Ancient Hindu-Buddhist civilization seal discovered in Pakistan

[Rig Vedic]

Why do Indians feel that Pakistanis have some kind of affinity for their Hindu Ancestors?

At this point of time, you don't.

But in the information age, you cannot stop the flow of ideas. Doctrines which rely on slaughtering apostates and blasphemers cannot expect to survive indefinitely.

I expect that it will take another 2 or 3 generations for change to manifest.

 

[Rusty]

At this point of time, you don't.

But in the information age, you cannot stop the flow of ideas. Doctrines which rely on slaughtering apostates and blasphemers cannot expect to survive indefinitely.

I expect that it will take another 2 or 3 generations for change to manifest.

Good thing our religion forbids such barbarity.
It's part of the reason we converted to Islam.
we also realized that burning widows in their husbands funeral pyre or killing people just because they ate beef was also barbaric.

Such antics of our ancestors also help us distance ourselves from them.
There is a reason we refer to this time as the Jahiliyah, or the uncivilized/barbaric times.

 

[Rig Vedic]

Good thing our religion forbids such barbarity.

That would be news to Asia Bibi ...

See, there is progress. Jinnah, Iqbal and Salman Taseer's father openly praised those who slaughtered blasphemers. In your generation, at least amongst the elites, people want to sweep such things under the carpet, and pretend that such barbarism is not part of their religion. Your children may have the courage to acknowledge the truth. And their children may start looking for a better alternative to the bankruptcy of their worldview.

It's part of the reason we converted to Islam.

No problem, I am not trying to convince you.

Let's wait and see.

 

[EastWest]

Good thing our religion forbids such barbarity.
It's part of the reason we converted to Islam.
we also realized that burning widows in their husbands funeral pyre or killing people just because they ate beef was also barbaric.

Such antics of our ancestors also help us distance ourselves from them.
There is a reason we refer to this time as the Jahiliyah, or the uncivilized/barbaric times.

i find u saying that u guys converted to islam because u considered Hinduism a backward religion very amusing and u caring about women and their status in hinduism when u guys dont treat women any better is absolutely hilarious...

I bet u to show one scripture which shows Hinduism supports sati...it was a cultural practice not a religious one..just like Pakistan's blasphemy law..

so before u abuse hindus and hinduism ..may be u should look into ur own society...why dont u look into rallies like Difa-e-Pakistan where Ahmedis are being threatened to leave Pakistan...

 

[Rusty]

That would be news to Asia Bibi ...

See, there is progress. Jinnah, Iqbal and Salman Taseer's father openly praised those who slaughtered blasphemers. In your generation, at least amongst the elites, people want to sweep such things under the carpet, and pretend that such barbarism is not part of their religion. Your children may have the courage to acknowledge the truth. And their children may start looking for a better alternative to the bankruptcy of their worldview.



No problem, I am not trying to convince you.

Let's wait and see.

1. There is a difference between what people do and what the religion preaches.
When Hindus kill people for eating beef, it does not mean that Hinduism said to do that.
2. where did Jinnah, Iqbal, and Salman praise the killing of people? please provide evidence.
3. Our world view is perfectly fine with our morality and sense of self, part of the reason Islam is the worlds fastest growing religion.
finally 4. It's heart warming you care about us so much, but I do recommend you look after yourself more. Your culture is basically falling to western hemogoney. Hindus are becoming more and more western with western life styles, foods, and clothing.
Heck they are even willing to cook/eat beef in their desperation to be accepted in the west.
I used to work for McDonald in high school and all the full time employees were Hindus, cooking and serving beef.

And the best part is that one time I asked a Hindu classmate of mine if he believed in reincarnation and he was almost ashamed to admit that he did.

So take care of your selves first, Islam will be fine.

 

[Rusty]

i find u saying that u guys converted to islam because u considered Hinduism a backward religion very amusing and u caring about women and their status in hinduism when u guys dont treat women any better is absolutely hilarious...

