# Z-8 and Z-18 transport helicopter thread



## Saifullah Sani

*A new anti-submarine warfare (ASW) helicopter for the People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) is undergoing trials and testing, according to news reports and Chinese military websites.*

The aircraft, believed to be designated Z-18F, has been developed from the Changhe Aircraft Industry Group (CAIG) Z-8, itself *a derivative of the long-serving French SA-321 Super Frelon.*

Images show that the Z-18 features a redesigned cockpit and modified hull form, while previous company statements suggest extensive use of composites and titanium in its construction. The reports also state that it is fitted with a new type of engine and composite main rotor blades.

These modifications appear to be in line with the Avicopter AC313 commercial design (originally designated Z-8F-100) that first flew from CAIG's Jingdezhen production facility in 2010. The AC313 is powered by three Pratt & Whitney (P&W) PT6B-67A engines, giving it a max speed around 180 kt, an operating range of 485 n miles, and an internal load capacity of 4 tonnes.

However, the Z-18 military variants are highly unlikely to have P&W engines in view of the fines imposed on P&W for supplying engines and control systems that were subsequently installed in the WZ-10 attack helicopter. Instead it is probable that the Z-18 is fitted with a development of the WZ-6 derivative of the Turbomeca Turmo 3C that powers the Z-8. AVIC (Engines) and Turbomeca (Safran) are jointly developing the Ardiden 3C/WZ16 engine that will power the medium-lift AC352/Z-15 derivative of the EC175.

The Z-18F ASW variant is equipped with a dipping sonar and reports suggest that it can carry up to 32 sonobuoys and 4 lightweight torpedoes such as the Yu-7. It has a prominent chin-mounted surface search radar and it is probable that the aircraft is fitted with a datalink like the Ka-28s in service with the PLA Navy, enabling it to operate in third-party targeting mode for long-range anti-ship cruise missiles launched from frigate or destroyer escorts.

*COMMENT*
None of the current PLAN destroyers or frigates will be able to support the 13.8-tonne maximum take-off weight of the Z-18, so in the near term it will be limited to operating at sea from the carrier Liaoning and the three Type 071 amphibious landing platform docks. The anticipated construction of Type 081 landing platform helicopter ships and Type 055 destroyers would increase the number of platforms that are capable of embarking the aircraft.

The Z-18F is the third variant to emerge, alongside a utility/VIP transport version and an airborne early warning (AEW) platform, possibly with the designation Z-18J. Mock-ups and prototypes of the AEW version, which has a radar antenna fitted in place of the loading ramp that is lowered for operation when the helicopter is airborne, have been photographed on Liaoning 's flight deck.

As with the Shenyang J-15 carrier strike aircraft, which features a shark emblem, the Z-18s appear to be marked with squadron-type emblems: the AEW variant is marked with a flying bat and the ASW aircraft with a swooping eagle. Commentators have suggested that both will be embarked on Liaoning in due course, with speculation that the carrier's air wing will include four AEW and four ASW helicopters, significantly enhancing its self-protection.

IHS Jane's recently reported that China also needs to deploy fixed-wing airborne early warning and control aircraft. Deploying a PLAN equivalent of the US' Northrop Grumman E-2C Hawkeye, perhaps derived from existing land-based aircraft, therefore represents a minimum requirement, although this would also require a carrier fitted with a catapult launching system.

China unveils ASW version of Z-18 helicopter - IHS Jane's 360

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## Genesis

A much improved version of the Z-8, these new helicopters can operate even in Tibet. This development will really strength PLA's ability to supply and its war making capabilities in the region.

Good times.













To see some obvious difference, this is a Z-8, look at the nose and also the landing gear, a lot of big difference for this helicopter.






In other news the first air cav Brigade has been created, we may be late, but we have finally created an air cav unit, and more will follow as we continue to break the barriers imposed on us by having primitive helicopter technology.

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## Genesis

Some bonus content with Z-10 attack helicopter fully loaded.

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## TimeTraveller

Both Helicopter looks amazing......

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## AgentOrange

The Z-18 can't come a moment too soon. China is still deficient in helicopters for disaster relief.

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## Sasquatch

Still waiting for the second Z-20.

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## gambit

AgentOrange said:


> The Z-18 can't come a moment too soon. China is still deficient in helicopters for *disaster relief*.


Not going to help China much regarding the highlighted.

Anyone who has ever been in a helo, either as a beneficiary of its many capabilities or even as a tourist, usually develops a new appreciation for the aircraft they never gave much thought before. The helo is often called 'The God Machine' or an angel or other variants of some divine creatures for good reasons. And the people who appreciates the helo the most are medical people and their charges.

That said...The reason why the Z-18, and it looks to be a capable medium transport helo, may not help China much is because internal Chinese airspace is still under strict military control. Of all the man-made flying machines, the helo is the most suitable and most amenable to civil aviation.

Medical emergencies, even when it is a positive thing like delivering a baby, are unexpected events that should *NOT* require filed flight plans before executions. Civil aviation is the best community to respond to these events. These events require the air ambulance to move in forward flight as soon as safety allows, which is between 100 to 1000 meters altitude and below most radars. You do not know if the victim is bleeding out or not, do not know if there are any internal injuries, you have very little information about the target landing area and must have faith on local authorities, and you must fly even if all you can do is drop the medic or just medical supplies. There is no time to call Beijing for permission to take off. These emergencies also require direct routes flight, not controlled air corridors that may involve altitude and heading changes. How many lives could have been saved if the Sichuan earthquake was accessible by civil aviation ?

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## cirr

Hu Songshan said:


> Still waiting for the second Z-20.



The timetable for the debut of high-speed helicopters（with speed 》400km/h）has been officially set：

中国在研新型高速直升机 时速将突破400千米|高原性能|作战需求_凤凰军事

So prototypes are expected within a couple of years。

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## UKBengali

^^ the bottom photo looks really cool.

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## monitor

cirr said:


> The timetable for the debut of high-speed helicopters（with speed 》400km/h）has been officially set：
> 
> 中国在研新型高速直升机 时速将突破400千米|高原性能|作战需求_凤凰军事
> 
> So prototypes are expected within a couple of years。
> 
> View attachment 179309
> 
> 
> View attachment 179310



Second aircraft looks cool any other specification set for this aircraft ?

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## AgentOrange

gambit said:


> Not going to help China much regarding the highlighted.
> 
> Anyone who has ever been in a helo, either as a beneficiary of its many capabilities or even as a tourist, usually develops a new appreciation for the aircraft they never gave much thought before. The helo is often called 'The God Machine' or an angel or other variants of some divine creatures for good reasons. And the people who appreciates the helo the most are medical people and their charges.
> 
> That said...The reason why the Z-18, and it looks to be a capable medium transport helo, may not help China much is because internal Chinese airspace is still under strict military control. Of all the man-made flying machines, the helo is the most suitable and most amenable to civil aviation.
> 
> Medical emergencies, even when it is a positive thing like delivering a baby, are unexpected events that should *NOT* require filed flight plans before executions. Civil aviation is the best community to respond to these events. These events require the air ambulance to move in forward flight as soon as safety allows, which is between 100 to 1000 meters altitude and below most radars. You do not know if the victim is bleeding out or not, do not know if there are any internal injuries, you have very little information about the target landing area and must have faith on local authorities, and you must fly even if all you can do is drop the medic or just medical supplies. There is no time to call Beijing for permission to take off. These emergencies also require direct routes flight, not controlled air corridors that may involve altitude and heading changes. How many lives could have been saved if the Sichuan earthquake was accessible by civil aviation ?



Good points. However, I read somewhere that nationwide, China only has helicopters numbering in the hundreds both civil and military. Compared to the thousands in service in the United States. After the Sichuan earthquake, though China's air traffic controllers may have been severely tested and found wanting in some instances, too often one would hear stories about Chinese first responders having to walk half a day to the disaster area because it was only accessible by chopper and China simply didn't have enough. IMO, at this point, any medium and heavy lift helos in any form would be desirable just to fill out the shortage in numbers in case something terrible happens again.

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## AZADPAKISTAN2009

ye to Amrika ki Kabaddi ho gai


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## black-hawk_101

Genesis said:


> A much improved version of the Z-8, these new helicopters can operate even in Tibet. This development will really strength PLA's ability to supply and its war making capabilities in the region.
> 
> Good times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To see some obvious difference, this is a Z-8, look at the nose and also the landing gear, a lot of big difference for this helicopter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In other news the first air cav Brigade has been created, we may be late, but we have finally created an air cav unit, and more will follow as we continue to break the barriers imposed on us by having primitive helicopter technology.



I am sure Pak will need it in good numbers like about 150 for PAA, 50 for PN and PAF and about some 110 for Paramilitary.


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## Zarvan

black-hawk_101 said:


> I am sure Pak will need it in good numbers like about 150 for PAA, 50 for PN and PAF and about some 110 for Paramilitary.


I would prefer the Transport helicopter Turkey is looking to build which is similar to Black HAWK and in really large numbers @Hakan @Neptune


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## black-hawk_101

Zarvan said:


> I would prefer the Transport helicopter Turkey is looking to build which is similar to Black HAWK and in really large numbers @Hakan @Neptune


But this one will help replace Mi-17s and rely on Russians.


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## Zarvan

black-hawk_101 said:


> But this one will help replace Mi-17s and rely on Russians.


