# CPEC and Russia’s quest for warm water ports



## Devil Soul

*CPEC and Russia’s quest for warm water ports*
By Naveed Ahmad
Published: December 13, 2016
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Pakistan’s point-man for China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC), Ahsan Iqbal, just concluded an exhaustive visit to Moscow. What would have been the point of a sojourn if there was no talk about the corridor and access to the warm waters of the Arabian Sea? A fortnight ago, Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif attended the Global Conference on Sustainable Transport in Ashgabat, Turkmenistan. Islamabad not only offered its land route to landlocked Central Asian states but also extended the olive branch to Russia. Moscow tried a different strategy to reach the warm waters of the Arabian Sea for three decades, but spectacularly failed courtesy the Afghans and Pakistan.

Russian foreign ministry denied any negotiations with Pakistan on joining the China-sponsored corridor to the Arabian Sea via the Gwadar port. The federal minister’s visit 10 days later offered a blunt rejoinder. On its part, the Central Asia Regional Economic Cooperation member state showed its willingness to work with Russia, thus the meeting with Maksim Sokolov, the Russian transport minister.

*Turbulent ties*

Islamabad and Moscow first interacted on the fringes of the UN General Assembly meeting on May 1, 1948, when Foreign Minister Sir Zafarullah Khan met his counterpart. Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto aspired to create a better bargain for Pakistan by wooing Russia, when he first visited the country in 1960 as Minister of Fuel Power and Natural Resources. Later, he remained actively engaged with Moscow as a foreign minister as well. The engagement eventually led to post-1965 war Tashkent Declaration. Kremlin backed Delhi outrightly as it sponsored Bengali secessionist militancy in 1971. Despite this, the controversial populist leader visited Moscow in 1972 as premier. Later, Russia launched a proxy war against Pakistan after it sided with the Afghan resistance against its military intervention as well as the capitalist bloc.

*Moscow not mulling to join CPEC: Russian foreign ministry*

Following his father’s footstep, Premier Benazir Bhutto tried to warm relations with Russia in 1994-1995. However, political infighting at home and Moscow’s annoyance over the rise of Taliban factored in adversely. Just months prior to the coup, Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif visited Russia in 1999. But General Musharraf pressed reset on almost everything the Nawaz government was pursuing, and ties with Russia were no exception.

Since Musharraf’s Russia visit in 2003, relations have steadily improved without considerable turbulence. While almost every Pakistan president or premier has visited Moscow since, none were reciprocated at the same level.

In 2015, commandoes from both sides held war-games, while their navies conducted a joint exercise in the northern Arabian Sea. These increasing comfort levels are leading the two nations to previously unchartered waters, the most notable being the sale of MiG-29’s engines, RD-33, for en masse production and likely export of JF-17 Thunder.

The move was preceded by a deal to buy Russian Mil Mi-35 gunships and electronic warfare equipment. Besides inducting initial deliveries of four rotary-wing aircrafts, Islamabad may order another 16 subject to the platform’s performance and budgetary conditions.

*Partnership for mutual benefit*

Russia’s prime interest in Pakistan has been investment in the energy sector, symbolised by financing of the 850km North-South (Lahore-Karachi) pipeline to securing investment in the Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline. And it remains to be seen if Moscow agrees to invest in the Thar coal field.

If the overview of complicated bilateral relations can be any guide, both the countries are steadily developing ties but are still far from becoming strategic and economic partners. Russia’s defense cooperation with India is at a far advanced level, which for now remains un-deterred by Delhi’s advances to Washington.

*CPEC’s western route: Protests may erupt over unkept promises*

Of late, Moscow has not shared India’s hardened position against Pakistan, may it be the BRICS summit in Goa or Heart of Asia conference in Amritsar. Islamabad’s recent abstention on the UN resolution regarding Syria was also an effort to stay out of the Pandora’s box.

The offer to join CPEC is too enticing for Russia to out-rightly reject. Its energy projects, such as the pipeline network, may eventually culminate in Russian oil being shipped to the east and the west from Gwadar port. Even if Kremlin may not benefit from the CPEC in the short term, it won’t back India’s rhetoric against the logistical corridor.

