Islamic Union

[Omar1984]

We've all seen how a European Union benefited the European countries.

Some of Pakistan's national heros like Allama Iqbal always called for Muslim unity.

The formation of Pakistan was for Muslim majority areas to have their own nation, so its natural for Pakistanis to want a union with Muslim majority countries.

Its not going to happen anytime soon but we can work on it by working on the existing Unions or organizations we have with Muslim majority countries and build on it so we can also have a European-like Union with countries who share the same ideologies and beliefs as us.

 

[R.A.W.]

The GWOT is a thinly veiled assault on Muslims -- all Muslims. It has legitimized persecution of Muslims worldwide, from 12 year old French schoolgirls, to the Muslim youth who faces job discrimination in Europe, to the bearded old man or hijab wearing woman who gets harrassed when they go to the supermarket.

You may not sympathize, or believe it, but it doesn't change the reality of what has been happening to Muslims in the last 8 years.

The fact of Islamic terrorism, both against Muslims and non-Muslims, does not justify the things I mentioned. Muslim countries are blackmailed and put under sanctions time and again to suit the political agenda of powerful countries. Countries which base their foreign policies on their religion (Israel, USA, Britain) against Muslims.

Ok so going by you do you think Islamic nations coming together would be in a state to wage a war against US if it tries to attack Iraq or other similar country.........

Another thing is will the dictators be ready to come down from power for the cause of Islamic union

Will the rich like Arabs share its finances with the war trodden countries?

Another problem would be, down the line Arabs consider themselves superior to Muslims in the Indian subcontinent. Will they be ready to treated at par with everyone else?

How the problems of Shia/Sunni be solved?

 

[R.A.W.]

We've all seen how a European Union benefited the European countries.

Some of Pakistan's national heros like Allama Iqbal always called for Muslim unity.

The formation of Pakistan was for Muslim majority areas to have their own nation, so its natural for Pakistanis to want a union with Muslim majority countries.

Its not going to happen anytime soon but we can work on it by working on the existing Unions or organizations we have with Muslim majority countries and build on it so we can also have a European-like Union.

See Omar we are not opposing the union it is more of cost/benifit analysis?

What my very initial post was that even Indians should try to join this as this will serve as a beneficiary factor for the majority of Indian muslims.

 

[Comet]

See Omar we are not opposing the union it is more of cost/benifit analysis?

What my very initial post was that even Indians should try to join this as this will serve as a beneficiary factor for the majority of Indian muslims.

Indian Muslims cannot join this for the very reason that Indian Muslims make up a very small population of India. We are talking about combining states here not people, if you take people than probably all the countries of the world would join( as almost all the countries have Muslim populations).

 

[SeaGull]

Its back

you have got to be kidding - this ain't the one - the one with the bald head and a defiant look.

 

[Developereo]

Ok so going by you do you think Islamic nations coming together would be in a state to wage a war against US if it tries to attack Iraq or other similar country.........

Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent -- Salvor Hardin
(From Asimov's Foundation series, )

No, the idea is to become large enough to deter military adventures by the US. A country with a billion people and $7 trillion GDP would have a lot of clout to play superpowers against each other.

Another thing is will the dictators be ready to come down from power for the cause of Islamic union

Will the rich like Arabs share its finances with the war trodden countries?

Another problem would be, down the line Arabs consider themselves superior to Muslims in the Indian subcontinent. Will they be ready to treated at par with everyone else?

How the problems of Shia/Sunni be solved?

All answered in my previous post"
http://www.defence.pk/forums/strategic-geopolitical-issues/34735-islamic-union-3.html#post490754

 

[Developereo]

See Omar we are not opposing the union it is more of cost/benifit analysis?

What my very initial post was that even Indians should try to join this as this will serve as a beneficiary factor for the majority of Indian muslims.

That's a slippery slope, best avoided. If Indian Muslims, then why not Chinese Muslims, or Thai Muslims, or...?

The solution is to provide a strong enough international body that the countries find it in their interest not to mistreat their Muslim citrizens. Aside from basic human rights, this would also be in their national interest to maintain good relations with the Islamic Union.

 

[R.A.W.]

That's a slippery slope, best avoided. If Indian Muslims, then why not Chinese Muslims, or Thai Muslims, or...?

The solution is to provide a strong enough international body that the countries find it in their interest not to mistreat their Muslim citrizens. Aside from basic human rights, this would also be in their national interest to maintain good relations with the Islamic Union.

So what will be the diffrence between OIC and this body

 

[SeaGull]

So what will be the diffrence between OIC and this body

The OIC is an impotent Bull -- This is supposed to have some sting to it.

 

[Developereo]

So what will be the diffrence between OIC and this body

This would be more like the EU. Common currency, no borders,
military alliance, one diplomatic entity, etc.

A US style union is unfeasible because the countries have established national identities, different languages, and long histories with a lot of ethnic/national pride.

Anyway, there's almost zero chance of it happening -- at least until the oil runs out. There is more chance of EU+Russia or China+DPRK+SK+Japan or even India+Pakistan confederation. The Muslim countries are just too divided, and not one of them seems to have a unifying, visionary leader.

 

[greatsequence]

A very very sweet dream. In US you have people with different color, in EU different languages and this is also true for every other union in this world. The gulf arab countries are just one you can not find any difference they look the same the speak the same they dress the same but instead of uniting they are stuck as "sultans" and "kings" of "states" which are no bigger then cities.
If they can somehow unite you may dream of a bigger union.

