Stealth frigate INS Sahyadri enters Da Nang port in Vietnam

[21 Dec 2012]

For comparison here's

British Type 26​

Type: Frigate or Global Combat Ship
Displacement: 6,500 t (6,400 long tons; 7,200 short tons), 8,000 t full load[5]
Length: 148.5 m (487 ft)[6]
Beam: 20 m (66 ft)[6]

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
8 × 6-cell CAMM VLS canisters for a total of 48:[4]
CAMM missiles (range 1-25+ km)

Strike-length VLS:
3 × 8-cell strike-length Mk 41 VLS for possible: Tomahawk, ASROC andLRASM[4][8]

Anti-submarine torpedoes:
Possible Sting Ray torpedo system[4]

Guns:
1 × BAE 5 inch Mk 45 naval gun[9][4]
2 × 30mm DS30M Mk2 guns[4]
2 × Phalanx CIWS[4]
2 × Miniguns
4 × General purpose machine guns

VS
Shivalik​

Displacement: 6,200 tonnes (6,100 long tons; 6,800 short tons) full load[3]
Length: 142.5 m (468 ft)[4]
Beam: 16.9 m (55 ft)

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
32-cell VLS launched Barak 8 missiles
24 × Shtil-1 medium range missiles

Anti-ship/Land-attack missiles:
8 × VLS launched Klub, anti-ship cruise missiles
or
8 × VLS launched BrahMos, anti-ship and land-attack cruise missiles

Guns:
1 × twin 3.0-inch Otobreda, naval gun
2 × AK-630 CIWS

Anti-submarine warfare:
2 × 2 DTA-53-956 torpedo launchers

2 × RBU-6000 (RPK-8) rocket launchers

FREMM​

Displacement:

France: 6,000 tonnes[3]
Italy: 6,900 tonnes[4]
Length: France: 142 m (466 ft)
Italy: 144.6 m (474 ft)
Beam: France: 20 m (66 ft)
Italy: 19.7 m (65 ft)

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
France: 16-cell SYLVER A43 VLS for 16Aster 15 missiles
Italy: 16-cell SYLVER A50 VLS for 16Aster 15 and 30 missiles

Guns:
France: 1 × OTO Melara 76 mm SR gun
Italy: 2 × OTO Melara 76/62 mmDavide/Strales CIWS guns (ASW variant)
1 × Otobreda 127/64 Vulcano and 1 ×OTO Melara 76/62 mm Davide/StralesCIWS gun (GP variant)

Small guns:
France: 3 × Nexter 20mm Narwhalremote weapon systems
Italy: 2 × Oto Melara/Oerlikon25/80 mm remote weapon systems

Anti-ship missiles:
France: 8 × MM-40 Exocet block 3 anti-ship missiles
Italy: 8 × Teseo\Otomat Mk-2/A anti-ship and land attack missiles

Land-attack cruise missiles:
France: 16-cell SYLVER A70 VLS for 16 × SCALP Naval land-attack cruise missiles

Anti-submarine warfare:
France: 2 x double WASS B-515 launcher for MU 90 torpedoes

Italy: 2 x triple WASS B-515/3 launcher for MU 90 torpedoes (GP variant)
2 x triple WASS B-515/3 launcher forMU 90 torpedoes and 4 x Milasmissiles (ASW variant)



Conclusion: The reports of Shivalik's underpowerty are greatly exaggerated.
@MilSpec VLS or not?

 

[Abingdonboy]

 

[MilSpec]

Hi,
My views on the IN platforms is common knowledge here on the forum. I am big fan of the Shivalik Class and Talwar class. Both these families are almost as potent in the water as the Delhi class destoyers and outguns the Rajput class by a mile, which by no means a small feat.

Both Shivalik and Talwar class replaced rajputs in the CBG formation and reduced the Delhi class ships in the formation.
I do think there can be another 32 cell VLS on a the Kolkatta class Destroyer though - but that's just my personal opinion.

Now coming to subsystem, small thing I would mention, the 533 mm torp tube will be capable of supporting SS-N-15 'Starfish' or possibly SS-N-16 'Stallion, both asroc missiles, but if we pay a little more attention, Brahmos/Klub N and Nirbhay SLCM will also be tube capable. So these puppies might be carrying more that what seems on the spec.

