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Belgium allows PKK to celebrate the anniversary of its first terror attack against Turkey

Penguin said:
PKK is seperate from and predates ISIL by many, many years. The first training camp was established in 1982 in Bekaa Valley (which was then under Syrian control), with the support of the Palestine Liberation Organization and Syria. Since the Kurds are spread over different states (Turkey, Iraq, Syria, Iran) so is the PKK. During the controversial Ergenekon trials in Turkey, allegations have been made that the PKK is linked to elements of the Turkish intelligence community.

The PKK engaged the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) forces in Syria in mid-July 2014 as part of the Syrian Civil War. In August the PKK engaged IS in Northern Iraq and pressured the Government of Turkey to take a stand against IS. PKK forces helped "tens of thousands of Yazidis escape an encircled Mount Sinjar." In September 2014, during the Siege of Kobane, the PKK engaged with Islamic State forces in Syria, which resulted in conflicts with Turks on the border and an end to a cease-fire that had been in place over a year. PKK snipers were active fighting ISIL on the front line in Sinjar in 2015. Meanwhile, the Turkish government restricted PKK-associated fighters' movement across its borders and Turkish Air Force fighter-bombers attacked PKK positions in the vicinity of Daglica, Hakkari Province. In July 2015, Turkey finally became involved in the war against ISIL. While they were doing so, they decided to bomb PKK targets in Iraq.

Your comment suggest you are ill-informed

ps. Are you suggesting Turkish retaliation against Belgium? As if threats are going to help Turkey...


Yes, the PKK is listed as a terrorist organization by several states and organizations, including the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), the United States of America and European Union.

However, the United Nations and countries such as Switzerland, China, India, Russia and Egypt have not designated the PKK as a terrorist organization.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/belgium-allows-pkk-to-celebrate-the-anniversary-of-its-first-terror-attack-against-turkey.444467/#ixzz4HUyWy0Th

Belgium is a member of NATO and EU as well as UN.

As indicated, how police decide to deal with an unauthorized demonstration is their priveledge (an operational decision). It does not mean the Belgian authorities condone or support PPK (tactical and strategic decisions). Only simple minded people make such simple connections
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Replace pkk with isis and the situation would be totally different. World would pressure Belgium to death, had it allowed an isis protest. It's simple, EU authorities are turning a blind eye towards pkk activities. Pkk propaganda at the EU parliament among endless examples.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/pr...rkey.aspx?PageID=238&NID=101538&NewsCatID=510

Try to fool someone else.
 
CrimsonFury said:
We don't have to retaliate at all, your amateurish borderline stupid handling of extremists is already making you pay a physchlogical/material price that only a full scale invasion can outshine....keep it up:lol:. The PKK and Isil have one thing in common p:both are terror groups but PKK is tacitly supported because it serves your interests. They will be dealt with one way or another, no matter how many demonstrations they are allowed to stage in your countries and no matter how long the text wall you post here. :enjoy:
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I am not from Belgium. Kindly keep your reponses mature and if possible professional.

You:
  • are just you, not a group.
  • don't seem to know the difference between Belgium and the next EU country.
  • make accusations concerning a situation you don't know any details of.
  • get personal
Who's being amateurish, bordeline stupid?

usernameless said:
Other (radical) groups in Syria are also fighting isis, why doesn't the US and EU supply these groups and send advisors directly like they do with pyd/ypg, which is pkk's syria wing (pkk is also on the terror list of the US and EU). The US has a clear agenda for pyd/ypg and the region. While Turkey is contributing towards the fight against pkk and isis, our 'allies' are openly supporting the pkk's Syrian wing and allows them to make propaganda in the EU and US. Who is hypocrite #1 is crystal clear.
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I'm not debating this with you, as it is going off-topic. If only because you now start bringing in the US and the initial post has no reference to the US but Belgium (which is an EU member).

