# Chinese Trainer JL-9, L-15, JL-10, CJ-7 News & Discussions



## aliaselin

According to news from CD, on June 29th, the first L-15 for overseas customer is delivered to a South Central African country&#65288;most probable is Zambia&#65289; and today, the first L-15 for PLAAF is delivered with formal name JL-10.
L-15 for overseas customer





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JL-10 for PLAAF




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## giant panda

JL-10 for PLAAF

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## xuxu1457

L-15 gets the formal name JL-10, and service in PLAAF and navy, Hongdu company self-financing about 800million Yuan(127million $) on development of L-15, finally get full bill of PLAAF and navy&#65292; the fist batch to PLAAF

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## cnleio

PLAAF name JL-10, export version still name L-15. 
First export deal has signed with one Africa country, 6x L-15 will export to Zambia in 2013-2014.

L-15 cockpit










L-15 light fighter


















L-15 advanced trainer

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## Fsjal

I went to this site and it said that the PLANAF was using the less advance JL-9. I forget the name of site.

Anyway, the L-15 will definitely compete with other advance trainers like the T-50 and Yak-130.


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## jamesseo89

This plane can be sold in Africa as they can't afford fighter jets and it will be a cheaper option.. even in Sri Lanka.


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## hk299792458

cnleio said:


> PLAAF name JL-10, export version still name L-15.
> First export deal has signed with one Africa country, 6x L-15 will export to Zambia in 2013-2014.
> 
> L-15 cockpit



In your photos it is not the latest version of cockpit -































Henri K.

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## Beast

Updated cockpit?



Fsjal said:


> I went to this site and it said that the PLANAF was using the less advance JL-9. I forget the name of site.
> 
> Anyway, the L-15 will definitely compete with other advance trainers like the T-50 and Yak-130.



L-15 is not ready yet that time. And PLANAF are desperate for a new trainer which JL-9 are chosen first as a interim solution until L-15 enter service.

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## shuntmaster

Isn't it unusual for a jet trainer to have twin engines?

Why are Russian engines (2 × Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25) used? What happened to the Chinese engines?


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## Fsjal

shuntmaster said:


> Isn't it unusual for a jet trainer to have twin engines?
> 
> Why are Russian engines (2 × Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25) used? What happened to the Chinese engines?



Just like any Chinese jets, those Ivchenkos and many Russian engines are interims. I am not sure what Chinese engines are gonna be used...


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## Sasquatch

shuntmaster said:


> Isn't it unusual for a jet trainer to have twin engines?
> 
> Why are Russian engines (2 × Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25) used? What happened to the Chinese engines?



Temporary, the indigenous turbofan for the L-15 comes around 2015. No trainers aircraft's like the Yak-130 and M-346 have twin engines.


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## cnleio

I remember AI-222-25F jet engine from Ukraine, not Russia.

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## Beerbal

Its resemble Yak pkane..


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## shuntmaster

Beerbal said:


> Its resemble Yak pkane..











Hongdu L-15 .................................... Yakovlev Yak-130

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## giant panda



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## applesauce

shuntmaster said:


> Isn't it unusual for a jet trainer to have twin engines?
> 
> Why are Russian engines (2 × Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25) used? What happened to the Chinese engines?



1. no
2. the engines are from Ukraine, the chinese engines are not ready, but china is suppose to get a co-production license for the Ukrainian engines



Beerbal said:


> Its resemble Yak pkane..



thats because they had consultation help from Yakovlev. but it doesnt matter much because the end product still belongs to china

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## Pakistanisage

shuntmaster said:


> *Isn't it unusual for a jet trainer to have twin engines*?
> 
> Why are Russian engines (2 × Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25) used? What happened to the Chinese engines?






No it is not. Many trainers had twin engines.

Even our Cessna T-37 (Twettie Bird ) used in PAF since 1960 had twin engines.

Since L-15 is an Advanced Trainer, twin engine training would be good for pilot of more Advanced Fighter aircrafts.


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## Beast

L-15 official given the name JL-10 which means it has enter service for PLAAF for training pilots of 4th gen fighter.

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## Deino

Any info on what unit will gain them first ?


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Any info on what unit will gain them first ?


No info but I don't know why they paint it everything yellow including the nozzle.


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## Deino

Beast said:


> No info but I don't know why they paint it everything yellow including the nozzle.



That's only the primer and not the final paint !

However all aircraft so far spotted are still assigned to the CFTE ... no operational yet.

Deino


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## black-hawk_101

Hmmm... I think PAF is getting T-38s and may be more from USA at later date. L-15s are really good as AJTs but I think PAF don't have money to spend on it as 65+ T-38 are enough for now.

May be PAF can easily gain F-5/F-5 dual from Middle East and other Muslim countries for Free.

F-5 can be used for light attack roles.


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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

cute little plane


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## bdslph

l15 looks more like the yak130
but i think the Yak130 is more advanced


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## Deino

bdslph said:


> l15 looks more like the yak130
> but i think the Yak130 is more advanced




Maybe You know that the L-15/JL-10 is based on the same design due to a close cooperation between Yakovlev and Hongdu similar to the CJ-7/L-7 and Yak-152.

Deino


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## Beast

bdslph said:


> l15 looks more like the yak130
> but i think the Yak130 is more advanced


L-15 is used as supersonic trainer from based up while Yak-130 capable of going supersonic , depend on which mode is based on is based on subsonic up.

In terms of aerodynamic or system, L-15 is supposed to be the most advance trainer. Even a PESA radar can be installed on it.

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## BoQ77

Hu Songshan said:


> Temporary, *the indigenous turbofan for the L-15 comes around 2015*. No trainers aircraft's like the Yak-130 and M-346 have twin engines.



Any news on "indigenous turbofan for the L-15" ?
I heard Bangladesh went for Yak 130
Our Vietnam went for Yak 130 too


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## Beast

BoQ77 said:


> Any news on "indigenous turbofan for the L-15" ?
> I heard Bangladesh went for Yak 130
> Our Vietnam went for Yak 130 too


So you think Vietnam will buy Chinese weapon even it maybe more adance? 

Bangladesh? They order the Yak-130 long ago before L-15 is finalized. Venezuela and Zambia are 2 comfirmed customer of L-15? Then the question shall be throw back to you why Venezuela and Zambia order L-15 instead of Yak-130?

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## BoQ77

Russian weapon is already brand name for a half of century.


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## Beast

BoQ77 said:


> Russian weapon is already brand name for a half of century.


So you are suggesting its more of branding rather than real capabilities? . I see....

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## BoQ77

Beast said:


> So you are suggesting its more of branding rather than real capabilities? . I see....



brand name derives from real capabilities. See recent military activities of Russian in Syria?
Let dream for

From your fighter or trainer, missile or warship, heli or tank ... most of them from Russia design.


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## Beast

BoQ77 said:


> brand name derives from real capabilities. See recent military activities of Russian in Syria?
> Let dream for
> 
> From your fighter or trainer, missile or warship, heli or tank ... most of them from Russia design.


Really? You want to search YouTube of saudi M1a1 tank easily knock out by ATGM


BoQ77 said:


> brand name derives from real capabilities. See recent military activities of Russian in Syria?
> Let dream for
> 
> From your fighter or trainer, missile or warship, heli or tank ... most of them from Russia design.



I do not agreed with your statement of branding equal real capabilites. Yes, I do agree a number of weapon derived from Russian design like L-15 but comes with better manufacturing techniques and better build by Chinese.

The Chinese drone export has been a success w/o any Russian influence. In fact, China are well ahead of Russian in UCAV.

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## BoQ77

Beast said:


> I do not agreed with your statement of branding equal real capabilites. Yes, I do agree a number of weapon derived from Russian design like L-15 but comes with better manufacturing techniques and better build by Chinese.
> .



Ask any foreigner members here, whether anyone believe in the marketing phrase "better manufacturing tech and better build by Chinese" .... They would laught out loud.
Actually, we wait for Chinese "pure" design but Chinese designers continue to wait for prototypes or stolen data provided by hackers.


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## Beast

BoQ77 said:


> Ask any foreigner members here, whether anyone believe in the marketing phrase "better manufacturing tech and better build by Chinese" .... They would laught out loud.


Really? Only China haters will do that and it included you 

They are simply jealous of rising China that's all I know.

3ders.org - China showcases large 3D printed metal frames for new generation of military aircraft | 3D Printer News & 3D Printing News

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## black-hawk_101

I am sure that after acquiring 65+ T-38s from Turkey but still I think PAF is interested in getting about 30-50 L-15s from China. Money will come to all PA, PN and PAF as now privatization will begun soon.


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## black-hawk_101

I think PAF will going to place an order for at least 30 of these and may be 30+40 more in near future to reach numbers of about 100 of these.

They can used for AJT, Attack and even surveillance missions.


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## cirr

Beast said:


> Really? Only China haters will do that and it included you
> 
> They are simply jealous of rising China that's all I know.
> 
> 3ders.org - China showcases large 3D printed metal frames for new generation of military aircraft | 3D Printer News & 3D Printing News



A few Viets still live in the Pithecanthrope Times when it comes to their “knowledge” about China and Chinese products。These guys are either totally stupid or trolls making a fool of themselves trying to project a negative image of China。

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## black-hawk_101

I think for PAF its good to welcome about 100 L-15s if China agrees.

Or may be like 50 L-15s in 3 batches/block with total of about 150 L-15s as they can be used operation of light bombing. But its amazing to see that why not PAF took the decision of transferring Mirages to KPK-FATA-Balochistan and bringing in F-7P/PGs here in East.


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## Akasa

PESA radar aboard the L-15:







The L-15 is the only trainer that is equipped with an ESA radar.

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## black-hawk_101

Will PAF be order 50 L-15s now?


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## Akasa

A clearer photo of its PESA radar:

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## bdslph

What is the difference between a PESA and an AESA radar? - Quora

PESA radar wow China spend a lot in the l15

jl10 if converted to fully light attack that will be a good sale in the african market


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## Beast

It is long known L-15 equipped with PESA.

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## aliaselin

African friends with L-15

Information for two types of L-15 radar

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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> View attachment 276625
> 
> 
> African friends with L-15
> 
> ...




Any info on when they will be delivered ??? ... and even more, when will the PLAAF receive their first JL-10s ?


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## Deino

Did some additional resorch on my harddrive and I'm a bit surprised:

Aircraft no. "08" made its maiden flight on 26. January 2015, ... no. "12" was spotted already on 25. June and no. "11" even more on 30. October *2013* !!!

So why all these delays, when will they be delivered .... and when will the PLAAF get it's first birds ?

Deino


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## aliaselin

Good luck, Zambia Air force!

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## Deino

Nice, for Zambia ... !

And when will the PLAAF will receive its first JL-10 ?

Deino


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## aliaselin

Looks like LIFT version, with radar and after-burn engines.

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## aliaselin

For comparison
L-15 03(AJT version): fake nozzle for engine and no radar





L-15 06(LIFT version): with after-burn engine

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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> Looks like LIFT version, with radar and after-burn engines.




I had a similar idea, after looking for details a second time ... Regarding the nose, the typical pitot is missing, hinting, a radar (maybe that small AESA we've seen some time ago?), while the rear section seems different to the standard L-15/JL-10 AJT-version but more like the AB-equipped LIFT (like pt. 06) version.

Deino


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## Beast

I am sure the African friends are very impatient for the long delay L-15

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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> I had a similar idea, after looking for details a second time ... Regarding the nose, the typical pitot is missing, hinting, a radar (maybe that small AESA we've seen some time ago?), while the rear section seems different to the standard L-15/JL-10 AJT-version but more like the AB-equipped LIFT (like pt. 06) version.
> 
> Deino



Most probable SY-80A, not PESA or AESA
Do you know what factors can define ratio of after-burn thrust to non after-burn thrust? For Minshan, it is reported the non after-burn thrust is 3200 kgf, while the after-burn thrust is only 4800 kgf, and this number is quite small (48:32) compared to other after-burn engine.

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## Beast

aliaselin said:


> Most probable SY-80A, not PESA or AESA
> Do you know what factors can define ratio of after-burn thrust to non after-burn thrust? For Minshan, it is reported the non after-burn thrust is 3200 kgf, while the after-burn thrust is only 4800 kgf, and this number is quite small (48:32) compared to other fater-burn engine.
> 
> 
> Not much delayed if they ordered during 2014 Zhuhai Air show.


They order in 2012 or 2013 and they are the first foreign customer of L-15.

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## aliaselin

Beast said:


> They order in 2012 or 2013 and they are the first foreign customer of L-15.


Yes， I have made a mistake.


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## Deino

And when will the PLAAf receive their first JL-10 ?? ... in mind that these are LIFT-versions, where are all these standard L-15/JL-10s ... we've seen already up to number 13 ??

Deino


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## Deino

Huitong confirmed the aversion for Zambia is "only" the standard AJT-version.


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Huitong confirmed the aversion for Zambia is "only" the standard AJT-version.


Not standard but upgraded AJT-version


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> Not standard but upgraded AJT-version




Reagrding the radome it seems to have that radar !

By the way ... any news on the PLAAF's birds ?


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## Deino

First L-15 that had its maiden flight in 2016 is the no. 12....

Untitled Document

Deino

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## Deino

Probably the first JL-10 for the PLAAF .... the pitot could be a hint since the Zambian one had no pitot.


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Probably the first JL-10 for the PLAAF .... the pitot could be a hint since the Zambian one had no pitot.
> View attachment 293996


Such a shame it took so long for it to be operation.


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## Deino

Again .. only the Zambian bird !


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## cirr



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## Kiss_of_the_Dragon

Can L15 be modified to have two vertical stabilizers ? it look weird to me the current design,.a twin engines should have twin tails.


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## BoQ77

Hu Songshan said:


> Temporary,* the indigenous turbofan for the L-15 comes around 2015*. No trainers aircraft's like the Yak-130 and M-346 have twin engines.



Did L-15 have domestic engines, @Hu Songshan ?


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## Ultima Thule

BoQ77 said:


> Did L-15 have domestic engines, @Hu Songshan ?


*NO*


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## knight11

Looks good design. Can anybody post the full specification of the L-15.


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## Deino

Nice images ...

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## Deino

Is the one on the right maybe for the PLAAF ???

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## cirr




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## Deino

Interesting that there are two slightly different versions ... the one without a pitot + grey radome (IMO L-15s for Zambia) and the ones with a white radome + pitot (IMO for the PLAAF).

Deino

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## Deino

missed one ...

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## Beast

Is that a integrated gun pod on the belly of L-15 for Zambian AF?


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## Deino

Yes ... here it is visible too, even if that image is really baaaaaad.

Strange is a bit, that this particular aircraft no. 12 - as seen in that recent images (from a video) above - was spotted already in June 2015....


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Yes ... here it is visible too, even if that image is really baaaaaad.
> 
> Strange is a bit, that this particular aircraft no. 12 - as seen in that recent images (from a video) above - was spotted already in June 2015....
> 
> View attachment 305766


If so, I am very sure. Zambian main purpose of this L-15 is not to be used as trainer. They will used it like a F-16 for their AF.


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## Deino

Beast said:


> If so, I am very sure. Zambian main purpose of this L-15 is not to be used as trainer. They will used it like a F-16 for their AF.




Yes for sure, the L-15 is for these countries some sort of mini-multirole type a calls below the JF-17 ... and as such a good sign, that the first export customer already chose that version, since for most of these Air Forces a L-15 as a jet-trainer is truly some sort of overkill.

However I can't wait for the first PLAAF one....


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Yes for sure, the L-15 is for these countries some sort of mini-multirole type a calls below the JF-17 ... and as such a good sign, that the first export customer already chose that version, since for most of these Air Forces a L-15 as a jet-trainer is truly some sort of overkill.
> 
> However I can't wait for the first PLAAF one....



With high level of media exposure, we shall not wait that long. Definitely within this year.


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## Penguin

Kiss_of_the_Dragon said:


> Can L15 be modified to have two vertical stabilizers ? it look weird to me the current design,.a twin engines should have twin tails.


Nah, I disagree

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## Deino

My latest work again ...

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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> My latest work again ...
> 
> View attachment 313300


The character is too small

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## Deino

Finally for The PLAAF?

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## Deino

New images of an export L-15 (albeit we have already seen no. 15) ...

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## Penguin

Deino said:


> New images of an export L-15 (albeit we have already seen no. 15) ...


