KSA, the UAE to get submarines

[Yzd Khalifa]

Saudi Arabia, UAE Eye Fincantieri Submarine Acquisitions; Achille Fulfaro Comments
Feb 10th, 2014 · 0 Comment
Italian shipbuilder Fincantieri plans to hold submarine acquisition talks with government customers in Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, Defense News reported Sunday.

Awad Mustafa writes Saudi Arabia also wants to purchase more than a dozen German-built Type 209 submarines worth $3.4 billion combined.

German newspaper Bild originally reported the details of that transaction.

Achille Fulfaro, Fincantieri Middle East naval executive and general manager of Etihad Ship Building, said the two countries will assess small- to medium-sized submarines, according to Defense News.

“With the experience of the Italian navy and with the existing cooperation with the UAE, we can create a program for the development of small submarines,” Fulfaro said.

Fulfaro also said the potential order could be for submarines weighing between 300 and 1,000 metric tons, according to the report.

Mustafa writes that Fincantieri plans to develop the fleet at the Abu Dhabi-based facilities of Etihad, a joint venture with Al Fattan Shipyard and Melara Middle East.

- See more at: Saudi Arabia, UAE Eye Fincantieri Submarine Acquisitions; Achille Fulfaro Comments

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

@Yzd Khalifa

u r directly going for 12 subs

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

UAE, Saudi Arabia want to buy submarines
Staff Report
Published February 10, 2014

ABU DHABI: There is a growing market for submarines in the Middle East, with the United Arab Emirates and Saudi Arabia both having expressed their intention to purchase them, assuming a threat perception in the region.

According to Achille Fulfaro, Middle East naval executive for Italian shipbuilder Fincantieri and general manager of Etihad Ship Building, these deals could come through “in the near future,” and the two military powers of the have expressed interest in the acquisition of small to medium submarines.

The submarine threat was deemed to be high, so a deterrent anti-submarine vessel has already been acquired by the UAE navy. Fulfaro said: “One of the critical issues of the region is the anti-submarine issue and this is the reason why we delivered to the UAE Navy a highly developed anti-submarine warfare vessel last year.”

He expected discussion to proceed to the acquisitions of submarines, next. He said: “We assume that countries like Saudi Arabia and the UAE, in the near future, will start with deep discussions regarding their submarine fleet.”

Describing these discussions as “very sensitive”, he said: “We need to create in the country specific skills and know how to manage such an important fleet,” reports Defense News.

UAE and Saudi government representatives could not be contacted for their comments at the moment, though UAE Naval Commander Rear Adm. Ibrahim al-Musharrakh had said last year the navy wants submarines to combat threats.

Speaking at the Gulf Naval Commanders’ Conference in Abu Dhabi last November, Musharrakh had said: “There are many different options for combating the threat of submarines in the region, for building the capacity and the capability to acquire submarines is something that is still under process and will take a long time. What we need is something within reach that we can use to counter the threat now; in the long term, you will probably see naval forces in the region acquiring submarines.”

It was in November itself that the German Bild newspaper had quoted German government sources in saying that Saudi Arabia wanted to buy five German submarines and more than two dozen more in the future. It also talked about German-made Type 209 submarines, and the cost was estimated at $3.4 billion.

Fulfaro said the requirement is for submarines in the 300-1,000 metric tons region.

@Yzd Khalifa

u r directly going for 12 subs

Maybe

 

[Armstrong]

Maybe

Without having Operated Submarines ever ?

Wouldn't it make more sense to buy 1-2 first in addition to sending your Submariners to Germany, France, the US, Turkiye or even Pakistan for a 1-2 stint before placing a follow up order of 8-10 Subs ?

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

Industry: UAE, Saudi Arabia Plan Purchases
Feb. 9, 2014 - 03:45AM |
By AWAD MUSTAFA | Comments

• World News
• Europe

ABU DHABI — The United Arab Emirates and Saudi Arabia are expected to launch discussions on submarine acquisitions “in the near future,” according to an executive with Italian shipbuilder Fincantieri.

Achille Fulfaro, Middle East naval executive for Fincantieri and general manager of Etihad Ship Building, said the two regional military powers are expected to examine small to medium submarines.

“One of the critical issues of the region is the anti-submarine issue and this is the reason why we delivered to the UAE Navy a highly developed anti-submarine warfare vessel last year,” Fulfaro said. “We assume that countries like Saudi Arabia and the UAE, in the near future, will start with deep discussions regarding their submarine fleet.”

