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Pakistan protests India glacier tourism plan

you are an Indian so you are not felling it, but it is a cheep move by Manmohan singh & company to distract Pakistan from its routs. the area was a Dispute.
& tomorrow Dont say anything to usm if any one the Mountainer Dies mysteriously.

you should be looking towards Peace not that you should be finding reasons to start a war, that unfortunately India is doing right now, they dont listen us on Kashmire, & now Sichain.

Mark my Words, if it continue like this you are gona see a disaster, & the country responsibal for that will be India.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:

Oh pls, you send terrorists weeks after your PM's highly successfull visit to India. And now see who is spking abt peace.
 
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My answer was to counter to your answer that this area doesent mean that much that a war could be fought of the basis on it, RIGHT.

Not understood.

Where did i said that ??

You did not say it.

It was to tell you that we too feel the same way and so what you said was nothing extraordinary or earth shaking.

indian Army Attack to capture Siachin, we were not starting a war but we were defending a agression that was put forward by our peaceful neighbors.

Do refresh how the Siachen started.

India, too did not start a war. She occupied what is hers!


If you allow tourists in Kashmire, do you think we will accept it as your part ?? no. i dont see any excelence in it rather a decision to end the peace process.

Does it matter what you accept or not?

Fight was not started by us, we have no chance except to defend it, Pakistan had no experiance of HAW but india after beaten by China in 1962 trained their army for this kind of warfare
so saying that Pakistan was ready for it, is itself a lame excuse.

Remember Op Gibralter and Kutch? Please check Pakistani links and you will find out. I have it on my hard disk.


again ! the war was not started by us we got no chance except to defend with all the sources we have. so Pakistan Army Generals deserve the best that they have provided
us best. we are proud of our Generals.

Good for you and you should be proud.

& at last, I am not in the favour of War, but if it is the last option, then Go for it.

Ditto.

Seen too many of them.


Regards
Wilco :pakistan:

Same to you.

India
 
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Oh pls, you send terrorists weeks after your PM's highly successfull visit to India. And now see who is spking abt peace.

now thats a Funny comment, we are fighting against the terrorists & also sending them to your country, thats Funny. But incase you are talking about the freedom fighters of Kashmir then they are not the terrorists they are just fighting for a right cause. though we are not supporting them in Govt lvl, but when we start it it will be not to long that kashmir will be our part.
we want to resolve it peacefully, but dont take it as our weakness.


Which Highily Successful visit you are talking about. ??

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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Not understood.
Same as i did not .

You did not say it.
It was to tell you that we too feel the same way and so what you said was nothing extraordinary or earth shaking.

I think i have answered it in my previous post.

Do refresh how the Siachen started.

India, too did not start a war. She occupied what is hers!
Now i am gona faint ! India did not started siachen, read some history book so you will get the truth, india started the Siachin not Pakistan even a retire Army soldier of indian army will tell you that.

Does it matter what you accept or not?
Yes it does, but only if you are really committed towards peace,

Remember Op Gibralter and Kutch? Please check Pakistani links and you will find out. I have it on my hard disk.

These operations took place 20years before Siachin, we are talking about siachin remember, that was started by India not Pakistan in 1985 not in 1965. ??

Good for you and you should be proud.
Yes we are, there is no doubt in that.

Seen too many of them.
it look likes that India gove didn't seems to saw them.

Same to you.
With best Regards Wilco.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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but it is a cheep move by Manmohan singh & company to distract Pakistan from its routs. the area was a Dispute.
& tomorrow Dont say anything to usm if any one the Mountainer Dies mysteriously.

From the political point of view, it is brilliant plan.

It has totally sanitised Siachen from aggression by adversaries!

you should be looking towards Peace not that you should be finding reasons to start a war, that unfortunately India is doing right now, they dont listen us on Kashmire, & now Sichain.

Listening to you and agreeing with you on all counts means Peace?

Yes, it will mean Peace, but it will be a Peace at all Costs.

Have you ever thought that maybe Pakistan should listen to India?

Mark my Words, if it continue like this you are gona see a disaster, & the country responsibal for that will be India.

No disaster for India I can assure you.

If India does not attack, how can India be held responsible for aggression committed by some other country?

Saw what happened in Kargil?

The world opinion was against Pakistan because she ingressed.
 
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Now i am gona faint ! India did not started siachen, read some history book so you will get the truth, india started the Siachin not Pakistan even a retire Army soldier of indian army will tell you that.

I am a retired soldier of the Indian Army and I don't tell that to myself, even in my dreams. When Siachen happened, I was in Kashmir and I was a volunteer!