How do you know it is for export? And, if so, any idea which client/state?


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## Blue Marlin

Deino said:


> New images of an export L-15 (albeit we have already seen no. 15) ...
> 
> View attachment 327849
> View attachment 327851
> View attachment 327852
> View attachment 327853
> View attachment 327854
> View attachment 327857


yellow engine exhausts?............thats a first


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## Penguin

@blue_marlin: If so, afterburners not yet used, it seems.






But not a new phenomenon





http://jkpeterson.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2098

"The 10001 prototype of JL-10/L-15 advanced jet trainer was taking off from Hongdu airfield on July 1, 2013."


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## Deino

Penguin said:


> How do you know it is for export? And, if so, any idea which client/state?




To admit, as far as I understand (+ a big piece of guesswork), then there are currently two "versions" on the production line right now. several have been spotted with this pitot-less radome (maybe fitted with that small PESA) as they were presented as the Zambian aircraft, while several others have a pitot.

If these are for Zambia, I don't know ...

Deino

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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> To admit, as far as I understand (+ a big piece of guesswork), then there are currently two "versions" on the production line right now. several have been spotted with this pitot-less radome (maybe fitted with that small PESA) as they were presented as the Zambian aircraft, while several others have a pitot.
> 
> If these are for Zambia, I don't know ...
> 
> Deino


These are L-15Bs and they are not for export.

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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> These are L-15Bs and they are not for export.




O.k. ... always nice to learn something each day.

So I am wrong with my observation, that a few have a pitot while other don't ?

But if there's an L-15B then there must be a L-15A ?? ... but I thought the PLAAF version is designated JL-10 ??? ... or is the JL-10 = L-15B and L-15A is the export version for Zambia.

Thanks in advance,
Deino


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> O.k. ... always nice to learn something each day.
> 
> So I am wrong with my observation, that a few have a pitot while other don't ?
> 
> But if there's an L-15B then there must be a L-15A ?? ... but I thought the PLAAF version is designated JL-10 ??? ... or is the JL-10 = L-15B and L-15A is the export version for Zambia.
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> Deino



L-15A is the export version will be a fair guess

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## Penguin

星海军事 said:


> L-15A is the export version will be a fair guess


Isn't this the dif between pure trainer and light attack version?


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> L-15A is the export version will be a fair guess




Thanks ... but why then do some on the production line have a pitot on their radar and others not ?


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## Deino

Deino said:


> Thanks ... but why then do some on the production line have a pitot on their radar and others not ?



Probably the first JL-10 for the PLAAF....










Again ... if those without the pitot are for the PLAAF and these now with a pitot too ... why two versions ??

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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Probably the first JL-10 for the PLAAF....
> 
> View attachment 329477
> View attachment 329478
> 
> 
> Again ... if those without the pitot are for the PLAAF and these now with a pitot too ... why two versions ??



I heard that those radomes without pitot are provisional nose cones


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> I heard that those radomes without pitot are provisional nose cones




Thanks again for Your reply but even if this could be a reasonable explanation, I have my serious doubts.

Why should they fly with a provisorial one featuring no pitot - at least the pitot is a sensor relevant for flying - only to receive later one with a pitot.
Even more if You remember that the PESA-equipped one had no pitot and there are already a few on the production line with and others without a pitot. If it would be only an interim measure, then all JL-10s and L-15s should be more or less the same during manufacturing.

Maybe it's a bit far-fetched, but IMO / my theory these are indeed two different versions currently on the production line: 1. the export versions L-15 - similar to the Zambian standard - featuring a radome without a pitot ... and
2. the PLAAF version JL-10 featuring a radome with a pitot.

Just my 2 cents.

Deino


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Thanks again for Your reply but even if this could be a reasonable explanation, I have my serious doubts.
> 
> Why should they fly with a provisorial one featuring no pitot - at least the pitot is a sensor relevant for flying - only to receive later one with a pitot.
> Even more if You remember that the PESA-equipped one had no pitot and there are already a few on the production line with and others without a pitot. If it would be only an interim measure, then all JL-10s and L-15s should be more or less the same during manufacturing.
> 
> Maybe it's a bit far-fetched, but IMO / my theory these are indeed two different versions currently on the production line: 1. the export versions L-15 - similar to the Zambian standard - featuring a radome without a pitot ... and
> 2. the PLAAF version JL-10 featuring a radome with a pitot.
> 
> Just my 2 cents.
> 
> Deino


I am sorry. The lastest Information I have is that newly produced radomes of either PLAAF or export versions are not mounted with pitot.


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## Deino

No need to be sorry, esp. since You are the one with a much better and deeper understanding of that matters.
It was only a theory ... but I'm surely we will find out.

Deino

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## Deino

Finally the images are getting better .... I'm most interested to know what unit will get them first.

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## cnleio

It's PLAAF JL-10 advanced jet trainer

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## Beast

This bird took so long to join the service.


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## Deino

And better ones .... 


Beast said:


> This bird took so long to join the service.




Indeed surprising esp. how urgent it is needed (however the JL-9 is at least an interim solution) ... by the way, are there any news concerning the L-7/CJ-7 ??? The most recent image is one prototype flying.

EDeino


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## Deino

My most favourite one !

By the way any news on what unit will the JL-10 first ?

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## zestokryl

What a wonderful birds. Paint shade couldnt be more close to my preference

This plane should receive integration of targeting pod + stand off missiles + protection system against missiles

At least till jet UCAV get widely adopted. Thats probably going to take 3 or 4 years

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## nadeemkhan110

The first JL-10 supersonic training and light attack aircraft of People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) was spotted during the PLAAF public day in Changchun.

The new JL-10 aircraft in gray tactical camouflage will show up on PLAAF public day in Changchun. In Changchun located PLA Air Force Aviation University.

The JL-10 (export name : L-15 Falcon) – is a Chinese supersonic training and light attack aircraft being developed by Nanchang-based Hongdu Aviation Industry Corporation (HAIG) to meet the Chinese People’s Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) and People’s Liberation Army Naval Air Force (PLANAF) lead-in fighter trainer (LIFT) requirements.

As designed, the JL-10 seats a crew of two – student and instructor or pilot and co-pilot depending on role. Overall length is 40 feet with a wingspan reaching 31 feet and height of 15.8 feet. Power is served through 2 x АI-322F Turbofan Aero Engines with Afterburner developed by Ukrainian company SE Ivchenko-Progress.

Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/chines...sonic-training-and-light-attack-aircraft.html

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## grey boy 2

Specifications of L-15 (AFT) 





*Radar comparison with others advance trainers







*

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## cirr

Hongdu's pulse production line

http://www.cannews.com.cn/2016/0922/158782.shtml

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## cnleio

L-15 produce line

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## Deino

cirr said:


> Hongdu's pulse production line
> 
> http://www.cannews.com.cn/2016/0922/158782.shtml


 

Indeed amazing. There are at least 11 JL-10s alone in that image ... so it's really time to see the first operational unit converted.

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## teddy

I counted 10. Anyway, it is good to see it went into mass production. It took too long in the prototype stage. Like 10 years? Longer than j20


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## Deino

teddy said:


> I counted 10. Anyway, it is good to see it went into mass production. It took too long in the prototype stage. Like 10 years? Longer than j20




Not really sure with the no. 1 ... but otherwise it's more than time that this type enters service.


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## nang2

teddy said:


> I counted 10. Anyway, it is good to see it went into mass production. It took too long in the prototype stage. Like 10 years? Longer than j20


different goals and requirements.


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## Deino

nang2 said:


> different goals and requirements.




... and most of all priorities !

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## Deino

With all the latest developments and progress on the JL-10 I'm a bit surprised that this small - but IMO not less important type - is still so much shrouded in secrecy.

Allegedly based on the Russian Yak-152K - similar to the JL-10 being based on the Yak-130 - and co-developed by Hongdu and Yakovlev Design Bureau since 2006 the CJ-7 is the next generation primary trainer to replace the obsolete CJ-6. In contrast to its Russian cousin which uses a German-designed RED A03 V12-diesel engine with 338 kW (460 PS), the Chinese CJ-7 uses a M-14X/HS-6K1 radial piston engine with only (360 PS)


The strange thing is that a first prototype was constructed by the end of October 2010 its first flight took place on 31 December 2010. However even if shown on public display at the 2010 Zhuhai Airshow since then nothing more but a few grainy images were released ... + finally this one in flight.

There are reports, that this type is not on top of the PLAAF's priority list and therefore has been making very little progress with the production still pending. However is this the only reason ??

Anyway, with its ancestor - a funny thing - having made its maiden flight only yesterday, I just want to ask, what's the current status of the CJ-7 today ???

http://echelon-defense.com/2016/09/29/russian-yak-152-trainer-airplane-performs-first-flight/

Deino

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## 艹艹艹

*A cute little plane.*


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## aliaselin

Don't think it will become future primary trainer of PLAAF for sure.


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> Don't think it will become future primary trainer of PLAAF for sure.




Care to explain ? The PLAAF will surely need a successor for the venerable CJ-6 and even if I'm more surprised that not a modern turboprop type similar to the PC-21 is developed I'm convinced it needs a small type for the first flying hours.

Deino


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Care to explain ? The PLAAF will surely need a successor for the venerable CJ-6 and even if I'm more surprised that not a modern turboprop type similar to the PC-21 is developed I'm convinced it needs a small type for the first flying hours.
> 
> Deino


Many of the CJ-6 still have quite a long life left, so this is why you can hear little news about CJ-7, even Hongdu itself does not care about it. So everything can be changed for the next tens of years. As to PT like PC-21, I think it depends on whether PLAAF wants to spend or save the money. Hongdu thought PLAAF wanted to spend less, so they chose CJ-7, but the customer may give a different request. It all depends on situations many years later and no one could know the answer at the moment.

Also there may be competition from CAIGA


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## grey boy 2



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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


>



Nice ... there are already three grey JL-10s !


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## nang2

the latest news/rumor on CJDBY is that by the end of this year, there will be 135 units delivered. Induction started in 2013.





magazine shot

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## Beast

If the induction started in 2013, I bet they really hide the news well from public since most though induction only started this year!

That also mean more than 300 engines from Ukraine has delivered or domestic produce version has started well recently!


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## Deino

Imo that report is simply wrong .


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Imo that report is simply wrong .


I will not outright dismiss those magazine info as wrong since those author has close ties with PLAAF and sometime, some of the info is disclose under the instruction of PLAAF.

If you managed to know the deliver date of AI-222 engines from Ukraine to China. What the author stated is quite feasible.

http://concorde.ua/en/research/daily/9983/

Or deino, you can tell me what ties do you have with PLAAF? Zero


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## lcloo

Viewing the authority of this magazine, I believe the induction is true.

However, I believe the purpose of this 2013 induction has an ad hoc purpose, i.e. to prepare in advance a core group of JL10 instructors and to formulated a new advance training syllabus based on the capability of JL10.

From this core group, the number of JL10 certified instructors should expand to more than 135.

Unlike the old single engined JJ-7 advance trainer, the twin engined JL10 is a bird of different aerodynamics and handling, instructors have to relearn their trade.

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## Deino

nang2 said:


> the latest news/rumor on CJDBY is that by the end of this year, there will be 135 units delivered. Induction started in 2013.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> magazine shot



To admit this report is not wrong but a bit misleading. The maiden flight of the first PLAAF JL-10 took place in 2013 and with at least confirmed one other bird being tested at the CFTE it is as such "delivered". I also agree that the numbers 135 mentions the order back-log but given the regular news from Hongdu and the number of aircraft spotted, there is NO chance of abot 135 examples being delivered by the end of 2016. So many aircraft simply were noticed somehow and the first grey JL-10 was spotted only in August and September.



Beast said:


> ...
> 
> Or deino, you can tell me what ties do you have with PLAAF? Zero



None, but you you would be surprised to know that this Magazine contacted me after my second book and already published to of my reports. At least they told me they were suprised by my insight into the PLAAF structre and my understanding of the Chinese military systems. Funny, isn't it?

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## Beast

Deino said:


> None, but you you would be surprised to know that this Magazine contacted me after my second book and already published to of my reports. At least they told me they were suprised by my insight into the PLAAF structre and my understanding of the Chinese military systems. Funny, isn't it?



Does that mean my previous enquiry on your non connection and no inside info from PLAAF is invalid or does not stand?

Or you want to tell me PLAAF staff commit treason by contacting a foreigner? 

The magazine auditor is just try to be humble with those words but you still know less compare to those author when comes PLAAF stuff. You need to be more humble and accept their insight/data rather than outright dismiss it as wrong.


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## Deino

Do I read envy from your reply??

But how do i get their insight if they use my reports?
Be it whatever the reason is but first they did whatever your wishful thinking or not-wishing might be and second that magzine Aerospace Knowledge is not the PLAAF. As such you can still be sure your beloved PLAAF- secrets will be still secret even if they hire a "stupid" foreigner to contribute.


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## nang2

Deino said:


> To admit this report is not wrong but a bit misleading. The maiden flight of the first PLAAF JL-10 took place in 2013 and with at least confirmed one other bird being tested at the CFTE it is as such "delivered". I also agree that the numbers 135 mentions the order back-log but given the regular news from Hongdu and the number of aircraft spotted, there is NO chance of abot 135 examples being delivered by the end of 2016. So many aircraft simply were noticed somehow and the first grey JL-10 was spotted only in August and September.


You are probably right. Some Chinese members also had similar speculation. That is why I put the word "rumor" there to cover my own ***.  Nevertheless, JL10 has certainly picked up the pace. That is the good news.

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## Beast

Deino said:


> Do I read envy from your reply??
> 
> But how do i get their insight if they use my reports?
> Be it whatever the reason is but first they did whatever your wishful thinking or not-wishing might be and second that magzine Aerospace Knowledge is not the PLAAF. As such you can still be sure your beloved PLAAF- secrets will be still secret even if they hire a "stupid" foreigner to contribute.


You are wrong. Aerospace Knowledge can be consider a semi PLAAF. They are some of the magazine leaking first hand photo or data contributed by PLAAF to them. Not all but you need to be able to read Chinese to dig out the golden info from there.

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## Deino

So then it seems I have indeed deeper contacts to rhe PLAAF than you would like me to have.


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## Beast

Deino said:


> So then it seems I have indeed deeper contacts to rhe PLAAF than you would like me to have.


You have zero, becos you are a foreigner who cant even speak and read Chinese.

When comes to differential rumours and facts or future of PLAAF. You come in last!

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## Deino

Beast said:


> You have zero, becos you are a foreigner who cant even speak and read Chinese.
> 
> When comes to differential rumours and facts or future of PLAAF. You come in last!



Poot guy ...
Again pure envy ... Something cannot be that does not fit your opinion?!

... So then explain why this Magazine publishes my Reports if they are so wrong?

Maye You should contact them and offer yours instead?

But maybw we can stay on Topic, your cantant rantings are too much annoying.

Deino


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Poot guy ...
> Again pure envy ... Something cannot be that does not fit your opinion?!
> 
> ... So then explain why this Magazine publishes my Reports if they are so wrong?
> 
> Maye You should contact them and offer yours instead?
> 
> But maybw we can stay on Topic, your cantant rantings are too much annoying.
> 
> Deino


LOL.. They reported 135 L-15 going to induct which you disagree! So you mean now you flip flop again and claim now its you who inform Aero knowledge that 135 L-15 going serve PLA in 2016?  Or you want to change stance or I need to quote back what you say or you want to change your comment to hide your embarassment? You choose 

Typical Deino, flip flopping to suit your agenda.


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## Deino

@Beast !

Let us do one agreement since we wont agree on nearly Anything.
I ignore what You post and You the same in return what i post!?
You Can can think whatever You Want on my post and the same is my freedom. Let us simply folliw the way of "peaceful coexistnce" ... It we be better for all here.

For me that's the final wird as a direct reply to all your insults, twistibg words and deliberate misquotings.

