# Karzai to ask for lethal weapons, won't mind Indian troops on Afghan soil



## Cyberian

Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldn&#8217;t mind troop presence on Afghan soil
_Friday May 17, 2013_







*NEW DELHI* - *Ahead of its President Hamid Karzai&#8217;s visit next week, the Afghan has asked India to supply lethal defence hardware as part of an intensified bilateral cooperation and even seemed to indicate that it would welcome troop deployment on its soil.*

Afghan President Hamid Karzai will be arriving in New Delhi on Monday for a three-day visit, his second in six months, but at a crucial juncture with only a year left for the foreign troops pullout from Afghanistan.

Vigorously batting for a stepped-up Indian role, Afghan Ambassador to India Shaida Mohammad Abdali said, &#8220;Investment in the security of Afghanistan is in India&#8217;s interest.&#8221;

He noted that while India had been training Afghan security personnel, it was not adequate to address the issues of a difficult security situation.

&#8220;Given the time, we are required to sit down and discuss the contours of our defence cooperation to ensure predictability,&#8221; he said, adding that current level of cooperation was hardly enough to &#8220;take preventive and pre-emptive action&#8221; against common threats.

India has so far been training Afghan security personnel only in Indian institutions. It has also supplied limited number of non-lethal equipment like jeeps and trucks and plans to hand over transport helicopters.

&#8220;So, we would like to have both lethal and non-lethal assistance to our forces in Afghanistan,&#8221; he said.

Better engagement in defence cooperation is likely to be a major topic of discussion during Karzai&#8217;s visit, which will also see him travelling to Jalandhar to receive a doctorate from a university.

Abdali said Pakistan had to realise that India was building institutions in Afghanistan, which would ensure that terrorism wouldn&#8217;t come back and affect the war-torn country even more. He said India&#8217;s cooperation in Afghanistan would ultimately serve Pakistan&#8217;s national interests too.

Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldn&#8217;t mind troop presence on Afghan soil - Pakistan Today

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## explorer9

SUPARCO said:


> Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldn&#8217;t mind troop presence on Afghan soil
> _Friday May 17, 2013_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *NEW DELHI* - *Ahead of its President Hamid Karzai&#8217;s visit next week, the Afghan has asked India to supply lethal defence hardware as part of an intensified bilateral cooperation and even seemed to indicate that it would welcome troop deployment on its soil.*
> 
> Afghan President Hamid Karzai will be arriving in New Delhi on Monday for a three-day visit, his second in six months, but at a crucial juncture with only a year left for the foreign troops pullout from Afghanistan.
> 
> Vigorously batting for a stepped-up Indian role, Afghan Ambassador to India Shaida Mohammad Abdali said, &#8220;Investment in the security of Afghanistan is in India&#8217;s interest.&#8221;
> 
> He noted that while India had been training Afghan security personnel, it was not adequate to address the issues of a difficult security situation.
> 
> &#8220;Given the time, we are required to sit down and discuss the contours of our defence cooperation to ensure predictability,&#8221; he said, adding that current level of cooperation was hardly enough to &#8220;take preventive and pre-emptive action&#8221; against common threats.
> 
> India has so far been training Afghan security personnel only in Indian institutions. It has also supplied limited number of non-lethal equipment like jeeps and trucks and plans to hand over transport helicopters.
> 
> &#8220;So, we would like to have both lethal and non-lethal assistance to our forces in Afghanistan,&#8221; he said.
> 
> Better engagement in defence cooperation is likely to be a major topic of discussion during Karzai&#8217;s visit, which will also see him travelling to Jalandhar to receive a doctorate from a university.
> 
> Abdali said Pakistan had to realise that India was building institutions in Afghanistan, which would ensure that terrorism wouldn&#8217;t come back and affect the war-torn country even more. He said India&#8217;s cooperation in Afghanistan would ultimately serve Pakistan&#8217;s national interests too.
> 
> Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldn&#8217;t mind troop presence on Afghan soil l Pakistan Today



It is not the first time Karzai is asking for lethal military hardware and Indian boots to manage the same. IMHO India would not cross the red line of directly involving in the Afghan imbroglio especially at a time when US/NATO is packing up.


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## Kompromat

I hear music playing,do you?

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## Hellraiser007

Military hard ware and aid is fine, Boots on the ground is not a nice move.

Rather training the Afghan troops is a good option.

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## Aslan

I dont think that the indians will be naive enough to play karzais game. Well if they do, are we looking at a repeat of Srilanka, and what Pakistan went through in Bangladesh.

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## jha

Some Anti-tank Missiles, artillery guns and some Akash should be a good start...

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## Cyberian

I say India should go in gun blazing to Afghanistan and conquer Kabul, don't hold back. This is India's chance and it won't get another one.

In Pakistan, a Taliban-friendly government is about to be sworn in. if India doesn't help out the Afghans now with troops and heavy weaponry, both India and Afghanistan will be dead meat in couple of years.

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## Digital Soldier

SUPARCO said:


> Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, *wouldn&#8217;t mind troop presence on Afghan soil* [/url]



A Pakistani source, with wrong provocative title. Karzai did not say anything as such.

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## Guynextdoor2

Aslan said:


> I dont think that the indians will be naive enough to play karzais game. Well if they do, are we looking at a repeat of Srilanka, and what Pakistan went through in Bangladesh.



Oh you guys are soooooo smarrt and we just don't know better no?


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## AUz

ISI will bury indians/ANA/Karzai alive in Afghan mountains...

Karzai knows it already...Without U.S/NATO, these retards are nothing more than a pack of card on the edge of a mountain during a windy day...

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## Shardul.....the lion

No Indian military boots on afghan soil nor has Karzai asked for it, no news in Indian newspaper........

Sorry Pakistanis, none of Indians wish to fulfill dreams of your newspapers............

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## Ayush

AUz said:


> ISI will bury indians/ANA/Karzai alive in Afghan mountains...
> 
> Karzai knows it already...Without U.S/NATO, these retards are nothing more than a pack of card on the edge of a mountain during a windy day...



all hail ISI,the superpower...



Digital Soldier said:


> A Pakistani source, with wrong provocative title. Karzai did not say anything as such.



then share the original source..

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## MilSpec

India should set up military aid fund equal to the development fund given to Afghanistan. Use that fund to buy the military hardware for Afghanistan.

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## joekrish

Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.

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## Kompromat

India should deploy its MKIs in Afghanistan to provide fire support to its Afghan allies against the Taliban. Afghanistan is in dire need of robust Indian military presence.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.



Lol.. would it hurt.. if sri lanka and bangladesh are given nukes?

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## Kompromat

joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.



What stops you?...maybe you don't have what it takes to do that,or your nation is impotent to carry out such a venture...,or maybe your generals are a little less stupid than a bhaarthi troll on the web?

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## RKhan

SUPARCO said:


> I say India should go in gun blazing to Afghanistan and conquer Kabul, don't hold back. This is India's chance and it won't get another one.
> 
> In Pakistan, a Taliban-friendly government is about to be sworn in. if India doesn't help out the Afghans now with troops and heavy weaponry, both India and Afghanistan will be dead meat in couple of years.



And you seem proud of this.

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## Invincible INDIAN

Aeronaut said:


> India should deploy its MKIs in Afghanistan to provide fire support to its Afghan allies against the Taliban. Afghanistan is in dire need of robust Indian military presence.



MKI??????????????

Do taliban have air force too???? 
JF 17

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## airmarshal

Karzai, the mayor of Kabul saying that and you guys commenting here are giving it more credibility than its worth.

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## REHAN NIAZI FALCON

well this region needs deweaponization , rather than weaponization .....
if this news is true then Mr Karzai is digging grave for whole the region ......

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## IamINDIA

we cannot afford troops in Afghanistan. right now our main goal is to improve our economy not get involved in Afghanistan.


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## farhan_9909

indian soldiers in afghanistan would be good for pakistan.

Since taliban will find a new front to open up in india..

unlike usa and nato..india is not out of the reach of taliban'S AND ofcourse with the help of ISI they will make hell for indians in there own country.

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## illusion8

LOL, Pakistani's inviting India to send its troops to Afghanistan - just a few consulates has broken your backs - imagine what a full fledged support scenario would do, Bangladesh and Mukhti Bahini comes to mind - how long did it take? - 12 or so months.

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## joekrish

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> Lol.. would it hurt.. if sri lanka and bangladesh are given nukes?



Not at all, The Bangladeshi one has more chances to land on you unless and until you dint hand it over to someone on PDF. 

Srilanka can't light a fire cracker forget the nuke, even if they use it most proberbly it would end up on the Tamil side of SL with the hate.

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## joekrish

Aeronaut said:


> What stops you?...maybe you don't have what it takes to do that,or your nation is impotent to carry out such a venture...,or maybe your generals are a little less stupid than a bhaarthi troll on the web?



Who wants to do that, we are not Pakistan, it was a joke and a senior mod such as you dint see the light side of it. Well can't blame you most here wear green glasses.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

joekrish said:


> Not at all, The Bangladeshi one has more chances to land on you unless and until you dint hand it over to someone on PDF.
> 
> Srilanka can't light a fire cracker forget the nuke, even if they use it most proberbly it would end up on the Tamil side of SL with the hate.



Im not talking abt the "dalal"  govt of BD... but BNP...

As for SL ... their target could be tamil nadu aswell...... 

And afghans well they will just sell it to anybody... 



illusion8 said:


> LOL, Pakistani's inviting India to send its troops to Afghanistan - just a few consulates has broken your backs - imagine what a full fledged support scenario would do, Bangladesh and Mukhti Bahini comes to mind - how long did it take? - 12 or so months.



Its the oposite in this case sunny boy.... with Pakistan between india and afghanistan...

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## joekrish

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> Im not talking abt the "dalal"  govt of BD... but BNP...
> 
> As for SL ... their target could be tamil nadu aswell......
> 
> And afghans well they will just sell it to anybody...
> 
> 
> 
> Its the oposite in this case sunny boy.... with Pakistan between india and afghanistan...



Well....karzai is not going to sell this one.

And Sri Lanka nuking Tamil nadu no way.........we have Rajnikath.

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## Icewolf

Wonder what Afghanis will think of this since they use maa-bhen gaali against dark people in India & Pakistan on comments



joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.



Never give a cave donkey a lethal weapon...
USA experienced this with giving Stingers to the Taliban,
Soviet Union experienced this when giving nukes to India

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## karan.1970

Aeronaut said:


> India should deploy its MKIs in Afghanistan to provide fire support to its Afghan allies against the Taliban. Afghanistan is in dire need of robust Indian military presence.



Good try, but no cigar.. There are better ways of helping a friendly nation than sending troops.. Both USA and USSR tried that in Afghanistan. We all know how both attempts went . The first one devastated Afghanistan and the 2nd one all but destroyed Pakistan..

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## DESERT FIGHTER

joekrish said:


> Well....karzai is not going to sell this one.
> 
> And Sri Lanka nuking Tamil nadu no way.........we have Rajnikath.



You dont know the afghans.. thts for sure..

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## karan.1970

airmarshal said:


> Karzai, the mayor of Kabul saying that and you guys commenting here are giving it more credibility than its worth.



Well.. That mayor has lasted more years in office than 90% of your leaders since Pakistan's formation. Think about it

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## EagleEyes

I think it would be in Pakistani interests to have Indian soldiers on board.

Taliban will get busy than being our problem.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

karan.1970 said:


> Well.. That mayor has lasted more years in office than 90% of your leaders since Pakistan's formation. Think about it



Too bad... hes restricted to kabul only..

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## Icewolf

karan.1970 said:


> Well.. That mayor has lasted more years in office than 90% of your leaders since Pakistan's formation. Think about it



Money can stretch...
Especially "CIA bags of money".

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## EagleEyes

karan.1970 said:


> Well.. That mayor has lasted more years in office than 90% of your leaders since Pakistan's formation. Think about it



He is a puppet with no one being able to challenge.

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## Areesh

illusion8 said:


> LOL, Pakistani's inviting India to send its troops to Afghanistan - just a few consulates has broken your backs - imagine what a full fledged support scenario would do, *Bangladesh and Mukhti Bahini comes to mind* - how long did it take? - 12 or so months.



But then again this scenario wasn't feasible and was not applied by India. Exists only in the minds internet hindoos. 

This is not 1971 and not every day is a sunday.

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## Mitro

What kind of weapon system we can provide to AF when all of our weapon are imported and very expensive and who is going to pay for it ?

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## joekrish

Icewolf said:


> Wonder what Afghanis will think of this since they use maa-bhen gaali against dark people in India & Pakistan on comments
> 
> 
> 
> Never give a cave donkey a lethal weapon...
> USA experienced this with giving Stingers to the Taliban,
> Soviet Union experienced this when giving nukes to India




Dint turn your back soon, you may just get kicked.......I dont know what the soviet experience was but I sure know what Pakistani experience is.

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## Icewolf

WebMaster said:


> I think it would be in Pakistani interests to have Indian soldiers on board.
> 
> Taliban will get busy than being our problem.



Taliban & TTP are completely different things..
Taliban is made up of ex-Mujahideen(soviet fighters) but TTP is made up of teenager Uzbek, Arab, Chechen, Tajik....
Their ideology is completely different as well...

But both need to be eliminated for sake of humanity

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## Areesh

karan.1970 said:


> Well.. That mayor has lasted more years in office than 90% of your leaders since Pakistan's formation. Think about it



May be because none of our leaders had 40+ countries occupying their country.

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## Icewolf

joekrish said:


> Dint turn your back soon, you may just get kicked.......I dont know what the soviet experience was but I sure know what Pakistani experience is.



How little you know about the situation...


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## karan.1970

Areesh said:


> May be because none of our leaders had 40+ countries occupying their country.



Yeah.. They only had their military generals staging a coup and occupying the country themselves

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## Armstrong

Czar786 said:


> What kind of weapon system we can provide to AF when all of our weapon are imported and very expensive and who is going to pay for it ?



Yaaar tu bhai ke khilaaaf aisaa kareiii gaaa ?

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## joekrish

Icewolf said:


> How little you know about the situation...



A little more than you do.....

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## karan.1970

WebMaster said:


> He is a puppet with no one being able to challenge.



That's your opinion.. He has though shown more independence than PPP in last 5 years..

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## Areesh

karan.1970 said:


> Yeah.. They only had their military generals staging a coup and occupying the country themselves



Occupying by own army is always better than getting occupied by foreign troops.

Since India is occupied too much time by foreigners, you can't feel that.

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## karan.1970

Icewolf said:


> Money can stretch...
> Especially "CIA bags of money".



One can always find excuses...

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## Armstrong

karan.1970 said:


> That's your opinion.. He has though shown more independence than PPP in last 5 years..



Like ?


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## Kompromat

@karan.1970

Afghanistan is your only true ally,it would be unfair if you don't extend the help they so desperately need.

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## Saleem

what does he mean lethal..so up to now they were using dart guns????


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## karan.1970

Areesh said:


> Occupying by own army is always better than getting occupied by foreign troops.



You think your generals staging a coup, arresting/hanging/exiling the democratically elected Prime minister is good?? Nice.. PKKH 



Areesh said:


> Since India is occupied too much time by foreigners, you can't feel that.


How so ?

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## Sugarcane

India ab 11 gunah lagaan bharay gaa

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## Areesh

karan.1970 said:


> You think your generals staging a coup, arresting/hanging/exiling the democratically elected Prime minister is good?? Nice.. PKKH



As I said. Always preferable than being occupied by foreign troops. Comprehension issues???



> How so ?



You don't feel anything bad in occupying by dozens of foreign troops. 

That so.

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## Mitro

Bilkol karoga pehle ham sulabh shauchalaya[Public Restroom] ki jho kami hai woh puri karde tub dekhe ge Around 2050 



Armstrong said:


> Yaaar tu bhai ke khilaaaf aisaa kareiii gaaa ?

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## EagleEyes

karan.1970 said:


> That's your opinion.. He has though shown more independence than PPP in last 5 years..



Please give your expert opinion of Pakistani politics on this.

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## Mitro

Maibaap aisha julom na karo sarkar Internet Hindooo tuh paglagaya hai  Aur panch salo se yeh Soniaji ki Sarkar ne khaple pe khapla kar ke hame nanga dar diye hai . 



LoveIcon said:


> India ab 11 gunah lagaan bharay gaa

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## Armstrong

Czar786 said:


> Bilkol karoga pehle ham sulabh shauchalaya[Public Restroom] ki jho kami hai woh puri karde tub dekhe ge Around 2050



Hows life treating you, young man ?


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## Sugarcane

Czar786 said:


> Maibaap aisha julom na karo sarkar Internet Hindooo tuh paglagaya hai  Aur panch salo se yeh Soniaji ki Sarkar ne khaple pe khapla kar ke hame nanga dar diye hai .



Bhai Karzai say bolo, main thori maang raha hon

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## Pandora

jha said:


> Some Anti-tank Missiles, artillery guns and some Akash should be a good start...



While you are at it why not hand them a nuke as well.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

smuhs1 said:


> While you are at it why not hand them a nuke as well.



They themselves are buying AT missiles ... face shortage of arty guns and akash is a short range missile... isnt even worth it...

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## Thirdfront

IA has extensive exposure to CI. Better thing is to negotiate with US to provide air support beyond and near to Af boundary, India can send boots to train AfArmy inside urban centers. US is unlike to completely refuse he request as any US withdrawal and talib return will embolden them so much that another 9/11 like situation will definitely re-occur. IMO, at least 20 years of stability is required in Af for rural level people to appreciate the fruits of democracy and peace. Of course, the boots need to be withdrawn if things do not work out (I know it is easy for me to say as I am not a "boot", but talib return in Af will be a disaster for India and other non sharia countries).


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## notsuperstitious

Nobody asked for troops, nobody wants to send troops. This self fulfilling cycle of paranoia and then using that to justify pakistan's interference in afghanistan must stop.

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## A1Kaid

Pres. Karzai can do what he likes and make whatever policy he wants for his country.

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## Cyberian

Come on now Indians, be brave and don't abandon your only ally in the region today. Remember what happened when India abandoned it's ally Sri Lanka back in 1987?



