# Pakistan Tests Upgraded Shaheen-1A Missile



## K-Xeroid

Pakistan test Ballistic missile Shaheen Hatf 4

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## AbhijitSingh

Android K-Zero said:


> Pakistan test Ballistic missile Shaheen Hatf 4



wasnt Hatf IV tested in 2008 ??

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## AyanRay

its range? and source please. congrats


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## Zarvan

Is it on Channels

yes we finally tested it

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## AyanRay

Zarvan said:


> Is it on Channels
> 
> yes we finally tested it


Ok.. is it the same missile which pakistan was about to test? The LRBM


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## Zarvan

Live Streaming Dunya News TV , Dunya TV Pakistan
Geo News Live | Geo Tv Live | Watch Geo News | Live Geo Streaming

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## AyanRay

I just saw in wiki it has a range of 750 km. so is there another test coming soon? The much talked about LRBM or shaheen 3?


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## mosu

Android K-Zero said:


> Pakistan test Ballistic missile Shaheen Hatf 4



we have tested it but what is his range??


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## Icewolf

AbhijitSingh said:


> wasnt Hatf IV tested in 2008 ??


 
you can test missiles whenever you want

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## Zarvan

laghari said:


> we have tested it but what is his range??


Channels are not quoting range yet but massage is being played that they have improved range of this missile

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## darkinsky

test same missile and we all thought it would be ICBM, its not even 1000

waste of time and thoughts

andof course public money

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## AbhijitSingh

Icewolf said:


> you can test missiles whenever you want



True, but was trying to ascertain if there was a typo in the OP...


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## AyanRay

darkinsky said:


> test same missile and we all thought it would be ICBM, its not even 1000
> 
> waste of time and thoughts
> 
> andof course public money


Infact i dont remember when the last time a missile over 1000 km was tested by Pakistan!


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## Awesome

darkinsky said:


> test same missile and we all thought it would be ICBM, its not even 1000
> 
> waste of time and thoughts
> 
> andof course public money



You don't know that, missile tests are routinely done. Military runs simulations upon simulations and when something cannot be calculated and some newer parameters need to be recorded, they conduct tests.

Although details of this test have not emerged, it seems like this test has nothing to do with ICBM or Shaheen III

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## Icewolf

AyanRay said:


> Infact i dont remember when the last time a missile over 1000 km was tested by Pakistan!


 
Okay.........


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## darkinsky

AyanRay said:


> Infact i dont remember when the last time a missile over 1000 km was tested by Pakistan!



no we have tested ghauri 2


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## Norboo

laghari said:


> we have tested it but what is his range??


Shaheen I (Hatf IV) is a short-range road mobile, solid propellant ballistic missile with an optimal range of 750 km. 

It appears to be a scaled up version of the Chinese M-11 design and was possibly designed with the assistance of PRC engineers. The M-11 is an improved Scud design, 34 of which are known to have been imported by Pakistan. It is possible that the M-11 was reverse engineered to develop the technology needed to design the Hatf-4. Like the M-11, the Hatf-4 is launched from modified Russian &#8216;Scud-B&#8217; Transporter-Erector-Launcher (TEL) vehicles.

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## AyanRay

darkinsky said:


> no we have tested shaheen 2


Ofcourse it has been tested before induction but what about followup tests like this one i.e Haft VI.


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## Awesome

AyanRay said:


> Ofcourse it has been tested before induction but what about followup tests like this one i.e Haft VI.



There have been follow up tests of course. Yaar, please google before derailing this thread further with such kiddy questions.


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## Tamizhan

If this was somehow meant has an a response to Agni V , I can only say its a waste of precious money, considering that Agni V is not even aimed at Pakistan.


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## Awesome

Tamizhan said:


> If this was somehow meant has an a response to Agni V , I can only say its a waste of precious money, considering that Agni V is not even aimed at Pakistan.



Anything below Shaheen III will not be considered in response to Agni V


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## Tamizhan

Asim Aquil said:


> Anything below Shaheen III will not be considered in response to Agni V



Even that will be a waste of money, as, (read it clearly), Agni V is NOT developed keeping Pakistan in mind.

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## Edevelop

What a waste stockpile. Shaheen 1 has been tested many times...


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## Awesome

They are calling it Shaheen 1A. What does 1A signify?

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## MJaa

Pakistan Army Strategic Forces Command (ASFC) today has test fired Shaheen IA (Hatf-IV) medium range ballistic missile which can deliver nuclear and conventional warheads to a distance of over 700 kilometers.

Read more: Pakistan Test Fires Shaheen-IA Ballistic Missile ~ Pakistan Military Review


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## joekrish

Any new updates on the tests? I'm reffering to thehe LRBM here


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## Icewolf

Now PA is just trying to show it has the power.... Now PA dn't have response so they keep testing old missils.. Please test Tipu or Taimur please

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## MJaa

Pakistan Army Strategic Forces Command (ASFC) today has test fired Shaheen IA (Hatf-IV) medium range ballistic missile which can deliver nuclear and conventional warheads to a distance of over 700 kilometers.

Read more: Pakistan Test Fires Shaheen-IA Ballistic Missile ~ Pakistan Military Review


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## Stealth

*RAWALPINDI: Pakistan has successfully test-fired long-range Hatf IV (Shaheen 1A) ballistic missile in the Indian Ocean, Geo News reported Wednesday.*


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## Awesome

Icewolf said:


> Now PA is just trying to show it has the power.... Now PA dn't have response so they keep testing old missils.. Please test Tipu or Taimur please



PA knows no one would go ooh aahh on an old tested Missile, they are testing as part of a routine process. Let's not make theories just like that. But yes, Shaheen III and above ranged missile is due on them.

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## HellRider

RAWALPINDI: Pakistan has successfully test-fired long-range Hatf IV (Shaheen 1A) ballistic missile in the Indian Ocean, Geo News reported Wednesday.

According to Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR), the missiles range and technical parameters have been improved while it is capable of carrying nuclear warhead.

Pakistan has tested the long-range missile just a week after India test fired its first Inter-continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) Agni V on April 18.

Indias indigenously built Agni-V has a range of more than 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles) and is capable of carrying nuclear warhead.



Pakistan successfully test-fires nuclear capable Hatf IV - geo.tv

damn. 3 threads within 2 mins. Mods please delete this one.


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## Edevelop

I think Pakistan has stopped making long range missiles.

Babur, Abdali, Nasr, Ra'ad is a hint that we are going towards smart/precision guided weapons.

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## Awesome

cb4 said:


> I think Pakistan has stopped making long range missiles.
> 
> Babur, Abdali, Nasr, Ra'ad is a hint that we are going towards smart/precision guided weapons.



You need to improve Ballistic missiles since they are very hard to shoot down due to their speed. Improve accuracy, range and of course MIRV capability is still pending. 

Improvements have to be shown.

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## HellRider

whats the point if its still Hataf iv?


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## Aryavart

how come a single missile have two name..hatf-IV & Shaheen IIIA...somewhere its quoting they tested Shaahen I , and somewhere Hatf I...its too confusing yar..are they just trying keep up moral of nation by firing any random missile from the stockpile.

I personaly say its not needed..India knows u guys have these missile..and agni v is not aimed to pakistan..its $600 million missile..too costly for pakistan....

anyway congratulation for your successful missile dreal...i guess this in response to Indian Army dreal which is currently going on in Thar Desert,


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## Tamizhan

Aryavart said:


> how come a single missile have two name..hatf-IV & Shaheen IIIA...somewhere its quoting they tested Shaahen I , and somewhere Hatf I...



Its like Sagarika and K-15 denoting the same missile.

One is the name and other the official designation.

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## Markus

I was expecting a Shaheen 3 launch...


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## lightoftruth

Congrats Pakistan ,any upgrades?


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## AUz

What a disappointment .... lol ... I though it would be some "long-range" missle....

Bharti media trolled us

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## IceCold

What a utter disappointment after all this hype about clearing the Indian ocean and notifying India blah blah. Routine tests are another thing, they happen all the time to check various parameters but considering the timing amid at the test of agni 5, this was utterly and a huge disappointment.
Apart from Shaheen 2 no long range series of missiles have been tested, is it safe to assume that Musharaf rolled back all long range series of missiles specially those developed by the KRL. During Nawaz Sharif time, Ghauri 3 with a range of 3000 kms was displayed in a parade although it wasn't tested back then. I wonder what happened to those series.

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## Arsalan

*Pakistan successfully test fires Hatf 4 Shaheen-I Alpha missile*
_By Mudasser Aziz - Apr 25th, 2012_Islamabad: Pakistan on Wednesday successfully test-fired a medium-range ballistic missile Hatf-4 Shaheen-1 Alpha, the Inter Services Public Relation (ISPR) said.

The ISPR said that the Strategic Missile Group had launched the Shaheen-1 Alpha missile on Wednesday from an undisclosed location while its target was in sea.

&#8220;The scientists have improved the range and technical parameters of the missile while it is also capable of carrying nuclear warhead,&#8221; the ISPR said.

It may be recalled that the Shaheen-1 Ballistic Missile System, with a range of 700 kms, is an operationalised weapon system held by the ASFC and is routinely fired during training exercises by the troops of the ASFC.

*The missile test was aimed at a target at sea.* The ISPR said the new design implemented "*improvements in range and technical parameters*". General Khalid Kidwai, the director general of the Pakistan army's Strategic Plans Division, witnessed the test, saying "*the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities*", according to the ISPR statement.

President of Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani have also congratulated the scientists on successful launch of the missile.


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## Edevelop

Who knows... Everything doesnt have to be disclosed.
Maybe we have tested Ghauri 3, Shaheen 3 or Tipu missile in the past...



Norboo said:


> It's just muscle flexing! Tit for tat! But one's a 5000 km beast, the other a 750 km pussycat!



As long as its in Indian range we should have no problem with that...


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## Zarvan

arsalanaslam123 said:


> *Pakistan successfully test fires Hatf 4 Shaheen-I Alpha missile*
> _By Mudasser Aziz - Apr 25th, 2012_Islamabad: Pakistan on Wednesday successfully test-fired a medium-range ballistic missile Hatf-4 Shaheen-1 Alpha, the Inter Services Public Relation (ISPR) said.
> 
> The ISPR said that the Strategic Missile Group had launched the Shaheen-1 Alpha missile on Wednesday from an undisclosed location while its target was in sea.
> 
> &#8220;The scientists have improved the range and technical parameters of the missile while it is also capable of carrying nuclear warhead,&#8221; the ISPR said.
> 
> It may be recalled that the Shaheen-1 Ballistic Missile System, with a range of 700 kms, is an operationalised weapon system held by the ASFC and is routinely fired during training exercises by the troops of the ASFC.
> 
> President of Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani have also congratulated the scientists on successful launch of the missile.


What the hell is Alpha thing ? First time it is being used with a missile can somebody explain ?


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## Norboo

Aryavart said:


> how come a single missile have two name..hatf-IV & Shaheen IIIA...somewhere its quoting they tested Shaahen I , and somewhere Hatf I...its too confusing yar..are they just trying keep up moral of nation by firing any random missile from the stockpile.


That's to confuse the enemy so they wouldn't know what hit them!!


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## Zarvan

Norboo said:


> It's just muscle flexing! Tit for tat! But one's a 5000 km beast, the other a 750 km pussycat!


Sir for your information 750 KM is enough for Delhi and Mumbai


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## Awesome

Aryavart said:


> how come a single missile have two name..hatf-IV & Shaheen IIIA...somewhere its quoting they tested Shaahen I , and somewhere Hatf I...its too confusing yar..are they just trying keep up moral of nation by firing any random missile from the stockpile.
> 
> I personaly say its not needed..India knows u guys have these missile..and agni v is not aimed to pakistan..its $600 million missile..too costly for pakistan....
> 
> anyway congratulation for your successful missile dreal...i guess this in response to Indian Army dreal which is currently going on in Thar Desert,



Dude you guys were testing your Agni-I for 20 years, so ease up on your kahani about motivations. It's TEST, it is to test the missile.

Also this is Shaheen 1A


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## Markus

Yeah...nothing wrong in improving on missile parameters.

But that person must be sued who said it will be a "long range" missile test.


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## Arsalan

arsalanaslam123 said:


> *Pakistan successfully test fires Hatf 4 Shaheen-I Alpha missile*
> _By Mudasser Aziz - Apr 25th, 2012_Islamabad: Pakistan on Wednesday successfully test-fired a medium-range ballistic missile Hatf-4 Shaheen-1 Alpha, the Inter Services Public Relation (ISPR) said.
> 
> The ISPR said that the Strategic Missile Group had launched the Shaheen-1 Alpha missile on Wednesday from an undisclosed location while its target was in sea.
> 
> The scientists have improved the range and technical parameters of the missile while it is also capable of carrying nuclear warhead, the ISPR said.
> 
> It may be recalled that the Shaheen-1 Ballistic Missile System, with a range of 700 kms, is an operationalised weapon system held by the ASFC and is routinely fired during training exercises by the troops of the ASFC.
> 
> *The missile test was aimed at a target at sea.* The ISPR said the new design implemented "*improvements in range and technical parameters*". General Khalid Kidwai, the director general of the Pakistan army's Strategic Plans Division, witnessed the test, saying "*the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities*", according to the ISPR statement.
> 
> President of Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani have also congratulated the scientists on successful launch of the missile.



surprised to see many bein disappointed that Pakistan have not test fired a LRBM, friends, please.
we DO NOT NEED a long range missiles to answer INDIA as all there land is already in range of our missiles. so kindly just clear your thoughts on this that the answer to Agni-IV is NOT a shaheen III!

regardsing this reported test, it is good that we are still working on our operational missiles, thriving to improve there flight parameters, improving the accuracy and just confirming to the enemy, that hey, we dont need to spend 600 million US to come for you, this is what we need to answer you, and this is deadly accurate!

good job, congrats to pakistani scinetists and all of you!

regards!

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## Safriz

Goes to show that Unlike India Pakistan can build and fire an improved missile much quicker and cheaper....



Markus said:


> Yeah...nothing wrong in improving on missile parameters.
> 
> *But that person must be sued who said it will be a "long range" missile test*.



That was not a claim..it was speculation.

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## Markus

Safriz said:


> Goes to show that Unlike India Pakistan can build and fire an improved missile much quicker and cheaper....



How can you conclude that its much cheaper and faster ?


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## Markus

Safriz said:


> Goes to show that Unlike India Pakistan can build and fire an improved missile much quicker and cheaper....
> 
> 
> 
> That was not a claim..it was speculation.



He should be sued for letting of rumors.

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## Edevelop

Markus said:


> Yeah...nothing wrong in improving on missile parameters.
> 
> But that person must be sued who said it will be a "long range" missile test.



Well i think it was the Indian media that first reported....
I guess it was a speculation...

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## ares

cb4 said:


> Who knows... Everything doesnt have to be disclosed.
> Maybe we have tested Ghauri 3, Shaheen 3 or Tipu missile in the past...
> 
> 
> 
> As long as its in Indian range we should have no problem with that...



It has to be.. as per bilateral treaty signed between India and Pakistan..All ballistic missile test have to be declared in advance by each country.
On top it, missile launches can be tracked by satellites in low earth orbits and its launch flare is even picked satellites in higher orbits...so if Pakistan launched a missile..some one definitely get to know.

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## Stealth

lightoftruth said:


> so much talk yesterday about long range missile by both medias (Indian and Pakistani) u came up with a already tested missile yaa with few upgrades, now u feel dissapointed. this missile can't come in Indian ocean itself and u say pussycat India I would say ur burning.



Why we are burning for what reasons ??? you whole country already in our range and about both side media .... i think you don't know about MEDIA and their Hype. Give the source where any General, Army Officer, Military or Govt Official talk about "Long Range Missile" same like "WE are ready for two front war" ? lolz

You can't do anything against Pakistan simple we saw what you did after 26/11. The problem for us is USA. USA using you for her objective and you are apni maan kar mano wala game with US. Just > US to put pressure on Pakistan that's it. That's what you first and last policy lol hope you get it now! or still bollywood style .. WE ARE SUPAAAAAAA power lol

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## Papa

cb4 said:


> Who knows... Everything doesnt have to be disclosed.
> Maybe we have tested Ghauri 3, Shaheen 3 or Tipu missile in the past...



When before 2000?



> As long as its in Indian range we should have no problem with that...



Well said!


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## SHAMK9

Asim Aquil said:


> PA knows no one would go ooh aahh on an old tested Missile, they are testing as part of a routine process. Let's not make theories just like that. But yes, Shaheen III and above ranged missile is due on them.


 


Markus said:


> He should be sued for letting of rumors.


Indian media created hype in the first place, Pakistanis didn't even knew about it, go on and sue your media

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## Awesome

Markus said:


> Yeah...nothing wrong in improving on missile parameters.
> 
> But that person must be sued who said it will be a "long range" missile test.



All of Indian media? Notice how they didn't quote a single person's name.



lightoftruth said:


> so much talk yesterday about long range missile by both medias (Indian and Pakistani) u came up with a already tested missile yaa with few upgrades, now u feel dissapointed. this missile can't come in Indian ocean itself and u say pussycat India I would say ur burning.



Errr 2-3 Pakistani outlets re-hashed the Indian articles, all the hype was from India. I think you are trolling.

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## Markus

Asim Aquil said:


> All of Indian media? Notice how they didn't quote a single person's name.



But its strange as to how this news first came in Indian media rather than Pakistan media.

We have big time moles in your weapons establishment.


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## Markus

SHAMK9 said:


> Indian media created hype in the first place, Pakistanis didn't even knew about it, go on and sue your media



Only some second tier news sources...Indian mainstream did not report any such thing.


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## Crypto

Initially our missiles were using INS and GPS for guidance however PA is has switched from GPS to our own satellite which was launched by china. I think the new parameters and conditions are to endorse that.


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## shuntmaster

HellRider said:


> RAWALPINDI: Pakistan has successfully test-fired long-range Hatf IV (Shaheen 1A) ballistic missile in the *Indian Ocean*, Geo News reported Wednesday.
> 
> According to Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR), the missiles range and technical parameters have been improved while it is capable of carrying nuclear warhead.
> 
> Pakistan has tested the long-range missile just a week after India test fired its first Inter-continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) Agni V on April 18.
> 
> Pakistan successfully test-fires nuclear capable Hatf IV - geo.tv



This is interesting. The news says the testing was done in Indian Ocean. Information from other news is that the missile range is only 700Kms. Indian ocean is thousands of Kms. from Pakistan mainland. So, does this mean that the missile was ship launched in the Indian ocean? Does anyone know the launch point and impact points of the missile?


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## Awesome

Markus said:


> But its strange as to how this news first came in Indian media rather than Pakistan media.
> 
> We have big time moles in your weapons establishment.



Errr no. A Shaheen I test got no attention in Pakistan and Pakistan must have only informed India as per our missile testing treaty that we are going to conduct a Ballistic missile test, not specifying which one. You know how Indian rumor mill works, they make baat ka bhatangar. Remember that kid who fell in a man hole? Prince? India was paralyzed for several days till the kid got out.

The fault starts with India, ends with India.

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## mughaljee

Geo urdu news - urdu.geo.tv -


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## AyanRay

Echelon said:


> Initially our missiles were using INS and GPS for guidance however PA is has switched from GPS to our own satellite which was launched by china. I think the new parameters and conditions are to endorse that.


Pakistani navigation system!!!!!! A technology which even China is still developing!


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## Markus

Asim Aquil said:


> Errr no. A Shaheen I test got no attention in Pakistan and Pakistan must have only informed India as per our missile testing treaty that we are going to conduct a Ballistic missile test, not specifying which one. You know how Indian rumor mill works, they make baat ka bhatangar. Remember that kid who fell in a man hole? Prince? India was paralyzed for several days till the kid got out.
> 
> The fault starts with India, ends with India.



So you saying Indian defence ministry, who was informed by Pakistan, leaked this news to Indian media and they put their own masala and published it?


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## ANG

Black Widow said:


> You don't understand the logic. Regular tests are needed, every country does, India name is end user trial, remember few months ago India tested Prithvi-I?
> 
> We all know (Including you) Most of the Pkaistani missiles are Korean or chinese, Many of them are taken off-shelf. Taken is working condition and tested. That was phase I. Latter they assembled in Pak.
> 
> Phase II of Pakistani Missile: Now Pakistani have mastered some missiles, They are making there own missile (There is difference btwn making and assembling). So the phase 2 missiles are true Pakistani missieles. And now Pakistan need to test these missiles.
> 
> Phase III: After Pakistani master it, they will start innovation, I think phase 3 will start in next decade.
> 
> This is how development work... Even India did the similar thing, First we buy/borrowed tech from others, later we mastered those tech,


 
Hi, I am not going to turn this into an India vrs Pakistan thing. But, Mr. Black Widow other than your prejudiced view of Pakistan, what evidence do you have? Yes, I know most Indians always say that Pakistan cannot build anything. But, have you ever visited a university in Pakistan. Have you ever toured any defence production facilities in Pakistan? 

I toured the tank rebuilding building plant in Taxila back in 1999. Given my arrogant view, from having grown up in the West, I was very pleasantly surprised at the innovation, technology, and actual inhouse production being done in Pakistan. I changed my point of view right then.

Making ignorant statements like yours are just childish and have no merit. I have read many books on the so called illegal nuclear and missile exports to Pakistan. Yes, in the late 80s and 90s, when Pakistan was getting started, they did buy a lot of missile technology production and solid fuel technology overseas, from China and Korea. However, most of that is in house now. In the 90s you would hear of sanctions on Pakistani firms for missile technology on a regular basis, however those have died down in the past few years.

Kindly please do not make any ignorant blanket statement in the future.

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## Awesome

shuntmaster said:


> This is interesting. The news says the testing was done in Indian Ocean. Information from other news is that the missile range is only 700Kms. Indian ocean is thousands of Kms. from Pakistan mainland. So, does this mean that the missile was ship launched in the Indian ocean? Does anyone know the launch point and impact points of the missile?



Missile tests are usually conducted in Somniani, its just convenient to point towards the Indian Ocean and shoot.

Officially speaking the Arabian sea is a part of the Indian ocean, oceanic division.

Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Look at the image highlighting the Indian ocean.


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## shuntmaster

Echelon said:


> Initially our missiles were using INS and GPS for guidance however PA is has switched from GPS to our own satellite which was launched by china. I think the new parameters and conditions are to endorse that.



Isn't Paksat-1R a telecommunications satellite in Geosynchronous orbit of 36,000Kms. above earth? How can it a single telecom sat help in navigation?


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## Awesome

Markus said:


> So you saying Indian defence ministry, who was informed by Pakistan, leaked this news to Indian media and they put their own masala and published it?



Leaked it? No. Probably informed them properly. Indian media went nuts with it.

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## SHAMK9

Markus said:


> But its strange as to how this news first came in Indian media rather than Pakistan media.
> 
> We have big time moles in your weapons establishment.


You call it "big time moles", I call it "big time addiction"

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## Windjammer

Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012: 
Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System.* The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters*. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads. 
Todays launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers. 
DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistans deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.


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## Markus

Asim Aquil said:


> Leaked it? No. Probably informed them properly. Indian media went nuts with it.



Such news cannot be given out to the media. There is a gag on it.

Its either leaked or there are moles somewhere.

Dont you find it strange that no Indian mainstream media reported it, only some second/third tier media did it ?


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## Awesome

Windjammer said:


> Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012:
> Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System.* The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters*. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.
> Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), *Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney*, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.
> DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.



Nescom?

Shaheen I & II is completely NDC, Shaheen III militarized version is NESCOM and SLV version is Suparco. 

According to common knowledge

Hmmmmmm. Let the rumors begin

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## Windjammer

Asim Aquil said:


> Nescom?
> 
> Shaheen I & II is completely NDC, Shaheen III militarized version is NESCOM and SLV version is Suparco.
> 
> According to common knowledge
> 
> Hmmmmmm. Let the rumors begin



Also fired into the sea......I am all ears at the moment.

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## IceCold

Will this thread would also share the same faith like many before i.e victim to Indian trolling which has begun to a full scale on this thread. Mods...Asim?

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## ANG

Hi, they might have been testing new motors, better designed gyroscopes and/or accelerometers, new fuel mix, or a new warhead on this particular test. The real nature of the test will never be public knowledge. Moreover, one has to test these missiles to ensure their reliability, you can only simulate so much. Trust me I am a statistician that runs simulations for banks on a daily basis.

Moreover, think of your car sitting around in the garage for a couple of years, you will probably want to turn the engine on to make sure all systems function.... same idea here.

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## Awesome

Markus said:


> Such news cannot be given out to the media. There is a gag on it.


Says who? We all knew Agni V was going to be launched before it was launched. Airlines have to be informed, fishing lines have to be monitored, there is no way there is a gag on it.



> Its either leaked or there are moles somewhere.



I don't know man, your theory just doesn't fit. I knew a few people who worked in related fields. They offered employees to come and watch the tests and would pack people in busses and go there. It is a festive like environment where they observe the tests.



> Dont you find it strange that no Indian mainstream media reported it, only some second/third tier media did it ?



I think all did...

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## IceCold

Windjammer said:


> Also fired into the sea......I am all ears at the moment.



You are always well informed Windjammer, what exactly does Alfah means? A news earlier suggested it hit a sea target, are ballistic missiles used for such purposes or are we following the Chinese strategy of hitting huge carrier groups with a single nuclear capable ballistic missile?

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## Awesome

Windjammer said:


> Also fired into the sea......I am all ears at the moment.



Remember 2002? Pakistan tested one missile after the other? Lets see maybe more tests are on the way.

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## Icarus

I don't get it, India tests an ICBM and all of a sudden it becomes compulsory for to test one as well? Grow up, this is not muscle flexing neither is this a di*k measuring contest. This was a routine launch of a pre-tested platform after it's guidance and stabilization systems were upgraded. The launch was not meant to deter anyone nor was it meant to send any message to anyone. It was just intended to clock the parameters of the upgrade. So both Pakistanis and Indians, grow up and stop trying to find a subliminal message in everything.

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## Black Widow

cb4 said:


> Perhaps you are right. The time has gone where Pakistan bought/borrowed stuff from China and North Korea.
> I don't see Ra'ad, Nasr and new versions of Babur and Shaheen 1 (Missiles) as copies.
> Maybe we are improvising in our own style now.


 


I agree with you, Though my Indian brothers label all Pakistani missiles as copy or painted, I don't Agree with them. Pakistan has come a long way ahead, Now they don't need to copy, you guys got good knowledge base and expertise.. Good luck.

You know what , "what ever technology we are using, most of them was invented for military use" So military development is not always for destruction  "

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## Awesome

IceCold said:


> Will this thread would also share the same faith like many before i.e victim to Indian trolling which has begun to a full scale on this thread. Mods...Asim?



Don't respond to such posts, they are getting infractions, will get auto banned.

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## Markus

Asim Aquil said:


> Says who? We all knew Agni V was going to be launched before it was launched. Airlines have to be informed, fishing lines have to be monitored, there is no way there is a gag on it.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know man, your theory just doesn't fit. I knew a few people who worked in related fields. They offered employees to come and watch the tests and would pack people in busses and go there. It is a festive like environment where they observe the tests.
> 
> 
> 
> I think all did...



1). All Indian media did not report this yesterday.
2). Agni 5 was a diff. thing, it was all over the Indian media, Pakistani media just took it from there.
3). Its common for journalists to have moles with ppl in the govt., they interact daily with them, it should not come as a surprise.

Anyway, the missile test is done. And now its Indian time to reply with K15 or Agni 1.


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## Awesome

Black Widow said:


> I agree with you, Though my Indian brothers label all Pakistani missiles as copy or painted



These are feel good exercises performed in India. There are 4 missile manufacturing companies with multiple factories each employing some of the brightest minds in Pakistan. They go to work every day, don't you think one of them would have leaked out "Yaar hum toh sirf painting karne jaatay hain". Thousands.

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## Black Widow

ANG said:


> Hi, I am not going to turn this into an India vrs Pakistan thing. But, Mr. Black Widow other than your prejudiced view of Pakistan, what evidence do you have? Yes, I know most Indians always say that Pakistan cannot build anything. But, have you ever visited a university in Pakistan. Have you ever toured any defence production facilities in Pakistan?
> 
> I toured the tank rebuilding building plant in Taxila back in 1999. Given my arrogant view, from having grown up in the West, I was very pleasantly surprised at the innovation, technology, and actual inhouse production being done in Pakistan. I changed my point of view right then.
> 
> Making ignorant statements like yours are just childish and have no merit. I have read many books on the so called illegal nuclear and missile exports to Pakistan. Yes, in the late 80s and 90s, when Pakistan was getting started, they did buy a lot of missile technology production and solid fuel technology overseas, from China and Korea. However, most of that is in house now. In the 90s you would hear of sanctions on Pakistani firms for missile technology on a regular basis, however those have died down in the past few years.
> 
> Kindly please do not make any ignorant blanket statement in the future.


 



I think we are saying the same thing..
What I said: In past Pakistani bought/borrowed and smuggled technology. Now they are self reliable in many field. In last para I said "India did the same, We borrowed our misslie tech from SLV programs"

Later I said "Now Pakistan is in self sufficient mode"

What you said : "In 80s and 90s we borrowed/bought/smuggled tech , now we are self sufficient"

*Both me and you are saying same thing in same tone. Why are u furious??? And ironically two ppl thanked you as well.  PS. All Indian are not Anti Pakistan.*

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## Xestan

Well, ISPR says, it's a *Intermediate Ballistic Missile*, so now you guys can speculate about the range.


No PR98/2012-ISPR	Dated: April 25, 2012

Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012: 

*Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.*

Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.

DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.


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## Awesome

Markus said:


> 1). All Indian media did not report this yesterday.


Google reported over 200 yesterday when I saw, almost all Indian. One French, One Russian, 2-3 Pakistani.



> 2). Agni 5 was a diff. thing, it was all over the Indian media, Pakistani media just took it from there.


How was it on the Indian media if there are gags on these things?



> 3). Its common for journalists to have moles with ppl in the govt., they interact daily with them, it should not come as a surprise.



It was announced! What mole? Don't you think the mole would have gotten the CORRECT information that it is a Shaheen I?



> Anyway, the missile test is done. And now its Indian time to reply with K15 or Agni 1.


Baray hi khwar hongay if they did that.

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## darkinsky

ISPR didnt even tell the range


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## Windjammer

Markus said:


> 1). All Indian media did not report this yesterday.
> 2). Agni 5 was a diff. thing, it was all over the Indian media, Pakistani media just took it from there.
> 3). Its common for journalists to have moles with ppl in the govt., they interact daily with them, it should not come as a surprise.
> 
> Anyway, the missile test is done. And now its Indian time to reply with K15 or Agni 1.



IBN was reporting it yesterday, how much more credible does it get for you. ?? !!

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## Manas

BTW Any PIC , Any Video of the missile taking up , blasting away ?? They are fun to watch , aren't they ??


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## Lankan Ranger

*Pakistan tests upgraded nuclear-capable missile
*

*Pakistani military says it has successfully test-launched an upgraded intermediate-range ballistic missile capable of carrying a nuclear warhead.

The military said in a statement Wednesday that the missile was an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with a longer range. The Shaheen 1 is believed to have a range of 750 kilometers (465 miles).
*
*Pakistani military did not provide the exact range of the new Shaheen 1A.*

Pakistan tests upgraded nuclear-capable missile | StarNewsOnline.com

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## bhedgehog

GOOD WORK!
I knew Packistan could make it! congratulation!
&#24178;&#24471;&#28418;&#20142;&#65281;

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## RoYaL~GuJJaR

Congrats pakistan on this great achievement.

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## Lankan Ranger

*Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile
*
*Competing with India which recently test-fired its 5,000 kn range Agni V missile, Pakistan successfully test-fired its nuclear capable Shaheen 1A ballistic missile on Wednesday morning.

The missile boasts of a range of 4,500 km which is enough to hit targets deep in the neighbouring countries. However, military officials are yet to confirm the range of the missile.

Pakistan had informed India that it is going to test fire its new Shaheen missile between April 24-29 and therefore it must stop its air traffic ahead of the missile launch and change the routes of all the commercial flights headed to Gulf countries and Africa as a precautionary measure.

Pakistan has always strived to compete with India in the arms race. Within a week of Indias nuclear test in 1998, Pakistan had also test fired its nuclear missile. Not only this, it has been testfiring its Gauri and Shaheen missiles within a short time of Indias weapon tests.

Pakistan had informed of the ballistic missile launch to India under the existing agreement between the two nations. Before test-firing its Agni V missile from Wheeler island off Odisha coast, India had also informed Pakistan about the launch.
*

Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile

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## GR!FF!N

Stealth said:


>



aren't these TELs are same Chinese TELs China exported to NK???just asking..


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## Windjammer

Damn, these Pakistani missiles are a big attraction. 

There are 32 members watching this thread......less than half a dozen are Pakistani members.

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## TrMhMt

Congrats bors...

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## Crypto

shuntmaster said:


> Isn't Paksat-1R a telecommunications satellite in Geosynchronous orbit of 36,000Kms. above earth? How can it a single telecom sat help in navigation?



