# Boeing Rolls Out 1st F-15SA for Royal Saudi Air Force



## Arabian Legend

*Boeing Rolls Out 1st F-15SA for Royal Saudi Air Force
*





​
ST. LOUIS, April 30, 2013 -- Boeing [NYSE: BA] today rolled out the F-15SA, ushering in a new era in fighter aircraft capability and affordability for the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
The F-15SA, the newest variant of the combat-proven F-15, provides improved performance and increased survivability at a lower life-cycle cost. The aircraft has two additional wing stations for increased payload and capability.
"We look forward to receiving the advanced capabilities of the F-15SA aircraft to continue to protect the security and stability of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia," said Lt. Gen. Mohammed Bin Abdullah Al-Ayeesh, commander, Royal Saudi Air Force. "Our relationship with the U.S. Air Force and The Boeing Company has helped to ensure the Royal Saudi Air Force remains among the best-equipped air forces in the world."
Flight testing began this year on the F-15SA. The Royal Saudi Air Force has operated F-15S fighters since the 1990s.
"The Kingdom and Boeing have been partners for 65 years and our partnership goes beyond the innovative products and services we provide," said Dennis Muilenburg, Boeing Defense, Space & Security president and CEO. "Equally as important are the excellent collaborations between Boeing and Saudi educational and industrial organizations." 

Boeing Rolls Out 1st F-15SA for Royal Saudi Air Force

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## Falcon29

Mabrook...., now just get the silent eagle please...

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## Arabian Legend

Hazzy997 said:


> Mabrook...., now just get the silent eagle please...



F-15SA is the most advanced version of the f-15.

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## BLACKEAGLE

Congratulations guys!

When would the completion of delivery be?








Hazzy997 said:


> Mabrook...., now just get the silent eagle please...



Each one has advantages and disadvantages, KSA decided to chose F-15 SA as it meets it's own requirements and missions.

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## Yzd Khalifa

BLACKEAGLE said:


> Congratulations guys!
> 
> When would the completion of delivery be?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Each one has advantages and disadvantages, KSA decided to chose F-15 SA as it meets it's own requirements and missions.



In 2019. It will start in 15. As for the SE, I think the RSAF is aiming at it. I don't think we should go after it ,I would like to see the new F-35 in our inventory ,and soon will be.


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## 500

BLACKEAGLE said:


>


It's F-15C. Here is F-15SA:






Hi Res.

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## BLACKEAGLE

Yzd Khalifa said:


> In 2019. It will start in 15. As for the SE, I think the RSAF is aiming at it. I don't think we should go after it ,I would like to see the new F-35 in our inventory ,and soon will be.



Many experts say F-15 SA is better than F-35 which has been facing allot of technical problems, even the countries which had ordered F-35 reconsidered it. Plus, F-15 SA meets Saudi requirements.


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## forcetrip

Hazzy997 said:


> Mabrook...., now just get the silent eagle please...



I always thought the SA is the silent eagle.. did saudi not order a bunch of silent eagles?


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## Bratva

forcetrip said:


> I always thought the SA is the silent eagle.. did saudi not order a bunch of silent eagles?



F-15SA is silent eagle customised for Saudia Arabia. Customization means standard Silent eagle does not impressed Saudis and they asked Americans to customize it according to their own standards

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## BLACKEAGLE

mafiya said:


> F-15SA is silent eagle customised for Saudia Arabia. Customization means standard Silent eagle does not impressed Saudis and they asked Americans to customize it according to their own standards



I was trying to say that, but sometimes words don't help me..


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## Safriz

F-15E.info: Strike Eagle reference and resources - F-15E.info - F-15SA Differences
Engines: Boeing will equip the F-15SA with General Electric made F-110- GE-129 engines, instead of the 'traditional' Pratt&Whitney F100-PW-220 series engines.





*Electronic Warfare*: Instead of the TEWS used in the Strike Eagle, the F-15SA will feature a digital electronic warfare system (developed by BAE Systems), dubbed as DEWS. DEWS was developed by leveraging F-22 and F-35 EW program results and replaces 4 legacy systems of the Strike Eagle. It is fully digital (hence its name) and works in close integration with wideband RF systems, including the AN/APG-63(v)3 AESA radar, giving the jet a very sharp edge in the electronic warfare arena.

*Radar: *It is arguably the most important difference between the F-15E and F-15SA models. The F-15SA will be equipped with the APG-63(V)3 radar, the newest of the ultramodern AESA line developed by Raytheon.





*Sensors*: The F-15SA will use the top-notch Sniper XR targeting pod. The targeting pod will be attached under a new 3rd generation FLIR sensor which Boeing calls as "Tiger Eyes". This pod will give the F-15SA IRST capabilities in air-to-air engagements. Note that "Tiger Eyes" is also in service with the F-15K Slam Eagle version, as it is seen on the image below.

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## Zoro

Hello all could some one tell me how long it took to seal this deal i.e from selection to signing of the deal?


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## Bratva

BLACKEAGLE said:


> I was trying to say that, but sometimes words don't help me..





Where words won't help, showing a finger would

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## Mitro

What type of BVR Missile Saudi are getting if any .


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## Bubblegum Crisis

Thank you very much *@ *Arabian Legend




> *F-15SA Development
> *
> The F-15 is not unknown in Saudi Arabia, since its localized version, the F-15S is in service in the RSAF from 1995. RSAF currently operates a total of 70 F-15S jets together with 66 F-15C single seat and 18 F-15D two-seat models.
> 
> Saudi Arabia sought to upgrade their existing F-15S fleet and they wanted to purchase more of the upgraded version. The goal was to have 70 + 84 jets at identical configuration, thus Saudi Arabia requested 84 new F-15SA aircraft, plus an upgrade of its F-15S fleet to F-15SA standards, plus related equipment and weapons. The US Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified the US Congress of this possible foreign military sale on Oct 20, 2010. The equipment list of the aircraft is very impressive:
> 
> *Engines:*
> 
> 193 F-110- GE-129 engines
> 
> 
> *Avionics and sensors:*
> 
> - 170 APG-63(v)3 AESA radar sets
> - 169 DEWS systems
> - 100 Link-16 datalink systems and spares
> - 40 ROVER systems (Remotely Operated Video Enhanced Receivers)
> - 193 LANTIRN navigation pods with Tiger Eye IRST systems
> - 158 AN/AAQ-33 Sniper targeting systems
> - 169 AN/AAS-42 IRST systems
> - 338 JHMCS systems with 462 JHMCS helmets
> - 462 AN/AVS-9 NVG&#8217;s
> - 10 DB-110 reconnaissance pods
> - 80 ACMI (Air Combat Maneuvering Instrumentation) pods
> 
> 
> *Weapons:*
> 
> - 100 M61 Vulcan cannons with 200,000 20mm cartridges and with 400,000 20mm target practice cartridges
> - 300 AIM-9X Sidewinder A/A missiles with 25 AIM-9X CATMs (Captive Air Training Missiles) and with 25 Special Air Training Missiles
> - 500 AIM-120C/7 AMRAAM A/A missiles with 25 AIM-120 CATMs
> - 1,000 dual mode laser/ GPS guided munitions (500 lbs)
> - 1,000 dual mode laser/ GPS guided munitions (2,000 lbs)
> - 1,100 GBU-24 Paveway III LGBs (2,000 lbs)
> - 1,000 GBU-31B V3 JDAMs (2,000 lbs)
> - 1,300 CBU-105D/B SFW/ WCMD
> - 50 CBU-105 inert
> - 1,000 MK-82 500 lb GP bombs with 6,000 MK-82 inert training bombs
> - 2,000 MK-84 2,000 lb GP bombs with 2,000 MK-84 inert training bombs
> - 400 AGM-84 Block II HARPOON missiles
> - 600 AGM-88B HARM missiles
> 
> ---------------------------------------
> 
> Also included are the upgrade of the existing Royal Saudi Air Force ( RSAF) fleet of seventy (70) F-15S multi-role fighters to the F-15SA configuration, the provision for CONUS-based fighter training operations for a twelve (12) F-15SA contingent, construction, refurbishments, and infrastructure improvements of several support facilities for the F-15SA in-Kingdom and/or CONUS operations, RR-188 Chaff, MJU-7/10 Flares, training munitions, Cartridge Actuated Devices/Propellant Actuated Devices, communication security, site surveys, trainers, simulators, publications and technical documentation, personnel training and training equipment, U.S. government and contractor engineering, technical, and logistical support services, and other related elements of logistical and program support.






