# UK & Brexit News and Updates



## LA se Karachi

_*‘Brexit’ Will Require a Vote in Parliament, U.K. Court Rules*
_
By STEPHEN CASTLE and STEVEN ERLANGER NOV. 3, 2016


LONDON — The British government’s plan for leaving the European Union was thrown into uncertainty on Thursday after the High Court ruled that Parliament must give its approval before the process can begin.

The court’s decision seemed likely to slow — but not halt — the British withdrawal from the bloc, a step approved by nearly 52 percent of voters in a June referendum.

Nevertheless, the court’s decision was a significant blow to Prime Minister Theresa May. She had planned to begin the legal steps for leaving the European Union by the end of March, and to prepare for the negotiations over Britain’s exit mostly behind closed doors.

If the court’s ruling is upheld — the government immediately vowed to appeal — that plan would be thrown into disarray, analysts said.







Prime Minister Theresa May had planned to begin the legal steps for leaving the European Union by the end of March, and to prepare for the negotiations over Britain’s exit mostly behind closed doors. 
Credit Kirsty Wigglesworth/Associated Press


Mrs. May would be forced to work with Parliament and consider its competing priorities for Britain’s future. Specifically, she would have to give it a detailed strategy for negotiating the British departure, or “Brexit.” She has adamantly resisted doing so, arguing that this would impede her flexibility in the negotiations, preventing Britain from getting the best possible deal.


Few observers believe that Parliament will go so far as to prevent a departure from the bloc. Lawmakers themselves voted overwhelmingly to hold the referendum and pledged to abide by the results.

The more likely impact could be to weaken Mrs. May’s hold on the negotiating process. Her main priority has been controlling immigration and Britain’s borders, even if that hurts the economy by forcing her nation to leave the European Union’s single market — a “hard Brexit.”

The court’s decision may ultimately force her to compromise, a prospect that led the pound to rise Thursday morning, lifting it from the multidecade lows it had been plumbing in recent weeks.

But it was not immediately clear how the politics would play out. The Conservative government is already split over what kind of future relationship it wants with the European Union, and in general, members of Parliament were not in favor of leaving the bloc in the first place. The government hoped to get the talks started without a major parliamentary debate and potential interference, especially in the House of Lords, where the Conservatives do not have a clear majority.

If Mrs. May should find parliamentary opposition intolerable, she might ultimately be tempted to seek an early general election to gain a wider mandate for leaving the bloc, some analysts said. Currently, her Conservative Party holds a slim majority, with 329 seats in the 650-seat Parliament, and many of those members opposed a withdrawal.

The ruling unsettled the proponents of exiting the European Union, who warned against any backsliding. Nigel Farage, who resigned as leader of the nationalist U.K. Independence Party after the referendum, said he feared that Britain was heading for a “half Brexit,” and he said he would return to politics in 2019 if the country had not left the bloc by then.

“I see M.P.s from all parties saying, ‘Oh well, actually we should stay part of the single market; we should continue with our daily financial contributions,’ ” he said in an interview on BBC Radio. “I think we could be at the beginning, with this ruling, of a process where there is a deliberate, willful attempt by our political class to betray 17.4 million voters.”

On Thursday, the government said that an expedited appeal would be heard in December by the Supreme Court, Britain’s highest appellate body, and that it was sticking to its timetable for leaving the bloc for now. Yet in the growing environment of constitutional, legal and political uncertainty, the government’s strategy could easily be disrupted.

The ruling was “a severe setback for Theresa May’s government,” said Mujtaba Rahman, managing director for Europe at the Eurasia Group, a political consulting firm. But he added that the government’s timetable could still be met if the Supreme Court rules in its favor.

Although Parliament approved holding the referendum, Mrs. May’s critics argued in court that failing to give lawmakers a voice would turn them into bystanders as Britain negotiated its disengagement from the bloc. They also pointed out that, technically, the referendum is not legally binding.

The case, brought by several plaintiffs, including Gina Miller, an investment fund manager, and Deir Dos Santos, a hairdresser, is a constitutional one, about the powers vested in the government, the crown and Parliament. The case is not about whether Britain will or will not leave the European Union, but about the procedure for invoking Article 50, the legal mechanism for leaving the bloc, which provides a two-year period for negotiations.

The plaintiffs argued successfully that leaving the European Union involved the revocation of certain rights granted to Britons by Parliament, and that lawmakers must have a say and a vote before Article 50 is invoked.

In his ruling, the lord chief justice, John Thomas, said that “the most fundamental rule of the U.K. Constitution is that Parliament is sovereign and can make or unmake any law it chooses.”

Oddly enough, this was precisely the case made by those who wanted to end membership, who argued that only by leaving the European Union could Parliament’s sovereignty be completely restored. Now that same argument could delay the very exit so desired by those politicians and their supporters.

The government argued that under residual powers of royal prerogative, which cover international treaty-making, it had the power to invoke Article 50 without a vote in Parliament.

But the court found that invoking Article 50 would essentially repeal the European Communities Act, a 1972 law that allowed for the incorporation of European law into the British legal system, and that only Parliament had the power to do so.

Tim Farron, leader of the Liberal Democrats, welcomed the ruling, adding that it was “disappointing that this government was so intent on undermining parliamentary sovereignty and democratic process that they forced this decision to be made in the court.”

In a statement, he added, “Given the strict two-year timetable of exiting the E.U. once Article 50 is triggered, it is critical that the government now lay out their negotiating to Parliament, before such a vote is held.”

Cian Murphy, a senior lecturer in public international law at the University of Bristol, wrote on Twitter: “The Article 50 judgment from the High Court: a political bombshell but really rather predicable as a matter of constitutional law.”

Although Mrs. May has said that lawmakers will eventually be consulted, many fear it will take place too late to influence the shape of Britain’s new relationship with the European Union.

For example, if Parliament is given a chance to vote on an exit agreement at the end of the two-year period, lawmakers may be forced to choose between endorsing a deal they oppose or leaving the bloc without any formal relationship with it.

The government had dismissed the case as legal “camouflage,” regarding it as a thinly disguised effort to frustrate the democratic outcome of the June 23 referendum.

The Conservative Party, which was badly split over the referendum, has now largely embraced its outcome, in many cases enthusiastically.

Many supporters of the opposition Labour Party also voted to leave the European Union, which will make it harder for their lawmakers to oppose a withdrawal.

Along with the Supreme Court, the ruling might ultimately be referred to the European Court of Justice, an institution opposed by many who argued for Britain to leave the bloc.


_http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/04/world/europe/uk-brexit-vote-parliament.html_

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## HAIDER

LA se Karachi said:


> _*‘Brexit’ Will Require a Vote in Parliament, U.K. Court Rules*
> _
> By STEPHEN CASTLE and STEVEN ERLANGER NOV. 3, 2016
> 
> 
> LONDON — The British government’s plan for leaving the European Union was thrown into uncertainty on Thursday after the High Court ruled that Parliament must give its approval before the process can begin.
> 
> The court’s decision seemed likely to slow — but not halt — the British withdrawal from the bloc, a step approved by nearly 52 percent of voters in a June referendum.
> 
> Nevertheless, the court’s decision was a significant blow to Prime Minister Theresa May. She had planned to begin the legal steps for leaving the European Union by the end of March, and to prepare for the negotiations over Britain’s exit mostly behind closed doors.
> 
> If the court’s ruling is upheld — the government immediately vowed to appeal — that plan would be thrown into disarray, analysts said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prime Minister Theresa May had planned to begin the legal steps for leaving the European Union by the end of March, and to prepare for the negotiations over Britain’s exit mostly behind closed doors.
> Credit Kirsty Wigglesworth/Associated Press
> 
> 
> Mrs. May would be forced to work with Parliament and consider its competing priorities for Britain’s future. Specifically, she would have to give it a detailed strategy for negotiating the British departure, or “Brexit.” She has adamantly resisted doing so, arguing that this would impede her flexibility in the negotiations, preventing Britain from getting the best possible deal.
> 
> 
> Few observers believe that Parliament will go so far as to prevent a departure from the bloc. Lawmakers themselves voted overwhelmingly to hold the referendum and pledged to abide by the results.
> 
> The more likely impact could be to weaken Mrs. May’s hold on the negotiating process. Her main priority has been controlling immigration and Britain’s borders, even if that hurts the economy by forcing her nation to leave the European Union’s single market — a “hard Brexit.”
> 
> The court’s decision may ultimately force her to compromise, a prospect that led the pound to rise Thursday morning, lifting it from the multidecade lows it had been plumbing in recent weeks.
> 
> But it was not immediately clear how the politics would play out. The Conservative government is already split over what kind of future relationship it wants with the European Union, and in general, members of Parliament were not in favor of leaving the bloc in the first place. The government hoped to get the talks started without a major parliamentary debate and potential interference, especially in the House of Lords, where the Conservatives do not have a clear majority.
> 
> If Mrs. May should find parliamentary opposition intolerable, she might ultimately be tempted to seek an early general election to gain a wider mandate for leaving the bloc, some analysts said. Currently, her Conservative Party holds a slim majority, with 329 seats in the 650-seat Parliament, and many of those members opposed a withdrawal.
> 
> The ruling unsettled the proponents of exiting the European Union, who warned against any backsliding. Nigel Farage, who resigned as leader of the nationalist U.K. Independence Party after the referendum, said he feared that Britain was heading for a “half Brexit,” and he said he would return to politics in 2019 if the country had not left the bloc by then.
> 
> “I see M.P.s from all parties saying, ‘Oh well, actually we should stay part of the single market; we should continue with our daily financial contributions,’ ” he said in an interview on BBC Radio. “I think we could be at the beginning, with this ruling, of a process where there is a deliberate, willful attempt by our political class to betray 17.4 million voters.”
> 
> On Thursday, the government said that an expedited appeal would be heard in December by the Supreme Court, Britain’s highest appellate body, and that it was sticking to its timetable for leaving the bloc for now. Yet in the growing environment of constitutional, legal and political uncertainty, the government’s strategy could easily be disrupted.
> 
> The ruling was “a severe setback for Theresa May’s government,” said Mujtaba Rahman, managing director for Europe at the Eurasia Group, a political consulting firm. But he added that the government’s timetable could still be met if the Supreme Court rules in its favor.
> 
> Although Parliament approved holding the referendum, Mrs. May’s critics argued in court that failing to give lawmakers a voice would turn them into bystanders as Britain negotiated its disengagement from the bloc. They also pointed out that, technically, the referendum is not legally binding.
> 
> The case, brought by several plaintiffs, including Gina Miller, an investment fund manager, and Deir Dos Santos, a hairdresser, is a constitutional one, about the powers vested in the government, the crown and Parliament. The case is not about whether Britain will or will not leave the European Union, but about the procedure for invoking Article 50, the legal mechanism for leaving the bloc, which provides a two-year period for negotiations.
> 
> The plaintiffs argued successfully that leaving the European Union involved the revocation of certain rights granted to Britons by Parliament, and that lawmakers must have a say and a vote before Article 50 is invoked.
> 
> In his ruling, the lord chief justice, John Thomas, said that “the most fundamental rule of the U.K. Constitution is that Parliament is sovereign and can make or unmake any law it chooses.”
> 
> Oddly enough, this was precisely the case made by those who wanted to end membership, who argued that only by leaving the European Union could Parliament’s sovereignty be completely restored. Now that same argument could delay the very exit so desired by those politicians and their supporters.
> 
> The government argued that under residual powers of royal prerogative, which cover international treaty-making, it had the power to invoke Article 50 without a vote in Parliament.
> 
> But the court found that invoking Article 50 would essentially repeal the European Communities Act, a 1972 law that allowed for the incorporation of European law into the British legal system, and that only Parliament had the power to do so.
> 
> Tim Farron, leader of the Liberal Democrats, welcomed the ruling, adding that it was “disappointing that this government was so intent on undermining parliamentary sovereignty and democratic process that they forced this decision to be made in the court.”
> 
> In a statement, he added, “Given the strict two-year timetable of exiting the E.U. once Article 50 is triggered, it is critical that the government now lay out their negotiating to Parliament, before such a vote is held.”
> 
> Cian Murphy, a senior lecturer in public international law at the University of Bristol, wrote on Twitter: “The Article 50 judgment from the High Court: a political bombshell but really rather predicable as a matter of constitutional law.”
> 
> Although Mrs. May has said that lawmakers will eventually be consulted, many fear it will take place too late to influence the shape of Britain’s new relationship with the European Union.
> 
> For example, if Parliament is given a chance to vote on an exit agreement at the end of the two-year period, lawmakers may be forced to choose between endorsing a deal they oppose or leaving the bloc without any formal relationship with it.
> 
> The government had dismissed the case as legal “camouflage,” regarding it as a thinly disguised effort to frustrate the democratic outcome of the June 23 referendum.
> 
> The Conservative Party, which was badly split over the referendum, has now largely embraced its outcome, in many cases enthusiastically.
> 
> Many supporters of the opposition Labour Party also voted to leave the European Union, which will make it harder for their lawmakers to oppose a withdrawal.
> 
> Along with the Supreme Court, the ruling might ultimately be referred to the European Court of Justice, an institution opposed by many who argued for Britain to leave the bloc.
> 
> 
> _http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/04/world/europe/uk-brexit-vote-parliament.html_


Feel the economic heat so quickly .....lolzzz

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## waz

No it won't, not until the supreme court decides. Even if they rule for a vote, then MP's across the conservative and Labour benches have promised to vote for article 50. They cannot go against their voters, otherwise they can kiss their jobs goodbye. 421 constituencies out of 574 voted to leave the EU, so if May calls an election she will win a landslide anyway hahaha.
Both these morons who bought the high court action can be hardly called British, Horrible f*cks.

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## Khafee

waz said:


> No it won't, not until the supreme court decides. Even if they rule for a vote, then MP's across the conservative and Labour benches have promised to vote for article 50. They cannot go against their voters, otherwise they can kiss their jobs goodbye. 421 constituencies 574 voted to leave the EU, so if May calls an election she will win a landslide anyway hahaha.
> Both these morons who bought the high court action can be hardly called British, Horrible f*cks.