Naveed Ahmad is a Pakistani investigative journalist and academic with extensive reporting experience in the Middle East and North Africa. He is based in Doha and Istanbul. He tweets @naveed360

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## EgyptianAmerican

Turingsage said:


> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port"



Wrong



Turingsage said:


> Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.



What does Pakistan have to do with Stalingrad?

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## Max

why Russia need warm water port? In past they may needed it for their central asian empire aka colonies.. But now?

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## Green Ranger

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2016/11/eric-margolis/russians-coming-russians-coming-2/

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## Hakikat ve Hikmet

Russia fought 14 wars with the Turkish folks mostly for getting unhindered access to the warm waters....

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## Indika

Max said:


> why Russia need warm water port? In past they may needed it for their central asian empire aka colonies.. But now?


russia has few warm water ports, there is one on easter side vladivostok. But on western /northern side they are 
blocked by the ice. As such if they want to trade or flex their naval might in europe it is not possible.


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## Max

Indika said:


> russia has few warm water ports, there is one on easter side vladivostok. But on western /northern side they are
> blocked by the ice. As such if they want to trade or flex their naval might in europe it is not possible.



what route they use for trade with South Asia, ME, Africa? And where our ports fits in Russian future trade strategy?


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## somebozo

Turingsage said:


> This laughable fantasy was initially sold to the brainwashed and dimwitted Pakistani Awam ( by the Pakistani Army) to justify the sale of Pakistani territory and manpower in support of US imperialism ( CENTO SEATO etc). It received tens of billions from the US whose only purpose was the breakup of the Soviet Union. The US and GHQ carried through with support of a terrorist group, the Taliban, to unravel Russia and its union with Afghanistan as road kill in pursuit of this goal.
> Afghanistan was ultimately abandoned by the US when the goal of destroying the Soviet and Union was achieved, Pakistan however decided that the Taliban were the perfect proxy ( Like its other many proxies across South Asia) to keep Afghanistan for itself
> That fantasy is still being played out
> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port" that delusion is just for the brainwashed.
> *Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.
> It has a long term plan to pay back those that wronged them and yes Pakistan does feature in that, EVENTUALLY.*



Straight out of bollywood!


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## PAKISTANFOREVER

Turingsage said:


> This laughable fantasy was initially sold to the brainwashed and dimwitted Pakistani Awam ( by the Pakistani Army) to justify the sale of Pakistani territory and manpower in support of US imperialism ( CENTO SEATO etc). It received tens of billions from the US whose only purpose was the breakup of the Soviet Union. The US and GHQ carried through with support of a terrorist group, the Taliban, to unravel Russia and its union with Afghanistan as road kill in pursuit of this goal.
> Afghanistan was ultimately abandoned by the US when the goal of destroying the Soviet and Union was achieved, Pakistan however decided that the Taliban were the perfect proxy ( Like its other many proxies across South Asia) to keep Afghanistan for itself
> That fantasy is still being played out
> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port" that delusion is just for the brainwashed.
> Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.
> It has a long term plan to pay back those that wronged them and yes Pakistan does feature in that, EVENTUALLY.





The biggest laughable fantasy was the one sold by the entire indian establishment pre-May 1998, that Pakistan will NEVER EVER become a nuclear weapons state with or without Chinese assistance. Just as that indian bollywood fantasy failed so will this one

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## Indus Pakistan

Max said:


> what route they use for trade with South Asia, ME, Africa? And where our ports fits in Russian future trade strategy?


Sochi, Russia - warm water?

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## war&peace

Max said:


> why Russia need warm water port? In past they may needed it for their central asian empire aka colonies.. But now?


There is something called trade...ever heard about that? yeah Russia wants warm water port for that which is open for trade the year round.


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## PWFI

Turingsage said:


> This laughable fantasy was initially sold to the brainwashed and dimwitted Pakistani Awam ( by the Pakistani Army) to justify the sale of Pakistani territory and manpower in support of US imperialism ( CENTO SEATO etc). It received tens of billions from the US whose only purpose was the breakup of the Soviet Union. The US and GHQ carried through with support of a terrorist group, the Taliban, to unravel Russia and its union with Afghanistan as road kill in pursuit of this goal.
> Afghanistan was ultimately abandoned by the US when the goal of destroying the Soviet and Union was achieved, Pakistan however decided that the Taliban were the perfect proxy ( Like its other many proxies across South Asia) to keep Afghanistan for itself
> That fantasy is still being played out
> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port" that delusion is just for the brainwashed.
> Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.
> It has a long term plan to pay back those that wronged them and yes Pakistan does feature in that, EVENTUALLY.


