Russia All set to lose the Indian defense market

[Storm Force]

The news that USA has for the 4th time in 2 years tipped Russia to a BIG indian military contract is no surprise

Flash! Boeing's Chinook Wins Indian Heavy Copter Fight

PHOTO / U.S. ARMY
Another one in the bag for Boeing. Reports today suggest that Boeing's CH-47F Chinook has beaten Russia's Mi-26T2 to meet an Indian Air Force requirement for 15 heavy-lift multirole helicopters. The Chinook has emerged the more competitively priced of the two helicopters following scrutiny of commercial bids that were opened late September.

While Boeing had exuded confidence about winning the IAF's attack helicopter deal -- which it did with the AH-64D Apache Block III, since the Russian Mi-28N had failed to meet requirements in field trials -- the heavy copter competition was more tricky, since both the Chinook and Mi-26 had been found compliant, and passed trials.

Commercial negotiations with Boeing are expected to commence shortly.

The amricans have no one

C17 globemasters
C130 transports
Apache 3 guns ships
P8 posedions
And engines for LCA TEJAS

and now above

THE INDIANS are dropping the russians

WHY ???????/

iTS BELIEVED even the FGFA will be russian only in airframe and engines

with the weapons radar and ECCM all being indian or MMRCA/israeli

I think the RUSSIANS will lose the massive indianm market now

 

[arp2041]

Who said Indians are dropping the Russians, isn't billions of dollars of assured deals in military as well as nuclear tech for at least next 2 decades not good enough?? if Russians want to remain the sole weapon supplier to the emerging power like India than i must say they are just greedy & are alienating themselves. India just want the best systems for there forces if u have one than u are welcome or else good bye

 

[illusion8]

The news that USA has for the 4th time in 2 years tipped Russia to a BIG indian military contract is no surprise




The amricans have no one

C17 globemasters
C130 transports
Apache 3 guns ships
P8 posedions
And engines for LCA TEJAS

and now above

THE INDIANS are dropping the russians

WHY ???????/

iTS BELIEVED even the FGFA will be russian only in airframe and engines

with the weapons radar and ECCM all being indian or MMRCA/israeli

I think the RUSSIANS will lose the massive indianm market now

I guess each case of loss has it's own set of reasons accompanied by say a couple of general reasons.

One general reason I can think of is the eternal delay that comes with Russian Exports.

 

[silent poison]

i don't think they will loose a Massive Indian Defence Market ..... they will only loose a bit of Share in it .. Russian will No more enjoy a status of Monoply In Indian Defence ....

I guess each case of loss has it's own set of reasons accompanied by say a couple of general reasons.

One general reason I can think of is the eternal delay that comes with Russian Exports.

INS Vikramaditya

 

[Capt.Popeye]

The news that USA has for the 4th time in 2 years tipped Russia to a BIG indian military contract is no surprise




The amricans have no one

C17 globemasters
C130 transports
Apache 3 guns ships
P8 posedions
And engines for LCA TEJAS

and now above

THE INDIANS are dropping the russians

WHY ???????/

iTS BELIEVED even the FGFA will be russian only in airframe and engines

with the weapons radar and ECCM all being indian or MMRCA/israeli

I think the RUSSIANS will lose the massive indianm market now

You seem to be a "A man in a hurry......................................to reach a conclusion".
Its usually said "one swallow does not a summer make" neither is loss of a defence deal going to cause "Siberian Blizzards in the Indo-Russian relationship".
Everybody (including the Russians) know that India is just opening up new options, simply because India is in a position (financial and strategic) to do so. Simply speaking, Russia has some competition now. That said, there are still some matters where the Russians have a competitive edge over anybody, including 'good old' Uncle Sam. That has been factored in by both Russia and India. While India and Russia have none of that "higher than........ and deeper than........" poetical hype between them; there is a deep down solid but relatively silent relationship.

That has'nt got chucked outta the window yet!

 

[illusion8]

iTS BELIEVED even the FGFA will be russian only in airframe and engines

The FGFA numbers have been cut to a third for the same precise reason of delay - we were to have a total of 3 prototypes of the FGFA one each in 2013, 2015, 2017 and the first roll out in 2018, now it's been pushed to 2020 which again is tentative.

This has been done owing to perpetual delays that has become synonymous with Russian manufacturing and R&D.

There is one more logical reason to it and that is - unmanned 5th generation drones/ aircrafts will be the norm in the 20'/30's and this delay will mean India having 5th generation manned crafts in those time frames.

