It Was Putin's Missile!

[Informant]

Nor would Rebels shoot down an civilian aircraft flying at 33,000ft . US says Rebels are responsible while Ukraine says its not rebels but Russia which is responsible because the SAM system is complicated. So who is it really ? Why not wait for the Probe before jumping into conclusions ...

Where will you get the proof? Russia has the black box. Second you cannot distinguish that easily a passenger craft and transport plane at the altitude of 15 kms. Somebody fucked up, and it doesnt look like ukraine since it doesnt have military presence in that area to reaffirm their air defence. So fingers do point to rebels, who are pretty much supplied and supported by the Ruskies.

 

[Götterdämmerung]

Why is the Kiev Junta already crying that the black box has been manipulated? (A black box is impossible to manipulate without breaking it apart) Is the Junta making precaution that the black box will reveal the truth and that it was them who murdered almost 300 innocent civilians?

The black box is being examined by an international expert team right now. The result should came out soon.

 

[jamahir]

could it?

I doubt that very much. What you say is like saying

had China militarily supported iraq in 2003, or at least libya in 2011... none of this would have happened. it would have been a different world

compare russia in 2003 with the soviet union before 1989.

the soviet union sent its military to democratic republic of afghanistan to help the government there fight the al qaida puppets of cia and israel... but russia in 2003 and 2011 didn't have the soviet union's courage to send its soldiers to iraq and libya to help saddam hussain and muammar gaddafi.

one of the the soviet union's presences in syria was through the tartus navy base... that base is now the last russia military presence in west asia... fine, the russia government had sent its aircraft carrier, admiral kuznetsov, to tartus in 2012, to make a demonstration to the western governments and their puppets of the gulf kingdoms... but russia didn't have the courage

the 70's and the 80's were full of direct action by socialist revolutionaries who took courage from presence of soviet union... and even the soviets were helping the socialist bloc direct or indirectly eliminate the enemies of the socialist bloc ( iraq, libya, syria... )... but the russia government after 2001 was not so keen.

iraq and libya fell because there was no soviet union to help them... only not so courageous russia government... and this russia government didn't see that after iraq and libya... the western bloc would target russia... which of course happened in 2012 itself... those "democracy activists" funded by cia-funded ngo like ned ( national endowment for democracy ) and amnesty international, who tried to effect regime change in russia through puppets like the chess player, gary kasparov.

had India militarily supported iraq in 2003, or at least libya in 2011...

sir, that was surprising, coming from a fauji historian like you.

actually, the indian government in 2003 ( bjp party in power ) was ordered by usa government to send indian army soldiers to iraq to help the usa-led "coalition of the willing ( killing )" to kill the iraqi resistance led by saddam hussain.

and the indian army prepared to send a battalion to iraq... at least 10,000 soldiers... to essentially kill saddam hussain.

it was only the protests of the communist parties of india which made the indian government to cancel that plan.

Okey they are there but if West stops trade settlement in US Dollar, Euro,Pound and Yen. Who would like to hold an unreliable Rubble?

why would the west even want to stop trading in dollars or euro or pound or yen?? they would rather want russia to pay them in those western currencies.

the main nation to be angered by changes in currency payments is usa. remember, saddam hussan's iraq insisted on paying for international goods in euros, which really angered usa government.

the payment currency depends on the region or nation that russia does deal with. for japan, it may choose yen. china is a big importer of oil from iran and from gulf, i think. so china would need usa dollars but that comes from the electrical goods, fashion items and other goods that china manufactures. but the western economy has crashed and some western capitalist companies are moving away even from china ( like microsoft ). so china will see a buble burst soon, and therefore will be forced to switc\h to a actually more stable, non-western-capitalist currency.

there is already the initiation of the "eurasian economic zone" ( Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan sign ‘epoch' Eurasian Economic Union — RT Business ) between the cis nations ( russia, kazakhstan, belarus... ) which is independent of the usa dollar... as for the other nations in my list, exchange of goods between them and russia is not totally capitalist economics but is more a political alliance trade of goods. china and north korea will possibly join this.

more importantly, there was the "gold dinar" world currency idea forwarded by muammar gaddafi but also championed by russia, china and malaysia... all this until 2009. the "gold dinar" had the ultimate goal of initiating a global currency which would replace the usa dollar. and the "gold dinar" was one of the reasons for the 2011 invasion of libya. the usa government didn't want anyone to stop using the usa dollar.