So in other words no hope of UK staying in the EU?

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## waz

Khafee said:


> So in other words no hope of UK staying in the EU?



Nope, not a hope in hell.

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## Fawad Sadique

Theresa May's urgency to be done with 'BREXIT' just a few weeks ago was such a hard blow to pound and now this... wow...


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## LA se Karachi

HAIDER said:


> Feel the economic heat so quickly .....lolzzz




Well, it just seems to be more of a legal issue than an economic one. The ruling will be appealed to the Supreme Court. We'll have to wait and see what it says.

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Damn that would be interesting , people in UK will not tolorate "abuse" from their Politicians and Judges they will beat the crap out of their judges and poilticians in matter of days.

Free nations don't tolorate none sense

And here I wish our people would grow some Jagarnaut testicles to tackle our corrupt politicians and judges

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## Zibago

Britain has no Brexit plan, leaked memo claims
November 15, 2016 By: Samaa Web Desk Published in Global Be the first to comment!





LONDON: The British government has no overarching plan for Brexit and may take another six months to agree a negotiating strategy, according to a leaked memo published by The Times on Tuesday.

Civil servants are struggling to cope with more than 500 Brexit-related projects and an extra 30,000 extra staff may be needed to handle the workload, according to the memo, reportedly prepared for the government by a consultant.

The document, dated November 7 and titled “Brexit update”, says “no common strategy has emerged” for leaving the European Union, despite lengthy debate among senior officials.

The government of Prime Minister Theresa May denied the claims and said it did not commission the report.

“This is not a government report and we don’t recognise the claims made in it,” a spokesman for May’s office said.

“We are focused on getting on with the job of delivering Brexit and making a success of it,” he said.

It could take another six months for the British government to agree on its priorities for Brexit, the memo, also seen by the BBC, suggests.

Although each government department has developed plans to cope with the departure, “this falls considerably short of having a ‘Government plan for Brexit’ because it has no prioritisation and no link to the overall negotiation strategy,” the memo reportedly states.

It criticises May’s approach, accusing her of “drawing in decisions and details to settle matters herself”.

May has promised to trigger Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty by the end of March next year to formally start the process of leaving the EU, but she has so far given few details of her strategy.

The leaked memo also says big businesses are expected to “point a gun at the government’s head” after the government assured carmaker Nissan that it would not lose out on investment after Britain leaves the EU.

May used a key address in the City of London late Monday to say that Britain will seize on Brexit to become a global leader on free trade and “forge new and dynamic trading agreements”. -AFP
https://www.samaa.tv/international/2016/11/britain-has-no-brexit-plan-leaked-memo-claims/


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## Zibago

European leaders agree UK must be forced into hard Brexit

Senior EU officials fear allowing Britain to exit on its own terms could empower far-right candidates in France and Germany

Samuel Osborne @SamuelOsborne93 32 minutes ago 293 comments
1K

Click to follow
Indy Politics

Prime Minister Theresa May is also facing fresh calls to deliver a hard Brexit from a group of 60 Conservative MPs Getty
European leaders have reportedly come to a 27-nation consensus that the UK must be forced into a hard Brexit in order to counter the rise of populist movements which could break up the European Union.

Senior EU officials fear allowing Britain to exit on its own terms could empower far-right candidates in France and Germany, which represent an existential danger to the bloc.

One EU diplomat told told The Observer: “If you British are not prepared to compromise on free movement, the only way to deal with Brexit is hard Brexit.



You can have 'hard Brexit' or no Brexit at all, EU council president warns UK
"Otherwise we would be seen to be giving in to a country that is leaving. That would be fatal.”

Speaking in the wake of Donald Trump's election as president of the United States, Ukip interim leader Nigel Farage warned it could be "game over for the EU" if Marine Le Pen, leader of the Front National, wins France's presidential election.

It came as Ms May faced fresh calls to deliver a hard Brexit from a group of 60 Conservative MPs, including prominent former cabinet ministers.

Cameron-era ministers Michael Gove, Iain Duncan Smith, John Whittingdale and Theresa Villiers urged the PM to pull Britain out of the European single market and the customs union.
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NewsUKUK Politics
European leaders agree UK must be forced into hard Brexit

Senior EU officials fear allowing Britain to exit on its own terms could empower far-right candidates in France and Germany

Samuel Osborne @SamuelOsborne93 32 minutes ago 293 comments
1K

Click to follow
Indy Politics

Prime Minister Theresa May is also facing fresh calls to deliver a hard Brexit from a group of 60 Conservative MPs Getty
European leaders have reportedly come to a 27-nation consensus that the UK must be forced into a hard Brexit in order to counter the rise of populist movements which could break up the European Union.

Senior EU officials fear allowing Britain to exit on its own terms could empower far-right candidates in France and Germany, which represent an existential danger to the bloc.

One EU diplomat told told The Observer: “If you British are not prepared to compromise on free movement, the only way to deal with Brexit is hard Brexit.



You can have 'hard Brexit' or no Brexit at all, EU council president warns UK
"Otherwise we would be seen to be giving in to a country that is leaving. That would be fatal.”

Speaking in the wake of Donald Trump's election as president of the United States, Ukip interim leader Nigel Farage warned it could be "game over for the EU" if Marine Le Pen, leader of the Front National, wins France's presidential election.

It came as Ms May faced fresh calls to deliver a hard Brexit from a group of 60 Conservative MPs, including prominent former cabinet ministers.

Cameron-era ministers Michael Gove, Iain Duncan Smith, John Whittingdale and Theresa Villiers urged the PM to pull Britain out of the European single market and the customs union.


They claimed getting out of the single market free trade zone was crucial for the UK to become free of Brussels regulations.

Pulling out of the customs union, which sets common tariffs for goods from countries outside it, would be the only way to strike trade deals with other nations, they said.

Eleven Labour, DUP and Ukip MPs also reportedly backed the call.

Brexit Concerns
22
show all
Ms May has previously said she would try to restrict freedom of movement between the UK and EU, a policy which is incompatible with membership of the single market.

A Government spokesperson said: "We are committed to getting the best possible deal as we leave the EU: one that is unique to Britain, not an ‘off the shelf’ solution.

READ MORE
Sixty Tory MPs demand Theresa May commits Britain to a Hard Brexit
May changes legal case for right to start Brexit without MPs' consent
Theresa May told to 'stop using EU staff as pawns in Brexit'
Liz Truss ‘may have broken law in failing to defend Brexit judges’
Supreme Court urge judge to stand down from Article 50 hearing
"It's not about binary choices - there is a huge range of possibilities for our future trading relationship with the EU. That's why the Government is painstakingly analysing the challenges and opportunities for all the different sectors of our economy.

"The Prime Minister has been clear that she wants UK companies to have the maximum freedom to trade with and operate in the Single Market – and to let European businesses do the same here.

"Beyond that, it's not in the UK's interest to give a running commentary on our thinking that could undermine our negotiating position."
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ee-movement-a7428021.html?cmpid=facebook-post
@waz @django @Vergennes

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## YeBeWarned

In the name of Queen they are out of European Union , deal with it ..


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## Louiq XIV

Hmm I'd rather say "Dear Brits, you're now out of the EU. Bye and deal with it !"


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## waz

That's what us Brexit folks have always wanted. Who wants to be part of the single market! It's literally the EU --3 i.e. you don't get a say how things are run and still have to accept its rules for example freedom of movement, customs union etc. We might as well stayed in.
No thanks, bye and no one apart from the Europhiles will shed a tear, and they're a minority which is growing slower by the day.


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## Star Expedition

The politicians have no courage to solve real problems. 
They leave them to people, and make things worse.

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## Louiq XIV

waz said:


> That's what us Brexit folks have always wanted. Who wants to be part of the single market! It's literally the EU --3 i.e. you don't get a say how things are run and still have to accept its rules for example freedom of movement, customs union etc. We might as well stayed in.
> No thanks, bye and no one apart from the Europhiles will shed a tear, and they're a minority which is growing slower by the day.



So everything is perfect and the divorce should be quick an easy because they won't be a lot of tears on the continent as well.

I will be a strong "Bye and good luck".

Or maybe "bon vent à vous !" from us.

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## waz

Louiq XIV said:


> So everything is perfect and the divorce should be quick an easy because they won't be a lot of tears on the continent as well.



Good for you, I hope we're both better off.


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## Vergennes

Louiq XIV said:


> Hmm I'd rather say "Dear Brits, you're now out of the EU. Bye and deal with it !"



"Par grâce de Dieu et du Roy,
Bouter l'anglois hors d'Europe nous devons. Pas d'quartier nous ferons !"

Kidding. 



waz said:


> Good for you, I hope we're both better off.



What an amazing love story.


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## Zibago

Tony Blair says Brexit can be stopped

By Charles Riley November 24, 2016 09:05AM EST
Tony Blair says that Britain's departure from the European Union is not etched in stone.
In an interview with the New Statesman, the former British prime minister said the process could be halted.
"It can be stopped if the British people decide that, having seen what it means, the pain-gain cost-benefit analysis doesn't stack up," Blair told the magazine.
The former Labour Party boss believes that parliament -- or the British people -- will in the end be allowed to pass judgment on the specific exit deal negotiated with the EU.
That puts him at odds with Prime Minister Theresa May, who has rejected calls for a second referendum, while insisting that "Brexit means Brexit." She's also appealing a court ruling that parliament should have a vote before the formal exit negotiations begin.
May has committed to triggering the legal exit process by the end of March. That will set off two years of frantic negotiations over the terms of Britain's exit from the trading bloc.
Blair makes the case for a public evaluation of whatever deal is negotiated. Will Britain retain access to the EU's giant free trade area? Or will it be forced to go it alone and negotiate new trade deals with Europe and the rest of the world?
"Why wouldn't you keep your options open? Why wouldn't you say, 'We took this decision, we took it before we saw what its consequences are; now we see its consequences, we're not so sure?' " he asked.
Related: The cost and complexity of leaving the EU
The public got its first official look at the cost of Brexit on Wednesday. The U.K. will be forced to borrow an extra £58.7 billion ($72.6 billion) over the next five years because of an economic slowdown triggered by the exit, according to estimates published by the Office of Budget Responsibility.
The independent government agency said growth will slump to just 1.4% next year -- the weakest rate since 2009.
Blair, who has expressed a desire to reengage in policy debates in the U.K., cited the example of a deal offered to Nissan (NSANY) following the referendum. In exchange for continued investment in the U.K., May is believed to have offered the Japanese automaker certain commitments.
But the specifics of the deal remain a closely held government secret.
"I don't know what the terms of that deal are, but we should know," Blair said. "Because that will tell us a lot about what [the government is] prepared to concede in order to keep access to the [EU] single market."
Related: U.K. economy to grow at slowest pace since 2009
Blair won three consecutive general elections, the last in 2005. He was the Labour Party's longest serving prime minister but faced fierce criticism over his decision to join the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq in March 2003.
Now he is intent on returning to policy debates by leading a resurgence of the center-left.
"You've got to learn the right lessons of Brexit, Trump and these popular movements across the Western world," he said. "Otherwise you're going to end up in a situation where you seriously think that the populism of the left is going to defeat the populism of the right. It absolutely won't."
http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/24/new...-blair-brexit0231AMVODtopLink&linkId=31548123
@django @waz


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## waz

This traitor knows better than to show his face in public. The only thing that will be stopped is him. He is the most hated individual in the UK.


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

I am still unsure that judge in court can cancel "vote" of public


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## Banglar Bir

As part of a major cleanup, merger and consolidation effort to make the Europe and Russia section more presentable, here's a thread for future discussions and news on the UK and its ongoing endeavors to leave the EU via Brexit.

Thank you - Technogaianist.
*...*

*The Queen just approved the UK's mass surveillance bill*

Sam Shead
http://www.businessinsider.com/parl...tm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer-ti

Nov. 29, 2016,
Investigatory Powers Bill (or IP Bill), as the legislation is known, was passed by Parliament on November 19 "with barely a whimper," according to The Guardian.

After the legislation was approved by both the House of Commons and the House of Lords, US whistleblower Edward Snowden tweeted: "The UK has just legalised the most extreme surveillance in the history of western democracy. It goes further than many autocracies."

But the Bill wasn't home and dry. It also needed to gain the approval of the country's constitutional monarch — the Queen — in a formality known as the Royal Assent.

To the disappointment of all those who signed a petition to repeal the IP Bill, also known as the Snopper's Charter, the Queen approved the bill on Tuesday, according to a Home Office press release. 

The law, pushed through Parliament by Prime Minister Theresa May when she was Home Secretary, makes it legal for UK intelligence agencies to hack, read, and store any information from any citizen's computer or phone, even if that citizen is completely innocent.

Home Secretary Amber Rudd said in a statement:

"This Government is clear that, at a time of heightened security threat, it is essential our law enforcement, security and intelligence services have the powers they need to keep people safe.

"The internet presents new opportunities for terrorists and we must ensure we have the capabilities to confront this challenge. But it is also right that these powers are subject to strict safeguards and rigorous oversight.

"The Investigatory Powers Act is world-leading legislation that provides unprecedented transparency and substantial privacy protection. 

"I want to pay tribute to the independent reviewers, organisations, and Parliamentarians of all parties for their rigorous scrutiny of this important law which is vital for the safety and security of our families, communities and country."

But Rafael Laguna, CEO at software firm Open-Xchange, said in a statement: "The Snoopers’ Charter is an excessive measure drawn-up by a government which has not consulted the tech community. Realistically, the only major effect the IP Bill will have is invading citizens’ privacy. Criminals and terrorists will only find other ways to communicate discretely."


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## Hindustani78

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/584215/romania-overtakes-india-uks-biggest.html
London, Dec 1, 2016 (PTI)





* Immigration into the UK from within the European Union (EU) has officially overtaken the rest of the world, with Romania replacing India at the top of the table in official figures released today.*

Romanians accounted for 10 per cent of all immigration in 2015 with 54,000 people coming to live in Britain – more than any other nationality, according to the Office of National Statistics (ONS).

