No Nuclear Limit: China

[CardSharp]

Does this imply that you condone racist personal attacks from your fellow countymen?

I'll condemn it when I see it.

 

[casual]

this thread needs to be closed.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Does this imply that you condone racist personal attacks from your fellow countymen?

He does the same thing by categorizing all Chinese as racist and communist.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I can't believe you guys are letting gambit get you all worked up. The guy is a walking mental case, he needs therapy not more fuel to add to his hate engine.

Exactly right.

 

[marshall]

Go worry about Viet Defense. The Chinese nor the Americans need you. People of your ethnicity were slaves of the Chinese, the French and now your own commie government. Gambit, your kind are born as slaves and should behave promptly.

I don't know what ethnicity GAMBIT but he doesn't act like the Vietnamese I know at all. Just keep this in mind. If I were to take a guess, he might have even made it up to to see what the reactions would be just like alot of Indians do by pretending to be somebody else and some FLG Chinese pretending to be pro-China while they criticize it with stupid stuff they read in Epoch Times.

 

[gambit]

I don't know what ethnicity GAMBIT but he doesn't act like the Vietnamese I know at all. Just keep this in mind. If I were to take a guess, he might have even made it up to to see what the reactions would be just like alot of Indians do by pretending to be somebody else and some FLG Chinese pretending to be pro-China while they criticize it with stupid stuff they read in Epoch Times.

You mean I do not act like a Viet you BELIEVE should act, which is anti-US and subservient to any Chinese.

 

[gambit]

Does this imply that you condone racist personal attacks from your fellow countymen?

I'll condemn it when I see it.

Yeah...

Well let's just say there were plenty of Chinese willing to serve the Japan Imperial Army for "intelligence and counter intelligence" too, when they killed 20 million Chinese.

lol @ you being a regionalist.

Us mainlanders may be crude and unfashionable in your eyes (love the k-pop hair btw) but there is little chance of us dying in blue on blue , just because that country boy from down the road thought you were a gook.

Let us know when you are serious enough about it that you will refrain from using such derogatives when there is no need for them to make your point.

 

[gambit]

"第十八条　义务兵服现役的期限：陆军三年；海军、空军四年."
ÖлªÈËÃñ¹²ºÍ¹ú±øÒÛ·¨¡¾1984-05-31¡¿

Thanks for continue to prove yourself ignorant. If you bother to do a little more research, then you would know the new NCO system that reduce conscription to 2 years will not take effect until later this year after it was passed in 2010. As of now, 3 years is still the term of service.

Sorry...But as much as I would like to, I do not read Chinese. This is primarily an English speaking forum. Post your sources in English. And...You may want to direct this to your pal who originally claimed that the PLA does not have a conscription program.

Conscription? LOL! What an imbecile! Don’t take mainland China for USA! Only democratic KMT has conscription, not “communist” PRC.

Nevertheless, at least we know that there is a reduction and as if a three year time in service is not bad enough, a two-year term is even worse, especially if this is service wide. Heck...Am willing to bet that you did not know that there is a two-year time in service requirement.

The number of NCO in the military in 2007 made up roughly half the military enlisted,...

And that is not good.

...not counting officers.

A curious statement. Of course the NCO corps does not contain commissioned officers. Sounds like you do not know what you are talking about.

Most technical knowledge intense units have 70 to 80% ratio of NCOs. The number had grown to 900,000 in 2009, and that was two years ago. An intermediate grade 3 NCO would have served in the military for over 12 years, plenty of time to train others. A steady stream of new blood ensures China has a vast reserve to personal to choose from in case of war. The army could be quickly expanded with minimal retraining for troops.

Here is what you do not understand...In an all volunteer force with at least half of the first-term enlistees reenlisted, and with a sufficient time in service requirement for that first term, the force would not have such an concentration of institutional knowledge into one group. We are not talking about a commando unit where all members are NCOs because they must have experience to even apply as candidates. We want those institutional and technical knowledges to be dynamic, laterally and vertically. Time to conduct training does not equal to having students to train and the more technically challening fields, the more time it will require to train new students. What is the ratio of conscripts who decide to reenlist versus those who decide not? Will the number of those who chose to reenlist compensate for the number of continuing retirees from the upper enlisted ranks? If not, then the enlisted force will inevitably have this gross disparity of NCOs versus the lower ranks and a declining number of new minds to transfer the institutional knowledge. A war's attrition rate will deplete the ranks of those with institutional knowledge faster than they could remain alive to pass it on. So regardless of the force being all volunteer or conscripts, either increase the time in service requirement or suffer the consequences at the worst time.