I believe its the Beidou!


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## ANG

Lankan Ranger said:


> *Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile
> *
> *Competing with India which recently test-fired its 5,000 kn range Agni V missile, Pakistan successfully test-fired its nuclear capable Shaheen 1A ballistic missile on Wednesday morning.
> 
> The missile boasts of a range of 4,500 km which is enough to hit targets deep in the neighbouring countries. However, military officials are yet to confirm the range of the missile.
> 
> Pakistan had informed India that it is going to test fire its new Shaheen missile between April 24-29 and therefore it must stop its air traffic ahead of the missile launch and change the routes of all the commercial flights headed to Gulf countries and Africa as a precautionary measure.
> 
> Pakistan has always strived to compete with India in the arms race. Within a week of Indias nuclear test in 1998, Pakistan had also test fired its nuclear missile. Not only this, it has been testfiring its Gauri and Shaheen missiles within a short time of Indias weapon tests.
> 
> Pakistan had informed of the ballistic missile launch to India under the existing agreement between the two nations. Before test-firing its Agni V missile from Wheeler island off Odisha coast, India had also informed Pakistan about the launch.
> *
> 
> Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile


 
Hi, this appears to be incorrect, as most other news chanels are saying a range of 750km.


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## Arsalan

Lankan Ranger said:


> *Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile
> *
> *Competing with India which recently test-fired its 5,000 kn range Agni V missile, Pakistan successfully test-fired its nuclear capable Shaheen 1A ballistic missile on Wednesday morning.
> 
> The missile boasts of a range of 4,500 km which is enough to hit targets deep in the neighbouring countries. However, military officials are yet to confirm the range of the missile.
> 
> Pakistan had informed India that it is going to test fire its new Shaheen missile between April 24-29 and therefore it must stop its air traffic ahead of the missile launch and change the routes of all the commercial flights headed to Gulf countries and Africa as a precautionary measure.
> 
> Pakistan has always strived to compete with India in the arms race. Within a week of India&#8217;s nuclear test in 1998, Pakistan had also test fired its nuclear missile. Not only this, it has been testfiring its Gauri and Shaheen missiles within a short time of India&#8217;s weapon tests.
> 
> Pakistan had informed of the ballistic missile launch to India under the existing agreement between the two nations. Before test-firing its Agni V missile from Wheeler island off Odisha coast, India had also informed Pakistan about the launch.
> *
> 
> Pakistan test fires 4,500 km range Shaheen 1A missile



the recently tested missile is Shaheen 1A, with a range of 700Km


> The missile test was aimed at a target at sea. The ISPR said the new design implemented "improvements in range and technical parameters". General Khalid Kidwai, the director general of the Pakistan army's Strategic Plans Division, witnessed the test, saying "the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities", according to the ISPR statement.


http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...llistic-missile-shaheen-1a-3.html#post2865146


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## ANG

GR!FF!N said:


> aren't these TELs are same Chinese TELs China exported to NK???just asking..



Hi, they might just indeed be. Let's think about it, Pakistan probably needs 100- 200 TELs, probably easier and much cheaper to import the chasis, and then modify the truck into a TEL. That is what NK did.


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## kursed

Doesn't NDC operate under NESCOM, which is the parent organization?


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## zip

The main point is pakistan let the chance go by to test a long range missile ..one can give 100 excuses but the time window has passed and train was missed ..
Strategically ,psychologically a good development that pakistan is turning 180 degree on arms race with india


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## Lankan Ranger




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## Manas

GR!FF!N said:


> aren't these TELs are same Chinese TELs China exported to NK???just asking..



Yes, they are .


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## MUHARIB

Congrats to Pakistan.


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## Arsalan

NDTV Reporting:
*Video Link*
[video]http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/fromndtv/230297[/video]


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## Lankan Ranger



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## saiyan0321

> The main point is pakistan let the chance go by to test a long range missile ..one can give 100 excuses but the time window has passed and train was missed ..
> Strategically ,psychologically a good development that pakistan is turning 180 degree on arms race with india



well still maybe more will happen but like i said your missile was not pakistan centric there was no reason to test anything like this as the world wont listen to well they did it too...

anyway good better range and accuracy is very good indeed lets see what will happen next.... well good anyway i am glad tests are happening



> Doesn't NDC operate under NESCOM, which is the parent organization?



nescom is buddy


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## Zarvan

Asim Aquil said:


> Says who? We all knew Agni V was going to be launched before it was launched. Airlines have to be informed, fishing lines have to be monitored, there is no way there is a gag on it.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know man, your theory just doesn't fit. I knew a few people who worked in related fields. They offered employees to come and watch the tests and would pack people in busses and go there. It is a festive like environment where they observe the tests.
> 
> 
> 
> I think all did...


Still the main question is what the hell is Alpha ?


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## saiyan0321

> Yes, they are .



no point we trade with china


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## darkinsky

range in 4500 km??


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## Zarvan

Pakistan test fires medium-range missile
By the CNN Wire Staff
April 25, 2012 -- Updated 0634 GMT (1434 HKT)
STORY HIGHLIGHTS
India carried out a test flight of a long-range nuclear-capable missile last week
Pakistan says it has launched a new version of a medium-range missile into the sea
The test will strengthen the country's "deterrence abilities," the Pakistani military says
Islamabad, Pakistan (CNN) -- Pakistan said Wednesday that it had conducted a test launch of a medium-range ballistic missile capable of carrying a nuclear warhead, just days after its arch-rival India tested a longer-range missile.
The Pakistani military said in a statement that the launch of the improved version of the Shaheen-1 missile was successful and that its impact point was at sea.
The new version of the missile "will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities," the statement said, citing Lt. Gen. Khalid Ahmed Kidwai, head of the military's Strategic Plans Division.
India said last week that it had successfully carried out the maiden test flight of its longest-range nuclear-capable missile, which can apparently travel more than 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles).


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## Norboo

arsalanaslam123 said:


> surprised to see many bein disappointed that Pakistan have not test fired a LRBM, friends, please.
> *we DO NOT NEED a long range missiles to answer INDIA *as all there land is already in range of our missiles. so kindly just clear your thoughts on this that the answer to Agni-IV is NOT a shaheen III!


Correct!* Why should Pakistan waste time and resources on an ICBM *with a range greater than 5000 km? Pakistan's only foe and staunch enemy is India which is within range of Pakistan's existing missiles. 

Unless they want an ICBM for targeting the Jews in Israel!  Israel though already possesses variants of the nuke tipped Jericho missiles that can reach Pakistan. I think that is what is in the minds of Pakistani strategists and the reason why they think they need an ICBM to counter Israel, just in case.


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## zip

Cnn_ibn is reporting it as hatf 4 ... Is it true ?


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## monitor

Hatf 4 Shaheen 1A ballistic missile test successful
By: Javeria Nasir, Uploaded: 25th April 2012 (1 hour ago)

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan here on Wednesday successfully fired Hatf 4- Shaheen 1A missile capable of carrying nuclear weapons , Aaj news reported.

The missile was marked into the Indian ocean and was targeted successfully at its location, said Inter services public relations (ISPR) sources.

Retired General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told media it would be able to hit targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away.

Haft 4 is an improvised form of Shaheen 1 missile series in Pakistan and capable of nuclear system.

Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai congratulated scientists and engineers on the successful launch.

Pakistan army also possess Hatf I battlefield range ballistic missile (BRBN) which entered service with the Pakistan Army in the early 1990s. It is deployed as an artillery rocket and has been replaced by the improved Hatf IA and Hatf IB, which have a maximum range of 100 km.


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## Arsalan

Zarvan said:


> Still the main question is what the hell is Alpha ?


improved version with better flight parameters and improved accuracy.
the improvement in flight parameters may include better maneuvering or something to avoid being easy target to ground based anti-missile defense systems!

regards!

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## saiyan0321

> Retired General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told media it would be able to hit targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away.



750 km only pal but so far not much is revealed but news channels are saying its 750 km can anybody clarify


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## SHAMK9

Some reports are saying 700km, others are saying 4,000kms, what's the real range?


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## Norboo

shuntmaster said:


> This is interesting. The news says the testing was done in Indian Ocean. Information from other news is that the missile range is only 700Kms. Indian ocean is thousands of Kms. from Pakistan mainland. So, does this mean that the missile was ship launched in the Indian ocean? Does anyone know the launch point and impact points of the missile?


I think they meant the *Arabian Sea!* Damn! These journalists and scientists need to study some geography before reporting the launching of missiles!


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## saiyan0321

> I think they meant the Arabian Sea! Damn! These journalists and scientists need to study some geography before reporting the launching of missiles!



isnt arabian sea part of the indian ocean

Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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## mautkimaut

Congratulations.. Still any clarity on the range?


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## saiyan0321

> Congratulations.. Still any clarity on the range?



waiting for that too somebody tell windjammer to contact that DGISI and ask him to tell you the damn range of the missile since many people in the internet are dying to know


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## Dark Warrior

So that's why the flights going to SA,UAE,Qatar were rerouted(As their routes were 910-1060km from Pakistan coast.)
But the ones going to South Africa were not diverted.

PS:I need to call the journo who told it is Shaheen 2.


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## iioal malik

I heard that on Dunya news,That the range is 4500 K.MNow that's wht I,m talking about :...God bless Pakistan...


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## ice_man

GR!FF!N said:


> aren't these TELs are same Chinese TELs China exported to NK???just asking..




 amazing!!! love the indian sense of humor!

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## Zarvan

Something strange has happened because first time in history no channel was quoting range of the missile even when a missile is tested again its range is told but not today don't know why but this has happened something is different this time


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## Dark Warrior

Zarvan said:


> Something strange has happened because first time in history no channel was quoting range of the missile even when a missile is tested again its range is told but not today don't know why but this has happened something is different this time


All channels are reporting that this missile range has been updated from Shaheen-1 so the max range is 1000-1200 km.


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## darkinsky

why os pak army so secretive about every thing dont know, are they scared america and india is trying every bit just to spy on every thing related to them??


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## SamantK

Lets face it, Pakistan's threat environment is limited to India, it does not need a 4000km missile.. They work on the technology yes but testing now will be a mistake for them, just making sure they can hit India anywhere should be enough. Ghauri III and Shaeen III will be a complete waste if tested, even Mussharaf had asked do you want to destroy Israel


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## Bharthi

4500 km means pakistan is aiming china or russia.


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## lightoftruth

Press Release 
No PR98/2012-ISPR Dated: April 25, 2012
Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012: 

Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.
Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.
DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism. 

:: ISPR :: Inter Services Public Relations - PAKISTAN


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## regular

saiyan0321 said:


> waiting for that too somebody tell windjammer to contact that DGISI and ask him to tell you the damn range of the missile since many people in the internet are dying to know


man this is not long range missile test...This is routine test for the missiles already with the Military during their training exercises.......


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## Bharthi

Any Videos?


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## Arsalan

saiyan0321 said:


> 750 km only pal but so far not much is revealed but news channels are saying its 750 km can anybody clarify


it is 750 Km, it is Shaheen 1!
the Alpha is for improved parameters and accuracy, not a threefold increase in range of Shaheen 1




Bharthi said:


> Any Videos?


http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...llistic-missile-shaheen-1a-8.html#post2865392



SHAMK9 said:


> Some reports are saying 700km, others are saying 4,000kms, what's the real range?


some media is confusing it because of earlier rumored news of Pakistan getting ready to test fire LRBM, that, was never confirmed. overall, all the links tat are quoting ISPR set the range at 750 KM, and describe the 1A designation for improvement in accuracy etc!
the ISPR release will soon com in to confirm!



Norboo said:


> I think they meant the *Arabian Sea!* Damn! These journalists and scientists need to study some geography before reporting the launching of missiles!


it is the media, not the scientists!
perhaps were to excited with the rumor of Pakistan getting set to launch Shaheen III and are now making up!


*ISPR PRESS RELEASE*
here it is:


> *No PR98/2012-ISPR
> Dated: April 25, 2012*
> Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012:
> 
> Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the *intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System.* The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.
> Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.
> DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.


http://www.ispr.gov.pk/front/main.asp?o=t-press_release&id=2043#pr_link2043


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## S.Y.A

very disappointed...was expecting something different and BETTER.


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## Najam Khan

S.Y.A said:


> very disappointed...was expecting something different and BETTER.



This is something better than its predecessor. The hype created by Indian Media on Pakistani ICBM test was a hoax call. Indian Foreign Office should not have sent the 'Official word' on test timings to media. That information was for only Indian foreign office and related organizations.

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## Zarvan

samantk said:


> Lets face it, Pakistan's threat environment is limited to India, it does not need a 4000km missile.. They work on the technology yes but testing now will be a mistake for them, just making sure they can hit India anywhere should be enough. Ghauri III and Shaeen III will be a complete waste if tested, even Mussharaf had asked do you want to destroy Israel


Sir Israel is potential enemy and if it gets into war with Saudi Arabia and than we will have to get involved no other option and Israel twice have tried to attack our Nuclear Sites so it is very much potential enemy of Pakistan and it is the main reason why America has never liked our Nuclear Program and now of Iran it is not America is scared of it but it is Israel which is feels the main threat


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## Dark Warrior

Najam Khan said:


> This is something better than its predecessor. The hype created by Indian Media on Pakistani ICBM test was a hoax call. Indian Foreign Office should not have sent the 'Official word' on test timings to media. That information was for only Indian foreign office and related organizations.


The test timings were also given to International Maritime and Civil aviation authorities,who passed this message to airlines and Shipping companies.


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## [--Leo--]

still waiting for shaheen 3


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## ice_man

Zarvan said:


> Sir Israel is potential enemy and if it gets into war with Saudi Arabia and than we will have to get involved no other option and Israel twice have tried to attack our Nuclear Sites so it is very much potential enemy of Pakistan and it is the main reason why America has never liked our Nuclear Program and now of Iran it is not America is scared of it but it is Israel which is feels the main threat



zarvan brother please wake up!! SAUDI will NEVER fight ISRAEL because both are american pets! and even if they fight you think uncle America will let pakistan bring its missiles to the party???

Saudi is more concerned about IRAN rather than Israel! 

*in OUR LIFE TIME WE WILL NEVER SEE SAUDI FIGHT THE ISRAELIS!! NOR WILL WE SEE PAKISTANIS EVER EVEN FUELING A MISSILE TO BE FIRED AT TEL AVIV! * israel is an arab concern just like india is our concern and not an arab concern!


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## saiyan0321

ok lets wait and see if no missile test then this was it i said some while ago that revealing any longer range missile that would bring sanctions would be troublesome so pakistan should mostly work on accuracy and tech of those missiles. still was hoping for shaheen 3 well lets see what will happen we still have 4 days to go


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## SHAMK9

Zarvan said:


> Sir Israel is potential enemy and if it gets into war with Saudi Arabia and than we will have to get involved no other option and Israel twice have tried to attack our Nuclear Sites so it is very much potential enemy of Pakistan and it is the main reason why America has never liked our Nuclear Program and now of Iran it is not America is scared of it but it is Israel which is feels the main threat


Why should Pakistan fight for KSA?


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## Najam Khan

Dark Warrior said:


> The test timings were also given to International Maritime and Civil aviation authorities,who passed this message to airlines and Shipping companies.


The Message isn't the first of its kind. Both India and Pakistan give such possible test brackets to each other. It is necessary (and safe) for both sides to relay it to related organizations (that include airlines, Defence forces, Maritime etc.). What isn't acceptable to release such information in Media.

Last but not the least, such message never contains information about "Missile test", rather it contains information about not using sea/air route of specified area between given dates. Its the Indian media that speculated things and created a big thing out of this.


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## Mo12

SHAMK9 said:


> Some reports are saying 700km, others are saying 4,000kms, what's the real range?



it looks to tiny be 4000km range, most likely 750km


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## Safriz

But we do have to thank Indian media to make such a BIIIG thing out of our Little missile


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## Peregrine

An extract from DAWN NEWS


> Shaheen 1 is estimated to have a payload capacity of 1,000 kilograms and a range of 750 kilometres. The exact range of the missile was not revealed, but retired *General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told AFP intermediate range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres away, which would put almost all of India within reach.*


That means Izzzraeeel is covered too


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## Windjammer

saiyan0321 said:


> waiting for that too somebody tell windjammer to contact that DGISI and ask him to tell you the damn range of the missile since many people in the internet are dying to know



Don't you think i tried, but he is in a meeting with mobile switched off.

The point worth noting is that Shaheen-1 has a range of some 700 KMs, if the missile launched today was of similar range, what was the need to fire it towards the sea. !!


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## Safriz

http://dawn.com/2012/04/25/pakistan-successfully-test-fires-hatf-iv-ballistic-missile/

Dawn news posting Babur cruise missile picture in the news


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## Mo12

Safriz said:


> But we do have to thank Indian media to make such a BIIIG thing out of our Little missile



Yeh true, India media is much bigger then Pakistan media.

So I guess in any big defence news in India, will shock shockwaves across the world.


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## WAQAS119

Since last year! Pakistan has lowered its tendency to boast for the matters related to defence. This could well be a 3000 Km missile otherwise there was no need to fire it towards Indian Ocean.

Well! I am impressed with this approach if this is exactly the case. "Keep it quiet" is the way to move forward.


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## Windjammer

Guys, did manage to speak to an other officer in the ISPR.
The actual range is classified but he did say it's a long range missile, and didn't comment on my query, whether this was a one of a kind or a series of tests. In any case, i should be able to post the picture of the missile soon.

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## Zarvan

ice_man said:


> zarvan brother please wake up!! SAUDI will NEVER fight ISRAEL because both are american pets! and even if they fight you think uncle America will let pakistan bring its missiles to the party???
> 
> Saudi is more concerned about IRAN rather than Israel!
> 
> *in OUR LIFE TIME WE WILL NEVER SEE SAUDI FIGHT THE ISRAELIS!! NOR WILL WE SEE PAKISTANIS EVER EVEN FUELING A MISSILE TO BE FIRED AT TEL AVIV! * israel is an arab concern just like india is our concern and not an arab concern!


 Sir you can't predict anything about that region specially after Arab Spring anything can happen other wise Arab Spring can even damage the Royal Family of Saudi Arabia Sir and with Israel and Jersulam involved their is to much stake anything happening to it can and Pakistan doing nothing or Israel attacking Holy Cities sir if Pakistan will do nothing than Pakistan it self will go in Civil War we will have to get involved and for my information we are getting involved already Pakistan Missiles are already placed in Saudi Arabia on some secret locations



Windjammer said:


> Guys, did manage to speak to an other officer in the ISPR.
> The actual range is classified but he did say it's a long range missile, and didn't comment on my query, whether this was a one of a kind or a series of tests. In any case, i should be able to post the picture of the missile soon.


This is what I am saying first time in history ISPR is not telling its actual range if it is even less than 1500 KM ISPR wouldn't have any problem telling it It is far more than that that is why ISPR is hiding the news or that is why they have named it Shaheen 1 Alpha just to confuse people and International society something is fishy around here

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## Sugarcane

(Reuters) - Pakistan successfully test-fired a nuclear-capable ballistic missile on Wednesday, the military said, less than a week after rival India tested a missile capable of delivering nuclear warheads as far as Beijing and Eastern Europe.

Pakistan's Shaheen-1A is an intermediate range ballistic missile, capable of reaching targets in India. Military officials declined to specify the range of the missile.

The missile's impact point was in the Indian Ocean.

India and Pakistan have fought three full-scale wars since they were carved out of British India in 1947. They conduct missile tests regularly and inform each other in advance.

Pakistan conducted nuclear tests in May 1998, shortly after India conducted similar tests.

U.S. intelligence estimates last year put the number of nuclear weapons deployed by Pakistan at 90 to 110. Analysts say the strategic U.S. ally's nuclear arsenal is the fastest growing in the world.

Pakistan, like neighboring India, is not a signatory to the nuclear non-proliferation treaty (NPT).

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## Windjammer

*Successful conduct of the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System today. (25-04-2012)  Photo ISPR*

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## Jinnah

Windjammer said:


> Guys, did manage to speak to an other officer in the ISPR.
> The actual range is classified but he did say it's a long range missile, and didn't comment on my query, whether this was a one of a kind or a series of tests. In any case, i should be able to post the picture of the missile soon.



This is what i am expecting. Congrats PAKISTAN


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## DMLA

It is naive to think that it would be possible to fool the interested parties (read USA/ India) of the actual missile capabilities by misreporting actual range of the weapons. Any missile needs to be tested for its maximum range in order for it to be qualified for use. So if it was actually a long range missile but tested over a shorter range, it doesn't make any difference. Moreover, it would be naive to think that the powers that be will not have a few surveillance satellites and radars looking at the launch. With the number of Aegis ships that US has in the area, I am sure they have a pretty good idea as to what the actual missile range is based on tracked ballistics. Long range missiles require major improvements in materials and navigational capabilities in order to have adequate accuracy and ability to withstand re-entry effects on the RV. I would assume that the missile probably features a few design changes from the original (maybe a maneuvering RV) but without additional information, it is premature for us to make comments on its range and capabilities. Another indication of possible range can be identified from the international maritime alert depending on the area sanitized for the launch. Though it is easier to fool people there by alerting a much larger zone than required.

Anyways, congrats to Pakistan on the test. Hope our guys got enough info to improve on our BMD algos.


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## Major Sam

poit to be noted here as ISPR said "its an Intermediate range" it means its range should be around 3000Kms, other wise there is no reason to fire towards the sea.


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## user1

Zarvan said:


> This is what I am saying first time in history ISPR is not telling its actual range if it is even less than 1500 KM ISPR wouldn't have any problem telling it It is far more than that that is why ISPR is hiding the news or that is why they have named it Shaheen 1 Alpha just to confuse people and International society something is fishy around here



Strategic ambiguity requires that you let the opponent keep on guessing what are the motives of your move. Reminds me of General Zia-ul-Haq's whisper in the ears of Rajiv Gandhi.


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## Bratva

Xestan said:


> Well, ISPR says, it's a *Intermediate Ballistic Missile*, so now you guys can speculate about the range.
> 
> 
> No PR98/2012-ISPR	Dated: April 25, 2012
> 
> Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012:
> 
> *Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.*
> 
> Todays launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.
> 
> DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistans deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.



Let's speculate something further. Intermediate means it has a range of 1400-1500 KM and Ghouri Missile has same range. So they may replace Liquid Fueled missile with an updated Shaheen 1-A


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## Mo12

usama waqas said:


> poit to be noted here as ISPR said "its an Intermediate range" it means its range should be around 3000Kms, other wise there is no *reason to fire towards the sea*.



So it should of landed on Pakistan then?



Windjammer said:


> *Successful conduct of the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System today. (25-04-2012) &#8211; Photo ISPR*



Looks to small to be 4000km.


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## Ajaxpaul

Congrats Pakistan on the missile test....

Israel and US would be more interested in this test than India.


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## Bratva

Mo12 said:


> So it should of landed on Pakistan then?
> 
> 
> 
> Looks to small to be 4000km.



He is confusing Intermediate with Intercontinental. Intermediate Missile means range of 1400-1600 Km


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## Major Sam

mafiya said:


> Let's speculate something further. Intermediate means it has a range of 1400-1500 KM and Ghouri Missile has same range. So they may replace Liquid Fueled missile with an updated Shaheen 1-A


 
intermediate missile have range of 3000-3500 km. thanks might be u r confusing it with medium range missile


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## Major Sam

mafiya said:


> He is confusing Intermediate with Intercontinental. Intermediate Missile means range of 1400-1600 Km



true ICBM have range of around 8000Km man



ashokdeiva said:


> That is one of the weirdest thing that i have ever heard. I think you are running yourself a secret organization to monitor the rest of the worlds secret services  . Pakistanis Missiles in a foreign soil is some fantasy story line that Pakistani Directors can use in their movie, we also had a movie of such a story line in the 1980's.
> Vikram (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> @ZARVAN, i think you need a physiatrist.



what ever he said he is right man


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## Ajaxpaul

usama waqas said:


> true ICBM have range of around 8000Km man
> 
> 
> 
> what ever he said he is right man



Yes India's Agni V is the first step towards a true ICBM.


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## Bratva

I have observed something interesting, Is this thrust vector controls?


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## Windjammer

Appears some what different to the Shaheen-1 model.


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## Jango

it makes no sense to launch a low range missile into sea, unless from a boat.

So, it must have a range of around 1000-2000 km.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> That is one of the weirdest thing that i have ever heard. I think you are running yourself a secret organization to monitor the rest of the worlds secret services  . Pakistanis Missiles in a foreign soil is some fantasy story line that Pakistani Directors can use in their movie, we also had a movie of such a story line in the 1980's.
> Vikram (film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> @ZARVAN, i think you need a Psychiatrist.


Sir when you don't know about something remain quit this thing is quite old now news has been coming from really long time ago and we all know Saudi Arabia is main funder of our Nuclear Program and every one can guess why is that

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## Mo12

nuclearpak said:


> it makes no sense to launch a low range missile into sea, unless from a boat.
> 
> So, it must have a range of around 1000-2000 km.



Yes do it on Pakistan next time, if thats what u want


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## Jango

Mo12 said:


> Yes do it on Pakistan next time, if thats what u want



What do you mean???

Missiles don't have active warheads. So, a short range missile can be tested on Pakistani soil. And they have been.


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## Abingdonboy

I'm just going to say it- tit for tat. 


Not very mature.

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## Zarvan

user1 said:


> Strategic ambiguity requires that you let the opponent keep on guessing what are the motives of your move. Reminds me of General Zia-ul-Haq's whisper in the ears of Rajiv Gandhi.


Sir Please understand a Nuclear Program whole world knows the ranges of different missiles of every country weather it is their friend or weather it is their enemy but surprisingly this is the first time Pakistan is hiding the range of Missile even after conducting the test that is raising lot of questions about the actual range because Ghauri has range of 1500 KM if would have been around 1500 ISPR would have revealed it but their hiding can be because of the fact that this missile has more range than 1500 KM


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## Jango

Abingdonboy said:


> I'm just going to say it- tit for tat.
> 
> 
> Not very mature.



How is this not mature?

You just don't go like, hey they have tested a ICBM, we will test a 1000km range missile day after tomorrow.

A missile test needs months of preparation, if it is indeed a test.


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## WAQAS119

Asim Aquil said:


> They are calling it Shaheen 1A. *What does 1A signify*?



Could be a changed name of Shaheen III.

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## Abingdonboy

Norboo said:


> Correct!* Why should Pakistan waste time and resources on an ICBM *with a range greater than 5000 km? Pakistan's only foe and staunch enemy is India which is within range of Pakistan's existing missiles.
> 
> Unless they want an ICBM for targeting the Jews in Israel!  Israel though already possesses variants of the nuke tipped Jericho missiles that can reach Pakistan. I think that is what is in the minds of Pakistani strategists and the reason why they think they need an ICBM to counter Israel, just in case.



There's no way the US/Israelis would allow Pakistan to develop such technologies as an ICBM.


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## IndianArmy

nuclearpak said:


> it makes no sense to launch a low range missile into sea, unless from a boat.
> 
> So, it must have a range of around 1000-2000 km.



Anything within the range of 90-100 is done on land.. Its always wise to take it to sea if the range is above 100. You cannot take a 700 km range rocket over civilian areas especially when u are testing it. I dont suppose any country has a 700km long test range.


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## tvsram1992

Congrats Pakistan !!!


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## A.Rafay

tribune.com.pk/story/369687/pakistan-test-fires-hatf-iv-ballistic-missile .Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told AFP it would be able to hit targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away, putting India well within reach.[/URL]


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## Abingdonboy

IndianArmy said:


> Anything within the range of 90-100 is done on land.. Its always wise to take it to sea if the range is above 100. You cannot take a 700 km range rocket over civilian areas especially when u are testing it. I dont suppose any country has a 700km long test range.



Right it is an issue of safety mainly, the entire flightpath of the missile has to be uninhabited so as to negate the risk to human life if the missie should fall short.

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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir when you don't know about something remain quit this thing is quite old now news has been coming from really long time ago and we all know Saudi Arabia is main funder of our Nuclear Program and every one can guess why is that


See there is still no credible evidence that suggest the sale of Pakistani Missiles to KSA except a speculation in WIKI Pakistan
I am sure of one thing that neither Pakistan will be allowed by the big boy USA to sell some thing that sensitive to KSA. Nor will they entertain the Royal Family of Soudhi to go for sensitive nuclear tech as KSA is said to be the largest funder of terror cells arround the world. One step in the wrong direction by the Soudhi family and we have a nother dictatorship thrown down the drain by its own people who will be provoked by the USA


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## cnnetspy2000

Warmly to congratulate! Pakistan's brother

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## Xestan

TX contacted Brigadier Ateeq ur Rehman, Director PR at the ISPR. *We are told that the range of the enhanced Hatf-IV (Shaheen-1A) has not been disclosed for various reasons. 

When asked whether the range will be revealed later on, we were told that nothing can be said of a surety at the moment.*

-Zaki Khalid

http://www.facebook.com/terminalxpk


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## Cool_Soldier

Congrats to all members.Still range is not confirmed.If it is long range missile with a range about r over 3000km, then radar should detect its range as Ballastic missile can be seen on radars.If Pakistan is not disclosing its range..Enemey can disclose..?


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> See there is still no credible evidence that suggest the sale of Pakistani Missiles to KSA except a speculation in WIKI Pakistan
> I am sure of one thing that neither Pakistan will be allowed by the big boy USA to sell some thing that sensitive to KSA. Nor will they entertain the Royal Family of Soudhi to go for sensitive nuclear tech as KSA is said to be the largest funder of terror cells arround the world. One step in the wrong direction by the Soudhi family and we have a nother dictatorship thrown down the drain by its own people who will be provoked by the USA


Sir who said Sale shifting of Missiles Sir and we have done many things in the past which have annoyed USA USA is not GOD sir and when it comes to Saudi Arabia Pakistan takes some extra ordinary steps and culture of Saudi Arabia is far different than other Arab States so first know than talk

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## Markus

Ofcourse, India has sensors, tracking stations all around the Arabian sea, our Navy would have certainly captured some info on this missile, ofcourse they wont leak out.


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## Cool_Soldier

We should have ICBM is for deterence role as other countries have.Its not only necessary but MUST for any nuclear power state.


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## Mo12

Cool_Soldier said:


> We should have ICBM is for deterence role as other countries have.Its not only necessary but MUST for any nuclear power state.



Could you target Isreal or Beijing with the new missile?


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## Windjammer

IndianArmy said:


> Anything within the range of 90-100 is done on land.. Its always wise to take it to sea if the range is above 100. You cannot take a 700 km range rocket over civilian areas especially when u are testing it. I dont suppose any country has a 700km long test range.



That's a lame argument, Pakistan is known to fire it's missiles from test sites in Jehlum to designated targets at Sonmiani Ranges outside Karachi and vice versa ......an overland distant of some 700 Miles.

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## Mo12

Markus said:


> Ofcourse, India has sensors, tracking stations all around the Arabian sea, our Navy would have certainly captured some info on this missile, ofcourse they wont leak out.



Hmm very valid point, we do have massive capabilities to find this out due to our blue water navy. The navy should of also had planes in the sky to see the trajection of the missile too.


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir who said Sale shifting of Missiles Sir and we have done many things in the past which have annoyed USA USA is not GOD sir and when it comes to Saudi Arabia Pakistan takes some extra ordinary steps and culture of Saudi Arabia is far different than other Arab States so first know than talk


Get me and the rest of the folk with some solid evidence before you dance to your tune mate. There is a international politics that determines the course of the world, there is every one involved and no one is out of the question. Every thing is manipulated as thing happen. US does not bark at INDIA for conducting a 5000 km missile test but it condemned the same with NK and might possibly with any other nation that not fit their view and might come up with sanctions against any such capable nation and the rest of the world will just watch and do nothing about that.
And as far as the Middle East is considered, it a volatile place with religiously emotional people can be directed against any one who is out of sync with the US views. 
This we can see as a live evidence in the case of Egypt, Libiya, Siriya, etc.

if you can not thing global, then its your problem not mine.


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## IND151

i don't think range of shaheen 1A is 4500 KM

if it is, its totally new missile(Shaheen 4 may be) and not shaheen 1A


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## Zarvan

Windjammer said:


> That's a lame argument, Pakistan is known to fire it's missiles from test sites in Jehlum to designated targets at Sonmiani Ranges outside Karachi and vice versa ......an overland distant of some 700 Miles.


Only mystery with this missile test is that ISPR for first time didn't revealed the range of Missile and this thing can't get into my head that why have they done it because they shouldn't have any problem if it would have less range than Shaheen 2 Missile other wise no purpose in hiding its range


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## Sugarcane

Pakistan successfully tested a nuclear-capable ballistic missile on Wednesday. The launch comes less than a week after Islamabad&#8217;s main adversary India tested a long-range ballistic missile of its own.

*Pakistan&#8217;s missile Shaheen-1A was reportedly shot southward to the Indian Ocean and managed to cover some 4,000-4,500 kilometers. This is enough to target any object on Indian territory.