Never knew u guys (indians) are so fukced up in ur mind vis-à-vis de Pakistan

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## SleepingLion

They need it to have economic access to east African Republics, East Asian & Middle East.


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## Indus Pakistan

SleepingLion said:


> African Republics, East Asian & Middle East.


Vladisvostock covers East Asia.







Sochi covers Africa, Middle East.








St. Petersburgh covers Western Europe.

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## Imad.Khan

Turingsage said:


> This laughable fantasy was initially sold to the brainwashed and dimwitted Pakistani Awam ( by the Pakistani Army) to justify the sale of Pakistani territory and manpower in support of US imperialism ( CENTO SEATO etc). It received tens of billions from the US whose only purpose was the breakup of the Soviet Union. The US and GHQ carried through with support of a terrorist group, the Taliban, to unravel Russia and its union with Afghanistan as road kill in pursuit of this goal.
> Afghanistan was ultimately abandoned by the US when the goal of destroying the Soviet and Union was achieved, Pakistan however decided that the Taliban were the perfect proxy ( Like its other many proxies across South Asia) to keep Afghanistan for itself
> That fantasy is still being played out
> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port" that delusion is just for the brainwashed.
> Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.
> It has a long term plan to pay back those that wronged them and yes Pakistan does feature in that, EVENTUALLY.



Wait, didn't India just sign a deal with the US giving it unrestricted access to its military bases? Also your history is pathetic just like your post. Taliban was formed in 1996, before that there were mujahideens that constitute all the factions that are now fighting each other including the Northern Alliance and Pakistan had no hand in Stalingrad or the siege of Moscow because Pakistan didn't exist then. 

Please take your nonsense with you to the Indian defence forum which will have the target audience you seek.



I'm Wrong said:


> Russia need warm water ports.. But why they need a warm water port to access Arabian Sea??
> They desperately need access to Mediterranean Sea through black sea (for Europe & Africa).. Cremea annexation & Syria wars are likely for that goal..Turkey is a problem there..
> Then they need to access Baltic Sea.. But there is no warm water ports available there..
> They have warm water ports in Pacific ocean.. So there is no problem..
> For accessing central Asia & thus Arabian Sea they have a better option Iran..
> But if they get access of a port in Arabian Sea without any cost, they will accept it.



A sensible post, and yes you raise a valid point and i also agree with your assessment that Russia has better options available to it than the route through Pakistan


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## v9s

Turingsage said:


> This laughable fantasy was initially sold to the brainwashed and dimwitted Pakistani Awam ( by the Pakistani Army) to justify the sale of Pakistani territory and manpower in support of US imperialism ( CENTO SEATO etc). It received tens of billions from the US whose only purpose was the breakup of the Soviet Union. The US and GHQ carried through with support of a terrorist group, the Taliban, to unravel Russia and its union with Afghanistan as road kill in pursuit of this goal.
> Afghanistan was ultimately abandoned by the US when the goal of destroying the Soviet and Union was achieved, Pakistan however decided that the Taliban were the perfect proxy ( Like its other many proxies across South Asia) to keep Afghanistan for itself
> That fantasy is still being played out
> Russia has no need for a "Pakistani warm water port" that delusion is just for the brainwashed.
> Russia never forgot and will never forget Stalingrad, The siege of Moscow the 20 million killed in the second world war.
> It has a long term plan to pay back those that wronged them and yes Pakistan does feature in that, EVENTUALLY.



lol chutiya

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## Goenitz

Kaptaan said:


> Sochi, Russia - warm water?


Sochi.. nowadays




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154426869484340


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## Indus Pakistan

Goenitz said:


> Sochi.. nowadays
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10154426869484340


Istanbul. Winter .....





I am big fanboy of CPEC but it's credibility is tarnished if you ttry to make it look like it is centre of universe. Russia does not need Gwadar directly. This Russian 'warm water port' is largely myth that was peddled by Gen. Zia to get more dollars out of the West - He himself had barrowed it from some dubvious sources from 19th century.

