MiG-29K planes face operation deficiencies: CAG

[Windjammer]

The USMC does not operate the Sea Harrier.

They both operate on same principals.

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Extra Long post

Beyond this
As per the protocol of the 16th Indo-Russian Inter Governmental
Commission – Military Technical Cooperation (IRIGSC-MTC)
(September 2014), un-serviceability of the simulator had prevented
its optimum utilization for training of IN pilots.
In reply to an audit query, Directorate of Aviation Projects Management
(DAPM) admitted (December 2014) that the simulator was assessed to be
unsuitable for Carrier Qualification (CQ) simulator training for pilots, as
the visuals did not support the profile which required high accuracy and
fidelity. As of 31st July 2015, the OEM was still in the process of
software corrections as required to make the simulator as realistic as
aircraft.
+++

@Abingdonboy @MilSpec @nair @Vergennes @Taygibay @Joe Shearer @AUSTERLITZ @anant_s @randomradio


Chief issues i read are

1. IAC1 coming on 2023 and Mig29K are already here.
2. Before the option clause of 29 Mig 29K were exercised the capability of 16 Mig29K with Vikramaditya were NOT TESTED.
3. The service life of RD-33MK engine fitted on MiG29K/KUB is 10 years/4000 hours with an overhaul life of 1000 hours.
4. Audit observed (December 2014) that as of September 2014, a total of 65 engines (42 with 21 aircraft and 23 spare) had been accepted. However, since induction in February 2010, 40 engines (representing 62 per cent of 65 engines) had been withdrawn from service/rejected due to design related defects/deficiencies.
5. The issue had serious flight safety implications, since in-flight engine defects had led to ten cases of single engine landings.
6. RAC MiG had forwarded a list of 17 modifications which they had scheduled to complete on all engines held in India by November 2014. However, as of September 2015, it was seen that four modifications (out of 17) had been implemented by RAC MiG on all engines and balance 13 modifications would be implemented as and when engines were sent to OEM at Russia for overhaul/repair.
7. In response to audit query about status of repairs on engines withdrawn, the Indian Navy replied (November 2015) that repairs of defective engines were being taken up with RAC MiG based on warranty/non-warranty basis, adding that repair of non-warranty engines were being progressed under IHQ MoD (N) indents.
8. The fact remains that up to August 2015, the number of engines withdrawn from service/rejected was 46, indicating that even as the RD- 33 MK engine was considered an advancement over the engine of the MiG29, its reliability remains questionable.
9. Major defects arose during first (July 2012) and subsequent deck trials of the MiG 29K/KUB on Admiral Gorshkov as reported (July 2013) by Headquarters Western Naval Command, Mumbai to Directorate of Naval Air Staff. The Russian Aircraft Corporation (RAC) certified (May 2014) that aircraft performance of MiG29K/KUB aircraft under tested conditions of INS Vikramaditya operations mainly conformed to the assigned specifications, however added that weaknesses were revealed during flight tests, which were to be eliminated. Directorate of Air Support Equipment informed (June 2014) RAC MiG that numerous defects pertaining to failure of airframe parts had occurred during deck operations despite modifications
10. The reliability of the fly by wire was very poor, ranging from 3.5 per cent to 7.5 per cent between 01 July 2012 and 30 June 2014 and measures were to be taken by RAC MiG to improve reliability of the system.
11. The Full Mission simulator remained unserviceable (July 2014) due to defects in three out of nine visual channels and was being used for training for basic flying profile akin to a procedure trainer
12. Low servicability point already covered
13. The service life of the aircraft is 6000 hrs or 25 calendar years whichever is earlier, as seen from the Option clause contract (March 2010). Out of 19 aircraft delivered up to November 2015, 12 had been built up, with time taken for build up ranging from two months to fifteen months. The contract did not stipulate any timeframe for completion of build up/assembly. Therefore, the delays in build up would reduce the service life, thereby impacting the operational life of the aircraft.

