# Pakistan Charges Hafiz Saeed With Terror Financing



## :::warrior:::

Jamaat-ud-Dawa getting banned?


----------



## Jackdaws

Pakistani authorities on Wednesday booked 26/11 Mumbai attacks mastermind Hafiz Saeed and his 12 accomplices for "terrorism financing" in 23 cases, amidst growing international pressure on Islamabad to act against militant groups.

Pakistan counter-terrorism department said it has registered 23 cases against the chief of the Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD) and 12 aides for using five trusts to "raise funds for terrorism financing".

The Counter-Terrorism Department (CTD) of Pakistan's Punjab province filed cases against Jamat-ud-Dawa (JUD) chief Hafiz Saeed and other members of his organisation. This comes after Punjab CTD launched second phase of crackdown against banned outfits, operating in the Punjab province.

The cases have been registered under the Anti-Terrorism Act (ATA). The charity organisations listed in the cases are:

1. Dawat Irshad Trust
2. Moaz Bin Jabal Trust
3. Al-Anfaal Trust
4. Al-Madina Foudation Trust
5. Al-Hamd Trust

The organisations have been operating in major cities including Lahore, Gujranwala and Multan. At least four main members of Jamat-ud-Dawa (JUD) have been nominated in the cases including:

1. Hafiz Mohammad Saeed
2. Abdul Rehman Makki (brother-in-law of Hafiz Saeed)
3. Ameer Hamza
4. Mohammad Yahya Aziz

Details of the cases reveal that these individuals have been involved in raising funds to facilitate terror activities.

Operating under the umbrella of charities, these organisations have been funneling funds to terror suspects and promoting terrorism.

It is pertinent to note that Pakistan government imposed a ban on Jamat-ud-Dawa (JUD) and its charity front Falah-e-Insaniyat Foundation (FIF), after enlisting them in its list of banned outfits.

The move was in live with United Nation (UN) list of banned outfits and individuals, which has had these organizations and individuals in its blacklist for some time.

JUD Chief Hafiz Saeed is accused of masterminding the 2008 Mumbai terror attacks with a 10 million dollar bounty on his head, sanctioned by the United States.

Source : https://www.indiatoday.in/world/sto...saeed-for-terror-financing-1561546-2019-07-03


----------



## mastaan

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/pak...terror-financing-2063676?pfrom=home-topscroll

*Pakistan Charges Hafiz Saeed With Terror Financing*
*Pakistan counter-terrorism department said it has registered 23 cases against the chief of the Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD) and 12 aides for using five trusts to "raise funds for terrorism financing".*

LAHORE: 

Pakistani authorities on Wednesday booked 26/11 Mumbai attacks mastermind Hafiz Saeed and his 12 accomplices for "terrorism financing" in 23 cases, amid growing international pressure on Islamabad to act against militant groups.

Pakistan counter-terrorism department said it has registered 23 cases against the chief of the Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD) and 12 aides for using five trusts to "raise funds for terrorism financing".

---

Comment: This is a welcome news. As of now, only one news channel is covering this in India so far.


----------



## Jackdaws

It's good that Pak is toeing the line, probably due to FATF

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## Wikki019

Jackdaws said:


> It's good that Pak is toeing the line, probably due to FATF



A shift in regional policy

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## mastaan

This is a welcome change. I just posted a thread as well.. Did not find an existing thread.


----------



## Zee-shaun

Good move. The guy has given us a bad name and rep.

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## Jackdaws

Zee-shaun said:


> Good movie. The guy has given us a bad name and rep.


I thought he enjoyed a lot of support among common people in Pak


----------



## Jf Thunder

Imran Khan 
the best Prime Minister for India 
in fact he has not done squat that would substantially positively effect Pakistan

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Zee-shaun

Jackdaws said:


> I thought he enjoyed a lot of support among common people in Pak


As a philantropist he does get support for his good work.


----------



## Jackdaws

Jf Thunder said:


> Imran Khan
> the best Prime Minister for India
> in fact he has not done squat that would substantially positively effect Pakistan


He has done wrong here?



Zee-shaun said:


> As a philantropist he does get support for his good work.


Yes, very Mother Teresa types.

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## lightoftruth

Usual hogwash to save themselves from FATF blacklist in October.

Not gonna work.

Reactions: Like Like:
5


----------



## Protest_again

At last, it took Imran Khan to do the needful. Hafeez did more harm to Pakistan than to any other country. India lost a useful tool. Good going Imran.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Jackdaws

lightoftruth said:


> Usual hogwash to save themselves from FATF blacklist in October.
> 
> Not gonna work.


It's good if they jail him


----------



## war&peace

Why there is no news in any of Pakistani media?


----------



## Cygnus Black

Why is Pakistan throwing away its bargaining chips without getting anything in return?


----------



## lightoftruth

Jackdaws said:


> It's good if they jail him


He is a global terrorist ,they still consider him a philanthropist.

You are expecting a lot.

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## SIPRA

war&peace said:


> Why there is no news in any of Pakistani media?



Express Tribune is reporting it.


