# Inside Pakistan's Sharp Sword - The Special Service Group (SSG).



## Kompromat

Enjoy the most comprehensive paper ever written on Pakistan Army's elite Special Service Group (SSG). Written and arranged by me using various sources. Don't forget to rate and share it. Cheers

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## Kompromat



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## Kompromat



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## Kompromat



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## Kompromat

*Having Trouble?

Download a PDF Copy Below.*

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## TaimiKhan

Wasn't the article posted already ?

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## SQ8

A paralell wikipedia update is also needed. Indians run Pakistani pages there more than Pakistanis themselves.

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## Old School

Good job. Why not a real book ?


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## Sipahi

Can I rate you positive 

Great Read, Thanks @Horus 

@MaarKhoor @The Eagle @Khafee a must read.

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## The Eagle

mshahid said:


> Can I rate you positive
> 
> Great Read, Thanks @Horus
> 
> @MaarKhoor @The Eagle @Khafee a must read.





Thanks @Horus Sir for interesting and a share worth reading. Maan Jaan'bazam. 

Hyderabad SSG Op will be remembered long especially the way Op was conducted as sign boards changed, people acted etc that the hijackers did not have a clue that what happening.... Professionalism at best . Hats off.....

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## ghazi52

Nice job.............................


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## Abdullah Noman

Very good Job .. Man Janbaz 



Abdullah Noman said:


> Very good Job .. Man Janbaz


Nice information ..


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## Kompromat

Thread was merged then it appeared with first 10 pages missing so had to reboot it.



TaimiKhan said:


> Wasn't the article posted already ?


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## k!ng_0f_(~)3@rt$

These images are not accessible at my end. is it because of internet or something else?

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## R Wing

Horus said:


> Thread was merged then it appeared with first 10 pages missing so had to reboot it.



Images don't seem to be working. 

Are the specialized units like Zarrar, Karrar, SOTF, etc., also mentioned --- or just the "vanilla" ones?


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## Talwar e Pakistan

Horus said:


> Enjoy the most comprehensive paper ever written on Pakistan Army's elite Special Service Group (SSG). Written and arranged by me using various sources. Don't forget to rate and share it. Cheers
> 
> View attachment 297563
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I cant see the pictures anymore.


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## Reichsmarschall

Horus said:


> Enjoy the most comprehensive paper ever written on Pakistan Army's elite Special Service Group (SSG). Written and arranged by me using various sources. Don't forget to rate and share it. Cheers
> 
> View attachment 297563
> View attachment 297564
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Can you help me??


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## Signalian

In early 1960's, intelligence reports started trickling in regarding some anti state activities in the agency by Khan of Jandole, a prominent personality of the area, along with some other notables of Dir State. They were getting support from across the border to pursue a rebellious design. 
Since the reports from various agencies were not only sketchy but at times confusing as well, so the Special Service Group(SSG) was asked to send a team in disguise, to assess the real ground situation.

For the purpose Captain Rauf (who later joined the civil service and became Home Secretary of Balochistan), along with *a team of four to five SSG personnel was deputed to proceed to the region in the guise of local inhabitants and send their factual assessment for any future action. From Chakdara onward they were to cover the area on foot while carrying the required stores and communication equipment on donkeys to look like the ordinary folks of the area*.

However, after some time the communication was totally lost which created some panic in the concerned quarters. An urgent message was received from SSG to despatch two aircraft next morning to Peshawar for an important search mission. For the purpose Captain Mushtaq Madni and Captain A R Kallue (both retired as Lieutenant Colonels) were nominated. 
The mission revolved around an aerial search for the lost SSG detachment. 

Captain Kallue was selected for the mission as he was a good friend of Captain Rauf and could recognize him from some distance. Since the area was generally considered hostile so *two promissory notes, duly signed and sealed by the appropriate authority were also given to both the pilots. Each promising a cash reward of rupees one hundred thousand if the pilot was handed over to the political authorities in case of any mishap*. 

From Peshawar, the pilots flew to Malakand and via Chakdara followed the only road leading to Khar area. Couple of miles short of Khar village, the group with two donkeys was spotted. 

Low passes were made and Captain Rauf was recognized by Captain Kallue without any doubt.

This was the beginning and soon after intense aerial reconnaissance of Dir-Bajaur area by 7 Infantry Division, based at Peshawer, Kohat and Bannu got underway.

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## Black Ops

Is there any age limit for an army officer to volunteer for OACC at SSG school?


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## Autodidact-knowledge

No age limit. but usually they went at the rank of Lt or Capt. However there are few exceptional motivated Majs also who had completed the course.


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## Signalian

@blain2 I am aware that SSG is trained in different arts of martial arts, especially taekwondo, is Krav Maga or something similar to street self defence introduced in training regimen?

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## Rafi

Signalian said:


> @blain2 I am aware that SSG is trained in different arts of martial arts, especially taekwondo, is Krav Maga or something similar to street self defence introduced in training regimen?



All sorts of unarmed combat training given. Including krav

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## Signalian

Gen Mitta though is being considered as father of SSG but in fact he was not. The CQB coy was raised in infantry school in probably 1950/51 commanded by Maj Ali Haider which was moved to Attack Fort in 1954. This site was selected by British Col after due Consideration after visiting many other places mostly in KPK. Two cols by the name of Col Ali Haider( 18 Baloch) and Col Muhammad Sarwar ( Baloch) were selected to undergo a special course for one year in UK. Both the officers returned successfully after completion of the course. Col Ali Haider was selected to command this newly special op Bn at Attock Fort. He assumed the command of that unit but due to bad luck he met a very serious accident near Akora Khattak and got decapicitated for many months. This was the time when the luck smiled on Gen Mitta who was GSO-1 in Trg Dte GHQ to go and take over the command of that unit without any special qualifications. Who recommended it ,only God knows. Surprisingly the second Colonel, Col Muhammad Sarwar from Mera Mator village in suburb of Rawalpindi was not asked to take over who had successfully qualified from Britain . This again remains a mystery . It is believed that the son of Col Sarwar had risen to the rank of a Maj Gen. The facts can be confirmed from him. The son of Col Ali Haider is a retired Lt Col living in Chaklala III. His name is Lt Col Ijaz from 33rd long course. He has some photos of that era with a British Lt Col who was posted to over see the training and org the set up. 

Any one interested in history must find the facts.

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## Men in Green

SSG in Russia for SCO peace training


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## blain2

Signalian said:


> Gen Mitta though is being considered as father of SSG but in fact he was not. The CQB coy was raised in infantry school in probably 1950/51 commanded by Maj Ali Haider which was moved to Attack Fort in 1954. This site was selected by British Col after due Consideration after visiting many other places mostly in KPK. Two cols by the name of Col Ali Haider( 18 Baloch) and Col Muhammad Sarwar ( Baloch) were selected to undergo a special course for one year in UK. Both the officers returned successfully after completion of the course. Col Ali Haider was selected to command this newly special op Bn at Attock Fort. He assumed the command of that unit but due to bad luck he met a very serious accident near Akora Khattak and got decapicitated for many months. This was the time when the luck smiled on Gen Mitta who was GSO-1 in Trg Dte GHQ to go and take over the command of that unit without any special qualifications. Who recommended it ,only God knows. Surprisingly the second Colonel, Col Muhammad Sarwar from Mera Mator village in suburb of Rawalpindi was not asked to take over who had successfully qualified from Britain . This again remains a mystery . It is believed that the son of Col Sarwar had risen to the rank of a Maj Gen. The facts can be confirmed from him. The son of Col Ali Haider is a retired Lt Col living in Chaklala III. His name is Lt Col Ijaz from 33rd long course. He has some photos of that era with a British Lt Col who was posted to over see the training and org the set up.
> 
> Any one interested in history must find the facts.


Gen Mitha was selected because he was para qualified and Gen Ayub Khan knew him to be a competent officer by way of Yahya Khan. After he was asked to take up the job, Mitha too went to the UK and attended training with the British SF including SBS and then later in the US with some unspecified special forces.

I think to raise a unit from scratch, you need to have officers with not just the practical experience of the operator, but also administrative and command abilities. Perhaps some favoritism had a part to play, but Mitha was popular with not only the officers but also the men who served in 19 Baloch (which later became the SSG).

I know of officers who served with Gen Mitha or joined the unit right after he had departed SSG and they regarded him highly as a good, competent commanding officer.

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## Ahmet Pasha

I think back in the day SSG recieved a lot of training from GSG-9, SAS, SBS and American Delta and Rangers. 

Now they seem to be formulating their own techniques. And borrowing some from the rest of the world.


blain2 said:


> Gen Mitha was selected because he was para qualified and Gen Ayub Khan knew him to be a competent officer by way of Yahya Khan. After he was asked to take up the job, Mitha too went to the UK and attended training with the British SF including SBS and then later in the US with some unspecified special forces.
> 
> I think to raise a unit from scratch, you need to have officers with not just the practical experience of the operator, but also administrative and command abilities. Perhaps some favoritism had a part to play, but Mitha was popular with not only the officers but also the men who served in 19 Baloch (which later became the SSG).
> 
> I know of officers who served with Gen Mitha or joined the unit right after he had departed SSG and they regarded him highly as a good, competent commanding officer.

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## blain2

SSG predates GSG, Delta etc. Most of these came in the 70s. SSG was raised in 1956.

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## Ahmet Pasha

We trained with them to fight sobiets and Indians in Kargil(Siachen)-Later. So both of our points make sense.


blain2 said:


> SSG predates GSG, Delta etc. Most of these came in the 70s. SSG was raised in 1956.

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## Cuirassier

Zarrar ATU should be our designated Tier One unit, they're the ones going into tough ops, and they should be provided with some good helmets for heaven's sake, ACH or MICH.


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## CHI RULES

Gen Mitha sacrificed much for this country and was treated badly as usual not in this country but common through out Muslim history. At least we should give him some respect. He was fully qualified when got command of Pak SF, and structured basis of a competent force. After retirement faced many hardships, salute to him for his bravery and feel ashamed for harsh treatment he faced like many true patriots.

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## Kompromat

Horus said:


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@WebMaster 

Please fix the images, or should i upload again?


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## Cuirassier

List of SS Group officers KIA in recent years. 

Lt.Col Aamir Awan, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident. I believe he was OC 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar). 

Maj. Khalid Aziz, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident, with 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar) (probably the 2IC). 

Captain Zameer Hussain, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident, with 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar), probably the Adjutant. Alongside these 3 officers 7 soldiers also lost their lives. 

Lt.Col Haroon Ul Islam, OC Zarrar ATU, famous martyr of Lal Masjid Op Silence/Sunrise. 

Captain Salman Lodhi, Zarrar ATU, in same Op Silence. 

Captain Junaid Khan, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), during recce op in Khwazakhela in the prelude of Op Rah-e-Raast, captured by TTP and executed. 

Captain Najam Riaz Raja, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), alongside Captain Junaid, captured and executed. 

Both officers alongwith 2 NCOs being unarmed managed to break the necks of 8 TTP fighters during their attempted escape before being shot by outer guards. 

Captain Bilal Zafar, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), famous martyr of Operation Black Thunderstorm, KIA while clearing the Peochar Valley, known as 'Ghazanosar ka Hero'. 

Major Zahid Hussain Shah, unit n/a, KIA in Op Rah-e-Raast. 

Captain Ali Mehmood, 5 Commando Btln (Zilzaal), KIA in 2011 versus TTP in Mohmand Agency. 

Captain Tariq Jamal, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), KIA in 2012 during operation versus TTP in Orakzai Agency. 

Captain Waseem Razi, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), KIA during the infamous ambush at Tirah in 2013, during Op Rahe Shahadat. 

Captain Ahmad Raza, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), martyred during Op Rahe Shahadat at Tirah in 2013. 

Captain Akash Rabbani, 4 Commando Btln (Yalghar). Famous martyr of Op ZeA in North Waziristan 2014, while conducting medevac and was hit by sniper fire. 

Captain Qayyum Khan, unit n/a, KIA during Op ZeA in North Waziristan. 

About 15 officers named on the roll of honor since 2006, more than total officers shaheed from 1956-2006. SS Group has been used time to time in our COIN ops, and has made big sacrifices. If you wish to add more details please point out.

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## WebMaster

Horus said:


> @WebMaster
> 
> Please fix the images, or should i upload again?


Unfortunately, they are lost. Upload them again or create a new thread. Whatever works.

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## Kompromat

Thread RELOADED.


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## CriticalThought

@Horus why no .50 Cal rifles for SSG?


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## Kompromat

CriticalThought said:


> @Horus why no .50 Cal rifles for SSG?




They do

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## osama zafar

SSG is actually a very efficient mechanism for the war against terrorism in Pakistan. But I personally feel that their should be more modern and innovative. The commandos can bear almost anything but we need to introduce more modern training methods for the commandos for them to perform as per the current requirements of this demanding war on terror.

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## Cuirassier

http://www.pakarmymuseum.com/exhibits/1965-war-contributions-ssg-wall-d2/

SSG operations in 1965, not mentioned are the operations with Ghaznavi Force in Rajauri sector.

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## R Wing

TF141 said:


> Zarrar ATU should be our designated Tier One unit, they're the ones going into tough ops, and they should be provided with some good helmets for heaven's sake, ACH or MICH.



They are designated our Tier One unit.


