Is west instigating terrorism against Muslims?

[King Solomon]

The problem is that it is much harder to control external factors than it is to control the domestic situation, so any rebirth has to come from internal strength. External agents will always take advantage of, and even seed, internal dissent and extremism but the resistance to such infection has to exist within the society itself. Scientific and economic progress can only be achieved if there is some level of domestic stability.

Given that the Muslim world is utterly divided and often at cross purposes, I don't see how external geopolitical factors can be stopped. There is practicaly zero coordination amongst Muslim countries and, to make matters worse, some of the instigators of extremism are other Muslim countries themselves. What countries like Pakistan, Bangladesh and others can do is to keep their distance from the ongoing feuds in the Middle East and focus on domestic strength. There is no way either country can take on any of the Western powers in any way, military or economic.

Agreed. What I would suggest is: Holding on to Quranic values and banning all forms of Mullahism. It is the western world which adopted Quranic values around the 16th century and look where they are now. We abandoned, and look at the state of Muslims, they are hunted like rats around the world right now. We will also have to do the same thing which was done prior to the start of Islamic golden age, that is, adopt only the Quranic values in our lifestyle, governance, finance, business and everything if we are to prosper and restore our former glory and dominance over the world again.

 

[Safriz]

For over a decade i am at loss in understanding how cave dwelling donkey riders fooled the Al mighty USA and according to USA's own claims still fooling them.

Agreed. What I would suggest is: Holding on to Quranic values and banning all forms of Mullahism. It is the western world which adopted Quranic values around the 16th century and look where they are now. We abandoned, and look at the state of Muslims, they are hunted like rats around the world right now. We will also have to do the same thing which was done prior to the start of Islamic golden age, that is, adopt Quranic values in our lifestyle, governance, finance, business and everything if we are to prosper and restore our former glory and dominance over the world again.

we are fed up of non-Muslims telling us how to practice our religion.
Would you like me dictating you on how to live your life?
I dont know what religion you are from...But no,i like islam in its original form and i never killed a fly....So that's not the problem.

 

[King Solomon]

How quickly he assumed I am a Kafir... see the result of Mullah-induced wahabi extremism? And they blame the west!

we are fed up of non-muslims telling us how to practice our religion.
Would you like me dictating you on how to live your life?

I am a Muslim myself and this is a forum for expressing individual views. If you do not accept my views, debate so otherwise refrain from personal attacks

 

[Developereo]

Again, I feel that we are deviating from the thread.

Nobody has denied that there is extremism within Muslims and Muslims hold much of the blame for their current condition. The issue in this thread is whether there are elements in the West who are promoting Islamophobia and terrorism against Muslims. Regardless of whether such actions are justified as a 'reaction' or not is secondary; the main point is to acknowledge that this indoctrination in the West is happening.

 

[Safriz]

How quickly he assumed I am a Kafir... see the result of Mullah-induced wahabi extremism? And they blame the west!



I am a Muslim myself and this is a forum for expressing individual views. If you do not accept my views, debate so otherwise refrain from personal attacks

No there was nothing personal in my comment...and there was nothing extremist in my comment.
But what you are suggesting is deletion of Islam all together or Altering it to unrecognizable levels...and that is extremism.

That is exactly the goal of all this hoax.

 

[kalu_miah]

Why do muslims always find others to blame when the problem is within themselves?

Once upon a time the role was reversed.. Europeans/romans/sassanids were in the same positions like Muslims now and they were hunted like rats by the muslims at that time who held on to Quranic values of equal rights, freedom, democracy, women's rights, secularism (freedom of religion), science, arts, aesthetics etc.

Now, the essence of islam has been divided into many sects. Mullahs and extremists have led muslims astray by misinterpreting hadiths to encourage militancy, extremism, terrorism, backwardness, oppression of woman, suppression of freedom, speech, forbidding science, technology arts etc. these have completely destroyed Muslims.

Whereas, in the meanwhile Quranic values like equal rights, freedom, democracy, women's rights, secularism (freedom of religion), science, arts, aesthetics etc. has been adopted by Europe and west. They got ahead of muslims as a result of adopting civilized, Quranic values. Now the role is reversed. Europeans and West are hunting Muslims like rats.But isn't that only logical due to muslims failure to abide by Quranic values?

So, why do muslims always find others to blame when the problem is within themselves?

Sorry to see you say that. I am guessing that you are a Muslim bro from one of the former Soviet countries (including Russia).

The Muslims in medieval world got ahead because of their superior firepower and superior ideology. Like Mongols Muslims have conquered many parts of the world, but Mongols had no ideology, except Yassa (Jasaq), which was not enough to keep this vast empire, it fell apart. Islam was slightly better and Islamic societies were vibrant and adaptable. But unfortunately they got a fatal blow from Mongols. From enlightened scientific curiosity we turned to holding on to our rote rituals. Ibn Taimya's conservative literalist back to the roots ideology was born as a direct reaction to attacks from Islamic Mongols like Timur Lang.

In short, Muslims were never great on their own historical continuity, but they compensated for it with size of Islamic empires and the cooperation between them. But after the fatal blow, we lost the edge to adapt to modern world. Here is where I explain it in great detail:
http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-...orld-order-road-map-future-8.html#post2758071

 

[Developereo]

Agreed. What I would suggest is: Holding on to Quranic values and banning all forms of Mullahism. It is the western world which adopted Quranic values around the 16th century and look where they are now. We abandoned, and look at the state of Muslims, they are hunted like rats around the world right now. We will also have to do the same thing which was done prior to the start of Islamic golden age, that is, adopt only the Quranic values in our lifestyle, governance, finance, business and everything if we are to prosper and restore our former glory and dominance over the world again.

I am loathe to tell people how to live their life or practice their religion. As long as others are not impacted, people are free to believe what they want and do as they please.

