# US Solider got half of his head blown off



## pkd

*The Picture*

*By: David Glenn Cox *






I want you to look very closely at this picture and try and keep it in your minds eye. This was a perfectly healthy twenty two-year-old young man who in the service of his country got half of his head blown off. I think that&#8217;s important, I think that&#8217;s newsworthy. Let me tell you how newsworthy I think it is. I think that it&#8217;s more important than chocolate cake recipes and far more important than comic book reviews. It is more important than who fell and whose swell at the winter Olympic games. 


It is far more important than any self-serving load of crap banged out by Pseudo doctor Amy. It is more important than American Idol or Lost or any other mindless goat droppings the public chooses to chew on. This is some American mother&#8217;s son, her little boy, he may be gay or straight or transgender but his life is fucked forever. 

How did this come to happen to this poor mother&#8217;s son? It came to happen because the people in the media who are supposed to foster a public debate on such public issues as war instead used their franchise to promote articles about chocolate cake and comic book reviews. They see their free press as free to choose not to look when bad thinks happen. They feel no need to explain to his parents or to anyone that the war that blew off half of this poor boys head was based on out and out lies. 

It was a war perpetrated by people who hoped to gain from it be it in oil or pipelines or service contracts and like the media they don&#8217;t care that this mother&#8217;s son is mangled and mutilated. Do you care? I&#8217;ve been married twice for a combined twenty-five years and in that time I doubt my wives ever baked a chocolate cake. I don&#8217;t read comic books or watch goat crap TV but you see I&#8217;ve got a son about this boy&#8217;s age. My heart aches and my mind fills with rage because the people that have the power and authority to show this picture would rather talk about American Idol and from where I sit that makes them an accomplice to a war crime. 

Because not content to ignore the current victims they support more crimes and call for more wars. Several years ago in Iraq parents waited for their children at a bus stop. An errant coalition missile struck the bus stop and blew the elementary school age children to pieces. Needless to say this wasn&#8217;t widely reported but the parents in a frenzy began fighting over the body parts of their children. Little arms and legs, little headless torsos identifiable only by the shirt or dress they were wearing. Imagine the horror, imagine the type of people who could do such a thing. How do they live with themselves? How do they sleep at night? 

They do it by watching Lost and American Idol and by eating chocolate cake. They read comic books and watch sports. It makes life easy because the media will not intrude on their fantasy world but instead will promote the fantasy. Oh, but who won the gold metal in curling and who was eliminated on American Idol. 

Iraq war Coalition Deaths 4,696 

Injured 30,000 

Iraqi civilian deaths and injured, 1,366,650 

Afghanistan coalition Deaths 1,659 

American taxpayers bill as of today $964,044,305,874 

&#160;&#160;&#160; : Information Clearing House -&#160; ICH

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Sad story ... very difficult for people to loose lives and limbs etc and the gov has no club what is happening , its all political every one does not want to be the one to admit it


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Sad story ... very difficult for people to loose lives and limbs etc and the gov has no club what is happening , its all political every one does not want to be the one to admit it

There are countless stories of ppl that came back with no arms or legs or their health destroyed but the news media does not tells that story 

Yes they do cover the odd , holiday prime time 1 hour special that shows few positive spin up to story


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## Awesome

Where are the details about the soldier? After reading that big rant I was hoping to understand how did this medical marvel take place!

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## Condor

^^^^^

OK, Here's HOW:















At least the guy has half his head - this chicken has no head.
There's much in life that you don't have to understand Asim, just
take them as it is.

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## pak-marine

respect to the Doctors ,its a medicle miracle that this guy survived

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## third eye

Asim Aquil said:


> Where are the details about the soldier? After reading that big rant I was hoping to understand how did this medical marvel take place!



Yes, was hoping to know of the advances made in medicine to sustain a man with part of the brain removed.

know someone who suffered so.


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## TaimiKhan

1 trillion dollars wasted in these wars, could have removed poverty and done so much better for the peace and living standard of the people on this earth, alas but wasted on these pathetic wars and more suffering and misery for God knows how many civilians and soldiers like the above one.