Looking at this i can point the following

1. Aircraft delivered between 2012-16 and IAC1 being readied by 2023 implies these jets will have useful life of anywhere between 11-15 years max before a deep overhaul will be required for them to function.
2. Its beyond doubt now that Indian Navy will opt for Rafale M (or F35 in worst case) and will give up on Russian fighters in coming years at least in Indian Navy.
3. All these points will also affect other procurement relationship in terms of fighter jets surely.

 

[John Reese]

You in an Indian issue called out Pakistani fan boys yet I'm the one flame baiting, and since you have the habit of cherry picking, the subject then in discussion was PAF which was actually awarded by PW for flying F-16 for 100 000 incident free hours.
And now since you are blaming Russian equipment, when i posted similar news earlier, the guns were trained elsewhere.

Im saying the Mig-29 K is OEM of RAC corp russia And Purchased of Off-Self How Its India Fault Since We not overhauled Single Mig-29 K Locally

Availability of F-16 70% in USAF with Multiple crashers and Non Stop Spares Supply
Whole Industrial base

Source
https://books.google.co.in/books?id...#v=onepage&q=f-16 serviceability usaf&f=false

Pakistan 100% With Minimum Spares Supply Critical Norms on Usage

 

[Abingdonboy]

They both operate on same principals.

The AV-8B Harrier II of the USMC is quite different from (and more advanced than ) the BAE (formerly Hawker Siddely) Sae Harrier the IN had operated.

 

[Allen Iverson]

I was referring to the comment of "PLA to bear That Cost". If you have evidence that shows PLA is bearing the cost of low serviceability of Russian equipment, feel free to enlighten me.

Mr Genius, for that point only our friend has referred to the fact that, China doesn't have free media which can bring such issues to the light, like India have.. Also China doesn't have or it doesn't reveal any centralised auditing authority reports Like the CAG reports for India, which can bring every single deficiency in the accounts and numbers to the light.. Hence no Proof.. There is no proof known to the world because there is no one who has got access to such news.. That doesn't mean that are no Proofs.. whole world knows Russian aviation Industry is limping to support with spares and after sales support for its Aircrafts sold to other countries, and China isn't exception to that..

There is no such a logical connection.

Logic is there, but when there is no sanity to accept logic, of course in that case Logic won't make sense..

 

[PARIKRAMA]

The IAC-1 will be in service from 2020 (it will be in sea trails from late 2018).

That i did observe my friend and my date which i have quoted many times is Dec 6 2018. In the same report another section following table is there

Notice point 9 ..

and then this

and this

so it is safe to say CAG has estimated an outer periphery of 2023 based on evidence in front of them and lack of substantiation by CSL.

We may see by earlier then 2023 subject to swift action by all concerned parties

 

[Taygibay]

Thanks PariK mate for that full report.

When even the simulator doesn't work, I for one would refuse to pilot the jet itself.
I mean, you don't send a 15s sprinter to the Olympics for the 100m dash, do you?
It's really rare that one who always fails in practice runs succeeds in real life.

Good day, Tay.

 

[nang2]

Logic is there, but when there is no sanity to accept logic, of course in that case Logic won't make sense..

What you mean is that logic is nothing but a formality. Of course, what I really said was "logical". When I say some argument is logical, I mean it makes sense.

 

[ashok321]

Mahinga roye ek baar - sasta roye baar baar
At 33 million a pc, what would IN expect?
A flawless diamond costs more why?

 

[Beast]

I haven't heard about PLA complaining serviceability of Russian equipment, have you?

Yes, we have but fortunately, we are able to replace all parts of Russian made plane by Chinese made. Even the engines of our J-11B is replace with Chinese domestic WS-10A engines.

 

[Allen Iverson]

What you mean is that logic is nothing but a formality. Of course, what I really said was "logical". When I say some argument is logical, I mean it makes sense.