> *U.S. to Sell F-15s to Saudi Arabia*
> 
> *December 30, 2011
> By NATHAN HODGE and CAROL E. LEE*
> 
> The Obama administration said it has reached a $30 billion agreement to sell advanced fighter aircraft to Saudi Arabia, part of a broader push by Washington to counter Iranian power.
> 
> *The government-to-government deal announced on Thursday includes the sale of 84 new F-15 fighter jets and an upgrade of 70 others.*
> 
> The package, which follows more than a year of discussions, comes amid escalating tensions between Iran and the U.S., and will help beef up the military of one of Washington's principal Middle East allies.
> 
> "This agreement reinforces the strong and enduring relationship between the United States and Saudi Arabia, and demonstrates the U.S. commitment to a strong Saudi defense capability as a key component to regional security," said White House spokesman Josh Earnest.
> 
> The White House also cast the agreement as one that would help give a lift to the U.S. economy, saying it would generate more than 50,000 manufacturing and supplier jobs in 44 states. The F-15s are manufactured by Boeing Co. in St. Louis.
> 
> Dennis Muilenburg, head of Boeing's defense segment, said in an interview the sale was a very important deal that reinforced the company's strategy of expanding international sales.
> 
> Boeing has set a target of making international business account for around 25% or 30% of defense segment revenues, up from a 7% share around five years ago.
> 
> "We're well on our way of achieving that" with the Saudi deal, Mr. Muilenburg said.
> 
> *Boeing said the deal would create jobs in Saudi Arabia as well as in the U.S. Mr. Muilenburg said the sale would include Saudi industrial participation, including parts assembly and manufacturing at a facility in Riyadh.*
> 
> Sales of advanced U.S. military equipment to allies in the Middle East have been a concern for Israel, which is keen to preserve its military edge.
> 
> U.S. officials have sought to reassure Israel that the fighter deal would benefit Israel's security by bolstering moderate allies in the Gulf.
> 
> The fighter sale "will not have an impact on Israel's qualitative military edge," said Assistant Secretary of State for Political-Military Affairs Andrew Shapiro in Washington.
> 
> "We did not gin up a package in response to current events in the region," he said, pointing out that Congress had received formal notification of the deal.
> 
> The Obama administration informed Congress last year of a plan to sell Saudi Arabia up to $60 billion in new weaponry, including the F-15s. While some lawmakers expressed reservations about the proposal, Congress didn't move to block the deal.
> 
> The Israeli Embassy in Washington didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
> 
> *U.S. officials have said the F-15s would be highly capable aircraft, comparable to the F-15s operated by South Korea and Singapore.
> 
> The new and upgraded fighters would be Saudi Arabia's "most capable and versatile aircraft" and could carry a range of precision-guided weapons and air-to-air missiles, said James Miller, U.S. principal deputy undersecretary of defense for policy.*
> 
> The first of the new aircraft are expected to be delivered around 2015.
> 
> Anthony Cordesman, a defense analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, said the Israeli military's concerns about Iran outweighed the potential risks Israel might perceive from Saudi Arabia or other Arab states acquiring improved military hardware.
> "It's not as if it came as a surprise to anyone in Israel," he said.
> 
> 
> *The Wall Street Journal
> *




*F-15K Slam Eagle (Republic of Korea Air Force)
*





































*F-15K Slam Eagle in Red Flag 08-4*








*F-15SA (Royal Saudi Air Force)*

*You can see new sensors at &#8216;the foot drifts&#8217; and &#8216;under the cockpit&#8217;.*

*Hi Res. pic* (Thank you very much *@ *500)







Thank you very much *@* Arabian Legend




> *Raytheon to Support AIM-9X for Saudi Arabia*
> 
> *April 17, 2013
> George I. Seffers*
> 
> Raytheon Missile Systems, Tucson, Ariz., is being awarded an $8,627,879 modification to a previously awarded cost-plus-fixed-fee contract services in support of the Phase II AIM-9X System Improvement Program for the U.S. Air Force, Navy, and the government of Saudi Arabia, including hardware and software development activities and implementation of security architecture requirements.



*AIM-9X*

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## Mosamania

Zoro said:


> Hello all could some one tell me how long it took to seal this deal i.e from selection to signing of the deal?



The deal is already signed dude, 84 new F-15SAs plus upgrading of 70 F-15Ss to F-15SA's standards.


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## Arabian Legend



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## LegionnairE

BLACKEAGLE said:


> Many experts say F-15 SA is better than F-35 which has been facing allot of technical problems, even the countries which had ordered F-35 reconsidered it. Plus, F-15 SA meets Saudi requirements.


"experts"  we have that kind of guys in newspapers


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## BLACKEAGLE

LegionnairE said:


> "experts"  we have that kind of guys in newspapers



I have read their evaluation of F-15 SA in respected and specialized military Websites. Anyhow, you can check the specs of the two jets and decide


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## Armstrong

BLACKEAGLE said:


> I have read their evaluation of F-15 SA in respected and specialized military Websites. Anyhow, you can check the specs of the two jets and decide



F-15SA is better than F-35 - Then why the heck is the US investing Billions in procuring the latter when they could just as easily & for less induct larger quantities of the former ?  

Use your brain, *Sab* !


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## mkg00179504

congrats, you will see some people on this forum calling F15,F16, too old they think its from 1970 so its not good enough.The reality is it can knock out almost anything.All it matter is what you have onboard the plane.


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## BLACKEAGLE

Armstrong said:


> F-15SA is better than F-35 - Then why the heck is the US investing Billions in procuring the latter when they could just as easily & for less induct larger quantities of the former ?
> 
> Use your brain, *Sab* !



I'm no expert to be honest with you, but from what I have read so far, I felt F-15 SA is better. Just my opinion.

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## Armstrong

BLACKEAGLE said:


> I'm no expert to be honest with you, but from what I have read so far, I felt F-15 SA is better. Just my opinion.



One is a 4.5th Generation platform whereas the other is a 5th Generation platform which had some of its goodies devolved to both the F-16 & the F-15 program as further upgrades - You add that up, akhi !


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## LegionnairE

BLACKEAGLE said:


> I have read their evaluation of F-15 SA in respected and specialized military Websites. Anyhow, you can check the specs of the two jets and decide


You're disappointing me..


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## BLACKEAGLE

Armstrong said:


> One is a 4.5th Generation platform whereas the other is a 5th Generation platform which had some of its goodies devolved to both the F-16 & the F-15 program as further upgrades - You add that up, akhi !


Not to that degree man, I know this, it has fifth gen components, the radar, electronics, weapons, engines are close or match those on F-35. The only advantage of F-35 is it's stealthiness, while F-15 SA has greater range, weapon load, speed, and maneuverability.



LegionnairE said:


> You're disappointing me..



Well, this is my opinion, I found those experts evaluation reasonable and logical as well as the general specs. I'm no expert though, aircrafts stuff are too complicated for us to evaluate, at least to me.

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## Armstrong

BLACKEAGLE said:


> Not to that degree man, I know this, it has fifth gen components, the radar, electronics, weapons, engines are close or match those on F-35. The only advantage of F-35 is it's stealthiness, while F-15 SA has greater range, weapon load, speed, and maneuverability.



Alright mate, whatever you think is right !  

I'm off to eat some Naan-Channas !


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## LegionnairE

BLACKEAGLE said:


> Well, this is my opinion, I found those experts evaluation reasonable and logical as well as the general specs. I'm no expert though, aircrafts stuff are too complicated for us to evaluate, at least to me.


I just wouldn't think that your vision would be soo limited. F15SE is a good bargain for some old F15 users but comparing it with the latest cutting-edge technology... I wouldn't think so little of you

F15 has more thrust than F22, which means more speed. "specs" doesn't mean a fvcking thing. It's not 1960s anymore, open your fvcking eyes.


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## BLACKEAGLE

LegionnairE said:


> I just wouldn't think that your vision would be soo limited. F15SE is a good bargain for some old F15 users but comparing it with the latest cutting-edge technology... I wouldn't think so little of you
> 
> F15 has more thrust than F22, which means more speed. "specs" doesn't mean a fvcking thing. It's not 1960s anymore, open your fvcking eyes.


I didn't say F-22, it's an another story. 
Yes I agree that specs are for noobs to compare, but what is on board matters and what are on F-15 SA board are on board of other 5th gen jets, the only advantage is F-35 design and yet stealthiness. @Mosamania could help with this, although he could be busy with his old mule,


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## LegionnairE

BLACKEAGLE said:


> I didn't say F-22, it's an another story.
> Yes I agree that specs are for noobs to compare, but what is on board matters and what are on F-15 SA board are on board of other 5th gen jets,







Only 5. generation feature SE has is the AESA radar. No DAS no IHADSS no nothing. Stop misinforming people and go inform yourself.


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## BLACKEAGLE

LegionnairE said:


> Only 5. generation feature SE has is the AESA radar. No DAS no IHADSS no nothing. Stop misinforming people and go inform yourself.



*Raytheon Delivers Next-Generation F-15 AESA Radar to Boeing Ahead of Schedule
*
http://raytheon.mediaroom.com/index.php?s=43&item=532&pagetemplate=release


*F-15SA Development*

*Avionics and sensors:*

*170 APG-63(v)3 AESA radar sets*
F-15E.info: Strike Eagle reference and resources - F-15E.info - F-15SA Development


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## BeyondHeretic

500 said:


> It's F-15C. Here is F-15SA:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Res.



500 , I feel so goddamned naïve as an Iranian watching you on this forum and the forum before this one 



500 said:


> It's F-15C. Here is F-15SA:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Res.



Isn't that the landing , the final" phase?


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## BLACKEAGLE

BeyondHeretic said:


> 500 , I feel so goddamned naïve as an Iranian watching you on this forum and the forum before this one



What's with you and 500? Get over it man, she is married

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## BeyondHeretic

BLACKEAGLE said:


> What's with you and 500? Get over it man, she is married



I thought she might be interested in kibbutz lifestyle ;D

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## thesolar65

Who are going to fly these planes, I mean Pilots? SA personnel or from other countries?


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## LegionnairE

@BLACKEAGLE
Are we speaking the same language here? Already told you the only 5. gen. feature was the AESA radar. There isn't a single mechanical or electronic feature that belongs to 5th generation fighters on SE. It's not comparable with either of F35 or F22.

Anyway, I got tired, I got studies to work on. So by all means, keep on masturbating.

@others
500 is a he


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## Bubblegum Crisis

thesolar65 said:


> Who are going to fly these planes, I mean Pilots? SA personnel or from other countries?



Not ! The Martians... ^^

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...-emirates-air-force-red-flag-13-2-2013-a.html

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...rabia-mulls-german-tank-deal.html#post3757741

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## AUz

Guys, can you post specs of this beauty?

Probably the most potent aircraft present in Middle-East/South Asia region!


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## Zarvan

Yzd Khalifa said:


> In 2019. It will start in 15. As for the SE, I think the RSAF is aiming at it. I don't think we should go after it ,I would like to see the new F-35 in our inventory ,and soon will be.



Even if they give you F-35 they will be of worst quality not even close to what Israel will get so better wait for China or Russia


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## 500

AUz said:


> Guys, can you post specs of this beauty?
> 
> Probably the most potent aircraft present in Middle-East/South Asia region!


