Plan to restore Pakistan - Lets have suggestions to restore our pride

[Developereo]

Dont ever consider pride in terms of Developments, Science, Technology, Megastructures etc. Pride, to us, means the wisdom of Islam, the teachings of our Holy Prophet, the Rule of Almighty Allah.

The computer that you are using, and the electricity that powers it, and the internet that connects it did not come into existence by some guy reading the Quran.

Islam encourages us to gain knowledge. The world is Allah's creation. Islam encourages us to get to know and understand his creation. It is one of the highest forms of 'ibaadat'.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Hmmm, two points resurface once more
1. Land reforms
2. Madrassah and Mullah culture

As for one, can every one agree that Land reforms must happen now.
That would include federal management of land, and the produce.
All land claims, feudal etc should be considered null and void.

Government should allow for a family based food rationing system at break even price. These food items should be the basic food items.

Any value added food items, such as potato crisps, and cereals etc should be taxed.

Now for point number 2, I fully agree that the present day mullah system is
only fueling anarchy. I am not in particular against religion.
However the system of managing religion should be on the same basis as
Saudi Arabia. All Mullah and clerics should be appointed by the government,
if they fullfill the pre-conditions of age, education, linguistics etc ..

if every one agrees, can we systematize these two work items ?

 

[Sinnerman108]

The seed of revolution:

There is not a doubt in my mind that what eventually will save the day is a revolution of sorts. And it will be no revolution like the blood less take over;
it will be revolution with full cosmetics of blood.

However saying that, I would still not sketch a complete anarchy, and violence for free. As I have said before that should be excellent management skills to lead and control this movement.

A obvious question maybe " where will these skills be found" ; but I like being basic , and the basic question is where will the volunteers and leaders of this movement be found ?

It is my belief, that a movement political or otherwise always has to start from bottom up. Since it is the poor laborer who suffers the most, and who is exploited the most.

A basic paradigm change is required as far as political thinking goes. The same peasants who are driven to polling stations in feudal jeeps must be made aware of their rights.

If the poor laborer learns of his right to his money, and if the laborer learns the worth of his hard work, there is no way he will let his hard earned cashed be stolen by any one, politician or bureaucrat.

Through out the history, any movement which was based at the poorest and oppressed of levels rose to success. And there is a very simple explanation

The first class is busy earning and oppressing the rest of the classes.

The is although oppressed them selves, but they are wanna be first class, so they do not mind being instruments to the first class and take jobs like
managers / supervisors etc. So the Middle class helps the first class in retaining it's hold, and in the process earns a commission.

What is left is the third class, The class who actually works, and creates work orders. This is the class of grain growers, people who make houses and roads,
people who defend the borders, who work in factories at daily wages, people who are fired from jobs with no notice.

Unfortunately these are the same people who have absolutely no facility what so ever. No government aid, no education, no help, and no justice !

It is the hard work and wealth of these people which becomes food for the rest of these classes.

It is obvious that while there is economic classification of people like this, there will always be unrest amongst the population.
Any system which allows for one set of people to oppress and exploit the others and inturn defend the right of the privilaged class to remain in that position of authority
is bound to end in disaster and cause immense suffering to others.


I invite you to criticize this hypothesis, or start to help in spreading awareness
and empowering people for them to take their right.

 

[Developereo]

Well, I am sure the feudal serfs are quite aware on a daily basis of their servitude. But they are powerless to do anything because the police, courts and politicians are all controlled by the feudal lords.

I don't know world history all that well but, it seems to me that even if common people rebel, the revolution is only successful if there is a charismatic individual to provide cohesion and leadership. Otherwise, the sporadic rebellions are eventually quashed by the entrenched interests.

So, I agree that it needs to be a grass roots rebellion but we still need a leader. Otherwise we are just courting anarchy and the military will move in. Maybe that's not so bad. I don't know...

 

[Sinnerman108]

Gents

Please keep contributing to the thread ...
we need your suggestions to keep moving forward, and getting to a point where we can get pragmatic.

I hate to think of our selves as a group who can only talk and critique but not contribute to the cause.

 

[AKHaider]

It seems that being a hardliner or an extremist has become a fashion of sorts these days in the country. Every other post I see on this forum has someone raising his blood pressure & claiming to be the protector of Islam & ALL muslims.

We are not the owners of Islam, and nobody has given us this divine duty of protecting Muslim interests around the world. We can't set our own house in order & we are out to teach the world about how to behave like Muslims.

I know this would be offending to a lot of people here, but this needs to be said. Most of the members here are less than half my age, you're the brains who will drive the nation forward in the decades to come, but if you ingrain your minds with nonsense that is being propagated around, the country is doomed.