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## gambit

taimikhan said:


> 1 trillion dollars wasted in these wars, could have removed poverty and done so much better for the peace and living standard of the people on this earth, alas but wasted on these pathetic wars and more suffering and misery for God knows how many civilians and soldiers like the above one.


We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7831460.stm


> By 2007, 1.3 million Africans were on medication, much of it paid for by the Bush administration.
> 
> And, as anyone who has ever been to a refugee camp in Africa will testify, almost all the food aid to be seen comes from American farmers - aid worth $1.23bn (&#163;0.85bn) in 2007.
> 
> Mr Bush's Malaria initiative has seen the disease halved in 15 African countries.
> 
> Travelling to the continent with the president in February last year, Bob Geldof concluded: "The Bush regime has been divisive - but not in Africa.
> 
> "I read it has been incompetent - but not in Africa. It has created bitterness - but not here in Africa. Here, *his administration has saved millions of lives." *



And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.

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## pkd

gambit said:


> We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined. And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.



Can you money get a new head for that unfortunate guy?

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## gambit

pkd said:


> Can you money get a new head for that unfortunate guy?


You are not fooling anyone about this thread. This is not about compassion for the wounded. This is nothing more than convenient sadistic entertainment value for those who hate US.

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## jagjitnatt

taimikhan said:


> 1 trillion dollars wasted in these wars, could have removed poverty and done so much better for the peace and living standard of the people on this earth, alas but wasted on these pathetic wars and more suffering and misery for God knows how many civilians and soldiers like the above one.



Wasted is not the word. Investment is.

If US didn't fight this war, world could have become a much more dangerous place in the future and more so for Pakistan, as a huge army of Talibanis are living just behind their back.

You should thank US. If it wasn't for US, this problem would have never been solved. Pakistan wasn't interested. And the day Pakistan would have realized the threat, it would have been too late.

Look at it now. Even after Taliban becoming so weak you still witness couple of blasts in Pakistan at least. Just shows how powerful they were and how important it is to finish them.

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Condor said:


> ^^^^^
> 
> OK, Here's HOW:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least the guy has half his head - this chicken has no head.
> There's much in life that you don't have to understand Asim, just
> take them as it is.





That chicken is fake right ??? can't be real


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## mjnaushad

jagjitnatt said:


> Wasted is not the word. Investment is.
> 
> If US didn't fight this war, world could have become a much more dangerous place in the future and more so for Pakistan, as a huge army of Talibanis are living just behind their back.
> 
> You should thank US. If it wasn't for US, this problem would have never been solved. Pakistan wasn't interested. And the day Pakistan would have realized the threat, it would have been too late.
> 
> Look at it now. Even after Taliban becoming so weak you still witness couple of blasts in Pakistan at least. Just shows how powerful they were and how important it is to finish them.


Yeah investment.....In oil....

How many civilians were dying every day in Iraq before the war. You call it investment because its the Muslims dying all over the world. I used to believe Oil is blood of Dinosaurs but now its changed. Its blood of dead Iraqi civilians.


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## pkd

gambit said:


> You are not fooling anyone about this thread. This is not about compassion for the wounded. This is nothing more than convenient sadistic entertainment value for those who hate US.



A conveniet way to escape the hollowness your argument is to demonise other being anti-US. Pathetic.



gambit said:


> This is nothing more than convenient sadistic entertainment value for those who hate US.


Can you corroborate your assertion with some valid logic?

Infact that was the story non of the mainstream media deemed good enough for some space and that was the preciese reason i posted that thread transceding the so called consecrated nationalism and more as a humanistic tragedy.


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

gambit said:


> We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined. And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.




Well unfortunately posts were sincere and its sad that young ppl have to suffer like this - may be to indians its another chance to hype things up 

Lets not forget we also lost 30,000 soliders in this war according to our armies way more then US casualties and probbly we have many soliders permenently injured and devestated as well

Pakistan is more closer to battle then you think - even now I feel if we get 80 helicopters and 3-4 billion for our army we can go in Afghanistan and take care of business get it done, and US can safely move its soliders back to recover from the 10 year war 

But indians just want to promote this as another thread - hey they invested nothing yet they got a nuclear deal - they would like the war to continue


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## gambit

pkd said:


> A conveniet way to escape the hollowness your argument is to demonise other being anti-US. Pathetic.


