A dream that the world conspired against: Manufacturing a warplane in Egypt and the position of the JF-17 Block 3

[Gomig-21]

Well..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyotr_Ufimtsev

Yep, this fella is well known amongst aviation enthusiasts.

 

[MastanKhan]

Because the first acquisition of the F-16 to Egypt was way back in the 1980's. It had nothing to do with current inventory or military acquisitions and when it started, it was under the Peace Vector program of military aid to try and stay in the game as much as possible. So it was either get the F-16s and keep trying to acquire the appropriate ammunitions for them as the orders kept happening but they kept being refused, or not have any 4th gen fighters. Finally Sisi's presidency is doing something about it 30 years later, going for Rafales and MiG-35s and Su-35s all with BVR capabilities including hopefully the Meteor.

So back then, if you were in our position, would you refuse the F-16 just because of BVR missiles? When they did eventually offer the modernized AIM-7P Sparrow semi active BVR missile so it's not completely without some form of that capability. But BVR is not the end all be all like many here seem to think. Having the 4th largest fleet of F-16s after the US, Israel, and Turkey (not by much BTW to the last member) with all other ordinances is much better than nothing, don't you think?



Once Sisi became president, he's shown that the crying and lobbying by Israel to the US to not provide Egypt with the AIM-120 is finished and he's moving on. He requested the F-35 knowing quite well that the US would refuse it so it gave him more ammunition to go after other choices such as the Rafale & Su-35SE.

Here's the funny thing that destroys the silly notion of the magic button or computer hack that disables jets. If that was the case, why are they so freaked out about providing the missiles then?

Hopefully Russia will provide as much as it can under ITAR including the R-27ER, the RVV-AE (which I believe has already been supplied with the MiG-35s) and possibly the R-37M.

The problem is that the US asked Egypt to cancel the deal and that they would substitute it with F-15s but Egypt declined, citing the Su-35SE is a much better platform than the F-15 or at least the one the US would offer Egypt which certainly wouldn't have been the EX model with the AIM-120C-7 and AIM-9X. That would've been the only way Egypt would've agreed to switch but there is also a possibility that it might not have, simply because it wants to move away from the grip of the US. Something that needed to be done a long time ago.

Hi,

Actually that was an Excellent decision made by Egypt going for the F16's regardless of the BVR or not.

The transition to BVR would a piece of cake.

 

[The SC]

Yep, this fella is well known amongst aviation enthusiasts.

I mean the Russians were first to conceptualize stealth technology.. so no wonder if they know how to counter it..

Hi,

Actually that was an Excellent decision made by Egypt going for the F16's regardless of the BVR or not.

The transition to BVR would a piece of cake.

Actually the F-16s came to Egypt fully armed ..and had the Sparrow semi-active BVR missiles .. but its stopped there for whatever reasons after the active radar BVR came along..

 

[Gomig-21]

I mean the Russians were first to conceptualize stealth technology.. so no wonder if they know how to counter it..

Actually the F-16s came to Egypt fully armed ..and had the Sparrow semi-active BVR missiles .. but its stopped there for whatever reasons after the active radar BVR came along..

As well as make the best use of it, too. They prioritized frontal and side aspect knowing enemy fighter radars would have a tough time detecting and tracking but didn't invest much in rear and lower aspect knowing ground radars outside of X band are too powerful against stealth, especially when they're building many of those radars including the NEBO and so then they invest in other features to protect those areas such as the electro-conductive coating and Khibiny pods which will be internal in the Su-57. But people look at it and don't see F-22 or F-35 features and without being knowledgeable enough, think it's a dud LOL.

 

[FCPX]

Actually it was a successful project..Egypt even made the engine too .. but many factors contributed to its demise, mainly the preparations for imminent war with Usrael, the Soviets presenting the Mig-21 as a cheaper alternative for that war with mass production..Egypt was not at that stage yet.. and the Usraelis of course .. as far as the ballistic missiles go Egypt has manufactured at least 7 types.. and it is still kept secret in that regard..

And yes Egypt is in a much better position today to undertake various sophisticated locally based defense projects..

I was quoting from some published material regarding the history of both the 2 x aircraft projects (fighter & trainer) and the various missile projects, anyways, happy to hear that Egypt now has the infrastructure to undertake complex defense projects.

 

[The SC]

June 15, 2019
(just 2years ago)

CATIC is engaged in discussions with Egypt surrounding the Block 3s

Block 3 Jets

The JF-17 Block 3 enhancements will involve new avionics, including a helmet-mounted display and a holographic wide-angle head-up display, better electronic warfare systems with integrated self-protection kit, as well as a missile approach and warning system, an increased payload, and more sophisticated weapons like a fifth-generation short-range air-to-air missile. It will be the ultimate JF-17, and with an AESA radar will have the capability to employ longer-range weapons and track multiple aircraft.

A decision on a new AESA radar for the Block 3s is expected to be made by the end of the year. There are now three Chinese contenders, which were all shown at last year’s Zhuhai Air Show, while Leonardo’s Grifo-E is still on the table.

Nanjing Research Institute of Electronics Technology's KLJ-7A is being marketed by China Electronics Technology Group Corporation in air- and liquid-cooling options. The second contender, which was displayed at the Zhuhai Air Show last November along with the two Nanjing examples, comes from Leihua Electronic Technology Research Institute (LETRI), another air-cooling AESA known as the LKF601E. AVIC has thrown its weight behind this option and claims it was the first air-cooling radar. Replacing the JF-17’s original KLJ-7 is simply a case of taking out the old system and inserting the new one. The PAF’s Flight Test Group is currently working the options.

Production Line

More than 100 JF-17s have now come off the AMF assembly line, where the wings, horizontal tail, vertical tail, and forward fuselage, representing 58 percent of the fighter, are built. They are matched with the remaining 42 percent built in Chengdu in China, including the mid- and rear- fuselages that are airfreighted to PAC Kamra. The three fuselage sections are mated at the JF-17 subassembly line and are pushed through on a large trolley to one of the four docks in the final assembly facility.
That’s when the avionics, wiring, undercarriage, harnesses, and Klimov RD93 powerplant are added, while the Martin-Baker Mk16 ejection seat comes later. The aircraft’s air-to-air refueling probes are not necessarily fitted on the assembly line, although all the necessary plumbing has been put in place since the production of Block 2 13-129.

After being towed down to the flight test shed, the newly built JF-17s are put through five functional check flights (FCFs) by one of the four qualified test pilots based at the co-located Test and Evaluation Squadron (TES). Three PAF pilots have qualified at the Boscombe Down-based Empire Test Pilot School for the JF-17, but now most of them go to Xian in China to get their qualifications. When the author met Squadron Leader Ali in April, he was about to test-fly the latest JF-17 to leave the assembly line. He went through a six months training program in China after flying with two operational JF-17 squadrons. Working alongside him in the flight test shed was Boscombe-qualified Group Captain Imran, who spent two years during the early days of the JF-17 test program at Chengdu flying the prototypes and was more recently the first JF-17 Combat Commanders School (CCS) commanding officer. He told AIN, “During the FCFs we push the aircraft to the limit, right through the complete envelope, to assess the handling qualities, checking the systems and aircraft performance.”

Once the FCFs are completed the PAF then puts the JF-17 through a further check flight and if there are no snags, the aircraft will be officially handed over.

...

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2019-06-15/jf-17-thunder-lightning-strikes-twice