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## Signalian

TF141 said:


> List of SS Group officers KIA in recent years.
> 
> Lt.Col Aamir Awan, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident. I believe he was OC 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar).
> 
> Maj. Khalid Aziz, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident, with 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar) (probably the 2IC).
> 
> Captain Zameer Hussain, in 2006 Akbar Bugti incident, with 2 Commando Btln (Rehbar), probably the Adjutant. Alongside these 3 officers 7 soldiers also lost their lives.
> 
> Lt.Col Haroon Ul Islam, OC Zarrar ATU, famous martyr of Lal Masjid Op Silence/Sunrise.
> 
> Captain Salman Lodhi, Zarrar ATU, in same Op Silence.
> 
> Captain Junaid Khan, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), during recce op in Khwazakhela in the prelude of Op Rah-e-Raast, captured by TTP and executed.
> 
> Captain Najam Riaz Raja, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), alongside Captain Junaid, captured and executed.
> 
> Both officers alongwith 2 NCOs being unarmed managed to break the necks of 8 TTP fighters during their attempted escape before being shot by outer guards.
> 
> Captain Bilal Zafar, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), famous martyr of Operation Black Thunderstorm, KIA while clearing the Peochar Valley, known as 'Ghazanosar ka Hero'.
> 
> Major Zahid Hussain Shah, unit n/a, KIA in Op Rah-e-Raast.
> 
> Captain Ali Mehmood, 5 Commando Btln (Zilzaal), KIA in 2011 versus TTP in Mohmand Agency.
> 
> Captain Tariq Jamal, 6 Commando Btln (Al-Samsaam), KIA in 2012 during operation versus TTP in Orakzai Agency.
> 
> Captain Waseem Razi, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), KIA during the infamous ambush at Tirah in 2013, during Op Rahe Shahadat.
> 
> Captain Ahmad Raza, 3 Commando Btln (Powindah), martyred during Op Rahe Shahadat at Tirah in 2013.
> 
> Captain Akash Rabbani, 4 Commando Btln (Yalghar). Famous martyr of Op ZeA in North Waziristan 2014, while conducting medevac and was hit by sniper fire.
> 
> Captain Qayyum Khan, unit n/a, KIA during Op ZeA in North Waziristan.
> 
> About 15 officers named on the roll of honor since 2006, more than total officers shaheed from 1956-2006. SS Group has been used time to time in our COIN ops, and has made big sacrifices. If you wish to add more details please point out.


2nd to 6th SSG battalions plus Zarrar ATU taking part in A-T Ops. It is disappointing to see SSG deviating away from traditional Behind Enemy Lines roles.

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## Sine Nomine

Signalian said:


> 2nd to 6th SSG battalions plus Zarrar ATU taking part in A-T Ops. It is disappointing to see SSG deviating away from traditional Behind Enemy Lines roles.


In start our troops lacked training for COIN ops.


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## Cuirassier

MUSTAKSHAF said:


> In start our troops lacked training for COIN ops.


SSG has performed great in both BEL and COIN operations. The best SF of South Asia without a doubt.

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## R Wing

Signalian said:


> 2nd to 6th SSG battalions plus Zarrar ATU taking part in A-T Ops. It is disappointing to see SSG deviating away from traditional Behind Enemy Lines roles.



Lots of lessons can translate to BEL ops. 

Also, Karrar Coy and SOTF played a key role in CT/AT ops in FATA.


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## Signalian

MUSTAKSHAF said:


> In start our troops lacked training for COIN ops.


I agree, SSG was best equipped and trained for the Ops at that time. Lack of foresight on part of Civilian Govt not to raise a SWAT for Police Ops. FC and Rangers were in tatters. Infantry Battalions of PA had no formal training fighting COIN. 

SSG paid the price for every shortcoming.



TF141 said:


> SSG has performed great in both BEL and COIN operations. The best SF of South Asia without a doubt.


Actually more in COIN in home territory, than BEL against IA, Soviets and the likes.



R Wing said:


> Lots of lessons can translate to BEL ops.
> 
> Also, Karrar Coy and SOTF played a key role in CT/AT ops in FATA.


There is no replacement for experience however the tactics, targets, enemy, territory etc are very different BEL than in COIN.

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## blain2

TF141 said:


> http://www.pakarmymuseum.com/exhibits/1965-war-contributions-ssg-wall-d2/
> 
> SSG operations in 1965, not mentioned are the operations with Ghaznavi Force in Rajauri sector.


Capt Shamim Alam Khan's exploits during these raids and ambushes along the LoC and the raid on the Drass cantonment by the SSG troops, which included Cast Tariq Mahmood (earning him his first SJ), are classic special forces missions that often get buried under other happenings of the past. These missions were well planned and executed.



Signalian said:


> 2nd to 6th SSG battalions plus Zarrar ATU taking part in A-T Ops. It is disappointing to see SSG deviating away from traditional Behind Enemy Lines roles.


It would be a waste if SSG was being trained up only on the role you describe. Any good Special Force should be able to adapt and employ itself in the roles needed and that is exactly what the SSG has done. Counter Terrorism is a very narrow definition of something as broad as sub-conventional warfare. The SSG as a force is involved in the latter while it regularly trains for operating behind the enemy lines. The actual counter-terrorism operations role is fulfilled by a small number of cadres (specialized units such as Zarrar ATU).

SSG detachments are rotated constantly along the LoC and in the FATA to expose the troops to both operating environments. Prior to GWOT and in the days of the Soviet-Afghan war, the SSG was rotated across three or four different operational environments ranging from LoC, Afghanistan, Siachen and even Balochistan.


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## Signalian

blain2 said:


> It would be a waste if SSG was being trained up only on the role you describe. Any good Special Force should be able to adapt and employ itself in the roles needed and that is exactly what the SSG has done. Counter Terrorism is a very narrow definition of something as broad as sub-conventional warfare. The SSG as a force is involved in the latter while it regularly trains for operating behind the enemy lines. The actual counter-terrorism operations role is fulfilled by a small number of cadres (specialized units such as Zarrar ATU).
> 
> SSG detachments are rotated constantly along the LoC and in the FATA to expose the troops to both operating environments. Prior to GWOT and in the days of the Soviet-Afghan war, the SSG was rotated across three or four different operational environments ranging from LoC, Afghanistan, Siachen and even Balochistan.



If AT is limited to Zarrar ATU, then thats fine.


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## CriticalThought

Signalian said:


> If AT is limited to Zarrar ATU, then thats fine.



Consider the type of training required for AT: CQB, hit and run, ambush execution and protection, VIP protection, kinetic entry, sniping. All of this forms the groundwork for behind enemy lines action.


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## Signalian

CriticalThought said:


> Consider the type of training required for AT: CQB, hit and run, ambush execution and protection, VIP protection, kinetic entry, sniping. All of this forms the groundwork for behind enemy lines action.


Thats all training. 

A lot of BEL took place in 1980's and 1990's.

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## CriticalThought

Signalian said:


> Thats all training.
> 
> A lot of BEL took place in 1980's and 1990's.



I get your drift now. Yes, the top brass of yesteryears has a lot to answer for.


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## Cuirassier

Check out the Wiki page, a lot of interesting edits which make organization of SSG more clear. However it i believe Tarbela Brigade is also known as 22nd SS Brigade.


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## Cuirassier

TF141 said:


> Check out the Wiki page, a lot of interesting edits which make organization of SSG more clear. However it i believe Tarbela Brigade is also known as 22nd SS Brigade.


I correct myself, i believe the Cherat Brigade is 22nd SS.


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## Cuirassier

TF141 said:


> I correct myself, i believe the Cherat Brigade is 22nd SS.


33rd SS Brigade at Tarbela consists of:

3rd Commando Powindah (SOTF)
4th Commando Yalghar
7th Commando Babrum


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## Cuirassier

Major Khalid Aziz 
2nd Commando Rehbar
2006
Balochistan


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## fakesoul

Why is this all in JPEG?


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## Kopfjager

Horus said:


> *Having Trouble?
> 
> Download a PDF Copy Below.*


Their dream of akhand baharat


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## Cuirassier

3rd Commando Battalion
"Powindahs"
Based at Tarbela
33rd SS Brigade

Operation Qiadat, 1987- versus all odds

Powindahs bravely charged in subzero conditions to eliminate IA posts in the Bilafond sector and gain a foothold on the Saltoro Ridge. Several enemy posts were eliminated but the assault stalled and was aborted following lack of reinforcements and casualties.

This Operation earned 18 martyrs for us, including :

Captain Iqbal Khan HJ 
Captain Salik Cheema SJ

En lost 21 men.


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## Cuirassier

Late Lt.Col Haroon Islam as a Captain.

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## Cuirassier

2nd Commando Battalion
"RAHBER" 
11th SS Brigade

'We Lead The Way'

17 x Sitara-e-Jurat
8 x Tamgha-e-Jurat
17 x Sitara-e-Basalat
60 x Tamgha-e-Basalat
30 x Imtiazi Sanad
40 x COAS Commendation Cards

Quaid Company
Ghazi Company
Jangju Company
Tipu Company
HQ Suleman

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## Cuirassier

Naib Subedar Atta Muhammad (SJ) was commanding a 7-8 man SSG team, manning the Quaid OP in Bilafond La sector of the Saltoro Ridge, in the spring of 1987. 

This team was responsible for the deaths of 18 Indian troops in action even as it was pitted versus intense artillery and superior enemy numbers. 5 of them including NbSub Atta were martyred and the OP eventually fell, with munitions and supplies on a low after the rope link to Ali Brangsa (basecamp) was cut off by Indian artillery shelling and surrounding of the OP.

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## Ahmet Pasha

What's a naib subedar in english/US ranks???
Staff sergeant???


TF141 said:


> Naib Subedar Atta Muhammad (SJ) was commanding a 7-8 man SSG team, manning the Quaid OP in Bilafond La sector of the Saltoro Ridge, in the spring of 1987.
> 
> This team was responsible for the deaths of 18 Indian troops in action even as it was pitted versus intense artillery and superior enemy numbers. 5 of them including NbSub Atta were martyred and the OP eventually fell, with munitions and supplies on a low after the rope link to Ali Brangsa (basecamp) was cut off by Indian artillery shelling and surrounding of the OP.
> 
> View attachment 560873


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## Cuirassier

Warrant Officer, though not exactly on NATO lines.


Ahmet Pasha said:


> What's a naib subedar in english/US ranks???
> Staff sergeant???


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## Talwar e Pakistan

TF141 said:


> This team was responsible for the deaths of 18 Indian troops in action even as it was pitted versus intense artillery and superior enemy numbers. 5 of them including NbSub Atta were martyred and the OP eventually fell, with munitions and supplies on a low after the rope link to Ali Brangsa (basecamp) was cut off by Indian artillery shelling and surrounding of the OP.


Were the remaining two captured? I heard some of the extremely weak ones (due to starvation/injuries) crawled out and fell to their deaths to avoid capture.


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## Cuirassier

Returned to base by jumping off the top on their commander's orders. Sepoy Arshad and Sepoy Zulfiqar.


Talwar e Pakistan said:


> Were the remaining two captured? I heard some of the extremely weak ones (due to starvation/injuries) crawled out and fell to their deaths to avoid capture.


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## Irfan Baloch

TF141 said:


> Late Lt.Col Haroon Islam as a Captain.
> View attachment 545892


May Allah Grant him Jannah
he took on the tukferis when the entire Pakistani media was sucking on to the TTP ideology and people were blinded by fake Mullahs

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## blain2

TF141 said:


> Warrant Officer, though not exactly on NATO lines.


Naib Subedar is actually a Junior Warrant Officer. There isn't an exact equivalent because these are JCO ranks and the NATO/Western militaries do not have a JCO classification.

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## Cuirassier

One thing I haven't figured out is the exact scale of SSG operations in Western Theatre of '71. Absolutely no solid details or accounts to justify the deaths in the West. If you have some, please share. Thanks.


blain2 said:


> Naib Subedar is actually a Junior Warrant Officer. There isn't an exact equivalent because these are JCO ranks and the NATO/Western militaries do not have a JCO classification.


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## Samlee

*MAN JAANBAAAZM!!!!!!!!!*


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## Cuirassier

Forgotten hero of OP Qiadat, 

Captain Salik Nawaz Cheema SJ
Powindah Battalion


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## Bullzz

*Capt Iqbal Shaheed (HJ), A Gallant SSG Officer Martyred At World Highest Battlefield Remembered On His Death Anniversary*

*Most of the people die on the bed others in accidents, but a few become immortal by laying their lives for the noble cause of safeguarding their motherland and set unprecedented examples of chivalry for others to follow.*

Captain Muhammad Iqbal Khan Shaheed (Hilal-e-Jurat) was the one of the gallant SSG Officers of Pakistan Army, who embraced martyrdom over an altitude of 21,000 feet at the world's highest battle zone 'Siachen glaciers' on September 25, 1987 while defending his country against the enemy and became immortalized.

"Death is inexorable. One can die in a road accident or suffer the last rigours interminably on a bed but I want to face death and look it in the eyes like a true warrior," the 27 year old young army officer told his relatives and friends just two months before he left this mortal world as a bachelor.

Born at village Pashtoon Garhi in district Nowshera on November 15, 1960 at Haji Mir Ahmad Khan's residence, he got Commission in the Pakistan Army's ASC in 1982. He faced enemy at an altitude of above 21,000 feet in Siachen glaciers and fought like a lion. He faced two enemies; the Indian Army and the harsh weather with steadfastness, bravery and determination.

Noor Jehan, mother of Capt Iqbal, said he was highly devoted and obedient son. "During his visits to home, he met with all family members, relatives including our servant warmly keeping no distance being an officer.

"Captain Iqbal wanted to become an MBBS doctor in his early student life but later on changed his mind when he was BSc student at Islamia College Peshawar and wanted to join Pakistan Army to serve his country," she said.

He loved education as he often stressed on his brothers to attain higher studies. He was greatly impressed from the poetry of national poet, Dr Alama Muhammad Iqbal, she said.

She said just two months before his martyrdom, he wrote his will and handed it over to his close childhood friend Ghayasuddin and told him not to disclose it before his death.

The will of Capt Iqbal says, "I owe 16 days of fasting. I took a bank loan of Rs 900 from a fund reserved for science student. The administration block of the Peshawar University would have the necessary particulars. I owe this amount and it must be paid to the Bank. My grave should be left unplastered and let it be only as high as the Shariah allows. No flowers, no sehra, no dupatta for my grave. All these are rituals. prayer is the real thing. There should be no chehlum or anniversary for me. Don't cook rice and call people and give alms on these occasions. Nothing of the sort is permitted by Islamic injunctions. Charity can be given at any time and not necessary at these occasions. Instead of cooking rice and calling people, let the amount be spent on paving a street or constructing a drain or give it to a mosque.

