Russia’s Stealth Fighter Could Outfly, Outshoot American Jets

[Beerbal]

blades??????





i loose man..........looks like pakfa is stealthier than both f-35 and j-20

nothing more to say

No need to loose or win, just increase your knowledge.. T-50s Could be less stealthier than F22 and F35 (because the philosophy behind making of T-50 is different) .

J20, we are not sure, No one knows the real capability of Chiniese stuff. The point you made were flawed (Exposed blade, Underbelly etc)..

canards?
its a discussion man,,,not a quiz



pls stop behaving totally ignorant...............when russians are themselves claiming it to be lesser stealthy then who are we to opine??

Go to any russian site and it will say the thing i am telling u thats its less stealthy(agreed it compares it to f-22)
Still its not even a discussion when u want to negate the overwhelming evidence of its lesser stealth

That thread was an exapmle. that was an opinion. there are many thread on T-50, In Indian defense section official PAK-FA thread is available, There you can gather some information


http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/118201-sukhoi-pak-fa-fgfa-updates-news-discussions.html

 

[he-man]

now u tell me the negative points of j-20 anyone?? except canards

No need to loose or win, just increase your knowledge.. T-50s Could be less stealthier than F22 and F35 (because the philosophy behind making of T-50 is different) .

J20, we are not sure, No one knows the real capability of Chiniese stuff. The point you made were flawed (Exposed blade, Underbelly etc)..





That thread was an exapmle. that was an opinion. there are many thread on T-50, In Indian defense section official PAK-FA thread is available, There you can gather some information


http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/118201-sukhoi-pak-fa-fgfa-updates-news-discussions.html

i have gathered all this information from russian threads and i have posted max details on pakfa i wikipedia too............so believe me i have read enough

No need to loose or win, just increase your knowledge.. T-50s Could be less stealthier than F22 and F35 (because the philosophy behind making of T-50 is different) .

J20, we are not sure, No one knows the real capability of Chiniese stuff. The point you made were flawed (Exposed blade, Underbelly etc)..





That thread was an exapmle. that was an opinion. there are many thread on T-50, In Indian defense section official PAK-FA thread is available, There you can gather some information


http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/118201-sukhoi-pak-fa-fgfa-updates-news-discussions.html

answer one question

Whats the use of s-duct??

And as i said earlier u can ask any russian in any forum,,,,and he will admit to indeed lesser stealtht shaping to reduce costs

 

[he-man]

and here is a pakfa

I maybe a pakfa fanboy but i am not going to refute the truth here

 

[Beerbal]

now u tell me the negative points of j-20 anyone?? except canards

i have gathered all this information from russian threads and i have posted max details on pakfa i wikipedia too............so believe me i have read enough



answer one question

Whats the use of s-duct??

And as i said earlier u can ask any russian in any forum,,,,and he will admit to indeed lesser stealtht shaping to reduce costs

You are new to the PDF, Here anything against china is not tolerated. We will discuss the possible drawback of J20 offline..

 

[he-man]

You are new to the PDF, Here anything against china is not tolerated. We will discuss the possible drawback of J20 offline..

haha.....mate who cares,,,,j-20 may have drawbacks in terms of engine or electronics but make no mistake its very stealthy if we look at the shaping,even americans will agree to that.

That was the reason i was advocating better radars on su-30 and mig-29k as in the future we need powerful aesa to counter stealth and slotted array of mig-29k will just not cut the ice

 

[GURU DUTT]

and here is a pakfa

I maybe a pakfa fanboy but i am not going to refute the truth here

your right buddy but i think russian doctroine is different from american & chinese looking closeli to all three i beleave american ones are multi role both air to air warfare and a significant amount of bombing expertize thats why they look so bulki and have S ducts while russian looks more like a sprinter and will be used as a spearhead for punching holes in enemy air defence and mastering in airial fights

but i think russians like americans still have one other platform for multi role (bombing missions)

now can some one please post the latest PAKFA/FGFA concepts shown in MAKS 13 as i missed it deu to ban

 

[Tshering22]

If IAF is able to gather itself from its current terrible position, a lot of goodies await our fleet in the coming years.

 

[he-man]

your right buddy but i think russian doctroine is different from american & chinese looking closeli to all three i beleave american ones are multi role both air to air warfare and a significant amount of bombing expertize thats why they look so bulki and have S ducts while russian looks more like a sprinter and will be used as a spearhead for punching holes in enemy air defence and mastering in airial fights

but i think russians like americans still have one other platform for multi role (bombing missions)

now can some one please post the latest PAKFA/FGFA concepts shown in MAKS 13 as i missed it deu to ban

for gneral pics of maks-2013
http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/274117-maks-2013-indian-angle.html

all the equipment related to pakfa and other future radars!!(pakfa equipment on page 2)
http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/275107-happy-times-iaf-ahead-options-galore-2.html

If IAF is able to gather itself from its current terrible position, a lot of goodies await our fleet in the coming years.

totally agree with u

but if we don't admit to limitations of pakfa then how can we help improve it......very depressing

 

[Ayush]

@gambit.........