Yes 100 of these could be good for Pakistan Army


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## DANGER-ZONE

@Oscar @Horus ..... Bhai ye *Nishan* k sath sath *Zarwan* ka dimag bhe karab ho gaya hai. 
Please do something about these wish listing, its really annoying.


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## Genesis

Zarvan said:


> I would prefer the Transport helicopter Turkey is looking to build which is similar to Black HAWK and in really large numbers @Hakan @Neptune




You mean this?







Z-20, better than Blackhawk, mostly because it's designed and made recently.


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## Zarvan

Genesis said:


> You mean this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Z-20, better than Blackhawk, mostly because it's designed and made recently.


Yes similar but Turkey will be able to put more western parts in there ones @danger Zone We nees really large number of both Teansport and Attack helicopters so in case of war we can move the troops in large numbers


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## 592257001

gambit said:


> Not going to help China much regarding the highlighted.
> 
> Anyone who has ever been in a helo, either as a beneficiary of its many capabilities or even as a tourist, usually develops a new appreciation for the aircraft they never gave much thought before. The helo is often called 'The God Machine' or an angel or other variants of some divine creatures for good reasons. And the people who appreciates the helo the most are medical people and their charges.
> 
> That said...The reason why the Z-18, and it looks to be a capable medium transport helo, may not help China much is because internal Chinese airspace is still under strict military control. Of all the man-made flying machines, the helo is the most suitable and most amenable to civil aviation.
> 
> Medical emergencies, even when it is a positive thing like delivering a baby, are unexpected events that should *NOT* require filed flight plans before executions. Civil aviation is the best community to respond to these events. These events require the air ambulance to move in forward flight as soon as safety allows, which is between 100 to 1000 meters altitude and below most radars. You do not know if the victim is bleeding out or not, do not know if there are any internal injuries, you have very little information about the target landing area and must have faith on local authorities, and you must fly even if all you can do is drop the medic or just medical supplies. There is no time to call Beijing for permission to take off. These emergencies also require direct routes flight, not controlled air corridors that may involve altitude and heading changes. How many lives could have been saved if the Sichuan earthquake was accessible by civil aviation ?



Official Chinese New Article: 西安将试点放开1000米以下低空空域 市民可空中游古城_新华网陕西频道
English Version: Opening of China’s low-altitude airspace to boost general aviation, ignores expanding civil aviation | CAPA - Centre for Aviation

It's good that you pointed out the 100-1000 meter altitude for the use of Civil Aviation, as China is opening up its airspace of that range as per this news article.

If you are trying to suggest that the Chinese relief effort is hampered by the lack of an organized civil rescue operation similar to that of STARS in Canada, then I have to suggest you to look it up, as the Chinese does not have a lack of such organization. There's also absolutely no need for these helicopters to have to "request permission from Beijing" while undergone rescue ops. (Of course there are still restricted military zones within China).










The main reason why China is just starting to open up its airspace for civil aviation is because China has 1/70 the amount of general aviation pilots the US does, so the need has just came up.

All in all, what AgnetOrange said about "China is still deficient in helicopters for disaster relief." is very much so correct, though I feel the addition of pilots would also be of great help.

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## Mughal-Prince

592257001 said:


> The main reason why China is just starting to open up its airspace for civil aviation is because *China has 1/70 the amount of general aviation pilots the US does,* so the need has just came up.
> 
> All in all, what AgnetOrange said about "China is still deficient in helicopters for disaster relief." is very much so correct, though I feel the addition of pilots would also be of great help.



Any opportunity in this region for international helo pilots .

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## 592257001

princeiftikharmirza said:


> Any opportunity in this region for international helo pilots .



Plenty, since China has a shortage of skilled civil helo pilots, international pilots would be very much so welcomed.


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## Talwar e Pakistan

The last pic is probably the most sexiest transport helicopter I've every seen.


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## Akasa

Genesis said:


> Z-20, better than Blackhawk, mostly because it's designed and made recently.



As if the Black Hawk hasn't undergone incremental upgrades...


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## BoQ77

Genesis said:


> You mean this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Z-20, better than Blackhawk, mostly because it's designed and made recently.



"better" ? what "better", real or planned performance ?

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## Mughal-Prince

592257001 said:


> Plenty, since China has a shortage of skilled civil helo pilots, international pilots would be very much so welcomed.



What about wages and if I am in a process of learning then ??


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## Genesis

princeiftikharmirza said:


> What about wages and if I am in a process of learning then ??


very high, potentially higher than America, if the current airliner pilots are any indication.

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## Irfan Baloch

Zarvan said:


> I would prefer the Transport helicopter Turkey is looking to build which is similar to Black HAWK and in really large numbers @Hakan @Neptune




If that carries any American components like T 129 then it wont happen like ATAK coptef cant be procured due to American powerplant

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## Mughal-Prince

Genesis said:


> very high, potentially higher than America, if the current airliner pilots are any indication.



Any age restriction??


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## Deino

A new image ....

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## graphican

Its a big helicopter. Is it able to carry some 30-40 soldiers together?


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## 帅的一匹

It looks good, fill up the stop gap.

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## Deino

Just a small remark especially to the different tail-boom design of both the PLA Z-18A and the three Z-18-naval versions ... IMO it's a bit strange that the design is so much different !

Deino

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## Deino

Look what's there .... + a Z-20 in the background !!!

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## Deino

Finally spotted again ...

1. on board the Liaoning as a VIP:






2. the PLA-LH-version Z-18A:


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## Zarvan

__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1826142324270946







The CCTV News has released video footage of new Z-18A military transport helicopter for People’s Liberation Army Ground Force.

China started reforming the People’s Liberation Army a year ago. Its ground force is undergoing a transformation, with the help of some helicopter test pilots. Part of the reforming program was the development of a new medium transport helicopter.

The Z-18A is a is a medium transport helicopter developed by Changhe Aircraft Industries Corporation (CAIC) to replace the Z-8 and Russian Mi-17.

The Z-18 is a single-rotor helicopter with tail rotor and a non-retractable landing gear, thought to be based on the Avicopter AC313, an updated design based on the earlier Harbin Z-8, itself a development of the Aérospatiale Super Frelon.

http://defence-blog.com/news/china-...ansport-helicopter-for-pla-ground-forces.html

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## Beast

I think the PLA reform is the PLA has their own aviation corps like transport helo and gunship. When they need CSA, they can call upon their own one without needing the aviation compatriot support.

This will make PLA more mobile and fast reaction.

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## cirr

Z-11WB






for police anti-terrorism squads?

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## zestokryl

I am imagining Z 11 WB, as a somehow redesigned, unmanned attack helicopter UAV 

Is the engine made in China out of chinese components ?


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## Beast

zestokryl said:


> I am imagining Z 11 WB, as a somehow redesigned, unmanned attack helicopter UAV
> 
> Is the engine made in China out of chinese components ?


Yes,all made in China. China has no problem regards to helo engines or producintg turboshaft.

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## RAMPAGE




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## zestokryl

Beast said:


> Yes,all made in China. China has no problem regards to helo engines or producintg turboshaft.



Thats very good. Russia is in dire straits in this regard. They dont have domestic engines for Ansat and Ka 226 helicopters, as for Mi 34 which got abandoned. The last is the class of the Z 11 WB, but sadly its dead born project

Im glad China is much wiser than Russia, with steady work and decade long commitments in projects. Thats why I asked. Medium and light turboshaft and turboprops are extremely important


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## Beast

zestokryl said:


> Thats very good. Russia is in dire straits in this regard. They dont have domestic engines for Ansat and Ka 226 helicopters, as for Mi 34 which got abandoned. The last is the class of the Z 11 WB, but sadly its dead born project
> 
> Im glad China is much wiser than Russia, with steady work and decade long commitments in projects. Thats why I asked. Medium and light turboshaft and turboprops are extremely important



They make the right choice to alliance with China. All they need to do is buy from China 

Sure at the moment we do not have some real heavy power turboshaft but its enough at least.

https://defence.pk/threads/russia-installed-chinese-engines-on-her-buyan-class-corvettes.429970/

Now its ship diesel engine. Turbo shaft maybe next? Who know...


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## Deino

Family CG: Seems only the AEW version and the tactical transport version missing !

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## Suff Shikan

Genesis said:


> Some bonus content with Z-10 attack helicopter fully loaded.


Looks awasome.... its so lethaly beautiful


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## Zarvan



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## war&peace

Can it be a replacement for the sea king helis?

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## Khafee

war&peace said:


> Can it be a replacement for the sea king helis?


@Deino @Chinese-Dragon are more knowledgeable and the right people to answer this question. It's not a question of just specs, but reliability / down time, would be a major issue. Lets see what these learned gentlemen say.

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## Deino

Upps ... There seem be now even four Z-18J AEW-helicopters on-board the CV-16 Liaoning.



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/816684881958805504


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## cirr



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## Deino

Deino said:


> Finally spotted again ...
> 
> 1. on board the Liaoning as a VIP:
> 
> View attachment 324928




Both Z-18 VIP and COD transports #380 & #381 !

By the way, what's the text written on the fuselage ? China Navy ?? ...these four ?? 中国海军


Deino

#380





#381

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/819911857276383232

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## Deino

Hmmmm ... again some Z-8-related news, ...


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/823210104849731585
... however but why another Z-8-variant if there's already the AC313 and Z-18-series or why not base it on the new airframe ?