​

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## Yeti

Karzai & his cronies being so corrupt is the main reason why the Taliban have some support among the people. India needs to keep some level of communication open with the Taliban after 2014 as well as with the Northern Alliance along with Iran.

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## Meluhan

farhan_9909 said:


> ISI they will make hell for indians in there own country.


 ISI ......lol
you are only assuming , what if one terrorist attack on indian soil will leads to 100 strikes in all over pakistan ...tit for tat .. 
and i am damn sure ISI guys were tripping on afeem scored from hindu kush mountains when osama was getting HALAL by us forces


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## That Guy

Meluhan said:


> ISI ......lol
> you are only assuming , what if one terrorist attack on indian soil will leads to 100 strikes in all over pakistan ...tit for tat ..
> and i am damn sure ISI guys were tripping on afeem scored from hindu kush mountains when osama was getting HALAL by us forces



If that were true, the amount of times India has accused Pakistan of such a thing, you'd think that Pakistan would be a nuclear wasteland.

Don't get your hopes up 


-----

Anyways, Karzai has always requested lethal military aid to Afghanistan from India. India has always been reluctant, as they don't want to antagonize Pakistan, the simple reason being that if even one of those pieces of equipment falls into militant hands (as a lot of ANA hardware tend to get sold off on the black market by corrupt ANA soldiers), Pakistan can accuse them of sponsoring terrorists and point out "evidence" to prove their claim.

On the other hand, nothing India does is in the interest of Pakistan's future, no matter what anyone of those political and diplomatic fools claim. If India had a chance, it would break Pakistan into little pieces, but the feeling is mutual, so...yeah.... :|

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## illusion8

Areesh said:


> *But then again this scenario wasn't feasible and was not applied by India.* Exists only in the minds internet hindoos.
> 
> This is not 1971 and not every day is a sunday.



Of course, good that you believe in that

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## Anony

Czar786 said:


> What kind of weapon system we can provide to AF when all of our weapon are imported and very expensive and who is going to pay for it ?



Arjun mk1, Akash - SAM and few artilleries. That will suffice. I was even thinking of Prahaar missile. Indian Army not finding a space to induct, give it to Afganistan. 180km range of it will suffice.

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## That Guy

Yeti said:


> Karzai & his cronies being so corrupt is the main reason why the Taliban have some support among the people. India needs to keep some level of communication open with the Taliban after 2014 as well as with the Northern Alliance along with Iran.



India has never had any sort of communication with the Taliban, and it likely never will. Not saying that they aren't capable, it's just that any link with the Taliban will make them look bad, if discovered.

Northern Alliance is dead, and has been replaced by the current Afghan government which is filled with former Northern Alliance groups. If the Afghan gov falls, then it's all over for Afghanistan for another 30 years.

In the end, Pakistan will suffer. No matter who comes to power, Pakistan will be scapegoated. The Afghan gov survives, they accuse Pakistan for supporting the Taliban and create instability in the tribal regions. Taliban comes to power, they accuse Pakistan of supporting NATO forces in Afghanistan and launch terrorist attacks in Pakistan.

No matter who wins, Pakistan will end up being a scapegoat.

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## Goodbye!

That Guy said:


> No matter who wins, Pakistan will end up being a scapegoat.



Happens often when you switch sides depending on the convenience of the day.

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## That Guy

cb7bs2 said:


> Happens often when you switch sides depending on the convenience of the day.



Not about switching sides, even if we stayed out of this entire conflict, Pakistan would still get blamed. Don't pretend otherwise.


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## Goodbye!

That Guy said:


> Not about switching sides, even if we stayed out of this entire conflict, Pakistan would still get blamed. Don't pretend otherwise.



Had you chosen not to join what was essentially America's war, after their "friendly" overtures, you would not have an alienated populace in the Pakistani Taliban. This is no pretense, just fact.

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## Digital Soldier

Yeti said:


> Karzai & his cronies being so corrupt is the main reason why the Taliban have some support among the people. India needs to keep some level of communication open with the Taliban after 2014 as well as with the Northern Alliance along with Iran.



Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters. 
Taliban have support among Afghans, its a completely false narrative. Very few people understand it.

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## Harmonia Dragon

sell to
afghan tejas & arjun..................


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## muse

Karzai needs the help - but does or will the US approve? I think Mr. Karzai may have jumped the gun if you will, He has not signed the SOFA yet, but he ultimately will have to -- and if he does leave to up to parliament, the US may end up getting what it needs to.

What does India get from passing on lethal aid and/or even troops on the ground? - lets, for sake of discussion, agree that the US will not stand in the way of the Indians deciding for themselves, what do the Indians get from this? How might the Pakistanis and "other" regional powers respond to this?

It is said that the international system is best understood in terms of capabilities nations bring to the global stage --- Can an Indian decision to funnel lethal aid and/or boots on the ground be possible without the assistance of Iran (ChahBahar)???


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## karan.1970

Aeronaut said:


> @karan.1970
> 
> Afghanistan is your *only* true ally


Not true 



Aeronaut said:


> ,it would be unfair if you don't extend the help they so desperately need.


We have and will continue to help Afghanistan, but not the way Pakistan wants us to 



Areesh said:


> As I said. Always preferable than being occupied by foreign troops. Comprehension issues???



 agreed that it may be preferable, but do you think its acceptable 





Areesh said:


> That so.


When was India occupied by foreign troops ?

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## notorious_eagle

I would personally welcome Indian Military presence in Afghanistan. India has already flushed Anti Pakistani groups operating in Afghanistan with money and weapons, boots on the ground will go far to protect those groups and keep Karzai's Government intact Post 2014. Even Karzai knows that he has no future in Afghanistan Post 2014 once the Americans pack up and leave, it appears that only sincere commitment from India can save his regime. It would be wonderful if the Indians make a serious effort and protect their investment in Afghanistan, because if they don't put boots on the ground it will likely go to waste.



Digital Soldier said:


> Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters.
> Taliban have support among Afghans, its a completely false narrative. Very few people understand it.



Is that why they control most of your country, some estimates suggest that they control more than 60% of your country. There is no way they can control this amount of territory and operate for this long against the world's mightiest military if they did not enjoy local support.

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## somebozo

Two solutions for Afghanistan.

1. Pakistan should annex the Pashtun majority parts while Tajik and Uzbeck majorities should be encouraged to join their respective countries.

2. Pakistan should build a giant fence on Af-Pak border manned by automatic guns shooting any intruder in range.



notorious_eagle said:


> I would personally welcome Indian Military presence in Afghanistan. India has already flushed Anti Pakistani groups operating in Afghanistan with money and weapons, boots on the ground will go far to protect those groups and keep Karzai's Government intact Post 2014. Even Karzai knows that he has no future in Afghanistan Post 2014 once the Americans pack up and leave, it appears that only sincere commitment from India can save his regime. It would be wonderful if the Indians make a serious effort and protect their investment in Afghanistan, because if they don't put boots on the ground it will likely go to waste.
> 
> 
> 
> Is that why they control most of your country, some estimates suggest that they control more than 60% of your country. There is no way they can control this amount of territory and operate for this long against the world's mightiest military if they did not enjoy local support.

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## notorious_eagle

somebozo said:


> Two solutions for Afghanistan.
> 
> 1. Pakistan should annex the Pashtun majority parts while Tajik and Uzbeck majorities should be encouraged to join their respective countries.
> 
> *2. Pakistan should build a giant fence on Af-Pak border manned by automatic guns shooting any intruder in range.*



I would prefer the second solution, and if the Afghans continue with their shenanigans we might as well implement this solution. Pakistan is slowly moving towards this option, we are already strengthening our presence of PA and FC on our Western borders. We are building bunkers and check posts, very soon we might as well put up fences and mine the entire border. We have hundreds and thousands of land mines in our surplus stocks, lets put them to good use.

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## Digital Soldier

notorious_eagle said:


> Is that why they control most of your country, some estimates suggest that they control more than 60% of your country. There is no way they can control this amount of territory and operate for this long against the world's mightiest military if they did not enjoy local support.



Nobody support Taliban and mullahs anymore. 60% Taliban control idea is just your fantasy that makes you live happily for a moment.


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## somebozo

notorious_eagle said:


> I would prefer the second solution, and if the Afghans continue with their shenanigans we might as well implement this solution. Pakistan is slowly moving towards this option, we are already strengthening our presence of PA and FC on our Western borders. We are building bunkers and check posts, very soon we might as well put up fences and mine the entire border. We have hundreds and thousands of land mines in our surplus stocks, lets put them to good use.



Pakistani population is a wimp and likes to be lead by strong rhetoric leader even if he will lead them to abyss with his BS. Think Jinnah for example who founded the country, Bhutto who destroyed its economy and Mard e Momin Zia ul Haq who set it on fire...It is a nation where Hitler will love to born again.

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## itachiii

jha said:


> Some Anti-tank Missiles, artillery guns and some Akash should be a good start...



the afghan army have to fight taiban .... and how would anti-tank missiles and akash hep them ??


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## Mitro

Karzai [Clown] Don't take him seriously He is only good for Entertainment  
But wait i guess We do take him seriously 



LoveIcon said:


> Bhai Karzai say bolo, main thori maang raha hon



Alhamdulillah No complain bro 



Armstrong said:


> Hows life treating you, young man ?

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## jha

itachiii said:


> the afghan army have to fight taiban .... and how would anti-tank missiles and akash hep them ??



I was not talking about their fight with Talibans.. They dont need much help in fighting them.. Anti-tank missiles and Akash will help them in fighting other interested forces..

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## Sugarcane

muse said:


> Karzai needs the help - but does or will the US approve? I think Mr. Karzai may have jumped the gun if you will, He has not signed the SOFA yet, but he ultimately will have to -- and if he does leave to up to parliament, the US may end up getting what it needs to.
> 
> What does India get from passing on lethal aid and/or even troops on the ground? - lets, for sake of discussion, agree that the US will not stand in the way of the Indians deciding for themselves, what do the Indians get from this? How might the Pakistanis and "other" regional powers respond to this?
> 
> It is said that the international system is best understood in terms of capabilities nations bring to the global stage --- Can an Indian decision to funnel lethal aid and/or boots on the ground be possible without the assistance of Iran (ChahBahar)???



Some more points - Just like India enjoys leverage on Iran because she is her customer for oil, China has upper hand because she is buying more oil and giving most of payment in US$ and also providing technology products which are banned, and assisting Iran to evade sanctions. So - Will China be happy with Indian influence more than threshold? And will Iran allow that Afghanistan get access to lethal weapons considering that Afghanistan have large number of Pashtuns who are more inclined towards KSA? They also have some disputes on water as well. 

Re Pakistan - That will be raise concern but on other hand IF India put troops on ground than she will try to divert TTP (or some groups of it) towards India.

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## SQ8

Making such statements, Karzai may be emboldened by the recent disarray in the Taliban leadership.

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## illusion8

That Guy said:


> *India has never had any sort of communication with the Taliban,* and it likely never will. Not saying that they aren't capable, it's just that any link with the Taliban will make them look bad, if discovered.



Cannot be certain of that, there haven't been any attacks on Indian interests in Afghanistan after the ISI sponsored Haqqani attack on Indian consulates way back, wonder if there's any truce on the ground - just a thought.

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## Areesh

karan.1970 said:


> agreed that it may be preferable, but do you think its acceptable



Not acceptable. But if we have to choose between our own army and the foreign troops, then my choice always would be my own troops.



> When was India occupied by foreign troops ?



Well weren't you occupied by mughals and british? India used to exist for thousands of years according to Indians here.

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## somebozo

In other words Karzai wants to switch masters from USA and Europe to India.
No suprise he will soon start bidding for Iran as well!

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## That Guy

illusion8 said:


> Cannot be certain of that, there haven't been any attacks on Indian interests in Afghanistan after the ISI sponsored Haqqani attack on Indian consulates way back, wonder if there's any truce on the ground - just a thought.



No evidence that the ISI was involved in the attack on the Indian consulate. The reason why there hasn't been attacks on Indian interests in Afghanistan may have more to do with good security rather than a link between the two...Unless you're admitting that the Indians have influence with the Taliban that no one knows about.



cb7bs2 said:


> Had you chosen not to join what was essentially America's war, after their "friendly" overtures, you would not have an alienated populace in the Pakistani Taliban. This is no pretense, just fact.



The Pakistani Taliban didn't exist until 2007, so you can't be right about that. I do admit that joining the war did help foster resentment, but the Pakistani Taliban didn't exist back then.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that Pakistan would still have been blamed regardless.

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## That Guy

Digital Soldier said:


> Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters.
> Taliban have support among Afghans, its a completely false narrative. Very few people understand it.



The fact that the Taliban draw mainly from Kandahar and control everything but the major cities in Afghanistan proves that they have support among the local population. You continuing to blame the ISI without evidence is nothing more than denying facts and living in a fantasy.

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## CaptainJackSparrow

Aeronaut said:


> What stops you?...maybe you don't have what it takes to do that,or your nation is impotent to carry out such a venture...,or maybe your generals are a little less stupid than a bhaarthi troll on the web?



Ahem...Our Generals don't control our nukes.


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## Wood

India is the largest importer of arms. I don't see how we will be able to support Afghanistan with military aid in any substantial way.


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## VeeraBhadra

That Guy said:


> No evidence that the ISI was involved in the attack on the Indian consulate. The reason why there hasn't been attacks on Indian interests in Afghanistan may have more to do with good security rather than a link between the two...Unless you're admitting that the Indians have influence with the Taliban that no one knows about.


Indian interests and Indian development projects are guarded by para-military forces of India itself,so you can say that Indian boots are already there in Afghanistan protecting and serving our interests.But yes there has not been even attempted attacks,so............


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## DESERT FIGHTER

somebozo said:


> Pakistani population is a wimp and likes to be lead by strong rhetoric leader even if he will lead them to abyss with his BS. Think Jinnah for example who founded the country, Bhutto who destroyed its economy and Mard e Momin Zia ul Haq who set it on fire...It is a nation where Hitler will love to born again.



If wish we had a leader like hitler (just less paranoid).. rest i agree with you..



Digital Soldier said:


> Nobody support Taliban and mullahs anymore. 60% Taliban control idea is just your fantasy that makes you live happily for a moment.



Than how are the taliban surviving with NATO and ur mighty NA on their arse? do they have magic wands or something?

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## karan.1970

Areesh said:


> Not acceptable. But if we have to choose between our own army and the foreign troops, then my choice always would be my own troops.



Sure.. The flip side though is that you cant even fight against them..





Areesh said:


> Well weren't you occupied by mughals and british? India used to exist for thousands of years according to Indians here.


Ah! so you do believe that India existed before 1947 ? Unlike a lot of your brethren here that believe that India and Pakistan both came into existence in 1947 and there was no entity called united India before that


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## That Guy

VeeraBhadra said:


> Indian interests and Indian development projects are guarded by para-military forces of India itself,so you can say that Indian boots are already there in Afghanistan protecting and serving our interests.But yes there has not been even attempted attacks,so............



Again, that could be more about security rather than Indian influence.

Maybe there have not been attempted attacks because the Taliban don't want even more foreigners in Afghanistan. Indian boots are only there to protect Indian workers and Indian related projects, not to fight war, and I think the Taliban understand that much.

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## bdslph

Indian RAW will be interested 
but troops there will be a big opposition from indian people as US and NATO troops are dying they cannot defend even they have more advance staff
Indians will die more and there will be more hate to Indian

Better stuck with the lethal weapons

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## OrionHunter

Lethal weapons? Even nukes?? 

Seriously, we don't need to get physically involved in Afghanistan by sending troops out there. It's a bad, bad idea!


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## DESERT FIGHTER

OrionHunter said:


> Lethal weapons? Even nukes??
> 
> Seriously, we don't need to get physically involved in Afghanistan by sending troops out there. It's a bad, bad idea!



Why man? arent afghans supposed to be ur best friends and all?

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## OrionHunter

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> Why man? arent afghans supposed to be ur best friends and all?


Best friends maybe, but that doesn't mean we go and share their bed and get screwed in the process! (Pun unintended!!)


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## Digital Soldier

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> If wish we had a leader like hitler (just less paranoid).. rest i agree with you..
> 
> Than how are the taliban surviving with NATO and ur mighty NA on their arse? do they have magic wands or something?



Good question. They force people to feed them in their houses, claiming to be ****** and fighting for Islam  and on some occasions the civilian residences come under airstrike because of this. Most of the Taliban involved in insurgency are foreigners. They do not have support among people in villages, they always force people and operate by force. This is a vast mountainous country, insurgents hide in mountains, its not Iraq scenario. People do not like them because they are deadly fools.


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## Digital Soldier

That Guy said:


> The fact that the Taliban draw mainly from Kandahar and control everything but the major cities in Afghanistan proves that they have support among the local population. You continuing to blame the ISI without evidence is nothing more than denying facts and living in a fantasy.



Even people in rural areas now believe and understand the problems, they call insurgents, the ISI dogs. please stop this prove and evidence logic. Main stream media knows this, cyber space is full of it, the whole world knows it. Our government presented tonnes evidence to Pakistani government, and asked them to stop the double game.

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## Beerbal

somebozo said:


> In other words Karzai wants to switch masters from USA and Europe to India.
> No suprise he will soon start bidding for Iran as well!





Read between the lines... The statement is not as simple as it seems...


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## Digital Soldier

*India to discuss Afghanistan&#8217;s demand on supply of military equipments*





Indian officials on Saturday announced New Delhi&#8217;s willingess to &#8220;discuss and respond&#8221; to specific requests by Afghan government regarding supply of lethal weapons to Afghan security forces.

The demand to supply lethal and non-lethal weapons to Afghan security forces was raised publicy by Afghan envoy to India, however, New Delhi insisted that such discussions will be held through proper channels.

Afghan ambassador to India, Shaida M Abdali on Thursday said that president Hamid Karzai will visit India to hold talks on bileral issues including enhanced defense cooperation of India to Afghanistan.

According to reports India has supplied only non-lethal military equipments to Afghan security forces since the two nations singed a long term strategic cooperation agreement.