There is definitely some slackness in Indo Russian defense programs and the Russians need to pull themselves together if they want the Indian market, the other option for them would be China and they are not comfortable with that plus the Chinese have started building their own systems.

Russia needs to buck up and come up to speed or else their defense global export pie will shrink considerably.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Russia still remains the supplier of AC and Nuke Submarine and FGFA etc all critical to India's future, which no one else will provide..

Also maybe S-400 in future.

 

[Storm Force]

Il,m glad to see illusion is seeing what i am seeing.

Many people are banking on the FGFA prgramme keeping russia in the MIX with indian military but i see trouble ahead

Its rumoured some of IAF 4000 RUSSIAN SUPPLIED BVR/WVR missles dont work
We all know about GORSKHOV saga
And that india is not happy with price escalation of MKI follow on orders

On the whole RUSSIAN after sales service has been poor.

I do feel the AMERICANS weapons sales and after sales is far superior BUT you have the baggage of sanctions always

 

[illusion8]

Il,m glad to see illusion is seeing what i am seeing.

Many people are banking on the FGFA prgramme keeping russia in the MIX with indian military but i see trouble ahead

Its rumoured some of IAF 4000 RUSSIAN SUPPLIED BVR/WVR missles dont work
We all know about GORSKHOV saga
And that india is not happy with price escalation of MKI follow on orders

On the whole RUSSIAN after sales service has been poor.

I do feel the AMERICANS weapons sales and after sales is far superior BUT you have the baggage of sanctions always

US cannot compensate for Russia for lack of trust - France and Israel can to an extent, India has started building its own systems again with outside help, Our R&D and own developments will be considerable in a decades time. These external purchases coming with limited TOT will help to some extent. You are right there is considerable problems in most of the programs and the reasons are in Russia.

I hope in the next one year we sort it out between ourselves or else the distance between us will increase considerably.

This does not mean that India and Russia will cease to be friends.

We will need to find other alternative areas of cooperation to keep the relationship going. For e.g. Gazprom has signed a multi billion Gas supply contract with India as a first. Glasnoss and the joint Mars exploration is one such.

 

[Storm Force]

I see the military share of RUSSIA shrinking from high of 70% to alm ost down to just 25% in the next decade

The indengious indian industry & USA & israel and europe will take even slice each by 2020+ i see this being

Indian indengious 25%
USA 20%
Russia 20%
israel 15%
France 15%

 

[Secur]

Its rumoured some of IAF 4000 RUSSIAN SUPPLIED BVR/WVR missles dont work

What ? ... How is it even possible ?

The FGFA numbers have been cut to a third for the same precise reason of delay - we were to have a total of 3 prototypes of the FGFA one each in 2013, 2015, 2017 and the first roll out in 2018, now it's been pushed to 2020 which again is tentative.

If you really think that it is that easy to make a 5th Generation fighter than you are illusioned ! Delays are expected due to the setbacks suffered by the Kremlin after the dissolution of USSR ... Check when the Raptor project was started ...

 

[Mirza Jatt]

Russia hasnt lost the market. The Russian share seems decreased because Indian weapon acquisition has increased. Moreover...India is looking to build the force with the best deals and it can be from any country.

I am not sure how much the past experience has played a role in these deals where Russia has lost..but if there is any such reason..then the Russians themselves are to be blamed...they had taken India for granted..which just showed that they were doing business and nothing else...starting from delays to increase in price to honey trapping Officers to using 2nd grade materials in our ships.

 

[illusion8]

Russia hasnt lost the market. The Russian share seems decreased because Indian weapon acquisition has increased. Moreover...India is looking to build the force with the best deals and it can be from any country.

I am not sure how much the past experience has played a role in these deals where Russia has lost..but if there is any such reason..then the Russians themselves are to be blamed...they had taken India for granted..which just showed that they were doing business and nothing else...starting from delays to increase in price to honey trapping Officers to using 2nd grade materials in our ships.

If one compares to delivery schedules of the US and Israel then on all counts Russia sucks, they consistently miss each and every delivery date.

 

[Sugarcane]

I see the military share of RUSSIA shrinking from high of 70% to alm ost down to just 25% in the next decade

The indengious indian industry & USA & israel and europe will take even slice each by 2020+ i see this being

Indian indengious 25%
USA 20%
Russia 20%
israel 15%
France 15%

Remaining 5%????

 

[Storm Force]

remaing 5%

Could be UK ukraine maybe czech republic maybe germany or brazil