Flight characteristics (speed, range, maneuverability) are equal to F-15E (which is good enough). But electronic equipment is a leap ahead (which was also very impressive):

1) APG-63(V)3 AESA radar instead APG-70 slot array.
2) DEWS electronic warfare instead TEWS.
3) JHMCS helmet cueing system with AIM-9X.
4) Sniper XR targeting pod + Tiger Eyes IRST instead Lantirn.
5) Two additional hardpoints for 4 AA missiles or 2 AG missiles (max AA missile capability increased from 8 to 12). 

No doubt its most potent non stealthy aircraft.

If you compare it to F-35. Here are F-15SA pros:

+ range.
+ speed.
+ altitude.
+ 2 men crew (its very hard to operate so many systems for one person). 
+ combat loadout.
+ two engines.

The only serious con is lack of stealth. But thats very very very very serious con, that counters all advantages of F-15SA. Stealth gives u a huge advantage in BVR air to air combat, stealth greatly increases your survivability against air defence systems.

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## Zarvan

Arabian Legend said:


> *Boeing Rolls Out 1st F-15SA for Royal Saudi Air Force
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ​
> ST. LOUIS, April 30, 2013 -- Boeing [NYSE: BA] today rolled out the F-15SA, ushering in a new era in fighter aircraft capability and affordability for the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.
> The F-15SA, the newest variant of the combat-proven F-15, provides improved performance and increased survivability at a lower life-cycle cost. The aircraft has two additional wing stations for increased payload and capability.
> "We look forward to receiving the advanced capabilities of the F-15SA aircraft to continue to protect the security and stability of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia," said Lt. Gen. Mohammed Bin Abdullah Al-Ayeesh, commander, Royal Saudi Air Force. "Our relationship with the U.S. Air Force and The Boeing Company has helped to ensure the Royal Saudi Air Force remains among the best-equipped air forces in the world."
> Flight testing began this year on the F-15SA. The Royal Saudi Air Force has operated F-15S fighters since the 1990s.
> "The Kingdom and Boeing have been partners for 65 years and our partnership goes beyond the innovative products and services we provide," said Dennis Muilenburg, Boeing Defense, Space & Security president and CEO. "Equally as important are the excellent collaborations between Boeing and Saudi educational and industrial organizations."
> 
> Boeing Rolls Out 1st F-15SA for Royal Saudi Air Force


When is first batch expected to arrive in Saudi Arabia ?


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## Mosamania

LegionnairE said:


> Only 5. generation feature SE has is the AESA radar. No DAS no IHADSS no nothing. Stop misinforming people and go inform yourself.



It also has the DEWS, and Super-cruise.



thesolar65 said:


> Who are going to fly these planes, I mean Pilots? SA personnel or from other countries?



We regularly hire Aliens from sector 2730B.

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## Yzd Khalifa

Zarvan said:


> Even if they give you F-35 they will be of worst quality not even close to what Israel will get so better wait for China or Russia



You raised a valid point. We don't do business at our expense Sir. The RSAF has its specific customizations and we put it on the table they can take it or leave. As far as my knowledge is concerned, We never took a single Aircarft out of our customizations, the Typhoon deal can speak for itself as well as what we are discussing now. If the RSAF is going after the F-35, we will only take what we demand. Of course, loud voices are always heard here and there ,so nothing new. And yes, the US reserves the right to turn any proposal down. 
If I had my druthers I will go after the stealthy Sino one.





Mosamania said:


> It also has the DEWS, and Super-cruise.
> 
> 
> 
> We regularly hire Aliens from sector *2730B*.


  
They can get a Kiwiish cow per each too.

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## Zarvan

Yzd Khalifa said:


> You raised a valid point. We don't do business at our expense Sir. The RSAF has its specific customizations and we put it on the table they can take it or leave. As far as my knowledge is concerned, We never took a single Aircarft out of our customizations, the Typhoon deal can speak for itself as well as what we are discussing now. If the RSAF is going after the F-35, we will only take what we demand. Of course, loud voices are always heard here and there ,so nothing new. And yes, the US reserves the right to turn any proposal down.
> If I had my druthers I will go after the stealthy Sino one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They can get a Kiwiish cow per each too.


Sir you should fund projects in China and also do sent your Aeronautical Engineers to train their specially in producing and designing Planes fighter planes by the way do you have Saudi Aeronautical engineers ?


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## Yzd Khalifa

Zarvan said:


> Sir you should fund projects in China and also do sent your Aeronautical Engineers to train their specially in producing and designing Planes fighter planes by the way do you have Saudi Aeronautical engineers ?



We've got our own crew in each and every industry including Aeronautical engineers. Many are training in the PRC.

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## Zarvan

Yzd Khalifa said:


> We've got our own crew in each and every industry including Aeronautical engineers. Many are training in the PRC.



What kind of weapons are you producing in Saudi Arabia I mean Tanks APC Guns and and other Armed Weapons


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## al-Hasani

Mosamania said:


> It also has the DEWS, and Super-cruise.
> 
> 
> 
> We regularly hire Aliens from sector 2730B.



  

Spare yourself Mosab. Not worth it.


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## LegionnairE

Mosamania said:


> It also has the DEWS, and Super-cruise.


DEWS is NOT a 5. gen. feature and F15SE does NOT have super-cruise. However, it's F110-GE129 engines generate slightly more thrust than the old models which makes the plane more agile. T/W ratios still suck. 

I'm not saying that it's a bad decision. In fact I think it's a great decision. Perhaps you're finally learning to standardize your equipment, it's a step. But comparing the SE with a genuine 5. generation fighter is absurd.

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## Mosamania

LegionnairE said:


> DEWS is NOT a 5. gen. feature and F15SE does NOT have super-cruise. However, it's F110-GE129 engines generate slightly more thrust than the old models which makes the plane more agile. T/W ratios still suck.
> 
> I'm not saying that it's a bad decision. In fact I think it's a great decision. Perhaps you're finally learning to standardize your equipment, it's a step. But comparing the SE with a genuine 5. generation fighter is absurd.



I did not compare it to a 5th Gen Aircraft mind you, nor did I claim it to be better. However I highlighted one of the criteriae that is needed in a 5th Gen aircraft to be called so which is also available in the F-15SA. 

"Electronic Warfare: Instead of the TEWS used in the Strike Eagle, the F-15SA will feature a digital electronic warfare system (developed by BAE Systems), dubbed as DEWS. DEWS was developed by leveraging F-22 and F-35 EW program results and replaces 4 legacy systems of the Strike Eagle. It is fully digital (hence its name) and works in close integration with wideband RF systems, including the AN/APG-63(v)3 AESA radar, giving the jet a very sharp edge in the electronic warfare arena.

DEWS offers full quadrant detection and response control, containing aft receiving antennas on top of the tails, aft RF transmitters and antennas built in the tailbooms, forward RF transmitters and antennas built in the leading edge of the wing roots, forward receiving antennas built in the wingtips and a low band Rx knife antenna placed on the underbelly of the jet below the cockpit. DEWS includes a digital RWR, digital jamming transmitter, ICS and an interference cancellation system. According to Boeing, the system will enables the F-15SA to jam enemy radars while its own radar and RWR continues to operate."

DEWS is a system that is derived from F-35 and F-22 EW systems, sure it is not DASH, however it is more advanced than PIRATE and SPECTRA even.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LegionnairE

Mosamania said:


> I did not compare it to a 5th Gen Aircraft mind you, nor did I claim it to be better. However I highlighted one of the criteriae that is needed in a 5th Gen aircraft to be called so which is also available in the F-15SA.


Friend,
You're not telling me something I don't already know. I know how advanced DEWS is but it doesn't necessarily make it a 5. generation aircraft feature. In the end it's just an EW module, you'll probably replace it when it's time to MLU 

It's not personal I just defended my argument. 
@BLACKEAGLE thinks SE is somehow "better" than F35 which is ridiculous.
SE could be a stop gap until better options become available but F35's a total game changer.


----------



## Yzd Khalifa

Zarvan said:


> What kind of weapons are you producing in Saudi Arabia I mean Tanks APC Guns and and other Armed Weapons



TPQH, I'm not equipped enough to answer you're question. @Arabian Legend and @Mosamania are the best when it comes to that.


----------



## Mosamania

LegionnairE said:


> Friend,
> You're not telling me something I don't already know. I know how advanced DEWS is but it doesn't necessarily make it a 5. generation aircraft feature. In the end it's just an EW module, you'll probably replace it when it's time to MLU
> 
> It's not personal I just defended my argument.
> @BLACKEAGLE thinks SE is somehow "better" than F35 which is ridiculous.
> SE could be a stop gap until better options become available but F35's a total game changer.



To be honest with you I am not the F-35's biggest fan. That plane has got some major deficiencies in some aspects. Sure it has Stealth going on which is on by itself a huge deal but in modern COIN theater of operations, or in CAS roles it will come short compared to other aircrafts. The F-16 for example can go rounds around the F-35 in CAS and COIN. 

The stop gap is not the F-15SAs. the stop gap is the Tornado upgrade to GR4, it will be replaced soon, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was replaced with the F-35 either. Mainly because the F-15SAs and the F-35 will serve an amazing complimentary role to one another.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Bubblegum Crisis

You are gonna like it. ^^

The wonderful life of F-35...