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## Deino



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## Deino

Deino said:


> View attachment 372645




A bit better but still with that nasty text on top...

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## fgdi iuoy

Base for helicopter transport medium and anti-submarine Z-18F in Duncan Island

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## Deino

Deino said:


> Hmmmm ... again some Z-8-related news, ...
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/823210104849731585
> ... however but why another Z-8-variant if there's already the AC313 and Z-18-series or why not base it on the new airframe ?




Just found this, not sure if only fan-art ... but isn't the PLA-LH-version Z-18A not already that wider fuselage Z-8G ?

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## Deino

Still the prototype or a first operational one ?

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/887640573422608384

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## cirr

Z-10ME？Z-10X？Z-XX？

*景德镇：披星戴月的直升机人*

千年瓷都景德镇东郊南山之麓、南河之滨，同样有一群异常忙碌的直升机人。航空工业直升机所坐落此地已近半个世纪，走进园区，楼宇高耸，花团锦簇，优雅的环境和人们匆匆的行色给人一种紧张有序的节奏感。

某型机科研团队今年以来的工作状态又是怎样呢？总师冯胜全介绍，该型直升机研制意义十分重大。为确保装备好用管用，冯胜全带队与客户进行了充分沟通，了解使用需求，后来产生的方案就是基于用户需求的共识。

总体气动研究室副主任张威将这型直升机比作帅小伙，外形设计漂亮，不仅长得好看，而且还非常内秀，性能指标没有下降。直升机体型大了，有效载荷却不能减少，只有从其他地方把重量抠下来。负责总体设计的李黔为此费尽了心机。好在有一个擅长技术攻关的青年团队，他们大多是近几年入职的硕士和博士。硕士王之良在机身阻力方面是主力，而博士徐明则在多方面显示了才华和干劲。

结构室副主任吴硕表示，这型机有许多新研项目，例如驾驶舱、整个机身结构、起落架，在详细设计阶段，结构室发图量接近50%。为了保证进度，他们尽可能把工作往前赶，起落架的图纸早在去年底就发往主机厂了，结构发图到今年6月也基本完成。

吴硕介绍，原有型号是钣金结构，现在采用的是复合材料，零件实施了整体化设计，这就使机身寿命大大延长，也有效提高了制造质量。与直10相比，驾驶舱防弹能力更强，单位重量则有所减轻。之所以能够取得这些进步，是因为充分借鉴了直10等型号的研制经验。吴硕说，大家的干劲也是重要因素，在近期评选优秀项目负责人时，大家一致选出了老党员程小青。程小青负责技术把关，协调工作特别繁杂，但是把工作交给他总是令人放心，他的特点是主动，而且非常细心。

这个型号有许多工作属于第一次，全机电缆优化布置是其中之一。电气特设研究室副主任曾庆吉介绍，目前的电缆布置给人直观的感受是整齐美观，电缆的重量、重心位置都清晰了，对于后续维护将非常便利。那为什么能够做得这么好呢？曾庆吉告诉我们，这得益于设计手段的改进，他们采用了新的软件，并且进行了二次开发，设计员杨庆在这方面贡献很大。

曾庆吉说，型号没有沿用过去的直流发电系统，进行了很大改动，做了可以兼容进口和国产设备的双构型设计。这项工作难度不小，科研人员做了深入钻研，经过多次讨论，找出两套设备的差异，不断调整设计，经过一个多月的努力，达到了比较理想的状态。

系统研究室燃油设计主管杨勇志介绍，这个型号的燃油系统也是全新研制，为了把4个油箱贴住两侧短翼，在保证油量不减的情况下，油箱的形状一改以往的长方形，变得不规则了，不仅如此，油箱的防弹防爆标准更高了，他们首次在直升机上采用了橡胶油箱，油箱管路的复杂性大大提高，在设计过程中，流体仿真软件的应用为解决问题提供了有效帮助。杨勇志说：“起初还犯过错误，导致加油时偏向左侧的油箱，重新设计后才使得供油均衡。为了任务，组里的同事们也是拼了，周佐俊的孩子刚满1岁，夫妻两地分居，他时常加班到半夜，有一回不知不觉干到了凌晨。”

所里的人都知道强度室有个钱学森，这回他在型号研制中和同事们一起攻克了在机舱内系留大质量设备这一关键问题。钱学森工作紧张的时候一忙就到了深夜两三点，“虽然累，但是内心充实，难题因此也就一个个被攻克了”。

http://www.cannews.com.cn/2017/0928/167020.shtml

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## aliaselin

cirr said:


> Z-10ME？Z-10X？Z-XX？
> 
> *景德镇：披星戴月的直升机人*
> 
> 千年瓷都景德镇东郊南山之麓、南河之滨，同样有一群异常忙碌的直升机人。航空工业直升机所坐落此地已近半个世纪，走进园区，楼宇高耸，花团锦簇，优雅的环境和人们匆匆的行色给人一种紧张有序的节奏感。
> 
> 某型机科研团队今年以来的工作状态又是怎样呢？总师冯胜全介绍，该型直升机研制意义十分重大。为确保装备好用管用，冯胜全带队与客户进行了充分沟通，了解使用需求，后来产生的方案就是基于用户需求的共识。
> 
> 总体气动研究室副主任张威将这型直升机比作帅小伙，外形设计漂亮，不仅长得好看，而且还非常内秀，性能指标没有下降。直升机体型大了，有效载荷却不能减少，只有从其他地方把重量抠下来。负责总体设计的李黔为此费尽了心机。好在有一个擅长技术攻关的青年团队，他们大多是近几年入职的硕士和博士。硕士王之良在机身阻力方面是主力，而博士徐明则在多方面显示了才华和干劲。
> 
> 结构室副主任吴硕表示，这型机有许多新研项目，例如驾驶舱、整个机身结构、起落架，在详细设计阶段，结构室发图量接近50%。为了保证进度，他们尽可能把工作往前赶，起落架的图纸早在去年底就发往主机厂了，结构发图到今年6月也基本完成。
> 
> 吴硕介绍，原有型号是钣金结构，现在采用的是复合材料，零件实施了整体化设计，这就使机身寿命大大延长，也有效提高了制造质量。与直10相比，驾驶舱防弹能力更强，单位重量则有所减轻。之所以能够取得这些进步，是因为充分借鉴了直10等型号的研制经验。吴硕说，大家的干劲也是重要因素，在近期评选优秀项目负责人时，大家一致选出了老党员程小青。程小青负责技术把关，协调工作特别繁杂，但是把工作交给他总是令人放心，他的特点是主动，而且非常细心。
> 
> 这个型号有许多工作属于第一次，全机电缆优化布置是其中之一。电气特设研究室副主任曾庆吉介绍，目前的电缆布置给人直观的感受是整齐美观，电缆的重量、重心位置都清晰了，对于后续维护将非常便利。那为什么能够做得这么好呢？曾庆吉告诉我们，这得益于设计手段的改进，他们采用了新的软件，并且进行了二次开发，设计员杨庆在这方面贡献很大。
> 
> 曾庆吉说，型号没有沿用过去的直流发电系统，进行了很大改动，做了可以兼容进口和国产设备的双构型设计。这项工作难度不小，科研人员做了深入钻研，经过多次讨论，找出两套设备的差异，不断调整设计，经过一个多月的努力，达到了比较理想的状态。
> 
> 系统研究室燃油设计主管杨勇志介绍，这个型号的燃油系统也是全新研制，为了把4个油箱贴住两侧短翼，在保证油量不减的情况下，油箱的形状一改以往的长方形，变得不规则了，不仅如此，油箱的防弹防爆标准更高了，他们首次在直升机上采用了橡胶油箱，油箱管路的复杂性大大提高，在设计过程中，流体仿真软件的应用为解决问题提供了有效帮助。杨勇志说：“起初还犯过错误，导致加油时偏向左侧的油箱，重新设计后才使得供油均衡。为了任务，组里的同事们也是拼了，周佐俊的孩子刚满1岁，夫妻两地分居，他时常加班到半夜，有一回不知不觉干到了凌晨。”
> 
> 所里的人都知道强度室有个钱学森，这回他在型号研制中和同事们一起攻克了在机舱内系留大质量设备这一关键问题。钱学森工作紧张的时候一忙就到了深夜两三点，“虽然累，但是内心充实，难题因此也就一个个被攻克了”。
> 
> http://www.cannews.com.cn/2017/0928/167020.shtml


Wide-body Z-18， compared to EH-101


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## Deino

aliaselin said:


> Wide-body Z-18， compared to EH-101




Could be the one posted just a few posts above?!


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## cirr

Factory designation - Type A903











What is it？New heavy attack helicopter? New stealth helicopter? Unknown type?


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## Deino

cirr said:


> Factory designation - Type A903
> 
> View attachment 441560
> 
> View attachment 441559
> 
> 
> What is it？New heavy attack helicopter? New stealth helicopter? Unknown type?




Most interesting any info on what factory?

Otherwise given its shape I don't think it is a combat helicopter and for its size it is difficult to assume if it is as big as a Z-18 development - so maybe the wide-fuselage version ? - or a bit smaller, more in the size of an NH-90 or S-70/Z-20??

Deino


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## cirr

Deino said:


> Most interesting any info on what factory?
> 
> Otherwise given its shape I don't think it is a combat helicopter and for its size it is difficult to assume if it is as big as a Z-18 development - so maybe the wide-fuselage version ? - or a bit smaller, more in the size of an NH-90 or S-70/Z-20??
> 
> Deino



Changhe

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## aliaselin

The thigh of a man Chinese is about 40~50 cm, and the width of the fuselage is 4-2/3 of the thigh, that is about 1.87m to 2.33m. So it should be Z-8 series.

