What's new

Why pray in Arabic and not in a language we understand?

Talking of reciting the quran in another language in prayers?

We read the Quran in arabic since we were kids, right? How many of us actually know the rules of qirat? The rules of qirat are expalined in the local language of any country.

When we do not even know the rules of qirat which - can be/are - explained in all languages apart from arabic why are you so keen to recite the quran in a different language?

When we are in an european or western country why do we learn the language of that country? Why does the governemnt of that country impose the national language on all the people to use it?

below part added later:

When we want to learn the litterature of any specific country why do we have to learn the original language in which it is written? Why don't we learn the french litterature for example in urdu or pushto or balauchi or sindhi Punjabi or kashmiri?
 
no ****! .................... I think it needs to be renamed! suggestions pls?
BTW hope u r not on the east coast!

I am just far away from Irene to see a bit of cloud and some rain later, but no worries. Thank you for asking though.

why is this fun?

odd thing to say, its somewhat serious.

It is a tragic comedy when a whole nation is worried about about abstractions than tangibles.

Why worry about the language of a divine text when none of it is practiced the way it is supposed to be? Why worry about learning Arabic when there are not enough schools to teach even basic alphabets?

Why worry about politics halfway across the world when all local politics is no more than petty thuggery? Why worry about ballistic missiles when the local law and order situation is as dire as it is?

Need I say more?

and your position on RD is well known, it was known as bending over.

I don't wish to take this thread off topic, but you are correct that the "bending over" was there, but happily it was NOT from my side, just as I predicted! :D
 
Below was posted by Muhammad Yahya here on 21-7-2010

-----


Aga Khan on Arabic as National Language of Pakistan

Sultan Muhammad Shah Aga Khan, the 48th Fatimid Imam Caliph and founder of Pakistan at a session of Motamer al-Alam-al-Islamiyya on February 9, 1951 in Karachi said:

“I can assure you that it is not with a light heart that I address you this evening. I fully realise that what I am going to say will make me most unpopular with important sections of the population. However, I would be a traitor to Islam if I let this opportunity pass without placing before the people of this powerful and populous Islamic nation the views which I consider my duty to place before the Muslims with as many of the arguments as I am capable of using in a short address.

I fear some of my arguments will mortally offend those who under totally different conditions gave so much of their life for the support of the cause which I think today has been passed by events far more important than any dreamt of in those days. I feel the responsibility greater than any I can think of to place my views and arguments before the Muslim population of Pakistan as a whole - each and every province - while what I consider a tragic and deadly step is not yet taken and not added to the constitution of this realm.

The language of a nation is not only the expression of its own voice but the mode of interpretation with all other human societies. Before it is too late, I, an old man, implore my brothers in Islam here not to finally decide for Urdu as the national language of Pakistan but to choose Arabic. Please hear my arguments.

If what was the other part of the former British Empire of India had made Urdu its national language, there would have been a great argument for Pakistan doing ditto. It could have been a linguistic and important point of contact with the vast Republic of the South. I am the last man on earth to desire to break any bridge of contact and understanding between Pakistan and its immense neighbour. Not only Urdu but even Hindustani has been replaced by Hindi throughout Bharat as the national language. The people of Bharat were perfectly justified to choose any language which the majority considered most appropriate and historically justified to be their national language. The majority there has the right to choose what was most suitable for them as the official language of the country.

Your choice in Pakistan of Urdu will in no way ameliorate or help your relations with your neighbour, nor will it help the Muslim minorities there in any conceivable way. Howsoever you may add Arabic and Persian words to Urdu there is no denying the fact that the syntax, the form, the fundamentals of the language are derived from Hindi and not from Arabic. Was Urdu the language of the Muslims of India at the time of their glory? During the long Pathan period, Urdu was never considered the language of the rulers.

Now we come to the Moghul Empire in the period of its glory. It was not the language of the educated. I defy anybody to produce a letter or any other form of writing by Emperors Aurangzeb, Shah Jehan, Jehangir, Akbar, Humayun or Babar in Urdu language. All that was spoken at the Court was Persian or occasional Turkish. I have read many of the writings of Aurangzeb and they are in beautiful Persian. Same is true if you go to the Taj Mahal and read what is written on the tombs of the Emperor and his famous consort. Persian was the court language and the language of the educated and even till the early 19th century in far Bengal, the Hindu intelligentsia wrote and used Persian and not Urdu. Up to the time of Macaulay, Persian was the language of Bengali upper classes irrespective of faith and of official documents and various Sadar Adalat. We must look historical facts in the face. Urdu became the language of Muslim India after the downfall. It is a language associated with the downfall. Its great poets are of the downfall period. The last and the greatest of them was lqbal, who with the inspiration of revival gave up Urdu poetry for Persian poetry. There was a meeting in Iqbal’s honour in London organised by men such as Prof. Nicholson. I was present at that meeting. Iqbal said that he went in for Persian poetry because it was associated with the greatness of the Islamic epoch and not with its misfortunes. Is it right that the language of the downfall period should become the national language of what we hope now is a phoenix-like national rising? All the great masters of Urdu belong to the period of greatest depression and defeat. It was then a legitimate attempt by the use of a language of Hindi derivation with Arabic and Persian words to find ways and means of better understanding with the then majority fellow countrymen.

