Pakistan's acquisition of the U-214

[Always Neutral]

It will fire Harpoon AShM but the launchers are large enough to accommodate other options as well.

Curious what other options are you talking about.

Regards

 

[Goodperson]

Don't get me wrong but I am curious how will Pakistan finance the acquisition? It just got approval for IMF loan.

 

[Neo]

Don't get me wrong but I am curious how will Pakistan finance the acquisition? It just got approval for IMF loan.

Just like any other military purchase, partly financed by the manufacturer and the rest will be approved by MoD.
Defence expenditures are not affected by IMF loan.

 

[Goodperson]

Just like any other military purchase, partly financed by the manufacturer and the rest will be approved by MoD.
Defence expenditures are not affected by IMF loan.

No I meant didn't IMF put conditions on Defense expenses for loan?

 

[Neo]

No I meant didn't IMF put conditions on Defense expenses for loan?

No, initially she suggested 10-15% decrease but it was refuted as unacceptable.

 

[blain2]

Curious what other options are you talking about.

Regards

Babur SLCM with significant engineering work.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Why would Pakistan buy something India rejected ? which missile will it fire ?

Regards

U-214 is more advanced compared to the Scorpene, by a generation. India rejected it due to previous corruption scams with the same German suppliers, it would be nice if someone could shed more light on that.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

"U33 of the German Navy is the platform for a series of flight tests of the fibre-optic guided IDAS submarine-launched missile, being developed by Diehl BGT Defence, HDW and Kongsberg Defence & Aerospace. In June 2008, the IDAS missile, designed to protect against anti-submarine helicopters, was successfully launched from the torpedo tubes of the submerged U33 submarine."

further more,

"Type 214

HDW has developed the Type 214 submarine, which is a further improvement on the Type 212.

The Greek Navy has ordered three Type 214 submarines. The first, Papanikolis (S120), was built at the HDW Kiel shipyard and was launched in April 2004. As of April 2008, the Greek government has refused to accept delivery of the vessel and a commissioning date is uncertain.

The Hellenic Shipyards is building the second (Pipinos S121, launched November 2006) and third (Matrozos 122) vessels at Skaramanga. Hellenic Shipyards was acquired by HDW (now part of ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems) in May 2002. A fourth vessel, Katsonis (S123) was ordered by Greece in June 2002 and is expected to commission in 2012.

South Korea has also ordered three Type 214, to enter service in 2007, 2008 and 2009. These are being built by Hyundai Heavy Industries. The first, Admiral Sohn Won-il, was launched in June 2006 and commissioned in December 2007. The second, Jung Ji, was launched in June 2007 and is to be delivered in November 2008. The third, Ahn Jung-geun, was launched in June 2008 and will be commissioned in November 2009. The submarines will form the KSS2 Class. An additional three submarines may be ordered.

The Type 214 will have an increased diving depth of over 400m, due to improvements in the pressure hull materials. Hull length is 65m and displacement 1,700t. Four of the eight torpedo tubes will be capable of firing missiles.

Type 214 submarines for the Hellenic Navy will be armed with the WASS (Whitehead Alenia Sistemi Subaquei) Black Shark heavyweight torpedo. The Black Shark is a dual-purpose, wire-guided torpedo which is fitted with Astra active / passive acoustic head and a multi-target guidance and control unit incorporating a counter-countermeasures system. It has an electrical propulsion system based on a silver oxide and aluminium battery.

"The Type 214 will have an increased diving depth of over 400m."Performance of the AIP system has been increased with two Siemens PEM fuel cells which produce 120kW per module and will give the submarine an underwater endurance of two weeks.

A hull shape which has been further optimised for hydrodynamic and stealth characteristics and a low-noise propeller combine to decrease the submarine's acoustic signature.

The integrated sensor underwater system ISUS 90, from ATLAS Elektronik integrates all sensors, command and control functions on board the submarine. BAE Systems provides the link 11 tactical data link. The sensor suite of the U214 submarine consists of the sonar systems, an attack periscope and an optronic mast. The submarine's electronic support measures system and global positioning system sensors are also installed on the optronic mast."

U212 / U214 Attack Submarines - Naval Technology

 

[blain2]

Eat this.. IN is waay too superior in terms of quality not only numerically,compared to PN..

Eat this??? Where did that come from?

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Eat this.. IN is waay too superior in terms of quality not only numerically,compared to PN..

what? your rusting submarine force? please explain on another thread with complete detail and links to prove it, otherwise stop trolling.

 

[Always Neutral]

U-214 is more advanced compared to the Scorpene, by a generation. India rejected it due to previous corruption scams with the same German suppliers, it would be nice if someone could shed more light on that.

