# We Are Soldiers



## moha199

For over seas Pakistanis watch it at this link at 7pm PST Saturday
http://www.dawntv.org/


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## Silverfalcon

i am seeing it now..

recording it also..

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## Imran Khan

thanks alot i see but cant record please post it to youtube and give me link bro.


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## Kasrkin

Very well done, bravo! Much better than I expected. Even though I didn't see the whole thing, it was clearly professionally done with the right historical references and largely accurate appraisals thoroughly presented. I liked the video game theme too when they were scrolling through the weapons and their performances, very innovative. Wajahat Hussain, while no expert at war, did do his research well enough.

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## Skywalker

Anxiously waiting for the recording.


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## pak-marine

post some videos plzz


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## s90

Oh sh!t i missed it


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## Rafael

Some pics from the documentary I found on Dawn website.. Sorry guys but till no Video

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## Rafael



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## Rafael




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## Sunny4pak

I have seen this video but at the last 15 minutes anybody recorded this documentary...............


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## batmannow

Silverfalcon said:


> i am seeing it now..
> 
> recording it also..



thts great sir, plz upload on the fourm , thanks


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## FarhanDanish

tomorrow i watch this program. very nice program


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## FarhanDanish

please share recording of "We Are Soldiers" 30.05.2009


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## Silverfalcon

I will InshAllah try to upload the recording on some video sharing site.

Just don't count on it though....

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## Imran Khan

i will wait for that silverfalcon


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## arslan_treen

^ count me in .. Upload plz !!


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## aziz raza

I couldnot see please upload at forum


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## Silverfalcon

I dont think i will be able to upload the recording , cause i have recorded it in my Tv's harddrive and i can't take it out from there.

but don't worry.

here are the shows repeat timings.



*and the link where u can watch dawn news live.*

Dawn TV Online Live | Watch Dawn News TV Channel Live Online for FREE! | News | RizwanAshraf.com

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## SQ8

The guy hosting it is quite fake


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## Silverfalcon

santro said:


> The guy hosting it is quite fake



he isn't any professional, but he seems to have done his homework pretty well.

saying that he is fake is plain rude.

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## SQ8

He is fake.. As far as the research is concerned, Its his producer and script writer that has done his research.


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## anathema

nobody recorded this stuff...thats sad .....looked like a good documentary, was waiting to see it.


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## batmannow

*our mods , should have been did this great thing! record & upload on the fourm*


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## Elmo

Firstly, it was obvious that his researcher had a lot of help from the ISPR/army. the content certainly wasn't done by a lay-man.

Secondly, the guy's accent and tone were overbearing and obnoxious. Inflections at the wrong time etc etc. So may be he came across as "fake". But my issue with the programme was its content: there was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen. You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only. Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo.

Thirdly, there's always next week. You guys can be prepared to record the programme then

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## Durran3

dam i missed.. it anyone know when the rerun is ?


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## batmannow

Nadja said:


> Firstly, it was obvious that his researcher had a lot of help from the ISPR/army. the content certainly wasn't done by a lay-man.
> 
> Secondly, the guy's accent and tone were overbearing and obnoxious. Inflections at the wrong time etc etc. So may be he came across as "fake". But my issue with the programme was its content: there was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen. You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only. Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo.
> 
> Thirdly, there's always next week. You guys can be prepared to record the programme then



IT WILL MAKE IT , POLITICLY CONTROVERCIAL!
I GUSS , ITS OKY , its an army doucumentry, & thts it!


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## Golden tigers

ANYONE TELL ME THE TIMMINGS OF THIS PROGRAM. PLZ


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## Silverfalcon

it will be repeated tomorrow at 11:05 PM on dawn news.

i already gave the link above to watch dawn news live.


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## Elmo

batmannow said:


> IT WILL MAKE IT , POLITICLY CONTROVERCIAL!
> I GUSS , ITS OKY , its an army doucumentry, & thts it!




Former armymen/independent analysis makes it politically controversial? How? 

It's an army documentary not done by the army/ISPR, rather by an independent news channel.

Hence that's not it and it's not okay


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## Zulfiqar

Third Promo video:

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## blain2

Nadja said:


> Former armymen/independent analysis makes it politically controversial? How?
> 
> It's an army documentary not done by the army/ISPR, rather by an independent news channel.
> 
> Hence that's not it and it's not okay



The purpose of these documentaries is not always to go into the depth of all the pros and cons of the issue. The reason for this are many. First of all, such documentaries are produced for laypersons. They cannot understand all of the issues around the challenges of absorbing equipment, changes in training doctrine etc. etc. As such the idea is to give a very high level view of life for an infanteer.

The fact that this documentary incorporates certain technical critique is already a good thing because almost 99&#37; of the urdu ones have been done for promotional reasons. Secondly, Armed Forces all over the world have very serious issues with their problems or challenges being brought out in the open. There are operational security reasons as well as a military culture which frowns upon sensitive issues being discussed out in public.

Usually such issues are discussed in much more detail in the writings and journals by officers (retd mostly) and the services themselves. If you really want to be a scholar of the military affairs within Pakistan and understand many of the issues facing the armed forces then you have to do quite a bit of the homework yourself. Hoping to get all the ins and outs of the armed forces through a documentary done by Dawn is not realistic.

The host of the show did what he is suppose to. He is not an expert or a scholar of such things and to expect him to be at ease with all of the subject matter is again expecting a bit too much. Most of the shows even in the West are documented and researched by a team and then the host goes about presenting the information gleaned via research. This is no different. I used to be able to watch some of the documentaries on Discovery's Military Channel and must say that a lot of that content was also for laypersons without divulging service or technical issues that crop up. The bottom line is that there is too much detail in such issues to be covered in a show. Most viewers would have no interest in such things.

Lastly, most retired personnel will not go on TV and critique the Army or its training philosophy etc. There are issues and problems that are dealt with internally and most like to keep it that way. Because these issues do not need to be in the public domain, there is no reason for such people to talk about them publicly on TV. This is the same reason that while you will see many, many retired officers on TV interview and shows, they will never discuss specifics of service, training doctrine, equipment evaluation etc. in detail. Maybe there has to be a slight shift in the military culture, but until that happens, expect closed doors on a lot of the details.

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## SQ8

The Idea is good, but the execution poor, 
quite a few times the music was too load and off cue. Content was not matched with the description.
so the director needs to be given the axe.


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## Elmo

blain2 said:


> The purpose of these documentaries is not always to go into the depth of all the pros and cons of the issue. The reason for this are many. First of all, such documentaries are produced for laypersons. They cannot understand all of the issues around the challenges of absorbing equipment, changes in training doctrine etc. etc. As such the idea is to give a very high level view of life for an infanteer.
> 
> The fact that this documentary incorporates certain technical critique is already a good thing because almost 99% of the urdu ones have been done for promotional reasons. Secondly, Armed Forces all over the world have very serious issues with their problems or challenges being brought out in the open. There are operational security reasons as well as a military culture which frowns upon sensitive issues being discussed out in public.
> 
> Usually such issues are discussed in much more detail in the writings and journals by officers (retd mostly) and the services themselves. If you really want to be a scholar of the military affairs within Pakistan and understand many of the issues facing the armed forces then you have to do quite a bit of the homework yourself. Hoping to get all the ins and outs of the armed forces through a documentary done by Dawn is not realistic.
> 
> The host of the show did what he is suppose to. He is not an expert or a scholar of such things and to expect him to be at ease with all of the subject matter is again expecting a bit too much. Most of the shows even in the West are documented and researched by a team and then the host goes about presenting the information gleaned via research. This is no different. I used to be able to watch some of the documentaries on Discovery's Military Channel and must say that a lot of that content was also for laypersons without divulging service or technical issues that crop up. The bottom line is that there is too much detail in such issues to be covered in a show. Most viewers would have no interest in such things.
> 
> Lastly, most retired personnel will not go on TV and critique the Army or its training philosophy etc. There are issues and problems that are dealt with internally and most like to keep it that way. Because these issues do not need to be in the public domain, there is no reason for such people to talk about them publicly on TV. This is the same reason that while you will see many, many retired officers on TV interview and shows, they will never discuss specifics of service, training doctrine, equipment evaluation etc. in detail. Maybe there has to be a slight shift in the military culture, but until that happens, expect closed doors on a lot of the details.




Sir, I wasn't asking for an in-depth analysis nor a critique by former soldiers. Just a balance of views. 

Also, I have no intentions/desire of becoming a military scholar

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## Xeric

Nadja said:


> Firstly, it was obvious that his researcher had a lot of help from the ISPR/army. the content certainly wasn't done by a lay-man.


Bad guess.



> Secondly, the guy's accent and tone were overbearing and obnoxious. Inflections at the wrong time etc etc.


Why would that bother you?
i hope you were not the producer?


> But my issue with the programme was its content: there was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen. You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only.


Agreed! It should have shown some 'independent analysis'
But what's so special about the former servicemen?(with due apology to Sir Fatman)

Oh so you are concerned that the _hazir service_ dudes would only give _sub accha hai_ report?

Dont get carried away with that 'Ex-Servicemen Society' kinda thing, how many other former servicemen did you see speaking 'bad' of the military?



> Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo.


And it was exactly meant to be one!

Tell me a military which show up on the media with an "Out Out..we dont need soldiers/ No need to join the military' attitude!

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## Kasrkin

*"But my issue with the programme was its content: there was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen. You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only. Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo...."*

If I may be so bold as to ask exactly what 'balance of view' you are referring to? Be precise, if you found something i.e. a remark, an assessment or a suggestion to be unbalanced then please discuss it. I think as far as the technicals the impartiality was sound, he did not hesitate to explore the weaknesses of all the equipment he discussed and compared it with western equipment, etc. When he referred to Lal Masjhid, which was a successful operation according to military experts, he was careful to imply things were far from perfect. More than that, given that you yourself have admitted are no military scholar or expert, what were you expecting from the show? Perhaps you are referring to the organizational/command aspects that were related, but not discussed. You go any deep into the pros and cons of Pak military doctrine and organization then most people here, let alone Dawn News viewers, would find it not only boring but way over their heads. Maybe you found it &#8216;unbalanced&#8217; because there was no explicit and undisciplined criticism of the army? Well, I feel that was what balanced it, not the other way round.


