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May I return the favour...I am the 1 who found the quote and reminded you what I wrote...I never edited it...but you are still screaming without using your brain...


1st Mr. Liar tell me where is the OTHER lie...Because you said ANOTHER lie meaning you have seen 1 somewhere else? Pry do tell where!


Read WHAT I WROTE few times, maybe your brain might start processing!



Pry do tell me WHAT OTHERWISE means...apparently you are not getting it....I put it there to SHOW THE DIFFERENCE between what is done in Saudi which EU CANT do...MEANING WE ARE ALLOWED to practice OUR RELIGION as par the constituition.....

WERE WE NOT! THen THERE WOULD BE NO DIFFERENCE between EU and SAUDI and hence, NO ONE WOULD be able to cry BS about SAUDI...GOT IT? if not, go for a brain exam! Apparently , your hatred has made you MEGA BLIND!

so intellectually honest of you to not quote the insinuations from page six where there is a blatant lie. the first one. Let me help you:

@KS Then kindly tell EU to change their law to the same as Saudi...NO TOLERANCE towards anything...And NEVER to raise a voice against Saudi coz you people are supporting the same thing only under a diff banner! :blink:

bolded and sized up so you don't strain your eyes.
 
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@Aussie4ever Hats off sir! A droll bit of humor mixed with the truth there..indeed. :agree:

@Chinese-Dragon He's nice to you coz you're Chinese..otherwise you'd be any other backward and ignorant idol worshiper.. after all the Muslims have advanced beyond us all. Those who would not be able to comprehend the noble truths or the noble eightfold path have started making a hierarchy of which religion is more advanced within their "logical progression". Oh my..the humor of it.

Ridiculous isn't it, them calling Buddhism and idol worship backwards and against progress?

East Asia is one of the most technologically advanced regions of the world, and the pre-dominant religion here is Buddhism.

And there are more statues/idols of Buddha in East Asia than the rest of the world combined.
 
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Ridiculous isn't it, them calling Buddhism and idol worship backwards and against progress?

East Asia is one of the most technologically advanced regions of the world, and the pre-dominant religion here is Buddhism.

Or look at China..majority population isn't even Buddhist but rather atheist/agnostic...and yet..meh leave it be. He's welcome to his bubble. And then we get called bigots and islamophobe..well what else is an idol worshiping Kaffir to do?
 
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so intellectually honest of you to not quote the insinuations from page six where there is a blatant lie. the first one. Let me help you:



bolded and sized up so you don't strain your eyes.

Lets break it up for your small brain:
@KS Then kindly tell EU to change their law to the same as Saudi
Is this tough to swallow?

...NO TOLERANCE towards anything...And NEVER to raise a voice against Saudi coz you people are supporting the same thing only under a diff banner!
Example of if EU = Saudi...
 
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@JonAsad, to answer your insult directed towards me, I am an Atheist and a cultural Buddhist.

Which means that for cultural purposes I do pray in front of Buddha statues, I practice Ancestor Worship during the Qingming festival, and I light joss sticks near the entrance to my house.

I am an Atheist because I do not literally believe that these deities are real. I do it for cultural purposes.

That doesn't mean I will enjoy it when you guys call us "ignorant kaffirs" (like Peregrine does) or make fun of idol worship.

Also, Buddha himself said specifically that there is no creator God, and that he himself is not a God. So at its core, it is an Atheist philosophy.
 
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@JonAsad, to answer your insult directed towards me, I am an Atheist and a cultural Buddhist.

Which means that for cultural purposes I do pray in front of Buddha statues, I practice Ancestor Worship during the Qingming festival, and I light joss sticks near the entrance to my house.

I am an Atheist because I do not literally believe that these deities are real. I do it for cultural purposes.

That doesn't mean I will enjoy it when you guys call us "ignorant kaffirs" (like Peregrine does) or make fun of idol worship.

