# STM TURKEY IN TALKS TO DESIGN CORVETTE FOR PAKISTAN



## Zarvan

A Turkish Navy Ada-class corvette. Photo credit: Millisanayi.

In its official press release, the Turkish shipbuilder Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret A.Ş. (STM Turkey) noted that it was in talks with Pakistan “_in order to develop [a] new corvette project, like MILGEM, in order to meet the needs of [the] Pakistan Navy._”

This follows an earlier statement by STM’s General Manager Davut Yilmaz, who had hoped to finalize at least one of two major export orders by the end of 2016, one of which is the Pakistan corvette program.

Pakistan formally requested four MILGEM corvettes in June when Turkey’s defence minister, Fikri Işık, made an official visit to Pakistan.

At the time, Defence Minister Fikri Işık announced that Pakistan’s request for a $400 million U.S. loan/line-of-credit to help finance the acquisition had been referred to the relevant Turkish government bodies.

*Notes, Comments & Analysis*

Pakistan had attempted to acquire four corvettes from Turkey in the late 2000s, but strenuous economic conditions caused those plans to be shelved. Fortunately for the Pakistan Navy, it appears that momentum is once again returning to this requirement. The corvettes are likely being sought to replace the Pakistan Navy’s six Tariq-class (Type 21) frigates, which are on average over 40 years of age. These ships would be used to patrol and defend Pakistan’s sea lines of communication.

At this time, the specific configuration of the Pakistan Navy’s corvette design has not been disclosed. STM seems to be suggesting that a platform could be designed based on the MILGEM, but to what extent it would be similar to the Ada-class corvette is not clear. STM does have numerous surface warship design concepts it could draw upon as it prepares a solution for Pakistan.

That said, there is a noticeable gap in the Pakistan Navy’s anti-air warfare (AAW) capabilities. Its newest warships – i.e. the Zulfiqar-class (F-22P) frigates – do not possess medium-range surface-to-air missile (SAM) systems, which are increasingly common on other modern surface combatants. At present, the Zulfiqar-class frigates depend on the short-range FM-90, which has a range of 15km.

It will be worth seeing if the Pakistan Navy specifies that the corvette design maintain sufficient space for a vertical launch system (VLS), which could be used by a medium-range SAM system.

Interestingly, in June the Pakistan Navy had expressed interest in the Denel Dynamics Umkhonto, though to what extent is not known. The South African SAM system currently possesses a range of 20km (and a maximum altitude reach of 8km). A 25-35km range variant – i.e. Umkhonto-EIR – is under development.

Alternative sources could potentially include Western Europe and China. In the former, the Pakistan Navy could seek the support of MBDA, which has two short-to-medium range SAM systems in its product line – the Aster-15and Common Anti-Air Modular Missile (CAMM). MBDA Italy and MBDA U.K. would likely be the principal vendors, respectively.

In China, Pakistan could closely monitor the development of the NORINCO DK-10A, which reportedly could have a maximum range of 50km. Alternatively, it could potentially wait for the Hisar-O, which is currently being developed in Turkey by Roketsan. The Turkish route would not be unexpected. While Pakistan may have to wait an additional period of time, it would be a simpler process considering it would only require the input of the Turkish defence industry.

Finalizing the corvette contract would amount to a very eventful year for STM, which has also secured the contract to upgrade the Pakistan Navy’s Agosta 90B submarines. In fact, the company is also anticipating to finalize another big-ticket contract, potentially from an Arab Gulf country. These contracts are not only an opportunity STM, but also other Turkish defence vendors, such as Aselsan, Havelsan and Roketsan.

http://quwa.org/2016/08/29/stm-turkey-talks-design-corvette-pakistan/

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## Muhammad Omar

That's gonna be something Like this i guess with VLS

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## PaklovesTurkiye

How about putting and integrating this on our vessels....Laser defense... SAPAN....

http://defence-blog.com/army/turkey-unveils-sapan-prototype-of-electromagnetic-railgun.html

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## The Accountant

PaklovesTurkiye said:


> How about putting and integrating this on our vessels....Laser defense... SAPAN....
> 
> http://defence-blog.com/army/turkey-unveils-sapan-prototype-of-electromagnetic-railgun.html



It requires lot of electrical energyy ... Cannot be genrated byy small power plant of a corvet ...