China contributed 44,000 immigrants, followed by Poland with 38,000 tally, and India was third with 36,000.

"Immigration levels are now among the highest estimates recorded – the inflow of EU citizens is also at historically high levels and similar to the inflow of non-EU citizens," said Nicola White, ONS head of international migration statistics.

"These long-term immigration figures run up to the end of June, so it is too early to say what effect, if any, the EU referendum has had on long-term international migration," she said.

Immigration was one of the key issues that is believed to have swung the vote in favour of an exit from the EU in the June 23rd referendum.

Annual net migration to Britain in the 12 months to June 2016, or before the Brexit referendum, continued at a record level of 335,000.

This remains far from the UK government's target to reduce net migration levels to the "tens of thousands".

However, Downing Street insisted Prime Minister Theresa May remains committed to that target.

"She remains absolutely committed to bringing net immigration down to sustainable levels, which means tens of thousands, but we have made clear it will take time," a spokesperson said.

UK Immigration Minister Robert Goodwill hinted at further tightening of immigration measures for non-EU nationals, which will include India, as their hands remain tied on internal European migration until the EU's freedom of movement rules can be addressed once official Brexit negotiations kick off.

"We continue to reform non-EU immigration routes to ensure we attract the best and brightest, who benefit and contribute to this country. But there is more to do as we build an immigration system that delivers the control we need," Goodwill said.

This year's migration was largely fuelled by the highest- ever influx of EU nationals in the 12 months before June's referendum.

Europeans came to Britain for work, from countries like Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Portugal, the Republic of Ireland, Spain and Sweden.

The overall 650,000 level of immigration for the year until June 2016 was made up of 284,000 EU citizens coming to live and work in Britain, 289,000 coming from outside Europe and 77,000 Britons returning to live in the UK.


----------



## waz

I don't know why they are all rushing here. The government has clearly said there will be a cut-off point, which will go some years back to apply for residency. But that all depends on how our citizens are treated in the EU.


----------



## Saho

It seems we’re entering another of those stupid seasons humans impose on themselves at fairly regular intervals. I am sketching out here opinions based on information, they may prove right, or may prove wrong, and they’re intended just to challenge and be part of a wider dialogue.

My background is archaeology, so also history and anthropology. It leads me to look at big historical patterns. My theory is that most peoples’ perspective of history is limited to the experience communicated by their parents and grandparents, so 50–100 years. To go beyond that you have to read, study, and learn to untangle the propaganda that is inevitable in all telling of history. In a nutshell, at university I would fail a paper if I didn’t compare at least two, if not three opposing views on a topic. Taking one telling of events as gospel doesn’t wash in the comparative analytical method of research that forms the core of British academia. (I can’t speak for other systems, but they’re definitely not all alike in this way).

So zooming out, we humans have a habit of going into phases of mass destruction, generally self imposed to some extent or another. This handy list shows all the wars over time. Wars are actually the norm for humans, but every now and then something big comes along. I am interested in the Black Death, which devastated Europe. The opening of Boccaccio’s Decameron describes Florence in the grips of the Plague. It is as beyond imagination as the Somme, Hiroshima, or the Holocaust. I mean, you quite literally can’t put yourself there and imagine what it was like. For those in the midst of the Plague it must have felt like the end of the world.

But a defining feature of humans is their resilience. To us now it seems obvious that we survived the Plague, but to people at the time it must have seemed incredible that their society continued afterwards. Indeed, many takes on the effects of the Black Death are that it had a positive impact in the long term. Well summed up here: “By targeting frail people of all ages, and killing them by the hundreds of thousands within an extremely short period of time, the Black Death might have represented a strong force of natural selection and removed the weakest individuals on a very broad scale within Europe,“ …In addition, the Black Death significantly changed the social structure of some European regions. Tragic depopulation created the shortage of working people. This shortage caused wages to rise. Products prices fell too. Consequently, standards of living increased. For instance, people started to consume more food of higher quality.”

But for the people living through it, as with the World Wars, Soviet Famines, Holocaust, it must have felt inconceivable that humans could rise up from it. The collapse of the Roman Empire, Black Death, Spanish Inquisition, Thirty Years War, War of the Roses, English Civil War… it’s a long list. Events of massive destruction from which humanity recovered and move on, often in better shape.

At a local level in time people think things are fine, then things rapidly spiral out of control until they become unstoppable, and we wreak massive destruction on ourselves. For the people living in the midst of this it is hard to see happening and hard to understand. To historians later it all makes sense and we see clearly how one thing led to another. During the Centenary of the Battle of the Somme I was struck that it was a direct outcome of the assassination of an Austrian Arch Duke in Bosnia. I very much doubt anyone at the time thought the killing of a European royal would lead to the death of 17 million people.

My point is that this is a cycle. It happens again and again, but as most people only have a 50–100 year historical perspective they don’t see that it’s happening again. As the events that led to the First World War unfolded, there were a few brilliant minds who started to warn that something big was wrong, that the web of treaties across Europe could lead to a war, but they were dismissed as hysterical, mad, or fools, as is always the way, and as people who worry about Putin, Brexit, and Trump are dismissed now.

Then after the War to end all Wars, we went and had another one. Again, for a historian it was quite predictable. Lead people to feel they have lost control of their country and destiny, people look for scapegoats, a charismatic leader captures the popular mood, and singles out that scapegoat. He talks in rhetoric that has no detail, and drums up anger and hatred. Soon the masses start to move as one, without any logic driving their actions, and the whole becomes unstoppable.

That was Hitler, but it was also Mussolini, Stalin, Putin, Mugabe, and so many more. Mugabe is a very good case in point. He whipped up national anger and hatred towards the land owning white minority (who happened to know how to run farms), and seized their land to redistribute to the people, in a great populist move which in the end unravelled the economy and farming industry and left the people in possession of land, but starving. See also the famines created by the Soviet Union, and the one caused by the Chinese Communists last century in which 20–40 million people died. It seems inconceivable that people could create a situation in which tens of millions of people die without reason, but we do it again and again.

But at the time people don’t realise they’re embarking on a route that will lead to a destruction period. They think they’re right, they’re cheered on by jeering angry mobs, their critics are mocked. This cycle, the one we saw for example from the Treaty of Versaille, to the rise of Hitler, to the Second World War, appears to be happening again. But as with before, most people cannot see it because:

1. They are only looking at the present, not the past or future

2. They are only looking immediately around them, not at how events connect globally

3. Most people don’t read, think, challenge, or hear opposing views

Trump is doing this in America. Those of us with some oversight from history can see it happening. Read this brilliant, long essay in the New York magazine to understand how Plato described all this, and it is happening just as he predicted. Trump says he will Make America Great Again, when in fact America is currently great, according to pretty well any statistics. He is using passion, anger, and rhetoric in the same way all his predecessors did — a charismatic narcissist who feeds on the crowd to become ever stronger, creating a cult around himself. You can blame society, politicians, the media, for America getting to the point that it’s ready for Trump, but the bigger historical picture is that history generally plays out the same way each time someone like him becomes the boss.

On a wider stage, zoom out some more, Russia is a dictatorship with a charismatic leader using fear and passion to establish a cult around himself. Turkey is now there too. Hungary, Poland, Slovakia are heading that way, and across Europe more Trumps and Putins are waiting in the wings, in fact funded by Putin, waiting for the popular tide to turn their way.

We should be asking ourselves what our Archduke Ferdinand moment will be. How will an apparently small event trigger another period of massive destruction. We see Brexit, Trump, Putin in isolation. The world does not work that way — all things are connected and affecting each other. I have pro-Brexit friends who say ‘oh, you’re going to blame _that_ on Brexit too??’ But they don’t realise that actually, yes, historians will trace neat lines from apparently unrelated events back to major political and social shifts like Brexit.

Brexit — a group of angry people winning a fight — easily inspires other groups of angry people to start a similar fight, empowered with the idea that they may win. That alone can trigger chain reactions. A nuclear explosion is not caused by one atom splitting, but by the impact of the first atom that splits causing multiple other atoms near it to split, and they in turn causing multiple atoms to split. The exponential increase in atoms splitting, and their combined energy is the bomb. That is how World War One started and, ironically how World War Two ended.

An example of how Brexit could lead to a nuclear war _could be_ this:

Brexit in the UK causes Italy or France to have a similar referendum. Le Pen wins an election in France. Europe now has a fractured EU. The EU, for all its many awful faults, has prevented a war in Europe for longer than ever before. The EU is also a major force in suppressing Putin’s military ambitions. European sanctions on Russia really hit the economy, and helped temper Russia’s attacks on Ukraine (there is a reason bad guys always want a weaker European Union). Trump wins in the US. Trump becomes isolationist, which weakens NATO. He has already said he would not automatically honour NATO commitments in the face of a Russian attack on the Baltics.

With a fractured EU, and weakened NATO, Putin, facing an ongoing economic and social crisis in Russia, needs another foreign distraction around which to rally his people. He funds far right anti-EU activists in Latvia, who then create a reason for an uprising of the Russian Latvians in the East of the country (the EU border with Russia). Russia sends ‘peace keeping forces’ and ‘aid lorries’ into Latvia, as it did in Georgia, and in Ukraine. He annexes Eastern Latvia as he did Eastern Ukraine (Crimea has the same population as Latvia, by the way).

A divided Europe, with the leaders of France, Hungary, Poland, Slovakia, and others now pro-Russia, anti-EU, and funded by Putin, overrule calls for sanctions or a military response. NATO is slow to respond: Trump does not want America to be involved, and a large part of Europe is indifferent or blocking any action. Russia, seeing no real resistance to their actions, move further into Latvia, and then into Eastern Estonia and Lithuania. The Baltic States declare war on Russia and start to retaliate, as they have now been invaded so have no choice. Half of Europe sides with them, a few countries remain neutral, and a few side with Russia. Where does Turkey stand on this? How does ISIS respond to a new war in Europe? Who uses a nuclear weapon first?

This is just one Arch Duke Ferdinand scenario. The number of possible scenarios are infinite due to the massive complexity of the many moving parts. And of course many of them lead to nothing happening. But based on history we are due another period of destruction, and based on history all the indicators are that we are entering one.

It will come in ways we can’t see coming, and will spin out of control so fast people won’t be able to stop it. Historians will look back and make sense of it all and wonder how we could all have been so naïve. How could I sit in a nice café in London, writing this, without wanting to run away. How could people read it and make sarcastic and dismissive comments about how pro-Remain people should stop whining, and how we shouldn’t blame everything on Brexit. Others will read this and sneer at me for saying America is in great shape, that Trump is a possible future Hitler (and yes, Godwin’s Law. But my comparison is to another narcissistic, charismatic leader fanning flames of hatred until things spiral out of control). It’s easy to jump to conclusions that oppose pessimistic predictions based on the weight of history and learning. Trump won against the other Republicans in debates by countering their claims by calling them names and dismissing them. It’s an easy route but the wrong one.

Ignoring and mocking the experts , as people are doing around Brexit and Trump’s campaign, is no different to ignoring a doctor who tells you to stop smoking, and then finding later you’ve developed incurable cancer. A little thing leads to an unstoppable destruction that could have been prevented if you’d listened and thought a bit. But people smoke, and people die from it. That is the way of the human.

So I feel it’s all inevitable. I don’t know what it will be, but we are entering a bad phase. It will be unpleasant for those living through it, maybe even will unravel into being hellish and beyond imagination. Humans will come out the other side, recover, and move on. The human race will be fine, changed, maybe better. But for those at the sharp end — for the thousands of Turkish teachers who just got fired, for the Turkish journalists and lawyers in prison, for the Russian dissidents in gulags, for people lying wounded in French hospitals after terrorist attacks, for those yet to fall, this will be their Somme.

What can we do? Well, again, looking back, probably not much. The liberal intellectuals are always in the minority. See Clay Shirky’s Twitter Storm on this point. The people who see that open societies, being nice to other people, not being racist, not fighting wars, is a better way to live, they generally end up losing these fights. They don’t fight dirty. They are terrible at appealing to the populace. They are less violent, so end up in prisons, camps, and graves. We need to beware not to become divided (see: Labour party), we need to avoid getting lost in arguing through facts and logic, and counter the populist messages of passion and anger with our own similar messages. We need to understand and use social media. We need to harness a different fear. Fear of another World War nearly stopped World War 2, but didn’t. We need to avoid our own echo chambers. Trump and Putin supporters don’t read the Guardian, so writing there is just reassuring our friends. We need to find a way to bridge from our closed groups to other closed groups, try to cross the ever widening social divides.

(Perhaps I’m just writing this so I can be remembered by history as one of the people who saw it coming.)

https://medium.com/@theonlytoby/his...ext-with-brexit-trump-a3fefd154714#.mqjr8eii9

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## T-72

Norbert Hofer, Marine Le Pen and Gert Wilders ?


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## Saho

Europe, next 12 months:

- Italy referendum
- Austria election
- Netherlands election
- France election
- Germany election
- UK: Article 50

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Nice write up really awesome read , I wish I could articulate as clearly as you did.

Well in term of imminent destruction , we will certainly see another wave of Virus outbreak , it is bound to happen as our medicines are starting to loose ammunity on year by year basis. The vaccines and medicines which were so prominent 100 year ago are no longer that effective and now require combination of 2-3 pills to get job done here is why

VIRUS life form in our bodies are evolving , may it be intelligent design or will of higher power VIRUS /Becteria in our bodies are there to control Human population , it seems after a defined amoungt of time we reach a point when the VIRUS wins vs our Antibodies.

So no matter how technically evolved we will become with Technology , we will eventually find a strain of VIRUS so powerful that we will not be able to contain it , Big pharmaceutical companies have already stated this clearly

That is what happened to Dinasors post meteor hit on earth , the remaining ones perished due to outbreak of VIRUS


As for your theory of recurrance of War in Human History , it is 100% accurate. We have fought tirelessly beyond 10,000 year history we tout about so often yet our minds are not designed to go beyond 70-100 year periods. We can't even remember the key people from Past 100 years. Yes it is true we fall , we fight and we die , and we forget that is the cycle we have followed as humans for god knows since when.