And how many threads here about the collapse of the US dollar? Hope you did not move your money into the euro. Look at the euro problems lately? Or how about the prediction by some obscure Russian professor predicting the breakup of the US. An American aircraft crash is a cause for a new thread. Spare me.


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## jagjitnatt

mjnaushad said:


> How many civilians were dying every day in Iraq before the war. You call it investment because its the Muslims dying all over the world.



A lot. There are videos all over the internet showing how people were killed. Saddam was a dictator and a harsh one at that. He killed thousands and ill treated millions. Were they not muslims?

I accept a lot of people died/are dying now but at least they have ensured a great future. 20 years from now things would be completely different. Could you expect something nice in Saddam's rule?

Taliban never attacked Pakistan before, but it now is desperately after Pak, since Pak is now helping US in WoT. Does that mean Taliban was good? No. You wipe them out today. You'll have a great future. 

To save millions, it is crucial to sacrifice thousands.


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## Condor

AZADPAKISTAN2009 said:


> That chicken is fake right ??? can't be real


Its for real AZAD, published in LIFE Magazine.

check out this Link:
Mike the Headless Chicken - Photo Gallery, 5 Pictures - LIFE


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Condor said:


> Its for real AZAD, published in LIFE Magazine.
> 
> check out this Link:
> Mike the Headless Chicken - Photo Gallery, 5 Pictures - LIFE



What? ? ?get out of here , the head is not even connected ...look how the other chickens are looking at the chicken , it makes no sense - it has no central nervous system


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## gen x

USA is not just a country its a dream country where freedom ,equality , peace take place 

god bless my USA and rest of world

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## Abu Zolfiqar

taimikhan said:


> 1 trillion dollars wasted in these wars, could have removed poverty and done so much better for the peace and living standard of the people on this earth, alas but wasted on these pathetic wars and more suffering and misery for God knows how many civilians and soldiers like the above one.



the soldiers just obey orders professionally and dutifully

it is the policy makers who sit comfortably while the poor suffer.....most of the soldiers dying in Iraq and Afghanistan wars are between 18 to 25 years old. There's nothing better than dying for your country, but there's also nothing worse than dying for pointless wars which just waste money, resources, and lives 


money could have gone to rehabilitating the homeless, feeding the poor, investing more in education and health services (in America and other parts of the world)...the list goes on



as for this soldier, i think it's a miracle he actually survived. He's lucky as hell to be breathing; I dont think we should make mockery out of his situation, how does it make one look if he/she does that


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## Abu Zolfiqar

$970 billion badly spent!! Imagine if it went elsewhere, for something productive.

I can assure you it would end a lot of strife in Africa and much of Asia. It would also make America look like a true global leader, and less people would perceive it as imperialist. Mr. President Obama promised change; we are waiting to see it


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## gambit

Abu Zolfiqar said:


> I dont think we should make mockery out of his situation, how does it make one look if he/she does that


This is **** for many here. The gorier the wound to any US soldier, the faster the fists pumps. The lust is disguised behind some incoherent rant about US foreign policy.


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## gambit

Abu Zolfiqar said:


> $970 billion badly spent!! Imagine if it went elsewhere, for something productive.
> 
> I can assure you *it would end a lot of strife in Africa* and much of Asia. It would also make America look like a true global leader, and less people would perceive it as imperialist. Mr. President Obama promised change; we are waiting to see it


See previous page.


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## Abu Zolfiqar

gambit said:


> This is **** for many here. The gorier the wound to any US soldier, the faster the fists pumps. The lust is disguised behind some incoherent rant about US foreign policy.



yeah but its a waste of time, and immature. He's just a foot soldier, he didnt make the policy decisions

i feel sorry for a lot of those soldiers who are being sent to countries with unrealistic objectives and no long-term strategy or plan. 