Pakistan notified its neighbors of plans to perform a launch a day before the event, saying the test would take place between April 24 and 29. Authorities of Oman, Yemen and India were warned to change routes of civil air flights in the direction of Africa during these dates but the actual test was performed just a day after the warning.

Indian aviation authorities expressed regret that the warning on the test launch came at the &#8220;last minute&#8221; but nevertheless all transport companies have been notified immediately.

On April 19 this year India test-launched its first long-range Agni-V intercontinental ballistic missile. With a 5,000km range it can target anywhere in China and even parts of Europe, not to mention neighboring Pakistan. 

Irreconcilable neighbors India and Pakistan have conducted three full-scale wars since their split from British India in 1947 (conflicts in 1947-1948, 1965, 1971). An arms test of one country usually is followed by a similar test by the other. For example after India successfully tested its first thermonuclear warhead on 11 May 1998, Pakistan replied with a series of nuclear bomb explosions on May 28, 1998.

Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile &mdash; RT


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir Please understand a Nuclear Program whole world knows the ranges of different missiles of every country weather it is their friend or weather it is their enemy but surprisingly this is the first time Pakistan is hiding the range of Missile even after conducting the test that is raising lot of questions about the actual range because Ghauri has range of 1500 KM if would have been around 1500 ISPR would have revealed it but their hiding can be because of the fact that this missile has more range than 1500 KM


the ISPR knows that revealing a lesser range than 5000 km will make the people of Pakistan question the credibility of the local missile program. The ISPR knows that it can not match the Agni 5 and there is no need too, but the people in every country are emotional idiots who will ask the government and the military to match any thing that the enemy has and in this case a range of any thing less than 4000 km atleast is not acceptable for the people of Pakistan and that is the reason that ISPR is not revealing any details on the range of the tested missile.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> Get me and the rest of the folk with some solid evidence before you dance to your tune mate. There is a international politics that determines the course of the world, there is every one involved and no one is out of the question. Every thing is manipulated as thing happen. US does not bark at INDIA for conducting a 5000 km missile test but it condemned the same with NK and might possibly with any other nation that not fit their view and might come up with sanctions against any such capable nation and the rest of the world will just watch and do nothing about that.
> And as far as the Middle East is considered, it a volatile place with religiously emotional people can be directed against any one who is out of sync with the US views.
> This we can see as a live evidence in the case of Egypt, Libiya, Siriya, etc.
> 
> if you can not thing global, then its your problem not mine.


Sir Pakistan will never do these kind of serious actions with solid proof for the world to see this will be done is most secret manner Sir so the purpose is also achieved and no one gets the chance to speak crap


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## illusion8

WAQAS119 said:


> Could be a changed name of Shaheen III.



It seems to be an upgrade of an earlier missile, probably an improvement, Shaheen 1 becomes Shaheen 1A after the improvement, lots of speculations flying around, 

Doesn't a 3000 km missile need a two stage rocket?, The picture posted doesn't look like one.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> the ISPR knows that revealing a lesser range than 5000 km will make the people of Pakistan question the credibility of the local missile program. The ISPR knows that it can not match the Agni 5 and there is no need too, but the people in every country are emotional idiots who will ask the government and the military to match any thing that the enemy has and in this case a range of any thing less than 4000 km atleast is not acceptable for the people of Pakistan and that is the reason that ISPR is not revealing any details on the range of the tested missile.


Sir whole world knows How successful Pakistan Missile program is that is not the question Sir even you people know it there is something else which is making ISPR hide the program and whole world also know Pakistan is already working on longer range Missiles Shaheen 4 and Taimur


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Only mystery with this missile test is that ISPR for first time didn't revealed the range of Missile and this thing can't get into my head that why have they done it because *they shouldn't have any problem if it would have less range than Shaheen 2 Missile other wise no purpose in hiding its range*


its exactly the opposite reason mate, what kind of a strategic thinker you are, had the achievement been any thing that is equvalent to 4500 + km is some thing that will boost the moral of the citizen of the nation and there is no way ISPR wants its people gussing on some thing like that.


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## mjnaushad

ashokdeiva said:


> the ISPR knows that revealing a lesser range than 5000 km will make the people of Pakistan question the credibility of the local missile program. The ISPR knows that it can not match the Agni 5 and there is no need too, but the people in every country are emotional idiots who will ask the government and the military to match any thing that the enemy has and in this case a range of any thing less than 4000 km atleast is not acceptable for the people of Pakistan and that is the reason that ISPR is not revealing any details on the range of the tested missile.



Not logical..... More than half Pakistanis on this forum believes that We dont need ICBM and and even if we do need or have ICBM no need to publicize it.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> its exactly the opposite reason mate, what kind of a strategic thinker you are, had the achievement been any thing that is equvalent to 4500 + km is some thing that will boost the moral of the citizen of the nation and there is no way ISPR wants its people gussing on some thing like that.


Sir majority Pakistanis don't even know India conducted test of Agni v they don't even know what the hell is Agni V so that thing is out of question the only question why ISPR is keeping surprise element Pakistan has many times done this kind of things that India has tested a longer range missile but Pakistan tested the missile with the least range so it would not have been the first time


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir whole world knows How successful Pakistan Missile program is that is not the question Sir even you people know it there is something else which is making ISPR hide the program and whole world also know Pakistan is already working on longer range Missiles Shaheen 4 and Taimur


see mate, I have no doubt in the capabilities of your scientist in developing a missile that has only INDIA in its mind, but any thing that has a range that is more than a minimum deterance against INDIA is never an option for PAKISTAN as it does not require one. 
speaking frankly you are not going to drop a bomb on US or Isreali soil. if the current course of CBM are taken with seriousnes on the PAKISTANI side I am sure then there wont be a necessity for you or us to go with any more weapons of MASS destruction.



mjnaushad said:


> Not logical..... More than half Pakistanis on this forum believes that We dont need ICBM and and even if we do need or have ICBM no need to publicize it.


come on mate, how many of the pakistanis are here in PDF, you educated people are less in percentage.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> see mate, I have no doubt in the capabilities of your scientist in developing a missile that has only INDIA in its mind, but any thing that has a range that is more than a minimum deterance against INDIA is never an option for PAKISTAN as it does not require one.
> speaking frankly you are not going to drop a bomb on US or Isreali soil. if the current course of CBM are taken with seriousnes on the PAKISTANI side I am sure then there wont be a necessity for you or us to go with any more weapons of MASS destruction.
> 
> 
> come on mate, how many of the pakistanis are here in PDF, you educated people are less in percentage.


Speaking Frankly you never know it Sir with Israel you can never tell How our future relations can shape up but you can tell more than 99 % chances are of both countries become really severe enemies if not Nuclear but we can use Missiles to damage our long range enemies or their targets


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## ice_man

FOR HEAVEN's SAKE!!! guys Pakistan has no weapons in SAUDI and definetly no intentions of targetting ISRAEL!!! hell even SAUDI has no near plans to fight a war with ISRAEL!!!! stop trying to make up fake myths! 

our missiles are indian centric and indian centric ONLY!!

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## DANGER-ZONE

loveicon said:


> Pakistan successfully tested a nuclear-capable ballistic missile on Wednesday. The launch comes less than a week after Islamabad&#8217;s main adversary India tested a long-range ballistic missile of its own.
> 
> *Pakistan&#8217;s missile Shaheen-1A was reportedly shot southward to the Indian Ocean and managed to cover some 4,000-4,500 kilometers. This is enough to target any object on Indian territory.
> 
> Pakistan notified its neighbors of plans to perform a launch a day before the event, saying the test would take place between April 24 and 29. Authorities of Oman, Yemen and India were warned to change routes of civil air flights in the direction of Africa during these dates but the actual test was performed just a day after the warning.
> 
> Indian aviation authorities expressed regret that the warning on the test launch came at the &#8220;last minute&#8221; but nevertheless all transport companies have been notified immediately.
> 
> On April 19 this year India test-launched its first long-range Agni-V intercontinental ballistic missile. With a 5,000km range it can target anywhere in China and even parts of Europe, not to mention neighboring Pakistan.
> 
> Irreconcilable neighbors India and Pakistan have conducted three full-scale wars since their split from British India in 1947 (conflicts in 1947-1948, 1965, 1971). An arms test of one country usually is followed by a similar test by the other. For example after India successfully tested its first thermonuclear warhead on 11 May 1998, Pakistan replied with a series of nuclear bomb explosions on May 28, 1998.
> 
> Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile &#8212; RT



*RT* is another *Indian TV* like channel/news agency .


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## Zarvan

ice_man said:


> FOR HEAVEN's SAKE!!! guys Pakistan has no weapons in SAUDI and definetly no intentions of targetting ISRAEL!!! hell even SAUDI has no near plans to fight a war with ISRAEL!!!! stop trying to make up fake myths!
> 
> our missiles are indian centric and indian centric ONLY!!


Sir you never know and it isn't about what Saudi Arabia is planning it is what can happen and lot of things can happen and war it is quite and option with one major city at stake Saudi Family will have to do something with Israel if it next time tries to attack or storm Palestinian areas specially change of government in Egypt anything can happen Sir anything


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## ashokdeiva

ice_man said:


> FOR HEAVEN's SAKE!!! guys Pakistan has no weapons in SAUDI and definetly no intentions of targetting ISRAEL!!! hell even SAUDI has no near plans to fight a war with ISRAEL!!!! stop trying to make up fake myths!
> 
> our missiles are indian centric and indian centric ONLY!!


i wish i had more people like you in Pakistan, its the number of people like you who will bring prosperity to your nation by focusing your nations strength on its development and not thinking some thing about a muslim ummha.


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## SamantK

Another angle that might be true is that since the capabilty for such a long range does not exists with pakistan yet it is hyping and conealing the range just to give the impression that it actually has a 4000+ Km range. If the range would have been anywhere near that im sure India would have already reacted.... hell, US would have come out with its guns blazing


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## Markus

samantk said:


> Another angle that might be true is that since the capabilty for such a long range does not exists with pakistan yet it is hyping and conealing the range just to give the impression that it actually has a 4000+ Km range. If the range would have been anywhere near that im sure India would have already reacted.... hell, US would have come out with its guns blazing



Yes, possible.

Trying to project something which u dont have is also a type of "deterrence"

Soviet Union used to do a lot of this kind of activity.

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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir you never know and it isn't about what Saudi Arabia is planning it is what can happen and lot of things can happen and war it is quite and option with one major city at stake Saudi Family will have to do something with Israel if it next time tries to attack or storm Palestinian areas specially change of government in Egypt anything can happen Sir anything


it takes more brains to understand the international politics and definetly is not in your reach to understand something of that magnitude.
you think KSA will fight a war for the palestinians or any other nation and vise versa, every one has thier own agenda and at the max they will only support financial assitance for hizibola or any other organization which is ready to fight the isrealis


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## ice_man

Zarvan said:


> Sir you never know and it isn't about what Saudi Arabia is planning it is what can happen and lot of things can happen and war it is quite and option with one major city at stake Saudi Family will have to do something with Israel if it next time tries to attack or storm Palestinian areas specially change of government in Egypt anything can happen Sir anything




brother the RED part is basically saying anything can happen. I totally agree anything can happen a TSUNAMI can come an asteroid can hit earth! BUT currently *NOTHING is HAPPENING!! and NOTHING WILL HAPPEN!* sir!

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## Sugarcane

danger-zone said:


> *RT* is another *Indian TV* like channel/news agency .



Pakistan has test fired a nuclear-capable ballistic missile, military officials say, less than a week after India also test-launched a long-range missile. The military said the test of the Shaheen 1-A, an intermediate-range missile capable of reaching targets in India, was successful.

India and Pakistan have fought three wars since 1947. They conduct regular missile tests and inform each other in advance. Both countries carried out nuclear weapons tests in 1998.

Defence experts say that while the exact range of the Pakistani missile has not been revealed, it is it capable of hitting targets up to 2,500 to 3,000km (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away - putting arch-rival India well within reach.

The Agni-V long-range intercontinental ballistic missile launched by India last week has a range of more than 5,000km (3,100 miles), potentially bringing targets in China within range.

Pakistan's last test was last month, when it launched the short-range nuclear-capable Abdali missile. The missile tested on Wednesday landed in the sea, the military said. It is a version of the Shaheen-1 - with improvements in range and technical capabilities - and is able to carry nuclear and conventional warheads.

The military say that the missile - which successfully hit its target in the Indian Ocean - further consolidates and strengthens Pakistan's deterrence abilities.

Pakistan's missile arsenal includes short, medium and long range missiles, all named after Muslim conquerors.

BBC News - Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable ballistic missile

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## Mav3rick

darkinsky said:


> test same missile and we all thought it would be ICBM, its not even 1000
> 
> waste of time and thoughts
> 
> andof course public money


 
I have to agree with your post, what was the point of this test except waste of money!



Asim Aquil said:


> Anything below Shaheen III will not be considered in response to Agni V


 
Anything other then 'Taimur' ICBM would always be non responsive to Indian test.



Aryavart said:


> how come a single missile have two name..hatf-IV & Shaheen IIIA...somewhere its quoting they tested Shaahen I , and somewhere Hatf I...its too confusing yar..are they just trying keep up moral of nation by firing any random missile from the stockpile.
> 
> I personaly say its not needed..India knows u guys have these missile..and agni v is not aimed to pakistan..its $600 million missile..too costly for pakistan....
> 
> anyway congratulation for your successful missile dreal...i guess this in response to Indian Army dreal which is currently going on in Thar Desert,


 
I think 1 of the series is solid fuelled and the other is liquid fuelled.


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## kshahzad

AyanRay said:


> its range? and source please. congrats


 
its range is 5,000 KM


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## A.Rafay

tribune.com.pk
this site says it range is 2500 km to 3000km


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## kawaraj

this is fabulous news. I knew it's testing, but not so early as expected.

I think the range is around 4000 km.


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Sir majority Pakistanis don't even know India conducted test of Agni v they don't even know what the hell is Agni V so that thing is out of question the only question why ISPR is keeping surprise element Pakistan has many times done this kind of things that India has tested a longer range missile but Pakistan tested the missile with the least range so it would not have been the first time


then I think that no one watches news in your country or is it INDIAN bollywood cinema that your country men chose over news.


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## Sugarcane

kshahzad said:


> its range is 5,000 KM



Do you have any credible source of your claim????


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## A.Rafay

kawaraj said:


> I knew it's testing, but not so early as expected.
> 
> I think the range is around 4000 km.


early as expected LOL i say it very late pk should be testing Icbm not this


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## Mav3rick

arsalanaslam123 said:


> surprised to see many bein disappointed that Pakistan have not test fired a LRBM, friends, please.
> we DO NOT NEED a long range missiles to answer INDIA as all there land is already in range of our missiles. so kindly just clear your thoughts on this that the answer to Agni-IV is NOT a shaheen III!
> 
> regardsing this reported test, it is good that we are still working on our operational missiles, thriving to improve there flight parameters, improving the accuracy and just confirming to the enemy, that hey, we dont need to spend 600 million US to come for you, this is what we need to answer you, and this is deadly accurate!
> 
> good job, congrats to pakistani scinetists and all of you!
> 
> regards!


 
India may not be our long term enemy, we need to realize who our enemies are and prepare accordingly. We desperately need an MIRV'd ICBM that is advanced enough to penetrate all known shields and hit our enemy anywhere in the world.

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## IceCold

Mav3rick said:


> India may not be our long term enemy, we need to realize who our enemies are and prepare accordingly. We desperately need an MIRV'd ICBM that is advanced enough to penetrate all known shields and hit our enemy anywhere in the world.



Exactly. This is something our political as well as military leadership are not considering and have their heads buried in the sand even after the fact that we have been threaten twice by a country and which by the way does not start with the letter I.


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## A.Rafay

kawaraj said:


> I knew it's testing, but not so early as expected.
> 
> I think the range is around 4000 km.


early as expected LOL i say it very late pk should be testing Icbm not this


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## Kambojaric

BBC said:


> Defence experts say that while the exact range of the Pakistani missile has not been revealed, it is it capable of hitting targets up to 2,500 to 3,000km (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away - putting arch-rival India well within reach.



BBC News - Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable ballistic missile


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## ashokdeiva

Bl[i]tZ;2866038 said:


> So the range is an improvement over 750 km, why call it a "long range" missile? Anyway, congrats to the Chinese.


dont bring the Chinese in, we tested a missile with 5000 range, but they have missiles of the same size and weight as agni 5 with a range of over 10000 - 12000 km range in active duty.
this test is a pure tastment to the abilities of the pakistani scientists

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## Hyde

ahh it's like Patakha phor ke bachon ko haath main candy aur lollypop pakra diya hai. ....

we need to fire long range missile soon... this is hour of the need and we have a reason after India already tested their ICBM... I understand it would be important test for the Army to conduct this test but the public want to see something new... It's been years since we tested any new missile and only conducting the old tests (which is important but public wont be satisfied with this test only)


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## Dark Warrior

> Defence experts say that while the exact range of the Pakistani missile has not been revealed, it is it capable of hitting targets up to 2,500 to 3,000km (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away - putting arch-rival India well within reach.


http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...listic-missile-shaheen-1a-16.html#post2866018 By BBC



Bamxa said:


> BBC News - Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable ballistic missile


How can a missile with a range of 2500-3000 km be called an ICBM?We don't call our Agni-2 an ICBM.
Anyways my source in Chennai was right it was going to be a Shaheen-2.


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## ashokdeiva

Zakii said:


> ahh it's like Patakha phor ke bachon ko haath main candy aur lollypop pakra diya hai. ....
> 
> we need to fire long range missile soon... this is hour of the need and we have a reason after India already tested their ICBM... I understand it would be important test for the Army to conduct this test but the public want to see something new... It's been years since we tested any new missile and only conducting the old tests (which is important but public wont be satisfied with this test only)


dear sir, i think that the timming of the tests are some thing that the PA has to change, it does not have to always do a test after india does some thing.


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## Markus

Zakii said:


> ahh it's like Patakha phor ke bachon ko haath main candy aur lollypop pakra diya hai. ....
> 
> we need to fire long range missile soon... this ia hour of the need and we have a reason after India already tested their ICBM... O understand it would be important test for the Army to conduct this test but the public want to see something new... It's been years since we tested any new missile and only conducting the old tests (which is important but public wont be satisfied with this test only)



Not that easy my friend.

Before Testing A5, India took into confidence every UNSC member except China. Thats is the reason why P5 except China gave a very balanced response to India's test.

Such long range missiles can easily raise shackles among the world powers.

There is no way you can test a long range missile without taking the P5 into confidence.


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## Bratva

Bl[i]tZ;2866038 said:


> So the range is an improvement over 750 km, why call it a "long range" missile? Anyway, congrats to the Chinese.
> 
> Pakistan tests missile days after India's launch: Associated Press



Because it has become an intermediate range ballistic missile. Possibly in the league of 12-1500 KM Missile. Also The pic shows it may have thrust vectoring.....


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## cnnetspy2000

Reply #199:
Your Agni-V landed in where? find no?

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## Bratva

mafiya said:


> I have observed something interesting, Is this thrust vector controls?



??????????????


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## Sugarcane

Dark Warrior said:


> How can a missile with a range of 2500-3000 km be called an ICBM?We don't call our Agni-2 an ICBM.
> Anyways my source in Chennai was right it was going to be a Shaheen-2.



Who is calling it ICBM?


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## SamantK

Zakii said:


> ahh it's like Patakha phor ke bachon ko haath main candy aur lollypop pakra diya hai. ....
> 
> we need to fire long range missile soon... this is hour of the need and we have a reason after India already tested their ICBM... I understand it would be important test for the Army to conduct this test but the public want to see something new... It's been years since we tested any new missile and only conducting the old tests (which is important but public wont be satisfied with this test only)


 I'm afraid that is the exact reason Pakistan is lagging behind in mostly everything, if what you say is true, they do not question the government why so much is being spent to match India? Its just a hype that India will swoop down on Pakistan when they will concentrate mainly on Millitary.. which IMHO is totally wrong!


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## illusion8

congratulations on the successful test, but more spec details and a video of the launch would have been more interesting.


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## sweetgrape

Pak is much better than India, Pak friend just said they will test the missile one or two day before the test, not like india, they boast about these one years ago!! Good job, friend. stronger don't need much propaganda!

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## IND151

BTW congrats for test!!!!!


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## Cyph3r

Pakistan test fires nuke-capable ballistic missile Shaheen-1A

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## Alchemy

Pakistan has wasted a wonderful opportunity it had for testing shaheen 3 or any long range missile , they could have easily countered any negative response from the international community by saying this was in response for Indian testing..... 

This technology Pakistan had 10 yrs ago and nothing new was achieved by this test


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## SamantK

sweetgrape said:


> Pak is much better than India, Pak friend just said they will test the missile one or two day before the test, not like india, they boast about these one years ago!! Good job, friend. stronger don't need much propaganda!


 what a simplistic view, making a missile of that calibre and capabilty, we boast because we do it ourself and for that it takes time. If Shaeen 1A is Shaeen II then it was know already that they have this missile so what is the big deal?


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## somebozo

> According to the Pakistani military the missile is an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with a longer range. Shaheen 1 has a range of 750 kilometers (465 miles), but there was no immediate confirmation of the new missile's range



What an answer..we did not even touch four digit figure of strike range (


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## Alchemy

Mav3rick said:


> I have to agree with your post, what was the point of this test except waste of money!
> Anything other then 'Taimur' ICBM would always be non responsive to Indian test.
> I think 1 of the series is solid fuelled and the other is liquid fuelled.



I agree that this was the right time for Pak to test Taimur if the technology was ready , but I guess Pak leaders both Civilian and military do not have the will power to test an ICBM ,fearing international sanctions and isolation, especially when they are going around asking for aid and funds around the globe. 

India justified its test by saying the ICBM is for deterrence against China , how can Pakistan possibly justify an ICBM???


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## ManuZ

So pakistan tested a new missile....and nobdy knows the range of it....
or any substantial information abt it...
But somehow the discussion rampaged into 18 pages???


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## Alchemy

Mav3rick said:


> India may not be our long term enemy, we need to realize who our enemies are and prepare accordingly. We desperately need an MIRV'd ICBM that is advanced enough to penetrate all known shields and hit our enemy anywhere in the world.



India may or may not be your long term enemy , but you have already covered India in missile range , time for ICBM for sure !!!

All the more reason todays test should have been tipu or taimur (ie if they are ready to be tested )


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## saiyan0321

> India may or may not be your long term enemy , but you have already covered India in missile range , time for ICBM for sure !!!
> 
> All the more reason todays test should have been tipu or taimur (ie if they are ready to be tested )



yaar many indians have said this but i still disagree dont get me wrong i wanted to see a a long range missile but we still couldnt explain it your missile was china centric which means it was aimed at your enemy it wouldnt make sense for us to do a test of 4000 km or 5000 km just bcz india did it the world wont follow the they did it we had to also and it was put us in alot of sanctions china is america,s enemy too usa wont say anything as long as india,s defence is china centric however shaheen 3 woujld raised some questions and would have shown that pakistan is trying to hit israel


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## Dark Warrior

Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?


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## The Deterrent

Why don't the confused members get an idea from the picture of the missile, that it is single-stage and TOTALLY resembles Shaheen-I? It definietly has a range of no more than a 1000 km (may be less)...

And "routine" tests are not a regular thing...special arrangments have to be made for each test everytime, with the missile being tested for new (better) parameters everytime! 

@Windjammer...I know you have a reputation sir...but the thing is that ALL of the Shaheen series of missiles have been ALWAYS test fired into the Arabian Sea. Even the first Shaheen-I was test fired into the Sea, back in '99. It is the Ghauri series that is test fired from the Tilla Ranges (Attock) into Baluchistan...

@Mafiya...those are jet vanes you identified. They are present in our missiles (Abdali, Ghaznavi, Shaheen etc) for giving the ballistic trajectory...

It is very much possible that the upgraded missile is faster and is equipped to better evade ABMs...

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## Bratva

Alchemy said:


> Pakistan has wasted a wonderful opportunity it had for testing shaheen 3 or any long range missile , they could have easily countered any negative response from the international community by saying this was in response for Indian testing.....
> 
> *This technology Pakistan had 10 yrs ago and nothing new was achieved by this test*



Idiotic comment, what part of Improved range, Improve flight parameters (Thrust vectoring), Improve defense against ABM's doesnot get in to your brain and you said nothing new achieved?

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## SHAMK9

Dark Warrior said:


> Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
> How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?


 people were calling it an ICBM because we were expecting Shaheen 3 or tipu, the hype of long ranged missle was obviously created by your media so go question them


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## The Deterrent

Dark Warrior said:


> Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
> How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?



Pakistan is not calling anything...ISPR refused to reveal the missile's range...BBC's report is based on speculations made by "Defence Analysts"...
Of course a missile with such range cant be an ICBM...plus the missile in the picture is single-staged, hence it CANNOT be of higher range...

Lets just all settle down on that Pakistan tested an SRBM...


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## Bratva

Dark Warrior said:


> Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
> How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?



Who is calling this missile an ICBM? Instead of ignoring idiotic comments you are further commenting on them to ruin this thread further. Stop asking childish questions. This Missile is not ICBM rather a Medium ranged missile


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## ashokdeiva

Dark Warrior said:


> Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
> How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?


non of the sane Pakistani members have said its a ICBM that they have tested. its a missile with a enhanced range is their claim, so please do not provoke a troll feast here my friend.

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## saiyan0321

> what a simplistic view, making a missile of that calibre and capabilty, we boast because we do it ourself and for that it takes time. If Shaeen 1A is Shaeen II then it was know already that they have this missile so what is the big deal?



how r you linking between two different variants of a missile let me tell you indians

this was not a wasted test as working on accuracy, range and advanced tech should be done continuously and let me tell you this a low range missile that can hit its target perfectly is more deadly then a long range that will miss it. i am happy for this test and will wait and see if any more test will happen.
this is not chinese missile yaar this was made and worked on by pakistan. variants can never be copies. period

18 pages of a test cmon yaar stop insulting pakistan congratulate us and get outfrown:



> non of the sane Pakistani members have said its a ICBM that they have tested. its a missile with a enhanced range is their claim, so please do not provoke a troll feast here my friend.



exactly thank you 

even shaheen 3 is not an icbm unless it crosses the 5000 range limit i think it becomes an intermeditae if its range is between 3500 to 4500 km


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## Bratva

Alchemy said:


> *I agree that this was the right time for Pak to test Taimur if the technology was ready , but I guess Pak leaders both Civilian and military do not have the will power to test an ICBM ,fearing international sanctions and isolation, especially when they are going around asking for aid and funds around the globe. *
> 
> India justified its test by saying the ICBM is for deterrence against China , how can Pakistan possibly justify an ICBM???



Who you to decide Pakistan test or build long range missile or not? Stop making stupid comments pleases, if you can't comment objectively, go vent your anger on BR then.


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## Sugarcane

Dark Warrior said:


> Still no Pakistani member has been able to answer my question.
> How can Pakistan call a missile with a strike range of up to 2,500km-3,000km(BBC) an ICBM?



You still not answered my question, Where Pakistan said that it's ICBM??


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## Mansukh.singh

Shaheen1A is neither Long range nor IRBM(american classification), due to 

1. It is a *Single stage* rocket so *it can not have range of 3000Km*. Compare it with Shaheen 2(Range 2500Km) which is double stage rocket.

2. Each forces has own Classification of IRBM,MRBM or SRBM. for eg. Russian calls IRBM as MRBM.

3. Whole confusion created by Gen. Talat masood who say since Shaheen 1A is IRBM and IRBM has range of 3000Km.

4. Pakistan Army strengthen the confusion by not disclosing range . But why ? answer is "*if you can not convince, then confuse them *" type of thinking.

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## Dark Warrior

It range is not 3,000 km but 1,000km.



> Pakistan Test-Fires Nuclear-Capable Shaheen 1A
> PTI | Rezaul H Laskar | Islamabad | Apr 25,2012
> Pakistan today test-fired the nuclear-capable Hatf-4 ballistic missile with improvements in range to hit targets anywhere in India.
> 
> The military did not specify the exact range of the missile though sources told PTI that the* Hatf-4's reach had been increased from 750 km to 1,000 km.*
> 
> The missile, capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads, can reach targets deep within India.
> 
> A statement issued by the military said the test of the Hatf-4, also known as Shaheen-1A, was conducted successfully.
> 
> Improvements have been mode to the missile's "range and technical parameters", the statement said without giving details.
> 
> The impact point of the missile was at sea, the statement said.
> 
> Pakistan had informed India in advance about the test and asked it to issue suitable warnings to aircraft flying over the region.
> 
> President Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani congratulated scientists and military officials over the successful test of the Hatf-4.
> 
> Lt Gen (retired) Khalid Kidwai, the Director General of the Strategic Plans Division, and Army Strategic Force Command chief Lt Gen Tariq Nadeem Gilani were among senior military officers and scientists who witnessed the launch.
> 
> Kidwai congratulated scientists and engineers on the "accuracy of the missile in reaching the target".
> 
> He said that the improved version of the Shaheen-1 will "further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities".
> 
> India had tested the Agni-V, its most powerful nuclear-capable missile, on April 19.



Pakistan Test-Fires Nuclear-Capable Shaheen 1A | news.outlookindia.com

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## farhan_9909

stay tuned

expect another test within a week

this was just to see the world response


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## saiyan0321

> You still not answered my question, Where Pakistan said that it's ICBM??



he never will he will just keep saying you didnt answer my question...... most over here who posted were disappointed that it was not an icbm even i was expecting shaheen 3 but hey i will still take accuracy and advanced tech over range


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## farhan_9909

stay tuned

expect another test within a week

this was just to see the world response

only if they have balls to test the shaheen.III


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## Mansukh.singh

Even Indian sources has said it's range is 1000Km. But I didn't give it. Pakistani won't believe them


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## saiyan0321

> 4. Pakistan Army strengthen the confusion by not disclosing range . But why ? answer is "if you can not convince, then confuse them " type of thinking.



confuse bhai tab logo karo jab humai yeh pata na ho kay km kitna hota hai we know if its 750 km how far it will go or its 2500 km infact people are not aware of what is mrbm or irbm or icbm they know which country it has the ability to hit ..........

plz plz plz think before you make a stupid post like that


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## ice_man

OH LORD give brains to both side of the border!!! firstly FOR PAKISTANIS our SIMPLE AIM is to *RETALITE* to _INDIAN AGRESSION_ and give them a *bloody NOSE!* our aim is not to HIT the MOON! or Israel or US!


as for indians well our armed forces just tested the perimieters of an intermediate ballsitic missile! range is maximum upto 1,000 kms! not something for the world to worry about but definetly able to hit central india!

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## The Deterrent

Mansukh.singh said:


> Shaheen1A is neither Long range nor IRBM(american classification), due to
> 
> 1. It is a *Single stage* rocket so *it can not have range of 3000Km*. Compare it with Shaheen 2(Range 2500Km) which is double stage rocket.
> 
> 2. Each forces has own Classification of IRBM,MRBM or SRBM. for eg. Russian calls IRBM as MRBM.
> 
> 3. Whole confusion created by Gen. Talat masood who say since Shaheen 1A is IRBM and IRBM has range of 3000Km.



Agreed...I once heard Gen Talat Masood aclling Ra'ad ALCM as "ground launched"...so I dont think anyone should pay heed to what he says, just because of the rank...


> 4. Pakistan Army strengthen the confusion by not disclosing range . But why ? answer is "if you can not convince then confuse them " type of thinking.



It is not PA's fault...the General is retired and doesnt speaks officially for the Pakistan Army.

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## Alchemy

farhan_9909 said:


> stay tuned
> 
> expect another test within a week
> 
> *this was just to see the world response*



I was of the same opinion too


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## saiyan0321

> Even Indian sources has said it's range is 1000Km. But I didn't give it. Pakistani won't believe them



well bbc says its 3000km but wide spread knowledge is 750 km so you r not exactly breaking the bomb if you would check previous pages many members are not sure and are asking for confirmation as one source is saying one thing and the other is saying something else


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## Markus

ice_man said:


> as for indians well our armed forces just tested the perimieters of an intermediate ballsitic missile! range is maximum upto 1,000 kms! not something for the world to worry about but definetly able to hit central india!



We already know abt it.

Why just central India, ur ghauri can hit all of India.


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## The Deterrent

Markus said:


> We already know abt it.
> 
> Why just central India, ur ghauri can hit all of India.



It is not about hitting how FAR...Shaheen-IA is about hitting how WELL...

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## Mansukh.singh

AhaseebA said:


> It is not PA's fault...the General is retired and doesnt speaks officially for the Pakistan Army.



Yes! indeed It's PA's fault.* They are in best position of quell this confusion*.But they choose to stir the speculation.

Because Pak Citizen can not be convinced with mere 750 or 1000km range of missile in response of Indian Long range Agni 5.