Deino


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## cirr



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## aliaselin

> 没有客户，企业就无法生存，只能关门！企业为满足客户需求而存在。准时、优质、高效地提供客户需要的产品和服务，为客户创造价值，让客户满意并帮助客户提升实力和形象，实质就是经营人心，得人心者得天下、得市场。
> 
> 贵飞公司要主动去创造和满足客户需求，在做好山鹰系列高教机的基础上，需要我们抓紧开发新型基础教练机、开发承接四代机训练的性能更好的教练机、以及客户用来保持规模的高性价比轻型作战飞机等。唯如此，我们才能不断巩固和扩大公司的客户群，把原本不是客户的变成客户，把已经成为客户的变成贵飞公司的粉丝，贵飞人航空报国的使命担当才能有最根本、最基础的产品依托。
> 
> 某型教练机是客户的刚性需求，仅国内就有巨大的市场份额。贵飞公司要在该教练机领域实现后来居上，必须从市场到研制都打破传统观念，主动出击市场，引入多方合作机制，建立全寿命周期研制理念，从设计、制造、试飞、售后服务向用户提供一揽子解决方案。在我国四代机已经首飞成功好几年的情况下，贵飞公司需要提前思考，四代机装配部队后，需要什么样的教练机来配套，提前预研一款更高端的教练机；在二代轻型作战飞机陆续退役的情况下，站在客户的角度，需要研制一款作为保持规模的作战飞机，实现贵飞公司飞机主业的历史性跨越。



GAC has joined in the competition. @Deino you may merge it with L-15 thread to become a pinned one about Chinese military trainer.


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> GAC has joined in the competition. @Deino you may merge it with L-15 thread to become a pinned one about Chinese military trainer.




Good ide ... but is this New project in competition for a basic trainer like the CJ-7 or is it related in general to the competition between Hongdu and Guizhou?


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Good ide ... but is this New project in competition for a basic trainer like the CJ-7 or is it related in general to the competition between Hongdu and Guizhou?


This news talks about both LIFT version of JL-9 to compete with the corresponding version of L-15 and a primary trainer to compete with CJ-7. By the way, the spelling of trainer in the title is wrong

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## Deino

Upppss !


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## ali_raza

china pak zindabad


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## terranMarine



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## Beast

I think if they put up the DSI and comformal version of FTC-2000G will be more attractive for buyers.

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## zestokryl

Maybe some new targeting pod, tailored for this particular plane is even better. Along with the high precision missile integration. And AA missile warning system

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## Deino

Finally a JL-9A off the ramp at the CFTE ...









+ a strange promo-video:
http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=MzA...252322f7a8dd05dedd9c5&scene=0#wechat_redirect

PS ... and here as a gif:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/791970255488692224
But I cannot save it

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## grey boy 2

JL-9

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/795461139446595588

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## Beast

Deino said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/795461139446595588


No wonder it need no appear at Zhuhai 2016 to market itself. I guess it already has so much order that they need to reject further ones to ensure they meet the deadline.

I guess Venezuela, Peru, more Zambia ,and now Uruguay will keep Hongdu very busy.

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## 592257001

Beast said:


> No wonder it need no appear at Zhuhai 2016 to market itself. I guess it already has so much order that they need to reject further ones to ensure they meet the deadline.
> 
> I guess Venezuela, Peru, more Zambia ,and now Uruguay will keep Hongdu very busy.



IMO The L-15 would be been a good trainer for PAF's fleet of single seated JF-17s. Additional, the latest L-15 already has AESA integrated into it, and the ability to launch pretty much any and every weapon the JF-17 has.


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## Beast

592257001 said:


> IMO The L-15 would be been a good trainer for PAF's fleet of single seated JF-17s. Additional, the latest L-15 already has AESA integrated into it, and the ability to launch pretty much any and every weapon the JF-17 has.


PESA not AESA.

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## grey boy 2

A fully loaded L-15, much more than a trainer 南方某地，某国购买的外贸版L-15“猎鹰”高级教练机全外挂训练飞行，图中可见其携带了两枚500千克航空炸弹、两枚红外格斗空空导弹、两个副油箱，以及机腹航炮吊舱，无疑是一架性能优异的轻型攻击机。

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## grey boy 2

L-15B model with AESA
中国在巴铁防展上卖L15B：换上相控阵战力倍增

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## Beast

grey boy 2 said:


> L-15B model with AESA
> 中国在巴铁防展上卖L15B：换上相控阵战力倍增


8 hard points? This version might be fitted with after burner engine and upthrust.


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## grey boy 2

The JL-9G is a modified JL-9 for aircraft carrier training. It is designed for ski-jump ramp takeoffs and arrested landings.[8] and includes a tailhook.[8] on board aircraft-carrier next (快上航母了！我海军山鹰打靶机炮火箭巢猛开火)

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> The JL-9G is a modified JL-9 for aircraft carrier training. It is designed for ski-jump ramp takeoffs and arrested landings.[8] and includes a tailhook.[8] on board aircraft-carrier next (快上航母了！我海军山鹰打靶机炮火箭巢猛开火)




But none of these images show a JL-9G ... like this one. These are all standard JL-9H.





Strangle non of them operationally so far has the tail-hook installed. This was only seen on the prototype.

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## grey boy 2



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## Deino

That's strange ... I thought 10001 is flying since late 2013 ?!!!


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## Pepsi Cola

Deino said:


> That's strange ... I thought 10001 is flying since late 2013 ?!!!


could this be a new variant?


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## Deino

Okarus said:


> could this be a new variant?




Don't think so; looks exactly like a standard JL-10 for the PLAAF ... however this 10001 is different in the serial-number to the old 10001. Maybe serial batch 01 aircrfat 01 and 02?

Deino


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## grey boy 2

Close up pictures of JL-9

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## grey boy 2

JL-9G with folding wing structure unveiled, ready as carrier base aircraft? (主翼折叠可上航母？疑曝中国舰载海山鹰教练机)
中航工业贵飞的官方新闻疑似曝光了海军型舰载山鹰教练机，并出现了总装完成的教练机图片。图中可以看出，舰载山鹰教练机采用DSI进气口、翼根前缘边条、中等后掠角展弦比梯形主翼等设计。最关键的是，主翼疑似采用了可折叠设计，完全是为登上航母准备的。（来源：贵飞公司

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## Deino

Actually if You look at the full-size images, there's nothing different to the previous JL-9A wing.

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## grey boy 2

JL-9

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-9



Very nice !!

But how long do we have to wait until we see similar images of operational JL-10 in full serials ???

Deino


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## Deino

Hey ... completely unnoticed !??


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819162446656999425
via: http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/3_ANiBInpKn0TlXHF_AqSA

... any info on what base or even unit ?


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Hey ... completely unnoticed !??
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819162446656999425
> via: http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/3_ANiBInpKn0TlXHF_AqSA
> 
> ... any info on what base or even unit ?


The first batch of 2 planes was delivered in December 2016.


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> The first batch of 2 planes were delivered in December 2016.




Ok. ... and do You know to what base or even which unit ? 

Deino


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## Deino

Deino said:


> Hey ... completely unnoticed !??
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819162446656999425
> via: http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/3_ANiBInpKn0TlXHF_AqSA
> 
> ... any info on what base or even unit ?



And also in the link: Sharp Sword UAV won the "national sci & tech progress 2nd prize", JL-10H for PLANAF is about to make 1st flight soon.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819190857966333953

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## grey boy 2

Many JL-9 delivered to PLAAF
又讯：1月21日中午11点左右起，中航工业贵飞又有多架份山鹰飞机陆续从机场跑道起飞，再次顺利转场交付部队用户。在连续两天的时间里，贵飞公司山鹰转场交付捷报连传，*大批量向部队交付了多架份山鹰飞机*，强力推进了公司新一年以试飞为龙头、狠抓飞机均衡生产的强劲势头！

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## Deino

Nice ...


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/829291700602408960
... but are there already any news about the PLAAF's first unit !??

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## cnleio

Deino said:


> Nice ...
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/829291700602408960
> ... but are there already any news about the PLAAF's first unit !??


JL-10 mass-production in NanChang city
近日，从媒体公开的画面里可以看出，中航工业洪都生产车间里非常忙碌，L-15/JL-10的生产分段停满了车间。目前猎鹰教练机要同时处理国内和国外两方面的订单，如此高的产量也是满足订单需要

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## cnleio

JL-10 mass-production in NanChang city

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## cnleio

JL-10 fighters







========================================================

PLAAF JL-9

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## Deino

cnleio said:


> JL-10 fighters
> 
> View attachment 382907




Nice ... any info on WHERE this image was taken ??


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## cnleio

Deino said:


> Nice ... any info on WHERE this image was taken ??


NanChang city, the runway of AVIC HongDu Aircraft Manufacturer ... my hometown.

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## Deino

cnleio said:


> NanChang city, the runway of AVIC HongDu Aircraft Manufacturer ... my hometown.




Nice ... Looks like some sort of hand-over celebration or waving good-bye ?! Hopefully finally to an operational unit. But where ?


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## 帅的一匹

JL10 can turn into an air to ground attacker anytime we need it.


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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> Many JL-9 delivered to PLAAF
> 又讯：1月21日中午11点左右起，中航工业贵飞又有多架份山鹰飞机陆续从机场跑道起飞，再次顺利转场交付部队用户。在连续两天的时间里，贵飞公司山鹰转场交付捷报连传，*大批量向部队交付了多架份山鹰飞机*，强力推进了公司新一年以试飞为龙头、狠抓飞机均衡生产的强劲势头！



Need some help or explanation again !

GAC released some nice of its test flight facility again on 02.Mar.2017. The business seems running very well and many new-build JL-9 and JL-9As were seen. However in the background there were also still some factory fresh-looking JJ-7As seen.












The original poster at SDF noted, that GAIG is still making new JJ-7... .

I know it is indeed the same manufactor and factory ... but I thought the JJ-7A is no longer in production since years ! Indeed strange.

Could it be that these are birds for maintenance or MLU?? Or do they specificly mention, that they are new-build ones?

Deino


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## Arthur

Deino said:


> Need some help or explanation again !
> 
> GAC released some nice of its test flight facility again on 02.Mar.2017. The business seems running very well and many new-build JL-9 and JL-9As were seen. However in the background there were also still some factory fresh-looking JJ-7As seen.
> 
> View attachment 385491
> View attachment 385492
> View attachment 385493
> 
> 
> The original poster at SDF noted, that GAIG is still making new JJ-7... .
> 
> I know it is indeed the same manufactor and factory ... but I thought the JJ-7A is no longer in production since years ! Indeed strange.
> 
> Could it be that these are birds for maintenance or MLU?? Or do they specificly mention, that they are new-build ones?
> 
> Deino


Indeed that production line was to be closed down after the delivery of BAF's F 7 BGI delivery.

These are most probably late series aircrafts after MLU ed. ( pure assumption in my side)

Yesterday I saw pictures of seemingly factory fresh Q-5 dual seat version posted in this section.

Strange! What's going on? Is there a China version of Air National Guard in making we still don't know of?


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## Deino

Khan saheb said:


> Indeed that production line was to be closed down after the delivery of BAF's F 7 BGI delivery.
> 
> These are most probably late series aircrafts after MLU ed. (I ain't betting anything on this assumption)



To admit I have the same feeling - even if the line at GAIG is different to the one at CAC - , that these are not factory fresh new birds but MLUed ... overall do we know how many JJ-7s were built and when production ceased at GAIC? and also how many FT-7s were built ?

A quick Googeling delivered:

Over 200 PLA Air Force (JJ-7) built and delivered. Export deliveries to Bangladesh Air Force (eight FT-7B); Myanmar AF (six FT-7); Pakistan AF (15 FT-7P and six FT-7PG); Sri Lanka AF (one FT-7); Zimbabwe AF (two FT-7B).

What else ... Iran had a few ??!!

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## Arthur

Deino said:


> To admit I have the same feeling - even if the line at GAIG is different to the one at CAC - , that these are not factory fresh new birds but MLUed ... overall do we know
> Do you know how many JJ-7s were built and when production ceased at GAIC? and also how many FT-7s were built
> 
> A quick Googeling delivered:
> 
> Over 200 PLA Air Force (JJ-7) built and delivered. Export deliveries to Bangladesh Air Force (eight FT-7B); Myanmar AF (six FT-7); Pakistan AF (15 FT-7P and six FT-7PG); Sri Lanka AF (one FT-7); Zimbabwe AF (two FT-7B).
> 
> What else ... Iran had a few ??!!



GAIC line stopped the production for a long time now. They shifted to Jl 9 development & production. I don't know the timeline.
Reportedly even the CAC line was closed when BAF ordered the F 7 BGI in 2010, they just kept the line open just to churn out these last 16 unit. G Variant was supposed to be the last production model. 

Iran has 20 - 36 units of F 7 fighters. Number of FT 7 can vary, I don't know a concrete number.
Other large operators are :-
Egypt - 150 Units delivered. That means 10 SQ of F7 (14x 10 single seat). We can safely assume they had minimum 10 JJ 7 's.

North Korea. They reportedly has some 120 j7 in service.
Sudan, Yemen & Nigeria are other big operators. Nigeria has two FT 7 in service.

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## Deino

hint, hint ....


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/846022530313809925

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## lcloo

Deino said:


> hint, hint ....
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/846022530313809925


May be we will see arrestor hooks fiitted on JL10 soon.

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## zestokryl



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## grey boy 2

JL-9G PLAAF carrier trainer variant 中国山鹰教练机带尾钩版曝光！今年或要上航母,去年曾有山鹰教练机在陆地模拟甲板进行滑跃起飞的画面流出，最近更是曝光了其带着舰尾钩版本早已存在。山鹰上舰，或许就在今年！

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-9G PLAAF carrier trainer variant 中国山鹰教练机带尾钩版曝光！今年或要上航母,去年曾有山鹰教练机在陆地模拟甲板进行滑跃起飞的画面流出，最近更是曝光了其带着舰尾钩版本早已存在。山鹰上舰，或许就在今年！




But this is an old image from June 2014 together with this one from May 2014:






If I'm not mistaken, the tailhooks were removed because the airframe couldn't handle the stress of arrested landings.

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## Deino

Some nice image of naval JL-9 ...

http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2017-04/18/content_7567082.htm

... but can anyone tell them, that these are not Q-5s ???


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## grey boy 2

JL-10

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-10




Very nice ... 78437 would mean 172. Brigade ... or again from the new serial-numbering system?

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## samsara

PLAAF JL-10 with serial number of 78437, the *98th* JL-10 on assembly line.

Today (April 23, 2017) is also the 66th anniversary of the founding of the HAIG or Hongdu Aviation Industry Group, based in Nanchang, the capital of Jiangxi province.










Via @xinfengcao 2017.04.23

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## Deino

Did I miss something ??? L-15B roll-out today ???

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## grey boy 2

L-15B fighter trainer unveiled (中国航空工业洪都最新型L15B攻击战斗教练机闪亮登场)

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## 帅的一匹

grey boy 2 said:


> L-15B fighter trainer unveiled (中国航空工业洪都最新型L15B攻击战斗教练机闪亮登场)


Can L15b provides CAS like USAAF A10 thunderbolt?


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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> L-15B fighter trainer unveiled (中国航空工业洪都最新型L15B攻击战斗教练机闪亮登场)




Interesting, but esp. this image is very much a mock-up only.




wanglaokan said:


> Can L15b provides CAS like USAAF A10 thunderbolt?




Surely not, role-like maybe but surely not capability-wise. Alone the A-10's cannon and armour is a league of its own.

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## Deino

Here it is ... + afterburner engines it seems.






Larger ... 

.. but wait; with already the PLAAF-symbol applied with the PLAAF introduce this version too - maybe as a Q-5 successor ?? - ... I thought it is an export version.

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## Deino

Hmmm .... however from the last images it looks more like a mock-up ??!


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## grey boy 2

JL-9

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## Deino

Deino said:


> Hmmm .... however from the last images it looks more like a mock-up ??!
> 
> View attachment 394125




No longer any doubts ... but still the question: Is there a PLAAF-requirement for that version ?


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/859269237059268608

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/859269382643437568

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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> No longer any doubts ... but still the question: Is there a PLAAF-requirement for that version ?
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/859269237059268608
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/859269382643437568


No


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> No




But why does it show the PLAAF symbol already, while other JL-10 in grey behind do not ?


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## bdslph

grey boy 2 said:


> Close up pictures of JL-9



i love the camo and congrats to China 

jl9 looks more like f7 
l15 and jl10 both looks like same like yak130 how are they different

i think china is thinking to market them well as it will be cheap for many nations to buy

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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> But why does it show the PLAAF symbol already, while other JL-10 in grey behind do not ?