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## Elmo

enigma947 said:


> Bad guess.
> Why would that bother you?
> i hope you were not the producer?
> Agreed! It should have shown some 'independent analysis'
> But what's so special about the former servicemen?(with due apology to Sir Fatman)
> Oh so you are concerned that the _hazir service_ dudes would only give _sub accha hai_ report?
> Dont get carried away with that 'Ex-Servicemen Society' kinda thing, how many other former servicemen did you see speaking 'bad' of the military?
> And it was exactly meant to be one!
> Tell me a military which show up on the media with an "Out Out..we dont need soldiers/ No need to join the military' attitude!




Yeah thanks for letting me know that a lay-man knows the intricacies of a G-3 rifle, its range, its make, its shortcomings, how it let armymen down in Siachen etc etc. That's information that's widely available on the internet. Bad guess on my part, whatever!
I am not the producer, if I was I would have certainly edited out certain parts out along with the music that kept skipping genres. Don't like incoherence in any work actually. As for ex-servicemen speaking badly, please go through Urdu newspapers more frequently. A week or two back, in a local daily there was a column by a former brigadier against the army operation in Swat and the way it was being conducted. One was not expecting the ex-servicemen to lash out against the army and I am least concerned about what the hazir or ghair-hazir servicemen have to say. As for military attitude on media, there is a reason why you have the "independent" logo attached to a documentary by a private channel which is owned by one of the most conservative media group. If it had an ISPR logo with it (like Alpha Bravo Charlie, Sunehray Din), it would have been fine, but it doesn't. 

Lastly, I haven't bashed the army and you are currently just picking on what I have said for no reason --- and that's not fair! 




Kasrkin said:


> If I may be so bold as to ask exactly what 'balance of view' you are referring to? Be precise, if you found something i.e. a remark, an assessment or a suggestion to be unbalanced then please discuss it. I think as far as the technicals the impartiality was sound, he did not hesitate to explore the weaknesses of all the equipment he discussed and compared it with western equipment, etc. When he referred to Lal Masjhid, which was a successful operation according to military experts, he was careful to imply things were far from perfect. More than that, given that you yourself have admitted are no military scholar or expert, what were you expecting from the show? Perhaps you are referring to the organizational/command aspects that were related, but not discussed. You go any deep into the pros and cons of Pak military doctrine and organization then most people here, let alone Dawn News viewers, would find it not only boring but way over their heads. Maybe you found it &#8216;unbalanced&#8217; because there was no explicit and undisciplined criticism of the army? Well, I feel that was what balanced it, not the other way round.



First of all, I have much better things to do in my life than go scavenging for "explicit and undisciplined criticism" of the army. If I find something wrong with the army, I'll state that unhindered. I did not in this case find anything wrong with what the army was shown doing, so let's leave that matter aside. Not one post so far on this thread has been about the army. It's been only about the programme. So stop grossly extrapolating what I have written and insinuating arguments that were not elicited on my part. It's getting weary for me now.

Coming to main topic, the content of the show, I found it either way too basic (the organizational command, now you'll be really living in another world to not know what a brigadier does or who a three or four star general is etc etc) or way too technical to keep one's attention (like the rifle make). I certainly wasn't expecting an in-depth analysis of military doctrines (where is that coming from anyways?) or pros and cons. It was a detached programme -- talking about ammos and guns, that's not attention-grabbing or even attention-holding for an average viewer. Nothing much on the way a soldier feels or thinks. Lastly, I wasn't expecting anything from the show at all. It hasn't fallen down or gone up, I actually will watch the next instalment of "W.A.S." My assessment is on what I saw during it. Nothing less, nothing more!

*Case Closed.*


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## Skywalker

Nadja said:


> Sir, I wasn't asking for an in-depth analysis nor a critique by former soldiers. Just a balance of views.
> 
> Also, I have no intentions/desire of becoming a military scholar



After reading so much criticism from you in this thread and some other threads, the only advise I can give you is to come back to planet earth as earth is more civilized than pluto and can cure all your negativity. Just an advise.


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## Elmo

Skywalker said:


> After reading so much criticism from you in this thread and some other threads, the only advise I can give you is to come back to planet earth as earth is more civilized than pluto and can cure all your negativity. Just an advise.



Keep rolling on the floor laughing... makes me happy that at least one person finds humour here 

And I love Pluto... have no plans of coming back... so you kinda gotta learn to deal with that man!


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## Xeric

Skywalker said:


> the only advise I can give you is to come back to planet earth as earth is more civilized than pluto and can cure all your negativity. Just an advise.



As the 'case' has been closed by our worthy Despot, i'll be keeping it out, but  (sorry i cant help it)

N.B. i hope Sky, you have a place to run and hide now


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## Kasrkin

*"So stop grossly extrapolating what I have written and insinuating arguments that were not elicited on my part. It's getting weary for me now..."*

You have a habit of bitterly denying comments you&#8217;ve clearly made and I&#8217;ve ignored this out of courtesy before. But instead of saying &#8216;topic closed&#8217; when you&#8217;ve failed to respond with a cohesive point or argument, you should be prudent in the first place while making comments that are likely to be challenged. You alleged that this show was biased along the lines of a &#8216;recruitment promo&#8217; and talked about &#8216;no other viewpoint&#8217;. Obviously there is little genuine material to your contentions, because as we can see now you&#8217;ve jumped to decrying over &#8216;nothing much on the way a soldier feels or thinks&#8217; (which is ironic given how you were just complaining about &#8216;only army point of view&#8217; being expressed by ex-servicemen). This is a place where we discuss PoVs, there is nothing wrong if someone&#8217;s is incomplete or inconsistent. But there is no need to dramatize the situation.

Topic Closed.


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## Elmo

Kasrkin said:


> *"So stop grossly extrapolating what I have written and insinuating arguments that were not elicited on my part. It's getting weary for me now..."*
> 
> You have a habit of bitterly denying comments youve clearly made and Ive ignored this out of courtesy before. But instead of saying topic closed when youve failed to respond with a cohesive point or argument, you should be prudent in the first place while making comments that are likely to be challenged. You alleged that this show was biased along the lines of a recruitment promo and talked about no other viewpoint. Obviously there is little genuine material to your contentions, because as we can see now youve jumped to decrying over nothing much on the way a soldier feels or thinks (which is ironic given how you were just complaining about only army point of view being expressed by ex-servicemen). This is a place where we discuss PoVs, there is nothing wrong if someones is incomplete or inconsistent. But there is no need to dramatize the situation.
> 
> Topic Closed.



*"Biased along army recruitment lines"
*

Here's my original quote: "Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo."

"End up" is way on the other end of the spectrum than saying outrightly it is "biased"! Where is this allegation that you are claiming I made?


*"no other viewpoint
*

Here's my original quote: "here was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen."

"Little" and "no" are again different.

*which is ironic given how you were just complaining about only army point of view being expressed by ex-servicemen
*

Here's my original quote: "Sir, I wasn't asking for an in-depth analysis nor a critique by former soldiers. Just a balance of views."

That's the only quote I have found of mine that had the word view in it!


*Ive ignored this out of courtesy before
*
Ahan!

You just don't stop drawing random conclusions from what I have said so I am consciously prudent to avoid you for your "dramatics". I in fact don't even post in the same thread as you do. make sure that I *do not *cross paths with you!

It's extremely easy to make personal attacks, I don't like that and refuse to be drawn in such arguments!


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## Kasrkin

No, don't argue over semantics. You expressed a view and you are incapable of defending it. Why would you have said these things if you weren&#8217;t referring to this show? You expressed your disappointment and you gave reasons, now should we believe that you were referring to entirely something else?

There is nothing ambiguous about how you expressed yourself, you can&#8217;t pretend that I drew the wrong conclusions in regards to your views when I read this:

*"But my issue with the programme was its content: there was little independent analysis, say from former servicemen. You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only. Otherwise, the show will then end up more or less being an army recruitment promo...."*

You stated you had issues with the program and its content, you then inserted a colon and went on to talk about a lack of &#8216;independent analysis&#8217; _in the show_ without which you claim programs are akin to &#8216;army recruitment promos&#8217;. So were you referring to some other show then, or was I suppose to take all that followed the colon to be inconsequential and unrelated grumbling?

When I went on to address these points you raised in regards to the show, incapable of addressing it you dramatize and accuse me of &#8216;grossly extrapolating&#8217; and &#8216;insinuating arguments&#8217;. There are inherit contradictions in all you&#8217;ve said and you&#8217;re incapable of acknowledging or addressing them.

*"Little" and "no" are again different.*

Wow does that change the nature of your argument? Was I wrong in assuming that you found it unbalanced? Your only defense is &#8216;I said there is _little independent analysis_ not _no independent analysis_&#8217; and you ignored everything I said about it being largely imparial. Ssshhh&#8230;. 

*"That's the only quote I have found of mine that had the word view in it!"*

Here is your quote, _"You need to have the other viewpoint rather than current servicemen speaking only..."_ Did that refresh your memory?

*&#8221;I in fact don't even post in the same thread as you do. make sure that I do not cross paths with you!&#8221;*

Now don&#8217;t you think that&#8217;s a bit of an over-reaction? 

*&#8221;It's extremely easy to make personal attacks, I don't like that&#8230;&#8221;*

See what I mean by dramatizing the situation? Please be kind enough to point out one place where I have attacked your person and not your view/argument.


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## Zulfiqar

This documentary was probably made to help the army boost its image to a better level then what it is now( i am not saying that it is down but public awareness is a good thing). 

Look at the timing, we have operations going on and the last thing we need is to criticize the army. The time is to build more support for the military and this documentary is the right tool for it and off course help in recruitment if possible.

The time is not right for playing devil's advocate.

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## blain2

Nadja said:


> Sir, I wasn't asking for an in-depth analysis nor a critique by former soldiers. Just a balance of views.
> 
> Also, I have no intentions/desire of becoming a military scholar



Agreed. However I think even interviews with jawans can be an issue for the Army and I say this knowing that its the same case across the border (pretty much in all of the South Asian countries).