> *Reduced F-35 performance specifications may have significant operational impact*
> 
> *By: Dave Majumdar Washington DC
> 11:25 30 Jan 2013*
> 
> The Pentagon's decision to reduce the performance specifications for the Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighter will have a significant operational impact, a number of highly experienced fighter pilots consulted by Flightglobal concur. But the careful development of tactics and disciplined employment of the jet may be able to mitigate some of those shortcomings.
> 
> "This is going to have a big tactical impact," one highly experienced officer says. "Anytime you have to lower performance standards, the capability of what the airframe can do goes down as well."
> 
> The US Department of Defense's decision to relax the sustained turn performance of all three variants of the F-35 was revealed earlier this month in the Pentagon's Director of Operational Test and Evaluation 2012 report. Turn performance for the US Air Force's F-35A was reduced from 5.3 sustained g's to 4.6 sustained g's. The F-35B had its sustained g's cut from five to 4.5 g's, while the US Navy variant had its turn performance truncated from 5.1 to five sustained g's. Acceleration times from Mach 0.8 to Mach 1.2 were extended by eight seconds, 16 seconds and 43 seconds for the A, B and C-models respectively. The baseline standard used for the comparison was a clean Lockheed F-16 Block 50 with two wingtip Raytheon AIM-120 AMRAAMs. "What an embarrassment, and there will be obvious tactical implications. Having a maximum sustained turn performance of less than 5g is the equivalent of an [McDonnell Douglas] F-4 or an [Northrop] F-5," another highly experienced fighter pilot says. "[It's] certainly not anywhere near the performance of most fourth and fifth-generation aircraft."
> 
> At higher altitudes, the reduced performance will directly impact survivability against advanced Russian-designed "double-digit" surface-to-air missile (SAM) systems such as the Almaz-Antey S-300PMU2 (also called the SA-20 Gargoyle by the North Atlantic Treaty Organization), the pilot says. At lower altitudes, where fighters might operate in for the close air support or forward air control role, the reduced airframe performance will place pilots at increased risk against shorter-range SAMs and anti-aircraft artillery.
> 
> Most egregious is the F-35C-model's drastically reduced transonic acceleration capabilities. "That [43 seconds] is a massive amount of time, and assuming you are in afterburner for acceleration, it's going to cost you even more gas," the pilot says. "This will directly impact tactical execution, and not in a good way."
> 
> Pilots typically make the decision to trade a very high rate of fuel consumption for supersonic airspeeds for one of two reasons. "They are either getting ready to kill something or they are trying to defend against something [that's trying to kill] them," the pilot says. "Every second counts in both of those scenarios. The longer it takes, the more compressed the battle space gets. That is not a good thing."
> 
> While there is no disputing that the reduced performance specifications are a negative development, there may be ways to make up for some of the F-35's less than stellar kinematic performance.
> 
> Pilots will have to make extensive use of the F-35's stealth characteristics and sensors to compensate for performance areas where the jet has weaknesses, sources familiar with the aircraft say. But engagement zones and maneuvering ranges will most likely be driven even further out against the most dangerous surface-to-air threats.
> 
> In an air-to-air engagement, for example, tactics would have to be developed to emphasize stealth and beyond visual range (BVR) combat. If a visual range engagement is unavoidable, every effort would have to be taken to enter the "merge" from a position of advantage, which should be possible, given the F-35's stealth characteristics.
> 
> Once engaged within visual range, given the F-35's limitations and relative strengths, turning should be minimized in favor of using the jet's Northrop Grumman AAQ-37 distributed aperture system of infrared cameras, helmet-mounted display and high off-boresight missiles to engage the enemy aircraft. If a turning fight is unavoidable, the F-35 has good instantaneous turn performance and good high angle of attack (50°AOA limit) performance comparable to a Boeing F/A-18 Hornet, which means a similar strategy could be adopted if one finds him or herself in such a situation.
> 
> Lockheed, for its part, maintains that the F-35 has performance superior to that of any "legacy" fighter at high altitudes. "Having flown over 4000 hours in fighter jets, I will tell you the F-35's capability at altitude, mostly driven by the internal carriage of those weapons, as a combat airplane, this airplane exceeds the capabilities of just any legacy fighter that I'm familiar with in this kind of regime," says Steve O'Bryan, the company's business development director for the F-35 during a January interview.
> 
> But much of the discussion is theoretical at this point, the F-35 has not been operationally tested, nor have tactics been developed for the aircraft's usage. How the aircraft will eventually fare once fully developed and fielded is an open question.
> 
> 
> *Flightglobal*





> *Concerns Linger Over F-35 Software Delays*
> 
> *by Brendan McGarry on April 24, 2013*
> 
> Top U.S. Defense Department officials say they&#8217;re concerned the slow pace of software development may delay the delivery of the most lethal version of the F-35 fighter jet beyond 2017.
> 
> The program manager, Air Force Lt. Gen. Christopher Bogdan, told lawmakers today the issue was his top priority.
> 
> &#8220;My biggest concern in development is software,&#8221; Bogdan said in remarks prepared for a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing. &#8220;I see more risk to the delivery of Block 3F, our full warfighting capability, by 2017.&#8221;
> 
> That model of the Lockheed Martin Corp.-made aircraft is designed to be equipped with a suite of internal and external weapons, including the GPS-guided Joint Direct Attack Munition, laser-guided Paveway II bomb, Advanced Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile and infrared Sidewinder missile.
> 
> The program office will have a better estimate of the planned delivery date this summer after reviewing at least six months of flight testing data, Bogdan said.
> 
> The Joint Strike Fighter is the Pentagon&#8217;s most expensive weapons acquisition program, estimated to cost almost $400 billion for a total of 2,457 aircraft, according to a 2011 defense acquisition report. It&#8217;s designed to replace such aircraft as the F-16, A-10, F/A-18 and AV-8B.
> 
> The department next year plans to spend $8.4 billion to buy 29 F-35 Lightning IIs, including 19 for the Air Force, six for the Marine Corps and four for the Navy, according to its budget request released earlier this month.
> 
> The concerns over software remain despite making a &#8220;major shift&#8221; in oversight the past year, Bogdan said. That change has resulted in faster software development and integration, reduced coding errors and better collaboration between the program office and Lockheed, he said.
> 
> The Bethesda, Maryland-based company and its subcontractors &#8220;still need to improve both the speed and quality of software development to be able to catch up from previous software delays,&#8221; Bogdan said.
> 
> The Pentagon&#8217;s top weapons buyer, Frank Kendall, echoed those comments during a separate briefing with reporters to announce an updated effort to improve how the department buys goods and services. &#8220;We still got a fair amount of software to write,&#8221; he said. &#8220;There are some risks there.&#8221;
> 
> The military is about 40 percent through the F-35 test program, Kendall said.
> 
> In addition to software, &#8220;there are still a few other issues we haven&#8217;t quite put to bed yet, but I&#8217;m feeling cautiously optimistic,&#8221; he said without elaborating. &#8220;I won&#8217;t say there won&#8217;t be any additional schedule slips.&#8221;
> 
> The department is working to reduce program expenses by negotiating better terms on production contracts, Kendall said. &#8220;I want to keep the pressure on to drive it down as much as we can,&#8221; he said.
> 
> Kendall described sustaining the aircraft as &#8220;our biggest opportunity&#8221; to find long-term savings. The cost of keeping the F-35 in service for 50 years is estimated at more than $1 trillion and the Pentagon plans to hold competitions for the work.
> 
> &#8220;We can achieve the greatest results there,&#8221; he said.
> 
> 
> *Defensetech
> *





Translation help?

*"Google Translate"*

*Link:* Google Translate




> *Contrat des F-35 : Ottawa fait « table rase »*
> 
> *Mise à jour le mercredi 12 décembre 2012 à 22 h 52 HNE*
> 
> Le gouvernement conservateur a indiqué mercredi qu'il cherchait des solutions de rechange aux chasseurs F-35 pour le remplacement de la flotte vieillissante de CF-18 des Forces canadiennes. Cette annonce survient au moment où un rapport indépendant révèle que le coût de ces avions ultramodernes est passé de 25 milliards de dollars à 45 milliards.
> 
> La durée de vie des CF-18, qui doivent être remplacés depuis 2003, a été prolongée jusqu'à 2017-2020. Mercredi, le ministre de la Défense nationale, Peter MacKay a annoncé qu'il procédait à « un examen approfondi » de la flotte actuelle, y compris les coûts des améliorations qui pourraient être nécessaires pour prolonger leur durée de vie.
> 
> Dans le cadre d'une conférence de presse à Ottawa pour parler de ce qu'ils appellent le « plan en sept points » visant à remplacer la flotte de CF-18, le ministre MacKay et sa collègue des Travaux publics, Rona Ambrose, ont annoncé qu'un comité de cinq experts indépendants a été nommé pour évaluer toutes les alternatives. « Nous recommençons à zéro et nous prenons le temps de faire une évaluation complète de toutes les options viables », a affirmé la ministre Ambrose.
> 
> 
> *45 milliards plutôt que 25*
> 
> Cette annonce du gouvernement conservateur a été faite dans la foulée de la publication d'un rapport de la firme KPMG commandé par le gouvernement du Canada. Le rapport révèle que le coût des 65 avions F-35 de la firme américaine Lockheed Martin atteint maintenant 45 milliards de dollars.
> 
> Le gouvernement aurait à acquitter cette facture sur une période de 42 ans, s'il décide d'aller de l'avant avec cette acquisition.
> 
> Le nouveau montant calculé par la firme indépendante KPMG inclut les coûts engendrés par le développement de l'appareil, et prévoit une durée de vie de 30 ans, ce qui n'était pas le cas lors de la précédente évaluation, en 2010.
> 
> Lorsque le gouvernement a annoncé son intention d'acheter 65 chasseurs F-35 en 2010, le coût d'achat était évalué à 9 milliards de dollars, en plus de 16 milliards de dollars en frais d'entretien.
> 
> En avril dernier, le vérificateur général Michael Ferguson accusait les ministères de la Défense et des Travaux publics d'avoir camouflé le coût réel du programme d'achat de ces avions.
> 
> *
> Radio-canada*






