taiwan.
> 
> Do you see the gigantic PAVE PAWS radar (see picture below) on a formerly beautiful Taiwanese mountain?
> 
> *The final cost was US$1.4 billion.* It went way over the original estimate. By the way, *it is a US-controlled radar. It is guarded by US soldiers. No Taiwanese work inside the PAVE PAWS radar and Taiwan does not have access to the radar data gathered.*
> 
> *See how the game is played? Taiwan provides the land for the PAVE PAWS radar. Taiwan pays a fortune for it. And it is a US military facility that is off-limits to Taiwanese military personnel.*
> 
> Taiwan plays its role as envisioned by the United States. In return, Taiwan is rewarded with participation in the US Global Entry program. Eligible Taiwanese don't have to wait in long lines for an immigration check to enter the United States. Eligible Taiwanese head into the express lane past US Customs.
> 
> Reference: Taiwan set to join U.S. Global Entry program | Focus Taiwan News Channel
> ...







_Taiwan's new PAVE PAWS early-warning radar system is built on top of a mountain_

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## yusheng

Britain, however, "Jane's defense weekly" website reported that in 2015, has been touted as Taiwan media "can be found on flight 3000 kilometers of golf" American "pave PAWS" radar is put into use in Taiwan for a year, has become "the eyes of the blind, the decoration". The reason is that the mainland in the opposite of fujian HuiAn deployed for "pave PAWS" interference of a large phased array radar, the distance is only 240 kilometers, almost equivalent to "cheek to cheek. The interference wave from the phased array radar launch of China's 21st century technology has made the "pavement claw" radar of the only 1970s technology level "no way to escape", and has lost the ability to spy on the continental air.







然而，英国《简氏防务周刊》网站2015年报道称，曾被台湾媒体吹嘘为“能够发现3000公里上飞行的高尔夫球”的美国“铺路爪”雷达在台湾投入使用一年，却成了“瞎子的眼睛——摆设”。原因在于大陆在与之隔海相望的福建惠安部署了针对“铺路爪”进行干扰的一部大型相控阵雷达，两者距离仅240公里，几乎相当于“脸贴脸”。中国21世纪技术水平的相控阵雷达发射的干扰波使仅有70年代技术水平的“铺路爪”雷达“无路可逃”，丧失了窥探大陆空情的能力。

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## samsara

New Chinese ballistic fire scheduled on 06 Nov at 08:02 UTC,
the fallout zone is identical to that one of the DF-41 ICBM shooting on 04 Dec 2015.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/927175749202624517

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## Title1234

SrNair said:


> And also copying.


Bramos is copy with the new name but VX1 is new design when look at their design component 
.


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## Figaro

Title1234 said:


> Bramos is copy with the new name but VX1 is new design when look at their design component
> .


Brahmos is basically an overhyped Russian missile with an Indian label ... nothing much to see here unfortunately

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## Ultima Thule

SrNair said:


> Where are you coming from?
> There is a hell lot of thread in this PDF where Brahmos was a JV based on Oniks.
> 
> On topic :They already gave them a name copy
> 
> Wait for 2 years you will get Mach 5+ Brahmos 2


Actually SIR P-800 was a internal/ Russian designation of Oniks
And Chinese aren't sitting idle they are way ahead of you ever heard WU-14 HGV and tested 2 or3 times successfully

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## Daniel808

pakistanipower said:


> Actually SIR P-800 was a internal/ Russian designation of Oniks
> And Chinese aren't sitting idle they are way ahead of you ever heard WU-14 HGV and tested 2 or3 times successfully




For China's WU-14 HGV already 4 times Successfully test

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-conducts-fourth-test-of-wu-14-strike-vehicle/

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## Han Patriot

Mitro said:


> Cx-1 Made by a country who makes lots of different missile system like Air to Air [BVR][WVR],SEAD,Cruise missile,Ballistic missile,Ground to Air missile and working on hypersonic cruise missile .
> They are independent in every thing except aircraft engine other then 100% indigenous
> So what makes a person to think that its very difficult to make CX-1 or impossible for china .
> When china show some thing in the weapon exhibition it means its all ready tested and marketed and there are some country already talk to buy it.
> Cx-1 is no doubt more formidable then Brahmos because russian tech base on soviet union glory is old with no new research .
> 
> Why China always Troll India with something new in every airshow
> Last time was Cm400AKG and this year HJ-12 [Spike] and CX-1 [Brahmos]


You have a good analysis, please Chinese and Pakistani members no more trolling plz.



cirr said:


> Brahmos is a piece of crap。CX-1 is a better piece of crap。


CX-1 is a piece of crap actually, it is a watered down version for export.

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## samsara

It seems Henry K was right with his earlier tweet done at one or two day(s) after the alleged trial 

New trial of the mobile DF-41 ICBM?
http://www.eastpendulum.com/nouvel-essai-icbm-mobile-df-41

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/927777782339391488
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*Did China test missile that could hit any target in US two days before Donald Trump’s visit?*

Evidence points to ICBM test on Monday as Beijing responds to Russia and America’s intensified nuclear tests

PUBLISHED : Thursday, 09 November, 2017, 11:32pm
UPDATED : Friday, 10 November, 2017, 10:45am
By Minnie Chan - South China Morning Post






_China’s missiles featured in a parade held to mark the 90th anniversary of the founding of the People’s Liberation Army earlier this year. Photo: AP_

China is likely to have tested an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) that could strike anywhere in the United States just two days before President Donald Trump’s Beijing visit.

Chinese military experts said the tests were intended to send a message to the US by highlighting China’s nuclear capability at a time when both the US and Russia are intensifying their own tests of ICBMs and hypersonic vehicles.

However, it was unclear whether the test had been deliberately timed to coincide with Trump’s visit (Nov. 8th).

On Sunday (Nov. 5th), Beijing announced an air closure zone over an area in Gobi Desert that has been used in the past to test China’s newest ICBM the DF-41.

The announcement said the 53-minute closure would end at around 9am on Monday, two days before Trump arrived in Beijing.

Chinese bomber runs near Guam aimed at sending a message to US, analysts say

*The DF-41 which has a range of 12,000km is one of the most cutting-edge weapons in the People’s Liberation Army.*





_The capabilities of the Dongfeng-41 missile_

The missile is equipped with two multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicles, each of which is capable of carrying several warheads. Its range allows the PLA to strike anywhere inside the US.

The Chinese foreign ministry *declined to confirm* whether it had conducted a test following a query from the _South China Morning Post_. The defence ministry did not reply to this newspaper’s questions on Thursday evening.

Song Zhongping, a Hong Kong-based military commentator with Phoenix TV, said it was possible the PLA’s Rocket Force had conducted ICBM tests in the air-closure zone in Gobi Desert, on Monday following its announcement of closure.

The location has previously been used for ground-based, high-altitude anti-missile tests and other ICBM tests.

Earlier reports from state media have said that the missile had been put in service by the PLA’s newly established Rocket Force before the start of this year.





_Russia test-fired its Satan 2 ICBM at the end of last month. Photo: Alamy_

Beijing-based military commentator Zhou Chengming said he would not rule out the possibility that Beijing wants flex its military muscles before Trump’s visit as China has made similar gestures ahead of visits by US top officials.

*The most notable example was the maiden flight made by the PLA’s J-20 fighter in January 2010 when then US defence secretary Robert Gates visited Beijing, Zhou said.*

*The key message was highlighting Beijing’s nuclear deterrent, he said.*

“_China, the US and Russia have started a secret competition over long-range strike technologies in recent years. There are voices saying there is a need for the three super powers to agree a higher level nuclear weapons convention as soon as possible,_” Zhou said.

“_As one of the three super powers in the world, China also needs to do something to boost its nuclear deterrence._”

But Song said the timing could just be a coincidence because the test should have been scheduled long before the date of the US president’s visit was confirmed.

“ICBM tests are very complicated. It needs many departments to work on and coordinate them. It should have been organised last year, but the US President’s Beijing trip was confirmed just two months ago,” Song, who previously served in the PLA’s Second Artillery Corps, the predecessor of Rocket Force, said.

At the end of last month, Russia tested four ICBMs, one of which was identified by its defence ministry as the *Satan 2, also known as the RS-28 Sarmat.*

Moscow has claimed the missile is capable of carrying 12 nuclear warheads.





_An American Minuteman 3 arcs through the sky in a test conducted earlier this year. Photo: Alamy_

Moscow’s latest exercise followed a successful test of US air force’s Minuteman 3 ICBM in California on August 2.

The tests come amid rising tensions over North Korea, which has conducted at least 13 rounds of missile tests this year.

Song said the latest ICBM tests indicated that Beijing was strengthening its nuclear capability in the wake of the US and Russian tests.

He added that China’s nuclear strategy was designed to avoid the risk of nuclear “blackmail” and was “not as aggressive as the US and Russia”.

Besides ICBMs and missile defence systems, China has also followed the US in developing hypersonic glide vehicles, a technology that can reach any target in the world within an hour using unmanned hypersonic bomber aircraft.

Last month, state-run China Central Television broadcast a special features discussing its JF-12 hypersonic wind tunnel and disclosing the different aircraft models it was testing.

http://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy-defence/article/2119201/did-china-test-missile-could-hit-any-target-us-two-days


_This article appeared in the South China Morning Post print edition as: Long-range missile test likely to have been held before visit_

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## samsara

WATCH: Video reveals *Dongfeng-41*, China's newest intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM), which can carry 10 nuclear warheads and has an operational range of over 12,000 kilometers.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/931765898087604224













And another footage of DF-41 (no Engsub):

东风41强势爆光，这才叫地动山摇，今后看谁还敢欺负我们_腾讯视频
_Public exposure of the mighty DF-41, with capabilities necessary in a tremendous battle, from now on it should serve as a stick large enough to prevent any bully over China - Tencent Video_




。。。

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## samsara

The latest footage from Shenzhen Satellite TV News on 22 Nov (sorry, no Engsub, just enjoy the pictures if can't grasp the spoken Chinese at all), focuses on the China's newest ICBM.

*The DF-41 ICBM is expected to be deployed at large scale!*

[Greater China Live Broadcast]《直播港澳台》 20171122 *Dongfeng-41 ICBM is expected to enter large scale operation *东风-41_有望大规模入役 - Shenzhen Satellite TV News




。。。

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## ChineseTiger1986

Daniel808 said:


> For China's WU-14 HGV already 4 times Successfully test
> 
> http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-conducts-fourth-test-of-wu-14-strike-vehicle/



Actually, the DF-ZF has been tested more than seven times so far. The western media has reported seven times, but the rest were never publically announced.

China is now pursuing the HGV with the speed of Mach 40 or more by building a new wind tunnel larger than the current JF12.

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## samsara

Pentagon officers confirm that it was indeed a trial of the Chinese *mobile ICBM DF-41* that took place on *November 6th*.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/933893871662067712

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## beijingwalker

*China: the New DF-41, expected to be-deployed-next year




*

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## Yukihime

beijingwalker said:


> *China: the New DF-41, expected to be-deployed-next year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *



please, pay attention about quality of theposts...
please avoid posting one sentence without source or proof, especially avoid using years-old picture attached with the one sentence post...


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## Beast

beijingwalker said:


> *China: the New DF-41, expected to be-deployed-next year
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


The most powerful road mobile ICBM

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## cirr

It looks though the 83th has got its own short range ballistic missile brigade. 

Ground force "Iskander" brigade.

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## samsara

*Some photos published by the Chinese army*

East Pendulum 8:15 AM - 14 Dec 2017


















。。。

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## JSCh



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## lcloo

The old HQ-2 are retirng, being replaced by the new mid-range SAM HQ-22 (Export designation FK-3) of 100KM range..

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## samsara

The Third Academy of CASIC, which is specialized in the design of *cruise missiles*, started this autumn the stealth measurements in real size of a "certain project".
"Like a bird" was said in the text. What (new) project is it?

East Pendulum @HenriKenhmann 8:25 AM - 16 Dec 2017





Thanks 星海军事 for the correction.
。。。


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## 星海军事

samsara said:


> CASIC "3th" (*), specialized in the design of cruise missiles, started this autumn the stealth measurements in real size of a "certain project".
> "Like a bird" was said in the text. What (new) project is it?
> 
> (*) CASIC "3th" --> CASIC 3rd / No. 3 / Unit 3 ?? confusing.
> 
> East Pendulum @HenriKenhmann 8:25 AM - 16 Dec 2017
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 。。。



Third Academy of CASIC.

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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> Third Academy of CASIC.



I've always wondered why the PLAAF/PLANAF have not pursued a stealthy ALCM like the Storm Shadow or SOM. It would be a perfect fit for the FC-31 or J-20's internal bays.


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## JSCh

​

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## cirr

"SM-3"


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## Akasa

cirr said:


> "SM-3"



You mean, this? (HQ-26 below)


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## BHarwana

The People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force has conducted two flight tests of a new ballistic missile attached to a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV), US officials confirmed in a recent intelligence assessment.

The two DF-17 ballistic missile tests occurred November 1 and November 15, respectively, a US official briefed on the intelligence assessment told the Diplomat on December 28. The November 1 test was the first ballistic missile test since the Communist Party of China's 19th Congress in October, the report notes.

The November 1 test comprised "the first HGV test in the world using a system intended to be fielded operationally," the US official told the news outlet. The US and Russia have been hard at work on honing hypersonic glide technology, but neither country is known to have conducted HGV tests for a system intended to become operational.

The HGV used in the November 1 test was designed specifically for the DF-17, a medium-range ballistic missile, according to the Diplomat. The missile landed "within meters" of its intended target and is expected to become fully operational in 2020, according to the US intelligence assessment.

The primary appeal of HGVs is that they are thought to be less vulnerable to missile defense systems. Given the high speeds at which the vehicles can transport payloads, missile interceptors do not have as much time to neutralize the projectile before the payload reaches its target, the Daily Beast reports.

"The combination of high speed, maneuverability, and relatively low altitudes makes [HGVs] challenging targets for missile defense systems," a National Air and Space Intelligence Center report released in June stated. HGVs fly faster than Mach 5 "and spend most of their flight at much lower altitudes than a typical ballistic missile," the June report says.

"Although hypersonic glide vehicles and missiles flying non-ballistic trajectories were first proposed as far back as World War II, technological advances are only now making these systems practicable," James Syring, director of the US Missile Defense Agency, told the House Armed Services Committee in June.





https://sputniknews.com/military/201712281060393103-china-tests-missiles-hypersonic-glide/

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## Mrc

Here goes US missile defence down the drain

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## beijingwalker

*China conducts 'WORLD FIRST' nuclear missile test that could hit target in SECONDS*
*CHINA has conducted a “world first” ballistic missile test that can come “within metres” of its target, US officials have confirmed.*
By DAN FALVEY
PUBLISHED: 03:08, Fri, Dec 29, 2017 | UPDATED: 03:45, Fri, Dec 29, 2017




In November, China’s People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force conducted two flight tests of a new ballistic missile that was attached to a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV).

A HGV is a form of aircraft that is capable of reaching speeds five times faster than the speed of sound, allowing it to deliver nuclear weapons to their target in a matter of seconds.

According to the US official the test was “the first HGV test in the world using a system intended to be fielded operationally”.

Both the US and Russia have been working hard on their own tests of HGVs, but neither are believed to have conducted tests for a system that could be operational.

James Syring, Director of the US Missile Defence Agency, said in June that attempts to harness HGVs span back over seventy years but are only now being tested with the intention of being used.

He said: “Although hypersonic glide vehicles and missiles flying non-ballistic trajectories were first proposed as far back as World War Two, technological advances are only now making these systems practicable.”

The new tests conducted by China are their first since the ruling Communist Party’s annual Congress in October.

The HGV tested on November 1 is said to have been specifically designed for a medium-range ballistic missile called DF-17 and landed “within metres” of its intended target.

A second test of the missile took place on November 15.

According to US officials the missile is expected to become fully operational by 2020.

A National Air and Space Intelligence Centre report released in June warned that HGVs could be more dangerous as they were harder to defend against due to the speed the missile travels at.

It said: “The combination of high speed, manoeuvrability, and relatively low altitudes makes HGVs challenging targets for missile defence systems.”

The planned introduction of the HGV into China’s nuclear arsenal comes after President Xi Jinping used the Communist Party’s 19th conference to unveil his plans to make a “world-class military”.

Centred around a new, condensed structure of 84 military units, the military reshuffle builds on Xi's years-long efforts to modernise the PLA with greater emphasis on new capabilities including cyberspace, electronic and information warfare.

As chair of the Central Military Commission, Xi is also commander-in-chief of China's armed forces.

President Xi told commanders of the new units at the PLA headquarters in Beijing the test “has profound and significant meaning in building a world-class military”.

All 84 new units are at the combined-corps level, which means commanders will hold the rank of major-general or rear-admiral, and unit members would likely be regrouped from existing forces.

The Chinese military is currently cutting its troops by 300,000, as part of a number of wide-ranging military reforms introduced by President Xi in late 2015.

Those reforms include establishing a joint operational command structure by 2020 and rejigging existing military regions, as well as streamlining troop numbers particularly in non-combat facing roles.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/worl...e-test-world-first-xi-jinping-donald-trump-us

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## Maxpane

wooooooow

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## beijingwalker




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## Deino

... and why again a new thread??


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## 星海军事

> Most of the missile’s flight time during the November 1 flight test was powered by the HGV during the glide phase, the source said.



The article about DF-17 seems to be self-contradictory.


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## 52051

China's new short-range missile size DF-17 has extended range thanks to its glide vehicle warhead.

The glide vehicle warhead has a power system that can actually allow the warhead travelling much longer than traditional hypersonic glide vehicle design.

Thanks to the glide vehicle warhead, DF-17 (which is basically DF-16 with hypersonic glide vehicle warhead) can achieve a range of 2500 km with only a short-ranged ballistic missile's size.

According to the US intelligence, China's DF-17 is the first product-grade weapon design in the world that using HGVs.

https://thediplomat.com/2017/12/int...issile-armed-with-a-hypersonic-glide-vehicle/



> China carried out the first flight-tests of a new kind of ballistic missile with a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) in November, The Diplomat has learned.
> 
> According to a U.S. government source who described recent intelligence assessments on the People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) on the condition of anonymity, China recently conducted two tests of a new missile known as the DF-17.
> 
> The first test took place on November 1 and the second test took place on November 15. The November 1 test was the first Chinese ballistic missile test to take place after the conclusion of the first plenum of the Communist Party of China’s 19th Party Congress in October.
> During the November 1 test flight, which took place from the Jiuquan Space Launcher Center in Inner Mongolia, the missile’s payload flew to a range of approximately 1,400 kilometers with the HGV flying at a depressed altitude of around 60 kilometers following the completion of the DF-17’s ballistic and reentry phases.
> 
> HGVs begin flight after separating from their ballistic missile boosters, which follow a standard ballistic trajectory to give the payload vehicle sufficient altitude.
> 
> Parts of the U.S. intelligence community assess that the DF-17 is a medium-range system, with a range capability between *1,800 and 2,500 kilometers*. The missile is expected to be capable of delivering both nuclear and conventional payloads and may be capable of being configured to deliver a maneuverable reentry vehicle instead of an HGV.
> 
> Most of the missile’s flight time during the November 1 flight test was powered by the HGV during the glide phase, the source said. *The missile successfully made impact at a site in Xinjiang Province, outside Qiemo, “within meters” of the intended target*, the source added. The duration of the HGV’s flight was nearly 11 minutes during that test.
> 
> The HGV payload that China tested in November was specifically designed for the DF-17, the source told _The Diplomat_, while noting that parts of the U.S. intelligence community assess that the *DF-17 is heavily based on the PLARF’s DF-16B short-range ballistic missile*, which is already deployed.
> 
> *“The missile is explicitly designed for operational HGV implementation and not as a test bed,” the source said, describing U.S. intelligence assessments of the DF-17. This was “the first HGV test in the world using a system intended to be fielded operationally,” the source added.*

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## 星海军事

星海军事 said:


> The article about DF-17 seems to be self-contradictory.




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/946454657836179456
Update. The author has corrected the error.

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## 52051

So basically China's HGV can double the range of a missile, with a hit accucy in meters, and the even better news is that according to the US intel, China is the first country to develop a production-grade HGV.

Just imagine if China put thest HGV on stuffs like DF-21/26 and double their range... I am almost feel sorry about any enemy ship within their 8000+ km range then.

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## clarkgap

beijingwalker said:


> *China conducts 'WORLD FIRST' nuclear missile test that could hit target in SECONDS*
> *CHINA has conducted a “world first” ballistic missile test that can come “within metres” of its target, US officials have confirmed.*
> By DAN FALVEY
> PUBLISHED: 03:08, Fri, Dec 29, 2017 | UPDATED: 03:45, Fri, Dec 29, 2017
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In November, China’s People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force conducted two flight tests of a new ballistic missile that was attached to a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV).
> 
> A HGV is a form of aircraft that is capable of reaching speeds five times faster than the speed of sound, allowing it to deliver nuclear weapons to their target in a matter of seconds.
> 
> According to the US official the test was “the first HGV test in the world using a system intended to be fielded operationally”.
> 
> Both the US and Russia have been working hard on their own tests of HGVs, but neither are believed to have conducted tests for a system that could be operational.
> 
> James Syring, Director of the US Missile Defence Agency, said in June that attempts to harness HGVs span back over seventy years but are only now being tested with the intention of being used.
> 
> He said: “Although hypersonic glide vehicles and missiles flying non-ballistic trajectories were first proposed as far back as World War Two, technological advances are only now making these systems practicable.”
> 
> The new tests conducted by China are their first since the ruling Communist Party’s annual Congress in October.
> 
> The HGV tested on November 1 is said to have been specifically designed for a medium-range ballistic missile called DF-17 and landed “within metres” of its intended target.
> 
> A second test of the missile took place on November 15.
> 
> According to US officials the missile is expected to become fully operational by 2020.
> 
> A National Air and Space Intelligence Centre report released in June warned that HGVs could be more dangerous as they were harder to defend against due to the speed the missile travels at.
> 
> It said: “The combination of high speed, manoeuvrability, and relatively low altitudes makes HGVs challenging targets for missile defence systems.”
> 
> The planned introduction of the HGV into China’s nuclear arsenal comes after President Xi Jinping used the Communist Party’s 19th conference to unveil his plans to make a “world-class military”.
> 
> Centred around a new, condensed structure of 84 military units, the military reshuffle builds on Xi's years-long efforts to modernise the PLA with greater emphasis on new capabilities including cyberspace, electronic and information warfare.
> 
> As chair of the Central Military Commission, Xi is also commander-in-chief of China's armed forces.
> 
> President Xi told commanders of the new units at the PLA headquarters in Beijing the test “has profound and significant meaning in building a world-class military”.
> 
> All 84 new units are at the combined-corps level, which means commanders will hold the rank of major-general or rear-admiral, and unit members would likely be regrouped from existing forces.
> 
> The Chinese military is currently cutting its troops by 300,000, as part of a number of wide-ranging military reforms introduced by President Xi in late 2015.
> 
> Those reforms include establishing a joint operational command structure by 2020 and rejigging existing military regions, as well as streamlining troop numbers particularly in non-combat facing roles.
> 
> https://www.express.co.uk/news/worl...e-test-world-first-xi-jinping-donald-trump-us



From yankeesama's source, it is not DF-17, it should be CJ-XX or YJ-XX.


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## 星海军事

clarkgap said:


> From yankeesama's source, it is not DF-17, it should be CJ-XX or YJ-XX.


Not true. Reason seen above.


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## first77

With one report claiming China could build 1,227 DF-21Ds for every carrier the U.S. military sends to sea, Beijing and other nations will have ample budgetary room to challenge our mighty carriers for decades to come.

http://www.theamericanconservative.com


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## Genesis

first77 said:


> With one report claiming China could build 1,227 DF-21Ds for every carrier the U.S. military sends to sea, Beijing and other nations will have ample budgetary room to challenge our mighty carriers for decades to come.
> 
> http://www.theamericanconservative.com



If China did that then, maybe it doesn't deserve its place in the sun. Then again, any nation stupid enough to do that would not have the capability to be where we are now. 

DF-21D is a propaganda piece, whether it works or not is irrelevant. As a great power, the job isn't to scare the super powers, it is to assert your mark on the rest of the world.

70 years since the start of the cold war, the super powers have gone to war for exactly 0 times. Do you know how many times they gone to war with non super powers? Not 0 times. So that should tell you all you need to know about what kind of a military China needs.

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## first77

Genesis said:


> If China did that then, maybe it doesn't deserve its place in the sun. Then again, any nation stupid enough to do that would not have the capability to be where we are now.


That huge explosion at China' sea port in 2015 had 700 tonnes of military explosives. China has missiles program


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## Brainsucker

first77 said:


> That huge explosion at China' sea port in 2015 had 700 tonnes of military explosives. China has missiles program



What do you mean with the huge explosion at China Sea Port in 2015?


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## Beast

Brainsucker said:


> What do you mean with the huge explosion at China Sea Port in 2015?


Tianjin port super explosion

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## Brainsucker

Beast said:


> Tianjin port super explosion



You mean that Tianjin Port was exploded or something?


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## Figaro

first77 said:


> That huge explosion at China' sea port in 2015 had 700 tonnes of military explosives. China has missiles program


That is not true. The 2015 Tianjin explosions had nothing to do with military explosives or China’s missile programs but rather improper storage of civilian chemicals.



first77 said:


> With one report claiming China could build 1,227 DF-21Ds for every carrier the U.S. military sends to sea, Beijing and other nations will have ample budgetary room to challenge our mighty carriers for decades to come.
> 
> http://www.theamericanconservative.com


This is an overhyped article trying to inflate the China threat perception. You would think the “American conservative” name would’ve given it away. We don’t know the effectiveness of the DF-21D ... and won’t truly know until it goes into combat against American carriers. If aircraft carriers were entirely useless, then why would China be developing carriers and catapults of its own? Simple fact is aircraft carriers will remain the centerpiece of the USN and the PLAN for a very long time



Brainsucker said:


> You mean that Tianjin Port was exploded or something?


August 2015 New Binhai area explosion ...

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## Brainsucker

Figaro said:


> That is not true. The 2015 Tianjin explosions had nothing to do with military explosives or China’s missile programs but rather improper storage of civilian chemicals.
> 
> This is an overhyped article trying to inflate the China threat perception. You would think the “American conservative” name would’ve given it away. We don’t know the effectiveness of the DF-21D ... and won’t truly know until it goes into combat against American carriers. If aircraft carriers were entirely useless, then why would China be developing carriers and catapults of its own? Simple fact is aircraft carriers will remain the centerpiece of the USN and the PLAN for a very long time
> 
> August 2015 New Binhai area explosion ...



@Beast, @Figaro, Thank for the info.

For the carrier, nobody can argue that it won't be obsolute, even to the next century. Because Carrier is just a simple mobile airfield on the sea. If the fixed airfield on the ground still considered useful (even when they have been flattened again and again in the history), then the same thing goes to Aircraft Carrier.

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## first77

Brainsucker said:


> You mean that Tianjin Port was exploded or something?


Yes

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## Deino

H-6G + YJ-12 launch

http://n.sinaimg.cn/mil/8_img/upload/641784af/w720h407/20180108/qSzD-fyqnici6170092.gif


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/950407100131405824

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## Brainsucker

@Deino, which is newer, H-6K or H-6G?


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## Deino

Brainsucker said:


> @Deino, which is newer, H-6K or H-6G?



The K-model.

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## Signalian

A Chinese military newspaper has published new photos showcasing its short- and medium-range missiles, the South China Morning Post reported Tuesday.

The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force recently tested DF-11 and DF-16 ballistic missiles, the Hong Kong newspaper said, citing the PLA Daily.








PLA DAILY
Chinese missile testing

When announcing the completion of the missile tests, the PLA Daily did not disclose where and when the tests took place, according to SCMP.





PLA DAILY

Chinese Missile Test

*The DF-16, first unveiled to the public in 2015, can travel about 625 miles and has been reported to be as accurate as a cruise missile*, Chinese military observers have said. The mobile-launched ballistic missiles could theoretically be launched from anywhere on China's mainland, one of China's missile shelters in the South China Sea, or even an aircraft carrier.

The DF-16, which can carry up to three nuclear warheads, puts the US Marine Corps Base on Okinawa within striking distance, as well as Japanese islands, Taiwan and the Philippines. Just last month, a minister with the Chinese Embassy to the US said the PLA would initiate Taiwan's reunification with mainland China through "military force" if the US follows through with plans to send an aircraft carrier to Taiwan to make a port call.

As China continues to develop its military technology, Chinese President Xi Jinping called on troops to fight with a tougher spirit and stand "always ready to fight."

"In the past, we had more spirit than steel. Now we have plenty of equipment, so we need an even tougher and stronger spirit to wield it," Xi told PLA soldiers last week.

https://sputniknews.com/military/201801091060627975-chinese-military-enhanced-missile-capability/

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## beijingwalker

*By 2020, China Could Have Hypersonic Missiles to Sink U.S. Aircraft Carriers*
The National Interest•January 13, 2018




By 2020, China Could Have Hypersonic Missiles to Sink U.S. Aircraft Carriers

In November, China tested what may become the world’s first operational hypersonic weapon. While Chinese progress in this area surprises no one, the first operational deployment of the weapon will add another weapon to China’s growing antiaccess toolkit, posing a dilemma for U.S. military planners in the Pacific.

The first test of the DF-17 ballistic missile took place on November 1, 2017, and the second test on November 15. A hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) detached from the missile during the reentry phase and flew approximately 1,400 kilometers to a target.


U.S. analysts don’t expect the vehicle to enter service until 2020, but by that point the PLARF may have significantly expanded the means through which it can deploy and deliver an HGV. Longer-range missiles would both expand China’s reach farther into the Pacific and make it more difficult for the United States to attack launch points, by enabling bases deep within the Chinese interior.

While hypersonic cruise missiles exist, the new Chinese HGV deploys from a ballistic missile, then glides to a target on a flight path much different (and much less predictable) than that of a traditional ballistic missile. The glide path is lower and slower than a normal ballistic-missile payload, although still generally higher and faster than a traditional cruise missile. The HGV may have maneuverable characteristics during its terminal phase, which would allow it to strike mobile targets such as aircraft carriers. In the initial launch phase, the HGV closely resembles a ballistic missile, which can complicate tense strategic situations in which the use of nuclear weapons may be in question.

Of course, the ability of modern missile-defense systems to defeat a volley of ballistic missiles launched in anger remains in deep question. In this sense, hypersonics are an answer to a problem that may not even exist. But when we consider the potential for hypersonic weapons to operate in concert with the rest of China’s A2/AD system, the true value becomes clear. Along with an array of high-accuracy ballistic missiles, cruise missiles deployed from air, sea, land and subsurface launchers, and submarines, China is developing a layered system intended to make it difficult for the United States to even conceive of undertaking high-intensity war.

It remains to be seen how widely China will deploy these weapons. We lack good data on the relative costs of producing and maintaining HGVs and their payloads. HGVs are just as dependent as traditional cruise missiles and ballistic missiles on good targeting data, meaning that they are not miracle weapons. The United States has nonkinetic (primarily electronic) ways of interfering with targeting and communication, complicating the task that HGVs are intended to fulfill.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/2020-china-could-hypersonic-missiles-123700139.html

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## Figaro

beijingwalker said:


> *By 2020, China Could Have Hypersonic Missiles to Sink U.S. Aircraft Carriers*
> The National Interest•January 13, 2018
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By 2020, China Could Have Hypersonic Missiles to Sink U.S. Aircraft Carriers
> 
> In November, China tested what may become the world’s first operational hypersonic weapon. While Chinese progress in this area surprises no one, the first operational deployment of the weapon will add another weapon to China’s growing antiaccess toolkit, posing a dilemma for U.S. military planners in the Pacific.
> 
> The first test of the DF-17 ballistic missile took place on November 1, 2017, and the second test on November 15. A hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) detached from the missile during the reentry phase and flew approximately 1,400 kilometers to a target.
> 
> 
> U.S. analysts don’t expect the vehicle to enter service until 2020, but by that point the PLARF may have significantly expanded the means through which it can deploy and deliver an HGV. Longer-range missiles would both expand China’s reach farther into the Pacific and make it more difficult for the United States to attack launch points, by enabling bases deep within the Chinese interior.
> 
> While hypersonic cruise missiles exist, the new Chinese HGV deploys from a ballistic missile, then glides to a target on a flight path much different (and much less predictable) than that of a traditional ballistic missile. The glide path is lower and slower than a normal ballistic-missile payload, although still generally higher and faster than a traditional cruise missile. The HGV may have maneuverable characteristics during its terminal phase, which would allow it to strike mobile targets such as aircraft carriers. In the initial launch phase, the HGV closely resembles a ballistic missile, which can complicate tense strategic situations in which the use of nuclear weapons may be in question.
> 
> Of course, the ability of modern missile-defense systems to defeat a volley of ballistic missiles launched in anger remains in deep question. In this sense, hypersonics are an answer to a problem that may not even exist. But when we consider the potential for hypersonic weapons to operate in concert with the rest of China’s A2/AD system, the true value becomes clear. Along with an array of high-accuracy ballistic missiles, cruise missiles deployed from air, sea, land and subsurface launchers, and submarines, China is developing a layered system intended to make it difficult for the United States to even conceive of undertaking high-intensity war.
> 
> It remains to be seen how widely China will deploy these weapons. We lack good data on the relative costs of producing and maintaining HGVs and their payloads. HGVs are just as dependent as traditional cruise missiles and ballistic missiles on good targeting data, meaning that they are not miracle weapons. The United States has nonkinetic (primarily electronic) ways of interfering with targeting and communication, complicating the task that HGVs are intended to fulfill.
> 
> https://www.yahoo.com/news/2020-china-could-hypersonic-missiles-123700139.html


The National Interest is very unreliable ... and dedicate a thread to this type of article?


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## ChineseTiger1986

Figaro said:


> The National Interest is very unreliable ... and dedicate a thread to this type of article?



These notorious China bashers love to sensationalize everything.

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## 52051

They can do it now, so no news material.

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## SingaporeGuy

well most important thing is to close the tech & qualitative not quantitative gap with USA with each passing day, and to continue on assymetric weapons while building a command and control system that is as good, if not better than USA.

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## Jlaw

Figaro said:


> The National Interest is very unreliable ... and dedicate a thread to this type of article?


Forgive him. He's a dumb Chinese. He will post anything that has China or India in any news article

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## Deino

beijingwalker said:


> ....




*Me again, but since you do not reply on PMs is there a certain reason why you nearly always start a new thread for post that nicely fit in already existing topics??? 

Is it over-eagerness, stubbornness or - since you don't reply - a method to annoy??

You are a long-time and well-respected member and you that we have a thread for missises, we have a thread (esp. already created by yourself) for the PLA police, we have a thread for the Type 002 carrier and nevertheless you started several new ones! WHY?  

Take this as a warning.*

Deino


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## yusheng

for RF

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## cirr

TEL

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## clarkgap

http://digitalpaper.stdaily.com/http_www.kjrb.com/kjrb/html/2018-01/15/content_386101.htm?div=-1

Just keep a file of valuable report.


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## JSCh

​

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## Beast

cirr said:


> TEL



I think China has a huge dislike for military TEL. Maybe civilian TEL is easily serviceable.

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## yusheng

2018 Jun19, cold lunching 吉林07 08视频星

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## Dungeness

*The Chinese Are on the Verge of Dominating a New Domain: Near Space*

The National Interest , January 20, 2018
Task and Purpose, Robert Work

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...-verge-dominating-new-domain-near-space-24124

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## BHarwana

*D-11 Ballistic missile Armed with Dong Neng-series anti-satellite weapon*


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## clarkgap

BHarwana said:


> *D-11 Ballistic missile Armed with Dong Neng-series anti-satellite weapon*



It is Long March 6.

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## BHarwana

clarkgap said:


> It is Long March 6.



http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...terious-chinese-anti-ballistic-missile-launch


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## clarkgap

BHarwana said:


> http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...terious-chinese-anti-ballistic-missile-launch





BHarwana said:


> http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...terious-chinese-anti-ballistic-missile-launch



It is a Long March 6. You can easily find image about it by google.

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## BHarwana

clarkgap said:


> It is a Long March 6. You can easily find image about it by google.


Yes I googled it after you told me. I think those idiots are reporting it wrong.

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## clarkgap

Anti-tank missile. It does not throw the launcher backward after launched the missile. So it is not HJ-8. Someone thins it maybe the HJ-11.

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## cirr



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## Deino

Slowly they learn to accept the facts ...

https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2018/...eed-future-military-technology-dominance.html

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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Slowly they learn to accept the facts ...
> 
> https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2018/...eed-future-military-technology-dominance.html
> 
> View attachment 454601


Mostly incorrect and out of date.

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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> Mostly incorrect and out of date.




Can you point to which statements it is wrong?


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Can you point to which statements it is wrong?


Sorry, I can't.

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## Beast

星海军事 said:


> Sorry, I can't.


That is as good as not saying. Are you trying to kid us?

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## Deino

Beast said:


> That is as good as not saying. Are you trying to kid us?



I don't know ... in nature science an unexpected result of a given experiment is also a result and here too he kindly tells us, that these specifications are wrong but he cannot - due to reasons he won't make public - tell.

At least IMO.

Best,
Deino


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## Beast

Deino said:


> I don't know ... in nature science an unexpected result of a given experiment is also a result and here too he kindly tells us, that these specifications are wrong but he cannot - due to reasons he won't make public - tell.
> 
> At least IMO.
> 
> Best,
> Deino


You believe his crap?

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## Deino

Pardon to say so ... yes, at least much, much more than yours like J-10B will NEVER go operational, Liaoning is secretly operating an AEW-type, the Y-20A uses WS-18 ... just to name a few.

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## Figaro

Deino said:


> Can you point to which statements it is wrong?


The PL-15 has a range of over 200 km and the ramjet PL-XX should have an even higher range. Yet the picture shows a 150 km limit for both a2a missiles ... also, the PL-12 is quoted as having 70 kilometer range when upgraded variants can reach 100 km. Besides, most of the stuff NextBigFuture posts is unreliable anyway ...



Deino said:


> Pardon to say so ... yes, at least much, much more than yours like J-10B will NEVER go operational, Liaoning is secretly operating an AEW-type, the Y-20A uses WS-18 ... just to name a few.


Why would Beast claim that the J-10B will never go operational??

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## Deino

Figaro said:


> The PL-15 has a range of over 200 km and the ramjet PL-XX should have an even higher range. Yet the picture shows a 150 km limit for both a2a missiles ... also, the PL-12 is quoted as having 70 kilometer range when upgraded variants can reach 100 km. Besides, most of the stuff NextBigFuture posts is unreliable anyway ...



Agreed, but that graphic and report quoted is via IISS ...



> Why would Beast claim that the J-10B will never go operational??



That's something I never understood - so you must ask him - but he once claimed that there would be close to dozens of finished J-10Bs standing at CAC waiting for their WS-10-engines only since the PLAAF refused them to enter service....  only one of his funny claims, but that would be off-topic, so we should leave it.

Deino


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## 星海军事

That's just a friendly reminder. To the author: Instead of waiting for leaked information, more research needs to be done. To readers: Don't be confused by nice pictures.

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## Beast

Figaro said:


> Why would Beast claim that the J-10B will never go operational??


The J-10b has stopped production and produced very short number. It was at a time believed it will never enter service as Its replaced by J-10C. It shared the same engine as J-20 and J-10c is more advanced and better.

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## Deino



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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> View attachment 454928
> View attachment 454929



JF-17 launched CM-400 Air-to-Ground Missile?

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## Mitro

Any video of the impact of this awesome missile any one


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## BHarwana

clarkgap said:


> JF-17 launched CM-400 Air-to-Ground Missile?



Mssn65 is saying it was launched from JF-17 and is for PAF.

here is a pic.

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## Beast

The attitude does not look very high. This missile needs to be launched at max height to achieved maximize impact.

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## Deino

Beast said:


> The attitude does not look very high. This missile needs to be launched at max height to achieved maximize impact.



Agreed, but since we don't know what was the purpose of this test it is difficult to assume anything meaningful from two small images.

It could be a simply drop-test at medium altitude, it could be as so often only an old image, it could actually be not even a launch, maybe just a drop...


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## Deino

PS ... as a gif !


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/966295598545608704


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## clarkgap

https://thediplomat.com/2018/02/revealed-the-details-of-chinas-latest-hit-to-kill-interceptor-test/

"The Chinese ballistic missile defense test that took place on February 5 involved a Dong Neng-3 (DN-3/KO09) hit-to-kill midcourse interceptor successfully striking a target DF-21 (CSS-5) medium-range ballistic missile, The Diplomat has learned from a U.S. government official with knowledge of China’s weapons programs."

https://weibo.com/guokrjs?refer_flag=0000015010_&from=feed&loc=nickname
@星海军事


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## BHarwana

clarkgap said:


> https://thediplomat.com/2018/02/revealed-the-details-of-chinas-latest-hit-to-kill-interceptor-test/
> 
> "The Chinese ballistic missile defense test that took place on February 5 involved a Dong Neng-3 (DN-3/KO09) hit-to-kill midcourse interceptor successfully striking a target DF-21 (CSS-5) medium-range ballistic missile, The Diplomat has learned from a U.S. government official with knowledge of China’s weapons programs."
> 
> https://weibo.com/guokrjs?refer_flag=0000015010_&from=feed&loc=nickname
> @星海军事



The altitude of a Satellite is some what 2000 km. What type of RADAR is China using that has such wast range to track?


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## 星海军事

clarkgap said:


> https://thediplomat.com/2018/02/revealed-the-details-of-chinas-latest-hit-to-kill-interceptor-test/
> 
> "The Chinese ballistic missile defense test that took place on February 5 involved a Dong Neng-3 (DN-3/KO09) hit-to-kill midcourse interceptor successfully striking a target DF-21 (CSS-5) medium-range ballistic missile, The Diplomat has learned from a U.S. government official with knowledge of China’s weapons programs."
> 
> https://weibo.com/guokrjs?refer_flag=0000015010_&from=feed&loc=nickname
> @星海军事




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/966353014989774848

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## BHarwana



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## AmirPatriot

Do any Chinese members have information on the acquisition and tracking of ships for the DF-21D ASBM? 

Does it use ground based radars? If so, what type? 

Does it use GPS?

Does it use drones/maritime patrol aircraft, if so, what type?

Does it use spy satellites? If so, how many and what are their details (weight, orbit).

Sorry for all the questions. Promise I'm not a spy


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## BHarwana

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/968754292663422977


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## Beast

AmirPatriot said:


> Do any Chinese members have information on the acquisition and tracking of ships for the DF-21D ASBM?
> 
> Does it use ground based radars? If so, what type?
> 
> Does it use GPS?
> 
> Does it use drones/maritime patrol aircraft, if so, what type?
> 
> Does it use spy satellites? If so, how many and what are their details (weight, orbit).
> 
> Sorry for all the questions. Promise I'm not a spy


Hi, use GPS? Lol.. please goggle what is beidou II

https://www.popsci.com/gaofen-4-wor...ontinues-chinas-great-leap-forward-into-space

The number of satellite put into space is only second time to USA. Not even Russia has as much workable satellite as China. From the latest 5G broadband satellite to the most secure quantum satellite. They are all made in China

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## AmirPatriot

Beast said:


> Hi, use GPS? Lol.. please goggle what is beidou II
> 
> https://www.popsci.com/gaofen-4-wor...ontinues-chinas-great-leap-forward-into-space
> 
> The number of satellite put into space is only second time to USA. Not even Russia has as much workable satellite as China. From the latest 5G broadband satellite to the most secure quantum satellite. They are all made in China


I know what Beidou is, but is it used for the DF-21D? Or does thatv just use INS?


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## clarkgap

AmirPatriot said:


> I know what Beidou is, but is it used for the DF-21D? Or does thatv just use INS?



GPS, INS, (probably star patterns matching in emergency) and active radar terminal homing system. Main challenge is how to find and track target, and damage assessment.

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## 52051

AmirPatriot said:


> I know what Beidou is, but is it used for the DF-21D? Or does thatv just use INS?



I doubt it depend on Beidou/GPS, most likely an active homing radar seeker (DF-21 has a payload of over 2000kg, so there is sufficient room to fit a powerful radar), as for the early targeting, it is actually the most critical/advanced part of the system, it may depend an network, including OTH radar/ocean observation satellite/long range UAVs/undersea sonar array to provide a robust long range targeting and detecting network.

With DF-21's speed and large warhead (to accommodate powerful active homing seeker), I doubt DF-21AShBM need mid-course position updating, they may only need a early targeting input through the large network and fire-and-forget.

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## AmirPatriot

Thanks for the help @clarkgap and @52051. 



52051 said:


> DF-21 has a payload of over 2000kg



Wow, I thought the warhead was like 600 kg.

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## clarkgap

AmirPatriot said:


> Thanks for the help @clarkgap and @52051.
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, I thought the warhead was like 600 kg.



DF-21: 600kg
DF-21A: 1000kg
DF-21C: 2000kg
DF-21D: ???


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## beijingwalker

*‘Falling behind’: US admiral warns of China dominance in hypersonic missile race*

Weapons under development by China and Russia – as well as by the United States – can fly at many times the speed of sound and are designed to beat regular anti-missile defence systems.
PUBLISHED : Friday, 16 February, 2018, 12:25pm
Even as the Pentagon hustles to ensure that its defences keep pace with North Korea’s fast-growing rocket programme, US officials increasingly are turning attention to a new generation of missile threat.

These weapons under development by China and Russia – as well as by the United States – can fly at many times the speed of sound and are designed to beat regular anti-missile defence systems.

The hypersonic missiles could change the face of future warfare, as they can switch direction in flight and do not follow a predictable arc like conventional missiles, making them much harder to track and intercept.

“China’s hypersonic weapons development outpaces ours … we’re falling behind,” Admiral Harry Harris, who heads the military’s Pacific Command, warned lawmakers on Wednesday.

“We need to continue to pursue that and in a most aggressive way to ensure that we have the capabilities to both defend against China’s hypersonic weapons and to develop our own offensive hypersonic weapons.”
In its proposed US$9.9 billion requested budget for 2019, the Missile Defence Agency (MDA) is asking for US$120 million to develop hypersonic missile defences, a big increase from the US$75 million in fiscal 2018.

MDA Director of Operations Gary Pennett told Pentagon reporters this week that the potential deployment by America’s rivals of hypersonic weapons – which could be launched from planes, ships or submarines and carry either nuclear or conventional payloads – would create a “significant” gap in US sensor and missile interceptor capabilities.

“The key challenge to US national security and the security of US friends and allies is the emergence of new threats designed to defeat the existing” ballistic missile defence system, Pennett said.

So, why the sudden alarm?
According to reports in the Japan-based _Diplomat_ magazine, China has developed – and last year tested – a new type of hypersonic missile called the DF-17. The US Office of the Director of National Intelligence this week stated China “has tested a hypersonic glide vehicle”.

Russia too is believed to be developing its own hypersonic weapon called the Zircon. According to Russian news agency Tass, it is to go into serial production this year.

Though the Pentagon is warning about hypersonics, the United States has been developing the technology for years.

The Air Force says its X-51A Waverider cruise missile, tested in 2012, could travel at speeds faster than Mach 6 (3,600 miles per hour, 5,800 kilometres per hour).

That is more than one mile a second, and future iterations are expected to go much faster.

Part of the reason China has been able to advance its hypersonic missile programmes is that it is not subject to anti-missile treaties signed between the United States and Russia.

The 1987 Intermediate Nuclear Forces Treaty banned short- and intermediate-range ground-launched missiles.

“Over 90 per cent of China’s ground-based missiles would be excluded by INF if they were now in it,” Harris said.

Still, by far the lion’s share of the MDA’s budget continues to go towards improving existing missile-defence systems.

Various sensors and radars can track an incoming missile hurtling towards a target, then blast interceptor rockets toward it to pulverise it with kinetic energy.
http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-...d-us-admiral-warns-china-dominance-hypersonic

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## Beast

US already failing behind China in electric propulsion system

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## terranMarine

We got some advanced sh!t here

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## beijingwalker

*Hypersonic missiles: China’s lead prompts Pentagon call for new defence systems*
CHINA’S development of “hypersonic” missiles has the United States deeply worried, with calls for urgent funding to catch up in the high-stakes arms race.




Jamie Seidel
News Corp Australia NetworkFEBRUARY 19, 201812:48PM

IT’s another example of the game of military leapfrog played ever since the first caveman hefted a rock.

Others immediately start looking for a better weapon.

It’s happening again.

The United States is concerned it has lost the technological edge when it comes to a new arena of warfare: hypervelocity missiles.

These are themselves a response to the increased capability of modern defensive systems.

Cruise and ballistic missiles can now be targeted. Ship, ground and air launched interceptors can destroy them before they reach their target. And even if they get close, radar-guided robotic gattling guns have a last-ditch chance of knocking them from the sky.

What makes a hypervelocity missiles so potent is they are fast.

Very fast.

So fast neither interceptor missile or bullet has enough time to act.

Late last year China declared it was on the brink of putting operational examples of this new weapon system into service.

The United States isn’t.

And that has The Pentagon worried.

*EXPLORE MORE: Beijing ‘perfects’ new hypervelocity missile*

”China’s hypersonic weapons development outpaces ours ... we’re falling behind,” Admiral Harry Harris — soon to be the next US ambassador to Australia — said late last week.

“We need to continue to pursue that and in a most aggressive way in order to ensure that we have the capabilities to both defend against China’s hypersonic weapons and to develop our own offensive hypersonic weapons.”

*A CALL TO ARMS*

A US Missile Defence Agency report reveals it has placed an urgent call to its suppliers for improved sensors capable of detecting — and tracking — hypervelocity missiles in flight.

It’s called for a new $9.9 billion budget for 2019.

It recognises the urgent need to improve its defences against this emerging threat.

Enormous nuclear-powered aircraft carriers suddenly seem vulnerable.

*RELATED: ‘How the US will lose the next war’*

Large but static strategic bases — such as Guam in the middle of the Pacific Ocean — have little chance of countering such an attack.

Which is why Missile Defense Agency Director of Operations Gary Pennett told reporters during a recent budget briefing that it has identified “sensor and interceptor capability gaps”.

“The key challenge to US national security and the security of US friends and allies is the emergence of new threats designed to defeat the existing ballistic missile defence system,” he said.

In particular, he was worried about the speed of command and control networks needed to isolate the threat, and to inform units capable of doing something about it.

Where once they had minutes, they now have just seconds.

“Any software associated with any of those systems might have some capability to track hypersonic systems. This evolving threat demands a globally present and persistent space sensor network to track it from birth to death,” Pennett said.

*DELVE DEEPER: Beijing has already won the South China Sea*

The budget appeal comes just months after Chinese state media reports it had successfully tested hypersonic warheads and was now moving on to full-scale production.

This may have a lot to do with the US Missile Defence Agency’s new plans to install 64 Ground Based Interceptor facilities around the United States before 2023.

But North Korea is also another motivator.

*ACHILLES HEEL*

Chinese state media has boasted of the success of its new type of hypersonic missile, designated the DF-17. The US Director of National Intelligence has confirmed these tests actually happened.

Beijing may have achieved this lead as it is not subject to the same international arms control treaties as Russia and the United States.

*EXPLORE MORE: Can China already beat the US?*

But Russian state media has been making similar claims. It says its first example of the new technology will enter production later this year.

This looming new threat may explain the a US emphasis on improved detection and response systems: these target the one weak point hypervelocity missiles retain.

They need to be boosted into space.

Like intercontinental ballistic missiles, a large rocket must lift the warhead off the ground and propel it high into orbit. The higher and faster it is going when it reaches the top of its parabolic arc, the faster it can dive back into the atmosphere below.

From that point, things get difficult.

The smaller warhead glides at more than 6000km/h. But it can also twist and turn to avoid detection and incoming fire.

So, like ICBMs, shooting it down during its heavy-and-slow launch phase is the easiest option.

And for its deadly fast glide phase, the earlier it is detected — the greater the chance of calculating a shoot-down solution.

Both need reliable information, fast.

Thus the emphasis on researching new long range / high accuracy sensors and command-and-control processes.

But also in the works is a redesigned ‘kill vehicle’ interceptor warhead, improving the chances of taking down a high-energy opponent.

http://www.news.com.au/technology/i...s/news-story/697fe1a50704fd6fa993f15419882177

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## ozranger

beijingwalker said:


> Chinese state media has boasted of the success of its new type of hypersonic missile, designated the DF-17



I haven't seen any evidence which shows that China has officially claimed a new missile model called DF-17. DF-17 is completely a made-up designation created by the U.S. government and media.


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## cirr

主持制定了我国首型中远程超声速反舰导弹总体方案，提出的大空域、高机动飞行控制与冲压发动机推力调节的一体化控制方案，解决了超声速飞行条件下变轨机动与稳定飞行的强耦合难题。在国际上首次使该类导弹射程从百余公里提高近4 倍，导弹法向机动过载达到巡航导弹中最高水平，能够在航母编队防御圈外发射、有效突破“宙斯盾”系统。导弹总体性能国际领先，成为海军、空军反制航母的杀手锏武器装备。（500km range YJ-12)

2002 年至2015 年，作为型号总师，主持新型通用中远程导弹技术攻关和型号研制。按照“打牢基础、分步实施”的原则，先用4 年时间，通过XX-XX 飞行演示验证，首次实现弹道导弹“数字化”、一车一弹全方位无依托任意点热发射，具备“竖起来就打”的能力。再用4 年时间，通过XX-XT 飞行演示验证，解决了核常兼备、陆基机动远程攻击、空气舵弹头再入强机动飞行、末制导米级精度打击等难题。上述两个型号的研制，直接支撑了XX-XX 的国家立项。2010 年，任XX-XXA 总师，带领团队研制成功我国首型中远程固体机动核导弹，实现了我国弹道导弹精确打击能力和实战化水平的重大跨越，成为突破第二岛链的杀手锏，在9.3 阅兵中被誉为“我军战略威慑力体系中的新型武器”。(DF-26A etc)

2015 年至今，任某国防重大工程飞行器系统总师，主持特种飞行器技术研究，多次完成*“螺旋式”高超声速机动飞行*试验，取得“垂直发射/直接入轨”临近空间多级固体助推技术等具有国际领先水平的技术成果，系统认知了临近空间“新环境”，引起国际社会极大关注，形成与美、俄比肩发展的态势。(Next generation strategic weapons/hypersonic vehicles)

她参加工作30年来一直工作在地地战术弹道导弹科研第一线，她先后担任我国三代、7个地地战术弹道导弹武器系统技术负责人/总设计师，现任战术弹道导弹系列总设计师兼我国第四代中近程常规导弹武器系统（xxxx7）总设计师.(4th generation Mach 7 surface-surface/air-surface/anti-ship/carrier missile)
……
2009年她提出并主持研制我国第一型面向实战的最大飞行速度达到10倍声速的助推滑翔式机动飞行导弹武器系统，于2014年成功进行了全程飞行试验，专家评价，“该项目技术复杂，…,取得了重大原创性理论与技术成果，拥有多项自主知识产权，在国际上率先成功实现了高超声速助推滑翔导弹全程飞行试验…主要技术指标达到国际领先水平”(DF-17/Wu-14)
……
3.提出了助推滑翔战术导弹多学科耦合设计等理论方法，取得了重大原创性技术成果。主持研制了我国第一型实战化的高超声速助推滑翔战术导弹武器系统，在国内外率先成功进行了实弹飞行试验，主要技术指标达到国际领先水平，实现了我国地地战术导弹由传统弹道式飞行到助推滑翔式机动飞行的重大跨越。(new DF-XX HGV)


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## Akasa

cirr said:


> 主持制定了我国首型中远程超声速反舰导弹总体方案，提出的大空域、高机动飞行控制与冲压发动机推力调节的一体化控制方案，解决了超声速飞行条件下变轨机动与稳定飞行的强耦合难题。在国际上首次使该类导弹射程从百余公里提高近4 倍，导弹法向机动过载达到巡航导弹中最高水平，能够在航母编队防御圈外发射、有效突破“宙斯盾”系统。导弹总体性能国际领先，成为海军、空军反制航母的杀手锏武器装备。（500km range YJ-12)
> 
> 2002 年至2015 年，作为型号总师，主持新型通用中远程导弹技术攻关和型号研制。按照“打牢基础、分步实施”的原则，先用4 年时间，通过XX-XX 飞行演示验证，首次实现弹道导弹“数字化”、一车一弹全方位无依托任意点热发射，具备“竖起来就打”的能力。再用4 年时间，通过XX-XT 飞行演示验证，解决了核常兼备、陆基机动远程攻击、空气舵弹头再入强机动飞行、末制导米级精度打击等难题。上述两个型号的研制，直接支撑了XX-XX 的国家立项。2010 年，任XX-XXA 总师，带领团队研制成功我国首型中远程固体机动核导弹，实现了我国弹道导弹精确打击能力和实战化水平的重大跨越，成为突破第二岛链的杀手锏，在9.3 阅兵中被誉为“我军战略威慑力体系中的新型武器”。(DF-26A etc)
> 
> 2015 年至今，任某国防重大工程飞行器系统总师，主持特种飞行器技术研究，多次完成*“螺旋式”高超声速机动飞行*试验，取得“垂直发射/直接入轨”临近空间多级固体助推技术等具有国际领先水平的技术成果，系统认知了临近空间“新环境”，引起国际社会极大关注，形成与美、俄比肩发展的态势。(Next generation strategic weapons)
> 
> 她参加工作30年来一直工作在地地战术弹道导弹科研第一线，她先后担任我国三代、7个地地战术弹道导弹武器系统技术负责人/总设计师，现任战术弹道导弹系列总设计师兼我国第四代中近程常规导弹武器系统（xxxx7）总设计师.(4th generation Mach 7 surface-surface/air-surface/anti-ship/carrier missile)
> ……
> 2009年她提出并主持研制我国第一型面向实战的最大飞行速度达到10倍声速的助推滑翔式机动飞行导弹武器系统，于2014年成功进行了全程飞行试验，专家评价，“该项目技术复杂，…,取得了重大原创性理论与技术成果，拥有多项自主知识产权，在国际上率先成功实现了高超声速助推滑翔导弹全程飞行试验…主要技术指标达到国际领先水平”(DF-17/Wu-14)
> ……
> 3.提出了助推滑翔战术导弹多学科耦合设计等理论方法，取得了重大原创性技术成果。主持研制了我国第一型实战化的高超声速助推滑翔战术导弹武器系统，在国内外率先成功进行了实弹飞行试验，主要技术指标达到国际领先水平，实现了我国地地战术导弹由传统弹道式飞行到助推滑翔式机动飞行的重大跨越。(new DF-XX HGV)



Some of these might be repetitive information. What is confirmed by these documents is that the YJ-12 has a max range of 400 km and that the DF-17 with HGV had completed test flights by 2014.

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## cirr

Akasa said:


> Some of these might be repetitive information. What is confirmed by these documents is that the YJ-12 has a max range of 400 km and that the DF-17 with HGV had completed test flights by 2014.



You are absolutely wrong


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## Akasa

cirr said:


> You are absolutely wrong



Please explain what's wrong?


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## cirr

Figaro said:


> I'm not sure. The YJ-12 definitely has a range of 400 km (this was confirmed just recently), so you are indeed correct on that. Maybe the DF-17 didn't complete flight testing in 2014?



For me, “射程从百余公里提高近4倍“ is 500km(=1xx+4X1xx)

“射程从百余公里提高到近4倍“ is 400km.

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> For me, “射程从百余公里提高近4倍“ is 500km(=1xx+4X1xx)
> 
> “射程从百余公里提高到近4倍“ is 400km.



It's a matter of dialogue; a fourfold increase (which is what the text translates to) can refer to either 4X the original value or 4X on top of the original value. In _most _cases, however, it refers to the former, which would match what other unofficial & official figures of roughly 400 km.


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## Dante80

The public information we have about the weapon really suggests that the range attributes of the system have a pretty serious release altitude and platform speed delta co-efficient. A reverse analogy (platform vulnerability variance according to mission profile) also exists.

In that context, any and all extreme range estimates should be taken with a grain of salt in my humble opinion, at least as far as concrete weapon capabilities in realistic theater scenarios are concerned.


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## lcloo

Dante80 said:


> The public information we have about the weapon really suggests that the range attributes of the system have a pretty serious release altitude and platform speed delta co-efficient. A reverse analogy (platform vulnerability variance according to mission profile) also exists.
> 
> In that context, any and all extreme range estimates should be taken with a grain of salt in my humble opinion, at least as far as concrete weapon capabilities in realistic theater scenarios are concerned.


There is a core difference between China military watching and the Western counterparts.

PLA seldom, in fact almost never, disclosed the true capabilities of their weapons. The so called public informations are from calculated speculatiions by western military watchers or from Chinese internets citing leaks or big shrimps. We can never be sure these informations are accurates.

Wherelse in the West, the weapon manufacturers are more than happy to publish their weapons with non-sensitive informations, they put up advertisement on military periodicals, internets, exhibitions etc, aiming to boast their sales.

Chinese exports have different model designations and capabilities from the domestic models, and we should be careful not to treat them (export variant and domestic variant) as same ones.

In most cases, the capabilities of PLA weapons are underestimated, though some western writers (mostly from US) tend to overestimate them creating perception of China Threat with aim of lobbying for more military budget fundings.

Thus public informations does not necessary show true capabilities of PLA weapons.

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## Deino

None of your attached images show up!?? 

... and for the MKK2 images I also only get "ERROR"


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## LKJ86

HQ-17

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## Dante80

Interesting, the sabot parts seem to be less/smaller than the TOR system. I was under the impression that the system still used a copy of the 9M331 missile, and the modernization/upgrades had to do with the radar, computers and system connectivity.


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## Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA

Missile and Target



Missile entering Window

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## khansaheeb

Scary.

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## Maxpane

Which missile is this?


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## Counterpunch

Such a huge fireball. What was the weapon packed with? Or, perhaps the building was coated with rdx and not reinforced concrete


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## ozranger

It seems to be an AKD-63

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## cirr

So when will the DF-31 family be expanded to include a member with Mach 20 HGV payload? 

The DF-31B?

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

CCTV1 News at 7: new type of missile(variant of DF-26? DF-26C??) enters service.

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 466603
> View attachment 466604
> View attachment 466605
> View attachment 466606
> 
> View attachment 466612


Hi @LKJ86 — what kind of missile these vehicles are carrying? See nothing on the missile part  but since you posted these pics under Missile thread I simply assume they must be about some kind of missile carrier. Btw, appreciate if you may set as regular practice to at least put a brief remark/label to those pictures that you post, *especially when they are not so obvious related to what... and THANKS *a lot for being the big contributor of the Chinese Column at PDF  You just remind me of another big contributor in this column who is not seen lately, @grey boy 2 —— _Hello @grey boy 2, I hope you're fine, if you happen to read this message bro, looking forward for your active engagement here  Greetz!_

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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Hi @LKJ86 — what kind of missile these vehicles are carrying? See nothing on the missile part  but since you posted these pics under Missile thread I simply assume they must be about some kind of missile carrier. Btw, appreciate if you may set as regular practice to at least put a brief remark/label to those pictures that you post, *especially when they are not so obvious related to what... and THANKS *a lot for being the big contributor of the Chinese Column at PDF  You just remind me of another big contributor in this column who is not seen lately, @grey boy 2 —— _Hello @grey boy 2, I hope you're fine, if you happen to read this message bro, looking forward for your active engagement here  Greetz!_


Hi, bro.
They are DF-26.

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> Hi, bro.
> They are DF-26.


Okay thanks for telling  is this batch of pics also related to your preceding post, the #1129... about the DF-26 as well? I am just not keen at identifying the various stuffs, rather dumb at that things


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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Okay thanks for telling  is this batch of pics also related to your preceding post, the #1129... about the DF-26 as well? I am just not keen at identifying the various stuffs, rather dumb at that things


No, related to the #1130.
#1129 is about YJ-62.

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## JSCh

*PLA commissions new-type ballistic missile with nuclear capacity*
By Gong Zhe
2018-04-15 23:03 GMT+8




The Rocket Force of China’s People’s Liberation Army (PLA) has recently commissioned a ballistic missile with nuclear capacity.

The weapon system is a new-type intermediate-range missile that was 100 percent self-developed by China.

The missile is capable of delivering nuclear warheads as well as other types of explosives.

When reporting the news on Sunday, CCTV used footage from last year's military parade, which showed trucks carrying missile-shaped containers.

CCTV described the missile as "being able to conduct fast nuclear counterattack" and can do "precision strikes" on heavy ships in the ocean.

"It's a killer weapon for the PLA," the report said.

(Jiang Jiao also contributed to the story.)

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## atan651

Yes, develop more and export them.


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## Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA

Americans can wipe out all Chinese people 500 times. The Chinese can eliminate all Americans twice: For China, this is enough.

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## samsara

Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA said:


> Americans can wipe out all Chinese people 500 times. The Chinese can eliminate all Americans twice: For China, this is enough.


You're hilariously funny  yet it's true.

But the warmongering party there often brag that they can wipe out the Chinese arsenal in a sudden, unprovoked First Nuclear Strike and deal with whatever remaining with their Global Shield ABM/BMD, or in the Chinese case, the Asia Pacific installations.
Therefore I wish China to up its strategic deterrence and keep the hotheads there remaining sober!!! Look forward for the disclosure of more lethal stuffs over time to put them in check. The HGV ones as well.

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## Dante80

China already has a pretty credible second strike capability. And will keep working on it. 
Copying from US DoDs 2017 report to Congress.

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## Figaro

Dante80 said:


> China already has a pretty credible second strike capability. And will keep working on it.
> Copying from US DoDs 2017 report to Congress.


I don't know exactly. I'm pretty sure there are more than 4 094's active ... especially given that the 094A has already entered service.

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## samsara

Dante80 said:


> China already has a pretty credible second strike capability. And will keep working on it.
> Copying from US DoDs 2017 report to Congress.


Thanks, new info to me. The 2017 US DoD Report, but still no mentioning about the DF-41... but they should add in the DF-41 in the 2018 edition  anyhow it's a good sign if they comprehend that they cannot decimate the Chinese strategic deterrence by any means, there's simply no way to win militarily without mutual-destruction, except doing some CVBG show-off in peace time, like they are doing now

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## Dante80

Figaro said:


> I don't know exactly. I'm pretty sure there are more than 4 094's active ... especially given that the 094A has already entered service.





samsara said:


> Thanks, new info to me. The 2017 US DoD Report, but still no mentioning about the DF-41... but they should add in the DF-41 in the 2018 edition  anyhow it's a good sign if they comprehend that they cannot decimate the Chinese strategic deterrence by any means, there's simply no way to win militarily without mutual-destruction, except doing some CVBG show-off in peace time, like they are doing now



Have in mind that this report comes out around May each year, and mostly contains intelligence and info on the developments happening in the year before. So, for this report, most baked and analyzed info comes from 2016.

Moreover, this is the de-classified part of the report. More speculative content using intelligence info is contained on the other part, but that is certainly not publicized.

Lastly, have in mind that objective analysis of capabilities has nothing to do with posturing. If some politician in America says that China is weak and "we will fry them", for example, you have to view this as a part of internal politics, rather than accepted doctrine. If you do ask the USN for example, that is actually contacting the PLAN on a regular basis, the only thing you will hear from them is the exceptional professionalism that they view in PLAN officers and the navys conduct as a whole.

This is also evident in the report (as well as the cooperation between the two navies, btw). Politics is one thing, actual conduct is another.

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## Cybernetics

Dante80 said:


> China already has a pretty credible second strike capability. And will keep working on it.
> Copying from US DoDs 2017 report to Congress.


China publicly acknowledged 5000 km of the "Underground Great Wall" which was "completed" (likely still on going) more than a decade ago. Georgetown University did an analysis on the program and concluded China had 3000 nuclear warheads due to the scale of the tunnel networks which is likely to be an exaggeration. China maintains a minimum deterrence and the length of the tunnels are needed to cover its large geography, be robust against a strike and be unpredictable in missile launch location.

The tunnel network includes roadway system, rail system and support facilities. During drills, members of the "second artillery" now called "rocket force" live in underground facilities for many weeks at a time.

The underground facilities are occasionally referenced in media. The movie "Sky Hunter" for example was produced in coordination with the Chinese military and were allowed to use military facilities and equipment during filming. During interviews it was said by the PLA official that "we didn't show everything but what we did show reflects reality". This was in reference to the equipment and tactics, thought it's more of a equipment showcase.

@22:52 in the Sky Hunter movie, it showed what looks to be an old declassified underground facility built many decades ago (60s?). It is likely unnetworked with other tunnels,a stand alone facility like the "816 project" which is open for tourism.

Full Sky Hunter movie





Link to Underground Great Wall thread and the Georgetown report:
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/pla-underground-great-wall-analysis.509270/

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## Figaro

Cybernetics said:


> China publicly acknowledged 5000 km of the "Underground Great Wall" which was "completed" (likely still on going) more than a decade ago. Georgetown University did an analysis on the program and concluded China had 3000 nuclear warheads due to the scale of the tunnel networks which is likely to be an exaggeration. China maintains a minimum deterrence and the length of the tunnels are needed to cover its large geography, be robust against a strike and be unpredictable in missile launch location.
> 
> The tunnel network includes roadway system, rail system and support facilities. During drills, members of the "second artillery" now called "rocket force" live in underground facilities for many weeks at a time.
> 
> The underground facilities are occasionally referenced in media. The movie "Sky Hunter" for example was produced in coordination with the Chinese military and were allowed to use military facilities and equipment during filming. During interviews it was said by the PLA official that "we didn't show everything but what we did show reflects reality". This was in reference to the equipment and tactics, thought it's more of a equipment showcase.
> 
> @22:52 in the Sky Hunter movie, it showed what looks to be an old declassified underground facility built many decades ago (60s?). It is likely unnetworked with other tunnels,a stand alone facility like the "816 project" which is open for tourism.
> 
> Full Sky Hunter movie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link to Underground Great Wall thread and the Georgetown report:
> https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/pla-underground-great-wall-analysis.509270/


Thanks for the video link! As for the Chinese nuclear arsenal, I estimate they have no less than 600 nukes, with the number being probably closer to 800. Minimum deterrence is not enough for China ... it has the money and ability to maintain many more.


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## 星海军事

Figaro said:


> I don't know exactly. I'm pretty sure there are more than 4 094's active ... especially given that the 094A has already entered service.


Those so called 094A are nothing more than fantasy.


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## 星海军事

Figaro said:


> So what are those then ... another modified variant?


You mean those modified 09IV?

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## Figaro

星海军事 said:


> You mean those modified 09IV?


What is their proper designation then?


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## Akasa

Figaro said:


> What is their proper designation then?



I think he's implying that the 09IV with curved sails are actually retrofits of existing boats.


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## UserUnknown2025

Near space hypersonic antiship missile

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## Beast

Figaro said:


> What is their proper designation then?


He is talking rubbish. Don’t trust him.


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## LKJ86



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## samsara

UserUnknown2025 said:


> Near space hypersonic antiship missile


Just out in tweet...

_“This presentation slide seems going to be real, *ship-borne near space hypersonic anti-ship missile.*“_

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/987346282439208960
EARLIER @cirr already hinted in other thread:


cirr said:


> It looks though progress in the R & D of YJ-XX near-space hypersonic anti-ship missile is faster than expected.

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## UserUnknown2025

samsara said:


> Just out in tweet...
> 
> _“This presentation slide seems going to be real, *ship-borne near space hypersonic anti-ship missile.*“_
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/987346282439208960


Is this navalized DF21d?


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## Safriz

Cybernetics said:


> China publicly acknowledged 5000 km of the "Underground Great Wall" which was "completed" (likely still on going) more than a decade ago. Georgetown University did an analysis on the program and concluded China had 3000 nuclear warheads due to the scale of the tunnel networks which is likely to be an exaggeration. China maintains a minimum deterrence and the length of the tunnels are needed to cover its large geography, be robust against a strike and be unpredictable in missile launch location.
> 
> The tunnel network includes roadway system, rail system and support facilities. During drills, members of the "second artillery" now called "rocket force" live in underground facilities for many weeks at a time.
> 
> The underground facilities are occasionally referenced in media. The movie "Sky Hunter" for example was produced in coordination with the Chinese military and were allowed to use military facilities and equipment during filming. During interviews it was said by the PLA official that "we didn't show everything but what we did show reflects reality". This was in reference to the equipment and tactics, thought it's more of a equipment showcase.
> 
> @22:52 in the Sky Hunter movie, it showed what looks to be an old declassified underground facility built many decades ago (60s?). It is likely unnetworked with other tunnels,a stand alone facility like the "816 project" which is open for tourism.
> 
> Full Sky Hunter movie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Link to Underground Great Wall thread and the Georgetown report:
> https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/pla-underground-great-wall-analysis.509270/


The movie is boring because they show J-20 the latest and the second only 5th Generation fighter in the world, being used to kill some ragtag terrorists?


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## samsara

UserUnknown2025 said:


> Is this navalized DF21d?


Not sure if one should regard it or call it that way, but the terse info gives hint that the new stuff is:
—a tech hybrid of ballistic missile [derived from DF-21D !?] + hypersonic characteristics
—a navalized (ship-borne version) targeted at naval assets (and perhaps other ground targets as well).

Basically when one masters all those techs it becomes easy to create new combo within the physics constraint. Just my 2 cents.

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## cirr

UserUnknown2025 said:


> Is this navalized DF21d?



No.


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## Akasa

samsara said:


> Just out in tweet...
> 
> _“This presentation slide seems going to be real, *ship-borne near space hypersonic anti-ship missile.*“_
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/987346282439208960
> EARLIER @cirr already hinted in other thread:



I now wonder if the following PDF thread is related somehow: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/chin...nti-ship-missile-with-12-000-km-range.470145/

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## LKJ86

PLAAF
April, 2018

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## LKJ86

HQ-9





---
PLAAF HQ-9 
April, 2018






















http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2018-04/25/content_8015296.htm

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## JSCh

*Dongfeng-26 ballistic missile commissioned: Defense Ministry*
Source: Xinhua| 2018-04-26 17:09:40|Editor: Yamei




BEIJING, April 26 (Xinhua) -- The Dongfeng-26 ballistic missile has been commissioned into the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force, said Wu Qian, spokesperson with China's Defense Ministry, on Thursday.

The new medium- and long-range ballistic missile was completely developed by the Chinese and will serve for nuclear strikes in short notice and conventional precision strikes, against targets on land and large- and medium-sized warships, Wu said at a press conference.

"China has not changed its defensive nuclear strategy nor the policy of no-first-use of nuclear weapons," he said.

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## LKJ86

PLAAF
2018.4.23

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## cirr

https://weibo.com/tv/v/GexH515YU?fid=1034:2fb07c8173a0f9faaacf5e195c427ad1

Cold launch?

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## samsara

cirr said:


> https://weibo.com/tv/v/GexH515YU?fid=1034:2fb07c8173a0f9faaacf5e195c427ad1
> 
> Cold launch?


Cold launch? It's obvious by the scene. 
The question: Is it a sort of rocket (preparation for sea-launch!?) or ballistic missile ???


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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Cold launch? It's obvious by the scene.
> The question: Is it a sort of rocket (preparation for sea-launch!?) or ballistic missile ???


CZ-11 & DF-31

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## LKJ86

PLA Army HQ-16














https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4235168246202782

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## LKJ86

PLAAF

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> PLA Army HQ-16
> View attachment 471127
> View attachment 471128
> 
> View attachment 471133
> View attachment 471134
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4235168246202782


It isn't a good news to India.

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> It isn't a good news to India.


IND is not much an issue. Care way more about the true potential flash points vs The Exceptional in the Taiwan Island and the SCS. From all kinds of reading, I believe those two are the most likely flash points, if any!!


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## Figaro

samsara said:


> IND is not much an issue. Care way more about the true potential flash points vs The Exceptional in the Taiwan Island and the SCS. From all kinds of reading, I believe those two are the most likely flash points, if any!!