I bet u to show one scripture which shows Hinduism supports sati...it was a cultural practice not a religious one..just like Pakistan's blasphemy law..

so before u abuse hindus and hinduism ..may be u should look into ur own society...why dont u look into rallies like Difa-e-Pakistan where Ahmedis are being threatened to leave Pakistan...

Are you kidding, Islam was the first religion to give Woman legal rights including the right to ownership and inheritance. Rights the western woman only got in like 1910.
If you are so concerned about Muslim women, why don't you actually talk to them about it instead of believing what fox and rss tell you.

And thanks for informing me that widow burning is cultural and not religious.
It shows that you understand the difference between people and religion.
Also I will change my stance on it from being a Hindu religious thing, to a Hindu people thing.

 

[amidamaru]

yeh i think it comes down to the people.. both pakistani and indians are barbaric and backwards.

both have attitude problems

 

[Rig Vedic]

2. where did Jinnah, Iqbal, and Salman praise the killing of people? please provide evidence.

That was the famous Ghazi Ilm-ud-din case. You can look it up. (Not Salman himself but his father Muhammad Din Taseer was involved.)

And the best part is that one time I asked a Hindu classmate of mine if he believed in reincarnation and he was almost ashamed to admit that he did.

You can ask your classmate to see this - http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/31863-newsweek-we-all-hindus-now.html. But frankly, the Indic civilization has no need to validate itself with opinions of others.

 

[Rusty]

That was the famous Ghazi Ilm-ud-din case. You can look it up. (Not Salman himself but his father Muhammad Din Taseer was involved.)


You can ask your classmate to see this - http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/31863-newsweek-we-all-hindus-now.html. But frankly, the Indic civilization has no need to validate itself with opinions of others. As the saying goes, one man with conviction is a majority.

since you only took issue with one point of my 4, I can only assume you agree with the rest.
And no
I will not do your research for you
You made an absurd claim and I called you out on it
your response of "look it up" is simply not good enough.

 

[Rig Vedic]

since you only took issue with one point of my 4, I can only assume you agree with the rest.

Of course not. The penalty for blasphemy is a well-settled matter in Islam. If you take permission from the mods and start a thread on it, we can discuss the relevant Sahih Hadiths.

your response of "look it up" is simply not good enough.

There are threads on this very topic in this forum itself. I'm not in the mood for spoon-feeding right now.

 

[Rusty]

Of course not. The penalty for blasphemy is a well-settled matter in Islam. If you take permission from the mods and start a thread on it, we can discuss the relevant Sahih Hadiths.


There are threads on this very topic in this forum itself. I'm not in the mood for spoon-feeding right now.

Really? then you will have no problems citing me where Islam gives permission to simply kill someone for blasphemy.

and please no Islamophobe links

using propaganda to help your argument just shows how weak it really is.

once again, you are saying a lot but not providing any evidence.
Do you know why I am not making any claims against Hinduism?
because I know that my knowledge on it is weak and I am not here to spread hatred against it.
And the one time I implied something against Hinduism, I was corrected and I graciously accepted that.

Of course you are just here to spread Islamophobic propaganda so you don't really need any evidence to back up anything.

 

[t_for_talli]

Why do Indians feel that Pakistanis have some kind of affinity for their Hindu Ancestors?
Yes at one point in history we were Hindus, just like we were cavemen at one point.
But that does not mean we have some kind of longing to live in a cave.
Personally I have much more feelings for the destruction of the caliphate then any Hindu ancestors.

We view our conversion to Islam as being brought into the light from darkness, and we are perfectly happy with that world view.

That is not to say we are not proud of our Ancestors, just like the Europeans are proud of the Romans and Greeks. But they don't have any special feeling for Zeus or Neptune.

