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Scorpene submarine: Indigenous AIP will increase endurance of the boats being built

You are a fool,plain and simple.Did you even read what that chap asked??Did you actually comprehend what was being asked to you...........cause I've very much doubt you did.
lagta hai sarre ke saare bongolie bhodro puroosh mujhe gareeb baniye se khaffa hain :o:

I believe he has much important economic agenda than just appeasing japan for a submarine.
its a toatal pakage and Japan has the best tech after USA + japanese are already doing great buisness with it so why not take it to next level as we both understand each other well
 
By IANS | 19 Jul, 2015, 03.27PM IST

Scorpene submarine: Indigenous AIP will increase endurance of the boats being built - The Economic Times

NEW DELHI: As India develops its air independent propulsion (AIP) technology that enables a submarine stay underwater for longer periods without having to constantly surface to charge its batteries, the last of the six boats being built in the country may benefit from the system.

While the initial plans were to fit at least two of the six submarines with the system, an Indian Navy officer said the technology may not be ready in time to install it in the fifth Scorpene submarine.

"The technology is being developed, and it may miss the fifth submarine, but we hope to get it on the sixth one. Everything depends on the development of the AIP system," an Indian Navy official told IANS.

He said another option was that the AIP system could be installed in the fifth Scorpene submarine later on.

"Maybe it can be retro-fitted in the fifth submarine later," the officer said.

The AIP system being developed by the Maharashtra-based Naval Materials Research Laboratory (NMRL) is a fuel cell that replaces diesel in conventional submarines.

It converts methanol-like substances to produce hydrogen, which is the fuel that runs the cell in producing electricity.

While diesel engines need oxygen to function, these cells are air independent. The sustem also emits less noise, increasing its stealth - the most critical feature of a submarine.


With this system, a conventional submarine that needs to surface every three to four days for replenishing its oxygen supply, can stay underwater for up to two weeks.

Developing the technology will cost India about Rs 50,000 crore ($7 billion).

On the other hand, submarines of archrival Pakistani Navy, mostly procured from France, are equipped with the AIP.

In 2005, India purchased six Scorpene submarines from France for US$3 billion. They are being manufactured under a technology transfer agreement by the state-owned Mazagon Docks in Mumbai in collaboration with the French group DCNS.

The submarines were initially to be delivered between 2012 and 2016.

The project is however running almost four years behind schedule, and first of the six submarines, INS Kalvari, is currently undergoing sea trials and is expected to be inducted into the Navy in 2016.

According to the navy officer, two more submarines are in the outfitting phase.

The Scorpene submarines are designed to operate in all theatres, including the tropics. They can undertake various types of missions like anti-surface warfare, anti-submarine warfare, mine laying, intelligence gathering and surveillance.

The submarine arm of the Indian Navy has been facing constraints in the recent past as most of its Soviet-era vessels have outlived their intended life. A couple of such submarines have also been involved in serious accidents, resulting in the loss of precious lives.
by the time our glorious indigenous AIP will be ready .. SUbmarines would be near their retirement ! All hail the super efficient govt labs!
 
by the time our glorious indigenous AIP will be ready .. SUbmarines would be near their retirement ! All hail the super efficient govt labs!
exactly.jpg
 
its a toatal pakage and Japan has the best tech after USA + japanese are already doing great buisness with it so why not take it to next level as we both understand each other well

Experts will disagree, MESMA is still the best AIP system out there, and US doesn't even operate any diesel electric submarine.

@Abingdonboy @sancho
 
Lets clear the doubts and reason the situation out.

These are the following countries which have a working AIP system.

1. France => MESMA
2. Sweden => Sterling
3. Germany => Hydrogen based Fuel cell.
4. Spain =>Organic fuel cell.

These are the countries trying to develop it.

1. Russia
2. India

These are the countries which use it.

1. Japan => Uses Swedish AIP.
2. Pakistan => Uses French AIP.
3. China => A derivative of Swedish Sterling. Now trying to improve it.


Now lets have a look at different types of AIP.

Basically these are of 3 types.