This way it will be a perpetual charity. There is no need for ostentation. If the amount received fromthe government after my death is of the order of Rs 50,000 or more, fully Rs 40,000 be distributed amongst the poor and the deprived as atonement for the prayers I did not offer and the fast I did not keep.

Stop my relatives from doing anything unIslamic after my death. If they want to cook rice on a Friday or do something similar, don't let them. Let the amount be given in alms on another occasion. Anyone wanting to do me good after my death should recite Darood Sharif as often as possible and offer its blessings for my soul." He further wrote: "Let the green pack and the high neck jersey go back to the company stores and the bills for "langar" (mess), washer man and cobbler be paid." Later on August 23, 1987, Capt Iqbal wrote his last letter to his friend Ghayasuddin Khan, asking him to pray to Almighty Allah for his good health, grant him the courage to follow the right path and serve islam and bestow him the life of a victorious Ghazi or the death of a Shaheed.

Akram Khan and Shamus Khan, brothers of Capt Iqbal said they had fulfilled 'will' of his Shaheed brother in letter and spirit.

Every year his death anniversary is being observed with great reverence and respect but quite simplicity as his grave in Pashtoon Garhi has no epitaph, no flowers no sehra and no dupatta in consonance with his will.

Brigadier (Retd) Rasheed Malik (Sitara e Jurat), then Captain, who was accompanying Capt Iqbal in the 'Qiadat' Operation told APP that Capt Iqbal was a symbol of courage, valour and was a highly motivated person. "Capt Iqbal was a true Muslim and death was meaningless to him," he said.

He said the enemy had established scores of bunkers, trenches and posts at most strategic location in the illegally occupied territory of Siachen from where they (enemy) were consistently targeting Pakistani posts besides monitoring our activities at that time.

To give befitting reply to the enemy's unprovoked aggressions, an operation 'Quaidat' was launched in which Capt Iqbal was assigned the task of evacuation of casualties, provision of food ration and other necessary assistance to Pakistani troops.

"We took control of a number of key posts but several of our team members had either embraced martyrdom or received injuries during the said operation. We asked for help and Capt Iqbal swiftly reached by leading his platoon from the front side, inflicting heavy losses to the enemy," the eyewitness brigadier recalled.

"Capt Iqbal kept climbing the steep mountains of Siachen over 21000 feet with a gun in one hand and holding himself with the other in-spite of receiving serious bullet injuries on his legs but did not lose courage, determination and proceeded forward," Brigadier Retd Rasheed Malik recalled.

He destroyed many pickets on his way till he reached the highest picket on the Siachen Glacier, held by the enemy where he waged the fiercest battle and in the process embraced martyrdom on September 25, 1987.

Brig (Retd) Rasheed Malik said two officers including Capt Iqbal and Capt Salik Chema among 16 jawans were martyred and over 100 others injured during the said operation.

Captain Iqbal's body went missing for eleven months in snow, and was finally recovered during in action and brought to his native village on August 6, 1988 where a sea of people attended the funeral of the celebrated hero of Siachen.

In recognition of his supreme sacrifices for motherland, the Government of Pakistani awarded the second highest military award Hilal-e-Jurat to Capt Iqbal Shaheed besides named the one kilometer long newly constructed bridge on River Sindh that connected Attock in Punjab with Nowshera in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa after Captain Iqbal Shaheed besides a martyr monument at Khariyan.

https://www.urdupoint.com/en/pakistan/capt-iqbal-shaheed-hj-a-gallant-ssg-office-425540.html

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## The Terminator

Where can I find latest gear of SSG in pictures or videos. Please provide a link for that thread. Thanks


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## Cuirassier

Remarks on the SSG by a US Special Forces (Green Berets) officer in an old paper.

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## Zarvan

Cuirassier said:


> Remarks on the SSG by a US Special Forces (Green Berets) officer in an old paper.
> View attachment 638353
> View attachment 638355


Interesting suggestions and SSG should consider resolving those issues which are identified.


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## Cuirassier

Zarvan said:


> Interesting suggestions and SSG should consider resolving those issues which are identified.


This is from 2010 - a lot has improved in terms of providing training to other forces - the LCBs were raised by the SSG too. But much is true about the Ranger part. 

SSG is trained on lines of US Special Forces but is used as US Army Rangers - even though at least at company-level the basic organization is kinda same (roughly 60 men per SSG coy). The US ODA system hasn't been adopted. 

He also praises the role of SSG in training 'mujahedeen' in the 80s - AFAIK 13 or 14 teams consisting of 200 SSG officers, JCOs & ORs were involved. 

IMO the SSG cannot exactly emulate what the Green Berets do - both are operating under a separate mandate, which has drastic difference owing to power projection of both countries. 

The prominence of the Light Commandos has however helped the SSG in shifting from direct-action to selective, cautious deployment - last resorts and embedded at platoon-level with local forces (i.e. FC, regular infantry at LC).

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## PanzerKiel

Cuirassier said:


> Remarks on the SSG by a US Special Forces (Green Berets) officer in an old paper.
> View attachment 638353
> View attachment 638355



Interesting, however, some facts are old... Could be an old writing .


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## Reichmarshal

Cuirassier said:


> This is from 2010 - a lot has improved in terms of providing training to other forces - the LCBs were raised by the SSG too. But much is true about the Ranger part.
> 
> SSG is trained on lines of US Special Forces but is used as US Army Rangers - even though at least at company-level the basic organization is kinda same (roughly 60 men per SSG coy). The US ODA system hasn't been adopted.
> 
> He also praises the role of SSG in training 'mujahedeen' in the 80s - AFAIK 13 or 14 teams consisting of 200 SSG officers, JCOs & ORs were involved.
> 
> IMO the SSG cannot exactly emulate what the Green Berets do - both are operating under a separate mandate, which has drastic difference owing to power projection of both countries.
> 
> The prominence of the Light Commandos has however helped the SSG in shifting from direct-action to selective, cautious deployment - last resorts and embedded at platoon-level with local forces (i.e. FC, regular infantry at LC).



SSG has nothing to do with the US army rangers but more in line with SAS/delta.
LCB has been raised and trained on the pattern of us army rangers. To bridge the gap and occupy the position between special forces and regular army.
Even interior ministry troops have their own special operations units.
SSG since 2001 has gone through a total transformation, it is also most combat experienced n that has been a huge factor in its transformation. Now it's a div.+ force second to none.


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## Cuirassier

PanzerKiel said:


> Interesting, however, some facts are old... Could be an old writing .


June '10.

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## Cuirassier

Reichmarshal said:


> SSG has nothing to do with the US army rangers but more in line with SAS/delta.
> LCB has been raised and trained on the pattern of us army rangers. To bridge the gap and occupy the position between special forces and regular army.
> Even interior ministry troops have their own special operations units.
> SSG since 2001 has gone through a total transformation, it is also most combat experienced n that has been a huge factor in its transformation. Now it's a div.+ force second to none.


US SF are apt at FID and training local forces w/o taking part in commando style ops - he is correct in noting that in those days at least, the SSG were used as commandos and like the 75th Rangers. Now this role is filled by LCBs, hence allowing SSG to fill a more subtle but force-multiplying role. 

Delta is an SMU - technically we dont have an equivalent but this role used to be mirrored by Karrar Coy and Z(ATU). Unaware of what has happened to Karrar - either embedded within a Cdo Bn or still with 33 SSB.


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## PanzerKiel

Cuirassier said:


> US SF are apt at FID and training local forces w/o taking part in commando style ops - he is correct in noting that in those days at least, the SSG were used as commandos and like the 75th Rangers. Now this role is filled by LCBs, hence allowing SSG to fill a more subtle but force-multiplying role.



I beg to differ. 
For war time you are right. However, they have an entirely different and important role for peace time.



Cuirassier said:


> Delta is an SMU - technically we dont have an equivalent but this role used to be mirrored by Karrar Coy and Z(ATU). Unaware of what has happened to Karrar - either embedded within a Cdo Bn or still with 33 SSB.



Main difference between Karrar and Zarrar was their US and British training... And their training and procedures.... 
Karrar was finished long ago and amalgamated with Zarrar.... Both outfits enjoyed a fierce reputation and sense of pride... They hardly went along with each other in the initial days......

Salman Lodhi, Bilal Zafar.... Just a couple of famous SSG officers... were both Karrar officers.

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## Cuirassier

PanzerKiel said:


> I beg to differ.
> For war time you are right. However, they have an entirely different and important role for peace time.
> 
> 
> 
> Main difference between Karrar and Zarrar was their US and British training... And their training and procedures....
> Karrar was finished long ago and amalgamated with Zarrar.... Both outfits enjoyed a fierce reputation and sense of pride... They hardly went along with each other in the initial days......
> 
> Salman Lodhi, Bilal Zafar.... Just a couple of famous SSG officers... were both Karrar officers.


Didn't get the first points. 


Karrar still exists but not independent anymore.

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## PanzerKiel

Cuirassier said:


> Didn't get the first points.
> 
> 
> Karrar still exists but not independent anymore.


Yes, Karrar is there only in name, as a subordinate company of ZATU.

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## Cuirassier

PanzerKiel said:


> Yes, Karrar is there only in name, as a subordinate company of ZATU.


Interestingly both operated jointly in Op Sunrise and Op Janbaz. 2 out of the 10 SSG troops who died in the former Op were from Karrar Coy (incld. Salman). At least 1 out of the 6 who died in the latter Op was also from Karrar.

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## ARMalik

SSG is my favorite part of Pakistan Military since it bring backs a lot of memories about my Father. He was SSG Naval. He use to tell me lots of nice stories about what SSG did and what they were capable of doing. He once told me about how SSG did para jumping in a competition in UK during extremely bad weather; the other foreign Special Forces including the ones from US and UK *refused to jump *because it was too dangerous. But SSG went ahead and did it successfully to the *utter shock of every one else*. My father worked with TM, and had very fond memories of TM, who later died during a para jumping. *May God bless my sweet father, and his boss TM. *

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## PanzerKiel

ARMalik said:


> SSG is my favorite part of Pakistan Military since it bring backs a lot of memories about my Father. He was SSG Naval. He use to tell me lots of nice stories about what SSG did and what they were capable of doing. He once told me about how SSG did para pumping in a competition in UK during extremely bad weather; the other foreign Special Forces including the ones from US and UK *refused to jump *because it was too dangerous. But SSG went ahead and did it to the *utter shock of every one else*. My father worked with TM, and had very fond memories of TM, who later died during a para jumping. *May God bless my sweet father, and his boss TM. *



Interesting and captivating..... It's an honor to know about your father.

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## Reichmarshal

Cuirassier said:


> US SF are apt at FID and training local forces w/o taking part in commando style ops - he is correct in noting that in those days at least, the SSG were used as commandos and like the 75th Rangers. Now this role is filled by LCBs, hence allowing SSG to fill a more subtle but force-multiplying role.
> 
> Delta is an SMU - technically we dont have an equivalent but this role used to be mirrored by Karrar Coy and Z(ATU). Unaware of what has happened to Karrar - either embedded within a Cdo Bn or still with 33 SSB.



US forces, special or otherwise have been a huge failure in accomplishing their role as trainers as FID....starting from Vietnam to Afghanistan....a total embarrassment. So much so that before the iraqis did their push to oust daesh they enlisted the help of ssg to train their SF personal first here n than in iraq......their local efilates have only any thing to show for when the US operatives participate them selves in opps.
On the other hand Pak SF has been a huge success as trainers ......from the Afghan jihad to training the Sri Lankan army to fight against the tamils.

SMU is an over glorified acronym to make a fool of the US public and ppl around the world star struck with the US armed forces.
Wt our SF have done against the odds with the limited resources at their disposal is nothing short of a miracle.
Had the US SF been able to achieve 50% of their objectives the US would not be in the shit show that it is now.
All SF by virtue of being SF carry out and are smu 99% of the time.

Just fancy words friend.....all talk n no action.

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## Scorpiooo



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## Signalian

PanzerKiel said:


> Yes, Karrar is there only in name, as a subordinate company of ZATU.


A few cowboys from my course were inclined to join SSG, specifically Zarrar Coy. The thoughts changes after visiting Peshawar, came back and said,
"Para ho gaya hay, kaafi hay"

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## SSGOPERATOR

Assalam O Alaikum










The Special Service Group does look cutting edge and and very lethal now....















However the thing that concerns me is not their weapon, equipment and tactics but it is that why anonymity is not practiced by them. They upload a lot of images online revealing their face and identity which can be used by enemy surveillance cameras which have the latest Artificial Intelligence which in turn will compromise their covert operations and resulting in operational failure. The threat is real as it has already been used against us directly or indirectly in 2020. Everyone directly or indirectly accepts that they were used by ISI as a paramilitary force against Soviet Union in Afghanistan and is still being used by ISI for purposes I don't want to mention but I know that they do the right thing. *Why is it that such a great Intelligence Agency(ISI) and such a great Special Operations Force which can defeat a superpower and is still doing so about which @Horus and @PanzerKiel hopefully know about hasn't upgraded itself in cyber warfare and something simple as wearing a mask.* Is it possible that they might be fooling us they are really good at it?
Note: NO one literally no one should give a criticizing comment and only give a positive reply no matter how much you know.
plus no one to give an answer as ''The lions don't hide their faces'', etc. Do some research online because the threat is real.

And Admins kindly don't remove this thread for asking sensitive question. Just message me and I will remove the sensitive part of the question. It is really difficult to make a *new non-sensitive thread*. Thank you.

