# The Kargil Conflict



## Indiarox

The 1999 Kargil War: Not a Generals Victory

By Air Marshal Ashok Goel (Retd)	Published : January 2009



New Delhi. The 1999 Kargil War caused the biggest .utter in the Indian subcontinent, bringing India and Pakistan close to a nuclear holocaust. Despite the fact that the last two wars between the two neighbours had been way back, in 1965 and 1971, it happened because the Indians were lax as usual and the Pakistanis in a mischief mode, also as usual.
Much has been written about the event, including by the Chief of Army Staff at that time, Gen V P Malik, as also by the then Home Minister L K Advani. There was an official inquiry by Indias renowned strategic affairs analyst, K Subrahmanyam, but he has pointed out to this writer that he did not go into operational details and accordingly, could not comment on certain weaknesses some top Indian commanders displayed. The mid-level and younger officers and men though fought well, and even though many of them perished, the victory actually belonged to them.
The Pakistani military leadership as well as its Inter Services Intelligence (ISI) have always been indulging in nasty manoeuvers against India. But that they dared to infiltrate troops into India and tried to capture a part of Kashmir yet again was possible because we were negligent, partly because we generally are so by temperament and partly because the government of the day, led by Mr A B Vajpayee, had ordered the forces to be soft on Pakistan because of the positive talks between him and his Pakistani counterpart, Nawaz Sharif towards maintaining peace and building friendship.
While opportunities for peace must be seized by politicians, there was no reason for the armed forces  the Army in particular  to be lax. In fact, the Pakistani move as it happened had been debated in the Indian Army for years and had been taken up as a strong possibility in periodic exercises. Yet, when it was happening, we were blind to it.
In the foreword to Brig Gurmeet Kanwals book, Indian Army Vision 2020, Gen Malik says: The Fact is that even after 60 years of independence, knowledge and experience of defence and military issues is lacking in most of our political leaders and civilian bureaucrats.
But the General has not shared the lapses and neglect of responsibilities of the Army leadership, particularly of the sector commanders, and to an extent, his own. Some of these are by now, well known, including the mindset of the 15 Corps Commander, Lt Gen Krishan Pal, who insisted that there were only a handful of infiltrators  60 to 80  and that none of them was a Pakistani soldier. He committed troops without allowing them adequate weapons and strength, and if facts given by Lt Gen Y M Bammi in a book are taken into account, he punished an officer, Brig Devinder Singh, who wanted better preparations insisting that there were a large number of Pakistani soldiers inside the Indian territory.
The officer had eight battalions under his charge, and by all accounts, he fought very well, leading the troops from the front. Gen Malik himself has been seen and heard praising this officer at various fora. Yet, Brig Devinder Singhs career was cut short to save those who were wrong.
To recall, the biggest players of the Kargil War were:
The Government at the highest echelon of the Political Leadership;
The top rung of the military leadership  The Army Chief, GOC-in-C Northern Command, 15 Corps Cdr , and the 3 Div Cdr;
The intelligence agencies, primarily the Intelligence Bureau (IB) and Research and Analysis Wing (RAW);
The Indian Air Force (IAF) and its exercise of Air Power.
The dedicated and committed soldiers and the middle and junior level officers.
THE ROLE OF THE POLITICAL LEADERSHIP
The NDA government was at its pinnacle in May 1998, having successfully conducted the nuclear test that month and having put India in the list of Nuclear Weapon States (NWS). The aim now was to resolve the Kashmir issue by seeking wellmeaning diplomatic and economic relations with Pakistan.
Mrs Indira Gandhi had also attempted that, after the 1971 Bangladesh Liberation War, by trying to tell the then Pakistani leader Z A Bhutto that only peace between the two neighbours would ensure their long-term economic prosperity and growth. In fact, she went out of the way to ensure a comfortable stay for Bhutto, personally choosing even the tapestry of the room he was to stay in Simla during the 1972 summit between them, and by telling Indian officers that the Pakistani leader must be given the respect due to a visiting head of government or state, and not that of a country which had lost war. She agreed to Bhuttos request to release nearly 96,000 Pakistani POWs, and Bhutto promised to work for peace with India.
Needless to say that he backed out.
Mrs Gandhi did what was right in those circumstances. But the lesson for the Indian leadership was to understand that Pakistan is never to be trusted. Islamabad built a network of nuclear capability and missiles by smuggling and deceit, lying even to Washington which gave it liberal aid as a friend and mentor.
Prime Minister Vajpayee and his deputy, Advani, tried to establish a political dialogue with Pakistan. Coupled with the nuclear tests, a success with Islamabad would give them respect in the history books forever.
Intelligence organizations were told to be easy, and the armed forces stopped looking for periodic information from them. There was the February 1999 Bus Yatra (journey) by Vajpayee to Lahore to meet with his counterpart, Nawaz Sharif. It was a goodwill mission, seemingly wellresponded by Sharif.
But the fact that the then Pakistani Chief of Army Staff, Gen Parvez Musharraf, did not pay due respects to the visiting Indian leader during the visit, should have been an indication of the Pakistani armys intentions; that it had no intention to accommodate the rapprochement that the political leadership in Islamabad perhaps then wanted.
It may be noted that as a Brigadier on assignment with a think tank in London, Musharraf had written in a thesis that Pakistan must capture Kashmir to secure water from the Himalayan rivers for itself. As a Chief of Staff, he would certainly try to realize his thoughts.
It is a well known fact that the Srinagar-Leh axis runs closest to the Line of Control (LOC) in the DrasKargil Sector. Also, the terrain on the Indian side is hostile to defend, whereas the terrain on the Pakistan side is favorable to launch an offensive. Strategically, Pakistan has always intended to block, disrupt or permanently dislocate it.
My first posting after being commissioned into the IAF in 1963 was to Jammu in Squadron 43, flying Dakotas. The main task was to operate to Kargil and Thoise to provide logistic support to the troops deployed in forward areas. I was fortunate to be deputed as the Base Commander of Air Force clement at Kargil from Feb to May 1964, working along with 121 (Ind) Infantry Brigade.
It was an education.
Brig Chopra, an Armoured Corps officer who was the Brigade Commander, always used to say that the Dras-Kargil Sector was the most sensitive because of its close proximity to the LOC as well as the terrain factors.
Much later, during a course in 1980-81 at the Armys prestigious College of Combat at MHOW, now renamed Army War College, this lesson was repeated by none other than the Commandant, Lt Gen K Sunderji.
He became the Chief of Army Staff later, and had a sand-model exercise conducted, visualizing exactly what the Pakistanis did to occupy Kargil. A counteroffensive plan was discussed at the 15 Corps Headquarters. I was privy to that along with Lt Gen B C Nanda, Army Commander Northern Command, Air Marshal M M Singh, AOC-in-C Western Command and some other officers.
That in 1998 and 1999, the top brass in the same sector was oblivious to the risk from the Pakistani Army, is absolutely un-understanable.
RAWS AVIATION RESEARCH CENTRE (ARC)
Till mid-1997, a user could approach ARC only through the RAW HQ for its operational tasks. This used to delay the process by a week. The legendary Billy Bedi, who headed ARC for several years, initiated userfriendly steps, and a required mission could be launched within hours. Analytical reports were delivered ASAP, within hours if required.
Top 3-star officers from the services were invited and informed of the ARCs capabilities in airborne electronic intelligence, and the then Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal A Y Tipnis, commended the ARC.
THE KARGIL SURPRISE
In May 1999, once reports of Pakistani infiltration had come in, Armys Directorate General of Military Intelligence (DGMI) sought Air Reconnaissance Mission in the Dras-Kargil sector.
I personally flew missions beginning May 13 and soon, on May 18, we had pictures of six Pakistani Army MI-17 helicopters parked in the Mushok Valley area on the Indian side. These photographs were shown to the then Defence Minister George Fernandes, who was aghast and observed that this could have happened only after months of planning and preparation.
Gen Malik also praised ARC for the inputs but strangely, till some three weeks after this input, Lt Gen Krishan Pal still seemed to believe that there were only a few infiltrators on the Indian side. He himself said in a TV statement that he revised his opinion only after India lost many lives in the Battle of Tololing (June 13).
Did the Army HQ fail to convey him the confirmation of the Pakistani helicopters, and presence, inside India? Or he just insisted on ignoring reality?
Perhaps, the Army should come out with the truth after an honest introspection.
For record, Gen Malik had told ARC that he had no hesitation in admitting that its inputs enabled the Army to correlate its operational plans and that otherwise the causality figures could have been much higher.
The gap between this statement and Lt Gen Krishanpals observation is glaring, and led to a tragic loss of lives.
THE INDIAN AIR FORCE
IAF does not have combat helicopters for high altitude offensive operations, and on May 25, it was decided to commit aircraft to neutralize the ***************** positions on the Indian side.
Initially, IAF lost two aircraft and one Mi 17 helicopter.
An IAF spokesman pointed out that the air operations in Kargil had taken place in an environment that was totally new in the history of world military aviation. The IAF had to unlearn what had been taught before, as it was operating with a new set of paradigms such as the ballistic trajectory of weapons in high altitude operations.
A well-respected Air Marshal Vinod Patney, Air Officer Commanding in-Chief (AOC-in-C) Western Air Command, conducted the air operations after a short course to his officers in precision bombing.
THE SUBRAHMANYAM COMMITTEE
The Subrahmanyam Committee did not attribute any intelligence failures to RAW or ARC, but highlighted equipment inadequacies like the lack of high resolution, all-weather and sub-meter imaging capability.
Lack of UAVs and better coordination between the security agencies was also mentioned but it acknowledged that the IB Director did convey certain inputs on activities in areas under the Gilgit-based FCNA (Force Commander orthern Areas) of Pakistan to the Prime Minister, the Home Minister, the Cabinet Secretary, the Home Secretary and the Director-General Military Operations (DGMO).
There is apparently a general lack of awareness of the critical importance of, and the need for, assessed intelligence, at all levels. Joint Intelligence Committee (JIC) reports do not receive the attention they deserve at the political and higher bureaucratic levels. One officer in a listening post mentions that a senior bureaucrat asked him about some entertainment programmes only in a span of one year.
It is clear that a Kargil-type situation could have been avoided either by plugging gaps as in Siachin, or by a credible declaratory policy of swiftly punishing wanton and willful violation of the sanctity of the LOC, as the Committee observed.
THE NUCLEAR TANGLE
Kargil was a stupid adventure for Pakistan.
Threats from Islamabad about using nuclear weapons were considered but dismissed as Pakistan would not have been more stupid to invite destructive retaliation.
The Kargil War has also helped strengthen Indias doctrine that while India would not first use nuclear weapons, it would retaliate by inflicting massive destruction.
CONCLUSION
There is much evidence available to suggest that the intelligence agencies, RAW and IB, had in fact provided their political masters and military commanders with ample warning about Pakistani intentions and activities.
In any case, lack of strategic intelligence could have been made up by the observation on the ground through scouts and patrolling. One did not have to get basic inputs about the Pakistani infiltration from shepherds, which as a matter fact, happened. After all, the Pakistani infiltration was spread over a large front.
India deliberately limited its response to the eviction of Pakistani soldiers.
But many of our officers and men died needlessly as we were neither prepared for the war nor ready to absorb the inputs towards efficient and better coordination between the security forces.
The victory indeed belonged to those officers and men who fought, died or survived, but won.

