Vikramditya & the IAC Vikrant Threat To Pakistan Waters

[HariPrasad]

to my knowledge PN already has capacity to launch land attack cruise missiles from its subsurface fleet, so PN already has limited nuke strike capacity

Do not make much difference as you may attack us from land. Your ships will have to travel a fair distance from your sea to attack southern part of India which is risky. Your surface ships definately can go to high sea to attack southern India. For your subs, It is risky too. You will always prefer to use ballistic missile insted.

PN already has capacity to launch land attack cruise missiles from its subsurface fleet,

Never heard of. Pl provide the link.

In case of emergency PN can put TELs of BMs & CMs on domestic commercial ships and launch them from open sea too.

First of all prove that you can launch them from war ship. It is not easy to launch them from commercial ship as they lacks the infrastructure to launch it. In case you do, your commercial ships shall be considered as the war ship an shall be attacked. It will not be able to defend itself.

 

[trident2010]

In case of emergency PN can put TELs of BMs & CMs on domestic commercial ships and launch them from open sea too.

It is sounds like a good idea but the problem with this is that India has number of remote sensing satellites deployed over the south asia. Each image is checked by the experts and if PN wants to load any ship with missiles, it will be shown in the pictures. Indian forces will share this information and will destroy that ship before it can fire. To succeed, you needs 10s of ships with 100s of armed missile to make sure one or two of these would slip through and do the damage. Too expensive and risky option in my opinion.

 

[indiatester]

It is sounds like a good idea but the problem with this is that India has number of remote sensing satellites deployed over the south asia. Each image is checked by the experts and if PN wants to load any ship with missiles, it will be shown in the pictures. Indian forces will share this information and will destroy that ship before it can fire. To succeed, you needs 10s of ships with 100s of armed missile to make sure one or two of these would slip through and do the damage. Too expensive and risky option in my opinion.

We must have software for that by now. Don't we?

 

[trident2010]

We must have software for that by now. Don't we?

No, since softwares are not as good the eye on an expert. They use software to enhance it but final call is made by the person.

 

[Mitro]

what ever you mention is future aquisition and not currently oeprational and nobody has seen future you never know what your enemy have it then.

and which ever weapon or missile i mention are currently operation with your enemy thats the reality.

That is my opinion. I see you are agree on that.

Forget about Nuclear Sub with western standard. Even china do not have it. Only we have that sub (Nepra). At the most Pakistan can get a nuke sub of dated (Even by chinese standard) technology.




Why do you forget Hypersonic Shaurya?



Tell me how would you counter Brahmos?



First of all they are AWE &C not AWACS. We have K 100 AWACS killer. Which can target AWACS from 400 KM. We are developing SAM of 300 KM range.

Even though your AWA& C Direct BABUR And RAAD (Actually it is nonsense as they are Surface to surface and Air to surface missile.) to Viky, we have sufficient counter measure in form of EW suit, Multi fire Gun etc. Barak 8 will come shortly as well as Matri.

Why you forget about their missile Abdali,shaheen,babur,raad,ghauri

But Prahar can hit lots and lots of Pakistani Stratagic assets in its limited range of 150 KM with a deadly accuracy of 2 m CEP. You forgot Prithvi and Agni Series.


please post any link that says Prahaar and Shaurya operation and deployed

You are making fun of yourself on forum.


Thats why you did nothing when 26-11 happen and Operation Parakram and you know how many indian soldier died without firing a single bullet and cost you $200billion

So far as Pakistan is concern we are sleeping with peace in mind without and any tension. We are worried about China only.

 

[Basel]

You are right. Brahmos is a potent system and Pakistan or China has nothing to shoot it down. Perhaps US or Russia can shoot it but no other country. We have so many other things to shootdown pakistani surface ships except Brahmos. All other naval assets (Except Ships) can easily be targeted by other missiles such as Prahar, Prithvi and agni, and K series.

Once again to much over confidence, I hope @gambit joins this thread and post what he has posted before about how net centric fighting force can employ its system to stop an incoming threat, that kind of force don't need specific anti supersonic missile defense to stop a missile like brahmos.

