War Talk: Could U.S. Forces Execute an Amphibious Assault against Iran?

[The SC]

A small detachment of Iranian forces and advisors managed to turn the tide of the war in favour of government forces. I mean, at most, Iran did not have more than a couple of thousand fighters on the front lines, while it had to assist an incompetent, demoralized and fractured Syrian army. The fact that Iran has managed to prevent the Assad government from falling is an accomplishment in itself. There is a reason why rebel forces feared any front under the guidance of Iranian forces/advisors, while speaking poorly of government forces.

You forgot Russia in all this..

 

[Surenas]

You forgot Russia in all this..

I'm not.

Even before Russia intervened, Iranian assistance on the ground prevented the total collapse of the Syrian government in 2012. In 2015, people tend to forget that the Russian intervention was coordinated with Iran, which provided the Russians with competent ground troops that where eventually responsible for the gains on the battlefield. It was a joint Russian-Iranian intervention in the end. That was why Putin insisted on Soleimani to visit him in Moscow to coordinate the whole thing.

We see the limitations of Syria's campaign in Idlib right now: despite the Russians providing Syrian troops with air cover, they have failed to make significant advances on the ground. It shows how much the Syrian army struggles to make gains if Iranian-backed forces aren't participating.

 

[TheImmortal]

You forgot Russia in all this..

Ignorant comment

Hezbollah convincingly won the battle of Yaburd which marked the turning point and was the beginning of the Iranian push on terrorist forces in the Damascus area.

By the time Russia intervened, Assad was secure and so was Alawite enclave. Russia came in to assist to secure everything else (Daara/Aleppo/Israeli border/Dier Ez zor).

 

[055_destroyer]

US has 500+ stealth fighters and 20 stealth bombers, no air defense network can stop the power of USAF + USN

Yes, US is so confident that until now they still don't dare to take a single military retaliation after one of their high end UAV got shot down.

US trying to establish a beachhead would be met with massive casualties as artillery, rockets, missiles rain on them.

It’s a stupid theory. Not even China can establish a beachhead on much weaker Taiwan without heavy casualties.

There is no to establish beachhead in Taiwan cos 2000 cruise missile and 1000 ballistic missile will neutralise all airbase, aircraft and all asset in Taiwan while Helo and airborne can easily transport large number of troops pass the 130km short Taiwan strait.

The only reason why it has not happened is TSMC who helps supply many Chinese semi conductor and many IT sector component that helps PRC economy plus Taiwan has not declared independent. Why break the bowl when it still works?

 

[The SC]

Ignorant comment

Hezbollah convincingly won the battle of Yaburd which marked the turning point and was the beginning of the Iranian push on terrorist forces in the Damascus area.

By the time Russia intervened, Assad was secure and so was Alawite enclave. Russia came in to assist to secure everything else (Daara/Aleppo/Israeli border/Dier Ez zor).

So why Usraeli raids continue.on Syria..ignorant shap.. If Iran was so efficient like in your wet dreams?

 

[khail007]

In Iran .... last time US was miserably failed in the very beginning phase of an operation to free the hostages from US Embassy; seems very difficult if not impossible.

 

[Hack-Hook]

How competent Iranian forces are in Syria?

No iranian forces in Syria only some advisor and some volunteer

A small detachment of Iranian forces and advisors managed to turn the tide of the war in favour of government forces. I mean, at most, Iran did not have more than a couple of thousand fighters on the front lines, while it had to assist an incompetent, demoralized and fractured Syrian army. The fact that Iran has managed to prevent the Assad government from falling is an accomplishment in itself. There is a reason why rebel forces feared any front under the guidance of Iranian forces/advisors, while speaking poorly of government forces.

It's not even a couple of hundreds troop .

You forgot Russia in all this..

Ok let just say just several hundred iranian advisors and volunteer without any heavy weapon and air support mange to made syrian government for 3-4 years .

 

[TheImmortal]

So why Usraeli raids continue.on Syria..ignorant shap.. If Iran was so efficient like in your wet dreams?

So you are nothing more than an unintelligent troll.

What does your comment have to do with the topic at hand.

Israeli air raids are targeting weapon transfers to Hezbollah and have nothing to do with the overall war that is now pretty much over with Assad holding most of Syria. You are claiming Russians in air planes were the result of this? You are uninformed and didn’t track major battles. Air power will never replace ground power. Though it certainly did assist in wiping out some cannon fodder the terrorists had.

Russians are afraid of touching the ground because Islamic Chechens in Syrian will wipe the floor with your average Russian soldier. Average Russian conscript would get demolished in asymmetric warfare, after all look at Syrian Arab army they were employing Soviet Union/Russian military tactics in early stages of war. Hence why Iran had to rewrite their strategy.

