France & Pakistan to revive JF-17 Avionics/EW/Missiles deal as Indian MMRCA stalls.

[zeeshanvita]

Did you want to know what Pakistan was looking from france---. It was the complete electronic package---radar and a full array of weaponery air to air air to ground

NO actually what i mean is which Radar or EW suit...the 1 which PAf wanted earlier was RC400.. i wonder if PAF still wants the same radar...

 

[slapshot]

Did you want to know what Pakistan was looking from france---. It was the complete electronic package---radar and a full array of weaponery air to air air to ground

I heard that A2A missile we considered in this deal could have been used in A2G as well. That could have saved us some hard points!
Edit or it was BVR/VR thingy

 

[salman-1]

One thing for sure from all above discussions that JF-17 has become a highly potent aircraft for which international companies are offering their best products. All such options would some day realize an export deal whether it has French or Chinese avionics. PAF had been looking for at least a batch of 50 aircraft's with western avionics for sale to those who opt for western gadgets only.

 

[Dazzler]

Just my two cents...

+ jf-17 1st batch avionics were comparatively better than what Thales and sagem offered.

+ klj-7 had more search range, better War and ecm modes than RC-400 and grifo-s.

+ the EW is not even Chinese,neither is rwr, discussed to death on this forum.

+ kg300g ecm has drfm capability, not present in French ecm pod offered in the package.

The French are bully***ting at best. Blk 2 avionics are leap ahead of the package offered.

 

[slapshot]

One thing for sure from all above discussions that JF-17 has become a highly potent aircraft for which international companies are offering their best products. All such options would some day realize an export deal whether it has French or Chinese avionics. PAF had been looking for at least a batch of 50 aircraft's with western avionics for sale to those who opt for western gadgets only.

I think it was more about PAF itself due their vast experience with western avionics/weapon packages. Thunder is tailored jet made for PAF needs so its not specifically designed by keeping exports in mind.

 

[MilSpec]

Just my two cents...

+ jf-17 1st batch avionics were comparatively better than what Thales and sagem offered.

+ klj-7 had more search range, better War and ecm modes than RC-400 and grifo-s.

+ the EW is not even Chinese,neither is rwr, discussed to death on this forum.

+ kg300g ecm has drfm capability, not present in French ecm pod offered in the package.

The French are bully***ting at best. Blk 2 avionics are leap ahead of the package offered.

what offer?

 

[SpArK]

Irrespective of Rafale,
lets review the book order for Indo-france.

DCNS Scorpene : $3 Billion

DCNS - SeC Supply chain for P75 - $55 Million

Areva - Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited, for the Jaitapur Nuclear Power Project - 8 billion Euro ($10.4 billion)

HAL/Turbomeca Shakti - $700 million

Dassault- HAL Mirage 200H upgrade program - $2.2 billion

i.e. 16.8 Billion Dollars worth of book order.... as far as recall the entire defence budget for pakistan was 3.4 billion dollars... So may be your source needs to provide some additional details...

Your list is unwanted.

As per @Horus , the deal is mainly with Thales.

Yes the same Thales with we have a lot of deals going on like:

Since the deals and future deals with India is small and Rafale deal cancellation will automatically cancel all the current deals and future deals. Pakistan can easily make a high value deal for it fighters...

So please stop posting about Scorpenes, Areva etc....

 

[Kambojaric]

French are not trustworthy. They still havent given the Russians the ship the Ruskis paid for. This is probably a pressure tactic on India. We should proceed with caution.

 

[salman-1]

I think it was more about PAF itself due their vast experience with western avionics/weapon packages. Thunder is tailored jet made for PAF needs so its not specifically designed by keeping exports in mind.