Yes it does, but only if you are really committed towards peace,

It really does not matter as to what Pakistani opinion is on territories of India.

These operations took place 20years before Siachin, we are talking about siachin remember, that was started by India not Pakistan in 1985 not in 1965. ??

India attacked no one.

We only established our lien on territory that was ours!

It was Pakistan who then attacked.

it look likes that India gove didn't seems to saw them.

Govts don't see wars.

They order them.

Soldiers see war.
 
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From the political point of view, it is brilliant plan.

It has totally sanitised Siachen from aggression by adversaries!
I thought we are not discussin Politics here, we have to see international matters domesticaly not Politically.
Even sending Freedom Fighters in Kashmir is politically very very good move, but internationally it is not.

Listening to you and agreeing with you on all counts means Peace?

Yes, it will mean Peace, but it will be a Peace at all Costs.

Have you ever thought that maybe Pakistan should listen to India?
I didn't said accept every thing Pakistan says neither did our gov said this, all we said this is our sugession for solving Kashmir what is yours come let sit together & solve this matter but India seem to neglect it. How many time did India said let sit togather & solve it ?? So how will Pakistan agree or disagree when india did not even present any solution.

No disaster for India I can assure you.
How can you assure that?? explain plz. if war starts it will be a disaster for both of us,

If India does not attack, how can India be held responsible for aggression committed by some other country?
I didn't say that India will commit aggression, but i said if Pakistan did then the reason behind it will be Indian behavior.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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I am a retired soldier of the Indian Army and I don't tell that to myself, even in my dreams. When Siachen happened, I was in Kashmir and I was a volunteer!

Pakistan started Siachin, ROFL. Y the hell Pakistan will capture it own territory. I said read the history. Y the hell should Pakistan start a war when not even having cloths to survive in that weather, think with some senses, most of the Pakistani soldiers martyred bcoz of Cold not bcoz of bullet.

It really does not matter as to what Pakistani opinion is on territories of India.
Siachin is not an Indian teritory, thats Y it is a Dispute & we are fighting for almost 25 years over it.

India attacked no one.
It is like.
Ghengas Khan did not kill any one.
Halaku Khan was a peace full ruler.

Govts don't see wars.

They order them.

Soldiers see war.
Wrong !
Govt See War.
Soldiers Fight War
Civilians Suffer from War.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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Do refresh how the Siachen started.

India, too did not start a war. She occupied what is hers!

May be this will help to refresh your memories.


Siachen Glacier / Operation Meghdoot

The Siachen Glacier has no significant strategic value. Since 1984, the "snow-warriors" of India and Pakistan have been locked in supremacy for the control of Siachen glacier. Its inhospitable terrain has taken heavy toll of men and resources on both sides. The world's highest battlefield, for over a decade India and Pakistan have fought at altitudes of over 22,000 feet in minus 60ºC temperatures. Siachen is the world's largest non-polar glacier, and thus is sometimes referred to as the third pole. It is 78 km long and situated at an altitude of 5,400 meters above sea level. The Siachen glacier is the great Himalayan watershed that demarcates central Asia from the Indian sub-continent, and that separates Pakistan from China in this region.

The roots of the conflict over Siachen (the place of roses) lie in the non-demarcations on the western side on the map beyond NJ9842. The 1949 Karachi agreement and the 1972 Simla agreement presumed that it was not feasible for human habitation to survive north of NJ9842. Piror to 1984 neither India nor Pakistan had any permanent presence in the area

In the 1970s and early 1980s Pakistan permitted several mountaineering expeditions to climb high peaks on this glacier. This was to reinforce their claim on the area as these expeditions arrived on the glacier with a permit obtained from the Government of Pakistan. Operation Meghdoot [named after the divine cloud messenger in a Sanskrit play] was launched on 13 April 1984 when the Indian Army and the Indian Air Force went into the Glacier. Pakistan quickly responded with troop deployments.

The 78 km long Siachen glacier lies between the Saltoro ridge line to the west and the main Karakoram range to the east. The Saltoro ridge originates from the Sia Kangri in the Karakoram range and the altitudes range from 18,000 to 24,000 ft. The major passes on this ridge are Sia La at 20,000 ft and Bila Fond La at 19,000 ft.

The Indian Army controls the heights, holding on to the tactical advantage of high ground. The Pakistanis cannot get up to the glacier, while the Indians cannot come down. Presently India holds two-thirds of glacier and commands two of the three passes. Pakistan controls Gyong La pass that overlooks the Shyok and Nubra river Valley and India's access to Leh district. The battle zone comprised an inverted triangle resting on NJ 9842 with Indira Col and the Karakoram Pass as the other two extremities.

