JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[araz]

yeah but it will come out in 2012.....may be with new version of JF-17 also known as block II

Seriously doubt it.I think PAF will letWS13 mature and may make a move towards it in 2015give or take a yr.
Araz

 

[TaimiKhan]

apparantly the chinese have 'cloned' the RD-33 engine according to Kanwa news.

Sir, Kanwa has not been very reliable in some of its news reporting about things from China.

Many sources do tell it to be a clone of RD-33, but some Chinese sources say it to be a mixture of RD-33 & some older Chinese design which was abandoned and later reactivated for the WS-13 engine when FC-1 came up, taking the best out of both and making something out of it, that is why its rumored to be having good thrust, more comprehensive FADEC technology etc etc. It seems the inner section is of the Chinese project while the out shell has been based on the RD-33. Ukrainians are rumored and suspected to have provided the Chinese with the RD-33 know how, which has been combined with the Chinese earlier work.

But once the final product is seen, then we can comment as to what it likes and what is it cloned from.

 

[fatman17]

Sir, Kanwa has not been very reliable in some of its news reporting about things from China.

Many sources do tell it to be a clone of RD-33, but some Chinese sources say it to be a mixture of RD-33 & some older Chinese design which was abandoned and later reactivated for the WS-13 engine when FC-1 came up, taking the best out of both and making something out of it, that is why its rumored to be having good thrust, more comprehensive FADEC technology etc etc. It seems the inner section is of the Chinese project while the out shell has been based on the RD-33. Ukrainians are rumored and suspected to have provided the Chinese with the RD-33 know how, which has been combined with the Chinese earlier work.

But once the final product is seen, then we can comment as to what it likes and what is it cloned from.

fair enough - i can wait!

 

[Qasibr]

The WS-13 is definitely not a clone of the RD-33. The engine's called WS-13 "Tianshan" which literally means "celestial mountains" and is the name of this mountain range in China.That was also the name given to an earlier engine project, called the Tianshan-21. There are little bits of information about it posted on Chinese Internet sources.

From what I've read so far, as the project's older, the core is perhaps a little more mature than the WS-10 used on the J-10, but it's a smaller engine rated at a lesser thrust category(sort of like RD-33 vs AL-31, or the F-119 vs F-135 in US fighters). I remember reading somewhere that the engine that powers J-XX(whether that's the now-public J-20 or their smaller F-35 equivilant lightweight jet) may be based on Tianshan rather than the newer WS-10 core, because the WS-10 core had some of initial/breaking-in issues perhaps partially due to the faster development cycle. The TS-21 engine development took more time than the aircraft it was originally intended to fly with(likely J-8, the planned but cancelled J-9, or some other aircraft) and rather than cancel the project in the early 2000's they decided to re-tool the Tianshan-21 engine core into the WS-13 Tianshan engine compatible with JF-17's engine bay specifications, largely because Russian engine delivery after Indian pressure was dubious at that stage. The existence and level of progress on the on-going WS-13 project likely had alot to do with Russia decision to supply the RD-93, because their stoppage would not have killed the project and just delayed it a couple of years, but would cost them hundreds of millions(250 JFTs for PAF alone means 500 million for them, at RD-93's cost of 2 million per engine).

Not alot is known about the engine core. Like Chinese style of development in other defense products they finalized the basic WS-13 variant years ago and subsequent variants also seem to be in the testing phase(just like the 054>054A frigates, J-10>J-10A>J-10B aircraft). The name WS-13A seems to float around quiet a bit, but it seems likely that subsequent versions may also be under development. A WS-13 engine variant/version powered that FC-1/JF-17 aircraft the Chinese are using for testing(the final development prototype, PT-06) in a test flight in 2009. Around the same time the FC-1 passed the PLAAF's "design appraisal" which means the airforce approves that the aircraft meets their requirement(having an indigenous engine likely had alot to do with this). I was talking to Feng over at the "China Air and Naval Power" blog and his contacts suggest that the engine would be significantly better in performance than the RD-33 rather than a copy of it.

I also recall that recently a PAF high-up publically said in an interview around Zuhai that whether the PAF goes for the Chinese engine(WS-13) solely depends on the engine quality. Given that China is focusing tremendously on it's engine development sector, I think that Inshallah, it's likely that we'll see the WS-13 flying not only in Pakistan but also in the PLAAF.

 

[abaseen99]

 

[houshanghai]

L15 cockpit

 

[Dazzler]

For those who think JFT has mechanical controls in roll or yaw, watch the Zhuhai videos to see its FBW performance especially low speed roll after recovering from vertical climb. It revolves on its own axis and maintains position, instead, if you look at Mirage or f-7, they lose their actual position while rolling. F-16 also rolls similar to JFT.

 

[abdulbarijan]

Im really sorry i ask too much from the senior members but i wanted to know Pakistan's contribution to JFT
I know that we did assist in design etc but i want to know in detail can u provide the info or the links to the thread or pages which can give such info
thanks in advance

 

[Dazzler]

35 PAF engineers part of JFT development team from the beginning of project. They didnt go there to watch and learn, but to contribute their share of expertise, the idea of DSI, extended lerx, ecm housing, full glass cockpit, high performance mission computers (we have been using them on ROSE mirage and F-16s for many years and we got tremendous boost to our avionics development capability by contributing with French, Italians for last 15 years) quad fly-by-wire, all in pt 04, is the brainchild of our engineers..

 

[Mani2020]

Interesting news

There is a video of Zuhai airshow where during reporting about jf-17 the Chinese expert said "Originally jf-17 was designed and customized according to PAF requirements ,PLAAF was not interested in it but now after seeing the jf-17 performance Chinese airforce is interested in procuring the jf-17aircraft

the video can be watched here

 

[Taha Samad]

21 JF-17 thunder jets in final stage: Rao Qamar Suleman

Qamar Suleman has appreciated the role of police in war against terror, a private TV reported on Thursday.
Talking to media after a ceremony in police lines Islamabad, Air Chief said that 45 F-16 fighter gets(jets) are being upgraded in Turkey. He added that new squadrons of F-16 and JF-17 thunder planes would be constituted in March.
He informed that PAF have 21 JF-17 thunder jets in final stage while nine are being manufactured.
Earlier, addressing the passing out ceremony as chief guest, Air Chief Marshal stated that sacrifices of police for the country would not go waste, adding that police and armed forces are fighting against the war on terror hand-to-hand. He was optimistic that terrorism would be eliminated from the country.

21 JF-17 thunder jets in final stage: Rao Qamar Suleman | Pakistan | News | Newspaper | Daily | English | Online

 

[mjnaushad]

35 PAF engineers part of JFT development team from the beginning of project. They didnt go there to watch and learn, but to contribute their share of expertise, the idea of DSI, extended lerx, ecm housing, full glass cockpit, high performance mission computers (we have been using them on ROSE mirage and F-16s for many years and we got tremendous boost to our avionics development capability by contributing with French, Italians for last 15 years) quad fly-by-wire, all in pt 04, is the brainchild of our engineers..

One more think nabil that when we say engineer its a man with lot of knowledge and experience ...... Because some of our 'Friends' consider it 35 labors who are there to fix screws ....

 

[Last Hope]

It seems much more mobile than F16 and also its aerobatics.
Althought F16s are much like a mini AWACS, i prefer JF17 over F16s after seeing this video.

Regards.

 

[Last Hope]

Post deleted due to the unwanted video clips.

 

[SQ8]

Above video has been debunked.. and has the potential to start a fanboy and troll fest. Please avoid vs threads based on visual cues ONLY.