Maybe in the future episodes and programs you will see more of the interaction at lower levels. So do not count that out.

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## Mujahid91

can someone please upload this documantry on youtube will be very helpfull.


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## UnKnOwN

Here are the promos for it:















Seems really professionally done, compared with what other Pakistani news channels do.

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## Sunny4pak

watch we are soldiers now on Dawn news BabuTv.com - Watch Pakistani and Indian TV Channels


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## Mujahid

*We Are Soldiers - Dawn News*

*download link*

zSHARE - wearesoldiers_documntary.wmv​

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## blain2

It would be great to see this posted on Dawnnewspakistan portal at Youtube. The original version with its high resolution is much better than the download, however for those who have not see it, thanks Mujahid!


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## mean_bird

You can also view it online without having to download it .

*Watch the video Online​*

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## echo 1

Guys thanks for the link I enjoyed it a lot man cant wait for next one.


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## owais.usmani

Guys (and Gals!), don't forget to watch the second episode of *"We Are Soldiers"* tonight at 7:05pm on DAWNNEWS.

*phir na kehna kay hamay khabar na hoi*


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## Zulfiqar

Its on? i wonder why are they changing the schedule.


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## Xeric

Mian Asad said:


> Its on? i wonder why are they changing the schedule.



Yes it's on, watch it!


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## Myth_buster_1

i missed the 7 pm show can some one please tell me what time its gonna repeat today?


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## Zulfiqar

I saw the second episode.It was fine but i did not like the intro( they used some clip from south park cartoons).

They showed infantry soldiers under going CQB training ,desert warfare and some details on india's cold start strategy ( he or his team had done some good research).

You can watch it on wednesday at 11 pm.I saw it twice today (7 pm and 11 pm).


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## Xeric

Mian Asad said:


> I saw the second episode.It was fine but i did not like the intro( they used some clip from south park cartoons).
> 
> They showed infantry soldiers under going CQB training ,desert warfare and some details on india's cold start strategy ( he or his team had done some good research).
> 
> You can watch it on wednesday at 11 pm.I saw it twice today (7 pm and 11 pm).



Ya the intro was kinda messed up, or should i say irrelevant. But the ATT/CTC dose made it up..oh that is something really tough and risky!


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## Zulfiqar

I liked the ATT part.


I am anxiously waiting for the episode regarding SSG.


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## anathema

You tube link please if any one can...


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## PakShaheen79

Pleaseeeeeeeeee Upload it. Missed it due to damn load shedding problem.


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## Blackpearl

In the segment of snipers, M82 Barret (Light Fifty), was shown 2 times. can anybody confirm by observation


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## Stealth

*Part 1*







*Part 2*







*Part 3*








"Add all Episode in this thread" thanks.

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## Stealth

*Episode 2*








*Episode 3*







*Episode 4*







*Episode 6*







*Episode 7*







*Episode 8*







*Episode 9*

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## kidwaibhai

where is episode 5


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## batmannow

Stealth said:


> *Episode 2*
> 
> MBLWhVGf19c[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 2
> 
> 
> 
> *Episode 3*
> 
> Symlt0lfFGI[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 3
> 
> 
> *Episode 4*
> 
> jWD2Q3eYtFQ[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 4
> 
> 
> *Episode 6*
> 
> DhUP03MZusE[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 6
> 
> 
> *Episode 7*
> 
> ViMzsTqH6XA[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 7
> 
> 
> *Episode 8*
> 
> GcP3mXOjGKY[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 8
> 
> 
> *Episode 9*
> 
> Q6SlkULUPo4[/media] - We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 9




super work!
my dear sir!


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## ajpirzada

kidwaibhai said:


> where is episode 5


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## PAFAce

ajpirzada said:


> We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army- Part 5



Watch from 3:25 to 3:27 of Part 5. The two soldiers advancing with MP5s in the fire position. The soldier behind runs across the picture, pointing his weapon at the soldier in front for a brief moment.

I was watching a similar show on the US Special Operations Forces a long time ago, and this was one mistake that they seriously, seriously reprimanded. Never point your weapon at a friendly, even briefly, it is un-forgivable.

The instructors must have turned that soldier's backside red after that move.

*Edit*

Ay host action zyada marna hai te utton bolda vi bohat hai.


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## Xeric

PAFAce said:


> Watch from 3:25 to 3:27 of Part 5. The two soldiers advancing with MP5s in the fire position. The soldier behind runs across the picture, pointing his weapon at the soldier in front for a brief moment.
> 
> I was watching a similar show on the US Special Operations Forces a long time ago, and this was one mistake that they seriously, seriously reprimanded. Never point your weapon at a friendly, even briefly, it is un-forgivable.
> 
> The instructors must have turned that soldier's backside red after that move.


Yes you are right!

As the 'complete' picture is not available so i cant tell that were they actually in the red zone or were they still running to approach the red zone. If they were inside the red zone and they did this then it was wrong otherwise this action is not that 'dangerous'. Now as for your concern when you compare it with the US military i'll say that in ATT/CTC ops friendly safety is of paramount importance, HARD and TOUGH tarining goes in to make sure that you dont kill own people while fighting CQB and conductions ops like room clearance/entry, BUT that is why a thing known as Safety ON, Safety OFF" is rigorously practised so that when the weapon is pointing down the weapon cant fire as the safety on that weapon is ON and the moment you bring the weapon to firing position (not a MILISECOND before the weapon is aimed) the safety is removed with the thumb so that immediate fire can be dilevered.

When we enter a room, i mean 4 men or 6 men entry, the entry sequence is such that FIRST individual enters from the right side and the other Second individual enters from the left side, BUT they DO NOT cross each other just for the same reason so that they dont rapture each other with bullets, moreover they shouldnt bump into each other also as the space is very less, BUT again when the THIRD and FOURTH individual enters he has to move behind the FIRST and SECOND individual respectively and cross them to go futher towards the right and left (meaning thereby they would be crossing the FIRST and SECOND individual from behind) thus creating a similar situation as you have referred to, but how they are saved is the PERFECT trigger control and making an excellent use of the safety provided with the weapon.

i hope you got it or should you want that i should make use of some hand made sketches

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## dherky

despite all this, i think we are in good shap, better than most of the developing countries.
i would say much better than we were in 2000 if you have seen clips of that period


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## aboutimeee

Can anyone plz tell me how many magazine a standard soldier carries, is it 1 in the gun and 2 spares right? and also do they carry water profs and first aid kit and survival kit.
and how its different form Indian and western soldiers.
thnx


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## Sgt Automatic

aboutimeee said:


> Can anyone plz tell me how many magazine a standard soldier carries, is it 1 in the gun and 2 spares right? and also do they carry water profs and first aid kit and survival kit.
> and how its different form Indian and western soldiers.
> thnx



I am not sure about PA, but most western armies carry around 5 magzines. Thats universal. I am assuming PA will be less due to two reasons. The more important one bieng that since they carry 7.62mm bullets rather than 5.56, it weighs more, and secondly there might not be enough ammo/magzines so that everyone can carry 4-6 clips.

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## PAFAce

enigma947 said:


> Yes you are right!
> 
> As the 'complete' picture is not available so i cant tell that were they actually in the red zone or were they still running to approach the red zone. If they were inside the red zone and they did this then it was wrong otherwise this action is not that 'dangerous'. Now as for your concern when you compare it with the US military i'll say that in ATT/CTC ops friendly safety is of paramount importance, HARD and TOUGH tarining goes in to make sure that you dont kill own people while fighting CQB and conductions ops like room clearance/entry, BUT that is why a thing known as Safety ON, Safety OFF" is rigorously practised so that when the weapon is pointing down the weapon cant fire as the safety on that weapon is ON and the moment you bring the weapon to firing position (not a MILISECOND before the weapon is aimed) the safety is removed with the thumb so that immediate fire can be dilevered.
> 
> When we enter a room, i mean 4 men or 6 men entry, the entry sequence is such that FIRST individual enters from the right side and the other Second individual enters from the left side, BUT they DO NOT cross each other just for the same reason so that they dont rapture each other with bullets, moreover they shouldnt bump into each other also as the space is very less, BUT again when the THIRD and FOURTH individual enters he has to move behind the FIRST and SECOND individual respectively and cross them to go futher towards the right and left (meaning thereby they would be crossing the FIRST and SECOND individual from behind) thus creating a similar situation as you have referred to, but how they are saved is the PERFECT trigger control and making an excellent use of the safety provided with the weapon.
> 
> i hope you got it or should you want that i should make use of some hand made sketches



Thanks a lot Enigma for that wonderfully descriptive explanation. This is why you train, so you don't make mistakes when it counts. Let this also be a message to all those who think that the Pakistan Army is "not trained" in anti-terrorism and needs "foreign assistance". I see the same type of training for our infantry as I did in that show for US SOFs. And add to this the SSG units, and we are more than capable of COIN warfare, all we need are resources.

Thanks again.

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## Rafael

enigma947 said:


> Yes you are right!
> 
> As the 'complete' picture is not available so i cant tell that were they actually in the red zone or were they still running to approach the red zone. If they were inside the red zone and they did this then it was wrong otherwise this action is not that 'dangerous'. Now as for your concern when you compare it with the US military i'll say that in ATT/CTC ops friendly safety is of paramount importance, HARD and TOUGH tarining goes in to make sure that you dont kill own people while fighting CQB and conductions ops like room clearance/entry, BUT that is why a thing known as Safety ON, Safety OFF" is rigorously practised so that when the weapon is pointing down the weapon cant fire as the safety on that weapon is ON and the moment you bring the weapon to firing position (not a MILISECOND before the weapon is aimed) the safety is removed with the thumb so that immediate fire can be dilevered.
> 
> When we enter a room, i mean 4 men or 6 men entry, the entry sequence is such that FIRST individual enters from the right side and the other Second individual enters from the left side, BUT they DO NOT cross each other just for the same reason so that they dont rapture each other with bullets, moreover they shouldnt bump into each other also as the space is very less, BUT again when the THIRD and FOURTH individual enters he has to move behind the FIRST and SECOND individual respectively and cross them to go futher towards the right and left (meaning thereby they would be crossing the FIRST and SECOND individual from behind) thus creating a similar situation as you have referred to, but how they are saved is the PERFECT trigger control and making an excellent use of the safety provided with the weapon.
> 
> i hope you got it or should you want that i should make use of some hand made sketches




Why arent you taking part in it?  We would have loved to see a friend and defence.pk member acting


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## Keanu

Guys here are the full episodes 1 and 2:

We Are Soldiers Episode 1: www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=98D4916FFD646980

We Are Soldiers Episode 2: www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=1F618E3CF6BD89D5

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## Sunny4pak

Aoa,
Thnx Stealth and AJPirzada for videos . I think the next episode is on wednesday but not sure can anbody confirm this.
Regards


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## blain2

Made the thread sticky for easy look up and future reference purposes.

