Arabic Coffee shop

[al-Hasani]

تازي=طائي
The iranians call arabs as tazi after one arab tribe which is tayy tribe
Arabs call Europeans as rom or Romans after one European civilization
Not all Europeans are Romans and not all arabs are from tayy tribe

Are you sure about that because Farsi people also call the Arab Saluki dog for Tazi I think. I cannot open those Wiki links for some reason.

Saluki dog is a royal dog and the fastest dog in the world. Ideal for hunting. I have used one.

What you two guys saying to all this? @Full Moon @rmi5

How come they started calling Arabs Tayy? Lakhmids were in Southern Iraq. Makes no sense. Arabs and Semites have encountered Southern Europeans for 10.000 years (the first farmers that migrated to Europe came from the Arab world) during the Neolithic times but at least the Arab generation of Prophet Muhammad (saws) called Europeans Romans because we faught and defeated the Romans. So it sticked. But Persians calling Arabs Tazi because of Tayy tribe makes little sense in my eyes.

 

[SALMAN F]

Are you sure about that because Farsi people also call the Arab Saluki dog for Tazi I think. I cannot open those Wiki links for some reason.

Saluki dog is a royal dog and the fastest dog in the world. Ideal for hunting. I have used one.

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What you two guys saying to all this? @Full Moon @rmi5

How come they started calling Arabs Tayy? Lakhmids were in Southern Iraq. Makes no sense. Arabs and Semites had encountered Southern Europeans for 10.000 years (the first farmers that migrated to Europe came from the Arab world) during the Neolithic times but at least the Arab generation of Prophet Muhammad (saws) called Europeans Romans because we taught and defeated the Romans. So it sticked. But Persians calling Arabs Tazi because of Tayy tribe makes little sense in my eyes.

Maybe because tayy tribe was big and powerful tribe or was on of the first tribe to contact the persians???
The Spanish and Europeans called Native Americans as Indians because they thought they arrived in India
You should ask iranian members in the forum

 

[al-Hasani]

Maybe because tayy tribe was big and powerful tribe or was on of the first tribe to contact the persians???
The Spanish and Europeans called Native Americans as Indians because they thought they arrived in India
You should ask iranian members in the forum

Tayy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Tayy Tribe before Islam was mostly Christian and the others believe in Canaanite religions (one of the many ancient Semitic religions (Pagans) ). They lived in Northern Najd, Iraq and Syria but have now spread to all over the Arab and Muslim world. Some say that the Shammar tribe is from Tayy tribe. Many people in Iraq also have Al-Ta'ii surname.

Arab tribes in Iraq - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Shammar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The famous generous Arab, Hatim al-Tai is one of the many characters of the Arabian Nights stories.

Hatim al-Tai - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Banu Tamim had closer contacts with the first Persians who arrived to the ME 2800 years ago. Some Banu Tamim members were even Zoroastrians and some allies of the Persians.

Banī Tamīm, Tamim is one of the largest of all Arab tribes. The tribe's history goes back to ancient pre-Islamic times, a sister-clan of Quraysh. Today millions descend from the tribe in the Arabian Peninsula and neighboring countries such as Iraq, Qatar, Jordan, Syria, Egypt, Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates. The word Tamim in Arabic means strong and solid. The Bani Tamīm are located primarily in Najd (Central Saudi Arabia), central and southern Iraq (Basra and Diyala), the Iranian province of Khuzestan, and south and north Yemen (Hadhramaut and Ta'izz). Members of the tribe are commonly identified by the surnames "Al-Tamimi" or "al-Tamīmī", which can be spelled as "Al-Timimi" or "Al-Temimi" in reflection of the local accent. Some members of the Al Tamim tribe migrated to Morocco as well during the Arab expansion). They are called "Temim", "Tamim" or "Tamimy".
The tribe traces its lineage to Adnan and Biblical figures Ishmael and Abraham. It has been said that Banu Tamim could be the largest Arab tribe. In pre-Islamic period Banu Tamim were allied with Sassanid Persians and were influenced by the Persian language and culture. Some Tamimi's even became Zoroastrians. The tribe embraced Islam in the eighth year after the Hijra. In an Islamic hadith, Prophet Muhammad remarked that the Tamīm tribe would be the most vigorous of his community in fighting the Dajjal (the Antichrist), an evil figure in Islamic eschatology. After Islam some groups of Tamimi's settled in border areas of Persia and gradually became bilingual in Arabic and Persian. Large sections of the Banu Tamim in Iraq converted from Sunnism to Shi’ism just before or during the 19th century.