----------



## Cygnus Black

He did not direct Mumbai attacks. Probably some rogue elements in his organization did, but he is innocent.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jf Thunder said:


> Imran Khan
> the best Prime Minister for India
> in fact he has not done squat that would substantially positively effect Pakistan




You idiotic comments are not worth commenting but again people like you rather let Pakistan go down the drain than see it prosper

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Zee-shaun

lightoftruth said:


> He is a global terrorist ,they still consider him a philanthropist.
> 
> You are expecting a lot.



Tone it down will ya. Sometimes butchers get elected sometimes philantropists are thrown into jail.

Reactions: Like Like:
4


----------



## Aryan0395

Cygnus Black said:


> Why is Pakistan throwing away its bargaining chips without getting anything in return?


They are getting something in return. Economic lifeline from FATF. Pakistan simply played this bargaining chip for far too long and now that India is a major country, G7 has to pay attention.


----------



## Chhatrapati

Cygnus Black said:


> Why is Pakistan throwing away its bargaining chips without getting anything in return?


What do you want in return for acting against the problems you created?


----------



## Zee-shaun

Cygnus Black said:


> Why is Pakistan throwing away its bargaining chips without getting anything in return?


Bargaining chip? Please elaborate.


----------



## SIPRA

Cygnus Black said:


> He did not direct Mumbai attacks. Probably some rogue elements in his organization did, but he is innocent.



BTW, he is my respected teacher, of Islamic studies, in Engineering University, Lahore, back in 70s.

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## H!TchHiker

Jackdaws said:


> It's good if they jail him


Indeed if modi just call him once ...he will do it...He is trying to reach Modi by writing letters and making phone calls..
Believe it ,IK is the most friendly PM india will have in Pakistan and having public support..


----------



## Zee-shaun

Aryan0395 said:


> They are getting something in return. Economic lifeline from FATF. Pakistan simply played this bargaining chip for far too long and now that India is a major country, G7 has to pay attention.


Pakistan is doing the right thing for her own interests. There is no bargaining chip. Corruption and extremism are two of our bigest problems and finally we have the civil govt and military on the same page.


----------



## Aryan0395

Zee-shaun said:


> Corruption and extremism are two of our bigest problems and finally we have the civil govt and military on the same page.


I would be glad if that is the case. 
For now i remain skeptical as no concrete irreversible step has been taken so far thus it begs the question if its just a show to escape FATF. 
Hopefully i will be proven wrong.


----------



## Zee-shaun

Aryan0395 said:


> I would be glad if that is the case.
> For now i remain skeptical as no concrete irreversible step has been taken so far thus it begs the question if its just a show to escape FATF.
> Hopefully i will be proven wrong.


Rome wasn't built overnight, have some patience.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## SIPRA

I am quite certain that no harm will come to Hafiz Saeed Sahib. The issue at hand is quite complex and has many facets. Needs to be tackled very carefully.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## war&peace

RIWWIR said:


> Express Tribune is reporting it.


He was under house arrest for quite some time.


----------



## Stealth

lightoftruth said:


> He is a global terrorist ,they still consider him a philanthropist.
> 
> You are expecting a lot.



lol what he did at 'global' level by the way ??


----------



## SIPRA

war&peace said:


> He was under house arrest for quite some time.



Yes. But today CTD has registered certain cases of terror financing, against them. Though, I think, nothing would come out of these cases.


----------



## lightoftruth

Stealth said:


> lol what he did at 'global' level by the way ??


Why not ask United Nations ?

He is a UN designated Global Terrorist.
https://www.business-standard.com/a...d-terrorists-govt-sources-119030700636_1.html

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Zee-shaun

Aryan0395 said:


> I would be glad if that is the case.
> For now i remain skeptical as no concrete irreversible step has been taken so far thus it begs the question if its just a show to escape FATF.
> Hopefully i will be proven wrong.


Do you realise that there is no permanent scape from FATF? Previous civil govts are responsible for the situation we are in today. Finally we have a leader who has the guts to stand up against extremism and take legal actions without fearing for his own life. Yet you remain sceptical....



RIWWIR said:


> I am quite certain that no harm will come to Hafiz Saeed Sahib. The issue at hand is quite complex and has many facets. Needs to be tackled very carefully.



The guy is terminally ill and hasn't got much time. Whatever life he has left, he will spend it in and out of court proceedings. No harm will come to him.


----------



## SIPRA

Zee-shaun said:


> The guy is terminally ill and hasn't got much time. Whatever life he has left, he will spend it in and out of court proceedings. No harm will come to him.



I believe, you are confusing Hafiz Sahib with Maulana Masood Azhar. Hafiz Saeed Sahib is quite healthy. But you are right that there would be prolonged and futile court proceedings, with hardly any result. And the time will pass.


----------



## Jackdaws

H!TchHiker said:


> Indeed if modi just call him once ...he will do it...He is trying to reach Modi by writing letters and making phone calls..
> Believe it ,IK is the most friendly PM india will have in Pakistan and having public support..


Lol.


----------



## Solomon2

RIWWIR said:


> Yes. But today CTD has registered certain cases of terror financing, against them. Though, I think, nothing would come out of these cases.


Why not?