Oh, then according to you Chinese logic, things that are completely non sense are perfectly sensible??? Great world to live in..

Yes, we have but fortunately, we are able to replace all parts of Russian made plane by Chinese made. Even the engines of our J-11B is replace with Chinese domestic WS-10A engines.

Really?? WS-10A??

 

[nang2]

Mr Genius, for that point only our friend has referred to the fact that, China doesn't have free media which can bring such issues to the light, like India have.. Also China doesn't have or it doesn't reveal any centralised auditing authority reports Like the CAG reports for India, which can bring every single deficiency in the accounts and numbers to the light.. Hence no Proof.. There is no proof known to the world because there is no one who has got access to such news.. That doesn't mean that are no Proofs.. whole world knows Russian aviation Industry is limping to support with spares and after sales support for its Aircrafts sold to other countries, and China isn't exception to that..

You are right. "That doesn't mean that are no Proofs.". But, that also doesn't mean there is proof, either. Therefore, bringing something like that into any argument is pointless. That was why I asked because someone brought PLA in, which, to me, is pointless.

Oh, then according to you Chinese logic, things that are completely non sense are perfectly sensible??? Great world to live in..

I simply asked for evidence that is sound and solid, not something assumed, guessed or dreamed up. If that is too much to ask for our Indian friends, I will refrain myself from now on.

 

[John Reese]

Mahinga roye ek baar - sasta roye baar baar
At 33 million a pc, what would IN expect?
A flawless diamond costs more why?

View attachment 320877

Your Analogy is flawed Check the
Eurofighter and Tornado - less than 50%
https://warisboring.com/germany-s-air-force-is-falling-apart-d06236a1de7d

You are right. "That doesn't mean that are no Proofs.". But, that also doesn't mean there is proof, either. Therefore, bringing something like that into any argument is pointless. That was why I asked because someone brought PLA in, which, to me, is pointless.

That Because your CCP Govt Regime Non-Transparent Structure are And Blocked access to Actual Cost assessment

Here how Non Transparent Regime Works

USAF Serviceability History Till Present


By Miguel Vasconcelos, United States Department of Transportation, Federal Aviation Administration

https://books.google.co.in/books?id=LyBQBwAAQBAJ&pg=SA2-PA45&lpg=SA2-PA45&dq=f-16+serviceability+usaf&source=bl&ots=5S1F15F1OF&sig=VVW7CBeiS_HKHLqNhhB1eqmS1dU&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjdoOmax5HOAhUKMI8KHZ8OD9AQ6AEINTAF#v=onepage&q=f-16 serviceability usaf&f=false

 

[ashok321]

https://warisboring.com/germany-s-air-force-is-falling-apart-d06236a1de7d

Your URL is faulty or phony.
Refuses to open via Opera or Edge.

 

[nang2]

That Because your CCP Govt Regime Non-Transparent Structure are And Blocked asses to Actual Cost assessment

Here how Non Transparent Regime Works

USAF Serviceability History Till Present


By Miguel Vasconcelos, United States Department of Transportation, Federal Aviation Administration

https://books.google.co.in/books?id=LyBQBwAAQBAJ&pg=SA2-PA45&lpg=SA2-PA45&dq=f-16+serviceability+usaf&source=bl&ots=5S1F15F1OF&sig=VVW7CBeiS_HKHLqNhhB1eqmS1dU&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjdoOmax5HOAhUKMI8KHZ8OD9AQ6AEINTAF#v=onepage&q=f-16 serviceability usaf&f=false

If you like this logic, you can make all kinds of ridiculous claims based on it. For example, the probability of China doing (beling) <blank> is high because of the lack of free press (or, non-transparent structure, whatever you prefer). Fill whatever you like in the blank.

As non-transparent structure in Chinese military, well, Chinese faithfully follow the instructions from SunZi's "The Art of War". It is not only recommended but also a necessity for underdogs. China is clearly an underdog.