PAF J-10C News, Updates and Discussion

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

I agree to many of your points and that how our approach should be and all. That's going certainly to geopolitics area. So I will make a new thread in some days whenever got the time as otherwise this thread will get majorly off-topic. But just to summarize, I know nobody is your 'brother' in geopolitics, in the end its business & politics. Sometimes common objectives makes us allies. The way we see, United States and india have become allies & partners for foreseeable future. India is not just United State's hired gun but their economic, strategic goals are well defined. I see the US will not chose or give any favor to Pakistan in anyway at expense of India. Indian policy makers are sharp, they want the best out of US -indo relations and they will ensure that Pakistan is kept at distance.

Absolutely, and it's imperative that we (i.e., our decision-makers) understand that this puts China in a precarious situation. Unfortunately, we're unable to leverage the geo-political reality to our favour (i.e., by exacting real concessions from China in return for derailing India and keeping America out of their backyard). Why? Because our leaders and elites are tied to the West; the former need Green Cards, the latter need trade.

China hasn't done anything to swing the latter (business elites) to their side (if anything, CPEC distanced them further), hence the lack of energy in aligning Pakistan with China. If China could've gotten Pakistani business elites on its side, then perhaps they'd throw out pro-Western military and political leaders by leveraging the media, economy, and other levers to throw the old hacks out.

 

[arslank03]

I don't disagree with the ideas you've raised, but China has never imposed crippling sanctions on Pakistan, it's as simple as that.

For the Pak military, securing uninterrupted supply lines is of critical importance. In addition, there has been significant ToT from China, case in point, the JF-17 would not have been possible. You can argue about the merits of the JF-17, but what other country or source of military technology would have allowed the PAF to establish some sort of home-grown technology base?

After all, beggars can't be choosers.

thats because china has never been in the position to do so. Remember, China is very new to its position of power, it would not do anything to hurt its rise

 

[TheSolution]

thats because china has never been in the position to do so. Remember, China is very new to its position of power, it would not do anything to hurt its rise

It's really pathetic that we have to rely on a foreign nation to make certain decisions just so our leadership acts in the nation's interest

 

[prothought]

lol, dont worry about my literacy, paindu.

Perhaps its time you brush up on your comprehension, as they were two separate statements.

I'd love for you to share how chinese equipment "comes with no conditions" lol, once again, let me know when you will see J-10c's flying alongside NATO or Turkish birds, or even, when you will see Pakistani modifications to it (local wpns integration etc), something which the chinese even blocked on the JF-17, which JamD has mentioned numerous times. On top of that, do enlighten me about Chinese business practices, withholding part numbers from PAC, coercing them to buy things they dont need- selling only packages, withholding technical data and documents, the list goes on. This is not just a planes thing, HIT has had the same experience. Just because you are UNAWARE of Chinese conditions, does NOT mean they do not exist. Chinese twist our arm to extract every dollar out of us, dollars provided by them as loans, then paid back at silly interest rates later. The Chinese have found a cash cow in Pakistan ironically.

Do you have any evidence to prove your claim (for example Chinese twist our arm to extract every dollar out of us, dollars provided by them as loans, then paid back at silly interest rates later).
I am pretty sure your claim is no better than a lie. You are just parroting what your western masters are saying time and again.

Literally, the ONLY aligned interest between China and Pakistan is containment of India, that's it. China has two interests, Containing India and then securing and growing itself, at ANY cost, including countries. As seen by the insane debt traps being laid out globally.

Here we go. It really exposes your ignorance. Please do some research/study on geopolitics and international relation before commenting on this topic. Pakistan and China are having much wider and far far reaching overlap of interests. That overlap would easily shadow any other common interests that we might have with any other nation and our common interests with the US being probably the smallest one. Please shrug off your bias towards western countries. We all need to be realistic.

 

[FuturePAF]

It's really pathetic that we have to rely on a foreign nation to make certain decisions just so our leadership acts in the nation's interest

There is no mechanism in place that ostracized members of the elite that do things for their personal gain over the national interest. Many of the elite act solely or at least overwhelming primarily in their own self-interest as those they were just any ole middle class person.

The national institutions give them privileges without demanding they moderate their behavior, but to their credit, when democracy keeps getting derailed, even the staunchest patriot has their family telling them to second guess their decisions and do what’s best for their personal self interest, because if they don’t their a fool.

 

[Tps43]

Just my opinion, but I agree, the PAF will likely pursue a new air-to-air refueling (AAR) platform soon, maybe as its next acquisition target.