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## Abingdonboy

can anyone help me out I am trying to find the name of a soldier in the Kargil war, I belive a Sikh in the Sikh regt who kille 4 SSG members in taking a point. I believe they engaged in hand to hand fighting.

There is not much info on this man for some reason. 

I am no trying to insult anyone only uncover FACTUAL HISTORY, if this happend then there should be no reason to take offence from the truth (history) and so no reason to complain.

Thanks to anyone for their help.


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## rockstarIN

Abingdonboy said:


> can anyone help me out I am trying to find the name of a soldier in the Kargil war, I belive a Sikh in the Sikh regt who kille 4 SSG members in taking a point. I believe they engaged in hand to hand fighting.
> 
> There is not much info on this man for some reason.
> 
> I am no trying to insult anyone only uncover FACTUAL HISTORY, if this happend then there should be no reason to take offence from the truth (history) and so no reason to complain.
> 
> Thanks to anyone for their help.


 
It was not in Kargil, its in Operation Rajiv, in 1987 - in Siachen Glacier area.

The guy is Bana Singh a Param Vir Chakra Awardee.

Bana Singh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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## boris

SSG was present in kargil but covertly in mujh gear and with AK's in an operation like kargil no SF is stupid enough to be in an war like overt mode of operation it gives away your identities which is the exact opposite for a kargil like operation,SSG has been in covert mode in both kargil and afghanistan during the soviet days.

and i havent heard anyone tell about the sikh story with SSG,they alongwith the normal regts were busy with maskoh,tiger valley,pimple complex,dras and tololing,the indian SF that is 9 para sf were engaging on the hard peaks of zulu 1.MARCOS are said to be involved but what they did remains classified to this day.


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## blackops

boris said:


> SSG was present in kargil but covertly in mujh gear and with AK's in an operation like kargil no SF is stupid enough to be in an war like overt mode of operation it gives away your identities which is the exact opposite for a kargil like operation,SSG has been in covert mode in both kargil and afghanistan during the soviet days.
> 
> and i havent heard anyone tell about the sikh story with SSG,they alongwith the normal regts were busy with maskoh,tiger valley,pimple complex,dras and tololing,the indian SF that is 9 para sf were engaging on the hard peaks of zulu 1.MARCOS are said to be involved but what they did remains classified to this day.



dude not in kargil but in siachen this incident took place why bring kargil in this


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## COLDHEARTED AVIATOR

blackops said:


> dude not in kargil but in siachen this incident took place why bring kargil in this


 
9 PARA took part in Kargil and this decision was lateron criticised as they were used like an Infantry and not as a "special force" which they are.

Secondly SSG were also involved and there is one incident in which the SSG conducted an operation to bring back the body of a Pakistani soldier(Lalak Jan i think) who had successfuly managed to destroy Indian Ammo dump.