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## Deino

cirr said:


> Changhe




Thanks a lot. So indeed most likely a Z-18 variant of some sort.

The front section reminds me to the Z-18A:


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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> Thanks a lot. So indeed most likely a Z-18 variant of some sort.
> 
> The front section reminds me to the Z-18A:
> View attachment 441607



Maybe Z-8K（Wide-body Z-18）


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## cirr

Deino said:


> Thanks a lot. So indeed most likely a Z-18 variant of some sort.
> 
> The front section reminds me to the Z-18A:
> View attachment 441607



Can't be certain.

Back on 24/11/2016 an AVIC spokesperson said in a meeting attended by the Minister for Industry and Information, that the company will unveil a number of new helicopters in 2017/2018, including one that is far more complex/sophisticated than the Z-10.


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## cirr

Project A903

*【最美一线】新型号背后的航空人*

2017-10-10 17:34

每一个新型号从研制到生产，

都体现着无数航空人的光荣与梦想！

每一架“中国制造”直升机的背后，

都凝结了众多航空人的智慧与汗水！






当前，昌飞公司掀起大干热潮，冲刺全年科研生产任务目标。让我们一起走近公司A903项目团队，感受航空人的大干激情。

由于时间紧、任务重、难度大，团队从成立起，每个人就做好了打硬仗的准备。为了加强团队的组织性，团队以计划为牵引，注重过程管控，执行周、日点检制度，采用集中办公的模式开展工作，坚决开展并行工程，严格进行工艺控制。

为了加快型号进度，团队的审查工作自设计方案构思之初便提前介入。工程技术部派出近20人到直升机设计研究所开展联合设计工作，早出晚归，加班加点。主管工艺驻扎直升机设计研究所进行设计数据的工艺审查，当场反馈意见并立即协调设计更改，极大地提升了工艺审查的效率和质量，在短短的3天时间内就完成了部件的工艺性审查并反馈给直升机设计研究所，在设计方案完全确定之前就已反馈完成大部分的改进意见，做到整体工艺进度与设计高度并行。






在整个型号工装研制初期，产品数据状态不稳定等因素给工装设计带来了很大的困难。工装设计所全体人员并没有被困难吓倒，合理安排任务节点，在年初制定“4+1”加班模式后，因任务紧急，毅然选择制定“7+7”工作模式（即一周工作7个白天和7个晚上）。






面对这场攻坚战，工程技术人员做到现场跟产，及时解决生产问题，生产操作人员，认真做好本职工作，确保产品质量。






各生产单位顾大局、讲担当，全力支持项目研制工作，项目团队与生产单位围绕共同目标进行密切合作。






团队在项目推进的过程中，一直重视技术改进。A903项目是公司整机采用MBD研制模式的第一个项目，技术状态控制方面做了积极的探索和改进，大型整体机加框均一次交检合格；对复合材料零件按特点进行分类，从模具设计开始就进行技术改进，确保了复合材料零件的成型质量；采用铆装模块化的分段形式，攻克了大部件对接产生的阶差和间隙等技术难题。






*国之重器，使命在肩*！

保节点、高质量、控成本、出精品！

多少个深夜，团队成员加班加点、通宵达旦！

多少次攻坚，团队成员敢于挑战，奋勇向前！

朝气蓬勃的干劲，

挑战极限的韧劲，

团结拼搏的作风，

A903项目团队上下齐心，

在大干四季度热潮中砥砺前行。






艰难困苦玉汝于成，风雨过后就是彩虹！正是因为昌飞人昂扬拼搏的斗志，让航空报国的誓言更加嘹亮；正是因为昌飞人担当作为的大干激情，让公司科研生产不断取得新进展、迈上新台阶。

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## Deino

So what is it ??? At the CDF Xinhiu is quite sure it is a Z-20.


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## aliaselin

Deino said:


> So what is it ??? At the CDF Xinhiu is quite sure it is a Z-20.


The original news does not have the enveloped helicopter at all!!!


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> So what is it ??? At the CDF Xinhiu is quite sure it is a Z-20.



Z-20 is manufactured by HAC.

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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> Z-20 is manufactured by HAC.




Yes I know and therefore it is either a Z-18A variant of some sort or something new, I so far did not get a reply to that argument.

Any idea from your side on what it is?

Deino


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Yes I know and therefore it is either a Z-18A variant of some sort or something new, I so far did not get a reply to that argument.
> 
> Any idea from your side on what it is?
> 
> Deino



I believe it is a derivative of Z-8.

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## Deino

Z-18A in service ... looks like LH952821 ... maybe?!


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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> Z-18A in service ... looks like LH952821 ... maybe?!
> 
> View attachment 446334
> View attachment 446335
> View attachment 446336



Why no antenna?


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## Deino

clarkgap said:


> Why no antenna?




You mean the Beidou-SAT-dome?


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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> You mean the Beidou-SAT-dome?
> 
> View attachment 446356



Yes, I saw Z-18A and Z-20 prototype both installed it.


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> Z-18A in service ... looks like LH952821 ... maybe?!
> 
> View attachment 446334
> View attachment 446335
> View attachment 446336



This is called Z-8G.


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## Deino

星海军事 said:


> This is called Z-8G.




That's interesting ... so only the naval variants are designated Z-18 or is this wrong too?


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## 星海军事

Deino said:


> only the naval variants are designated Z-18



That's correct.

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## Deino

Better image ...

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## Deino



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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> View attachment 446639



https://weibo.com/1728148193/FD7hciMfb?type=comment#_rnd1515255783134

Z-8G in an aviation brigade of Xinjiang Military region:






“【新疆军区某陆航旅沙场点兵 场面壮观！】“开车！”十余架多机型混编直升机群一字排开，机声轰鸣，旋翼卷起的浮雪瞬间将直升机包裹，某新型国产运输直升机率先升空。1月3日上午，新疆军区某陆航旅千余名官兵，十余个作战要素迅即奔向各自战位，掀起年度军事训练热潮。”

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## Beast

Deino said:


> View attachment 446639


Z-18 looks like a combo of NH-90 and Super Frelon...


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## clarkgap

clarkgap said:


> https://weibo.com/1728148193/FD7hciMfb?type=comment#_rnd1515255783134
> 
> Z-8G in an aviation brigade of Xinjiang Military region:
> 
> View attachment 446652
> 
> 
> “【新疆军区某陆航旅沙场点兵 场面壮观！】“开车！”十余架多机型混编直升机群一字排开，机声轰鸣，旋翼卷起的浮雪瞬间将直升机包裹，某新型国产运输直升机率先升空。1月3日上午，新疆军区某陆航旅千余名官兵，十余个作战要素迅即奔向各自战位，掀起年度军事训练热潮。”



More detail about this Brigade:
https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/2aT_1De1xh1ts09ARmAB-Q
http://photo.chinamil.com.cn/jypk/2018-01/05/content_7896856.htm






Is it LH911822? Moreover, I am confusing about the SATCOM antenna on top of the tail boom ...

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## JSCh

*Chinese army commissions new homemade heavy-lift helicopter*
Ding Xiaoxiao China Plus Published: 2018-01-06 19:39:48

The People’s Liberation Army (PLA) has commissioned China’s domestically developed transport helicopter Z-18A, reports China Central Television (CCTV). 



Pilots chat besides a Z-18A helicopter. [File Photo: ifeng.com]

The Z-18A can carry up to 30 passengers and has a range of about 1,000 kilometers. The Z-18A is more powerful than the earlier Z-8B model or the MI-171 helicopter manufactured by Russia for the Chinese military. The Z-18A is capable of flying as high as 8,000 meters on plateaus, and it can carry people as well as large pieces of equipment. 

The aircraft can operate during both daytime and nighttime, and can fly in extreme weather conditions. The Z-18A incorporates design changes that enable the crew to get a better view than what is available in its current navy counterpart. 

China and Russia are currently developing a new 38-ton heavy lift helicopter but that aircraft is still far from completion, which makes the production of the Z-18A helicopter all the more important for the PLA.

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## Deino

clarkgap said:


> More detail about this Brigade:
> https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/2aT_1De1xh1ts09ARmAB-Q
> http://photo.chinamil.com.cn/jypk/2018-01/05/content_7896856.htm
> 
> View attachment 446711
> 
> 
> Is it LH911822? Moreover, I am confusing about the SATCOM antenna on top of the tail boom ...




Seems indeed like LH911xxx but I expected LH971xxx








Beast said:


> Z-18 looks like a combo of NH-90 and Super Frelon...




And it looks GOOD !!!


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## Deino



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## Deino

via CDF

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## Deino

merged


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## bananarepublic

Deino said:


> via CDF
> 
> View attachment 449863
> View attachment 449864


Wow is this real


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## clarkgap

bananarepublic said:


> Wow is this real



Of course not. An interesting PS.

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## Beast



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## BHarwana



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## clarkgap

Deino said:


> Better image ...
> 
> View attachment 446628



Z-8G - LH953821:





Extra foul tank inside the helicopter:

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## Beast

clarkgap said:


> Z-8G - LH953821:
> View attachment 461173
> 
> 
> Extra foul tank inside the helicopter:
> View attachment 461174


I can assume Y-9 and Y-20 can easily extend its ferry range if such tank is install inside the load bay....