And more importantly what would Russia do with the Egyptian Dollars, Syrian, Cuban,Venezuelan currencies? The sanctions have much deeper impact than you're just trying to downplay.

an example would be russia repairing syrian military helicopters, despite western sanctions on syria. even if syria paid in euros, they amount wouldn't be that large, but still russia accepted the payment... because the trade was political

 

[Star Wars]

Where will you get the proof? Russia has the black box.

Nobody knows who has the black box , some says Russia has it others say they got the black box yesterday

Second you cannot distinguish that easily a passenger craft and transport plane at the altitude of 15 kms. Somebody fucked up, and it doesnt look like ukraine since it doesnt have military presence in that area to reaffirm their air defence.

RUSSIA: HAS IMAGES OF UKRAINE DEPLOYING BUK ROCKETS IN EAST: IFX
RUSSIA: UKRAINE MOVED BUK NEAR REBELS IN DONETSK JULY 17: IFX
RUSSIA: DETECTED UKRAINIAN FIGHTER JET PICK UP SPEED TOWARD MH17(also confirmed by a portugese air traffic controller in Ukraine)

So fingers do point to rebels, who are pretty much supplied and supported by the Ruskies.

As per the selective reporting from western media, not from the entire picture ..

ok am going to sleep now , talk to you tomorrow

 

[Deathstroke]

question is why was a commercial flight routed through war zone where multiple military cargo planes and a fighter jet have been recently been shot out of the sky by SAMS operated by forces on the ground fighting a civil war against a country with an air force attacking them?

 

[Götterdämmerung]

Where will you get the proof? Russia has the black box. Second you cannot distinguish that easily a passenger craft and transport plane at the altitude of 15 kms. Somebody fucked up, and it doesnt look like ukraine since it doesnt have military presence in that area to reaffirm their air defence. So fingers do point to rebels, who are pretty much supplied and supported by the Ruskies.

What are you talking about? The black box has been handed to Malaysian Airlines and is being examined by an international expert group in GB at the request of the Netherlands.

 

[jamahir]

What are you talking about? The black box has been handed to Malaysian Airlines and is being examined by an international expert group in GB at the request of the Netherlands.

absolutely. as against our "truthful" friends, the usa government and allies, who insisted that a north korean submarine sank the south korean navy ship, cheonan... and then the usa government instituted a "international panel of "experts" to investigate this issue, and the panel consisted of entirely the allies of usa... sweden, britain, japan etc

and in february 2011, the nato and gcc prepared to invade libya by creating an excuse that the libyan jamahiriya airforce was bombing "civilians, including women and children" in benghazi. the russian government showed satellites pictures of the supposedly bombed areas of benghazi at the united nations organization... and clearly, those pictures showed no airforce bombing.

and on the ground in benghazi, there were no "civilians, including women and children" being killed by libyan forces. what certainly were present, were cia and mossad trained terrorists from al qaida and taliban who had for days been murdering libyans... and of course, the libyan jamahiri militia and military had to rightfully engage them on ground.

so i think, the stage is set for nato forces to go help the nazis in kiev. there are already some israeli commanders leading army units of occupied ukraine.

this will only grow... as @airmarshal said on page# 4, the usa government is a habitual lier.

and why is @Informant so eager to speak on behalf of the very same usa government which has been supporting the talibanis who murder pakistanis??

 

[Deathstroke]

US intelligence supports theory of rebel 'mistake'
A press conference was held this afternoon by the US office of the director of national intelligence (ODNI), at which select reporters were briefed on US intelligence with regard to MH17, the SA-11 missile system suspected, and rebels’ and Russians’ alleged participation.

Details are expected soon, but a report from the AP has come out saying that “senior US intelligence officials say they have no evidence of direct Russian government involvement” in the downing of MH17.

They say the passenger jet was likely felled by an SA-11 surface-to-air missile fired by Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine and that Russia “created the conditions” for the downing by arming the separatists.

They said they didn’t know if any Russians were present at the missile launch, and they wouldn’t say that the missile crew was trained in Russia.

The briefing underlined the theory espoused by most of a senior official at the briefing, and by most analysts since plane first crashed: rebels “most likely shot down the plane by mistake”.

Sorry can't post links. but its on "The Guardian"

 

[jamahir]

US intelligence supports theory of rebel 'mistake'

i still wonder about your previous point...

question is why was a commercial flight routed through war zone where multiple military cargo planes and a fighter jet have been recently been shot out of the sky by SAMS operated by forces on the ground fighting a civil war against a country with an air force attacking them?

