so, IMO tfx was as risky, you know how I felt about the tfx not too long ago, I think my piece is still on quwa?, the project seemed doomed also, major suppliers were dropping out, the Turks were in political turmoil, they hadn’t dedicated any significant share of funding towards it, I had more hope for azm than I did tfx, so I completely understand why it may not have been selected at the time. I still am somewhat skeptical about it, just less so after seeing their press release and rather realistic expectations, unlike someone *cough cough* ex acm who was going off on a tangent about directed energy weapons and allah jaane aur kya. So I think the real advantage in tfx lies in its somewhat, relatively underwhelming expectations(vs the f35), which could mean we do actually see it come to fruition, then developed further eventually.
At the risk of lengthening the off-topic discussion, let me say that Turkish struggle was exactly what suited Pakistan. You join a struggling program and commit resources after negotiating an advantageous position to create a good bargain. I have always agreed with
@Quwa on his contention that a much better course of action would have been to join an active program rather than marching alone into the unknown.
Pakistan severely lacks industrial base & technical know-how; the culture (both government & most private industry) is hostile to innovative thinking; army officers make policy & expect cushy jobs after retirement & get their way anyway & however. We have insular thinking where civilians (thought-leaders, politicians, policy-makers, industrialists, engineers, scientists, etc...) are irrelevant. How can a civilian like me hope to contribute anything meaningful? There simply is no avenue available.
While this is the situation in Pakistan, India has invested in indigenous programs & learnt via their mistakes (Tejas, Dhruv, missile tech, etc...) and established a well-staffed infrastructure in partnership with business leaders.
Case in point: when I was at Georgia Tech in early-mid nineties, two of the senior professors of fiber science were Indian - Dr. Satish Kumar & Dr. Desai (?). There were at least two Indians completing their PhDs in high performance composite materials, while I was the lone Pakistani who took a few courses in composites. There were a number of Pakistani students studying Electrical / Electronic engineering, Civil Engineering (not Structures, but water resources :-\ ), a couple of students were studying Environmental Engineering also. There were none in aerospace (GA Tech was nationally ranked #3 in AE), and one airforce officer in Industrial & Systems Engineering (GA Tech was ranked #1). Most fat Colonels were enrolled in Civil Engineering & took their sweet time getting their PhDs while their wives worked, earned, & saved. Except two people, I do not know of a single person associated with Army or PAF who made any positive contribution after their subsequent return to Pakistan - the lone exception from the Army being Dr. Shoaib who completed his PhD in good time & was well-regarded among us. In short, for the resources spent what was the outcome?
JF-17 could be the success that leads us to expecting miracles because we generally got it right this one time. PAF is the only airforce that manufactures its own aircraft via PAC. Is it realistic to expect that PAF by itself can create a whole top-notch industry? I don't think so. JF-17 taught us the value of partnering with someone & that should be the lesson learned here, not the notion that PAF can (or should) do it all. There is no aircraft that can do it all, & there is no organization that can be everything to everyone. Unless there is a partnership with own civvies and our international friends, there is precious little hope.
).
