No J-10B for PAF | A.C Khalid, calls for a focus on 5th generation platform instead.

[Informant]

u have lost any moral right to question anybody today.



40 million per bird without even engine change..................fucking scam

2 upgrades would net you a Rafale. Scam man, your politicians are the boss.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

My friend I have a great deal of respect for you because of your quality posts. And I know that you are a serious poster. Forget for a moment that you are from India and that I am from Pakistan. Now read his posts and you would see that he was being very stubborn. Irfan Sahib, Munir, I addressed his posts and tried to explain the relevant points. But the quality of his posts kept going down. I agree that quality of language was an issue from other posters too, but none was being as stubborn as him. He has a history of such behavior, as evident from negative ratings already on record, and the rating that I gave him took into account this background. It was not as though he was not fore-warned. He brought this upon himself. Munir has been very hard on him, yes. But even if most of the ratings are overturned by Webby (as should be done), some would still stick because he deserved them. Disagreement is welcome, but stubbornness coupled with lack of understanding and bad language????

I understand to a point what ur saying.I read the topic again.

''do u understand that we have already paid 300 million$ for design phase of pakfa??
and do u understand that we have selected rafale with a contract to be signed shortly...confirmed by both sides??
but all i see on the pakistani side is between the lines bullshit.
i countered on jf-17 and j-10b differences but none,,,least of all u,gave a clear answer.its people like u who are trolls and comparing j-10b with jf-17 and showing ur supreme stupidity time and again.''

Yes this above post perhaps was trolling and could have gotten negative rating,but the others he got were not deserved.Because he didn't use abusive language in them nor did he insult anyone's race,religion,ethnicity,family which are serious violations.And he didn't exactly go off topic either.On the quality of language that didn't start with him as u saw.He-man is naturally stubborn,headstrong and deviant member.He has posted several threads in Indian defence forum blasting rafale,mirage upgrade and several other defects in IAF which didn't particularly endear him to people-and he even got accused of being false flagger,but he just doesn't make a blanket statement and leave-he usually tries to prove his point(Succesfully or unsuccessfully).He does irritate people,but i think 10 negative ratings is overreaction to someone who irritates title holders but hasn't broken any major rules,he could have been called a troll,lacking understanding of opposing POV or simply given link to jf-17 info pool or ignored.Except for above post that would probably have been enough.People like auz,batman often go into indian threads to make sudden blanket statement which irritate lots of indian members..they don't get 10 negative ratings.
Good thing is mods seem to have taken notice and both this post and informant's one have been removed.So with that i think we are thankfully nearing the end of this episode.That's all i had to say.

 

[Informant]

I disagree that a mig-29k is useless and its crying...Well.Thank you.

Mig 29 are a fatigue-prone plane. Not doubting it's capabilities but they are repair intensive and their downtime/turnaround time is very high along with the costs associated with it.

This is factual. I do not get your point.

Edit: If you meant Indian Migs after upgrades, then yes they're formidable but still maintanance prone/heavy/intensive.

u don't know the stuff that goes into a mig-29 k
its all foreign

israeli rwr's ,ukranian jammers and a radar thats better than both klj-7 and apg-66v9 allegedly while also having an irst(albeit not a very good one)

No doubt after upgrades you have turned the plane into a formidable craft, but the RCS is still huge that works to our benefit fortunately

 

[he-man]

Mig 29 are a fatigue-prone plane. Not doubting it's capabilities but they are repair intensive and their downtime/turnaround time is very high along with the costs associated with it.

This is factual. I do not get your point.

the point is its ecm suite is better than anything u have,,as simple as that and on top of that its a proven dogfighter.

 

[Informant]

the point is its ecm suite is better than anything u have,,as simple as that and on top of that its a proven dogfighter.

ECM better than Block 52's? Doubt it.

 

[he-man]

Mig 29 are a fatigue-prone plane. Not doubting it's capabilities but they are repair intensive and their downtime/turnaround time is very high along with the costs associated with it.

This is factual. I do not get your point.



