Saudi Arabia to invest more than $20 billion in its military industry over next decade

[The SC]

DUBAI (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia will invest more than $20 billion in its domestic military industry over the next decade as part of aggressive plans to boost local military spending, the head of the kingdom’s military industry regulator said on Saturday.

The Gulf state wants to develop and manufacture more weapons and military systems domestically, aiming to spend 50% of the military budget locally by 2030.

“The government has put a plan that we will be investing in excess of $10 billion in the military industry in Saudi Arabia over the next decade and equal amounts on research and development,” Governor of the General Authority for Military Industries (GAMI) Ahmed bin Abdulaziz Al-Ohali told a defence conference in Abu Dhabi.

He also said the kingdom plans to increase military research and development (R&D) spending from 0.2% to around 4% of armaments expenditure by 2030.


https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN2AK098


$10 billion dollars in the military industry
&
$10 billion military research and development

The important thing is that $20 billion dollars will be pumped into the private military sector inside the kingdom
For Saudi companies .. Research and development of new weapons and systems and the Local military industry..
A very important step that will create jobs and a local industry ecosystem..

 

[FuturePAF]

ToT of modern western, Russian, or Chinese systems is plausible, but advancing in meaningful way beyond products that can be bought off the shelf from the west, won’t get foreign support. The Saudis will have to not only get the equipment but have a top notch staff to assure projects get developed. It will be either training locals or hiring foreigners they can rely upon to advance their domestic production.

Odds are the products developed or built in Saudi will be relatively more modest items and systems, while high end systems will continue to be produced from abroad; such as Fighter jets and high end comms equipment.

 

[The SC]

ToT of modern western, Russian, or Chinese systems is plausible, but advancing in meaningful way beyond products that can be bought off the shelf from the west, won’t get foreign support. The Saudis will have to not only get the equipment but have a top notch staff to assure projects get developed. It will be either training locals or hiring foreigners they can rely upon to advance their domestic production.

Odds are the products developed or built in Saudi will be relatively more modest items and systems, while high end systems will continue to be produced from abroad; such as Fighter jets and high end comms equipment.

Still.. better than nothing..HaHaHa!

Believe it my friend.. the day will come when you will see high end products coming from Saudi Arabia.. in next decade. some for sure and more in the following years..

 

[Titanium100]

ToT of modern western, Russian, or Chinese systems is plausible, but advancing in meaningful way beyond products that can be bought off the shelf from the west, won’t get foreign support. The Saudis will have to not only get the equipment but have a top notch staff to assure projects get developed. It will be either training locals or hiring foreigners they can rely upon to advance their domestic production.

Odds are the products developed or built in Saudi will be relatively more modest items and systems, while high end systems will continue to be produced from abroad; such as Fighter jets and high end comms equipment.

They can tap into arab intellectual talent pool not only Saudis. There are many geniuses running allover the place waiting to be discovered these are the once they need. ''Intellectual property'' Is the most important thing. They can achieve big things imo and they are going the right direction

 

[FuturePAF]

Still.. better than nothing..HaHaHa!

Believe it my friend.. the day will come when you will see high end products coming from Saudi Arabia.. in next decade. some for sure and more in the following years..

Better than nothing indeed. Let’s see what concrete steps they take in this regard, and what compromises they are willing to make to achieve domestic production while still keeping up with their threats.

If anything they should focus on a comprehensive and layered air defense network, to take down the PGM threat.

They can tap into arab intellectual talent pool not only Saudis. There are many geniuses running allover the place waiting to be discovered these are the once they need. ''Intellectual property'' Is the most important thing. They can achieve big things imo and they are going the right direction

This is something they should have done decades ago, across the entire technological spectrum, but better late then never. If they had done this after the outcome of the 1967 war, they would have had over 50 years of catching up with technological threats. Perhaps only now, when the danger of oil becoming less important globally and the instability of putting all their trillions in their sovereign wealth fund in western markets, do they think of self reliance.

 

[Titanium100]

This is something they should have done decades ago, across the entire technological spectrum, but better late then never. If they had done this after the outcome of the 1967 war, they would have had over 50 years of catching up with technological threats. Perhaps only now, when the danger of oil becoming less important globally and the instability of putting all their trillions in their sovereign wealth fund in western markets, do they think of self reliance.