I don’t think the SCS is a hotspot now, especially with the Philippines detente. The two flash points I can think of currently are the Taiwan scenario and possible conflict with Japan over the island dispute. The PLAGF is more than enough for the Indian border but a war with Japan (and by extension the US) would require huge resources and PLA interoperability.


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## Akasa

A recent CNBC report has revealed that the YJ-12B has a range of 550 km and the HQ-16B a range of 300 km.

*China quietly installed defensive missile systems on strategic Spratly Islands in hotly contested South China Sea*


> China has installed anti-ship cruise missiles and surface-to-air missile systems on three of its fortified outposts in the South China Sea, sources tell CNBC.
> By all accounts, the new coastal defense systems are a significant addition to Beijing's military portfolio in one of the most contested regions in the world.
> Amanda Macias | @amanda_m_macias
> 
> China has quietly installed anti-ship cruise missiles and surface-to-air missile systems on three of its fortified outposts west of the Philippines in the South China Sea, a move that allows Beijing to further project its power in the hotly disputed waters, according to sources with direct knowledge of U.S. intelligence reports.
> 
> Intelligence assessments say the missile platforms were moved to the outposts in the Spratly Islands within the past 30 days, according to sources who spoke on the condition of anonymity.
> 
> The placement of the defensive weapons also comes on the heels of China's recent South China Sea installation of military jamming equipment, which disrupts communications and radar systems. By all accounts, the new coastal defense systems represent a significant addition to Beijing's military portfolio in one of the most contested regions in the world.
> 
> The United States has remained neutral – but expressed concern – about the overlapping sovereignty claims to the Spratlys.
> 
> "We have consistently called on China, as well as other claimants, to refrain from further land reclamation, construction of new facilities, and militarization of disputed features, and to commit to managing and resolving disputes peacefully with other claimants," a Pentagon official told CNBC when asked about China's recent military activity in the area. "The further militarization of outposts will only serve to raise tensions and create greater distrust among claimants."
> 
> The recent intelligence, according to sources, indicates the deployment of anti-ship cruise missiles and surface-to-air missiles on Fiery Cross Reef, Subi Reef and Mischief Reef in the Spratly Islands. The Spratlys, to which six countries lay claim, are located approximately two-thirds of the way east from southern Vietnam to the southern Philippines.
> 
> The land-based anti-ship cruise missiles, designated as *YJ-12B*, allow China to strike surface vessels within *295 nautical miles* of the reefs. Meanwhile, the long-range surface-to-air missiles designated as *HQ-9B*, have an expected range of targeting aircraft, drones and cruise missiles within *160 nautical miles*.
> 
> The defensive weapons have also appeared in satellite images of Woody Island, China's military headquarters in the nearby Paracel Islands.
> 
> "Woody Island serves as the administrative and military center of China's presence in the South China Sea," Gregory Poling, Center for Strategic and International Studies fellow and director of the Asia Maritime Transparency Initiative, told CNBC in a prior interview.
> 
> "We assume that anything we see at Woody will eventually find its way farther south to more directly menace China's neighbors," he added.
> 
> *A hotly contested part of the world*
> 
> The South China Sea, which is home to more than 200 specks of land, serves as a gateway to global sea routes where approximately $3.4 trillion of trade passes annually.
> 
> The numerous overlapping sovereign claims to islands, reefs and rocks — many of which disappear under high tide — have turned the waters into an armed camp. Beijing holds the lion's share of these features with approximately 27 outposts peppered throughout.
> 
> Beijing's interest in developing the crumbs of land across the South China Sea is by no means new.
> 
> For instance, China first took possession of Fiery Cross Reef and Subi Reef in 1988 and has since outfitted the features with deep-water ports, aircraft hangars, communication facilities, administration offices and a 10,000-foot runway.
> 
> Last week, U.S. Navy Adm. Philip Davidson, the expected nominee to replace U.S. Pacific Command Chief Adm. Harry Harris, described China's increased presence in the South China Sea as "a substantial challenge to U.S. military operations in this region."
> 
> In written testimony to the U.S. Senate Armed Services Committee, Davidson said the development of China's forward operating bases in the hotly contested waters appear to be complete.
> 
> "The only thing lacking are the deployed forces. Once occupied, China will be able to extend its influence thousands of miles to the south and project power deep into Oceania," Davidson wrote. "In short, China is now capable of controlling the South China Sea in all scenarios short of war with the United States."
> 
> Davidson's comments echo a steady drumbeat of warnings made by Harris regarding China's growing strength.
> 
> Earlier this year, Harris told Congress that Beijing's impressive military buildup, including its pursuit of hypersonic weapons, could challenge the United States "across almost every domain."
> 
> "While some view China's actions in the East and South China Seas as opportunistic, I do not. I view them as coordinated, methodical and strategic, using their military and economic power to erode the free and open international order," Harris told the House Armed Services Committee.
> 
> Harris, whom President Donald Trump is reportedly set to nominate as U.S. ambassador to South Korea, currently oversees approximately 375,000 military personnel and is responsible for defending a theater that spans nearly half of the Earth's surface.
> 
> "Ladies and gentlemen, China's intent is crystal clear. We ignore it at our peril," Harris said.
> 
> Amanda Macias
> National security reporter


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## Akasa

Figaro said:


> Where did they get these numbers from?



They cited "US intelligence reports", so it's pretty vague.


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## LKJ86



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## cirr

DF-ZF? Again?  

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-successfully-tests-hypersonic-missile/

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## Ultima Thule

Akasa said:


> HQ-16B a range of *300 km.*


??? @Akasa sir


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## LKJ86



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## JSCh

航空君 
今天 16:18 来自 微博 weibo.com
#航空君航空科普# 俄罗斯第一批向中国运送S-400防空导弹系统的队伍已经完成任务。
航空君 
*Today 16:18 From Weibo weibo.com*
Russia's first batch supply of S-400 air defense missile system to China has completed its duty.

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## LKJ86

Celebrate the success of flight test of XXX missile???
Interesting!

@Deino

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 473725
> View attachment 473726
> View attachment 473727
> View attachment 473728
> 
> Celebrate the success of flight test of XXX missile???
> Interesting!
> 
> @Deino



Considering that a cheap-looking, stale cake was involved, it was probably not an impressive missile. They were even hasty enough to post a picture of a Long March rocket instead of an actual missile.

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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> Considering that a cheap-looking, stale cake was involved, it was probably not an impressive missile. They were even hasty enough to post a picture of a Long March rocket instead of an actual missile.


At least better than this one.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

PLAAF 2018.5.12

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## cirr

Scramjet powered LingYun universal test flight platform for near-space hypersonic vehicles

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## Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA

*China's "Lingyun" hypersonic weapon revealed for the first time*
2018-05-20 01:32:07
Recently, Chinese media reported on China’s “Lingyun” hypersonic weapon platform, which is also the first public appearance of China’s hypersonic weapon. Hypersonic weapons are weapons that are based on hypersonic flight technology and fly at speeds exceeding 6 times the speed of sound. The hypersonic speed is of great significance in the military. High-speed supersonic weapons have a long range, high speed, simple structure, and superior performance. They can quickly strike long-range targets.





Long-range ballistic missiles and intercontinental ballistic missiles are actually hypersonic weapons. The conventional intercontinental missile’s flight speed outside the atmosphere is about Mach 15 to Mach 20, but the trajectories are relatively fixed, lacking the ability to maneuver from orbit, making the relative success rate of intercepting in the middle stage higher. 




In order to overcome such problems, whether using the classic "Qian Xuesen trajectory" or the "Sangleng trajectory" hypersonic vehicle, can have a certain ability to change orbit, which makes the existing interception system extremely difficult to intercept. The design of the existing interception system is based on trajectory prediction, allowing interceptor missiles to "wait" missiles. Hypersonic missiles are not only slow and the trajectory is not fixed, which means that existing interception systems have no effect on it.




The supersonic missile may have adopted domestic scramjet engines. According to the Washington Freedom Lighthouse website, it first reported on the development of a new hypersonic missile powered by a ramjet engine in 2014. Perhaps the engine will pave the way for the development of a new generation of supersonic missiles in China.

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## Beast

Figaro said:


> Can you post an English translation?


Nothing significant. That only talks about pre flight safety measure.

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## qwerrty



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## cirr

Chinese “LRASM”... tick tock...

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## wulff

LRASM is subsonic, stealth and fully passive. Is the Chinese LRASM all those?


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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> PLAAF 2018.5.12
> View attachment 474855
> View attachment 474856
> View attachment 474857
> View attachment 474858
> View attachment 474859
> View attachment 474860
> View attachment 474835
> View attachment 474836
> View attachment 474838
> View attachment 474839


PLA*RF *— Rocket Force 

Series of cool pics!

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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> PLA*RF *— Rocket Force
> 
> Series of cool pics!


No, it is PLAAF.

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## LKJ86



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## beijingwalker

*China pushing new generation of nuclear weapons: report*
BY ELLEN MITCHELL - 05/28/18 02:41 PM EDT




China is reportedly stepping up its development of next-generation nuclear weapons, holding tests to simulate blasts more often than the United States is.

*The United States carries out less than one such test a month on average, while China’s average is five tests a month.*

China conducted about 200 nuclear blast simulations between September 2014 and December 2017, according to the China Academy of Engineering Physics, a major Chinese weapons research institute.

The United States, in comparison, carried out only 50 such tests between 2012 and 2017, according to the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, an American federal research facility in California used to aid national security.

Experts warned The South China Morning Post that as China, the United States and Russia separately seek more targeted nuclear weapons to deter against potential threats, the risk of a nuclear conflict increases.

The White House has pushed a $1.2 trillion plan to upgrade its nuclear stockpile, while the Pentagon In January unveiled its Nuclear Posture Review, which calls for developing smaller, low-yield nuclear weapons to deter Russia and China.

Pentagon officials have said the United States wants aggressive nations to believe it might actually use such weapons.

“We need to ensure we have a credible nuclear deterrent, and we are confident that we are prepared to ... defend this nation no matter what,” Pentagon chief spokeswoman Dana White said in February.

Congress followed up with authorization to fund such weapons in separate versions of its annual defense policy bill.

The Senate Armed Services Committee's version of a $716 billion National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) for fiscal 2019 — moved to the full Senate last week — supports the administration’s request for $65 million to develop a low-yield nuclear warhead.

The House’s version of the NDAA, passed by the full chamber last week, also authorizes $65 million for the new low-yield nuclear weapon, to be launched from submarines.

But after the U.S. Nuclear Posture Review was released, Chinese state-run paper Global Times published an editorial that stated China would seriously consider going public with its low-yield nuclear weapons program in response to a new nuclear arms race.

An international ban imposed in the 1990s prevents nuclear weapons from being tested — though North Korea has not followed the agreement.

In place of the real tests, Chinese scientists instead use high-powered gas guns that fire projectiles in the country’s main nuclear design facilities under mountains in Mianyang, southwestern Sichuan province.

China is currently creating new tactical nuclear weapons meant for close-range battles.

http://thehill.com/policy/defense/389628-china-pushing-new-generation-of-nuclear-weapons-report

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## My-Analogous

beijingwalker said:


> *China pushing new generation of nuclear weapons: report*
> BY ELLEN MITCHELL - 05/28/18 02:41 PM EDT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> China is reportedly stepping up its development of next-generation nuclear weapons, holding tests to simulate blasts more often than the United States is.
> 
> *The United States carries out less than one such test a month on average, while China’s average is five tests a month.*
> 
> China conducted about 200 nuclear blast simulations between September 2014 and December 2017, according to the China Academy of Engineering Physics, a major Chinese weapons research institute.
> 
> The United States, in comparison, carried out only 50 such tests between 2012 and 2017, according to the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, an American federal research facility in California used to aid national security.
> 
> Experts warned The South China Morning Post that as China, the United States and Russia separately seek more targeted nuclear weapons to deter against potential threats, the risk of a nuclear conflict increases.
> 
> The White House has pushed a $1.2 trillion plan to upgrade its nuclear stockpile, while the Pentagon In January unveiled its Nuclear Posture Review, which calls for developing smaller, low-yield nuclear weapons to deter Russia and China.
> 
> Pentagon officials have said the United States wants aggressive nations to believe it might actually use such weapons.
> 
> “We need to ensure we have a credible nuclear deterrent, and we are confident that we are prepared to ... defend this nation no matter what,” Pentagon chief spokeswoman Dana White said in February.
> 
> Congress followed up with authorization to fund such weapons in separate versions of its annual defense policy bill.
> 
> The Senate Armed Services Committee's version of a $716 billion National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) for fiscal 2019 — moved to the full Senate last week — supports the administration’s request for $65 million to develop a low-yield nuclear warhead.
> 
> The House’s version of the NDAA, passed by the full chamber last week, also authorizes $65 million for the new low-yield nuclear weapon, to be launched from submarines.
> 
> But after the U.S. Nuclear Posture Review was released, Chinese state-run paper Global Times published an editorial that stated China would seriously consider going public with its low-yield nuclear weapons program in response to a new nuclear arms race.
> 
> An international ban imposed in the 1990s prevents nuclear weapons from being tested — though North Korea has not followed the agreement.
> 
> In place of the real tests, Chinese scientists instead use high-powered gas guns that fire projectiles in the country’s main nuclear design facilities under mountains in Mianyang, southwestern Sichuan province.
> 
> China is currently creating new tactical nuclear weapons meant for close-range battles.
> 
> http://thehill.com/policy/defense/389628-china-pushing-new-generation-of-nuclear-weapons-report


So they all are adopting Pakistani theory of low yield nuclear options

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## Chinese-Dragon

My-Analogous said:


> So they all are adopting Pakistani theory of low yield nuclear options



The strategic value of low-yield tactical nukes is to lower the nuclear threshold as a means of deterrence.

The problem is that any use of nuclear weapons, including low-yield tactical nukes will invite nuclear retaliation as well.

It's a tricky tightrope to balance on, but having more options is always nice.

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/p2E4a5ssWwr0W_Lp2qUYZw

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## ozranger

One-piece, 3D printed frame for hyper sonic vehicles. See how big it is. It should help build up better heat and impact resistance for the vehicles.

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## LKJ86

PLAN YJ-62

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## LKJ86

PLAAF “蓝盾-18”
2018.6.5

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## cirr

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/china-flights-tests-new-multi-warhead-icbm/

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## LKJ86



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## Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA

Obviously this is China self defense weapons,nothing to worry about unless you want to invade China!


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## LKJ86



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## Dante80

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 479501



Weapon type?


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## LKJ86

Dante80 said:


> Weapon type?


I'm not sure.


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## LKJ86

Dante80 said:


> Weapon type?


DF-15

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

*China's DF-26 Missile: It Can Sink an Aircraft Carrier and Nuke an Army Base*
TNI Staff
June 14, 2018






The Chinese People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) commissioned the DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) into service earlier this year in April.

“The newly commissioned weaponry of the Rocket Force is Dongfeng-26 missile,” Senior Colonel Wu Qian, spokesman for China Ministry of National Defense, told reporters on April 26. “After the trial and operational test, this type of missiles are ready to be equipped to the full establishment of unit and have since then been officially commissioned to the Rocket Force.”

Wu broke down the four key features of the DF-26 missile and what it means for China’s capabilities. “As a new generation of medium-and-long range missile, DF-26 has the following four features,” Wu said. “First, it is researched, developed and manufactured by China independently and we have complete property right over it. Second, it can carry both conventional and nuclear warheads, capable of both rapid nuclear counter-strikes and conventional medium-and-long range precision strikes. Third, it is capable of launching precision strikes at both critical target on land and medium- and large-sized vessels at sea. Fourth, several new technologies have been applied to the missile, which helps increase the missile’s utilization and improve its integration and informationization.”

Wu noted, however, that Beijing—unlike the United States or Russia—continues maintain a strict “no first use” of nuclear weapon policy despite the fielding of the new weapon. “It should be stressed that there is no change in China’s self-defense nuclear strategy and ‘No First Use’ of nuclear weapons policy,” Wu said.

The DF-26, which is now operational, has a range of 3,000-4,000 km and can carry a 1,200-1,800 kg nuclear or conventional warhead. That means that China can strike directly at the U.S. territory of Guam in the event of a war—or it can be used to target ships at sea. As such, the massive 20,000 kg missile could not only target Guam but also America’s fleet of Nimitz and Ford-class nuclear-powered supercarriers.

As Wu stated, because the DF-26 is supposed to be capable of “both rapid nuclear counter-strikes and conventional medium-and-long range precision strikes” while also being designed to hit maritime targets, there must be several versions. And there are at least two: DF-26A and DF-26B—of the missile with different warheads and guidance packages. One version is probably designed to hit fixed ground targets and is likely fitted with a dual nuclear/conventional warhead, which could have a circular error of probability of 150-450 meters.

However, the anti-ship ballistic missile variant of the DF-26 weapon that is designed to target ground and maritime targets, the missile must be extremely accurate. Thus, the circular error of probability is likely very small—possibly as little as 10m according to some estimates. But exactly how the weapon is targeted and guided is not clear. In any case, the kill chain for the missile would be extremely long and complicated—and thus far there does not appear to have been a publicly acknowledged test of the weapon against a target at sea.

There has been some speculation that a May 2017 missile test in waters near the Korean peninsula was a DF-26, however, there is no official acknowledgement from the People’s Liberation Army. “The People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force conducted a test of a new type of missile somewhere in Bohai [Sea] in recent days, and achieved desired results,” the Chinese Ministry of National Defense said on May 9, 2017. However, Beijing offered no details of about the weapon that was being tested.

“The missile might be launched from the northwest to the east by the Rocket Force, with a range of 2,000km or above. It was likely the advanced intermediate-range DF-26B, a modified version of the DF-26,” Hong Kong-based military analyst Liang Guoliang told the _South China Morning Post_ at the time. “Given the landing area, the test is obviously aimed at THAAD in South Korea.”

Liang, however, was speculating—as were the other analysts cited in the report. But it is certainly possible that Beijing did test the DF-26, but there is no hard evidence.

Source:http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...-it-can-sink-aircraft-carrier-nuke-army-26270

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## beijingwalker

Why use them when China can certainly win a war without firing a single shot through trade and economic development.


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## ZeEa5KPul

beijingwalker said:


> Why use them when China can certainly win a war without firing a single shot through trade and economic development.


It's not about using them, it's about having them and making sure everyone knows you have them. Without them the West would launch a war against China rather than allow China's trade and economic development.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4253657937531743

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## samsara

*China develops two new airborne ballistic missile systems (June 2018)*

While Russia has officially announced the commissioning of a new hypersonic missile known as Kh-47M2 "Kinjhal", which is no more or less an airborne ballistic missile system, China on its side would also be developing two vectors of the same concept but this time in all discretion.

The news was first revealed in early March by Lieutenant General Robert Ashley, director of the US Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), in his testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee on threats to the national security.
_“These capabilities are being augmented with two new air-launched ballistic missiles, one of which may include a nuclear payload - Lt. Gen. Robert Ashley”_

Ashley said in his speech that the Chinese Rocket Force is strengthening its conventional and nuclear capabilities to accurately strike targets down to Guam, which is the main US military base in the western Pacific. 'Supporting both the DF-21 anti-ship ballistic missile (in fact the *DF-21D*) and also the DF-26 long-range missile, itself capable of hitting fixed targets on the ground or moving to the sea. All this is complemented by a growing panoply of cruise missiles of all kinds, as well as _"two new airborne ballistic missiles, one of which could carry a nuclear charge"_.

The statement of the director of the DIA, if it gives credibility on the existence of such a development program in China, only confirms in fact *rumors circulating for two years,* saying that a platform capable of transporting a mid-range anti-ship ballistic missile —derived from the H-6K bomber and equipped with a refueling pole to maintain or increase its range— would have reached the final stage of development. The first maiden flight would have taken place in December 2016.

And the reference *H-6N*, whose meaning is not known to date, also appears in some recent publications of the Chinese aircraft manufacturer AVIC (see our file "H-6N, HX ... Chinese bomber programs are multiplying").

Unaware of its official designation given by the Chinese armed forces, the US intelligence services have referenced one of these two new Chinese missiles "CH-AS-X-13", AS for Anti-Ship probably, and estimating the reach of the craft at about 3,000 km.

And according to US government sources, relayed by our colleague Ankit Panda in The Diplomat, this Chinese missile has already made five test shots. The first took place in December 2016, and the last one in the last week of January this year.

If it is difficult to reconstitute with open sources the first flight test of the system, since no less than 17 similar ballistic activities were identified during the month of December in 2016, the last test dating from January 2018 seems easier to trace.

Just like the "Kinjhal" whose development is based on a 9M723 short-range Russian ground-to-ground ballistic missile (from the Iskander 9K720 system), it is thought that the Chinese CASIC missile group engineers have adopted the same approach, to reduce the cycle development, basing the design of the "CH-AS-X-13" on the DF-21 medium-range ballistic missile, and more specifically the AShBM DF-21D if the new missile is indeed intended to hit large targets naval vessels at the sea.

Given the relatively large size of the DF-21 / DF-21D, which is *1.4 meters in diameter and 10.7 meters long* for the terrestrial version, it is not surprising that the Chinese need design a larger platform than the MiG-31K to transport and launch the new missile.

As for the estimated range of 3,000 km for the "CH-AS-X-13" against about 1,500 km for the DF-21D, this remains consistent when we know that the announced range of "Kinjhal" has been multiplied by four times compared to his twin, ground-to-ground missile.

The question now arises as to the purpose of such an airborne missile system and its possible operational deployment. If this "CH-AS-X-13" is actually designed for anti-ship, especially against aircraft carriers that remain an "obsession" in every sense of the term of the Chinese armed forces over the past 30 years why develop such a capacity when it would duplicate the medium-range DF-21D land-to-sea on the one hand, and the long-range DF-26 on the other?

Without being behind the scenes of little secrets, it is believed that the new "CH-AS-X-13" is being used to *expand the range of existing "anti-aircraft carrier" weapons, and to add an extra dimension as well as greater operational flexibility *to the global Chinese "Anti Access / Area Denial" (A2/AD) system. This multiplication of offensive vectors would make countermeasures more difficult to maintain and succeed.

Its development also makes it possible to convert the DF-21D Land-Sea, initially limited in range, to double its range to reach the same level as the IRBM DF-26. On the other hand, it does not seem to be technically or operationally relevant to develop an Air-Land version based on it.

And the associated technologies would not be solely dedicated to the military field and could be beneficial to some civilian programs. For example, this could allow CASIC, also a major player in the Chinese aerospace sector, to develop an airborne satellite launcher, similar to what it does with its competitor CASC with a Y-20 transport aircraft.

As for the question on the eventual operational deployment of the missile, it will probably remain in the direction of the ocean, i.e. one towards the Pacific Ocean and the South China Sea of the other, with a possible extension to the Indian Ocean.

Given its relatively short development, since the first pre-studies of "anti-aircraft airborne ballistic missile" seem to have begun around 2005, it would be again a "pragmatic" and "contextual" weapon of the Chinese armed forces, as for example the hypersonic glider missile DF-17 and the AVIC hypersonic reconnaissance drone, which has a very precise and targeted objective, and thus would not have a more global utility outside the sphere of the Chinese A2/AD.

One of the Chinese R & D documents from 2005 on the subject of the airborne ballistic missile dedicated to anti-ship missions.

Henri Kenhmann (East Pendulum)
http://www.eastpendulum.com/la-chin...eaux-systemes-de-missile-balistique-aeroporte

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## BHarwana

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1010789622740389888

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## LKJ86

DF-10A










https://m.weibo.cn/1972474734/4254588972974431

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## LKJ86

Maybe a new version of YJ-62

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## cirr

LKJ86 said:


> DF-10A
> View attachment 482241
> View attachment 482242
> View attachment 482243
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1972474734/4254588972974431

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## JSCh

DF-16



























​

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/jqDInYpP0Che4S3gwIM9KA

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

Remember this?






It is turning out to be launch platform for next generation hypersonic cruise missile.

Chances are high that the system be put on display come 2019 Military Parade.

The bigger, the faster, the more powerful, the better.

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## cirr

*China's hypersonic military projects include spaceplanes and rail guns*

https://www.popsci.com/chinas-hypersonic-work-speeds-up

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 & HQ-9B

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## samsara

*From DF-10A to Ballistic Missiles ... PLARF Launches Sky Sword Exercise (25 June)*

For reasons that are still unknown, the commander of a battalion of the Chinese Rocket Force (PLA Rocket Force / PLARF) has been widely covered in recent days. Although the focus is obviously on the human and also on the new Ground-Ground DF-10A cruise missile that exploits his unit, but the whole seems to be part of a much more global event, namely the annual exercise known as* "Sky Sword" ("天剑"系列演训).*


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1010559831613161472(tweet from Henri Kenhmann (East Pendulum): "Burst firing exercise of the new DF-10A cruise missile" on 23 June 2018)

If we are confined initially to this commander in question, we know that his name is Luo Yinsheng (罗寅生) and he is at the rank of Lieutenant-Colonel. Regulator of a master's degree in a Chinese Army University and decorated at least five times individually, he was promoted to commander of the 6th (??) battalion of a Rocket Force brigade in March 2017 and led his first real shots four months later.

The images broadcast by the national military channel CCTV-7 suggest that Luo is actually serving in the 821st PLARF Brigade, based in Luorong in the mountainous province of Guangxi in the south of China, itself belonging to Base No. 62 formerly known as "Base No. 53".

It is also this 821 Brigade which is nicknamed today "First Cruise Missile Brigade" in China.
_[4 pics, look at author's site]_

According to the official videos released, it is reported that Luo and his battalion have fired several real shots of a "new type of cruise missile" since the end of May, one of which took place between June 20 and 22 .

Launch vehicle analysis (TEL) shows that this is clearly the DF-10A cruise missile, first revealed in September 2015 during the military parade to celebrate the victory against the Japanese invaders in World War II, and whose characteristics are kept secret but it is thought that its range of up to 2,000 to 2,500 km.

Comments from television reports include words such as "precision strike", "day and night penetration", "volley of shots in multiple waves" and "confrontation Red-Blue" for this series of maneuvers. And we can see images where six DF-10A missiles were fired simultaneously from a vast meadow while other launches took place visibly in the night, and two life-size buildings serving as targets that were hit hard.

With the help of our colleague Raj, one of these target buildings could be located in the Gobi Desert, among a large field of fire used by the Chinese Army for many years. The comparison of the images of this seven-storey building released this weekend by the state media and those dating a few years ago actually suggests that these first would be recent.

We see then that a missile, supposed DF-10A, touched the fourth floor of the building and caused a sharp explosion. These images are therefore a priori consistent with the description of a journalist who witnessed one of the shots of the Luo unit .

"End of June [...] In the space of a few tens of minutes, several cruise missiles of the same model have crossed windows to destroy targets located more than a thousand li ¹, and this in a surgical way," writes the reporters of the journal of the Science and Technology Daily, institutional everyday Chinese Ministry of Science and Technology (MOST), "the scene is impressive ...".
_[5 pics, look at author's site]_

To be able to respond to the new strategic requirement of the country, namely "deterrence and combat any zone, both nuclear and conventional", the force of Chinese rockets organizes since 2012 a new series of annual exercises called "Sky Sword"  ("The Sword of the Sky"), which focuses particularly on the rapprochement to modern combat conditions, confrontation as well as interoperability with the other air forces, marine and land forces of the Chinese army.

And the "Sky Sword" drills began at the end of May this year - if you would take the Chinese Army newspaper - and the focus also shifts from "Brigade Level Assault" from previous years to "Real Fire Confrontation," and assault by group of armies. The units involved in the launches, namely several cruise missile and ballistic missile brigades, were chosen in a "random" and "unscheduled" manner according to official evidence.

The videos also show the presence of Chinese Air Force anti-aircraft units, so it is not excluded that penetration and interception simulations have occurred, as was already the case. During the "Sky Sword 2016" where ten missiles MRBM DF-21C were fired in salvo and about twenty SAM systems of the Air Force simulated their interception.

Apart from the widely reported DF-10A cruise missiles, short and medium range ballistic missiles such as DF-15 and DF-16 also appeared in the reports. A salvo of ten ballistic missiles was also filmed, like the exercise carried out a few years ago on the Tibetan plateau.





As for the locations of this year's maneuvers, the institutional media simply mentioned "the desert to the northwest" and "the forest to the northeast" (戈壁 大漠, 东北 密林). But airmail messages (NOTAM) indicated, for example, the presence of several no-go zones in northwestern China between June 20 and 22. The locations, dates and characteristics of these closed areas are therefore consistent with the shooting reported by Science and Technology Daily journalists (the article was published on June 22).

[The impact site of the DF-10A missile, and the NOTAM dated June 20 in the morning. Not everything is related to the exercise in question. (Image: East Pendulum)]

Henri Kenhmann
http://www.eastpendulum.com/du-df-10a-aux-missiles-balistiques-plarf-lance-lexercice-sky-sword

¹ Li (里, lǐ) is a Chinese distance measurement unit that has varied considerably in value over time, but is now standardized at the equivalent of 500 meters.

——————

The PLARF "Missile Impact Range" analysis indicates perfect navigation accuracy.Seven storied target building has 10 impact points with AOI (Area of Investigation/Interest) almost 90 degree. Great read on recent PLARF exercise:
http://www.eastpendulum.com/du-df-10a-aux-missiles-balistiques-plarf-lance-lexercice-sky-sword

A tweet from Raj47 on 6:33 PM — 25 June 2018

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1011210851934601216
_@rajfortyseven is the Tweeter's handle of *Col. Vinayak Bhat*, a military intelligence veteran of the Indian Army. He has studied Chinese and has worked as an interpreter in the Indian Army. He specialises in satellite imagery interpretation and analysis. He works mostly on Chinese PLA and Pakistan armed forces._

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## cirr

Launch vehicle analysis (TEL) shows that this is clearly the DF-10A cruise missile, first revealed in September 2015 during the military parade to celebrate the victory against the Japanese invaders in World War II, and whose characteristics are kept secret but it is thought that its *range of up to 2,000 to 2,500 km*

Wrong. It should be range of 3XXXkm.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mbd.baidu.com/newspage/data/landingshare?pageType=1&isBdboxFrom=1&context={"nid":"news_15584051564957578340"}
CH-T1 has already been passed the test of designing finalization.

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

“Rumours" have it that HQ-19, HQ-26 and HQ-29 have all be inducted into the PLAAF.

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> “Rumours" have it that HQ-19, HQ-26 and HQ-29 have all be inducted into the PLAAF.


HQ-29 doesn't even exist


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> HQ-29 doesn't even exist



What is the Sino-PAC3 called and what is its status?


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## Akasa

cirr said:


> “Rumours" have it that HQ-19, HQ-26 and HQ-29 have all be inducted into the PLAAF.



Could you provide a link to these rumors? The HQ-26 is a naval missile and is generally comparable to the HQ-19, so it makes no sense for the PLAAF to induct it.


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> What is the Sino-PAC3 called and what is its status?



I believe I have answered your question last year.



星海军事 said:


> The new model shares some of the features with PAC-3 while they are highly different. You are half right about its designation.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> I believe I have answered your question last year.



Yes I do recall that. But was I "half-right" on the "2", "9", or "HQ-"?


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> Yes I do recall that. But was I "half-right" on the "2", "9", or "HQ-"?



"HQ" isn't a part of the quiz.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> "HQ" isn't a part of the quiz.



I've heard that this particular missile might be a derivative of the HQ-9 (a "HQ-9C" perhaps) with CEC. Would this be in the ballpark?


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## LKJ86

HQ-17

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

*"It's Real, It's Coming, It's A Matter Of Time" - US General Warns Of Hypersonic Attack (01 JULY)*

Air Force Lt. Gen. Samuel Greaves, director of the Missile Defense Agency (MDA), said he has the full support of Undersecretary of Defense for Research and Engineering Michael Griffin to *advance the development of space-based sensors that would defend the nation from hypersonic attacks by America’s adversaries.*

The Pentagon believes funding will be in place next year to begin the constellation of missile-surveillance satellites amid new warnings of hypersonic weapons being tested and deployed Russia and China.

*“The hypersonic threat is real, it is not imagination,”* Lt. Gen. Greaves explained Tuesday at the Capitol Hill Club, emphasizing that defending against hypersonic missile attacks has become a top priority for the agency. But he forewarned the audience at the elitist, members-only club in Washington, D.C., that *the Pentagon has a poor track record developing satellite constellations and should not deploy new systems unless a considerable amount of testing has been completed.*

We will prove the technology before we jump into a major program,” said Greaves.

*“We will not repeat AEHF, SBIRS, GPS 3, OCX,” *he said, referring to a list of Air Force satellite programs that have cost taxpayers billions of dollars and were years behind schedule.

“We all know what happens when we overpromise and we underdeliver,” Greaves said.

Greaves said the Pentagon wants to construct a sensor layer in space for missile defense, which right now, that is at the top of MDA’s priorities. While there is an urgency to deploy the system because of Russia’s hypersonic threat, he noted that defense agencies should not rush — to make sure all the bases are covered.

“To go fast sometimes you need to go slow early on,” he said. “This is the slow part, doing the requirements, the architecture studies, the modeling and simulation, so by the time you make your decision, industry is ready to ramp up.”

On the modern battlefield, the “vantage point of space” is critical to track hypersonic missiles that Russia and China are developing and currently testing, Greaves insisted. He said the Air Force already has the Space Based Infrared (SBIRS) satellites that detect missile launches from geostationary Earth orbit, which could be blended with a larger constellation of surveillance satellites to track “birth to death” of a hypersonic missile.

If funding is approved, Greaves said the space-based sensor layer for missile defense could be deployed by 2025. The Pentagon has given the MDA extraordinary authorities to quickly advance defense systems to shield the nation from hypersonic attacks.

Greaves comments come after Air Force Gen. John Hyten, commander of U.S. Strategic Command, recently warned the Senate Armed Services Committee that the U.S. is extremely vulnerable to future attack via hypersonic weapons.

*Hyten said we are falling behind in the technological know-how to defend the homeland from the threat, as Russia and China advance their hypersonic technologies.*

Russia will be capable of fielding a hypersonic glide vehicle, a weapon that no country can defend against, by 2020, which would mean the U.S. would have a gap in hypersonic defense systems for at least a few years.

*Hyten suggested the U.S. is powerless against hypersonic weapon threats and has to rely on deterrence against these so-called weapons.*

What is that deterrence you might ask?

“So our response would be our deterrent force which would be the triad and the nuclear capabilities that we have to respond to such a threat,” Hyten warned.

In other words, if Russia or China launches a hypersonic missile attack on the U.S., the Pentagon will respond with nuclear war.

*While Russia and China are many years ahead of the U.S. when it comes to hypersonic weapon development, the world has finally figured out the Achilles’ heel of the West.*

*From U.S. Air Force generals to Pentagon officials, they are mostly singing the same tune: the threat of hypersonic attacks from Russia and China are concerning.*

The race to the bottom started many years ago for Washington, as their decades of failed wars in the Middle East has left a massive vulnerability gap in missile defense systems to protect the homeland against hypersonic threats, which could be exploited once Russia or China launches a production run of the weapons.

Moreover, not to frighten anyone, but Russia recently launched a “series production” of its latest hypersonic missile — indicating that inevitable is coming.

We must prepare for the possible endgame that Russia and China understand the defense gap that exists today, but in the next 5 to 8 years could be plugged via the unprecedented military spending unleashed by the Trump administration. As some say — strike while the iron is hot…

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018...atter-time-us-general-warns-hypersonic-attack

More billions of dollars to feed the MIC. Generals + MIC are quite effective to suck the US taxpayers' money... spend till it drops. May not be the clear problem as long as other nations are still willing to "loan" the US by buying its bonds and holding the usd to buy oil. Any wonder why the US "forgets" to build its infrastructure and real economy? The self-implosion will be the ultimate exit path of The Exceptional empire.

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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

What kind of missile is this?
@星海军事 

*Researchers design new air-defense missile system*


> By Zhao Lei | China Daily | Updated: 2018-07-09 09:24
> 
> China has become a world leader in air-defense technologies thanks to the hard work and dedication of researchers at China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp's Second Academy, the country's major developer of air-defense weapons systems.
> 
> Researchers from the academy's Zhang Yiqun Laboratory have been playing a vital role in the development of China's *new air-defense missile system* by designing its control systems - the "brain" of any missile.
> 
> Compared with previous generations of air-defense missiles, the new-generation missile system will have a *wider range of targets and be much more technologically sophisticated*, taking China into the ranks of just a handful of nations capable of designing and producing such a system.
> 
> *The cutting-edge missile's control systems need to be extremely efficient and accurate*, said Wang Mengyi, deputy head of the Second Academy's General Design Department and former leader of the laboratory.
> 
> "Metaphorically put, the mission of these control systems is to *guide a needle to fly 1,000 kilometers to pierce the eye of another needle*," he said. "For researchers from Zhang Yiqun Laboratory, their mission is to turn this seemingly impossible task into reality."
> 
> Wang said control systems are mainly tasked with working out a missile's best trajectory and making sure it can hit its target.
> 
> The successful development of China's new air-defense missile system would be unachievable if researchers at the laboratory had failed to design world-class control systems, he said, noting that they adopted new design methods that have reduced design time tremendously and improved missile performance.
> 
> Wang Xiaodong, a laboratory researcher, said members of the laboratory spent numerous days and nights improving the accuracy of control systems and optimizing the algorithms that are central to them.
> 
> "For example, we worked 10 consecutive days and slept little each day to detect and resolve one extremely rare abnormality because all of us are aware that our nation's air-defense networks can only be reliable if we are meticulous and responsible toward our work," he said.
> 
> The laboratory, named after Zhang Yiqun, a top researcher at the academy and former head of the laboratory, has been *granted 11 National Science and Technology Advancement Awards and 28 National Defense Science and Technology Progress Awards *due to its extensive contribution to China's air-defense networks. It has also registered more than 130 defense technology patents.
> 
> In the laboratory, members of the Communist Party of China play a vanguard, exemplary role, leaders of the laboratory said. They always take the lead in innovating, carry out their assignments carefully, with scrupulous attention to detail, and also display an inspirational level of diligence and devotion toward their work.


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> What kind of missile is this?
> @星海军事
> 
> *Researchers design new air-defense missile system*


This is what we just talked about.


----------



## Jlaw

samsara said:


> *"It's Real, It's Coming, It's A Matter Of Time" - US General Warns Of Hypersonic Attack (01 JULY)*
> 
> Air Force Lt. Gen. Samuel Greaves, director of the Missile Defense Agency (MDA), said he has the full support of Undersecretary of Defense for Research and Engineering Michael Griffin to *advance the development of space-based sensors that would defend the nation from hypersonic attacks by America’s adversaries.*
> 
> The Pentagon believes funding will be in place next year to begin the constellation of missile-surveillance satellites amid new warnings of hypersonic weapons being tested and deployed Russia and China.
> 
> *“The hypersonic threat is real, it is not imagination,”* Lt. Gen. Greaves explained Tuesday at the Capitol Hill Club, emphasizing that defending against hypersonic missile attacks has become a top priority for the agency. But he forewarned the audience at the elitist, members-only club in Washington, D.C., that *the Pentagon has a poor track record developing satellite constellations and should not deploy new systems unless a considerable amount of testing has been completed.*
> 
> We will prove the technology before we jump into a major program,” said Greaves.
> 
> *“We will not repeat AEHF, SBIRS, GPS 3, OCX,” *he said, referring to a list of Air Force satellite programs that have cost taxpayers billions of dollars and were years behind schedule.
> 
> “We all know what happens when we overpromise and we underdeliver,” Greaves said.
> 
> Greaves said the Pentagon wants to construct a sensor layer in space for missile defense, which right now, that is at the top of MDA’s priorities. While there is an urgency to deploy the system because of Russia’s hypersonic threat, he noted that defense agencies should not rush — to make sure all the bases are covered.
> 
> “To go fast sometimes you need to go slow early on,” he said. “This is the slow part, doing the requirements, the architecture studies, the modeling and simulation, so by the time you make your decision, industry is ready to ramp up.”
> 
> On the modern battlefield, the “vantage point of space” is critical to track hypersonic missiles that Russia and China are developing and currently testing, Greaves insisted. He said the Air Force already has the Space Based Infrared (SBIRS) satellites that detect missile launches from geostationary Earth orbit, which could be blended with a larger constellation of surveillance satellites to track “birth to death” of a hypersonic missile.
> 
> If funding is approved, Greaves said the space-based sensor layer for missile defense could be deployed by 2025. The Pentagon has given the MDA extraordinary authorities to quickly advance defense systems to shield the nation from hypersonic attacks.
> 
> Greaves comments come after Air Force Gen. John Hyten, commander of U.S. Strategic Command, recently warned the Senate Armed Services Committee that the U.S. is extremely vulnerable to future attack via hypersonic weapons.
> 
> *Hyten said we are falling behind in the technological know-how to defend the homeland from the threat, as Russia and China advance their hypersonic technologies.*
> 
> Russia will be capable of fielding a hypersonic glide vehicle, a weapon that no country can defend against, by 2020, which would mean the U.S. would have a gap in hypersonic defense systems for at least a few years.
> 
> *Hyten suggested the U.S. is powerless against hypersonic weapon threats and has to rely on deterrence against these so-called weapons.*
> 
> What is that deterrence you might ask?
> 
> “So our response would be our deterrent force which would be the triad and the nuclear capabilities that we have to respond to such a threat,” Hyten warned.
> 
> In other words, if Russia or China launches a hypersonic missile attack on the U.S., the Pentagon will respond with nuclear war.
> 
> *While Russia and China are many years ahead of the U.S. when it comes to hypersonic weapon development, the world has finally figured out the Achilles’ heel of the West.*
> 
> *From U.S. Air Force generals to Pentagon officials, they are mostly singing the same tune: the threat of hypersonic attacks from Russia and China are concerning.*
> 
> The race to the bottom started many years ago for Washington, as their decades of failed wars in the Middle East has left a massive vulnerability gap in missile defense systems to protect the homeland against hypersonic threats, which could be exploited once Russia or China launches a production run of the weapons.
> 
> Moreover, not to frighten anyone, but Russia recently launched a “series production” of its latest hypersonic missile — indicating that inevitable is coming.
> 
> We must prepare for the possible endgame that Russia and China understand the defense gap that exists today, but in the next 5 to 8 years could be plugged via the unprecedented military spending unleashed by the Trump administration. As some say — strike while the iron is hot…
> 
> https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018...atter-time-us-general-warns-hypersonic-attack
> 
> More billions of dollars to feed the MIC. Generals + MIC are quite effective to suck the US taxpayers' money... spend till it drops. May not be the clear problem as long as other nations are still willing to "loan" the US by buying its bonds and holding the usd to buy oil. Any wonder why the US "forgets" to build its infrastructure and real economy? The self-implosion will be the ultimate exit path of The Exceptional empire.


wtf. these US military leaders are whining like a little girl..."oh, its real , the Chinese are coming! "

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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> This is what we just talked about.



Really? The HQ-XX (supposedly a PAC-3MSE equivalent) has a range of 1000 km?


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> Really? The HQ-XX (supposedly a PAC-3MSE equivalent) has a range of 1000 km?


It's apparently an analogy. The original test should be “千里之外穿针引线”.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> It's apparently an analogy. The original test should be “千里之外穿针引线”.



Interesting, when can we expect this missile to be unveiled or at least "photographed"?


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> Interesting, when can we expect this missile to be unveiled or at least "photographed"?


If I am to be optimistic I would say next year, in the military parade.

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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> If I am to be optimistic I would say next year, in the military parade.



It would be interesting to see if the HQ-19 and HQ-26 make an appearance as well.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> HQ-29 doesn't even exist



The missile is called "HQ-20", if a certain "forum" is to be trusted. 

That being said, what is the status of the HQ-19 and HQ-26, and have they passed certification or entered preliminary service yet?


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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4262037679327074


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## LKJ86

HQ-16

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> CX-1
> View attachment 486234




Following this link and image it is a Brahmos!??

https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...ecutive-day/articleshow/64278156.cms?from=mdr

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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Following this link and image it is a Brahmos!??
> 
> https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...ecutive-day/articleshow/64278156.cms?from=mdr


I think I make a mistake.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> I think I make a mistake.




No problem... and hats off to admit it.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/IMWX5ecvcvbACUnf9l7msA

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## Zarvan

China has become a world leader in air-defense technologies thanks to the hard work and dedication of researchers at China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp's Second Academy, the country's major developer of air-defense weapons systems.





*HQ-16 Chinese-made medium-range air defense missile system at AirShow China. (Picture source Army Recognition)*

Since the period 2007/2008 China has launched programs to develop new air defense capabilities. When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, China air defense systems was mainly composed by old Soviet-made *SA-2 / SA-75 Dvina* but now Chinese defense industry has designed and developed many types of air defense systems including the *HQ-9*, HQ-12, *HQ-16* and more.

Researchers from the academy's Zhang Yiqun Laboratory have been playing a vital role in the development of China's new air-defense missile system by designing its control systems - the "brain" of any missile.

Chinese armed forces also use Russian-made air defense system as the *S-300 PMU-2* Favorit and the *TOR-M1* under the name of *HQ-17*, Chinese development of the Russian-made Tor-M1 system with multiple improvements.

In 2018, Russia has delivered the first regimental set of *S-400 Triumf* advanced interceptor-based Air Defense Systems (NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler) to China under a 2014 government-to-government contract.

Compared with previous generations of air-defense missiles, the new-generation missile system will have a wider range of targets and be much more technologically sophisticated, taking China into the ranks of just a handful of nations capable of designing and producing such a system.

The cutting-edge missile's control systems need to be extremely efficient and accurate, said Wang Mengyi, deputy head of the Second Academy's General Design Department and former leader of the laboratory.

The successful development of China's new air-defense missile system would be unachievable if researchers at the laboratory had failed to design world-class control systems, he said, noting that they adopted new design methods that have reduced design time tremendously and improved missile performance.

Wang Xiaodong, a laboratory researcher, said members of the laboratory spent numerous days and nights improving the accuracy of control systems and optimizing the algorithms that are central to them.

"For example, we worked 10 consecutive days and slept little each day to detect and resolve one extremely rare abnormality because all of us are aware that our nation's air-defense networks can only be reliable if we are meticulous and responsible toward our work," he said.

The laboratory, named after Zhang Yiqun, a top researcher at the academy and former head of the laboratory, has been granted 11 National Science and Technology Advancement Awards and 28 National Defense Science and Technology Progress Awards due to its extensive contribution to China's air-defense networks. It has also registered more than 130 defense technology patents.

In the laboratory, members of the Communist Party of China play a vanguard, exemplary role, leaders of the laboratory said. They always take the lead in innovating, carry out their assignments carefully, with scrupulous attention to detail, and also display an inspirational level of diligence and devotion toward their work.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/jul...ader_in_air-defense_missile_technologies.html

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## khansaheeb

They need to be battle tested against advance adversaries only can then we say they have become a world leader. Else these are unsubstantiated claims.


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## Figaro

khansaheeb said:


> They need to be battle tested against advance adversaries only can then we say they have become a world leader. Else these are unsubstantiated claims.


Yes but I don't think any of these types of SAM systems have really ever been tested by an "advanced adversary". The only scenario that comes slightly close to this would be the Persian Gulf War. And we all remember how badly the PATRIOTs performed against very low tech Scud missiles.

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## !eon

> *China has become a world leader in air-defense missile technologies*


This article negates it's own headline later in details



Zarvan said:


> In 2018, *Russia has delivered *the first regimental set of *S-400 Triumf* advanced interceptor-based Air Defense Systems (NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler) to China under a 2014 government-to-government contract.

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## Figaro

!eon said:


> This article negates it's own headline later in details


Lol the S-400 deal was signed way back in 2014 with discussions beginning even earlier. Back then China wasn’t a world leader in SAM technology ... now it may be. Besides the S-400 deal was highly politicized from the very beginning ... doesn’t mean much (same as the Su-35).


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## LKJ86

HQ-16

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## samsara

Zarvan said:


> China has become a world leader in air-defense technologies thanks to the hard work and dedication of researchers at China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp's Second Academy, the country's major developer of air-defense weapons systems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *HQ-16 Chinese-made medium-range air defense missile system at AirShow China. (Picture source Army Recognition)*
> 
> Since the period 2007/2008 China has launched programs to develop new air defense capabilities. When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, China air defense systems was mainly composed by old Soviet-made *SA-2 / SA-75 Dvina* but now Chinese defense industry has designed and developed many types of air defense systems including the *HQ-9*, HQ-12, *HQ-16* and more.
> 
> Researchers from the academy's Zhang Yiqun Laboratory have been playing a vital role in the development of China's new air-defense missile system by designing its control systems - the "brain" of any missile.
> 
> Chinese armed forces also use Russian-made air defense system as the *S-300 PMU-2* Favorit and the *TOR-M1* under the name of *HQ-17*, Chinese development of the Russian-made Tor-M1 system with multiple improvements.
> 
> In 2018, Russia has delivered the first regimental set of *S-400 Triumf* advanced interceptor-based Air Defense Systems (NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler) to China under a 2014 government-to-government contract.
> 
> Compared with previous generations of air-defense missiles, the new-generation missile system will have a wider range of targets and be much more technologically sophisticated, taking China into the ranks of just a handful of nations capable of designing and producing such a system.
> 
> The cutting-edge missile's control systems need to be extremely efficient and accurate, said Wang Mengyi, deputy head of the Second Academy's General Design Department and former leader of the laboratory.
> 
> The successful development of China's new air-defense missile system would be unachievable if researchers at the laboratory had failed to design world-class control systems, he said, noting that they adopted new design methods that have reduced design time tremendously and improved missile performance.
> 
> Wang Xiaodong, a laboratory researcher, said members of the laboratory spent numerous days and nights improving the accuracy of control systems and optimizing the algorithms that are central to them.
> 
> "For example, we worked 10 consecutive days and slept little each day to detect and resolve one extremely rare abnormality because all of us are aware that our nation's air-defense networks can only be reliable if we are meticulous and responsible toward our work," he said.
> 
> The laboratory, named after Zhang Yiqun, a top researcher at the academy and former head of the laboratory, has been granted 11 National Science and Technology Advancement Awards and 28 National Defense Science and Technology Progress Awards due to its extensive contribution to China's air-defense networks. It has also registered more than 130 defense technology patents.
> 
> In the laboratory, members of the Communist Party of China play a vanguard, exemplary role, leaders of the laboratory said. They always take the lead in innovating, carry out their assignments carefully, with scrupulous attention to detail, and also display an inspirational level of diligence and devotion toward their work.
> 
> https://www.armyrecognition.com/jul...ader_in_air-defense_missile_technologies.html


The original article is here:

*Researchers design new air-defense missile system (09 JULY)*

China has become a world leader in air-defense technologies thanks to the hard work and dedication of researchers at China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp's Second Academy, the country's major developer of air-defense weapons systems.

Researchers from the academy's Zhang Yiqun Laboratory have been playing a vital role in the development of China's NEW air-defense missile system by designing its control systems - the "brain" of any missile.

Compared with previous generations of air-defense missiles, the NEW-GENERATION missile system will have a wider range of targets and be much more technologically sophisticated, taking China into the ranks of just a handful of nations capable of designing and producing such a system.

The cutting-edge missile's control systems need to be extremely efficient and accurate, said Wang Mengyi, deputy head of the Second Academy's General Design Department and former leader of the laboratory.

"METAPHORICALLY put, the mission of these control systems is to guide a needle to fly 1,000 kilometers to pierce the eye of another needle," he said. "For researchers from Zhang Yiqun Laboratory, their mission is to turn this seemingly impossible task into reality."

Wang said control systems are mainly tasked with working out a missile's best trajectory and making sure it can hit its target.

The successful development of China's new air-defense missile system would be unachievable if researchers at the laboratory had failed to design world-class control systems, he said, noting that they adopted new design methods that have reduced design time tremendously and improved missile performance.

Wang Xiaodong, a laboratory researcher, said members of the laboratory spent numerous days and nights improving the accuracy of control systems and optimizing the algorithms that are central to them.

The laboratory, named after Zhang Yiqun, a top researcher at the academy and former head of the laboratory, has been granted 11 National Science and Technology Advancement Awards and 28 National Defense Science and Technology Progress Awards due to its extensive contribution to China's air-defense networks. It has also registered more than 130 defense technology patents.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/201807/09/WS5b42b96aa3103349141e1755.html

(Posted via my P9 Plus)

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## samsara

Educate oneself better and watch this whole 5-episode series then infer on one's own. But don't expect the blunt, explicit articulations, that is not the Chinese style of communication, one must look elsewhere for such direct even hyping style  

I posted these footages here because those underlying technologies are principally applicable to missiles and missile defence systems incl. the ASBM. 

CCTV-4 Program “Across China“：The 5 series of “Shield of China” — covering VARIOUS RADAR TECHNOLOGIES, with full English subtitles, broadcast recently in JULY 2018
《走遍中国》 5集系列片《中国之盾》几种雷达技术的覆盖 07/2018 CCTV中文国际

Bilingually subtitled 中英文字幕

*EP1: Gazing at the Blue Sky 凝视蓝天*





*EP2: Guarding the Territorial Seas 捍卫海疆*





*EP3: Casting Shield As Spear 铸盾为矛*





*EP4: Overlooking the Earth 俯瞰大地*





And the last episode of this series,
*EP5: Radar Tracking for Spacecraft and Satellites 仰望星空*






(Posted via my P9 Plus)

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## LKJ86

HJ-10
2018.7.20

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

New missile? HQ-9C?

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> New missile? HQ-9C?
> 
> View attachment 488907



@星海军事

Your thoughts? Could this be the HQ-XX that we talked about earlier?


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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/b9rA3QNsd6M70tT6AblGyg

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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> @星海军事
> 
> Your thoughts? Could this be the HQ-XX that we talked about earlier?


Maybe it's something you've long known but long forgotten.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> Maybe it's something you've long known but long forgotten.



Man, you just enjoy invoking frustration and headaches, don't ya? 

Could this be HQ-19 or HQ-26?


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## LKJ86

HQ-16A & B
2018.7.27

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

"NB" missile is launched successfully from H-6.

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## cirr

So H-6N has successfully test fired one "NB" hypersonic missile.

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## UserUnknown2025

cirr said:


> So H-6N has successfully test fired one "NB" hypersonic missile.


Does “NB” stand for 牛逼？

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## Beast

Nuclear ballistic

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489613
> 
> View attachment 489614
> 
> "NB" missile is launched successfully from H-6.







Air-based hypersonic anti-ship ballistic missile

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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1971538745/4267798693962828

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489619
> 
> Air-based hypersonic anti-ship ballistic missile











https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4267853701465474

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## Title1234

S 400 is not battle test too.


khansaheeb said:


> They need to be battle tested against advance adversaries only can then we say they have become a world leader. Else these are unsubstantiated





Akasa said:


> Man, you just enjoy invoking frustration and headaches, don't ya?
> 
> Could this be HQ-19 or HQ-26?


Some india are gentleman if he is just take him like a friend .



LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489620
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1971538745/4267798693962828


Nice cartoon.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489669



But that bomber is - at least serial number wise - just an ordinary H-6K assigned to the 10. Bomber Division.


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## yantong1980

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489669
> 
> View attachment 489670
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4267853701465474



So it's similar to Russian 'Kinzhal' system?


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## Beast

yantong1980 said:


> So it's similar to Russian 'Kinzhal' system?


No. Kinzhal system is just a ballistic missile with CEP of 300m to 500m hitting a stastic target.

While this Chinese one not iust need precision hit of 2-3m CEP but able to hit a moving target going at 30knots. The guidance system need not just need to be different but revolutional.

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## Deino

But according to the earlier artworks and reports that missile was to be an airborne variant of the DF-21D or similar. The missile shown today - if it is in fact the missile what we see under the wings of that H-6K - however
is a different design and smaller and lighter since it can be carried under the wings.

So either these older reports were wrong or this is yet another missile ....


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## 星海军事

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489669
> 
> View attachment 489670
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4267853701465474


Please ignore this blogger (copycat, plagiarizer and rumormonger).

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## cirr

HQ-XX/DN-X interceptor missile

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## Deino

for what does DN stand for?

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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> for what does DN stand for?


DN stands for Dong Neng (动能), meaning kinetic energy.

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## Deino

Thanks a lot !

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> HQ-XX/DN-X interceptor missile








A 2004 US Air Force missile defense test.

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## cirr

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 489619
> 
> Air-based hypersonic anti-ship ballistic missile



Looks like air-launched derivative of hypersonic YJ-XX. 



Deino said:


> But according to the earlier artworks and reports that missile was to be an airborne variant of the DF-21D or similar. The missile shown today - if it is in fact the missile what we see under the wings of that H-6K - however
> is a different design and smaller and lighter since it can be carried under the wings.
> 
> So either these older reports were wrong or this is yet another missile ....
> 
> View attachment 489780



Another missile indeed - YJ-XX hypersonic anti-ship missile launched from air.

Test of airborne "DF-21D" was carried out onboard an H-6N in May, not June.

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## Deino

cirr said:


> Looks like air-launched derivative of hypersonic YJ-XX.
> 
> 
> 
> Another missile indeed - YJ-XX hypersonic anti-ship missile launched from air.
> 
> Test of airborne "DF-21D" was carried out onboard an H-6N in May, not June.



Concerning this alleged DF-21D variant, how sure we are that it is indeed a DF-21-based design? Wouldn't be a missile based on the DF-12 aka M20 much more suitable and easier to carry for the H-6?


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## cirr

Deino said:


> Concerning this alleged DF-21D variant, how sure we are that it is indeed a DF-21-based design? Wouldn't be a missile based on the DF-12 aka M20 much more suitable and easier to carry for the H-6?
> 
> 
> View attachment 490012



Some suggest that it is a more advanced variant of the M20.

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## JSCh

*科技日报 
今天 15:15 来自 微博 weibo.com*
【我国首款乘波体高超声速飞行器（星空-2）飞行试验圆满成功】3日06点41分，随着一声巨响，由中国航天科技集团有限公司第十一研究院（简称十一院）研制的星空-2火箭在西北某靶场缓缓升空，经过近10分钟飞行后，该火箭完成主动段转弯、抛罩/级间分离、试飞器释放自主飞行、弹道大机动转弯等动作，按预定弹道进入落区。此举标志着星空-2火箭飞行试验圆满成功，实现了“国内第一乘波体”的飞行壮举。

*Science and technology daily
Today 15:15 from weibo.com*
[China's first waverider hypersonic vehicle (XingKong-2) flight test was a complete success] At 6:41 on the 3rd, with a loud noise, the XingKong rocket developed by the China Aerospace Science and Technology Group Co., Ltd. The 11th Research Institute (referred to as the 11th Institute) lifted off from a target range in the northwest. After nearly 10 minutes of flight, the rocket completed the active phase turning, the fairing separation, the test vehicle separated/released for autonomous flight, large ballistic turning and other actions, ballistic entry into the landing zone as schedule. This move marked the successful completion of the XingKong-2 rocket test, and achieved the flying feat of “the first domestic waverider”.

作为十一院开展的创新研发项目，星空-2火箭飞行试验任务是在集团公司的支持下，历时三年，成功自主研制的国内首款乘波体气动布局的高超声速试验飞行器。其以空气创新技术验证为目标，实现高超声速科学研究飞行平台研制与飞行试验。该试飞器集成了疏导式热防护热系统、内外力热测量系统及转捩流动测试系统等，依托航天科工四院火箭助推系统，将之投送到预定高度，并分离自主飞行，实现临近空间高炒声速滑翔飞行，完成气动力/热、分离干扰、自然转捩/人工转捩等多项科学问题数据测量。

据了解，星空-2火箭飞行试验项目创新性强，技术难度大，挑战了多项国际前沿创新技术难题：除了首次疏导式热防护技术飞行性能验证与工程应用、低空高动压高超声速抛罩分离技术外，还实现首个乘波体布局飞行器工程化，并高超声速静不稳定飞行与弹道控制。同时，首次将微涡发生器（MVG）技术应用于火箭/试飞器级间分离流动控制，完成乘波体高超飞行器大机动转弯飞行控制与制导技术等。

十一院负责人介绍说，本次飞行试验实现了飞行试验窗口科学载荷的全通道测量，全程光测、雷测、遥测正常，试飞器飞行可控、科学数据有效，完整回收。

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## cirr

JSCh said:


> *科技日报
> 今天 15:15 来自 微博 weibo.com*
> 【我国首款乘波体高超声速飞行器（星空-2）飞行试验圆满成功】3日06点41分，随着一声巨响，由中国航天科技集团有限公司第十一研究院（简称十一院）研制的星空-2火箭在西北某靶场缓缓升空，经过近10分钟飞行后，该火箭完成主动段转弯、抛罩/级间分离、试飞器释放自主飞行、弹道大机动转弯等动作，按预定弹道进入落区。此举标志着星空-2火箭飞行试验圆满成功，实现了“国内第一乘波体”的飞行壮举。
> 
> *Science and technology daily
> Today 15:15 from weibo.com*
> [China's first waverider hypersonic vehicle (XingKong-2) flight test was a complete success] At 6:41 on the 3rd, with a loud noise, the XingKong rocket developed by the China Aerospace Science and Technology Group Co., Ltd. The 11th Research Institute (referred to as the 11th Institute) lifted off from a target range in the northwest. After nearly 10 minutes of flight, the rocket completed the active phase turning, the fairing separation, the test vehicle separated/released for autonomous flight, large ballistic turning and other actions, ballistic entry into the landing zone as schedule. This move marked the successful completion of the XingKong-2 rocket test, and achieved the flying feat of “the first domestic waverider”.
> 
> 作为十一院开展的创新研发项目，星空-2火箭飞行试验任务是在集团公司的支持下，历时三年，成功自主研制的国内首款乘波体气动布局的高超声速试验飞行器。其以空气创新技术验证为目标，实现高超声速科学研究飞行平台研制与飞行试验。该试飞器集成了疏导式热防护热系统、内外力热测量系统及转捩流动测试系统等，依托航天科工四院火箭助推系统，将之投送到预定高度，并分离自主飞行，实现临近空间高炒声速滑翔飞行，完成气动力/热、分离干扰、自然转捩/人工转捩等多项科学问题数据测量。
> 
> 据了解，星空-2火箭飞行试验项目创新性强，技术难度大，挑战了多项国际前沿创新技术难题：除了首次疏导式热防护技术飞行性能验证与工程应用、低空高动压高超声速抛罩分离技术外，还实现首个乘波体布局飞行器工程化，并高超声速静不稳定飞行与弹道控制。同时，首次将微涡发生器（MVG）技术应用于火箭/试飞器级间分离流动控制，完成乘波体高超飞行器大机动转弯飞行控制与制导技术等。
> 
> 十一院负责人介绍说，本次飞行试验实现了飞行试验窗口科学载荷的全通道测量，全程光测、雷测、遥测正常，试飞器飞行可控、科学数据有效，完整回收。



Video: https://www.bilibili.com/video/av28408204/

This is not China's but CASC's first waverider hypersonic vehicle.

It so happens that CASIC and CASC often do not recognize each other's records.

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## JSCh

XingKong-2

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## JSCh

*China tests hypersonic aircraft that can 'break any missile defense system'*
By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2018/8/5 22:43:40
*
Hypersonic aircraft can break any missile defense system: expert*

China has successfully tested its first waverider hypersonic flight vehicle, a weapon that can carry nuclear warheads and break through any current generation anti-missile defense system due to its high speed and unpredictable trajectory, Chinese experts said on Sunday.

Designed by the China Academy of Aerospace Aerodynamics under China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation, the Xingkong-2, or Starry Sky-2, was launched in a target range located in Northwest China on Friday, the academy said in a statement released on its WeChat account on Friday.

Launched in a rocket, the waverider was released in the air after about 10 minutes.

It flew independently, made large-angle turning maneuvers, and landed in the targeted area as planned.

The flight vehicle reached 30 kilometers in altitude at Mach 5.5-6, the academy said.

Waverider is a flight vehicle that flies in the atmosphere and uses shockwaves generated by its own hypersonic flight with the air to glide at high speed, Song Zhongping, a military expert and TV commentator, told the Global Times on Sunday.

Various parameters were proved and the flight vehicle was fully recovered, which marks the successful launch of Xingkong-2 and the first flight of a Chinese waverider, according to the statement.

"Announcing the successful test to the public indicates that China must have already made a technological breakthrough with the weapon," Song said.

The waverider is expected to be tested more frequently in future before being handed over for deployment to the People's Liberation Army, he said.

The current generation of anti-missile defense systems is mainly designed to intercept cruise and ballistic missiles, which are either slower or easier to predict, making them possible to intercept.

But the trajectory of a waverider is relatively unpredictable in the glide and it flies so fast that it poses an extreme challenge to current anti-missile defense systems, Song noted.

Any rocket has the potential of launching a waverider, and the waverider can carry both conventional and nuclear warheads, Song said.

Given different targets, the waverider can use different setups to be either a tactical or a strategic weapon, he noted.

"The test showed that China is advancing shoulder to shoulder with the US and Russia," Song said.

In addition to its military use, the hypersonic flight vehicle may also see civil use in the future, a military expert, who asked not to be named, told the Global Times on Sunday.

"If the hypersonic technology matures, it may see other applications including industrial transport," the expert said.

The research is a strategic investment by China, from which many possibilities may derive, according to the expert.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HJ-10 anti-tank missile

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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/5996312730/4272592573885826

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://www.guancha.cn/XiYaZhou/2018_08_26_469621_5.shtml

*Baidu Translate:*
This reminds me of the ultra-long-range air-to-air missile with a range of XXX kilometers developed by a domestic institute. This PL-1X missile adopts the design of satellite relay communication, terminal infrared, radar composite guidance and so on, which looks quite "science fiction" and its target is also a large aircraft with poor maneuverability. There is also a kind of PL-XX missile, which was developed by a certain domestic space academy and designed with variable thrust rocket, can effectively attack a high maneuvering target XXX kilometers away. It was hung under the wing of the J-16.
PL-1X and PL-XX missiles have been tested by live ammunition, and PL-XX has become one of the main equipment of the J-16.

As we mentioned earlier, China is most interested in the S-400 system is a small, long-range, high-precision 9M96 missile. But in reality, on the one hand, China now has a HQ-9B, HQ-9C, and even a new generation of air-space defense missile HQ-19, there is still a rumor stage, similar to the concept of "Patriot 3" HQ-26 or HQ-29 missiles. With these missiles, Russia's rush to sell 40N6E missiles can succeed (from the Russian attitude, China and Russia signed the S-400 agreement, should not include 40N6 missiles, so the Russian side will be anxious to sell 40N6E missiles this year), may be worth playing.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/cy18mq4jwhQUCkf7x-lirg

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

DF-21A
September 10, 2018

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

PLARF vs. PLAAF


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## cirr



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## samsara

cirr said:


> View attachment 499926


Pardon me, what is this? A TEL for the DF series?


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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Pardon me, what is this? A TEL for the DF series?


DF-41

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> DF-41


Okay, but this vehicle looks like more a mere transporter than a TEL - transporter erector launcher.


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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Okay, but this vehicle looks like more a mere transporter than a TEL - transporter erector launcher.


Yep, for logs.

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

Yes, truly, the log carrier 











__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1042771062432325633
HAPPY MID-AUTUMN FESTIVAL

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

DF-21D

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## LKJ86

HQ-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

The performance of HQ-9 is intermediate between S-300 PMU1 and PMU2.

HQ-9B is better than S-300 PMU2, but more expensive.

HQ-9C is better than S-400, but more expensive too.

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 503567
> 
> The performance of HQ-9 is intermediate between S-300 PMU1 and PMU2.
> 
> HQ-9B is better than S-300 PMU2, but more expensive.
> 
> HQ-9C is better than S-400, but more expensive too.



Where is this rumor from and is the OP credible?

====

@星海军事, is the rumored *HQ-9C* the same missile as the *HQ-2X* we talked about earlier?


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## LKJ86

HHQ-9C ~ SM-6
HQ-19 ~ THAAD-ER
HQ-26 ~ SM-3
HQ-29 ~ PAC-3MSE

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> HHQ-9C ~ SM-6
> HQ-19 ~ THAAD-ER
> HQ-26 ~ SM-3
> HQ-29 ~ PAC-3MSE



There is no such "HQ-29" designation. I also suspect that the HQ-9C and HQ-"29" is the same system.

Additionally, I don't think OP ("隼鹰") is credible; he/she isn't an insider or anything like that.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

New version of YJ-12?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

New large-scale light-weight electropult/hot canister launch system sucessfully tested 

*大干百天 决战决胜|做好最充分的准备工作，剩下的就让试验去检验！*

中国航天科工三院 今天

做好最充分的准备工作，剩下的就让试验去检验吧！”*8359所某大型轻质化发射装备*研制团队负责人回忆起当天的试验场景仍然激动不已。






*日前，8359所某大型轻质化发射装备验证试验取得圆满成功，取得了重大技术突破，创造了在箱式热发射领域发射方式新、质量重和发射推力大等多个第一*。

因为*远超同类产品的“体格”*，该产品被大家美称为“*巨无霸*”。也正因为其的大“体格”，研制团队面临的攻关难度也是前所未有的。为适应未来装车及竞争要求，8359所“两总”系统带领项目团队在竞争压力大、研制时间紧、任务难度大和资源冲突严重的形势下，群策群力、集智攻关，圆满完成了责任令任务，“巨无霸”系列产品技术水平有了较大提升，产品成功进阶。

创新牵引新发展

为适应新的装载要求，8359所该项目研制团队径直切入新型轻质化产品设计技术领域，力求以技术革新在激烈的市场竞争中赢得主动。

将产品的重量减半，最初设计人员心里完全没有底。减重不是简单的更换轻质材料。在综合考虑多种因素后，项目组锁定优化排导方案与选择多种材料双管齐下的方式实现目标。“国际首创的自排导技术是我们的看家本领，此次排导方案的优化就是跟自己较劲的成果。”技术负责人贺卫东介绍说，经项目团队充分研究确定的优化方案为产品实现自身减重打下了坚实基础。

选材是“轻量化”的另一个突破口。根据产品不同承载要求以及材料成型工艺要求，项目团队确定了材料优选方案，实现了外观的一体化效果，“厂家省模具，咱们所的优势也能发挥，降本增效何乐而不为？”这是令该项目主任设计师党海燕最为满意的一点。

仿真优化保成功

与前期相比，此次试验中验证的是最真实的发射状态，耦合仿真是难点。为满足真实产品的受力需求，受力位置需要作出调整。刚开始确定的简单调整方案经过几轮仿真验证，行不通，项目团队只好另辟蹊径，“既要考虑简单实用、又要满足要求，确保产品间的贴合”是党海燕提出的改进思路。

要攻克的重要关键技术不仅数量多，更是难在可参考借鉴的相关资料少之又少。在调研了全国十余家单位后，项目团队扎根试验室针对不同部位承载载荷要求开展验证试验，经过一轮又一轮的反复最终确定了方案，这是8359所在大型发射装备的预研创新道路上迈出的一大步。

“查阅资料、参考算例，项目组与高校老师分别使用不同的仿真工具进行仿真比对，试验的可信度就有了保障。”入所两年的航天新兵张奥林介绍说。从方案设计到详细的结构方案，再到产品实物呈现出来，产品经过了多轮仿真，复核复算工作的严格把控确保了设计的技术状态一次到位，产品一次通过试验验证成为可能。

齐心协力出妙招

设计阶段一切都准备就绪，如何把*“巨无霸”这一系列大家伙*在试验场地转运成了摆在项目团队面前的难题。产品长度长，重量大对道路载荷和路线规划要求高。在先前空车探路的基础上，项目管理调度冯大鸣和设计团队考虑随车调用一辆大铲车做运输保障。

车辆运输的当天，由于道路环境恶劣，不出所料，满载的运输车车轮发生下陷，一旁保障的铲车立刻把车拖了出来。“如果不是前期考虑周全，后果不堪设想。”8359所项目指挥刘君说起此次保障工作肯定地点了点头。

终于盼来了对接试验的这一天，然而天公似乎是在考验项目团队的意志力。操作人员刚刚揭开篷布，雨点就淅淅沥沥从天而降，“有可能是阵雨，大家先吃口饭看看雨是不是能停！”可是眼看着雨越下越大，在雨中，刘君带领着团队每人揪住篷布的一个角，生怕产品受到一点影响。试验场的风呼啸着，无论是身型娇小的女调度、还是主管前期工作的设计人员，大家紧紧抓住篷布，就这样坚持着，直到操作人员把篷布完全盖严……雨渐渐停了，试验按原计划有条不紊地推进。

试验的圆满成功离不开项目团队中奋战在各条战线上的“钢铁战士”：为确认接口准确到位，周转全国四地的设计师赵博文；为试验现场调试解困，让院总师拍手称赞的设计师李波；为保证试验环境要求，与“巨无霸”在零下十几度寒冬中共宿野外的设计师马瑾；为装配100多个测量点用热情点燃了荒凉试验场的试验人员李德明；为撑到有“熟手”来换岗，咬牙生抗病痛一天一夜的调试人员陈志强；在压缩一多半生产周期的严苛条件下，保质保量完成总装总调任务，为后续涂装和试验工作争取充足时间的总装团队等等，他们用严慎细实的工作作风挑起了“一次成功”的大任。

试验的成功只是迈出的第一步，后续推向项目应用，真真切切实现工程化还有很多工作要做。项目团队将进一步*围绕用户需求*，依托三院自主研发和可持续发展能力，抓住战略投入项目的研究支持，快速推进项目转化的脚步，以好用、管用的产品为*国防*事业提供坚强保障！“巨无霸”进阶记还在续写……

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz ... e5JzughAfDTVa6XT#rd

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## JSCh



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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

HD-1 missile system successfully completed its first supersonic cruise flight test

千龙网北京10月15日讯 广东宏大爆破股份有限公司（简称“宏大爆破”）15日晚间公告称，当日，该公司自行投资、自主研制的导弹武器系统 HD-1 项目在北方某飞行试验基地圆满完成首次超声速巡航飞行试验。

据悉，HD-1 项目采用了国际先进的固体冲压发动机技术。此次试验主要验证发射系统、导弹动力系统、飞行控制系统等技术科目。导弹出箱、转级和超声速巡航飞行各项技术指标符合试验大纲要求。

宏大爆破表示，HD-1 项目尚处于试验验证阶段，后续公司仍需对其技术及产品的适应性、稳定性、可靠性进行测试，待公司取得该项目相应生产和出口许可资质，并与客户签订批量供货合同后，公司将进行项目扩产，实现批量化生产。

Looks like private companies are also eyeing overseas markets for missile. Missile proliferation?

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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> HD-1 missile system successfully completed its first supersonic cruise flight test
> 
> 千龙网北京10月15日讯 广东宏大爆破股份有限公司（简称“宏大爆破”）15日晚间公告称，当日，该公司自行投资、自主研制的导弹武器系统 HD-1 项目在北方某飞行试验基地圆满完成首次超声速巡航飞行试验。
> 
> 据悉，HD-1 项目采用了国际先进的固体冲压发动机技术。此次试验主要验证发射系统、导弹动力系统、飞行控制系统等技术科目。导弹出箱、转级和超声速巡航飞行各项技术指标符合试验大纲要求。
> 
> 宏大爆破表示，HD-1 项目尚处于试验验证阶段，后续公司仍需对其技术及产品的适应性、稳定性、可靠性进行测试，待公司取得该项目相应生产和出口许可资质，并与客户签订批量供货合同后，公司将进行项目扩产，实现批量化生产。
> 
> Looks like private companies are also eyeing overseas markets for missile. Missile proliferation?









A CG of HD-1. BTW, Hongda is a state-owned company.

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## samsara

cirr said:


> HD-1 missile system successfully completed its first supersonic cruise flight test
> 
> 千龙网北京10月15日讯 广东宏大爆破股份有限公司（简称“宏大爆破”）15日晚间公告称，当日，该公司自行投资、自主研制的导弹武器系统 HD-1 项目在北方某飞行试验基地圆满完成首次超声速巡航飞行试验。
> 
> 据悉，HD-1 项目采用了国际先进的固体冲压发动机技术。此次试验主要验证发射系统、导弹动力系统、飞行控制系统等技术科目。导弹出箱、转级和超声速巡航飞行各项技术指标符合试验大纲要求。
> 
> 宏大爆破表示，HD-1 项目尚处于试验验证阶段，后续公司仍需对其技术及产品的适应性、稳定性、可靠性进行测试，待公司取得该项目相应生产和出口许可资质，并与客户签订批量供货合同后，公司将进行项目扩产，实现批量化生产。
> 
> Looks like private companies are also eyeing overseas markets for missile. Missile proliferation?


