what will be pakistan's answer to rafale

[KBW-1]

The J-10 B & C tipped with AESA radars and the price of J-10...... 30-35 million USD is quiet an attraction for Pakistan.

J-10,s with their WVR BVVR(PL-10 WVR & SD10 BVVR missiles is a match for the Japanese F-15,s .Chinese technology is improving by the hour.

Pakistan in increments of 36 J-10,s will have to induct this platform.
It is a clean & a reliable fighter a MMRCA for Pakistan .

We would require 5-6 Billion USD for the inductions which by no means is available with no strings attached.
In total I am talking of 126-150 J-10B,s.

If you want to keep it High low than we have 69-Mirage 2009 in U.A.E Air force and 13 with Qatar Making a total of 82 Mirage 2009-2005 .Greece can be a seller for 32 Mirage 2005 to Pakistan .This is not mere speculation but hard fact You have to talk to the players and help yourself out as per the situation.

By applying this approach we can half our J-10 B/C bill 2 USD 3 Billion by acquiring 76 J-10 B,s.

This will be a great addition to the strength to P.A.F by preserving our Mirage III/V in hot reserve and to induct the Mirages 2005-2009 Direct on availability .

The same goes for the F-7 fleet either all the fleet in hot reserve or half the fleet in reserve as we will have to take out four squadrons for hot reserve.

For deep penetration Pakistan surely has to go to Russia for the SU-35 with the ALF-41 engines & that to in 48 in number . U.A.E and Saudi Arabia are interested in Su-35 .

 

[batmannow]

Honestly This Forum from is changing itself from a defence forum to like joke or wishlist page

People are making jokes or or bitching about the things they have no idea

Why Pakistan has kept selecting 2nd f16s
Few reasons
Long history and know the limitations of that platform and easily manage even if Pakistan goes into embargo again a dedicated fighter bird which can fill any role Pakistan air force needs for specific mission

Now all who are saying su 35 , its not happening and sayign pakistan need a really heavy deep strike bird come on people you are fighting a enemy which is right beside you
And they have really good sams , radars and list goes on and sending those bird for deep strike you are not come out of 60s people sams are really good now its time for a systematic warfare
Fighter bombers are a realic of past or you have complete air superiority and eneimes ground radar and sams are tottaly disabled
Unless they will be sitting ducks for sams which India operates
For Pakistan now the current job for Air force is to defend its border inside Pakistan
F16 is a capable air craft and has proven itself again and again
As people saying
Pakistan should buy this and that than also keep making 10 to 15 thunders per years and also keep saying money to for a 5th gen jet people please stop day dreaming
36 birds are capable but instead pakistan lacks in advance ground radar systems and sams these are the priorities and these should be sorted out and put all the system in one system which will save time and will give option of using other options which can change everything

Now the point in your post is itself a big joke , I mean your post has a million % imperesion of not knowing any thing about a thing call SU*35?
Do you know how many roles that machine can play ?
Its air superiority /bomber / higher range / double & more lethal payload with much advanced avionics ?
I don't know , why America , India , France & all the major air forces are keep changing their leading fighter jets ?
Maybe USA/France /russia /India /China s strategists are fools that , they are using so different & so many fighter jets in their inventories ?
Its a decade old stupid logic , to fool Pakistanis by their govts , that F*16s are the only dam fighter jet sent by god to save Pakistan ?
No its not true , & every air force in this world has to change its strategy with , more different & efficient fighter jets in its ranks & it happens because the technological advancement .

F*16s were good back in 80s or 90s for now , we have F-17s & that's enough of that ?

If Pakistani fighter jet pilots can train themselves within 6 months for F*16s , sure hell !
they can do for any other fighter jet ?

& I don't think that USA has given us , the compact infrastructure of any kind for F*16s till yet , so we have just made that dam fighter jet a holly cow nothing more then that ?
There was a good old fighter jet in world war 2 called tempest , it also proven again & again ?
So should PAF , get that in 2016 ?
We have enough of that stupid love with F*16s which really are just show pieces , which can't be used in kargill our last of wars in INDIA ?
Its a proven dead meat & that's all ?

Its another stupid point in your post that , since INDIA has better SAMS we should stop getting high tech , fighter /bomber jet ?
Hell why not , dump the whole PAF with your logic ?