I consider myself a friend of America, since I have American friends and family in the U.S. I do hope the policy makers mend their ways and get themselves out of this madness.

Same way I hope for a lot of change and reforms here at home


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## Abu Zolfiqar

gambit said:


> See previous page.



i'm not denying that America has been a generous country....but unfortunately, it seems sometimes there are strings attached and also selectivity

America is a powerful country in every aspect. Why doesnt she use her might to END conflicts in the world -- such as Palestine issue which has been a destabilizing factor in Middle East.


I read this article earlier today. I'm sorry to deviate from the subject, but do read it when you have the time, especially the last few lines regarding aid to Palestine. 



Criticism of Israel is not ?anti-Israel? - or worse, says US congressman - RT Top Stories


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## DaRk WaVe

Soldiers are soldiers no matter from which country they are, They are there to serve country & they do with their lives

There are people who say american soldiers are cowards &  

but think for a moment the very fact that the they are serving in areas where they know that on every corner there is an IED, any time any one can explode & from no where a sniper can pierce a hole through their head is enough bravery 

atleast they are better than us, so 

*LEARN TO RESPECT THEM*

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## gambit

Abu Zolfiqar said:


> America is a powerful country in every aspect. *Why doesnt she use her might to END conflicts in the world* -- such as Palestine issue which has been a destabilizing factor in Middle East.


There goes that canard again. And there goes the Palestinians canard again...and again...and again...ad nauseum. It is funny that no equal burden is placed on the Arabs, the Iranians and the Palestinians themselves, especially when it is a fact, thru UNRWA, that the US is the most generous donor to the improvement of the Palestinians. Since when is it the responsibility of the US to 'END conflicts' anyway? Because we are the wealthiest? First you complain 'Who appointed US the global police?' Now you demand that we 'END conflicts' when the argument is rhetorically convenient for you. Sometimes to end conflicts the police may have to initiate a conflict. Ever consider that?


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## DaRk WaVe




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## kashith

gambit said:


> We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined.
> 
> BBC NEWS | Africa | Has Bush been Africa's best friend?
> 
> 
> And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.



Gambit,there are some people who will never realize the importance of greater good.I respect US for the courage it has shown since WW1 and WW2.Unfortunately,nobody looks at the sacrifice US makes for the world peace.China may be getting economically big but we have still to see global leadership like US.It is sad that so many people hate US ,they want US to solve all their problem and not only that want to get money too from US all the while cursing US.I salute the brave soldier and his mother.

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## Abu Zolfiqar

gambit said:


> There goes that canard again. And there goes the Palestinians canard again...and again...and again...ad nauseum. It is funny that no equal burden is placed on the Arabs, the Iranians and the Palestinians themselves, especially when it is a fact, thru UNRWA, that the US is the most generous donor to the improvement of the Palestinians. Since when is it the responsibility of the US to 'END conflicts' anyway? Because we are the wealthiest? First you complain 'Who appointed US the global police?' Now you demand that we 'END conflicts' when the argument is rhetorically convenient for you. Sometimes to end conflicts the police may have to initiate a conflict. Ever consider that?



Obama himself promised to *help* end the issue. Now he is remaining silent; he has been in power long enough now to understand what is at stake here.

I agree that the Arabs need to get their acts together as well, as they are dis-united (nothing new with that).





you have the leverage to help solve the issue......U.S. being a primary aid and arms dealer to israeli can also help creation of an independent Palestinian state; so that the world can move on.



Like i said, it is stupid to bash America all the time. In Pakistan, I find myself defending America on certain things. But on this issue, I feel strongly that they have wasted a lot of money on useless wars that have had no success or benefit for your country. America's image and PR is not so good in front of many parts of the world. 

America has done many generous things. Look how much they helped us during our 2005 earthquake. Kashmir/Pakistanis didnt forget that, though politics is clouding the minds of a lot of people.

admittedly, at times --- even my own

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

gambit said:


> This is **** for many here. The gorier the wound to any US soldier, the faster the fists pumps. The lust is disguised behind some incoherent rant about US foreign policy.