----------



## SIPRA

Solomon2 said:


> Why not?



Why should or would?


----------



## Zee-shaun

RIWWIR said:


> I believe, you are confusing Hafiz Sahib with Maulana Masood Azhar. Hafiz Saeed Sahib is quite healthy. But you are right that there would be prolonged and futile court proceedings, with hardly any result. And the time will pass.


I believe both are ill but I could be wrong.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## SIPRA

Zee-shaun said:


> I believe both are ill but I could be wrong.



I have not heard any news that Hafiz Saeed Sahib is ill; though of course he is an aged person and may be having some common age-related health problems.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Stealth

lightoftruth said:


> Why not ask United Nations ?
> 
> He is a UN designated Global Terrorist.
> https://www.business-standard.com/a...d-terrorists-govt-sources-119030700636_1.html



oh comeon we know how world politics work.. today you're blue eyed of United States tomorrow someone else... tell me what he has done @ global level ...


----------



## lightoftruth

Stealth said:


> oh comeon we know how world politics work.. today you're blue eyed of United States tomorrow someone else... tell me what he has done @ global level ...


Victims of just nariman house of 26/11 terror attacks by Hafiz Saeed.

*Name* *Age* *Nationality*
Rabbi Gavriel Holtzberg 29 

 Brooklyn, United States (and dual 

 Israeli citizenship)
Rebbetzin Rivka Holtzberg 28 

 Afula, Israel
Bentzion Kruman 26 

 Bat Yam, Israel (and dual 

 US citizenship)
Rabbi Leibish Teitelbaum 37 

 Brooklyn, United States
Yoheved Orpaz 62 

 Givatayim, Israel
Norma Shvarzblat Rabinovich 50





Mexico


----------



## Zee-shaun

lightoftruth said:


> Why not ask United Nations ?
> 
> He is a UN designated Global Terrorist.
> https://www.business-standard.com/a...d-terrorists-govt-sources-119030700636_1.html


Do you listen to the UN?


----------



## Solomon2

RIWWIR said:


> Why should or would?


You don't have confidence that the gov't wouldn't have booked a case against H.S. if it didn't feel it had the evidence to convict him? Or is your question, "Even if the gov't does have such evidence, why should H.S. be convicted at all?"


----------



## SIPRA

Zee-shaun said:


> Do you listen to the UN?



Yes. They listen, but very selectively, where it suits them.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Solomon2

RIWWIR said:


> BTW, he is my respected teacher, of Islamic studies, in Engineering University, Lahore, back in 70s.


Thirty years between his instruction to you and the 2008 Mumbai attacks. You don't think a man can change in that time?


----------



## SIPRA

Solomon2 said:


> You don't have confidence that the gov't wouldn't have booked a case against H.S. if it didn't feel it had the evidence to convict him? Or is your question, "Even if the gov't does have such evidence, why should H.S. be convicted at all?"



Your post is quite complex and I don't fully gather it. But, in my post, I have given my assessment that nothing much would come out of these cases. You have all the right to disagree with me.



Solomon2 said:


> Thirty years between his instruction to you and the 2008 Mumbai attacks. You don't think a man can change in that time?



Of course, many people change a lot with time. This is a common human experience.

As for Mambai Attacks, this, by any measure, is a grossly insignificant incidence, particularly, in our part of the world; if you care to read the history of Asia, for the last about 100 years, where tens of millions of innocent people have lost their lives and belongings, because of religious or political reasons.


----------



## Yaseen1

Bad decision by ik govt .He is damaging kashmir cause everyday for dollars and has no respect .He should learn from iran .ik is not difference from previous govt and has a slave mentality .I wish new coas adopts firm stance and agressive policy towards india like Raheel Shareef did and force govt to adopt strong stance against indian support of terrorism in Pakistan and their brutality against innocent kashmiris.coas bajwa is turning in another gen kyani for us


----------



## MilSpec

Interesting move by Pakistan.


----------



## Stealth

lightoftruth said:


> Victims of just nariman house of 26/11 terror attacks by Hafiz Saeed.
> 
> *Name* *Age* *Nationality*
> Rabbi Gavriel Holtzberg 29
> 
> Brooklyn, United States (and dual
> 
> Israeli citizenship)
> Rebbetzin Rivka Holtzberg 28
> 
> Afula, Israel
> Bentzion Kruman 26
> 
> Bat Yam, Israel (and dual
> 
> US citizenship)
> Rabbi Leibish Teitelbaum 37
> 
> Brooklyn, United States
> Yoheved Orpaz 62
> 
> Givatayim, Israel
> Norma Shvarzblat Rabinovich 50
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mexico



So based on someone killed inside your country and the guy allegedly with no concrete evidence labelled global terrorist amazing... that's the failure of your country's security LEA's who are responsible of foreign life including yours...... just go and read the definition with explanation of global terrorist if you don't understand simple word "Global Terrorist"

- Operate on foreign soils or from multiple countries
- Conduct operations from different countries and into different countries (killed people in different part of the world)...

where as HS non qualify as per your description.


----------



## Vortex

He has been booked, then in court nothing will be proved and he will be free.


