Did India gave it up too easily??

[rkjindal91]

'China did not expect India to give up
so easily in 1962'

Jan 9, 2012, 03.30AM IST TNN [ Pratishtha Ingale ]

NAGPUR: China did not expect India to give in so easily in the 1962 war, so much so that the People's Liberation Army (PLA) overran Indian posts and reached deep into Tezpur in the plains of Assam, said Colonel (retd) Abhay Patwardhan.

He was delivering a lecture as part of a series organized at the Dharampeth College of Arts. Even fifty years after the war, scars of the debacle remain fresh and the ex- serviceman came up with some rare declassified documents related to the war.
Addressing a small audience of mainly senior citizens, Colonel Patwardhan showed a letter citing an admission by then Chinese Premier Chou En-lai to a veteran journalist. Chou En-lai had gone on record saying Chinese leaders were surprised at the feeble resistance of the Indian Army.
Patwardhan, now a defence analyst, also
showed a telegram shot off to US
President John F Kennedy by Indian Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru, in which the latter pleaded for more help from the superpower. As the PLA was over running post after post, Nehru sent the frantic cable depicting the situation and asked for jet fighters and transport planes to stem the Chinese tide. Nehru's telegram mentions India was grateful for the help it earlier received from the US.

He says that Bomdila, the headquarters of North Easter Frontier Agency (NEFA), was already surrounded by the Chinese and Indian forces amounting to two divisions (18 infantry battalions) were fighting a grim battle.
Nehru had expressed uncertainty about
how many of them would be able to find
their way back safely to the Corps
headquarters in Tezpur. Nehru added for emphasis that the Chinese forces were
heading toward Leh and there was
nothing to stop them after that. Patwardhan brought memories of the
war alive with his presentation to an
audience that might have only heard
radio broadcasts as teenagers as that
time. A 1971 war veteran himself,
Patwardhan was 15 years old at the time. He also showed a picture depicting an Indian jawan cooking in a makeshift kitchen, showing how the army was low on rations besides other equipment.

 

[perplexed]

Before IA could give it up, the lame as$ leaders of our country gave it up... Nehru never had the balls to take a firm stand. Be it Kashmir problem resolution or Tibet cessation to PLA. I cant understand why that fukcer is much revered in our books etc when we had better leaders than him.

 

[seethru]

Before IA could give it up, the lame as$ leaders of our country gave it up... Nehru never had the balls to take a firm stand. Be it Kashmir problem resolution or Tibet cessation to PLA. I cant understand why that fukcer is much revered in our books etc when we had better leaders than him.

The way i see it. Nehru did the right thing. That was a war based on igo. why waste human lives on nothing.

 

[perplexed]

The way i see it. Nehru did the right thing. That was a war based on igo. why waste human lives on nothing.

whose ego ?

 

[LetsGetRowdy]

wow get over it already. we treated your POW well, sent them home, let your army come pick up all the weapons your soldiers left behind. and we also didn't harm your civilians, even though the aggression was initiated by nehru's forward policy, yet china is now india's biggest enemy LOL.

1947 - 2012
1962 - 2012

there is a 15 years difference from the end of the centuries of british enslavement of india to the sino-indian war of 1962, but indians have largely forgiven the british for all the atrocities they have committed yet holding on so deeply for the defeat by china during the minor conflict.

it is indeed a phenomenon, but i think there is a logical conclusion. india have become fearful of the british (white people), yet deep down they hate them for what they did to their country, but know there is nothing they can do about it, which infuriates them even more. just 15 years after the british released india, china beats them in a border war, thus humiliating them on the world stage. since then, india taken out their centuries of hatred against the british and placed them onto china.

indian hatred against china is now fueled by the very people who enslaved them; through western media propaganda which runs fabricated anti-china stories 24/7.

 

[janon]

^^
Dude, you really shouldn't be dabbling in this amateur psychology. There is something wrong with it - that most of it is not true. I agree that it has been 50 years and India should get over it, but this trying to read into the psyche of a nation is just plain nonsense. There is no such thing as mass psychology, where you can just sit and write about the workings of the minds of a billion people.

