# Women Will Have Access To Education And Work, Foreigners Can Leave, Says Taliban After Entering Kabul



## FOOLS_NIGHTMARE

*The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.*

Amid concerns in Afghanistan with regard to the regressive diktats issued by the insurgent group during their reign earlier between 1996 and 2001, the Taliban has said they respect women’s rights.

The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.

The spokesperson said that policy on punishments will depend on courts and added the media will be allowed to criticise anyone, but they should not indulge in character assassination.

The Taliban insurgents had earlier, as per reports, ordered nine women working with a bank in Kandahar to leave and said the male relatives can take their place.

The foreigners in the city can leave if they wish, but if they continue to stay then they will have to register their presence with Taliban administrators, according to the insurgent group.

Meanwhile, the Taliban commanders claim to have taken over control of Afghanistan’s presidential palace, according to Reuters.

This comes after a senior Interior Ministry official told the news agency that Afghan President Ashraf Ghani has left the country for Tajikistan. However, the President's advisor rubbished the claims and said that he has not yet left the country.

The Taliban insurgents on Sunday entered the outskirts of the capital city, causing panic and fear among the residents.

In a matter of days, the Taliban swept through major parts of Afghanistan, seizing control of around 25 of the 34 provincial capitals, including key cities such as Kandahar, Herat, Mazar-e-Sharif and Jalalabad.









Women Will Have Access To Education And Work, Says Taliban


The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.




news.abplive.com

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## Ahmet Pasha

White man: women won't have access to education and work.

Taliban: assures they will.

White man: we don't trust Taliban.

Why make noise then?

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## VCheng

Ahmet Pasha said:


> Taliban: assures they will.



As long as Taliban actually permit what they are saying here ... ... where are the actual deeds and not just words?


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## Ahmet Pasha

VCheng said:


> As long as Taliban actually permit what they are saying here ... ... where are the actual deeds and not just words?


It's barely been 24 hours since they took over man. They're still waiting to take over officially.

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## Mentee

VCheng said:


> As long as Taliban actually permit what they are saying here ... ... where are the actual deeds and not just words?




They just entered Kabul yesterday atleast give them a year or two .


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## khansaheeb

FOOLS_NIGHTMARE said:


> *The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.*
> 
> Amid concerns in Afghanistan with regard to the regressive diktats issued by the insurgent group during their reign earlier between 1996 and 2001, the Taliban has said they respect women’s rights.
> 
> The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.
> 
> The spokesperson said that policy on punishments will depend on courts and added the media will be allowed to criticise anyone, but they should not indulge in character assassination.
> 
> The Taliban insurgents had earlier, as per reports, ordered nine women working with a bank in Kandahar to leave and said the male relatives can take their place.
> 
> The foreigners in the city can leave if they wish, but if they continue to stay then they will have to register their presence with Taliban administrators, according to the insurgent group.
> 
> Meanwhile, the Taliban commanders claim to have taken over control of Afghanistan’s presidential palace, according to Reuters.
> 
> This comes after a senior Interior Ministry official told the news agency that Afghan President Ashraf Ghani has left the country for Tajikistan. However, the President's advisor rubbished the claims and said that he has not yet left the country.
> 
> The Taliban insurgents on Sunday entered the outskirts of the capital city, causing panic and fear among the residents.
> 
> In a matter of days, the Taliban swept through major parts of Afghanistan, seizing control of around 25 of the 34 provincial capitals, including key cities such as Kandahar, Herat, Mazar-e-Sharif and Jalalabad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Women Will Have Access To Education And Work, Says Taliban
> 
> 
> The women will be allowed to leave homes alone and they will have access to education and work, but they will have to wear the hijab, a Taliban spokesperson told Reuters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.abplive.com



They should check all foreigners to see if they have contributed to war crimes and committed crimes against the Afghan people. They shouldn't be given a free get out card.

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## Indos

Hopefully they can be more moderate and dont target Hazara people like being accused by Hazara activist. So women can wear Hijab, no more Burqa obligation ? This is a good step

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## nang2

Ahmet Pasha said:


> It's barely been 24 hours since they took over man. They're still waiting to take over officially.


So what they are saying doesn't count much. Their track record speaks more loudly.

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## VCheng

Ahmet Pasha said:


> It's barely been 24 hours since they took over man. They're still waiting to take over officially.





Mentee said:


> They just entered Kabul yesterday atleast give them a year or two .




Of course. There should be no rush to judge their performance without adequate time.

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## Indos

nang2 said:


> So what they are saying doesn't count much. Their track record speaks more loudly.



The leaders are living in Qatar for almost 20 years and they are discussing with many Ulama from other Muslim world like Indonesia, so the chance they get moderated and apply real Islam rather than Pashtun-Islamic culture is big.

They were just coming from Madrasah in Pakistan before they took control Afghan in 1997. Their Islamic knowledge is limited. Here in Indonesia, Baradar, Taliban current Leader met with Indonesia Islamist leader, Yusuf Kalla ( who is also VP at that time) in Jakarta 2019

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## gambit

You guys really believe that?

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## nang2

Indos said:


> The leaders are living in Qatar for almost 20 years and they are discussing with many Ulama from other Muslim world like Indonesia, so the chance they get moderated and apply real Islam rather than Pashtun-Islamic culture is big.
> 
> They were just coming from Madrasah in Pakistan before they took control Afghan in 1997. Their Islamic knowledge is limited. Here in Indonesia, Baradar, Taliban current Leader met with Indonesia Islamist leader, Yusuf Kalla ( who is also VP at that time) in Jakarta 2019


I hope Islamism can evolve out of its old shadow.

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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?


Makes sense, you will see some change in how they behaved in past and in future, in past they were multiple groups working for own interest just to gather power in local area not caring about external intervention.


Now they are big player and have to run the country, for past 2 decades they have been living in same land with others.


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## PurpleButcher

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?


YES


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## Darth Vader

nang2 said:


> I hope Islamism can evolve out of its old shadow.


No problem with islam, problem lies with not understanding and trying to force something which you and others dont understand which causes problem.