Also, Buddha himself said specifically that there is no creator God, and that he himself is not a God. So at its core, it is an Atheist philosophy.

You are too sensitive to be an anthiest-
The athiests i know doesnt give a flying fcuk to what *ignorant slave bound by religion and imaginary fantasies* think about some other *ignorant slave bound by some other religion and imaginary fantasies*-

Yet you take insult when some one calls you a "kaffir"- which liyerally means "Infidel"-
And by definition it simply means
"Noun- A person who does not believe in religion or who adheres to a religion other than one's own." Google-

So Mr atheist bound by cultural purposes learn to deal with the insults towards your Buddhists/ Idol worshippers/ Kaffirs- like we Muslims deal with it every day on this forum and else where-
 
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You are too sensitive to be an anthiest-
The athiests i know doesnt give a flying fcuk to what *ignorant slave bound by religion and imaginary fantasies* think about some other *ignorant slave bound by some other religion and imaginary fantasies*-

Yet you take insult when some one calls you a "kaffir"- which liyerally means "Infidel"-
And by definition it simply means
"Noun- A person who does not believe in religion or who adheres to a religion other than one's own." Google-

So Mr atheist bound by cultural purposes learn to deal with the insults towards your Buddhists/ Idol worshippers/ Kaffirs- like we Muslims deal with it every day on this forum and else where-

offtopic :, but 'kafir' is not such an innocent word that you make out to be. Its like calling somebody barbarian and then saying we merely meant foreigners.
Check out the wiki page on word kafir, it clearly has negative connotation. (especially its use in quran section).

On topic: EDL is gaining ground for sometime, its a shame.
 
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offtopic, but 'kafir' is not such an innocent word that you make out to be. Its like calling somebody barbarian and then saying we merely meant foreigners.
Check out the wiki page on word kafir, it clearly has negative connotation. (especially its use in quran section).

Dear Sir- fcuk wiki- any one can change it- and it is mostly written by ignorant people who take offence of word "kaffir"- so it will be biased-

Go for google translations- they have authentic definitions- plus nuetral real rational sane ones-

And google is not run by Muslims- Lol-
 
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Dear Sir- fcuk wiki- any one can change it- and it is mostly written by ignorant people who take offence of word "kaffir"- so it will be biased-

Go for google translations- they have authentic definitions- plus nuetral real rational sane ones-

And google is not run by Muslims- Lol-
I know wiki is not neutral, this specific page is not too.. can you tell me the verses mentioned in the second section(with references) are wrong? I will take your word for it, if you say they dont exist in quran.
 
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I know wiki is not neutral, this specific page is not too.. can you tell me the verses mentioned in the second section(with references) are wrong? I will take your word for it, if you say they dont exist in quran.

Dear Sir- Just for the sake of argument i read wiki- i am sure my postgratuate english lecturer will not be happy- any ways here what wiki says-

Islamic[edit]
Infidel is an English language word commonly used to translate the equivalent Arabic language word for non-Muslims; kafir, literally the one who "covers", is usually translated as "disbeliever"; i.e. in English translations of the Quranic verse, 109:1,[16][17][18] In the Islamic doctrinal sense, the term only refers to a person who does not recognize the one God (Allah) such as atheists and polytheists. In contrast to these, Islam considers Jews and Christians as fellow believers. They are called "People of the Book (Ahl al-kitab)".[19][20][21]

So Sir the verse is there- the translation is there- whats so offensive?-

I mean literally you guys are complaining why the word "kaffir" is used to describe non believers in Quran written in Arabic-
o bhai meray- the whole Quran is in Arabic so the word for non believers in arabic is "kaffir"-
its a literature thingy-
your reservations- where is the sense in it?-
 
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@hinduguy,Jonasad

The word “kafir” (and variations of it) is mentioned in the Qur’an in five different senses:

1. Kufr al-tawheed: to reject the belief in the Oneness of God. The Qur’an says what means:

*{As to those who reject faith (kafaru), it is the same to them whether you warn them or do not warn them; they will not believe }* (Al-Baqarah 2:6)