Russia has enough ports on every flank, east, west, south and even north. In winter some of them are iced over but Russian's are not babboons from Africa. They along with others who live in the freezing north like Finns, Swedes and Norweigians have adapted for their cold environment. They uses icebreakers to cut paths through the norther seaports. In addition if you look at East Asia they have Vladisvostok which is near Japan. Koreas and Northern China.

They have almost every ocean covered except for Indian Ocean. However if they wanted to they could use Iran for that as it is closer to their main population centres.


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## Taimoor Khan

Kaptaan said:


> Istanbul. Winter .....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am big fanboy of CPEC but it's credibility is tarnished if you ttry to make it look like it is centre of universe. Russia does not need Gwadar directly. This Russian 'warm water port' is largely myth that was peddled by Gen. Zia to get more dollars out of the West - He himself had barrowed it from some dubvious sources from 19th century.
> 
> Russia has enough ports on every flank, east, west, south and even north. In winter some of them are iced over but Russian's are not babboons from Africa. They along with others who live in the freezing north like Finns, Swedes and Norweigians have adapted for their cold environment. They uses icebreakers to cut paths through the norther seaports. In addition if you look at East Asia they have Vladisvostok which is near Japan. Koreas and Northern China.
> 
> They have almost every ocean covered except for Indian Ocean. However if they wanted to they could use Iran for that as it is closer to their main population centres.




They can have many "Sochi" along the black sea coast, however their bottleneck will always be the Bosporus which is controlled by Turkey/Nato. Black Sea is in a nutshell is a lake. You also mentioned St Petersburg, however both ingress/egress is controlled by Europe/NATO if you look at geography. Understanding present geopolitical landscape, an arc from Russia, down to China, into Pakistan and off to Arabian Sea via Gawadar makes all sense, bypassing all the "stans" of central Asia. This is todays news:

http://www.dawn.com/news/1302291/pakistan-russia-hold-first-ever-consultation-on-regional-issues

_"During the consultations, a wide range of regional issues as well as key areas of mutual interest, including economic cooperation and *connectivity*, were discussed."
_
There is definitely something cooking with regards to CPEC and Russian participation in it.

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## Indus Pakistan

Taimoor Khan said:


> Understanding present geopolitical landscape, an arc from Russia, down to China, into Pakistan and off to Arabian Sea via Gawadar makes all sense, bypassing all the "stans" of central Asia. This is todays news:


No offence but lots of these articles on newspapers and I say this with regret are written by immature men with staggering lack of insight or maybe they do it just to feed the ignorant Pakistani public similar to tabliods do in UK.

Let's get a few facts correct. Major portion of Russian population lives in European Russia. I have drawn two lines on map below. Red is the Iran route and green the Pakistan route. Look which one makes more sense? The green is nightmare, it has to go through so many Stans and then it has to go through the country our members at PDF love like no other, Afghanistan. Imagine the complications and political poblems in sustaining this route and in addition it is actually longer.

Then compare the red or Iranian route. Russia already has very good relations with that country and indeed is allied with Iran in the civil war in Syria whereas our position is ambivalent. Overlooking that Iran route is shortest and if needed can be effected without even depending on any other country - along the doted red lines thus this route would be politically robust. Therefore beyond grandstanding nobody can make a serious case for Russian need for Gwadar. I think the map below makes it crystal clear.

And finally do not underestimate Black Sea. No country would dare block it off from Russia. The only possibility would be if NATO was involved in which case we would be heading for a nuclear showdown as Russia would not allow those routes ( along with the Baltic - St Petersburgh) to be blocked therefore this block scenario is not applicable.