> *F-35 : encore loin du chasseur ultra-performant*
> 
> *Mise à jour le dimanche 13 janvier 2013 à 11 h 04 HNE
> Radio-Canada avec Reuters*
> 
> Selon un rapport du Pentagone, les avions de chasse F-35 fabriqués par Lockheed Martin connaîtraient encore de multiples problèmes. Après avoir subi le tiers des tests qu'on leur réserve, ces avions sont toujours en cours d'évaluation.
> 
> Le rapport de 18 pages affirme que les tests effectués n'ont fait que souligner que le projet est encore loin du terme. Débuté en 2001, le projet a été modifié trois fois depuis.
> 
> Il note qu'en 2012, 18 % plus de tests de vol ont été effectués que ce qui avait été prévu. Ces tests supplémentaires ont permis de constater que la performance des avions reste en dessous de ce qui était attendu à ce stade de développement.
> 
> Les programmes informatiques utilisés par les avions nécessitent encore des améliorations et connaissent d'ailleurs plusieurs délais de livraison. Le casque qui sera porté par les pilotes et qui reçoit des données de chaque détecteur installé sur le chasseur est entre autres visé.
> 
> L'intégration des armes sur les avions de chasse connaît aussi des complications, ainsi que le système d'aération de l'un des modèles et le système de refroidissement d'un autre. De plus, le revêtement des F-35, qui doit les rendre presque invisibles aux radars, s'écaille lorsque l'avion vole à grande vitesse où se retrouve en haute altitude.
> 
> Un système protégeant le chasseur des explosions de réservoirs d'essence qui pourraient être causées par les éclairs a également dû être revu. On a même annulé les tests de vol à 25 miles d'une zone orageuse.
> 
> Par ailleurs, les tests de résistance de l'un des modèles ont dû être arrêtés en décembre après que des lézardes aient été détectées sur le fuselage. Les trois différents modèles de F-35 que Lockheed Martin veut construire connaîtraient des ratés.
> 
> [Après avoir annoncé son intention d'acheter 65 chasseurs F-35 en 2010 afin de remplacer sa flotte vieillissante de CF-18, le gouvernement canadien a indiqué en décembre dernier qu'il cherchait des solutions de rechange. Cette annonce est survenu au moment de la publication d'un rapport indépendant qui révèlait que le coût des F-35 est passé de 25 milliards de dollars à 45 milliards.]
> 
> Lockheed Martin en confiance
> 
> Plus positive, la société Lockheed Martin affirme que le programme ne cesse d'afficher des progrès et démontre une stabilité « exceptionnelle ».
> 
> « Même si nous nous appliquons à parvenir aux objectifs attendus, le plan global reste le même », a déclaré le porte-parole de la compagnie, Michael Rein.






> *
> Upgraded F/A-18 to begin test flights; offer Navy alternative to F-35C*
> 
> *by Brendan McGarry on April 8, 2013*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boeing Co. as early as this summer will fly for the first time an upgraded version of the F/A-18 Super Hornet that it&#8217;s pitching to the U.S. Navy as an alternative to the Lockheed Martin Corp.-made F-35, a Boeing vice president said.
> 
> A Super Hornet outfitted with a weapons pod on its belly, an avionics system in the cockpit featuring a touch-screen pad, and other modifications will begin test flights in late summer or early fall from St. Louis and then from Naval Air Station Patuxent River in Md., according to Mike Gibbons, vice president of F/A-18 programs at Chicago-based Boeing.
> 
> The improvements, to include new engines made by General Electric Co., are part of a company investment designed to provide the service with an alternative to the F-35 Lightning II during a period of tightening defense budgets, Gibbons said today at the Sea-Air-Space exhibition, a three-day conference at National Harbor, Maryland, organized by the Navy League.
> 
> &#8220;We&#8217;re not trying to replace the F-35,&#8221; he said in an interview after a media briefing. &#8220;We&#8217;re just trying to give the Navy solutions as they look at that fleet mix and figure out what works best.&#8221;
> 
> The F-35 program, known as the Joint Strike Fighter, is the Defense Department&#8217;s most expensive acquisition effort, estimated to cost almost $400 billion for a total of 2,443 aircraft. The Navy plans to buy about 260 of the Navy variant of the plane known as F-35C, designed to take off from and land on aircraft carriers.
> 
> Even the Navy&#8217;s top officer has questioned the need for a stealth naval aircraft such as the F-35 given advances in radar technology. In an editorial last year in &#8220;Proceedings,&#8221; a monthly magazine published by the U.S. Naval Institute, Adm. Jonathan Greenert, chief of naval operations, argued that &#8220;we need to move from &#8216;luxury-car&#8217; platforms &#8212; with their built-in capabilities &#8212; toward dependable &#8216;trucks&#8217; that can handle a changing payload selection.&#8221;
> 
> During a speech this morning, Greenert defended the F-35. &#8220;I need the fifth-generation strike fighter,&#8221; he said. &#8220;We&#8217;re all in, but it has to perform.&#8221;
> 
> Regardless, Boeing wants the F/A-18 to be that cheaper workhorse for the Navy.
> 
> &#8220;Everybody needs defense dollars to stretch further,&#8221; Gibbons said. &#8220;That&#8217;s why the Super Hornet looks good right now.&#8221;
> 
> The Defense Department faces $1 trillion in cuts over the next decade under deficit-reduction legislation passed in 2011. Half of that, about $500 billion, will come from automatic, across-the-board cuts &#8212; unless Congress and the White House agree to an alternative spending plan.
> 
> 
> *Defensetech*




And finally, cherry on the cake. ^^



Translation help?

*"Google Translate"*

*Link:* Google Translate




> *
> JSF (F-35) réparé mais irréparable*
> 
> *04/03/2013
> *
> Le Pentagone a décidé que sa flotte de F-35, désignation sérieuse du JSF, était à nouveau autorisée à évoluer dans son élément, &#8211; on veut dire : voler, &#8211; après l&#8217;interruption due à la découverte d&#8217;une fissure dans une ailette de la turbine d&#8217;un réacteur Pratt & Whitney F135 installé sur cet avion. Danger Room annonce la chose le 3 mars 2013, répercutant les déclarations rassurantes de Pratt & Whitney, &#8211; ce que Danger Room désigne comme «the best possible spin» dont le sens est pour le moins ambigu. On comprend plus loin pourquoi.
> 
> «Pratt and Whitney put the best possible spin on the turbine blade&#8217;s potentially catastrophic flaw, which if undetected could have caused a crash. &#8220;Prolonged exposure to high levels of heat and other operational stressors on this specific engine were determined to be the cause of the crack,&#8221; the company announced late Thursday. &#8220;No additional cracks or signs of similar engine stress were found during inspections of the remaining F135 inventory. No engine redesign is required as a result of this event.&#8221;»
> 
> Le JSF est une chaîne sans fin de petites, moyennes et grosses catastrophes qui ne cessent de répercuter leurs effets les unes sur les autres, pour former la catastrophe monstrueuse qu&#8217;on connaît. Ici, bien entendu, nous ne parlons que du moteur, qui est, pour le public que nous sommes, un nouveau domaine catastrophique du JSF, qui en a déjà beaucoup à son actif.
> 
> Originellement, le F135, moteur à la poussée énorme de 40.000 livres, correspondait bien au JSF théorique et triomphant, envisagé comme un avion aux lignes aérodynamiques assez pures et au poids correspondant bien au moteur. Puis, le très long développement de la chose ayant commencé, l&#8217;avion commença parallèlement à rencontrer ses diverses catastrophes. Cela obligea à diverses refontes qui ne cessèrent d&#8217;alourdir l&#8217;avion lui-même, autant que l&#8217;aérodynamisme de sa silhouette, transformant l&#8217;agile merveille en un embarrassant fer à repasser.
> 
> Cette situation impliquait que, pour tenir ses performances de vol promises, et même avec l&#8217;intervention amicale de l&#8217;USAF qui abaissa un tantinet ses exigences opérationnelles, le F135 devait, et doit, et devra de plus en plus fonctionner à très haut régime et ainsi produire une très haute chaleur très dommageable à lui-même. Des système nouveaux pouvant supprimer ce handicap structurel et sans fin sont en développement, mais, semble-t-il, beaucoup trop cher et trop avancé pour aller sur le F-35/F135. Ainsi, conclut Danger Room, le JSF est-il condamné à voler ad vitam aeternam avec l&#8217;épée de Damoclès de la probabilité, sinon de la certitude d&#8217;interruptions de vol successives et intempestives, avec son moteur qui chauffe trop et ses turbines ainsi fragilisées. Encore s&#8217;agit-il de l&#8217;hypothèse optimiste et ne dit-on rien de ce qu&#8217;il pourrait advenir du moteur à mesure qu&#8217;il avance dans l&#8217;usage opérationnel dans de telles conditions, c&#8217;est-à-dire avec la possibilité d&#8217;un point de rupture catastrophique ou de nouvelles faiblesses résultant d&#8217;un tel fonctionnement&#8230; (Mais tout cela est vraiment optimiste, puisque cela suppose que le JSF entrera un jour en service.)
> 
> «&#8230;But the redesign has an adverse effect on the plane&#8217;s aerodynamics, making the F135 work harder than is normal for a fighter engine. Generating more than 40,000 pounds of thrust, the F135 is the most powerful fighter motor ever. Even though the Pentagon has downgraded the F-35&#8217;s acceleration specs to ease the strain on the engine, the F135 runs extra hot &#8212; a problem that has concerned Lockheed and Pratt and Whitney engineers for at least seven years and likely contributed to turbine problems in 2007, 2008 and 2009.
> 
> »Through an initiative called Advent, the Air Force and several aerospace companies are investigating a host of new engine technologies that could someday be installed in the F-35, potentially alleviating some of the engine problems. According to the Air Force, Advent&#8217;s advancements include &#8220;turbine section for increased thrust, third stream cooled cooling air for engine hot section thermal management system, and lightweight high temperature materials.&#8221; General Electric, Pratt and Whitney&#8217;s main rival, completed some major testing of Advent tech late last month. Trials of a complete Advent engine are slated for 2017. The Pentagon has said the new motor must be scaled to fit the F-35. But Larry Burns, government program manager for Advent, said it&#8217;s unlikely the full Advent motor will be installed on the F-35. Owing to the high cost, such retrofit are &#8220;few and far between,&#8221; Burns told reporter Steve Trimble.
> 
> »So the Pentagon&#8217;s mainstay future fighter is probably stuck with its existing engine, as well as with that motor&#8217;s high temperatures and fragile turbines. And that means groundings like last week&#8217;s could be a distressingly common occurrence.»
> 
> 
> *Dedefensa.org
> *

Reactions: Like Like:
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## AUz

500 said:


> Flight characteristics (speed, range, maneuverability) are equal to F-15E (which is good enough). But electronic equipment is a leap ahead (which was also very impressive):
> 
> 1) APG-63(V)3 AESA radar instead APG-70 slot array.
> 2) DEWS electronic warfare instead TEWS.
> 3) JHMCS helmet cueing system with AIM-9X.
> 4) Sniper XR targeting pod + Tiger Eyes IRST instead Lantirn.
> 5) Two additional hardpoints for 4 AA missiles or 2 AG missiles (max AA missile capability increased from 8 to 12).
> 
> No doubt its most potent non stealthy aircraft.
> 
> If you compare it to F-35. Here are F-15SA pros:
> 
> + range.
> + speed.
> + altitude.
> + 2 men crew (its very hard to operate so many systems for one person).
> + combat loadout.
> + two engines.
> 
> The only serious con is lack of stealth. But thats very very very very serious con, that counters all advantages of F-15SA. Stealth gives u a huge advantage in BVR air to air combat, stealth greatly increases your survivability against air defence systems.