 

[PakEye]

As i think
The Answer have two Answers
No.- 1 acquiring F-16, Su- 35 and from available options.
No. - 2 continue the work for JF-17 more new blocks
and
must invest in the filed of R&D and promotion of Fighter Jet program as like dual engine version of JFT

 

[nana41]

As the deal between india and france is almost done for 36 rafale , what will be the answer of PAF to this acquisition of IAF , RAFALE is miles ahead of anything we have in our inventory , it will shift the balance of power even more , PAF might go for
36 F16 Block 61 (V)
36 J10C
Australian F18 (but pak must not go for american again )
36 J11D if russia allows
36 SU35 ( difficult to get and maintain )
F15 eagle ( very difficult )
36 eurofighter ( if pakistan can get them then its gonna be the most prime fighter of asia )
or shift the funds to J31 and procure them in large numbers
opinions please

F-16 Block 61 with Aeasa Radar,just in case J-31 does not come up to expectation.

 

[Mrc]

Despite what our neighbours are saying, j 31 will not take more than 5 years for operational deployment. Let the Rafael deal achieve a financial close than we can talk on time lines for their deliveries....

No need to waste money on 4th generation except jf 17....if push comes to shove j 10s can be inducted fairly quickly

 

[BRAVO_]

Discussion is already undergoing for J-31 and hopefully it will be matured soon with TOT ... if not then SU-35 Flankers E will be the choice.

The Pakistan Air Force (PAF) has discussed buying Su-35 'Flanker-E' fighter aircraft from Russia in potentially the largest defence deal between the two countries, but a final decision is yet to be made, a senior Pakistani government official has confirmed to IHS Jane's .

The official was responding to Russian media reports that Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov had said talks were underway for an unspecified number of Su-35s, which follow a recent agreement to provide Mi-35M 'Hind E' attack helicopters to Islamabad.

While the official said "it's too early to say if a deal will conclude and the terms", the fact that discussions have taken place shows Russia's willingness to sell advanced hardware with Pakistan despite Moscow's longstanding ties with India.

The official said Pakistan's interest in the Su-35 was driven by the PAF's need for a twin-engine fighter "that can fly for a longer range than the JF-17 and penetrate more deeply into the enemy's territory". The PAF flies a mixed fleet of Lockheed Martin F-16s, Dassault Mirage-5s, Chinese-manufactured F-7s, and the JF-17 Thunder, which is jointly produced by China and Pakistan.

In November 2014 a senior Pakistani official told IHS Jane's that Pakistan was in discussions with China to buy 30 to 40 FC-31s - the export version of China's J-31 fifth-generation platform. At the time, the official told IHS Jane's that Pakistan was interested in the platform partly because it was fitted with two RD-93 Russian Klimov engines, which also powers the JF-17. PAF officials have also told IHS Jane's in the past that they have considered the purchase of up to 40 Chengdu J-10 fighters.

 

[Hellfire]

what i was saying that 55% of the planes are in an "available" state to fly immediately. the rest is in need of parts/servicing/maintenance to fly. how long do you think it would take to get the rest/most of the mki's ready in time of need, considering you rely on russia for parts and servicing of the engines .our typhoons are in decent shape and we do have a tendency to cannibalize some of them temporarily to maintain upkeep, we have a qru (quick response unit) thats are ready to fly immediately and are airborne in about 90 seconds from getting the call to taking of. the lL-76 are robust work horses they near enough always ready just like the c17's, its too early to say for the a400m's

And, pray, tell me, what is the time frame that shall be served as a warning period for imminent strikes/requirement of 100% aircrafts? We do not have requirements of deployment ex-India. Any conflict with either China or Pakistan will have adequate warning time of few weeks at least. My previous post concerning WWR was exactly meant to convey that our 55% availability has more to do with cutting revenue expenses than lack of spare parts from Russia. Please do not even bother quoting our media. They are a bunch of buffoons at best. The WWR stock caters to any contingency wherein we require all the aircrafts to be fielded and has enough spares held in reserve. And, like you, we also cannibalize as and when required. The turnaround time in terms of spares for war is not a problem. Please read the current force availability only in terms of cutting costs.

 

[mingle]

According to Pshamim PDF PAF looking to buy F 31 jets from china off the shelfs with numbers according to him numbers r 61 to begin with looks like Pak skip J10 c and move staight to j 31 which is very good move in the long run i guess its very good answer to french jets & bye bye to F16s .