Bani Tamim

Malik bin Nuwaira was a chief of the Bani Yarbu', a large section of the powerful tribe of Bani Tamim which inhabited the north-eastern region of Arabia, above Bahrain. Being close to Persia, some elements of the Bani Tamim had embraced Zoroastrianism, but by and large the tribe was pagan until Islam came to Arabia. The centre of Malik's clan was Butah.2 (See Map. 8).

Read more: Grande Strategy

Banu Tamim is the only Arab tribe of which some members embraced Zoroastrianism. Rest were Semitic pagans or Christians. So logically Farsis should call Arabs for Tamimis or Tamims and not Tazi after Tayy as you say.

Are you not a Tamimi @SALMAN AL-FARSI ?

This warrants an investigation I believe.

 

[SALMAN F]

Tayy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Tayy Tribe before Islam was mostly Christian and the others believe in Canaanite religions (one of the many ancient Semitic religions (Pagans) ). They lived in Northern Najd, Iraq and Syria but have now spread to all over the Arab and Muslim world. Some say that the Shammar tribe is from Tayy tribe. Many people in Iraq also have Al-Ta'ii surname.

Arab tribes in Iraq - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Shammar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The famous generous Arab, Hatim al-Tai is one of the many characters of the Arabian Nights stories.

Hatim al-Tai - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Banu Tamim had closer contacts with the first Persians who arrived to the ME 2800 years ago. Some Banu Tamim members were even Zoroastrians and some allies of the Persians.






Bani Tamim


Read more: Grande Strategy

Banu Tamim is the only Arab tribe of which some members embraced Zoroastrianism. Rest were Semitic pagans or Christians. So logically Farsis should call Arabs for Tamimis or Tamims and not Tazi after Tayy as you say.

Are you not a Tamimi @SALMAN AL-FARSI ?

This warrants an investigation I believe.

No I am not tamimi

 

[rmi5]

Or you live my friend, on Mars ? Shi'ism was planned, created, organized (A protection against Arabs) with only goal, to preserve the Persian identity with the idea - crazy - one day to revive the Empire.




...

That's very wrong bro. The first shiites were yemenite tribes. @al-Hasani is more expert in this stuff. Then later, some of these tribes emigrated to Qom(basically they were the ones who founded this city), and also Kashan. Yet, they did not find much fans in persians. Then, the massive wave of sufism came, and some sufis, like Shah Ne'matAllah Vali, and Ghutb Al-din Heydar, got some support, specially in Turkic tribes of Azerbaijan and Anatolia. Safavids later emerged among Turks, not persians, as a shia sufi movement, which spread shiism in Iran. Also, Most famous Shia clerics have been Arabs from Iraq, in contrast to Sunnism in which there were some Afghan/Farsi scholars like Abu Hanifah, and Muslim Bukhari, ... So, conceptually, Shiism is even developed more by arabs than Sunnism, and its spread is done by Turks(like spread of sunni islam in sub continent and Balkan, ... which was done by Turks as well). Relating the concept of Shia/Sunni to Arab/Farsi fights is very new, and started after Iranian Revolution.

 

[rmi5]

Not right. Traditional Shia Islam has nothing to do with Iran. Millions of Arabs were Shia before Shia even became the dominant sect of Iran. The Iranian ولاية الفقيه system is a Persian invention though. Persian as Persian after all the Mullah's that invented it claim paternal Arab ancestry (Sadah families). At least it is a new invention unique to the Iranian establishment. This is right. Some Arabs should stop thinking that Shias are the problem. No, it's the Persian regime and their supporters that are a problem. Whether in Iran, the Arab world or elsewhere! A clear distinction should be made!!!!!!! I cannot state this clearly enough! I am sure that even @Full Moon will agree with me on this.

Do we have a problem with our Shia community? The answer is no outside of a tiny, tiny, tiny number of troublemakers in you know what city led by you know which Mullah.


Anyway see here my brother.

http://ar.wikipedia.org/wiki/ولاية_الفقيه

That's exactly right. That's why Arab shias in Iraq and Turk Shias in Azerbaijan are different from Persian so called shias. As you correctly mentioned, Velayat Faqih is a new bid'ah in shiism, which is even considered as blasphemy by some high rank shia marja', and I believe that they are right. Grand Ayatullah Khoyi(RIP) never approved Velayat Faqih. In shiism, it's not allowed to try to establish a religious government by using the name of islam before Imam Mahdi arrives, since it would sectarian problems and its incompetency would defame Islam. As history proved, Shia maraja' were right, and Iranian revolution ruined the reputation of islam for millions of people. Before revolution, there were even some clerics in Qom who were washing a cup if Khomeini had been drink from it, since they believed Khomeini is no longer a muslim because of such beliefs. Velayat Faqih has nothing to do with true shiism, and it's a new persian/uneducated bid'ah.