2. Kufr al-ni`mah: to lack gratefulness to God or to people. The Qur’an says what means:

*{Therefore remember Me, I will remember you, and be thankful to Me, and do not be ungrateful to Me (la takfurun)}* (Al-Baqarah 2:152)

*{[Pharaoh] said [to Moses]: … And you did [that] deed of yours which you did, and you are one of the ungrateful (kafireen)}* (Ash-Shu`araa’ 26:18-19)

3. Kufr at-tabarri: to disown/clear oneself from. The Qur’an says what means:

*{Indeed, there is for you a good example in Ibrahim and those with him when they said to their people: “Surely we are clear of you (kafarna bekom).”}* (Al-Mumtahanah 60:4)

4. Kufr al-juhud: to deny. The Qur’an says what means:

*{When there comes to them that which they [should] have recognized, they deny (kafaru) it.}* (Al-Baqarah 2:89)

5. Kufr at-taghtiyah: to hide/bury something, like planting a seed in the ground. The Qur’an says what means:

*{The likeness of vegetation after rain, whereof the growth is pleasing to the husbandmen/tillers (kuffar.}* (Al-Hadid 57:20)

Exegesis (tafseer) scholars decide as to which meaning of the word “kufr/kafir” is meant in a specific verse based on the context. Therefore, not every use of the root “ka fa ra” means the rejection of faith. For example, when the Prophet (peace be upon him) warned some of his companions from becoming “kuffar” after his death, he did not mean that they would become disbelievers but rather that they would become ungrateful to Allah, for the blessing of unity, when they fight each other after his death.

Regarding whether to call non-Muslims “kuffar” or not, the answer is that we should call people the names that the Qur’an gave them. In the Qur’an, you will not find a single “O disbelievers” (“Ya Kuffar”, “Ya ayuhalathina kafaru”, or “Ya ayuhal-kafirun”) other than in the following two places:

1. In Hellfire, we seek refuge in Allah from it. The Qur’an says what means:

*{[Then it will be said]: “O ye who disbelieve (Ya ayuhalathina kafaru)! Make no excuses for yourselves this day.}* (At-Tahrim 66:7)

So, it is something that is said to them by Allah Almighty or by the angels, not by us.

2. In Surat Al-Kafirun (109) that you mentioned in your question. It says what means:

*{Say [O Muhammad]: “O ye that reject faith (al-Kafirun)! I worship not that which ye worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship.”}*

But this surah is addressing Prophet Muhammad and therefore must be understood in its historical context. Allah is asking Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) to address a group of leaders from Makkah who offered him the following deal: That they all —including Muhammad— worship God for one year and then they all worship the idols for the next year, and so on. That is why Allah asked him to address them in this term “rejecters of faith” and to refuse to accept this kind of deal.

In the rest of the Qur’an, however, the Qur’anic style followed two principals:

1. To label certain sayings or actions to be sayings or actions of kufr (disbelief or rejection of faith), without labeling any specific group of people with that name and calling them with it. For example, the Qur’an says what means:

*{Certainly they disbelieve who say: Surely God is the third [person] of the three. And there is no god but One God, and if they desist not from what they say, a painful chastisement shall befall those among them who disbelieve [reject]. Will they not then turn to Allah and ask His forgiveness? And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. The Messiah, son of Mary is but a messenger; messengers before him have indeed passed away; and his mother was a truthful woman.}* (Al-Ma’idah 5:73-75)

2. To distinguish clearly between idol-worshippers, on one hand, and believers in God and a Script that went through a phase of corruption, on the other hand. Allah called the later group only by the name “People of the Book.” For example, the Qur’an says what means:

*{Quite a number of the People of the Book wish they could turn you [people] back to infidelity after ye have believed, from selfish envy, after the truth hath become manifest unto them. But, forgive and overlook, till Allah accomplish His purpose; for Allah Hath power over all things.}* (Al-Baqarah 2:109)