While speaking during a media briefing, Union External Affairs Ministry spokesperson Syed Akbaruddin said, the two countries had mechanisms available to address all issues.

Syed Akbaruddin quoted by The New Indian Express said, &#8220;Our view is that there is a mechanism available, and within our modest means as a developing country, we will continue to discuss and respond to specific requests from the Afghan government.&#8221;

He said, &#8220;There are diplomatic channels available and we will consider these (requests) as and when they are raised in the channels available.&#8221;

He also noted that the SP pact is implemented by the SPA council, chaired by the foreign ministers.

Under this agreement, there are four rubrics, including those for political and security consultations.

President Hamid Karzai is due to visit India on a two day tour from 20 to 22 May.


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## Secur

Alright , what exactly is it in the lethal weapons category that the Indians can provide to Afghans when they buy even the simple ammo from Russians ? 

I can better understand it if he's asking for " direct military intervention " which is a bad idea from the past experiences . Maybe " finances " for buying those weapons but again , he will have enough money from the EU and Americans for that .

Earning hostility with Islamabad will not help Afghanistan a little bit , but further worsen the situation specially when the coalition is packing its bags , tired of the decade old campaign and no deal has been negotiated with the militants yet .

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## Amaa'n

Digital Soldier said:


> Even people in rural areas now believe and understand the problems, they call insurgents, the ISI dogs. please stop this prove and evidence logic. Main stream media knows this, cyber space is full of it, the whole world knows it. *Our government presented tonnes evidence to Pakistani government, and asked them to stop the double game*.


Our Pakistani leaders are too impotent, they are always busy with their own money making sh!t, do us all a favor and once for all file a case against ISI/ PA in Internation Court, present the evidence and get done with this all for once.

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> Alright , what exactly is it in the lethal weapons category that the Indians can provide to Afghans when they buy even the simple ammo from Russians ?
> 
> I can better understand it if he's asking for " direct military intervention " which is a bad idea from the past experiences . Maybe " finances " for buying those weapons but again , he will have enough money from the EU and Americans for that .
> 
> Earning hostility with Islamabad will not help Afghanistan a little bit , but further worsen the situation specially when the coalition is packing its bags , tired of the decade old campaign and no deal has been negotiated with the militants yet .



The government is fighting an insurgency. How can this mean hostility with Islamabad, talk sense man...


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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> The government is fighting an insurgency. How can this mean hostility with Islamabad, talk sense man...


_
We want Indian troops on Afghan soil - Mayor Of Kabul_ 

What is it , if not seeking hostility with Pakistan ? You think that would be acceptable to us ?

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> _
> We want Indian troops on Afghan soil - Mayor Of Kabul_
> 
> What is it , if not seeking hostility with Pakistan ? You think that would be acceptable to us ?



Pakistan is already considered a hostile country. How it will bother Pakistan, nobody gives a damn sh!t. Somebody corrupt-programmed you about the idea of Indians in Afghan soil. There are lots of religious morons still alive here, they don't like such thing and Karzai never said that, he is afraid of Mullahs

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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Pakistan is already considered a hostile country. How it will bother Pakistan, nobody gives a damn sh!t. Somebody corrupt-programmed you about the idea that of Indians in Afghan soil. There are lots of religious morons still alive here, they don't like such thing and Karzai never said that, he is afraid of Mullahs



Yes indeed and how exactly has it benefited you since the beginning of the animosity in '47 is also well known , right ?  Actually , everyone who knows the influence of Pakistan in your country , gives a darn about it . Bonn Summit and Chicago conference did not fail for no reason when we chose not to participate . 

Nobody programmed me , kiddo , Mr Karzai indicated that he wouldn't mind the Indian troops on his soil , now knowing the Indians they aren't such fools to accept that offer , but still your mayor isn't sending a good message across the border when he's already considered a person who works against the Pakistani interests .

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> Yes indeed and how exactly has it benefited you since the beginning of the animosity in '47 is also well known , right ?  Actually , everyone who knows the influence of Pakistan in your country , gives a darn about it . Bonn Summit and Chicago conference did not fail for no reason when we chose not to participate .
> 
> Nobody programmed me , kiddo , Mr Karzai indicated that he wouldn't mind the Indian troops on his soil , now knowing the Indians they aren't such fools to accept that offer , but still your mayor isn't sending a good message across the border when he's already considered a person who works against the Pakistani interests .



Do you have any respectful source about what Kazai said? I don't think so. I already mentioned this pakistani title: Karzai to ask for lethal weapons, won't mind Indian troops on Afghan soil is baseless, likely to be approved by a foool editor. and this sh!t programmed you now and you are arguing with me.


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## somebozo

Secur said:


> _
> We want Indian troops on Afghan soil - Mayor Of Kabul_
> 
> What is it , if not seeking hostility with Pakistan ? You think that would be acceptable to us ?



There is a reason why Pashtuns of Pakistan look down upon Afghanistan.

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## Digital Soldier

somebozo said:


> There is a reason why Pashtuns of Pakistan look down upon Afghanistan.



You should watch peshawari movies, khybar tv, pakistani peshawari special dances


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## That Guy

Digital Soldier said:


> Even people in rural areas now believe and understand the problems, they call insurgents, the ISI dogs. please stop this prove and evidence logic. Main stream media knows this, cyber space is full of it, the whole world knows it. Our government presented tonnes evidence to Pakistani government, and asked them to stop the double game.



Keep living in a dream world, and your body will starve.

Your government also takes money from the CIA and Iran, so you shouldn't put much faith into their words.

If they have evidence, why has no one ever seen it? Because it doesn't exist.

Remember, your government also accused the Americans of helping the Taliban. This proves that your government is filled with nothing more than paranoid anti-Pakistani warlords, who don't give a crap about Afghanistan and only care about their money wallets.

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## Areesh

karan.1970 said:


> Sure.. The flip side though is that you cant even fight against them..



Obviously. I won't fight my own soldiers. Same would go for you too.



> Ah! so you do believe that India existed before 1947 ? Unlike a lot of your brethren here that believe that India and Pakistan both came into existence in 1947 and there was no entity called united India before that



Even I don't believe India existed before 15 August 1947. But then again if we analyze common Indian perception what I said comes in mind.

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## Die Hard

AUz said:


> ISI will bury indians/ANA/Karzai alive in Afghan mountains...
> 
> Karzai knows it already...Without U.S/NATO, these retards are nothing more than a pack of card on the edge of a mountain during a windy day...



You are such a big mouth. We have been fucked day in and day out from last 10 yrs and you are praising ISI here. What ISI has done in last 15 yrs other than supporting Haqanis or Afghan Taliban ? What we have got out of it ? We are into this mess bcoz of ISI and Army.


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## Cheetah786

joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.



Not at all at least indians made nukes dropping on India via Indian made missiles cant be traced back to pakistan.

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## joekrish

Cheetah786 said:


> Not at all at least indians made nukes dropping on India via Indian made missiles cant be traced back to pakistan.



Dont worry this is going to get strapped on a man with a donkey and is sure to hit the target.


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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Do you have any respectful source about what Kazai said? I don't think so. I already mentioned this pakistani title: Karzai to ask for lethal weapons, won't mind Indian troops on Afghan soil is baseless, likely to be approved by a foool editor. and this sh!t programmed you now and you are arguing with me.



You are more than free to post that respectful source's link , nobody's stopping you ! 

In the meantime , we will comment on the article/thread at hand .

_ "India and Afghanistan are facing very similar situation. *India's military engagement in Afghanistan is a requirement.* It is not a choice that someone has to make, but it is an imperative," Abdali said.
_
Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...elp-shaida-mohammad-abdali.html#ixzz2Tl6NjRRT

_ Afghan President Hamid Karzai is visiting New Delhi May 20-22 and *the issue of stationing of Indian troops is likely to be discussed*, said an official of the Indian External Affairs Ministry._

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-...-ground-forces-afghanistan.html#ixzz2Tl9JX4jX

Pakistani one haven't twisted the meanings , they have merely hinted at the agenda of Mr.Karzai's visit next week to India and seeing the recent statement of the ambassador in that view and those coming out of New Dehli , seems more than true what he's gonna request . Timing is important , if you even remotely understand these matters .

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## Cheetah786

joekrish said:


> Don't worry this is going to get strapped on a man with a donkey and is sure to hit the target.



Well since you are going to supply the delivery system. I take it donkey delivery was adopted after DARDO made designs failed 



> joekrish=Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems

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## joekrish

Cheetah786 said:


> Well since you are going to supply the delivery system. I take it donkey delivery was adopted after DARDO made designs failed


No doubt, I did make a statement about supplying them with the delivery system but what is the harm in using the jv systems built by you and them when it is cost effective.


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## Cheetah786

joekrish said:


> No doubt, I did make a statement about supplying them with the delivery system but what is the harm in using the jv systems built by you and them when it is cost effective.






> joekrish=Would it hurt to give him few nukes and *delivery systems *





> Originally Posted by joekrish View Post *Don't worry this is going to get strapped on a man with a donkey and is sure to hit the target*.





joekrish said:


> No doubt, I did make a statement about supplying them with the delivery system but what is the harm in using the jv systems built by you and them when it is cost effective.



The above statements says it all

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## joekrish

Cheetah786 said:


> The above statements says it all




Agreed, the above statement says it all.


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## karan.1970

Areesh said:


> Even I don't believe India existed before 15 August 1947. But then again if we analyze common Indian perception what I said comes in mind.



But it was you assertion that India was occupied by foreign forces .. 

Any port in the storm ? eh ??


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## Yeti

That Guy said:


> *India has never had any sort of communication with the Taliban*, and it likely never will. Not saying that they aren't capable, it's just that any link with the Taliban will make them look bad, if discovered.
> 
> Northern Alliance is dead, and has been replaced by the current Afghan government which is filled with former Northern Alliance groups. If the Afghan gov falls, then it's all over for Afghanistan for another 30 years.
> 
> In the end, Pakistan will suffer. No matter who comes to power, Pakistan will be scapegoated. The Afghan gov survives, they accuse Pakistan for supporting the Taliban and create instability in the tribal regions. Taliban comes to power, they accuse Pakistan of supporting NATO forces in Afghanistan and launch terrorist attacks in Pakistan.
> 
> No matter who wins, Pakistan will end up being a scapegoat.




Actually we have had some communication with them because the Indian security establishment had to learn a painful lesson in the past with the Kandahar Indian Airlines hijacking and there is talk of expanding that dialogue further which would be a wise thing to do by our intelligence.



Pakistan should try to work closer with the Afghan government to improve relations and the SCO could be a platform in which all regional countries can try to find the best solution post NATO 2014



Digital Soldier said:


> Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters.
> Taliban have support among Afghans, its a completely false narrative. Very few people understand it.




I really hope that is the case and the figure is as low as that.


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## That Guy

Yeti said:


> Actually we have had some communication with them because the Indian security establishment had to learn a painful lesson in the past with the Kandahar Indian Airlines hijacking and there is talk of expanding that dialogue further which would be a wise thing to do by our intelligence.
> 
> 
> 
> Pakistan should try to work closer with the Afghan government to improve relations and the SCO could be a platform in which all regional countries can try to find the best solution post NATO 2014
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I really hope that is the case and the figure is as low as that.



until SCO actually accepts Pakistan as a full member, I don't think the organization should be involved. If you're talking about individual countries, then sure.

Pakistan has tried to improve relations with the government, including offers to train and equip their security forces, but because the ANA is majority Northern Alliance, the ANA has forced the Afghan gov to take a anti-Pakistan stance.

As for India having some communication, a one time thing doesn't mean full on contacts. It's would also be against Indian interest, simply because if Pakistan finds out about them, Pakistan would have a field day by saying that RAW is supporting the Taliban, regardless of what the Indians are actually doing.

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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Nobody support Taliban and mullahs anymore. 60% Taliban control idea is just your fantasy that makes you live happily for a moment.



Actually , there are reports from the International media telling us exactly how much of Afghanistan do the Taliban control with figures as high as 72% even now despite the decade old campaign and trillions of dollars spent and a million soldiers committed !

Want me to post it for you ? 



Digital Soldier said:


> Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters.



Then , how exactly do they control the majority parts of your country ? 

In what universe and in what alternate reality , are the Taliban fighting in your country some people from the tribal areas of Pakistan , because its an historical fact that the movement rose up in Afghanistan in '94 from the remnants of the Mujahideen who defeated U.S.S.R. in the 80's , what are you smoking to claim that all Afghan Taliban are actually Pakistani , kiddo ?

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> Gift of any kind of lethal chemical and biological by india would be greatly appreciated by Afghan nation...we share a common enemy



Trust me , your sorry excuse country of a country wouldn't even be left to exist if you try anything like that with the help of anyone because we will make sure that already in stone age Afghanistan becomes a nuclear wasteland for thousands of years if any such thing happens  .

Be careful what you wish for and learn to contribute anything positive to the thread .

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## karan.1970

Afghan Prince said:


> Gift of any kind of lethal chemical and biological by india would be greatly appreciated by Afghan nation...we share a common enemy



Sorry, but India does not deal in Banned weapons


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## karan.1970

Icewolf said:


> Breaking News: India uses chemical weapons on Kashmiri population!!!



Banned weapons ?? Evidence ?


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## Icewolf

karan.1970 said:


> Banned weapons ?? Evidence ?



Chemical weapons were first tested in a remote village in Northern Kashmir and Indian govt did its best to conceal this.. Date was 1985 when Kashmiri militants were hitting back hard in Kashmir and India became desperate..
India tested it on that village, rest is history...
Now Indians has stopped testing after Pakistan got to know about the matter..
Pakistan govt didnt do anything cuz they were too busy funding militants to fight in kashmir.
As you know, media is extremely censored in IOK.

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## karan.1970

Icewolf said:


> Chemical weapons were first tested in a remote village in Northern Kashmir and Indian govt did its best to conceal this.. Date was 1985 when Kashmiri militants were hitting back hard in Kashmir and India became desperate..
> India tested it on that village, rest is history...
> Now Indians has stopped testing after Pakistan got to know about the matter..
> Pakistan govt didnt do anything cuz they were too busy funding militants to fight in kashmir.
> As you know, media is extremely censored in IOK.



And this retro nonsensical blabber is considered evidence ..?


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## Icewolf

karan.1970 said:


> And this retro nonsensical blabber is considered evidence ..?



Its not blabber I got confirmation from a Kashmiri


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## Abhishek_

Icewolf said:


> Its not blabber I got confirmation from a Kashmiri


oh wow, i can't imagine how we can refute that now. you win

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## ExtraOdinary

Icewolf said:


> Its not blabber I got confirmation from a Kashmiri



Indian govt. using chemical weapons . Interesting, do tell more


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## ejaz007

joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.



He will sell these to Pakistan in return for his own safety guarantee.

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## INDIC

Secur said:


> Then , how exactly do they control the majority parts of your country ?
> 
> In what universe and in what alternate reality , are the Taliban fighting in your country some people from the tribal areas of Pakistan , because its an historical fact that the movement rose up in Afghanistan in '94 from the remnants of the Mujahideen who defeated U.S.S.R. in the 80's , what are you smoking to claim that all Afghan Taliban are actually Pakistani , kiddo ?



Watch this video, Afghans are talking about your Punjabis and people from Karachi in Taliban ranks.


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## joekrish

ejaz007 said:


> He will sell these to Pakistan in return for his own safety guarantee.



Day dreaming?


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## ejaz007

joekrish said:


> Day dreaming?



Afghans are very good scrap dealers. Whenever they get their hands on a large quantity they run to Pakistan for a deal.

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> You are more than free to post that respectful source's link , nobody's stopping you !
> 
> In the meantime , we will comment on the article/thread at hand .
> 
> _ "India and Afghanistan are facing very similar situation. *India's military engagement in Afghanistan is a requirement.* It is not a choice that someone has to make, but it is an imperative," Abdali said.
> _
> Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian...elp-shaida-mohammad-abdali.html#ixzz2Tl6NjRRT
> 
> _ Afghan President Hamid Karzai is visiting New Delhi May 20-22 and *the issue of stationing of Indian troops is likely to be discussed*, said an official of the Indian External Affairs Ministry._
> 
> Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-...-ground-forces-afghanistan.html#ixzz2Tl9JX4jX
> 
> Pakistani one haven't twisted the meanings , they have merely hinted at the agenda of Mr.Karzai's visit next week to India and seeing the recent statement of the ambassador in that view and those coming out of New Dehli , seems more than true what he's gonna request . Timing is important , if you even remotely understand these matters .



I understand it took you hours to find those links. The topics discuss Indian prospective and probability about deploying troops on the ground, again Karzai never said that. Having good relations with countries like India is good for our country. If we had good honest relations with Pakistan it would be great for both nations but unfortunately Pakistan is deceptive, wants to play double game with us.


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## Hyperion

Chupp oye, dramaybaz Tajik. Afghanistan is gods gift to all Pashtuns, just like the promised land of Israel to the Jews. 



Afghan Prince said:


> Gift of any kind of lethal chemical and biological by india would be greatly appreciated by Afghan nation...we share a common enemy

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## arp2041

Afghan Prince said:


> Gift of any kind of lethal chemical and biological by india would be greatly appreciated by Afghan nation...we share a common enemy



Sorry, we are a signatory of UN's agreement on banning chemical & biological weapons.

So we don't have any.......Will Nuclear weapons suffice??


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## arp2041

ExtraOdinary said:


> Indian govt. using chemical weapons . Interesting, do tell more



How Many Times will i tell you???

It's Never GOI.......

It's Always -------> *RAW*

RAW is the Power Above the THRONE!!!

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> Actually , there are reports from the International media telling us exactly how much of Afghanistan do the Taliban control with figures as high as 72% even now despite the decade old campaign and trillions of dollars spent and a million soldiers committed !
> 
> Want me to post it for you ?
> 
> 
> Then , how exactly do they control the majority parts of your country ?
> 
> In what universe and in what alternate reality , are the Taliban fighting in your country some people from the tribal areas of Pakistan , because its an historical fact that the movement rose up in Afghanistan in '94 from the remnants of the Mujahideen who defeated U.S.S.R. in the 80's , what are you smoking to claim that all Afghan Taliban are actually Pakistani , kiddo ?