However, I don't think getting the A330 MRTT directly from Airbus can be on the cards (as they have a vested business interest in India). But...I can see the PAF trying an original project where they acquire some surplus airliner A330s and, in turn, modify them into AARs using UPAZ hose-and-drogue pods. It wouldn't be a simple project, but I'm sure Paramount Group from South Africa could take a shot at it, just as they are with the Sea Sultan LRPMA. It'd crack open the AAR market to more players too, and I'm sure the likes of Leonardo and others would love that

You are right they are looking for surplus A330 airliners and than turn them into AAR but the problem Paf is facing rn is they aren't getting their hands on suitable airframes as used airliners are short in market especially all variants of Airbus. They will have to get the new airliner variant directly from airbus and then go for conversion but regardless of any situation new MRRTT platform is high up the list.

 

[TheSolution]

There is no mechanism in place that ostracized members of the elite that do things for their personal gain over the national interest. Many of the elite act solely or at least overwhelming primarily in their own self-interest as those they were just any ole middle class person.

The national institutions give them privileges without demanding they moderate their behavior, but to their credit, when democracy keeps getting derailed, even the staunchest patriot has their family telling them to second guess their decisions and do what’s best for their personal self interest, because if they don’t their a fool.

Our elite and upper-class are (unfortunately) filled with the lowest quality and worthless humans you could possibly find on the planet, and the worst thing about it is that they've deluded themselves into thinking they are somehow more respected and better people.

Extremely narcissistic, corrupt, destructive, disloyal to their own people and country, cheaper to buy than a local street prostitute and the worst of all is that they suffer from an inferiority complex. They are insecure in themselves and their own lifestyle/culture to the point where their politics isn't based on independent thinking - they think by copying the politics and cultures of foreigners (Americans, etc) makes them more valuable. Little do they release they come off as insecurity-ridden and even less likeable and respectable.

Fundamentally if your politics and everything you do is not rooted in pragmatism for what is actually beneficial for your unique and specific circumstances, then you will entirely mess up everything around you because the solutions to Pakistan's problems are not at all the same as the solutions to America's or other countries problems.

Being a feminist and liberal just because you think it makes you look "modern" since that's trending in America is the cringiest and most pathetic, insecure thing ever.

Even Indians don't do this.

 

[Tps43]

how do you know for sure?

Because I know them through mutuals in workspace

I hope it's not the transport ......... :-(

I do want it to be C-130's or refuellers for the ease of operational & logistical matters. Integrating every component is vital for Paf's doctrine.

 

[arslank03]

You are right they are looking for surplus A330 airliners and than turn them into AAR but the problem Paf is facing rn is they aren't getting their hands on suitable airframes as used airliners are short in market especially all variants of Airbus. They will have to get the new airliner variant directly from airbus and then go for conversion but regardless of any situation new MRRTT platform is high up the list.

well well well
if only someone was retiring their 777's

Though i think this project would be biting off more than they can chew, it would be very nice to see the 777's be brought into AF use, our own AF1, tankers, whatever else

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

well well well
if only someone was retiring their 777's
View attachment 957069

Though i think this project would be biting off more than they can chew, it would be very nice to see the 777's be brought into AF use, our own AF1, tankers, whatever else

Mysterious transfers of Cobham AAR pods one day, perhaps...

 

[Tps43]

well well well
if only someone was retiring their 777's
View attachment 957069

Though i think this project would be biting off more than they can chew, it would be very nice to see the 777's be brought into AF use, our own AF1, tankers, whatever else

PIA would die on train track before offloading 777's. There's 777 cult over there just like the F-16 cult in Paf

 

[arslank03]

PIA would die on train track before offloading 777's. There's 777 cult over there just like the F-16 cult in Paf

Mysterious transfers of Cobham AAR pods one day, perhaps...

someone needs to take a danda and force the tri services to standardise on things like aircraft

 

[Reichmarshal]

Turkey looking to acquire the j10c !

 

[El Sidd]

My wish is for having 36 Block 72's

bante hain.

PIA would die on train track before offloading 777's. There's 777 cult over there just like the F-16 cult in Paf

777 are aesthetically beautiful and our tharak on them is here to stay.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Turkey looking to acquire the j10c !

There is NO way that Turkey is going to buy the J10C.. they just got their approval for F16s for approving Sweden into NATO and their Ka'an project is maturing towards its first flight soon,