----------



## lightoftruth

Stealth said:


> So based on someone killed inside your country and the guy allegedly with no concrete evidence labelled global terrorist amazing... that's the failure of your country's security LEA's who are responsible of foreign life including yours...... just go and read the definition with explanation of global terrorist if you don't understand simple word "Global Terrorist"
> 
> - Operate on foreign soils or from multiple countries
> - Conduct operations from different countries and into different countries (killed people in different part of the world)...
> 
> where as HS non qualify as per your description.


Read "Just" again ,between here it is as per your definition.



> The Markaz campus at Muridke in Lahore, its headquarters, was used as a hide-out for both Ramzi Yousef, involved in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, and Mir Aimal Kansi, convicted and executed for the January 1993 killing of two Central Intelligence Agency officers outside the agency's headquarters in Langley, Virginia.[135] A group of men dubbed the Virginia Jihad Network attended LeT training camps and were convicted in 2006 of conspiring to provide material support to the LeT.[136] The leader of the group, Ali al-Timimi, urged the men to attend the LeT camps and to "go abroad to join the mujahideen engaged in jihad in Afghanistan." The men also trained with weapons in Virginia.[137]Two U.S. citizens, Syed Haris Ahmed and Ehsanul Sadequee were arrested in 2006 for attempting to join LeT. Ahmed traveled to Pakistan in July 2005 to attend a terrorist training camp and join LeT. The men also shot videos of U.S. landmarks in the Washington, D.C. area for potential terrorist attacks. They were convicted in Atlanta during the summer of 2009 for conspiring to provide material support to terrorists.[138] U.S. citizen Ahmad Abousamra was indicted in November 2009 for providing material support to terrorists. He allegedly went to Pakistan in 2002 to join the Taliban and LeT, but failed.[139] The F.B.I. issued a $50,000 reward for his capture on 3 October 2012



Between LET had close links with Al-Qaeda as well, google where they have attacked.


----------



## Stealth

lightoftruth said:


> Read "Just" again ,between here it is as per your definition.
> 
> 
> 
> Between LET had close links with Al-Qaeda as well, google where they have attacked.



oh comeon lame excuses... Al-Qaida targetted US (foreign soil) + operating from many countries. They did similar kind of activities "In many countries not only in US". What is that "links" excuse to make ABCD global terrorist? is that your definition?


----------



## Smoke

Why haven't you guys realized something? 

This deal was probably to black list BLA in exchange for giving up Hafiz Saeed!

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Clutch

Cygnus Black said:


> Why is Pakistan throwing away its bargaining chips without getting anything in return?



FATF


----------



## Jackdaws

lightoftruth said:


> Victims of just nariman house of 26/11 terror attacks by Hafiz Saeed.
> 
> *Name* *Age* *Nationality*
> Rabbi Gavriel Holtzberg 29
> 
> Brooklyn, United States (and dual
> 
> Israeli citizenship)
> Rebbetzin Rivka Holtzberg 28
> 
> Afula, Israel
> Bentzion Kruman 26
> 
> Bat Yam, Israel (and dual
> 
> US citizenship)
> Rabbi Leibish Teitelbaum 37
> 
> Brooklyn, United States
> Yoheved Orpaz 62
> 
> Givatayim, Israel
> Norma Shvarzblat Rabinovich 50
> 
> 
> 
> Mexico


Besides the 162 other victims. And some unborn kids.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Adonis

Zee-shaun said:


> *Good move. *The guy has given us a bad name and rep.



Good Move?.... why so late?.... it was always a good move but dear establishment said no...now they themselves are facing the heat (constraints of funds) so started towing the line they were told to do long back (by US etc)....

Irony is say of civilian government doesn't matter . I remember NS during his last stint as PM, vouched to rein in these jihadis but was ignored...he voiced out his frustration in his interviews thereafter and Dawn leaks...


----------



## khail007

Wish list of Indian/USA nexus. Pakistan just trying to avoid FATF black listing. In the court of law these cases not going to prove anything against Hafiz Saeed Sahib. Same as Indian courts of law never able to prove anything against Hindu terrorists.
US is now negotiating with terrorist; yesterday's declared by UN to fulfill US wish.
May ALLAH SWT knows better, the time when same bitter pill to be swallowed by India in Kashmir/Afghanistan.


----------



## Arulmozhi Varman

He has been arrested before and he had come out with Pakistani investigators asking India for more evidence. I mean it was plotted in Pakistani soil and how are we supposed to investigate and prosecute people there? 

This is just an 90 days arrest without charge till the day FATF convenes in October or till the day one court will deem it illegal (they work on evidences) and release him.


----------



## xyxmt

lightoftruth said:


> Usual hogwash to save themselves from FATF blacklist in October.
> 
> Not gonna work.



Everything works in the End like BLA declared as terrorist outfit



Arulmozhi Varman said:


> He has been arrested before and he had come out with Pakistani investigators asking India for more evidence. I mean it was plotted in Pakistani soil and how are we supposed to investigate and prosecute people there?
> 
> This is just an 90 days arrest without charge till the day FATF convenes in October or till the day one court will deem it illegal (they work on evidences) and release him.