Ok kid, let me enlighten you with something, International media is not on the ground here, people are on the ground, my information came is directly from people, how can you believe international media always reflect the truth, a good example is Syria where international media support terrorists, that eat a dead Syrian soldier's heart and shout Allah O Akbar and then post the video in YouTube and the so-called international media support such criminals in war against Syrian civilians and government. 

The Taliban that you mentioned were eliminated by US in 2002-2003 and the newer version (suicide bombing) insurgency began in 2006 and still going on with new support infrastructure across the border.
My intention was not to argue with you, but to enlighten you with the facts but you still can continue your daydreaming if you want to.

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## SEAL

__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10151579261787510





Advanced Indian weaponry and Afghan interest in it can be really dangerous for Pakistan.

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## Hyperion

LOL... copying what your master says / his voice / dialogues, doesn't change who you are, your genetic makeup, or put you on an accelerated evolutionary path. Cheeky monkey. 




Afghan Prince said:


> Oh yes. Nuking Islamabad or lahore may become a necessary step if they become threat to the world peace.
> I think in any future indo-pak war Afghanistan should invade Pakistan from west , we missed the golden oppurtunities in 1965 and 1971, especially 1971 was the right time to completely distintegrate the artificial state of pakistan and make river indus the border between india and Afghanistan.

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## Hyperion

Dear son, I shall personally enjoy few hundred of your women as _maal-e-ghanemat_, post 2014. Either wait for the inevitable or migrate with your masters. 



Afghan Prince said:


> Pakistan is british creation. River indus should be the future border between india and Afghanistan..Its upto india whether to keep your punjab or not but we are definately going to extend our border upto indus river or even upto jehlum.

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## Badmash Sharif

Hyperion said:


> Dear son, I shall personally enjoy few hundred of your women as _maal-e-ghanemat_, post 2014. Either wait for the inevitable or migrate with your masters.



On the contrary, History is full of evidences of how afghani invaders killed, raped and forcefully converted millions of your unfortunate souls of the banks of Indus river. Most of todays pakistan including your forefathers (and foremothers) were maal-e-ganimat of Afghanis, the abdalis, ghaznavis, ghauris etc...

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## Digital Soldier

Yeti said:


> I really hope that is the case and the figure is as low as that.



In some provinces like Ghazni and Kandahar, even the civilians took arms against insurgents and cleaned their districts from Taliban. I can see minds are hearts are changing, and nothing is more important then this if we have to live from inside-out as a nation.

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## Hyperion

Dear dear.... I am no soldier..... I'm a Pushtun, true inheritance of Afghanistan lies with me, not your chinky Northern Alliance arse. 



Afghan Prince said:


> Do you know what happened to one of your brave soldier in kurram agency when he thought the girls there are for enjoyment and pleasure?

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## asad71

1. Firstly the Afghan Forn Ministry hasn't realized that "Abdali" is a name which still terrorizes Hindu Indians. They should have posted a man with another man as ambassador.

2. Afghans get bored easily without fighting. They would welcome Indians so that they can ambush and kill them, and raid to loot their camps. Hindus on the wrong side of the Hindu Kush - the Afghans would love the prospects.

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## Hyperion

LOL... you are talking to one of those people. Guess what? We have our allegiances with Republic of Pakistan. 

Please don't let the door hit you on your way out! 



Badmash Sharif said:


> On the contrary, History is full of evidences of how afghani invaders killed, raped and forcefully converted millions of your unfortunate souls of the banks of Indus river. Most of todays pakistan including your forefathers (and foremothers) were maal-e-ganimat of Afghanis, the abdalis, ghaznavis, ghauris etc...



Haye Allah. Sadkay ho jaon. Massa treated you bad today, angry much chinky boy? 



Afghan Prince said:


> So you are house negro of punjabis.

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## arp2041

Hyperion said:


> Dear son, I shall personally *enjoy few hundred of your women* as _maal-e-ghanemat_, post 2014. Either wait for the inevitable or migrate with your masters.



abey kitni pey rukega????


On Topic: 

I think we should help our Afghan brothers by fortifying there defences......

here's my Wishlist:

10 nukes.
4-5 Agni - V for delivering nukes.
1 squad Rafale.
1 squad super sukhoi
1 squad lca tejas mk2
make & launch an Afghani Spy sat Karzai-1.
4-5 UAV squad.
involve Afghanistan in every indegineous project.
1 Arihant class sub should function directly under the authority of Mr. Hamid Karzai (should be renamed ANS Karzai).
INS Virat should function directly under the Afghani command after decommissioning.

100+ Bofors
etc.

Ours is the friendship Higher than Mt. Everest & Deeper than Marina Trench.........

We are all weather Brothers (including Winter Season).

Long Live Indo-Afghani Partnership.

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## Hyperion

LOL.. last time when I told you about 4 wives, i forgot to tell you about women in maal-e-ghanemat. Now let me enlighten you about that as well. Well, simple. There is no limit on that. It's all kosher! 

Wanna convert? Contact Dr. Hypey... 


On topic: Yes, yes please give all those to the Afghans. My wish list for BD and Sri Lanka:

20 nukes, 200kT each, with short range cruise missiles, to both nations. 

Long live tit-for-tat. 



arp2041 said:


> abey kitni pey rukega????
> 
> 
> On Topic:
> 
> I think we should help our Afghan brothers by fortifying there defences......
> 
> here's my Wishlist:
> 
> 10 nukes.
> 4-5 Agni - V for delivering nukes.
> 1 squad Rafale.
> 1 squad super sukhoi
> 1 squad lca tejas mk2
> make & launch an Afghani Spy sat Karzai-1.
> 4-5 UAV squad.
> involve Afghanistan in every indegineous project.
> 1 Arihant class sub should function directly under the authority of Mr. Hamid Karzai (should be renamed ANS Karzai).
> INS Virat should function directly under the Afghani command after decommissioning.
> 
> 100+ Bofors
> etc.
> 
> Ours is the friendship Higher than Mt. Everest & Deeper than Marina Trench.........
> 
> We are all weather Brothers (including Winter Season).
> 
> Long Live Indo-Afghani Partnership.

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## arp2041

Hyperion said:


> LOL.. last time when I told you about 4 wives, i forgot to tell you about women in maal-e-ghanemat. Now let me enlighten you about that as well. Well, simple. There is no limit on that. It's all kosher!
> 
> Wanna convert? Contact Dr. Hypey...
> 
> 
> On topic: Yes, yes please give all those to the Afghans. My wish list for BD and Sri Lanka:
> 
> 20 nukes, 200kT each, with short range cruise missiles, to both nations.
> 
> Long live tit-for-tat.



abey tu janta nahi hai......we are RUNNING the BD govt.

Nothing shall pass onto BD without our Consent.

For Lanka.....TRY IT 

We are also in process to setting up Lankan Dalals there.

So no Tit for Tat (oops it sounds NAUGHTY ) will work here

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## Beerbal

arp2041 said:


> abey kitni pey rukega????
> 
> 
> On Topic:
> 
> I think we should help our Afghan brothers by fortifying there defences......
> 
> here's my Wishlist:
> 
> 10 nukes.
> 4-5 Agni - V for delivering nukes.
> 1 squad Rafale.
> 1 squad super sukhoi
> 1 squad lca tejas mk2
> make & launch an Afghani Spy sat Karzai-1.
> 4-5 UAV squad.
> involve Afghanistan in every indegineous project.
> 1 Arihant class sub should function directly under the authority of Mr. Hamid Karzai (should be renamed ANS Karzai).
> INS Virat should function directly under the Afghani command after decommissioning.
> 
> 100+ Bofors
> etc.
> 
> Ours is the friendship Higher than Mt. Everest & Deeper than Marina Trench.........
> 
> We are all weather Brothers (including Winter Season).
> 
> Long Live Indo-Afghani Partnership.







Why are u scaring Pakistani...?


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## BeyondHeretic

you mean Israeli weapons , lethal?

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## uzair ramay

karzai is such a donkey.....

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## arp2041

Beerbal said:


> Why are u scaring Pakistani...?



According to them these are FAILED weapons & Afghanistan is a FAILED state.......

So, FAILED WEAPONS + FAILED STATE = COMPLETE BLUNDER (so no worries).

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## Hyperion

Bhawawawawawawawawawawawawawawawawawawa...... 



Afghan Prince said:


> Its disturbing to see my *lar Afghans as brainwashed servants of punjabis and suffering from low self esteem*, they need to be liberated.

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## Bayonet

Afghan Prince said:


> Its disturbing to see my lar Afghans as brainwashed servants of punjabis and suffering from low self esteem, they need to be liberated.



I also thinks so, Karzai has stated very recently that Talibans should attack Pakistan.

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## Parul

arp2041 said:


> abey kitni pey rukega????
> 
> 
> On Topic:
> 
> I think we should help our Afghan brothers by fortifying there defences......
> 
> here's my Wishlist:
> 
> 10 nukes.
> 4-5 Agni - V for delivering nukes.
> 1 squad Rafale.
> 1 squad super sukhoi
> 1 squad lca tejas mk2
> make & launch an Afghani Spy sat Karzai-1.
> 4-5 UAV squad.
> involve Afghanistan in every indegineous project.
> 1 Arihant class sub should function directly under the authority of Mr. Hamid Karzai (should be renamed ANS Karzai).
> INS Virat should function directly under the Afghani command after decommissioning.
> 
> 100+ Bofors
> etc.
> 
> Ours is the friendship Higher than Mt. Everest & Deeper than Marina Trench.........
> 
> We are all weather Brothers (including Winter Season).
> 
> Long Live Indo-Afghani Partnership.

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## nair

Karzai masth mood mein hein........ Bhai jaan yeh sab nahi hoga.... aapko non military support diya jayega..... if not contact @arp2041 woh aapko khoob support dega... ithna support dega ki aapko bhi super power kehalaya jayega....

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## Bayonet

BeyondHeretic said:


> you mean Israeli weapons , lethal?



Hey leftover of Arabic invasion convert Zoroastrian, just stop hallucination.We don't photoshop like you.We have many India made lethal weapons .


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## Sugarcane

nair said:


> Karzai masth mood mein hein........ Bhai jaan yeh sab nahi hoga.... aapko non military support diya jayega..... if not contact @arp2041 woh aapko khoob support dega... ithna support dega ki aapko bhi super power kehalaya jayega....



I told you India ab 11 guna lagaan bharay ga

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## BeyondHeretic

Bayonet said:


> Hey leftover of Arabic invasion convert Zoroastrian, just stop hallucination.We don't photoshop like you.We have many India made lethal weapons .



Ok then , sorry , i'm a tech enthusiast , I thought india didn't have

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## arp2041

I have a Question for our Afghani BROTHERS.......

Our PM Manmohan Singh is getting completely free in May-2014......

So, can we transfer him as well to Afghanistan?

Though he is a NON-LETHAL stuff.

Thanks In Advance.

LONG LIVE INDIA-AFGHANISTAN BROTHERHOOD!!!

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## Bayonet

BeyondHeretic said:


> Ok then , sorry , i'm a tech enthusiast , I thought india didn't have



Your Avatar is suggesting , which type of enthusiast you are.


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## BeyondHeretic

Bayonet said:


> Your Avatar is suggesting , which type of enthusiast you are.



haha , ok ........

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## nair

arp2041 said:


> I have a Question for our Afghani BROTHERS.......
> 
> Our PM Manmohan Singh is getting completely free in May-2014......
> 
> So, can we transfer him as well to Afghanistan?
> 
> Though he is a NON-LETHAL stuff.
> 
> Thanks In Advance.
> 
> LONG LIVE INDIA-AFGHANISTAN BROTHERHOOD!!!



Oye agar offer karna hein tho achaa offer dena.... Take MMS get sonia and rahul free..... Bumper offer.... Diggu absoultely freee....


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## Hyperion

LOL.. make him Afghan Minister of Economy and he will be lethal as hell. I mean lethal to the Afghans themselves.  



arp2041 said:


> I have a Question for our Afghani BROTHERS.......
> 
> Our PM Manmohan Singh is getting completely free in May-2014......
> 
> So, can we transfer him as well to Afghanistan?
> 
> Though he is a NON-LETHAL stuff.
> 
> Thanks In Advance.
> 
> LONG LIVE INDIA-AFGHANISTAN BROTHERHOOD!!!

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## nair

arp2041 said:


> abey pagal.....
> 
> abhi toh unka khara hua hai....desh, apney pairo par.....
> 
> kyo wapas unhey wheelchair par bethaney ko keh raha hai???



Ab samjhaa.... thum bhaki logon ko BD bejna chahthein hein na??????


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## Beerbal

nair said:


> Oye agar offer karna hein tho achaa offer dena.... Take MMS get sonia and rahul free..... Bumper offer.... Diggu absoultely freee....
> 
> 
> 
> Oye agar offer karna hein tho achaa offer dena.... Take MMS get sonia and rahul free..... Bumper offer.... Diggu absoultely freee....






If we are true well-wisher of Afghanistan, we should give these guys to Pakistan.. MMS as Pakistani PM, Sonia Rahul Sibbal, Diggi, Raja, Kalmadi etc as team..  
 @Topic: 
a) India will not send active troop unless its thru UN Peacekeeping force. 
b) Karzai can't be snubbed so India has given words to think about it.
c) Unstable Pakistan is big problem for us, Unstable Afghanistan will be headache for world (except Pakistan). 3 Major enemy of Terrorists ideology are (India, Israel and USA). Newly added Russia, Australia and west
d) Indian support will be limited to logistic (Under international law, not nuke smuggling like Pakistani did), and infrastructure (if we don't go there chinese will)

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## p4kistan

Afghan Prince said:


> Nowadays it is punjabis who prays ""Oh Lord, save us from the claw of the tiger, the fang of the cobra and the vengeance of the Afghan"



Haha you deluded idiot, afghan vengeance.

Where is your vengeance when the US & NATO is raping and fuck1ng your mothers and daughters. 

Its nowhere to be seen, in fact you're facilitating it so carry on with your vengeance. Realise this punjabis will never be cared of women like yourselves.

You aim to cause discord but we are all Pakistani muslims first & then are we our tribes etc. You Afghans are jealouse coz you all can't get on with each other. 

You're very ungrateful, if it wasn't for Pakistan you'd be speaking Russian son.

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## Beerbal

p4kistan said:


> Haha you deluded idiot, *afghan vengeance.*
> 
> Where is your vengeance when the US & NATO is raping and fuck1ng your mothers and daughters.
> 
> Its nowhere to be seen, in fact you're facilitating it so carry on with your vengeance. Realise this punjabis will never be cared of women like yourselves.
> 
> You aim to cause discord but we are all Pakistani muslims first & then are we our tribes etc. You Afghans are jealouse coz you all can't get on with each other.
> 
> You're very ungrateful, if it wasn't for Pakistan you'd be speaking Russian son.






Son, if you recall 3-4 years of PDF, this (afghan vengeance) is the exact term used by Pakistani PDF members. No NATO troop is raping Afghan lady. If any found doing human right violation) they are punished.

If Pakistan-KSA-USA wouldn't have interfered in Afghan Matter, Afghanistan would be developing country, and Pakistan would have been developed country. This Islam-mania and Dollar-love fcuked entire world ...




















If Islam-Maniac and Dollar-lover wouldn't have messed with Afghanistan, Indian bollywood instry would have been flooded with Afghani actors.. India and Afghan were very close to each other.

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## Secur

arp2041 said:


> abey kitni pey rukega????



I can understand every dream of yours , sure 

But , just tell me what sort of Aircraft Carriers and submarines run on deserts ? 
 @Hyperion

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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Ok kid, let me enlighten you with something, International media is not on the ground here, people are on the ground, my information came is directly from people, how can you believe international media always reflect the truth, a good example is Syria where international media support terrorists, that eat a dead Syrian soldier's heart and shout Allah O Akbar and then post the video in YouTube and the so-called international media support such criminals in war against Syrian civilians and government.
> 
> The Taliban that you mentioned were eliminated by US in 2002-2003 and the newer version (suicide bombing) insurgency began in 2006 and still going on with new support infrastructure across the border.
> My intention was not to argue with you, but to enlighten you with the facts but you still can continue your daydreaming if you want to.



What Afghan crap are you giving me here ? 

The research organization whose report I am talking about has offices in your country and hence I consider the report as credible . Yeah , keep your " insider information " with yourself which you cant back with any credible source but mainly hearsay things . A good example is your hypocrisy , supporting US on the invasion considering it as savior of your nation and then trying to discredit the reports coming from its media and criticizing the same Americans elsewhere  . Actually , the International media is well on the ground there with the soldiers of a dozen different countries .

_Taliban fighters have a &#8220;permanent presence&#8221; in almost three quarters of Afghanistan and are tightening a noose around the capital, Kabul, according to a *Paris-based research organization.**The International Council on Security and Development, which has fulltime offices in Afghanistan*, said in a report that Taliban fighters have advanced out of their bases in the south and east and are infiltrating Kabul at will. _

Taliban Control 72% of Afghanistan; Surround Kabul, Group Says 

Yeah , Kandahar's finest can get you in these alternate universes , so I am told !  

If they were all eliminated as per you , then who are you trying to negotiate with , at the moment ? Literally begging for the assistance of the Govt of Pakistan whilst doing so ?  Who are those who have opened offices in Qatar ? How much powerful are we , to do so , whilst the coalition is controlling your country ? Kiddo , Taliban were never eliminated , even the Americans admit that to the extent that they now talk of " damage limitation " and not " long forgotten victory " . Nah , your intention is to show the effects of Cannabis and you are doing that fine with alternate histories and what-not . Do continue , its good entertainment for us .

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> Nowadays it is punjabis who prays ""Oh Lord, save us from the claw of the tiger, the fang of the cobra and the vengeance of the Afghan"



What drug is this @Hyperion ? 



Afghan Prince said:


> Its disturbing to see my lar Afghans as brainwashed servants of punjabis and suffering from low self esteem, they need to be liberated.



