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Iran launching missiles towards ISIS positions

New clip published by IRGC.
Saegheh drone taking off from it's mobile launcher:
Saqegheh take off from launcher.jpg



Sadid bombs beneath its belly are visible:
Saegheh armed with Sadid bombs.jpg

Saegheh & 2 Sadid bombs.jpg



Simorgh drone and it's jet engine:
simorgh drone.jpg

Interesting thing is that with a little change of it's pitch angle, engine's light disappears.
 
So a Saeghe can at least fly the 1200km+ range of the operation with two Sadids, likely further.

It can't fly with the jet Simorgh variant as the carrier component of the swarm as it is too slow, but it burns much less fuel and does not need a runway.

One could imagine a set up of a 1:1 scale Simorgh for long range targeting and reconnaissance that has half as large mini jet powered munition carriers that can fly together with it. Where necessary and operation conditions allow, Saeghe's would be sent in advance until a 1:1 Simorgh starts the operation with all its systems such as SAR and wide field of view long range night/day optics. Shaheed-129 and other non-stealth assets would add to this if the airspace is not contested.
Of course small relay UAVs would first set up the communication link for real-time operations.

Such a setup would be the most efficient approach.
Certainly a fleet of large Simorghs with own long-range targeting and weapons would be more imposing but these would be always bound to runways and need a full grown jet engine.

The reputation of the Saeghe speaks for itself: Israelis detected it, but were only able to target it with a non-IR, non-Radar guided Hellfire. Implying its not easy to lock-on via common X-band fire control radars. Of course the 2 Sadids add to its RCS.
 
New clip published by IRGC.
Saegheh drone taking off from it's mobile launcher:
View attachment 505427


Sadid bombs beneath its belly are visible:
View attachment 505428
View attachment 505429


Simorgh drone and it's jet engine:
View attachment 505430
Interesting thing is that with a little change of it's pitch angle, engine's light disappears.
Looks like they used at least 2 versions of the rq170 based design.One is clearly the smaller jet powered version with external bombs and the other is the full sized copy with 2 small internal weapons bays.
Do you have a link to the new video clip these pics came from?
 
Looks like they used at least 2 versions of the rq170 based design.One is clearly the smaller jet powered version with external bombs and the other is the full sized copy with 2 small internal weapons bays.
Do you have a link to the new video clip these pics came from?
http://www.telewebion.com/episode/1908227
skip to 9m16s

smaller one with external bombs is Saegheh and is propeller-driven.
 
I wonder why the engine exhaust is glowing yellow.
Normally only afterburing engines visibly glow in that way.
But afterburning engine makes not not sense on a subsonic drone.

One answer is that they selected a weak but cheap engine such as the Tolue, added an afterburner to it in order to take off via its extra thrust. It would make some sense for a 50% downscaled variant to use something Tolue based. But that is far fetched... J85/Owj on a full size Simorgh? Would probably not fit...
Strange.
 
I wonder why the engine exhaust is glowing yellow.
Normally only afterburing engines visibly glow in that way.
But afterburning engine makes not not sense on a subsonic drone.

One answer is that they selected a weak but cheap engine such as the Tolue, added an afterburner to it in order to take off via its extra thrust. It would make some sense for a 50% downscaled variant to use something Tolue based. But that is far fetched... J85/Owj on a full size Simorgh? Would probably not fit...
Strange.

Still need proof this is a full size Simorgh (1-1 RQ-170 copy).

To build such a drone and have it carry two tiny optically guided PGM is a waste of resources. A highly advanced recon/EW/SIGNIT version makes sense, this does not.

Both Reaper and Heron severely outclass Simorgh in payload. Not that I would expect a internal to match an external payload class drone, but the difference is an ocean.

Until Simorgh can carry two at least two 500lb PGM or 4 250LB PGM, it’s not a viable strike platform.

Many here might not agree with me, but a supersonic large flying wing design UAV with advanced radar and EW capabilities is the ultimate answer alongside these smaller “swarm” drones.

Imagine a flying wing design with 3000+KM range (1st gen) that can carry a payload of 3000-5000KG. Upon entering contested airspace it would activate its EW package and strive to jam and disrupt radars while releasing its payload from 250KM out and then going supersonic (afterburner) out of the battlefield.

That’s a game changer.

Simorgh armed version is not. I don’t even know a real battlefield use vs a competent adversary. If your talking terrorists than Shahed-129 can do that at a cheaper cost. Against a competent adversary, the tiny payload of simorgh makes it more of a assassination/High value target drone than anything that can do severe battlefield damage.

You must realize the amounts of ordnance the US dropped to prevent ISIS from taking Kobane in Syria. Or even the amount of 500KG to 1000KG SVIED that ISIS used in their offensives. We are taking massive amounts of payloads to change a small front in an overall large battlefield.