All this sounds interesting on paper - indians have a deep seated fear of the white people, they then transferred it onto the chinese - all this makes for an interesting narrative, but if you want to pretend that it is anything beyond fiction, please provide your deep analysis which led you to these conclusions. I mean, psychology is a science after all, you can't just make up theories, you have to have observations, justifications, reasoning etc. Oh and I forgot, evidence.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

there is a 15 years difference from the end of the centuries of british enslavement of india to the sino-indian war of 1962, but indians have largely forgiven the british for all the atrocities they have committed yet holding on so deeply for the defeat by china during the minor conflict.

The difference, is that we Chinese are non-white.

 

[janon]

The difference, is that we Chinese are non-white.

No. The difference is that there are unresolved disputes even today with China, which we don't have with the British or portugese or dutch. Once those are resolved, India wouldn't be so obsessed with 1962.

Being an Indian I can assure you that for us this is not a question of white versus non white. If you keep insisting that it is, I really don't know what to say. Take it as my opinion for what its worth.

Do you really have a reason to believe that its a white versus non white thing? I mean, here you are, telling us whats going through our minds - don't you think you should maybe listen to what we have to say on that matter? And that when we say its not a race issue for us, that should be what matters, rather than your psycho-analysis of whats on our minds?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

No. The difference is that there are unresolved disputes even today with China, which we don't have with the British. Once those are resolved, India wouldn't be so obsessed with 1962.

Being an Indian I can assure you that for us this is not a question of white versus non white. If you keep insisting that it is, I really don't know what to say. Take it as my opinion for what its worth.

Do you really have a reason to believe that its a white versus non white thing? I mean, here you are, telling us whats going through our minds.

Everyone has heard of the caste system, with the Brahmins on top. Aryan invasion, etc.

And apparently, the worst insult in India is to call someone "black". Skin colour in India is linked with social status, and is the first thing that people write down when they describe themselves to potential partners.

Look what the British did to you, and compare that to China's counterattack against India's Forward Policy.

Yet now you hate Chinese and Pakistanis the most. Even though we are developing countries like you, and we share the same history of being exploited by the colonial powers.

 

[seethru]

wow get over it already. we treated your POW well, sent them home, let your army come pick up all the weapons your soldiers left behind. and we also didn't harm your civilians, even though the aggression was initiated by nehru's forward policy, yet china is now india's biggest enemy LOL.

1947 - 2012
1962 - 2012

there is a 15 years difference from the end of the centuries of british enslavement of india to the sino-indian war of 1962, but indians have largely forgiven the british for all the atrocities they have committed yet holding on so deeply for the defeat by china during the minor conflict.

it is indeed a phenomenon, but i think there is a logical conclusion. india have become fearful of the british (white people), yet deep down they hate them for what they did to their country, but know there is nothing they can do about it, which infuriates them even more. just 15 years after the british released india, china beats them in a border war, thus humiliating them on the world stage. since then, india taken out their centuries of hatred against the british and placed them onto china.

indian hatred against china is now fueled by the very people who enslaved them; through western media propaganda which runs fabricated anti-china stories 24/7.

Your fundamental assumption is that Indians are hard core nationalists and Indian nationalism is similar to Chinese nationalism.
Rest is your own racial inferiority complex. I would go further and say that you are suffering from inferiority complex and over compensating it.

"Hey, china defeated India in 1962 and they are burning with revenge"
"Look we have everything like the west, sky scrappers, trains, why aren't everyone still respecting us. They must be west's slaves and suffering from Inferiority complex"

one other Chinese guy called Chinesedragon let it out

"The difference, is that we are non-white."

This clearly shows your cry for help as a nation. You are seeking the power the west wields on the world and even after doing exactly what they did(Industrialization, infrastructure building, wealth creation) you aren't getting enough attention or respect from the rest of world except Pakistan(North Korea may be). That's the reason you guys are crying foul at that other people, incidentally Indians here that they feel inferior about themselves and consider white people superior.

It's obvious from most of the Chinese trolls talking about west and India.

 

[janon]

Everyone has heard of the caste system, with the Brahmins on top. Aryan invasion, etc.

And apparently, the worst insult in India is to call someone "black".

Look what the British did to you, and compare that to China's counterattack against India's Forward Policy.

Yet now you hate Chinese and Pakistanis the most. Even though we are fellow developing countries, and we share with you the same history of being exploited by the colonial powers.