Gambit - you need to understand , when soliders are sent in there are casualties , but provided there is planning and goals 

When the soliders are sent in with out any planning and sound logic , then someone has to take responsibiliy

If people are told they can't have health care because it cost 50-150 billion dollars , ok , ppl understand but when whole army goes to Afghanistan and Iraq and no one sees the cash ppl wonder k where did the 10 trillion dollaers went ?

These soliders come home , and they are suffering who who should fix these solider's life ? Me/You ... society 

*Whose fault is it the leaders who concluded things and went in?? *

If I was the leader , I would have listened to Taliban, who wanted to give up Bin Ladin provided he was tried under Afghan law, once he was in sight just negotiate a deal.

So why did people had to lose their limbs and lives over ?? for past 10 years? 

The people who made these decisions are gone now *NO ONE IS HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR *

If you still thing there is some odd pleasure , in this I am sorry there is no such thing but at same time anyone with a head on their shoulders , would agree that its not fair ppl have to go to war which has no purpose.....

If some one can proof that , sheep hearders can threathen world power (well used to be world power) then sure I would understand but at present - its a shame - we see such images - quite shameful

We are more practical , we have fought the war closely with casualties so we understand the situation 

Indians are just in it for 

a) Making sure they keep getting the outsourcing jobs to India
You ask any American , and they will tell you , lost job as company opened office in 
India, so where is the check on corporations who are exploiting Americans?
b) Indians are just interested in the nuclear deal 

*Pakistan and our soliders are paying with their lives in this war , and that is the bottom line , so if we see a US solider, we know also there must be Pakistani soliders who have very dangerous wounds ...* And there is no denying that ...

And in the end - but we do ask , the logic , I mean why on god earth would anyone attack Afghanistan its a DESERT !!! ... no roads no sea port nothing ... 

10 TRILLION DOLLARS??? 

*It could have given*
a)Free medical system to US population
b)Landed a man on mars for US
c)Free University education for all americans
d)Tranined a generation of new soliders and improved soliders
e)Helped people locally who lost jobs going to India
f) could have build free energy solar power system for every home in USA

As far as I know the American political system is desigend to always have checks and balances , but were are those checks ?? Why is no one questioning things anymore ?? 

*Just because the gov changed now no one is held responsible anymore ?? *
If you don't ask these question then these soliders have gone thur hell for no reason ..
becasue no one stands up for them , the insurance companies sure don't 

What ever happned to the qualities that made US what it was ?

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## Abu Zolfiqar

AZADPAKISTAN2009 said:


> *Pakistan and our soliders are paying with their lives in this war , and that is the bottom line , so if we see a US solider, we know also there must be Pakistani soliders who have very dangerous wounds ...* And there is no denying that ...
> 
> Its common sense



Well put.

Pakistan has paid a much bigger price. You can't even put a value on the huge price Pakistan has paid


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

Abu Zolfiqar said:


> Well put.
> 
> Pakistan has paid a much bigger price. You can't even put a value on the huge price Pakistan has paid



I mean just the other day I heard a breifing that almost 30,000 injuries/casualties on Pakistani side , in this on going war thats quite a heavy number in term of casualties , and serious injuries 

What we got in return was , unpaid claims , and red tape on past owed amounts , that we need to provided to soliders who lost their lives or have serious injurie etc 

Obviously there is anger on our end why things were done this way when intelligence on our side warned of what to expect ...

And its not just us American families , whose sons are coming home with injuries are super mad -

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## pkd

gambit said:


> And how many threads here about the collapse of the US dollar?


What's so special there? Your own economist are talking about that, does it mean all of them are anti-US?



gambit said:


> Or how about the prediction by some obscure Russian professor predicting the breakup of the US. An American aircraft crash is a cause for a new thread. Spare me.



Can you prove that with a link? When i posted such a thread?
I cannt take more pity on you for your fragile condition.


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## H2O3C4Nitrogen

indeed its a miracle ...!


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## TaimiKhan

gambit said:


> We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined.
> 
> BBC NEWS | Africa | Has Bush been Africa's best friend?
> 
> 
> And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.



where in the hell does ME comes into this discussion ?? Did i mention ME in it or did i mention something else for comparison. 

