Altay & Turkish Main Battle Tank Programs

[ptldM3]

Pretty sure it had every advantage over T-72/90 when it came out..

When simple economics forced russia to upgrade t-72s into T-90 rather than producing more expensive T-80s.


Not to forget the fact that T-80s were produced by Marshev plant in Ukraine. Rather than Russia... after the break up of USSR...

One of the reasons Russia forced Ukraine to halt supply of T-80s to Pak... forcing them to incorporate T-84 design into Pak UDs like turret,gun,engine,electronics etc.

Nice.



Also T-80 was better armoured than T-72 or T-90. When it was produced... infact it was considered the USSRs most advanced tank...

While T-72s were cheaper to produce and hence the upgraded UB variant aka T-90.


T-80BV upgraded into “M”?

The B and BVs were proceeded by the U variant..


Early models ;


T-72
View attachment 448744
T-80

View attachment 448745

T-80s were also produced in Omsk Russia. The armor on the T-80 is also not at all better compared to the T-90, it always had thinner armor. Both tanks had the same firepower, the only meaningful advantage the T-80 had over the T-90 was that it had more power, better mobility but at the cost of being a gas guzzler, which turned out to be a disadvantage.

T-80s eats a lot of fuel and in Chechnya proved to burn rather quickly if hit in the engine.


Armor thicknesses comparisons.

 

[Mr.Department]

I tend to ignore Twitter statements, I was hoping maybe it was from and S&H, MSI or C4Defence magazines... Anyway thanks..

There are some serious experts

I tend to ignore Twitter statements, I was hoping maybe it was from and S&H, MSI or C4Defence magazines... Anyway thanks..

Most of the experts in twitter are also source for them too. E.g. Göksel, Turan Oguz etc.
you know nobody likes Bekdil here, but he writes for Janes. And Janes is the credible source for defence Industry.

T-80s were also produced in Omsk Russia. The armor on the T-80 is also not at all better compared to the T-90, it always had thinner armor. Both tanks had the same firepower, the only meaningful advantage the T-80 had over the T-90 was that it had more power, better mobility but at the cost of being a gas guzzler, which turned out to be a disadvantage.

T-80s eats a lot of fuel and in Chechnya proved to burn rather quickly if hit in the engine.


Armor thicknesses comparisons.



View attachment 448749

Very informative.

 

[UzaySan]

What about gas-turbin engines for tanks? Is there any domestic engine project ? Features of gas-turbin engines they run with jet-fuel as well gasoline , genareting more power very silently.
Thats why T-80 tanks stiil occupy %50 of operational russians tank inventory.
And legendary M1abrams runs with gas-turbinr engines .

American abrams tanks use gas turbin engine.But developing gasturbin engine for tanks is much more difficult than diesel engines.

They are very effective in cold conditions. Difficult to maintain and not suited for hot desert areas.

I dont think gas turbin engine is bad for deserts.Most of american lands is desert.if it wasnt good for desert usa wouldnt choose it.but gas turbin engine cant run well in cold area.the thing with turbin engine is compressing air.How more you compress,it works better.in hot weather compressin air is easy.but in cold area it gets hard unlike you i think gas turbin engines are good for desert.

 

[era_shield]

Most of the experts in twitter are also source for them too. E.g. Göksel, Turan Oguz etc.
you know nobody likes Bekdil here, but he writes for Janes. And Janes is the credible source for defence Industry.

Bokdil does not write for Jane's, he writes for Defencenews which is just a news aggregator.

 

[Mr.Department]

gas turbin engines are good for desert

Operation desert storm

Maybe that the problems were filter related
"In Desert Storm, the M1 Abrams could only travel as few as 12 miles (20 km) before the filters needed to be changed."
But I never heard that piston engines in the Arab peninsula had comparable problems.

Bokdil does not write for Jane's, he writes for Defencenews which is just a news aggregator.

Are you sure ?