Dear Assad,

You are wrong. The Indian Courts lifted the ban. Ex CNS Admiral Prakash as per Jliu said that they had evaluated both platforms but the French said that their exocets would only be possible with a French platform and there was no guarantee on the harpoon missile.

Even Blain suggestion that Babur would be used is quite far fetched unless ofcourse Blain knows more than we do as he has very good connections in the armed forces.

Regards

 

[blain2]

Dear Assad,

You are wrong. The Indian Courts lifted the ban. Ex CNS Admiral Prakash as per Jliu said that they had evaluated both platforms but the French said that their exocets would only be possible with a French platform and there was no guarantee on the harpoon missile.

Even Blain suggestion that Babur would be used is quite far fetched unless ofcourse Blain knows more than we do as he has very good connections in the armed forces.

Regards

AN,

We had the same issue with the French platform (Marlin/Scorpene offer). The French said we want "nothing to do" when the topic of integrating Harpoon came up. While Exocet is a very fine AShM, it does not offer the flexibility that the Harpoon does owing to the range of payload and land attack capabilities being offered in newer blocks of the US AShM.

My comment about Babur was in line with what the Navy has been thinking along the lines of providing a land attack capability (potentially the third leg of the N-triad). I think it will require considerable work but I think with the U-214s, the options are greater than any other conventional platform.

 

[asaad-ul-islam]

Dear Assad,

You are wrong. The Indian Courts lifted the ban. Ex CNS Admiral Prakash as per Jliu said that they had evaluated both platforms but the French said that their exocets would only be possible with a French platform and there was no guarantee on the harpoon missile.

Even Blain suggestion that Babur would be used is quite far fetched unless ofcourse Blain knows more than we do as he has very good connections in the armed forces.

Regards

I stand corrected, thanks for the info. The PN is planning to use Babur on the subs, and it was close to being tested until the current govt. decided to put a halt to it. a few days later, my info was confirmed when the navy chief came out with this statement. By the way, I found out about this a while ago, I think now people are mature enough to handle the news

‘Navy capable of deploying strategic weapons’

By Shamim-ur-Rehman

KARACHI, Oct 14: Chief of Staff of Pakistan Navy Vice-Admiral Asif Humayun has said that navy is fully capable of deploying strategic weapons on the sea, if and when the government takes such a decision.

Speaking at a workshop for the media here on Tuesday, he said that so far the government had not decided to deploy strategic weapons on the sea.

He said that in the context of the evolving strategic environment in the region because of the changing complexion of the war on terror, the navy had to do more in order to ensure a secure environment.The navy’s role in multilateral force in the region was discussed in the context of capability and determination to protect territorial integrity and keep the sea lane safe from terrorists and non-state actors in the region.

The vice-admiral called for providing more battle ships and submarines to the PN for augmenting the country’s defence capabilities and meeting regional maritime needs.

He said the PN’s annual budget of Rs27.5 billion was the lowest of the three services. The budgets of Pakistan Air Force and Pakistan Army are Rs71 billion and Rs141 billion, respectively.

Chief Staff Officer of Commander Pakistan Fleet Commodore Tahseenullah Khan said the Pakistan Navy had formally communicated to the government its requirements and specifications for acquiring new submarines and now it was up to the government to select a country for finalising a deal for undersea platform. The deal for new submarines would include transfer of technology, similar to the deal for Agosta class French submarines.

The participants of the workshop were informed that the navy was trying to acquire LRMP and UAVs as alternative to Atlantic reconnaissance aircraft while it was acquiring seven P3C aircraft from the US. Pakistan Navy was also acquiring the collaborative design capability for building corvettes.

Operational deployment of the PN in the Sir Creek area was also mentioned while reviewing the PN’s roles in defending Pakistan’s Exclusive Economic Zone.

‘Navy capable of deploying strategic weapons’ -DAWN - National; October 15, 2008

second strike, anyone?

 

[satishkumarcsc]

Which missiles are with Pakistan that can be launched from a ship or a Sub?

 

[indiapakistanfriendship]

what? your rusting submarine force? please explain on another thread with complete detail and links to prove it, otherwise stop trolling.

I aint need to prove anything .. if you still don't know then you are either lazy to read or too proud to accept. Compare the micro procrurement aspects and you will see the larger picture. As they say the devil lies in detail > Radar, air defense radar procrurement(for Navy), AAM,s and I can still go on. Please tell me why PN surface fleet with three odd 214 is qualitatively superior to IN. AFAIK PN surface combatants are nothing short of joke. If you can swallow some pride read about IN and its future procurements and order sheets. Why should I dig it up. Even this forum has pretty much good details with regards to IN..
IPF