1. Internal combustion Steam Turbines . ( Ex MESMA of France. )
2. Sterling cycle AIP. (Sweden)
3. Fuel cell ( Ex Hydrogen fuel cell AIP of Germany, Bio ethanol of Spain, DRDO AIP)

Now lets take a look at their comparison.

In range
(Present not future)

Fuel Cell > MESMA > Sterling

In stealth and efficiency

Fuel cell = Sterling > MESMA


NOW come to a question why DRDO is taking time.

● Because it has chosen the most difficult type to build.
● Technologically it will be superior to MESMA and Sterling used presently. Systems from Germany and Spain only supersede it.

Why we should stick to it now.

Because we have already completed the first and most difficult stage of building and testing the prototype at ground.


PS:- Why I say Fuel cell is superior to MESMA of France. Please do some research yourselves in this field. By research, I mean just go through the working of each of them.

Also I have tried to be accurate . Corrections are most welcome.
and that is what will be cause the endless delay. DRDO is trying once again to develop something it has no ducking idea !
between prototype and actual implementation takes ages in the annals of DRDO !
 
Experts will disagree, MESMA is still the best AIP system out there, and US doesn't even operate any diesel electric submarine.

@Abingdonboy @sancho
here i was not talking about "deisel sub tech" or "AIP" alone as i said "total pakage" both Japan and India can gain much much more from collaborating with each other lets see what happens too soon to say anything
 
Japan is itself using the Swedish Sterling AIP system. There is no way by which Sweden will allow Japan to sell it( virtually it will be if we collaborate)and reap the profits. If we want what Japan uses, we will only be successful if we talk with SAAB and Kokums directly about it.
 
and that is what will be cause the endless delay. DRDO is trying once again to develop something it has no ducking idea !
between prototype and actual implementation takes ages in the annals of DRDO !

Just what I expected from a,well,something like you.The bold part bears the testimony to your stupidity,ignorance and your lack of ducking idea.As they say,ignorance may be bliss for the ignorant,but for others it's a big pain in the @ss.

And quite obviously,your post was thanked by another of your kind.Again,"Rab ne bana di jodi,ak ana aur ak kaudi". :D

@punit and @GURU DUTT you guys make a nice cute couple you two,you know that??Oh the love,the addiction and the bonding towards each other......damn!!It's a high time,you two lovebirds give your relationship a name. :D
 
And hydrogen based fuel cells by Germany trumps the Oxygen Ethanol based MESMA steam Turbine of France any day over endurance, stealth, etc.

Proof to my sentence is the worldwide number of users of FUEL CELLS vs MESMA.
 
AIP was not in the contract. India was even talking with the Swedish for their fuel cell technology, but the negotiation never went ahead.

The construction of the submarines already started and they already have the money, don't behave like a typical marwari in a sweet shop. :D

Kockums of Sweden has a full fledged AIP unit in operation, i wonder why the deal didn't go ahead? Maybe no kick backs?
 
Just what I expected from a,well,something like you.The bold part bears the testimony to your stupidity,ignorance and your lack of ducking idea.As they say,ignorance may be bliss for the ignorant,but for others it's a big pain in the @ss.

And quite obviously,your post was thanked by another of your kind.Again,"Rab ne bana di jodi,ak ana aur ak kaudi". :D

@punit and @GURU DUTT you guys make a nice cute couple you two,you know that??Oh the love,the addiction and the bonding towards each other......damn!!It's a high time,you two lovebirds give your relationship a name. :D
wow so after making fun of me you are trying to become "rishtey waali aunty" sorry bro unlike you i prefer women not "boys" but cant say about your taste SIR :haha:
 
wow so after making fun of me you are trying to become "rishtey waali aunty" sorry bro unlike you i prefer women not "boys" but cant say about your taste SIR :haha:

I believe in letting my actions speaks for me,and here your action is showing the exact opposite to what you said in the bold part!!But hey,don't worry if you are gay,that's none of my concern.You do not have to lie to me about your sexual orientation as you did with your experience with firearms you know??Haha................two gays in one thread. :D
 
That is a clear indication that you have no ducking idea!
me and u both are here only. let's wait and watch the drama ! At the end navvy will be blamed for delay and forced to adopt whatever crap DRDO will be able to manage !
 

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