From the tweet of Henri Kenhmann (East Pendulum) on 2018-10-16:

“HD-1, the new missile equipped with solid propellant ramjet and developed by HongDa Blasting, a national company specialized in mining and mine blasting, seems to have flown its maiden flight from Dingxing Air base. The NOTAMs testified to that.”







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1051902444874096640

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## cirr

星海军事 said:


> View attachment 505513
> 
> 
> A CG of HD-1. BTW, Hongda is a state-owned company.



Hongda(stock code 002683) is a publicly traded company, it may be stated-controlled but definitey not state-owned. You can be a proud part owner of the company today if you so decide.

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## LKJ86




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## 星海军事

cirr said:


> Hongda(stock code 002683) is a publicly traded company, it may be stated-controlled but definitey not state-owned. You can be a proud part owner of the company today if you so decide.


广东宏大爆破股份有限公司创建于1988年，是广东省国资委下属广东省广业集团有限公司控股企业
http://www.hdbp.com/about.php?cid=45

The government being a relative holding stockholders does not change the fact that it is a state-owned company.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> View attachment 505513
> 
> 
> A CG of HD-1. BTW, Hongda is a state-owned company.



Why are they calling this a "cruise missile"?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Zarvan

China Develops Competitor to BrahMos Cruise Missile
A Chinese firm yesterday tested a ramjet powered- missile, HD-1 which it claims is a rival to the Indo-Russian BrahMos supersonic cruise missile.

Suggesting that the missile would target the potential market of BrahMos, a Chinese export was quoted by the Global Times publication as saying, “the BrahMos missile is a more expensive, less useful supersonic cruise missile developed by India and Russia. Besides BrahMos can only be sold to ‘responsible’ countries friendly with both India and Russia.”

The Guangdong Hongda Blasting Company (GHBC), which makes propellants for the mining industry said it had completed a successful supersonic missile flight test on Monday. The test in North China verified the launch, power and flight control systems, according to a GBHC statement on Monday quoted in various Chinese media.

All parameters for the supersonic cruising flight of the HD-1 missile achieved their estimated values, the statement said adding that GBHC independently invested in and developed the HD-1 as a private venture and part of China’s military-civilian integration.

The HD-1's advanced solid fuel ramjet needs less fuel than its competitors, rendering the lighter missile able to fly faster and farther. After governmental approval, GBHC intends to sign deals and mass-produce the HD-1 for export.

GBHC is a mining company based in Guangzhou, capital of South China's Guangdong Province that also manufactures blasting and military equipment, according to the company website. The company is expected to showcase the missile in Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai in November.



Pakistan and certain Middle Eastern countries are likely to show interest given the weapon's potential to break anti-missile systems at supersonic speeds.

The HD-1 cruise missile system consists of missile, launcher, command and control unit, target indication and comprehensive support systems. The HD-1 can be adapted to aircraft and ships as well as the basic ground-based vehicle version, the company said.

The total investment in the HD-1 project is expected to top 1.3 billion yuan ($188 million).

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/23...valing_Supersonic_Cruise_Missile#.W8cicGgzZPY

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## war&peace

Zarvan said:


> The total investment in the HD-1 project is expected to top 1.3 billion yuan ($188 million).


Not a big deal vs USD 5 billion for S400. Pakistan should pay this money and get it on ToT basis so we can produce the next version with a longer range.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

The PLAAF is in the process of turning its air defence branch into an integrated missile and aerospace defence force(meaning the deployments of a new family of HQ-XXs continue to gather pace?).

https://www.bilibili.com/video/av34138520

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> The PLAAF is in the process of turning its air defence branch into an integrated missile and aerospace defence force(meaning the deployments of a new family of HQ-XXs continue to gather pace?).
> 
> https://www.bilibili.com/video/av34138520



The question becomes what the "HQ-XX" refers to: HQ-2X? HQ-19? GB-1/2/3? Something new?


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## The Ronin

Last 15 October, China-based Guangdong Hongda Blasting Company claimed that it had successfully tested a new supersonic cruise missile not intended for the PLA but for export, as reported by The Diplomat. Guangdong Hongda Blasting Company has not designed and manufactured missiles prior to the HD-1. Total company investment into the HD-1 program has been $188 million, according to Hongda.






Hongda said that “All parameters for the supersonic cruising flight of the HD-1 missile achieved their estimated objectives”. The test launch aimed to check the HD-1’s launch, power and flight control systems. The company did not reveal additional details about the test or the missile.

Hongda claims that the HD-1 uses “advanced solid-fuel ramjet technology” and will be available to international customers in air-, ground-, and sea-launched variants. “The HD-1’s advanced solid fuel ramjet needs less fuel than its competitors, rendering the lighter missile able to fly faster and farther,” Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, was quoted by the Global Times as saying. “The test flight shows that the HD-1’s core components are now mature, with its aerodynamic design, materials and overall structure already proven viable.”

The HD-1 program is still in an “experimental verification stage” and the company will still need to be granted an export license by the Chinese government, after which the company is set to begin serial production. The HD-1’s three-stage engine was reportedly first tested in horizontal configuration in May. The short time interval between engine tests and the HD-1s first launch is noteworthy and may suggest the involvement of an international partner or another Chinese defense contractor.

Chinese military analysts have already touted the HD-1 as superior to the BrahMos supersonic cruise missile, a joint venture between India’s Defense Research Development Organization and Russian rocket design bureau NPO Mashinostroyeniya. “The BrahMos missile is a more expensive, less useful supersonic cruise missile developed by India and Russia,” Wei Dongxu told the Global Times on October 16. “Pakistan and Middle Eastern countries are likely to show interest given the weapon’s potential to break anti-missile systems at supersonic speeds,” he added.

China’s defense industry is also continuing to work on other supersonic cruise missile specifically designed for export, such as the CM-302 or the Chaoxun-1 (CX-1), unveiled in 2016 and 2014 respectively. The latter is available in two variants: the CX-1A ship-borne system and CX-1B road-mobile land-based system. To date, no international customer has been identified for either missile.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/oct...Ar64reyV4HkVF_DBf6VPz4nSr_AcUvYoGqBm88H40X3qA

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

HQ-X6/HQ-6X 

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=Mj...=1&scene=23&srcid=1023i8AKuT5jH9dMXQG3DWfF#rd

HQ-26? 

Anyway a new member is about to join the HQ family.

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## Akasa

cirr said:


> HQ-X6/HQ-6X
> 
> https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=Mj...=1&scene=23&srcid=1023i8AKuT5jH9dMXQG3DWfF#rd
> 
> HQ-26?
> 
> Anyway a new member is about to join the HQ family.



What about the article makes you think that this is a HQ-XX member?


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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 507609
> View attachment 507610


Nice pics. What type of missile is this?

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Nice pics. What type of missile is this?


DF-31AG and DF-21D

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16B

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

So, tell us a bit more about this *HQ-8* anti-AWACS SAM: @星海军事


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## Ultima Thule

Akasa said:


> HQ-8


HQ-8 @Beast , @wanglaokan ,@cirr please clarify what is HQ-8, never heard of it


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## ozranger

On a Solid-Liquid Rocket Ramjet to hit an AWACS 400km away.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1058432254333018112

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## ZeEa5KPul

What exactly is meant by "solid-liquid rocket ramjet"? I have a layman's understanding of how the integral rocket ramjet on the YJ-12 works. It's a brilliant idea that takes advantage of the fact that ramjets have no moving parts: the combustion chamber and intakes of the ramjet are packed with solid rocket fuel. In the initial stage it functions like a regular rocket and accelerates the missile, but once the rocket fuel burns away the chamber and intakes are clear and the ramjet engine kicks in. That is some really clever sh*t.

Does this HQ-8 work in a similar way? Is it a YJ-12 of the skies?

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## Akasa

ZeEa5KPul said:


> What exactly is meant by "solid-liquid rocket ramjet"? I have a layman's understanding of how the integral rocket ramjet on the YJ-12 works. It's a brilliant idea that takes advantage of the fact that ramjets have no moving parts: the combustion chamber and intakes of the ramjet are packed with solid rocket fuel. In the initial stage it functions like a regular rocket and accelerates the missile, but once the rocket fuel burns away the chamber and intakes are clear and the ramjet engine kicks in. That is some really clever sh*t.
> 
> Does this HQ-8 work in a similar way? Is it a YJ-12 of the skies?



Yes; the booster of the missile is integrated into the ramjet system, both saving space and allowing efficient acceleration to the speeds required for ramjets to function. The other missile that supposedly uses this configuration is the surface-launched YJ-12/CM-302.


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## ozranger

ZeEa5KPul said:


> What exactly is meant by "solid-liquid rocket ramjet"? I have a layman's understanding of how the integral rocket ramjet on the YJ-12 works. It's a brilliant idea that takes advantage of the fact that ramjets have no moving parts: the combustion chamber and intakes of the ramjet are packed with solid rocket fuel. In the initial stage it functions like a regular rocket and accelerates the missile, but once the rocket fuel burns away the chamber and intakes are clear and the ramjet engine kicks in. That is some really clever sh*t.
> 
> Does this HQ-8 work in a similar way? Is it a YJ-12 of the skies?



That's what it meant to be. The rocket is a solid fuel rocket. The liquid will be consumed by the ramjet after the rocket being separated from the missile. Using liquid fuel makes it easier to adjust the thrust of the ramjet dynamically during the flight and hence obtain longer flight distance.

I don't know whether it is like sort of a YJ-12 on the skies. That's why I am pretty intrigued about the shape of the missile. It'd be very interesting.


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> So, tell us a bit more about this *HQ-8* anti-AWACS SAM: @星海军事
> 
> View attachment 512344



It is not SAM but a member of our old friend -- the famous Weishi family.

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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> It is not SAM but a member of our old friend -- the famous Weishi family.



I just found out it's the WS-600L SRBM system.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> It is not SAM but a member of our old friend -- the famous Weishi family.



But do you know if this could possibly be related to the actual HQ-8/19/26/2X?


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## LKJ86



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## cirr

CM-401 hypersonic anti-ship missile

Range 15-290km
Max. speed Mach 6
















as apposed to YJ-XX with a range of 1000km at Mach 10 max.

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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> But do you know if this could possibly be related to the actual HQ-8/19/26/2X?


No. They are products of different companies.

BTW, both "HQ-8" rumor and 1000km/Ma10 "YJ-XX" rumor brought up above came from the same source.

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## Beast

cirr said:


> CM-401 hypersonic anti-ship missile
> 
> Range 15-290km
> Max. speed Mach 6
> 
> View attachment 512978
> 
> 
> View attachment 512980
> 
> 
> View attachment 512979
> 
> 
> as apposed to YJ-XX with a range of 1000km at Mach 10 max.


Obviously the range is purposely limited to fulfill international export restriction....


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## ozranger

cirr said:


> CM-401 hypersonic anti-ship missile
> 
> Range 15-290km
> Max. speed Mach 6
> 
> View attachment 512978
> 
> 
> View attachment 512980
> 
> 
> View attachment 512979
> 
> 
> as apposed to YJ-XX with a range of 1000km at Mach 10 max.



Export some of it with stealth UAVs to developing countries!!! They are not having massive satellite constellations like China. So UAVs can help target something like aircraft carriers and the customer can use this missile to hit it.


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> No. They are products of different companies.
> 
> BTW, both "HQ-8" rumor and 1000km/Ma10 "YJ-XX" rumor brought up above came from the same source.



So neither the HQ-8 nor YJ-XX exists?


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## 星海军事

Akasa said:


> So neither the HQ-8 nor YJ-XX exists?


HQ-8 does exist and was developed by the Second Research Institute of CASIC, while the WS family is developed by the Seventh Research Institute of CASC.


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## ZeEa5KPul

星海军事 said:


> HQ-8 does exist and was developed by the Second Research Institute of CASIC, while the WS family is developed by the Seventh Research Institute of CASC.


Does the HQ-8 use a rocket/ramjet hybrid like Henri Kenhmann reported when he misidentified this missile?


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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> HQ-8 does exist and was developed by the Second Research Institute of CASIC, while the WS family is developed by the Seventh Research Institute of CASC.



Interesting; when can we expect to see the initial deployment and/or production of the HQ-8 and the other "new HQ" missiles (HQ-9C, HQ-19, HQ-26, & HQ-2X)?


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## samsara

It's bizarre to see some persona like Akasa / SinoSoldier having such deeply seated contempt over the nation of China and its political system as well as its progress and strength to maintain such curiosity to know the latest... looks like quite an antagonistic attitude  or does he want to boast his standing in the SDF by soliciting the info here then crediting to none  lol... What a cunning habit!

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## 星海军事

ZeEa5KPul said:


> Does the HQ-8 use a rocket/ramjet hybrid like Henri Kenhmann reported when he misidentified this missile?



Henri is right about the rocket/ramjet hybrid engine. HQ-8 is a two-stage missile with the hybrid engine as the second stage. The solid rocket in the hybrid engine of HQ-8 needs to work during almost the whole flight of the missile, which is different from the one in the integral rocket/ramjet of YJ-12.



Akasa said:


> Interesting; when can we expect to see the initial deployment and/or production of the HQ-8 and the other "new HQ" missiles (HQ-9C, HQ-19, HQ-26, & HQ-2X)?



You know I am not the one All-Knowing, right?

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## Path-Finder

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1058877285028159488
what does it say about HQ16?

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

M20


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## LKJ86



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## HRK

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 514008
> View attachment 514009
> View attachment 514010


any details about these systems


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 514996


Looks like YJ-18.


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## LKJ86

Beast said:


> Looks like YJ-18.


YJ-12

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## serenity

Nice photo of YJ-12. Already not the best Chinese antiship missile and already better than Brahmos and Yakhont. Russia offered Yakhont/ Onyx type missile in 00s but China turned it down. Maybe it is very impressive or just improvement over Moskit but not enough to buy. Instead PLAN just improved Moskit idea of rocket then ramjet for solid fuel rocket boost followed by liquid fuel ramjet flight that allows missile to change throttle and speed. This happened concurrently while real next generation is being developed which according to close sources say started late 90s already. Now they have much longer ranges than these 200km missiles and even higher speeds. Antiship ballistic missile they think should work well but very expensive for effectiveness that these next gen can almost replicate while untested as well but more method means better chances than less means. China's development is from worrying that USA will start a war before 2020 and keeping the navy far away we need better range, speed, variety and launching platform. YJ-12 and YJ-18 seem new but have been around for many years already and they are stopgaps for next generation antiship missiles. All concentrated around mission to sink carriers. Submarines are much harder problem to solve and so far nothing promising. Only thing keeping USA away is nuclear warheads. Some biological and chemical weapons are even scarier and more effective in stopping USA than China's entire thermonuclear + neutron bomb stockpile. That's already old toys. Old but effective. Chinese leaders are worried that USA won't fight conventional war with China but just straight away do first strike without warning. So a lot of energy and money being spent on making sure there's enough warning for China to make sure they take USA to hell before we get hit. That's USA's best plan so far but I don't know if they can disable all detection sites. They have experimented with different ways of disabling China and some sources claim USA's final plan is just to destroy China completely after making up good excuses. Their media already doing that job.

China's life at this moment is very threatened by USA. China has no way or point to kill USA but opposite is not true. I still don't understand why Chinese leaders don't just give all major weapon secrets to Iran, North Korea, Pakistan and any country against USA. Don't give away all the top secrets but just give them best hydrogen bomb weapons and some other WMD as life insurance. This way if USA kills China suddenly in one shot, they have to deal with other guys who can maybe retaliate and also this gives them more headache and need to spend resources on solving those problems. USA sells good weapons to Taiwan, Japan and is happy to supply India who is their new best friend against China. Indians are happy to play this part because they hate Chinese and Communists. This will give China enough time to improve more and hopefully make sure USA will never be able to kill China without being killed 100%. Right now it's still a maybe.

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## Beast

serenity said:


> Nice photo of YJ-12. Already not the best Chinese antiship missile and already better than Brahmos and Yakhont. Russia offered Yakhont/ Onyx type missile in 00s but China turned it down. Maybe it is very impressive or just improvement over Moskit but not enough to buy. Instead PLAN just improved Moskit idea of rocket then ramjet for solid fuel rocket boost followed by liquid fuel ramjet flight that allows missile to change throttle and speed. This happened concurrently while real next generation is being developed which according to close sources say started late 90s already. Now they have much longer ranges than these 200km missiles and even higher speeds. Antiship ballistic missile they think should work well but very expensive for effectiveness that these next gen can almost replicate while untested as well but more method means better chances than less means. China's development is from worrying that USA will start a war before 2020 and keeping the navy far away we need better range, speed, variety and launching platform. YJ-12 and YJ-18 seem new but have been around for many years already and they are stopgaps for next generation antiship missiles. All concentrated around mission to sink carriers. Submarines are much harder problem to solve and so far nothing promising. Only thing keeping USA away is nuclear warheads. Some biological and chemical weapons are even scarier and more effective in stopping USA than China's entire thermonuclear + neutron bomb stockpile. That's already old toys. Old but effective. Chinese leaders are worried that USA won't fight conventional war with China but just straight away do first strike without warning. So a lot of energy and money being spent on making sure there's enough warning for China to make sure they take USA to hell before we get hit. That's USA's best plan so far but I don't know if they can disable all detection sites. They have experimented with different ways of disabling China and some sources claim USA's final plan is just to destroy China completely after making up good excuses. Their media already doing that job.
> 
> China's life at this moment is very threatened by USA. China has no way or point to kill USA but opposite is not true. I still don't understand why Chinese leaders don't just give all major weapon secrets to Iran, North Korea, Pakistan and any country against USA. Don't give away all the top secrets but just give them best hydrogen bomb weapons and some other WMD as life insurance. This way if USA kills China suddenly in one shot, they have to deal with other guys who can maybe retaliate and also this gives them more headache and need to spend resources on solving those problems. USA sells good weapons to Taiwan, Japan and is happy to supply India who is their new best friend against China. Indians are happy to play this part because they hate Chinese and Communists. This will give China enough time to improve more and hopefully make sure USA will never be able to kill China without being killed 100%. Right now it's still a maybe.


American only dare to take on small countries. The chances of American going to start a war with China is very low. American congress despite being very aggressive are still rule by sounded headed people who do not wish to see the end of world. China is a country with proven 3 mega ton miniature nuke warhead. Same as USA and Russia that has never started war with each other.

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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

The BP-12B can also be used as an anti-ship ballistic missile, making it one of three systems of the ASBM category at this year's Zhuhai airshow. The other two systems are the CM-401 and A/MGG-20B (aka M-20B).

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## LKJ86

The export versions of HQ-9B and HQ-16B

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## LKJ86

The video of FD-41: https://m.weibo.cn/3181052590/4304428431153966

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## war&peace

Good question. I think to deliver Chinese green tea at a distance quickly while it is still hot.

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## HariPrasad

Machism said:


> Why China has ICBM missiles that can hit targets 10,000 to 14,000 kilometers away?
> 
> Read more: https://www.sinodefenceforum.com[/QUtQOTE]
> That depends on load. China has quoted JL2 range of 7000 km with just 700 kg load while india quotes k4 range with 2000 kg +. China is master in inflating figures whether it is GDP or missile range


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## Akasa

HariPrasad said:


> That depends on load. China has quoted JL2 range of 7000 km with just 700 kg load while india quotes k4 range with 2000 kg +. China is master in inflating figures whether it is GDP or missile range



The JL-2 has a range of 7400-8000 km as per Western sources. Do you have any sources that can confirm the JL-2's payload being 700 kg and the K4's 2000 kg?


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## LKJ86



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## HariPrasad

Akasa said:


> The JL-2 has a range of 7400-8000 km as per Western sources. Do you have any sources that can confirm the JL-2's payload being 700 kg and the K4's 2000 kg?




Ofcorse I have the sources.

*Specifications*
ContractorAcademy of Rocket Motors Technology - ARMTConfigurationThree StageLength [meters]10+Diameter [meters]2.0Mass [kilograms]20,000+PropellantSolidGuidanceInertialFirst Flight19IOC19DeploymentType 094 SSBNRange (km)7,500-8,000Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg)700 kgWarhead Yield3 or 4 MIRV @ 90 kT
1 @ 250-1000 kTCEP (meters)500 ??

https://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/china/jl-2.htm

The 12 metre tall *missile* weighs around 17 tonnes and can carry a warhead weighing up to *2,000 kg*. The*missile* is powered by solid *rocket*propellant. Russia, US, France, UK and China which have the capability of firing nuclear tipped *missiles* from air, land and undersea.Jan 3, 2018

K Series of submarine-launched missile - A sneak peek into India's missile firepower | The Economic Times
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com › ...


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## Akasa

HariPrasad said:


> Ofcorse I have the sources.
> 
> *Specifications*
> ContractorAcademy of Rocket Motors Technology - ARMTConfigurationThree StageLength [meters]10+Diameter [meters]2.0Mass [kilograms]20,000+PropellantSolidGuidanceInertialFirst Flight19IOC19DeploymentType 094 SSBNRange (km)7,500-8,000Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg)700 kgWarhead Yield3 or 4 MIRV @ 90 kT
> 1 @ 250-1000 kTCEP (meters)500 ??
> 
> https://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/china/jl-2.htm
> 
> The 12 metre tall *missile* weighs around 17 tonnes and can carry a warhead weighing up to *2,000 kg*. The*missile* is powered by solid *rocket*propellant. Russia, US, France, UK and China which have the capability of firing nuclear tipped *missiles* from air, land and undersea.Jan 3, 2018
> 
> K Series of submarine-launched missile - A sneak peek into India's missile firepower | The Economic Times
> https://economictimes.indiatimes.com › ...



I wouldn't use Global Security as an authoritative source for anything relating to ICBMs; they pool their "sources" from everything including blogs and the like.

As for the warhead masses, just because a missile is capable of carrying XXXX kilograms doesn't mean it can do so at the range stated.


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## Kailash Kumar

Chinese firm unveils new cruise missile

Could be cost-effective aircraft carrier killer: expert

2018/11/9





Photo of an HD-1 supersonic cruise missile at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province. 






Interior of an HD-1 supersonic cruise missile at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province. 






Hongda Blasting staff members introduce the HD-1 supersonic cruise missile to a foreign customer at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province.

Chinese mining company Guangdong Hongda Blasting revealed technical details of its recently tested supersonic cruise missile, HD-1, at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province, leading a military expert to believe it could be a cost-efficient aircraft carrier killer and fleet demolisher.

The made-for-export HD-1 debuted at the air show, which runs from Tuesday to Sunday.

The missile uses a solid-propellant ramjet and can reach targets 290 kilometers away at a speed of Mach 2.2 to 3.5, according to the description the company released at the show.

Weighing 2,200 kilograms, the weapon can fly as high as 15 kilometers and as low as 5-10 meters when sea skimming, the description said.

The company claims it takes less than 5 minutes to prepare for a launch, and less than 10 seconds to launch a second one.

It can accurately hit ground and sea targets, the company said.

Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, told the Global Times on Friday that the flight speed and altitudes make the HD-1 very difficult to intercept.

"It could be an awesome aircraft carrier killer," Wei said.

"A saturated attack by the HD-1 can even demolish an entire fleet," he said.

The HD-1 can be launched from a land-based transport erection and launch vehicle (TEL), which was also displayed at the show.

One TEL can be loaded with 6 missiles, which can be fired with a single push of a button. The vehicle adopts an 8x8 all-wheel chassis, making it very mobile and can withdraw within 3 minutes after launch, ensuring its strong battlefield survivability, the company said.

In addition to the basic version, the company also introduced the HD-1A, an HD-1 variant that can be launched in the air by fighter jets and bombers and has similar capabilities.

The HD-1 can also be launched from a ship, the company said.

Capable of being used on multiple platforms is a major selling point of this weapon, Wei noted.

The missile was successfully tested in October. Military experts said it has the potential to rival the BrahMos missile jointly developed by India and Russia.

Wei said that the HD-1's capability has already surpassed early versions of the BrahMos. He expects the price of the Chinese missile to be significantly lower than similar products on the international arms market.

Many foreign military representatives stopped by the HD-1 at the air show. Some of them made inquiries to staff members, the Global Times noted.

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1126731.shtml

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## BHarwana

Seems like a scramjet powered.


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## Ultima Thule

BHarwana said:


> Seems like a scramjet powered.


Ramjet cruise speed is/will be at mach-3.4, scramjet is for hypersonic speed Mach-5 and above @BHarwana

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## BHarwana

pakistanipower said:


> Ramjet cruise speed is/will be at mach-3.4, scramjet is for hypersonic speed Mach-5 and above @BHarwana


What is the minimum speed needed for ramjet please first check it and correct your provided info because you are misinformed.


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## Ultima Thule

BHarwana said:


> What is the minimum speed needed for ramjet please first check it and correct your provided info because you are misinformed.


uo're misinformed than me i already did lot of research on this topic Under MACH-5 missiles uses RAMJET and above MACH-5 missile uses SCRAMJET @BHarwana 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramjet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramjet


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## Figaro

Machism said:


> Why China has ICBM missiles that can hit targets 10,000 to 14,000 kilometers away?
> 
> Read more: https://www.sinodefenceforum.com


You are the exact same guy who's been posting this crap on SDF. Why create such useless threads? If you really want to know why China has ICBMs, maybe you should think about it yourself.



HariPrasad said:


> Ofcorse I have the sources.
> 
> *Specifications*
> ContractorAcademy of Rocket Motors Technology - ARMTConfigurationThree StageLength [meters]10+Diameter [meters]2.0Mass [kilograms]20,000+PropellantSolidGuidanceInertialFirst Flight19IOC19DeploymentType 094 SSBNRange (km)7,500-8,000Re-entry Vehicle Mass (kg)700 kgWarhead Yield3 or 4 MIRV @ 90 kT
> 1 @ 250-1000 kTCEP (meters)500 ??
> 
> https://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/china/jl-2.htm
> 
> The 12 metre tall *missile* weighs around 17 tonnes and can carry a warhead weighing up to *2,000 kg*. The*missile* is powered by solid *rocket*propellant. Russia, US, France, UK and China which have the capability of firing nuclear tipped *missiles* from air, land and undersea.Jan 3, 2018
> 
> K Series of submarine-launched missile - A sneak peek into India's missile firepower | The Economic Times
> https://economictimes.indiatimes.com › ...


And explain to us how Global Security is by any means a credible source?

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## Yaseen1

Best submarine icbm is u.s ,u.k trident then russian bulava china needs to prove its capability of submarine launched icbm as tests are very limited


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## Figaro

Yaseen1 said:


> Best submarine icbm is u.s ,u.k trident then russian bulava china needs to prove its capability of submarine launched icbm as tests are very limited


How can you prove the Chinese haven't conducted many SLBM tests? Just because they are not revealed publicly does not mean the Chinese did not test them. In fact, you have to dig deep for many Chinese ICBM tests, let alone SLBM tests.

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## Yaseen1

Figaro said:


> How can you prove the Chinese haven't conducted many SLBM tests? Just because they are not revealed publicly does not mean the Chinese did not test them. In fact, you have to dig deep for many Chinese ICBM tests, let alone SLBM tests.


China land based icbm are revealed to public like df41 test videos are revealed but there is no video evidence of submarine icbm test


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## Akasa

Yaseen1 said:


> China land based icbm are revealed to public like df41 test videos are revealed but there is no video evidence of submarine icbm test



There are no DF-41 test videos.

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## Foxtrot Delta

it would be stupid if chinese didn't work on contigency plans against united states , Russia and europe. these dont need to be public but china should have capability to bring anyone to its knees if they pick fight. even if all come together in a pack.


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## lonelyman

Jyotish Kailashkumar said:


> Chinese firm unveils new cruise missile
> 
> Could be cost-effective aircraft carrier killer: expert
> 
> 2018/11/9
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Photo of an HD-1 supersonic cruise missile at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Interior of an HD-1 supersonic cruise missile at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hongda Blasting staff members introduce the HD-1 supersonic cruise missile to a foreign customer at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province.
> 
> Chinese mining company Guangdong Hongda Blasting revealed technical details of its recently tested supersonic cruise missile, HD-1, at the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province, leading a military expert to believe it could be a cost-efficient aircraft carrier killer and fleet demolisher.
> 
> The made-for-export HD-1 debuted at the air show, which runs from Tuesday to Sunday.
> 
> The missile uses a solid-propellant ramjet and can reach targets 290 kilometers away at a speed of Mach 2.2 to 3.5, according to the description the company released at the show.
> 
> Weighing 2,200 kilograms, the weapon can fly as high as 15 kilometers and as low as 5-10 meters when sea skimming, the description said.
> 
> The company claims it takes less than 5 minutes to prepare for a launch, and less than 10 seconds to launch a second one.
> 
> It can accurately hit ground and sea targets, the company said.
> 
> Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, told the Global Times on Friday that the flight speed and altitudes make the HD-1 very difficult to intercept.
> 
> "It could be an awesome aircraft carrier killer," Wei said.
> 
> "A saturated attack by the HD-1 can even demolish an entire fleet," he said.
> 
> The HD-1 can be launched from a land-based transport erection and launch vehicle (TEL), which was also displayed at the show.
> 
> One TEL can be loaded with 6 missiles, which can be fired with a single push of a button. The vehicle adopts an 8x8 all-wheel chassis, making it very mobile and can withdraw within 3 minutes after launch, ensuring its strong battlefield survivability, the company said.
> 
> In addition to the basic version, the company also introduced the HD-1A, an HD-1 variant that can be launched in the air by fighter jets and bombers and has similar capabilities.
> 
> The HD-1 can also be launched from a ship, the company said.
> 
> Capable of being used on multiple platforms is a major selling point of this weapon, Wei noted.
> 
> The missile was successfully tested in October. Military experts said it has the potential to rival the BrahMos missile jointly developed by India and Russia.
> 
> Wei said that the HD-1's capability has already surpassed early versions of the BrahMos. He expects the price of the Chinese missile to be significantly lower than similar products on the international arms market.
> 
> Many foreign military representatives stopped by the HD-1 at the air show. Some of them made inquiries to staff members, the Global Times noted.
> 
> http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1126731.shtml



Haha Indians bragging Bahamos -  even our never-heard-of a private mining company can easily develop a better missile


----------



## BHarwana

pakistanipower said:


> uo're misinformed than me i already did lot of research on this topic Under MACH-5 missiles uses RAMJET and above MACH-5 missile uses SCRAMJET @BHarwana
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scramjet
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramjet



I asked what is the minimum speed for ramjet. Is it a wrong question?


----------



## Ultima Thule

BHarwana said:


> I asked what is the minimum speed for ramjet. Is it a wrong question?


Mach-1 for initiating a ramjet @BHarwana


----------



## Basel

A thread is already running on HD-1 missile, why another thread is being created??

@waz @The Eagle please merge this thread with already running one.


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## LKJ86

Machism said:


> See DF-31 and DF-41 getting fired at the link


If you can find DF-41getting fired at the link, it will be a headline news.

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## Akasa

Machism said:


> See DF-31 and DF-41 getting fired at the link



There are no videos of the DF-41 being launched, period.

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## HariPrasad

Figaro said:


> You are the exact same guy who's been posting this crap on SDF. Why create such useless threads? If you really want to know why China has ICBMs, maybe you should think about it yourself.
> 
> 
> And explain to us how Global Security is by any means a credible source?



I am not in a business to covience people with prejudice mind. If that is not true, quote whatever reference is ok according to you.


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## Broccoli

Machism said:


> Why China has ICBM missiles that can hit targets 10,000 to 14,000 kilometers away?



For the same reason why US and Russia have them... so they can nuke each others.

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## ozranger

Broccoli said:


> For the same reason why US and Russia have them... so they can nuke each others.



More specifically they want to make sure that they can wipe out the US for at least once. For Russia they already have more than enough intermediate range missiles.


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## khanasifm

LKJ86 said:


> The export versions of HQ-9B and HQ-16B
> View attachment 517027
> View attachment 517028



Theater Ballistic Missile TBM defense / intercept capability ??


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## LKJ86



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## Figaro

lonelyman said:


> Haha Indians bragging Bahamos -  even our never-heard-of a private mining company can easily develop a better missile


Brahmos is a Russian missile with an Indian label ... the former basically did all the technological development while the latter supplied the money.

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## LKJ86

HQ-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

YJ-12A & YJ-12B

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## LKJ86

HQ-16A

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## LKJ86

HQ-17

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## LKJ86

The video of PLARF: http://v.ifeng.com/201811/video_29222145.shtml

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> The video of PLARF: http://v.ifeng.com/201811/video_29222145.shtml


Thanks for the link, it's a cool short footage of 20MB: “PLARF real missile shots round the clock as if meteors flying across the sky” — Phoenix Video (Ifeng)
大国重锤：实拍“火箭军”导弹昼夜发射 长剑飞天似彗星划过-凤凰网视频-最具媒体品质的综合视频门户

Cannot locate the date but guess it's a new footage released within Nov 2018.


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## Deino

Do we have any recent news on the PL-XX ultra-long-range AAM? If I remember correctly, then the final image is from 2016 during the Red Sword exercise, when it was seen under a J-11B.


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Do we have any recent news on the PL-XX ultra-long-range AAM? If I remember correctly, then the final image is from 2016 during the Red Sword exercise, when it was seen under a J-11B.


I suppose you might have misread something.


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> I suppose you might have misread something.




Care to explain what I might have misread?

Best,
Deino


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Care to explain what I might have misread?
> 
> Best,
> Deino



It will be easier if you could repost the image.


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> It will be easier if you could repost the image.




This one??


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> This one??
> 
> View attachment 523347


Thank you. I believe it is an overlapping of two missiles.


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> Thank you. I believe it is an overlapping of two missiles.




Surely could be and esp difficult to decide due to the low resolution. However a missile of that dimension/diameter is IMO unlikely a PL-12, and we have never seen two PL-12s under the J-11Bs wings ... and a PL-12 + a PL-8 would result in some distortions due to the different fins.


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Surely could be and esp difficult to decide due to the low resolution. However a missile of that dimension/diameter is IMO unlikely a PL-12, and we have never seen two PL-12s under the J-11Bs wings ... and a PL-12 + a PL-8 would result in some distortions due to the different fins.



I did count those in. The image is still too small and blurry for us to make that decision.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

YJ-21 etc. etc. 

将发明的镁稀土合金与创新的工艺结合，首次实现了大型复杂高性能镁稀土合金航天与航空主承力结构部件设计与制造。研制了30余种大型复杂国防关键部件，其中实现(型号)典型应用的有：089专项xx飞行器三角翼，已成功试验多次，累计供货20件；新型Z20直升机机匣50余套，XX反坦克导弹壳体已转让批量生产，累计供货近万件，均为世界首次。xx导弹用FS-x涡扇发动机中介机匣40余套、*YJ-21*导弹舱30余套、HQ16导弹舱体50余套，均已实现批量供货。已经完成研制的有：xxx战机导弹弹射架完成飞行试验，单机实现减重60公斤;空天飞机系列部件20余套，均实现减重25%以上。

http://sklcm.sjtu.edu.cn/chengguo_content.asp?id=54

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16
> View attachment 527797
> View attachment 527798
> View attachment 527799
> View attachment 527800
> View attachment 527801
> View attachment 527802
> View attachment 527803
> View attachment 527804
> View attachment 527805


Video:https://m.weibo.cn/1296738653/4319318253072157

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## JSCh

*China has experienced s-400*
By Andry Kut
21.12.2018






Archived fotofoto: Ministry of defense / RIA Novosti​
The people’s liberation army (PLA) conducted the first test bought from Russian anti-aircraft missile system s-400, told TASS military-diplomatic source.

“The test firing took place in the first week of December in the Chinese landfill with one of the two battalions of s-400, purchased from Russia. Released fire unit system 48N6E missile struck the ballistic target flying at the speed of three kilometers per second,” — said the source.

According to the source, target at maximum range (about 250 kilometers), and the tests were carried out “in a setting of notional enemy to the strong interference”.

China became the first foreign buyer of s-400 “Triumph”. All China needs to obtain two regimental sets of s-400, the first of which the country adopted in may.


http://handofmoscow.com/2018/12/21/china-has-experienced-s-400/

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## LKJ86

HQ-9

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## LKJ86

DF-15B

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-17

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## Crystal-Clear

.
.
a flying Di**o for China's enemy ....

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## Crystal-Clear

Machism said:


> China to make 1000 DF-31 ICBM missiles


1000 ? u sure?


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## Figaro

Crystal-Clear said:


> 1000 ? u sure?


No way


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## Feng Leng

It's time to race to nuclear parity!

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## ozranger

Feng Leng said:


> It's time to race to nuclear parity!



Half of the America's should be good enough.


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## LKJ86

The video of DF-10A:
https://m.weibo.cn/6393904893/4323697987300939

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## Brainsucker

Machism said:


> China to make 1000 DF-31 ICBM missiles https://www.sinodefenceforum.com



LOL, you're being banned, permanently, in SDF; by the same mod that take care of this sub forum.

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## Figaro

Brainsucker said:


> LOL, you're being banned, permanently, in SDF; by the same mod that take care of this sub forum.


He is just here to troll ... to think that China would make more than 100 DF-31s is already too optimistic ... let alone 1000. Also, China has DF-41 now, which is more advanced than DF-31.

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## ChineseTiger1986

ozranger said:


> Half of the America's should be good enough.



China is planning to build 12 Type 096 boomers along with several hundred land based ICBMs such as DF-41/DF-31AG/DF-5C, also the H-20 bombers.

That's de facto the parity.

The Cold War nuclear devices don't count, most of these were nuclear bomb/mine/torpedo, hardly useful in the modern age.

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## Adam WANG SHANGHAI MEGA

PLA anti missle fire coverage






or rocket gun fire coverage?

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## LKJ86



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## ozranger

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> China is planning to build 12 Type 096 boomers along with several hundred land based ICBMs such as DF-41/DF-31AG/DF-5C, also the H-20 bombers.
> 
> That's de facto the parity.
> 
> The Cold War nuclear devices don't count, most of these were nuclear bomb/mine/torpedo, hardly useful in the modern age.



I think the US is now having more than 3000 and less than 4000 nuclear warheads. So from my point of view China should need 1500 or more. It can be easily achieved as I guess China is now already having more than 1000+ warheads and obviously more than half of them can hit targets in the US.

Say if DF-41 is capable of carrying 3 warheads, though I have to admit this figure might highly underestimate DF-41's capability, when there are 100 missiles, DF-41 alone would easily make up 300 warheads. With current scale of China's economy, having 100 DF-41 missiles can't be easier.

All those warheads are understandably hydrogen warheads, i.e. thermonuclear warheads.

It would be extremely uneconomical to mount conventional warheads onto those DF-41 (carrying 3 to 10 warheads), DF-31/AG (carrying 1 to 3 warheads) and DF-5A/B (carrying 3 to 10 warheads) missiles. Therefore all those missile families can already make up nearly 1000 warheads which can hit targets in America.

There is no need to use them to hit Russia or India as they all are ICBMs. No submarine launched missiles have been included in my analysis yet.

I also didn't include hypersonic gliding vehicles boosted by intermediate range missiles which can reach American continent as I don't know whether there will be nuclear warheads on them.

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## ChineseTiger1986

ozranger said:


> I think the US is now having more than 3000 and less than 4000 nuclear warheads. So from my point of view China should need 1500 or more. It can be easily achieved as I guess China is now already having more than 1000+ warheads and obviously more than half of them can hit targets in the US.
> 
> Say if DF-41 is capable of carrying 3 warheads, though I have to admit this figure might highly underestimate DF-41's capability, when there are 100 missiles, DF-41 alone would easily make up 300 warheads. With current scale of China's economy, having 100 DF-41 missiles can't be easier.
> 
> All those warheads are understandably hydrogen warheads, i.e. thermonuclear warheads.
> 
> It would be extremely uneconomical to mount conventional warheads onto those DF-41 (carrying 3 to 10 warheads), DF-31/AG (carrying 1 to 3 warheads) and DF-5A/B (carrying 3 to 10 warheads) missiles. Therefore all those missile families can already make up nearly 1000 warheads which can hit targets in America.
> 
> There is no need to use them to hit Russia or India as they all are ICBMs. No submarine launched missiles have been included in my analysis yet.
> 
> I also didn't include hypersonic gliding vehicles boosted by intermediate range missiles which can reach American continent as I don't know whether there will be nuclear warheads on them.



Most of the US warheads are the W76, which are too old right now.

The US doesn’t want to spend a large amount of money to maintain all of these, rather they would save some money to maintain the more advanced W87/88.

If China has fully integrated the HGV technology into the DF-41 and JL-3, then 10 nuclear warheads will be mounted for each missile, no decoy is needed, as the warheads are becoming uninterceptable. Otherwise, it would be a waste of storage.

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## LKJ86



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## Brainsucker

ChineseTiger1986 said:


> Most of the US warheads are the W76, which are too old right now.
> 
> The US doesn’t want to spend a large amount of money to maintain all of these, rather they would save some money to maintain the more advanced W87/88.
> 
> If China has fully integrated the HGV technology into the DF-41 and JL-3, then 10 nuclear warheads will be mounted for each missile, no decoy is needed, as the warheads are becoming uninterceptable. Otherwise, it would be a waste of storage.



Don't underestimated US. They have the same military industrial capability as China, if not better. If China can procure 1000 DF-41 in one year production time, US can also do it with their own version of Thermonuclear missiles. 

You can witness their military industry ability from how fast they could built Arleigh Burke Destroyers at the beginning of war of terror. It was fast. As fast as China spams their warships right now. And look at how they build their F-35. They have more than a hundred right now, in a very short of production time. While China still doing it easy with their J-20.

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## Figaro

Brainsucker said:


> Don't underestimated US. They have the same military industrial capability as China, if not better. If China can procure 1000 DF-41 in one year production time, US can also do it with their own version of Thermonuclear missiles.
> 
> You can witness their military industry ability from how fast they could built Arleigh Burke Destroyers at the beginning of war of terror. It was fast. As fast as China spams their warships right now. And look at how they build their F-35. They have more than a hundred right now, in a very short of production time. While China still doing it easy with their J-20.


Agreed. China has only started production modern, hi-tech weapons en masse in the past 2 decades. Compare that to the United States (just look at how much weaponry was produced in WW2). To dismiss America's industrial capacity would be a severe miscalculation. But @ChineseTiger1986 is correct regarding the bulk of American nuclear warheads ... they are all based on dated, Cold-War designs and mainly in storage facilities. So China would never need to match the US nuke per nuke to achieve a similar deterrent. China should instead focus on building up its air based deterrent (H-20) and its sub based deterrent (producing many more 096's and JL-3's).



ozranger said:


> Say if DF-41 is capable of carrying 3 warheads, though I have to admit this figure might highly underestimate DF-41's capability, when there are 100 missiles


DF-41 can carry up to 10 or 12 warheads. But 3 is a fair number of actual warheads while the rest are decoys.

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## ChineseTiger1986

Brainsucker said:


> Don't underestimated US. They have the same military industrial capability as China, if not better. If China can procure 1000 DF-41 in one year production time, US can also do it with their own version of Thermonuclear missiles.
> 
> You can witness their military industry ability from how fast they could built Arleigh Burke Destroyers at the beginning of war of terror. It was fast. As fast as China spams their warships right now. And look at how they build their F-35. They have more than a hundred right now, in a very short of production time. While China still doing it easy with their J-20.



China has never underestimated the US, but just being confident that would outproduce it.

F-35 is an utter failure, and China now only focuses to mass produce the J-20, then pull out the 6th aircraft fighter with the variable cycle engine by 2025.



Figaro said:


> Agreed. China has only started production modern, hi-tech weapons en masse in the past 2 decades. Compare that to the United States (just look at how much weaponry was produced in WW2). To dismiss America's industrial capacity would be a severe miscalculation. But @ChineseTiger1986 is correct regarding the bulk of American nuclear warheads ... they are all based on dated, Cold-War designs and mainly in storage facilities. So China would never need to match the US nuke per nuke to achieve a similar deterrent. China should instead focus on building up its air based deterrent (H-20) and its sub based deterrent (producing many more 096's and JL-3's).
> 
> 
> DF-41 can carry up to 10 or 12 warheads. But 3 is a fair number of actual warheads while the rest are decoys.



When the DF-41 and JL-3 have been HGVed, it won't need any decoy because all the warheads are becoming uninterceptable.

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## ozranger

Figaro said:


> DF-41 can carry up to 10 or 12 warheads. But 3 is a fair number of actual warheads while the rest are decoys.



ICBMs of the three super powers are not intermediate range missiles. When they are launched, the end of world comes near. So there is no need to have decoys. Just shoot them all with full nuclear warheads.

The warhead count variation, for example from 3 to 10, is related to the weight and power of different combinations of different types of thermonuclear bombs in the warhead. Fewer warheads come with a lot more powerful bombs.

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## LKJ86



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## JSCh



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4326166787545308

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 531360
> View attachment 531361
> View attachment 531362
> View attachment 531363
> View attachment 531364
> View attachment 531365
> View attachment 531366
> View attachment 531367
> View attachment 531368


The video of DF-26:
https://m.weibo.cn/6444593050/4326235901356502

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 531400
> View attachment 531401
> View attachment 531402
> View attachment 531403
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4326166787545308



No evidence that this is YJ-18.


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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> The video of DF-26:
> https://m.weibo.cn/6444593050/4326235901356502



Very good, high quality clip, thank you!

Just grabbed it for passing along to some friends through the other means

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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4326302179221162

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 531551
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4326302179221162


Some guessed it's a mobile radar system.

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## samsara

*China’s ship-killer missiles mobilized to Northwest China plateau (09 JAN)
*
(IMG)
_File photo taken on Sept. 3, 2015 shows DF-26 missiles attending a military parade in Beijing, capital of China. (Xinhua)_

*China's far-reaching, anti-ship ballistic missile the DF-26 has been mobilized to Northwest China's plateau and desert areas*, reported China's national broadcaster on Tuesday after a US warship trespassed into China's territorial waters off the Xisha Islands in the South China Sea on Monday.

*The DF-26 is China's new generation of intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) capable of targeting medium and large ships at sea. It can carry both conventional and nuclear warheads.*

*The DF-26 is attached to a brigade under the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force that operates in Northwest China's plateau and desert areas*, China Central Television (CCTV) reported.

The report said the missiles are now *capable of mobile operations across the country*. It was unclear from the CCTV report when the missiles were mobilized.

*A mobile missile launch from deep in the country's interior is more difficult to intercept*, a Beijing-based military expert, who asked not to be named, told the Global Times on Wednesday.

During the initial phase of a ballistic missile launch, the missile is relatively slow and not difficult to detect, making it an easier target for enemy anti-missile installations, the expert noted.

*After the missile enters a later stage, its speed is so high that chances for interception are significantly lower*, the expert said.

This is also the *first time the missile has made a close-up public appearance since it came into service with the PLA*, cctv.com reported.

The timing of the report sparked discussions among Chinese military observers online, as it came after the USS McCambell, a US guided missile destroyer, trespassed into China's territorial waters off the Xisha Islands on Monday without permission from the Chinese government.

China dispatched aircraft and warships to warn the US vessel and has lodged a solemn representation with the US, Foreign Ministry Spokesperson Lu Kang said at a daily briefing on Monday.

The report is a good reminder that China is capable of safeguarding its territory, the anonymous expert said. _*"Even when launched from deeper inland areas of China, the DF-26 has a range far-reaching enough to cover the South China Sea."*_

*It can hit targets 4,500 kilometers away*, china.com reported, making it capable of striking targets including US naval bases in Guam in the western Pacific.

*In April 2018, Ministry of National Defense announced that the missile has officially joined the PLA Rocket Force.*


Newspaper headline: _China’s ship-killer missiles mobilized to Northwest_


http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1135138.shtml

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

New early-stage PL? Another addition to the PL family of A2A missiles? 

http://124.205.131.135:8090/article...6344&products=11000112-1&rightList=1280241758

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## JSCh

*China’s ‘Underground Steel Great Wall’ capable of defeating hypersonic weapon attacks: academician*
By Deng Xiaoci and Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/1/13 17:33:39




Qian Qihu, recipient of the 2018 State Preeminent Science and Technology Award, during his interview with the Global Times on Friday. Photo: Deng Xiaoci/GT

China's "Underground Steel Great Wall" could "guarantee the security of the country's strategic arsenal" against potential attacks including those from future hypersonic weapons, Qian Qihu, recipient of the country's highest science and technology award, told the Global Times. 

Qian, 82, an academician of the both Chinese Academy of Sciences and the Chinese Academy of Engineering, received the 2018 State Preeminent Science and Technology Award during a grand conference held at the Great Hall of the People in Beijing on Tuesday.

The "Underground Steel Great Wall" is a series of defense facilities located deep under mountains. While the mountain rocks are thick enough to resist enemy attacks, entrances and exits of these facilities are often vulnerable, and Qian's work was to provide extra protection to these parts.

China's nuclear strategy follows the principle of "No first use." It requires the country to have the capability of withstanding a nuclear attack before it responds with its strategic weapons. 

Qian's work achieves that to guarantee the safety of the country's strategic weapons and launch and storage facilities, as well as the commanders' safety during extreme times, said Song Zhongping, a military expert and TV commentator.

In an exclusive interview with the Global Times on Friday, Qian describes his work, the "Underground Steel Great Wall," as the "country's last national defense line," because when other lines of defense such as the strategic missile interception system, anti-missile system and air defense system fail to function against hypersonic missiles and recently developed earth-penetrators, his work can thwart all types of attack. 

"The development of the shield must closely follow the development of spears. Our defense engineering has evolved in a timely manner as attack weapons pose new challenges," Qian said.

According to the academician, hypersonic weapons that move as fast as 10 times the speed of sound are capable of changing trajectory mid-flight and penetrate any current anti-missile installations.

US media outlet CNBC reported that in March 2018, during a State of the Nation address Russian President Vladimir Putin debuted new nuclear and hypersonic weapons, which he described as "invincible." 

The US is also trying to develop hypersonic weapons, as then US Deputy Secretary of Defense Patrick Shanahan, now acting secretary of defense, said in October 2018, "We are going to fly sooner and more often than people have ever expected," CNBC reported.

*Emerging challenges*

National defense challenges do not only emerge from the development of advanced attack weapons but are also a result of an unpredictable international environment. 

Qian cited the US' recent stance that the Donald Trump administration is mulling to lower its threshold for nuclear weapons deployment.

The US is planning to loosen US nuclear weapon constraints, and develop low-yield nuclear warheads, the Wall Street Journal reported in January 2018. 

It is highly possible that US weapons with "low-yield nuclear warheads" are earth penetrators, with higher surgical strike capability that may cause larger damage, military experts previously noted, warning that China should stay alert, and accordingly upgrade its own national defense.

Qian also provided advice in many civilian construction projects, including the Nanjing Yangtze River Tunnel, the Hong Kong-Zhuhai-Macao Bridge, and the giant South-to-North Water Transfer Project, according to a China Global Television Network (CGTN) report.

When asked how he will spend the 8 million yuan national award in cash, Qian said that part of it will go to research for national defense, and the rest will be used for social welfare such as fighting poverty and support to poor students. 

"I have never had a thought of earning any prize money for my research, nor would I think it came too late," Qian said. "I am only grateful that the national-level recognition offers a great opportunity to raise the public's national defense awareness."

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16B

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

DF-5A

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## LKJ86

HQ-17

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

某飞行试验成绩再创新高；某研究性飞行试验圆满成功，对飞航导弹跨域发展具有里程碑意义；“腾飞一号”组合动力飞行器首飞成功。全年飞行试验成功率居集团首位，批生产难度创近年新高，提前实现年度目标。圆满完成演习及训练保障任务，设立驻青岛前出保障工作站，开创装备保障服务体系新架构。

New high achieved of certain flight test results

Research flight test successfully conducted, a milestone for the cross-domain development of cruise missiles.

Successful first flight of "Tengyun I" combined cycle vehicle.

.....

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=Mz...=1&scene=23&srcid=01198wvkpPtwU1k6qUhhn1L5#rd

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## Jlaw

JSCh said:


> *China’s ‘Underground Steel Great Wall’ capable of defeating hypersonic weapon attacks: academician*
> By Deng Xiaoci and Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/1/13 17:33:39
> 
> 
> 
> Qian Qihu, recipient of the 2018 State Preeminent Science and Technology Award, during his interview with the Global Times on Friday. Photo: Deng Xiaoci/GT
> 
> China's "Underground Steel Great Wall" could "guarantee the security of the country's strategic arsenal" against potential attacks including those from future hypersonic weapons, Qian Qihu, recipient of the country's highest science and technology award, told the Global Times.
> 
> Qian, 82, an academician of the both Chinese Academy of Sciences and the Chinese Academy of Engineering, received the 2018 State Preeminent Science and Technology Award during a grand conference held at the Great Hall of the People in Beijing on Tuesday.
> 
> The "Underground Steel Great Wall" is a series of defense facilities located deep under mountains. While the mountain rocks are thick enough to resist enemy attacks, entrances and exits of these facilities are often vulnerable, and Qian's work was to provide extra protection to these parts.
> 
> China's nuclear strategy follows the principle of "No first use." It requires the country to have the capability of withstanding a nuclear attack before it responds with its strategic weapons.
> 
> Qian's work achieves that to guarantee the safety of the country's strategic weapons and launch and storage facilities, as well as the commanders' safety during extreme times, said Song Zhongping, a military expert and TV commentator.
> 
> In an exclusive interview with the Global Times on Friday, Qian describes his work, the "Underground Steel Great Wall," as the "country's last national defense line," because when other lines of defense such as the strategic missile interception system, anti-missile system and air defense system fail to function against hypersonic missiles and recently developed earth-penetrators, his work can thwart all types of attack.
> 
> "The development of the shield must closely follow the development of spears. Our defense engineering has evolved in a timely manner as attack weapons pose new challenges," Qian said.
> 
> According to the academician, hypersonic weapons that move as fast as 10 times the speed of sound are capable of changing trajectory mid-flight and penetrate any current anti-missile installations.
> 
> US media outlet CNBC reported that in March 2018, during a State of the Nation address Russian President Vladimir Putin debuted new nuclear and hypersonic weapons, which he described as "invincible."
> 
> The US is also trying to develop hypersonic weapons, as then US Deputy Secretary of Defense Patrick Shanahan, now acting secretary of defense, said in October 2018, "We are going to fly sooner and more often than people have ever expected," CNBC reported.
> 
> *Emerging challenges*
> 
> National defense challenges do not only emerge from the development of advanced attack weapons but are also a result of an unpredictable international environment.
> 
> Qian cited the US' recent stance that the Donald Trump administration is mulling to lower its threshold for nuclear weapons deployment.
> 
> The US is planning to loosen US nuclear weapon constraints, and develop low-yield nuclear warheads, the Wall Street Journal reported in January 2018.
> 
> It is highly possible that US weapons with "low-yield nuclear warheads" are earth penetrators, with higher surgical strike capability that may cause larger damage, military experts previously noted, warning that China should stay alert, and accordingly upgrade its own national defense.
> 
> Qian also provided advice in many civilian construction projects, including the Nanjing Yangtze River Tunnel, the Hong Kong-Zhuhai-Macao Bridge, and the giant South-to-North Water Transfer Project, according to a China Global Television Network (CGTN) report.
> 
> When asked how he will spend the 8 million yuan national award in cash, Qian said that part of it will go to research for national defense, and the rest will be used for social welfare such as fighting poverty and support to poor students.
> 
> "I have never had a thought of earning any prize money for my research, nor would I think it came too late," Qian said. "I am only grateful that the national-level recognition offers a great opportunity to raise the public's national defense awareness."


Isn't that a wrong doctrine. If China remove non strike first than the underground bunkers are not as relevant. 
In a nuclear war the country who strikes first will win. A good defense is a great offense

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## LKJ86



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## Figaro

Jlaw said:


> Isn't that a wrong doctrine. If China remove non strike first than the underground bunkers are not as relevant.
> In a nuclear war the country who strikes first will win. A good defense is a great offense


I agree. I feel that China's no first strike policy puts itself at a significant disadvantage should nuclear war be imminent. China is one of only two nuclear powers - the other being India - to have this policy. Ultimately, China does not have thousands of nuclear weapons like the US to fully guarantee a successful second strike.

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## nang2

Figaro said:


> I agree. I feel that China's no first strike policy puts itself at a significant disadvantage should nuclear war be imminent.


It is only true when it had formed an alliance and wanted to protect allies from nuclear attack.


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## ZeEa5KPul

Figaro said:


> I agree. I feel that China's no first strike policy puts itself at a significant disadvantage should nuclear war be imminent. China is one of only two nuclear powers - the other being India - to have this policy. Ultimately, China does not have thousands of nuclear weapons like the US to fully guarantee a successful second strike.


The NFU policy itself isn't a problem, it's the low warhead counts that are a problem. Once China (hopefully) gets to US/Russia levels with new systems like the DF-41 and JL-3, it won't matter whether it proclaims NFU or not since no one can afford to believe it. That's the best of all worlds: China gets to morally grandstand since it declares NFU, but can credibly plan and execute first strikes.

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## LKJ86

ZeEa5KPul said:


> The NFU policy itself isn't a problem, it's the low warhead counts that are a problem.


In fact, no one knows the the real number of China's nuclear warheads basically.

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## samsara

samsara said:


> *China’s ship-killer missiles mobilized to Northwest China plateau (09 JAN)
> *
> (IMG)
> _File photo taken on Sept. 3, 2015 shows DF-26 missiles attending a military parade in Beijing, capital of China. (Xinhua)_
> 
> *China's far-reaching, anti-ship ballistic missile the DF-26 has been mobilized to Northwest China's plateau and desert areas*, reported China's national broadcaster on Tuesday after a US warship trespassed into China's territorial waters off the Xisha Islands in the South China Sea on Monday.
> 
> *The DF-26 is China's new generation of intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) capable of targeting medium and large ships at sea. It can carry both conventional and nuclear warheads.*
> 
> *The DF-26 is attached to a brigade under the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force that operates in Northwest China's plateau and desert areas*, China Central Television (CCTV) reported.
> 
> The report said the missiles are now *capable of mobile operations across the country*. It was unclear from the CCTV report when the missiles were mobilized.
> 
> *A mobile missile launch from deep in the country's interior is more difficult to intercept*, a Beijing-based military expert, who asked not to be named, told the Global Times on Wednesday.
> 
> During the initial phase of a ballistic missile launch, the missile is relatively slow and not difficult to detect, making it an easier target for enemy anti-missile installations, the expert noted.
> 
> *After the missile enters a later stage, its speed is so high that chances for interception are significantly lower*, the expert said.
> 
> This is also the *first time the missile has made a close-up public appearance since it came into service with the PLA*, cctv.com reported.
> 
> The timing of the report sparked discussions among Chinese military observers online, as it came after the USS McCambell, a US guided missile destroyer, trespassed into China's territorial waters off the Xisha Islands on Monday without permission from the Chinese government.
> 
> China dispatched aircraft and warships to warn the US vessel and has lodged a solemn representation with the US, Foreign Ministry Spokesperson Lu Kang said at a daily briefing on Monday.
> 
> The report is a good reminder that China is capable of safeguarding its territory, the anonymous expert said. _*"Even when launched from deeper inland areas of China, the DF-26 has a range far-reaching enough to cover the South China Sea."*_
> 
> *It can hit targets 4,500 kilometers away*, china.com reported, making it capable of striking targets including US naval bases in Guam in the western Pacific.
> 
> *In April 2018, Ministry of National Defense announced that the missile has officially joined the PLA Rocket Force.*
> 
> 
> Newspaper headline: _China’s ship-killer missiles mobilized to Northwest_
> 
> http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1135138.shtml



A tweet by *Hans M. Kristensen*, director of Nuclear Information Project, Federation of American Scientists (FAS), 2019-01-21

_"Here is my analysis of China’s recent DF-26 deployment to a new missile training area in northern China 
Kudos to @DigitalGlobe @TerraServer @planetlabs @googleearth" _


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1087366788818571265
*
Chinese DF-26 Missile Launchers Deploy To New Missile Training Area (2019-01-21)*

[Updated] Earlier this month, the Chinese government outlet Global Times published a report that a People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) unit with the *new DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile* had carried out an exercise in the _“Northwest China’s plateau and desert areas.”_ The article made vague references to a program previously aired on China’s CCTV-7 that showed a column of DF-26 launchers and support vehicles driving on highways, desert roads, and through mountain streams.

As it turns out, the exercise may have been west of Beijing, but the actual location is in upper Central China. Several researchers (for example Sean O’Connor) have been attempting to learn more about the unit. By combining scenes from the CCTV-7 program with various satellite imagery sources, I was able to geolocate the DF-26s to the S218 highway (39.702137º, 105.731469º) outside the city of Jilantai (Jilantaizhen) roughly 100 km north of Alxa in the Inner Mongolia province in the northern part of central China (see image below).

*




*

The DF-26s appear to have been visiting a new missile training area established by PLARF since 2015. By combining use of Google Earth, Planet, and Terra Server, each of which has unique capabilities needed to scan vast areas and identifying individual facilities, as well as analyzing images purchased from Digital Globe, I have so far been able to identify more than 100 launch pads used by launchers and support vehicles during exercises, a support base, a landing strip, and at least eight launch unit camp sites covering an area of more than 1,000 square kilometers along a 90-kilometer corridor (see image below).






The Chinese military has for decades been operating a vast missile training area further west in the Qinghai province, which I profiled in an article a decade ago. They also appear to operate a training area further west near Korla (Beyingol). The best unclassified guide for following Chinese missile units is, of course, the indispensable _PLA Rocket Force Leadership and Unit Reference _produced by Mark Stokes at the Project 2049 Institute.

It is not clear if the DF-26 unit that exercised in the Jilantai training area is or will be permanently based in the region. It is normal for Chinese missile units to deploy long distances from their home base for training. The first brigade (666 Brigade) is thought to be based some 1,100 kilometers (700 miles) to the southeast near Xinyang in southern Henan province. This was not the first training deployment of the brigade. The NASIC reported in 2017 that China had 16+ DF-26 launchers and it is building more. The _CCTV-7_video shows an aerial view of a launch unit camp with TEL tents, support vehicles, and personnel tents. A DF-26 is shown pulling out from under a camouflage tent and setting up on a T-shaped concrete launch pad (see image below). More than 100 of those pads have been identified in the area.






The support base at the training area does not have the outline of a permanent missile brigade base. But several satellite images appear to show the presence of DF-16, DF-21, and DF-26 launchers at this facility. One image purchased from Digital Globe and taken by one of their satellites on October 24, 2018, shows the base under construction with what appears to be two DF-16 launchers (h/t @reutersanders) parked between two garages. Another photo taken on August 16, 2017, shows what appears to be 22 DF-21C launchers with a couple of possible DF-26 launchers as well (see below).






*The DF-26, which was first officially displayed in 2015, fielded in 2016, and declared in service by April 2018, is an intermediate-range ballistic missile launched from a six-axle road-mobile launchers that can deliver either a conventional or nuclear warhead to a maximum distance of 4,000 kilometers.* From the 666 Brigade area near Xinyang, a DF-26 IRBM could reach Guam and New Delhi (see map below). China has had the capability to strike Guam with the nuclear DF-4 ICBM since 1980, but the DF-4 is a moveable, liquid-fuel missiles that takes a long time to set up, while the DF-26 is a road-mobile, solid-fuel, dual-capable missile that can launch quicker and with greater accuracy. Moreover, DF-26 adds conventional strike to the IRBM range for the first time.






The 666 Brigade is in range of U.S. sea- and air-launched cruise missiles as well as ballistic missiles. But the DF-26 is part of China’s growing inventory of INF-range missiles (most of which, by far, are non-nuclear), a development that is causing some in the U.S. defense community to recommend the United States should withdraw from the INF treaty and deploy quick-launch intermediate-range ballistic missiles in the Western Pacific. Others (including this author) disagree, saying current and planned U.S. capabilities are sufficient to meet national security objectives and that engaging China in an INF-race would make things worse.

See also: FAS Nuclear Notebook on Chinese Nuclear Forces, 2018

https://fas.org/blogs/security/2019/01/df-26/

_This publication was made possible by a grant from the Carnegie Corporation of New York, the John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, the New Land Foundation, and the Ploughshares Fund. The statements made and views expressed are solely the responsibility of the author._

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## samsara

Recently Henri Kenhmann (East Pendulum) just posted some cool as well as *rare* pics of the some *PLARF's underground facility* on 2019.01.20:

_“In an underground base of the Chinese Rocket Force”_


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1086974007352545280

















Very neat underground facility. And I guess that the packed meal (bread) should be some kind of emergency stockpile not the common daily ration.

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## LKJ86

The launch video of DF-26:
https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4331713485934367

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> The launch video of DF-26:
> https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4331713485934367


A cool DF-26 exercise clip lasts for about 05:40.

I believe this is the kind of video that Hans Kristensen from FAS watched and analysed earlier. Some folks just have their job desc among others to monitor CCTV videos and its affiliates

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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/2859620437/4331714631184664

----------


LKJ86 said:


> The launch video of DF-26:
> https://m.weibo.cn/6005843218/4331713485934367

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

A short video clip from Dafeng Cao via Twitter on 23/24 Jan 2019:

*“The launch of DF-26 IRBM”*


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1088049641487126528

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## Title1234

Jlaw said:


> Isn't that a wrong doctrine. If China remove non strike first than the underground bunkers are not as relevant.
> In a nuclear war the country who strikes first will win. A good defense is a great offense


Counter strike that can turn country who strike first to be third world country is enough .


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## LKJ86



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## Jlaw

Title1234 said:


> Counter strike that can turn country who strike first to be third world country is enough .


When you get into a fight it's best you hit the opponent a few times first. A first nuclear strike may be enough to knock out some of the counter strike capabilities of a country.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

WX-1: Tiny ASM for drones and choppers.
Developer: Huanghu Science and Technology Co., Ltd.
Length: 0.687 meters.
Weight: 3 Kg
Warhead: (dude from Huanghu refused to expose...)
Range: 1-3 Km

There is also WX-2 - a longer version (about one meter, 10 kg) but the dude from the company refused to expose its warhead and its max range...

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## cirr

DF-17 HGV(operational)
DF-26X HGV(operational)
DF-XXB HGV(in test)
DF-XX
DX-XX
......

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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86

YJ-xx for Type 055 DDG

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## LKJ86



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## Dante80

Can someone explain to me the differences between the HQ-22 and latest variants of the HQ-9 family? It seems like both systems are using wheeled launchers holding 4 big canisters.


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## lcloo

Dante80 said:


> Can someone explain to me the differences between the HQ-22 and latest variants of the HQ-9 family? It seems like both systems are using wheeled launchers holding 4 big canisters.


The HQ-22 is the latest in the family of HQ-2 series. The first is HQ-2 based on the Soviet SAM-2, this was the main SAM of China in 1960s. The next model is HQ-12 with improved features and physical look, and the latest is HQ-22.

The sequential number is HQ-X2, so in the future, the replacement would be HQ-32.

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> YJ-xx for Type 055 DDG
> View attachment 535614
> View attachment 535615



Could you provide a translation?


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## LKJ86



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## 21stCentury

China's non-first strike policy is akin to putting a shackle on its own foot; trapping oneself; letting others NUKE you first, and then respond.....that does not seem like a good policy.

I suggest scrapping this 'non-first strike', but I am not saying China should use nukes first in response to attack, but simply remove that shackle/containment on oneself..

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## Dante80

21stCentury said:


> China's non-first strike policy is akin to putting a shackle on its own foot; trapping oneself; letting others NUKE you first, and then respond.....that does not seem like a good policy.



No, it is actually the best policy. You see, policies or dogmas are like treaties. Meaningless when the sh-t hit the fan. China was the first nuclear power to adopt and actually put into writing the NFU doctrine as it is known today, and it has repeatedly re-affirmed its no-first-use policy in recent years, doing so in 2005, 2008, 2009 and again in 2011. The reason for that is self-evident and has to do with the optics involved in nuclear proliferation.

If the need arises, China may adopt or simply execute a pre-emptive nuclear strike, as a response to large scale conventional war, for example (like Russia proclaims). *There are no shackles when you are the one imposing them on yourself.*

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## lcloo

True, the perception of being threatened by China's first strike policy will only increase the urge of other nations to deploy more nuclear warheads aim at China's cities and other strategic infrastructures.

And the fear of being strike first by China may make other nuclear powers to carry out pre-emptive strike with-out much hesitation.

Unlike other war happy nations, China does not want any war and will always try to prevent war as much as it can. However, coupling first strike policy with a war preventive mindset is a disaster, as the enemy can only see the threat of first strike and not the policy to prevent war.

China had too many wars and too many deaths from the Taiping rebellion to the Civil war period, more than 50 million had died, some even estimated up to 70 million deaths. Thus not wise to instigate nuclear threat and fear onto others as this might bring more wars. Non-strike First policy first thought by chairman Mao is still the best.

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## atan651

By now we have already witnessed several irresponsible world leaders bullying other nations. A No-First-Strike policy is suicidal to China. Get rid of it!

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## Dante80

TANAHH said:


> By now we have already witnessed several irresponsible world leaders bullying other nations. A No-First-Strike policy is suicidal to China.



In what possible way? Please describe why you think it is "suicidal". 
Reading comments like this gives me the impression that most people are not even remotely acquainted with the nuances of nuclear policy and posture.

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## ozranger

Akasa said:


> Could you provide a translation?



The only useful information is that there will be 1000km range anti-ship ballistic missiles deployed to Type 055 DDG.

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## Kailash Kumar

China unveils anti-ship version of its DF-26 missile

31 JANUARY 2019

China has strengthened its ballistic capabilities, by increasing its Anti-Access/Area Denial (A2/AD) forces with the development of an anti-ship variant of the Dong Feng 26 (DF-26), to deny access to its maritime zones to the US forces. It is part of a Chinese stategy that includes the expansion of the maritime zones secured by China.





Dong Feng 26 medium range anti-ship, ballistic missile

As part of this ballistic power expansion, China has recently tested an anti-ship version of its Dong Feng 26 (DF-26), just a few days after some US combat vessels went through Taiwan detroit. Both countries increase their presence near Taiwan, China to ensure its domination on Taiwan and the US to reaffirm its support to its Taiwanese ally.

The DF-26 is a medium range ballistic missile (MRBM) able to precisely reach targets from 3,500 to 4,000 km away. This variant of the missile is capable of hitting moving large vessels up to 2,200 km away. Therefore, some may call this variant of the Dong Feng a "carrier killer", destined to sink US aircraft carriers, which may frighten US officers and decision-makers about sending troops in the South East China Sea.

Yet, few details are known about this missile, but it is believed to be solid-fuelled and road-mobile, allowing it to be stored in underground bunkers and fired at short notice, hence difficult to counter. It is possible that the DF-26C is a follow-up version of the DF-21. Possible warheads include conventional, nuclear or even maneuverable anti-ship and hypersonic warheads.

https://www.navyrecognition.com/ind...s-anti-ship-version-of-its-df-26-missile.html

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## 星海军事

LKJ86 said:


> YJ-xx for Type 055 DDG
> View attachment 535614
> View attachment 535615


The article is wrong from the first sentence.

В России начались испытания гиперзвуковых *крылатых ракет* "Циркон" 
https://ria.ru/20160317/1391446801.html


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## Jlaw

21stCentury said:


> China's non-first strike policy is akin to putting a shackle on its own foot; trapping oneself; letting others NUKE you first, and then respond.....that does not seem like a good policy.
> 
> I suggest scrapping this 'non-first strike', but I am not saying China should use nukes first in response to attack, but simply remove that shackle/containment on oneself..


true. as in a fight, if you can get some good punches in first you will most likely win. chinas 300 nukes will be destroyed onn first strike by US. If you have 5000 nukes than NFU makes sense

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

Stealthy anti-ship cruise missile under development by AVIC Hongdu

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## ZeEa5KPul

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 536911


All the DF-21Ds are erect, there must be an American carrier nearby.

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## bahadur999

ZeEa5KPul said:


> All the DF-21Ds are erect, there must be an American carrier nearby.


I think DF-21D is the air-variant.


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## LKJ86

YJ-12

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 538865


What is it?


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## lcloo

bahadur999 said:


> What is it?


HQ-12 Air defence missile.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1097682754240565248Global Times✔@globaltimesnews
#ChinaDefense The PLA Rocket Force released its first promotional video on Chinese social media, showcasing rare scenes of its missiles.

10:22 AM - Feb 19, 2019

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1099211731128049664Global Times✔@globaltimesnews

#ChinaDefense: The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force University of Engineering released a video showing the process of launching a ballistic missile, which also gives a glimpse of a Rocket Force command center.

31
3:37 PM - Feb 23, 2019

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## LKJ86

S-300

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## 925boy

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 539052
> View attachment 539053
> View attachment 539054


Chinese Tochka?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

925boy said:


> Chinese Tochka?


Why "Chinese Tochka"?


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## 925boy

LKJ86 said:


> Why "Chinese Tochka"?


Because it looks like Russian Tochka and i dont believe China invented it before Russia.


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## Ultima Thule

925boy said:


> Because it looks like Russian Tochka and i dont believe China invented it before Russia.





925boy said:


> Chinese Tochka?


why you think that China always copycat and don't have ability to develop by itself @925boy


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## LKJ86

925boy said:


> Because it looks like Russian Tochka and i dont believe China invented it before Russia.


OTR-21 Tochka





Operational range
70 km (43 mi) Scarab A 
120 km (75 mi) Scarab B 
185 km (115 mi) Scarab C
---

DF-16




The DF-16 (CSS-11) is a new-model missile that has a longer range than the DF-15 (between 800–1,000 km (500–620 mi)).

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## Ultima Thule

LKJ86 said:


> OTR-21 Tochka
> View attachment 541545
> 
> Operational range
> 70 km (43 mi) Scarab A
> 120 km (75 mi) Scarab B
> 185 km (115 mi) Scarab C
> ---
> 
> DF-16
> View attachment 541552
> 
> The DF-16 (CSS-11) is a new-model missile that has a longer range than the DF-15 (between 800–1,000 km (500–620 mi)).


He wont understand you bro @LKJ86

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## Figaro

925boy said:


> Because it looks like Russian Tochka and i dont believe China invented it before Russia.


Are you intentionally trying to sound ignorant here?

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## LKJ86



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## 925boy

Figaro said:


> Are you intentionally trying to sound ignorant here?


No. The size on the DF-16 pic i saw made it look smaller than it is.

@LKJ86 thanks for the clarification.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 544452
> View attachment 544453
> View attachment 544454
> View attachment 544455
> View attachment 544456


HQ-9 ?? Nice pics

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 548977
> View attachment 548978
> View attachment 548979
> View attachment 548980
> View attachment 548981
> View attachment 548982
> View attachment 548983
> View attachment 548985
> View attachment 548986
> View attachment 548987


Which missile is this one?


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## ozranger

samsara said:


> Which missile is this one?


HQ-16 with only 3 canisters in a row loaded for training.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 549511
> View attachment 549512
> View attachment 549513
> View attachment 549514
> View attachment 549515
> View attachment 549516


The DF-16 in exercise recently in March 2019.

The DF-16 is a mobile short medium-range, two-stage solid-fuel ballistic missile (with range of app.800~1,000 km), carried in a 10-wheeled TEL. This missile also supports MIRV, and has CEP of 5~10 meters.


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## bahadur999

Does someone know a good pic of HQ-19?

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## cirr

Deleted

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## cirr

We now know what this monster houses






China's first-ever *near-space* *long-range* *supersonic* cruise missile 

Now the questions are (1) what long-range? 2000km? 3000km? (2) how supersonic? M3? M4? M4.5? 






1 is YJ-12 and variants
2 is as above
3 is a new type of supersonic air-2-ground anti-radiation missile

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## bahadur999

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16 SAM
> View attachment 553136
> View attachment 553137
> View attachment 553138
> View attachment 553139
> View attachment 553140
> View attachment 553141


Isn't HQ-16 truck usually carry 6 missiles and not 3?
I also wonder what radar type those other trucks carry.