And yeah we know how this money is made up and from where it comes, i do hope we don't get into a fact posting competition, otherwise the reality of money and other figures would have been there for everyone to read and see how things are run. 

Leave aside other things, the money you are bragging about isn't even your own govt's or its people, private individuals run the show and your govt is dependent on them.


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## AstanoshKhan

gambit said:


> We have done more for world peace and global poverty than all the ME countries combined.
> 
> BBC NEWS | Africa | Has Bush been Africa's best friend?
> 
> 
> And fret not about the money, we got plenty more. Just keep in mind not to piss off 'The Great Satan'.



There are bundles of sad stories of US soldiers. In the video below, (x-US) soldiers are telling what really is happening, why are these wars being fought, that a common man doesn't know.






Curse on the policy makers both in Pakistan and US, and my utmost respect to the soldiers.


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

salute to the brave people in the video

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## no_name

AZADPAKISTAN2009 said:


> What? ? ?get out of here , the head is not even connected ...look how the other chickens are looking at the chicken , it makes no sense - it has no central nervous system



The chicken is alive because the brain stem, which controls basic body functions, is intact. But the chicken is not there anymore, whats left is not more than a mechanical body with reflexes, comparable to a brain dead guy on life support.

You can lose head and live and be able to move, provided the blood lost can be stopped and your brain stem and cerebellum remains intact. Losing the cerebral hemispheres will cause loss of memory and personality. I do not think the son can connect with his mother in that picture anymore like he used to, this to me is worse than death.

A more highly developed cerebral hemispheres is what separates us from other animals. 

regards,

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## gambit

taimikhan said:


> where in the hell does ME comes into this discussion ?? Did i mention ME in it or did i mention something else for comparison.


It is very much needed for comparison. When you make this kind of indictment...



taimikhan said:


> 1 trillion dollars wasted in these wars, could have removed poverty and done so much better for the peace and living standard of the people on this earth,...



It inevitably compel people to make comparisons so why not make it a comparison between US and the ME, a region perpetually volatile from religious conflicts?



taimikhan said:


> And yeah we know how this money is made up and from where it comes, i do hope we don't get into a fact posting competition, otherwise the reality of money and other figures would have been there for everyone to read and see how things are run.
> 
> Leave aside other things, the money you are bragging about isn't even your own govt's or its people, private individuals run the show and your govt is dependent on them.


Ah...So you do admit that the US does give, and generously at that, to encourage world peace and reduce poverty. What difference does it make if it is from individuals, private organizations or the US government? Do you think the recipients of those aid really care? The indictment is implying that the US is doing nothing to contribute to the betterment of mankind. It is wrong and you know it is wrong. Confronted with the facts not to your liking you resort to tap dancing on their sources. The money issue is, and there is no better word for it, a canard. It serves as a convenient distraction from the fact that for each of all the problems in the world, there is someone other than US with greater culpability in that problem than you would care to admit, and if the second and third parties just happens to be muslims, then all blame should be on US.



taimikhan said:


> And i don't thank, rather spit on the US and its govt.


It has been my observation and experience on many muslim dominated forums that while all professed to believe in freedom of expression, whenever a member of the admin staff begins to speak in this manner, the better course for the American is to pull the ejection handle. No accusations, just precaution. You boys have a good time masturbating over this American soldier's wound.

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## Condor

^^^^^^

*GAMBIT*, Don't go away yet.

Just give me all of that Money and let me deal with your *Security Issues*.

Offering *Guaranteed Solutions*.


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## All-Green

jagjitnatt said:


> A lot. There are videos all over the internet showing how people were killed. Saddam was a dictator and a harsh one at that. He killed thousands and ill treated millions. Were they not muslims?
> 
> I accept a lot of people died/are dying now but at least they have ensured a great future. 20 years from now things would be completely different. Could you expect something nice in Saddam's rule?
> 
> Taliban never attacked Pakistan before, but it now is desperately after Pak, since Pak is now helping US in WoT. Does that mean Taliban was good? No. You wipe them out today. You'll have a great future.
> 
> To save millions, it is crucial to sacrifice thousands.



