Has PAF managed to reduce threats posed by IAF?

[Myth_buster_1]

In the late 90s and until 2008 PAF faced technical advantage by IAF such as BVR AAM and technical and numerical threat.
In simple words PAF main workforce F-7/Mirage had no BVR AAM meaning they were prone to BVR threats but at least today PAF is filling this gap by acquiring JF-17s.

Discuss, was 1990-2008 decade more challenging for PAF or the next decade?

@ indian members. Kindly refrain from diverting this thread into your own p1ssing contest. I want some realistic and mature discussion. And oh try not including PAK-FA into this discussion because its about a decade away from being inducted and operational.


MODS kindly close this thread.. its pointless to involve indians in this discussion.

 

[AMCA]

U had asked a Question nof last decade is challenging or the Next decade adn Have Refused to Add FGFA to the List which According to ACM will start Induction by 2018 onwards.... But Lets Leave it for Now since u have asked me to.... BVRM is not the real Strength , Even the Mig 21's Of Ours are BVR Capable...

You could come to A Conclusion if U find me the following answers

1) Good Air defense???
2)New generation war planes???
3)How Competing is the Indigenous Aviation Industry??
4)Future Acquisitions
5)Number Superiority

Let me Give The Answers to these 5 relating to my country

1)Yes India has Good Air Defense... Ne generation S-300, SPYDER SAM,AKASH
2)Yes SU 30 MKI and Mig 29's
3)Starting to Blossom, manufactured a 3rg gen aircraft and Is Manufacturing 2 Aircrafts this decade and 1 Next decade (HF-Marut,LCA MK1 and LCA MK2 and AMCA)
4)MMRCA,LCA MK2,FGFA,PAK FA,AMCA
5) Its well Known

 

[monitor]

In the late 90s and until 2008 PAF faced technical advantage by IAF such as BVR AAM and technical and numerical threat.
In simple words PAF main workforce F-7/Mirage had no BVR AAM meaning they were prone to BVR threats but at least today PAF is filling this gap by acquiring JF-17s.

Discuss, was 1990-2008 decade more challenging for PAF or the next decade?

@ indian members. Kindly refrain from diverting this thread into your own p1ssing contest. I want some realistic and mature discussion. And oh try not including PAK-FA into this discussion because its about a decade away from being inducted and operational.

the 1990-2008 was challenging for paf as lack of bvr allong with numerical advantage enjoyed by iaf . now paf has reduced the lack of bvr capability with the induction of jf-17 and in future with fc-20 from 2014 . but the balance is still tilted toward iaf as they are having 126 mrca along with su-30mki in great number so in this decade you have to face a fleet of around ~ 400 modern fighters while in last decade you were only faceing quantative advantages as the iaf had relatively moderate fighter, now you have to face both quality and quantity unless you make agreat stride in defence procurment .paf future will depends how many modern fighter like jf-17 block II and fc-20 you can induct in this decade in great number only then you can hope for balance the situation .

 

[monitor]

U had asked a Question nof last decade is challenging or the Next decade adn Have Refused to Add FGFA to the List which According to ACM will start Induction by 2018 onwards.... But Lets Leave it for Now since u have asked me to.... BVRM is not the real Strength , Even the Mig 21's Of Ours are BVR Capable...

You could come to A Conclusion if U find me the following answers

1) Good Air defense???
2)New generation war planes???
3)How Competing is the Indigenous Aviation Industry??
4)Future Acquisitions
5)Number Superiority

Let me Give The Answers to these 5 relating to my country

1)Yes India has Good Air Defense... Ne generation S-300, SPYDER SAM,AKASH
2)Yes SU 30 MKI and Mig 29's
3)Starting to Blossom, manufactured a 3rg gen aircraft and Is Manufacturing 2 Aircrafts this decade and 1 Next decade (HF-Marut,LCA MK1 and LCA MK2 and AMCA)
4)MMRCA,LCA MK2,FGFA,PAK FA,AMCA
5) Its well Known

@1 )HQ-9 POSSIBILITY, SPADA 2000
@ 2)JF-17 AND FC-20
@ 3)START MANUFACTURING JF-17 IN HOME MAY BE FC-20
ASSEMBLY IN PAKISTAN
@ 4) J-XX
@ 5) L LUCKING BUT NOT NECESSARY TO THWART ANY AGGRATION

 

[Icarus]

Don't forget the AWACS and Aerial Refuellers.....They are also important steps forward for the PAF...........

 

[prototype]

In the late 90s and until 2008 PAF faced technical advantage by IAF such as BVR AAM and technical and numerical threat.
In simple words PAF main workforce F-7/Mirage had no BVR AAM meaning they were prone to BVR threats but at least today PAF is filling this gap by acquiring JF-17s.

Discuss, was 1990-2008 decade more challenging for PAF or the next decade?

@ indian members. Kindly refrain from diverting this thread into your own p1ssing contest. I want some realistic and mature discussion. And oh try not including PAK-FA into this discussion because its about a decade away from being inducted and operational.

u want a know ground reality and still u refrain from acknowledging the ground reality

U r talking about the coming decade FGFA is very much a part of IAF in the coming decade,as it is all set to get inducted in 2018(according to official's

Now coming to the topic,like AMCA said BVR is not a game changer,even our Mig-21's have it,so at best u had only scored even,but still we have a much bigger fleet

So what i believe is PAF should give more importance to the induction of new generation SAM's in high number,along with the induction of new planes which Pakistan had already in sight.