Hongdu have painted 八一 on L15 even for the 1st plane in 2006


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## samsara

L-15B attack variant IFF antenna, which is similar to F-16













Via *@xinfengcao* 2017.05.02


*A brief description of Hongdu L-15B light attack aircraft*

The Hongdu L-15 Falcon (猎鹰) [Pinyin: liè yīng] is a Chinese *supersonic training and light attack aircraft* being developed by Nanchang-based Hongdu Aviation Industry Group (HAIG) to fulfill the PLAAF and PLAN lead-in fighter trainer (LIFT) requirements.

The model *L-15B* is an *upgraded attack variant* equipped with a pair of Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25F jet engines with an afterburner, giving it a maximum speed of 1.4 Mach, MTOW (Maximum Take-Off Weight): 11,600 kgs, 9 hardpoints with 11 pylons, 5 IFF antennae, a PESA (passive electronically scanned array) multifunctional radar with a detection range 75 km, and a 360-degree MAW (missile approach warning) system on its vertical tail. Its prototype rolled out in April 2017.

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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> Hongdu have painted 八一 on L15 even for the 1st plane in 2006



Thanks ...
Maybe a stupid question, but how likely is this new L-15B simply the original no. 06 prototype updated with the latest modifications?


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## 帅的一匹

samsara said:


> L-15B attack variant IFF antenna, which is similar to F-16
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Via *@xinfengcao* 2017.05.02
> 
> 
> *A brief description of Hongdu L-15B light attack aircraft*
> 
> The Hongdu L-15 Falcon (猎鹰) [Pinyin: liè yīng] is a Chinese *supersonic training and light attack aircraft* being developed by Nanchang-based Hongdu Aviation Industry Group (HAIG) to fulfill the PLAAF and PLAN lead-in fighter trainer (LIFT) requirements.
> 
> The model *L-15B* is an *upgraded attack variant* equipped with a pair of Ivchenko Progress AI-222K-25F jet engines with an afterburner, giving it a maximum speed of 1.4 Mach, MTOW (Maximum Take-Off Weight): 11,600 kgs, 9 hardpoints with 11 pylons, 5 IFF antennae, a PESA (passive electronically scanned array) multifunctional radar with a detection range 75 km, and a 360-degree MAW (missile approach warning) system on its vertical tail. Its prototype rolled out in April 2017.


Can China produce AL-222K-25F by our own?


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Thanks ...
> Maybe a stupid question, but how likely is this new L-15B simply the original no. 06 prototype updated with the latest modifications?


It is a reasonable guess.


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## grey boy 2

JL-10 fighter trainer has been produced more than 100 plane so far (中航工业洪都的明星产品教练10. 已经生产超过100架)

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-10 fighter trainer has been produced more than 100 plane so far (中航工业洪都的明星产品教练10. 已经生产超过100架)




But where are they all assigned to ??
So far we've seen one single aircraft in PLAAF-serials and nothing more ... not even a known unit other than the 172. Brigade and I can't think that this brigade houses 100 JL-10s.

So IMO at least three full units could be expected somewhere out there ...

Deino


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## 帅的一匹

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-10 fighter trainer has been produced more than 100 plane so far (中航工业洪都的明星产品教练10. 已经生产超过100架)


Can't be that fast!? Unbelievable China speed.

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## grey boy 2

The 1st export version of JL-9 fighter trainer is schedule to be rolling out on 6/5/2017 (首架外贸型山鹰6月5日下线)

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## Deino

grey boy 2 said:


> The 1st export version of JL-9 fighter trainer is schedule to be rolling out on 6/5/2017 (首架外贸型山鹰6月5日下线)




A hint, which country ?

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## grey boy 2

JL-10 fighter bomber "Pulsating production line" unveiled (飞机也疯狂下饺子！中国L15战机使用脉动生产线)

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## yusheng



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## grey boy 2

JL-9 and 10

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## grey boy 2

Plenty of JL-9 (一排望不到边的山鹰)

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## Deino

Tomorrow the first foreign customer for the FTC-2000G will be revealed !

Any guess ?

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## Ben-Liubin

I am surprised to see so many Chinese here posting threads  This is my first reply!

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## 帅的一匹

这么多机机，换装压力好大呀！

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## grey boy 2

Delivery ceremony of the 1st JL-9 export version(FTC 2000) 首架外贸“山鹰”今天下线，现场仪式照还是你熟悉的土鳖?

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## grey boy 2

Some more for the delivery ceremony: destination "Sudan" (贵航首架山鹰外贸飞机总装下线，出口苏丹)

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## zestokryl

Whats that big ball on the 5 th photo ?


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## grey boy 2

zestokryl said:


> Whats that big ball on the 5 th photo ?


I believed its the switches for the lighting of the ceremony that was used like in some big charity shows on TV

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## grey boy 2

Specifications of "FTC 2000" (山鹰FTC-2000高级教练机主要参数)
















*FTC-2000 VS air defense system
















VS fighter jets












*

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## Deino




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## lcloo

Does the number 0621 means unit numbered 21 in batch 6?


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## Deino

lcloo said:


> Does the number 0621 means unit numbered 21 in batch 6?




Yes ... that's the typical serial-pattern: name of the aircraft followed by the production batch (here 06) and the individual aircraft's number within that batch.

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## grey boy 2

L-15

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## grey boy 2

The new kid in town (JL-9) fighter trainer

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## grey boy 2

JL-10 fighter trainer from June 10 2017

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## grey boy 2

JL-10 fighter trainer "Pulsating production line" (这才是中国速度！L15猎鹰教练机生产车间爆满)
L15这样脉动总装也有好长一段时间了，只要有订单保障，估计今年总产量就可以超过山鹰！ 这才是真正的中国速度！（来源：沉默的山羊）

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## grey boy 2



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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/882159578779009026

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## grey boy 2

JL-9 (navy export version unveiled)  海山鹰的多用途出口版本已经立项，并完成设计发图,高清细节曝光,正在试制中！

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## Deino

Aviadarts 2017

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## bdslph

Chinese are very smart while other country left the low and medium end market 
China kept it open and plus point no string attach and also all planes are brand new at a very cheap price



grey boy 2 said:


> JL-9 (navy export version unveiled)  海山鹰的多用途出口版本已经立项，并完成设计发图,高清细节曝光,正在试制中！



what is the spec and also why would some one buy this a naval version this is very short range plane plus a trainer 
is it good for the basic naval duty

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## grey boy 2

JL-10

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## Deino

Finally the JL-10H for the PLANAF !!!!

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## grey boy 2

JL-10

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## cnleio

grey boy 2 said:


> JL-10


Hope JL-10 to become next K-8 in China, export as many as we can.

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## Deino

Deino said:


> Finally the JL-10H for the PLANAF !!!!




Is this only a prototype or already one operationally delivered to the PLANAF?


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## Deino

Seems as if Diamond Aircraft China has the intention to join the PLAAF's basic trainer competition, which is said to replace the once proposed Hongdu CJ-7 with a design based on the Diamond Dart 450.












IMO a perfect proposal replacing the CJ-7.

However can anyone explain how much legally Diamond can propose, develop and sell such a version to China? I think it is still an Austrian company.


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## Blue Marlin

Deino said:


> Seems as if Diamond Aircraft China has the intention to join the PLAAF's basic trainer competition, which is said to replace the once proposed Hongdu CJ-7 with a design based on the Diamond Dart 450.
> 
> View attachment 424549
> View attachment 424550
> View attachment 424551
> 
> 
> IMO a perfect proposal replacing the CJ-7.
> 
> However can anyone explain how much legally Diamond can propose, develop and sell such a version to China? I think it is still an Austrian company.


its a foreign aircraft (austrian) im sure chinese manufactures can whip something up of their own.


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Seems as if Diamond Aircraft China has the intention to join the PLAAF's basic trainer competition, which is said to replace the once proposed Hongdu CJ-7 with a design based on the Diamond Dart 450.
> 
> View attachment 424549
> View attachment 424550
> View attachment 424551
> 
> 
> IMO a perfect proposal replacing the CJ-7.
> 
> However can anyone explain how much legally Diamond can propose, develop and sell such a version to China? I think it is still an Austrian company.


“want to” does not mean can. It is produced by CETC Wuhu Diamond, but they should get military certification first


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> “want to” does not mean can. It is produced by CETC Wuhu Diamond, but they should get military certification first



But getting a military certification should not be impossible - esp. since that type is already a military trainer - an is maybe a less complicated task than designing a clean-sheet design. We all know that the CJ-7 was not the most successful project.

Deino


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## leapx

Blue Marlin said:


> its a foreign aircraft (austrian) im sure chinese manufactures can whip something up of their own.



I don' think PLA will care it is a foreign aircarft or not. It is just a basic trainer. But I doubt this aircraft can meet PLA requirement better than CJ-7. PLA just want a reliable，cheap aircraft.That is why CJ-7 use a pistol engine.


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> But getting a military certification should not be impossible - esp. since that type is already a military trainer - an is maybe a less complicated task than designing a clean-sheet design. We all know that the CJ-7 was not the most successful project.
> 
> Deino


You are right, but they should ensure all of the components have reliable suppliers. At least at the moment, most of the internal component of Dart-450 are from unreliable Western suppliers.


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> You are right, but they should ensure all of the components have reliable suppliers. At least at the moment, most of the internal component of Dart-450 are from unreliable Western suppliers.




Sorry to say so, but I think here You are simply wrong: Diamond has an own facility in China , that is also making the DA.42. And concerning the unreliable Western suppliers; what are You talking about? The engine is an Ukrainian Iwtschenko Progress AI-450S, the avionics could easily be replaced by Chinese systems ... so what's Your issue?


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> Sorry to say so, but I think here You are simply wrong: Diamond has an own facility in China , that is also making the DA.42. And concerning the unreliable Western suppliers; what are You talking about? The engine is an Ukrainian Iwtschenko Progress AI-450S, the avionics could easily be replaced by Chinese systems ... so what's Your issue?


To be sold in the West, all of DART 450s internal components should follow the FAA rule but there is not a single company having FAA's certificaion except the fuselage in China, so I can safely say that all of the internal component are from the West and should be replaced by made in China ones, but, unfortunately, most of the aeronautical facility in China belongs to AVIC.


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## grey boy 2

JL-9 with night mission ability during test flight 加了夜训设备的山鹰在北方外场科研试飞中

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## STRANGER BIRD



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## grey boy 2

GAIEC delivered a few more JL-9G aiming to be carrier-borne soon 航空工业贵飞多架海山鹰转场交付,海山鹰什么时候上舰?
Disclaimer: I do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials.

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## Martian2

grey boy 2 said:


> GAIEC delivered a few more JL-9G aiming to be carrier-borne soon 航空工业贵飞多架海山鹰转场交付,海山鹰什么时候上舰?


Very interesting photo.

That looks like a DSI (diverterless supersonic inlet) bump on the JL-9G trainer aircraft.

It's amazing that an advanced design-feature to lessen the weight of supersonic airflow control has migrated from the J-10B test aircraft, J-20, and J-31 downwards to the JL-9G.

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## zestokryl




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## cirr

*Advanced version of China's first electric plane makes maiden flight*

2017-11-02 08:47 Xinhua _Editor: Gu Liping_

An advanced version of China's first electric plane made its maiden flight on Wednesday, extending the single flight time to two hours from around 45 minutes.

The two-seater aircraft, the RX1E-A, designed by Shenyang Aerospace University, performed the task at around 3 p.m. at Caihu airport in Shenyang, capital of northeast China's Liaoning Province.

The extended endurance of the plane will help it tap into markets in the United States and Europe, according to Zou Haining, deputy head of Liaoning General Aviation Academy.

In addition, the improved aircraft is equipped with a new parachute that enables safe landing of both pilot and plane.

With a maximum speed of 160 km per hour, the aircraft can be used in pilot training, passenger transportation, tourism and aerial photography.

Mass production of the first-generation type, RX1E, started in early 2016.

http://www.ecns.cn/2017/11-02/279313.shtml

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## kristisipe

*Advanced version of China's first electric plane makes maiden flight*
*



*

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## STRANGER BIRD




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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/940937973767421953

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/943935431846125568

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## Deino

First clear images of the naval JL-10H

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## Deino

What do You think of this report: 

http://www.scmp.com/news/china/dipl...nese-navy-trains-more-fighter-pilots-expanded 




> ....
> 
> The report did not specify which training aircraft was being used, but experts said it was likely to be the L-15B Falcon supersonic advanced jet trainer developed by Hongdu Aviation Industry in Nanchang, Jiangxi province.
> 
> Chinese military websites have previously reported that the L-15B would be modified for aircraft carrier pilot training. The light attack aircraft is also used by the air force for training and has been exported to Venezuela and Zambia.
> 
> ....



To admit I'm very much sceptical both on SCMP's and Minnie Chan's reliability & credibility and even more on this. So far one L-15B-prototype/demonstrator is flying, in PLA-service this is called JL-10 and not L-15 ... however the fact that a carrier-capable variant based on the "B" is surely better suited than the current standard model is undeniable.

Deino


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## lcloo

2018 training starts today, opened by President Xi himself. 2 PLAAF JL10 taxi for take off.

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/951147570516119553

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## Deino

Via Oedo... 

But their serials are psed

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/956388983075983360

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## cirr



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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/956423430471024640

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## Deino

Deino said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/956388983075983360



A better shot

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## Deino



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## Deino

Does anyone what PLA Naval Aviation base this is?
Allegedly a batch of 3 JL-10Hs were delivered to this base alongside JH-7As (?)






Just got the reply ... it is Suizhong, the 3rd Regiment (maybe from the 5th NAD/13rd AR) ... and it seems as also Qinhuangdao/Shanhaiguan has no longer JH-7A (5th NAD/13rd AR) but JL-9 ... maybe from the 3rd AR at Jiyuan??

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## Figaro

Deino said:


> What do You think of this report:
> 
> http://www.scmp.com/news/china/dipl...nese-navy-trains-more-fighter-pilots-expanded
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To admit I'm very much sceptical both on SCMP's and Minnie Chan's reliability & credibility and even more on this. So far one L-15B-prototype/demonstrator is flying, in PLA-service this is called JL-10 and not L-15 ... however the fact that a carrier-capable variant based on the "B" is surely better suited than the current standard model is undeniable.
> 
> Deino


Anything coming out from SCMP, especially if they include "unnamed sources", should be treated as false until proven otherwise.

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## LKJ86

The production line of CJ-6 restarts.

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## Arthur

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 463650
> 
> The production line of CJ-6 restarts.


For a foreign customer?

Rumor is BAF is buying a squadron of PT 6 as part of a billion dollar deal.


----------



## LKJ86

Khan saheb said:


> For a foreign customer?
> 
> Rumor is BAF is buying a squadron of PT 6 as part of a billion dollar deal.


@Khan saheb
For PLAAF.

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## LKJ86

L-15





























video:http://video.weibo.com/show?fid=1034:279f689815b254440311bbdc6dfcc95f

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## LKJ86

CJ-6























Source:https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/DYrtbvHeN4z6Zj1d8TwU6A

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 465867
> ....




To admit I'm surprised to see a yellow-primer-coloured JH-7A in the background. Is it one during MLU? ... or is that type still in production?

Any info appreciated.

Best,
Deino

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86

AVIC Jiangxi Hongdu Aviation Industry Group Corporation Limited

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
2018.4.24

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## LKJ86

JL-8
2018.4.20




























http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2018-04/25/content_8014941.htm

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## LKJ86

JL-8
2018.4.13

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86

JL-10
2018.4.26







https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/MYo95yHunJUO7Hvy6hPAjg

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/BWBSLdsNpOX3e4mgzxw5HA

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 471223



Nice ... but still a photoshopped image only. :-(


----------



## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

2018.5.4

























http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2018-05/07/content_8024919.htm


----------



## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/hSamaz-VeqY1RNLIV9Zv-Q


----------



## Deino

Finally a Naval Aviation JL-10H with a number  ... 88003 - NA University


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/995133736172867584


----------



## MReynolds

Still no tail hook. I'm surprised the PLA-N haven't inducted such a model. IMO, using the J-15 as a trainer is rather expensive.

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

2003.5.15









2003.12.13




https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/ahNe_Xlw7WwFKZhljp5ifA

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/09nDDgJYoLK8a_vkBWLvuw

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/YCgzZL2UfoD-sNbdwGoJ6A

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/9co9JQnsppMrDKhWXq5DIA

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/74zDsr67uEyIcs615RuvXQ

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/3JB5OKnBRHAtv90R1DykUQ

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## LKJ86

JJ-7

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 485824




The JL-10 on top has a radome as it seems??