 

[King Solomon]

I am loathe to tell people how to live their life or practice their religion. As long as others are not impacted, people are free to believe what they want and do as they please.

Then again, you cannot do this until you eradicate extremism and backward thoughts among society. To do that you will have to ban or at least severely restrict Mullahism, which induces backwardness and extremism. So, some form of interference is must if the root of the problem is to be cut.

 

[Safriz]

Then again, you cannot do this until you eradicate extremism and backward thoughts among society. To do that you will have to ban or at least severely restrict Mullahism, which induces backwardness and extremism. So, some form of interference is must if the root of the problem is to be cut.

I have friends and Family who studied at Madrissah...and are full time mullah...and believe me they aren't Mutants or Bozos..
They are normal people with families and Sources of income like you and me.
Theyhave been painted as evil to a level that any muslim man with beard and a cap is now deemed eveil and suspicious straight away....
Such propaganda and brainwashing cant bring peace.

 

[Bhairava]

.... doesn't understand the simple fact that the burden of proof lies with the claimant, not the skeptic.

Indeed..

So prove the claim the West is instigating terrorism against the Muslims to us skpetics.

 

[King Solomon]

Sorry to see you say that. I am guessing that you are a Muslim bro from one of the former Soviet countries (including Russia).

The Muslims in medieval world got ahead because of their superior firepower and superior ideology. Like Mongols Muslims have conquered many parts of the world, but Mongols had no ideology, except Yassa (Jasaq), which was not enough to keep this vast empire, it fell apart. Islam was slightly better and Islamic societies were vibrant and adaptable. But unfortunately they got a fatal blow from Mongols. From enlightened scientific curiosity we turned to holding on to our rote rituals. Ibn Taimya's conservative literalist back to the roots ideology was born as a direct reaction to attacks from Islamic Mongols like Timur Lang.

In short, Muslims were never great on their own historical continuity, but they compensated for it with size of Islamic empires and the cooperation between them. But after the fatal blow, we lost the edge to adapt to modern world. Here is where I explain it in great detail:
http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-...orld-order-road-map-future-8.html#post2758071

Thank you. Great insight into the matter.

I agree, but I would say still the Ottomans were a feared power in Europe. But yet, they lacked the scientific zeal of the Abbasids and the empire before.

 

[Bhairava]

Developereo, you think you can change their mind? .

That's rich...considering that people don't have 1st grade common sense of differentiating between war's between sovereign nations and terror acts of non-state actors and like to club them all together in a (vain) attempt to rationalize jihadi terrorism worldwide.

 

[Safriz]

Indeed..

So prove the claim the West is instigating terrorism against the Muslims to us skpetics.

Hint; Read the news.....
tell me if you ever read anything positive about Muslims/Muslim countries/Muslim culture/Islam.

Its impossible that 2 billion humans dont have anything positive.

That's rich...considering that people don't have 1st grade common sense of differentiating between war's between sovereign nations and terror acts of non-state actors and like to club them all together in a (vain) attempt to rationalize jihadi terrorism worldwide.

wearing Uniform does not legitimize all your acts...second hint.

 

[kalu_miah]

The problem is that it is much harder to control external factors than it is to control the domestic situation, so any rebirth has to come from internal strength. External agents will always take advantage of, and even seed, internal dissent and extremism but the resistance to such infection has to exist within the society itself. Scientific and economic progress can only be achieved if there is some level of domestic stability.

Given that the Muslim world is utterly divided and often at cross purposes, I don't see how external geopolitical factors can be stopped. There is practicaly zero coordination amongst Muslim countries and, to make matters worse, some of the instigators of extremism are other Muslim countries themselves. What countries like Pakistan, Bangladesh and others can do is to keep their distance from the ongoing feuds in the Middle East and focus on domestic strength. There is no way either country can take on any of the Western powers in any way, military or economic.

You have seen what I promoted in "the world order" thread. Most countries in the world today are like freely dating bachelors. Eventually they will have to make up their mind, decide and settle down and have a family, like EU countries have done. You cannot have your cake and eat it too.

I have already figured out that it will be easier for Bangladesh to join ASEAN than make SAARC a working union. Same goes for Pakistan and Afghanistan. Until a regional framework is worked out, the instability and interference will remain. The adversaries will work overtime to ensure that we remain unstable semi-failed states. How can US and Indian influence be minimized in the region? Do you think China will take Pakistan into a Union? I doubt it. The answer might be a reconstructed Soviet Union. If Russia later joins EU, then a Turkey led Central Asian Union would still be viable.

Without correct geopolitics, I do not think you can counter internal forces that are destabilizing, because these internal destabilizing forces, like the Army and the feudals are using the US for milking more aid money and China for strategic alliance to counter India, while Baloch insurgents are using India. You have to counter these negative interference with positive interference from potential long term partners, such as Iran, Turkey, Russia etc., to build, organize and unite your civil society, strengthen democratic institutions and reduce influence of Army in running of the country.

It is not an easy job, and it seems far fetched. But geopolitics has always been how the chess gam between nations were played. Either you play it or somebody will play you (use you) as a pawn, with not so good results for you.

 

[Bhairava]

Hint; Read the news.....
tell me if you ever read anything positive about Muslims/Muslim countries/Muslim culture/Islam.

Its impossible that 2 billion humans dont have anything positive.

Never said all Muslims are evil , with persons like Dr.Abdul Kalam or Abdul Sattar Edhi known to me....but just am I just skeptic about the claim West is instigating terrorism against Muslims. So I'm asking for definite proof, any terrorist incident etc.

After all isn't the burden of proof on the claimant ?

wearing Uniform does not legitimize all your acts...second hint.

Still it is war...between two sovereign nations. Not action of non-state actors with religious indoctrination.