Today that vast British dependency is partitioned and succeeded by two independent and great nations and the whole world hopes that both sides now accept partition as final. Is it a natural and national language of the present population of Pakistan? Is it the language of Bengal where the majority of Muslims live? Is it what you. hear in the streets of Dacca or Chittagong? Is it the language of the North West Frontier? Is it the language of Sind? Is it the language of the Punjab? Certainly after the fall of the Mughal Empire the Muslims and Hindus of certain areas found in it a common bond, but now today other forms of bridges must be found for mutual understanding. Who were the creators of Urdu? What are the origins of Urdu? Where did it come from? The camp followers, the vast Hindi-speaking population attached to the Imperial Court who adapted, as they went along, more Arabic and Persian words into the syntax. of their own language just as in later days the English words such as glass and cup became part of a new form of Urdu called Hindustani. Are you going to make the language of the Camp, or of the Court, the national language of your new-born realm? Every Muslim child of a certain economic standard learns the Quran in Arabic, whether he is from Dacca or Quetta. He learns Arabic to read the Quran.

Arabic is the language of Islam. The Qur’an is in Arabic. The Prophet’s hadith are in Arabic. The highest form of Islamic culture in Spain was in Arabic. Your children must learn Arabic to a certain extent always. The same is true of your West whether Sind, Baluchistan or the North. From the practical and worldly point of view, Arabic will give you, as a national language, immediate contact not only with the 40 million Arabic-speaking people of independent nations on your West, but the other 60 million more or less Arabic-speaking people who are not independent but who exist in Africa. Right up to the Atlantic, not only in North but as far South as Nigeria and the Gold Coast, Arabic is known to the upper classes of the population. In all the Sudans, on the Nile or under French rule, Arabic is the language right up to the borders of Portuguese West Africa. In East Africa, not only in Zanzibar but amongst the Muslim population of even countries as far apart as Madagascar and Portuguese East Africa, Arabic is known. If we turn to the Far East, Arabic has prospered throughout the region inhabited by 80 million Muslims of Indonesia, Malaya and Philippines. In Ceylon, Muslim children of the well-to-do classes get some knowledge of Arabic.

Is it not right and proper that this powerful Muslim State of Pakistan, with its central geographical position, its bridges between the nearly 100 million Muslims of the East and 100 million Muslims of the West - its position of the East from Philippines and the Great State of Indonesia and Malaya and Burma and then westward with the hundred millions in Africa, right up to the Atlantic, should make Arabic its national language and not isolate itself from all its neighbors and from the world of Islam with a language that was associated with the period of downfall of Muslim States.

And finally, whi1e Arabic, as a universal language of the Muslim world will unite, Urdu will divide and isolate. Gentlemen, brothers in Islam, people of Pakistan, people of every Province, I appeal to you, before you take the final and what I unfortunately must say, I consider, the fatal jump down the precipice, please discuss and let all and every one contribute their views. Take time and think over it. Once more I appeal for Islamic charity from those whom I may have offended and I appeal to all others to look to the facts in the face both historically and as they exist at present. I pray that the people of this country may be guided by Divine Wisdom before they decide.”
 
It is because it is standard
Allah says in Quran that I(Allah) have make this(quran) easy for you to understand. there is also other ayats about the arabic context of quran and besides Holy Quran is translated almost into evey language you can read translation to understand or you can also learn Arabic language
2) the other reason is that the Arabic language is the most versatile language of all one word in arabic has so much meaning and usage.
3)The Holy Prophet(S.A.W) belongs to Arab.
4)Arabic is the language in After Life
5)As for Traveeh is concerned, in some mosques the imam after traveeh explain the context of the chapter ha has recited..
6)The uneducated people should educate themselves.
7)if every one is going to offer prayer in his own language then there must conflict which arose among the people as the difference of understanding and difference of translation
8)So to unit all the muslims arabic is made a standard by Allah you may go anywhere in the world you will find unity.

It is a great thinking but every thing has its own place in Islam , Arabic the Language of our Holy Prophet ,The language chosen for the ultimate Code and Order ( QURAN ) , the language of the Heaven and Paradise . How can anyone deny that even if u not understand it , only listening to it is a great blessing :angel:
and talking about Arabic understanding to some extent ( at least to grab the main Idea of an AYYAT ) some years back Arabic was taught in our School courses but then the Education Ministry drop that :undecided:
But even now there are many places in our city or area where we can get short courses of Arabic Language and Not even listen to it but also make it enter in our whole personal life and Body language :agree:
 
I couldnt agree with you more.. nu bia whats the problem then.
But that must not come at the cost of ignoring the original text.. precisely for the reason that when asked about what he understood he can bring up the original text and recite it.. and then repeat it in his/her own language that YES .. this is what I read and understood.
It is the same as my friend from Germany read it.. and understood it.