There is really not much to catch up and it was good somehow they avoided all the dragging from the 1960s etc etc. The technology advancement was just not good. People didn't even have mobile phones, and TV's were black and white just 60 years ago in the 1960s. The only country that had a significiant head start on the rest was the US but the cap is shortened today and you could argue some countries may surpass them someone like China in the next 10 years and there are other candidates also.

Sometimes we don't realize how fast the world has moved since the turn of the century. This is the era of technological expansion 2000s and onwards. They can hire the right people who are arabs or even from the entire muslim world and build something unique by hiring people with already experience and plenty of geeks.

Having a new beginning means you can move in a complete different direction and look for more outlandish newer technologies and something the world have not seen

 

[FuturePAF]

There is really not much to catch up and it was good somehow they avoided all the dragging from the 1960s etc etc. The technology advancement was just not good. People didn't even have mobile phones, and TV's were black and white.

Sometimes we don't realize how fast the world has moved since the turn of the century. This is the era of technological expansion. They can hire the right people who are arabs or even from the entire muslim world and build something unique people with already experience.

Having a new beginning means you can move in a complete different direction and look for more outlandish newer technologies and something the world have not seen

The late 60s were when the Asian tigers were taking off. Had Saudi invested in semiconductors and petrochemical products like pharmaceuticals, they could have really had a good chunk of the electronics markets. Jeddah on the trade routes would have made an ideal place to build out an extensive manufacturing industry, and allowed the Saudis to dominate their region militarily. In an alternative history, they could have taken on the Iraqis during the gulf war or nipped the Iranian revolution in the bud.

By the time the new technologies started to emerge, they could be the ones making them like the South Koreans.

Bring closer to raw materials in Africa, they could also have funded infrastructure projects there and really been at the center of globalization before China emerged under Deng Xioping.

All this while employing tens of millions in Saudi and in other Muslim countries. all that oil wealth squandered just seems tragic.

 

[Titanium100]

The late 60s were when the Asian tigers were taking off. Had Saudi invested in semiconductors and petrochemical products like pharmaceuticals, they could have really had a good chunk of the electronics markets. Jeddah on the trade routes would have made an ideal place to build out an extensive manufacturing industry, and allowed the Saudis to dominate their region militarily. In an alternative history, they could have taken on the Iraqis during the gulf war or nipped the Iranian revolution in the bud.

By the time the new technologies started to emerge, they could be the ones making them like the South Koreans.

Bring closer to raw materials in Africa, they could also have funded infrastructure projects there and really been at the center of globalization before China emerged under Deng Xioping.

No. You can't take of in technology there is no such barometer. You mean it was in the 60s the Asian tigers took off economically instead.

As for building technology. You need intellectual property. There is no experience advantage here but ''INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY''

Let me explain this to you. In an arms race the winner will be the one who has most geniuses in his possession? You could have 2 million experienced people if they don't have gifted genius intellectual propety they won't build you stuff or you need a thief who steals from others but that is not the path you wanna chose.

It is not experience and never was when it comes to technology building but IP genius aka people who are divinely gifted separates the mere mortal. People like AQ Khan to be exact with you and you need as many of these folks as you can get in different fields. You need about in total 500 AQ Khans to have an edge on everyone.

Example:

Every 10 years in the world 2000 geniuses are born but the one who gets possession of most geniuses wins the arms race.

Lets assume that China has 25 of these and Japan has like 140? In this case Japan wins the arms race and develops better tech then China and even if China has 10-15 times bigger defense budget. But this is just an example. It is not the size of the budget or experience but IP.

So initially all the difference will come down to how many geniuses and intellectual property you can get under your control.

You don't need people from way back from the 60s. You only need Intellectual property.

but you can increase that number and say example 1000-2000 AQ khan's in every field and even having multiple of them in same fields to strengthen it more

 

[FuturePAF]

No. You can't take of in technology there is no such barometer. You mean it was in the 60s the Asian tigers took off economically instead.