He said the “discussions are very sensitive” because “we need to create in the country specific skills and know how to manage such an important fleet,” he added.

Representatives from the UAE and Saudi Arabia governments could not be reached for comment by press time.

Last year, UAE Naval Commander Rear Adm. Ibrahim al-Musharrakh said the UAE Navy is looking to acquire submarines to combat threats in the gulf’s littoral waters.

“There are many different options for combating the threat of submarines in the region, for building the capacity and the capability to acquire submarines is something that is still under process and will take a long time,” Musharrakh said at the Gulf Naval Commanders Conference in Abu Dhabi in November.

“What we need is something within reach that we can use to counter the threat now; in the long term, you will probably see naval forces in the region acquiring submarines,” he said.

In November, German government sources said Saudi Arabia wanted to buy five German submarines and more than two dozen more in the future, according to Bild newspaper.

The German-made Type 209 submarines were estimated at a cost of $3.4 billion, according to the newspaper.

One of the key factors in developing the submarines, Fulfaro said, would be the involvement of the Italian Navy.

“With the experience of the Italian Navy and with the existing cooperation with the UAE, we can create a program for the development of small submarines,” he said.

Fulfaro added that the requirement is expected to be for small to medium submarines th at are between 300 and 1,000 tons metric tons. “We assume that here in this region the core business is going to be small submarines.”

The Italian shipbuilder in 2010 established Etihad Ship Building, a joint venture with Al Fattan Shipyard and Melara Middle East. Last year, it delivered two Falaj-class stealth offshore patrol vessels and an Abu Dhabi-class stealth corvette.

According to Fulfaro, in 2013 Etihad Ship Building won a €100 million (US $135 million) contract for services, logistics and maintenance of combatant vessels.

“We signed the services contract and Fincantieri delivered the first Falaj-class and Abu Dhabi-class vessels with in the right timeframe and budget,” he said. “The trials phase has been completed with the complete satisfaction of the client and now we expect to close negotiations on further Falaj- and Abu Dhabi-class vessels,” he added.

The negotiations on the Falaj program are expected to be completed quickly, he said.

Furthermore, the company is planning to expand its presence in the Arabian Gulf.

Last year the company signed a contract with the Iraqi Navy for the maintenance of four patrol vessels at Etihad.

“For Qatar, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia in 2014, the negotiations will start and we will go in to deep analysis of their requirements and we hope to create the conditions for production,” he added.

Etihad facilities in Abu Dhabi will be the base of services and production; however, Fulfaro said his company is open to discussing specific programs or joint ventures if it is a requirement, then continue the Etihad joint venture model. ■

Without having Operated Submarines ever ?

Wouldn't it make more sense to buy 1-2 first in addition to sending your Submariners to Germany, France, the US, Turkiye or even Pakistan for a 1-2 stint before placing a follow up order of 8-10 Subs ?

A delivery of 10 - 8 subs may take up to 15 years to 20 years.

We've been operating the PN's subs since the late 80s. Usually, one of PN's subs is deployed in Jeddah.

Pakistan has a word on this.

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Without having Operated Submarines ever ?
Wouldn't it make more sense to buy 1-2 first in addition to sending your Submariners to Germany, France, the US, Turkiye or even Pakistan for a 1-2 stint before placing a follow up order of 8-10 Subs ?

They are Arabs, all they have to do is touch something and they automatically know how to use it.

T212s are more than 1,000 Metric Tons. So this project will either lessen the weight, by taking off some support beams (since depth is not much in the Gulf) or Lighter metals.

Or create a new Sub.

But, i'm not getting this. Subs, if purchased, don't need to be in the Gulf or Red Sea. They'll probably be in the Arabian Sea. Other wise you might as well get upgraded Midget Subs that can fire missiles. So a 300-1,000 MTon sub doesn't make sense.

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

I dislike the way you try to assert racial profiling in a sarcastic sense.

I guess some people are insanely mad or maybe jealous.

They are Arabs, all they have to do is touch something and they automatically know how to use it.

T212s are more than 1,000 Metric Tons. So this project will either lessen the weight, by taking off some support beams (since depth is not much in the Gulf) or Lighter metals.

Or create a new Sub.

But, i'm not getting this. Subs, if purchased, don't need to be in the Gulf or Red Sea. They'll probably be in the Arabian Sea. Other wise you might as well get upgraded Midget Subs that can fire missiles. So a 300-1,000 MTon sub doesn't make sense.