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## nang2

Darth Vader said:


> No problem with islam, problem lies with not understanding and trying to force something which you and others dont understand which causes problem.


I am not talking about Islam. I said "Islamism".


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## Darth Vader

nang2 said:


> I am not talking about Islam. I said "Islamism".


I know what you meant, but that is the problem


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## gambit

Darth Vader said:


> No problem with islam, problem lies with not understanding and trying to force something which you and others dont understand which causes problem.


It is a problem with Islam, the same way that Christianity create problems for its followers. I like IKEA furniture. Simple enough to assemble and use. Nothing 'heirloom' about them but they are just good enough. Too bad these 'holy books' are not as easy to understand as IKEA instructions.

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## Indos

nang2 said:


> I hope Islamism can evolve out of its old shadow.



The words evolve is not right. Islam is actually beautiful and give huge freedom to human kind. The reason it has bad name is because Taliban during their first rule in Afghan and also Al-Qaeda and ISIS. They dont have tolerant with Shiah Hazara for example and Hazara activist talked very bad about Taliban during Taliban rule 1997-2001.

Taliban Ulama only get educated in Madrasah and with the social atmosphere under USSR occupation, where real Islamic study we can get into multi discipline and reach Professor level. Here in Indonesia we have some one who make Tafsir about Quran, but in order to do that he has to study Arabic literature for quite long in Al -Azhar University, Egypt.

He can only finish make Quran Tafsir after he reached 70 years old and all of his live is about studying and teaching in university.






AQ and ISIS is flourist due to Arab world which is filled by Autoritarian Ruler, in this kind of social environment the group who wanted change can only do that through Military means. This is why the next step for Muslim nations to be more developed and striving is to adopt Democracy ( by peaceful process )

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## nang2

Indos said:


> The words evolve is not right. Islam is actually beautiful and give huge freedom to human kind. The reason it has bad name is because Taliban during their first rule in Afghan and also Al-Qaeda and ISIS. They dont have tolerant with Shiah Hazara for example and Hazara activist talked very bad about Taliban during Taliban rule 1997-2001.
> 
> Taliban Ulama only get educated in Madrasah and with the social atmosphere under USSR occupation, where real Islamic study we can get into multi discipline and reach Professor level. Here in Indonesia we have some one who make Tafsir about Quran, but in order to do that he has to study Arabic literature for quite long in Al -Azhar University, Egypt.
> 
> He can only finish make Quran Tafsir after he reached 70 years old and all of his live is about studying and teaching in university.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AQ and ISIS is flourist due to Arab world which is filled by Autoritarian Ruler, in this kind of social environment the group who wanted change can only do that through Military means. This is why the next step for Muslim nations to be more developed and striving is to adopt Democracy ( by peaceful process )


I say Islamism and you say Islam. Islamism isn't Islam. It is just a political movement in the name of Islam. Not everything in the name of Islam is really Islamic. A man in a woman's dress is still a man, regardless what the dress says.  

Mixing politics and religion is often a dangerous move. That is why modern countries call for the separation of church and state. It is not like these two cannot be mixed. It is just very easy to be wrong. Religions call for unwavering faith and blind acceptance. That is because what religions pursuit is beyond human intellect, beyond human life on earth. But politics is everything human and everything earthly. Forcing some ordinary people to do what would be required for a monk is nothing but cruelty, which is against everything taught in Islam.

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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> It is a problem with Islam, the same way that Christianity create problems for its followers. I like IKEA furniture. Simple enough to assemble and use. Nothing 'heirloom' about them but they are just good enough. Too bad these 'holy books' are not as easy to understand as IKEA instructions.


Some people are good with math, some not ? Cant say there is problem with math or not, it depends on your teacher how can he translate and teach you.

No problem with islam, Problem lies with people judging other people and thinking they are gods on the Earth.

In regards to Islam, no issues with it, it came with perfect set of instructions thats Holy Quran, have a perfect role model ( Prophet Muhammad ( Peace.upon.Him))

And in regards to Holy books being hard. SINCE others are not in perfect condition so i can only point out Quran. 
You have to understand off course it will be harder for us to understand as its from much more intelligent being then us humans will ever be.





Main thing is really simple 
There is no God, But one whats so hard to understand here

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## magra

Taliban recently entered Kabul but they were in other provinces for some time and were occuping some rural areas for few years. Were they allowing girl education (and not just Quran learning) in these areas?


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## Indos

nang2 said:


> I say Islamism and you say Islam. Islamism isn't Islam. It is just a political movement in the name of Islam. Not everything in the name of Islam is really Islamic. A man in a woman's dress is still a man, regardless what the dress says.
> 
> Mixing politics and religion is often a dangerous move. That is why modern countries call for the separation of church and state. It is not like these two cannot be mixed. It is just very easy to be wrong. Religions call for unwavering faith and blind acceptance. That is because what religions pursuit is beyond human intellect, beyond human life on earth. But politics is everything human and everything earthly. Forcing some ordinary people to do what would be required for a monk is nothing but cruelty, which is against everything taught in Islam.



Yup Islamism that you learn from AQ/ISIS/Taliban, better you say AQ/ISIS/Taliban interpretation about Islam, not Islamism.

Yep, Islam is great but it is not easy to understand Islam if you are not raised by knowledgeable father since you are kid, a father who have huge Islamic books. Then there should be discussion between Father and his kids, not giving dogmatic teaching, so the father should hold democratic principle as well, not becoming an authorian father.

Islam is not like Christian, here everything can be understood. As non Muslim I bet you dont know that democratic system is actually endorsed in Quran through surah As-Syura and first Caliph get elected through democratic process. 

I learn about Abu Bakr, first Caliph get elected through debate and voting is through my father book who bough Abu Bakar Biography written by famous Eqyptian Historian, Muhammad Haikal. 