I think you should not open your mouth about things you don't know
If they use dorood and Salam that's their languege like Berbers use uzul instead of Salam

Bro, it's hard to find a normal religious person who uses "doroud" instead of "Salam". People who want to purify farsi from Arabic, use "Doroud" instead

Tazi mean taiyy tribe the named the arabs after that tribe

No, a person from Tay, is called Taa'ee in farsi. I am not sure, but I think "Taazi" is derived from the verb "Taazandeh" as a subject name. Taazandeh means the one who invades, or something similar.

طی (قبیله) - ویکی‌پدیا، دانشنامهٔ آزاد
تازی - ویکی‌پدیا، دانشنامهٔ آزاد
This from farsi wiki
The iranian named the arabs tazi mistakenly after tayy tribe
Like the European named the Native American as Indians
The arabs named the Europeans as rums(Romans​

I read wiki, first wiki is not reliable, but this is what wiki says:
نام تازی ظاهراً تغییریافتهٔ واژه طی‌زی است به معنای کسی که در قبیلهطی زندگی می‌کند.[۳] برخی نیز تازی را منسوب به تاز به معنی تازَنده و مهاجم می‌انگارند که یادآور یورشهای گاه‌ و بیگاه اعراب به شهرهای ایران است.[چه کسی؟] بعدها ایرانیان این نام را به کل عربان اطلاق کردند.

It says, there is two theory behind it. First, it's derived from Tay, which I think it's ridiculous, second theory is that it's coming from "Taaz", and "Taazandeh" as I said in my previous post. it means invader.

 

[rmi5]

Tazi = Dog. Tayy the name of an ancient Arab tribe based in Najd but thought originally to be from Yemen. How do those two have any connection?

@rmi5

Is this correct?

Tay has nothing to do with tazi. first, a person from Tay is called Taa'ee not tazi, and second Tay tribe were not living in Persians neighborhood. "Sag e Taazi" means Arabic dog. Taazi means invader and plunderer in Farsi.

 

[al-Hasani]

@rmi5

This is completely correct. The problem nowadays is that people do not study history anymore and just look at recent history without going into depth. This disappoints me as there are 50-80 million Shia Arabs out there and Shia Islam originated in the Arab world too (Hijaz and Southern Iraq) and later spread to the remaining world. Let alone Karbala and Najaf being located in Iraq.

Moreover many Arab dynasties from Al-Andalus to Iran were Shias. Or what about the Fatimid Dynasty which is probably the most import Shia dynasty? Shia Arabs founded it and they also ruled Hijaz at one point. Their empire was almost as big as the Ottomans!

It lasted for almost 300 years too so not just for a few years or decades.

Fatimid Caliphate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is always controversial to speak about who the first "Shias" or "Sunnis" were. After all Shias believe that the Prophets (saws) family were the first Shias and their companions especially those of Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra). At that time many Arab clans/tribes also pleaded allegiance to Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra) or his two sons. Shias consider them Shias.

Yes, I have read about some Yemenite famileis/clans/tribes settling in Iran and founding cities there and they might very well have been Shias but during the Islamic Conquest of Persia the majority of the conquerors were Sunnis and Sunni Islam was first spread to Iran and later what is now Central Asia, Pakistan etc.

It is interesting because many of the Arab kingdoms, sultanates, emirates, sheikdoms etc. adhered to different sects depending on the time periods and they stretched from Al-Andalus in the West to what is now Pakistan in the East and Syria in the North to East Africa in the South.

Then you had Ibadis, Sufis and now extinct madahib.

But I think that @Bubblegum Crisis refers to this below

Guardianship of the Islamic Jurists - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (which is a new invention from my understanding) rather than Shia Muslims overall. Or at least I hope so.

Right now I am about to read about Ibadism which I find kind of interesting. Not much information about them and they are mainly based in Oman and parts of Algeria, Libya and East Africa. There have also been a lot of interesting madahib that are now "extinct" or at least followed by very few Muslims. Once they played a big role in Islamic theology.

One can say a lot about Islam but from a historical viewpoint it is surely interesting.

