Indian Ocean Peaceful Geo-Political Pivot Or Contentious Source of Hedging

[great]

Its actually India that should be worried, because Pakistan and China can easily counter India, and Pakistan can easily give China access to the Arabian Sea to threaten Indian shipping lanes. China also and probably will arm Pakistan with it's best technology to challenge Indian hegemony.
And you know what is the best part about everything, India really doesn't have a counterweight to a Pakistan-China strategy.

The thing is can China be world dominator like you think. China's sphere of influence is South China sea and atlantic not Indian ocean. Can China afford to place as many as Indian vessels in Indian ocean, I don't think so. Rest is all BS and delusional.

 

[PakShah]

The thing is can China be world dominator like you think. China's sphere of influence is South China sea and atlantic not Indian ocean. Can China afford to place as many as Indian vessels in Indian ocean, I don't think so. Rest is all BS and delusional.

To say Indian Ocean will be dominated by the Indian navy is delusional and idiotic.
China can easily arm Pakistan.

 

[harpoon]

To say Indian Ocean will be dominated by the Indian navy is delusional and idiotic.
China can easily arm Pakistan.

Arming a navy is not like selling you some knock off AK-47s.

 

[Ticker]

@Tinu and Jinx1

Read the article again, the large amounts of trade and India being the most powerful country in the Indian Ocean, it becomes its responsibility to police the shipping lanes. This is only natural. The south Indian Cholas had a vast empire around the Bay of Bengal region in the middle ages. Even Allama Iqbal in his 1930 address mentioned the importance of India having a strong navy to deter foreign aggressors as the British and other European nations took a sea route to colonise India. So India will eventually have the strongest Navy in the Indian Ocean rim countries. Being the largest by population and GDP, it is only natural.

Pakistan and China should be worried only if they want to create problems for India or start a war with it. India has already declared that it will be open shipping lanes meaning there will be no blocking of lanes.

Sir,
I agree that India may become a strong economic power and be able to economically influence its trading partners to varying degree. However, it’s overall power projection and generation of influence in the key regions would still remain rather limited. Though many Indians believe that India is a regional power, yet they fail to realize the fact that its regional prowess can only be exercised against nations as small and vulnerable as Nepal, Bhutan, Sri Lanka, Maldives and Bangladesh etc. It has not been able to convincingly project its power potential against present day strong and powerful Pakistan and China and it is unlikely to happen in the future as well.

US, France, UK, China and Russia etc can project their power potential because either they do not have a powerful regional threat to counter or they have enough capability to deter a regional threat and also project their capability to take care of extra-regional threats. Pakistan at this stage does not want project its power potential beyond the region.

India cannot laterally expand its influence beyond its western borders due the existence of geo-political impediments in addition to the geographical restrictions placed by the presence of Pakistan. Expansion of its influence towards the east is impeded due to the large geographical lay of China. Therefore the only direction it could expand its influence is towards the vast expanse of sea in the south.

Alas, even this can not happen due to operation of powerful world navies in Indian Ocean. Therefore as the author says, Indian Navy is a force in being and will remain so for a very long time. This because of the fact that attention of the world is on Asia and these world powers will not leave these regions for a very very long time. In the meanwhile, Pakistan and China are going to grow past the difficulties they are facing now and Indian force potential would even diminish further.

Therefore you guys continue dreaming as this is what you do best through make believing.

 

[kawaraj]

Arming a navy is not like selling you some knock off AK-47s.

your weapons are all purchased from either Russia or the West.

China will have at least a few Joint Navy bases with Pakistan and Sri Lanka, or Myanmar . It's only a time matter.

 

[Ticker]

Arming a navy is not like selling you some knock off AK-47s.