 But there are no legal Afghans here , merely refugees and illegals from your country . The Pakistani Pashtuns are a completely different story altogether .

They have more representation in the Pakistan army and literally every institution of this country to the extent that we have had Pashtun COAS and Presidents and are integrated so much in the society than you can ever even dream of , in so called Afghan National Army and puppet Kabul Govt not to mention the stone age society of yours

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> Thats why the whole world consider you danger to the peace and hub of terrorism. Pakistan nuclear weapons are not in safe hands, it needs to be destroyed...



Yeah , your whole world consisting of a couple " Western countries "  Afghanistan has been occupied by foreigners for so long now that they have no free thinking even . 

I think , we can detonate them over Afghanistan for safe disposal , what say you ?

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## Hyperion

Aiwain hee. Bechara Tajik pagal hua hoa hai. Issay meray tigers nay chakk mara tha. 



Secur said:


> What drug is this @Hyperion ?
> 
> 
> 
> But there are no legal Afghans here , merely refugees and illegals from your country . The Pakistani Pashtuns are a completely different story altogether .
> 
> They have more representation in the Pakistan army and literally every institution of this country to the extent that we have had Pashtun COAS and Presidents and are integrated so much in the society than you can ever even dream of , in so called Afghan National Army and puppet Kabul Govt not to mention the stone age society of yours

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## Secur

INDIC said:


> Watch this video, Afghans are talking about your Punjabis and people from Karachi in Taliban ranks.



Unfortunately for you , I am not interested in playing this " Youtube " game , spamming the forum whilst doing so . 

Anyone can make a video and post it for the world - doesn't make it credible , rest assured if I decide to go that way , there are dozens of finest ones I have about Afghanistan so !



Hyperion said:


> Aiwain hee. Bechara Tajik pagal hua hoa hai. Issay meray *tigers *nay chakk mara tha.



Dekho Dekho Kon Aya , Sher Aaya Sher Aaya

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## Dillinger

Indian troops? Not happening. Period!

Training your NCO, JCO, jawaans..that is already going on but we can always bring forth a healthy increase in numbers. 

Weapons can be provided. Word of caution, they will not be as swanky as the American arms and munitions but they'll get the job done- they've worked for us against the LeT- although I've been told that the Punjabi LeT are a bit green compared to the Afghan Taliban. Still, a bullet's a bullet. 

Personally, the Afghans I've seen and met have been courteous and deserving people. Many of them have taken up temporary residence in and around a certain super specialty hospital near my area. Never had any complaints, no issues despite what many people had said of these people. They keep their noses clean and their hands cleaner..they stay for a few months as they avail the GOI initiated medical assistance offered to them. Based on such experiences I'd say that they deserve a bright future. Hopefully they will meet success in striving towards it- with any assistance that maybe within our capability to offer.


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## joekrish

ejaz007 said:


> Afghans are very good scrap dealers. Whenever they get their hands on a large quantity they run to Pakistan for a deal.



Does that mean that all Pakistan is got is scrap. 

Now read this and keep yourself busy. 

http://www.defence.pk/forums/politi...very-dark-unstable-after-these-elections.html


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## Secur

@Dillinger 

Afghans remain good with you and Iranian because you keep them under check and control and restrict their movements . 

Otherwise , the one who are refugees here are involved in all sort of heinous crimes and illegal activities because lets get it they were given a free pass by the late Commander of the Faithful when they came here , to travel to any city and place they like . Basically , we have the same complaints from them what you have from Bangladeshis and the same " refusing to return to their country " problem .

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## INDIC

Secur said:


> Unfortunately for you , I am not interested in playing this " Youtube " game , spamming the forum whilst doing so .
> 
> Anyone can make a video and post it for the world - doesn't make it credible , rest assured if I decide to go that way , there are dozens of finest ones I have about Afghanistan so !



You know that Afghans don't like Pakistanis.


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## Dillinger

Secur said:


> @Dillinger
> 
> Afghans remain good with you and Iranian because you keep them under check and control and restrict their movements .
> 
> Otherwise , the one who are refugees here are involved in all sort of heinous crimes and illegal activities because lets get it they were given a free pass by the late Commander of the Faithful when they came here , to travel to any city and place they like . Basically , we have the same complaints from them what you have from Bangladeshis and the same " refusing to return to their country " problem .



Yaara aisi koi bhi kaum nahi jise agar sambhala naa jaye toh woh battameezi na kare.  The thing is that they are indeed well provided for but they freely mingle with the local populace. As I said at least here they are extremely polite and courteous, I've often had the chance to help them out as they went about trying to purchase medication from a nearby chemist shop which I frequent. There aren't any restrictions on them either although I do believe that they have to get a clearance from their embassy before they can move out of the city they currently reside in. Besides most of them are either students, people who've come for professional training or for medical reasons and the GOI goes to a certain length to ensure that at least those who come for medical reasons are provided with all reasonable amenities. 

Its just a difference in the environment man...if you leave them close to Mullah Omar sahib and lackeys- who seem to be content in abusing all and any norms of hospitality- well then you'll even have people who started with the disposition of lambs singing about slitting your throat within no time. Provide them with proper support *AWAY* from such elements and they are right as rain. 

The Bangladeshis are another matter...our issue with them is strictly legal. We NEVER opened our doors for them, Pakistan I believe took in the refugees with open arms during Zia's rule. Ten to one the chances are Zia ji promised them the lands for perpetuity- knowing that fellow's piety and all.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Secur said:


> @Dillinger
> 
> Afghans remain good with you and Iranian because you keep them under check and control and restrict their movements .
> 
> Otherwise , the one who are refugees here are involved in all sort of heinous crimes and illegal activities because lets get it they were given a free pass by the late Commander of the Faithful when they came here , to travel to any city and place they like . Basically , we have the same complaints from them what you have from Bangladeshis and the same " refusing to return to their country " problem .



Yaar.... once i was travelling on daewoo ... saw these 2 chutiyas misbehaving with the poor hostess...kept ringing the bell...every 5 minutes for water-softdrinks etc,loud music, and what not... dimagh kharab kar diya BCdoun nay! i confronted those bastards... the other passengers also rose up... slapped them around ... and when we reached the bus terminal handed them over to the security incharge... who himself was a pashtun and an ex-PA service man... the damn dude pull out his gun..people stopped him from popin 2 in their arses... he told those afghans tht if they were in our tribal areas they would have been shot...(they beat their arses again) and guess what to top it all those bastards didnt even have travel documents... 

Moral of the story... latoun k bhoot batoun say nahin mantay.....Pakistan should fence n mine the border and let them .... remain in their god forsaken country.

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Afghan Prince said:


> A skinny paqi like you do not have guts to slap an Afghan, you lower your eyes in nervousness when he looks at you.. One slap from Afghan can cause you serious brain damage.



Skinny? kid i probably weigh more than you....Nanner 80% of ur country lives on UN zakat ... go see the malnurishment rate in ur country before ranting... last time ur border police harassed a Pakistani.... people got them (nanners or locust eaters) off a bus... near torkham n beat the crap out of them in retaliation...and the last time u fired at our check post... 1 ANA soldier got killed 5-6 got wounded n ur check posts destroyed... u people are full of hot air.

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## United

Beerbal said:


> *Son, if you recall 3-4 years of PDF..............This Islam-mania and Dollar-love fcuked entire world ...
> *
> If Islam-Maniac and Dollar-lover wouldn't have messed with Afghanistan, Indian bollywood instry would have been flooded with Afghani actors.. India and Afghan were very close to each other.



what is *Islam-mania* is it something like saffron terrorism?











many bollywood actors are foreigners

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Afghan Prince said:


> You people surely have got skinny and small bodies but big tongues.



I stand at 183... and weigh 182 pounds.... and another news flash.. Pakistanis on average are taller than afghans... due to ur malnurishment... and we dont just threat .. we kill ...from where i come from..

Also get the myth out of your head that afghanistan has never been conquered... read about alexander,mongols,persians,hindu shahis,ashoka,mauryans etc etc..

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## Die Hard

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> I stand at 183... and weigh 182 pounds.... and another news flash.. Pakistanis on average are taller than afghans... due to ur malnurishment... and we dont threat .. we kill where i come from... Baluchistan..
> 
> Also get the myth out of your head that afghanistan has never been conquered... read about alexander,mongols,persians,hindu shahis,ashoka,mauryans etc etc..



Lullz if they can beat the **** out of Americans and Russians then where do we stand ? Avg height and weight is good for Indians and not for Aghans.. I just want to wage my 2 cents


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## DESERT FIGHTER

Afghan Prince said:


> So what if you are from balochistan? Most of the baloch look like punjabis, many even like negroes. They are treated like dirt by Pakistani army. They do not have guts to take on professional army so they vent their frustration on unarmed settlers, sign of cowardice. Or blow up gas pipelines and then run with tails between their legs.
> Afghans are settled in your province and have acquired domiciles with the help of pashtunkhwa mili awami party and have turned into a minority and you balochs can not do any thing about it. Thats why your ultimate dream is to slap an afghan but the problem is you **** in your pants when you see the one.



First of all why the racism man? is that because u have the lowest IQ in all of asia? even kenya is more developed than afghanistan... also are there no dark skinned pashtuns or afghans? the negro makranis are much better than u afghans thats for sure... as for treated like dirty... if we were treated like than my father wouldnt have become a brig in the army... and your citing the example of BLA rats that your govt shelters...

Afghans my that do you mean the kochis? yes they migrate every season...and smuggle tractors and other stuff... ...rest of the pashtuns have been living here for centuries.. and mili awami party itself is a Pakistani party that believes in the constitution of the country... so you fail again!
As for slapping... yes i have done it... not once but several times...and you know why and why i dont feel bad? bcoz they deserved it... you dont misbehave with women... you dont abuse the country that shelters you...... and why should i be afraid of afghans? do they eat humans or are you guys super men?... you should not make such tall claims...

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Die Hard said:


> Lullz if they can beat the **** out of Americans and Russians then where do we stand ? Avg height and weight is good for Indians and not for Aghans.. I just want to wage my 2 cents



You should read about the afghan jihad ... and without US,Pakistan,KSA etc etc... if they had a chance... as for USA... my frnd read the news... and the accusations levelled against Pakistan..

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## Die Hard

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> You should read about the afghan jihad ... and without US,Pakistan,KSA etc etc... if they had a chance... as for USA... my frnd read the news... and the accusations levelled against Pakistan..



Look what they are doing to us now ? We cannot fire a bullet to them


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## DESERT FIGHTER

Die Hard said:


> Look what they are doing to us now ? We cannot fire a bullet to them



No wonder dozens of thousands of them have died... and why the grin dumbass? u laughing at our martyrs?

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## EXPERIMENT

Abhishek_ said:


> oh wow, i can't imagine how we can refute that now. you win



He is correct I became a mutant Hulk/Ninja when it occurred.


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## Die Hard

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> No wonder dozens of thousands of them have died... and why the grin dumbass? u laughing at our martyrs?



don't loose temper man..I am laughing on our establishment. On one side we say that Afghans are warriors and they dont surrender, even Superpowers like USA and USSR was not able to take them down and on the other hand we say we will fix them up. It is hard to digest for People like me at least.


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## DESERT FIGHTER

Die Hard said:


> don't loose temper man..I am laughing on our establishment. On one side we say that Afghans are warriors and they dont surrender, even Superpowers like USA and USSR was not able to take them down and on the other hand we say we will fix them up. It is hard to digest for People like me at least.



The idiot ur talking about also says that afghan taliban are his children and how he trained them etc etc... But the fact is tht USSR withdrew mostly bcoz of its economic situation... tht in the end lead to its disintegration... and US and Pakistan played a very big role in it... as for TTP... They are not afghan taliban... but thugs,criminals who are supported by our afghan frnds.. and "others"... with shelter,weapons,meds etc all coming from afghanistan...

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## Mitro

It&#8217;s an Embarrassment FOr future Super Power to see its majority doing open defecation so they decided to divert all defence budget to make Public restroom .

So No Dinero till 2050 



EXPERIMENT said:


> Your country can pay for it.

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## surya kiran

EXPERIMENT said:


> Last reply: Ball less false flagger !!!



Its just natural for him. Offline also he must be saying he is Indian to hide his shame, now online be shuru. Who knows, he may actually start believing he is one in sometime.

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> A skinny paqi like you do not have guts to slap an Afghan, you lower your eyes in nervousness when he looks at you.. One slap from Afghan can cause you serious brain damage.



Kid , all of your supplies go from Pakistan from the same enemies . We shut it down for a week and you will starve to death with the same big tongue you are using here , stone agers , you already face severe malnourishment according to the UN . Best not want me to post the psychological problems that Afghans face due to the ongoing war . 
 @DESERT FIGHTER @Armstrong @Hyperion @Hermione G @Marshmallow

Khaane ko paisa nhi , aur bat karne ka style dekho

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> How much representation?


_
More than you can ever imagine in your Afghanistan _

I do not need to explain their integration , high status and economical condition to a racist like you . 

Mind your language , we have a couple of nice words for Afghans too .

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Secur said:


> Kid , all of your supplies go from Pakistan from the same enemies . We shut it down for a week and you will starve to death with the same big tongue you are using here , stone agers , you already face severe malnourishment according to the UN . Best not want me to post the psychological problems that Afghans face due to the ongoing war .
> 
> @DESERT FIGHTER @Armstrong @Hyperion @Hermione G @Marshmallow
> 
> Khaane ko paisa nhi , aur bat karne ka style dekho



This explains it:

http://www.google.com.pk/url?sa=t&r...TJB1caYYEZhEfjfYANOzZ4Q&bvm=bv.46751780,d.dmQ

http://www.google.com.pk/url?sa=t&r...dYkXUtvrM3r49iDNU-SPK9g&bvm=bv.46751780,d.dmQ

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## Secur

Afghan Prince said:


> I think in any future indo-pak war Afghanistan should invade Pakistan from west , we missed the golden oppurtunities in 1965 and 1971



I think you do not remember the fate of the Afghans who once tried to invade Bajaur ! The same Pakistani Pashtuns beat the hell out of them and later called in the airforce . What happened next should be anybody's guess . 

From that day , your people learned their " limits " and never tried any sort of mischief again

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## Secur

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> This explains it:



I didn't want to go that route , but this dimwit left me no choice . I mean can these people debate without being racist or making personal attacks ? The delusions of " unconquerable Afghanistan " has surely affected their minds more deeply than previously thought .

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Secur said:


> I didn't want to go that route , but this dimwit left me no choice . I mean can these people debate without being racist or making personal attacks ? The delusions of " unconquerable Afghanistan " has surely affected their minds more deeply than previously thought .



The only achievement afghans have made is.................... getting born...

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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> I understand it took you hours to find those links. The topics discuss Indian prospective and probability about deploying troops on the ground, again Karzai never said that. Having good relations with countries like India is good for our country. If we had good honest relations with Pakistan it would be great for both nations but unfortunately Pakistan is deceptive, wants to play double game with us.



By the way , I am still waiting for you to post that respectful link to refute the article's claim ?

Not really , unlike some , I know how to search . The links are from the same forum actually and all say the same thing . Now , the officials of Indian external affairs ministry aren't making statements out of thin air , most probably Mr.Karzai wants that and conveyed the message to the Indian , there's no other explanation . Hence , the newspaper hints at that , what problem do you see with it now ? 

The animosity with Pakistan was started by your country even before it came into existence in '47 . So , do not blame it on Pakistan when you were making ridiculous territorial claims which were settled a long time ago , opposing the independence of the country and continuously trying to separate the N.W.F.P. from it - not to mention the invasion of Bajaur back then .

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## Yeti

That Guy said:


> until SCO actually accepts Pakistan as a full member, I don't think the organization should be involved. If you're talking about individual countries, then sure.
> 
> Pakistan has tried to improve relations with the government, including offers to train and equip their security forces, but because the ANA is majority Northern Alliance, the ANA has forced the Afghan gov to take a anti-Pakistan stance.
> 
> As for India having some communication, a one time thing doesn't mean full on contacts. It's would also be against Indian interest, simply because if Pakistan finds out about them, *Pakistan would have a field day by saying that RAW is supporting the Taliban, regardless of what the Indians are actually doing*.




Would not deter Indian intelligence if that were to happen as it is in our own interest to have some sort of channel open with the Taliban.


Afghan Journal | Analysis & Opinion | Reuters.com


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## That Guy

Yeti said:


> Would not deter Indian intelligence if that were to happen as it is in our own interest to have some sort of channel open with the Taliban.
> 
> 
> Afghan Journal | Analysis & Opinion | Reuters.com



Whether or not it would deter India's intelligence is something completely irrelevant, it would lose face in the international community. That is not something India can afford to do, if it ever hopes to become entirely self-sufficient.

Also, that article is 3 years old, and no results have shown from any such talks.


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## selvan33

*Hamid Karzai seeks Indian military aid amid Pakistan row*

Afghan President Hamid Karzai says he will seek military aid from India during a three-day visit this week.

Karzai&#8217;s trip comes during escalating border tension with Pakistan.Karzai spokesperson Aimal Faizi says the president will discuss recent border skirmishes with Pakistan when he visits New Delhi starting tomorrow.

He added that Karzai would seek Indian help in &#8220;strengthening of our security forces.&#8221;

The visit could irk Pakistan, which suspects its rival India of seeking influence in Afghanistan, which Pakistan considers its own backyard.

Analyst Wadir Safi says the timing of Karzai&#8217;s India trip is likely related to recent border skirmishes with Pakistan.