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## ozranger

bahadur999 said:


> Isn't HQ-16 truck usually carry 6 missiles and not 3?
> I also wonder what radar type those other trucks carry.



They normally carry 3 when in training to minimise the wears.

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## samsara

From OedoSoldier on 2019.04.15:

_On September 27, *1988*, China's first submarine launched ballistic missile "*JL-1*" ( 巨浪-1 Ju Lang means 'Mighty Waves' ) was successfully accomplished from an underwater launch test._







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1117592495637004288

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

HQ-16

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## LKJ86

The hypersonic AShM YJ-XX for Type 055 destroyer, which can break through the defense of SM-3 Block IIA and SM-6 Block IA, has finished the test on land.

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## Deino

So far best image of a YJ-12 AShM under a H-6L

via Huitong's blog
(http://chinese-military-aviation.blogspot.com/p/missiles-iii.html#YJ-12)

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## The Ronin

*China reportedly tests a new hypersonic missile capable to ‘destroy US warships’ *

Chinese sources have reported that a mystery anti-ship hypersonic missile is being tested by the People’s Liberation Army Navy (PLAN).

According to the current information, the prototype hypersonic missile, being developed to increase the firepower of the newest Chinese Type 055 guided missile destroyers, has done successfully land tests.

Sources have claimed the new hypersonic missile, known as YJ-XX, will to capable of destroying US warships missile defenses. The YJ-XX is an ultra-high-speed missile, with the range of 1000 km, allegedly capable of penetrating US air defense systems based on Standard Missile 3 (SM-3) Block IIA and SM-6 Block IA hit-to-kill interceptor missiles.

Notably, the first Type 055 destroyer, Nanchang (visual indicative 101), made its first public debut during the massive celebrated the 70th anniversary of the founding of the People’s Liberation Army Navy in Qingdao.

The 180-meter long, 20-meter wide Type 055 class is a development of the Type 052D Luyang III-class guided-missile destroyer but is about a third bigger than the latter.

The ship is armed with 112 vertical-launch cells with the ability to fire HHQ-9 surface-to-air missiles, YJ-18 anti-ship cruise missiles, and CJ-10 land-attack cruise missiles. The main gun is a H/PJ-38 130-mm gun, but there are reports that this vessel also could eventually be equipped with a railgun. The vessel uses X- and S-band radars, allowing it to track stealthy objects of various sizes.

Type 055 with newest anti-ship hypersonic missiles descendants could significantly extend the Chinese Navy range at the central Pacific.

https://defence-blog.com/news/china...JN76CZLUuqd0Kgx8yL-NVmnCJYx6V3zfl3lsnBL8HZoJU

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## bahadur999

Deino said:


> So far best image of a YJ-12 AShM under a H-6L
> 
> via Huitong's blog
> (http://chinese-military-aviation.blogspot.com/p/missiles-iii.html#YJ-12)
> 
> 
> View attachment 556586


Is the air-launched variant of YJ-12 called YJ-12C?
As far as i know A and B are the sea and land variants.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## ozranger

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 557092
> View attachment 557093



Guam Express, excellent!

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## LKJ86

Influences of SM-1 and Shitl to the development of HQ-16

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## JSCh



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## bahadur999

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1126242264299261953He calls it HQ-17 but i think it is FM-2000.
I assume FM-2000 is the export version of the HQ-17 then? Only that this one is based on wheels.


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## LKJ86

bahadur999 said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1126242264299261953He calls it HQ-17 but i think it is FM-2000.
> I assume FM-2000 is the export version of the HQ-17 then? Only that this one is based on wheels.


HQ-17A


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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17A


So you are saying the only difference between 17 and 17A is that the latter has wheels?!
The thing is...the "two" systems should be completely different since one is based on Tor-1M and the other on Tor-2M...


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## ozranger

bahadur999 said:


> So you are saying the only difference between 17 and 17A is that the latter has wheels?!
> The thing is...the "two" systems should be completely different since one is based on Tor-1M and the other on Tor-2M...



HQ-17's radars and fire control system is completely different to TOR.


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## LKJ86

ozranger said:


> HQ-17's radars and fire control system is completely different to TOR.


https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/V_ane8QXaZSSC_ZrO-eISg

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## bahadur999

LKJ86 said:


> https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/V_ane8QXaZSSC_ZrO-eISg


Thanks. Now i see they are talking about CASIC 4th Academy 311 Institute to develop the 17A.


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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## samsara

*New missile gap leaves U.S. scrambling to counter China*

_REUTERS — By David Lague and Benjamin Kang Lim (2019-04-25)_

_Under Xi Jinping, Beijing has elevated its missile forces to a point where many rockets in the Chinese arsenal now rival or outperform those of the United States. This dramatic shift could render American carriers – the backbone of U.S. military supremacy – obsolete in a conflict with China._


China's powerful military is considered to be a master at concealing its intentions. But there is no secret about how it plans to destroy American aircraft carriers if rivalry becomes war.

At November’s biennial air show in the southern city of Zhuhai, the biggest state-owned missile maker, China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation Ltd, screened an animation showing a hostile “blue force,” comprising an aircraft carrier, escort ships and strike aircraft, approaching “red force” territory.

On a giant screen, the animation showed a barrage of the Chinese company’s missiles launched from “red force” warships, submarines, shore batteries and aircraft wreaking havoc on the escort vessels around the carrier. In a final salvo, two missiles plunge onto the flight deck of the carrier and a third slams into the side of the hull near the bow.

The fate of the ship is an unmistakable message to an America that has long dominated the globe from its mighty aircraft carriers and sprawling network of hundreds of bases [over at least 800 military outposts and lily pads]. With the Pentagon distracted by almost two decades of costly war in the Middle East and Afghanistan, the Chinese military, the People’s Liberation Army (PLA), has exploited a period of sustained budget increases and rapid technical improvement to build and deploy an arsenal of advanced missiles.

Many of these missiles are *specifically designed to attack the aircraft carriers and [military] bases that form the backbone of U.S. military dominance in the region* and which for decades have protected allies including Japan, South Korea and Taiwan.

Across almost all categories of these weapons, based on land, loaded on strike aircraft or deployed on warships and submarines, China’s missiles rival or outperform their counterparts in the armories of the United States and its allies, according to current and former U.S. military officers with knowledge of PLA test launches, Taiwanese and Chinese military analysts, and technical specifications published in Chinese media.

China has also seized a virtual monopoly in one class of conventional missiles – land-based, intermediate-range ballistic and cruise missiles.

Under the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces (INF) Treaty, a Cold War-era agreement aimed at reducing the threat of nuclear conflict, the United States and Russia are banned from deploying this class of missiles, with a range between 500 and 5,500 kilometers. But Beijing, unrestrained by the INF Treaty, is deploying them in massive numbers.

This includes so-called *carrier killer missiles like the DF-21D*, which can target aircraft carriers and other warships underway at sea at a range of up to 1,500 kilometers, [and the more powerful, newer *DF-26* nicked "Guam Express" for being able to reach Guam and beyond] according to Chinese and Western military analysts. If effective, these missiles would give China a destructive capability no other military can boast. China’s advantage in this class of missiles is likely to remain for the foreseeable future, despite U.S. President Donald Trump’s decision in February to withdraw from the INF Treaty in six months.

China is also making rapid strides in developing so-called *hypersonic missiles*, which _can maneuver sharply and travel at five times the speed of sound (or even faster)_. Currently, the United States has no defenses against a missile like this, according to Pentagon officials.

China’s Ministry of National Defense and China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation did not respond to questions from Reuters about Beijing’s missile capabilities. The U.S. Indo-Pacific Command and the Pentagon had no comment.

China’s growing missile arsenal hasn’t yet been proven in a real-world clash, and some Chinese officials play down their advances. But under the Trump administration, Washington has come to view China as a rival determined to displace the United States in Asia. This modern-day missile gap, the administration believes, is emerging as one of the biggest dangers to American military supremacy in Asia since the end of the Cold War. The Pentagon is now scrambling for new weapons and strategies to counter the PLA's rocket arsenal.

“We know that China has the most advanced ballistic missile force in the world,” said James Fanell, a retired U.S. Navy captain and former senior intelligence officer with the U.S. Pacific Fleet. “They have the capacity to overwhelm the defensive systems we are pursuing.”

Fanell was sidelined by the Pentagon ahead of his 2015 retirement, after warning about the Chinese build-up at a time when President Barack Obama was seeking cooperation with Beijing. Today, Pentagon policy hews more closely to his views that China intends to displace the United States as Asia’s dominant power.

Chinese military brass agree they can now keep American carriers at bay. Six people in China interviewed by Reuters, including retired PLA officers and a person with ties to the Beijing leadership, said China's enhanced missile capability was a great leveler and would serve to deter the United States from getting too close to Chinese shores.

“We cannot defeat the United States at sea,” a retired PLA colonel said in an interview. The United States has 11 aircraft carriers and China has just two. “But we have missiles that specifically target aircraft carriers to stop them from approaching our territorial waters if there were conflict.”

A person with ties to the Chinese leadership who once served in the military had a similar message: “If U.S. aircraft carriers come too close to our coastlines in a conflict, our missiles can destroy them.”

Xi Jinping has played a pivotal role in the ascendancy of Chinese missile forces. This series, _“The China Challenge,”_ examines how Xi is transforming the PLA and challenging U.S. supremacy in Asia. He has delivered a powerful boost to the prestige and influence of the elite unit responsible for China's nuclear and conventional missiles, the PLA Rocket Force.

The Chinese leader has described the missile forces as a “core of strategic deterrence, a strategic buttress to the country’s position as a major power and a cornerstone on which to build national security.” Xi has brought senior missile force veterans into his closest circle of military aides as he has consolidated his grip on the PLA with a sweeping purge of senior officers accused of corruption or disloyalty.

The Rocket Force has always enjoyed strong support from the ruling powers. But under Xi, the once secretive unit, formerly known as the Second Artillery Corps, has been thrust into the limelight. Since he took power in 2012 with a pledge to rejuvenate China as a great power, the Rocket Force’s latest nuclear and conventional missiles have played a starring role at some of the biggest military parades held in the New China era.

In one of these displays, in 2015, the designations of new missiles, including the “carrier killer” DF-21D, were painted on the sides of the projectiles in big white letters. The bold labels were aimed directly at foreign audiences, according to Western military analysts monitoring the parade in Beijing. At a parade Xi presided over to mark the 90th anniversary of the PLA in 2017, missiles were also prominently displayed.

This elaborate, choreographed showcasing of the newest and most powerful missiles has provided a backdrop for Xi as he burnishes his credentials as China’s highest military leader. Coverage of test launches, new warheads and technical breakthroughs dominate the Chinese military media.

But it’s not mere theater. This concerted advertising of China’s ability to deliver long-range conventional strikes without risking aircraft, ships or casualties is a key element of PLA strategy under Xi. Foreign military analysts say it sends a signal that China has the capacity to resist interference as it expands control over vast swathes of the South China Sea, intensifies naval and air sorties around Taiwan, and extends operations into territory it disputes with Japan in the East China Sea [that is the Diaoyu Islands / Senkaku Islands, a legacy from the Shimonoseki Treaty at 1895].

To be sure, while China's missile fleet has indisputably grown more formidable, the reliability, accuracy and payloads of its weapons have yet to be tested in battle. China hasn't fought a war since conflict against Vietnam in 1979. The U.S. arsenal of air and sea-launched missiles, by contrast, has been tried and proven repeatedly in wars over the past two decades.

It is also unknown if the PLA missile systems could survive electronic, cyber and physical attacks on launch facilities, guidance systems and command-and-control centers. Military analysts point out that there is still some doubt about whether China has mastered the know-how that would allow a “carrier killer” ballistic missile to detect, track and hit a moving target far from the Chinese coast.

U.S. military commanders and PLA watchers also acknowledge that there could be elements of subterfuge involved in the publicity about Chinese missiles. Deception is a key element of any military strategy. The PLA is well aware that America and other potential rivals would be closely monitoring their test sites, according to satellite imagery specialists.

Some retired PLA officers who spoke to Reuters played down the capability of China’s missiles.

“U.S. missiles are superior to ours in terms of quality and quantity,” the former PLA colonel told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss a sensitive topic with the foreign media. “If we were truly more advanced than the United States,” said a Chinese military analyst, “we would have liberated Taiwan.”

Still, current and former U.S. military officials say they are convinced from close monitoring of China's numerous test firings that PLA missiles are a genuine threat.


_*From REUTERS, the world's largest news agency, owned and controlled by the famous Rothschild family, with HQ in London. Part of the triumvirate of the world's dominating news agencies: Reuters–AP–AFP. This article is part of the special coverage on China titled "The China Challenge".

Note: the usage of common political/ideological slurs employed by the MSM on the PRC were removed and replaced by the common, neutral terms, but keep all other substances incl. the usual "doubtful lines".*_

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Nahid

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17 SAM
> View attachment 559869


you gyes copied tor too.............


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## Ultima Thule

Nahid said:


> you gyes copied tor too.............


With lots of indigenous improvements @Nahid


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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 560106
> View attachment 560107
> View attachment 560108
> View attachment 560109
> View attachment 560110
> View attachment 560111


What's this? HQ-16A/B or else ?



LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 560152
> View attachment 560153


This one is HQ-16A/B Air Defense missiles from the PLA Army.


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## cirr

New HQ-17A 






for medium wheeled combined brigade

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## Kompromat

Nice



cirr said:


> New HQ-17A
> 
> View attachment 560503
> 
> 
> for medium wheeled combined brigade


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## LKJ86



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## Path-Finder

cirr said:


> New HQ-17A
> 
> View attachment 560503
> 
> 
> for medium wheeled combined brigade


Is this upgraded or better than Tor??


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## bahadur999




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## LKJ86



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## lcloo

Difference between China's HQ-17 and Russian Tor missile. They look similar but are not the same. HQ-17 is improved Chinese variants based on earlier imported TOR-M1, and has slightly longer range.






*HQ-17 (China Variant)*
The HQ-17 (Hongqi-17) is China's reported variant of the Tor-M1 system.

In 1996, China ordered 14 Tor-M1 missile systems from Russia which were delivered under contract in 1997. In 1999, another contract for 13 Tor-M1 systems was signed between Russia and China. Delivery of the systems took place in 2000.

*The HQ-17 is a Chinese development of the Tor-M1 system with multiple improvements. Unlike the Tor system, the HQ-17 incorporates an IFF array on top of an electronically scanned array radar, modernized electronics, a new all-terrain launcher, and the ability to datalink with other Chinese systems*.

*FM-2000* is a mobile short-range air-defence (SHORAD) system unveiled by China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation at the 2018 Zhuhai Airshow. Its range is 15 km and engagement altitude is 10 km. It is carried on a 3 axle TEL. It is a version of the HQ-17

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## samsara

星海军事 said:


> My article about the HQ-17 series.
> 
> https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/V_ane8QXaZSSC_ZrO-eISg



*HQ-17A, A New-Generation Wheeled Field Air Defense Missile System*

Original: *星海坊主* 星海坊 (2019-05-13)

*In 1991, precision guided weapons were widely used in the Gulf War and achieved fruitful results.* The technical difficulties of air defense weapons have changed from "anti-ultra-low altitude aircraft" in the 1960s and 1970s to precision guided weapons with small cross-section (RCS / Radar Cross-Section), high overload, wide range of velocity and dive angle. In order to meet the needs of air defense in the new era, senior army officers believe that the army should be equipped with an air defense weapon system with anti-precision guidance capability, rapid mobility and certain armor protection to accompany field forces.

Based on this background, China began to import М1 (9К331) from Russia in the mid-1990s. But the "9958 incident" soon made it clear to China that if we want to base ourselves on the world, we can not do without an independent and sound defense industry system. Therefore, the development of a series of domestic equipment has been put on the agenda. Among them, the Second Academy of Aerospace, the main contractor of China's air defense missiles, has been commissioned to start the development of the field air defense missile weapon system of the army in the third generation of missile air defense missiles.





*
Yu Benshui 于本水* was the chief designer of Hongqi-7 series second generation missile air defense missile weapon system. According to the naming rules of air defense missiles, the model is named HQ-17 (Hong Qi 红旗 or Red Flag). After the team led by Yu Benshui has identified several key technologies for the development of HQ-17 through the research of relevant models, and on the basis of the HQ-7 series, which has the ability of rapid response and interception of ultra-low altitude targets, the vehicle-borne equipment has been further integrated and miniaturized, and the functions of search, launch and guidance have been integrated, thus completing the design of the first "vehicle integrated" air defense missile system in China.

In 2002, Chen Guoxin took over as the chief of HQ-17, while Yu Benshui, an academician in his late 70s, took a back seat. Later, Xue Lin, who had studied under Yu Benshui, took over the task of developing the HQ-17. *Along the way, the HQ-17 team broke through the technologies of vertical launching, fast turning, composite guidance design, single-chamber dual-thrust solid rocket engine, and so on, finally ensured the successful delivery of the HQ-17, which has been highly praised.* From the delivery of the HQ-17 in transport, it can be seen that it is superior to the prototype of the liquid-air suspension chassis.

“The HQ-17 anti-aircraft missile array and the PGZ-09 self-propelled anti-aircraft artillery finalized in 2009 constitute the division and brigade-level air defense combat units, and then with the HQ-16A finalized in 2010 and deployed in the group army level, the new generation of air defense system of the PLA Army is completely independent. *In December 2013, the HQ-17 anti-aircraft missile weapon system won the First Prize of the National Science and Technology Progress Award; in December 2014, the HQ-17 missile development won the First Prize of the National Defense Science and Technology Progress Award.* Although the HQ-17 was not included in the previous parade, it did participate in the parade for the 90th Anniversary of the Founding of the Army in 2017.”





In the table, the row means: (1) Target [km-away, km-high] / (2) Single Stage Thrust / (3) Double-Stage Thrust / (4) Double-Pulse Thrust

( … )


This is an incomplete translation work, for the rest of article along with several more pictures, please refer to the article link at below:

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/V_ane8QXaZSSC_ZrO-eISg


_How those sacrifices of the Third World countries like Iraq/Saddam Hussein had taught the Chinese the very good lessons to better arm themselves... there are several key brute smacking scenes upon several regions spanned over the last 2-3 decades that served as very good awakening lessons for China indeed! Something that I never thought of when I was still young, back then witnessed the savage smacking scenes one by one, which among other made famous the Ted Turner's original version of CNN and its well-known field hot-zone reporter, Peter Arnett (the era before the Pentagon's later creation of the EMBEDDED war reportage for regulated firing coverage)._





*Peter Arnett with Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan, 1997*

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## 055_destroyer

samsara said:


> Just to show the country appreciation on the quality and virtues of the HQ-17 红旗 (Hong Qi means Red Flag) system:
> 
> “The HQ-17 anti-aircraft missile array and the PGZ-09 self-propelled anti-aircraft artillery finalized in 2009 constitute the division and brigade-level air defense combat units, and then with the HQ-16A finalized in 2010 and deployed in the group army level, the new generation of air defense system of the PLA Army is completely independent. *In December 2013, the HQ-17 anti-aircraft missile weapon system won the First Prize of the National Science and Technology Progress Award; in December 2014, the HQ-17 missile development won the First Prize of the National Defense Science and Technology Progress Award.* Although the HQ-17 was not included in the previous parade, it did participate in the parade for the 90th Anniversary of the Founding of the Army in 2017.”


A weapon that can outrange most anti-tank missile. A weapon that can accompanied armour column on moved and can fired missile at incoming air threat in just few seconds preparation after stopping. An almost stand alone air defense while can be network for greater coverage. I am wondering if the air defense missile can be used as surface attack missile like SM-1 one too... Its no wonder this weapon won the first prize for such award. 

This platform cost a few times more than a Type99A mbt alone.


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## yantong1980

I think AD unit package with EW capability integrated with Air Force fighters/drones and S/MRBM/long-range artillery will be awesome.


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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16 SAM
> View attachment 561239
> View attachment 561240
> View attachment 561241
> View attachment 561242
> View attachment 561243
> View attachment 561244


Video: https://m.weibo.cn/6362632222/4373672124754326

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## bahadur999



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1497728405/4374878243248109

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## zectech

Any news on the deployment of HQ-26s on surface vessels?


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## LKJ86



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## Grandy

*China’s meter wave anti-stealth radar capable of guiding missiles to destroy stealth aircraft: senior designer*

China’s meter wave anti-stealth radar not only detects advanced stealth aircraft, but also guides missiles to destroy them, a senior Chinese radar designer said at a recent interview.

Meter wave radar can be deployed on vehicles, on land and warships, creating a dense web that gives hostile stealth aircraft nowhere to hide, Chinese military experts told the Global Times on Thursday.

“As long as they are designed to serve this purpose, meter wave anti-stealth radars can fulfill the requirement,” Wu Jianqi, a senior scientist at the state-owned China Electronics Technology Group Corporation (CETC) who conducts researches and designs anti-stealth radar, said when asked in an interview with the Naval & Merchant Ships magazine whether a meter wave radar can guide missiles to shoot down stealth aircraft.

Meter wave radars can detect stealth aircraft because modern stealth aircraft are mainly designed to avoid detection by microwave radar, and are less stealthy to meter wave radar, military experts noted.

However, analysts previously said that because of their low resolution and accuracy, meter wave radars can only send warnings about incoming threats. And even if microwave radars compensate for the shortcomings of the meter wave radars, they are unable to entirely overcome these shortcomings.

Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, told the Global Times that older meter wave radars could only see roughly an object’s general direction, not its exact location.

Wu solved the issue by designing the world’s first practical meter wave sparse array synthetic impulse and aperture radar.

Wu said that his radar has multiple transmitting and receiving antennas tens of meters high, scattered in a range of tens to hundreds of meters. They can continuously cover the sky as the radar receives echoes from all directions.

Wei said that this significantly enhances the radar’s ability to track an aerial target, pinpointing the stealth aircraft’s exact coordinates by synthesizing parameters and data gathered by the radar under the support of advanced algorithms.

Since the radar can now see stealth aircraft clearly and track them continuously and accurately, it could become capable of guiding long-range anti-aircraft missiles and landing precision strikes on them, Wei said.

Although other countries like Russia are also developing meter wave radars, Wu seems confident that China’s are the best.

“As for now, I do not see a meter wave air defense radar from abroad that can match the criteria of the advanced meter wave radar [like the one China has],” Wu said.

_Source: Global Times “China’s meter wave anti-stealth radar capable of guiding missiles to destroy stealth aircraft: senior designer”
_

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## LKJ86



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## cirr

A derivative of the DF-26 missile family is about to be armed with a new HGV warhead.

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## cirr

Early morning 02.06.2019 - midcourse interceptor？hypersonic weapon？

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## ozranger

cirr said:


> Early morning 02.06.2019 - midcourse interceptor？hypersonic weapon？



Objects in the photos were maneuvering.


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## cirr

ozranger said:


> Objects in the photos were maneuvering.



Could be the JL-3 or the new hypersonic YJ-XX。 Your guess is as good as mine。

https://weibo.com/1499104401/Hx1HU3aPL?type=comment


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## 52051

Its should be JL-3, only JL-3 need to launch from Bohai to the central desert in Xinjiang to cover a high-trajectory test.

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## The Ronin

*New Chinese submarine-launched ballistic missile spotted on test in the Bohai Bay*





0

The Chinese People’s Liberation Army-Navy successfully tested its next-generation of a submarine-launched ballistic missile on 2 June.

According to several media reports, the Chinese navy launched a new submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM), allegedly JL-3, in the Bohai Bay near the Shandong Peninsula at 4 hours 28 minutes in the morning on June 2, 2019.

Tests of the new Chinese SLBM were spotted by numerous witnesses and fishermen.

The JL-3 third-generation solid-fuelled missile, which must be used to equip the next-generation Chinese nuclear missile submarines, has an intercontinental range (up to 12-14 thousand km) and is capable of carrying up to ten independent warheads.

Earlier, the Maritime Security Administration of Liaoning Province issued a navigation warning about the closing of the maritime zone for “military exercises” in the Bohai Bay area on June 2, 2019.

According to Jane’s Missiles & Rockets, the JL-3 SLBM is intended to arm the next-generation Type 096 nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine (SSBN) class, the first of which is expected to enter service in the late 2020s.

The JL or Julang series – meaning “big wave” in Chinese – are intercontinental ballistic missiles designed for China’s nuclear-powered submarines, as part of the People’s Liberation Army strategy to extend the country’s nuclear deterrent capabilities from land to sea.

https://defence-blog.com/news/new-c...VfauFngZaG0mYS0J_L9y3gThbT9VMWGfVNcr8i9-SyWf0


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1135115866352304130

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## ozranger

The Ronin said:


> *New Chinese submarine-launched ballistic missile spotted on test in the Bohai Bay*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 0
> 
> The Chinese People’s Liberation Army-Navy successfully tested its next-generation of a submarine-launched ballistic missile on 2 June.
> 
> According to several media reports, the Chinese navy launched a new submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM), allegedly JL-3, in the Bohai Bay near the Shandong Peninsula at 4 hours 28 minutes in the morning on June 2, 2019.
> 
> Tests of the new Chinese SLBM were spotted by numerous witnesses and fishermen.
> 
> The JL-3 third-generation solid-fuelled missile, which must be used to equip the next-generation Chinese nuclear missile submarines, has an intercontinental range (up to 12-14 thousand km) and is capable of carrying up to ten independent warheads.
> 
> Earlier, the Maritime Security Administration of Liaoning Province issued a navigation warning about the closing of the maritime zone for “military exercises” in the Bohai Bay area on June 2, 2019.
> 
> According to Jane’s Missiles & Rockets, the JL-3 SLBM is intended to arm the next-generation Type 096 nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine (SSBN) class, the first of which is expected to enter service in the late 2020s.
> 
> The JL or Julang series – meaning “big wave” in Chinese – are intercontinental ballistic missiles designed for China’s nuclear-powered submarines, as part of the People’s Liberation Army strategy to extend the country’s nuclear deterrent capabilities from land to sea.
> 
> https://defence-blog.com/news/new-c...VfauFngZaG0mYS0J_L9y3gThbT9VMWGfVNcr8i9-SyWf0
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1135115866352304130



Just watched the video, it's not matching the ballistic missile clips, including those lauched from submarines, which I watched before, that normally the missile disappeared in sight very quickly after launch.

Seems to me, this one flew at near space at least for quite a while, otherwise the smoke trail wouldn't have been seen like that. I understand the actual smoke should be much smaller and those visuals were actually generated by the refracted sunlight on the smoke, which means the missile still flew within the atmosphere but the altitude was already very high. Of course I noticed the missile disappeared shortly and think it had already gone out of the atmosphere then.

Could that be a glider, any one?


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## yusheng

https://m.weibo.cn/status/4378837805149659?sudaref=login.sina.com.cn#&video

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM

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## JSCh

PLA Navy posted on weibo a picture of SLBM launched in 2002.

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## cirr

Second（JL-3?） launch in as many days？


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## LKJ86



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## cirr

Model on display in Chinese People's Revolutionary Military Museum

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## JSCh

*China showcases cluster of ‘aircraft carrier killer’ missiles*
Source:Global Times Published: 2019/6/5 17:05:26




The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force showcases a cluster of 10 DF-21D anti-ship ballistic missiles in a 2019 promotional video. Photo: screenshot of China Central Television

In a rare move, the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force displayed 10 DF-21D anti-ship ballistic missiles in a recent video, as China reaffirmed the weapon's capability of attacking medium- to large-sized vessels.

The 10 DF-21D missiles can be seen erected into launch positions in a promotional video of the PLA Rocket Force, Weihutang, a column on the military affiliated with China Central Television, reported on Wednesday.

This type of weapon can serve as a trump card in naval asymmetrical combat, as it is capable of attacking medium- to large-sized vessels from land, the report said.

It is rare to see so many DF-21Ds gathered together, and 10 could be enough to do serious damage to a hostile aircraft carrier, military observers said.

Together with the DF-21D, China's DF-26 ballistic missile can reach targets even further at sea, according to reports.

The Weihutang report came after an unidentified flying object was spotted across multiple Chinese provinces on Sunday, as the PLA Rocket Force and Navy hinted on Monday evening that it may have been a Chinese submarine-launched ballistic missile test.

Analysts said that both events are demonstrations of China's strategic deterrence capability and determination to safeguard territorial integrity amid recent US military provocations in the Taiwan Straits and the South China Sea.

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

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## 925boy

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17 SAM
> View attachment 564433
> View attachment 564434
> View attachment 564435


Chinese version of Tor M-1?


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## LKJ86



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## vi-va

lcloo said:


> True, the perception of being threatened by China's first strike policy will only increase the urge of other nations to deploy more nuclear warheads aim at China's cities and other strategic infrastructures.
> 
> And the fear of being strike first by China may make other nuclear powers to carry out pre-emptive strike with-out much hesitation.
> 
> Unlike other war happy nations, China does not want any war and will always try to prevent war as much as it can. However, coupling first strike policy with a war preventive mindset is a disaster, as the enemy can only see the threat of first strike and not the policy to prevent war.
> 
> China had too many wars and too many deaths from the Taiping rebellion to the Civil war period, more than 50 million had died, some even estimated up to 70 million deaths. Thus not wise to instigate nuclear threat and fear onto others as this might bring more wars. Non-strike First policy first thought by chairman Mao is still the best.



Also, in Chairman Mao's era, China don't have the capability to initiate First Strike to US. DF-5 was not ready until Deng Xiaoping was in charge. USSR had way to many nuclear war heads and missiles, it's stupid to strike USSR firstly. Of course Mao thought through and made this wise decision.

Nowadays, we have different geopolitical situation, and China is building relatively equal nuclear deterrence comparing with US and Russia. But China still insist NFU doctrine, I think China learnt the lesson from USSR collapse. The threat from USSR is so severe, it paved the way for US to organize NATO and made NATO the most successful military group.

China don't want neighbors scrared, otherwise it will only let US take advantage and organize WPTO(I invented, West Pacific Treaty Organization) and contain China. In that case, China is doomed and China won't surpass US in foreseeable future.

The NFU doctrine and Peaceful Rise are the keystone for a better developing environment in neighborhood.

In the opposite, India is stupid and try to whip every neighbors, such as Bhutan, Nepal, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka. India's policy help Pakistan and China to isolate India in South Asia.

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1141880916534542336

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## bahadur999

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1141960211990626309


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## bahadur999

DF-17?

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## JSCh

*Speculation rife about DF-17 after video shows hypersonic vehicle*
By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/6/24 14:16:42



An animated video released by the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation shows a boost-glide vehicle reentering the atmosphere. Photo: Screenshot from Passion News

China's missile manufacturing giant showcased hypersonic boost-glide vehicles in a recent animated video, and media reports speculate that the weapon might be the DF-17 of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force.

Such weapons, which Russia and the US are developing, are very difficult to intercept due to their hypersonic speed and high mobility, experts said Monday.

The animated video, released by the state-owned China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC) on its social media platform Douyin account, shows the launch of multiple boost-glide vehicles, which reenter the atmosphere and hit an underground command center.

This is the first time the company has shown a simulated animation on a boost-glide vehicle, Passion News, a media outlet under k618.cn, a news portal run by the Communist Youth League of China Central Committee, reported on Sunday.

A boost-glide vehicle, which is essentially a warhead, is stored in the nose of a missile, and will be released once the rocket booster sends it fast and high enough. It will then fly over the upper edge of the atmosphere, changing directions frequently, which makes it very difficult to intercept by anti-missile systems, Wei Dongxu, a Beijing-based military analyst, told the Global Times on Monday.

Such a glide vehicle flies at hypersonic speeds, so the enemy has little time to react, Wei noted.

Russia's Avangard and the US' AGM-183A missiles also use similar technologies.

Citing analysts, Passion News said the weapon in the CASIC video could be the DF-17 of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force, as reports said the DF-17 missile uses a hypersonic boost-glide vehicle as its warhead.

The Chinese military has not yet announced any hypersonic glide vehicle deployment.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1143047824952532992

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## bahadur999

*US response to China's top air-to-air missile should not be underestimated: experts*
By Zhang Jie Source:Global Times Published: 2019/6/26 16:50:33




Two J-20s howling through the sky with their missile bays open, each showcasing six missiles as the stealth fighter jets celebrated the 69th birthday of the Chinese People's Liberation Army Air Force on the last day of the Airshow China 2018 in Zhuhai, Guangdong Province on Sunday. Photo: Cui Meng/GT

China should not underestimate the new long-range air-to-air missile being developed by the US Air Force, Chinese military experts said on Wednesday after the development of the new US weapon was revealed. 

The US Air Force is working with arms manufacturer Lockheed Martin and other branches of its military to develop a new long-range air-to-air missile called the AIM-260, which is expected to enter military service by 2022, US media outlet the National Interest reported on Monday.

The motivation behind such a development is to counter China's top long-range air-to-air missile, the PL-15, which was made public in 2016, the National Interest reported, quoting US Air Force Weapons Program Executive Officer Anthony Genatempo.

Having a maximum range of about 160 kilometers, the US' current air-to-air missile the AIM-120 is apparently inferior to China's PL-15, judging by the US military's decision to create a new weapon, the National Interest report said.

The PL-15 is equipped with active electronically scanned array radar and is thought to have a range of about 200 kilometers, the Business Insider reported on Monday. 

China's top stealth fighter jet J-20 displayed its weapons including what analysts said was the PL-15 missile at Airshow China in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province in November 2018.

*China is also developing a new missile known as the PL-21, which could reach targets 300 kilometers away, the Business Insider report said.*

Some Chinese military observers said the US, once a forerunner in weapon development, is now chasing China, and the new AIM-260 *could be a copycat of the PL-15* in terms of applied technologies.

An anonymous Chinese military expert, however, told the Global Times that China should not underestimate the AIM-260 due to its late-mover advantages.

The expert predicted that the US missile could use revolutionary technologies to boost range significantly without making it significantly larger, and these technologies will in return bring pressure to China's air-to-air missile development.

US media used to hype that China made copycat weapons, which makes little sense as weapon designing tends to converge due to similar combat requirements, said the expert, suggesting the US is probably not trying to copy China's weapons.

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## bahadur999

*Submarine-launched missile meets national security needs: Defense Ministry*
By Guo Yuandan and Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/6/27 22:28:42




On Monday, the People's Liberation Army Navy posts a file photo of the firing of a submarine-launched ballistic missile on Sina Weibo, China's Twitter-like social media, asking, "Do you believe [there are] UFOs, too?" Photo: screenshot of Sina Weibo

The scheduled test was normal, China's Ministry of National Defense said on Thursday, when asked about the alleged test launch of a JL-3 submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM) on June 2.

"These tests are not targeted at any country or objective," Defense Ministry spokesperson Ren Guoqiang said at a routine press conference.

Ren was responding to a question from the Global Times on reports that residents claimed to have seen an unidentified flying object (UFO) on June 2.

Just as media and netizens speculated on the true nature of the UFO, relating it to a naval exercise that took place in the Bohai Sea and Bohai Straits at the same time, the People's Liberation Army Rocket Force and Navy hinted on June 3 that the "UFOs" could be missiles launched.

Chinese and foreign reports then speculated that the missile could be China's new SLBM, the JL-3.

During the press conference, Ren did not explain what weapon was used in the test, however, if the information provided in the question was wrong and it was not the JL-3, the spokesperson would have denied it, as in many previous cases, military analysts said.

Military experts told the Global Times that the JL-3 is China's latest SLBM under development that is expected to reach targets farther away with higher accuracy and capable of carrying more warheads than China's current SLBMs.

The SLBM might have a range of up to 14,000 kilometers and be equipped with 10 independent guided nuclear warheads, Russia's state TV channel Russia Today reported.

China always pursues a defensive national defense policy and active defense military strategy, Ren said, noting that developing weapons and equipment meets the basic needs of safeguarding national security of China.

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## vi-va

http://www.guancha.cn/military-affairs/2019_07_02_507820.shtml

DF21D tested, at least 1 missile tested.

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## vi-va

viva_zhao said:


> http://www.guancha.cn/military-affairs/2019_07_02_507820.shtml
> 
> DF21D tested, at least 1 missile tested.


@Deino @ChineseTiger1986 @cirr @LKJ86 @Han Patriot @lcloo @samsara 
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/china/...-missile-tests-hotly-contested-south-n1025456

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## Han Patriot

viva_zhao said:


> @Deino @ChineseTiger1986 @cirr @LKJ86 @Han Patriot @lcloo @samsara
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/china/...-missile-tests-hotly-contested-south-n1025456


It works, with near real time monitoring, and beidou, we can sink a carrier.

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## vi-va

Han Patriot said:


> It works, with near real time monitoring, and beidou, we can sink a carrier.



Agree. The missiles are very expense, the whole system are much more expense including satellite, over-the-horizon radar, sonar, and so on.

China keep investing resources on this project, which mean it works.

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## 055_destroyer

viva_zhao said:


> Agree. The missiles are very expense, the whole system are much more expense including satellite, over-the-horizon radar, sonar, and so on.
> 
> China keep investing resources on this project, which mean it works.


It definitely works. They are long operation and not just prototype. Such test had long conducted in yellow sea area before. This is not new.

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## samsara

viva_zhao said:


> @Deino @ChineseTiger1986 @cirr @LKJ86 @Han Patriot @lcloo @samsara
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/china/...-missile-tests-hotly-contested-south-n1025456


The NBC news quoted the Pentagon report, which is as good as the China's 300 nuclear warheads. In essence it said China only has the DF-21D ballistic missile that can function as anti-ship missile. The report simply ignores the "Guam Express" DF-26  well, just believe as one wishes. I posted about the DF-26 earlier. It may not be in line with the USN posturing with all its carriers in the AsPac!

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## bahadur999

samsara said:


> The NBC news quoted the Pentagon report, which is as good as the China's 300 nuclear warheads. In essence it said China only has the DF-21D ballistic missile that can function as anti-ship missile. The report simply ignores the "Guam Express" DF-26  well, just believe as one wishes. I posted about the DF-26 earlier. It may not be in line with the USN posturing with all its carriers in the AsPac!


The DOD reports don't dive deep into details since it is an unclassified report - Only features trends. I am sure they know stuff that they can't share because it will risk their sources.
However, and as a result, most of those reports are recycled and almost boring after you read just one report. 
DF-21D is something that most government sources never referred to. We don't know estimated numbers and deployment for sure.


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## lcloo

La Chine lance 6 missiles ASBM vers la mer de Chine méridionale
China launches 6 ASBM missiles towards South China Sea

East Pendulum/ Henry K 8th July 2019

_Translated from French to English by Google translator:-
_
Details are beginning to be found about the recent firing of Chinese anti-ship ballistic missile towards the South China Sea, which took place on Monday, July 1 in southern China.

First revealed by the American media CNBC before being confirmed by the Pentagon, these ASBM launches of the Chinese Rocket Force finally concern six missiles that hit two different areas in the sea. The identification of the exact pattern used in these shots is still ongoing.

The CNBC text, published on July 2, citing two U.S. officers with knowledge of the matter, first referred to a "series of ASBM tests" of which at least one was pulled out to sea over the weekend, and they were potentially waiting for others until Wednesday, July 3.

Several U.S. Navy ships were present at the time in the South China Sea but none were near the area or endangered, according to one of the officers who is not authorized to reveal further details.

First described as "concerning" by these early U.S. officers, Lieutenant-Colonel Dave Eastburn, a Pentagon spokesman, then used the word "disturbing" when commenting on the event.

"The Pentagon was aware of the launch of Chinese missiles from the artificial structures of the South China Sea near the Spratlys Islands," Eastburn said. "What is really disturbing about this act is that it is in direct contradiction to President XI's statement. . . . that it would not militarize these artificial outposts."

But this first statement that the departure of Chinese anti-ship ballistic missiles would be on the Spratlys, south of the South China Sea, seems both unlikely and unfounded - deploying weapons of this category and deploying them use from seriously missing sites of strategic depth, such as Subi Reef with its 5.52 km2 yet already the largest among the Spratly islands, would be rather a mistake because TEL gear have nowhere to shelter and then become very vulnerable targets to pre-emptive strikes, while on the continent these same ASBMs can blend into the mass easily with the extent of the Chinese road network and thanks to the numerous underground fortifications.

It should also be noted that to reach major naval targets such as aircraft carriers and helicopter carriers sailing in the South China Sea, positioning the ASBBs on the fortified reefs at the Spratleys does not have any more tactical advantages. if only in terms of scope. A deployment to the island of Hainan or to the mountainous provinces of Guizhou and Yunnan will be more than enough.

Is it, then, a personal misunderstanding of the spokesman, a wilful misinformation of the Pentagon, or a communication war effort on the part of American institutions to discredit its adversaries? However, according to other American sources, the missiles were indeed launched from the Chinese mainland and not the Spratlys:

Faced with the Pentagon's "accusation" that the missiles were fired from the Spratlys Islands, the Chinese Ministry of Defense was quick to give its version of events - In the first response provided to the Global Times, the communications office of MoD Chino is states that "According to the annual training plan, the Southern Theatre Command of the People's Liberation Army recently conducted a real-fire exercise near the island of Hainan. This is not aimed at any particular country or target" ).

The second reply, sent to the Reuters news agency, essentially repeats the same message to the Global Times that it was only a planned live shooting exercise, adding to this: "The reports do not agree with the facts" (The relevant reports do not agree with the facts).
However, the precise point of this "denial" - does it concern the location of the firing, or the fact that it is highly sensitive anti-ship ballistic missiles? In any case the message looks curiously like a standard response that foreign journalists are used to hearing in Beijing during press conferences at this Chinese ministry...

Assuming that the Chinese MoD is true - that these firings are part of the Chinese Rocket Force's annual training plan and not a response to the joint maneuvers of the USNaval Group USS Ronald Reagan and the Japanese Navy at sea South China in June - we could then consider these ASBM launches as an extension of the exercise in January this year as the Chinese military led to southern China, where the Rockets Forces as well as other bodies (Support Force strategic, Marine...) worked together in a counter-offensive simulation. There had been rumours at the time of real shootings planned "in a few months" to put this joint work into practice.

And in reality these weekend shots of 29-30 June are more or less known in advance - indeed, a security alert had been issued by the Chinese Maritime Security Administration to signal the closure of a maritime zone for "military exercises", in the middle of the South China Sea (see red zone below).

This area, which bears the number HN-0075, prohibits access to all ships from Saturday 29 June 00:00 to Wednesday 3 July 24:00 Beijing time. It should be noted that this alert was then cancelled by HN-0078, published on 2 July, suggesting the end of the exercise.

*琼航警0075*
南海 2019年6月29日0000时至7月3日2400时，在
1:13-48.00N/114-10.00E
2:12-48.00N/114-10.00E
3:12-48.00N/116-02.00E
4:13-48.00N/116-02.00E
诸点连线范围内进行军事训练。禁止驶入。

*琼航警0078*
南海 撤销2019年琼航警0075，希各航船注意。




In parallel to this maritime access ban, we note the closure of the airspace also, this time in another area (see the yellow zone below) and at a different time. The information is described in a message to airfares (NOTAM) A3298/19 and the ban on air access at all altitudes was only valid for a short time on 1 July from 07:00 to 12:00 Beijing time.
A3298/19
Q) ZJSA/QRDCL/IV/BO/W/000/999/
A) ZJSA B) 1906302300 C) 1907010400
E) A TEMPORARY DANGER AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED BY:
N185006E1110248-N192230E11115812-N183342E1125736-N173533E1133544-N 171343E1133409-N163654E1121354-N175336E112200-N185006E1110248.
ALL ACFT ARE FORBIDDEN TO FLY INTO THE TEMPORARY DANGER AREA.
VERTICAL LIMITS: SFC-UNL.
F) SFC G) UNL

The combination of the HN-0075 marine safety alert and the NOTAM A3298/19 then allows the exact window of fire to be found, which is in fact the same as that indicated in the NOTAM. The Chinese ASBBs are therefore expected to have taken off on Monday, July 1st in the morning.

And that date is also confirmed by a U.S. military officer on condition of anonymity, quoted by Japanese media NHK, according to which six ballistic missiles were launched from the mainland towards the South China Sea on Sunday, June 30 Pacific.

Given the 15-hour difference between Beijing time (UTC-8) and Pacific time (UTC-7), this means that the tests were listed by the Americans on July 1st Beijing time.

This same source has also added an additional element - the six ASBMs have in fact struck two distinct areas at sea. But the missile type or types - namely DF-16x, DF-21D or DF-26C if not more - is still being identified.
_

_
_

_
Apart from this open question about the type or types of ASBM used, the Chinese missile departure site also remains an interesting point to study. No authentic photos or videos are available at the moment to allow the identification of the places, but by drawing a line connecting the two no-reach zones this takes us to the mountainous province of Guizhou, especially near Anshun, where new anti-ship units of the Chinese Rocket Force would be based.

The question will also be examined on the usefulness of the two zones in question - did the missile heads strike the yellow zone or the red zone instead? Knowing that the shallowest place in the red zone is still at -293 meters deep, this makes any recovery operation more difficult than if it had been in the yellow zone.

Then, at the time of the firing, where are the optical, radar and electromagnetic space satellites and constellations that China had launched over the last 10 years to trace and identify the "big ships"? Has the supersonic reconnaissance drone designed by the 611 Chengdu Institute to assess strike damage been deployed? Did the Chinese military use manoeuvrable or fixed targets at sea?

These are all questions that remain to be studied, we will not fail to return to these subjects in the near future.

To follow.
Henry K.

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## Grandy

Science 
*How China could use bio-waste to mass-produce cheap super-fuel for missiles*

Scientists’ large-scale conversion of agricultural waste into fuel offers savings up to 60 per cent, they say
Discovery could slash military costs and bring civilian applications of hypersonic flight technology closer



Stephen Chen  
Published: 11:30pm, 15 Jul, 2019






Super-fuel for military aircraft costs nearly 10 times as much as ordinary jet fuel for commercial planes. Photo: Shutterstock.

Chinese scientists say they have developed a technology to convert bio-waste into fuel for missiles and hypersonic planes, reducing fuel costs by as much as 60 per cent.

The existing JP-10 super-fuel for military aircraft has numerous advantages including high energy density, good thermal stability and low freezing point, but it costs more than US$7,000 per tonne – nearly 10 times as much as ordinary jet fuel for commercial aircraft.

It is used mainly in cruise missiles and ramjet or scramjet engines on new-generation aircraft travelling at hypersonic speed, or five times faster than sound.

Scientists from the Dalian Institute of Chemical Physics, at the Chinese Academy of Sciences in the northeastern province of Liaoning, predicted using the new technology in the near future could reduce the cost to as low as US$2,547 per tonne.

The secret, according to their paper, published in the latest issue of German chemistry journal _Angewandte Chemie_, lies in cheap bio-waste.

Using agricultural and forestry residues including bran, chaff and mill dust, Professor Zhang Tao, Li Ning and colleagues discovered new chemical processes that can turn the waste to JP-10 fuel on a large scale with unprecedented efficiency.

At present, the super-fuel comes from coal tar or naphtha, and the synthesis is extremely costly and unfriendly to the environment.

The bio-JP-10 fuel can be produced by two different methods, one involving six steps of chemical reactions and the other only four, according to the paper.

* China’s plan to make jet fuel from restaurant leftovers*

Combining these methods with the latest technology in biomass conversion, the researchers said, the super-fuel can be mass-produced at a price equivalent to that of some of the bio-jet fuels already in commercial use, thanks to government subsidies provided for their environmental benefits.

“We believe that the future commercialisation of bio-JP-10 fuel is very promising, especially taking policy support and exemption from CO2 emission tax into consideration,” the authors wrote in the paper.

Liu Huoxing, professor at the school of energy and power engineering at Beijing University of Aeronautics and Astronautics, said civilian applications of hypersonic flight technology faced many challenges that remained to be solved, with the problem of high fuel prices being one of the headaches.

“No airline will buy a plane if the fuel costs too much, however fast it can fly,” he said.

Liu, who conducts research on engine technology for hypersonic
vehicles but was not involved in the Dalian study, said the reduction of production costs for jet fuel was usually incremental and it was quite rare to see a significant drop.
“This can be an important development,” he said of the Dalian findings.

China is developing various models of hypersonic speed aircraft for military and civilian use. Some are aimed at flying distances such as Shanghai to Los Angeles in a couple of hours.

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## bahadur999



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## samsara

From Dafeng Cao on 2019.07.25:

_A supersonic drone heat resisting nose cone is on display in Anshun, Guizhou Province, which can withstand temperature as high as 350°Celcius for a long time and is 30 percent lighter than Titanium alloy._







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1154209211120623616
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From Henry Kenhmann at the East Pendulum on 2019.07.25:

_This could finally be the first piece in real life of the *supersonic drone of the 611 Chengdu Institute* that I have been looking for a long time. This is the composite front tip, exposed by a subsidiary of AVIC, able to withstand up to 350°Celcius and lighter than a Titanium alloy._

(the same pic as Cao's)


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1154296424781058049

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## JSCh

*Russia kicks off delivery of 2nd S-400 regiment set to China by sea, says source - Military & Defense - TASS*
The delivery of the entire regiment set to China envisages "involving no less than three vessels" that will take to the sea one by one within short time intervals



S-400 surface-to-air missile systems
© Sergei Malgavko/TASS

MOSCOW, July 24. /TASS/. Russia has launched an operation to deliver the 2nd regiment set of S-400 surface-to-air missile systems to China by sea, a source in military and diplomatic circles told TASS on Wednesday.

"A transport vessel with the first batch of hardware from the second S-400 regiment set for China has taken to the sea from the port of Ust-Luga on the Baltic coast. Therefore, like in the case with Turkey, the deliveries of the systems have started several months ahead of the term stipulated in the contract," the source said.

READ ALSO
Russia’s charter carrier launches direct flights from Moscow to China’s Hefei​https://tass.com/economy/1068652
The delivery of the entire S-400 regiment set to China envisages "involving no less than three vessels" that will take to the sea one by one "within short time intervals," the source added.

Russia’s Federal Service for Military and Technical Cooperation declined to comment for TASS on the information provided by the source.

China became the first foreign buyer of Russia’s most advanced S-400 ‘Triumf’ surface-to-air missile systems. Russia signed a contract with China on the delivery of two regiment sets of S-400 air defense missile systems in 2014.

The first regiment set of S-400 anti-aircraft missile systems was delivered to China in the spring of 2018. The Chinese military successfully test-fired the missile launchers from the first S-400 regiment set, striking an aerodynamic and a ballistic target at its firing ranges.

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## 055_destroyer

samsara said:


> From Dafeng Cao on 2019.07.25:
> 
> _A supersonic drone heat resisting nose cone is on display in Anshun, Guizhou Province, which can withstand temperature as high as 350°Celcius for a long time and is 30 percent lighter than Titanium alloy._
> 
> View attachment 570723
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1154209211120623616
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> From Henry Kenhmann at the East Pendulum on 2019.07.25:
> 
> _This could finally be the first piece in real life of the *supersonic drone of the 611 Chengdu Institute* that I have been looking for a long time. This is the composite front tip, exposed by a subsidiary of AVIC, able to withstand up to 350°Celcius and lighter than a Titanium alloy._
> 
> (the same pic as Cao's)
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1154296424781058049


Looks like sharkfin.


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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 571079


What's this impressive maneuver all about? Anti-air missile?

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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> What's this impressive maneuver all about? Anti-air missile?


HQ-16

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## LKJ86



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## ZeEa5KPul

DF-41 ICBM cruising down the highway

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


A cool short clip of the anti-air defense! 

_“I stride across mountains and rivers, have a long and arduous journey, just to strike you in one second”_

我跨越千山万水，只为一击秒杀“你” | 小央视频

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

DF-26C ?

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## LKJ86

YJ-18

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 573049
> View attachment 573050


Wow, the tyres have covers!

Is this a TEL? What's the missile model?

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## LKJ86

samsara said:


> Wow, the tyres have covers!
> 
> Is this a TEL? What's the missile model?


HQ-9 SAM

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## JSCh

From weibo, speculate to be DF41 missile on training for the upcoming 70th national parade.

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 573046
> View attachment 573047
> View attachment 573048

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Akasa

星海军事 said:


> The improved version of FK-1000, FK-1000A, seems to be prepared for self-use.



Isn't it a bit redundant with the HQ-17?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 573797
> View attachment 573798
> View attachment 573799
> View attachment 573800
> View attachment 573801
> View attachment 573802
> View attachment 573803
> View attachment 573804
> View attachment 573805
> View attachment 573806

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

DF-17???

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## LKJ86



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## Figaro

LKJ86 said:


> DF-17???
> View attachment 574741


How reliable is this illustration though? It would appear all the text is in traditional Chinese ... implying the illustration is not from the mainland.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## LKJ86



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## Beast

DF-26 hitting moving vessel.

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## smooth manifold

Beast said:


> DF-26 hitting moving vessel.


Am I the only one who can't see any target hitting scene in this video?

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## Beast

smooth manifold said:


> Am I the only one who can't see any target hitting scene in this video?


Unless you have access to US intel department. You are not going to see the actual process but it exists. See how US military is quiet about DF-26 and not talking it as fake ASBM. You need to accept how China convey message about its military capabilities. They dont openly show you their capabilities or purposely show off but it doesnt mean it dont exist or dont work. They want just the US military to know its capabilities. Surely, US spy intel satellite witness the whole process.

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## vi-va

smooth manifold said:


> Am I the only one who can't see any target hitting scene in this video?


When China was incapable to hit US aircraft carrier, US media will big mouth on China threat. When China demonstrate the capability, US media will keep quiet like a kitty.

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## Figaro

Beast said:


> Unless you have access to US intel department. You are not going to see the actual process but it exists. See how US military is quiet about DF-26 and not talking it as fake ASBM. You need to accept how China convey message about its military capabilities. They dont openly show you their capabilities or purposely show off but it doesnt mean it dont exist or dont work. They want just the US military to know its capabilities. Surely, US spy intel satellite witness the whole process.


Then dont give a misleading caption ... your caption suggests we should see footage of the DF-26 hitting a moving vessel. That is clearly not the case.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

The land-attack version of YJ-18

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## Smarana Mitra

Beast said:


> Unless you have access to US intel department. You are not going to see the actual process but it exists. See how US military is quiet about DF-26 and not talking it as fake ASBM. You need to accept how China convey message about its military capabilities. They dont openly show you their capabilities or purposely show off but it doesnt mean it dont exist or dont work. They want just the US military to know its capabilities. Surely, US spy intel satellite witness the whole process.


Why is it ok for USA to see but not the public? What crimes have normal people don't which makes them undeserving? Why does USA have the privilege to see the missile test see being an enemy of China?


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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> The land-attack version of YJ-18
> View attachment 576657



Translation, please?


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## Beast

Smarana Mitra said:


> Why is it ok for USA to see but not the public? What crimes have normal people don't which makes them undeserving? Why does USA have the privilege to see the missile test see being an enemy of China?


Fear is the word. Does US really want US public to lose opinion about USN capable of winning war with China? The very fact US failed to defend against DF-26 ASBM and a single missile sinking a US CVN with 5000 american sailor onboard?

ASBM travel a 10 mach speed with a 300kg warhead. You can imagine the upon impact and the destruction. It might even directly penetrate the hull and right into the kneel and break it. That is enough to sink even a 100000 tons warship.

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## LKJ86

Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM 







Via @南海舰队 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @当代海军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东线瞭望 from Weixin

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## ZeEa5KPul

Smarana Mitra said:


> Why is it ok for USA to see but not the public? What crimes have normal people don't which makes them undeserving? Why does USA have the privilege to see the missile test see being an enemy of China?


Because the US is the one test is aimed at. China making this sort of thing public is unnecessarily bellicose. So long as the intended audience understands the message, nothing more need be said.

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## Smarana Mitra

ZeEa5KPul said:


> Because the US is the one test is aimed at. China making this sort of thing public is unnecessarily bellicose. So long as the intended audience understands the message, nothing more need be said.


It is the duty of a friend to tell all those things which he tells to the enemy. So, China has a duty to tell its people what it tells USA. Otherwise, it will be like waging information war on own people while being frank with USA. It will be unfair. If the enemy knows, let the friend also know


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## samsara

Smarana Mitra said:


> It is the duty of a friend to tell all those things which he tells to the enemy. So, China has a duty to tell its people what it tells USA. Otherwise, it will be like waging information war on own people while being frank with USA. It will be unfair. If the enemy knows, let the friend also know


WHAT FOR ???

Those who need to know, do know!!! Message sent already  lol

Those who don't know, need not to know! Just irrelevant!!!


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## ozranger

Smarana Mitra said:


> It is the duty of a friend to tell all those things which he tells to the enemy. So, China has a duty to tell its people what it tells USA. Otherwise, it will be like waging information war on own people while being frank with USA. It will be unfair. If the enemy knows, let the friend also know


They normally have internal information channels or circles, mostly through various levels of CCP organisations, people's congress systems, etc. Hence all relevant people can get informed if something happens. But no one within that scope would publish anything in public if not allowed.


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## Smarana Mitra

ozranger said:


> Hence all relevant people can get informed if something happens


This is the problem. Who decides who is relevant or not? Are young but talented people irrelevant just because they haven't yet grown their nexus network? That is why free knowledge and information sharing is needed. Humans can't identify all those relevant or not just by looks.


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## Broccoli

*New Missile Silo And DF-41 Launchers Seen In Chinese Nuclear Missile Training Area*
https://fas.org/blogs/security/2019/09/china-silo-df41/

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## Broccoli

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 577622
> 
> Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin



When have they begun using woodland camo? It can be also seen in other recent pics.


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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weibo

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## shanlung

I have been trying to locate the layout model above on Google Earth.
But cannot find it.
That was a practise targetting site in Western China for Chinese missiles to land warheads on.
And supposed to be a representation of the Naval base of Yokosuka Japan.

Will appreciate the help of you folks here if you know the coordinate I need to set on Google Earth to get that.

I have located the practise targetting site representation of Japanese airbases located in Western China on Google Earth for those interested. 
Latitude 40°30'10.73"N
Longitude 93°28'46.58"E

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## LKJ86

Via www.top81cn.cn

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## ZeEa5KPul



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## bahadur999

http://english.chinamil.com.cn/view/2019-09/18/content_9627920.htm

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## shanlung

shanlung said:


> I have been trying to locate the layout model above on Google Earth.
> But cannot find it.
> That was a practise targetting site in Western China for Chinese missiles to land warheads on.
> And supposed to be a representation of the Naval base of Yokosuka Japan.
> 
> Will appreciate the help of you folks here if you know the coordinate I need to set on Google Earth to get that.
> 
> I have located the practise targetting site representation of Japanese airbases located in Western China on Google Earth for those interested.
> Latitude 40°30'10.73"N
> Longitude 93°28'46.58"E



I finally found the location of the practise model of the harbour and ships.
China removed those outlines of docks and ships. But some landmarks still there.

Google Earth for those interested. 
Latitude 40°30'10.73"N
Longitude 93°28'46.58"E

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM


































Via www.top81cn.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东线瞭望 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @空军记者 from Weixin

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## Ibn Batouta

It is possible to have a video of the Sky Dragon 50 Air Defence System in action with the Chinese Army ? 
We bought this system in Morocco but i never see a video of this system.

Thanks.

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## lcloo

Ibn Batouta said:


> It is possible to have a video of the Sky Dragon 50 Air Defence System in action with the Chinese Army ?
> We bought this system in Morocco but i never see a video of this system.
> 
> Thanks.


There are a few videos on you tube regarding SD-50, this is one of them. Live firing of missile at the end of this video.

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## bahadur999

lcloo said:


> There are a few videos on you tube regarding SD-50, this is one of them. Live firing of missile at the end of this video.


Funny that the Army Recognition page says that SD-50 is the name of the system and ere you can see that it is (indeed) also the name of the missile.


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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/3937348351/4420455777873811

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## ozranger

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 581063
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/3937348351/4420455777873811



Truly amazing! Looking forward to a close-up photo!


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## Deino

ozranger said:


> Truly amazing! Looking forward to a close-up photo!




Pardon, but what type of missile is this?

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## ZeEa5KPul

Deino said:


> Pardon, but what type of missile is this?


It's a near-space supersonic cruise missile. The shot is taken from this tacky video.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1176812953368027136

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## Ibn Batouta

What is the name of this system please ?


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## ZeEa5KPul

Ibn Batouta said:


> What is the name of this system please ?


Rumoured to be CJ-100. We'll find out within a week.

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## Navigator

Since it missile of PLA Rocket forces, it real name must be some "DF-xx"..

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## vi-va

Navigator said:


> Since it missile of PLA Rocket forces, it real name must be some "DF-xx"..


Rumor df-100

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## j20blackdragon

This so-called "cruise missile" looks an awful lot like SM-3 to me...

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## vi-va

j20blackdragon said:


> This so-called "cruise missile" looks an awful lot like SM-3 to me...


sm-3 do NOT have ramjet.


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## Fsjal

Wait, it's a cruise missile? Looks like a theater ballistic missile tbh.

Is there any estimated figures on the range and speed of this missile?


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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## ozranger

Fsjal said:


> Wait, it's a cruise missile? Looks like a theater ballistic missile tbh.
> 
> Is there any estimated figures on the range and speed of this missile?



I just read some tweets and it was said to have a range of 1000+km and speed from 3Ma to 5Ma. So it is a near space, supersonic (not hypersonic as it is not over 5Ma yet) cruise missile for attacking at least land targets.

Most people think it's powered by Ramjet or even Scramjet.

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## bahadur999

*Did China just accidentally show off its new supersonic cruise missile?*

Mystery weapon is seen in video released by PLA Rocket Force as part of 70th anniversary celebrations only to disappear from edited version
Missile’s design unlike any other in military’s arsenal, experts say




Liu Zhen 

Published: 1:00am, 27 Sep, 2019




People’s Republic of China
, which falls on Tuesday.
The film contained a two-second clip in which an unidentified missile with an unusual design is seen being fired from a launcher truck. However, in the later version, the scene is replaced with footage of two separate missile launches in a desert setting.


The editing did not go unnoticed by China’s military observers, several of whom suggested that the weapon in the original film might have been a never-before-seen supersonic cruise missile.



In the clip the missile appears to have slim dorsal fins, foldable tail fins and additional propellant, all of which, according to one expert who asked not to be identified, suggests it is designed to fly long distances and faster than the speed of sound.

“The new missile would probably have a range of more than 1,000km [680 miles],” the person said.

The PLA already has a land-attack subsonic cruise missile – the Changjian-10 – that has an operational range of more than 1,500km (932 miles), which is equivalent to that of a medium-range ballistic missile.


Ballistic and cruise missiles differ in a number of ways but the latter tend to fly at lower altitudes and at slower speeds, making them more vulnerable to defence systems.

However, the Rocket Force has made significant progress in the development of glider vehicles for its ballistic missiles, like the Dongfeng-17 (DF-17), which is now capable of gliding in outer atmosphere at upwards of five times the speed of sound, making it more able to evade missile defence systems.


“Now that the DF-17’s glider technology is becoming more mature it could be used elsewhere. Other missiles, like this cruise missile [in the video clip], could also adopt similar vehicles to carry the warhead,” the source said.

The missile in the original footage also appeared to be fitted with several unidentified items of kit, which a second observer, who also asked not to be identified, said might be jamming and anti-jamming devices.

“These would enhance the missile’s ability to avoid electronic interference or guided interception by enemy missile defence systems, and therefore increase its chances of penetration,” he said.

China’s missiles are likely to be a big feature of the military parade that will take place on Tuesday in Beijing, with several of them going on display to the public for the very first time.





A military vehicle carrying DF-41 intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) travels through Beijing on September 14 in a rehearsal for the military parade. Photo: Reuters
Share:
Among the stars of the show will be the DF-17 and the DF-41, an 
intercontinental ballistic missile
that is capable of carrying 10 nuclear warheads and has the range to strike any point on the US mainland. It remains to be seen if the mystery supersonic cruise missile will be among them.
Chinese President Xi Jinping
, who also chairs the Central Military Commission, will officiate the day’s events, which will also feature 15,000 troops from 59 units, more than 160 aircraft and 580 active weapon systems.
In 1949, then Communist Party chairman Mao Zedong was guest of honour at a military parade to declare the founding of the People’s Republic of China.

While there were more troops on hand that day – about 19,000 in total – there was significantly less military hardware, with just 17 aircraft taking part in the fly-past. Nine of them even did two laps to make the air force look bigger than it actually was.

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## Bussard Ramjet

ozranger said:


> I just read some tweets and it was said to have a range of 1000+km and speed from 3Ma to 5Ma. So it is a near space, supersonic (not hypersonic as it is not over 5Ma yet) cruise missile for attacking at least land targets.
> 
> Most people think it's powered by Ramjet or even Scramjet.



You can't have a near space ramjet or scramjet.


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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## Ibn Batouta

The Chinese Army use the Sky Dragon 50 AD system or no ? I never see a picture or video of this system used by chinese army. 

Thank you.


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## vi-va

Bussard Ramjet said:


> You can't have a near space ramjet or scramjet.


of course you can. as booster.

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## LKJ86

Via @eaglephoto from Weibo

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## vi-va

DF-17


























DF-41















JL-2

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## Brainsucker

What is DF-100?


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## Dungeness

Brainsucker said:


> What is DF-100?




Supersonic cruise missile.

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## Grandy

DF-100 Hypersonic Cruise Missile at National Day Military Parade 2019. With a range of 2000-3000 kms that is capable of hitting land targets or large warships.

*DF 17, DF 100 & DF 41 make debuts at National Day parade*





The Strategic Attack Formation is one of the most anticipated parts of Tuesday's military parade, as the DF-17, CJ-100, and DF-41 missiles, World's longest range ICBM, with range of 15,000 km, made their first appearances. DF-17 conventional missiles are used for precision strikes against medium-and-close targets. The hypersonic CJ-100 With a range of 2000-3000 km, on the other hand, is the latest cruise missile of the CJ family, and can strike long-range targets. Lastly, the DF-41 has gained worldwide attention. The purpose of the DF-41 intercontinental strategic nuclear missile is for balancing power and securing victory. Other equipment being showcased includes the second-generation JL-2 long-range ballistic missiles, solid-fuel DF-31 nuclear missiles and DF-5B nuclear missiles, which can carry multiple warheads and excel at both assault and defense. #70YearsOn #NationalDay2019

*Highlights: China celebrates 70th anniversary*





*China's National Day Military Parade 2019: Best Moments *





*China marks the 70th anniversary *

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## FuturePAF

Any image of the *DF-100* missile itself? any indication of its size? It seems it would be perfect SLCM (3000 km range)for the Deterence Role for a certain navy. 
(12 missiles could be carried in each Type 032 AIP SSK , a potent force if they have 3-4 of these submarines and always have one submarine always out on patrol)











The *DF-17* (2500 km range) is also very impressive and would also help the strategic ground forces of that same country maintain credible minimum deterrence. 

A mix of the DF-100 SLCM and a DF-17 type SLBM would complicate any enemy force in countering a second strike capability. All within a Submarine as small and quiet as the Type 032.

With China's knowledge of the S-400, We can assume these systems know how to navigate around *ANY ABM currently out there.*

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM 




Via @太湖啥个 from Weibo

DF-17




Via @赵昱桦-John from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @钢铁机机 from Weibo

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## FuturePAF

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17A SAM
> View attachment 581900
> 
> Via @太湖啥个 from Weibo
> 
> DF-17
> View attachment 581913
> 
> Via @赵昱桦-John from Weibo


Specs on the HQ-17? Is it equal to or better than the Tor System?


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## The Ronin

*Analysis of Anti-ship missiles and Ship-borne air defense system unveiled at Chinese military parade 2019*
Naval Technology
POSTED ON FRIDAY, 04 OCTOBER 2019 10:45

A variety of shore-to-ship missiles, ship-to-ship missiles, "YJ-12" and "YJ-18/18A" as well as the latest ship-borne air defence weapons "HHQ-9A" were shown as part of the naval battle group formations that marched through Beijing's in a military parade marking the 70th founding anniversary of the People's Republic of China.





*YJ-12 air-launched, anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM)* *(Picture source: Chinese Internet)*

The YJ-12B shore-to-ship missiles, which made their debut in China's military parade, can hit large and-medium-sized ships and play an important role in China's coastal defence system. An upgraded version of YJ-12 supersonic anti-ship missile, YJ-12B boasts a maximum range of 310 miles and could be stationed in remote islands, such as those in the South China Sea. China claims that the missile can sink medium to large vessels during surprise attacks and will serve as a cornerstone for the country's naval defence system.

The YJ-12 is an air-launched, anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) that China deploys on its H-6K medium-range strategic bombers. The YJ-12 has a range of 400 km, can reach speeds of up to Mach 3, and is capable of performing air-borne evasive manoeuvres before hitting its target. [1] China began developing the YJ-12 during the 1990s and began deploying it aboard its bombers in the 2000s. While the YJ-12 is air-launched, the CM-302 export variant can be launched from air, land, or sea platforms and used in a land-attack role.

The YJ-12 poses a number of a number of security concerns for U.S. naval forces in the Pacific and is considered the “most dangerous anti-ship missile China has produced thus far.” [2] The danger posed by the YJ-12 comes from its range of 400 km, making it the longest-ranged ACBM ever engineered, and its ability to travel at high rates of speed (up to Mach 3). This makes it difficult for Aegis Combat Systems and SM-2 surface-to-air missiles that protect U.S. carrier strike groups to identify and engage the missile since it can be launched beyond their engagement ranges, which greatly reduces the U.S. Navy’s time to react. Protection against the YJ-12 is even more difficult due to its cork-screw-like turns which allow it to evade final defences. With the combination of Chinese Flankers, YJ-12’s can potentially reach up to 1,900km which could cause an even larger problem for the U.S. than China’s DF-21D ASBM. Deployment of the YJ-12 and the development of related ASCMs also demonstrates China’s desire to field anti-access and area denial capabilities in case of future conflict.





*YJ-18 Beijing's latest anti-ship cruise missiles* *(Picture source: Chinese Internet)*

YJ-18 and YJ-18A are Beijing's latest anti-ship cruise missiles. Being paraded for the first time, the two missiles can be launched from submarines as well as ships. They have been described as China's 'secret weapons' for naval warfare. Both missiles can be launched vertically from vessels and travel as fast as three times the speed of sound, it is claimed. YJ is the acronym for 'eagle strike' in Chinese.

The YJ-18 is a vertically-launched, anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) that can travel at supersonic speeds of up to Mach 3 and has a range of 540km. The YJ-18 carries up to a 300 kg high explosive (HE) warhead that can take out a destroyer-sized ship and severely damage a carrier-sized vessel. The PLA Navy deploys the YJ-18 on its Luyang III DDG and Type 055 CG surface combatant ships and Song-, Yuan-, and Shang-class attack submarines. Although China currently has only one Luyang III destroyer with a vertical-launch system capable of firing the YJ-18, it plans to have ten more ships operational by 2017.

The YJ-18’s ability to accelerate to supersonic speeds close to its target makes it difficult for ships to destroy the incoming missile with onboard guns. This ASCM also increases the stand-off distance for Chinese vessels and contributes to their anti-access area denial (A2/AD) capabilities. China’s A2/AD capabilities could prove critical during a conflict in the western Pacific and adds to its growing arsenal of anti-ship cruise and ballistic missiles.





*HHQ-9 Long Range Air Defence Missiles (Picture source: Chinese Internet)*

The HQ-9 is a long-range surface-to-air missile intended to counter a wide spectrum of airborne threats such as supersonic aircraft, helicopters cruise missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs). It was designed by the China Academy of Defence Technology to counter targets at ranges of up to 200 kilometres and altitudes of up to 30,000 meters. The HQ-9 missile is utilized by a mobile ground-based air defence known as HQ-9A and its naval version which is being provided to surface combatants.

The HQ-9B or HHQ-9B is a new vertical launch, long-range, surface-to-air missile (SAM) developed for the Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) to engage airborne targets at ranges of up to 250 kilometres. The HHQ-9A missile system provided to Type 052C destroyers has eight six-cell Vertical Launch Systems (VLS) with six of them at the bow deck and the remaining two at the stern.

The Chinese designed VLS features a cylindrical shape and "cold launch" in comparison with Western VLS such as Mk-41 and Sylver which are rectangular and use "hot launch". The main difference between cold and hot launches is that the rocket motor ignites out or in the launch tube. The Chinese VLS is neither based upon the Russian revolver launch system also featuring six-cell.

Each HQ-9 launcher contains four missiles stored in individual containers and is transported on Taian TA5380 8×8 high mobility chassis. HQ-9’s standard HT-233 engagement radar can track 100 targets and engage 50 of them at a range of 100 km. A normal PLA HQ-9 battery includes “a command vehicle, six control vehicles, 6 targeting radar vehicles, 6 search-radar vehicles, 48 missile-launch vehicles, and 192 missiles.” HQ-9 can use a variety of radar sensors to detect different targets, including ballistic missiles and stealth objects. A battery may include HT-233 engagement radar, H-200 mobile engagement radar, and a number of search radars like the Type 120 low altitude acquisition radar, Type 305A 3D acquisition radar, or Type 305B 3D acquisition radar.

http://www.navyrecognition.com/inde...gW0s4mjqyRFBYZ97m5vuUpMRwl9sHqzf_2bg4DAwxd1Dc

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## LKJ86

Via BTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 582475
> View attachment 582476
> View attachment 582477
> View attachment 582478
> 
> Via BTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


DF-26 SRBM?


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## LKJ86

Via @NikoVISION from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @钢铁机机 from Weibo

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## Haris Ali2140

@LKJ86 Which missile is this??


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## Grandy

CJ 100 or DF 100

The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force, or PLARF, posted the full video on social media on Sept. 25, 2019. Sometime afterward, the original one-minute long montage was replaced with one that omitted the launch of the unknown weapon and replaced it with unrelated footage of known missiles, according to the _SCMP._

There is no obvious indication about what this new missile is or what its mission may be. The video shows that it is vertically launched from a 10-wheel transporter-erector-launcher (TEL) that appears to be able to carry two of the weapons in a ready-to-fire configuration. Photos of preparations for the 70th-anniversary parade in Beijing on Oct. 1, 2019, have shown a similar, previously unseen TEL with its entire rear section tarped off.





A screenshot from the original PLARF video showing the TEL as the missile begins to blast off.





Chinese Internet
A similar-looking TEL seen during preparations for the parade in Beijing on Oct. 1.








__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1176828135809024001
The weapon itself appears to have at least two distinct parts, a main body with a very large rocket booster attached to the end. The booster would fall away at some point in the early stage of flight.

The main weapon has large strakes or fins and what appear to be a number of relatively long and thin fairings at the tail end, which some have suggested could be ramjet intakes. An air-breathing ramjet propulsion system would fit with the large booster motor, since the weapon would then need to get up to an appropriate speed and altitude before its engines could function properly. A number of existing Chinese supersonic anti-ship missiles, such as the YJ-12 series or the newer HD-1, use a similar general configuration.





PLARF capture
The unidentified missile seen in the original PLARF video.





Chinese Internet
China's HD-1 supersonic anti-ship cruise missile.

The PLARF already operates the ground-based subsonic CJ-10 land-attack cruise missile, which has a range of approximately 930 miles. This has led some to believe that this new weapon is a supersonic, or possibly hypersonic, land-attack cruise missile intended to replace that existing weapon.

Hypersonic speed is defined as greater than Mach 5. The wide nose and missile body, together with the strakes/fins, would seem to make it unlikely that this is indeed a hypersonic weapon.

Others have posited that it could be a new quasi-ballistic missile. However, the strakes/fins and possible ramjet propulsion would be at odds with what one would expect to see in a weapon that is supposed to fly in a ballistic flight path.

Regardless of the exact nature of its configuration, the weapon could also potentially be intended for other roles instead of or in addition to striking land targets, including engaging hostile ships at extended ranges. The PLARF has already developed significant anti-ship ballistic missile capabilities, most notably with the DF-21D medium-range ballistic missile and the DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile, the latter of which is seen in the video below.