That is what you Indians also need to understand. I agree with you 100% that "Arming a navy is not like selling you some knock off AK-47s." That is what Indians make believe in. Statements like Indian Ocean is India's ocean, it is India's backyard, India has a right to police Indian Ocean, India is the most powerful country in Indian Ocean and blah blah blah. Neither of the above statements are true if you live in real world. It takes years and years just to absorb the new technology and when you are not in a position to exercise its usage, what is the fun of acquiring it. Feed the teeming millions of perpetually hungry open mouths and live in peace in this region rather than telling us you are big.

 

[IND151]

Sir,
I agree that India may become a strong economic power and be able to economically influence its trading partners to varying degree. However, it’s overall power projection and generation of influence in the key regions would still remain rather limited. Though many Indians believe that India is a regional power, yet they fail to realize the fact that its regional prowess can only be exercised against nations as small and vulnerable as Nepal, Bhutan, Sri Lanka, Maldives and Bangladesh etc. It has not been able to convincingly project its power potential against present day strong and powerful Pakistan and China and it is unlikely to happen in the future as well.

US, France, UK, China and Russia etc can project their power potential because either they do not have a powerful regional threat to counter or they have enough capability to deter a regional threat and also project their capability to take care of extra-regional threats. Pakistan at this stage does not want project its power potential beyond the region.

India cannot laterally expand its influence beyond its western borders due the existence of geo-political impediments in addition to the geographical restrictions placed by the presence of Pakistan. Expansion of its influence towards the east is impeded due to the large geographical lay of China. Therefore the only direction it could expand its influence is towards the vast expanse of sea in the south.

Alas, even this can not happen due to operation of powerful world navies in Indian Ocean. Therefore as the author says, Indian Navy is a force in being and will remain so for a very long time. This because of the fact that attention of the world is on Asia and these world powers will not leave these regions for a very very long time. In the meanwhile, Pakistan and China are going to grow past the difficulties they are facing now and Indian force potential would even diminish further.

Therefore you guys continue dreaming as this is what you do best through make believing.

our aim is not to bully any nation but to have strong navy that can protect maritime borders of India. i agree that big powers will not allow India to increase its influence in Indian ocean. but how long ? after 20-30 years america wont be a superpower. west is on decline. what we have to do is keep building economy and increasing military power.

we soon will cross 2 trillion $ mark. after that our influence will further increase.

and we have achieved a success- Pakistani navy can not spread influence in even arebian sea because we have ensured it wont happen. i know pn is strong navy. but sill they are forced to be defensive.

 

[Night_Raven]

China will have at least a few Joint Navy bases with Pakistan and Sri Lanka, or Myanmar.

China can easily arm Pakistan.

Always unnecessarily bringing in China into the debate which you cannot hold on your own.

China will always look after its own interests and its own sphere of influence, which currently , is not the Indian Ocean.

 

[tjpf]

your weapons are all purchased from either Russia or the West.

China will have at least a few Joint Navy bases with Pakistan and Sri Lanka, or Myanmar . It's only a time matter.

whats the profit for china to arm pakistan and risk a trade ban of 100 billion dollar b/w india and china???????????????

China is supporting pak to contain india's growing economic and military clout but it would never cross the line i.e. the threshold limit of India's patience coz a country called USA desperately wants India to curtail china but due to our neutral policy there is no new cold war in our region got it!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Ticker]

our aim is not to bully any nation but to have strong navy that can protect maritime borders of India. i agree that big powers will not allow India to increase its influence in Indian ocean. but how long ? after 20-30 years america wont be a superpower. west is on decline. what we have to do is keep building economy and increasing military power.

we soon will cross 2 trillion $ mark. after that our influence will further increase.

and we have achieved a success- Pakistani navy can not spread influence in even arebian sea because we have ensured it wont happen. i know pn is strong navy. but sill they are forced to be defensive.

Sir,
You have given the answer in your reply. You say that you don't want to bully any nation and intend to have strong navy for protection of your maritime borders. Lets explain what are maritime borders in international law. The zones of maritime boundaries are expressed in concentric limits surrounding coastal and feature baselines.

