Pakistan Air Force — new challenges

[Keysersoze]

PAK-FA vs JXX ??? Lol its like comparing Mature with Amature Hahaha. We indians waiting for PAK-FA. Hey by the way what engines would JXX have? Made by china? Or Russia? Lol anyway i just curious Which Jet fighter Pakistan have as a answer to Sukhoi-30MKI? Lol. Su-30MKI cant match F-22 but its Superior to china's Su-30MKK.

Err you are new here so i will give you the benefit of doubt. however where is the PAK-FA? when it flies then come back and crow otherwise i suggest shutting it until that time.

You need to do some research on the Chinese engine developments. They have gotten quite a bit of experience in building them.

And as for the MKI look up F-16 block 50........

 

[Black Stone]

PAK-FA vs JXX ??? Lol its like comparing Mature with Amature Hahaha. We indians waiting for PAK-FA. Hey by the way what engines would JXX have? Made by china? Or Russia? Lol anyway i just curious Which Jet fighter Pakistan have as a answer to Sukhoi-30MKI? Lol. Su-30MKI cant match F-22 but its Superior to china's Su-30MKK.

Seriously, your an embarrassment to other Indian members on this forum. Can you actually make a reasonable post for once?.

You are so proud of India's partnership with Russia on the PAK-FA and you would bash China and Pakistan whenever you get the chance. That is just cheap.

You talk of comparison between PAK-FA and the J-XX like it is your own work, well, it is a partnership, and if I want to bash India, I would even say that PAK-FA is a Russian project and India is just tagging along. Anyways, At least the Chinese are trying to make a 5th generation on their own.

You talk about engines? then tell me, will the PAK-FA have Indian Engines? LOL. Perhaps, the Chinese engine are not as good as the Russian ones, but at least they try and make their own engines.

China is also a late starter when it comes to engine technology compared to the West and the Russians but they are making rapid progress.

Perhaps I will take your posts more seriously when India produces a 5th generation fighter with Indian engines independently, not joint projects and talk like it's their own work LOL.

Disclaimer, No offense to other Indians, but he had it coming.

 

[Keysersoze]

Not to worry guys he has been given a break......hopefully when he comes back he will be a bit more mature

 

[IceCold]

No offense mate, You are one of the respectable and responsible member of this forum, you should be very focused in judging a particuler pieace of new. I am not trying to teach you anything rather giving a suggestion. Above article that has posted above is completely punctuated by lack of general thinking and rationality which is clearly demonstrated by authors quoating of LCA's induction is going on since 1978. On the face of it, he hasn't given name of any Indian author who are claiming MKI as comparable to F-22, comparison with F-15 is understandable.

Another gruesome point is that, author is saying that MKI has been deployed in Kashmir to crush democracy, just tell me how on earth one need to take an offensive measures against defenseless kashmiris with such advance machine. Are really Kashmiris are armed with fighter jets, SAM's or Tanks or anyother armoured vehilcles in their quest for Democracy which is driving IAF to deploy MKI?

Regarding Air crashes, it is world wide knowledge that IAF's jet were once prone to frequent aircrashes but that's because of faulty spare parts that they required to purchase from Soviet's, I am not denying that some operational or human errors also played an important role in those crashes, but massive reasons for those crashes were nothing but faulty spare parts. If author had even slightest dignity for IAF then he must have acknowledge reduction in number of crashes in past few years.

From above article, it is completely clear that, author just seems to be engaged in saber rattling rather then providing any solution for PAF to counter IAF's emergance.

So how exactly is your post related to mine?

 

[shehbazi2001]

PAF is again facing challenges with regard to modernization……..While not abandoning the efforts to modernize and upgrade the capability, PAF should continue to deliver with all the resources at its disposal……

Believing that mind is the ultimate weapon, it should continue to search for solutions to any emerging threats……

Knowledge-based brainstorming should continue to be done to develop counter tactics against advanced fighter jets that pose threat to Pakistan. This should be followed by pilot projects to see the feasibility of those ideas. In those projects, outstanding technicians can also be invited. PAF has been lucky in having very able technicians in addition to officers and their potential should be utilised.