As indicated, many people confuse an operational level police decision with national or even supranational policy. That's just plain simple minded. And, like it of not, Turkey is neither the white knight nor the dark prince but rather one of many players of different shades of grey, all part of a bigger game, all with their own private agenda's.

Please remain polite and civil in any discussion here.

usernameless said:
Replace pkk with isis and the situation would be totally different. World would pressure Belgium to death, had it allowed an isis protest. It's simple, EU authorities are turning a blind eye towards pkk activities. Pkk propaganda at the EU parliament among endless examples.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/pr...rkey.aspx?PageID=238&NID=101538&NewsCatID=510

Try to fool someone else.
Click to expand...
I don't know why you feel the need to accuse me of attempting to fool anyone. I respond to silly or ill-informed posts. Don't want me to respond? Inform yourself and construct a post proper (rather than just yap someting).

You make a lot of claims above, which you can't, don't and won't substantiate with some supporting evidence.

I can appreciate patriotism, but it shouldn't blind anyone.
 
Penguin said:
I am not from Belgium. Kindly keep your reponses mature and if possible professional.

You:
  • are just you, not a group.
  • don't seem to know the difference between Belgium and the next EU country.
  • make accusations concerning a situation you don't know any details of.
  • get personal
Who's being amateurish, bordeline stupid?
Click to expand...
I:
-Was born in a EU country, and went to university in another EU country. I have friends in EU countries and traveled it east to west.
-I don't know much about Belgium as Belgium is a irrelevant little country . All I know about it is that it has good chocolate, beer and also tacitly supports all terror organisations against Turkey.
-I know more about this situation than you. Try all you want to introduce a red herring when it comes to arguments about PKK vs. Isis or the Belgian police not wanting to cause "violence". You won't fool me
-The reason as to why I get personal is because Europeans still try to defend the PKK and come up with pathetic excuses when asked as to why they tolerate them making propaganda.

As for being amateurish and borderline stupid I meant the Belgian security forces:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ials-bash-shitty-belgian-security-forces.html
 
CrimsonFury said:
I:
-Was born in a EU country, and went to university in another EU country. I have friends in EU countries and traveled it east to west.
-I don't know much about Belgium as Belgium is a irrelevant little country . All I know about it is that it has good chocolate, beer and also tacitly supports all terror organisations against Turkey.
-I know more about this situation than you. Try all you want to introduce a red herring when it comes to arguments about PKK vs. Isis or the Belgian police not wanting to cause "violence". You won't fool me
-The reason as to why I get personal is because Europeans still try to defend the PKK and come up with pathetic excuses when asked as to why they tolerate them making propaganda.

As for being amateurish and borderline stupid I meant the Belgian security forces:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ials-bash-shitty-belgian-security-forces.html
Click to expand...

Relax man, nobody attacked you. Take a chill pill or something.
  • It is not relevant where you were born, or got your education, or where you have friends, or where you travelled
  • Belgium not only makes the best chocolate and beers in the world but has a nice little arms industry (FN Herstal, CMI Defence etc) and its where the EU lives.
  • You have no idea what I do or do not know. In order for a mind to function properly it has to be open (like a parachute)
  • Go get personal with someone else please, I for one have not patience for it.
If you don't know e.g. how local government in the Brussels area is, you really are not in a position to come to a valid conclusion about what the police did.

Brussels capital region (1 million people) is divided into 19 municipalities, each having its own government (i.e. a mayor and a cabinet for each municipality), responsible for the handling of local level duties, such as law enforcement and the upkeep of schools and roads within its borders. Some of the municipalities are Flemish speaking, others French speaking, and therefor don't cooperate. This aside from the political competition between these municipalities.