Thank You sir.

How many hard points does it have (total)?

Also, I thought that F-15 SA was upgraded Saudized version of F-15 Silent Eagle? In short, a specially made version of F-15 Silent Eagle just for Saudi Airforce? Is it true? If yes, then isn't this plane stealthy too?


----------



## Bubblegum Crisis

Stealth




> *Boeing Looks to First Silent Eagle Flight*
> 
> *by christian on January 21, 2010*
> 
> *This article first appeared in Aviation Week & Space Technology.*
> 
> With radar-cross-section (RCS) trials for Boeings Silent Eagle semi-stealthy F-15 prototype complete, company officials are now focusing on South Korea as a possible first customer.
> 
> The RCS testing took place during a two-week period last August and September, although Boeing has only just acknowledged it because of proprietary issues, says Mark Bass, vice president of F-15 programs.
> 
> The company is eyeing South Koreas forthcoming F-X3 competition for 60 fighters as the first sales opportunity for the Silent Eagle. The South Korean parliaments recent hesitancy about investing in all-stealth aircraft validates our approach with the aircraft, says Bass. The company is considering potential international co-development partners for a Silent Eagle conformal fuel tank, although no announcements have been made.
> 
> *Boeing is developing the variant for international customers that already operate F-15s and are seeking additional aircraft. The system is a possible alternative for nations interested in the Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighter. The Silent Eagle is not as stealthy as the JSF, but it could provide flexibility for countries trying to stretch their defense dollars.*
> 
> In the early days of an air campaign, the Silent Eagle can be outfitted with weapon bays suitable for carrying air-to-air and air-to-ground weapons that would be tucked inside conformal fuel tanks, thus reducing the aircrafts front-quadrant RCS. The aircraft could then be reconfigured in hours to handle the F-15s characteristic heavy load of weapons once early threats are removed and sustainment operations begin.
> 
> *The RCS tests on F-15E1, an Air Force test asset leased to Boeing, took place at the companys anechoic chamber in St. Louis. Various coatings were evaluated and a final candidate has been selected and applied to the appropriate portions of the airframe. Testing produced the desired results, he said. Bass declined to provide details on the coating or the precise RCS numbers.
> *
> 
> *Defense.org*




*...*



*See old link: *

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...f-15sa-royal-saudi-air-force.html#post4233935




> *2010-12 Saudi Shopping Spree: F-15s, Helicopters & More*
> 
> *April 2/12: F-15S Sensors.* Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control in Orlando, FL receives a $410.6 million firm-fixed-price contract for 95 sniper advanced targeting pod and spares; 35 compact multiband data links; 70 infrared search and track (IRST) systems and spares; 75 IRST pylons; and data, in support of the Royal Saudi Air Force F-15S to F-15SA conversion. The F-15S already uses LANTIRN, and both of these systems offer considerable improvements over that existing gear. The 2 systems can even be combined, via a single underbody pylon that contains the Tiger Eyes and mounts the Sniper pod.
> 
> Lockheed Martins Sniper pod offers pilots advanced day/night ground surveillance and laser or GPS targeting. The version offered is not clear; the most recent variant is the USAFs new Sniper-SE.
> 
> *Lockheed Martins Tiger Eyes IRST external link is also a long-range surveillance tool, but one focused on heat emissions from aircraft. That gives fighters a non-radar surveillance option, which is useful on a tactical level and offers options against stealth aircraft.* As a side benefit, Tiger Eyes provides classic LANTIRN capabilities like terrain following, and all-weather navigation. Work is to be completed by Nov 31/17. The Warner Robins Air Logistics Center at Robins AFB, GA manages this contract on behalf of its Saudi FMS client (FA8540-12-C-0012).
> 
> *
> by Defense Industry Daily staff*










> *Lockheed Martin TIGER Eyes*
> 
> *Introduction*
> 
> *The TIGER Eyes is an advanced electro-optical sensor suite that provides targeting, all-weather navigation, terrain-following and Infrared Search and Track (IRST) for the F-15K multirole fighter. TIGER Eyes is an evolution of combat-proven AN/AA!-13 LANTIRN and US Navy IRST technology.*
> 
> *The TIGER Eyes sensor suite includes a mid-wave FLIR, TFR, 40,000 feet altitude laser, CCD-TV, and a long-range IRST. It will enable release of air-to-surface weapons at the longer ranges available for those weapons today. The system's IRST, similar to the F-14-mounted IRST, enables the F-15K to engage passively, long range airborne targets without using the radar system.*
> 
> *Production*
> 
> In April 2006 Boeing selected Lockheed Martin to provide AN/AAQ-33 Sniper Advanced targeting pods, Tiger Eyes navigation pods, and an IRST system for the Republic of Singapore F-15SGs. Under an undisclosed fixed-price five-year contract this advanced electro-optical sensor suite will be integrated into the F-15SG aircraft beginning in the second quarter of 2007.
> 
> *Supported platforms*
> 
> F-15K/F-15SG
> 
> 
> *Scramble - The Aviation Magazine*





Translation help?

*"Google Translate"*

*Link:* Google Translate




> *
> Le F22 Raptor vu sous OSF du Rafale
> *
> *9 décembre 2011 par Optro & Défense*
> 
> *A loccasion du Lima 2011 air show en Malaisie, Dassault a publié une série dimages provenant dun engagement entre le Rafale et le F-22A Raptor de Lockheed Martin. Lune de ces images avait déjà été communiquée et il provenait dun combat amical au cours de lexercice international Advanced Tactical Leadership Course (ATLC) réalisé en novembre 2009 à la base aérienne dAl Dhafra aux Emirats Arabes Unis.
> 
> Limage est issue de lOptronique Secteur Frontal (OSF, soit FSO pour Front Sector Optronics en Anglais), un système de capteurs optroniques passifs conçu par Thales Optronique. Les caractéristqies de lOSF ont déjà été présentées ici sur Optronique & Défense.*
> 
> Aéroplans rapporte les propos du service des relations publiques de larmée de lair américaine expliquant que lors de ces engagements à vue et à courte distance (combat rapproché « un contre un » qui, à niveau de performances rapprochées, sapparente à un combat canon pouvant se solder par une neutralisation mutuelle dès lors que personne naccroche personne) sur six engagements, un seul a permis au F-22 douvrir le feu. Les pilotes américains auraient étaient extrêmement surpris par la résistance des hommes et des machines françaises.



*
Eurofighter Typhoon IRST (Infra-Red Search and Track)*










*Continue... See old links:*

http://www.defence.pk/forums/air-warfare/181915-interesting-article-irst.html#post2963613

http://www.defence.pk/forums/air-warfare/181915-interesting-article-irst.html#post2963618