PAF primary objective id defense of their skies(according to Pakistani members),so focusing more on advanced SAM's will b quite helpful

I think PN should also raise a separate fleet to protect their naval assets,that can b helpful in offloading the pressure from PAF,and it all depends on funds also,i think even 2 or 3 squads will b sufficient

 

[AMCA]

@1 )HQ-9 POSSIBILITY, SPADA 2000
@ 2)JF-17 AND FC-20
@ 3)START MANUFACTURING JF-17 IN HOME MAY BE FC-20
ASSEMBLY IN PAKISTAN
@ 4) J-XX
@ 5) L LUCKING BUT NOT NECESSARY TO THWART ANY AGGRATION

I see a Lot of Possibilites here.... As the thread starter has mentioned.. we Should not put assumptions a room here... Mention if u have anything confirmed rather probables....

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Our F-7PGs,mirage and F-16 also are BVR capable just like JF-17 nd J-10B.

 

[Ammyy]

In the late 90s and until 2008 PAF faced technical advantage by IAF such as BVR AAM and technical and numerical threat.
In simple words PAF main workforce F-7/Mirage had no BVR AAM meaning they were prone to BVR threats but at least today PAF is filling this gap by acquiring JF-17s.

Discuss, was 1990-2008 decade more challenging for PAF or the next decade?

@ indian members. Kindly refrain from diverting this thread into your own p1ssing contest. I want some realistic and mature discussion. And oh try not including PAK-FA into this discussion because its about a decade away from being inducted and operational.

First learn to take care of your own words then teach others

Present situation (India)

Sukhoi Su-30MKI -140
Mikoyan MiG-29S- 69 ( On the way to upgrade)
Dassault Mirage 2000 - 51 (still up-gradation not confirm)
MiG-21 Bison - 121 and etc

UAVs
IAI-Searcher, IAI Heron, IAI Harpy, Lakshya PTA

(Pakistan)
JF-17 Thunder - 25
F-161A/B - 45 (still upgradashion not confirm)
F-16C/D - 6
Dassault Mirage III - 121
Dassault Mirage 5 - 60


Indian Air force have - "S-300, SPYDER SAM,AKASH"
Pakistan air force - Nothing ( dnt know)


Future (India)
126 MMRCA ( Conformed )
300 PAKFA/FGFA (Conformed)
48 LCA Tejas Mk1 (Conformed )

64 MMRCA (May be no. extend to total 200)
200 AMCA (Still in development - not conformed)
250 Tejas Mk2 ( Still in development - not conformed)

(Pakistan)
250 JF17 (Still in development - not conformed)
36 FC-20 ( Order conformed - still in development )
JXX- ?????????????

 

[Areesh]

In the late 90s and until 2008 PAF faced technical advantage by IAF such as BVR AAM and technical and numerical threat.
In simple words PAF main workforce F-7/Mirage had no BVR AAM meaning they were prone to BVR threats but at least today PAF is filling this gap by acquiring JF-17s.

Discuss, was 1990-2008 decade more challenging for PAF or the next decade?

@ indian members. Kindly refrain from diverting this thread into your own p1ssing contest. I want some realistic and mature discussion. And oh try not including PAK-FA into this discussion because its about a decade away from being inducted and operational.

Well bro Growler. Your wish in bold is very difficult to be fulfilled and by looking at the "realistic" and "mature" posts above I don't think your wish is going to be fulfilled. Anyways I hope best of luck for this thread.

 

[Manticore]

the air refuelers and awacs have provided better situational awareness as well deeper penetration

our f7 pgs/ mirages had bvrs since a long time , our f16s had sparrows-- they trained with turkey for many years in bvr/anti bvr measures

now with sd10 and aim120 , along with ra'ad , upgradation of f16s , complete rewamping of our basic fleet with jf17 , cluster bombs, precision guided bombs, night combat capability----- tackling paf is no walk in the play ground

in the next 5 years , well , fc20 will give better attacking capabilities and choices

spada/crotale4000standard i know of ,, ft2000/hq9 info is classified


SO, i think these measures have provided our pilots with better survivibilty chances , which is a good start

 

[Myth_buster_1]

The indians have yet again amused us with their BSing. Obviously they suffer from a inner genetic disease thus such unexpected comments are always due from them.
Surly this forum has been infested and degraded by Indians whom we have given them too much freedom of speech which is clearly absent from their side of the world.

 

[AMCA]

The indians have yet again amused us with their BSing. Obviously they suffer from a inner genetic disease thus such unexpected comments are always due from them.
Surly this forum has been infested and degraded by Indians whom we have given them too much freedom of speech which is clearly absent from their side of the world.

We obviously know Your Intention of Starting this thread, If You cannot take What has been answerd for Your Questions, Please Place a Counter argument rather Escaping by saying "All Is BS"

 

[Rafi]

I think the rumoured purchase of HQ-18, is very significant these missiles would make it hairy for any indian plane entering our airspace.

 

[SEAL]

We can't match IAF number superiority and the only advantage IAF had over PAF in last decade is BVR-AAM just hit and run don't get involve in close dog fights with the induction of Aim-120Charlie and SD-10 their advantage is gone.

IAF advantages and disadvantages:

Number superiority.
IAF training and maintenance is poor.
IAF is short of 400 pilots and training aircrafts.
IAF aircrafts require more time for maintenance.
50% IAF inventory obsolete(IAF chief said that)
IAF will start receiving MRCA 2013 onwards, their MRCA wont have experience pilots anytime soon.


PAF advantages/disadvantages.
Small budget major disadvantage.
PAF have more number of pilots then aircrafts.
PAF training is world class and maintenance record is very good.
PAF defense capability is significantly increase with JF-17.(JF-17 4BVR+2WVR compared to F7PG with 2 missiles.)
In strike role we have h2, h4, Ra'ad IAF don't have anything which match this capability.
Our aircrafts are maintenance friendly like in one JF-17 video Pilot said its turn around time for next sortie is better then F-16. We can prepare JF-17 for next mission in very short time.

*IAF can create problems for us but they can't win.