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Hagel warns Pakistan to resolve drone strike protests, open shipping routes

If you don't know who said so, than stop mentioning me in your post and STFU. I am not replying a IK Follower. Neither am interested in, so before mentioning me think again who said what and where.

Relax dude, if you don't want me to mention you then fine. I mentioned you not because you said something about this matter, I instead mentioned you because I wanted to have your opinion on this topic. And if you don't want to comment because you have nothing really to say I guess, then stop better off from personal attacks and ask politely..
 
Actions speaks louder than words........

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I for one choose not to believe what American say, being Pakistani its my duty to believe what my govt says and everyone including Musharaf, PPP and PMLN is denying if there was a permission. If I choose not to believe what my govt say then I have no right to do any criticism on them. But thats not the issue here, issue is no country have a right to attack the sovereignty of another country, and US should not do it unless Pakistani govt accepts it openly.

Of course, you are right in saying that no country should accept an attack on its soveriegnity, but then militants emanating out of Pakistani territory are attacking the soveriegnity of its neighboring countries and nothing is being done about it by Pakistani authorities - Iran is the latest entrant to start attacking across the border at terrorists who are killing their forces.

Its like people from your house are attacking your neighbors house and you expect them to not attack back. - the excuse normally given for this thinking by Pakistan is that "we are also victims of terrorism and the same terrorists are attacking us to"....this excuse does not satisfy the neighbors obviously who for -

1) are not concerned with whats happening internally in Pakistan - their only concern is to stop such activities thats emanating from Pakistan from a long time - enough warnings to desist or control these elements have been issued by the neighbors for decades but nothing has come out of it.

2) Due to inaction by the house owner the neighbors adopt their own methods directly or indirectly to curtail these attacks by hook or by crook. You cannot fault them for doing whats in their best interest in safeguarding their people from this menace.

What I was suggesting is Pakistan should differentiate between a unilateral action taken by CIA's drone program and the nato supply route which caters to a joint force of many countries...Afghanistan being a landlocked country and all. Resorting to blackmailing nato forces to stop which the US thinks is the weapon that is effective in taking out the terror headhonchos will not be acceptable. The supplies were stopped because the drone attack took out terrorists. Many people will not see any logic in that....so dehypenating both will serve a purpose and might generate some support against the unilateral drone campaign against Pakistan.
 
"Beggers can't be choosers." Firstly develop our own economy so that we don't have to depend upon US. Its ironic that we would speak against Pakistan's biggest military financier, biggest development donor and biggest investor of FDI.

I am sorry but couldn't help to ask even if USA is Pakistan's biggest military financier, biggest development donor and biggest investor of FDI why most of the Pakistanis ( at least here ) think its China !!!! If I am not wrong China hasn't done anything comparable to USA for Nation Pakistan.
 
Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel warned Pakistan
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If I am not wrong China hasn't done anything comparable to USA for Nation Pakistan.
o_O

Hmm... I am a bug supporter for US/Pak ties, but unfair statements like that deserve a response.

Lets see:
1950 – Pakistan becomes the third non-communist country, and first Muslim one, to recognize the People's Republic of China.
1951 – Beijing and Karachi establish diplomatic relations.
1963 – Pakistan cedes the Trans-Karakoram Tract to China, ending border disputes.
1970 – Pakistan helps the U.S. arrange the 1972 Nixon visit to China.
1978 – The Karakoram Highway linking the mountainous Northern Pakistan with Western China officially opens.
1980s – China and the U.S. provide support through Pakistan to the Afghan guerrillas fighting Soviet occupational forces.
1986 – China and Pakistan reach a comprehensive nuclear co-operation agreement.
1996 – Chinese President Jiang Zemin pays a state visit to Pakistan.
1999 – A 300-megawatt nuclear power plant, built with Chinese help in Punjab province, is completed.
2001 – A joint-ventured Chinese-Pakistani tank, the MBT-2000 (Al-Khalid) MBT is completed.
2002 – The building of the Gwadar deep sea port begins, with China as the primary investor.
2003 – Pakistan and China signed a $110 million contract for the construction of a housing project on Multan Road in Lahore
2007 – The Sino-Pakistani joint-ventured multirole fighter aircraft – the JF-17 Thunder (FC-1 Fierce Dragon) is formally rolled out.
2008 – Pakistan welcomes the Chinese Olympic Torch in an Islamabad sports stadium, under heavy guard amidst security concerns.
2008 – China and Pakistan sign a free trade agreement.
2008 – Pakistan and China to build a railway through the Karakoram Highway, in order to link China's rail network to Gwadar Port.
2008 – The F-22P frigate, comes into service with the Pakistani Navy.
2009 – The ISI arrest several suspected Uyghur terrorists seeking refuge in Pakistan.
2010 – Pakistan and China conduct a joint anti-terrorism drill.
2010 – China donates $260 million in dollars to flood hit Pakistan and sends 4 military rescue helicopters to assist in rescue operations.
2010 – Wen Jiabao visits Pakistan. More than 30 billion dollars worth of deals were signed.
2011 – Pakistan is expected to buy air to air SD 10 missiles from China for its 250 JF 17 thunder fighter fleet
2013 - Management of Gwadar port is handed over to state-run Chinese Overseas Port Holdings after previously being managed by Singapore’s PSA International, and it becomes a matter of great concern for India.
2013 – Chinese Premier Li Keqiang visits Pakistan. Trade between China and Pakistan hit a 12-month figure of $12 billion for the first time in 2012.


