Why the hatred for India is so sublime than vice versa...are Pakistanis more civilized

[padamchen]

Your soldiers have been deployed to forcibly occupy a people and territory on the command of your politicians.

What does expressing support for the right of millions to vote in a plebiscite have to do with the soldiers? They are only deployed there because of political considerations. You should be happy that said peaceful resolution would allow soldiers to return to their homes and spend more time with their families - in both countries.

Soldiers of India are not religious indoctrinated.

They fight for their country.

Feeble attempt at trying to make them out to be unwilling participants just following orders.

Give up. You don't have it in you to convert me. Or any Indian.

What's wrong in calling you rapists?
Indian Army using rape as an organised military strategy in Occupied Kashmir is a well document FACT

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/unde...re-in-kashmir-prevalence-consequences.445402/

The reality is very different.

Distasteful.

Different.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

So, you guys are having a field day . Keep showing them (Indians) their true face.

There are takers for the kind of 'people to people connection & dialog' that Indians like Padamchen want, and it accomplishes absolutely nothing.

Remember Marvi Sirmed's eulogy for Sushma Swaraj when she died? What was it that she called Sushma, 'Didi'?

Don't underestimate the leverage this kind of 'dialog' and 'civility' creates. Contrast the vicious vitriol Indian analysts & commentators resort to at home and in the West with the much more 'civil & polite' commentary Pakistani analysts and commentators display.

A lot of us were in the same bandwagon as the aforementioned Pakistani analysts & commentators, but as I pointed out to Padamchen elsewhere, hate doesn't exist in a vacuum, and the unchecked hatred in India was eventually going to have repercussions in Pakistan.

'For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction'.

 

[M. Sarmad]

The reality is very different.

Distasteful.

Different.

You support rape, you support genocide
And then you talk about lack of basic human decency in others!!
O kaun laug o tussi ?

 

[padamchen]

There are takers for the kind of 'people to people connection & dialog' that Indians like Padamchen want, and it accomplishes absolutely nothing.

Remember Marvi Sirmed's eulogy for Sushma Swaraj when she died? What was it that she called Sushma, 'Didi'?

Don't underestimate the leverage this kind of 'dialog' and 'civility' creates. Contrast the vicious vitriol Indian analysts & commentators resort to at home and in the West with the much more 'civil & polite' commentary Pakistani analysts and commentators display.

A lot of us were in the same bandwagon as the aforementioned Pakistani analysts & commentators, but as I pointed out to Padamchen elsewhere, hate doesn't exist in a vacuum, and the unchecked hatred in India was eventually going to have repercussions in Pakistan.

'For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction'.

You have a problem with Sushma ji also?

She was like a Punjabi mom to you guys.

Disgusting.

 

[Ali Tariq]

You support rape, you support genocide
And then you talk about lack of basic human decency in others!!
O kaun laug o tussi ?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Soldiers of India are not religious indoctrinated.

They fight for their country.

Feeble attempt at trying to make them out to be unwilling participants just following orders.

Give up. You don't have it in you to convert me. Or any Indian.

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the military in India has always strictly followed the elected government's orders, so it follows then that the Indian military deployment in J&K is a political decision.

An expression of support for a UN held plebiscite in J&K says nothing about Indian soldiers, it only reverses a political decision made by successive Indian governments and allows for a just and peaceful resolution of the J&K dispute - a peaceful resolution that will allow soldiers on both sides to finally return to their families and end the death and destruction along the LoC & in Indian Occupied Kashmir and allow both countries to hopefully spend more on their development and engage in greater trade and economic cooperation - and you still won't express support for a plebiscite?

 

[padamchen]

You support rape, you support genocide
And then you talk about lack of basic human decency in others!!
O kaun laug o tussi ?

I don't support rape.

The reality in Kashmir is different to what your awam has been fed.

Hypocrites.

Remember, we are a disgusting people when it comes to women.

But are hypocrites when it comes to so called izzat and aabroo of same women when convenient.

 

[M. Sarmad]

I don't support rape.

The reality in Kashmir is different to what your awam has been fed.

Hypocrites.

Remember, we are a disgusting people when it comes to women.

But are hypocrites when it comes to so called izzat and aabroo of same women when convenient.

Those reports documenting sexual violence by the rapist Indian Army in Occupied Kashmir are by well reputed International Organisations like:

United Nations

Amnesty International

Asia Watch

Human Right Watch

International Commission of Jurists

Physicians for Human Rights

Doctors without Borders

etc.?

Did you even bother to read the thread/link?

You are the only hypocrite here, doc

You support Muslim genocide, you support Rape in Occupied Kashmir, but you want Pakistanis to condemn 26/11!! ...

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

You have a problem with Sushma ji also?

She was like a Punjabi mom to you guys.

Disgusting.

I'm just pointing out the futility of moderating the Pakistani position, or how strongly we articulate our stance, because of 'personal contacts/friendship'.