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> The JL-10 on top has a radome as it seems??


Yes

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Yes



Any more info on it? So far all PLAAF and NA JL-10s had none.


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## Deino

How does the ones delivered to Sudan differ to the FTC-2000G?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Any more info on it? So far all PLAAF and NA JL-10s had none.

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/XQepFVkTUUI1SxVTf6Oaxg

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Yes




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1021414333174157312

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/gG2ptG2LZtJKjh5ropPbng

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## LKJ86

JJ-7

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## Deino

Several JL-10H entering service with Naval Aviation School.

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## Deino

several JL-10H with 88x0x serials assigned to the Naval Aviation University at Suizhong

via https://www.weibo.com/tv/v/GtIg7lf8M?fid=1034:4270815387028139

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G

























https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/QFAYzKR_Kz_TIujXHhqYaA

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## LKJ86




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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 491289




But heavily ps'ed on the spine !


----------



## Deino

unfortunately with the numbers erased again


----------



## JSCh

*New training aircraft expected to help PLA Navy pilots polish carrier skills*
By Zhao Lei | China Daily | Updated: 2018-08-14 08:58

















China's latest trainer aircraft, delivered recently to the People's Liberation Army Navy, is expected to help improve the training of pilots based on aircraft carriers.

The PLA Navy said in a statement last week that its Naval Aviation University in Shandong province had held a commissioning ceremony for a new type of trainer jet at an unidentified naval airport along the Bohai Sea.

The statement said the aircraft is a third-generation trainer jet developed by the Aviation Industry Corp of China's Hongdu Aviation Industry Group in Nanchang, Jiangxi province.

Rear Admiral Wang Jundong, political commissar of the university, was quoted in the statement as saying at the ceremony that the service of the new trainer jet will complement the university's trainer fleet and enable pilots to get more realistic experience for air combat.

Though the statement did not identify the new aircraft, pictures published by the university showed that it is a Hongdu Aviation Industry L-15 advanced trainer jet. At least 12 L-15s were delivered at the ceremony.

According to AVIC, a leading aircraft maker in the country, the domestically developed L-15 has two engines, a streamlined aerodynamic design and integrated avionics.

The L-15 has two types - one for advanced jet training and the other for lead-in fighter training, the State-owned defense giant said.

Trainer jets for advanced application teach student pilots how to operate supersonic aircraft and how to carry out sophisticated aerial maneuvers, while those for lead-in fighter training are enhanced versions of advanced jet models and focus on familiarizing trainees with combat maneuvers and skills.

AVIC also noted that the L-15 has a maximum speed of 1,200 kilometers per hour and a maximum flight range of 2,600 km.

Before the L-15, the PLA Navy lacked a third-generation trainer aircraft, so it had to rely on its second-generation JJ-7 trainer jet and that aircraft's upgraded version, the JL-9, to conduct advanced training for student pilots.

Currently, a Navy flight student will fly the CJ-6 pistonengine basic trainer, followed by the JL-8 intermediate trainer jet. When pilots begin the advanced training stage, both the JJ-7 and JL-9 will be used to simulate real fighter aircraft.

Wang Ya'nan, editor-in-chief of Aerospace Knowledge magazine, said the use of the L-15 will help shorten the time required for Navy aviators' training before they become qualified to operate modern fighter jets. The trainer jet will be especially useful for carrier-based pilots, Wang said.

"The L-15 has advanced design and equipment, and its capabilities are very close to those of a genuine fighter jet. Compared with its predecessors, it is more suitable for carrier-based pilots' flight training," Wang said.


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## Deino

JSCh said:


> *New training aircraft expected to help PLA Navy pilots polish carrier skills*
> ....



But what's still missing is a true carrier-capable variant.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Yes

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 492277




Could you please translate the text on that banner?


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## Deino

Here a clear image of that PESA-equipped JL-10A

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G













https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/j0iaU3mRunZgF1zogPWfmQ

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

August 20, 2018










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/1KSigHbOsOtJewIPpJYEIg


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## LKJ86

August 22, 2018










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/_DTaOoHYi4MhHjkl-qGqQQ

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

CJ-6

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## LKJ86

CJ-6











































https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/4cBoByS-kRo3dGduGEeBkw

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G



















https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/UDExjpgwzeLX9roz74jBIg

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/rHvcF3fONYkbNfXvNgIjtw


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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/2050309667/4279159641363195


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
















https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/L_GNViu4P_i2qe-JAgtlWQ

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G


 It is finished ...

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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> It is finished ...
> 
> View attachment 496690

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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/zrMYSWIkrZT1Egrc0IYyGg

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 496749
> View attachment 496750
> View attachment 496751
> View attachment 496752
> View attachment 496753
> View attachment 496754



So the G-variant is a mix of the PLAAF JL-9 with certain elements from the JL-9G.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 498261



Nice shot ... but still without a hook it is not really a carrier trainer.


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G





































https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/cfsBolcSArYcedYOzu-ieQ


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
















https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/-_a5bA2gZVCgZS9Py0W6Vg


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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

L-15


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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/a003zGP-Ho3ZmDzHHoQCfA

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
September 19, 2018










https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/Q028nQVevsMyw27A2TfEVA


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
September 19, 2018





























































https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/tOcouBHqCgTPaPuS60Q8wQ

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
September 20, 2018































https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/9QcmxcgvZoQ9x9tbRl_TTQ

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


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## 055_destroyer

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G
> View attachment 517039
> View attachment 517040
> View attachment 517041


If this plane is selling less than USD 10million per piece. It's a steal.


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


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## LKJ86

FTC-2000 & FTC-2000G


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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

JL-10


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

http://www.hermes-sys.com/qiyedongtai/201811/185.html

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 528999
> View attachment 529000
> View attachment 529001
> View attachment 529002
> View attachment 529003
> 
> 
> http://www.hermes-sys.com/qiyedongtai/201811/185.html



Is this "TA-20" trainer a Diamond 450-based design?? ... or even just a renamed one?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Is this "Smart 210" a Diamond 450-based design?? ... or even just a renamed one?


TA-20

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> TA-20




I just saw my mistake ... TA-20 is the aircraft, Smart 210 the integrated avionics system.

But again, the TA-20 looks very much like a Diamond Dart 450.






Just found it myself ... TA-20 built by CETC Wuhu Diamond!

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## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86

L-15

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

Are all new-built JL10s equippdd with the radar or are these older images?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Are all new-built JL10s equippdd with the radar or are these older images?


December, 2018

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> December, 2018




Does this mean the PLAAF will indeed get radar-equipped ones soon?

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 530921
> View attachment 530922
> View attachment 530923
> View attachment 530924




AFAIK these are from Hongdu's new home airport ... unfortunately I can't remember the air bases' name. Can anyone help me out?

Best and thanks in advance,
Deino


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> AFAIK these are from Hongdu's new home airport ... unfortunately I can't remember the air bases' name. Can anyone help me out?
> 
> Best and thanks in advance,
> Deino


Nanchang Yaohu Airport

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> ...
> View attachment 529340




Given the fact that one of them carries an official CFTE serial number #437 - the first two prototypes were 001/#434 and 002/#435 - it seems highly likely that the PLAAF is interested in that variant.


----------



## Akasa

Deino said:


> Given the fact that one of them carries an official CFTE serial number #437 - the first two prototypes were 001/#434 and 002/#435 - it seems highly likely that the PLAAF is interested in that variant.
> 
> View attachment 530973



I don't think CFTE trials suggest that the PLAAF is interested in them. Don't all Chinese aircraft, export or otherwise, go through tests at CFTE?


----------



## Deino

Akasa said:


> I don't think CFTE trials suggest that the PLAAF is interested in them. Don't all Chinese aircraft, export or otherwise, go through tests at CFTE?



Not sure but at first sight, do you know any type that was tested at the CFTE with an official number and PLAAF emblem that was not a PLAAF project??


----------



## Akasa

Deino said:


> Not sure but at first sight, do you know any type that was tested at the CFTE with an official number and PLAAF emblem that was not a PLAAF project??



Hasn't the JF-17 been frequently spotted at Yanliang? Or am I mistaken?


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9H

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9N

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## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




----------



## Foxtrot Delta

Im not a fan of JL9 it looks cheap. 
But the l 15 looks great.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 535017




Oh well they already have a serial number??? ... in the original post of this image it wasn't visible.


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Oh well they already have a serial number??? ... in the original post of this image it wasn't visible.


http://www.hongdu.com.cn/xwxx/911.html

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> http://www.hongdu.com.cn/xwxx/911.html



Interesting, since on the image you posted on January 18th it was not visible.


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## LKJ86




----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 535325



Interesting new antenna on the dorsal spine ... however I would like to know the serial number.


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

JL-10

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## lcloo

Many single seat J7 have been used as trainers, not sure why, but my speculation is they are maximising usage of J7 and JJ7 so that their airframe lives would be used up in shortest possible time and then retired. 
With J7 and JJ7 retire, logistic can be less burdened, and support for JL9 and JL10 can be more focused.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

February 21, 2019

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-10

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> View attachment 551607




As in the J-20 thread ... any idea on its location?


----------



## Deino

Deino said:


> As in the J-20 thread ... any idea on its location?




Also at Wuhu ... indeed a surprise.


----------



## bahadur999

Deino said:


> Also at Wuhu ... indeed a surprise.


That's not necessarily means a new training unit moved there. Maybe it was just an exercise and they had to land there. But that's only my speculation...

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## lcloo

JL10 would be perfectly serve as a lead in conversion trainer for new pilots of J20. Even after simulator training, hands on flight on an actual conversion aircraft would serve the pilots' transition much smoother.

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## LKJ86

New production line for FTC-2000G.


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86

CJ-6


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86




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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 554042
> View attachment 554043




Is the image above an old one like the one below or a recent one? Would be great ...


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## LKJ86

April 18, 2019


----------



## Enigma SIG

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> View attachment 552311


So many similarities to the F/A 18.


----------



## LKJ86

Enigma SIG said:


> So many similarities to the F/A 18.


Why not Yak-130?


----------



## Enigma SIG

LKJ86 said:


> Why not Yak-130?



More similar to Yak-130 yes. I was referring to the picture from the underside:







A fleeting look and the viewer could assume its an F/A-18.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> April 18, 2019
> View attachment 554501




Oh well  ... if you look closely this radar-equipped JL-10A has a serial number attached but in the other images it is deleted.


----------



## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 559978




Allegedly Batch 03


----------



## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 560292




What a strange serial number??


----------



## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 560292




Now Huitong reports this as serial 2x1x, what would fit to a training brigade assigned to the Shijiazhuang Flying Academy

http://chinese-military-aviation.blogspot.com/p/trainers.html#JL-10

However 212 could then only fit to 2*212* - aka the 1. Training Brigade at Shijiazhuang - and IMO the space in front of the 212 looks a bit narrow? ... so more likely *212*x, which would then be a 2x2x serial - aka the 2. Training Brigade at Yongji?


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## LKJ86

JL-10




https://m.weibo.cn/3499923294/4374365128608585

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> View attachment 561186
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/3499923294/4374365128608585



And they are all radar-equipped JL-10As. 

I would love to see their serial numbers


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## LKJ86

by 摧毁疯人院

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 562474




Oh well ... where is this?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## JSCh

*Sneak peek of China's most advanced jet trainer L-15*
New China TV
Published on Jul 13, 2019

Click to see China's most advanced jet trainer L-15, which is capable of advanced training (AJT) and lead-in fighter training (LIFT) for the pilots of the third generation fighter.

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## Deino

JL-9 catapult gear


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1154256755636887553

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## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 573938




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1161609926709587969


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## LKJ86

JL-9

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

JL-10

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 576015



Is this a hint, that the PLAAF will also introduce the version with afterburner-engines?


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## vi-va

Deino said:


> Is this a hint, that the PLAAF will also introduce the version with afterburner-engines?


I think afterburner is needed for supersonic training.


----------



## LKJ86



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## Deino

viva_zhao said:


> I think afterburner is needed for supersonic training.




Yes, but the question is, ... is this an afterburner-equipped one or not?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 576434




However - given the different nozzle - I'm not sure if this alleged JL-10B is not closer related to the L-15B.


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 576434



By the way, what's the difference between the JL-10H and the JL-10J?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> By the way, what's the difference between the JL-10H and the JL-10J?


JL-10J is said to be the carrier-based version in the picture.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10J is said to be the carrier-based version in the picture.




But without a hook?


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> But without a hook?


It is just a random picture, not a real one, as said in the picture.

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## LKJ86

CJ-6

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

L-15 and CJ-6
August 31, 2019

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

L-15, M-346, and Yak-130










Via @彩虹熊_白玮 from weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @空军记者 from Weixin

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## waja2000

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 576711
> View attachment 576712



new version with improvement on glass cockpit ?


----------



## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @空军记者 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 4 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

September 20, 2019





Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## UmairNawaz

Is L-15B still being developed? It would be a great multirole fighter, but many members are saying it would still be a LIFT with BVRAAMs.





It's loadout can mirror JF-17 but unsure of its radar.


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @DS谁明浪子心 from Weibo





Via @DS南海听风 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @goneless from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via @hysplan from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H







Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @现代兵器 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10







Via @DS南海听风 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10













Via @wanquanfoto from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H 

























Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G No.2 makes its maiden flight on October 29, 2019:




















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

JL-9H



















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

JL-10



















Via navy.81.cn

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## LKJ86

JL-9

























Via @空军记者 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @白龙_龙腾四海 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @太湖啥个 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via @Dear-吕俊彦 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @斯文的威猛 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @CAN-MUGUA from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via jx.people.cn


----------



## Adam_Khan

LKJ86 said:


> JL-9H
> View attachment 586871
> View attachment 586872
> View attachment 586873
> View attachment 586874
> View attachment 586875
> View attachment 586876
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin



What's the difference between FTC.2000 and the JL.9?


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## Deino

Adam_Khan said:


> What's the difference between FTC.2000 and the JL.9?




FTC-2000 is a refined export variant, JL-9 the standard PLAAF and PLA NA trainer



LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 587370
> 
> Via jx.people.cn




Any more info on this variant? Why does it have an ECM on top of the tailfin, will it be introduced as - say the JL-10B - in PLAAF or Naval Aviation service? Is it only a test or for export?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @CAN-MUGUA from Weibo

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## LKJ86

JL-10






















Via @B747SPNKG from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1191203499469615104


----------



## LKJ86

Via @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H










Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via 中国航空报

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## LKJ86

Via 中国航空报

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## LKJ86

Sword Fish







Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

L-15




Via @斯文的威猛 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10



















Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @幸福a迷了路 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6




Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

L-15







Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

via kj.81.cn


----------



## Philip the Arab

Can JL-9 carry SD-10?


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Can JL-9 carry SD-10?


No


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> No


Are you 100% sure?


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Are you 100% sure?


Yeah because of limited range of its radar


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## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> Yeah because of limited range of its radar


Does the ability to fire SD-10 make L-15B a good fighter?
@seven0seven 

Also, L-15B can carry SD-10 maybe.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Does the ability to fire SD-10 make L-15B a good fighter?
> @seven0seven
> 
> Also, L-15B can carry SD-10 maybe.


Its basically good only for African countries


----------



## Philip the Arab

@ChineseTiger1986
@LKJ86
Can L-15B be a good multirole fighter for developing nations who need a fighter with BVRAAM capability?


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> @ChineseTiger1986
> @LKJ86
> Can L-15B be a good multirole fighter for developing nations who need a fighter with BVRAAM capability?


bro its basically lead in fighter trainer jet like F/A-50/ M-346/Yak-130 not true multirole fighter jet, its good in only for light strike/CAS/COIN role


----------



## lcloo

Philip the Arab said:


> Does the ability to fire SD-10 make L-15B a good fighter?
> @seven0seven
> 
> Also, L-15B can carry SD-10 maybe.


Very unlikely a SD-10 AAM due to limited range of L-15B radar , more like an LD-10 Anti-radiation missile.





_The LD-10 air-to-surface anti-radiation missile is* a variant of the SD-10A missile meant for Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD)*, similar to Raytheon's High-speed Anti-Radiation Missile (HARM). The LD-10 retains the overall aerodynamic layout of the SD-10A, but has the active radar seeker of the SD-10A replaced with a new passive radar-homing seeker.