*{It is He Who got out the Unbelievers among the People of the Book from their homes at the first gathering [of the forces]. Little did ye think that they would get out: And they thought that their fortresses would defend them from Allah! But the [wrath of] Allah came to them from quarters from which they little expected [it], and cast terror into their hearts, so that they destroyed their dwellings by their own hands and the hands of the Believers, take warning, then, O ye with eyes [to see]!}* (Al-Hashr 59:2)

In today’s world, we should use the same term “People of the Book” with Christians and Jews, or call them Christians and Jews, if they wish to be called so, or simply call them “non-Muslims”.

As for dealing with non-Muslims, the general rule is mentioned in the verse that says what means:

*{Allah does not forbid you respecting those who have not made war against you on account of [your] religion, and have not driven you forth from your homes, that you show them kindness (birr) and deal with them justly; surely Allah loves the doers of justice. Allah only forbids you respecting those who made war upon you on account of [your] religion, and drove you forth from your homes and backed up [others] in your expulsion, that you make friends with them, and whoever makes friends with them, these are the unjust.}* (Al-Mumtahanah 60:8-9)

And notice that the word “birr” (translated as kindness) that Allah used in this context is the same word that is used for the type of kindness that a Muslim should show his/her parents as in birr al-walidain )kindness to parents)!!

Finally, it is fair enough before labeling any person as a “rejecter of faith” to make sure that he/she is clearly aware of that faith and what it entails. In my view, most people in today’s world did not reject the message because simply they are not aware of what Islam is. This is largely due to the biased international media and to Muslims themselves falling short to present their religion properly to the world. These uninformed people, again in my view, could only fall under the verse that says what means:

*{No laden soul can bear another's load, We never punish until we have sent a messenger.}* (Al-Israa’ 17:15)


Source:http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/S...AskAboutIslamE
 
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Dear Sir- Just for the sake of argument i read wiki- i am sure my postgratuate english lecturer will not be happy- any ways here what wiki says-



So Sir the verse is there- the translation is there- whats so offensive?-

I mean literally you guys are complaining why the word "kaffir" is used to describe non believers in Quran written in Arabic-
o bhai meray- the whole Quran is in Arabic so the word for non believers in arabic is "kaffir"-
its a literature thingy-
your reservations- where is the sense in it?-

my reservation was to do with what should be done to kafirs... check the second section, it has verses as to what to do to them.
Its one thing to say a person is negroid (purely from anthropoligical point of view) but negro word has a lot of negative baggage now.
The way one islamic sect uses the word kafir to describe other, it looks like more than a term for non-believer, it does carry some hatred.
 
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my reservation was to do with what should be done to kafirs... check the second section, it has verses as to what to do to them.
Its one thing to say a person is negroid (purely from anthropoligical point of view) but negro word has a lot of negative baggage now.
The way one islamic sect uses the word kafir to describe other, it looks like more than a term for non-believer, it does carry some hatred.

Quran is a book telling us Muslims will go to Jannah and Kaffirs will burn/ rot in hell fire FOREVER-
If you dont believe in Quran- there is nothing to be worried about-

For one i never complained why i have only one janam and not seven?-
And i dont care what other Holy books describe their set of disbeliever will go through-
 
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UK seems like a cesspool these days
 
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Quran is a book telling us Muslims will go to Jannah and Kaffirs will burn/ rot in hell fire FOREVER-
If you dont believe in Quran- there is nothing to be worried about-

For one i never complained why i have only one janam and not seven?-
And i dont care what other Holy books describe their set of disbeliever will go through-
I was not talking about that.. check the second section.. of wiki (the bits terrorized, slain, crucified,evil cursed)
Kafir - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

secondly you seem to completely disregard the use of kafir in popular culture in muslim world, it is definitely a derogatory term, even if you dispute its origin.
 
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