Do not make much difference as you may attack us from land. Your ships will have to travel a fair distance from your sea to attack southern part of India which is risky. Your surface ships definately can go to high sea to attack southern India. For your subs, It is risky too. You will always prefer to use ballistic missile insted.

When Agosta 90Bs which are upgraded will go hunting your navy will be on their toes, because one tiny mistake and they are gone. PN now want these subs to have air defense capability while submerged it will add more punch and your assets like P-8s will be in pressure too.

is sounds like a good idea but the problem with this is that India has number of remote sensing satellites deployed over the south asia. Each image is checked by the experts and if PN wants to load any ship with missiles, it will be shown in the pictures. Indian forces will share this information and will destroy that ship before it can fire. To succeed, you needs 10s of ships with 100s of armed missile to make sure one or two of these would slip through and do the damage. Too expensive and risky option in my opinion.

No they can be hide, have u seen Russian Klub missile develop to be deployed from merchant ships??

 

[Mitro]

Desperadors are those who don't have any capacity and pretend to have it
e.g
1)Tejas mk1 is not ready and ppl talk about mk2
2)Air launch brahmos is in drawing board and ppl talk about destroying the enemy with that
3)Nuclear sub is just prototype
4)russian sub cannot carry nuke
5)Aircraft carrier battle group without proper air defense
6)Ageing sub
7)Scorpion sub without AIP.
8)despite of Arjun tank but still army buys T90.
9) no long range air or ground launch cruise missile .

Pakistan have right weapon system to defend them self
already have sub that are more advance with AIP then kilo class and scorpion sub do not have AIP
F22p frigate enough to protect their shore lines and missile boats with 180 km range cruise missile.
they spend less money and make you guys spend more money and you guys end up buying dud's weapons without tot so they keep on buying .

Pakistan has the technology to make Sub and knowledge to make reactor fot it i bet it will be more advance and cheaper then indian sub marine and it will be in service before indian nuke sub.

Czar 786 sounds desperate.

Somebody ask this fella how many nuke subs Pakistan building or how many destroyers and frigates they building. Ask him what Pakistan can do with a tiny forex of 8 billion versus 300 billion for poor India. Does this Pakistani understand theddirect correlation on no GDP = no military capability.. cruise missles from China will do zilch in the end.

 

[Basel]

link for those who think missiles cant be hide and launched from commercial ships specially for those who praise Russia, now tell me is Russia stupid that they develop this??

Club-K Container Missile System Royalty Free Stock Photography - Image: 26146327

another link.

Deadly new Russian weapon hides in shipping container| Reuters

 

[trident2010]

No they can be hide, have u seen Russian Klub missile develop to be deployed from merchant ships??

Yes they can hide but when they are transported to the ships at that time can be detected. During peace time when the satellite data is not scrutinise in as much detail as during the confrontation, it has more chances to slip through.

As I said before, PN will need many ships with hundreds of missile and hope that few can slip through the IN surveillance to do the job.

 

[Basel]

Yes they can hide but when they are transported to the ships at that time can be detected. During peace time when the satellite data is not scrutinise in as much detail as during the confrontation, it has more chances to slip through.
As I said before, PN will need many ships with hundreds of missile and hope that few can slip through the IN surveillance to do the job.

How much area Indian sats cover?? because PN may not just use its own ports to launch these type of ships (if ever needed) and they will use long range missile. Many Indian are here are very over confident of stuff they have purchased from other countries, if India is so good then why afraid of China, go and finish them with all the advance tech you have and Chinese stuff is junk as per Indians in most forums then why afraid?? Chest thumping is easy and fighting a war is totally different ball game.

Indians think they have Russia with them what they don't understand that they had USSR with them in 1971 and now its Russia with you and Russia is not USSR if you understand the difference between them. China is next USSR level upcoming power in the world and whole world knows that and you think you can mess up with its Israel (Pakistan) and run away with it, and China will not take measures to protect its Israel (Pakistan), for tech / stuff India spend billions to have we get counter tech in just millions due to China.