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## TMA

Kaptaan said:


> No offence but lots of these articles on newspapers and I say this with regret are written by immature men with staggering lack of insight or maybe they do it just to feed the ignorant Pakistani public similar to tabliods do in UK.
> 
> Let's get a few facts correct. Major portion of Russian population lives in European Russia. I have drawn two lines on map below. Red is the Iran route and green the Pakistan route. Look which one makes more sense? The green is nightmare, it has to go through so many Stans and then it has to go through the country our members at PDF love like no other, Afghanistan. Imagine the complications and political poblems in sustaining this route and in addition it is actually longer.
> 
> Then compare the red or Iranian route. Russia already has very good relations with that country and indeed is allied with Iran in the civil war in Syria whereas our position is ambivalent. Overlooking that Iran route is shortest and if needed can be effected without even depending on any other country - along the doted red lines thus this route would be politically robust. Therefore beyond grandstanding nobody can make a serious case for Russian need for Gwadar. I think the map below makes it crystal clear.
> 
> And finally do not underestimate Black Sea. No country would dare block it off from Russia. The only possibility would be if NATO was involved in which case we would be heading for a nuclear showdown as Russia would not allow those routes ( along with the Baltic - St Petersburgh) to be blocked therefore this block scenario is not applicable.


But what about allowing Russia to use Pakistani ports as a military naval base, a bit like Syria has allowed Russia a Mediterranean port?


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## Taimoor Khan

Kaptaan said:


> No offence but lots of these articles on newspapers and I say this with regret are written by immature men with staggering lack of insight or maybe they do it just to feed the ignorant Pakistani public similar to tabliods do in UK.
> 
> Let's get a few facts correct. Major portion of Russian population lives in European Russia. I have drawn two lines on map below. Red is the Iran route and green the Pakistan route. Look which one makes more sense? The green is nightmare, it has to go through so many Stans and then it has to go through the country our members at PDF love like no other, Afghanistan. Imagine the complications and political poblems in sustaining this route and in addition it is actually longer.
> 
> Then compare the red or Iranian route. Russia already has very good relations with that country and indeed is allied with Iran in the civil war in Syria whereas our position is ambivalent. Overlooking that Iran route is shortest and if needed can be effected without even depending on any other country - along the doted red lines thus this route would be politically robust. Therefore beyond grandstanding nobody can make a serious case for Russian need for Gwadar. I think the map below makes it crystal clear.
> 
> And finally do not underestimate Black Sea. No country would dare block it off from Russia. The only possibility would be if NATO was involved in which case we would be heading for a nuclear showdown as Russia would not allow those routes ( along with the Baltic - St Petersburgh) to be blocked therefore this block scenario is not applicable.



You have to understand what I was saying in my original posting, only selective quotation wont make sense.


First understand what CPEC is. Its a trade "corridor". Just like you got corridors in vastness of high seas and oceans where lonely ships carry goods far away from the human population, think of it the same way or route to transport goods for trade, overland. Where the population resides, does not matter a bit. Answer this, did Chinese cared about this fact that majority of industry and population lies on their eastern part of country far away from KKH? YET, its them who proposed to Pakistan the concept of CPEC years ago. Did WE in Pakistan cared about that Gawadar was basically a fishermen town , desolate and cut off from any civilization from rest of Pakistan? 

Now put yourself in a Russian strategist shoes and think what is happening around your country. First the west headed by yanks did a "regime change" in Ukraine and Russia responded by annexing Crimea, the upper basin of black sea, because if they didnt act at that time, they could have kissed goodbye to their direct access to black sea. failing to restrict Russia through upper basin, they tried to create crisis in lower basin, between Turkey and Russia by downing Russian jet by a Gulenist pilot which when failed to achieve the desired results, they tried direct "regime change" through western puppets, the Gulenists. Your assumption that no one should dare block Russia is naive, they are not only daring, but actually working on their planes to cage Russia in. Russia do need to explore other alternative routes to its access to outside world. It is in Russia own interest, not Pakistan. 

Now I have done the modification to your map and I want to go back to my original post where I talked about direct link between Russia, down to China, and Pakistan, bypassing all the "stans" of central Asia including Afghansitan. The route 3.







The route 1 , also got the "stans" of central Asia, and other states in between who can flip flop at the whims of uncle sam and put spanner in the works. Caspian Sea route would be idiotic to even think about. 

I have already discarded route 2.

Now coming to route 3. China and Russia already got solid links between them. CPEC is more or less complete now. You already have full connectivity from Gawadar all the way to Russia. However, most important thing here is that between Russia, China and Pakistan, you are talking about world first, third and perhaps fourth biggest nukes powers, with "odd" America sitting at number 2 position. This "trioka" is such a formidable block , if and when connected via CPEC, those who dare to derail or sabotage this connectivity , will pay price that they cannot afford. Your route 1 and 2 can easily be manipulated by external forces through the tin pot states of central Asia including Iran itself. With all due respect, Iran is a paper tiger. 