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## killeragent

Self-delete/..............................


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## Windjammer

Major sacked, gets sentence for faking Siachen encounters

The Gorkha Rifles officer who staged and filmed encounters hoping to get bravery awards said he would appeal to the Supreme Court.

NEW DELHI, JODHPUR, DHNS/PTI/UNI: 

Major Surinder Singh, a Gorkha Rifles officer, was on Tuesday dismissed from service after an army court martial found him guilty of faking encounters with the enemy on Siachen Glacier and sentenced him to three years rigorous imprisonment. 

The Major had filmed the fake encounters to buttress his claims to bravery awards and obtain favourable mentions by higher formation commanders.

Major Surinder Singh has been found guilty of all charges by the General Court Marshal (GCM) and is cashiered from the Army and sentenced to undergo rigorous imprisonment for three years, Presiding Officer of the seven-member jury Brig A D S Grewal said.

The Army Court, started on September 21 after the 80-day Summary of Evidence (SoE) proceedings, included five colonels and the court martial process began after a court of inquiry recommended disciplinary action against the Major.

The sentence will now be confirmed by the Army Chief as per rules.

On being pronounced guilty, Maj Singh pleaded for leniency, saying he was the lone earning member of his family. His wife and three children aged between 5-8 years had no other source of income, he said.

Major sacked, gets sentence for faking Siachen encounters - Deccan Herald


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## EastWest

Windjammer said:


> Major sacked, gets sentence for faking Siachen encounters
> 
> The Gorkha Rifles officer who staged and filmed encounters hoping to get bravery awards said he would appeal to the Supreme Court.
> 
> NEW DELHI, JODHPUR, DHNS/PTI/UNI:
> 
> Major Surinder Singh, a Gorkha Rifles officer, was on Tuesday dismissed from service after an army court martial found him guilty of faking encounters with the enemy on Siachen Glacier and sentenced him to three years&#8217; rigorous imprisonment.
> 
> The Major had filmed the fake encounters to buttress his claims to bravery awards and obtain favourable mentions by higher formation commanders.
> 
> &#8220;Major Surinder Singh has been found guilty of all charges by the General Court Marshal (GCM) and is cashiered from the Army and sentenced to undergo rigorous imprisonment for three years&#8221;, Presiding Officer of the seven-member jury Brig A D S Grewal said.
> 
> The Army Court, started on September 21 after the 80-day Summary of Evidence (SoE) proceedings, included five colonels and the court martial process began after a court of inquiry recommended disciplinary action against the Major.
> 
> The sentence will now be confirmed by the Army Chief as per rules.
> 
> On being pronounced guilty, Maj Singh pleaded for leniency, saying he was the lone earning member of his family. His wife and three children aged between 5-8 years had no other source of income, he said.
> 
> Major sacked, gets sentence for faking Siachen encounters - Deccan Herald



Ur point being???

what has this article to do with Kargil War?


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## Veeru

EastWest said:


> Ur point being???
> 
> what has this article to do with Kargil War?


 
troll and flame


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## GUNS-N- ROSES

posting on this thread is a sure way to get into hall of shame.

on topic ints been 11 years now. guys lets move on. anyone ready to talk abt peace?

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## EastWest

Peace is good..

But does the other side want it?
Taali ek haath se nahi bajti..

And we should never forget the lessons of Kargil..Never let ur guard down against Pakistan..They will talk about peace and they will also be planning to attack us when we least expect..


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## Kevrai

Mobilee said:


> haha kargli war v hit bharath in d head form kargil haha and u cry hahaha go by more helikcoperts 360 helikopers and pul dem in kargil becoz v cum der in 2011 ears and agan cuntrol antaire bharath hahahaha were is da cowwwwwww hahah


 

in english buddy!!!


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> haha this is from wikipedia
> 
> Bana Singh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


 
My dear, check your link again , there is nothing of such sort written over there, Its a Well Admired thing that you cared to satisfy your egos by editing it while quoting, But at the same time you satisfied non , not even you, but you own Ego...


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> haha this is from wikipedia--
> 
> Bana Singh - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> 
> thats how reliable wiki is--


 


This is the Real Article 


> Bana Singh
> From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> Captain Bana Singh, was born on 6 January 1949 at Kadyal in Jammu and Kashmir. He enrolled in the Indian Army on 6 January 1969 into the 8th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAK LI) Regiment. He was awarded the Param Vir Chakra, the highest wartime gallantry medal in India.
> During the Siachen Conflict of June 1987, the 8th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAKLI), was deployed to the Siachen Glacier area. It was then found that a large number of Pakistani infiltrators had intruded in the Siachen Glacier. The ejection of these infiltrators was considered difficult but necessary and a special task force was constituted for the purpose. Bana Singh was a Naib Subedar then, posted on the Glacier. Naib Subedar Singh volunteered to join this force.
> The Pakistani intrusion had taken place at a height of 6450 metres, one of the highest peaks in the Siachen Glacier area. From this feature the Pakistanis could snipe at Indian army positions since the height gave a clear view of the entire saltoro range and siachen glacier. The Pakistanis called this post 'Quaid post' after their founder Quaid-e-azam Md Ali Jinnah. The enemy post was virtually an impregnable glacier fortress with ice walls, 457 metres high, on either side. Operation Rajiv, named after 2nd Lt Rajiv Pande VrC, was launched to evict the Pakistanis from that post. Naib Subedar Bana Singh led his men through an extremely difficult and hazardous route, climbing a height of 1500 feet in near darkness in a snowstorm. He inspired them by his indomitable courage and leadership. He and his men crawled and closed in on the adversary. Lobbing hand-grenades, charging with a bayonet and moving from trench to trench, he cleared the post of all intruders. All together 6 Pakistani Special Service Group commandos were killed, 3 or 4 of them were bayoneted in hand to hand battle at a height of 21,000 ft.
> Naib Subedar Bana Singh was awarded the Param Vir Chakra, the highest wartime gallantry medal in India, for conspicuous bravery and leadership under most adverse conditions. The peak which he captured was renamed Bana Top in his honour. At the time of the Kargil War, he was the only PVC awardee who was still serving in the Army.