Do you even know which police agency (federal, local) was operating and under whose instructions?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_enforcement_in_Belgium#Local_Police
 
Last edited:
Penguin said:
Relax man, nobody attacked you. Take a chill pill or something.
  • It is not relevant where you were born, or got your education, or where you have friends, or where you travelled
  • Belgium not only makes the best chocolate and beers in the world but has a nice little arms industry (FN Herstal, CMI Defence etc) and its where the EU lives.
  • You have no idea what I do or do not know. In order for a mind to function properly it has to be open (like a parachute)
  • Go get personal with someone else please, I for one have not patience for it.
Click to expand...
Good, if you have no patience then don't try and defend terrorist supporters spreading propaganda in a EU country. Adios
 
Let's clear some misunderstandings here.

Penguin said:
Turkey finally became involved in the war against ISIL. While they were doing so, they decided to bomb PKK targets in Iraq.
Click to expand...
Turkey was bombing PKK positions in Iraq, way before ISIS...We are not gonna ask permission from anybody to bomb terrorists.


Penguin said:
During the controversial Ergenekon trials in Turkey, allegations have been made that the PKK is linked to elements of the Turkish intelligence community.
Click to expand...
Ergenekon, Balyoz, İnternet Andıcı were phony cases set up by Gülenist prosecutors and judges. Most of them are jail and the soldiers whom jailed by those cases are out.

CrimsonFury said:
Good, if you have no patience then don't try and defend terrorist supporters spreading propaganda in a EU country. Adios
Click to expand...
When it's about a terrorist organization which harms Turkey, not only EU politicians but also european people as individuals, rally behind terrorists.....it's a very interesting phenomenon.
 
Sinan said:
Let's clear some misunderstandings here.


Turkey was bombing PKK positions in Iraq, way before ISIS...We are not gonna ask permission from anybody to bomb terrorists.



Ergenekon, Balyoz, İnternet Andıcı were phony cases set up by Gülenist prosecutors and judges. Most of them are jail and the soldiers whom jailed by those cases are out.


When it's about a terrorist organization which harms Turkey, not only EU politicians but also european people as individuals, rally behind terrorists.....it's a very interesting phenomenon.
Click to expand...
It's not a phenomenon. When your dog goes and attacks the neighbor you despise or shits on that neighbors front lawn this makes you happy even though you try and look somewhat apologetic and "friendly" . But when your neighbor demands you to keep your dog in check you react angrily talking about rights and more bullshit about compassion and right to life and so you let this go on. But one day the neighbor is going to grab a gun and shoot your fucking dog and shoot you too if you resist or try and retaliate.
 
Ghazwa e Hind said:
They are the so called chanters of human rights slogans. Their history, their near past and their current actions are all barbaric. From crusades to world wars to modern wars. These westerners are crushing their adversaries with lethal force and they don't give a damn to the ethics, moralities or human rights. "Collateral Damage" is just a joke for them where they can kill dozens of children by just giving the name of collateral damage to their actions.
Click to expand...

That is why the Westerners have been the driving force behind the Geneva Convention,
which is what is governing legal warfare.
Pakistan has signed the Geneva Convention, so Your country are bound by its rules.
According to the convention, it is always legal to attack military targets.
Exception are hospitals and the force used must be proportional.
It also emphasis the importance of separation between civilians and combatants to avoid killing of civilians.
It is the responsibility of the combatant to ensure thus separation.

If a military target is attacked and civilians are killed it is collateral damage.
If a civilian target is believed to be a military target and civilians are killed it is a mistake.
If a civilian target is believed to be civilian, and then attacked, only then it is a crime.

None treats the Geneva Convention as a joke, except apparently Muslims which believes that they know better,
regardless whether their country signed it or not. At least this is the impression you get when You read PDF.
 
A.P. Richelieu said:
That is why the Westerners have been the driving force behind the Geneva Convention,
which is what is governing legal warfare.
Pakistan has signed the Geneva Convention, so Your country are bound by its rules.
According to the convention, it is always legal to attack military targets.
Exception are hospitals and the force used must be proportional.
It also emphasis the importance of separation between civilians and combatants to avoid killing of civilians.
It is the responsibility of the combatant to ensure thus separation.

