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Collapse of Turkey’s Middle East policy

During the Sassanid Byzantium wars, Turkic tribes help the Persians lay seige to the walls of constantinople (626)..

You are referring to the Avar siege, but you forget about the wars between Gokturk Khaganate and Sassanids, where Gokturks and Byzantines participated as allies.

The first two wars were fought in Central Asia between Gokturks and Sassanids, the third (and last) however was fought in present-day Azerbaijan with Gokturk Khaganate and Byzantines participating as allies against Sassanids. Gokturks entered the area through Derbent passage.
 
Iran and Turkey are traditionally the two major powerhouses in the Middle East and are culturally more related to each other than they are to other Arab countries.

Turkey is not in the Middle East.....however Turks has a "get out of jail free card" from Sunni Muslim countries. even though they got screwed during the Ottoman rules.

They are neighbors and have a interest to secure the border between both of the countries; to restrain Kurdish separatism for example.

The borders are secure right now...lets hope Iran does not give more land away to Turkey. As far as the Kurds this is the way I see it.

PKK fights Turkey for more rights (they have giving up hopes of getting land from Turkey)
PJAK was created by foreign forces to disturb Iran.

So no, Iran is for Turkey far more important than all the Arab countries. As it is the other way around.

If Iran didn't hold that 30 percent of Turkish energy supply leash then Turkey would be even more aggressive against Iran.

At political level the relations currently are not bad like you said trade is increasing but Iran knows who they are dealing with.
 
At political level the relations currently are not bad like you said trade is increasing but Iran knows who they are dealing with.

Who they are dealing with?

Let me answer it for you, They are dealing with a country which Iran's so-called agents crawling in, gathering information about military buildings, helping PKK, in the end getting themselfs cought. And Iran knows this country has its limits on patience.
 
Erdo is no fool.....this was all set up from beginning with good relations with Syria and Iran. Turkey has achieved exactly what she was send to achieve. Mission accomplished and Turkey will be rewarded handsomely. Everything is as planned boys and girls.

Edit: everything is as planned but one thing that was underestimated by these powers was the level of support Syria would get from Russia and Iran, I don't think it was expected to be this much.

I have no proof for what I say....just observation.

Rewarded with what? Another full elections support by USA to keep AKP on power?
 
Anyway, about the former discuission, I just checked the Iraqi cuisine, and it seems like its much more closer to Ottoman cuisine(mixed elements of Turkish, Levantine etc. cuisines) then the Iranian one, although there are Iranian elements too in the Ottoman cuisine.
 
When somthing get dirty en difficult you will see always see people running away:woot:. Dont forget this when assad falls you must shame to your selfs. You doubt about what if they lose?


amk bunlar iste boyle.....:rofl:


araplara hic bir zaman guven olmas. Her zaman devlet olarak kendi cikarlarini koruyacaksin. Insallah Suriye tampon devletimiz olacak. Ayni bizanslilar kurduklari gibi bizler siilerin karsisinda tampon ve pkk ya karsida kullanacagiz.

Küçük beyinler, insanları;
Orta beyinler, olayları;
Büyük beyinler, FİKİRLERİ tartışırlar.


eyvallah hurmetler....
 
Rewarded with what? Another full elections support by USA to keep AKP on power?

How about EU membership and a better new energy routes if Iran ever falls and Russia weakens......Turkey lost the WWI but came out as a winner.
 
I don't see how Turkish Middle East policy is collapsing. When the FSA become victorious, then Turkey wins big time and Iran loses big time. I don't see Turkey championing Pan Islamism, but I see Iran doing that. As for these sectarian wars going on in the region, it is 100% the fault of Iran. where ever there is sectarian tension you could find Iranian hands. Syria, Iraq, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Yemen and Lebanon. fortunately, after Syria Iran's hands will be cut and they will have nothing to do except to enjoy the sanctions.
 
I don't see how Turkish Middle East policy is collapsing. When the FSA become victorious, then Turkey wins big time and Iran loses big time. I don't see Turkey championing Pan Islamism, but I see Iran doing that. As for these sectarian wars going on in the region, it is 100% the fault of Iran. where ever there is sectarian tension you could find Iranian hands. Syria, Iraq, Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Yemen and Lebanon. fortunately, after Syria Iran's hands will be cut and they will have nothing to do except to enjoy the sanctions.
Says the guy from Saudi Arabia..
 
Sorry to say this brother but you are non trustable. Before Syria you gave me many points and good comments but after my opinions about Syria you changed your acts towards me. This because i have different opinions about the situations? First you supported Erdogans policy about Syria but now suddenly you have no respect to Turks anymore? Weird.

