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Big Win- Indian Muslim Women(Supreme Court Declares triple talaq Practice 'Unconstitutional)

The reservation system is phoney and you are pointing out its silliness. Wish we could do something to remove it.
Parsis have prospered since the days of Raj, it shouldn't hurt your community as much as it hurts the poor from general categories, share the load of the collective crap that comes our way as indians
 
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The reservation system is phoney and you are pointing out its silliness. Wish we could do something to remove it.
Parsis have prospered since the days of Raj, it shouldn't hurt your community as much as it hurts the poor from general categories, share the load of the collective crap that comes our way as indians

Why should it not hurt us?

All Parsi students are Einsteins?

Don't need help getting a seat in a top college? Where money is not the issue but number of seats are.

I don't understand this attitude of asking us to share because we are well off.

We are tiny. Very small number of kids. One kid does not get a good college, that's one family bloodline down the drain.

Is that fair?

What have Parsis done in a system that predates them even coming here?

Cheers, Doc
 
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Fair enough.

Give them reservations from Hindu quota.

100% reservation for all I care.

Leave 21% seats untouched. And closed to Hindus.

Cheers, Doc
So you want a Hindu and a non-hindu quota? The caste system is more complicated than that.
Assuming the hypothesis that caste-based representation helps uplift the poor in general, such a broad break-up would not do any service to the low-caste muslims, sikhs and christians of India.
 
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So you want a Hindu and a non-hindu quota? The caste system is more complicated than that.
Assuming the hypothesis that caste-based representation helps uplift the poor in general, such a broad break-up would not do any service to the low-caste muslims, sikhs and christians of India.

Yeah. Its an idea.

Everyone get as many reservations as they are a percentage of the total population of.

Have half the seats reserved. Half open competition.

NO CROSS POLLINATION.

Which means, you pick which category you want to compete for BEFORE sitting for the exam.

Cheers, Doc
 
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Why should it not hurt us?

All Parsi students are Einsteins?

Don't need help getting a seat in a top college? Where money is not the issue but number of seats are.

I don't understand this attitude of asking us to share because we are well off.

We are tiny. Very small number of kids. One kid does not get a good college, that's one family bloodline down the drain.

Is that fair?

What have Parsis done in a system that predates them even coming here?

Cheers, Doc
The quota system is stupid, hurts atheists, hindus, muslims, parsis all in the same way. Let's do something to remove it.
I still don't buy your gripe. Parsis are one of the most affluent, heavily networked, entrepreneurial communities in India, it should technically not hit you as much as it hits a 'sharma' from Delhi whose family lives on sarkari clerical wages.

http://www.thehindu.com/todays-pape...ning-90000-a-month-is-poor/article3521448.ece
 
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Don't know about the difference. It could be since we are a Muslim country every case is scrutinized and interpretation on Islamic shariah is discussed with both lawyers making arguments. Quite frankly I haven't studied Indian law so two things have surprised me quite a bit.

A. That you guys have single strike triple talaq. I wonder about your inheritance laws as well. Tell me are Muslim grandchildren allowed inheritance of the grandfather. Bcz in shariah interpretation grandchildren don't have right in grandfathers property. Let me explain.

Let's say the grandfather is alive. He has two sons. One of his sons has a son ( being grand children). The father of that grandchildren dies before the grandfather. Now would the grandchildren inherit from the grandfather in the above scenario. @Joe Shearer maybe ask your lawyer friends.

B. Why doesn't India have a distinct single law for all Indians. India based itself on the fact that the uniformity of India is above creed and religion. Shouldn't the law of the land speak of the same thing. Doesn't having two distinct laws contradict it? Pakistan was based on Islamic principles so we need distinct minority laws and even Islamic sect laws for example shia and sunni laws are different. Marriage laws of christians are different.

Hmmm

Let me tell you another case law.

Facts.

A couple ran away and did marriage without the consent of their household and parents. The parents filed and FIR of kidnapping and caught the boy. The girl came into court and said that she married him of free will. The family filed a case in family courts stating that since the consent of the parents was not received thus the marriage is void and unislamic.

Now this is a very important case law. Case went ahead and Islamic scholars were called. The party argued that its unislamic since consent of parents is required. The courts asked for the presence of boy and girl. Boy was still in police custody and he was tortured and vowed his torture marks. The court passed this judgement.

Consent of parents are not required in Islam. Even the surahs read are a mere formality and not a requirement. Marriage is a contract and not a sacrament and if two consenting adult sign on a nikah nama in the presence of two witnesses then they are married. Parents, tribals, surahs are mete customs and have nothing to do with Islamic law thus marriage shall be treated in lines with a contract. Infact if you actually look at the nikah nama its basically a contract page.