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## saiyan0321

> OH LORD give brains to both side of the border!!! firstly FOR PAKISTANIS our SIMPLE AIM is to RETALITE to INDIAN AGRESSION and give them a bloody NOSE! our aim is not to HIT the MOON! or Israel or US!



hey i know i ahve been saying on this forum we cant tell the world they tested it so we can too we have to name our threat and naming israel and usa will put is in a position for which we r not ready to be read this sentence people

*there is a time and place for everything but still wanted the shaheen 3*

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## Markus

AhaseebA said:


> It is not about hitting how FAR...Shaheen-IA is about hitting how WELL...



So, how well did the missile perform ?


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## saiyan0321

> It is not about hitting how FAR...Shaheen-IA is about hitting how WELL...



can you believe that this lack of understanding has derailed the thread completely

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## Mansukh.singh

AhaseebA said:


> It is not about hitting how FAR...Shaheen-IA is about hitting how WELL...



True ! Shaheen class of missile is solid fuelled missile which are more advanced than Liquid fuelled Ghauri missile .


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## saiyan0321

> Yes! indeed It's PA's fault. They are in best position of quell this confusion.But they choose to stir the speculation.
> 
> Because Pak Citizen can not be convinced with mere 750 or 1000km range of missile in response of Indian Long range Agni 5.



yaar do you even know what you r saying how sensless it sounds we know india tested a 5000km missile and our people know we tested a 750 km missile( range still unknown) do you think our people cant think huh tell me we know yaar how can you just state that


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## ice_man

Mansukh.singh said:


> Yes! indeed It's PA's fault.* They are in best position of quell this confusion*.But they choose to stir the speculation.
> 
> Because Pak Citizen can not be convinced with mere 750 or 1000km range of missile in response of Indian Long range Agni 5.



Pakistani citiziens couldn't care less!!! they are more concerned about their daily issues! then see what indians are upto! 

INDIA has agressive intentions hence need to test long range ICBMs pakistan basically has a defence against india strategy hence we just need to MAINTAIN a minimum deterence!


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## The Deterrent

Mansukh.singh said:


> Yes! indeed It's PA's fault.* They are in best position of quell this confusion*.But they choose to stir the speculation.
> 
> Because Pak Citizen can not be convinced with mere 750 or 1000km range of missile in response of Indian Long range Agni 5.



I disagree....These type of Missile Tests are not a "response" to anything...They are planned months ahead.
Also, only the hate-mongers want something in response...An educated person would know that Agni-5 was never meant for Pakistan, and that these "regular" tests are not regular but tests of improvised missiles...

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## saiyan0321

> So, how well did the missile perform ?



hmmm what could a successful test possibly mean



> I disagree....These type of Missile Tests are not a "response" to anything...They are planned months ahead.
> Also, only the hate-mongers want something in response...An educated person would know that Agni-5 was never meant for Pakistan, and that these "regular" tests are not regular but tests of improvised missiles...



educated yaar bahar chaprasi say poch lo woh bta day ka kay india covered us with their start missiles why bcz pakistan is smaller then india. pakistan had to take time bcz india was larger and people know the difference between 5000 km and 750 km that they wont be confused which is long range...... and i agree all day the news mostly showed gilani case or nepra increasing electric prices there are just too many problems


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## The Deterrent

Markus said:


> So, how well did the missile perform ?



Nobody knows for real, except the Army...as ISPR has always stated every missile test succesful...So We have to accept the official statement, that the missile test met all parameters...

Im just speculating that the missile most probably has an improved design, which could ensure quicker response and ABM evading capabilities...


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## SHAMK9

Mansukh.singh said:


> Yes! indeed It's PA's fault.* They are in best position of quell this confusion*.But they choose to stir the speculation.
> 
> Because Pak Citizen can not be convinced with mere 750 or 1000km range of missile in response of Indian Long range Agni 5.


OH MY GOD!!!! What point of testing Shaheen's accuracy is soo hard to get through your brains, 1st: Indian media was the first one to make a big deal out of this and giving it a huge hype. 2nd: Pakistani members already said that we are not planning to hit the moon or Israel, Pak army did a good thing by hiding the real range, element of surprise is always good if a war breaks through


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## DDLJ

What is the actual range of the missile.


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## Windjammer

farhan_9909 said:


> stay tuned
> 
> expect another test within a week
> 
> this was just to see the world response
> 
> only if they have balls to test the shaheen.III



The Indian media was covered with the news that Pakistan is to conduct an ICBM test between 25 & 29 April.
I make today the first day of the notification. 
When i inquired from Brigadier Atique on weather this is part of a series of tests....he simply didn't want to comment on this. 
As they say, tomorrow is another day.

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## Mansukh.singh

DDLJ said:


> What is the actual range of the missile.



It is about 1000Km .


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## illusion8

SHAMK9 said:


> people were calling it an ICBM because we were expecting Shaheen 3 or tipu, the hype of long ranged missle was obviously created by your media so go question them



I plead benefit of doubt for the Indian media, when Pakistan said that it will test a long range ballistic missile and asked for clearance of the IOR the media will put 2 and 2 together.



Windjammer said:


> The Indian media was covered with the news that Pakistan is to conduct an ICBM test between 25 & 29 April.
> I make today the first day of the notification.
> When i inquired from Brigadier Atique on weather this is part of a series of tests....he simply didn't want to comment on this.
> As they say, tomorrow is another day.



But Pakistan informed about just one test, not a series of tests. I think this is it.


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## Mansukh.singh

Thank god , It is *single stage Shaheen 1 test* ..
If it would have been double stage shaheen 2 then speculators would have streched it's range near 4000 or even 5000 km !!


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## ice_man

Mansukh.singh said:


> Thank god , It is *single stage Shaheen 1 test* ..
> If it would have been double stage shaheen 2 then speculators would have streched it's range near 4000 or even 5000 km !!



nah i guess to the moon! anyhow i hope your buddies are having fun at BR forum and having a verbal diarhea


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## Windjammer

illusion8 said:


> But Pakistan informed about just one test, not a series of tests. I think this is it.



We will just have to wait and see.

My argument is that the gentleman at the affairs could have simply said....."this was the only test for now". !! Why would Pakistan ask for the sea and air routes to be cleared for five consecutive days. ??

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## illusion8

Windjammer said:


> We will just have to wait and see.



Will be a hell of a lot more interesting if Pakistan does test a IRBM about 4000 km or a ICBM , but sadly i think this is it.


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## illusion8

> My argument is that the gentleman at the affairs could have simply said....."this was the only test for now". !! Why would Pakistan ask for the sea and air routes to be cleared for five consecutive days. ??



Thats a normal window given to take into considerations any delays, and enough time for air and sea traffic to make alternate arrangements i guess.


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## Mansukh.singh

illusion8 said:


> Will be a hell of a lot more interesting if Pakistan does test a IRBM about 4000 km or a ICBM , but sadly i think this is it.



ICBM is a different beast altogether. It have* re-entry technology and Guidance systems*.

At very high speed, temperature of missile reaches 3000 to 4000 Degree centigrade.

Normal missile can not withstand such a high temperature, That's why need Heat shields and Composite materials.


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## Adnan Faruqi

Zarvan said:


> Sir for your information 750 KM is enough for Delhi and Mumbai



I suggest you to learn geography and distances.

The Distance between Karachi Airport (,Pakistan) [Airport] and Mumbai (Maharashtra,India) is : 880.83 kilometers (km). 

- In short to target Mumbai you need a missile longer then 900 kms range.

- Mumbai/Delhi can survive because of our BMD + we have Akaash + Russian S-300, pakistan won't.

- Even without Delhi/Mumbai India can survive and progress, we are huge.


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## abdulbarijan

*Interesting thing in this is ...if u go to youtube itself and check out the description of the video it mentions the range off 4000 Km's... *
and no need to mention its RT


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## Sugarcane

Mansukh.singh said:


> ICBM is a different beast altogether. It have* re-entry technology and Guidance systems*.
> 
> At very high speed, temperature of missile reaches 3000 to 4000 Degree centigrade.
> 
> Normal missile can not withstand such a high temperature, That's why need Heat shields and Composite materials.



Why you are rolling on the floor after stating the things which every member of the forum already knows


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## illusion8

Mansukh.singh said:


> ICBM is a different beast altogether. It have* re-entry technology and Guidance systems*.
> 
> At very high speed, temperature of missile reaches 3000 to 4000 Degree centigrade.
> 
> Normal missile can not withstand such a high temperature, That's why need Heat shields and Composite materials.



China has ICBM's so would be easy for Pakistan to get one, it would be interesting to see the fallout of such a test if Pakistan does go ahead with it , There was no negative reaction to India's test, just wanted to see if the same happens if Pakistan does test an IRBM.

Speculative of course if they do have an ICBM ready to test at this stage.

Let Pakistan initiate for a change


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## Mansukh.singh

Adnan Faruqi said:


> I suggest you to learn geography and distances.
> 
> The Distance between Karachi Airport (,Pakistan) [Airport] and Mumbai (Maharashtra,India) is : 880.83 kilometers (km).
> 
> - In short to target Mumbai you need a missile longer then 900 kms range.
> 
> - Mumbai/Delhi can survive because of our BMD + we have Akaash + Russian S-300, pakistan won't.
> 
> - Even without Delhi/Mumbai India can survive and progress, we are huge.



Cool mate!, 750 km means it threaten both Delhi and Mumbai.What India will do , will be concern of Indian not for Shaheen 1A.

Please stick to the topic .


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## regular

Mansukh.singh said:


> ICBM is a different beast altogether. It have* re-entry technology and Guidance systems*.
> 
> At very high speed, temperature of missile reaches 3000 to 4000 Degree centigrade.
> 
> Normal missile can not withstand such a high temperature, That's why need Heat shields and Composite materials.


I guess ure sattelites and the Phalcon radars are dumb@$$ and useless can't track down our missiles and their ranges......our missile covered 4500km range within Indian Ocean shows that its range is more than 4500km......The Russian sattelites tracked it .......I guess the Indian heroes shold shut down now cuz their remote sensing sattelites are just garbage. Go and read Russia today newspaper on the internet on 25th April 2012 4:15pm........
here is the link:
Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile &mdash; RT

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## Mansukh.singh

illusion8 said:


> China has ICBM's so would be easy for Pakistan to get one, it would be interesting to see the fallout of such a test if Pakistan does go ahead with it , There was no negative reaction to India's test, just wanted to see if the same happens if Pakistan does test an IRBM.
> 
> Speculative of course if they do have an ICBM ready.



Uncle Sam has watched transfer of technology with patience because IRBM or short range are not concern for USA or his pet Israel.

But ICBM will threaten both USA's Base and Israel , So uncle Sam will not keep quite in this case


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## Sugarcane

Adnan Faruqi said:


> I suggest you to learn geography and distances.
> 
> The Distance between Karachi Airport (,Pakistan) [Airport] and Mumbai (Maharashtra,India) is : 880.83 kilometers (km).
> 
> - In short to target Mumbai you need a missile longer then 900 kms range.
> 
> - Mumbai/Delhi can survive because of our BMD + we have Akaash + Russian S-300, pakistan won't.
> 
> - Even without Delhi/Mumbai India can survive and progress, we are huge.



This missile is for hunting sharks in sea, now happy????

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## regular

If the Indian space department or their Navy or Airforce were capable enough then they must have tracked down our missile covering distance within the ocean but they all are nothing but looking for their paychecks.....they are useless.....


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## illusion8

Mansukh.singh said:


> Uncle Sam has watched transfer of technology with patience because IRBM or short range are not concern for USA or his pet Israel.
> 
> But ICBM will threaten both USA's Base and Israel , So uncle Sam will not keep quite in this case



Whatever dude, they were working on an ICBM so would be foolish to think that Pakistan don't have it, My point is, it was the right chance to test an BM of 3 - 4000 km range, and would have been interesting to see the world's reaction on it vis a vis India's test.


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## Mansukh.singh

abdulbarijan said:


> *Interesting thing in this is ...if u go to youtube itself and check out the description of the video it mentions the range off 4000 Km's... *
> and no need to mention its RT



If single stage Shaheen 1A can attain range of 4000km and Shaheen 2 (Two stage) have range of 2500.

Then it mean , shaheen 2 is a complete waste !! (but in my opinion Shaheen 2 is a pretty good missle)

Confusion is created by PK and Gen. Talat masood, Every news paper quoting him as according to 'defence experts'.


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## monitor

What is the range of the missile ? 750 km or increased to 1000 km ?


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## Mansukh.singh

monitor said:


> What is the range of the missile ? 750 km or increased to 1000 km ?



Man ! Shaheen 1 has range of 750Km which is enhanced as 1000Km in Shaheen 1'A'.


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> it takes more brains to understand the international politics and definetly is not in your reach to understand something of that magnitude.
> you think KSA will fight a war for the palestinians or any other nation and vise versa, every one has thier own agenda and at the max they will only support financial assitance for hizibola or any other organization which is ready to fight the isrealis


Sir they will have to one day because support of Palestinan people is massive and more important is Jarsulam and if anything happens to Masjid e Aqsa you can't understand the rage that will happen in Muslim Countries

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## Zarvan

List of missiles of Pakistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It has added Shaheen 1A in Intermediate Range Category


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## ajpirzada

so shaheen 1 was 750 and shaheen 2 was 3000-3500km. Now instead of shaheen 3, we came up with shaheen 1A with a range of 4000-4500km. i wonder wat 'A' stands for? any idea?

However, former General Talat Masood has speculated the range to be 2500-3000. Pakistan test fires Hatf IV ballistic missile &#8211; The Express Tribune 

and why are they both (shaheen 1 and 1A) called Hatf IV when they have such a big difference in range? Does Hatf IV name has to do something with technology?

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## Zarvan

Video: Pakistan test fires nuke-capable ballistic missile Shaheen-1A - YouTube


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## Mansukh.singh

Zarvan said:


> List of missiles of Pakistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> It has added Shaheen 1A in Intermediate Range Category



Do you want me to edit that ? 

Man! I said , every force has it's own classification. There is no sharp boundary lines.


----------



## mjnaushad

Adnan Faruqi said:


> Where are Mods?????????
> 
> Asim ur quite active on this thread plz take care of it.
> 
> Ban him because if someone uses the same words for pak or china he will get banned.
> 
> Thanks



*I also think its time to clean up. All trolls who in every other post of their keep calling Pakistani missile a chinese gift/ Purchase from NK. Lets start by Post of Blackwidow and all other indians who without any proof or logic keep implying that Pakistani missiles are actually chinese and NK missiles. shall we?*


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## Mansukh.singh

ajpirzada said:


> so shaheen 1 was 750 and shaheen 2 was 3000-3500km. Now instead of shaheen 3, *we came up with shaheen 1A with a range of 4000-4500km.* i wonder wat 'A' stands for? any idea?
> 
> However, former General Talat Masood has speculated the range to be 2500-3000. Pakistan test fires Hatf IV ballistic missile &#8211; The Express Tribune
> 
> and why are they both (shaheen 1 and 1A) called Hatf IV when they have such a big difference in range? Does Hatf IV name has to do something with technology?



Who said that ... Shaheen 1 A has 4000-4500Km range ?? Do you ever heard a single stage missile to have such range.

Shaheen 2 is two stage but range is 2500km.


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## Zarvan

Sir Pakistan have tested low range missile before to when India tested some long range missiles not very long but Pakistan in return test those missiles with least range this time it is different Pakistan has done and now acting different rather strange

Pak test fires missile: Tit for tat?

Did China nudge Pakistan to conduct its test days after India showed off Agni 5? Experts weigh in.


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## regular

ajpirzada said:


> so shaheen 1 was 750 and shaheen 2 was 3000-3500km. Now instead of shaheen 3, we came up with shaheen 1A with a range of 4000-4500km. i wonder wat 'A' stands for? any idea?
> 
> However, former General Talat Masood has speculated the range to be 2500-3000. Pakistan test fires Hatf IV ballistic missile &#8211; The Express Tribune
> 
> and why are they both (shaheen 1 and 1A) called Hatf IV when they have such a big difference in range? Does Hatf IV name has to do something with technology?


"A" stands for Advanced version.....in the intermediate range......


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## ajpirzada

well to be honest i dont know anything about this thing.

4000 was given in RT. Talat Masood said 2500-3000km. Im just confused. 
so in short we do not know anything about the upgrades on this missile. any speculation is a waste of time i guess!

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## Mercenary




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## Zarvan

ajpirzada said:


> well to be honest i dont know anything about this thing.
> 
> 4000 was given in RT. Talat Masood said 2500-3000km. Im just confused.
> so in short we do not know anything about the upgrades on this missile. any speculation is a waste of time i guess!


This is exactly what is creating confusion Pakistan has never done this kind of thing when ever Pakistan tests a Missile it also reveals its range this is first time Pakistan has done this kind of act


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## Mansukh.singh

ajpirzada said:


> well to be honest i dont know anything about this thing.
> 
> 4000 was given in RT. Talat Masood said 2500-3000km. Im just confused.
> so in short we do not know anything about the upgrades on this missile. any speculation is a waste of time i guess!



Talat masood once even said that , Ra'ad ALCM is launched from 'Ground'.


----------



## Hashshāshīn

lol why are Indians getting happy that it's only 1500 KM range? 1500km is more than enough to reach ALL of India...


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## Zarvan

Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable ballistic missile

The move comes less than a week after India test-launched a long-range missile
Pakistan has test fired a nuclear-capable ballistic missile, military officials say, less than a week after India also test-launched a long-range missile.

The military said the test of the Shaheen 1-A, an intermediate-range missile capable of reaching targets in India, was successful.

India and Pakistan have fought three wars since 1947.

They conduct regular missile tests and inform each other in advance.

Both countries carried out nuclear weapons tests in 1998.

Continue reading the main story
Analysis


M Ilyas Khan
BBC News, Islamabad
The Pakistani test is seen by many as a message that Islamabad is not behind in upgrading its weapons in terms of both range and delivery capacity.

The nuclear arms race in South Asia has been one of the most persistent in the world, and is known for such tit-for-tat tests.

The latest tests indicate that this race continues despite recent ground-breaking trade talks between India and Pakistan that promise to normalise relations between the two nuclear-armed neighbours.

India has been building its defences against China and has developed missiles that can threaten a vast region from eastern Europe to Australia.

Pakistan's missile programme, which is in the hands of the military, is more India-specific. It strives for a capability to threaten as many major Indian cities as possible.

*Defence experts say that while the exact range of the Pakistani missile has not been revealed, it is capable of hitting targets up to 2,500 to 3,000km (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away - putting arch-rival India well within reach.*

The Agni-V long-range intercontinental ballistic missile launched by India last week has a range of more than 5,000km (3,100 miles), potentially bringing targets in China within range.

Pakistan's last test was last month, when it launched the short-range nuclear-capable Abdali missile.

The missile tested on Wednesday landed in the sea, the military said. It is a version of the Shaheen-1 - with improvements in range and technical capabilities - and is able to carry nuclear and conventional warheads.

The military say that the missile - which successfully hit its target in the Indian Ocean - further consolidates and strengthens Pakistan's deterrence abilities.

Pakistan's missile arsenal includes short, medium and long range missiles, all named after Muslim conquerors.


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## Windjammer

&#7716;ashsh&#257;sh&#299;n;2866844 said:


> lol why are Indians getting happy that it's only 1500 KM range? 1500km is more than enough to reach ALL of India...



It's called......trying to put on a brave face. !!

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## Sugarcane

Zarvan said:


> Their are many more experts in Pakistan to



Forget experts it's better to stick to 750-1000 unless told otherwise by officials, no need to debate based on rumors


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## Dr. Strangelove

please tell me is it upgraded shaheen 1 or 2


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## Mansukh.singh

loveicon said:


> Forget experts it's better to stick to 750-1000 unless told otherwise by officials, no need to debate based on rumors



Now this is logical reply.

Single stage rocket(shaheen 1 A) have these kind of ranges like 750 to 1000Km.


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## Windjammer

abdulbarijan said:


>



*Shaheen-1 is reputedly one of the fastest missile in it's class, the acceleration soon after launch proves this point.*


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## Mansukh.singh

wasm95 said:


> please tell me is it upgraded shaheen 1 or 2



Can't read the title of thread ?

It is shaheen 1 'Advanced'


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## Zarvan

wasm95 said:


> please tell me is it upgraded shaheen 1 or 2


The name which ISPR used is Shaheen 1A so autmatically means it is upgraded form of Shaheen 1A but still can't understand what is the point of hiding the range of the missile which Pakistan has never done before


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## Zarvan

Windjammer said:


> *Shaheen-1 is reputedly one of the fastest missile in it's class, the acceleration soon after launch proves this point.*


Sir that is not the question the question is what is the bloody range of the missile ?


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## monitor

Windjammer said:


> *Shaheen-1 is reputedly one of the fastest missile in it's class, the acceleration soon after launch proves this point.*


 

Yea I noticed it too . it seems to me very fast from the beginning.


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## Don Jaguar

Please confirm its range.


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## monitor

Windjammer said:


> *Shaheen-1 is reputedly one of the fastest missile in it's class, the acceleration soon after launch proves this point.*



May be it seems very fast to me from beginning .


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## Zarvan

Windjammer said:


> Actually your repeated nonsensical comments prove that there is no wind in your sails.
> The speed disclosure wasn't exactly made today but some years back.
> As for the range, we all only too well how the Indians on this very forum, were running around like headless Chicken even when Battlefield Buster NASR was tested. So no need to go on a tangent.


Now from my Personal Source I also getting to know that range is more than 4000 KM but still need official confirmation


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## ashokdeiva

Zarvan said:


> Now from my Personal Source I also getting to know that range is more than 4000 KM but still need official confirmation


how old are you and who is your personal source, just don't try to fool your own country men. 
this guy is a undisputed king of self embarasment.

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## Mansukh.singh

Zarvan said:


> Now from my Personal Source I also getting to know that range is more than 4000 KM but still need official confirmation



OMG ! Single stage rocket having 4000km range.

Some people don't use their head at all .

another try : Do you see your media is going Gaga over it , as it was in 1998 ?


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## Sugarcane

Zarvan said:


> Now from my Personal Source I also getting to know that range is more than 4000 KM but still need official confirmation



Don't tell me your personal source is RT or TM type analyst

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## Windjammer

Zarvan said:


> Now from my Personal Source I also getting to know that range is more than 4000 KM but still need official confirmation



And a very credible source tells me to concentrate on the designation Alpha....more than anything else.

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## ashokdeiva

Windjammer said:


> And a very credible source tells me to concentrate on the designation Alpha....more than anything else.


hey i did not get that, what does Alpha stands for?


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## Don Jaguar

Windjammer said:


> And a very credible source tells me to concentrate on the designation Alpha....more than anything else.



If there is Alpha then there can be Beta also. 







http://vusolutions.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Pakistan-Launched-Missile-Successfuly.jpg


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## Windjammer

ashokdeiva said:


> hey i did not get that, what does Alpha stands for?



The new missile designation is Shaheen-1 A (Alpha)


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## saiyan0321

> If there is Alpha then there can be Beta also.



5 days then for 5 days this thread well keep on going the way it is full trollingP

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## ashokdeiva

Windjammer said:


> The new missile designation is Shaheen-1 A (Alpha)


come on man, i know that the A stands for ALpha, my question was if this word has a significance on any of the paramenters of the missile. or its like a proven version of BETA grade missile?


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## SQ8

ashokdeiva said:


> come on man, i know that the A stands for ALpha, my question was if this word has *a significance on any of the paramenters of the missile*. or its like a proven version of BETA grade missile?



Improved Launch cycle, Guidance,Accuracy and Evasive systems.

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## ashokdeiva

Oscar said:


> Improved Launch cycle, Guidance,Accuracy and Evasive systems.


Thanks for the reply Oscar.

that essentially means that the range is more or less the same as its predecessor with a little improvement of probably a 250 to 500 km extra range.
Congrats to the Pakistanis on adding improvements to their defence systems.

Then I see MR ZARVAN quoting from his personal source of over 4000 km, which is fooling his country men.


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## SQ8

ashokdeiva said:


> Thanks for the reply Oscar.
> 
> that essentially means that the range is more or less the same as its predecessor with a little improvement of probably a* 250* to 500 km extra range.
> Congrats to the Pakistanis on adding improvements to their defence systems.
> 
> Then I see MR ZARVAN quoting from his personal source of over 4000 km, which is fooling his country men.



Id look towards that figure..
since many of the improvements are aimed at weight reduction.. Analog to solid state.. smaller but equally powerful servos...etc

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## The SC

Some say it is a long range ballistic missile so it is at least 5500km range.
Others say it is Medium range so it is up to 4500km 
Some say it is just an improvement over Shaheen 1 and the range is around 750 km

So no one's guess is better.


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## SEAL

We haven't test fire our ICBM yet but you can see the frustration of bhrati's

Nice upgrade over Shaheen-1 you can see the difference in the launch of old shaheen and 1A, maybe Shaheen-1A is testbed for various advanced technologies use in ICBM.


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## DMLA

&#7716;ashsh&#257;sh&#299;n;2866844 said:


> lol why are Indians getting happy that it's only 1500 KM range? 1500km is more than enough to reach ALL of India...



While I am not exactly sure how or why the "Indians" are happy, the proliferation of long range missiles into Pakistan will lead to problems for our fledgeling BMD capabilities. The phase 1 of Indian BMD is meant for missiles upto 2000 Km in range and cannot target RV's with higher re-entry velocities. If Pakistan develops missiles with very long ranges, we will again have a 5-7 year cycle before Phase II of Indian BMD kicks in.


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## regular

Zarvan said:


> The name which ISPR used is Shaheen 1A so autmatically means it is upgraded form of Shaheen 1A but still can't understand what is the point of hiding the range of the missile which Pakistan has never done before


cuz we don't want to offend the Israel and the West......


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## Mansukh.singh

The SC said:


> Some say it a long range ballistic missile so it is at least 5500km range.
> Others day it Medium range so it is up to 4500km
> Some say it just an improvement over Shaheen 1 and the range is around 750 km
> 
> So no one's guess is better.



Do you ever heard of single stage missile having range like 4000 or 5000km ?

Even your shaheen 2 is two stage whose range is 2500Km.

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## Edevelop

> The exact range of the missile was also not revealed, but retired General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told AFP it would be able to hit targets up to 2500km to 3000km away - putting arch-rival India well within reach.



I think this must be a medium range.


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## Mansukh.singh

cb4 said:


> I think this must be a medium range.



True ! it is Medium range ballistic missile or MRBM.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

*Stick to the topic please.*

For those arguing that Pakistani missiles are essentially North Korean knock-offs, Pakistan's missile tests actually work, whereas those by the North Koreans do not ...

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## H.A.W.K

Any pic or video would be nice..


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## The SC

Mansukh.singh said:


> Do you ever heard of single stage missile having range like 4000 or 5000km ?
> 
> Even your shaheen 2 is two stage whose range is 2500Km.



Do you know something more than anyone else in this forum about the Shaheen-1A ? be it a single, double or three stage ballistic missile is anyone's guess for the moment.

This is what I have said:

Some say it is a long range ballistic missile so it is at least 5500km range.
Others say it is Medium range so it is up to 4500km
Some say it is just an improvement over Shaheen 1 and the range is around 750 km


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## humanfirst

regular said:


> Mr. Zarvan is telling the truth ..The missile falls in the 5000km category.......checkout ure sattelite recordingz on ure remote sensor sattelites if U have any on the Indian Oceanz or get some help from USA, Israel etc...they might give U the real data of our Missile test.......


If you dont have enough knowledge of missiles please ask military professionals in this forum whether there is any chance of a single stage missile being able to reach 4500 km range(remember your 2 staged shaheen 2 is of range 2500km).
By the way every major nations must have monitored the test and if it was indeed a 5000km range missile then it would only benifit them(especially us)to exaggerate and sensationalize the threat level(PAKISTAN TESTS THE MISSILE THAT CAN REACH EUROPE..!!!).There were no response from any nations so far.


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## Desert Fox

arsalanaslam123 said:


> *Pakistan successfully test fires Hatf 4 Shaheen-I Alpha missile*
> _By Mudasser Aziz - Apr 25th, 2012_Islamabad: Pakistan on Wednesday successfully test-fired a medium-range ballistic missile Hatf-4 Shaheen-1 Alpha, the Inter Services Public Relation (ISPR) said.
> 
> The ISPR said that the Strategic Missile Group had launched the Shaheen-1 Alpha missile on Wednesday from an undisclosed *location while its target was in sea*.
> 
> &#8220;The scientists have improved the range and technical parameters of the missile while it is also capable of carrying nuclear warhead,&#8221; the ISPR said.
> 
> It may be recalled that the Shaheen-1 Ballistic Missile System, with a range of 700 kms, is an operationalised weapon system held by the ASFC and is routinely fired during training exercises by the troops of the ASFC.
> 
> *The missile test was aimed at a target at sea.* The ISPR said the new design implemented "*improvements in range and technical parameters*". General Khalid Kidwai, the director general of the Pakistan army's Strategic Plans Division, witnessed the test, saying "*the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities*", according to the ISPR statement.
> 
> President of Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani have also congratulated the scientists on successful launch of the missile.



Was this a Carrier Killer Missile?

I can't see no other reason why they would test it against Target at Sea unless its a Carrier killer.


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## Mansukh.singh

The SC said:


> Do you know something more than anyone else in this forum about the Shaheen-1A ? be it a single, double or three stage ballistic missile is anyone's guess for the moment.



It is single stage solid fuelled rocket.

See your self video posted on Dawn news site.



Desert Fox said:


> Was this a Carrier Killer Missile?
> 
> I can't see no other reason why they would test it against Target at Sea unless its a Carrier killer.



Hold your horses mate !

Do you any anti-ship missile developed ? then come to me with carrier killer missile.

India always test missile in the sea. By your logic India already has killer missiles from 90's.


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## Safriz



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## Saifullah Sani

Defence experts say that while* the exact range of the Pakistani missile has not been revealed*, it is capable of hitting targets up to 2,500 to 3,000km (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away
BBC News - Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable ballistic missile


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## Safriz



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## Desert Fox

arsalanaslam123 said:


> NDTV Reporting:
> *Video Link*
> [video]http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/news/fromndtv/230297[/video]


 
Again indian media reporters are stating its a "Long Range Missile", these people intentionally spread false info to confuse the audience. Very unprofessional!


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## The SC

The other logical possibility is that it is an ABM missile with a nuclear capable warhead.


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## Desert Fox

Mansukh.singh said:


> It is single stage solid fuelled rocket.
> 
> See your self video posted on Dawn news site.
> 
> 
> 
> Hold your horses mate !
> 
> Do you any anti-ship missile developed ? then come to me with carrier killer missile.
> 
> India always test missile in the sea. By your logic India already has killer missiles from 90's.



Dude, relax your indian behind, i just asked a question! Pakistan has never tested BM's in the Sea before this test AFAIK.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

humanfirst said:


> If you dont have enough knowledge of missiles please ask military professionals in this forum whether there is any chance of a single stage missile being able to reach 4500 km range(remember your 2 staged shaheen 2 is of range 2500km).
> By the way every major nations must have monitored the test and if it was indeed a 5000km range missile then it would only benifit them(especially us)to exaggerate and sensationalize the threat level(PAKISTAN TESTS THE MISSILE THAT CAN REACH EUROPE..!!!).There were no response from any nations so far.


The old Chinese DF-3A missiles reportedly had a range of 2,800KM to 4,000KM and were single stage ballistic missiles ...

DF-3A - China Nuclear Forces

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## ashokdeiva

Desert Fox said:


> Again indian media reporters are stating its a "Long Range Missile", these people intentionally spread false info to confuse the audience. Very unprofessional!


why does not PA reveal the range and tell the world what they have in thier pocket rahter than allowing speculation to go gaga.
I think they are enjoying this seculation and if true the PA officers who knew the data might even be here in PDF just enjoying what both Pakistanis and INDIANS have to guess on the range of this missile.


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## The SC

> It is single stage solid fuelled rocket.
> 
> See your self video posted on Dawn news site.



I saw different videos before I stated that it was unclear to discuss the issue for now.


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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> The old Chinese DF-3A missiles reportedly had a range of 2,800KM to 4,000KM and were single stage ballistic missiles ...
> 
> DF-3A - China Nuclear Forces



*The DF-3A is a Chinese liquid-fueled, single-stage, medium-range nuclear ballistic missile that entered service in 1971. DF-3A is the oldest missile in China's inventory and is nearing retirement after four decades of service*

DF 3A is missile of 60's-70's. When rocket technology of China was not advanced.

Do you think Pakistan's technology is four decade old ?

Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Rafi

*An intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) is a ballistic missile with a range of 3,0005,500 km (1,8653,420 miles), between a medium-range ballistic missile and an intercontinental ballistic missile. Classifying ballistic missiles by range is done mostly for convenience, in principle there is very little difference between a low-performance ICBM and a high-performance IRBM. *

Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

*Press Release	
No PR98/2012-ISPR	Dated: April 25, 2012
Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012: 
Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads. 
Todays launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers. 
DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistans deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism. *

:: ISPR :: Inter Services Public Relations - PAKISTAN

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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> *The DF-3A is a Chinese liquid-fueled, single-stage, medium-range nuclear ballistic missile that entered service in 1971. DF-3A is the oldest missile in China's inventory and is nearing retirement after four decades of service*
> 
> DF 3A is missile of 60's-70's. When rocket technology of China was not advanced.
> 
> Do you think Pakistan's technology is four decade old ?