Looking long term, the route which can survive the changes on geopolitics is the route 3 only.

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## Indus Pakistan

We will look into this later when I have more time but if you have had contact with Central Asians, Kazakhs, Uzbeks etc you will know that they are practically 'honourable Russians'. I mean this, they talk Russian like almost first language, they even have distinct Russian mannerisms. If you think the Stans will drop Russia you have it wrong. Between Russian cultural influence and Chinese economic influence US has no chance of gaing leverage in this region.

Talking of culture I have ran into some Tajiks from Tajikistan. You know how Northern Alliance is full of Tajiks, well these Tajiks are polar opposites of Afghan Tajiks. Their women are entirely westernized and the ones I met drank freely. In fact most were almost indistinquishable from Europeans. To cap it Russian Army is based in Tajikistan guarding their southern border against Islamists. My point being the last Stan that Russia will trust is Pakistan. The rest with exception of Pakistan are it's 'blood brothers' so to speak.

Your assumption that they will place Pakistan above Stans is badly mistaken.


_Unlike the other former Soviet states of Central Asia, Tajikistan did not form armed forces based upon former Soviet units on its territory. Instead, the Russian Ministry of Defence took control of the Dushanbe-based 201st Motor Rifle Division. Control simply shifted from the former district headquarters in Tashkent, which was in now-independent Uzbekistan, to Moscow. Also present in Tajikistan was a large contingent of Soviet border guards, which transitioned into a Russian-officered force with Tajik conscripts. For a long period a CIS peacekeeping force, built around the 201st MRD, were in place in the country.
_
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Tajikistan


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## Taimoor Khan

Kaptaan said:


> We will look into this later when I have more time but if you have had contact with Central Asians, Kazakhs, Uzbeks etc you will know that they are practically 'honourable Russians'. I mean this, they talk Russian like almost first language, they even have distinct Russian mannerisms. If you think the Stans will drop Russia you have it wrong. Between Russian cultural influence and Chinese economic influence US has no chance of gaing leverage in this region.
> 
> Talking of culture I have ran into some Tajiks from Tajikistan. You know how Northern Alliance is full of Tajiks, well these Tajiks are polar opposites of Afghan Tajiks. Their women are entirely westernized and the ones I met drank freely. In fact most were almost indistinquishable from Europeans. To cap it Russian Army is based in Tajikistan guarding their southern border against Islamists. My point being the last Stan that Russia will trust is Pakistan. The rest with exception of Pakistan are it's 'blood brothers' so to speak.
> 
> Your assumption that they will place Pakistan above Stans is badly mistaken.
> 
> 
> _Unlike the other former Soviet states of Central Asia, Tajikistan did not form armed forces based upon former Soviet units on its territory. Instead, the Russian Ministry of Defence took control of the Dushanbe-based 201st Motor Rifle Division. Control simply shifted from the former district headquarters in Tashkent, which was in now-independent Uzbekistan, to Moscow. Also present in Tajikistan was a large contingent of Soviet border guards, which transitioned into a Russian-officered force with Tajik conscripts. For a long period a CIS peacekeeping force, built around the 201st MRD, were in place in the country.
> _
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Tajikistan




These "honorable Russian" you so highly speak of, they have allowed American military bases on their soil. Worst, most of CIA black ops are carried out from the "stans" of central Asia. Hell, even India got presence there. 

Do you think these central Asians are more "Russian" then Ukrainians? If west can engineer the "regime change" there, let me assure you, it will be a child play for them to give the same doze to the CIS states if they dare let Russia a safe passage. 

Its not about trusting Pakistan, there is no other option apart for China-Pakistan route when we talk about north south corridor. 


And please quote me next time so I know your have replied.

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## Indian wonk

Russia dosen't need CPEC they can use astrakhan oblast to Iran 

















This is what they have planned with India and Iran .