We do yeild a power , and that power now is called Books and Internet , and knowledge which allows us to deeply study the past and learn lessons to avoid confrontations. However , such ideas are not always shared by many. I mean just the other day I stumbled upon some destructive videos on war in Syria and people dying yet when I changed channels I saw people just enjoying life , watching soccer games and enjoying life. I flipped the channel I saw people crying on dead bodies , I flipped the channel then I saw folks enjoying music and life eating happily. Somehow that moment relates to the little story your included in your article about Plague and how it changed society. In the link that talks about Plague and how people and family bounds were broken due to fear. Moden day plague is "War".

Will there be WW3 sure why not it happened before just was called something else , but it has always happened before in past.

What event will trigger is no one knows but it always starts with some of the most minior events in history or the most obvious there is no defined way how things start.

I wish I has the answer to say no we learned our lesson or things have changed , unfortunately the war I have seen in last 16 years or the ones before even have made me firmly believe we don't learn as humans

So pick your choice

a) VIRUS
b) WW3 event
c) Commet or Metor (You can also add UFO suprise)
d) 'AI' Army out of control, sure it would seem like nice idea at first Super computer AI commanding forces


If it makes people sleep well in night, certain nations (You know who) have copies of plague in their hidden facilities , just incase you ever wondered it may not resurface


As for EU or no EU , well globalization in its current form will be rejected by many countries whose local eocnomies have suffered due to mass globalization never really understood point of EU to be honest seems like a BIG wall between EU and world restricting trade other benefits

British / French / German the more dominant group from Europe tend to change alliances and watch for their own interest and that is completely fine. Ideas like EU don't work for very long due to various social and linguistic difficulties and of course cultural differences

US in general is different from Europe they think differently

When you view the problem really from a simplistic point of view we only have so much food!!! in planet , while our Population is going thru the roof !!!!!

Can't have corporations and globalization take food away from table

Russia ...hmmm they are just Russia they chill in their own place like bear. Anyone throws a bananna at Russia they will get angry like a bear and it will be war

All Corporations are busying making the Next Artificial Intelligence Genius Commander
How many are busy to care for refugee or war victims ?

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## Hakikat ve Hikmet

The world order as we know it is coming to an end. And, a new one will rise up. Countries are folding into their known spheres...

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## -SINAN-

Saho said:


> It seems we’re entering another of those stupid seasons humans impose on themselves at fairly regular intervals. I am sketching out here opinions based on information, they may prove right, or may prove wrong, and they’re intended just to challenge and be part of a wider dialogue.
> 
> My background is archaeology, so also history and anthropology. It leads me to look at big historical patterns. My theory is that most peoples’ perspective of history is limited to the experience communicated by their parents and grandparents, so 50–100 years. To go beyond that you have to read, study, and learn to untangle the propaganda that is inevitable in all telling of history. In a nutshell, at university I would fail a paper if I didn’t compare at least two, if not three opposing views on a topic. Taking one telling of events as gospel doesn’t wash in the comparative analytical method of research that forms the core of British academia. (I can’t speak for other systems, but they’re definitely not all alike in this way).
> 
> So zooming out, we humans have a habit of going into phases of mass destruction, generally self imposed to some extent or another. This handy list shows all the wars over time. Wars are actually the norm for humans, but every now and then something big comes along. I am interested in the Black Death, which devastated Europe. The opening of Boccaccio’s Decameron describes Florence in the grips of the Plague. It is as beyond imagination as the Somme, Hiroshima, or the Holocaust. I mean, you quite literally can’t put yourself there and imagine what it was like. For those in the midst of the Plague it must have felt like the end of the world.
> 
> But a defining feature of humans is their resilience. To us now it seems obvious that we survived the Plague, but to people at the time it must have seemed incredible that their society continued afterwards. Indeed, many takes on the effects of the Black Death are that it had a positive impact in the long term. Well summed up here: “By targeting frail people of all ages, and killing them by the hundreds of thousands within an extremely short period of time, the Black Death might have represented a strong force of natural selection and removed the weakest individuals on a very broad scale within Europe,“ …In addition, the Black Death significantly changed the social structure of some European regions. Tragic depopulation created the shortage of working people. This shortage caused wages to rise. Products prices fell too. Consequently, standards of living increased. For instance, people started to consume more food of higher quality.”
> 
> But for the people living through it, as with the World Wars, Soviet Famines, Holocaust, it must have felt inconceivable that humans could rise up from it. The collapse of the Roman Empire, Black Death, Spanish Inquisition, Thirty Years War, War of the Roses, English Civil War… it’s a long list. Events of massive destruction from which humanity recovered and move on, often in better shape.
> 
> At a local level in time people think things are fine, then things rapidly spiral out of control until they become unstoppable, and we wreak massive destruction on ourselves. For the people living in the midst of this it is hard to see happening and hard to understand. To historians later it all makes sense and we see clearly how one thing led to another. During the Centenary of the Battle of the Somme I was struck that it was a direct outcome of the assassination of an Austrian Arch Duke in Bosnia. I very much doubt anyone at the time thought the killing of a European royal would lead to the death of 17 million people.
> 
> My point is that this is a cycle. It happens again and again, but as most people only have a 50–100 year historical perspective they don’t see that it’s happening again. As the events that led to the First World War unfolded, there were a few brilliant minds who started to warn that something big was wrong, that the web of treaties across Europe could lead to a war, but they were dismissed as hysterical, mad, or fools, as is always the way, and as people who worry about Putin, Brexit, and Trump are dismissed now.
> 
> Then after the War to end all Wars, we went and had another one. Again, for a historian it was quite predictable. Lead people to feel they have lost control of their country and destiny, people look for scapegoats, a charismatic leader captures the popular mood, and singles out that scapegoat. He talks in rhetoric that has no detail, and drums up anger and hatred. Soon the masses start to move as one, without any logic driving their actions, and the whole becomes unstoppable.
> 
> That was Hitler, but it was also Mussolini, Stalin, Putin, Mugabe, and so many more. Mugabe is a very good case in point. He whipped up national anger and hatred towards the land owning white minority (who happened to know how to run farms), and seized their land to redistribute to the people, in a great populist move which in the end unravelled the economy and farming industry and left the people in possession of land, but starving. See also the famines created by the Soviet Union, and the one caused by the Chinese Communists last century in which 20–40 million people died. It seems inconceivable that people could create a situation in which tens of millions of people die without reason, but we do it again and again.
> 
> But at the time people don’t realise they’re embarking on a route that will lead to a destruction period. They think they’re right, they’re cheered on by jeering angry mobs, their critics are mocked. This cycle, the one we saw for example from the Treaty of Versaille, to the rise of Hitler, to the Second World War, appears to be happening again. But as with before, most people cannot see it because:
> 
> 1. They are only looking at the present, not the past or future
> 
> 2. They are only looking immediately around them, not at how events connect globally
> 
> 3. Most people don’t read, think, challenge, or hear opposing views
> 
> Trump is doing this in America. Those of us with some oversight from history can see it happening. Read this brilliant, long essay in the New York magazine to understand how Plato described all this, and it is happening just as he predicted. Trump says he will Make America Great Again, when in fact America is currently great, according to pretty well any statistics. He is using passion, anger, and rhetoric in the same way all his predecessors did — a charismatic narcissist who feeds on the crowd to become ever stronger, creating a cult around himself. You can blame society, politicians, the media, for America getting to the point that it’s ready for Trump, but the bigger historical picture is that history generally plays out the same way each time someone like him becomes the boss.
> 
> On a wider stage, zoom out some more, Russia is a dictatorship with a charismatic leader using fear and passion to establish a cult around himself. Turkey is now there too. Hungary, Poland, Slovakia are heading that way, and across Europe more Trumps and Putins are waiting in the wings, in fact funded by Putin, waiting for the popular tide to turn their way.
> 
> We should be asking ourselves what our Archduke Ferdinand moment will be. How will an apparently small event trigger another period of massive destruction. We see Brexit, Trump, Putin in isolation. The world does not work that way — all things are connected and affecting each other. I have pro-Brexit friends who say ‘oh, you’re going to blame _that_ on Brexit too??’ But they don’t realise that actually, yes, historians will trace neat lines from apparently unrelated events back to major political and social shifts like Brexit.
> 
> Brexit — a group of angry people winning a fight — easily inspires other groups of angry people to start a similar fight, empowered with the idea that they may win. That alone can trigger chain reactions. A nuclear explosion is not caused by one atom splitting, but by the impact of the first atom that splits causing multiple other atoms near it to split, and they in turn causing multiple atoms to split. The exponential increase in atoms splitting, and their combined energy is the bomb. That is how World War One started and, ironically how World War Two ended.
> 
> An example of how Brexit could lead to a nuclear war _could be_ this:
> 
> Brexit in the UK causes Italy or France to have a similar referendum. Le Pen wins an election in France. Europe now has a fractured EU. The EU, for all its many awful faults, has prevented a war in Europe for longer than ever before. The EU is also a major force in suppressing Putin’s military ambitions. European sanctions on Russia really hit the economy, and helped temper Russia’s attacks on Ukraine (there is a reason bad guys always want a weaker European Union). Trump wins in the US. Trump becomes isolationist, which weakens NATO. He has already said he would not automatically honour NATO commitments in the face of a Russian attack on the Baltics.
> 
> With a fractured EU, and weakened NATO, Putin, facing an ongoing economic and social crisis in Russia, needs another foreign distraction around which to rally his people. He funds far right anti-EU activists in Latvia, who then create a reason for an uprising of the Russian Latvians in the East of the country (the EU border with Russia). Russia sends ‘peace keeping forces’ and ‘aid lorries’ into Latvia, as it did in Georgia, and in Ukraine. He annexes Eastern Latvia as he did Eastern Ukraine (Crimea has the same population as Latvia, by the way).
> 
> A divided Europe, with the leaders of France, Hungary, Poland, Slovakia, and others now pro-Russia, anti-EU, and funded by Putin, overrule calls for sanctions or a military response. NATO is slow to respond: Trump does not want America to be involved, and a large part of Europe is indifferent or blocking any action. Russia, seeing no real resistance to their actions, move further into Latvia, and then into Eastern Estonia and Lithuania. The Baltic States declare war on Russia and start to retaliate, as they have now been invaded so have no choice. Half of Europe sides with them, a few countries remain neutral, and a few side with Russia. Where does Turkey stand on this? How does ISIS respond to a new war in Europe? Who uses a nuclear weapon first?
> 
> This is just one Arch Duke Ferdinand scenario. The number of possible scenarios are infinite due to the massive complexity of the many moving parts. And of course many of them lead to nothing happening. But based on history we are due another period of destruction, and based on history all the indicators are that we are entering one.
> 
> It will come in ways we can’t see coming, and will spin out of control so fast people won’t be able to stop it. Historians will look back and make sense of it all and wonder how we could all have been so naïve. How could I sit in a nice café in London, writing this, without wanting to run away. How could people read it and make sarcastic and dismissive comments about how pro-Remain people should stop whining, and how we shouldn’t blame everything on Brexit. Others will read this and sneer at me for saying America is in great shape, that Trump is a possible future Hitler (and yes, Godwin’s Law. But my comparison is to another narcissistic, charismatic leader fanning flames of hatred until things spiral out of control). It’s easy to jump to conclusions that oppose pessimistic predictions based on the weight of history and learning. Trump won against the other Republicans in debates by countering their claims by calling them names and dismissing them. It’s an easy route but the wrong one.
> 
> Ignoring and mocking the experts , as people are doing around Brexit and Trump’s campaign, is no different to ignoring a doctor who tells you to stop smoking, and then finding later you’ve developed incurable cancer. A little thing leads to an unstoppable destruction that could have been prevented if you’d listened and thought a bit. But people smoke, and people die from it. That is the way of the human.
> 
> So I feel it’s all inevitable. I don’t know what it will be, but we are entering a bad phase. It will be unpleasant for those living through it, maybe even will unravel into being hellish and beyond imagination. Humans will come out the other side, recover, and move on. The human race will be fine, changed, maybe better. But for those at the sharp end — for the thousands of Turkish teachers who just got fired, for the Turkish journalists and lawyers in prison, for the Russian dissidents in gulags, for people lying wounded in French hospitals after terrorist attacks, for those yet to fall, this will be their Somme.
> 
> What can we do? Well, again, looking back, probably not much. The liberal intellectuals are always in the minority. See Clay Shirky’s Twitter Storm on this point. The people who see that open societies, being nice to other people, not being racist, not fighting wars, is a better way to live, they generally end up losing these fights. They don’t fight dirty. They are terrible at appealing to the populace. They are less violent, so end up in prisons, camps, and graves. We need to beware not to become divided (see: Labour party), we need to avoid getting lost in arguing through facts and logic, and counter the populist messages of passion and anger with our own similar messages. We need to understand and use social media. We need to harness a different fear. Fear of another World War nearly stopped World War 2, but didn’t. We need to avoid our own echo chambers. Trump and Putin supporters don’t read the Guardian, so writing there is just reassuring our friends. We need to find a way to bridge from our closed groups to other closed groups, try to cross the ever widening social divides.
> 
> (Perhaps I’m just writing this so I can be remembered by history as one of the people who saw it coming.)
> 
> https://medium.com/@theonlytoby/his...ext-with-brexit-trump-a3fefd154714#.mqjr8eii9



Summary please.


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Well to be honest looking at older maps , of Europe so many countries that existed no long exist anymore 
or world wide , maps always change borders always change. Kings come and kings go


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## Saho

Sinan said:


> Summary please.


Don't be lazy, it's an interesting read.

It's about history repeating itself in Europe.

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## LA se Karachi

*Liberal Democrats overturn large Conservative majority to achieve a by-election result that sends shockwaves through Westminster.*







Sarah Olney won in Richmond Park by around 1900 votes


The year of political upsets continued last night, as the Liberal Democrats pulled of a sensational by-election victory in Richmond Park. The result, which saw the Lib Dems' *Sarah Olney* defy the odds to oust *Zac Goldsmith*, could have major implications for the government's Brexit plans.