So Indian put the blame on him without any evidences?


----------



## War Thunder

Jackdaws said:


> I thought he enjoyed a lot of support among common people in Pak




You need to go and check the common people of Pakistan then. The YouTube is kinda full of the common people now a days.
80 - 90% of the population wont even know who this fella is...


----------



## Abdussamad

Just goes to show that you can kill as many Pakistanis as you like without consequences but if you hurt Indians they will come after you in this islamic republic:



> "I want to ask you this; this has happened before and continues to happen but until when? How many more lives?"
> He questioned whether the government will act on the National Action Plan "only when there is pressure from India or the United States" and whether there was "no value" of the lives of Pakistani residents.



Source


----------



## Kathin_Singh

*Hafiz Saeed, 12 other JuD leaders booked for terror financing*

LAHORE: Top 13 leaders of the banned Jamaatud Dawa (JuD), including its chief Hafiz Saeed and Naib Emir Abdul Rehman Makki, have been booked in nearly two dozen cases for terror financing and money laundering under the Anti-Terrorism Act, 1997.

The Counter-Terrorism Department (CTD), which registered the cases in five cities of Punjab, declared that the JuD was financing terrorism from the massive funds collected through non-profit organisations and trusts including Al-Anfaal Trust, Dawatul Irshad Trust, Muaz Bin Jabal Trust, etc.

These non-profit organisations were banned in April as the CTD during detailed investigations found that they had links with the JuD and its top leadership, accused of financing terrorism by building huge assets/properties from the collected funds in Pakistan.

_Read: NSC orders acceleration of anti-terrorism ops; reinstates ban on JuD, charity arm FIF_

Finally, 23 FIRs were registered against JuD leaders at the CTD police stations of Lahore, Gujranwala, Multan, Faisalabad and Sargodha on July 1 and 2.

Besides the top two JuD leaders, Malik Zafar Iqbal, Ameer Hamza, Mohammad Yahya Aziz, Mohammad Naeem, Mohsin Bilal, Abdul Raqeeb, Dr Ahmad Daud, Dr Muhammad Ayub, Abdullah Ubaid, Mohammad Ali and Abdul Ghaffar were also booked in the cases.

“Formal investigations on a large scale have been launched against the top leadership of the JuD for terror financing after the registration of FIRs against them during the last two days,” said a spokesperson for the CTD, Punjab.

According to the official, substantial and irreversible punitive/ legal action has been taken against them by the state, making these organisations “fully dysfunctional”.

He explained that action was taken against them in connection with implementation of UN sanctions imposed on the JuD, Lashkar-i-Taiba and Falah-i-Insaniyat Foundation (FIF) besides their designated entities and leadership as directed by the National Security Committee (NSC) in January 2019 under the National Action Plan.

_Editorial: Ban on JuD_

The CTD took some months to collect evidence against the banned organisations regarding terror financing and assets/properties which had already been seized by the state. “These assets/non-profit organisations have already been taken over by the government in compliance with UN sanctions,” he added.

The spokesperson said the suspects had committed multiple offences of terror financing and money laundering and would be prosecuted in anti-terrorism courts.

_Published in Dawn, July 4th, 2019_


----------



## Kathin_Singh

Isn't Hafiz Saeed a charity worker!!


----------



## SIPRA

Already a thread is there on this news.


----------



## BATMAN

As long Imran Khan is PM, name of Pakistan shall be changed to Puppy of In-Laws.


----------



## Kathin_Singh

BATMAN said:


> As long Imran Khan is PM, name of Pakistan shall be changed to Puppy of In-Laws.



Imran is also Niazi.


----------



## Rollno21

And the drama continues ,every year he is arrested and let go.arrested just before a meeting with fatf officials or someone else and let him go after few months .

When Pakistan really wants change and acts on it ,you will really see the change on the ground only then Pakistan will be believed


----------



## Baghial

Zee-shaun said:


> Good move. The guy has given us a bad name and rep.


So has the beard. Turban.and jihad..why dont the jew lover ban all in pakistan....wht will be pakistani eat after donkey population is extint....pigs???


----------



## Jf Thunder

Flight of falcon said:


> You idiotic comments are not worth commenting but again people like you rather let Pakistan go down the drain than see it prosper


just because its IK, it is prosperous for Pakistan


----------



## Chhatrapati

Court will let him go because of lack of evidence like always. 

This is just a googly, it won't fly. 

We need to push for punitive action until there is a significant drop in gun wielding cartoons in valley.


----------



## Kathin_Singh

'Cosmetic steps': India dismisses Pakistan's action against .. 

Read more at:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst


----------



## maithil

Hope FATF and India fall for this.


----------



## Clutch

Kathin_Singh said:


> 'Cosmetic steps': India dismisses Pakistan's action against ..
> 
> Read more at:
> http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...ofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst




Hindutva india is always about "moo par ram ram baghaal may chooree" mantra.

They can never be trusted. Screw 'em dont appease 'em.