Also how exactly are IRGC advisors and some militia supposed to stop air raids on shipments? Iran doesn’t have air defense systems in Syria nor does it operate Syrian air defenses. Lastly Syrian air defenses are mostly trash due to the war and their only new system is the Pantsir which is not equipped for saturation attacks. Since Israel releases their payloads in the Mediterranean or at best over Lebanon, the chance of intercepting the plane is very low (ex russian recon plane mishap)

Lastly those air raids are not doing jack ****! Mostly propaganda. I don’t doubt that they destroy SOMETHING every once in a while. But Iran is transferring old stock from its inventory to HZ and for every airstrike on a shipment, 10 make it through. This is the same county that is smuggling BMs to Houthis when they are under a US led Navy embargo, you really think Israeli airstrikes once a month are doing anything?

But let’s say for the sake of argument you are right that the Israeli air strikes are destroying every piece of hardware Iran tries to transfer to HZ, in the end Iran still won. Prior to 2011, Iran’s influence Syria was very minimal. They were allies, but Syria kept Iran at arms length. Today Iran literally owns parts of Syria because Syria is too poor to pay Iran back for the material support during war time (several billions in credit lines extended). So now Iran is entrenching in syria and even when the advisors leave, there will a large Syrian Force ready to answer to Iran.

So for all Iran cares Israel can keep bombing shipments, it already gained more influence in Syria then it had prior to 2011 war. So anything on top of that is gravy.

Iran plays the long game, Israel has been playing the short game since 2003 when it idoitically support toppling of Saddam and gave Iran free roam from Tehran to Baghdad to Damascus to Beirut.

But believe what you want to believe. It’s a free world after all.

 

[TheImmortal]

There is no to establish beachhead in Taiwan cos 2000 cruise missile and 1000 ballistic missile will neutralise all airbase, aircraft and all asset in Taiwan while Helo and airborne can easily transport large number of troops pass the 130km short Taiwan strait.

The only reason why it has not happened is TSMC who helps supply many Chinese semi conductor and many IT sector component that helps PRC economy plus Taiwan has not declared independent. Why break the bowl when it still works?

Why 2000 cruise missiles and not 20000? Or 2 Million? Seriously your tactics are basically something out of a Call of Duty video game doomsday cut scene. Kinetic aerial damage doesn’t dislodge your opponent have you learned nothing from past wars?

Transporting troops by soley by air? Seriously?

Whoa guys listen to this armchair general, someone should have told the US what morons they were for storming Normandy or Okinowa or Iwo Jima or Vietnam or literally idk every conflict known to man that involved use of beachheads.

You need supplies and equipment and organization with a solidified front line, if you just drop paratroopers into a hostile territory they will get butchered once they run out of bullets.

Btw China doesn’t even have the amphibious force needed for a beachhead attempt. Furthermore, the type of resources that would be needed to be gathered for a full invasion of Taiwan would mean a massive red flag appearing months in advance prior to operation. Taiwan would be reinforced and US would assist.

Hence why China plays the stupid “oh they are mine but I will let you hold on to them for now” game with the US. I think the Hong Kong protest should show you how tentative Chinese grip is on Non mainland Chinese territories even among the native population.

 

[Keysersoze]

US trying to establish a beachhead would be met with massive casualties as artillery, rockets, missiles rain on them.

It’s a stupid theory. Not even China can establish a beachhead on much weaker Taiwan without heavy casualties.

No that wouldn't happen. Artillery and rockets would be In the range of air strikes. And would be targeted as a priority. Missiles would be limited in number and comparatively inaccurate as well as target able by ground based interceptors.

You are comparing incompetent Arab armies with a competent Iranian one. Saudi shows the same intrinsic weaknesses now: the overabundance of equipment does not make up for the societal, industrial and scientific defincies of these states. Iran on the other hand has a fairly professional scientific and military base.

There is a reason why Iran is left alone despite confronting major powers in the region.

How has the Iranian military qualified itself as competent? The last time I checked the Iraqis held up against Iran (10 years plus) and they folded hard against coalition forces.

In Iran .... last time US was miserably failed in the very beginning phase of an operation to free the hostages from US Embassy; seems very difficult if not impossible.

Are you seriously comparing a special forces operation that went wrong BEFORE to an invasion? I could even tell you how they would do it. The damage to Iran would be heavy.

 

[Trango Towers]

US has 500+ stealth fighters and 20 stealth bombers, no air defense network can stop the power of USAF + USN

History is full of the mighty falling when they gave the weaker lesser force no chance

 

[khail007]

Are you seriously comparing a special forces operation that went wrong BEFORE to an invasion? I could even tell you how they would do it. The damage to Iran would be heavy.

Invasions single handedly, neither US speciality nor they will go for it. Casualties will be on both sides, will be heavy on Iranian side but will also be heavy on US side comparing mission accomplished statements in Afghanistan/Iraq.

 

[Keysersoze]

History is full of the mighty falling when they gave the weaker lesser force no chance

Yes it is but the U S airforce will defeat the Iranian airforce. Iran needs to stop think that shooting down drones is the same as stopping waves of bombs. Iran might shoot down 20-30 aircraft but won't stop the other 170.