------------------------------------------------------------

In Islam, all your live should be for Allah. It is because we dont live to make people admire us, Muslim lives to get Ridho ( acceptance/praise ) from Allah


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## gambit

Darth Vader said:


> Some people are good with math, some not ? Cant say there is problem with math or not, it depends on your teacher how can he translate and teach you.
> 
> No problem with islam, Problem lies with people judging other people and thinking they are gods on the Earth.
> 
> In regards to Islam, no issues with it, it came with perfect set of instructions thats Holy Quran, have a perfect role model ( Prophet Muhammad ( Peace.upon.Him))
> 
> And in regards to Holy books being hard. SINCE others are not in perfect condition so i can only point out Quran.
> You have to understand off course it will be harder for us to understand as its from much more intelligent being then us humans will ever be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Main thing is really simple
> There is no God, But one whats so hard to understand here


Everything you said pretty much proved my point -- that the problem lies with these 'holy books'. You got your interpretations of Islam, the Pope got his interpretations of Christianity, and the list of the world's religions and various interpretations goes on. And just like you, each said the problem lies with someone else, not with his interpretations.

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## CatSultan

nang2 said:


> I say Islamism and you say Islam. Islamism isn't Islam. It is just a political movement in the name of Islam. Not everything in the name of Islam is really Islamic. A man in a woman's dress is still a man, regardless what the dress says.
> 
> Mixing politics and religion is often a dangerous move. That is why modern countries call for the separation of church and state. It is not like these two cannot be mixed. It is just very easy to be wrong. Religions call for unwavering faith and blind acceptance. That is because what religions pursuit is beyond human intellect, beyond human life on earth. But politics is everything human and everything earthly. Forcing some ordinary people to do what would be required for a monk is nothing but cruelty, which is against everything taught in Islam.


Islam is more than other religions. Its not just a private thing you do once a day. It is a way of life and it also contains laws for how to run a society. Islamic law doesn't force people to follow Islam. Even now in Muslim countries minorities get their own courts like in Jordan. The problem is when you make a psuedo islamic court like we have in Pakistan and force everyone to follow it.


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## nang2

Indos said:


> Yup Islamism that you learn from AQ/ISIS/Taliban, better you say AQ/ISIS/Taliban interpretation about Islam, not Islamism.
> 
> Yep, Islam is great but it is not easy to understand Islam if you are not raised by knowledgeable father since you are kid, a father who have huge Islamic books. Then there should be discussion between Father and his kids, not giving dogmatic teaching, so the father should hold democratic principle as well, not becoming an authorian father.
> 
> Islam is not like Christian, here everything can be understood. As non Muslim I bet you dont know that democratic system is actually endorsed in Quran through surah As-Syura and first Caliph get elected through democratic process.
> 
> I learn about Abu Bakr, first Caliph get elected through debate and voting is through my father book who bough Abu Bakar Biography written by famous Eqyptian Historian, Muhammad Haikal.
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> In Islam, all your live should be for Allah. It is because we dont live to make people admire us, Muslim lives to get Ridho ( acceptance/praise ) from Allah


It is not just hard to understand. It is nearly impossible. Some say you have to cut your head and step on it in order to know Allah. (Here, head means ego, of course.) Books don't help much, either, because the understanding cannot be passed along with words, only a glimpse of it, which is often wrong. Books only serve as a reminder to keep your hope up. Eventually, you need someone who truly knows Allah to introduce you to Him. Only such a person has the understanding. Even then his understanding is NOT yours. That you have to get it from Allah Himself. That is how difficult religions are. Yet, so many people claim to be experts after reading a few books.

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## Adecypher




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## Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen

Women will have limited education. Maybe primary school level. But will not be allowed high level education.

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## Indos

nang2 said:


> It is not just hard to understand. It is nearly impossible. Some say you have to cut your head and step on it in order to know Allah. (Here, head means ego, of course.) Books don't help much, either, because the understanding cannot be passed along with words, only a glimpse of it, which is often wrong. Books only serve as a reminder to keep your hope up. Eventually, you need someone who truly knows Allah to introduce you to Him. Only such a person has the understanding. Even then his understanding is NOT yours. That you have to get it from Allah Himself. That is how difficult religions are. Yet, so many people claim to be experts after reading a few books.



Yup, heart is important to be a good Muslim. Reading Islamic books are importants since many dont read Islamic book. Even so few Muslim read and understand whole Quran verses, most Muslim dont read whole Quran verses ( meaning ) yet. Non Arab Muslim usually just read some Quran verses and usually they read Quran without understanding about the meaning since they are lazy to read the translation in their own language

Actually Islam is still intact and the best interpreter of Quran is of course the one who understand about Allah and has connection with Him. We also can understand what Allah wants if we read Quran verses ( meaning) until complete.

Islam also has given us insight about who should be followed. One of the trait of them is that they are very careful ( of course unlike some one who dont hesitate to kill another Muslim ) and they like to stay in the middle ( not hold extreme position)

Many teaching in Quran that can make us understand about what Islam is.


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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> Everything you said pretty much proved my point -- that the problem lies with these 'holy books'. You got your interpretations of Islam, the Pope got his interpretations of Christianity, and the list of the world's religions and various interpretations goes on. And just like you, each said the problem lies with someone else, not with his interpretations.



If the problem is the interpretation and interpreter? how can it be the problem of Original TEXT or Source?
Quran ( All Holy books ) provided clear guidelines to its follower, it's the people who twisted it for their own benefit, don't blame the text, blame our own Greed, Ignorance, and Pride,


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## gambit

Darth Vader said:


> If the problem is the interpretation and interpreter? how can it be the problem of Original TEXT or Source?


Not very clear.

2 + 2 = 4

Clear. No room for interpretations.

If I say that I will meet at 5-ish o'clock. The number five is a reference point and going forward, not backward. It mean my time will be between 5:01 and 5:59. But most people will interpret that to be within 30 min. Anything beyond 5:30 or even 5:15 and it would be rude on my part.

So called 'holy books' are not like that. And yes, we humans have the right to demand the window of interpretation to be within that quarter, not the whole. The greater that window, the greater the odds of abuse of 'holy' texts. And that is what we have in history to today.