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## cloud4000

Please indulge me on my ignorance of naval matters, but what's is difference between a corvette and, say, a frigate? Is it a matter of tonnage? Thanks.


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## Benign Persona

cloud4000 said:


> Please indulge me on my ignorance of naval matters, but what's is difference between a corvette and, say, a frigate? Is it a matter of tonnage? Thanks.


in simple words: A corvette is a very small class of combat ship, often the smallest in any fleet. These ships have limited range and weapon systems, but they are quite effective at tracking down and hence primarily used by naval police to patrol the sea and also for close defence of a larger ship. Frigates are larger than corvettes and have a fair mix of offensive and defence capabilities. These are also used for patrol missions and to escort larger ships.

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## PaklovesTurkiye

cloud4000 said:


> Please indulge me on my ignorance of naval matters, but what's is difference between a corvette and, say, a frigate? Is it a matter of tonnage? Thanks.



Someone in the past explained it in hilarious way that I still remember that....

Aircraft Carrier --- Great Grandfather

Destroyer --- Grandfather

Frigate --- Father

Corvette --- Son

 

Hope you got it, now...

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## Tank131

Really in modern navies its a matter of semantics. There are broad overlaps between classes it just depends on what the home navy calls it. For example, the term frigate and destroyer are often used interchangeably in PN. 

But in general corevettes tend to be smallest of the large surface vessels (500-3000 tons), frigates tend to be medium size (2000 - 6000t) while destroyers are larger (5000 - 12000t) and cruisers are the largest though only US and russia have them (9000 - 12000t typically with Kirov class battle cruiser being 24000t)

But the vessels capability is more relevant. Corvettes typically have self protection capability (point defese type missiles), frigates can provide medium ramge air cover, amd destroyers and cruisers provide fleet level air protection.

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## war&peace

The best approach will be a JV-venture between PNS, KSEW and STM for the development of the corvettes specifically for PNS needs. Since KSEW has a large skilled work force with experience of developing and manufacturing large vessels and even submarine, we need to polish them and utilise them instead of totally out-sourcing the design and development to other organisations. That will be rather unfortunate if otherwise is done and would give rise to suspicion of corruption and incompetence of the people involved in such a deal and they will be held accountable even if they reach their graves.

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Great Initiative the sooner the better , wow 1000 users viewing this today

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## PaklovesTurkiye

Tank131 said:


> Really in modern navies its a matter of semantics. There are broad overlaps between classes it just depends on what the home navy calls it. For example, the term frigate and destroyer are often used interchangeably in PN.
> 
> But in general corevettes tend to be smallest of the large surface vessels (500-3000 tons), frigates tend to be medium size (2000 - 6000t) while destroyers are larger (5000 - 12000t) and cruisers are the largest though only US and russia have them (9000 - 12000t typically with Kirov class battle cruiser being 24000t)
> 
> But the vessels capability is more relevant. Corvettes typically have self protection capability (point defese type missiles), frigates can provide medium ramge air cover, amd destroyers and cruisers provide fleet level air protection.



In your opinion, which SAM system PN should opt for its vessels? Which vendor, (China, Turkiye, UK/Italy) can offer better SAM system?