• Coastal waters—the zone extending 3 nm. from the baseline.
• Territorial sea—the zone extending 12 nm. from the baseline.
• Contiguous zone—the area extending 24 nm. from the baseline.
• Exclusive Economic Zone—the area extending 200 nm. from the baseline except when the space between two countries is less than 400 nm.

Do you need 3 aircraft carriers, 140 surface ships, nuclear submarines and naval air arm with fighter aircraft etc for your maritime borders. Kis ko phuddu laga rahe ho.

The you say we are peaceful, don't want to bully any nation and after 20-30 years America and others will leave Indian Ocean, implying that you would then rule Indian Ocean. Wah bhei wah ............ as if in these 20-30 years other nations in Indian Ocean would be sleeping.

Therefore you guys continue dreaming as this is what you do best through make believing.

 

[Ticker]

Always unnecessarily bringing in China into the debate which you cannot hold on your own.

China will always look after its own interests and its own sphere of influence, which currently , is not the Indian Ocean.

There is something which is known as "collusion of national interests" - this is what is happening between Pakistan and China and therefore the cooperation. Your cooperation with Americans is for 20-30 years, @ IND151 explained above but our relationship with China will remain as long as India remain as a threat for both countries - which will remain much longer than 20-30 years.

 

[Ticker]

whats the profit for china to arm pakistan and risk a trade ban of 100 billion dollar b/w india and china???????????????

China is supporting pak to contain india's growing economic and military clout but it would never cross the line i.e. the threshold limit of India's patience coz a country called USA desperately wants India to curtail china but due to our neutral policy there is no new cold war in our region got it!!!!!!!!!!

Because your Prime Minster wrote a letter to world leaders before conducting nuclear tests and your defence ministers and army chiefs have said again and again that China is India's number one enemy.

 

[tjpf]

Sir,
You have given the answer in your reply. You say that you don't want to bully any nation and intend to have strong navy for protection of your maritime borders. Lets explain what are maritime borders in international law. The zones of maritime boundaries are expressed in concentric limits surrounding coastal and feature baselines.

• Coastal waters—the zone extending 3 nm. from the baseline.
• Territorial sea—the zone extending 12 nm. from the baseline.
• Contiguous zone—the area extending 24 nm. from the baseline.
• Exclusive Economic Zone—the area extending 200 nm. from the baseline except when the space between two countries is less than 400 nm.

Do you need 3 aircraft carriers, 140 surface ships, nuclear submarines and naval air arm with fighter aircraft etc for your maritime borders. Kis ko phuddu laga rahe ho.

The you say we are peaceful, don't want to bully any nation and after 20-30 years America and others will leave Indian Ocean, implying that you would then rule Indian Ocean. Wah bhei wah ............ as if in these 20-30 years other nations in Indian Ocean would be sleeping.

Therefore you guys continue dreaming as this is what you do best through make believing.

to bully and to look out for our strategic interest is totally different did our navy bully or harass your navy?????

we are looking for global stage hence all this weapon system.....China can do it but we can't do it in our own little way huh!!!!!!!
Except for USA,China and Russia there is no country in this world that can match us in military capabilities....Pak has nuclear weapon hence yes real pain in the neck but our armed force are more in no., better equiped then pak so don't try to match us

 

[tjpf]

Because your Prime Minster wrote a letter to world leaders before conducting nuclear tests and your defence ministers and army chiefs have said again and again that China is India's number one enemy.

China is a threat to us - YES
but we are dealing it with trade and creating enough military deterence for China so that both country can weigh the advantage and disadvantage of going into a war - STRATEGY

 

[tjpf]

There is something which is known as "collusion of national interests" - this is what is happening between Pakistan and China and therefore the cooperation. Your cooperation with Americans is for 20-30 years, @ IND151 explained above but our relationship with China will remain as long as India remain as a threat for both countries - which will remain much longer than 20-30 years.

we are dealing it with trade and creating enough military deterence for China so that both country can weigh the advantage and disadvantage of going into a war - STRATEGY