Why cant we just mind our own business??

[Arabian Legend]

@Arabian Legend

The request has been placed, now that its in the media a pandoras box is open. Pakistanis need to stay the fukk out of wars that have zero implications for our safety. We already have enough warfare on our own plate which requires our resources. Training Saudi military is something that we have done for decades because it helps a friendly nation, however training a rebel movement is a whole different ballgame we cannot afford to be a part of.

You mean the saudi land force, its only basic training but not the Saudi military. Our air forces and SSF are being trained by either Saudis or international training academies. This report is untrue for the lack of official announcement so yeah stay the FoOk out. 

The Saudi Navy in '71 War - Whatever were they doing there ?

I've read about the '71 War History but I can't recall reading anything about any Saudi Naval Contingent taking part in any Operation ?

Maybe @Oscar can shed some light on this !

Indo-Pakistani Naval War of 1971 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Will look up for other sources as well. give it a bit.

 

[Arabian Legend]

reading few media gimmicks based reports recently clubbing KSA and Pakistan (first nukes now this BS) sans any backup proofs, it seems the world political psyops at work.

We need to be careful . Because

1. Such training programe is not feasible

2. The defence planners are not foolish to commit such a suicide.

3.KSA defence weapons including airpower are literally in hands of Americans. Why will we even think of handing our secrets to USA via KSA?

Perpetuating lies is all you can do. KSA operate various of weapons from china, russia, Europe and the US. So how they are in the hands of the US exactly I don't get your point? Do we look like stupid to you or something? Also what are you secrets to the US? The US is way advanced in term of military equips why would they look for you. Overestimation aside please. 

1. Syria attack has failed .

2. Saudia does not know anything about Pak nukes .

3. There is no direct war in that region where we can think over sending such instructors. We at State level cant intervene in internal rifts in a country.

4. Though they can hire individuals

4.

The only country that has access to pakistan's nuclear facilities and military bases is Saudi Arabia.

 

[Kompromat]

@Armstrong

Whats gone is gone, im not yanking about Saudis not helping us when our arse was on the line. They effectively had not military until Saddam came knocking on their door.

Besides, Pakistan doesn't have the 'right to exist', we only have a 'right to defend ourselves'.

Past is past, looking forward, Saudis being the middle east's regional power needs to enter a defence pact with us now that they have one of the best Air Forces on the Asian continent.

We should fight for them but they must fight for 'us' too. The relationship will exist only if its fair to both nations.

@Arabian Legend @Yzd Khalifa @JUBA

 

[SQ8]

Thank You For the F-104s ! What worst conditions ?

We sent our boys in every one of the Arab-Israeli Wars & yet we were under US Sanctions throughout the time !



The Saudi Navy in '71 War - Whatever were they doing there ?

I've read about the '71 War History but I can't recall reading anything about any Saudi Naval Contingent taking part in any Operation ?

Maybe @Oscar can shed some light on this !

All the Saudis had were rusty patrol boats and landing craft of which neither was used nor useful in 71.

 

[Arabian Legend]

@Armstrong

Whats gone is gone, im not yanking about Saudis not helping us when our arse was on the line. They effectively had not military until Saddam came knocking on their door.

Besides, Pakistan doesn't have the 'right to exist', we only have a 'right to defend ourselves'.

Past is past, looking forward, Saudis being the middle east's regional power needs to enter a defence pact with us now that they have one of the best Air Forces on the Asian continent.

We should fight for them but they must fight for 'us' too. The relationship will exist only if its fair to both nations.

@Arabian Legend @Yzd Khalifa @JUBA

You are wrong if you think KSA will hesitate if Pakistan get into something God forbids. We will be the first inlines. Pakistan is part of our national security as KSA is for Pakistan. We know its importance as country and nation and, we know that the only two Islamic power left are both countries. If they beak apart the whole Islamic world will sink down. Not talking form Ummah point of view don't go into that direction I'm talking from idealogical economical and geo political prospective.

 

[Imran Khan]

now wait for shia terror group in pakistan .