What I have been saying is proven over and over and over throughout history and all the world's major successful militaries, the ones that managed to project their power and dominate their enemies. In times of national emergencies, of course everyone will rally behind the flag and willing to make sacrifices. But in peace, an all volunteer force is the best guarantor of a high quality military for deterrence and increased odds of success in the event of that national emergency. What I see here is typical behavior of letting one's nationalism overrode one's common sense when presented with reasonable arguments.

Really? The process requires you to register yourself in front of a recruiter and be examined, not actually go. You get to pick whether you choose to do it or not. Even if you are willing, you still need to compete with other candidates for a spot. In that case, the selective service system in United States is conscription too? Since it requires you to register.

Wrong...The US Selective Service Registration program in no way qualify as a conscription. A conscription policy does not mean everyone are automatically inducted into service. There is something called SELECTIVE CONSCRIPTION and this is what the PLA is doing. The American program does not require the person to present himself for examination. He does not even need a Social Security number. He just need to let the government know he is available for military service. He is the one doing the selection between offers.

Why don't you ask the Chinese government to change the constitution? Since it stated every citizen has responsibility to defend the country and military laws are written according to such. Unlike some country where recruiters try to sucker people in.

And yet we have a higher than %50 retention rate across the board. It pays to have some 'sucker' programs, especially when it paid off, as in Desert Storm that shocked the PLA into changes. But if life in the PLA is so good, then would that not be enough to offset any conscription policy or even a law?

Yes, you were making assumptions. PLA's professional education system is available to both NCOs and officers. I can name at least 5 different NCO schools that belong to the army alone.

That does not mean their attendance is mandatory.

I've made no implications that education was optional. It was you that made the assumption.

Of course you made such an implication. Here...

Some NCOs are even sent to military academies and commissioned as officers later.

The word 'even' implied that such assignments are selective and therefore that higher PME is either an option for the individual to exercise, or those assignments are at the commanders' discretions. For US, there are no options.

For example...

Enlisted professional military education: Air Force - Air Force Careers - Air Force Times

Enlisted airmen have four levels of Professional Military Education, with graduation from in-residence PME required for promotion to certain ranks:

• Airman Leadership School, for promotion to staff sergeant

• NCO Academy, for promotion to master sergeant

• Senior NCO Academy, for promotion to chief master sergeant

• Chief Master Sergeant Leadership Course.

The in-residence courses are scheduled based on projected grade, date of rank and availability.

Not only about PME, senior US military NCOs of all branches have university degrees and some gone as high as Doctorate. Looks to me you are ignorant about the differences between professional military education (PME) versus university level education. Take some time and read up on them. So either YOU are wrong and that the PLA does require its senior NCOs to attend PME, or that the PLA is being shortsighted with this selective PME policy. Which is it?

I admit was being generous on your ignorance. You were borderline retarded.


Sources full of errors mixed up with your own ignorance, good combo.

A conscript reject is calling a 10-yr veteran 'ignorant' about the military...

 

[gambit]

Read the damn article. This article isn't about nuclear reduction. This article is about nuclear equality.

If you really wonder about China's views on nuclear reduction, please read General Ma's statement. Cheers.

This is not about the article but about the greater issue of nuclear weapons and what to do about them. The creation of the nuclear nonproliferation treaty (NNPT) is one attempt to control the spread of nuclear weapons and associated programs. If China is a member of the NNPT, then at the very least China is under a moral obligation not to increase China's own nuclear weapons stockpile and do nothing to encourage non-NNPT states to build nuclear weapons. Control of growth and proliferation is the first step towards reduction and since the collapse of the USSR, we are on the road towards reduction. So why is China advocating growth? Will proliferation be next?

You just contradicted yourself again. If you are forced to serve, then you can't be "too cowardly" to serve. You still serve no matter what your state of mind is. Seriously man, if you want to insult somebody, please try to make it logical.

Oh, so the forum members are too scared to serve, eh? Then, since you are a big advocate of "sources", why don't you do some surveying and provide proof?

And you think you Chinese boys' personal attacks against me are any 'logical'? I will repeat myself again...In the beginning, I have no reasons to be hostile towards anyone regardless of nationalities. When you Chinese boys began to make unsupported and fantastical claims about Chinese military, I challenged those claims by staying on subject and supported my arguments with credible third party sources that anyone can verify for himself. You Chinese boys did not like that and began making personal attacks against me under the assumption that I was a typical white American. Then when it became known that I was Viet, the attacks got worse and even racist. So what reasons NOW do I have to be nice?

 

[CardSharp]

Read it carefully I didn't call him a gook,

Us mainlanders may be crude and unfashionable in your eyes (love the k-pop hair btw) but there is little chance of us dying in blue on blue , just because that country boy from down the road thought you were a gook.

 

[CardSharp]

So what reasons NOW do I have to be nice?