I said at the weekend that 2016 might have one last political shock up its sleeve and Neil Monnery went further yesterday, listing four reasons why the Lib Dems would win. These turned out to be absolutely on the money as Olney, overturned Goldsmith's 23,000 majority to win by around 1900 votes.

It was a dramatic night with news filtering out after the polls closed at 10pm that the result would be very tight. Shortly afterwards, rumours appeared on Twitter that Labour canvassers had been telling constituents to vote Lib Dem and, around midnight, they became favourites on Betfair.

The result is a *disaster for Goldsmith* who, as the result was announced, looked as devastated as Michael Portillo in 1997. Goldsmith resigned from the Conservative Party in protest at the government's plans to expand Heathrow Airport, sparking the by-election and expecting to win as an independent. Having already been defeated as the Conservative candidate for Mayor of London in May, he's now suffered two humiliating electoral defeats in the space of six months.

But this result is about far more than Olney and Goldsmith. The Lib Dems successfully turned this by-election into a *plebiscite on the government's Brexit plans*, underlining Goldsmith's support for Leave in this summer's referendum while the constituency voted 72% for Remain.

The result will send powerful ripples down the Thames to Westminster and perhaps make a hard Brexit less likely. It also means there's one fewer pro-Brexit MP in Parliament and reduces Theresa May's already narrow majority by one. More than anything, perhaps, it changes the political weather and is, along with the recent ruling in the High Court about Parliament voting on *Article 50*, a boost to the 48% of Britons who do not want to leave the EU.

The result could also have implications for the way that opposition parties fight elections. When the by-election was announced, the Green Party threw their support behind Olney and urged Labour to do the same. Labour refused and their candidate, *Christian Wolmar*, lost his deposit.


_https://betting.betfair.com/politic...ection-friday-december-2-2016-021216-204.html_

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Banglar Bir

Channel 4 News is live now.
Page Liked · 25 mins · 








__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154309011581939





Supreme Court hearing live - Tue 6 DecThe Supreme Court is hearing the case about whether Parliament needs to approve the triggering of Article 50 - the formal mechanism for leaving the European Union.

This is the first time the court’s deliberations have been streamed on social media.


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## Banglar Bir

Channel 4 News is live now.
Page Liked · 12 mins ·





Supreme Court hearing live - Tue 6 Dec,The Supreme Court is hearing the case about whether Parliament needs to approve the triggering of Article 50 - the formal mechanism for leaving the European Union.

This is the first time the court’s deliberations have been streamed on social media.





__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154309548511939






This footage is made available for the sole purpose of the fair and accurate reporting of the judicial proceedings of The UK Supreme Court. Although you are welcome to view these proceedings, the re-use, capture, re-editing or redistribution of this footage in any form is not permitted. 

You should be aware that any such use could attract liability for breach of copyright or defamation and, in some circumstances, could constitute a contempt of court.


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## Banglar Bir

*Angela Merkel: Theresa May cannot 'cherry pick' Brexit terms*
More than 1,000 CDU delegates applaud and shout as German Chancellor stakes claim for historic fourth term in office

Peter Walker 
14 hours ago

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-cherry-pick-terms-latest-eu-uk-a7458486.html

Angela Merkel has told her own party congress that Britain will not be allowed to “cherry pick” in Brexit negotiations.

The German Chancellor told her Christian Democratic Union meeting on Tuesday that Theresa May's government would have to respect freedom of movement and the single market.

"We will not allow any cherry picking," Ms Merkel said, to cheers from more than 1,000 delegates in the western rust belt city of Essen.

"The four basic freedoms must be safeguarded - freedom of movement for people, goods, services and financial market products. Only then can there be access to the single market."

The UK's Conservative cabinet has seemingly flip-flopped back and forth over its strategy in leaving the European Union.

Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union, David Davis, surprised MPs in the House of Commons last week by revealing the Government is potentially willing to pay for single market access.


It once again shone a light on the legitimacy of the Vote Leave claim that £350m in EU money could be spent on the NHS if Britain opted for Brexit.

Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson reportedly told four EU ambassadors he was privately in favour of freedom of movement - according to a diplomat interviewed by _Sky News_ last week. Mr Johnson has since denied the reports.

This again contradicts what Ms May's ministers have said publicly, and the rhetoric of the leave campaign, which wanted to fundamentally regain control of British borders.

Ms Merkel was speaking at the CDU party congress, where she also said it was a "disgrace" that the international community had proved unable to alleviate suffering in Syria's besieged city of Aleppo.

"It is a disgrace that we have been unable to establish humanitarian corridors, but we must continue to fight for it," said Ms Merkel.

EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier says Brexit deal could be reached by October 2018
The 62-year-old also took a tougher stance on migration after around 890,000 asylum-seekers arrived in the country last year, saying: "A situation like the one in the late summer of 2015 cannot, should not and must not be repeated."
FindTheData | Graphiq
The EU's chief Brexit negotiator Michael Barnier sung from the same hymn sheet as Ms Merkel today at a press conference in Brussels.

Mr Barnier said: "The single market and its four freedoms are indivisible, cherry-picking is not an option."

A Supreme Court case over whether MPs will get a Brexit vote began yesterday.


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## LA se Karachi

*Brexit Negotiations: What We Know and What We Don't*

By Josh Lowe 


The new year was barely underway before Britain got embroiled in another Brexit row. The unexpected departure of its Brussels ambassador Ivan Rogers, and the quickfire appointment of his replacement Tim Barrow, kept the U.K. political press busy in the early January lull.

But even though the row is over, it highlights something Prime Minister Theresa May knows only too well; the Brexit negotiations are fast approaching, and time is running out for those preparing for the battle ahead.

May is much criticized for not having a plan for Brexit—on Thursday, _ The Economist_ branded her “Theresa Maybe” on a withering cover—but thanks to some revealing comments by her and her European counterparts, we do have some clues to her thinking. Here’s what we know—and what we don’t—about the Brexit negotiations.

*We know: When it starts*
It all kicks off in March. Theresa May has set herself an end of March deadline for triggering the Article 50 EU exit mechanism.

*We don’t know: When it ends*
There’s little agreement yet on what kind of “transition period,” if any, Britain will try to negotiate. May and Brexit Secretary David Davis have suggested they want to wrap up both the U.K.’s exit deal and the terms of a new trading relationship within the two-year exit period following Article 50. Most experts say the latter is unlikely to happen that quickly. And even if it did, the U.K. would probably need some time to phase out EU regulations and processes and phase in new ones.

*We know: May wants to reduce immigration*
May has repeatedly made it clear that gaining some measure of control over immigration is to be a British priority in the negotiations. If the other EU states and Brussels stick to their current stance, that also means the U.K. will need to leave the single market—at the moment, the Europeans argue its “four freedoms” of goods, services, capital and people are indivisible.

*We don’t know: What happens to migrants already in the U.K.*
The British government has said it wants to confirm the rights after Brexit of EU migrants who live in the country under free movement rules. But it says it can’t achieve this until it gets the same guarantee about its citizens from other EU states.

*We know: Britain is out of court*
May has said that after Brexit, the U.K. will no longer be subject to the judgements of the European Court of Justice. That’s another aim that means the U.K. will probably have to leave the single market.

*We don’t know: Britain could leave the Customs Union*
Britain could stay within the EU’s customs union after Brexit, but it’s unclear whether the government wants to do so. ITV political editor Robert Peston has suggested the creation of the new Department for International Trade might mean the U.K. will leave, because members of the customs union usually cannot negotiate their own trade deals. But the department’s head, Trade Secretary Liam Fox, has denied this.

*We know: There’s a lot we don’t know*
The negotiations will mean years of uncertainty. That could be very damaging for the economy.

*We don’t know: Whether it matters that we don’t know*
Many of the worst economic predictions about what would follow the Brexit vote have been proved wrong. It may be that the years of uncertainty don’t have the crippling impact some fear.


_http://www.newsweek.com/brexit-nego...appens-next-theresa-may-michel-barnier-539052_


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## خره مينه لګته وي

*Theresa May giving a pro-EU speech in April (left) and delivering her Brexit address

*
Theresa May has said the UK will emerge from Brexit as a "great, global trading nation", becoming "safer, more secure and more prosperous".

But in April - before the EU referendum - the then home secretary gave a speechwarning of the implications of a vote to leave the EU. Here's how some of the key quotes compare:

*Leaving the single market*
*April 2016*: "So, if we do vote to leave the European Union, we risk bringing the development of the single market to a halt, we risk a loss of investors and businesses to remaining EU member states driven by discriminatory EU policies, and we risk going backwards when it comes to international trade.

"But the big question is whether, in the event of Brexit, we would be able to negotiate a new free trade agreement with the EU and on what terms."

*January 2017*: "I respect the position taken by European leaders who have been clear about their position, just as I am clear about mine. So an important part of the new strategic partnership we seek with the EU will be the pursuit of the greatest possible access to the single market, on a fully reciprocal basis, through a comprehensive free trade agreement."

*April 2016:* "The reality is that we do not know on what terms we would win access to the single market. We do know that in a negotiation we would need to make concessions in order to access it, and those concessions could well be about accepting EU regulations, over which we would have no say, making financial contributions, just as we do now, accepting free movement rules, just as we do now, or quite possibly all three combined.

"It is not clear why other EU member states would give Britain a better deal than they themselves enjoy."

*January 2017*: "If we were excluded from accessing the single market, we would be free to change the basis of Britain's economic model.

"But for the EU, it would mean new barriers to trade with one of the biggest economies in the world. It would jeopardise investments in Britain by EU companies worth more than half a trillion pounds... and I do not believe that the EU's leaders will seriously tell German exporters, French farmers, Spanish fishermen, the young unemployed of the eurozone, and millions of others, that they want to make them poorer, just to punish Britain and make a political point."

*International trade deals*





*The PM said China had expressed an interest in a trade deal with the UK


April 2016:* "It is tempting to look at developing countries' economies, with their high growth rates, and see them as an alternative to trade with Europe. But just look at the reality of our trading relationship with China - with its dumping policies, protective tariffs and industrial-scale industrial espionage. And look at the figures. We export more to Ireland than we do to China, almost twice as much to Belgium as we do to India, and nearly three times as much to Sweden as we do to Brazil. It is not realistic to think we could just replace European trade with these new markets."

"And while we could certainly negotiate our own trade agreements, there would be no guarantee that they would be on terms as good as those we enjoy now. There would also be a considerable opportunity cost given the need to replace the existing agreements - not least with the EU itself - that we would have torn up as a consequence of our departure."

*January 2017:* "We want to get out into the wider world, to trade and do business all around the globe. Countries including China, Brazil, and the Gulf States have already expressed their interest in striking trade deals with us."


*Immigration*

_April 2016 (responding to a question from the BBC):_ *"What matters is that we have brought about changes in the free movement rules as a result of the negotiation."*

_*January 2017:*_* "As home secretary for six years, I know that you cannot control immigration overall when there is free movement to Britain from Europe."*
*

Not reaching a deal
*
_*April 2016*:_ "With no agreement, we know that WTO rules would oblige the EU to charge 10% tariffs on UK car exports, in line with the tariffs they impose on Japan and the United States. They would be required to do the same for all other goods upon which they impose tariffs. Not all of these tariffs are as high as 10%, but some are considerably higher."

*January 2017*: "And while I am confident that this scenario need never arise - while I am sure a positive agreement can be reached - I am equally clear that no deal for Britain is better than a bad deal for Britain.
*
"Because we would still be able to trade with Europe. We would be free to strike trade deals across the world. And we would have the freedom to set the competitive tax rates and embrace the policies that would attract the world's best companies and biggest investors to Britain."*


*http://www.bbc.com*


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## LA se Karachi

*Supreme Court Brexit ruling: What happens next?*


The Supreme Court has dismissed the government's appeal in a landmark case about Brexit, meaning Parliament will be required to give its approval before official talks on leaving the EU can begin.

The ruling is a significant, although not totally unexpected, setback for Theresa May.

What will the prime minister do next and what impact will the ruling have on the process of leaving the EU, following last year's referendum vote?

*Why did the court say Parliament should trigger Article 50?*

*



*

The highest court in the UK dismissed the government's argument that it has the power to begin official Brexit negotiations with the rest of the EU without Parliament's prior agreement.

By a margin of eight to three, the 11 justices upheld November's High Court ruling which stated that it would be unlawful for the government to rely on executive powers known as the royal prerogative to implement the outcome of last year's referendum.

It said a law would have to be passed to authorise Article 50 but the precise form such legislation should take was "entirely a matter" for Parliament.

*What happens next?*





Attorney General Jeremy Wright said the government would "comply with the judgement of the court and do all that is necessary to implement it".

In a statement to Parliament setting out details of the government's legislative response, David Davis said he intended to publish an outline bill "within days".

The BBC's political editor Laura Kuenssberg said the details could be announced as early as Thursday, with a view to staging the first vote next week and getting it through the Commons within a couple of weeks.

*So Parliament's voice will be heard - but how?*





We will get more details from the government later this week, with draft legislation already said to have been prepared in preparation for the appeal being rejected.

The new bill is expected to be short, with the government's lawyer suggesting during the hearing that "one-line" legislation could be put forward.

Both the House of Commons and House of Lords will have to vote in favour of it.

Separately, the government has agreed to produce an official policy document known as a White Paper explaining its objectives for the upcoming Brexit negotiations.

Ministers initially resisted the move, saying it would take too long, but Theresa May has agreed to it. The concession is being seen as a victory for opposition parties and a group of former Tory ministers who oppose a so-called "hard Brexit" and want to examine the government's plans in greater detail.

*How long will this process take?*





The bill will be given special priority by Parliament, whose order of business is still largely controlled by ministers.

While Tory MPs would like to see it fast-tracked through Parliament, many Labour, Lib Dem and SNP MPs will want as much time as possible to discuss a variety of issues and to make amendments.

The SNP responded to the ruling by saying it would table 50 "serious and substantive" amendments.

Labour said it too would seek to amend the bill but would not "frustrate" the Brexit process.