 

[tarrar]

obviously sir one of these options , sorry forgot to put or in there ,


i asked for suggestions that for which platform PAF must go , aint here to give interview to you ,

may be some F16V along with JF17 block 3 should do the job

Sooner or later we won't be getting any more F16's, that is for sure. Also keep in mind that US military hardware is coming with strict terms & conditions. So Pakistan will have to work on JF17 & making it even more better, but we have to realize that JF17 is not a solution for every problem as modern & advance fighter jets require a equal response. So Pakistan should try to sign new deal for a research & production of new fighter jet either with China or Turkey i.e. if Pakistan is interested in making new fighter jet, which I want Pakistan to do as JF17 should be the last one.

The open options for Pakistan are J31 & SU35, although J31 is not yet ready & its performance is unknown so it is uncertain if the aircraft will pass the requirement & trials by PAF. 2nd option for Pakistan is a ready & the best SU35, but I doubt if Pakistan will go for them as a lot of time has been taken by the authorities to decide if they want to go for the aircraft or not. More over, I don't think Pakistan can get J11 as Russia had raised its concern over reverse engineering by the Chinese & a possible offer of J11 which was made by China to Pakistan in the past.

I don't see Pakistan getting European Aircraft's as India is already heavy lobbying against Pakistan & our Govt. has done absolutely nothing to deal with such Anti Pakistani lobbying.

So the end result is, Pakistan is having very limited options but good ones & it is all about fixing & maintaining good ties with Russia.

 

[SR-91]

Even the almighty F-22 lost out to Rafales. A rare video.

 

[alimobin memon]

Right now there is no plane that could counter rafale and mki which are in great numbers. It's better to wait and save money till right platform comes. Su35 is good jet but what if it ends up having issues like MKI.

 

[Darth Vader]

Now the point in your post is itself a big joke , I mean your post has a million % imperesion of not knowing any thing about a thing call SU*35?
Do you know how many roles that machine can play ?
Its air superiority /bomber / higher range / double & more lethal payload with much advanced avionics ?
I don't know , why America , India , France & all the major air forces are keep changing their leading fighter jets ?
Maybe USA/France /russia /India /China s strategists are fools that , they are using so different & so many fighter jets in their inventories ?
Its a decade old stupid logic , to fool Pakistanis by their govts , that F*16s are the only dam fighter jet sent by god to save Pakistan ?
No its not true , & every air force in this world has to change its strategy with , more different & efficient fighter jets in its ranks & it happens because the technological advancement .

F*16s were good back in 80s or 90s for now , we have F-17s & that's enough of that ?

If Pakistani fighter jet pilots can train themselves within 6 months for F*16s , sure hell !
they can do for any other fighter jet ?

& I don't think that USA has given us , the compact infrastructure of any kind for F*16s till yet , so we have just made that dam fighter jet a holly cow nothing more then that ?
There was a good old fighter jet in world war 2 called tempest , it also proven again & again ?
So should PAF , get that in 2016 ?
We have enough of that stupid love with F*16s which really are just show pieces , which can't be used in kargill our last of wars in INDIA ?
Its a proven dead meat & that's all ?

Its another stupid point in your post that , since INDIA has better SAMS we should stop getting high tech , fighter /bomber jet ?
Hell why not , dump the whole PAF with your logic ?

Many things come in Play
Russian jets Is a pipe dream which isnt happening Soon Unless Indian Fcks it up big time you will see only good economy projects or some so level weapons coming to Pakistan which wont offened indian lobby that much because India is still a major buyer
F16 and kargil Pakistan didnt have bvr that didnt have spares for its bird no sane commander will ask his men to fight where he knows he cant win not by any chance
They kept there mouth shut and saved there assets
There are other planes too which do different missions to so should buy everything
F16 its cheap , can do anything as its also will be there for a while you dont need to get new infrastructure or anything and save the money for next project and also keep making thunders
In future you will see Pakistan going for high end bird when they have acquired 150+ thunders and 100+ f16s
Than we will be the major change because
Making 10 to 12 birds per year its not cheap
So Indian Has sams so Pakistan should just buy hi end birds no everything comes into play
PAF is a mixture of Hi low end birds
Whichs comes with there pro and cons

 

[Akasa]

24 SU35 are examples which they'll try to reverse engineer, they don't have confidence in there own aircraft it's a fact

There is talk that the Chinese are retrofitting these Su-35s with their own avionics, subsystems, and weaponry. Doesn't seem like a case of reverse-engineering to me (although I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to take apart the 117S engine). Moreover, the testing and production of J-11D/15/16 proves exactly that they do have confidence in their own Flankers.