If a military target is attacked and civilians are killed it is collateral damage.
If a civilian target is believed to be a military target and civilians are killed it is a mistake.
If a civilian target is believed to be civilian, and then attacked, only then it is a crime.

None treats the Geneva Convention as a joke, except apparently Muslims which believes that they know better,
regardless whether their country signed it or not. At least this is the impression you get when You read PDF.
Click to expand...
It means Al-Qaeda and ISIS are justified?
 
Penguin said:
I don't know why you feel the need to accuse me of attempting to fool anyone. I respond to silly or ill-informed posts. Don't want me to respond? Inform yourself and construct a post proper (rather than just yap someting).

You make a lot of claims above, which you can't, don't and won't substantiate with some supporting evidence.

I can appreciate patriotism, but it shouldn't blind anyone.
Click to expand...
You definitely need to inform yourself about Turkey and the relations with the EU. You can come talking to me and other Turks here about whatever topic you want and we will be all ears, but when it comes to our country and, for example, the relationship with the EU, then we don't appreciate it when a foreigner is clearly misinformed, yet is talking from a high horse. So, get off that high horse first.

No need to get complicated with 'Belgian municipalities' and what not.
Such pkk protests have been happening for who knows how many years in the EU. Belgium and other EU countries are not banana countries, are they? If they can't/don't want to prevent such protests, then we have the right to criticize them and even suspect them of indirectly supporting.

Let's see what Belgium allows despite having the pkk on its terrorist list;
  1. Allowing pkk supporters to set up tents in Brussels and make propaganda there.
    http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/teror-or...nti-brukselde-actigi-cadir-hala-faal-40073066
  2. Belgium does not extradite pkk and other terrorists to Turkey.
    http://www.dailysabah.com/war-on-te...kk-rejects-20-extradition-demands-from-ankara
  3. pkk supporters are free to protest.
    (See this article)
  4. EU parliament in Brussels allowed pyd/pkk propaganda.
    http://aa.com.tr/en/anadolu-post/eu-parliament-criticized-over-terrorist-photo-exhibit/606486
At this point, Belgium (and some other EU states) might as well remove the pkk from the terror list and at least be direct with us instead of pretending to be combating the pkk :rolleyes1:
 
CrimsonFury said:
Good, if you have no patience then don't try and defend terrorist supporters spreading propaganda in a EU country. Adios
Click to expand...
Please quote the exact passage from the exact post where I've defended 'terrorist supporters spreading propaganda in a EU country'. I dare you.
 
Penguin said:
Please quote the exact passage from the exact post where I've defended 'terrorist supporters spreading propaganda in a EU country'. I dare you.
Click to expand...
Lol the whole day you are arguing that Belgian police decided to not interfere with the demo. Now why'd they not interfere? Even when the demo is illegal? Even if the demo is pro-terrorism? Even when the demo supports a group that the EU recognises as a terror group? By not interfering you are guilty of supporting terrorism in Turkey. Those that stand by and let it happen are just as guilty as those doing it. The EU s arrogance and hypocrisy will be reason for its destruction, I can't wait for the far right to tear this spineless entity into pieces.
 
Ghazwa e Hind said:
It means Al-Qaeda and ISIS are justified?
Click to expand...
There are very few clauses in the Geneva Convention that Al-Qaeda and ISIS does not violate.
Suicide bombing in a market square - War Crime
Shooting down a passenger jet, knowing it to be a passenger jet - War Crime.
Blowing a bomb in a passenger terminal - War Crime
Cutting throat of a priest giving sermon - War Crime
Attacking USS Cole while pretending to be civilian - War Crime
Blowing up discoteque with hundreds of kids - War Crime
Blowing up a commuter bus - War Crime
Incinerating a Jordanian captured pilot alive - War Crime
Ethnic cleansing of non Muslims - War Crime

Your attempt to compare this with legal warfare shows how retarded you are.
 

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