Estimates of the current troop deployments vary. One estimate suggests that Both sides deploy about 3,000 soldiers, while another reports that a total of some 10,000 troops are deployed on each side of the Line of Actual Control. According to a third estimate Pakistan maintains three battalions on the glacier, while India has seven battalions defending Siachen.

The Pakistanis can resupply most of their posts by road and pack mule. At their forward positions, some as high as 21,000 feet, the Indians must rely on helicopters.

On average, one Pakistani soldier is killed every fourth day, while one Indian soldier is killed every other day. Over 1,300 Pakistani soldiers have died on Siachen between 1984 and 1999. According to Indian estimates, this operation had cost India over Rs. 50 billion and almost 2,000 personnel casualties till 1997. Almost all of the casualties on both sides have been due to extreme weather conditions.
Siachen Glacier / Operation Meghdoot

now you understand who started Siachin ??

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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Indeed, we occupied before Pakistan could react.

But that is not war.

Just because we went there before you realised, is it India's fault that the Pakistan Army was not upto the mark?

The operative word is "war".

Occupation what is rightfully ours is not war!
 
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Indeed, we occupied before Pakistan could react.

But that is not war.

The operative word is "war".

Occupation what is rightfully ours is not war!
So after all you accepted that India made agression on Siachin not Pakistan.
& though we were not ready still responded firmly.

Just because we went there before you realised, is it India's fault that the Pakistan Army was not upto the mark?
This is no excuse, what will you do if one day we enter into Amritsar before you realize ?? will it mean that your army was not up to mark.

Indeed, we occupied before Pakistan could react.

India did not occupied the whole Half is controled by us 7 half is by you people.

Regards
Wilco
 
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Pakistan started Siachin, ROFL. Y the hell Pakistan will capture it own territory. I said read the history. Y the hell should Pakistan start a war when not even having cloths to survive in that weather, think with some senses, most of the Pakistani soldiers martyred bcoz of Cold not bcoz of bullet.

And why in the name of Dickens should India not occupy her territory?

If Pakistan is keen to martyr its soldier, how is it big deal for India? And do you think India should bother how Pakistan organise/ disorganise her Army?

Siachin is not an Indian teritory, thats Y it is a Dispute & we are fighting for almost 25 years over it.

Fine if that is what you wish to say.

If it is disputed, then why are you making such a big deal about Indians being earlier than Pakistanis in occupying an area that she claims as hers? And if it is disputed, why are you so vociferous that it is Pakistan's? India feels otherwise!


It is like.
Ghengas Khan did not kill any one.
Halaku Khan was a peace full ruler.

Who cares about all these?

Get back to reality and the present!

Wrong !
Govt See War.
Soldiers Fight War
Civilians Suffer from War.

Too bad, what?

I say war is a waste of time and everything!
 
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So after all you accepted that India made agression on Siachin no Pakistan.
& though we were not ready still responded firmly.


This is no excuse, what will you do if one day we enter into Amritsar before you realize ??



India did not occupied the whole Half is controled by us 7 half is by you people.

Regards
Wilco

Christ, occupation is NOT War.

I think I shall not pander to your day dreams about Walking into A or B. Go ahead and dream. Dreams are good for mental health so I learn from Readers Digest! I wouldn't know for sure.
 
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And why in the name of Dickens should India not occupy her territory?

If Pakistan is keen to martyr its soldier, how is it big deal for India? And do you think India should bother how Pakistan organise/ disorganise her Army?

How the hell did it become your teritory. try to understand YOU DONOT OCCUPY WHAT IS YOURS YOU ONLY OCCUPY WHAT IS OTHERS. you own question answers your question.

Fine if that is what you wish to say.

If it is disputed, then why are you making such a big deal about Indians being earlier than Pakistanis in occupying an area that she claims as hers? And if it is disputed, why are you so vociferous that it is Pakistan's? India feels otherwise!

Take Kashmire as Example + YOU DONOT OCCUPY WHAT IS YOURS YOU ONLY OCCUPY WHAT IS OTHERS.

Who cares about all these?

Get back to reality and the present!
I showed you the reality didn't i ?

Too bad, what?
???

I say war is a waste of time and everything!
This is what is am trying to tell you. that you should take measures to Prevent the war not the Start one.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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Christ, occupation is NOT War.

Did i said war ?? i said Aggression you are using the word war.

I think I shall not pander to your day dreams about Walking into A or B. Go ahead and dream. Dreams are good for mental health so I learn from Readers Digest! I wouldn't know for sure.
I happens some time when you got no answer.:)

Defending you country is Very good, but defending it for wrong cause is not good.

Regards
Wilco :pakistan:
 
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