Saeghe makes sense in grand scheme of things (Iranian philosophy). but let’s make one thing clear. Israel easily detected this upon it entering Golan heights, yet somehow Iran couldn’t detect an Unknown non stealth drone till it was well inside Iran and reaching a major nuclear site. (They claim they knew the whole time, but who really knows).

So again forcing Saeghe to use optical guided munitions vs glide standoff munitions will make it always exposed.

Lastly, to reiterate the Simorgh (armed) version is really just a nice fancy toy. But no real improvements over Simorgh (recon) version.

Furthermore, Iran really needs to advance on to radar absorbing skins and paint composites. The larger RQ-170 variants are exposed without them.
 
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Still need proof this is a full size Simorgh (1-1 RQ-170 copy).

To build such a drone and have it carry two tiny optically guided PGM is a waste of resources. A highly advanced recon/EW/SIGNIT version makes sense, this does not.

Both Reaper and Heron severely outclass Simorgh in payload. Not that I would expect a internal to match an external payload class drone, but the difference is an ocean.

Until Simorgh can carry two at least two 500lb PGM or 4 250LB PGM, it’s not a viable strike platform.

Many here might not agree with me, but a supersonic large flying wing design UAV with advanced radar and EW capabilities is the ultimate answer alongside these smaller “swarm” drones.

Imagine a flying wing design with 3000+KM range (1st gen) that can carry a payload of 3000-5000KG. Upon entering contested airspace it would activate its EW package and strive to jam and disrupt radars while releasing its payload from 250KM out and then going supersonic (afterburner) out of the battlefield.

That’s a game changer.

Simorgh armed version is not. I don’t even know a real battlefield use vs a competent adversary. If your talking terrorists than Shahed-129 can do that at a cheaper cost. Against a competent adversary, the tiny payload of simorgh makes it more of a assassination/High value target drone than anything that can do severe battlefield damage.

You must realize the amounts of ordnance the US dropped to prevent ISIS from taking Kobane in Syria. Or even the amount of 500KG to 1000KG SVIED that ISIS used in their offensives. We are taking massive amounts of payloads to change a small front in an overall large battlefield.

Saeghe makes sense in grand scheme of things (Iranian philosophy). but let’s make one thing clear. Israel easily detected this upon it entering Golan heights, yet somehow Iran couldn’t detect an Unknown non stealth drone till it was well inside Iran and reaching a major nuclear site. (They claim they knew the whole time, but who really knows).

So again forcing Saeghe to use optical guided munitions vs glide standoff munitions will make it always exposed.

Lastly, to reiterate the Simorgh (armed) version is really just a nice fancy toy. But no real improvements over Simorgh (recon) version.

Furthermore, Iran really needs to advance on to radar absorbing skins and paint composites. The larger RQ-170 variants are exposed without them.

It is not a full sized Simorgh, otherwise they would have to build a 100% double size Sadid for scales to make any sense.

It all comes down how much value you give to stealth and EW.
Americans give both very much value others not so much.

This means a RQ-170 is not given that much value against an advanced enemy.

Iran hunted it down for the best we know, the Skunk works super original variant of it.

-Today we see Resonanz series long range VHF-band radars in the UAE.
-Radars that are much more robust against EW due to high processing power and PESA/AESA arrays.
-We see ELINT DF systems that can triangulate any source of EW from extended ranges.
-Long range SAM systems are slowly appearing that would instantly attack those EW sources from extended ranges.
-We now have passive thermal imagers that can precisely and cost effectively determine 3D coordinates at good ranges.

A supersonic Simorgh would be instantly detected if it applies EW. You need something trying to do that from a stand-off position and able to defend itself if attacked, not the Simorgh itself.

A supersonic escape capability would be useful that's sure.

In total: Simorgh/RQ-170 works only against an advanced enemy which capabilities have already been degraded by real "superweapons" --> precision guided ballistic missiles, or against second class enemies.

But an expandable concept of it could be effective if cheap and numerous enough --> Saeghe.
A full size reconnaissance variant of it that identifies targets from stand-off ranges like 200km away from the enemy would make sense.

The Simorgh is thus not a superweapon that needs to be mastered and invested upon as much as possible. Same as you will never see the billion B-2 over Tehran anytime soon in a conflict, you won't see the Simorgh striking high priority targets of an advanced enemy at will. That's the task of ballistic missiles, even CM's won't be survivable enough for this role.
Degrading enemy capabilities and start using Simorgh bombers from the enemies periphery and slowly winning the battle. Of course only if the enemy is not Iran-like an starts to kill you from it's protected central regions due to long range weapons.