The most thing I loathe in a person is hypocrisy. If you noticed I have no problems with Iranians nor pro regime Syrians, because they have different beliefs, different agenda and most importantly they are here to defend their own people and country. But when a person who whines day and night about Islam and then attacks his aggrieved "brothers" in their worst times and even question their loyalty. I prefer to avoid such people.

Don't read my post out of context, I am not a hypocrite, and I didn't say that I had no respect for Turks. People here know that I hold Turkey and Erdogan with regards. However, I did attack them one time because I couldn't stand some racist Turks mud-slinging of Arabs that long, I had to stop them, it was really awkward for me to show respect while I get hatred in return. Although I hold Turkey and Turks with high respect, but I would never accept interference at our expense in our issues. Regarding Syria and Palestine, Turkey entered through the door not through the window like Iran, it's role is constructive and much appreciated.
 
but I would never accept interference at our expense in our issues. Regarding Syria and Palestine, Turkey entered through the door not through the window like Iran, it's role is constructive and much appreciated.


What are you people doing for Syria and Palestine? Only talking and talking like present....
 
Ankara needs to rethink its relations with all its neighbours — Syria first among them
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The Arab Spring will undoubtedly go down in history as an important moment in the liberation of the Arab people from tyranny. But, like most major political upheavals, it has had a number of unfortunate and largely unforeseen consequences.
The economies of Egypt, Tunisia and Yemen have suffered serious damage; Syria’s ongoing civil war has resulted in heavy — and mounting — civilian casualties and material destruction; in the Sahel, violence and chaos have followed the overthrow of Libya’s Muammar Al Gaddafi, especially in Mali where Tawareq rebels backed by Islamist groups have seized a great chunk of the country; sectarian tensions have sharpened across the region causing all minorities to feel less secure; the Palestine cause has been consigned to the margins of international attention, while Israel, fully backed by the US, proceeds undisturbed with its land grab.
Turkey is yet another victim of the unforeseen consequence of the Arab Spring: its ambitious Middle East policy has collapsed. Two years ago, Turkey could claim to be the most successful country in the region. Its economy was booming. Its charismatic Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, in power since 2002, enjoyed popularity at home and respect abroad.
The Turkish combination of democracy and Islam was hailed as a model for the region. Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu, an academic turned statesman, was credited with devising a peaceful regional order, based on the principle of ‘zero problems with neighbours’.
A key pivot of Davutoglu’s new regional order was a Turkish-Syrian partnership, both commercial and political, which soon expanded into a free-trade zone embracing Turkey, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan. Visas with these countries were abolished. Meanwhile, Turkish construction companies were active in Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states, as well as in Gaddafi’s Libya (where contracts were estimated at some $18 billion for roads, bridges, pipelines, ports, airports and much else besides.)
Buoyed by these successes, Turkey set about seeking to solve some of the region’s most obdurate conflicts. It tried hard to bring Syria and Israel to the negotiating table. Together with Brazil, it made what seemed a promising advance towards solving the problem of Iran’s nuclear programme. In Afghanistan, Turkish troops were the only foreign forces welcome, which seemed to presage a role for Ankara in negotiating a settlement with the Taliban.
In addition, Erdogan had hopes of reaching an entente with Turkey’s old rival, Greece, and of making peace at last with Armenia (a country still smarting from the harsh treatment of Armenians by the Ottoman Turks.) Above all, Erdogan seemed ready to make major political concessions to the Kurds of eastern Anatolia in a bid to end, once and for all, the long and violent struggle with the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK), which has claimed tens of thousands of lives.
Then the whole thing fell apart.
The deal which Turkey and Brazil negotiated with Iran over its nuclear facilities was rejected by Washington. Turkey’s overtures to Armenia got nowhere: the border remains closed. Turkey quarrelled violently with Israel when Israeli commandos boarded a Turkish ship, the Mavi Marmara, in international waters, and killed nine activists, most of them Turks, who were trying to break Israel’s cruel siege of Gaza. Israel has refused to apologise for its brutal behaviour.
Turkey’s hopes of better relations with Greece were dashed by Greece’s economic collapse. Moreover, having quarrelled with Turkey, Israel hurried to embrace Greece, as well as the Greek-speaking Republic of Cyprus, joining with it in the exploitation of gas finds in the eastern Mediterranean, to the anger of Turkish-speaking northern Cyprus and of Turkey itself.
On the commercial front, Gaddafi’s overthrow put an end to several big Turkish contracts in Libya, while Turkey’s expanding business with Saudi Arabia and the Arab Gulf states was dealt a harsh blow by the disruption of road traffic across Syria due to the uprising there.
Turkey’s once friendly relations with Iran suffered because they now found themselves on opposite sides of the Syrian conflict, while Turkish relations with Iraq suffered because of Turkey’s close ties with the autonomous Kurdish Regional Government in northern Iraq (including providing the KRG with facilities to export oil direct to Turkey, to the fury of Baghdad.)
Instead of ‘no problems with neighbours’, Turkey is now beset with grave problems on almost every front. Inevitably, Davutoglu’s star has waned. No longer the master strategist, he is seen as an amateur politician struggling to survive.
The real turning point was Turkey’s impetuous decision to back the Syrian rebels against President Bashar Al Assad’s regime. At a stroke, Turkey’s partnership with Syria collapsed, bringing down the whole of Turkey’s Arab policy. Instead of attempting to resolve the Syrian conflict by mediation — which it was well placed to do — Turkey took sides.
It provided house room in Istanbul for the civilian Syrian opposition and camps for the Free Syrian Army and other fighting groups. Under Turkish protection, the Syrian rebels now control a narrow strip of territory of some 70km along the Syrian-Turkish border.
Turkey and Syria are virtually at war. In retaliation to Turkey’s role in channelling funds, weapons and intelligence to the rebels, Syria seems to be encouraging the PKK — and its Syrian affiliate, the PYD — to turn up the heat on Turkey. The PYD has occupied five largely Kurdish towns in northern Syria, from which Syrian government forces were deliberately withdrawn. If Syria’s Kurds gain anything like the autonomy already enjoyed by Iraq’s Kurds, then Turkey’s own Kurds are bound to press their claims for political rights and freedoms.
In eastern Turkey, the PKK’s 28-year insurgency seems to be springing back to life with deadly ambushes against military targets, such as last Sunday’s attack which killed a dozen Turkish soldiers. The struggle to put a lid on Kurdish militancy could once again become Turkey’s most painful and disruptive domestic problem.
A real headache for Turkey is the massive influx of Syrian refugees. To stem the flood, Turkey has closed its frontier with Syria for the time being. Syrian refugees in Turkey are said to number over 80,000, lodged in nine tented camps. Five more camps are under construction, which could house another 30,000 refugees. Turkey says it cannot realistically take in more than about 100,000, without help from other countries and international organisations. Hosting the refugees has already cost Turkey an estimated 135 million euros (Dh624.1 million) — and no doubt will cost a great deal more.
Should Turkey revise its Syria policy? Instead of joining in Washington’s (and Israel’s) war against Tehran and Damascus, Ankara might be well advised to revert back, step by step, to a more neutral stance. Lakhdar Brahimi, the new UN peace envoy, needs Turkey’s help in his difficult task of mediating a peaceful resolution of the Syrian conflict. That would be the way to restore Turkey’s Middle East policy to its former glory. Turkey needs urgently to rethink its relations with all its neighbours — Syria first among them.