And for the lethality of the SSG:














Watch the video before Youtube removes them.
*Allah o Akbar
Fi AmanAllah
Pakistan Zindabad*
*InshAllah there is no power on earth that can undo Pakistan.
Allah is with the one who is for Allah no matter how underfunded they are.
“Do not say that! How few are the Romans and how numerous are we ! 'An army's strength lies not in numbers of men but in Allah's help, and its weakness lies in being forsaken by Allah”
-- **Khalid ibn al-Walid*

@Horus , @PanzerKiel and others Kindly Reply with any information you know regarding the topic.
*Plus also explain what exactly is the 'Covert Action Division' and 'Directorate S' or 'SS directorate'(there is a lot of confusion online) and what is the difference between these two?*

@Horus
@PanzerKiel
@MastanKhan
@Horus
@SQ8
@Oscar
@Zarvan
@Pomegranate
@Dubious
@Akheilos
@RescueRanger
@hassan1
@Manticore
@Levina
@syedali73
@Irfan Baloch
@Big Tank
@Sine Nomine

*P.S. What is Pakistan's approx equivalent of TIER 1? Is it Zarrar COY?*

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## TheSnakeEatingMarkhur

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam O Alaikum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Special Service Group does look cutting edge and and very lethal now....
> 
> View attachment 684639
> View attachment 684640
> View attachment 684641
> View attachment 684642
> 
> 
> However the thing that concerns me is not their weapon, equipment and tactics but it is that why anonymity is not practiced by them. They upload a lot of images online revealing their face and identity which can be used by enemy surveillance cameras which have the latest Artificial Intelligence which in turn will compromise their covert operations and resulting in operational failure. The threat is real as it has already been used against us directly or indirectly in 2020. Everyone directly or indirectly accepts that they were used by ISI as a paramilitary force against Soviet Union in Afghanistan and is still being used by ISI for purposes I don't want to mention but I know that they do the right thing. Why is it that such a great Intelligence Agency(ISI) and such a great Special Operations Force which can defeat a superpower and is still doing so about which @Horus and @PanzerKiel hopefully know about hasn't upgraded itself in cyber warfare and something simple as wearing a mask. Is it possible that they might be fooling us they are really good at it?
> Note: NO one literally no one should give a criticizing comment and only give a positive reply no matter how much you know.
> plus no one to give an answer as ''The lions don't hide their faces'', etc. Do some research online because the threat is real.
> 
> And Admins kindly don't remove this thread for asking sensitive question. Just message me and I will remove the sensitive part of the question. It is really difficult to make a new non-sensitive thread. Thank you.
> 
> And for the lethality of the SSG:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch the video before Youtube removes them.
> Fi AmanAllah
> Pakistan Zindabad
> InshAllah there is no power on earth that can undo Pakistan.
> 
> @Horus , @PanzerKiel and others Kindly Reply with any information you know regarding the topic.
> Plus also explain what exactly is the 'Covert Action Division' and 'Directorate S' or 'SS directorate'(there is a lot of confusion online) and what is the difference between these two?
> 
> @Horus
> @PanzerKiel
> @MastanKhan
> @Horus
> @SQ8
> @Oscar
> @Zarvan
> @Pomegranate
> @Dubious
> @Akheilos
> @RescueRanger
> @hassan1
> @Manticore
> @Devil Soul
> @Levina
> @syedali73
> @Irfan Baloch
> @Big Tank
> @Sine Nomine


Ssg in black uniform ?

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## SSGOPERATOR

TheSnakeEatingMarkhur said:


> Ssg in black uniform ?


Assalam o Alaikum
Yup. The Zarrar ATU(Anti-Terrorist Unit)(A company of SSG) wears black uniform.

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## TheSnakeEatingMarkhur

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam o Alaikum
> Yup. The Zarrar ATU(Anti-Terrorist Unit)(A company of SSG) wears black uniform.


Oh ok didnt know Zarrar wears Black Uniform mostly seen them in Civil in Videos but good to know we have all black uniformed commandos as well...

Btw Zarrar se Shaan ki nai movie zehn me aa rehi he 😅


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## SSGOPERATOR

TheSnakeEatingMarkhur said:


> Oh ok didnt know Zarrar wears Black Uniform mostly seen them in Civil in Videos but good to know we have all black uniformed commandos as well...
> 
> Btw Zarrar se Shaan ki nai movie zehn me aa rehi he 😅


Yeah they wear civilian for blending in & they do wear green(woodland) and black too depending on the situation. The only thing they lack behind is in technology.
Yes the movie delayed coz of covid-19 I think

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## Reichmarshal

black Storks

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## TheSnakeEatingMarkhur

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Yeah they wear civilian for blending in & they do wear green(woodland) and black too depending on the situation. The only thing they lack behind is in technology.
> Yes the movie delayed coz of covid-19 I think


Technology?you never know what they pack behind the scene but we do need more tech especially small AI drones

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## xyx007

I think one thing needs to be done. Pakistan is the last siege of the Muslim subcontinent. Just as Granada was once the last Muslim siege of Andalusia. Like Granada, thousands of flaws can be found in the state of Pakistan. But despite all these flaws, this is the only shield left. The Hindutva mentality we see in India today was realized by some great minds in the 1930s.
It became clear that in the democracy brought by the British, Muslims would never be able to reach the houses of power. And the narrow-minded and vindictive nature of Hindus in particular will never be willing to live with Muslims on the basis of peaceful coexistence. Therefore, they will be willing to go to any lengths to humiliate the Muslims.
The only possible solution to the situation was to establish a separate state free from Hindu influence. It is also worth noting here that Muslims have been trying to gain lasting assurances for their rights by staying inside India till the last moment. As a final argument, the Cabinet also agreed to the Mission Plan 1946. But the Indian National Congress not only rejected the plan, but also did not agree to separate elections for Muslims and reserved seats. After which there was no choice but to form a separate state.
Obviously this was not an ideal solution. It was a survival option. Just as the gates of the fort were forced to close as the attacker approached. While many people were still outside the fort. However, some people here had pinned their hopes on the Hindus in the face of British hostility. Who realized their mistake soon after independence. In this regard, the testimonies of Maulana Habib-ur-Rehman Ludhianvi of Majlis-e-Ahrar and Maulana Abul Kalam Azad of Congress can be seen. Today, you can pick up all the channels talking about India's defense on YouTube, most of which target Muslims, especially Indian Muslims. Look at the arrogance of France in honor of the Prophet (peace be upon him). Pakistan is like that but no ruler of Pakistan will ever have the courage to openly support France like Modi Coins and even Pakistani rulers condemned France. While the ruler of India Modi did not appreciate the sentiments of 200 million Muslims in his country and spoke of standing with France in this difficult time. At present 80% of the Hindu Baniyas are running against the Muslims. They blame the Muslims for everything. The poor Muslim just spends his whole life proving his patriotism to the Hindu Baniyas. If he insults, then the next test is called the infidel sentence of the servant Matram, whoever does this, then today it is time to insult Islam and test its patriotism. Have mercy on the brothers.

There is no denying the fact that even after the formation of Pakistan, the situation has never improved. Sharia has not been enforced here till date. Various proxy wars have been going on all the time and are still going on today. Numerous occupation groups have taken over the state, whose experiences have left the country hollow. But the point is that this is the last siege and refuge. Now the nation must stand on it. I learn and have more respect of pakistan after 35 years living aborad.Pakistan Zindabad

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## Varunastra

The sf are cool but why put those singing twats in the video? Totally takes away the feel imho


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## Talwar e Pakistan

UDAYCAMPUS said:


> The sf are cool but why put those singing twats in the video? Totally takes away the feel imho


It's a music video.


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## CodeforFood

Beautiful first video of the forces gave me goose bumps. Rejuvenated my memories from my childhood


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## Varunastra

Talwar e Pakistan said:


> It's a music video.


Not saying it's not but it looks like something funded by pak govt. /army and in such videos singers only serve as an annoying distraction, just an opinion though, i feel just keeping background music is good


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## SSGOPERATOR

Assalam O Alaikum


Reichmarshal said:


> black Storks


By the Grace of Allah
A nightmare for soviets without any cutting edge weaponry.


TheSnakeEatingMarkhur said:


> Technology?you never know what they pack behind the scene but we do need more tech especially small AI drones


Yup we do need it but I think they might have some drones in the back. As the file 'Yalghaar' featured them. I know films aren't real but they had some collaboration from ISPR, etc. so who knows. And everyone accepts that Pakistan millitary has done several Intelligence-based air strike and there is an article too on wikipedia. InshAllah Allah will help us in the future but a little poverty is good because man remembers ALLAH more when he is in need and when he is fulfilled he disobeys ALLAH. Everything happens only by the will of ALLAH (I don't mean that they should not upgarde)


xyx007 said:


> I think one thing needs to be done. Pakistan is the last siege of the Muslim subcontinent. Just as Granada was once the last Muslim siege of Andalusia. Like Granada, thousands of flaws can be found in the state of Pakistan. But despite all these flaws, this is the only shield left. The Hindutva mentality we see in India today was realized by some great minds in the 1930s.
> It became clear that in the democracy brought by the British, Muslims would never be able to reach the houses of power. And the narrow-minded and vindictive nature of Hindus in particular will never be willing to live with Muslims on the basis of peaceful coexistence. Therefore, they will be willing to go to any lengths to humiliate the Muslims.
> The only possible solution to the situation was to establish a separate state free from Hindu influence. It is also worth noting here that Muslims have been trying to gain lasting assurances for their rights by staying inside India till the last moment. As a final argument, the Cabinet also agreed to the Mission Plan 1946. But the Indian National Congress not only rejected the plan, but also did not agree to separate elections for Muslims and reserved seats. After which there was no choice but to form a separate state.
> Obviously this was not an ideal solution. It was a survival option. Just as the gates of the fort were forced to close as the attacker approached. While many people were still outside the fort. However, some people here had pinned their hopes on the Hindus in the face of British hostility. Who realized their mistake soon after independence. In this regard, the testimonies of Maulana Habib-ur-Rehman Ludhianvi of Majlis-e-Ahrar and Maulana Abul Kalam Azad of Congress can be seen. Today, you can pick up all the channels talking about India's defense on YouTube, most of which target Muslims, especially Indian Muslims. Look at the arrogance of France in honor of the Prophet (peace be upon him). Pakistan is like that but no ruler of Pakistan will ever have the courage to openly support France like Modi Coins and even Pakistani rulers condemned France. While the ruler of India Modi did not appreciate the sentiments of 200 million Muslims in his country and spoke of standing with France in this difficult time. At present 80% of the Hindu Baniyas are running against the Muslims. They blame the Muslims for everything. The poor Muslim just spends his whole life proving his patriotism to the Hindu Baniyas. If he insults, then the next test is called the infidel sentence of the servant Matram, whoever does this, then today it is time to insult Islam and test its patriotism. Have mercy on the brothers.
> 
> There is no denying the fact that even after the formation of Pakistan, the situation has never improved. Sharia has not been enforced here till date. Various proxy wars have been going on all the time and are still going on today. Numerous occupation groups have taken over the state, whose experiences have left the country hollow. But the point is that this is the last siege and refuge. Now the nation must stand on it. I learn and have more respect of pakistan after 35 years living aborad.Pakistan Zindabad


Assalam O Alaikum
InshAllah Allah will help muslims restore our true identity.
Yes I totally agree with you. Almost everyone these days is trying to Nauzubillah destroy our us and only hope is Allah. We can only hope that Allah stands with us because only the Order of Allah gets things done but Allah is only with those who are for Allah. We have to become a better Muslim. Read Quran Majeed(with translation to better understand it minimum one page a day if you are busy) because it prays for its reader. And we have to be disciplined in Salat. Help others. Stay away from sins especially being toxic to others, pornography and such filthy things like drugs because it is destroying our young generations and they are gonna lead tommorow.
May Allah give us refuge and strength to stay away from sins and to do good deeds. Ameen
Only then our Golden age will be restored again. We have many enemies especially Jews and Hindus and only Allah can help us succeed. Many scholars think the end time has begun because evil has covered the surface of Earth and it is time Imam Mahdi(A.S) and Hazrat Isa (A.S) will InshAllah rise.
May Allah make us stand with them and give us victory. Ameen.
Allah O Akbar


CodeforFood said:


> Beautiful first video of the forces gave me goose bumps. Rejuvenated my memories from my childhood


Great to know you liked the thread.
Thanks.
What about the last videos???


UDAYCAMPUS said:


> Not saying it's not but it looks like something funded by pak govt. /army and in such videos singers only serve as an annoying distraction, just an opinion though, i feel just keeping background music is good


Assalam O Alaikum
Sorry can't provide it with the background music but some people like the way it is.
Everyone has their own perception.
Anyways many scholars agree that music is haraam in Islam I want to upload it without music but can't.
And please don't start a debate on halal or haram in the thread
Allah Hafiz

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## Salman876

TheSnakeEatingMarkhur said:


> Oh ok didnt know Zarrar wears Black Uniform mostly seen them in Civil in Videos but good to know we have all black uniformed commandos as well...
> 
> Btw Zarrar se Shaan ki nai movie zehn me aa rehi he 😅


CTD punjab are also black uniformed

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## SSGOPERATOR

Salman876 said:


> CTD punjab are also black uniformed


Assalam O Alaikum
Yes they are but in the video it is Zarrar ATU.


TheSnakeEatingMarkhur said:


> Technology?you never know what they pack behind the scene but we do need more tech especially small AI drones


Assalam O Alaikum 
Can you specifically tell what they might have 'behind the scene'
Jazak Allah


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## SSGOPERATOR

*Do SSG officers get issued tactical watches?




*


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## Metal 0-1

SSGOPERATOR said:


> View attachment 684905
> 
> 
> *Do SSG officers get issued tactical watches?
> 
> View attachment 684915
> *


personal purchases


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## SSGOPERATOR

Metal 0-1 said:


> personal purchases


Assalam O Alaikum
Oh thanks and JazakAllah for the answer. In an other thread people were talking about the SSG's outlet where bags were for 11k, etc. Do they sell watches at there? And is the bag really for PKR 11000?