Be proud to be a Pakistani first, muslim second. If your identity is Islam & Islam only, then Pakistan is nothing but a piece of real estate inhabited by Non-Indians & Non-Hindus, rather than Pakistanis.

All the successful & prosperous nations of this world have one thing in common - a strong sense of nationalism & identity in their people. USA, Russia, Britain, France, you name it. No such thing exists in Pakistan. It's a culture that you, the youth, will have to build from the scratch. And there will be a lot of obstacles in the way, people preaching hatred, spreading false propaganda & questioning your faith, change is never easy, but it has to come.

I understand that we all want to see Pakistan as a superpower, as a country that everyone in the world respects (and not fears). To affect this massive change requires an even massive effort, given the current image of the country.

Instead of looking around & celebrating others' failures, we should rather be celebrating every tiniest of our successes. But that hardly happens, people here will jump with joy at a piece of news that claims that the USA is breaking up or that 80% of India lives below poverty line. How that affects us? If I had the power, I would lock every young & able Pakistani in a large hall for a few hours and then give all of them a reality check on how bad a condition we are in & how it is only going to get worse if nothing is done. The government will not tell you the humiliating terms & conditions that are put on the table by the so called 'Friends of Pakistan' everytime they loosen their purse to bail us out. T&Cs that no Pakistan worth his salt will tolerate. Yet we only talk about having more fighter jets to fight non existent wars. We have our priorities awfully wrong and nobody seems to care.

There are also some who think that being Muslims, we are immune to failure & sooner or later, we will prevail. I am not talking about the common man on the street, but senior diplomats & politicians. These are people who run the country & have the ability to affect major changes in the way the country is governed, but all they have done is dug the hole deeper. With such people at the helm, who sit tight on their ***** and fill their foreign accounts with all kinds of currency on the planet, it comes as a duty to the youth of Pakistan to take the wheel & drive the country to the right path, but are you doing so? I, most sadly, doubt.

 

[Bane Blade]

We are not the owners of Islam, and nobody has given us this divine duty of protecting Muslim interests around the world. We can't set our own house in order & we are out to teach the world about how to behave like Muslims.

Exactly hence we should have a conservative religious party that should try to set an example with one version of Islam preferably of educated aalims who are closest to the imitation of Khulafaiy Rashida.

I know this would be offending to a lot of people here, but this needs to be said. Most of the members here are less than half my age, you're the brains who will drive the nation forward in the decades to come, but if you ingrain your minds with nonsense that is being propagated around, the country is doomed.

Nonsense that you seniors allowed to grow over the years is effecting our minds and that is very true however I really hope sincerely that we don't allow such idiocy to spread any further.

Be proud to be a Pakistani first, muslim second. If your identity is Islam & Islam only, then Pakistan is nothing but a piece of real estate inhabited by Non-Indians & Non-Hindus, rather than Pakistanis.

Yes but to put a piece of real estate first would be utter rubbish principles in my opinion however to use it as an example for the world would be a very good idea so sticking to your religion would definitely be more important wouldn't it?

All the successful & prosperous nations of this world have one thing in common - a strong sense of nationalism & identity in their people. USA, Russia, Britain, France, you name it. No such thing exists in Pakistan. It's a culture that you, the youth, will have to build from the scratch. And there will be a lot of obstacles in the way, people preaching hatred, spreading false propaganda & questioning your faith, change is never easy, but it has to come.

Yes I agree that all these nations grew on their national identity and ours could easily be Islam and Islam alone couldn't it? We could follow the traditions that Islam allows and run a system according to its modus operandi

I understand that we all want to see Pakistan as a superpower, as a country that everyone in the world respects (and not fears). To affect this massive change requires an even massive effort, given the current image of the country.

and change would only come if we had a binding factor between each other and in this case it can only possibly be religion, as you can see at the moment we lack that awareness however with a nationalist spirit we can bring change for the better.

Instead of looking around & celebrating others' failures, we should rather be celebrating every tiniest of our successes. But that hardly happens, people here will jump with joy at a piece of news that claims that the USA is breaking up or that 80% of India lives below poverty line. How that affects us? If I had the power, I would lock every young & able Pakistani in a large hall for a few hours and then give all of them a reality check on how bad a condition we are in & how it is only going to get worse if nothing is done. The government will not tell you the humiliating terms & conditions that are put on the table by the so called 'Friends of Pakistan' everytime they loosen their purse to bail us out. T&Cs that no Pakistan worth his salt will tolerate. Yet we only talk about having more fighter jets to fight non existent wars. We have our priorities awfully wrong and nobody seems to care.

People in our country have an idea of how poor a state we are in but they don't have a banner to follow that would unite them at the moment.

