# Grand Siege of Kaaba ended by SSG under Musharraf ?



## Zarvan

Soon after the rebel seizure, about a hundred security officers of the Ministry of Interior attempted to retake the mosque, and were decisively turned back with heavy casualties. The survivors were quickly joined by units of the Saudi Arabian Army and Saudi Arabian National Guard.
By the evening, the entire city of Mecca had been evacuated. Prince Sultan appointed Turki bin Faisal Al Saud, then head of the Al Mukhabaraat Al 'Aammah (Saudi Intelligence), to take over the forward command post several hundred metres from the mosque, where Prince Turki would remain for the next several weeks. However, the first order of business was to seek the approval of the ulema, which was led by Abdul Aziz bin Baz. Islam forbids any violence within the Grand Mosque, to the extent that plants cannot be uprooted without explicit religious sanction. Ibn Baaz found himself in a delicate situation, especially as he had previously taught al-Otaybi in Medina. Regardless, the ulema issued a fatwa allowing deadly force to be used in retaking the mosque.[16]
With religious approval granted, Saudi forces launched frontal assaults on three of the main gates. The assaulting force was repulsed, and never even got close to breaking through the insurgents' defences. Snipers continued to pick off soldiers who showed themselves. The mosque's public address system was used to broadcast the insurgents' message throughout the streets of Mecca.
*An elite unit called "Rahbar" of the SSG, the commando battalion of the Pakistan Army, headed by Major Pervez Musharraf now a Retired General of Pakistan Army and Ex-President of Pakistan, was mobilized and SSG commandos were rushed to Mecca from Pakistan on Saudi Government's request.[1] In the middle of the day, Saudi troops abseiled from helicopters directly into the central courtyard of the mosque.* The Saudi soldiers were picked off by insurgents holding superior positions. After failure of this exercise, Pakistani SSG Commandos split/showered the water allover the Grand Masjid floors even in Minarets. This situation was very surprising for the insurgents that what was going to be happen next. On having water all over the floors of the Grand Masjid, Pak Army Commandos released the electric current in the water and insurgent suspended their activities and start changing their positions to save them from the electric shocks. During this Pak Army Commandos were dropped by helicopters into the Grand Masjid in different locations and they easily captured many of the insurgents alive. [17]
The insurgents aired their demands from the mosque's loudspeakers, calling for the cutoff of oil exports to the United States and the expulsion of all foreign civilian and military experts from the Arabian Peninsula.[18] On 25 November, the Arab Socialist Action Party &#8211; Arabian Peninsula issued a statement from Beirut alleging to clarify the demands of the insurgents. The party, however, denied any involvement of its own in the seizure.[19]
Officially, the Saudi government took the position of not aggressively taking the mosque, but rather to starve the militants. Nevertheless, several unsuccessful assaults were undertaken, at least one of them through the underground tunnels in and around the mosque.[20]
By 27 November, most of the mosque was retaken by the Saudi National Guard and the Army, though they suffered heavy casualties in the assault. In the catacombs under the mosque, however, several militants continued to resist and tear gas was used to force them out.[21] Several of the top militants escaped the siege [22] and days later sporadic fighting erupted in other parts of the city in trying to capture them.
The battle had lasted more than two weeks, and had officially left "255 pilgrims, troops and fanatics" killed and "another 560 injured ... although diplomats suggested the toll was higher."[citation needed] Military casualties were 127 dead and 451 injured.[23]
Grand Mosque Seizure - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia @Aeronaut @Leader @Oscar @nuclearpak @Icarus @Rafi @Areesh @balixd @HRK @Arabian Legend @Yzd Khalifa @JUBA @al-Hasani @BLACK EAGLE @DESERT FIGHTER @Imran Khan @jaibi @A.Rafay and others

Reactions: Like Like:
9


----------



## Sugarcane

Source? Is it Wikipedia???


----------



## Spring Onion

was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??

anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation

was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time?? 

anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation.


----------



## Zarvan

Spring Onion said:


> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation
> 
> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation.