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## tigerrock ali

Zarvan said:


> A Turkish Navy Ada-class corvette. Photo credit: Millisanayi.
> 
> In its official press release, the Turkish shipbuilder Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret A.Ş. (STM Turkey) noted that it was in talks with Pakistan “_in order to develop [a] new corvette project, like MILGEM, in order to meet the needs of [the] Pakistan Navy._”
> 
> This follows an earlier statement by STM’s General Manager Davut Yilmaz, who had hoped to finalize at least one of two major export orders by the end of 2016, one of which is the Pakistan corvette program.
> 
> Pakistan formally requested four MILGEM corvettes in June when Turkey’s defence minister, Fikri Işık, made an official visit to Pakistan.
> 
> At the time, Defence Minister Fikri Işık announced that Pakistan’s request for a $400 million U.S. loan/line-of-credit to help finance the acquisition had been referred to the relevant Turkish government bodies.
> 
> *Notes, Comments & Analysis*
> 
> Pakistan had attempted to acquire four corvettes from Turkey in the late 2000s, but strenuous economic conditions caused those plans to be shelved. Fortunately for the Pakistan Navy, it appears that momentum is once again returning to this requirement. The corvettes are likely being sought to replace the Pakistan Navy’s six Tariq-class (Type 21) frigates, which are on average over 40 years of age. These ships would be used to patrol and defend Pakistan’s sea lines of communication.
> 
> At this time, the specific configuration of the Pakistan Navy’s corvette design has not been disclosed. STM seems to be suggesting that a platform could be designed based on the MILGEM, but to what extent it would be similar to the Ada-class corvette is not clear. STM does have numerous surface warship design concepts it could draw upon as it prepares a solution for Pakistan.
> 
> That said, there is a noticeable gap in the Pakistan Navy’s anti-air warfare (AAW) capabilities. Its newest warships – i.e. the Zulfiqar-class (F-22P) frigates – do not possess medium-range surface-to-air missile (SAM) systems, which are increasingly common on other modern surface combatants. At present, the Zulfiqar-class frigates depend on the short-range FM-90, which has a range of 15km.
> 
> It will be worth seeing if the Pakistan Navy specifies that the corvette design maintain sufficient space for a vertical launch system (VLS), which could be used by a medium-range SAM system.
> 
> Interestingly, in June the Pakistan Navy had expressed interest in the Denel Dynamics Umkhonto, though to what extent is not known. The South African SAM system currently possesses a range of 20km (and a maximum altitude reach of 8km). A 25-35km range variant – i.e. Umkhonto-EIR – is under development.
> 
> Alternative sources could potentially include Western Europe and China. In the former, the Pakistan Navy could seek the support of MBDA, which has two short-to-medium range SAM systems in its product line – the Aster-15and Common Anti-Air Modular Missile (CAMM). MBDA Italy and MBDA U.K. would likely be the principal vendors, respectively.
> 
> In China, Pakistan could closely monitor the development of the NORINCO DK-10A, which reportedly could have a maximum range of 50km. Alternatively, it could potentially wait for the Hisar-O, which is currently being developed in Turkey by Roketsan. The Turkish route would not be unexpected. While Pakistan may have to wait an additional period of time, it would be a simpler process considering it would only require the input of the Turkish defence industry.
> 
> Finalizing the corvette contract would amount to a very eventful year for STM, which has also secured the contract to upgrade the Pakistan Navy’s Agosta 90B submarines. In fact, the company is also anticipating to finalize another big-ticket contract, potentially from an Arab Gulf country. These contracts are not only an opportunity STM, but also other Turkish defence vendors, such as Aselsan, Havelsan and Roketsan.
> 
> http://quwa.org/2016/08/29/stm-turkey-talks-design-corvette-pakistan/


These Corvettes will be a welcome and a formidable addition in Pakistan Navy.

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## Tank131

PaklovesTurkiye said:


> In your opinion, which SAM system PN should opt for its vessels? Which vendor, (China, Turkiye, UK/Italy) can offer better SAM system?



That depends on whats in the works. 

Turkey's Hisar O will have a 40km range amd is safe from a political and financial perspective, but is a (as far as we know) a single packed missile per launch tube. 