1) I did not understand the relevance of bringing in the caste system.

2) No, "black" is not the biggest insult, the biggest insults would be masked if I type it here. But yes, for many people fairer skin is considered desirable. But all that has nothing to do with hostilities or friendship with other nations, thats an issue of pervceived beauty, NOT a worship of europeans. That affects the marriage market, NOT foreign policy. And by the way blue eyes or "european" kind of whiteness is not what is considered desirable either. Where I come from, referring to somebody's blue eyes (as some here have) is an insult.

3) No, most of us don't hate the chinese. There is a deep distrust of Chinese military, which may be unjustified. If you think there is hatred of China like there is of pakistan, you are just plain mistaken. And I told you why we have this distrust of the Chinese military today but not the British or other European ones. I will repeat - because there are unresolved border issues. Not because you are not white.

What I am writing will sound just plain obvious to any Indian member reading this. I really cannot understand why you want to make it a white versus non white thing, when it is not.

At the risk of sounding insulting (I do not mean to), I must point out that this accusation speaks more about you than about us. It has never been a race issue for Indians, and you will notice that it is ONLY chinese members who have played that card anywhere. Ask yourself if you have heard any Indian make a race issue out of this.

White versus non white racism or prejudice simply does not exist in India. A lot of other prejudices do exist, including caste based ones - but not white v/s non white. Thats just the plain truth of the matter. If that prejudice did exist, I wouldn't be shy of admitting it. I am being objective here.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

3) No, most of us don't hate the chinese. There is a deep distrust of Chinese military, which may be unjustified. If you think there is hatred of China like there is of pakistan, you are just plain mistaken. And I told you why we have this distrust of the Chinese military today but not the British or other European ones. I will repeat - because there are unresolved border issues. Not because you are not white.

Most developing countries, especially those who had a history of being exploited by colonialism, will want to stick together.

Indians on the other hand, they are always looking for the affection of the former colonial powers (the West).

Like in school, when one guy wants to leave his group, in order to join the "cooler kids".

So even though the British did so much to you, Indians will always hate their neighbours first (Chinese and Pakistanis), and forgive the West without a second thought.

 

[janon]

^^
Read my previous post. I cannot keep repeating "we don't hate you", "we don't hate you".

As for pakistan, yes there is a lot of hatred towards it here. Just as there is a lot of hatred for India in pakistan. And you may know that there are several reasons for that, you can't compare that with our relations with any other country. China is only talked about or discussed by people who have an interest in the military or economies. Most other people know close to zilch about China, to hate or love. In short, most Indians hate Chinese just as much as about the average Chinese person thinks about hating or loving India.

If you want to keep believing that Indians hate you...well, what can I say?

And look at the kind of things you are saying - "Indians will always hate their neighbours", "Indians are looking for affection from former powers"...as I said before, why don't you actually ask the Indians if any of it is true, instead of going on asserting it?

 

[seethru]

Everyone has heard of the caste system, with the Brahmins on top. Aryan invasion, etc.

And apparently, the worst insult in India is to call someone "black". Skin colour in India is linked with social status, and is the first thing that people write down when they describe themselves to potential partners.

Look what the British did to you, and compare that to China's counterattack against India's Forward Policy.

Yet now you hate Chinese and Pakistanis the most. Even though we are developing countries like you, and we share with you the same history of being exploited by the colonial powers.

Oh god, "The Aryan Invasion theory and racism in caste" has been refuted over and over again. Those are colonel constructions to justify their own world view of scientific racism. Either Chinese are purposefully trolling or simply plain stupid for bringing this up.

Brahmans come in all colors so do the dalits.

I am going to let a secret out about Indians hating Pakistan.

For Indians the Pakistanis are laughing material,. Why do you think you find so many Indians on PDF talking non sense? because we find them entertaining when we play this cyber wars when they hate on Indians.

So china fan boys, please get informed and stop writing the same non sense again and again.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

^^
Read my previous post. I cannot keep repeating "we don't hate you", "we don't hate you".

I don't believe you for one second.

It was your own DEFENCE MINISTER who said that China was your #1 enemy.

Look at any Indian news channel or newspaper, they are all scaremongering about either China or Pakistan.

Look, even this missile is described as the "China killer":

Indian ICBM Agni 5 China Killer - YouTube