Each side has been accusing the other of firing across the border.
*Hamid Karzai seeks Indian military aid amid Pakistan row | idrw.org
*


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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> What Afghan crap are you giving me here ?
> 
> The research organization whose report I am talking about has offices in your country and hence I consider the report as credible . Yeah , keep your " insider information " with yourself which you cant back with any credible source but mainly hearsay things . A good example is your hypocrisy , supporting US on the invasion considering it as savior of your nation and then trying to discredit the reports coming from its media and criticizing the same Americans elsewhere  . Actually , the International media is well on the ground there with the soldiers of a dozen different countries .
> 
> _Taliban fighters have a permanent presence in almost three quarters of Afghanistan and are tightening a noose around the capital, Kabul, according to a *Paris-based research organization.**The International Council on Security and Development, which has fulltime offices in Afghanistan*, said in a report that Taliban fighters have advanced out of their bases in the south and east and are infiltrating Kabul at will. _
> 
> Taliban Control 72% of Afghanistan; Surround Kabul, Group Says
> 
> Yeah , Kandahar's finest can get you in these alternate universes , so I am told !
> 
> If they were all eliminated as per you , then who are you trying to negotiate with , at the moment ? Literally begging for the assistance of the Govt of Pakistan whilst doing so ?  Who are those who have opened offices in Qatar ? How much powerful are we , to do so , whilst the coalition is controlling your country ? Kiddo , Taliban were never eliminated , even the Americans admit that to the extent that they now talk of " damage limitation " and not " long forgotten victory " . Nah , your intention is to show the effects of Cannabis and you are doing that fine with alternate histories and what-not . Do continue , its good entertainment for us .



So what do you really want to prove? being pessimistic, ill wisher to Afghanistan or what?


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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> By the way , I am still waiting for you to post that respectful link to refute the article's claim ?
> 
> Not really , unlike some , I know how to search . The links are from the same forum actually and all say the same thing . Now , the officials of Indian external affairs ministry aren't making statements out of thin air , most probably Mr.Karzai wants that and conveyed the message to the Indian , there's no other explanation . Hence , the newspaper hints at that , what problem do you see with it now ?
> 
> The animosity with Pakistan was started by your country even before it came into existence in '47 . So , do not blame it on Pakistan when you were making ridiculous territorial claims which were settled a long time ago , opposing the independence of the country and continuously trying to separate the N.W.F.P. from it - not to mention the invasion of Bajaur back then .



Living in the past is unwise. Lets be honest and solve the problems both nations are faced with today. why should we be stuck in what happened in the past. Pakistan must cooperate with us instead backstabbing us. Pakistani and Afghan civilians are both paying the price for Pakistani Taliban policy. At least have some mercy on yourselves if not us.


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## ejaz007

*Official: Karzai To Seek More Military Aid During India Trip*

NEW DELHI  Afghan President Hamid Karzai will seek greater Indian military aid during a visit this week to New Delhi, officials of both countries said Monday.

India has provided billions of dollars of aid to Afghanistan since the fall of the Taliban in 2001, and is keen to ensure that no radical Islamist regime takes power in Kabul after international troops pull out in 2014.

Afghanistans request will include all kinds of assistance from India in order to strengthen our military and security institutions, Karzais presidential spokesman, Aimal Faizi, told reporters in Kabul.

Karzai, set to start his two-day trip to New Delhi late Monday, will hold talks with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on the future of the war-torn country and also meet Indian President Pranab Mukherjee.

Discussions will cover a potential arms deal between the two countries, an Indian foreign ministry official told AFP in New Delhi, speaking on condition of anonymity.

India is ready to meet any request that would strengthen Afghan security institutions. He (Karzai) is visiting India to discuss a potential arms deal, the foreign ministry official said.

But any Indian activity in Afghanistan triggers sensitivities in neighboring rival Pakistan, which fears losing influence in Afghanistan.

India has been training a limited number of Afghan military officers for years at its military institutions but has provided little weapons assistance except for some vehicles.

Earlier this month, Afghanistans ambassador to India said the country needs Indias help with equipment and weapons and was hoping to boost defense ties.

In 2011, India and Afghanistan began a strategic partnership aimed at deepening security and economic links.

Official: Karzai To Seek More Military Aid During India Trip | Defense News | defensenews.com


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## fatman17

are there any non-lethal weapons.....?????


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## TaimiKhan

fatman17 said:


> are there any non-lethal weapons.....?????



Daandaaaaaa

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## qamar1990

joekrish said:


> Would it hurt to give him few nukes and delivery systems.


delivery systems?
you cant even deliver your own without foreign tech lol.

doesnt india import most of their stuff from other countries?
if so then what are they going to send the afghans? bb guns?



Anony said:


> Arjun mk1, Akash - SAM and few artilleries. That will suffice. I was even thinking of Prahaar missile. Indian Army not finding a space to induct, give it to Afganistan. 180km range of it will suffice.




a poor country like india sending aid? lol.
wouldnt it be better to feed a few kids in your country instead signing for death will?


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## qamar1990

TaimiKhan said:


> Daandaaaaaa



thats the only they produce of quality when it comes to weapons lol.

i just pray to god that india sends weapons soldiers and everything to afghanistan.
its the best thing that can happen to us(pakistan)


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## ExtraOdinary

qamar1990 said:


> delivery systems?
> you cant even deliver your own without foreign tech lol.
> 
> doesnt india import most of their stuff from other countries?
> if so then what are they going to send the afghans? bb guns?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a poor country like india sending aid? lol.
> wouldnt it be better to feed a few kids in your country instead signing for death will?



Brother why are you getting so worked up. If Afghans need weapons for defence, they will get them from US/Russia/Iran/India etc. They need all possible help from all countries in the world so that their country moves towards peace, stability and prosperity.Pakistan should also improve her relations with them.


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## qamar1990

ExtraOdinary said:


> Brother why are you getting so worked up. If Afghans need weapons for defence, they will get them from US/Russia/Iran/India etc. They need all possible help from all countries in the world so that their country moves towards peace, stability and prosperity.Pakistan should also improve her relations with them.



im just replying to comments indians made.
its principle brother lol you should know how it is.
i dont hate you guys, im just going to respond with hate if i get hate.

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## Jade

Weapons OK. No ground troops


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## joekrish

qamar1990 said:


> delivery systems?
> you cant even deliver your own without foreign tech lol.
> 
> doesnt india import most of their stuff from other countries?
> if so then what are they going to send the afghans? bb guns?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> a poor country like india sending aid? lol.
> wouldnt it be better to feed a few kids in your country instead signing for death will?




Well......they do have the jv tech (Afghanistan- Pakistan) tie it on their back and blow it up on the fav test bed.


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## SEAL

Karzai can have better military equipment of US/NATO don't know why he is interested in Indian mall, IMO he is demanding protection for himself after all he is "usefull idiot" and anything can happen.


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## Beerbal

United said:


> what is *Islam-mania* is it something like saffron terrorism?






And how come this make Islam-mania less dangerous? The Islamist were the root cause of Afghanistan. There is a shloka in Sanskrit.. "Ati Sarvatra Varjayet"

Ati Sarvatra Varjayet  is a part of a sloka emphasising the importance of limiting oneself to appropriate limits and to not to be extravagant. The sloka gives examples of 
The Rakshasa Emperor Bali who was bound by his limitless sacrifice- the sacrifice he made to Vamana against the advice of his teacher Sukracharya,
Suyodhana, the eldest son of Dhrutaraashtra , died of limitless pride/self- respect.
Ravana died of limitless lust.
Hence beware and be limited in your wants and desires.



UNfortunately you ppl stop reading sanskrit after converting to arabic religion..  .. Our (Hindu) culture is not what you have posted, We have sheltered Jews/Parsi even Muslims.. If you read Indian (Hindu) moral books (Panchtantra, Geetha) you will know what Hindusism is...


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## qamar1990

SEAL said:


> Karzai can have better military equipment of US/NATO don't know why he is interested in Indian mall, IMO he is demanding protection for himself after all he is "usefull idiot" and anything can happen.



words on the street that the great ole US of A is leaving everything except planes to pakistan.


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## Beerbal

qamar1990 said:


> words on the street that the great ole US of A is leaving everything except planes to pakistan.




WoW! If it is auctioned, Please buy a Humvee for me.. Its best opportunity to buy an Hummer ... 
@Topic: USA will keep helping Afghanistan, They why Karzai asking co-opration from India? Reason is simple, alone USA can't fight WoT, Pakistan will not continue to be part of WoT. Karzai is looking for more allies.. 


Indian weapons will be cheaper.


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## qamar1990

Beerbal said:


> WoW! If it is auctioned, Please buy a Humvee for me.. Its best opportunity to buy an Hummer ...
> @Topic: USA will keep helping Afghanistan, They why Karzai asking co-opration from India? Reason is simple, alone USA can't fight WoT, Pakistan will not continue to be part of WoT. Karzai is looking for more allies..
> 
> 
> Indian weapons will be cheaper.



lets see if we even get them


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## BlueWarrior

They don't need a complete lethal weapons because NATO had used everything and neither had worked. Fighting in mountain areas, they only need drones.


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## Armstrong

Hyperion said:


> Chupp oye, dramaybaz Tajik. Afghanistan is gods gift to all Pashtuns, just like the promised land of Israel to the Jews.



Oh shut up you - I've come across more Afghan Tajiks that I can be friends with than Afghan Pukhtoons - At least those Farsiwans don't want half of my country, recognize the Durand Line & don't want everyone from the TTP to the Baluch Separatists finding sanctuaries in Afghanistan !

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## Marshmallow

Secur said:


> Kid , all of your supplies go from Pakistan from the same enemies . We shut it down for a week and you will starve to death with the same big tongue you are using here , stone agers , you already face severe malnourishment according to the UN . Best not want me to post the psychological problems that Afghans face due to the ongoing war .
> 
> @DESERT FIGHTER @Armstrong @Hyperion @Hermione G @Marshmallow
> 
> Khaane ko paisa nhi , aur bat karne ka style dekho



dare he threatns us again n we wud send @Secur n @DESERT FIGHTER to handle him in afghanistan...thez both r more thn enuff to show him wht pakistaniz r

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## DESERT FIGHTER

Armstrong said:


> Oh shut up you - I've come across more Afghan Tajiks that I can be friends with than Afghan Pukhtoons - At least those Farsiwans don't want half of my country, recognize the Durand Line & don't want everyone from the TTP to the* Baluch Separatists* finding sanctuaries in Afghanistan !



I have no bloody love for the terrorists....id kill my own brother if he was a traitor... but lets face it man..... the govt of Pakistan is also to be blamed... for neglecting our province....

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## Armstrong

DESERT FIGHTER said:


> I have no bloody love for the terrorists....id kill my own brother if he was a traitor... but lets face it man..... *the govt of Pakistan is also to be blamed... for neglecting our province*....



More than anyone because no amount of explanations can excuse us from the guilt & the fault of neglecting a member of our family for the past 65 years !

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## A1Kaid

Digital Soldier said:


> Not 1% Afghans support Taliban, even in villages, I am aware of it. All Taliban are illiterate and jobless morons of Pakistani tribal areas, lured by ISI as proxy PA fighters.
> Taliban have support among Afghans, its a completely false narrative. Very few people understand it.



Taliban began in Afghanistan by Afghanis, Mullah Omar is a citizen of Afghanistan.

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## Yeti

That Guy said:


> Whether or not it would deter India's intelligence is something completely irrelevant, it would lose face in the international community. That is not something India can afford to do, if it ever hopes to become entirely self-sufficient.
> 
> Also, that article is 3 years old, and no results have shown from any such talks.





What do you mean by losing face? as Qatar which is largely seen as a pro western country is also conducting talks with the Taliban and the US is well aware about this.

There was a recent article from last week in the Times of India about this matter I will try finding it and post it here if I can.

India is no friend of the Taliban but having no form of communication open with some pockets of the regime would in my view be a mistake.

As the old saying goes keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Taliban also are human beings they have the same weakness as the rest of us mortals and are susceptible to bribery, India having economic interest in the country must make sure its vital strategic assets are protected by any cost.


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## Yzd Khalifa

SUPARCO said:


> Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldnt mind troop presence on Afghan soil
> _Friday May 17, 2013_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *NEW DELHI* - *Ahead of its President Hamid Karzais visit next week, the Afghan has asked India to supply lethal defence hardware as part of an intensified bilateral cooperation and even seemed to indicate that it would welcome troop deployment on its soil.*
> 
> Afghan President Hamid Karzai will be arriving in New Delhi on Monday for a three-day visit, his second in six months, but at a crucial juncture with only a year left for the foreign troops pullout from Afghanistan.
> 
> Vigorously batting for a stepped-up Indian role, Afghan Ambassador to India Shaida Mohammad Abdali said, Investment in the security of Afghanistan is in Indias interest.
> 
> He noted that while India had been training Afghan security personnel, it was not adequate to address the issues of a difficult security situation.
> 
> Given the time, we are required to sit down and discuss the contours of our defence cooperation to ensure predictability, he said, adding that current level of cooperation was hardly enough to take preventive and pre-emptive action against common threats.
> 
> India has so far been training Afghan security personnel only in Indian institutions. It has also supplied limited number of non-lethal equipment like jeeps and trucks and plans to hand over transport helicopters.
> 
> So, we would like to have both lethal and non-lethal assistance to our forces in Afghanistan, he said.
> 
> Better engagement in defence cooperation is likely to be a major topic of discussion during Karzais visit, which will also see him travelling to Jalandhar to receive a doctorate from a university.
> 
> Abdali said Pakistan had to realise that India was building institutions in Afghanistan, which would ensure that terrorism wouldnt come back and affect the war-torn country even more. He said Indias cooperation in Afghanistan would ultimately serve Pakistans national interests too.
> 
> Karzai to ask for lethal weapons from India, wouldnt mind troop presence on Afghan soil - Pakistan Today



Karazi knows his days are numbered by now and that's why he's willing to sell his soul to the devil


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## Cyberian

Yzd Khalifa said:


> Karazi knows his days are numbered by now and that's why he's willing to sell his soul to the devil



These are just his empty statements as his tenure runs out next year. He wants to leave some sort of a legacy of himself after being a complete failure for Afghanistan in past 12-years of his rule.

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## Yzd Khalifa

SUPARCO said:


> These are just his empty statements as his tenure runs out next year. He wants to leave some sort of a legacy of himself after being a complete failure for Afghanistan in past 12-years of his rule.



Yeah, he should make sure that he takes his intelligence stooge out too or else.


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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> So what do you really want to prove? being pessimistic, ill wisher to Afghanistan or what?



I was just refuting your alternate history scenarios in which " Taliban were all Pakistani nationals " and they had " no local support in Afghanistan " and " the new versions of Taliban " thing with ' cold hard bitter facts showing the reality on ground ' and a dose of reality . That is it .

By the way , I am still waiting for the respectful link , does it exist ?


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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Living in the past is unwise. Lets be honest and solve the problems both nations are faced with today.



Very true ! 

Tell this to your so called Govt of Kabul and specially Mr.Karzai who himself assisted the Mujahideen , worked against the communists and was a CIA contractor back then and now . They churn out anti-Pakistan statements every week with some new ridiculous claim , blaming Islamabad for what-not . Propping up the issue of the settled Durand Line just to make things worse with Pakistan , not that it makes any difference to us . But if the Afghans themselves do not want better relations with Islamabad , there's nothing that we can do . Is it our fault that you Afghans have been fighting within yourselves for the last 200 years ? 

We assisted you in your war against the comrades-in-Kabul , we sheltered millions of refugees from your country and do it till this day , every supply to your country goes through Pakistan duty-free from our ports , we even allowed the Indians to provide transit trade , we have committed money for development of your country , we have offered to train your forces and we have assisted you in the negotiations with militants ! What more is it that you want ?

As I said in my first post on this thread , cozying up with enemies of Pakistan will only deteriorate the relations and worsen the situation in your country . Indian presence in Afghanistan isn't acceptable to us .

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## That Guy

Yeti said:


> What do you mean by losing face? as Qatar which is largely seen as a pro western country is also conducting talks with the Taliban and the US is well aware about this.
> 
> There was a recent article from last week in the Times of India about this matter I will try finding it and post it here if I can.
> 
> India is no friend of the Taliban but having no form of communication open with some pockets of the regime would in my view be a mistake.
> 
> As the old saying goes keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Taliban also are human beings they have the same weakness as the rest of us mortals and are susceptible to bribery, India having economic interest in the country must make sure its vital strategic assets are protected by any cost.



You're comparing apples and oranges, Qatar is doing so openly and with US support. India is doing so secretly.

You're assuming to know what is best for India, as if you were in charge of nation and knew all of it's secrets.

Let's take a different approach to this, shall we? India may have some sort of contact (which I doubt), but let's say they do, now having open communication would be a bad thing for them, as it would jeopardize their relationship with the ANA and Afghan gov. They'd see it as India legitimizing the Taliban, and push the Afghan gov towards Pakistan.

Keeping your enemies close will get you killed, that saying has made no sense to me, so I take anyone who says it with a large amount of skepticism.

What regime? The Taliban don't have any form of real governance in the nation, besides just controlling land and taxing people.

Finally, if you can find the link, I would appreciate it.


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## Kavin

That Guy said:


> Anyways, Karzai has always requested lethal military aid to Afghanistan from India. India has always been reluctant, as they don't want to antagonize Pakistan, the simple reason being that if even one of those pieces of equipment falls into militant hands (as a lot of ANA hardware tend to get sold off on the black market by corrupt ANA soldiers), Pakistan can accuse them of sponsoring terrorists and point out "evidence" to prove their claim.
> 
> On the other hand, nothing India does is in the interest of Pakistan's future, no matter what anyone of those political and diplomatic fools claim. If India had a chance, it would break Pakistan into little pieces, but the feeling is mutual, so...yeah.... :|



Very good & balanced post. It's surprising me why most of members (even senior mod & webmaster) start calculating "(a+b)²=a²+b².." when there is no 'a' (requisition for indian troop presense by AF) or 'b' (Indian consideration of sending troop to AF)?

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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> I was just refuting your alternate history scenarios in which " Taliban were all Pakistani nationals " and they had " no local support in Afghanistan " and " the new versions of Taliban " thing with ' cold hard bitter facts showing the reality on ground ' and a dose of reality . That is it .
> 
> By the way , I am still waiting for the respectful link , does it exist ?



In fact your whole army is Taliban-minded fighters hiding in uniform. your SSG was fighting against Northern Alliance alongside Taliban during Taliban regimen. Thousands were slaughtered in the mountains of north.
Taliban is a Pakistani phenomenon. Its a way for Pakistan to survive, Its in Pakistan's national interest to have good relations with Taliban, as your Hamid Gul said once.
Accept this simple fact instead arguing like a foool.