SSG took part in that operation that is known to every one that is a fact they were they ones to who took out those militants

I am only shocked by Musharraf as their leader that is only thing which shocked me

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Spring Onion

Zarvan said:


> SSG took part in that operation that is known to every one that is a fact they were they ones to who took out those militants
> 
> I am only shocked by Musharraf as their leader that is only thing which shocked me



I really don't know but there are reports and claims that suggest otherwise.

As I said that many were suggested to keep a mum over involvement of Pakistani commandos in ending the siege.

More evidence is in support of involvement of French commandos too.


----------



## Malik Usman

Zarvan said:


> SSG took part in that operation that is known to every one that is a fact they were they ones to who took out those militants
> 
> I am only shocked by Musharraf as their leader that is only thing which shocked me



But from where you pick this story..........what is a source............I also have a different version of story.......but first i want a source of your story..


----------



## Zarvan

Malik Usman said:


> But from where you pick this story..........what is a source............I also have a different version of story.......but first i want a source of your story..



I posted the source above wikki Mr what do you know about this operation


----------



## Sugarcane

Malik Usman said:


> But from where you pick this story..........what is a source............I also have a different version of story.......but first i want a source of your story..



That part is recently added into Wikipedia article by some fanboy - can be someone from PDF


----------



## Panther 57

Spring Onion said:


> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation
> 
> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation.



It is correct that Pak SSG ultimately got the issue resolved. I did not know that the det commander was PM


----------



## Yzd Khalifa

Spring Onion said:


> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation
> 
> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??
> 
> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation.





> was there any detachment of Pak SSG at that time??



No, they assisted us unconditionally. 





> anyway many suggest that they were asked or rather advised not to disclose or accept or claim that any Pakistani commando took part in that operation.



This goes in contrast to what they taught us.



LoveIcon said:


> That part is recently added into Wikipedia article by some fanboy - can be someone from PDF



  ^ LoL sarcasm much? ?

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## Spring Onion

Yzd Khalifa said:


> No, they assisted us unconditionally.



 always. 







> This goes in contrast to what they taught us.



I was talking about the Pakistanis. I don't know personally but those who knew and were close said they were suggested not to claim or own anything like that.



But since you are Saudian and may be knowing more hence I believe your post.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## pak-marine

Musharaf had a God given charge of clearing holy places from terrorists for example: Holy Kabba and The Red Mosque

Reactions: Like Like:
9


----------



## ajpirzada

from what i have heard, it was the French special force which lead the operation and it was French idea to use this water trick. SSG was also supporting the operation but it was the French who were leading it. i read this info somewhere on this forum few years back and no one could contradict it from what i remember.


----------



## MrShabi2010

That's why i liked Musharraf cleaning out the terrorists like my bruv @pak-marine said

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Yzd Khalifa

ajpirzada said:


> from what i have heard, it was the French special force which lead the operation and it was French idea to use this water trick. SSG was also supporting the operation but it was the French who were leading it. i read this info somewhere on this forum few years back and no one could contradict it from what i remember.



France's involvment was more like of a consultative one, while Pakistan played a key role in this Opt long with the SANG. 

We didn't have _specialized _ Comandos to handle a sitution like this.

I honestly don't know anything about the Pakistani version of the story, all I know is that the Saudis apprecaited Pakistan's help to go hand in hand with the SANG to destory these scums. 




Spring Onion said:


> always.
> 
> I was talking about the Pakistanis. I don't know personally but those who knew and were close said they were suggested not to claim or own anything like that.
> 
> 
> 
> But since you are Saudian and may be knowing more hence I believe your post.