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## Metal 0-1

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam O Alaikum
> Oh thanks and JazakAllah for the answer. In an other thread people were talking about the SSG's outlet where bags were for 11k, etc. Do they sell watches at there? And is the bag really for PKR 11000?


That's high quality military gear. You get what you pay for.

This investment will last long.

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## Reichmarshal

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam O Alaikum
> Oh thanks and JazakAllah for the answer. In an other thread people were talking about the SSG's outlet where bags were for 11k, etc. Do they sell watches at there? And is the bag really for PKR 11000?


the camel hump is not for 11000 but around half of that.

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## Cuirassier

UDAYCAMPUS said:


> The sf are cool but why put those singing twats in the video? Totally takes away the feel imho


our PR wankers believe it's 'cool'. another factor is the gawaar awaam that adores such music.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Reichmarshal said:


> the camel hump is not for 11000 but around half of that.


As Salam o Alaikum,
Do they or any official SSG authority sell watches their? A couple of years ago I brought a mug from their as a souvenir but didn't ask about the cample hump or the watches....

BTW is this the 'Camel Hump'


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## SSGOPERATOR

Assalam o Alaikum
@Horus and @PanzerKiel I am awaiting your reply to this thread....


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## Signalian

One of the roles that SSG was tasked to have was to stay behind in Pakistani towns if Pakistan is run over by India. This could have been applied in East Pakistan had the surrender not taken place.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Signalian said:


> One of the roles that SSG was tasked to have was to stay behind in Pakistani towns if Pakistan is run over by India. This could have been applied in East Pakistan had the surrender not taken place.


Yup it could have helped. Do you know something about the 'identity thing' and is Zarrar our approx tier 1?


SSGOPERATOR said:


> As Salam o Alaikum,
> Do they or any official SSG authority sell watches their? A couple of years ago I brought a mug from their as a souvenir but didn't ask about the cample hump or the watches....
> 
> BTW is this the 'Camel Hump'
> View attachment 685166
> View attachment 685167


@Reichmarshal

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## Reichmarshal

Things are available in the Mkt, not that readly as before but still available.


Signalian said:


> One of the roles that SSG was tasked to have was to stay behind in Pakistani towns if Pakistan is run over by India. This could have been applied in East Pakistan had the surrender not taken place.


U can only imploy such tactics if the general population is on ur side or at the very least have some support, in 71 the population had turned on us.
We were losing soldier even in the hospitals.

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## PanzerKiel

Signalian said:


> One of the roles that SSG was tasked to have was to stay behind in Pakistani towns if Pakistan is run over by India. This could have been applied in East Pakistan had the surrender not taken place.



One regular brigade out of three ex 14 Division was taken up for this experiment a bit before 65 War ... A whole brigade fighting on lines of guerilla warfare which was found extremely successful in 1965 war.... 

Sadly, many of the veterans of this very brigade were also instrumental in mounting of several such attacks against Pak Army in 1971.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Assalam O Alaikum
@Horus can you plz ask someone from SSG these questions and answer them here.


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## SSGOPERATOR

Zarrar Coy is the approximate Tier 1/SMU of Pakistan Special Operation Forces. It is the most trained and elite unit of SSG.
Combined with 3 Cdo Bn Powindah (Karrar is embedded inside Zarrar) it forms the "Special Operations Task Force''.
*1) Why is it called SOTF? Don't the other units of SSG conduct Special Operations? What are the roles of the other units.*
*2) Is an SSG Janbaz trained only in one scope of warfare (i.e. Urban/ Airborne/ Maritime/ Guerilla/ Mountain/ Desert/ COIN/ Unconventional/ CT/ Jungle etc.) or can a single SSG Janbaz be trained in mulitiple scopes of warfare?*
*3) Is Zarrar only reserved for Urban Warfare, CT, COIN or can it conduct OPs in Jungle, Desert, Mountains, Unconventional, Guerilla, Airborne, Maritime, etc. Has it been deployed in Kashmir, Narogo Karabakh, Yemen, Afghanistan, Waziristan, Swat, etc? Being trained in CT can it fight soldiers of other Armies other than just countering terrorist?*

Plus I have seen video of Yalghaar Cdo Bn doing hostage-rescue:




@Horus @Metal 0-1 @PanzerKiel @Reichmarshal

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## Ahmet Pasha

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Zarrar Coy is the approximate Tier 1/SMU of Pakistan Special Operation Forces. It is the most trained and elite unit of SSG.
> Combined with 3 Cdo Bn Powindah (Karrar is embedded inside Zarrar) it forms the "Special Operations Task Force''.
> *1) Why is it called SOTF? Don't the other units of SSG conduct Special Operations? What are the roles of the other units.*
> *2) Is an SSG Janbaz trained only in one scope of warfare (i.e. Urban/ Airborne/ Maritime/ Guerilla/ Mountain/ Desert/ COIN/ Unconventional/ CT/ Jungle etc.) or can a single SSG Janbaz be trained in mulitiple scopes of warfare?*
> *3) Is Zarrar only reserved for Urban Warfare, CT, COIN or can it conduct OPs in Jungle, Desert, Mountains, Unconventional, Guerilla, Airborne, Maritime, etc. Has it been deployed in Kashmir, Narogo Karabakh, Yemen, Afghanistan, Waziristan, Swat, etc.*
> 
> Plus I have seen video of Yalghaar Cdo Bn doing hostage-rescue:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @Horus @Metal 0-1 @PanzerKiel @Reichmarshal



Your asking for too much info on a Task Force that's supposed to be clandestine. 

Suffice it to say most tier 1 units train an operator to specialize in one or two roles and then they work together in a team.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Ahmet Pasha said:


> Your asking for too much info on a Task Force that's supposed to be clandestine.
> 
> Suffice it to say most tier 1 units train an operator to specialize in one or two roles and then they work together in a team.


Don't share the classified stuff just share the general stuff or *privately message me.*


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## Ahmet Pasha

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Don't share the classified stuff just share the general stuff or *privately message me.*


To the extent possible I have. Although I am not in any service.

An operator is a tool; a very sharp, refined, razor edge tool. But its effectiveness will always be dependant upon how the operation as a whole is planned and executed.

American SOF (supposedly the best) and with whole bunch of allies couldn't do jack in Afghanistan. Sure they must've done great shock and awe raids and some war crimes(a la Australians) to stoke fear in enemy ranks.

But how effective was that at the large scale? Afghanis made Americans and NATO chase their own tail. The guy who is one day ANA general, whom they are briefing about how things are gonna go down. Next day he has defected to another faction. Or is AWOL. Or some politician they were grooming now suddenly is Taliban cuz some stupid soldier insulted his religion/culture.

Socio-Politics is where America lost it in Afghanistan

Compare that with same American SOF/SOCOM in Iraq where similar loosely controlled SOF units with more autonomy/loose command structure yielded much better results.

To go along with that US civ-mil leadership played Iraqi socio-politics against Iraqis very well. It was a country which had systematically been starved through sanctions much like Yemen and then picked from the tree like ripe fruit.

So SOF units are just a tool. Dependant upon how good the greater game is planned.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Ahmet Pasha said:


> To the extent possible I have. Although I am not in any service.
> 
> An operator is a tool; a very sharp, refined, razor edge tool. But its effectiveness will always be dependant upon how the operation as a whole is planned and executed.
> 
> American SOF (supposedly the best) and with whole bunch of allies couldn't do jack in Afghanistan. Sure they must've done great shock and awe raids and some war crimes(a la Australians) to stoke fear in enemy ranks.
> 
> But how effective was that at the large scale? Afghanis made Americans and NATO chase their own tail. The guy who is one day ANA general, whom they are briefing about how things are gonna go down. Next day he has defected to another faction. Or is AWOL. Or some politician they were grooming now suddenly is Taliban cuz some stupid soldier insulted his religion/culture.
> 
> Socio-Politics is where America lost it in Afghanistan
> 
> Compare that with same American SOF/SOCOM in Iraq where similar loosely controlled SOF units with more autonomy/loose command structure yielded much better results.
> 
> To go along with that US civ-mil leadership played Iraqi socio-politics against Iraqis very well. It was a country which had systematically been starved through sanctions much like Yemen and then picked from the tree like ripe fruit.
> 
> So SOF units are just a tool. Dependant upon how good the greater game is planned.


Assalam O Alaikum
JazakAllah for the answer. I am just being curious about the questions that I asked but your reply is also informative. 
*Fear not the army of Lions lead by a Coward. Fear the army of cowards(or lions) lead by Lions.*


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## Sine Nomine

Signalian said:


> One of the roles that SSG was tasked to have was to stay behind in Pakistani towns if Pakistan is run over by India. This could have been applied in East Pakistan had the surrender not taken place.


Actually that role was devised by US.Pakistan was frontline state in West fight against commies.US and PA raised and trained 19 Bln crica 1953-54, into a special unit for covert warfare,in 1956 it was enlarged and SSG was formed.It's primary role during it's inception was fighting an unconventional war if Pak is overrun by Red Army.Pakistan quest for a spec ops unit dates back to 1950.

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## Sulman Badshah

Training Nigerian Snipers

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## R Wing

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam O Alaikum
> @Horus can you plz ask someone from SSG these questions and answer them here.



1.) Zarrar is the Tier 1 unit. It was set up on the lines of the British SAS, just like the US Delta Force was/is. Karrar is another unit that was created with American assistance specifically for the WOT. SOTF was yet another unit specifically for FATA ops (specific to the terrain, heli ops, etc.) Karrar has been absorbed into Zarrar now. Zarrar was perfectly capable of handling all roles but was a very small team reserved for HVTs, etc. 

2.) An SSG commando can gain skills in various specialties. Courses are run at the Special Operations School and elsewhere (even abroad.) However, some tend to stick to their (very difficult) specializations, like the "frog men" of Musa Coy or the "anti terrorists" of Zarrar. Jack of all trades, master of some 

3.) Zarrar, like any Tier 1 unit, is perfectly capable of fighting any enemy force --- however, not in the conventional sense. Read up on JSOC missions --- one can assume that any other worthy Tier 1 unit would have the same mission set, except in our case we are mostly operating internally or in the region (vs. on different continents.)


Reichmarshal said:


> US forces, special or otherwise have been a huge failure in accomplishing their role as trainers as FID....starting from Vietnam to Afghanistan....a total embarrassment. So much so that before the iraqis did their push to oust daesh they enlisted the help of ssg to train their SF personal first here n than in iraq......their local efilates have only any thing to show for when the US operatives participate them selves in opps.
> On the other hand Pak SF has been a huge success as trainers ......from the Afghan jihad to training the Sri Lankan army to fight against the tamils.
> 
> SMU is an over glorified acronym to make a fool of the US public and ppl around the world star struck with the US armed forces.
> Wt our SF have done against the odds with the limited resources at their disposal is nothing short of a miracle.
> Had the US SF been able to achieve 50% of their objectives the US would not be in the shit show that it is now.
> All SF by virtue of being SF carry out and are smu 99% of the time.
> 
> Just fancy words friend.....all talk n no action.



Actually, the American SMUs are - by all measures - bloody brilliant. Granted, they have the best tech at their disposal and the support of the world's main superpower. But that doesn't mean that tactically they have been very good. 

The issue is at the strategic level where the States (in my opinion) wants to get itself into intractable quagmires so it can remain in parts of the world where it wants to maintain a presence. 

Also, the phrase "US SF" specifically refers to the US Army Special Forces (aka Green Berets) whose main mission is training guerilla forces in other countries (Foreign Internal Defense, not Direct Action.) Though the US SF does have some direct action-focused teams within it, the premier direct action and special recon units are the SMUs under JSOC (DEVGRU, Delta, ISA, 24th Special Tactics etc.) 

Finally, I absolutely agree with your point that our spec ops units (SSG) achieved stunning results against internal militants.

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## Reichmarshal

Actually our delta force equlant are the "black storks".
They sit on the top of the pyramid.

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## MastanKhan

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam O Alaikum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Special Service Group does look cutting edge and and very lethal now....
> 
> View attachment 684639
> View attachment 684640
> View attachment 684641
> View attachment 684642
> 
> 
> However the thing that concerns me is not their weapon, equipment and tactics but it is that why anonymity is not practiced by them. They upload a lot of images online revealing their face and identity which can be used by enemy surveillance cameras which have the latest Artificial Intelligence which in turn will compromise their covert operations and resulting in operational failure. The threat is real as it has already been used against us directly or indirectly in 2020. Everyone directly or indirectly accepts that they were used by ISI as a paramilitary force against Soviet Union in Afghanistan and is still being used by ISI for purposes I don't want to mention but I know that they do the right thing. *Why is it that such a great Intelligence Agency(ISI) and such a great Special Operations Force which can defeat a superpower and is still doing so about which @Horus and @PanzerKiel hopefully know about hasn't upgraded itself in cyber warfare and something simple as wearing a mask.* Is it possible that they might be fooling us they are really good at it?
> Note: NO one literally no one should give a criticizing comment and only give a positive reply no matter how much you know.
> plus no one to give an answer as ''The lions don't hide their faces'', etc. Do some research online because the threat is real.
> 
> And Admins kindly don't remove this thread for asking sensitive question. Just message me and I will remove the sensitive part of the question. It is really difficult to make a *new non-sensitive thread*. Thank you.
> 
> And for the lethality of the SSG:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Watch the video before Youtube removes them.
> *Allah o Akbar
> Fi AmanAllah
> Pakistan Zindabad*
> *InshAllah there is no power on earth that can undo Pakistan.
> Allah is with the one who is for Allah no matter how underfunded they are.
> “Do not say that! How few are the Romans and how numerous are we ! 'An army's strength lies not in numbers of men but in Allah's help, and its weakness lies in being forsaken by Allah”
> -- **Khalid ibn al-Walid*
> 
> @Horus , @PanzerKiel and others Kindly Reply with any information you know regarding the topic.
> *Plus also explain what exactly is the 'Covert Action Division' and 'Directorate S' or 'SS directorate'(there is a lot of confusion online) and what is the difference between these two?*
> 
> @Horus
> @PanzerKiel
> @MastanKhan
> @Horus
> @SQ8
> @Oscar
> @Zarvan
> @Pomegranate
> @Dubious
> @Akheilos
> @RescueRanger
> @hassan1
> @Manticore
> @Levina
> @syedali73
> @Irfan Baloch
> @Big Tank
> @Sine Nomine
> 
> *P.S. What is Pakistan's approx equivalent of TIER 1? Is it Zarrar COY?*



Hi,

Actually---a lion does hide its face till the last moment when it pounces at the prey---.