For comparison here's

British Type 26​

Type: Frigate or Global Combat Ship
Displacement: 6,500 t (6,400 long tons; 7,200 short tons), 8,000 t full load[5]
Length: 148.5 m (487 ft)[6]
Beam: 20 m (66 ft)[6]

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
8 × 6-cell CAMM VLS canisters for a total of 48:[4]
CAMM missiles (range 1-25+ km)

Strike-length VLS:
3 × 8-cell strike-length Mk 41 VLS for possible: Tomahawk, ASROC andLRASM[4][8]

Anti-submarine torpedoes:
Possible Sting Ray torpedo system[4]

Guns:
1 × BAE 5 inch Mk 45 naval gun[9][4]
2 × 30mm DS30M Mk2 guns[4]
2 × Phalanx CIWS[4]
2 × Miniguns
4 × General purpose machine guns

VS
Shivalik​

Displacement: 6,200 tonnes (6,100 long tons; 6,800 short tons) full load[3]
Length: 142.5 m (468 ft)[4]
Beam: 16.9 m (55 ft)

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
32-cell VLS launched Barak 8 missiles
24 × Shtil-1 medium range missiles

Anti-ship/Land-attack missiles:
8 × VLS launched Klub, anti-ship cruise missiles
or
8 × VLS launched BrahMos, anti-ship and land-attack cruise missiles

Guns:
1 × twin 3.0-inch Otobreda, naval gun
2 × AK-630 CIWS

Anti-submarine warfare:
2 × 2 DTA-53-956 torpedo launchers

2 × RBU-6000 (RPK-8) rocket launchers

FREMM​

Displacement:

France: 6,000 tonnes[3]
Italy: 6,900 tonnes[4]
Length: France: 142 m (466 ft)
Italy: 144.6 m (474 ft)
Beam: France: 20 m (66 ft)
Italy: 19.7 m (65 ft)

Armament:

Anti-air missiles:
France: 16-cell SYLVER A43 VLS for 16Aster 15 missiles
Italy: 16-cell SYLVER A50 VLS for 16Aster 15 and 30 missiles

Guns:
France: 1 × OTO Melara 76 mm SR gun
Italy: 2 × OTO Melara 76/62 mmDavide/Strales CIWS guns (ASW variant)
1 × Otobreda 127/64 Vulcano and 1 ×OTO Melara 76/62 mm Davide/StralesCIWS gun (GP variant)

Small guns:
France: 3 × Nexter 20mm Narwhalremote weapon systems
Italy: 2 × Oto Melara/Oerlikon25/80 mm remote weapon systems

Anti-ship missiles:
France: 8 × MM-40 Exocet block 3 anti-ship missiles
Italy: 8 × Teseo\Otomat Mk-2/A anti-ship and land attack missiles

Land-attack cruise missiles:
France: 16-cell SYLVER A70 VLS for 16 × SCALP Naval land-attack cruise missiles

Anti-submarine warfare:
France: 2 x double WASS B-515 launcher for MU 90 torpedoes

Italy: 2 x triple WASS B-515/3 launcher for MU 90 torpedoes (GP variant)
2 x triple WASS B-515/3 launcher forMU 90 torpedoes and 4 x Milasmissiles (ASW variant)



Conclusion: The reports of Shivalik's underpowerty are greatly exaggerated.
@MilSpec VLS or not?

 

[21 Dec 2012]

Hi,
My views on the IN platforms is common knowledge here on the forum. I am big fan of the Shivalik Class and Talwar class. Both these families are almost as potent in the water as the Delhi class destoyers and outguns the Rajput class by a mile, which by no means a small feat.

Both Shivalik and Talwar class replaced rajputs in the CBG formation and reduced the Delhi class ships in the formation.
I do think there can be another 32 cell VLS on a the Kolkatta class Destroyer though - but that's just my personal opinion.

Now coming to subsystem, small thing I would mention, the 533 mm torp tube will be capable of supporting SS-N-15 'Starfish' or possibly SS-N-16 'Stallion, both asroc missiles, but if we pay a little more attention, Brahmos/Klub N and Nirbhay SLCM will also be tube capable. So these puppies might be carrying more that what seems on the spec.

I don't know what this is about. I asked about the 6x4 Shitil VLS quote earlier while everything else says it is rail launched.

 

[MilSpec]

I don't know what this is about. I asked about the 6x4 Shitil VLS quote earlier while everything else says it is rail launched.