As for building technology. You need intellectual property. There is no experience advantage here but ''INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY''

Let me explain this to you. In an arms race the winner will be the one who has most geniuses in his possession? You could have 2 million experienced people if they don't have gifted genius intellectual propety they won't build you stuff or you need a thief who steals from others but that is not the path you wanna chose.

It is not experience and never was when it comes to technology building but IP genius aka people who are divinely gifted separates the mere mortal. People like AQ Khan to be exact with you and you need as many of these folks as you can get in different fields. You need about in total 500 AQ Khans to have an edge on everyone.

Example:

Every 10 years in the world 2000 geniuses are born but the one who gets possession of most geniuses wins the arms race.

Lets assume that China has 25 of these and Japan has like 140? In this case Japan wins the arms race and develops better tech then China and even if China has 10-15 times bigger defense budget. But this is just an example.

So initially all the difference will come down to how many geniuses and intellectual property you can get under your control.

You don't need experience or people from way back from the 60s. You only need Intellectual property.

but you can increase that number and say example 1000-2000 AQ khan's in every field and even having multiple of them in same fields to strengthen it more

Homegrown, or from allied nations, I agree, Geniuses accelerate a program like nothing else. The Manhattan project is the best example. But everyone steals or copies initially, the soviets has a working weapon within a few years of the Americans, due to the knowledge passed on the Fuchs, and their own geniuses putting it together.

What I was referring to was a broad technological base, companies bought wholesale from overseas with their technology, patents, and contracts offered to their top scientists. Something similar to what Japan did during the Meiji restoration. After WW2, there were a lot of out of work German Geniuses that could have been picked up for relatively cheap. Considering the kind of protection and money the Saudis could offer them, it would have at least layer the ground work to not only start the industries but the Germans could have helped them find Saudi, Arab, or Muslim geniuses from around the he region, that could be taught, and take over from where the Germans left off.

A rigorously honest selection process is the key . The money is just the accelerator.

 

[Titanium100]

Homegrown, or from allied nations, I agree, Geniuses accelerate a program like nothing else. The Manhattan project is the best example. But everyone steals or copies initially, the soviets has a working weapon within a few years of the Americans, due to the knowledge passed on the Fuchs, and their own geniuses putting it together.

What I was referring to was a broad technological base, companies bought wholesale from overseas with their technology, patents, and contracts offered to their top scientists. Something similar to what Japan did during the Meiji restoration. After WW2, there were a lot of out of work German Geniuses that could have been picked up for relatively cheap. Considering the kind of protection and money the Saudis could offer them, it would have at least layer the ground work to not only start the industries but the Germans could have helped them find Saudi, Arab, or Muslim geniuses from around the he region, that could be taught, and take over from where the Germans left off.

A rigorously honest selection process is the key . The money is just the accelerator.

That is actully how the US defeated the Soviet union in the 70s and 80s arms race they were much better then them to gather geniuses example they took in the best Nazi germany had to offer after the fall of Hitler and just absorbed so many talents through out the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s and 00s.. Also Many of them coming from the Central Asia, The Arab world, Subcontinent, China, Japan and other European countries like Tesla etc etc The US have been brain draining everyone.

Look example: They snapped few Pakistani super kids

Muhammad Humza Shahzad: The 6 Year Old Microsoft Professional

world’s youngest computer programmer


Haris Khan-Youngest Smartphone Developer At The Age Of 11

Ayan Qureshi: The Youngest MCP Professional In The World

12. Babar Iqbal- Youngest Certified Internet Web Professional (CIWA) At The Age Of Nine

Currently working at the Microsoft Office in Dubai, Babar Iqbal is the youngest IEEE Researcher. He became the youngest Certified Internet Web Professional (CIWA) at the age of nine.

This is something all countries can learn from and adopt such formula.

The Soviet union had no chance of competing with them because it is a closed society whereas the US is open society with globalist mindset and they had access to all walks of lifes and people from allover the world and inviting them with financial packages. I also think intially China's short coming will be that same issue on the long term. The key element is having access to vast pools not only local.