*Landlocked Central Asia gets shorter railway link to Persian Gulf*

Turkmenistan, Kazakhstan and Iran on Wednesday inaugurated a new railway route that will improve resource-rich Central Asia's access to markets in the Middle East and South Asia.

The 925-km (578-mile) stretch of railway, built jointly by the three Caspian neighbours, will ease the exchange of goods between the landlocked post-Soviet region and the countries lying along the Indian Ocean and the Persian Gulf.

It will also accelerate shipments of goods between the Persian Gulf and South Asia on the one hand and Russia and Europe on the other.

"These are just our first steps," Iranian President Hassan Rouhani told a ceremony in Turkmenistan which marked the end of the building of the final Turkmen-Iranian link of the new route, stretching from Uzen in western Kazakhstan to Gorgan in Iran.

"This (link) will cut trade costs and make trade more efficient."

Rouhani, accompanied by his Kazakh counterpart Nursultan Nazarbayev and Turkmenistan's Kurbanguly Berdymukhamedov, symbolically bolted up the railway's final link with wrenches.

The initial carrying capacity of the new railway route of 5 million tonnes of cargo a year is set to rise to 20 million tonnes annually in 2020.

"I am confident that this new route will create new geopolitical and new geoeconomic opportunities for the region's development, as well as for our nations," Berdymukhamedov said.

Turkmenistan, holder of the world's fourth-largest reserves of natural gas, hopes to ship textiles and products of its nascent gas processing industry along the new route, consistent with its strategy of economic diversification.

Oil-rich Kazakhstan, Central Asia's largest economy and grain producer, plans to boost exports of wheat to Iran and other markets of the region.


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## Indian wonk

According to the Ministry of Transport of the Russian Federation, the volume of transport via the North-South corridor, excluding oil and oil related products, could reach 30 to 40 million tons. *The initial agreement on the North-South corridor was signed between Russia, Iran, India and Oman in Saint Petersburg, Russia in September 2000*.
*The agreement proposes the shipment of goods and containers from India to Russia via Iran and the Caspian Sea*. Azerbaijan officially joined the corridor project on 10 September, 2005.* Russian experts estimate that, when compared to routes from South Asia to Northern European and Baltic ports via the Mediterranean and the Suez Canal, the North-South route through the Caspian Sea will shorten delivery periods by 10 to 20 days and reduce shipment costs by $400 to $500*.44 For example, if shipping a container from Germany to India via the Suez Canal costs about $3,500 and takes 40 days, it will cost $2,500 and take 15 to 20 days if shipped through the North-South corridor.


Chabar to Afghanistan






Astrakhan (Russia ) to Bandar Abbas (Iran) and other central asian states already complete no need for CPEC







Chabhar port and Bandar Abbas port in Iran in International north south corridor with corridors in Iran





Rail link nearly finished


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## Taimoor Khan

Indian wonk said:


> Russia dosen't need CPEC they can use astrakhan oblast to Iran



The Caspian Sea route is figment of Indian imagination. There are many load/unloads of goods, from train , trucks to ships in between that economic viability of such stupidity will not go far. Whereas CPEC provide just one stop shop among three very powerful nations, where Russian trucks when loaded in Russian territory will only unload at Gawadar.

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## Clutch

Russia supports China-Pakistan Economic Corridor project: Envoy

Russia says it "strongly" supports the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor project as it is crucial for Pakistan's economy and regional connectivity.

According to an interview on Radio Pakistan, this was stated by Russian Ambassador to Pakistan Alexey Y Dedov.

Dedov pointed out that CPEC is a component of China's Silk Road and his country was also working on a similar Eurasian Economic Union. He added that China and Russia are holding discussions to merge the two projects.

Asked about Pakistan's North-South gas pipeline project, the Russian Ambassador said they are eager to finalise the project at the soonest.

The ambassador said the two countries are closely cooperating in different areas but there is a need to enhance the volume of bilateral trade.

About the MI-35 gunship helicopter deal between the two countries, he said the contract has already been signed and it is now for the officials concerned to define a time-frame for the purpose.

Replying to a question, the Russian ambassador said his country wants Pakistan and India to resolve all issues including Jammu and Kashmir through peaceful means.

He said Pakistan and Russia are also closely cooperating in efforts for restoration of peace in Afghanistan.


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