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

---

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

AC313













https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/-Xlo5_TjtwO4bKh-6RK1Qg


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## LKJ86

---


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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4239700833754109

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 479137


Soon it will replaced all Mi-17 helo.

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 480081



Interesting. I remember this type some time ago as a prototype with its characteristic modified rear-engine cover and new nose, but what's its designation??


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Interesting. I remember this type some time ago as a prototype with its characteristic modified rear-engine cover and new nose, but what's its designation??


It is said to be Z-8C.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> It is said to be Z-8C.




Thanks ... Said to be a Z-8C dedicated for SAR and CSAR.


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## Beast

Seems like Z-8A is produced in large number and fufil PLA requirement. Not as some claim enter service in limited numbers and not favour by PLA.


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## Deino

Beast said:


> Seems like Z-8A is produced in large number and fufil PLA requirement. Not as some claim enter service in limited numbers and not favour by PLA.



Indeed ... but one small correction, these are Z-8Bs not As

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## LKJ86



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## python-000

Hi Bro, 1 Question: why China is not interested to build something like this rather then that...









LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 479137

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## Deino

python-000 said:


> Hi Bro, 1 Question: why China is not interested to build something like this rather then that...
> View attachment 481842
> View attachment 481843



It is ... that project is called AHL and in co-development with Russia.


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## LKJ86




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## Beast

New powerful engine installed.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/Du3qtFxarZgUvAhAet83gQ

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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/2859620437/4276223091410550

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 493866
> View attachment 493868
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/2859620437/4276223091410550




Is that a hint for the long-rumoured wide cabin variant to appear soon? ... since the second image is clearly faked.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 498898



Nice ... but these are not Z-8 or Z-18s but Russian Mi-171!


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Nice ... but these are not Z-8 or Z-18s but Russian Mi-171!


No, look carefully.


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> No, look carefully.




Oh well ... stupid me !


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Video: https://m.weibo.cn/c/story/player?oid=1042151:4287393667185475_6&display=0&retcode=6102

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## cirr

Z-8 "WideBody"

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## LKJ86



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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 520683
> View attachment 520684


New engine fitted?


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## Deino

Beast said:


> New engine fitted?



I don't think so, but I would like to know, why that strange hump??


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## Deino

cirr said:


> Z-8 "WideBody"



Ok ... and now, come on, don't be so shy?

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## LKJ86



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## Beast

I have a feeling , the Z-8 and Z-18 has almost replaced all Mi-17V.... Maybe in another 1-2 years time, no Mi-17V will be in service since spare parts and repair is more and more difficult to procure.

Almost all the Helo report and video of recent PLA exercise are filled with Z-8/Z-18.. Mi-17V are very rare to be spotted.


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## Deino

Beast said:


> I have a feeling , the Z-8 and Z-18 has almost replaced all Mi-17V.... Maybe in another 1-2 years time, no Mi-17V will be in service since spare parts and repair is more and more difficult to procure.
> 
> Almost all the Helo report and video of recent PLA exercise are filled with Z-8/Z-18.. Mi-17V are very rare to be spotted.




Pardon, but that's not true ... just take a look at all PLA Army Aviation Brigades and look how many Mils are still operational, even in mixed units.


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## Beast

Deino said:


> Pardon, but that's not true ... just take a look at all PLA Army Aviation Brigades and look how many Mils are still operational, even in mixed units.


It difficult just to look at pure numbers. And most of the recent exercise is all Z-8/Z-18, they dont just come in 4-5 of it but sometimes a few dozen of them appear together... This show its being mass produced at very fast pace given that they are only official inducted last year. Maybe its even cheaper getting this new Z-8/Z-18 compare to maintenance those old Mi-17V.

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## Deino

Beast said:


> It difficult just to look at pure numbers. And most of the recent exercise is all Z-8/Z-18, they dont just come in 4-5 of it but sometimes a few dozen of them appear together... This show its being mass produced at very fast pace given that they are only official inducted last year. Maybe its even cheaper getting this new Z-8/Z-18 compare to maintenance those old Mi-17V.




That's surely correct.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 527583




With a new radar? ... the ASW variant or the wide-fuselage type?


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 527593



But this one looks like a regular Z-8( with the short sponsoons ?


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 527583



A bit larger ...

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## JSCh

From cjdby,

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## cirr

Z-8L 






Previously known as "Z-8 Widebody"

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## 055_destroyer

cirr said:


> Z-8L
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Previously known as "Z-8 Widebody"


Looks more modern.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1080460936526381057

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## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 529525
> 
> 
> View attachment 529526
> View attachment 529527
> View attachment 529528
> View attachment 529529
> View attachment 529530
> View attachment 529531


From the same model company:

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> From the same model company:
> View attachment 531069



But as we know by now with a wrong missile load.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Z-8L

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 533973
> View attachment 533974
> View attachment 533975
> View attachment 533976
> View attachment 533977
> View attachment 533978
> View attachment 533979




Now I'm very much surprised... Z-18s in dark green with red serials and strange markings.... what organisation are they assigned to??? PAP???


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Now I'm very much surprised... Z-18s in dark green with red serials and strange markings.... what organisation are they assigned to??? PAP???


PAP

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> PAP



Thanks, but indeed strange ... is there any mentioning in tis TV-report, where are they from?

And why do they get a new colour scheme?


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> Thanks, but indeed strange ... is there any mentioning in tis TV-report, where are they from?
> 
> And why do they get a new colour scheme?


What is the new colour scheme?

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> What is the new colour scheme?



Please correct me, but I thought they were previously either red-orange or white coloured like these?

Z18A WJS560305 - PAP Forestry Command Heli Detachment 2. Battalion - 1







Z-8AWJ WJ527302 - PAP Xinjiang Corps Helo Battalion (2)

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## lcloo

Deino said:


> Please correct me, but I thought they were previously either red-orange or white coloured like these?
> 
> Z18A WJS560305 - PAP Forestry Command Heli Detachment 2. Battalion - 1
> View attachment 534026
> 
> 
> 
> Z-8AWJ WJ527302 - PAP Xinjiang Corps Helo Battalion (2)
> View attachment 534029


The following extract would explain the paint scheme differences. Internal Guard Corps of PAP is now separated from Forestry Fire Fighting and under different joint command since 2018. Looks like different joint command has different paint scheme (my two cent).

_From 1 January 2018, command of the People's Armed Police is jointly held by the Central Committee of the Communist Party of China and the Central Military Commission, with the PAP no longer subordinate to the State Council.*[9][10]*_

_The reform was reportedly carried out in order to deprive the local Party authorities of the power to use the PAP units to commit abuses or even against the leadership in Beijing. With the new organization, local authorities need central approval in order to deploy the PAP.[11]_

_From 1 January 2018, command of the People's Armed Police is jointly held by the Central Committee of the Communist Party of China and the Central Military Commission, with the PAP no longer subordinate to the State Council.*[9][10]*_

_The reform was reportedly carried out in order to deprive the local Party authorities of the power to use the PAP units to commit abuses or even against the leadership in Beijing. With the new organization, local authorities need central approval in order to deploy the PAP.[11]_

_Prior to the 2018 reform, the People's Armed Police was further divided into eight corps: Internal Guard, Gold, Forestry, Hydropower, Transportation, Border Defense, Firefighting, and Safeguard Corps.[3]:232* The Internal Guard Corps, which makes up for the bulk of PAP, is under the PAP Headquarters and reports thus to the Party CC and the CMCs.* *The Gold, Forestry, Hydropower, and Transportation Corps, collectively known as the Specialist Corps, are under the joint leadership of PAP Headquarters and their respective ministries in the State Council.[3]:232* *The Border Defense, Firefighting, and Civil Guard Corps, collectively known as the Public Security Corps, are under the direct supervision of the Ministry of Public Security.*_

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## LKJ86



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## Deino

Anyone with an idea, why these completely redesigned "Z-8s" are still called Z-8 - aka Z-8G and Z-8L - in PLA Army Aviation, whereas the naval variants got the new Z-18 designation?

Especially the latest wide-body variant really should no longer be designated Z-8.


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## LKJ86




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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 534864



Is there a possibility to contact the photographer?


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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 534900
> View attachment 534901
> View attachment 534902




If I'm not entirely wrong from the Hunan Corps/ Helicopter Battalion also known as 2nd Mobile Corps Helicopter Detachment (武警第2机动总队直升机支队)


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## bahadur999

Can i get a short explanation of the differences between Z-8 and Z-18? I thought Z-18 and Z-8G are the same?


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## Deino

bahadur999 said:


> Can i get a short explanation of the differences between Z-8 and Z-18? I thought Z-18 and Z-8G are the same?



From what I understand, the basis of these new variants is the civil AC313, which in modified variants entered service within the Naval Aviation at first as a transport (Z-18), then AEW (Z-18J) and ASW (Z-18F). In parallel they were introduced in the PAP - not sure as Z-8AWJ or even AC313; I must admit, I don't know - and further developed into the Army Aviation variants. This was at first called Z-18A but later identified as the Z-18G ... and evolved into the wide cabin variant Z-8L.

Why these still are called Z-8 even if they are now even one step more away from the original Z-8 than the Z-18 (VIP) I don't know.


