The effectiveness of Bayraktar tb2 drones in Karabakh war

[Falcon26]

I think the Pak Army will mirror the TB2 as much as possible now via the Shahpar-2 (a very comparable design).

In fact, it wouldn't surprise me now if the PA massively steps up MALE UAV acquisitions to fill out a lot of its CAS coverage needs. There'll probably be a Shahpar-2/TB2 unit posted to each key engagement point on the Eastern front IMHO.

Remember how the utility of such drones against modern conventional military used to be mocked? I think the trajectory of war has changed. The 2020 Nagorno-Karabakh war has established that modern drones pose a crippling challenge.

I don’t think the Pakistani drones enjoy the same electronic warfare and sensor superiority of the Turkish drones.

I have been saying for a long time that the Pakistani navy should order the Akinci strike drone. Pakistan can’t rely simply on the Air Force to stop advancing Indian forces. Both on land and on sea, these deadly modern drones are essential.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Remember how the utility of such drones against modern conventional military used to be mocked? I think the trajectory of war has changed. The 2020 Nagorno-Karabakh war has established that modern drones pose a crippling challenge.

I don’t think the Pakistani drones enjoy the same electronic warfare and sensor superiority of the Turkish drones.

I have been saying for a long time that the Pakistani navy should order the Akinci strike drone. Pakistan can’t rely simply on the Air Force to stop advancing Indian forces. Both on land and on sea, these deadly modern drones are essential.

NESCOM did sign a deal with TAI to continue Anka development in Pakistan. I don't think NESCOM would make purely commercial decisions, I suspect at least one of the tri-services signaled that they want that drone and its tech stack. OTOH, we still have a gap re: loitering munitions.

 

[Falcon26]

I think this war also exposes that the Russian defence industry isn't the "go-to" alternative to Western solutions. IMO, that crown now goes to China without any contest or argument whatesoever (@tphuang). China is the alternative for full-stack defence solutions (i.e., aircraft, critical input, electronics, and munitions). tbh I expect the Chinese industry to get a lot of orders for J-10CE, VT4, HQ-9BE, and so on after this war. I can't see Iraq, Algeria, Saudi, UAE, etc, taking Russian gear that seriously.

This war has truly exposed the uselessness of Russian military equipment. No wonder Putin went full Modi and started threatening nuclear strikes after his forces were humiliated.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

This war has truly exposed the uselessness of Russian military equipment. No wonder Putin went full Modi and started threatening nuclear strikes after his forces were humiliated.

Rationally speaking, it makes sense. Russia isn't an electronics power. You can't have truly modern weapons without a modern electronics industry. Well, in the world, there are only 2 serious electronics powers: the West (including their allies Taiwan, ROK, and Japan) and China. No surprise then that they're the top weapons makers.

 

[Falcon26]

Rationally speaking, it makes sense. Russia isn't an electronics power. You can't have truly modern weapons without a modern electronics industry. Well, in the world, there are only 2 serious electronics powers: the West (including their allies Taiwan, ROK, and Japan) and China. No surprise then that they're the top weapons makers.

Which makes me wonder why Turkey went for the S-400 and lost the F-35 deal. This becomes even more crazy when you consider the Turks will have long range SAMs of their own in couple years.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Which makes me wonder why Turkey went for the S-400 and lost the F-35 deal. This becomes even more crazy when you consider the Turks will have long range SAMs of their own in couple years.

Well, they definitely know what's up with the S-400. That knowledge is likely feeding their own SAM program as well as their SEAD/DEAD strategies through drones, MLRS, ECM, SIGINT, etc.

 

[Foinikas]

What surprised me is the logistics problems of the Russian Army. Weren't they preparing the invasion for months?

 

[Oublious]

What surprised me is the logistics problems of the Russian Army. Weren't they preparing the invasion for months?

LoL...

