JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

[Metal 0-1]

PAC officially confirming what Aviation Article confirmed. HMD for BLOCK-III also confirmed. First Official confirmation of three axis digital fly by wire FCS

Avionics Suite​

The avionics suite makes the JF-17 an effective weapon platform. The glass cockpit and hands on throttle and stick (HOTAS) controls reduce pilot workload. Accurate navigation and weapon aiming information on the head up display helps the pilot achieve his mission effectively. The multifunction displays provide information on engine, fuel, hydraulics, electrical, flight control and environmental control system on a need-to-know basis along with basic flight and tactical information. The capability has been built around highly modern state-of-the-art avionics equipment that can undertake high-tech aerial warfare in an all-weather operations, detecting/tracking/locating by AESA Radar in complicated ECM environment ensuring improved Short-Range Air-to-Air and Beyond Visual Range multi-target attack capability. The salient avionics equipment is as follows:

• Dual redundant mission computers
• Dual redundant 1553 Mux bus architecture
• AESA Radar capable of tracking multiple targets with prioritized firing
• In-built self-protection jamming
• Internal and external SPJ suites
• Ring laser gyro inertial navigation system tied with GPS
• Smart head up display with up front control panel and 28 Degrees FoV
• Color video recording camera and video recorder
• HOTAS
• Three smart multi-function color displays
• Helmet Mounted Display
• Radar Altimeter
• Combined Interrogator/Transponder
• Live Virtual Construct (LVC)
• Tactical Data Link
• VHF / UHF Communication System

Weapons Capability​

The aircraft is fitted with modern Stores Management System incorporating accurate weapon delivery modes and solutions involving minimum pilot workload. The aircraft is capable of carrying some of the most modern as well as conventional weapons, including:

• Beyond visual range active missiles
• Highly agile Imaging infrared short range missiles
• Air to sea missiles
• Anti radiation missiles
• Laser guided weapons
• Runway penetration bombs
• Stand-off weapons
• General purpose bombs
• Training bombs
• 23 mm double barrel gun

Design Features​

Aerodynamic Configuration Bifurcated side air inlet with incorporation of latest BUMP intake technology for improved performance Leading edge maneuvering flaps Trailing edge flaps Twin Ventral Fins Landing Gear Nose gear with steering Main gear with paddle controlled hydraulic brakes and anti-skid braking system. Comfortable Cockpit Escape and Egress System NVG compatible cockpit conforming to US MIL Standard, suitable for 3% to 98% percentile range of pilots. Single Piece Stretch Acrylic Transparent Canopy providing a good all-around Field of View Ejection Seat Latest Martin Baker high performance ejection seat Canopy Severance System for additional safety French Oxygen Regulation System Passive Leg Restraint System

Environment Control System and Oxygen System Effective control of cockpit pressure and temperature Effective temperature and humidity control of cockpit and avionics for optimum performance Efficient Anti G system for Pilot Flight Control System Flight control system of JF-17 Block-III aircraft is a full authority, three axis, and quad redundant digital fly by wire system Quad-redundancy in Fly By Wire System Autopilot, Auto spin recovery and Auto TEF controls Fuel System Total internal fuel 5400 lb (3000 liters) Single point pressure refueling system External Fuel One centre line drop tank 800 liters Two under wing drop tanks 800/1100 liters

Pakistan Aeronautical Complex Kamra - JF-17 Thunder Aircraft

www.pac.org.pk

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @SQ8 @JamD

What does the word "redundant" means here?

 

[untitled]

What does the word "redundant" means here?

Extra, more than one. If one system fails the redundant versions can take over

 

[Tair-Lahoti]

This video probably explain why Pakistan declined to be part of J10 and went with JF17s.

 

[tphuang]

Perhaps there has already been a commitment made by the Pakistani and Chinese sides to procure the RD-93MA in principle, when it is ready, so that Russian industry would fund its development. Also, so that the Russians wouldn’t produce a product to challenge the JF-17 in the 4th Generation light fighter market.

The RD-93 could be in use with the J-35, and therefore a better performing RD-93MA would be beneficial to that program as well, when it is ready.

All this because only in the past few years has the J-35 programs seems to have been given the green light, and it may take some time before the performance of the WS-13/19 engine will exceed the performance of the RD-93MA.

Once, the WS-13/19 matured enough to reach max thrust of at least 120kn (equal to that of the F-414EPE), it may be worth putting it on new built JF-17s.

What?

How does the choice of j35 engine have anything to do with what's on paf jf17?

J35 prototypes are using ws21. That's likely what they will continue to use until ws19 is ready. Plan does not make decisions based on what engine paf uses on jf17.

Keep in mind that it does make sense for paf to continue to use rd93 since an additional Chinese engine would only increase maintenance costs and complexity for the jf17 program.

It makes absolutely not sense for china to put Russian engines on it's future aircraft when domestic options are available. Having the entire supply chain in china allows them to manage the production cost and easily ramp up production. Relying on engine imports would put china at mercy of production issues in Russia. The j10 program already suffered over several years because Russians could not deliver sufficient al31fn.