I am not sure what you are asking? If your query is VLS vs rail launched, it think it is VLS on Shivalik, and rail launched on Talwar class.

Edit: let me take that back it is a rail launched version

 

[21 Dec 2012]

I am not sure what you are asking?

This

6x4 Shtil 32 cell VLS for AD

 

[cloud_9]

Water's around Da Nang are infested with Chinese vessels as the Parcels Islands and Yulin Naval base are pretty close by.
Hopefully they do encounter some floating warning bureau's a.k.a PLAN Naval Ship's.

PS : The city with Russians!

 

[MilSpec]

This

my bad it is a rail launched version, not a VLS, I was thinking AFT launcher was Shtil, turns out that's the barak.

 

[Abingdonboy]

P-17A:

 

[Abingdonboy]

Buddy get your facts of weapon systems like Shtils first. These are not some dude Sam systems. Shtil 1 :
the new Shtil-1 can launch once every 1.5-2 seconds.Range 32km altitude 15 km.

Russian media : The Shtil-1 may also interest China, whose forces are armed with the old version of the SAM.

"China has six project 956 destroyers which are armed with the Shtil. Russia also has such vessels. Repairing the old SAMs is meaningless. Therefore, in the future, the current upgrade may interest not only the Russian Navy, but also our Chinese partners,” said Kuzyuk.

Launch and ground equipment for the medium range Shtil-1 SAM is produced at the scientific-manufacturing enterprise “Start” (which is part of the Tekhnodinamika holding). The system is designed to engage all the modern means of air attack at medium range and at altitudes from 15 kilometers. A distinctive feature of the system is the use of the updated surface-to-air missile with a vertical start, and the use of multi-function radar with phased array antennas.

Of course the envelop is of both Barak 1 and shtil 1 is around 32 km. But 32 Barak and 24 shtil is no joke. That too when our frigates has power full electronic suite and sensors coupled with world's fastest cruise missile with 300 km range. And backed up by 2 multiple purpose naval helicopters we are far ahead of Chinese and Pakistan. Our presumed enemies our ships will be fighting.

So IOR and SCS warfare can be fought with these little beasts of ours. Barak 8 with operational range of 80-90 km already under several tests. So our future fleet of frigates will be kick as s buddy



Does it even matter buddy? Are you saying SAM without vertical launch configuration are duds? Vertical launch silos allows you to configure with many kinds of missiles systems it's not possible with angled launched Shtil missiles. But it's gonna hit it target what so ever

You haven't even factored in the EL/M-2248 MF-STAR and RAN-40L combo that is coming on the P-17A (and will likely be fitted onto the P-17s during MLU)- by FAR the most devastating sensor suite in the region aboard a warship (if not the world).

 

[TOPGUN]

A very nice piece of ship packed with a lot of firepower thanks for sharing .

 

[Spectre]

Our superiority in IOR and SCS is given. We just have to keep our lines running. 3 more frigates to be signed with Russia too. More frigates can shatter invading formation while destroyers and Carries pound their shattered targets. Our list is like day dreaming but it's a reality 6 +6 ssk old ssk upgrades SSNs lol. Death trap awaiting our neighbors

Chinese have an edge at SCS, Indians at IOR this is irrefutable. Plain and simple.

Indians lack the numbers to take on China in SCS specially with the current and projected capability. Qualitatively we might be a wee bit better with surface assets but disparity is huge with sub surface vessels

Asserting anything else is a mistake.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Our superiority in IOR and SCS is given. We just have to keep our lines running. 3 more frigates to be signed with Russia too. More frigates can shatter invading formation while destroyers and Carries pound their shattered targets. Our list is like day dreaming but it's a reality 6 +6 ssk old ssk upgrades SSNs lol. Death trap awaiting our neighbors

Whoa whoa, let's not even think about the SCS for now-that is the next decade's fight. Right now it is all about building a solid foundation in the IOR (and that is what is happening).

The SCS pivot will come but let's not preempt it but watch the Eastern fleet and developments at the ANC closely, things are changing down there rapidly.

 

[Spectre]

Understand what I said. ? Based on one on one battle with frigates of countries in IOR and SCS.

I agree we can't carryout operations against China alone. So does China's fate in IOR

OK

 

[Abingdonboy]

Understand what I said. ? Based on one on one battle with frigates of countries in IOR and SCS.

Well using this very specific (and arbitrary) criteria you are correct.