I am merely giving you an example of a single stage ballistic missile with a range between 2,800km and 4,000km in response to repeated questions about such a missile.

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## Rafi

*An intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) is a ballistic missile with a range of 3,000&#8211;5,500 km (1,865&#8211;3,420 miles), between a medium-range ballistic missile and an intercontinental ballistic missile. Classifying ballistic missiles by range is done mostly for convenience, in principle there is very little difference between a low-performance ICBM and a high-performance IRBM. *

Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

*Press Release	
No PR98/2012-ISPR	Dated: April 25, 2012
Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012: 
Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads. 
Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers. 
DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism. *

:: ISPR :: Inter Services Public Relations - PAKISTAN


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## saiyan0321

well range or no range i like that it has better tech and better accuracy i am still waiting in these 5 days to see if anything else will happen


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## Gessler

Rafi said:


> *An intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) is a ballistic missile with a range of 3,000&#8211;5,500 km (1,865&#8211;3,420 miles), between a medium-range ballistic missile and an intercontinental ballistic missile. Classifying ballistic missiles by range is done mostly for convenience, in principle there is very little difference between a low-performance ICBM and a high-performance IRBM. *
> 
> Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> *Press Release
> No PR98/2012-ISPR	Dated: April 25, 2012
> Rawalpindi - April 25, 2012:
> Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate Range Ballistic Missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A Weapon System. The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads.
> Today&#8217;s launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R), Chairman NESCOM Mr Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.
> DG SPD Lieutenant General Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (R) congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen 1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism. *
> 
> :: ISPR :: Inter Services Public Relations - PAKISTAN



How do they know that Shaheen-1a is an IRBM when they dont specify the range?

If it was true that 4000+km figure, a furroar must've been raised in the west by now.


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## Mansukh.singh

@Rafi,

Agni 5 is an ICBM, and true ICBM has range from 8000km-14000km.

So by your logic Agni 5 has range of 14000Km. Right.


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## saiyan0321

> Agni 5 is an ICBM, and true ICBM has range from 8000km-14000km.
> 
> So by your logic Agni 5 has range of 14000Km. Right.



ok from 3500 to 4500 km an intermediate missile goes from 5500 km upward is an icbm


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## Mansukh.singh

Every forces has own classification of Missile .

Russia don't call their IRBM as IRBM but MRBM.

But USA has two separate classification. IRBM and MRBM.


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## saiyan0321

> You too think , it's range is 4000Km ?



he just gave you ur answer that a missile can be of over 2500 to 4000 having a single rocket. what more do you want? so far the range is not specified so people cant answer

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## Rafi

According to ISPR - the missile is an Intermediate Range Ballistic Missile, which has a range of between 3,000 to 5,000 km.

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## Peaceful Civilian

Well, i think, we don't Need ICBM, Whole India is already in range, Israel is no more enemy Nor a friend. Even if we test ICBM, this is huge waste of money. 600 million dollar for one Long range Missile, Instead of 3 Long Range Missile, we can easily get/produce 1 nuclear powered submarine which possess huge threat from any water in the world..


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## Mansukh.singh

saiyan0321 said:


> he just gave you ur answer that a missile can be of over 2500 to 4000 having a single rocket. what more do you want? so far the range is not specified so people cant answer



Dude, look at picture of DF-3A, it is more mammoth than Agni 5.

Earlier rocket technology were inefficient.

that's why DF-3A is replaced by DF 21.

I add proviso: No single stage modern missile can have such a range.


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## saiyan0321

> Well, i think, we don't Need ICBM, Whole India is already in range, Israel is no more enemy Nor a friend. Even if we test ICBM, this is huge waste of money. 600 million dollar for one Long range Missile, Instead of 3 Long Range Missile, we can easily get/produce 1 nuclear powered submarine which possess huge threat from any water in the world..



i say have them but dont test it you never know who can be ur enemy wise to have an ace


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## Mercenary

Our Nuclear Missiles are only aimed at India.

Where as India has to divide its forces between China, Pakistan and maybe even Bangladesh.


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## Mansukh.singh

Calling a missile an IRBM does not mean it has range of 3000Km.

Even Shaheen 2 has range of 2500 which is two stage.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> You too think , it's range is 4000Km ?


I didn't make any comments about the range of the tested missile, I merely answered a question about Single Stage Ballistic missiles with a range greater than 2,500KM.


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## Mansukh.singh

Mercenary said:


> Our Nuclear Missiles are only aimed at India.
> 
> Where as India has to divide its forces between China, Pakistan and maybe even Bangladesh.



why stopped at bangladesh ... roll on .. Nepal ,srilanka , Maldivies.. Moon,Mars


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## Mercenary

Mansukh.singh said:


> Calling a missile an IRBM does not mean it has range of 3000Km.
> 
> Even Shaheen 2 has range of 2500 which is two stage.



The Shaheen 1-A missile is not an ICBM in the conventional sense. But that doesn't matter. USA made missiles to target the Soviets half a world away.

India is right next door to us. So our mission has been accomplished. The missile was tested and performed according to expectations.

So this missile is a new headache that India has to deal with. 



Mansukh.singh said:


> why stopped at bangladesh ... roll on .. Nepal ,srilanka , Maldivies.. Moon,Mars



Bro, there are border clashes everyday with Bangladesh and India can't even win those.


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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> I didn't make any comments about the range of the tested missile, I merely answered a question about Single Stage Ballistic missiles with a range greater than 2,500KM.



Ok , that was my question .. What your informed opinion says ?
What will be the range of Shaheen 1A?


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## saiyan0321

have the airlines started again. i think pakistan will tell india that tests are done and they could go back to the routes if it hasnt then there would be more tests


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## Mercenary

saiyan0321 said:


> military could be
> missiles thats over kill for bangladesh



Maybe I went overboard with India using Missiles in a war with Bangladesh


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## saiyan0321

ok so,ebody has to come up wuth a range some say its over 3500km others say 750km well one thing is sure accuracy and technology has been worked on and is great plus speed also


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> Dude, look at picture of DF-3A, it is more mammoth than Agni 5.
> 
> Earlier rocket technology were inefficient.


Which would imply that modern rocket technology could provide similar ranges in a smaller package ...

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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> What will be the range of Shaheen 1A?


Ask the concerned entities ...

I don't think it is possible to provide an 'informed opinion' based on the publicly available data regarding the recent missile test.

At best one might be able to estimate the size of the missile by coming up with an average height of the nearby streetlights etc. and comparing it to the missile size ....


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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Which would imply that modern rocket technology could provide similar ranges in a smaller package ...



Then your Shaheen 2(double stage) is grossly inefficient which has range of 2500km.

even One stage shaheen 1A (4000Km) can wonders why needs shaheen 2.


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## darkinsky

i think it has a surprisingly long range and that whymilitary is declining to tell its range

or why would it hide if it had range of 100 or even 2000, we have already tested till 3000


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## saiyan0321

> Pakistan Army intentionally didn't disclose the range.
> 
> Because Shaheen 1A was not the answer pakistani were seeking from launch of Agni 5.
> 
> They just make people confused.
> 
> There is old saying "If you can not convince people then confuse them"



why do you keep saying the army is trying to confuse us. the best part is the media is more involved in gilani case and increases in electricity prices. this missile test and yours didnt stir anything bcz a certain somebody has made our lives a living hell and we dont care if you test a 30000km missile when things will be ok then we will start caring


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> Then your Shaheen 2(double stage) is grossly inefficient which has range of 2500km.
> 
> even One stage shaheen 1A (4000Km) can wonders why needs shaheen 2.


I said nothing about ranges so why do you keep asking me about them? I merely answered your questions and made some points regarding missile technology improving over time. The rest is merely you trying to troll and put words in peoples mouths.

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## Mansukh.singh

saiyan0321 said:


> why do you keep saying the army is trying to confuse us. the best part is the media is more involved in gilani case and increases in electricity prices. this missile test and yours didnt stir anything bcz a certain somebody has made our lives a living hell and we dont care if you test a 30000km missile when things will be ok then we will start caring



Look at the start of thread. when people dissappointed with mere 750Km range.

Whole range of discussion liven up by Gen(retd) Talat Masood observation.



AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> I said nothing about ranges so why do you keep asking me about them? I merely answered your questions and made some points regarding missile technology improving over time. The rest is merely you trying to troll and put words in peoples mouths.



I can give credible Source but that is Indian Newspaper.
But that is futile in PDF.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> Look at the start of thread. when people dissappointed with mere 750Km range.
> 
> Whole range of discussion liven up by Gen(retd) Talat Masood observation.


If the Army really wanted to create a lot of hoopla about a test (long range or otherwise) it would have announced it publicly days/weeks in advance and trumpeted it on the national media.

Instead, the only reason anyone even knew Pakistan was conducting a missile test was because someone in the Indian government leaked the information to the Indian media, which was then picked up by some Pakistani media outlets, and even then it did not make the front page news.

Your theory therefore falls flat given the manner in which the test was conducted.

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## saiyan0321

> I can give credible Source but that is Indian Newspaper.
> But that is futile in PDF.



i can give you credible sources that both say 750 and 3500 its useless to talk about range since it has not been revealed so i say quit talking about it and he never asked you for sources nor for range even he says its futile to talk about it and buddy if you think pdf is so biased then you can always go to BR.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> I can give credible Source but that is Indian Newspaper.
> But that is futile in PDF.


What does a 'credible source in an Indian Newspaper' have to do with my comments?

You asked a question, it got answered, you then indicated the answer referred to decades old technology, in response to which I pointed out that technological improvements over time would improve range/reduce size. 

What exactly do you disagree with above?

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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> If the Army really wanted to create a lot of hoopla about a test (long range or otherwise) it would have announced it publicly days/weeks in advance and trumpeted it on the national media.
> 
> Instead, the only reason anyone even knew Pakistan was conducting a missile test was because someone in the Indian government leaked the information to the Indian media, which was then picked up by some Pakistani media outlets, and even then it did not make the front page news.
> 
> Your theory therefore falls flat given the manner in which the test was conducted.



No Sir, that is not case always. All Fingers are not same. 

Every Indian Media is not like ToiLet newspaper. 

That's why I said, I can give credible source.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> No Sir, that is not case always. All Fingers are not same.
> 
> Every Indian Media is not like ToiLet newspaper.
> 
> That's why I said, I can give credible source.


Are you even reading my posts, because your responses are making no sense ...

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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> What does a 'credible source in an Indian Newspaper' have to do with my comments?
> 
> You asked a question, it got answered, you then indicated the answer referred to decades old technology, in response to which I pointed out that technological improvements over time would improve range/reduce size.
> 
> What exactly do you disagree with above?



It is shaheen 1 vs Shaheen 2. that is point of disagreement.

Pakistan has tested shaheen 2 (two stage) back in 2008(Shaheen 2 is not obsolete). but range was 2500Km.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> It is shaheen 1 vs Shaheen 2. that is point of disagreement.
> 
> Pakistan has tested shaheen 2 (two stage) back in 2008(Shaheen 2 is not obsolete). but range was 2500Km.


Sure, but that does not mean that there can be no developments on new designs ... 

A new design would have to be tested, validated and then eventually deployed, if it fit into the ASFC doctrine.

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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Sure, but that does not mean that there can be no developments on new designs ...
> 
> A new design would have to be tested, validated and then eventually deployed, if it fit into the ASFC doctrine.



Sorry but, It was not new design but modified Shaheen 1 which has a range of 750Km.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> Sorry but, It was not new design but modified Shaheen 1 which has a range of 750Km.


Sure, and the question pretty much revolves around 'how modified' - what were the improvements in range, guidance, weight, warhead etc.


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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Sure, and the question pretty much revolves around 'how modified' - what were the improvements in range, guidance, weight, warhead etc.



then Also, It is indeed an modification not a new design.

It's performance enhancing modifications not a new concept altogether.

Even Pakistan media is not enthusiastic about it, they are doing interview with a serial killer.


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## SHAMK9

Mansukh.singh said:


> Sorry but, It was not new design but modified Shaheen 1 which has a range of 750Km.


Cool, awesome, great, why does this concerns you again?

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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> then Also, It is indeed an modification not a new design.


Modifications can involve design refinements of various sub-systems that comprise the overall system (the ballistic missile in this case) - the guidance system, propellant, rocket motors, structure, warhead, launch vehicle etc. all make up the larger system, and 'new designs/modifications' can be incorporated in all or some of the sub-systems that might improve the performance of some/many/all aspects of the the Ballistic Missile System.

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## darkinsky

maybe pakistan had too much shaheen in its arsenal and decided to improve its ability, but still why is the range being kept so secret, is it because of US knows it can jump on its seat??


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## mjnaushad

Mansukh.singh said:


> then Also, It is indeed an modification not a new design.
> 
> It's performance enhancing modifications not a new concept altogether.
> 
> Even Pakistan media is not enthusiastic about it, they are doing interview with a *serial killer*.



Care to explain?


----------



## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Modifications can involve design refinements of various sub-systems that comprise the overall system (the ballistic missile in this case) - the guidance system, propellant, rocket motors, structure, warhead, launch vehicle etc. all make up the larger system, and 'new designs/modifications' can be incorporated in all or some of the sub-systems that might improve the performance of some/many/all aspects of the the Ballistic Missile System.



Performance enhancement contains a question .. what was it's performance? range is one them, other are navigation system,size and weight reduction and air drag reduction.

But core feature remain same .. it is the single stage solid fuelled rocket with minor (250Km) enhancement in range.



mjnaushad said:


> Care to explain?



Watch tonight with Jasmine programme.


----------



## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> it is the single stage solid fuelled rocket with minor (250Km) enhancement in range.


Perhaps, but we don't really know what the range improvement, if any, is.


----------



## BLACKEAGLE

Pakistan successfully test-fired a medium-range missiles with a range of coverage in India






BEIJING, April 25, Dow Jones News, Pakistan&#8217;s military said Pakistan successfully test-fired a medium-range missiles can carry nuclear warheads, the missile range has not yet disclosed.
a retired military analysts have told AFP that the Pakistani military&#8217;s test-firing missiles can hit a target beyond the 2500-3000 km. It is reported that this missile has a range up to the Indian territory.
previously reported that the notice in India Pakistan in the evening of the 23rd may at any time in the 24 to 29 day test-firing missiles, and the Indian civil aviation sector commercial flights to avoid the relevant regional As a result, this time from India flight to fly to the Persian Gulf countries will have to cancel or select other flight routes.
According to another report, local time on April 19, India from the eastern Wheeler Island, the first test independently developed a range of over 5000 km and can carry nuclear warheads fire -5 range ballistic missiles. Agni-5 missile is India&#8217;s longest-range, flight speed of the fastest missile. Indian officials predict that the, -5 missile Agni are needed 4-5 times a test-firing is expected in 2014 or 2015 service.

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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Perhaps, but we don't really know what the range improvement, if any, is.



Sir, Look this news created no discussion in programmes ..........not in Indian media not in Western Media not even Pakistan media.

May be you asking too much from Shaheen 1.


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## Mansukh.singh

BLACKEAGLE said:


> a retired military analysts have told AFP that the Pakistani military&#8217;s test-firing missiles can hit a target beyond the 2500-3000 km.



Whole discussion is caused by Gen(retd.) Talat Mashood who once said Ra'ad ALCM is "ground launched".


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## mjnaushad

Mansukh.singh said:


> Sir, Look this news created no discussion in programmes ..........not in Indian media not in Western Media not even Pakistan media.
> 
> May be you asking too much from Shaheen 1.



Let me give you example of whatever we do the discussion will be in Indian media "they got the technology from China". Infact there is a NDTV link few pages back in which a so called analyst is taking "wisdom" about this news. So what Indian media say we dont care, Our media is busy on other things and as our military development are mostly classified they really dont have anything to talk about.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

Mansukh.singh said:


> Sir, Look this news created no discussion in programmes ..........not in Indian media not in Western Media not even Pakistan media.
> 
> May be you asking too much from Shaheen 1.



Discussions in the media, or lack of, imply nothing.

I am merely pointing out that that it is certainly possible that the Pakistani missile recently tested had a significant improvement in range, among other improvements - whether that is the case or not we simply cannot say given the paucity of publicly available information. We will just have to wait and see.


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## mjnaushad

Mansukh.singh said:


> then Also, It is indeed an modification not a new design.
> 
> It's performance enhancing modifications not a new concept altogether.
> 
> Even Pakistan media is not enthusiastic about it, *they are doing interview with a serial killer.*





*Seriously? HOW IS THAT EVEN CLOSELY RELATED TO THIS TOPIC???????? JEEZ INDIANS*

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## Mansukh.singh

mjnaushad said:


> Let me give you example of whatever we do the discussion will be in Indian media "they got the technology from China". Infact there is a NDTV link few pages back in which a so called analyst is taking "wisdom" about this news. So what Indian media say we dont care, Our media is busy on other things and as our military development are mostly classified they really dont have anything to talk about.



Dude, I don't care if missile technology is attained by self or beg,borrow or steel.

As long as Missile fire at time, It is a concern for Enemy.

BTW:It is not only Indian media but some elements of Pak Media like Najir Naji or Najam Sethi has argued that missile technology was externally influenced.


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## Areesh

mjnaushad said:


> Even i dont watch Jasmine's program.... She keep screaming the whole 55 mins..... Kinda like India TV anchors and their funny news...



Actually I did watched her program today. It was about an arrested serial killer who was killing women in Karachi. Looks like people on the eastern side are so obsessed with our country that they regularly watch our TV programs too. 

I regularly interact with Indians here but I am yet to watch an Indian news channel program completely.

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## mjnaushad

Areesh said:


> Actually I did watched her program today. It was about an arrested serial killer who was killing women in Karachi. Looks like people on the eastern side are so obsessed with our country that they regularly watch our TV programs too.
> 
> I regularly interact with Indians here but I am yet to watch an Indian news channel program completely.



The thing is what is that have to do with missile program..... Whats the link????


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## Mansukh.singh

AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> Discussions in the media, or lack of, imply nothing.
> 
> I am merely pointing out that that it is certainly possible that the Pakistani missile recently tested had a significant improvement in range, among other improvements - whether that is the case or not we simply cannot say given the paucity of publicly available information. We will just have to wait and see.



Sir , I'm just giving you a idea of 'How much modified'.

If it really a technological breakthrough then it would have been concern for Indian Media at least. 

Shaheen 1A created no fuss at all but some perceived 'long range ' missile created uproar in media.



Areesh said:


> Actually I did watched her program today. It was about an arrested serial killer who was killing women in Karachi. Looks like people on the eastern side are so obsessed with our country that they regularly watch our TV programs too.
> 
> I regularly interact with Indians here but I am yet to watch an Indian news channel program completely.



I too watch never watch her show .. or anyother show ... I just see Najam Show on diplomacy not local politics.

If Indian people is obsessed with Pak programmes then Pak can gain lot from MFN status. although Offtopic.


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## mjnaushad

Mansukh.singh said:


> Dude, I don't care if missile technology is attained by self or beg,borrow or steel.
> 
> As long as Missile fire at time, It is a concern for Enemy.
> 
> BTW:It is not only Indian media but some elements of Pak Media like *Najir Naji or Najam Sethi* has argued that missile technology was externally influenced.



We accept difference of opinion (which is not the case on other side of the border) but let be sure its OPINION not fact but for my Indian friends if a opinion suites there needs its a fact for them... Its old self satisfying habbit of Indian media... Indian media cant stand the idea that Pakistan have the ability to build military equipment thats why they just as you say us Living in a dream.... BTW its Nazir Not Najir.


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## darkinsky

Areesh said:


> Actually I did watched her program today. It was about an arrested serial killer who was killing women in Karachi. Looks like people on the eastern side are so obsessed with our country that they regularly watch our TV programs too.
> 
> I regularly interact with Indians here but I am yet to watch an Indian news channel program completely.



it seems they stick onto the screens and watch our political programs even more than we do 

such is the height and paranoia of obsession

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## Mansukh.singh

darkinsky said:


> it seems they stick onto the screens and watch our political programs even more than we do
> 
> such is the height and paranoia of obsession


If it is so then..
It should be welcomed by you .
Increasing your softpower. 
Increasing acceptance of pakistan's point of view.

what is the problem?


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## darkinsky

Mansukh.singh said:


> If it is so then..
> It should be welcomed by you .
> Increasing your softpower.
> Increasing acceptance of pakistan's point of view.
> 
> what is the problem?



pakistan soft powerwith these political shows, you are kidding right ,most of them need to grow up


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## MilSpec

Congratulations to all pakistani members, Successful testing of any missile platform is a great achievement for the engineers and scientists of your nation. 

It would have been nicer to understand more about the improvements, but I can understand if they are not disclosed for national security purposes. Both India and pakistan have achieved big milestones in propulsion technology and are racing ahead further. Next step for pakistan would be to start developing SLV's. Congrats again!

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## Areesh

mjnaushad said:


> The thing is what is that have to do with missile program..... Whats the link????



He is just trying to say since Jasmeen or any other Pakistani media anchor didn't talk about Shaheen 1A so it has nothing new in it.


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## Mansukh.singh

darkinsky said:


> pakistan soft powerwith these political shows, you are kidding right ,most of them need to grow up



Man, It change a lot of perceptive regarding Pakistan.

How does an ordinary Indian(Aam Admi) know about Pakistan ? Newspaper (All bomb blasts and coup) ,same for Indian e-Media.

If Indian people obsessed with Pak programmes then they got aware about Pak problems and pak view of the world.

Man! I was amazed by listening same Muhawara and old saying in Pakistan Media. 
Sometime I think that we (India and Pakistan)are the real brothers. 

Do you think it is possible if we continue to watch Indian media programmes ? No.

If some are obsessed than it is good for Pakistan.


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## SBD-3

Asim Aquil said:


> You need to improve Ballistic missiles since they are very hard to shoot down due to their speed. Improve accuracy, range and of course MIRV capability is still pending.
> 
> Improvements have to be shown.


I think Shaheen Already has MIRV capability


> Hamid Mir: Now if we talk of missiles, you have told us something about Ghaznavi, what is Shaheen, you have now fired Shaheen-II also?
> Samar: Shaheen-II is the front line missile of the entire family of missiles being made Pakistan, starting from Hatf-I to Abdali, to Ghaznavi to Shaheen-I version I and Shaheen-I version II to this Shaheen-II. Shaheen-II is a solid fuelled missile, it is a very big missile and weighs 25 tons and consists of two-stages. It has a rocket motor which activates when the missile lifts off which takes the missile to a height of 25 kms after which the rocket motor of second stage is activated and the first stage rocket motor separates at this stage. Then the second stage motor takes the missile to a height of 130 kms and after this its re-entry vehicle which includes the warhead and terminal guidance and control system, this is known as re-entry vehicle, this is then separated from the second stage motor which then takes it forward and after making very accurate corrections takes the missile to a height of 600 kms in orbit after which the missile is brought down and it enters the atmosphere and hits the target.
> Pakistan Military Consortium :: www.PakDef.info


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## Hulk

hasnain0099 said:


> I think Shaheen Already has MIRV capability


 
Yeah you can get any capability without testing it.



AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> *Stick to the topic please.*
> 
> For those arguing that Pakistani missiles are essentially North Korean knock-offs, Pakistan's missile tests actually work, whereas those by the North Koreans do not ...



North Korea and China. There was a thread opened by a Pakistani which listed details of each missile. None of you said that info is false.


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## dilpakistani

I don't know why few people are so over hyped here.... Nothing out of this world is demonstrated today... it was just Shaheen 1 with may be 1-2 hundred kilometers of more range....your over hyped illogical comments make us all look stupid .... If you don't know about this subject then you shouldn't comment ...


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## SBD-3

indianrabbit said:


> Yeah you can get any capability without testing it.
> 
> 
> 
> North Korea and China. There was a thread opened by a Pakistani which listed details of each missile. None of you said that info is false.


Before opening your mouth with closed eyes, I have provided the link below.........


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## Sugarcane

dilpakistani said:


> I don't know why few people are so over hyped here.... Nothing out of this world is demonstrated today... it was just Shaheen 1 with may be 1-2 hundred kilometers of more range....your over hyped illogical comments make us all look stupid .... If you don't know about this subject then you shouldn't comment ...



Aoo G - Ap ke kami thi

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## Hulk

Breaking News : Pakistan successfully tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile - YouTube


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## Abu Zolfiqar

AbhijitSingh said:


> wasnt Hatf IV tested in 2008 ??



this is a modified variant of the Shaheen-1 missile, with improved range & payload



AgNoStIc MuSliM said:


> *Stick to the topic please.*
> 
> For* those* arguing that Pakistani missiles are essentially North Korean knock-offs, Pakistan's missile tests actually work, whereas those by the North Koreans do not ...




"those" are the ones that claim that india's nuclear program since inception was peaceful and non-aggressive but Pakistan's nuclear program (whose weaponization was only that of 'last resort' and purely a RESPONSE) is aggressive and a threat to world peace


NoKo launches a FAILED ICBM and the world condemns. Barely a week later india launches the Agni and the US State Dept. and other watchful 'enthusiastics' remain deaf and dumb



so basically, Zain bhai --- why should we give a damn-and-a-half for "those"

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## 70cc F-16 block 90

Abu Zolfiqar said:


> this is a modified variant of the Shaheen-1 missile, with improved range & payload
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "those" are the ones that claim that india's nuclear program since inception was peaceful and non-aggressive but Pakistan's nuclear program (whose weaponization was only that of 'last resort' and purely a RESPONSE) is aggressive and a threat to world peace
> 
> 
> NoKo launches a FAILED ICBM and the world condemns. Barely a week later india launches the Agni and the US State Dept. and other watchful 'enthusiastics' remain deaf and dumb
> 
> 
> 
> so basically, Zain bhai --- why should we give a damn-and-a-half for "those"



sir when will Pakistan test fire the ICBM?and also why dosent Pakistan makes high definition videos of the launch....considering camcorders are pretty cheap these day.


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## AgNoStiC MuSliM

indianrabbit said:


> North Korea and China. There was a thread opened by a Pakistani which listed details of each missile. None of you said that info is false.


So now every one of us is expected to read every possible thread that has XYZ information that you think supports your argument?

Don't make ludicrous arguments for point scoring.

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## Edevelop



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## Roybot

^^^

Looks shopped.


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## Edevelop

Roybot said:


> ^^^
> 
> Looks shopped.



Its taken from a good quality camera.

Pakistan test-fires nuclear missile | News | National Post

This is what it said under the pic:

"HO/AFP/Getty Imagesge..."


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## shuttler

*Congratulations!*

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## Juice

darkinsky said:


> test same missile and we all thought it would be ICBM, its not even 1000
> 
> waste of time and thoughts
> 
> andof course public money



Tactical missles are better suited to Pakistan's needs and situation, destroying cities may feel good but would help little given lack of strategic depth and even make the fighting more costly (killing a guy's wife and kids tends to fanaticize them)

(PS...haven't read the whole post, but it looks similar to a scud, same family tree perhaps?)


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## RayKalm

Someone edit this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaheen-1A


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## Thorough Pro

Why most of the Pakistani members are obsessed with range? I simply fail to understand the logic of having a missile with 2500+K range when the major enemy targets are within this range and covered by various missiles.

Reminds me of a story, Therre is a master swordsman who teaches the art to an arrogant prince, after two years of training the prince who now think he has become the master challenges his teacher for a duel. Teacher advises him that he still needs a lot to learn, but the prince being a prince, insists that he has become a better swordman than the teacher and insists for a martch. Teacher accepts the challenge and next morning places an order for a new 4 foot long sword (instead of the standard three foot long) to the best sword maker in town. 

Prince's spys tell him about the four foot long sword, prince trying to outsmart the teacher orders a five foot long sword. On the big day they both come to the town center for the match. When the match start, teacher easily pulls out his three foot long sword from a four foot long sheath, but the prince couldnt pull out his five foot long sword from its five foot long sheath.... I think you get the picture 

All those who think the test was a failure / waste of time and money have no clue about missile testing, missile testing is not limited to "range" only. Quite possible the test was conducted to test Chinese GPS system, or a new fuel type for higher speed/ efficiency, may be they just test fired a five year old missile to test the fuel/equipment life. May be they tested its resistance against some counter measures. there could be thousand different things. But Pakistani members being the typical Pakistani members would first create a super hype themselves and then get disappointed and then start bashing every institution and government offical, the only thing they should really be bashing is themselves.

I would only request them to please grow up, don;t build castels in the air, be realistic and respectful. Don't make fun fo your selves.

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## Kiss_of_the_Dragon

Congratulations  my Paksitani Friends...when you guys go the write an article about "this Indian centric missle"?  remember to sent me a copy...

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## The Deterrent

Conceal Carry said:


> *All those who think the test was a failure / waste of time and money have no clue about missile testing, missile testing is not limited to "range" only. *Quite possible the test was conducted to test Chinese GPS system, or a *new fuel type for higher speed/ efficiency*. May be they tested its *resistance against some counter measures*. there could be thousand different things. But Pakistani members being the typical Pakistani members would first create a super hype themselves and then get disappointed and then start bashing every institution and government official, the only thing they should really be bashing is themselves.
> 
> I would only request them to please grow up, don;t build castles in the air, be realistic and respectful. Don't make fun of your selves.



Exactly my point...testing is not for the sake of "response" or "showing of" (not this type of testing). Every time, something new is tried.


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## shuntmaster

Which Indian cities can Shaheen-1A cover with 750Kms range? Can it reach Delhi or Mumbai?


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## v9s

shuntmaster said:


> Which Indian cities can Shaheen-1A cover with 750Kms range? Can it reach Delhi or Mumbai?



Are you dense or something? Shaheen I has a range of 750KM. Shaheen IA has an improved range, i.e. greater than 750KM.

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## kawaraj

v9s said:


> Are you dense or something? Shaheen I has a range of 750KM. Shaheen IA has an improved range, i.e. greater than 750KM.



don't mind him. the range is around 4000km, try to remember that number.

someone above mentioned the Chinese GPS, it's called Beidou system? Quite possible considering China's situation in South China Sea. it's a smart move into two angles, Chinese way of thinking.


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## AUz

shuntmaster said:


> *Which Indian cities can Shaheen-1A cover with 750Kms range?* Can it reach Delhi or Mumbai?




_*New Delhi* , *Mumbai* ,* Agra* , *Jaipur* , *Amritsar* , *Chandigarh* , *Indore* , *Ahmedabad* , and *Pune*_ to name a few 


Plus the actual range of Shaheen 1-A is more than 750 km . . . . So add many more cities in the above list.

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## The SC

Are you blind?
India tested an ICBM, Pakistan tested an ABM, since Pakistan goes most of the time for the most cost effective solution, that was the most reasonable and logical response.
600 million for an ICBM vs at most 6 million for a few ABMs for each Indian ICBM.
So you want to go bankrupt !?

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## shuntmaster

v9s said:


> Are you dense or something? Shaheen I has a range of 750KM. Shaheen IA has an improved range, i.e. greater than 750KM.



>750kms. means 750.0001Kms. to infinity range? May be Pakistan can target Andromeda galaxy with Shaheen-1A.


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## no_koadsheding_plz

where is the test video showing this missile hitting its target ?
why are it not shown?
so far i have failed miserably to see a video of it hitting its target . Please someone give me link to video iut hitting the target


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## RazPaK

no_koadsheding_plz said:


> where is the test video showing this missile hitting its target ?
> why are it not shown?
> so far i have failed miserably to see a video of it hitting its target . Please someone give me link to video iut hitting the target



PA is secretive and for very good reason. But let me assure you boy, there is no reason for you to doubt our military establishment. The best of the best are involved.

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## v9s

ISLAMABAD - Pakistan on Wednesday test-fired Medium-Range Ballistic Missile (MRBM) Shaheen I-A, the upgraded version of Shaheen I of Hatf IV series, having a reported range of 1,000 kilometres.

The sophisticated missile is capable of carrying both the nuclear and conventional combatant warheads simultaneously. The previous version Short-Range Ballistic Missile (SRBM) Shaheen-I has a range of 750 kilometres that can carry either nuclear or conventional warheads at a time.

&#8220;The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-I with improvements in range and technical parameters. It is capable of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads,&#8221; Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR) said.

According to sources in Strategic Plans Division (SPD), the approximately 10,000 kilogram heavy missile is equipped with carrying the nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg and conventional warheads between a weight range of 500-600 kg.

The missile test was purportedly conducted during early hours at an *undisclosed location somewhere near Nilor, a suburban town of Islamabad.*

*In addition, the Shaheen I-A primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version Shaheen-I having limited stealth features to avoid detections from Navigational Radar System (NRS).* The Shaheen I missile was reportedly installed at the Eastern border at regiment and battalion levels in 2003 during the tenure of General (R) Pervez Musharraf. Its deployment followed a series of successive and successful tests

Shaheen I-A is considered to be technologically and operationally superior than SRBM Ghaznavi I (300 km range approximately) and MRBM Ghauri I of Hatf V series. Despite having an optimal range of 1,500 km that is greater than that of Shaheen I-A range, Ghauri I lacks advanced fuelling features as characterised in Shaheen I and advanced refuelling features like those in Shaheen I-A that reduce fuel expenditure, pre-launch procedures and strategic costs. 