For example, if a fighter jet carries Pulse Doppler radar then it should be dealt differently as compared to simple Pulse radars. Commonly most fighters carry PD ones but then their BVR AAMs also carry radar seekers and a complete data base of specs is vital for devising self-defence tactics……

We mostly discuss only the ranges of radars but don’t discuss its type whether its CW (Continuous Wave), Pulse, Pulse Doppler Radar or a PD radar operating in a CW mode for missile guidance etc and what’s the impact of radar’s type on the performance …

Similarly BVR missiles carry radar seeker in nose cone and their radar types should be studied in detail like what is the scan pattern in addition to acquisition range? Normally it’s in 10-20km range bracket.

For the scan pattern, I liked the pattern of Sea Eagle Anti-ship missile…once it reaches the target area, it switches on its radar…..and the radar beam does a circular search over the sea, each time reducing the radius of the circle ie with each turn, radar tightens the circle to locate the ship…….

so its all a game of knowledge……..

In addition to thinking of self-defence tactics against BVR AAMs, why not work on creating phantom BVR AAM threats for the opposing fighter planes? ….

To a pilot, it’s his Radar Warning Receiver (RWR) that tells him whether he is under attack……if a false alarm can be generated over the RWR, the pilot shall initiate evasive maneuvers without knowing whether actually a missile has been fired…..

Now the false alarm over the RWR can be generated by a drone, special EW aircraft or even AEW aircraft, provided such capability is developed and installed in them…..

Similarly an intelligent ground radar can generate false alarms of SAM launch and put the pilot in panic…….

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Going back to the original post---there is 1/2 a sqdrn of SU 30's within 30 minutes of striking distance from the heart of pakistan----and to date pakistan has nothing to show as to how it would retaliate against a strike mission or what equipment does it have to counter the threat.

The best that pakistan has been able to do is to act like as the threat does not exist and so let it be.

 

[fatman17]

Hi,

Going back to the original post---there is 1/2 a sqdrn of SU 30's within 30 minutes of striking distance from the heart of pakistan----and to date pakistan has nothing to show as to how it would retaliate against a strike mission or what equipment does it have to counter the threat.

The best that pakistan has been able to do is to act like as the threat does not exist and so let it be.

MK - what makes u think nothing is being done?. thanks to expand.

 

[Muradk]

I am fearing the same thing. ASIF(ghadari) made a deal with France for Mirages and Took commission (Because he is Mr 10 &#37 and PAF was stuck with the Mirages as they grew Older and France was reluctant to provide the Latest versions and PAF ran out of Finances as well and on the other hand FRANCE gave Mirage 2000 To India.

I fear he will cut the funding for PAF and take all the money to his SWISS ACCOUNTS or he will make us buy CRAP and he will take commission from that Deal as he has done before.

I hope he does no harm to our relations with China.

I am sorry but your info on mirages and Zardari getting commission is wrong.
the deal didn't go through because Zardari stepped in and wanted to change the amount , the Joint Sec was an airforce officer who refused to change the price and told Zardari he will not change the price at any cost, Zardari offered him 5 million $$ but that PAF Officer opened the whole case when he took the file to the President, by that time it was to late and we never got the Mirages in 1995. We got them later.

 

[Contrarian]

Err you are new here so i will give you the benefit of doubt. however where is the PAK-FA? when it flies then come back and crow otherwise i suggest shutting it until that time.

You need to do some research on the Chinese engine developments. They have gotten quite a bit of experience in building them.

And as for the MKI look up F-16 block 50........

Tell me Key, do you even need to reply to some posts?

 

[JEFF]

So how exactly is your post related to mine?

Because your readiness to acknowledge author's percepation that according to him some Indian analysit consider F-22 with MKI and your subsequent readiness to consider the same.

 

[metalfalcon]

I am sorry but your info on mirages and Zardari getting commission is wrong.
the deal didn't go through because Zardari stepped in and wanted to change the amount , the Joint Sec was an airforce officer who refused to change the price and told Zardari he will not change the price at any cost, Zardari offered him 5 million $$ but that PAF Officer opened the whole case when he took the file to the President, by that time it was to late and we never got the Mirages in 1995. We got them later.