My friend, no body really liked Saddam.
However it is not a very simple matter that we conclude a golden future for Iraq now that he is gone.
Iraq did not have a democracy but they had sound infrastructure, health plan, education plans etc.

After first gulf war it mostly went down the drain but still they could have recovered, then the second war happened and broke the country into many factions and chaos reigned supreme, much of which could have been avoided...

The first war was Saddam's mistake and no doubt he is to be blamed for it.
However what happened after the first war is not something i can agree to as the best thing possible...

Leaving aside the WMD fiasco which in itself is a huge issue, the manner in which the Iraq reconstruction effort was dealt with was absolutely pathetic.
The experts like Gen Jay Garner which US had at its disposal were sidelined despite having a much better grasp of the job at hand, Bush and his close group really messed it up big time.

I suggest watching a very solid documentary called "No End In Sight", it has interviews with most of people involved in the post war scenario and is not filled with any conspiracy theory but facts alone.
How the US commanders in field could have saved some strategic locations but were only tasked to protect the oil ministry.
The chaos only spread when there was no law and order, the Iraqi museum which housed some of the most valuable artifacts in history was looted and pillaged despite the US commanders being contacted by concerned people who wanted to save the heritage of Iraq.

However these are small examples, the bigger blunder was how the Iraqi Army was treated, despite Jay Garner's sound plan to seek their support in post war reconstruction.

The US commanders wanted the Iraqi Army to maintain law and order and this was a very logical thing to do and fully backed by Gen Jay Garner in his capacity as the one overseeing the post war reconstruction.
A force of 500,000 Iraqis would have helped control the chaos and bring about normalcy and stability.
The officers of the Iraqi Army entered into talks with US commanders and everything was on track for a decent setup.
They were not Saddam Loyalists and were all sick of the past regime.
They would have been the best thing for those seeking reconstruction!

On may 11 Coalition Provisional Authority (CPA) head was changed and Paul Bremer took over from Gen Jay Garner, a sad day indeed for Iraq since all sense was lost.
Mr. Paul Bremer without consulting the experts and many of those who mattered (as confirmed in the interviews) went ahead and disbanded the Iraqi Military within weeks, all were shocked and many were angered.
This led to the Insurgency because now hundreds of thousands of soldiers were out of job and forced to fend for themselves in the streets...this was not a mistake...it was a criminal negligence of the government of USA that allowed this to happen when its own experts did not agree to this step.
The US military was doing the right thing and all of a sudden they were sidelined and entire future of the Iraqi people was put in further jeopardy because Paul Bremer wanted to de Baathify Iraq...the human cost of this decision was of tragic proportions for all parties involved.

To serve the ego of few men like Paul Bremer, the lives of many Iraqis, aid workers, US military, UN etc. were thrown away.

I wish it was a sacrifice of thousands to save millions, it was simply not the case in the end due to certain villains who were allowed to get away with Murder.

I have great respect for Gen Jay Garner, his staff and many US (and UK) officers who were genuinely trying to stabilize the situation, however the political leadership which sidelined all the logic to satisfy its ego is inexcusable.

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## S-2

*"whenever a member of the admin staff begins to speak in this manner, the better course for the American is to pull the ejection handle."*

Concur. Color me gone. The thread was an utterly tasteless display. No American here would consider using a seriously wounded Pakistani soldier or citizen as a vehicle for a political rant. Nor should it have been permitted to exist beyond the first post.

Color me gone. The lowest snake slithering on its belly possesses more dignity than those here who'd participate in or permit such.

Thanks.

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## All-Green

gambit said:


> This is **** for many here. The gorier the wound to any US soldier, the faster the fists pumps. The lust is disguised behind some incoherent rant about US foreign policy.



No my friend, sadly many here know the sorrow associated with such misfortune.
In Pakistan we have seen too much death, blood and injuries...this is not **** for most of us but something we are familiar with.