So you are saying that you 'developed' all these aircrafts in J series upto 20 and 31 including a, b and c and what not but forgot to develop just the one to serve alongside J-11B and J-11D?

The J-11D was developed specifically to complement (and eventually supplant) the J-11B. I don't know which mystery fighter you are referring to.

Moreover you are buying just 24 to complement the existing fighters in the hundreds. Who are you kidding ?

First of all, it's not me who is buying these jets; my assets would be in danger if I were doing so. Secondly, the fact that the Chinese are merely purchasing 24, in light of the sizes of their other Flanker fleets, speaks to me that the purchase is much less capability-driven than what people perceive it to be.

The reason remains that Su35 is far superior to anything in you inventory and probably you would want to get your hands on the engine tech of something. The usual chinese way.

Oh, you've looked at the engineering data and technical parameters for both the Su-35 and Chinese Flankers? Tell me how you managed to gain clearance for that.

So I ask again why was Su-35 bought from Russia when you are oh so self reliant in aircrafts manufacturing?

There are many fathomable reasons:
- Logistical: there are reports that old PLAAF Su-27 imports are suffering from reliability issues and are being retired early, leaving a numerical gap within the PLAAF Flanker fleet that cannot be rectified with the current rate of J-16/11B production
- Political: Chinese purchase of an yet-unsold Russian fighter aircraft exhibits China's solidarity with Russia in a time of economic hardship and political isolation
- Economic: it is certainly possible that Russia bundled major energy deals (or similar sales) with the Su-35

Price and capability are merely two factors amongst a myriad of variables that might precipitate a Su-35 purchase.

That is the point here.

You already have J 11 which is exact copy of Russian design, thing is chinese airforce is looking some thing in su 35 reason why your govt is buying them.

Seems J11 is not at the standard of su 35.

A few things speak to me that this Su-35 purchase isn't about technical capabilities:

- the quantity being procured (24) is far too insignificant to add an overall capability boost to the rest of the PLAAF's Flanker fleet
- the Chinese continue to not only produce, but also develop, the J-11D, J-15, and J-16, all of which should be redundant if the Su-35 were so significantly more effective
- there is talk that the Chinese are retrofitting the Su-35s with their own subsystems, including domestic avionics, datalinks, and weaponry
- the Su-35 purchase corresponds, time-wise, with recent reports of old PLAAF Su-27SKs being retired early due to reliability issues, whereby creating a quantity gap that can't be rectified with the current production rate of J-11D/15/16

 

[Gallium Nitride]

I heard the Su-30MKI'S frontal RCS is more than 10m^2 with empty configuration and with full load (AG) It exceeds 20m^2.
Somebody please correct me If I'm wrong.

 

[Ultima Thule]

The J-10 B & C tipped with AESA radars and the price of J-10...... 30-35 million USD is quiet an attraction for Pakistan.

J-10,s with their WVR BVVR(PL-10 WVR & SD10 BVVR missiles is a match for the Japanese F-15,s .Chinese technology is improving by the hour.

Pakistan in increments of 36 J-10,s will have to induct this platform.
It is a clean & a reliable fighter a MMRCA for Pakistan .

We would require 5-6 Billion USD for the inductions which by no means is available with no strings attached.
In total I am talking of 126-150 J-10B,s.

If you want to keep it High low than we have 69-Mirage 2009 in U.A.E Air force and 13 with Qatar Making a total of 82 Mirage 2009-2005 .Greece can be a seller for 32 Mirage 2005 to Pakistan .This is not mere speculation but hard fact You have to talk to the players and help yourself out as per the situation.

By applying this approach we can half our J-10 B/C bill 2 USD 3 Billion by acquiring 76 J-10 B,s.

This will be a great addition to the strength to P.A.F by preserving our Mirage III/V in hot reserve and to induct the Mirages 2005-2009 Direct on availability .

The same goes for the F-7 fleet either all the fleet in hot reserve or half the fleet in reserve as we will have to take out four squadrons for hot reserve.

For deep penetration Pakistan surely has to go to Russia for the SU-35 with the ALF-41 engines & that to in 48 in number . U.A.E and Saudi Arabia are interested in Su-35 .

Wake up for your wet dreams kid those toys are cost billions of $ and PAF has a total 7 billion $, the cheapest way to counter Rafael and other threats from India is to get high quality long range SAM like HQ-9 or ASTER