No doubt after upgrades you have turned the plane into a formidable craft, but the RCS is still huge that works to our benefit fortunately

ucannot take advantage of that rcs with small radars like klj-7 and apg-66v9...............u need better radars,,,till that time mig-29 wil be filled with zhuk-ae aesa

ECM better than Block 52's? Doubt it.

then post whats there in block 52,,,the problem with usa planes is we don't have any info on whats inside??!!
i cannot find one single source on apg-66v9,,,,,not one!

 

[Kloitra]

No doubt after upgrades you have turned the plane into a formidable craft, but the RCS is still huge that works to our benefit fortunately

That depends on ECM suite. Even if you can see but can't get a lock on it, its useless.

 

[Informant]

ucannot take advantage of that rcs with small radars like klj-7 and apg-66v9...............u need better radars,,,till that time mig-29 wil be filled with zhuk-ae aesa

Yes but having huge RCS is at disadvantage, smaller radars love huge RCS bro. Easier for the small ones to detect as compared to something like Rafael. Long time till you guys have 5th gen assets plus Rafael. We got time as well. Qualitatively we will be a match, but not quantitatively. Same is the case with you and China just as ours is with yours.

 

[Manticore]

Mig 29k has low radar cross-section

 

[Kloitra]

ECM better than Block 52's? Doubt it.

Possible, with more engine power.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Mig 29 are a fatigue-prone plane. Not doubting it's capabilities but they are repair intensive and their downtime/turnaround time is very high along with the costs associated with it.

This is factual. I do not get your point.

How does that make them useless?Yes it makes them more difficult to maintain than say f-16,but do u mean to say that IAF's premier air defence fighter on the border is mostly bluff because it spends its time in maintainence.Thats a rather arrogant assumption.Especially on brand new upgrade or built fighters.On the cost issue,its half that of a mki.Also we are upgrading existing mig-29s for IAF and it was dirt cheap compared to mirage upgrade.On mig-29k -we don't have another option to use in vikramaditya,mig-29k is best naval fighter russia has.So take these facts into consideration as well plz.

 

[Informant]

ucannot take advantage of that rcs with small radars like klj-7 and apg-66v9...............u need better radars,,,till that time mig-29 wil be filled with zhuk-ae aesa



then post whats there in block 52,,,the problem with usa planes is we don't have any info on whats inside??!!
i cannot find one single source on apg-66v9,,,,,not one!

That is how US and most others work. India is very transparent ( not completely but relatively). This works in our favor. And so do we, we do not disclose after some time. Policies really and Block 52 ECM is something for Indians to be vary off. The people i speak to sing praises about it's abilities.

How does that make them useless?Yes it makes them more difficult to maintain than say f-16,but do u mean to say that IAF's premier air defence fighter on the border is mostly bluff because it spends its time in maintainence.Thats a rather arrogant assumption.Especially on brand new upgrade or built fighters.On the cost issue,its half that of a mki.Also we are upgrading existing mig-29s for IAF and it was dirt cheap compared to mirage upgrade.On mig-29k -we don't have another option to use in vikramaditya,mig-29k is best naval fighter russia has.So take these facts into consideration as well plz.

I edited the post, i thought you referred to plain M-29s. Not the upgraded version. So no need to gun for me.

Possible, with more engine power.

New ones are enough to sustain for as long as required

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

I doubt ECM will be better than f-16,.this i must admit.Unless we had israeli stuff in it.If we used the elta jammer or advnaced version of it i would have been more comfortable.

 

[he-man]

its not as bad now after upgrades,,,but truth can never be found out as we have no idea whats there in block 52

I doubt ECM will be better than f-16,.this i must admit.Unless we had israeli stuff in it.If we used the elta jammer or advnaced version of it i would have been more comfortable.

Shown below is the OMUT internally-mounted EW jammer from Ukraine’s Radionix Ltd for the IN’s MiG-29Ks and MiG-29KUBs, plus the ELTA Systems-built EL/L-8222 jammer configured for escort jamming purposes.

so yeah it contains both israeli and ukranian jammers

 

[EagleEyes]

Dont derail threads or you will be thread banned/neg rated...possibly banned.