There are also some who think that being Muslims, we are immune to failure & sooner or later, we will prevail. I am not talking about the common man on the street, but senior diplomats & politicians. These are people who run the country & have the ability to affect major changes in the way the country is governed, but all they have done is dug the hole deeper. With such people at the helm, who sit tight on their ***** and fill their foreign accounts with all kinds of currency on the planet, it comes as a duty to the youth of Pakistan to take the wheel & drive the country to the right path, but are you doing so? I, most sadly, doubt.

True that we have top diplomats but I sincerely doubt that they hope for things to sort themselves out at any point in time they love the situation Pakistanis are in with this odd sort of lack of direction.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Mr Haider

Thank you very much for taking the time out to reply, we really appreciate this and would expect a lot more.

Please help me and others understand some few arguments which I am sure are confusing not just me but many more like me.

I know this would be offending to a lot of people here, but this needs to be said. Most of the members here are less than half my age, you're the brains who will drive the nation forward in the decades to come, but if you ingrain your minds with nonsense that is being propagated around, the country is doomed.

Kind Sir, since you have mentioned that you are almost twice the average age of the visitor on this post, I assume the people who you mention pollute young brains are the same age as you.

Please tell us out of history

a. How did these people who ingrain our minds with false beliefs come into being and how did they go unnoticed from past day authorities ? why did the civil society not take any action ? and how did the scholars of Pakistan let this happen ?.

Be proud to be a Pakistani first, muslim second. If your identity is Islam & Islam only, then Pakistan is nothing but a piece of real estate inhabited by Non-Indians & Non-Hindus, rather than Pakistanis.

This is where the problem starts. The name of the country you refer to as Pakistan happens to be Islamic Republic of Pakistan..
The Idea of Pakistan being a home land for Muslims of Sub-continent where they would be free from persecution and hate by the Hindu majority has been squeezed in our minds since history.

How can I set back religion in favor of Nation?
when we are taught that the Nation exists only because of religion.

I smell either some one has been playing around with history books, or there is some lack of understanding some where.

Please don't feel even for a minute that my questions are rhetorical, I need help to make up my mind for sure.

The youth of this country are willing to change their stance, and change for the better, but the youth need arguments and reasoning to base their beliefs upon.

If yet again, we adopt a set of beliefs without sound reasoning, tomorrow they will be erased once more.

 

[dabong1]

Instead of people standing for election what if we chsnged it got the people to nominate in a vote who they thought would be the best person for the job.

A. Money spent on elections by individuals which is then clawed back by corrupt practice will be finshed.
B. More honest people will be put into postions of power.
C. More democratic with people across the social-economic spectum being put to into postions of power.

As an example is say a certain area has a population of 50'000 the people vote in 25 councillors who then choose amongs themselves who is the best person to represent the people in parliment.
The people in parliment choose the leader and he stays in power for 10 years.

 

[Sinnerman108]

Instead of people standing for election what if we chsnged it got the people to nominate in a vote who they thought would be the best person for the job.

A. Money spent on elections by individuals which is then clawed back by corrupt practice will be finshed.
B. More honest people will be put into postions of power.
C. More democratic with people across the social-economic spectum being put to into postions of power.

As an example is say a certain area has a population of 50'000 the people vote in 25 councillors who then choose amongs themselves who is the best person to represent the people in parliment.
The people in parliment choose the leader and he stays in power for 10 years.

Now that is almost very very right.
That is the closest to what I can think of as an alternate form of government. Some thing that can bind the departments and bureaucracy together to do the same task.

Lets have more suggestions of this sort, maybe open all our minds to some thing efficient and do-able.

 

[Kamakazi 69]

How about we start by spending revitalising the education sector.

I mean, even with the pathetic budget given to education, we only spend about half of it.

Better trained teachers, free education (including uniforms and books), more kids in school.

Then we move on to everything else.

 

[Developereo]

Now that is almost very very right.
That is the closest to what I can think of as an alternate form of government. Some thing that can bind the departments and bureaucracy together to do the same task.

Lets have more suggestions of this sort, maybe open all our minds to some thing efficient and do-able.

One very radical idea I was playing around with is unlikely to happen in real life, but it is an interesting exercise.

- we abolish all provinces and have only small municipalities of at most 250,000 people each. That's 700 elected representatives, which is manageable.

- we abolish all political parties.

This will help remove ethnic and religious agendas from our politics, and hopefully release Pakistan from being held hostage to the decades old family feud between the Sharifs and the Bhuttos (and now Zardaris). It will also make politicians more accountable to their electorate because 250,000 is a small enough number that people can directly meet and question their representative in person. It will make all politics local. It also makes it possible to have direct democracy (actual voting) on important issues within a district, whose result would then determine how the representative would vote in the Parliament.