Another ballistic missile of Hatf IV series Shaheen II is known as the best of Pakistan&#8217;s all the ballistic missiles, having a range of 2,500 km and currently deployed at selective security installations. The three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen I-A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system.

The missile launch &#8220;whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division Lieutenant General (R) Khalid Ahmed Kidwai, Chairman NESCOM Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General Tariq Nadeem Gilani and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.

&#8220;DG SPD congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen I-A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan&#8217;s deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism,&#8221; the ISPR said.

Upgraded Hatf IV test-launched

Source: Upgraded Hatf IV test-fired | The Nation

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## Rafi

According to ISPR = the missile is an intermediate range ballistic missile. This would mean a considerably longer range.

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## A.Rafay



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## SHAMK9

shuntmaster said:


> >750kms. means 750.0001Kms. to infinity range? May be Pakistan can target Andromeda galaxy with Shaheen-1A.


 


A.Rafay said:


>


Daummmm the speed!!!!!! Watch that thing go


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## Zarvan

ashokdeiva said:


> Thanks for the reply Oscar.
> 
> that essentially means that the range is more or less the same as its predecessor with a little improvement of probably a 250 to 500 km extra range.
> Congrats to the Pakistanis on adding improvements to their defence systems.
> 
> Then I see MR ZARVAN quoting from his personal source of over 4000 km, which is fooling his country men.


Mr My source is from Forces but first they don't tell the speed officially and now ask people to focus on Alpha thing and in my knowledge no country has used such word for any of its Missile don't know why Pakistan is doing it


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## RazPaK

Dear lord, 

The bhartis are still jealous?

Bhartis you have your Agni V, masturbate to that rather than flaming this thread.

Thanks.

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## IceCold

The speed with which it took off, i think it would require max 3-5 mins to hit any target in India. This time leaves little to no time for an ABM system to successfully intercept an incoming missile.

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## Manas

v9s said:


> ISLAMABAD - Pakistan on Wednesday test-fired Medium-Range Ballistic Missile (MRBM) Shaheen I-A, the upgraded version of Shaheen I of Hatf IV series, having a reported range of 1,000 kilometres.
> 
> 
> Upgraded Hatf IV test-launched
> 
> Source: Upgraded Hatf IV test-fired | The Nation



So its 1000km range , not 4000km or from 2500-3000km . mystery solved. congratulation.


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## RazPaK

Manas said:


> So its 1000km range , not 4000km or from 2500-3000km . mystery solved. congratulation.



You will read higher and lower numbers, but until the military establishment releases the information, all this speculation is donkey ****.


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## Zarvan

RAWALPINDI: Displaying its prowess in the missile technology, Pakistan successfully test-fired a nuclear-capable intermediate-range surface-to-surface ballistic Hatf IV (Shaheen-1A) missile on Wednesday.

Fired from an undisclosed location, Pakistan carried out this successful test-fire almost a week following the Indian announcement of test-launch of 5,000-km range nuclear-capable Agni with Washington calling for "restraint" among nuclear powers.

"The missile is an improved version of Shaheen-1 with improvements in range and technical parameters, and having capability of carrying nuclear and conventional warheads," said an announcement of the ISPR following the successful test-fire by Pakistan. 

President Asif Ali Zardari and Prime Minister Syed Yusuf Raza Gilani congratulated the scientists working on the programme over the success of the missile test. Though the range and payload of this missile are not disclosed, but many say that Shaheen-1 is estimated to have a payload capacity of 1,000 kilograms and range of 750 kilometres. However, it can hit a target in much longer range.

Pakistan does have short, medium and long range missiles, and now it has launched an advance training programme for the special force which is responsible for the protection of these arsenals.

It is said that the launch, whose impact point was at sea, was witnessed by Director General Strategic Plans Division (SPD), Lieutenant General (R) Khalid Ahmed Kidwai (now on his 8th extension), Chairman NESCOM, Muhammad Irfan Burney, Commander Army Strategic Force Command Lieutenant General, Tariq Nadeem Gilani, and other senior military officers, scientists and engineers.

DG SPD Kidwai congratulated all scientists and engineers on the successful launch, and the accuracy of the missile in reaching the target. He said that the improved version of Shaheen-1A would further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities. He appreciated the efforts of all personnel for their dedication and professionalism.

Some time back, Pakistan successfully test-fired its Babur Cruise missile, which has a range of 700 kilometres. The ISPR said Babur was capable of carrying conventional and atomic warheads. 

A special feature of Wednesdayís launch was the validation of a new multi-tube Missile Launch Vehicle (MLV) during the test. The three-tube MLV enhances manifold the targeting and deployment options in the conventional and nuclear modes. With its shoot-and-scoot capability, the MLV provides a major force multiplier effect for target employment and survivability.

Pakistan's most recent missile test came last month with the launch of the short-range nuclear-capable Abdali, while in April 2008 it tested the Shaheen II, or Hatf VI, missile having range of 2,000 kilometres.



Manas said:


> So its 1000km range , not 4000km or from 2500-3000km . mystery solved. congratulation.


Sir these are all guesses because their is no ISPR official confirmation

Daily Express News Story
This paper is quoting 3000 KM range What the hell is going on ?

Latest News Video : Arms race intensifies in Asia

Latest News Video : Arms race intensifies in Asia- II
I love Indian News Channels


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## monitor

PressTV: Pakistan test fires nuclear-capable missile in rivalry with India
Posted on April 25, 2012 


Pakistan&#8217;s Hatf IV ballistic missile being test fired from an undisclosed location
Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:24AM GMT

Pakistan has test fired a medium-range ballistic missile capable of carrying a nuclear warhead shortly after India launched a long-range missile test, according to the Pakistani military, Press TV reports.

&#8220;Pakistan today successfully conducted the launch of the intermediate range ballistic missile Hatf IV Shaheen-1A weapon system,&#8221; Pakistan&#8217;s military said in a statement on Wednesday.

The missile, which landed in the sea, was an improved version of the Shaheen-one with a longer range, said the military, without revealing the exact range of the projectile.

*However, Pakistani retired General Talat Masood, who is a defense analyst, told AFP that the missile would be able to hit targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometers away.* 

The test comes just days after neighboring India announced that it had successfully test fired a long-range intercontinental ballistic missile capable of carrying a 1.5-ton nuclear warhead from a military base off the country&#8217;s eastern coast of Orissa.

Pakistan routinely tests various missiles to match those of India. The two neighbors have engaged in an arms race since the partition of Pakistan from India in 1947.


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## Viper0011.

monitor said:


> *However, Pakistani retired General Talat Masood, who is a defense analyst, told AFP that the missile would be able to hit targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometers away.*



Ok, I never said it. This was a reduced range test due to the depth. Upgrades included Stealthy features, Radar evading re-entry technologies and dynamic course change with higher speed. All these are part of S II & S III (to be tested) systems. No further comments!!! Thank you


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## pakistanitarzan

I have an excellent idea for Pakistan Army. For God sake, please test these misiles on TTP!

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## IceCold

So if the range of Shaheen 1 is increased from the original 750 kms to 1000 kms, is it safe to assume that the new technology used in alpha version will also find its way into the Shaheen 2 thus increasing its range from 2500 to 3000 Km. I believe General Talat Masoon is also referring to this when he says that the missile would be able to hit targets at 2500 to 3000 km. Shaheen 2 can already hit up to 2500 km.
But this is strictly my own speculation, i do not intend to invite a troll fest from the Indian side so just relax.

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## Viper0011.

IceCold said:


> So if the range of Shaheen 1 is increased from the original 750 kms to 1000 kms, is it safe to assume that the new technology used in alpha version will also find its way into the Shaheen 2 thus increasing its range from 2500 to 3000 Km.



Read my previous post. The answer is yes. This was just a reduce range test for a bunch of new tech. All this will be available in Shaheen II & S III (to be tested). This test wasn't about just some additional range though . That's easy part to increase range. ALPHA.....Advance LPHA. I'd like to stop now .


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## DEV444

ashokdeiva said:


> Get me and the rest of the folk with some solid evidence before you dance to your tune mate. There is a international politics that determines the course of the world, there is every one involved and no one is out of the question. Every thing is manipulated as thing happen. US does not bark at INDIA for conducting a 5000 km missile test but it condemned the same with NK and might possibly with any other nation that not fit their view and might come up with sanctions against any such capable nation and the rest of the world will just watch and do nothing about that.
> And as far as the Middle East is considered, it a volatile place with religiously emotional people can be directed against any one who is out of sync with the US views.
> This we can see as a live evidence in the case of Egypt, Libiya, Siriya, etc.
> 
> if you can not thing global, then its your problem not mine.


 
Well sir, Uncle Sam notwithstanding, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan have a very close relationship :
- the Saudis give oil to Pakistan at very cheap rates and long line of credit.
- Saudi Defence Minister Prince something-something is on record saying that they don't maintain a large army because of the fear of the Army becoming too powerful and overthrowing the regime and in any case, they can fall back on the Pakistan army to help them out when needed.Totally believable, given the history of PAF pilots fighting for their Islamic allies against Israel in the 60s & 70s.
- Why is the Pakistani Nuclear Bomb projected as the Islamic bomb or more correctly the Sunni Bomb? And why did Saudi Arabia liberally assist in funding the Pakistani nuclear program ?They see it as their insurance against nuclear Israel and Nuclear Iran.


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## fatman17

ASIA PACIFIC Date Posted: 25-Apr-2012 

Pakistan test-fires Hatf 4 IRBM


Farhan Bokhari - Correspondent - Islamabad

Ben Goodlad Land Systems Analyst - London



Pakistan test-fired a Hatf 4 (Shaheen 1A) intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) on 25 April: the first test of its kind since India tested its Agni 5 IRBM on 19 April. 

Pakistan's strategic missiles do not match the Agni 5's range of 5,000 km, but as a senior Pakistani official stated after India's missile test: "Pakistan's current missiles all have the ability to strike targets deep inside India. We do not need to match the Agni 5." 

The Pakistan Army said on 25 April that the Shaheen-1A missile that was test-fired was an "improvement in range and technical parameters over the Shaheen-1", although it did not give further details. A Western defence official based in Islamabad said the Shaheen-1A probably had improvements to its guidance system and was able to carry a heavier payload. "This is a more sophisticated version of the Shaheen-1," he added. 


COMMENT

The testing of the Hatf 4 (Shaheen 1A) serves as a reminder of Pakistan's own ballistic missile capabilities and it is likely that the test was brought forward to serve as a response to India's Agni 5 test. 

However, while the Shaheen 1A is reported to have an increased range of 2,500 km to 3,000 km, it does not provide a significant increase in capability over the Hatf 6 (Shaheen 2), which is also believed to have a range of 2,500 km. Both missiles have similar assemblies, so it is possible that this is part of an upgrade programme to bring the Shaheen 1 closer to the Shaheen 2 in terms of capability.


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## IceCold

DEV444 said:


> Well sir, Uncle Sam notwithstanding, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan have a very close relationship :
> - the Saudis give oil to Pakistan at very cheap rates and long line of credit.
> - Saudi Defence Minister Prince something-something is on record saying that they don't maintain a large army because of the fear of the Army becoming too powerful and overthrowing the regime and in any case, they can fall back on the Pakistan army to help them out when needed.Totally believable, given the history of PAF pilots fighting for their Islamic allies against Israel in the 60s & 70s.
> - Why is the Pakistani Nuclear Bomb projected as the Islamic bomb or more correctly the Sunni Bomb? And why did Saudi Arabia liberally assist in funding the Pakistani nuclear program ?They see it as their insurance against nuclear Israel and Nuclear Iran.



First of all there is not such thing as a Islamic Bomb, its all BS. Its a nuclear bomb and the purpose of it is to deter against India in case push comes to shove. This is as simple as it gets.
We do have an obligation as would any other Muslim country to protect Saudi Arabia in case of an attack from outside but that is not due to our love for the regime but because of the holy places Macca and Madina, more specifically Kaba.

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## Zarvan

IceCold said:


> First of all there is not such thing as a Islamic Bomb, its all BS. Its a nuclear bomb and the purpose of it is to deter against India in case push comes to shove. This is as simple as it gets.
> We do have an obligation as would any other Muslim country to protect Saudi Arabia in case of an attack from outside but that is not due to our love for the regime but because of the holy places Macca and Madina, more specifically Kaba.


Sir you don't consider but world knows it this is and they also know where we get funds from to maintain our Nuclear Program and what kind of relations Saudi And Pakistan Have


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## regular

ashokdeiva said:


> why does not PA reveal the range and tell the world what they have in thier pocket rahter than allowing speculation to go gaga.I think they are enjoying this seculation and if true the PA officers who knew the data might even be here in PDF just enjoying what both Pakistanis and INDIANS have to guess on the range of this missile.


They will not until India tests its first ICBM openly.....I guess......


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## Juice

IceCold said:


> The speed with which it took off, i think it would require max 3-5 mins to hit any target in India. This time leaves little to no time for an ABM system to successfully intercept an incoming missile.



My point on tac missles as opposed to ICBM, more useful in Pak's situation, less able to be countered. Same for India. In the current geo-political situation, ICBM's are an expensive waste


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## Last Hope

It was no ICBM test. It were just some posters who were guessing that Pakistan would respond to Indian ICBM test with another. ICBM is long way, I expected a upgraded missile of Shaheen or Ghauri series.

Anyways, Shaheen 1A was just an updated version of Shaheen 1, with a range between 2500 and 3500 (Not 1000 or 750). It probably has a different fuel or engine.

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## regular

no_koadsheding_plz said:


> where is the test video showing this missile hitting its target ?
> why are it not shown?
> so far i have failed miserably to see a video of it hitting its target . Please someone give me link to video iut hitting the target


I guess we never seen any video for our missiles hitting their targets before.They don't release those videos....


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## al_asad_al_mulk

Shaheen 1-A is improved version of Shaheen 1 (750Km)
To carry new type of warheads improve accuracy and 300Km more range. I suspect one more thing pakistan convert Shaheen 1 ballistic missile into Anti Ship Balistic missile.


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## Dark Warrior

According to India's Ministry of Defence this is just a ordinary missile with a range of 1,000km,so they dismissed it.


> NEW DELHI/ISLAMABAD: Pakistan tested an upgraded version of its Shaheen missile on Wednesday, in an apparent retaliation to India's Agni V launch. A Pakistani army statement said the Shaheen 1A is a nuclear-capable intermediate-range ballistic missile, while military analysts said it was capable of covering almost all of India.
> 
> Interestingly, the Pakistani authorities withheld crucial information about the missile, namely its range, which is what gives a missile its bragging rights. *According to reports by observers, the missile touched 1,000km, though there was no confirmation from Pakistan, and its point of impact was in the Indian Ocean.* Many of Pakistan's missiles can reach faraway Indian cities, so this was hardly a breakthrough. This has led many to suspect that the question of parity with India was paramount during the test launch.
> 
> *The test of Shaheen 1A came up for mention in the monthly security review meeting called by defence minister A K Antony on Wednesday, which was attended by national security adviser Shiv Shankar Menon and the three service chiefs.
> 
> But the test was largely dismissed as "routine" in nature, with the range of the 750km Shaheen 1 missile probably being extended. Pakistan also has the Shaheen-II missile that has a strike range of 2,500km.*
> 
> But the test made one thing very clear: Pakistan continues to maintain the "parity" argument with India. Particularly in defence and security matters, Islamabad ignores the growing asymmetry with New Delhi to be seen as "equal". Pakistan's strategic plans division chief Lt Gen (retd) Khalid Ahmed Kidwai said the improved missile version could successfully hit a target in the Indian Ocean and would "further strengthen and consolidate Pakistan's deterrence capabilities''. An expert said the latest launch signifies "Pakistan's resolve to upgrade and modernize its nuclear delivery system''.
> 
> "Authorities have not described the missile's exact range but this is perhaps the longest-range missile in Pakistan's nuclear programme. An intermediate-range missile is capable of hitting targets at a distance of 2,500 to 3,000km," said Talat Masood, a defence analyst.
> 
> Pak fires Shaheen in tit-for-tat test - The Times of India


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## Windjammer

*Pakistan tested a missile that strikes at the enemy's heart......not the one that flies over it's head.*

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## al_asad_al_mulk

There is good news Pakistan fire Shaheen 1-A near Islamabad "Nilor" into sea ok and the length if we calculated from islamabad to sea roughly 3500Kms so guys gues what if the above info is correct which seems to be then Shaheen 1-A range aroximatly 3500 Kms to 4000Kms + what you people think


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## HANI

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> There is good news Pakistan fire Shaheen 1-A near Islamabad "Nilor" into sea ok and the length if we calculated from islamabad to sea roughly 3500Kms so guys gues what if the above info is correct which seems to be then Shaheen 1-A range aroximatly 3500 Kms to 4000Kms + what you people think



express news also declaring it a long rage approx 1000-3000 km range missile any confirmation???????????????


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## al_asad_al_mulk

BREAKING NEWS
The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km


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## Stealth

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> BREAKING NEWS
> The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km



*
1000KMH Not possible.


Technically speaking if this Missile fired from Islamabad then Islamabad to Karachi around 1400 KMH and this Missile fired into Indian Ocean.... Calculate in your mind about the range simple!*

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## SBD-3

RPK said:


> So Your long range Missile launch traveled by road


Help yourself 
Google Maps Distance Calculator



> BREAKING NEWS
> The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be *MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads*. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km


Now that is some serious capability.....

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## RPK

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator



Ok I know, sorry boss just for fun .

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## manofwar

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> BREAKING NEWS
> The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars.* Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched.* All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km


Then how do you know if the test was successful??? 
Missiles of such length and size cannot be made undetectable by radars, heck, the smaller cruise missiles cannot achieve this!!
I see two possibilities, either the radars are malfunctioning or the dudes at NDC are bluffing......


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## Sugarcane

manofwar said:


> Then how do you know if the test was successful???
> Missiles of such length and size cannot be made undetectable by radars, heck, the smaller cruise missiles cannot achieve this!!
> I see two possibilities, either the radars are malfunctioning or the dudes at NDC are bluffing......



Do you think you are the only Einstein left on earth and people who are working on stealth technologies are Idiots?


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## Windjammer

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....


 
*Damn, so it's a multi-war head capable platform, no wonder the new designation Alpha. 
You can see the head on the new missile is bigger and longer without the fins.*

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## shuntmaster

I think the missile whole flight path during the testing can be tracked by Indian RADAR systems on the Western border. From what I hear and looking at the size of Shaheen-1 (around 10 tonnes) the range was only around 500-600Kms.




> Dongfeng 11 (CSS-7)
> 
> Also known as the M-11 (export), the DF-11 is a road-mobile short-range ballistic missile (SRBM) designed by Wang Zhenhua at the Sanjiang Missile Corporation (also known as the 066 Base) in the late 1970s. The DF-11 has range of 300 km and 800 kg payload. An improved DF-11A version has increased range of >825 km. China is known to have exported DF-11s to Pakistan, which served as the basis for the Shaheen-1 and Shaheen-2 missiles. The range of the M-11 does not violate the limits set by the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR). Unlike previous Chinese ballistic missiles, the DF-11 use solid fuel, which greatly reduces launch preparation time (15-30 min). Liquid-fueled missiles such as the DF-5 require up to 2 hours of pre-launch preparation. Estimates on the number of DF-11s in service vary between 500 to 600.


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## Dark Warrior

My post in page number 32 reveals that we tracked the missile and found out that it splashed down at a range of 1000 km.Anyways only 3 nuke MiRV?s?Our new missile can carry 10.


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## shuntmaster

Dark Warrior said:


> My post in page number 32 reveals that we tracked the missile and found out that it splashed down at a range of 1000 km.Anyways only 3 nuke MiRV?s?Our new missile can carry 10.



Looking at the size, I doubt Shaheen-1A can go beyond 700Km. Agni-1 which is 20% bigger, can go to 750Kms with single warhead.


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## graphican

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....



News resource please?


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## SBD-3

manofwar said:


> *Then how do you know if the test was successful??? *
> Missiles of such length and size cannot be made undetectable by radars, heck, the smaller cruise missiles cannot achieve this!!
> I see two possibilities, either the radars are malfunctioning or the dudes at NDC are bluffing......


There are observers placed around the target, Thats one of the most interesting expression of the day......
"Common sense is a sense thats not common in common Indians?"

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## Windjammer

Dark Warrior said:


> My post in page number 32 reveals that we tracked the missile and found out that it splashed down at a range of 1000 km.Anyways only 3 nuke MiRV?s?Our new missile can carry 10.



Don't want to go into details, but you Indians seem to have more of every thing.

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## DARKY

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> BREAKING NEWS
> The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km



So the maximum range is 1000km.
The warhead certain doesn't appear to be having MIRV(too small to carry multiple warheads).
What refueling do you require in a solid fueled missile ??... the fuel in a solid fuel missiles is stored during manufacturing process and it is takes lot more time than a liquid fuel one.. since the layers must be quantized as it burns out layer after layer... even slight difference might cause the missile to imbalance and cause a disaster.
There is no way a ballistic missile can avoid detection by long radars...... the one who said is certain fooling the public... such a lowlife he is who thinks that public are morons and would believe whatever BS he speaks.
There are small thrusters in moder Ballistic missiles which corrects its course in space... all Indian BM have it..If you didn't have such thrusters then there is no difference between your missile and a Scud.. such thrusters work only in the space.. for making RE warhead maneuver in the atmosphere you would need flex nozzles and not thrusters which can throw the missile way out of course.


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## SBD-3

DARKY said:


> So the maximum range is 1000km.
> The warhead certain doesn't appear to be having MIRV(too small to carry multiple warheads).
> What refueling do you require in a solid fueled missile ??... the fuel in a solid fuel missiles is stored during manufacturing process and it is takes lot more time than a liquid fuel one.. since the layers must be quantized as it burns out layer after layer... even slight difference might cause the missile to imbalance and cause a disaster.
> There is no way a ballistic missile can avoid detection by long radars...... the one who said is certain fooling the public... such a lowlife he is who thinks that public are morons and would believe whatever BS he speaks.
> There are small thrusters in moder Ballistic missiles which corrects its course in space... all Indian BM have it..If you didn't have such thrusters then there is no difference between your missile and a Scud.. such thrusters work only in the space.. for making RE warhead maneuver in the atmosphere you would need flex nozzles and not thrusters which can throw the missile way out of course.





> According to sources in Strategic Plans Division (SPD), the approximately *10,000 kilogram heavy missile *is equipped with carrying the nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg and conventional warheads between a weight range of 500-600 kg.


Upgraded Hatf IV test-fired | The Nation
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/26/w...-test-fires-nuclear-capable-missile.html?_r=1


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## SBD-3

HappinessMark! said:


> Don't worry we are working on so long ranges (out of ranges)...This ICBM (inter *continental* Balistic Missile) is an oldie (bassi) game...
> Pakistan is infact developing IPBM (Inter *Planetal * Balistic missile)...We will be the first to test


The missile programs are not just one time projects, NESCOM conducts regular tests for improving and testing the validity of parameters.According to Dr Samar testing is done for every batch of missiles before being handed over to PA's SCF. We need right ranged Missiles, thats fairly what we have at the moment. If our Missiles cover Ample Indian Territory and Can fly upto Israel, thats more than enough.

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## Awesome

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BREAKING NEWS
> The following day on 26 April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile, confirming the missile has a maximum range of 1000km. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can be *MIRVed with either 3 nuclear warheads or 6 conventional warheads*. In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refuelling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen IA and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Selection Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....
Click to expand...


Your source for the bolded part?


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## LEGENDARY WARRIOR

The missile tested now has increased accuracy and precision.. Thats a good development, btw range and payload are'nt the only thing that matters in a missile technology..


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## graphican

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....


 


shuntmaster said:


> I think the missile whole flight path during the testing can be tracked by Indian RADAR systems on the Western border. From what I hear and looking at the size of Shaheen-1 (around 10 tonnes) the *range was only around 500-600Kms*.



It needs somewhat biase, bit of jealousy, bit of nonsense and an Indian Analyst to imagine an upgraded missile to have lesser range than the earlier version. Common men, look at this analysis.. honestly!



hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....


 


shuntmaster said:


> Looking at the size, I doubt Shaheen-1A can go beyond 700Km. Agni-1 which is 20% bigger, can go to 750Kms with single warhead.



I have just learned that 20% of 700 is only 50. SMOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOKIN SICK!

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## DARKY

LEGENDARY WARRIOR said:


> Now, no one started this thread to teach you missile technology and prove you that the test was successful.. You think its a propaganda; go ahead but the fact won't change.. ITS A SUCCESS!!!



No doubt it was a success.. hats off to the men involved in this... but spoils every thing is the propaganda politics played over their hard work... no engineer would want his product to be over hyped upto the extent those Lt. Gen./directors have done in this case.. and the ones like the missile flew 4000km/cannot be seen by radars were EPIC... how would you feel like If your collage declares you small helicopter as an Alien space ship so that it can dwarf the solar powered scooter made by the student of the neighboring collage.


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## unicorn

> The missile test was purportedly conducted during early hours at an undisclosed location somewhere near Nilor, a suburban town of Islamabad.



Upgraded Hatf IV test-fired | The Nation

The missile was launched from an undisclosed location near Islamabad. And the distance from Islamabad to Karachi alone is 1100 km in displacement. Which means the missile is indeed an IRBM as claimed.

jang news is also validating it further

http://e.jang.com.pk/04-26-2012/karachi/images/1010.gif


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## shuntmaster

Asim Aquil said:


> Missile tests are usually conducted in Somniani, its just convenient to point towards the Indian Ocean and shoot.
> 
> Officially speaking the Arabian sea is a part of the Indian ocean, oceanic division.
> 
> Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Look at the image highlighting the Indian ocean.



By mentioning that the impact point was in the ''Indian Ocean", probably Pakistan wanted to send India a message.. Maybe they feared that if they mentioned that the missile hit the ''Arabian sea" the Arabs will get angry and we all know how much the Pakistanis revere the Arabs...


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## graphican

Guys, 

- Pakistan had never officially claimed to have MIRV installed on its missiles. So MIRV has arrived and acknowledged which is one big step ahead. 
- The speed of missile is probably the fastest one in surface launched ballistic missile that I have witnessed anywhere before. It took less than 10 seconds after launching to cross clouds.. and that is yet another achievement by Pakistan. 
- 3rd and most useful development is that it is claimed to be stealthy to the Radars. While I have less data to consider this as a fact, I want to mention that this missile test came AFTER aboveboard operation in which Pakistan had received latest RAM Materials. Would this missile not have that coating on it by now? I have a reason to think it would be less visible to radars than its earlier version was. 
- And, this missile gave minimum 25% more depth at the same length. That means with minimum changes required to the infrastructure, including launchers, storage and deployment systems, future missiles are going to strike minimum 25% deeper, with 30-40% added speed and MIRV. Not to forget the stealth. If I sum them all together, I can safely call this test was a wonderful achievement by Pakistan and it is worth celebrating. Lets look at possible results of these developments. 

1 - Pakistan would only need to launch 1-2 missiles per city. 

2 - with MIRV in place, it is reduces possibility to 1/3rd to be intersected by a missile defense system.

3 - With increased speed, it is would be even harder to intersect incoming missile.

4 - With RAM coating or being "stealthy" to Radars, it would be less visible to radars the first place. That reduces the possibility of intersecting even lower. 

5 - In terms of deployment, Pakistan could keep these missile launchers well within its areas and wouldn't need to move launchers close to borders to attack same targets. If Pakistan had to carry its missile close to borders (imagining they were not already there), it must have taken Pakistan several hours to reach areas from where missiles could hit. Now we can launch the same attack without having to move near the border areas. A BIG ACHIEVEMENT!

6 - And finally.. Pakistan already have missiles which can reach 3500KM. Here we are talking about 25% increase in their range and that means 4375KM range is already achieved (within our potential). Why would you need an ICBM when you are covering India more than enough already????

Pakistan don't have any enemy 4000-5000 KM away and Pakistan is not looking to create new enemies either. Therefore we don't need to match finger to finger and arm to arm. We only need to develop our weapons which are enough to destroy our existing enemy and Thanks to Allah Almighty, today we have developed them further, made them more potent, less intersect-able and with MIRV, almost unstoppable and that all ensures our enemy stays within its Pajama.

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## unicorn

> *The missile test was purportedly conducted during early hours at an undisclosed location somewhere near Nilor, a suburban town of Islamabad.*



http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/national/26-Apr-2012/upgraded-hatf-iv-test-fired

The missile was launched from an undisclosed location near Islamabad. And the distance from Islamabad to Karachi alone is 1100 km in displacement. Which means the improved version of Shaheen is indeed an IRBM as claimed.

jang news is also validating it.


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## SHAMK9

DARKY said:


> No doubt it was a success.. hats off to the men involved in this... but spoils every thing is the propaganda politics played over their hard work... no engineer would want his product to be over hyped upto the extent those Lt. Gen./directors have done in this case.. and the ones like the missile flew 4000km/cannot be seen by radars were EPIC... how would you feel like If your collage declares you small helicopter as an Alien space ship so that it can dwarf the solar powered scooter made by the student of the neighboring collage.


How ate Generals "creating propaganda" when they havnt said a word about the range it self ?


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## manofwar

loveicon said:


> Do you think you are the only Einstein left on earth and people who are working on stealth technologies are Idiots?


Dude , Wake UP!!
Stealth does not mean invisibility!!
no matter how good the rcs of an object is, it can only go as far as making it difficult to spot and that is for the F 22 with an RCS of something like 0.001...
Do you seriously believe that something 10 m tall and 1 m wide can achieve a better RCS??
I tell you, if the bst radars of the PAF were not able to catch this missile, they are probably of very low power...


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## Sugarcane

manofwar said:


> Dude , Wake UP!!
> Stealth does not mean invisibility!!
> no matter how good the rcs of an object is, it can only go as far as making it difficult to spot and that is for the F 22 with an RCS of something like 0.001...
> Do you seriously believe that something 10 m tall and 1 m wide can achieve a better RCS??
> I tell you, if the bst radars of the PAF were not able to catch this missile, they are probably of very low power...



I think by the time radar will detect it will be landing on it's targets


----------



## shuntmaster

unicorn said:


> Upgraded Hatf IV test-fired | The Nation
> 
> The missile was launched from an undisclosed location near Islamabad. And the distance from Islamabad to Karachi alone is 1100 km in displacement. Which means the missile is indeed an IRBM as claimed.
> 
> jang news is also validating it further
> 
> http://e.jang.com.pk/04-26-2012/karachi/images/1010.gif



Someone said that the missile was launched from the Sonmiani test range in coastal Baluchistan. This news says it was from Islamabad. Can somebody clarify this will official news release.
If the missile is launched near Islamabad and flew south, it would have to pass over 80% of the Pakistani population centres. Isn't it too risky to do it. No country tests its missiles over population centres, even if the missile is tried and tested many times before.



loveicon said:


> I think by the time radar will detect it will be landing on it's targets



RADAR detects at speed of light..


----------



## Markus

For how many kilometers did the missile fly over Pakistani territory? Any body ?


----------



## Riz

Bolton: Pakistani Nuclear Capability Is a 'Global Problem

*Former United Nations Ambassador John Bolton says hes concerned about Pakistans improving capabilities to deliver nuclear weapons in the wake of a major missile test by that country on Wednesday. 

This gives them a capability across India, he said Wednesday night on Fox News On the Record with Greta Van Susteren.

Their missile is not as powerful as the one that India launched [a few days ago]. But . . . this is a demonstration to India from the Pakistani military that they are prepared,  Bolton said.
*
Tensions between the two countries continue to grow, and Bolton said the situation is made worse by the instability of the government in Pakistan. Bolton said he worries it could become a grave issue if the countrys nuclear weapons fall into the wrong hands.

Its ability to hold together in the face of Islamic radical infiltration is very much in question these days, Bolton said. The security of its nuclear weapons and the capability on the ballistic missile front are not just abstract issues and confined to India. This is a global problem.