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## blain2

Sunny4pak said:


> Aoa,
> Thnx Stealth and AJPirzada for videos . I think the next episode is on wednesday but not sure can anbody confirm this.
> Regards



Wednesday is a repeat telecast/rerun. The new episode is on Saturdays I believe.


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## Sunny4pak

Dear Brothers
I was watching We Were Soldier Movie (Hollywood)... and i saw that there was Bell Helicopter with attack feature i mean there was some weapon on both side some misiles and others u people can check this on youtube too.... any body can guide me that Pakistan has same kind of Bell hellis if not then can they do so by fitting there own same like the US has


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## blain2

Sunny4pak said:


> Dear Brothers
> I was watching We Were Soldier Movie (Hollywood)... and i saw that there was Bell Helicopter with attack feature i mean there was some weapon on both side some misiles and others u people can check this on youtube too.... any body can guide me that Pakistan has same kind of Bell hellis if not then can they do so by fitting there own same like the US has



Most of Pakistani bells (utility helicopters) as well as Mi-17s have dual MG-3s mounted on spindle on the side doors. Some PA bells have M-134 Gatling gun mounted as well.


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## Sunny4pak

I think Blain u r talking about the gun that is fitted inside the helli (Bell). but i am talking about outside he doors. and u were saying about MI - 17 too 
can u share some snaps plz


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## Xeric

Sgt Automatic said:


> I am not sure about PA, but most western armies carry around 5 magzines. Thats universal. I am assuming PA will be less due to two reasons. The more important one bieng that since they carry 7.62mm bullets rather than 5.56, it weighs more,



You did talk some sense here, but...


> and secondly there might not be enough ammo/magzines so that everyone can carry 4-6 clips.



...but what happened here..??

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## Xeric

PAFAce said:


> Thanks a lot Enigma for that wonderfully descriptive explanation. This is why you train, so you don't make mistakes when it counts. Let this also be a message to all those who think that the Pakistan Army is "not trained" in anti-terrorism and needs "foreign assistance". I see the same type of training for our infantry as I did in that show for US SOFs. And add to this the SSG units, and we are more than capable of COIN warfare, all we need are resources.
> 
> Thanks again.



Sweat saves Blood!!

Sweat now so that you can save Blood tomorrow.

That's how things work here!


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## Xeric

raheel1 said:


> Why arent you taking part in it?  We would have loved to see a friend and defence.pk member acting



Lolzzz..
i already had my share well!!

It is a bloody thankless job-i am referring to these ATT Ops. They take the maximum toil and still you get the beating if the dude you went in to save gets screwed either by your or enemy's fire!!

BTW, i have my own videos of these kinda ops where me and colleagues are polishing the rigor, but you know i'll not upload it. BTW the one with gas masks got deleted, so sorry again!

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## Kasrkin

I was looking forward to the _We Are Soldiers_ of this weekend because they said it would be about the armoured corps and major operations BUT they just repeated last week's episode...


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## arsenal_gooner

has anyone uploaded the new one about the tanks

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## moha199

Kasrkin said:


> I was looking forward to the _We Are Soldiers_ of this weekend because they said it would be about the armoured corps and major operations BUT they just repeated last week's episode...


Man that sucks i was getting so excited


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## Irfan Baloch

here you go my friends

this is a website called friends korner which has it.

please be warned that the forum is full of Pro taliban bastards and Anti Pakistan Army people. me and only a handful there confront them but just because they are followers of Imran Khan and Jamiat Islami they see it as their right to defame army.

maybe the video is already here but I provided the links in any case.

Part 1
Video We Are Soldiers - Dawn News - Friends Korner


*Part 2*
Video We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Army Part 2 - Friends Korner

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## blain2

Sunny4pak said:


> I think Blain u r talking about the gun that is fitted inside the helli (Bell). but i am talking about outside he doors. and u were saying about MI - 17 too
> can u share some snaps plz



No I was referring to door mounted M134. Some of the Pakistani Bell helicopters have this gun mounted.


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## blain2

xeric said:


> Sweat saves Blood!!
> 
> Sweat now so that you can save Blood tomorrow.
> 
> That's how things work here!



If I recall, the complete little slogan used to read:

"Sweat saves blood, blood saves life, brain saves both!"...

Realistic reminder about having josh as well as hosh.

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## moha199

Oh man that was awesome!!!!


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## PakShaheen79

I think Dawn News will be pressurized to either edit all sensitive stuff from it or program will not aired from next week.


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## Irfan Baloch

PakShaheen79 said:


> I think Dawn News will be pressurized to either edit all sensitive stuff from it or program will not aired from next week.




pressurised by who? Pak Army? they made it with their cooperation
dont be so naive. if there is any thing sensitive they wont have covered it anyway.
the program is beign aired after editing anyway and it is general stuff no tactical or operational planing that may be sensitive is going to be covered.


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## TsAr

PakShaheen79 said:


> I think Dawn News will be pressurized to either edit all sensitive stuff from it or program will not aired from next week.



Any programme on the army is first approved by ispr they just cannot film it and show it on tv.......I have not been able to find the 3rd episode anywhere can anyone post the link....


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## Irfan Baloch

TsAr said:


> Any programme on the army is first approved by ispr they just cannot film it and show it on tv.......I have not been able to find the 3rd episode anywhere can anyone post the link....



about 20 minutes ago i caught the last bit of the program talking about the drawbacks of the tank
I hope someone managed to record it


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## Kasrkin

Yaar it will be repeated at 11 PM, why dont you catch that?


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## Sunny4pak

is it today at 11pm (3rd part) 
kindly reply


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## ajpirzada




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## Irfan Baloch

Kasrkin said:


> Yaar it will be repeated at 11 PM, why dont you catch that?



salams,
I read your comment in time to catch the program when it started


cheers bro


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## ajpirzada




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## Sunny4pak

Thanks brother on sharing video i missed that but is it a complete episode or some parts left


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## ajpirzada

^^its complete


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## moha199

I loved it,


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## Irfan Baloch

moha199 said:


> I loved it,




i dont think the program did justice to Pakistani Armed corps. Wajahat is heavily relying on movie clips and other forces which is becoming overbearing.
I was hoping onboard Al Khalid video and maybe some firing demonstrations or some military exercise. the presentation extra is excellent no doubt but it didnt do justice the way in depth details about infantry as given there were none here in comparison except some borrowed clips from old videos. I dont think any of our tank based weapon system s that modern or classified that it couldnt be shown in this episode

this episode left me wanting for more for the Pakistani tanks in action


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## Keanu

We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Military - Episode 3:

ww.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=82BF034709A369C6


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## Kasrkin

This this one was quite nice, the best so far I must say.


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## Irfan Baloch

Kasrkin said:


> This this one was quite nice, the best so far I must say.



I would have looked to get up and personal with the tanks like Al Khalid. too much time was given to mechanised Infantry and APCs. the program was good no doubt but left lot to be desired


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## Shiji

When the Dawn NEWS guy asks the Army Officer about why the T-59's are still in service he is like "Its not the machine its the man behind the machine". It may be true sometimes but most of the time the Novice in the Highly Advanced T-90S can takeout the Pro in the T-59 long before the T-90 comes in its Main Guns range. I am sick of statements like these.


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## Ghareeb_Da_Baal

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


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## Shiji

Okay my bad!


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## Ghareeb_Da_Baal

Shiji said:


> Okay my bad!



NO worries............. I took care of it!


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## Xeric

What's goin on in here
Anywaz..


Shiji said:


> When the Dawn NEWS guy asks the Army Officer about why the T-59's are still in service he is like "Its not the machine its the man behind the machine". It may be true sometimes but most of the time the Novice in the Highly Advanced T-90S can takeout the Pro in the T-59 long before the T-90 comes in its Main Guns range. I am sick of statements like these.



Why you have to compare T-90s with T-59s? The UDs and AK is there to take guud care of them, so relax.


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## Shiji

> The UDs and AK is there to take guud care of them, so relax.


What if the AK or the UD are not available?
Being a defensive force we can't decide where the engagement occurs, its the Indian who will decide where they wanna use their 90s, and if they are even a bit smart they are gonna go for the areas protected by the 59s.


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## Xeric

Shiji said:


> What if the AK or the UD are not available?



Why?


> Being a defensive force


i never knew we were defensive!


> we can't decide where the engagement occurs, its the Indian who will decide where they wanna use their 90s, and if they are even a bit smart they are gonna go for the areas protected by the 59s.



i can just laugh on this bro.

You are planning is as if two kids are fighting in some school!


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## Shiji

I have got no more words to say!


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## Xeric

Shiji said:


> I have got no more words to say!



You bet.

---

BTW, try to read the 'new' doctrine of Pak Army if you can find it on the internet. Also try to find how our military do the tank battle and which all units are given the AKs and where they are located. Then you and me be able to understand each other better! Till then, school is fun!


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## Shiji

School ain't fun. Talking on this cool forum IS!


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## Xeric

Shiji said:


> School ain't fun. Talking on this cool forum IS!



You got that right bro!


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## Kasrkin

Irfan Baloch said:


> I would have looked to get up and personal with the tanks like Al Khalid. too much time was given to mechanised Infantry and APCs. the program was good no doubt but left lot to be desired



It&#8217;s not easy to get 'close and personal' with an Al-Khalid like it was with the M-113. There is simply not enough room and the only way you can film the interior is if the cameraman goes inside the commanders/gunners/drivers hatch and the hatches are small enough as it is so you&#8217;d need a small camera. And secondly there is a lot of sensitive and vital equipment the gunner and commander have access to including digital battlefield integrated systems, LCD sites, communications gear and other stuff. So actually I was impressed at the way they had managed to get all the MBTs and park them together for the briefing. He must have had to pull a few strings I guess.

