Why India Occupied Siachen?

[AUSTERLITZ]

Siachen dispute is a waste,a pathetic game of one upmanship from 2 punks on a dick measurement contest at the cost of good men's lives and their families sorrow.Both sides should withdraw.

 

[Bhairava]

If Pakistan had not intended to ocuupy the glacier and order large number of winter wear from that London outfiteers, India would not have sprinted first to the glacier.

And moreover they tried to retake it in '87 and failed miserably. Winners,keepers.

Any way there has been casualty in IA for the last 10 years in Siachen and we could not care less.

 

[Awesome]

There were two benefits. One of was stopping Pakistan from sending tourists to Siachen (which Pakistan already does by its control over K2) and then to try and infiltrate to a point where they can monitor the KKH and the KKH can now be monitored from satelites and other intel, and not like anything Earth shattering would be discovered from seeing trucks pass by on the highway.

It currently offers no importance to India. India and Pakistan can put a joint team, a much smaller force for observation sakes, perhaps geologists or any other branch of science suited and carry out a joint scientific operation.

This would mean a lot less casualties and no fear of a fight breaking out and since its a joint observatory place, a safe(r) place can be chosen for the base.

This would bring costs down as well as save lives.

If Pakistan had not intended to ocuupy the glacier and order large number of winter wear from that London outfiteers, India would not have sprinted first to the glacier.

And moreover they tried to retake it in '87 and failed miserably. Winners,keepers.

Any way there has been casualty in IA for the last 10 years in Siachen and we could not care less.

Pakistan was carrying out tourist expeditions. Pakistan would have never willingly tried to occupy Siachen since it serves no military purpose to us. Your guys occupy high ground, so obviously you have a tactical advantage and it would be difficult to take you guys out of there.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Sensible post from asim aquil.
And as for bhairava of course you 'couldn't care less' you are not freezing in the cold on a barren mountain range or dying,ur sitting in a cosy laptop and typing at leisure.You have no right to imagine the hardship of the soldiers on both sides over this foolishness.

 

[Edevelop]

Sorry wrong thread (Self Delete)

 

[anoop]

Its funny, Indians have J&K and Siachin to themselves but they won't feed their poor with clean fresh water...
Whats the point when Indians are proven to be natural misers?

pakistan too have *** and still can`t feed their poor with clean fresh water. so whats point ??

 

[Edevelop]

pakistan too have *** and still can`t feed their poor with clean fresh water. so whats point ??

wrong we don't have water. All rivers in Pakistan flow from Kashmir and you built dams to block all the water coming in to our side. In fact we have so little left that we are using groundwater.

 

[ashokdeiva]

Thanks for that reveal. So everything you have been citing so far on Siachen was ceremonial.

I don't regret on my pick of demilitarization of this barren land because I believe both the nations are bearing unnecessary burden.
I also don't care what you think, for me you are no different from typical keyboard worriers.

Good night and I may not be able to reply your post so please don't waste your energy on typing one for me.

How could that be cerimonial, when I was talking about demilitarizing that land, I insisted that we both with draw, not hand that place to you in a plater. When you guys are not ready to withdraw on your part why would the IA withdraw their high grounds.

wrong we don't have water. All rivers in Pakistan flow from Kashmir and you built dams to block all the water coming in to our side. In fact we have so little left that we are using groundwater.

Take it to the INternational Court of Arbiteration where they will trough your argument to the dustbin. We have the right to construct run off dams and that is what we have been doing, we have never chocked Pakistan of here water needs. Not even during war, why would we choke you guys and earn a bad name in the international arena and make them belive that we are the ones who are bad. You guys have always taken the short cut and have ended up in the place where you are today in the eyes of the international community.

 

[OrionHunter]

The writer mentions that Pakistan's claim on Siachen is internationally recognized as various international magazines have shown in their maps that the region belongs to Pakistan.

Oh really? That's news to me! Can you produce a map that shows Siachen as part of Pakistan? Here's the map of the region..

The conflict in Siachen stems from the incompletely demarcated territory on the map beyond the map coordinate known as NJ9842. The 1972 Simla Agreement did not clearly mention who controlled the glacier, merely stating that from the NJ9842 location the boundary would proceed "thence north to the glaciers."

And that's what India is claiming as per the agreement, but Pakistan wants the line redrawn towards the East. Attempts to reclaim positions were launched by Pakistan in 1990, 1995, 1996 and even in early 1999, just prior to the Lahore Summit. The 1995 attack by Pakistan SSG was significant as it resulted in 40 casualties for Pakistan troops without any changes in the positions.