A lion is a "stalker" by nature---.

There is no reason for the spec forces operators should be allowed to have display their photos on public forums or any other forum---.

As a matter of fact---all predators are stalkers---. They hide---they use camouflagee of nature and environment to conceal their presence/faces till they pounce on the prey.

I think that there is a little too much " show off " mentality in the pakistani spec forces---.

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## Irfan Baloch

Sulman Badshah said:


> Training Nigerian Snipers
> View attachment 706463


love the Nigerian poses lol


MastanKhan said:


> Hi,
> 
> Actually---a lion does hide its face till the last moment when it pounces at the prey---.
> 
> A lion is a "stalker" by nature---.
> 
> There is no reason for the spec forces operators should be allowed to have display their photos on public forums or any other forum---.
> 
> As a matter of fact---all predators are stalkers---. They hide---they use camouflagee of nature and environment to conceal their presence/faces till they pounce on the prey.
> 
> I think that there is a little too much " show off " mentality in the pakistani spec forces---.


the British SAS and SBS are complete opposite of that, even their retired personnel dont show their faces except a few that came in the media limelight. all their pictures are on media are done by actors. few years back some of them posted their pictures with the tactical gear but their faces blocked with black blocks but were still told off for "showing off" due to showing some advanced gear.

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## Metal 0-1

MastanKhan said:


> Hi,
> 
> Actually---a lion does hide its face till the last moment when it pounces at the prey---.
> 
> A lion is a "stalker" by nature---.
> 
> There is no reason for the spec forces operators should be allowed to have display their photos on public forums or any other forum---.
> 
> As a matter of fact---all predators are stalkers---. They hide---they use camouflagee of nature and environment to conceal their presence/faces till they pounce on the prey.
> 
> I think that there is a little too much " show off " mentality in the pakistani spec forces---.


Seriously!
I do agree they show off too much. They should spend their time on range rather than social media.

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## Reichmarshal

No more pics of armed forces personal specially SF personal on social media. For at least the last one year.
Only controlled leaks. Policy being strictly enforced. 
All offenders get an adverse at the very least.

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## Ahmet Pasha

Metal 0-1 said:


> Seriously!
> I do agree they show off too much. They should spend their time on range rather than social media.


How else will our Leftain sahbs and Kaptaan sahbs get bachian??

Vice news tracked down Russian commandoes and Spetsnaz operators using facebook and other osint sources to triangulate their locations. They were fighting in Ukraine(Crimea), disavowed by their state. But were traced by Vice news lmao.

If Vice news can do that then imagine what our enemies with help of hostile intelligence can do.

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## SSGOPERATOR

R Wing said:


> 1.) Zarrar is the Tier 1 unit. It was set up on the lines of the British SAS, just like the US Delta Force was/is. Karrar is another unit that was created with American assistance specifically for the WOT. SOTF was yet another unit specifically for FATA ops (specific to the terrain, heli ops, etc.) Karrar has been absorbed into Zarrar now. Zarrar was perfectly capable of handling all roles but was a very small team reserved for HVTs, etc.
> 
> 2.) An SSG commando can gain skills in various specialties. Courses are run at the Special Operations School and elsewhere (even abroad.) However, some tend to stick to their (very difficult) specializations, like the "frog men" of Musa Coy or the "anti terrorists" of Zarrar. Jack of all trades, master of some
> 
> 3.) Zarrar, like any Tier 1 unit, is perfectly capable of fighting any enemy force --- however, not in the conventional sense. Read up on JSOC missions --- one can assume that any other worthy Tier 1 unit would have the same mission set, except in our case we are mostly operating internally or in the region (vs. on different continents.)





Reichmarshal said:


> Actually our delta force equlant are the "black storks".
> They sit on the top of the pyramid.





Reichmarshal said:


> No more pics of armed forces personal specially SF personal on social media. For at least the last one year.
> Only controlled leaks. Policy being strictly enforced.
> All offenders get an adverse at the very least.


Assalam o Alaikum
@R Wing and @Reichmarshal Can you kindly tell me what you do? I mean do you study or are you in the Military(Spec Ops, Intel, etc.). Give me just a simple hint if you want to keep the reality hidden.
P.S. Where did you get all of this information from? Any sources you can share?


----------



## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam o Alaikum
> @R Wing and @Reichmarshal Can you kindly tell me what you do? I mean do you study or are you in the Military(Spec Ops, Intel, etc.). Give me just a simple hint if you want to keep the reality hidden.
> P.S. Where did you get all of this information from? Any sources you can share?



you don't ask such questions from anyone on this forum ----

Bhai, problem kia hai, i see you are wandering Spec Ops threads asking questions, lets settle the issue once for all & shoot away you your questions...lets see if i can answer them in meaningful way

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## Big Tank

Ahmet Pasha said:


> How else will our Leftain sahbs and Kaptaan sahbs get bachian??
> 
> Vice news tracked down Russian commandoes and Spetsnaz operators using facebook and other osint sources to triangulate their locations. They were fighting in Ukraine(Crimea), disavowed by their state. But were traced by Vice news lmao.
> 
> If Vice news can do that then imagine what our enemies with help of hostile intelligence can do.



Lol yess. Bachian and then those wannabe pAk AmRy fAnX cLub groups on fb with cringe. 

Seriously some SSG capt was an online celebrity posting his filtered candy cam videos almost every day. Fangirls were all crazy for him. Cannot believe that this shit was tolerated for a year bc


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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> you don't ask such questions from anyone on this forum ----
> 
> Bhai, problem kia hai, i see you are wandering Spec Ops threads asking questions, lets settle the issue once for all & shoot away you your questions...lets see if i can answer them in meaningful way


Assalam o Alaikum
Well my curiosty about SSG never ends so I might start annoying you.
But for now the question is that whether Zarrar is the best unit of SSG or not???
In reality I am just a young kid kind of you know AlhamdUllilah ______________________________ about SSG
and i want real satisfying answers


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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Assalam o Alaikum
> Well my curiosty about SSG never ends so I meet start annoying you.
> But for now the question is that whether Zarrar is the best unit of SSG or not???
> In reality I am just a young kid kind of you know ______________________________ about SSG
> and i want real satisfying answers


Define 'best', a definition which is acceptable to you


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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> Define 'best', a definition which is acceptable to you


Foxtrot Bhaiya actually I mean the most elite, the most trained, the most dangerous, the most used, etc.


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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Foxtrot Bhaiya actually I mean the most elite, the most trained, the most dangerous, the most used, etc.
> View attachment 719535


each Group is best at what they do, though the competition exists b/w each but ultimately each is best to their own domain...

High Altitude Mountain Warfare to LoC cross border attacks, HALO Paratroopers / Pathfinders to Anti Terrorism Unit, each group works in their own domain & trains to achieve peak performance in that domain.....

Musa Company is the designated Frogman Team & they train specifically for ambitious assualt that doesn't mean that Powindah will not have Frogman,


SSGOPERATOR said:


> Foxtrot Bhaiya actually I mean the most elite, the most trained, the most dangerous, the most used, etc.
> View attachment 719535


If you are looking for a counter part to US Spec Ops Tier 1 groups like Seal Team or CAG then SSG itself is the counter part to these units

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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> each Group is best at what they do, though the competition exists b/w each but ultimately each is best to their own domain...
> 
> High Altitude Mountain Warfare to LoC cross border attacks, HALO Paratroopers / Pathfinders to Anti Terrorism Unit, each group works in their own domain & trains to achieve peak performance in that domain.....
> 
> Musa Company is the designated Frogman Team & they train specifically for ambitious assualt that doesn't mean that Powindah will not have Frogman,
> 
> If you are looking for a counter part to US Spec Ops Tier 1 groups like Seal Team or CAG then SSG itself is the counter part to these units


JazakAllah but yet another question
What are the roles of all the units? and what R Wing bhai said was write or not?


Foxtrot Alpha said:


> each Group is best at what they do, though the competition exists b/w each but ultimately each is best to their own domain...
> 
> High Altitude Mountain Warfare to LoC cross border attacks, HALO Paratroopers / Pathfinders to Anti Terrorism Unit, each group works in their own domain & trains to achieve peak performance in that domain.....
> 
> Musa Company is the designated Frogman Team & they train specifically for ambitious assualt that doesn't mean that Powindah will not have Frogman,
> 
> If you are looking for a counter part to US Spec Ops Tier 1 groups like Seal Team or CAG then SSG itself is the counter part to these units


What????????????do?????????you????????????mean????????????
I seriously thought the the rest SSG was tier 2 like green berets and Zarrar was the tier 1.
if you can prove this state(give me a satisfying answer) then tonight i might just sleep peacefully not thinking which is the best unit of SSG???????????🖖


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## CriticalThought

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> each Group is best at what they do, though the competition exists b/w each but ultimately each is best to their own domain...
> 
> High Altitude Mountain Warfare to LoC cross border attacks, HALO Paratroopers / Pathfinders to Anti Terrorism Unit, each group works in their own domain & trains to achieve peak performance in that domain.....
> 
> Musa Company is the designated Frogman Team & they train specifically for ambitious assualt that doesn't mean that Powindah will not have Frogman,
> 
> If you are looking for a counter part to US Spec Ops Tier 1 groups like Seal Team or CAG then SSG itself is the counter part to these units



What's the equivalent of Seal Team 6?


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## SSGOPERATOR

and then if SSG itself is Tier 1, who is Tier 2
and CAG has expertise in counter terrorism, Zarrar has expertise in counter terrorism
The whole SAS has expertise in counter terrorism
then how do the different units of SSG differ?
and R Wing bhai said Zarrar was Tier 1.............. Everything so confusing for me(the reason i am always asking question and can't go to sleep because of curiosty..............(well i got sleep but kahwat hai)


CriticalThought said:


> What's the equivalent of Seal Team 6?


Assalam o Alaikum
@Foxtrot Alpha bhaiya said the whole SSG is there equivalent(and thus Tier 1) and then there are people who say Zarrar is our only expert and Tier 1.
If Zarrar is expert in counter terrorsim then baki kya kar rahey hai. Don't do they kill terrorists????????
Allah ki Kasam Dua donga jus ne mujhe satisfy kia.........
And so everyone knows how to do anything....but has experitse in their own domain
ok yet some more answers...........


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## Reichmarshal

LCB is equlant of us army rangers.

All ssg battalions are tier 1. It took them 20 plus years to go from 4 units to 9 if that tells u any thing.

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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> and then if SSG itself is Tier 1, who is Tier 2
> and CAG has expertise in counter terrorism, Zarrar has expertise in counter terrorism
> The whole SAS has expertise in counter terrorism
> the how do the different units of SSG differ?
> and R Wing bhai said Zarrar was Tier 1.............. Everything so confusing for me(the reason i am always asking question and can't go to sleep because of curiosty..............(well i got sleep but kahwat hai)
> 
> Assalam o Alaikum
> @Foxtrot Alpha bhaiya said the whole SSG is there equivalent(and thus Tier 1) and then there are people who say Zarrar is our only expert and Tier 1.
> If Zarrar is expert in counter terrorsim then baki kya kar rahey hai. Don't do they kill terrorists????????
> Allah ki Kasam Dua donga jus ne mujhe satisfy kia.........
> And so everyone knows how to do anything....but has experitse in their own domain
> ok yet some more answers...........


bhai, don't compare US Uk system to ours, their Spec Ops structures differs from ours...
Going by What you are saying about US Tier 1 group being Seal Team 6 & Delta / CAG then what is Tron Victor?
Bloody hell this unit doesn't even have one name for more than 6 months and recruits from Tier 1 units....so what does this mean that it is Tier 0 unit??

Bottom line don't stress yourself over this & go to sleep....Each Unit in SSG specializes in it;s own doman. Zarrar is go to team for Anti Terror ops in Close quarters / building clearance & are equipped according to the needs of the Op.

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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> bhai, don't compare US Uk system to ours, their Spec Ops structures differs from ours...
> Going by What you are saying about US Tier 1 group being Seal Team 6 & Delta / CAG then what is Tron Victor?
> Bloody hell this unit doesn't even have one name for more than 6 months and recruits from Tier 1 units....so what does this mean that it is Tier 0 unit??
> 
> Bottom line don't stress yourself over this & go to sleep....Each Unit in SSG specializes in it;s own doman. Zarrar is go to team for Anti Terror ops in Close quarters / building clearance & are equipped according to the needs of the Op.