 

[Götterdämmerung]

Die Zeit just posted that the US gov. has no evidence that Russia was directly involved in shooting down MH 17.

What they have left is the hope that the rebels have mistakenly shot down the plane.

What next? Are they backpedalling because the evidences are getting thicker and thicker against the Kiev Junta?

Konflikte: Medien: USA ohne Beweise für russische Mitwirkung an Flugzeugabschuss | ZEIT ONLINE

 

[airmarshal]

You believe Russia will disclose "facts" that will implicate them? Plus the rebels boasted they shot down a transport plane right around the time MH17 went down. So circumstantial evidence is against the rebels.

The rebels boast is a doctored tape that Americans like you have been fed by CNN and Fox through, of course, CIA. The forensic examination of tape proved it has different digital signatures.

As I said, I will never trust Americans. They are liars. Within a few hours they knew the airliner was shot down by rebels? How? By seeing a missile battery with two missiles missing.

How do we know that it was same missile battery?

How do we know its the same location and time as the time of shooting?

How do we know the battery came from Russia and went back to Russia after shooting?

The more you watch American media and read it, the more stupid you become. If you want yourself conditioned to go to war, then American media is a great source.

If I have take Russian side, so be it. Haven't I seen America destroying country after country on a lie bigger than the previous lie?

 

[Informant]

The rebels boast is a doctored tape that Americans like you have been fed by CNN and Fox through, of course, CIA. The forensic examination of tape proved it has different digital signatures.

As I said, I will never trust Americans. They are liars. Within a few hours they knew the airliner was shot down by rebels? How? By seeing a missile battery with two missiles missing.

How do we know that it was same missile battery?

How do we know its the same location and time as the time of shooting?

How do we know the battery came from Russia and went back to Russia after shooting?

The more you watch American media and read it, the more stupid you become. If you want yourself conditioned to go to war, then American media is a great source.

If I have take Russian side, so be it. Haven't I seen America destroying country after country on a lie bigger than the previous lie?

So in your disgust over USA, which obviously is the life source for canadians, you will overlook the Ukraine doesnt have military presence nor Air Defence units in the area the plane came down. Twitter was filled with seperatists claiming to have shot down a military transport. Then took down when it became clear the plane was MH 17.

US has nothing to do here, Russia fucked up probably. One way or another Russia was involved in this carnage.

Thankyou, come again.

 

[ptldM3]

So in your disgust over USA, which obviously is the life source for canadians, you will overlook the Ukraine doesnt have military presence nor Air Defence units in the area the plane came down. Twitter was filled with seperatists claiming to have shot down a military transport. Then took down when it became clear the plane was MH 17.

US has nothing to do here, Russia fucked up probably. One way or another Russia was involved in this carnage.

Thankyou, come again.

This is a complete lie that you are simply recycling from other people much like yourself that are gullible. Russia has just provided satellite images of the area that showed buk systems. Again where is the US satellite evidents that it keeps boasting of?

 

[Ceylal]

Putin probably crapped his pants after he heard that there were 23 Americans on board.
Luckily for him there wad only one.

doubt it!

had russia militarily supported iraq in 2003, or at least libya in 2011... none of this would have happened. it would have been a different world.

In 2003, they had Yeltsin and Russia was in her skivies..
in 2011, she had Medvedev a naive pro western idiot...
Putin, is on . Syria is still standing and rolling back the bearded radical...Assad got re-elected, the Qatari bullfrog exiled to England, Bandar Bush admitted in a hospice for seniles, King Abdullah's fingers smacked, Crimea back to Russia...ALL THAT IS PUTIN ...

 

[Ceylal]

Ukraine army doesnt control that area where the plane was shot down. So it was the rebels, refrain from conspiracy theories. Putin's plan backfired.

It more the action of the UKRAINIANS with the ok of NATO that are behind the downing of the jet. The purpose is to get NATO directly involved in the conflict and the Muslims world outraged at the Russians...The plan failed miserably!

What kind of an idiot are you? JEsus. Russia will now face sanctions, which will hurt them in the long run.

Sanction are hurting Europe more than they are to Russia...Russia has a close of $1T surplus, the only country in Europe among NATO that are comfortably in the black is Germany...the rest they are nearly bankrupt.

What a cocky bastard, Putin. Shame on him.

cocky for some , hero for others...Putin is what the world needs to balance the NATO's homogeneity.