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## Agnostic_Indian

Bana Singh Captain Bana Singh , was born on 6 January 1949 at Kadyal in Jammu and Kashmir. He enrolled in the Indian Army on 6 January 1969 into the 8 th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAK LI) Regiment . He was awarded the Param Vir Chakra, the highest wartime gallantry medal in India . During the Siachen Conflict of June 1987, the 8 th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAKLI ), was deployed to the Siachen Glacier area. It was then found that a large number of Pakistani infiltrators had intruded in the Siachen Glacier . The ejection of these infiltrators was considered difficult but necessary and a special task force was constituted for the purpose. Bana Singh was a Naib Subedar then , posted on the Glacier . Naib Subedar Singh volunteered to join this force . The Pakistani intrusion had taken place at a height of 6450 metres , one of the highest peaks in the Siachen Glacier area . From this feature the Pakistanis could snipe at Indian army positions since the height gave a clear view of the entire saltoro range and siachen glacier . The Pakistanis called this post ' Quaid post ' after their founder Quaid -e - azam Md Ali Jinnah . The enemy post was virtually an impregnable glacier fortress with ice walls , 457 metres high, on either side . Operation Rajiv , named after 2 nd Lt Rajiv Pande VrC, was launched to evict the Pakistanis from that post . Naib Subedar Bana Singh led his men through an extremely difficult and hazardous route , climbing a height of 1500 feet in near darkness in a snowstorm . He inspired them by his indomitable courage and leadership . He and his men crawled and closed in on the adversary. Lobbing hand- grenades , charging with a bayonet and moving from trench to trench, he cleared the post of all intruders . All together 6 Pakistani Special Service Group commandos were killed , 3 or 4 of them were bayoneted in hand to hand battle at a height of 21 ,000 ft . Naib Subedar Bana Singh was awarded the Param Vir Chakra , the highest wartime gallantry medal in India , for conspicuous bravery and leadership under most adverse conditions. The peak which he captured was renamed Bana Top in his honour . At the time of the Kargil War, he was the only PVC awardee who was still serving in the Army.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bana_Singh?wasRedirected=true


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## blackops

I dont know why my post was deleted when i wrote the same about bana singh can any one explain it & i was the first to write it about him my post was deleted as pointless


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> My dear, check your link again , there is nothing of such sort written over there, Its a Well Admired thing that you cared to satisfy your egos by editing it while quoting, But at the same time you satisfied non , not even you, but you own Ego...


 
Do not shoot the messenger-- i just posted-- what i read-- on the link your guy posted--
About my Ego- i have plenty of other useful things to do to satisfy my ego--


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> This is the Real Article and Some Son of a Female Dog edited the original article , , Sorry to hurt the sentiments of who edited it, But I am sure he is not one among you, so curse the editor....


 
with out any sources-- the credibility is nil--


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> Do not shoot the messenger-- i just posted-- what i read-- on the link your guy posted--
> About my Ego- i have plenty of other useful things to do to satisfy my ego--


 
Ok My apologies if You havent edited the WikiPedia, But some one has, Do you know who he is??? An Insult to a Soldier and I take it as Mine....


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> with out any sources-- the credibility is nil--


 
Some Credibilities cannot be Proven, You need to Go out , take Arms and Feel it, In a Comfort Zone, Credibility is Zero


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## JonAsad

double post


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> Ok My apologies if You havent edited the WikiPedia, But some Son of a ___, has, Do you know who he is??? An Insult to a Soldier and I take it as Mine....


 
If i have to edit some thing-- i will make sure it is- the most insulting- disgusting-- embarrassing- post- for the target audience--
So when you find some thing like that-- then you can imagine me has edited it


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> If i have to edit some thing-- i will make sure it is- the most insulting- disgusting-- embarrassing- post- for the target audience--
> So when you find some thing like that-- then you can imagine me has edited it


 
Well, You are a Dangerous Young man, Enough to give me a Heart Attack....  ...

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## Bratva

Lalak Jan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

On 15 September 1999, the commanding officer of 12th NLI sent two Special Service Group Comando groups to Tiger Hills to recover the body of Lalak Jan. The two forces were designated 'Ababeel' and 'Uqaab'(Eagle). Ababeel provided the fire cover while Uqaab went into the destroyed enemy bunker to retrieve the body of Lalak Jan. When his body was found, Havaldar Lalak Jan had his AK-47 firmly clinched to his chest.


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> Some Credibilities cannot be Proven, You need to Go out , take Arms and Feel it, In a Comfort Zone, Credibility is Zero


 
Am not asking for the soldier-- the credibility of this character Bana Singh-- it could well be a fairy tale-- with out -sources- without any disrespect Sir--


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> Am not asking for the soldier-- the credibility of this character Bana Singh-- it could well be a fairy tale-- with out -sources- without any disrespect Sir--


 






This Man You see above is Naik Subedar Bana Singh , Any more proof of his existence??

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## Bratva

The government of Pakistan awarded Captain Karnal Sher Khan with Nishan-e-Haider, the country's highest gallantry award. Captain Karnal Sher Khan was posthumously awarded Pakistan's highest gallantry award, the Nishan-e-Haider, for his actions during the Kargil Conflict with India in 1999, *on the recommendation of the Indian Army*


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## JonAsad

mafiya said:


> Lalak Jan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> On 15 September 1999, the commanding officer of 12th NLI sent two Special Service Group Comando groups to Tiger Hills to recover the body of Lalak Jan. The two forces were designated 'Ababeel' and 'Uqaab'(Eagle). Ababeel provided the fire cover while Uqaab went into the destroyed enemy bunker to retrieve the body of Lalak Jan. When his body was found, Havaldar Lalak Jan had his AK-47 firmly clinched to his chest.



Jesus christ--





You have given them the bait-- Now some one is going to edit this aswell-- better save a copy of it-- in advance-


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> This Man You see above is Naik Subedar Bana Singh , Any more proof of his existence??


 
He exist-- i do not deny that-- i am talking about the story thats been associated with him--


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> Jesus christ--
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have given them the bait-- Now some one is going to edit this aswell-- better save a copy of it-- in advance-


 
The person who would Edit a Soldiers Profile would be the Biggest Idiot the World Would Ever See, Never disgrace those who Fought for theirs, They Might be Your Enemy, But after they die, they are heroes of there Nations....

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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> He exist-- i do not deny that-- i am talking about the story thats been associated with him--


 
Iam sorry, no international sources have written about him, so I can help you out with an Indian one, about the credibility of the source, dont ask me.. If you believe me, Fine and Good, If you dont , you may read the below link aswel...

» Saluting our Heroes: Nb Subedar Bana Singh, PVC . || Satyameva Jayate ||


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## blackops

bana singh


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## JonAsad

I remember we used to acknowledge brave people on both sides-- and i remember some Indian major- or general- acknowledging the bravery of Col. Sher Khan-- the point i am trying to make is-- if this supposedly story is true and Bana Singh really killed those- SSG commandos hand in hand to hand fighting- then there must be some one from our side-- acknowledging his bravery-- apparently SSG or for that matter any Commando are trained to not die like that-- by the hand of a single regular soldier-- 1 can be believable-- 4-5 just unbelievable-- impossible--