 

[Musalman]

Not possible coz there is only one political party which is working toward that goal, i.e. Hizb i Tahrir, which is banned in most of the Muslim countries including Pakistan.
Even Arabs with same ethicinicty and language can not unite together, i doubt they will unite with us and the Bangladeshis. I think goal should be West Asian East Asian and African Economic union. We being part of East Asia should be part of that union. But union is impossible unless India Pakistan and China resolve their differences.

 

[gogbot]

The GWOT is a thinly veiled assault on Muslims -- all Muslims. It has legitimized persecution of Muslims worldwide, from 12 year old French schoolgirls, to the Muslim youth who faces job discrimination in Europe, to the bearded old man or hijab wearing woman who gets harrassed when they go to the supermarket.

You may not sympathize, or believe it, but it doesn't change the reality of what has been happening to Muslims in the last 8 years.

The fact of Islamic terrorism, both against Muslims and non-Muslims, does not justify the things I mentioned. Muslim countries are blackmailed and put under sanctions time and again to suit the political agenda of powerful countries. Countries which base their foreign policies on their religion (Israel, USA, Britain) against Muslims.

The purpose of an Islamic union would be to form an entity that is large enough to resist Western blackmail and sanctions, and which has enough clout to hold the West accountable for its mistreatment of its Muslim citizens.

you have the same rights as every other citizen dont you.
Racism and intolerance is existent in every society, Its human nature to fear what we cant understand. And people act out at that fear differently.
Its cold hard reality.

I dont blame Muslims for Islamic terrorism.
I frankly just blame region, all religion.
Faith in god is a belief. I can tolerate, its your life to do with as you please.
But the moment some one thinks they are entitled by god to interfere with someone else's life, its crossing the line.

the Christians created the dark ages where scientific progress was stopped for nearly 800 years.

The crusades

Religions ideals have never mixed well with politics. Our History shows how religion has always twisted politics to service it.

Are you sure that this Islamic union will be any different.

And why do Pak always talk about Muslim world this and Muslim world that.

Why cant you just talk about the world?
Why do the Muslims have to be separate from the world?

Where did this notion of the Muslim world come from.
are you deliberately trying to isolate your self from the rest of the world.

Do you guys despise the rest of humanity so much you want your own planet.

You can say Muslim community but no , you say Muslim world.

You attach religion to almost every aspect of your nation.

the Islamic bomb for example
Referring to your soldiers as Muslim warriors, well i know they technically are but you done have to emphasize they are Muslim all the time. we kinds get it

you see the whole world with those religious lense.
Its always Hindu this and Christian that.

All this segregation discrimination based on religious beliefs
It frankly is rather upsetting.

 

[greatsequence]

And why do Pak always talk about Muslim world this and Muslim world that.

Why cant you just talk about the world?
Why do the Muslims have to be separate from the world?

For The same reason why the west talks about the west.
For The same reason why turkey does not get into the European union.
For The same reason why Palestine and kashmir are not solved in decades and east timur is independent in years.

We are part of this world and thats what we have learnt that "might is right" so better to get some might one way or the other.

 

[Al-zakir]

Is it possible to build something like Muslim Union with Islamic States...Islamic Version of Soviet Union..I often hear this idea from a lot of people so i was wondering if it is possible..?The Muslims countries are rich with resources etc.It can become the richest and most strong union ever created..We would have a proper Islamic army, air force, navy.We could liberate Palestine.No western nation will dare to attack it but the question is Can Muslims unite like this or Shia-Sunni divide will not let this happen.Also Indians please don't troll here.

Thank for bring out this subject. One of my favorite subject. Islamic unity is the demand of time if we are to survive with dignity. I don't see why it not possible when We are all Muslims, we believe in one Almighty Allah, we believe in one Prophet (Sallallaho Alaihe wa Aal-e-hee Wasallam) and we all have the book of Allah i.e. Qur'an.

I would like to emphasize the Muslim unity in the light of Quran and Sunnah.

"These are the foundational principles of Islam. The Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet (PBUH) require Muslims to work for the unity of the Ummah. Muslims are required to be merciful towards each other (The Quran (48:29)) and be like the body where if any part hurts the whole body should feel the pain (Hadith)."

" And hold fast all together by the rope which Allah (stretches out for you) and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favor on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love so that by His grace ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the pit of fire and He saved you from it. Thus doth Allah make his signs clear to you: that ye may be guided". (Verse 013, Al-i-Imran).


"Qur’an says that those who create differences in the Deen (Islam) are among the Mushrikun:

"Be not among the Mushrikun i.e., those who create differences in Deen (Isalm) and become sects. Each (sectarian) party quite content with itself (that it is following the correct path)." (30:32)"

"And those who create division in Deen (Islam) and become divided into sects, O Prophet (PBUH)! You have no part in them in the least." (6:159)


Hadis e nabi(PHUB)


The Prophet (PBUH) is reported to have said:

"Anyone who gets even one feet away from the Ummah has taken out the Islamic yoke from his neck, even if he prays and fasts."

One obstacle we must overcome in order to form a strong and solid Islamic unity. We must give up local Nationalism. Nationalism based on country is mushriki concept. Muslims of subcontinent can initiate this noble process and rest will follow Insh'allah. We Muslims in subcontinent suffered the most thus we can not look other way around and hope things will be fixed by itself.