Pakistan Navy to Purchase Frigates from China

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Don't see any arrival Till next year's election or later
Should just get , used ships for fill gap till new ships arrive

 

[Gryphon]

If they can at least get the 280 km APAR and 500 km OTOH, the Navy would have (1) the ability to guide the CM-302 or CX-1 AShM and (2) provide stand-off range surveillance in lieu of and/or complementing AEW&C. Of course, with the sensor suite in place they can fit LR-SAM later.

If PN has licensed C-602 as Zarb and C-802A as Harba, then IMO we won't get to see any other AShM on PN's surface ships acquired from China/Turkey. Licensing isn't free and deploying Zarb on two Azmat FAC's just doesn't cut it.

One may argue that DGMP is developing an indigenous AShM/LACM launcher, but, the Babur is a NESCOM thing.

 

[Blue Marlin]

If they can at least get the 280 km APAR and 500 km OTOH, the Navy would have (1) the ability to guide the CM-302 or CX-1 AShM and (2) provide stand-off range surveillance in lieu of and/or complementing AEW&C. Of course, with the sensor suite in place they can fit LR-SAM later.

it would a powerful L-band radar like the smart-L for it to guide missiles to it target. if not then a s-band would be needed. anti ship missiles would only need initial guidance as they have radar of their own. most ships have an l-d band radar for long range surveillance and tracking if advanced enough, and an s-band for searching and tracking.
and x band radar as a fire and control radar and jamming.

 

[YeBeWarned]

Assuming that each ship costs 350 million USD, that is 1.4 bn USD for four. The LR-SAM capability it could bring will be worth every penny spent.

Fleet level AD for F-22P, Alamgir, remaining Type 21 and possibly Ada corvettes as well.

I think type 21 will be retired once the new frigate start joining .. Hopefully PN will increase number to 6 for these type54A frigates .
And I am still hoping for I-class frigate from turkey cause swiftship corvette and ada is almost same in configuration.

 

[Gryphon]

I think type 21 will be retired once the new frigate start joining .. Hopefully PN will increase number to 6 for these type54A frigates .
And I am still hoping for I-class frigate from turkey cause swiftship corvette and ada is almost same in configuration.

Two Type 21's are equipped with Harpoon and the other two with LY-60 SAM. Two were retired, one with Harpoon (later fitted to PNS Alamgir) & the other with LY-60.

The primary role was ASW for all six. IMO, Ada corvettes (with or without VLS) are more suitable for this role.

I don't think Chinese frigates are meant to replace 4 out of 6 Type 21's. Those will increase surface fleet numbers.

No offense to Turks, but I-Class frigates don't offer anything over CSOC 4000 ton frigate. PN doesn't need a frigate that has only 16 VLS cells for American semi-active ESSM (though quad packable), no LACM integration possibility with Mk 41, American AShM and ASW torpedo.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Two Type 21's are equipped with Harpoon and the other two with LY-60 SAM. Two were retired, one with Harpoon (later fitted to PNS Alamgir) & the other with LY-60.

The primary role was ASW for all six. IMO, Ada corvettes (with or without VLS) are more suitable for this role.

I don't think Chinese frigates are meant to replace 4 out of 6 Type 21's. Those will increase surface fleet numbers.

No offense to Turks, but I-Class frigates don't offer anything over CSOC 4000 ton frigate. PN doesn't need a frigate that has only 16 VLS cells for American semi-active ESSM (though quad packable), no LACM integration possibility with Mk 41, American AShM and ASW torpedo.

The best route with the Turks is to go for the LF-2400. It seems like an inherently low cost design similar to the Gowind 2500 (inc. VLS). It'd be a good light-end complement to the 4,000-ton FFG.

As for supersonic AShM, the PN can buy a stock directly off the shelf. That or foot the bill for a new design, like getting Denel to revive the LRTM.

 

[JamD]

As for supersonic AShM, the PN can buy a stock directly off the shelf. That or foot the bill for a new design, like getting Denel to revive the LRTM.

No promises, but I have strong indications that an indigenous system is under development, to be revealed in 2018. Often, parallel development and procurement programs are run (as was the case with Burraq and Shahpar).

 

[ziaulislam]

Two Type 21's are equipped with Harpoon and the other two with LY-60 SAM. Two were retired, one with Harpoon (later fitted to PNS Alamgir) & the other with LY-60.

The primary role was ASW for all six. IMO, Ada corvettes (with or without VLS) are more suitable for this role.

I don't think Chinese frigates are meant to replace 4 out of 6 Type 21's. Those will increase surface fleet numbers.