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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> Not very clear.
> 
> 2 + 2 = 4
> 
> Clear. No room for interpretations.
> 
> If I say that I will meet at 5-ish o'clock. The number five is a reference point and going forward, not backward. It mean my time will be between 5:01 and 5:59. But most people will interpret that to be within 30 min. Anything beyond 5:30 or even 5:15 and it would be rude on my part.
> 
> So called 'holy books' are not like that. And yes, we humans have the right to demand the window of interpretation to be within that quarter, not the whole. The greater that window, the greater the odds of abuse of 'holy' texts. And that is what we have in history to today.



Can life's all questions be answered by 2+2 = 4 ? are humans that simple ? no. So understandable we make errors.

" we humans have the right to demand " ? are we the creator or the creation, only creator has the right to 
demand from us not the other way

" The greater that window, the greater the odds of abuse of 'holy' texts. And that is what we have in history to today. " So who is at fault here? Humans or God ?, as i said the earlier problem isn't with Source it's with humans ( us )
Forget Holy Texts, Murder, Rape are one of the biggest criminal acts no matter what society & country you are in, but people still do that daily even knowing that its illegal, and wrong and most probably they will face harsh punishment but still do that so who is at wrong here Law or Person?


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## Zibago

nang2 said:


> I hope Islamism can evolve out of its old shadow.


Societies evolve at their own pace you cant fast forward in real life

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## nang2

Zibago said:


> Societies evolve at their own pace you cant fast forward in real life


Definitely. Look how big a failure American experiment has become with Afghanistan.

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## gambit

Darth Vader said:


> Can life's all questions be answered by 2+2 = 4 ? are humans that simple ? no.


But at least that simplicity give us a starting point.



Darth Vader said:


> " we humans have the right to demand " ? are we the creator or the creation, only creator has the right to demand from us not the other way


We have no evidence, let alone proof, that we were 'created'. As such, anyone with any kind of 'holy book' have the burden to make such book easy to read and understand.

Am not interested in the minutiae of Islam and you not in Christianity. So the best evidence that both of us have is how we live in our respective worlds. Right now, with the Taliban and their interpretations of Islam, your world ain't looking too attractive.

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## aziqbal

nang2 said:


> I am not talking about Islam. I said "Islamism".



stay out of our religious matters we are not communists 

for us our faith is everything 

Chinese opinion does not count

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## Mentee

gambit said:


> Am not interested in the minutiae of Islam and you not in Christianity. So the best evidence that both of us have is how we live in our respective worlds. Right now, with the Taliban and their interpretations of Islam, your world ain't looking too attractive.




At the end of the day we all gonna perish so the theory that there's "no" Creator won't cause any inconvenience , no harm done to either side but what IF it turned out to be the other way around and we are taken to a court to be judged for our acts ? 


Even Logic dictates that we certainly should opt for the safest option

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## 313ghazi

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?



With a pinch of salt but more so than WMD and 911.


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## nang2

aziqbal said:


> stay out of our religious matters we are not communists
> 
> for us our faith is everything
> 
> Chinese opinion does not count


Now you are equating Chinese with Communists, although I understand that your brain may take many shortcuts to maintain its functionality.

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## gambit

Mentee said:


> At the end of the day we all gonna perish so the theory that there's "no" Creator won't cause any inconvenience , no harm done to either side but what IF it turned out to be the other way around and we are taken to a court to be judged for our acts ?
> 
> 
> *Even Logic dictates that we certainly should opt for the safest option*


That -- the highlighted -- is fine. Which is why I like the Buddhist path the best. Live and let live. Let your life be *THE* example for others. Do not evangelize but always be ready to answer questions. If I erred with my religion, then I will pay the price. Same for you with your religion, if it turned out the false.

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## Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen

aziqbal said:


> stay out of our religious matters we are not communists
> 
> for us our faith is everything
> 
> Chinese opinion does not count



Everyone has their own faiths. My faith is Frosty the Snowman.

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## MultaniGuy

Yes I have heard. Afghan Taliban are coming back to power. They are probably already in power.
@Dalit Do you remember me? I am back now.


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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> But at least that simplicity give us a starting point.
> 
> 
> We have no evidence, let alone proof, that we were 'created'. As such, anyone with any kind of 'holy book' have the burden to make such book easy to read and understand.
> 
> Am not interested in the minutiae of Islam and you not in Christianity. So the best evidence that both of us have is how we live in our respective worlds. Right now, with the Taliban and their interpretations of Islam, your world ain't looking too attractive.



And you like others have the answer.
There is no one but the One.

Proof is right here, from nothing came everything what more evidence we can ask for.

In regards to minutiae details, All muslim still follow the core Christian beliefs that God is one, there is no one beside him Prophet Jesus was his prophet we still follow the original text.

As for taliban in all religions you will find some sort of extreme group.

In last 150 years how many Muslim countries have invaded non Muslim countries and did genocide, its the civilized world who still loots, Kills 3rd world barbarians.

World war 1 40 million deaths
Philippines vs US 250K + Deaths
Ethiopian - Italy war 300k+ Deaths
World war 2 75 mil
Forget about nukes on Japanese cities
WOT is hitting what 2 Mil + 
when i look at your more world more problem we will die much much sooner, in the name of democracy


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## MultaniGuy

aziqbal said:


> stay out of our religious matters we are not communists
> 
> for us our faith is everything
> 
> Chinese opinion does not count


Although I agree with you.
I would rather work with the Chinese Communists, than say the West. Atleast Chinese are more honest though.


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## Ahmet Pasha

Green disc said:


> This b**** must be crying inside, attention seeking b****
> 
> 
> Afghanistan: UK and US must protect Afghan activists - Malala
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Afghanistan: UK and US must protect Afghan activists - Malala
> 
> 
> The Nobel Peace Prize winner, who was shot by the Taliban, calls for countries to take in refugees.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.co.uk


Iss manhoos kaamwali ko Western powers ne fridge me rakha hota hai jab Islam/Musalmano/Pakistan ki gandi karni hoti hai is ko microwave me defrost kar ke dunya k samne pesh kar dete hain. Phir wapis fridge me saja kar rakh dete hain.