 

[Syrian Lion]

well u must admit a fact that sunnis were being pressed by alawite minority.that is the reason behind the sunni upraising.

if it was a Sunni uprising Alasad would not have lasted a minute, becuase Sunnis are the majority in Syria, in the Syrian Army and in the Syrian government....

 

[Kompromat]

@Arabian Legend

If the news was published by some fifth grade piece of crap Pakistani newspaper like Express Ttibune or the Daily Times, i would not have posted it to begin with.

DAWN and The Nation are two reliable sources of news with high level of editorial control. They don't post 'made up' news.

There's substance to it because we have a history of poking into other people's business. In many ways we are like apartheid south africa.

 

[Secur]

@Aeronaut

I believe this is the continuity of the same old foreign policy and the current mindset of the nation religious and emotional in nature , ever since our independence because we have had nothing , which can be considered as an independent or free " foreign policy " . Ever since the beginning , we found some sort of imagined protection by siding the country with a " superpower " and its " allies " - good for short term benefits , sure thing . But why haven't our leaders had the far sightedness and wisdom to see the disadvantages of it ? Why not remain neutral from the beginning and gain benefits from both sides in the long term ? The dominion of Pakistan sided itself with the superpower the United States of American in '47 , got some free cash and weapons for fighting against the rise of communism - again something which had got nothing to do with us , assurance of help against an enemy which remained as such and didn't really materialize , some support in International arena , even help in Security Council for Kashmir - which would have been granted nonetheless at that time but the " over dependence " had developed by then - something which is never good . Got betrayed twice during both wars by our supposed " friend " and then again mindlessly take part in a fight of superpower - which would have went the same way if even we wouldn't have minus the extremism and terrorism in the country , so why do we do that ? Again for weapons and money and I cant understand the logic behind that . Why didn't we try to develop our economy to purchase the weapons ourselves ? Why not " trade " instead of " aid " ? Why not develop the " Gwadar port " back then so it could rival that of M.E countries and utilize well the geographical and strategic importance of our country ? Why not facilitate trade through there to the landlocked Afghanistan and the Central Asia - then part of U.S.S.R. ? Why fixate on short term benefits always and the easy ways ? . There's no such thing as free lunch in the world . Today , we are again siding with Americans , in the War on Terror , but this time it has more to do with our " compulsions " rather than " acting on free will " because of the blunder committed in the 80's fought on hyped up " Soviet threat " and the myth of " warm waters " . The state of affair and the present condition of Islamic Republic of Pakistan has very much to do with Afghan war . The same followed with Ummah from the beginning too , since the country was formed on " two nation theory " even though the Jinnah's vision wasn't a wholly and strict religious state , we somehow thought it as our duty to help each and every Muslim country and in the meantime , got weak and even made a few new " enemies " , fought in wars which didn't concern us and gave rise to the sectarian divide in the country . The story of the betrayal and the great myth of " Ummah " is so great that it needs a separate article , a thread post wouldn't do justice to it .

So when would we learn to formulate the foreign policy of the country on " national interests " rather than imagined brotherhood which gives us back extremely little to say the least * compared to the help we provide * and sides with our enemies at times . When would we learn to put the " country " first before other things . When would we run it on " interests " rather than " religion and emotions " . Alas ! What we learn from history , is that we do not learn from it . Why take part in things from which we will get no benefit and worse of all , will harm us . Does any Muslim country specially or other countries do that ?

 

[Secur]

Thankx for the word rusty that shows how ungrateful you are.

Ungrateful ? Isn't that rich coming from you guys , whose almost all army is trained by us ? Didn't your country pay the Americans for defending it against the Iraqis ? Who requires Pakistani army personnel to command them in war ? Even fight the enemy at times ? Even send commandos to liberate , what they cant by themselves ? Even guarantee the security of your nation ? Provide the nuclear Umbrella ? What have we got in return ? Proxy wars being fought in our country ? Arab countries destabilizing Baluchistan so that their ports have no competition ? An extremist ideology and constant funding from G.C.C. countries fueling the terrorism and extremism and radicalization in our country ?