JazakAllah JazakAllah
but probably the last question to ask
your review on this:


R Wing said:


> 1.) Zarrar is the Tier 1 unit. It was set up on the lines of the British SAS, just like the US Delta Force was/is. Karrar is another unit that was created with American assistance specifically for the WOT. SOTF was yet another unit specifically for FATA ops (specific to the terrain, heli ops, etc.) Karrar has been absorbed into Zarrar now. Zarrar was perfectly capable of handling all roles but was a very small team reserved for HVTs, etc.
> 
> 2.) An SSG commando can gain skills in various specialties. Courses are run at the Special Operations School and elsewhere (even abroad.) However, some tend to stick to their (very difficult) specializations, like the "frog men" of Musa Coy or the "anti terrorists" of Zarrar. Jack of all trades, master of some
> 
> 3.) Zarrar, like any Tier 1 unit, is perfectly capable of fighting any enemy force --- however, not in the conventional sense. Read up on JSOC missions --- one can assume that any other worthy Tier 1 unit would have the same mission set, except in our case we are mostly operating internally or in the region (vs. on different continents.)
> 
> 
> Actually, the American SMUs are - by all measures - bloody brilliant. Granted, they have the best tech at their disposal and the support of the world's main superpower. But that doesn't mean that tactically they have been very good.
> 
> The issue is at the strategic level where the States (in my opinion) wants to get itself into intractable quagmires so it can remain in parts of the world where it wants to maintain a presence.
> 
> Also, the phrase "US SF" specifically refers to the US Army Special Forces (aka Green Berets) whose main mission is training guerilla forces in other countries (Foreign Internal Defense, not Direct Action.) Though the US SF does have some direct action-focused teams within it, the premier direct action and special recon units are the SMUs under JSOC (DEVGRU, Delta, ISA, 24th Special Tactics etc.)
> 
> Finally, I absolutely agree with your point that our spec ops units (SSG) achieved stunning results against internal militants.


@R Wing said Zarrar is tier 1
and the following thread also indirectly says something:





Call for Pakistan Army, to raise a TIER-1 Special Operations Force.


The title is pretty self explanatory for those who already realize the dire need for a TIER-1 Special Operations Force to be raised by Pakistan Army. Some would argue that the SSG has TIER-1 SOF units at its disposal, which go by different names inside the SSG. However, it is imperative for...



defence.pk




Plus one more thing
Who do you think will win SSG vs SAS, CAG, DEVGRU, blah blah blah


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## SSGOPERATOR

Reichmarshal said:


> LCB is equlant of us army rangers.
> 
> All ssg battalions are tier 1. It took them 20 plus years to go from 4 units to 9 if that tells u any thing.


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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> @R Wing said Zarrar is tier 1
> and the following thread also indirectly says something:


read point # 3


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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> read point # 3


well he means that Zarrar is an independent tier 1 unit(seperate from SSG) doen't he?


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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> well he means that Zarrar is an independent tier 1 unit(seperate from SSG) doen't he?


it is not Tier 1...end of story


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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> it is not Tier 1...end of story


JazakAllah bro........................... Now i will pray for you
BTW my monkey mind is asking for a solid source on this information like something solid.(like are you in Intel, Spec OPs, etc.)
and in your about on your profile you wrote in your occupation "Hunting Terrorists". Do you really do that or just a joke(just a hint bhaiya Please)


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## Amaa'n

SSGOPERATOR said:


> in your about on your profile you wrote in your occupation "Hunting Terrorists". Do you really do that or just a joke(just a hint bhaiya Please


Not a joke !!!

now you are more than welcome to deduce anything from that

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## SSGOPERATOR

Foxtrot Alpha said:


> Not a joke !!!
> 
> now you are more than welcome to deduce anything from that


and one more thing
how closely do you work with SSG?
BTW i am slowly getting scared of you bhaiya....You literally kill people???


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## baqai

Google is your friend mate, doubt you will find a Tier 1 operator here who will brag about their ops online, about who is the best? Well who manages the first reaction, first shot and first kill, rest from what I have gathered is that info you want to hear is all very patriotic filmi topgun type hehe


SSGOPERATOR said:


> JazakAllah bro........................... Now i will pray for you
> BTW my monkey mind is asking for a solid source on this information like something solid.(like are you in Intel, Spec OPs, etc.)
> and in your about on your profile you wrote in your occupation "Hunting Terrorists". Do you really do that or just a joke(just a hint bhaiya Please)

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## SSGOPERATOR

baqai said:


> Google is your friend mate, doubt you will find a Tier 1 operator here who will brag about their ops online, about who is the best? Well who manages the first reaction, first shot and first kill, rest from what I have gathered is that info you want to hear is all very patriotic filmi topgun type hehe


Asslam o Alaikum
no I was just asking @Foxtrot Alpha how closely he has worked with SSG so i can just rely on his info and go to sleep


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## baqai

SSGOPERATOR said:


> Asslam o Alaikum
> no I was just asking @Foxtrot Alpha how closely he has worked with SSG so i can just rely on his info and go to sleep



W'salam, @Foxtrot Alpha is a knowledgeable and well respected poster, a lot of people here are gems but not directly in forces yet day in and out we go to sleep with a smile because we take their word based on their past record. Same applies here mate, go to sleep and rely on his info, doubt he will reveal anything more about his links.

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## CriticalThought

So one key attribute in a special services operator is the ability to pick up and apply new technologies. I want to share where I am coming from on this.

Modern FPS games such as Call of Duty have taken a futuristic tangent in which you are in command of crazy technologies such as ability to walk along walls, jump extremely high, become invisible etc. I like to watch 'game movies' of these, where someone goes through the game and records it for YouTube. What I have seen is that people tend to go back to basics: enter into battle with guns blazing, kill enemies through brute force, move on. It is very rare that someone is able to onboard new technologies and apply them in the heat of battle.

With the above in mind, my question is: how good are our SSG operators in adopting such new technologies and then applying them in the heat of battle? The mind plays a big role in this. You have to have superior intellect and presence of mind in order to be able to achieve this. I know SSG are recruited and trained based on superior strength, but what about superior intellect?

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## farooqbhai007

SSG with HK -416 ? & under barrel grenade launcher

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## iLION12345_1

farooqbhai007 said:


> View attachment 727707
> 
> SSG with HK -416 ? & under barrel grenade launcher


Gun likely belongs to host country, common practice to use host countries firearms during exercises.

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## farooqbhai007

iLION12345_1 said:


> Gun likely belongs to host country, common practice to use host countries firearms during exercises.


nope , all countries brought their own weapons , this wasnt a simple exercise , it is like the middle east's biggest counter terrorism exercise , there was also no limit on the amount of units , like Morroco sent 4 different counter terror units from different branches


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## Metal 0-1

farooqbhai007 said:


> nope , all countries brought their own weapons , this wasnt a simple exercise , it is like the middle east's biggest counter terrorism exercise , there was also no limit on the amount of units , like Morroco sent 4 different counter terror units from different branches


What's the name name of this exercise?


farooqbhai007 said:


> View attachment 727707
> 
> SSG with HK -416 ? & under barrel grenade launcher


Sorry to break it it you but that's not HK-416 rather some AR-15 variant with extended rails.

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## farooqbhai007

Metal 0-1 said:


> What's the name name of this exercise?
> 
> Sorry to break it it you but that's not HK-416 rather some AR-15 variant with extended rails.


yea i was wondering which gun it was hence i put the "?" after writing HK-416 ,
Exercise name is " Al Hares Al Mane 2021 " hosted by Qatar , with participating units from Morocco , Jordan , Turkey , Pakistan and Italy. There is also a part of this exercise with US forces in which they conducted anti-terror exercises in malls.

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## Metal 0-1

farooqbhai007 said:


> yea i was wondering which gun it was hence i put the "?" after writing HK-416 ,
> Exercise name is " Al Hares Al Mane 2021 " hosted by Qatar , with participating units from Morocco , Jordan , Turkey , Pakistan and Italy. There is also a part of this exercise with US forces in which they conducted anti-terror exercises in malls.


Hey man will you please link some video?


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## farooqbhai007

Metal 0-1 said:


> Hey man will you please link some video?


Don't have any link yet, I found this picture after a morrocan posted images of their units in the exercise and I spotted the ssg dude


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## Reichmarshal

farooqbhai007 said:


> View attachment 727707
> 
> SSG with HK -416 ? & under barrel grenade launcher


M4a1 with a m203 expic 40MM grenade launcher

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## farooqbhai007

more pics , and yes every country brought their own guns and gear ,

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## Metal 0-1

farooqbhai007 said:


> View attachment 731984
> 
> View attachment 731985
> 
> more pics , and yes every country brought their own guns and gear ,


Weapons are provided by host. No one in the SSG-G uses a magpul CTRO stock and aftermarket rails.

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## mingle

Metal 0-1 said:


> Hey man will you please link some video?


It's Qatar


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## Sulman Badshah

NIgerian with SSG patch

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## SSGOPERATOR

farooqbhai007 said:


> View attachment 731984
> 
> View attachment 731985
> 
> more pics , and yes every country brought their own guns and gear ,


i don't know but the hate for C-Clamp is real


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## Metal 0-1

SSGOPERATOR said:


> i don't know but the hate for C-Clamp is real


It's the old training manual. For years our guys are trained like this. And no one wants to improve.


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## SSGOPERATOR

Metal 0-1 said:


> It's the old training manual. For years our guys are trained like this. And no one wants to improve.


not even the foreign spec ops taught them the news style?


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## Metal 0-1

SSGOPERATOR said:


> not even the foreign spec ops taught them the news style?


Their training program by US Army SF was suspended by Trump administration. They went their to complete specialized courses like diving, halo/haho jumps, airborne courses. I don't think they taught them on rifle fundamentals. 

Long story short they didn't taught if they taught them it was never picked


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## kursed

For all the times that SSG have been trashed upon in this thread vs SEALS in terms of training and equipment. It does not seem like SEALs are respected much by their compatriots. If anything... they are treated as man-children. Check the entire thread, I've never read such remarks about SSG, ever! 


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1461135329205932037

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## iLION12345_1

kursed said:


> For all the times that SSG have been trashed upon in this thread vs SEALS in terms of training and equipment. It does not seem like SEALs are respected much by their compatriots. If anything... they are treated as man-children. Check the entire thread, I've never read such remarks about SSG, ever!
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1461135329205932037


The SEALs are a known meme in the US for always writing books and making movies about their missions and deployments while other SFs (by that I mean their own like Delta) never do it, add to that claims of embellishment and There you have it.

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## Metal 0-1

SEAL Team 3 in Ramadi was most hated unit.
From the accounts of Army Vets that were there SEALs got in trouble and they had to get them out of there everytime.

Jocko Willink was not this good dude you see in youtube videos. He always told Army guys to get out of his way and those Army guys were to save them.

Delta on the other hand was more respectable.


Part of it is also the fact that they don't seem to be effective in firefights. SEALs are sailors or civilians.

But Army Special Operations community is prior infantry. So when shit hits the fan those SF guys infantry roots come into play.

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## Windjammer

__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=425313928996323

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## TsAr

iLION12345_1 said:


> The SEALs are a known meme in the US for always writing books and making movies about their missions and deployments while other SFs (by that I mean their own like Delta) never do it, add to that claims of embellishment and There you have it.


Deltas come from the Army like our SSG, whereas Seals are from Navy, so Deltas have exposure to army routines and culture.

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## R Wing

Metal 0-1 said:


> SEAL Team 3 in Ramadi was most hated unit.
> From the accounts of Army Vets that were there SEALs got in trouble and they had to get them out of there.
> 
> Jocko Willink was not this good dude you see in youtube videos. He always told Army guys to get out of his way and those Army guys were to save them.
> 
> Delta on the other hand was more respectable.
> 
> 
> Part of their is also they don't seem to be effective in firefights. SEALs are sailors or civilians.
> 
> But Army Special Operations community is prior infantry. So when shit hits the fan those SF guys infantry roots come into play.



Just some small pts:

1.) You cannot compare SEAL Team 3 to Delta; the former is a Tier 2 unit and the latter is a Tier 1 unit. 
Delta and SEAL Team 6 (aka DEVGRU, which gets to pick the best from all the other SEAL Teams and _then_ puts those selected few under another long round of training/selection) work under JSOC. 
The other SEAL Teams (like 3) and Army SF (aka Green Berets) are Tier 2 spec ops. 

2.) There has been a huge discipline problem in the USN Special Warfare community, specifically within the SEAL community. Entire units were 'disbanded' (or had their officer/NCO cadre changed) due to serious violations, including the death of an Army SF man on deployment (the SEALs were indulging in illegal activities that he had threatened to report). 

3.) SEALs are military men just like Army SF, Delta, etc. They are in the Navy, sure, but a huge part of their responsibility is land-based fighting (e.g. the Abbottabad Raid and lots of ops in Afghanistan and Iraq).


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## Pakstallion

Windjammer said:


> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=425313928996323



This clip may give heart attacks to Indians….

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## Raja Porus

Windjammer said:


> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=425313928996323


Russian BMP-2, Peace Mission 2021.


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## PanzerKiel

Maj Rana Bilal Ahmed, SJ: A Hero of the 1971 War

Brig Tughral Yamin 

Maj Bilal belongs to a generation of young men who died for their country fighting for the unity of motherland in East Pakistan. The deck was heavily stacked against them but notwithstanding the odds, the officers and men fought and died courageously in a war far from home. They did not return and lie buried in unmarked graves. May have Allah shower his infinite mercy on their souls. 

I met Maj Bilal when I was a schoolkid, and he was a young captain in the special forces. I think the year should be 1968 or thereabouts. I was eleven years old and he 24. His elder sister was married to my father’s friend Mr. Subah Sadiq (SS for short) Hameed. Mr. Hameed was posted as manager of the State Bank’s Peshawar branch. He had a large house at Fort Road in the Cantonment near the cricket stadium. We children always had a fun time in the large rambling lawn, playing cricket and hide and seek. The Hameed children: Saeed, Gul and Sameena, were the same ages as us (myself and my two younger sisters Sadaf and Humaira). 

I presume Maj Bilal Rana was deployed with special services at either Attock or Cherat at that time. I remember him as a dashing young officer. A few years later he was killed in action in the former East Pakistan in 1971. He was only 27 years old at the time. A grateful nation acknowledged his supreme sacrifice and awarded him the coveted gallantry award of Sitara-i-Jurat (Star of courage). 

I joined 7FF in 1976 and my acquaintance with Maj Bilal renewed. His portrait adorned the anteroom of the officers’ mess. Bilal Masjid in our company lines in Multan was constructed by funds provided by his mother and was a constant reminder that Maj Bilal belonged to our unit. Each rifle company vied for the award i.e., the Bilal banner. The best company proudly displays it in its lines.