We can relate to what this family is going through, because we too have seen friends and family go through similar ordeals.
An associate of mine was injured in the inconclusive FATA operations in early 2000 and has lost control of his entire lower body, a hale and hearty fellow who was a great soldier with much promise is now forced to seek help from those around him to just move...he will suffer all his life and such sacrifices demand that the policy makers are crystal clear in their objectives and deliver something so as to justify the sacrifices.

Some people have not seen human suffering so cannot imagine how it feels but many do know it and sympathize with the family.
The soldiers do their duty and sacrifice for a higher cause which they fight for, that is something we all respect since many of us have seen such things as well.

I salute this young man for bravery and i have respect for his family which is dealing with this tragedy.
I think we can discuss the policy matters on another thread.

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## fallstuff

pkd said:


> *The Picture*
> 
> *By: David Glenn Cox *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I want you to look very closely at this picture and try and keep it in your minds eye. This was a perfectly healthy twenty two-year-old young man who in the service of his country got half of his head blown off. I think that&#8217;s important, I think that&#8217;s newsworthy. Let me tell you how newsworthy I think it is. I think that it&#8217;s more important than chocolate cake recipes .................................................
> 
> American taxpayers bill as of today $964,044,305,874
> 
> *** : Information Clearing House -* ICH



I know the discussion has strayed from the plight of the soldier concerned. There are arguments for and againt, and everything in between. Some are angry at him, some salute him. *Soldiers fight because thats what is asked of them*. Internet chest thumpers, how many of these folks you really know ? The story of this soldier is an American one, but his story is routinely played out in every nation all over the world. 

The name of the soldier is Sgt. Frank M. Sandoval. 27 years old and assigned to 2nd Battalion, 5th Artillery, Fort Sill, Oklahoma. He sustained injuries when his unit was attacked by insurgents using small-arms fire Nov. 28, 2005, in Tikrit, Iraq.





Sandoval, of Yuma, Ariz., joined the Army after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. He was on his second tour in Iraq when a bomb left him badly wounded on Nov. 28, 2005. After he was airlifted to Walter Reed Medical Center in Washington, D.C., his family was told he would probably not live more than 24 hours, and if he did, he would not be able to walk or see.

But he undertook months of rehabilitation, relearning to perform the simplest functions &#8212; swallowing, speaking, walking. He made much progress, and the prosthesis was designed to cover an exposed part of Sandoval&#8217;s brain, which would have allowed him to stop wearing a protective helmet, doctors said.

&#8220;All he wanted to do was serve his country and make the world better,&#8221; said Frank Sandoval&#8217;s father Ricky Sandoval, a Department of Homeland Security official who works along the California-Mexico border.

He underwent brain surgery to remove the brains exposed part.
Before the surgery, Sandoval said he wanted to be more independent and not have to rely so much on his wife Michelle, 22, and the couple&#8217;s 5-year-old daughter, Joelena. 

He was also worried &#8220;that I won&#8217;t wake up,&#8221; he said the day before the operation.
*
He never woke up after the surgery.*

Sgt. Frank M. Sandoval was declared brain dead on June 18, 2007. 

His family made the decision to keep Sandoval, 27, on a ventilator till June 21, 2007, so seven of his organs can be harvested for donation.

"I really hope someone can use his heart," his wife, Michelle, said through tears. "And if another man can love a woman as much as he loved me, that would make me very happy."
===============================================================================
I don't know about you folks, but to me Sgt. Frank M. Sandoval is a champ all the way to end.

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## Awesome

gambit said:


> This is **** for many here. The gorier the wound to any US soldier, the faster the fists pumps. The lust is disguised behind some incoherent rant about US foreign policy.


Ummm... ????? 

I skimmed through the thread, and I couldn't find any such comment celebrating this poor guy's misery. At most people are mixing up economy with it.


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## Awesome

Closing the thread anyway, due to the sensibilities involved and the issue is not really related to Pakistan's Defence.

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## Awesome

Just wanted to add as a clarification that for most people this thread showed the plight of the regular Americans too who are standing in harms way protecting all of us just like the Pakistani soldiers are.

The ISAF and Pakistani soldiers fighting this war and sacrificing their body parts deserve our (the enitre world's) gratitude - they literally got their heads blown away so ours won't!

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