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## ozranger

An analysis on DF-100
Poster said CX-1 is a downgraded export version of DF-100
https://lt.cjdby.net/thread-2591398-1-1.html

My impression is that DF-100 is using a subsonic ramjet (airflow decelerated to subsonic in intake) to cruise from 3 Ma to 5 Ma at very high altitude. Air is so thin at that altitude that no scramjet is needed if speed is not over 5 Ma.

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## ZeEa5KPul



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## TOTUU



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## j20blackdragon

DF-17

These fins look steerable at hypersonic speed. Nightmare weapon.

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## ozranger

TOTUU said:


> View attachment 583246



That's significant!

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## j20blackdragon

cirr said:


> Scramjet powered LingYun universal test flight platform for near-space hypersonic vehicles
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 475251



DF-100 is probably the current iteration of this.

_Lingyun 1, a hypersonic aircraft that can travel at more than five times the speed of sound, or 6,100 kilometer per hour, made its public debut at the museum on Saturday. It was developed by the College of Aerospace Science and Technology at the National University of Defense Technology.

The craft has a Chinese-designed supersonic combustion ramjet engine, *also known as scramjet*, the exhibition panel relates. The missile-shaped Lingyun made its maiden flight in 2015, making it the second low-cost, multipurpose hypersonic vehicle known to the public - the other is the HIFiRE vehicle jointly developed by the United States and Australia._
http://english.cctv.com/2018/05/21/ARTIXsd6dtoTVLTT8kPwIqTq180521.shtml

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## LKJ86

The range of YJ-12B AShM is over 1000 km?

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## LKJ86

DF-26










Via @浩汉-亮剑 from Weibo

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## ZeEa5KPul

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1184275281139253250

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## LKJ86

Via @绘图匠佟旭 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @社会主义新青年Memorian from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## Philip the Arab

Does China use Sky Dragon 50 or just for export?


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## lcloo

Philip the Arab said:


> Does China use Sky Dragon 50 or just for export?

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## ozranger

lcloo said:


> View attachment 585637



SD-50 is a SAM version of PL-12/SD-10 with additional booster. PLA shouldn't be interested as they have so many other options developed from the very beginning as SAMs.

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## Philip the Arab

ozranger said:


> SD-50 is a SAM version of PL-12/SD-10 with additional booster. PLA shouldn't be interested as they have so many other options developed from the very beginning as SAMs.


That is true, I agree. It could in theory be a good naval SAM for export though. Couldn't it in theory be able to fit in HQ-7 configuration? It is lighter than LY-80, and seems a lot thinner diameter wise but is still kind of long.











It would be much easier to integrate this on ships with decks not able to support VLS systems and much better protected than current ships equipped with short range SAMs.






lcloo said:


> View attachment 585637


I knew it was based off PL-12... So China doesn't use the SAM itself? Somebody asked this a few pages back but nobody answered for him.

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## Beast

Philip the Arab said:


> That is true, I agree. It could in theory be a good naval SAM for export though. Couldn't it in theory be able to fit in HQ-7 configuration? It is lighter than LY-80, and seems a lot thinner diameter wise but is still kind of long.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It would be much easier to integrate this on ships with decks not able to support VLS systems and much better protected than current ships equipped with short range SAMs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I knew it was based off PL-12... So China doesn't use the SAM itself? Somebody asked this a few pages back but nobody answered for him.



China destroyer VLS system used quadpad of these missiles(DK-10) in one silo. As for frigate or export warship, such VLS will be expensive which so far no market for such system.

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## Philip the Arab

Beast said:


> China destroyer VLS system used quadpad of these missiles in one silo. As for frigate or export warship, such VLS will be expensive which so far no market for such system.


How would it be expensive? It would be much cheaper to have a system above deck than below deck.

Like this, but instead of HQ-7 it could be Sky Dragon 50 if dimensions permit it.





I'm just saying, you could advertise it as an air-defence ship to 3rd world African/Asian nations that can't afford expensive dedicated air-defence ships with VLS. 50 KM range is great if you could integrate it on 2-4 ton ships.

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## Beast

Philip the Arab said:


> How would it be expensive? It would be much cheaper to have a system above deck than below deck.
> 
> Like this, but instead of HQ-7 it could be Sky Dragon 50 if dimensions permit it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just saying, you could advertise it as an air-defence ship to 3rd world African/Asian nations that can't afford expensive dedicated air-defence ships with VLS. 50 KM range is great if you could integrate it on 2-4 ton ships.


The VLS is highly complex and expensive system and also the weight added will be far greater which once again come back to balancing the ship. This will make export very expensive for warship. So far, China do not have very rich customers for most of our weapon system.

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## ZeEa5KPul

Beast said:


> The VLS is highly complex and expensive system and also the weight added will be far greater which once again come back to balancing the ship. This will make export very expensive for warship. So far, China do not have very rich customers for most of our weapon system.


It's a real problem. The US and Russia have the market on lock, it's difficult to see how China will be able to break through.


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## LKJ86

Via @北陆强军号 from Weixin

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## Philip the Arab

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 586029
> View attachment 586030
> View attachment 586031
> View attachment 586032
> 
> Via @北陆强军号 from Weixin


LY-80?


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## LKJ86

Philip the Arab said:


> LY-80?


In PLA, it should be called HQ-16.

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## LKJ86

HQ-7B




Via @兵工科技 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B



















Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## JSCh

*New rocket launcher shows versatility, superiority: report*
By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/11/4 19:52:56




China reveals its new long range multiple rocket launcher at the National Day parade on October 1. Photo: IC

China's new multiple rocket launcher, which debuted at the National Day parade on October 1, not only fires rockets, but also tactical ballistic and anti-ship missiles, Chinese media reported, with experts saying on Monday the weapon could give the Chinese military an overwhelming advantage over enemies.

The new multiple rocket launcher, still not known by its official designation, was developed based on the PHL-03 long-range multiple rocket launcher. It uses an 8x8 wheeled high mobility chassis, weighs 45 tons, and can adapt to temperatures ranging from -22 C to 55 C, Ordnance Industry Science Technology, a Xi'an-based periodical focused on the national defense industry, reported over the weekend.

Unlike the PHL-03, which is loaded with a fixed type of ammunition, the new rocket launcher has two modularized launch cells, and each can carry different types of ammunition, the periodical said, noting that this brings versatility and high efficiency to the weapon.

While the weapon only carried two sets of four 370-millimeter rockets at the parade, the report said it could also switch to two sets of five 300-millimeter rockets, or the combination of the two.



China North Industries Group Corp (Norinco) showcases the AR-3 multiple rocket launcher at Airshow China 2016 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province in on November 3, 2016. Photo: IC

The export version of the new multiple rocket launcher, the AR-3, can even switch to the 750-millimeter Fire Dragon 480 tactical ballistic missile and TL-7B anti-ship missile, the report said.

The AR-3 has a range of about 280 kilometers with rockets, and the domestic version is expected to be able to hit targets at 360 kilometers, even farther with missiles, the periodical wrote, noting that it can target high value strategic targets like airports, command centers, supply bases and anti-air installations.

Highly automated, the weapon has a full communications system, weather information system, command system and maintenance system, allowing as few as three people to operate in minimum combat reaction time, the report said.

The new multiple rocket launcher will give the People's Liberation Army an overwhelming advantage over its enemies, as it is highly mobile, easy to operate and can fire very fast, a military expert who asked not to be named told the Global Times on Monday.

It can fire across the Taiwan Straits, be deployed not only on plains but also on plateaus, and strike at naval targets, the expert said, noting that the AR-3 could be the best on the international market.

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## bahadur999

JSCh said:


> *New rocket launcher shows versatility, superiority: report*
> By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2019/11/4 19:52:56
> 
> 
> 
> China reveals its new long range multiple rocket launcher at the National Day parade on October 1. Photo: IC
> 
> China's new multiple rocket launcher, which debuted at the National Day parade on October 1, not only fires rockets, but also tactical ballistic and anti-ship missiles, Chinese media reported, with experts saying on Monday the weapon could give the Chinese military an overwhelming advantage over enemies.
> 
> The new multiple rocket launcher, still not known by its official designation, was developed based on the PHL-03 long-range multiple rocket launcher. It uses an 8x8 wheeled high mobility chassis, weighs 45 tons, and can adapt to temperatures ranging from -22 C to 55 C, Ordnance Industry Science Technology, a Xi'an-based periodical focused on the national defense industry, reported over the weekend.
> 
> Unlike the PHL-03, which is loaded with a fixed type of ammunition, the new rocket launcher has two modularized launch cells, and each can carry different types of ammunition, the periodical said, noting that this brings versatility and high efficiency to the weapon.
> 
> While the weapon only carried two sets of four 370-millimeter rockets at the parade, the report said it could also switch to two sets of five 300-millimeter rockets, or the combination of the two.
> 
> 
> 
> China North Industries Group Corp (Norinco) showcases the AR-3 multiple rocket launcher at Airshow China 2016 in Zhuhai, South China's Guangdong Province in on November 3, 2016. Photo: IC
> 
> The export version of the new multiple rocket launcher, the AR-3, can even switch to the 750-millimeter Fire Dragon 480 tactical ballistic missile and TL-7B anti-ship missile, the report said.
> 
> The AR-3 has a range of about 280 kilometers with rockets, and the domestic version is expected to be able to hit targets at 360 kilometers, even farther with missiles, the periodical wrote, noting that it can target high value strategic targets like airports, command centers, supply bases and anti-air installations.
> 
> Highly automated, the weapon has a full communications system, weather information system, command system and maintenance system, allowing as few as three people to operate in minimum combat reaction time, the report said.
> 
> The new multiple rocket launcher will give the People's Liberation Army an overwhelming advantage over its enemies, as it is highly mobile, easy to operate and can fire very fast, a military expert who asked not to be named told the Global Times on Monday.
> 
> It can fire across the Taiwan Straits, be deployed not only on plains but also on plateaus, and strike at naval targets, the expert said, noting that the AR-3 could be the best on the international market.


Its name is PHL-191.

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM



















Via kj.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军画报 from Weixin

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 589293
> View attachment 589294
> View attachment 589295
> View attachment 589296
> 
> Via @解放军画报 from Weixin


What is this? So big the size.


----------



## LKJ86

samsara said:


> What is this? So big the size.


DF-4

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## LKJ86

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1195269383133646848

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B

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## LKJ86

Via www.top81cn.cn

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16B
> View attachment 590176
> …


In the first picture, the amazing view of sky filled up with the numerous stars is the typical scene of the Qinghai-Tibet Plateau in general, and more specifically the view of Ali Prefecture in the southwestern Tibet, the home of Mount Kangrinboqe (Mt. Kailash) and Mapam Yumco (Manasarovar Lake).

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## LKJ86

HQ-22

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 590800
> View attachment 590801
> View attachment 590802
> View attachment 590803
> View attachment 590807
> 
> Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


What is the type of SAM this one?


----------



## lcloo

samsara said:


> What is the type of SAM this one?


HQ-16 operated by PLA ground forces.

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## LKJ86

HQ-9




























Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## JSCh

*Long-range missile test adds to growing Chinese arsenal*
Bill Gertz - The Washington Times - Monday, November 25, 2019

China has conducted a flight test of its newest long-range missile, the Dong Feng 41, multi-warhead nuclear strike weapon, the Pentagon confirmed Monday.


...

Long-range missile test adds to growing Chinese arsenal - Washington Times

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## khanasifm

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 590245
> View attachment 590246
> 
> Via www.top81cn.cn



8 torpedo tubes is this new boat type ? Or just Cgi


----------



## Philip the Arab

Does anyone know if FM-90/HQ-7B is still being produced, or was replaced or is in the process of being replaced?
@YuChen 
@LKJ86 
@beijingwalker


----------



## Bogeyman

YJ-12 supersonic cruise ship missile

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## Deino

cirr said:


> Second（JL-3?） launch in as many days？



Allegedly the new SLBM JL-3 was tested today ... 

https://twitter.com/PLANavyNews/status/1209016733903646721

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## IblinI

Deino said:


> Allegedly the new SLBM JL-3 was tested today ...
> 
> https://twitter.com/PLANavyNews/status/1209016733903646721
> 
> View attachment 595086

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## JSCh

*Flying object hovering over Beijing possibly a rocket*
Source:Global Times Published: 2019/12/23 16:48:33



Netizens from Beijing spot a weird luminous flying object early Monday morning that was likely a rocket being launched, said experts. Photo: huanqiu.com

A weird luminous flying object spotted by Beijing residents early Monday morning was likely a rocket streaking across the night sky, which also left a contrail that was still visible at dawn, experts said.

Multiple videos taken by netizens in Beijing and posted on Sina Weibo, China's Twitter-like social media platform early Monday morning, show a large glowing object with a fiery tail ripping through the darkness.

Netizens then began to report an unnatural-looking cloud in the sky, very likely the vapor trail left by the unidentified flying object.

Photos show the long linear cloud, which was luminous during sunrise, had zigzagged like a colored ribbon in the sky.

Beijing Meteorological Service was quick to respond, saying on its Sina Weibo account at 7:00 am that the cloud was likely the contrail left by an aircraft.

Aerospace Knowledge magazine reported later in the morning in its WeChat public account that the trail could be that of a rocket.

What people saw in the sky is likely the result of sunlight reflecting off aluminum oxide particles in the sky, which are produced during combustion of solid rocket fuel, Aerospace Knowledge reported, citing experts.

These particles usually meet little resistance in the upper atmosphere so they can stretch for many kilometers, the report said, noting that winds will blow the contrail into twisted shapes.

A similar rocket trail was seen in Beijing on December 7, when China launched six satellites on a Kuaizhou-1A rocket from the Taiyuan Satellite Launch Center in North China's Shanxi Province.

A planned rocket launch for early Monday morning had not been announced as of press time.

The sighting coincided with a scheduled military mission in the Bohai Straits and North Yellow Sea near Northeast China's Liaoning Province, netizens noticed.

According to a navigation notice released by the Maritime Safety Administration of China, a designated sea area was restricted due to military exercises from December 20 to 27.

The notice did not elaborate on the substance of the exercises.

China reportedly conducted a submarine-launched ballistic missile test in June, which also caused a similar phenomenon that was witnessed by many.

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> *Flying object hovering over Beijing possibly a rocket*
> Source:Global Times Published: 2019/12/23 16:48:33
> 
> 
> 
> Netizens from Beijing spot a weird luminous flying object early Monday morning that was likely a rocket being launched, said experts. Photo: huanqiu.com
> 
> A weird luminous flying object spotted by Beijing residents early Monday morning was likely a rocket streaking across the night sky, which also left a contrail that was still visible at dawn, experts said.
> 
> Multiple videos taken by netizens in Beijing and posted on Sina Weibo, China's Twitter-like social media platform early Monday morning, show a large glowing object with a fiery tail ripping through the darkness.
> 
> Netizens then began to report an unnatural-looking cloud in the sky, very likely the vapor trail left by the unidentified flying object.
> 
> Photos show the long linear cloud, which was luminous during sunrise, had zigzagged like a colored ribbon in the sky.
> 
> Beijing Meteorological Service was quick to respond, saying on its Sina Weibo account at 7:00 am that the cloud was likely the contrail left by an aircraft.
> 
> Aerospace Knowledge magazine reported later in the morning in its WeChat public account that the trail could be that of a rocket.
> 
> What people saw in the sky is likely the result of sunlight reflecting off aluminum oxide particles in the sky, which are produced during combustion of solid rocket fuel, Aerospace Knowledge reported, citing experts.
> 
> These particles usually meet little resistance in the upper atmosphere so they can stretch for many kilometers, the report said, noting that winds will blow the contrail into twisted shapes.
> 
> A similar rocket trail was seen in Beijing on December 7, when China launched six satellites on a Kuaizhou-1A rocket from the Taiyuan Satellite Launch Center in North China's Shanxi Province.
> 
> A planned rocket launch for early Monday morning had not been announced as of press time.
> 
> The sighting coincided with a scheduled military mission in the Bohai Straits and North Yellow Sea near Northeast China's Liaoning Province, netizens noticed.
> 
> According to a navigation notice released by the Maritime Safety Administration of China, a designated sea area was restricted due to military exercises from December 20 to 27.
> 
> The notice did not elaborate on the substance of the exercises.
> 
> China reportedly conducted a submarine-launched ballistic missile test in June, which also caused a similar phenomenon that was witnessed by many.


JL-3 SLBM firing test !?

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## 艹艹艹

Beautiful rainbow


YuChen said:


>

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## Deino

Deino said:


> Allegedly the new SLBM JL-3 was tested today ...
> 
> https://twitter.com/PLANavyNews/status/1209016733903646721
> 
> View attachment 595086



I'm sorry to ruin the party, but this is not the JL-3 but a Bulava tested from the ''Yury Dolgoruky' prj.955 Borei class SSBN in September 2016


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/781530986270040064
https://xn--80ahclcogc6ci4h.xn--90a...ia/photo/gallery.htm?id=32769@cmsPhotoGallery

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## JSCh

samsara said:


> JL-3 SLBM firing test !?


It is a rocket launch. Details ->

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/chin...ons-news-updates.464793/page-72#post-11959372​

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## IblinI

Deino said:


> I'm sorry to ruin the party, but this is not the JL-3 but a Bulava tested from the ''Yury Dolgoruky' prj.955 Borei class SSBN in September 2016
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/781530986270040064
> https://xn--80ahclcogc6ci4h.xn--90a...ia/photo/gallery.htm?id=32769@cmsPhotoGallery


Yep, never considerd that as Chinese, that is the nature of Chinese report, pic doesnt matter.

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @航空知识365 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @军报记者 from Weibo

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## JSCh

samsara said:


> JL-3 SLBM firing test !?


*China's test of sub-launched missile a threat to peace, retired captain warns*
Underwater JL-3 launch comes amid fears of North Korean missile test

By Bill Gertz - The Washington Times - Tuesday, December 24, 2019

China’s military this week conducted a flight test of a new submarine-launched missile capable of hitting the entire United States with a nuclear warhead, according to Pentagon officials.


....

China tests submarine-launched JL-3 missile capable of hitting U.S with nuke - Washington Times

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM













Via www.81.cn

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## JSCh



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## JSCh

*Soldiers fire smoke bombs for concealment*
Editor：Huang Panyue Time：2019-12-30 17:04:11



​Soldiers assigned to an air-defense brigade of the navy under the PLA Northern Theater Command operate a crane to transfer a surface-to-air missile module onto an anti-aircraft missiles system during a real combat training exercise in early December, 2019. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lu Wenjie and Yang Shuorui)


​Soldiers assigned to an air-defense brigade of the navy under the PLA Northern Theater Command fire smoke bombs as a concealment wall during a real combat training exercise in early December, 2019. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lu Wenjie and Yang Shuorui)

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## LKJ86

DF-26



















Via CCTV 1 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

DF-31AG




Via CCTV 1 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## onebyone

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1211676497196417026

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## JSCh



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## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM from PLA Army




Via @高原战士 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM










Via @当代海军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin








Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## Figaro

JSCh said:


> *China's test of sub-launched missile a threat to peace, retired captain warns*
> Underwater JL-3 launch comes amid fears of North Korean missile test
> 
> By Bill Gertz - The Washington Times - Tuesday, December 24, 2019
> 
> China’s military this week conducted a flight test of a new submarine-launched missile capable of hitting the entire United States with a nuclear warhead, according to Pentagon officials.
> 
> 
> ....
> 
> China tests submarine-launched JL-3 missile capable of hitting U.S with nuke - Washington Times


The JL-3 and JL-2's range figures seem way off in this article (5600 miles for the JL-3 and 4350 miles for the JL-2).

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM




Via @北海舰队 from Weibo

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## samsara

Figaro said:


> The JL-3 and JL-2's range figures seem way off in this article (5600 miles for the JL-3 and 4350 miles for the JL-2).


That article didn't want to spoil the confidence of the widely believed notion that China has no credible submarine + SLBM solution to threaten the CONUS. Thus some discounts on JL-3 and JL-2 ranges. About the Nuclear Triad, according to the many US think tanks, China so far essentially only possesses the credible ground deterrent with the deployment of the mobile DF-41 as far as concerning the CONUS.

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## Figaro

samsara said:


> That article didn't want to spoil the confidence of the widely believed notion that China has no credible submarine + SLBM solution to threaten the CONUS. Thus some discounts on JL-3 and JL-2 ranges. About the Nuclear Triad, according to the many US think tanks, China so far essentially only possesses the credible ground deterrent with the deployment of the mobile DF-41 as far as concerning the CONUS.


I think the US has believed China has a credible underwater deterrent since the JL-2A. The author here probably misstated the range figures, especially considering when the JL-3 is basically a navalized version of the DF-41.

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## LKJ86

Via CSIS

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## JSCh

*Need for speed*
Richard Stone
Richard Stone is senior science editor at the Howard Hughes Medical Institute's Tangled Bank Studios in Chevy Chase, Maryland.

Science 10 Jan 2020:
Vol. 367, Issue 6474, pp. 134-138
DOI: 10.1126/science.367.6474.134

Despite hype and technological hurdles, a hypersonic arms race is accelerating.




Bullet-shaped interceptors defend the United States against attacking hypersonic weapons in an artist's concept. Such defenses remain hypothetical.
ILLUSTRATION: DARPA

High in the sky over northwestern China, a wedge-shaped unmanned vehicle separated from a rocket. Coasting along at up to Mach 6, or six times the speed of sound, the Xingkong-2 “waverider” hypersonic cruise missile (HCM) bobbed and weaved through the stratosphere, surfing on its own shock waves. At least that's how the weapon's developer, the China Academy of Aerospace Aerodynamics, described the August 2018 test. (China did not release any video footage.) The HCM's speed and maneuverability, crowed the Communist Party's _Global Times_, would enable the new weapon to “break through any current generation anti-missile defense system.”

For decades, the U.S. military—and its adversaries—have coveted missiles that travel at hypersonic speed, generally defined as Mach 5 or greater. Intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) meet that definition when they re-enter the atmosphere from space. But because they arc along a predictable ballistic path, like a bullet, they lack the element of surprise. In contrast, hypersonic weapons such as China's waverider maneuver aerodynamically, enabling them to dodge defenses and keep an adversary guessing about the target.


....

Need for speed | Science

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## ozranger

JSCh said:


> *Need for speed*
> Richard Stone
> Richard Stone is senior science editor at the Howard Hughes Medical Institute's Tangled Bank Studios in Chevy Chase, Maryland.
> 
> Science 10 Jan 2020:
> Vol. 367, Issue 6474, pp. 134-138
> DOI: 10.1126/science.367.6474.134
> 
> Despite hype and technological hurdles, a hypersonic arms race is accelerating.
> 
> 
> 
> Bullet-shaped interceptors defend the United States against attacking hypersonic weapons in an artist's concept. Such defenses remain hypothetical.
> ILLUSTRATION: DARPA
> 
> High in the sky over northwestern China, a wedge-shaped unmanned vehicle separated from a rocket. Coasting along at up to Mach 6, or six times the speed of sound, the Xingkong-2 “waverider” hypersonic cruise missile (HCM) bobbed and weaved through the stratosphere, surfing on its own shock waves. At least that's how the weapon's developer, the China Academy of Aerospace Aerodynamics, described the August 2018 test. (China did not release any video footage.) The HCM's speed and maneuverability, crowed the Communist Party's _Global Times_, would enable the new weapon to “break through any current generation anti-missile defense system.”
> 
> For decades, the U.S. military—and its adversaries—have coveted missiles that travel at hypersonic speed, generally defined as Mach 5 or greater. Intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) meet that definition when they re-enter the atmosphere from space. But because they arc along a predictable ballistic path, like a bullet, they lack the element of surprise. In contrast, hypersonic weapons such as China's waverider maneuver aerodynamically, enabling them to dodge defenses and keep an adversary guessing about the target.
> 
> 
> ....
> 
> Need for speed | Science



The DF-17 glider or alike won't fly out of the atmosphere to start gliding, which makes it impossible for a mid-course intercept with today's technologies.

In near space, no interceptor can rely on aerodynamic controllability due to the very thin air. So it has to maneuver using rocket powered vector thrust control. The biggest problem is, it's approaching the target from the ground up and most of its fuel and energy will be spent on cancelling the gravity and accelerating, whereas the DF-17 HGV can maneuver above in full dimensions.

Unless the interceptor can be built on a large rocket, there is no chance for it to make up a successful intercept as it requires sufficient energy to outperform the DF-17 HGV's maneuverability in a pretty long but required duration.

However, if the US really choose to build such big rocket interceptors in mass, their armed forces will go bankrupt if remaining on its current scale is also required. Small amount of big rocket interceptors will not work at all because of the low probability of successful intercepts.

On the other hand, if the US choose to develop capability and assets similar to the DF-17, they need to start from building the required infrastructure to close an at least ten-year gap. That also requires them to cut budget elsewhere, like ships, aircraft, etc.

So far they are highly hesitant on this as, if they shrink their conventional air force, navy and marines, they will definitely lose controls on some hot spots of the world and endanger their global financial hegemony deeply coupled with oils, ie. the petrodollars, and probably drug businesses as well.

The following video reveals problems in their decision making towards hypersonic weapon buildup.





The root problem is that the US ruling class always wants to maintain its current military scale to serve a well established global financial hegemony which have been successfully sucking up bloods from developed countries in the second world and developing countries in the third world for so long.

It is harder and harder for them to make it now.

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM
















Via @钢铁先锋号 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM













Via @南疆号角 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## Ich

Go TEL them...


----------



## ChineseTiger1986

A new variant of the DF-26.

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## fatman17

Air-Launched Weapons
*China aiming to procure airborne laser-based weapon pod*
*Andrew Tate, London* - Jane's Defence Weekly
08 January 2020



China's People's Liberation Army (PLA) has issued an invitation to tender for the procurement of a laser-based weapon pod, as reflected in an entry on the Chinese military and weapon procurement website: weain.mil.cn.

The website, which lists a "tender announcement for a laser strike pod procurement project", indicates that further information about the planned acquisition is confidential. However, the announcement was picked up by the state-owned _Global Times_ newspaper, which focused on the likelihood that the project is aimed at delivering an airborne laser-based weapon, with the terminology "laser strike pod" suggesting that this is the capability expected to be delivered.

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## LKJ86

YJ-83 AShM













Via @当代海军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM













Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM



















Via @东海舰队发布 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东风快递 from Weibo

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## JSCh

*Chinese Rocket Force exercise ensures nuclear counterattack capability*
By Liu Xuanzun Source:Global Times Published: 2020/1/16 23:18:40



China reveals its most advanced nuclear-armed intercontinental ballistic missile, the DF-41, at the National Day parade in Beijing on October 1, 2019. Photo: Fan Lingzhi/GT

The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force has conducted a nuclear attack survival exercise where troops in an underground missile facility had to endure extreme conditions and make sure they could still launch nuclear counterattacks.

During the undated exercise, a Rocket Force brigade mobilized into the launch bunker at an undisclosed location and completely sealed themselves off from the outside world, as the troops readied for combat, China Central Television (CCTV) reported on Wednesday.

The bunker was then struck by a mock hostile nuclear attack as the troops inside, fully dressed in protection suits, carried out contingency plans and operated missiles for upcoming counterattacks, according to the report.

They also simulated a situation where missile fuel leaked after a hostile strike and a troubleshooting team was immediately deployed to repair.

Tactics including a fast missile condition check, rapid logistics, bunker defense and hasty launch were also practiced, CCTV reported.

While China is one of a few countries in the world that operate nuclear weapons, it has promised no first use, a military expert who asked not to be named told the Global Times on Thursday.

It was crucial the force survive an initial hostile strike to launch a counterattack, the expert noted. Such exercises ensure that capability and contribute to China's nuclear deterrence, the expert said.

China has a series of defense facilities located deep under mountains dubbed the "Underground Steel Great Wall," which "guarantee the security of the country's strategic arsenal" against potential attacks, including those from hypersonic weapons, Qian Qihu, a key architect of the fortifications who won China's highest science and technology award of 2018, told the Global Times in a previous interview.

At the National Day military parade on October 1 last year, China displayed the DF-5B silo-based nuclear-armed intercontinental ballistic missile.

The parade also showcased the DF-31AG and DF-41 road-mobile ICBM, DF-26 nuclear/conventional intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBM) and JL-2 submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM).

No nuke is expected to be ever used again, but China needs to protect itself by retaining its nuclear deterrent, developing and practicing with the weapons, analysts said.

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7

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## ZeEa5KPul

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 601324
> View attachment 601325
> View attachment 601326
> View attachment 601327
> 
> Via CCTV 7






The (boring) show these shots were taken from. VLS canister loading at 24:29

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## LKJ86

Via 央视军事报道

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @电波震长空XYY from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HHQ-9 SAM





HHQ-9B SAM





YJ-18A AShM







Via @利刃斩海飞剪艏 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM










Via navy.81.cn

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## ChineseTiger1986

@Beast

What do you think? I think they have severely underestimated the DF-41 and DF-31AG, also completely neglected the JL-2A.

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## LKJ86

DF-16 



















Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

DF-31







Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weibo

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 605150
> View attachment 605151
> View attachment 605152
> 
> Via @中国火箭军 from Weibo


A little info about these great pics… which missile? And what's the flexible hose for? (resemble to the flexible hose used at bathroom only this one is of larger size and higher quality ofc)


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Hot-launched YJ-18A AShM and cold-launched HHQ-9B SAM from Type 052D DDG

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## ZeEa5KPul

LKJ86 said:


> Hot-launched YJ-18A AShM and cold-launched HHQ-9B SAM from Type 052D DDG
> View attachment 606485
> View attachment 606486
> View attachment 606487


Source video?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B







Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM
















Via @人民陆军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @南海舰队 from Weixin

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3


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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM

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## LKJ86

Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo

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## ZeEa5KPul

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 612120
> 
> Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo


From the left
1. PCL191/AR3 PHL-191
2. DF-10A
3. DF-100
4. DH-10/CJ-10 YJ-12B
5. DF-21D
6. DF-17
7. DF-31AG
8. DF-41

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## LKJ86

ZeEa5KPul said:


> 1. PCL191/AR3


PHL-191


ZeEa5KPul said:


> 4. DH-10/CJ-10


YJ-12B

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## ZeEa5KPul

You sure about 5? That doesn't look like a DF-26. The DF-26 doesn't have those box structures on the right side of the missile canister and the top of the cab is notched from the front.




While the DF-21D has those boxes and the notch doesn't reach the front.

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## LKJ86

ZeEa5KPul said:


> You sure about 5? That doesn't look like a DF-26. The DF-26 doesn't have those box structures on the right side of the missile canister and the top of the cab is notched from the front.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> While the DF-21D has those boxes and the notch doesn't reach the front.


It is DF-21D.

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## Pakistani Fighter

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16 SAM
> View attachment 610326
> View attachment 610327
> View attachment 610328
> View attachment 610329
> View attachment 610330
> 
> Via @人民陆军 from Weixin


Can HQ 16A be converted into HQ 16B?


----------



## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM































Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM




Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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5


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## LKJ86

Via @解放军画报 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## FuturePAF

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 616756
> 
> Via @解放军画报 from Weixin



Df-26?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

FuturePAF said:


> Df-26?


DF-16

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM and YJ-83 AShM










Via @北海舰队 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM











Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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7


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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 612120
> 
> Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo







Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo

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## bahadur999



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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 617796
> View attachment 617797
> View attachment 617798
> View attachment 617799
> View attachment 617800
> View attachment 617801
> View attachment 617802
> View attachment 617803
> View attachment 617804
> View attachment 617805
> View attachment 617806
> View attachment 617807
> View attachment 617808
> View attachment 617809
> 
> Via www.81.cn


Actually these very impressive photos are accompanied by very interesting description… so interesting that I had passed them to friends in other medium.

The description and its translation are as below:

东风快递送来火箭军的超级大片，这个应该敢查收吧！

来源：央广军事 发布：2020-03-27

这是一支神秘的部队

有着大国重器、战略铁拳的美誉

有着亲昵而又响亮的昵称

——东风快递

他们是大国长剑的执掌人

远离灯火斑斓

在深山密林、大漠戈壁、雪原林海
[消息来源没有提到的是，在中国的山区有5000多公里深的深地下隧道]

枕戈待旦，只为一声号令

“点火”

“发射”

我国的战略导弹部队

火箭军！来了


*DONGFENG EXPRESS — PLA ROCKET FORCE*

This is a mysterious force

It has a good reputation as a great power, a heavy weapon and a strategic iron fist

With an endearing and loud nickname

DONGFENG EXPRESS

They are the masters of the long sword of great powers

Stay away from the lights

In the deep mountains and thick forests, the vast desert of Gobi, snowfield and sea of trees
_[And what the source did not mention, more than 5,000 kilometers of deep underground tunnels in the mountainous regions across China]_

All they need is just one single call

“IGNITE!”

“FIRE!”

The Strategic Missile Force of China (PLARF)

Note: text under the square brackets […] is my own improvisation

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1249234457036455936

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 619555
> 
> Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo







Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo

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## IblinI

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 623023
> 
> Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo


DF100 is missing.


----------



## fatman17

*PL-17*



This stunning image (November 2016) indicated a new large VLRAAM has been under development and its exact designation is unknown (*PL-17*?) . Compared to PL-12, it has 4 tail control fins only (coupled with TVC?) and is significantly longer and thicker than PL-12 (length 5.7m, diameter 300mm). Its large size suggests the missile actually belongs to a new class of VLRAAM and not a PL-12 replacement. As the result it cannot be carried internally by the 4th generation fighters such as J-20 but is expected to be carried externally by 3.5th generation long-range fighters/interceptors such as J-16. However it may still be carried externally by J-20 underneath its wings. The missile appears to be propelled by a dual pulse rocket motor in favor of a ramjet engine, which has a smaller drag and a slimmer size. It is also speculated to fly a semi-ballistic trajectory similar to American AIM-54 in order to achieve an extra long range (range>300km, speed>Mach 4, cruising altitude 30km). *PL-17* is believed to feature an advanced guidance system including a two-way datalink and a new active AESA seeker with enhanced ECCM capability. Before the launch the missile must obtain the target information via datalink from an AWACS, a land-based long-range radar or even a satellite. The launch aircraft disengages right after releasing the missile. After the initial ascent stage, the missile may use Beidou+INS+datalink guidance during the mid-course cruising stage. At the terminal diving stage, in combination with the AESA seeker, it may also use an IIR seeker as indicated by a small optical window in its nose, which further increases its kill probability amid severe jamming. Therefore this VLRAAM could pose a serious threat to high-value aerial targets deep behind the enemy line such as AWACS and tankers, and currently is the only type in this class. It was rumored in November 2016 that a *PL-17* was test-fired successfully from a J-16. The latest image (April 2020) of the missile being carried by a JH-7A testbed suggests that the development of *PL-17* is moving forward and it is expected to enter the service in the near future.
_- Last Updated 4/11/20_

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## samsara

From Rick Joe on 12 April:

New pic of JH-7/A testing *PL-X VLR AAM* from Huitong.

JH-7/A is A2G focused, not A2A + also relatively old, not very advanced avionics.

?Significant - reinforces idea PL-X relies on offboard sensors to exploit its range, reinforcing idea PLAAF has/will have CeC-esque capability.

CEC = Cooperative Engagement Capability








__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1249205464090521601

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 623023
> 
> Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo


May someone here give the respective missile TYPE annotation, put on the last picture of the missiles CGI, then re-upload it with embedded type information. Thanks.


----------



## IblinI

Deino said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1249234457036455936


Anti radiation missile based on PL-XX?

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1249987720233070593

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM







Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM







Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1250702477755846656

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @疯子白杨 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM







Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM








Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

By 张杰

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM










Via @军报记者 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM







Via @喀喇昆仑卫士 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## ILC

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 627926
> View attachment 627927
> View attachment 627928
> View attachment 627929
> View attachment 627930
> View attachment 627931
> 
> Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin



DF-10A range is about 1500km? Is it correct https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CJ-10_(missile)


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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via @星途探索 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## samsara

*China Increases Potency Of Anti-Carrier Capabilities*

By H I Sutton, Forbes - 01 May 2020

The Chinese Navy is building an incredible number of modern warships. New frigates, destroyers, cruisers and aircraft carriers will spearhead the world’s largest Navy. But hiding behind the vast shipbuilding program is another pillar of the Chinese Navy’s war-fighting capability; *UPGRADING older warships with new weapons*. These upgrades are less widely reported than the impressive new ships, but they are a significant factor in the Chinese Navy’s overall firepower.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1204215674245021696
The first warship confirmed to be fitted with the *YJ-12 supersonic anti-ship missile, dubbed a ‘Carrier Killer’ in some circles, is an older ship.*

The People’s Liberation Army Navy, or PLAN’s, sole Type-051B destroyer, DD-167 Shenzhen, entered service 20 YEARS ago. It was first seen with YJ-12s a couple of years ago, but only at the end of last year was it seen with a full complement of 16 missiles. Previously it had carried the ubiquitous *YJ-83 missiles*, generally analogous to the U.S. Navy’s Harpoon. Don’t be misled by the smaller number in the designation, the YJ-12 is a much NEWER missile than the YJ-83. The sea-skimming YJ-83 boasts an impressive range and is still considered an effective missile, but it lacks the strategic impact of the YJ-12.

The YJ12’s speed and long range make it particularly difficult to counter. A volley of four, or even 16, missiles could pose a significant threat to even the most sophisticated air defense system. And it’s large warhead makes it potentially devastating, even to large warships like Aircraft Carriers.

Accurate figures for the YJ-12 missile are HARD TO COME BY, but it is expected to have a maximum speed of up to 4 times the speed of sound, or Mach 4. It’s range is around 160-220 miles (257-354 kilometers) and it packs a massive warhead of approximately 1,000 lbs (app. 453 kgs). For context, the warhead is around 3 times larger than that of the NSM (Naval Strike Missile) which is likely to equip the U.S. Navy's new frigates. The Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance (MDAA) suggests that it can carry a 700 kiloton nuclear warhead.

Initially the YJ-12 was only deployed as a large air-launched missile, carried by bombers and heavy jet fighters. Then in NOVEMBER 2018 a ground launched version was revealed. Now older destroyers are being fitted with it. This greatly increases their relevancy in a peer-to-peer conflict scenario.

As well as Shenzhen, the missile appears to be refitted to the PLAN’s Sovremenny class destroyers. The Sovremenny class are a Russian [Soviet Union?!] design, imported in the 1990s (as many as four units) when China was upgrading its defense capabilities with Russian technology. Although the Sovremenny class are about the same size as Shenzhen, upgraded ships will only carry 6 missiles compared to Shenzhen’s 16. Another type which may get the new missiles are the two Type-052 class ships. These currently carry 16 of the older YJ-83s.

The continued upgrade of China’s first generation of modern warships is less high-profile than the new warships. And individually these older ships are unlikely to be as capable as the newer and larger types, but they change the overall picture. Armed with these new missiles they continue to pack a heavy punch.

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## LKJ86

Via @南部强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16A and HQ-16B




















---

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17, HQ-16, and HQ-9






















Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17




By 杨健

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## LKJ86

Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 631774
> View attachment 631775
> View attachment 631776
> View attachment 631777
> View attachment 631778
> View attachment 631779
> View attachment 631780
> View attachment 631781
> View attachment 631782
> View attachment 631783
> 
> Via @央广军事 from Weixin


Which missile is this one??


----------



## LKJ86

YJ-18 AShM and Type 052D DDG




Via @雷曼军事现代舰船 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## xuxu1457

The Hong Kong-based website ifeng.com has launched an online poll on whether China should increase the number of its nuclear warheads to 1,000.
90.73% thought it was necessary.
1. If 300 warheads can destroy the enemy, it is necessary to expand to 1000?
No need to waste funds 7.25% 21021 votes
*It is necessary to increase the number just in case90.73% 262938 votes*
Hard to say2.02% 5859 votes

2. Do you think the construction of nuclear deterrence system, which is more important in quantity and quality?

Quality is a priority, and there are still lessons to be made on our nuclear weapons delivery platform19.13% 55452 votes

Quantity is also a strength15.80% 45795 votes

If the funds are enough, both can be taken care of65.07% 188571 votes

3. Do you understand China's four policies in the nuclear field?

To understanding21.23% 61533 votes

Don't understand10.86% 31470 votes

Understand a part, such as not using nuclear weapons first67.91% 196815 votes

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## samsara

xuxu1457 said:


> View attachment 634115
> 
> The Hong Kong-based website ifeng.com has launched an online poll on whether China should increase the number of its nuclear warheads to 1,000.
> 90.73% thought it was necessary.
> 1. If 300 warheads can destroy the enemy, it is necessary to expand to 1000?
> No need to waste funds 7.25% 21021 votes
> *It is necessary to increase the number just in case90.73% 262938 votes*
> Hard to say2.02% 5859 votes
> 
> 2. Do you think the construction of nuclear deterrence system, which is more important in quantity and quality?
> 
> Quality is a priority, and there are still lessons to be made on our nuclear weapons delivery platform19.13% 55452 votes
> 
> Quantity is also a strength15.80% 45795 votes
> 
> If the funds are enough, both can be taken care of65.07% 188571 votes
> 
> 3. Do you understand China's four policies in the nuclear field?
> 
> To understanding21.23% 61533 votes
> 
> Don't understand10.86% 31470 votes
> 
> Understand a part, such as not using nuclear weapons first67.91% 196815 votes


Good input for making a page for distribution through other medium. Such polling is for gauging the general feeling and thinking of the Chinese society wrt the threat levels, frictions, tensions and risks faced by China caused by the moves done by the Trump regime. The latest news says that the US is pondering to conduct low yield nuclear test to put pressure on China and Russia. In particular the USA wanna engage China in some nuclear treaty, a three-party treaty that China declines to take part, and deems as silly due to the big gap in nuke weapons owned by the three. For sure the world is getting hotter due to the aggressive moves taken by the USA to maintain its dominance! A declining bloody empire like the USA is a very dangerous one, like the injured bull in bullfighting show!

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM





By 旭阳

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## LKJ86

Via @南海舰队 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16A SAM







Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## zectech

viva_zhao said:


> When PL-15 AESA confront with E-3 electronic warfare, little chance to win.



There has to be a band(s) that shatters EW, an ECM band that interferes and silences incoming waves that the missile can produce to allow their IR to guide to the target. That is my theory.

The missile may not powerful enough to project outward strong enough waves to allow for radar homing under heavy EW. IR is a heat visible so there is a chance to pick up on a heat signature under EW if you can give some room for that missile to operate when under EW attack. Now I am trying to figure out if heat signature reading by AAM can be interfered with by EW. 

The Meteor Missile is supposed to be effective under ECM against the missile. So Europe is figuring this out. Saab is figuring this out.

EW is the top technology of a nation. They can determine if your missiles can hit their targets or if you are protected by your billion dollar equipment.


----------



## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国航天科工 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM







Via @民间保密爱好者 from Weibo

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## samsara

_The Global Times just affirmed the news story carried out by the South China Morning Post recently at the end of May 2020 about the substantial progress in SCRAMJET research by the team led by Dr. Fan Xuejun from the Institute of Mechanics and it's told that Dr. Fan is nominated to be “the innovator of the year” by the prestigious and influential CAS. 

The Institute of Mechanics was founded by *Dr. Qian Xuesen*, the Father of China's Rocketry, the most prominent rocket scientist in his time. _

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*China’s hypersonic cruise missile sees technological breakthrough: reports*

By Liu Xuanzun
Source: Global Times
Published: 2020/6/8





Photo: Zhang Haichao

A top Chinese science institute recently *made record-breaking progress in a scramjet program* which Chinese media speculate could lead to significant advances in the development of *China's hypersonic cruise missile*, another type of hypersonic weapon that is *more powerful* than China's DF-17 hypersonic glide-boost missile.

A team led by *Fan Xuejun at the Institute of Mechanics* under the Chinese Academy of Sciences has developed a type of scramjet that *ran continuously for 600 seconds in a ground test*, Weihutang, a program on military affairs affiliated with state broadcaster China Central Television (CCTV), reported on over the weekend.

This broke the world record of 210 seconds set by the US' X-51 aircraft, Weihutang said.

A powerful *scramjet*, also known as *supersonic combustion ramjet*, is crucial for a hypersonic cruise missile to reach hypersonic speed, *but developing one is highly challenging due to issues with heat resistant materials and cooling of the engine*, the report said.

Hypersonic weapons are known for their *high speeds* and *unpredictable trajectories*, which render most of the current generation of *air defense systems useless* against them.

China unveiled its DF-17 missile for the first time at the National Day military parade *on October 1, 2019*. This type of missile was widely believed by military observers to be a hypersonic weapon due to its aerodynamic design.

Weihutang said that the *DF-17* is a type of *hypersonic glide-boost missile*, meaning that it is propelled into the sky via a rocket and glides in the air using shock waves generated by its own hypersonic flight, but the other type of hypersonic weapon, the *hypersonic cruise missile, has constant thrust thanks to the scramjet,* which gives it a longer range and even more unpredictable trajectory.

The DF-17 is a short to medium-range missile, and using a scramjet can potentially extend its range by *at least five times,* allowing it to become *intercontinental*, Shanghai-based news website eastday.com reported on Friday, citing estimations by experts.

Since a hypersonic cruise missile does not require a rocket as large as the one used by a glide-boost missile, its size and weight are smaller, *allowing it to be stealthier*, the eastday.com report said.

The DF-17 is not the only item in China's hypersonic aircraft program. In August 2018, the China Academy of Aerospace Aerodynamics under the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation successfully launched the *Xingkong-2, or Starry Sky-2, China's first waverider hypersonic flight vehicle.*

It is not known if the Xingkong-2 is a boost-glide or cruise missile, but a CCTV program aired in late 2019 suggested it might use a different flight pattern to the DF-17.

Other countries including the US and Russia are developing both types of hypersonic weapons, and it will be natural to see China develop new ones following the DF-17, experts told the Global Times.

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## LKJ86

Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo

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## farooqbhai007

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17A SAM
> View attachment 639619
> View attachment 639620
> 
> Via @民间保密爱好者 from Weibo


very interesting vehicle in first photo , i suppose its based on FM-90C chassis by the looks of it , any more photos ?


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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM













Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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## farooqbhai007

有HQ-7支援车的图片吗

Also does the FM-90 have a additional radar vehicle in addition to the AESA radar mounted on 6x6 chassis vehicle , for example the bangladeshi version (correct me if I'm wrong)

(high res image , open in new tab)

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## samsara

_Look at how *persistent and meticulous* Henri Kenhmann (East Pendulum) is . All originated from one single picture with very vague clue posted by an amateur at some Chinese forum… _
_



_
_Amazing tracing work — a close-up look: those few Chinese characters seen are simply too little as well as quite generic to serve as a clue! _

_but eventually he managed to come out with all the details tracing the lone DF-17 TEL in question back to the Sanjiang Group in Beijing Street, near to the Xiaohan Avenue in Xiaogan city, Hubei. How many individuals can do that under some significant barriers like in this case? _
_He's truly a remarkable and useful OSINT analyst and expert on China's military supposed he chooses such direction  Read on below! _

*~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~*
*From the massage parlor to the DF-17 hypersonic glider*

*By Henri Kenhmann — East Pendulum*
(2020-06-15)

What is the link between a massage parlor practicing the Japanese Shiatsu technique, and the new Chinese hypersonic glider DF-17? None, a priori…

And yet, *an amateur photo*, posted on a local Chinese forum last Friday, *creates this link by putting in the same frame a barely identifiable advertising panel*, and a brand new transporter-erector-launcher (TEL).

We can see in close-up on this photo, visibly taken in front of a large boulevard, a 5-axle TEL of the DF-17. The latter is easily recognizable thanks to the images and videos of the military parade last year, when 16 of these machines were shown for the first time in front of the whole world.

A protective plastic film, in any case it seems to be, is stuck on each of the side windows of the cabin, which is painted in dark military green, like the other TELs of the DF-17 already in service. (1)

It will be noted that the upper part of the vehicle is closed by a metallic “cover” painted in white gray, while the TEL present at the parade of the 70th Anniversary of the People's Republic of China were uncovered, and the missiles with their glider were completely exposed from above. The rest of the vehicle is in gray, green and beige camouflage, the same as in 2019, but strangely gives an old or worn look.

Behind the vehicle is what appears to be a small parking lot and a large building, rather modern but not identifiable at first glance. We only notice *an advertising panel*, partially hidden by trees, on which mentions “御尚… 妙指压”.

The last two words, "指压", mean Shiatsu, literally "finger pressure", a manual therapy from Japan. It is therefore a safe bet that it is a massage parlor.





_An amateur photo is posted on Friday June 12 on a local Chinese forum, showing a TEL of the DF-17_





_TELs from DF-17 during the military parade in 2019_

The story should have ended here. A TEL identified as that of the DF-17, but in an environment that lacks an obvious benchmark, *is difficult to locate…*

There is indeed this clue of the massage parlor, the name of which would be “御尚” or would contain these. *But it seems impossible to associate* the full or partial name of a massage parlor, which has hundreds of thousands in China, with an equally partial building facade.

After some rather opportunistic tests, the fears of the beginning are verified - There are far too many massage parlors in China bearing this name, and research on Google precisely dispels the myth of Google, in the context of China.

But Baidu, the Chinese equivalent of Google, does little better. The search results do not display the images of the massage parlors found. We would then need a tool, accessible in Chinese data and similar to Google Maps Street View, so that we can both search by keyword and move around the premises as if we were there to view the buildings.

A first attempt on Baidu Map unfortunately does not give satisfaction - the Web version returns approximate results, and the mobile version, in other words in "Apps", does not have a man-machine interface which facilitates searches for national coverage (which remains understandable for nominal use cases).

After testing another tool but without success, and before giving up for lack of means, the web version of Tencent Maps seems to have given hope. It allows you to group the search results by province (and by city of direct administration), and a good part of urbanized areas in China is covered by the "Street View" function.

It is therefore with *Tencent Maps and its Street View function*, and using as keyword “御尚” (the other combinations are unfortunately not conclusive), that a list of 294 establishments distributed in practically all the Chinese provinces was incorporated.

Among these establishments, some are indeed a massage or beauty salon but do not correspond to the photo in question, others are restaurants (we can also be surprised by the number of Chinese fondue restaurants that borrow the same name…), plus a part that *cannot be viewed* on Street View. One of them, located in *Xiaogan *(孝感)*, a city in Hubei province,* finally shows some interesting signs.




_The street view using the Tencent Maps tool_

Indeed, if we do not see any identical advertising panel on this view compared to that of the photo in question, the architectural structure of the building remains however similar, in particular at the level of the stone posts of the large entrance, the colors of the wall as well as decorative wall prints.

And a deeper research on this massage parlor and this place in particular allows to say that the name of the establishment marked on this Street View of Tencent Maps dates in fact from 2016, and since the parlor has changed its name, which is of "御尚至尊港派足浴" now. The view provided by the tool is therefore obsolete.

Continuing then on this track, we quickly find much more recent images of the show *on the local rating sites*, which confirmed without any harm that the TEL of the DF-17 on the amateur photo was indeed well in Xiaogan, in the province of Hubei, and more precisely on *Xiaohan Avenue* (孝汉大道), in front of the Fuhua Boutique Hotel (富华精品酒店).

Using Google Earth type satellite images, and with other details provided by the original photo, we can even assume that the vehicle was not going to continue straight on Xiaohan Avenue, but was rather going turn left at the next intersection.

*Many questions arise then, like why a TEL of the DF-17 is in this city? Where does it come from and where does it go?*





_Identification of the place thanks to the rating site photos_





_The position of the TEL in question and its possible route on satellite image_

To answer these questions, you just have to… turn left.

In fact, once the vehicle leaves Xiaohan Avenue to go to the left, it will be on *Beijing Street* (北京路), where part of the Chinese missile giant CASIC's subsidiaries are located, such as:

Sanjiang Astronautics Hongfeng Control
Sanjiang Astronautics Xianfeng Electron Information
Sanjiang Astronautics Wanshan Special Type Vehicles
Sanjiang Astronautics Jiangbei Mechanical Engineering
Sanjiang Astronautics Wanfeng Technology Development
…
Note that these entities located along the Beijing Street are all part of the Sanjiang Group (itself a subsidiary of CASIC), better known by its former name "Base 066" and its emblematic ballistic missile DF-11.

Given the appearance of the TEL in question, namely a brand new cabin with protective plastic films on the windows, an upper "cover" in white gray which appears provisional and the rest of the TEL which seems to be worn, the one of the hypotheses is to say that the vehicle would have left the *Wanshan Special Type Vehicle factory,* located to the east of the city, to reach the other entities on Beijing Street and continue the rest of the installation there.





_The possible route taken by the TEL of the DF-17 (in blue), and the factories of the Sajiang group (in yellow)_

If this hypothesis is confirmed, it amounts not only to saying that the TEL of the DF-17 is designed by Sanjiang, but also indicates that this new Chinese weapon called "penetration" against anti-missile systems is in fact a joint project between the two largest Chinese missiles, CASC and CASIC.

It can then be assumed that CASC is responsible for the overall project, including the design of the hypersonic glider by its subsidiary CALT from institutional publications, while CASIC would take care of the development of TEL, and would also probably contribute to the carrier missile that remains not identified to date (see the file _"DF-17: What we know about this Chinese hypersonic weapon"_).

While waiting for new amateur photos on a theme park, a vegetarian restaurant or a luxury goods boutique, with a close-up of a state-of-the-art Chinese weapon, this photo of the TEL from DF-17 to Xiaogan suggests above all that the *mass production* of this missile with regional reach, and intended to complement the already large panoply of offensive vectors of the Chinese Rocket Force, *calmly follows its course*.

It also suggests that this type of collaboration between the various Chinese entities, even between the competitors within a common sector, as what we have already observed on the IRBM DF-26 project, would be more widespread than we thought.

(1) From the CCTV-7 television news dated December 2, 2019 - [军事报道] 走进导弹发射先锋营 ：战场是最好的课堂对抗是检验自己的磨刀石

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM










Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM




Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM




Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM




Via @高原战士 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @人民海军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

























Via @枕戈观澜 from Weixin and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## Deino

A new and most likely older image of the PL-XX (PL-20 or PL-21) Ultra-long-range-AAM carried by a 'PLAAF J-11B.
(Image courtesy of LXFFJBSX via Huitong's CMA-Blog)

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 646498
> View attachment 646499


HQ-7B shooting practice


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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via @忠诚号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM







Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## samsara

中国航天科工三院:

说起朱坤,一定得谈谈他的专业领域飞航导弹。他攻克了其他大国都多次失败的世界性难题,突破了我国20多年都没解决的技术瓶颈,更根据作战需求研制了比同类导弹更小巧、威力却更大的新一代导弹武器。在一次项目评审会上,一位在科研领域深耕多年的专家听完朱坤的汇报后,吃惊地说:“这是一代宗师啊!“





*The Third Academy of China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC)*

Speaking of *Zhu Kun*, we must talk about his professional field of *cruise missiles*. He has overcome the world-wide problems that other major powers have failed many times, and *has broken through the technical bottleneck that China has not solved for more than 20 years*.

He has also developed a new generation of missile weapons that are *smaller and more powerful* than similar missiles according to operational requirements.

At a project review meeting, an expert who has been working in the field of scientific research for many years heard Zhu Kun's report and said in surprise: _*“This is a generational grandmaster!”*_

By the way CASIC's Third Academy encompasses the Academy of Cruise Missile Technology.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## ariez168

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1278363203504877575

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## Figaro

ariez168 said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1278363203504877575


Nice lights

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## LKJ86

Via @陆军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @喀喇昆仑卫士 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @高原战士 from Weibo

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## Figaro

What is the status of the HQ-9C? Its range is said to be over 400km

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## 925boy

Figaro said:


> What is the status of the HQ-9C? Its range is said to be over 400km


Great question. China should already have good #s of longer range AD systems than the HQ9s and HQ16s..

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## JSCh



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## S10

I am stealing this from CD. Possible arrangement of HGV in the near future in ICBMs.

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## samsara

S10 said:


> I am stealing this from CD. Possible arrangement of HGV in the near future in ICBMs.


DF-45, three stages, Diameter (straight): 2.6 meters
8 × 650 kiloton HGV (warheads)

JL-3 (SLBM), the 2nd stage has diameter of 2.2 meters, and the 3rd stage has diameter of 1.2 meters.
8 × 150kt HGV

DF-41, the 2nd stage has diameter of 2 meters
8 × 150kt HGV

DF-41, the 3rd stage has diameter of 1.7 meters
4 × 650kt HGV

150kt HGV: height 0.45m, width 0.8m, weight 200kg

650kt HGV: height 0.625m, width 1.0m, weight 450kg

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## ozranger

samsara said:


> DF-45, three stages, Diameter (straight): 2.6 meters
> 8 × 650 kiloton HGV (warheads)
> 
> JL-3 (SLBM), the 2nd stage has diameter of 2.2 meters, and the 3rd stage has diameter of 1.2 meters.
> 8 × 150kt HGV
> 
> DF-41, the 2nd stage has diameter of 2 meters
> 8 × 150kt HGV
> 
> DF-41, the 3rd stage has diameter of 1.7 meters
> 4 × 650kt HGV
> 
> 150kt HGV: height 0.45m, width 0.8m, weight 200kg
> 
> 650kt HGV: height 0.625m, width 1.0m, weight 450kg


While the DF-45 is very interesting, worth noting that the new DF-41 releases HGVs very early from the 2nd stage. Not sure if it is truly authentic though.

Assuming that is true, I guess this new version of DF-41 will release the smaller HGVs from stage 2 to attack the relatively near targets when the stage 3 is detached. Then stage 3 will continue its trip to hit farther targets with later released 4 bigger HGVs.


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## samsara

ozranger said:


> While the DF-45 is very interesting, worth noting that the new DF-41 releases HGVs very early from the 2nd stage. Not sure if it is truly authentic though.
> 
> Assuming that is true, I guess this new version of DF-41 will release the smaller HGVs from stage 2 to attack the relatively near targets when the stage 3 is detached. Then stage 3 will continue its trip to hit farther targets with later released 4 bigger HGVs.


How about if the DF-41 is designed or modified to have more than one variant? Let say one variant with two stages and the other one with three stages. Then HGV warheads. 

I don't have further info, and never read as such. But when I see this info, I am thinking perhaps the DF-41 has dual variants. Just my two cents.

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via @南陆一号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HJ-10

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## LKJ86

Via @中国军网 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @海军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM







Via @陆军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM





































Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Good news!!!




Via @帧察点 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM








Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM







Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM













Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16B SAM
> View attachment 651849
> View attachment 651850
> View attachment 651851
> View attachment 651852
> 
> Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM


































Via @陆军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM





































Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-16B SAM
> View attachment 652664
> View attachment 652666
> View attachment 652668
> View attachment 652669
> View attachment 652670
> View attachment 652671
> View attachment 652672
> View attachment 652674
> View attachment 652677
> View attachment 652678
> View attachment 652680
> View attachment 652682
> 
> Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM




























Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## vi-va

Found a good old video on Jun 24, 2018

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## bahadur999

HQ-16 dummy

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南疆号角 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM





Via 兵工科技

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## LKJ86

HQ-10 SAM




Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM



















Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 657052
> View attachment 657053
> 
> Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo







Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## vi-va

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 657118
> 
> Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


faster than Spike NLOS


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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM




Via @南海舰队 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @北陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @忠诚号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

*Rocket Force University Cadets Launch Missiles to Complete Graduate Drill*

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM











Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @南疆号角 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @北海舰队 from Weixin


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## beijingwalker

*China test fires 'carrier killer' ballistic missile amid tensions with India, USA*
Amid growing tensions with India and the United States of America, the Chinese have test-fired a ballistic missile which is being tipped as 'carrier killer'. On Monday, People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) announced that it had test-fired two ballistic missiles during recent drill, a short-range and an intermediate-range missile. 

Published on: August 06, 2020 8:36 IST





Image Source : PLA OFFICIAL WEBSITE

Amid growing tensions with India and the United States of America, the Chinese have test-fired a ballistic missile which is being tipped as 'carrier killer'. On Monday, People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) announced that it had test-fired two ballistic missiles during recent drill, a short-range and an intermediate-range missile. 

"We are in a highly alert state for combat, to ensure our actions are prompt and precise,” Liu Yang, the commander of the brigade that carried out the tests, was quoted as saying in a story on PLA news site 81.cn


The IRBM launched by the Chinese Army has a range of 2,500 miles and is being tipped as an 'aircraft carried killer', a potential threat to the USS Nimitz and other American Navy vessels in the region. 

The drill was to test how 1quickly PLARF soldiers could respond to an incoming nuclear attack. In the video, uploaded to the PLA website, they are seen charging towards the mobile missile launchers. The report however did not confirm when the drill took place. 

This comes after US Air Force's Global Strike Command test-fired the LGM-30 minuteman lll ICBM which has a range of 4,200 miles, just after midnight on August 4. 

“The Minuteman III is 50 years old, and continued test launches are essential in ensuring its reliability until the 2030s when the Ground Base Strategic Deterrent is fully in place. Most importantly, this visible message of national security serves to assure our allies and dissuade potential aggressors,” 576th Flight Test Squadron commander Col. Omar Colbert said in the release.

China's relations with both US and India have been on a downward trend in the last few months. India has taken significant steps to counter Chinese involvement in the country by banning a number of Chinese apps. 

US has meanwhile extended its support to India against the expansionist policy of China. 

US Congressmen Eliot Engel and Michael McCaul wrote to External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar last night. "US-India relationship is all the more important as India faces aggression from China along your shared border, that is part of Chinese government's pattern of unlawful and belligerent territorial aggression across Indi-Pacific," the letter read. 

"The United States will remain steadfast in support of India’s efforts to defend its sovereignty and territorial integrity. We acknowledge ongoing serious security and counterterrorism concerns in region and look forward to work with your govt to address these while upholding our shared commitments to democratic values on which our nations’ bond was built," the Congressmen futher added. 

https://www.indiatvnews.com/news/wo...ndia-tension-icbm-india-china-standoff-639906


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## achhu

posturing for war .


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## bolo

achhu said:


> posturing for war .


India's dream will come true soon. Now there's no turning back.
Warming up my popcorn.

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## achhu

bolo said:


> India's dream will come true soon. Now there's no turning back.
> Warming up my popcorn.


keep dreaming.

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## bolo

achhu said:


> keep dreaming.


Indians want war from Indian twitter sources and from what I gathered from Indians online. Are you saying India doesn't want war?
Who's going to avenge the 22 Indian soldiers death and the 50+ missing?

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## atan651

Just keep building up these powerful nuclear and non-nuclear weapons and assume a war is imminent. China's enemies will have to think thrice before they do anything stupid.

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## achhu

bolo said:


> Indians want war from Indian twitter sources and from what I gathered from Indians online. Are you saying India doesn't want war?
> Who's going to avenge the 22 Indian soldiers death and the 50+ missing?


we dont want war , but we will do everything to save our country.


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## Oracle

bolo said:


> India's dream will come true soon. Now there's no turning back.
> Warming up my popcorn.


India will never fight with china. barking dogs never bite ... specially after 27 feb

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## Riz

Modi just want china to escalate one more time so that he can order his troops to carryout surgical strike in Beijing..

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## rent4country

China fires but never shows even partial data supporting this AC killer capability. Missle goes up, and the missile splashes down. Hell, even Iran shows taking down an aircraft carrier with ten's of small attack boats.


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## Beast

achhu said:


> keep dreaming.


We slay 20 indian soldiers with bare hands and no fatality and yet to see any concrete military response from India beside doing such childish banning of Tiktok. 

Looks like India is some small fry.

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## Beast

rent4country said:


> China fires but never shows even partial data supporting this AC killer capability. Missle goes up, and the missile splashes down. Hell, even Iran shows taking down an aircraft carrier with ten's of small attack boats.


Why would China reveal secret and path of the trajectory of the missile , only to allow US more info on how to intercept this missile? 

Did USAF even reveal the full capabilities of F-22 or M1A2 tank spec? No, then why must China do that?

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## achhu

Beast said:


> We slay 20 indian soldiers with bare hands and no fatality and yet to see any concrete military response from India beside doing such childish banning of Tiktok.
> 
> Looks like India is some small fry.


those soldiers were martyred defending their nation , we are proud of them unlike your country who is hiding their 43 dead just to avoid humiliation .


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## achhu

Beast said:


> Why would China reveal secret and path of the trajectory of the missile , only to allow US more info on how to intercept this missile?
> 
> Did USAF even reveal the full capabilities of F-22 or M1A2 tank spec? No, then why must China do that?



lol........


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## Beast

achhu said:


> those soldiers were martyred defending their nation , we are proud of them unlike your country who is hiding their 43 dead just to avoid humiliation .


There is no fatality. I know it a bitter pill of truth Indian soldiers are so weak that 20 killed by just bare hand of Chinese soldiers. 

A bunch of weakling. 

The Chinese can even throw rifle to Indian soldiers and we still can beat the crapped out of Indian soldiers with our bare hand.

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## PakFactor

achhu said:


> those soldiers were martyred defending their nation , we are proud of them unlike your country who is hiding their 43 dead just to avoid humiliation .



This is funny you people have no concept of Martyr or Shaheed in Hinduism and copy Islamic concepts, yet you guys play the Hindu card when lynching for eating beef etc. lol

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## rent4country

Beast said:


> Why would China reveal secret and path of the trajectory of the missile , only to allow US more info on how to intercept this missile?
> 
> Did USAF even reveal the full capabilities of F-22 or M1A2 tank spec? No, then why must China do that?



I never asked why it has not spilled all the beans (_"never shows even *partial data supporting* this AC killer capability._"). 

If you are going to claim a game-changing weapon defying physics as a deterrence, then you should make some effort to prove it's veracity, even if at very high level- yet logical to see. China does this with its aircraft too. they hide any effort to make it a credible deterrence. But guess what? Hiding is a Chinese military tradition, ain't it Beast. 

We did not share everything about our F 22, but we showed the world some of the design and the physics behind stealth. It was not hard for everyone to grasp that it indeed had radar avoidance/reduction design features. You can simply do a video showing missile fired from land it being tracked and then hitting a moving vessel chugging at the same speeds as an AC and at distances you would expect an AC to hang back with its protection cover.


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## rent4country

Beast said:


> There is no fatality. I know it a bitter pill of truth Indian soldiers are so weak that 20 killed by just bare hand of Chinese soldiers.
> 
> A bunch of weakling.
> 
> The Chinese can even throw rifle to Indian soldiers and we still can beat the crapped out of Indian soldiers with our bare hand.



Stop disrespecting other nation's soldiers. Your people have a tradition of dishonoring their soldiers by covering up their sacrifices because you are embarrassed by dead soldiers. You got no room to troll any country when you have this shameful tradition.


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## Beast

rent4country said:


> Stop disrespecting other nation's soldiers. Your people have a tradition of dishonoring their soldiers by covering up their sacrifices because you are embarrassed by dead soldiers. You got no room to troll any country when you have this shameful tradition.


Indian troll and stop flying US flag. See how these despicable people desperate to make up fatalities to ease their wounded ego. Let me show you one of the low life trick from Indians. They have no shame! 

https://www.boomlive.in/fake-news/n...generals-viral-as-slain-chinese-soldiers-8550

Names Of 56 Former PLA Generals Viral As Slain Chinese Soldiers BOOM found that the viral list was taken right out of a Wikipedia page on Chinese generals.

A list of names of 56 individuals is being shared on social media with the claim that they are the slain Chinese soldiers from the Galwan Valley clash the occurred between Indian and Chinese troops on June 15. This claim is false; BOOM found that those names belong to 56 former Generals of the People's Liberation Army (PLA), and that the list has been taken right out of a Wikipedia page called "List of generals of the People's Republic of China". An image containing the viral list was shared by Twitter handle News Line IFE (@NewsLineIFE) with the caption: "#BreakingNews : Official notification on #PLA Casualties in #GalwanValley #Ladakh #IndiaChinaFaceOff ! 45 were confirmed before. But now looks like 11 who was in ICU passed away." The list also contains a piece of text in Mandarin, which roughly translates to, "We express our deepest condolences to these families, and are firmly committed to protecting the sovereignty of our country." Created on March 2020, News Line IFE - which describes itself as a news outlet - has gained nearly 10,000 followers in just three months.

*https://www.boomlive.in/fake-news/n...generals-viral-as-slain-chinese-soldiers-8550*

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## rent4country

Beast said:


> Indian troll and stop flying US flag. See how these despicable people desperate to make up fatalities to ease their wounded ego. Let me show you one of the low life trick from Indians. They have no shame!
> 
> https://www.boomlive.in/fake-news/n...generals-viral-as-slain-chinese-soldiers-8550
> 
> Names Of 56 Former PLA Generals Viral As Slain Chinese Soldiers BOOM found that the viral list was taken right out of a Wikipedia page on Chinese generals.
> 
> A list of names of 56 individuals is being shared on social media with the claim that they are the slain Chinese soldiers from the Galwan Valley clash the occurred between Indian and Chinese troops on June 15. This claim is false; BOOM found that those names belong to 56 former Generals of the People's Liberation Army (PLA), and that the list has been taken right out of a Wikipedia page called "List of generals of the People's Republic of China". An image containing the viral list was shared by Twitter handle News Line IFE (@NewsLineIFE) with the caption: "#BreakingNews : Official notification on #PLA Casualties in #GalwanValley #Ladakh #IndiaChinaFaceOff ! 45 were confirmed before. But now looks like 11 who was in ICU passed away." The list also contains a piece of text in Mandarin, which roughly translates to, "We express our deepest condolences to these families, and are firmly committed to protecting the sovereignty of our country." Created on March 2020, News Line IFE - which describes itself as a news outlet - has gained nearly 10,000 followers in just three months.
> 
> *https://www.boomlive.in/fake-news/n...generals-viral-as-slain-chinese-soldiers-8550*



Stop spazzing out because you see conspiracies everywhere 

Fake news of 56 Chinese being dead does not absolve your sick tradition of dishonoring your dead soldiers and covering up their sacrifice because you want to save face. Imagine that platoon being told they can't honor or speak about their fellow dead soldiers because the Chinese military and CCP think it will be embarrassing. 

Who are you kidding to tell us not a single Chinese died on your side? I had read even many of your net citizens were angry online about the CCP covering up their soldier's sacrifices.


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## Arsalan

The United States and the People’s Republic of China have both recently test-fired long-range ballistic missiles. Although the US has nearly 20 times the number of nuclear weapons as China, the Trump administration has insisted Beijing be included in any new arms control treaties.

*Chinese Nuclear Response Test*
On Monday, the People’s Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) announced it had test-fired two ballistic missiles during a recent drill: one was a short-range Dongfeng-16 missile and the other was a Dongfeng-26, an intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) designed to strike targets thousands of miles away.

“We are in a highly alert state for combat, to ensure our actions are prompt and precise,” Liu Yang, the commander of the brigade that carried out the tests, was quoted as saying in a story on PLA news site.






*A road-mobile DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile is test-fired by China's People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF)*

The Dongfeng-26 has a range of some 2,500 miles and has been touted as a “carrier-killer” capable of endangering US battle fleets in the region. It has the range to strike US installations on Guam from the Chinese coast.

According to the report, the drill was to test how quickly PLARF soldiers could respond to an incoming nuclear attack. In the video, they are seen donning protective gear as they rush to their mobile missile launchers, then driving them to a platform on a plain that appears to be prepared for launching missiles. The report did not say when the drill occurred.

*US Launches Minuteman ICBM*
Meanwhile, just after midnight on August 4, the US Air Force’s Global Strike Command fired off an unarmed LGM-30 Minuteman III intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) equipped with three reentry vehicles. In a real nuclear strike, each would carry its own nuclear warhead and go on to strike a separate target.

The missile flew some 4,200 miles from Vandenberg Air Force Base on the California coast to Kwajalein Atoll in the Marshall Islands, US Strategic Command said in a news release.




* An Air Force Global Strike Command unarmed Minuteman III intercontinental ballistic missile launches during an operational test at 12:21 a.m. Pacific Daylight Time 4 August 2020, at Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif.*

A US Navy E-6 Mercury “doomsday plane” airborne command post and communications aircraft also used the drill to test its own ability to take charge of an ICBM in the event that ground command is interrupted during the missile’s flight.

*Arms Control, But Whose Arms?*
In just six months, on February 5, 2021, the New Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty (New START) between the US and Russia will expire, and the rush is on to either extend or replace it.

The United States has some 5,800 nuclear weapons - roughly 20 times China’s arsenal - but New START limits the US to just 1,550 deployed at any one time. Russia’s arsenal is slightly larger at 6,800 weapons, but is subject to the same limitations. China, meanwhile, has just 300 nuclear warheads. Despite this, the US has insisted that China be involved in any new arms control treaty.

On July 5, Fu Cong, the head of the arms control department of the Chinese Foreign Ministry, said Beijing would “be happy to” join the US and Russia in such talks - provided the US reduces its own arsenal to the size of China’s, which Beijing says serves no purpose except deterrence.
The US State Department seemed to accept the prospect of talks, but not of arms reduction, suggesting the Chinese begin talks with their Russian counterparts first.

However, Chinese Ambassador to Russia Zhang Hanhui blasted the US response in comments on July 30, saying, “the US has repeatedly made proposals on arms control for China, Russia and the US and promoted the 'China factor' to distract international attention, pursuing to justify its withdrawal from the US-Russian New Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty and pursuing 'self-liberation' and achievement of absolute strategic advantage. China and Russia see this very clearly.”

"China's refusal to participate in trilateral arms control negotiations does not mean that China refuses to participate in international nuclear disarmament efforts," Zhang continued.
Several days earlier, US President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin reaffirmed at least the principle of a bilateral arms treaty between them due to their “special responsibility for maintaining international peace and security” as the world’s largest nuclear powers, according to a Kremlin press release.

The US has withdrawn from several key treaties designed to reduce war tensions, including the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces (INF) Treaty that banned missiles with ranges between 500 and 5,500 kilometers, and, more recently, the Treaty on Open Skies, which provided for flyover inspections of each member’s territory in the spirit of openness. Many fear New START may be the next treaty shed as the US prepares for “inter-state strategic competition” with Russia and China, as Pentagon strategy statements indicate.

Article Link


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## Figaro

Arsalan said:


> The United States has some 5,800 nuclear weapons - roughly 20 times China’s arsenal - but New START limits the US to just 1,550 deployed at any one time. Russia’s arsenal is slightly larger at 6,800 weapons, but is subject to the same limitations. China, meanwhile, has just 300 nuclear warheads.


How people believe China only has 300 nuclear weapons to this day is extremely laughable. Even the former head of the Russian Strategic Rocket Forces, Col. Gen. Viktor Yesin, says China has between 1600 to 1800 nukes (as of 2012). Note I'd think he is a tad more credible than your run of the mill Western analyst lol.

https://freebeacon.com/national-security/number-the-nukes/

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## PeacefulWar

I really think China should attend the trilateral arms control negotiations.
She should request USA and Russia to bring down their nuclears to China's level.
It's a good thing for this world, isn't it


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## ozranger

Figaro said:


> How people believe China only has 300 nuclear weapons to this day is extremely laughable. Even the former head of the Russian Strategic Rocket Forces, Col. Gen. Viktor Yesin, says China has between 1600 to 1800 nukes (as of 2012). Note I'd think he is a tad more credible than your run of the mill Western analyst lol.
> 
> https://freebeacon.com/national-security/number-the-nukes/


Some people active in Chinese social networks estimated warhead count for those which *can hit the entire US land*, based on the launcher vehicles and missiles shown in last parade. They think it is a figure between 500 and 1000.

Of course there should be other warheads than those 500 - 1000 strategically targeting the US.


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## Figaro

ozranger said:


> Some people active in Chinese social networks estimated warhead count for those which *can hit the entire US land*, based on the launcher vehicles and missiles shown in last parade. They think it is a figure between 500 and 1000.
> 
> Of course there should be other warheads than those 500 - 1000 strategically targeting the US.


I would caution using the parade count though. Can we be certain they are not mockups? Moreover, even just because the DF-41 has a MIRV payload of 10 warheads does not mean it will carry 10 warheads. More likely, at least half would be used as penetration decoys.