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Pakistan asks China to raise investments to $10 billion - thenews.com.pk

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/27/w...lear-power-plant-project-with-china.html?_r=0

Pakistan building country's largest nuclear power plant — with China's help - NY Daily News

CNLC helping Pakistan in Well testing & Logging:
Welcome to CNLC


So yes, China has not done a lot for Pakistan.
 
Hmm... I am a bug supporter for US/Pak ties, but unfair statements like that deserve a response.



So yes, China has not done a lot for Pakistan.
Really !!! Unfair statement !!! Which part was unfair ???
Do you see I write China has not done anything ???

If one has to ; one can create bigger list for US side but I am getting into that trouble. I was expecting simple answer than getting into anybody's emotional views.

Can you say China has done more than US !!! If yes I will retract my statement and question. Then I have no question.
But if NOT please try to answer my question as the list of Chinese deeds really didnt help my question.
 
Really !!! Unfair statement !!! Which part was unfair ???
Do you see I write China has not done anything ???

If one has to ; one can create bigger list for US side but I am getting into that trouble. I was expecting simple answer than getting into anybody's emotional views.

Can you say China has done more than US !!! If yes I will retract my statement and question. Then I have no question.
But if NOT please try to answer my question as the list of Chinese deeds really didnt help my question.

You ask questions as if you cup is empty, but your statements prove your cup if full. How many nuclear plants has american helped build in Pakistan... ?
 
You ask questions as if you cup is empty, but your statements prove your cup if full. How many nuclear plants has american helped build in Pakistan... ?
Yu want to say anything/anyone is not as big as the one who help you become strong to fight your sworn enemy !!! I know the answer. Thats why I precisely write "the Nation Pakistan" in first post.

A direct answer would really help than cup theory. I was/is never a really fan of cup theory.
PS. Same america didnt stop you from making Nukes too ;)
 
I was/is never a really fan of cup theory.

What answer do you seek, you tell me? Because the answers i have given do not suit your palate. If you are no fan of the cup theory, that on it's own reinforces the fact that your mind on the matter is made up. Why waste each others time, you feel the US is beneficial to Pakistan strategically in the long term, give it 5 years then comeback and we will talk.
 
What answer do you seek, you tell me? Because the answers i have given do not suit your palate. If you are no fan of the cup theory, that on it's own reinforces the fact that your mind on the matter is made up. Why waste each others time, you feel the US is beneficial to Pakistan strategically in the long term, give it 5 years then comeback and we will talk.
The answer I seek is " why people here think/believe China is better bait for Pak than US ??? And why ??? What is more important development of Pak or making sure Pak can give India a bloddy nose everytime they want !!! Or is China helping on the scale US was !!! I never heard about China giving out aids to anybody ( open to correction )

My problem with Cup theory is always the content of cup and not the quantity. And cup theory is all about quantity ;)

Ok. But I think US-Pak relations are on no-return track. And withdrawal from AFG will be final chapter and if iffffffff Iran plays along for while Pak is going to have bad time. ( my opinion I might be wrong )
 
Anti-American protests along Pakistan's borders have disrupted U.S. military shipments into Afghanistan.

RIYADH, Saudi Arabia -- Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel warned Pakistani leaders Monday that if they don't resolve protests stalling some military shipments across the border with Afghanistan, it could be difficult to maintain political support in Washington for an aid program that has sent billions of dollars to Islamabad, defense officials said.