You have been brought up in a totally different environment
This is the story of your ancestors Hindu Kush means Hindu Slaughter accept Islam or your head will be chopped off
In sub-continent the percentage of people who's forefathers converted to Islam by their will is very less because the golden period of Islam in sub-continent was under Akbar and Shahjahan , except these two all were barbaric
The main difference between Abhramic(Islam Christanity) and non Abharamic(Dharma- Hinduism,Buddhism ) religions is that you guys believe in propagating religion by Force/Incentives/Taxation on others etc etc. I dont know why you people are running behind numbers another example is christan missionaries in rural areas offer medicines in the name of holy water to buy their faiths

 

[Rig Vedic]

Really? then you will have no problems citing me where Islam gives permission to simply kill someone for blasphemy.

and please no Islamophobe links

using propaganda to help your argument just shows how weak it really is.

once again, you are saying a lot but not providing any evidence.
Do you know why I am not making any claims against Hinduism?
because I know that my knowledge on it is weak and I am not here to spread hatred against it.
And the one time I implied something against Hinduism, I was corrected and I graciously accepted that.

Of course you are just here to spread Islamophobic propaganda so you don't really need any evidence to back up anything.

You will have to get permission from the mods before I give you evidence.

But anyway, go in peace. I have no hostility to any individual. I support the truth, in a detached way.

 

[Rusty]

You have been brought up in a totally different environment
This is the story of your ancestors Hindu Kush means Hindu Slaughter accept Islam or your head will be chopped off
In sub-continent the percentage of people who's forefathers converted to Islam by their will is very less because the golden period of Islam in sub-continent was under Akbar and Shahjahan , except these two all were barbaric
The main difference between Abhramic(Islam Christanity) and non Abharamic(Dharma- Hinduism,Buddhism ) religions is that you guys believe in propagating religion by Force/Incentives/Taxation on others etc etc. I dont know why you people are running behind numbers another example is christan missionaries in rural areas offer medicines in the name of holy water to buy their faiths

Once again Indians living in their fantasy world.
1. I am sure you can provide evidence for your claims of mass forced conversions. But judging from previous discussions I won't have too much hope that you will. And I want evidence for wholesale forced mass conversions, not of a person here or there, as I will admit there were a few leaders who were forced to convert or die, and that too was mostly for political reason and not religious.
2. let me ask you a single logical question
Muslims have been in India for 800 years
and yet 80% of India is Hindu.
So either the Muslims were so bad at forcing people to convert that only managed to convert like 15% of the population in 800 years, OR you are living in a fantasy world and there was no mass forced conversions.

Just for the sake of comparison, lets look at Spain, Muslims were also there for 800 years but now many Muslims are left in Spain?
ZERO!
you know why?
because they were forced to convert to Christianity during the Spanish inquisition.

You guys need to stop living in this fantasy world and accept that people freely left your religion for Islam, including my ancestors.


@Rig Vedic

pretty convenient

but still, the same to you, go in peace.

 

[Don Jaguar]

Once again Indians living in their fantasy world.
1. I am sure you can provide evidence for your claims of mass forced conversions. But judging from previous discussions I won't have too much hope that you will. And I want evidence for wholesale forced mass conversions, not of a person here or there, as I will admit there were a few leaders who were forced to convert or die, and that too was mostly for political reason and not religious.
2. let me ask you a single logical question
Muslims have been in India for 800 years
and yet 80% of India is Hindu.
So either the Muslims were so bad at forcing people to convert that only managed to convert like 15% of the population in 800 years, OR you are living in a fantasy world and there was no mass forced conversions.

Just for the sake of comparison, lets look at Spain, Muslims were also there for 800 years but now many Muslims are left in Spain?
ZERO!
you know why?
because they were forced to convert to Christianity during the Spanish inquisition.

You guys need to stop living in this fantasy world and accept that people freely left your religion for Islam, including my ancestors.


@Rig Vedic

pretty convenient

but still, the same to you, go in peace.

Well said brother.

Indians are taught that we are forcefully converted to islam.