The LD-10 has been designed such as to be retrofitted faster and with minimal modifications to launch platforms, which have been cleared for use with the SD-10A missile. These include the J-8, J-10, J-11 and the JF-17. The missile was marketed with a maximum range of 80 km with a 20 kg warhead. _

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## Philip the Arab

lcloo said:


> Very unlikely a SD-10 AAM due to limited range of L-15B radar , more like an LD-10 Anti-radiation missile.
> 
> View attachment 595225
> 
> _The LD-10 air-to-surface anti-radiation missile is* a variant of the SD-10A missile meant for Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (SEAD)*, similar to Raytheon's High-speed Anti-Radiation Missile (HARM). The LD-10 retains the overall aerodynamic layout of the SD-10A, but has the active radar seeker of the SD-10A replaced with a new passive radar-homing seeker.
> 
> The LD-10 has been designed such as to be retrofitted faster and with minimal modifications to launch platforms, which have been cleared for use with the SD-10A missile. These include the J-8, J-10, J-11 and the JF-17. The missile was marketed with a maximum range of 80 km with a 20 kg warhead. _


I see, are you sure that is the LD-10? Various sources say it is in fact the SD-10.

http://military.china.com/important/11132797/20170620/30779354_3.html

Also, L-15B radar is apparently 110km so it has enough range to fire PL-12/SD-10.


----------



## lcloo

Philip the Arab said:


> I see, are you sure that is the LD-10? Various sources say it is in fact the SD-10.
> 
> http://military.china.com/important/11132797/20170620/30779354_3.html


Technically, yes, L-15B can carry SD-10 since both LD-10 and SD-10 use the same pylon. But the small radar on L-15B will not explore the full potential of SD-10 AAM as the missile can only be effectively locked onto target within the limited range of L-15B's radar. Though if the end users wants SD-10 AAM, there is no reason not to sell to them.

However, looking at the photo that you posted, other than the WVR AAM, all other payloads are intended for Ground Strike/SEAD mission, thus the chances of that particular missile is LD-10 is far greater.

In short, both SD-10 and LD-10 can be carried by L-15B, but it is a real waste of potential of SD-10 and the money if L-15B is used as the launch platform.

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## Philip the Arab

lcloo said:


> Technically, yes, L-15B can carry SD-10 since both LD-10 and SD-10 use the same pylon. But the small radar on L-15B will not explore the full potential of SD-10 AAM as the missile can only be effectively locked onto target within the limited range of L-15B's radar. If the end users wants SD-10 AAM, there is no reason not to sell to them.
> 
> However, looking at the photo that you posted, other than the WVR AAM, all other payloads are intended for SEAD mission, thus the chances of that particular missile is LD-10 is far greater.
> 
> In short, both SD-10 and LD-10 can be carried by L-15B, but it is a real waste of potential of SD-10 and the money if L-15B is used as the launch platform.


110 km range of radar is short? Lets be honest, most SD-10s won't be launched at that range so radar could be even less range. This is the first mention of LD-10 so I have to take it with a grain of salt if you understand what I am saying.

The L-15B also has a lengthened nose to accommodate a Passive Electronically Scanned Array radar with a reported detection range of -seven or seventy miles (sources differ)

L-15B operating with a jamming pod, and SD-10 could be a fairly good fighter but as you said this may be LD-10.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> 110 km range of radar is short? Lets be honest, most SD-10s won't be launched at that range so radar could be even less range. This is the first mention of LD-10 so I have to take it with a grain of salt if you understand what I am saying.
> 
> The L-15B also has a lengthened nose to accommodate a Passive Electronically Scanned Array radar with a reported detection range of -seven or seventy miles (sources differ)
> 
> L-15B operating with a jamming pod, and SD-10 could be a fairly good fighter but as you said this may be LD-10.


Bro getting lock of max range of radar is difficult things then you assume BVR are not fire at max range but main consideration for good kill is NEZ/F-POLE


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> Bro getting lock of max range of radar is difficult things then you assume BVR are not fire at max range but main consideration for good kill is NEZ/F-POLE


Yes, I know that is why 110 km radar range isn't needed, you can probably use 80-90 km range radar and fire at 50-60 to have good chances of killing target.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Yes, I know that is why 110 km radar range isn't needed, you can probably use 80-90 km range radar and fire at 50-60 to have good chances of killing target.


THIS WORKS ONLY THAT OPPONENT JET HAS A SIMILAR CAPABILITIES LIKE L-15 HAVE, EVEN FOR LIGHT FIGHTER JET LIKE JF17 OR GRIPPEN CAN EASILY DESTROY L-15B IN A BVR FIGHT


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> THIS WORKS ONLY THAT OPPONENT JET HAS A SIMILAR CAPABILITIES LIKE L-15 HAVE, EVEN FOR LIGHT FIGHTER JET LIKE JF17 OR GRIPPEN CAN EASILY DESTROY L-15B IN A BVR FIGHT


Well, yes that is true but you are assuming it will be a fair 1v1 fight. There are many variables that go into A2A combat like AWACS, and detectability of L-15B.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Well, yes that is true but you are assuming it will be a fair 1v1 fight. There are many variables that go into A2A combat like AWACS, and detectability of L-15B.


At best L-15B IS A LIGHT SUPPORT JET ESPECIALLY FOR STRIKE/CAS ROLE ITS CAN'T BE COUNTRY'S MAIN AIR SUPERIORITY JET


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> At best L-15B IS A LIGHT SUPPORT JET ESPECIALLY FOR STRIKE/CAS ROLE ITS CAN'T BE COUNTRY'S MAIN AIR SUPERIORITY JET


Maybe for developing nations in Africa, and Asia. L-15B with SD-10 and EW jammer could have great potential at destroying enemy fighters who may not be equipped with modern jets.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Maybe for developing nations in Africa, and Asia. L-15B with SD-10 and EW jammer could have great potential at destroying enemy fighters who may not be equipped with modern jets.


Only for Africa and not much for Asia, and tell me how many countries in Asia that want to buy L-15B for their main jet


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> Only for Africa and not much for Asia, and tell me how many countries in Asia that want to buy L-15B for their main jet


Well, L-15 is an affordable LIFT with secondary combat capabilities(with SD-10) in conflict time so could be an addition to af complementing other fighters whereas usually LIFT would have to sit idle or be venerable.


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> Well, L-15 is an affordable LIFT with secondary combat capabilities(with SD-10) in conflict time so could be an addition to af complementing other fighters whereas usually LIFT would have to sit idle or be venerable.


Most countries in Asia has strong opponents which hinder L-15 use as their main fighter jet but fits African environment where opponent also weak

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## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> Most countries in Asia has strong opponents which hinder L-15 use as their main fighter jet but fits African environment where opponent also weak


As I said, what modifications would allow it to take on say a F-16?


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> As I said, what modifications would allow it to take on say a F-16?


not possible



Philip the Arab said:


> As I said, what modifications would allow it to take on say a F-16?


not possible


----------



## Philip the Arab

seven0seven said:


> not possible
> 
> 
> not possible


You got to back that up with evidence, why is it not possible?


----------



## Ultima Thule

Philip the Arab said:


> You got to back that up with evidence, why is it not possible?


Because it is trainer jet small compare to F-16, not much advance and long range avionics+radar it can carry and have less EW/ECM space as compare to F-16 Block 52 have AN/APG-68 V9 has range of 300 Km and L-15B Radar range is already quoted us

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## LKJ86

seven0seven said:


> THIS WORKS ONLY THAT OPPONENT JET HAS A SIMILAR CAPABILITIES LIKE L-15 HAVE, EVEN FOR LIGHT FIGHTER JET LIKE JF17 OR GRIPPEN CAN EASILY DESTROY L-15B IN A BVR FIGHT














Philip the Arab said:


> Can JL-9 carry SD-10?

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @当代海军 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10






















Via 央视军事 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## F-20 Tigershark

Can any members here tell me how capable FTC-2000G is at air to air combat with LKF601E, and if it will get the ability to fire later versions of PL-12, and PL-15?


----------



## Deino

F-20 Tigershark said:


> Can any members here tell me how capable FTC-2000G is at air to air combat with LKF601E, and if it will get the ability to fire later versions of PL-12, and PL-15?



Please do your homework ... the FTC-2000 is a low cost trainer/fighter ... so far there is none with that radar and if it will get the PL-12/15 depends on cost, the will to export these systems and if any country not better purchases then a true fighter.


----------



## LKJ86

Via 中国航空报

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## F-20 Tigershark

Deino said:


> Please do your homework ... the FTC-2000 is a low cost trainer/fighter ... so far there is none with that radar and if it will get the PL-12/15 depends on cost, the will to export these systems and if any country not better purchases then a true fighter.


It already carries SD-10, at least at Zhuhai airshow.

https://defense-update.com/20181106_lfk601e.html

The new radar uses high-efficiency air-cooling systems to support new and upgraded platforms such as the JF-17 and FTC-2000G ‘export fighters’ that do not facilitate water-cooling systems necessary for other AESA radars.




Even with CM-102 it can be a fairly potent platform for SEAD. So why would they use SD-10 on the display if it isn't being integrated?

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## Deino

F-20 Tigershark said:


> It already carries SD-10, at least at Zhuhai airshow.
> 
> https://defense-update.com/20181106_lfk601e.html
> 
> The new radar uses high-efficiency air-cooling systems to support new and upgraded platforms such as the JF-17 and FTC-2000G ‘export fighters’ that do not facilitate water-cooling systems necessary for other AESA radars.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even with CM-102 it can be a fairly potent platform for SEAD. So why would they use SD-10 on the display if it isn't being integrated?



Simply since it is only a PR stund. That particular aurcraft hasn't flown yet at that time - I was at Zhuhai myself - and also the second one with another radar flew only much later. So in essence noneof the shown weapons were intrgrated nor a radar equipped one flown.


----------



## F-20 Tigershark

Deino said:


> Simply since it is only a PR stund. That particular aurcraft hasn't flown yet at that time - I was at Zhuhai myself - and also the second one with another radar flew only much later. So in essence noneof the shown weapons were intrgrated nor a radar equipped one flown.


And they can all in theory be integrated if a customer orders the plane?


----------



## khanasifm

LKJ86 said:


> L-15
> View attachment 591047
> View attachment 591048
> 
> Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin



2 New hp/pylon so now jl-10 can carry ldp and a jammer plus a2a and a2g ordinance plus a tank of fuel in a single mission and be omni or multirole in same mission [emoji106]

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## F-20 Tigershark

khanasifm said:


> 2 New hp/pylon so now jl-10 can carry ldp and a jammer plus a2a and a2g ordinance plus a tank of fuel in a single mission and be omni or multirole in same mission [emoji106]


What kind of fighters can it handle in a2a combat?


----------



## Figaro

F-20 Tigershark said:


> What kind of fighters can it handle in a2a combat?


I thought the JL-10 was mainly a training aircraft ... not an air to air fighter. If I were to assume, probably only very light aircraft in combat.

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## F-20 Tigershark

Figaro said:


> I thought the JL-10 was mainly a training aircraft ... not an air to air fighter. If I were to assume, probably only very light aircraft in combat.


It can carry SD-10 BVRAAM, and assuming it is getting an AESA radar could probably take on older 4th gen fighters.

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## Figaro

F-20 Tigershark said:


> It can carry SD-10 BVRAAM, and assuming it is getting an AESA radar could probably take on older 4th gen fighters.


Interesting load out for such a light aircraft ... I'm thinking this is more of a budget export to nations that can't afford the JF-17.

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## F-20 Tigershark

Figaro said:


> Interesting load out for such a light aircraft ... I'm thinking this is more of a budget export to nations that can't afford the JF-17.


I like FTC-2000G more

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----------



## LKJ86

JL-10













Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H



















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## LKJ86

Via @CAN-MUGUA from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9



















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## nomi007

why chinese are using Hongdu Yakovlev CJ-7


----------



## LKJ86

Via @罗韬1515 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Deino

nomi007 said:


> why chinese are using Hongdu Yakovlev CJ-7



The question should better be: Is it still using it?

Reactions: Like Like:
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## lcloo

I don't think Hongdu Yakovlev CJ-7 has entered PLAAF service yet, the impression is that they will continue to use CJ-6, and also they are continuing making more new CJ-6 as well.

May be the CJ-7 project has been cancelled.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

CJ-6
January 12, 2020
















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-9H
January 10, 2020







Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via www.top81cn.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 1 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9 













Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9











Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

February 17, 2020













Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10



















Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H































Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6

























Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9 











































Via @央广军事 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

L-15




Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9
















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

L-15
















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6




Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

K-8




Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-9
> View attachment 608780
> View attachment 608781
> View attachment 608782
> View attachment 608783
> View attachment 608784
> View attachment 608785
> View attachment 608786
> View attachment 608787
> View attachment 608788
> View attachment 608789
> View attachment 608790
> View attachment 608791
> View attachment 608792
> View attachment 608793
> 
> Via @央广军事 from Weixin




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1232725405225955330


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H

























Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6

















Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

K-8
February 26, 2020



















Via @航空工业 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @耿直的鲁斯兰 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G













Via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9










Via navy.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @DS_T黑黑T from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10







Via @白龙_龙腾四海 from Weibo


----------



## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> View attachment 613305
> View attachment 613306
> 
> Via @白龙_龙腾四海 from Weibo



Any chance that the L-15B with afterburning engines will enter service with the PLAAF/PLANAF?


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1238724081773694976


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9





























Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H




Via @万全 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## dilpakistani

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G
> View attachment 610547
> View attachment 610548
> View attachment 610549
> View attachment 610550
> 
> Via @航空新视野-赤卫 from Weibo


nika jf-17


----------



## Deino

dilpakistani said:


> nika jf-17




Ähhhm NO, clearly a JL-9!


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6






















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## lcloo

*China's JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet to be modified for aircraft carrier operation: reports*
Global Times
Chen Lufan
2020-03-18 17:45:38


_Two JL-9 jet trainers attached to an aviation regiment under the PLA Navy take off in echelon formation during a flight training course on February 22, 2020. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei) _

The naval version of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet is being modified to enable it to train aircraft carrier jet pilots on an actual aircraft carrier at a time when China is in urgent need of training more aircraft carrier jet pilots, as its second carrier was just commissioned last year, reports said on Tuesday.

Multiple promotional materials released by JL-9's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), involved the JL-9 and an aircraft carrier operating together in edited pictures, leading to speculation that the JL-9 could eventually be modified into a carrier-based jet trainer, reported Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, on Tuesday.

The report came after the Guizhou company released a statement on Monday, saying it is determined to "win a new victory in developing and producing the naval version of the Mountain Eagle."

The statement came with a picture of an aircraft carrier sailing in the sea, with a picture of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle edited onto it, flying above the carrier.

Having been already delivered to the Chinese Navy, the naval version of the JL-9 is now training aircraft carrier jet pilots on land-based airfields, but China still does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer aircraft that can take off and land on an actual carrier, Weihutang reported.

With China's second aircraft carrier, the Shandong, joining Chinese naval service in December 2019, China needs to train more pilots more efficiently, and a trainer aircraft that can operate on a carrier rather than a simulated airfield can contribute a great deal to this aim, analysts said.

Having the JL-9 fly on a carrier might require major modifications in aspects including the airframe structure and engine, Weihutang said.

A powerful competitor to the single-engined JL-9 Mountain Eagle is the twin-engined JL-10 Falcon, which has a more advanced avionics system and better aerodynamic performance, the report said. But the JL-10 advanced trainer jet, developed by AVIC Hongdu Aviation Industry Group, is more expensive, analysts said.