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## BeyondHeretic

Israel weapons in the hand of afghans gives the Taliban the edge , there's a purpose to this , think about it


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## muse

somebozo said:


> Two solutions for Afghanistan.
> 
> 1. Pakistan should annex the Pashtun majority parts while Tajik and Uzbeck majorities should be encouraged to join their respective countries.
> 
> 2. Pakistan should build a giant fence on Af-Pak border manned by automatic guns shooting any intruder in range.




Tajik, Uzbek, Hazara, Aimak, Arab and Pashai have as much right to Pakistani government services and fruits of a Palistani economy open to participation by all ---- Pashtun in Afghanistan are not clamoring for Pakistan to annex areas in which they live nor is any sane person in the Pakistan government going to give this idea serious thought.

It will be interesting to hear the views of the Chinese and the Russe, they in turn would be interested to see how the US wants to play the Iranian


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## That Guy

Kavin said:


> Very good & balanced post. It's surprising me why most of members (even senior mod & webmaster) start calculating "(a+b)²=a²+b².." when there is no 'a' (requisition for indian troop presense by AF) or 'b' (Indian consideration of sending troop to AF)?



Thank you, unfortunately, I have to agree, some of the senior members and even a few so called "think tanks" (not going to name anyone here, already got in trouble for that) tend to have a one sided view on here.

I try and be balanced when it comes to these issues, I consider it a disservice to people's intelligence by being one sided, but you know how people on both sides are (whether Indian or Pakistani), and I always get beaten on by people who always claim I'm bias or use straw-man arguments 



Digital Soldier said:


> In fact your whole army is Taliban-minded fighters hiding in uniform. your SSG was fighting against Northern Alliance alongside Taliban during Taliban regimen. Thousands were slaughtered in the mountains of north.
> Taliban is a Pakistani phenomenon. Its a way for Pakistan to survive, Its in Pakistan's national interest to have good relations with Taliban, as your Hamid Gul said once.
> Accept this simple fact instead arguing like a foool.



Wow, what a revisionist view you have. I have to admire your imagination, it's quite something.

Pakistan supported the Taliban, yes, but it is no longer in Pakistan's interest to support them.

The Taliban aren't stupid, they won't forget about the assistance that Pakistan gave NATO, and that will be held against them.

I've said it before many times, no matter who wins in Afghanistan, Pakistan loses.


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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> abe chup kar, you think you are Israel.we can do anything we want in our country.
> 
> We respect Israel more then you pak satan. Even if Israel want to come we will let them, its our choice.



So , your refugees in Pakistan parents never taught you any manners , kiddo . Why quote my post out of context when I actually said " Indian presence in Afghanistan is not acceptable to us " ?  . Yeah , delude yourself about doing anything you like when majority of your country is still controlled by militants and there exists no Govt with any power . 

@Armstrong @muse @FaujHistorian @Hyperion The funeral of the Muslim Ummah concept comes to mind , what say you guys ?

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## Secur

Digital Soldier said:


> Taliban is a Pakistani phenomenon. Its a way for Pakistan to survive, Its in Pakistan's national interest to have good relations with Taliban, as your Hamid Gul said once.
> Accept this simple fact instead arguing like a foool.


 
You have a pathetic habit of diverting the debate , first of all , I want that respectful link you rambled from your first post here about the article lying about the military request ? 

Second , Taliban emerged in Afghanistan if you read your own history properly , we supported them just because other countries like India and Iran were supporting Northern Alliance and other Shia groups , all fought for their interests , it just happened that ours won .  So , no need to play " angel angel " with me , here . When you cant control the country , somebody else will try to . Something , you Afghans haven't learned for the last 200 years . 

Accept that you are a pathological liar who cant back up his claims with sources and tries to argue against the sun and when all fails , start the same " autobot " lecture about Taliban and Pakistan . I may reciprocate in kind , maybe .

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## muse

Secur said:


> When you cant control the country , somebody else will try to . Something , you Afghans haven't learned for the last 200 years . .



That could be Pakistan as well, couldn't it? Digital Soldier may be more angry than rational in his post, but lets look at this beyond, us vs them, because as you can see, sometimes they are the same - wear are a peoples that agreed to lose a majority of it country to satisfy what exactly?? And we are a peoples who are not united in condemning sectarian hate organizations, heck our own army nurtured and created those organizations.

Look, lets for arguments sake say that it is may 2015, the most US and NATO are gone, and consensus is the US with regard to paying for a ANA is fraying -- and that increasingly Afghanistan is being run by war lords and the idea of Afghanistan as a state is one that is increasingly difficult to imagine, the ANA suffer many desertions and defeats 

Quick question -- What do you imagine would be going on in Pakistan at the same time?????????????? Will Jihad fever have died down? Will sectarianism die down? Will international financial institutions be willing to bail out our non-tax paying behinds?? And will the so called Pakistan army really be willing to protect you, yes, specifically, you??

So, lets give Digiotal a wide berth, lets look at this less nationalistically and with more of preventative bent.

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## Parul

*India offers more aid for Afghanistan
India announces more training and reconstruction aid, as Afghan president seeks help ahead of withdrawal of NATO troops.*

India has offered to provide more training and reconstruction aid for Afghanistan as most international troops prepare to withdraw next year.

President Pranab Mukherjee told visiting Afghan President Hamid Karzai that India was proud to help, a statement from Mukherjee's office said on Tuesday.

"India is prepared to increase bilateral contribution to institution-building, training and equipment to the extent India can," Mukherjee said. The statement did not say whether it would include military aid.

Aimal Faizi, Karzai&#8217;s spokesperson, earlier said that Afghanistan would ask for Indian help in the strengthening of its security forces ahead of the withdrawal of international forces.

Karzai also held talks with Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh later on Tuesday.

"I think we should respond positively to Afghan requests for assistance to build the Afghan security forces," former Indian Ambassador to Afghanistan, Vivek Katju, told Al Jazeera from New Delhi.

"We already have a process of training the Afghan forces in India that can be stepped up, and if the Afghans require equipment to develop their capabilities... we should also have a positive response."

Strategic partnership

A 2011 strategic partnership agreement between the two countries includes Indian training of Afghan security forces. Small batches of Afghan soldiers are undergoing training at Indian military schools.

India has invested more than $2bn in Afghan infrastructure, including highways and hospitals and rural electricity projects. It is also helping the Afghan government rebuild its police forces, judiciary and diplomatic services.

New Delhi is hoping to gain some influence in the country after 2014, when Afghan forces are to become responsible for the entire country's security.

As NATO troops prepare to withdraw, India fears the possibility of the country falling into the hands of a Taliban-led regime, endangering many of India's interests there.

India, Afghanistan and Iran have been discussing how best to utilise the southeastern Iranian port of Chahbahar and develop road and rail links from there to Afghanistan.

For India, the shortest and most economical route for sending supplies to Afghanistan would be by road through Pakistan. But Pakistan, India's bitter rival, has denied New Delhi road access to Kabul, making the route through Iran all the more significant.

Karzai, who earned his college degree in India, has visited New Delhi more than a half dozen times in the past few years.


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## Jzaib

Indian troops in afghanistan, Good for US now when ever we have to go hunting will will just cross border and go in Afghanistan for hunting ..

On a serious note ..i think india is smart enough , they will not move troops in Afghanistan.. But they can support them and influence them with dollars ..that is much better for India


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## Secur

muse said:


> That could be Pakistan as well, couldn't it? Digital Soldier may be more angry than rational in his post, but lets look at this beyond, us vs them, because as you can see, sometimes they are the same - wear are a peoples that agreed to lose a majority of it country to satisfy what exactly?? And we are a peoples who are not united in condemning sectarian hate organizations, heck our own army nurtured and created those organizations.
> 
> Look, lets for arguments sake say that it is may 2015, the most US and NATO are gone, and consensus is the US with regard to paying for a ANA is fraying -- and that increasingly Afghanistan is being run by war lords and the idea of Afghanistan as a state is one that is increasingly difficult to imagine, the ANA suffer many desertions and defeats
> 
> Quick question -- What do you imagine would be going on in Pakistan at the same time?????????????? Will Jihad fever have died down? Will sectarianism die down? Will international financial institutions be willing to bail out our non-tax paying behinds?? And will the so called Pakistan army really be willing to protect you, yes, specifically, you??
> 
> So, lets give Digiotal a wide berth, lets look at this less nationalistically and with more of preventative bent.



That is true for all countries , mate . Just more true for decades for Afghanistan . I do not care about his state of mind or emotional banter about Pakistan , but I dislike very much these alternate histories . Well , that has been discussed to death before , muse , why we lost East Pakistan ? There are differing opinions but none of them discount the Govt of Pakistan back then in any way . It sometimes happens , that we are left with no choice , so after the Americans abandoned the Afghanistan after Soviet defeat , we had to manage that mess and it turned messy with other players poking their nose in . Caught between the devil and deep sea , we played for our interests , the same as India and Iran did . Do you believe that Dostam was an angel who could lead the Afghans to freedom , had he lived ? No , he was just another warlord . The same dilemma that Musharraf faced after 9/11 .

Well the current plans are the same , there's no need to make it for argument's sake but still . I see a future bleak for Afghanistan with the fight turning towards the Northern Safehouses and the same situation being repeated again . 

Hard to predict , mate , very hard . The fight can turn elsewhere towards other races in Afghanistan or return back to Kashmir or worst of all affect Pakistan . I am seriously not seeing anything very promising for my country but for now , we have nothing to lose if you want to talk that way . The army's there and its controlling the situation very well at the moment in the militant infested areas , a few hit and run are no indicator of control for Taliban .

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## muse

Secur said:


> T I dislike very much these alternate histories . Well , that has been discussed to death before , muse , why we lost East Pakistan ? There are differing opinions but none of them discount the Govt of Pakistan back then in any way . It sometimes happens , that we are left with no choice , so after the Americans abandoned the Afghanistan after Soviet defeat , we had to manage that mess and it turned messy with other players poking their nose in . Caught between the devil and deep sea , we played for our interests , the same as India and Iran did . Do you believe that Dostam was an angel who could lead the Afghans to freedom , had he lived ? No , he was just another warlord . The same dilemma that Musharraf faced after 9/11 .
> 
> Well the current plans are the same , there's no need to make it for argument's sake but still . I see a future bleak for Afghanistan with the fight turning towards the Northern Safehouses and the same situation being repeated again .
> 
> Hard to predict , mate , very hard . The fight can turn elsewhere towards other races in Afghanistan or return back to Kashmir or worst of all affect Pakistan . I am seriously not seeing anything very promising for my country but for now , we have nothing to lose if you want to talk that way . *The army's there and its controlling the situation very well at the moment in the militant infested areas , a few hit and run are no indicator of control for Taliban* .



Recall you told Digital that Afghans "did not learn" -- Are we better? From what you have written, it seems that it has all been one disaster to another, how very much like Afghanistan?

I realize that on this forum, one has to be more Catholic than the Pope, when it comes to the so called Pakistan army, for my money it is the root of all evil in Pakistan, (by the way you will see that expressing the idea that the Pakistan Army is the root of evil in Pakistan, will go the way of the Dodo) -- Why is it the root of evil? Because it has become the ****** army, it is no longer loyal to any notion other than a radical Wahabized, Arabized, Pakistan -- and they will not defend you, unless you are their tyoe of people in which case you don't need defending (just ask ANP)

Anyway, back to the topic at hand, this unbalanced Karzai playing rogue - What's he going to get from the Indian, other than thanks for coming? Not much, actually nothing. look for noises making nice to the Iranians next.


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## Thorough Pro

Karzai must be asking for lethal weapons that india used against China in DBO to bulldoze their own bunkers....LOL hahahaha


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## ejaz007

*Karzai meets Indian leaders in push for military aid*

NEW DELHI: Afghan President Hamid Karzai held talks with Indian leaders Tuesday, hoping to secure more military aid as he looks to beef up his security forces after international troops pull out next year.

An Indian foreign ministry source confirmed that Karzai had held talks late Tuesday with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh after a separate meeting earlier in the evening with his Indian counterpart Pranab Mukherjee.

But there were no immediate details about the discussions and officials said there would be no official statement as is customary after such meetings nor any plans for a press conference.

Officials had said before the meeting that Karzai would use his trip to India to drum up support from a long-time ally.

Karzai's spokesman, Aimal Faizi, said last week that Karzai would ask for "all kinds of assistance from India in order to strengthen our military and security institutions" during his talks in the capital New Delhi.

An Indian foreign ministry official, speaking on condition of anonymity, also said at the weekend that the discussions would cover a potential arms deal between the two countries.

"India is ready to meet any request that would strengthen Afghan security institutions," said the official.

India has been training a limited number of Afghan military officers for years at its military institutions, but has provided little weapons assistance except for some vehicles.

Speaking on Monday night as he accepted an honorary degree from a university in the northern state of Punjab, Karzai thanked India for its support since he came to power in 2001 after the fall of the Taliban.

"India, as a friend of Afghanistan, has made an immense contribution in uplifting its youths," he said.

"India has contributed $2 billion from the hard-earned money of its taxpayers for the betterment of Afghanistan."

Karzai meets Indian leaders in push for military aid - thenews.com.pk


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## Secur

muse said:


> Recall you told Digital that Afghans "did not learn" -- Are we better? From what you have written, it seems that it has all been one disaster to another, how very much like Afghanistan?
> 
> Anyway, back to the topic at hand, this unbalanced Karzai playing rogue - What's he going to get from the Indian, other than thanks for coming? Not much, actually nothing. look for noises making nice to the Iranians next.



I remember well , mate  . Yes , somehow we are , muse , we did learn at times . From sanctions and American treachery . That is another story that at most important occasions , we were left but with one option . No other choice to make it simple . I am talking about the civil war in Afghanistan after Soviets left and the Op.Enduring Freedom after September 11 attacks . But we never learned to keep our foreign policy " balanced " and this is what saddens me . 

I would leave the army part for another thread , seriously . Because that will derail the thread . 

What opinion did you have when Karzai said " the US wanted bases - several of them " only to be met with a strong denial from the top American brass ? I know his unbalanced part , I just do not know where does it end . At " conjoined twins " things , at requesting " Indian military presence " part or the much awaited Tehran trip next . I personally , do not think he's going to get anything from New Dehli for some reasons . Cant he get better military aid from the EU countries who are actually willing to help him ? I see nothing of substance that the Indians can sell at the moment .


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## muse

Secur said:


> we were left but with one option . No other choice to make it simple . I am talking about the civil war in Afghanistan after Soviets left and the Op.Enduring Freedom after September 11 attacks . But we never learned to keep our foreign policy " balanced " and this is what saddens me .
> What opinion did you have when Karzai said " the US wanted bases - several of them " only to be met with a strong denial from the top American brass ? I know his unbalanced part , I just do not know where does it end . At " conjoined twins " things , at requesting " Indian military presence " part or the much awaited Tehran trip next . I personally , do not think he's going to get anything from New Dehli for some reasons . Cant he get better military aid from the EU countries who are actually willing to help him ? I see nothing of substance that the Indians can sell at the moment .




I'm pretty confident that this India trip is more show than substance -- While, I think, Pakistan do want a new relationship with India, a relationship where they allow uncontested, India to arm a potential adversary, especially when it cannot supply that adversary, that's just too "new" of a relationship with India

And the Indian knows this, if the so called Pakistan army can create the general impression in Pakistan that it has made peace with TTP, while at the same time persuading the Indian, the Russian and the Chinese and the Iranian, that the so called Pakistan army is a leoard that can change it's pots, well, that's a significant achievement


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## rubyjackass

muse said:


> That could be Pakistan as well, couldn't it? Digital Soldier may be more angry than rational in his post, but lets look at this beyond, us vs them, because as you can see, sometimes they are the same - wear are a peoples that agreed to lose a majority of it country to satisfy what exactly?? And we are a peoples who are not united in condemning sectarian hate organizations, heck our own army nurtured and created those organizations.
> 
> Look, lets for arguments sake say that it is may 2015, the most US and NATO are gone, and consensus is the US with regard to paying for a ANA is fraying -- and that increasingly Afghanistan is being run by war lords and the idea of Afghanistan as a state is one that is increasingly difficult to imagine, the ANA suffer many desertions and defeats
> 
> Quick question -- What do you imagine would be going on in Pakistan at the same time?????????????? Will Jihad fever have died down? Will sectarianism die down? Will international financial institutions be willing to bail out our non-tax paying behinds?? And will the so called Pakistan army really be willing to protect you, yes, specifically, you??
> 
> So, lets give Digiotal a wide berth, lets look at this less nationalistically and with more of preventative bent.



True man. Finally I saw one Pakistani who would accept that Taliban(both the bad and good variety) is dangerous for Pakistan. Most Pakistanis are just happy to have their leg burnt as long as the heat from it irks India. They are not seeing what happens when USA leaves. They plan to push out every last extremist into Afghanistan, like it is possible. Even if it is possible, it is morally wrong to wish upon someone what you don't what for yourself.

And they use a grand word called strategic plan for this drama. Like they have been masters at the game for decades. Somebody please them to stop boxing above their weight.


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## Digital Soldier

That Guy said:


> The Taliban aren't stupid.



They are morons of the worst kind on this planet.


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## Digital Soldier

Secur said:


> So , your refugees in Pakistan parents never taught you any manners , kiddo . Why quote my post out of context when I actually said " Indian presence in Afghanistan is not acceptable to us " ?  . Yeah , delude yourself about doing anything you like when majority of your country is still controlled by militants and there exists no Govt with any power .



      I don't have time to type for you foool.



Secur said:


> You have a pathetic habit of diverting the debate , first of all
> Accept that you are a pathological liar .



I don't prefer to directly react the words of a hypocrite and idiot like you and this does not mean i am a pathological liar.