This case law is still used in courts when lawyers argue.

Well there are other case laws as well. Like the christian marriage law one. This one was awesome. The grandchildren inheritance was also amazing one. In pakistan grandchildren can inherit. :p

Its all very vague and confusing to me.

We have Indian Muslims here. Maybe they can help.

@The_Showstopper

@SOUTHie

Cheers, Doc

P.S. Don't even know what "Parsi Law" is. All kids are equal.

And try your best to not piss off the wife ....

The quota system is stupid, hurts atheists, hindus, muslims, parsis all in the same way. Let's do something to remove it.
I still don't buy your gripe. Parsis are one of the most affluent, heavily networked, entrepreneurial communities in India, it should technically not hit you as much as it hits a 'sharma' from Delhi whose family lives on sarkari clerical wages.

http://www.thehindu.com/todays-pape...ning-90000-a-month-is-poor/article3521448.ece

Most Parsis today are professionals.

You are talking of the past. British days.

What we have today, we study and earn. 99% of us.

Cheers, Doc
 
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Yeah. Its an idea.

Everyone get as many reservations as they are a percentage of the total population of.

Have half the seats reserved. Half open competition.

NO CROSS POLLINATION.

Which means, you pick which category you want to compete for BEFORE sitting for the exam.

Cheers, Doc
Not a bad idea actually. Assuming that most people from small communities will chose the 50% free competition option in spite of a quota based on population size.
Its a less stupider option considering what we have currently.
 
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Don't know about the difference. It could be since we are a Muslim country every case is scrutinized and interpretation on Islamic shariah is discussed with both lawyers making arguments. Quite frankly I haven't studied Indian law so two things have surprised me quite a bit.

A. That you guys have single strike triple talaq. I wonder about your inheritance laws as well. Tell me are Muslim grandchildren allowed inheritance of the grandfather. Bcz in shariah interpretation grandchildren don't have right in grandfathers property. Let me explain.

Let's say the grandfather is alive. He has two sons. One of his sons has a son ( being grand children). The father of that grandchildren dies before the grandfather. Now would the grandchildren inherit from the grandfather in the above scenario. @Joe Shearer maybe ask your lawyer friends.

B. Why doesn't India have a distinct single law for all Indians. India based itself on the fact that the uniformity of India is above creed and religion. Shouldn't the law of the land speak of the same thing. Doesn't having two distinct laws contradict it? Pakistan was based on Islamic principles so we need distinct minority laws and even Islamic sect laws for example shia and sunni laws are different. Marriage laws of christians are different.

Hmmm

Let me tell you another case law.

Facts.

A couple ran away and did marriage without the consent of their household and parents. The parents filed and FIR of kidnapping and caught the boy. The girl came into court and said that she married him of free will. The family filed a case in family courts stating that since the consent of the parents was not received thus the marriage is void and unislamic.

Now this is a very important case law. Case went ahead and Islamic scholars were called. The party argued that its unislamic since consent of parents is required. The courts asked for the presence of boy and girl. Boy was still in police custody and he was tortured and vowed his torture marks. The court passed this judgement.

Consent of parents are not required in Islam. Even the surahs read are a mere formality and not a requirement. Marriage is a contract and not a sacrament and if two consenting adult sign on a nikah nama in the presence of two witnesses then they are married. Parents, tribals, surahs are mete customs and have nothing to do with Islamic law thus marriage shall be treated in lines with a contract. Infact if you actually look at the nikah nama its basically a contract page.

This case law is still used in courts when lawyers argue.

Well there are other case laws as well. Like the christian marriage law one. This one was awesome. The grandchildren inheritance was also amazing one. In pakistan grandchildren can inherit. :p

«لَا نِكَاحَ إِلَّا بِوَلِيٍّ؛؛(ولی کے بغیر نکاح نہیں)ابوداود2085 دوسری حدیث میں ہےعَنْ عَائِشَةَ، قَالَتْ: قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ: «أَيُّمَا امْرَأَةٍ نَكَحَتْ بِغَيْرِ إِذْنِ مَوَالِيهَا، فَنِكَاحُهَا بَاطِلٌ» ، ثَلَاثَ مَرَّاتٍ(جس عورت نے اپنے ولی کی اجازت کے بغیر نکاح کیا اس کا نکاح باطل ہے)ابوداود2083

The first hadees says that no nikah without wali (guardian) the second says that the woman who married without the permission of wali (guardian) her nikah is invalid.
on the surahs part you are right also there were no written nikah namas before so contract wali baat bhi mashkook hai mazeed tehqeeq chahiye .That is why two witnesses were required .
 