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## LKJ86




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## bahadur999

Deino said:


> From what I understand, the basis of these new variants is the civil AC313, which in modified variants entered service within the Naval Aviation at first as a transport (Z-18), then AEW (Z-18J) and ASW (Z-18F). In parallel they were introduced in the PAP - not sure as Z-8AWJ or even AC313; I must admit, I don't know - and further developed into the Army Aviation variants. This was at first called Z-18A but later identified as the Z-18G ... and evolved into the wide cabin variant Z-8L.
> 
> Why these still are called Z-8 even if they are now even one step more away from the original Z-8 than the Z-18 (VIP) I don't know.


Thanks! So does the Z-8 have J and F versions as well?


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## lcloo

bahadur999 said:


> Thanks! So does the Z-8 have J and F versions as well?


Z8J #9537, factory production serial #Z8J-004. China Navy Aviation. Don't know about "F" variant.

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## Deino

lcloo said:


> Z8J #9537, factory production serial #Z8J-004. China Navy Aviation. Don't know about "F" variant.
> View attachment 535111



However the Z-8F is a transport version, whereas the Z-18F is for ASW.

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## bahadur999

Deino said:


> However the Z-8F is a transport version, whereas the Z-18F is for ASW.


So what is Z-8A and Z-8C then? older transportation versions of F?


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## Deino

bahadur999 said:


> So what is Z-8A and Z-8C then? older transportation versions of F?



A and B are Army Aviation versions, the C is quite new but a naval variant

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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

Deino said:


> A and B are Army Aviation versions, the C is quite new but a naval variant


So let me get this straight:
A/B = PLAGF
F = PLAAF
J = PLANAF
but all are transportation variants, right?


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## lcloo

bahadur999 said:


> So let me get this straight:
> A/B = PLAGF
> F = PLAAF
> J = PLANAF
> but all are transportation variants, right?



I suggest you visit this web site, it is informative, good coverage and credible on identifying flying objects in China.
http://chinese-military-aviation.blogspot.com/p/whats-new.html

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## bahadur999

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 537484
> View attachment 537486
> View attachment 537487
> View attachment 537489


I am confused. Is that the 75th Aviation Brigade? I thought they are called the 121st.


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## Deino

bahadur999 said:


> I am confused. Is that the 75th Aviation Brigade? I thought they are called the 121st.



Yes, 75th Group Army but *121st Helicopter Assault Brigade (空中突击第121旅)*

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Deino




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## AMG_12

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 541467


Decent replacement for MI17

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

CG

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 547000



Shall be able to slingshot the AH-4 arty.


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 547000



I really don't understand why this - in fact new helicopter - is still labelled a Z-8 variant.


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> I really don't understand why this - in fact new helicopter - is still labelled a Z-8 variant.


It is the same to Type 052 DDG and Type 052C/D DDG, ZTZ-99 tank and ZTZ-99A tank.


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## Beast

Deino said:


> I really don't understand why this - in fact new helicopter - is still labelled a Z-8 variant.


PLA labelling is terrible. Have to agree with you.

KLJ-7 radar and KLJ-7A radar are hell lot different gen of radar but from such designation. Anybody can be misled into as just a minor upgrade.

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## Deino




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## Deino

With the individual number '331' assigned, this Z-18F ASW helicopter on-board the aircraft carrier Liaoning, seems finally to be in operational service.
Also interesting, its c/n is visible ... it's the no. 04

(image courtesy of FJ / via Huitong's CMA blog)


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## python-000

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 563011





LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 563011


Why not China can design something like this...


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## Deino

python-000 said:


> Why not China can design something like this...
> View attachment 568113
> View attachment 568114



It does at the moment ... called AHLH, but it takes time:


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## bahadur999

Deino said:


> With the individual number '331' assigned, this Z-18F ASW helicopter on-board the aircraft carrier Liaoning, seems finally to be in operational service.
> Also interesting, its c/n is visible ... it's the no. 04
> 
> (image courtesy of FJ / via Huitong's CMA blog)
> 
> View attachment 568080


So do Aircrafts/Helicopters which operate under the Aircraft carriers are "attached" to them as an independent 'unit'?


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4405295792814400

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 574003
> View attachment 574004
> View attachment 574005
> 
> https://m.weibo.cn/1740979351/4405295792814400



But isn't this just another Mi-17 or -171??


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> But isn't this just another Mi-17 or -171??
> 
> View attachment 574014


What about the 3rd pic?

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## Khafee

Deino said:


> I really don't understand why this - in fact new helicopter - is still labelled a Z-8 variant.


Uncanny resemblance to S92?


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> What about the 3rd pic?




looks like a regular Z-8G


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## LKJ86



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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 574179
> View attachment 574180
> View attachment 574181



Beautiful  ... any idea, where this is?


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## lcloo

Deino said:


> Beautiful  ... any idea, where this is?


Most likely Southern part of Yunnan close to Laos border, a region inhabited by ethnic Tai people who are closely related to Laos and Thailand. That nice golden building is a traditional Thai Buddhist temple.

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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1163056534538084352

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86



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## lcloo

Medical evacuation of victims of tourist bus accident in Laos, flying back to China by Z18G helicopter.

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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

AC313


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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @佛系军迷京城老九 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @超大善舞精灵 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via www.top81cn.cn


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @DS北风 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @南部强军号 from Weixin


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## LKJ86




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## Beast

I see less and less MI-17 helo operating for PLAAF. I think they are slowly phasing out.


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## LKJ86




----------



## aziqbal

Beast said:


> I see less and less MI-17 helo operating for PLAAF. I think they are slowly phasing out.



there is literally hundreds in operation and new Z18 only a hand full 

it will be years before they are phased out even if ever


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## Beast

aziqbal said:


> there is literally hundreds in operation and new Z18 only a hand full
> 
> it will be years before they are phased out even if ever


I don't think it just handful. We literally seen and many Z-8 & Z-18 involved in many exercise in last couple of years in large numbers with even no Mi-17 involved. The production rate I believe is quite high per year with up to 35-40 units. The difficult to get spares and obsolete of Mi-17 means PLA are replacing quite fast at a rate. Given a huge number of Z-8 and Z-18 appear in 70th anniversary celebrration. Estimate a more than hundred has put into service.


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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @北海舰队 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @B747SPNKG from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南陆一号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 590763
> 
> Via @捣蛋就对 from Weibo




An impressive lineup of 14 Z-8KA SAR helicopters and one KJ-2000 + a KJ-200 AEW in the background
However IMO it must be an older image, since the 6x9x pattern is no longer in use and it seems more likely from the then 78th SAR Regiment, 26th Division.


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## LKJ86

Deino said:


> An impressive lineup of 14 Z-8KA SAR helicopters and one KJ-2000 + a KJ-200 AEW in the background
> However IMO it must be an older image, since the 6x9x pattern is no longer in use and it seems more likely from the then 78th SAR Regiment, 26th Division.


It was 10 years ago.

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> It was 10 years ago.



Thanks a lot ... and still an impressive image


----------



## Deino

A new ASW variant if the legacy Z-8 helicopter was spotted. This one is allegedly based on the improved Z-8C SAR variant and features a prominent radome sjmilar to the Z-18F. Anyway I'm confused, why developing yet another ASW type based on the older and much less capable original Z-8 when already a much more capable Z-18F is avalable?

(Image via @Loongnaval)


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## lcloo

Here is a clear photo. Oops!, it is not the same variant. May be one is a test-bed while the other is a serial production?

Edit： as per Huitong:-
The latest image (November 2019) indicated that an improved variant of *Z-18F* is being developed at Changhe, featuring a *Z-8CJ* style engine compartment with new domestic engines inside.

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## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报


----------



## LKJ86

Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 596804
> 
> Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo



Very similar to this one 
Any idea, where this is?

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## LKJ86

Via kj.81.cn


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## lcloo

Deino said:


> Very similar to this one
> Any idea, where this is?
> 
> View attachment 596805


China Yunnan Mangshi county level city . The golden Buddhist temple is a local landmark.

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## Imran Khan

Deino said:


> Very similar to this one
> Any idea, where this is?
> 
> View attachment 596805


now this one look so cool man thanks for shear

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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @天真卖萌Bernard from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @CNR国防时空 from Weixin


----------



## JSCh

Said to be Z-8B. From weibo via 鼎盛huitong


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南部强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @当代海军 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @T汪汪T from Weibo

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## lcloo

Z8B - A group of Z-8B transport helicopters attached to an army aviation brigade under the PLA 71st Group Army execute formation flight training at an extremely-low altitude in the misty weather on February 5, aiming to hone the troops’ tactical flying skills in the poor-visibility condition. (eng.chinamil.com.cn/Photo by Xiang Xu)

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

February 12, 2020































Via www.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

February 17, 2020
















Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @80强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## Deino

The first clear image of the Changhe Z-8L transport helicopter - the "wide-body variant" of the Z-8G - was re-posted now in much higher resolution. It was first published in January 2019 (see second image). 

(Image by DSZJHF/FengJian Aviation Photos via Huitong's CMA-Blog)

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

By 齐晓东


----------



## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @白龙_龙腾四海 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南陆一号 from Weixin


----------



## Sine Nomine

@LKJ86 what is carrying capacity of Z-8 & 18 helis.


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民前线 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @我们的天空 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via 解放军画报


----------



## LKJ86

Via @ZHANGWENTIAN天天 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin












































Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## Deino

Nice ... 76. Brigade


----------



## Beast

Sine Nomine said:


> @LKJ86 what is carrying capacity of Z-8 & 18 helis.