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## blackops

Captain Bana Singh is one of the three living recipients of the Param 
Vir Chakra, the highest Indian bravery Award. He earned his award in 
*interview of bana singh *
capturing the most strategic post on the Saltoro range near the 
Siachen glacier in Ladakh. 
Claude: Tell us about your origin, where are you born, when did you 
join the Army? 
BS: I am born in 1949 in Kadyal district of Jammu province. My father 
was farmer though many of my uncles had joined the Army. My father 
used to tell me that Army&#8217;s life is a very prestigious. He also wanted 
me to join that Army because a farmer&#8217;s life is very harsh. I remember 
when I was a kid, I used to be so happy each time I saw off-duty Army 
officers or jawans visited our village. 
C: What was your motivation to join the Army? 
BS: I decided that I wanted to do something for my country. That is 
why I joined the Army. 
C: Why did you join the Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAK LI)? 
BS: Because it was the State force of Jammu and Kashmir, so being a 
Kashmiri I naturally joined the J&K forces. 
C: When were you posted first in Siachen glacier? BS: On April 20 1987 
C: Did you practice mountain climbing before being posted in Siachen 
at such a high altitude? 
BS: I was trained at the High Altitude Warfare School in Gulmarg (in 
Kashmir) and also at another school at Sonamarg. My battalion was 
trained there. Though the altitude is not as high as in the Siachen 
area, we learnt mountain warfare, how to climb, how to fight in the 
snows, how to move on a glacier. 
When I was in Gulmarg, there were three battalions: the 10 Dogras, 
the 8 JAK LI and the 5 Guard. The mountain training is imparted to 
formations from all over India, but more particularly to this Mountain 
Brigade which was specially established by the Government of India to 
look after the Siachen glacier. It is not only an opportunity for the 
battalions to be trained, but also to acclimatize at relative high 
altitude. 
Then we moved to the base camp of the glacier which is located at 
18,000 feet. It takes 7 days to be fully acclimatized, during this period 
we move to the base camp for the day and come back the next day. 
This is No 1 camp. 
C: When you got posted on the Siachen in April 1987, was the Quaid 
Post already occupied by the Pakistanis? 
BS: Yes, they had occupied it earlier. Around that time, the Pakistanis 
started firing on our patrols and helicopters from the post. My Commanding Officer (CO) decided with the Brigade Commander to 
send a patrol to find out the position of the Pakistanis and how many 
of them were manning the Post. 
On May 29, a patrol of 8 JAK LI was sent for a reconnaissance of the 
possible approaches to the Quaid Post. The patrol leader was Lt. Rajiv 
Pande. He had 10 men with him. Unfortunately, they were sighted by 
the Pakistanis commandos. Most of them, including Rajiv Pande were 
killed. 
C: Why this post was called the &#8216;Quaid&#8217; Post 
BS: This is the name of Mohamed Ali Jinnah, the father of Pakistan. 
This is the most important and highest post in the area. From the top 
you can see 80 km around. You can see the entire Saltoro range, all 
the other posts like the Amar and Sonam Posts which can only be 
supplied by choppers. If you control this post, you can prevent the 
supply of these posts located on the Saltoro. That is why it had such 
an importance for Pakistan (and why they call it after Jinnah). 
My CO had therefore to prepare a secret plan to recapture the post 
otherwise we would not be able to hold the other posts in the area. 
C: How did the Pakistanis capture the Post? 
BS: I do not know. It must have captured long ago. The Pakistanis 
started occupying the glacier in 1984. When I arrived in 1987, it was 
already occupied. 
C: How many people were killed on May 29? BS: Lt Pande, a JCO and 8 jawans. Total 10 people [three survived]. 
C: What was then decided by your CO and the Army HQ in Delhi? 
BS: [Before Lt Pande&#8217;s reconnaissance patrol], a very secret operation 
had been planned. It could not be disclosed to anybody. We had to 
find the different accesses and the one which would easier to get to 
the Post. The first patrol was sent for this purpose. With this 
information, my CO and the Army Commander were able to decide the 
next step. 
C: When was the second patrol was sent? 
BS: It was not a patrol. It was troops for fighting purpose, to capture 
the Post. It was in June. 
C: How was the approach route to reach the Post at 21,000? 
BS: There was a 90° climb on a distance of 1,500 km and ice walls. Lt 
Pande had managed to fix ropes, but due to heavy snow fall, the rope 
had got completely lost when the troops tried to reach the Post in 
June. Ropes had to be fixed again. 
In the meantime, to divert the attention of the Pakistanis, Indian 
troops had been firing at the Post. There was no artillery fire, only 
machine guns. It is only when the attack started that artillery was 
used from the base camp. 
C: Was artillery not dangerous for the climbing troops?


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## blackops

*continued interview of bana singh*
BS: It was at the beginning. We were climbing from the other side 
when the Post was fired at. 
C: Tell us now about your operation, it was the third attempt? 
BS: A total of 62 people participated to the final operation. Two 
officers, 3 JCO and 57 jawans were selected. The operation was 
conducted in three phases on June 23, June 25 and June 26, 1987. 
A first platoon was sent under Major Varinder Singh on 23
rd
but 
unfortunately they had to come back. Two soldiers were killed. 
The second platoon led by Subedar Harnam Singh with 10 jawans 
made an attempt on June 25. At that time, there was no problem with 
the rope, but due to some communication gap with us, the mission 
had to be aborted. 
The next day, on 26
th
, I started early and was told that we will try 
another attack and capture the Post from the enemy today itself. A 
message was passed from the Major General who was the Task Force 
Commander and we got the green light. 
C: All the 62 were volunteers? 
BS: We had been selected by our CO. 
C: Could you refuse to go? 
BS: Yes, of course! But we all said that we were ready. 
C: Tell us now about your assault? What did you feel? BS: It is at day time, but because of the snow fall, you could not say if 
it was the day or the night. It was snowing so heavily. 
C: The Pakistanis Commandos couldn&#8217;t see you? 
BS: No, but they must be have knowing that something was going on 
because the firing from the base camp (to divert their attention). 
We had been trained for such a fight and how to lob grenades. At that 
time, some Pakistanis tried to fight, but unfortunately he is injured and 
he 
My Commander had told us before that we should try to get them 
alive, but I told him: &#8220;Sir, it is not possible&#8221;. There was a single bunker 
on the top. I threw a grenade inside and closed the door. At the end, a 
total of six Pakistanis were killed. We brought back their bodies which 
were later handed over to the Pakistanis authorities during a flag 
meeting in Kargil. 
C: Some sources say that there were 17 persons manning the Post. 
BS: Some must have escaped towards the Pakistani side, perhaps over 
the cliff. But only six were killed. I think, we bayoneted three or four 
persons, I don&#8217;t remember now. 
When you are fighting for your life, you can not say


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> I remember we used to acknowledge brave people on both sides-- and i remember some Indian major- or general- acknowledging the bravery of Col. Sher Khan-- the point i am trying to make is-- if this supposedly story is true and Bana Singh really killed those- SSG commandos hand in hand to hand fighting- then there must be some one from our side-- acknowledging his bravery-- apparently SSG or for that matter any Commando is not trained to die like that-- by the hand of a regular soldier-- 1 can be believabled-- 4-5 just unbelievable-- impossible--


 
Nothing is Impossible Mate, Acknowledging others Bravery is a Quality of a true Soldier, India Showed it, And You cannot Question why Pakistan hasnt favored a Soldier from our side for Param Veer Chakra.... You cannot keep that as an Excuse to what this Man Has done for his Country....