Honestly speaking I am saddened when Muslims or just people from the same country or region kill each other due to such stupidity like a slightly different sect from the same religion let alone people killing each other due to different religions or views etc.

Tay has nothing to do with tazi. first, a person from Tay is called Taa'ee not tazi, and second Tay tribe were not living in Persians neighborhood. "Sag e Taazi" means Arabic dog. Taazi means invader and plunderer in Farsi.

I thought that this made no sense when I read it. Not sure what Salman tried to tell here, LOL. Anyway it is good if they call us invader and plunderer. I just wonder what they were when they occupied Eastern Arabia, Yemen and large parts of what is now the Arab ME or previously Semitic speaking ME.

But is Tazi also not the Farsi name for Saluki dog? They are lovely dogs.

 

[rmi5]

@rmi5

This is completely correct. The problem nowadays is that people do not study history anymore and just look at recent history without going into depth. This disappoints me as there are 50-80 million Shia Arabs out there and the Shia Islam originated in the Arab world too (Hijaz and Southern Iraq) and later spread to the remaining world. Let alone Karbala and Najaf being located in Iraq.

Moreover many Arab dynasties from Al-Andalus to Iran were Shias. Or what about the Fatimid Dynasty which is probably the most import Shia dynasty. Arabs founded them and they also ruled Hijaz at one point. Their empire was almost as big as the Ottomans!

It lasted for almost 300 years!

Fatimid Caliphate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is completely right. BTW, Fatimids had immense impact on other parts of islamic world as well. Hasan Sabbah, and his followers were fans of Fatimids as well.

It is always controversial to speak about who the first "Shias" or "Sunnis" were. After all Shias believe that the Prophets (Saws) family were the first Shias and their companions especially those of Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra). At that time many Arab clans/tribes also pleaded allegiance to Ali ibn Abi Talib (ra) or his two sons. Shias consider them Shias.
Yes, I have read about some Yemenite famileis/clans/tribes settling in Iran and founding cities there and they might very well have been Shias but during the Islamic Conquest of Persia the majority of the conquerors were Sunnis and Sunni Islam was first spread to Iran and later what is now Central Asia, Pakistan etc.

That's right. It is believed that first individuals, except for Ahl al Bayt, were people like Salman, Abu Dhar, Ammar bin Yasir, ...
The first tribes, though, were yemenite tribes who immigrated to Southern Iraq.

It is interesting because many of the Arab kingdoms, sultanates, emirates, sheikdoms etc. adhered to different sects depending on the time periods and they stretched from Al-Andalus in the West to what is now Pakistan in the East and Syria in the North to East Africa in the South.

Then you had Ibadis, Sufis and now extinct madahib.

Guardianship of the Islamic Jurists - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (which is a new invention from my understanding) rather than Shia Muslims overall. Or at least I hope so.

Right now I am about to read about Ibadism which I find kind of interesting. Not much information about them and they are mainly based in Oman and parts of Algeria, Libya and East Africa. There have also been a lot of interesting madahib that are now "extinct" or at least followed by very few Muslims. Once they played a big role in Islamic theology.

They were once really strong in South and South eastern Iran as well.

One can say a lot about Islam but from a historical viewpoint it is surely interesting.

Honestly speaking I am saddened when Muslims or just people from the same country or region kill each other due to such stupidity like a slightly different sect from the same religion let alone people killing each other due to different religions or views etc.

I thought that this made no sense when I read it. Not sure what Salman tried to tell here, LOL. Anyway it is good if they call us invader and plunderer. I just wonder what they were when they occupied Eastern Arabia, Yemen and large parts of what is now the Arab ME or previously Semitic speaking ME.

But is Tazi also not the Farsi name for Saluki dog?

No, it does not mean dog. it's plunderer. As I remember, two thing though, are referred with the term tazi, which are "Asb e Tazi", meaning Arabian Horse, and "Sag e Tazi", meaning Arabian dog. I don't know what breed are Tazi dogs or Saluki dogs, though

 

[SALMAN F]

That's exactly right. That's why Arab shias in Iraq and Turk Shias in Azerbaijan are different from Persian so called shias. As you correctly mentioned, Velayat Faqih is a new bid'ah in shiism, which is even considered as blasphemy by some high rank shia marja', and I believe that they are right. Grand Ayatullah Khoyi(RIP) never approved Velayat Faqih. In shiism, it's not allowed to try to establish a religious government by using the name of islam before Imam Mahdi arrives, since it would sectarian problems and its incompetency would defame Islam. As history proved, Shia maraja' were right, and Iranian revolution ruined the reputation of islam for millions of people. Before revolution, there were even some clerics in Qom who were washing a cup if Khomeini had been drink from it, since they believed Khomeini is no longer a muslim because of such beliefs. Velayat Faqih has nothing to do with true shiism, and it's a new persian/uneducated bid'ah.