> *French Rafale Versus USA Corruption*
> 
> *TAXES FOR STEALTH CORRUPTION? THE F-22, F-35 SCANDALS.*
> 
> *The F22 Raptor is the USA air superiority plane. It cost too much and proved too fragile. In USA style stealth, sharp angles are used because only reflections in discrete directions come back. So the USA style stealth plane acts as a diamond: a bright radar flash is followed by nothing, as the plane has moved slightly in the next sweep, and the sharp reflection went far away.
> 
> In 2009, in the United Arab Emirates, F22s Raptors met French Rafales in mock combat. The French weekly Air & Cosmos released an instructive picture. Here is a F22, in the gun sight of a Rafale:
> 
> The word blasphemy comes to mind. To put things in their proper context, the Rafale is a superlative bomber and ground attack plane. Contrarily to the F22 Raptor, it was not built just for air supremacy.
> 
> In the above picture, the Raptor is obviously maneuvering hard in the vertical plane: its nose is up, and one can see the bright flares of its two engines in post combustion, as they vector as hard as they can (see the supersonic shockwaves in the white jet exhausts). The F22 is trying to escape an inverted Rafale pulling with a lot of acceleration (gs) toward the ground. The F-22 is clearly not in a position for a gun or an infrared missile shoot (fox2). The thrust vectoring the F22 is engaging into is killing its speed. if the Rafale does not shoot it right away, its going to be the biggest slow moving turkey the sky has ever seen, within a few seconds.
> 
> Also remember that the Rafale carries its missiles externally, and normally the F22 does not (because, if it did, it would lose stealth). So the Rafale is capable of an instantaneous InfraRed missile shot on the F22, should the latter somehow escape the Rafales 30 mm gun *
> 
> Radars use intermittency to detect a moving object, so, if a reflection is followed by no reflection as the target has moved slightly, the electronic connected to the radar sees nothing.
> 
> One of the many disadvantages of USA style stealth is that sharp angles are not very aerodynamic, resulting in all sorts of problems, including fatigue of the exposed parts of the plane. Thus some of the plastic of the F-22 wore off, and had to be replaced by titanium (which is highly reflective).
> 
> The F22 Raptor plane is made of toxic polymers and epoxy glue, and technicians have to wear mask and gloves when approaching it. Cough and actually asphyxia have been reported in or around the plane. Making it the only neurotoxic plane in the world.
> 
> The F22 also cost 400 million dollar apiece. (And the F-22 lacks more recent features such as High Off Bore Sight and Helmet Mounted Display, let alone a very long range missile such as the Meteor.)
> 
> The F-22 was thus replaced by the smaller, cheaper, much slower F-35. With just one single engine. Four hundred (400) billion dollars has been spent on the F-35, and still, more than ten years later, it has not dropped a bomb, fired one missile, or a single canon shell
> 
> The F35 program is actually the most expensive defense program, ever. By a very long shot.
> 
> By comparison, the Manhattan project cost 20 billion dollars, by the time it had dropped two nuclear fisson bombs on Japan and forced its surrender (and the hurried suicides of a few of the military plutocrats who terrorized Japan).
> 
> The F35 cannot cruise at supersonic speeds (the Rafale can cruise supersonically, and stealthily, with ten tons of weapons hanging outside). One may wonder if the F-35 could have caught up with the 9/11 terrorists (After all, F15s, which fly much faster, could not, but at the time nobody expected that the USA would be attacked the way France had been in 1996, by suicidal highjackers!)
> 
> 
> *Now for a somewhat peaceful sight:*
> 
> Rafale (on the left) and Typhoon Eurofighter (built respectively by French Dassault and part-French EADS, the company that owns Airbus). Both planes were successfully engaged in Libya, although:
> 
> 1) The Eurofighter needed assistance from Tornado bombers to bomb. (The Tornadoes detected and painted targets for the Eurofighters laser guided bombs. Eurofighters cant bomb on their own!)
> 
> 2) The Rafales were fully autonomous, and proved capable, using their active stealth, to search and destroy enemy missile batteries and radars of a fully functional air defense system.
> 
> 3) Somehow American business men and their friends in Washington were able to persuade some of the nations which (helped) built (and purchase) the Typhoon Eurofighter to pitch into the F-35 Lightning II program. Thats very remarkable.
> 
> The United Kingdom, which is in a depression (its GDP numbers are worse than in the 1930s) and bankrupt Italy are now funding a useless, immensely expensive plane made in the USA. As if money grew on trees, or, at least, so it does in Washington. How much money has been passing under that table?
> 
> Rafales recently visited Great Britain. Instructions were issued to British pilots, with their Typhoon Eurofighters, to NOT engage in war games with French Rafales.
> 
> Is it all bad with the Typhoon Eurofighters? Well, not at all, as long as they stay away from Rafales, and go shoot F22s!
> 
> Lockheed Martin haughtily claims: the F-22 is the only aircraft that blends supercruise speed, super-agility, stealth and sensor fusion into a single air dominance platform.
> 
> In mid-June 2012, 150 German airmen and eight twin-engine, non-stealthy Typhoons arrived at Eielson Air Force Base in Alaska for an American-led Red Flag exercise involving more than 100 aircrafts from Germany, the U.S. Air Force and Army, NATO, Japan, Australia and Poland.
> 
> Eight times during the two-week war game, single German Typhoons flew against single F-22s , simulating close-range dogfights.
> 
> Conclusion? In a close-range tangle  which pilots call a merge  the bigger and heavier F-22 is at a disadvantage. German Typhoon pilots said that, when flying without their external fuel tanks, in the WVR (Within Visual Range) arena, the Eurofighter proved to be better than the F22 Raptor.
> 
> The F-22 tends to lose too much energy when using thrust vectoring (TV): TV can be useful to enable a rapid direction change without losing sight of the adversary but, unless the Raptor can manage to immediately get a kill, the energy it loses makes the then slow moving plane quite vulnerable!
> 
> (Also the F-22 burns fuel like crazy during TV, and it has a short range to start with, due to its poor aerodynamics, and enormous engines to push its brutal shape.)
> 
> The Raptor fights well from beyond visual range with its high speed and altitude, sophisticated radar and long-range AIM-120 AMRAAM missiles. Yet the AMRAAM maximum range is around 100 kms, less than the Meteor missile used by the Typhoon (and the Rafale!).
> 
> *At this point, the partisans of the F22 will start their usual USA superiority sing-song. They will say, the Raptor is so stealthy, outside of visual range, it will sneak onto non stealthy Typhoons. And yet, this is another lie.*
> 
> *At a distance of about 50 km, the Typhoon IRST (Infra-Red Search and Track) system can find even a stealthy plane especially if it is large and hot, like the F-22&#8243; a Eurofighter pilot said. (Another reason for compact beauty, as in the Rafale!)
> 
> In any case, the Typhoons killed several Raptors during the Red Flag Alaska. On one day a German pilot quipped: yesterday, we have had a Raptor salad for lunch.
> *
> Other problems with the Raptor: it chokes its pilots, and its long range missiles do not work when its cold (like it tends to get, up there in the sky). Both problems have been with the plane in the last two years, and its supposed to stay close to a base all the time!
> 
> 
> *Ah, and what of the Rafale already?*
> 
> Well in an exercise, Rafales and Typhoons met, 9 Typhoons got killed while a single Rafale was disqualified for flying too low. Super agility, anyone?
> 
> So, taxpayers, to your purses! The stealthy Military-Industrial Complex wants more from you. Much more. Some will say: wait a minute, why all these useless planes? Well, because after charging two billion dollars apiece for the completely useless subsonic B2 bomber, the plane makers of the USA realized they had found a story taxpayers bought with relish: the STEALTH plane. It was a nationalistic story: only the USA had stealth planes. The American public loves nationalistic, only-in-the-USA stories.
> 
> One difference between the USA and France is that one needs more nationalistic fervor to keep the USA together (the same applies to other countries, and the less they hold together naturally, the more strident the nationalistic fervor!). The French are more blasé: they are stuck together, anyway (although they feel it would be more elevated not to be).
> 
> OK, most publics are nationalistic, but can the most advanced civilization be the most nationalistic? Well, no. Nationalism is a form of hubris, and there is no stealthier poison. Athens tasted of that delicious poison, the poison of hubris, the poison so many in Germany, helas, even while torturting Hellas, tasted with relish.
> 
> All and any argument resting on nationalism is logically suspect, its a contaminant.
> 
> After building and operating for more than a trillion dollar of these useless planes, the F-22, the F-35, more money will be needed For weapons that really work. Thus a double subsidy for the Military-Industrial Complex. One for useless weapons, and then one, absolutely necessary, for weapons that actually work!
> 
> 
> *Patrice Ayme*



*USA F22 Raptor In Crosshairs Of French Rafale. The Outmaneuvered F22 is Fully Vectoring.*

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## BLACKEAGLE

AUz said:


> Thank You sir.
> 
> How many hard points does it have (total)?
> 
> Also, I thought that F-15 SA was upgraded Saudized version of F-15 Silent Eagle? In short, a specially made version of F-15 Silent Eagle just for Saudi Airforce? Is it true? If yes, then isn't this plane stealthy too?



It has 12 hard points..

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## AUz

BLACKEAGLE said:


> It has 12 hard points..



Great! How much payload? 

Does KSA have Aim 120C/D etc?


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## Bubblegum Crisis

AUz said:


> Great! How much payload?
> 
> *Does KSA have Aim 120C/D* etc?



See here:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...f-15sa-royal-saudi-air-force.html#post4233935


and here...

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...ion-arms-deal-israel-uae-ksa.html#post4181079

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## 500

AUz said:


> Thank You sir.
> 
> How many hard points does it have (total)?


2 side wing.
2 central wing.
2 conformal tank.
1 central hull.

But each can take multiple missiles/bombs.

- Each conformal can take 6 500-pound bombs, 2 2000-pound bombs, 8 SDB + 3 500-pound bombs, 2 AA missiles. 
- Each central wing can take 2 AA missiles + 610 gal fuel tank, 2000-pound bomb/missile, 4 500-pound bombs.
- Central hull can take 610 gal fuel tank or 2000-bomb or 4 500-pound bombs.
- Each side wing can take 2 AA missiles, 2 500 lb bombs, 1 1000 lb bomb/missile.

So overall it can take: 
12 AA missiles + 3 fuel tanks. Air-air mission.
28 500-pound bombs + 4 AA missiles. Close support mission. 
4 2000-pound bombs + 3 fuel tanks + 4 AA missiles + 2 HARM missiles. Long range strike mission.
.......
.......



> Also, I thought that F-15 SA was upgraded Saudized version of F-15 Silent Eagle? In short, a specially made version of F-15 Silent Eagle just for Saudi Airforce? Is it true? If yes, then isn't this plane stealthy too?


No SA is not Silent Eagle and its not stealthy.

Silent Eagle is quite problematic by the way. Because it cant carry external tanks and conformal tanks are removed to carry missiles. As result it has very limited fuel (36% less than F-35). And its not really stealthy either.

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## Bratva

Bubblegum Crisis said:


> Stealth&#8230;
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *...*
> 
> 
> 
> *See old link: *
> 
> http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...f-15sa-royal-saudi-air-force.html#post4233935
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Translation help?
> 
> *"Google Translate"*
> 
> *Link:* Google Translate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *USA F22 Raptor In Crosshairs Of French Rafale. The Outmaneuvered F22 is Fully Vectoring.*



@gambit your thoughts on these pics?