 

[he-man]

@gambit.........

ya ya........i feel a fresh wave on onslaught coming

 

[he-man]

your right buddy but i think russian doctroine is different from american & chinese looking closeli to all three i beleave american ones are multi role both air to air warfare and a significant amount of bombing expertize thats why they look so bulki and have S ducts while russian looks more like a sprinter and will be used as a spearhead for punching holes in enemy air defence and mastering in airial fights

but i think russians like americans still have one other platform for multi role (bombing missions)

now can some one please post the latest PAKFA/FGFA concepts shown in MAKS 13 as i missed it deu to ban

Thats the point i am making

Russians ditched the s-duct due to

1)weight issues
2)space issues
3)straight intakes provide better performance(correct me if i am wrong here pls)
4)The biggest flaw of pakfa is external pod that it will carry.................no internal EOTS
But they will now use radar blocker instead of s-duct which is a compromise!!

 

[Beerbal]

haha.....mate who cares,,,,j-20 may have drawbacks in terms of engine or electronics but make no mistake its very stealthy if we look at the shaping,even americans will agree to that.

That was the reason i was advocating better radars on su-30 and mig-29k as in the future we need powerful aesa to counter stealth and slotted array of mig-29k will just not cut the ice

I will not fall in trap and will not utter a single word against CHina and Chinese maal. I agree with you on other topics..

U remember 60s and 70s? when USA believed that close areal combat are obsolete, and in Vietnaam war there F4 lost to MiG19. Russia don't want to sacrifice close aircombat , thats why they have not compromise on maneuverability of T-50.

As we know there is trade-off of everything, if Russians are not compramise on one domain, they will have to compramise on other domain.

F35 may not be great close-air-combat aircraft (compared to contemporary fighters) , while it is best in stealth feature..

 

[he-man]

I will not fall in trap and will not utter a single word against CHina and Chinese maal. I agree with you on other topics..

U remember 60s and 70s? when USA believed that close areal combat are obsolete, and in Vietnaam war there F4 lost to MiG19. Russia don't want to sacrifice close aircombat , thats why they have not compromise on maneuverability of T-50.

As we know there is trade-off of everything, if Russians are not compramise on one domain, they will have to compramise on other domain.

F35 may not be great close-air-combat aircraft (compared to contemporary fighters) , while it is best in stealth feature..

The truth is with all the radars we are getting in pakfa along the electronics...........it will be a very good platform,no doubt about it.

But it would be foolish to compare it to f-35 which may have a smaller radar(1200t/r) but its 3 rd generation aesa for americans and is virtually jam-proof acc to OEM

On stealth i disagree on f-35 as clearly j-20 has far better shaping,,,,,,now i cannot comment on the quality of ram here
@BlueDot_in_Space

hi buddy u can clearly see me trolling here,,,,right??

 

[BlueDot_in_Space]

at least we are wanting in that respect

You pour billion dollars and we can do far better. Even on a shoestring budget, we have developed so much.

and how do i know whether chinese or russians have better ram??

Russian experience. Read about all the TDs that russians worked on.

we can only make assumptions on shape

Thats the last thing you should be doing.



1)j-20 has s-ducts,pakfa dosen't. Based on what ?? have you seen the sduct of J20??
2)j-20 has internal EOTS........pakfa has suspended pod. For the time being.
3)J-20 dosen't mount its irst like a ball at the front...............pakfa does. Have you seen the bulky wing actuators of J20?? they are far worse then the small IRST
4)the underbelly of j-20 is optimized,,,pakfa's is not. Again, having smooth surface doesnot mean optimized. And Russians are far more experience than the chinese when it comes to designing fighter planes .

 

[he-man]

You pour billion dollars and we can do far better. Even on a shoestring budget, we have developed so much.



Russian experience. Read about all the TDs that russians worked on.



Thats the last thing you should be doing.



1)j-20 has s-ducts,pakfa dosen't. Based on what ?? have you seen the sduct of J20??
2)j-20 has internal EOTS........pakfa has suspended pod. For the time being.
3)J-20 dosen't mount its irst like a ball at the front...............pakfa does. Have you seen the bulky wing actuators of J20?? they are far worse then the small IRST
4)the underbelly of j-20 is optimized,,,pakfa's is not. Again, having smooth surface doesnot mean optimized. And Russians are far more experience than the chinese when it comes to designing fighter planes .

4)have u seen the s- duct of f-22 and f-35.......what sort of argument is that??
its a fact

1)u cannot comment on ram......no one can
2)j-20 underbelly is exactly like f-22
3)Pakfa will never have internal EOTS
4)j-20 uses a s-duct as well as dsi......................undisputed fact


I don't doubt about sukhoi's ability,,,,its indeed more than chinese.,,,,but the consideration is





money.....