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## Mrc

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1427408477526188036


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## Menace2Society

BozkurtCCC said:


> Why can‘t a woman choose what she wants to wear? You guys have a sick mindset if you agree with that



This strange dynamic in the muslim world, I have figured it. 

It is a result of insecurity in men who do not want to see (for them legs and arms is "seeing in that way") what they can't have. So they can't take it they have to see all these beautiful women being themselves but can't have them. So what do they do? They cover them up, makes them feel better. True story.

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## ziaulislam

This is honestly surprising




__ https://www.facebook.com/1277577772356613/posts/4238421002938927


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## Thorough Pro

Did you not believe the US government and your military leadership for the last 20 years? Let him believe what he believes and time will be the judge in the days to come. 



gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?


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## gambit

Darth Vader said:


> And you like others have the answer.
> There is no one but the One.
> 
> Proof is right here, from nothing came everything what more evidence we can ask for.
> 
> In regards to minutiae details, All muslim still follow the core Christian beliefs that God is one, there is no one beside him Prophet Jesus was his prophet we still follow the original text.
> 
> As for taliban in all religions you will find some sort of extreme group.
> 
> In last 150 years how many Muslim countries have invaded non Muslim countries and did genocide, its the civilized world who still loots, Kills 3rd world barbarians.
> 
> World war 1 40 million deaths
> Philippines vs US 250K + Deaths
> Ethiopian - Italy war 300k+ Deaths
> World war 2 75 mil
> Forget about nukes on Japanese cities
> WOT is hitting what 2 Mil +
> when i look at your more world more problem we will die much much sooner, in the name of democracy


Every major power in history have two things in common: the Arts and STEM. Combined, the two contributed to the overall 'culture'. But for outside observers, the Arts and STEM nearly always stand out.

The Arts is about the intellect, the soul, and the heart of the people. These things are expressed in language, music, paintings, religion, and so on.

Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math (STEM) are about Nature, as in how the people manipulate Nature for their advantage. For example, sand and rocks are natural, but the brick and concrete are not. To make bricks and concrete requires study and understanding of Nature.

For the Arts, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated with blowing up statues.

For STEM, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated to rigging up heavy weapons to Toyota trucks.

And that will be it...

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## Thorough Pro

Let me guess your PhD in religious studies came from watching Fox news




gambit said:


> It is a problem with Islam, the same way that Christianity create problems for its followers. I like IKEA furniture. Simple enough to assemble and use. Nothing 'heirloom' about them but they are just good enough. Too bad these 'holy books' are not as easy to understand as IKEA instructions.

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## Meengla

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?



I am cautiously optimistic. As @Indos says above, in the 1990s they were just coming out of Madrassahs and brought a lot of extremism along; they had a Messianic Zeal then! BUT they are also human being, capable of change and 20 years in the wilderness, especially in such a connected, informed world, had to have some moderating affect on them.

Related to this topic, saw a video from within last 24 hours featuring Pakistani journalism Saleem Safi. He is one of those journalists from Pakistan whose opinion about events in Afghanistan are extremely insightful and informed-- HE is the one who should have been consulted by Americans instead of a lot of idiots in London or Washington DC commenting about Afghanistan.

Anyway, here is my understanding of Mr. Safi's key points (some points added per other sources): 
1) Taliban have shown mercy and respect even to the Gov. of Kandahar who had killed a lot of Taliban.
2) So far, not enforced beards on men where in the past even the length of the beards were enforced.
3) Women are NOT expected to wear a Burqah--a head-covering would suffice. 
4) Women are supposed to be allowed to go to work without a male escort.
5) Education for women through even PhD would be okay but in technical fields (Ex: Lady doctors)
6) Taliban are seeking legitimacy and they are not the same as they were (this was said by a staffer from the UK's Ministry of Defense!)
7) Taliban have not touched the Shia Hazara community so far this time--perhaps as an olive branch to Iran or as genuine change of heart.
8) Internal dialogs from Taliban revealed that they would have even spared General Dostum. 

It is too early to say whether how many of these would be actually allowed but I am cautiously optimistic. Also, one thing to note is that beyond Kabul and very few large cities' whose very small more 'liberal' populations, most Afghans are very conservative anyway.

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## Rollno21

Meengla said:


> I am cautiously optimistic. As @Indos says above, in the 1990s they were just coming out of Madrassahs and brought a lot of extremism along; they had a Messianic Zeal then! BUT they are also human being, capable of change and 20 years in the wilderness, especially in such a connected, informed world, had to have some moderating affect on them.
> 
> Related to this topic, saw a video from within last 24 hours featuring Pakistani journalism Saleem Safi. He is one of those journalists from Pakistan whose opinion about events in Afghanistan are extremely insightful and informed-- HE is the one who should have been consulted by Americans instead of a lot of idiots in London or Washington DC commenting about Afghanistan.
> 
> Anyway, here is my understanding of Mr. Safi's key points (some points added per other sources):
> 1) Taliban have shown mercy and respect even to the Gov. of Kandahar who had killed a lot of Taliban.
> 2) So far, not enforced beards on men where in the past even the length of the beards were enforced.
> 3) Women are NOT expected to wear a Burqah--a head-covering would suffice.
> 4) Women are supposed to be allowed to go to work without a male escort.
> 5) Education for women through even PhD would be okay but in technical fields (Ex: Lady doctors)
> 6) Taliban are seeking legitimacy and they are not the same as they were (this was said by a staffer from the UK's Ministry of Defense!)
> 7) Taliban have not touched the Shia Hazara community so far this time--perhaps as an olive branch to Iran or as genuine change of heart.
> 8) Internal dialogs from Taliban revealed that they would have even spared General Dostum.
> 
> It is too early to say whether how many of these would be actually allowed but I am cautiously optimistic. Also, one thing to note is that beyond Kabul and very few large cities' whose very small more 'liberal' populations, most Afghans are very conservative anyway.