28 fully equipped armed soldiers or 6tons of payload.

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## LKJ86

Via @南陆一号 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

Via www.81.cn

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1


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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2


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1249977483514036225

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## LKJ86

Via navy.81.cn

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## JohnWick

@Deino @LKJ86 Do you folks copied/reverse engineered/developed sth like osprey of USAF?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南陆一号 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Z-8C and its domestic engine

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Z-8C and its domestic engine
> View attachment 626506



Interesting! Is the designation of this engine known?

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## LKJ86

Via @我们的天空 from Weibo

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## aziqbal

Z18 for army is surely not as important as the Navy 

so how come army is getting new variants and Navy has still those old 1960s cone nose helicopters ?

now they have 8 x LPD and 2 x LHD and 2 x carriers they need naval helicopters


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @stinger_银翼 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民武警 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 634399
> View attachment 634400
> View attachment 634401
> View attachment 634402
> 
> Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


Very nice hello. Truly can replace Mi-17.

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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7, www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 638605
> View attachment 638606
> View attachment 638607
> View attachment 638608
> View attachment 638609
> 
> Via CCTV 7, www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo





'382' the third one spotted for the Liaoning


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin

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## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民海军 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## lcloo

Z8L on stationery hovering.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1278711217436033024

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## LKJ86

Huskies


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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2


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

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## sheik

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 650112
> View attachment 650113
> 
> Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo



We want Z-8L and Lynx ATVs

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## LKJ86

Via 舰船知识

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## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 655794
> View attachment 655796
> View attachment 655797
> View attachment 655798
> View attachment 655799
> View attachment 655800
> View attachment 655801
> View attachment 655802
> View attachment 655803
> View attachment 655804
> View attachment 655805
> View attachment 655806
> View attachment 655807
> View attachment 655808
> 
> Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## LKJ86

Via @人民海军 from Weixin

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @不研究军事的蓝海踏浪 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 657980
> View attachment 657981
> View attachment 657982
> View attachment 657983
> View attachment 657984
> View attachment 657985
> View attachment 657986
> View attachment 657987
> View attachment 657988
> 
> Via @央广军事 from Weibo




I hope you don't mind the maybe stupid question, but given the camouflage on the uniforms are these soldiers from the PLAN Marine Corps?

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## Figaro

Deino said:


> I hope you don't mind the maybe stupid question, but given the camouflage on the uniforms are these soldiers from the PLAN Marine Corps?


The PLA Marine Corps really needs to change the color of their uniform ... makes absolutely no sense to have these bright blue fatigues even in the water.


----------



## LKJ86

Deino said:


> I hope you don't mind the maybe stupid question, but given the camouflage on the uniforms are these soldiers from the PLAN Marine Corps?





Figaro said:


> The PLA Marine Corps really needs to change the color of their uniform ... makes absolutely no sense to have these bright blue fatigues even in the water.


----------



## lcloo

Z8L

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

lcloo said:


> Z8L
> 
> View attachment 661618
> View attachment 661619
> View attachment 661620
> View attachment 661621




Finally!

By the way, how official is the original source? Or is it just a private account?

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/cbfX7ZJF9PZ1FJQrKirv5g


----------



## lcloo

Deino said:


> Finally!
> 
> By the way, how official is the original source? Or is it just a private account?
> 
> https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/cbfX7ZJF9PZ1FJQrKirv5g


The source is "Chinese Weapon Tests" magazine, the narrative mentioned the joint tests between manufacturer and the army testing team on procedure and safety on hosting materials and ATV (all terrain vehicle) by Z8L. Z8L is thus still under flight testing stage.

The magazine source can be described as quasi-official as the tests are not open to public.

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## Deino

Quite interesting, and I must admit, I'm surprised: The Z-8L was always described as a "wide boy variant" of the Z-8G, now - if my laymen's attempt si not too far off - shows it is more a longer and flatter, streamlined fuselage variant.


----------



## LKJ86

Via @大包00 from Weibo

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## Deino

lcloo said:


> Z8L
> 
> View attachment 661618
> View attachment 661619
> View attachment 661620
> View attachment 661621




Another question; Do we know, how recent these images are?


----------



## lcloo

Deino said:


> Another question; Do we know, how recent these images are?


The only clue in this news article is that it mentioned the test was done recently. By the way the magazine is owned by PLA 32183 detachment, so it is very official, not quasi-official as I mentioned before.

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## bahadur999

lcloo said:


> The only clue in this news article is that it mentioned the test was done recently. By the way the magazine is owned by PLA 32183 detachment, so it is very official, not quasi-official as I mentioned before.


What is 32183? Sounds like an EDD unit?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @feel的小步舞曲 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via CCTV and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296404785655054337

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 657980
> View attachment 657981
> View attachment 657982
> View attachment 657983
> View attachment 657984
> View attachment 657985
> View attachment 657986
> View attachment 657987
> View attachment 657988
> 
> Via @央广军事 from Weibo




As per this report, these are allegedly the first PLAN Marine Corps helicopters under the PLANMC 7th Aviation Brigade ... Does anyone know an official report 



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296217705998168065

Also, given that TV-report mentioned above at http://js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo, but I cannot find the video itself ... also it seems as if the helicopter is the Z-8C; the Z-8CJ is a training variant at the NA University.

Does anyone have the full video?


----------



## lcloo

I have a feeling that Z8L (and Z20) will show up in this year's Zhuhai airshow. We will know its full dimensions then. Let's keep the fingers crossed.

From Huitong

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @会飞的电池片 from Weibo


----------



## Beast

lcloo said:


> I have a feeling that Z8L (and Z20) will show up in this year's Zhuhai airshow. We will know its full dimensions then. Let's keep the fingers crossed.
> 
> From Huitong
> View attachment 662638


Z-18L height seems to be abit lower. Meaning the inner hanger is longer but lower height.


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8L





Via @迪哥加西亚 from Weibo

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## lcloo

lcloo said:


> I have a feeling that Z8L (and Z20) will show up in this year's Zhuhai airshow. We will know its full dimensions then. Let's keep the fingers crossed.
> 
> From Huitong
> View attachment 662638

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Z-8L
> View attachment 662755
> 
> Via @迪哥加西亚 from Weibo




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1296754593662214144


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8G
















Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8G










Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin

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## sheik

Deino said:


> Quite interesting, and I must admit, I'm surprised: The Z-8L was always described as a "wide boy variant" of the Z-8G, now - if my laymen's attempt si not too far off - shows it is more a longer and flatter, streamlined fuselage variant.
> 
> View attachment 661634



It's flatter because the tank under the floor has been moved to side.


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1304709408182677504


----------



## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
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## Beast

LKJ86 said:


>


Is that additional fuel tank inside the helo?

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## LKJ86

Beast said:


> Is that additional fuel tank inside the helo?


A yellow fuel tank.


----------



## LKJ86

By 冯健 and 尚文斌


----------



## LKJ86

By 走近哈佛

Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Via @南疆号角 from Weixin

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 669453
> 
> By 走近哈佛




So the PAP also operates the latest Z-8G?


----------



## LKJ86

Via @80强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via www.js7tv.cn and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 673718
> 
> Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo





__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1310104147681849352


----------



## LKJ86

Via @央视军事报道 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1318077099224272901


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8G




Via @南疆号角 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 13 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Via @海军航空大学 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

Any idea what happened here or why it flew so low?


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1339498563978424320


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin

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1


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业 from Weixin

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2


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## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南疆号角 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86




----------



## LKJ86

Via @ 西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @人民海军 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @南部战区 from Weixin

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2


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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2


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## LKJ86

Via @西陆强军号 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86

Via @航空工业昌飞 from Weixin


----------



## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

If I'm not mistaken, then this is the first image not only clearly showing Z-8 (Z-8CJ ?) but even more that many - I see eight - ship-borne transport helicopters on deck of the first Type 075 LHD at Hainan.

(Image via @柳成梁 / FB)

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## LKJ86



Reactions: Like Like:
 1


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## Deino

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1387069492530929668


----------



## Deino

Even if its serial number is once again psed, this is the first clear image on an operational PLA Army Aviation Z-8L - the wide-bode variant - with the typical LHXXXXX number visible.
Based on other reports this is something within the LH953txx range and as such assigned to the 161st Air Assault Brigade (83rd GA) at Xinxiang within the Central Theater Command.

(Image via Huitong's CMA-Blog)


----------



## LKJ86

Via @用户hc_andy from Weibo

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## lcloo

A front view of Z8L, photo via Chinese Military Aviation.

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## Deino

;-)


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1396381367601090561

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## LKJ86

Via Weibo

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## LKJ86

Z-8L













Via @九月飞鹰001 from Weibo

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## Deino

And in comparison

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## LKJ86

Via @白龙_龙腾四海 from Weibo


----------



## qwerrty



Reactions: Like Like:
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## LKJ86

Z-8L




Via @九月飞鹰001 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Beast

Deino said:


> And in comparison
> 
> View attachment 749966


The new Z-8L looks more stealthy, sharper nose cone .