Buddy we don't care if you're nice to us, we just want to seek professional help for the childhood trauma you endured. Hell we'll a "help gambit find a shrink fund". I'm sure everyone would donate.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Buddy we don't care if you're nice to us, we just want to seek professional help for the childhood trauma you endured. Hell we'll a "help gambit find a shrink fund". I'm sure everyone would donate.

I'm not paying a cent

 

[below_freezing]

This is not about the article but about the greater issue of nuclear weapons and what to do about them. The creation of the nuclear nonproliferation treaty (NNPT) is one attempt to control the spread of nuclear weapons and associated programs. If China is a member of the NNPT, then at the very least China is under a moral obligation not to increase China's own nuclear weapons stockpile and do nothing to encourage non-NNPT states to build nuclear weapons. Control of growth and proliferation is the first step towards reduction and since the collapse of the USSR, we are on the road towards reduction. So why is China advocating growth? Will proliferation be next?


And you think you Chinese boys' personal attacks against me are any 'logical'? I will repeat myself again...In the beginning, I have no reasons to be hostile towards anyone regardless of nationalities. When you Chinese boys began to make unsupported and fantastical claims about Chinese military, I challenged those claims by staying on subject and supported my arguments with credible third party sources that anyone can verify for himself. You Chinese boys did not like that and began making personal attacks against me under the assumption that I was a typical white American. Then when it became known that I was Viet, the attacks got worse and even racist. So what reasons NOW do I have to be nice?

I never made racist attacks against you as a Viet. I talked about you being a low IQ redneck american. Don't think that people hate you due to your race. People hate you because you're you.

And no, China doesn't have conscription in anything but name. 0.015% of the population is in the military, we really don't need conscription for that. If you want to be technical I guess the military training for high school students is "conscription"

 

[marshall]

You mean I do not act like a Viet you BELIEVE should act, which is anti-US and subservient to any Chinese.

No, actually most Vietnamese who are not Chinese-Vietnamese are anti-Chinese just like you. It's the inconsistent characteristics that I was referring to and what is interesting.

 

[Akasa]

This is not about the article but about the greater issue of nuclear weapons and what to do about them. The creation of the nuclear nonproliferation treaty (NNPT) is one attempt to control the spread of nuclear weapons and associated programs. If China is a member of the NNPT, then at the very least China is under a moral obligation not to increase China's own nuclear weapons stockpile and do nothing to encourage non-NNPT states to build nuclear weapons. Control of growth and proliferation is the first step towards reduction and since the collapse of the USSR, we are on the road towards reduction. So why is China advocating growth? Will proliferation be next?

Does the article talk about other countries' nuclear programs? Does it talk about the world's current nuclear situation? This isn't about the world, buddy. This is about China's nuclear warheads, and about their production specifically. The NTP is aimed to reduce the spread of nuclear warheads. China's arsenal, as far as I know, is not an open supermarket with checkout lanes. Hence the term "proliferation". And please keep informed with the news and realize that China is against North Korea's and Iran's nuclear program.

Like the article said, China is increasing its number of nuclear warheads because the US and Russian arsenals are many times larger than China's. So what if the US and Russia reduced their number of warheads? They still have a crapload of these babies, and it's not like few thousand warheads less is going to make a difference if a nuclear conflict is to break out. You may disagree with me, but my logic is that once China has achieved rough parity with Russia or the US, production will slow down or eventually stop.

And you think you Chinese boys' personal attacks against me are any 'logical'? I will repeat myself again...In the beginning, I have no reasons to be hostile towards anyone regardless of nationalities. When you Chinese boys began to make unsupported and fantastical claims about Chinese military, I challenged those claims by staying on subject and supported my arguments with credible third party sources that anyone can verify for himself. You Chinese boys did not like that and began making personal attacks against me under the assumption that I was a typical white American. Then when it became known that I was Viet, the attacks got worse and even racist. So what reasons NOW do I have to be nice?

How does being insulted by forum members relate to conscription? It's one thing to reply to an insult. It's another to generalize and call everybody a "conscript reject". Aren't you doing the same thing that you accuse the forum members of doing to you?

Really, you are not hostile to anyone regardless of nationalities? What about your comments about Chinese being "communist liars"? You claim to be a victim of this yet you are also a perpetrator. Hypocrisy can come a long way.

News articles aren't "fantastical claims", buddy. There is a saying: "Denial isn't just a river in Egypt". Your belief in so-called "reliable sources" is not reflected all the time when you make your own claims. And it is definitely not a reason to start a racial argument.

You want nice? Then take into account everything I've read above and try to apply it to your posts, and try not to post emotionally-reactive comments in the first place.
Starting by giving out some "thanks".