Great show man, the historical references were sound too.


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## blain2

The materials is not anything new. What I appreciate about the show is the insight to the officers like the interview of Commander, V Corps as well as his CoS. That is the interesting part. Next one ought to be interesting with SSG/N being showcased.


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## Kasrkin

I do wonder why they didn't go to the Army SSG next, that would've been the logical step. Maybe they're saving it for next season or something.


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## Xeric

Kasrkin said:


> I do wonder why they didn't go to the Army SSG next, that would've been the logical step. Maybe they're saving it for next season or something.



SSG!

What about the Artillery Kas!

The infantry , then the AC, Artillery should have been the next 'logical' step, i hope he is not missing it out totally!

i was waiting to show you people my guns

he better come back to the Army soon

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## Xeric

blain2 said:


> The materials is not anything new. What I appreciate about the show is the insight to the officers like the interview of Commander, V Corps as well as his CoS. That is the interesting part. Next one ought to be interesting with SSG/N being showcased.



Well Blaini, the interesting part for me is that the Army high command is being quite flexible and 'talking', otherwise you know how 'tight' they are as regards to doctrines.

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## Kasrkin

Sorry, did mean to offend you xeric! I know there is a lot of stuff in the Army they could've covered, Special Forces, artillery and even aviation being in that. But what I meant was that the jump from Army to Navy was a little sudden.

We hope to see your guns too.



> Well Blaini, the interesting part for me is that the Army high command is being quite flexible and 'talking', otherwise you know how 'tight' they are as regards to doctrines.



They didn't give much away to be honest though. They were vague enough not to merit such concern, but the fact that they're opening up is a great sign.


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## Xeric

Kasrkin said:


> Sorry, did mean to offend you xeric! I know there is a lot of stuff in the Army they could've covered, Special Forces, artillery and even aviation being in that. But what I meant was that the jump from Army to Navy was a little sudden.
> 
> We hope to see your guns too.
> 
> 
> 
> They didn't give much away to be honest though. They were vague enough not to merit such concern, but the fact that they're opening up is a great sign.


Sorry for what dear? i was joking and you know it. Anywaz, in the first episode of the show he mentioned the three fighting arms and the supporting arms in such a sequence that it seemed that he would go about the Army first and then towards the other services. BTW, there was no mention of other forces in his opener. And i was still not convinced that he would talk about the PAK and PN (though ships and crafts show up in his promo stuff) until he made it amply clear in his last episode that the next one would on the Navy SSG.

But still, let me tell you the Navy SSG episode would be a treat to watch!

And as for the senior officers opening up, i must say that they ofcourse are wary of what they say, and they must be, but still they are more forthcoming more than ever.


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## Zulfiqar

> I was impressed at the way they had managed to get all the MBTs and park them together for the briefing. He must have had to pull a few strings I guess.



That clip was shot in school of armor Nowshera.


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## PAFAce

xeric said:


> SSG!
> 
> What about the Artillery Kas!
> 
> The infantry , then the AC, Artillery should have been the next 'logical' step, i hope he is not missing it out totally!
> 
> i was waiting to show you people my guns
> 
> he better come back to the Army soon


*Xeric*, I couldn't wait for Artillery as well. My Khaloo is Major in Artillery Training Regiment, so I was hoping to see his toys. InshAllah, we'll see it soon.



Kasrkin said:


> I do wonder why they didn't go to the Army SSG next, that would've been the logical step. Maybe they're saving it for next season or something.


*Kasrkin*, I too was surprised to see the immediate jump from Army to Navy, and that too from Armoured Corps to SSGN. Maybe they did that because the SSGN does all the training the SSG offers, and then does underwater demolitions etc. additionally. Therefore, SSGN kind of includes SSG. That is just a guess, ofcourse.

Also, I couldn't wait for Army Aviation. One of my distant Chachoo is in the Army Aviation (sorry, I forgot the rank, but pretty high up) and he's a Cobra pilot.
--------------------------
I haven't revealed this information about my family before because then people think "another guy whose family members are in the military, and so he is military-crazy". In fact, that is not the case at all. I didn't know I had family in the Army until I was almost 10, but I loved the Pakistan Armed Forces long before that. It does suck to not have a family member in the Air Force, however, because that would have been cool (just read MuradK's son's first post, you'll know what I mean).

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## blain2

xeric said:


> Well Blaini, the interesting part for me is that the Army high command is being quite flexible and 'talking', otherwise you know how 'tight' they are as regards to doctrines.




That was my exact point. I doubt if I have ever seen a serving Corps Commander and his Chief of Staff talk to the TV crews like this. The usual stuff is the tanks and the guns etc. etc. that you get to see quite often. However one rarely gets a peak inside some of the thinking the way they showcased it with those two interviews. 

The CoS seems to be related to the Nawab of Pataudi. An interesting lineage.

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## blain2

xeric said:


> SSG!
> 
> What about the Artillery Kas!
> 
> The infantry , then the AC, Artillery should have been the next 'logical' step, i hope he is not missing it out totally!
> 
> i was waiting to show you people my guns
> 
> he better come back to the Army soon



I concur! 

Artillery has a special place in the military folklore of Pakistan. In terms of their impact, I think Pakistani Artillery has had a bigger influence in all of the past wars than the AC folks (I know they will take offense to that), but it really is the most powerful arm of the Pakistan Army and also the one that has turned tables quite a few times in the past wars.

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## All-Green

blain2 said:


> I concur!
> 
> Artillery has a special place in the military folklore of Pakistan. In terms of their impact, I think Pakistani Artillery has had a bigger influence in all of the past wars than the AC folks (I know they will take offense to that), but it really is the most powerful arm of the Pakistan Army and also the one that has turned tables quite a few times in the past wars.



Artillery is the god of war afterall...

I have to agree that PA Artillery has always been a very professional, aggressive and resourceful branch when under pressure and they have many times given knockout punches to enemy formations.
The forward observers of our Artillery batteries were always a source of great pain to the enemy.
Even the good old AA batteries engaged the IAF in some very brave duels and inflicted heavy losses on the IAF due to their tenacity and courage under fire.

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## Kasrkin

> Artillery has a special place in the military folklore of Pakistan. In terms of their impact, I think Pakistani Artillery has had a bigger influence in all of the past wars than the AC folks (I know they will take offense to that), but it really is the most powerful arm of the Pakistan Army and also the one that has turned tables quite a few times in the past wars.



Its true. Foreign observers refer to Pakistani artillery as having been particularly effective during the wars. It is unfortunate that our potent but conventional artillery skills are not so useful in this war where the enemy operates from villages and houses as opposed to from bunkers or large formations. People complain about the Pakistan Army using artillery in Swat and FATA, I tell them artillery is what we do best. Hopefully our gunners will be adapting to the new requirements, I&#8217;m guessing the emphasis on volume and concentration of firepower will have to be deflected to a more diffuse mode of deployment and operation.



> Maybe they did that because the SSGN does all the training the SSG offers, and then does underwater demolitions etc. additionally. Therefore, SSGN kind of includes SSG. That is just a guess, ofcourse.



Yup, a mamo of mine was in the army SSG but served in the SSG/N as well.


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## Xeric

Folks remember the Three As of '65 War? They say it was these As which made us win the war:

Allah
Airforce
Artillery

Now i dont want to start an inter-arm war between the AC and artillery. All arms have their importance and has a definite role to play in battle. You take out one and the rest would collapse! Our every arm do best what it is supposed to do.

As for the concern over artillery versus the current operation: you must know that how much deliberation works up before the military decides to make use of an artillery gun. Actually speaking frankly this is not new for the Pakistan Artillery. Artillery have been used in Balochistan but to the minimum, except for an operation or two it was there for the purpose of 'show of force and firepower' (anyone of you who had experienced a shell landing somewhere around 100~300 meters away from him would bare me out as regards to how a gun can piss off the enemy).

Utmost care is seeked before an artillery raid is planned. Now i am not sure how they are making use of the guns in Swat, but what i know is that commander thinks and deliberates a thousands time before he allow the artillery to open up in a BUA! Actually sorry yanks, we are not operating in Afghanistan, we are still inside Pakistan (well that was some sheer sarcasm  Coming back to the 'houses and villages' against the artillery: Artillery may not be that effective in a BUA due to the obvious reasons, but then we also dont have drones and sat imagery (for the airforce) to target with pin point accuracy. Yes the airforce does it best when it comes to PGMs but that's something to be made use of when things get clearer as a particular battle progresses. Moreover, deserted villages cause no human-damage-fear but still it would not mean that the artillery would go on a bunker busting spree which actually may be home to some innocent civilian.

In the last i can assure you that the military make the best, efficient and most importantly justifiable, ethical and wary use of any gadgetry that it has on its inventory.


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## Kasrkin

> (anyone of you who had experienced a shell landing somewhere around 100~300 meters away from him would bare me out as regards to how a gun can piss off the enemy).



I hope you havent experienced any such thing! It would be a ridiculous risk and you'd almost certainly be dead if the shell were airburst. Its painful enough being near a 155mm when its fired, let alone the shell exploding on your head!

Ah, 3 'A's of 65, I like that !


----------



## Xeric

Kasrkin said:


> I hope you haven&#8217;t experienced any such thing! It would be a ridiculous risk and you'd almost certainly be dead if the shell were airburst. Its painful enough being near a 155mm when its fired, let alone the shell exploding on your head!
> 
> Ah, 3 'A's of 65, I like that !



Well yes i have experinced artillery fire first hand i.e. at the receiving end! It was when i served in Kashmir and Siachen.

Let me assure you it is terrible!

Let me teach you some ballistics 
The stuff that happens at the gun end is _different_ that occurs at the target end. The simplest and a basic example that i can give you is that the sound that you experience at the gun end when any gun fires is due to the "Explosion", which is defined as 'rapid burning of anything' i.e. the blast that occurs when some gun powder burns or the propellant ignites.