Bro, it's hard to find a normal religious person who uses "doroud" instead of "Salam". People who want to purify farsi from Arabic, use "Doroud" instead

No, a person from Tay, is called Taa'ee in farsi. I am not sure, but I think "Taazi" is derived from the verb "Taazandeh" as a subject name. Taazandeh means the one who invades, or something similar.


I read wiki, first wiki is not reliable, but this is what wiki says:
نام تازی ظاهراً تغییریافتهٔ واژه طی‌زی است به معنای کسی که در قبیلهطی زندگی می‌کند.[۳] برخی نیز تازی را منسوب به تاز به معنی تازَنده و مهاجم می‌انگارند که یادآور یورشهای گاه‌ و بیگاه اعراب به شهرهای ایران است.[چه کسی؟] بعدها ایرانیان این نام را به کل عربان اطلاق کردند.

It says, there is two theory behind it. First, it's derived from Tay, which I think it's ridiculous, second theory is that it's coming from "Taaz", and "Taazandeh" as I said in my previous post. it means invader.

I was talking about the athiests or the ones who became christains who live in n america and Europe they hate arabs and islam they use dorood instead of Salam
The same with the Berbers in North Africa who hate arabs and islam they use uzul instead of Salam
About tazi I heard before that its meaning invader but I also heard it comes from tayy tribe and its mean arabs
Thanks for clearing the information

 

[al-Hasani]

I was talking about the athiests or the ones who became christains who live in n america and Europe they hate arabs and islam they use dorood instead of Salam
The same with the Berbers in North Africa who hate arabs and islam they use uzul instead of Salam
About tazi I heard before that its meaning invader but I also heard it comes from tayy tribe and its mean arabs
Thanks for clearing the information

Berbers do not hate Arabs. In fact most North Africans are a mixture of Arabs and Berbers. It's only a few Berbers who want a Berber country of their own despite that probably not going to happen. Anyway even if we look past that then Arabs and Berbers are distantly related.

Anyway @rmi5 thanks for clarifying it bro.

 

[rmi5]

I was talking about the athiests or the ones who became christains who live in n america and Europe they hate arabs and islam they use dorood instead of Salam

You are exactly right. In addition, even many muslim persian who hate arabs, use this word, since as they say, they want to purify Farsi from Arabic.

The same with the Berbers in North Africa who hate arabs and islam they use uzul instead of Salam

I did not know much about such Berbers.

About tazi I heard before that its meaning invader but I also heard it comes from tayy tribe and its mean arabs
Thanks for clearing the information

No problem brother. I think the root from Tay does not make sense for me, since a person from Tay, is a Taa'ee not a Taazi in farsi language.

Berbers do not hate Arabs. In fact most North Africans are a mixture of Arabs and Berbers. It's only a few Berbers who want a Berber country of their own despite that probably not going to happen. Anyway even if we look past that then Arabs and Berbers are distantly related.

Anyway @rmi5 thanks for clarifying it bro.

There is one of those algerian Berbers in ME section, though.

 

[Chronos]

Bro, Farsis are throughly brainwashed people. All they learn is to bash turks, europeans, ... in schools, and bash arabs through their opposition media in Los Angeles, and learning to mock pakistanis and hindis for being poor. Also, they think that they are german's cousins, and are the superior race. They are uneducated about their history, science, technology, and how to behave.
Talking with them is like trying to pierce a rock with water droplets. I don't have the required patience to talk with such bigots anymore. So, I mostly ignore their comments.
What's the point in talking with bigots?

Joke's on them, if they were so smart, then they would know a large number of Indians aren't Hindi

 

[rmi5]

Joke's on them, if they were so smart, then they would know a large number of Indians aren't Hindi

All Indian are called "Hendi" in farsi

 

[al-Hasani]

@rmi5

Our Berber friend, Ceylal.

Admit what? How can you hate somebody that you don't even freaking know? And Can you say that I hate arabs, when we share blood and culture... For a supposed learned individual, you are really lacking in social skills. Sometimes, you act like an imbecile..and you are showing it here...

9/11: The Rothschild Zionist Connection

PS; I made that troll thread long ago to troll an Jewish suicide troll.