Reactions: Like Like:
5


----------



## W.11

ajpirzada said:


> from what i have heard, it was the French special force which lead the operation and it was French idea to use this water trick. SSG was also supporting the operation but it was the French who were leading it. i read this info somewhere on this forum few years back and no one could contradict it from what i remember.



non muslim aren't allowed inside makkah, is that right?

as it was about the holy sites, i don't think that saudis will hand over such an exercise to the non muslims, considering the significance of those holy sites

Reactions: Like Like:
3


----------



## ajpirzada

W.11 said:


> non muslim aren't allowed inside makkah, is that right?
> 
> as it was about the holy sites, i don't think that saudis will hand over such an exercise to the non muslims, considering the significance of those holy sites



ya i am aware of it. some exceptions were made for that particular case. anyways it will be interesting to know the official details rather than the sepculations


----------



## ajpirzada

Yzd Khalifa said:


> *France's involvment was more like of a consultative one,* while Pakistan played a key role in this Opt long with the SANG.
> 
> We didn't have _specialized _ Comandos to handle a sitution like this.
> 
> I honestly don't know anything about the Pakistani version of the story, all I know is that the Saudis apprecaited Pakistan's help to go hand in hand with the SANG to destory these scums.


 @W.11 this seems more accurate from what i can recall. French played an active consultative role. and most likely it was a French idea to flood the Kaba and then electrocute it. SSG's role is very over blown while that of French is very understated.


----------



## Thəorətic Muslim

Is there a time-table until when Classified Ops/ Papers in Pakistan are unclassified?

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Yzd Khalifa

Th&#601;or&#601;tic Muslim;4833812 said:


> Is there a time-table until when Classified Ops/ Papers in Pakistan are unclassified?



Except the USSR's invasion of Afghanistan you won't find any data related to KSA being declassified.

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Xestan

Well, I don't know about Musharraf but Brigadier TM Shaheed took part in this operation, that I'm quite sure about.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## Sugarcane

Yzd Khalifa said:


> ^ LoL sarcasm much? ?



Yeah - And fanboy forgot that Musharaf was Colonel in 1979 not Major

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## krash

ajpirzada said:


> from what i have heard, it was the French special force which lead the operation and it was French idea to use this water trick. SSG was also supporting the operation but it was the French who were leading it. i read this info somewhere on this forum few years back and no one could contradict it from what i remember.





ajpirzada said:


> @W.11 this seems more accurate from what i can recall. French played an active consultative role. and most likely it was a French idea to flood the Kaba and then electrocute it. SSG's role is very over blown while that of French is very understated.



Well, officially there was no non-Saudi involvement in the episode. But unofficially it is said that two/three French Special Forces officers were converted to Islam and then brought over in consultative roles. I've posted this before but I remember reading an account of the incident somewhere in which the scene of Pakistani SSG guys kneeling down, untying and taking their shoes off before entering the Ka'baa was depicted quite beautifully.


----------



## Sashan

Spring Onion said:


> I really don't know but there are reports and claims that suggest otherwise.
> 
> As I said that many were suggested to keep a mum over involvement of Pakistani commandos in ending the siege.
> 
> More evidence is in support of involvement of French commandos too.



Read a book long time ago - House of Saud??? - It was the French commandos who were temporarily converted to Islam who aided the Saudis in ending the Siege. There was a chapter dedicated to Mecca crisis.

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Thirdfront

What a joke!!! It seems like this thread is opened and the garbage posted so that it can be linked in wiki as a "source".. circular reference. That wiki article is a joke and fanboy stuff. "Looming Tower" was referenced with page numbers and when I go to those pages, there is nothing remotely connected to the subject. The previous version had tariq m. as the commander and it was saudis who abseiled and not SSG. And all those hollywood movie watchers who believe in the absurd story of flooding mosque with water and then giving electricity.... get a life... it is not possible, at least practically.

Why do people feel like lying so blatantly, that too with this much of absurdity? do they really believe? Is their ego hurt so bad or they simply too stupid to understand?


----------



## jaunty

Sashan said:


> Read a book long time ago - House of Saud??? - It was the French commandos who were temporarily converted to Islam who aided the Saudis in ending the Siege. There was a chapter dedicated to Mecca crisis.



So essentially kafirs had to save it, oh the irony!!!


----------



## Sashan

jaunty said:


> So essentially kafirs had to save it, oh the irony!!!