The JL-10, although not yet modified for aircraft carrier operations, is also in active service, according to publicly available reports.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

lcloo said:


> *China's JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet to be modified for aircraft carrier operation: reports*
> Global Times
> Chen Lufan
> 2020-03-18 17:45:38
> 
> 
> _Two JL-9 jet trainers attached to an aviation regiment under the PLA Navy take off in echelon formation during a flight training course on February 22, 2020. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei) _
> 
> The naval version of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet is being modified to enable it to train aircraft carrier jet pilots on an actual aircraft carrier at a time when China is in urgent need of training more aircraft carrier jet pilots, as its second carrier was just commissioned last year, reports said on Tuesday.
> 
> Multiple promotional materials released by JL-9's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), involved the JL-9 and an aircraft carrier operating together in edited pictures, leading to speculation that the JL-9 could eventually be modified into a carrier-based jet trainer, reported Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, on Tuesday.
> 
> The report came after the Guizhou company released a statement on Monday, saying it is determined to "win a new victory in developing and producing the naval version of the Mountain Eagle."
> 
> The statement came with a picture of an aircraft carrier sailing in the sea, with a picture of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle edited onto it, flying above the carrier.
> 
> Having been already delivered to the Chinese Navy, the naval version of the JL-9 is now training aircraft carrier jet pilots on land-based airfields, but China still does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer aircraft that can take off and land on an actual carrier, Weihutang reported.
> 
> With China's second aircraft carrier, the Shandong, joining Chinese naval service in December 2019, China needs to train more pilots more efficiently, and a trainer aircraft that can operate on a carrier rather than a simulated airfield can contribute a great deal to this aim, analysts said.
> 
> Having the JL-9 fly on a carrier might require major modifications in aspects including the airframe structure and engine, Weihutang said.
> 
> A powerful competitor to the single-engined JL-9 Mountain Eagle is the twin-engined JL-10 Falcon, which has a more advanced avionics system and better aerodynamic performance, the report said. But the JL-10 advanced trainer jet, developed by AVIC Hongdu Aviation Industry Group, is more expensive, analysts said.
> 
> The JL-10, although not yet modified for aircraft carrier operations, is also in active service, according to publicly available reports.




But how likely is this? AFAIK the original carrier capable JL-9 failed due to structural issues and there are also reports that Hongdu has a carrier variant called JL-10J already?


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1241103855972220928

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1241288072022700032


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6






















Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

By the way, any news regarding the rumored carrier-capable JL-10 variant?


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9














Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H







Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9































Via @央广军事 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9




























Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H

























Via @人民海军 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10






















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

K-8










Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> K-8
> View attachment 619094
> View attachment 619095
> View attachment 619096
> 
> Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin




Are they still in production?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Are they still in production?


Yes

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9




























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9G






















Via navy.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via 江西卫视 and @沉默的山羊 fom Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1247423866907099141

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10
April 7, 2020
















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H














































Via navy.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9













Via @央广军事 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via 解放军报

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9































Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via @万全 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> But how likely is this? AFAIK the original carrier capable JL-9 failed due to structural issues and there are also reports that Hongdu has a carrier variant called JL-10J already?


"海山鹰" 






















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> JL-10
> View attachment 623804
> 
> Via 解放军报






















Via www.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

lcloo said:


> *China's JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet to be modified for aircraft carrier operation: reports*
> Global Times
> Chen Lufan
> 2020-03-18 17:45:38
> 
> 
> _Two JL-9 jet trainers attached to an aviation regiment under the PLA Navy take off in echelon formation during a flight training course on February 22, 2020. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei) _
> 
> The naval version of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle trainer jet is being modified to enable it to train aircraft carrier jet pilots on an actual aircraft carrier at a time when China is in urgent need of training more aircraft carrier jet pilots, as its second carrier was just commissioned last year, reports said on Tuesday.
> 
> Multiple promotional materials released by JL-9's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), involved the JL-9 and an aircraft carrier operating together in edited pictures, leading to speculation that the JL-9 could eventually be modified into a carrier-based jet trainer, reported Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, on Tuesday.
> 
> The report came after the Guizhou company released a statement on Monday, saying it is determined to "win a new victory in developing and producing the naval version of the Mountain Eagle."
> 
> The statement came with a picture of an aircraft carrier sailing in the sea, with a picture of the JL-9 Mountain Eagle edited onto it, flying above the carrier.
> 
> Having been already delivered to the Chinese Navy, the naval version of the JL-9 is now training aircraft carrier jet pilots on land-based airfields, but China still does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer aircraft that can take off and land on an actual carrier, Weihutang reported.
> 
> With China's second aircraft carrier, the Shandong, joining Chinese naval service in December 2019, China needs to train more pilots more efficiently, and a trainer aircraft that can operate on a carrier rather than a simulated airfield can contribute a great deal to this aim, analysts said.
> 
> Having the JL-9 fly on a carrier might require major modifications in aspects including the airframe structure and engine, Weihutang said.
> 
> A powerful competitor to the single-engined JL-9 Mountain Eagle is the twin-engined JL-10 Falcon, which has a more advanced avionics system and better aerodynamic performance, the report said. But the JL-10 advanced trainer jet, developed by AVIC Hongdu Aviation Industry Group, is more expensive, analysts said.
> 
> The JL-10, although not yet modified for aircraft carrier operations, is also in active service, according to publicly available reports.





LKJ86 said:


> "海山鹰"
> View attachment 624406
> View attachment 624407
> View attachment 624408
> View attachment 624409
> View attachment 624410
> View attachment 624411
> View attachment 624412
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 625434
> 
> 
> View attachment 625435
> View attachment 625436
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin




So this is supposed to be the first truly carrier-capable Mountain Eagle?


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> So this is supposed to be the first truly carrier-capable Mountain Eagle?


Yes


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Yes



Great 

Can you already spot a detail which shows differences?

This part seems to be this small grill/outlet under the wings?!


----------



## Ultima Thule

Deino said:


> Great
> 
> Can you already spot a detail which shows differences?
> 
> This part seems to be this small intake under the wings?!
> 
> View attachment 625509


I think its not like a intake to me but more like a sensor window or something sir


----------



## Deino

seven0seven said:


> I think its not like a intake to me but more like a sensor window or something sir




I don't think so ...

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Ultima Thule

Deino said:


> I don't think so ...
> 
> View attachment 625522


Now i agree with you sir its clearly a some kind of secondary intake

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## lcloo

This news is on coming maiden flight of aircraft carrier based trainer jet.

*China's modified trainer jet prototype ready for maiden flight*
Source Global Times
Editor Huang Panyue
2020-04-22 08:22:59


A JL-9 fighter trainer attached to the PLA Naval Aviation University taxis on the runway after finishing flight training in Hebei province. Cadets assigned to the regiment conduct flight training subjects including instrument flight, low-altitude aerobatics and formation flying. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei)


*The prototype of the newly modified version of the Naval Mountain Eagle trainer jet is now preparing for its maiden flight* after its production was completed on Sunday, the aircraft's maker announced on Monday. This type of aircraft is expected *to serve as an aircraft carrier-based trainer,* which China is in desperate need to train more aircraft carrier-based fighter jet pilots, analysts said on Tuesday.

Under the full support of military representatives, the prototype in the Naval Mountain Eagle project was delivered on Sunday evening, marking a milestone in the project, and the aircraft is on the way to make its first flight according to schedule, read a statement the aircraft's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), released on its WeChat account on Monday.

While the Guizhou company did not elaborate on the project, it said in a separate statement in March that the goal was to "win a new victory in developing and producing the Naval Mountain Eagle," and the statement came with a picture showing an aircraft carrier at sea, with a Naval Mountain Eagle flying above the carrier and J-15 fighter jets parked on the carrier's flight deck.

This had led Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, to say in March that this project is likely a modification of the original Naval Mountain Eagle, enabling it to become an aircraft carrier-based trainer.

*The Naval Mountain Eagle trainer, designated as the JL-9*, is already in service with the Chinese PLA Navy. It can only operate on land-based airfields and simulate aircraft carrier operations.

China does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer jet to train fighter pilots and have to first train them on a land-based trainer, then switch directly to the actual J-15 fighter jet, a military expert who requested anonymity told the Global Times on Monday.

Developing a carrier-based trainer will help China train carrier-based fighter pilots more efficiently at a time when China is building more aircraft carriers and having more carrier-based fighter jets, the expert said.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

lcloo said:


> This news is on coming maiden flight of aircraft carrier based trainer jet.
> 
> *China's modified trainer jet prototype ready for maiden flight*
> Source Global Times
> Editor Huang Panyue
> 2020-04-22 08:22:59
> 
> 
> A JL-9 fighter trainer attached to the PLA Naval Aviation University taxis on the runway after finishing flight training in Hebei province. Cadets assigned to the regiment conduct flight training subjects including instrument flight, low-altitude aerobatics and formation flying. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei)
> 
> 
> *The prototype of the newly modified version of the Naval Mountain Eagle trainer jet is now preparing for its maiden flight* after its production was completed on Sunday, the aircraft's maker announced on Monday. This type of aircraft is expected *to serve as an aircraft carrier-based trainer,* which China is in desperate need to train more aircraft carrier-based fighter jet pilots, analysts said on Tuesday.
> 
> Under the full support of military representatives, the prototype in the Naval Mountain Eagle project was delivered on Sunday evening, marking a milestone in the project, and the aircraft is on the way to make its first flight according to schedule, read a statement the aircraft's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), released on its WeChat account on Monday.
> 
> While the Guizhou company did not elaborate on the project, it said in a separate statement in March that the goal was to "win a new victory in developing and producing the Naval Mountain Eagle," and the statement came with a picture showing an aircraft carrier at sea, with a Naval Mountain Eagle flying above the carrier and J-15 fighter jets parked on the carrier's flight deck.
> 
> This had led Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, to say in March that this project is likely a modification of the original Naval Mountain Eagle, enabling it to become an aircraft carrier-based trainer.
> 
> *The Naval Mountain Eagle trainer, designated as the JL-9*, is already in service with the Chinese PLA Navy. It can only operate on land-based airfields and simulate aircraft carrier operations.
> 
> China does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer jet to train fighter pilots and have to first train them on a land-based trainer, then switch directly to the actual J-15 fighter jet, a military expert who requested anonymity told the Global Times on Monday.
> 
> Developing a carrier-based trainer will help China train carrier-based fighter pilots more efficiently at a time when China is building more aircraft carriers and having more carrier-based fighter jets, the expert said.







Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 626076
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin



Could you please provide at least an English summary? Did it already fly? When will it fly ....


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Could you please provide at least an English summary? Did it already fly? When will it fly ....


The first one has been handed over to flight test station on April 19, 2020, and the maiden flight would be coming very soon.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> The first one has been handed over to flight test station on April 19, 2020, and the maiden flight would be coming very soon.




Thanks my friend ... always highly appreciated.


----------



## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> The first one has been handed over to flight test station on April 19, 2020, and the maiden flight would be coming very soon.



So there could be potentially two carrier-based aircraft making their first flights this year: JL-9X and J-35.


----------



## Deino

Akasa said:


> So there could be potentially two carrier-based aircraft making their first flights this year: JL-9X and J-35.




And I was always hoping for a carrier-variant of the JL-10! 

Wasn't there already a report about a variant called JL-10J? ... was it a hoax, a rumor only or is it delayed?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## LKJ86

Via 中国航空报

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10










Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10
April 27, 2020



















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> JL-9G
> View attachment 628231
> View attachment 628232
> View attachment 628233
> View attachment 628234
> View attachment 628235
> View attachment 628236
> 
> Via @军报记者 from Weibo




No images visible!


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9G



















Via @军报记者 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
4


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
4


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255857728217628673

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10


































Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9







Via kj.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 630138
> View attachment 630139
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin




The new carrier capable variant?


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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1258296951801614337


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

JL-10













Via www.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

lcloo said:


> This news is on coming maiden flight of aircraft carrier based trainer jet.
> 
> *China's modified trainer jet prototype ready for maiden flight*
> Source Global Times
> Editor Huang Panyue
> 2020-04-22 08:22:59
> 
> 
> A JL-9 fighter trainer attached to the PLA Naval Aviation University taxis on the runway after finishing flight training in Hebei province. Cadets assigned to the regiment conduct flight training subjects including instrument flight, low-altitude aerobatics and formation flying. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Lan Pengfei)
> 
> 
> *The prototype of the newly modified version of the Naval Mountain Eagle trainer jet is now preparing for its maiden flight* after its production was completed on Sunday, the aircraft's maker announced on Monday. This type of aircraft is expected *to serve as an aircraft carrier-based trainer,* which China is in desperate need to train more aircraft carrier-based fighter jet pilots, analysts said on Tuesday.
> 
> Under the full support of military representatives, the prototype in the Naval Mountain Eagle project was delivered on Sunday evening, marking a milestone in the project, and the aircraft is on the way to make its first flight according to schedule, read a statement the aircraft's developer, Guizhou Aviation Industry Corporation under the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC), released on its WeChat account on Monday.
> 
> While the Guizhou company did not elaborate on the project, it said in a separate statement in March that the goal was to "win a new victory in developing and producing the Naval Mountain Eagle," and the statement came with a picture showing an aircraft carrier at sea, with a Naval Mountain Eagle flying above the carrier and J-15 fighter jets parked on the carrier's flight deck.
> 
> This had led Weihutang, a column on military affairs affiliated with China Central Television, to say in March that this project is likely a modification of the original Naval Mountain Eagle, enabling it to become an aircraft carrier-based trainer.
> 
> *The Naval Mountain Eagle trainer, designated as the JL-9*, is already in service with the Chinese PLA Navy. It can only operate on land-based airfields and simulate aircraft carrier operations.
> 
> China does not have an aircraft carrier-based trainer jet to train fighter pilots and have to first train them on a land-based trainer, then switch directly to the actual J-15 fighter jet, a military expert who requested anonymity told the Global Times on Monday.
> 
> Developing a carrier-based trainer will help China train carrier-based fighter pilots more efficiently at a time when China is building more aircraft carriers and having more carrier-based fighter jets, the expert said.



It has made its maiden flight on May 12, 2020. No tailhook...










Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1260505441026662401

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## Armchair

Seems like redesigned to have similar flight characteristics to the J-15.


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## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6
May 13, 2020







Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H

























Via @CNR国防时空 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6










Via @万全 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @万全 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via @万全 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @ 海军航空大学 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

JL-10







Via @万全 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




























Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10







Via @空军在线 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

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## LKJ86

JL-9G

























Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

JL-10





































Via @航空工业 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

CJ-6

























Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10

























Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H






















Via @人民海军 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9



















Via @ 贵飞公司 from Weixin


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## Deino

Just a question ... Huitong updated his site with a JL-9 numbered "78542", but this would correspond to the 173rd Air Brigade (a unit I don't know) 

So is it not more likely 3542 esp since that image is a bit cropped which would then IMO much better fit to the Xi'an Flying Academy and the 4th Training Brigade at Wuwei which might have received JL-9 in addition or replacing the JL-8??

http://chinese-military-aviation.blogspot.com/p/trainers.html#JL-9 
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-eMjRjPaQ...JsaTa4m1LQqznKsMACPcBGAsYHg/s1600/JL-9_52.jpg


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9



















Via kj.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10










Via @航空工业 from Weixin

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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

JL-10










Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86




----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1283275137647869952


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9H




























Via @央广军事 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10
















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9

























Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10


----------



## JSCh

*First pilot cadets from Chinese advanced trainer jet program graduate with high scores*
Source: Global Times Published: 2020/7/23 23:38:07



China’s basic trainer aircraft CJ-6, intermediate trainer jet K-8 and advanced training and light combat aircraft L-15 jointly put on a flight performance for the first time at Nanchang Flight Convention in East China's Jiangxi Province on November 2. Photo: IC

The first batch of People’s Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force pilot cadets trained on the JL-10 advanced trainer jet program recently graduated with high scores.

The JL-10, a domestically developed new generation advanced training aircraft, shortened the training of pilot cadets and accelerates the advent of a new generation of combat capable pilots for the PLA Air Force, China Central Television (CCTV) reported on Wednesday.

Following their graduation from the PLA Air Force’s Shijiazhuang Flight Academy, the new pilots were deployed to combat units, and after gaining experience with other combat aircraft there, they will start joining exercises, the report said, noting that the cadets should seamlessly adapt to other fighter jets in combat units thanks to the JL-10 trainer.

The PLA Air Force operates third generation fighter jets like the J-10, J-11 and J-16. It also has a type of fourth generation fighter jet, the J-20.

After studying at the academy for a year, the pilot cadets completed all training programs, including solo flights, nighttime aviation, weapon deployment, tactical formation flying and air combat.

The JL-10 training program has helped the Air Force to add fighter jet introduction training to advanced training program, and broadened the training approach to develop new pilot talent, the report said.

In this new training model, the trainees focus more on tactical training, air combat and free operation, emphasizing the development of tactical awareness with enhanced difficulty and intensity in weapons trainings.

Compared to previous cadets, the graduating cadets who trained on the JL-10 used twice as many munitions, according to the report.

The PLA Air Force previously used basic trainer aircraft CJ-6, intermediate trainer jet K-8 to train pilot cadets, military observers noted.

Known as the L-15 for its export model, the JL-10 is a newly developed training and light combat aircraft that uses advanced technology, including an advanced aerodynamic design, a fly-by-wire control system, and an open avionics structure.