PeacefulWar said:


> I really think China should attend the trilateral arms control negotiations.
> She should request USA and Russia to bring down their nuclears to China's level.
> It's a good thing for this world, isn't it


I doubt anybody believes the Chinese number of 300. I can bet you the Pentagon has much better intelligence than those Western nuclear disarmament "experts." If the director of STRATCOM Intelligence says the Chinese doubled their nuclear arsenal in the past decade, then the Chinese have a minimum of 600 nukes (since the nuclear count in 2010 was around 300 nukes). I'm sure the Pentagon knows their arsenal is much higher. 



> “China has long had a no-first-use policy, and yet they’ve doubled their nuclear arsenal in about the last decade, and they’re on track to double it again in the next decade,” Brookes said.


https://americanmilitarynews.com/2019/08/china-has-doubled-its-nuclear-arsenal-stratcom-says/


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## samsara

achhu said:


> we dont want war , but we will do everything to save our country.


Who want your country???

Do you think any other nation wanna take care and feed the population of that many???

But *disputed territory* has *disputed* ownership, think that simple meaning explains the actual thing, and please don't try to twist the word, it's plain and simple.

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## samsara

beijingwalker said:


> *China test fires 'carrier killer' ballistic missile amid tensions with India, USA*
> Amid growing tensions with India and the United States of America, the Chinese have test-fired a ballistic missile which is being tipped as 'carrier killer'. On Monday, People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) announced that it had test-fired two ballistic missiles during recent drill, a short-range and an intermediate-range missile.
> 
> Published on: August 06, 2020 8:36 IST
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Image Source : PLA OFFICIAL WEBSITE
> 
> Amid growing tensions with India and the United States of America, the Chinese have test-fired a ballistic missile which is being tipped as 'carrier killer'. On Monday, People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) announced that it had test-fired two ballistic missiles during recent drill, a short-range and an intermediate-range missile.
> 
> "We are in a highly alert state for combat, to ensure our actions are prompt and precise,” Liu Yang, the commander of the brigade that carried out the tests, was quoted as saying in a story on PLA news site 81.cn
> 
> 
> The IRBM launched by the Chinese Army has a range of 2,500 miles and is being tipped as an 'aircraft carried killer', a potential threat to the USS Nimitz and other American Navy vessels in the region.
> 
> The drill was to test how 1quickly PLARF soldiers could respond to an incoming nuclear attack. In the video, uploaded to the PLA website, they are seen charging towards the mobile missile launchers. The report however did not confirm when the drill took place.
> 
> This comes after US Air Force's Global Strike Command test-fired the LGM-30 minuteman lll ICBM which has a range of 4,200 miles, just after midnight on August 4.
> 
> “The Minuteman III is 50 years old, and continued test launches are essential in ensuring its reliability until the 2030s when the Ground Base Strategic Deterrent is fully in place. Most importantly, this visible message of national security serves to assure our allies and dissuade potential aggressors,” 576th Flight Test Squadron commander Col. Omar Colbert said in the release.
> 
> China's relations with both US and India have been on a downward trend in the last few months. India has taken significant steps to counter Chinese involvement in the country by banning a number of Chinese apps.
> 
> US has meanwhile extended its support to India against the expansionist policy of China.
> 
> US Congressmen Eliot Engel and Michael McCaul wrote to External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar last night. "US-India relationship is all the more important as India faces aggression from China along your shared border, that is part of Chinese government's pattern of unlawful and belligerent territorial aggression across Indi-Pacific," the letter read.
> 
> "The United States will remain steadfast in support of India’s efforts to defend its sovereignty and territorial integrity. We acknowledge ongoing serious security and counterterrorism concerns in region and look forward to work with your govt to address these while upholding our shared commitments to democratic values on which our nations’ bond was built," the Congressmen futher added.
> 
> https://www.indiatvnews.com/news/wo...ndia-tension-icbm-india-china-standoff-639906


I can't understand why this seemingly INDIAN media use the Imperial System instead of Metric System.

Do Indian people use the Imperial System in their daily lives?

We, the Asian, don't measure in miles, we use kilometers. We don't use Imperial System in day-to-day life, we use Metric System!

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## Figaro

bolo said:


> Who's going to avenge the 22 Indian soldiers death and the 50+ missing?


Bollywood ... a Galwan movie is already in the making. I guess they're gonna get NE Indians who look East Asian to be the Chinese 

https://indianexpress.com/article/e...fice-of-indian-army-at-galwan-valley-6489570/

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## ozranger

Figaro said:


> I would caution using the parade count though. Can we be certain they are not mockups? Moreover, even just because the DF-41 has a MIRV payload of 10 warheads does not mean it will carry 10 warheads. More likely, at least half would be used as penetration decoys.



I can't remember where I saw it but the link was on CJDBY pointing to a different website, with following comments underneath. Those people actually estimated the number more conservatively than you thought. DF-41 was estimated as carrying 6 warheads of 65kt TNT based on the sizes they got from the pictures or video clips of the parade. They also noticed the latest launch vehicle number of a typical brigade for ICBMs is 18.

I think I should make it more clear. They actually estimated the sizes and numbers based on what were visible at the parade and combined them with results from satellite photos of those newly built PLARF brigades or bases. Then they multiplied up number of launch vehicles and number of brigades.

Of course experienced PLARF watchers all know that those brigades or bases visible to satellites are actually training hubs. The real deployment could mostly be in or within support range of a huge system called Underground Great Walls. However numbers of those bases and vehicles can still give you some rough idea about the deployment scale of the missiles with a range for targets in the US.

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## beijingwalker

A very good generalization from Indian source over the global situation of the past couples of decades. If we can win easily and naturally, why we have to fight?

"China had been winning without fighting, while the US was fighting without winning."
*The impact on the global order of China’s rise will be visible over the next generation
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com...ise-will-be-visible-over-the-next-generation/*

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1291327645980876800

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## vi-va

JSCh said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1291327645980876800


game changer.

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## ZeEa5KPul

vi-va said:


> game changer.


It really is. Being able to launch attacks on carriers beyond the first island chain or attack carriers in the SCS from the Gobi desert is a remarkable capability.

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## Figaro

ZeEa5KPul said:


> It really is. Being able to launch attacks on carriers beyond the first island chain or attack carriers in the SCS from the Gobi desert is a remarkable capability.


Are we sure they are launching the rockets from the Gobi desert to the SCS for exercise? If this was the case, they would have launched a notice (e.g. NOTAM).


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## ZeEa5KPul

Figaro said:


> Are we sure they are launching the rockets from the Gobi desert to the SCS for exercise? If this was the case, they would have launched a notice (e.g. NOTAM).


I'm not talking about this launch, but what capability the DF-26 gives the PLA. Being able to attack American carriers in the SCS from deep in the Chinese hinterland away from any possibility of a preemptive strike or boost interception is significant.

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## bolo

Figaro said:


> Bollywood ... a Galwan movie is already in the making. I guess they're gonna get NE Indians who look East Asian to be the Chinese
> 
> https://indianexpress.com/article/e...fice-of-indian-army-at-galwan-valley-6489570/


That's just nuts.


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## bolo

Oracle said:


> India will never fight with china. barking dogs never bite ... specially after 27 feb


You're right. After June 15th all I hear and see on YouTube, Twitter, Indian news are Indians barking. Barking dogs never bite...

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## LKJ86

HJ-10




Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## farooqbhai007

LKJ86 said:


> HJ-10
> View attachment 660045
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo





__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1292780353476673538

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM













Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM








Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## Broccoli

LKJ86 said:


> HJ-10
> View attachment 660045
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo



Wheeler launch platform makes more sense that then more expensive and maintanance heavy tracked vehicle.


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## casual

Broccoli said:


> Wheeler launch platform makes more sense that then more expensive and maintanance heavy tracked vehicle.


wheeled platform can't support as much weight and has poor mobility in areas with low ground resistance. you need both wheeled and tracked platforms


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## bahadur999

TOR + PG99 (Maybe HQ-17 and not TOR)

http://english.chinamil.com.cn/view/2020-08/13/content_9881184_3.htm


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## ozranger

bahadur999 said:


> TOR + PG99 (Maybe HQ-17 and not TOR)
> 
> http://english.chinamil.com.cn/view/2020-08/13/content_9881184_3.htm



It is TOR. 




HQ-17 has different radar systems

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## bahadur999



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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1294360216541237248

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## LKJ86

HJ-10













Via @高原战士 from Weixin

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## JSCh

*Indigenous airborne munitions dispenser can paralyze airfield in one shot*
By Liu Xuanzun Source: Global Times Published: 2020/8/16 19:00:55



A pilot assigned to an aviation regiment under the PLA Air Force climbs into the cockpit of his fighter jet prior to a night flight training exercise in late June, 2020. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Tang Huaihui)

China has revealed a type of domestically developed airborne munitions dispenser, a hybrid weapon that lies between an air-to-ground missile and a guided bomb droppable by an aircraft from a safe distance, that can release hundreds of submunitions that cover a large area. This kind of weapon can effectively paralyze an airfield in one shot, leaving enemy warplanes grounded or destroyed, experts said on Sunday.

Formally classified as a guided glide dispenser bomb, this highly accurate, modularized weapon weighs 500 kilograms. While it looks like a missile, it has a square cross-section to hold more submunitions. This design can also reduce the weapon's radar cross-section, enhancing the weapon's stealth capability, making it more difficult to intercept, according to a report by China Central Television (CCTV) on Saturday.

When dropped, the dispenser can open its wings, which can provide extra lift force and controllability and allow it to have a range of more than 60 kilometers, the CCTV report said, noting that this means the aircraft carrying it can safely drop the weapon without entering the enemy's air defense zone.

Each dispenser can carry 240 submunitions of six types, which when released will cover more than 6,000 square meters, CCTV quoted a senior engineer at the weapon's manufacturer, China North Industries Group Corp (NORINCO), as saying.

When attacking groups of tanks and armored vehicles, the dispenser can use anti-tank submunitions that can penetrate tanks' armor from the top, or it can equip regional lockdown submunitions when attacking large facilities like airfields, CCTV reported.

A typical munitions dispenser like this can disable an airfield for an extended period with only one shot, because the sheer number of submunitions means the whole runway will be destroyed, and it is also possible that some of the submunitions will be mines, which will make attempts to repair the runway very risky, a Chinese military expert told the Global Times on Sunday on condition of anonymity.

This will provide crucial battle opportunities, because it means the enemy would not be able to make any warplane sortie, and the user of the dispenser can seize air superiority and gain tactical and even strategic advantages, the expert said.

A separate CCTV report in March 2019 showed a Chinese J-16 fighter jet equipped with a weapon that looked very like a munitions dispenser. The report speculated at that time that the weapon had been commissioned into the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force.

In addition to the J-16, China's JH-7 fighter bomber and H-6 bomber could also be equipped with the dispenser, the expert said.

Foreign media reported on Saturday that the island of Taiwan has officially signed an agreement with the US to buy 66 F-16V fighter jets. Chinese mainland military analysts said that if a reunification-by-force operation breaks out, the PLA would destroy Taiwan's airfields and command centers, giving the F-16Vs no chance to even take off, and giving those already in the air no place to land.

NORINCO has also developed airborne munitions dispensers for export, including the TL500 that made its appearance at Airshow China in previous years, Shanghai-based news website eastday.com reported on Sunday.

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## ozranger

JSCh said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1294360216541237248


HQ-16 but with only 3 canisters mounted.

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HJ-10
> View attachment 660045
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


HJ-10




Via @人民陆军 from Weixin

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> *Indigenous airborne munitions dispenser can paralyze airfield in one shot*
> By Liu Xuanzun Source: Global Times Published: 2020/8/16 19:00:55
> 
> 
> 
> A pilot assigned to an aviation regiment under the PLA Air Force climbs into the cockpit of his fighter jet prior to a night flight training exercise in late June, 2020. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Tang Huaihui)
> 
> China has revealed a type of domestically developed airborne munitions dispenser, a hybrid weapon that lies between an air-to-ground missile and a guided bomb droppable by an aircraft from a safe distance, that can release hundreds of submunitions that cover a large area. This kind of weapon can effectively paralyze an airfield in one shot, leaving enemy warplanes grounded or destroyed, experts said on Sunday.
> 
> Formally classified as a guided glide dispenser bomb, this highly accurate, modularized weapon weighs 500 kilograms. While it looks like a missile, it has a square cross-section to hold more submunitions. This design can also reduce the weapon's radar cross-section, enhancing the weapon's stealth capability, making it more difficult to intercept, according to a report by China Central Television (CCTV) on Saturday.
> 
> When dropped, the dispenser can open its wings, which can provide extra lift force and controllability and allow it to have a range of more than 60 kilometers, the CCTV report said, noting that this means the aircraft carrying it can safely drop the weapon without entering the enemy's air defense zone.
> 
> Each dispenser can carry 240 submunitions of six types, which when released will cover more than 6,000 square meters, CCTV quoted a senior engineer at the weapon's manufacturer, China North Industries Group Corp (NORINCO), as saying.
> 
> When attacking groups of tanks and armored vehicles, the dispenser can use anti-tank submunitions that can penetrate tanks' armor from the top, or it can equip regional lockdown submunitions when attacking large facilities like airfields, CCTV reported.
> 
> A typical munitions dispenser like this can disable an airfield for an extended period with only one shot, because the sheer number of submunitions means the whole runway will be destroyed, and it is also possible that some of the submunitions will be mines, which will make attempts to repair the runway very risky, a Chinese military expert told the Global Times on Sunday on condition of anonymity.
> 
> This will provide crucial battle opportunities, because it means the enemy would not be able to make any warplane sortie, and the user of the dispenser can seize air superiority and gain tactical and even strategic advantages, the expert said.
> 
> A separate CCTV report in March 2019 showed a Chinese J-16 fighter jet equipped with a weapon that looked very like a munitions dispenser. The report speculated at that time that the weapon had been commissioned into the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force.
> 
> In addition to the J-16, China's JH-7 fighter bomber and H-6 bomber could also be equipped with the dispenser, the expert said.
> 
> Foreign media reported on Saturday that the island of Taiwan has officially signed an agreement with the US to buy 66 F-16V fighter jets. Chinese mainland military analysts said that if a reunification-by-force operation breaks out, the PLA would destroy Taiwan's airfields and command centers, giving the F-16Vs no chance to even take off, and giving those already in the air no place to land.
> 
> NORINCO has also developed airborne munitions dispensers for export, including the TL500 that made its appearance at Airshow China in previous years, Shanghai-based news website eastday.com reported on Sunday.


*INDIGENOUS AIRBORNE MUNITIONS DISPENSER CAN PARALYZE AIRFIELD IN ONE SHOT*

GLOBAL TIMES (2020-08-16)

_Foreign media reported on Saturday that the island of Taiwan has officially signed an agreement with the US to buy 66 F-16V fighter jets. Chinese mainland military analysts said that *IF a reunification-by-force operation breaks out, the PLA would destroy Taiwan's airfields and command centers,* giving the F-16Vs no chance to even take off, and giving those already in the air no place to land._

https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1197894.shtml


_And from Hao Gao @HaoGao12 on 2020-08-15:_

*The 500 kilo Munition Dispenser, capable of carrying cluster and other guided munitions. Chinese version of the JSOW.* [The U.S.'s AGM-154 Joint Standoff Weapon (JSOW)]

Source: weibo沉默的山羊



















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1294513079527419904
From the above thread, jawadqamar @jaawadqamar posted as follows:

_Same or similar system already available for export with JF-17 Thunder_



















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1294692316385509380

And a couple more clearer pictures from the Airshow China Zhuhai 2014 as seen below:

*And from the Zhuhai 2014: Defense Technology Banquet*
https://aviationweek.com/defense-space/zhuhai-2014-defense-technology-banquet

_The biennial Zhuhai air show is a banquet for observers of Chinese defense technology. Although nuclear-capable missiles and the latest developmental and operational air force systems are absent, China’s policy of ensuring that there are multiple suppliers in all key areas results in many new programs at Zhuhai. This year, counterstealth technology and advanced missiles were in the forefront.

There are a dozen pictures though only these two are relevant with above article.





*Norinco’s GB-6 500-kg.-class guided, gliding dispenser* can be armed with either runway-breaker warheads or fuel-air explosive munitions. It uses GPS/INS guidance. It was displayed on an operational Xian JH-7 attack fighter and alongside a Pakistan air force Chengdu FC-17. Credit: Bill Sweetman/AW&ST






*The CS/BBC5 is related to the G-6, It is a 500-kg unitary glide bomb* and was displayed next to an H-6M bomber: The external design is similar to the GB-6, except there are six rather than four tail surfaces. Credit: Bill Sweetman/AW&ST

_

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM





Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## vi-va

Broccoli said:


> Wheeler launch platform makes more sense that then more expensive and maintanance heavy tracked vehicle.


depends. In Finland, tracked has it's advantage in Winter and Spring.


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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

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## samsara

A short video on the abovementioned Airborne Munitions Dispenser:

揭秘国产机载布撒器 一弹毁伤6000平米！「威虎堂」| 军迷天下
_Unveil the secrets of a domestically developed airborne munitions dispenser, which is able to damage the targeted area as large as 6,000 square meters - CCTV-7 (Military), No Engsub, posted on 2020.08.17_

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## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin

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## lcloo

Screen print of video of full train loads of HQ16 on the way to a certain place. I received the video from my cousin in China yesterday.

Can't sent the video because it is in my hard disk, forum rule restriction.

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## Figaro

lcloo said:


> Screen print of video of full train loads of HQ16 on the way to a certain place. I received the video from my cousin in China yesterday.
> 
> Can't sent the video because it is in my hard disk, forum rule restriction.
> View attachment 662574


Here is the full video ... do mind the unnecessary/provocative political commentary.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296056675217137665

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## samsara

Figaro said:


> Here is the full video ... do mind the unnecessary/provocative political commentary.
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296056675217137665


Posted by a hardline Trumpturd, the far right of Rep adoring Reagan era, binding together all the supporters of that renegade island   they even said that the HQ-16s are the plastic toys

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## Broccoli

vi-va said:


> depends. In Finland, tracked has it's advantage in Winter and Spring.



Maybe, but most places where wheels dont work aren't suitable for larger tracked vehicles.

Biggest things you can get into forests are snowmobiles and tracked lighter APC like the BMP-2 but even those lighter tracked vehicles struggle and in forests they cant move into most places because there are big trees everywhere.

In practice tracked artillery and tanks operate near roads.


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## vi-va

Broccoli said:


> Maybe, but most places where wheels dont work aren't suitable for larger tracked vehicles.
> 
> Biggest things you can get into forests are snowmobiles and tracked lighter APC like the BMP-2 but even those lighter tracked vehicles struggle and in forests they cant move into most places because there are big trees everywhere.
> 
> In practice tracked artillery and tanks operate near roads.


Finland defeated USSR in Winter War in 1939. The cold weather, heavy snow, forest, and skillful Finland hunters were nightmare of USSR.

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 vs S-300

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## LKJ86



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## Figaro

samsara said:


> Posted by a hardline Trumpturd, the far right of Rep adoring Reagan era, binding together all the supporters of that renegade island   they even said that the HQ-16s are the plastic toys


Just posted for the video ... ignore the dumb commentary. These people should know the Taiwanese military is the Indian military of East Asia. At least the Indians have not managed to have their highest ranking military officer get killed in a helicopter crash yet.

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## LKJ86

Via @北海舰队 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM











Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM










Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## JSCh

南海的浪涛​今天 09:45 来自 微博 weibo.com​琼航警0078，粤航警0172，NOTAM A3325/20​把三个航行/飞行警告结合起来看……#微博公开课#​就是今天上午的双反舰弹道导弹实弹射击演练！#南海战报#​
*Waves of the South China Sea
Today at 09:45 from Weibo *

Hainan Maritime Safety Administration 0078, Guangdong Maritime Safety Administration 0172, NOTAM A3325/20
Combine the three navigation/flight warnings...#微博公课#
It is this morning's double anti-ship ballistic missile live fire drill! #南海战报#












​

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298462189041287170

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## vi-va

JSCh said:


> 南海的浪涛​今天 09:45 来自 微博 weibo.com​琼航警0078，粤航警0172，NOTAM A3325/20​把三个航行/飞行警告结合起来看……#微博公开课#​就是今天上午的双反舰弹道导弹实弹射击演练！#南海战报#​
> *Waves of the South China Sea
> Today at 09:45 from Weibo *
> 
> Hainan Maritime Safety Administration 0078, Guangdong Maritime Safety Administration 0172, NOTAM A3325/20
> Combine the three navigation/flight warnings...#微博公课#
> It is this morning's double anti-ship ballistic missile live fire drill! #南海战报#
> 
> View attachment 664049
> 
> View attachment 664050
> 
> View attachment 664051
> ​
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298462189041287170


I guess this is a demonstration of War Scenarios for SCS and Taiwan issues.


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## JSCh

vi-va said:


> I guess this is a demonstration of War Scenarios for SCS and Taiwan issues.


Could be a test/demo of a swarm anti-ship ballistic missile attack?

Anyway, video from Weibo this morning,
--> _L_战忽局局座首席大弟子的微博视频

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## Figaro

JSCh said:


> 南海的浪涛​今天 09:45 来自 微博 weibo.com​琼航警0078，粤航警0172，NOTAM A3325/20​把三个航行/飞行警告结合起来看……#微博公开课#​就是今天上午的双反舰弹道导弹实弹射击演练！#南海战报#​
> *Waves of the South China Sea
> Today at 09:45 from Weibo *
> 
> Hainan Maritime Safety Administration 0078, Guangdong Maritime Safety Administration 0172, NOTAM A3325/20
> Combine the three navigation/flight warnings...#微博公课#
> It is this morning's double anti-ship ballistic missile live fire drill! #南海战报#
> 
> View attachment 664049
> 
> View attachment 664050
> 
> View attachment 664051
> ​
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298462189041287170


Were they striking moving targets? That would be the ultimate demonstration of the DF-21Ds and DF-26s potency.


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## JSCh

Figaro said:


> Were they striking moving targets? That would be the ultimate demonstration of the DF-21Ds and DF-26s potency.


No idea, but the target area is at sea. Given the huge relative speed, I do not think it make much difference.

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## redtom

Figaro said:


> Were they striking moving targets? That would be the ultimate demonstration of the DF-21Ds and DF-26s potency.


I don't think it's difficult in theory.Relative to the speed of the missile, the ship is almost stationary. All you need is GPS, reconnaissance systems, space communications, orbital transfer technology, terminal active radar guidance and trajectory correction. Only the last two are difficult.You need a hypersonic wind tunnel to test, a powerful electronics industry.


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## LKJ86

Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> Could be a test/demo of a swarm anti-ship ballistic missile attack?
> 
> Anyway, video from Weibo this morning,
> --> _L_战忽局局座首席大弟子的微博视频


今天上午的其中一发
转自微博战忽局局座首席大弟子

*Repost from Weibo - One of this morning's rounds*

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298644132089360385
And a bit "naughty" poster yet there's some truth inside...

今天两枚，明天两枚，超过96年了，可能是实战前最后一次打靶。 
_Two today, two tomorrow, *more than 96 years*, may be the last target shooting before the actual combat._


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298611448419987463

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM













Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## samsara

samsara said:


> 今天上午的其中一发
> 转自微博战忽局局座首席大弟子
> 
> *Repost from Weibo - One of this morning's rounds*
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298644132089360385
> And a bit "naughty" poster yet there's some truth inside...
> 
> 今天两枚，明天两枚，超过96年了，可能是实战前最后一次打靶。
> _Two today, two tomorrow, *more than 96 years*, may be the last target shooting before the actual combat._
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298611448419987463


*Reported PLA anti-ship ballistic missile launches 'show saturated attack capability'*

_GLOBAL TIMES (2020-08-27)_

The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) on Wednesday launched multiple anti-ship ballistic missiles into the South China Sea in a military exercise, overseas media reported. The missile launches, if true, demonstrated the PLA's ability to hit maritime targets with powerful ballistic missiles from multiple directions in coordinated, saturated attacks against which there is no defense, analysts said on Thursday.

*US media outlet Bloomberg reported on Wednesday, citing an anonymous US defense official, that China launched four medium-range ballistic missiles into the South China Sea.*

(...)





Reported PLA anti-ship ballistic missile launches 'show saturated attack capability' - Global Times







www.globaltimes.cn





_From Henri Kenhmann at East Pendulum on 2020-08-27:_

4 MRBMs were reportedly fired towards the South China Sea on Wednesday morning.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298777497241174018

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## Figaro

From SDF (Temstar)

Rumour is that the target ship this time is a decommissioned Type 904 general stores issue ship, Pennant 884 Jingpo Lake.

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM
















Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## ILC

Have we heard any rumors about new variant of HQ-9? When we may see HQ-9C in action? Or HQ-9B is the last variant and in the future we will see completely different system replacing HQ-9.


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## samsara

Some interesting comment about the recent live double-firing exercise of DF-26 and DF-21D in the South China Sea at the Chinese internet. Each of the AShBM does employ its own probe module, launched to get around the re-entry radio blackout due to plasma sheath, a smart engineering feat.

美帝这次又丢脸了，数数数错了，战时这是决不能原谅的 2020-08-29
反航母弹的套路，与对地弹打发不一样。出大气层先放探测舱段，为弹头最后砸向目标提供修正数据，结果被美帝看成是一个弹头了。这也不能怪美帝，没玩过这类弹，当然不懂套路，这次完整的演给他看看，省的有疑虑。

This time the US observation made a mistake again and counted wrongly

The routine of anti-carrier missile is different from that of ground bombs. *The probe module was first released from the atmosphere, providing updated data for the warhead's final impact on the target*, and this outcome was mistakenly deemed as a warhead itself by the US observers. Cannot really blame them since they have not dealt with this kind of missile. Of course they did not fully understand the routine, this complete performance will be shown to them to remove the doubts.



https://www.talkcc.net/article/4550727

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## Figaro

samsara said:


> Some interesting comment about the recent live double-firing exercise of DF-26 and DF-21D in the South China Sea at the Chinese internet. Each of the AShBM does employ its own probe module, launched to get around the re-entry radio blackout due to plasma sheath, a smart engineering feat.
> 
> 美帝这次又丢脸了，数数数错了，战时这是决不能原谅的 2020-08-29
> 反航母弹的套路，与对地弹打发不一样。出大气层先放探测舱段，为弹头最后砸向目标提供修正数据，结果被美帝看成是一个弹头了。这也不能怪美帝，没玩过这类弹，当然不懂套路，这次完整的演给他看看，省的有疑虑。
> 
> This time the US observation made a mistake again and counted wrongly
> 
> The routine of anti-carrier missile is different from that of ground bombs. *The probe module was first released from the atmosphere, providing updated data for the warhead's final impact on the target*, and this outcome was mistakenly deemed as a warhead itself by the US observers. Cannot really blame them since they have not dealt with this kind of missile. Of course they did not fully understand the routine, this complete performance will be shown to them to remove the doubts.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.talkcc.net/article/4550727


If true, this is quite embarrassing for the US observers/intelligence officials who claimed 4 missiles were fired ... an oversight like this would have catastrophic consequences in wartime.


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## ZeEa5KPul

Damn, China must be very confident to reveal this trick. It's *really* clever, like diabolically, fiendishly clever to have the warhead bus chuck up what is essentially a temporary mini-targeting satellite. It's a solution that solves a lot of problems with AShBMs... I just can't get over how effective and elegant it is!

I think another important feature this test revealed is strike simultaneity. It's important for a strike package arriving along different directions to reach the target at the same time to maximize load on the defenders - this test must also have surely demonstrated that.

I can't help but connect this test to the escalation on the Indian border. Now that China has sufficiently frightened and deterred the US (and confirm this through espionage), the field is clear to escalate on other fronts and resolve those disputes favourably.

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## Beast

ZeEa5KPul said:


> Damn, China must be very confident to reveal this trick. It's *really* clever, like diabolically, fiendishly clever to have the warhead bus chuck up what is essentially a temporary mini-targeting satellite. It's a solution that solves a lot of problems with AShBMs... I just can't get over how effective and elegant it is!
> 
> I think another important feature this test revealed is strike simultaneity. It's important for a strike package arriving along different directions to reach the target at the same time to maximize load on the defenders - this test must also have surely demonstrated that.
> 
> I can't help but connect this test to the escalation on the Indian border. Now that China has sufficiently frightened and deterred the US (and confirm this through espionage), the field is clear to escalate on other fronts and resolve those disputes favourably.


I guess who still dare to claim DF-21D ASBM are fluke!

It's a real working anti- ship ballistic missile.

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## samsara

ZeEa5KPul said:


> Damn, China must be very confident to reveal this trick. It's *really* clever, like diabolically, fiendishly clever to have the warhead bus chuck up what is essentially a temporary mini-targeting satellite. It's a solution that solves a lot of problems with AShBMs... I just can't get over how effective and elegant it is!
> 
> I think another important feature this test revealed is strike simultaneity. It's important for a *strike package arriving along different directions to reach the target at the same time* to maximize load on the defenders - this test must also have surely demonstrated that.
> 
> I can't help but connect this test to the escalation on the Indian border. Now that China has sufficiently frightened and deterred the US (and confirm this through espionage), the field is clear to escalate on other fronts and resolve those disputes favourably.



Not merely the different missiles came from the different directions (angles), but they differed largely in term of distance of firing (DF-26 from Qinghai at over 2300 kilometers; and DF-21D from Zhejiang at over 1400 km) as well as the missiles' own characteristics (speed etc). How to coordinate them to kiss the target at more or less the same time to create the effect of saturation attack ? Many readers just didn't imagine these underlying complexity.


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## Deino

samsara said:


> Not merely the different missiles came from the different directions (angles), but they differed largely in term of distance of firing (DF-26 from Qinghai at over 2300 kilometers; and DF-21D from Zhejiang at over 1400 km) as well as the missiles' own characteristics (speed etc). How to coordinate them to kiss the target at more or less the same time to create the effect of saturation attack ? Many readers just didn't imagine these underlying complexity.




Indeed ... I would love to see a video of the target area when both hit.


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## samsara

Deino said:


> Indeed ... I would love to see a video of the target area when both hit.


They won't release it. Folks can wait for its release in few years to come. In the meantime one just keeps his own faith as he wishes. They just don't need to convince the general public to believe in anything! The cost benefit ratio simply doesn't justify such official vivid visualization, if you get over it.


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## Figaro

samsara said:


> They won't release it. Folks can wait for its release in few years to come. In the meantime one just keeps his own faith as he wishes. They just don't need to convince the general public to believe in anything! The cost benefit ratio simply doesn't justify such official vivid visualization, if you get over it.


Maybe the PACOM will give us a favor and release footage of it ... I'm sure they saw it


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## Deino

samsara said:


> They won't release it. Folks can wait for its release in few years to come. In the meantime one just keeps his own faith as he wishes. They just don't need to convince the general public to believe in anything! The cost benefit ratio simply doesn't justify such official vivid visualization, if you get over it.




I know, but sometimes my wishes are nothing but wishes. In the same way my once 5 year old doughter wanted a unicorn for CHristmas.

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## Figaro

Deino said:


> I know, but sometimes my wishes are nothing but wishes. In the same way my once 5 year old doughter wanted a unicorn for CHristmas.


You should have given her a plush unicorn

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## LKJ86

HJ-10


































Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




























Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @舰船知识 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HJ-10 and HQ-17







Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM














Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## Figaro

*PLA Rocket Force holds AI challenge*

Source China Military Online Editor Li Jiayao





BEIJING, Sept. 11 -- To serve as a "touchstone" and a "training ground" for the transformation and application of innovative technological achievements, the PLA Rocket Force hosts the "Smart Rocket-Fire Eye" Artificial Intelligence Challenge from August to December, in order to promote the transformation of intelligent concepts, and help create an intelligent development ecology featuring the coordinated efforts of enterprises, universities, research institutions and consumers.

The event is sponsored by the Equipment Department of the PLA Rocket Force. Participants come from relevant military industry groups, universities and research institutes inside and outside the military, private enterprises with cutting-edge and related teams in related fields. The objective of the activity is set for intelligent image detection and recognition. Through the scientific setting of competition subjects and reasonable construction of the test environment, the challenge uses multi-source data sets, carries out the performance comparison of artificial intelligence algorithms, discovers cutting-edge innovative technologies, selects innovative talents and teams, and improves image detection and recognition technology level in complex environments.

The challenge is divided into three stages, including preparation, preliminary and finals. The registration process has been started and the deadline is the end of September. The preliminary round will be completed from early October to November 20 and the finalists will be announced. After entering the final stage, the participating teams will receive relevant training before the finals.

The organizing committee plans to hold special presentations in Beijing, Xi'an, Chengdu, Changsha, Shenzhen and other cities in mid-September. The specific time and location will be announced on the official registration website, WeChat official account and other platforms.


http://english.chinamil.com.cn/view/2020-09/11/content_9901344.htm

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 665949
> 
> Via @舰船知识 from Weibo







Via 舰船知识

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM













Via @南部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

























Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @中国航天科工 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

YJ-18




Via @中国军网 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via Weibo

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## farooqbhai007

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 670329
> 
> Via Weibo



Nice , alot of ATGM stuff , also is that HJ-10 Tracked vehicle with a newer Optical sight ,
and there is also this

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## JSCh

Picture from CASIC official weibo,

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## ariez168

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306448422065455105

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> Picture from CASIC official weibo,
> 
> View attachment 670999
> 
> View attachment 671000​


If I can order some HQ/HHQ series via Aliexpress or JD Int'l then I'll get some for display at home


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## LKJ86

ariez168 said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306448422065455105


HQ-16A

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM





Via @东海舰队发布 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## Figaro

The new TEL

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## samsara

Figaro said:


> The new TEL


*PLA Rocket Force's New TEL (Transporter Erector Launcher)*

Recently in the report on the advanced deeds by a research office of the PLA Rocket Force, China's *new type of missile heavy-duty equipment vehicle* has made a brilliant appearance.

It's understood that this missile heavy-duty equipment vehicle *weighs about 100 tons*, which adopts the mature *hybrid technology* in the field of civil vehicles, but is very rarely used in large military vehicles.

In 2016 the first generation of engineering prototype was completed and a number of tests were carried out.

If you compare a missile to a bullet that hits the heart of the target, then the missile heavy-duty equipment vehicle is likened to a durable sniper rifle.

In addition to carrying missiles over mountains and deserts, the vehicle itself must be solid and durable without any small defect.

This put forward very high requirements for the country's special vehicle industry.

* * * * *

SEE ALSO

OedoSoldier @OedoSoldier on 2020.09.16

_*New TEL under test, adopts diesel-electric system*_


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1306195091854221315

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## LKJ86

YJ-18







Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## Feng Leng

It seems China is developing a Midgetman.

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


Do you know which missile is this?


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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @80强军号 from Weixin

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## Feng Leng

samsara said:


> Do you know which missile is this?


DF-15B

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## LKJ86

Via @80强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 and HQ-16A







Via @解放军报 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM
















Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM










Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-6A










Via @北海舰队 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## ILC

DF10A 👌


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-62 AShM










Via @东海舰队发布 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM
















Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## samsara

*A couple of days ago Xinhua News posted a video about Russia successfully test-fires Tsirkon hypersonic missile (2020.10.06).*

_"Russia successfully test-fired a Tsirkon hypersonic cruise missile in the Arctic on Tuesday. The missile reached a hypersonic speed of over Mach 8. The missile covered a distance of 450 km with the max altitude of its trajectory at 28 km. The flight lasted 4.5 minutes at over Mach 8. The Tsirkon system will be deployed on Russian submarines and surface ships."_

*I wonder how is China's own hypersonic missile(s) positioning with regard to this Russian high-profile one?

Then where is the USA's position in this basically three-party hypersonic race (besides some other lesser participants)?*

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## juj06750

samsara said:


> *A couple of days ago Xinhua News posted a video about Russia successfully test-fires Tsirkon hypersonic missile (2020.10.06).*
> 
> _"Russia successfully test-fired a Tsirkon hypersonic cruise missile in the Arctic on Tuesday. The missile reached a hypersonic speed of over Mach 8. The missile covered a distance of 450 km with the max altitude of its trajectory at 28 km. The flight lasted 4.5 minutes at over Mach 8. The Tsirkon system will be deployed on Russian submarines and surface ships."_
> 
> *I wonder how is China's own hypersonic missile(s) positioning with regard to this Russian high-profile one?
> 
> Then where is the USA's position in this basically three-party hypersonic race (besides some other lesser participants)?*


my comrade, this is chinese missile thread;
plz write them on russian forum


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## samsara

juj06750 said:


> my comrade, this is chinese missile thread;
> plz write them on russian forum


First of all, I am not your comrade!

Second, if you don't have any good info to address my QUESTION, just stay quiet.

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## juj06750

samsara said:


> First of all, I am not your comrade!
> Second, if you don't have any good info to address my QUESTION, just stay quiet.


so your question is NOT for here;
I said to let us focus on the thread


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## Figaro

juj06750 said:


> my comrade, this is chinese missile thread;
> plz write them on russian forum


He was asking a question regarding Chinese hypersonic developments vs Russian ones ... what exactly is your problem? Are you just always here to spread provocative comments? Some members here already believe you are a false flagger, most likely of Indian origin ... and I am starting to think that as well unfortunately.

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## LKJ86

HQ-10









Via 秦慧鹏, 王光杰

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## LKJ86

HJ-10



















Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @海军新闻 from Weixin

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## JSCh

From weibo via 鼎盛DDX












​Edit: video.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1317386673991417856

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 679930
> 
> Via @海军新闻 from Weixin



Is this the YJ-18A being trialed aboard the #891 (Type 909) weapons trials ship?


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## LKJ86

HJ-10




Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> From weibo via 鼎盛DDX
> 
> View attachment 680170
> 
> View attachment 680171
> 
> View attachment 680172
> ​Edit: video.
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1317386673991417856


From our int'l mod, *Rupprecht Andreas Deino* @RupprechtDeino on 2020-10-17: 

_Concerning the recent sighting of the PLAAF H-6N and its supposed huge ALBM/ALAShBM here's an interesting estimation of that missile's dimension.

(Image via @92军迷 from http://bbs.meyet.net)




_





__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1317486861464588288

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

samsara said:


> From our int'l mod, *Rupprecht Andreas Deino* @RupprechtDeino on 2020-10-17:
> 
> _Concerning the recent sighting of the PLAAF H-6N and its supposed huge ALBM/ALAShBM here's an interesting estimation of that missile's dimension.
> 
> (Image via @92军迷 from http://bbs.meyet.net)
> 
> View attachment 680537
> _
> View attachment 680538
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1317486861464588288


*China develops two new airborne ballistic missile systems*

By Henri Kenhmann | East Pendulum

While Russia has officially announced the entry into service of a new hypersonic missile known as the Kh-47M2 "Kinzhal", which is nothing less than an airborne ballistic missile system, China for its part would also be developing two vectors of the same concept but this time discreetly.

The news was first revealed in early March 2018 by Lieutenant General Robert Ashley, director of the US Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), in his testimony to the Senate Armed Services Committee on threats to the national security. 

_These capabilities are being augmented with *two new air-launched ballistic missiles*, one of which may include a nuclear payload - Lt. Gen. Robert ashley_

Ashley said in his speech that the Chinese Rocket Force is bolstering its conventional and nuclear capabilities to accurately strike targets as far as Guam, which is the main US military base in the Western Pacific, relying on both the DF-21 anti-ship ballistic missile (in fact the DF-21D) and also the DF-26 long-range missile, itself capable of hitting fixed targets on the ground or moving at sea. All this is complemented by a growing array of cruise missiles of all kinds, as well as "two new airborne ballistic missiles, one of which could carry a nuclear charge".

The declaration of the director of the DIA, if it gives some credibility to the existence of such a development program in China, only confirms in reality the rumors circulating for two years, affirming that a platform capable of transporting a medium-range anti-ship ballistic missile - derived from the H-6K bomber and fitted with a supply pole to maintain or increase its range - would have reached the final stage of development. The first inaugural flight would have taken place in December 2016.

And the reference of H-6N, the meaning of which is not known to date (back then) [today we do know that H-6N is a variant of H-6 series bomber with capability to launch nuclear weapon attacks], also appears in some recent publications of the Chinese aircraft manufacturer AVIC (see our article on "H-6N, H-X... Chinese bomber programs are multiplying").

Not knowing its official designation given by the Chinese military, the American intelligence services referenced one of these two new Chinese missiles the "CH-AS-X-13", AS for Anti-Ship probably, and estimating the range of the machine to about 3,000 kilometers.

And according to US government sources, relayed by our colleague Ankit Panda in The Diplomat, this Chinese missile has already carried out five test shots. The first took place in December 2016, and the last in the last week of January 2018.

If it is difficult to reconstruct with open sources the first flight test of the system, because no less than 17 similar ballistic activities were recorded during the month of December alone in 2016, the last test dating from January 2018 seems easier to trace.

Indeed, if we filter the messages to airmen (NOTAM) valid between January 28 and 31 2018 and around Dingxing Air Base where most of the Chinese air weapons tests take place, we think that this fifth test reported by US sources would have taken place either on January 30, or on January 31 at two separate windows.

Just like the "Kinzhal" whose development is based on a Russian 9M723 short-range ground-to-ground ballistic missile (from the 9K720 Iskander system), it is believed that engineers from the Chinese missilier group CASIC have adopted the same approach, to reduce the development cycle, basing the design of the "CH-AS-X-13" on the DF-21 medium-range ballistic missile, and more specifically the AShBM DF-21D if the new missile is actually intended to strike large naval targets at sea.

Given the relatively large size of the DF-21/DF-21D, which measures 1.4 meters in diameter and 10.7 meters long for the land version, it is by no means surprising that the Chinese need to design a larger platform than the MiG-31K to carry and launch the new missile.

As for the estimated range of 3,000 kilometers of the "CH-AS-X-13" compared to about 1,500 km for the DF-21D, this is consistent when you consider that the announced range of the "Kinzhal" has increased fourfold compared to its twin ground-to-ground version.





_DF-21D TELs (bottom) and DF-26 TELs with twice the range, both capable of hitting ships while sailing (Photo: Chinese Military)_

The question now arises as to the objective of such an airborne missile system and its possible operational deployment. If this "CH-AS-X-13" is indeed designed for anti-ship, in particular against aircraft carriers which remain an "obsession" in all senses of the term of the Chinese military over the last 30 years, why develop such a capacity when it would duplicate the DF-21D ground-to-sea on the one hand, and the long-range DF-26 on the other?

*Without being behind the scenes of small secrets, it is thought that the new "CH-AS-X-13" serves to expand the range of existing "anti-aircraft" weapons, and to give an additional dimension and greater operational flexibility to the overall "Anti Access / Area Denial" (A2/AD) system in China. This proliferation of offensive vectors would make counter-measures more difficult to maintain and succeed.

Its development also converts the DF-21D ground-to-sea, initially limited in range, to double its range to reach the same level as the DF-26 IRBM. *On the other hand, it does not seem to be relevant both technically and operationally to develop an air-to-ground version based on the latter.

And the associated technologies would not only be dedicated to the military field and could be beneficial to some civilian programs. For example, this could allow CASIC, also a major player in the Chinese aerospace sector, to develop an airborne satellite launcher, similar to what it does with its competitor CASC with a Y-20 transport aircraft.

As for the question on the possible operational deployment of the missile, it will undoubtedly remain in the direction of the ocean, that is towards the Pacific Ocean as well as the South China Sea, with a possible extension to the Indian Ocean.

In view of its relatively short development, since the first pre-studies of an “airborne anti-ship ballistic missile” seem to have started around 2005, it would once again be a “pragmatic” and “contextual” weapon. the Chinese military, as for example the hypersonic glider missile DF-17 as well as the hypersonic reconnaissance drone of AVIC, which has a very precise and targeted objective, and would not therefore have a more general utility outside the sphere Chinese A2/AD.






One of the Chinese R&D documents dating from 2005 on the subject of the airborne ballistic missile dedicated to anti-ship missions.

Henri K.
2018-06-20

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


决胜利器（4）：“东风家族”不断壮大！探秘中国新一代核打击利器 东风-5B战略核导弹使命必达 「兵器面面观」| 军迷天下

本期节目主要内容：东风夜放花千树，早在一千多年前的宋代火药已经在中国民间得到广泛应用，各种样式的烟花层出不穷，每逢节庆夜晚人们相聚在院落街头，仰看火树银花共赏漫天烟彩。当时的人们在纸筒中放入火药，然后用泥土封住一头，另一头用引信点燃，只听一声呼啸，纸筒冲天而起。这或许是人类历史上最早利用火箭推进原理升空的飞行器。然而没人能够想到，千年之后，本为娱乐众人而生的它会变身为一枚枚名叫“导弹”的庞然大物。






_Decisive weapon (4): "Dongfeng family" continues to grow! Exploring China's new generation of nuclear weapon: Dongfeng-5B (DF-5B) strategic nuclear missile mission will certainly achieve its eminence

Gunpowder during the Song Dynasty, as early as over a thousand years ago, has been widely used among Chinese people. Various styles of fireworks emerge in endlessly. People gather in the streets of the courtyard at every festival nights to watch the fireworks and enjoy the colorful sparks. At that time, people put gunpowder into paper cans, and then sealed one end with mud, and the other end was ignited with a fuse. Only when they heard a whistling sound, the paper cylinder soared into the sky. This is perhaps the first aircraft in human history to use the principle of rocket propulsion to launch. However, no one could imagine that, after a thousand years it was invented to entertain people, then it would turn into a huge thing called "Missiles"._

*Watch the footage, it's an interesting program, though as usual, without English subtitles.





*
_Qian Xuesen explained the Medium and Long Range Missiles and ICBM_





_Qian Xuesen “Two Bombs and One Satellite” - Can China engages in missiles_





(Source: Quora capture)

*• This segment also mentions the ballistic trajectory: “Qian Xuesen trajectory” vs. “Sanger trajectory”.




*
(Source: CCTV-7 capture, with added English descriptions)





(Source: Quora capture)

• *Liang Sili* - _Deputy Chief Designer of Dongfeng-5 (DF-5)_





(Source: CCTV-7 capture)

• Assassin's Mace 杀手锏 (Shashoujian)






China's missile ranges: Short; Medium; Long ranges and ICBM

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## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

YJ-18




Via @舰船知识 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @高原战士 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via www.81.cn

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## samsara

*An impressive short footage posted by Henri.*

*A DF-10A cruise missile brigade on firing practice (2020-10)*


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1322615459779235840

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## LKJ86

Via @西部战区 from Weixin

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## samsara

samsara said:


> *China develops two new airborne ballistic missile systems*
> 
> By Henri Kenhmann | East Pendulum
> 
> While Russia has officially announced the entry into service of a new hypersonic missile known as the Kh-47M2 "Kinzhal", which is nothing less than an airborne ballistic missile system, China for its part would also be developing two vectors of the same concept but this time discreetly.
> 
> The news was first revealed in early March 2018 by Lieutenant General Robert Ashley, director of the US Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), in his testimony to the Senate Armed Services Committee on threats to the national security.
> 
> _These capabilities are being augmented with *two new air-launched ballistic missiles*, one of which may include a nuclear payload - Lt. Gen. Robert ashley_
> 
> Ashley said in his speech that the Chinese Rocket Force is bolstering its conventional and nuclear capabilities to accurately strike targets as far as Guam, which is the main US military base in the Western Pacific, relying on both the DF-21 anti-ship ballistic missile (in fact the DF-21D) and also the DF-26 long-range missile, itself capable of hitting fixed targets on the ground or moving at sea. All this is complemented by a growing array of cruise missiles of all kinds, as well as "two new airborne ballistic missiles, one of which could carry a nuclear charge".
> 
> The declaration of the director of the DIA, if it gives some credibility to the existence of such a development program in China, only confirms in reality the rumors circulating for two years, affirming that a platform capable of transporting a medium-range anti-ship ballistic missile - derived from the H-6K bomber and fitted with a supply pole to maintain or increase its range - would have reached the final stage of development. The first inaugural flight would have taken place in December 2016.
> 
> And the reference of H-6N, the meaning of which is not known to date (back then) [today we do know that H-6N is a variant of H-6 series bomber with capability to launch nuclear weapon attacks], also appears in some recent publications of the Chinese aircraft manufacturer AVIC (see our article on "H-6N, H-X... Chinese bomber programs are multiplying").
> 
> Not knowing its official designation given by the Chinese military, the American intelligence services referenced one of these two new Chinese missiles the "CH-AS-X-13", AS for Anti-Ship probably, and estimating the range of the machine to about 3,000 kilometers.
> 
> And according to US government sources, relayed by our colleague Ankit Panda in The Diplomat, this Chinese missile has already carried out five test shots. The first took place in December 2016, and the last in the last week of January 2018.
> 
> If it is difficult to reconstruct with open sources the first flight test of the system, because no less than 17 similar ballistic activities were recorded during the month of December alone in 2016, the last test dating from January 2018 seems easier to trace.
> 
> Indeed, if we filter the messages to airmen (NOTAM) valid between January 28 and 31 2018 and around Dingxing Air Base where most of the Chinese air weapons tests take place, we think that this fifth test reported by US sources would have taken place either on January 30, or on January 31 at two separate windows.
> 
> Just like the "Kinzhal" whose development is based on a Russian 9M723 short-range ground-to-ground ballistic missile (from the 9K720 Iskander system), it is believed that engineers from the Chinese missilier group CASIC have adopted the same approach, to reduce the development cycle, basing the design of the "CH-AS-X-13" on the DF-21 medium-range ballistic missile, and more specifically the AShBM DF-21D if the new missile is actually intended to strike large naval targets at sea.
> 
> Given the relatively large size of the DF-21/DF-21D, which measures 1.4 meters in diameter and 10.7 meters long for the land version, it is by no means surprising that the Chinese need to design a larger platform than the MiG-31K to carry and launch the new missile.
> 
> As for the estimated range of 3,000 kilometers of the "CH-AS-X-13" compared to about 1,500 km for the DF-21D, this is consistent when you consider that the announced range of the "Kinzhal" has increased fourfold compared to its twin ground-to-ground version.
> 
> View attachment 680973
> 
> _DF-21D TELs (bottom) and DF-26 TELs with twice the range, both capable of hitting ships while sailing (Photo: Chinese Military)_
> 
> The question now arises as to the objective of such an airborne missile system and its possible operational deployment. If this "CH-AS-X-13" is indeed designed for anti-ship, in particular against aircraft carriers which remain an "obsession" in all senses of the term of the Chinese military over the last 30 years, why develop such a capacity when it would duplicate the DF-21D ground-to-sea on the one hand, and the long-range DF-26 on the other?
> 
> *Without being behind the scenes of small secrets, it is thought that the new "CH-AS-X-13" serves to expand the range of existing "anti-aircraft" weapons, and to give an additional dimension and greater operational flexibility to the overall "Anti Access / Area Denial" (A2/AD) system in China. This proliferation of offensive vectors would make counter-measures more difficult to maintain and succeed.
> 
> Its development also converts the DF-21D ground-to-sea, initially limited in range, to double its range to reach the same level as the DF-26 IRBM. *On the other hand, it does not seem to be relevant both technically and operationally to develop an air-to-ground version based on the latter.
> 
> And the associated technologies would not only be dedicated to the military field and could be beneficial to some civilian programs. For example, this could allow CASIC, also a major player in the Chinese aerospace sector, to develop an airborne satellite launcher, similar to what it does with its competitor CASC with a Y-20 transport aircraft.
> 
> As for the question on the possible operational deployment of the missile, it will undoubtedly remain in the direction of the ocean, that is towards the Pacific Ocean as well as the South China Sea, with a possible extension to the Indian Ocean.
> 
> In view of its relatively short development, since the first pre-studies of an “airborne anti-ship ballistic missile” seem to have started around 2005, it would once again be a “pragmatic” and “contextual” weapon. the Chinese military, as for example the hypersonic glider missile DF-17 as well as the hypersonic reconnaissance drone of AVIC, which has a very precise and targeted objective, and would not therefore have a more general utility outside the sphere Chinese A2/AD.
> 
> View attachment 680977
> 
> 
> One of the Chinese R&D documents dating from 2005 on the subject of the airborne ballistic missile dedicated to anti-ship missions.
> 
> Henri K.
> 2018-06-20


*China’s New Aircraft Carrier Killer Is World’s Largest Air-Launched Missile*

_H I Sutton sheds some light on China's latest aircraft carrier killer: The CH-AS-X-13 air-launched anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM)._

By H I Sutton | NAVALNEWS (2020-11-01)





_Chinese Air Force Xian H-6N bomber launching a CH-AS-X-13 anti-ship ballistic missile over the South China Sea_

*Navies are racing to develop hypersonic missiles which may change the pace of naval warfare.* Russia will deploy the *Zircon hypersonic missile* aboard warships and submarines. The US Navy has started down the path of the common *hypersonic glide body (c-HGB)* for its destroyers. Meanwhile China’s latest hypersonic weapon is something completely different; it is air launched.

The massive new missile, labelled *CH-AS-X-13* [since the Chinese own naming is not known by the outside world], is *probably the largest air-launched missile in the world*.

The missile was first reported by *Ankit Panda*, the Stanton Senior Fellow at the Nuclear Policy Program, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, *in April 2018*. More recently candid images have appeared on Chinese social media. These provide a clearer view of the novel weapon.

Analysts believe that it may be intended to *target high-value warships*, particularly aircraft carriers. This makes it an *anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM / AShBM)*. And it appears to be carrying a *hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV)*. This may give it extended range and increase survivability against air defenses.






The CH-AS-X-13 *may be closely related* to the ground based *DF-21D* anti-ship ballistic missile. Image analysis suggests that it has different dimensions however, so may use a different rocket motor. The most likely reason for this would be the physical restrictions imposed by carrying it under an H-6 bomber. Additionally it appears to be equipped with a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) similar to the one seen on the *DF-17* ballistic missile. Clearer images in the future may clarify this.

The DF-21D is believed to have a range in excess of *1,500 kilometers*. The CH-AS-X-13 may have a similar range, or possibly further due to the aerial launch and a hypersonic glide vehicle. Either way, being carried by a bomber will massively increase its overall reach. The *H-6N* version which carries it has *aerial refueling* to further increase their range. The CH-AS-X-13 is therefore a threat beyond the first island chain and South China Sea. It could potentially hit targets in the vast expanse of the Pacific Ocean, or Indian Ocean.

Even if the missile has this incredible range it will face challenges reaching its full potential. Finding and tracking an aircraft carrier at extreme ranges may be the Achilles’ heel. And a lot may depend on the survivability of the bomber itself, and the number of aircraft available for the mission. Context, of course is everything.

The H-6 bomber is not limited to the CH-AS-X-15 however. It can also carry *a range of anti-ship missiles*. Foremost among these is the *YJ-12 supersonic missile*. This is similar to the Russian Kh-31 (AS-17 Krypton) missile, but significantly larger. At least four YJ-12s can be carried, meaning that a squadron of bombers could launch a saturation attack on a Carrier Battle Group. The *subsonic KD-63* (also commonly referred to as the* YJ-63*) can also be carried.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1321511667428167683
Having anti-ship ballistic missiles may also be *used to message* China’s potential adversaries. ON AUGUST 26, 2020 China *test fired a DF-21D ASBM* [or more possibly, two missiles, a DF-26 & a DF-21D] into the South China Sea. This was just weeks after the US Navy aircraft carrier USS Ronald Reagan had been exercising in the area. The CH-AS-X-13 adds another dimension to the threat to carrier battle groups, so its development alone can be seen as *sending a clear message* of China’s increasing military confidence.

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## JSCh

*China’s ‘aircraft-carrier killer’ missiles successfully hit target ship in South China Sea, PLA insider reveals*

DF-26B and DF-21D missiles launched in August struck moving vessel close to Paracel Islands, former senior colonel Wang Xiangsui says
‘This is a warning to the US, asking it not to take any military risk,’ he says


Kristin Huang
Published: 7:00am, 14 Nov, 2020

....









China’s ‘aircraft-carrier killer’ missiles hit target ship, insider reveals


DF-26B and DF-21D missiles launched in August struck moving vessel close to Paracel Islands, former senior colonel Wang Xiangsui says.




www.scmp.com

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## samsara

samsara said:


> Not merely the different missiles came from the different directions (angles), but they differed largely in term of distance of firing (DF-26 from Qinghai at over 2300 kilometers; and DF-21D from Zhejiang at over 1400 km) as well as the missiles' own characteristics (speed etc). How to coordinate them to kiss the target at more or less the same time to create the effect of saturation attack ? Many readers just didn't imagine these underlying complexity.


*China’s ‘aircraft-carrier killer’ missiles successfully hit target ship in South China Sea, PLA insider reveals*

• DF-26B and DF-21D missiles launched in August struck moving vessel close to Paracel Islands, former senior colonel Wang Xiangsui says

• ‘This is a warning to the US, asking it not to take any military risk,’ he says

_By Kristin Huang | South China Morning Post - 14 NOVEMBER 2020_





_Military vehicles carrying DF-26 and DF-21D ballistic missiles take part in a parade to mark the 70th anniversary of the end of World War II in Beijing on 2015-09-03. Photo: internet_

The TWO “aircraft-carrier killer” missiles that China launched in August 2020 travelled thousands of kilometres and hit their designated target, a MOVING SHIP, near the Paracel Islands in the South China Sea, according to a Chinese military expert.

This is the FIRST TIME the Chinese side has revealed details of the missile launches, which were first reported by the South China Morning Post IN AUGUST 2020. The news was later confirmed by the US military.

After the launches it was reported that the missiles fell into the South China Sea, but Wang Xiangsui, a former senior colonel who now works as a professor at Beihang University in Beijing, said *they hit a ship, their intended target*.






One of the missiles, a DF-26B, was launched from the northwestern province of Qinghai, while the other, a DF-21D, lifted off from Zhejiang province in China’s east.





_A DF-26B IRBM was fired from Da Qaidam, Qinghai (2319km) and a DF-21D MRBM was fired from Ningbo, Zhejiang (1450km) to the Xisha Islands (Paracels) in the South China Sea on 2020-08-26._

The launches came a day after Beijing said a US U-2 spy plane entered a no-fly zone without permission during a Chinese live-fire naval drill in the Bohai Sea off its northern coast. The US Navy had earlier sent TWO AIRCRAFT CARRIER STRIKE GROUPS into the SOUTH CHINA SEA.

_“So several days later [after the aircraft carrier manoeuvres], we launched the DF-21 and DF-26, and the missiles hit a vessel sailing south of the Paracel Islands,”_ Wang said at a closed-door meeting in Zhejiang last month. The details of his speech were published for the first time on Wednesday (11/11).

_“SHORTLY AFTER THAT, an American military attaché in Geneva complained [to us] and said it would lead to severe consequences if the missiles hit an American aircraft carrier. They see this as a show of force. *But we are doing this because of their provocation*,”_ Wang said.

His remarks were made during the *four-day Moganshan forum* to discuss domestic and international issues and China’s new five-year plan. The event was organised by the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC) and attended by 80 economists, former government officials and entrepreneurs.

_“This is a warning to the US, asking it not to take any military risks,” Wang said. “Such actions mark the bottom line of Sino-US confrontation.”_

The missile launches came at a time of high tensions between Beijing and Washington over the disputed South China Sea.

The US Navy said ON JULY 4 it had deployed TWO AIRCRAFT CARRIER GROUPS, led by the *USS Nimitz and USS Ronald Reagan*, to conduct tactical air defence exercises in the disputed waters “in support of a free and open Indo-Pacific”.

Beijing blasted the manoeuvres, describing them as PROVOCATIVE, while the US said China’s missile launches were reckless and destabilising.

Song Zhongping, a former instructor with the People’s Liberation Army’s Second Artillery Corps, said the mission was *evidence that China could carry out long-range precision strikes *against medium to large surface vessels.

_“__*To hit a moving object is not an easy task, especially for ballistic missiles*__, which normally hit a stationary target,” he said. __*“The mission shows Chinese missiles are a real deterrent against US warships.”*_

Michael Raska, an assistant professor at the S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies at Nanyang Technological University in Singapore, said *China was developing advanced combat systems capable of negating the United States’ traditional military superiority.*

“*The key problem for the US is to sustain its long-term deterrence*, particularly in contested areas, while simultaneously mitigating risks,” he said.

According to a report published by the US defence department IN SEPTEMBER, China may have already overtaken America in the area of MISSILE DEVELOPMENT and SHIPBUILDING, and is set to double its nuclear warhead stockpile over the next decade.

The PLA has more than 1,250 ground-launched ballistic missiles and ground-launched cruise missiles with ranges of up to 5,500km. The US has a single type of conventional ground-launched ballistic missile, with a range of 70km to 300km, the report said.

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## LKJ86

HJ-10








Via https://weibo.com/tv/show/1034:4571205403869201?from=old_pc_videoshow

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## LKJ86

HQ-9








Via https://weibo.com/tv/show/1034:4570538916380679?from=old_pc_videoshow

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## samsara

*China now has the nuclear strength to hit back at a first strike, former PLA colonel says*

The military has built an ‘underground Great Wall’ of tunnels to hide and move its arsenal of ballistic missiles, Wang Xiangsui tells Moganshan forum
The defences add up to a credible ability to mount a second strike, resulting in a deterrent effect, he says
*Liu Zhen in Beijing | South China Morning Post*
Published: 12:00pm, 17 Nov, 2020





_China’s JL-3 is estimated have a range of over 12,000km, putting the US well within reach from the Chinese coast. Photo: Handout_

*China has spent the **last two decades building defences for its nuclear armoury on land and at sea**, ensuring that the military can hit back at a nuclear attack and deter others from launching one, according a former Chinese senior colonel.*

Wang Xiangsui, now a professor at Beihang University in Beijing, said these defences – which included a *vast network of tunnels to transport and protect missiles* – meant China’s security was guaranteed even in the worst scenario.

_“Launching nuclear strikes on China has always been a military option for the US,”_ Wang told a closed-door meeting last month.

_*“But for this option they are facing increasing uncertainties due to our adjustment and changes in the past 20 years.”*_

He delivered the assessment at the *four-day Moganshan forum* to discuss domestic and international issues and China’s new five-year plan, but the transcript of his remarks was only made public on Wednesday (11/11).

Without specifying the source, _Wang said some US assessments claimed that only one Chinese nuclear warhead_ would be able to survive a US first strike and reach American soil in a counter-attack.

He dismissed the claims as *“clearly nonsense”*.

He said China *had taken a series of measures over the years to establish a credible “second-strike” capability* to respond to a nuclear attack.

*In addition to intercontinental ballistic missile tunnels, China had developed advanced missiles and expanded “bastion waters” in the South China and Yellow seas in which its ballistic missile submarines could operate safely.*

_“These have drawn a *bottom line* for China-US confrontation – that the confrontation is unlikely to become a massive invasion, which is an important basis [of calculation for both sides],” he said._

China has pledged “no first use” of nuclear weapons and is thought to have 200 or 300 nuclear warheads, a fraction of the 4,000 or so Russia and the US have each.

*Its nuclear strategy depends on ensuring its nuclear forces can survive the first wave of an enemy strike.*

State media reported *in 2018 that the military had built an “underground Great Wall” of 5,000km* (3,100 miles) of tunnels throughout the country to hide, move and launch its nuclear counterstrike forces. In the footage, ICBMs were shown being loaded on trucks and driven through the tunnels.

China also established a *firm maritime nuclear capability in 2015* when its Type 094A ballistic missile nuclear submarines (SSBNs) were fitted with JL-2 missiles (SLBM) on patrols.

This added to the potential to hit back if land-based silos were taken out.

The PLA has one SSBN base in the South China Sea, where the waters are deeper and therefore safer for covert submarine operations; *and two in the Yellow Sea*, closer to the mainland United States for missiles sent over the north pole.

“[US spy planes] found our SSBNs in the South China Sea operating in trenches as deep as 3,000m *and the artificial islands we built as an SLBM missile launch area*,” said Wang, adding that the Yellow Sea was another bastion area.

The JL-2 has a range of 7,400km, and its successor, *the JL-3, is estimated have a range of over 12,000km*, putting the US well within reach from the Chinese coast.

The People’s Liberation Army has also developed its missile portfolio, *creating the world’s first hypersonic glider missile the DF-17*, which is fast enough to penetrate the US missile defence system, according to Wang.

He said that all these measures meant it was not possible for the US to launch a massive nuclear strike against China.

Also at the forum, *Wang revealed for the first time* that the PLA’s DF-26B and DF-21D “aircraft-carrier killer” missiles successfully hit a moving vessel in the South China Sea in a test in August, sending a warning to the US “not to take any military risks”.

*=============================================*

*American hostility means China can’t come clean on its nuclear arsenal, Beijing official says*

To ensure the effectiveness of its nuclear strategy, ‘China maintains a certain degree of ambiguity’ regarding numbers of warheads, head of the foreign ministry arms control department says
Beijing will only join Washington and Moscow in arms limitation talks if ‘US commits to reducing its nuclear arsenal to a level’ similar to China’s, he says
Kinling Lo | South China Morning Post
Published: 7:00pm, 16 Oct, 2020

The United States’ “hostile policies” mean *China must retain some ambiguity regarding its nuclear arsenal*, and expecting Beijing to engage in arms control talks under the current circumstances is “unreasonable and unrealistic”, according to a senior foreign ministry official.





_Fu Cong, who heads the Chinese foreign ministry’s arms control department, says the US cannot expect China to be transparent in doctrine and numbers. Photo: AP_

*In an interview with Russian newspaper Kommersant* – an English translation of which was published by Beijing on Thursday – *Fu Cong, the head of the Chinese foreign ministry’s arms control department, defended China’s lack of transparency on the issue.*

To ensure the *effectiveness* of its nuclear strategy, _*“it is important that China maintains a certain degree of ambiguity in terms of its numbers”*_, he said.

“Especially given the fact that the US, which regards China as its biggest competitor, is adopting *such hostile policies* towards China and maintains such a huge nuclear arsenal, of 6,000 [warheads].”

The US Department of Defence said in its annual report to Congress on China’s military power last month that the Asian giant’s nuclear arsenal was set to at least double over the next decade.

Fu said *China’s nuclear capacity building was a necessary “deterrent”* amid America’s expansion of its nuclear arsenal and plans to deploy land-based intermediate-range missiles in territories neighbouring China. 

_*“Under all these circumstances, you can’t expect China to be both transparent in doctrine and transparent in numbers,” he said.*_

Nuclear disarmament could become a new front in the deepening rift between China and the US, after Beijing refused to join talks with Washington and Moscow in June to extend the 2010 New Start accord, which is set to expire in February.

The US has pushed for China to be brought into any future deal, saying its nuclear and missile capabilities pose a growing threat to the US and its allies.

Fu, however, rejected the idea of China joining such talks, calling them “unfair, unreasonable and unrealistic” on the grounds that the US and Russia were much larger nuclear powers.

“China has on numerous occasions reiterated its position [on the three-way talks] that given the huge disparity between the Chinese nuclear arsenal and that of the US and the Russian Federation, *we do not believe there is any fair and equitable basis for China to join*,” he said.

_“[But] if the US commits to reducing its nuclear arsenal to a level comparable to the Chinese nuclear arsenal, we’ll be happy to join.” _

According to the [U.S.] defence department’s report last month, the US has about 6,000 nuclear weapons, including retired warheads, while China’s total is in the low 200s.

China *does not publish* figures on how many nuclear warheads it has, but according to a report by the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute it was one of six countries – along with India, Britain, Pakistan, Israel and North Korea – that increased their arsenals in 2020.

Fu said in the Kommersant interview that in nuclear arsenal terms, China should be classified together with France and Britain.

Despite six nations increasing their nuclear capacity, global inventories have been falling, mostly as a result of the US and Russia dismantling retired stocks, according to the Stockholm report.

America had 1,750 deployed warheads – placed on missiles or located on bases with operational forces – and 4,050 in reserve or retired, while the equivalent figures for Russia were 1,570 and 4,805, the report said.



samsara said:


> It's a GOOD READ. It answers many questions that members of PDF may wonder about China's Nuke standing! Before reading this piece I have many questions, after reading it most become clear
> 
> On October 15, 2020, Mr. FU Cong, Director-General of Department of Arms Control, took an interview with Ms. Elena Chernenko, Special Correspondent at the Russian Daily Newspaper Kommersant. During the interview, Director-General FU *enunciated China's position* on a number of issues related to *global strategic stability and nuclear disarmament*. The transcript is as follows:
> 
> 
> 
> 系统维护_中华人民共和国外交部

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1328761138071343104IEEE Spectrum @IEEESpectrum

After years in the doldrums, research on hypersonic flight—at Mach 5 and up—has suddenly taken off. The reason: politics



Russia, China, the U.S.: Who Will Win the Hypersonic Arms Race?​spectrum.ieee.org​
2:05 AM · Nov 18, 2020

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM

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## samsara

*US conducts ICBM interception test; ‘tech won’t work against advanced missiles’ (2020-11-19)*

The US recently conducted an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) *interception test* with a missile launched from a warship. US media said on Wednesday the move could harm the mutual deterrence between major nuclear powers and force China and Russia to expand their capabilities.

*Chinese military analyst*s said on Thursday that the test was only done in an *optimal scenario* and may find it difficult when facing a real missile, not to mention that China and Russia are already developing and commissioning more advanced missiles, including hypersonic ones, which are much harder to intercept.


The test used only a mock missile, and was done *under an optimal scenario in which the defending side knows where and when the missile would come from*, so it is very questionable to what extent the test could represent a real-battle scenario where the missile could be launched from unpredictable locations and at an unknown time, given both China and Russia operate road-mobile ICBMs and submarine-launched ballistic missiles, a military expert who asked for anonymity told the Global Times on Thursday. 

(...)






US conducts ICBM interception test; ‘tech won’t work against advanced missiles’ - Global Times







www.globaltimes.cn

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @亮剑东南 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM
















Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## samsara

*From Henri Kenhmann at East Pendulum on 2020.11.23:*

_Dropped from a balloon for their *first free fall flight* on __*21 SEPTEMBER 2018*__, the three IMECH prototypes are finally revealed tonight on CCTV-7.

The *D18-1S, 2S and 3S* allow IMECH engineers to study the new aerodynamic configurations in the *hypersonic regim*e.







_











__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1330569092252594176
_Note: IMECH = *Institute of Mechanics, Chinese Academy of Sciences* (also abbreviated as IMCAS) is the *first national institution for mechanics research in China*. It is a comprehensive and multidisciplinary national mechanics research center organized on the conception of engineering science by *Professor Qian Xuesen (Hsue-Shen Tsien)*._




http://english.imech.cas.cn/au/bi/



I think I already saw the pics here at PDF, most likely uploaded by @LKJ86 but cannot locate where they are 

Yes, I see it again in other thread, posted as GIF, here:





China Space Military：Recon, Satcom, Navi, ASAT/BMD, Orbital Vehicle, SLV, etc.


Chinese private rocket complete the third phase engine thermo ground test 2019-12-05 14:02:16 Editor : Li Yan Chinese private rocket company Galactic Energy has successfully finished the third stage thermo ground test for its Ceres-1 launch vehicle on Tuesday, according to a company statement...



defence.pk

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## LKJ86

HHQ-9B SAM & Type 052D DDG




Via @舰船知识 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## juj06750

samsara said:


> *Covid Is Increasing America’s Lead Over China*
> 
> _As the post-pandemic world order takes shape, it’s clear that the U.S. still has huge advantages._
> 
> By Tyler Cowen | Bloomberg (2020-11-17)
> 
> ...
> The broader question of allies is central for understanding the relative balance of power moving forward. China is likely to overtake the U.S. in terms of GDP, yet China has performed poorly in cultivating and developing reliable allies. The infrastructure emphasis of the “One Belt, One Road” plan no longer seems like such a great investment, with so many nations strapped for cash and the drop in travel and commuting. The notion of East Africa as a China’s sphere of influence now seems like a distant dream. In Pakistan Baloch separatists have attacked Chinese projects, due to fears of resource theft and encroaching influence.
> ...
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> Is this a kind of veiled threat or warning to China... in regard to some possible military conflict or even nuke exchanges (when the US has so many more nuke heads than China's stock)? That the US is capable to absorb some casualties in seeking out domination and victory?










we already much superior to US in terms of overall military projection capability in East Asia; not only by missiles but also by ships, aircrafts, or logistics; and when it comes to matters of speed and quantity in East Asia, we easily overwhelm US; seemingly, many prideful americans and US media don't want to admit the fact but it very importantly true; actually it must be because US is NOT in Asia!!

I suggest samsara to leave such propaganda from US media; US often done so against soviet union during cold war; it always does when it really fears; I believe it won't stop such propaganda in the last moment until it finally leaves Asia

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM













Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## JSCh

JSCh said:


> *China’s ‘aircraft-carrier killer’ missiles successfully hit target ship in South China Sea, PLA insider reveals*
> 
> DF-26B and DF-21D missiles launched in August struck moving vessel close to Paracel Islands, former senior colonel Wang Xiangsui says
> ‘This is a warning to the US, asking it not to take any military risk,’ he says
> 
> 
> Kristin Huang
> Published: 7:00am, 14 Nov, 2020
> 
> ....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> China’s ‘aircraft-carrier killer’ missiles hit target ship, insider reveals
> 
> 
> DF-26B and DF-21D missiles launched in August struck moving vessel close to Paracel Islands, former senior colonel Wang Xiangsui says.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.scmp.com


Excerp from,

Opinion | China’s military expansion will test the Biden administration - The Washington Post


> Davidson confirmed, for the first time from the U.S. government side, that China’s People’s Liberation Army has successfully tested an anti-ship ballistic missile against a moving ship. This was done as part of the PLA’s massive joint military exercises, which have been ongoing since the summer. These are often called “aircraft carrier killer” missiles, because they could threaten the United States’ most significant naval assets from long distances.

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## ILC

Paywall


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## samsara

samsara said:


> *Covid Is Increasing America’s Lead Over China*
> 
> _As the post-pandemic world order takes shape, it’s clear that the U.S. still has huge advantages._
> 
> By Tyler Cowen | Bloomberg (2020-11-17)
> 
> ...
> The broader question of allies is central for understanding the relative balance of power moving forward. China is likely to overtake the U.S. in terms of GDP, yet China has performed poorly in cultivating and developing reliable allies. The infrastructure emphasis of the “One Belt, One Road” plan no longer seems like such a great investment, with so many nations strapped for cash and the drop in travel and commuting. The notion of East Africa as a China’s sphere of influence now seems like a distant dream. In Pakistan Baloch separatists have attacked Chinese projects, due to fears of resource theft and encroaching influence.
> ...
> 
> _There is one other factor that people are loathe to discuss (with one exception). Yes, the U.S. has botched its response to Covid-19. At the same time, its experience shows that *America as a nation can in fact tolerate casualties*, too many in fact. *It had long been standard Chinese doctrine that Americans are “soft” and unwilling to take on much risk. If you were a Chinese war game planner, might you now reconsider that assumption?*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Covid Is Increasing America’s Lead Over China
> 
> 
> As the post-pandemic world order takes shape, it’s clear that the U.S. still has huge advantages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bloomberg.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> Is this a kind of veiled threat or warning to China... in regard to some possible military conflict or even nuke exchanges (when the US has so many more nuke heads than China's stock)? That the US is capable to absorb some casualties in seeking out domination and victory?


From Sardaukar20 /SDF -- with my little adaptations and corrections:

*A bankrupt hegemon will do very well when its No. 1 economic adversary is dead and gone. *The next economic competitors: Japan, Germany, UK, India, France, etc. are either vassals or friends. Russia poses no economic challenge to the US. Especially not with China is gone. *A bankrupt USA will continue to be the No. 1 in a bankrupt world with no China around!* Crazy you say? I don't think Steve Bannon, Tom Cotton, or Donald Trump would think so. The US could put 1000 warheads on China, think about those Ohio-class SSBN, and still have plenty to spare for Russia.

I strongly disagree that nukes serve no purpose for China. If China focuses mainly on economic development and ignores the pressing defence matters, this will be the same mistake, or even worse, that the Qing dynasty made right before the Century of Humiliation. _"All is fine in China, let the barbarians play with their superior toys."_ That was until these barbarians started to use these toys on China. With these toys, they could dictate economic terms with China, pushed Opium into China, and took territories from China. In the context of the 21st century, the USA *could wipe China off the map* for the price of several millions or even many tens of millions of dead Americans and a bankrupt economy. Economies can revive, the dead won't. Now that's an absolute power!!!