The book is "Siege of Mecca" by Yaroslav Trofimov - a nice one to read and the interview from the author himself - 



Yaroslav Trofimov - An interview with author


What was the US's role in the Siege of Mecca?
There were American citizens on both sides of the barricades. The gunmen occupying the Mosque included a number of African-American converts to Islam. Retired American military personnel were employed flying Saudi helicopters above the Mosque in support of the mission in Mecca. And the CIA provided tear gas and advice on the ground. *At the end, however, it was the role of the French commandos that proved decisive in the final assault on the shrine. 
*



The French commandos were led by Captain Paul Barril (he was later indicted in the Rwandan genocide for supplying arms) 






Thirty years on, Mecca mosque siege reverberates | Latest news, Breaking news, Pakistan News, World news, business, sport and multimedia | DAWN.COM



The soldiers were backed by a small team of French commandos, led by the now infamous Lieutenant Paul Barril, and endorsed by a fatwa extracted the highest clerics that it was permissible to shoot the militants inside the sanctum.


----------



## Panther 57

Thirdfront said:


> What a joke!!! It seems like this thread is opened and the garbage posted so that it can be linked in wiki as a "source".. circular reference. That wiki article is a joke and fanboy stuff. "Looming Tower" was referenced with page numbers and when I go to those pages, there is nothing remotely connected to the subject. The previous version had tariq m. as the commander and it was saudis who abseiled and not SSG. And all those hollywood movie watchers who believe in the absurd story of flooding mosque with water and then giving electricity.... get a life... it is not possible, at least practically.
> 
> Why do people feel like lying so blatantly, that too with this much of absurdity? do they really believe? Is their ego hurt so bad or they simply too stupid to understand?




Is it an incident of your life time?


----------



## Yzd Khalifa

Sashan said:


> Read a book long time ago - House of Saud??? - It was the French commandos who were temporarily converted to Islam who aided the Saudis in ending the Siege. There was a chapter dedicated to Mecca crisis.



Hey there! What's up?  

Actually, the author of the book never bothered documenting what took place, nor had he relied on trusted sources. My father was present back in the day. the French personnels were divided into two groups; First the consultative team of whom work in Taif, Second the Commandos of who they were Muslims of North African origins.

Reactions: Like Like:
2


----------



## Sashan

Yzd Khalifa said:


> Hey there! What's up?
> 
> Actually, the author of the book never bothered documenting what took place, nor had he relied on trusted sources. My father was present back in the day. the French personnels were divided into two groups; First the consultative team of whom work in Taif, Second the Commandos of who they were Muslims of North African origins.



He mentioned that he spoke to Paul Barril and other French commandos and readily accepts that he could not talk to Saudi soldiers who participated in breaking the Siege but he mentions he spoke to a gunman who was part of the Siege.

Reactions: Like Like:
1


----------



## rubyjackass

ajpirzada said:


> from what i have heard, it was the French special force which lead the operation and it was French idea to use this water trick. SSG was also supporting the operation but it was the French who were leading it. i read this info somewhere on this forum few years back and no one could contradict it from what i remember.


No one can contradict out of the world assertions like SSG took part in the operation. There is no evidence pointing to that so far. It seems to be fan boy stuff. Asking to contradict things like this is like asking to prove God is not there.


----------



## Malik Usman

LoveIcon said:


> That part is recently added into Wikipedia article by some fanboy - can be someone from PDF



No...That part that SSG took part in this action is right.....and it is also right they spread the water and then put electricity in that water...................but what Saud Family currently ruling tell the world that those were Jews..........but those were not Jews....but a Arab Tribe who is from Ahle-Sunnat Group (Remember Currently Saud family is Wahabi Group)..And that group who was wanted to take control from this saud family (it is also beleived that currently saud family are servants of America because they came into power due to US)....was included peoples from Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Egypt and Pakistan...I also knew a person in Pakistan who was also in that group (Unfortunately he died just last month, he was a pious person)..... when that was happened....and he was rushed to Kuwait and then from Kuwait to Pakistan and One of Kuwaiti Minister for Okaf helped him to escape (Cross the border of Saudia and Kuwait). And after that he was banned to travel to Saudia for his whole life even for Hajj or Omera.


----------