Burak Bekdil, Turkey's defense corespondent for Hurriyet Daily News and Jane's Defence Weekly,

https://turkeywonk.wordpress.com/category/missile-defense/

 

[era_shield]

Operation desert storm

Maybe that the problems were filter related
"In Desert Storm, the M1 Abrams could only travel as few as 12 miles (20 km) before the filters needed to be changed."
But I never heard that piston engines in the Arab peninsula had comparable problems.



Are you sure ?

Burak Bekdil, Turkey's defense corespondent for Hurriyet Daily News and Jane's Defence Weekly,

https://turkeywonk.wordpress.com/category/missile-defense/

Pretty sure. Google shows no articles with his name in it on janes.com: link

 

[Silahtar]

Mine Clearance Mission to Altay



Turkish Undersecretariat for Defence Industries (SSM) wants to develop a new mine clearance vehicles using the Altay Tank's body. SSM invited companies to participate in the project with the Request for Information (RFI) issued on 16 January.

The project foresees the development of a vehicle which is capable of disassembling and detonating anti-tank and anti-personnel mines. Mine clearing vehicles are required to have a high-powered engine due to their working principle and to provide high protection.

A German Leopard tank configured for mine clearance can be seen in the picture.

OTOKAR participated in the 2017 IDEF exhibiting the "asymmetric warfare" version of Altay developed for urban warfare.

http://en.c4defence.com/Agenda/mine-clearance-mission-to-altay/5557/1

 

[DavidSling]

Mine Clearance Mission to Altay



Turkish Undersecretariat for Defence Industries (SSM) wants to develop a new mine clearance vehicles using the Altay Tank's body. SSM invited companies to participate in the project with the Request for Information (RFI) issued on 16 January.

The project foresees the development of a vehicle which is capable of disassembling and detonating anti-tank and anti-personnel mines. Mine clearing vehicles are required to have a high-powered engine due to their working principle and to provide high protection.

A German Leopard tank configured for mine clearance can be seen in the picture.

OTOKAR participated in the 2017 IDEF exhibiting the "asymmetric warfare" version of Altay developed for urban warfare.

http://en.c4defence.com/Agenda/mine-clearance-mission-to-altay/5557/1

 

[Mr.Department]

Dave we have similar system- what will happen if it fails and a 1000kg IED is ignited by wire ?

 

[DavidSling]

Dave we have similar system- what will happen if it fails and a 1000kg IED is ignited by wire ?

Firstly, it's either autonomous or equiped to a Merkava or a namer.
Secondly, the chances of failure are very low, cause there's no human invulvement in the process(identifying the threat and neutrilizing the IED is done by the system itself)

 

[Mr.Department]

Firstly, it's either autonomous or equiped to a Merkava or a namer.
Secondly, the chances of failure are very low, cause there's no human invulvement in the process(identifying the threat and neutrilizing the IED is done by the system itself)

Ok got it. Unmanned system.

http://www.aselsan.com.tr/tr-tr/basin-odasi/Brosurler/Elektronik-Harp-Sistemleri/EJDERHA_HPEM_TR.pdf

Similar system. Thanks David

 

[DavidSling]

Ok got it. Unmanned system.

http://www.aselsan.com.tr/tr-tr/basin-odasi/Brosurler/Elektronik-Harp-Sistemleri/EJDERHA_HPEM_TR.pdf

Similar system. Thanks David

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/israeli-drones.413048/page-5

 

[Mr.Department]

Now in the vid its explained

 

[DavidSling]

Now in the vid its explained

updated my post with autonomous vehicles of the IDF so u'll see how it's working

 

[mete]

Operation desert storm

Maybe that the problems were filter related
"In Desert Storm, the M1 Abrams could only travel as few as 12 miles (20 km) before the filters needed to be changed."
But I never heard that piston engines in the Arab peninsula had comparable problems.

I agree to a degree but I have to add one more problem for turbines.

They are really complicated when compared to ordinary internal combustion engines. Complicated means costly spare parts, costly and slow repair and maintainance, higher logistics demand.

Those might not be a major problem for USA but those are really big problems for us. We do not have same conditions, so what is good for them might be a disaster for us or vice versa.