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## Deino

LKJ86 said:


> Z-8L
> View attachment 752903
> 
> Via @九月飞鹰001 from Weibo




Just for the fun!  ... I posted a Tweet to this and this was an Indian reply:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1403981758526332929

Reactions: Haha Haha:
7


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## GiantPanda

Deino said:


> Just for the fun!  ... I posted a Tweet to this and this was an Indian reply:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1403981758526332929




Only an idiot Indian would spasm and kneejerk that Z-8L is a copy of a MiG helo when MiG does not make helos. lol

Reactions: Haha Haha:
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----------



## Gripen9

Does look like it took "inspiration" from S-92.


----------



## Bilal Khan (Quwa)

Gripen9 said:


> Does look like it took "inspiration" from S-92.


Perhaps, but the Z-8L is definitely larger. Basically AW101 territory.

It'll be interesting if and when AVIC adds this to its export catalogue. Combined with China's economies of scale, the unit cost of the Z-8L will be competitive. IMHO, this can give the Mi-38 a run for its money in the giant market of replacing old Mi-8 and Mi-17s. Ironic that CAATSA could basically pave the way for China to take up a chunk of the helicopter market.

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## Deino

Bilal Khan (Quwa) said:


> Perhaps, but the Z-8L is definitely larger. Basically AW101 territory.
> ...




But isn't the S-92 basically "playing" in the same league? 


Max takeoff weight: 

AW101 - 14,600 kg (32,187 lb) 
S-92 - 12,565 kg (27,700 lb)
Mi-38 - 15,600 kg (34,392 lb) 
Z-8L - 13,800 kg (30,360 lb) ... data from Z-18/AC313 (??)


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8G










Via @南陆一号 from Weixin

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Bilal Khan (Quwa)

Deino said:


> But isn't the S-92 basically "playing" in the same league?
> 
> 
> Max takeoff weight:
> 
> AW101 - 14,600 kg (32,187 lb)
> S-92 - 12,565 kg (27,700 lb)
> Mi-38 - 15,600 kg (34,392 lb)
> Z-8L - 13,800 kg (30,360 lb) ... data from Z-18/AC313 (??)


Yeah, but S-92's the short guy.

Reactions: Haha Haha:
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## LKJ86

Via @双垂尾无影侠 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## qwerrty



Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

Via @斯文的威猛 from Weibo

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----------



## LKJ86

Via @万全 from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8L




















Via 八一电视 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

Reactions: Like Like:
1


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## LKJ86

Via @CAN-MUGUA from Weibo


----------



## LKJ86

Z-8L







Via CCTV

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## LKJ86

Via @央广军事 from Weixin


----------



## Beast

Noticed the giant yellow fuel tank inside the helo to increase the range of the helo.

Internal fuel tank seems to be very common among bigger helo of PLA helicopter.

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Deino

Can anyone help to identify since I have no access to my images at home … is this a Z-8L under construction or something new?

Reactions: Like Like:
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----------



## Polestar 2

https://inf.news/en/military/26f4137ac941de38482c562fc8eff576.html

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Bilal9

Polestar 2 said:


> https://inf.news/en/military/26f4137ac941de38482c562fc8eff576.html



Very nice modernized update for the cockpit section, and excellent medium lift option for navies in ASW and other roles.

However, what is the role change vis-a-vis the Harbin Z-20? Which some would argue - is a more efficient and modern design?


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## Deino

Bilal9 said:


> Very nice modernized update for the cockpit section, and excellent medium lift option for navies in ASW and other roles.
> 
> However, what is the role change vis-a-vis the Harbin Z-20? Which some would argue - is a more efficient and modern design?




From my understanding both are different classes … the Z-20 is a 10t helicopter, whereas the Z-18/8L and AC-313A 13.8t helicopter

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## Piotr

Bilal9 said:


> Very nice modernized update for the cockpit section, and excellent medium lift option for navies in ASW and other roles.
> 
> However, what is the role change vis-a-vis the Harbin Z-20? Which some would argue - is a more efficient and modern design?



AC313 unlike Z-20 has a tail ramp. Also Z-18 has seats for 27 passengers while Z-20 for 11-14. But if needed Z-20 can carry as much as 43 passengers while Z-18 probably even more.

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## Shotgunner51

Bilal9 said:


> vis-a-vis the Harbin Z-20


Bro they are two different platforms!
Z-20: a more compact twin-engine 10 tons helo, while
Z-8/18: a more "obese" (cargo bay design) triple-engine 14 tons helo.

This AC313A a new civilian variant belonging to the Z-8/18 platform, there are other variants some already inducted into army and navy.

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## Bilal9

Piotr said:


> AC313 unlike Z-20 has a tail ramp. Also Z-18 has seats for 27 passengers while Z-20 for 11-14. But if needed Z-20 can carry as much as 43 passengers while Z-18 probably even more.



OK so Z-18 (AC313) is almost as large as an AW101 it seems.

Wasn't sure about the weight class.


Shotgunner51 said:


> Bro they are two different platforms! The Z-20 is a twin-engine 10 tons helo, while the Z-8/18 is a triple-engine 14 tons helo.
> 
> This AC313A a new civilian variant belonging to the Z-8/18 platform, there are other variants some already inducted into army and navy.



Thanks for the explanation.

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## Piotr

Deino said:


> Can anyone help to identify since I have no access to my images at home … is this a Z-8L under construction or something new?
> View attachment 770694



AC313A ?

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## Shotgunner51

Piotr said:


> AC313A ?


Yes. The designation "A" may be confusing, it's not a progression from AC313, it's commercial variant of Z-8L.

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## Piotr

Shotgunner51 said:


> Yes. The designation "A" may be confusing, it's not a progression from AC313, it's commercial variant of Z-8L.
> 
> View attachment 816576



I like that they implemented tilted tail rotor in AC313A.

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## Polestar 2

Seems like a new domestic turboshaft will be installed on upcoming AC313A with 1600kw power. More powerful than WZ-16 turboshaft co develop between SAFRAN and AVIC.

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## Deino

Polestar 2 said:


> Seems like a new domestic turboshaft will be installed on upcoming AC313A with 1600kw power. More powerful than WZ-16 turboshaft co develop between SAFRAN and AVIC.




I thought it is using the WZ-10 as in the Z-20?


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## LKJ86



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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @中国军视网 from Weibo


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## GiantPanda

LKJ86 said:


> View attachment 833856
> View attachment 833857
> 
> Via @中国军视网 from Weibo



Wow! Front view comparison of the Z-8 G and L variants. Cool.


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hj/2022-04/20/content_10149239.htm


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/syjdt/2022-04/22/content_10149839.htm


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.mod.gov.cn/shouye/2022-04/28/content_4909957.htm


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## Joe Shearer

Saifullah Sani said:


> None of the current PLAN destroyers or frigates will be able to support the 13.8-tonne maximum take-off weight of the Z-18, so in the near term it will be limited to operating at sea from the carrier Liaoning and the three Type 071 amphibious landing platform docks. The anticipated construction of Type 081 landing platform helicopter ships and Type 055 destroyers would increase the number of platforms that are capable of embarking the aircraft.


Moomin found a compass.

Moomin Papa asked him what he could possibly do with the compass.

Moomin looked at him strangely. 'Why, build a binnacle for it, to be sure! That's what people do with compasses!'

Moomin Papa was baffled. 

'But what will you do with a compass in a binnacle?'' he asked, a little helplessly. 

This was getting too much. The old troll had clearly lost his marbles. 

'It's obvious!,' he burst out, 'I'll build a ship around the binnacle.'

With apologies to Tove Jansson,
and grateful thanks for a blessed childhood.​


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## KampfAlwin

Joe Shearer said:


> Moomin found a compass.
> 
> Moomin Papa asked him what he could possibly do with the compass.
> 
> Moomin looked at him strangely. 'Why, build a binnacle for it, to be sure! That's what people do with compasses!'
> 
> Moomin Papa was baffled.
> 
> 'But what will you do with a compass in a binnacle?'' he asked, a little helplessly.
> 
> This was getting too much. The old troll had clearly lost his marbles.
> 
> 'It's obvious!,' he burst out, 'I'll build a ship around the binnacle.'
> 
> With apologies to Tove Jansson,
> and grateful thanks for a blessed childhood.​


You forgot to take your meds or something?

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo

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## vi-va

Avicopter AC313 - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org












https://inf.news/en/military/26f4137ac941de38482c562fc8eff576.html

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## LKJ86

Via @Ds走近哈佛 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Z-8G







Via @南部战区 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via 央视军事 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/syjdt/2022-06/07/content_10160998.htm


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## LKJ86

Via CCTV 7 and @沉默的山羊 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-06/20/content_10164822.htm

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## LKJ86

Via http://www.mod.gov.cn/power/2022-06/23/content_4913843.htm


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/hj/2022-06/22/content_10162889.htm


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## LKJ86

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## LKJ86

Via 岳书华摄影工作室

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## LKJ86

Via 新华社

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## LKJ86

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## LKJ86




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## LKJ86

Via @学习军团 from Weibo

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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-09/27/content_10187614.htm


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## LKJ86

Via http://eng.chinamil.com.cn/view/2022-10/03/content_10189140.htm

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## LKJ86

Via @舰船知识 from Weibo


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## SQ8

@LKJ86 @Deino was there ever a minesweeping version of the Z-18 ala the MH-53e?


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## Deino

SQ8 said:


> @LKJ86 @Deino was there ever a minesweeping version of the Z-18 ala the MH-53e?




Not to my knowledge


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## LKJ86

Via http://www.81.cn/lj/2022-10/21/content_10194025.htm

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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo


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## LKJ86

Via @解放军报 from Weibo


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