China can offer hq16 (40km) which PA also operates, so from a logistics perspective has some advantages. That being said, the syrian military operates the missile the hq16 is based on (russian Buk) and has had difficulty taking out Israeli aircraft. They also have the DK-10A based on SD-10A. It has been labled China's answer to ESSM, which hopefully means it is quad packable. Like ESSM it has a 50km range, but it is Active homing rather than semi-active.

South Africa has Umkhonto-ir which has a 20km range but is developing 35km umkhonto-ir er amd 60km Umkhonto-R. It may be quad packable (unsure if thats true). 

UK/italy have CAMM and CAMM-ER. They are rated for 25km+ and 45km+. That being said, the CAMM has been tested out to 60km (per Janes) it is quad-packable and as such, on Type-45 Destroyers of UK, it will be replacing some of the Aster missiles to enable more missiles on board. 

Based on this info, i think quad acked CAMM would be best for PN frigates/corvettes. With a limited 16 cell vls, PN would benefit frok quad packable missiles. There is a possibility that DK-10A will also be quad packed, but it is a longer missile. If CAMM is unavailable, i think DK-10>Hisar-O >hq-16>aster 15>umkhonto-ir

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## cabatli_53

It is certain in article that Pakistan wants Milgem with VLS and STM redesigns/modifies its istanbul class frigates ( Longer Milgem with VLS) for Pakistan needs. The project model is considered similar to what is done with STM fleet tanker construction which is done in Karachi shipyard.

This ship is a candidate of being a real modern nightmare and has a huge potential thanks to strong fire power, electronic warfare, underwater and aerial protection capabilities.

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## Bilal Khan (Quwa)

cabatli_53 said:


> It is certain in article that Pakistan wants Milgem with VLS and STM redesigns/modifies its istanbul class frigates ( Longer Milgem with VLS) for Pakistan needs. The project model is considered similar to what is done with STM fleet tanker construction which is done in Karachi shipyard.
> 
> This ship is a candidate of being a real modern nightmare and has a huge potential thanks to strong fire power, electronic warfare, underwater and aerial protection capabilities.


Scaling up the Ada-class corvette (instead of drawing up a clean sheet design) was a smart decision. STM added key capabilities (e.g. VLS and another 8 AShM), but likely kept the final cost well under control. I prefer the I-Class frigate over the idea of a 4,000+ ton clean sheet frigate, at least as a quantitative fleet builder.

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## GumNaam

PaklovesTurkiye said:


> Someone in the past explained it in hilarious way that I still remember that....
> 
> Aircraft Carrier --- Great Grandfather
> 
> *Cruiser --- Great Grandmother *
> 
> Destroyer --- Grandfather
> 
> Frigate --- Father
> 
> Corvette --- Son
> 
> 
> 
> Hope you got it, now...

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## PaklovesTurkiye

GumNaam said:


> Cruiser - Great Grandmother



.........

By the way, I didn't know that Cruiser is also one of vessels, being made for navies


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## Blue Marlin

cloud4000 said:


> Please indulge me on my ignorance of naval matters, but what's is difference between a corvette and, say, a frigate? Is it a matter of tonnage? Thanks.


well kind of but this is neither a corvette nor frigate but more in the category of a littoral combat ship which is like a mixture of both frigate and corvette if you do some research its quiet similar to the American freedom class lcs but not as fast. i suspect they are going for the vls variant which would serve as a cheap frigate to replace the type 21 and would have Chinese or Pakistani asm's

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## Tank131

The issue PN needs to solve is credible air defense. Have vls alone is not enough. Having med-long range missiles alone is not enough. You MUST have quantity to survive a saturation attack. This is most evident when you look at UK considering exchanging some Aster 15s on Type 45 destroyers with camm for increased numbers (will try to find the source... Read it few months back). 

PN needs to push for a quad packed medium range missile with good anti-missile characteristics. I think CAMM is politically feasible given UK and Italian in design but question will be financial. If not push for a chinese solution. 16 vls cells is not enough for PN to make a suitable air defense. Addition of a 24 cell FL3000N (while keeping at least 1 ciws) would go a long way to making up the difference though.

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