However it pans out, BBC Parliamentary correspondent Mark D'Arcy says the bill could pass through the Commons before the half-term recess in the middle of February, giving ample time for the Lords to then consider it and for it to become law before the end of March.

While there are some MPs who want the process to be delayed, they are vastly outnumbered by those who want the government to get on with it so that the UK will have left the EU by the time of the next election - scheduled for May 2020.

*Is there any chance of Brexit being blocked? *





In theory, yes there is. But in reality it is extremely unlikely to happen.

Few, if any, Conservative MPs are likely to vote against Article 50. In fact, only one - the europhile former chancellor Ken Clarke - has said he will do so.

Given that the Tories have a working majority of 15 in the Commons, this means that the bill is guaranteed to pass - especially since a majority of Labour MPs have said they will not stand in the way of the process and many will actually vote for Article 50.

Although the Lib Dems, the SNP and some Labour MPs are likely to vote against, this will make little difference. What will be more interesting is if a coalition of pro-European Conservatives and opposition MPs join forces to win concessions, over the extent of Parliamentary scrutiny of the two-year process.

Events in the Lords - where the government does not have a working majority and there are 178 non-affiliated cross-bench peers - could be more unpredictable. Mark D'Arcy says there are murmurings of an organised attempt to resist Article 50 and a "doomed last stand" by diehard Remainers.

But amid warnings that any attempt to block Brexit could trigger a general election, in which the future of the Lords would be a major issue - it is likely that the skirmishes will amount to just that and the government will eventually get its way.

*What does it mean for Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales?*





The Supreme Court case wasn't just a battle over the powers of the executive and the legislature.

The justices heard a number of separate but related challenges to the government's Brexit approach, centred around the involvement of the devolved administrations in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

But the court unanimously ruled that devolved administrations did not need to be consulted, and did not have a right to veto Article 50.

The government has previously said Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland will be kept fully involved.


_http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-38721650_


----------



## ahojunk

*Brexit: UK House of Commons gives Theresa May power to trigger exit from European Union*
Updated yesterday at 8:25pm

Prime Minister Theresa May has won approval from her parliament's lower chamber to trigger Britain's exit from the European Union, defeating attempts by pro-EU politicians to attach extra conditions to her plan to start divorce talks by March 31.

*Key points:*

Brexit minister hails the 'historic vote' for helping move EU negotiations forward
The bill must be approved by the House of Lords, where May does not hold a majority
The law debates exposed two fault lines: pro-EU Scotland's disconnect and divisions within the Labour Party
MPs voted 494 to 122 in favour of a law giving Ms May the right to start the formal Brexit process, ending days of intense debate which has tested Ms May's slim parliamentary majority.

The bill must now be approved by the upper chamber, in which Ms May does not have a majority, before it becomes law.

The victory marks a significant step towards starting what is expected to be a complex and difficult two-year negotiation with the EU on issues such as trade, immigration and security that will redraw Britain's role in the world.

"We've seen a historic vote tonight," Brexit minister David Davis said.

After surviving a minor rebellion from within Ms May's Conservative Party that had threatened to undermine her authority and negotiating strategy, the law was passed without amendment and on schedule.

That raised expectations the bill will enjoy an equally smooth passage in the unelected House of Lords, when its journey there begins in earnest on February 20 — the government wants to complete the legislative process by March 7.

*Law debate exposes two major divisions*

Sources close to discussions in the upper chamber said they expected peers to keep pushing for parliament to have more say during the negotiating process.

One source said that could mean a one-week delay to the law's final approval, but neither expected the process to endanger Ms May's end of March deadline.

At times rancorous, the debate exposed two major fault lines running through Britain's post-referendum politics: the disconnect between strongly pro-EU Scotland and the rest of the country, and the division over Europe in the opposition Labour Party.

An opinion poll indicated on Wednesday that support for Scottish independence had risen since Ms May came out last month in favour of Britain making a clean break when it leaves the EU.

Scottish National Party (SNP) MPs repeatedly said in parliament they were being denied a voice in the Brexit process, which was fuelling demand for another independence referendum.

"The barracking by government members and the preventing of SNP MPs from speaking in this House play right into our hands and result in headlines saying that support for independence is surging," said SNP politician Joanna Cherry.

As the final votes were being counted, SNP lawmakers sang Beethoven's Ode to Joy — the EU's anthem — in the debating chamber.

The law has also become a conduit for frustrations within the Labour Party, which has split over whether it should support Ms May's vision of Brexit or try to block it to secure a different deal.

*Reuters*


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## Dai Toruko

Queen Elizabeth signs Brexit deal into law authorizing exit from EU


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## A.P. Richelieu

Brexit may only be temporary!

Reactions: Like Like:
2


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## Vergennes

*Merkel: Britain is wasting its time thinking it will get equal EU rights*

https://www.thelocal.de/20170427/me...its-time-thinking-it-will-get-equal-eu-rights


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## waz

Vergennes said:


> *Merkel: Britain is wasting its time thinking it will get equal EU rights*
> 
> https://www.thelocal.de/20170427/me...its-time-thinking-it-will-get-equal-eu-rights



Then Britain will say goodbye, and it's going to be German industry who will booting out of power after that lol.


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## Path-Finder

I didn't vote in Brexit either for or against. I was Neutral


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## Piotr

*EU signals Northern Ireland could join if united with Ireland*
BRUSSELS, 28. Apr, 17:59

EU leaders are to confirm at a summit in Brussels on Saturday (28 April) that if Northern Ireland reunited with Ireland it would automatically become part of the bloc.

The issue could irritate London ahead of 8 June's general election and the soon-to-begin Brexit talks.

The Irish commitment, which had always been an informal understanding, will not be part of the EU 27’s negotiating guidelines, but it will be annexed to the document as part of the minutes of the discussion upon Ireland's request.

The British government has a similar understanding.

Brexit secretary David Davis in a leaked letter in March said: "In that event [Irish reunification] Northern Ireland would be in a position of becoming part of an existing EU member state, rather than seeking to join the EU as a new independent state."

On the other hand, if Scotland broke away from the UK to become a sovereign state it would have to apply for EU membership.

The Scottish government said it wants to hold a new independence referendum because Scots voted to stay in the EU in the Brexit referendum last year.

The Irish pledge is the only new element that has emerged in the EU's position as it prepares for its first ever formal summit without the UK under the Article 50 exit procedure.

*Key elements*
Leaders are expected to agree on the so-called negotiating guidelines that sets out the red lines for the bloc.

Upholding the 1998 Good Friday Agreement that, which brought an end to decades of violence over Northern Ireland's status, is one of the key issues.

The EU wants to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland, while maintaining the external borders of the EU, which will shift after Brexit.

Safeguarding the rights of EU citizens living in the UK, and of UK citizens residing in the EU is another key element for the EU in the Brexit talks.

We need "guarantees that are effective, enforceable, non-discriminatory and comprehensive, and which should be accompanied by simple and smooth administrative procedures", European Council chef Donald Tusk said in his invitation letter to leaders.

EU officials are looking for UK guarantees that the rights of EU citizens who live in Britain will accumulate until the day of withdrawal, meaning that if someone moved to the UK the day before the UK left the EU they would still be entitled to their full rights as an EU passport holder.

"Assurances so far from UK government that acquired rights will be protected is not enough," one senior diplomat told EUobserver.

The third key element is the "bill" the UK will have to pay when it leaves to honour its previous financial commitments.

Another senior EU official quipped that he had never seen EU states, who normally fight over who foots the bill in the EU budget, work so closely together as on British prime minister Theresa May's divorce settlement.

The final figure of that bill is unlikely to be clarified until the end of the process.

EU countries first want to reach on understanding with the UK on the methodology of what should and should not be included in the settlement, before moving onto the next phase of talks.

*Phased goodbye*
Tusk has reiterated that, contrary to May's expectations, the talks will have to be two-phased.

"We will not discuss our future relations with the UK until we have achieved sufficient progress on the main issues relating to the UK's withdrawal from the EU," he wrote in his letter on Friday.

The EU-27 will decide when that "sufficient progress" has been reached, in a unanimous political decision by the EU nations.

"It is not a matter of tactics, given the limited timeframe, it is the only possible approach," an EU official told this website.

The divorce deal will have to be agreed and ratified by March 2019.

That is when the UK automatically leaves the EU even if there is no deal in place, unless the EU-27 agree to give more time.

A transitional arrangement is another possibility to bridge the time between the withdrawal and the deal on the future relations entering into force.

*Relocate agencies*
On Saturday, Tusk and European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker will also propose a roadmap on relocating the two EU agencies that are based in the UK - the European Medicines Agency and the European Banking Authority.

EU leaders are expected to agree on the procedure and criteria for relocations in June, and EU officials are aiming for a decision this year.

Fighting for EU agencies is a toxic issue for member states.

May on Thursday accused the 27 of "lining up against Britain", to which a senior EU diplomat bluntly reacted: "She is right."

Officials highlighted rare unity of the 27 member states in the process so far.

"It took the UK nine months to prepare the notification letter, the 27 have their position in one month," a senior EU official said.

Sources said that that unity would be tested, however.

"Over time it will be difficult. It will be relatively easier to keep the unity in the withdrawal part of the discussion and more challenging in the future relationship talk," said one EU official.

Saturday's meeting is expected to be short and devoted only to Brexit.

The negotiating directives for EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier will be officially agreed by EU affairs ministers on 22 May, making the EU ready to kick off the exit talks.

Officials said it was likely that the 27 leaders would have to meet on Brexit during the upcoming June, October, and December EU summits as well.
Source: https://euobserver.com/uk-referendum/137722

I'm afraid lackeys of the so called "Queen of England" aka "unionists" in northern part of Ireland curently occupied by England will try to disrupt unification of Ireland.

Let Ireland be Ireland.


----------



## Blue Marlin

Piotr said:


> *EU signals Northern Ireland could join if united with Ireland*
> BRUSSELS, 28. Apr, 17:59
> 
> EU leaders are to confirm at a summit in Brussels on Saturday (28 April) that if Northern Ireland reunited with Ireland it would automatically become part of the bloc.
> 
> The issue could irritate London ahead of 8 June's general election and the soon-to-begin Brexit talks.
> 
> The Irish commitment, which had always been an informal understanding, will not be part of the EU 27’s negotiating guidelines, but it will be annexed to the document as part of the minutes of the discussion upon Ireland's request.
> 
> The British government has a similar understanding.
> 
> Brexit secretary David Davis in a leaked letter in March said: "In that event [Irish reunification] Northern Ireland would be in a position of becoming part of an existing EU member state, rather than seeking to join the EU as a new independent state."
> 
> On the other hand, if Scotland broke away from the UK to become a sovereign state it would have to apply for EU membership.
> 
> The Scottish government said it wants to hold a new independence referendum because Scots voted to stay in the EU in the Brexit referendum last year.
> 
> The Irish pledge is the only new element that has emerged in the EU's position as it prepares for its first ever formal summit without the UK under the Article 50 exit procedure.
> 
> *Key elements*
> Leaders are expected to agree on the so-called negotiating guidelines that sets out the red lines for the bloc.
> 
> Upholding the 1998 Good Friday Agreement that, which brought an end to decades of violence over Northern Ireland's status, is one of the key issues.
> 
> The EU wants to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland, while maintaining the external borders of the EU, which will shift after Brexit.
> 
> Safeguarding the rights of EU citizens living in the UK, and of UK citizens residing in the EU is another key element for the EU in the Brexit talks.
> 
> We need "guarantees that are effective, enforceable, non-discriminatory and comprehensive, and which should be accompanied by simple and smooth administrative procedures", European Council chef Donald Tusk said in his invitation letter to leaders.
> 
> EU officials are looking for UK guarantees that the rights of EU citizens who live in Britain will accumulate until the day of withdrawal, meaning that if someone moved to the UK the day before the UK left the EU they would still be entitled to their full rights as an EU passport holder.
> 
> "Assurances so far from UK government that acquired rights will be protected is not enough," one senior diplomat told EUobserver.
> 
> The third key element is the "bill" the UK will have to pay when it leaves to honour its previous financial commitments.
> 
> Another senior EU official quipped that he had never seen EU states, who normally fight over who foots the bill in the EU budget, work so closely together as on British prime minister Theresa May's divorce settlement.
> 
> The final figure of that bill is unlikely to be clarified until the end of the process.
> 
> EU countries first want to reach on understanding with the UK on the methodology of what should and should not be included in the settlement, before moving onto the next phase of talks.
> 
> *Phased goodbye*
> Tusk has reiterated that, contrary to May's expectations, the talks will have to be two-phased.
> 
> "We will not discuss our future relations with the UK until we have achieved sufficient progress on the main issues relating to the UK's withdrawal from the EU," he wrote in his letter on Friday.
> 
> The EU-27 will decide when that "sufficient progress" has been reached, in a unanimous political decision by the EU nations.
> 
> "It is not a matter of tactics, given the limited timeframe, it is the only possible approach," an EU official told this website.
> 
> The divorce deal will have to be agreed and ratified by March 2019.
> 
> That is when the UK automatically leaves the EU even if there is no deal in place, unless the EU-27 agree to give more time.
> 
> A transitional arrangement is another possibility to bridge the time between the withdrawal and the deal on the future relations entering into force.
> 
> *Relocate agencies*
> On Saturday, Tusk and European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker will also propose a roadmap on relocating the two EU agencies that are based in the UK - the European Medicines Agency and the European Banking Authority.
> 
> EU leaders are expected to agree on the procedure and criteria for relocations in June, and EU officials are aiming for a decision this year.
> 
> Fighting for EU agencies is a toxic issue for member states.
> 
> May on Thursday accused the 27 of "lining up against Britain", to which a senior EU diplomat bluntly reacted: "She is right."
> 
> Officials highlighted rare unity of the 27 member states in the process so far.
> 
> "It took the UK nine months to prepare the notification letter, the 27 have their position in one month," a senior EU official said.
> 
> Sources said that that unity would be tested, however.
> 
> "Over time it will be difficult. It will be relatively easier to keep the unity in the withdrawal part of the discussion and more challenging in the future relationship talk," said one EU official.
> 
> Saturday's meeting is expected to be short and devoted only to Brexit.
> 
> The negotiating directives for EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier will be officially agreed by EU affairs ministers on 22 May, making the EU ready to kick off the exit talks.
> 
> Officials said it was likely that the 27 leaders would have to meet on Brexit during the upcoming June, October, and December EU summits as well.
> Source: https://euobserver.com/uk-referendum/137722
> 
> I'm afraid lackeys of the so called "Queen of England" aka "unionists" in northern part of Ireland curently occupied by England will try to disrupt unification of Ireland.
> 
> Let Ireland be Ireland.


what a load of horse shit, article 50 has been triggered and there coming for the ride. they scots tried something similar but failed.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Piotr

Blue Marlin said:


> what a load of horse shit, article 50 has been triggered and there coming for the ride.