No offense to Turks, but I-Class frigates don't offer anything over CSOC 4000 ton frigate. PN doesn't need a frigate that has only 16 VLS cells for American semi-active ESSM (though quad packable), no LACM integration possibility with Mk 41, American AShM and ASW torpedo.

type 21 are on borrowed time, what makes you think PN will keep them beyond 2025?(best case scenrio for Chinese frigates is 2025)
turkish deal is still not confirmed though likely, but will be taking more time than chinese frigates

 

[khanasifm]

type 21 are on borrowed time, what makes you think PN will keep them beyond 2025?(best case scenrio for Chinese frigates is 2025)
turkish deal is still not confirmed though likely, but will be taking more time than chinese frigates

Chinese built may come sooner but pak built may take longer Chinese yard pumping ships like there is no tomorrow but also depends on the contract
What is the source of 2025 date or just guessing ??

 

[ziaulislam]

Chinese built may come sooner but pak built may take longer Chinese yard pumping ships like there is no tomorrow but also depends on the contract
What is the source of 2025 date or just guessing ??

just a guess

 

[Gryphon]

Chinese built may come sooner but pak built may take longer Chinese yard pumping ships like there is no tomorrow but also depends on the contract
What is the source of 2025 date or just guessing ??

KS&EW can't compete with the Chinese on price. The reason 4x MPV's for PMSA are being built in China and only 2x MPV's at Karachi.

KS&EW is scheduled to start Hangor class submarine construction in 2020 and Milgem construction 'soon' (as per Rana Tanveer, Minister of DP). I suspect none of the Chinese frigates contracted will be assembled in Pakistan.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

KS&EW can't compete with the Chinese on price. The reason 4x MPV's for PMSA are being built in China and only 2x MPV's at Karachi.

KS&EW is scheduled to start Hangor class submarine construction in 2020 and Milgem construction 'soon' (as per Rana Tanveer, Minister of DP). I suspect none of the Chinese frigates contracted will be assembled in Pakistan.

IMO with the the first 4 Hangor SSP it would be wise to focus on bringing the integration work to Pakistan. That way, KSEW can independently (after receiving capacity building from CSOC) integrate PN's choice of subsystems.

Like Thailand and Algeria, it would give the PN the chance to select and integrate the Western subsystems it already has to those platforms. For example, Algeria had the Thales SMART-S Mk2 integrated to the C28A, while the Thai fitted a Mk41 VLS with ESSM to the 025T. The PN could standardize the subsystem suite of the Agosta 90B across the Hangor SSP.

The Chinese FFG might be a bit tougher if Chinese APAR and OTHR are sought. In that case, I wonder if it'd be possible to quietly procure the Russian Redut (naval S-350 with 60 km and 120 km range) for it.

 

[Gryphon]

As for supersonic AShM, the PN can buy a stock directly off the shelf. That or foot the bill for a new design, like getting Denel to revive the LRTM.

Chinese supersonic AShM's aren't proven designs like subsonic Harpoon & C-802. AFAIK, PLAN hasn't adopted those either and is equipping newer ships with YJ-83.

There are considerations of size (i.e. the impact on RCS) and cost as well.

The Chinese FFG might be a bit tougher if Chinese APAR and OTHR are sought. In that case, I wonder if it'd be possible to quietly procure the Russian Redut (naval S-350 with 60 km and 120 km range) for it.

As I have mentioned earlier, if naval HQ-9 is 6.8m (inc. booster), it will fit the new 7m Chinese VLS. If PN wants a third party missile which was designed according to their own VLS, then the feasibility, integration (with CMS, air sur. radar, VLS, etc) and testing costs have to be paid as well.

 

[Daniel808]

Would be nice to see this Frigate with Pakistani Naval Flag

 

[MastanKhan]

Chinese supersonic AShM's aren't proven designs like subsonic Harpoon & C-802. AFAIK, PLAN hasn't adopted those either and is equipping newer ships with YJ-83.

There are considerations of size (i.e. the impact on RCS) and cost as well.



As I have mentioned earlier, if naval HQ-9 is 6.8m (inc. booster), it will fit the new 7m Chinese VLS. If PN wants a third party missile which was designed according to their own VLS, then the feasibility, integration (with CMS, air sur. radar, VLS, etc) and testing costs have to be paid as well.

Hi,

The C-802 was not proven till it was---.

In this day and age---we still use the term "PROVEN" very losely---like it was the 50's and 60's---.

Today---with all technology available at hands---and a totally ruthless cycle of testing---re-testing---field testing---combat / battle conditions testing---there is nothing more that one can accomplish to say that the system is " not proven ".

Harpoon or the C802 just did not become proven like that---they went thru gruesome field testing as well to get deployed.

Same with CM400AKG.