We need to wait to see the true colours of Taliban, I am not sure as old habits die hard. For example your claim not enforced beards for men.have you seen a single Taliban without beard,atleast I did not ,I will believe when I see one.


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## Mentee

gambit said:


> That -- the highlighted -- is fine. Which is why I like the Buddhist path the best. Live and let live. Let your life be *THE* example for others. Do not evangelize but always be ready to answer questions. If I erred with my religion, then I will pay the price. Same for you with your religion, if it turned out the false.




Yes sir, The Lord Himself has spoken

"no compulsion in religion"

coz if there was any He Himself may have made every single soul obedient . Nice talking to you.


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## Darth Vader

gambit said:


> Every major power in history have two things in common: the Arts and STEM. Combined, the two contributed to the overall 'culture'. But for outside observers, the Arts and STEM nearly always stand out.
> 
> The Arts is about the intellect, the soul, and the heart of the people. These things are expressed in language, music, paintings, religion, and so on.
> 
> Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math (STEM) are about Nature, as in how the people manipulate Nature for their advantage. For example, sand and rocks are natural, but the brick and concrete are not. To make bricks and concrete requires study and understanding of Nature.
> 
> For the Arts, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated with blowing up statues.
> 
> For STEM, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated to rigging up heavy weapons to Toyota trucks.
> 
> And that will be it...


🤣that knowledge of ART & STEM is sponsored by UNCLE Sam
In past 60 all major insurgency, uncle sam was involved it directly or in directly funded these when they served its purpose they became bad people ?

These are the same people who were compared to US forefathers when they were on US side in Washington.

At this stage US, after all the bloods of innocent on UNCLE SAMS hand, doesnt have the right to speak and let others know what they are doing is wrong or right.

Let the world learn from its own mistakes, and uncle sam solve own internal problems


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## Ahmet Pasha

BozkurtCCC said:


> Why can‘t a woman choose what she wants to wear? You guys have a sick mindset if you agree with that


Yea bro why can't a woman decide what to wear? Why did you ban women from choosing of their own free will to wear the hijab? Why are/were Turbanli kadınlar labeled as being backward and ignorant? 

It is truly sick what you lot did in 90s to mid 2000s.


BozkurtCCC said:


> Your mother really failed in teaching proper manners to you. Your language is disgusting. Learn to respect women even if you are fundamentalist.


Ok abicim you can teach us. Open an academy.


gambit said:


> Every major power in history have two things in common: the Arts and STEM. Combined, the two contributed to the overall 'culture'. But for outside observers, the Arts and STEM nearly always stand out.
> 
> The Arts is about the intellect, the soul, and the heart of the people. These things are expressed in language, music, paintings, religion, and so on.
> 
> Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math (STEM) are about Nature, as in how the people manipulate Nature for their advantage. For example, sand and rocks are natural, but the brick and concrete are not. To make bricks and concrete requires study and understanding of Nature.
> 
> For the Arts, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated with blowing up statues.
> 
> For STEM, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated to rigging up heavy weapons to Toyota trucks.
> 
> And that will be it...


You used to say similar things 20 years ago. Belittling Afghans and Taliban. Look where it has lead you.


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## Ahmet Pasha

BozkurtCCC said:


> Never accepting your faults will just keep you in the downward spiral. You are one of the most unpopular countries in the world and regarded as a terrorism and fundamentalism hub, although I am sure there are so many reasonable people in your country which are oppressed by Islam. Religion has eaten up your brain.


That's great to hear but you totally dodged my question bro?

If you really do support freedom of choice why ban women's choice to wear hijab?

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## Ahmet Pasha

BozkurtCCC said:


> The hijab isn‘t banned currently, I don‘t know what you are talking about. You have a huge rape problem in your country, honor killings, Terrorism, Fundamentalism, Child molestation, poverty, oppression of women, infamous blasphemy law, oppression of minorities and the only you thing you can come up with is, that a symbol of oppression (hijab) was banned? Get a grip ffs.


The hijab was famously banned by Kemalist government/dictators in 1990s Turkey. You keep trying to dodge it without answering. If you really do value all this freedom, liberty and enlightenment why ban women's choice to wear hijab?

About the other stuff you mention as if none of this exists in your sultanate of Turkey. How every Kemalist government oppresses the conservatives and the other side retaliates in Turkey every time a new government comes? 

Why Adnan menderes was executed? Why forcibly close masjids? Why forcibly change azan to Turkish? Why forcibly make people wear Fedora or be executed? 

If you really love freedom and liberty why do all these things when these things had not even been done by France and China(XinJiang) yet? Why?

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## Ahmet Pasha

BozkurtCCC said:


> Whataboutism at its finest. You are a lost cause and a deeply radical and backward person. I won‘t answer to someone with a steonage mindset like you. But believe me, people like you are the minority in the world. You guys have your own radical version of Islam because you don‘t have another identity. I pity your oppressed women.


Am I doing whataboutism or are you constantly dodging questions?

How is presenting facts from history being backward?

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## newb3e

Ahmet Pasha said:


> Am I doing whataboutism or are you constantly dodging questions?
> 
> How is presenting facts from history being backward?


pussy liberation new slogan for western pets!

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## ARMalik

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?



Do you really believe Sleepy Joe Biden??


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## gambit

Thorough Pro said:


> Let me guess your PhD in religious studies came from watching Fox news


Better than any degree of 'Islamic studies' from any madrassas.


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## Indos

Rollno21 said:


> We need to wait to see the true colours of Taliban, I am not sure as old habits die hard. For example your claim not enforced beards for men.have you seen a single Taliban without beard,atleast I did not ,I will believe when I see one.



I get some reasoning about growing beard, I forget the detail but the reason prophet Muhammad and early Muslim use beard is to differentiate them during the war as ancient war you do fight very close. 

It has some practically aspect in the era you dont have good modern technic to make distinctive military dress, practically as they are fighting the same Arab who look the same like them


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## Green disc

BozkurtCCC said:


> Your mother really failed in teaching proper manners to you. Your language is disgusting. Learn to respect women even if you are fundamentalist.