Thats why, he added, the U.S. presence in Afghanistan, and how we deal with the al-Qaida and [the] Taliban, both in Afghanistan and in Pakistan, remains extremely important for the United States directly.
Bolton: Pakistani Nuclear Capability Is a 'Global Problem'

Shaheen-1A: Pakistan tested Intercontinental Ballistic Missile?
Karachi: *Pakistan: Commenting on Pakistan&#8217;s Wednesday test of ballistic missile an international institution the Global Security has said that the range of the missile might be around 3000 to 5000 kilometers if it was a medium range missile. 
According to experts an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) is a ballistic missile with a long range (greater than 5,500 km or 3,500 miles).*
Strategic Plan Division (SDP) issued a press release on Wednesday stating that a medium range missile Shaheen-1A fourth of Hataf series. However it didn&#8217;t disclosed range of the missile that is capable of carrying both nuclear and traditional war-heads.
Pakistan&#8217;s latest missile test was apparently in response to New Delhi&#8217;s Agni-V InterContinental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) test. According to reports Agni-V could hit Beijing and all the cities of Pakistan.
Earlier Pakistan had tested Shaheen and Shaheen-II missiles of the Hataf series.
Pakistan has been building its missile as part of nations efforts to improve deterrence against India.
Shaheen-1A: Pakistan tested Intercontinental Ballistic Missile? | The News Tribe


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## Bratva

DARKY said:


> So it carries a 300kg nuclear warhead...and a 600kg conventional one... now what difference does it make here the original shaheen might be carrying a 1000kg warhead..* so its basically the same missile with warhead being made smaller in mass so that it can fly longer... hence its clear that the test is more of a propaganda to fool public and statements like it flew 4000km* and was not detected by Radar proves the fact... and it seems that they have been quiet successful in this case...



Have you gone made? XYZ said Blah Blah and you instantly believed because it suited your propaganda? What part of Intermediate Missile does not get into your brain? 1200-1500 Km is the latest version. Upgraded it's accuracy which mean Less CEP and for the sake of your LORD KRISHNA. Read previous pages, Some Ex General quoted 4000 Range which is entirely wrong and we have refuted this range in previous pages. SO stop BS'ing yourself and making others annoying.

And also put some sense in your brain when next you claim that Generals are making baseless claims while None of the Generals who are involved with missile program said anything or any other general. One Ex-GENERAL who made this claim was retired 18 years ago.


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## Bubblegum Crisis

Observed.


*Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI*







*Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV *







Shaheen II (Length) 17.5 m - Shaheen IA (Length) 12 m = 5,5 m difference
Shaheen II (Diameter) 1.4 m - Shaheen IA (Diameter) 1 m = 0,5 m difference
Shaheen II (Weight ) 25,000 kg - Shaheen IA (Weight ) 9,500 kg = 15,500 kg difference




> *Pakistan test-fires Hatf 4 IRBM*
> 
> 
> *Farhan Bokhari - Correspondent - Islamabad
> 
> Ben Goodlad Land Systems Analyst - London
> 
> ASIA PACIFIC Date Posted: 25-Apr-2012*
> 
> 
> Pakistan test-fired a Hatf 4 (Shaheen 1A) intermediate-range ballistic missile (IRBM) on 25 April: the first test of its kind since India tested its Agni 5 IRBM on 19 April.
> 
> Pakistan's strategic missiles do not match the Agni 5's range of 5,000 km, but as a senior Pakistani official stated after India's missile test: "Pakistan's current missiles all have the ability to strike targets deep inside India. We do not need to match the Agni 5."
> 
> The Pakistan Army said on 25 April that the Shaheen-1A missile that was test-fired was an "improvement in range and technical parameters over the Shaheen-1", although it did not give further details. A Western defence official based in Islamabad said the Shaheen-1A probably had improvements to its guidance system and was able to carry a heavier payload. "This is a more sophisticated version of the Shaheen-1," he added.
> 
> 
> *COMMENT*
> 
> The testing of the Hatf 4 (Shaheen 1A) serves as a reminder of Pakistan's own ballistic missile capabilities and it is likely that the test was brought forward to serve as a response to India's Agni 5 test.
> 
> However, while *the Shaheen 1A is reported to have an increased range of 2,500 km to 3,000 km*, it does not provide a significant increase in capability over the Hatf 6 (Shaheen 2), which is also believed to have a range of 2,500 km. Both missiles have similar assemblies, so it is possible that this is part of an upgrade programme to bring the Shaheen 1 closer to the Shaheen 2 in terms of capability.





> *Ben Goodlad*
> 
> *Researcher, Jane&#8217;s Defence Forecasts *
> 
> Ben Goodlad is an analyst with Jane&#8217;s Defence Forecasts &#8211; Combat Vehicle Programmes which provides up-to-date global insight on current and future vehicle procurement and upgrades. He also writes for Jane's Defence Weekly, Jane's International Defence Review and Jane's Defence Industry on vehicle procurement issues, particularly the US MRAP programme.
> 
> Previously Ben has worked with several Jane&#8217;s land systems editors, helping to produce Jane&#8217;s Explosive Ordnance Disposal, Jane&#8217;s Mine and Mine Clearance, Jane&#8217;s Ammunition Handbook and Jane&#8217;s Infantry Weapons. He has also provided analysis to the Jane&#8217;s Cluster Munitions study. Ben has an undergraduate degree in War Studies from Kings College, London, and has previously served with the UK Territorial Army, deployed on operations as part of an armoured infantry battlegroup to Iraq in 2003.



*Link official "IHS Jane's Defense & Security Intelligence & Analysis":*

http://www.janes.com/products/janes/index.aspx



For the same &#8220;Operational range&#8221; of 2,500 km to 3,000 km for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; and &#8220;Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV&#8221;. 


A passage of 700 km to 2,500 km - 3,000 km of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV for a length, a diameter and a weight lower to &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221;. A gain of 1,800 km - 2,300 km for Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV.

This is really a major advanced. 

&#8220;If the information is true concerning the new operational range of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV &#8221; to 2,500 km - 3,000 km. Shaheen-III can achieve now very easily the &#8220;Operational range&#8221; ICBM of 5,000 km.



...


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## Safriz

shuntmaster said:


> Someone said that the missile was launched from the Sonmiani test range in coastal Baluchistan. This news says it was from Islamabad. Can somebody clarify this will official news release.
> If the missile is launched near Islamabad and flew south, *it would have to pass over 80% of the Pakistani population centres.* Isn't it too risky to do it. No country tests its missiles over population centres, even if the missile is tried and tested many times before.
> 
> 
> 
> RADAR detects at speed of light..



To be honest..this has happened most of the times when Pakistan tests missiles,and never anything went wrong....
When Doctor AQ khan was still involved in the Missile development....i remember him saying that this shows our confidence in the missiles,they don't fail and the wont.


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## Sugarcane

shuntmaster said:


> RADAR detects at speed of light..



have Indian radars detected it?


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## Bratva

riz1978 said:


> Bolton: Pakistani Nuclear Capability Is a 'Global Problem
> 
> *Former United Nations Ambassador John Bolton says he&#8217;s concerned about Pakistan&#8217;s improving capabilities to deliver nuclear weapons in the wake of a major missile test by that country on Wednesday.
> 
> &#8220;This gives them a capability across India,&#8221; he said Wednesday night on Fox News&#8217; &#8220;On the Record with Greta Van Susteren.&#8221;
> 
> &#8220;Their missile is not as powerful as the one that India launched [a few days ago]. But . . . this is a demonstration to India from the Pakistani military that they are prepared, &#8221; Bolton said.
> *
> Tensions between the two countries continue to grow, and Bolton said the situation is made worse by the instability of the government in Pakistan. Bolton said he worries it could become a &#8220;grave&#8221; issue if the country&#8217;s nuclear weapons fall into the wrong hands.
> 
> &#8220;Its ability to hold together in the face of Islamic radical infiltration is very much in question these days,&#8221; Bolton said. &#8220;The security of its nuclear weapons and the capability on the ballistic missile front are not just abstract issues and confined to India. This is a global problem.&#8221;
> 
> &#8220;That&#8217;s why,&#8221; he added, &#8220;the U.S. presence in Afghanistan, and how we deal with the al-Qaida and [the] Taliban, both in Afghanistan and in Pakistan, remains extremely important for the United States directly.&#8221;
> Bolton: Pakistani Nuclear Capability Is a 'Global Problem'
> 
> Shaheen-1A: Pakistan tested Intercontinental Ballistic Missile?
> Karachi: *Pakistan: Commenting on Pakistan&#8217;s Wednesday test of ballistic missile an international institution the Global Security has said that the range of the missile might be around 3000 to 5000 kilometers if it was a medium range missile.
> According to experts an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) is a ballistic missile with a long range (greater than 5,500 km or 3,500 miles).*
> Strategic Plan Division (SDP) issued a press release on Wednesday stating that a medium range missile Shaheen-1A fourth of Hataf series. However it didn&#8217;t disclosed range of the missile that is capable of carrying both nuclear and traditional war-heads.
> Pakistan&#8217;s latest missile test was apparently in response to New Delhi&#8217;s Agni-V InterContinental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) test. According to reports Agni-V could hit Beijing and all the cities of Pakistan.
> Earlier Pakistan had tested Shaheen and Shaheen-II missiles of the Hataf series.
> Pakistan has been building its missile as part of nations efforts to improve deterrence against India.
> Shaheen-1A: Pakistan tested Intercontinental Ballistic Missile? | The News Tribe


 


Bubblegum Crisis said:


> Observed.
> 
> 
> *Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Shaheen II (Length) 17.5 m - Shaheen IA (Length) 12 m = 5,5 m difference
> Shaheen II (Diameter) 1.4 m - Shaheen IA (Diameter) 1 m = 0,5 m difference
> Shaheen II (Weight ) 25,000 kg - Shaheen IA (Weight ) 9,500 kg = 15,500 kg difference
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the same &#8220;Operational range&#8221; of 2,500 km to 3,000 km for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; and &#8220;Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV&#8221;.
> 
> 
> A passage of 700 km to 2,500 km - 3,000 km of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV for a length, a diameter and a weight lower to &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221;. A gain of 1,800 km - 2,300 km for Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV.
> 
> This is a major advanced.
> 
> &#8220;If the information is true concerning the new operational range of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV &#8221; to 2,500 km - 3,000 km. Shaheen-III can achieve now very easily the &#8220;Operational range&#8221; ICBM of 5,000 km.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Idiotic and stupid assumptions made in both articles. Creating fantasies at it's best. Morons don't know their own Military declared missile and INTERMEDIATE RANGE Baliistic missile and Intermediate means having range of 1200-1500 KM.


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## Markus

Man this is the 36th page and ppl are still not sure of the actual range of the missile.

Multiple articles have proved it, its 1000 KM.

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## Windjammer

Some delusional characters need to be reminded of the fact that Pakistan has mastered the art of miniaturising it's nuclear weapons, check the war head on it's shoot and scoot NASR missile and then compare it with the head on the Shaheen-1A. Now for arguments say wouldn't three of those fit into one of S-1A's.
*
Jealousy is the tribute mediocrity pays to genius.*~ Fulton

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## Markus

Windjammer said:


> Some delusional characters need to be reminded of the fact that Pakistan has mastered the art of miniaturising it's nuclear weapons, check the war head on it's shoot and scoot NASR missile and then compare it with the head on the Shaheen-1A. Now for arguments say wouldn't three of those fit into one of S-1A's.
> *
> &#8220;Jealousy is the tribute mediocrity pays to genius.&#8221;*~ Fulton



Nasr has a tactical warhead while Shaheen will have a heavy duty warhead.

Nasr is to take out multiple Indian Battalians, Shaheen will be to take out Indian cities.


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## Bubblegum Crisis

mafiya said:


> Creating fantasies at it's best. Morons don't know their own Military declared missile and INTERMEDIATE RANGE Baliistic missile and Intermediate means having range of 1200-1500 KM.






 Bubblegum Crisis said:


> Observed.
> 
> 
> *Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Shaheen II (Length) 17.5 m - Shaheen IA (Length) 12 m = 5,5 m difference
> Shaheen II (Diameter) 1.4 m - Shaheen IA (Diameter) 1 m = 0,5 m difference
> Shaheen II (Weight ) 25,000 kg - Shaheen IA (Weight ) 9,500 kg = 15,500 kg difference
> 
> 
> 
> For the same &#8220;Operational range&#8221; of 2,500 km to 3,000 km for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; and &#8220;Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV&#8221;.
> 
> 
> A passage of 700 km to 2,500 km - 3,000 km of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV for a length, a diameter and a weight lower to &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221;. A gain of 1,800 km - 2,300 km for Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV.
> 
> This is really a major advanced.
> 
> &#8220;If the information is true concerning the new operational range of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV &#8221; to 2,500 km - 3,000 km. Shaheen-III can achieve now very easily the &#8220;Operational range&#8221; ICBM of 5,000 km.




This information about the new operational range of &#8220;Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV&#8221;. *Of 700 km to 2,500 km - 3,000 km.* By approximation with a volume of fuel available now of 15,500 kg for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; or future &#8220;Shaheen-III&#8221;. A was connected by many big expert military analysts around the world. Until evidence to the contrary and you do not have. I tend to have more confidence in them rather than you.


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## graphican

hasnain0099 said:


> Help yourself
> Google Maps Distance Calculator
> 
> 
> Now that is some serious capability.....


 


Markus said:


> Nasr has a tactical warhead while Shaheen will have a heavy duty warhead.
> 
> Nasr is to take out multiple Indian Battalians, Shaheen will be to take out Indian cities.



I never knew you were involved in the strategic planning of Pakistani nuclear attack on its enemy :p BUT keeping the pun aside, what makes you think that a "heavy duty nuclear weapon" *has to be* thick in terms of diameter and heavy duties were not possible in length? Nasr will be definitely a carrier of strategic nuke as Nasr is specifically designed to be that kind but for Shaheen, Ghouri and Abadali (and other variations of Hatf series) we have all options open. 

Also with Nuclear Weapons, you don't need to have heavy-weight nuclear warheads to have greater damage radius, nuclear weapons on their own are destructive and radiation, biological, environmental and psychological damage is itself huge. With that in view, I wouldn't mind keeping strategic MIRVs and dropping several of those upon an area instead of one big heavy duty one. All this discussion is so inhuman and disgusting but we are discussing wars here. I just hope such time wouldn't come ever.


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## Windjammer

Markus said:


> Nasr has a tactical warhead while Shaheen will have a heavy duty warhead.
> 
> Nasr is to take out multiple Indian Battalians, Shaheen will be to take out Indian cities.



Shaheen-1 and Shaheen-1 Alpha.....Two different missiles designed for different scenarios and missions.

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## graphican

Safriz said:


> To be honest..this has happened most of the times when Pakistan tests missiles,and never anything went wrong....
> When Doctor AQ khan was still involved in the Missile development....i remember him saying that this shows our confidence in the missiles,they don't fail and the wont.



You know there is a simple approach to success... test every stage before moving to the next. When Pakistan tests its missile, if they have spent good time in all the pre-tests which lead to physical test, they are not likely to end at failures. Also Pakistan is facing a lot bigger security challenge than India _has been_ facing in terms of Pakistan and contrary to India, we have developed a habit of taking defense matters very very seriously which I think is another reason of not finding blunders in tests.


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## no_koadsheding_plz

RazPaK said:


> PA is secretive and for very good reason. But let me assure you boy, there is no reason for you to doubt our military establishment. The best of the best are involved.


I cant understand this anomaly ..they do show its launch but not it hitting the target.. whats secretive in this ?

showing just few seconds of launch and not showing it hitting its target surely leaves more to speculate..


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## RazPaK

no_koadsheding_plz said:


> I cant understand this anomaly ..they do show its launch but not it hitting the target.. whats secretive in this ?



Bhai jan, humaray launch itnay transparent ney hain, kyun ki saray mulak Pakistan ke peche par jai gayne.


It's better for Pakistan not to show it's capabilities.


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## manofwar

loveicon said:


> I think by the time radar will detect it will be landing on it's targets


Your thinking doesn't make it true
The waves move at the speed of light.....
as i have said before either the radars are crap, or the NDC guys have recreated Mr. India's watch.....


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## Sugarcane

manofwar said:


> Your thinking doesn't make it true
> The waves move at the speed of light.....
> as i have said before either the radars are crap, or the NDC guys have recreated Mr. India's watch.....



as i asked before have Indian radars detected it? obviously missiles are for India, you radars needs to detect it - isn't it?


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## manofwar

loveicon said:


> as i asked before have Indian radars detected it? obviously missiles are for India, you radars needs to detect it - isn't it?


Did you know that most radars do not have a range beyond 2000-3000 kms??The max range India has is 1400 kms on swordfish....


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## humanfirst

Safriz said:


> When Doctor AQ khan was still involved in the Missile development....i remember him saying that this shows our confidence in the missiles,they don't fail and the wont.


It is the usual practice of Pakistan not to inform the media or citizens before the launch(unlike india or russia or USA where launch date is published days or even months before launch).Doesn't that indicate the opposite of what you claim..?ie the lack of confidence..?


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## Sugarcane

no_koadsheding_plz said:


> yesterday i saw a picture which was some answer sheet in which a question was asked "Qayam -e-Pakistan ma liaqat ali khan ka kitna hath tha" and the student drew a big hand and there was written beneath it " janab-e-wala itna bara hath tha"
> 
> so what u mean is like this boys answers...
> 
> whats the difference betqween testing and saying it hit the target ,,,and showing it ?
> will just showing it hitting target bring about sanctions ? and not showing it will 'void' any sanctions ?
> and if u still insist then even showing its launch should bring sanctions/condemnation 'if any' like the case ofd NK.. and we are not like NK.. we are in a situation where we need to test these...



Dear - I haven't seen videos of balletic missile test of any country showing it's accuracy, It's not just Pakistan


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## mjnaushad

shuntmaster said:


> It could also mean that the confidence from the fact that the missiles are pre-tested by someone else, if you know what I mean...
> Instead of claiming it a test, Pakistan should be calling it a user trial...



Yup its a user trial.... NESCOM as manufacturer and Pakistan army strategic command is the user.....


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## SamantK

loveicon said:


> Dear - I haven't seen videos of balletic missile test of any country showing it's accuracy, It's not just Pakistan


 Youtube search minuteman test!! you are wrong!


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## Sugarcane

samantk said:


> Youtube search minuteman test!! you are wrong!



Gimme link of Agni-V hitting target....

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## SamantK

loveicon said:


> Gimme link of Agni-V hitting target....


 re-read your post , you said any country. Please do not troll without reading things here properly. Did I say I have a video of Agni-V hitting the target?


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## nomi007

i personally feel that this test did not inspire the world like agni-5


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## Sugarcane

samantk said:


> re-read your post , you said any country. Please do not troll without reading things here properly. Did I say I have a video of Agni-V hitting the target?



You think - American videos are trust-able?


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## Safriz

humanfirst said:


> It is the usual practice of Pakistan not to inform the media or citizens before the launch(unlike india or russia or USA where launch date is published days or even months before launch).Doesn't that indicate the opposite of what you claim..?ie the lack of confidence..?


apparently it is......


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## SamantK

loveicon said:


> You think - American videos are trust-able?


 If you do not believe in Videos why ask at all? I said there is, verify the authenticity of it if you want... but probably I think it is true, they show MIRV tech too..


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## alimobin memon

Do you guys really think Shaheen 1-A is what pakistan told airlines of india and other airlines in the region as prescribed by indian leaked news , i am definitely sure this is something very big not disclosed online or to media. so those who think its not a breaking news u are wrong definitely.


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## The Deterrent

*Attention all...*

The missile WAS NOT launched from Nilore,Islamabad. Only the Ghauri series is launched from somewhere in Northern Punjab.
The "news" has been mistakenly released most probably, because all the activity took place far south. So stop calculating distances from Islamabad. Shaheen series of missiles are ALWAYS test fired into the Arabian Sea from Baluchistan.

And there is NO WAY Shaheen-1A ,having only ONE stage, can reach above 1000 km (considering other parameters like launch weight,lenght,diameter too). Also, one simply CANNOT just fit in MIRVs into such a small missile. Then it would be MRVs (multiple re-entry vehicles), not MIRVs.
l
LASTLY, the so-called "Stealth"...lol...The missile's ReV MAY have reduced RCS, but not the whole missile. Any long range radar can detect something THIS BIG. So please, fellow countrymen, stop fantasizing.

I do agree that the missile may have increased range (upto 1000 km), it may be faster, may have advanced counter measures to counter ABMs, better fuel, more compact and lesser launch preparation time.

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## SQ8

nomi007 said:


> i personally feel that this test did not inspire the world like agni-5



You should prostrate before god in thanks that it did not!



AhaseebA said:


> *Attention all...*
> 
> The missile WAS NOT launched from Nilore,Islamabad. Only the Ghauri series is launched from somewhere in Northern Punjab.
> The "news" has been mistakenly released most probably, because all the activity took place far south. So stop calculating distances from Islamabad. Shaheen series of missiles are ALWAYS test fired into the Arabian Sea from Baluchistan.
> 
> And there is NO WAY Shaheen-1A ,having only ONE stage, can reach above 1000 km (considering other parameters like launch weight,lenght,diameter too). Also, one simply CANNOT just fit in MIRVs into such a small missile. Then it would be MRVs (multiple re-entry vehicles), not MIRVs.
> l
> LASTLY, the so-called "Stealth"...lol...The missile's ReV MAY have reduced RCS, but not the whole missile. Any long range radar can detect something THIS BIG. So please, fellow countrymen, stop fantasizing.
> 
> I do agree that the missile may have increased range (upto 1000 km), it may be faster, may have advanced counter measures to counter ABMs, better fuel, more compact and lesser launch preparation time.



Its the same JF-17 block-II euphoria again..
They take an incremental upgrade as having turned the thing into an F-22.

Although the question of MIRVs and MRVs is debatable since the I in MIRV is for independently targetable ..

So while the ReV's may be all pointed at the same target..they will manoeuvre separately.. and take different trajectories..
Pretty much what many cold war MIRV's were supposed to do.. and hence have increased effectiveness over a target area.

What it does imply is that since this has now been tested on the Shaheen-1..
these upgrades are more than likely going to be applied across the Shaheen series and all systems developed at NESCOM.
The KRL Ghauri series will fall back to second line systems and will eventually be phased out.

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## regular

Oscar said:


> You should prostrate before god in thanks that it did not!
> 
> 
> 
> Its the same JF-17 block-II euphoria again..
> They take an incremental upgrade as having turned the thing into an F-22.
> 
> Although the question of MIRVs and MRVs is debatable since the I in MIRV is for independently targetable ..
> 
> So while the ReV's may be all pointed at the same target..they will manoeuvre separately.. and take different trajectories..
> Pretty much what many cold war MIRV's were supposed to do.. and hence have increased effectiveness over a target area.
> 
> What it does imply is that since this has now been tested on the Shaheen-1..
> these upgrades are more than likely going to be applied across the Shaheen series and all systems developed at NESCOM.
> The KRL Ghauri series will fall back to second line systems and will eventually be phased out.


Yes! the Ghauri series will be the waste of money cuz it uses liquid fuel and are not so handy.....more heavy and bulky, hard to maintain for war......


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## DARKY

mafiya said:


> Have you gone made? XYZ said Blah Blah and you instantly believed because it suited your propaganda? What part of Intermediate Missile does not get into your brain? 1200-1500 Km is the latest version. Upgraded it's accuracy which mean Less CEP and for the sake of your LORD KRISHNA. Read previous pages, Some Ex General quoted 4000 Range which is entirely wrong and we have refuted this range in previous pages. SO stop BS'ing yourself and making others annoying.
> 
> And also put some sense in your brain when next you claim that Generals are making baseless claims while None of the Generals who are involved with missile program said anything or any other general. One Ex-GENERAL who made this claim was retired 18 years ago.



Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km which lies between short range and long range.. 

Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

neither does this makes your Shaheen 1A fly more than 1000km.. In fact its range would still be around 700km.. If it carries the same amount of payload and not a reduced one.. there is no modification done on the missile body Its still the old shaheen.. without those small canards(unless the weight is reduced substantially by the use of composite casings but in this case the weight has rather increased according to source and links posted)... Its your Generals and officials who are claiming nonsense...increasing the range of missile is not a big issue here... I can explain how its done in solid fuel missile but that would go over your head.

Now on the accuracy part.. care to explain what was put inside the last stage to make it more accurate or what kind of guidance was used through which the small thrusters correct the course in space.. or what CEP has the missile been able to achieve on the basis of deflection in degree per hour.

What time the missile took to reach its target and what trajectory did it follow...(the height of apogee..etc..).. before reaching the conclusion that the missile is the improved version and not just another version... until you have the answers of the following for your ALLAH's sake stop concluding baseless conclusions like imaginary range figures and alien abilities(such as being invisible to radar).


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## Peregrine

DARKY said:


> Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km which lies between short range and long range..


Even if the rumors, regarding this missile having intermediate range are preposterous, then to be precise, Pakistani's are dreaming not losing sleep. The only one's losing sleep over this are indians, attempting 24/7 to prove that they know more about this missile. And even after making your point, you people can't resist coming here. Seriously that's sick, in an obsessive kind of way.


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## Emmie

DARKY said:


> Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km *which lies between short range and long range*..



Intermediate range ballistic missiles are also known as long range ballistic missiles therefore IRBM lies between medium range and ICBM.



> neither does this makes your Shaheen 1A fly more than 1000km.. In fact its range would still be around 700km.. If it carries the same amount of payload and not a reduced one.. there is no modification done on the missile body Its still the old shaheen



Care to explain??


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## SQ8

DARKY said:


> Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km which lies between short range and long range..
> 
> Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> neither does this makes your Shaheen 1A fly more than 1000km.. In fact its range would still be around 700km.. If it carries the same amount of payload and not a reduced one.. there is no modification done on the missile body Its still the old shaheen.. without those small canards(unless the weight is reduced substantially by the use of composite casings but in this case the weight has rather increased according to source and links posted)... Its your Generals and officials who are claiming nonsense...increasing the range of missile is not a big issue here... I can explain how its done in solid fuel missile but that would go over your head.
> 
> Now on the accuracy part.. care to explain what was put inside the last stage to make it more accurate or what kind of guidance was used through which the small thrusters correct the course in space.. or what CEP has the missile been able to achieve on the basis of deflection in degree per hour.
> 
> What time the missile took to reach its target and what trajectory did it follow...(the height of apogee..etc..).. before reaching the conclusion that the missile is the improved version and not just another version... until you have the answers of the following for your ALLAH's sake stop concluding baseless conclusions like imaginary range figures and alien abilities(such as being invisible to radar).


All wonderful holier than thou words..but can you prove otherwise that it is not all that is stated?
just by looking at the picture or video?


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## Bratva

DARKY said:


> Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km which lies between short range and long range..
> 
> Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> neither does this makes your Shaheen 1A fly more than 1000km.. In fact its range would still be around 700km.. If it carries the same amount of payload and not a reduced one.. there is no modification done on the missile body Its still the old shaheen.. without those small canards(unless the weight is reduced substantially by the use of composite casings but in this case the weight has rather increased according to source and links posted)... Its your Generals and officials who are claiming nonsense...increasing the range of missile is not a big issue here... I can explain how its done in solid fuel missile but that would go over your head.
> 
> Now on the accuracy part.. care to explain what was put inside the last stage to make it more accurate or what kind of guidance was used through which the small thrusters correct the course in space.. or what CEP has the missile been able to achieve on the basis of deflection in degree per hour.
> 
> What time the missile took to reach its target and what trajectory did it follow...(the height of apogee..etc..).. before reaching the conclusion that the missile is the improved version and not just another version... until you have the answers of the following for your ALLAH's sake stop concluding baseless conclusions like imaginary range figures and alien abilities(such as being invisible to radar).



have you made shaheeen 1 A that you are making the most idotic comments that missile has not improved? Have you seen the inner side of shaheen where updates and improvements have been made actually?

Officials did not disclose any of the updates they have done with missile so your claims based on exteriors of missile is same so no improvement made is the most desperate attempt on your part.

Let me put some sense in to you. Ghauri is irbm having range of 1500. So when shaheen 1 A is declared IRBM by official army press release. Everone assumed it has a range of 1500 km. So when you don't know about the facts and figures of pakistani missiles, dont make desperate claims that we are imagining or making up claims

Dr.Samar mubarikmand, shaheen 1 missile program supervisior in an interview said shaheen 1 cep is around 15-20 meter. So improved accuracy must have put its accuracy at 10-15 m.


And all in all, why are you qouting some members who are making baseless claims of invisiible to radar or having range greater than 2000?

When you know, pakistan army didnot discloe anything yet about alpha updates why are you idiotocally asking same thing again and again.if you dont believe any update is made, then we are not forcing you to believe,except stop irritating us with your foolish repetitve arguments.

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## ChineseTiger1986

I think Pakistan is trying to fully master the re-entry technology of the warhead, after ICBM shouldn't be a major issue after all.


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## The Deterrent

DARKY said:


> Its your countrymen who have lost sleep over the intermediate range issue... intermediate range is not 1000-1500km.. but 2500-5500km which lies between short range and long range..
> 
> Intermediate-range ballistic missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> neither does this makes your Shaheen 1A fly more than 1000km.. In fact its range would still be around 700km.. If it carries the same amount of payload and not a reduced one.. there is no modification done on the missile body Its still the old shaheen.. without those small canards(unless the weight is reduced substantially by the use of composite casings but in this case the weight has rather increased according to source and links posted)... Its your Generals and officials who are claiming nonsense...increasing the range of missile is not a big issue here... I can explain how its done in solid fuel missile but that would go over your head.
> 
> Now on the accuracy part.. care to explain what was put inside the last stage to make it more accurate or what kind of guidance was used through which the small thrusters correct the course in space.. or what CEP has the missile been able to achieve on the basis of deflection in degree per hour.
> 
> What time the missile took to reach its target and what trajectory did it follow...(the height of apogee..etc..).. before reaching the conclusion that the missile is the improved version and not just another version... until you have the answers of the following for your ALLAH's sake stop concluding baseless conclusions like imaginary range figures and alien abilities(such as being invisible to radar).



Err dude...You want the details, released officially by the Army, right? We get it...

I am surprised that being in touch with Pakistani missiles news for so long, you still expect them to release any details. 
An upgrade is an upgrade if it is said so. Dont believe if you dont want to.

If the missile is officially designated an upgrade with a separate name, I'm sure that it has undergone massive upgrading. You really expect Pakistan not to do any upgrading on a missile, which was first test fired 12 years ago???

Of course we had to upgrade it!


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## Thorough Pro

Hi,

My brothers here are still focussed on range and have missed the most important aspect of the new missile, which is the ability to carry multiple warheads. 
1. 1 nuclear warhead of 300 kg + 1 conventinal warhead of 600 kg (or three nuclear warheads of 300 kg each)
2. Advanced fule giving higher speed (less time for the enemy to counter)
3. higher range 750 -> 1000 (33% increase, same tech applied to ShaheenII would increase its range to 2500->3300 KM)
4. Advanced ECM to provide more stealth.

One last request, DO NOT RESPOND TO TROLLS, Ijust ignore them.. thanks.

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## Last Hope

Conceal Carry said:


> Hi,
> 
> My brothers here are still focussed on range and have missed the most important aspect of the new missile, which is the ability to carry multiple warheads.
> 1. 1 nuclear warhead of 300 kg + 1 conventinal warhead of 600 kg (or three nuclear warheads of 300 kg each)
> 2. Advanced fule giving higher speed (less time for the enemy to counter)
> 3. higher range 750 -> 1000 (33% increase, same tech applied to ShaheenII would increase its range to 2500->3300 KM)
> 4. Advanced ECM to provide more stealth.
> 
> One last request, DO NOT RESPOND TO TROLLS, Ijust ignore them.. thanks.



Please. The range is not 1000. A official, who would like to be kept anonymous, stated the figure to be between 2,500 and upto 3,000 and said that this now is the longest-range missile in Pakistan's inventory.


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## laiqs@mi



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## Zarvan

Last Hope said:


> Please. The range is not 1000. A official, who would like to be kept anonymous, stated the figure to be between 2,500 and upto 3,000 and said that this now is the longest-range missile in Pakistan's inventory.


Sir the range is not 2500 to 3000 still not clear many news papers are reporting it to be 1500 KM


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## DARKY

mafiya said:


> have you made shaheeen 1 A that you are making the most idotic comments that missile has not improved? Have you seen the inner side of shaheen where updates and improvements have been made actually?
> 
> Officials did not disclose any of the updates they have done with missile so your claims based on exteriors of missile is same so no improvement made is the most desperate attempt on your part.
> 
> Let me put some sense in to you. Ghauri is irbm having range of 1500. So when shaheen 1 A is declared IRBM by official army press release. Everone assumed it has a range of 1500 km. So when you don't know about the facts and figures of pakistani missiles, dont make desperate claims that we are imagining or making up claims
> 
> Dr.Samar mubarikmand, shaheen 1 missile program supervisior in an interview said shaheen 1 cep is around 15-20 meter. So improved accuracy must have put its accuracy at 10-15 m.
> 
> 
> And all in all, why are you qouting some members who are making baseless claims of invisiible to radar or having range greater than 2000?
> 
> When you know, pakistan army didnot discloe anything yet about alpha updates why are you idiotocally asking same thing again and again.if you dont believe any update is made, then we are not forcing you to believe,except stop irritating us with your foolish repetitve arguments.



One get a little idea by looking at the picture and keeping in mind the state of R&D in Pakistan.
The missile clearly doesn't show weight reduction methods.. If it somehow exists then its being delliberately hidden with another layer of metal and paint.

