Comparison of IN and PN

[Adux]

Dude, we took command of Persian Gulf for six monts, PN is the first non Nato navy in history to do so.

Neo I mean no Disrespect, but what is the experience for your Naval Command have other than with those 3 Agustoa's...Honestly there are more professional and trained and equipped forces than yours. Unfortunatly for you it is Indian. 6 months thing was always a token.

 

[HAIDER]

All very simple Arabian waters are dominated by NATO ships. NATO will never wants India to walk inn.Need constant flow of oil from this region and all muslim countries, so India doesn't fit in this situation at all. Best and closest support is Pakistan right on the mouth of Perisan gulf is Gwadar port. Extremely easy logistic and Pakistan small country plus always American alley. American least interest in India is to defuse Chinense power.
But Pakistan has much more bigger role in the region.

 

[Adux]

All very simple Arabian waters are dominated by NATO ships. NATO will never wants India to walk inn.Need constant flow of oil from this region and all muslim countries, so India doesn't fit in this situation at all. Best and closest support is Pakistan right on the mouth of Perisan gulf is Gwadar port. Extremely easy logistic and Pakistan small country plus always American alley. American least interest in India is to defuse Chinense power.
But Pakistan has much more bigger role in the region.

So to defuse the Chinese threat, America will use the China's alley....
Please do understand what is reaquired for Deep Ocean Patrolling, Pakistan doesnt have that capability. Have some old frigates which rarely leave the port does not make a Naval Tradition, I would have kept quiet for everything else, Airforce Army, But Navy you gotta be freaking kidding me; THere are press releases Mulford asking India to take on the responsibilties
PS: Arabian sea is not infested with NATO ships but American, from the Deigo Garcia base in the indian ocean

Take's Bull's advice, stop the rhetoric and dont make a mockey out of yourself

 

[HAIDER]

Mulford is non offical, non NATO mouth piece. Well PN is performing duty along NATO ships in middle eastern region since 06. For the required operation doesn't need blue water navy. Patroling area of PN is app 500 miles from coastal area of any middle eastern country of closer to 200 miles or less.

 

[Adux]

Mulford is non offical, non NATO mouth piece. Well PN is performing duty along NATO ships in middle eastern region since 06. For the required operation doesn't need blue water navy. Patroling area of PN is app 500 miles from coastal area of any middle eastern country of closer to 200 miles or less.

How are PN commanders going to command when they themseleves lack Fleet commanding, Whatever makes you sleep at night, Pakistan is severly (understatement) lacking in the Navy department,

 

[EagleEyes]

How are PN commanders going to command when they themseleves lack Fleet commanding, Whatever makes you sleep at night, Pakistan is severly (understatement) lacking in the Navy department,

On what basis do you say that Pakistan lacks fleet commanding? Or you just want to say it.

 

[Adux]

On what basis do you say that Pakistan lacks fleet commanding? Or you just want to say it.

For the mere fact they dont have an operational fleet that is in accordance with the duties they might have to perform as a NATO fleet commander, Pakistani Navy if you ask me are in tatters excpet for those P-3C's and Agosta's

 

[Neo]

Neo I mean no Disrespect, but what is the experience for your Naval Command have other than with those 3 Agustoa's...Honestly there are more professional and trained and equipped forces than yours. Unfortunatly for you it is Indian. 6 months thing was always a token.

Apparently we're experienced enought to be honord the post of Task Force-150 by the USA regardless how 'improfessional' we are.

 

[Adux]

Apparently we're experienced enought to be honord the post of Task Force-150 by the USA regardless how 'improfessional' we are.

You are taking it in the wrong way, That post was nothing more than a honarary post

 

[Neo]

How are PN commanders going to command when they themseleves lack Fleet commanding, Whatever makes you sleep at night, Pakistan is severly (understatement) lacking in the Navy department,

This is how.

Pakistan to take over multi-national task force command on Monday

The Pakistan navy will take over the command of the multi-national Task Force-150 of the Coalition Maritime Campaign Plan (CMCP) on Monday.

