Capabilities of PAF Dassault MIRAGE-III/V.

[ziaulislam]

The MIRAGE 5 first flew in 1955
The build quality is 70 year old technology
metal alloy airframe
All hydraulic gears no digital FBW

Mirage5 was relaced by mirage2000 then rafale

Mirage5 was a Mig21 of france ..........its ancient

IT WAS

IAF tonight

272 Su30mki
100 Jaguar
63 MIG29upg
54 Mig21 BIISON
45 Mirage2000
20 Tejas

THE DIFFERENCE between PAF & IAF

IAF is acquiring 12 su30 mki & 21 mig29upg as a interim measure and spares & attrition losses. For cheap money ie about $1.4 billion for the planes alone & $1 billion of new BVRS and WVR missles

PAF is aquiring 36 MIRAGE 5 for same resason ie attrition losses and spares etc.

IAF = new gen fighters 36 rafales & 20 Tejas ( 20 delivered alrready)

PAF = New gen fighters 50 block 3 thunders

YES, jaguars flew in 1960s, was very underpowered, and is worse than mirage 5 in every other way,s till the second most common aircraft in IAF just like mirage 5 is in PAF..
PAF is acquiring for spare parts, as spares are no longer built, something india is doing with jaguars , already received 31 used from france as spares
https://defpost.com/indian-air-force-acquire-used-jaguar-attack-aircraft-france-oman-uk/

 

[MastanKhan]

Why not build a new dedicated Mirage replacement. Use a Skunk works like process - where the cobbled together the F-117 from parts of various other aircraft.

A stealthy, low level strike aircraft. After watching this video, I believe it is perfectly possible with the right project management decisions:

Hi,

The JF17 is an extremely inexpensive aircraft for the Paf in its own flight parameters---.

The problem happens when you change those parameters---. Then---it maybe successful---it may not be successful---. You also need to look at a different engine as well.

For that reason---JH7A is the best option---.

We would never know about the failed projects at Skunkwerks---.

 

[ziaulislam]

Interestingly, RC-400 Radar can reportedly fire Russian missiles as well. Which basically means the radar architecture allows non-Nato products to be mated (sort of open-code).
This would be an excellent additional bonus, considering firing Chinese missiles should be possible with slight coding adjustments. In such a case, a mirage Horus with SD-10 wont surprise me a dime.
We are in short talking about a Mirage 5 with true multi-role capabilities in PA colors!

"The radar can track a 5m2 (55ft2) target in low-altitude/look-down mode at 100km (55nm) range, says the company, and air-to-ground ranging is possible down to a "few metres" accuracy. The RC400 is compatible with European and Russian beyond visual range missiles, says de la Bourdonnaye."

https://www.flightglobal.com/thomson-csf-unveils-rc400-airborne-radar/26925.article

question would PAF think its worth the effort?
my guess is they wont bother adding the SD10 but will consider if they get the MICA some how

 

[Nomad40]

How many fighters and sqds of mirage 5 are PAF retaining and until what time period .

This is my guess PAF tonight


1 sqd F16/52 = 18 fighter
3 sqd F16 mlu/A/B = 55 fighters
3 sqds block1 thunders = 50 fighters
4 sqds block 2 Thunders = 70 fighters
6 sqds Mirage5 = 120 fighters
3 sqds F7PG = 55 fighters

THIS MAKES THE MIRAGE 5 the most numerous fighters in your airforce

57* + bunch of nasty nasty surprises abhi ana khusbu laga kar.

 

[Akh1112]

The MIRAGE 5 first flew in 1955
The build quality is 70 year old technology
metal alloy airframe
All hydraulic gears no digital FBW

Mirage5 was relaced by mirage2000 then rafale

Mirage5 was a Mig21 of france ..........its ancient

IT WAS

IAF tonight

272 Su30mki
100 Jaguar
63 MIG29upg
54 Mig21 BIISON
45 Mirage2000
20 Tejas

THE DIFFERENCE between PAF & IAF

IAF is acquiring 12 su30 mki & 21 mig29upg as a interim measure and spares & attrition losses. For cheap money ie about $1.4 billion for the planes alone & $1 billion of new BVRS and WVR missles

PAF is aquiring 36 MIRAGE 5 for same resason ie attrition losses and spares etc.

IAF = new gen fighters 36 rafales & 20 Tejas ( 20 delivered alrready)

PAF = New gen fighters 50 block 3 thunders

Right but heres the issue with your logic. Qualitatively, a Mirage V Horus, equipped with MICA is arguably superior to about 490-510 of your aircraft. The biggest threat the PAF faces atm is the M2K's and then the Rafale. Realistically, Flankers suffer from sad avionics which put them in the crosshairs of even the earlier JF-17 iterations with their superior SD-10. Mig-21's suffer from the Kopyo making use of a tiny antenna because of the nose cone size, 30km for a 3m^2 RCS, pretty poor. Mig-29 UPG's 120km for a 5m^2 RCS, again, pretty poor by modern standards, outclassed by both the KLJ-7 and KLJ-7V2, alongside this, they probably also dont have as good ECM/ECCM resistance as the Chinese radars considering they were derived from earlier, cold war systems.

question would PAF think its worth the effort?
my guess is they wont bother adding the SD10 but will consider if they get the MICA some how

It would make the most sense to go for the MICA on cost grounds, however, i feel like there would be some difficulties with integrating the SD-10 considering relations between France and China have gone frosty.

 

[nomi007]

Mirage Horus are coming with weapon package or just jets?