Therefore, nukes do matter for China. If China's second or retaliatory nuke strike have the capability to also wipe the CONUS and its allies from the map like what Russia can do, then that deterrent capability would help to eliminate any American wet dream of ever winning a nuke fight with China. Today, we have an increasingly irrational crowd of USA and its allies. So nukes are the best guarantor of peace and continued prosperity for China. If the US and its allies are becoming too insane and would nuke China anyway, then China shall have its ultimate revenge. To deny them an ultimate victory over China. *To ensure the MAD -- Mutually-Assured Destructions!*

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I think China need several thousand of strategic nuke warheads with adequate delivery means that can reach CONUS and its warring allies... a quantity that will survive any sudden & massive First Nuke Strike, thus China is still capable to launch decisive retaliatory nuke attacks that keep the MAD scenario to its real meaning in the worst scenario! Having a decisively credible fleet of SSBN with reach to CONUS and its warring allies will increase the level of confidence and deterrence. Just take the US Ohio-class SSBN for some benchmarking.

Needless to say that the urgency of safeguarding nation's safety from the *existential threats* by any hostile force is surpassing any other consideration and should have the paramount importance. No amount of wealth and advancement will matter if one's facing dire threats to be annihilated!!!

I really hope that China's strategist planner *never underestimate* the level of insanity that the some elements in power in the US may pursue to maintain its domination when that nation is unable to compete normally!!! A declining empire trying to hold fast its dominance by any means is extremely dangerous to the world and moreover to its peer rival!

~~~~~~~~~~

_"Whatever happens, the rules are far simpler than you imagine: Any attempt to replace the dollar as the world's reserve currency will lead to war. We run the world. Our dollar is legal tender -- EVERYWHERE. Anyone else who wants out of that game will be on the other end of our military might. This is high stakes poker. We're the house and we get to decide what cards are dealt in what order and everyone else has to play along or else."_

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## clarkgap

ILC said:


> Paywall



https://armynow.net/china-rockets-asymmetric-threat-us-navy-jinping/

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## LKJ86

HJ-10

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM




Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> Excerp from,
> 
> Opinion | China’s military expansion will test the Biden administration - The Washington Post


*China’s military expansion will test the Biden administration*

*Opinion by Josh Rogin | Columnist | The Washington Post*
Dec. 3, 2020 at 5:50 p.m. EST

The tectonic plates of the military balance in Asia are shifting underneath our feet. It’s happening slowly and inexorably, but over time the magnitude of the change is becoming vividly apparent. As the United States prepares to change its leadership, China’s military advancement and expansion are now a problem too glaring to ignore.





_Adm. Philip Davidson, Commander of the U.S. Indo-Pacific Command_

*Adm. Philip Davidson, who is nearing the end of his tour as the head of U.S. Indo-Pacific Command, has been warning about the changing military balance in Asia throughout his tenure.* But his warnings have often fallen on deaf ears in a Washington *mired in partisanship and dysfunction*. The Trump administration talked a big game about meeting the challenge of China’s military encroachment, but Davidson’s calls for substantially *more investment* to restore the regional balance that has deterred Beijing for decades *have gone largely unanswered*.

China’s military *has moved well past a strategy of simply defending its territory* and is now modernizing with the objective of *being able to operate and even fight far from its shores*, Davidson told me in an interview conducted last month for the 2020 Halifax International Security Forum. *Under President Xi Jinping, Davidson said, China has built advanced weapons systems, platforms and rocket forces that have altered the strategic environment in ways the United States has not sufficiently responded to.*

_“We are seeing great advances in their modernization efforts,”_ he said. _“China will test more missiles, conventional and nuclear associated missiles this year than every other nation added together on the planet. So that gives you an idea of the scale of how these things are changing.”_

*Davidson confirmed, for the first time from the U.S. government side, that China’s People’s Liberation Army has successfully tested an anti-ship ballistic missile against a moving ship.* This was done as part of the PLA’s massive joint military exercises, which have been ongoing since the summer. These are often called “aircraft carrier killer” missiles, because they could threaten the United States’ most significant naval assets from long distances.

_*“It’s an indication that they continue to advance their capability. We’ve known for years they’ve been in pursuit of a capability that could attack moving targets,”*_ Davidson said. I asked him whether they are designed to target U.S. aircraft carriers. _*“Trust me, they are targeting everything,”*_ he replied.

*Chinese missile and rocket forces now represent “a great asymmetry” in the region, Davidson said, that presents a threat along the first island chain, which stretches from the Koreas down through Japan to Southeast Asia and Taiwan. He has advocated integrated air and missile defense in the region and on Guam, which is strategic but vulnerable.*

Davidson’s watch has almost ended. The Wall Street Journal reported this week that President Trump plans to nominate Pacific Fleet commander *Adm. John Aquilino* to succeed him. But before that change will likely take place, a new president will take office in Washington, one who is promising to review the U.S. strategic approach to Asia early on. What Joe Biden’s officials will find is *that the PLA of 2021 is quite different from the PLA they last dealt with in 2016*.

_“Recent advances in equipment, organization, and logistics have significantly improved the PLA’s ability to project power and deploy expeditionary forces far from China’s shores,”_ the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission wrote in its latest annual report, released this week. _“A concurrent evolution in military strategy requires the force to become capable of operating anywhere around the globe and of contesting the U.S. military if called upon to do so.”_
...

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## LKJ86

YJ-18 & Type 052D DDG




Via @舰船知识 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## vi-va

samsara said:


> *China’s military expansion will test the Biden administration*
> 
> *Opinion by Josh Rogin | Columnist | The Washington Post*
> Dec. 3, 2020 at 5:50 p.m. EST
> 
> The tectonic plates of the military balance in Asia are shifting underneath our feet. It’s happening slowly and inexorably, but over time the magnitude of the change is becoming vividly apparent. As the United States prepares to change its leadership, China’s military advancement and expansion are now a problem too glaring to ignore.
> 
> View attachment 693408
> 
> _Adm. Philip Davidson, Commander of the U.S. Indo-Pacific Command_
> 
> *Adm. Philip Davidson, who is nearing the end of his tour as the head of U.S. Indo-Pacific Command, has been warning about the changing military balance in Asia throughout his tenure.* But his warnings have often fallen on deaf ears in a Washington *mired in partisanship and dysfunction*. The Trump administration talked a big game about meeting the challenge of China’s military encroachment, but Davidson’s calls for substantially *more investment* to restore the regional balance that has deterred Beijing for decades *have gone largely unanswered*.
> 
> China’s military *has moved well past a strategy of simply defending its territory* and is now modernizing with the objective of *being able to operate and even fight far from its shores*, Davidson told me in an interview conducted last month for the 2020 Halifax International Security Forum. *Under President Xi Jinping, Davidson said, China has built advanced weapons systems, platforms and rocket forces that have altered the strategic environment in ways the United States has not sufficiently responded to.*
> 
> _“We are seeing great advances in their modernization efforts,”_ he said. _“China will test more missiles, conventional and nuclear associated missiles this year than every other nation added together on the planet. So that gives you an idea of the scale of how these things are changing.”_
> 
> *Davidson confirmed, for the first time from the U.S. government side, that China’s People’s Liberation Army has successfully tested an anti-ship ballistic missile against a moving ship.* This was done as part of the PLA’s massive joint military exercises, which have been ongoing since the summer. These are often called “aircraft carrier killer” missiles, because they could threaten the United States’ most significant naval assets from long distances.
> 
> _*“It’s an indication that they continue to advance their capability. We’ve known for years they’ve been in pursuit of a capability that could attack moving targets,”*_ Davidson said. I asked him whether they are designed to target U.S. aircraft carriers. _*“Trust me, they are targeting everything,”*_ he replied.
> 
> *Chinese missile and rocket forces now represent “a great asymmetry” in the region, Davidson said, that presents a threat along the first island chain, which stretches from the Koreas down through Japan to Southeast Asia and Taiwan. He has advocated integrated air and missile defense in the region and on Guam, which is strategic but vulnerable.*
> 
> Davidson’s watch has almost ended. The Wall Street Journal reported this week that President Trump plans to nominate Pacific Fleet commander *Adm. John Aquilino* to succeed him. But before that change will likely take place, a new president will take office in Washington, one who is promising to review the U.S. strategic approach to Asia early on. What Joe Biden’s officials will find is *that the PLA of 2021 is quite different from the PLA they last dealt with in 2016*.
> 
> _“Recent advances in equipment, organization, and logistics have significantly improved the PLA’s ability to project power and deploy expeditionary forces far from China’s shores,”_ the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission wrote in its latest annual report, released this week. _“A concurrent evolution in military strategy requires the force to become capable of operating anywhere around the globe and of contesting the U.S. military if called upon to do so.”_
> ...

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## samsara

samsara said:


> From Sardaukar20 /SDF -- with my little adaptations and corrections:
> 
> *A bankrupt hegemon will do very well when its No. 1 economic adversary is dead and gone. *The next economic competitors: Japan, Germany, UK, India, France, etc. are either vassals or friends. Russia poses no economic challenge to the US. Especially not with China is gone. *A bankrupt USA will continue to be the No. 1 in a bankrupt world with no China around!* Crazy you say? I don't think Steve Bannon, Tom Cotton, or Donald Trump would think so. The US could put 1000 warheads on China, think about those Ohio-class SSBN, and still have plenty to spare for Russia.
> 
> I strongly disagree that nukes serve no purpose for China. If China focuses mainly on economic development and ignores the pressing defence matters, this will be the same mistake, or even worse, that the Qing dynasty made right before the Century of Humiliation. _"All is fine in China, let the barbarians play with their superior toys."_ That was until these barbarians started to use these toys on China. With these toys, they could dictate economic terms with China, pushed Opium into China, and took territories from China. In the context of the 21st century, the USA *could wipe China off the map* for the price of several millions or even many tens of millions of dead Americans and a bankrupt economy. Economies can revive, the dead won't. Now that's an absolute power!!!
> 
> Therefore, nukes do matter for China. If China's second or retaliatory nuke strike have the capability to also wipe the CONUS and its allies from the map like what Russia can do, then that deterrent capability would help to eliminate any American wet dream of ever winning a nuke fight with China. Today, we have an increasingly irrational crowd of USA and its allies. So nukes are the best guarantor of peace and continued prosperity for China. If the US and its allies are becoming too insane and would nuke China anyway, then China shall have its ultimate revenge. To deny them an ultimate victory over China. *To ensure the MAD -- Mutually-Assured Destructions!*
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> I think China need several thousand of strategic nuke warheads with adequate delivery means that can reach CONUS and its warring allies... a quantity that will survive any sudden & massive First Nuke Strike, thus China is still capable to launch decisive retaliatory nuke attacks that keep the MAD scenario to its real meaning in the worst scenario! Having a decisively credible fleet of SSBN with reach to CONUS and its warring allies will increase the level of confidence and deterrence. Just take the US Ohio-class SSBN for some benchmarking.
> 
> Needless to say that the urgency of safeguarding nation's safety from the *existential threats* by any hostile force is surpassing any other consideration and should have the paramount importance. No amount of wealth and advancement will matter if one's facing dire threats to be annihilated!!!
> 
> I really hope that China's strategist planner *never underestimate* the level of insanity that the some elements in power in the US may pursue to maintain its domination when that nation is unable to compete normally!!! A declining empire trying to hold fast its dominance by any means is extremely dangerous to the world and moreover to its peer rival!
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> _"Whatever happens, the rules are far simpler than you imagine: Any attempt to replace the dollar as the world's reserve currency will lead to war. We run the world. Our dollar is legal tender -- EVERYWHERE. Anyone else who wants out of that game will be on the other end of our military might. This is high stakes poker. We're the house and we get to decide what cards are dealt in what order and everyone else has to play along or else."_


From vincent /SDF:

*Donald Trump: The Wizard of Wuz*

_Trump may have made Americans feel better about themselves but he missed an opportunity to improve America_

by Spengler | December 7, 2020 | ASIA TIMES
...

Trump was the best that America could come up with at the moment. In reality, America imports its Wizard, including real wizards like the Hungarian-Jewish scientists who built the atom bomb (and who in the person of Edward Teller persuaded Ronald Reagan to pursue the Strategic Defense Initiative / SDI in 1980s). It also imports fake wizards, for example, Henry Kissinger, whom I qualified in a recent essay as “Klemens von Metternich – as played by Groucho Marx.”

*The sad fact is that the US economy is 70% consumption*, against an OECD average of 60%. *We don’t invest in future productivity; we borrow and we consume. That is America’s problem, and Trump did nothing to correct it.* Someone needs to tell Americans that there’s a difference between winning and feeling good while we’re losing. *If America wants to remain the world’s preeminent power, it needs to teach high school students Calculus in 10th grade and subsidize engineering majors instead of resentment studies. It needs a tax system that encourages US tech companies to make hardware as well as software. And it needs a lot of qualified immigrants from China and India to build new industries while we wait for the long-term impact of education reforms.

Why won’t any politician stand up and say this? Probably because no-one will believe it’s possible.* A POLITICAL SCIENTIST of my acquaintance, CLIFFORD ANGELL BATES, posted this comment on my recent report of Chinese breakthroughs in 5G broadband: _*“I think we need to take John von Neumann’s recommendation that he gave regarding what should be done to [the] Soviets,” that is, a preemptive nuclear attack.*_
Why not just improve America and compete with China? I posted back.






*PROF. BATES REPLIED:* _“Sorry… given the declining IQ of the American population due to dysgenetic behavior of large parts of the American population and the failure of our schools to educate the young to produce the necessary skillset to pull it off, any thought of trying to repeat what Reagan was able to do is very, very unlikely. The odds of being able to reform our education system are as unlikely [as] someone winning [the lottery] Powerball – heck no, winning 10 Powerballs. Why so low? Because of the political interests that make the public education system the clusterfuck it is. Also, China unlike the Soviet Union is wholly integrated into the global economic system and is working at the same level as we are. No, we **** up in 1988-89 when [we] did not clamp down and cutting them off… Now we have the devil to pay… I prefer not to be ruled by them… so I think what Neumann recommends needs to be taken seriously if one wishes not to face the dismal future of slavery under a Chinese hegemonic despotism.”_

Prof. Bates was letting off steam, to be sure; given the opportunity to press the button and start a nuclear war with China, I suspect he would demur. *But his bad mood is indicative: This is an America that eagerly believed the happy stories that Donald Trump told about it but doesn’t really believe in itself. It will alternate between rage and despondency for the foreseeable future.*

Read the full article at:









Donald Trump: The Wizard of Wuz


“I think you are a very bad man,” said Dorothy. “Oh, no, my dear; I’m really a very good man, but I’m a very bad Wizard, I must admit.” Most phenomena in American politics are clarified…




asiatimes.com





~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*Why some Americans (a professor, mind you... and Prof. Bates ain't the first, and definitely not the lone voice articulating the very sinister things like this thermonuclear genocide either) always assume that a world that America doesn't dominate and screw up would be a world where the Chinese are stepping in and doing the same. Nobody wants to rule the America, nobody wants to rule the world, just mind one's own business, and stop interfering into other people's affairs, just get the prosperity... and stop telling, preaching other people what to do, how to live...*

*No wonder the feel threatened side gonna increase much its strategic nuke warhead stockpiles and delivery means to ensure the effective MAD doctrine in some quiet crash program(s) as some indicative signs have already signaled...*

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 693748
> View attachment 693750

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM














Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM













Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## samsara

*Air-to-Air Missiles: Capabilities and Developments In China*

*By Peter Wood, David Yang, and Roger Cliff* 
Published November 30, 2020
*China Aerospace Studies Institute | USAF Air University*

“Good enough”, this is how I often describe China’s short-term ambitions. They don’t need to have a world-class / global-leader military, not yet; what they need is something that is ‘good enough’. This has implications for how China pursues its program of military modernization and its goal to increase its comprehensive national power. They don’t need to have a navy that can go toe to toe with the U.S. Navy, they need a military which is ‘good enough’ to keep the U.S. Navy occupied or distracted, *hence developing the idea to use ballistic missiles against aircraft carriers*, this is a ‘good enough’ solution for now, at a much lower cost. So too in the realm of aviation. China is working very hard to modernize their fleet of aircraft and striving to improve their aerospace forces, but it takes time and money. So where do they focus? On getting to ‘good enough’. *Air-to-air missiles are a perfect example of this.* Their newest fighter, the J-20, is stealthy-ish, may soon be able to supercruise-ish (if they solve their engine problems), and is a modern fighter. Is it as good as an F-35, no, but if you can develop air-to-air missiles that can outreach American and allied missiles, then a decent J-20 is good enough to keep the U.S. aviation forces, *particularly the tanker bridge on which we heavily rely, at arm’s length*. Thus ‘good enough’ (for now). Make no mistake, *China has goals to create a ‘world class military’ by 2049* (the centenary of the founding of the PRC), and they have the plans to get there. But in the interim, *finding creative ways to fight asymmetrically will be ‘good enough’* to achieve their aims.

*Drawing on Chinese-language sources*, this report is the next in the *series of studies* by the *China Aerospace Studies Institute* that seeks to lay the foundation for *better understanding the Aerospace Sector of the People’s Republic of China (PRC).* *This report describes China’s air-to-air missile capabilities and development.* It reviews the history of the PRC’s acquisition of air-to-air missiles and production capabilities, describes the missiles and associated airborne sensors that China has produced or is currently developing, and *provides an overview of China’s air-to-air missile research and development (R&D) ecosystem*, *including profiles of key organizations and individuals*. It concludes with an assessment of the outlook for China’s air-to-air missile capabilities and their implications for the United States.

We hope you find this volume useful, and look forward to bringing you further details on the foundations of Chinese aerospace in this series.




















Air-to-Air Missiles: Capabilities and Developments In China


“Good enough”, this is how I often describe China’s short-term ambitions. They don’t need to have a world-class / global-leader military, not yet; what they need is something that is ‘good enough’.



www.airuniversity.af.edu






*NOTE:* _This link may probably be geo-blocked in certain geography_; in that case you need to use some IP adaptation to see the page. At the bottom part of the page, there is a link to download the report in PDF.



> The Report is downloadable as PDF - 12.2 MB (12,848,196 bytes)
> “2020-11- 30 Air-to-Air Missiles and Guidance Systems.pdf”
> Checksum (MD5): 01CFAA7891D4C8F53862712B6320DBF1

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## juj06750

samsara said:


> *Air-to-Air Missiles: Capabilities and Developments In China*
> 
> *By Peter Wood, David Yang, and Roger Cliff*
> Published November 30, 2020
> *China Aerospace Studies Institute | USAF Air University*
> 
> “Good enough”, this is how I often describe China’s short-term ambitions. They don’t need to have a world-class / global-leader military, not yet; what they need is something that is ‘good enough’


"yes, good enough to beat US"
samsara, please ignore baseless US report

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## samsara

LATEST UPDATE - CHINA NUKE WARHEAD COUNT -- *FAS VERSION* December 2020 edition:

From Matt Korda @mattkorda on 2020.12.10:

_Our 2020 overview of China's nuclear forces is out _
_@BulletinAtomic, w/ estimates by @nukestrat and myself:

Bomb 350 warheads (~270 operational; >DoD's # b/c we include warheads for incoming weapons)

for delivery by:
- Rocket 240 land-based missiles
- Airplane 20 gravity bombs_
_- Motor boat 48 SLBMs_


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1337076484440264708

*Matt Korda* is a Research Associate for the Nuclear Information Project at the Federation of American Scientists (FAS), where he co-authors the Nuclear Notebook with *Hans Kristensen*. Previously, he worked for the Arms Control, Disarmament, and WMD Non-Proliferation Centre at *NATO HQ in Brussels*. *Matt is also the co-director of Foreign Policy Generation*––a group of young people working to develop a progressive foreign policy for the next generation.

He received his MA in International Peace & Security from the Department of War Studies at King’s College London, where he subsequently worked as a Research Assistant on nuclear deterrence and strategic stability. He also completed an internship with the Verification, Training and Information Centre (VERTIC) in London, where he focused on nuclear security and safeguards.

He is a Canadian, lives/works in Washington, Toronto.









Matt Korda


Learn more about Matt @ the Federation of American Scientists




fas.org

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## ozranger

samsara said:


> LATEST UPDATE - CHINA NUKE WARHEAD COUNT -- *FAS VERSION* December 2020 edition:
> 
> From Matt Korda @mattkorda on 2020.12.10:
> 
> _Our 2020 overview of China's nuclear forces is out _
> _@BulletinAtomic, w/ estimates by @nukestrat and myself:
> 
> Bomb 350 warheads (~270 operational; >DoD's # b/c we include warheads for incoming weapons)
> 
> for delivery by:
> - Rocket 240 land-based missiles
> - Airplane 20 gravity bombs_
> _- Motor boat 48 SLBMs_
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1337076484440264708
> 
> *Matt Korda* is a Research Associate for the Nuclear Information Project at the Federation of American Scientists (FAS), where he co-authors the Nuclear Notebook with *Hans Kristensen*. Previously, he worked for the Arms Control, Disarmament, and WMD Non-Proliferation Centre at *NATO HQ in Brussels*. Matt is also the co-director of Foreign Policy Generation––a group of young people working to develop a progressive foreign policy for the next generation.
> 
> He received his MA in International Peace & Security from the Department of War Studies at King’s College London, where he subsequently worked as a Research Assistant on nuclear deterrence and strategic stability. He also completed an internship with the Verification, Training and Information Centre (VERTIC) in London, where he focused on nuclear security and safeguards.
> 
> He is a Canadian, lives/works in Washington, Toronto.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Matt Korda
> 
> 
> Learn more about Matt @ the Federation of American Scientists
> 
> 
> 
> 
> fas.org



Obviously still a propaganda to western main stream. For example DF-41. The launcher number visible to them is 18 from the parade. With an assumption of carrying 3 warheads and a range of 12,000 km, they summarised that to be 54 warheads.


----------



## samsara

ozranger said:


> Obviously still a propaganda to western main stream. For example DF-41. The launcher number visible to them is 18 from the parade. With an assumption of carrying 3 warheads and a range of 12,000 km, they summarised that to be 54 warheads.


Those who read and think, know that the FAS is conducting propaganda works with such reports like this one.

*What's its motive and purpose* in this case is what the interesting part to discuss about

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## ZeEa5KPul

ozranger said:


> Obviously still a propaganda to western main stream. For example DF-41. The launcher number visible to them is 18 from the parade. With an assumption of carrying 3 warheads and a range of 12,000 km, they summarised that to be 54 warheads.


I really think Kristansen goes with 3 warheads on the DF-41 because that's the smallest number the word "multiple" in MIRV allows him to get away with. It's so widely accepted that the DF-41 is MIRVed that even Hans has to go along with it, so he has to have at least 2. I'm sure he'd love to say 2 warheads, but 2 doesn't quite make "multiple", but 3 does.

I'm willing to bet my house that this is as far as the thinking went. That's the whole logic right there.

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## Zarvan

LKJ86 said:


> YJ-18 & Type 052D DDG
> View attachment 693415
> 
> Via @舰船知识 from Weibo


Well I hope China comes up with 1500 to 2000 KM range land attack version of YJ 18. If it already doesn't exist. Which I hope does exist.


----------



## shanlung

ozranger said:


> Obviously still a propaganda to western main stream. For example DF-41. The launcher number visible to them is 18 from the parade. With an assumption of carrying 3 warheads and a range of 12,000 km, they summarised that to be 54 warheads.



Correct!

Only 3 nuclear warheads carried by each DF41

The other 7 warheads carry and deliver dim sum, wulung tea bags, General Tso sweet & sour chicken and cleaned pressed laundry from chink laundryman.



And please do not talk of nukes. China might well be the only country
with fully functional H Bombs
Chinese H Bombs are done to the YuMing configuration requiring very little maintenance.
Muricans do their H bombs to the Ulam Teller configuration needing lots of maintenances.

Each warhead needs to have about 200 milligrams of fresh tritium added every year. Here’s a pic showing W80s having their gas changed.








How many Murican H Bombs can go kaboom immediately? Not many.


*When China was still almost in stone age condition in 1960s, China still developed the Hydrogen Bomb 3.3 Mtons just 32 months in June 1967 after China first fission bomb. China was using teams of Chinese working away at abacus as they had no computers or even electronic calculators then.*

*We all know China is a lot more advanced since the mid 60s.

US intelligence projection made late in the 1960s that China would have 435 nuclear weapons by 1973.
Karber’s report mentioned that “PRC data in 1995 gave the figure at 2,350.”*

*We all know China is a lot more advanced since 1995.*

Why You Should Fear China's Nuclear Weapons

Underground Great Wall of China - Wikipedia

And remember the DF5s and DF31AG as well. About 100 or more of them, mirving 10 nukes or more.
China has at least three brigades of DF-5 missiles. Assuming all three brigades have been modernized, that's 360 thermonuclear warheads with a half-megaton on each warhead.
3 brigades DF-5B ICBM x 12 missiles per brigade x 10 MIRVs per missile = 360 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-5B ICBMs









DF-5B got throw weight of 5,000 kgs
In 2017, China successfully completed tests of DF-5C. Presumably with greater throw weight and greater accuracy in targetting.

7 brigades DF-31A ICBM (since 2007 introduction and adding one brigade per year) x 12 missiles per brigade x 3 MIRVs = 252 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-31A ICBMs (assuming NO RELOAD missile per TEL; if you assume ONE reload missile per TEL then you double the number of warheads to 504 thermonuclear warheads).

Since then, China tested and got operational DF31AG and DF31B. Obviously able to throw more warheads than the DF31A. The DF31s are solid fuel and can fire within 3 to 5 minutes.

And the H-6K bombers. H-6K can carry up to six YJ-12 and 6-7 ALCMs; and air launched missiles (CH-AS-X-13)
As at 2015, there are 15 numbers of H-6Ks, and 150 numbers of assorted H-6s.
Using just H-6Ks, there will be need for 15X10 , or 150 thermonuclear bombs.
2015 is 5 years ago. You can be sure there will be even more numbers of H-6K, and even more advanced bombers being build by China.

DF-41 - Wikipedia

*The Dong Feng 41* (CSS-X-10) is a road- and rail-mobile intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM). The DF-41 completed all testing stages and deployed in the People’s Republic of China (PRC) since 2017. It is estimated to have an operational range of 12,000 to 15,000 km, which would make it the longest range missile in operation. It will likely have a top speed of Mach 25 and will be capable of delivering up to 10 MIRVed warheads. Throw weight of DF-41 is 2,500 kg.

The DF-41 is a three-stage solid-fueled intercontinental ballistic missile reported to have a maximum range of up to 15,000 kilometers (more than 9320 miles) and a top speed of Mach 25 (19,030 mph). It is said to be capable of carrying up to 10 multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle (MIRVs). Its launch preparation time is estimated to be between 3 to 5 minutes.

*This would make the DF-41 the world's longest range missile, surpassing the range of the US **LGM-30 Minuteman* *which has a reported range of 13,000 km. Throw weight of LGM-30 is only 1000kg or just 3 numbers of 170kton nukes. USA UGM-133 Trident II throw weight is only 2,800 kg.*



Four brigades of DF-41 ICBMs (Heilongjiang, Henan, Xinjiang, and Tibet Provinces) with one re-load per DF-41 TEL yields 96 total DF-41 ICBMs.
*How many brigades of DF-41 since 2017 number of 4 brigades?
6 Brigades or 8 Brigades?*









Reported DF-41 Deployment: China 'Responding to US Missile Defense in Asia'
Expert: DF-41 among most advanced missiles in the world


If China got only 260 thermonukes like what everyone is saying and hoping, the surplus warheads will be delivering dim sum and tea bags and cleaned pressed laundry from Chinese laundrymen.

_Please remember DF-41 got a very big brother coming up as well in case you think DF-41 not worthy enough to deliver dim sum and tea bags and cleaned laundry.
Russia’s RS-28 “Sarmat” ten-ton payload, rated as the most dangerous ICBM . Reportedly it may carry up to fifteen 350 kiloton warheads, or up to twenty-four of the new “Avangard” nuclear-armed Hypersonic Glide Vehicle (HGV) warheads. Sarmat will be dwarfed by Chinese new missile with even larger twenty-ton payload. That will be solid-fuel space-launch vehicle (SLV), and could form the basis for what might become the world’s largest “mobile” ICBM._
_The Next China Military Threat: The World's Biggest Mobile ICBM?_


*SSBNs
Type 094 Jin Class SSBN*

Currently 6 of type 094 but projected to be 8 in years to come.
Carrying 12 numbers of JL-2, mirving 3–4 thermonuclear warheads.
Or 288 nuclear warheads

*Type 096 Tang Class SSBN*
This is similar to Ohio Class

Carrying 24 JL-3 missiles , each mirving 5–7 warheads.
Currently, 6 numbers of 096 SSBNs are being build simultaneously.
Using 6x24x5, we have 720 thermonuclear warheads.

Or at least 1000 nukes can be delivered by China.
Or the warheads delivered are empty. Or used to deliver dim sums, General Tso chicken, wulung tea bags and cleaned laundry by Chink laundrymen, express delivery.

If China is ever turned into a nuclear wasteland, those that send nukes into China will be nuked into glowing and molten multicolored wasteland.

China promised never to use the first nuke. But if just one nuke land on China or her forces, *ALL THE USA BASES FROM EUROPE, DIEGO GARCIA , SINGAPORE . JAPAN AND USA HERSELF WILL BE SEAS AND LAKES OF MOLTEN MULTI COLOR GLASS.
None of the USA carriers will be spared. The carriers will be taken out with nukes even if the carriers hide in Frisco Bay or in the Atlantic Ocean or any other ocean.*

And as demonstrated so clearly in KSA a few days ago, the Aegis and Patriot systems defending Saudi a joke as the Aegis and Patriot cannot even detect a few sub Mach cruise missiles not to talk of taking them down. Even to now, no one sure where those came from and who flown them. Despite overlapping coverage of those Patriot and Aegis systems.
New sales pitch? US makes the world’s ‘finest’ anti-air systems, but sometimes they just don’t work, Pompeo explains
Saudi air defenses like Patriot & Aegis don’t match their advertised properties, unfit for real combat – Russian Army (MAP)








How will the Patriot systems in USA defend against ICBMs coming in at speed of Mach 25 when they cannot even detect missiles at sub Mach or even know where the missiles came from despite overlapping coverage?

Allies of the country that nuke China will not go unpunished as well. Whether they could not stop USA or do not want to stop USA or USA do not want to listen to them will be irrelevant to China.
A nuked China will be very very weak. And China recalled the days where the British and French and Japan and USA came to carve her up when China was weak.
*China will not allow that to happen again. China will ensure those countries will be weaker than a nuked China, or exist only in name (Japan) after a nuked China*

So please let peace prevail and it is irrelevant whether you think China only got 260 nukes
The lucky ones will be those that die in the first micro second.
Those still alive a year later will wish they gone at the very beginning.

And why the war fought or even started, no one will give a flying **** as to the reasons.










Even so, China never ever threatened to use nukes. Other than if nuke used on China, China will retaliate and use nukes as well.

*So please be peaceful and respectful and more courtesy, and no more phony FONOPs and playing games of who will blink with China with phony FONOPs. Do not play with fire regarding Taiwan. AND DO NOT THREATEN TO NUKE CHINA.*

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## juj06750

samsara said:


> LATEST UPDATE - CHINA NUKE WARHEAD COUNT -- *FAS VERSION* December 2020 edition:
> 
> From Matt Korda @mattkorda on 2020.12.10:
> 
> _Our 2020 overview of China's nuclear forces is out _
> _@BulletinAtomic, w/ estimates by @nukestrat and myself:
> 
> Bomb 350 warheads (~270 operational; >DoD's # b/c we include warheads for incoming weapons)
> 
> for delivery by:
> - Rocket 240 land-based missiles
> - Airplane 20 gravity bombs_
> _- Motor boat 48 SLBMs_
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1337076484440264708


again; samsara, please ignore baseless western report; I guess the canadian still lives in 1980s; we NO LONGER use single warhead ICBM; simply, each chinese DF41 missile, the world's biggest TEL based ICBM, has 10-12 nuclear warheads; at least over hundred of DF41 missiles are deployed, thus simply counting thousands of nuclear warheads all-time-ready by now; also, note that US is officially asking China to join START treaty between US and russia since US is currently suspecting about numbers of chinese nuclear warheads (implying US does NOT believe official number of them)


Zarvan said:


> Well I hope China comes up with 1500 to 2000 KM range land attack version of YJ 18. If it already doesn't exist. Which I hope does exist.


Again I hope Pakistan pays in cash if it wants something from china; Pakistan always sounds like our arms is almost free

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## LKJ86

Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## Zarvan

juj06750 said:


> again; samsara, please ignore baseless western report; I guess the canadian still lives in 1980s; we NO LONGER use single warhead ICBM; simply, each chinese DF41 missile, the world's biggest TEL based ICBM, has 10-12 nuclear warheads; at least over hundred of DF41 missiles are deployed, thus simply counting thousands of nuclear warheads all-time-ready by now; also, note that US is officially asking China to join START treaty between US and russia since US is currently suspecting about numbers of chinese nuclear warheads (implying US does NOT believe official number of them)
> 
> Again I hope Pakistan pays in cash if it wants something from china; Pakistan always sounds like our arms is almost free


Nothing has been bought for free. Everything is being paid for. How about you learn facts before spewing BS.


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## juj06750

Zarvan said:


> Nothing has been bought for free. Everything is being paid for. How about you learn facts before spewing BS.


Nothing has been bought in cash. Everything is being paid on enormous credit only; and pakistan still keeps asking for another deals on big credit; not only our arms but also highway, subway, sea port; now pakistan is even asking chinese serial cash on credit; How about you and other pakistani learn stunning facts of the relationship between pakistan and china.

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## LKJ86

HJ-10











Via @北疆卫士号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## 52051

Currently China have 2 kind of nuclear warhead in service.

One type is 650k TNT @360KG
The other type is 100-150k TNT @100-120KG

Judging by the payload of DF-41 (less than 2000 kg) @14,0000 km range, apart from decoys, countermeasures and engines, DF-41 can at most carry 2 650k TNT warheads or 5-6 100-150k TNT warheads.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @南部战区 from Weixin

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## samsara

From OedoSoldier @OedoSoldier on 2020.12.28:

_*PLA Rocket Force - The exercise of the 'Dongfeng First Brigade',
DF-5B ICBM launch scene was publicized for the very first time* (started around 1:57)._


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1343577016080068609

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM




Via @亮剑东南 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 701749
> View attachment 701750
> View attachment 701751
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


*火箭军：群英托起“倚天剑”*


http://www.js7tv.cn/video/202012_237879.html



_*PLA Rocket Force： The heroes hold up the “Heavenly Sword”*_

JS7TV.CN - 军事视频 军事新闻 - 中国军视网 最大的军事视频网站

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## IblinI

Happy new year with first aerial view of DF-17

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## LKJ86



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## siegecrossbow

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 701942
> 
> View attachment 701943

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## shanlung

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 701942
> 
> View attachment 701943





That missile was aiming for the window on the left!

It missed! 

😭😭😭

Accuracy must be improved with Beidou 3!

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 701942
> 
> View attachment 701943


HAPPY NEW YEAR 2021 PDFers!

From OedoSoldier @OedoSoldier on 2020.12.31:

_*PLA Rocket Force ‘Cruise Missile 1st Brigade’ CJ-10A training scene*_


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1344581742254911488
_The CJ-10A is a land-attack cruise missile (LACM) with a range of __more than 1,500 km_

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 701749
> View attachment 701750
> View attachment 701751
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


*Some active collection of the PLA Rocket Force: DF-15B - DF-16 - DF-31A - DF-21D - DF-26*

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

_*On the hypersonic missile DF-17:*_

From Hao Gao @HaoGao12 on 2020.12.30:

_*Two night vision lens enable the driver to drive at night without turning on the headlights, avoiding air reconnaissance*_


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1344184861242769408
A couple more with pics at this thread:

• _Training Simulator_

• _VR simulation_ is used in training that allows operators to familiarize the mechanical structure and repair of the TEL.

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## IblinI

Df-17

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## LKJ86



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## vi-va

LKJ86 said:


>


I think this is the first time reveal details of DF-5.

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## Beast

vi-va said:


> I think this is the first time reveal details of DF-5.


Doesnt look like DF-5B has refuel delay problem.. And looks very mobile which can setup in wild and fire off.

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


_*The short footage of the 5th anniversary of the PLA Rocket Force :: 2016-01-01 ~ 2021-01-01*_

※ _*Pursue the ultimate goal of reducing the launch time by nearly one third.*_

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## LKJ86

HQ-17/A SAM

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## LKJ86

Via @苹果酱79 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM
















Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM







Via @南陆一号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM










Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM
















Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## JSCh

*A brigade of the PLA Rocket Force carried out cross-regional drills during the New Year holiday.*
Jan 4, 2021
People's Daily, China 人民日报

In video: A brigade of the PLA Rocket Force carried out cross-regional drills during the New Year holiday.

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM





Via @北陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @铁肩重拳 from Weixin






Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## samsara

IblinI said:


> Df-17
> View attachment 702399
> 
> View attachment 702400



_China's transporter erector launcher (TEL), which carries and fires DF-17 hypersonic missiles, has received a stealth camouflaged cover that makes it more challenging for the US and allies to identify via reconnaissance satellites._

_TEL is a ground-based vehicle with an integrated prime mover (tractor unit) that can carry and elevate a DF-17 into a firing position. 

The upgraded TEL was spotted in a video celebrating the founding of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force last week and was published initially on the Chinese website 81.cn. _

_According to the video, the camouflaged missile transporter has a hypersonic missile encased inside a shell as it traverses desert terrain._ 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*China's DF-17 hypersonic missile seen to get stealth upgrade, reports show*

By Liu Xuanzun | Global Times
Published: Jan 04, 2021 08:23 PM





_A transporter erector launcher of a missile in a desert. Photo: Screenshot from 81.cn_

*One of China's most advanced weapons, the DF-17 hypersonic missile*, was seen in media reports to have received an UPGRADE that experts said on Monday can improve the weapon's capability to DISGUISE itself from hostile reconnaissance and protect itself from complicated battlefield environments.

*A previously unknown type of transporter erector launcher (TEL)* of a missile was spotted by military observers in a video celebrating the fifth founding anniversary of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force on Thursday (Dec. 31, 2020), released on 81.cn, the website of the PLA.

The TEL uses an integrated cover and encloses the missile within the camouflaged transporter as it runs on desert terrain, according to the video.

While the video did not specify the designation of the missile, Shanghai-based news website *EASTDAY.COM* identified it in a Saturday report as an *UPGRADED VERSION of the DF-17 hypersonic missile.*

According to the speculations in the eastday.com report, the upgraded version is the *COMPLETE FORM of the DF-17*. When the missile made its public debut at the National Day military parade in 2019, the DF-17 did not have the cover and exposed the whole missile on the back of the TEL.

Covering the missile can help the missile *disguise itself and protect it* from external environments, Song Zhongping, a Chinese military expert and TV commentator, told the Global Times on Monday.

The fully camouflaged TEL can make itself more difficult to be detected by hostile aerial or satellite reconnaissance, and the missile within will not be affected by harsh weather conditions or complicated battlefield environments, *as the road-mobile TEL traverses complicated terrains*, analysts said.

A separate report by China Central Television (CCTV) on Thursday said that a new type of missile TEL recently received additional equipment *so it can fully hide the missile within its cabin*.

The CCTV report also did not identify the designation of the missile, nor did it give a glimpse of the missile, but said the missile made its debut at the 2019 National Day military parade. This could be additional evidence that the missile is the DF-17, observers said. 

*The first PLA Rocket Force missile brigade equipped with this type of missile recently conducted a fire assault exercise, the CCTV report said, noting that this brigade is now ready for combat.*

_Reportedly equipped with a hypersonic glide vehicle as its warhead, the __*DF-17 is a short to medium-range missile against which the no current missile defense system can intercept*__, analysts said._






China's DF-17 hypersonic missile seen to get stealth upgrade, reports show - Global Times







www.globaltimes.cn

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## LKJ86

Via @高原战士 from Weixin

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## kungfugymnast

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17/A SAM



China made Tor SA-15 Gauntlet?

Just done reading details found on google. It should be way better than original Russian Tor system with ability to interlink detection from other radars to counter low flying drone that could easily hide between uneven mountainous terrain such as in Armenia but would still require radar in the air.

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## LKJ86

Via @80强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中部战区发布 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


驰骋万里 仗剑天疆 中国火箭军2021年形象大片完整版发布！展示硬核力量！「逐梦青春」| 军迷天下

PLARF 2021 Promotional Video (PV) - Galloping thousands of miles battle、 holding the sword to heaven - showing hard core force! 20210110

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

YJ-18 AShM




Via @兵器知识读者服务 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


>

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


>

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## LKJ86

Via @海军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


>

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


>

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## JSCh

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1350488581987594243

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## Deino

JSCh said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1350488581987594243




Any idea what missile this is?


----------



## ozranger

Deino said:


> Any idea what missile this is?


As indicated in subtitles it was a YJ-83 target missile for testing HQ-10 SAM intercepts. I guess for some unknown reason the rocket booster detached from the missile earlier than expected. The remaining fuel drove the rocket booster into a vertical climb and then turned horizontal randomly until all the fuel ran out. The missile was actually flying in desired direction with its turbo jet engine but looked invisible in the clip as the video's graphic resolution and contrast are too low.

Don't get confused on the ending scene in which the missile hit a ship. Someone put 2 unrelated clips together. The original video shows a HQ-10 SAM intercepted the YJ-83 successfully.

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## vi-va

Deino said:


> Any idea what missile this is?



Alleged JY-83, actually what we seen is the rocket booster, the YJ-83 turbojet is harder to be seen.



http://t.cn/A65PvrMJ?m=4592914229364921&u=7073308386

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## siegecrossbow

Interpretation of the booster as some sort of super maneuverable missile is pretty cringe. Why would it be maneuvering right after takeoff?


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## samsara

siegecrossbow said:


> Interpretation of the booster as some sort of super maneuverable missile is pretty cringe. Why would it be maneuvering right after takeoff?


Some netizen asked similar question as yours about the JY-83, which was explained that _such large-angle manoeuvre right after launch is intended to avoid the launch position being tracked by radar._

Or other thought, in this demonstration flight they *just showed us at the beginning *what the missile could also do at the end stage of manoeuvring, employing a kind of large-angle movement, which is a nightmare for terminal defense.

Other pointed out that such manoeuvre might in particular put in test the computing power of the terminal defense system, making the missile more difficult to intercept (missile prediction calculation).

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM










Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## shanlung

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/mil...es-success-latest-anti-missile-intercept-test 🇨🇳🇨🇳🇨🇳 *WANG SUI WANG WANG SUI 萬歲 萬 萬歲*🇨🇳🇨🇳🇨🇳

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## samsara

shanlung said:


> https://www.scmp.com/news/china/mil...es-success-latest-anti-missile-intercept-test 🇨🇳🇨🇳🇨🇳 *WANG SUI WANG WANG SUI 萬歲 萬 萬歲*🇨🇳🇨🇳🇨🇳


“But to be honest, China’s midcourse anti-ballistic technology still can’t knock down nuclear missiles from the United States and Russia, as there is still a gap between the PLA and the two nuclear giants.”

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## Deino

samsara said:


> “But to be honest, China’s midcourse anti-ballistic technology still can’t knock down nuclear missiles from the United States and Russia, as there is still a gap between the PLA and the two nuclear giants.”



Oh well ... is there anyone out there who takes the SCMP seriously??

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM














Via @中部战区号角 from Weixin

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## juj06750

samsara said:


> “But to be honest, China’s midcourse anti-ballistic technology still can’t knock down nuclear missiles from the United States and Russia, as there is still a gap between the PLA and the two nuclear giants.”


"But to be honest, US midcourse anti-ballistic technology still can't knock down nuclear missiles from China, Russia, or others because it has NEVER proved high reliability of such technology; please NOTE that so far any country NEVER assures creditbility of ABM system; the capability of such system is still uncertain although it is deployed; meanwhile, China further deployed highly maneuverable and hypersonic missiles, which are almost impossible to intercept in flight; and China developed anti-ballistic missiles with the most advanced kinetic kill technology after US, also meaning ahead of russia."


----------



## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM






















Via @西南雄师号 from Weixin

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## Zarvan

China successfully conducted a land-based, mid-course antiballistic missile (ABM) technical test on February 4 in a move experts said showed China's mastery of the technology as the country's antiballistic missile system gradually matures and becomes more reliable. Liu Xuanzun reports in Global Times.
*Follow Army Recognition on Google News at this link*





*An HQ-16 medium-range air-defense missile system attached to an air defense brigade under the PLA 77th Group Army launched a rocket into the air at a military shooting range in desert area in late August, 2020. (Picture source : eng.chinamil.com.cn/Hu yonghui)*

China conducted the test within its border, and the test reached the desired objective, the country's Ministry of National Defense announced on Thursday in a statement. It was the fifth land-based ABM technical test China has publicly announced and the fourth land-based, mid-course ABM technical test publicly known.

Mid-course is the most vital phase in the interception of a ballistic missile, and a mid-course ABM means to intercept the missile while it is in its free flight phase outside of the atmosphere, Song Zhongping, a Chinese military expert and TV commentator, told the Global Times on February 4. While the duration of the mid-course phase is relatively long, the great difficulty of an interception lies in the high trajectory, Song said, noting that the target of interception is usually intermediate-range or intercontinental ballistic missile.

China has already mastered the mid-course ABM system, and conducting the latest test shows that the system is becoming mature, and the success rate and reliability of interceptions are increasing significantly, which is very important for China to build a complete ABM system, Song said.

The flight of a ballistic missile usually consists of three phases in time order: boost phase in which the rocket booster will power the missile into sky, mid-course phase in which the booster stops as the missile traverses outside of the atmosphere, and reentry or terminal phase in which the missile reenters the atmosphere and dives on its target.

It's technically easy to intercept a ballistic missile in the boost phase, because the missile is still close to the ground and accelerating, but it is difficult to get close to the launch site which is usually deep in hostile territory; in terminal phase, the interception is challenging because the speed of the diving missile is very high, observers said.

Known ABM tests were carried out by China previously in 2010, 2013, 2014 and 2018, according to media reports and official statements.

China performs successful mid-course antiballistic missile test | Defense News February 2021 Global Security army industry | Defense Security global news industry army year 2021 | Archive News year (armyrecognition.com)

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

Zarvan said:


> China successfully conducted a land-based, mid-course antiballistic missile (ABM) technical test on February 4 in a move experts said showed China's mastery of the technology as the country's antiballistic missile system gradually matures and becomes more reliable. Liu Xuanzun reports in Global Times.
> *Follow Army Recognition on Google News at this link*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *An HQ-16 medium-range air-defense missile system attached to an air defense brigade under the PLA 77th Group Army launched a rocket into the air at a military shooting range in desert area in late August, 2020. (Picture source : eng.chinamil.com.cn/Hu yonghui)*
> 
> China conducted the test within its border, and the test reached the desired objective, the country's Ministry of National Defense announced on Thursday in a statement. It was the fifth land-based ABM technical test China has publicly announced and the fourth land-based, mid-course ABM technical test publicly known.
> 
> Mid-course is the most vital phase in the interception of a ballistic missile, and a mid-course ABM means to intercept the missile while it is in its free flight phase outside of the atmosphere, Song Zhongping, a Chinese military expert and TV commentator, told the Global Times on February 4. While the duration of the mid-course phase is relatively long, the great difficulty of an interception lies in the high trajectory, Song said, noting that the target of interception is usually intermediate-range or intercontinental ballistic missile.
> 
> China has already mastered the mid-course ABM system, and conducting the latest test shows that the system is becoming mature, and the success rate and reliability of interceptions are increasing significantly, which is very important for China to build a complete ABM system, Song said.
> 
> The flight of a ballistic missile usually consists of three phases in time order: boost phase in which the rocket booster will power the missile into sky, mid-course phase in which the booster stops as the missile traverses outside of the atmosphere, and reentry or terminal phase in which the missile reenters the atmosphere and dives on its target.
> 
> It's technically easy to intercept a ballistic missile in the boost phase, because the missile is still close to the ground and accelerating, but it is difficult to get close to the launch site which is usually deep in hostile territory; in terminal phase, the interception is challenging because the speed of the diving missile is very high, observers said.
> 
> Known ABM tests were carried out by China previously in 2010, 2013, 2014 and 2018, according to media reports and official statements.
> 
> China performs successful mid-course antiballistic missile test | Defense News February 2021 Global Security army industry | Defense Security global news industry army year 2021 | Archive News year (armyrecognition.com)


2021年2月4日中国成功进行陆基中段反导试验






_*   Cool footage!* _ _On February 4, 2021, China successfully conducted the land-based midcourse antiballistic missile test_

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## vi-va

samsara said:


> 2021年2月4日中国成功进行陆基中段反导试验
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _*Cool footage!* On February 4, 2021, China successfully conducted the land-based midcourse antiballistic missile test_


Big love.


----------



## samsara

*Temstar* did a good work (also it took time aside from one's skills and insights to present it this way)  Here's an interesting read, incl. the original article at Guancha.

I'm sure many of us here recall the article penned by Hu Xijin (the editor-in-chief of the Global Times) last year about how China urgently need to increase warhead count into the thousands.

Yang Chengjun 杨承军, a retired member of PLARF Staff wrote this in response.

_*“Nuclear expert: Nuclear issues should not be hyped on the Internet”*_
*核专家：涉核问题不宜在网络上炒作 (2020-05-14)*


https://user.guancha.cn/main/content?id=307185



Aside from the line of "people not in this sensitive field should keep their opinions to themselves" at the start of the article, he unexpectedly revealed some interesting information about the rocket force:

*核武器质量*。注重对现役核武器的技术和材料更新，与核大国相比我们的核武器质量并不落后。
*Quality of nuclear weapons* - much attention is paid to maintenance and update of current deployed weapons, China's nuclear arsenal is not inferior to any other nuclear weapon state in quality.

*核武器数量*。在按照预定的规划、计划、根据国际核形势变化，科学确定发展数量，注重弥补服役期满的退役武器。
*Quantity of nuclear weapons* - number of weapons follow carefully calculated, science guided plans, with attention paid to international political situations. Special attention is paid to prompt replacement of any weapons reaching end of service life.

*生存能力。*基本阵地坑道、竖井的抗压强度可靠可信；当前重点发展的是能够实施机动作战型号。
*Survivability* - silo and bases are sufficiently hardened and reliable. Current focus is on developing mobile weapons

*反应时间。*已经从我刚刚入伍时的需要几天、数小时缩短到数分钟；能够在敌核武器落地前实施预警核反击。
*Response time* - when I (杨承军) first joined RF/2A response time was measured in days. It has gradually decreased to hours and now minutes. Now we are fully capable of carrying out launch on warning

*命中精度。*已经从当初的数公里误差，减小到百米以内，以最大限度的减少附带毁伤。
*Accuracy* - CEP use to be several kilometres, now it's within 100m. This ensures greatly reduced secondary destruction

*毁伤威力。*可以反击目标性质及幅员，选择不同威力和当量的战斗部。
*Yields* - warheads of different yields are available, to suit targets of different nature and area

*突防能力。*运用多弹头技术，及抗干扰、释放干扰、改变壳体形状及变轨滑翔技术等不断提升突防能力。
*Penetration* - MIRV, interference, anti-interference, variable geometry and glide re-entry capabilities continue to raise weapon's capability to penetrate defence

*协同保障。*军种内的各种技术协同、作战时的各项保障没有任何障碍。
*Joint forces *- different branches of the PLA are well capable of working as one, to ensure no issues in times of war

*生产能力和潜力*。我国核武器的并没有达到最大的生产量，具有强大的生产潜力。
*Production and strategic reserve* - China's nuclear weapon production has not reached peak capacity, vast amount of reserved production capability exist.


I don't think that Hu and Yang are fighting it out with words in the media in this case. Rather I think they are working together to get the words out to those who need to hear it.

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## GumNaam

China conducts mid-course antiballistic missile test, system 'becomes more mature, reliable' - Global Times







www.globaltimes.cn








looks like india's agni deterrent just got flushed down the toilet!

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## siegecrossbow

GumNaam said:


> China conducts mid-course antiballistic missile test, system 'becomes more mature, reliable' - Global Times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.globaltimes.cn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 713977
> 
> looks like india's agni threat just went down the toilet!



I doubt even the Indians know where the Agni missiles would land after launch. How the heck do you intercept them?

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## ozranger

Quite likely to be HGV intercept test.

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @陆军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @ 西部空天 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @刀尖舞者 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @兵工科技 from Weixin

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## 52051

Here, someone discussed that satellite map revealed that China is building about 16 new silo in innner monoglia.

Hope they are for the upcoming silo-based heavy ICBM DF-45.

疑似我国在内蒙古兴建16个发射井（？？？）-航天及新概念武器-超级大本营军事论坛-最具影响力军事论坛 - (cjdby.net)

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## bshifter

52051 said:


> Here, someone discussed that satellite map revealed that China is building about 16 new silo in innner monoglia.
> 
> Hope they are for the upcoming silo-based heavy ICBM DF-45.
> 
> 疑似我国在内蒙古兴建16个发射井（？？？）-航天及新概念武器-超级大本营军事论坛-最具影响力军事论坛 - (cjdby.net)


DF-45? name already confirmed?


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## 52051

bshifter said:


> DF-45? name already confirmed?



Obviously it is just a name around in the internet

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## samsara

52051 said:


> Here, someone discussed that satellite map revealed that China is building about 16 new silo in innner monoglia.
> 
> Hope they are for the upcoming silo-based heavy ICBM DF-45.
> 
> 疑似我国在内蒙古兴建16个发射井（？？？）-航天及新概念武器-超级大本营军事论坛-最具影响力军事论坛 - (cjdby.net)


疑似我国在内蒙古吉兰泰训练基地兴建16个发射井（？？？）





微博


随时随地发现新鲜事！微博带你欣赏世界上每一个精彩瞬间，了解每一个幕后故事。分享你想表达的，让全世界都能听到你的心声！




m.weibo.cn





_*It is suspected that China has built 16 launching silos in Jilantai Training Base in Inner Mongolia*_

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## onebyone

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1368190552710160385

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## onebyone

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1367810737029017601

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## JSCh

*Air-defense system ready for global sales*
By ZHAO LEI | CHINA DAILY | Updated: 2021-03-08 08:37



A HQ-17AE air-defense missile is fired during a recent test. [Photo provided to China Daily]

China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, the country's top missile maker, has brought a new high-mobility air-defense missile system to the international market.

Developed by the CASIC Second Academy in Beijing, China's leading manufacturer of air-defense weapons, each HQ-17AE unit consists of one six-wheeled launch vehicle, eight short-range air-defense missiles and a solid-state phased-array radar system.

It can detect and intercept multiple targets and also has good mobility, which means it is an ideal option for forward-deployed ground forces' air-defense operations, the academy said.

Designers said the system is capable of detecting and bringing down all types of air threats including stealth fighter jets, helicopters, combat drones and cruise missiles that enter its defensive perimeter.

The launch vehicle can travel at speeds of up to 90 kilometers per hour and can fire missiles while moving at speeds of up to 25 km/h, designers said, adding that its strike range for incoming fighter jets ranges from 15 km to 20 km.

Yu Benshui, an air-defense missile expert at the CASIC Second Academy, said that each HQ-17AE launch vehicle can simultaneously handle four incoming targets while its predecessors can only deal with one target at a time.

"The missile system can rapidly respond to incoming threats and can fit in complicated battlefield situations. The HQ-17AE is five times more combat capable than its predecessors," said Yu, who is also an academician at the Chinese Academy of Engineering.

Chinese weapons observers believe the HQ-17AE is the export version of the HQ-17A, the latest air-defense weapon for the People's Liberation Army Ground Force, which was also developed by the CASIC Second Academy. CASIC has not confirmed the link between the two types.

The HQ-17A was first shown to the public during the National Day parade in Beijing in October 2019 that marked the 70th anniversary of the founding of the People's Republic of China.

Before the HQ-17AE, CASIC had provided its FM-3000 short-to-medium-range air-defense missile system to the global market, saying it was a good choice for any buyer seeking an effective, reliable and affordable air-defense system.

Designers said the FM-3000 is particularly suitable for defense against precision-guided munitions such as air-to-ground tactical missiles and laser-guided bombs, adding it can be used to safeguard strategically important regions such as national capitals or places with key assets.

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## lcloo

From East Pendulum/ Henry K's tweeter. "HQ-19, an Artist's impression."




HQ-19 is the new generation long range air defence missile capable of ABM, it is based on HQ9 and has been improved vastly to justiy a different class designation.

Chinese SAM designation usually follows the practice of adding sequantial number infront of previous generation missile.

Example, HQ2 - first generation
HQ12 - 2nd generation
HQ22 - 3rd generation.



*HQ-9*_ – TVM version SAM._
_*HHQ-9* — Naval version.[19]_
_*HQ-9A* — Upgraded version, first tested in 1999 and service entry in 2001.[19] Chinese sources claim that the HQ-9 family of systems employ much newer computing technology than imported Russian S-300PMU/PMU1/PMU2 systems, because HQ-9 is developed more than a decade later, thus allowing it to incorporate advancement in microelectronics. Due to the superior computing capability for signal processing, data processing and guidance support, this missile can have an optional semi-active radar homing (SARH) mode, because more info can be processed on board the missile itself._
_*HHQ-9A* — Ship-borne naval version of HQ-9A. Eight 6-cell vertical launch silos, of cylindrical shape and using "cold launch" method, mounted on the Type 052C destroyer (48 missiles in total).[20]_
_*HQ-9B* — reportedly tested in February 2006.[19] According to Jane's Information Group, this missile has a dual seeker that incorporates both SARH & infrared homing mode[21]_
_*HQ-9C* – Currently under development, incorporating active radar homing mode. Range reported to be 400km._
_*HQ-19 – A vastly upgraded version of HQ-9 to counter ballistic missile and satellites (ASAT) on the lower end of Low Earth orbits, and it is the Chinese equivalent of THAAD.[22] HQ-19 is armed with a dual purpose exosphere kinetic kill vehicle (kkv) warhead designed by a team led by Professor Zhou Jun (周军), which can be used against ballistic missile warheads or satellites.[23] Its first flight occurred in 2003; since then, the missile has conducted several other tests, including one on 1 November 2015.[24]*_*[25]*

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## T-55

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1365968644413530114

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## LeGenD

GumNaam said:


> China conducts mid-course antiballistic missile test, system 'becomes more mature, reliable' - Global Times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.globaltimes.cn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 713977
> 
> looks like india's agni deterrent just got flushed down the toilet!


Mapping of this test by the French for reference:







That is THAAD level demonstration - very impressive.

China should make a footage similar to that of MDA for general viewership IMHO; this is better for sending a message across.

*HQ-19* is a massive leap from *HQ-9* it seems.

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## samsara

JSCh said:


> *Air-defense system ready for global sales*
> By ZHAO LEI | CHINA DAILY | Updated: 2021-03-08 08:37
> 
> 
> 
> A HQ-17AE air-defense missile is fired during a recent test. [Photo provided to China Daily]
> 
> China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, the country's top missile maker, has brought a new high-mobility air-defense missile system to the international market.
> 
> Developed by the CASIC Second Academy in Beijing, China's leading manufacturer of air-defense weapons, each HQ-17AE unit consists of one six-wheeled launch vehicle, eight short-range air-defense missiles and a solid-state phased-array radar system.
> 
> It can detect and intercept multiple targets and also has good mobility, which means it is an ideal option for forward-deployed ground forces' air-defense operations, the academy said.
> 
> Designers said the system is capable of detecting and bringing down all types of air threats including stealth fighter jets, helicopters, combat drones and cruise missiles that enter its defensive perimeter.
> 
> The launch vehicle can travel at speeds of up to 90 kilometers per hour and can fire missiles while moving at speeds of up to 25 km/h, designers said, adding that its strike range for incoming fighter jets ranges from 15 km to 20 km.
> 
> Yu Benshui, an air-defense missile expert at the CASIC Second Academy, said that each HQ-17AE launch vehicle can simultaneously handle four incoming targets while its predecessors can only deal with one target at a time.
> 
> "The missile system can rapidly respond to incoming threats and can fit in complicated battlefield situations. The HQ-17AE is five times more combat capable than its predecessors," said Yu, who is also an academician at the Chinese Academy of Engineering.
> 
> Chinese weapons observers believe the HQ-17AE is the export version of the HQ-17A, the latest air-defense weapon for the People's Liberation Army Ground Force, which was also developed by the CASIC Second Academy. CASIC has not confirmed the link between the two types.
> 
> The HQ-17A was first shown to the public during the National Day parade in Beijing in October 2019 that marked the 70th anniversary of the founding of the People's Republic of China.
> 
> Before the HQ-17AE, CASIC had provided its FM-3000 short-to-medium-range air-defense missile system to the global market, saying it was a good choice for any buyer seeking an effective, reliable and affordable air-defense system.
> 
> Designers said the FM-3000 is particularly suitable for defense against precision-guided munitions such as air-to-ground tactical missiles and laser-guided bombs, adding it can be used to safeguard strategically important regions such as national capitals or places with key assets.


首次公开！中国新一代防空导弹HQ-17AE震撼亮相 实弹测试现场罕见曝光 4大突出性能揭秘 堪称最强野战防空“神器”！「军武零距离」20210306 | 军迷天下

本期节目主要内容：作为一款可伴随机械化部队作战的随行近程防空武器系统，HQ-17AE系统不但能有效拦截武装直升机、无人机、巡航导弹，而且还能拦截战术空地导弹、火箭弹等。本期节目我们走进靶场，去了解一款能够打造一道低空防御盾牌的国产防空导弹系统，并见证它进行实弹测试的现场。

For the first time! *China's new generation of air defense missile **HQ-17AE* appeared in live fire test site, rarely exposed four outstanding performance secrets, can be called the strongest field air defense "artifact"! 20210306

The main content of this program: as an *accompanying short-range air defense weapon system* that can accompany mechanized forces, the HQ-17AE system can not only effectively intercept armed helicopters, UAVs and cruise missiles, but also intercept tactical air-to-ground missiles and rockets. In this program, we go to the shooting range to learn about China's domestic air defense missile system that can build a low altitude defense shield, and witness its live fire test.






(about 26-min; No Engsub)

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## T-55

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1370003512411648000

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## samsara

More CGI artist impression images -- HQ-19 / HQ-26

From Caesar @Ninja998998 on 2021.03.11:



















__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1370003778523385865

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## samsara

*17 March 2021* -- some excerpts from the long & complex chained threads by *Thomas Shugart* @tshugart3 -- Former USN submariner and *Adjunct Senior Fellow at the Center for a New American Security* (CNAS) @cnasdc


Today I had the privilege of testifying to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee—along with
@LizEconomy and Saif Khan of @CSETGeorgetown —on the strategic competition with China (my focus being on the military balance in the Indo-Pacific region).

My overall assessment of the state of the regional military balance is that we're entering a PERIOD OF DEEP UNCERTAINTY, in contrast to the more favorable situation of the past, and also in contrast to where—absent significant changes in current trends—we seem headed.

The regional trends that concern me most are those related to China’s development of broader regional capabilities clearly intended to counter or deter a U.S. intervention to defend our allies and partners.

These counter-intervention capabilities are most visible in the form of China’s deployment of large numbers of capable precision-strike Intermediate Range Ballistic Missiles (IRBMs), its growing long-range bomber force, and its rapidly growing blue-water navy.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1372230193004249096

This previously-unpublished image, from the missile impact range in western China, shows what appears to be a mock target specifically designed to imitate a parked E-3 Sentry airborne early warning and control aircraft (AWACS).

IMO the use of a mock target to represent a specific U.S. aircraft type (no one else in the region operates them) may indicate the development of a warhead with the capability to recognize and home in on specific aircraft, rather than having to blanket an entire airfield.











__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1372230211178094595
It also provides yet another indicator that China's missile force is practicing, quite specifically, attacks on U.S. bases in the region. My colleague Javier Gonzalez and I talked about this in detail in our report "First Strike" in 2017:

JUNE 28, 2017








First Strike: China's Missile Threat to U.S. Bases in Asia


Developing strong, pragmatic and principled national security and defense policies.




www.cnas.org






*What is the Center for a New American Security (CNAS)?

Source of Funding*








CNAS Supporters


Developing strong, pragmatic and principled national security and defense policies.




www.cnas.org








Project for the New American Century (PNAC)
American Enterprise Institute (AEI)
Heritage Foundation

*Think Tanks and Influence on US Foreign Policy: The People and the Ideas*


https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/1039265.pdf



AEI American Enterprise Institute (for Public Policy Research)
APRC Asia Pacific Research Center
CAP Center for American Progress
CEIP Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
CFR Council on Foreign Relations
CNP Center for National Policy
CNAS Center for a New American Security
CSIS Center for Strategic and International Studies
CSP Center for Security Policy
DLC Democratic Leadership Council
FPI Foreign Policy Initiative
IISS International Institute for Security Studies
PNAC Project for the New American Century
PPI Progressive Policy Institute
TTCSP Think Tanks and Civil Societies Program
USIP United States Institute of Peace

From the past thread (Sep 2020):

BTW, I've heard some folks doubt publicly whether the PLA Rocket Force *can actually hit a moving target at sea*. For at least the 2nd year in a row, the report states flat out that the *DF-26 "is capable" of conducting strikes against naval targets*. Pretty strong language IMO.







__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1300861959286353921
More:

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1300845648594399232
Thread by @tshugart3: Ok, folks. The 2020 China Military Power report is out! Here are a few thoughts on some of the interesting tidbits (IMO): media.defense.gov/…








Thread by @tshugart3: Ok, folks. The 2020 China Military Power report is out! Here are a few thoughts on some of the interesting tidbits (IMO): media.defense.gov/…


Thread by @tshugart3: Ok, folks. The 2020 China Military Power report is out! Here are a few thoughts on some of the interesting tidbits (IMO): media.defense.gov/2020/Sep/01/20… First up: overall size of the PLAN. Folks will debate whether the PLAN is the "large…




threadreaderapp.com






A Thread from @tshugart3: "A few thoughts on tonnage: There's been wide discussion recently on the size of the Chinese Navy, largely [...]" (Sep 2020)








Threader - Good threads every day


Welcome to Threader, a place to read and discover stories and knowledge from Twitter. Get a selection of good threads every day.




threader.app

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM







Via @亮剑东南 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @兵工科技 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @枕戈观澜 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM




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## LKJ86

Via @34号军事室 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM



















Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-16A SAM

















Via @铁肩重拳 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM




Via @人民画报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HHQ-9B SAM & Type 052D DDG




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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HHQ-9B SAM & Type 052D DDG 




Via 张海龙

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM
















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @铁肩重拳 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM













Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-10 SAM & Type 052D DDG




Via 张海龙

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via @亮剑东南 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16 SAM & Type 054A FFG

























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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


大批防空武器“亮剑”大漠！红旗-16 道尔-M1 双35高炮各显神通 直击解放军防空演练全过程！「军事纪实」20210520 | 军迷天下

A large number of anti-aircraft weapons “Bright Sword” desert! HQ-16 ??-M1 twin 35-mm anti-aircraft cannon to show their magic powers to directly hit the whole process of the PLA Air Defense drill! "Military documentary" | 20210520

I am confused with the exact type denomination, thus ?? -- 8'20'' No-Engsub

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


>


The new HQ-17AE is amazing, and the 'E' notation may mean model for export, thus the domestic version should be better. It can shoot while on the move.

The HQ-17AE is the latest model of the "Flying Mongoose" family of short-range air-defense (SHORAD) system developed by the Second Academy of the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation (CASIC). It is designed to counter precision-guided munitions such as cruise missiles, guided bombs and air-to-surface missiles.

The HQ-17AE is armed with eight surface-to-air missiles (SAMs) that are vertically cold-launched before their rocket motors are ignited. The vehicle can move at speed up to 90 kph and can remain fully ready to engage up to four threats simultaneously.


Another longer footage but no Engsub!

首次公开！中国新一代防空导弹HQ-17AE震撼亮相 实弹测试现场罕见曝光 4大突出性能揭秘 堪称最强野战防空“神器”！「军武零距离」20210306 | 军迷天下

本期节目主要内容：作为一款可伴随机械化部队作战的随行近程防空武器系统，HQ-17AE系统不但能有效拦截武装直升机、无人机、巡航导弹，而且还能拦截战术空地导弹、火箭弹等。本期节目我们走进靶场，去了解一款能够打造一道低空防御盾牌的国产防空导弹系统，并见证它进行实弹测试的现场。






*LAUNCH ON THE MOVE*

_China's New Generation of Air Defense Missile *HQ-17AE *in Live firing test, first coverage, exposing its outstanding performance, can be called among the strongest field air defense systems.

The main content of this program: as an accompanying short-range air defense weapon (SHORAD) system that can accompany mechanized forces, HQ-17AE system can not only effectively intercept armed helicopters, UAVs and cruise missiles, but also intercept tactical air to ground missiles and rockets. In this program, we go to the shooting range to learn about China's air defense missile system that can build a low altitude defense shield, and witness its live fire test._

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM










Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM













Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM







Via @亮剑东南 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @南部空军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @兵器知识杂志 from Weixin

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## Abid123

The DF-41 is one bad-a-s-s missile!


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## Deino

Abid123 said:


> The DF-41 is one bad-a-s-s missile!




But that's not the DF-41

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## Abid123

Deino said:


> But that's not the DF-41


Where did I say that picture above was the DF-41? Cant you see properly? I am aware that a MIRV ICBM does not look like that😂😂😂 I mentioned the DF-41 because this is a thread about chinese missiles.

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## Zarvan

"]https://www.globaltimes.cn/Portals/...5d09ee-5284-4417-a401-2757770adc93.jpeg[/IMG]
File photo taken on Sept. 3, 2015 shows DF-26 missiles attending a military parade in Beijing, capital of China. (Xinhua)



The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force recently conducted a series of exercises with the "aircraft carrier killer" DF-26 ballistic missile at night, and while related techniques are challenging, they can bring many advantages on the battlefield, experts said on Wednesday.

A missile brigade affiliated with the PLA Rocket Force recently organized an exercise at midnight, featuring training courses like multi-wave mock fire strike and transferring and loading of missiles, China National Radio reported on Tuesday.

After launching a first wave of missile strikes, the troops received orders to relocate, reload and start a second wave of strikes. The drills also simulated a hostile attack on a launch position, and the troops had to maneuver to a backup launch location.

The missiles featured in the exercise were DF-26s, report footage shows.

Reloading requires troops to be accurate and shorten the time as much as possible despite low visibility at night to win more opportunities for succeeding maneuvers and fire strikes, as well as to increase survivability on the battlefield, Sergeant Deng Kuan, a missile loading operator at the brigade, was quoted as saying.

"We have been holding night exercises on a regular basis recently, which usually lasted past midnight. They featured the random changes of launch positions and targets, consecutive fire strikes and relocations," Colonel Jiang Feng, the deputy commander of the brigade, told China National Radio.

The exercise put the troops' operational skills to a test and honed their combat capability at night, the report said.

Night launches are more challenging than in the day due to lower visibility, and artificial light must be controlled to a low level in order not to expose the launch position, Fu Qianshao, a Chinese military aviation expert, told the Global Times on Wednesday.

It is particularly more challenging for the DF-26, which is designed to also attack moving targets including warships in addition to attacking stationary targets like normal ballistic missiles, Fu said, noting that it would take more advanced reconnaissance and tracking systems to detect a moving target at night and accurately guide the missile to it.

But challenges are the same from the receiving end, as it is also more difficult to intercept a missile and launch a counterattack at night, Fu said.

"Under complex battlefield situations, mastering more tactics and techniques means more chances to gain initiatives to win," Fu said.

PLA Rocket Force practices night DF-26 missile launch - Global Times

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## samsara

Zarvan said:


> "]https://www.globaltimes.cn/Portals/...5d09ee-5284-4417-a401-2757770adc93.jpeg[/IMG]
> File photo taken on Sept. 3, 2015 shows DF-26 missiles attending a military parade in Beijing, capital of China. (Xinhua)
> 
> 
> 
> The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Rocket Force recently conducted a series of exercises with the "aircraft carrier killer" DF-26 ballistic missile at night, and while related techniques are challenging, they can bring many advantages on the battlefield, experts said on Wednesday.
> 
> A missile brigade affiliated with the PLA Rocket Force recently organized an exercise at midnight, featuring training courses like multi-wave mock fire strike and transferring and loading of missiles, China National Radio reported on Tuesday.
> 
> After launching a first wave of missile strikes, the troops received orders to relocate, reload and start a second wave of strikes. The drills also simulated a hostile attack on a launch position, and the troops had to maneuver to a backup launch location.
> 
> The missiles featured in the exercise were DF-26s, report footage shows.
> 
> Reloading requires troops to be accurate and shorten the time as much as possible despite low visibility at night to win more opportunities for succeeding maneuvers and fire strikes, as well as to increase survivability on the battlefield, Sergeant Deng Kuan, a missile loading operator at the brigade, was quoted as saying.
> 
> "We have been holding night exercises on a regular basis recently, which usually lasted past midnight. They featured the random changes of launch positions and targets, consecutive fire strikes and relocations," Colonel Jiang Feng, the deputy commander of the brigade, told China National Radio.
> 
> The exercise put the troops' operational skills to a test and honed their combat capability at night, the report said.
> 
> Night launches are more challenging than in the day due to lower visibility, and artificial light must be controlled to a low level in order not to expose the launch position, Fu Qianshao, a Chinese military aviation expert, told the Global Times on Wednesday.
> 
> It is particularly more challenging for the DF-26, which is designed to also attack moving targets including warships in addition to attacking stationary targets like normal ballistic missiles, Fu said, noting that it would take more advanced reconnaissance and tracking systems to detect a moving target at night and accurately guide the missile to it.
> 
> But challenges are the same from the receiving end, as it is also more difficult to intercept a missile and launch a counterattack at night, Fu said.
> 
> "Under complex battlefield situations, mastering more tactics and techniques means more chances to gain initiatives to win," Fu said.
> 
> PLA Rocket Force practices night DF-26 missile launch - Global Times



*PLA Rocket Force recently conducted a series of exercises with the “aircraft carrier killer” DF-26 ballistic missile at night, and while related techniques are challenging, they can bring many advantages on the battlefield, experts said. *

09 JUNE 2021








PLA Rocket Force practices night DF-26 missile launch - Global Times







www.globaltimes.cn





VIDEO CLIP:

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1402647052509581313

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## ZeEa5KPul

samsara said:


> *PLA Rocket Force recently conducted a series of exercises with the “aircraft carrier killer” DF-26 ballistic missile at night, and while related techniques are challenging, they can bring many advantages on the battlefield, experts said. *
> 
> 09 JUNE 2021
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PLA Rocket Force practices night DF-26 missile launch - Global Times
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.globaltimes.cn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VIDEO CLIP:
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1402647052509581313


I wish they'd stop with the sh*tty _Pirates of the Caribbean_ music.

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## samsara

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 751656
> 
> Via @兵器知识杂志 from Weixin


Which missile is this one?


ZeEa5KPul said:


> I wish they'd stop with the sh*tty _Pirates of the Caribbean_ music.


Actually you can put in any BGM *to fit your personal likeness* if you're willing to spend some time to rework the video clip, or simply mute it

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## bshifter

samsara said:


> Which missile is this one?


Looks like DF-15B to me but the TEL is for DF-16


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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




















Via @亮剑东南 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM



















Via @西部空天 from Weixin

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## T-55

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1403774783515336704

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## samsara

T-55 said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1403774783515336704