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«لَا نِكَاحَ إِلَّا بِوَلِيٍّ؛؛(ولی کے بغیر نکاح نہیں)ابوداود2085 دوسری حدیث میں ہےعَنْ عَائِشَةَ، قَالَتْ: قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ: «أَيُّمَا امْرَأَةٍ نَكَحَتْ بِغَيْرِ إِذْنِ مَوَالِيهَا، فَنِكَاحُهَا بَاطِلٌ» ، ثَلَاثَ مَرَّاتٍ(جس عورت نے اپنے ولی کی اجازت کے بغیر نکاح کیا اس کا نکاح باطل ہے)ابوداود2083

The first hadees says that no nikah without wali (guardian) the second says that the woman who married without the permission of wali (guardian) her nikah is invalid.
on the surahs part you are right also there were no written nikah namas before so contract wali baat bhi mashkook hai mazeed tehqeeq chahiye .That is why two witnesses were required .

This is pakistan law. You can contract marriage marriage with another with two witnesses irrespective of parent consent and its very common in kocheri. Run away couples contract marriage. Infact parents who want to punish them don't file for void marriage but file 498C Fir which is the inticing, seducing e.t.c of a girl for illicit purposes. Of course a statement crpc 164 happens and she reveals that I had my consent but till them its a hassle for the boy in police custody.


As for contract. Yes its treated as a contract to be fulfilled. Anything agreed on the nikah nama is to be fulfilled for example in one of the clauses if a husband writes that he will give his prompt dower of house, car and his lands then he will have to give it to her and even if he writes that after divorce he will maintain his ex wife for this period then it will be done so. There are various case laws. Many infact.

Remember one thing. Pakistan law and Islamic law are two different things. Interpretation and needs of modern world and society are taken into concept in Pakistan law and the evolution and interpretation of Islamic law. For example. Inheritance laws.
 
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A. That you guys have single strike triple talaq. I wonder about your inheritance laws as well. Tell me are Muslim grandchildren allowed inheritance of the grandfather. Bcz in shariah interpretation grandchildren don't have right in grandfathers property. Let me explain.

Let's say the grandfather is alive. He has two sons. One of his sons has a son ( being grand children). The father of that grandchildren dies before the grandfather. Now would the grandchildren inherit from the grandfather in the above scenario. @Joe Shearer maybe ask your lawyer friends.
I'm no lawyer. Anyway, from what I understand there is Muslim personal Law regarding this. In cases of Non testamentary succession, the Muslim Personal Law it is Shariat is applied. Which you mentioned.

If the person dies after writing his will then the process will be governed by the Sunni and Shia board for their respective people.

If a Muslim dies without writing a will, his whole property can be inherited by his heirs be it his son, daughter or grandson/daughter.
B. Why doesn't India have a distinct single law for all Indians. India based itself on the fact that the uniformity of India is above creed and religion. Shouldn't the law of the land speak of the same thing. Doesn't having two distinct laws contradict it? Pakistan was based on Islamic principles so we need distinct minority laws and even Islamic sect laws for example shia and sunni laws are different. Marriage laws of christians are different.
These are the two dilemmas we face. One providing equality to all the citizens irrespective of cast creed or religion. Other is the right to practice one's religion.

For Pakistan it is relatively easy as there is no sizable minority compared to India. Whereas in India, there is a sizable Christian, Sikh and Muslim population as minority hence application of common law sometimes becomes difficult on marriage, divorce and property related matters.

Hence there are separate laws regarding such. Only civil laws. Seperate marriage acts have been passed for Hindu, Christian and Muslim.

The BJP is pushing for a Uniform civil law though. Although the impact of it is still unknown to me. It will be a complicated law in this regard.
 
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Its all very vague and confusing to me.

We have Indian Muslims here. Maybe they can help.

@The_Showstopper

@SOUTHie

Cheers, Doc

P.S. Don't even know what "Parsi Law" is. All kids are equal.

And try your best to not piss off the wife ....



Most Parsis today are professionals.

You are talking of the past. British days.

What we have today, we study and earn. 99% of us.

Cheers, Doc

Always intrigued by Parsi community in Karachi Pakistan, educated and cultured and rich too, the diminishing population is a problem here too.

Karachi Pakistan has the likes of Cowasjees into shipping and trading, Avari's into hotels and tourism. Byram Avari in Pakistan owns more than 3 five star hotels and many 4 star properties.

Karachi also has Ghadiallis, and Agha's in the Parsi fraternity.

Check this interesting video of a Parsi visiting his/her family in Karachi. You might get some acquaintance...some old missing relative...

 
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