 

[Nomad40]

Hi,

The JF17 is an extremely inexpensive aircraft for the Paf in its own flight parameters---.

The problem happens when you change those parameters---. Then---it maybe successful---it may not be successful---. You also need to look at a different engine as well.

For that reason---JH7A is the best option---.

We would never know about the failed projects at Skunkwerks---.

I can agree with you on this one JH-7Aii will be an excellent replacement for mirage's.

Mirage Horus are coming with weapon package or just jets?

NO only spare's.

Right but heres the issue with your logic. Qualitatively, a Mirage V Horus, equipped with MICA is arguably superior to about 490-510 of your aircraft. The biggest threat the PAF faces atm is the M2K's and then the Rafale. Realistically, Flankers suffer from sad avionics which put them in the crosshairs of even the earlier JF-17 iterations with their superior SD-10. Mig-21's suffer from the Kopyo making use of a tiny antenna because of the nose cone size, 30km for a 3m^2 RCS, pretty poor. Mig-29 UPG's 120km for a 5m^2 RCS, again, pretty poor by modern standards, outclassed by both the KLJ-7 and KLJ-7V2, alongside this, they probably also dont have as good ECM/ECCM resistance as the Chinese radars considering they were derived from earlier, cold war systems.




It would make the most sense to go for the MICA on cost grounds, however, i feel like there would be some difficulties with integrating the SD-10 considering relations between France and China have gone frosty.

Flanker has excellent avionics, it is one of the best dog-fighters it's thrust to weight ratio is impeccable.

I know how the flanker fights and it's a dangerous opponent there is a massive weakness of the flanker and well all know what it is and that is what gives us an advantage over the flank. Its biggest disadvantage is PAF's greatest advantage.

M2k are excellent plane's, a threat on par of the flank.

 

[denel]

I can agree with you on this one JH-7Aii will be an excellent replacement for mirage's.


NO only spare's.


Flanker has excellent avionics, it is one of the best dog-fighters it's thrust to weight ratio is impeccable.

I know how the flanker fights and it's a dangerous opponent there is a massive weakness of the flanker and well all know what it is and that is what gives us an advantage over the flank. Its biggest disadvantage is PAF's greatest advantage.

M2k are excellent plane's, a threat on par of the flank.

problem with flankers - they are too too maintenance hungry.

i concur with you - jh-7 is ideal platform but you me and @MastanKhan are the only ones who keep proposing but get hostile responses.

 

[Nomad40]

problem with flankers - they are too too maintenance hungry.

yes and the air intakes--------awful awful RCS, Like the fattest person in the gym.

 

[Akh1112]

I can agree with you on this one JH-7Aii will be an excellent replacement for mirage's.


NO only spare's.


Flanker has excellent avionics, it is one of the best dog-fighters it's thrust to weight ratio is impeccable.

I know how the flanker fights and it's a dangerous opponent there is a massive weakness of the flanker and well all know what it is and that is what gives us an advantage over the flank. Its biggest disadvantage is PAF's greatest advantage.

M2k are excellent plane's, a threat on par of the flank.

"
Flanker has excellent avionics, it is one of the best dog-fighters it's thrust to weight ratio is impeccable.

I know how the flanker fights and it's a dangerous opponent there is a massive weakness of the flanker and well all know what it is and that is what gives us an advantage over the flank. Its biggest disadvantage is PAF's greatest advantage."

This is objectively false. The Flankers have been widely reported to have poor avionics, just an example. Look at the PLAAF vs Thai air force DACT exercise, Thai Gripens smashed the SU-30MKK's of the PLAAF, however, when the PLAAF brought out the J-10s and J-16's the Gripens got their a** handed to them.

 

[Saifullah]

"
This is objectively false. The Flankers have been widely reported to have poor avionics, just an example. Look at the PLAAF vs Thai air force DACT exercise, Thai Gripens smashed the SU-30MKK's of the PLAAF, however, when the PLAAF brought out the J-10s and J-16's the Gripens got their a** handed to them.

Flankers in Russian forces are extreemly excellent platforms. Indians bought a good piece of fighting machine and made them not so good fighting machine. Hopefully they keep doing it with their stuff.

 

[Akh1112]

Flankers in Russian forces are extreemly excellent platforms. Indians bought a good piece of fighting machine and made them not so good fighting machine. Hopefully they keep doing it with their stuff.

Id argue IAF flankers are technologically superior. Besides, we can look back to the example i cited.

 

[Nomad40]

"
Flanker has excellent avionics, it is one of the best dog-fighters it's thrust to weight ratio is impeccable.

I know how the flanker fights and it's a dangerous opponent there is a massive weakness of the flanker and well all know what it is and that is what gives us an advantage over the flank. Its biggest disadvantage is PAF's greatest advantage."

This is objectively false. The Flankers have been widely reported to have poor avionics, just an example. Look at the PLAAF vs Thai air force DACT exercise, Thai Gripens smashed the SU-30MKK's of the PLAAF, however, when the PLAAF brought out the J-10s and J-16's the Gripens got their a** handed to them.

We are talking about MKI's they have pretty good avionics PERIOD. Stop comparing an MKK to The MKI the whole avionics package exception of the Radar is bulked Israeli and french.

 

[Akh1112]

We are talking about MKI's they have pretty good avionics PERIOD. Stop comparing an MKK to The MKI the whole avionics package exception of the Radar is bulked Israeli and french.

Ok and what is the most important part of a modern fighter????

 

[Nomad40]

Ok and what is the most important part of a modern fighter????

The fighter pilot.