Now the stuff the take place at the target end is not explosion, it is called as 'Detonation", which is defined as the 'molecular disintegration of mass or something' Now that's the killer! The blast, the sound that is produced when the gun fires and the detonation taht takes place when a shell explodes is very different in nature. A simplest way to make you understand is that an explosion would not push your heart to your mouth, but the detonation would definitely pump you heart up to the throat even if you experience that sound from far away (point to consider is that the effect of being at the receiving end is omitted in this experiment, i mean that dont consider the 'enemy' factor in this, i am just talking about the sound and the blast wave)

The closest brush that i had with a shell was somewhere near the indian border when i was taking an air-burst shoot and an 155 mm shell landed just beside me...dont worry ..lolzz... it landed just on the opposite side of that boulder (when i say boulder i men a huge boulder, may be like 15 x 12 feet) to which i was shouldering as i couldnt observe the fire from my bunker so i had to get out to direct it.

The result: had a bleeding ear, couldn't feel my head for the next few days and had a tiny piece of splinter touched my upper arm after it re-bounded from the ground!


Oh yes and i am surprised that you missed the As till yet!?

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## blain2

I was going to write about the triple A's but you beat me to it. Interestingly enough, some Pakistani writers of late have taken the Artillery out and have written about the 3 A's of the 65 war as Allah, Airforce and America (even though Amreekis were no where around and it was the Artillery that saved the day).

While I too have never been on the receiving side, but I have seen a lot of the post detonation/impact sites in Pakistan and the most vicious of it beyond the blast and sound is the shrapnel. You put your hand on it and it can be cut in multiple ways. The pieces of shrapnel would give one an idea as to how insanely effective artillery fire is even if you are nowhere close to the blast, these small pieces (anywhere from sub inch to 8-9 inches long) would cut a body into two. The shrapnel is sharper than most of the finely sharpened daggers and knives around and every edge of the shrapnel is pretty much a blade.

After seeing this, one has no option but to come away with immense awe for the Artillery.

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## Kasrkin

xeric you just made me look like an idiot. I'm aware of how guns work mate! I'm aware that the artillery detonations are louder as Ive heard them rumbling in the distant mountains (nowhere near as close as your experience ofcourse!) whereas the actual firing can be uncomfortable enough for the unaccustomed ear as well. Close proximity to exploding munitions can cause ear bleeding, eye bleeding and a lot of other stuff depending on the warhead. Thermodynamic warheads for instance kill with sheer pressure and heat, while there is kinetic element to airburst and most munitions, shrapnel ofcourse would be their most dangerous aspect and boy do they make those things sharp. Also the difference between the propellant and the explosive is that the explosive just burns much faster...at an _explosive _rate. Rocket propellant for instance is not an explosive but its dangerous enough. Shells though have explosive propellant.

Well, I must've heard about the 'A's but you reminded me and I like that! Also I've heard people say Allah, Army and America in regards to Pakistan a lot but never Allah, Airforce and America because that would be retarded. The Americans couldn't have been more unhelpful in the wars had they tried, they screwed our artillery and airforce with both almost out of ammo.

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## Xeric

blain2 said:


> I was going to write about the triple A's but you beat me to it. Interestingly enough, some Pakistani writers of late have taken the Artillery out and have written about the 3 A's of the 65 war as Allah, Airforce and America (even though Amreekis were no where around and it was the Artillery that saved the day).
> 
> While I too have never been on the receiving side, but I have seen a lot of the post detonation/impact sites in Pakistan and the most vicious of it beyond the blast and sound is the shrapnel. You put your hand on it and it can be cut in multiple ways. The pieces of shrapnel would give one an idea as to how insanely effective artillery fire is even if you are nowhere close to the blast, these small pieces (anywhere from sub inch to 8-9 inches long) would cut a body into two. The shrapnel is sharper than most of the finely sharpened daggers and knives around and every edge of the shrapnel is pretty much a blade.
> 
> After seeing this, one has no option but to come away with immense awe for the Artillery.



Yes i heard about this amreeki adition of lately but nver read anything on it. If they suport this version of the As then i must say that they have been fooling around in their riting carriers and nothing else.

As for the shrapnel, they are the most effective of all.
Reasons:

1. They dont have a direction they can come from anywhere, they are not like a bullet that you have to face it to take it

2. They are sharp as hell, you break a glass bottle and see the 'shrapnel' formed by the broken glass, that's how a shell gives out the splinters

3. They are burning hot, as i have experienced one and while talking to others who had taken bigger ones, they have said that you feel the roasting more than the pain or rapture, it literally roast the meat and it smells delicious then , seriously!

4. As Blaini has pointed out, they vary from centimeters to feet, you get a small one inside you then probably its not getting out for ever. As it would be so minute that it cant be extracted or it might reach a place where it would not be feasible to take it out. Once i met an Officer who had like 6-7 pieces inside him and i remember teasing him that how can he pass the metal detector at the airports! Now if you meet the big bad-a$$ splinter, it definitely would cut you in halves so the story ends there and then!

5. Very high terminal velocity, the shrapnel have a scary velocity and when combined with its mass (as compared to a 7.62/5.56 mm bullet), it would play havoc with your body!

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## Xeric

Kasrkin said:


> xeric you just made me look like an idiot. I'm aware of how guns work mate!



Sorry bro i never knew that you had the knowledge or may be it was because of some thick-heads that i have met in the past. Actually even some artillery officers shy making out the difference between the gun end and the target end theory, especially when it comes to ballistics and its sub-categories, so i was not sure how 'accustomed' you were

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## Zulfiqar

> artillery may not be that effective in a BUA due to the obvious reasons, but then we also don't have drones and sat imagery (for the airforce) to target with pin point accuracy. Yes the airforce does it best when it comes to PGMs but that's something to be made use of when things get clearer as a particular battle progresses.



I suggest that we use these.

GP1 152/155mm Laser-Guided Projectile - SinoDefence.com


The chinese do make 155mm laser guided shells.It has a range of 20 km.It may be expensive(it would be cheaper than hellfire) but it is accurate and can be used to target TTP commanders by using UAVs like Falcos with a laser designating pod.It can serve the purpose until we have our own armed UAVS.

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## anathema

any recent episodes


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## Elmo

No links for this week's episode? Or was it not run?


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## Sunny4pak

Aoa,
Dear All New episode will be on Dawn news tomorrow at 7:00pm and repeat teleast will be on wednesday at 11:00pm so stay tuned on 04 July and 08 July..................
Regards

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## Sunny4pak

any body watching it right now............?
Please Record it i got a prob with net


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## Zulfiqar

I saw it today.

It was about SSG navy and marines. It was good but it clearly needed some more material(They had a 3-4 min clip of Normandy assault from saving private Ryan). I did not like the western music. They also showed SSG weapons like steyr sniper rifles(there were two,one was SSG 69 and the other was either Steyr-Mannlicher SSG 08 or SSG 04 as the presenter said it can carry ten bullets in its magazine), FN minimi, M4s e.t.c . I never knew that Steyr AUG can float in water.They showed ship boarding VBSS exercise. They also showed Marines using hovercraft. 

A second part on SSG(N) and the marines will be shown on next saturday


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## Keanu

We Are Soldiers - Pakistan Military - Episode 4:

www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=255D08A48849817C
*
Hello Mods,

I just want to post links to the latest episodes of We are Soldiers every week but the restriction of at least 15 posts before posting links is creating problems for me. Please give me special permission to post links before 15 posts.

Thanks*

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## blain2

5.56mm FN Minimie for the SSG/N...cannot go wrong with that type of a SAW. I hope SSG/A also get some!


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## ajpirzada

this one was quite interesting. may be bec i dont know much about navy.

anyways i have got a question. in these exercises do they use rubber bullets? or do u just assume that you gonna achieve the targets. if these drills are conducted with the assumption of victory then wats the point? there should be an option of failin as well


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## blain2

What you saw there was not an exercise, rather a demonstration put on by the units for the Dawn documentary. Usually in exercises, they have opposing side which thinks, calculates and adjusts its tactics etc. as the enemy would. 

The fact that you have cameras showing the opposition is a tell-tale sign that these are put on for the program. Real exercises are much more complex and if large enough then umpired.

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## ajpirzada

blain2 said:


> What you saw there was not an exercise, rather a demonstration put on by the units for the Dawn documentary. Usually in exercises, they have opposing side which thinks, calculates and adjusts its tactics etc. as the enemy would.
> 
> The fact that you have cameras showing the opposition is a tell-tale sign that these are put on for the program. Real exercises are much more complex and if large enough then umpired.



so if a camp is being raded then those defending the camp get equal chance to keep it under their control?


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## Kamakazi 69

Has DAWN shown anything on the air force yet?


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## moha199

nice job bro


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## blain2

ajpirzada said:


> so if a camp is being raded then those defending the camp get equal chance to keep it under their control?



Yes absolutely. They are also being evaluated in their ability to hold their positions etc.

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## Kasrkin

From what I saw in the glimpses WAS will be covering the Army SSG and artillery. I think I saw Wajahat touring the SSG company at Siachen!


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## blain2

Arty is being covered specifically to keep Xeric happy  We had to put in a special request into Wajahat sahib for this.

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## Xeric

blain2 said:


> Arty is being covered specifically to keep Xeric happy  We had to put in a special request into Wajahat sahib for this.




Guud!

Let's see if he do justice with the Corp of Artillery!!!


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## Shiji

Can someone please tell me what was the name of the other sniper that was showcased in the NSSG episode? The one lighter then the SSG-69? I am guessing the L-96 but am not sure.


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## Elmo

ajpirzada said:


> this one was quite interesting. may be bec i dont know much about navy.
> 
> anyways i have got a question. in these exercises do they use rubber bullets? or do u just assume that you gonna achieve the targets. if these drills are conducted with the assumption of victory then wats the point? there should be an option of failin as well



Hi AJ, agreed with you about it being interesting ... but some of Wajahat's antics are so over-board. It's like a little boy on the rampage in a toy shop. Some of the content, I couldn't understand its relevance. Like that bit from Saving Private Ryan 

On the risk of sounding shallow but whatever, here goes it: my bane these days with the programme, and I mean no offense to any serving/retired military professional on board or from military backgrounds, is the blatant lack of good-looking guys featured in the episodes.  
I mean, aren't the military guys are supposed to be all hunky. What happened to the coloured-eyed, tall, muscular, charming kinds &#8212; all the women get to see are skinny men (very agile nevertheless) with no strong jaws, good bods etc etc. No biggie but eye candy doesn't hurt, eh? And nobody dare say, that the presenter is eye-candy because he's not. He's tall, stocky and bald! Yikes!