"In recognition of the Pakistan navy's professional ability and increased mutual confidence, Pakistan has been offered the Command of Multi National Task Force Group 150," said the Pakistan navy Sunday in a statement.

The CMCP is the maritime component of "Operation Enduring Freedom" being undertaken by a U.S.-led coalition of naval forces in the Golf of Oman, Arabian Sea, Arabian Gulf and Horn of Africa since October 2001.

Presently the command is held by the Dutch Navy.

Pakistan will be the first non-NATO country to take over the command. Pakistan's Rear Admiral Shahid Iqbal will be the Commander of Task Force-150, said the statement.

The legal basis for Operation Enduring Freedom is United Nations Resolution 1373, adopted by the UN Security Council at its 8345th meeting on Sept. 28, 2001, according to the statement.

"This operation aims to prevent, deter and destroy international terrorist organizations by denying them the use of maritime environment thereby contributing towards stability and security in Indian Ocean," the statement said.

"This will go a long way in projecting Pakistan's positive image in international community and will significantly highlight the Pakistan navy's contribution towards global war on terrorism."

Upon approval from the government of Pakistan, the Pakistan navy joined the CMCP in April 2004.

Other nations presently participating in the CMCP are the United States, Britain, France, Australia, Italy, Japan, Germany, the Netherlands and Spain.

Source: Xinhua

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200604/24/eng20060424_260595.html

Pakistani Admiral Takes Command of Regional Maritime Task Force
By Jim Garamone and Petty Officer 2nd Class Carolla Bennett, USN
American Forces Press Service


MINA SALMAN, Bahrain, April 24, 2006 – Pakistan today became the first regional country to command a combined task force in the Middle East in the war on terror. Pakistani Rear Adm. Shahid Iqbal received command from Dutch Commodore Hank Ort during a ceremony aboard the HNLMS De Zeven Provicien in the harbor here. Iqbal will command the force for the next six months.

American, French, German, British, Dutch, Australian, New Zealand, Canadian, Spanish, Italian, Turkish and Portuguese ships have participated in the force. Japan has provided logistical support to the effort.

"I, my team, and the Pakistan navy, feel elated and honored for being entrusted with this important, professional responsibility," Iqbal said during his acceptance speech. "Terrorism is a worldwide phenomenon which has become an enormous challenge for the international community. Given the transcending nature of terrorism and its magnitude, it's not within the capacity of one single country or force to address this issue.

"(We require) a joint approach to address this menace," he said. "Command of Task Force 150 is a challenge, (but) I and my team are confident that, with the support of our coalition and regional partners, ... this challenge can be converted into opportunities for the benefit of all."

Iqbal said he was looking forward to the challenges of commanding the task force. "I'm sure during my tenure our sincere efforts will add positively in achieving aims and objectives of the task force," he said, "and will bring more stability and peace in the region."

Ort, who commanded CTF 150 since mid-December, stressed the importance of the task force. "Our mission contributes to regional maritime security by making sure that terrorist cannot use our area either as a venue or an enabler," he said. "In doing so, the military contribution is a key enabler for structural work in the political and economical arena," Ort said.

The command patrols the waterways of the Middle East from the Gulf of Oman to the southern border of Kenya and includes the Red Sea. It extends out to Pakistan's border with India. The task force has ships from 15 to 17 nations, and support from other nations.

It is configured to provide maritime security for 2.5 million square miles in the region and complements counterterrorist activities on land. "The international community today shares a common goal against a common enemy -- an enemy of peace, an enemy of stability and an enemy of prosperity," said U.S. Navy Vice Adm. Patrick M. Walsh, commander of combined maritime forces in the region.

"To succeed in this critical important mission over the expanse of the ocean, we need an approach to leadership that develops one team to blend the individual contribution from an international array of unique maritime capabilities," Walsh added.

Al Qaeda and other extremists are the primary enemy in the region, he said. "Al Qaeda has already showed itself all too eager to attack at sea," Walsh said during a short press conference. "They attacked the motor vessel Limburg in 2002; they targeted economic infrastructure with attacks on oil platforms in 2004; and they attacked the USS Cole in 2000."