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## blackops

*last part of interview *
C: How long lasted the operation? 
BS: We left by noon. The entire operation was completed by 5 pm., so 
5 hours (including the climb). A: Were you cold or tired? 
BS: In these conditions, when you face death, you do not feel cold, 
you don&#8217;t feel fear. You don&#8217;t think that you are going to die or fail. 
C: Did you think of your wife or your dear ones? 
BS: No, never. But I prayed the Gurus before and after the operation. 
After having been successful in my task, I considered myself as a lucky 
man. 
I must tell you, a strange thing happened one day before the assault. 
As I was feeling depressed, I heard the voice of Guru Gobind Singh 
who said: &#8220;I was only testing you&#8221;. Then my depression disappeared. 
It is the first (and last) time that I had such an experience. 
C: When the silence fell back on the Post, what happened? 
BS: All the officers started congratulate me, to pat me: &#8220;You have 
done very well, Bana, Congratulations&#8221;. All this through wireless. 
C: Three months later there was a major Pakistani attack on the 
Bilafond; they had apparently been very upset to lose the Jinnah Post. 
Did you participate to the defense of Bilafond? 
BS: Yes, it was in September. I did not participate because I was not 
posted in this area. But about 1000 Pakistani men must have died. 
General Musharraf was then the Brigade Commander [of the Special 
Security Group]. He had himself planned the operation. C: In one way, he is a looser. He lost the Jinnah Post, then in 
September on the Bilafond, then again in 1998 in Kargil. Do you think 
that there is a link between these three events? 
BS: No, but Musharraf was very upset when I captured the Post. 
C: There are rumours that an agreement will be signed between India 
and Pakistan on the Siachen and that the glacier and the Saltoro range 
will be demilitarized. What are comments? 
BS: I feel that it is not good, but I do not want to comment further 
because in the past my words have been distorted. But the point is 
that so many people died for this glacier, it would not be good to give 
it to Pakistan. I have told this so many times to the media persons. 
Politicians do not know the value of the lives of the jawans. They know 
only how to maraud the money. 
If they knew what has happened to the glacier, if they knew 
everything, 
C: If tomorrow India withdraws, the Pakistanis make take the post 
again and call it again Jinnah Post. 
BS: Everyone knows that in Kargil it was the decision of Musharraf and 
the military to start the conflict, but he says that it was Nawaz Shariff 
and the politicians who gave the order. Everyone knows that it is a lie. 
Tomorrow, if India withdraw, the Pakistanis will take the Siachen, 
Pakistan will take it over, because they will always tell lies [to the 
Indian Government]. But please don&#8217;t quote me. Sometimes I received threat from the Pakistani side. Since I am 
retired, I attend some functions, but I still need permission from the 
Army HQ. Unless, I get the permission, I can not go and attend official 
functions. I have two PSOs protecting me. 
C: But you are stronger than your own PSOs. 
BS: Yes and I am not worried about my life (laughing) 
C: I understand that you had a good offer from the Punjab 
Government? 
BS: The Punjab Government has a deep respect for the Indian Army. 
They have offered me Rs 25 lakhs and a monthly allowance of Rs 
15,000 and a 25 acre plot if I accept to move to Punjab. But I refused. 
C: Why? 
BS: Because I consider myself a State Subject of Jammu and Kashmir. 
My own State gives me Rs 160/month only as an allowance for having 
won the Param Vir Chakra, the highest bravery award. It is the way we 
are treated in Jammu and Kashmir.


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## JonAsad

IndianArmy said:


> Nothing is Impossible Mate, Acknowledging others Bravery is a Quality of a true Soldier, India Showed it, And You cannot Question why Pakistan hasnt favored a Soldier from our side for Param Veer Chakra.... You cannot keep that as an Excuse to what this Man Has done for his Country....


 
Well i keep that as a excuse-- but surely i will doubt it-- the reason i being skeptical-- i have read the Indian army kargil scandals-- on false imaginary encounters-- and soldiers getting medals for it-- a dead soldier given gallantry medal-- and latter he was found alive and well-- i have my doubts-- Sir


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## blackops

there are many more articles about him 
» Saluting our Heroes: Nb Subedar Bana Singh, PVC . || Satyameva Jayate ||
http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Bana_Singh_P.V.C.


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## IndianArmy

Glorious Resolve said:


> Well i keep that as a excuse-- but surely i can doubt it-- the reason i being skeptical-- i have read the Indian army scandals-- on false imaginary encounters-- and getting medals for it-- a dead soldier given gallantry-- and latter he was found alive and well-- i have my doubts-- Sir


 
Let me tell you this , SSG were Good , But Your Commandants were not good Enough to Command them, SSG's Came Deep inside Indian Territory Un detected, But they were made to Do what they were not and could not do, that is hold posts and defensive positions which is where they were Made to suffer heavy losses, If they were used for Sabotage missions, Well Who knows the History might have Changed over the sands of Time.... So I haveno proof to Justify the Claim of that mans Honor, But I tried my best in explaining you, I cannot explain you any more son, Past is never worth debating, We might conclude on mutual terms, But the History remains the same...

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## SR 71 Blackbird

SSGs were meant to be used as Shock troops.Para SF were used mainly for clearance operations.Both of the SF's are well trained but Para won in the end.


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## desioptimist

Glorious Resolve said:


> Well i keep that as a excuse-- but surely i will doubt it-- the reason i being skeptical-- i have read the Indian army kargil scandals-- on false imaginary encounters-- and soldiers getting medals for it-- a dead soldier given gallantry medal-- and latter he was found alive and well-- i have my doubts-- Sir


 I agree, your scepticism is justifiable.


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## IND151

Bana Singh
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
*Captain Bana Singh, was born on 6 January 1949 at Kadyal in Jammu and Kashmir.* He enrolled in the Indian Army on 6 January 1969 into the 8th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAK LI) Regiment. He was awarded the Param Vir Chakra, the highest wartime gallantry medal in India.
During the Siachen Conflict of June 1987, the 8th Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (JAKLI), was deployed to the Siachen Glacier area.* It was then found that a large number of Pakistani infiltrators had intruded in the Siachen Glacier.* The ejection of these infiltrators was considered difficult but necessary and a special task force was constituted for the purpose. Bana Singh was a Naib Subedar then, posted on the Glacier. Naib Subedar Singh volunteered to join this force.
*The Pakistani intrusion had taken place at a height of 6450 metres, one of the highest peaks in the Siachen Glacier area.* *From this feature the Pakistanis could snipe at Indian army positions since the height gave a clear view of the entire saltoro range and siachen glacier. *The Pakistanis called this post 'Quaid post' after their founder Quaid-e-azam Md Ali Jinnah. *The enemy post was virtually an impregnable glacier fortress with ice walls, 457 metres high, on either side.* Operation Rajiv, named after 2nd Lt Rajiv Pande VrC, was launched to evict the Pakistanis from that post.* Naib Subedar Bana Singh led his men through an extremely difficult and hazardous route, climbing a height of 1500 feet in near darkness in a snowstorm*. He inspired them by his indomitable courage and leadership. He and his men crawled and closed in on the adversary. Lobbing hand-grenades, charging with a bayonet and moving from trench to trench, he cleared the post of all intruders. *All together 6 Pakistani Special Service Group commandos were killed, 3 or 4 of them were bayoneted in hand to hand battle at a height of 21,000 ft.
Naib Subedar Bana Singh was awarded the Param Vir Chakra, the highest wartime gallantry medal in India, for conspicuous bravery and leadership under most adverse conditions. **The peak which he captured was renamed Bana Top in his honour.* At the time of the Kargil War, he was the only PVC awardee who was still serving in the Army.