In response, the officials said, Hagel received assurances from the Pakistanis that they would take "immediate action" to resolve the shipment problem. The officials did not provide details on how that might be done.

Just last week, anti-American protests along one of the primary border crossing routes in Pakistan prompted the U.S. to stop the shipments from Torkham Gate through Karachi last week, due to worries about the safety of the truckers. The protests center on the CIA's drone program that has targeted and killed many terrorists, but has caused civilian casualties.

The defense officials said Hagel described a political reality on Capitol Hill that could complicate support for the billions of dollars of aid Pakistan now receives. It was Hagel's intent to try and pre-empt any problems with the aid, said the officials who spoke to reporters on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the private meetings publicly on the record.

Hagel had back-to-back meetings Monday with Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and the new army chief, Gen. Tahaeel Sharif, in a move to further repair what has been a strained and sputtering relationship between Washington and Islamabad. Defense officials said Hagel is first high ranking U.S. official to meet with the Army chief, who took over at the end of last month.

After leaving Islamabad, he flew to Saudi Arabia where he is meeting with Crown Prince Salman.

During the Pakistan meetings some of the more contentious issues also were raised, including Islamabad's opposition to ongoing CIA drone strikes and Washington's frustration with Pakistan's reluctance to go after the Haqqani terrorist network, which operates along the border and conducts attacks on U.S. and coalition troops in Afghanistan. The officials acknowledged that little progress was made other than to agree to continue talking.

Sharif's office said in a statement the prime minister and Hagel had "in-depth exchanges on a whole range of issues of mutual interest" including bilateral defense, security cooperation and Afghanistan. Sharif's office also said the prime minister conveyed Pakistan's deep concern over continuing U.S. drone strikes, "stressing that drone strikes were counter-productive to our efforts to combat terrorism and extremism on an enduring basis," the statement said.

Shireen Mazari, the information secretary for the political party Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf, said in a statement Monday it's time for the government to speak forcefully to the U.S. to demand an end to the drone attacks. The party is leading the protests.

Pakistan has called the drone strikes a violation of the country's sovereignty, but the issue is muddied by the fact that Islamabad and the military have supported at least some of the strikes in the past.

Following their meeting in Rawalpindi, Hagel and Sharif echoed each other's desire to work to strengthen the countries' ties. The top military men discussed the defense relationship between the two countries and regional stability, according to the Pakistani army chief's office.

Hagel's warning to the Pakistanis about the supply route reflects what has been a growing frustration among U.S. lawmakers with Pakistan in recent years.

The Pakistani government blocked the supply crossings for seven months following U.S. airstrikes that accidentally killed two dozen soldiers on the Afghan border in November 2011. Pakistan finally reopened the routes after the U.S. apologized.

The rift largely led the U.S. to sever most aid to Pakistan for some time, but relations were restored in July 2012. Since then the U.S. has delivered over $1.15 billion in security assistance to Pakistan. Some of the items include advanced communications equipment, roadside bomb jammers, night vision goggles and surveillance aircraft.

Since July 2012, relations between Washington and Islamabad have been improving. Sharif met with President Barack Obama and Hagel in late October in Washington.

The last Pentagon chief to visit Pakistan was Robert Gates in January 2010.

Hagel flew to Pakistan from Afghanistan, where he visited U.S. troops but declined to meet with President Hamid Karzai, who has rankled the U.S. by refusing to sign a security agreement before year's end.

Hagel warns Pakistan to resolve drone strike protests, open shipping routes | PBS NewsHour

Stop the supply on a permanent basis, time we grow a pair and tell them they can shove their aid
 
The answer I seek is " why people here think/believe China is better bait for Pak than US ??? And why ??? What is more important development of Pak or making sure Pak can give India a bloddy nose everytime they want !!! Or is China helping on the scale US was !!! I never heard about China giving out aids to anybody ( open to correction )

My problem with Cup theory is always the content of cup and not the quantity. And cup theory is all about quantity ;)

Ok. But I think US-Pak relations are on no-return track. And withdrawal from AFG will be final chapter and if iffffffff Iran plays along for while Pak is going to have bad time. ( my opinion I might be wrong )

My problem with Cup theory is always the content of cup and not the quantity. And cup theory is all about quantity ;)
Subjective and cynical view at looking at the value of "knowledge". Information and opinion do not equate wisdom.