----------



## Pakistansdefender

Jf Thunder said:


> just because its IK, it is prosperous for Pakistan


That is your personal grudge speaking. 
I agree maybe there are some celebrating here as Imran khan action or something . 
But I reality these types of matters are the matters of state. 
These groups are of no use any longer . 
And why is the usa and others countries continuously say us to do a crack down against those groups while they have done nothing to them . 
It's how you play the game. The use of force has ended post 911 and India has used this and built a case against us in the international community . All you have to do is to become a normal country to improve your economy and then fight your wars as much as you like.
Hafiz Saeed sir I hope knows about this and fully cooperates with the state . Because they themselevs realize that their strategy is not working .

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Humble Analyst

Flight of falcon said:


> You idiotic comments are not worth commenting but again people like you rather let Pakistan go down the drain than see it prosper





lightoftruth said:


> Why not ask United Nations ?
> 
> He is a UN designated Global Terrorist.
> https://www.business-standard.com/a...d-terrorists-govt-sources-119030700636_1.html


Ajeet Dawal is an Indian Government terrorist why nobody takes notice of his speech confession of supporting terrorist activity in Pakistan?



Smoke said:


> Why haven't you guys realized something?
> 
> This deal was probably to black list BLA in exchange for giving up Hafiz Saeed!


This is the best explanation under the circumstances.



Yaseen1 said:


> Bad decision by ik govt .He is damaging kashmir cause everyday for dollars and has no respect .He should learn from iran .ik is not difference from previous govt and has a slave mentality .I wish new coas adopts firm stance and agressive policy towards india like Raheel Shareef did and force govt to adopt strong stance against indian support of terrorism in Pakistan and their brutality against innocent kashmiris.coas bajwa is turning in another gen kyani for us


@Smoke pointed out correctly, this in exchange for declaring BLA terrorist organisation.


----------



## Yaseen1

Humble Analyst said:


> Ajeet Dawal is an Indian Government terrorist why nobody takes notice of his speech confession of supporting terrorist activity in Pakistan?
> 
> 
> This is the best explanation under the circumstances.
> 
> 
> @Smoke pointed out correctly, this in exchange for declaring BLA terrorist organisation.


India not declare bla as terrorist org and our problem is with india .u.n declaration has nothing to do with it as far as india supports them like they supported ttp


----------



## PakAlp

Political stunt, Him and his followers will open new charities under different names. His Jamat Dawah organisation also operates as Jamat Ahle Hadith so all his assets will be passed on to a different organisation. In AjK they have a big mosque which also operates as a recruiting place. Nobody can touch the place, the local parties and people tried to close it a few times but people from higher up in Punjab gave threats to let them operate. They recruited young poor children. Quiet sad if you think of them as your own children.


----------



## KhanBaba2

Zee-shaun said:


> Do you realise that there is no permanent scape from FATF? Previous civil govts are responsible for the situation we are in today. Finally we have a leader who has the guts to stand up against extremism and take legal actions without fearing for his own life. Yet you remain sceptical....


We will be skeptical till you hang him.


----------



## Cent4

PakAlp said:


> Political stunt, Him and his followers will open new charities under different names. His Jamat Dawah organisation also operates as Jamat Ahle Hadith so all his assets will be passed on to a different organisation. In AjK they have a big mosque which also operates as a recruiting place. Nobody can touch the place, the local parties and people tried to close it a few times but people from higher up in Punjab gave threats to let them operate. They recruited young poor children. Quiet sad if you think of them as your own children.


What a nice picture you paint. 
You must have some sort of evidence of this.


----------



## Jf Thunder

Pakistansdefender said:


> That is your personal grudge speaking.
> I agree maybe there are some celebrating here as Imran khan action or something .
> But I reality these types of matters are the matters of state.
> These groups are of no use any longer .
> And why is the usa and others countries continuously say us to do a crack down against those groups while they have done nothing to them .
> It's how you play the game. The use of force has ended post 911 and India has used this and built a case against us in the international community . All you have to do is to become a normal country to improve your economy and then fight your wars as much as you like.
> Hafiz Saeed sir I hope knows about this and fully cooperates with the state . Because they themselves realize that their strategy is not working .


They are useful still, justifying an act on the orders of a single person cannot be declared "matters of the state"


----------



## Pakistansdefender

Jf Thunder said:


> They are useful still, justifying an act on the orders of a single person cannot be declared "matters of the state"


Seriously . 
Do you really think Imran khan is that powerful that he orders and they put hafiz Saeed in jail? 
Then you must really don't know how things work in our country . 
Infact Imran khan is a political man and he don't want the supporters of jud going against him. 
It's state that decide . 
When they decide they do things.
It's not a one man show or order as you put it.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Mujahid Memon

Jackdaws said:


> I thought he enjoyed a lot of support among common people in Pak


Common Pakistani people don't even know who the hell are JUD and JED and these persons etc only we hear about them on indian media.


----------



## PakAlp

Cent4 said:


> What a nice picture you paint.
> You must have some sort of evidence of this.



Evidence? As if any evidence would make any difference. When your own children become trained militants thats when reality bites. Evidence is always needed when poor people children are used for suicide bombings. 

Where do you think lashkar tayba gets its foot soldiers from?