Leave my mother out of this 
My mother taught my never to fellow people like her, claim to be Muslim but openly declare sexual relationship without marriage is okay
Looks like your mother taught you to keep these people in high esteem


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## Attila the Hun

BozkurtCCC said:


> The hijab isn‘t banned currently, I don‘t know what you are talking about. You have a huge rape problem in your country, honor killings, Terrorism, Fundamentalism, Child molestation, poverty, oppression of women, infamous blasphemy law, oppression of minorities and the only you thing you can come up with is, that a symbol of oppression (hijab) was banned? Get a grip ffs.


You're not a "Bozkurt CCC" lol


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## Ahmet Pasha

Attila the Hun said:


> You're not a "Bozkurt CCC" lol


Dude seriously what is up with these "Turks" actively attacking Pakistanis recently on this forum? 

Before it was "Islamic looking children" aka MM-E guy now this Bozkurt CCC guy??


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## Attila the Hun

Ahmet Pasha said:


> Dude seriously what is up with these "Turks" actively attacking Pakistanis recently on this forum?
> 
> Before it was "Islamic looking children" aka MM-E guy now this Bozkurt CCC guy??


MM-E is AKP Erdogan fanboy they're like a cult some of them. 
This BozkurtCCC doesn't like Islam. Many like him in Turkey, but only dfference is they do not claim to be "Bozkurt" lol.


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## Attila the Hun

BozkurtCCC said:


> Your mother sucked Bin Laden‘s cock, she is a Taliban slut


Since when do Nationalist Turks cared for Taliban and what happens in Afghanistan


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## Green disc

Attila the Hun said:


> Since when do Nationalist Turks cared for Taliban and what happens in Afghanistan





Attila the Hun said:


> Since when do Nationalist Turks cared for Taliban and what happens in Afghanistan


something/someone must have hurt him big time


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## waz

BozkurtCCC said:


> Your mother sucked Bin Laden‘s cock, she is a Taliban slut



That's it ban for quite a while. His posts were shocking beyond belief.

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## MultaniGuy

waz said:


> That's it ban for quite a while. His posts were shocking beyond belief.


Now the Afghan Taliban are running the show in Afghanistan. This means India is in big trouble now.
Good Riddance!


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## Trango Towers

Ahmet Pasha said:


> White man: women won't have access to education and work.
> 
> Taliban: assures they will.
> 
> White man: we don't trust Taliban.
> 
> Why make noise then?


Whites don't lie... they are pure

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## MultaniGuy

Trango Towers said:


> Whites don't lie... they are pure


USA has done many dishonest things:
1) Removal of Mohammad Mossadeq
2) Vietnam War
3) WMDs in Iraq
4) Pressler Amendment for Pakistan for developing nuclear weapons

Yet, some baboons here want to still trust USA because of a few F-16s.

I hope Pakistan develop JF-17 and J-10Cs so we don't have to rely on USA for anything.


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## Trango Towers

MultaniGuy said:


> USA has done many dishonest things:
> 1) Removal of Mohammad Mossadeq
> 2) Vietnam War
> 3) WMDs in Iraq
> 4) Pressler Amendment for Pakistan for developing nuclear weapons
> 
> Yet, some baboons here want to still trust USA because of a few F-16s.
> 
> I hope Pakistan develop JF-17 and J-10Cs so we don't have to rely on USA for anything.


You do realise I was sarcastic? And yes I agree with all you wrote. I wouldn't trust an America ever


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## Verve

gambit said:


> You guys really believe that?



Taliban didn't kill a single US/NATO soldier after signing the agreement, despite US breaking the agreement by bombing them last week! 

Taliban are far more believable than you lying scum Americans.

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## magra

Meengla said:


> I am cautiously optimistic. As @Indos says above, in the 1990s they were just coming out of Madrassahs and brought a lot of extremism along; they had a Messianic Zeal then! BUT they are also human being, capable of change and 20 years in the wilderness, especially in such a connected, informed world, had to have some moderating affect on them.
> 
> Related to this topic, saw a video from within last 24 hours featuring Pakistani journalism Saleem Safi. He is one of those journalists from Pakistan whose opinion about events in Afghanistan are extremely insightful and informed-- HE is the one who should have been consulted by Americans instead of a lot of idiots in London or Washington DC commenting about Afghanistan.
> 
> Anyway, here is my understanding of Mr. Safi's key points (some points added per other sources):
> 1) Taliban have shown mercy and respect even to the Gov. of Kandahar who had killed a lot of Taliban.
> 2) So far, not enforced beards on men where in the past even the length of the beards were enforced.
> 3) Women are NOT expected to wear a Burqah--a head-covering would suffice.
> 4) Women are supposed to be allowed to go to work without a male escort.
> 5) Education for women through even PhD would be okay but in technical fields (Ex: Lady doctors)
> 6) Taliban are seeking legitimacy and they are not the same as they were (this was said by a staffer from the UK's Ministry of Defense!)
> 7) Taliban have not touched the Shia Hazara community so far this time--perhaps as an olive branch to Iran or as genuine change of heart.
> 8) Internal dialogs from Taliban revealed that they would have even spared General Dostum.
> 
> It is too early to say whether how many of these would be actually allowed but I am cautiously optimistic. Also, one thing to note is that beyond Kabul and very few large cities' whose very small more 'liberal' populations, most Afghans are very conservative anyway.


If Taliban has truly changed and want an inclusive Afghan govt, they should organize free elections in Afghanistan. Let the elected body (without outside interference) lead Afghanistan for its best interests.

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## Thorough Pro

There are those who lack awareness or knowledge and then their are arrogant and delusional, stay where you are, you deserve nothing better.




gambit said:


> Better than any degree of 'Islamic studies' from any madrassas.


----------



## Thorough Pro

For arts the western countries are known for making ****, legalizing prostitution, gay marriages, child rape, abortion, hate, racism, indiscriminate massacre of other religions and races, for STEM all your high tech couldn't do jack shit about rigged up illiterate rag tag Taliban's who riggup those Toyota trucks.