Turkish EW is playing in Ukrain, ther is no communication possible between Russian forces, beside that EU and US is doing the SIGNAL intelligence. Thats why they are faked up, other whise they would destroyed Ukrain.

 

[Foinikas]

LoL...

Turkish EW is playing in Ukrain, ther is no communication possible between Russian forces, beside that EU and US is doing the SIGNAL intelligence. Thats why they are faked up, other whise they would destroyed Ukrain.

Oh it's Turkish EW that saved Ukraine. Oh ok.

Are you kidding me? The war is going on and Turks believe Ukrainian propaganda. Don't listen to either side. Just wait until the war is over.

 

[dBSPL]

TB2 has established itself as the most battle proven armed drone in the world. It has taken on Syrian, Armenian forces and turned the tide of war in the favor of its Libyan and Ethiopian allies. The Ethiopian rebels were literally at the gates of Addis Ababa before the Turkish drones showed up to the scene. The rest is history.

There are no systems with similar operational experience, but let say UAVs produced to do similar tasks, all of them more expensive than tb2. Most battle proven, the most flown aircraft in its class, the complete solution package from munition types to support elements, and all these capabilities and proven success at the most competitive initial cost of ownership. By the end of 2025, the number of Baykar tactical armed UAV operator forces will be close to 30.

This system was originally developed for use in internal counter-terrorism operations. When the terror inside was destroyed, TB2 had to find another job. Mostly we don't share it here, but sometimes TB2 still hunts terrorists from the red and gray list in Iraq or Syria for nostalgia. Joking aside, currently, both the Turkish defense industry and Baykar are looking at further horizons. Just as the results of the steps taken 10 years ago are seen today, the results of the steps taken today will be seen near future.

 

[Falcon26]

What surprised me is the logistics problems of the Russian Army. Weren't they preparing the invasion for months?

As they say, amateurs talk about tactics, while experts talk of logistics.

But to conveniently reduce the reason for the Russian humiliation to simple logistics while ignoring the decisive role played by Turkish drones is very self-deluding.

The Ukrainians have no doubts about the secret behind their success.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1497920369247731712

 

[Oublious]

Oh it's Turkish EW that saved Ukraine. Oh ok.

Are you kidding me? The war is going on and Turks believe Ukrainian propaganda. Don't listen to either side. Just wait until the war is over.

What they use we I don't now, the same what they did in Syria, Karabagh, Libya they are doing it in Ukrain. No com possible for the enemy, beside that SAM doesn't work for the enemy.

more, more and more....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1498369955796078602

 

[Foinikas]

As they say, amateurs talk about tactics, while experts talk of logistics.

But to conveniently reduce the reason for the Russian humiliation to simple logistics while ignoring the decisive role played by Turkish drones is very self-deluding.

The Ukrainians have no doubts about the secret behind their success.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1497920369247731712

We'll see. Both sides are lying. We have to wait until the war is over. Ukrainians claim they've destroyed thousands of armored vehicles,Russians claim they've destroyed almost all of Ukraine's Air Force and control the air space.

The Americans nag about Russian bombings,the Ukrainians say they shoot down Russian aircraft every day.

The Ukrainians say they retook cities,the Russians say they've captured 1/3 of the country.

The media talk about bombings and hundreds of dead,the reporters are always in places where nothing happens.

 

[Oublious]

It is time that Hollywood use TB2 in movies, they should used in games to....


Battlefield 7 drone war....

 

[Falcon26]

We'll see. Both sides are lying. We have to wait until the war is over. Ukrainians claim they've destroyed thousands of armored vehicles,Russians claim they've destroyed almost all of Ukraine's Air Force and control the air space.

The Americans nag about Russian bombings,the Ukrainians say they shoot down Russian aircraft every day.

The Ukrainians say they retook cities,the Russians say they've captured 1/3 of the country.

The media talk about bombings and hundreds of dead,the reporters are always in places where nothing happens.

You’re welcome to pull the Indian stunt and delude yourself. I have nothing against that.