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## Joe Shearer

Glorious Resolve said:


> I remember we used to acknowledge brave people on both sides-- and i remember some Indian major- or general- acknowledging the bravery of Col. Sher Khan-- the point i am trying to make is-- if this supposedly story is true and Bana Singh really killed those- SSG commandos hand in hand to hand fighting- then there must be some one from our side-- acknowledging his bravery-- apparently SSG or for that matter any Commando are trained to not die like that-- by the hand of a single regular soldier-- 1 can be believable-- 4-5 just unbelievable-- impossible--



No doubt you mean well. However, can you name a single instance when the Pakistan Army has recommended an Indian Army soldier or officer for gallantry? Not in the literature, but organisation to organisation: we are not talking about the effusive praise for Arun Khetrapal from the best and most reliable PA sources, but from the PA to the IA. 

There are nearly a dozen instances of it happening the other way around. Sher Khan and Lalak Jan were the two examples from Kargil.

Check it out for yourself.

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## Abingdonboy

mafiya said:


> The government of Pakistan awarded Captain Karnal Sher Khan with Nishan-e-Haider, the country's highest gallantry award. Captain Karnal Sher Khan was posthumously awarded Pakistan's highest gallantry award, the Nishan-e-Haider, for his actions during the Kargil Conflict with India in 1999, *on the recommendation of the Indian Army*


 
Source,source, source, that's all you guys say but then you throw your stories out without one. I think we can ALL agree (hopefully) that there are brave men in ALL armies, I asked the original question, if your minds can go that far back, just to find out about ONE brave INDIAN soldier, and now look at it some Pakistani members have started bringing their war heros into the thread, Indian members are getting all worked up. There is no need we have solved the mystery Of Bhana Singh, a great man. End of story. 

And I'm sorry but I would have let this go but since you've emboldened it to make it stand out (*



on the recommendation of the Indian Army

Click to expand...

*) surely this just shows the integrity and honour of the Indian army as opposed to:



> Aftermath
> [edit] India
> Indian PM A.B.Vajpayee flashes the V sign after the Parliamentary elections in which his coalition emerged the victors. His handling of the Kargil crisis is believed to have played a big part in garnering the votes.
> 
> From the end of the war until February 2000, the Indian stock market rose by over 30%. The next Indian national budget included major increases in military spending.
> 
> There was a surge in patriotism, with many celebrities expressing their support for the Kargil cause.[86] Indians were angered by media reports of the death of pilot Ajay Ahuja, especially after Indian authorities reported that Ahuja had been *murdered and his body mutilated by Pakistani troops.* The war had produced higher than expected fatalities for the Indian military, with a sizeable percentage of them including newly commissioned officers. One month after conclusion of the Kargil war, the Atlantique Incident - where a Pakistan Navy plane was shot down by India - briefly reignited fears of a conflict between the two countries.


Kargil War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now I don't want this to be offensive, I'm sure that this was only a small number of soldiers and an isolated incident, but since you highlighted that I thought I would highlight something else for you.

Oh and another thing this award was it before or after the Pakistani side refused to accept the bodies of its fallen men?


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## kartika

happy kargil vijay divas,on 26th july 2011.
salute to the martyrs.

LieutenantManoj Kumar Pandey
Grenadier Yogendra Singh Yadav
Captain Anuj Nayyar
Captain Amol Kalia
Captain Aditya Mishra
[[Captain Haneefuddin
[[Captain Jerry Premrajma
[[Captain Jintu Gogoi
[[Captain L Clifford Nongrum
Captain P.V.Vikram
Captain Vikram Batra
Deputy Commander Sukhbir Singh Yadav
Driver-Soldier Gopinath Moharana
Flight Engineer Raj Kishore Sahoo
Flight Lieutanant S Muhilan
Grenadiar Amardeep
Grenadiar Bajinder Singh
Grenadiar Mohan Katha
Grenadiar Munish Kumar
Grenadiar Raj Kumar
Havaldar Abdul Karim
Havaldar Beejay Singh
Havaldar Daler Singh Bahu
Havaldar Jai Prakash Singh
Havaldar Khazan Singh
Havaldar Padam Singh Dhama
Havaldar Ram Kumar
Havaldar Sarwan Singh Se
ngar Havaldar Surendra Singh
Havaldar Sultan Singh Narwari
s Havaldar Tan Bahadur Chhetri
Havaldar Tsweang Rigzin
Havaldar Yashvir Singh
Jawan Arvind Kumar Pandey
Lance Havaldar Ramkumar
Lance Havaldar Samandar Singh Hooda
Lance Naik Ahmed Ali
Lance Naik Balwan Singh
Lance Naik Bijender Singh
Lance Naik Eknath Khairnar
Lance Naik Gurmail Singh
Lance Naik Hera Singh
Lance Naik Keshan Singh
Lance Naik Madan Singh
Lance Naik Manas Ranjan Sahu
Lance Naik Om Prakash
Lance Naik Rakesh Chand
Lance Naik Ram Kumar Pradhan
Lance Naik Surianam Singh
Lance Naik Shankar Shinde
Lance Naik T.S.Jaswant Singh
Lieutanant Haneef Uddin
Lieutanant Neikezhakou Kengurusie
Lieutanant Sourav Kalia
Lieutanant Vijayant Thapar
Lieutanant Col R.Vishwanathan
Major Ajay Singh Jasrotia
Major Kamlesh Prasad
Major Padmapani Acharya
Major Parmanand
Major Rajesh S. Adhikari
Major Vivek Gupta
Naik Anand singh
Naik Bharat Singh
Naik Birender Singh Lamba
Naik Buta Singh
Naik Chaman Singh
Naik Dharam Singh
Naik Ganesh Prasad Yadav
Naik Guardian Mekh Bahadur Gurung
Naik Jagat Singh
Naik Kasmir Singh
Naik Krishan Pal
Naik Mangat Singh
Naik Narayana Rao Desai
Naik Nirmal Singh
Naik R. Kamaraj
Naik Raj Kumar Punia
Naik Rakesh Chand
Naik Ram Swarup
Naik Sachidananda Malik
Naik Samunder Singh
Naik Shatrughan Singh
Naik Shiv Vasayya
Naik Surendra Singh
Naik Surendra Pal
Naik Surjeet Singh
Naik Subedar Lal Chand
Naik Vikram Singh
Naik Yoginder Singh
Rifleman Ansuya Prasad Dhayani
Rifleman Bachan Singh
Rifleman Dabal Singh
Rifleman Dilwar Singh
Rifleman Jaideep Singh
Rifleman Kuldeep Singh
Rifleman Linkon Pradhan
Rifleman Mohammed Aslam
Rifleman Mohammed Farid
Rifleman Rattan Chand
Rifleman Shaukat Hussain Kalgam
Rifleman Sunil Jungt Mahat
Rifleman Varinder Lal
Rifleman Vikram Singh
Rifleman Guardian Johar Singh
Rifleman Guardian Sarvan Kumar
Sergeant PVNR Prasad
Sergeant Raj Kishore Sahu
Sepoy Ajmer Singh
Sepoy Amardeep Singh
Sepoy Anil Kumar
Sepoy Arjun Ram
Sepoy Arvind Kumar Pandey
Sepoy Bajinder Singh
Sepoy Bhanwar Lal Bagaria
Sepoy Bhikaram
Sepoy Chara Nicholas
Sepoy Dharambir Singh
Sepoy Dineshkumar Vaghela
Sepoy Gangching Konyak
Sepoy Gazpal Singh
Sepoy Gopinath Mohrana
Sepoy Harendragiri Goswami
Sepoy Jugal Kishore
Sepoy Har Prasad
Sepoy Karan Singh
Sepoy Keolanand Dwivedi
Sepoy Kewal Anand
Sepoy Khem Raj
Sepoy Krishan Kumar
Sepoy Moola Ram
Sepoy Naresh Singh
Sepoy Pramod Kumar
Sepoy Rajinder
Sepoy Rajvir Singh
Sepoy Raswinder Singh
Sepoy Satvir Singh
Sepoy Satnam Singh
Sepoy Senthil
Sepoy Shaikh Mastan Wali
Sepoy Sheesh Ram
Sepoy Shiv Shankar Prasad Gupta
Sepoy Sukhwinder Singh
Sepoy Suresh Chhetri
Sepoy Suresh Kumar
Sepoy Varinder Kumar
Sepoy Vijaypal Singh
Signalman Rajan Sahu
Signalman Vinod Kumar
Subedar Bhanwar Lal
Subedar Harpaul Singh
Subedar Lal Singh
Subedar K. Medappa
Subedar Randhir Singh
Subedar Sumer Singh Rathore
Squadron Leader Ajay Ahuja
Squadron Leader Rajiv Pundir
Squadron Leader Lal Singh
Squadron Leader Ojha
Zrfn Man Singh
Kaushal Yadav