So how do you say that Pakistan's position on the dispute is internationally recognized?

 

[Areesh]

The why do you always cry about how Siachen is a 'needless' issue which can be solved 'in an hour'?

We are not the ones whose economy is bleeding bad because of Siachen. It's a minor strain, if anything, for us.

We are not the ones who are losing soldiers regularly on Siachen. In fact, we have not lost a single soldier for the past eight years.
We are not the ones occupying the lower grounds. In fact, we have the advantage of occupying the higher ground.

Why should we show any urgency to solve Siaches, then?

Your economy can continue to bleed for all we care.

Bold part is not true. Take help from some senior Bharati members. They might give you a reality check.

We want this issue to be solved because we value human life. At least of our soldiers. We know Siachen is a wasteland. We know unlike fanboys of Bharat that whatever "strategic or military" threats that India could pose from those heights have been greatly neutralized. We know India isn't going to achieve much from the heights except fanboys cheering on public forums that "hey we sit on greater heights" That's what we know and that's why we want to resolve this issue.

Not going to answer your rant about economy since nothing is too expensive for us when it comes to defense of Pakistan.

Then by all means don't ..no one is forcing you.

There is a reason 'the' process is called a negotaition(ie compromise)...as it involves "give and take"
We have the high ground ..we are ready to withdraw from there , but we need something in return too.

We aren't going to give any part of any of our territory for give and take. Yeah we can assure you the demilitarization of the region from our side if you agree to going back to pre-1984 positions.

 

[Bhairava]

Sensible post from asim aquil.
And as for bhairava of course you 'couldn't care less' you are not freezing in the cold on a barren mountain range or dying,ur sitting in a cosy laptop and typing at leisure.You have no right to imagine the hardship of the soldiers on both sides over this foolishness.

My "could not care less" was meant with the attitude of the Pak fanbois and never at the brave men at the heights.

We aren't going to give any part of any of our territory for give and take. Yeah we can assure you the demilitarization of the region from our side if you agree to going back to pre-1984 positions.

The Indian position is eerily similar to that. So what are we arguing here ?

And no India did not sacrifice 1000s of its good men to go back to pre-1984" positions.

Pakistan was carrying out tourist expeditions. Pakistan would have never willingly tried to occupy Siachen since it serves no military purpose to us. Your guys occupy high ground, so obviously you have a tactical advantage and it would be difficult to take you guys out of there.

And why would Pak Army order winter wear mil grade for tourist expeditions ?

India too never had any willingness to occupy territory..the PA mistook the mapping expedition of Col. Narinder (Bull) Kumar who had gone on a reconnaissance expedition after US cartographic maps showed Siachen as a part of Pakistan as some sorta invasion and tried to occupy the heights. RAW got wind of that from those London outfiteers and IA then raced to the top first.

 

[Areesh]

The Indian position is eerily similar to that. So what are we arguing here ?

And no India did not sacrifice 1000s of its good men to go back to pre-1984" positions.

I think you didn't understand my post. I didn't say that India should give up it's territory. India should reverse the aggression it committed in 1984. That's it.

 

[Bhairava]

I think you didn't understand my post. I didn't say that India should give up it's territory. India should reverse the aggression it committed in 1984. That's it.

That's what I said by "India did not sacrifice 1000s of its good men to give up everything and go back to pre-84 positions".

The only way forward to end this madness is by authenticating the AGPL and de-militarizing the area just like the only way forward on Kashmir is by authenticating the LoC and demilitarizing it.

 

[Areesh]

That's what I said by "India did not sacrifice 1000s of its good men to give up everything and go back to pre-84 positions".

The only way forward to end this madness is by authenticating the AGPL and de-militarizing the area just like the only way forward on Kashmir is by authenticating the LoC and demilitarizing it.

I don't know why India sacrificed it's people. Doesn't matter for us. I am just giving you the most feasible solution to you. You started this madness and hence the greater responsibility is on you to end it.

 

[Bhairava]

I don't know why India sacrificed it's people. Doesn't matter for us. I am just giving you the most feasible solution to you. You started this madness and hence the greater responsibility is on you to end it.

No..Pakistan started the madness. Read up on why India decided to take Siachen in the first place.

And the most feasible way, agreeable to India, is to authenticate the AGPL so that once we come down , Pakistan does not occupy it. PA did it in Kargil and there is no guarentee they will not do it in Siachen.