You have to pay €100bn:
*Report: EU raises initial Brexit demand to €100bn*
3. May, 08:22
Following the requests of several member states, the EU has raised its opening demand for Britain’s Brexit bill to an upfront gross payment of up to €100bn, according to the Financial Times. France and Poland have pushed to include post-Brexit annual farm payments in the sum of money. However, the calculations vary widely depending on the UK's possible exit date, its share of contributions, its EU budget rebate, and liabilities.
Source: https://euobserver.com/tickers/137749https://euobserver.com/tickers/137749



> they scots tried something similar but failed.



You stolen Scotland's independence. You rigged Scottish Independence Referendum (source)
Let Scotland be Scotland.


----------



## Zibago

*Merkel warns UK cap on EU immigration post-Brexit would have 'its price'*
German Chancellor Angela Merkel has warned of consequences in case Britain restricted EU immigration. Her comment came as Nigel Farage delivered his own warning to the EU Parliament.






The German chancellor delivered a vague but pointed warning to British leaders on Wednesday amid questions over how the UK's divorce from the EU will impact the free movement of people across Europe.

Speaking at an event for labor union officials in Berlin, Merkel said that "if the British government says that free movement of people is no longer valid, that will have its price in relations with Britain."

Merkel said that if Britain were to limit the number of EU citizens allowed into the country to only 100,000 or 200,000, for example, "we would have to think about what obstacle we create from the European side to compensate that." She was quick to say, however, that such a plan wasn't meant to be "malicious."

Freedom of movement between the UK and the EU remains a central issue in negotiations over Brexit, whose supporters often pointed to migration as one of the most compelling reasons to leave the 28-member bloc.




Farage tells EU to 'grow up'

Also on Wednesday, MEP Nigel Farage of UKIP, the right-wing populist and euroskeptic party that led the drive to leave the EU, warned his colleagues in the EU Parliament that the UK would walk away from the table if Brussels continued its "bullying" behavior.

"In any other part of the civilized world frankly that behavior would be considered to be bloody rude and the act of a bully," Farage said. "Well I'll tell you something, your attempt to bully the Brits through these negotiations is not working, sixty-eight percent now of the British people want Brexit to happen."

Farage was responding to alleged leaks following a meeting between May and EU Commision President Jean-Claude Juncker.

"Either we get some grown up, reasonable demands from the European Union or the United Kingdom will be forced to walk away before the end of this year," he said.

blc/rc (AP, Reuters, dpa)


----------



## Piotr

*Jean-Claude Juncker: ‘English is losing importance’*
The European Commission president opted to deliver a speech in Florence in French.

By Ryan Heath

5/5/17, 11:52 AM CET

Updated 5/8/17, 2:51 PM CET

FLORENCE — Jean-Claude Juncker, the European Commission president, opted to deliver a speech in French on Friday morning because he said “English is losing importance” in Europe.

He gave the comments, which are unlikely to mend fences after a war of words between Brussels and London over Brexit negotiations, at the “State of the Union” conference in Florence’s Palazzo Vecchio — an annual event for European dignitaries.


Juncker said he was opting for French because “slowly but surely English is losing importance in Europe and France has elections this Sunday and I want the French people to understand what I am saying about the importance of the EU.”

The Commission president tackled the row that erupted over a private meeting he had with U.K. Prime Minister Theresa May last week. Following the meeting Juncker reportedly said: “I leave Downing Street 10 times more skeptical than I was before.” May gave a speech on the steps of Downing Street on Thursday in which she said some in Europe were trying influence the British election.

In Florence, Juncker said, “[Brexit] is no small event. Of course we will negotiate with our British friends in full transparency. But there should be no doubt whatsoever about the idea that it is the EU that is abandoning the U.K. It is the opposite in fact. It is the U.K. that is abandoning the EU.”

European Parliament President Antonio Tajani offered his full support to EU Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier and attempted to tone down the verbal joust with London.

“There is no ill will toward them. No one wants to interfere in the election of the U.K,” he said. Tajani said the EU simply wants a stable government it can negotiate with. “It would be detrimental to everyone were we not capable of reaching an agreement,” Tajani said.

The EU’s chief Brexit negotiator Michel Barnier said he would deliver his speech in English. “Obviously I want to be understood by the French, but it is equally important than I am understood by the British people,” he said.

Source: http://www.politico.eu/article/jean-claude-juncker-english-is-losing-importance/


----------



## Cell_DbZ

*Brexit: Remain would win if new EU referendum vote were held tomorrow, poll finds*


Survation survey shows 54 per cent of Britons would now prefer to stay in Europe

*Monday 3 July 2017*
Staff and agencies






Bad news for Brexit Secretary David Davis Reuters
The outcome of the Brexit referendum would be reversed if it was held tomorrow, a poll suggests.

The Survation survey showed a clear majority of Britons (54 per cent) would vote to Remain in the European Union if another referendum was held, while 46 per cent would back Brexit.

As Commons Leader Andrea Leadsom signalled a more consultative approach, the Survation survey also showed just over half want a cross-party coalition of parties to negotiate the UK's exit from the EU, compared to less than a third who think it should fall to the Tory minority Government alone.


Theresa May found herself ahead of Jeremy Corbyn on which leader voters trust more to negotiate the best deal, at 51 per cent to 35 per cent respectively.

However, a majority said the best outcome would be to stop exit talks altogether and work to stay in the EU, while around a third backed paying a fee for access to the tariff-free customs union.

Less than a quarter support the Government's current strategy of leaving the customs union in order to strike free trade deals with other countries, as Labour signalled its strongest backing for staying in the bloc yet.

However more Britons (47 per cent) oppose a referendum on the final deal than support it (46 per cent).

Meanwhile, the poll showed the Tories regaining a one-point lead over Labour.

But a separate Opinium survey for the Observer showed Labour on 45 per cent, six points ahead of the Tories on 39 per cent.

That poll also showed Mrs May with a net approval rating of -20 following her disastrous general election, with Mr Corbyn on +4. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...new-eu-exit-vote-survation-poll-a7820286.html


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## MMM-E

Brits are so smart


----------



## Path-Finder

Bloody hell.


----------



## Wolfhunter

Brexit is a disaster for the UK.


----------



## Path-Finder

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/951432504568774656


----------



## Wolfhunter

Path-Finder said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/951432504568774656



I hate this charlatan.


----------



## Numerous

Didn't know you guys had a brexit thread


----------



## Dubious

President Macron and other member states fear Britain could gain advantage over them by undercutting EU environment laws
Daniel Boffey in Brussels

Sat 17 Nov 2018 19.28 GMT






Emmanuel Macron’s climate change demand is just one of a series by member states on the Brexit negotiations. Photograph: Sébastien Bozon/AFP/Getty Images

*France is pushing the UK to incorporate future European climate change directives into law automatically in return for an ambitious trade deal with the EU.*

*A large number of member states fear that the UK could enjoy an economic advantage after Brexit if it were able to diverge from European laws and regulations, and they want to use their leverage now to force a commitment from future British governments.*

The demand by Emmanuel Macron for the UK to be tied into the EU’s Paris 2030 targets was just one of a series of interventions made by member states during recent meetings with Michel Barnier and his negotiating team.

*While a UK withdrawal agreement dealing with citizens’ rights, the £39bn financial settlement and the Irish border have been agreed in principle, the political declaration on the future relationship is yet to be finalised.* A seven-page declaration published last week is set to become a much heavier document* after member states made a series of interventions in meetings with the European commission for additional text.* One EU diplomat said:* “It’s a Christmas tree and all the member states are putting their baubles on it.”*

Olly Robbins, Downing Street’s Brexit adviser, was in Brussels this weekend for meetings with the commission. *On Sunday, ambassadors for the 27 member states are to meet Barnier to discuss the text. *Negotiations will have to be completed when ministers for the 27 meet on Monday, with a draft due to be made public on Tuesday.

Downing Street is hopeful that the political declaration can be a “sweetener” to the withdrawal agreement, which has faced a storm of protest in Britain.

On Saturday, Commons leader Andrea Leadsom insisted there was “more to be done” before a special European council meeting on Sunday 25 November to get “the best possible deal for the UK”.

*But the extra demands on the UK are likely to be unwelcome to Brexiters, who fear that the government is allowing the UK to be permanently sucked into the EU’s regulatory orbit.*

While the UK is a leading light among the EU member states on climate change, the French government is concerned that in a post-Brexit world there will be calls within Britain to undercut the rest of the continent.

The EU has been steadily ratcheting up its targets as part of the 2015 Paris climate change accord, and France wants the UK to be bound to them.

*Last week the European parliament adopted energy-savings targets of 32.5% and a renewable energy uplift of 32% by 2030*. That will put the bloc on course to cut emissions by 45% from 1990 levels by 2030.

The most politically sensitive demand from the EU is likely, however, *to concern the trade-off the bloc wants to make between access for the European fishing fleet to British waters and the wider trade deal.*

It is understood that* a clause will be included in the political declaration making a link between British companies having access to the European market, and maintaining the “existing reciprocal access to fishing waters and resources”.*

The EU wants a deal on access to UK waters by July 2020, with the UK being tied to making its “best endeavour” to get an agreement,* or British exporters will face a loss of access to its market for their own goods.*

A number of member states are also championing more positive language in the political declaration on the future trading relationship.

One diplomat from a European country on the western fringe of the EU said: *“The relationship as sketched out in the political declaration doesn’t do enough for us. It doesn’t protect the supply lines and we should aim higher, and lock ourselves in to achieve more.”*

Andrew Duff, a former MEP, and visiting fellow at the European Policy Centre thinktank, said: *“The political declaration needs to do two things* – corral the 27 behind a settled course of action leading to an unprecedented association agreement with the UK, and secondly to commit the British prime minister – and if possible her successor – in that same direction.

“It can’t be too loose, therefore, but also can’t be so tightly drafted that it pre-empts the association agreement negotiations. It’s the first chance for the EU 27 to plot the future of Europe without the Brits – an important moment, therefore.”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/nov/17/france-wants-uk-climate-pledge-brexit-trade-deal


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## Ali_Baba

We need a new prime minister who will tell the EU where to get off, and who will fight for the UK.

The current one, only seems to be interested in taking "instructions" from the EU..


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## 313ghazi

The Maybot has not postponed the vote on brexshit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-may-postpones-brexit-deal-meaningful-vote-eu

Meanwhile the pound is at an 18 month low.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...s-trade-war-growth-fears-uk-gdp-business-live


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## KhalaiMakhlooq

Since the UK Government has been found 'In contempt of Parliament' ( https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-advice-government-geoffrey-cox-a8667086.html ), the *first time in entire history of the UK*, this has happened...

*Teresa May walks out of Parliament, In Face of No Confidence Vote.*






*There will be a total brexit mission failure *
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/to...s-and-farm-animals-voted-for-brexit-1-5620470



Cell_DbZ said:


> *Brexit: Remain would win if new EU referendum vote were held tomorrow, poll finds*
> 
> 
> Survation survey shows 54 per cent of Britons would now prefer to stay in Europe
> 
> *Monday 3 July 2017*
> Staff and agencies
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bad news for Brexit Secretary David Davis Reuters
> The outcome of the Brexit referendum would be reversed if it was held tomorrow, a poll suggests.
> 
> The Survation survey showed a clear majority of Britons (54 per cent) would vote to Remain in the European Union if another referendum was held, while 46 per cent would back Brexit.
> 
> As Commons Leader Andrea Leadsom signalled a more consultative approach, the Survation survey also showed just over half want a cross-party coalition of parties to negotiate the UK's exit from the EU, compared to less than a third who think it should fall to the Tory minority Government alone.
> 
> 
> Theresa May found herself ahead of Jeremy Corbyn on which leader voters trust more to negotiate the best deal, at 51 per cent to 35 per cent respectively.
> 
> However, a majority said the best outcome would be to stop exit talks altogether and work to stay in the EU, while around a third backed paying a fee for access to the tariff-free customs union.
> 
> Less than a quarter support the Government's current strategy of leaving the customs union in order to strike free trade deals with other countries, as Labour signalled its strongest backing for staying in the bloc yet.
> 
> However more Britons (47 per cent) oppose a referendum on the final deal than support it (46 per cent).
> 
> Meanwhile, the poll showed the Tories regaining a one-point lead over Labour.
> 
> But a separate Opinium survey for the Observer showed Labour on 45 per cent, six points ahead of the Tories on 39 per cent.
> 
> That poll also showed Mrs May with a net approval rating of -20 following her disastrous general election, with Mr Corbyn on +4.
> 
> http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...new-eu-exit-vote-survation-poll-a7820286.html



Will never happen, they tease the idea but they cant do it. 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/9...an-Second-Referendum-aliens-Michael-Heseltine


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## Ali_Baba

if there is another vote, then there will be one after. Other problem is the Scots will want another one aswell.

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## KhalaiMakhlooq

*EU-UK Announces plans for 'NO-DEAL' brexit.*

The European Commission says it has started to implement its preparations for a no-deal Brexit - in case the UK crashes out of the EU without a plan. It has announced temporary measures to try to reduce the impact, but says it cannot counter all the problems it expects.