So to conclude finally: Your idea of a high capability Simorgh bomber fleet is flawed and not worth the investments necessary. It will never beat ballistic missiles in effectiveness with the spread of counter-stealth assets.
A cost effective concept that can tackle the already degraded capability enemy makes best sense. And once it is degraded enough S-129 like drones will do the job as you said correctly.
 
Just how dangerous is this drone in a potential war scenario agains the US? Can it inflict damage to critical US assets in a war due to it's stealth properties?
 
Just how dangerous is this drone in a potential war scenario
agains the US? Can it inflict damage to critical US assets in a war due to it's stealth properties?

@PeeD just texted and explained how and why these drones can be utilized but somewhere I have stumbled upon a
discussion whether or not these drones can be detected if they were guided from the ground using over the horizon communication radio systems which can give away position of the drone. Not far in past one of the IRGC commanders has disclosed that their ground air defense units are using communication and data transfer using lasers.
I wonder if its possible to guide a stealth drone and transmit and receive data using lasers from the ground, in that case no radio signals are transmitted except from the particles which are narrow and exclusively pointed at the drone at all time and jamming such a drone is virtually impossible unless third party is also pointing lasers. I remember Iranians did manage to blind a US spy satellite once so I assume altitude for lasers isn't that a big problem. I only see one problem I can think of, laser beam has to be deadly accurate to point at the receiver that has to be on the drone and one on the ground which drone has to emit. I can think one solution using drone outter skin which has inbuilt sensors across its body to absorb laser radiation.

@PeeD any thoughts on this idea and anyone else?
 
@PeeD just texted and explained how and why these drones can be utilized but somewhere I have stumbled upon a
discussion whether or not these drones can be detected if they were guided from the ground using over the horizon communication radio systems which can give away position of the drone. Not far in past one of the IRGC commanders has disclosed that their ground air defense units are using communication and data transfer using lasers.
I wonder if its possible to guide a stealth drone and transmit and receive data using lasers from the ground, in that case no radio signals are transmitted except from the particles which are narrow and exclusively pointed at the drone at all time and jamming such a drone is virtually impossible unless third party is also pointing lasers. I remember Iranians did manage to blind a US spy satellite once so I assume altitude for lasers isn't that a big problem. I only see one problem I can think of, laser beam has to be deadly accurate to point at the receiver that has to be on the drone and one on the ground which drone has to emit. I can think one solution using drone outter skin which has inbuilt sensors across its body to absorb laser radiation.

@PeeD any thoughts on this idea and anyone else?

Over horizon communication is as of yet close to impossible due to the large antenna(s) it would require as well as dynamic position change.
Iran seems to concentrate on expandable small (effectively stealth), long endurance relay drones.
They don't emit strong signals and are close to each other.
With LPI techniques it could be really hard to detect them.

Lasers would be as of now too instabile for use on dynamic platforms like drones. They are suitable for static systems at this point of time.

Maybe the RQ-170 had a phased array, high gain directional array in one of its two bumps.
If that would be the case long range LPI communication between drones and ground stations would become possible. The Mig-31 was the first aircraft with such a capability, so it is not impossible.
This would be the best case situation, such a system would allow a Simorgh with a relay-Simorgh in between on station to enable low detectable high bandwidth communication out to 1000km.

So beside satcom, there is already a very good method for drone communication, the question is only if Iran has that technology and if it was present on the RQ-170. Sardar Hajizadeh thinks Iran is ahead of Russia and China in some drone technologies and alone such a communication capability would make that statement correct.
 
Just how dangerous is this drone in a potential war scenario agains the US? Can it inflict damage to critical US assets in a war due to it's stealth properties?

No, this isn’t “stealth”. It has a reduce RCS, but lacks critical stealth features such as Radar absorbing paint/panels and ways to cool engine exhaust.

If iran was able to track the drone back in 2011, then US will be able to track the “cheaper” Iranian version.

The limited payload means it’s good for token strikes against insurgents.
 
Just how dangerous is this drone in a potential war scenario agains the US? Can it inflict damage to critical US assets in a war due to it's stealth properties?
No, it is not that capable.

IDF shot down a similar drone when it infiltrated Israeli airspace. US would have no issue in detecting these.

In fact;

Americans surveillance apparatus noticed Iranian forces moving mobile launchers into position in the country’s Kemansheh province. These TEL were used to strike intended targets in Deir ez-zor region in Iran. Do the math.

Would not be surprised if NSA saw the entire event unfold live on the screens.
 
Would not be surprised if NSA saw the entire event unfold live on the screens.

Well first you should probably learn what the NSA does and that is primarily SIGNIT.

NSA is not watching live Centcom sat feeds of Iran moving mobile launchers into position in a peace time scenario. Get real.
 

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