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## fatman17

Elmo sounds very much like a Nadja !!!


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## Elmo

fatman17 said:


> Elmo sounds very much like a Nadja !!!




Yeah, it doesn't really require rocket science to figure that out!!!!


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## PAFAce

Elmo said:


> On the risk of sounding shallow but whatever, here goes it: my bane these days with the programme, and I mean no offense to any serving/retired military professional on board or from military backgrounds, is the blatant lack of good-looking guys featured in the episodes.
> I mean, aren't the military guys are supposed to be all hunky. What happened to the coloured-eyed, tall, muscular, charming kinds &#8212; all the women get to see are skinny men (very agile nevertheless) with no strong jaws, good bods etc etc. No biggie but eye candy doesn't hurt, eh? And nobody dare say, that the presenter is eye-candy because he's not. He's tall, stocky and bald! Yikes!


Lol! Military men won't take that lightly at all. I bet fatman17 starts posting shirtless pictures from his youth now... (after much Photoshop-ing).

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## Elmo

PAFAce said:


> Lol! Military men won't take that lightly at all. I bet fatman17 starts posting shirtless pictures from his youth now... * (after much Photoshop-ing).*



Anyone will definitely take offence to that!


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## PAFAce

Elmo said:


> Anyone will definitely take offence to that!


Well, you're the one making unreasonable demands. Not all soldiers can look like Brad Pitt or Matt Damon, you know. Hollywood has set the bar too high. Phtoshop is now essential. Though, I should be the last one to talk. I'm the opposite of skinny and bald.


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## Elmo

PAFAce said:


> Well, you're the one making unreasonable demands. Not all soldiers can look like Brad Pitt or Matt Damon, you know. Hollywood has set the bar too high. Phtoshop is now essential. Though, I should be the last one to talk. I'm the opposite of skinny and bald.



So you are saying you are fat and hairy? 

Unreasonable demands!

Come on PAFAce things can be spiced up a bit! Agreed not all soldiers look like Brad Pitt or Matt Damon or Harrison Ford (one of my favs) but hey did you ever watch Sunheray Din or even Alpha Bravo Charlie  Gulsher (Captain Qasim Khan) was such a softie/cutie (even though now he is not even close to that) and so was his other friend Kashif (Captain Abdullah Mahmood). Not even one guy close to their level after four episodes


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## Kasrkin

> On the risk of sounding shallow but whatever, here goes it: my bane these days with the programme, and I mean no offense to any serving/retired military professional on board or from military backgrounds, is the blatant lack of good-looking guys featured in the episodes.
> I mean, aren't the military guys are supposed to be all hunky. What happened to the coloured-eyed, tall, muscular, charming kinds  all the women get to see are skinny men (very agile nevertheless) with no strong jaws, good bods etc etc. No biggie but eye candy doesn't hurt, eh? And nobody dare say, that the presenter is eye-candy because he's not. He's tall, stocky and bald! Yikes!



All this would be so weird if you were a guy...

Listen, Elmo, everyone has different points of view and perceptions, even when it comes to 'looks'. So best raise issues that are more credible and discussable, so as to be less annoying to other members. These are news documentaries, not movies or dramas, so no point comparing them with actors.

Too bad they're not airing an episode every week, I was looking forward to this Sundays but they didnt show.


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## Elmo

*Too bad they're not airing an episode every week, I was looking forward to this Sundays but they didnt show.
*
They changed the schedule last I heard... let me see if I can find a link to that.

*So best raise issues that are more credible and discussable*
Completely cool with that.


P.S.: *All this would be so weird if you were a guy...*
The statement isn't funny... in fact quite tiring and annoying. At least a mod should not hurl it a member's way.


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## Kasrkin

> in fact quite tiring and annoying. At least a mod should not hurl it a member's way.



Please accept my apology. I'll refrain from such "sexist" comments in the future.


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## Elmo

Kasrkin said:


> Please accept my apology. I'll refrain from such "sexist" comments in the future.



Accepted..


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## blain2

Elmo said:


> *Too bad they're not airing an episode every week, I was looking forward to this Sundays but they didnt show.
> *
> They changed the schedule last I heard... let me see if I can find a link to that.
> 
> *So best raise issues that are more credible and discussable*
> Completely cool with that.
> 
> 
> P.S.: *All this would be so weird if you were a guy...*
> The statement isn't funny... in fact quite tiring and annoying. At least a mod should not hurl it a member's way.



WAS is on hold for now.


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## fatman17

xeric said:


> Guud!
> 
> Let's see if he do justice with the Corp of Artillery!!!



The Queens of Battle !!!

---------- Post added at 10:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:45 AM ----------




blain2 said:


> WAS is on hold for now.



I wonder Why???


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## blain2

Some additional screening/reviewing needed.


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## ajpirzada

no. actually they have started lookin for some gud looking guys

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## Slides

Navy put a stop to WAS.


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## Elmo

Slides said:


> Navy put a stop to WAS.



How do you know that? Why have they put a stop?


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Slides said:


> Navy put a stop to WAS.



You would think that if they had issues with what was being shown, they would have vetted the material and edited it before it was aired.


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## Slides

Elmo said:


> How do you know that? Why have they put a stop?


Navy chief didn't like some of his commentary after WAS was approved by ISPR and Navy HQ. Wahajat probably made some stupid comment comparing navy to the other services. PEMRA told Dawn News to not show that episode, the rest who knows.


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## kidwaibhai

so what if he said anything this is a democracy. the right to free speech is a fundemental one. the Navy is shooting itself in the foot by not allowing this to be aired. this was really creating some goodwill among the people about the services and could have even bought in some more recruits of higher caliber.


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## PAFAce

kidwaibhai said:


> so what if he said anything this is a democracy. the right to free speech is a fundemental one. the Navy is shooting itself in the foot by not allowing this to be aired. this was really creating some goodwill among the people about the services and could have even bought in some more recruits of higher caliber.



It is foolish to start throwing accusations willy-nilly without proper evidence. All we have is one man's word-of-mouth and other rumours. If I were you I would reserve judgement until and if more concrete information becomes available.

It could well be something to do with exposure of sensitive information or affect on troop morale etc. Who knows? My personal entertainment and general knowledge are not more important than the defence of my country. If it isn't anything serious, I'm sure we'll see the show again.


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## Kasrkin

Where are you getting your info from Slides?


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## Slides

Kasrkin said:


> Where are you getting your info from Slides?


Pakdef.info

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## moha199

Slides said:


> Pakdef.info



 That was good one lmao

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## Slides

moha199 said:


> That was good one lmao


Is that funny?


----------



## Xeric

Slides said:


> Pakdef.info



No hard feelings bro!


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## Slides

I guess I missed the joke...


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## blain2

moha199 said:


> That was good one lmao



There is some issue with the content and that is why the show is not being aired any longer. What Slides has posted is not that much off the mark.


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## Kasrkin

Do we know any particulars? I think its a bit odd that the Navy and Army gave him so much access and now they&#8217;re against it being aired.


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## Xeric

Kasrkin said:


> Do we know any particulars? I think its a bit odd that the Navy and Army gave him so much access and now theyre against it being aired.



Bad Homework, nothing else.


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## Silverfalcon

Could you explain the situation in more detail please. Thanks.


----------



## signals3_t4

Yes,
We are Social Soldiers

---------- Post added at 09:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:57 AM ----------

Nice Army Images


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## PAFAce

Sorry to revive a hibernating thread, but I'd really like to see a Top Gear style documentary on Pak forces. We are Soldiers is a fine effort (whatever they released of it, that is), but it's not in the same league as some of the docs I've seen on international channels. There was a documentary series on Discovery Channel called "Jetstream", following Canadian Forces pilots through Fighter training on CF-18s (F/A-18 hornets). I thought that was very interesting, and I guarantee it boosted recruitment. Now they've followed it up with "Combat School", which is focused on Canadian Army ops in Afghanistan. Both these docs are far, far more interesting than WAS, but neither compare with BBC docs Top Gear style (sorry, I just love that show).

I just thought I'd express my views here, since its a related thread. You don't have to put _any_ sensitive material into the documentaries, just basic training coupled with veteran anecdotes, interviews and computer generated animation. It's probably harder said than done, but we can try.

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## Hunter911

Nice picture!it's cool !


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## Kamakazi 69

PAFAce said:


> Sorry to revive a hibernating thread, but I'd really like to see a Top Gear style documentary on Pak forces. We are Soldiers is a fine effort (whatever they released of it, that is), but it's not in the same league as some of the docs I've seen on international channels. There was a documentary series on Discovery Channel called "Jetstream", following Canadian Forces pilots through Fighter training on CF-18s (F/A-18 hornets). I thought that was very interesting, and I guarantee it boosted recruitment. Now they've followed it up with "Combat School", which is focused on Canadian Army ops in Afghanistan. Both these docs are far, far more interesting than WAS, but neither compare with BBC docs Top Gear style (sorry, I just love that show).
> 
> I just thought I'd express my views here, since its a related thread. You don't have to put _any_ sensitive material into the documentaries, just basic training coupled with veteran anecdotes, interviews and computer generated animation. It's probably harder said than done, but we can try.



Kick-*** visuals, incredible cinematography, genuine wit, whats not to like.

If only we had a local version of Jeremy Clarkson. Baitullah Mehsud sort of looked like Hammond.


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## moha199

What i believe is that May be it aired at the wrong time since we have enemy and who can learn our way of fighting since this programe started to get deep. I believe once the Talibans are done we might see them....


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## GLOBAL HAWK

Kamakazi 69 said:


> Baitullah Mehsud sort of looked like Hammond.




ohhh man Thats both scary and funny


----------



## Mujahid

why isnt the programme airing ???
it has been a long time !!