Read more.. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46617152

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## KhalaiMakhlooq

*Updates:

1. Brexit DELAY - final split from EU pushed to December 2021
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1...esa-May-deal-Ireland-backstop-MPs-vote-latest*

*2. France ORDERS Britain to 'STICK TO IT' as row erupts over May’s DOOMED deal and REFUSES to help whatsoever
https://www.express.co.uk/news/poli...-delay-article-50-meaningful-vote-theresa-may
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1...Theresa-May-deal-vote-Nathalie-Loiseau-latest*

*3. US downgrades EU diplomatic status in Washington, DOESN'T EVEN BOTHER notifying them*







Previously US practice was to treat the EU delegation and ambassador "as a country would be", now it its been downgraded to "international organisation" Read more: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46798861

*4. 'No deal' is what people actually want says Boris Johnson, Downing Street disagrees sending Cabinet into 'Civil War' *
*
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1068831/brexit-news-no-deal-boris-johnson-peoples-vote

https://www.itv.com/news/2019-01-08/the-cabinet-civil-war-on-a-no-deal-brexit/*

*5. Farage FURIOUS, says 'My car was SMASHED up!'  *






Mr Farage appeared passionate in his tirade which he delivered to ITV Good Morning Britain host Piers Morgan earlier today. He said: 

"I’ve suffered this every day. I mean literally every day, year after year. We even reached the position where my family was attacked - the car was smashed up and vandalised, written off. And the police didn’t pursue a single prosecution."

*READ MORE: https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/t...ubry-abuse-Brexit-news-BBC-Sky-EU-Theresa-May*

*7. The ONLY thing we are CERTAIN of, is that no one actually knows whats going on


 https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1063057301635059717*

*8. No more 'evidence of Cocaine' found in the bathrooms of UK and EU Parliaments. We can assume Brexit will not be a 'white affair'. *

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/1494167/Cocaine-found-at-Brussels-parliament.html
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...races-cocaine-toilets-Palace-Westminster.html


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## KhalaiMakhlooq

Government loses Brexit 'Plan-B' vote in Parliament.


----------



## Ali_Baba

KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> *Updates:*
> *3. US downgrades EU diplomatic status in Washington, DOESN'T EVEN BOTHER notifying them*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Previously US practice was to treat the EU delegation and ambassador "as a country would be", now it its been downgraded to "international organisation" Read more: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-46798861



This absolutely brilliant and very correct and accurate. I think we in the UK should do the same when we get the chance to do so !!!

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## KhalaiMakhlooq

Ali_Baba said:


> This absolutely brilliant and very correct and accurate. I think we in the UK should do the same when we get the chance to do so !!!



lol, we just make out, what you on about, we already left... you can check our website.


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## Ali_Baba

KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> lol, we just make out, what you on about, we already left... you can check our website.



You turned on the beeb recently? Brexit dead dude. Dead... we are gonna be turned into a banana republic by the weaked minder remoaners ....


----------



## KhalaiMakhlooq

Ali_Baba said:


> You turned on the beeb recently? Brexit dead dude. Dead... we are gonna be turned into a banana republic by the weaked minder remoaners ....



what no what happened, no-deal brexit


----------



## Ali_Baba

KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> what no what happened, no-deal brexit



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6576431/Senior-Tories-open-talks-Labour-Brexit.html

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## KhalaiMakhlooq

Ali_Baba said:


> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6576431/Senior-Tories-open-talks-Labour-Brexit.html



mini revolution! yikes


----------



## KhalaiMakhlooq

*UK PM says 'no Brexit' more likely than 'no deal'*
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46856149


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## Ali_Baba

The dream is over!!!!!!!


----------



## 313ghazi

Latest update - Nissan will no longer manufacture the new X-trail in Sunderland, instead they'll be making it in Japan. It makes sense, they have an FTA with the EU, why manufacture in a country that doesn't?

This is on top of;

Dyson moving to Singapore (despite campaigning for Brexit).
Airbus threatening to leave
Merrill Lynch moving jobs to Paris
Jaguar Landrover cutting jobs

Apparently the Tories want the no-lube no deal version of brexit!


----------



## Nasr

KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> Government loses Brexit 'Plan-B' vote in Parliament.



It is like watching a Netflix soap opera, most are paid actors performing to the british public, most of whom are as clueless as these actors and actresses. british are what they were before, an evil, colonial, imperial empire. The clothes and the manner of speaking has changed, otherwise they have the same mentality as they did for the last 500 years. Just better concealed.


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## 313ghazi

*British Government admits paying Nissan to stay post Brexit*

The business secretary has been forced to admit the existence of a previously secret package of state aid to Nissan that could have been worth up to £80m had the carmaker gone ahead with plans to manufacture a new model X-Trail in Sunderland after Brexit.

Greg Clark released a letter dated October 2016 in which he pledged tens of millions of taxpayer support and promised the Japanese company it would not be “adversely affected” after the UK left the EU.

Yet, at the time the commitments were first made, Downing Street had said “there was no special deal for Nissan” and Clark refused six times to answer a question about what was on offer when interviewed on the BBC. He even appeared to suggest no money was involved. Asked on BBC One’s Question Time about the deal, he said: “There’s no chequebook. I don’t have a chequebook.”

Clark and the government had repeatedly refused to release the 2016 letter until the promises turned out to be worthless, because Nissan had abandoned its future investment plan, partly because of uncertainty over Brexit.

The four-page document, sent by Clark to Nissan’s then chief executive, Carlos Ghosn, committed the government to “a package of support in areas such as skills, R&D and innovation” which “could amount to additional support of up to £80m”.

The state aid package ultimately turned out to be worth £61m when it was formally awarded to Nissan in June 2018, a fact only acknowledged by Clark in a second letter sent on Monday to the Labour MP Rachel Reeves, who chairs the business select committee.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...o-nissan-reveals-brexit-promise-to-carmarkers

========

The politicians knew about the damage their stupid political willy waving would cause - yet went ahead with it anyway. It's unforgiveable.


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## 313ghazi

Ford read to leave Britain in event of No-deal Brexit

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-b...tive-production-sites-the-times-idUKKCN1Q12SK

NHS to stockpile bodybags to cope with no-deal Brexit

“The Department is working with its partners across Government, in the health sector and in industry to prepare for any possible disruption in the supply chain.

“While this does not mean that we are expecting such disruption, the Government is preparing for all exit scenarios.

“These include sensible strategies for devices and consumables, including body bags, that come to the UK from or through the EU, such as precautionary stockpiling by suppliers, to ensure that the supply of essential products is not disrupted.”

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/nhs-stockpiling-body-bags-cope-13985984


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## KhalaiMakhlooq

313ghazi said:


> “These include sensible strategies for devices and consumables, including body bags, that come to the UK from or through the EU, such as precautionary stockpiling by suppliers, to ensure that the supply of essential products is not disrupted.”



why are they so dramatic, unless brexit is a code word for jesus coming back to destory mankind for their sins



KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> why are they so dramatic, unless brexit is a code word for jesus coming back to destory mankind for their sins


i hope he starts with the heads of the goverments of the world. then the religous leaders next.



KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> i hope he starts with the heads of the goverments of the world. then the religous leaders next.



then all the armed forces of the world.



KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> then all the armed forces of the world.



then all the slave master and bankers



KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> and then all the slave master and bankers



then the liars, scribes and pharisees



KhalaiMakhlooq said:


> then the liars, scribes and pharisees



then ebay, because theys so much fake shit on there i keep getting scammed.


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## k s ahmed

UK is trying to show that they are important . EU doesn't give a damn .
Juncker was saying that I am wasting my.tkme.in Brexit. UK politics is exactly the same as dirty Pakistani politics and those whom we call civilised are true animals . This is the time to see their real face


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## dexter

Brexit? Is that still happening, or what?


----------



## A.P. Richelieu

View this content on Instagram            View this content on Instagram


----------



## KhalaiMakhlooq

*MPs reject all 8 different Brexit options*

Published on Mar 27, 2019






*MPs reject all four different options to Theresa May’s deal in the second round of indicative votes*

Published on Apr 1, 2019


----------



## Battle of Waterloo

Boris Johnson has said that the UK will leave the EU by the end of October no matter what.

The current British position is that the Irish backstop must be taken off the table. 

The current EU position is that they will not renegotiate at all the deal Theresa May's government reached.

Therefore, we have a stalemate... 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49240809

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## k s ahmed

buffoon is a shame .. uk will end up in english channel and as a result, there will be no english.. only channel


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## 8888888888888




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## Battle of Waterloo

Good, prevent Parliament blocking a no deal Brexit.


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## Ali_Baba

This is good decision. The sooner the EU occupation over my country ends, the better. This a beautifully bold and decisive decision. Made my day.

The remoaners have broken all the conventions of our demoncracy to have a guerilla movement to stop Brexit. Now, brexiters must return the favour in the same coin to the remoaners...


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## k s ahmed

hahah..
uk has become facist. buffoon is playing juvenile.
scotland hopefully will opt of the "kingdom" and uk will be a dot on the map with lot of control :p


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## Dai Toruko

The British prime minister has put his Brexit deal on hold, after losing a vote in parliament. MPs approved the Brexit agreement Boris Johnson brokered with the EU... but they rejected his plan to push the legislation through parliament in just three days. This makes it unlikely the UK will leave the EU as planned at the end of the month. And as Sarah Morice reports, the prime minister is now considering whether to follow through on his threat to call a snap election.


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## Ali_Baba

Go Bojo!!! Go !!!! Freeeddooommmm !!!!!

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## Ivan

*UK Government ‘failed to investigate’ Russian interference in Brexit*







​By | George Allison | July 21, 2020

*The ‘Russia Report’ reveals that the government failed to investigate Russian meddling in the Brexit vote, only “belatedly realising” the threat from Moscow.*

​The report is the result of an 18-month investigation by the former Intelligence committee chaired by former Attorney General Dominic Grieve.

The report states that there have been widespread allegations that Russia sought to influence voters in the 2016 referendum on the UK’s membership of the EU: studies have pointed to the preponderance of pro-Brexit or anti-EU stories on RT and Sputnik, and the use of ‘bots’ and ‘trolls’, as evidence.

The actual impact of such attempts on the result itself would be difficult – if not impossible – to prove. However what is clear is that the Government was slow to recognise the existence of the threat – only understanding it after the ‘hack and leak’ operation against the Democratic National Committee, when it should have been seen as early as 2014.

As a result states the report, the Government did not take action to protect the UK’s process in 2016. The Committee added that it has not been provided with any post-referendum assessment – in stark contrast to the US response to reports of interference in the 2016 presidential election. They also say that there must be an analogous assessment of Russian interference in the EU referendum.

_“What is clear is that Russian influence in the UK is ‘the new normal’: successive_
_Governments have welcomed the Russian oligarchy with open arms, and there are a lot of Russians with very close links to Putin who are well integrated into the UK business, political and social scene – in ‘Londongrad’ in particular. Yet few, if any, questions have been asked regarding the provenance of their considerable wealth and this ‘open door’ approach provided ideal mechanisms by which illicit finance could be recycled through the London ‘laundromat’. It is not just the oligarchs either – the arrival of Russian money has resulted in a growth industry of ‘enablers’: lawyers, accountants, and estate agents have all played a role, wittingly or unwittingly, and formed a “buffer” of Westerners who are de facto agents of the Russian state.”_

The Intelligence and Security Committee of Parliament issued the following points as part of a press notice with the report.


_Russian influence in the UK is the new normal. Successive_
_Governments have welcomed the oligarchs and their money with open_
_arms, providing them with a means of recycling illicit finance through_
_the London ‘laundromat’, and connections at the highest levels with_
_access to UK companies and political figures._
_This has led to a growth industry of ‘enablers’ including lawyers,_
_accountants, and estate agents who are – wittingly or unwittingly – de_
_facto agents of the Russian state._
_It clearly demonstrates the inherent tension between the Government’s_
_prosperity agenda and the need to protect national security. While we_
_cannot now shut the stable door, greater powers and transparency are_
_needed urgently._
_UK is clearly a target for Russian disinformation. While the mechanics_
_of our paper-based voting system are largely sound, we cannot be_
_complacent about a hostile state taking deliberate action with the aim of_
_influencing our democratic processes._
_Yet the defence of those democratic processes has appeared_
_something of a ‘hot potato’, with no one organisation considering itself_
_to be in the lead, or apparently willing to conduct an assessment of_
_such interference. This must change._
_Social media companies must take action and remove covert hostile_
_state material: Government must ‘name and shame’ those who fail to_
_act._
_We need other countries to step up with the UK and attach a cost to_
_Putin’s actions. Salisbury must not be allowed to become the high water_
_mark in international unity over the Russia threat._
_A number of issues addressed in this published version of the Russia_
_Report are covered in more depth in the Classified Annex. We are not_
_able to discuss these aspects on the grounds of national security._
The Intelligence and Security Committee of Parliament (ISC) is the committee of Parliament with statutory responsibility for oversight of the UK Intelligence Community. In its own words, Under the Justice and Security Act 2013 and the accompanying Memorandum of Understanding, the ISC oversees the policies, expenditure, administration and operations of MI5, MI6, GCHQ, Defence Intelligence, the Joint Intelligence Organisation, the National Security Secretariat (NSS) and the Office for Security and Counter-Terrorism.

The Committee sets its own agenda and work programme, taking evidence from Ministers, the Heads of the intelligence and security Agencies, senior officials, experts, and academics as it considers necessary.


George Allison
George has a degree in Cyber Security from Glasgow Caledonian University and has a keen interest in naval defence technology and cyber security matters.


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## FuturePAF

Is Rishi Sunak likely to become the next British Prime minister, and will that have a significant effect on Pakistan or British-Pakistanis?

The British establishment seems to be promoting this guy heavily.


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## FuturePAF

FuturePAF said:


> Is Rishi Sunak likely to become the next British Prime minister, and will that have a significant effect on Pakistan or British-Pakistanis?
> 
> The British establishment seems to be promoting this guy heavily.


Seem to have called it.

Btw, it looks like this is what Rushi has decided to do for all in the UK. Hopefully it’s all for the best and won’t be too hard on the most vulnerable. Seems like tough years ahead.


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