*vande matharam!*







salute to the lives lost from both sides!
may the souls of the real heroes rest.in.peace.










p.s:this old thread has been re-alived as per the instruction of the moderatos.please don't troll.

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## Tiki Tam Tam

Abindonboy.

The source is here



> Captain Karnal Sher Khan shaheed :
> 
> Karnal Sher Khan (1970&#8211;1999) (Urdu: &#1705;&#1585;&#1606;&#1575;&#1604; &#1588;&#1740;&#1585; &#1582;&#1575;&#1606 was a Pakistani Army officer and one of only 10 recipients of Pakistan's highest gallantry award, the Nishan-e-Haider. He was a Captain in the 12 Northern Light Infantry (NLI) and, previously in 27 Sindh Regiment of the Pakistan........
> 
> The government of Pakistan awarded Captain Karnal Sher Khan with Nishan-e-Haider, the country's highest gallantry award. Captain Karnal Sher Khan was posthumously awarded Pakistan's highest gallantry award, the Nishan-e-Haider, for his actions during the Kargil Conflict with India in 1999, on the recommendation of the Indian Army.
> Captain Karnal Sher Khan shaheed : colonel sher khan shaheed ~ PUKHTOONS






> The Award and last tour of duty
> 
> Captain Karnal Sher was posthumously awarded the Nishan-e-Haider for his daring actions and services to his country during the Kargil Conflict with India in 1999, on the recommendation of the Indian Army. Indian army shelled across the line of control which summoned response from regular Pakistan army units thus pitching Karnal Sher in action.
> Karnal Sher Khan | The Pathans



Google and it is full of such information.


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## Tiki Tam Tam

In the Indian Army, we respect courage and valour even of our enemies.

Not only did we recognise the bravery of Capt Kernel Sher Khan in the Kargil War, we also recognised in 1971 the Colonel's action as below:



> Colonel Mohammed Akram Raja's bravery, who was awarded Hilal-i-Jurat by the Pakistan Government on the basis of a citation written by Lieutenant Colonel, Ved Airy, who was Commanding Officer, 3 Grenadiers, Indian Army. The Pakistani Colonel lead the counter attack of his battalion and was killed!
> Battle of Basantar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia





> It was probably the first time in the history of wars, that an enemy recommended a soldier for an award. Colonel Mohammed Akram Raja was awarded Hilal-i-Jurat by the Pakistan Government on the basis of a citation written by Lieutenant Colonel, Ved Airy, who was Commanding Officer, 3Grenediars, Indian Army
> Battle of Basantar Summary | BookRags.com

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## Avishek

We are proud of our braveheart army men


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## Black Widow

Avishek said:


> We are proud of our braveheart army men


 
Yes we are proud of it, But in my view It was a useless/Unnecessary war waged on us.


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## kartika

Black Widow said:


> Yes we are proud of it, But in my view It was a useless/Unnecessary war waged on us.


 
to fighback was neccessary.


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## kartika

we should also remeber the loses from our air force too.
we lost one mi-8 helicopter (shot down by stinger sam) in which entire four member crew was dead,
one mig-27 (lost due to engine failure;pilot taken PoW),and a mig 21 which went in search of the mig-27,without waiting to be equiped with weapons or counter measures.it was shot down by stinger sam.the pilot safely ejected out but was killed by pakistani troops .
squadron leader ajay ahuja,pilot of the mig-21


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## kartika

*Kambampati Nachiketa*






he was the pilot of the downed mig-27 which went down due to engine flame out.he ejected safely and managed to evade pak troops for 3 hours but was finally caught by pak patrol troops.he spend about 1 week as a PoW.

Nachiketa is currently a Wing Commander and flies Illyushin-78 mid air refuller transport aircraft with No.78 Squadron, Indian Air Force stationed at Agra. He was transferred to Transports due to the injuries he sustained during para-landing and the physical hardships during captivity.


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## LiberalAtheist

Manoj Pandey







Lieutenant Manoj Kumar Panday took part in a series of boldly led attacks during &#8216;operation Vijay; forcing back the intruders with heavy losses in Batalik including the capture of Jabbar Top. On the night of 2/3 July 1999 during the advance to Khalubar as his platoon approached its final objective, it came under heavy and intense enemy fire from the surrounding heights. Lieutenant Pandey was tasked to clear the interfering enemy positions to prevent his battalion from getting day lighted, being in a vulnerable position. He quickly moved his platoon to an advantageous position under intense enemy fire, sent one section to clear the enemy positions from the right and himself proceeded to clear the enemy positions from the left. Fearlessly assaulting the first enemy position, he killed two enemy personnel and destroyed the second position by killing two more. He was injured on the shoulder and legs while clearing the third position. Undaunted and without caring for his grievous injuries, he continued to lead the assault on the fourth position urging his men and destroyed the same with a grenade, even as he got a fatal burst on his forehead. This singular daredevil act of Lieutenant Pandey provided the critical firm base for the companies, which finally led to capture of Khalubar. The officer, however, succumbed to his injuries.
Lieutenant Manoj Kumar Pandey, thus, displayed most conspicuous bravery, indomitable courage, outstanding leadership and devotion to duty and made the supreme sacrifice in the highest traditions of the Indian Army.


RIP Jai JAWAN!!!!!!!


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