Thread: 
Detailed shots of #China's ballistic missiles from my previous post with human models for comparison. 

Starting with the DF-31 family of missiles consisting of the DF-31,DF-31A,DF-31AG and its distant relative the DF-41 (left image). 

JL-2, DF-31 SLBM subvariant.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1404140941309464577
- The DF-26 which is a MaRV'ed IRBM with anti-ship capability
- The DF-21 family of MRBM's. DF-21X,DF-21C and DF-21D (left image) and DF-21A,JL-1 (right image)
- The DF-5A and DF-5B ICBMs which are both silo based are the largest ballistic missiles in China's arsenal.
- The DF-17 HGV and an unknown air launched hypersonic glide vehicle spotted on a PLAAF H-6 bomber in Oct 2020.
- DF-16 MRBM's
- The DF-15 family of SRBM's consisting of DF-15A, DF-15B and DF-15C
- The DF-11 family of SRBM's consisting of the DF-11, DF-11AZT and DF-11A
- DF-3A MRBM and DF-4 IRBM
- The DF-12 SRBM

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## LKJ86

HJ-10

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## LKJ86

HQ-17 SAM

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## JSCh

Shocked! A closer look at the launching process of the People’s Liberation Army’s Hongqi series air defense missiles.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

HQ-9 SAM




Via @西部空天 from Weibo


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo


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## FOOLS_NIGHTMARE

HQ-17 medium-altitude short-range surface-to-air missile vertical cold launch.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1416262304958664704

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM










Via www.81.cn

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## bahadur999

Interesting work here

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1418869808968388611


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## Polestar 2

FOOLS_NIGHTMARE said:


> HQ-17 medium-altitude short-range surface-to-air missile vertical cold launch.
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1416262304958664704


Seems like HQ-7 missile speed is much faster.

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## bahadur999

*

 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1422236431754399746*New SAM site. What type will it use?


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## Jamie Brooks



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## Deino

I must admit I'm a bit surprised since it was allegedly posted already by @siegecrossbow ... maybe I missed it during the holydays?!


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1429676492439658497


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## Jamie Brooks

Next-Generation wind tunnel development for testing new hypersonic glide vehicles, aircraft and missiles.
Wechat translation pls ignore any grammatical errors
*30倍声速！*

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## beijingwalker

*China's feverish missile frenzy*
Updated: Aug 23, 2021 14:39 IST

Hong Kong, August 23 (ANI): Militaristic China is prioritizing the mass deployment of ballistic missiles. The country has secretively engineered vast missile silo fields able to host nuclear weapons, has ramped up nuclear production and deployed new shorter-range missile types.

The People's Liberation Army Rocket Force (PLARF) controls China's ballistic-missile arsenal, and this includes vast silo fields currently under construction from which to launch intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBM).

To date, the open-source intelligence (OSINT) community has discovered three large missile silo sites deep inside China. The James Martin Center for Non-proliferation Studies at the Middlebury Institute of International Studies unearthed the first, an ICBM field of 120 silos near Yumen in the Gobi Desert, in late June.

Then, in July, Matt Korda and Hans Kristensen from the Federation of American Scientists announced the discovery of 110 missile silos near Hami in eastern Xinjiang.

The latest revelation on 12 August was by Roderick Lee from the China Aerospace Studies Institute, who uncovered a third silo field in Hanggin Banner in Inner Mongolia.

Construction on a grid layout similar to the other two had commenced by mid-May. Satellite imagery showed two clusters with 29 potential silos in total, of which 13 were sheltered by typical inflatable domes to cover sensitive construction details.

Lee estimated that the site would boast 30-36 silos at a minimum. Advantages of the Hanggin Banner site compared to Yumen and Hami are its proximity to ground-based fibre-optic communications nodes, and its shorter distance to the PLARF's central warhead handling and storage facility in Taibai County, Baoji.

Of course, it is not confirmed that every new silo will indeed house a DF-41 ICBM, for some could be decoys, and actual missiles could be rotated around silos in a kind of shell game.

Realistically, the DF-41 is unlikely to contain more than six nuclear warheads per missile. However, if each silo did house a DF-41, then China's projected inventory of ICBM launchers would equal the Minuteman-III ICBMs operationally deployed by the USA.
In addition, the PLA has nuclear missiles mounted on submarines and carried on H-6 bombers and on the future H-20 stealth bomber. These silo discoveries reinforce what the US military has been alluding to in recent years about the fast expansion of Chinese strategic nuclear forces.

Many doubted the Pentagon's assessment, but its descriptions have been well and truly vindicated.

Admiral Charles A. Richard, head of the US Strategic Command (STRATCOM), warned at the Space &amp; Missile Defense Symposium in Huntsville, Alabama earlier this month,

"The explosive growth in their nuclear and conventional forces can only be what I describe as breathtaking. Frankly, that word 'breathtaking' may not be enough."

The imminent expansion of China's DF-41 ICBM arsenal is reinforced by a revelation that the China Nuclear Engineering and Construction Group Corporation Limited has received a fourfold expansion in military contracts in the first seven months of 2021 compared to last year.

The state-owned company reported on 18 August that it had been awarded CNY17.2 billion (USD2.65 billion) in military contracts this year to date.

China Nuclear Engineering and Construction engages in both civil and military nuclear projects. Its military engineering arm enjoyed a 332.4% year-on-year increase in May, and 302.2% in June.

This is well in accord with the discovery of missile silos, for facilities must be built first so that ICBMs can be installed later.
The South China Morning Post quoted Song Zhongping, a former PLA instructor: "The numbers indicate a trend of expanding our nuclear weapons and power systems, which come under the nuclear military engineering sector. It is necessary for us to expand our capabilities in this field in order to maintain national security on our own, as the United States is increasingly challenging China and interfering in China's internal affairs more deeply."

These silo field discoveries, with perhaps more on the way, indicate a fundamental transformation in China's military and strategic posture. At the foundational level, it gives any would-be adversary a more challenging set of targets, simply because static sites have been multiplied more than twelvefold. Furthermore, these silos give the PLARF the ability to quickly launch missiles - in a retaliatory way only if Beijing's No First Use policy is to be believed.

Admiral Richard of STRATCOM warned, "It really doesn't matter why China continues to modernize. What matters is they are building the capability to execute any plausible nuclear employment strategy - the last brick in the wall of a military capable of coercion."

One can authoritatively say that China has moved beyond minimum deterrence. Indeed, US Secretary of State Antony Blinken told a meeting of Asian foreign ministers in August "how Beijing has sharply deviated from its decades-old nuclear strategy based on minimum deterrence".

The STRATCOM commander again: "China has correctly figured out that you can't coerce a peer - in other words, us - from a minimum deterrent posture." He said for the USA, "Business as usual will not work." The USA's new policy could be one of "integrated deterrence", a concept to be explained in a forthcoming nuclear posture review.

Interestingly, Admiral Richard encouraged OSINT communities to continue their hunt for Chinese missile sites. He said, "If you enjoy looking at commercial satellite imagery or stuff in China, can I suggest you keep looking?"

This was a strong hint that more Chinese silo fields await discovery. In fact, some experts assess that discovery of the first 230 silos is perhaps only 30-40% of the full picture.

Until now, the PLARF possessed just 20 operational silos for DF-5 ICBMs. Eight new silos for the older DF-5 are thought to be under construction, plus new ones are being built in Jilantai, likely for training.

Nor is China wholesale replacing older and less-capable ICBMs. For example, there is no evidence that older DF-31 and DF-31A ICBMs mounted on transporter-erector-launchers (TEL) are being withdrawn.

Decker Evelyth, the researcher who discovered the first missile silo field, offered some thoughts as to why the transformation in China's nuclear posture caught so many by surprise: (1) Over-estimating bureaucratic inertia in Chinese strategic culture and organization/underestimating Xi's goals and influence.

Reading of reaction from Chinese experts/ex-PLARF people makes me think this is genuinely a shock to some of them; (2) Not appreciating how China's shift from regional/non-peer power to global/near-peer power might influence nuclear posture; (3) Not appreciating how much thinking about national prestige and using nuclear weapons as symbols of state power might drive the program forward; and (4) Simple speed of change. I made an argument in my thesis about a gradual shift from assured retaliation to escalation or something else. I did not think things would accelerate so quickly.

There is speculation about China's intentions for its ICBM arsenal. Thomas Shugart, an Adjunct Senior Fellow at the Center for a New American Security, suggested that perhaps the PLA is developing a large dual nuclear-conventional ICBM force that could strike the continental USA in time of war. A conventional DF-41 might thus be equipped with a large unitary high-explosive warhead (i.e. a single charge), or perhaps a warhead that carries precision-guided sub-munitions to cause damage over a wide area.

Certainly, despite all these new China Nuclear Engineering and Construction contracts, Beijing definitely could not quickly create enough fissile material to fill every silo with a nuclear warhead.

Using conventional warheads would help to fill out numbers, however. The Second Artillery Corps, the PLARF's predecessor, has discussed in the past using conventional ICBMs to strike targets beyond the range of other missile types. Indeed, there have been subtle references to this in more recent documents as well. The circular error probable (a measure of accuracy) for such missiles could be in the single-digit meters, which means China can deliver such a conventional missile precisely even at intercontinental ranges.

Of course, using the same intercontinental ballistic missile for dual missions is fraught with risk, for a targeted country does not know whether a conventional or nuclear warhead is fitted. This could quickly rise to nuclear retaliation, even if China did not intend it.

This is one serious criticism of China's dual-nature DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missile, for example. However, the DF-26's fielding shows that China is already comfortable with this ambiguous situation.

Meanwhile, Ma Xiu, an analyst at BluePath Labs, and Peter W. Singer, a strategist at New America, assessed that these silo fields might affect the PLARF's order of battle.

They wrote: "The PLARF exploded in size between 2017 and 2019, growing more than 33% in only three years. Ten new brigades were added, with the six bases growing to accommodate them. However, the construction of two [now three] entirely new missile silo fields could make that existing structure inadequate. Assuming roughly 6-12 silos for a typical ICBM brigade, each field could easily require multiple brigades, even if only a fraction of silos were filled. 

Currently, all PLARF bases oversee between six and seven brigades and seem unlikely to grow much further. This means that each of these sites would likely be too large to fit within the existing force structure and could easily become a base in its own right. This would make them the PLA's first new ballistic missile bases in over 50 years."

Speaking at the same Alabama conference as Admiral Richard was General Glen D. VanHerck, commander of the US North American Aerospace Defense Command.

He reported that China had "just demonstrated" a "very fast" hypersonic vehicle, a reference
to a missile carrying a warhead that travels at hypersonic speed.

VanHerck said such warheads would challenge current US early-warning systems. He did not clarify whether this was a new type of hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) or an existing one. China is known to already possess the DF-17 HGV, which was carried on a 10x10 TEL at a Beijing military parade in 2019.

Recently, a photo of a new type of missile carried by 12x12 TELs appeared on the Chinese internet. The missile body is longer than that of the DF-17, and it features a similar HGV warhead. It is not known if this was the type referred to by General VanHerck. Some speculatively call it the DF-27, but the identity of such a third- generation missile with sufficient range to reach Hawaii is by no means confirmed.

Any "leak" of such a photo is obviously sanctioned by the Chinese government.

Furthermore, Chinese state media reported on 22 August that China had successfully tested two new short-range conventional missiles. This new type can overcome "complex electromagnetic interference" to destroy facilities (e.g. enemy communications) in a "fast-reaction" operation.

Indeed, PLARF officers claimed such an operation now took half the time it did previously, and required involvement of fewer people. CCTV reported the missiles "successfully hit the target in an enemy camp equipped with multilayer defenses several hundred kilometers away and effectively paralyzed the enemy's key communications node". The outlet broadcast images of the live-fire drills in northwest China.

In a takeover of Taiwan, for example, China could attempt to first knock out communications and networks with a barrage of such missiles. Wu Shaomin, a senior engineer from the 1st Conventional Missile Brigade (a unit designation not previously known), noted, "Before we can gain control over the sea and air, we can use these kinds of missiles to destroy the enemy's bases and then we can send over fighter jets, ships and amphibious vehicles."

The CCTV report suggested that the missile is some kind of electromagnetic weapon. It is tentatively analyzed as a member of the DF-15 short-range ballistic-missile family that entered service in 1991. The modified DF-15A has a 600km range and carries a high- explosive warhead, the 725km-range DF-15B possibly adds a radar correlation terminal guidance system, and the DF-15C with earth-penetrating warhead appeared in 2013.

The new missile type could then be a DF-15D, but there is no confirmation of this yet. China denies there is any change in its strategic forces. But when it comes to China, one should look at what they do rather than listen to what they say. 









China's feverish missile frenzy


Hong Kong, August 23 (ANI): Militaristic China is prioritizing the mass deployment of ballistic missiles. The country has secretively engineered vast missile silo fields able to host nuclear weapons, has ramped up nuclear production and deployed new shorter-range missile types.




www.aninews.in

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## shi12jun




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## Daniel808

*From China's Strategic Rocket Forces

 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1310025105997615109*

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## jaybird

*China Tested A Fractional Orbital Bombardment System That Uses A Hypersonic Glide Vehicle: Report*

*Such a capability could potentially allow China to execute a nuclear strike on any target on earth with near-impunity and very little warning.*









China Tested A Fractional Orbital Bombardment System That Uses A Hypersonic Glide Vehicle: Report


Such a capability could potentially allow China to execute a nuclear strike on any target on earth with near-impunity and very little warning.




www.thedrive.com





A report from _Financial Times'_ Demetri Sevastopulo and Kathrin Hille states that China has tested a nuclear-capable hypersonic glide vehicle that goes into space and traverses the globe in an orbital-like fashion before making its run through the atmosphere toward its target. There would be huge implications if such a system were to be operationalized, and according to this story, which says it talked to five officials confirming the test, the U.S. government was caught totally off-guard by it.

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## lcloo

China is using mobile aircraft carrier target in desert for anti-ship ballistic missile tests.






















The Chinese military has built targets in the shape of an American aircraft carrier and other U.S. warships in the Taklamakan desert as part of a new target range complex, according to photos provided to USNI News by satellite imagery company Maxar.

The full-scale outline of a U.S. carrier and at least two Arleigh Burke-class destroyers are part of the target range that has been built in the Ruoqiang region in central China. The site is near a former target range China used to test early versions of its so-called carrier killer DF-21D anti-ship ballistic missiles, according to press reports in 2013.


China Builds Missile Targets Shaped Like U.S. Aircraft Carrier, Destroyers in Remote Desert - USNI News

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## lcloo

A display model of mobile aircraftcarrier target mounted on rail. The larger model at the bottom of picture is probably sea mobile target ship.

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## JSCh

Seem that it is not easy to detect hypersonic missile even with satellite.








US satellite could detect Chinese hypersonic missiles, but could it stop them?


Prototype for satellite that will help US track hypersonic threats reportedly passes design review, clearing the way for it to be built.




www.scmp.com

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## vi-va

JSCh said:


> Seem that it is not easy to detect hypersonic missile even with satellite.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> US satellite could detect Chinese hypersonic missiles, but could it stop them?
> 
> 
> Prototype for satellite that will help US track hypersonic threats reportedly passes design review, clearing the way for it to be built.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.scmp.com


Satellites are very easy to be destroyed or blinded by laser. Many countries can do that. 
Give me money, I can do it as well, not hard at all.

Satellites are vulnerable targets.

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## Shotgunner51

Two ballistic tests would have taken place on January 7 from the Taiyuan space center. The first around 10:43 a.m. and the other around 3:41 p.m. local time.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1479543360910155779

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## Abid123

Stupid question but anyways.... Does anybody here know much a single DF-17 cost? Or DF-100? Like roughly?


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## Shotgunner51

Abid123 said:


> Stupid question but anyways.... Does anybody here know much a single DF-17 cost? Or DF-100? Like roughly?


That's tough question bro! DF-17 is actually replacing RV payload on standard DF-15 SRBM by a HGV. One can estimate the cost of DF-15 (excluding payload) by comparing to BM of similar range & payload, but the cost of HGV tech is too new to be estimated.

DF-100 is hi-altitude long-range two-stage CM, cruise at 4M, attack at 6M capable of terminal maneuver, again not easy to find comparable in the "market" so hard to tell the cost.

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## ozranger

Shotgunner51 said:


> That's tough question bro! DF-17 is actually replacing RV payload on standard DF-15 SRBM by a HGV. One can estimate the cost of DF-15 (excluding payload) by comparing to BM of similar range & payload, but the cost of HGV tech is too new to be estimated.
> 
> DF-100 is hi-altitude long-range two-stage CM, cruise at 4M, attack at 6M capable of terminal maneuver, again not easy to find comparable in the "market" so hard to tell the cost.


DF-17 is on DF-16 booster, right?


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## Shotgunner51

ozranger said:


> DF-17 is on DF-16 booster, right?


Yes my bad, stand corrected, DF-17 is on DF-16 booster


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## Abid123

Shotgunner51 said:


> That's tough question bro! DF-17 is actually replacing RV payload on standard DF-15 SRBM by a HGV. One can estimate the cost of DF-15 (excluding payload) by comparing to BM of similar range & payload, but the cost of HGV tech is too new to be estimated.
> 
> DF-100 is hi-altitude long-range two-stage CM, cruise at 4M, attack at 6M capable of terminal maneuver, again not easy to find comparable in the "market" so hard to tell the cost.


I appreciate your answer bro. I am just so surprised by how North Korea managed to develop the Hwasong-8. Since the Hwasong looks to be a copy of the DF-17 I was curios about the unit price. 

What will be the main use for the DF-17? To target military bases, airfields etc...? 

I know that the DF-100 was designed to land-based facilities, hardened targets, underground bunkers and large warships, including aircraft carriers and amphibious assault ships. According to wikipedia it could can target "moving" aircraft carriers. 

If Pakistan could manage to have a couple of hundred DF-100 stationed along our coast it would be a massive boost to our firepower. With a 2000 km range it would be able to target any warship in persian gulf, huge part of the arabian sea. Almost all the way to gulf of aden.


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## Shotgunner51

Abid123 said:


> I appreciate your answer bro. I am just so surprised by how North Korea managed to develop the Hwasong-8. Since the Hwasong looks to be a copy of the DF-17 I was curios about the unit price.
> 
> What will be the main use for the DF-17? To target military bases, airfields etc...?
> 
> I know that the DF-100 was designed to land-based facilities, hardened targets, underground bunkers and large warships, including aircraft carriers and amphibious assault ships. According to wikipedia it could can target "moving" aircraft carriers.
> 
> If Pakistan could manage to have a couple of hundred DF-100 stationed along our coast it would be a massive boost to our firepower. With a 2000 km range it would be able to target any warship in persian gulf, huge part of the arabian sea. Almost all the way to gulf of aden.


You're welcome bro!

I won't view NK's economy through the lens of market economy, they practice planned economy, so it's hard to tell how good or bad is their economic situation in comparison. The concept of "cost" may be very different in such a system, citing both USSR and pre-1978 China had developed many supposed to be very "expensive" weapons, it's no surprise NK can deliver similar results nowadays. All hammers look the same, China or Russia might have provided a "minimum" degree of resources in the process, but I won't undermine their own R&D capability.

Not much different from most missiles, DF-17 is also used to strike a variety of targets, the difference is _how_ it gets there, i.e. HGV versus traditional RVs, the whole purpose of this tech is to *evade enemy mid-course interception*. The deployment of DF-17 (1 ton payload including HGV, 1800-2500 km) also means PLARF has mastered the HGV tech which may be extended to other range/payload, it won't be a surprise if they build bigger HGVs and mount on boosters of DF-26 IRBM or DF-31 ICBM.

Yes DF-100 is definitely good addition to a saturated multi-dimensional anti-ship offensive, and of course it can go solo.

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## serenity

Abid123 said:


> I appreciate your answer bro. I am just so surprised by how North Korea managed to develop the Hwasong-8. Since the Hwasong looks to be a copy of the DF-17 I was curios about the unit price.
> 
> What will be the main use for the DF-17? To target military bases, airfields etc...?
> 
> I know that the DF-100 was designed to land-based facilities, hardened targets, underground bunkers and large warships, including aircraft carriers and amphibious assault ships. According to wikipedia it could can target "moving" aircraft carriers.
> 
> If Pakistan could manage to have a couple of hundred DF-100 stationed along our coast it would be a massive boost to our firepower. With a 2000 km range it would be able to target any warship in persian gulf, huge part of the arabian sea. Almost all the way to gulf of aden.



NK's Hwasong-8 looks like exactly the same as DF-17 rocket stage and HGV both look identical.

I guess China controls Hwasong-8 and the weapon is shipped over and kept in case of US escalation of east asia war and causing disruptions than NK forces can be said to be using their own weapon and acting alone. Basically with at least this HGV weapon, it is a proxy actor and guarantor Japan does not get ideas. Japan can be hit by China through NK is the idea and purpose.

I would bet launch control and weapon use is managed by China only.

You need many top end supercomputers and many hypersonic wind tunnels to develop HGV. It is absolutely impossible to do without. Otherwise it would take far too long to test and refine until the weapon is actually good and useful. Only China, USA, and Russia have several hypersonic wind tunnels. Only China and USA have these level of supercomputers at that sort of availability for various programs. Even with all the main tools, developing HGV still takes several decades and multi-billions in development cost. China has been researching HGV since Qian Xuesen created the concept of HGV during the era of Von Braun and Sanger.

Now the interesting thing to realize is that China openly showed the DF-ZF vehicle on DF-17 booster. It is the first and only nation in the world to openly show one of their in service HGV weapons. A short range ballistic missile booster would give the HGV weapon Medium to Intermediate range since the vehicle flies thousands of kilometers under hypersonic shockwave riding techniques. How come they showed it so openly when Russia only dares show some animation?

USA says China has flown hypersonic aircraft and weapons "hundreds of times". This is not an exaggeration and dozens of flights in year 2000s would have been refinement and testing, building accurate mathematical models and collecting data for computation. USA says Russia has two hypersonic weapons in service which are their avangard ICBM warhead carrying type which is probably unpowered by extremely fast like mach 20. Also their zircon boost glide which is probably scramjet powered and around mach 5 to 10 max. Most likely around mach 5 due to scramjet limits.

China developed some exotic scramjets which they comfortably revealed in 2010s and then a few years ago also revealed they are testing world's first finished sodramjet type engine. Americans only conceptualized it but never even built a single one because they don't know how to manage airflow and maybe some other details. China finished it. It is also why China has at least one type of hypersonic aircraft for within atmosphere flight and one for orbit service as part of single stage to orbit programs.

This all indicates that DF-17 is old stuff or not sensitive at all. Could have been in service since early 2010s when hints were given that new generations of strategic missiles to complement anti ship ballistic missiles are denying Americans carrier operations during wartime. Purpose is not only to hit carriers but also medium to intermediate range bases around Pacific and Indian Ocean.

It is so old news that they give some to North Korea. One generation on way out, latest one already in service, and one near service in testing is the rule. Generation on the way out is less sensitive and can be exported and even some important details revealed. Probably considered already well known by adversary intelligence as well. The reason no one else reveals actual pictures of their HGV is because the shape is super secretive. Even small details like where intakes are can reveal things like what the turning performance range and speed might be. If it is boring straight line boost glide scramjet missile like zircon and one HAWCC program missile or advanced like DF-ZF and can "bounce" around at mach 10+ with perfect control.

DF-100 is also more secretive than DF-ZF since they only showed one very blurry video and hidden most of the details but they showed the starry sky prototypes for probably the same program since shape of scramjet intake is very similar. I'm assuming it is the military project that developed from starry sky again they are more than comfortable revealing.

The most secretive ones are these:

ICBM carried glide only for nuclear

hypersonic aircraft that flies within atmosphere entire journey or only a short boost towards edge of space for potential energy or some other reasons

hypersonic capable single stage to orbit transport for space launch service

zircon equivalent for anti shipping. This type is unknown but much less capable than longer ranged HGV because this type is far less capable of rapid controlled turning and much slower compared to HGV boosted to mach 10+ or mach 20 and then makes 300km radius turns to approach from many angles. Also zircon like missile will have much less range in only the hundreds of kilometers vs thousands to tens of thousands of kilometers. Also much less effective than ASBM which drops from space at mach 20 and approaches from vertical angle.

DF-17 type weapons also much more useful at attacking regional bases and probably can carry many types of warheads or electronic warfare equipment. A small missile similar to the anti-ship missiles of today cannot carry even a small warhead and powerful EW equipment. If they can make use of the heat on the surface of the vehicle, they can easily power extremely powerful and large EW equipment.

Chinese sources said back in late 2010s that USA has a powerful EW cruise missile and only China has equivalents at least back then developing that concept. Problem for that idea which is why it is probably now phased out is because stealth drones can do the job better and carry much better EW equipment and have access to more power. Next would be to do that on large HGV like DF-17's vehicle. They can fly low or high and can even be used for recon when the vehicle is not in acceleration and in inertial frame. With HGV you can do that and let it fly with pretty constant speed and direction or in a wide circle.


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## serenity

For example this vehicle or weapon is not DF-17 or DF-100.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1425102415146233859
This is a okay summary with only surface information on some Chinese hypersonic program.

https://b776141bb4b7592b6152-dbef5d...deb9-44cc-9f52-a6a1dffb96f9_121034_4700_1.pdf

Even interception against HGV have been done in China for a long time. First and only in the world.

https://thediplomat.com/2018/02/revealed-the-details-of-chinas-latest-hit-to-kill-interceptor-test/

Engine similar to sodramjet abandoned by NASA because they couldn't do it. This one I think is some other form of combined cycle rather than sodramjet like thing that only China has completed.

https://archive.md/2021.12.08-23594...ht-chinese-scientists-create-prototype-engine

Successful interceptions against zig zagging HGV weapons since 2021.

https://www.scmp.com/comment/opinio...fensive-interception-test-sends-message-world

HGV and interceptor both


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1357351805223534594
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/...ilot-snaps-launch-anti-ballistic-missile.html

Intercepting HGV is the next goal for all the top three militaries.

NASA's "Schramjet" was never made and only theorized.

China at least made the "Sodramjet" and successfully controlled the oblique detonation angle problems. No one else has even bothered to try except top US science and technology institutions and they have so far not done it. But China has been testing working ones for years.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/sc...flowTWPOP&src=socialflowTW&utm_source=twitter

This is all NASA managed to do in theory. The actual technology in full that China developed and finished isn't 88 pages long but 8888 pages at least lol.

https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/19800005874/downloads/19800005874.pdf

All sensitive and core technologies and knowledge are not available in public access papers whether Chinese or American. Only give out bachelor level information. Top level knowledge is either blacked out in papers or not shown at all.


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## serenity

In truth I think USA is ahead of Russia in hypersonics but USA doesn't quite show off or announce as much. China is ahead even of the US due to the decades of intense but secretive development and many programs.

Russia's Zircon is not that hard to do. Kinzhal is not HGV just a rocket. Many normal rockets and missiles actually exceed mach 5 but they are not aerodynamic vehicles in the same way as HGV are.

USA programs are extremely advanced aerodynamically and on communications and controls and guidance technologies like China's. Russia's Avangard might be miniature nuclear delivery glide vehicles which China has been doing for a long time as well but just not so publicly mentioned or revealed due to nature of being highest escalation ladder weapon and China does not like Western media continuously talking about how scary China is. Even the global flight of the Chinese hypersonic vehicle China had to formally say is not a weapon while USA keeps saying it is for nuclear delivery. In any case China has hypersonic nuclear delivery capability and when it reveals that it does, by then it has already a replacement in service and another even newer technology in testing.

When it comes to Chinese strategic weapons this is the rule. Only reveal and admit weapons that are no longer the latest ones in service. So when China has HGV nuclear delivery since late 2010s with DF-41 and whatever other missiles, it does not say. When it reveals it in 2025 or whenever, it already has superior type in service and even greater type in development. This is a national policy and a rule that only is broken in rare occasions when other methods of avoiding war are not as effective and the adversary requires more show for deterrence and make them think twice about real war.

USA chooses instead to engage China for the last twenty years or so in only propaganda war which then escalated to full blown trade war. They want to play proxy war as well with China's neighbors and east Asia domain. This is probably one reason why China has given North Korea some less advanced HGV from China.

USA relies on its huge numbers of SLBM and SSBN for nuclear. Russia too relies on huge numbers of missiles and warheads. China has a lot too but less than both of these guys even probably if true numbers are several times larger than estimated numbers. This is partly why USA never put as much effort in HGV as China. USA also relies on carrier group and naval war for power projection in offensive posture while China's been focused on area denial type weapons and defeating power projection methods such as attacking and destroying supply chains, regional bases, and last but important, carriers.

However USA's hypersonic programs I think are at least as advanced as China's maybe not as ahead but they are alert that they are behind now so they are pushing the investments and effort. Russia I feel is more showy than actual capabilities although they do have two types in service which is at least one more than USA. China shows a fraction of what it has and is capable of. Same as USA although USA programs in early development are usually much more transparent as their departments and private contractors often leak information about the programs at least. With China, all programs at every stage can be in total complete darkness unless they want to reveal a bit or adversary is talking a lot about them.

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## JSCh

中国航天科工​



​22-2-14 09:53​来自 微博视频号​​【超强战力！#前卫12导弹抗击8枚干扰弹命中目标#



】靶场上空，靶机连续释放8枚红外诱饵弹，我国国产的前卫-12单兵便携式防空导弹在飞行中丝毫不受干扰，精准击中目标，抗干扰能力超强。据了解，目前世界上还没有同类导弹公开展示过这样的实力。



带你感受现场的超强战力！（军武零距离） @央视军事 

央视军事的微博视频​
*China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation*
22-2-14 09:53

[Super strength! QW-12 missiles hit the target against 8 jamming decoy]

Over the shooting range, the target drone continuously released 8 infrared decoy. China's domestically-made Qianwei-12 man-portable air defense missile was not disturbed at all during flight, hit the target accurately, proved excellent anti-jamming ability. It is understood that no similar missiles in the world have publicly demonstrated such capability. (Military military zero distance)


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## JSCh

3D printing speeds up production of missiles​By Zhao Lei | CHINA DAILY | Updated: 2022-03-21 09:3

China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, the nation's largest missile maker, is taking advantage of additive manufacturing technology, commonly known as 3D printing, to accelerate the design and production of cruise missiles, engineers said.

"It takes about one to two months for dozens of technicians and workers to manufacture a gas rudder (used on a cruise missile) with traditional machining methods because it involves a succession of processes like casting and welding," said Zhang Chunhu, a senior technician at CASIC's Third Academy. "And a rudder is only a small part on a missile, so you can imagine how much manpower and time it takes to build a whole cruise missile by traditional means.

"But now, with 3D printing technology, a handful of workers can make a rudder within a week. The 3D-printing-enabled procedure can save us a great deal of labor, time and cost, and is much better than mechanical machining when it comes to weight and accuracy control for our products."

Zhang said a mechanically made rudder has rough surfaces that require workers to use machines and a lot of time to smooth them, and during that process, a large proportion of metal is chopped off and wasted. By comparison, a 3D printed one has very smooth surfaces with a tiny amount of redundant material－usually just a few grams－which means it is almost ready for installation on a missile.

"Thanks to 3D printing technology, our production efficiency and quality have substantially improved," Zhang said.
Jiao Shikun, an engineer at the academy's Technological Innovation Center for Additive Manufacturing, said 3D printers have enabled workers to increase the raw material utilization rate by dozens of times when it comes to manufacturing large missile components. The "printed" products have higher structural strength and a better pass rate, he added.

He said CASIC's Third Academy is the largest user of 3D printers in China's aerospace industry, and its technicians are using the technology to make many cruise missile parts such as engines and fuselage panels.

Zhang and Jiao said they will cooperate with weapons designers at the academy to introduce 3D printing technology in the design of new missiles.

"Designers can consider which components are suitable to be 'printed'. This technology can give engineers more space for imagination and innovation and allow them to design advanced, sophisticated components that would be difficult for traditional methods to manufacture but easy for 3D printers," Zhang said. "It is no exaggeration to say that 3D printing technology will revolutionize the design work of missiles."

The technology also has huge potential in the academy's production of unmanned aircraft, he said.

Wu Peixin, a defense industry observer in Beijing, said it is likely that in the future, 3D printers will be taken to the battlefield to allow soldiers to print and assemble missiles on the spot based on their needs.

China's aviation and space industries have used 3D printers widely on their production lines. Chinese scientists also carried out space-based 3D printing experiments on the country's new-generation manned spacecraft during its first flight test in May 2020.









3D printing speeds up production of missiles


China Aerospace Science and Industry Corp, the nation's largest missile maker, is taking advantage of additive manufacturing technology, commonly known as 3D printing, to accelerate the design and production of cruise missiles, engineers said.




www.chinadaily.com.cn

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM











Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-03/22/content_10142557.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-01/04/content_10120613.htm

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## lcloo

How do you fool an incoming anti-radiation missile towards a say, HQ-16B radar truck? Can the idea of having a decoy truck that emits the same radar emissions works?

The decoy may be made up of a cheap truck or a tow cart and a simple radar transmitter but minus other equipment on the real radar truck.

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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-03/30/content_10144805.htm

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @兵器知识杂志 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hjj/2022-04/13/content_10147715.htm

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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM










Via http://www.81.cn/yw/2022-04/14/content_10147883.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/tp/2022-03/16/content_10141374.htm

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## LKJ86



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## serenity

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 835814



YJ-12 can vertically launch?


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## LKJ86

serenity said:


> YJ-12 can vertically launch?


It is not YJ-12, but a new one.

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## KampfAlwin

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 835814


The new hypersonic AShM

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## serenity

LKJ86 said:


> It is not YJ-12, but a new one.



Oh YJ-21 or the new hypersonic anti ship missile. Wonder if it is scramjet missile or hgv.

I thought it was HQ-19 ballistic missile interceptor or anti satellite missile footage.


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## LKJ86



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## Deino

serenity said:


> YJ-12 can vertically launch?




Not YJ-12, but YJ-21!

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## ahtan_china

Long long ago picture

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## ozranger

It turns out there are 3 different types of ASBM or rocket boosted HGV. 






__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1516606366789828608

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## IblinI

PLA this decade will go all hypersonic, ballistic and cruise.


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## serenity

ozranger said:


> It turns out there are 3 different types of ASBM or rocket boosted HGV.
> View attachment 835972
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1516606366789828608



You're right, all three are different.

Air launched with double conical lift type from second picture shown this week is different to the ship launched one since it's very clear that ship launched one seems to be either single conical shape or subtle double conical BUT much longer. The air launched one has nearly twice the length of the booster section while the conical missile section is like at least 1m shorter than the ship launched one.

The older picture from years ago is DF-ZF like shape and not conical.


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## CSAW

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1516645917335687169

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1516647165371760642

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1516648373989818369

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## luciferdd

It does surprise me that CASIC had been shown you such thing in zhuhai-airshow 2022...LOL

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## LKJ86

Via @钢铁机机 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 835830







__





055的高超声速撒手锏亮相了【亚洲特快】_哔哩哔哩_bilibili


最近，我国海军新的宣传片首次公开了一种新型导弹，这是否是传说已久的“鹰击-XX”导弹呢？俄罗斯“萨尔马特”和高超声速技术又有什么关系呢？本期节目咱们高强度过山车！, 视频播放量 1128123、弹幕量 7986、点赞数 61650、投硬币枚数 11188、收藏人数 5417、转发人数 1629, 视频作者 观察者网, 作者简介...




www.bilibili.com


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## Bin Laden

LKJ86 said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 055的高超声速撒手锏亮相了【亚洲特快】_哔哩哔哩_bilibili
> 
> 
> 最近，我国海军新的宣传片首次公开了一种新型导弹，这是否是传说已久的“鹰击-XX”导弹呢？俄罗斯“萨尔马特”和高超声速技术又有什么关系呢？本期节目咱们高强度过山车！, 视频播放量 1128123、弹幕量 7986、点赞数 61650、投硬币枚数 11188、收藏人数 5417、转发人数 1629, 视频作者 观察者网, 作者简介...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bilibili.com



Chinese known hypersonics (so far);

Ballistic (sustained-boost rocket propelled):
1: CM401
2: YJ21

Glide Vehicles: 
1: DF-17

Scramjet powered:
? ? ? 

Unknown type:
1.DF100/CJ100(slates to be cruise missile)

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## LKJ86

YJ-18




Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## IblinI

Bin Laden said:


> Unknown type:
> 1.DF100/CJ100(slates to be cruise missile)


The hypersonic cruise missile is under development, not the DF100 series but its successor.


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## LKJ86

Via @利刃斩海飞剪艏 from Weibo

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## ozranger

Bin Laden said:


> Chinese known hypersonics (so far);
> 
> Ballistic (sustained-boost rocket propelled):
> 1: CM401
> 2: YJ21
> 
> Glide Vehicles:
> 1: DF-17
> 
> Scramjet powered:
> ? ? ?
> 
> Unknown type:
> 1.DF100/CJ100(slates to be cruise missile)


Although never being officially confirmed, most online analysts believe DF100 is a cruise missile flying in near space driven by a ramjet (not a scramjet), which decelerate the airflow speed to subsonic within the air intake. The missile is supposed to have a cruise speed less than 5 Ma, thus being categorised officially by PLARF as a supersonic cruise missile.

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/kj/2022-04/24/content_10150065.htm

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## LKJ86



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## Wergeland

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 836984
> 
> Via @利刃斩海飞剪艏 from Weibo



WOW this is incredible! Hypersonic warheards. Many different forms and flavours.


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hjj/2022-04/27/content_10151033.htm

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## Wergeland

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 838894
> 
> Via http://www.81.cn/hjj/2022-04/27/content_10151033.htm



DF-26 ?


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## luciferdd

Wergeland said:


> DF-26 ?


DF-16

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.mod.gov.cn/photos/2022-04/25/content_4909778.htm

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## S10

I hope you guys enjoy this hilarious article from Taiwan's news media. They really believe this shit.



> 俄羅斯黑海艦隊「莫斯科號」，4月遭烏克蘭軍隊發射兩枚該國產的「海王星」反艦飛彈擊沉，不僅使海王星一舉成名，亦使大眾驚覺反艦飛彈的重要性。也因莫斯科號遭擊沉，中共、台灣間的艦艇與反艦飛彈配置，瞬間成為大眾關心的焦點，甚至將雄二雄三飛彈與海王星相比。
> 
> 烏克蘭製海王星是一款次音速飛彈，推測最大射程約300公里，相關數據與我國產雄二反艦飛彈較為相近。兩者同樣為次音速反艦飛彈，我國雄二射程僅約140到250公里，射程範圍雖不如海王星，可差別在於，台灣在反艦飛彈的研發已歷經數年，且雄二早在1990年便已列裝服役，相較於海王星係由俄製舊型Kh-35「天王星」反艦巡弋飛彈進行改良，且是在2021年3月才服役，綜合比較下，雄二不管是技術上還是性能上皆比烏克蘭制的海王星成熟穩定許多。
> 
> 加上我國雄風飛彈系列仍在持續研發精進，雄三已為超音速反艦飛彈，最大射程範圍更是提高至400公里，還具備目標鎖定功能，過去雖發生漁船誤射事件，可也因此驗證雄三是一款有效的制海武器系統，故理論上我國雄風飛彈系統整體性能更優於海王星，對於中共大多數軍艦均為模仿俄艦打造的情形下，雖能以大型軍艦向周邊國家進行威嚇，但由莫斯科號的沉沒便可知，中共軍艦並非如同表面上所見的堅不可摧，反而成為大型海上標靶。
> 
> 
> 且近年來為因應共軍威脅，我國持續強化不對稱戰力，除了精進雄風系列飛彈，國防部更啟動各型飛彈量產任務，增加雄二、雄三及增程型雄三飛彈產能之外，更將量產「雄昇飛彈」。雄昇雖為地對地巡弋飛彈，可射程估計能達1000至1200公里，打擊範圍可直達中國內陸，具有強大源頭打擊戰力。另中科院飛彈量產廠房預計6月完工，啟用後台灣飛彈量大增，雄昇的產量估計至少能達到百枚以上，自主防衛能力更是不在話下。
> 
> 過往我國發展飛彈等計畫多是祕而不宣，如今能如此公開搬上檯面，無非是國際社會都想遏止中共軍力崛起。而我國地處第一島鏈要塞，在地緣戰略中擁有絕佳優勢，美方雖無法直接提供我國攻擊性武器，仍能支持我國自主研發。如今台灣自主發展雄昇、雄風等系列飛彈，不只能協同美方固守第一島鏈，更能增強我國防能力，抗衡中共以量取勝的劣質軍艦。











【Yahoo論壇】台灣國產飛彈性能優 無需畏懼共軍仿造艦


讀者投書：eva（研究生）




tw.news.yahoo.com


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hjj/2022-05/09/content_10153579.htm

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## MajesticPug

S10 said:


> I hope you guys enjoy this hilarious article from Taiwan's news media. They really believe this shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 【Yahoo論壇】台灣國產飛彈性能優 無需畏懼共軍仿造艦
> 
> 
> 讀者投書：eva（研究生）
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tw.news.yahoo.com


I've seen more hilarious 'beliefs' from Taiwanese. But you can't argue against believers. That's why I kept saying 'peaceful reunification' is a wet dream.


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## Beast

-60 tons missile weight
-16.5m long
-14000km range
-100 CEP
-10 warhead
-20 mins from China to New York
-take just few mins to prepare to fire once erected on a flat ground
-require just few crews to fire it.
-It can even position itself to fire from a basketball court.

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## Wergeland

Beast said:


> -60 tons missile weight
> -16.5m long
> -14000km range
> -100 CEP
> -10 warhead
> -20 mins from China to New York
> -take just few mins to prepare to fire once erected on a flat ground
> -require just few crews to fire it.
> -It can even position itself to fire from a basketball court.



How many is China gonna produce? Including the silo, railway and underground great wall ones.


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## Beast

Wergeland said:


> How many is China gonna produce? Including the silo, railway and underground great wall ones.


I bet at least 100 DF-41.


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## Wergeland

Beast said:


> I bet at least 100 DF-41.



So in theory 1000 warheads? Probably wil be a mixture of high and low yield. Maybe 500 warheads in real.


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## Beast

Wergeland said:


> So in theory 1000 warheads? Probably wil be a mixture of high and low yield. Maybe 500 warheads in real.


China nuclear stockpile is a top secret. Only the Chairman and few top general knows the actual number. But you are quite correct for that number. 

In case some troll claim US missile shield as some magic weapon against China and Russia ICBM, they need to come back to reality.

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## Abid123

DF-41 combination with JL-3 will be lethal.

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## Beast

Abid123 said:


> DF-41 combination with JL-3 will be lethal.


Precisely, just dealing with DF-41 is already headache for US defense shield. Couple with JL-3, DF-17 and DF-31A. Anyone who claim US defense shield can stop China nuclear attack on US soil are just deluding themselves. 

It is impossible to intercept or stop China nuclear retaliation on US soil. 

@Oldman1

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## Abid123

Beast said:


> Precisely, just dealing with DF-41 is already headache for US defense shield. Couple with JL-3, DF-17 and DF-31A. Anyone who claim US defense shield can stop China nuclear attack on US soil are just deluding themselves.
> 
> It is impossible to intercept or stop China nuclear retaliation on US soil.
> 
> @Oldman1


The Yankees also like to claim that they will nuke any country that sink their aircraft carriers lmao. What logic...

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## S10

I think the next logical step is to develop HGV warheads to target US ships anywhere in the world.

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## Beast

S10 said:


> I think the next logical step is to develop HGV warheads to target US ships anywhere in the world.


They are already doing that. It has reported Chinese HGV managed to hit moving targets.

Btw, there is reason why Chinese put HGV on a intermediate range ballistics missile. It is more for political and defensive purpose. It can fit into a ICBM if needed to achieve global strike.

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## Deino

Beast said:


> -60 tons missile weight
> -16.5m long
> -14000km range
> -100 CEP
> -10 warhead
> -20 mins from China to New York
> -take just few mins to prepare to fire once erected on a flat ground
> -require just few crews to fire it.
> -It can even position itself to fire from a basketball court.




And why do you think this YouTube video reveals something officially?

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## LKJ86



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## Abid123

LKJ86 said:


>


What is the name of the first vehicle? Is that the HQ-17 later on in that video?


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## KampfAlwin

Abid123 said:


> What is the name of the first vehicle? Is that the HQ-17 later on in that video?


First vehicle is a ZBD-04A IFV

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## Brainsucker

S10 said:


> I hope you guys enjoy this hilarious article from Taiwan's news media. They really believe this shit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 【Yahoo論壇】台灣國產飛彈性能優 無需畏懼共軍仿造艦
> 
> 
> 讀者投書：eva（研究生）
> 
> 
> 
> 
> tw.news.yahoo.com


Yes, it is hilarious. But being complacent is also hilarious. Even if that Xiong Feng missile or something is obsolete, but it's stink and capable to beat your Type-055 or Aircraft Carrier if you take it lightly.


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## LKJ86




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## Beast

Deino said:


> And why do you think this YouTube video reveals something officially?


The data this youtube provided are obtained from official release public report from PLA for their DF-41. Not made up by the youtube video maker themselves.

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## DF41

Abid123 said:


> DF-41 combination with JL-3 will be lethal.







JL-3 is the navalised version of my namesake


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## arjunk

Abid123 said:


> The Yankees also like to claim that they will nuke any country that sink their aircraft carriers lmao. What logic...


Any non nuclear countries which sink American ships or kill Americans will be destroyed. Any nuclear countries will be dealt with on an equal escalation scale.


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## DF41

S10 said:


> I think the next logical step is to develop HGV warheads to target US ships anywhere in the world.







Beast said:


> They are already doing that. It has reported Chinese HGV managed to hit moving targets.
> 
> Btw, there is reason why Chinese put HGV on a intermediate range ballistics missile. It is more for political and defensive purpose. It can fit into a ICBM if needed to achieve global strike.



 

Which is why recently I said even if USA carriers hide in Frisco Bay or off Long Island Atlantic Ocean, the carriers will not be safe.
DF21s DF26s are only the delivery means of the message to keep sailors on carriers from aging.

DF41 can also deliver the message 


DF 41 can mount HGVs together with nukes 




DF41 said:


> *In war time, even USA carriers hiding in Frisco Bay or off Long Island in Atlantic Ocean will be tracked and sailors in them will remain eternally un-aging*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> China’s DF-21D, DF-26 Anti-Ship Ballistic Missiles Could Trigger Mayhem On US Aircraft Carriers – CRS Report
> 
> 
> And do not forget! :D Other YJs galore, with long reach and bigger bang, and total knowledge where USA naval assets are and heading. So any time USA want to tango, China will tango too. :enjoy: :pleasantry:
> 
> 
> 
> defence.pk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _
> 
> I bad bad and mistaken!
> My apologies.
> 
> I always thought USA carriers will be safe if they hiding in Frisco bay or Hudson Bay or in Atlantic Ocean.
> And not cross West of 3rd Island Chain, the carriers will not be tracked.
> 
> I never realised Chinese satellite know where the carriers are anywhere they are and direction and speed they going
> 
> Even off the coast of Long Island in New York, China also know. Together with the accompanying USA warships.
> 
> Nowhere can the USA carriers hide to spring out to surprise China.
> 
> https://www.scmp.com/news/china/sci...atellite-tracks-us-aircraft-carrier-real-time_
> 
> _Chinese smart satellite tracks US aircraft carrier in real time, researchers say_​
> _AI-powered eye in the sky could identify a wide range of tactical or strategic targets, developers say_
> _Previously, a huge amount of raw satellite data had to be analysed on the ground_
> _
> 
> 
> Stephen Chen in Beijing
> Published: 12:05am, 10 May, 2022
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Chinese researchers say a smart satellite tracked the USS Harry S. Truman during a drill last year. Photo: US Navy
> 
> When USS Harry S. Truman was heading to a strait transit drill off the coast of Long Island in New York on June 17 last year, a Chinese remote sensing satellite powered by the latest artificial intelligence technology automatically detected the Nimitz-class aircraft carrier and alerted Beijing with the precise coordinates, according to a new study by Chinese space scientists.
> 
> The live-fire exercise that day involved a joint action of seven warships and many planes to simulate a fight against a powerful enemy while passing a narrow passage of water.
> 
> The fleet tested numerous tactics such as changing formation and making emergency manoeuvres to deter enemy submarines and other threats, according to the US Navy.
> 
> In the past, the Chinese military had to collect and analyse a huge amount of raw satellite data on the ground to get a clue on the details of such drills taking place in the US home waters, and the results usually came after the event was over.
> 
> But with AI-powered satellites, Beijing could detect and “live stream” military activities or assets of interest on the other side of the planet, according to space scientist Yang Fang and her colleagues with DFH Satellite in Beijing in a paper published in domestic peer-reviewed journal Spacecraft Engineering last month.
> 
> The satellite that caught the US aircraft carrier in the act was so smart, it could identify a wide range of tactical or strategic targets by analysing more than 200 frames of high-definition images per second, a speed that some ground-based computers would struggle to achieve, according to the Chinese team.
> 
> Putting AI into space involved many challenges, according to a Beijing-based satellite imaging researcher who was informed about the study but requested not to be named due to the sensitivity of the technology.
> 
> The mainstream AI algorithms required extensive training based on a huge amount of data, but the calculation resources in the orbit were rather limited, he said.
> 
> Satellite computers usually trail far behind their counterparts on the ground in processing speed due to weight, space and power constraints.
> 
> And they have to work for years without a glitch in a harsh environment. Most chips designed to handle AI tasks would fail quickly under strong radiation, according to the researcher.
> 
> Yang’s team said that they had achieved a breakthrough on “weight reduction” for AI technology. The image recognition with the algorithm they developed for the satellite consumed just 3 per cent of the calculation resources used by traditional algorithms when doing the same task, according to their paper.
> 
> They also made a new family of AI chipsets that could do many different types of jobs simultaneously on board the satellite.
> 
> If one chip failed, another would serve as backup and immediately take over the job to ensure the continuous functioning of the satellite.
> 
> There were some clouds over the New York region during the USS Harry S. Truman strike group exercise.
> 
> The Chinese satellite identified the aircraft carrier in the gaps of clouds with a sharp image containing so much detail that it almost ruled out the possibility of a mistake, according to Yang’s team.
> 
> In another test to verify the performance of space-based AI, the same satellite automatically detected and obtained the coordinates of military aircraft, naval ships and strategic assets such as oil storage tanks in northeastern Australia.
> 
> The researchers did not name the satellite reported in their paper. Yang could not be reached for comment.
> 
> Several small satellites launched by Chinese universities, government institutes and private companies in recent years have employed AI to improve China’s response to events happening around the world, according to openly available information.
> 
> Yang and her colleagues said the smart satellite could increase the communication efficiency with home by a million times because the AI would remove most of the junk information that jammed the communication channels.
> 
> China also has a plan to bring AI to its older remote sensing satellites, according to researchers involved in StarNet, an global internet satellite project launched by the Chinese government last year.
> 
> StarNet will only have about 400 satellites, many fewer than the US’ Starlink and OneWeb networks.
> 
> But some of these Chinese communication satellites would carry AI processors to boost their performance.
> 
> These smart communication satellites could receive and analyse raw data from traditional remote sensing satellites, identify targets of interest, and then pass the information to end users at home with little time delay, the project’s scientists said in a paper published in domestic peer-reviewed journal Telecommunications Science last month.
> 
> But a major concern to the space community was the “black box” problem, that humans did not fully understand how the AI learned and thought, they said._

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## Abid123

arjunk said:


> Any non nuclear countries which sink American ships or kill Americans will be destroyed.


So why has US not destroyed Iran? Iran killed 600 us soldiers in Iraq.


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## DF41

arjunk said:


> Any non nuclear countries which sink American ships or kill Americans will be destroyed. Any nuclear countries will be dealt with on an equal escalation scale.


    






Not that kind of shit again please.

*Go EDUCATE YOURSELF

CHINA MIGHT WELL BE THE ONLY COUNTRY WITH IMMEDIATELY DEPLOYABLE USABLE THERMO NUKES
AND IF USA WANT TO USE EVEN ONE NUKE *

===================================================================================================

Sailing their carriers up and down in phony FONOPs.

And a great game to bully China for the fun of it.

And screaming if their carriers are touched, China will be in a big world of hurting.

As if Murica the only one with nukes and happy to toss them about like confetti.


And please do not talk of nukes. China might well be the only country
with fully functional H Bombs
Chinese H Bombs are done to the YuMing configuration requiring very little maintenance.
Muricans do their H bombs to the Ulam Teller configuration needing lots of maintenances.

Each warhead needs to have about 200 milligrams of fresh tritium added every year. Here’s a pic showing W80s having their gas changed.











How many Murican H Bombs can go kaboom immediately? Not many.


When China was still almost in stone age condition in 1960s, China still developed the Hydrogen Bomb 3.3 Mtons just 32 months in June 1967 after China first fission bomb. China was using teams of Chinese working away at abacus as they had no computers or even electronic calculators then.

We all know China is a lot more advanced since the mid 60s.

US intelligence projection made late in the 1960s that China would have 435 nuclear weapons by 1973.
Karber’s report mentioned that “PRC data in 1995 gave the figure at 2,350.”

We all know China is a lot more advanced since 1995.

Why You Should Fear China's Nuclear Weapons

Underground Great Wall of China - Wikipedia

And remember the DF5s and DF31AG as well. About 100 or more of them, mirving 10 nukes or more.
China has at least three brigades of DF-5 missiles. Assuming all three brigades have been modernized, that's 360 thermonuclear warheads with a half-megaton on each warhead.
3 brigades DF-5B ICBM x 12 missiles per brigade x 10 MIRVs per missile = 360 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-5B ICBMs












DF-5B got throw weight of 5,000 kgs
In 2017, China successfully completed tests of DF-5C. Presumably with greater throw weight and greater accuracy in targetting.

7 brigades DF-31A ICBM (since 2007 introduction and adding one brigade per year) x 12 missiles per brigade x 3 MIRVs = 252 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-31A ICBMs (assuming NO RELOAD missile per TEL; if you assume ONE reload missile per TEL then you double the number of warheads to 504 thermonuclear warheads).

Since then, China tested and got operational DF31AG and DF31B. Obviously able to throw more warheads than the DF31A. The DF31s are solid fuel and can fire within 3 to 5 minutes.

And the H-6K bombers. H-6K can carry up to six YJ-12 and 6-7 ALCMs; and air launched missiles (CH-AS-X-13)
As at 2015, there are 15 numbers of H-6Ks, and 150 numbers of assorted H-6s.
Using just H-6Ks, there will be need for 15X10 , or 150 thermonuclear bombs.
2015 is 5 years ago. You can be sure there will be even more numbers of H-6K, and even more advanced bombers being build by China.

DF-41 - Wikipedia

*The Dong Feng 41* (CSS-X-10) is a road- and rail-mobile intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM). The DF-41 completed all testing stages and deployed in the People’s Republic of China (PRC) since 2017. It is estimated to have an operational range of 12,000 to 15,000 km, which would make it the longest range missile in operation. It will likely have a top speed of Mach 25 and will be capable of delivering up to 10 MIRVed warheads. Throw weight of DF-41 is 2,500 kg.

The DF-41 is a three-stage solid-fueled intercontinental ballistic missile reported to have a maximum range of up to 15,000 kilometers (more than 9320 miles) and a top speed of Mach 25 (19,030 mph). It is said to be capable of carrying up to 10 multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle (MIRVs). Its launch preparation time is estimated to be between 3 to 5 minutes.

*This would make the DF-41 the world's longest range missile, surpassing the range of the US **LGM-30 Minuteman* *which has a reported range of 13,000 km. Throw weight of LGM-30 is only 1000kg or just 3 numbers of 170kton nukes. USA UGM-133 Trident II throw weight is only 2,800 kg.*



Four brigades of DF-41 ICBMs (Heilongjiang, Henan, Xinjiang, and Tibet Provinces) with one re-load per DF-41 TEL yields 96 total DF-41 ICBMs.
How many brigades of DF-41 since 2017 number of 4 brigades?
6 Brigades or 8 Brigades?











Reported DF-41 Deployment: China 'Responding to US Missile Defense in Asia'
Expert: DF-41 among most advanced missiles in the world


If China got only 260 thermonukes like what everyone is saying and hoping, the surplus warheads will be delivering dim sum and tea bags and cleaned pressed laundry from Chinese laundrymen.

_Please remember DF-41 got a very big brother coming up as well in case you think DF-41 not worthy enough to deliver dim sum and tea bags and cleaned laundry.
Russia’s RS-28 “Sarmat” ten-ton payload, rated as the most dangerous ICBM . Reportedly it may carry up to fifteen 350 kiloton warheads, or up to twenty-four of the new “Avangard” nuclear-armed Hypersonic Glide Vehicle (HGV) warheads. Sarmat will be dwarfed by Chinese new missile with even larger twenty-ton payload. That will be solid-fuel space-launch vehicle (SLV), and could form the basis for what might become the world’s largest “mobile” ICBM._
_The Next China Military Threat: The World's Biggest Mobile ICBM?_


*SSBNs
Type 094 Jin Class SSBN*

Currently 6 of type 094 but projected to be 8 in years to come.
Carrying 12 numbers of JL-2, mirving 3–4 thermonuclear warheads.
Or 288 nuclear warheads

*Type 096 Tang Class SSBN*
This is similar to Ohio Class

Carrying 24 JL-3 missiles , each mirving 5–7 warheads.
Currently, 6 numbers of 096 SSBNs are being build simultaneously.
Using 6x24x5, we have 720 thermonuclear warheads.

Or at least 1000 nukes can be delivered by China.
Or the warheads delivered are empty. Or used to deliver dim sums, General Tso chicken, wulung tea bags and cleaned laundry by Chink laundrymen, express delivery.

If China is ever turned into a nuclear wasteland, those that send nukes into China will be nuked into glowing and molten multicolored wasteland.

China promised never to use the first nuke. But if just one nuke land on China or her forces, *ALL THE USA BASES FROM EUROPE, DIEGO GARCIA , SINGAPORE . JAPAN AND USA HERSELF WILL BE SEAS AND LAKES OF MOLTEN MULTI COLOR GLASS.*
*None of the USA carriers will be spared. The carriers will be taken out with nukes even if the carriers hide in Frisco Bay or in the Atlantic Ocean or any other ocean.*

And as demonstrated so clearly in KSA a few days ago, the Aegis and Patriot systems defending Saudi a joke as the Aegis and Patriot cannot even detect a few sub Mach cruise missiles not to talk of taking them down. Even to now, no one sure where those came from and who flown them. Despite overlapping coverage of those Patriot and Aegis systems.
New sales pitch? US makes the world’s ‘finest’ anti-air systems, but sometimes they just don’t work, Pompeo explains
Saudi air defenses like Patriot & Aegis don’t match their advertised properties, unfit for real combat – Russian Army (MAP)










How will the Patriot systems in USA defend against ICBMs coming in at speed of Mach 25 when they cannot even detect missiles at sub Mach or even know where the missiles came from despite overlapping coverage?

Allies of the country that nuke China will not go unpunished as well. Whether they could not stop USA or do not want to stop USA or USA do not want to listen to them will be irrelevant to China.
*A nuked China will be very very weak. And China recalled the days where the British and French and Japan and USA came to carve her up when China was weak.
China will not allow that to happen again. China will ensure those countries will be weaker than a nuked China, or exist only in name after a nuked China*

So please let peace prevail and it is irrelevant whether you think China only got 260 nukes
The lucky ones will be those that die in the first micro second.
Those still alive a year later will wish they gone at the very beginning.

And why the war fought or even started, no one will give a flying **** as to the reasons.












Even so, China never ever threatened to use nukes. Other than if nuke used on China, China will retaliate and use nukes as well.

*So please be peaceful and respectful and more courtesy, and no more phony FONOPs and playing games of who will blink with China with phony FONOPs. Do not play with fire regarding Taiwan. AND DO NOT THREATEN TO NUKE CHINA.*

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## Beast

DF41 said:


> Not that kind of shit again please.
> 
> *Go EDUCATE YOURSELF
> 
> CHINA MIGHT WELL BE THE ONLY COUNTRY WITH IMMEDIATELY DEPLOYABLE USABLE THERMO NUKES
> AND IF USA WANT TO USE EVEN ONE NUKE *
> 
> ===================================================================================================
> 
> Sailing their carriers up and down in phony FONOPs.
> 
> And a great game to bully China for the fun of it.
> 
> And screaming if their carriers are touched, China will be in a big world of hurting.
> 
> As if Murica the only one with nukes and happy to toss them about like confetti.
> 
> 
> And please do not talk of nukes. China might well be the only country
> with fully functional H Bombs
> Chinese H Bombs are done to the YuMing configuration requiring very little maintenance.
> Muricans do their H bombs to the Ulam Teller configuration needing lots of maintenances.
> 
> Each warhead needs to have about 200 milligrams of fresh tritium added every year. Here’s a pic showing W80s having their gas changed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How many Murican H Bombs can go kaboom immediately? Not many.
> 
> 
> When China was still almost in stone age condition in 1960s, China still developed the Hydrogen Bomb 3.3 Mtons just 32 months in June 1967 after China first fission bomb. China was using teams of Chinese working away at abacus as they had no computers or even electronic calculators then.
> 
> We all know China is a lot more advanced since the mid 60s.
> 
> US intelligence projection made late in the 1960s that China would have 435 nuclear weapons by 1973.
> Karber’s report mentioned that “PRC data in 1995 gave the figure at 2,350.”
> 
> We all know China is a lot more advanced since 1995.
> 
> Why You Should Fear China's Nuclear Weapons
> 
> Underground Great Wall of China - Wikipedia
> 
> And remember the DF5s and DF31AG as well. About 100 or more of them, mirving 10 nukes or more.
> China has at least three brigades of DF-5 missiles. Assuming all three brigades have been modernized, that's 360 thermonuclear warheads with a half-megaton on each warhead.
> 3 brigades DF-5B ICBM x 12 missiles per brigade x 10 MIRVs per missile = 360 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-5B ICBMs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DF-5B got throw weight of 5,000 kgs
> In 2017, China successfully completed tests of DF-5C. Presumably with greater throw weight and greater accuracy in targetting.
> 
> 7 brigades DF-31A ICBM (since 2007 introduction and adding one brigade per year) x 12 missiles per brigade x 3 MIRVs = 252 thermonuclear warheads carried on DF-31A ICBMs (assuming NO RELOAD missile per TEL; if you assume ONE reload missile per TEL then you double the number of warheads to 504 thermonuclear warheads).
> 
> Since then, China tested and got operational DF31AG and DF31B. Obviously able to throw more warheads than the DF31A. The DF31s are solid fuel and can fire within 3 to 5 minutes.
> 
> And the H-6K bombers. H-6K can carry up to six YJ-12 and 6-7 ALCMs; and air launched missiles (CH-AS-X-13)
> As at 2015, there are 15 numbers of H-6Ks, and 150 numbers of assorted H-6s.
> Using just H-6Ks, there will be need for 15X10 , or 150 thermonuclear bombs.
> 2015 is 5 years ago. You can be sure there will be even more numbers of H-6K, and even more advanced bombers being build by China.
> 
> DF-41 - Wikipedia
> 
> *The Dong Feng 41* (CSS-X-10) is a road- and rail-mobile intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM). The DF-41 completed all testing stages and deployed in the People’s Republic of China (PRC) since 2017. It is estimated to have an operational range of 12,000 to 15,000 km, which would make it the longest range missile in operation. It will likely have a top speed of Mach 25 and will be capable of delivering up to 10 MIRVed warheads. Throw weight of DF-41 is 2,500 kg.
> 
> The DF-41 is a three-stage solid-fueled intercontinental ballistic missile reported to have a maximum range of up to 15,000 kilometers (more than 9320 miles) and a top speed of Mach 25 (19,030 mph). It is said to be capable of carrying up to 10 multiple independently targetable reentry vehicle (MIRVs). Its launch preparation time is estimated to be between 3 to 5 minutes.
> 
> *This would make the DF-41 the world's longest range missile, surpassing the range of the US **LGM-30 Minuteman* *which has a reported range of 13,000 km. Throw weight of LGM-30 is only 1000kg or just 3 numbers of 170kton nukes. USA UGM-133 Trident II throw weight is only 2,800 kg.*
> 
> 
> 
> Four brigades of DF-41 ICBMs (Heilongjiang, Henan, Xinjiang, and Tibet Provinces) with one re-load per DF-41 TEL yields 96 total DF-41 ICBMs.
> How many brigades of DF-41 since 2017 number of 4 brigades?
> 6 Brigades or 8 Brigades?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reported DF-41 Deployment: China 'Responding to US Missile Defense in Asia'
> Expert: DF-41 among most advanced missiles in the world
> 
> 
> If China got only 260 thermonukes like what everyone is saying and hoping, the surplus warheads will be delivering dim sum and tea bags and cleaned pressed laundry from Chinese laundrymen.
> 
> _Please remember DF-41 got a very big brother coming up as well in case you think DF-41 not worthy enough to deliver dim sum and tea bags and cleaned laundry.
> Russia’s RS-28 “Sarmat” ten-ton payload, rated as the most dangerous ICBM . Reportedly it may carry up to fifteen 350 kiloton warheads, or up to twenty-four of the new “Avangard” nuclear-armed Hypersonic Glide Vehicle (HGV) warheads. Sarmat will be dwarfed by Chinese new missile with even larger twenty-ton payload. That will be solid-fuel space-launch vehicle (SLV), and could form the basis for what might become the world’s largest “mobile” ICBM._
> _The Next China Military Threat: The World's Biggest Mobile ICBM?_
> 
> 
> *SSBNs
> Type 094 Jin Class SSBN*
> 
> Currently 6 of type 094 but projected to be 8 in years to come.
> Carrying 12 numbers of JL-2, mirving 3–4 thermonuclear warheads.
> Or 288 nuclear warheads
> 
> *Type 096 Tang Class SSBN*
> This is similar to Ohio Class
> 
> Carrying 24 JL-3 missiles , each mirving 5–7 warheads.
> Currently, 6 numbers of 096 SSBNs are being build simultaneously.
> Using 6x24x5, we have 720 thermonuclear warheads.
> 
> Or at least 1000 nukes can be delivered by China.
> Or the warheads delivered are empty. Or used to deliver dim sums, General Tso chicken, wulung tea bags and cleaned laundry by Chink laundrymen, express delivery.
> 
> If China is ever turned into a nuclear wasteland, those that send nukes into China will be nuked into glowing and molten multicolored wasteland.
> 
> China promised never to use the first nuke. But if just one nuke land on China or her forces, *ALL THE USA BASES FROM EUROPE, DIEGO GARCIA , SINGAPORE . JAPAN AND USA HERSELF WILL BE SEAS AND LAKES OF MOLTEN MULTI COLOR GLASS.
> None of the USA carriers will be spared. The carriers will be taken out with nukes even if the carriers hide in Frisco Bay or in the Atlantic Ocean or any other ocean.*
> 
> And as demonstrated so clearly in KSA a few days ago, the Aegis and Patriot systems defending Saudi a joke as the Aegis and Patriot cannot even detect a few sub Mach cruise missiles not to talk of taking them down. Even to now, no one sure where those came from and who flown them. Despite overlapping coverage of those Patriot and Aegis systems.
> New sales pitch? US makes the world’s ‘finest’ anti-air systems, but sometimes they just don’t work, Pompeo explains
> Saudi air defenses like Patriot & Aegis don’t match their advertised properties, unfit for real combat – Russian Army (MAP)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How will the Patriot systems in USA defend against ICBMs coming in at speed of Mach 25 when they cannot even detect missiles at sub Mach or even know where the missiles came from despite overlapping coverage?
> 
> Allies of the country that nuke China will not go unpunished as well. Whether they could not stop USA or do not want to stop USA or USA do not want to listen to them will be irrelevant to China.
> A nuked China will be very very weak. And China recalled the days where the British and French and Japan and USA came to carve her up when China was weak.
> China will not allow that to happen again. China will ensure those countries will be weaker than a nuked China, or exist only in name after a nuked China
> 
> So please let peace prevail and it is irrelevant whether you think China only got 260 nukes
> The lucky ones will be those that die in the first micro second.
> Those still alive a year later will wish they gone at the very beginning.
> 
> And why the war fought or even started, no one will give a flying **** as to the reasons.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even so, China never ever threatened to use nukes. Other than if nuke used on China, China will retaliate and use nukes as well.
> 
> *So please be peaceful and respectful and more courtesy, and no more phony FONOPs and playing games of who will blink with China with phony FONOPs. Do not play with fire regarding Taiwan. AND DO NOT THREATEN TO NUKE CHINA.*


Any attempt to nuke China will be end of the world. If China is dead. No one on globe expect to live and that included USA. China definitely has abilities kill all 400 million american. Chinese is not afraid of kamikaze. It is the American who don't have such balls to play such game.

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## ozranger

Got a friend sending me probably the first publicly available DF-27 photo. It shows a head cover highly likely a housing shaped for a HGV and a 6 axle TEL which shares the same design as that of DF-26. As such it is unavoidable to think DF-27 is derived from DF-26 with an extended range on its HGV final stage. The range is rumoured to be 5000km to 8000km with various types of warheads including nuclear ones.





In comparison, DF-26 TELs.





It is definitely not DF-17 as both DF-17 and DF-16 employ the same 5 axle TELs. That could be justified as what internet sources said that DF-17's rocket booster design is derived from DF-16. Same can also apply to DF-26 and DF-27.

DF-17





DF-16





BTW when a DF-17 TEL has the missile cover on, it looks like this,

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## Oldman1

Beast said:


> Precisely, just dealing with DF-41 is already headache for US defense shield. Couple with JL-3, DF-17 and DF-31A. Anyone who claim US defense shield can stop China nuclear attack on US soil are just deluding themselves.
> 
> It is impossible to intercept or stop China nuclear retaliation on US soil.
> 
> @Oldman1


Never said it was possible to intercept all of them, I said it helps to negate many missiles and give Chinese doubts what they really hit. And you have to be deluded to think China will escape a nuclear war unscathe.


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## S10

Oldman1 said:


> Never said it was possible to intercept all of them, I said it helps to negate many missiles and give Chinese doubts what they really hit. And you have to be deluded to think China will escape a nuclear war unscathe.


Well the whole point is China had too few ICBMs and nukes to ensure MAD doctrine. Now that's being rectified we can all live in peace once more.

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## Oldman1

S10 said:


> Well the whole point is China had too few ICBMs and nukes to ensure MAD doctrine. Now that's being rectified we can all live in peace once more.


Yes we can all live in peace once more.


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## JSCh

China carried out a land-based, mid-course #antiballistic #missile technical test on Sunday, marking a consecutive year of this kind of tests, and bringing the tally of publicly announced Chinese antiballistic missile tests to six since 2010.
https://bit.ly/3tPIrHF

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1538612606537179141

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1538551553144958976

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via 央视网


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-06/29/content_10167414.htm


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-06/29/content_10167476.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/yw/2022-07/05/content_10168929.htm

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## FuturePAF

What is the state of the JL-3? Could it be retrofitted to the 094 SSBNs or is it too large, and could only fit in the 096 SSBNs?


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## LKJ86

Via @中国火箭军 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @中国军号 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-07/11/content_10170253.htm

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## Bin Laden

Bin Laden said:


> Chinese known hypersonics (so far);
> 
> Ballistic (sustained-boost rocket propelled):
> 1: CM401
> 2: YJ21
> 
> Glide Vehicles:
> 1: DF-17
> 
> Scramjet powered:
> ? ? ?
> 
> Unknown type:
> 1.DF100/CJ100(slates to be cruise missile)


 UPDATE!

Scramjet powered:
1: Feitian 1 (not to be confused with the SLV)

After the latest successful test of the new Scramjet engine China is now another step closer to become the 2nd country that has "HYPERSONIC TRIAD", After Russia's Kinzhal,Avangard,Zircon trio.


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## LKJ86

Via 中部号角 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 862122
> View attachment 862123
> View attachment 862124
> 
> Via 中部号角 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo







Via @Ds走近哈佛 from Weibo


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

HQ-17B SAM

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## onebyone

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1549820649878609920


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## LKJ86

Via 中国军视网 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @东部战区 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via http://81.cn/yw/2022-08/16/content_10178444.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/bz/2022-08/24/content_10180103.htm

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM



















Via http://www.81.cn/lj/2022-08/24/content_10180238.htm

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## LKJ86

Via 中国军事网 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via 新华社

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## LKJ86

HQ-16B SAM




Via http://www.mod.gov.cn/power/2022-09/05/content_4920250.htm

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## LKJ86

HQ-17A SAM






















Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> HQ-17A SAM
> View attachment 878326
> View attachment 878327
> View attachment 878329
> View attachment 878331
> View attachment 878332
> View attachment 878333
> View attachment 878334
> 
> Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

HQ-22 SAM













Via @空军在线 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 1 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @东风快递 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via 子游

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/bg/2022-10/08/content_10190011.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-10/09/content_10190400_3.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/pk/2022-10/09/content_10190411.htm

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-10/20/content_10193855.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-10/20/content_10193879.htm

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## LKJ86

Via 娱乐天使哈哈

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## LKJ86

PL-17





Via @lyman2003 from Weibo

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## hualushui

LKJ86 said:


> PL-17
> View attachment 889778
> 
> Via @lyman2003 from Weibo


300km？


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## luciferdd

From weibo@应用技术联合体

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## LKJ86

Via @马妍 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @焦糖色的独角仙 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo

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## Deino

What is this?? Another air-launched ballistic missile "small" enough to be carried under a H-6's wings instead of the single larger one under its belly?

Also the designation is strange: 2PZD-21 ... something DF-21 related?


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> What is this?? Another air-launched ballistic missile "small" enough to be carried under a H-6's wings instead of the single larger one under its belly?
> 
> Also the designation is strange: 2PZD-21 ... something DF-21 related?
> 
> View attachment 892408






















Via @航空工业 from Weibo


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## Deino



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## LKJ86

Via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @Ds走近哈佛 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

HQ-16FE
















Via @赤胆忠诚的龙骑卫 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

HQ-9BE




Via @AC一派胡言侯东渐 from Weibo

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## ozranger

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 892928
> View attachment 892929
> View attachment 892932
> 
> Via @Ds走近哈佛 from Weibo








It seems that the HQ-6x missiles have been changed to using vertical launch. Previously it looks like the following.


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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 892928
> View attachment 892929
> View attachment 892930
> View attachment 892931
> View attachment 892932
> View attachment 892933
> View attachment 892934
> View attachment 892935
> View attachment 892936
> 
> Via @Ds走近哈佛 from Weibo







Via @疯子白杨 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 893539
> 
> Via @疯子白杨 from Weibo


HQ-11




















Via @赤胆忠诚的龙骑卫 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-11/05/content_10196208.htm

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## Akasa

Does anyone have any information about the *HJ-20*/*HJ-50* ATGM? Are they the same system or two distinct missiles?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @洋务先驱张之洞 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## IblinI

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 895564
> View attachment 895565


This thing deserved a seperate thread.


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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-11/23/content_10200997.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/yw/2022-12/08/content_10204166.htm

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## Deino

IblinI said:


> This thing deserved a seperate thread.




... since it is what?


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## LKJ86

Via @边城扫图 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via @中国军号 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/tp/2022-12/15/content_10205875.htm


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## LKJ86

Via @南部战区 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## Corax

Deino said:


> What is this?? Another air-launched ballistic missile "small" enough to be carried under a H-6's wings instead of the single larger one under its belly?
> 
> Also the designation is strange: 2PZD-21 ... something DF-21 related?
> 
> View attachment 892408



Looks like Kinzal/Iskander type.



LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 895564
> View attachment 895565



What system is this? That's a very high cold launch ejection.


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## LKJ86




----------



## vi-va

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 907501


Red THAAD and SM-3


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 907501




What's this??


----------



## vi-va

Deino said:


> What's this??


Counterpart of THAAD and SM-3 I think

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## S10

vi-va said:


> Counterpart of THAAD and SM-3 I think
> View attachment 907631
> View attachment 907632
> View attachment 907633


No it's YJ-21 ASBM, estimated to have around 1000km range.

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## Super Falcon

Chinese JL 3 SLMB with MIRV can hit USA from Chinese shore range upto 12000 difference between us slbm and Chinese USA did not use MIRV in slbm as far as i know may be I'm wrong here but Chinese slbm JL 3 is developed for future second strike capability hitting them with that'd and David sling anti missile shield won't be easy task specially if the launched from Bermuda or cinary islands


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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 907501


----------



## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hjj/2023-01/09/content_10210627.htm


----------