----------



## r0ck

Kamakazi 69 said:


> Baitullah Mehsud sort of looked like Hammond.





GLOBAL HAWK said:


> ohhh man Thats both scary and funny



And imagine him going to America to do a show just like the usual lot on Top Gear


----------



## owais.usmani

A few weeks ago I inquired Wajahat on facebook about the status of WE ARE SOLDIERS. Today I got his reply. This is what he had to say:



> *Getting Shot Down Doesn't Mean You're Gonna Crash...​*
> 
> 
> I know. It's super cheesy. But you've always got options. After 'We Are Soldiers' was banned, I faced serious issues as a professional. My proposals for new projects were turned down, I was effectively out of the 'power loop' at work, and I felt pretty useless. But everyone moves on. And I did too. Today, on Nov 7, two days after my 31st birthday and a day short of my 6 month wedding anniversary (both serious hallmarks, trust me) I am making my official comeback by returning with 'TalkBack', my old series. But actually, its not really about my 'comeback'. And it's not really about me. Its about what I do: journalism.
> 
> Journalism has changed the face of Pakistan. Sure, its got regulation, ethical, and bias issues. Sure, many of those who write in our papers and blogs or appear on our screens are perhaps not as responsible (or even as bright, or even as trained) as some of the others. But trust me, most of them mean well.
> 
> 'Soldiers' was banned by a very powerful institution. Still, months after the ban and the doc not being on TV, this facebook page is still growing. The show is not on air, but its message and impact remains. Just tonight, I got an email from a young lady who said that she was inspired by the documentary and that it had played a part in propelling her to study documentary film making.
> 
> If most of you thought that 'Soldiers' was for guys with a 'boys with toys' complex, think again. And if you think a very powerful institution can magically make a show that took a few thousand hours of shooting, editing and writing to disappear, then you're wrong on that as well. Why? Because good journalism is like telling the truth, and truth is inspirational. And constant.
> 
> Thus, journalism and its many facets, from blogs to docs to tweeting, from Geo to Dawn to CNN to Pay-per-view Bloomberg News, will continue to affect us and will continue to evolve. And we must keep up with it. It's a civic duty to observe journalism, participate in it, and think critically about it. But we have to challenge it, like we would to a science, not just believe in it, like we would with religion.
> 
> As for my new show, 'TalkBack' has been called by a critic to be the 'toughest show on television'. It's a hard earned title, because we work hard to prove a point. Extra hard. We look for sources no one really knows about. We devise our research methodology with such detail that we have to force ourselves to actually take some time off before the shoot to relax a little. We pull all nighters every week, week after week, and inspire each other with the belief that this work will pay off. If not today evening, then maybe tomorrow morning, when the show repeats. If not tomorrow morning, then maybe on some website somewhere, where it will be posted by a fan. The possibilities of the dissemination of information in today's world are both numerous and exciting.
> 
> That's why the information going 'out there' better be good.
> 
> That's why we do journalism. To get the word out. The right word.
> 
> I hope to hear back from you guys about the show. Just like we did in 'Soldiers' we are trying to shatter the barriers and myths that are so pervasive in our country.
> 
> 'TalkBack, the Comeback Series ' airs at 7pm PST today (Saturday 7/11) and then at 11 am again tomorrow morning on Dawn News TV. It will be uploaded on (YouTube - talkbackdawn's Channel) after broadcast. I might even do a 'ustream.com' video conference after the show, which is like video blogging, but I haven't slept in a couple of days so that depends on how far the coffee can take me today!
> 
> You liked We Are Soldiers. That's why you're on this page and getting this message. Trust me, you will love TalkBack.
> 
> Best of luck. Over and Out.
> 
> WSK
> 
> PS: If you think this message is worth spreading, send it to your pals. We need the support and the viewership




*I guess it sums it up pretty clearly that WE ARE SOLDIERS is not going to be aired again. *

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## Slides

Soldiers, while a good enough series lacked in quality and accuracy of information.


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## blain2

The quality and accuracy, or there lack of, was as good as that of any show you see on Discovery's military channel. For a Pakistani show, it was a very decent effort to set the military documentaries on the right footing..too bad Navy had other ideas.


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## PAFAce

owais.usmani said:


> A few weeks ago I inquired Wajahat on facebook about the status of WE ARE SOLDIERS. Today I got his reply. This is what he had to say:
> 
> I guess it sums it up pretty clearly that WE ARE SOLDIERS is not going to be aired again.


Owais, did you write to him on behalf of PDF? Also, if you did, can we please see what you wrote?

Also, It was interesting to read about the "very powerful organization". If this organization is the ISPR, then they have every right to block the spread of information. I didn't realize there was any "sensitive" information in WAS, however, you never know what piece of information could be used against us.

I will wait for TalkBack. Hopefully, it will live to the "toughest show on TV" comment. I wish this man all the best in his endeavors, his efforts with WAS were surely appreciated.

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## owais.usmani

PAFAce said:


> *Owais, did you write to him on behalf of PDF? Also, if you did, can we please see what you wrote?*
> 
> Also, It was interesting to read about the "very powerful organization". If this organization is the ISPR, then they have every right to block the spread of information. I didn't realize there was any "sensitive" information in WAS, however, you never know what piece of information could be used against us.
> 
> I will wait for TalkBack. Hopefully, it will live to the "toughest show on TV" comment. I wish this man all the best in his endeavors, his efforts with WAS were surely appreciated.



No sir I didn't write on behalf of PDF.

Wajahat is my friend on facebook and I asked him this question in a private conversation.

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## Kasrkin

blain2 said:


> The quality and accuracy, or there lack of, was as good as that of any show you see on Discovery's military channel. For a Pakistani show, it was a very decent effort to set the military documentaries on the right footing..too bad Navy had other ideas.



Do we have any idea of what _actually_ irked the Navy? I have some ideas...


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## Patriot

Kasrkin said:


> Do we have any idea of what _actually_ irked the Navy? I have some ideas...


Oh do tell us..


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## owais.usmani

*Posted by Wajahat on facebook:*



> *NEGOTIATING THE BAN!​*
> 
> ATTENTION SOLDIERS:
> 
> We need your help on this one!
> We need a message, or an appeal, or a request, whatever you want to call it, from YOU guys, to US, regarding why you think the ban on WE ARE SOLDIERS should be OVERTURNED!
> We will process all of your messages forward to the concerned authorities. Rest assured, your messages will go a long way in building a case for W.A.S. and its return to the screens of this country!
> 
> So, email us at : dawncurrentaffairs@gmail.com
> 
> Over and Out...


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## Super Falcon

why they stoppped we are soldiers on NSSG when they were last episode on NSSG


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## Kompromat

Why would they ban such an Awesome show? Any sensitive Info aired
?????


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## S-A-B-E-R->

i herd wajahat said some thing which some how ment that ssg is better than nssg also in another report another reporter showed evidence of navy officals using naval personal and naval weapons for their own protection ...something like that 
plz if im wrong correct me


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## usmanjilani

just got some tips for my new essay regarding pakistans defence and soverinity (spell)...........................
Thank you, ""'Owais.Usmani"" sb


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## RAVIAN

DID ANYBODY UPLOADED THE VIDEO,as i missed the video


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## Super Falcon

well in last episode wajahat said wait for next episode he was due to show more things hope some one here knows wajahat closely and tell his about our request we need this show to be run again and with few NSSG weapons i think they are not well equiped


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## LeeRain

Made the thread sticky for easy look up and future reference purposes.


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## Super Falcon

well hope to see its again and again and again hope to see more small new weapons for ssg and nssg these are not enough

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## uncanny

got a msg through facebook on july 17th this interview might clear things up..........


It's been debated and discussed, but here is the first on-cam version of what went wrong with We Are Soldiers. This story (by Kiran Khalid of CNN, who has done a very fair job with the subject) also provides a good insight on the pressures the media faces when it comes to covering certain other 'no go' areas in Pakistan. Hope you enjoy it (and leave your comments too)

Pakistani Journalist Battles the Army?and his Bosses - VJ Movement

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## D.I.G Mansoor

Excellent Pics

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## Anti_Zionist

awesoome stuff

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## Ali.009

Can someone please share the downloading links?!!

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## Irfan Baloch

uncanny said:


> got a msg through facebook on july 17th this interview might clear things up..........
> 
> 
> It's been debated and discussed, but here is the first on-cam version of what went wrong with We Are Soldiers. This story (by Kiran Khalid of CNN, who has done a very fair job with the subject) also provides a good insight on the pressures the media faces when it comes to covering certain other 'no go' areas in Pakistan. Hope you enjoy it (and leave your comments too)
> 
> Pakistani Journalist Battles the Army?and his Bosses - VJ Movement



the link si now broken 

I was interested to see what was said

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## Ali.009

Post new HIGH Quality links people!

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## Super Falcon

can we ever see remaining episodes of we are soldiers

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## skybolt



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## skybolt



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## skybolt



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## skybolt

*There were only 4 episodes on aired!!!!

All 4 Episodes are available on You Tube We Are Soldiers Channel

We Are Soldiers ( HD ) Episodes

*
*YouTube - WeAreSoldierss's Channel*

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## skybolt



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## skybolt



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## skybolt

*Pakistan Navy Small Arms Dispaly​*

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## @nline

Pakistan Zindabad.

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## AsianLion

Anyone has HD quality links ? any news episodes, I hope Military allows it happen.


Terrible hideous Army or Military to ban wajahat khan from defence matters.

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## brucepham

Very well done, bravo! Much better than I expected

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## Battle Axe

This was one terrific series: I was glued to TV for this...

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## CHNTiger



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## Super Falcon

hope new programms willl come tooo like we are solders

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## Darth Vader

Was their any episode on PAF

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## BannuTorkham

Mast hai yaar sari photos

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## Bamboo Castle

Are we all soldiers???

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## AmnaR

ny non-youtube links for all episodes!! just saw some clips and this is really nice!

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## skybolt

can someone please upload this documentary on Vimeo will be very helpful.

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## LeslieEngel

Great work. I just loved it.


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## stalintom

It is really nice. I have seen it. You are done a great work


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## SSG commandos




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