Patrick Seale is a commentator and author of several books on Middle East affairs.

Collapse of Turkey


"Collapse" is a very strong word and should be used wisely. Although there are some complications in Davutoglu's foreign policy, which I don't support, I wouldn't use the word "collapse"

And one should investigate the writer of the article to understand his aims. Here is what Cengiz Çandar wrote about him in Radikal (Radikal / 'Ortado) :

"Patrick Seale'i yıllar öncesinden gayet iyi tanırım. Hafız Esad'ın, Esad ailesi tarafından onaylanan biyografisinin yazarıdır. Ayrıca, Suriyede'ki rejimle sıkı fıkı ilişkiler geliştirmiş bir İngiliz Yahudisi olarak, Suriye ile İsrail arasından kapalı kapılar ardındanki temaslarda da rol almıştır. Kalemini eline aldığı vakit, öncelikli vurgusu, Esad ailesinin ve Suriye'deki rejimin çıkarlarını gözetmektir. Son yazıdında yaptığı da bu."

And here is my translation:

"I have known Patrick Seale very well for some years. He is the writer of Hafez Al Assad's biography, which was approved by Assad family. Moreover, he, who has very close relations with Syrian regime as an English Jew, has taken roles to provide contact between Syria and Israel behind the closed doors. When he takes his pen into his hands, his primary goal is to look out for Syrian regime and Assad family. That's what he has been doing in his last article."
 
What are you people doing for Syria and Palestine? Only talking and talking like present....

Without Arab financial, arms, diplomatic and media support, Syrian revolution would have been repressed by now like Hamah uprising in 1982.
 
Utter BS. Turkey is not calling the shots with these terrorists, it is simply providing a transit point and housing their "leadership."
Utter BS, who you think have planned that attack killing defence minister?
 
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