Dutch forces led the command as the organization's emphasis shifted to combating crime on the sea and piracy. Smugglers will transport anything for the right amount of money, command officials said, and there is no reason to believe that they will stop with drugs, people or electronics.

The Pakistani navy's cultural and regional knowledge will help combat crimes upon the sea, Walsh said. He explained that Pakistanis understand the maritime domain in the region. "That means understanding intelligence, understanding what activities are legitimate on the water, and what are not," he said. "So as I stand side by side with (the unit's new commander, Iqbal), who do you think has a better understanding of what's going on off the Gulf of Aden -- me, who comes from northern Fairfax County, Virginia, or my partner from Karachi (Pakistan)?"

Speaking directly to Iqbal, Walsh said, "Pakistan has played a strategic role and partnership in CTF 150. We look forward to your insight, judgment and leadership in maritime security operations in the coming months. Teach and guide our team well with an approach that is collective in character, shared in responsibility and postured for the future."

He said Pakistan taking over represents another aspect of coalition strategy in the region -- getting regional partners to take on the security mission. "Pakistan is a strategic partner in the war on terror," the admiral said.

Since the announcement that Pakistan was to take command, several regional countries have expressed interest in participating in Combined Task Force 150 in some way, Walsh said.

The ships in the task force - usually 14 or 15 in number -- employ state-of-the-art communications and intelligence analysis to deter or disrupt attacks at sea, Walsh said. This allows the force to capitalize on assets. "The approach we are trying to take here is where we share intelligence and we can posture ourselves to sustain the coalition presence over time," he said. "That means managing and posturing assets in strategic locations throughout the area of operations."

For example, the task force has changed its posture to maintain a sustainable presence off the Horn of Africa for an indefinite period of time. Merchant vessels currently steam hundred of miles off the coast of Somalia to avoid incidents. The coalition presence does two things, Walsh said. First, it combats piracy. And second, it confronts the fact that Somalia is an ungoverned area.

"The lesson we have learned is that we can no longer step away and turn a blind eye to an area, because that is exactly the sort of area that al Qaeda and other terrorist organizations thrive in," he said. "We will not let that happen again."

(Navy Petty Officer 2nd Class Carolla Bennett is assigned to U.S. Naval Forces Central Command and U.S. 5th Fleet.)
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Apr2006/20060424_4907.html

:flag: :flag: :flag:

 

[Neo]

You are taking it in the wrong way, That post was nothing more than a honarary post

Read the articles I just posted, seems like more than honorary to me.

 

[EagleEyes]

For the mere fact they dont have an operational fleet that is in accordance with the duties they might have to perform as a NATO fleet commander, Pakistani Navy if you ask me are in tatters excpet for those P-3C's and Agosta's

Pakistan Navy has to operate in the region, they dont have to face an aircraft carrier. We have everything to perform duties. P-3C and Agostas are out of question, we are not at war.

 

[Adux]

Well i stand corrected, i got mislead by the duties the PN had to perform, It is just counter-terrorism. Anyways its a good post and lot of responsibilities.
But as a naval enthusiast its quite hard for me to give high marks for naval organization like PN.

 

[Contrarian]

Mulford is the official ambassador of US to India, HAIDER.
PN lacks surface combatants, how does it have the capability to patrol such areas. I still stand by that this is a token post, that too a kind of reward for Pakistan helping in the WoT.

In the future, IN is going to be patrolling the entire IOR+Arabian, till the Straights of Hormuz. India is already trying for more naval bases in the region in other countries, i think we already have one. Regardless, IN makes port calls on all major countries, etc, etc. India recently also sealed a treaty with Madagascar i think, in which they asked us to patrol more in that area. USN will remain a token force after a decade in this region.

 

[EagleEyes]

PN has 6 Type-21 frigates and will get 4 S-Class frigates by the end of 2007 with heavy Greek upgrades. Do you have any idea how many frigates it takes to lead a CTF-150? PNS Shahjahan did commanding all by itself, until the command was transfered to the Germans and was awarded.

On what basis do you say that PN doesn't have the capability to patrol such areas?