Iranian Missiles | News and Discussions

[tsunset]

I don't think Russia will believe Shahed-131/136 would be sufficient for a trade, although it's quite apparent that Russia is learning or has already learned the manufacturing process and is constantly receiving components for assembling these drones themselves. So it looks like an agreement was made to supply finished units, tech transfer, and production license, including facility construction. This agreement would be worth a few hundred million for sure.

Add in a few hundred BMs from 300 - 700 km range, and you can easily trade these for 2 dozen Su-35's.

Isn't there a limit of range for the sale to be considered "legal" to international law?

 

[Hack-Hook]

Isn't there a limit of range for the sale to be considered "legal" to international law?

that's a self inflicted range . otherwise we saw in Ukraine war they sold storm shadow to Ukraine which have nearly twice the range than that 300km limit

and Iran didn't sign that treaty

 

[SalarHaqq]

A transaction is not "gone through" until delivery of the product. Pen on paper is nice, but an agreement is done when the delivery is made and complete.

The delivery can be made but it can only be hidden for so long. Iran won't be able to hide Su-35's for long till it;s open source, and the moment Russia fires a Zolfiqar, they will be able to identify its flight characteristics to already existing telemetry data they have on Iranian BMs.

Except there's no evidence such a deal was ever struck in the first place. It's nothing but a rumor, and more likely than not a baseless one.

 

[Stryker1982]

Except there's no evidence such a deal was ever struck in the first place. It's nothing but a rumor, and more likely than not a baseless one.

Fair.

It's worth noting from officials have made it clear they do want to export missiles to countries, with export variants being made available. They know Russia is a prime customer at the moment. Aside from political reasons their would be little reason not to export to them. I think they should utilize this opportunity that will not be available 5-10 years from now, when Russia rebuilds its BMs, and more importantly, starts building ballistic missiles with more than 500km range.

 

[Stryker1982]

Isn't there a limit of range for the sale to be considered "legal" to international law?

Yeah, generally if you are a member of MCTR which most countries are, you cannot export Ballistic missiles over 300km range and 500kg payload.

Their is a UN resolution that "calls upon" Iran not to import or export missiles and related technology which expires in mid-October. Iran is not a member of MCTR as well, and Russia is no longer a member, so technically their are no violations of any agreements and it should be "legal" after October 18th.

that's a self inflicted range . otherwise we saw in Ukraine war they sold storm shadow to Ukraine which have nearly twice the range than that 300km limit

and Iran didn't sign that treaty

That's only for BMs, doesn't apply to storm shadows

 

[SalarHaqq]

Fair.

It's worth noting from officials have made it clear they do want to export missiles to countries, with export variants being made available. They know Russia is a prime customer at the moment. Aside from political reasons their would be little reason not to export to them. I think they should utilize this opportunity that will not be available 5-10 years from now, when Russia rebuilds its BMs, and more importantly, starts building ballistic missiles with more than 500km range.

Yes but barter deals, namely fighter jets in exchange for drones and missiles are rather unlikely or at least they've never been substantiated by any evidence.

 

[Hack-Hook]

That's only for BMs, doesn't apply to storm shadows

and how when it suited them they claimed it include iran drones

 

[Stryker1982]

Yes but barter deals, namely fighter jets in exchange for drones and missiles are rather unlikely or at least they've never been substantiated by any evidence.

Indeed, I've seen renewed media coverage about this, ever since the ISW a few days ago basically made a guess and said Iran might do a barter deal with Russia after October 18th, but their was no evidence for this. It was a mere guess from analysis's but people have taken it as confirmed news.

and how when it suited them they claimed it include iran drones

I see what you mean lol.

 

[tsunset]

but people have taken it as confirmed news.

This is the whole forum's problem

 

[925boy]

Yes but barter deals, namely fighter jets in exchange for drones and missiles are rather unlikely or at least they've never been substantiated by any evidence.

Just because they are rare doesnt mean that wasnt the deal Russia and Iran agreed to. Actually, why were those rumors SO STRONG of a barter deal between Russia and Iran- Su-35s for drones or/and missiles? Simnce the rumors were so strong and persistent, there is likely some truth in it ("where there is smoke there is fire"), but i'm unsure what specifics could be true or untrue in the deal, but i do think Russia and Iran made a deal, but Russia is unwilling or unable to execute its portion early/on time/ at a timing that Iran "likes".

I think Russia will buy (if Russia hasnt bought and stored already) Iranian BMs if and when:

1. Russia NEEDs BMs in the Ukraine war (other than Iskanders for ex.).
2. Russian production capacity for domestic BM production is too slow for the war's demands.
3. Russian war finances are very tight - so bargain merchant -of-death weapons like Iranian BMs will be too attactive and needed for the war.
4. When the UN embargo on Iranian BM exports expires- Russia still cares about the laws/agreements it is a party too, esp. as a UNSC member.