With all due respect sir this is what i heard, It was in the NEWS and PAPERS many years ago and even on WIKIPEDIA i read this, but what you have told me i never heard that so i must say THANK YOU SIR !

I salute Joint Sec who was the air force officer who saved PAF and precious Pakistani tax payer's money. But Still this guy, who happens to be our President as well (Webmaster has told all the members, not to insult him as he is our President now so i will not say anything even though i want to ) Did Every thing to earn money from this Deal.

PAF is run by Professional People and and they know very well how to deal with Every threat, I am 100 % sure PAF is working on the threat posed by Su-30 MKI and very soon INSHALLAH we will hear a good news.

 

[TOPGUN]

I agree we will be ready for any challenge inshallah!!!!!!

 

[metalfalcon]

A hero is born During CRISIS

There is no problem without a solution, Pakistan came out of crisis in the past as well and Pakistan will continue to do so.

PAF has many challenges BUT we have great Leadership, Skilled professionals and Ambitious Engineers, If we can Make Al-Khalid Tank (one the BEST in the WORLD), If we can Make JF-17 Thunder (one the best in the 4th Generation fighter List) and AGOSTA submarines (one of the best In the Arabian sea) and in the Last but not Least If we can make The most Complex weapons like Nuclear weapons Then i see no Reason Pakistan Can't make a 5th Generation Fighter to Challenge Mig 1.44 and PAK-FA.

All PAF need is Determination (Which they already have) and Funding from Govt (which is doubtful) To overcome the Challenges thrown by the IAF.

Where there is a will there is a way

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

The joint sec didnot realize what the implications were of his good deed---even if Zardari was paid a handsome sum from that purchase---pakistan airforce would have been 13 years ahead of where it is now----a whole line of mirage 2000's would have been flying in the pakistani colors alongwith with the rafaels for extra support. The issue of the BVR's, high quality radars, deep strikes and air superiority against the indian airforce would have been discussed at a different level.

Indeed righteousness prevailed at that time---but strategy and gamesmanship failed. I don't think if anybody ever realized the consequences of that decision---I don't think that any pakistani has analyzed the loss to the PAF for not going forward with that order of mirage 2000's.

Pakistan hardly has any aircraft today, that could compete one on one with with the indian mirage 2000's.

People talk about superior training etc etc---IAF is not behind anyone in its training of its pilots. The present flyers of the mirage 2000's, the su 27's the jags the su 30's can take on anyone anywhere head to toe----my pakistanis can only say that we will die with pride---the indians are saying---ok---when and where.


Fatman---the pride of the IAF is stationed within 20 minutes off the pakistani heartland----india is sending out a dare to pakistan and PAF---there is a message---something has happened between the world super power and india in relation to pakistan since the departure of Musharraf---some kind of a deal has been struck---the posture of IAF has gone from wait and see attitude to right in your face stance---india doesnot need su 30's to fight insurgency in kashmir---they had their mirage 2000's for that.

Pakistan is busy in infighting amongst its different political parties since the earthquake. The millitary was caught with its pants down when the time came to order high tech equipment----there was too much jumping around and too many orders changed---even Gen retd Collin Powell made that comment in one of his interviews---.

Let me ask you Fatman----name one plane that can combat the su 30 today-----not tomorrow or the day after---name one missile system that can take down enemy aircraft flying 30 thousand feet in the air straight up. It has been 7 plus years since 9/11 when the world opened its doors to our defence needs.

We have the al khalid---that was started before 9/11---we have agostas---they were also started before 9/11---we have the cruise missiles---thanks to Bill Clinton for not asking about the ones salvaged in pakistan---the cruise missile programme started before 9/11-----but where is the point defence----where are the 20---30---50---100 miles range ground to air defence missile system---spada is just one order---what is it---20 plus miles---.

 

[ejaz007]

Yes indeed some thing has been cooked up by USA and India. The reward perhaps is nuclear deal. We need to be on our toes for atleast three to four months.

The Mirage 2000 deal should have been concluded regardless of who was getting commission. Commissions are paid by most sellers and Saudi UK deal or India Bofors deal are good examples. Atleast we would have some good quality fighters to fly and challenge IAF.