 

[Thorough Pro]

backup system

What does the word "redundant" means here?

 

[araz]

I am still confused Pease someone answer my question
Does RD-93 support 3 axis fly-by-wire?
Not RD-93MA i am asking for RD-93 only which is in block 3 also

I dont think the engine has anything to do with FBW.
"Fly-by-wire (FBW) is a system that replaces the conventional manual flight controls of an aircraft with an electronic interface. The movements of flight controls are converted to electronic signals transmitted by wires, and flight control computers determine how to move the actuators at each control surface to provide the ordered response." Something that I hastily copied from a website.
A

 

[FuturePAF]

What?

How does the choice of j35 engine have anything to do with what's on paf jf17?

J35 prototypes are using ws21. That's likely what they will continue to use until ws19 is ready. Plan does not make decisions based on what engine paf uses on jf17.

Keep in mind that it does make sense for paf to continue to use rd93 since an additional Chinese engine would only increase maintenance costs and complexity for the jf17 program.

It makes absolutely not sense for china to put Russian engines on it's future aircraft when domestic options are available. Having the entire supply chain in china allows them to manage the production cost and easily ramp up production. Relying on engine imports would put china at mercy of production issues in Russia. The j10 program already suffered over several years because Russians could not deliver sufficient al31fn.

Commitment by China and Pakistan to Russia, to equip the JF-17 for export, so Russia doesn’t build a light weight fighter. My hypothesis was that the J-31 prototypes were using the RD-93 engines until a better performing Chinese engine was ready.

 

[tphuang]

Commitment by China and Pakistan to Russia, to equip the JF-17 for export, so Russia doesn’t build a light weight fighter. My hypothesis was that the J-31 prototypes were using the RD-93 engines until a better performing Chinese engine was ready.

Russia is having trouble developing even 1 real 5th generation aircraft. I don't think China is worried about a second light weight one. J-35 prototype is most likely using WS-21 (upgraded WS-13). I can completely understand why PAF would not want to use it. But China has learnt its lesson to not rely on Russian supply chain for its future projects.

 

[FuturePAF]

Russia is having trouble developing even 1 real 5th generation aircraft. I don't think China is worried about a second light weight one. J-35 prototype is most likely using WS-21 (upgraded WS-13). I can completely understand why PAF would not want to use it. But China has learnt its lesson to not rely on Russian supply chain for its future projects.

It’s good that China is doing everything in house. The technology developed for the WS-15, such as single crystal brisk blade for the engine, and other advancements can find their way into the WS-19.

Considering the infrastructure build to maintain the RD-93, it only makes sense to maximize the use of that until there is a substantial improvement to warrant the change; 20% increase in thrust when the WS-19 is ready.

I hypothesis on a light fighter was not about the Russians developing a light 5th Gen fighter, but a light 4 th Gen fighter at the same time the JF-17 came out. They win by having their engine in the JF-17. Down the line if the JF-17 keeps evolving into a Block 4 model, with a WS-19 engine, and some RCS reduction features, the Russians will lose out, but by then they will be moving on to market their Su-75 and will be leaving the light end of the market to planes like the JF-17. Perhaps their Klimov engine company will switch to making engines for loyal wingman UCAVs.

 

[Chak Bamu]

Considering the infrastructure build to maintain the RD-93, it only makes sense to maximize the use of that until there is a substantial improvement to warrant the change; 20% increase in thrust when the WS-19 is ready.

Something has changed in the last 24 hours. I say we go for WS-13E or WS-21 (if it is an advanced version of WS-13 as mentioned by @tphuang )

 

[Iron Shrappenel]

Something has changed in the last 24 hours. I say we go for WS-31E or WS-21 (if it is an advanced version of WS-13 as mentioned by @tphuang )

AoA maybe that was the plan altogether ? It would be logical to see a bigger step forward with B4 ?
Maybe Pakistan does not want to use the RD-93MA altogether.... Most of it is speculation...
Let's see what PM's visit to Russia brings...

 

[FuturePAF]

Something has changed in the last 24 hours. I say we go for WS-31E or WS-21 (if it is an advanced version of WS-13 as mentioned by @tphuang )

If it’s a substantial improvement I agree. Ooohh I see what you are saying the political issue considering what has just happened. Yes in that case, best to move to a Chinese engine to prevent that becoming an issue down the line.

 

[messiach]

Plz give some more detail if possible, because the common understanding is that how could we be a 4th gen Air Force in the presence of Mirage-III and V, plus we still have some F-7 PGs so we may be a full 4th gen Air Force in let say next 3-5 years but as of now we are not fully 4th Gen Air force.

F7 and pg will go.

 

[White privilege]

F7 and pg will go.

Will they go to Shooter squadron or PAF museum??

 

[messiach]

Madam, are you saying we are getting a derivative of Jian10? How much does it deviate from the original? Can you give us some specifics?

I have no details on jian10 but i except ToT for AL31 from NPO Saturn.

Whats next in roadmap from china ?

NGFA can be j31/35 or will be project azam

We have three consolidated wing configurations, one swept back, one trapezoidal design for NGFA. I dont know which will be selected.