I'm not blaming SS here - she promoted her country's position as best as she could. My criticism was more for Pakistanis like Sirmed who let personal connections and friendships with Indians moderate their own views.

Look at Barkha Dutt on the Indian side - she's considered a 'liberal/moderate' in India, but compared to the peaceniks on the Pakistani side, she's a hawk.

 

[padamchen]

Those reports documenting sexual violence by the rapist Indian Army in Occupied Kashmir are by well reputed International Organisations like:

United Nations

Amnesty International

Asia Watch

Human Right Watch

International Commission of Jurists

Physicians for Human Rights

Doctors without Borders

etc.?

Did you even bother to read the thread/link?

You are the only hypocrite here, doc

You support Muslim genocide, you support Rape in Occupied Kashmir, but you want Pakistanis to condemn 26/11!! ...

These same bodies have much more to say about you guys.

I've seen exactly how much faith your lot puts in their on ground credibility and intelligence and absence of agenda when that happens.

Let's have an adult conversation.

With you at least.

You've been a balanced commentator on internal issues so you have that credibility in my eyes at least.

The maximum institutionalised rape of Kashmiri women is not by any Indians, military or otherwise.

It's by MUSLIMS.

I'm just pointing out the futility of moderating the Pakistani position, or how strongly we articulate our stance, because of 'personal contacts/friendship'.

I'm not blaming SS here - she promoted her country's position as best as she could. My criticism was more for Pakistanis like Sirmed who let personal connections and friendships with Indians moderate their own views.

Look at Barkha Dutt on the Indian side - she's considered a 'liberal/moderate' in India, but compared to the peaceniks on the Pakistani side, she's a hawk.

Barkha Duty is having a bit of a Ghar waapsi phase

 

[M. Sarmad]

These same bodies have much more to say about you guys.

I've seen exactly how much faith your lot puts in their on ground credibility and intelligence and absence of agenda when that happens.

Let's have an adult conversation.

With you at least.

You've been a balanced commentator on internal issues so you have that credibility in my eyes at least.

The maximum institutionalised rape of Kashmiri women is not by any Indians, military or otherwise.

It's by MUSLIMS.

Here we are talking about the use of rape/sexual violence as a military strategy

Show us similar reports about Pakistani Army and no Pakistani will ever defend such actions

That's the difference between Pakistanis and Indians.

Indian Army has molested more than 11,000 Kashmiri women. Provide credible source to back up your claim that 'the maximum institutionalised rape of Kashmiri women is not done by Indians'

Yes, let's have an adult and balanced conversation!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I'm just pointing out the futility of moderating the Pakistani position, or how strongly we articulate our stance, because of 'personal contacts/friendship'.

I'm not blaming SS here - she promoted her country's position as best as she could. My criticism was more for Pakistanis like Sirmed who let personal connections and friendships with Indians moderate their own views.

Look at Barkha Dutt on the Indian side - she's considered a 'liberal/moderate' in India, but compared to the peaceniks on the Pakistani side, she's a hawk.

As a contrast, look at Imran Khan - he’s continued to have strong friendships with Indians most of his life. Navjot Sidhu for example.

Yet he’s never backed off from strongly pushing Pakistan’s position on issues. He’s spoken of peace but he hasn’t compromised on talking about the need for a plebiscite.

That’s what we need.

 

[padamchen]

Here we are talking about the use of rape/sexual violence as a military strategy

Show us similar reports about Pakistani Army and no Pakistani will ever defend such actions

That's the difference between Pakistanis and Indians.

Indian Army has molested more than 11,000 Kashmiri women. Provide credible source to back up your claim that 'the maximum institutionalised rape of Kashmiri women is not done by Indians'

Yes, let's have an adult and balanced conversation!

I'm rejecting completely your assertion as well as the sources quoted.

For the same reasons you do on other similar issues of national interest when convenient.

The same organisations.

No cherry picking.

As a contrast, look at Imran Khan - he’s continued to have strong friendships with Indians most of his life. Navjot Sidhu for example.

Yet he’s never backed off from strongly pushing Pakistan’s position on issues. He’s spoken of peace but he hasn’t compromised on talking about the need for a plebiscite.

That’s what we need.

I'm happy that you are happy with your leader.

Not all of us are with ours. And not all of the time.

But he is our leader. And we are behind him 100%.

 

[M. Sarmad]

I'm rejecting completely your assertion as well as the sources quoted.

For the same reasons you do on other similar issues of national interest when convenient.

The same organisations.

No cherry picking.

Well, Denial ain't just a river in Egypt

You of course are free to reject all those reports by well reputed international organisations. But then you shouldn't be talking about adult and balanced conversations

 

[padamchen]

Well, Denial ain't just a river in Egypt

You of course are free to reject all those reports by well reputed international organisations. But then you shouldn't be talking about adult and balanced conversations

Adult does not mean taking on someone else's guilt.

I'm telling you Kashmiri women are being raped by Muslims who are not Indian.

How this disgusting practice is institutionalised and goes on is known to everyone in the valley.