----------



## Bubblegum Crisis

> *Duels over the sands*
> 
> *Air&Cosmos , June 2010*
> 
> Saint-Dizier, November 8, 2009. a first wave of 3 Rafale from the 1 / 7 "Provence" squadron is leaving Haute-Marne for much more desert horizons. Heading to the United Arab Emirates (UAE) and the Al Dhafra air base, to an exercise that any fighter pilot in the world would not want to miss, the Advanced Tactical Leadership Course (ATLC), organized annually by the UAE.
> 
> In total, 6 Rafale of the 1/7, in 2 waves of 3 aircrafts, join the UAE base in autumn 2009. They are accompanied by 15 pilots, with different backgrounds and experiences. All have the opportunity to come and train on an extraordinary playground: 3 times larger than the Red Flag "range", the Air Warfare Centre (AWC) was established in 2000 for Gulf countries and their key allies such as the United States, Britain and France, as well as other nations invited each year. The UAE AWC also has the latest equipment in the field of debrief missions, allowing very precise debriefing at the end of each mission.
> 
> In 2009, the Rafale participate ATLC for the first time. But another special guest shares the bill : the US F-22A Raptor, the U.S. Air Force has dispatched 6 aircraft attached to the 27th Fighter Squadron, based in Langley AFB.
> 
> Designed in the early 90s, the American fighter is the most modern fighter in service today. It combines extraordinary aerodynamic performance with a very large stealth, but also a weapon system built around a powerful AESA radar and passive sensors whose operation is similar in principle to those of Spectra. Tailored for high-altitude interception and BVR Combat, the Raptor knows how to defend itself in dogfight: it has a thrust vector that guides the air flow of its two reactors in the vertical plan, with overflow maneuverability in all phases of flight. On paper, the F-22A Raptor and the Rafale have not much in common. While the U.S. aircraft (the most expensive fighter in the world) was designed as the ultimate fighter aircraft, the french jet is a versatile and "affordable" combat aircraft. Both are not even competing on the international market because Washington refuses to export the Raptor, which must remain the "secret US boot" during an aerial war of high intensity.
> 
> The 2009 ATLC release will be the pretext of the first confrontation between the two aircraft ...
> 
> 
> *One defeat for five draws.
> *
> The U.S. Air Force, however, put strict conditions surrounding the confrontation: the Raptor will not participate in any BVR exercise with foreign aircraft. The American pilots only accept to confront in dogfight, 1 vs 1, against crews that participate in the exercise. Pilots of the 1/7 take their chance ... and the results will be rather promising: on 6 engagements, only one has resulted, according to the French aviators, with a straightforward victory for the F-22A. The other 5 have ended with a 'draw' ,a situation of equality that can be obtained by various parameters: Dual protracted beyond a preset time,crossing of the floor set for the exercice ...
> 
> 2 main parameters give the advantage to the Raptor in dogfight: the thrust vector and the enormous power conferred by its 2 reactors, which give each twice the thrust of the M88! Although it is much heavier than the Rafale, the F22A maintains a formidable manceuvrability that allows it to leave the most delicate BFM situations; even if it loses a lot of energy during maneuvers with the highest angle of attack, this energy can be quickly recovered by its engines.
> 
> But the french pilots are careful to qualify the Raptor as invulnerable: "Facing an F-22A, the Rafale can be put in firing position but it must do it very quickly, lest the roles reversed if the battle drags on" summarizes a French aviator.
> 
> [...]
> 
> The performance of Spectra amaze:
> 
> The airmen of the "Provence" leave Al Dhafra on Dec. 12, after accumulating 320 flying hours in 182 missions. A large number of complex engagements have once again to the demonstration of the versatility of the french fighter. An example: during a mission hombardement, the number 2 of a patrol of 4 Rafale dropped six AASM GPS guided on six different objectives, while firing 3 Mica on hostile tracks ... all in barely more than a minute. The debriefing will show that the 6 objectives, far from nearly 50 km, have been destroyed, while two enemy aircraft were shot down by French missiles.
> 
> As for Red Flag, the French also praised the performance of Spectra in the location of air defense threats: the Rafale deployed to ATLC wouldhave been able to perfectly fulfill the mission of destroying enemy air defenses (SEAD) with the American F-16CJ, which is the main mission. A henceforth proven multirole ability that will allow the Rafale to finally make the difference with its competitors.
> 
> 
> *Air&Cosmos*


*
Rafale OSF (Front Sector Optronics)*














Translation help?
*
"Google Translate"*

*Link:* Google Translate




> *L'optronique secteur frontal (L'OSF)*
> 
> Implanté en pied de la verrière sur l'avant du cockpit, dans un volume de 80 litres, il a la caractéristique d'être passif, en n'émettant pas d'énergie, ce qui rend son fonctionnement quasiment indétectable.C'est un système complet en service sur aucun autre avion d'armes en service dans le monde.Son fonctionnement se rapproche d'un radar, dans la fonction air/air et dans la fonction air/surface.
> 
> - Il détecte et localise les cibles
> - il identifie les cibles
> - analyse les formations
> - le résultat des tirs.
> 
> Il participe aussi bien à l'autoprotection de l'avion qu'à l'attaque.
> 
> Grâce à ses capacités infrarouges, il offre une aide précieuse pour le pilotage de nuit.
> 
> L'OSF a une intégration totale au système de navigation et d'attaque de l'avion.
> 
> *
> FONCTION AIR/AIR :*
> 
> L'OSF assure la recherche, l'acquisition et la poursuite de cibles aériennes en deux dimensions avec une discrétion totale, et en trois dimensions en utilisant la voie laser.
> 
> Avec des fonctions importantes:
> 
> - l'analyse de raids
> - l'analyse des résultats de tir
> - la reconnaissance visuelle de cibles.
> 
> Les principales qualités du capteur sont sa discrétion, sa capacité de fonctionnement intègre en ambiance de brouillage électronique, son large domaine angulaire et la précision des paramètres fournis.
> 
> *
> FONCTION AIR/ SOL&MER :*
> 
> Les nombreux modes de fonctionnement air-air, air-sol et air-mer sont configurés automatiquement en fonction de la mission programmée pour l'avion, ou à la demande du pilote pendant le vol.
> 
> L'OSF conserve ses capacités de recherche et d'acquisition.
> 
> Le mode imagerie permet l'analyse et la poursuite des cibles, le mode télémétrie la localisation trois dimensions.
> 
> L'OSF est composé de deux voies optiques :
> 
> - une consacrée à l'infrarouge et dont la tête est une boule stabilisée affleurant au-dessus du nez de l'avion
> 
> La voie IR possède une fonction veille/poursuite et une fonction imagerie, respectivement appelées IRST et FLIR.
> 
> - une rassemblant une voie TV et un télémètre laser.
> 
> La voie TV/laser est réservée à l'identification de la cible et à la télémétrie. Toutes deux ont un large domaine d'excursion et offrent la possibilité pour le pilote d'opter pour le champ de vision de son choix.
> 
> 
> *Le RBE2*
> 
> Associé aux caractéristiques «tire et oublie» du missile Mica et intégré dans un système fusionnant les données des autres capteurs (dont l'identification à distance), le RBE2 est un élément fondamental de la conduite de tir «multicibles simultanées» du Rafale.
> 
> *FONCTION AIR/AIR :*
> 
> le radar met en &#339;uvre un mode de détection et de poursuite automatique à grande distance de plusieurs dizaines de cibles aériennes, dans toutes des configurations possibles :
> 
> - rapprochement
> - éloignement
> - vers le haut
> - vers le bas.
> 
> La finesse des poursuites donne des désignations d'objectifs précises à la conduite de tir du missile Mica.
> 
> Le balayage électronique optimise le compromis domaine surveillé/cibles poursuivies et donne à l'équipage le moyen d'engager les cibles de son choix tout en continuant à surveiller l'apparition de menaces éventuelles dans la portion d'espace désignée.
> 
> Un apport indispensable en attaque au sol et sur mer
> 
> Pour l'attaque au sol, le radar apporte l'information temps réel nécessaire, quelles que soient les conditions météorologiques, au suivi automatique du terrain dans le plan vertical à très basse altitude. Cette capacité est couplée aux commandes de vol et permet de s'affranchir de la plupart des tirs missiles adverses en libérant l'équipage du pilotage de base au profit de la conduite de la mission. Le RBE2 est également capable de fournir au système les informations d'évitement latéral des obstacles non prévus en préparation de mission.
> 
> *FONCTION AIR/ SOL&MER :*
> 
> Le RBE2 est un capteur unique capable de se configurer à l'échelle de la seconde pour faire face à une menace aérienne ou permettre la destruction d'un objectif de surface:
> 
> La polyvalence : tous les constituants du système d'armes Rafale amènent leur contribution, puisque l'emport simultané de missiles Mica et d'armements air-sol, ainsi que la disponibilité permanente dans le logiciel opérationnel de l'ensemble des conduites de tir air-air, air-sol et air-mer.
> 
> Le RBE2 apporte l'information nécessaire au recalage de la navigation inertielle/GPS, et permet la désignation précise d'objectifs terrestres par tous les temps.
> 
> En attaque à la mer, le RBE2 délivre à grande distance une analyse de la situation tactique avec identification et classement des cibles et permet le tir de missiles type Exocet hors des systèmes de défense surface-air.
> 
> 
> *Dassault*



*Optronique secteur frontal*

Optronique secteur frontal - Wikipédia


*
Air&Cosmos Article*

















*
See old link (&#8216;Stealth&#8217; Thread 1):*

http://www.defence.pk/forums/arab-d...15sa-royal-saudi-air-force-4.html#post4240602

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## Yzd Khalifa

@Bubblegum Crisis 

Do you believe that the RSAF is going after the F-35 (; ..


----------



## gambit

mafiya said:


> @gambit your thoughts on these pics?


We have gone through these before. Do you see that little 'dingleberry' on the underside of the F-22? That is a passive radar enhancer designed from the 'luneburg lens' construction. Also spelled 'luneberg'.

RCS Radar Cross Section, Lüneberg Reflector lensref - Luneburg radar


> The Luneberg reflector gives an homogeneous response inside a wide angle. It is an ideal passive responder, perfect for highlighting, and eventually monitoring the radar target to which it is attached, with a high level of security.
> The Luneberg lens is the most efficient passive radar reflector available.
> The Luneberg reflector requires no power supply nor maintenance.













Go back and look at your images again. You will see it.

What this mean is that during that exercise, opposition fighters needed assistance in order to track and target the F-22. Without that assistance via the enhancer, they would not be able to radar lock the F-22 at all. Within visual range, they may be able to detect it, but not likely radar lock it.

The B-2, F-117, F-22, and F-35 must fly with enhancers so air traffic controllers can 'see' them on their radar scopes.

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## Arabian Legend



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