Pakistansdefender said:


> Seriously .
> Do you really think Imran khan is that powerful that he orders and they put hafiz Saeed in jail?
> Then you must really don't know how things work in our country .
> Infact Imran khan is a political man and he don't want the supporters of jud going against him.
> It's state that decide .
> When they decide they do things.
> It's not a one man show or order as you put it.



I agree. This decision is made from the military circles. In our area local politicians and police closed down the school/mosque many years back but people higher up gave threats so it had to be opened. Our ajk government has a ban on these types of organisations but cannot do anything about it. They are untouchable. Everybody knows how these people operate. Just some pdf members pretent to be naive.


----------



## Jf Thunder

Pakistansdefender said:


> Seriously .
> Do you really think Imran khan is that powerful that he orders and they put hafiz Saeed in jail?
> Then you must really don't know how things work in our country .
> Infact Imran khan is a political man and he don't want the supporters of jud going against him.
> It's state that decide .
> When they decide they do things.
> It's not a one man show or order as you put it.


well, I cannot argue with that


----------



## Cent4

PakAlp said:


> Evidence? As if any evidence would make any difference. When your own children become trained militants thats when reality bites. Evidence is always needed when poor people children are used for suicide bombings.
> 
> Where do you think lashkar tayba gets its foot soldiers from?
> 
> 
> 
> I agree. This decision is made from the military circles. In our area local politicians and police closed down the school/mosque many years back but people higher up gave threats so it had to be opened. Our ajk government has a ban on these types of organisations but cannot do anything about it. They are untouchable. Everybody knows how these people operate. Just some pdf members pretent to be naive.


You are just generalising a everything. 

When people were going to IOK in 1990's they were going from all over the country not just AJK. Not even a fraction of that scale is happening at the moment.


----------



## Jackdaws

Pakistansdefender said:


> Seriously .
> Do you really think Imran khan is that powerful that he orders and they put hafiz Saeed in jail?
> Then you must really don't know how things work in our country .
> Infact Imran khan is a political man and he don't want the supporters of jud going against him.
> It's state that decide .
> When they decide they do things.
> It's not a one man show or order as you put it.


Your Prime Minister can't put a man declared a terrorist by the UN in jail. And then Pakistan asks why doesn't India start bilateral dialogue with Pak.


----------



## LeGenD

khail007 said:


> Wish list of Indian/USA nexus. Pakistan just trying to avoid FATF black listing. In the court of law these cases not going to prove anything against Hafiz Saeed Sahib. Same as Indian courts of law never able to prove anything against Hindu terrorists.
> US is now negotiating with terrorist; yesterday's declared by UN to fulfill US wish.
> May ALLAH SWT knows better, the time when same bitter pill to be swallowed by India in Kashmir/Afghanistan.


US is not negotiating with terrorists - this might surprise you but original Taliban was never declared a terrorist organization at any point in time. Room for talks with this group was always there, but Americans were waiting for the right moment.

US have been absolutely ruthless to terrorists around the world - countless executed.

If Hafiz Saeed has done wrong and US is after him = his days are numbered.

As for your US/India nexus remark, US have declared BLA a terrorist organization recently - a big relief to Pakistan.

Systematic proceedings on the backend...


----------



## Pakistansdefender

Humble Analyst said:


> Ajeet Dawal is an Indian Government terrorist why nobody takes notice of his speech confession of supporting terrorist activity in Pakistan?
> 
> 
> This is the best explanation under the circumstances.
> 
> 
> @Smoke pointed out correctly, this in exchange for declaring BLA terrorist organisation.


You do have very strong views without knowing anything and lacking the basic understanding of things .
One must control childish emotions and look at the reality.
And please stop glorifying Iran . 
They have better governance structure , oil and everything and still those mullahs are craving for a fight which only they would loose .
Pakistan has its challenges . We are attacked from two sides by enemies. There are too many proxy groups and too many challenges which Iran cannot possibally imagine . 
If you are so sensitive to the kashmir cause raise your children as jehadis and you yourself become jehidi and go and fight.


----------



## Humble Analyst

Pakistansdefender said:


> You do have very strong views without knowing anything and lacking the basic understanding of things .
> One must control childish emotions and look at the reality.
> And please stop glorifying Iran .
> They have better governance structure , oil and everything and still those mullahs are craving for a fight which only they would loose .
> Pakistan has its challenges . We are attacked from two sides by enemies. There are too many proxy groups and too many challenges which Iran cannot possibally imagine .
> If you are so sensitive to the kashmir cause raise your children as jehadis and you yourself become jehidi and go and fight.


Who are you talking to who is glorifying Iran you lack basic skills of replying. Come on


----------



## khail007

LeGenD said:


> US is not negotiating with terrorists - this might surprise you but original Taliban was never declared a terrorist organization at any point in time. Room for talks with this group was always there, but Americans were waiting for the right moment.


News to me ... all negotiator from Talibans are Ex-Guantanamo. They were not there as US state guests.



LeGenD said:


> US have been absolutely ruthless to terrorists around the world - countless executed.


Then they have to commit suicides.



LeGenD said:


> If Hafiz Saeed has done wrong and US is after him = his days are numbered.