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

I dislike the way you try to assert racial profiling in a sarcastic sense.
I guess some people are insanely mad or maybe jealous.

..... Come on Scarface no Sarcasm?

The Saudi Navy always had friends in the Pak Navy, explaining why usually there were PN ships on 'Port Call' in Saudi Ports.

But French and German/Italian subs are different platforms.

Any fear that this will be seen as "escalation" by 'enemies' in the region?

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

Is that what you got?


@Imran Khan is a PN Naval officer in KSA. Ask him if there is a thing in there barring to the French sub.

Dismissed

..... Come on Scarface no Sarcasm?

The Saudi Navy always had friends in the Pak Navy, explaining why usually there were PN ships on 'Port Call' in Saudi Ports.

But French and German/Italian subs are different platforms.

Any fear that this will be seen as "escalation" by 'enemies' in the region?

 

[Sargodhian_Eagle]

Without having Operated Submarines ever ?

Wouldn't it make more sense to buy 1-2 first in addition to sending your Submariners to Germany, France, the US, Turkiye or even Pakistan for a 1-2 stint before placing a follow up order of 8-10 Subs ?

Dude, $$$$$$ always matters and Arab brothers have a lot of $$$ to buy any stuff.

It will cost only few barrels of oil to our bro @Yzd Khalifa

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

Dude, $$$$$$ always matters and Arab brothers have a lot of $$$ to buy any stuff.

It will cost only few barrels of oil to our bro @Yzd Khalifa

But that doesn't mean they're gonna buy it all out

Don't forget Pakistan, our closet ally

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Is that what you got?

Good to see you warming up to me.

At the end of the day $$$$$ talks, French, German/Italian, whoever will give SA, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain whatever they want for a small increase in fee of course.

 

[Sargodhian_Eagle]

But that doesn't mean they're gonna buy it all out

Don't forget Pakistan, our closet ally

yup, if KSA will buy these submarines, i will take a ride to see some sharks in Arabian Ocean

 

[Nishan_101]

Saudi Arabia, UAE Eye Fincantieri Submarine Acquisitions; Achille Fulfaro Comments
Feb 10th, 2014 · 0 Comment
Italian shipbuilder Fincantieri plans to hold submarine acquisition talks with government customers in Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, Defense News reported Sunday.

Awad Mustafa writes Saudi Arabia also wants to purchase more than a dozen German-built Type 209 submarines worth $3.4 billion combined.

German newspaper Bild originally reported the details of that transaction.

Achille Fulfaro, Fincantieri Middle East naval executive and general manager of Etihad Ship Building, said the two countries will assess small- to medium-sized submarines, according to Defense News.

“With the experience of the Italian navy and with the existing cooperation with the UAE, we can create a program for the development of small submarines,” Fulfaro said.

Fulfaro also said the potential order could be for submarines weighing between 300 and 1,000 metric tons, according to the report.

Mustafa writes that Fincantieri plans to develop the fleet at the Abu Dhabi-based facilities of Etihad, a joint venture with Al Fattan Shipyard and Melara Middle East.

- See more at: Saudi Arabia, UAE Eye Fincantieri Submarine Acquisitions; Achille Fulfaro Comments

KSA and UAE together should go for JV with Germany on:
3000 Tons SSK
1600 Tons SSK
700 Tons SSK
160 Tons Special Force Submarines
Rescue Submarines

And instead of building more surface fleet they along with Jordan, Oman and Yemen must look in to developing submerge fleet.

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

yup, if KSA will buy these submarines, i will take a ride to see some sharks in Arabian Ocean

Like I said the PN will have a word on this bro you can hub in if you wish.

KSA and UAE together should go for JV with Germany on:
3000 Tons SSK
1600 Tons SSK
700 Tons SSK
160 Tons Special Force Submarines
Rescue Submarines

And instead of building more surface fleet they along with Jordan, Oman and Yemen must look in to developing submerge fleet.

The thing is that we don't take the Germans seriously. Today they give you one word, tomorrow you will hear something else you know?

I guess the Italiano-Russo submarine project is promising, we might look into it deeply to see the pros and the cons. Otherwise, we are in talks with the French to procure 4-6 Frigates and 5-7 submarines.

What do you guys make of this Italian sub project?

@Imran Khan @Pakistanisage @Aeronaut