Maj Bilal was born November 12, 1944 to Rana Sher Jang and his wife. His parents lived in Rana Mansion Block 2 Commercial Area, PECHS Karachi. He joined PMA in a regular course on November 23, 1961, twelve days after his seventeenth birthday. He was allotted GC No. 3024. Commissioned as a second lieutenant on April 19, 1964 after one-and-a-half year of training, he was given the Army No PA 6917. The last digit matched the unit he joined – the prestigious 7th battalion of the Frontier Force Regiment. Bilal fought the 1965 War as a lieutenant and was promoted as a captain during the war. A few years later, he joined the SSG. After his basic training in Cherat, he was sent to the U.S. for an advance course. 

When the war of 1971 broke out, Maj Bilal was serving with 2 Commando battalion. As the situation deteriorated, his company was sent to East Pakistan to become part of 3 Commando battalion. On the 25th of March 1971, 3 Commando was tasked to apprehend Sheikh Mujibur Rahman from his Dhan Mandi residence in Dhaka. The operation was fraught with danger, but Maj Bilal and his platoon pulled off the mission with clockwork precision. Sheikh Mujib was whisked away to West Pakistan, he would return to Bangladesh and hailed as its founding father. While Maj Bilal would never return to Pakistan to the bosom of his family. 

The civil war in East Pakistan was actively supported by the Indians. After Pakistan Army had been suitably weakened fighting the Mukti Bahini, Indian army invaded East Pakistan on November 23, 1971. Maj Bilal’s depleted SSG company was employed for the protection of 39 (raised on ad hoc arrangements) Division. His ragtag band included naval ratings and sundry left-over elements were deployed in defending the Chandpur blocking position. He was killed in action on December 14, 1971 in aerial strafing on the naval gunboat that served as his company HQ, on the banks of the River Meghna in Chandpur district. The battlefield citation written by his GOC for the award of an SJ read: 
“On 5th December 1971, when the enemy columns had broken through our defences between Laksham and Comilla and were heading for the Divisional Headquarters and Chandpur base, there were no troops on defensive positions except small detachments on bridges between him and his objectives. At that critical stage approximately half a company of commandos under Major Bilal Ahmed was made available to my Division. This company was given the task of delaying the enemy’s advance consisting of strong outflanking foot columns of Indian Army and Mukti Bahini supported by thousands of locals acting as porters. Major Bilal fought the enemy columns for almost three days and nights with his very small force holding a front of 5-6 miles. He not only held the enemy away from Chandpur, but he inflicted serious casualties on him. His troops were separated in twos and threes over this large frontage and were being harassed in the rear by hostile local population. By being continuously on the move conducting raids and readjusting his positions, he fought numerous skirmishes with the enemy as well as the local population, but maintained an intact front and thereby succeeded in delaying the enemy till the night of 7/8th when final evacuation of Chandpur took place. Exhausted, hungry and continuously under enemy attacks, this officer showed determination and gallantry of the highest order. Despite the casualties being suffered by his small band, he fought rear guard action against vastly superior enemy columns over a distance of approximately 40 miles for about 72 hours gaining in valuable time for the evacuation of Chandpur base. But for his personal courage, continuously exposing himself to enemy fire and his daring raids, his small force would have melted, resulting in disaster in that sector. He displayed exemplary courage, determination and the will to fight on against great odds during a withdrawal which taxed the morale of his troops to the utmost but was sustained only by his personal example. 
He, unfortunately, was killed in enemy air attack soon after he had accomplished his mission. I strongly recommend him for a posthumous award of Sitara-i-Jurat.” 

An eyewitness account states: 
“Dear Tughral! I am an eyewitness to Maj Bilal’s shahadat. I was Adjutant 2 Commando Battalion at Dacca. On 13/14 night December 1971, I, with one Platoon, proceeded to Chandpur Ferry in a naval boat to reinforce Bilal's Jangju Company. On 14 December, at first light Indian Air Force attacked and strafed bullets on the gunboat in which Company HQ was located. When Indian Air Force came for a second round, Maj Bilal aimed his SMG at the attacking aircraft and fired. But unfortunately, we both got severely wounded due to bullets and the boat's collapse. From there our men evacuated us to CMH Dacca in a native power-boat. Bilal during evacuation succumbed to wounds and embraced shahadat. I remained in CMH Dacca and from there was evacuated to CMH Agra for subsequent treatment. This is an eyewitness account of my short stay with Bilal’s Jangju company. Regards, Col Zaffar Cheema (Retired). SSG/2 Cdo Bn.” (Received on November 5, 2020)

Obituary report of Col Suleiman SSG published in The News edition of December 19, 2019 stated: During the war, SSG Commando Major Bilal Rana turned to his friend Col Suleiman and said, "Promise me one thing, take this grenade of mine and should the enemy get close, use the grenade but never be captured by them and one last thing, should you have a son, name him Bilal" and with this sentence, they both erupted with uncontrollable laughter. 
Col Suleiman was able to escape from East Pakistan and did not become a prisoner of war. True to his promise, he named his son Bilal and so did another coursemate, General Pervez Musharraf. 

Col Zaffar Cheema says that Maj Bilal is buried in the Army graveyard in Dhaka. He had visited the site in a subsequent visit to Bangladesh to attend the wedding of the daughter of a Bengali friend. The graves of the Pakistani soldiers in East Pakistan bear no markers. It is time that we reclaimed the graves of our fallen soldiers and accord them the respect that they deserve.

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## Raja Porus

PanzerKiel said:


> Brig Tughral Yamin


Read his book "Evolution of Nuclear deterrence in South Asia" 4-5 years back. It was a relatively short yet very precise book. It is a good starter and knocks alot of sense especially related to strategic thinking and its effects on operational doctrines. Does prevent one from raising and launching five six strike formations towards Delhi.

I remember reading the Author's introduction and was very impressed.
He was a G3 of and Inf and one armd bde, liason of an inf bn in Somalia, commanded two infantry battalions and a mech bde. He was also an instructor at the Command & Staff College.Tughral did his war course frim NDU, Staff Colleges in Hamburg, Germany and Quetta, the Infantry Schools in Warminster,
Warwickshire, UK and Quetta, the School of Armour, Nowshehra. He was trained as Class I interpreter in German language from NUML and
specialised in German military language.
Still he retired a Brigadier!! @PanzerKiel you know why?

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## CodeforFood

PanzerKiel said:


> Maj Rana Bilal Ahmed, SJ: A Hero of the 1971 War
> 
> Brig Tughral Yamin
> 
> Maj Bilal belongs to a generation of young men who died for their country fighting for the unity of motherland in East Pakistan. The deck was heavily stacked against them but notwithstanding the odds, the officers and men fought and died courageously in a war far from home. They did not return and lie buried in unmarked graves. May have Allah shower his infinite mercy on their souls.
> 
> I met Maj Bilal when I was a schoolkid, and he was a young captain in the special forces. I think the year should be 1968 or thereabouts. I was eleven years old and he 24. His elder sister was married to my father’s friend Mr. Subah Sadiq (SS for short) Hameed. Mr. Hameed was posted as manager of the State Bank’s Peshawar branch. He had a large house at Fort Road in the Cantonment near the cricket stadium. We children always had a fun time in the large rambling lawn, playing cricket and hide and seek. The Hameed children: Saeed, Gul and Sameena, were the same ages as us (myself and my two younger sisters Sadaf and Humaira).
> 
> I presume Maj Bilal Rana was deployed with special services at either Attock or Cherat at that time. I remember him as a dashing young officer. A few years later he was killed in action in the former East Pakistan in 1971. He was only 27 years old at the time. A grateful nation acknowledged his supreme sacrifice and awarded him the coveted gallantry award of Sitara-i-Jurat (Star of courage).
> 
> I joined 7FF in 1976 and my acquaintance with Maj Bilal renewed. His portrait adorned the anteroom of the officers’ mess. Bilal Masjid in our company lines in Multan was constructed by funds provided by his mother and was a constant reminder that Maj Bilal belonged to our unit. Each rifle company vied for the award i.e., the Bilal banner. The best company proudly displays it in its lines.
> 
> Maj Bilal was born November 12, 1944 to Rana Sher Jang and his wife. His parents lived in Rana Mansion Block 2 Commercial Area, PECHS Karachi. He joined PMA in a regular course on November 23, 1961, twelve days after his seventeenth birthday. He was allotted GC No. 3024. Commissioned as a second lieutenant on April 19, 1964 after one-and-a-half year of training, he was given the Army No PA 6917. The last digit matched the unit he joined – the prestigious 7th battalion of the Frontier Force Regiment. Bilal fought the 1965 War as a lieutenant and was promoted as a captain during the war. A few years later, he joined the SSG. After his basic training in Cherat, he was sent to the U.S. for an advance course.
> 
> When the war of 1971 broke out, Maj Bilal was serving with 2 Commando battalion. As the situation deteriorated, his company was sent to East Pakistan to become part of 3 Commando battalion. On the 25th of March 1971, 3 Commando was tasked to apprehend Sheikh Mujibur Rahman from his Dhan Mandi residence in Dhaka. The operation was fraught with danger, but Maj Bilal and his platoon pulled off the mission with clockwork precision. Sheikh Mujib was whisked away to West Pakistan, he would return to Bangladesh and hailed as its founding father. While Maj Bilal would never return to Pakistan to the bosom of his family.
> 
> The civil war in East Pakistan was actively supported by the Indians. After Pakistan Army had been suitably weakened fighting the Mukti Bahini, Indian army invaded East Pakistan on November 23, 1971. Maj Bilal’s depleted SSG company was employed for the protection of 39 (raised on ad hoc arrangements) Division. His ragtag band included naval ratings and sundry left-over elements were deployed in defending the Chandpur blocking position. He was killed in action on December 14, 1971 in aerial strafing on the naval gunboat that served as his company HQ, on the banks of the River Meghna in Chandpur district. The battlefield citation written by his GOC for the award of an SJ read:
> “On 5th December 1971, when the enemy columns had broken through our defences between Laksham and Comilla and were heading for the Divisional Headquarters and Chandpur base, there were no troops on defensive positions except small detachments on bridges between him and his objectives. At that critical stage approximately half a company of commandos under Major Bilal Ahmed was made available to my Division. This company was given the task of delaying the enemy’s advance consisting of strong outflanking foot columns of Indian Army and Mukti Bahini supported by thousands of locals acting as porters. Major Bilal fought the enemy columns for almost three days and nights with his very small force holding a front of 5-6 miles. He not only held the enemy away from Chandpur, but he inflicted serious casualties on him. His troops were separated in twos and threes over this large frontage and were being harassed in the rear by hostile local population. By being continuously on the move conducting raids and readjusting his positions, he fought numerous skirmishes with the enemy as well as the local population, but maintained an intact front and thereby succeeded in delaying the enemy till the night of 7/8th when final evacuation of Chandpur took place. Exhausted, hungry and continuously under enemy attacks, this officer showed determination and gallantry of the highest order. Despite the casualties being suffered by his small band, he fought rear guard action against vastly superior enemy columns over a distance of approximately 40 miles for about 72 hours gaining in valuable time for the evacuation of Chandpur base. But for his personal courage, continuously exposing himself to enemy fire and his daring raids, his small force would have melted, resulting in disaster in that sector. He displayed exemplary courage, determination and the will to fight on against great odds during a withdrawal which taxed the morale of his troops to the utmost but was sustained only by his personal example.
> He, unfortunately, was killed in enemy air attack soon after he had accomplished his mission. I strongly recommend him for a posthumous award of Sitara-i-Jurat.”
> 
> An eyewitness account states:
> “Dear Tughral! I am an eyewitness to Maj Bilal’s shahadat. I was Adjutant 2 Commando Battalion at Dacca. On 13/14 night December 1971, I, with one Platoon, proceeded to Chandpur Ferry in a naval boat to reinforce Bilal's Jangju Company. On 14 December, at first light Indian Air Force attacked and strafed bullets on the gunboat in which Company HQ was located. When Indian Air Force came for a second round, Maj Bilal aimed his SMG at the attacking aircraft and fired. But unfortunately, we both got severely wounded due to bullets and the boat's collapse. From there our men evacuated us to CMH Dacca in a native power-boat. Bilal during evacuation succumbed to wounds and embraced shahadat. I remained in CMH Dacca and from there was evacuated to CMH Agra for subsequent treatment. This is an eyewitness account of my short stay with Bilal’s Jangju company. Regards, Col Zaffar Cheema (Retired). SSG/2 Cdo Bn.” (Received on November 5, 2020)
> 
> Obituary report of Col Suleiman SSG published in The News edition of December 19, 2019 stated: During the war, SSG Commando Major Bilal Rana turned to his friend Col Suleiman and said, "Promise me one thing, take this grenade of mine and should the enemy get close, use the grenade but never be captured by them and one last thing, should you have a son, name him Bilal" and with this sentence, they both erupted with uncontrollable laughter.
> Col Suleiman was able to escape from East Pakistan and did not become a prisoner of war. True to his promise, he named his son Bilal and so did another coursemate, General Pervez Musharraf.
> 
> Col Zaffar Cheema says that Maj Bilal is buried in the Army graveyard in Dhaka. He had visited the site in a subsequent visit to Bangladesh to attend the wedding of the daughter of a Bengali friend. The graves of the Pakistani soldiers in East Pakistan bear no markers. It is time that we reclaimed the graves of our fallen soldiers and accord them the respect that they deserve.


Beautiful people, beautiful souls. These are the type of people who provide energy and force to Pakistan!

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## blain2

This and many other missions where they have been unsung heroes:









Sepoy wounded during embassy attack shares story | The Express Tribune


Israr, who was injured during an assassination attempt on the ambassador in Kabul, was shot twice




tribune.com.pk

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## FOOLS_NIGHTMARE

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1600066529973837824

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