It is equipped with many advanced technologies that other Chinese trainers, like the K-8, do not have, analysts said.

China will train more pilots with advanced aircraft, as more fighter jets are being commissioned by the Air Force, experts said.


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## LKJ86

JL-9H

























Via www.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

CJ-6































Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @哈飞院 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @哈飞院 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

*China’s Hongying aerobatic team performs to mark the Qixi Festival*


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

By 天一


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6







Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1307636596754317313


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9G








Via 央广新闻 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## lcloo

Deino said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1307636596754317313


Could be the first shipboard arrest landing trial of JL-9GJ, "J" normally indicate the aircraft is based on a ship (Huitong's remark refers).

Example of suffix "J" letter designation is Z-8J. "J" is for Jian or 舰 ship in Chinese. JL-9GJ is the latest variant the gained much publicity a few months ago, though no photo of one with arrester hood was shown.

Navy aircraft that is not based onboard a ship normally gets an "H" or "Hai" for Sea or Navy (Haijun) in Chinese. Ex J11BH. They are not given the "J" suffix.

This is not a strict ruling that the PLAN is adhering to, as can be seen on J15, Z9C/D and H6J. However in JL-9's case, this suffix has some significance to it.


----------



## LKJ86

Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1311916343101476864


----------



## DANGER-ZONE

Does anyone have HD video of JL-9G / FTC-2000 air display from Zhuhai Airshow 2018?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @哈飞院 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

JL-10




























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 677882
> View attachment 677883
> 
> Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10




Via @哈飞院 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

CJ-6



















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9

























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

L-15




























Via @哈库纳玛塔塔_Sit from Weibo

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## LKJ86

L-15




Via @万全 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

L-15










Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @feel的小步舞曲 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

CJ-6



















Via @航咖V from Weibo

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> CJ-6
> View attachment 684706
> View attachment 684708
> View attachment 684709
> View attachment 684710
> View attachment 684714
> View attachment 684715
> 
> Via @航咖V from Weibo


CJ-6










Via @航空物语 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

JL-8




























Via @央视军事 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## Akasa

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 687784
> View attachment 687785
> View attachment 687786
> View attachment 687787
> View attachment 687788
> View attachment 687789
> View attachment 687790
> View attachment 687791
> 
> Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo



What does the report say, that the L-15B is being produced for the PLAAF?


----------



## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> JL-8
> View attachment 687546
> View attachment 687547
> View attachment 687548
> View attachment 687549
> View attachment 687550
> View attachment 687551
> View attachment 687552
> View attachment 687553
> View attachment 687554
> 
> Via @央视军事 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G







Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

JL-10































Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-9H

























Via www.81.cn

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## LKJ86

JL-10













Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10













Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

January 5, 2021






































































Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-9
















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

JL-9



















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-10




Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## sahureka2

thanks, nice photo





do you think it would be commercially interesting to make a single-seater version?
a supersonic aircraft whose price may be relatively low could attract nations with low spending budgets
my photoshop


----------



## LKJ86

JL-9


----------



## LKJ86

L-15

























Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10 and JL-9

























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

FTC-2000G













Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G
> View attachment 718991
> View attachment 718992
> View attachment 718993
> View attachment 718994
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin




Aren't these old images from the maiden flight?


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10


























Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G













Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
3


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## Polestar 2

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G
> View attachment 719974
> View attachment 719975
> View attachment 719976
> View attachment 719977
> 
> Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


the FTC-2000G order by a southeast asia countries? they ready to be delivered soon, I guess...

i have a feeling, it might not be cambodia AF.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

FTC-2000G
















Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> FTC-2000G
> View attachment 720585
> View attachment 720586
> View attachment 720587
> View attachment 720588
> View attachment 720589
> 
> Via @贵飞公司 from Weixin and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


Source:https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/ozJXkV96SBKreu2P6eeaBg

Reactions: Like Like:
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## lcloo

Polestar 2 said:


> the FTC-2000G order by a southeast asia countries? they ready to be delivered soon, I guess...
> 
> *i have a feeling, it might not be cambodia AF.*


Vietnam? Definitely not.
Philippines? No, they bought Korean TA-50
Indonesia? No, they bought Korean T-50
Thailand? No, they bought T-50
Singapore? No, they bought M-346
Malaysia? No, the related purchase has been postponed. Contract tender has not yet begun.
Myanmar? No, they bought YAK-130
Laos? No, they bought YAK-130.
Brunei? Very unlikely.
Cambodia? The most pro-China ASEAN member. And the only South East Asian country that has not yet inducted an advance trainer/light fighter jet.

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## Polestar 2

JL-9G is a fourth gen fighter/trainer.. Using many composite on its fuselage, high angle of attack. It can used to train on many situation of stalling. A dangerous training subject used to avoid by AF.


----------



## Deino

Polestar 2 said:


> JL-9G is a fourth gen fighter/trainer.. Using many composite on its fuselage, high angle of attack. It can used to train on many situation of stalling. A dangerous training subject used to avoid by AF.




Come on ... it is a cheap and simple trainer, based on a dated design. Surely not a fourth generation fighter-like trainer!


----------



## Polestar 2

Deino said:


> Come on ... it is a cheap and simple trainer, based on a dated design. Surely not a fourth generation fighter-like trainer!


I dont think you can called a fighter fitted with high level of composite, single structural fuselage, DSI inlet, 3 large LCD glass cockpit fitted with advanced Doppler pulse radar and fourth gen avionics that is capable of BVR, multi role fighter like JL-9G as simple trainer.

Reactions: Haha Haha:
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## Deino

Polestar 2 said:


> I dont think you can called a fighter fitted with high level of composite, single structural fuselage, DSI inlet, 3 large LCD glass cockpit fitted with advanced Doppler pulse radar and fourth gen avionics that is capable of BVR, multi role fighter like JL-9G as simple trainer.




Please!

Put a modern small radar in it, replace some certain parts of the fuselage with composite and that makes a regular F-5E Tiger to be a "fourth generation fighter"??  

It's nothing but a pimped up old design using an old structure and even more a dated engine. It is never ever comparable to true "fourth generation fighters" like the J-10, F-16 or whatever.


----------



## Polestar 2

Deino said:


> Please!
> 
> Put a modern small radar in it, replace some certain parts of the fuselage with composite and that makes a regular F-5E Tiger to be a "fourth generation fighter"??
> 
> It's nothing but a pimped up old design using an old structure and even more a dated engine. It is never ever comparable to true "fourth generation fighters" like the J-10, F-16 or whatever.


F-5E is basically an old design without much changes compare to F-5A freedom fighter. The layout are very similar.

But JL-9G has many major changes compare to even J-7PG. It is capable of many performance which F-5EII cannot perform. It's aerodynamic is fourth gen and a big reason why it is close as advance trainer for China fourth gen fighter pilots.


----------



## Polestar 2

China’s L-15 Falcon: Cut-rate warfare on a budget


Let’s face it, you’re not the Pentagon, and you never will be. You’re a small developing country, but you have military needs — an efficient and affordable air force, to provide national security a…




asiatimes.com


----------



## ozranger

Polestar 2 said:


> I dont think you can called a fighter fitted with high level of composite, single structural fuselage, DSI inlet, 3 large LCD glass cockpit fitted with advanced Doppler pulse radar and fourth gen avionics that is capable of BVR, multi role fighter like JL-9G as simple trainer.


It doesn't seem to be having a lot of composite materials on the fuselage though. It is even more unlikely when the customers are Cambodia or alike as those countries simply can't afford the cost.

The spec of the plane has also been drastically changed to only having a maximum speed Mach 1.2, while J-7 II can fly over Mach 2. This plane literally can neither intercept nor dog fight now, although it becomes much easier for inexperienced pilots to fly, especially for training purpose. It works a lot better than J-7 on patrol missions too. Obviously training or patrol tasks don't require extensive use of composite materials.

The avionics looks to be very modern but I think they can make the cost low enough on it for a country like Cambodia just because the supply chains in China really allow them to quickly source many out of shelf products instead of redeveloping a new set of those on their own.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-10



















Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-9






















Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

JL-9G

















































Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

JL-9

























Via @空军新闻 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @CAN-MUGUA from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @市民贾先生 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

WOW

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> WOW

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

JL-10

























Via www.81.cn

Reactions: Like Like:
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## lcloo

Two L-15 are in Dubai for air show.


----------



## siegecrossbow

lcloo said:


> Two L-15 are in Dubai for air show.
> 
> View attachment 793026
> View attachment 793027
> View attachment 793028
> View attachment 793029
> View attachment 793030
> View attachment 793031



Last picture made me LOL. Falcon and Falcon.


----------



## Polestar 2

lcloo said:


> Two L-15 are in Dubai for air show.
> 
> View attachment 793026
> View attachment 793027
> View attachment 793028
> View attachment 793029
> View attachment 793030
> View attachment 793031


Are those the one fitted with after burner?


----------



## lcloo

Polestar 2 said:


> Are those the one fitted with after burner?


From the solid color on the engine exhaust, I would say no. This variant is L-15AW. I believe only L-15B has afterburner engine.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## johncliu88

Just wonder if the L-15's are still using the imported engines, or already using self-made version.


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## luciferdd




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## siegecrossbow

johncliu88 said:


> Just wonder if the L-15's are still using the imported engines, or already using self-made version.



Still using Ukranian engines.


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## johncliu88

siegecrossbow said:


> Still using Ukranian engines.


Thanks for the information. Hopefully we will see Chinese made more powerful engines for this plane, then it will be able to carry heavier loads for battle.


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## lcloo

L-15AW and its glass cockpit.

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## world of power

johncliu88 said:


> Just wonder if the L-15's are still using the imported engines, or already using self-made version.





siegecrossbow said:


> Still using Ukranian engines.





johncliu88 said:


> Thanks for the information. Hopefully we will see Chinese made more powerful engines for this plane, then it will be able to carry heavier loads for battle.


so far china NOT seems to develop its domestic engine for JL10, which first fly in 2006;; although JL10 deployed in china since 2010, only dozens in service now;; such low turbofan engine is NOT technically difficult to develop but requires much costs especially when it needs only small number;; so china chose to import it from ukraine for costs;; I guess it's NOT necessary for a certain country to domesticate all of massive arms industry;; even US imports arms from others

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## lcloo

world of power said:


> so far china NOT seems to develop its domestic engine for JL10, which first fly in 2006;; although JL10 deployed in china since 2010, only dozens in service now;; such low turbofan engine is NOT technically difficult to develop but requires much costs especially when it needs only small number;; so china chose to import it from ukraine for costs;; I guess it's NOT necessary for a certain country to domesticate all of massive arms industry;; even US imports arms from others


I won't put the inservice figure at only dozens. There are 5 prototypes and 139 serial production aircrafts as per Chinese wikipedia.

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## Polestar 2

I highly doubt China still rely 100% on Ukraine for L-15 engine import. This aircraft has officially enter full serial production, meaning large number of them need to enter service. China usually are sceptical of need to import foreign engine especially for military related products. They wouldn't mass produced something unless they have full control over it.

We all know the dirt situation of Ukraine and many missed date line or delay due to ongoing economy hardship and civil war. The Royal Thai Army failure to deliver on time for their Oplot tank is great true reflection of current industry situation of Ukraine.

I am sure China has already master a huge portion of engine parts require for L-15 or limited production of the engine.

Ukraine owe China lots of money. They surely has no means to return even a single cent. Asking them to repay in terms of export good is the only choice.


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## johncliu88

Polestar 2 said:


> I highly doubt China still rely 100% on Ukraine for L-15 engine import. This aircraft has officially enter full serial production, meaning large number of them need to enter service. China usually are sceptical of need to import foreign engine especially for military related products. They wouldn't mass produced something unless they have full control over it.
> 
> We all know the dirt situation of Ukraine and many missed date line or delay due to ongoing economy hardship and civil war. The Royal Thai Army failure to deliver on time for their Oplot tank is great true reflection of current industry situation of Ukraine.
> 
> I am sure China has already master a huge portion of engine parts require for L-15 or limited production of the engine.
> 
> Ukraine owe China lots of money. They surely has no means to return even a single cent. Asking them to repay in terms of export good is the only choice.


I am expecting the same thing since the relationship between Ukraine & China is not that good due to the Ukraine government falls onto US or NATO. There must be a backup plan to the small engines used on this platform. Also, don't know if China needs Ukraine's permission to sell this plane to third country just like China needed Russia to give permission to sell JF-17 to Pakistan due the the use of Russia engine.
Just wonder why the intakes are not changed to DSI type. Maybe there will not be increase of performance?


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## Trailer23

__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=3373933299398122



@siegecrossbow @IblinI @vi-va @Beast @beijingwalker @Shotgunner51 @nang2 @JSCh @LKJ86 @Deino

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## Polestar 2

johncliu88 said:


> Just wonder why the intakes are not changed to DSI type. Maybe there will not be increase of performance?


To save cost? 

By the way, regarding the export. Ukraine has no restriction for re export unless clash of interest but since Ukraine industry has no similar product. Zero chance of Ukraine veto any re export unless export to Russia.

There are rumours of Ukraine Air Force order the L-15 but not after the r/s with Russia sour. China of course will not want to strain Sino- Russia r/s by selling arms to Ukraine.


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## Polestar 2

lcloo said:


> From the solid color on the engine exhaust, I would say no. This variant is L-15AW. I believe only L-15B has afterburner engine.


Ok, to answer my own inquiry. Yes, its the afterburner version. Right from the horse mouth! 






4:45mins onwards if you can understand Chinese.


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## Deino

Polestar 2 said:


> Ok, to answer my own inquiry. Yes, its the afterburner version. Right from the horse mouth!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4:45mins onwards if you can understand Chinese.



No, the L-15AW does not use the AB-version regardless what he claims and this is well known and can easily be seen: As such, there is no need to understand Chinese, but simply to read what you see properly. 







L-15AW has claerly the non-afterburner engines

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## Polestar 2

Deino said:


> No, the L-15AW does not use the AB-version regardless what he claims and this is well known and can easily be seen: As such, there is no need to understand Chinese, but simply to read what you see properly.
> 
> View attachment 797343
> 
> 
> L-15AW has claerly the non-afterburner engines
> 
> View attachment 797344


It seems to me that is the reverse. The one with ceramic petal are afterburner version while the one with traditional dark charcoal petal are non afterburner version.

Why would Hongdu bring an non afterburner version to Dubai Air show for flying demo? They try hard not to win any deal and waste time, is it?


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## Deino

Polestar 2 said:


> It seems to me that is the reverse. The one with ceramic petal are afterburner version while the one with traditional dark charcoal petal are non afterburner version.
> 
> Why would Hongdu bring an non afterburner version to Dubai Air show for flying demo? They try hard not to win any deal and waste time, is it?




Simply since the non-afterburning version is the currently built one, the one that is in service since years and at least IMO the only one available. Not sure what this alleged expert noted, but there is nothing to debate or reverse regardless you like it or not. NO currently in service including the L-15AZ have an afterburning engine.

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## Shotgunner51

L-15AW





Credit: East Pendulum

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via http://www.mod.gov.cn/power/2022-04/06/content_4908403.htm

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## LKJ86



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## johncliu88

Did UAE order some of the L-15s? If so, which version, the ones with afterburner?


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## LKJ86

JL-10



















Via 空军在线

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 835079
> 
> Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin




For a brief moment I had hope it could be the alleged / suspected carrier capable one with the new green tail.


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## LKJ86

Via @中国军视网 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-04/02/content_10145570.htm

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## LKJ86

Via @军事报道 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weibo

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## johncliu88

No more Ukrainian engines for L-15. Did China stock enough earlier?


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## Deino

So far the most detailed image of a model showing the carrier capable JL-10J (?).

Most noticeable detail besides the tail-hook is a twin-wheel front landing gear and a catapult launch bar. 

(Image via 解放軍評論團 / FB)

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## LKJ86

Via @国防时报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @中国军号 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @学习军团 from Weibo

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## air marshal



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## LKJ86

Via @苏两栖dearwux from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @前站起飞 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @空军在线 from Weixin

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## LKJ86




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## air marshal



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## LKJ86

Via 江西卫视 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weibo

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via http://www.plapic.com.cn/pub/2022-10/20/content_10193881.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/bz/2022-11/08/content_10197849.htm

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## LKJ86

JL-10










Via http://www.81.cn/jx/2022-12/06/content_10203465.htm

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业洪都 from Weixin

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