Gauri 1 and 2 both are MRBM
Ghauri (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Pakistan's Missile Technology

I am only saying that the missile is just another version of Shaheen 1 weather or not its upgraded can only be said once the specs come out...
Musharraf approves another missile test
for example they can install GPS guidance inside the missile and make it have a very good CEP... you can call that some upgrade but the real upgrade would a new INS and Guidance which has improved upon the older ones in the missile.. (GPS are jammed very easily these days even Iran and NK does it)... Increased weight, MRV and a conventional warhead system... although a few things like post separation trajectory and altitude correction system can be termed as improvement if the earlier shaheen 1 didn't have that which is highly doubtful since it is having a CEP of 25-50m.


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## Arsalan

*News Video:*





*Launch Video:*


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## Last Hope

Zarvan said:


> Sir the range is not 2500 to 3000 still not clear many news papers are reporting it to be 1500 KM



Would you believe in the journalists or officials?
Dawn news, AFP, APP, BBC all quote the officials stating the range to be between 2500-3000 (which could be further increased to 3500 but that would be at cost of lower warhead).

General Talat Masood, told AFP intermediate range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres away.


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## Bratva

Last Hope said:


> Would you believe in the journalists or officials?
> Dawn news, AFP, APP, BBC all quote the officials stating the range to be between 2500-3000 (which could be further increased to 3500 but that would be at cost of lower warhead).
> 
> General Talat Masood, told AFP intermediate range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres away.



Anonymous sources like to spread the rumors and we know how they spread rumours of JF-17 block 2 upgrades, Qing class subarines, J-10 and also your sources turned out to be false most of the time so please don't forces your claims on others. Visual evidence points Shaheen 1 A to be a MRBM and seeing is more believing than depending upon XYZ anonymous sources


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## Bratva

DARKY said:


> *One get a little idea by looking at the picture and keeping in mind the state of R&D in Pakistan.*
> The missile clearly doesn't show weight reduction methods.. If it somehow exists then its being delliberately hidden with another layer of metal and paint.
> 
> Gauri 1 and 2 both are MRBM
> Ghauri (missile) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> Pakistan's Missile Technology
> 
> I am only saying that the missile is just another version of Shaheen 1 weather or not its upgraded can only be said once the specs come out...
> Musharraf approves another missile test
> for example they can install GPS guidance inside the missile and make it have a very good CEP... you can call that some upgrade but the real upgrade would a new INS and Guidance which has improved upon the older ones in the missile.. (GPS are jammed very easily these days even Iran and NK does it)... Increased weight, MRV and a conventional warhead system... although a few things like post separation trajectory and altitude correction system can be termed as improvement if the earlier shaheen 1 didn't have that which is highly doubtful since it is having a CEP of 25-50m.



Let me rebuke your Bold statment. After rebuking the bold statement, whatever written after it will become a rant and useless discussion.

Babur Guidance system. TERECOM and DSMAC Plus GPS. ALCM Guidance System. IR plus Terecom and DSMAC plus GPS. We miniaturized nuclear warheads upto such points where it can be fitted in to very small missiles like NASR battle field qausi ballistic missile.

That's the real R&D happening in Pakistan. Now which moron will deny that We can not upgrade our Ballistic missiles after developing such technologies????? Obviously Indians like YOU.

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## Last Hope

mafiya said:


> Anonymous sources like to spread the rumors and we know how they spread rumours of JF-17 block 2 upgrades, Qing class subarines, J-10 and also* your sources turned out to be false most of the time* so please don't forces your claims on others. Visual evidence points Shaheen 1 A to be a MRBM and seeing is more believing than depending upon XYZ anonymous sources



Please specify when.

And we are not forcing anyone to digest what we post. It is up to the person, whether to believe or not.

Quoting the source (You will find it in newspapers too): AFP: Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile



> The exact range of Pakistan's missile was not revealed, but retired General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told AFP intermediate-range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500-3,000 kilometres (1,550-1,850 miles) away -- which would put almost all of arch-rival India within reach.


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## Bratva

Last Hope said:


> Please specify when.
> 
> And we are not forcing anyone to digest what we post. It is up to the person, whether to believe or not.
> 
> Quoting the source (You will find it in newspapers too): AFP: Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile



Retired General Is obviously wrong and nor he is authority in the subject And can you clarify How modern day missile without any second stage vehicle can achieve 2500-3000 Km, Example is in your own backyard. Why Shaheeen 2 was developed if you can make missiles of 2500 KM with single stage?

Anonymous sources tend be absurd and illogical.

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## Last Hope

mafiya said:


> Retired General Is obviously wrong and nor he is authority in the subject And can you clarify How modern day missile without any second stage vehicle can achieve 2500-3000 Km, Example is in your own backyard. Why Shaheeen 2 was developed if you can make missiles of 2500 KM with single stage?
> 
> Anonymous sources tend be absurd and illogical.



Like I said again, you believe what you wish to, and I would believe what I feel is better.
Only time and official stats would answer that, I will try to get the 'official stat'.


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## The SC

If the Intermediate range is between 2500 km and 5000 km and the long range is from 5500 km and up, than agni5 with a 5000 km range in not an ICBM is it?

Please someone cares to explain.


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## Su-11

Agni-V is a MRBM.. Medium Range ballistic missile. The people who go around claiming it as an ICBM have no shame, or just ignorant.

It is clearly obvious that this single stage Missile which looks like the earlier Shaheen, only has a range less than 1000km. I dunno what propels people to inflate the range of this single stage missile... massive inferiority complex perhaps? Whatever be the case, if Pakistan has achieved 2500km then it should receive a nobel prize for breaking the laws of physics. The only way this missile can achieve that range if it has anti-gravity alien technology. Not to mention it is even peddled as stealthy! lol


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## v9s

Su-11 said:


> Agni-V is a MRBM.. Medium Range ballistic missile. The people who go around claiming it as an ICBM have no shame, or just ignorant.
> 
> It is clearly obvious that this single stage Missile which looks like the earlier Shaheen, only has a range less than 1000km. I dunno what propels people to inflate the range of this single stage missile... massive inferiority complex perhaps? Whatever be the case, if Pakistan has achieved 2500km then it should receive a nobel prize for breaking the laws of physics. The only way this missile can achieve that range if it has anti-gravity alien technology. Not to mention it is even peddled as stealthy! lol



Thank you for regurgitating what other Indian members have already posted in this thread once more. Drinks are to your left. Hope you have a pleasant stay.


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## Bubblegum Crisis

Su-11 said:


> It is clearly obvious that this single stage Missile which looks like the earlier Shaheen, only has a range less than 1000km. I dunno what propels people to inflate the range of this single stage missile... massive inferiority complex perhaps? Whatever be the case, if Pakistan has achieved 2500km then it should receive a nobel prize for breaking the laws of physics. The only way this missile can achieve that range if it has anti-gravity alien technology.




*Link « CSS-2 (DF-3, DF-3A) » :*

MissileThreat :: CSS-2 (DF-3, DF-3A)


*Link « Ghauri-II » :*

Ghauri-II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




> *Shaheen-1A: Pakistan tests nuclear-capable ballistic missile days after India's Agni V launch*
> 
> *AP Apr 26, 2012, 12.47AM IST*
> 
> *ISLAMABAD:* Pakistan successfully launched an upgraded ballistic missile capable of carrying a nuclear warhead Wednesday, days after its neighbor and archenemy India conducted its own missile test, the Pakistani military said.
> 
> *The Hatf IV Shaheen-1A missile was fired into the sea, the military said in a written statement. It was described as an intermediate-range missile having a longer range than its predecessor, the Shaheen-1, which is believed to fly up to 750 kilometers (465 miles).
> *
> *"The improved version of Shaheen-1A will further consolidate and strengthen Pakistan's deterrence abilities," said Lt. Gen. Khalid Ahmed Kidwai, who witnessed the launch and is responsible for the country's nuclear program. *
> 
> *Intermediate-range ballistic missiles have a range of 3,000 to 5,000 kilometers (1,865 to 3,110 miles), according to the website GlobalSecurity.org. *
> 
> *If the Shaheen-1A is indeed an intermediate-range missile, it would represent a quantum leap from the previous version. Pakistan's longest range missile before Wednesday's launch was believed to be the Shaheen II, with a range of 2,000 kilometers (1,240 miles). That is far enough to hit targets anywhere in India. *
> 
> India announced last Thursday that it had successfully test-launched a new nuclear-capable, long-range missile, the Agni-V, which has a range of 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles).
> 
> The US State Department urged restraint. "The Pakistanis have said it wasn't a direct response to the Indian test,'' spokeswoman Victoria Nuland said. ``But what's most important is that they do seem to have taken steps to inform the Indians, and we, as you know, are quite intent on those two countries continuing to work together and improve their dialogue."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _*This handout photograph released by the Pakistan's Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR) on April 25, 2012, shows a Hatf IV Shaheen-1A nuclear-capable intermediate range ballistic missile launched from an undisclosed location in Pakistan. Pakistan successfully test fired a nuclear-capable intermediate range ballistic missile on April 25, the military said, less than a week after India test launched a long range missile. The exact range of the missile was not revealed, but retired General Talat Masood, a defence analyst, told AFP intermediate range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres (1,550 to 1,850 miles) away, which would put almost all of arch-rival India within reach. (AFP)*_
> 
> Pakistan and India have fought three major wars since they achieved independence from the British empire in 1947. Relations have warmed somewhat over the last year, especially with respect to trade, but the two still consider each other enemies and regularly conduct tests of weapons systems to display their military prowess.
> 
> *"This is what has been happening over the past few years,'' said Talat Masood, a Pakistani defense analysts and retired army general."The tests by Pakistan and India follow each other to show that their programs are robust.'' *
> 
> India's latest test, however, was conducted with an eye toward its eastern neighbor, China, rather than its western neighbor, Pakistan. The Agni-V gave India the capability of striking Beijing and Shanghai for the first time, and the government hailed the launch as a major boost to its efforts to counter China's regional dominance and become an Asian power in its own right.
> 
> India had already achieved the ability to reach anywhere in Pakistan with the development of its Agni-I and Agni-II missiles, said Rahul Bedi, a defense analyst in India."Agni-V has nothing to do with Pakistan,'' said Bedi.
> 
> 
> *The Economic Times*




*Link wikipedia « The Economic Times » :*

The Economic Times - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




*Link wikipedia « Lieutenant General Talat Masood » :*

Talat Masood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


*Link wikipedia « Defence Science and Technology Organization (DESTO) » :*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DESTO_%28Pakistan%29


*Link Wikipedia « Pakistani missile research and development program » :
*
Pakistani missile research and development program - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


*Link Wikipedia « Pakistan Army Corps of Electrical and Mechanical Engineering » :*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_Army_Corps_of_Electrical_and_Mechanical_Engineering

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## RanaMubashir




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## farhan_9909

If it was really fired into Indian ocean

and mostly missiles are launched fromm jhelum in pak

so calculating the distance it comes upto 2300-2400km

so it is a extensive upgrade i must say

bt instead of this they should have opted and invested in the MIRV tech and fitting that onto the Shaheen IIA would be a more better option than this one


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## razgriz19

Last Hope said:


> Would you believe in the journalists or officials?
> Dawn news, AFP, APP, BBC all quote the officials stating the range to be between 2500-3000 (which could be further increased to 3500 but that would be at cost of lower warhead).
> 
> General Talat Masood, told AFP intermediate range ballistic missiles could reach targets up to 2,500 to 3,000 kilometres away.



yes it could, but not this particular missile.
Shaheen-2 can reach 2500-3000km.


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## DARKY

mafiya said:


> Let me rebuke your Bold statment. After rebuking the bold statement, whatever written after it will become a rant and useless discussion.
> 
> Babur Guidance system. TERECOM and DSMAC Plus GPS. ALCM Guidance System. IR plus Terecom and DSMAC plus GPS. We miniaturized nuclear warheads upto such points where it can be fitted in to very small missiles like NASR battle field qausi ballistic missile.
> 
> That's the real R&D happening in Pakistan. Now which moron will deny that We can not upgrade our Ballistic missiles after developing such technologies????? Obviously Indians like YOU.


 
Babur Guidance has got nothing to do with INS of a Ballistic missile.. it certainly isn't as easy as you think it to be... even Russian and Chinese haven't been able to master systems like ring leaser gyros... your IR, optical and whatever guidance used on babur won't work on any BM... you are free to consider yourself a moron here.

RE is certainly not R&D.. even on that note I would like to see how accurate is Babur CM against its target... take some effort and post a few images or videos of the missile hitting its target.. or hitting in the vicinity of the target.


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## Bratva

DARKY said:


> ]Babur Guidance has got nothing to do with INS of a Ballistic missile.. it certainly isn't as easy as you think it to be... even Russian and Chinese haven't been able to master systems like ring leaser gyros... your IR, optical and whatever guidance used on babur won't work on any BM... you are free to consider yourself a moron here.[/B]
> 
> RE is certainly not R&D.. even on that note I would like to see how accurate is Babur CM against its target... take some effort and post a few images or videos of the missile hitting its target.. or hitting in the vicinity of the target.



Unsubstantiated claims. What proof do you got that Pakistani ballistic missiles had the outdated Guidance systems? My prove is the official CEP told by head of shaheen-1 program which was 15-20 Meters and that was in early 2000. Ranting without fact and figure makes you look moron in a longer run. 

Second Fact. There were test videos of shaheen 1 on youtube which were removed later. Your Indian Buddy Markus has seen it. You can ask him that. From that video, A Flag was the impact point and when the missile exploded a casual eye could guess missile blasted 40-70 feet away from the flag which translates into 15-20 Meters.

These two facts have proved to me that what would be the actual CEP of shaheen 1. So how much you rant and cry, the spoken truth verified by the visual proof would beat anyone in the argument. Unless you bring forward any Visual or Spoken statement which would proof me wrong that "PAKISTANI BM" are outdated and have large CEP's.


Nah, i could not show you any Babur video hitting it's target. But there is firm believe in my heart and mind which tells me when a Ballistic missile of 700 Km range (Shaheen-1) had a CEP of 15-20 M. Then How come, The CRUISE MISSILE. Most Sophisticated guidance systems having TERECOM and DSMAC which can not be shot down and have proven again and again the CEP of 1-10 M in gulf war 1, gulf war 2, in Libya and cruise missile of Pakistan having same TERECOM and DSMAC plus the GPS guidance and same 700 KM would not have pin point accuracy and much lower CEP error than SHAHEEN-1.

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## graphican

farhan_9909 said:


> *bt instead of this they should have opted and invested in the MIRV tech and fitting that onto the Shaheen IIA would be a more better option than this one*




Anything which enemy has installed to hurt Pakistan is likely to be installed between 400-1000KM and Pakistan must have cost effective means to "settle" such targets and this missile is the right step towards that. We haven't witnessed any new missiles coming with extended range in the past several years and rather the new missiles have even shorter ranges, like Nasr with 60KM-100 KM range.

*In my books being potent is more important than appearing to be one and we are doing exactly that. *


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## Viper0011.

razgriz19 said:


> yes it could, but not this particular missile.
> Shaheen-2 can reach 2500-3000km.



I think I tried to post this earlier. They are being VERY SMART about the world politics when this test was conducted. They knew that putting a 5000 or above to test will cause world backlash and after all that's been going on, this was the last thing they wanted to do. Here's what got tested:
1) Extended range & certain stealthy features
2) Ability to target sea based slow moving targets 
3) Testing & switching of GPS as / when needed, from general GPS to Chinese
4) New / upgraded solid fuel tech & management systems
5) Some features of re-entry vehicle as this went hundreds of miles up, way more than anything before.

Now here's the common sense conclusion. If you take systems that were tested, put the tech from above into an extended fuel two stage Shaheen II or add another rocket / fuel stage to make it III, you just moved Shaheen III capable of around 5-6 k kilometers. Pak has designed some long range capability but they'll keep testing the technology on the smaller ones dubbed "as improvements" to avoid bad press and bit-cing from all sides

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## DANGER-ZONE

DARKY said:


> Babur Guidance has got nothing to do with INS of a Ballistic missile.. it certainly isn't as easy as you think it to be... even Russian and Chinese haven't been able to master systems like ring leaser gyros... your IR, optical and whatever guidance used on babur won't work on any BM... you are free to consider yourself a *moron* here.
> 
> RE is certainly not R&D.. even on that note *I would like to see how accurate is Babur CM against its target... take some effort and post a few images or videos of the missile hitting its target.. or hitting in the vicinity of the target*.



here is what u wanted to see ... 00:30 - 00:35 ... babur hitting target.






and for Moron thing ... don't even think of considering yourself a Moron. You are not suitable for the same title twice.

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## Bubblegum Crisis

razgriz19 said:


> yes it could, but not this particular missile.
> Shaheen-2 can reach 2500-3000km.




Yes, it&#8217;s true but the main interest lies elsewhere.


*Reissue:*


Observed.


*Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI*







*Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV*







Shaheen II (Length) 17.5 m - Shaheen IA (Length) 12 m = 5,5 m difference

Shaheen II (Diameter) 1.4 m - Shaheen IA (Diameter) 1 m = 0,5 m difference

Shaheen II (Weight ) 25,000 kg - Shaheen IA (Weight ) 9,500 kg = 15,500 kg difference



For the same &#8220;Operational range&#8221; of 2,500 km to 3,000 km for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; and &#8220;Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV&#8221;. 

A passage of 700 km to 2,500 km - 3,000 km of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV for a length, a diameter and a weight lower to &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221;. Giving a gain of 1,800 km - 2,300 km for Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV.

By approximation with a volume of fuel available now of about 15,500 kg for &#8220;Shaheen-II / Hatf-VI&#8221; or future &#8220;Shaheen-III&#8221;.

This is really a major advanced.

&#8220;If the information is really true concerning the new operational range of Shaheen-IA / Hatf-IV &#8221; to 2,500 km - 3,000 km. And there is a huge opportunity it is true. Then Shaheen-III can achieve now very easily the &#8220;Operational range ICBM of 5,000 km&#8221;.

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## The_magnificent

saiyan0321 said:


> isnt arabian sea part of the indian ocean
> 
> Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Indian Ocean - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



from the same source. look this pic please and educate yourself. 


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/71/Indian_Ocean_-_en_IHO.png


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## yyetttt

Shaheen IA is 3000 km since its Intermediate range


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## SamantK

Bubblegum Crisis said:


> *Link « CSS-2 (DF-3, DF-3A) » :*
> 
> MissileThreat :: CSS-2 (DF-3, DF-3A)
> 
> 
> *Link « Ghauri-II » :*
> 
> Ghauri-II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Link wikipedia « The Economic Times » :*
> 
> The Economic Times - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Link wikipedia « Lieutenant General Talat Masood » :*
> 
> Talat Masood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> *Link wikipedia « Defence Science and Technology Organization (DESTO) » :*
> 
> Defence Science and Technology Organization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> *Link Wikipedia « Pakistani missile research and development program » :
> *
> Pakistani missile research and development program - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> 
> *Link Wikipedia « Pakistan Army Corps of Electrical and Mechanical Engineering » :*
> 
> Pakistan Army Corps of Electrical and Mechanical Engineering - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Ok, I might even agree that it might be a IRBM, but what is the need to test it right after India does a test?
I mean, the projection is basically useless when you follow launches right after ours.. India already knows that Pakistan would do anything to make Indian cities in range but it still does not explain the tests right after ours..


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## yyetttt

samantk said:


> Ok, I might even agree that it might be a IRBM, but what is the need to test it right after India does a test?
> I mean, the projection is basically useless when you follow launches right after ours.. India already knows that Pakistan would do anything to make Indian cities in range but it still does not explain the tests right after ours..


 





We already have all Indian cities under our range

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## TaimiKhan

samantk said:


> Ok, I might even agree that it might be a IRBM, but what is the need to test it right after India does a test?
> I mean, the projection is basically useless when you follow launches right after ours.. India already knows that Pakistan would do anything to make Indian cities in range but it still does not explain the tests right after ours..



Well, Pakistan uses a very clever technique, which many of you guys are missing. Indian test gives us the opportunity to test from our side which is new and needs testing. taking the example of this current test, its a new version of Shaheen Missile which has been reshaped a little bit and added new features and it required testing, but since if we do the test first, all the western media cries foul play, thus we wait, when Indians test something it gives us the perfect opportunity to test what we want to, thus its labelled as tit for tat but in truth we tested our own new system without being labeled the one who took the first step, ours is called a retaliatory response.

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## SamantK

jellodragon said:


> We already have all Indian cities under our range


 Ok, are you happy now, can you explain the other part for which I was *really *looking for an answer?


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## TaimiKhan

samantk said:


> Ok, are you happy now, can you explain the other part for which I was *really *looking for an answer?



I believe i already answered that.


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## SamantK

TaimiKhan said:


> I believe i already answered that.


 Sorry you misunderstood, I was asking that despite having the capability to cover India, why Pakistan tests missiles only after India does?

Now, please answer..


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## TaimiKhan

samantk said:


> Sorry you misunderstood, I was asking that despite having the capability to cover India, why Pakistan tests missiles only after India does?
> 
> Now, please answer..



Did you even read what i answered ?? Have you checked my post #578.

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## SamantK

TaimiKhan said:


> Did you even read what i answered ?? Have you checked my post #578.


 Sorry I missed that post. The point you claim cannot be true always.. Agni V cannot not be used against Pakistan so where is the rationale in saying it was a retaliatory response. For other instances that reasoning might apply but im sure not for everything... This retaliatory respsonse still has left me clueless...


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## TaimiKhan

samantk said:


> Sorry I missed that post. The point you claim cannot be true always.. Agni V cannot not be used against Pakistan so where is the rationale in saying it was a retaliatory response. For other instances that reasoning might apply but im sure not for everything... This retaliatory respsonse still has left me clueless...



Sometimes it becomes very hard to make Indians understand. Retaliatory response is understood from your side, you guys say we Indians test missile and then Pak does the same, its retaliatory from your point of view and world's point of view, we all know Agni-V has nothing to do with us, Prithvi & Agni 1 are more then enough for us, but such tests fom your side which has nothing to do with us gives us an opportunity to test our own systems, especially our newer , upgraded missiles. 

hope this time i was clear enough..

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## SamantK

TaimiKhan said:


> Sometimes it becomes very hard to make Indians understand. Retaliatory response is understood from your side, you guys say we Indians test missile and then Pak does the same, its retaliatory from your point of view and world's point of view, we all know Agni-V has nothing to do with us, Prithvi & Agni 1 are more then enough for us, but such tests fom your side which has nothing to do with us gives us an opportunity to test our own systems, especially our newer , upgraded missiles.
> 
> hope this time i was clear enough..


 Ok, if you say opportunity its fine.. however, what Pakistan needs is more diplomatic muscle, see NK did a test and the world went into convolutions but Pakistan did not elicit that response.. if you can achieve an independence then this opportunity hunting will be less burden for you guys..


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## Peregrine

I read in a news paper that, with 1000 kg weight it has a range of 750 KM, but can strike targets at longer range too. 
*The real purpose of the test was the validation of a ballistic missile, three tube MLV. *

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## Sugarcane

samantk said:


> Ok, if you say opportunity its fine.. however, what Pakistan needs is more diplomatic muscle, see NK did a test and the world went into convolutions but Pakistan did not elicit that response.. if you can achieve an independence then this opportunity hunting will be less burden for you guys..



Either you don't live in this world or you don't have any idea about world affairs. Today - if a Pakistani farts west amplify it as this will blow them.

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## SamantK

loveicon said:


> Either you don't live in this world or you don't have any idea about world affairs. Today - if a Pakistani farts west amplify it as this will blow them.


 Dude, that is the exact reason I said that you guys need more diplomatic muscle so that the fart remains a harmless fart except for the people around not the nations around... 

I was actually putting the point that Pakistan can avoid the amplification if it does some work diplomatically... maybe your skin is too thick to understand.. I have enough idea about the world affairs, do not need lessons from some country and countrymen who could not have done worse in the world affairs for their country..


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## Sugarcane

samantk said:


> Dude, that is the exact reason I said that you guys need more diplomatic muscle so that the fart remains a harmless fart except for the people around not the nations around...
> 
> I was actually putting the point that Pakistan can avoid the amplification if it does some work diplomatically... maybe your skin is too thick to understand.. I have enough idea about the world affairs, do not need lessons from some country and countrymen who could not have done worse in the world affairs for their country..



You really don't have any Idea of World Affairs and what's happening other than in India - I am sure about it now.

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## TaimiKhan

samantk said:


> Ok, if you say opportunity its fine.. however, what Pakistan needs is more diplomatic muscle, see NK did a test and the world went into convolutions but Pakistan did not elicit that response.. if you can achieve an independence then this opportunity hunting will be less burden for you guys..



Why are you comparing Pk with NK ??? NK has a different situation, they do things through blackmail to get aid or concessions from west since they japan, s.korea, US are threatened by NK's aggressive behavior which is more like NK is ready for a war, while we have no one to threaten to nor we want concessions from anyone. 

Kindly be more rational when comparing Pak to NK, but are different countries with different regional environments.

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## SamantK

TaimiKhan said:


> Why are you comparing Pk with NK ??? NK has a different situation, they do things through blackmail to get aid or concessions from west since they japan, s.korea, US are threatened by NK's aggressive behavior which is more like NK is ready for a war, while we have no one to threaten to nor we want concessions from anyone.
> 
> Kindly be more rational when comparing Pak to NK, but are different countries with different regional environments.



The exact reason I compared Pakistan to Nk were they are incomparable.. a test by them is too bad but for you its just about an opportunity.. You guys are better off much better and you can improve that position by actually playing nice diplomatically.. and when time will be right you will need no opportunity shackles to test your missiles... hope even loveicon understand that im actually not comparing NK and PAK.. gosh!!! I actually was thinking how Pakistan can come out of the opportunity shackles...



loveicon said:


> You really don't have any Idea of World Affairs and what's happening other than in India - I am sure about it now.


 Read my post above and if you still do not understand you can put your head in Ice...


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## Sugarcane

samantk said:


> The exact reason I compared Pakistan to Nk were they are incomparable.. a test by them is too bad but for you its just about an opportunity.. You guys are better off much better and you can improve that position by actually playing nice diplomatically.. and when time will be right you will need no opportunity to test your missiles... hope even loveicon understand that im actually not comparing NK and PAK.. gosh!!! I actually was thinking how Pakistan can come out of the opportunity shackles...
> 
> Read my post above and if you still do not understand you can put your head in Ice...



Good God - how i missed the gems hidden in your post. Take Care & be safe


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## SamantK

loveicon said:


> Good God - how i missed the gems hidden in your post. Take Care & be safe


 thanks, im much safer here!


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## al_asad_al_mulk

*Shaheen 1A*
On 25 April 2012, Pakistan successfully test-launched an upgraded Shaheen I called Shaheen 1A. Like the US naming of the Pershing 1 and 1A, Pakistan has named both missiles as Shaheen 1 and 1A respectively. The features of the Shaheen 1A are similar to the United States MGM-31 Pershing 1A. The military said in a statement that the Shaheen 1A is a medium-range ballistic missile.[5] It is an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with better accuracy and double the range of its predecessor.[6]

The Pakistani military initially did not publicly reveal the range of the missile which lead to media speculation of the true range of the missile. The missile is also equipped with maneuverable reentry vehicle warheads designed to evade missile defense systems, he said.[7] The speed of the Shaheen 1A also provides an extremely high impact speed for nearby targets, enabling it to avoid any anti-ballistic missile defenses that may develop in the immediate region. A western official in Islamabad mentioned that the Shaheen 1A missile seems to have an improved ability to strike at its targets. It also has a more powerful engine, which means that it travels at scramjet speeds and can strike at longer distances than Shaheen-1.[8]

On 25th April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can carry either a single 1000kg warhead or be MIRVed with between 3 to 5 nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg each.[9] In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refueling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen 1A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Separation Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km

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## Edevelop

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> *Shaheen 1A*
> On 25 April 2012, Pakistan successfully test-launched an upgraded Shaheen I called Shaheen 1A. Like the US naming of the Pershing 1 and 1A, Pakistan has named both missiles as Shaheen 1 and 1A respectively. The features of the Shaheen 1A are similar to the United States MGM-31 Pershing 1A. The military said in a statement that the Shaheen 1A is a medium-range ballistic missile.[5] It is an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with better accuracy and double the range of its predecessor.[6]
> 
> The Pakistani military initially did not publicly reveal the range of the missile which lead to media speculation of the true range of the missile. The missile is also equipped with maneuverable reentry vehicle warheads designed to evade missile defense systems, he said.[7] The speed of the Shaheen 1A also provides an extremely high impact speed for nearby targets, enabling it to avoid any anti-ballistic missile defenses that may develop in the immediate region. A western official in Islamabad mentioned that the Shaheen 1A missile seems to have an improved ability to strike at its targets. It also has a more powerful engine, which means that it travels at scramjet speeds and can strike at longer distances than Shaheen-1.[8]
> 
> On 25th April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can carry either a single 1000kg warhead or be MIRVed with between 3 to 5 nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg each.[9] *In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refueling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched*. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen 1A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Separation Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km



If this is true then,

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## SamantK

Grerat, Can anyone point out the stealth features?


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## Zarvan

ISPR should end confusion and reveal the range of the missile as far as long range missiles are concerned we know that Pakistan is working on them and hope Pakistan reveals them soon to

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## al_asad_al_mulk

Zarvan said:


> ISPR should end confusion and reveal the range of the missile as far as long range missiles are concerned we know that Pakistan is working on them and hope Pakistan reveals them soon to


On 25th April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can carry either a single 1000kg warhead or be MIRVed with between 3 to 5 nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg each.[9] In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refueling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen 1A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Separation Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km


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## al_asad_al_mulk

Pakistan Test Fire Shaheeh 1-A
Specifications:
Shaheen 1-A (MIRV) / Stealth
Speed: 16 mach (possible scramjet type engine)
Range: 1500 KMS Max
Payload: Nuclear 3 warheads / HE 5 warheads
Platform Mobile / Underground Silo / Fast attack ships
Guidance: Terminal / Post sepration / GPS

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## al_asad_al_mulk

*Breaking News*
Pakistan have no plan for ICBM and this is for your info that shaheen 3 is ICBM with range more then 5500 Kms. With better egine and feul Pakistan Already increase the range of Shaheen 1-A 1500 kms & Shaheen 2-A range of 3500 to 4000 Kms with 5 mirv nuclear and 8 non-nuclear warheads if they feel they test only upgraded Shaheen 2 missile.

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## Desert Fox

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> *Shaheen 1A*
> On 25 April 2012, Pakistan successfully test-launched an upgraded Shaheen I called Shaheen 1A. Like the US naming of the Pershing 1 and 1A, Pakistan has named both missiles as Shaheen 1 and 1A respectively. The features of the Shaheen 1A are similar to the United States MGM-31 Pershing 1A. The military said in a statement that the Shaheen 1A is a medium-range ballistic missile.[5] It is an improved version of the Shaheen 1 with better accuracy and double the range of its predecessor.[6]
> 
> The Pakistani military initially did not publicly reveal the range of the missile which lead to media speculation of the true range of the missile. The missile is also equipped with maneuverable reentry vehicle warheads designed to evade missile defense systems, he said.[7] The speed of the Shaheen 1A also provides an extremely high impact speed for nearby targets, enabling it to avoid any anti-ballistic missile defenses that may develop in the immediate region. A western official in Islamabad mentioned that the Shaheen 1A missile seems to have an improved ability to strike at its targets. It also has a more powerful engine, which means that it travels at scramjet speeds and can strike at longer distances than Shaheen-1.[8]
> 
> On 25th April 2012, the ISPR revealed more information about the missile. The missile weight is approximately 10,000 kg, slightly heavier than its predecessor and can carry either a single 1000kg warhead or be MIRVed with between 3 to 5 nuclear warheads weighing between 200-300 kg each.[9] In addition, the Shaheen IA primarily contains sophisticated automated refueling and advanced stealth technology features that were not present in its previous version to avoid detections from radars. Even Pakistani radars could not track the missile after it was launched. All three Shaheen missiles, Shaheen I, Shaheen 1A and Shaheen II are reportedly equipped with the latest PSAC (Post-Separation Attitude Correction) system. This is a unique feature which consists of small thrusters that can adjust the warhead trajectory for greater accuracy and evading anti-ballistic missile defence systems. The features of the missile could also serve as a testbed of features which could be implemented on the yet to be deployed Shaheen III which could potentially have a range of 4500km



Please also post link to the source.


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## Last Hope

I confirmed with someone, the range of the missile is 1,000KM not 3,000KM according to a retired General.

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## al_asad_al_mulk

Desert Fox said:


> Please also post link to the source.


Shaheen-I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Dr. Strangelove

al_asad_al_mulk said:


> Shaheen-I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


COME ON WIKIPEDIA


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## shaheenmissile

Bratva said:


> I have observed something interesting, Is this thrust vector controls?


No. These are Jet vanes. Basically the same purpose as Thrust vectoring but a More simple,less expensive system.
Downside is that even in Neutral position the Control Blades are in Exaust's path and interfere with the thrusts,making a small reduction in the thrust.
With Gimbals Exhaust as used in Missile thrust vectoring,this interference is not there and missile attains a bit more power.


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