Thats the most wrong impression for thunder, as it was always quoted as replacement for not just our F-7 and Mirages but also for the same class of fighters as F-5, Mig-21 etc and similar old aircraft's of 2nd and third generation. Any country making such project has always exports in mind specially a project with a magnitude of investing a billion dollars.
Air forces around the world never make and build fighter jets, its always private and govt joint ventures that attempt such things. PAF i think was not sure for success at this level on on their own, that s why engaged China to help them out and later configure exports as well

 

[nomi007]

if any such type of situation will occur
than i my opinion
we will try to request
TopOwl-F(Topsight/TopNight)
for our jf-17s
which we lack

 

[Yahoooooo!]

Highly placed industrial sources have indicated to me that the deal for advanced Avionics, Radar, EW suite, HMD/S and MICA Missiles for PAF's JF-17 Thunder jets is back on the table. The deal was postponed after India removed Rafale from its MMRCA. Now that the Rafale deal with India is stalling, the French are willing to sell the whole package PAF wants for its Thunder fleet.

[COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=6]@Windjammer[/SIZE][/COLOR]

If it happen this will be the biggest news of 2015 ... and it will completely change the JF program ...
@Horus how capable your source is ?

I think you missed the above part in Blue @ the identity of his highly placed industrial source.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Apparently one of our Middle Eastern friends who's looking for Rafales to replace Tornados is arm twisting France to approve the Pakistani deal, either overtly or covertly with the said country agreeing to play the middleman.

So the Saudis are going to operate the EFT AND the Rafale? I'm not convinced at all.....

 

[Kompromat]

Despite Indian objections French Thales and Sagem continue to do business with Pakistan. The sale of Fennec helos and optronics for Armored vehicles are a few examples.

So the Saudis are going to operate the EFT AND the Rafale? I'm not convinced at all.....

Saudis are between Rafale or Enhanced SH for their SANG/RSN. The Typhoons and Eagles are operated by RSAF. You don't have to be convinced, a country with a $75 billion budget can buy whatever it wants.

 

[Donatello]

Just my two cents...

+ jf-17 1st batch avionics were comparatively better than what Thales and sagem offered.

+ klj-7 had more search range, better War and ecm modes than RC-400 and grifo-s.

+ the EW is not even Chinese,neither is rwr, discussed to death on this forum.

+ kg300g ecm has drfm capability, not present in French ecm pod offered in the package.

The French are bully***ting at best. Blk 2 avionics are leap ahead of the package offered.

It's not about if it was equal or better, but the fact that JF-17 would be able to utilize the lethality of MICA/Meteor missiles, plus it is always good have different weaponary. French do have a decent Pod variety along with LGBs. It wouldn't hurt to have them, would it? Plus the fact that operation of similar systems that India has or would have, would only help to our preparedness.

Irrespective of Rafale,
lets review the book order for Indo-france.

DCNS Scorpene : $3 Billion

DCNS - SeC Supply chain for P75 - $55 Million

Areva - Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited, for the Jaitapur Nuclear Power Project - 8 billion Euro ($10.4 billion)

HAL/Turbomeca Shakti - $700 million

Dassault- HAL Mirage 200H upgrade program - $2.2 billion

i.e. 16.8 Billion Dollars worth of book order.... as far as recall the entire defence budget for pakistan was 3.4 billion dollars... So may be your source needs to provide some additional details...

Now you are being stupid at best. That list shows one thing:
India is heavily dependent on french technology....meaning, France loses the money, but India loses the much needed capability, which it would have trouble sourcing from elsewhere.

You need to realize, France is a highly developed society, a knowledge based society, the loss of billions in deals today, can be made up in other means. So again, France will sell to whomever it wants.

 

[Mughal-Prince]

Reading the whole thread post by post a lot of things comes to my mind as I have discussed in some thread EJ-210 for JFT if acquired by RSAF so it is possible that it may carry French avionics so the similar configuration can be offered to other ME and interested countries.

2nd people are debating over Chinese and French avionics comparison so is their any one who says Chinese have more matured avionics industry in front of France ?? Of course not. Although they are catching up fast and making pretty good avionics which are at par with western counterparts in much lower price but still French have an established and proven industry with much more to offer so if we could have some of these packages in our own build machines they may help us to improve those which are thoroughly built with Pak-China technology.