 

[Mehdipersian]

Russia 'expects' Fateh-110 and Zolfaghar and other missiles from Iran

UNSCR 2231’s missile restrictions ban Iran from exporting missiles with a range of 300 kilometers or more.[33] Ukranian and Israeli intelligence reports indicate that Russia seeks to acquire Iran’s Fateh-110 and Zolfaghar ballistic missiles, both of which have ranges of 300 kilometers or...

pdf.defence.pk

 

[SalarHaqq]

Just because they are rare doesnt mean that wasnt the deal Russia and Iran agreed to.

Maybe. If massive Iranian missile deliveries to Russia took place, then they could have formed part of some barter arrangement in exchange for fighter jets. Point being that the latter are overpriced compared to the drones Iran furnished previously. At a price tag of a couple tens of thousands of Euros, Iran would have had to supply the equivalent of more than 50000 Shahed-136 UAV's for a force of some 50 Su-35's, which is unrealistic. Artillery rounds wouldn't make so much of a difference either.

Ballistic missiles could potentially change this equation but they too would need to be exported in really consequent numbers, read literally in the thousands to finance 50 Su-35's or even a significant reduction on the bill. If Iran bills Russia half a million for each missile, 900 missiles would amount to just 450 million i.e. less than a quarter of what those Su-35 would cost.

Any degree of barter would make Iran save money due to the profit margin on exported goods, so it'd be beneficial at any rate.

Actually, why were those rumors SO STRONG of a barter deal between Russia and Iran- Su-35s for drones or/and missiles? Simnce the rumors were so strong and persistent, there is likely some truth in it ("where there is smoke there is fire"),

This however is not something one can rely on. There are so many false things about Iran the public at large considers as factual, due to persistent disinformation efforts by Iran's resourceful enemies who control the mainstream media.

Which is why I think it's preferable never to take such rumors for granted.

 

[tsunset]

A relic of the cold war, BGM-109G, ground based Tomahawk launcher

China CJ-10 GLCM TEL

With the unveiling of multiple cruise missiles such as Paveh and the one shown to Choigu in Iran, i think Iran could make and benefit from TELs like above for GLCM launch with 3/4 canisters, NK unveiling its own, this is ergonomic, saves time to launch a quick barrage of CMs, Iran has the truck TEL for Ghadir and Abu Mahdi, their advantage to pass as a civilian truck, but larger vehicles such as above for barrage attack, something like Bastion and CJ-10, made for Iran's cruise missiles, conventional ordnance.

I really admire China concerning missiles, i think it is the one that makes the most diversified missiles arsenal as Iran does too

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

Iran is moving around a hundred ballistic missiles and other preparations

 

[Deez Nutz]

Deart Ladies and Germs:

This is how your new JCPOA will look like when you negotioate without building the bomb:
Under JCOA 2.0: (Key points)
-Iran will be forced to limit its rang of BM, CM, and drones to 300km. You won't be able to hit a target inside your own country. lolol
-All your long range BM, CM, and drones will be shipped to Russia free of charge for their war in Ukraine.
-All your Enriched U235 and heavy water inventory will also be shipped to russia free of charge like last time, do you still remember that?
-Your Lithium reserve will be divided between Russia, US, and China. They're already working out the detail.
-Anything or anyone that have not been sanctioned, will be. More Iranian asset will be frozen and divided among your foes, US/NATO, russia, and china.

-The benefits: Big fat ZERO like last time (remember), more than likely even less..... but don't you worry. You will be given a line of credit to buy more black fabrics from SK for your beloved hijab. You see, Both east and west love it when you subjugate your women that way, so that they villify you for it to the globe.
Did you know, hijab, scarf, and all body covering were creation of imperial Briton? lol
Last but least, your Azari nego-team will get to travel in luxury to Europe, wine and dine with Whiskey, Beer and wine, ham sandwiches, and take pictures with old lard bottom white women of politics. Return home and claim of a deal of life time.

History will repeat itself, doesn't it.

Your only hope is IRGC leadership, that's a powerful organ with a lot of cloud. May be, they can take action to stop this from happening. Why this azari regime in Iran insists on staying in NPT, refuses to build the bomb, or even increase the range of their missiles above 2000km (LOLOL) despite all the sanctions, draw backs, nuclear threat, threat of military invasion, and all humiliation, is very mind bottling.

By The Way, US just announced yesterday that they will be increasing their imports from russia regardless of all their sanctions, and 'so called' animosioty between them.
How about that!