I know you are hurt, my condolences on the beginning of the end of your so called American Century.






gambit said:


> Every major power in history have two things in common: the Arts and STEM. Combined, the two contributed to the overall 'culture'. But for outside observers, the Arts and STEM nearly always stand out.
> 
> The Arts is about the intellect, the soul, and the heart of the people. These things are expressed in language, music, paintings, religion, and so on.
> 
> Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math (STEM) are about Nature, as in how the people manipulate Nature for their advantage. For example, sand and rocks are natural, but the brick and concrete are not. To make bricks and concrete requires study and understanding of Nature.
> 
> For the Arts, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated with blowing up statues.
> 
> For STEM, Afghanistan under the Taliban will be associated to rigging up heavy weapons to Toyota trucks.
> 
> And that will be it...

Reactions: Like Like:
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## Trango Towers

Verve said:


> Taliban didn't kill a single US/NATO soldier after signing the agreement, despite US breaking the agreement by bombing them last week!
> 
> Taliban are far more believable than you lying scum Americans.


Plus they can easily over run kabul Airport but they haven't bothered


----------



## Tom_Cruise

waz said:


> That's it ban for quite a while. His posts were shocking beyond belief.



He only registered a few days ago and almost all his posts were anti-Pakistan rhetoric right from the outset. He was clearly some dumb Indian.


----------



## mike2000 is back

Indos said:


> They were just coming from Madrasah in Pakistan before they took control Afghan in 1997


So madrasah teaches what if not islam?


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## Mohammed al-Faruqi

Glad tidings for Afghanistan. After decades of American colonisation, they've removed and liberated the country within matter's of day from the yoke of imperialism.

Hold tight to the hard earned freedom and independence.

May peace and prosperity flourish insha'Allah.


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## Verve

mike2000 is back said:


> So madrasah teaches what if not islam?



Madrasah's teach the ideology of the sect/group it's part of, and each sect deviates in many ways from Islam. Independent study of Quran and Sunnah is not allowed, and their own interpretations are only accepted and taught. In summary, Sects exist for power and funding, not to teach Islam.

Afghan Taliban moving to hijab from burkah for women is the right Islamic law and a major deviation from the sect they were taught. Hijab is compulsory in Islam, not burkah, but a woman who wants to wear burkah on her own accord can't be forced not to. Allowing education and work for women is also a major deviation from their sects teachings, that is now in compliance with Islam. It seems they've had time to study Islam (Quran and Sunnah only) independently. I am waiting for their laws to be announced to understand what all they've changed on.


----------



## Indos

mike2000 is back said:


> So madrasah teaches what if not islam?



Madrasah is like a high school in Islamic study, here in Indonesia Madrasah student will go to university after completing the 3 years study there.

Sunni Islam has 4 Madzhab and all of them are normal. unlike Taliban version of Islam. All 4 Madzhab is followed by all Muslim nation like Indonesia and Saudi

Here in Indonesia, state Islamic university has female Rector, she leads the university and all Madrasah students who want to study Islam go to this university. We have one in every province with majority Muslim population.

This UIN Sharif Hidayatullah Jakarta, Islamic University with many Islamic study until Doctoral degree. The location is near Jakarta and the center or the most respected in all Islamic study universities across Indonesia that all are state owned. In here there also many non-Islamic studies like Medical, Psychology, and other. It is like Al Azhar University in Cairo, Egypt.

The rector is female, Prof Doctor Amany Lubis. (From her name she comes from North Sumatra). Doctorate degree is similar like Phd in USA.


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## Indos

Indos said:


> Madrasah is like a high school in Islamic study, here in Indonesia Madrasah student will go to university after completing the 3 years study there.
> 
> Sunni Islam has 4 Madzhab and all of them are normal. unlike Taliban version of Islam. All 4 Madzhab is followed by all Muslim nation like Indonesia and Saudi
> 
> Here in Indonesia, state Islamic university has female Rector, she leads the university and all Madrasah students who want to study Islam go to this university. We have one in every province with majority Muslim population.
> 
> This UIN Sharif Hidayatullah Jakarta, Islamic University with many Islamic study until Doctoral degree. The location is near Jakarta and the center or the most respected in all Islamic study universities across Indonesia that all are state owned. In here there also many non-Islamic studies like Medical, Psychology, and other. It is like Al Azhar University in Cairo, Egypt.
> 
> The rector is female, Prof Doctor Amany Lubis. (From her name she comes from North Sumatra). Doctorate degree is similar like Phd in USA.



This is why I bring this video from Prof Doctor Quraish Shihab, here he is with his own daughter who is a respected journalist in Indonesia, Najwa Shihab. He respect her daughter decision to not wear hijab as Hijab is personal domain ibadah, like prayer and others that cannot be forced in term of the implementation except by the person him/herselves

The main theme of the conversation here is Islam which is misunderstood. He was also previously a rector of UIN Sharif Hidayatullah Islamic University Jakarta.






*Islam yang Disalahpahami | Shihab & Shihab*

@mike2000 is back


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## Saho

You can picture that.


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## gambit

Thorough Pro said:


> For arts the western countries are known for making ****, legalizing prostitution, gay marriages, child rape, abortion, hate, racism, indiscriminate massacre of other religions and races, for STEM all your high tech couldn't do jack shit about rigged up illiterate rag tag Taliban's who riggup those Toyota trucks.
> 
> I know you are hurt, my condolences on the beginning of the end of your so called American Century.


And now we see desperate Afghan mothers handling their children over the Americans. How many of those babies and toddlers are girls?

Child rape? Sounds like common Taliban practice.

Me hurt? No. If you want to see who is truly hurt, go look in the mirror.


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## Thorough Pro

Chill out, the weather is already too hot




gambit said:


> And now we see desperate Afghan mothers handling their children over the Americans. How many of those babies and toddlers are girls?
> 
> Child rape? Sounds like common Taliban practice.
> 
> Me hurt? No. If you want to see who is truly hurt, go look in the mirror.


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## Thorough Pro




----------



## Ghareeb_Da_Baal



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## AsianLion




----------