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## Yeti

That Guy said:


> You're comparing apples and oranges, Qatar is doing so openly and with US support. India is doing so secretly.
> 
> You're assuming to know what is best for India, as if you were in charge of nation and knew all of it's secrets.
> 
> Let's take a different approach to this, shall we? India may have some sort of contact (which I doubt), but let's say they do, now having open communication would be a bad thing for them, as it would jeopardize their relationship with the ANA and Afghan gov. They'd see it as India legitimizing the Taliban, and push the Afghan gov towards Pakistan.
> 
> Keeping your enemies close will get you killed, that saying has made no sense to me, so I take anyone who says it with a large amount of skepticism.
> 
> What regime? The Taliban don't have any form of real governance in the nation, besides just controlling land and taxing people.
> 
> Finally, if you can find the link, I would appreciate it.






I do not agree that having some sort of communication open would be a bad thing as having no form of contact as we did pre 9/11 did not do us any favours.

The USA knows all to well about the risk of terrorism faced by India if you remember the 2008 Indian embassy bombing in Kabul it was linked to the ISI through the Haqqani network and Taliban.

I am not saying that we should hold tea talks with the Taliban but in having a channel open with some of it's elements and that is also the view that many in our security establishment have been saying also.

The Americans themselves I must add have also met with Mullah Omar&#8217;s representatives, including Syed Taib Agha, a Taliban ambassador-at-large because there is a general view that the Taliban are not going to go away whether we like it or not so to ignore them and have no contact with them is a real mistake from a security point of view.


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## surya kiran

muse said:


> I'm pretty confident that this India trip is more show than substance -- While, I think, Pakistan do want a new relationship with India, a relationship where they allow uncontested, India to arm a potential adversary, especially when it cannot supply that adversary, that's just too "new" of a relationship with India
> 
> And the Indian knows this, if the so called Pakistan army can create the general impression in Pakistan that it has made peace with TTP, while at the same time persuading the Indian, the Russian and the Chinese and the Iranian, that the so called Pakistan army is a leoard that can change it's pots, well, that's a significant achievement



Indian agenda for Afghanistan is driven by the following :

1. Impact on Indian investment in Afghanistan
2. Impact on Kashmir

Both of these are dependent on how the new power situation plays out in Pakistan. The KP province will have IK at its head. Now, if they go for reconciliation with the extremist elements without disarming them, it is going to be the start of a new problem. This is going to be a more likely scenario.

Now, second question is how will the re-rehabilitation of militants happen? And will it happen. Easy solution is to re-direct their efforts towards a second target and the second target is quite obvious. Now this may not happen, but if it does there will be a re-action.

Indian supply of equipment will not be required in quantities. Why? The amount of equipment left behind by the Americans should be sufficient. Now, India could increase training programs and supply of choppers, that is a possibility. Also, I will not rule of Indian policy makers talking to Taliban elements to ensure protection of Indian investments. There will be speeding up of the Chabbar route and the taliban elements will get paid off to ensure smooth movement of goods.


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## Koovie

jha said:


> Some Anti-tank Missiles, artillery guns and some Akash should be a good start...



The Army desperately lacks ATGMs, arty guns and modern AA weapons and you want to send those things to AFGH. ?!?!


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## jha

Koovie said:


> The Army desperately lacks ATGMs, arty guns and modern AA weapons and you want to send those things to AFGH. ?!?!



Army lacks Next gen. ATGM.. BDL can churn out Milans as much as it wants to.. the same is the case with Arty guns.. We can afford to transfer some 105 mm guns..

Lets not forget that these weapons will enhance their preparedness a lot.. And they are our strategic partners. We are supposed to help them.


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## That Guy

Digital Soldier said:


> They are morons of the worst kind on this planet.



If they were dumb, they would have lost the war already. In order to defeat your enemy, you must first learn to respect them.


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## That Guy

Yeti said:


> I do not agree that having some sort of communication open would be a bad thing as having no form of contact as we did pre 9/11 did not do us any favours.



Having an open communication is a bad thing, India will only face a backlash internationally.



> The USA knows all to well about the risk of terrorism faced by India if you remember the 2008 Indian embassy bombing in Kabul it was linked to the ISI through the Haqqani network and Taliban.



ISI was never linked to them, it was only alleged. If there was evidence, why has India or the US never presented evidence to prove their claim? It's just scapegoating of the worst kind.



> I am not saying that we should hold tea talks with the Taliban but in having a channel open with some of it's elements and that is also the view that many in our security establishment have been saying also.



I think you're confusing contacts with open dialogue, having contacts is fine, but open dialogue is not.

Please name me who in the Indian security establishment is suggesting such a thing. They need to be slapped on the back of their head for trying to mess up relations with Kabul.



> The Americans themselves I must add have also met with Mullah Omar&#8217;s representatives, including Syed Taib Agha, a Taliban ambassador-at-large because there is a general view that the Taliban are not going to go away whether we like it or not so to ignore them and have no contact with them is a real mistake from a security point of view.



The Americans are trying, that is the reason why the Qatar office exists, but there is no evidence that they're getting anywhere with their talks. The Taliban look at the withdrawal as a sign of victory, which means that the US is only negotiating for a safe withdrawal, nothing more...but that's just me speculating.

Who knows, both of us could be wrong and Xenu the galactic overlord created this conflict to amusing him and his space minions.


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## Digital Soldier

That Guy said:


> If they were dumb, they would have lost the war already. In order to defeat your enemy, you must first learn to respect them.



They are not the main mindset, they are just programmed instruments that's why i called them morons of worst kind.


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## ejaz007

*Karzai gives India military equipment &#8216;wish list&#8217;*

NEW DELHI: Afghan President Hamid Karzai said on Wednesday he had given a &#8220;wish list&#8221; of military equipment to India during a visit this week, presenting a conundrum for New Delhi as it weighs whether arming the Afghan army is in its interests. 

India wants to stabilise Afghanistan and is concerned about the resurgence of militant groups after foreign combat troops leave in 2014. But arming Afghanistan would alarm Pakistan. It takes issue with the influence of its old rival in Afghanistan. India does not want to get drawn into a proxy war with Pakistan, which has ties to the Taliban. India and Afghanistan signed a strategic partnership agreement in 2011 under which New Delhi agreed to assist in the training and equipping of Afghan security forces. 

India has trained Afghan security force personnel in its military academies, but it has provided little military equipment, according to Indian officials. India&#8217;s Afghan strategy has centred on boosting its influence through economic reconstruction projects. 

&#8220;We have a wish list that we have put before the government of India,&#8221; Karzai told reporters, adding that it was up to India to decide how much help it was prepared to give Afghanistan. 

Karzai would not say what was on the list, but India&#8217;s firstpost.com website said it included 105 mm artillery, medium-lift aircraft, bridge-laying equipment and trucks. 

The Indian government had no immediate comment on Karzai&#8217;s statement. Karzai&#8217;s spokesman said both countries had agreed not to discuss the contents of the shopping list. 

An Indian government official said earlier that India had already provided some military equipment to Afghanistan but he declined to give details. He said he was surprised that Afghanistan was speaking openly about a weapons request. 

India is not a major weapons exporter, and suffers chronic shortages of defence equipment itself, including artillery. 

Afghanistan&#8217;s request for military equipment comes as its relations with Pakistan, which have been difficult for decades, are again at a low. 

This month, Pakistan border guards and Afghan police clashed over a contested border area. The Afghan police complained they had been out-gunned and said they wanted heavy artillery and tanks. 

Afghan security forces have also made no secret of their desire for an air force. 

The clash over their border, which Afghanistan has never officially recognised, raised new tension between Afghanistan and Pakistan. reuters

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan


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## skysthelimit

> *Why India is concerned about supplying arms to Afghanistan*
> May 22, 2013
> 
> Early this month, border guard Muhammad Kasim sauntered over to the Pakistani soldiers who had begun to erect fortifications near his dusty outpost in southern Afghanistan. He demanded they leave-and the words were followed by bullets.
> 
> Kasim was killed, and three other Afghans injured, in clashes that went on for six hours. Protestors have since marched through Afghanistan's cities shouting anti-Pakistan slogans, undaunted by a Taliban attack that claimed 11 lives. President Hamid Karzai has been riding wave of public anger, calling on the Taliban to to drop their weapons against Afghanistan's people and aim at where the hostility is coming from.
> 
> Karzai arrived in New Delhi on Tuesday, armed with a short but lethal wish-list that will let him aim wherever he wishes: 105 millimetre artillery, An.32 medium-lift aircraft, bridge-laying equipment, trucks. The equipment Karzai seeks isn't a military game-changer, but then the reason he wants isn't killing. The request is in fact a signal to Pakistan-a warning that if Islamabad continues to sponsor jihadists, the price will be a growing Indian military presence in Afghanistan.
> 
> India promised, in a strategic partnership agreement signed in 2011 to assist in the training, equipping and capacity building programmes for [the] Afghan National Security Forces. New Delhi, though, has stalled Karzai since his requests for military hardware were first revealed in November, 2012. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's cherished pursuit of peace with Pakistan, the government feared, would be dead if India went down that road. New Delhi thus chose to dither-but it's running out of time to take a call.
> 
> ]Hamid Karzai. Reuters. Hamid Karzai. Reuters.
> Fighting along the Durand Line-the 2,640km. frontier drawn by imperial administrator Mortimer Durand and Afghan amir Abdur Rahman Khan in 1893, but never ratified by Kabul-has erupted periodically since 9/11. Last year, attacks by jihadist groups operating with Pakistan army support set off skirmishes which ran through the summer and autumn. In 2007, clashes broke out when the Pakistan army sought to erect fences inside Afghan territory in the Angoor Adda area, along the border with South Waziristan. In the summer of 2003, the Afghan government claimed Pakistan established bases up to 600 metres inside its territory.
> 
> In essence, Pakistan has been seeking to enforce the Durand Line, occupying positions vacated by departing international forces, and thus assert its sovreignity over ethnic-Pashtun tribes on its side of the border.
> 
> Kabul has, in turn, done its best to stop the line from settling. The message is simple: if the Pakistan army doesn't stop trying to install its jihadist proxies north of the border, Kabul will stoke Pashtun irredentism.
> 
> Last year, some thought the two sides had reached a deal. Pakistan promised to move incarcerated Taliban commanders to Doha, and thus facilitate negotiations between them and Afghan peace council chief Salahuddin Rabbani. In the event 18 low-ranking Taliban were released-but remained on in Pakistan, most without severing their links to the insurgency. Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence shot down Afghan demands for key pro-dialogue Taliban leader Abdul Gani Baradar. To make things worse, terrorist commanders like Islamist warlord Jalaluddin Haqqani continue to operate from safe havens inside Pakistan.
> 
> The key hardware Afghanistan wants include hand-me-down A2.A18 105-milimeter howitzer, a robust and rugged weapon India has used for years. The Afghan army has an estimated 84 second-hand A2.A18s-also known as the D.30-donated by Slovakia and Bosnia. The Afghan army also has an estimated two dozen 155-milimetre Korean war vintage M-114A1 howitzers. India is in the process of phasing out its 105-milimetre M.1954 130-milimetre with state-of-the-art United States-made M.777 howitzers, as part of an $14 billion programme.
> 
> In addition, Afghanistan wants urgent assistance to get its mothballed fleet of Antonov An.32 medium transport aircraft back into the air. Earlier this year, the Afghan army lost its second-hand Finmeccanica G.222 transports, after the United States cancelled the $317 million deal which had enabled their induction in 2008. The G.222s had to be grounded because of airworthiness problems in December, 2011 and March, 2012. The Afghan army is now forced to operate using a fleet of six Cessna 182 light transports, essentially commuter planes.
> 
> Karzai wants to have the six An.32s given to his country by the Soviet Union refitted in the Ukraine, where the Indian Air Force is upgrading its own fleet of 105 aircraft. Indian air force sources have told Firstpost that the An.32-which, brand new, comes with a price tag of $6-9 million-is a rugged aircraft that has proven itself in high-altitude regions with poor airstrips.
> 
> The Afghan army may, in the future, also consider requesting service infrastructure for its helicopter fleet India. The country now has 40-plus Mi.8/Mi.17 transport helicopters, as well as 11 Mi.35 attack helicopters-adequate to meet its needs. It is short, though, of engineers to keep the fleet flying.
> 
> For India, the costs of this kit are small change-but government sources in New Delhi say there are three concerns. First, no-one is sure the Afghan army will hold together. Now estimated at 352,000-strong, Afghanistan's security forces will cost $4bn a year to support post-2014. Participants at the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation's summit in Chicago last May agreed to continue to foot the Bill until 2017. Kabul worries, though, that the purse strings will soon be tightened. It's worth noting that Afghanistan's defence budget fell from $2.49bn in 2011, to $2.09bn in 2012.
> 
> In addition, Afghanistan's army is riven by the same ethnic tensions as the country. The army's strength is 38 percent ethnic Pashtuns, 25 percent Tajik, 19 percent Hazara and 12 percent Uzbek. In the event international funding for the armed forces dries up after 2014, the army could start collapsing back into the warlord militia organisations from which it was initially drawn.
> 
> Perhaps more important, there's no clarity on Afghan politics after elections scheduled for 2014. From India's point of view, the best-case scenario will an alliance that pulls together Northern notables, like former foreign minister Abdullah Abdullah, with anti-Taliban Pashtuns like Hanif Atmar. Talks are underway, but should they fail, the next Afghan president could be a pro-Pakistan figures like Muhammad Umar Daudzai, now ambassador to Islamabad. New Delhi doesn't, for obvious reasons, see profit in giving aid to a Pakistan-backed dispensation.
> 
> Finally, and most important, there's Pakistan. For its own reasons, New Delhi does not want to be seen as backing territorial revisionism in the region. It also worries that military support to Kabul could end any hopes of dialogue with Prime Minister-in-waiting Nawaz Sharif.
> 
> Indian-provided artillery hitting Pakistani troops across the Durand Line will, without doubt, kill off any prospect of forward movement in bilateral ties. It's also true, though, that bar ideological proponents of India-Pakistan peace, few think there's much left to be salvaged from the dialogue process. Ever since 2008, when General Pervez Musharraf was forced out of office, the Prime Minister's Pakistan policies have yielded diminishing returns-a point illustrated in stark relief by 26/11 and the country's accelerating tactical nuclear weapons programme.
> 
> New Delhi, not for the first time, thus has to make a hard choice. If the past is a guide, though, it will likely impale itself to the fence.



Why India is concerned about supplying arms to Afghanistan - Firstpost


Good analysis of India's options.


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## That Guy

Digital Soldier said:


> They are not the main mindset, they are just programmed instruments that's why i called them morons of worst kind.



Have you actually interviewed everyone in Southern Afghanistan? I'd hazard a guess and say you haven't. As such, I'm inclined to not believe a word you say, as it's pure speculation.



skysthelimit said:


> Why India is concerned about supplying arms to Afghanistan - Firstpost
> 
> 
> Good analysis of India's options.



As soon as I read the first paragraph, I stopped reading. The entire thing is made to make Pakistan look bad.

This isn't an analysis, it's a rant.


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## AUSTERLITZ

No indian troops on foreign soil.I think everyone underestimating common afghan soldier.They have once been under taliban trauma,don't want to see their beloved country ruined again.Just provide logistics and weapon support and ANA will take care of talib bastards on their own.NATO will give them air support and drones to crush any major troop concentration anyway.


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## FaujHistorian

Secur said:


> So , your refugees in Pakistan parents never taught you any manners , kiddo . Why quote my post out of context when I actually said " Indian presence in Afghanistan is not acceptable to us " ?  . Yeah , delude yourself about doing anything you like when majority of your country is still controlled by militants and there exists no Govt with any power .
> 
> @Armstrong @muse @FaujHistorian @Hyperion The funeral of the Muslim Ummah concept comes to mind , what say you guys ?




Ummah concept only lived in the over-active minds of Desi Muslims. Everyone has been $hitting on it for a long long long long long time. 


Coming back to the OP. 

Us Pakistani posters on this forum don't need to convince Afghanistanis or INdians about what to do on Afghanistan soil. 

If they soil their own soil, who are we to stop them. They have been doing it for a long long time. 


I trust our army to take care of any threat that may come from such schemes. 

so us the poor civis don't need to push to much in one way or the other. 


peace

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## skysthelimit

That Guy said:


> As soon as I read the first paragraph, I stopped reading. The entire thing is made to make Pakistan look bad.
> 
> This isn't an analysis, it's a rant.



Aww, little baby thinks Pakistani soldiers can't do anything bad!


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## That Guy

skysthelimit said:


> Aww, little baby thinks Pakistani soldiers can't do anything bad!



No, I refuse to read further because the author has shown that he's incompetent. The first paragraph PROVES that he's basing his opinions on nothing but pure speculations. There is no evidence that Pakistan fired first, and there is no evidence that the man went up to the border post to tell them to stop building it.

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## skysthelimit

That Guy said:


> No, I refuse to read further because the author has shown that he's incompetent. The first paragraph PROVES that he's basing his opinions on nothing but pure speculations. There is no evidence that Pakistan fired first, and there is no evidence that the man went up to the border post to tell them to stop building it.



Except the testimony of the Afghan soldiers - but i guess they don't count.

Still you should read the article, it is actually pretty fair to Pakistani concerns. Or you can bury your head in the sand - your choice.


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## That Guy

skysthelimit said:


> Except the testimony of the Afghan soldiers - but i guess they don't count.
> 
> Still you should read the article, it is actually pretty fair to Pakistani concerns. Or you can bury your head in the sand - your choice.



And you're going to believe a group of people that have more interest in humiliating Pakistan, rather than telling an non-distorted view?

Out of concern for fairness, I actually did go through the article, and while it is not as bad as it seems, I still think it is not worth reading. I still think the author is stuck in his anti-Pakistani mentality and some of the assumptions he makes, I find to be wrong.


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## Shaggy82

SUPARCO said:


> I say India should go in gun blazing to Afghanistan and conquer Kabul, don't hold back. This is India's chance and it won't get another one.
> 
> In Pakistan, a Taliban-friendly government is about to be sworn in. if India doesn't help out the Afghans now with troops and heavy weaponry, both India and Afghanistan will be dead meat in couple of years.



Two jokes in one

Nawaz Shareef Government pro Taliban 

India and Afghanistan "Dead Meat"


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