 

[Zhukov]

So their is a war cooking up in our neighborhood without asking our opinion about it
Had Iran Established Good Relations with Pakistan on Priority basis instead of prioritizing Indian Oil Deals and Threatening Pakistan despite of calm and neutral tone by Government of Pakistan, We could have made Afghanistan Hell for USA so that Northern Flank was not much of a trouble for Iran and we get rid of these Spineless Pro Indian Clowns in Kabul that USA have gifted us with.
Now at best we can remain neutral and deny US of any operations from Pakistani Land and at best support covert operations against US activity in Afghanistan.
Iran is technologically much behind US is not Fault of Iran. It has no real Allies is its fault. Fighting with everyone with stupidly aggressive Foreign Policy. I understand KSA and Gulf nations Bad Blood with Iran there are territorial Issues.
But Whats its problem with Pakistan and Turkey? Previously Strongest Allies of Iran in the Region now love/hate hostiles?.IRGC Generals Threatening us for no reason for an Attack on our territory because alledgly some rag tag hill billies abducted your border security guards from Your Territory?
Allies win you wars. Stand alone and you are done. Now go ask your love dolly India for even Diplomatic Support.

 

[LeGenD]

Iraq had vintage AD equipment during that war, this has been stated so many times yet you and Gambit bring up the Gulf-war of 91 all the time as if to make some relevant point in relationship to Iran's current situation when the reality is that Iran has updated its radars and SAM system to be more than capable of engaging modern U.S. aircraft efficiently.

The shooting down of the RQ-4A wasn't some fluke, it is indicative of a larger Iranian defense network ready to go in case of a full-blown war.

I'm sure you'll give me a half-page rebuttal full of copy-pasted information as to why you say what you say....

Vintage AD equipment?

500 radar systems in total (dispersed across 100+ locations), providing necessary cues to various types of SAM systems* and thousands of different types of AA guns.

"The Iraqi IADS was a composite system which integrated European and Soviet search and acquisition radars, and a range of Soviet and European SAM and AAA systems, all tied together with a French built Kari C3 (Command/Control/Communications) network. While smaller than the now defunct Soviet system in central Europe (Western TVD), the system had a respectable capability and comparable if not higher density of SAM and AAA systems, with considerable redundancy in communications links and hardened C3 facilities." - Carlo Kopp

*Following options:

Roland-2 (mobile)
SA-13 Gopher (mobile)
SA-9 Gaskin (mobile)
SA-8 Gecko (mobile)
SA-6 Gainful (mobile)
SA-3 Goa
SA-2 Guideline

- dispersed across 130+ locations (air defense spots) and 4 air-defense sectors in total. Some of the above are EO/IR based, and could operate independently of radar guidance.

Man portable options: HN-5A; SA-7 Grail; SA-14 Gremlin; SA-16 Gimlet; and SA-18 Grouse

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Iraq had established a proper IADS by 1990, and it was far more extensive and capable than that of Vietnam. US-led forces had no prior operational exposure to air defense arrangements of matching complexity, mind you.

If you think that Iraq had vintage AD equipment in 1991, then take a look at Soviet and Chinese AD equipment and arrangements in the same year.

- Linked to Soviet C^3 (command/control/communications) network encompassing hundreds of radar systems and thousands of different types of AA guns.

China was below USSR and Iraq in these matters in 1991.

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US-led forces did not simply pound their way to glory in the Persian Gulf War (1991).

There was substantial (behind-the-scenes) homework prior to pressing the trigger, and engagement tactics were devised accordingly (credit to Herbert Norman Schwarzkopf Jr. and his colleagues). There was a massive military build-up prior to pressing the trigger as well because Saddam Hussein had committed a million troops to the defense of Kuwait and Iraq on the whole. First step was to destroy Iraqi early warning radar systems with carefully executed surgical strikes involving special forces, to open a gaping hole in the Iraqi IADS coverage through which hundreds of potent fighter aircraft and electronic warfare platforms could be slipped through. Next step was to strike at and disrupt KARI C^3 (command/control/communications) network on the whole = hundreds of air strikes were directed towards this end alone; power stations and military bases were also struck in the process. Precision munitions and cruise missiles were utilized for the first time in large numbers, to devastating effect. This war turned out much different from the Vietnam War because US was a DIFFERENT BEAST in terms of warfare in 1991. Advanced spy satellite networks and powerful AWACS platforms made it possible for US-led forces to map Iraqi IADS prior to the war. Even then every aircraft lost during the course of military operations in this war, was attributed to Iraqi IADS - it had lot of teeth.

Vietnam War was a fantastic teacher to the US in the art of warfare, and subsequent military-related reforms completely redefined American war-machine and conventional fighting methods - this is the topic worth exploring - a topic which people commonly overlook in relation to Persian Gulf War (1991). Instead of declaring Iraq being ill-equipped to fight a war in 1991, concentrate on actual facts and ignore silly narratives/perceptions. I shall remind you that US is only getting better in this game but few are paying attention as usual.