The problem is seems has more to do with the apathy of the clergy..
and some apathy on part of the people who have not taken the time to explore.
The Khutba at the masjid still has people explaining the Quran in the local language...but people prefer to just come and offer the prayers and leave. Sure .. people have obligations.. so they can use their spare time to read a translation of the Quran in their own language..and be able to understand more and more of what is being recited.


Actually the problem has to do with "compulsion" La iqra Fideen is a basic idea - If someone wants to recite prayers or read Quran in whatever language they want, what possible objection can anyone else have to what any individual chooses for him or herself - but when the state uses her power to coerce and force people, well then, that's what all of this ferment is really about.

It is not an accident that newspapers and blogs are full of these ideas - fact of the matter is people are sick and tired of being forced to embrace this false religiosity - When ever people are forced to give up their conscience to the state, there will always be a rejection of this idea.
 
In Christianity, my religion, we make efforts to translate the holy bible into all known languages in the world. In kerala, church sermons, services are all conducted in Malayalam ( this includes reading from a Malayalam bible) . Christians strive to convert the text to the local language so that people may be able to relate to it and grasp the true meaning of what is being conveyed. For a true understanding of ones religion, one has to able to read, understand and interpret the text for himself/herself. Until then, you are just another drone.
 
If one cannot relate to his/her religion; if one cannot look to it for solace and hope; then religion has failed its purpose.
 
Assalam alaikum

i love it when some never accept the verse of quran or hadeeth but when it suits them they use it without regard that verse was intended to kuffars or muslims, a muslim can't have a masjed and start praying fajar as 6 raka'a and will say " La iqra Fideen " and let me do what i want and don't force me pray 2 raka'a. The govt. has to come and force him to no do it otherwise it will be fitna.

TARIQ
 
For a true understanding of ones religion, one has to able to read, understand and interpret the text for himself/herself. Until then, you are just another drone.

Quran repeated makes the individual responsible for the Quality of his or her faith - but since this "islamization", we have been pushed into a straight jacket of Wahabi dogma -- it is unfortunate that otherwise reasonable people cannnot understand that there as many way to get to God as there are faithful - and to insist that peole be pushed into a single dogmatic view, is to risk much, especially the authority which coerces you.
 
The reason is simple its not rocket science. The moment you translate verses into
other languages and use other languages (whole Quran can't be learnt by heart in English/Urdu yet in Arabic it can be learnt by heart word to word...this is the miracle of Quran and such a person is known as hafiz) instead of arabic, Holy Quran will God For Bid suffer the same fate as New and Old Testaments. They were translated from Hebrew/Armaic to Latin and then to English due to which the original meaning of many verses got changed.
 
In Christianity, my religion, we make efforts to translate the holy bible into all known languages in the world. In kerala, church sermons, services are all conducted in Malayalam ( this includes reading from a Malayalam bible) . Christians strive to convert the text to the local language so that people may be able to relate to it and grasp the true meaning of what is being conveyed. For a true understanding of ones religion, one has to able to read, understand and interpret the text for himself/herself. Until then, you are just another drone.

can you some how find the original pure form of bible?- so many traslations brought so many changes in the teachings-
there are versions of bible in different languages, whose teachings contradict with each other?- True?-
 
It is a great thinking but every thing has its own place in Islam , Arabic the Language of our Holy Prophet ,The language chosen for the ultimate Code and Order ( QURAN ) , the language of the Heaven and Paradise . How can anyone deny that even if u not understand it , only listening to it is a great blessing :angel:
and talking about Arabic understanding to some extent ( at least to grab the main Idea of an AYYAT ) some years back Arabic was taught in our School courses but then the Education Ministry drop that :undecided:
But even now there are many places in our city or area where we can get short courses of Arabic Language and Not even listen to it but also make it enter in our whole personal life and Body language :agree:

As per an article of the constitution, teaching Arabic is to be facilitated by the government, but that article like many other articles which can make a big difference in the life of the normal Pakistani was and is still being neglected.
 
Mesh quran is translated in many languages in urdu etc, but it is upto an individual how he gives importance to understand it in his language, and doesnot have to wait till he comes to prayer time and say oh my God i don't know what the imam is saying

TARIQ
 
The argument is circular and self serving - It's not Imam who should care if anyone understands him, it's the individual who must work to understand the Imam
 
As per an article of the constitution, teaching Arabic is to be facilitated by the government, but that article like many other articles which can make a big difference in the life of the normal Pakistani was and is still being neglected.
Ok Government is to blamed , but what we intend on our own selves , how many of us ever tried to learn even the basic Arabic language from a great facility available to us :Internet :argh:
 

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom