PAF Future Leading Aircraft

[Super Falcon]

J 10 is only suitable platform

 

[mingle]

J 10 is only suitable platform

No it would be twin Engine .

 

[Amigator]

J 10 is only suitable platform

If you read about J-10, you will come to know that Jf-17 thunder will be almost equal to J-10B variant. Same radar will be used by both. KLJ-7A for JF-17 thunder is proposed which is an AESA radar also known as 1473H radar is being used in latest model of J-10B

Only major difference b/w 2 will be of payload & hard points. In block 3 we will narrow this difference.

 

[CHI RULES]

If you read about J-10, you will come to know that Jf-17 thunder will be almost equal to J-10B variant. Same radar will be used by both. KLJ-7A for JF-17 thunder is proposed which is an AESA radar also known as 1473H radar is being used in latest model of J-10B

If you read about J-10, you will come to know that Jf-17 thunder will be almost equal to J-10B variant. Same radar will be used by both. KLJ-7A for JF-17 thunder is proposed which is an AESA radar also known as 1473H radar is being used in latest model of J-10B

Only major difference b/w 2 will be of payload & hard points. In block 3 we will narrow this difference.

major difference b/w 2 will be of payload & hard points. In block 3 we will narrow this difference.[

The AESA radar on J10b must be better in range as compared to lighter AESAs developed for JF17 due to more space and power availability in case of J10b/c

Its the F-16 obsession. PAF wants to get more used or new F-16's, just like it rounded up a hundred Mirages eventually. PAF has got its hands on F-16's spares even during sanctions, so PAF sees no issues with that otherwise PAF would have jumped on a new aircraft by now. Have you not observed that the fighter induction in PAF is there but only F-16's in past few years. JF-17 is a domestic induction which will continue regardless of any other fighter induction in PAF.

Statements by PAF and other officials come out as looking for new aircrafts like 5th gen and even conducting domestic ventures. Cost issue or budget may not be a hurdle since PA and PN are acquiring new weapon systems also. PAF has looked at every available option out there but practically PAF seems to be looking only for the F-16's.

Dear Pak has limited resources and induction of new platform shall require huge investment in infrastructure and training that's not simple plug and play. Pak will shall require F16 even as second tier jet once we get enough JF17 BLOCK iii along with induction of expected 5th gen fighter. Like Mirages they are long race horses.

 

[The Accountant]

I

I don't give a damn to such labels and what fanboys say. One must tell the truth and shatter the fragile and unrealistic dreams of kids on this forum and wake them up to the bitter reality so they do something if they can and survive.

I'm totally in favour of indigenous development of 5th gen A/C but there are few caveats to this approach. PAF is in dire need of an upgrade. Right now it is lagging behind any force in the region both in terms of quality and quantity. This program is late by at least two decades. Furthermore, Pakistan is starting with a huge handicap, how much experience PAF has of designing even a 4th gen A/C? JF17 was beyond the design stage when PAF joined it.

Look at Russia and China, with huge experience of designing multiple A/C, established aviation industry and a huge industrial base, deep budgets and skilled labour, it has taken them decades and still Russia has not been able to provide a production ready 5th A/C, China has though inducted J-20 but still it is a long way to go before China may be able to help PAF since it needs such birds itself in large numbers and still it is not comparable to F35, it will take a decade for China to catch up with the USA.

One of the best way for PAF now is to participate in J-31 program and channel the funds and resources in it to get the bird before the water is way above their heads.

The way PAF has started is ridiculous, right now they are starting with the human resource development, can you please tell me how many years will it take to get the right number of skilled people ready? bhai jaaan yeh truck ka batti ha, jo naswar pee kar aapke air chief ne qoam ko laga diya hai...

Is there a viable schedule with set timelines, and stop gap strategy taking into account the developments happening around us? The answer is a resounding 'No'.

I don't understand who is behaving a fan boy here ...

Look at your economy, your exports are puny you are in consisten trade deficit ,,, you dont even manufacture a motor cycle designed by you and yet you are saying that aviation city project is stupidity ? how naive ...

Aviation city is not to design own aircraft but to prepare a work force for future development programs the work force that can absorb the knowledge base from thunder and upcoming 5th generation program ... Who told you that Pakistan is going to design its own fifth generation ?? You are behaving wired ...

With the available resources at hand PAF is doing its best and the best example is comparision between thunder and Tejas program ... look where thunder is standing today and tejas is no where on the scene ...

Yaar hamary mulk k loog 1 motor cycle tu bana nahi sakty or jis institute ny thudner jaisy program ko successful ker dekhaya un ko gaaliyan dety hain ... I don't understand hum mn kun itny ehsan faramosh hain ...

PAF mn bhi log asman sy nahi aty hum jaisy hi choor uchakay wahan per bhi ... in comparision to an average Pakistani contribution and success of PAF are much more werna aaj Pakistan ka namo nishan nahi hota ... Saary tax chor bethy hain hamary mulk mn ... honestly sy tax dn tu PAF q na purchase kary gi typhoon?

What you are trying to say that PAF is willingly declining state of the art Rafael and Typhoon and are begging for f16s? Dont you know that amount needs to be invested for setting up infrastructure of just one squadron of typhoon will be much more than annual budget of PAF ... Rafael deal of India is close to total annual budget of all branches of Pakistan armed forces ...

Hamari jaib mn paisa nahi ha or jo loog kam paisy mn bhi apna maximum deny ki koshish ker rahy hain un ko galiyan dy rahy hain hum loog ...

 

[war&peace]

I

I don't understand who is behaving a fan boy here ...

Look at your economy, your exports are puny you are in consisten trade deficit ,,, you dont even manufacture a motor cycle designed by you and yet you are saying that aviation city project is stupidity ? how naive ...

Aviation city is not to design own aircraft but to prepare a work force for future development programs the work force that can absorb the knowledge base from thunder and upcoming 5th generation program ... Who told you that Pakistan is going to design its own fifth generation ?? You are behaving wired ...

With the available resources at hand PAF is doing its best and the best example is comparision between thunder and Tejas program ... look where thunder is standing today and tejas is no where on the scene ...

Yaar hamary mulk k loog 1 motor cycle tu bana nahi sakty or jis institute ny thudner jaisy program ko successful ker dekhaya un ko gaaliyan dety hain ... I don't understand hum mn kun itny ehsan faramosh hain ...

PAF mn bhi log asman sy nahi aty hum jaisy hi choor uchakay wahan per bhi ... in comparision to an average Pakistani contribution and success of PAF are much more werna aaj Pakistan ka namo nishan nahi hota ... Saary tax chor bethy hain hamary mulk mn ... honestly sy tax dn tu PAF q na purchase kary gi typhoon?

What you are trying to say that PAF is willingly declining state of the art Rafael and Typhoon and are begging for f16s? Dont you know that amount needs to be invested for setting up infrastructure of just one squadron of typhoon will be much more than annual budget of PAF ... Rafael deal of India is close to total annual budget of all branches of Pakistan armed forces ...

Hamari jaib mn paisa nahi ha or jo loog kam paisy mn bhi apna maximum deny ki koshish ker rahy hain un ko galiyan dy rahy hain hum loog ...

If you are talking about Oct 19, 2017....then perhaps 30-40% of your rant makes sense but if we are talking about at 3 decades of bad decision and lethargy on the part of PAF and their ahsaan faramoshi, then your rant makes no sense at all.
But no problem, we can have an objective discussion once you get sober.

 

[PakAlp]

Comparing Indian future planes vs Pakistan as expected and evident forecast till 2030
Rafale 36
Make in india 36 estimated
Sukhois 280
Migs29 70
Tejas 60 estimated
Mirages 50
Jaguar 100
Pakistan
F16 76
Jf17 200
Mirages 100
Any 4.5 gen 36 (if we decide now)
The balance is totally out like 2:1 including quality difference and i am expecting Indian economy would grow faster so they can buy more and can diversify more.
What are our chances of survival against any Indian threat, cause it will be a huge threat.
Forget the navy...

I would say by 2030 Indian Air force would look like:

Rafale - 72
Sukhois - 280
Mig 29 - 70
Tejas - 150
5th Gen - 100
Total approx 680 fighter planes

Pakistan air force would look like:
F16 - 70
Jf17 - 250 all block 3
5th Gen - 36
Total approx 356 planes

Pakistan desperately needs a 4.5th generation heavy weight fighter plane numbering 100 planes.
But since the money issue and lack of fighters available i think Pakistan is planning to rely on jf17 block 3 to counter Indian threats. Similar to Japan Sweden and South Korea.
The other option they have is J11D which needs Russian permission for export.
This Pak airforce looks alot more deadly:
F16 - 70
Jf17 - 250 all block 3
J11D - 100
5th Gen - 36
Total approx 456 planes

 

[The Accountant]

If you are talking about Oct 19, 2017....then perhaps 30-40% of your rant makes sense but if we are talking about at 3 decades of bad decision and lethargy on the part of PAF and their ahsaan faramoshi, then your rant makes no sense at all.
But no problem, we can have an objective discussion once you get sober.

Yes sure i will be happy to listen to u ...

My point is f16 is still the best fighter im f16 ... Issue is of quantity if we could maintain the quantity then they can even take care of rafael assuming that we will be allowed upgrade to blk 62 level ...

Thunder was also achieved back in late 90s and was a reaction to pressler ammendment ...

If you remember we are in continous financial crisis except for few years of musharaf era so we had no budgets for procurements and hence we came with thw idea of budget fighter and we did astonishingly well despite of having no experience and facilities required still if you think PAF did blunders than kindly enlighten me ...

 

[barbarosa]

SU 35 is best.

 

[Amigator]

SU 35 is best.

Its high maintenance & operational cost is very high. Rafales and Grippen are also expensive one but comparatively has less maintenance and operational cost to Flankers.

 

[princefaisal]

If you read about J-10, you will come to know that Jf-17 thunder will be almost equal to J-10B variant. Same radar will be used by both. KLJ-7A for JF-17 thunder is proposed which is an AESA radar also known as 1473H radar is being used in latest model of J-10B

Only major difference b/w 2 will be of payload & hard points. In block 3 we will narrow this difference.

J-10B is flying while JF-17 block 3 (at par with J10B) will come in 2019. So there is a time gap. Also when block-3 will come, J-10D would be flying in China.

 

[rohailmalhi]

J-10B is flying while JF-17 block 3 (at par with J10B) will come in 2019. So there is a time gap. Also when block-3 will come, J-10D would be flying in China.

I have seen people go over and over again with the notion that we should go with J-10B, But do you know how much effort is needed to integrate a new platform, which is not much different than JF-17 Block 3.

JF-17 as a platform is already in use with PAF so integrating Block III wont be much of an issue.

At this point in time , what we need is a advanced 4.5 Gen fighter like Typhoon or Rafales e.t.c

 

[princefaisal]

I have seen people go over and over again with the notion that we should go with J-10B, But do you know how much effort is needed to integrate a new platform, which is not much different than JF-17 Block 3.

JF-17 as a platform is already in use with PAF so integrating Block III wont be much of an issue.

At this point in time , what we need is a advanced 4.5 Gen fighter like Typhoon or Rafales e.t.c

Need is now and waiting for 2019. Good going...

 

[rohailmalhi]

Need is now and waiting for 2019. Good going...

Do you even know how much effort is needed to accomodate a new platform ?

It is not simple as that, In reality it is a very tedious process and in our case might take up a year or so to negotiate a deal , given if the parties are willing to offer us the technology we are seeking.

 

[mikkix]

Do you even know how much effort is needed to accomodate a new platform ?

It is not simple as that, In reality it is a very tedious process and in our case might take up a year or so to negotiate a deal , given if the parties are willing to offer us the technology we are seeking.

We will talk same thing in 2022. All we know is talk, money issues, no supplier and tedious process..