When the true downfall of Pakistan began

TheSolution · Feb 12, 2023

Menace2Society said:
Pakistan and Afghanistan are already at war since last 20 years. Just because they are called TTP doesn't mean they are not Afghans.

Don't bother with people like @doorstar , if they are unable to see the issue with Afghanistan today, then no amount of explaining can help them understand.

It is a simple case of not possessing the intellectual capacity required, or a case of inferiority Muslim bradar complex.

Erieye · Feb 12, 2023

Maula Jatt said:
yeah but that was what 40-50 years ago, great nations are known for course corrections
instead of crying we should correct our course (B- Zia brought mass corruption in politics, army, bureaucracy, radicalization aside)

We must learn from history.

There is an important thing we need to take from this, too much nationalisation is not good. Free market economy means more quality and productivity.

It is unfair how they took that man's company. If the government wanted to go down that route they should have opened their own parallel company.

Imran Khan · Feb 12, 2023

it was started in 1948

Genghis khan1 · Feb 12, 2023

Bleek said:
Pakistani is a haram khor opportunistic selfish and greedy bastard.

Being selfish, greedy and opportunistic is human nature but not being Haram khor. Only difference between Pakistani and rest of the develop world is being Haram khor. Because Gora isn’t Haram khor they develop robust accountability measures for their greed, selfishness and opportunistic society and they don’t do Haram khori when it comes to Justice.

ziaulislam · Feb 12, 2023

Bleek said:
@Areesh @PakFactor @Meengla @Goenitz @Goritoes @Signalian @PanzerKiel @villageidiot @Mirzali Khan @_NOBODY_ @Erieye @Sayfullah @Olympus81 @N.Siddiqui @Maula Jatt @Muhammad Saftain Anjum @Dalit @Ali_Baba @ziaulislam

Whatever Bhutto did was with consent of military

Genghis khan1 said:
Being selfish, greedy and opportunistic is human nature but not being Haram khor. Only difference between Pakistani and rest of the develop world is being Haram khor. Because Gora isn’t Haram khor they develop robust accountability measures for their greed, selfishness and opportunistic society and they don’t do Haram khori when it comes to Justice.

Disagree

Don't believe me ?

ask 100 people is corruption from PMLN or PDM okay as long as dollar comes to 100. Everyone will say yes and khata hey tu lagata be hey

Then go to western country and ask is corruption fine or okay.

You will get your answer

Mirzali Khan · Feb 12, 2023

Bleek said:
@Areesh @PakFactor @Meengla @Goenitz @Goritoes @Signalian @PanzerKiel @villageidiot @Mirzali Khan @_NOBODY_ @Erieye @Sayfullah @Olympus81 @N.Siddiqui @Maula Jatt @Muhammad Saftain Anjum @Dalit @Ali_Baba @ziaulislam @FuturePAF

True downfall began the moment it was made.

Menace2Society said:
Pakistan and Afghanistan are already at war since last 20 years. Just because they are called TTP doesn't mean they are not Afghans.

Pakistan and Afghanistan have been at war with each other since 1947.

It just took different forms and environments.

Menace2Society · Feb 12, 2023

Zia was the biggest cause after ZAB.

Allowed in Afghan refugees

Supported Afghan Pashtuns

Introduced the Sharifs to politics

ZAB's nationalisation was the first nail in the coffin.

Once the Sharifs and Bhuttos took a stranglehold of the country they corrupted everything including the army.

Genghis khan1 · Feb 12, 2023

ziaulislam said:
Whatever Bhutto did was with consent of military
Disagree

Don't believe me ?

ask 100 people is corruption from PMLN or PDM okay as long as dollar comes to 100. Everyone will say yes and khata hey tu lagata be hey

Then go to western country and ask is corruption fine or okay.

You will get your answer

Because they are at a different stage where accountability is ingrained into their society. Same Goras will go to other countries with weaker accountability laws and do all kinds heinous acts. Thousands of Americans have their companies registered offshore to evade Taxes. A legal loophole.

Salaries of CEOs of all major companies are linked with performance in stock prices, because companies knows greed is a motivating factor for CEOs to perform better. Guess, Who end up getting the short end of the stick, average employee with long hrs and society in many ways.

So greed is everywhere.

TheSolution · Feb 12, 2023

Mirzali Khan said:
True downfall began the moment it was made.

Pakistan was thriving after its establishment, the Korean's were inspired by its economic model, it had one of the best space programs in Asia and was doing far better than India.

Although it may be true from your perspective however I would strongly disagree.

Mirzali Khan · Feb 12, 2023

Bleek said:
Pakistan was thriving after its establishment, the Korean's were inspired by its economic model, it had one of the best space programs in Asia and was doing far better than India.

Although it may be true from your perspective however I would strongly disagree.

It was “thriving” because it got lucky with select leaders.

The entire state machinery from 1947 always ensured it to be set up for failure.

TheSolution · Feb 13, 2023

Mirzali Khan said:
It was “thriving” because it got lucky with select leaders.

The entire state machinery from 1947 always ensured it to be set up for failure.

The same can be said for select bad leaders.

The failure of the state machinery is entirely a self-imposed problem.

Meengla · Feb 13, 2023

Bleek said:
@Areesh @PakFactor @Meengla @Goenitz @Goritoes @Signalian @PanzerKiel @villageidiot @Mirzali Khan @_NOBODY_ @Erieye @Sayfullah @Olympus81 @N.Siddiqui @Maula Jatt @Muhammad Saftain Anjum @Dalit @Ali_Baba @ziaulislam @FuturePAF

Nonsense.
Firstly, Bhutto had the mandate for his 'socialism' via the 1971 elections. That was the zeitgeist of the 1960s, right or wrong. Also, it is an urban myth that his socialism 'destroyed' Pakistan. Some large industries were 'nationalized' but not most of the industry. My family has bees in textile mill business since before the Partition of 1947 and still have a prosperous textile mill in the SITE area of Karachi. We more than survived Bhutto's nationalization. If anything, I am very glad the workers were given some 'rights'! I still remember in front of our textile mill office small signs/boards appeared for something like 'Employees Age Old Benefits' in the 1970s. Workers were given rights even if it meant my family had to cough up some extra money.

Quit exaggerating Bhutto's 'socialism'!! It had some negative impact but it was not something that destroyed Pakistan. Under Ayub Khan, a guy I deeply admire like I admire Musharraf, wealth was too concentrated. You know the fabled '22 families' having bulk of the Pakistani wealth??

PS. The famous 'CHHIPA' welfare organization based in Karachi are my distant relatives. The word 'CHHIPA' is derived from 'Cheepa' which is a clan from India of which I am a part of, and the word literally means 'printers' as from textiles!

Mirzali Khan · Feb 13, 2023

Bleek said:
The same can be said for select bad leaders.

The failure of the state machinery is entirely a self-imposed problem.

Fair point but as @Maula Jatt said most countries are able to self correct.

There’s a reason why we aren’t able to “self-correct” and it’s deeper than the army.

TheSolution · Feb 13, 2023

Mirzali Khan said:
Fair point but as @Maula Jatt said most countries are able to self correct.

There’s a reason why we aren’t able to “self-correct” and it’s deeper than the army.

What do you propose it is?

There's a group of issues and the political system, government policy, and socioculture is part of it.

I don't see self-correction as something impossible as you would imply.