To give you more definition what it is like when it is US vs China in the real context. The world(US) vs China or Soviet union vs The World(US).. You see the world is always gonna beat one country but you need to create an environment with world talent where it becomes ''The world vs The world'' If you gather more talent it becomes your world team vs theirs but yours is just much better

 

[The SC]

The late 60s were when the Asian tigers were taking off. Had Saudi invested in semiconductors and petrochemical products like pharmaceuticals, they could have really had a good chunk of the electronics markets. Jeddah on the trade routes would have made an ideal place to build out an extensive manufacturing industry, and allowed the Saudis to dominate their region militarily. In an alternative history, they could have taken on the Iraqis during the gulf war or nipped the Iranian revolution in the bud.

By the time the new technologies started to emerge, they could be the ones making them like the South Koreans.

Bring closer to raw materials in Africa, they could also have funded infrastructure projects there and really been at the center of globalization before China emerged under Deng Xioping.

All this while employing tens of millions in Saudi and in other Muslim countries. all that oil wealth squandered just seems tragic.

In the 60's Saudi Arabia wasn't that rich.. in the 70's, 80's and 90's..it has started to build it's infrastructure with mostly the help of south Koreans who were not that rich in those periods.. you can only really talk about 2000 to now..

 

[FuturePAF]

In the 60's Saudi Arabia wasn't that rich.. in the 70's, 80's and 90's..it has started to build it's infrastructure with mostly the help of south Koreans who were not that rich in those periods.. you can only really talk about 2000 to now..

perhaps not the 60s, but surely after the 1973 OPEC oil embargo, the Saudis started getting richer, and instead of pouring that money into their own industrialization, they invest abroad and bought off the shelf for what they needed.

It was a question researchers were asking, way back in 1974; what path was Saudi Arabia’s industrialization going to take. They saw by at least 1974, the Saudis had sufficient funds to finance major development. Perhaps it was a societal modernization, such that by 2000, they were ready to make such a shift, but even then the last 20 years were definitely a lost opportunity, as seen by the progress Dubai has made to leverage its wealth to that end.

Had Saudi carried out similar efforts, due to its large financial potential and location on the Persian gulf and Red Sea, it could have been many folds more industrialized then the UAE.

better late then never.

Saudi Arabia's Economy at the Beginning of the 1970s on JSTOR

Ramon Knauerhase, Saudi Arabia's Economy at the Beginning of the 1970s, Middle East Journal, Vol. 28, No. 2 (Spring, 1974), pp. 126-140

www.jstor.org

 

[The SC]

perhaps not the 60s, but surely after the 1973 OPEC oil embargo, the Saudis started getting richer, and instead of pouring that money into their own industrialization, they invest abroad and bought off the shelf for what they needed.

It was a question researchers were asking, way back in 1974; what path was Saudi Arabia’s industrialization going to take. They saw by at least 1974, the Saudis had sufficient funds to finance major development. Perhaps it was a societal modernization, such that by 2000, they were ready to make such a shift, but even then the last 20 years were definitely a lost opportunity, as seen by the progress Dubai has made to leverage its wealth to that end.

Had Saudi carried out similar efforts, due to its large financial potential and location on the Persian gulf and Red Sea, it could have been many folds more industrialized then the UAE.

better late then never.

Saudi Arabia's Economy at the Beginning of the 1970s on JSTOR

Ramon Knauerhase, Saudi Arabia's Economy at the Beginning of the 1970s, Middle East Journal, Vol. 28, No. 2 (Spring, 1974), pp. 126-140

www.jstor.org

First things first..The infrastructure needed to be built first..We are talking about a huge whole country infrastructure..KSA did well with that.. and since you can't have an arms industry without infrastructure .. one has to go step by step..

 

[FuturePAF]

First things first..The infrastructure needed to be built first..We are talking about a huge whole country infrastructure..KSA did well with that.. and since you can't have an arms industry without infrastructure .. one has to go step by step..

I agree Infastructure needed to be built first, and the population educated, but by at least 2000, they could have pivoted to bring in companies to start non-military industrialization, which would form the backbone of military production down the line.

 

[The SC]

I agree Infastructure needed to be built first, and the population educated, but by at least 2000, they could have pivoted to bring in companies to start non-military industrialization, which would form the backbone of military production down the line.

KSA did just that in many fields.. mostly concentrating on its resources like OIL.. Check The Saudi Aramco..
And now there are more Aramco-like companies emerging in other fields.. including defence..