 

[Kompromat]

@Secur @Arabian Legend @Yzd Khalifa @JUBA @BLACKEAGLE @Armstrong

I know some of you my friends don't like some of my views, but my opinion is simple. We are on a verge of collapse and need to focus inwards, we are not making any friends, we must not make any new enemies either. We cant afford to turn Iran and Afghanistan into hostile states when we have a 1900km long border with an enemy that will love to eradicate us if it has its way.

Let me give you an example.

Saudi Air Force | has the ability to tip the balance of power in Pakistan's favor should a period of active hostilities come by or at the least the inclusion of Saudi air power into Pakistan's calculus against India will create a 'airpower parity' which means that Indian generals would have nightmares sending their jets against F-16s, F-15s and Typhoons, which means that they would be forced to downgrade their 'objectives assessment' - if they deem their projected damages to be too high than they can bare - they would have to either abandon the hostility altogether or reduce the frequency and geography of the attacks.

This will mean that no full scale war will take place between India and Pakistan. Similarly, if we sign a NATO like agreement to provide the Kingdom with a Nuclear arch - it will reduce any plans from any hostile state by reducing their projected objectives of success, which would mean balance of power, which means peace. I believe in an even relationship with the Saudis, not what it is in its current state.

I hope i made myself clear. 

Thankx for the word rusty that shows how ungrateful you are.

That is correct, KSA has never had naval power, not even today. This is something your military planners have ignored despite the fact that you have 3X the coastline as compared to ours. 

Ungrateful ? Isn't that rich coming from you guys , whose almost all army is trained by us ? Didn't your country pay the Americans for defending it against the Iraqis ? Who requires Pakistani army personnel to command them in war ? Even fight the enemy at times ? Even send commandos to liberate , what they cant by themselves ? Even guarantee the security of your nation ? Provide the nuclear Umbrella ? What have we got in return ? Proxy wars being fought in our country ? Arab countries destabilizing Baluchistan so that their ports have no competition ? An extremist ideology and constant funding from G.C.C. countries fueling the terrorism and extremism and radicalization in our country ?

I'd disagree with you on the Balochistan side of things, Saudis have supported us all the way, the trouble comes from the 'gulfees' - UAE,Bahrain & Qatar.

 

[Secur]

@Aeronaut

See any help - military or economical or even diplomatic in this War on Terror or against India in these troubled times by our Muslim brother countries ? See any weapons being purchased for you ? Any technology being delivered ? Any help on International forums ? I see none , I see them fraternizing with the enemy actually , signing deals with New Delhi . 

I'd disagree with you on the Balochistan side of things, Saudis have supported us all the way, the trouble comes from the 'gulfees' - UAE,Bahrain & Qatar.

I should have made myself clear there , mate .

I didn't mean " Saudi Arabia " specifically there , see " the Arab countries " there in that post , I meant the other G.C.C. countries , surely Riyadh can pressurize or influence them , right ?

 

[Arabian Legend]

@Arabian Legend

If the news was published by some fifth grade piece of crap Pakistani newspaper like Express Ttibune or the Daily Times, i would not have posted it to begin with.

DAWN and The Nation are two reliable sources of news with high level of editorial control. They don't post 'made up' news.

There's substance to it because we have a history of poking into other people's business. In many ways we are like apartheid south africa.

Im not challenging the credibility of the news however, this report would be considered highly classified by KSA authority if its true, it can't be disclosed to public level unless further notice was given by both KSA and Pakistan. And if that measure has been taken it would have been reported by our media outlet. Lets just wait and see, it seems like the Saudi-US rifts has led KSA to recalculate its move toward the Syrian issue.

 

[Kompromat]

@Secur

Saudis partially funded the SAAB-Eri Eye Purchase. 
@Secur

Qataris have 'sort of' backed off from funding the marxists in Balochistan after our saudi friends kicked out its king and replaced him with his son. No one said a word..

UAE process is underway being lead by Gen R Pasha - Bahrain will back off when other gulfees do.

 

[Secur]

@Secur

Saudis partially funded the SAAB-Eri Eye Purchase.

I didn't know that and I would want a source this time but whatever you think , please remember , my friend .

That there's no such thing as free lunch , we still provide a lot of help , do not we ? The Saudi security is a red line for Islamabad but is it the same otherwise ? Ever saw a statement from Riyadh this sort ?