 

[trident2010]

How much area Indian sats cover??

It covers all of south asia, china and part of central asia. Also since all the remote sensing satellites are sun synchronous, they can see any point on the earth passing through their orbit.

 

[HariPrasad]

I hope @gambit joins this thread and post what he has posted before about how net centric fighting force can employ its system to stop an incoming threat,

Very funny!!!!

How network centeric force is going to counter a missile? Any idea? or shooting from Hips? Do you know what network centeric force mean? Pl give me a single reference which says that network centric force counter a missile Or anything without a proper weapon to counter it? Only Single reference.

When Agosta 90Bs which are upgraded will go hunting your navy will be on their toes, because one tiny mistake and they are gone. PN now want these subs to have air defense capability while submerged it will add more punch and your assets like P-8s will be in pressure too.

Now you seem to have accepted the fact that only sub surface ship of Pakistan can be a threat to India and not surface vessel.

 

[HariPrasad]

Why you forget about their missile Abdali,shaheen,babur,raad,ghauri

Because they are not anti ship missile.

1)Tejas mk1 is not ready and ppl talk about mk2

MK 1 is ready today. MK2 is under construction. It is same as pakistan talks of Block 2 without Block 1 getting FOC.

2)Air launch brahmos is in drawing board and ppl talk about destroying the enemy with that

Brahmos is a operational system for many years. Aircrft is getting ready to integrate it.

3)Nuclear sub is just prototype

It has entered a crucial phase of testing and delivery systems are ready.

4)russian sub cannot carry nuke

Very funny. Keep entertaining.

5)Aircraft carrier battle group without proper air defense

It has very strong EW suit to counter any plane or missile from 500 KM away. CBI filled closure report in Barak case. Very soon Barak 8 will be there to counter high speed missile. Current anti aircraft guns are more than sufficient to counter any subsonic missile.

6)Ageing sub

4 Arihant class, 4 scorpin class under construction. More nepra will be leased.

7)Scorpion sub without AIP.

Future version shall have it.

8)despite of Arjun tank but still army buys T90.

The orders were given a long back. No new order for T 90. 250 Arjun are on order. More order after Testing of MK2 is over.

9) no long range air or ground launch cruise missile .

Nirbhay will be operational within 3 years. However they are Not required. In Pakistan's case. Brahmos is more than sufficient. There is an army of Ballastic missile with high accuracy which can do the job.

Pakistan have right weapon system to defend them self

Pakistan has hardly anything to defend. (Yes, they have the things to attack)

what ever you mention is future aquisition and not currently oeprational and nobody has seen future you never know what your enemy have it then.
and which ever weapon or missile i mention are currently operation with your enemy thats the reality.

Pl talk specific and not general. If we do not know what enemy will have than enemy also do not know ahat we will have. Missile you mentioned operational but for different role and are of no use for topic under discussion. The missile I mentioned are also operational.

 

[HariPrasad]

We must have software for that by now. Don't we?

In fact If Pakistan does that, that will give India a chance to destroy all merchant ships of pakistan saying that it carries Missile.

 

[gambit]

Once again to much over confidence, I hope @gambit joins this thread and post what he has posted before about how net centric fighting force can employ its system to stop an incoming threat, that kind of force don't need specific anti supersonic missile defense to stop a missile like brahmos.

Networking is about the sharing of data and share it as fast and as often as possible.

For example...A machine gun can bring down a supersonic cruise missile if enough bullets hit it, so theoretically speaking, we can have an array of anti-aircraft machine guns of large calibers slaved to high power radars and networked to each other to have an effective point defense of any incoming threats. But the downside to that idea is that not all bullets are going to hit the threat missile so we will end up with a lot of bullets raining down and possibly killing our own people.

It is not so much about networking but about how are you going to exploit that capability -- the sharing of data -- so that there is less of the need for a dedicated anti-whatever weapon and more about using the current weapons platforms that you have to accomplish defense.