Yes anyone who stands against US will, his days are numbered ... no need to look around, Liaqat Ali Khan, Bhutto, Zia-ul-Haq all are examples just in Pakistan.



LeGenD said:


> As for your US/India nexus remark, US have declared BLA a terrorist organization recently - a big relief to Pakistan.


Just a cosmetic step ... you will soon observe what significance it will bring. BLA/Hafiz Saeed issue seems to be only pre 22July eyewash; Indian subversive activities will con tinge in Balochistan. No improvement/impact on Pak/US relations. US will always be on other side.



LeGenD said:


> Systematic proceedings on the backend...


Yes you could give a more descriptive term 'Arm twisting tactics at the back-end'.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jackdaws said:


> Your Prime Minister can't put a man declared a terrorist by the UN in jail. And then Pakistan asks why doesn't India start bilateral dialogue with Pak.




No one really cares if India talks or not. India will talk when Sikhs decide they want Khalistan in India. By the way have you seen the map of Khalistan ?


----------



## Jackdaws

Flight of falcon said:


> No one really cares if India talks or not. India will talk when Sikhs decide they want Khalistan in India. By the way have you seen the map of Khalistan ?


Yea. Lahore as the capital and Nankana Sahib and Kartarpur Sahib as its principalities.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jackdaws said:


> Yea. Lahore as the capital and Nankana Sahib and Kartarpur Sahib as its principalities.




Not at all.:.. your bharat mata will be split up and torn into pieces..... 

Here is the map. Sikhs know they are always welcomed in Pakistan. They have never touched upon borders of Pakistan. Hope to visit Khalistan soon after 2020.....

We are preparing a lot more detailed map showing exact areas down to the villages Khalistan will take. 
Also a booklet about how the administrative control, bureaucracy and elections will work will be published and millions of copies distributed. 

I will send you one too.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Jackdaws

Flight of falcon said:


> Not at all.:.. your bharat mata will be split up and torn into pieces.....
> 
> Here is the map. Sikhs know they are always welcomed in Pakistan. They have never touched upon borders of Pakistan. Hope to visit Khalistan soon after 2020.....
> 
> We are preparing a lot more detailed map showing exact areas down to the villages Khalistan will take.
> Also a booklet about how the administrative control, bureaucracy and elections will work will be published and millions of copies distributed.
> 
> I will send you one too.


Lol. Nope. The microstate of Khalistan will have Lahore as its capital. Work is already on - they building a Ranjit Singh statue as well. Work has started on Kartarpur Sahib. Nankana Sahib is next.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jackdaws said:


> Lol. Nope. The microstate of Khalistan will have Lahore as its capital. Work is already on - they building a Ranjit Singh statue as well. Work has started on Kartarpur Sahib. Nankana Sahib is next.




I would know... I hang around with those who are the architects of this dream project. Kirtarpur is 1 km inside .... I say give it to Sikhs....

There are Sikhs from Jammu here who want to join Khalistan as well.... with Punjab gone India will
Loose 35 percent of their GDP .....

By the way the member of Canadian parliament joked to me that they will name a road after me once Khalistan is created!!!!! So watch out bro..


----------



## Solomon2

RIWWIR said:


> As for Mambai Attacks, this, by any measure, is a grossly insignificant incidence, particularly, in our part of the world -


So you're busy making excuses for murderers: no need to prosecute them because their deeds are "grossly insignificant." Aren't you proud of yourself today?

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Jackdaws

Flight of falcon said:


> I would know... I hang around with those who are the architects of this dream project. Kirtarpur is 1 km inside .... I say give it to Sikhs....
> 
> There are Sikhs from Jammu here who want to join Khalistan as well.... with Punjab gone India will
> Loose 35 percent of their GDP .....
> 
> By the way the member of Canadian parliament joked to me that they will name a road after me once Khalistan is created!!!!! So watch out bro..


Sure, let the Canucks do what they can. Must be high on maple syrup. Meanwhile, you should worry about Lahore. It's a lot closer to the border than Dacca ever was. Oops, it is Dhaka now.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jackdaws said:


> Sure, let the Canucks do what they can. Must be high on maple syrup. Meanwhile, you should worry about Lahore. It's a lot closer to the border than Dacca ever was. Oops, it is Dhaka now.




Same Lahore your Indian cowards attacked in 1965 with three divisions but couldnt even cross BRB canal????
You should worry about Delhi.... soon to be renamed and called Azad Dilli after liberation by Sikhs.


----------



## Jackdaws

Flight of falcon said:


> Same Lahore your Indian cowards attacked in 1965 with three divisions but couldnt even cross BRB canal????
> You should worry about Delhi.... soon to be renamed and called Azad Dilli after liberation by Sikhs.


Lol. Keep believing in your myths and cry to your Canadian MP about it. Meanwhile, work on Khalistan with Lahore as capital has begun.


----------



## Flight of falcon

Jackdaws said:


> Lol. Keep believing in your myths and cry to your Canadian MP about it. Meanwhile, work on Khalistan with Lahore as capital has begun.


Arguing with idiots can result in lower IQ. So I decide to walk away.


----------