The answer I seek is " why people here think/believe China is better bait for Pak than US ???
1980, 1990, Early 2000, GWOT, Op Neptune, Post 9/11 Afghanistan anyone?

never heard about China giving out aids to anybody
o_O AIDS as in HIV aids or Aid as in Humanitarian aid?

If you are asking about humanitarian aid:
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Source: UN OCHA -http://www.unocha.org

Ok. But I think US-Pak relations are on no-return track.
Then, why do you question the choice of people to see China as a all weather friend instead of being treated like a one night stand by the U.S?
 
This is so unfortunate because Hagel is anti-war and intervention in the Middle East. He's also against supporting Israel's occupation with military and economic aid.

The problem is he takes orders only in the White House and can't do anything else.

I remember before he was given the position he was attacked and questioned over his stance on Israel. It's such a pathetic congress who serves Jewish money.

In the future there should be consequences for such two faced people enough of this.
 
Subjective and cynical view at looking at the value of "knowledge". Information and opinion do not equate wisdom.
illusion is the world you might be looking for !!! Or want to avoid ;)
My work experience says otherwise so lets agree to disagree.

1980, 1990, Early 2000, GWOT, Op Neptune, Post 9/11 Afghanistan anyone?
already said one can make bigger for US. And yes China did help Pak alot. Question isn't does it or not. Question is how much ? Can you still say its bigger than US ???
And for this it really doesn't show trend. US too helped Pak in bigger scale and now you are hating them ;) Pak may be right in doing so. I am not arguing about right or wrong. Just want to know why if you can tell me.Nothing else ;)
o_O AIDS as in HIV aids or Aid as in Humanitarian aid?
If you are asking about humanitarian aid:
you know which AIDS. Not only humanitarian aid.
I didn't see PAK get more than 18 million from the chart. US figure is in billions right !!!


Then, why do you question the choice of people to see China as a all weather friend instead of being treated like a one night stand by the U.S?
Again I write that clearly thats my opinion ( and wish too ;) )
No problems to look at all weather friend/s. but ditching one for another is the question.
OBL and some events turn out to be "cheating" so one decide to have a quick one night stand than to continue with someone "cheating" - Just metaphors no offence intended.

Main reason of all this ^^^ exercise is to find out what common man thinks.
All GOVTs BS on daily basis. Nothing new there so I try to find answers around here.
Mostly I kept it to reading but could help quoting the post form the poster I quoted. Then you replied ..... And till here.
 
illusion is the world you might be looking for !!! Or want to avoid ;)
My work experience says otherwise so lets agree to disagree.

already said one can make bigger for US. And yes China did help Pak alot. Question isn't does it or not. Question is how much ? Can you still say its bigger than US ???
And for this it really doesn't show trend. US too helped Pak in bigger scale and now you are hating them ;) Pak may be right in doing so. I am not arguing about right or wrong. Just want to know why if you can tell me.Nothing else ;)

you know which AIDS. Not only humanitarian aid.
I didn't see PAK get more than 18 million from the chart. US figure is in billions right !!!



Again I write that clearly thats my opinion ( and wish too ;) )
No problems to look at all weather friend/s. but ditching one for another is the question.
OBL and some events turn out to be "cheating" so one decide to have a quick one night stand than to continue with someone "cheating" - Just metaphors no offence intended.

Main reason of all this ^^^ exercise is to find out what common man thinks.
All GOVTs BS on daily basis. Nothing new there so I try to find answers around here.
Mostly I kept it to reading but could help quoting the post form the poster I quoted. Then you replied ..... And till here.

My work experience says otherwise so lets agree to disagree.
Enlighten me, what is your work? :)

And for this it really doesn't show trend. US too helped Pak in bigger scale and now you are hating them

Oh Bahi, who said i hate the US, please do a search of my posts, I have a deep respect for them. But i don't think they will stay with Pakistan in the long run.

Just want to know why if you can tell me.
You are starting to sound like a broken record... lol, i have already given you my reasons why i am Pro China in the long run, i cannot speak for all of Pakistan :/

you know which AIDS. Not only humanitarian aid.
o_O

I didn't see PAK get more than 18 million from the chart. US figure is in billions right !!!

Are you comparing Chinese humanitarian aid to US assistance... :/

Main reason of all this ^^^ exercise is to find out what common man thinks.

And i suppose you are Daniel Ellsberg?
 
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