I realize this is unlikely to happen because, even if the constitution allowed it, political parties would form again in some other guise anyway.

The President would not be elected. There would be competency tests of knowledge and skill that would be open to any Pakistani citizen above a certain age. People can compete in these tests and the winner, after a security check, would be President for a certain term. This is not too risky because most of the actual power would belong to the Parliament; the President would be there to set the general direction of the country.

 

[Student]

Corruption is the problem of Pakistan.

Even the so called best system of governance will fail if it is corrupt.

Without Religion there can be no Basis for morality without morality there is no justice without justics there is just hypocracy.

Ye kainat abhi na-tamam hai shayad
kai a rehei hai dam-a-dam sadaye-Kun-fa-ya-koon

Sabaq Phir Parh Sadaqat Ka, Adalat Ka, Shujaat Ka,
Liya Jai Ga Tujh Se Kaam Duniya Ki Imamat Ka

Nikal Ke Sehra Se Jisne Rooma Ki Saltanat Ko Ulat Diya Tha
Suna Hai Ye Qudsiyon Se Maine Wo Sher Phir Hoshiyar Hoga

Diyaar-e-Maghrib K Rehne Walon, Khuda Ki Basti Dukan Nahi Hai
Khara Jise Tum Samajh Rahe Ho Wo Ab Zar-e-Kam 'Ayaar Hoga.

Tumhaari Tehzeeb Apne Khanjar Se Aap Hi Khudkashi Karegi
Jo Shaakh-e-Naazuk Pe Aashiyana Banega Na-Payedaar Hoga

Is Daur mein Maa Aur Hai Jaam Aur Hai Jam Aur
Saqi Na Bina Ki Larsih e lutfo sitam aur
Muslim Na bhi tamir Kiya Haram Aur

In taza khudaon mein bada sab se watan hai
Jo perhan uska woh mazhab ka kafan hai

Aye Mustafvi Khak Mein Is Bout Ko Mila De
Tu Mustafavi Hai Bazo Tera Tauhid Ki Kouvat Se Kavi Hai

We have ignored the philosohy behind the creation of Pakistan. Our Oath to Allah SAW that if we get this country we will live by THY Law and hence we are subject to this mass Hypocracy from top to bottom that we see today. If we continue down this drain that we are going soon we will be flushed out. Wake up change yourself then change your household then come into the field and try to change the community.

 

[Zee-Gen]

No matter what is the system and how we can change it because at the end its man who will run it. Create good man and u will find your desired results….

Our politics is an example for this…..there is nothing wrong in our 1971 law and in our system, except for the people who are running this system.

Now how we can create good man? The answer is simple……by education....

1. Ban all the Islamic organizations and “Madrassahs” regardless of good or bad even basic religious education in mosques.
2. Start religious education in schools and colleges.
3. There should be only one syllabus for all institutions whether private or public.
4. Education should be free in initial stages that everyone can get it…once a decent level achieved…..then plan according to needs.

The outcome of this plan will be:

Whole educated society that is liberal and possesses great knowledge of Islam………

Now find all the problems around and apply this plan……I am sure you will get exceptional outcome

 

[Sinnerman108]

One very radical idea I was playing around with is unlikely to happen in real life, but it is an interesting exercise.

- we abolish all provinces and have only small municipalities of at most 250,000 people each. That's 700 elected representatives, which is manageable.

- we abolish all political parties.

This will help remove ethnic and religious agendas from our politics, and hopefully release Pakistan from being held hostage to the decades old family feud between the Sharifs and the Bhuttos (and now Zardaris). It will also make politicians more accountable to their electorate because 250,000 is a small enough number that people can directly meet and question their representative in person. It will make all politics local. It also makes it possible to have direct democracy (actual voting) on important issues within a district, whose result would then determine how the representative would vote in the Parliament.

I realize this is unlikely to happen because, even if the constitution allowed it, political parties would form again in some other guise anyway.

The President would not be elected. There would be competency tests of knowledge and skill that would be open to any Pakistani citizen above a certain age. People can compete in these tests and the winner, after a security check, would be President for a certain term. This is not too risky because most of the actual power would belong to the Parliament; the President would be there to set the general direction of the country.

Develepero

That was not radical at all...
As a matter of fact I have been waiting for some one to break the idea and to encourage the readers in this direction.
I have done some research on this concept, and I have some blue prints as well....

Please do suggest how can this be shared ? and how can this be presented ?

I am really looking forward to this now !


Now as for the comments by Zeeshukhan
Sir,
MAN does not run any thing if a system is present,
the basic definition of system is violated if it is let for individual interpretation.
I would encourage you to please go around the ESTA code 1977,
and see for your self why this system is such a failure.